From msevior at physics.unimelb.edu.au Tue Mar 1 02:18:01 2005 From: msevior at physics.unimelb.edu.au (Martin Sevior) Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 13:18:01 +1100 Subject: fedora-devel-list Digest, Vol 12, Issue 104 In-Reply-To: <20050228160657.AD0887314C@hormel.redhat.com> References: <20050228160657.AD0887314C@hormel.redhat.com> Message-ID: <1109643481.14742.2751.camel@localhost.localdomain> On Mon, 2005-02-28 at 11:06 -0500, fedora-devel-list-request at redhat.com > -jef"No one in the sum total of human history has ever felt a deeper > rage than what I felt when oneko was ripped out of rhl. I fell into a > darkness, deep and bottomless. I wandered the earth, lost and forlorn > searching for meaning. I swore an oath to seek my revenge on those who > have hurt me so. I have fought a daily struggle to break open the Red > gates so that I have can get oneko back into distribution. And now > that Fedora Extras is finally here and my goal is at hand, its not so > compelling anymore cuz xdesktopwaves is sooo much cooler."spaleta My thoughts exactly, except that nothing will be cooler than AbiWord :-) OK there are several things about this series of posts from me. If I just went quietly into the night, people would think I don't care. I do care. Now I'll plug AbiWord-2.2 since almost no one here has tried it. The AbiWord community is as vibrant as ever. We committed over 300,000 LOC of changes to the code base over 14 months to produce AbiWord-2.2. We implemented all sorts of cool stuff that neither MS Word or OOo has. We implemented features that make the users job of creating documents easier and more fun. We want that code to be seen and used and appreciated by as many people as possible. We're in a position to be widely deployed across heterogenic communities like Universities and Schools since we have Windows, Mac and Linux clients. We're seeing substantial growth in our direct download stats and hits on our website from outside the Linux world. Having released 2.2 we've started work on 2.4 and have already added a number of new features while steadily fixing bugs in 2.2. I bought into the idea of Fedora as a community project with real support for grass roots developers and users. What I see are corporate backed projects pushing the grass roots projects out. I also see these projects pushing all the fun stuff out too. Fedora has to be careful about maintaining relevance for your average computer enthusiast. As someone else has said if we wanted a boring, corporate supported OS with excellent Java support we'd download Solaris 10. Martin From thacker at math.cornell.edu Tue Mar 1 01:32:22 2005 From: thacker at math.cornell.edu (John Thacker) Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2005 20:32:22 -0500 Subject: fedora-devel-list Digest, Vol 12, Issue 104 In-Reply-To: <1109643481.14742.2751.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <20050228160657.AD0887314C@hormel.redhat.com> <1109643481.14742.2751.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <20050301013222.GA31096@thacker.dyndns.org> On Tue, Mar 01, 2005 at 01:18:01PM +1100, Martin Sevior wrote: > > The AbiWord community is as vibrant as ever. We committed over 300,000 > LOC of changes to the code base over 14 months to produce AbiWord-2.2. > We implemented all sorts of cool stuff that neither MS Word or OOo has. > We implemented features that make the users job of creating documents > easier and more fun. We want that code to be seen and used and > appreciated by as many people as possible. We're in a position to be > widely deployed across heterogenic communities like Universities and > Schools since we have Windows, Mac and Linux clients. I otherwise like the program, but it's an incredible PIA for me to use because of its absolutely horrible CJK support. So I essentially never use it, even though a few years ago Japanese support (on Linux) went from "completely unavailable" to "laughably horrible." OOo has very nice, mature, professional CJK features. http://bugzilla.abisource.com/buglist.cgi?keywords=cjk Now I see that someone made it "not totally suck" on MacOSX recently, so maybe there's hope yet for AbiWord. > I bought into the idea of Fedora as a community project with real > support for grass roots developers and users. What I see are corporate > backed projects pushing the grass roots projects out. I also see these > projects pushing all the fun stuff out too. Of course, being in Extras is supposed to be the community project part with grassroots support. Now of course we want to make sure that it appears in Extras and that Extras is easy to find (such as from the website), but in the future, Extras is to be everything that is community based, which outside people can easily add to, whereas Core is a limited set of necessary things that only RedHat people add to. In the long run, a vibrant and useful Extras is better than a situation where nearly everything is in Core and dependent on RedHat employees updating them if this is to be a real community project. John Thacker -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: not available URL: From moe at blagblagblag.org Tue Mar 1 01:49:29 2005 From: moe at blagblagblag.org (jeff) Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2005 18:49:29 -0700 Subject: fedora-devel-list Digest, Vol 12, Issue 104 In-Reply-To: <20050301013222.GA31096@thacker.dyndns.org> References: <20050228160657.AD0887314C@hormel.redhat.com> <1109643481.14742.2751.camel@localhost.localdomain> <20050301013222.GA31096@thacker.dyndns.org> Message-ID: <200502281849.29215.moe@blagblagblag.org> John Thacker wrote: > In > the long run, a vibrant and useful Extras is better than a > situation where nearly everything is in Core and dependent on > RedHat employees updating them if this is to be a real > community project. If it's to be a real community project wouldn't that mean people outside redhat could update core? From skvidal at phy.duke.edu Tue Mar 1 01:58:40 2005 From: skvidal at phy.duke.edu (seth vidal) Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2005 20:58:40 -0500 Subject: fedora-devel-list Digest, Vol 12, Issue 104 In-Reply-To: <200502281849.29215.moe@blagblagblag.org> References: <20050228160657.AD0887314C@hormel.redhat.com> <1109643481.14742.2751.camel@localhost.localdomain> <20050301013222.GA31096@thacker.dyndns.org> <200502281849.29215.moe@blagblagblag.org> Message-ID: <1109642320.23615.0.camel@cutter> On Mon, 2005-02-28 at 18:49 -0700, jeff wrote: >John Thacker wrote: >> In >> the long run, a vibrant and useful Extras is better than a >> situation where nearly everything is in Core and dependent on >> RedHat employees updating them if this is to be a real >> community project. > >If it's to be a real community project wouldn't that mean people >outside redhat could update core? let's work on extras and making it happy then work on worrying with core. -sv From michael.favia at insitesinc.com Tue Mar 1 02:12:56 2005 From: michael.favia at insitesinc.com (Michael Favia) Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2005 20:12:56 -0600 Subject: Intel Pro Wireless cards In-Reply-To: <4223505B.20402@snowmoon.com> References: <4223505B.20402@snowmoon.com> Message-ID: <4223CFA8.2000308@insitesinc.com> Eric Warnke wrote: > After reviewing the archives of the various lists I have found no > discussion on the topic of wireless driver inclusion in FC. Along these same lines is the Ralink 2500/2400 chip sets. They power a number of useful 802.11 b/g devices (most notably linksys PCI revision 4 here in the US which is a large number of devices sold). They gpl'd their source code back in December IIRC. As wireless NICs are becoming more popular and network install approach "default" (with FC5 anaconda and newly discussed capabilities) it will become increasingly more important to get these "popular" cards under "Just Works" functionality during installs. What is required to get ootb functionality for a device like this? Here are some relevant links: Ralink site with source: http://www.ralinktech.com.tw/supp-1.htm rt2x00 Open Source Project http://rt2x00.serialmonkey.com/wiki/index.php/Main_Page -mf From aoliva at redhat.com Tue Mar 1 02:15:04 2005 From: aoliva at redhat.com (Alexandre Oliva) Date: 28 Feb 2005 23:15:04 -0300 Subject: FC3 -> FC4 Upgrade? (was Re: reducing distribution CD count) In-Reply-To: <42239279.90505@snowmoon.com> References: <1109287914.26364.69.camel@localhost.localdomain> <421F36A6.8040401@olin.edu> <1109342585.26364.163.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1109346741.10989.13.camel@opus.phy.duke.edu> <1109346973.26364.181.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1109348125.10989.22.camel@opus.phy.duke.edu> <20050225162219.GD1048932@hiwaay.net> <1109348730.10989.33.camel@opus.phy.duke.edu> <1109349041.26364.190.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1109355427.10989.39.camel@opus.phy.duke.edu> <20050225190829.GG1048932@hiwaay.net> <1109358912.23111.1.camel@cutter> <1109360807.26364.217.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1109361494.23111.18.camel@cutter> <1109399987.27384.33.camel@cutter> <1109536319.22789.21.camel@bree.local.net> <42239279.90505@snowmoon.com> Message-ID: On Feb 28, 2005, Eric Warnke wrote: > 2) Do what I do. Kickstart %post section that installs a rpm with > updates fot yum repos as well as new ones. I import all the necessary > keys and do a "yum -y update" and then "yum -y install > packagename". Yeah, I had something like that at some point. selinux attributes are somewhat messed up when you do this. At least they still are for the configuration stuff I run in %post, that among other things runs texhash, and tex config files get incorrectly-labeled. Perhaps it's unrelated and I'm just barking up the wrong tree, but I was concerned it could mess things up further and didn't try that again. -- Alexandre Oliva http://www.ic.unicamp.br/~oliva/ Red Hat Compiler Engineer aoliva@{redhat.com, gcc.gnu.org} Free Software Evangelist oliva@{lsd.ic.unicamp.br, gnu.org} From aoliva at redhat.com Tue Mar 1 02:17:41 2005 From: aoliva at redhat.com (Alexandre Oliva) Date: 28 Feb 2005 23:17:41 -0300 Subject: reducing distribution CD count In-Reply-To: <604aa79105022814364bafe9ea@mail.gmail.com> References: <200502240906.20729.czar@czarc.net> <20050224175035.22391185@python2> <1109515772.5676.29.camel@angua.localnet> <604aa791050227111510d45277@mail.gmail.com> <604aa79105022814364bafe9ea@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On Feb 28, 2005, Jeff Spaleta wrote: > On 28 Feb 2005 19:04:08 -0300, Alexandre Oliva wrote: >> fedora-release could Obsolete: package <= V-R as of the time of the > obsoleting does more than notify.. Could be Conflicts:, then. -- Alexandre Oliva http://www.ic.unicamp.br/~oliva/ Red Hat Compiler Engineer aoliva@{redhat.com, gcc.gnu.org} Free Software Evangelist oliva@{lsd.ic.unicamp.br, gnu.org} From mattdm at mattdm.org Tue Mar 1 03:01:52 2005 From: mattdm at mattdm.org (Matthew Miller) Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2005 22:01:52 -0500 Subject: I want more CDs in the distribution In-Reply-To: References: <55668b8c050228120473a73b01@mail.gmail.com> <42237B18.3000803@snowmoon.com> Message-ID: <20050301030152.GA26131@jadzia.bu.edu> On Mon, Feb 28, 2005 at 06:48:57PM -0500, Gerald Henriksen wrote: > I am beginning to think this is the best idea. > Delay Fedora Core 4 for 6 months. Why? That's in the FC5 timeframe already. Might as well do *both*. -- Matthew Miller mattdm at mattdm.org Boston University Linux ------> From pedro.lamarao at mndfck.org Tue Mar 1 03:43:09 2005 From: pedro.lamarao at mndfck.org (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Pedro_Lamar=E3o?=) Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 00:43:09 -0300 Subject: FC5 anaconda In-Reply-To: <200502281449.23163.czar@czarc.net> References: <200502281401.20237.czar@czarc.net> <20050228190552.GA3456@jadzia.bu.edu> <200502281449.23163.czar@czarc.net> Message-ID: <4223E4CD.8090309@mndfck.org> Gene C. wrote: > Even for Internet connected systems, if you have a number of systems to do > installs on, you do not want to have to download the packages for each > system ... you (or at least I) want to download the packages once and then do > installs on all of the systems. Consider a local mirror of the Extras repositories. Or all repositories, for that matter. -- Pedro Lamar?o From mpeters at mac.com Tue Mar 1 04:02:56 2005 From: mpeters at mac.com (Michael A. Peters) Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 04:02:56 +0000 Subject: fedora-devel-list Digest, Vol 12, Issue 86 In-Reply-To: (from rahulsundaram@gmail.com on Mon Feb 28 08:06:32 2005) References: <20050225095531.EA00873351@hormel.redhat.com> <1109555212.14742.2443.camel@localhost.localdomain> <20050228033618.GA32178@jadzia.bu.edu> <1109572560.14742.2502.camel@localhost.localdomain> <20050228140126.GA15793@jadzia.bu.edu> <31925.211.28.207.95.1109603717.squirrel@kiosk.ph.unimelb.edu.au> Message-ID: <1109649776l.17169l.1l@devel.mpeters.us> On 02/28/2005 08:06:32 AM, Rahul Sundaram wrote: > Hi > > > > > > > > Well if it's so great why isn't all the java and server stuff > placed > in > > Extras? Developers and sys-admins know how to find stuff. > > I believe the reason for this was already discussed in this list. > basically this is the first time Free java has become good enough to > be shipped with a distro and since fedora developers did the major > work in bringing it up to this point they want to push it better. I think most Java stuff belongs in JPackage.org - and that JPackage.org should have a repo file in default install. That may not happen because RH does not have oversight of JPackage.org - but I do think that is the best way to do java. A JRE with browser plugin in core though I think would be the right thing, but everything else Java, it really should (imho) leverage the JPackage "package ecosystem", which really rocks. -- Michael A. Peters http://mpeters.us/ From webmaster at margo.bijoux.nom.br Tue Mar 1 04:22:48 2005 From: webmaster at margo.bijoux.nom.br (Pedro Fernandes Macedo) Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 01:22:48 -0300 Subject: I want more CDs in the distribution In-Reply-To: <7E8BD023E1D0BED2FFF63B5C@[10.169.6.246]> References: <55668b8c050228120473a73b01@mail.gmail.com> <42237A7C.1000309@atl.lmco.com> <754f42e7050228121916f277ba@mail.gmail.com> <422394FC.8040002@margo.bijoux.nom.br> <7E8BD023E1D0BED2FFF63B5C@[10.169.6.246]> Message-ID: <4223EE18.1090204@margo.bijoux.nom.br> Kenneth Porter wrote: > --On Monday, February 28, 2005 7:02 PM -0300 Pedro Fernandes Macedo > wrote: > >> One example to answer the question: I'm a computer science student in >> the >> biggest university in my city (the 3rd >> biggest capital of brazil). And guess what? Until recently (at least 1 >> year ago), I was the only one with a DVD burner (the Digital Image >> Processing >> Lab bought a dvd burner 4 months after me and my best friend just bought >> one). 3 burners in an universe of 1500+ people gives an idea on >> how hard would it be to burn that media .... > > > The prices dropped fast recently, at least in the US. I bought an > external USB2 burner maybe two years ago, for $400, and now an > internal drive can be had for about $70, and a USB2 enclosure for > maybe another $50. Has Brazil seen any of that drop? > Only now they're starting to drop.. When I bought my burner , it was around R$500,00 (which is around US$180,00). Currently , the cheapest dvd burner is R$292,00 , while a cd burner can be found for R$79,00 (or R$98,00 if you want a better brand)... And there's also the media availability/price issue. A generic no name 4x media (or anything worse than that) is around R$4,00. A CDR is around R$1,00 (even for good brands). And the DVD-+RWs are worse... When I bought my burner , I had to order online some Samsung DVD-RW , since the noname ones were so good that my burner considered them as DVD-R ... And they were around R$15,00 each... -- Pedro Macedo From msevior at physics.unimelb.edu.au Tue Mar 1 06:13:40 2005 From: msevior at physics.unimelb.edu.au (Martin Sevior) Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 17:13:40 +1100 Subject: fedora-devel-list Digest, Vol 12, Issue 108 In-Reply-To: <20050301040315.88DE073342@hormel.redhat.com> References: <20050301040315.88DE073342@hormel.redhat.com> Message-ID: <1109657620.14742.2786.camel@localhost.localdomain> > Message: 9 > Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2005 20:32:22 -0500 > From: John Thacker > Subject: Re: fedora-devel-list Digest, Vol 12, Issue 104 > To: fedora-devel-list at redhat.com > Message-ID: <20050301013222.GA31096 at thacker.dyndns.org> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > > On Tue, Mar 01, 2005 at 01:18:01PM +1100, Martin Sevior wrote: > > > > The AbiWord community is as vibrant as ever. We committed over 300,000 > > LOC of changes to the code base over 14 months to produce AbiWord-2.2. > > We implemented all sorts of cool stuff that neither MS Word or OOo has. > > We implemented features that make the users job of creating documents > > easier and more fun. We want that code to be seen and used and > > appreciated by as many people as possible. We're in a position to be > > widely deployed across heterogenic communities like Universities and > > Schools since we have Windows, Mac and Linux clients. > > I otherwise like the program, but it's an incredible PIA for me to use > because of its absolutely horrible CJK support. So I essentially never > use it, even though a few years ago Japanese support (on Linux) went from > "completely unavailable" to "laughably horrible." OOo has very nice, > mature, professional CJK features. > > http://bugzilla.abisource.com/buglist.cgi?keywords=cjk > > Now I see that someone made it "not totally suck" on MacOSX recently, > so maybe there's hope yet for AbiWord. > See the post from today. http://www.abisource.com/mailinglists/abiword-dev/2005/Mar/0002.html Join in. Be part of the solution. As I said we're a grass roots organisation that responds to real people with real problems. We're VERY responsive to people with patches. AbiWord takes less than 10 minutes to build from scratch on a modern computer so the threshold for testing stuff is not high. Just testing and telling us what works for CJK and what doesn't is really useful. Cheers Martin From thacker at math.cornell.edu Tue Mar 1 05:34:12 2005 From: thacker at math.cornell.edu (John Thacker) Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 00:34:12 -0500 Subject: fedora-devel-list Digest, Vol 12, Issue 108 In-Reply-To: <1109657620.14742.2786.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <20050301040315.88DE073342@hormel.redhat.com> <1109657620.14742.2786.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <20050301053412.GA32335@thacker.dyndns.org> On Tue, Mar 01, 2005 at 05:13:40PM +1100, Martin Sevior wrote: > See the post from today. > > http://www.abisource.com/mailinglists/abiword-dev/2005/Mar/0002.html > > Join in. Be part of the solution. As I said we're a grass roots > organisation that responds to real people with real problems. > We're VERY responsive to people with patches. I have made some comments and bugs in Bugzilla in the past, part of which resulted in some things getting fixed, and other ones which have been left for years with "well, none of us who hack on this regularly are CJK users" comments. I know that it's a nasty cycle where CJK users won't use your program so much, which makes it harder for things to get fixed. I also know that all your custom widgets make it difficult to get the same level of support (and I know why you have those custom widgets too). However, I am willing to trust that things will improve, and I look forward to it, as Abiword does have a lot of nice features, as you said. Personally, though, I don't have the time to hack on Abiword now. Still, given all that, OOo right now does use a free license, and FC current attempts to only have one application *in Core* (as opposed to Extras) for each job. And given that, it's hard for me to support Abiword over the equally free OOo *right now* in Core as the default with the lack of workable CJK support. In the future, it might be different, but right now if you're going to choose one, it has to be the one that CJK users can actually use. It's not like being in Extras means not being available at all. (Now gnumeric I like more than the OOo Calc-- but shipping OOo Writer tends to push toward making Calc the default as well.) John Thacker -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: not available URL: From skvidal at phy.duke.edu Tue Mar 1 05:46:29 2005 From: skvidal at phy.duke.edu (seth vidal) Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 00:46:29 -0500 Subject: FC3 -> FC4 Upgrade? (was Re: reducing distribution CD count) In-Reply-To: References: <1109287914.26364.69.camel@localhost.localdomain> <421F36A6.8040401@olin.edu> <1109342585.26364.163.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1109346741.10989.13.camel@opus.phy.duke.edu> <1109346973.26364.181.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1109348125.10989.22.camel@opus.phy.duke.edu> <20050225162219.GD1048932@hiwaay.net> <1109348730.10989.33.camel@opus.phy.duke.edu> <1109349041.26364.190.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1109355427.10989.39.camel@opus.phy.duke.edu> <20050225190829.GG1048932@hiwaay.net> <1109358912.23111.1.camel@cutter> <1109360807.26364.217.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1109361494.23111.18.camel@cutter> <1109399987.27384.33.camel@cutter> <1109536319.22789.21.camel@bree.local.net> <42239279.90505@snowmoon.com> Message-ID: <1109655990.23615.9.camel@cutter> On Mon, 2005-02-28 at 23:15 -0300, Alexandre Oliva wrote: >On Feb 28, 2005, Eric Warnke wrote: > >> 2) Do what I do. Kickstart %post section that installs a rpm with >> updates fot yum repos as well as new ones. I import all the necessary >> keys and do a "yum -y update" and then "yum -y install >> packagename". > >Yeah, I had something like that at some point. selinux attributes are >somewhat messed up when you do this. At least they still are for the >configuration stuff I run in %post, that among other things runs >texhash, and tex config files get incorrectly-labeled. Perhaps it's >unrelated and I'm just barking up the wrong tree, but I was concerned >it could mess things up further and didn't try that again. selinux attributes should not be messed up by installing another package in %post from the distro. if you have a file that has the wrong attributes that came from a package file a bug against that package. -sv From naoki at valuecommerce.com Tue Mar 1 06:11:59 2005 From: naoki at valuecommerce.com (Naoki) Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 15:11:59 +0900 Subject: gnome-screenshot, gone? Message-ID: <1109657519.13826.334.camel@dragon.sys.intra> Hi all, I'm running gnome-panel-2.9.91-2 and gnome-screenshot has gone away. I can add it to the panel but the executable isn't there. FC3 package : # rpm -qlp gnome-panel-2.8.1-3.i386.rpm | grep screen /etc/gconf/schemas/gnome-panel-screenshot.schemas /usr/bin/gnome-panel-screenshot /usr/share/gnome/panel/gnome-panel-screenshot.glade /usr/share/pixmaps/gnome-screenshot.png FC4 package : $ rpm -qlp gnome-panel-2.9.91-2.i386.rpm | grep screen $ The changelog entries for screen shot show : $ rpm -qp --changelog gnome-panel-2.9.91-2.i386.rpm |grep screen - fix the extra separator left when we lack screenshot menuitem - run xscreensaver fortune instead of just "fortune" from the fish - Fix problem with "hold down print screen" (71432) - remove gnome-panel-screenshot patch now upstream - Fix gnome-panel-screenshot I've looked at the list archives but can't find it. Anybody know what happened? -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From linux00 at kornet.net Tue Mar 1 06:28:13 2005 From: linux00 at kornet.net (sangu) Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 15:28:13 +0900 Subject: gnome-screenshot, gone? In-Reply-To: <1109657526178193.0.ppp8@ppp8> References: <1109657526178193.0.ppp8@ppp8> Message-ID: <1109658493.3877.5.camel@sangu.sangu.net> $rpm -ql gnome-utils | grep gnome-screenshot /etc/gconf/schemas/gnome-screenshot.schemas /usr/bin/gnome-screenshot /usr/share/gnome-screenshot /usr/share/gnome-screenshot/glade /usr/share/gnome-screenshot/glade/gnome-screenshot.glade $rpm -q gnome-utils gnome-utils-2.9.91-1 2005-03-01 (?), 15:11 +0900, Naoki ???: > >Hi all, I'm running gnome-panel-2.9.91-2 and gnome-screenshot has gone >away. I can add it to the panel but the executable isn't there. > >FC3 package : ># rpm -qlp gnome-panel-2.8.1-3.i386.rpm | grep screen >/etc/gconf/schemas/gnome-panel-screenshot.schemas >/usr/bin/gnome-panel-screenshot >/usr/share/gnome/panel/gnome-panel-screenshot.glade >/usr/share/pixmaps/gnome-screenshot.png > >FC4 package : >$ rpm -qlp gnome-panel-2.9.91-2.i386.rpm | grep screen >$ > >The changelog entries for screen shot show : > >$ rpm -qp --changelog gnome-panel-2.9.91-2.i386.rpm |grep screen >- fix the extra separator left when we lack screenshot menuitem >- run xscreensaver fortune instead of just "fortune" from the fish >- Fix problem with "hold down print screen" (71432) >- remove gnome-panel-screenshot patch now upstream >- Fix gnome-panel-screenshot > >I've looked at the list archives but can't find it. Anybody know what >happened? >-- >fedora-devel-list mailing list >fedora-devel-list at redhat.com >http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-list From naoki at valuecommerce.com Tue Mar 1 07:02:20 2005 From: naoki at valuecommerce.com (Naoki) Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 16:02:20 +0900 Subject: gnome-screenshot, gone? In-Reply-To: <1109658493.3877.5.camel@sangu.sangu.net> References: <1109657526178193.0.ppp8@ppp8> <1109658493.3877.5.camel@sangu.sangu.net> Message-ID: <1109660540.13826.358.camel@dragon.sys.intra> Brilliant, course it is :) Cheers. On Tue, 2005-03-01 at 15:28 +0900, sangu wrote: >$rpm -ql gnome-utils | grep gnome-screenshot >/etc/gconf/schemas/gnome-screenshot.schemas >/usr/bin/gnome-screenshot >/usr/share/gnome-screenshot >/usr/share/gnome-screenshot/glade >/usr/share/gnome-screenshot/glade/gnome-screenshot.glade >$rpm -q gnome-utils >gnome-utils-2.9.91-1 > > >2005-03-01 (?), 15:11 +0900, Naoki ???: >> >>Hi all, I'm running gnome-panel-2.9.91-2 and gnome-screenshot has gone >>away. I can add it to the panel but the executable isn't there. >> >>FC3 package : >># rpm -qlp gnome-panel-2.8.1-3.i386.rpm | grep screen >>/etc/gconf/schemas/gnome-panel-screenshot.schemas >>/usr/bin/gnome-panel-screenshot >>/usr/share/gnome/panel/gnome-panel-screenshot.glade >>/usr/share/pixmaps/gnome-screenshot.png >> >>FC4 package : >>$ rpm -qlp gnome-panel-2.9.91-2.i386.rpm | grep screen >>$ >> >>The changelog entries for screen shot show : >> >>$ rpm -qp --changelog gnome-panel-2.9.91-2.i386.rpm |grep screen >>- fix the extra separator left when we lack screenshot menuitem >>- run xscreensaver fortune instead of just "fortune" from the fish >>- Fix problem with "hold down print screen" (71432) >>- remove gnome-panel-screenshot patch now upstream >>- Fix gnome-panel-screenshot >> >>I've looked at the list archives but can't find it. Anybody know what >>happened? >>-- >>fedora-devel-list mailing list >>fedora-devel-list at redhat.com >>http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-list > > > > > ...................................................................................... Mark "Naoki" Rogers /VP - Systems Engineering Systems ValueCommerce Co., Ltd. Tokyo Bldg 4F 3-32-7 Hongo Bunkyo-ku Tokyo 113-0033 Japan Tel. +81.3.3817.8995 Fax. +81.3.3812.4051 mailto:naoki at valuecommerce.co.jp ...................................................................................... From sta282 at astradyne.co.uk Tue Mar 1 07:47:31 2005 From: sta282 at astradyne.co.uk (Tet) Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 07:47:31 +0000 Subject: fedora-devel-list Digest, Vol 12, Issue 108 In-Reply-To: Your message of "Tue, 01 Mar 2005 00:34:12 EST." <20050301053412.GA32335@thacker.dyndns.org> Message-ID: <200503010747.j217lVFY030618@leto.astradyne.corp> John Thacker writes: >Still, given all that, OOo right now does use a free license, and FC >current attempts to only have one application *in Core* (as opposed to >Extras) for each job. And given that, it's hard for me to support >Abiword over the equally free OOo *right now* in Core as the default >with the lack of workable CJK support. That's fine. For you OO.o is the right solution. Just remember that there are others for whom the opposite is true. Abiword does some things that OO.o can't do, and thus for them, that's the right solution. For me, there's no question that Abiword/Gnumeric are a better combination than OO.o. But it seems there's little point in arguing about it now. AFAICT, the decision has already been made, and FC4 will ship with them in Extras. Let's just hope someone sees the light and puts them back into Core for FC5. Tet From markmc at redhat.com Tue Mar 1 08:31:13 2005 From: markmc at redhat.com (Mark McLoughlin) Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 08:31:13 +0000 Subject: gnome-screenshot, gone? In-Reply-To: <1109657519.13826.334.camel@dragon.sys.intra> References: <1109657519.13826.334.camel@dragon.sys.intra> Message-ID: <1109665873.5414.0.camel@blaa> On Tue, 2005-03-01 at 15:11 +0900, Naoki wrote: > > Hi all, I'm running gnome-panel-2.9.91-2 and gnome-screenshot has gone > away. I can add it to the panel but the executable isn't there. Its moved to gnome-utils and is called gnome-screenshot now. Cheers, Mark. From kzak at redhat.com Tue Mar 1 08:44:08 2005 From: kzak at redhat.com (Karel Zak) Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 09:44:08 +0100 Subject: I want more CDs in the distribution In-Reply-To: <55668b8c050228120473a73b01@mail.gmail.com> References: <55668b8c050228120473a73b01@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1109666648.10657.37.camel@petra> On Mon, 2005-02-28 at 12:04 -0800, Daryll Strauss wrote: > Here's a counter idea for people to chew on. I'd like to see more CDs > in the distribution, I'd just like them all to be less full. > > DISADVANTAGES: > More files to download - I don't think this is an issue > More CDs required for the full distribution - Media costs are small > and you can put it all on one DVD if you really care. This probaby is > an issue for publishers. > More disk swapping to install everything - That's a real drawback, > but since you have to swap disks anyway I'm not sure it's a big deal. > More work categorizing end user usage and arguing over which > packages are in which category. - yes :) > Users need to figure out which disks to download. You forgot important things: - We need more package maintainers for this extra work - and more time for development - and more time for testing I think Debian has experience with huge number of packages. The cost of this work is huge too. I think one possible solution is release the Extras branch less often than the Core branch. It means do something like minor releases of the core branch and the major release (that will include new Extras release). FC5.0 - Core+Extras FC5.1 - Core (with new features, but still compatible with actual Extras) FC5.2 - Core (with new features, but still compatible with actual Extras) FC6.0 - Core+Extras ... Karel -- Karel Zak From nicolas.mailhot at laposte.net Tue Mar 1 09:03:41 2005 From: nicolas.mailhot at laposte.net (Nicolas Mailhot) Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 10:03:41 +0100 (CET) Subject: fedora-devel-list Digest, Vol 12, Issue 86 In-Reply-To: <1109649776l.17169l.1l@devel.mpeters.us> References: <20050225095531.EA00873351@hormel.redhat.com> <1109555212.14742.2443.camel@localhost.localdomain> <20050228033618.GA32178@jadzia.bu.edu> <1109572560.14742.2502.camel@localhost.localdomain> <20050228140126.GA15793@jadzia.bu.edu> <31925.211.28.207.95.1109603717.squirrel@kiosk.ph.unimelb.edu.au> <1109649776l.17169l.1l@devel.mpeters.us> Message-ID: <24411.192.54.193.137.1109667821.squirrel@rousalka.dyndns.org> On Mar 1 mars 2005 5:02, Michael A. Peters a ?crit : > > On 02/28/2005 08:06:32 AM, Rahul Sundaram wrote: >> Hi >> >> > > >> > >> > Well if it's so great why isn't all the java and server stuff >> placed >> in >> > Extras? Developers and sys-admins know how to find stuff. >> >> I believe the reason for this was already discussed in this list. >> basically this is the first time Free java has become good enough to >> be shipped with a distro and since fedora developers did the major >> work in bringing it up to this point they want to push it better. > > I think most Java stuff belongs in JPackage.org - and that JPackage.org > should have a repo file in default install. That may not happen because > RH does not have oversight of JPackage.org - but I do think that is the > best way to do java. A JRE with browser plugin in core though I think > would be the right thing, but everything else Java, it really should > (imho) leverage the JPackage "package ecosystem", which really rocks. I can tell you Red Hat can influence pretty heavily JPackage right now, if only because some of the most active contributors these days are @hat people (Suse/Novell & Mandrake are welcome too but so far they've committed far less resources than RH). Now due the way JPP is organised we're very good for stuff that is distro-independant but very bad for stuff like native builds that must be rebuilt separately for each distros (just consider the time it took for FE to get its build infrastructure in place, and it had the backing of a real corp behind). So for now we need Fedora so gcj/native builds can be tried and take off. JPP's contribution is more a pool of noarch packages and a place were rpm distros can try to sync a bit than a full FOSS ready-to-use java repository. Regards, -- Nicolas Mailhot From nicolas.mailhot at laposte.net Tue Mar 1 09:14:09 2005 From: nicolas.mailhot at laposte.net (Nicolas Mailhot) Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 10:14:09 +0100 (CET) Subject: I want more CDs in the distribution In-Reply-To: References: <55668b8c050228120473a73b01@mail.gmail.com> <42237B18.3000803@snowmoon.com> Message-ID: <64134.192.54.193.137.1109668449.squirrel@rousalka.dyndns.org> On Mar 1 mars 2005 0:48, Gerald Henriksen a ?crit : > On Mon, 28 Feb 2005 22:49:19 +0100 (CET), you wrote: > >>Yet another alternative: >> >>Postpone FC4 until both Anaconda repo support and Fedora Extras are >> ready, >>and let FC3 evolve more controlled over the stretched period. Preparing >>FC4 will result in spending less resources in Anaconda and Fedora Extras. > > I am beginning to think this is the best idea. > > Delay Fedora Core 4 for 6 months. > > This hopefully gives time to get Anaconda and all the other relevant > bits set up to allow for a distribution that is made up of 2 parts > (Core and Extras). Prehaps even rename them to better reflect that > they are of equal value. > > It also gives more time to allow the things people are aiming to try > and include (gcc 4, java, openoffice.org 2) to get ready as well as > get people and mirrors used to Extras. There's always some almost ready next big thing we should wait for. Slipping a bit is reasonnable. Slipping a lot is a good way to stay stuck indefinitely. This is why rolling releases ? la rawhide and frequent releases ? la FC are good - with them "stuff to be looked at for next release" does not pile up to the point it's impossible to manage. (IMHO, BTW this is the reason the FC project continued to exist even when RH management was less than convinced about it - the release schedule of RHEL makes it pretty impossible to jump directly from one release to the other without some intermediate steps between them.) Regards, -- Nicolas Mailhot From sta282 at astradyne.co.uk Tue Mar 1 09:45:45 2005 From: sta282 at astradyne.co.uk (Tet) Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 09:45:45 +0000 Subject: Package pruning for FC4 and beyond - DRAFT FINAL In-Reply-To: Your message of "Tue, 01 Mar 2005 09:29:07 +1100." <20050228222907.GA21427@cskk.homeip.net> Message-ID: <200503010945.j219jjnk031024@leto.astradyne.corp> Cameron Simpson writes: >| w3m/w3m-el - another text pager/web browser > >Part of the standard recipe for rendering HTML in mutt (and probably other >text mode mail readers). Given that you advocate punting lynx too, how >do you suggest text mode users render HTML for humans? There are at least three text browsers in FC. All that's being proposed is removing one or two. A means of rendering HTML for text mode users will remain. Exactly which means of doing so it what's being discussed (FWIW, I use both lynx and links on a regular basis, but could happily lose w3m). Tet From tagoh at redhat.com Tue Mar 1 09:36:17 2005 From: tagoh at redhat.com (Akira TAGOH) Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 18:36:17 +0900 (JST) Subject: Package pruning for FC4 and beyond In-Reply-To: References: <604aa79105022809106bd60c13@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20050301.183617.653026525707332394.tagoh@redhat.com> >>>>> On Mon, 28 Feb 2005 12:23:33 -0500 (EST), >>>>> "EL" == Elliot Lee wrote: EL> On Mon, 28 Feb 2005, Jeff Spaleta wrote: >> On Mon, 28 Feb 2005 11:51:06 -0500 (EST), Elliot Lee wrote: >> > A while back I tried to work out the whole "text mode browser" confusion. >> > There is also w3m in the mix. Each of them has unique attributes for >> > particular users (blind users, CJK users, etc.) Someone such as yourself >> > needs to find out all the details, pick the best one or two for the >> > overall Fedora audience, and move the other(s) to Extras. >> >> is there a reasonable good checklist of 'details' people are suppose >> to be looking for? Its very easy to forget about CJK users or the like >> if you personally never have to deal with the tech issues that raises. EL> Akira is the RH package owner of w3m, and he's well qualified to fill us EL> in on the details because he did that last time I brought the issue up ;-) Though I mentioned in the another mail on this thread, the details is simple. even if we use UTF-8 for the default locale, the web page isn't necessarily UTF-8. but both lynx and elinks doesn't take care of it. that's all for the internationalization. We could just ignore it, but it will make it terrible and unusable thing then. -- Akira TAGOH From tarjei.knapstad at predichem.com Tue Mar 1 11:49:54 2005 From: tarjei.knapstad at predichem.com (Tarjei Knapstad) Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 12:49:54 +0100 Subject: More package pruning - i18n Message-ID: <1109677794.16953.55.camel@tarjei.predichem.nett> With all the talk about package removal I thought I'd drop my $0.02 in as well. One set of packages that take up a _lot_ of space is the language/i18n support packages. (I didn't check the exact size, but I think it's in the vicinity of 300-400 MB?) The vast majority of people will only need support for either one language in addition to English or none at all, so I think these are a prime candidate for Extras. Before anyone starts screaming, let me explain how I envision this (and for the record I'm Norwegian, so please don't call me ignorant :)) Anaconda should of course retain it's language support for people who either don't know English or are more comfortable using their native language. Then, either: a) During the Anaconda install, ask the user if they would like support for any additional languages. If they selected a different language for the install process this should be tagged off automatically. Have yum (or whatever) pull these packages from Extras and install them during firstboot. b) If it's difficult to put this in Anaconda, move the process to the firstboot setup process. Now that the i18n stuff for OO.org has been split up this becomes more viable thatn it was before. For distributors/people with limited bandwidth I think the language stuff could be packaged onto a separate Locale ISO (ooh, that brought out some nostalgia from the Amiga days :)) Am I making any sense here? Arguments for/against? Regards, -- Tarjei From ivg2 at cornell.edu Tue Mar 1 11:59:53 2005 From: ivg2 at cornell.edu (Ivan Gyurdiev) Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 06:59:53 -0500 Subject: gpdf vs evince Message-ID: <1109678393.32115.9.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> Hi, I noticed gv, ggv, and gpdf were removed from FC3 in favor of evince. I had never used evince before, so I had no opinion. However now that I'm using it, it looks very nice, but it's not able to change orientation of my PDF. That's a major oversight IMHO, since now I have to read my course documents sideways or use xpdf. IIRC ggv, or gpdf, I don't remember which, was able to change orientation -- Ivan Gyurdiev Cornell University From markmc at redhat.com Tue Mar 1 12:00:04 2005 From: markmc at redhat.com (Mark McLoughlin) Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 12:00:04 +0000 Subject: gpdf vs evince In-Reply-To: <1109678393.32115.9.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> References: <1109678393.32115.9.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> Message-ID: <1109678405.25776.5.camel@blaa> On Tue, 2005-03-01 at 06:59 -0500, Ivan Gyurdiev wrote: > Hi, I noticed gv, ggv, and gpdf were removed from FC3 in favor of > evince. I had never used evince before, so I had no opinion. However > now that I'm using it, it looks very nice, but it's not able to change > orientation of my PDF. That's a major oversight IMHO, since now I have > to read my course documents sideways or use xpdf. IIRC ggv, or gpdf, I > don't remember which, was able to change orientation http://bugzilla.gnome.org/enter_bug.cgi?product=evince :-) Cheers, Mark. From sta282 at astradyne.co.uk Tue Mar 1 12:24:13 2005 From: sta282 at astradyne.co.uk (Tet) Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 12:24:13 +0000 Subject: gpdf vs evince In-Reply-To: Your message of "Tue, 01 Mar 2005 06:59:53 EST." <1109678393.32115.9.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> Message-ID: <200503011224.j21CODBP032208@leto.astradyne.corp> Ivan Gyurdiev writes: >Hi, I noticed gv, ggv, and gpdf were removed from FC3 in favor of >evince. I had never used evince before, so I had no opinion. I found myself in the same position, so I thought I'd give evince a go. The only problem is, there is no easy way of trying it out. "A "yum search evince" comes back empty, for example. Since evince doesn't even appear to be in FC3, isn't it a bit premature to be talking about it replacing other (working, available) apps? I guess I could probably get it from Rawhide, but should that really be necessary? I'm all for progress, but I'd rather see at least some overlap between a proposed new app, and the older apps it's intended to replace, if for no other reason that giving users a chance to have a side by side comaprison. Isn't this supposed to be a meritocracy? Let the best app win? Replacing working and used code with an untried and untested app seems a little rash... Tet From cra at WPI.EDU Tue Mar 1 12:26:02 2005 From: cra at WPI.EDU (Chuck R. Anderson) Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 07:26:02 -0500 Subject: Package pruning for FC4 and beyond - DRAFT FINAL In-Reply-To: <20050228222907.GA21427@cskk.homeip.net> References: <422007DD.1020404@snowmoon.com> <42207BEB.7020000@snowmoon.com> <422086A8.7020200@snowmoon.com> <604aa79105022607043d109bf1@mail.gmail.com> <422092F8.4050003@snowmoon.com> <4220B0C2.2060007@snowmoon.com> <42215618.9000905@snowmoon.com> <20050228222907.GA21427@cskk.homeip.net> Message-ID: <20050301122602.GQ21024@angus.ind.WPI.EDU> On Tue, Mar 01, 2005 at 09:29:07AM +1100, Cameron Simpson wrote: > Got another text->ps in core please? > Some tools are used on their own! enscript From marco at gnome.org Tue Mar 1 12:32:39 2005 From: marco at gnome.org (Marco Pesenti Gritti) Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 13:32:39 +0100 Subject: gpdf vs evince In-Reply-To: <200503011224.j21CODBP032208@leto.astradyne.corp> References: <200503011224.j21CODBP032208@leto.astradyne.corp> Message-ID: <1109680359.16580.2.camel@localhost.localdomain> On Tue, 2005-03-01 at 12:24 +0000, Tet wrote: > Ivan Gyurdiev writes: > > >Hi, I noticed gv, ggv, and gpdf were removed from FC3 in favor of > >evince. I had never used evince before, so I had no opinion. > > I found myself in the same position, so I thought I'd give evince > a go. The only problem is, there is no easy way of trying it out. > "A "yum search evince" comes back empty, for example. Since evince > doesn't even appear to be in FC3, isn't it a bit premature to be > talking about it replacing other (working, available) apps? I guess > I could probably get it from Rawhide, but should that really be > necessary? Unfortunately evince depend on gtk 2.6, so providing FC3 packages is not possible. Marco From sta282 at astradyne.co.uk Tue Mar 1 13:04:31 2005 From: sta282 at astradyne.co.uk (Tet) Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 13:04:31 +0000 Subject: gpdf vs evince In-Reply-To: Your message of "Tue, 01 Mar 2005 13:32:39 +0100." <1109680359.16580.2.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <200503011304.j21D4VcS032333@leto.astradyne.corp> Marco Pesenti Gritti writes: >Unfortunately evince depend on gtk 2.6, so providing FC3 packages is not >possible. That's fine. But I'd say it makes deprecating other apps in favour of evince premature for FC4. Tet From rahulsundaram at yahoo.co.in Tue Mar 1 13:08:14 2005 From: rahulsundaram at yahoo.co.in (Rahul Sundaram) Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 05:08:14 -0800 (PST) Subject: gpdf vs evince In-Reply-To: <200503011304.j21D4VcS032333@leto.astradyne.corp> Message-ID: <20050301130814.71673.qmail@web8503.mail.in.yahoo.com> --- Tet wrote: > > Marco Pesenti Gritti writes: > > >Unfortunately evince depend on gtk 2.6, so > providing FC3 packages is not > >possible. > > That's fine. But I'd say it makes deprecating other > apps in favour > of evince premature for FC4. > >From my experience using rawhide so far, evince is good enough for regular use. ===== Regards Rahul Sundaram __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - Find what you need with new enhanced search. http://info.mail.yahoo.com/mail_250 From johnp at redhat.com Tue Mar 1 13:12:08 2005 From: johnp at redhat.com (John (J5) Palmieri) Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 08:12:08 -0500 Subject: gpdf vs evince In-Reply-To: <200503011224.j21CODBP032208@leto.astradyne.corp> References: <200503011224.j21CODBP032208@leto.astradyne.corp> Message-ID: <1109682728.2532.20.camel@localhost.localdomain> On Tue, 2005-03-01 at 07:24, Tet wrote: > Ivan Gyurdiev writes: > > >Hi, I noticed gv, ggv, and gpdf were removed from FC3 in favor of > >evince. I had never used evince before, so I had no opinion. > > I found myself in the same position, so I thought I'd give evince > a go. The only problem is, there is no easy way of trying it out. > "A "yum search evince" comes back empty, for example. Since evince > doesn't even appear to be in FC3, isn't it a bit premature to be > talking about it replacing other (working, available) apps? I guess > I could probably get it from Rawhide, but should that really be > necessary? > > I'm all for progress, but I'd rather see at least some overlap between > a proposed new app, and the older apps it's intended to replace, > if for no other reason that giving users a chance to have a side > by side comaprison. Isn't this supposed to be a meritocracy? Let > the best app win? Replacing working and used code with an untried > and untested app seems a little rash... Evince is just a rewrite of the gpdf code which most people thought was getting unwieldy to maintain. In a short period of time it surpassed the functionality of gpdf. Evince is actually being maintained and is under active development. The other packages I believe may show up in Extras. Poppler has just been announced which is a fork of the xpdf codebase into a library which both KDE and Gnome are looking to use as their pdf viewing backend which all in the long run will create a better PDF viewer. Fedora is a proving ground for new technologies. -- J5 From ivg2 at cornell.edu Tue Mar 1 13:18:18 2005 From: ivg2 at cornell.edu (Ivan Gyurdiev) Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 08:18:18 -0500 Subject: gpdf vs evince In-Reply-To: <20050301130814.71673.qmail@web8503.mail.in.yahoo.com> References: <20050301130814.71673.qmail@web8503.mail.in.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1109683098.764.5.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> >> That's fine. But I'd say it makes deprecating other >> apps in favour >> of evince premature for FC4. >> > >>From my experience using rawhide so far, evince is >good enough for regular use. Sure, let's completely ignore the issue which I just pointed out three emails above - that should make it go away. I do like evince. I particularly like the fact that it can select and copy text. For some reason no other pdf viewer can do that besides xpdf. I was just getting excited about using evince, but now I find out it can't rotate - not cool at all. If I've missed it somewhere please point out how evince can rotate? -- Ivan Gyurdiev Cornell University From shiva at sewingwitch.com Tue Mar 1 13:17:59 2005 From: shiva at sewingwitch.com (Kenneth Porter) Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 05:17:59 -0800 Subject: I want more CDs in the distribution In-Reply-To: <4223EE18.1090204@margo.bijoux.nom.br> References: <55668b8c050228120473a73b01@mail.gmail.com> <42237A7C.1000309@atl.lmco.com> <754f42e7050228121916f277ba@mail.gmail.com> <422394FC.8040002@margo.bijoux.nom.br> <7E8BD023E1D0BED2FFF63B5C@[10.169.6.246]> <4223EE18.1090204@margo.bijoux.nom.br> Message-ID: <70E46988EEFD9C37A77A1AE6@[10.0.0.14]> --On Tuesday, March 01, 2005 1:22 AM -0300 Pedro Fernandes Macedo wrote: > A generic no name 4x media (or anything worse than that) is around > R$4,00. A CDR is around R$1,00 (even for good brands). For comparison, I'm seeing DVD +R and -R in the US for about $0.40 for 4x and $2.00 for 8x. This reminds me of the maxim, "Never underestimate the bandwidth of a station wagon full of tapes". There's a humorous web page updating this to a 747 full of DVD's here: From sta282 at astradyne.co.uk Tue Mar 1 13:21:22 2005 From: sta282 at astradyne.co.uk (Tet) Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 13:21:22 +0000 Subject: gpdf vs evince In-Reply-To: Your message of "Tue, 01 Mar 2005 05:08:14 PST." <20050301130814.71673.qmail@web8503.mail.in.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <200503011321.j21DLMP5032583@leto.astradyne.corp> Rahul Sundaram writes: >>From my experience using rawhide so far, evince is >good enough for regular use. Yeah, but the few users that have played with it from Rawhide aren't enough of a proving ground. It'll only get a decent shakedown with the widespread use that will come from being part of Core. I think that's absolutely the right thing to do. I'm just uncomfortable with removing the older packages until evince has proven itself. Just MHO. I just hope that when I finally get to try it, it'll be better than the slow bloated pig that is ggv (I still use gv because ggv sucks so badly). Tet From Axel.Thimm at ATrpms.net Tue Mar 1 13:23:49 2005 From: Axel.Thimm at ATrpms.net (Axel Thimm) Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 14:23:49 +0100 Subject: Intel Pro Wireless cards In-Reply-To: <4223505B.20402@snowmoon.com> References: <4223505B.20402@snowmoon.com> Message-ID: <20050301132349.GG13835@neu.nirvana> On Mon, Feb 28, 2005 at 12:09:47PM -0500, Eric Warnke wrote: > After reviewing the archives of the various lists I have found no > discussion on the topic of wireless driver inclusion in FC. > > I have checked with LICENSE and FAQ for the intel driver and firmware > and was wondering if it could be included in core. Without those driver > it makes most centrino based laptops useless without special handling. > > Specifically since I know people will ask, the problem must lie in the > firmware since the driver is GPL. The firmware is under a commercial > licence that allows redistribution as long as a small number of > conditions are met. Distributed by rpm and installed the only condition > that needs to be met is that the LICENCE file needs to be installed with > the firmware. > > http://ipw2100.sourceforge.net/firmware.php?fid=1 > > "*Your rights to redistribute the Software shall be contingent upon your > installation of this Agreement in its entirety in the same directory as > the Software.*" > > > So, is this a non-starter, or can this be accomodated by FC? I know > this would be a bog help to the laptop users out there. At least if we > can get the driver support in core so that each kernel release does not > break laptop support I would be most grateful. Try the packages at http://ATrpms.net/name/ipw2200/ http://ATrpms.net/name/ipw2100/ http://ATrpms.net/name/ipw2200-firmware/ http://ATrpms.net/name/ipw2100-firmware/ and, if you are adventurous http://ATrpms.net/name/ipw2200-testing/ http://ATrpms.net/name/ipw2100-testing/ -- Axel.Thimm at ATrpms.net -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: not available URL: From rdieter at math.unl.edu Tue Mar 1 13:32:10 2005 From: rdieter at math.unl.edu (Rex Dieter) Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 07:32:10 -0600 Subject: rawhide report: 20050224 changes In-Reply-To: References: <200502241852.j1OIqU0T017593@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> Message-ID: <42246EDA.4060002@math.unl.edu> Lars wrote: >>Removed package kdetoys > why is the kdetoys package removed? > i enjoy the kweatherservice/applet all the time, its *really* nice. > please, bring it back to core, or import it to extras. It's going to extras. -- Rex From alan at redhat.com Tue Mar 1 13:45:57 2005 From: alan at redhat.com (Alan Cox) Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 08:45:57 -0500 Subject: reducing distribution CD count In-Reply-To: <20050224175035.22391185@python2> References: <200502240906.20729.czar@czarc.net> <20050224175035.22391185@python2> Message-ID: <20050301134557.GA7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> On Thu, Feb 24, 2005 at 05:50:35PM +0100, Matthias Saou wrote: > - Both tuxracer and bzflag were removed, but many people (Havoc, > Alan) definitely want at least one good 3D game to "show off". And to debug 3D. We no longer have any way to debug 3D problems on Fedora with packages we know the client side of and build form. From alan at redhat.com Tue Mar 1 13:46:58 2005 From: alan at redhat.com (Alan Cox) Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 08:46:58 -0500 Subject: reducing distribution CD count In-Reply-To: References: <200502240906.20729.czar@czarc.net> <20050224175035.22391185@python2> Message-ID: <20050301134658.GB7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> On Thu, Feb 24, 2005 at 12:21:26PM -0500, Elliot Lee wrote: > > - Both tuxracer and bzflag were removed, but many people (Havoc, > > Alan) definitely want at least one good 3D game to "show off". > > It can be showed off without being included in Core. I can no longer credibly work on fixing 3D bug reports. This *is* a problem From mricon at gmail.com Tue Mar 1 13:47:12 2005 From: mricon at gmail.com (Konstantin Ryabitsev) Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 08:47:12 -0500 Subject: More package pruning - i18n In-Reply-To: <1109677794.16953.55.camel@tarjei.predichem.nett> References: <1109677794.16953.55.camel@tarjei.predichem.nett> Message-ID: On Tue, 01 Mar 2005 12:49:54 +0100, Tarjei Knapstad wrote: > Before anyone starts > screaming, let me explain how I envision this (and for the record I'm > Norwegian, so please don't call me ignorant :)) Any Swedes here care to chime in? :) (see, you can always find someone) > Am I making any sense here? Arguments for/against? This was recently brought up, but the (in)decision has been that until Anaconda can do non-Core package installs, there is no reason to do anything for FC4. Firstboot doesn't really help since it's possible that network hardware isn't working properly after the initial boot, so it has to be done during the install procedure itself. Besides, if you don't know English very well, getting through various "do this to add language support" screens becomes difficult. Regards, -- Konstantin Ryabitsev Zlotniks, INC From skvidal at phy.duke.edu Tue Mar 1 13:57:20 2005 From: skvidal at phy.duke.edu (seth vidal) Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 08:57:20 -0500 Subject: reducing distribution CD count In-Reply-To: <20050301134658.GB7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> References: <200502240906.20729.czar@czarc.net> <20050224175035.22391185@python2> <20050301134658.GB7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> Message-ID: <1109685440.23615.42.camel@cutter> On Tue, 2005-03-01 at 08:46 -0500, Alan Cox wrote: >On Thu, Feb 24, 2005 at 12:21:26PM -0500, Elliot Lee wrote: >> > - Both tuxracer and bzflag were removed, but many people (Havoc, >> > Alan) definitely want at least one good 3D game to "show off". >> >> It can be showed off without being included in Core. > >I can no longer credibly work on fixing 3D bug reports. This *is* a problem So, just to make sure I understand, yum doesn't work for you? You can't run: yum install bzflag2 tuxracer ? -sv From carwyn at carwyn.com Tue Mar 1 13:56:04 2005 From: carwyn at carwyn.com (Carwyn Edwards) Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 13:56:04 +0000 Subject: reducing distribution CD count In-Reply-To: <1109685440.23615.42.camel@cutter> References: <200502240906.20729.czar@czarc.net> <20050224175035.22391185@python2> <20050301134658.GB7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> <1109685440.23615.42.camel@cutter> Message-ID: <42247474.7080606@carwyn.com> seth vidal wrote: >>I can no longer credibly work on fixing 3D bug reports. This *is* a problem >> >> > >So, just to make sure I understand, yum doesn't work for you? > > I think Alan was meaning more from a political standpoint. I suspect that Red Hat staff have more justification for fixing things in Core than Extras. Carwyn From sta282 at astradyne.co.uk Tue Mar 1 13:58:02 2005 From: sta282 at astradyne.co.uk (Tet) Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 13:58:02 +0000 Subject: reducing distribution CD count In-Reply-To: Your message of "Tue, 01 Mar 2005 08:57:20 EST." <1109685440.23615.42.camel@cutter> Message-ID: <200503011358.j21Dw2st000363@leto.astradyne.corp> seth vidal writes: >So, just to make sure I understand, yum doesn't work for you? > >You can't run: yum install bzflag2 tuxracer ? Perhaps he's referring to the fact that he can no longer rely on an end user reporting a bug having a 3D application present with which to test any fixes. Remember, Extras will simply be unavailable to some people. Tet From skvidal at phy.duke.edu Tue Mar 1 14:05:22 2005 From: skvidal at phy.duke.edu (seth vidal) Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 09:05:22 -0500 Subject: reducing distribution CD count In-Reply-To: <42247474.7080606@carwyn.com> References: <200502240906.20729.czar@czarc.net> <20050224175035.22391185@python2> <20050301134658.GB7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> <1109685440.23615.42.camel@cutter> <42247474.7080606@carwyn.com> Message-ID: <1109685922.23615.48.camel@cutter> >I think Alan was meaning more from a political standpoint. I suspect >that Red Hat staff have more justification for fixing things in Core >than Extras. I don't think I understand how this is political. We're talking about a single command post-install. He was talking about debugging, I don't think it's CRAZY that a developer have to run a single command in order to debug something. bzflag and tuxracer were not in the normal install in core, iirc. So why is it harder to install them now than before? is it b/c they're in a separate repo? But that repo will be on by default for fc4, so how is that harder for the end user or developer? -sv From skvidal at phy.duke.edu Tue Mar 1 14:07:32 2005 From: skvidal at phy.duke.edu (seth vidal) Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 09:07:32 -0500 Subject: reducing distribution CD count In-Reply-To: <200503011358.j21Dw2st000363@leto.astradyne.corp> References: <200503011358.j21Dw2st000363@leto.astradyne.corp> Message-ID: <1109686052.23615.53.camel@cutter> On Tue, 2005-03-01 at 13:58 +0000, Tet wrote: >seth vidal writes: > >>So, just to make sure I understand, yum doesn't work for you? >> >>You can't run: yum install bzflag2 tuxracer ? > >Perhaps he's referring to the fact that he can no longer rely on an >end user reporting a bug having a 3D application present with which >to test any fixes. Remember, Extras will simply be unavailable to >some people. 1. so a user can report a bug (presumably by bugzilla, on the internet) but can't download bzflag or tuxracer? How is that unavailable? 2. also what about gl-gears or whatever it's called - it comes with x server, I thought, can't that be used as a tester? -sv From alan at redhat.com Tue Mar 1 14:04:00 2005 From: alan at redhat.com (Alan Cox) Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 09:04:00 -0500 Subject: ITE 8212 and pwc drivers absent in Rawhide In-Reply-To: <20050225082208.GA14931@redhat.com> References: <1109319950.5110.22.camel@localhost.localdomain> <20050225082208.GA14931@redhat.com> Message-ID: <20050301140400.GD7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> On Fri, Feb 25, 2005 at 03:22:08AM -0500, Dave Jones wrote: > Right now, they're only in Alan Cox's -ac tree, for which there > is no patch that applies to the 2.6.11rc tree that FC3 is tracking. You can track 11rc, but the 2.6.11rc still has all the locking holes unfixed. The IT8212 driver depends upon the newer IDE work so isn't independant of the core IDE changes. I tried to resolve that but never managed to resolve it with Bartlomiej. Similar problems with the changes to make ide-cd work although that may be simpler to port over one day. Given the mess the old PATA ide code is and the number of bugs that are essentially unfixable (and that isn't Bartlomiej fault the code just needs a total rewrite but 2.6 has no non stable tree to fix it) my longer term plan is to work with the folks moving all the IDE drivers to the newer SATA (and now PATA aware) layer once the right bits are there and I have time. Its simply easier that fixing the 2.6. base IDE code. Alan From alan at redhat.com Tue Mar 1 14:04:54 2005 From: alan at redhat.com (Alan Cox) Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 09:04:54 -0500 Subject: ITE 8212 and pwc drivers absent in Rawhide In-Reply-To: <20050225082208.GA14931@redhat.com> References: <1109319950.5110.22.camel@localhost.localdomain> <20050225082208.GA14931@redhat.com> Message-ID: <20050301140454.GE7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> On Fri, Feb 25, 2005 at 03:22:08AM -0500, Dave Jones wrote: > Right now, they're only in Alan Cox's -ac tree, for which there > is no patch that applies to the 2.6.11rc tree that FC3 is tracking. As a PS: the pwc driver applies as a direct drop in from -ac to the base tree. The only reason it hasn't been applied seems to be that I've not split the cleaned up one out for Andrew Morton yet From ph18 at cornell.edu Tue Mar 1 14:06:15 2005 From: ph18 at cornell.edu (Paul A Houle) Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 09:06:15 -0500 (EST) Subject: Entering the DVD age... In-Reply-To: <70E46988EEFD9C37A77A1AE6@[10.0.0.14]> References: <55668b8c050228120473a73b01@mail.gmail.com> <42237A7C.1000309@atl.lmco.com> <754f42e7050228121916f277ba@mail.gmail.com> <422394FC.8040002@margo.bijoux.nom.br> <7E8BD023E1D0BED2FFF63B5C@[10.169.6.246]> <4223EE18.1090204@margo.bijoux.nom.br> <70E46988EEFD9C37A77A1AE6@[10.0.0.14]> Message-ID: <49688.67.138.149.162.1109685975.squirrel@67.138.149.162> I think Fedora should look at the CD crisis as an opportunity rather than the need to axe a lot of packages in a hurry. First, the world is moving towards DVD. It's an absolute joy to install Fedora off a DVD, although I've often found that process of downloading an manipulating a disk image that big can be challenging. (BitTorrent anyone?) My AMD64 has an optical drive that reads and writes every CD and DVD format (other than double-sided) that cost about $100; in the long term, the majority of users are going to enjoy that convenience. It may make sense for Fedora to see itself primarily as a DVD product, and to see the CDs as a secondary product. The CDs ought to be there for people who don't have a DVD drive. Also, I like the idea of being able to "target" Fedora for particular types of installation -- for instance, I can picture a single-disk distribution that brings the system up with a minimal installation and does a network install from there. I can also see a "KDE desktop" disk and a "Gnome desktop" disk. Part of Fedora's trouble is that it often packages five or six packages that almost work instead of one package that really works. (Having a GUI and being written in Python are two big risk factors.) I'm typing this on a Mac Mini that I just bought, and I've been quite impressed with Mac OS X; Mac OS X standardizes on Postfix as an MTA -- it has one program for organizing music, iTunes, which really works. Of course, Fedora might not be able to shake that off the way that a new distribution can, say, Linspire. One some level it's really silly that Fedora has both the Gnome and KDE desktops, yet there are two reasons why that can't change: (1) Neither of those desktops are 100% satisfactory, and even if you're running one desktop, you're going to want some apps from the other desktop and libraries to run the other desktop, and (2) politics. If Fedora remains a community project, it's likely to suffer from this "big tent" effect. It's going to be hard to make the decision to marginalize a project which has made great contributions to the Linux/Unix world, despite the fact that a real quality consumer OS is, almost by definition, going to have one MTA and one desktop. On the other hand, if we see it as an OS for enthusiasts that other entities can repackage, that might be a good place to be. From terraformers at gmx.net Tue Mar 1 13:57:41 2005 From: terraformers at gmx.net (Lars) Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 14:57:41 +0100 Subject: rawhide report: 20050224 changes References: <200502241852.j1OIqU0T017593@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <42246EDA.4060002@math.unl.edu> Message-ID: Rex Dieter wrote: > Lars wrote: >>>Removed package kdetoys > >> why is the kdetoys package removed? >> i enjoy the kweatherservice/applet all the time, its *really* nice. >> please, bring it back to core, or import it to extras. > > It's going to extras. > > -- Rex > great! thanks a lot ! best lars From rahulsundaram at yahoo.co.in Tue Mar 1 14:16:59 2005 From: rahulsundaram at yahoo.co.in (Rahul Sundaram) Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 06:16:59 -0800 (PST) Subject: gpdf vs evince In-Reply-To: <1109683098.764.5.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> Message-ID: <20050301141659.91409.qmail@web8503.mail.in.yahoo.com> --- Ivan Gyurdiev wrote: > > >> That's fine. But I'd say it makes deprecating > other > >> apps in favour > >> of evince premature for FC4. > >> > > > >>From my experience using rawhide so far, evince is > >good enough for regular use. > > Sure, let's completely ignore the issue which I just > pointed out three > emails above - that should make it go away. you do realise that development on evince hasnt stopped and its current state in rawhide maybe completely different from what would ship in fc4. so you can file bug reports now and see if they are being actively fixed. if not feel free to complain its not like ggv which was the default before was a very good app and you can always install it with yum if you have problems using evince. ===== Regards Rahul Sundaram __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Sports - Sign up for Fantasy Baseball. http://baseball.fantasysports.yahoo.com/ From rahulsundaram at yahoo.co.in Tue Mar 1 14:20:31 2005 From: rahulsundaram at yahoo.co.in (Rahul Sundaram) Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 06:20:31 -0800 (PST) Subject: gpdf vs evince In-Reply-To: <200503011304.j21D4VcS032333@leto.astradyne.corp> Message-ID: <20050301142031.62976.qmail@web8504.mail.in.yahoo.com> --- Tet wrote: > > Marco Pesenti Gritti writes: > > >Unfortunately evince depend on gtk 2.6, so > providing FC3 packages is not > >possible. > > That's fine. But I'd say it makes deprecating other > apps in favour > of evince premature for FC4. it seems premature to complain about it now :-) Lets wait for near code freeze and see if Evince has important missing features and then raise a alert then. Remember that fc4 will have extras repo enabled by default too ===== Regards Rahul Sundaram __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - Helps protect you from nasty viruses. http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail From alan at redhat.com Tue Mar 1 14:20:55 2005 From: alan at redhat.com (Alan Cox) Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 09:20:55 -0500 Subject: ITE 8212 and pwc drivers absent in Rawhide In-Reply-To: <20050226050705.GA11218@kroah.com> References: <1109319950.5110.22.camel@localhost.localdomain> <20050226050705.GA11218@kroah.com> Message-ID: <20050301142055.GF7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> On Fri, Feb 25, 2005 at 09:07:05PM -0800, Greg KH wrote: > The pwc driver author asked for it to be removed. It no longer has a > maintainer nor anyone who wants to support it. Until then it will Untrue. It has a new maintainer and has had one for several months now. From skvidal at phy.duke.edu Tue Mar 1 14:26:21 2005 From: skvidal at phy.duke.edu (seth vidal) Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 09:26:21 -0500 Subject: Entering the DVD age... In-Reply-To: <49688.67.138.149.162.1109685975.squirrel@67.138.149.162> References: <55668b8c050228120473a73b01@mail.gmail.com> <42237A7C.1000309@atl.lmco.com> <754f42e7050228121916f277ba@mail.gmail.com> <422394FC.8040002@margo.bijoux.nom.br> <7E8BD023E1D0BED2FFF63B5C@[10.169.6.246]> <4223EE18.1090204@margo.bijoux.nom.br> <70E46988EEFD9C37A77A1AE6@[10.0.0.14]> <49688.67.138.149.162.1109685975.squirrel@67.138.149.162> Message-ID: <1109687181.23615.61.camel@cutter> On Tue, 2005-03-01 at 09:06 -0500, Paul A Houle wrote: > I think Fedora should look at the CD crisis as an opportunity rather >than the need to axe a lot of packages in a hurry. > > First, the world is moving towards DVD. It's an absolute joy to >install Fedora off a DVD, although I've often found that process of >downloading an manipulating a disk image that big can be challenging. >(BitTorrent anyone?) It's linked off of the fedora download page: http://torrent.linux.duke.edu > My AMD64 has an optical drive that reads and writes every CD and DVD >format (other than double-sided) that cost about $100; in the long >term, the majority of users are going to enjoy that convenience. DVDs are available but: 1. thousands of users don't have them/can't afford them 2. many can't boot from them even if they did have them -sv -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From alan at redhat.com Tue Mar 1 14:22:53 2005 From: alan at redhat.com (Alan Cox) Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 09:22:53 -0500 Subject: ITE 8212 and pwc drivers absent in Rawhide In-Reply-To: <1109405368.1049.6.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <1109319950.5110.22.camel@localhost.localdomain> <20050226050705.GA11218@kroah.com> <1109405368.1049.6.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <20050301142253.GG7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> On Sat, Feb 26, 2005 at 09:09:27AM +0100, Peter Backlund wrote: > IIRC, Alan Cox stepped up as a maintainer of the driver, and it's > included in the -ac patchset. I offered to, but there are other maintainers. I mostly offered to prove Linus was being totally two faced about it. When he removed the driver at the original authors request I asked him to remove all my code too because his approach was offensive to me. He refused. The new maintainer has not only taken over maintenance but has also replaced the binary only modules with open source equivalents. From Nigel.Metheringham at dev.intechnology.co.uk Tue Mar 1 14:24:26 2005 From: Nigel.Metheringham at dev.intechnology.co.uk (Nigel Metheringham) Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 14:24:26 +0000 Subject: Entering the DVD age... In-Reply-To: <49688.67.138.149.162.1109685975.squirrel@67.138.149.162> References: <55668b8c050228120473a73b01@mail.gmail.com> <42237A7C.1000309@atl.lmco.com> <754f42e7050228121916f277ba@mail.gmail.com> <422394FC.8040002@margo.bijoux.nom.br> <7E8BD023E1D0BED2FFF63B5C@[10.169.6.246]> <4223EE18.1090204@margo.bijoux.nom.br> <70E46988EEFD9C37A77A1AE6@[10.0.0.14]> <49688.67.138.149.162.1109685975.squirrel@67.138.149.162> Message-ID: <1109687066.7421.23.camel@angua.localnet> On Tue, 2005-03-01 at 09:06 -0500, Paul A Houle wrote: > First, the world is moving towards DVD. Its interesting having a look round here. My home boxes have DVD (and thats the preferred method of installation - a DVD is a good way of moving several days of continuous download over ADSL). However at work I see things are somewhat different:- * Laptops mostly have DVD (read) capability * Desktops normally have no optical media, if they do have any its CD-ROM * Servers, including absolutely current kit from main manufacturers, have CD-ROM drives. None here have DVD drives (although a Sun 3500 from 1999 does have DVD capability). This actually isn't a problem as from my point of view the required installation kit is a 80MB CD and a network connection. However I think moving to DVD only is a non starter at this point in time. As a mirror admin I would like to have another way of packaging that does not require me to keep unpacked, CD and DVD images around. Nigel. -- [ Nigel Metheringham Nigel.Metheringham at InTechnology.co.uk ] [ - Comments in this message are my own and not ITO opinion/policy - ] From terraformers at gmx.net Tue Mar 1 14:07:33 2005 From: terraformers at gmx.net (Lars) Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 15:07:33 +0100 Subject: kde-3.4 (3.3.92) in fc4 References: <20050227220622.89456.qmail@web41523.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Roberto Peon wrote: > By which, I believe, Lars means that it is out... > .. and I mean that it is compiling on my box. > > (Well, at least the konstruct is. I havn't even looked for packages) > -R > yes its out now for about five days and no binary packages in rawhide and kde's ftp. oh well, maybe its in todays rawhide... would be great! best lars From jos at xos.nl Tue Mar 1 14:24:55 2005 From: jos at xos.nl (Jos Vos) Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 15:24:55 +0100 Subject: Entering the DVD age... In-Reply-To: <49688.67.138.149.162.1109685975.squirrel@67.138.149.162>; from ph18@cornell.edu on Tue, Mar 01, 2005 at 09:06:15AM -0500 References: <55668b8c050228120473a73b01@mail.gmail.com> <42237A7C.1000309@atl.lmco.com> <754f42e7050228121916f277ba@mail.gmail.com> <422394FC.8040002@margo.bijoux.nom.br> <7E8BD023E1D0BED2FFF63B5C@[10.169.6.246]> <4223EE18.1090204@margo.bijoux.nom.br> <70E46988EEFD9C37A77A1AE6@[10.0.0.14]> <49688.67.138.149.162.1109685975.squirrel@67.138.149.162> Message-ID: <20050301152455.A21679@xos037.xos.nl> On Tue, Mar 01, 2005 at 09:06:15AM -0500, Paul A Houle wrote: > It may make sense for Fedora to see itself primarily as a DVD product, > and to see the CDs as a secondary product. [...] FWIW: for our X/OS Linux (RHEL rebuild) I include (during the DVD/CD generation process, after the CD "splittree") a file list on the DVD for each CD and the necessary .discinfo files, and a small tool (dvd2cd) that creates a CD ISO (you only have to give the CD sequence number) from a mounted DVD image, including a bootable CD #1 etc. I'll happily post the few bits of code here, if anyone is interested, so that Fedora can include that in their image generate process. I currently do not implant checksums, as this requires that the system on which this is done is a RH-ish system, which may not always be true, but this option can be added easily of course. -- -- Jos Vos -- X/OS Experts in Open Systems BV | Phone: +31 20 6938364 -- Amsterdam, The Netherlands | Fax: +31 20 6948204 From hp at redhat.com Tue Mar 1 14:27:36 2005 From: hp at redhat.com (Havoc Pennington) Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 09:27:36 -0500 Subject: default app threads [was Re: gpdf vs evince] In-Reply-To: <1109683098.764.5.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> References: <20050301130814.71673.qmail@web8503.mail.in.yahoo.com> <1109683098.764.5.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> Message-ID: <1109687257.11030.13.camel@localhost.localdomain> On Tue, 2005-03-01 at 08:18 -0500, Ivan Gyurdiev wrote: > > Sure, let's completely ignore the issue which I just pointed out three > emails above - that should make it go away. I do like evince. I > particularly like the fact that it can select and copy text. For some > reason no other pdf viewer can do that besides xpdf. I was just getting > excited about using evince, but now I find out it can't rotate - not > cool at all. If I've missed it somewhere please point out how evince can > rotate? The point Mark was trying to make is, file a bug, people have been fixing evince at a rapid pace and it will probably get fixed. Maybe the more general point I'd make is that thread after thread after thread after thread on this list about default/included applications looks like this: - app A has feature X! - app B has bug Y! - app C has feature Q! - app D has feature Z! - app E has bug W! Given two apps, guess what, the bug and feature set will not be perfectly identical and yes both of them will have bugs. But no that doesn't imply we should include every app under the sun so you can always find one without some particular bug. It implies that we should choose the overall best app according to some guidelines better than "posts about particular features/bugs", some examples: http://fedora.redhat.com/projects/desktop/defaults.html And then we should view bugs in the default app as *reason to fix the default app* not *reason to argue about which app is the default*. Havoc From rjune at bravegnuworld.com Tue Mar 1 14:28:11 2005 From: rjune at bravegnuworld.com (Richard June) Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 09:28:11 -0500 Subject: reducing distribution CD count In-Reply-To: <1109685922.23615.48.camel@cutter> References: <200502240906.20729.czar@czarc.net> <42247474.7080606@carwyn.com> <1109685922.23615.48.camel@cutter> Message-ID: <200503010928.16712.rjune@bravegnuworld.com> On Tuesday 01 March 2005 09:05, seth vidal wrote: > >I think Alan was meaning more from a political standpoint. I suspect > >that Red Hat staff have more justification for fixing things in Core > >than Extras. > > I don't think I understand how this is political. We're talking about a > single command post-install. He was talking about debugging, I don't > think it's CRAZY that a developer have to run a single command in order > to debug something. > > bzflag and tuxracer were not in the normal install in core, iirc. So why > is it harder to install them now than before? both bzflag & tuxracer are in the default "personal desktop" install in fedora core 3. > is it b/c they're in a separate repo? But that repo will be on by > default for fc4, so how is that harder for the end user or developer? How does the end user know that these exist and that they are games? -- Public Key available Here: http://www.bravegnuworld.com/~rjune/pubkey.asc -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: not available URL: From alan at redhat.com Tue Mar 1 14:29:20 2005 From: alan at redhat.com (Alan Cox) Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 09:29:20 -0500 Subject: Package pruning for FC4 and beyond In-Reply-To: <422086A8.7020200@snowmoon.com> References: <422007DD.1020404@snowmoon.com> <42207BEB.7020000@snowmoon.com> <422086A8.7020200@snowmoon.com> Message-ID: <20050301142920.GH7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> On Sat, Feb 26, 2005 at 09:24:40AM -0500, Eric Warnke wrote: > dovecot - IPAP server - 2 objections, but if you can server to the > internet, you can download it from extras. Ether this or cyrus should > be cut. Cyrus should go then. Dovecot works for any user but Cyrus requires an expert to set up its way of doing things. > *lynx/elinks - 1 objection about scripts using lynx... ether those > scripts are not part of core or they are not marked correctly. If you > can surf the web with either, you can download them from extras. If > either has a dependancy in core the .src.rpm needs to be corrected. > Personally I think lynx should go to extras.* Lynx is essential for blind users, elinks could go. > *New additions to the likley list* > dmalloc, valgrind - electricence appears to be more compatible and > better developed. > freeglut - library with no dependancy in core Freeglut is basically expected to be part of an OS with OpenGL > giftrans - netpbm tools can do the same netpbm tools are garbage, lose netpbm instead. netpbm security is abysmal and functionality iffy. > iptstate - package getting stale > jed - another text mode editor > joe - yet another text editor ( nano / pico / emacs / ed / vi ) > lftp - useful ftp client ( ftp, ncftp ) D:0 As a heavyweight joe user I still agree it should be extras > MAKEDEV - Superceeded by udev ? Not always and tiny > *VFlib2 - Required by MajicPoint and ghostscript - only if we can break > the ghostscript compatibility > + MagicPoint - Duplicated functionality already in other packages Not duplicated at all. May be appropriate for extras for other reasons but there is no duplication between mgp and openoffice because openoffice can't do most of what mgp can do and vice versa > awesfx - OLD ( 2000 ) D:0 Needed for SB64 still > cdecl - C/C++ to English conversion D:0 Tiny > autorun - functionality in most desktops already d:0 Should go - its dangerous anyway > ftpcopy - utility D:0. I have never used it, do we need in core ssh + rsync nowdays Alan From rahulsundaram at yahoo.co.in Tue Mar 1 14:31:32 2005 From: rahulsundaram at yahoo.co.in (Rahul Sundaram) Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 06:31:32 -0800 (PST) Subject: ITE 8212 and pwc drivers absent in Rawhide In-Reply-To: <20050301142253.GG7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> Message-ID: <20050301143132.46441.qmail@web8507.mail.in.yahoo.com> Hi > I offered to, but there are other maintainers. I > mostly offered to prove > Linus was being totally two faced about it. When he > removed the driver at > the original authors request I asked him to remove > all my code too because > his approach was offensive to me. He refused. Greg and Linus were trying to be polite about it. In general we shouldnt be having code despite authors requests inside the kernel. Of course removing all your contributions from Linux is too much of work. so its a balance. not as black and white as you imply ===== Regards Rahul Sundaram __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - now with 250MB free storage. Learn more. http://info.mail.yahoo.com/mail_250 From alan at redhat.com Tue Mar 1 14:33:14 2005 From: alan at redhat.com (Alan Cox) Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 09:33:14 -0500 Subject: writing zero bytes in bash In-Reply-To: <20050226175426.GJ3626@redhat.com> References: <200502261832.16337.russell@coker.com.au> <20050226175426.GJ3626@redhat.com> Message-ID: <20050301143314.GJ7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> On Sat, Feb 26, 2005 at 05:54:26PM +0000, Tim Waugh wrote: > > To unset the fscreate or exec context you have to write zero bytes > > to /proc/self/attr/fscreate or /proc/self/attr/exec respectively. > > Oh dear, really? How badly designed. The man page for write() says > that writing no bytes causes write() to return 0 "without causing any > other effect". Actually its worse than that, for some situations the kernel enforces that behaviour and you *can't* propogate a zero byte write. From rahulsundaram at yahoo.co.in Tue Mar 1 14:33:51 2005 From: rahulsundaram at yahoo.co.in (Rahul Sundaram) Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 06:33:51 -0800 (PST) Subject: Package pruning for FC4 and beyond In-Reply-To: <20050301142920.GH7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> Message-ID: <20050301143351.86437.qmail@web8501.mail.in.yahoo.com> Hi > > autorun - functionality in most desktops already > d:0 > > Should go - its dangerous anyway > Alan, can you please clarify that statement. its redundant obviously but why is it dangerous? ===== Regards Rahul Sundaram __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - You care about security. So do we. http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail From alan at redhat.com Tue Mar 1 14:34:24 2005 From: alan at redhat.com (Alan Cox) Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 09:34:24 -0500 Subject: Package pruning for FC4 and beyond - COMPLETE LIST In-Reply-To: <1109442347.27384.104.camel@cutter> References: <422007DD.1020404@snowmoon.com> <42207BEB.7020000@snowmoon.com> <422086A8.7020200@snowmoon.com> <604aa79105022607043d109bf1@mail.gmail.com> <422092F8.4050003@snowmoon.com> <4220B0C2.2060007@snowmoon.com> <1109442347.27384.104.camel@cutter> Message-ID: <20050301143424.GK7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> On Sat, Feb 26, 2005 at 01:25:47PM -0500, seth vidal wrote: > I'm fine with moving joe to extras personally but it does fill a place > nothing else fills. I think nowdays for most users kedit/gedit are that place From cmadams at hiwaay.net Tue Mar 1 14:36:50 2005 From: cmadams at hiwaay.net (Chris Adams) Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 08:36:50 -0600 Subject: Package pruning for FC4 and beyond - COMPLETE LIST In-Reply-To: <20050228162426.28497.qmail@web8502.mail.in.yahoo.com> References: <20050228162426.28497.qmail@web8502.mail.in.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20050301143650.GB1403373@hiwaay.net> Once upon a time, Rahul Sundaram said: > let me get this straight. if its called fedora core > and is in ISO images, its there and if its in fedora > extras as rpm packages, it goes away? Hey, let's just put the kernel and a static shell on a CD; you can get the rest over the Internet! Objectives of Fedora Core: 1. Create a complete general-purpose operating system with capabilities equivalent to competing operating systems, ... ... 6. Emphasize usability and a "just works" philosophy in selecting default configuration and designing features. ... 8. Include a range of popular packages, beyond those included in Red Hat's commercially supported products. (Limited, of course, to packages that Red Hat can legally provide; also limited to quality packages as defined by our standards.) ... If the plan is to chuck everything possible to Extras, then someone should go update the Objectives. Competing operating systems include sudo or something like it. -- Chris Adams Systems and Network Administrator - HiWAAY Internet Services I don't speak for anybody but myself - that's enough trouble. From johnp at redhat.com Tue Mar 1 14:37:00 2005 From: johnp at redhat.com (John (J5) Palmieri) Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 09:37:00 -0500 Subject: Entering the DVD age... In-Reply-To: <49688.67.138.149.162.1109685975.squirrel@67.138.149.162> References: <55668b8c050228120473a73b01@mail.gmail.com> <42237A7C.1000309@atl.lmco.com> <754f42e7050228121916f277ba@mail.gmail.com> <422394FC.8040002@margo.bijoux.nom.br> <7E8BD023E1D0BED2FFF63B5C@[10.169.6.246]> <4223EE18.1090204@margo.bijoux.nom.br> <70E46988EEFD9C37A77A1AE6@[10.0.0.14]> <49688.67.138.149.162.1109685975.squirrel@67.138.149.162> Message-ID: <1109687819.2532.44.camel@localhost.localdomain> On Tue, 2005-03-01 at 09:06, Paul A Houle wrote: > I think Fedora should look at the CD crisis as an opportunity rather > than the need to axe a lot of packages in a hurry. > > First, the world is moving towards DVD. It's an absolute joy to > install Fedora off a DVD, although I've often found that process of > downloading an manipulating a disk image that big can be challenging. > (BitTorrent anyone?) Moving to dvd and using CD's as secondary doesn't solve the problem. You still have a huge download which can be annoying even on a fast connection. YOu still have to engineer for CD's unless you get rid of CD's all together. Lowest common denominator wins out. > My AMD64 has an optical drive that reads and writes every CD and DVD > format (other than double-sided) that cost about $100; in the long > term, the majority of users are going to enjoy that convenience. We have DVD iso's. We handed them out at Linux world so this is already solved. > It may make sense for Fedora to see itself primarily as a DVD product, > and to see the CDs as a secondary product. The CDs ought to be there > for people who don't have a DVD drive. Also, I like the idea of > being able to "target" Fedora for particular types of installation -- > for instance, I can picture a single-disk distribution that brings > the system up with a minimal installation and does a network install > from there. I can also see a "KDE desktop" disk and a "Gnome desktop" > disk. I would like a base system that can then update from the net. As it is you will most likely need to update anyway. > Part of Fedora's trouble is that it often packages five or six packages > that almost work instead of one package that really works. (Having a > GUI and being written in Python are two big risk factors.) I'm typing > this on a Mac Mini that I just bought, and I've been quite impressed > with Mac OS X; Mac OS X standardizes on Postfix as an MTA -- it has > one program for organizing music, iTunes, which really works. This is what we are getting away from. We want best of breed software in the core and the rest in extras. What do you mean by "having a GUI and being written in Python are two big risk factors"? As it is on the desktop for the most part we only have one app for each task or at least there is an app that is favored and the others are kept because of various reasons. But, most of them are moving to extras anyway. > Of course, Fedora might not be able to shake that off the way that a > new distribution can, say, Linspire. One some level it's really silly > that Fedora has both the Gnome and KDE desktops, yet there are two > reasons why that can't change: Gnome is under heavy development and engineering at Red Hat. It may just seem like we get it from upstream but that is just because all of our work goes there. And yes we can move in other directions. Fedora is leading the way in integrating new technology into Linux such as dbus and hal. You might not see it because it is under the hood. > (1) Neither of those desktops are 100% satisfactory, and even if you're > running one desktop, you're going to want some apps from the other > desktop and libraries to run the other desktop, and > (2) politics. > If Fedora remains a community project, it's likely to suffer from this > "big tent" effect. It's going to be hard to make the decision to > marginalize a project which has made great contributions to the > Linux/Unix world, despite the fact that a real quality consumer OS is, > almost by definition, going to have one MTA and one desktop. Um, we are already stripping out apps from the core. And a person won't care about multiple MTA's as long as we have good defaults. > On the other hand, if we see it as an OS for enthusiasts that other > entities can repackage, that might be a good place to be. That is exactly what Fedora is. -- J5 From rahulsundaram at yahoo.co.in Tue Mar 1 14:42:10 2005 From: rahulsundaram at yahoo.co.in (Rahul Sundaram) Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 06:42:10 -0800 (PST) Subject: Package pruning for FC4 and beyond - COMPLETE LIST In-Reply-To: <20050301143650.GB1403373@hiwaay.net> Message-ID: <20050301144210.7646.qmail@web8502.mail.in.yahoo.com> --- Chris Adams wrote: > Once upon a time, Rahul Sundaram > said: > > let me get this straight. if its called fedora > core > > and is in ISO images, its there and if its in > fedora > > extras as rpm packages, it goes away? > > Hey, let's just put the kernel and a static shell on > a CD; you can get > the rest over the Internet! yes. something close to this is very useful as a minimalistic installation which many users have been asking for repeatedly > > > If the plan is to chuck everything possible to > Extras, then someone > should go update the Objectives. Competing > operating systems include > sudo or something like it. I actually agree with you on sudo but telling people that you would change operating systems instead of typing in yum install sudo is silly. ===== Regards Rahul Sundaram __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - Easier than ever with enhanced search. Learn more. http://info.mail.yahoo.com/mail_250 From carwyn at carwyn.com Tue Mar 1 14:56:33 2005 From: carwyn at carwyn.com (Carwyn Edwards) Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 14:56:33 +0000 Subject: reducing distribution CD count In-Reply-To: <1109685922.23615.48.camel@cutter> References: <200502240906.20729.czar@czarc.net> <20050224175035.22391185@python2> <20050301134658.GB7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> <1109685440.23615.42.camel@cutter> <42247474.7080606@carwyn.com> <1109685922.23615.48.camel@cutter> Message-ID: <422482A1.7030505@carwyn.com> seth vidal wrote: >I don't think I understand how this is political. > It's "political" in the sense that it depends more on RH policies than common sense in some respects :-) If RH give core a higher policital (business case) priority then bug priority for stuff that's in extras may well be lower. It depends if Alan meant "credibly" in the justification of work sense or the testing coverage sense (maybe both). Carwyn -- School of Informatics University of Edinburgh From nicolas.mailhot at laposte.net Tue Mar 1 14:58:34 2005 From: nicolas.mailhot at laposte.net (Nicolas Mailhot) Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 15:58:34 +0100 (CET) Subject: gpdf vs evince In-Reply-To: <200503011321.j21DLMP5032583@leto.astradyne.corp> References: Your message of "Tue, 01 Mar 2005 05:08:14 PST." <20050301130814.71673.qmail@web8503.mail.in.yahoo.com> <200503011321.j21DLMP5032583@leto.astradyne.corp> Message-ID: <21695.192.54.193.137.1109689114.squirrel@rousalka.dyndns.org> On Mar 1 mars 2005 14:21, Tet a ?crit : > > Rahul Sundaram writes: > >>>From my experience using rawhide so far, evince is >>good enough for regular use. > > Yeah, but the few users that have played with it from Rawhide aren't > enough of a proving ground. It'll only get a decent shakedown with the > widespread use that will come from being part of Core. I think that's > absolutely the right thing to do. I'm just uncomfortable with removing > the older packages until evince has proven itself. Just MHO. > > I just hope that when I finally get to try it, it'll be better than the > slow bloated pig that is ggv (I still use gv because ggv sucks so badly). evince clearly deprecates gpdf (which was a disaster during its short life). Anyone that works a lot with pdfs will keep ggv (and probably acroread) for some time - the codebases are so different they don't share a lot of bugs Regards, -- Nicolas Mailhot From carwyn at carwyn.com Tue Mar 1 14:59:29 2005 From: carwyn at carwyn.com (Carwyn Edwards) Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 14:59:29 +0000 Subject: ITE 8212 and pwc drivers absent in Rawhide In-Reply-To: <20050226050705.GA11218@kroah.com> References: <1109319950.5110.22.camel@localhost.localdomain> <20050226050705.GA11218@kroah.com> Message-ID: <42248351.2060107@carwyn.com> Greg KH wrote: >The pwc driver author asked for it to be removed. It no longer has a >maintainer nor anyone who wants to support it. > Yes it does: http://www.saillard.org/linux/pwc/ Carwyn From mattdm at mattdm.org Tue Mar 1 15:04:24 2005 From: mattdm at mattdm.org (Matthew Miller) Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 10:04:24 -0500 Subject: FC5 anaconda In-Reply-To: <200502281449.23163.czar@czarc.net> References: <200502281401.20237.czar@czarc.net> <20050228190552.GA3456@jadzia.bu.edu> <200502281449.23163.czar@czarc.net> Message-ID: <20050301150424.GA12953@jadzia.bu.edu> On Mon, Feb 28, 2005 at 02:49:23PM -0500, Gene C. wrote: > Thanks, that provides some info but I suspect that a lot of words were > spoken which added a lot more info. Yeah; hopefully the video feed will be up soon. > I believe I understand how this will (could) all work for an Internet > connected system where, basically, you do a network install for a lot of > that packages (especially those in Fedora Extras). However, how about the > unconnected system? What is the thinking on how it will handle installing > everything from CD or DVD images? Will there be CD and/or DVD iso images > for Extras or will we need to roll our own? I'm hoping for the multiple-extras-flavors (Extras:Java / Extras:Games / Extras:Whatever), which could each have CDs. But I think that network install is going to be more and more the way. > Even for Internet connected systems, if you have a number of systems to do > installs on, you do not want to have to download the packages for each > system ... you (or at least I) want to download the packages once and then > do installs on all of the systems. Caching proxy. :) Or, make your own local mirror. -- Matthew Miller mattdm at mattdm.org Boston University Linux ------> From mattdm at mattdm.org Tue Mar 1 15:06:45 2005 From: mattdm at mattdm.org (Matthew Miller) Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 10:06:45 -0500 Subject: suggested tweak to "objectives" web page [was Re: Package pruning for FC4 and beyond - COMPLETE LIST] In-Reply-To: <20050301143650.GB1403373@hiwaay.net> References: <20050228162426.28497.qmail@web8502.mail.in.yahoo.com> <20050301143650.GB1403373@hiwaay.net> Message-ID: <20050301150645.GB12953@jadzia.bu.edu> On Tue, Mar 01, 2005 at 08:36:50AM -0600, Chris Adams wrote: > Objectives of Fedora Core: ^^^^ Good point. I think this should read "Objectives of the Fedora Project". -- Matthew Miller mattdm at mattdm.org Boston University Linux ------> From malists at epon.ro Tue Mar 1 15:21:58 2005 From: malists at epon.ro (Marius Andreiana) Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 17:21:58 +0200 Subject: dovecot, cyrus (was Re: Package pruning for FC4 and beyond) In-Reply-To: <20050301142920.GH7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> References: <422007DD.1020404@snowmoon.com> <42207BEB.7020000@snowmoon.com> <422086A8.7020200@snowmoon.com> <20050301142920.GH7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> Message-ID: <1109690518.3474.5.camel@marte.biciclete.ro> On Tue, 2005-03-01 at 09:29 -0500, Alan Cox wrote: > On Sat, Feb 26, 2005 at 09:24:40AM -0500, Eric Warnke wrote: > > dovecot - IPAP server - 2 objections, but if you can server to the > > internet, you can download it from extras. Ether this or cyrus should > > be cut. > > Cyrus should go then. Dovecot works for any user but Cyrus requires an expert > to set up its way of doing things. cyrus works great for large number of users/domains, with authentication from databases instead of system users. Please keep both (I never used dovecot, but it looks to work out-of-the-box compared to cyrus). Btw, cyrus default config should work with system users in the same way live dovecot? -- Marius Andreiana Epon Business Applications http://www.epon.ro From skvidal at phy.duke.edu Tue Mar 1 15:23:14 2005 From: skvidal at phy.duke.edu (seth vidal) Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 10:23:14 -0500 Subject: reducing distribution CD count In-Reply-To: <200503010928.16712.rjune@bravegnuworld.com> References: <200502240906.20729.czar@czarc.net> <42247474.7080606@carwyn.com> <1109685922.23615.48.camel@cutter> <200503010928.16712.rjune@bravegnuworld.com> Message-ID: <1109690594.23615.70.camel@cutter> >> is it b/c they're in a separate repo? But that repo will be on by >> default for fc4, so how is that harder for the end user or developer? >How does the end user know that these exist and that they are games? yum search games returns all of them. -sv From alan at redhat.com Tue Mar 1 15:19:24 2005 From: alan at redhat.com (Alan Cox) Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 10:19:24 -0500 Subject: reducing distribution CD count In-Reply-To: <42247474.7080606@carwyn.com> References: <200502240906.20729.czar@czarc.net> <20050224175035.22391185@python2> <20050301134658.GB7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> <1109685440.23615.42.camel@cutter> <42247474.7080606@carwyn.com> Message-ID: <20050301151924.GT7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> On Tue, Mar 01, 2005 at 01:56:04PM +0000, Carwyn Edwards wrote: > >>I can no longer credibly work on fixing 3D bug reports. This *is* a > >>problem > >> > >So, just to make sure I understand, yum doesn't work for you? > > > I think Alan was meaning more from a political standpoint. I suspect > that Red Hat staff have more justification for fixing things in Core > than Extras. Its a lot harder to deal with 3D bugs unless you know the precise binary and environment the user has to reproduce it. Now if Extras goes in out of the box then it may work for most users (except .de of course) Alan From alan at redhat.com Tue Mar 1 15:21:18 2005 From: alan at redhat.com (Alan Cox) Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 10:21:18 -0500 Subject: reducing distribution CD count In-Reply-To: <1109686052.23615.53.camel@cutter> References: <200503011358.j21Dw2st000363@leto.astradyne.corp> <1109686052.23615.53.camel@cutter> Message-ID: <20050301152118.GU7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> On Tue, Mar 01, 2005 at 09:07:32AM -0500, seth vidal wrote: > 2. also what about gl-gears or whatever it's called - it comes with x > server, I thought, can't that be used as a tester? gears tests 3D cards in the same way as hello world tests 2D 8) From skvidal at phy.duke.edu Tue Mar 1 15:26:06 2005 From: skvidal at phy.duke.edu (seth vidal) Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 10:26:06 -0500 Subject: reducing distribution CD count In-Reply-To: <20050301151924.GT7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> References: <200502240906.20729.czar@czarc.net> <20050224175035.22391185@python2> <20050301134658.GB7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> <1109685440.23615.42.camel@cutter> <42247474.7080606@carwyn.com> <20050301151924.GT7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> Message-ID: <1109690766.23615.72.camel@cutter> On Tue, 2005-03-01 at 10:19 -0500, Alan Cox wrote: >On Tue, Mar 01, 2005 at 01:56:04PM +0000, Carwyn Edwards wrote: >> >>I can no longer credibly work on fixing 3D bug reports. This *is* a >> >>problem >> >> >> >So, just to make sure I understand, yum doesn't work for you? >> > >> I think Alan was meaning more from a political standpoint. I suspect >> that Red Hat staff have more justification for fixing things in Core >> than Extras. > >Its a lot harder to deal with 3D bugs unless you know the precise binary and >environment the user has to reproduce it. Now if Extras goes in out of the box >then it may work for most users (except .de of course) why won't it work in .de? -sv From alan at redhat.com Tue Mar 1 15:25:32 2005 From: alan at redhat.com (Alan Cox) Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 10:25:32 -0500 Subject: Package pruning for FC4 and beyond In-Reply-To: <20050301143351.86437.qmail@web8501.mail.in.yahoo.com> References: <20050301142920.GH7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> <20050301143351.86437.qmail@web8501.mail.in.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20050301152532.GV7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> On Tue, Mar 01, 2005 at 06:33:51AM -0800, Rahul Sundaram wrote: > Alan, can you please clarify that statement. its > redundant obviously but why is it dangerous? The various "automatically run" tools get dangerous because they provide paths for exploits. There is the obvious binary approach (eg a Windows CD that has autorun of format/u c: and is labelled PORN) but there are more subtle tricks too - CD's with movies on them that exploit older video players, or with html and images that exploited linux/windows image viewer holes. It's a trust thing. Alan From dwmw2 at infradead.org Tue Mar 1 15:25:44 2005 From: dwmw2 at infradead.org (David Woodhouse) Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 15:25:44 +0000 Subject: gpdf vs evince In-Reply-To: <20050301142031.62976.qmail@web8504.mail.in.yahoo.com> References: <20050301142031.62976.qmail@web8504.mail.in.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1109690744.22578.100.camel@hades.cambridge.redhat.com> On Tue, 2005-03-01 at 06:20 -0800, Rahul Sundaram wrote: > it seems premature to complain about it now :-) > > Lets wait for near code freeze and see if Evince has > important missing features and then raise a alert > then. Remember that fc4 will have extras repo enabled > by default too Please don't wait. If there are important features missing, make sure that bugs are filed ASAP. -- dwmw2 From alan at redhat.com Tue Mar 1 15:27:57 2005 From: alan at redhat.com (Alan Cox) Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 10:27:57 -0500 Subject: reducing distribution CD count In-Reply-To: <422482A1.7030505@carwyn.com> References: <200502240906.20729.czar@czarc.net> <20050224175035.22391185@python2> <20050301134658.GB7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> <1109685440.23615.42.camel@cutter> <42247474.7080606@carwyn.com> <1109685922.23615.48.camel@cutter> <422482A1.7030505@carwyn.com> Message-ID: <20050301152757.GX7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> On Tue, Mar 01, 2005 at 02:56:33PM +0000, Carwyn Edwards wrote: > If RH give core a higher policital (business case) priority then bug > priority for stuff that's in extras may well be lower. We have internal priorities but they are based on common sense things you'd expect. If I have a "fix right now" IDE corruption problem and a bzflag bug then the bzflag bug will not be the priority bug. Not that bzflag has bugs 8) Alan From tarjei.knapstad at predichem.com Tue Mar 1 15:27:59 2005 From: tarjei.knapstad at predichem.com (Tarjei Knapstad) Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 16:27:59 +0100 Subject: More package pruning - i18n In-Reply-To: References: <1109677794.16953.55.camel@tarjei.predichem.nett> Message-ID: <1109690879.16953.82.camel@tarjei.predichem.nett> On Tue, 2005-03-01 at 14:47, Konstantin Ryabitsev wrote: > On Tue, 01 Mar 2005 12:49:54 +0100, Tarjei Knapstad > wrote: > > Before anyone starts > > screaming, let me explain how I envision this (and for the record I'm > > Norwegian, so please don't call me ignorant :)) > > Any Swedes here care to chime in? :) > (see, you can always find someone) > lol, how could I forget :) > > Am I making any sense here? Arguments for/against? > > This was recently brought up, but the (in)decision has been that until > Anaconda can do non-Core package installs, there is no reason to do > anything for FC4. Firstboot doesn't really help since it's possible > that network hardware isn't working properly after the initial boot, > so it has to be done during the install procedure itself. Besides, if > you don't know English very well, getting through various "do this to > add language support" screens becomes difficult. > Ah, yes. Good point about the network, should've remembered after recently helping a friend set up WLAN... Wrt. to firstboot, of course I meant this to come with localization as well (where is the localization for firstboot pulled from now btw?) Anyway, so the (in)conclusion was that further down the road we'll have support in Anaconda for "extra CD's" (or extra stuff over a network including updates), so that people can add extra languages/-devel stuff/whatever found on a separate ISO? That would be very nice indeed. Cheers, -- Tarjei From rahulsundaram at yahoo.co.in Tue Mar 1 15:28:57 2005 From: rahulsundaram at yahoo.co.in (Rahul Sundaram) Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 07:28:57 -0800 (PST) Subject: gpdf vs evince In-Reply-To: <1109690744.22578.100.camel@hades.cambridge.redhat.com> Message-ID: <20050301152857.60836.qmail@web8507.mail.in.yahoo.com> Hi > > Please don't wait. If there are important features > missing, make sure > that bugs are filed ASAP. > I requested that people file bug reports in an earlier mail. I was just answering the question of "what happens if evince still has important features missing when fc4 is about to be shipped" ===== Regards Rahul Sundaram __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - Easier than ever with enhanced search. Learn more. http://info.mail.yahoo.com/mail_250 From alan at redhat.com Tue Mar 1 15:33:09 2005 From: alan at redhat.com (Alan Cox) Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 10:33:09 -0500 Subject: reducing distribution CD count In-Reply-To: <1109690766.23615.72.camel@cutter> References: <200502240906.20729.czar@czarc.net> <20050224175035.22391185@python2> <20050301134658.GB7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> <1109685440.23615.42.camel@cutter> <42247474.7080606@carwyn.com> <20050301151924.GT7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> <1109690766.23615.72.camel@cutter> Message-ID: <20050301153309.GY7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> On Tue, Mar 01, 2005 at 10:26:06AM -0500, seth vidal wrote: > >then it may work for most users (except .de of course) > why won't it work in .de? Because the game is not part of a basic OS product and has not been through video game approval. See: http://www.germanlawjournal.com/current_issue.php?id=279 Actually reading the material about this again it may be a good reason for keeping bzflag in extras. Alan From skvidal at phy.duke.edu Tue Mar 1 15:38:43 2005 From: skvidal at phy.duke.edu (seth vidal) Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 10:38:43 -0500 Subject: reducing distribution CD count In-Reply-To: <20050301153309.GY7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> References: <200502240906.20729.czar@czarc.net> <20050224175035.22391185@python2> <20050301134658.GB7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> <1109685440.23615.42.camel@cutter> <42247474.7080606@carwyn.com> <20050301151924.GT7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> <1109690766.23615.72.camel@cutter> <20050301153309.GY7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> Message-ID: <1109691524.23615.86.camel@cutter> On Tue, 2005-03-01 at 10:33 -0500, Alan Cox wrote: >On Tue, Mar 01, 2005 at 10:26:06AM -0500, seth vidal wrote: >> >then it may work for most users (except .de of course) >> why won't it work in .de? > >Because the game is not part of a basic OS product and has not been through >video game approval. > >See: http://www.germanlawjournal.com/current_issue.php?id=279 > >Actually reading the material about this again it may be a good reason for >keeping bzflag in extras. > so is germany not in the free world anymore either? heh -sv From jkeating at j2solutions.net Tue Mar 1 15:35:13 2005 From: jkeating at j2solutions.net (Jesse Keating) Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 07:35:13 -0800 Subject: reducing distribution CD count In-Reply-To: <20050301151924.GT7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> References: <200502240906.20729.czar@czarc.net> <20050224175035.22391185@python2> <20050301134658.GB7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> <1109685440.23615.42.camel@cutter> <42247474.7080606@carwyn.com> <20050301151924.GT7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> Message-ID: <1109691313.13489.15.camel@localhost.localdomain> On Tue, 2005-03-01 at 10:19 -0500, Alan Cox wrote: > Its a lot harder to deal with 3D bugs unless you know the precise > binary and > environment the user has to reproduce it. Now if Extras goes in out of > the box > then it may work for most users (except .de of course) Given the amount of 3rd party repo use that most end users have now anyway, expecting a precise binary and environment is rather tough to begin with. However, Fedora Extras will be built on a maintained build server so that the binary Joe gets is the same binary you can get as well. As for environment, again, most end-users are pulling SOME 3rd party packages from SOMEwhere now anyway. Making it easier for YOU to match their environment by having them all in Extras, now isn't that a BONUS? -- Jesse Keating RHCE (http://geek.j2solutions.net) Fedora Legacy Team (http://www.fedoralegacy.org) GPG Public Key (http://geek.j2solutions.net/jkeating.j2solutions.pub) Was I helpful? Let others know: http://svcs.affero.net/rm.php?r=jkeating -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part URL: From jkeating at j2solutions.net Tue Mar 1 15:36:17 2005 From: jkeating at j2solutions.net (Jesse Keating) Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 07:36:17 -0800 Subject: reducing distribution CD count In-Reply-To: <20050301134557.GA7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> References: <200502240906.20729.czar@czarc.net> <20050224175035.22391185@python2> <20050301134557.GA7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> Message-ID: <1109691377.13489.17.camel@localhost.localdomain> On Tue, 2005-03-01 at 08:45 -0500, Alan Cox wrote: > And to debug 3D. We no longer have any way to debug 3D problems on > Fedora > with packages we know the client side of and build form. Fedora Extras is not BUILT by community, just maintained. Packages will be built on a RH maintained build server/software. -- Jesse Keating RHCE (http://geek.j2solutions.net) Fedora Legacy Team (http://www.fedoralegacy.org) GPG Public Key (http://geek.j2solutions.net/jkeating.j2solutions.pub) Was I helpful? Let others know: http://svcs.affero.net/rm.php?r=jkeating -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part URL: From alan at redhat.com Tue Mar 1 15:37:18 2005 From: alan at redhat.com (Alan Cox) Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 10:37:18 -0500 Subject: reducing distribution CD count In-Reply-To: <1109691524.23615.86.camel@cutter> References: <20050224175035.22391185@python2> <20050301134658.GB7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> <1109685440.23615.42.camel@cutter> <42247474.7080606@carwyn.com> <20050301151924.GT7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> <1109690766.23615.72.camel@cutter> <20050301153309.GY7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> <1109691524.23615.86.camel@cutter> Message-ID: <20050301153718.GZ7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> On Tue, Mar 01, 2005 at 10:38:43AM -0500, seth vidal wrote: > >Actually reading the material about this again it may be a good reason for > >keeping bzflag in extras. > > so is germany not in the free world anymore either? I don't know enough about what the German people think about the issue to even speculate. I'm not sure bzflag exactly glorifies war but I do need to find more out about that. [PS Farenheit 451 is a great book] Alan From alan at redhat.com Tue Mar 1 15:38:22 2005 From: alan at redhat.com (Alan Cox) Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 10:38:22 -0500 Subject: reducing distribution CD count In-Reply-To: <1109691377.13489.17.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <200502240906.20729.czar@czarc.net> <20050224175035.22391185@python2> <20050301134557.GA7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> <1109691377.13489.17.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <20050301153822.GA7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> On Tue, Mar 01, 2005 at 07:36:17AM -0800, Jesse Keating wrote: > Fedora Extras is not BUILT by community, just maintained. Packages will > be built on a RH maintained build server/software. Ok that works for me in this case. I just don't want to enter gentoospace where every user has a different binary From skvidal at phy.duke.edu Tue Mar 1 15:45:17 2005 From: skvidal at phy.duke.edu (seth vidal) Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 10:45:17 -0500 Subject: reducing distribution CD count In-Reply-To: <20050301153822.GA7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> References: <200502240906.20729.czar@czarc.net> <20050224175035.22391185@python2> <20050301134557.GA7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> <1109691377.13489.17.camel@localhost.localdomain> <20050301153822.GA7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> Message-ID: <1109691917.23615.88.camel@cutter> On Tue, 2005-03-01 at 10:38 -0500, Alan Cox wrote: >On Tue, Mar 01, 2005 at 07:36:17AM -0800, Jesse Keating wrote: >> Fedora Extras is not BUILT by community, just maintained. Packages will >> be built on a RH maintained build server/software. > >Ok that works for me in this case. I just don't want to enter gentoospace >where every user has a different binary When/where did you get the impression that random users' binaries would be uploaded for extras? I'm asking b/c if this is a common impression I'd like to dispell it. -sv From pknirsch at redhat.com Tue Mar 1 15:42:39 2005 From: pknirsch at redhat.com (Phil Knirsch) Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 16:42:39 +0100 Subject: reducing distribution CD count In-Reply-To: <20050301153718.GZ7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> References: <20050224175035.22391185@python2> <20050301134658.GB7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> <1109685440.23615.42.camel@cutter> <42247474.7080606@carwyn.com> <20050301151924.GT7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> <1109690766.23615.72.camel@cutter> <20050301153309.GY7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> <1109691524.23615.86.camel@cutter> <20050301153718.GZ7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> Message-ID: <42248D6F.10605@redhat.com> Alan Cox wrote: > On Tue, Mar 01, 2005 at 10:38:43AM -0500, seth vidal wrote: > >>>Actually reading the material about this again it may be a good reason for >>>keeping bzflag in extras. >> >>so is germany not in the free world anymore either? > > > I don't know enough about what the German people think about the issue to > even speculate. I'm not sure bzflag exactly glorifies war but I do need > to find more out about that. As a home grown German (although possibly "polluted" by US propaganda :)) i think i can honestly say that at least i think we're still part of the free world ;) If that's true is written in another book (see below), see also 1984 or Animal Farm (which are great books, too). And despite possibly bzflag glorifying war it's still a damn fun game to play and it kept me up loads of nights way back when i was still at the University and sleep an uncessary burden. :) > [PS Farenheit 451 is a great book] Never read it, i always intended to read it, buying it from Amazon NOW. :) Read ya, Phil -- Philipp Knirsch | Tel.: +49-711-96437-470 Development | Fax.: +49-711-96437-111 Red Hat GmbH | Email: Phil Knirsch Hauptstaetterstr. 58 | Web: http://www.redhat.de/ D-70178 Stuttgart Motd: You're only jealous cos the little penguins are talking to me. From alan at redhat.com Tue Mar 1 15:43:13 2005 From: alan at redhat.com (Alan Cox) Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 10:43:13 -0500 Subject: reducing distribution CD count In-Reply-To: <1109691917.23615.88.camel@cutter> References: <200502240906.20729.czar@czarc.net> <20050224175035.22391185@python2> <20050301134557.GA7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> <1109691377.13489.17.camel@localhost.localdomain> <20050301153822.GA7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> <1109691917.23615.88.camel@cutter> Message-ID: <20050301154313.GA25689@devserv.devel.redhat.com> On Tue, Mar 01, 2005 at 10:45:17AM -0500, seth vidal wrote: > >Ok that works for me in this case. I just don't want to enter gentoospace > >where every user has a different binary > > When/where did you get the impression that random users' binaries would > be uploaded for extras? >From the fact that extras build systems still seem to be under discussion > I'm asking b/c if this is a common impression I'd like to dispell it. You just did 8) From rahulsundaram at yahoo.co.in Tue Mar 1 15:44:15 2005 From: rahulsundaram at yahoo.co.in (Rahul Sundaram) Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 07:44:15 -0800 (PST) Subject: reducing distribution CD count In-Reply-To: <1109691917.23615.88.camel@cutter> Message-ID: <20050301154415.16161.qmail@web8510.mail.in.yahoo.com> Hi > > When/where did you get the impression that random > users' binaries would > be uploaded for extras? > > I'm asking b/c if this is a common impression I'd > like to dispell it. > > -sv its not just his impression. I have heard it mentioned in several news sites and forums that fedora extras might not be reliable because random people will play with it. It might be a good idea to document how the process work in detail so I can point it to them the next time this FUD comes up anywhere ===== Regards Rahul Sundaram __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - Easier than ever with enhanced search. Learn more. http://info.mail.yahoo.com/mail_250 From skvidal at phy.duke.edu Tue Mar 1 15:49:10 2005 From: skvidal at phy.duke.edu (seth vidal) Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 10:49:10 -0500 Subject: reducing distribution CD count In-Reply-To: <42248D6F.10605@redhat.com> References: <20050224175035.22391185@python2> <20050301134658.GB7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> <1109685440.23615.42.camel@cutter> <42247474.7080606@carwyn.com> <20050301151924.GT7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> <1109690766.23615.72.camel@cutter> <20050301153309.GY7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> <1109691524.23615.86.camel@cutter> <20050301153718.GZ7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> <42248D6F.10605@redhat.com> Message-ID: <1109692151.23615.91.camel@cutter> >> [PS Farenheit 451 is a great book] > >Never read it, i always intended to read it, buying it from Amazon NOW. :) > >Read ya, Phil > plot summary: the gov't burns books and hunts down readers. People turn into drones watching tv. Some folks memorize books to carry on their stories. Moral: Book burning, bad. Reading, good. -sv From jkeating at j2solutions.net Tue Mar 1 15:47:11 2005 From: jkeating at j2solutions.net (Jesse Keating) Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 07:47:11 -0800 Subject: reducing distribution CD count In-Reply-To: <20050301153822.GA7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> References: <200502240906.20729.czar@czarc.net> <20050224175035.22391185@python2> <20050301134557.GA7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> <1109691377.13489.17.camel@localhost.localdomain> <20050301153822.GA7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> Message-ID: <1109692032.13489.20.camel@localhost.localdomain> On Tue, 2005-03-01 at 10:38 -0500, Alan Cox wrote: > On Tue, Mar 01, 2005 at 07:36:17AM -0800, Jesse Keating wrote: > > Fedora Extras is not BUILT by community, just maintained. Packages > will > > be built on a RH maintained build server/software. > > Ok that works for me in this case. I just don't want to enter > gentoospace > where every user has a different binary That indeed is a scary prospect. The Fedora Extras build server (not yet finished) has the goal of being self-hosting in FC, built from 100% FOSS, easy to setup so that joe-endpackager can run a copy of it on their own system before submitting srpms to Extras for official build, and stable enough to be blessed by RH for use in their facility. I think this will work out well. -- Jesse Keating RHCE (http://geek.j2solutions.net) Fedora Legacy Team (http://www.fedoralegacy.org) GPG Public Key (http://geek.j2solutions.net/jkeating.j2solutions.pub) Was I helpful? Let others know: http://svcs.affero.net/rm.php?r=jkeating -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part URL: From jspaleta at gmail.com Tue Mar 1 15:47:22 2005 From: jspaleta at gmail.com (Jeff Spaleta) Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 10:47:22 -0500 Subject: reducing distribution CD count In-Reply-To: <20050301151924.GT7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> References: <200502240906.20729.czar@czarc.net> <20050224175035.22391185@python2> <20050301134658.GB7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> <1109685440.23615.42.camel@cutter> <42247474.7080606@carwyn.com> <20050301151924.GT7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> Message-ID: <604aa7910503010747656b54b4@mail.gmail.com> On Tue, 1 Mar 2005 10:19:24 -0500, Alan Cox wrote: > Its a lot harder to deal with 3D bugs unless you know the precise binary and > environment the user has to reproduce it. Now if Extras goes in out of the box > then it may work for most users (except .de of course) from everything ive seen the intent is to have extras enabled by default in all repository aware tools that ship in core, yum,up2date and pup (when its ready). It should be just as easy to verify that a package is from extras as it is from core, when trying to compare your system to a user's system. It's not like it was safe to assume users weren't installing 3rd party versions of the games before... its the same verification step.. its just from a different repo at download.fedora.redhat.com Is there something specific about how Extras are built that makes debugging harder for you? -jef From skvidal at phy.duke.edu Tue Mar 1 15:52:42 2005 From: skvidal at phy.duke.edu (seth vidal) Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 10:52:42 -0500 Subject: reducing distribution CD count In-Reply-To: <20050301154415.16161.qmail@web8510.mail.in.yahoo.com> References: <20050301154415.16161.qmail@web8510.mail.in.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1109692362.23615.96.camel@cutter> >its not just his impression. I have heard it mentioned >in several news sites and forums that fedora extras >might not be reliable because random people will play >with it. It might be a good idea to document how the >process work in detail so I can point it to them the >next time this FUD comes up anywhere > well it depends on what you mean by 'play with it'. Fedora Extras allows people who are sponsored as packagers to add packages into the repository. They submit a src.rpm earlier on, normally some folks check through it to look for crack or legal problems. Then the packager checks it into cvs and a build request is made. The packages are built by the buildsystem and then pushed out to the repository. wash, rinse, repeat. They're all built in a known environment, but the packagers can be from all over the world. Does that make sense? all sorts of extras information here: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Extras -sv From rc040203 at freenet.de Tue Mar 1 15:51:40 2005 From: rc040203 at freenet.de (Ralf Corsepius) Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 16:51:40 +0100 Subject: Package pruning for FC4 and beyond - COMPLETE LIST In-Reply-To: <20050301143424.GK7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> References: <422007DD.1020404@snowmoon.com> <42207BEB.7020000@snowmoon.com> <422086A8.7020200@snowmoon.com> <604aa79105022607043d109bf1@mail.gmail.com> <422092F8.4050003@snowmoon.com> <4220B0C2.2060007@snowmoon.com> <1109442347.27384.104.camel@cutter> <20050301143424.GK7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> Message-ID: <1109692300.15959.722.camel@mccallum.corsepiu.local> On Tue, 2005-03-01 at 09:34 -0500, Alan Cox wrote: > On Sat, Feb 26, 2005 at 01:25:47PM -0500, seth vidal wrote: > > I'm fine with moving joe to extras personally but it does fill a place > > nothing else fills. > > I think nowdays for most users kedit/gedit are that place They ain't ASCII-editors, so they, unlike "joe", they don't help you in emergency situations. kedit and gedit could be moved to Extras without much pain. Ralf From walters at redhat.com Tue Mar 1 15:53:03 2005 From: walters at redhat.com (Colin Walters) Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 10:53:03 -0500 Subject: FC3 -> FC4 Upgrade? (was Re: reducing distribution CD count) In-Reply-To: References: <1109287914.26364.69.camel@localhost.localdomain> <421F36A6.8040401@olin.edu> <1109342585.26364.163.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1109346741.10989.13.camel@opus.phy.duke.edu> <1109346973.26364.181.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1109348125.10989.22.camel@opus.phy.duke.edu> <20050225162219.GD1048932@hiwaay.net> <1109348730.10989.33.camel@opus.phy.duke.edu> <1109349041.26364.190.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1109355427.10989.39.camel@opus.phy.duke.edu> <20050225190829.GG1048932@hiwaay.net> <1109358912.23111.1.camel@cutter> <1109360807.26364.217.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1109361494.23111.18.camel@cutter> <1109399987.27384.33.camel@cutter> <1109536319.22789.21.camel@bree.local.net> <42239279.90505@snowmoon.com> Message-ID: <1109692384.4740.2.camel@nexus.verbum.private> On Mon, 2005-02-28 at 23:15 -0300, Alexandre Oliva wrote: >On Feb 28, 2005, Eric Warnke wrote: > >> 2) Do what I do. Kickstart %post section that installs a rpm with >> updates fot yum repos as well as new ones. I import all the necessary >> keys and do a "yum -y update" and then "yum -y install >> packagename". > >Yeah, I had something like that at some point. selinux attributes are >somewhat messed up when you do this. At least they still are for the >configuration stuff I run in %post, that among other things runs >texhash, and tex config files get incorrectly-labeled. Can you elaborate a bit? Is this really just doing: yum install blah in the %post section? Or are you also passing options like --root or whatever to RPM? We do have a longstanding TODO now to fix up the RPM security context initialization to use the libselinux functionality instead of its own version; it might solve this issue. From rahulsundaram at yahoo.co.in Tue Mar 1 15:53:37 2005 From: rahulsundaram at yahoo.co.in (Rahul Sundaram) Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 07:53:37 -0800 (PST) Subject: Package pruning for FC4 and beyond - COMPLETE LIST In-Reply-To: <1109692300.15959.722.camel@mccallum.corsepiu.local> Message-ID: <20050301155337.41867.qmail@web8509.mail.in.yahoo.com> Hi > kedit and gedit could be moved to Extras without > much pain. > bad idea what GUI text editors are KDE and GNOME users supposed to use?. ===== Regards Rahul Sundaram __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - 250MB free storage. Do more. Manage less. http://info.mail.yahoo.com/mail_250 From mattdm at mattdm.org Tue Mar 1 15:55:44 2005 From: mattdm at mattdm.org (Matthew Miller) Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 10:55:44 -0500 Subject: reducing distribution CD count In-Reply-To: <1109692151.23615.91.camel@cutter> References: <20050301134658.GB7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> <1109685440.23615.42.camel@cutter> <42247474.7080606@carwyn.com> <20050301151924.GT7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> <1109690766.23615.72.camel@cutter> <20050301153309.GY7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> <1109691524.23615.86.camel@cutter> <20050301153718.GZ7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> <42248D6F.10605@redhat.com> <1109692151.23615.91.camel@cutter> Message-ID: <20050301155544.GA15349@jadzia.bu.edu> On Tue, Mar 01, 2005 at 10:49:10AM -0500, seth vidal wrote: > plot summary: the gov't burns books and hunts down readers. People turn > into drones watching tv. Some folks memorize books to carry on their > stories. Moral: Book burning, bad. Reading, good. Also, "having libraries on CD would be handy". -- Matthew Miller mattdm at mattdm.org Boston University Linux ------> From rc040203 at freenet.de Tue Mar 1 15:56:57 2005 From: rc040203 at freenet.de (Ralf Corsepius) Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 16:56:57 +0100 Subject: Package pruning for FC4 and beyond - COMPLETE LIST In-Reply-To: <20050301143650.GB1403373@hiwaay.net> References: <20050228162426.28497.qmail@web8502.mail.in.yahoo.com> <20050301143650.GB1403373@hiwaay.net> Message-ID: <1109692618.15959.728.camel@mccallum.corsepiu.local> On Tue, 2005-03-01 at 08:36 -0600, Chris Adams wrote: > Once upon a time, Rahul Sundaram said: > > let me get this straight. if its called fedora core > > and is in ISO images, its there and if its in fedora > > extras as rpm packages, it goes away? > > Hey, let's just put the kernel and a static shell on a CD; you can get > the rest over the Internet! Frankly speaking, that's close to I am using Fedora: All I'd need is a CD sufficiently equipped to perform a "basic upgrade/install" and to launch a "yum/apt network install". Once the "network install" is up, it doesn't matter much in which repository on the net the packages are located. Ralf From daryll.strauss at gmail.com Tue Mar 1 15:56:25 2005 From: daryll.strauss at gmail.com (Daryll Strauss) Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 07:56:25 -0800 Subject: I want more CDs in the distribution In-Reply-To: <1109666648.10657.37.camel@petra> References: <55668b8c050228120473a73b01@mail.gmail.com> <1109666648.10657.37.camel@petra> Message-ID: <55668b8c05030107564d3648d3@mail.gmail.com> On Tue, 01 Mar 2005 09:44:08 +0100, Karel Zak wrote: > You forgot important things: > > - We need more package maintainers for this extra work > - and more time for development > - and more time for testing > > I think Debian has experience with huge number of packages. The cost of > this work is huge too. I don't think you understood what I wrote. I don't want more packages. I'm suggesting more CDs. The suggestion is to store the same number of packages, but split over more CDs. A number of people are arguing for a smaller core in order to reduce the download size and install time and splitting the CDs up in some reasonable way achieves that without requiring pruning. This is also independent of who maintains different packages. It would be possible to have extras exist with 3rd parties maintaining packagages and still include them in a disc of a distribution if that's desired. We all hope to have the bright shiney new systems in place by FC5, but splitting the distribution into more CDs is a transitional step between the monolithic distribution we have today and the new system. It seems like a reasonable solution for FC4 and a safety net for FC5 if that is needed. - |Daryll From pknirsch at redhat.com Tue Mar 1 15:58:09 2005 From: pknirsch at redhat.com (Phil Knirsch) Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 16:58:09 +0100 Subject: reducing distribution CD count In-Reply-To: <1109692151.23615.91.camel@cutter> References: <20050224175035.22391185@python2> <20050301134658.GB7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> <1109685440.23615.42.camel@cutter> <42247474.7080606@carwyn.com> <20050301151924.GT7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> <1109690766.23615.72.camel@cutter> <20050301153309.GY7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> <1109691524.23615.86.camel@cutter> <20050301153718.GZ7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> <42248D6F.10605@redhat.com> <1109692151.23615.91.camel@cutter> Message-ID: <42249111.3000002@redhat.com> seth vidal wrote: >>>[PS Farenheit 451 is a great book] >> >>Never read it, i always intended to read it, buying it from Amazon NOW. :) >> >>Read ya, Phil >> > > > plot summary: the gov't burns books and hunts down readers. People turn > into drones watching tv. Some folks memorize books to carry on their > stories. Moral: Book burning, bad. Reading, good. > Good summary. And see, thats why i'm going to buy and read the book. And maybe later burn it, just to prove the point (whichever needs proving ;)) and see wether i feel good or bad about it aferwards to so i can decide wether i'm more prone to be a government official or a freedom of speach type of guy. Oh. Wait. I forgot, it's only a book and fiction... ;) Read ya, Phil -- Philipp Knirsch | Tel.: +49-711-96437-470 Development | Fax.: +49-711-96437-111 Red Hat GmbH | Email: Phil Knirsch Hauptstaetterstr. 58 | Web: http://www.redhat.de/ D-70178 Stuttgart Motd: You're only jealous cos the little penguins are talking to me. From skvidal at phy.duke.edu Tue Mar 1 16:06:38 2005 From: skvidal at phy.duke.edu (seth vidal) Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 11:06:38 -0500 Subject: reducing distribution CD count In-Reply-To: <20050301154313.GA25689@devserv.devel.redhat.com> References: <200502240906.20729.czar@czarc.net> <20050224175035.22391185@python2> <20050301134557.GA7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> <1109691377.13489.17.camel@localhost.localdomain> <20050301153822.GA7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> <1109691917.23615.88.camel@cutter> <20050301154313.GA25689@devserv.devel.redhat.com> Message-ID: <1109693198.23615.101.camel@cutter> > From the fact that extras build systems still seem to be under discussion ah, yes, the build system. Well at this moment, I'm the buildsystem. :) I have a couple of systems I keep the chroots on and build from there. I'm working with an assortment of others to have a build system that any random packager can install to test if their package builds cleanly in the environment that it will be built in for release. it's a work in progress, of course. -sv From mattdm at mattdm.org Tue Mar 1 16:11:18 2005 From: mattdm at mattdm.org (Matthew Miller) Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 11:11:18 -0500 Subject: doing something with /etc/security/access.conf Message-ID: <20050301161118.GA15972@jadzia.bu.edu> One of the admins here pointed out to me that /etc/security/access.conf isn't actually referenced by the default PAM config at all. I checked in bugzilla, and found bug #13245, and bug #19839, both of which are basically resolved as "yep, that's not referenced by the default config at all". *Should* this file be included in system-auth (or at least login's and sshd's pam conf), or is it just "yet another access control mechanism and we've already got a dozen of those and that would just further confuse people"? I think that if not, the comment in the file should be changed to mention that it's not used in the default Fedora/RH config. Anyone have any opinion on this? -- Matthew Miller mattdm at mattdm.org Boston University Linux ------> From rc040203 at freenet.de Tue Mar 1 16:24:02 2005 From: rc040203 at freenet.de (Ralf Corsepius) Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 17:24:02 +0100 Subject: Package pruning for FC4 and beyond - COMPLETE LIST In-Reply-To: <20050301155337.41867.qmail@web8509.mail.in.yahoo.com> References: <20050301155337.41867.qmail@web8509.mail.in.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1109694242.15959.734.camel@mccallum.corsepiu.local> On Tue, 2005-03-01 at 07:53 -0800, Rahul Sundaram wrote: > Hi > > > kedit and gedit could be moved to Extras without > > much pain. > > > > bad idea > > what GUI text editors are KDE and GNOME users > supposed to use?. Either pull one of those in Extras, .. or learn to launch a terminal and start an ASCII-editor :-) .. may-be then they finally realize they don't need one of these GUI- editors ;-) In emergency situations they will have to use them anyway ... Oh, wait, I forgot, these users will reinstall everything, should the X-server come up, or something else prevent them from logging in "graphically". Ralf From shiva at sewingwitch.com Tue Mar 1 16:25:25 2005 From: shiva at sewingwitch.com (Kenneth Porter) Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 08:25:25 -0800 Subject: Entering the DVD age... In-Reply-To: <1109687181.23615.61.camel@cutter> References: <55668b8c050228120473a73b01@mail.gmail.com> <42237A7C.1000309@atl.lmco.com> <754f42e7050228121916f277ba@mail.gmail.com> <422394FC.8040002@margo.bijoux.nom.br> <7E8BD023E1D0BED2FFF63B5C@[10.169.6.246]> <4223EE18.1090204@margo.bijoux.nom.br> <70E46988EEFD9C37A77A1AE6@[10.0.0.14]> <49688.67.138.149.162.1109685975.squirrel@67.138.149.162> <1109687181.23615.61.camel@cutter> Message-ID: <08A98009B7657F0C93F962AF@[10.0.0.14]> --On Tuesday, March 01, 2005 9:26 AM -0500 seth vidal wrote: > DVDs are available but: > 1. thousands of users don't have them/can't afford them > 2. many can't boot from them even if they did have them My installations don't use optical media. Instead, I use the Anaconda option to mount the ISO images I have on the HD. I just need one CD to boot from, and it doesn't need packages, just enough stuff to find the HD and mount the ISO images. I do this mainly for upgrades, but it also works when adding Fedora to a Windows system, and I expect that's the more common use case. From rahulsundaram at yahoo.co.in Tue Mar 1 15:51:24 2005 From: rahulsundaram at yahoo.co.in (Rahul Sundaram) Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 07:51:24 -0800 (PST) Subject: reducing distribution CD count In-Reply-To: <1109692362.23615.96.camel@cutter> Message-ID: <20050301155124.45623.qmail@web8506.mail.in.yahoo.com> Hi > > well it depends on what you mean by 'play with it'. I meant add malicious stuff into it. > > They're all built in a known environment, but the > packagers can be from > all over the world. > > Does that make sense? yes. > > all sorts of extras information here: > http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Extras > ok. thanks ===== Regards Rahul Sundaram __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - now with 250MB free storage. Learn more. http://info.mail.yahoo.com/mail_250 From iago.rubio at hispalinux.es Tue Mar 1 17:05:14 2005 From: iago.rubio at hispalinux.es (Iago Rubio) Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 18:05:14 +0100 Subject: gpdf vs evince In-Reply-To: <20050301152857.60836.qmail@web8507.mail.in.yahoo.com> References: <20050301152857.60836.qmail@web8507.mail.in.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1109696713.22188.150.camel@speedy.iagorubio.net> On Tue, 2005-03-01 at 16:28, Rahul Sundaram wrote: > Hi > > > > Please don't wait. If there are important features > > missing, make sure > > that bugs are filed ASAP. > > > I requested that people file bug reports in an earlier > mail. I was just answering the question of "what > happens if evince still has important features missing > when fc4 is about to be shipped" Well, if this issue with evince is still present on fc4, we can always try "the simplest solution". http://iagorubio.com/evince/simplest_solution.png Just joking 8^) I hope it gets fixed soon. -- Iago Rubio From nalin at redhat.com Tue Mar 1 17:09:30 2005 From: nalin at redhat.com (Nalin Dahyabhai) Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 12:09:30 -0500 Subject: doing something with /etc/security/access.conf In-Reply-To: <20050301161118.GA15972@jadzia.bu.edu> References: <20050301161118.GA15972@jadzia.bu.edu> Message-ID: <20050301170930.GD18754@redhat.com> On Tue, Mar 01, 2005 at 11:11:18AM -0500, Matthew Miller wrote: > *Should* this file be included in system-auth (or at least login's and > sshd's pam conf), or is it just "yet another access control mechanism and > we've already got a dozen of those and that would just further confuse > people"? > > I think that if not, the comment in the file should be changed to mention > that it's not used in the default Fedora/RH config. > > Anyone have any opinion on this? The pam_access mechanism requires that the invoking application define a PAM_TTY item to be useful. That rules its inclusion right out for many PAM configurations. Nalin From michael.favia at insitesinc.com Tue Mar 1 17:15:25 2005 From: michael.favia at insitesinc.com (Michael Favia) Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 11:15:25 -0600 Subject: gpdf vs evince In-Reply-To: <1109696713.22188.150.camel@speedy.iagorubio.net> References: <20050301152857.60836.qmail@web8507.mail.in.yahoo.com> <1109696713.22188.150.camel@speedy.iagorubio.net> Message-ID: <4224A32D.7010205@insitesinc.com> Iago Rubio wrote: >On Tue, 2005-03-01 at 16:28, Rahul Sundaram wrote: > > >>Hi >> >> >>>Please don't wait. If there are important features >>>missing, make sure >>>that bugs are filed ASAP. >>> >>> >>> >>I requested that people file bug reports in an earlier >>mail. I was just answering the question of "what >>happens if evince still has important features missing >>when fc4 is about to be shipped" >> >> > >Well, if this issue with evince is still present on fc4, we can always >try "the simplest solution". >http://iagorubio.com/evince/simplest_solution.png > >Just joking 8^) > >I hope it gets fixed soon. > > hahaha... wow you actualkly took some time for that joke. Thanks for breaking up my morning :). -mf From ivg2 at cornell.edu Tue Mar 1 17:20:57 2005 From: ivg2 at cornell.edu (Ivan Gyurdiev) Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 12:20:57 -0500 Subject: gpdf vs evince In-Reply-To: <1109696713.22188.150.camel@speedy.iagorubio.net> References: <20050301152857.60836.qmail@web8507.mail.in.yahoo.com> <1109696713.22188.150.camel@speedy.iagorubio.net> Message-ID: <1109697657.3682.10.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> >I hope it gets fixed soon. Bug filed. Hopefully it will have better fate than the bug I filed saying SMB file browsing in nautilus doesn't work at all. That one's been open for two months now, in the UNCONFIRMED state with no comment. Sent another reminder there. Don't blame me if I have no faith in the bugzilla system - there's a reason for that. I have mozilla bugs that were opened in 2003. -- Ivan Gyurdiev Cornell University From rjune at bravegnuworld.com Tue Mar 1 17:20:19 2005 From: rjune at bravegnuworld.com (Richard June) Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 12:20:19 -0500 Subject: reducing distribution CD count In-Reply-To: <1109690594.23615.70.camel@cutter> References: <200502240906.20729.czar@czarc.net> <200503010928.16712.rjune@bravegnuworld.com> <1109690594.23615.70.camel@cutter> Message-ID: <200503011220.22309.rjune@bravegnuworld.com> On Tuesday 01 March 2005 10:23, seth vidal wrote: > >> is it b/c they're in a separate repo? But that repo will be on by > >> default for fc4, so how is that harder for the end user or developer? > > > >How does the end user know that these exist and that they are games? > > yum search games > > returns all of them. heh, learn something new every day. -- Public Key available Here: http://www.bravegnuworld.com/~rjune/pubkey.asc -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: not available URL: From stan at ccs.neu.edu Tue Mar 1 17:33:21 2005 From: stan at ccs.neu.edu (Stan Bubrouski) Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 12:33:21 -0500 Subject: reducing distribution CD count In-Reply-To: <1109691917.23615.88.camel@cutter> References: <200502240906.20729.czar@czarc.net> <20050224175035.22391185@python2> <20050301134557.GA7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> <1109691377.13489.17.camel@localhost.localdomain> <20050301153822.GA7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> <1109691917.23615.88.camel@cutter> Message-ID: <4224A761.4070605@ccs.neu.edu> seth vidal wrote: > When/where did you get the impression that random users' binaries would > be uploaded for extras? > I think many people still get the impression that Fedora Extras is in some way correlated to Red Hat Contrib where users did submit their own binaries. When really its processes are more like Red Hat's old Powertools. Just a thought. > I'm asking b/c if this is a common impression I'd like to dispell it. > Consider the job done. -sb > -sv > > From stan at ccs.neu.edu Tue Mar 1 17:41:29 2005 From: stan at ccs.neu.edu (Stan Bubrouski) Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 12:41:29 -0500 Subject: Package pruning for FC4 and beyond - COMPLETE LIST In-Reply-To: <1109694242.15959.734.camel@mccallum.corsepiu.local> References: <20050301155337.41867.qmail@web8509.mail.in.yahoo.com> <1109694242.15959.734.camel@mccallum.corsepiu.local> Message-ID: <4224A949.3010505@ccs.neu.edu> Ralf Corsepius wrote: > > Either pull one of those in Extras, .. or learn to launch a terminal and > start an ASCII-editor :-) > Yeah but when people load up X they aren't wasting the memory to continue to do everything in terminals...that's kinda the point... > .. may-be then they finally realize they don't need one of these GUI- > editors ;-) > Forcing them to doesn't really make X look that useful to new users, or that friendly either. > In emergency situations they will have to use them anyway ... Oh, wait, > I forgot, these users will reinstall everything, should the X-server > come up, or something else prevent them from logging in "graphically". > Sure cause they are all too stupid use a web browser and look for a solution. Your view of typical Fedora users is somewhat disheartening. Would you think taking notepad out of Windows would make more people use DOS Edit? Or install someting else? Look all I'm saying is why take the basic GUI editors out when they don't really take much space and don't take 2 mins to load like OO? -sb > Ralf > > From ville.skytta at iki.fi Tue Mar 1 17:53:13 2005 From: ville.skytta at iki.fi (Ville =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Skytt=E4?=) Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 19:53:13 +0200 Subject: Package pruning for FC4 and beyond In-Reply-To: <20050228183608.GD897460@hiwaay.net> References: <422007DD.1020404@snowmoon.com> <42207BEB.7020000@snowmoon.com> <604aa79105022809106bd60c13@mail.gmail.com> <20050228183608.GD897460@hiwaay.net> Message-ID: <1109699593.15077.114.camel@bobcat.mine.nu> On Mon, 2005-02-28 at 12:36 -0600, Chris Adams wrote: > Mmm... nethack. I had a good nethack package a while back; sounds like > a good excuse to clean it up and learn about maintaining a package in > Extras. Already there, "yum install nethack-falconseye". It's the Falcon's eye GUI version of NH; traditional TTY works too: $ NETHACKOPTIONS=windowtype:tty nethack From fedora at wir-sind-cool.org Tue Mar 1 17:57:22 2005 From: fedora at wir-sind-cool.org (Michael Schwendt) Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 18:57:22 +0100 Subject: reducing distribution CD count In-Reply-To: <20050301154415.16161.qmail@web8510.mail.in.yahoo.com> References: <1109691917.23615.88.camel@cutter> <20050301154415.16161.qmail@web8510.mail.in.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20050301185722.36044c90.fedora@wir-sind-cool.org> On Tue, 1 Mar 2005 07:44:15 -0800 (PST), Rahul Sundaram wrote: > > When/where did you get the impression that random > > users' binaries would > > be uploaded for extras? > > > > I'm asking b/c if this is a common impression I'd > > like to dispell it. > > > > -sv > > its not just his impression. I have heard it mentioned > in several news sites and forums that fedora extras > might not be reliable because random people will play > with it. Do you know of any news sites where such rumours have been spread? If it's just forum members, who are not Fedora Core users, it's not interesting. But _news sites_...? From dmalcolm at redhat.com Tue Mar 1 18:07:10 2005 From: dmalcolm at redhat.com (David Malcolm) Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 13:07:10 -0500 Subject: gpdf vs evince In-Reply-To: <1109696713.22188.150.camel@speedy.iagorubio.net> References: <20050301152857.60836.qmail@web8507.mail.in.yahoo.com> <1109696713.22188.150.camel@speedy.iagorubio.net> Message-ID: <1109700430.4888.16.camel@cassandra.boston.redhat.com> On Tue, 2005-03-01 at 18:05 +0100, Iago Rubio wrote: >On Tue, 2005-03-01 at 16:28, Rahul Sundaram wrote: >> Hi >> > >> > Please don't wait. If there are important features >> > missing, make sure >> > that bugs are filed ASAP. >> > >> I requested that people file bug reports in an earlier >> mail. I was just answering the question of "what >> happens if evince still has important features missing >> when fc4 is about to be shipped" > >Well, if this issue with evince is still present on fc4, we can always >try "the simplest solution". >http://iagorubio.com/evince/simplest_solution.png > >Just joking 8^) /me ROFL Thanks! From mike at navi.cx Tue Mar 1 18:43:58 2005 From: mike at navi.cx (Mike Hearn) Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 18:43:58 +0000 Subject: Hacking modversions Message-ID: Hello, I'd like to propose that kernel updates release via fedora-updates use the same modversions.h as the last one if there were no interface changes. I know that may be a controversial proposal, but read on. For security fixes, it's rare (but not impossible) that a kernel interface changes. In this case it would be possible to use the same symbol mangling and therefore not prevent user-compiled modules from loading, and it would be safe. For the other updates released, more care would have to be taken to notice if there were changes or not - if there was any doubt about binary compatibility, then modversions would still change, but if there was simply eg, a driver bugfix then it would not be changed. This solves the following problem: Bill sets up a Linux system for Sally. She does a "yum upgrade" because she knows it's important to stay up to date to be secure. The kernel is changed, and as a result various things break even though the update was fixing a race condition in a syscall implementation. She does not know how to fix it. This is not a "please can the kernel have a stable ABI" email. It doesn't, and that's the end of the story. This is a "please do not prevent self-compiled modules from loading unless there is a real need" email, which I haven't seen brought up before (you have my apologies if it was) and should not have much impact outside a bit more work for Dave Jones I guess ;) Is this possible to do? It would require a careful analysis of the changes being made to the kernel in online updates, but hopefully this already happens anyway :) The actual build system modifications should not be too tricky, I hope ... thanks -mike From arjanv at redhat.com Tue Mar 1 18:56:07 2005 From: arjanv at redhat.com (Arjan van de Ven) Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 19:56:07 +0100 Subject: Hacking modversions In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1109703367.6293.145.camel@laptopd505.fenrus.org> On Tue, 2005-03-01 at 18:43 +0000, Mike Hearn wrote: > Hello, > > I'd like to propose that kernel updates release via fedora-updates use the > same modversions.h as the last one if there were no interface > changes. I know that may be a controversial proposal, but read on. > > For security fixes, it's rare (but not impossible) that a kernel interface > changes. In practice those ALWAYS change. That's just speaking from experience. Fedora doesn't have kernel updates that are "just" minimal security fixes. And even with those it's really hard to not break the internal abi (or even to know you didn't break the abi, since there is no abi definition or no way to really check it) to the point that it's ALWAYS better to just recompile. Once you're set up for that, there's no point in doing weird hacks for the 1 in 100 where you could avoid the recompile; it's then so rare that it becomes REALLY fragile and just breaks more than it fixes. -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part URL: From buildsys at redhat.com Tue Mar 1 19:08:47 2005 From: buildsys at redhat.com (Build System) Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 14:08:47 -0500 Subject: rawhide report: 20050301 changes Message-ID: <200503011908.j21J8lsr013948@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> New package openssl097a The OpenSSL toolkit. Removed package gcc4 Removed package fake-build-provides Removed package ttfonts-zh_CN Removed package ttfonts-zh_TW Updated Packages: apr-0.9.6-2 ----------- * Tue Mar 01 2005 Joe Orton 0.9.6-2 - have apr-devel depend on specific version of gcc - add NOTICE to docdir arts-8:1.4.0-0.rc1.3 -------------------- * Tue Mar 01 2005 Than Ngo 8:1.4.0-0.rc1.3 - rebuilt against gcc 4 * Fri Feb 25 2005 Than Ngo 8:1.4.0-0.rc1.2 - KDE 3.4.0 rc1 * Mon Feb 14 2005 Than Ngo 8:1.3.92-0.1 - 3.4beta2 binutils-2.15.94.0.2-3 ---------------------- * Mon Feb 28 2005 Jakub Jelinek 2.15.94.0.2-3 - fix buffer overflows in readelf (#149506) - move c++filt to binutils from gcc-c++, conflict with gcc-c++ < 4.0 (#86333) cvs-1.11.19-2 ------------- * Mon Feb 28 2005 Martin Stransky 1.11.19-2 - add opt flags * Mon Feb 28 2005 Martin Stransky 1.11.19-1 - update to 1.11.19 dump-0.4b39-2 ------------- * Mon Feb 28 2005 Jindrich Novy 0.4b39-2 - Updated the EA patch with support for in-inode EAs, big inodes and fixes 'error in EA block' displayed for every single inode (#149299) - patch from Stelian Pop dvgrab-1.7-2 ------------ * Mon Feb 28 2005 Warren Togami 1.7-2 - gcc4 rebuild epiphany-1.5.7-1 ---------------- * Mon Feb 28 2005 Matthias Clasen - 1.5.7-1 - Update to 1.5.7 gaim-1:1.1.4-2 -------------- * Mon Feb 28 2005 Warren Togami 1:1.1.4-2 - remove gcc4 conditional since FC4 is gcc4 default gcc-4.0.0-0.30 -------------- gettext-0.14.1-14 ----------------- * Tue Mar 01 2005 Jakub Jelinek - rebuilt with gcc 4.0 * Wed Dec 01 2004 Leon Ho - Add env var to redirect use fastjar instead of jar - BuildRequires /usr/bin/fastjar and libgcj glib2-2.6.3-1 ------------- * Mon Feb 28 2005 Matthias Clasen - 2.6.3-1 - Upgrade to 2.6.3 gnome-utils-1:2.9.92-1 ---------------------- * Mon Feb 28 2005 Matthias Clasen 1:2.9.92-1 - Update to gnome-utils, zenity 2.9.92 gnopernicus-0.10.2-1 -------------------- * Mon Feb 28 2005 Matthias Clasen 0.10.2-1 - Update to 0.10.2 gok-1.0.1-1 ----------- * Mon Feb 28 2005 Matthias Clasen 1.0.1-1 - Update to 1.0.1 gtk2-2.6.3-1 ------------ * Mon Feb 28 2005 Matthias Clasen - 2.6.3-1 - Upgrade to 2.6.3 * Fri Feb 04 2005 Matthias Clasen - 2.6.2-1 - Upgrade to 2.6.2 * Mon Jan 10 2005 Matthias Clasen - 2.6.1-1 - Upgrade to 2.6.1 - Drop no longer needed fixes gtkhtml2-2.6.3-1 ---------------- * Mon Feb 28 2005 Matthias Clasen - 2.6.3-1 - Update to 2.6.3 hotplug-3:2004_09_23-2 ---------------------- * Mon Feb 28 2005 Bill Nottingham 3:2004_09_23-2 - fix mishandling of addressless devices in net.agent hpijs-1.7.1-2 ------------- * Mon Feb 28 2005 Tim Waugh 1.7.1-2 - Fixes inspired by GCC4 . iptables-1.3.0-1 ---------------- * Mon Feb 21 2005 Thomas Woerner 1.3.0-1 - new version 1.3.0 kdebase-6:3.4.0-0.rc1.3 ----------------------- * Tue Mar 01 2005 Than Ngo 6:3.4.0-0.rc1.3 - rebuilt against gcc-4 * Sat Feb 26 2005 Than Ngo 6:3.4.0-0.rc1.2 - bump release * Fri Feb 25 2005 Than Ngo 6:3.4.0-0.rc1.1 - KDE 3.4.0 rc1 kdegames-6:3.4.0-0.rc1.1 ------------------------ * Sat Feb 26 2005 Than Ngo 6:3.4.0-0.rc1.1 - KDE-3.4.0 rc1 * Sun Feb 20 2005 Than Ngo 6:3.3.92-0.1 - KDE-3.4 beta2 kdelibs-6:3.4.0-0.rc1.2 ----------------------- * Tue Mar 01 2005 Than Ngo 6:3.4.0-0.rc1.2 - rebuilt against gcc-4 * Sat Feb 26 2005 Than Ngo 6:3.4.0-0.rc1.1 - bump release * Fri Feb 25 2005 Than Ngo 6:3.4.0-0.rc1.0 - KDE 3.4.0 rc1 libavc1394-0.4.1-7 ------------------ * Mon Feb 28 2005 Warren Togami 0.4.1-7 - gcc4 rebuild libdv-0:0.103-3 --------------- * Mon Feb 28 2005 Warren Togami - 0:0.103-3 - gcc4 rebuild libraw1394-1.1.0-2 ------------------ * Mon Feb 28 2005 Warren Togami 0.9.12-8 - gcc4 rebuild libtool-1.5.14.multilib2-5 -------------------------- * Tue Mar 01 2005 Alexandre Oliva 1.5.14.multilib2-5 - use gfortran instead of g77. - rebuild with GCC 4. metacity-2.9.21-1 ----------------- * Mon Feb 28 2005 Matthias Clasen 2.9.21-1 - Update to 2.9.21 net-tools-1.60-47 ----------------- * Mon Feb 28 2005 Radek Vokal 1.60-47 - added RPM_OPT_FLAGS - execshield patch for netplug nss_db-2.2-30 ------------- * Mon Feb 28 2005 Nalin Dahyabhai 2.2-30 - update to DB 4.3 (#140094) - add sample getent-based makefile as a doc file - pass S_IFREG to matchpathcon() to properly match contexts which are earmarked for only files nss_ldap-234-1 -------------- * Mon Feb 28 2005 Nalin Dahyabhai 234-1 - update to nss_ldap 234 - configure with --enable-configurable-krb5-ccname * Wed Feb 02 2005 Nalin Dahyabhai 232-2 - prefer using libraries in /usr/lib64/nss_ldap-openldap if we find any - use ldap_start_tls in preference to ldap_start_tls_s, if found openmotif-2.2.3-9 ----------------- * Mon Feb 28 2005 Thomas Woerner 2.2.3-9 - Upstream Fix: Multiscreen mode - Upstream Fix: Crash when restarting by a session manager (motifzone#1193) - Upstream Fix: Crash when duplicating a window menu containing f.circle_up (motifzone#1202) - fixed divide by zero error in ComputeVizCount() (#144420) - Xpmcreate: define LONG64 on 64 bit architectures (#143689) * Mon Nov 29 2004 Thomas Woerner 2.2.3-8.1 - allow to write XPM files with absolute path names again (#140815) * Wed Nov 24 2004 Miloslav Trmac 2.2.3-8 - Convert man pages to UTF-8 openssh-3.9p1-12 ---------------- * Mon Feb 28 2005 Nalin Dahyabhai 3.9p1-12 - rebuild so that configure can detect that krb5_init_ets is gone now openssl-0.9.7e-2 ---------------- * Mon Feb 28 2005 Tomas Mraz 0.9.7e-2 - rebuild * Mon Feb 28 2005 Tomas Mraz 0.9.7e-1 - new upstream source, updated patches - added patch so we are hopefully ABI compatible with upcoming 0.9.7f * Thu Feb 10 2005 Tomas Mraz - Support UTF-8 charset in the Makefile.certificate (#134944) - Added cmp to BuildPrereq pam_krb5-2.1.4-1 ---------------- * Mon Feb 28 2005 Nalin Dahyabhai - 2.1.4-1 - update to 2.1.4 policycoreutils-1.21.20-3 ------------------------- * Mon Feb 28 2005 Dan Walsh 1.21.20-3 - Fix genhomedircon to add extr "\n" qt-1:3.3.4-6 ------------ * Mon Feb 28 2005 Than Ngo 1:3.3.4-6 - rebuilt against gcc-4 rpmdb-fedora-1:4-0.20050301 --------------------------- tetex-3.0-3 ----------- * Mon Feb 28 2005 Jindrich Novy 3.0-3 - repack sources from gz -> bz2 (reduces srpm size of about 10M) - add $RPM_OPT_FLAGS to CFLAGS - replace obsolete --with-x-toolkit with --with-mf-x-toolkit and --with-xdvi-x-toolkit From hp at redhat.com Tue Mar 1 19:10:40 2005 From: hp at redhat.com (Havoc Pennington) Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 14:10:40 -0500 Subject: gpdf vs evince In-Reply-To: <1109697657.3682.10.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> References: <20050301152857.60836.qmail@web8507.mail.in.yahoo.com> <1109696713.22188.150.camel@speedy.iagorubio.net> <1109697657.3682.10.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> Message-ID: <1109704240.12612.86.camel@localhost.localdomain> On Tue, 2005-03-01 at 12:20 -0500, Ivan Gyurdiev wrote: > >I hope it gets fixed soon. > > Bug filed. Hopefully it will have better fate than the bug I filed > saying SMB file browsing in nautilus doesn't work at all. That one's > been open for two months now, in the UNCONFIRMED state with no comment. > Sent another reminder there. Don't blame me if I have no faith in the > bugzilla system - there's a reason for that. I have mozilla bugs that > were opened in 2003. > Welcome to reality. If you file a bug, you know it's in the priority queue. It could still be near the bottom, in which case it's likely to be permanently starved because new stuff gets added to the top constantly. If you want guaranteed response time you have two options: - make your own priority queue and start working on it in the order of your choice - pay someone to do that for you But the simple reality is that number of bugs vastly exceeds developers to fix them, for any large software project I know of, so the bugs at the bottom of the list aren't going to get fixed. Grumbling about it on mailing lists isn't going to change anything. Havoc From terraformers at gmx.net Tue Mar 1 19:13:12 2005 From: terraformers at gmx.net (Lars) Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 20:13:12 +0100 Subject: kde-3.4 (3.3.92) in fc4 References: <20050227220622.89456.qmail@web41523.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Lars wrote: > Roberto Peon wrote: > >> By which, I believe, Lars means that it is out... >> .. and I mean that it is compiling on my box. >> >> (Well, at least the konstruct is. I havn't even looked for packages) >> -R >> > > yes its out now for about five days and no binary packages in rawhide and > kde's ftp. oh well, maybe its in todays rawhide... would be great! > > best > lars > > > i'm in love with the buildsystem again! finally *IT* arrived ! yay! :) best lars From mike at navi.cx Tue Mar 1 19:22:13 2005 From: mike at navi.cx (Mike Hearn) Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 19:22:13 +0000 Subject: Hacking modversions References: <1109703367.6293.145.camel@laptopd505.fenrus.org> Message-ID: On Tue, 01 Mar 2005 19:56:07 +0100, Arjan van de Ven wrote: > In practice those ALWAYS change. That's just speaking from experience. > Fedora doesn't have kernel updates that are "just" minimal security > fixes. So I noticed. Right now it's a moot point because there are no patch RPMs, but in future it might be worth making sure the amount you need to download to stay secure is minimal. Otherwise dialup users are going to be immediately left behind and insecure. Something for the future though. > And even with those it's really hard to not break the internal > abi (or even to know you didn't break the abi, since there is no abi > definition or no way to really check it) to the point that it's ALWAYS > better to just recompile. An ABI is a precise thing, I see that modversions already bases the checksums on things like struct size (though in my kernels it looks like every symbol changes so maybe it's random too). It should be possible to look at a bugfix and say "Yep that doesn't change the ABI". There are other types of breaking change which are harder, like 4k stacks, but recompiling doesn't fix them anyway. So it doesn't matter from the module loaders perspective. > Once you're set up for that, there's no point > in doing weird hacks for the 1 in 100 where you could avoid the > recompile; it's then so rare that it becomes REALLY fragile and just > breaks more than it fixes. If Fedoras security updates were actually just security updates, and not "fix a security bug and also rebase the kernel to a new patchset" then it wouldn't be rare and fragile. But that's a totally different area of policy I don't want to get into now .... OK, thanks for explaining this Arjan. I'll consider the matter closed. thanks -mike From eric at snowmoon.com Tue Mar 1 19:21:24 2005 From: eric at snowmoon.com (Eric Warnke) Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 14:21:24 -0500 Subject: Hacking modversions In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4224C0B4.7010400@snowmoon.com> Mike Hearn wrote: >This solves the following problem: > >Bill sets up a Linux system for Sally. She does a "yum upgrade" because >she knows it's important to stay up to date to be secure. The kernel is >changed, and as a result various things break even though the update was >fixing a race condition in a syscall implementation. She does not >know how to fix it. > > > Why not use tiggers in binary kernel mod rpm's to at least attempt to get a more an up-to-date version? That way whenever the kernel changes the dependant rpm's would attempt to install the latest version of the modules. Though I admit that maybe it's time for a more intuitive boot process so that users faced with a horribly messed up system from a kernel upgrade could "Boot from last known good kernel". Cheers, Eric -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 252 bytes Desc: OpenPGP digital signature URL: From skvidal at phy.duke.edu Tue Mar 1 19:29:13 2005 From: skvidal at phy.duke.edu (seth vidal) Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 14:29:13 -0500 Subject: Hacking modversions In-Reply-To: <4224C0B4.7010400@snowmoon.com> References: <4224C0B4.7010400@snowmoon.com> Message-ID: <1109705353.31304.27.camel@cutter> >Why not use tiggers in binary kernel mod rpm's to at least attempt to >get a more an up-to-date version? That way whenever the kernel changes >the dependant rpm's would attempt to install the latest version of the >modules. > the most wonderful thing about tiggers. Is tiggers are wonderful things. However, triggers are not. They should be handled with excruciating care, like epochs. Now, in this situation you're describing you want an rpm to spawn off some other process to go fetch new kernel module rpms? How would you standardize and mandate that? Remember, %scriptlets cannot be user-interactive. -sv -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From peter.backlund at home.se Tue Mar 1 19:30:15 2005 From: peter.backlund at home.se (Peter Backlund) Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 20:30:15 +0100 Subject: rawhide report: 20050301 changes In-Reply-To: <200503011908.j21J8lsr013948@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> References: <200503011908.j21J8lsr013948@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> Message-ID: <1109705415.4352.0.camel@localhost.localdomain> >gaim-1:1.1.4-2 >-------------- >* Mon Feb 28 2005 Warren Togami 1:1.1.4-2 >- remove gcc4 conditional since FC4 is gcc4 default Well, this is certainly news, or have I not been paying attention lately? /Peter From skvidal at phy.duke.edu Tue Mar 1 19:30:35 2005 From: skvidal at phy.duke.edu (seth vidal) Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 14:30:35 -0500 Subject: rawhide report: 20050301 changes In-Reply-To: <1109705415.4352.0.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <200503011908.j21J8lsr013948@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <1109705415.4352.0.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <1109705435.31304.29.camel@cutter> On Tue, 2005-03-01 at 20:30 +0100, Peter Backlund wrote: >>gaim-1:1.1.4-2 >>-------------- >>* Mon Feb 28 2005 Warren Togami 1:1.1.4-2 >>- remove gcc4 conditional since FC4 is gcc4 default > >Well, this is certainly news, or have I not been paying attention >lately? > which part? gcc4 being the default? if so then you've not been paying attention. Bill announced it last week. -sv From michael.favia at insitesinc.com Tue Mar 1 19:57:11 2005 From: michael.favia at insitesinc.com (Michael Favia) Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 13:57:11 -0600 Subject: Package pruning for FC4 and beyond - COMPLETE LIST In-Reply-To: <1109694242.15959.734.camel@mccallum.corsepiu.local> References: <20050301155337.41867.qmail@web8509.mail.in.yahoo.com> <1109694242.15959.734.camel@mccallum.corsepiu.local> Message-ID: <4224C917.3000004@insitesinc.com> Ralf Corsepius wrote: >On Tue, 2005-03-01 at 07:53 -0800, Rahul Sundaram wrote: > > >>Hi >> >> >> >>>kedit and gedit could be moved to Extras without >>>much pain. >>> >>> >>> >>bad idea >> >> what GUI text editors are KDE and GNOME users >>supposed to use?. >> >> >Either pull one of those in Extras, .. or learn to launch a terminal and >start an ASCII-editor :-) > >.. may-be then they finally realize they don't need one of these GUI- >editors ;-) > >In emergency situations they will have to use them anyway ... Oh, wait, >I forgot, these users will reinstall everything, should the X-server >come up, or something else prevent them from logging in "graphically". > >Ralf > > This is sarcasm correct? There will be a *simple gui text editor* in fc4 right? -mf From fedora-devel at camperquake.de Tue Mar 1 19:59:54 2005 From: fedora-devel at camperquake.de (Ralf Ertzinger) Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 20:59:54 +0100 Subject: reducing distribution CD count In-Reply-To: <20050301153309.GY7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> References: <200502240906.20729.czar@czarc.net> <20050224175035.22391185@python2> <20050301134658.GB7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> <1109685440.23615.42.camel@cutter> <42247474.7080606@carwyn.com> <20050301151924.GT7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> <1109690766.23615.72.camel@cutter> <20050301153309.GY7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> Message-ID: <20050301205954.28ff24e0@nausicaa.camperquake.de> Hi. Alan Cox wrote: > Actually reading the material about this again it may be a good reason > for keeping bzflag in extras. Well, SuSE ships bzflag, also, and I do not remember seeing a sticker (since SuSE ships actual boxes contrary to Fedora) claiming that the product is unsuitable for persons aged below 18 (which would be the case if the game is not rated, which it obviously is not). Maybe a chat with the SuSE peole would clear that one up. -- I'm a sysadmin, not a doctor, and I've spent the last ten years ensuring that state of affairs. -- Patrick Gosling From ghenriks at rogers.com Tue Mar 1 20:06:01 2005 From: ghenriks at rogers.com (Gerald Henriksen) Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 15:06:01 -0500 Subject: I want more CDs in the distribution In-Reply-To: <64134.192.54.193.137.1109668449.squirrel@rousalka.dyndns.org> References: <55668b8c050228120473a73b01@mail.gmail.com> <42237B18.3000803@snowmoon.com> <64134.192.54.193.137.1109668449.squirrel@rousalka.dyndns.org> Message-ID: On Tue, 1 Mar 2005 10:14:09 +0100 (CET), you wrote: > >On Mar 1 mars 2005 0:48, Gerald Henriksen a ?crit : >> On Mon, 28 Feb 2005 22:49:19 +0100 (CET), you wrote: >> >>>Yet another alternative: >>> >>>Postpone FC4 until both Anaconda repo support and Fedora Extras are >>> ready, >>>and let FC3 evolve more controlled over the stretched period. Preparing >>>FC4 will result in spending less resources in Anaconda and Fedora Extras. >> >> I am beginning to think this is the best idea. >> >> Delay Fedora Core 4 for 6 months. >> >> This hopefully gives time to get Anaconda and all the other relevant >> bits set up to allow for a distribution that is made up of 2 parts >> (Core and Extras). Prehaps even rename them to better reflect that >> they are of equal value. >> >> It also gives more time to allow the things people are aiming to try >> and include (gcc 4, java, openoffice.org 2) to get ready as well as >> get people and mirrors used to Extras. > >There's always some almost ready next big thing we should wait for. The point is that the new version of Anaconda is really a requirement for this Core plus Extras that the people in charge of Fedora want. Given that the process of moving packages out of Core and into Extras has already started it seems to me to be a bad move to release a version of Fedora that can't deal with this fact. These aren't packages that are obsolete or that people aren't using anymore, but packages that for whatever reason no longer fit the requirements to be in Core. If Red Hat and the people in charge of Fedora want people to view Extras as a postive change then not only does Extras have to be available at the same time Core is but the installer/updater needs to be able to deal with the fact that some of the packages are in Extras now. Shipping a release of Fedora that can't deal with Extras in in essence shipping a broken version of Fedora if Extras really is a first class part of Fedora as people are trying to say. From skvidal at phy.duke.edu Tue Mar 1 20:12:03 2005 From: skvidal at phy.duke.edu (seth vidal) Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 15:12:03 -0500 Subject: reducing distribution CD count In-Reply-To: <4224A761.4070605@ccs.neu.edu> References: <200502240906.20729.czar@czarc.net> <20050224175035.22391185@python2> <20050301134557.GA7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> <1109691377.13489.17.camel@localhost.localdomain> <20050301153822.GA7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> <1109691917.23615.88.camel@cutter> <4224A761.4070605@ccs.neu.edu> Message-ID: <1109707923.31304.47.camel@cutter> On Tue, 2005-03-01 at 12:33 -0500, Stan Bubrouski wrote: >seth vidal wrote: > > When/where did you get the impression that random users' binaries would >> be uploaded for extras? >> > >I think many people still get the impression that Fedora Extras is in >some way correlated to Red Hat Contrib where users did submit their own >binaries. When really its processes are more like Red Hat's old >Powertools. Just a thought. Yes, much more like powertools. Not at all like contrib. And if it starts to be like contrib well, we have baseball bats and hammers to fix that problem. :) -sv From skvidal at phy.duke.edu Tue Mar 1 20:13:50 2005 From: skvidal at phy.duke.edu (seth vidal) Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 15:13:50 -0500 Subject: Package pruning for FC4 and beyond - COMPLETE LIST In-Reply-To: <4224C917.3000004@insitesinc.com> References: <20050301155337.41867.qmail@web8509.mail.in.yahoo.com> <1109694242.15959.734.camel@mccallum.corsepiu.local> <4224C917.3000004@insitesinc.com> Message-ID: <1109708030.31304.51.camel@cutter> >> >>In emergency situations they will have to use them anyway ... Oh, wait, >>I forgot, these users will reinstall everything, should the X-server >>come up, or something else prevent them from logging in "graphically". >> >>Ralf >> >> >This is sarcasm correct? There will be a *simple gui text editor* in fc4 >right? yes, There will be a simple gui text editor. Ralf has no more control over core than you or I. -sv From skvidal at phy.duke.edu Tue Mar 1 20:14:32 2005 From: skvidal at phy.duke.edu (seth vidal) Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 15:14:32 -0500 Subject: I want more CDs in the distribution In-Reply-To: References: <55668b8c050228120473a73b01@mail.gmail.com> <42237B18.3000803@snowmoon.com> <64134.192.54.193.137.1109668449.squirrel@rousalka.dyndns.org> Message-ID: <1109708072.31304.53.camel@cutter> >If Red Hat and the people in charge of Fedora want people to view >Extras as a postive change then not only does Extras have to be >available at the same time Core is but the installer/updater needs to >be able to deal with the fact that some of the packages are in Extras >now. Shipping a release of Fedora that can't deal with Extras in in >essence shipping a broken version of Fedora if Extras really is a >first class part of Fedora as people are trying to say. Fedora can deal with Extras. Fedora has no problem dealing with extras. anaconda, right now, does not know much about it. That's all. -sv From terraformers at gmx.net Tue Mar 1 20:12:53 2005 From: terraformers at gmx.net (Lars) Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 21:12:53 +0100 Subject: rawhide report: 20050301 changes References: <200503011908.j21J8lsr013948@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> Message-ID: there is a problem updating to the new kde rc and ssl. i get: Error: Missing Dependency: openssl = 0.9.7a is needed by package kdelibs i guess the (compat) openssl097a package should be used by kdelibs instead? L From arjanv at redhat.com Tue Mar 1 20:13:46 2005 From: arjanv at redhat.com (Arjan van de Ven) Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 21:13:46 +0100 Subject: Hacking modversions In-Reply-To: References: <1109703367.6293.145.camel@laptopd505.fenrus.org> Message-ID: <1109708026.6293.159.camel@laptopd505.fenrus.org> On Tue, 2005-03-01 at 19:22 +0000, Mike Hearn wrote: > An ABI is a precise thing only if it's defined. the linux kernel internals aren't. > , I see that modversions already bases > the checksums on things like struct size (though in my kernels it looks > like every symbol changes so maybe it's random too). that by far isn't enough to describe the ABI. You also have to include things like locking order, locking rules and every other kind of behavior as well. Simple example: a function that suddenly no longer accepts NULL as a safe parameter but oopses. Ok artiticial, but not that much (esp if it was never supposed to be called with NULL) and it's REALLY hard to catch such ABI changes. One step further: Now imagine this happening because you add a function call inside the function, where with luck before NULL was harmless. And this function happened to be one to be used (incorrectly) by $yourfavoritemodule. End of game. It's *REALLY* hard to detect such things preemptively, esp since we don't have the source to the external modules (even when they are open source; realistically they are second citizens and don't get looked at much for such things) > It should be possible > to look at a bugfix and say "Yep that doesn't change the ABI". you would be surprised how incredibly hard that is. Red Hat tries it really hard for RHEL, and even there we accidentally break the ABI like every other update release in practice, despite trying REALLY hard. It simply isn't as simple as it sounds. Most security fixes nowadays are either very local, or cross multiple functions, probably in a 50% ratio each. The moment you cross a function barrier you've lost in the "easy ABI" game and it gets REALLY tricky. And even for local fixes it's not always so easy... take the NULL pointer example. -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part URL: From dwmw2 at infradead.org Tue Mar 1 20:42:22 2005 From: dwmw2 at infradead.org (David Woodhouse) Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 20:42:22 +0000 Subject: Hacking modversions In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1109709742.15242.8.camel@baythorne.infradead.org> On Tue, 2005-03-01 at 18:43 +0000, Mike Hearn wrote: > This solves the following problem: > > Bill sets up a Linux system for Sally. She does a "yum upgrade" because > she knows it's important to stay up to date to be secure. The kernel is > changed, and as a result various things break even though the update was > fixing a race condition in a syscall implementation. She does not > know how to fix it. Bill was wrong here to leave Sally with a Linux system which relies on stuff which is not in the standard kernel. If she's going to use binary- only crap he might as well have installed Windows for her. -- dwmw2 From barryn at pobox.com Tue Mar 1 21:10:24 2005 From: barryn at pobox.com (Barry K. Nathan) Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 13:10:24 -0800 Subject: Hacking modversions In-Reply-To: <1109705353.31304.27.camel@cutter> References: <4224C0B4.7010400@snowmoon.com> <1109705353.31304.27.camel@cutter> Message-ID: <20050301211023.GD30940@ip68-4-98-123.oc.oc.cox.net> On Tue, Mar 01, 2005 at 02:29:13PM -0500, seth vidal wrote: > the most wonderful thing about tiggers. Is tiggers are wonderful things. > However, triggers are not. They should be handled with excruciating > care, like epochs. Now, in this situation you're describing you want an > rpm to spawn off some other process to go fetch new kernel module rpms? > > How would you standardize and mandate that? Remember, %scriptlets cannot > be user-interactive. Perhaps DKMS would be a more suitable solution then... (It can be used for open-source as well as closed-source software BTW. For instance, Dell used to use it to preload ALSA on some of their computers back in the Red Hat 8.0 days. Upgrading the kernel would cause the ALSA modules to be recompiled when booting into the new kernel, so everything kept working.) http://linux.dell.com/projects.shtml#dkms http://linux.dell.com/dkms/dkms.html -Barry K. Nathan From davej at redhat.com Tue Mar 1 21:26:29 2005 From: davej at redhat.com (Dave Jones) Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 16:26:29 -0500 Subject: ITE 8212 and pwc drivers absent in Rawhide In-Reply-To: <20050301143132.46441.qmail@web8507.mail.in.yahoo.com> References: <20050301142253.GG7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> <20050301143132.46441.qmail@web8507.mail.in.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20050301212629.GF10277@redhat.com> On Tue, Mar 01, 2005 at 06:31:32AM -0800, Rahul Sundaram wrote: > Hi > > > I offered to, but there are other maintainers. I > > mostly offered to prove > > Linus was being totally two faced about it. When he > > removed the driver at > > the original authors request I asked him to remove > > all my code too because > > his approach was offensive to me. He refused. > > > Greg and Linus were trying to be polite about it. In > general we shouldnt be having code despite authors > requests inside the kernel. Authors sign away the right to take their toys home when they want to throw a tantrum when they submit code under the GPL. *nothing* stops someone else taking the last version of the GPL'd code and taking over maintenance. It's the same deal as if someone decided that something was going to be changed from GPL to proprietary. (See OpenGFS history for an example of this in action). Consider it the anti-loony clause of the GPL. Dave From davej at redhat.com Tue Mar 1 21:28:40 2005 From: davej at redhat.com (Dave Jones) Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 16:28:40 -0500 Subject: ITE 8212 and pwc drivers absent in Rawhide In-Reply-To: <20050301140400.GD7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> References: <1109319950.5110.22.camel@localhost.localdomain> <20050225082208.GA14931@redhat.com> <20050301140400.GD7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> Message-ID: <20050301212840.GG10277@redhat.com> On Tue, Mar 01, 2005 at 09:04:00AM -0500, Alan Cox wrote: > On Fri, Feb 25, 2005 at 03:22:08AM -0500, Dave Jones wrote: > > Right now, they're only in Alan Cox's -ac tree, for which there > > is no patch that applies to the 2.6.11rc tree that FC3 is tracking. > > You can track 11rc, but the 2.6.11rc still has all the locking holes unfixed. I don't see a point in the development tree continuing to track .10 By the time FC4 ships, it's likely we'll be at .12, so theres plenty of time to get stuff like this upstream. Who knows, we may even be able to ship a 2.6.12-ac if we need to 8-) Dave From jwz at jwz.org Tue Mar 1 21:36:17 2005 From: jwz at jwz.org (Jamie Zawinski) Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 13:36:17 -0800 Subject: reducing distribution CD count References: <200502240906.20729.czar@czarc.net> <20050224175035.22391185@python2> <20050301134557.GA7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> Message-ID: <4224E051.39E412B0@jwz.org> Alan Cox wrote: > > > - Both tuxracer and bzflag were removed, but many people (Havoc, > > Alan) definitely want at least one good 3D game to "show off". > > And to debug 3D. We no longer have any way to debug 3D problems on Fedora > with packages we know the client side of and build form. In my experience, xscreensaver is going to give the 3d hardware a much more extensive workout than any given game. Maybe this has changed in the latest Rawhide (I haven't checked) but it used to be that a Gnome install came with the full complement of 3D savers. Also, more people run screen savers than tuxracer, so that's where the video driver crashes tend to occur. Then they blame me and I am sad. -- Jamie Zawinski jwz at jwz.org http://www.jwz.org/ jwz at dnalounge.com http://www.dnalounge.com/ http://jwz.livejournal.com/ From aoliva at redhat.com Tue Mar 1 21:38:41 2005 From: aoliva at redhat.com (Alexandre Oliva) Date: 01 Mar 2005 18:38:41 -0300 Subject: FC3 -> FC4 Upgrade? (was Re: reducing distribution CD count) In-Reply-To: <1109692384.4740.2.camel@nexus.verbum.private> References: <1109287914.26364.69.camel@localhost.localdomain> <421F36A6.8040401@olin.edu> <1109342585.26364.163.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1109346741.10989.13.camel@opus.phy.duke.edu> <1109346973.26364.181.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1109348125.10989.22.camel@opus.phy.duke.edu> <20050225162219.GD1048932@hiwaay.net> <1109348730.10989.33.camel@opus.phy.duke.edu> <1109349041.26364.190.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1109355427.10989.39.camel@opus.phy.duke.edu> <20050225190829.GG1048932@hiwaay.net> <1109358912.23111.1.camel@cutter> <1109360807.26364.217.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1109361494.23111.18.camel@cutter> <1109399987.27384.33.camel@cutter> <1109536319.22789.21.camel@bree.local.net> <42239279.90505@snowmoon.com> <1109692384.4740.2.camel@nexus.verbum.private> Message-ID: On Mar 1, 2005, Colin Walters wrote: > On Mon, 2005-02-28 at 23:15 -0300, Alexandre Oliva wrote: >> On Feb 28, 2005, Eric Warnke wrote: >> >>> 2) Do what I do. Kickstart %post section that installs a rpm with >>> updates fot yum repos as well as new ones. I import all the necessary >>> keys and do a "yum -y update" and then "yum -y install >>> packagename". >> >> Yeah, I had something like that at some point. selinux attributes are >> somewhat messed up when you do this. At least they still are for the >> configuration stuff I run in %post, that among other things runs >> texhash, and tex config files get incorrectly-labeled. > Can you elaborate a bit? Is this really just doing: > yum install blah Nope, it's not actually doing any of that. What it's doing now is running a script that contains: grep ['^portuges[ ]'] \ /usr/share/texmf/tex/generic/config/language.dat > /dev/null || VISUAL="emacs -batch -nw -l `pwd`/latex-hyphen.el" \ texconfig hyphen latex egrep \ ['^@ [a-zA-Z0-9][a-zA-Z0-9]* [0-9][0-9.]*(in|mm) [0-9][0-9.]*(in|mm)$'] \ /usr/share/texmf/dvips/config/config.ps | sed 1q | grep letter > /dev/null || texconfig dvips paper letter grep '^o$' /usr/share/texmf/dvips/config/config.ps > /dev/null || texconfig dvips printcmd - latex-hyphen.el follows: (progn (find-file (car command-line-args-left)) (replace-regexp "^%!* *portuges" "portuges") (save-buffer 0) (save-buffers-kill-emacs)) After running the above during %post, most of the tex config files will have incorrect labels, that a post-reboot fixfiles run will fix. I also run stuff such as: gpg --import $keyfile gpg --import `/usr/sbin/up2date --gpg-flags` $keyfile rpm --import $keyfile in %post, for a number of ${keyfile}s, and, in a fresh install, the newly-created files /root/.gnupg will be mislabeled too. -- Alexandre Oliva http://www.ic.unicamp.br/~oliva/ Red Hat Compiler Engineer aoliva@{redhat.com, gcc.gnu.org} Free Software Evangelist oliva@{lsd.ic.unicamp.br, gnu.org} From mattdm at mattdm.org Tue Mar 1 21:39:22 2005 From: mattdm at mattdm.org (Matthew Miller) Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 16:39:22 -0500 Subject: reducing distribution CD count In-Reply-To: <1109707923.31304.47.camel@cutter> References: <200502240906.20729.czar@czarc.net> <20050224175035.22391185@python2> <20050301134557.GA7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> <1109691377.13489.17.camel@localhost.localdomain> <20050301153822.GA7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> <1109691917.23615.88.camel@cutter> <4224A761.4070605@ccs.neu.edu> <1109707923.31304.47.camel@cutter> Message-ID: <20050301213922.GA31808@jadzia.bu.edu> On Tue, Mar 01, 2005 at 03:12:03PM -0500, seth vidal wrote: > Yes, much more like powertools. Not at all like contrib. And if it I'm hoping "significantly better maintained than powertools", especially near the end there. As per (Fedora Core -- see my earlier post) non-objective #3. -- Matthew Miller mattdm at mattdm.org Boston University Linux ------> From davej at redhat.com Tue Mar 1 21:49:49 2005 From: davej at redhat.com (Dave Jones) Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 16:49:49 -0500 Subject: Hacking modversions In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20050301214949.GJ10277@redhat.com> On Tue, Mar 01, 2005 at 06:43:58PM +0000, Mike Hearn wrote: > It doesn't, and that's the end of the story. This is a "please do not > prevent self-compiled modules from loading unless there is a real need" > email, which I haven't seen brought up before (you have my apologies if it > was) and should not have much impact outside a bit more work for Dave > Jones I guess ;) Congratulations. You win todays understatement of the day award. You have no idea how maddening doing this is for RHEL. If I had to do it for Fedora too, I think I'd be institutionalised by now. To do this properly is an incredible amount of work. It's one of the reasons that our enterprise kernels stick at one version for their lifetimes, as to bend every change to fit the abi of your release kernel is just so time-consuming (and sometimes its just not possible to fix some stuff without breaking ABI). > Is this possible to do? It would require a careful analysis of the changes > being made to the kernel in online updates, but hopefully this already > happens anyway :) The actual build system modifications should not be too > tricky, I hope ... For Fedora, I can't see this happening tbh. For RHEL we get to be really picky about which upstream cset's we pull in. Conservatism is the name of the game there. Fedora users tend to want the latest and greatest bits and pieces, and pulling in individual csets is just going to be too much overhead given each point release upstream is currently churning out around 4000 csets. To maintain any kind of illusion of the kabi you propose, you'd need to do this to throw out the bits that break kabi so drastically. It's counter-intuitive to the Fedora goal of staying as close to upstream as possible, given that upstream doesn't give two hoots about maintaining any kind of ABI compatibility between releases. Dave From aoliva at redhat.com Tue Mar 1 21:53:45 2005 From: aoliva at redhat.com (Alexandre Oliva) Date: 01 Mar 2005 18:53:45 -0300 Subject: reducing distribution CD count In-Reply-To: <1109686052.23615.53.camel@cutter> References: <200503011358.j21Dw2st000363@leto.astradyne.corp> <1109686052.23615.53.camel@cutter> Message-ID: On Mar 1, 2005, seth vidal wrote: > 1. so a user can report a bug (presumably by bugzilla, on the internet) > but can't download bzflag or tuxracer? How is that unavailable? How about: internet access only from work, monitored downloads, no CD burning permitted, small amount of web browsing tolerated? -- Alexandre Oliva http://www.ic.unicamp.br/~oliva/ Red Hat Compiler Engineer aoliva@{redhat.com, gcc.gnu.org} Free Software Evangelist oliva@{lsd.ic.unicamp.br, gnu.org} From kyrre at solution-forge.net Tue Mar 1 21:56:07 2005 From: kyrre at solution-forge.net (Kyrre Ness Sjobak) Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 22:56:07 +0100 Subject: Hacking modversions In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1109714167.3439.3.camel@localhost.localdomain> tir, 01.03.2005 kl. 19.43 skrev Mike Hearn: > Hello, > > I'd like to propose that kernel updates release via fedora-updates use the > same modversions.h as the last one if there were no interface > changes. I know that may be a controversial proposal, but read on. > > For security fixes, it's rare (but not impossible) that a kernel interface > changes. In this case it would be possible to use the same symbol mangling > and therefore not prevent user-compiled modules from loading, and it would > be safe. > > For the other updates released, more care would have to be taken > to notice if there were changes or not - if there was any doubt about > binary compatibility, then modversions would still change, but if there > was simply eg, a driver bugfix then it would not be changed. > > This solves the following problem: > > Bill sets up a Linux system for Sally. She does a "yum upgrade" because > she knows it's important to stay up to date to be secure. The kernel is > changed, and as a result various things break even though the update was > fixing a race condition in a syscall implementation. She does not > know how to fix it. > > This is not a "please can the kernel have a stable ABI" email. > > It doesn't, and that's the end of the story. This is a "please do not > prevent self-compiled modules from loading unless there is a real need" > email, which I haven't seen brought up before (you have my apologies if it > was) and should not have much impact outside a bit more work for Dave > Jones I guess ;) > > Is this possible to do? It would require a careful analysis of the changes > being made to the kernel in online updates, but hopefully this already > happens anyway :) The actual build system modifications should not be too > tricky, I hope ... > > thanks -mike It *could* be great - exept, it trashes expectations (not correct word, i know...). A user can today know "if i update my kernel i must *always* recompile external modules". If this happens, it is "if i install a new kernel, i *might* have to recompile my module, and only way (wihout being a kernel guru) to know is to reboot and see what happens...". Kyrre From skvidal at phy.duke.edu Tue Mar 1 22:01:37 2005 From: skvidal at phy.duke.edu (seth vidal) Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 17:01:37 -0500 Subject: reducing distribution CD count In-Reply-To: References: <200503011358.j21Dw2st000363@leto.astradyne.corp> <1109686052.23615.53.camel@cutter> Message-ID: <1109714497.31304.74.camel@cutter> On Tue, 2005-03-01 at 18:53 -0300, Alexandre Oliva wrote: >On Mar 1, 2005, seth vidal wrote: > >> 1. so a user can report a bug (presumably by bugzilla, on the internet) >> but can't download bzflag or tuxracer? How is that unavailable? > >How about: internet access only from work, monitored downloads, no CD >burning permitted, small amount of web browsing tolerated? so how did the user get fedora to begin with!? -sv From jspaleta at gmail.com Tue Mar 1 21:58:01 2005 From: jspaleta at gmail.com (Jeff Spaleta) Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 16:58:01 -0500 Subject: reducing distribution CD count In-Reply-To: References: <200503011358.j21Dw2st000363@leto.astradyne.corp> <1109686052.23615.53.camel@cutter> Message-ID: <604aa7910503011358404ec6b3@mail.gmail.com> On 01 Mar 2005 18:53:45 -0300, Alexandre Oliva wrote: > How about: internet access only from work, monitored downloads, no CD > burning permitted, small amount of web browsing tolerated? How does that system get any update packages at all? -jef From fedora-devel at camperquake.de Tue Mar 1 21:58:14 2005 From: fedora-devel at camperquake.de (Ralf Ertzinger) Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 22:58:14 +0100 Subject: reducing distribution CD count In-Reply-To: References: <200503011358.j21Dw2st000363@leto.astradyne.corp> <1109686052.23615.53.camel@cutter> Message-ID: <20050301225814.1a3c251e@nausicaa.camperquake.de> Hi. Alexandre Oliva wrote: > How about: internet access only from work, monitored downloads, no CD > burning permitted, small amount of web browsing tolerated? Given the recent developments on this list these people are simply not the target group of Fedora. Pity for them. -- You may be an engineer if... ...you are currently gathering the components to build your own nuclear reactor. From skvidal at phy.duke.edu Tue Mar 1 22:05:04 2005 From: skvidal at phy.duke.edu (seth vidal) Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 17:05:04 -0500 Subject: reducing distribution CD count In-Reply-To: <20050301225814.1a3c251e@nausicaa.camperquake.de> References: <200503011358.j21Dw2st000363@leto.astradyne.corp> <1109686052.23615.53.camel@cutter> <20050301225814.1a3c251e@nausicaa.camperquake.de> Message-ID: <1109714704.31304.77.camel@cutter> On Tue, 2005-03-01 at 22:58 +0100, Ralf Ertzinger wrote: >Hi. > >Alexandre Oliva wrote: > >> How about: internet access only from work, monitored downloads, no CD >> burning permitted, small amount of web browsing tolerated? > >Given the recent developments on this list these people are simply not >the target group of Fedora. Pity for them. > actually, no, in that situation the user is just going to have to ask wherever he/she got the fedora core cds from to burn them an iso of some pkgs from extras. -sv From kyrre at solution-forge.net Tue Mar 1 22:01:10 2005 From: kyrre at solution-forge.net (Kyrre Ness Sjobak) Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 23:01:10 +0100 Subject: gpdf vs evince In-Reply-To: <1109680359.16580.2.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <200503011224.j21CODBP032208@leto.astradyne.corp> <1109680359.16580.2.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <1109714469.3439.6.camel@localhost.localdomain> tir, 01.03.2005 kl. 13.32 skrev Marco Pesenti Gritti: > On Tue, 2005-03-01 at 12:24 +0000, Tet wrote: > > Ivan Gyurdiev writes: > > > > >Hi, I noticed gv, ggv, and gpdf were removed from FC3 in favor of > > >evince. I had never used evince before, so I had no opinion. > > > > I found myself in the same position, so I thought I'd give evince > > a go. The only problem is, there is no easy way of trying it out. > > "A "yum search evince" comes back empty, for example. Since evince > > doesn't even appear to be in FC3, isn't it a bit premature to be > > talking about it replacing other (working, available) apps? I guess > > I could probably get it from Rawhide, but should that really be > > necessary? > > Unfortunately evince depend on gtk 2.6, so providing FC3 packages is not > possible. > > Marco Its possible... Just install gtk 2.6 from rawhide. I installed gtk 1.6 that way and evince through the evince repo (haven't happened much there lately) - and i must say that evince is something like the best pdf/ps viewer for Linux i know ! Great work! From kyrre at solution-forge.net Tue Mar 1 22:02:02 2005 From: kyrre at solution-forge.net (Kyrre Ness Sjobak) Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 23:02:02 +0100 Subject: gpdf vs evince In-Reply-To: <20050301141659.91409.qmail@web8503.mail.in.yahoo.com> References: <20050301141659.91409.qmail@web8503.mail.in.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1109714522.3439.8.camel@localhost.localdomain> ggv doesn't support mulitple printers... tir, 01.03.2005 kl. 15.16 skrev Rahul Sundaram: > --- Ivan Gyurdiev wrote: > > > > > >> That's fine. But I'd say it makes deprecating > > other > > >> apps in favour > > >> of evince premature for FC4. > > >> > > > > > >>From my experience using rawhide so far, evince is > > >good enough for regular use. > > > > Sure, let's completely ignore the issue which I just > > pointed out three > > emails above - that should make it go away. > > you do realise that development on evince hasnt > stopped and its current state in rawhide maybe > completely different from what would ship in fc4. so > you can file bug reports now and see if they are being > actively fixed. if not feel free to complain > > its not like ggv which was the default before was a > very good app and you can always install it with yum > if you have problems using evince. > > ===== > Regards > Rahul Sundaram > > > > __________________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > Yahoo! Sports - Sign up for Fantasy Baseball. > http://baseball.fantasysports.yahoo.com/ From rjune at bravegnuworld.com Tue Mar 1 22:07:14 2005 From: rjune at bravegnuworld.com (Richard June) Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 17:07:14 -0500 Subject: reducing distribution CD count In-Reply-To: <20050301152757.GX7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> References: <200502240906.20729.czar@czarc.net> <422482A1.7030505@carwyn.com> <20050301152757.GX7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> Message-ID: <200503011707.19920.rjune@bravegnuworld.com> > We have internal priorities but they are based on common sense things you'd > expect. If I have a "fix right now" IDE corruption problem and a bzflag bug > then the bzflag bug will not be the priority bug. Not that bzflag has bugs No, BZFlag has features, some of the new ones are better graphics and wings. Any chance bzflag2 will get built for fc3? -- Public Key available Here: http://www.bravegnuworld.com/~rjune/pubkey.asc -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: not available URL: From thias at spam.spam.spam.spam.spam.spam.spam.egg.and.spam.freshrpms.net Tue Mar 1 22:13:55 2005 From: thias at spam.spam.spam.spam.spam.spam.spam.egg.and.spam.freshrpms.net (Matthias Saou) Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 23:13:55 +0100 Subject: reducing distribution CD count In-Reply-To: <200503011707.19920.rjune@bravegnuworld.com> References: <200502240906.20729.czar@czarc.net> <422482A1.7030505@carwyn.com> <20050301152757.GX7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> <200503011707.19920.rjune@bravegnuworld.com> Message-ID: <20050301231355.0ed6511c@python2> Richard June wrote : > > We have internal priorities but they are based on common sense things you'd > > expect. If I have a "fix right now" IDE corruption problem and a bzflag bug > > then the bzflag bug will not be the priority bug. Not that bzflag has bugs > > No, BZFlag has features, some of the new ones are better graphics and wings. > Any chance bzflag2 will get built for fc3? Well, you can get it from here if you want : http://heidelberg.freshrpms.net/ Matthias -- Clean custom Red Hat Linux rpm packages : http://freshrpms.net/ Fedora Core release 3 (Heidelberg) - Linux kernel 2.6.10-1.766_FC3.radeon Load : 0.94 0.67 0.56 From rjune at bravegnuworld.com Tue Mar 1 22:21:26 2005 From: rjune at bravegnuworld.com (Richard June) Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 17:21:26 -0500 Subject: reducing distribution CD count In-Reply-To: <20050301231355.0ed6511c@python2> References: <200502240906.20729.czar@czarc.net> <200503011707.19920.rjune@bravegnuworld.com> <20050301231355.0ed6511c@python2> Message-ID: <200503011721.32752.rjune@bravegnuworld.com> On Tuesday 01 March 2005 17:13, Matthias Saou wrote: > Richard June wrote : > > > We have internal priorities but they are based on common sense things > > you'd > > > > expect. If I have a "fix right now" IDE corruption problem and a bzflag > > bug > > > > then the bzflag bug will not be the priority bug. Not that bzflag has > > bugs > > > No, BZFlag has features, some of the new ones are better graphics and > > wings. > > > Any chance bzflag2 will get built for fc3? > > Well, you can get it from here if you want : > http://heidelberg.freshrpms.net/ I rebuilt the package myself, I was curious to see if it would become an fc3 update -- Public Key available Here: http://www.bravegnuworld.com/~rjune/pubkey.asc -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: not available URL: From perbj at stanford.edu Tue Mar 1 22:25:50 2005 From: perbj at stanford.edu (Per Bjornsson) Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 14:25:50 -0800 Subject: debug about NetworkManager & resolv.conf being erased In-Reply-To: <1109340911.22812.2.camel@dcbw.boston.redhat.com> References: <421EEFFE.30003@univ-nantes.fr> <1109340911.22812.2.camel@dcbw.boston.redhat.com> Message-ID: <1109715950.10016.14.camel@localhost.localdomain> Hi Dan, On Fri, 2005-02-25 at 09:15 -0500, Dan Williams wrote: > I removed that "feature" quite a few weeks ago because it caused too > many problems, like this one. Current CVS and the builds in rawhide > shouldn't have this problem, but FC3 builds have lagged behind a bit. > > What version of NetworkManager are you running? Is this the one from > fc3-updates or fc3-updates-testing? I'd like to test out a new version of NetworkManager, it seems like the recent updates might solve som rather random issues that I have had recently (at least I'd like to test something fresh instead of filing inconclusive bug reports against an old version - I have nothing really reproducible, just that it randomly takes a long time to connect to some access points etc). Of course I could rebuild it myself but from this it sounds like you meant to push a new package into updates-testing - is that the case? I can't see anything there I'm afraid. Rebuild problem, or did some button somewhere just not get pushed? By the way, my current version is NetworkManager-0.3.3-1.cvs20050119.2.fc3, which as far as I can tell is the newest in FC3 updates-released. Thanks, Per -- Per Bjornsson Ph.D. Candidate, Department of Applied Physics, Stanford University From jspaleta at gmail.com Tue Mar 1 22:26:03 2005 From: jspaleta at gmail.com (Jeff Spaleta) Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 17:26:03 -0500 Subject: I want more CDs in the distribution In-Reply-To: References: <55668b8c050228120473a73b01@mail.gmail.com> <42237B18.3000803@snowmoon.com> <64134.192.54.193.137.1109668449.squirrel@rousalka.dyndns.org> Message-ID: <604aa7910503011426319bd8ae@mail.gmail.com> On Tue, 01 Mar 2005 15:06:01 -0500, Gerald Henriksen wrote: > Given that the process of moving packages out of Core and into Extras > has already started it seems to me to be a bad move to release a > version of Fedora that can't deal with this fact. Packages leave Core with every release. Packages left rhl with every release. The fact that packages now have some place to go with they leave is actually progress. Fedora Extras will be enabled by default in yum and up2date... this is progress.. compared to having to configure 3rd party repos that hold any missing packages that are dropped. > > These aren't packages that are obsolete or that people aren't using > anymore, but packages that for whatever reason no longer fit the > requirements to be in Core. Let's talk about the reason for a second.... java is FRELLING HUGE! If java had been ready for inclusion for rhl8 or rhl9 or any previus FC release.. the decision to include it would still have meant packages would be dropped. There is no getting around that.. just be glad there is an Extras for packages to go to... an Extras that will be enabled by default in the post-install package management tools included in the distro. Having Extras available at post-install time is progress...incremental progress. In a world without perfect solutions, incremental progress is the best you can expect. Java gets included.. the cd count doesn't go up for x86, people get access to Extras post-install....all for the price of not having some packages available at install time. Considering that extras or anything like it as NEVER been available by default at install time or post-install.. and that java has NEVER been available by default at install or post-install time....this is progress. No one has ever made promises that progress is linear or clean... 2 steps forward and 1 step back...its a cha-cha.. a bloody bare-knuckles knockdown dragout cha-cha... stiletto heels optional. You either agree that java is worth including and getting out to people in the scheduled fc4 time frame or you don't. I for one think the long term benefits of including an actual honest to god open source implementation of java and getting it into wide circulation via fc4 far outweighs whatever short term cost one incurs by making space for it now through careful pruning of duplicate or extraneous packages. Putting those packages into Extras is a remarkable bonus. The timing of things could very well have been worse, java could have been ready to roll as part of Core for fc2 or fc3 and extras could have slipped back again. But if Extras wasn't here right now.. I doubt this decision would have gone differently. The birth of open source java was foretold in ages past..or at least by the fact that some prep work went into fc2 and fc3, that was sort of a big hint that java was on the horizon for inclusion. Hopefully some of the issues surrounding Extras for dialup users and non-networked users can be clearup by making sure vendors such as cheapbytes or community lugs can spin up isos from extras with as little hassle as possible to be used post-install. > If Red Hat and the people in charge of Fedora want people to view > Extras as a postive change ... I'm not sure what to really say about this. People who expect perfection at every step in a long multifacetted process are setting themselves up for continual disappointment. The existance of Extras is absolutely a positive change... but integrating fully with the evolving development process of Core is not going to happen overnight... its not going to happen in one release cycle. -jef From abo at kth.se Tue Mar 1 22:39:15 2005 From: abo at kth.se (Alexander =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Bostr=F6m?=) Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 23:39:15 +0100 Subject: rawhide report: 20050301 changes In-Reply-To: <200503011908.j21J8lsr013948@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> References: <200503011908.j21J8lsr013948@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> Message-ID: <1109716755.19111.11.camel@tudor.e.kth.se> > openssl-0.9.7e-2 No change regarding https://bugzilla.redhat.com/135961 . Pretty please could someone look in to this? :) The bug is that /lib/libcrypto.so.0.9.7e links to the krb5 libs because of a broken patch. Only libssl should link to krb5. /abo From fherrera at onirica.com Tue Mar 1 22:56:52 2005 From: fherrera at onirica.com (Fernando Herrera) Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 23:56:52 +0100 Subject: Hacking modversions In-Reply-To: <1109709742.15242.8.camel@baythorne.infradead.org> References: <1109709742.15242.8.camel@baythorne.infradead.org> Message-ID: <1109717812.15915.9.camel@dyckola> El mar, 01-03-2005 a las 20:42 +0000, David Woodhouse escribi?: > On Tue, 2005-03-01 at 18:43 +0000, Mike Hearn wrote: > > This solves the following problem: > > > > Bill sets up a Linux system for Sally. She does a "yum upgrade" because > > she knows it's important to stay up to date to be secure. The kernel is > > changed, and as a result various things break even though the update was > > fixing a race condition in a syscall implementation. She does not > > know how to fix it. > > Bill was wrong here to leave Sally with a Linux system which relies on > stuff which is not in the standard kernel. If she's going to use binary- > only crap he might as well have installed Windows for her. Then, if we cannot stop breaking this modules we should think about creating a little graphical tool for compiling/recompiling external kernel modules (maybe a magic app and ugly application finding makefiles, or some special file, dunno). But if Sally bought a webcam that is not supported by the standard kernel, should we say to her "Don't use linux, use Windows"? Salu2 From david at fubar.dk Tue Mar 1 23:10:03 2005 From: david at fubar.dk (David Zeuthen) Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 18:10:03 -0500 Subject: Hacking modversions In-Reply-To: <1109717812.15915.9.camel@dyckola> References: <1109709742.15242.8.camel@baythorne.infradead.org> <1109717812.15915.9.camel@dyckola> Message-ID: <1109718603.14010.23.camel@daxter.boston.redhat.com> On Tue, 2005-03-01 at 23:56 +0100, Fernando Herrera wrote: > Then, if we cannot stop breaking this modules we should think about >creating a little graphical tool for compiling/recompiling external >kernel modules (maybe a magic app and ugly application finding >makefiles, or some special file, dunno). Users can't, won't and shouldn't have to understand things like this. >But if Sally bought a webcam >that is not supported by the standard kernel, should we say to her >"Don't use linux, use Windows"? > Can someone explain to me why this is not a package management problem? Suppose some user is running kernel-2.6.10-1.1154_FC4 and types 'yum install kernel-module-foobar'. User gets this module from a 3rd party repo (cause otherwise it would just be in the kernel) with the following version kernel-module-foobar 2.6.10-1.1154_FC4-module_foobar_version_042 (meaning version 042 of foobar built against 2.6.10-1.1154_FC4) and it says Requires: kernel = 2.6.10-1.1154_FC4 Conflicts: kernel > 2.6.10-1.1154_FC4 Now, next time user types 'yum update', suddenly kernel-2.6.10-1.1155_FC4 is available. However, kernel-module-foobar is not updated yet so the update transaction fail (ok, maybe it's something other than Conflicts, expert packagers would know). Now, two hours later the 3rd party repo providing kernel-module-foobar has (automatically) respun the build of kernel-module-foobar and now provides kernel-module-foobar-2.6.10-1.1155_FC4-module_foobar_version_042 with Requires: kernel = 2.6.10-1.1155_FC4 Conflicts: kernel > 2.6.10-1.1155_FC4 and this makes the transaction succeed. The big part is of course getting the 3rd party repo to provide the automatic rebuilding of kernel-module-foobar which may require tweaking it to the upstream kernel interfaces. This may take time though since it leaves users depending on not-in-mainstream modules in a vulnerable state. However, I suppose time is best spent on automating tasks exactly like that instead of discussing pipe dreams about a stable kABI. At least for the short term. David From jspaleta at gmail.com Tue Mar 1 23:11:07 2005 From: jspaleta at gmail.com (Jeff Spaleta) Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 18:11:07 -0500 Subject: Hacking modversions In-Reply-To: <1109717812.15915.9.camel@dyckola> References: <1109709742.15242.8.camel@baythorne.infradead.org> <1109717812.15915.9.camel@dyckola> Message-ID: <604aa79105030115117b9cd629@mail.gmail.com> On Tue, 01 Mar 2005 23:56:52 +0100, Fernando Herrera wrote: > But if Sally bought a webcam > that is not supported by the standard kernel, should we say to her > "Don't use linux, use Windows"? Use what works best for you. Is that such a hard guideline? If sally finds relying on bill's experience works best.. then sally should rely on bill's experience. If sally wants to do things for herself and finds that works best then she should do that. If sally finds that using specific model of webcam is supremely important to the exclusion of other factors and can not rely on bill's experience to keep it working in linux, she should do exactly what it takes to best fit her needs even if its using windows. Though someone perhaps might decide to befriend sally and buy her a webcam that works under linux without the need for binary kernel modules... its a crazy crazy hypothetical world afterall. There really is no point in debating in this list, the pros and cons of upstream kernel development's insistence on having the flexibility of an undefined internal abi. The fact that there is no stable abi is a 'feature' of upstream kernel development.. a delibrate design choice. Fighting that fact means consuming substantial developer time that could be better spent working on bugs. -jef From fherrera at onirica.com Tue Mar 1 23:36:02 2005 From: fherrera at onirica.com (Fernando Herrera) Date: Wed, 02 Mar 2005 00:36:02 +0100 Subject: Hacking modversions In-Reply-To: <1109718603.14010.23.camel@daxter.boston.redhat.com> References: <1109709742.15242.8.camel@baythorne.infradead.org> <1109717812.15915.9.camel@dyckola> <1109718603.14010.23.camel@daxter.boston.redhat.com> Message-ID: <1109720162.15915.18.camel@dyckola> El mar, 01-03-2005 a las 18:10 -0500, David Zeuthen escribi?: > On Tue, 2005-03-01 at 23:56 +0100, Fernando Herrera wrote: > > Then, if we cannot stop breaking this modules we should think about > >creating a little graphical tool for compiling/recompiling external > >kernel modules (maybe a magic app and ugly application finding > >makefiles, or some special file, dunno). > > Users can't, won't and shouldn't have to understand things like this. Agree. I was thinking in some autopackage module/tool or so, just automagically invoked after the kernel update and saying ("we are updating your system: WebCam XXY driver....[===== ]") > >But if Sally bought a webcam > >that is not supported by the standard kernel, should we say to her > >"Don't use linux, use Windows"? > > > > Can someone explain to me why this is not a package management problem? a) 3rd party Open Source kernel module maintainers cannot manage so many packages for so many distributions. b) That woudn't be inmediate. If Sally up2date magics update her kernel and she has to wait 4 days to get his webcam back working is a bad user experience. Salu2 From rodd at clarkson.id.au Tue Mar 1 23:57:32 2005 From: rodd at clarkson.id.au (Rodd Clarkson) Date: Wed, 02 Mar 2005 10:57:32 +1100 Subject: Intel Pro Wireless cards In-Reply-To: <1109620703.571.1.camel@dcbw.boston.redhat.com> References: <4223505B.20402@snowmoon.com> <604aa79105022809535577c11c@mail.gmail.com> <42237603.6040000@snowmoon.com> <1109620703.571.1.camel@dcbw.boston.redhat.com> Message-ID: <1109721453.3724.6.camel@trevally.redfishdemo.com> On Mon, 2005-02-28 at 14:58 -0500, Dan Williams wrote: >> The bluez-bluefw module ships with a GLP license even though the >> firmware that is included appears ( as in I'm email broadcom right now ) >> to be free as in beer not free as in speech. Without the source code >> it's only Free and not FOSS. >> >> If they can ship free-redistibutution firmware for the broadcom why not >> intel's free-redistribution license? > >That would appear to be an oversight. File a bug against the package. Which is the oversight. That the bluez-bluefw module is shipped, or that the intel centrino stuff isn't? Rodd From mike at navi.cx Wed Mar 2 00:11:21 2005 From: mike at navi.cx (Mike Hearn) Date: Wed, 02 Mar 2005 00:11:21 +0000 Subject: Hacking modversions References: <1109703367.6293.145.camel@laptopd505.fenrus.org> <1109708026.6293.159.camel@laptopd505.fenrus.org> Message-ID: On Tue, 01 Mar 2005 21:13:46 +0100, Arjan van de Ven wrote: > only if it's defined. the linux kernel internals aren't. I'm using ABI to mean things that a recompile would fix. So I think that is well defined (struct size changes, #define constant changes etc). > that by far isn't enough to describe the ABI. You also have to include > things like locking order, locking rules and every other kind of > behavior as well. > Simple example: a function that suddenly no longer accepts NULL as a > safe parameter but oopses. Ok artiticial, but not that much (esp if it > was never supposed to be called with NULL) and it's REALLY hard to catch > such ABI changes. That's not (IMHO) an ABI change, that's a semantic change that recompiling a module wouldn't fix anyway. So it's out of scope of what I was proposing. >> It should be possible >> to look at a bugfix and say "Yep that doesn't change the ABI". > > you would be surprised how incredibly hard that is. Red Hat tries it > really hard for RHEL, and even there we accidentally break the ABI like > every other update release in practice, despite trying REALLY hard. I'm thinking for things like, "XYZ doesn't validate parameters" or "race condition in function ABC". For more extensive changes yes, I know it's hard. > It simply isn't as simple as it sounds. Most security fixes nowadays are > either very local, or cross multiple functions, probably in a 50% ratio > each. The moment you cross a function barrier you've lost in the "easy > ABI" game and it gets REALLY tricky. And even for local fixes it's not > always so easy... take the NULL pointer example. I think we're using different terminology - I'd refer to breaking changes in the behaviour of a function not as ABI but as semantics. ABI would be about linkage, and so on. thanks -mike From dag at wieers.com Wed Mar 2 00:05:42 2005 From: dag at wieers.com (Dag Wieers) Date: Wed, 2 Mar 2005 01:05:42 +0100 (CET) Subject: I want more CDs in the distribution In-Reply-To: <604aa7910503011426319bd8ae@mail.gmail.com> References: <55668b8c050228120473a73b01@mail.gmail.com> <42237B18.3000803@snowmoon.com> <64134.192.54.193.137.1109668449.squirrel@rousalka.dyndns.org> <604aa7910503011426319bd8ae@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On Tue, 1 Mar 2005, Jeff Spaleta wrote: > On Tue, 01 Mar 2005 15:06:01 -0500, Gerald Henriksen > wrote: > > > Given that the process of moving packages out of Core and into Extras > > has already started it seems to me to be a bad move to release a > > version of Fedora that can't deal with this fact. > > Packages leave Core with every release. Packages left rhl with every release. > The fact that packages now have some place to go with they leave is > actually progress. The move of a large set of packages from Fedora Core to Fedora Extras is in no way comparable to the few packages that in the past became unmaintained and obsoleted. I would even dare to say that in the past we've always had progress. And I'm sure even Fedora Extras will have unmaintained and obsoleted packages. Your point being ? -- dag wieers, dag at wieers.com, http://dag.wieers.com/ -- [all I want is a warm bed and a kind word and unlimited power] From dwmw2 at infradead.org Wed Mar 2 00:06:05 2005 From: dwmw2 at infradead.org (David Woodhouse) Date: Wed, 02 Mar 2005 00:06:05 +0000 Subject: Intel Pro Wireless cards In-Reply-To: <1109721453.3724.6.camel@trevally.redfishdemo.com> References: <4223505B.20402@snowmoon.com> <604aa79105022809535577c11c@mail.gmail.com> <42237603.6040000@snowmoon.com> <1109620703.571.1.camel@dcbw.boston.redhat.com> <1109721453.3724.6.camel@trevally.redfishdemo.com> Message-ID: <1109721965.28414.21.camel@baythorne.infradead.org> On Wed, 2005-03-02 at 10:57 +1100, Rodd Clarkson wrote: > Which is the oversight. That the bluez-bluefw module is shipped, or > that the intel centrino stuff isn't? Probably the former. -- dwmw2 From mike at navi.cx Wed Mar 2 00:16:14 2005 From: mike at navi.cx (Mike Hearn) Date: Wed, 02 Mar 2005 00:16:14 +0000 Subject: Hacking modversions References: <20050301214949.GJ10277@redhat.com> Message-ID: On Tue, 01 Mar 2005 16:49:49 -0500, Dave Jones wrote: > Congratulations. You win todays understatement of the day award. > You have no idea how maddening doing this is for RHEL. > If I had to do it for Fedora too, I think I'd be institutionalised by now. > > To do this properly is an incredible amount of work. It's one of the reasons > that our enterprise kernels stick at one version for their lifetimes, > as to bend every change to fit the abi of your release kernel is just > so time-consuming (and sometimes its just not possible to fix some stuff > without breaking ABI). Well, I didn't say "Fedora should ship a stable kernel interface". I said, changes which do not require a recompile should not force one to occur. That's very different. To use Arjans example, I don't care about functions no longer accepting NULL pointers or whatever, because that isn't something a recompile would fix. I also don't care (for this proposal) if the ABI *does* change. What I was talking about is when I need to recompile a module, but there's not really any reason for it. It's just modversions being modversions. > For Fedora, I can't see this happening tbh. For RHEL we get to be > really picky about which upstream cset's we pull in. Conservatism is the > name of the game there. Fedora users tend to want the latest and > greatest bits and pieces, and pulling in individual csets is just going > to be too much overhead given each point release upstream is currently > churning out around 4000 csets. To maintain any kind of illusion of the > kabi you propose, you'd need to do this to throw out the bits that break > kabi so drastically. I'm not suggesting throwing bits out, rather: - Being more conservative about what changes are pushed into fedora-updates, and just putting them off for FC4. In particular I was kind of surprised to see such huge changes in security patches! - Using that conservatism to say "This security/driver fix clearly does not break something that a recompile would fix, so _this time_ let's not force a module rebuild". That's quite different to actually maintaining a stable kernel ABI, which isn't what I was asking for. Yes, that means that some new features may not get in until the next Fedora release. So be it. Online updates should be about bugfixes and security patches IMHO, not about adding or removing features once the OS is deployed. thanks -mike From dag at wieers.com Wed Mar 2 00:18:30 2005 From: dag at wieers.com (Dag Wieers) Date: Wed, 2 Mar 2005 01:18:30 +0100 (CET) Subject: Hacking modversions In-Reply-To: <1109720162.15915.18.camel@dyckola> References: <1109709742.15242.8.camel@baythorne.infradead.org> <1109717812.15915.9.camel@dyckola> <1109718603.14010.23.camel@daxter.boston.redhat.com> <1109720162.15915.18.camel@dyckola> Message-ID: On Wed, 2 Mar 2005, Fernando Herrera wrote: > El mar, 01-03-2005 a las 18:10 -0500, David Zeuthen escribi?: > > On Tue, 2005-03-01 at 23:56 +0100, Fernando Herrera wrote: > > > >But if Sally bought a webcam > > >that is not supported by the standard kernel, should we say to her > > >"Don't use linux, use Windows"? > > > > > > > Can someone explain to me why this is not a package management problem? > > a) 3rd party Open Source kernel module maintainers cannot manage so many > packages for so many distributions. Actually, that is not so big a problem, building kernel modules is not a CPU intensive task. The biggest problem is that building kernel modules for 2.6 actually become harder (because of internal changes), instead of easier since 2.4. That's why I postponed all kernel-module development for now. > b) That woudn't be inmediate. If Sally up2date magics update her kernel > and she has to wait 4 days to get his webcam back working is a bad user > experience. 4 days would certainly be a bit exagerated and frankly, I don't think Sally would mind if the kernel was held back until the camera module becomes available. It would be nice though if the package manager could indicate how long a certain update has been held back, so a user could make an opiniated decision to stay with the current kernel, or go without webcam driver. What's the alternative anyway if you're stuck with unusual hardware that do have external drivers ? -- dag wieers, dag at wieers.com, http://dag.wieers.com/ -- [all I want is a warm bed and a kind word and unlimited power] From david at fubar.dk Wed Mar 2 00:24:21 2005 From: david at fubar.dk (David Zeuthen) Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 19:24:21 -0500 Subject: Hacking modversions In-Reply-To: <1109720162.15915.18.camel@dyckola> References: <1109709742.15242.8.camel@baythorne.infradead.org> <1109717812.15915.9.camel@dyckola> <1109718603.14010.23.camel@daxter.boston.redhat.com> <1109720162.15915.18.camel@dyckola> Message-ID: <1109723061.3434.9.camel@daxter.boston.redhat.com> On Wed, 2005-03-02 at 00:36 +0100, Fernando Herrera wrote: >> Users can't, won't and shouldn't have to understand things like this. > > Agree. I was thinking in some autopackage module/tool or so, just >automagically invoked after the kernel update and saying ("we are >updating your system: WebCam XXY driver....[===== ]") Right, but I'm not really sure we want to require a C compiler and -devel packages on Sally's system. In fact, I'm quite sure we won't want that. Leave that to 3rd party repos. >> >But if Sally bought a webcam >> >that is not supported by the standard kernel, should we say to her >> >"Don't use linux, use Windows"? >> > >> >> Can someone explain to me why this is not a package management problem? > >a) 3rd party Open Source kernel module maintainers cannot manage so many >packages for so many distributions. Hence why it needs to be sort of automated. Another thought is that IHV's themselves can maintain such repositories (you may argue NVidia is doing just that) before their kernel hits the mainline and/or vendor kernels since it can take a long long time even for open source drivers from vendors to get into mainline. But I hear what you are saying. >b) That woudn't be inmediate. If Sally up2date magics update her kernel >and she has to wait 4 days to get his webcam back working is a bad user >experience. > No, she would wait four days for the kernel upgrade. Though this is pretty bad if it's a security update. People can blame on a) kernel guys not willing/able to maintain kABI; and b) users not using open source drivers in mainline/vendor kernels. An interesting data point is that update kernels in Fedora normally goes to -updates-testing for quite a few days before they are pushed out. This leaves a window for 3rd party repositories to catch up. (and now I will get flamed for even suggesting to put usability before security. Oh well.) David From dag at wieers.com Wed Mar 2 00:24:58 2005 From: dag at wieers.com (Dag Wieers) Date: Wed, 2 Mar 2005 01:24:58 +0100 (CET) Subject: reducing distribution CD count In-Reply-To: <4224E051.39E412B0@jwz.org> References: <200502240906.20729.czar@czarc.net> <20050224175035.22391185@python2> <20050301134557.GA7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> <4224E051.39E412B0@jwz.org> Message-ID: On Tue, 1 Mar 2005, Jamie Zawinski wrote: > Also, more people run screen savers than tuxracer, so that's where the > video driver crashes tend to occur. Then they blame me and I am sad. Hehe, I've had several people complain about 'random' crashes, usually when they arrived at work in the morning or came back from coffee. All of them related to 3D screensavers :) Maybe disabling 3D screensavers by default (and/or a warning about the potential to crash when people open the screensaver configuration) would reduce the uncomfortable (unstable) feeling people got when using Linux in these cases. -- dag wieers, dag at wieers.com, http://dag.wieers.com/ -- [all I want is a warm bed and a kind word and unlimited power] From dag at wieers.com Wed Mar 2 00:34:56 2005 From: dag at wieers.com (Dag Wieers) Date: Wed, 2 Mar 2005 01:34:56 +0100 (CET) Subject: reducing distribution CD count In-Reply-To: <20050301205954.28ff24e0@nausicaa.camperquake.de> References: <200502240906.20729.czar@czarc.net> <20050224175035.22391185@python2> <20050301134658.GB7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> <1109685440.23615.42.camel@cutter> <42247474.7080606@carwyn.com> <20050301151924.GT7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> <1109690766.23615.72.camel@cutter> <20050301153309.GY7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> <20050301205954.28ff24e0@nausicaa.camperquake.de> Message-ID: On Tue, 1 Mar 2005, Ralf Ertzinger wrote: > Alan Cox wrote: > > > Actually reading the material about this again it may be a good reason > > for keeping bzflag in extras. > > Well, SuSE ships bzflag, also, and I do not remember seeing a sticker (since > SuSE ships actual boxes contrary to Fedora) claiming that the product is > unsuitable for persons aged below 18 (which would be the case if the game > is not rated, which it obviously is not). Maybe a chat with the SuSE peole > would clear that one up. Resulting in Novell removing it from their distribution too ? :) j/k -- dag wieers, dag at wieers.com, http://dag.wieers.com/ -- [all I want is a warm bed and a kind word and unlimited power] From rodd at clarkson.id.au Wed Mar 2 00:41:46 2005 From: rodd at clarkson.id.au (Rodd Clarkson) Date: Wed, 02 Mar 2005 11:41:46 +1100 Subject: Intel Pro Wireless cards In-Reply-To: <1109612007.14468.7.camel@dcbw.boston.redhat.com> References: <4223505B.20402@snowmoon.com> <1109612007.14468.7.camel@dcbw.boston.redhat.com> Message-ID: <1109724106.3724.19.camel@trevally.redfishdemo.com> >The actual _driver_ has been included in Core kernels for some time >already. Having just purchased a laptop with PRO/Wireless 8915 chipset I'm understandably keen to see it supported out of the box in Fedora. I'm content to download the firmware as a separate package as it isn't FOSS and I think Intel could do better here. Are you listening Intel? I'm thrilled to see that both the drivers for the ipw2100 and the ipw2200 included in the kernel. BUT... (come on you knew it was coming ;-]) ... it seems the the ipw2200 driver in the kernel is 0.13 (based on a less of /lib/modules/2.6.10-1.1155_FC4/kernel/drivers/net/wireless/ipw2200/ipw2200.ko, and then looking through the strings and seeing this: <6>ipw2200: Intel(R) PRO/Wireless 2200/2915 Network Driver, 0.13 that the current version used it 0.13. Given that the current version is 1.0.1 and that there's been about 8 or nine releases since 0.13, what needs to be done to get a more up-to-date version included in the kernel? Rodd From davej at redhat.com Wed Mar 2 00:51:07 2005 From: davej at redhat.com (Dave Jones) Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 19:51:07 -0500 Subject: Hacking modversions In-Reply-To: References: <20050301214949.GJ10277@redhat.com> Message-ID: <20050302005107.GB27369@redhat.com> On Wed, Mar 02, 2005 at 12:16:14AM +0000, Mike Hearn wrote: > - Being more conservative about what changes are pushed into > fedora-updates, and just putting them off for FC4. In particular I was > kind of surprised to see such huge changes in security patches! http://fedora.redhat.com/about/objectives.html "#3. Do as much of the development work as possible directly in the upstream packages. This includes updates; our default policy will be to upgrade to new versions for security as well as for bugfix and new feature update releases of packages." backporting fixes to older releases is a real killer. Especially when you consider that you're taking code from one release that has had no testing at all with another. (Quite nasty if for eg a security hole in the VM is found, and there's been significant change between $oldrelease and current). Every time a fix gets backported, you're also introducing the possibility of getting something wrong due to some other unrelated change. I've seen this happen to multiple vendors, and no amount of review catches such gotchas. > Yes, that means that some new features may not get in until the next > Fedora release. So be it. The rebasing to new releases isn't about adding the new features. It's done to lower maintainence overhead. Supporting 3 releases at the same time becomes a lot easier when 2 of them share the same kernel (and one is only a point release away). > Online updates should be about bugfixes and > security patches IMHO, not about adding or removing features once the OS > is deployed. If something got removed without a viable alternative, then that's a regression that should be reported. Examples ? Dave From fenn at stanford.edu Wed Mar 2 00:59:20 2005 From: fenn at stanford.edu (Tim Fenn) Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 16:59:20 -0800 Subject: Intel Pro Wireless cards In-Reply-To: <1109724106.3724.19.camel@trevally.redfishdemo.com> References: <4223505B.20402@snowmoon.com> <1109612007.14468.7.camel@dcbw.boston.redhat.com> <1109724106.3724.19.camel@trevally.redfishdemo.com> Message-ID: <20050302005919.GF2421@stanford.edu> On Wed, Mar 02, 2005 at 11:41:46AM +1100, Rodd Clarkson wrote: > > ... it seems the the ipw2200 driver in the kernel is 0.13 (based on a > less of > /lib/modules/2.6.10-1.1155_FC4/kernel/drivers/net/wireless/ipw2200/ipw2200.ko, > > and then looking through the strings and seeing this: > > <6>ipw2200: Intel(R) PRO/Wireless 2200/2915 Network Driver, 0.13 > > that the current version used it 0.13. Given that the current version > is 1.0.1 and that there's been about 8 or nine releases since 0.13, what > needs to be done to get a more up-to-date version included in the > kernel? > go to your nearest neigborhood friendly apt/yum repositories! http://atrpms.net/dist/fc3/ipw2100/ http://atrpms.net/dist/fc3/ipw2100-testing/ http://atrpms.net/dist/fc3/ipw2200/ http://atrpms.net/dist/fc3/ipw2200-testing/ so, e.g.: apt-get install ipw2200-kmdl-$(uname -r) firmware will get lumped in as well. HTH, Tim From davej at redhat.com Wed Mar 2 01:17:23 2005 From: davej at redhat.com (Dave Jones) Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 20:17:23 -0500 Subject: reducing distribution CD count In-Reply-To: <4224E051.39E412B0@jwz.org> References: <200502240906.20729.czar@czarc.net> <20050224175035.22391185@python2> <20050301134557.GA7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> <4224E051.39E412B0@jwz.org> Message-ID: <20050302011722.GD27369@redhat.com> On Tue, Mar 01, 2005 at 01:36:17PM -0800, Jamie Zawinski wrote: > > And to debug 3D. We no longer have any way to debug 3D problems on Fedora > > with packages we know the client side of and build form. > > In my experience, xscreensaver is going to give the 3d hardware a much > more extensive workout than any given game. Maybe this has changed in > the latest Rawhide (I haven't checked) but it used to be that a Gnome > install came with the full complement of 3D savers. > > Also, more people run screen savers than tuxracer, so that's where the > video driver crashes tend to occur. Then they blame me and I am sad. Don't feel sad, read DRI source code, and shift the blame accordingly :-) On a serious note, in my experience 3d screensaver crashes have been driver problems _every_ time I've looked into them, whether its been DRI, or binary drivers. Dave From davej at redhat.com Wed Mar 2 01:18:42 2005 From: davej at redhat.com (Dave Jones) Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 20:18:42 -0500 Subject: reducing distribution CD count In-Reply-To: References: <200502240906.20729.czar@czarc.net> <20050224175035.22391185@python2> <20050301134557.GA7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> <4224E051.39E412B0@jwz.org> Message-ID: <20050302011842.GE27369@redhat.com> On Wed, Mar 02, 2005 at 01:24:58AM +0100, Dag Wieers wrote: > On Tue, 1 Mar 2005, Jamie Zawinski wrote: > > > Also, more people run screen savers than tuxracer, so that's where the > > video driver crashes tend to occur. Then they blame me and I am sad. > > Hehe, I've had several people complain about 'random' crashes, usually > when they arrived at work in the morning or came back from coffee. All of > them related to 3D screensavers :) > > Maybe disabling 3D screensavers by default (and/or a warning about the > potential to crash when people open the screensaver configuration) would > reduce the uncomfortable (unstable) feeling people got when using Linux in > these cases. Or how about just fixing the drivers so they don't lock up ? (reports to upstream DRI bugzilla at freedesktop.org, or $binary_driver_vendor_of_choice accordingly) Dave From dag at wieers.com Wed Mar 2 01:45:22 2005 From: dag at wieers.com (Dag Wieers) Date: Wed, 2 Mar 2005 02:45:22 +0100 (CET) Subject: reducing distribution CD count In-Reply-To: <20050302011842.GE27369@redhat.com> References: <200502240906.20729.czar@czarc.net> <20050224175035.22391185@python2> <20050301134557.GA7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> <4224E051.39E412B0@jwz.org> <20050302011842.GE27369@redhat.com> Message-ID: On Tue, 1 Mar 2005, Dave Jones wrote: > On Wed, Mar 02, 2005 at 01:24:58AM +0100, Dag Wieers wrote: > > On Tue, 1 Mar 2005, Jamie Zawinski wrote: > > > > > Also, more people run screen savers than tuxracer, so that's where the > > > video driver crashes tend to occur. Then they blame me and I am sad. > > > > Hehe, I've had several people complain about 'random' crashes, usually > > when they arrived at work in the morning or came back from coffee. All of > > them related to 3D screensavers :) > > > > Maybe disabling 3D screensavers by default (and/or a warning about the > > potential to crash when people open the screensaver configuration) would > > reduce the uncomfortable (unstable) feeling people got when using Linux in > > these cases. > > Or how about just fixing the drivers so they don't lock up ? People first have to know why it crashes before they know where to report it. The anecdotes I gave was to indicate that people usually don't know why it crashed and in return have a general feeling of unstability. I would like to make sure that 1) these people don't have an uncomfortable feeling and 2) understand that enabling 3D has a potential to crash a system, so people might realise why it happens and where to report it. -- dag wieers, dag at wieers.com, http://dag.wieers.com/ -- [all I want is a warm bed and a kind word and unlimited power] From davej at redhat.com Wed Mar 2 01:47:00 2005 From: davej at redhat.com (Dave Jones) Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 20:47:00 -0500 Subject: reducing distribution CD count In-Reply-To: References: <200502240906.20729.czar@czarc.net> <20050224175035.22391185@python2> <20050301134557.GA7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> <4224E051.39E412B0@jwz.org> <20050302011842.GE27369@redhat.com> Message-ID: <20050302014700.GH27369@redhat.com> On Wed, Mar 02, 2005 at 02:45:22AM +0100, Dag Wieers wrote: > On Tue, 1 Mar 2005, Dave Jones wrote: > > > On Wed, Mar 02, 2005 at 01:24:58AM +0100, Dag Wieers wrote: > > > On Tue, 1 Mar 2005, Jamie Zawinski wrote: > > > > > > > Also, more people run screen savers than tuxracer, so that's where the > > > > video driver crashes tend to occur. Then they blame me and I am sad. > > > > > > Hehe, I've had several people complain about 'random' crashes, usually > > > when they arrived at work in the morning or came back from coffee. All of > > > them related to 3D screensavers :) > > > > > > Maybe disabling 3D screensavers by default (and/or a warning about the > > > potential to crash when people open the screensaver configuration) would > > > reduce the uncomfortable (unstable) feeling people got when using Linux in > > > these cases. > > > > Or how about just fixing the drivers so they don't lock up ? > > People first have to know why it crashes before they know where to report > it. The anecdotes I gave was to indicate that people usually don't know > why it crashed and in return have a general feeling of unstability. > > I would like to make sure that 1) these people don't have an uncomfortable > feeling and 2) understand that enabling 3D has a potential to crash a > system, so people might realise why it happens and where to report it. The problem is a "turning on this feature may crash you computer" dialog is enough to scare away a majority of users. Lowering the amount of testing something gets lowers the possibility of it ever getting reported, and subsequently fixed. Dave From dag at wieers.com Wed Mar 2 02:05:04 2005 From: dag at wieers.com (Dag Wieers) Date: Wed, 2 Mar 2005 03:05:04 +0100 (CET) Subject: reducing distribution CD count In-Reply-To: <20050302014700.GH27369@redhat.com> References: <200502240906.20729.czar@czarc.net> <20050224175035.22391185@python2> <20050301134557.GA7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> <4224E051.39E412B0@jwz.org> <20050302011842.GE27369@redhat.com> <20050302014700.GH27369@redhat.com> Message-ID: On Tue, 1 Mar 2005, Dave Jones wrote: > On Wed, Mar 02, 2005 at 02:45:22AM +0100, Dag Wieers wrote: > > On Tue, 1 Mar 2005, Dave Jones wrote: > > > > > On Wed, Mar 02, 2005 at 01:24:58AM +0100, Dag Wieers wrote: > > > > On Tue, 1 Mar 2005, Jamie Zawinski wrote: > > > > > > > > > Also, more people run screen savers than tuxracer, so that's where the > > > > > video driver crashes tend to occur. Then they blame me and I am sad. > > > > > > > > Hehe, I've had several people complain about 'random' crashes, usually > > > > when they arrived at work in the morning or came back from coffee. All of > > > > them related to 3D screensavers :) > > > > > > > > Maybe disabling 3D screensavers by default (and/or a warning about the > > > > potential to crash when people open the screensaver configuration) would > > > > reduce the uncomfortable (unstable) feeling people got when using Linux in > > > > these cases. > > > > > > Or how about just fixing the drivers so they don't lock up ? > > > > People first have to know why it crashes before they know where to report > > it. The anecdotes I gave was to indicate that people usually don't know > > why it crashed and in return have a general feeling of unstability. > > > > I would like to make sure that 1) these people don't have an uncomfortable > > feeling and 2) understand that enabling 3D has a potential to crash a > > system, so people might realise why it happens and where to report it. > > The problem is a "turning on this feature may crash you computer" dialog is enough > to scare away a majority of users. Lowering the amount of testing something > gets lowers the possibility of it ever getting reported, and subsequently fixed. I agree, though it probably depends on the exact wordings, it could be prefixed with: "Don't panic", in large friendly letters. :) -- dag wieers, dag at wieers.com, http://dag.wieers.com/ -- [all I want is a warm bed and a kind word and unlimited power] From byte at aeon.com.my Tue Mar 1 23:21:40 2005 From: byte at aeon.com.my (Colin Charles) Date: Wed, 02 Mar 2005 07:21:40 +0800 Subject: Entering the DVD age... In-Reply-To: <1109687819.2532.44.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <55668b8c050228120473a73b01@mail.gmail.com> <42237A7C.1000309@atl.lmco.com> <754f42e7050228121916f277ba@mail.gmail.com> <422394FC.8040002@margo.bijoux.nom.br> <7E8BD023E1D0BED2FFF63B5C@[10.169.6.246]> <4223EE18.1090204@margo.bijoux.nom.br> <70E46988EEFD9C37A77A1AE6@[10.0.0.14]> <49688.67.138.149.162.1109685975.squirrel@67.138.149.162> <1109687819.2532.44.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <1109719300.5676.500.camel@arena.soho.bytebot.net> On Tue, 2005-03-01 at 09:37 -0500, John (J5) Palmieri wrote: > > My AMD64 has an optical drive that reads and writes every CD and > DVD > > format (other than double-sided) that cost about $100; in the long > > term, the majority of users are going to enjoy that convenience. > > We have DVD iso's. We handed them out at Linux world so this is > already > solved. "How did you fit Fedora onto one CD?!?" ;-) (you'd have to had been at LWE or gotten one of the DVDs) -- Colin Charles, byte at aeon.com.my http://www.bytebot.net/ "First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win." -- Mohandas Gandhi From rodd at clarkson.id.au Wed Mar 2 02:29:42 2005 From: rodd at clarkson.id.au (Rodd Clarkson) Date: Wed, 02 Mar 2005 13:29:42 +1100 Subject: Intel Pro Wireless cards In-Reply-To: <20050302005919.GF2421@stanford.edu> References: <4223505B.20402@snowmoon.com> <1109612007.14468.7.camel@dcbw.boston.redhat.com> <1109724106.3724.19.camel@trevally.redfishdemo.com> <20050302005919.GF2421@stanford.edu> Message-ID: <1109730582.3599.4.camel@trevally.redfishdemo.com> On Tue, 2005-03-01 at 16:59 -0800, Tim Fenn wrote: >On Wed, Mar 02, 2005 at 11:41:46AM +1100, Rodd Clarkson wrote: >> >> ... it seems the the ipw2200 driver in the kernel is 0.13 (based on a >> less of >> /lib/modules/2.6.10-1.1155_FC4/kernel/drivers/net/wireless/ipw2200/ipw2200.ko, >> >> and then looking through the strings and seeing this: >> >> <6>ipw2200: Intel(R) PRO/Wireless 2200/2915 Network Driver, 0.13 >> >> that the current version used it 0.13. Given that the current version >> is 1.0.1 and that there's been about 8 or nine releases since 0.13, what >> needs to be done to get a more up-to-date version included in the >> kernel? >> > >go to your nearest neigborhood friendly apt/yum repositories! > >http://atrpms.net/dist/fc3/ipw2100/ >http://atrpms.net/dist/fc3/ipw2100-testing/ >http://atrpms.net/dist/fc3/ipw2200/ >http://atrpms.net/dist/fc3/ipw2200-testing/ > Useful to know, but it still leaves the question open, why are the current FC kernels (I'm using the rawhide kernels so the files above aren't a lot of use) sporting such an old driver for ipw2200, and what do I need to do to encourage the kernel maintainers for FC to update the driver? Rodd From davej at redhat.com Wed Mar 2 02:31:40 2005 From: davej at redhat.com (Dave Jones) Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 21:31:40 -0500 Subject: Intel Pro Wireless cards In-Reply-To: <1109730582.3599.4.camel@trevally.redfishdemo.com> References: <4223505B.20402@snowmoon.com> <1109612007.14468.7.camel@dcbw.boston.redhat.com> <1109724106.3724.19.camel@trevally.redfishdemo.com> <20050302005919.GF2421@stanford.edu> <1109730582.3599.4.camel@trevally.redfishdemo.com> Message-ID: <20050302023140.GA7955@redhat.com> On Wed, Mar 02, 2005 at 01:29:42PM +1100, Rodd Clarkson wrote: > On Tue, 2005-03-01 at 16:59 -0800, Tim Fenn wrote: > >On Wed, Mar 02, 2005 at 11:41:46AM +1100, Rodd Clarkson wrote: > >> > >> ... it seems the the ipw2200 driver in the kernel is 0.13 (based on a > >> less of > >> /lib/modules/2.6.10-1.1155_FC4/kernel/drivers/net/wireless/ipw2200/ipw2200.ko, > >> > >> and then looking through the strings and seeing this: > >> > >> <6>ipw2200: Intel(R) PRO/Wireless 2200/2915 Network Driver, 0.13 > >> > >> that the current version used it 0.13. Given that the current version > >> is 1.0.1 and that there's been about 8 or nine releases since 0.13, what > >> needs to be done to get a more up-to-date version included in the > >> kernel? > >> > > > >go to your nearest neigborhood friendly apt/yum repositories! > > > >http://atrpms.net/dist/fc3/ipw2100/ > >http://atrpms.net/dist/fc3/ipw2100-testing/ > >http://atrpms.net/dist/fc3/ipw2200/ > >http://atrpms.net/dist/fc3/ipw2200-testing/ > > > Useful to know, but it still leaves the question open, why are the > current FC kernels (I'm using the rawhide kernels so the files above > aren't a lot of use) sporting such an old driver for ipw2200, and what > do I need to do to encourage the kernel maintainers for FC to update the > driver? it's been on my todo list for a while. I'll get to it this week. rawhide will get it in the next day or two hopefully. fc2/fc3 will probably be in the update after next. Dave From rodd at clarkson.id.au Wed Mar 2 02:42:00 2005 From: rodd at clarkson.id.au (Rodd Clarkson) Date: Wed, 02 Mar 2005 13:42:00 +1100 Subject: gpdf vs evince In-Reply-To: <200503011224.j21CODBP032208@leto.astradyne.corp> References: <200503011224.j21CODBP032208@leto.astradyne.corp> Message-ID: <1109731321.3599.10.camel@trevally.redfishdemo.com> On Tue, 2005-03-01 at 12:24 +0000, Tet wrote: >Ivan Gyurdiev writes: > >>Hi, I noticed gv, ggv, and gpdf were removed from FC3 in favor of >>evince. I had never used evince before, so I had no opinion. > >I'm all for progress, but I'd rather see at least some overlap between >a proposed new app, and the older apps it's intended to replace, >if for no other reason that giving users a chance to have a side >by side comaprison. Isn't this supposed to be a meritocracy? Let >the best app win? Replacing working and used code with an untried >and untested app seems a little rash... Sure, I'm all for comparison, but I'm pretty confident that the word 'working' doesn't go very well with gpdf. As for ggv, it's a dog for viewing PDF's and as such, I'm not sure that 'working' is a word that goes with it either. As someone who has struggled through the PDF handling attempts made over the years in Redhat and Fedora (and usually solved them by switching back to xpdf) I'm thrilled about how well evince works, and the speed with which issue are being fixed in it. If only every other open source project had the same sort of vitality and enthusiasm. I know it might be frustrating seeing packages you know (and goodness knows, might even love) being removed from the next version, but I say good riddance and welcome to evince. Rodd From rodd at clarkson.id.au Wed Mar 2 02:45:14 2005 From: rodd at clarkson.id.au (Rodd Clarkson) Date: Wed, 02 Mar 2005 13:45:14 +1100 Subject: Intel Pro Wireless cards In-Reply-To: <20050302023140.GA7955@redhat.com> References: <4223505B.20402@snowmoon.com> <1109612007.14468.7.camel@dcbw.boston.redhat.com> <1109724106.3724.19.camel@trevally.redfishdemo.com> <20050302005919.GF2421@stanford.edu> <1109730582.3599.4.camel@trevally.redfishdemo.com> <20050302023140.GA7955@redhat.com> Message-ID: <1109731514.3599.12.camel@trevally.redfishdemo.com> On Tue, 2005-03-01 at 21:31 -0500, Dave Jones wrote: >On Wed, Mar 02, 2005 at 01:29:42PM +1100, Rodd Clarkson wrote: > > On Tue, 2005-03-01 at 16:59 -0800, Tim Fenn wrote: > > >On Wed, Mar 02, 2005 at 11:41:46AM +1100, Rodd Clarkson wrote: > > >> > > >> ... it seems the the ipw2200 driver in the kernel is 0.13 (based on a > > >> less of > > >> /lib/modules/2.6.10-1.1155_FC4/kernel/drivers/net/wireless/ipw2200/ipw2200.ko, > > >> > > >> and then looking through the strings and seeing this: > > >> > > >> <6>ipw2200: Intel(R) PRO/Wireless 2200/2915 Network Driver, 0.13 > > >> > > >> that the current version used it 0.13. Given that the current version > > >> is 1.0.1 and that there's been about 8 or nine releases since 0.13, what > > >> needs to be done to get a more up-to-date version included in the > > >> kernel? > > >> > > > > > >go to your nearest neigborhood friendly apt/yum repositories! > > > > > >http://atrpms.net/dist/fc3/ipw2100/ > > >http://atrpms.net/dist/fc3/ipw2100-testing/ > > >http://atrpms.net/dist/fc3/ipw2200/ > > >http://atrpms.net/dist/fc3/ipw2200-testing/ > > > > > Useful to know, but it still leaves the question open, why are the > > current FC kernels (I'm using the rawhide kernels so the files above > > aren't a lot of use) sporting such an old driver for ipw2200, and what > > do I need to do to encourage the kernel maintainers for FC to update the > > driver? > >it's been on my todo list for a while. I'll get to it this week. >rawhide will get it in the next day or two hopefully. >fc2/fc3 will probably be in the update after next. Dave, Thanks for your quick reply letting me know where things stand. Much appreciated 8-] Rodd From mattdm at mattdm.org Wed Mar 2 02:54:06 2005 From: mattdm at mattdm.org (Matthew Miller) Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 21:54:06 -0500 Subject: reducing distribution CD count In-Reply-To: References: <200502240906.20729.czar@czarc.net> <20050224175035.22391185@python2> <20050301134557.GA7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> <4224E051.39E412B0@jwz.org> <20050302011842.GE27369@redhat.com> <20050302014700.GH27369@redhat.com> Message-ID: <20050302025406.GA9722@jadzia.bu.edu> On Wed, Mar 02, 2005 at 03:05:04AM +0100, Dag Wieers wrote: > I agree, though it probably depends on the exact wordings, it could be > prefixed with: "Don't panic", in large friendly letters. :) Maybe all of the 3D drivers could flash "BUGGY 3D DRIVERS CAN CRASH YOUR SYSTEM" every 30th frame. Then, there'd be a 1/30th chance that when the system crashes, that's stuck displayed in the screen. -- Matthew Miller mattdm at mattdm.org Boston University Linux ------> From crisppyf at gmail.com Wed Mar 2 06:53:43 2005 From: crisppyf at gmail.com (crisppy fernandes) Date: Wed, 2 Mar 2005 12:23:43 +0530 Subject: Spamassassin 3.0.2 autolearn=ham/spam/no Message-ID: I have a problem related to spamassassin-3.0.2 which i have packged for my use. I have installed all rpms of spam-3.0.2 on my FC2 box. and then i have sent spam mail message to check whether its working properly or not on my box. Its able to grab the spam and giving header info as spam i.e. X-spam-status: yes etc but in its header information its giving """ autolearn=ham """ which should not be the case when its spam. rather it should be autolearn=spam. so can anybody of you help me in identifying where is the things wrong , i have not packged properly or i need to change something in some configuration file. -- Crisppy Fernandes From iago.rubio at hispalinux.es Wed Mar 2 08:15:41 2005 From: iago.rubio at hispalinux.es (Iago Rubio) Date: Wed, 02 Mar 2005 09:15:41 +0100 Subject: Spamassassin 3.0.2 autolearn=ham/spam/no In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1109751341.5385.32.camel@speedy.iagorubio.net> On Wed, 2005-03-02 at 07:53, crisppy fernandes wrote: > I have a problem related to spamassassin-3.0.2 which i have packged for my use. > I have installed all rpms of spam-3.0.2 on my FC2 box. and then i have > sent spam mail message to check whether its working properly or not on > my box. Its able to grab the spam and giving header info as spam i.e. > X-spam-status: yes etc > but in its header information its giving """ autolearn=ham """ which > should not be the case when its spam. rather it should be > autolearn=spam. > so can anybody of you help me in identifying where is the things wrong > , i have not packged properly or i need to change something in some > configuration file. Not sure if it's the place to ask it .... What's happening is your bayesian rules are recognizing this message as ham. You should feed some spam messages for the bayesian rules to work. Nothing related with packaging, Try to save the message and run "sa-learn --spam message" , so the bayesian rules can take some data about what spam is. Before some time feeding sa-learn, it should start working. But again, it seems it's not the place to ask it. -- Iago Rubio From thias at spam.spam.spam.spam.spam.spam.spam.egg.and.spam.freshrpms.net Wed Mar 2 08:21:56 2005 From: thias at spam.spam.spam.spam.spam.spam.spam.egg.and.spam.freshrpms.net (Matthias Saou) Date: Wed, 2 Mar 2005 09:21:56 +0100 Subject: reducing distribution CD count In-Reply-To: <200503011721.32752.rjune@bravegnuworld.com> References: <200502240906.20729.czar@czarc.net> <200503011707.19920.rjune@bravegnuworld.com> <20050301231355.0ed6511c@python2> <200503011721.32752.rjune@bravegnuworld.com> Message-ID: <20050302092156.400e6445@python2> Richard June wrote : > > > Any chance bzflag2 will get built for fc3? > > > > Well, you can get it from here if you want : > > http://heidelberg.freshrpms.net/ > > I rebuilt the package myself, I was curious to see if it would become an fc3 > update I really doubt it, as BZFlag 2 network play isn't compatible with BZFlag 1. Matthias -- Clean custom Red Hat Linux rpm packages : http://freshrpms.net/ Fedora Core release 3 (Heidelberg) - Linux kernel 2.6.10-1.766_FC3.radeon Load : 1.15 0.91 1.07 From skvidal at phy.duke.edu Wed Mar 2 08:29:19 2005 From: skvidal at phy.duke.edu (seth vidal) Date: Wed, 02 Mar 2005 03:29:19 -0500 Subject: reducing distribution CD count In-Reply-To: <20050302092156.400e6445@python2> References: <200502240906.20729.czar@czarc.net> <200503011707.19920.rjune@bravegnuworld.com> <20050301231355.0ed6511c@python2> <200503011721.32752.rjune@bravegnuworld.com> <20050302092156.400e6445@python2> Message-ID: <1109752160.5543.101.camel@cutter> >I really doubt it, as BZFlag 2 network play isn't compatible with BZFlag 1. and backward compat in games is an absolute must!!! :-D -sv From mpeters at mac.com Wed Mar 2 08:42:34 2005 From: mpeters at mac.com (Michael A. Peters) Date: Wed, 02 Mar 2005 08:42:34 +0000 Subject: Hacking modversions In-Reply-To: (from mike@navi.cx on Tue Mar 1 10:43:58 2005) References: Message-ID: <1109752954l.2425l.1l@devel.mpeters.us> On 03/01/2005 10:43:58 AM, Mike Hearn wrote: > > This solves the following problem: > > Bill sets up a Linux system for Sally. She does a "yum upgrade" > because > she knows it's important to stay up to date to be secure. The kernel > is > changed, and as a result various things break even though the update > was > fixing a race condition in a syscall implementation. She does not > know how to fix it. There's a better solution. It involves having a compiler on the system. kernel modules that are not part of the kernel proper should have their source in somewhere, like /usr/src/bizarro/modules (or whatever ;) A text file - /etc/bizarro.txt contains the names of these modules. An init script tests for the existince of the modules in the running kernel module tree. If any are not found, it links the module for the running kernel and put it where it goes. In this way - when you update the kernel, your madwifi (or whatever) driver gets updated for the new running kernel the first time you boot into the new kernel. I've seen this done before - I think with a mpeg2 decoder card - and it actually works, most of the time. When it doesn't work, it's because the kernel changed in such a way that the module broke - and nothing other than update from the module vendor will fix that. -- Michael A. Peters http://mpeters.us/ From naoki at valuecommerce.com Wed Mar 2 08:59:24 2005 From: naoki at valuecommerce.com (Naoki) Date: Wed, 02 Mar 2005 17:59:24 +0900 Subject: rhythmbox segfault (at libgstreamer) Message-ID: <1109753964.19811.3.camel@dragon.sys.intra> Hi all, rhythmbox segs on all MP3s with the backtrace pointing at gstreamer being the culprit. (gdb) bt #0 0x07571354 in ?? () from /usr/lib/libgstreamer-0.8.so.1 #1 0x074a8870 in gst_type_find_get_length () from /usr/lib/libgstreamer-0.8.so.1 #2 0x0053963a in ?? () from /usr/lib/gstreamer-0.8/libgsttypefindfunctions.so #3 0xb7307bd0 in ?? () #4 0xb7307ad8 in ?? () #5 0x00000000 in ?? () Is this known or something I should investigate? $ rpm -qf /usr/lib/libgstreamer-0.8.so.1 gstreamer-0.8.8-2 $ rpm -qf /usr/lib/gstreamer-0.8/libgsttypefindfunctions.so gstreamer-plugins-0.8.7-3 $ rpm -q rhythmbox rhythmbox-0.8.8-1 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From dawid_gajownik at o2.pl Wed Mar 2 09:32:09 2005 From: dawid_gajownik at o2.pl (Dawid Gajownik) Date: Wed, 02 Mar 2005 10:32:09 +0100 Subject: rawhide report: 20050301 changes In-Reply-To: <200503011908.j21J8lsr013948@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> References: <200503011908.j21J8lsr013948@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> Message-ID: <42258819.5090209@o2.pl> Hi! > kdelibs-6:3.4.0-0.rc1.2 > ----------------------- > * Tue Mar 01 2005 Than Ngo 6:3.4.0-0.rc1.2 > - rebuilt against gcc-4 > > * Sat Feb 26 2005 Than Ngo 6:3.4.0-0.rc1.1 > - bump release > > * Fri Feb 25 2005 Than Ngo 6:3.4.0-0.rc1.0 > - KDE 3.4.0 rc1 Do you plan reenabling "-fvisibility=hidden -fvisibility-inlines-hidden" options? Right now they are disabled [1] or am I wrong? [1] http://cvs.fedora.redhat.com/viewcvs/devel/kdelibs/admin-visibility.patch -- ^_* From crisppyf at gmail.com Wed Mar 2 10:04:07 2005 From: crisppyf at gmail.com (crisppy fernandes) Date: Wed, 2 Mar 2005 15:34:07 +0530 Subject: Spamassassin 3.0.2 autolearn=ham/spam/no In-Reply-To: <1109751341.5385.32.camel@speedy.iagorubio.net> References: <1109751341.5385.32.camel@speedy.iagorubio.net> Message-ID: thanks for reply. please point me to the right place if you know. On Wed, 02 Mar 2005 09:15:41 +0100, Iago Rubio wrote: > On Wed, 2005-03-02 at 07:53, crisppy fernandes wrote: > > I have a problem related to spamassassin-3.0.2 which i have packged for my use. > > I have installed all rpms of spam-3.0.2 on my FC2 box. and then i have > > sent spam mail message to check whether its working properly or not on > > my box. Its able to grab the spam and giving header info as spam i.e. > > X-spam-status: yes etc > > but in its header information its giving """ autolearn=ham """ which > > should not be the case when its spam. rather it should be > > autolearn=spam. > > so can anybody of you help me in identifying where is the things wrong > > , i have not packged properly or i need to change something in some > > configuration file. > > Not sure if it's the place to ask it .... > > What's happening is your bayesian rules are recognizing this message as > ham. > > You should feed some spam messages for the bayesian rules to work. > > Nothing related with packaging, > > Try to save the message and run "sa-learn --spam message" , so the > bayesian rules can take some data about what spam is. > > Before some time feeding sa-learn, it should start working. > > But again, it seems it's not the place to ask it. > -- > Iago Rubio > > -- > fedora-devel-list mailing list > fedora-devel-list at redhat.com > http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-list > -- Crisppy Fernandes From rmy at tigress.co.uk Wed Mar 2 10:04:27 2005 From: rmy at tigress.co.uk (Ron Yorston) Date: Wed, 2 Mar 2005 10:04:27 GMT Subject: reducing distribution CD count Message-ID: <200503021004.KAA24395@internal.tigress.co.uk> Seth Vidal wrote: >So, just to make sure I understand, yum doesn't work for you? > >You can't run: yum install bzflag2 tuxracer ? Good question, let's try it: $ yum install bzflag tuxracer You need to be root to perform this command. Oh dear! Fortunately I have root on this machine: $ su Password: # yum install bzflag tuxracer Setting up Install Process Setting up Repo: base ftp://janus/fc3/base/repodata/repomd.xml: [Errno 4] IOError: Trying other mirror. Cannot open/read repomd.xml file for repository: base failure: repodata/repomd.xml from base: [Errno 256] No more mirrors to try. # Oh dear! I'm not on a network. Seth Vidal also wrote: >On Tue, 2005-03-01 at 18:53 -0300, Alexandre Oliva wrote: >>How about: internet access only from work, monitored downloads, no CD >>burning permitted, small amount of web browsing tolerated? > >so how did the user get fedora to begin with!? >From a magazine cover CD? Via snail mail from a mail order supplier? One day everyone will have gigabit wireless networking everywhere. Until that happy day some people have to use computers with poor to non-existent network connectivity. Any solution that excludes them is incomplete. Ron From nicolas.mailhot at laposte.net Wed Mar 2 10:23:51 2005 From: nicolas.mailhot at laposte.net (Nicolas Mailhot) Date: Wed, 2 Mar 2005 11:23:51 +0100 (CET) Subject: reducing distribution CD count In-Reply-To: References: <200502240906.20729.czar@czarc.net> <20050224175035.22391185@python2> <20050301134557.GA7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> <4224E051.39E412B0@jwz.org> <20050302011842.GE27369@redhat.com> Message-ID: <8277.192.54.193.28.1109759031.squirrel@rousalka.dyndns.org> On Mer 2 mars 2005 2:45, Dag Wieers a ?crit : > On Tue, 1 Mar 2005, Dave Jones wrote: > >> On Wed, Mar 02, 2005 at 01:24:58AM +0100, Dag Wieers wrote: >> > On Tue, 1 Mar 2005, Jamie Zawinski wrote: >> > >> > > Also, more people run screen savers than tuxracer, so that's where >> the >> > > video driver crashes tend to occur. Then they blame me and I am >> sad. >> > >> > Hehe, I've had several people complain about 'random' crashes, >> usually >> > when they arrived at work in the morning or came back from coffee. >> All of >> > them related to 3D screensavers :) >> > >> > Maybe disabling 3D screensavers by default (and/or a warning about >> the >> > potential to crash when people open the screensaver configuration) >> would >> > reduce the uncomfortable (unstable) feeling people got when using >> Linux in >> > these cases. >> >> Or how about just fixing the drivers so they don't lock up ? > > People first have to know why it crashes before they know where to report > it. The anecdotes I gave was to indicate that people usually don't know > why it crashed and in return have a general feeling of unstability. What would be helpful is some script that went through all the screesavers sequentially so it'd be easier to test what screensaver is failing. Pretty often when that happens to me the screen goes to sleep after a while and good luck finding what screensaver locked-up the box (yes I know I could do it manually - I just have other things to do than go through the full FC screensaver list with mouse and keyboard) Regards, -- Nicolas Mailhot From jwz at jwz.org Wed Mar 2 10:41:33 2005 From: jwz at jwz.org (Jamie Zawinski) Date: Wed, 02 Mar 2005 02:41:33 -0800 Subject: reducing distribution CD count References: <200502240906.20729.czar@czarc.net> <20050224175035.22391185@python2> <20050301134557.GA7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> <4224E051.39E412B0@jwz.org> <20050302011842.GE27369@redhat.com> <8277.192.54.193.28.1109759031.squirrel@rousalka.dyndns.org> Message-ID: <4225985D.23926B66@jwz.org> Nicolas Mailhot wrote: > > What would be helpful is some script that went through all the screesavers > sequentially so it'd be easier to test what screensaver is failing. while true; do xscreensaver-command -next; sleep 10; done > Pretty often when that happens to me the screen goes to sleep after a > while and good luck finding what screensaver locked-up the box (yes I know > I could do it manually - I just have other things to do than go through > the full FC screensaver list with mouse and keyboard) xscreensaver-command -exit xscreensaver -verbose >> LOG 2>&1 Then after you've unwedged the box, check the log. -- Jamie Zawinski jwz at jwz.org http://www.jwz.org/ jwz at dnalounge.com http://www.dnalounge.com/ http://jwz.livejournal.com/ From fedora at wir-sind-cool.org Wed Mar 2 10:58:09 2005 From: fedora at wir-sind-cool.org (Michael Schwendt) Date: Wed, 2 Mar 2005 11:58:09 +0100 Subject: rhythmbox segfault (at libgstreamer) In-Reply-To: <1109753964.19811.3.camel@dragon.sys.intra> References: <1109753964.19811.3.camel@dragon.sys.intra> Message-ID: <20050302115809.2fff8bbd.fedora@wir-sind-cool.org> On Wed, 02 Mar 2005 17:59:24 +0900, Naoki wrote: > Hi all, > > rhythmbox segs on all MP3s with the backtrace pointing at gstreamer > being the culprit. Wrong list, since Rawhide and problems with Fedora Test releases are covered on fedora-test-list. > (gdb) bt > #0 0x07571354 in ?? () from /usr/lib/libgstreamer-0.8.so.1 > #1 0x074a8870 in gst_type_find_get_length () > from /usr/lib/libgstreamer-0.8.so.1 > #2 0x0053963a in ?? () > from /usr/lib/gstreamer-0.8/libgsttypefindfunctions.so > #3 0xb7307bd0 in ?? () > #4 0xb7307ad8 in ?? () > #5 0x00000000 in ?? () > > Is this known or something I should investigate? Investigation can start at looking whether this has been reported in bugzilla before. > $ rpm -qf /usr/lib/libgstreamer-0.8.so.1 > gstreamer-0.8.8-2 > $ rpm -qf /usr/lib/gstreamer-0.8/libgsttypefindfunctions.so > gstreamer-plugins-0.8.7-3 > $ rpm -q rhythmbox > rhythmbox-0.8.8-1 FWIW, I cannot reproduce it. For every mp3 file I get a warning message that mp3 is not understood. And I haven't rebuilt gstreamer-plugins-mp3 for Rawhide yet. Did you change/rebuild anything or do you refer to stock Rawhide packages, which don't support mp3. From rbultje at ronald.bitfreak.net Wed Mar 2 11:05:22 2005 From: rbultje at ronald.bitfreak.net (Ronald S. Bultje) Date: Wed, 02 Mar 2005 12:05:22 +0100 Subject: rhythmbox segfault (at libgstreamer) In-Reply-To: <1109753964.19811.3.camel@dragon.sys.intra> References: <1109753964.19811.3.camel@dragon.sys.intra> Message-ID: <1109761521.2840.30.camel@tux.lan> On Wed, 2005-03-02 at 09:59, Naoki wrote: > #0 0x07571354 in ?? () from /usr/lib/libgstreamer-0.8.so.1 > #1 0x074a8870 in gst_type_find_get_length () from > /usr/lib/libgstreamer-0.8.so.1 Someone updated gst-plugins without updating the gst-core requirement (even though the configure check is definately there). There's an uninitialized function pointer being accessed here, fix in newer gst-core release (I can provide a custom patch for the fedora package if the maintainer prefers so). Cheers, Ronald -- Ronald S. Bultje From fedora-devel at camperquake.de Wed Mar 2 11:10:03 2005 From: fedora-devel at camperquake.de (Ralf Ertzinger) Date: Wed, 2 Mar 2005 12:10:03 +0100 Subject: reducing distribution CD count In-Reply-To: References: <200502240906.20729.czar@czarc.net> <20050224175035.22391185@python2> <20050301134658.GB7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> <1109685440.23615.42.camel@cutter> <42247474.7080606@carwyn.com> <20050301151924.GT7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> <1109690766.23615.72.camel@cutter> <20050301153309.GY7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> <20050301205954.28ff24e0@nausicaa.camperquake.de> Message-ID: <20050302121003.2338db9c@nausicaa.camperquake.de> Hi. Dag Wieers wrote: > Resulting in Novell removing it from their distribution too ? :) The regulation (which I personally consider a good thing, in contrast to the situation beforehand) covers _every_ game. Even solitaire. So as long as there is a single game in the distribution which is not covered by the USK, the distribution can not be sold to minors. In theory. This is obviously bogus, and one of the situations in which the regulation breaks. Maybe someone else realized that, too, which is the reason why SuSE is still available for everyone to buy. -- The nice thing about Windows is that it doesn't just crash, it displays a dialog box and lets you press 'OK' first. From rahulsundaram at yahoo.co.in Wed Mar 2 11:47:50 2005 From: rahulsundaram at yahoo.co.in (Rahul Sundaram) Date: Wed, 2 Mar 2005 03:47:50 -0800 (PST) Subject: reducing distribution CD count In-Reply-To: <20050301185722.36044c90.fedora@wir-sind-cool.org> Message-ID: <20050302114750.81965.qmail@web8509.mail.in.yahoo.com> Hi > > Do you know of any news sites where such rumours > have been spread? > If it's just forum members, who are not Fedora Core > users, it's not > interesting. But _news sites_...? its not reported as news that fedora extras in insecure or something stupid as that in any news site but comments in say osnews.com have had users who might be using fedora and are exhibiting doubts or others who are deliberately spreading misinformation to support some other distro. ===== Regards Rahul Sundaram __________________________________ Celebrate Yahoo!'s 10th Birthday! Yahoo! Netrospective: 100 Moments of the Web http://birthday.yahoo.com/netrospective/ From tarjei.knapstad at predichem.com Wed Mar 2 11:57:27 2005 From: tarjei.knapstad at predichem.com (Tarjei Knapstad) Date: Wed, 02 Mar 2005 12:57:27 +0100 Subject: Spamassassin 3.0.2 autolearn=ham/spam/no In-Reply-To: References: <1109751341.5385.32.camel@speedy.iagorubio.net> Message-ID: <1109764647.16445.1.camel@tarjei.predichem.nett> On Wed, 2005-03-02 at 11:04, crisppy fernandes wrote: > thanks for reply. > please point me to the right place if you know. > This is SpamAssassin specific, so try the SpamAssassin user mailinglist: http://wiki.apache.org/spamassassin/MailingLists (Failing that, you might try the Fedora users list, but it's got nothing to do with Fedora really) -- Tarjei From nicolas.mailhot at laposte.net Wed Mar 2 12:32:00 2005 From: nicolas.mailhot at laposte.net (Nicolas Mailhot) Date: Wed, 2 Mar 2005 13:32:00 +0100 (CET) Subject: rhythmbox segfault (at libgstreamer) In-Reply-To: <20050302115809.2fff8bbd.fedora@wir-sind-cool.org> References: <1109753964.19811.3.camel@dragon.sys.intra> <20050302115809.2fff8bbd.fedora@wir-sind-cool.org> Message-ID: <40408.192.54.193.28.1109766720.squirrel@rousalka.dyndns.org> On Mer 2 mars 2005 11:58, Michael Schwendt a ?crit : > On Wed, 02 Mar 2005 17:59:24 +0900, Naoki wrote: > >> Hi all, >> >> rhythmbox segs on all MP3s with the backtrace pointing at gstreamer >> being the culprit. > > Wrong list, since Rawhide and problems with Fedora Test releases are > covered on fedora-test-list. Fedora devel problems are no longer covered by the fedora-devel list ? I thought fedora-test was only there to avoid drowning fedora-devel with problem reports at test times. Regards, -- Nicolas Mailhot From nicolas.mailhot at laposte.net Wed Mar 2 12:35:22 2005 From: nicolas.mailhot at laposte.net (Nicolas Mailhot) Date: Wed, 2 Mar 2005 13:35:22 +0100 (CET) Subject: reducing distribution CD count In-Reply-To: <4225985D.23926B66@jwz.org> References: <200502240906.20729.czar@czarc.net> <20050224175035.22391185@python2> <20050301134557.GA7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> <4224E051.39E412B0@jwz.org> <20050302011842.GE27369@redhat.com> <8277.192.54.193.28.1109759031.squirrel@rousalka.dyndns.org> <4225985D.23926B66@jwz.org> Message-ID: <50534.192.54.193.28.1109766922.squirrel@rousalka.dyndns.org> On Mer 2 mars 2005 11:41, Jamie Zawinski a ?crit : > Nicolas Mailhot wrote: >> >> What would be helpful is some script that went through all the >> screesavers >> sequentially so it'd be easier to test what screensaver is failing. > > while true; do xscreensaver-command -next; sleep 10; done > >> Pretty often when that happens to me the screen goes to sleep after a >> while and good luck finding what screensaver locked-up the box (yes I >> know >> I could do it manually - I just have other things to do than go through >> the full FC screensaver list with mouse and keyboard) > > xscreensaver-command -exit > xscreensaver -verbose >> LOG 2>&1 > > Then after you've unwedged the box, check the log. Thanks! I just knew something like this must be possible. Shouldn't this be in a wiki somewhere? As other people noted, looping through the gl screensavers is a pretty effective way to test driver sanity. Regards, -- Nicolas Mailhot From jwz at jwz.org Wed Mar 2 12:47:58 2005 From: jwz at jwz.org (Jamie Zawinski) Date: Wed, 02 Mar 2005 04:47:58 -0800 Subject: reducing distribution CD count References: <200502240906.20729.czar@czarc.net> <20050224175035.22391185@python2> <20050301134557.GA7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> <4224E051.39E412B0@jwz.org> <20050302011842.GE27369@redhat.com> <8277.192.54.193.28.1109759031.squirrel@rousalka.dyndns.org> <4225985D.23926B66@jwz.org> <50534.192.54.193.28.1109766922.squirrel@rousalka.dyndns.org> Message-ID: <4225B5FE.2F37636B@jwz.org> Nicolas Mailhot wrote: > > Thanks! I just knew something like this must be possible. > Shouldn't this be in a wiki somewhere? /usr/share/doc/xscreensaver-*/README.debugging which is also http://www.jwz.org/xscreensaver/bugs.html > As other people noted, looping through the gl screensavers is a > pretty effective way to test driver sanity. You'd think this would have occured to the driver developers by now, wouldn't you? Evidence suggests not. -- Jamie Zawinski jwz at jwz.org http://www.jwz.org/ jwz at dnalounge.com http://www.dnalounge.com/ http://jwz.livejournal.com/ From alan at redhat.com Wed Mar 2 12:54:32 2005 From: alan at redhat.com (Alan Cox) Date: Wed, 2 Mar 2005 07:54:32 -0500 Subject: ITE 8212 and pwc drivers absent in Rawhide In-Reply-To: <20050301212840.GG10277@redhat.com> References: <1109319950.5110.22.camel@localhost.localdomain> <20050225082208.GA14931@redhat.com> <20050301140400.GD7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> <20050301212840.GG10277@redhat.com> Message-ID: <20050302125432.GB1849@devserv.devel.redhat.com> On Tue, Mar 01, 2005 at 04:28:40PM -0500, Dave Jones wrote: > > You can track 11rc, but the 2.6.11rc still has all the locking holes unfixed. > > I don't see a point in the development tree continuing to track .10 Of course From ralph+fedora at strg-alt-entf.org Wed Mar 2 12:55:24 2005 From: ralph+fedora at strg-alt-entf.org (Ralph Angenendt) Date: Wed, 2 Mar 2005 13:55:24 +0100 Subject: reducing distribution CD count In-Reply-To: <1109691524.23615.86.camel@cutter> References: <20050224175035.22391185@python2> <20050301134658.GB7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> <1109685440.23615.42.camel@cutter> <42247474.7080606@carwyn.com> <20050301151924.GT7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> <1109690766.23615.72.camel@cutter> <20050301153309.GY7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> <1109691524.23615.86.camel@cutter> Message-ID: <20050302125524.GB6606@br-online.de> seth vidal wrote: > On Tue, 2005-03-01 at 10:33 -0500, Alan Cox wrote: >>Because the game is not part of a basic OS product and has not been through >>video game approval. >> >>See: http://www.germanlawjournal.com/current_issue.php?id=279 > > so is germany not in the free world anymore either? I sometimes do get that feeling, yes. It's especially nice for those of us over 18 who are getting denied such things >:( Ralph -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: not available URL: From ghenriks at rogers.com Wed Mar 2 12:58:42 2005 From: ghenriks at rogers.com (Gerald Henriksen) Date: Wed, 02 Mar 2005 07:58:42 -0500 Subject: I want more CDs in the distribution In-Reply-To: <604aa7910503011426319bd8ae@mail.gmail.com> References: <55668b8c050228120473a73b01@mail.gmail.com> <42237B18.3000803@snowmoon.com> <64134.192.54.193.137.1109668449.squirrel@rousalka.dyndns.org> <604aa7910503011426319bd8ae@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On Tue, 1 Mar 2005 17:26:03 -0500, you wrote: >Let's talk about the reason for a second.... java is FRELLING HUGE! Java is not huge. It is all the other stuff coming along for the ride (Eclipse, etc.) that make java seem huge. >> If Red Hat and the people in charge of Fedora want people to view >> Extras as a postive change ... > >I'm not sure what to really say about this. People who expect >perfection at every step in a long multifacetted process are setting >themselves up for continual disappointment. The existance of Extras I am certainly not expecting perfection. Anyone who has gone through the birth of Fedora and is still here most certainly realizes that things happen. But the flip side is that we also view statements about timeframes for things to be implemented with a great deal of skepticism. While I believe Red Hat has the best of intentions regarding Fedora and the announcements that are made one cannot escape that things have moved a lot slower than anticipated. >is absolutely a positive change... but integrating fully with the >evolving development process of Core is not going to happen >overnight... its not going to happen in one release cycle. Your final sentence sums it up the fear that all the people fighting the move of packages into Extras have. That Fedora 5 will come and go with no support in anaconda, and maybe even future releases. If Extras is important to Fedora then it should be supported, not half supported, or partially supported, or even mostly supported but fully supported. From ghenriks at rogers.com Wed Mar 2 12:58:42 2005 From: ghenriks at rogers.com (Gerald Henriksen) Date: Wed, 02 Mar 2005 07:58:42 -0500 Subject: I want more CDs in the distribution In-Reply-To: <1109708072.31304.53.camel@cutter> References: <55668b8c050228120473a73b01@mail.gmail.com> <42237B18.3000803@snowmoon.com> <64134.192.54.193.137.1109668449.squirrel@rousalka.dyndns.org> <1109708072.31304.53.camel@cutter> Message-ID: On Tue, 01 Mar 2005 15:14:32 -0500, you wrote: >Fedora can deal with Extras. >Fedora has no problem dealing with extras. >anaconda, right now, does not know much about it. But anaconda is part of Fedora, and as the installer a rather critical part. If anaconda cannot deal with Extras then claiming Fedora can deal with extras is a bit misleading. I realize that for many people having to run yum or up2date after they think they have finished their upgrade to Fedora 4 will not be a big issue. But there will be a group of people who will find it confusing and/or inconvenient. From alan at redhat.com Wed Mar 2 13:04:33 2005 From: alan at redhat.com (Alan Cox) Date: Wed, 2 Mar 2005 08:04:33 -0500 Subject: reducing distribution CD count In-Reply-To: References: <200502240906.20729.czar@czarc.net> <20050224175035.22391185@python2> <20050301134557.GA7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> <4224E051.39E412B0@jwz.org> Message-ID: <20050302130433.GD1849@devserv.devel.redhat.com> On Wed, Mar 02, 2005 at 01:24:58AM +0100, Dag Wieers wrote: > Hehe, I've had several people complain about 'random' crashes, usually > when they arrived at work in the morning or came back from coffee. All of > them related to 3D screensavers :) The 3D screensavers don't seem to be the big problem always. The shipped ones are pretty dumb in terms of 3D usage anyway. We've actually had a longer history of problems with servers because there are utterly weird functions in X that come under the "hindsight" category which only Screen savers use > Maybe disabling 3D screensavers by default (and/or a warning about the > potential to crash when people open the screensaver configuration) would > reduce the uncomfortable (unstable) feeling people got when using Linux in > these cases. Or fix the 3D drivers - they are definitely getting a lot more stable now From rahulsundaram at yahoo.co.in Wed Mar 2 13:07:21 2005 From: rahulsundaram at yahoo.co.in (Rahul Sundaram) Date: Wed, 2 Mar 2005 05:07:21 -0800 (PST) Subject: I want more CDs in the distribution In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20050302130721.72996.qmail@web8504.mail.in.yahoo.com> Hi > If Extras is important to Fedora then it should be > supported, not half > supported, or partially supported, or even mostly > supported but fully > supported. thats idealistic. it wont always happen that way esp with software that has time based releases ===== Regards Rahul Sundaram __________________________________ Celebrate Yahoo!'s 10th Birthday! Yahoo! Netrospective: 100 Moments of the Web http://birthday.yahoo.com/netrospective/ From pjones at redhat.com Wed Mar 2 13:23:35 2005 From: pjones at redhat.com (Peter Jones) Date: Wed, 02 Mar 2005 08:23:35 -0500 Subject: FC5 anaconda In-Reply-To: <20050301150424.GA12953@jadzia.bu.edu> References: <200502281401.20237.czar@czarc.net> <20050228190552.GA3456@jadzia.bu.edu> <200502281449.23163.czar@czarc.net> <20050301150424.GA12953@jadzia.bu.edu> Message-ID: <1109769815.16903.7.camel@localhost.localdomain> On Tue, 2005-03-01 at 10:04 -0500, Matthew Miller wrote: > On Mon, Feb 28, 2005 at 02:49:23PM -0500, Gene C. wrote: > > I believe I understand how this will (could) all work for an Internet > > connected system where, basically, you do a network install for a lot of > > that packages (especially those in Fedora Extras). However, how about the > > unconnected system? What is the thinking on how it will handle installing > > everything from CD or DVD images? Will there be CD and/or DVD iso images > > for Extras or will we need to roll our own? > > I'm hoping for the multiple-extras-flavors (Extras:Java / Extras:Games / > Extras:Whatever), which could each have CDs. But I think that network > install is going to be more and more the way. Yeah, network install from a local mirror is definitely the way. With CDs there's just no way to avoid the scenario where we have you swap discs up front to read repodata, and then wind up going through all of them *again* during the actual install. It should be doable, of course, but it'll be a painfully high level of user interaction for an install. Whereas with a local mirror, you can do network install pretty easily. It's not yet clear exactly which of these features will land in FC5 and which will take longer, but this is the route everybody has agreed we're headed in. -- Peter From fedora at wir-sind-cool.org Wed Mar 2 13:33:26 2005 From: fedora at wir-sind-cool.org (Michael Schwendt) Date: Wed, 2 Mar 2005 14:33:26 +0100 Subject: rhythmbox segfault (at libgstreamer) In-Reply-To: <40408.192.54.193.28.1109766720.squirrel@rousalka.dyndns.org> References: <1109753964.19811.3.camel@dragon.sys.intra> <20050302115809.2fff8bbd.fedora@wir-sind-cool.org> <40408.192.54.193.28.1109766720.squirrel@rousalka.dyndns.org> Message-ID: <20050302143326.60d9b86e.fedora@wir-sind-cool.org> On Wed, 2 Mar 2005 13:32:00 +0100 (CET), Nicolas Mailhot wrote: > >> rhythmbox segs on all MP3s with the backtrace pointing at gstreamer > >> being the culprit. > >> Is this known or something I should investigate? > > Wrong list, since Rawhide and problems with Fedora Test releases are > > covered on fedora-test-list. > > Fedora devel problems are no longer covered by the fedora-devel list ? > I thought fedora-test was only there to avoid drowning fedora-devel with > problem reports at test times. I'm pretty sure, fedora-devel has never been a list for users of Fedora Core development packages. It's a list about developing Fedora Core and developing on top of Fedora Core. Bugs in Rawhide are dealt with in bugzilla. Packages in Rawhide are test packages, and hence any problem related discussion about them belongs onto fedora-test-list. Fedora Core Test releases are snapshots of Rawhide and are discussed on the same list. Updates for Fedora Core Test releases come out of Rawhide. All the test stuff is discussed on fedora-test. With a bit of fantasy you could turn a segfault into a development related topic. But if fedora-devel were used for every ordinary report of malfunctioning software in unstable test packages, the list would be cluttered up with such messages. From fedora at wir-sind-cool.org Wed Mar 2 13:35:19 2005 From: fedora at wir-sind-cool.org (Michael Schwendt) Date: Wed, 2 Mar 2005 14:35:19 +0100 Subject: I want more CDs in the distribution In-Reply-To: References: <55668b8c050228120473a73b01@mail.gmail.com> <42237B18.3000803@snowmoon.com> <64134.192.54.193.137.1109668449.squirrel@rousalka.dyndns.org> <1109708072.31304.53.camel@cutter> Message-ID: <20050302143519.597e5a42.fedora@wir-sind-cool.org> On Wed, 02 Mar 2005 07:58:42 -0500, Gerald Henriksen wrote: > On Tue, 01 Mar 2005 15:14:32 -0500, you wrote: > > >Fedora can deal with Extras. > >Fedora has no problem dealing with extras. > >anaconda, right now, does not know much about it. > > But anaconda is part of Fedora, and as the installer a rather critical > part. > > If anaconda cannot deal with Extras then claiming Fedora can deal with > extras is a bit misleading. > > I realize that for many people having to run yum or up2date after they > think they have finished their upgrade to Fedora 4 will not be a big > issue. But there will be a group of people who will find it confusing > and/or inconvenient. The same people, who have installed many extra packages with yum/apt-get before? ;) From jnovy at redhat.com Wed Mar 2 13:41:49 2005 From: jnovy at redhat.com (Jindrich Novy) Date: Wed, 02 Mar 2005 14:41:49 +0100 Subject: Package pruning for FC4 and beyond - COMPLETE LIST In-Reply-To: <4220B0C2.2060007@snowmoon.com> References: <422007DD.1020404@snowmoon.com> <42207BEB.7020000@snowmoon.com> <422086A8.7020200@snowmoon.com> <604aa79105022607043d109bf1@mail.gmail.com> <422092F8.4050003@snowmoon.com> <4220B0C2.2060007@snowmoon.com> Message-ID: <1109770910.16689.32.camel@obelix.redhat.usu> On Sat, 2005-02-26 at 12:24 -0500, Eric Warnke wrote: > lynx/w3m+w3m-el/elinks I think we should have a text-mode browser in core, personaly I vote for elinks. The only thing I missed with elinks was the -dump feature that was available only in lynx. The recent elinks has this feature so I think elinks is the best from these now. > usermode/utempter - overlaps with sudo Nope, usermode contains not only authentication helpers, but also usermount and other things that are of course missing in the other mentioned packages. Many programs are dependent on userhelper now so it's quite impossible to replace it by anything else at the moment. > nedit - another x text editor No objections against dropping this from core. > mc - Is this really a core util? would it be better served in extras? This is very useful thing that should be in core. I don't see any substitute for it in field of text-mode file managers and it has some unique features such as rpm vfs that helps many people. Jindrich -- Jindrich Novy , http://people.redhat.com/jnovy/ From pjones at redhat.com Wed Mar 2 13:43:16 2005 From: pjones at redhat.com (Peter Jones) Date: Wed, 02 Mar 2005 08:43:16 -0500 Subject: I want more CDs in the distribution In-Reply-To: References: <55668b8c050228120473a73b01@mail.gmail.com> <42237B18.3000803@snowmoon.com> <64134.192.54.193.137.1109668449.squirrel@rousalka.dyndns.org> <1109708072.31304.53.camel@cutter> Message-ID: <1109770996.16903.25.camel@localhost.localdomain> On Wed, 2005-03-02 at 07:58 -0500, Gerald Henriksen wrote: > On Tue, 01 Mar 2005 15:14:32 -0500, you wrote: > > >Fedora can deal with Extras. > >Fedora has no problem dealing with extras. > >anaconda, right now, does not know much about it. > > But anaconda is part of Fedora, and as the installer a rather critical > part. > > If anaconda cannot deal with Extras then claiming Fedora can deal with > extras is a bit misleading. If you send me a patch to handle repos in anaconda, I'll be certain to have a look at it ASAP to see if we can use it. I'm going to bet that won't happen, and in that case, basic repo support in anaconda is one of the major features of the plan for FC5, with improved support in further releases. > I realize that for many people having to run yum or up2date after they > think they have finished their upgrade to Fedora 4 will not be a big > issue. But there will be a group of people who will find it confusing > and/or inconvenient. Sure. We still need to do an FC4 release, and pushing for 6 months is the same thing as just not doing one. With Fedora, we've consciously chosen to do regular releases rather than collapse under the weight of really big changes. This has good sides and bad sides. One result of is that there are things we all know are the right step, but they're not *this* step, they're the next one. That's just the way it is. If you don't think anaconda development is moving quickly enough, and you're writing useful code, get on the mailing list for anaconda development. Keep in mind that it's a "this piece of code works this way" and "I have a patch to this" sort of list, so if you just want to discuss the plan, here on fedora-devel is almost certainly a better venue. -- Peter From jspaleta at gmail.com Wed Mar 2 13:57:42 2005 From: jspaleta at gmail.com (Jeff Spaleta) Date: Wed, 2 Mar 2005 08:57:42 -0500 Subject: Hacking modversions In-Reply-To: <1109752954l.2425l.1l@devel.mpeters.us> References: <1109752954l.2425l.1l@devel.mpeters.us> Message-ID: <604aa791050302055775346f43@mail.gmail.com> On Wed, 02 Mar 2005 08:42:34 +0000, Michael A. Peters wrote: > I've seen this done before - I think with a mpeg2 decoder card - and it > actually works, most of the time. When it doesn't work, it's because > the kernel changed in such a way that the module broke - and nothing > other than update from the module vendor will fix that. DKMS http://linux.dell.com/projects.shtml From rc040203 at freenet.de Wed Mar 2 14:06:24 2005 From: rc040203 at freenet.de (Ralf Corsepius) Date: Wed, 02 Mar 2005 15:06:24 +0100 Subject: I want more CDs in the distribution In-Reply-To: <20050302143519.597e5a42.fedora@wir-sind-cool.org> References: <55668b8c050228120473a73b01@mail.gmail.com> <42237B18.3000803@snowmoon.com> <64134.192.54.193.137.1109668449.squirrel@rousalka.dyndns.org> <1109708072.31304.53.camel@cutter> <20050302143519.597e5a42.fedora@wir-sind-cool.org> Message-ID: <1109772385.7143.18.camel@mccallum.corsepiu.local> On Wed, 2005-03-02 at 14:35 +0100, Michael Schwendt wrote: > On Wed, 02 Mar 2005 07:58:42 -0500, Gerald Henriksen wrote: > > > On Tue, 01 Mar 2005 15:14:32 -0500, you wrote: > > > > >Fedora can deal with Extras. > > >Fedora has no problem dealing with extras. > > >anaconda, right now, does not know much about it. > > > > But anaconda is part of Fedora, and as the installer a rather critical > > part. > > > > If anaconda cannot deal with Extras then claiming Fedora can deal with > > extras is a bit misleading. > > > > I realize that for many people having to run yum or up2date after they > > think they have finished their upgrade to Fedora 4 will not be a big > > issue. But there will be a group of people who will find it confusing > > and/or inconvenient. > > The same people, who have installed many extra packages with yum/apt-get > before? ;) These people don't need anaconda - It's superfluous to them ;-) Ralf From linux_4ever at yahoo.com Wed Mar 2 14:09:24 2005 From: linux_4ever at yahoo.com (Steve G) Date: Wed, 2 Mar 2005 06:09:24 -0800 (PST) Subject: Updated CVS documents? Message-ID: <20050302140925.50260.qmail@web51501.mail.yahoo.com> Hi, I was looking through the developer's guidelines specifically to see how to setup my system to commit code to fedora extras. The documentation on the web site doesn't address this: http://fedora.redhat.com/participate/developers-guide/s1-cvs-configure.html Is there another document somewhere that tells you how to configure cvs access assuming you have an account? Thanks, -Steve Grubb __________________________________ Celebrate Yahoo!'s 10th Birthday! Yahoo! Netrospective: 100 Moments of the Web http://birthday.yahoo.com/netrospective/ From harald at redhat.com Wed Mar 2 14:09:33 2005 From: harald at redhat.com (Harald Hoyer) Date: Wed, 02 Mar 2005 15:09:33 +0100 Subject: Package pruning for FC4 and beyond - DRAFT FINAL In-Reply-To: <42215618.9000905@snowmoon.com> References: <422007DD.1020404@snowmoon.com> <42207BEB.7020000@snowmoon.com> <422086A8.7020200@snowmoon.com> <604aa79105022607043d109bf1@mail.gmail.com> <422092F8.4050003@snowmoon.com> <4220B0C2.2060007@snowmoon.com> <42215618.9000905@snowmoon.com> Message-ID: <4225C91D.4030606@redhat.com> Eric Warnke wrote: > *Recommend eviction from core* > cdlabelgen - does anyone use? D:0 agreed > autorun - functionality in most desktops already d:0 hmm, in KDE also? From fedora at wir-sind-cool.org Wed Mar 2 14:14:22 2005 From: fedora at wir-sind-cool.org (Michael Schwendt) Date: Wed, 2 Mar 2005 15:14:22 +0100 Subject: Updated CVS documents? In-Reply-To: <20050302140925.50260.qmail@web51501.mail.yahoo.com> References: <20050302140925.50260.qmail@web51501.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20050302151422.004a7dbb.fedora@wir-sind-cool.org> On Wed, 2 Mar 2005 06:09:24 -0800 (PST), Steve G wrote: > Hi, > > I was looking through the developer's guidelines specifically to see how to setup > my system to commit code to fedora extras. The documentation on the web site > doesn't address this: > > http://fedora.redhat.com/participate/developers-guide/s1-cvs-configure.html > > Is there another document somewhere that tells you how to configure cvs access > assuming you have an account? Here's some information, but only for anonymous access: http://cvs.fedora.redhat.com/ This is what I use: export CVSROOT=:ext:USERNAME at cvs.fedora.redhat.com:/cvs/extras export CVS_RSH=ssh export WORKDIR=~/tmp/rpm/tmp From linux_4ever at yahoo.com Wed Mar 2 14:25:33 2005 From: linux_4ever at yahoo.com (Steve G) Date: Wed, 2 Mar 2005 06:25:33 -0800 (PST) Subject: Updated CVS documents? In-Reply-To: <20050302151422.004a7dbb.fedora@wir-sind-cool.org> Message-ID: <20050302142533.56288.qmail@web51501.mail.yahoo.com> >This is what I use: Gotcha. That's what I was looking for. Now, looking at section 3.3.4, adding files...do we add tarballs straight to the repo using "cvs add" or do we do something else? The document also doesn't address kicking off a build in the extras system. Is there another document that addresses it? These issues really should be in the developer's guide. Thanks, -Steve Grubb __________________________________ Celebrate Yahoo!'s 10th Birthday! Yahoo! Netrospective: 100 Moments of the Web http://birthday.yahoo.com/netrospective/ From harald at redhat.com Wed Mar 2 14:33:19 2005 From: harald at redhat.com (Harald Hoyer) Date: Wed, 02 Mar 2005 15:33:19 +0100 Subject: writing zero bytes in bash In-Reply-To: <200502261832.16337.russell@coker.com.au> References: <200502261832.16337.russell@coker.com.au> Message-ID: <4225CEAF.5010007@redhat.com> Russell Coker wrote: > To unset the fscreate or exec context you have to write zero bytes > to /proc/self/attr/fscreate or /proc/self/attr/exec respectively. I would say, this is a bad designed kernel interface... From linux_4ever at yahoo.com Wed Mar 2 14:37:05 2005 From: linux_4ever at yahoo.com (Steve G) Date: Wed, 2 Mar 2005 06:37:05 -0800 (PST) Subject: writing zero bytes in bash In-Reply-To: <4225CEAF.5010007@redhat.com> Message-ID: <20050302143705.84747.qmail@web51502.mail.yahoo.com> >I would say, this is a bad designed kernel interface... Stephen Smalley already has a patch for the kernel to fix it. Should be in 2.6.12 I suspect. -Steve Grubb __________________________________ Celebrate Yahoo!'s 10th Birthday! Yahoo! Netrospective: 100 Moments of the Web http://birthday.yahoo.com/netrospective/ From kyrre at solution-forge.net Wed Mar 2 14:39:48 2005 From: kyrre at solution-forge.net (Kyrre Ness Sjobak) Date: Wed, 02 Mar 2005 15:39:48 +0100 Subject: fedora-devel-list Digest, Vol 12, Issue 108 In-Reply-To: <200503010747.j217lVFY030618@leto.astradyne.corp> References: <200503010747.j217lVFY030618@leto.astradyne.corp> Message-ID: <1109774387.30922.2.camel@localhost.localdomain> tir, 01.03.2005 kl. 08.47 skrev Tet: > John Thacker writes: > > >Still, given all that, OOo right now does use a free license, and FC > >current attempts to only have one application *in Core* (as opposed to > >Extras) for each job. And given that, it's hard for me to support > >Abiword over the equally free OOo *right now* in Core as the default > >with the lack of workable CJK support. > > That's fine. For you OO.o is the right solution. Just remember that > there are others for whom the opposite is true. Abiword does some things > that OO.o can't do, and thus for them, that's the right solution. For > me, there's no question that Abiword/Gnumeric are a better combination > than OO.o. But it seems there's little point in arguing about it now. > AFAICT, the decision has already been made, and FC4 will ship with them > in Extras. Let's just hope someone sees the light and puts them back > into Core for FC5. As far as i understand, extras is open for non-rh devs to maintain - and if (example) AbiWord was maintained by somebody who used AbiWord reguraly, and maybe even was an AbiWord developer - wouldn't that possibly give a better AbiWord than somebody who never used it exept fiering it up to check that "yum, it still starts" after recompiling, but never sees any bugs etc. ? Kyrre From thias at spam.spam.spam.spam.spam.spam.spam.egg.and.spam.freshrpms.net Wed Mar 2 14:40:09 2005 From: thias at spam.spam.spam.spam.spam.spam.spam.egg.and.spam.freshrpms.net (Matthias Saou) Date: Wed, 2 Mar 2005 15:40:09 +0100 Subject: Current i386 install (boot.iso -> nfs) broken Message-ID: <20050302154009.2c9d0191@python2> Hi, I wanted to test a complete installation of the development tree from start to end, but after booting off boot.iso and choosing to do a network install from an nfs server, I got this error after entering the nfs server parameters : Traceback with last line being "from _rpm import *" and : ImportError: libssl.so.4: cannot open shared object file: No such file or directory Then the install aborts. Matthias -- Clean custom Red Hat Linux rpm packages : http://freshrpms.net/ Fedora Core release 3 (Heidelberg) - Linux kernel 2.6.10-1.770_FC3 Load : 0.05 0.11 0.18 From clumens at redhat.com Wed Mar 2 14:51:19 2005 From: clumens at redhat.com (Chris Lumens) Date: Wed, 2 Mar 2005 09:51:19 -0500 (EST) Subject: Current i386 install (boot.iso -> nfs) broken In-Reply-To: <20050302154009.2c9d0191@python2> References: <20050302154009.2c9d0191@python2> Message-ID: > I wanted to test a complete installation of the development tree from start > to end, but after booting off boot.iso and choosing to do a network install > from an nfs server, I got this error after entering the nfs server > parameters : > > Traceback with last line being "from _rpm import *" and : > > ImportError: libssl.so.4: cannot open shared object file: No such file or > directory There have been a lot of library changes recently and we're working on making sure the install image has everything it needs as these changes occur (like the new libkrb5support library just the other day). Please file a bug against anaconda in bugzilla and we'll take care of it. - Chris From bigjoe1008 at gmail.com Wed Mar 2 14:52:54 2005 From: bigjoe1008 at gmail.com (Joe Harnish) Date: Wed, 02 Mar 2005 09:52:54 -0500 Subject: FC5 anaconda In-Reply-To: <1109769815.16903.7.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <200502281401.20237.czar@czarc.net> <20050228190552.GA3456@jadzia.bu.edu> <200502281449.23163.czar@czarc.net> <20050301150424.GA12953@jadzia.bu.edu> <1109769815.16903.7.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <1109775174.5947.2.camel@doit-l52125> On Wed, 2005-03-02 at 08:23 -0500, Peter Jones wrote: > On Tue, 2005-03-01 at 10:04 -0500, Matthew Miller wrote: > > On Mon, Feb 28, 2005 at 02:49:23PM -0500, Gene C. wrote: > > > I believe I understand how this will (could) all work for an Internet > > > connected system where, basically, you do a network install for a lot of > > > that packages (especially those in Fedora Extras). However, how about the > > > unconnected system? What is the thinking on how it will handle installing > > > everything from CD or DVD images? Will there be CD and/or DVD iso images > > > for Extras or will we need to roll our own? > > > > I'm hoping for the multiple-extras-flavors (Extras:Java / Extras:Games / > > Extras:Whatever), which could each have CDs. But I think that network > > install is going to be more and more the way. > > Yeah, network install from a local mirror is definitely the way. With > CDs there's just no way to avoid the scenario where we have you swap > discs up front to read repodata, and then wind up going through all of > them *again* during the actual install. > > It should be doable, of course, but it'll be a painfully high level of > user interaction for an install. Whereas with a local mirror, you can > do network install pretty easily. > > It's not yet clear exactly which of these features will land in FC5 and > which will take longer, but this is the route everybody has agreed we're > headed in. > > -- > Peter > Something that would be really cool to go along with a local mirror is to be able to run the installer from a CD but point to a locally mounted USB hard disk or something. This may be too complicated compared to a local repo but it would sure be nice. :) Joe From fedora at wir-sind-cool.org Wed Mar 2 14:55:02 2005 From: fedora at wir-sind-cool.org (Michael Schwendt) Date: Wed, 2 Mar 2005 15:55:02 +0100 Subject: Updated CVS documents? In-Reply-To: <20050302142533.56288.qmail@web51501.mail.yahoo.com> References: <20050302151422.004a7dbb.fedora@wir-sind-cool.org> <20050302142533.56288.qmail@web51501.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20050302155502.7d757d56.fedora@wir-sind-cool.org> On Wed, 2 Mar 2005 06:25:33 -0800 (PST), Steve G wrote: > > >This is what I use: > > Gotcha. That's what I was looking for. > > Now, looking at section 3.3.4, adding files...do we add tarballs straight to the > repo using "cvs add" or do we do something else? Tarballs and other [larger] binary blobs are uploaded into a HTTP/CGI based lookaside cache using "make" targets, e.g. make upload FILES=foo-3.0.tar.gz This would upload the file and add its MD5 checksum to the local "sources" file in your CVS working copy. See also: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Extras/UsingCvsFaq > The document also doesn't address kicking off a build in the extras system. There is no such build system yet. Seth Vidal does builds for 32-bit and 64-bit x86 systems. We still request builds via a Wiki page: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Extras/FC3Status For local builds, check out "make help". From kyrre at solution-forge.net Wed Mar 2 14:54:54 2005 From: kyrre at solution-forge.net (Kyrre Ness Sjobak) Date: Wed, 02 Mar 2005 15:54:54 +0100 Subject: Package pruning for FC4 and beyond In-Reply-To: <20050301142920.GH7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> References: <422007DD.1020404@snowmoon.com> <42207BEB.7020000@snowmoon.com> <422086A8.7020200@snowmoon.com> <20050301142920.GH7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> Message-ID: <1109775294.30922.7.camel@localhost.localdomain> > > awesfx - OLD ( 2000 ) D:0 > > Needed for SB64 still But it still (fc2...) aren't automatically setup with some free soundfont set. Somhow i just got stuck with timitity - it can use *much* larger midi patches than i can load into the RAM of my SBAWE64 :) So either fix so that some patch is loaded by default, setup timidity with some resonable patchset (CCRMA?) or drop it altogether and let users wanting to play a midi file suffer. Kyrre From harald at redhat.com Wed Mar 2 15:04:57 2005 From: harald at redhat.com (Harald Hoyer) Date: Wed, 02 Mar 2005 16:04:57 +0100 Subject: FC5 anaconda In-Reply-To: <1109775174.5947.2.camel@doit-l52125> References: <200502281401.20237.czar@czarc.net> <20050228190552.GA3456@jadzia.bu.edu> <200502281449.23163.czar@czarc.net> <20050301150424.GA12953@jadzia.bu.edu> <1109769815.16903.7.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1109775174.5947.2.camel@doit-l52125> Message-ID: <4225D619.40508@redhat.com> Joe Harnish wrote: > Something that would be really cool to go along with a local mirror is > to be able to run the installer from a CD but point to a locally mounted > USB hard disk or something. This may be too complicated compared to a > local repo but it would sure be nice. :) > > Joe > already in anaconda for a long time.. From harald at redhat.com Wed Mar 2 15:10:58 2005 From: harald at redhat.com (Harald Hoyer) Date: Wed, 02 Mar 2005 16:10:58 +0100 Subject: I want more CDs in the distribution In-Reply-To: <1109770996.16903.25.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <55668b8c050228120473a73b01@mail.gmail.com> <42237B18.3000803@snowmoon.com> <64134.192.54.193.137.1109668449.squirrel@rousalka.dyndns.org> <1109708072.31304.53.camel@cutter> <1109770996.16903.25.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <4225D782.1000406@redhat.com> Peter Jones wrote: > On Wed, 2005-03-02 at 07:58 -0500, Gerald Henriksen wrote: > >>On Tue, 01 Mar 2005 15:14:32 -0500, you wrote: >> >> >>>Fedora can deal with Extras. >>>Fedora has no problem dealing with extras. >>>anaconda, right now, does not know much about it. >> >>But anaconda is part of Fedora, and as the installer a rather critical >>part. >> >>If anaconda cannot deal with Extras then claiming Fedora can deal with >>extras is a bit misleading. > > > If you send me a patch to handle repos in anaconda, I'll be certain to > have a look at it ASAP to see if we can use it. Come on! Send patches! It's not that hard! :-) If noone does, I might spend a week of evenings/nights for this... From jwboyer at jdub.homelinux.org Wed Mar 2 15:16:27 2005 From: jwboyer at jdub.homelinux.org (Josh Boyer) Date: Wed, 2 Mar 2005 09:16:27 -0600 Subject: Updated CVS documents? In-Reply-To: <20050302155502.7d757d56.fedora@wir-sind-cool.org> References: <20050302151422.004a7dbb.fedora@wir-sind-cool.org> <20050302142533.56288.qmail@web51501.mail.yahoo.com> <20050302155502.7d757d56.fedora@wir-sind-cool.org> Message-ID: <20050302151627.GA26850@yoda.jdub.homelinux.org> On Wed, Mar 02, 2005 at 03:55:02PM +0100, Michael Schwendt wrote: > > The document also doesn't address kicking off a build in the extras system. > > There is no such build system yet. Seth Vidal does builds for 32-bit > and 64-bit x86 systems. We still request builds via a Wiki page: I think David Woodhouse is doing ppc builds for Extras as well. josh From mattdm at mattdm.org Wed Mar 2 15:38:24 2005 From: mattdm at mattdm.org (Matthew Miller) Date: Wed, 2 Mar 2005 10:38:24 -0500 Subject: FC5 anaconda In-Reply-To: <4225D619.40508@redhat.com> References: <200502281401.20237.czar@czarc.net> <20050228190552.GA3456@jadzia.bu.edu> <200502281449.23163.czar@czarc.net> <20050301150424.GA12953@jadzia.bu.edu> <1109769815.16903.7.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1109775174.5947.2.camel@doit-l52125> <4225D619.40508@redhat.com> Message-ID: <20050302153824.GA27855@jadzia.bu.edu> On Wed, Mar 02, 2005 at 04:04:57PM +0100, Harald Hoyer wrote: > >Something that would be really cool to go along with a local mirror is > >to be able to run the installer from a CD but point to a locally mounted > >USB hard disk or something. This may be too complicated compared to a > >local repo but it would sure be nice. :) > already in anaconda for a long time.. Yes. Boot with the 'askmethod' parameter. -- Matthew Miller mattdm at mattdm.org Boston University Linux ------> From than at redhat.com Wed Mar 2 16:00:30 2005 From: than at redhat.com (Than Ngo) Date: Wed, 02 Mar 2005 17:00:30 +0100 Subject: rawhide report: 20050301 changes In-Reply-To: References: <200503011908.j21J8lsr013948@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> Message-ID: <4225E31E.3010902@redhat.com> Lars wrote: >there is a problem updating to the new kde rc and ssl. > >i get: >Error: Missing Dependency: openssl = 0.9.7a is needed by package kdelibs > >i guess the (compat) openssl097a package should be used by kdelibs instead? > >L > > > > > it's fixed in kdelibs-3.4.0-0.rc1.3 Than From tibbs at math.uh.edu Wed Mar 2 16:05:22 2005 From: tibbs at math.uh.edu (Jason L Tibbitts III) Date: Wed, 02 Mar 2005 10:05:22 -0600 Subject: rawhide report: 20050301 changes In-Reply-To: <1109716755.19111.11.camel@tudor.e.kth.se> (Alexander =?iso-8859-1?q?Bostr=F6m's?= message of "Tue, 01 Mar 2005 23:39:15 +0100") References: <200503011908.j21J8lsr013948@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <1109716755.19111.11.camel@tudor.e.kth.se> Message-ID: >>>>> "AB" == Alexander Bostr?m writes: AB> No change regarding https://bugzilla.redhat.com/135961 . Pretty AB> please could someone look in to this? :) Looks like Tomas Mraz was listening. - J< From than at redhat.com Wed Mar 2 16:06:09 2005 From: than at redhat.com (Than Ngo) Date: Wed, 02 Mar 2005 17:06:09 +0100 Subject: rawhide report: 20050301 changes In-Reply-To: <42258819.5090209@o2.pl> References: <200503011908.j21J8lsr013948@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <42258819.5090209@o2.pl> Message-ID: <4225E471.5000102@redhat.com> Dawid Gajownik wrote: >Hi! > > > >>kdelibs-6:3.4.0-0.rc1.2 >>----------------------- >>* Tue Mar 01 2005 Than Ngo 6:3.4.0-0.rc1.2 >>- rebuilt against gcc-4 >> >>* Sat Feb 26 2005 Than Ngo 6:3.4.0-0.rc1.1 >>- bump release >> >>* Fri Feb 25 2005 Than Ngo 6:3.4.0-0.rc1.0 >>- KDE 3.4.0 rc1 >> >> > >Do you plan reenabling "-fvisibility=hidden -fvisibility-inlines-hidden" >options? Right now they are disabled [1] or am I wrong? > > > enabling "-fvisibility=hidden -fvisibility-inlines-hidden", it caused build some problem on non ix86 plattform ATM. so i disable it temporary, but i will reenable in 3.4.0 final release. Than From dnjinc at wowway.com Wed Mar 2 16:07:18 2005 From: dnjinc at wowway.com (Demond James) Date: Wed, 02 Mar 2005 11:07:18 -0500 Subject: I want more CDs in the distribution In-Reply-To: References: <55668b8c050228120473a73b01@mail.gmail.com> <42237B18.3000803@snowmoon.com> <64134.192.54.193.137.1109668449.squirrel@rousalka.dyndns.org> <604aa7910503011426319bd8ae@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <4225E4B6.2090200@wowway.com> Gerald Henriksen wrote: >On Tue, 1 Mar 2005 17:26:03 -0500, you wrote: > > >If Extras is important to Fedora then it should be supported, not half >supported, or partially supported, or even mostly supported but fully >supported. > > > > C'mon, be realistic. Better yet be productive and get extras "fully supported" as you see it. From jakub at redhat.com Wed Mar 2 16:08:51 2005 From: jakub at redhat.com (Jakub Jelinek) Date: Wed, 2 Mar 2005 11:08:51 -0500 Subject: rawhide report: 20050301 changes In-Reply-To: <4225E471.5000102@redhat.com> References: <200503011908.j21J8lsr013948@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <42258819.5090209@o2.pl> <4225E471.5000102@redhat.com> Message-ID: <20050302160850.GJ853@devserv.devel.redhat.com> On Wed, Mar 02, 2005 at 05:06:09PM +0100, Than Ngo wrote: > enabling "-fvisibility=hidden -fvisibility-inlines-hidden", it caused > build some problem on non ix86 plattform ATM. >From what I understood on ix86 as well. DT_TEXTREL libraries are really bad. Jakub From bigjoe1008 at gmail.com Wed Mar 2 16:10:02 2005 From: bigjoe1008 at gmail.com (Joe Harnish) Date: Wed, 02 Mar 2005 11:10:02 -0500 Subject: FC5 anaconda In-Reply-To: <20050302153824.GA27855@jadzia.bu.edu> References: <200502281401.20237.czar@czarc.net> <20050228190552.GA3456@jadzia.bu.edu> <200502281449.23163.czar@czarc.net> <20050301150424.GA12953@jadzia.bu.edu> <1109769815.16903.7.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1109775174.5947.2.camel@doit-l52125> <4225D619.40508@redhat.com> <20050302153824.GA27855@jadzia.bu.edu> Message-ID: <1109779802.5947.4.camel@doit-l52125> On Wed, 2005-03-02 at 10:38 -0500, Matthew Miller wrote: > On Wed, Mar 02, 2005 at 04:04:57PM +0100, Harald Hoyer wrote: > > >Something that would be really cool to go along with a local mirror is > > >to be able to run the installer from a CD but point to a locally mounted > > >USB hard disk or something. This may be too complicated compared to a > > >local repo but it would sure be nice. :) > > already in anaconda for a long time.. > > Yes. Boot with the 'askmethod' parameter. Sweet - you learn something new everyday!! Even if you have done something a million times. From cmadams at hiwaay.net Wed Mar 2 16:13:53 2005 From: cmadams at hiwaay.net (Chris Adams) Date: Wed, 2 Mar 2005 10:13:53 -0600 Subject: Package pruning for FC4 and beyond In-Reply-To: <1109699593.15077.114.camel@bobcat.mine.nu> References: <422007DD.1020404@snowmoon.com> <42207BEB.7020000@snowmoon.com> <604aa79105022809106bd60c13@mail.gmail.com> <20050228183608.GD897460@hiwaay.net> <1109699593.15077.114.camel@bobcat.mine.nu> Message-ID: <20050302161353.GA733581@hiwaay.net> Once upon a time, Ville Skytt said: > On Mon, 2005-02-28 at 12:36 -0600, Chris Adams wrote: > > Mmm... nethack. I had a good nethack package a while back; sounds like > > a good excuse to clean it up and learn about maintaining a package in > > Extras. > > Already there, "yum install nethack-falconseye". I saw that, but I want the current "real" nethack. I'll work on it when I get a chance. -- Chris Adams Systems and Network Administrator - HiWAAY Internet Services I don't speak for anybody but myself - that's enough trouble. From mbneto at gmail.com Wed Mar 2 16:16:22 2005 From: mbneto at gmail.com (mbneto) Date: Wed, 2 Mar 2005 12:16:22 -0400 Subject: rawhide report: 20050301 changes In-Reply-To: <4225E31E.3010902@redhat.com> References: <200503011908.j21J8lsr013948@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <4225E31E.3010902@redhat.com> Message-ID: <5cf776b805030208167b4b4bd9@mail.gmail.com> How about those error messages .. Error: Missing Dependency: libgcj_fc4.so.6 is needed by package eclipse-jdt Error: Missing Dependency: libgcj_fc4.so.6 is needed by package libswt3-gtk2 Error: Missing Dependency: libgcj_fc4.so.6 is needed by package eclipse-platform Error: Missing Dependency: libgcj_fc4.so.6 is needed by package eclipse-ecj Error: Missing Dependency: libgcj.so.5 is needed by package gjdoc Error: Unable to satisfy dependencies Error: Package libwvstreams needs libssl.so.4, this is not available. Error: Package distcache needs libcrypto.so.4, this is not available. Error: Package gnome-vfs2 needs libssl.so.4, this is not available. Error: Package neon needs libssl.so.4, this is not available. Error: Package openvpn needs libssl.so.4, this is not available. Error: Package httpd needs libcrypto.so.4, this is not available. Error: Package cups-libs needs libssl.so.4, this is not available. Error: Package distcache needs libssl.so.4, this is not available. Error: Package libgnomecups needs libssl.so.4, this is not available. Error: Package lftp needs libssl.so.4, this is not available. Error: Package rpm-build needs libssl.so.4, this is not available. Error: Package perl-Crypt-SSLeay needs libcrypto.so.4, this is not available. Error: Package xmlsec1-openssl needs libcrypto.so.4, this is not available. Error: Package kdelibs needs openssl = 0.9.7a, this is not available. Error: Package xine needs libssl.so.4, this is not available. Error: Package wget needs libssl.so.4, this is not available. Error: Package xine needs libcrypto.so.4, this is not available On Wed, 02 Mar 2005 17:00:30 +0100, Than Ngo wrote: > Lars wrote: > > >there is a problem updating to the new kde rc and ssl. > > > >i get: > >Error: Missing Dependency: openssl = 0.9.7a is needed by package kdelibs > > > >i guess the (compat) openssl097a package should be used by kdelibs instead? > > > >L > > > > > > > > > > > it's fixed in kdelibs-3.4.0-0.rc1.3 > > Than > > -- > fedora-devel-list mailing list > fedora-devel-list at redhat.com > http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-list > From aoliva at redhat.com Wed Mar 2 16:38:37 2005 From: aoliva at redhat.com (Alexandre Oliva) Date: 02 Mar 2005 13:38:37 -0300 Subject: reducing distribution CD count In-Reply-To: <1109714497.31304.74.camel@cutter> References: <200503011358.j21Dw2st000363@leto.astradyne.corp> <1109686052.23615.53.camel@cutter> <1109714497.31304.74.camel@cutter> Message-ID: On Mar 1, 2005, seth vidal wrote: > On Tue, 2005-03-01 at 18:53 -0300, Alexandre Oliva wrote: >> On Mar 1, 2005, seth vidal wrote: >> >>> 1. so a user can report a bug (presumably by bugzilla, on the internet) >>> but can't download bzflag or tuxracer? How is that unavailable? >> >> How about: internet access only from work, monitored downloads, no CD >> burning permitted, small amount of web browsing tolerated? > so how did the user get fedora to begin with!? How about from a magazine? -- Alexandre Oliva http://www.ic.unicamp.br/~oliva/ Red Hat Compiler Engineer aoliva@{redhat.com, gcc.gnu.org} Free Software Evangelist oliva@{lsd.ic.unicamp.br, gnu.org} From aoliva at redhat.com Wed Mar 2 16:39:25 2005 From: aoliva at redhat.com (Alexandre Oliva) Date: 02 Mar 2005 13:39:25 -0300 Subject: reducing distribution CD count In-Reply-To: <604aa7910503011358404ec6b3@mail.gmail.com> References: <200503011358.j21Dw2st000363@leto.astradyne.corp> <1109686052.23615.53.camel@cutter> <604aa7910503011358404ec6b3@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On Mar 1, 2005, Jeff Spaleta wrote: > On 01 Mar 2005 18:53:45 -0300, Alexandre Oliva wrote: >> How about: internet access only from work, monitored downloads, no CD >> burning permitted, small amount of web browsing tolerated? > How does that system get any update packages at all? Odds are it doesn't need them, since it's not connected. -- Alexandre Oliva http://www.ic.unicamp.br/~oliva/ Red Hat Compiler Engineer aoliva@{redhat.com, gcc.gnu.org} Free Software Evangelist oliva@{lsd.ic.unicamp.br, gnu.org} From jspaleta at gmail.com Wed Mar 2 17:01:18 2005 From: jspaleta at gmail.com (Jeff Spaleta) Date: Wed, 2 Mar 2005 12:01:18 -0500 Subject: reducing distribution CD count In-Reply-To: References: <200503011358.j21Dw2st000363@leto.astradyne.corp> <1109686052.23615.53.camel@cutter> <604aa7910503011358404ec6b3@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <604aa791050302090129932cd6@mail.gmail.com> On 02 Mar 2005 13:39:25 -0300, Alexandre Oliva wrote: > Odds are it doesn't need them, since it's not connected. oh please... there are all sorts of updates that have come out that have had a direct impact on end-user facing elements to fix some annoying issues. Its not ALL about security fixes. There have been 'needed' functionality fixes. Even non-networked people who do updates of fc3 are going to notice a marked difference in some aspects of non-networked elements.. because of bug fixes. One man's unneeded update is another man's critical feature bugfix. This whole line of argument that you are trying to make is errenous in the context of the original discussion about effective 3d testing. How can you do effective do 3d testing/troubleshooting if you can't eat the updates that are spun up to confirm the problem has been fixed on your hardware? Confirming the fix is sort of important.. and if you can't get the updates.. how do you confirm the fix? The issue of trying to cram everything into the release isos is a completely red herring issue. If you want to work on the more important issue of how to build reliable mechanisms on how to get updates into the hands of system admins in network-poor environments that would be far more valuable in the long run. -jef From dawid_gajownik at o2.pl Wed Mar 2 17:22:45 2005 From: dawid_gajownik at o2.pl (Dawid Gajownik) Date: Wed, 02 Mar 2005 18:22:45 +0100 Subject: rawhide report: 20050301 changes In-Reply-To: <4225E471.5000102@redhat.com> References: <200503011908.j21J8lsr013948@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <42258819.5090209@o2.pl> <4225E471.5000102@redhat.com> Message-ID: <4225F665.3070006@o2.pl> Dnia 03/02/2005 05:06 PM, U?ytkownik Than Ngo napisa?: > so i disable it temporary, but i will reenable in 3.4.0 final release. Sweet :) I asked about it because I was worrying that this patch would be included in FC4. -- ^_* -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: OpenPGP digital signature URL: From rahulsundaram at yahoo.co.in Wed Mar 2 17:51:39 2005 From: rahulsundaram at yahoo.co.in (Rahul Sundaram) Date: Wed, 2 Mar 2005 09:51:39 -0800 (PST) Subject: reducing distribution CD count In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20050302175140.14488.qmail@web8506.mail.in.yahoo.com> Hi > > so how did the user get fedora to begin with!? > > How about from a magazine? Linux for you in India distributed the fedora 3 dvd with one issue and includes all the updates till then in the next month but they said they would have preferred to distribute a single CD the first time. if there are any quick ways to build an ISO with the all the relevant updates it is a good idea to document it. Fedora should be have a organised way to target OEM's ===== Regards Rahul Sundaram __________________________________ Celebrate Yahoo!'s 10th Birthday! Yahoo! Netrospective: 100 Moments of the Web http://birthday.yahoo.com/netrospective/ From aoliva at redhat.com Wed Mar 2 17:53:33 2005 From: aoliva at redhat.com (Alexandre Oliva) Date: 02 Mar 2005 14:53:33 -0300 Subject: reducing distribution CD count In-Reply-To: <604aa791050302090129932cd6@mail.gmail.com> References: <200503011358.j21Dw2st000363@leto.astradyne.corp> <1109686052.23615.53.camel@cutter> <604aa7910503011358404ec6b3@mail.gmail.com> <604aa791050302090129932cd6@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On Mar 2, 2005, Jeff Spaleta wrote: > Even non-networked people who do updates of fc3 are going to notice > a marked difference in some aspects of non-networked > elements.. because of bug fixes. One man's unneeded update is > another man's critical feature bugfix. Sure. If it's critical, and the person learns about the fix, I'm sure she'll find a way to get the update somehow. > The issue of trying to cram everything into the release isos is a > completely red herring issue. If you want to work on the more > important issue of how to build reliable mechanisms on how to get > updates into the hands of system admins in network-poor environments > that would be far more valuable in the long run. Agreed. Way to go for FC5. If we could add support for picking updates from ISOs for FC5, we could even roll weekly-or-so ISO updates. Or just let the installer take CDs containing updates and figure out that, instead of installing something from core, it'd be better off installing the newer corresponding package from the updates CD. -- Alexandre Oliva http://www.ic.unicamp.br/~oliva/ Red Hat Compiler Engineer aoliva@{redhat.com, gcc.gnu.org} Free Software Evangelist oliva@{lsd.ic.unicamp.br, gnu.org} From buildsys at redhat.com Wed Mar 2 18:15:49 2005 From: buildsys at redhat.com (Build System) Date: Wed, 2 Mar 2005 13:15:49 -0500 Subject: rawhide report: 20050302 changes Message-ID: <200503021815.j22IFnMu027490@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> New package java-1.4.2-gcj-compat JPackage runtime scripts for GCJ Removed package java-1.4.2-gcj4-compat Updated Packages: Canna-3.7p3-12 -------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Akira TAGOH - 3.7p3-12 - rebuild for gcc4. - Canna-3.7p3-fix-gcc4-warning.patch: applied to fix more compiler warnings. VFlib2-2.25.6-28 ---------------- * Tue Mar 01 2005 Akira TAGOH - 2.25.6-28 - requires fonts-japanese instead of ttfonts-ja - VFlib2-2.25.6-build-fix.patch: applied to fix the build fails with gcc4. anaconda-10.2.0.24-1 -------------------- * Tue Mar 01 2005 Peter Jones 10.2.0.24-1 - gcc4 fixes (clumens, pjones) - build C files with -D_FORTIFY_SOURCE=2 (pjones) * Mon Feb 28 2005 Chris Lumens 10.2.0.23-1 - Don't write out filesystems to fstab we haven't mounted (katzj, #149091). - Deal with multiple Apple Bootstrap partitions (pnasrat). - Set hostname sensitivity UI bug. - Eject CD when failing (pnasrat, #147272). - Better handling of Apple Bootstrap throughout (pjones). - Do ethtool setup everywhere (pnasrat, #145522). - Fix "debug" command line arg (pjones). - Import new libkrb5support library (#149856). - Add -once to ensure Xvnc exits (katzj, #137337). autofs-1:4.1.3-107 ------------------ * Mon Feb 28 2005 Chris Feist - 1:4.1.3-103 - When using ldap if auto.master doesn't exist we now check for auto_master. Addresses bz #130079 - When using an auto.smb map we now remove the leading ':' from the path which caused mount to fail in the past. Addresses bz #147492 - Autofs now checks /etc/nsswitch.conf to determine in what order files & nis are checked when looking up autofs submount maps which don't specify a maptype. Addresses IT #57612. automake17-1.7.9-6 ------------------ * Tue Mar 01 2005 Karsten Hopp 1.7.9-6 - pdfoutput seems to be set to 0 by other tex* stuff, this breaks txinfo16 selfcheck as is now produces pdf files instead of dvi. Added workaround bind-22:9.3.1rc1-3 ------------------ * Tue Mar 01 2005 Nalin Dahyabhai - 22:9.3.1rc1-3 - configure with --with-pic to get PIC libraries cadaver-0.22.2-2 ---------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Joe Orton 0.22.2-2 - rebuild checkpolicy-1.21.4-2 -------------------- * Tue Mar 01 2005 Dan Walsh 1.21.4-2 - Rebuild for FC4 cpufreq-utils-1:0.2-1.1.12 -------------------------- * Tue Mar 01 2005 Dave Jones - Rebuild for gcc4. cpuspeed-1:1.2.1-1.19 --------------------- * Tue Mar 01 2005 Dave Jones - Rebuild for gcc4. cups-1:1.1.23-12 ---------------- * Tue Mar 01 2005 Tomas Mraz 1:1.1.23-12 - rebuild for openssl-0.9.7e curl-7.13.0-2 ------------- * Tue Mar 01 2005 Tomas Mraz 7.13.0-2 - rebuild with openssl-0.9.7e cyrus-sasl-2.1.20-4 ------------------- * Tue Mar 01 2005 Nalin Dahyabhai 2.1.20-4 - rebuild with new deps diskdumputils-1.0.1-2 --------------------- * Tue Mar 01 2005 Akira Imamura 1.0.1-2 - Updated source package to diskdumputils-1.0.1.tar.gz. - User-space portion of FZ #132466, diskdumpfmt performance improvement. - Updated to use glib2 instead of glib1. BZ #136227, BZ #148998 - Added missing a BuildRequires for glib2-devel. BZ #132872 - Deleted dead code to avoid compiler complaint. BZ #143202 - Fix for compiler complaint by making a variable static. BZ #136147 distcache-1.4.5-7 ----------------- * Tue Mar 01 2005 Tomas Mraz 1.4.5-7 - rebuild with openssl-0.9.7e dmidecode-1:2.5-1.10 -------------------- * Tue Mar 01 2005 Dave Jones - Rebuild for gcc4 dmraid-1.0.0.rc6-2_FC4 ---------------------- dump-0.4b39-3 ------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Jindrich Novy 0.4b39-3 - Added patch to fix negative size problem with -s/-d options (#147710) - from Stelian Pop evolution-2.1.6-2 ----------------- * Tue Mar 01 2005 David Malcolm - 2.1.6-2 - added patch to fix build with GCC4 * Tue Mar 01 2005 David Malcolm - 2.1.6-1 - Update from upstream unstable 2.1.6 to 2.1.6 - Added patches to fix calendar and addressbook printing for non-Roman scripts (#138075) - Added explicit requirement on libgnomeprint22 >= 2.8.0 - Added BuildRequires: gtk-doc - Updated requirements: * gtkhtml3 from 3.5.6 to 3.5.7 * libgal2 from 2.3.4 to 2.3.5 * eds from 1.1.5 to 1.1.6 * Wed Feb 09 2005 David Malcolm - 2.1.5-1 - Update from upstream unstable 2.1.4 to 2.1.5 - Updated requirements: * gtkhtml3 from 3.5.4 to 3.5.6 * libgal2 from 2.3.3 to 2.3.4 * eds from 1.1.4.1 to 1.1.5 - Removed explicit packaging of weather icons as these are now below DATADIR/evolution/2.2 rather than DATADIR/evolution-2.2 evolution-connector-2.1.6-3 --------------------------- * Tue Mar 01 2005 David Malcolm - 2.1.6-3 - reapply the 64bit multilib LDAP patch, and regenerate the autotool patch accordingly * Tue Mar 01 2005 David Malcolm - 2.1.6-2 - actually remove the convenience library patches this time * Wed Feb 09 2005 David Malcolm - 2.1.6-1 - Update from unstable upstream 2.1.5 to 2.1.6 - Require evolution 2.1.6 - Removed patches for convenience libraries as these are now upstream evolution-data-server-1.1.6-5 ----------------------------- * Tue Mar 01 2005 David Malcolm - 1.1.6-5 - disabling gtk-doc on ia64 and s390x * Tue Mar 01 2005 David Malcolm - 1.1.6-4 - added macro use_gtk_doc; added missing BuildRequires on gtk-doc; enabled gtk-doc generation on all platforms (had been disabled on ia64) * Tue Mar 01 2005 David Malcolm - 1.1.6-3 - extended patch to deal with camel-groupwise-store-summary.c evolution-webcal-2.1.92-1 ------------------------- * Tue Mar 01 2005 David Malcolm - 2.1.92-1 - updated from 2.1.91 to 2.1.92 gamin-0.0.25-4 -------------- * Tue Mar 01 2005 Daniel Veillard 0.0.25-4 - Fix a configure problem reported by Martin Schlemmer - Fix the /media/* and /mnt/* mount blocking problems from 0.0.24 e.g. #142637 - Fix the monitoring of directory using poll and not kernel ghostscript-7.07-39 ------------------- * Tue Mar 01 2005 Tim Waugh 7.07-39 - Rebuilt for new GCC. gimp-print-4.2.7-5 ------------------ * Tue Mar 01 2005 Tomas Mraz 4.2.7-5 - rebuild with openssl-0.9.7e gnome-vfs2-2.9.91-3 ------------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Tomas Mraz - 2.9.91-3 - rebuild with openssl-0.9.7e gtk2-2.6.4-1 ------------ * Tue Mar 01 2005 Matthias Clasen - 2.6.4-1 - Upgrade to 2.6.1 - Remove upstreamed patch gtkhtml3-3.5.7-1 ---------------- * Tue Mar 01 2005 David Malcolm - 3.5.7-1 - 3.5.7 gwenhywfar-1.7.2-2 ------------------ hardlink-1:1.0-1.11 ------------------- * Tue Mar 01 2005 Dave Jones - rebuild for gcc4 hpijs-1.7.1-3 ------------- * Tue Mar 01 2005 Tim Waugh 1.7.1-3 - Rebuilt for new GCC. httpd-2.0.53-5 -------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Joe Orton 2.0.53-5 - apachectl: restore use of $OPTIONS again irqbalance-1:1.12-1.18 ---------------------- * Tue Mar 01 2005 Dave Jones - Rebuild with gcc4 kdeaccessibility-1:3.4.0-0.rc1.1 -------------------------------- * Sun Feb 27 2005 Than Ngo 1:3.4.0-0.rc1.1 - KDE 3.4.0 rc1 * Sun Feb 20 2005 Than Ngo 1:3.3.92-0.1 - KDE 3.4 beta2 kdeadmin-7:3.4.0-0.rc1.1 ------------------------ * Sat Feb 26 2005 Than Ngo 7:3.4.0-0.rc1.1 - KDE 3.4.0 rc1 * Fri Feb 18 2005 Than Ngo 7:3.3.92-0.1 - KDE-3.4 beta2 kdeartwork-3.4.0-0.rc1.1 ------------------------ * Mon Feb 28 2005 Than Ngo 3.4.0-0.rc1.1 - 3.4.0 rc1 * Wed Feb 16 2005 Than Ngo 3.3.92-0.1 - KDE-3.4 Beta2 kdeedu-3.4.0-0.rc1.1 -------------------- * Tue Mar 01 2005 Than Ngo 3.4.0-0.rc1.1 - 3.4.0 rc1 * Wed Feb 16 2005 Than Ngo 3.3.92-0.1 - KDE-3.4 Beta2 kdegraphics-7:3.4.0-0.rc1.1 --------------------------- * Tue Mar 01 2005 Than Ngo 7:3.4.0-0.rc1.1 - rebuilt with gcc-4 * Sat Feb 26 2005 Than Ngo 3.4.0-0.rc1.0 - KDE-3.4.0 rc1 * Tue Feb 22 2005 Than Ngo 7:3.3.92-0.1 - KDE-3.4 beta2 kdelibs-6:3.4.0-0.rc1.3 ----------------------- * Tue Mar 01 2005 Than Ngo 6:3.4.0-0.rc1.3 - fix dependency problem with openssl-0.9.7e kdemultimedia-6:3.4.0-0.rc1.1 ----------------------------- * Mon Feb 28 2005 Than Ngo 6:3.4.0-0.rc1.1 - KDE 3.4.0 rc1 * Fri Feb 18 2005 Than Ngo 6:3.3.92-0.1 - KDE-3.4 beta2 * Mon Feb 14 2005 Than Ngo 6:3.3.2-0.2 - apply Steve cleanup patch kdenetwork-7:3.4.0-0.rc1.1 -------------------------- * Sun Feb 27 2005 Than Ngo 7:3.4.0-0.rc1.1 - KDE 3.4.0 rc1 * Mon Feb 21 2005 Than Ngo 7:3.3.92-0.1 - KDE-3.4 beta2 kdepim-6:3.4.0-0.rc1.2 ---------------------- * Tue Mar 01 2005 Than Ngo 6:3.4.0-0.rc1.2 - fix casting issue * Mon Feb 28 2005 Than Ngo 6:3.4.0-0.rc1.1 - KDE 3.4.0 rc1 * Wed Feb 16 2005 Than Ngo 6:3.3.92-0.1 - KDE-3.4 Beta2 kdeutils-6:3.4.0-0.rc1.1 ------------------------ * Tue Mar 01 2005 Than Ngo 6:3.4.0-0.rc1.1 - KDE 3.4.0 rc1 * Mon Feb 21 2005 Than Ngo 6:3.3.92-0.1 - KDE-3.4 beta2 kdevelop-9:3.2.0-0.rc1.1 ------------------------ * Tue Mar 01 2005 Than Ngo 9:3.2.0-0.rc1.1 - KDE 3.4.0 rc1 * Mon Feb 21 2005 Than Ngo 9:3.1.92-0.1 - KDE-3.4 beta2 kdewebdev-6:3.4.0-0.rc1.1 ------------------------- * Mon Feb 28 2005 Than Ngo 6:3.4.0-0.rc1.1 - 3.4.0 rc1 * Mon Feb 21 2005 Than Ngo 6:3.3.92-0.1 - 3.4 beta2 kernel-2.6.10-1.1162_FC4 ------------------------ * Tue Mar 01 2005 David Woodhouse - Fix ppc/ppc64/ppc64iseries builds for gcc 4.0 - Fix Xen build too * Mon Feb 28 2005 Dave Jones - 2.6.11-rc5-bk3 - Various compile fixes for building with gcc-4.0 ksh-20041225-2 -------------- * Tue Mar 01 2005 Karsten Hopp 20041225-2 - fix gcc4 build libc-client-2002e-9 ------------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Jindrich Novy 2002e-9 - rebuilt libgal2-2:2.3.5-1 ----------------- * Tue Mar 01 2005 David Malcolm - 2:2.3.5-1 - 2.3.5 libgnomecups-0.1.14-2 --------------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Jindrich Novy 0.1.14-2 - rebuilt libgpg-error-1.0-2 ------------------ * Wed Mar 02 2005 Bill Nottingham - 1.0-2 - we can rebuild it. we have the technology. libselinux-1.21.12-1 -------------------- * Tue Mar 01 2005 Dan Walsh 1.21.12-1 - Update from NSA * Changed matchpathcon_common to ignore any non-format bits in the mode. * Mon Feb 28 2005 Dan Walsh 1.21.11-2 - Default matchpathcon to regular files if the user specifies a mode libsepol-1.3.7-1 ---------------- * Tue Mar 01 2005 Dan Walsh 1.3.7-1 - Update to latest from NSA * Merged sepol_debug and fclose patch from Dan Walsh. libsoup-2.2.2-3 --------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 David Malcolm - 2.2.2-3 - rebuild with GCC 4 libunwind-0.98.2-3 ------------------ * Tue Mar 01 2005 Jeff Johnston 0.98.2.3 - Bump up release number longrun-1:0.9-1.8 ----------------- mcelog-1:0.4-1.8 ---------------- microcode_ctl-1:1.11-1.21 ------------------------- * Tue Mar 01 2005 Dave Jones - Rebuild for gcc4 * Thu Feb 17 2005 Dave Jones - s/Serial/Epoch/ mikmod-3.1.6-34 --------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Bill Nottingham 3.1.6-34 - new compiler. old code. mkinitrd-4.2.1-1 ---------------- * Tue Mar 01 2005 Peter Jones - 4.2.1-1 - typo fixes - one missed gcc4 fix * Tue Mar 01 2005 Peter Jones - 4.2.0.4-1 - fix gcc4 warnings/errors - use -D_FORTIFY_SOURCE=2 wherever we don't use RPM_OPT_FLAGS neon-0.24.7-6 ------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Joe Orton 0.24.7-6 - rebuild net-snmp-5.2.1-4 ---------------- * Tue Mar 01 2005 Tomas Mraz - 5.2.1-4 - rebuild with openssl-0.9.7e net-tools-1.60-48 ----------------- * Tue Mar 01 2005 Radek Vokal 1.60-48 - behaviour of netstat -i option changed (#115987) - netstat -i shows all interface, -I only one numactl-0.6.4-1.18 ------------------ * Tue Mar 01 2005 Dave Jones - Rebuild for gcc4 openjade-1.3.2-16 ----------------- * Tue Mar 01 2005 Tim Waugh 1.3.2-16 - Rebuilt for new GCC. openldap-2.2.23-4 ----------------- * Tue Mar 01 2005 Nalin Dahyabhai 2.2.23-4 - prefer libresolv to libbind * Tue Mar 01 2005 Nalin Dahyabhai 2.2.23-3 - add bind-libbind-devel and libtool-ltdl-devel buildprereqs * Tue Mar 01 2005 Tomas Mraz 2.2.23-2 - rebuild with openssl-0.9.7e openssl-0.9.7e-3 ---------------- * Tue Mar 01 2005 Tomas Mraz 0.9.7e-3 - libcrypto shouldn't depend on libkrb5 (#135961) pam-0.78-5 ---------- * Tue Mar 01 2005 Tomas Mraz 0.78-5 - echo why tests failed when rebuilding - fixed some warnings and errors in pam_console for gcc4 build - improved parsing pam_console config file * Mon Feb 21 2005 Tomas Mraz - don't log garbage in pam_console_apply (#147879) * Tue Jan 18 2005 Tomas Mraz - don't require exact db4 version only conflict with incompatible one pciutils-2.1.99.test8-7 ----------------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Bill Nottingham - 2.1.99.test8-7 - FC4. GCC 4. fore! pcmcia-cs-3.2.8-4.11 -------------------- * Tue Mar 01 2005 Dave Jones - Rebuild for gcc4 php-5.0.3-3 ----------- * Fri Feb 18 2005 Joe Orton 5.0.3-3 - fix build with GCC 4 postgresql-8.0.1-3 ------------------ * Tue Mar 01 2005 Tomas Mraz 8.0.1-3 - rebuild with openssl-0.9.7e qt-1:3.3.4-7 ------------ * Tue Mar 01 2005 Than Ngo 1:3.3.4-7 - fix build problem with gcc4 readahead-1:1.0-1.7 ------------------- * Tue Mar 01 2005 Dave Jones - Rebuild for gcc4 rng-utils-1:2.0-1.5 ------------------- rpm-4.4.1-4 ----------- * Tue Mar 01 2005 Jeremy Katz - 4.4.1-4 - fix build with gcc 4 * Mon Feb 28 2005 Jeremy Katz - 4.4.1-3 - fix posttrans callback check being backwards (#149524) rpmdb-fedora-1:4-0.20050302 --------------------------- salinfo-1:0.5-1.4 ----------------- samba-0:3.0.11-5 ---------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Tomas Mraz 3.0.11-5 - rebuild with openssl-0.9.7e schedutils-1.4.0-4 ------------------ * Tue Mar 01 2005 Dave Jones - Rebuild for gcc4 selinux-policy-strict-1.21.15-4 ------------------------------- * Mon Feb 28 2005 Dan Walsh 1.21.15-4 - Add Ivans changes to cleanup writing to homedir - Update strict policy changes - Allow httpd_sys_script_t self: create_stream_socket_perms selinux-policy-targeted-1.21.15-4 --------------------------------- * Mon Feb 28 2005 Dan Walsh 1.21.15-4 - Add Ivans changes to cleanup writing to homedir - Update strict policy changes - Allow httpd_sys_script_t self: create_stream_socket_perms sendmail-8.13.3-1.1 ------------------- * Tue Mar 01 2005 Thomas Woerner 8.13.3-1.1 - fixed gcc4 build: use double quotes for confOPTIMIZE to avoid m4 confusion with ',' - fix for ppc: using tripple-quotes smartmontools-1:5.33-1.5 ------------------------ tzdata-2005f-2 -------------- * Tue Mar 01 2005 Jakub Jelinek 2005f-2 - 2005f - more updates for Israel, updates for Azerbaijan up2date-4.4.9-1 --------------- * Tue Mar 01 2005 Adrian Likins 4.4.9 - fix #149947 * Tue Feb 15 2005 Adrian Likins 4.4.8 - fix #139537 * Fri Jan 14 2005 Adrian Likins 4.4.7 - fix #136497 - fix #142750, #142589 (less deprecation warnings) x86info-1:1.13-1.9 ------------------ From kyrre at solution-forge.net Wed Mar 2 18:17:29 2005 From: kyrre at solution-forge.net (Kyrre Ness Sjobak) Date: Wed, 02 Mar 2005 19:17:29 +0100 Subject: Package pruning for FC4 and beyond In-Reply-To: <1109582014.5885.7.camel@perun.redhat.usu> References: <422007DD.1020404@snowmoon.com> <42207BEB.7020000@snowmoon.com> <42207E54.9090902@feuerpokemon.de> <1109582014.5885.7.camel@perun.redhat.usu> Message-ID: <1109787449.30922.14.camel@localhost.localdomain> man, 28.02.2005 kl. 10.13 skrev Tomas Mraz: > On Sat, 2005-02-26 at 14:49 +0100, dragoran wrote: > > "SDL* - kdeaddons is the only thing that depends on this" > > dropping sdl isn't a good idea because many third party apps require it. > +1 > I agree that removing most games (except the basic as gnome-games) from > FC is desirable however removing SDL would mean that even for installing > almost any games this dependency would have to be installed by user. I > don't think it's a good idea. > SDL isn't only used by games, but also as an A/V output system by many (3.party) progs. Please keep SDL - it is a really usefull libary. BTW, we must decide wether Fedora (core+extras(+livna)) should be self-containing, or if it should be as easy as possible to use as a platform for 3. party programs. I think it should be made as easy as possible to use as a platform, and not depend on the "all programs MUST come from RH/extras or they ar EVIL!" thinking we are seeing now... Kyrre From Fedora at TQMcube.com Wed Mar 2 18:27:04 2005 From: Fedora at TQMcube.com (David Cary Hart) Date: Wed, 02 Mar 2005 13:27:04 -0500 Subject: 2.6.11 ALPS Issue Message-ID: <1109788024.3327.28.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> Just an unconfirmed heads up. I installed Korg 2.6.11 and it broke the ability to "tap" mouse clicks on the touchpad. I tried to get someone to confirm on the FC-list. So far no response. -- Total Quality Management - A Commitment to Excellence Fight Spam: http://www.tqmcube.com/rbldnsd.htm Daily Updates: rsync -t \ tqmcube.com::spamlists/[README.htm][clients][dynamic][relays][asiaspam] http://www.tqmcube.com/spam_trap.htm From kyrre at solution-forge.net Wed Mar 2 18:30:17 2005 From: kyrre at solution-forge.net (Kyrre Ness Sjobak) Date: Wed, 02 Mar 2005 19:30:17 +0100 Subject: rawhide report: 20050301 changes In-Reply-To: <200503011908.j21J8lsr013948@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> References: <200503011908.j21J8lsr013948@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> Message-ID: <1109788217.30922.19.camel@localhost.localdomain> > Removed package gcc4 Hmm? Didn't somebody just say "fc4 has gcc 4 as default"?!? From mitr at volny.cz Wed Mar 2 18:32:22 2005 From: mitr at volny.cz (Miloslav Trmac) Date: Wed, 2 Mar 2005 19:32:22 +0100 Subject: rawhide report: 20050301 changes In-Reply-To: <1109788217.30922.19.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <200503011908.j21J8lsr013948@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <1109788217.30922.19.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <20050302183218.GA19309@chrys.ms.mff.cuni.cz> On Wed, Mar 02, 2005 at 07:30:17PM +0100, Kyrre Ness Sjobak wrote: > > Removed package gcc4 > Hmm? Didn't somebody just say "fc4 has gcc 4 as default"?!? That's why it is in package "gcc" now. Mirek From skvidal at phy.duke.edu Wed Mar 2 18:36:38 2005 From: skvidal at phy.duke.edu (seth vidal) Date: Wed, 02 Mar 2005 13:36:38 -0500 Subject: rawhide report: 20050301 changes In-Reply-To: <1109788217.30922.19.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <200503011908.j21J8lsr013948@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <1109788217.30922.19.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <1109788598.14561.20.camel@cutter> On Wed, 2005-03-02 at 19:30 +0100, Kyrre Ness Sjobak wrote: >> Removed package gcc4 > >Hmm? Didn't somebody just say "fc4 has gcc 4 as default"?!? yes so the package 'gcc' is now gcc 4.0 so you don't need a package named gcc4 -sv From rdieter at math.unl.edu Wed Mar 2 18:32:29 2005 From: rdieter at math.unl.edu (Rex Dieter) Date: Wed, 02 Mar 2005 12:32:29 -0600 Subject: rawhide report: 20050301 changes In-Reply-To: <1109788217.30922.19.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <200503011908.j21J8lsr013948@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <1109788217.30922.19.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <422606BD.8090404@math.unl.edu> Kyrre Ness Sjobak wrote: >>Removed package gcc4 > > > Hmm? Didn't somebody just say "fc4 has gcc 4 as default"?!? If gcc4 is renamed to gcc, then gcc4 does go away. (-: -- Rex From cmadams at hiwaay.net Wed Mar 2 18:32:35 2005 From: cmadams at hiwaay.net (Chris Adams) Date: Wed, 2 Mar 2005 12:32:35 -0600 Subject: rawhide report: 20050301 changes In-Reply-To: <1109788217.30922.19.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <200503011908.j21J8lsr013948@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <1109788217.30922.19.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <20050302183235.GC733581@hiwaay.net> Once upon a time, Kyrre Ness Sjobak said: > > Removed package gcc4 > > Hmm? Didn't somebody just say "fc4 has gcc 4 as default"?!? Yes. That means that "gcc" is now gcc-4.0.0 and there is no separate "gcc4" package. -- Chris Adams Systems and Network Administrator - HiWAAY Internet Services I don't speak for anybody but myself - that's enough trouble. From rjune at bravegnuworld.com Wed Mar 2 18:36:16 2005 From: rjune at bravegnuworld.com (Richard June) Date: Wed, 2 Mar 2005 13:36:16 -0500 Subject: Package pruning for FC4 and beyond In-Reply-To: <1109787449.30922.14.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <422007DD.1020404@snowmoon.com> <1109582014.5885.7.camel@perun.redhat.usu> <1109787449.30922.14.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <200503021336.18890.rjune@bravegnuworld.com> [snip] > BTW, we must decide wether Fedora (core+extras(+livna)) should be > self-containing, or if it should be as easy as possible to use as a > platform for 3. party programs. I think it should be made as easy as > possible to use as a platform, and not depend on the "all programs MUST > come from RH/extras or they ar EVIL!" thinking we are seeing now... then a lot of third part packagers should do a better job of packaging. myself included. -- Public Key available Here: http://www.bravegnuworld.com/~rjune/pubkey.asc -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: not available URL: From notting at redhat.com Wed Mar 2 18:37:40 2005 From: notting at redhat.com (Bill Nottingham) Date: Wed, 2 Mar 2005 13:37:40 -0500 Subject: rawhide report: 20050301 changes In-Reply-To: <1109788217.30922.19.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <200503011908.j21J8lsr013948@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <1109788217.30922.19.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <20050302183740.GA2182@nostromo.devel.redhat.com> Kyrre Ness Sjobak (kyrre at solution-forge.net) said: > > Removed package gcc4 > > Hmm? Didn't somebody just say "fc4 has gcc 4 as default"?!? ... and as such, the gcc4 package became gcc-4.0-0.x. Bill From dnjinc at wowway.com Wed Mar 2 18:40:25 2005 From: dnjinc at wowway.com (Demond James) Date: Wed, 02 Mar 2005 13:40:25 -0500 Subject: Package pruning for FC4 and beyond In-Reply-To: <1109787449.30922.14.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <422007DD.1020404@snowmoon.com> <42207BEB.7020000@snowmoon.com> <42207E54.9090902@feuerpokemon.de> <1109582014.5885.7.camel@perun.redhat.usu> <1109787449.30922.14.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <42260899.404@wowway.com> Kyrre Ness Sjobak wrote: >BTW, we must decide wether Fedora (core+extras(+livna)) should be >self-containing, or if it should be as easy as possible to use as a >platform for 3. party programs. I think it should be made as easy as >possible to use as a platform, and not depend on the "all programs MUST >come from RH/extras or they ar EVIL!" thinking we are seeing now... > >Kyrre > > > Where are you seeing that? You are seeing a discussion of Fedora Core/Extras development. 3rd party development discussions are elsewhere. 3rd party programs are welcomed. From rahulsundaram at yahoo.co.in Wed Mar 2 18:41:48 2005 From: rahulsundaram at yahoo.co.in (Rahul Sundaram) Date: Wed, 2 Mar 2005 10:41:48 -0800 (PST) Subject: 2.6.11 ALPS Issue In-Reply-To: <1109788024.3327.28.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> Message-ID: <20050302184148.78786.qmail@web8501.mail.in.yahoo.com> --- David Cary Hart wrote: > Just an unconfirmed heads up. I installed Korg > 2.6.11 and it broke the > ability to "tap" mouse clicks on the touchpad. I > tried to get someone to > confirm on the FC-list. So far no response. Hey I did respond suggesting you post here :-) ===== Regards Rahul Sundaram __________________________________ Celebrate Yahoo!'s 10th Birthday! Yahoo! Netrospective: 100 Moments of the Web http://birthday.yahoo.com/netrospective/ From dax at gurulabs.com Wed Mar 2 18:52:42 2005 From: dax at gurulabs.com (Dax Kelson) Date: Wed, 02 Mar 2005 11:52:42 -0700 Subject: 2.6.11 ALPS Issue In-Reply-To: <1109788024.3327.28.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> References: <1109788024.3327.28.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> Message-ID: <1109789562.5947.24.camel@mentorng.gurulabs.com> On Wed, 2005-03-02 at 13:27 -0500, David Cary Hart wrote: > Just an unconfirmed heads up. I installed Korg 2.6.11 and it broke the > ability to "tap" mouse clicks on the touchpad. I tried to get someone to > confirm on the FC-list. So far no response. Message from the linux-kernel mailing list about this issue: Dax Kelson Guru Labs -------- Forwarded Message -------- From: Dmitry Torokhov Reply-To: dtor_core at ameritech.net To: MIGUELANXO at telefonica.net Cc: linux-kernel at vger.kernel.org Subject: Re: 2.6.11: touchpad unresponsive Date: Wed, 2 Mar 2005 12:12:53 -0500 On Wed, 02 Mar 2005 16:55:59 +0100, MIGUELANXO at telefonica.net wrote: > I just compiled 2.6.11 from 2.6.10 config using 'make oldconfig', > activate new options to default values (i.e. set "main kernel lock > preemtive" to YES). > > Booting X in new kernel makes my touchpad very unresponsive. I can't > click any longer in the touchpad area, and the touchpad doesn't response > when moving in small increments, so the whole experience is quite bad. > If it is identified as an ALPS touchpad you can try installing Peter Osterlund's Synaptics X driver: http://web.telia.com/~u89404340/touchpad/ Alternatively you can restore 2.6.10 behavior with psmouse.proto=exps boot option (if psmouse is a module add "options psmouse proto=exps" to your /etc/modprobe.conf). From perbj at stanford.edu Wed Mar 2 19:00:19 2005 From: perbj at stanford.edu (Per Bjornsson) Date: Wed, 02 Mar 2005 11:00:19 -0800 Subject: 2.6.11 ALPS Issue In-Reply-To: <1109789562.5947.24.camel@mentorng.gurulabs.com> References: <1109788024.3327.28.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> <1109789562.5947.24.camel@mentorng.gurulabs.com> Message-ID: <1109790019.7248.13.camel@localhost.localdomain> On Wed, 2005-03-02 at 11:52 -0700, Dax Kelson wrote: > On Wed, 2005-03-02 at 13:27 -0500, David Cary Hart wrote: > > Just an unconfirmed heads up. I installed Korg 2.6.11 and it broke the > > ability to "tap" mouse clicks on the touchpad. I tried to get someone to > > confirm on the FC-list. So far no response. > > Message from the linux-kernel mailing list about this issue: Seems likely. However, the synaptics driver should already be installed, it's a dependency for lots of stuff including system-config-display. However, it needs to be enabled in xorg.conf; the easiest way to do this is likely to do a completely fresh X configuration with 'system-config- display --reconfig'. Good luck! Per -- Per Bjornsson Ph.D. Candidate, Department of Applied Physics, Stanford University From fedora-devel at camperquake.de Wed Mar 2 19:04:19 2005 From: fedora-devel at camperquake.de (Ralf Ertzinger) Date: Wed, 2 Mar 2005 20:04:19 +0100 Subject: rawhide report: 20050301 changes In-Reply-To: <5cf776b805030208167b4b4bd9@mail.gmail.com> References: <200503011908.j21J8lsr013948@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <4225E31E.3010902@redhat.com> <5cf776b805030208167b4b4bd9@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20050302200419.063140fb@nausicaa.camperquake.de> Hi. mbneto wrote: > How about those error messages > > .. Most of those ought to be gone once kde gets it's openssl dependency right. -- For every action, there is an equal and opposite criticism. From fedora-devel at camperquake.de Wed Mar 2 19:07:50 2005 From: fedora-devel at camperquake.de (Ralf Ertzinger) Date: Wed, 2 Mar 2005 20:07:50 +0100 Subject: rawhide report: 20050302 changes In-Reply-To: <200503021815.j22IFnMu027490@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> References: <200503021815.j22IFnMu027490@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> Message-ID: <20050302200750.7881d658@nausicaa.camperquake.de> Hi. Build System wrote: Some gems, sometimes. > libgpg-error-1.0-2 > ------------------ > * Wed Mar 02 2005 Bill Nottingham - 1.0-2 > - we can rebuild it. we have the technology. What exactly is that supposed to mean, anyway? Sounds like a line from Star Trek :) -- Ein Eisbein ist besonders frisch, wenn man es der Sau erst bei Bedarf amputiert. From Fedora at TQMcube.com Wed Mar 2 19:13:31 2005 From: Fedora at TQMcube.com (David Cary Hart) Date: Wed, 02 Mar 2005 14:13:31 -0500 Subject: 2.6.11 ALPS Issue In-Reply-To: <1109790019.7248.13.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <1109788024.3327.28.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> <1109789562.5947.24.camel@mentorng.gurulabs.com> <1109790019.7248.13.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <1109790811.3327.35.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> On Wed, 2005-03-02 at 11:00 -0800, Per Bjornsson wrote: > On Wed, 2005-03-02 at 11:52 -0700, Dax Kelson wrote: > > On Wed, 2005-03-02 at 13:27 -0500, David Cary Hart wrote: > > > Just an unconfirmed heads up. I installed Korg 2.6.11 and it broke the > > > ability to "tap" mouse clicks on the touchpad. I tried to get someone to > > > confirm on the FC-list. So far no response. > > > > Message from the linux-kernel mailing list about this issue: > > Seems likely. However, the synaptics driver should already be installed, > it's a dependency for lots of stuff including system-config-display. > However, it needs to be enabled in xorg.conf; the easiest way to do this > is likely to do a completely fresh X configuration with 'system-config- > display --reconfig'. > Why would I do that in contrast to simply changing the mouse driver with s-c-mouse? > Good luck! > Per > > -- > Per Bjornsson > Ph.D. Candidate, Department of Applied Physics, Stanford University -- Total Quality Management - A Commitment to Excellence Fight Spam: http://www.tqmcube.com/rbldnsd.htm Daily Updates: rsync -t \ tqmcube.com::spamlists/[README.htm][clients][dynamic][relays][asiaspam] http://www.tqmcube.com/spam_trap.htm From pnasrat at redhat.com Wed Mar 2 19:15:01 2005 From: pnasrat at redhat.com (Paul Nasrat) Date: Wed, 02 Mar 2005 19:15:01 +0000 Subject: 2.6.11 ALPS Issue In-Reply-To: <1109790019.7248.13.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <1109788024.3327.28.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> <1109789562.5947.24.camel@mentorng.gurulabs.com> <1109790019.7248.13.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <1109790902.4788.0.camel@anu.eridu> On Wed, 2005-03-02 at 11:00 -0800, Per Bjornsson wrote: >On Wed, 2005-03-02 at 11:52 -0700, Dax Kelson wrote: >> On Wed, 2005-03-02 at 13:27 -0500, David Cary Hart wrote: >> > Just an unconfirmed heads up. I installed Korg 2.6.11 and it broke the >> > ability to "tap" mouse clicks on the touchpad. I tried to get someone to >> > confirm on the FC-list. So far no response. >> >> Message from the linux-kernel mailing list about this issue: > >Seems likely. However, the synaptics driver should already be installed, >it's a dependency for lots of stuff including system-config-display. >However, it needs to be enabled in xorg.conf; the easiest way to do this >is likely to do a completely fresh X configuration with 'system-config- >display --reconfig'. A kudzu change was needed, and I need to do some ALPS specific config in rhpl to make it sensible (the sensitivity is different). Paul From jspaleta at gmail.com Wed Mar 2 19:14:56 2005 From: jspaleta at gmail.com (Jeff Spaleta) Date: Wed, 2 Mar 2005 14:14:56 -0500 Subject: rawhide report: 20050302 changes In-Reply-To: <20050302200750.7881d658@nausicaa.camperquake.de> References: <200503021815.j22IFnMu027490@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <20050302200750.7881d658@nausicaa.camperquake.de> Message-ID: <604aa79105030211143ef0fa2b@mail.gmail.com> On Wed, 2 Mar 2005 20:07:50 +0100, Ralf Ertzinger > What exactly is that supposed to mean, anyway? Sounds like a line from > Star Trek :) get the reference right... six million dollar man... and just be glad it wasn't a buck rogers referece, http://www.scifi.com/bionics/sixmill.html -jef"fears we are losing touch with our tv show heritage. Everyone needs to watch more re-runs and learn to charish the plastic episodic cultural of the 20th century"spaleta From elanthis at awesomeplay.com Wed Mar 2 19:14:33 2005 From: elanthis at awesomeplay.com (Sean Middleditch) Date: Wed, 02 Mar 2005 14:14:33 -0500 Subject: rawhide report: 20050302 changes In-Reply-To: <20050302200750.7881d658@nausicaa.camperquake.de> References: <200503021815.j22IFnMu027490@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <20050302200750.7881d658@nausicaa.camperquake.de> Message-ID: <1109790873.6254.6.camel@support02.civic.twp.ypsilanti.mi.us> On Wed, 2005-03-02 at 20:07 +0100, Ralf Ertzinger wrote: >Hi. > >Build System wrote: > >Some gems, sometimes. > >> libgpg-error-1.0-2 >> ------------------ >> * Wed Mar 02 2005 Bill Nottingham - 1.0-2 >> - we can rebuild it. we have the technology. > >What exactly is that supposed to mean, anyway? Sounds like a line from >Star Trek :) Probably means that they rebuilt the package. The line is from The Billion Dollar Man. > >-- >Ein Eisbein ist besonders frisch, wenn man es der Sau erst bei Bedarf >amputiert. > -- Sean Middleditch From thacker at math.cornell.edu Wed Mar 2 19:15:55 2005 From: thacker at math.cornell.edu (John Thacker) Date: Wed, 2 Mar 2005 14:15:55 -0500 Subject: rawhide report: 20050302 changes In-Reply-To: <20050302200750.7881d658@nausicaa.camperquake.de> References: <200503021815.j22IFnMu027490@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <20050302200750.7881d658@nausicaa.camperquake.de> Message-ID: <20050302191555.GA18362@thacker.dyndns.org> On Wed, Mar 02, 2005 at 08:07:50PM +0100, Ralf Ertzinger wrote: > Build System wrote: > > Some gems, sometimes. > > > libgpg-error-1.0-2 > > ------------------ > > * Wed Mar 02 2005 Bill Nottingham - 1.0-2 > > - we can rebuild it. we have the technology. > > What exactly is that supposed to mean, anyway? Sounds like a line from > Star Trek :) http://us.imdb.com/title/tt0071054/quotes "Steve Austin, astronaut. A man barely alive. Gentlemen, we can rebuild him. We have the technology. We have the capability to build the world's first bionic man. Steve Austin will be that man. Better than he was before. Better, stronger, faster." John Thacker -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: not available URL: From ziga.mahkovec at klika.si Wed Mar 2 19:32:13 2005 From: ziga.mahkovec at klika.si (Ziga Mahkovec) Date: Wed, 02 Mar 2005 20:32:13 +0100 Subject: reducing distribution CD count In-Reply-To: <20050302175140.14488.qmail@web8506.mail.in.yahoo.com> References: <20050302175140.14488.qmail@web8506.mail.in.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1109791933.5433.14.camel@localhost> On Wed, 2005-03-02 at 09:51 -0800, Rahul Sundaram wrote: > Linux for you in India distributed the fedora 3 dvd > with one issue and includes all the updates till then > in the next month but they said they would have > preferred to distribute a single CD the first time. if > there are any quick ways to build an ISO with the all > the relevant updates it is a good idea to document it. > Fedora should be have a organised way to target OEM's I think this is what you're looking for: http://fedoranews.org/contributors/gene_czarcinski/update_distro/ -- Ziga From sitsofe at yahoo.com Wed Mar 2 19:30:30 2005 From: sitsofe at yahoo.com (Sitsofe Wheeler) Date: Wed, 02 Mar 2005 19:30:30 +0000 Subject: reducing distribution CD count In-Reply-To: <20050301152757.GX7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> References: <200502240906.20729.czar@czarc.net> <20050224175035.22391185@python2> <20050301134658.GB7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> <1109685440.23615.42.camel@cutter> <42247474.7080606@carwyn.com> <1109685922.23615.48.camel@cutter> <422482A1.7030505@carwyn.com> <20050301152757.GX7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> Message-ID: <1109791830.4336.7.camel@galvatron.localdomain> On Tue, 2005-03-01 at 10:27 -0500, Alan Cox wrote: > then the bzflag bug will not be the priority bug. Not that bzflag has bugs 8) No *reproducible* bugs ; ) -- Sitsofe | http://sucs.org/~sits/ From feliciano.matias at free.fr Wed Mar 2 19:51:44 2005 From: feliciano.matias at free.fr (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?F=E9liciano?= Matias) Date: Wed, 02 Mar 2005 20:51:44 +0100 Subject: rawhide report: 20050302 changes In-Reply-To: <200503021815.j22IFnMu027490@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> References: <200503021815.j22IFnMu027490@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> Message-ID: <1109793104.23488.2.camel@one.myworld> Le mercredi 02 mars 2005 ? 13:15 -0500, Build System a ?crit : > evolution-2.1.6-2 > ----------------- > ... > * Tue Mar 01 2005 David Malcolm - 2.1.6-1 > - Update from upstream unstable 2.1.6 to 2.1.6 fascinating -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: Ceci est une partie de message num?riquement sign?e URL: From jwz at jwz.org Wed Mar 2 19:59:38 2005 From: jwz at jwz.org (Jamie Zawinski) Date: Wed, 02 Mar 2005 11:59:38 -0800 Subject: reducing distribution CD count References: <200502240906.20729.czar@czarc.net> <20050224175035.22391185@python2> <20050301134557.GA7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> <4224E051.39E412B0@jwz.org> <20050302130433.GD1849@devserv.devel.redhat.com> Message-ID: <42261B2A.53F240E9@jwz.org> Alan Cox wrote: > > The 3D screensavers don't seem to be the big problem always. The shipped ones > are pretty dumb in terms of 3D usage anyway. We've actually had a longer > history of problems with servers because there are utterly weird functions in > X that come under the "hindsight" category which only Screen savers use Wow, that has totally not been my experience at all (either personally, or in the slew of "you crashed my server!" mail I get.) It's *always* one of the GL ones. In fact, the only non-GL saver I can recall having gotten a crash report about was "blaster", which uses such esoteric functions as XDrawLine and XFillArc. Years ago, Solaris used to like to crash if you use XSHM, but Linux never had that problem. > Or fix the 3D drivers - they are definitely getting a lot more stable now I guess I must grudgingly agree with this. After all, now that I'm running recent non-free nvidia drivers on a recent-but-not-too-recent card, it's the first time since I stopped using Irix in 1998 that I'm able to wake up to a non-wedged X server. Multiple days in a row! Truly it is a new golden age. -- Jamie Zawinski jwz at jwz.org http://www.jwz.org/ jwz at dnalounge.com http://www.dnalounge.com/ http://jwz.livejournal.com/ From kyrre at solution-forge.net Wed Mar 2 20:39:54 2005 From: kyrre at solution-forge.net (Kyrre Ness Sjobak) Date: Wed, 02 Mar 2005 21:39:54 +0100 Subject: Hacking modversions In-Reply-To: <1109718603.14010.23.camel@daxter.boston.redhat.com> References: <1109709742.15242.8.camel@baythorne.infradead.org> <1109717812.15915.9.camel@dyckola> <1109718603.14010.23.camel@daxter.boston.redhat.com> Message-ID: <1109788544.30922.21.camel@localhost.localdomain> *snip* > > kernel-module-foobar 2.6.10-1.1154_FC4-module_foobar_version_042 > (meaning version 042 of foobar built against 2.6.10-1.1154_FC4) > > and it says > > Requires: kernel = 2.6.10-1.1154_FC4 > Conflicts: kernel > 2.6.10-1.1154_FC4 > > Now, next time user types 'yum update', suddenly > > kernel-2.6.10-1.1155_FC4 > > is available. However, kernel-module-foobar is not updated yet so the > update transaction fail (ok, maybe it's something other than Conflicts, > expert packagers would know). *snip* Or will yum just bail out "hey there is a conflict here, so i won't do ANYTHING AT ALL!!!*? From kyrre at solution-forge.net Wed Mar 2 20:39:56 2005 From: kyrre at solution-forge.net (Kyrre Ness Sjobak) Date: Wed, 02 Mar 2005 21:39:56 +0100 Subject: Intel Pro Wireless cards In-Reply-To: <4223CFA8.2000308@insitesinc.com> References: <4223505B.20402@snowmoon.com> <4223CFA8.2000308@insitesinc.com> Message-ID: <1109788921.30922.23.camel@localhost.localdomain> tir, 01.03.2005 kl. 03.12 skrev Michael Favia: > Eric Warnke wrote: > > > After reviewing the archives of the various lists I have found no > > discussion on the topic of wireless driver inclusion in FC. > > Along these same lines is the Ralink 2500/2400 chip sets. They power a > number of useful 802.11 b/g devices (most notably linksys PCI revision 4 > here in the US which is a large number of devices sold). They gpl'd > their source code back in December IIRC. As wireless NICs are becoming > more popular and network install approach "default" (with FC5 anaconda > and newly discussed capabilities) it will become increasingly more > important to get these "popular" cards under "Just Works" functionality > during installs. What is required to get ootb functionality for a device > like this? Here are some relevant links: > > Ralink site with source: > http://www.ralinktech.com.tw/supp-1.htm > > rt2x00 Open Source Project > http://rt2x00.serialmonkey.com/wiki/index.php/Main_Page > > -mf Same aplies to the adm8211 driver - its all GPL - and heading for the mainline kernel. It just needs to get all fixed up and "perfect" first :) From kyrre at solution-forge.net Wed Mar 2 20:39:57 2005 From: kyrre at solution-forge.net (Kyrre Ness Sjobak) Date: Wed, 02 Mar 2005 21:39:57 +0100 Subject: Why is sendmail bad? In-Reply-To: References: <20050224195343.GA17633@yoda.jdub.homelinux.org> <1109275608.7775.239.camel@serendipity.dogma.lan> <20050224205611.GB17728@yoda.jdub.homelinux.org> <1109279833.7775.251.camel@serendipity.dogma.lan> <1109288482.17967.28.camel@jdub.homelinux.org> <79FAA82857A03335BDEE9331@[10.0.0.4]> <1109441709.5970.15.camel@rousalka.dyndns.org> Message-ID: <1109789855.30922.25.camel@localhost.localdomain> man, 28.02.2005 kl. 17.55 skrev Kenneth Porter: > --On Saturday, February 26, 2005 7:15 PM +0100 Nicolas Mailhot > wrote: > > > The nice thing about a full-featured MTA with real local queues is your > > mail will still pass through when your ISP decides to do a big > > advertising campaign without upgrading its network first. > > I don't question the value of a full-featured MTA for an advanced user. I > just don't see it as being a required feature for a new user. > > Presumably the people installing Fedora who can't configure sendmail are > either home users (who have a full-featured ISP to operate a real MTA) or > business users operating behind a company MTA. AFAIK, Fedora isn't being > pushed as an "MTA training platform", so there's no need to keep one in the > Core product when it's tight for space. And if it's not tight for space, > one could still use a very simple outbound-only queuing MTA for the default > and make Postfix/Exim/Sendmail choices for advanced users. > Not having to start a mta at boot would make it boot quicker as well... From skvidal at phy.duke.edu Wed Mar 2 20:49:44 2005 From: skvidal at phy.duke.edu (seth vidal) Date: Wed, 02 Mar 2005 15:49:44 -0500 Subject: Hacking modversions In-Reply-To: <1109788544.30922.21.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <1109709742.15242.8.camel@baythorne.infradead.org> <1109717812.15915.9.camel@dyckola> <1109718603.14010.23.camel@daxter.boston.redhat.com> <1109788544.30922.21.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <1109796584.16819.0.camel@cutter> >> is available. However, kernel-module-foobar is not updated yet so the >> update transaction fail (ok, maybe it's something other than Conflicts, >> expert packagers would know). >*snip* > >Or will yum just bail out "hey there is a conflict here, so i won't do >ANYTHING AT ALL!!!*? If there is an explicit conflict, yes, yum will exit and report the conflicting packages. -sv From ville.skytta at iki.fi Wed Mar 2 20:48:22 2005 From: ville.skytta at iki.fi (Ville =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Skytt=E4?=) Date: Wed, 02 Mar 2005 22:48:22 +0200 Subject: Nethack (was: Re: Package pruning for FC4 and beyond) In-Reply-To: <20050302161353.GA733581@hiwaay.net> References: <422007DD.1020404@snowmoon.com> <42207BEB.7020000@snowmoon.com> <604aa79105022809106bd60c13@mail.gmail.com> <20050228183608.GD897460@hiwaay.net> <1109699593.15077.114.camel@bobcat.mine.nu> <20050302161353.GA733581@hiwaay.net> Message-ID: <1109796502.15077.262.camel@bobcat.mine.nu> On Wed, 2005-03-02 at 10:13 -0600, Chris Adams wrote: > Once upon a time, Ville Skytt said: > > On Mon, 2005-02-28 at 12:36 -0600, Chris Adams wrote: > > > Mmm... nethack. I had a good nethack package a while back; sounds like > > > a good excuse to clean it up and learn about maintaining a package in > > > Extras. > > > > Already there, "yum install nethack-falconseye". > > I saw that, but I want the current "real" nethack. As I tried to say, nethack-falconseye *includes* the "real" nethack (version 3.4.1, so it's lagging slightly behind). See my earlier post how to launch the "real" one instead of the fancy GUI. > I'll work on it when I get a chance. As long as a reasonably recent version of the traditional one is bundled in nethack-falconseye, I think that time would be better spent on something else. There should be a new NHFE release out soon, which will probably satisfy also the "current" part of what you want above. From kyrre at solution-forge.net Wed Mar 2 20:49:38 2005 From: kyrre at solution-forge.net (Kyrre Ness Sjobak) Date: Wed, 02 Mar 2005 21:49:38 +0100 Subject: Package pruning for FC4 and beyond In-Reply-To: <42260899.404@wowway.com> References: <422007DD.1020404@snowmoon.com> <42207BEB.7020000@snowmoon.com> <42207E54.9090902@feuerpokemon.de> <1109582014.5885.7.camel@perun.redhat.usu> <1109787449.30922.14.camel@localhost.localdomain> <42260899.404@wowway.com> Message-ID: <1109796578.30922.28.camel@localhost.localdomain> ons, 02.03.2005 kl. 19.40 skrev Demond James: > Kyrre Ness Sjobak wrote: > > >BTW, we must decide wether Fedora (core+extras(+livna)) should be > >self-containing, or if it should be as easy as possible to use as a > >platform for 3. party programs. I think it should be made as easy as > >possible to use as a platform, and not depend on the "all programs MUST > >come from RH/extras or they ar EVIL!" thinking we are seeing now... > > > >Kyrre > > > > > > > Where are you seeing that? You are seeing a discussion of Fedora > Core/Extras development. 3rd party development discussions are > elsewhere. 3rd party programs are welcomed. No it's just the common mentality i am seeing on these lists - if a lib isn't required for anything in core, drop it as fast as possible! From kyrre at solution-forge.net Wed Mar 2 20:53:12 2005 From: kyrre at solution-forge.net (Kyrre Ness Sjobak) Date: Wed, 02 Mar 2005 21:53:12 +0100 Subject: reducing distribution CD count In-Reply-To: <1109752160.5543.101.camel@cutter> References: <200502240906.20729.czar@czarc.net> <200503011707.19920.rjune@bravegnuworld.com> <20050301231355.0ed6511c@python2> <200503011721.32752.rjune@bravegnuworld.com> <20050302092156.400e6445@python2> <1109752160.5543.101.camel@cutter> Message-ID: <1109796791.30922.30.camel@localhost.localdomain> ons, 02.03.2005 kl. 09.29 skrev seth vidal: > >I really doubt it, as BZFlag 2 network play isn't compatible with BZFlag 1. > > and backward compat in games is an absolute must!!! > > :-D > -sv > extras? From sitsofe at yahoo.com Wed Mar 2 20:58:27 2005 From: sitsofe at yahoo.com (Sitsofe Wheeler) Date: Wed, 02 Mar 2005 20:58:27 +0000 Subject: reducing distribution CD count In-Reply-To: <4224E051.39E412B0@jwz.org> References: <200502240906.20729.czar@czarc.net> <20050224175035.22391185@python2> <20050301134557.GA7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> <4224E051.39E412B0@jwz.org> Message-ID: <1109797107.4336.21.camel@galvatron.localdomain> On Tue, 2005-03-01 at 13:36 -0800, Jamie Zawinski wrote: > Alan Cox wrote: > > And to debug 3D. We no longer have any way to debug 3D problems on Fedora > > with packages we know the client side of and build form. > > In my experience, xscreensaver is going to give the 3d hardware a much > more extensive workout than any given game. Maybe this has changed in > the latest Rawhide (I haven't checked) but it used to be that a Gnome > install came with the full complement of 3D savers. This used to be true for me too but the new "exercises 3D drivers like no other program" belongs to bzflag. Without fail every version has found something wrong in the binary nvidia drivers. The latest bzflag (version 2) now triggers a problem that causes X to take 100% of the CPU and nearly stops task switching completely. -- Sitsofe | http://sucs.org/~sits/ From shiva at sewingwitch.com Wed Mar 2 21:11:35 2005 From: shiva at sewingwitch.com (Kenneth Porter) Date: Wed, 02 Mar 2005 13:11:35 -0800 Subject: Hacking modversions In-Reply-To: <20050301211023.GD30940@ip68-4-98-123.oc.oc.cox.net> References: <4224C0B4.7010400@snowmoon.com> <1109705353.31304.27.camel@cutter> <20050301211023.GD30940@ip68-4-98-123.oc.oc.cox.net> Message-ID: <6554DA2268C423A92091F545@[10.0.0.14]> --On Tuesday, March 01, 2005 1:10 PM -0800 "Barry K. Nathan" wrote: > Perhaps DKMS would be a more suitable solution then... I'm reading the white paper and this looks like something that should be in Fedora, at least in Extras if not in Core. This paper posted on the DKMS project page is a pretty approachable introduction for driver developers and sysadmins: I was surprised when looking at my FC2 RPM directory that DKMS wasn't included, given how useful this looks. I'm not so much interested in drivers as experimental modules like the latest stuff in netfilter. (The U32 match target and the TARPIT destination look intriguing.) RH has a policy of not including these in its kernels, which is reasonable for the majority of users, but it would be great to be able to use something like DKMS to package and install these without needing a custom-compiled kernel. From jkeating at j2solutions.net Wed Mar 2 21:21:43 2005 From: jkeating at j2solutions.net (Jesse Keating) Date: Wed, 02 Mar 2005 13:21:43 -0800 Subject: reducing distribution CD count In-Reply-To: <1109797107.4336.21.camel@galvatron.localdomain> References: <200502240906.20729.czar@czarc.net> <20050224175035.22391185@python2> <20050301134557.GA7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> <4224E051.39E412B0@jwz.org> <1109797107.4336.21.camel@galvatron.localdomain> Message-ID: <1109798503.904.176.camel@jkeating2.hq.pogolinux.com> On Wed, 2005-03-02 at 20:58 +0000, Sitsofe Wheeler wrote: > This used to be true for me too but the new "exercises 3D drivers like > no other program" belongs to bzflag. Without fail every version has > found something wrong in the binary nvidia drivers. The latest bzflag > (version 2) now triggers a problem that causes X to take 100% of the > CPU > and nearly stops task switching completely. This would be useful if we shipped Nvidia drivers. Oh wait, they're probably in Extras right? -- Jesse Keating RHCE (geek.j2solutions.net) Fedora Legacy Team (www.fedoralegacy.org) GPG Public Key (geek.j2solutions.net/jkeating.j2solutions.pub) Was I helpful? Let others know: http://svcs.affero.net/rm.php?r=jkeating From paul at all-the-johnsons.co.uk Wed Mar 2 21:32:49 2005 From: paul at all-the-johnsons.co.uk (Paul) Date: Wed, 02 Mar 2005 21:32:49 +0000 Subject: rawhide report: 20050302 changes In-Reply-To: <20050302200750.7881d658@nausicaa.camperquake.de> References: <200503021815.j22IFnMu027490@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <20050302200750.7881d658@nausicaa.camperquake.de> Message-ID: <1109799170.7967.28.camel@localhost.localdomain> Hi, >> libgpg-error-1.0-2 >> ------------------ >> * Wed Mar 02 2005 Bill Nottingham - 1.0-2 >> - we can rebuild it. we have the technology. > >What exactly is that supposed to mean, anyway? Sounds like a line from >Star Trek :) Six million dollar man. TTFN Paul > -- "I like blinking me" - Helen, Big Brother 2 contestant -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part URL: From shiva at sewingwitch.com Wed Mar 2 21:42:41 2005 From: shiva at sewingwitch.com (Kenneth Porter) Date: Wed, 02 Mar 2005 13:42:41 -0800 Subject: rawhide report: 20050302 changes In-Reply-To: <1109799170.7967.28.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <200503021815.j22IFnMu027490@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <20050302200750.7881d658@nausicaa.camperquake.de> <1109799170.7967.28.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <12511F77AFBCFEDE2EDAD3C2@[10.0.0.14]> --On Wednesday, March 02, 2005 9:32 PM +0000 Paul wrote: >>> libgpg-error-1.0-2 >>> ------------------ >>> * Wed Mar 02 2005 Bill Nottingham - 1.0-2 >>> - we can rebuild it. we have the technology. >> >> What exactly is that supposed to mean, anyway? Sounds like a line from >> Star Trek :) > > Six million dollar man. Boy, that dates us. How many people recognize Lee Majors in the latest IBM laptop commercial with the biometric fingerprint reader? From mpeters at mac.com Wed Mar 2 21:44:42 2005 From: mpeters at mac.com (Michael A. Peters) Date: Wed, 02 Mar 2005 21:44:42 +0000 Subject: Hacking modversions In-Reply-To: <604aa791050302055775346f43@mail.gmail.com> (from jspaleta@gmail.com on Wed Mar 2 05:57:42 2005) References: <1109752954l.2425l.1l@devel.mpeters.us> <604aa791050302055775346f43@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1109799882l.6816l.0l@devel.mpeters.us> On 03/02/2005 05:57:42 AM, Jeff Spaleta wrote: > > DKMS > http://linux.dell.com/projects.shtml That looks wicked :) -- Michael A. Peters http://mpeters.us/ From dmalcolm at redhat.com Wed Mar 2 21:47:30 2005 From: dmalcolm at redhat.com (David Malcolm) Date: Wed, 02 Mar 2005 16:47:30 -0500 Subject: rawhide report: 20050302 changes In-Reply-To: <1109793104.23488.2.camel@one.myworld> References: <200503021815.j22IFnMu027490@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <1109793104.23488.2.camel@one.myworld> Message-ID: <1109800050.23341.52.camel@cassandra.boston.redhat.com> On Wed, 2005-03-02 at 20:51 +0100, F?liciano Matias wrote: >Le mercredi 02 mars 2005 ? 13:15 -0500, Build System a ?crit : >> evolution-2.1.6-2 >> ----------------- >> ... >> * Tue Mar 01 2005 David Malcolm - 2.1.6-1 >> - Update from upstream unstable 2.1.6 to 2.1.6 > >fascinating You spotted the deliberate mistake then! The even-less deliberate mistake was that evolution-data-server managed to link against an earlier version of itself due to some libtool snarl-up, which will give you an unresolved libegroupwise-1.2.so.4 dependency. Should be fixed in tomorrow's build. Dave From paul at all-the-johnsons.co.uk Wed Mar 2 21:50:24 2005 From: paul at all-the-johnsons.co.uk (Paul) Date: Wed, 02 Mar 2005 21:50:24 +0000 Subject: rawhide report: 20050302 changes In-Reply-To: <12511F77AFBCFEDE2EDAD3C2@[10.0.0.14]> References: <200503021815.j22IFnMu027490@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <20050302200750.7881d658@nausicaa.camperquake.de> <1109799170.7967.28.camel@localhost.localdomain> <12511F77AFBCFEDE2EDAD3C2@[10.0.0.14]> Message-ID: <1109800224.7967.30.camel@localhost.localdomain> Hi, On Wed, 2005-03-02 at 13:42 -0800, Kenneth Porter wrote: >> Six million dollar man. > >Boy, that dates us. Nah, we just claim that we'd seen a repeat on the Sci Fi channel! TTFN Paul > -- "I like blinking me" - Helen, Big Brother 2 contestant -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part URL: From dnjinc at wowway.com Wed Mar 2 22:20:41 2005 From: dnjinc at wowway.com (Demond James) Date: Wed, 02 Mar 2005 17:20:41 -0500 Subject: reducing distribution CD count In-Reply-To: <1109798503.904.176.camel@jkeating2.hq.pogolinux.com> References: <200502240906.20729.czar@czarc.net> <20050224175035.22391185@python2> <20050301134557.GA7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> <4224E051.39E412B0@jwz.org> <1109797107.4336.21.camel@galvatron.localdomain> <1109798503.904.176.camel@jkeating2.hq.pogolinux.com> Message-ID: <42263C39.5010408@wowway.com> Jesse Keating wrote: >On Wed, 2005-03-02 at 20:58 +0000, Sitsofe Wheeler wrote: > > >>This used to be true for me too but the new "exercises 3D drivers like >>no other program" belongs to bzflag. Without fail every version has >>found something wrong in the binary nvidia drivers. The latest bzflag >>(version 2) now triggers a problem that causes X to take 100% of the >>CPU >>and nearly stops task switching completely. >> >> > >This would be useful if we shipped Nvidia drivers. Oh wait, they're >probably in Extras right? > > > It would be nice if Extras could be a network of Fedora/Red Hat certified repos hosted by individual hardware providers and software developers. FE would have one main list that tells the package update tool where to find the files. That would save Red Hat from trying to host every software for FCx on their server. If that buildsystem that has been talked about actually materializes, it can be used for this effort. Instead of submitting the actual SRPM, the software/hardware vendor would host the binary rpms and FE would have the information to grab these rpms form that location. Most likely the current repo/metadata setup will have to be extended to handle this. Not that I want to take away from the work of repo maintainers. Perhaps 3rd party repos could be one of the sources in the certified list (for some individual packages not their entire repo). Also, proprietary software companies like skype and adobe, who don't want to release their source code but want to build their software for Fedora/Linux can utilizes this. There would have to be a certification process ofcourse along with some other legalities. Just an idea! -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jkeating at j2solutions.net Wed Mar 2 22:32:13 2005 From: jkeating at j2solutions.net (Jesse Keating) Date: Wed, 02 Mar 2005 14:32:13 -0800 Subject: reducing distribution CD count In-Reply-To: <42263C39.5010408@wowway.com> References: <200502240906.20729.czar@czarc.net> <20050224175035.22391185@python2> <20050301134557.GA7968@devserv.devel.redhat.com> <4224E051.39E412B0@jwz.org> <1109797107.4336.21.camel@galvatron.localdomain> <1109798503.904.176.camel@jkeating2.hq.pogolinux.com> <42263C39.5010408@wowway.com> Message-ID: <1109802733.904.194.camel@jkeating2.hq.pogolinux.com> On Wed, 2005-03-02 at 17:20 -0500, Demond James wrote: > It would be nice if Extras could be a network of Fedora/Red Hat > certified repos hosted by individual hardware providers and software > developers. FE would have one main list that tells the package update > tool where to find the files. That would save Red Hat from trying to > host every software for FCx on their server. That would be sortof nightmarish, the legalities alone boggle my feeble mind. > If that buildsystem that has been talked about actually materializes, > it can be used for this effort. Instead of submitting the actual > SRPM, the software/hardware vendor would host the binary rpms and FE > would have the information to grab these rpms form that location. > Most likely the current repo/metadata setup will have to be extended > to handle this. Not that I want to take away from the work of repo > maintainers. Perhaps 3rd party repos could be one of the sources in > the certified list (for some individual packages not their entire > repo). Also, proprietary software companies like skype and adobe, who > don't want to release their source code but want to build their > software for Fedora/Linux can utilizes this. Extras can only contain FOSS. > There would have to be a certification process ofcourse along with > some other legalities. > > Just an idea! -- Jesse Keating RHCE (geek.j2solutions.net) Fedora Legacy Team (www.fedoralegacy.org) GPG Public Key (geek.j2solutions.net/jkeating.j2solutions.pub) Was I helpful? Let others know: http://svcs.affero.net/rm.php?r=jkeating From mfioretti at mclink.it Wed Mar 2 22:37:45 2005 From: mfioretti at mclink.it (M. Fioretti) Date: Wed, 2 Mar 2005 23:37:45 +0100 Subject: ANNOUNCE: RULE installers for Fedora Core 3 Message-ID: <20050302223745.GH3415@mclink.it> Greetings, everybody! I am happy to announce that the RULE project is back, allowing to install modern software like Fedora Core 3 on so-called "obsolete" hardware. Details at http://www.rule-project.org/breve.php3?id_breve=19 Users, testers and people helping us to update/check the documentation are more than welcome! Thanks for your attention, Marco Fioretti RULE project coordinator -- Marco Fioretti mfioretti, at the server mclink.it Red Hat & Fedora for low memory http://www.rule-project.org/ Don't think that a small group of dedicated individuals can't change the world. it's the only thing that ever has. (read on /.) From jon at jonshouse.co.uk Wed Mar 2 22:45:34 2005 From: jon at jonshouse.co.uk (Unknown) Date: Wed, 02 Mar 2005 22:45:34 +0000 Subject: Core 3 Xinerama and KDE Message-ID: <1109803534.11811.6.camel@jonspc> I've just upgraded from Redhat9 to Core 3. I've got a dual head g450 with dual monitors and I notice that KDE refuses to open windows onto the second workspace. I can manually move the window onto the second monitor, but the window manager refuses to use it automatically even if its blank. My question is who do I file this sort of bug with ? Is it a window manager problem (kde) or an X problem (Xinerama) or some Redhat tweak - is their a "general bugs" system I can file against ? Cheers, Jon From mbneto at gmail.com Wed Mar 2 23:04:13 2005 From: mbneto at gmail.com (mbneto) Date: Wed, 2 Mar 2005 19:04:13 -0400 Subject: rawhide report: 20050301 changes In-Reply-To: <20050302200419.063140fb@nausicaa.camperquake.de> References: <200503011908.j21J8lsr013948@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <4225E31E.3010902@redhat.com> <5cf776b805030208167b4b4bd9@mail.gmail.com> <20050302200419.063140fb@nausicaa.camperquake.de> Message-ID: <5cf776b80503021504da6b84f@mail.gmail.com> any idea of when ? > > > How about those error messages > > > > .. > > Most of those ought to be gone once kde gets it's openssl dependency right. > From michael.favia at insitesinc.com Wed Mar 2 23:14:01 2005 From: michael.favia at insitesinc.com (Michael Favia) Date: Wed, 02 Mar 2005 17:14:01 -0600 Subject: rawhide report: 20050302 changes In-Reply-To: <200503021815.j22IFnMu027490@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> References: <200503021815.j22IFnMu027490@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> Message-ID: <422648B9.8070300@insitesinc.com> Build System wrote: >hpijs-1.7.1-3 >------------- >* Tue Mar 01 2005 Tim Waugh 1.7.1-3 >- Rebuilt for new GCC. > > Isnt hplip the preferred driver assortment from HP these days? Im unaware of any conflicts so i dont mean to step on anyones toes but is there any reason they arent being included in rawhide/for fc4? The project unifies hpijs and provides a unified single and multi-function connectivity solution to some 300 hp models (printing, faxing, scanning, photo-card access, and device management ). It also seems to have worked a good number of the bugs out and seems to be the recommended default from HP. The driver architecture sure looks pretty: http://hpinkjet.sourceforge.net/architecture.php and it works for me locally for sometime. -mf From rodd at clarkson.id.au Wed Mar 2 23:33:28 2005 From: rodd at clarkson.id.au (Rodd Clarkson) Date: Thu, 03 Mar 2005 10:33:28 +1100 Subject: rawhide report: 20050301 changes In-Reply-To: <1109788217.30922.19.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <200503011908.j21J8lsr013948@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <1109788217.30922.19.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <1109806409.3652.1.camel@trevally.redfishdemo.com> On Wed, 2005-03-02 at 19:30 +0100, Kyrre Ness Sjobak wrote: >> Removed package gcc4 > >Hmm? Didn't somebody just say "fc4 has gcc 4 as default"?!? Well, after that barrage of responses, I think Kyrre might have learnt something (maybe not to ask in the future) Kyrre, don't feel victimized over this. None of them slept well last night and they just needed to get out the angst. ;-] R. > From rodd at clarkson.id.au Wed Mar 2 23:49:39 2005 From: rodd at clarkson.id.au (Rodd Clarkson) Date: Thu, 03 Mar 2005 10:49:39 +1100 Subject: Intel Pro Wireless cards In-Reply-To: <4223CFA8.2000308@insitesinc.com> References: <4223505B.20402@snowmoon.com> <4223CFA8.2000308@insitesinc.com> Message-ID: <1109807380.3652.11.camel@trevally.redfishdemo.com> On Mon, 2005-02-28 at 20:12 -0600, Michael Favia wrote: >Eric Warnke wrote: > >> After reviewing the archives of the various lists I have found no >> discussion on the topic of wireless driver inclusion in FC. > >Along these same lines is the Ralink 2500/2400 chip sets. They power a >number of useful 802.11 b/g devices (most notably linksys PCI revision 4 >here in the US which is a large number of devices sold). They gpl'd >their source code back in December IIRC. As wireless NICs are becoming >more popular and network install approach "default" (with FC5 anaconda >and newly discussed capabilities) it will become increasingly more >important to get these "popular" cards under "Just Works" functionality >during installs. What is required to get ootb functionality for a device >like this? Here are some relevant links: > >Ralink site with source: >http://www.ralinktech.com.tw/supp-1.htm > >rt2x00 Open Source Project >http://rt2x00.serialmonkey.com/wiki/index.php/Main_Page > Having followed the rt2x00 development I know the guys are keen to get this driver in the kernel eventually. The rt2x00 cards are avaiable cheaply in Australia in both PCI and PCMCIA formats and work well, so there's quite a few people using them The intention is the unify their rt2400 and rt2500 drivers in a completely new base currently under development, the rt2x00. This driver compiles (sometimes) but isn't close to use, however they are working hard too make sure that it's fit for inclusion in the kernel at such a time that it is ready (whatever that means). The rt2x00 is intended to share wireless infrastructure in the kernel. It will also move from using ra[x] as it's device name (something that comes from the RaLink driver) to using a more appropriate device name in line with current kernel thinking (I think this means using eth[x], but there seems to be another identifier used for some wireless cards, so this needs to be thought through.) One think I'm sure of is that they would welcome anyone willing to get in and contribute the the development of the new (or exisiting) drivers. Hope that gives a little heads up. Rodd From rodd at clarkson.id.au Wed Mar 2 23:54:19 2005 From: rodd at clarkson.id.au (Rodd Clarkson) Date: Thu, 03 Mar 2005 10:54:19 +1100 Subject: rawhide report: 20050302 changes In-Reply-To: <200503021815.j22IFnMu027490@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> References: <200503021815.j22IFnMu027490@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> Message-ID: <1109807659.3652.16.camel@trevally.redfishdemo.com> On Wed, 2005-03-02 at 13:15 -0500, Build System wrote: >kernel-2.6.10-1.1162_FC4 >------------------------ >* Tue Mar 01 2005 David Woodhouse >- Fix ppc/ppc64/ppc64iseries builds for gcc 4.0 >- Fix Xen build too > >* Mon Feb 28 2005 Dave Jones >- 2.6.11-rc5-bk3 >- Various compile fixes for building with gcc-4.0 Hmmm, I just got the following output updating the kernel using yum update. (I haven't tried the new kernel yet, but wanted to get the output onto the list in case it's important. I'll concede that I've been having some strange update issues (mostly reported) of late and that my rawhide install might well be a little sketchy. I'm intending to try a complete rawhide install this weekend using the img to install, but I'd hate to waste this sort of information if it is relevant.) Here's the output: [rodd at trevally ~]$ sudo yum update kernel Setting up Update Process Setting up Repos development 100% |=========================| 1.1 kB 00:00 Reading repository metadata in from local files developmen: ################################################## 3596/3596 Resolving Dependencies --> Populating transaction set with selected packages. Please wait. ---> Package kernel.i686 0:2.6.10-1.1162_FC4 set to be installed --> Running transaction check Dependencies Resolved Transaction Listing: Install: kernel.i686 0:2.6.10-1.1162_FC4 - development Total download size: 12 M Is this ok [y/N]: y Downloading Packages: (1/1): kernel-2.6.10-1.11 100% |=========================| 12 MB 04:34 Running Transaction Test Finished Transaction Test Transaction Test Succeeded Running Transaction Installing: kernel ######################### [1/1] WARNING: /lib/modules/2.6.10-1.1162_FC4/kernel/drivers/isdn/hardware/avm/b1.ko needs unknown symbol b1_exit WARNING: /lib/modules/2.6.10-1.1162_FC4/kernel/drivers/scsi/qlogicfas408.ko needs unknown symbol qlogicfas408_exit WARNING: /lib/modules/2.6.10-1.1162_FC4/kernel/drivers/scsi/qlogicfas408.ko needs unknown symbol qlogicfas408_init WARNING: /lib/modules/2.6.10-1.1162_FC4/kernel/drivers/md/xor.ko needs unknown symbol xor_exit WARNING: /lib/modules/2.6.10-1.1162_FC4/kernel/drivers/media/common/saa7146_vv.ko needs unknown symbol saa7146_vv_cleanup_module WARNING: /lib/modules/2.6.10-1.1162_FC4/kernel/drivers/media/common/saa7146_vv.ko needs unknown symbol saa7146_vv_init_module WARNING: /lib/modules/2.6.10-1.1162_FC4/kernel/drivers/media/common/saa7146.ko needs unknown symbol saa7146_cleanup_module WARNING: /lib/modules/2.6.10-1.1162_FC4/kernel/drivers/net/wireless/orinoco.ko needs unknown symbol exit_orinoco WARNING: /lib/modules/2.6.10-1.1162_FC4/kernel/drivers/net/wireless/hermes.ko needs unknown symbol exit_hermes WARNING: /lib/modules/2.6.10-1.1162_FC4/kernel/drivers/net/wireless/hermes.ko needs unknown symbol init_hermes WARNING: /lib/modules/2.6.10-1.1162_FC4/kernel/drivers/usb/atm/usb_atm.ko needs unknown symbol udsl_usb_exit WARNING: /lib/modules/2.6.10-1.1162_FC4/kernel/sound/drivers/mpu401/snd-mpu401-uart.ko needs unknown symbol alsa_mpu401_uart_init WARNING: /lib/modules/2.6.10-1.1162_FC4/kernel/sound/drivers/mpu401/snd-mpu401-uart.ko needs unknown symbol alsa_mpu401_uart_exit WARNING: /lib/modules/2.6.10-1.1162_FC4/kernel/sound/drivers/vx/snd-vx-lib.ko needs unknown symbol alsa_vx_core_exit WARNING: /lib/modules/2.6.10-1.1162_FC4/kernel/sound/drivers/vx/snd-vx-lib.ko needs unknown symbol alsa_vx_core_init WARNING: /lib/modules/2.6.10-1.1162_FC4/kernel/sound/drivers/opl3/snd-opl3-lib.ko needs unknown symbol alsa_opl3_init WARNING: /lib/modules/2.6.10-1.1162_FC4/kernel/sound/drivers/opl3/snd-opl3-lib.ko needs unknown symbol alsa_opl3_exit WARNING: /lib/modules/2.6.10-1.1162_FC4/kernel/sound/drivers/opl4/snd-opl4-lib.ko needs unknown symbol alsa_opl4_init WARNING: /lib/modules/2.6.10-1.1162_FC4/kernel/sound/drivers/opl4/snd-opl4-lib.ko needs unknown symbol alsa_opl4_exit WARNING: /lib/modules/2.6.10-1.1162_FC4/kernel/sound/pci/ac97/snd-ak4531-codec.ko needs unknown symbol alsa_ak4531_init WARNING: /lib/modules/2.6.10-1.1162_FC4/kernel/sound/pci/ac97/snd-ak4531-codec.ko needs unknown symbol alsa_ak4531_exit WARNING: /lib/modules/2.6.10-1.1162_FC4/kernel/sound/pci/ac97/snd-ac97-codec.ko needs unknown symbol alsa_ac97_exit WARNING: /lib/modules/2.6.10-1.1162_FC4/kernel/sound/pci/ac97/snd-ac97-codec.ko needs unknown symbol alsa_ac97_init WARNING: /lib/modules/2.6.10-1.1162_FC4/kernel/sound/pci/ice1712/snd-ice17xx-ak4xxx.ko needs unknown symbol alsa_ice1712_akm4xxx_module_init WARNING: /lib/modules/2.6.10-1.1162_FC4/kernel/sound/pci/ice1712/snd-ice17xx-ak4xxx.ko needs unknown symbol alsa_ice1712_akm4xxx_module_exit WARNING: /lib/modules/2.6.10-1.1162_FC4/kernel/sound/isa/cs423x/snd-cs4236-lib.ko needs unknown symbol alsa_cs4236_exit WARNING: /lib/modules/2.6.10-1.1162_FC4/kernel/sound/isa/cs423x/snd-cs4236-lib.ko needs unknown symbol alsa_cs4236_init WARNING: /lib/modules/2.6.10-1.1162_FC4/kernel/sound/isa/cs423x/snd-cs4231-lib.ko needs unknown symbol alsa_cs4231_exit WARNING: /lib/modules/2.6.10-1.1162_FC4/kernel/sound/isa/cs423x/snd-cs4231-lib.ko needs unknown symbol alsa_cs4231_init WARNING: /lib/modules/2.6.10-1.1162_FC4/kernel/sound/isa/sb/snd-sb16-csp.ko needs unknown symbol alsa_sb_csp_init WARNING: /lib/modules/2.6.10-1.1162_FC4/kernel/sound/isa/sb/snd-sb16-csp.ko needs unknown symbol alsa_sb_csp_exit WARNING: /lib/modules/2.6.10-1.1162_FC4/kernel/sound/isa/sb/snd-sb-common.ko needs unknown symbol alsa_sb_common_exit WARNING: /lib/modules/2.6.10-1.1162_FC4/kernel/sound/isa/sb/snd-sb-common.ko needs unknown symbol alsa_sb_common_init WARNING: /lib/modules/2.6.10-1.1162_FC4/kernel/sound/isa/sb/snd-sb16-dsp.ko needs unknown symbol alsa_sb16_init WARNING: /lib/modules/2.6.10-1.1162_FC4/kernel/sound/isa/sb/snd-sb16-dsp.ko needs unknown symbol alsa_sb16_exit WARNING: /lib/modules/2.6.10-1.1162_FC4/kernel/sound/isa/sb/snd-sb8-dsp.ko needs unknown symbol alsa_sb8_init WARNING: /lib/modules/2.6.10-1.1162_FC4/kernel/sound/isa/sb/snd-sb8-dsp.ko needs unknown symbol alsa_sb8_exit WARNING: /lib/modules/2.6.10-1.1162_FC4/kernel/sound/isa/gus/snd-gus-lib.ko needs unknown symbol alsa_gus_init WARNING: /lib/modules/2.6.10-1.1162_FC4/kernel/sound/isa/gus/snd-gus-lib.ko needs unknown symbol alsa_gus_exit WARNING: /lib/modules/2.6.10-1.1162_FC4/kernel/sound/isa/es1688/snd-es1688-lib.ko needs unknown symbol alsa_es1688_init WARNING: /lib/modules/2.6.10-1.1162_FC4/kernel/sound/isa/es1688/snd-es1688-lib.ko needs unknown symbol alsa_es1688_exit WARNING: /lib/modules/2.6.10-1.1162_FC4/kernel/sound/isa/ad1848/snd-ad1848-lib.ko needs unknown symbol alsa_ad1848_exit WARNING: /lib/modules/2.6.10-1.1162_FC4/kernel/sound/isa/ad1848/snd-ad1848-lib.ko needs unknown symbol alsa_ad1848_init WARNING: /lib/modules/2.6.10-1.1162_FC4/kernel/sound/isa/ad1816a/snd-ad1816a-lib.ko needs unknown symbol alsa_ad1816a_init WARNING: /lib/modules/2.6.10-1.1162_FC4/kernel/sound/isa/ad1816a/snd-ad1816a-lib.ko needs unknown symbol alsa_ad1816a_exit WARNING: /lib/modules/2.6.10-1.1162_FC4/kernel/sound/core/seq/instr/snd-ainstr-fm.ko needs unknown symbol alsa_ainstr_fm_exit WARNING: /lib/modules/2.6.10-1.1162_FC4/kernel/sound/core/seq/instr/snd-ainstr-fm.ko needs unknown symbol alsa_ainstr_fm_init WARNING: /lib/modules/2.6.10-1.1162_FC4/kernel/sound/core/seq/instr/snd-ainstr-iw.ko needs unknown symbol alsa_ainstr_iw_exit WARNING: /lib/modules/2.6.10-1.1162_FC4/kernel/sound/core/seq/instr/snd-ainstr-iw.ko needs unknown symbol alsa_ainstr_iw_init WARNING: /lib/modules/2.6.10-1.1162_FC4/kernel/sound/core/seq/instr/snd-ainstr-simple.ko needs unknown symbol alsa_ainstr_simple_init WARNING: /lib/modules/2.6.10-1.1162_FC4/kernel/sound/core/seq/instr/snd-ainstr-simple.ko needs unknown symbol alsa_ainstr_simple_exit WARNING: /lib/modules/2.6.10-1.1162_FC4/kernel/sound/core/seq/instr/snd-ainstr-gf1.ko needs unknown symbol alsa_ainstr_gf1_init WARNING: /lib/modules/2.6.10-1.1162_FC4/kernel/sound/core/seq/instr/snd-ainstr-gf1.ko needs unknown symbol alsa_ainstr_gf1_exit WARNING: /lib/modules/2.6.10-1.1162_FC4/kernel/sound/core/seq/snd-seq-midi-emul.ko needs unknown symbol alsa_seq_midi_emul_exit WARNING: /lib/modules/2.6.10-1.1162_FC4/kernel/sound/core/seq/snd-seq-midi-emul.ko needs unknown symbol alsa_seq_midi_emul_init WARNING: /lib/modules/2.6.10-1.1162_FC4/kernel/sound/core/seq/snd-seq-virmidi.ko needs unknown symbol alsa_virmidi_exit WARNING: /lib/modules/2.6.10-1.1162_FC4/kernel/sound/core/seq/snd-seq-virmidi.ko needs unknown symbol alsa_virmidi_init WARNING: /lib/modules/2.6.10-1.1162_FC4/kernel/sound/core/seq/snd-seq-instr.ko needs unknown symbol alsa_seq_instr_exit WARNING: /lib/modules/2.6.10-1.1162_FC4/kernel/sound/core/seq/snd-seq-instr.ko needs unknown symbol alsa_seq_instr_init WARNING: /lib/modules/2.6.10-1.1162_FC4/kernel/sound/i2c/snd-i2c.ko needs unknown symbol alsa_i2c_init WARNING: /lib/modules/2.6.10-1.1162_FC4/kernel/sound/i2c/snd-i2c.ko needs unknown symbol alsa_i2c_exit WARNING: /lib/modules/2.6.10-1.1162_FC4/kernel/sound/i2c/snd-cs8427.ko needs unknown symbol alsa_cs8427_module_exit WARNING: /lib/modules/2.6.10-1.1162_FC4/kernel/sound/i2c/snd-cs8427.ko needs unknown symbol alsa_cs8427_module_init WARNING: /lib/modules/2.6.10-1.1162_FC4/kernel/sound/i2c/other/snd-ak4xxx-adda.ko needs unknown symbol alsa_akm4xxx_module_exit WARNING: /lib/modules/2.6.10-1.1162_FC4/kernel/sound/i2c/other/snd-ak4xxx-adda.ko needs unknown symbol alsa_akm4xxx_module_init WARNING: /lib/modules/2.6.10-1.1162_FC4/kernel/sound/i2c/other/snd-tea575x-tuner.ko needs unknown symbol alsa_tea575x_module_exit WARNING: /lib/modules/2.6.10-1.1162_FC4/kernel/sound/i2c/other/snd-tea575x-tuner.ko needs unknown symbol alsa_tea575x_module_init WARNING: /lib/modules/2.6.10-1.1162_FC4/kernel/sound/i2c/snd-tea6330t.ko needs unknown symbol alsa_tea6330t_exit WARNING: /lib/modules/2.6.10-1.1162_FC4/kernel/sound/i2c/snd-tea6330t.ko needs unknown symbol alsa_tea6330t_init WARNING: /lib/modules/2.6.10-1.1162_FC4/kernel/sound/synth/snd-util-mem.ko needs unknown symbol alsa_util_mem_exit WARNING: /lib/modules/2.6.10-1.1162_FC4/kernel/sound/synth/snd-util-mem.ko needs unknown symbol alsa_util_mem_init WARNING: /lib/modules/2.6.10-1.1162_FC4/kernel/sound/synth/emux/snd-emux-synth.ko needs unknown symbol alsa_emux_init WARNING: /lib/modules/2.6.10-1.1162_FC4/kernel/sound/synth/emux/snd-emux-synth.ko needs unknown symbol alsa_emux_exit Installed: kernel.i686 0:2.6.10-1.1162_FC4 Complete! [rodd at trevally ~]$ From davej at redhat.com Wed Mar 2 23:56:52 2005 From: davej at redhat.com (Dave Jones) Date: Wed, 2 Mar 2005 18:56:52 -0500 Subject: rawhide report: 20050302 changes In-Reply-To: <1109807659.3652.16.camel@trevally.redfishdemo.com> References: <200503021815.j22IFnMu027490@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <1109807659.3652.16.camel@trevally.redfishdemo.com> Message-ID: <20050302235652.GG10124@redhat.com> On Thu, Mar 03, 2005 at 10:54:19AM +1100, Rodd Clarkson wrote: > WARNING: /lib/modules/2.6.10-1.1162_FC4/kernel/drivers/isdn/hardware/avm/b1.ko needs unknown symbol b1_exit > WARNING: /lib/modules/2.6.10-1.1162_FC4/kernel/drivers/scsi/qlogicfas408.ko needs unknown symbol qlogicfas408_exit > WARNING: /lib/modules/2.6.10-1.1162_FC4/kernel/drivers/scsi/qlogicfas408.ko needs unknown symbol qlogicfas408_init bugzilla 150150 Dave From ellson at research.att.com Wed Mar 2 23:57:41 2005 From: ellson at research.att.com (John Ellson) Date: Wed, 02 Mar 2005 18:57:41 -0500 Subject: rawhide report: 20050302 changes In-Reply-To: <422648B9.8070300@insitesinc.com> References: <200503021815.j22IFnMu027490@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <422648B9.8070300@insitesinc.com> Message-ID: <422652F5.7000500@research.att.com> Michael Favia wrote: > Build System wrote: > >> hpijs-1.7.1-3 >> ------------- >> * Tue Mar 01 2005 Tim Waugh 1.7.1-3 >> - Rebuilt for new GCC. >> >> > Isnt hplip the preferred driver assortment from HP these days? Im > unaware of any conflicts so i dont mean to step on anyones toes but is > there any reason they arent being included in rawhide/for fc4? The > project unifies hpijs and provides a unified single and multi-function > connectivity solution to some 300 hp models (printing, faxing, > scanning, photo-card access, and device management ). It also seems to > have worked a good number of the bugs out and seems to be the > recommended default from HP. The driver architecture sure looks > pretty: http://hpinkjet.sourceforge.net/architecture.php and it works > for me locally for sometime. > > -mf > It sure would be nice to get rid of the hpoj + ptal_ nonsense, but perhaps its not being included because it doesn't build with gcc 4? /usr/bin/gcc -DPACKAGE_NAME=\"\" -DPACKAGE_TARNAME=\"\" -DPACKAGE_VERSION=\"\" -DPACKAGE_STRING=\"\" -DPACKAGE_BUGREPORT=\"\" -DPACKAGE=\"hplip\" -DVERSION=\"0.8.8\" -DSTDC_HEADERS=1 -DHAVE_SYS_TYPES_H=1 -DHAVE_SYS_STAT_H=1 -DHAVE_STDLIB_H=1 -DHAVE_STRING_H=1 -DHAVE_MEMORY_H=1 -DHAVE_STRINGS_H=1 -DHAVE_INTTYPES_H=1 -DHAVE_STDINT_H=1 -DHAVE_UNISTD_H=1 -DHAVE_DLFCN_H=1 -DHAVE_LIBPTHREAD=1 -DHAVE_LIBCRYPTO=1 -DSTDC_HEADERS=1 -DHAVE_CUPS_CUPS_H=1 -DHAVE_NET_SNMP_NET_SNMP_CONFIG_H=1 -DHAVE_PYTHON2_4_PYTHON_H=1 -I. -I. -g -O2 -MT xjpg_fix.lo -MD -MP -MF .deps/xjpg_fix.Tpo -c ip/xjpg_fix.c -fPIC -DPIC -o .libs/xjpg_fix.o ip/xjpg_fix.c: In function 'jpgFix_getActualTraits': ip/xjpg_fix.c:512: error: invalid lvalue in assignment ip/xjpg_fix.c:533: error: invalid lvalue in assignment ip/xjpg_fix.c:549: error: invalid lvalue in assignment ip/xjpg_fix.c:560: error: invalid lvalue in assignment ip/xjpg_fix.c:581: error: invalid lvalue in assignment ip/xjpg_fix.c:587: error: invalid lvalue in assignment ip/xjpg_fix.c:595: error: invalid lvalue in assignment ip/xjpg_fix.c:605: error: invalid lvalue in assignment ip/xjpg_fix.c:610: error: invalid lvalue in assignment make[1]: *** [xjpg_fix.lo] Error 1 John From rodd at clarkson.id.au Thu Mar 3 00:18:52 2005 From: rodd at clarkson.id.au (Rodd Clarkson) Date: Thu, 03 Mar 2005 11:18:52 +1100 Subject: rawhide report: 20050302 changes In-Reply-To: <20050302235652.GG10124@redhat.com> References: <200503021815.j22IFnMu027490@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <1109807659.3652.16.camel@trevally.redfishdemo.com> <20050302235652.GG10124@redhat.com> Message-ID: <1109809132.3553.3.camel@trevally.redfishdemo.com> On Wed, 2005-03-02 at 18:56 -0500, Dave Jones wrote: >On Thu, Mar 03, 2005 at 10:54:19AM +1100, Rodd Clarkson wrote: > > > > WARNING: /lib/modules/2.6.10-1.1162_FC4/kernel/drivers/isdn/hardware/avm/b1.ko needs unknown symbol b1_exit > > WARNING: /lib/modules/2.6.10-1.1162_FC4/kernel/drivers/scsi/qlogicfas408.ko needs unknown symbol qlogicfas408_exit > > WARNING: /lib/modules/2.6.10-1.1162_FC4/kernel/drivers/scsi/qlogicfas408.ko needs unknown symbol qlogicfas408_init > >bugzilla 150150 Right. Thanks for that. I also had problems with the network thinking it was both up and down. I got some error messages during boot that suggested that the network (eth0) hadn't started properly (and the usual resulting problems of ntpd not getting the time because the interface wasn't up) but ifconfig said the card had an IP address and it had a hostname (that comes from a DHCPd on another server) so the interface had worked at some stage. I couldn't boot into GNOME because it said it couldn't resolve the hostname. Very weird. I'll find out more if you think it's useful (I forgot to save dmesg) but could reboot if you think it might be useful for finding out more. Or, I'm happy to ignore the current kernel and wait until a new one arrives. Rodd From zaitcev at redhat.com Thu Mar 3 00:50:10 2005 From: zaitcev at redhat.com (Pete Zaitcev) Date: Wed, 2 Mar 2005 16:50:10 -0800 Subject: 2.6.11 ALPS Issue In-Reply-To: References: <1109788024.3327.28.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> Message-ID: <20050302165010.2c9b5a1e@localhost.localdomain> On Wed, 02 Mar 2005 11:52:42 -0700, Dax Kelson wrote: > -------- Forwarded Message -------- > From: Dmitry Torokhov > Reply-To: dtor_core at ameritech.net > To: MIGUELANXO at telefonica.net > Cc: linux-kernel at vger.kernel.org > Subject: Re: 2.6.11: touchpad unresponsive > Date: Wed, 2 Mar 2005 12:12:53 -0500 > > Booting X in new kernel makes my touchpad very unresponsive. I can't > > click any longer in the touchpad area, and the touchpad doesn't response > > when moving in small increments, so the whole experience is quite bad. > If it is identified as an ALPS touchpad you can try installing Peter > Osterlund's Synaptics X driver: > > http://web.telia.com/~u89404340/touchpad/ Load of bull! See the attached patch for real fix for "no motion for small increments" problem. It's a kernel bug, plain and simple (provided that your ALPS was identified in the first place, just like Dmitry said). Actually, using Peter's driver is a good idea and I'll be happy to see it packaged and shipping. But it's retarded to use it in order to cover for obvious bugs. -- Pete diff -urp -X dontdiff linux-2.6.11-rc4/drivers/input/mousedev.c linux-2.6.11-rc4-lem/drivers/input/mousedev.c --- linux-2.6.11-rc4/drivers/input/mousedev.c 2005-02-15 22:38:39.000000000 -0800 +++ linux-2.6.11-rc4-lem/drivers/input/mousedev.c 2005-02-15 22:54:35.000000000 -0800 @@ -71,6 +71,7 @@ struct mousedev { struct mousedev_hw_data packet; unsigned int pkt_count; int old_x[4], old_y[4]; + int frac_dx, frac_dy; unsigned long touch; }; @@ -117,24 +118,31 @@ static struct mousedev mousedev_mix; static void mousedev_touchpad_event(struct input_dev *dev, struct mousedev *mousedev, unsigned int code, int value) { - int size; + int size, tmp; + enum { FRACTION_DENOM = 100 }; if (mousedev->touch) { + size = dev->absmax[ABS_X] - dev->absmin[ABS_X]; + if (size == 0) size = xres; switch (code) { case ABS_X: - size = dev->absmax[ABS_X] - dev->absmin[ABS_X]; - if (size == 0) size = xres; fx(0) = value; - if (mousedev->pkt_count >= 2) - mousedev->packet.dx = ((fx(0) - fx(1)) / 2 + (fx(1) - fx(2)) / 2) * xres / (size * 2); + if (mousedev->pkt_count >= 2) { + tmp = ((value - fx(2)) * (250 * FRACTION_DENOM)) / size; + tmp += mousedev->frac_dx; + mousedev->packet.dx = tmp / FRACTION_DENOM; + mousedev->frac_dx = tmp - mousedev->packet.dx * FRACTION_DENOM; + } break; case ABS_Y: - size = dev->absmax[ABS_Y] - dev->absmin[ABS_Y]; - if (size == 0) size = yres; fy(0) = value; - if (mousedev->pkt_count >= 2) - mousedev->packet.dy = -((fy(0) - fy(1)) / 2 + (fy(1) - fy(2)) / 2) * yres / (size * 2); + if (mousedev->pkt_count >= 2) { + tmp = ((fy(2) - value) * (250 * FRACTION_DENOM)) / size; + tmp += mousedev->frac_dy; + mousedev->packet.dy = tmp / FRACTION_DENOM; + mousedev->frac_dy = tmp - mousedev->packet.dy * FRACTION_DENOM; + } break; } } @@ -268,6 +276,8 @@ static void mousedev_touchpad_touch(stru clear_bit(0, &mousedev_mix.packet.buttons); } mousedev->touch = mousedev->pkt_count = 0; + mousedev->frac_dx = 0; + mousedev->frac_dy = 0; } else if (!mousedev->touch) From jonathansavage at gmail.com Thu Mar 3 00:57:36 2005 From: jonathansavage at gmail.com (Jon Savage) Date: Wed, 2 Mar 2005 16:57:36 -0800 Subject: reducing distribution CD count In-Reply-To: <200503021004.KAA24395@internal.tigress.co.uk> References: <200503021004.KAA24395@internal.tigress.co.uk> Message-ID: <2ad7cea1050302165778cb62c5@mail.gmail.com> > Oh dear! I'm not on a network. > > Seth Vidal also wrote: > >On Tue, 2005-03-01 at 18:53 -0300, Alexandre Oliva wrote: > >>How about: internet access only from work, monitored downloads, no CD > >>burning permitted, small amount of web browsing tolerated? > > > >so how did the user get fedora to begin with!? > > >From a magazine cover CD? Via snail mail from a mail order supplier? > > One day everyone will have gigabit wireless networking everywhere. > Until that happy day some people have to use computers with poor to > non-existent network connectivity. Any solution that excludes them > is incomplete. > > Ron In a perfect world the following would be an ideal scenario IMHO: Minimal install: CD 1 only Desktop: (default stuff): CD1 + possibly CD 2 Workstation (again defaults): CDs 1-4 Server: (defaults) maybe CDs 1-3 Everything: CDs 1-5 Since the decision as already been made to prune in order to keep the total size down then I can only hope that our friends on @ the nascent fedora extras team will wisely opt to put ISOs out for extras as well so that the network challenged folks can install all of the extra goodness(tm) offline. Hopefully core will eventually include only the best of breed for each particular app rather than having multiple applications that are used to perform the same function. I'd venture to guess that that would free up *lots* of space. Bests, JS From skvidal at phy.duke.edu Thu Mar 3 01:39:27 2005 From: skvidal at phy.duke.edu (seth vidal) Date: Wed, 02 Mar 2005 20:39:27 -0500 Subject: rawhide report: 20050301 changes In-Reply-To: <1109806409.3652.1.camel@trevally.redfishdemo.com> References: <200503011908.j21J8lsr013948@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <1109788217.30922.19.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1109806409.3652.1.camel@trevally.redfishdemo.com> Message-ID: <1109813967.19398.1.camel@cutter> On Thu, 2005-03-03 at 10:33 +1100, Rodd Clarkson wrote: >On Wed, 2005-03-02 at 19:30 +0100, Kyrre Ness Sjobak wrote: >>> Removed package gcc4 >> >>Hmm? Didn't somebody just say "fc4 has gcc 4 as default"?!? > >Well, after that barrage of responses, I think Kyrre might have learnt >something (maybe not to ask in the future) > >Kyrre, don't feel victimized over this. None of them slept well last >night and they just needed to get out the angst. ;-] I don't think anyone meant any harm to Kyrre. It's just a series of uncoordinated responses. -sv From aoliva at redhat.com Thu Mar 3 01:48:10 2005 From: aoliva at redhat.com (Alexandre Oliva) Date: 02 Mar 2005 22:48:10 -0300 Subject: reducing distribution CD count In-Reply-To: <20050302175140.14488.qmail@web8506.mail.in.yahoo.com> References: <20050302175140.14488.qmail@web8506.mail.in.yahoo.com> Message-ID: On Mar 2, 2005, Rahul Sundaram wrote: > Linux for you in India distributed the fedora 3 dvd > with one issue and includes all the updates till then > in the next month but they said they would have > preferred to distribute a single CD the first time. I don't think the trademark use guidelines would allow them to do so, even if there was a documented procedure to do it. Ugh :-( -- Alexandre Oliva http://www.ic.unicamp.br/~oliva/ Red Hat Compiler Engineer aoliva@{redhat.com, gcc.gnu.org} Free Software Evangelist oliva@{lsd.ic.unicamp.br, gnu.org} From rjune at bravegnuworld.com Thu Mar 3 01:52:55 2005 From: rjune at bravegnuworld.com (Richard June) Date: Wed, 2 Mar 2005 20:52:55 -0500 Subject: reducing distribution CD count In-Reply-To: <20050302092156.400e6445@python2> References: <200502240906.20729.czar@czarc.net> <200503011721.32752.rjune@bravegnuworld.com> <20050302092156.400e6445@python2> Message-ID: <200503022052.58749.rjune@bravegnuworld.com> since most of the servers have already moved to bzflag2, it makes sense to update it. -- Public Key available Here: http://www.bravegnuworld.com/~rjune/pubkey.asc -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: not available URL: From msevior at physics.unimelb.edu.au Thu Mar 3 03:35:23 2005 From: msevior at physics.unimelb.edu.au (Martin Sevior) Date: Thu, 03 Mar 2005 14:35:23 +1100 Subject: All packages need love. In-Reply-To: <20050302153832.5913F735FF@hormel.redhat.com> References: <20050302153832.5913F735FF@hormel.redhat.com> Message-ID: <1109820923.14742.3265.camel@localhost.localdomain> > > That's fine. For you OO.o is the right solution. Just remember that > > there are others for whom the opposite is true. Abiword does some things > > that OO.o can't do, and thus for them, that's the right solution. For > > me, there's no question that Abiword/Gnumeric are a better combination > > than OO.o. But it seems there's little point in arguing about it now. > > AFAICT, the decision has already been made, and FC4 will ship with them > > in Extras. Let's just hope someone sees the light and puts them back > > into Core for FC5. > > As far as i understand, extras is open for non-rh devs to maintain - and > if (example) AbiWord was maintained by somebody who used AbiWord > reguraly, and maybe even was an AbiWord developer - wouldn't that > possibly give a better AbiWord than somebody who never used it exept > fiering it up to check that "yum, it still starts" after recompiling, > but never sees any bugs etc. ? Yes indeed. But this is the whole point of involving the community and RH engaging the community. Wouldn't it be great *every* package in FC Core also had this kind of love? What needs to happen so this occurs? Cheers! Martin From skvidal at phy.duke.edu Thu Mar 3 03:08:13 2005 From: skvidal at phy.duke.edu (seth vidal) Date: Wed, 02 Mar 2005 22:08:13 -0500 Subject: All packages need love. In-Reply-To: <1109820923.14742.3265.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <20050302153832.5913F735FF@hormel.redhat.com> <1109820923.14742.3265.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <1109819293.19398.8.camel@cutter> >Yes indeed. But this is the whole point of involving the community and >RH engaging the community. Wouldn't it be great *every* package in FC >Core also had this kind of love? > >What needs to happen so this occurs? > We need to make sure extras is successful covering the areas it has right now. After that, we figure out how to deal with security embargo'd items in core. Then we can get into core maintenance. it just takes some time. -sv From rodd at clarkson.id.au Thu Mar 3 03:18:49 2005 From: rodd at clarkson.id.au (Rodd Clarkson) Date: Thu, 03 Mar 2005 14:18:49 +1100 Subject: rawhide report: 20050301 changes In-Reply-To: <1109813967.19398.1.camel@cutter> References: <200503011908.j21J8lsr013948@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <1109788217.30922.19.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1109806409.3652.1.camel@trevally.redfishdemo.com> <1109813967.19398.1.camel@cutter> Message-ID: <1109819929.4045.10.camel@trevally.redfishdemo.com> On Wed, 2005-03-02 at 20:39 -0500, seth vidal wrote: >On Thu, 2005-03-03 at 10:33 +1100, Rodd Clarkson wrote: >>On Wed, 2005-03-02 at 19:30 +0100, Kyrre Ness Sjobak wrote: >>>> Removed package gcc4 >>> >>>Hmm? Didn't somebody just say "fc4 has gcc 4 as default"?!? >> >>Well, after that barrage of responses, I think Kyrre might have learnt >>something (maybe not to ask in the future) >> >>Kyrre, don't feel victimized over this. None of them slept well last >>night and they just needed to get out the angst. ;-] > >I don't think anyone meant any harm to Kyrre. It's just a series of >uncoordinated responses. I sure it was just a coincidence. Maybe I should have wrapped my remarks in a tags. ;-] Rodd > -- >From the pain come the dream >From the dream come the vision >From the vision come the people >From the people come the power >From this power come the change - Peter Gabriel From rodd at clarkson.id.au Thu Mar 3 03:19:11 2005 From: rodd at clarkson.id.au (Rodd Clarkson) Date: Thu, 03 Mar 2005 14:19:11 +1100 Subject: Intel Pro Wireless cards In-Reply-To: <4223CFA8.2000308@insitesinc.com> References: <4223505B.20402@snowmoon.com> <4223CFA8.2000308@insitesinc.com> Message-ID: <1109819951.4045.11.camel@trevally.redfishdemo.com> On Mon, 2005-02-28 at 20:12 -0600, Michael Favia wrote: >As wireless NICs are becoming >more popular and network install approach "default" (with FC5 anaconda >and newly discussed capabilities) it will become increasingly more >important to get these "popular" cards under "Just Works" functionality >during installs. Mmmm, this makes me wonder how Fedora will handle cards like the ipw2200 (Intel PRO/Wireless cards). The driver for these cards is included in the kernel because it's under the GPL. However, the firmware won't be included because of it's licensing requirements. There are other cards that are in a similar situation, AFAIK. Will Fedora be set up so that the firmware can be provided as a third party during the install? I guess the way I see this happening would be for the installer to note that the computer it's installing on has a wireless card (or wired card) that needs 'extra' information to work, and then prompts the installee to provide this on some sort of meda. Will this be possible, or are users of these cards be out of luck? Also, as a related issue, will fedora then install the firmware so that the user doesn't need to do this again on first boot. This would make sense, and given that the user has provided the firmware once, would presumably be appropriate. Something to think about. Rodd -- >From the pain come the dream >From the dream come the vision >From the vision come the people >From the people come the power >From this power come the change - Peter Gabriel From eric at snowmoon.com Thu Mar 3 04:56:19 2005 From: eric at snowmoon.com (Eric Warnke) Date: Wed, 02 Mar 2005 23:56:19 -0500 Subject: Intel Pro Wireless cards In-Reply-To: <1109819951.4045.11.camel@trevally.redfishdemo.com> References: <4223505B.20402@snowmoon.com> <4223CFA8.2000308@insitesinc.com> <1109819951.4045.11.camel@trevally.redfishdemo.com> Message-ID: <422698F3.7090201@snowmoon.com> I know this will open a large can of worms, so please take this message as mearly a way of opening a dialog on the subject. Objecive 2 of the Fedora "contract" specifies that it should be built exclusivly from open source software. But is firmware software? It is more like a document, image, or other fixed item. What about Creative Commons "by" and "by-nd" licensed documentation are those items locked out of Fedora as well? I think we should re-evaluate the belief that locking out "free as in beer" firmware ( and all firmware is only "free as in beer" unless they provide the source ) is the proper action for the community when these files enable open source operating systems to interact with otherwise propratary hardware. I think that the first objective of the "contract" is to provide a general operating system platform equivilant to other competing systems must be evaluated before locking these files out. To say that these types of firmware are no longer welcome I think will hurt us long term as the hardware get smarter and more flexable. Communications hardware especially that are generally bound by one or more legal body to constrain it's abilities. Hardware manufactures who open their hardware to blanket hacking risk loosing the license to sell the hardware, so don't expect them to open the firmware as that is legally not an option for them. Is this lock out based on ideology or reality. Including "free as in beer" firmware does not compromise the ability to redistribute Fedora freely and I think it moves us closer to the goal of a genreal-purpose operating system out of the box. It improves user feedback and reduces problamatic and frustrating installs for both users and the people that are drawn in to help new users get past these repetitive and common problems. Cheers, Eric From michael.favia at insitesinc.com Thu Mar 3 04:58:26 2005 From: michael.favia at insitesinc.com (Michael Favia) Date: Wed, 02 Mar 2005 22:58:26 -0600 Subject: rawhide report: 20050302 changes In-Reply-To: <422652F5.7000500@research.att.com> References: <200503021815.j22IFnMu027490@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <422648B9.8070300@insitesinc.com> <422652F5.7000500@research.att.com> Message-ID: <42269972.30106@insitesinc.com> John Ellson wrote: > Michael Favia wrote: > >> Build System wrote: >> >>> hpijs-1.7.1-3 >>> ------------- >>> * Tue Mar 01 2005 Tim Waugh 1.7.1-3 >>> - Rebuilt for new GCC. >>> >>> >> Isnt hplip the preferred driver assortment from HP these days? Im >> unaware of any conflicts so i dont mean to step on anyones toes but >> is there any reason they arent being included in rawhide/for fc4? The >> project unifies hpijs and provides a unified single and >> multi-function connectivity solution to some 300 hp models (printing, >> faxing, scanning, photo-card access, and device management ). It also >> seems to have worked a good number of the bugs out and seems to be >> the recommended default from HP. The driver architecture sure looks >> pretty: http://hpinkjet.sourceforge.net/architecture.php and it works >> for me locally for sometime. >> >> -mf >> > It sure would be nice to get rid of the hpoj + ptal_ nonsense, but > perhaps its not being included because it doesn't build with gcc 4? > Ahh. i hadnt yet tried that. If this is the only stumbling block though perhaps we can talk to the project contributers about their plans and maybe resolve it before fc4 still. Are there any other known issues? -mf From rodd at clarkson.id.au Thu Mar 3 05:56:25 2005 From: rodd at clarkson.id.au (Rodd Clarkson) Date: Thu, 03 Mar 2005 16:56:25 +1100 Subject: Intel Pro Wireless cards In-Reply-To: <422698F3.7090201@snowmoon.com> References: <4223505B.20402@snowmoon.com> <4223CFA8.2000308@insitesinc.com> <1109819951.4045.11.camel@trevally.redfishdemo.com> <422698F3.7090201@snowmoon.com> Message-ID: <1109829386.4045.13.camel@trevally.redfishdemo.com> On Wed, 2005-03-02 at 23:56 -0500, Eric Warnke wrote: >I know this will open a large can of worms, so please take this message >as mearly a way of opening a dialog on the subject. > >Objecive 2 of the Fedora "contract" specifies that it should be built >exclusivly from open source software. > >But is firmware software? It is more like a document, image, or other >fixed item. What about Creative Commons "by" and "by-nd" licensed >documentation are those items locked out of Fedora as well? It's an interesting take on firmware. It makes me wonder if there's a lot of difference between Fedora trademarks and firmware, in that both are free-as-in-beer, but if you wish to roll your own fedora (AFAIK) you have to remove all the Fedora trademarks. Or am I totally confused? Rodd From anil411 at gmail.com Thu Mar 3 06:16:34 2005 From: anil411 at gmail.com (anil prasad) Date: Thu, 3 Mar 2005 11:46:34 +0530 Subject: fedora+xen question Message-ID: Hi, I downloaded fedora packages for Xen hypervisor. In kernel-xen0-devel package, i see missing .c files in all directories. Only Makefiles are present. What else should i do to get kernel-xen0-devel package compiled? Thanks in advance, Anil. From mitr at volny.cz Thu Mar 3 07:55:28 2005 From: mitr at volny.cz (Miloslav Trmac) Date: Thu, 3 Mar 2005 08:55:28 +0100 Subject: Intel Pro Wireless cards In-Reply-To: <422698F3.7090201@snowmoon.com> References: <4223505B.20402@snowmoon.com> <4223CFA8.2000308@insitesinc.com> <1109819951.4045.11.camel@trevally.redfishdemo.com> <422698F3.7090201@snowmoon.com> Message-ID: <20050303075523.GA21380@chrys.ms.mff.cuni.cz> On Wed, Mar 02, 2005 at 11:56:19PM -0500, Eric Warnke wrote: > I think we should re-evaluate the belief that locking out "free as in > beer" firmware For ipw2100, this misses the point; ISTR we are shipping several other firmware images in Fedora without source. The ipw2100 license doesn't allow free redistribution (the recipient must explicitly agree to the license); you can't just burn a CD including that firmware and give it to someone. I don't know whether you condider that "free as in beer", but IMHO sacrificing redistributability of FC for the firmware is just not worth it, all other factors aside. Mirek From pnasrat at redhat.com Thu Mar 3 08:37:04 2005 From: pnasrat at redhat.com (Paul Nasrat) Date: Thu, 03 Mar 2005 08:37:04 +0000 Subject: 2.6.11 ALPS Issue In-Reply-To: <20050302165010.2c9b5a1e@localhost.localdomain> References: <1109788024.3327.28.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> <20050302165010.2c9b5a1e@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <1109839024.4788.15.camel@anu.eridu> On Wed, 2005-03-02 at 16:50 -0800, Pete Zaitcev wrote: >On Wed, 02 Mar 2005 11:52:42 -0700, Dax Kelson wrote: > >> -------- Forwarded Message -------- >> From: Dmitry Torokhov >> Reply-To: dtor_core at ameritech.net >> To: MIGUELANXO at telefonica.net >> Cc: linux-kernel at vger.kernel.org >> Subject: Re: 2.6.11: touchpad unresponsive >> Date: Wed, 2 Mar 2005 12:12:53 -0500 > >> > Booting X in new kernel makes my touchpad very unresponsive. I can't >> > click any longer in the touchpad area, and the touchpad doesn't response >> > when moving in small increments, so the whole experience is quite bad. > >> If it is identified as an ALPS touchpad you can try installing Peter >> Osterlund's Synaptics X driver: >> >> http://web.telia.com/~u89404340/touchpad/ > >Load of bull! See the attached patch for real fix for "no motion for >small increments" problem. It's a kernel bug, plain and simple (provided >that your ALPS was identified in the first place, just like Dmitry said). > >Actually, using Peter's driver is a good idea and I'll be happy to see >it packaged and shipping. But it's retarded to use it in order to cover >for obvious bugs. It is packaged and shipped I need to check configuration for ALPS but other than that it should be good. Paul From rahulsundaram at yahoo.co.in Thu Mar 3 09:25:13 2005 From: rahulsundaram at yahoo.co.in (Rahul Sundaram) Date: Thu, 3 Mar 2005 01:25:13 -0800 (PST) Subject: Intel Pro Wireless cards In-Reply-To: <422698F3.7090201@snowmoon.com> Message-ID: <20050303092513.28239.qmail@web8503.mail.in.yahoo.com> Hi > > Is this lock out based on ideology or reality. > Including "free as in > beer" firmware does not compromise the ability to > redistribute Fedora > freely and I think it moves us closer to the goal of > a genreal-purpose > operating system out of the box. but only if the firmware is actually freely redistributable. many vendors do not agree to this. OpenBSD had a users campaign and they did get some success with it but intel has refused to cooperate ===== Regards Rahul Sundaram __________________________________ Celebrate Yahoo!'s 10th Birthday! Yahoo! Netrospective: 100 Moments of the Web http://birthday.yahoo.com/netrospective/ From rahulsundaram at yahoo.co.in Thu Mar 3 09:30:48 2005 From: rahulsundaram at yahoo.co.in (Rahul Sundaram) Date: Thu, 3 Mar 2005 01:30:48 -0800 (PST) Subject: reducing distribution CD count In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20050303093048.5311.qmail@web8501.mail.in.yahoo.com> Hi > I don't think the trademark use guidelines would > allow them to do so, > even if there was a documented procedure to do it. > Ugh :-( Then the guidelines should be changed to accomodate this. Wasnt flexible trademark guidelines one of the changes for the rename to Fedora? ===== Regards Rahul Sundaram __________________________________ Celebrate Yahoo!'s 10th Birthday! Yahoo! Netrospective: 100 Moments of the Web http://birthday.yahoo.com/netrospective/ From dragoran at feuerpokemon.de Thu Mar 3 09:39:32 2005 From: dragoran at feuerpokemon.de (dragoran) Date: Thu, 03 Mar 2005 10:39:32 +0100 Subject: Who is broken when hotplug,udev and hal are causing high cpu load? Message-ID: <4226DB54.90406@feuerpokemon.de> I bought a new card usb2 card reader. Sometimes when I plug a sd card into it all hotplug programs cause 60-80% cpu load and nothing happens (no mount) sometimes it just works. I want to fill this into bugzilla but dunno against what? When this happens dmesg reports many Buffer I/O erros. From rahulsundaram at yahoo.co.in Thu Mar 3 10:01:14 2005 From: rahulsundaram at yahoo.co.in (Rahul Sundaram) Date: Thu, 3 Mar 2005 02:01:14 -0800 (PST) Subject: Targetting OEM's (Re: reducing distribution CD count) In-Reply-To: <1109791933.5433.14.camel@localhost> Message-ID: <20050303100114.17622.qmail@web8501.mail.in.yahoo.com> Hi > I think this is what you're looking for: > > http://fedoranews.org/contributors/gene_czarcinski/update_distro/ > yes. thats part of the solution. thanks for the pointer. However fedora projects needs to do something like this in a official way. maybe update the ISO images every other week or so with all the updates till then. Targetting OEM's probably requires more than just this ===== Regards Rahul Sundaram __________________________________ Celebrate Yahoo!'s 10th Birthday! Yahoo! Netrospective: 100 Moments of the Web http://birthday.yahoo.com/netrospective/ From dragoran at feuerpokemon.de Thu Mar 3 10:14:22 2005 From: dragoran at feuerpokemon.de (dragoran) Date: Thu, 03 Mar 2005 11:14:22 +0100 Subject: Who is broken when hotplug,udev and hal are causing high cpu load? In-Reply-To: <4226DB54.90406@feuerpokemon.de> References: <4226DB54.90406@feuerpokemon.de> Message-ID: <4226E37E.3050508@feuerpokemon.de> dragoran schrieb: > I bought a new card usb2 card reader. Sometimes when I plug a sd card > into it all hotplug programs cause 60-80% cpu load and nothing happens > (no mount) sometimes it just works. > I want to fill this into bugzilla but dunno against what? > When this happens dmesg reports many Buffer I/O erros. > reported it agains kernel (#150175) From dwmw2 at infradead.org Thu Mar 3 10:33:47 2005 From: dwmw2 at infradead.org (David Woodhouse) Date: Thu, 03 Mar 2005 10:33:47 +0000 Subject: reducing distribution CD count In-Reply-To: <20050303093048.5311.qmail@web8501.mail.in.yahoo.com> References: <20050303093048.5311.qmail@web8501.mail.in.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1109846028.16158.18.camel@hades.cambridge.redhat.com> On Thu, 2005-03-03 at 01:30 -0800, Rahul Sundaram wrote: > Then the guidelines should be changed to accomodate > this. Wasnt flexible trademark guidelines one of the > changes for the rename to Fedora? It would certainly be useful if the trademark guidelines permitted one to build and distribute a DVD or set of CDs which contains _only_ Fedora Core, Fedora Extras and the official updates to those. -- dwmw2 From pnasrat at redhat.com Thu Mar 3 11:07:33 2005 From: pnasrat at redhat.com (Paul Nasrat) Date: Thu, 03 Mar 2005 11:07:33 +0000 Subject: reducing distribution CD count In-Reply-To: <1109846028.16158.18.camel@hades.cambridge.redhat.com> References: <20050303093048.5311.qmail@web8501.mail.in.yahoo.com> <1109846028.16158.18.camel@hades.cambridge.redhat.com> Message-ID: <1109848053.4788.32.camel@anu.eridu> On Thu, 2005-03-03 at 10:33 +0000, David Woodhouse wrote: >On Thu, 2005-03-03 at 01:30 -0800, Rahul Sundaram wrote: >> Then the guidelines should be changed to accomodate >> this. Wasnt flexible trademark guidelines one of the >> changes for the rename to Fedora? > >It would certainly be useful if the trademark guidelines permitted one >to build and distribute a DVD or set of CDs which contains _only_ >Fedora Core, Fedora Extras and the official updates to those. I think it might - but maybe we should get a clarification: http://fedora.redhat.com/about/trademarks/guidelines/page4.html They must only use the Fedora? mark in association with the original Fedora? code found on the Fedora Project website (see http://fedora.redhat.com/) without modification Both extras and core are available here, and updates also. http://fedora.redhat.com/about/trademarks/guidelines/page5.html So we'd be shipping unmodified Fedora Core, Updates and Extras as a work. Which is still identifiable as Fedora. So I don't think we fall into the "seperate patches" category. Paul From rahulsundaram at yahoo.co.in Thu Mar 3 11:23:45 2005 From: rahulsundaram at yahoo.co.in (Rahul Sundaram) Date: Thu, 3 Mar 2005 03:23:45 -0800 (PST) Subject: reducing distribution CD count In-Reply-To: <1109848053.4788.32.camel@anu.eridu> Message-ID: <20050303112345.53451.qmail@web8501.mail.in.yahoo.com> --- Paul Nasrat wrote: > On Thu, 2005-03-03 at 10:33 +0000, David Woodhouse > wrote: > >On Thu, 2005-03-03 at 01:30 -0800, Rahul Sundaram > wrote: > >> Then the guidelines should be changed to > accomodate > >> this. Wasnt flexible trademark guidelines one of > the > >> changes for the rename to Fedora? > > > >It would certainly be useful if the trademark > guidelines permitted one > >to build and distribute a DVD or set of CDs which > contains _only_ > >Fedora Core, Fedora Extras and the official updates > to those. > > I think it might - but maybe we should get a > clarification: > > http://fedora.redhat.com/about/trademarks/guidelines/page4.html Yes a clarification regarding this is necessary. It would much better to have a FAQ which answers such questions explicitly. ===== Regards Rahul Sundaram __________________________________ Celebrate Yahoo!'s 10th Birthday! Yahoo! Netrospective: 100 Moments of the Web http://birthday.yahoo.com/netrospective/ From eric at snowmoon.com Thu Mar 3 12:27:49 2005 From: eric at snowmoon.com (Eric Warnke) Date: Thu, 03 Mar 2005 07:27:49 -0500 Subject: Intel Pro Wireless cards In-Reply-To: <20050303075523.GA21380@chrys.ms.mff.cuni.cz> References: <4223505B.20402@snowmoon.com> <4223CFA8.2000308@insitesinc.com> <1109819951.4045.11.camel@trevally.redfishdemo.com> <422698F3.7090201@snowmoon.com> <20050303075523.GA21380@chrys.ms.mff.cuni.cz> Message-ID: <422702C5.5090507@snowmoon.com> Miloslav Trmac wrote: >The ipw2100 license doesn't allow free redistribution (the recipient >must explicitly agree to the license); you can't just burn a CD including >that firmware and give it to someone. > > No it does not. To redistribute you must only agreee to copy the license in it's entirety to the same location as the software. As computer users firmware has and will be a fact of life. It's firmware that takes propriataty x86 hardware and makes it into a commodity platform. Without the BIOS we would all be hacking individual registers in each componient chip to try and get the memory subsystems initalized and stable. Without firmware many parts of the system would be useless. I just think that someone with the appropriate level of knowledge should review the license to see if will truly prevent redistribution of the software. Based on my reading of the license it does stop copying and it's license clauses are no more burdensom than the GPL in their requirements. Cheers, Eric From czar at czarc.net Thu Mar 3 13:04:27 2005 From: czar at czarc.net (Gene C.) Date: Thu, 3 Mar 2005 08:04:27 -0500 Subject: reducing distribution CD count In-Reply-To: References: <200503011358.j21Dw2st000363@leto.astradyne.corp> <604aa7910503011358404ec6b3@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <200503030804.28115.czar@czarc.net> On Wednesday 02 March 2005 11:39, Alexandre Oliva wrote: > On Mar ?1, 2005, Jeff Spaleta wrote: > > On 01 Mar 2005 18:53:45 -0300, Alexandre Oliva wrote: > >> How about: internet access only from work, monitored downloads, no CD > >> burning permitted, small amount of web browsing tolerated? > > > > How does that system get any update packages at all? > > Odds are it doesn't need them, since it's not connected. While security updates may not have the same level of concern for unconnected systems, bugfixes are. With Fedora Core having a much higher number of updates issued than Red Hat Linux had, updating unconnected systems or network of systems is an issue with network-only updating. As I see it there are two issues: 1. Will the updating program be able to pull updates from a CD or DVD with updated packages on it? If the current up2date has this capability, I have not been able to figure out how to make it work. 2. Will the master repositories be organized in such a manner as to "make it easy" to mirror updates. Yes, I know there will be official mirror sites but will I be able to easily get all the updates and then "move them" to some media for updating stand-alone systems or networks of systems. My experience is that I have fewer problems if I keep up-to-date than if I just apply fixes when a problem occurs. -- Gene From jspaleta at gmail.com Thu Mar 3 13:20:08 2005 From: jspaleta at gmail.com (Jeff Spaleta) Date: Thu, 3 Mar 2005 08:20:08 -0500 Subject: reducing distribution CD count In-Reply-To: <1109848053.4788.32.camel@anu.eridu> References: <20050303093048.5311.qmail@web8501.mail.in.yahoo.com> <1109846028.16158.18.camel@hades.cambridge.redhat.com> <1109848053.4788.32.camel@anu.eridu> Message-ID: <604aa79105030305205fad213b@mail.gmail.com> On Thu, 03 Mar 2005 11:07:33 +0000, Paul Nasrat wrote: > So we'd be shipping unmodified Fedora Core, Updates and Extras as a > work. Which is still identifiable as Fedora. So I don't think we fall > into the "seperate patches" category. unless of course you are talking about making changes to the installer image to make the installer process aware of an expanded package set. And there is the question of whether or not any installable mediaset can be considered 'unmodified' in the sense that the md5sums that make media-check work would change. Is it just the packages.. or is the installer image itself covered by the 'unmodified' language. Its far different to shove this all into a replacement installable image cd... than to gather packages to gether on a seperate cd. Even then on a seperate cd... are you allowed to generate repo metadata that differs from the original network repository? If you have a subset of packages the metadata will need to be regenerated. In either case whether its allowed or not, I don't see it as clearly delineated enough in the guidelines. I would much rather see the trademark guidelines rewritten to give some very specific guidance for the most commonly expected usage case.... instead of being written for lawyers to read. Exactly in what ways is a replacement set of installable media allowed to deviate from the original set? Can I include an Extras directory tree? Can I generate repo metadata for the Extras tree? Can I re-work the comps file to include more packages and groups? None of these questions are actually spelled out and they need to be. -jef From nicolas.mailhot at laposte.net Thu Mar 3 13:23:22 2005 From: nicolas.mailhot at laposte.net (Nicolas Mailhot) Date: Thu, 3 Mar 2005 14:23:22 +0100 (CET) Subject: reducing distribution CD count In-Reply-To: <200503030804.28115.czar@czarc.net> References: <200503011358.j21Dw2st000363@leto.astradyne.corp> <604aa7910503011358404ec6b3@mail.gmail.com> <200503030804.28115.czar@czarc.net> Message-ID: <27767.192.54.193.137.1109856202.squirrel@rousalka.dyndns.org> > As I see it there are two issues: > > 1. Will the updating program be able to pull updates from a CD or DVD > with > updated packages on it? If the current up2date has this capability, I > have > not been able to figure out how to make it work. This is pretty trivial to do with a small script that calls yum in a temp root and tells it to look at on-cd repodata. Regards, -- Nicolas Mailhot From mike at navi.cx Thu Mar 3 14:11:31 2005 From: mike at navi.cx (Mike Hearn) Date: Thu, 03 Mar 2005 14:11:31 +0000 Subject: Hacking modversions References: <20050301214949.GJ10277@redhat.com> <20050302005107.GB27369@redhat.com> Message-ID: On Tue, 01 Mar 2005 19:51:07 -0500, Dave Jones wrote: > The rebasing to new releases isn't about adding the new features. > It's done to lower maintainence overhead. Supporting 3 releases at the same > time becomes a lot easier when 2 of them share the same kernel (and one is > only a point release away). OK then, this answers all my original questions. Thankyou. > If something got removed without a viable alternative, then that's > a regression that should be reported. Examples ? I was thinking of the 4G/4G VM patch, but I guess that's not really a feature. thanks -mike From shiva at sewingwitch.com Thu Mar 3 15:09:53 2005 From: shiva at sewingwitch.com (Kenneth Porter) Date: Thu, 03 Mar 2005 07:09:53 -0800 Subject: Intel Pro Wireless cards In-Reply-To: <422702C5.5090507@snowmoon.com> References: <4223505B.20402@snowmoon.com> <4223CFA8.2000308@insitesinc.com> <1109819951.4045.11.camel@trevally.redfishdemo.com> <422698F3.7090201@snowmoon.com> <20050303075523.GA21380@chrys.ms.mff.cuni.cz> <422702C5.5090507@snowmoon.com> Message-ID: --On Thursday, March 03, 2005 7:27 AM -0500 Eric Warnke wrote: > It's firmware that takes propriataty x86 hardware and makes it into a > commodity platform. Without the BIOS we would all be hacking individual > registers in each componient chip to try and get the memory subsystems > initalized and stable. USB host controllers seem to have succeeded with a standardized register layout and no proprietary firmware. From buildsys at redhat.com Thu Mar 3 15:52:52 2005 From: buildsys at redhat.com (Build System) Date: Thu, 3 Mar 2005 10:52:52 -0500 Subject: rawhide report: 20050303 changes Message-ID: <200503031552.j23Fqqer007404@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> New package device-mapper-multipath Tools to manage multipath devices using device-mapper. New package eclipse-changelog Eclipse Changelog plug-in Removed package fonts-bengali Updated Packages: GConf-1.0.9-16 -------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Mark McLoughlin 1.0.9-16 - Rebuild with gcc4 * Fri Aug 06 2004 Tim Waugh 1.0.9-15 - Fixed underquoted m4 definitions. * Tue Jun 15 2004 Elliot Lee - rebuilt GConf2-2.9.91-2 --------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Mark McLoughlin 2.9.91-2 - Rebuild with gcc4 ORBit-1:0.5.17-15 ----------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Mark McLoughlin 1:0.5.17-15 - Rebuild with gcc4 * Fri Aug 06 2004 Tim Waugh 1:0.5.17-14 - Fixed another m4 warning. * Thu Jul 15 2004 Tim Waugh 1:0.5.17-13 - Fixed warnings in shipped m4 file. ORBit2-2.12.1-2 --------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Mark McLoughlin 2.12.1-2 - Rebuild with gcc4 Omni-0.9.2-3 ------------ * Wed Mar 02 2005 Tim Waugh 0.9.2-3 - Rebuild for new GCC. PyXML-0.8.4-3 ------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Karsten Hopp 0.8.4-3 - build with gcc-4 a2ps-4.13b-45 ------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Tim Waugh 4.13b-45 - Rebuild for new GCC. aiksaurus-1:1.2.1-5 ------------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Caolan McNamara 1.2.1-5 - rebuild with gcc4 at-spi-1.6.2-2 -------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Matthias Clasen 1.6.2-2 - Rebuilt with gcc4 atk-1.9.0-2 ----------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Matthias Clasen - 1.9.0-2 - Rebuilt autorun-3.15-2 -------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Harald Hoyer - 3.15-2 - rebuilt bash-3.0-29 ----------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Tim Waugh 3.0-29 - Rebuild for new GCC. bluez-hcidump-1.18-1 -------------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 David Woodhouse 1.18-1 - update to bluez-hcidump 1.18 bluez-libs-2.15-1 ----------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 David Woodhouse 2.15-1 - Update to bluez-libs 2.15 - Remove Obsoletes: bluez-sdp to fix #131653 bluez-pin-0.24-1 ---------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 David Woodhouse 0.24-1 - Update to 0.24, use $RPM_OPT_FLAGS bluez-utils-2.15-1 ------------------ * Wed Mar 02 2005 David Woodhouse 2.15-1 - Update to bluez-utils 2.15 - Add Obsoletes: bluez-sdp (#131653) - Fix hidd default args (#145939) - Make /etc/pcmcia/bluetooth executable (#148752) - Use dbus PIN by default (#131603, #134856, #145993) - Don't report hidd status in bluetooth initscript (#139169) bonobo-1.0.22-10 ---------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Mark McLoughlin 1.0.22-10 - Rebuild with gcc4, add patch for build failure bridge-utils-1.0.4-6 -------------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 David Woodhouse 1.0.4-6 - Rebuild with gcc 4 cdecl-2.5-33 ------------ * Wed Mar 02 2005 Phil Knirsch 2.5.-33 - bump release and rebuild with gcc 4 * Sun Feb 27 2005 Florian La Roche 2.5-32 - Copyright: -> License * Wed Jan 12 2005 Tim Waugh 2.5-31 - Rebuilt for new readline. cdlabelgen-3.5.0-1 ------------------ * Wed Mar 02 2005 Harald Hoyer - 3.5.0 - updated to version 3.5.0 cdrdao-1.1.9-9 -------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Harald Hoyer - rebuilt cdrtools-8:2.01.1-8 ------------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Harald Hoyer - rebuilt compat-readline43-4.3-2 ----------------------- compat-slang-1.4.5-10 --------------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Petr Rockai - 1.4.5-10 - rebuild cscope-15.5-11 -------------- dasher-3.2.13-2 --------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 3.2.13-2 - Rebuilt with gcc4 dcraw-0.0.20050227-1 -------------------- dev86-0.16.17-1 --------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Karsten Hopp 0.16.17-1 - update and rebuild with gcc-4 - drop obsolete overflow patch dia-1:0.94-6 ------------ * Wed Mar 02 2005 Caolan McNamara - rebuild with gcc4 - gnome#169019# gcc4 patch * Fri Sep 03 2004 Matthias Clasen - Fix a problem with the help patch * Fri Sep 03 2004 Matthias Clasen - Update to final 0.94 tarball - Make the help button work (#131622) dialog-1.0.20050206-1 --------------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Harald Hoyer 1.0-20050206-1 - new version 1.0-20050206 dictd-1.9.7-6 ------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Karsten Hopp 1.9.7-6 - build with gcc-4 diffstat-1.38-2 --------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Tim Waugh 1.38-2 - Rebuild for new GCC. diffutils-2.8.1-14 ------------------ * Wed Mar 02 2005 Tim Waugh 2.8.1-14 - Rebuild for new GCC. diskdumputils-1.0.1-3 --------------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Dave Anderson 1.0.1-3 - rebuild with gcc 4. dmidecode-1:2.6-1.13 -------------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Dave Jones - Update to upstream 2.6 dvd+rw-tools-5.21.4.10.8-6 -------------------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Harald Hoyer - rebuilt eclipse-1:3.1.0_fc-0.M5.8 ------------------------- * Tue Mar 01 2005 Andrew Overholt 3.1.0_fc-0.M5.8 - Add ppc. - Add patch to copy over icon for unsupported (upstream) platforms but don't include the source for the launcher. - gcc4 -> gcc changes. - Add swt-cairo to 64-bit platforms' %files. * Fri Feb 25 2005 Andrew Overholt 3.1.0_fc-0.M5.7 - Add tar args patch (e.o #86571). - New build bootstrapping patches. * Fri Feb 25 2005 Andrew Overholt 3.1.0_fc-0.M5.6 - Re-work how we do the gcj-dbtool magic. - Don't remove ant-netrexx (need to find an RPM if we can). ed-0.2-38 --------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Karsten Hopp 0.2-38 - build with gcc-4 eel2-2.9.91-2 ------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Alex Larsson 2.9.91-2 - Rebuild enchant-1:1.1.5-3 ----------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Caolan McNamara 1:1.1.15-3 - rebuild with gcc4 enscript-1.6.1-30 ----------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Tim Waugh 1.6.1-30 - Rebuild for new GCC. esound-1:0.2.35-4 ----------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 John (J5) Palmieri - 1:0.2.35-4 - Rebuild with gcc 4.0 evolution-data-server-1.1.6-6 ----------------------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Jeremy Katz - 1.1.6-6 - rebuild to fix library linking silliness findutils-1:4.2.18-2 -------------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Tim Waugh 1:4.2.18-2 - Rebuild for new GCC. flac-1.1.0-9 ------------ * Wed Mar 02 2005 John (J5) Palmieri 1.1.0-9 - rebuild for gcc 4.0 foomatic-3.0.2-16 ----------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Tim Waugh 3.0.2-16 - Rebuild for new GCC. * Fri Feb 25 2005 Tim Waugh - Add IEEE 1284 information for Lexmark Optra R+ (bug #149498). fribidi-0.10.4-8 ---------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Caolan McNamara 0.10.4-8 - rebuild with gcc4 gail-1.8.2-2 ------------ * Wed Mar 02 2005 Matthias Clasen 1.8.2-2 - Rebuild with gcc4 gawk-3.1.4-5 ------------ * Wed Mar 02 2005 Karsten Hopp 3.1.4-5 - rebuild with gcc-4 gconf-editor-2.9.91-2 --------------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Mark McLoughlin 2.9.91-2 - Rebuild with gcc4 gd-2.0.32-2 ----------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Phil Knirsch 2.0.32-2 - bump release and rebuild with gcc 4 * Wed Nov 03 2004 Phil Knirsch 2.0.32-1 - Update to 2.0.32 which includes all the security fixes * Wed Oct 27 2004 Phil Knirsch 2.0.28-2 - Fixed several buffer overflows for gdMalloc() calls gdk-pixbuf-1:0.22.0-16 ---------------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Matthias Clasen - 1:0.22.0-16 - Rebuild with gcc4 * Fri Sep 24 2004 Matthias Clasen - 1:0.22.0-15.1 - Rebuild for RHEL4 without gnome support. giftrans-1.12.2-22 ------------------ * Wed Mar 02 2005 Phil Knirsch 1.12.2-22 - bump release and rebuild with gcc 4 gimp-2:2.2.4-2 -------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Nils Philippsen - rebuild against gcc 4.0 * Wed Feb 23 2005 Nils Philippsen - version 2.2.4 - require newer versions of gtk2 (#143840), glib2 and pango * Sat Jan 29 2005 Nils Philippsen - make desktop icon themeable (#146486) gimp-data-extras-2.0.1-1 ------------------------ * Wed Mar 02 2005 Nils Philippsen 2.0.1-1 - version 2.0.1 * Mon Oct 18 2004 Nils Philippsen 2.0.0-1 - rather cosmetic version upgrade - fix BuildRoot gimp-gap-2.0.2-4 ---------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Nils Philippsen 2.2.4-3 - build with gcc-4 glade2-2.9.0-2 -------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Matthias Clasen - 2.9.0-2 - Rebuild with gcc4 glib-1:1.2.10-16 ---------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Matthias Clasen 1:1.2.10-16 - Rebuild with gcc4 * Mon Aug 09 2004 Tim Waugh 1:1.2.10-15 - Fixed underquoted m4 definitions. * Sun Jun 20 2004 Matthias Clasen 1:1.2.10-14 - Make it build with gcc 3.4 glib2-2.6.3-2 ------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Matthias Clasen - 2.6.3-2 - Rebuild with gcc4 gnome-applets-1:2.9.6-2 ----------------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Mark McLoughlin 1:2.9.6-2 - Stop libgswitchit using -Werror - Rebuild with gcc4 gnome-bluetooth-0.5.1-10 ------------------------ * Wed Mar 02 2005 Harald Hoyer - rebuilt gnome-desktop-2.9.91-3 ---------------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Mark McLoughlin 2.9.91-3 - Rebuild with gcc4 gnome-keyring-0.4.1-2 --------------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Alex Larsson 0.4.1-2 - Rebuild gnome-keyring-manager-0.0.4-2 ----------------------------- gnome-mag-0.11.14-2 ------------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Matthias Clasen 0.11.14-2 - Rebuild with gcc4 gnome-menus-2.9.90-3 -------------------- gnome-netstatus-2.9.4-2 ----------------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Mark McLoughlin 2.9.4-2 - Rebuild with gcc4 gnome-nettool-0.99.3-3 ---------------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Mark McLoughlin 0.99.3-3 - Rebuild with gcc4 gnome-panel-2.9.91-3 -------------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Mark McLoughlin 2.9.91-3 - Rebuild with gcc4 gnome-themes-2.9.94-1 --------------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Matthias Clasen - 2.9.94-1 - Update to 2.9.94 gnopernicus-0.10.3-1 -------------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Matthias Clasen 0.10.3-1 - Update to 0.10.3 - Removed upstreamed patches gnuplot-4.0.0-7 --------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Phil Knirsch 4.0.0-7 - bump release and rebuild with gcc 4 gnutls-1.0.20-6 --------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Warren Togami 1.0.20-6 - gcc4 rebuild gob2-2.0.11-3 ------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Harald Hoyer - rebuilt gok-1.0.1-2 ----------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Matthias Clasen 1.0.1-2 - Rebuild with gcc4 gperf-3.0.1-6 ------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Karsten Hopp 3.0.1-6 - build with gcc-4 grep-2.5.1-48 ------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Tim Waugh 2.5.1-48 - Rebuild for new GCC. grub-0.95-11 ------------ * Thu Mar 03 2005 Peter Jones 0.95-11 - Make it build with gcc4 * Sun Feb 20 2005 Peter Jones 0.95-10 - Always install in MBR for raid1 /boot/ * Sun Feb 20 2005 Peter Jones 0.95-9 - Always use full path for mdadm in grub-install gtk-engines-1:0.12-6 -------------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Matthias Clasen 1:0.12-6 - Replace Copyright: with License: - rebuild with gcc4 gtk2-2.6.4-2 ------------ * Tue Mar 01 2005 Matthias Clasen - 2.6.4-2 - Rebuild with gcc4 gtk2-engines-2.6.1-2 -------------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Matthias Clasen 2.6.1-2 - Rebuild with gcc4 guile-5:1.6.7-2 --------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Phil Knirsch 5:1.6.7-2 - bump release and rebuild with gcc 4 - Fixed problem with ltdl and gcc 4 rebuild - Add BuildPreReq for libtool-ltdl-devel hdparm-5.9-1 ------------ * Wed Mar 02 2005 Karsten Hopp 5.9-1 - update to 5.9 - build with gcc-4 hfsutils-3.2.6-7 ---------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 David Woodhouse 3.2.6-7 - Rebuild with gcc 4 hotplug-3:2004_09_23-3 ---------------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Bill Nottingham 3:2004_09_23-3 - really fix loading of sg module (#137952, #150113) howl-0.9.8-3 ------------ * Wed Mar 02 2005 Alex Larsson 0.9.8-3 - Rebuild htdig-3:3.2.0b6-5 ----------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Phil Knirsch 3:3.2.0b6-5 - bump release and rebuild with gcc 4 * Tue Jan 25 2005 Phil Knirsch 3:3.2.0b6-4 - Fixed security bug with unescaped output in htsearch and qtest (#144127) - Removed .la and .a libs from package (#145649) * Wed Aug 04 2004 Phil Knirsch 3:3.2.0b6-3 - Corrected the htdig-web requires line. hwdata-0.151-1 -------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Mike A. Harris 0.151-1 - Added one hundred billion new nvidia PCI IDs to pcitable and Cards to synchronize it with X.Org X11 6.8.2. (#140601) im-sdk-1:12.1.1-6.svn2208 ------------------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Akira TAGOH - 1:12.1.1-6.svn2208 - iiimgcf-dont-always-emit-commit-signal-r2231.patch: applied to not emit commit signal when there is no preedit string. * Wed Mar 02 2005 Akira TAGOH - 1:12.1.1-5.svn2208 - Use %{_host} instead of %{_arch}-%{_host_vendor}-%{_host_os} for calling update-gtk-immodule like gtk2 does. otherwise gtk2 won't read the correct gtk.immodules. - leif-sampleja3-fix-gcc4.patch: applied to fix the build fails for gcc4. * Tue Mar 01 2005 Tomas Mraz - 1:12.1.1-4.svn2208 - added patch to be able to build with gcc4 - rebuild with openssl-0.9.7e intltool-0.33-2 --------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Matthias Clasen - 0.33-2 - Rebuild with gcc4 iptraf-2.7.0-13 --------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Karsten Hopp 2.7.0-13 - - build with gcc-4 irda-utils-0.9.16-7 ------------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Karsten Hopp 0.9.16-7 - build with gcc-4 jadetex-3.12-13 --------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Tim Waugh 3.12-13 - Use fmtutil-sys instead of fmtutil (bug #150089). - Require at least teTeX 3. java-1.4.2-gcj-compat-0:1.4.2.0-40jpp_4rh ----------------------------------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Thomas Fitzsimmons - 0:1.4.2.0-40jpp_4rh - Bump release number. * Wed Mar 02 2005 Thomas Fitzsimmons - 0:1.4.2.0-40jpp_3rh - Make java-1.4.2-gcj-compat-devel obsolete java-1.4.2-gcj4-compat-devel. - Import java-gcj-compat 1.0.17. - Specify --with-arch-directory and --with-os-directory options on configure line. kernel-2.6.11-1.1166_FC4 ------------------------ * Wed Mar 02 2005 Dave Jones - 2.6.11 ksh-20050202-1 -------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Karsten Hopp 20050202-1 - update and rebuild with gcc-4 kudzu-1.1.110-1 --------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Bill Nottingham 1.1.110-1 - fix reading of modules.pcimap when /usr/share/hwdata isn't there (#150123, ) - support fddiX device naming (#109689) libart_lgpl-2.3.17-2 -------------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Matthias Clasen 2.3.17-2 - Rebuild with gcc4 libbtctl-0.4.1-5 ---------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Harald Hoyer - rebuilt libcap-1.10-22 -------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Karsten Hopp 1.10-22 - build with gcc-4 libcroco-0.6.0-5 ---------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Matthias Clasen - 0.6.0-5 - Rebuild with gcc4 libexif-0.5.12-6 ---------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Matthias Clasen - Rebuild with gcc4 libgail-gnome-1.1.0-2 --------------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Matthias Clasen 1.1.0-2 - Rebuild with gcc4 libgda-1:1.2.0-5 ---------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Caolan McNamara 1:1.2.0-5 - rebuild with gcc4 libglade-1:0.17-16 ------------------ * Wed Mar 02 2005 Matthias Clasen 1:0.17-16 - Replace Copyright: with License: - rebuilt with gcc4 * Fri Aug 06 2004 Tim Waugh 1:0.17-15 - Fixed underquoted m4 definition. * Tue Jun 15 2004 Elliot Lee - rebuilt libglade2-2.5.1-2 ----------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Matthias Clasen - 2.5.1-2 - Rebuild with gcc4 libgnomecanvas-2.9.2-1 ---------------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Matthias Clasen - 2.9.2-1 - update to 2.9.2 * Wed Jan 26 2005 Matthias Clasen - 2.9.1-1 - update to 2.9.1 * Wed Sep 22 2004 Alexander Larsson - 2.8.0-1 - update to 2.8.0 libgnomedb-1:1.2.0-3 -------------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Caolan McNamara 1.2.0-3 - rebuild with gcc4 libgnomeprint22-2.8.2-2 ----------------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Tomas Mraz - 2.8.2-2 - Rebuild with openssl-0.9.7e libgsf-1.11.1-2 --------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Caolan McNamara 1.11.1-2 - rebuild with gcc4 libieee1284-0.2.9-2 ------------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Tim Waugh 0.2.9-2 - Rebuild for new GCC. libjpeg-6b-34 ------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Matthias Clasen - 6b-34 - Rebuild with gcc4 libmng-1.0.9-1 -------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Matthias Clasen 1.0.9-1 - Update to 1.0.9 - Work around autogen.sh brokenness libogg-2:1.1.2-2 ---------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 John (J5) Palmieri 2:1.1.2-2 - rebuild for gcc 4.0 libpng-2:1.2.8-2 ---------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Matthias Clasen - 2:1.2.8-2 - Rebuild with gcc4 * Mon Dec 06 2004 Matthias Clasen - 2:1.2.8-1 - Update to 1.2.8 * Wed Sep 15 2004 Matthias Clasen - 2:1.2.7-1 - Update to 1.2.7 libpng10-1.0.18-2 ----------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Matthias Clasen - 1.0.18-2 - Rebuild with gcc4 librsvg2-2.9.5-2 ---------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Matthias Clasen - 2.9.5-2 - Rebuild with gcc4 libtheora-0:1.0alpha4-2 ----------------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 John (J5) Palmieri - 1.0alpha4-2 - rebuild with gcc 4.0 libtiff-3.7.1-5 --------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Matthias Clasen - 3.7.1-5 - Don't use mktemp * Wed Mar 02 2005 Matthias Clasen - 3.7.1-4 - Rebuild with gcc4 libungif-4.1.3-3 ---------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Matthias Clasen 4.1.3-3 - Rebuild with gcc4 libusb-0.1.10-2 --------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Tim Waugh 0.1.10-2 - Rebuild for new GCC. libvorbis-1:1.1.0-2 ------------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 John (J5) Palmieri 1:1.1.0-2 - rebuild with gcc 4.0 libwmf-0.2.8.3-8 ---------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Caolan McNamara 0.2.8.3-8 - rebuild with gcc4 libwnck-2.9.91-2 ---------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Mark McLoughlin 2.9.91-2 - Rebuild with gcc4 libwpd-0.8.0-2 -------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Caolan McNamara 0.8.0-2 - rebuild with gcc4 linux-atm-2.5.0-0.20050118.2 ---------------------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 David Woodhouse 2.5.0-0.20050118.2 - Rebuild with gcc 4 linuxdoc-tools-0.9.21-5 ----------------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Tim Waugh 0.9.21-5 - Rebuild for new GCC. lksctp-tools-1.0.2-5 -------------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Karsten Hopp 1.0.2-5 - build with gcc-4 lm_sensors-2.8.8-5 ------------------ * Wed Mar 02 2005 Phil Knirsch 2.8.8-5 - bump release and rebuild with gcc 4 * Tue Jan 11 2005 Dave Jones 2.8.8-4 - Add dependancy on dmidecode rather than the obsolete kernel-utils. - Don't delete dmidecode from the buildroot. * Thu Dec 23 2004 Phil Knirsch 2.8.8-2 - Fixed typo in initscript (#139030) lynx-2.8.5-22 ------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Tim Waugh 2.8.5-22 - Rebuild for new GCC. m4-1.4.2-3 ---------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Karsten Hopp 1.4.2-3 - build with gcc-4 mingetty-1.07-5 --------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Karsten Hopp 1.07-5 - build with gcc-4 mpage-2.5.4-5 ------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Tim Waugh 2.5.4-5 - Rebuild for new GCC. mtools-3.9.9-11 --------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Tim Waugh 3.9.9-11 - Rebuild for new GCC. mtr-2:0.69-3 ------------ * Wed Mar 02 2005 Phil Knirsch 2:0.69-3 - bump release and rebuild with gcc 4 nano-1.3.5-0.20050302 --------------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 David Woodhouse 1.3.5-0.20050302 - Update to post-1.3.5 CVS tree to get UTF-8 support. nautilus-2.9.91-2 ----------------- * Thu Mar 03 2005 Alex Larsson 2.9.91-2 - Rebuild ncftp-2:3.1.8-4 --------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Karsten Hopp 2:3.1.8-4 - build with gcc-4 netdump-0.7.7-5 --------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Jeff Moyer - 0.7.7-5 - Add support for auto-detecting the first hop on the way to the netdump server. nmap-2:3.81-1 ------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Harald Hoyer - 2:3.81-1 - version 3.81 oaf-0.6.10-12 ------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Mark McLoughlin 0.6.10-12 - Rebuild with gcc4 openCryptoki-2.1.5-9 -------------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Phil Knirsch 2.1.5-6.9 - bump release and rebuild with gcc 4 openobex-1.0.1-3 ---------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Harald Hoyer - rebuilt openobex-apps-1.0.0-8 --------------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Harald Hoyer - rebuilt openswan-2.3.0-5 ---------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Harald Hoyer - rebuilt ots-0.4.2-4 ----------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Caolan McNamara - 0.4.2-4 - rebuild with gcc4 - small lvalue assign patch passivetex-1.25-5 ----------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Tim Waugh 1.25-5 - Use fmtutil-sys instead of fmtutil (bug #150089). * Wed Mar 02 2005 Tim Waugh 1.25-4 - Rebuild for new teTeX. patch-2.5.4-22 -------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Tim Waugh 2.5.4-22 - Rebuild for new GCC. patchutils-0.2.30-4 ------------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Tim Waugh 0.2.30-4 - Rebuild for new GCC. pcmcia-cs-3.2.8-4.12 -------------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 John Linville - Exclude SB emulation registers in config.opts pkgconfig-1:0.15.0-4 -------------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Matthias Clasen - rebuild with gcc4 planner-0.12.1-4 ---------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Caolan McNamara - 0.12.1-4 - rebuild with gcc4 postgresql-8.0.1-4 ------------------ * Wed Mar 02 2005 Tom Lane 8.0.1-4 - Attach Obsoletes: declarations for rh-postgresql to subpackages (bz#144435) - Make Requires: and Prereq: package linkages specify release not only version, as per recent mailing list discussion. postgresql-odbc-08.00.0100-1 ---------------------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Tom Lane 08.00.0100-1 - Update to version 08.00.0100. prctl-1.4-5 ----------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Karsten Hopp 1.4-5 - build with gcc-4 privoxy-3.0.3-7 --------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Karsten Hopp 3.0.3-7 - build with gcc-4 rarpd-ss981107-20 ----------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Phil Knirsch ss981107-20 - bump release and rebuild with gcc 4 rcs-5.7-28 ---------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Phil Knirsch 5.7-28 - bump release and rebuild with gcc 4 * Sun Feb 13 2005 Florian La Roche 5.7-27 - add spec change from #144485 * Tue Sep 21 2004 Phil Knirsch 5.7-26 - rebuilt rdate-1.4-4 ----------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Phil Knirsch 1.4-4 - bump release and rebuild with gcc 4 rdesktop-1.3.1-7 ---------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Mark McLoughlin 1.3.1-7 - Rebuild with gcc4 rdist-1:6.1.5-40 ---------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Phil Knirsch 6.1.5-40 - bump release and rebuild with gcc 4 readline-5.0-3 -------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Tim Waugh 5.0-3 - Rebuild for new GCC. redhat-artwork-0.120-6 ---------------------- * Thu Mar 03 2005 Alex Larsson 0.120-6 - Rebuild rhdb-utils-4.0-3 ---------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Tom Lane 4.0-3 - Rebuild for gcc4 update. rpmdb-fedora-1:4-0.20050303 --------------------------- rsync-2.6.3-3 ------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Jay Fenlason 2.6.3-3 - bump release, rebuild with gcc4 - pass RPM_OPT_FLAGS to make rusers-0.17-43 -------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Phil Knirsch 0.17-43 - bump release and rebuild with gcc 4 rwall-0.17-25 ------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Phil Knirsch 0.17-25 - bump release and rebuild with gcc 4 s390utils-2:1.3.2-4 ------------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Phil Knirsch 2:1.3.2-4 - bump release and rebuild with gcc 4 sane-backends-1.0.15-9 ---------------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Tim Waugh 1.0.15-9 - Rebuild for new GCC. sane-frontends-1.0.13-2 ----------------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Tim Waugh 1.0.13-2 - Rebuild for new GCC. sash-3.7-6 ---------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Karsten Hopp 3.7-6 - build with gcc-4 screen-4.0.2-7 -------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Petr Rockai - 4.0.2-7 - rebuild selinux-policy-strict-1.21.15-5 ------------------------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Dan Walsh 1.21.15-5 - Remove cyrus_r selinux-policy-targeted-1.21.15-5 --------------------------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Dan Walsh 1.21.15-5 - Remove cyrus_r setools-2.0.0-1 --------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Dan Walsh 2.0.0-6 - Update to latest from tresys * Mon Nov 29 2004 Dan Walsh 1.5.1-6 - add FALLBACK=true to /etc/security/console.apps/apol setserial-2.17-19 ----------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Tim Waugh 2.17-19 - Rebuild for new GCC. sg3_utils-1.06-5 ---------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Phil Knirsch 1.06-5 - bump release and rebuild with gcc 4 slang-1.4.9-16 -------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Petr Rockai - rebuild speex-1.0.4-5 ------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 John (J5) Palmieri -1.0.4-5 - rebuild for gcc 4.0 startup-notification-0.8-2 -------------------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Mark McLoughlin 0.8-2 - Rebuild with gcc4 statserial-1.1-37 ----------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Tim Waugh 1.1-37 - Rebuild for new GCC. swig-1.3.24-2 ------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Phil Knirsch 1.3.24-2 - bump release and rebuild with gcc 4 symlinks-1.2-24 --------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Tim Waugh 1.2-24 - Rebuild for new GCC. sysfsutils-1.2.0-4 ------------------ * Wed Mar 02 2005 AJ Lewis 1.2.0-4 - Rebuild system-config-httpd-5:1.3.1-2 ----------------------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Phil Knirsch 1.3.1-2 - bump release and rebuild with gcc 4 telnet-1:0.17-34 ---------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Harald Hoyer - rebuilt texinfo-4.8-3 ------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Tim Waugh 4.8-3 - Rebuild for new GCC. time-1.7-27 ----------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Karsten Hopp 1.7-27 - build with gcc-4 tree-1.5.0-3 ------------ * Wed Mar 02 2005 Tim Waugh 1.5.0-3 - Rebuild for new GCC. tsclient-0.132-5 ---------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Mark McLoughlin 0.132-5 - Rebuild with gcc4 udev-050-8 ---------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Harald Hoyer - 050-8 - fixed rh#144598 usermode-1.79-1 --------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Jindrich Novy 1.79-1 - fix problem with root passwords starting with space (#124980) vconfig-1.8-7 ------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Phil Knirsch 1.8-7 - bump release and rebuild with gcc 4 vim-1:6.3.062-1 --------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Karsten Hopp 6.3.062-1 - patchlevel 62, build with gcc-4 * Thu Feb 10 2005 Karsten Hopp 6.3.061-3 - spec.vim fix from Andrew Overholt vino-2.9.2-2 ------------ * Wed Mar 02 2005 Mark McLoughlin 2.9.2-2 - Rebuild with gcc4 vnc-4.0-15 ---------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Tim Waugh 4.0-15 - Upgraded base package to xorg-x11-6.8.2-6. - Rebuild for new GCC. vorbis-tools-1:1.0.1-5 ---------------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 John (J5) Palmieri 1:1.0.1-5 - rebuild with gcc 4.0 vsftpd-2.0.1-10 --------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Radek Vokal 2.0.1-10 - rebuilt against gcc4 and new openssl wget-1.9.1-22 ------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Karsten Hopp 1.9.1-22 - build with gcc-4 x3270-3.3.3.b1-2 ---------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Karsten Hopp 3.3.3.b1-2 - build with gcc-4 * Thu Jan 13 2005 Karsten Hopp 3.3.3.b1-1 - update to fix ibm_hosts file parsing and c3270 color support xmltex-20020625-5 ----------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Tim Waugh 20020625-5 - Use fmtutil-sys instead of fmtutil (bug #150089). - Use etex/pdfetex as engine. * Wed Mar 02 2005 Tim Waugh 20020625-4 - Rebuild for new teTeX. xmlto-0.0.18-6 -------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Tim Waugh 0.0.18-6 - Rebuild for new GCC. xorg-x11-6.8.2-6 ---------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Mike A. Harris 6.8.2-6 - Added xorg-x11-6.8.2-ati-radeon-gcc4-fix.patch to fix bug in radeon driver when building with gcc 4. (#150086) * Tue Mar 01 2005 Mike A. Harris 6.8.2-5 - Conditionalize the gcc4 patch for FC4 only for now. - Disable FORTIFY_SOURCE on RHEL4/FC3 builds as it fails for some odd reason, yet it builds ok on FC4. - Added xorg-x11-6.8.2-ati-radeon-disable-broken-renderaccel-by-default.patch to disable render acceleration by default in the "radeon" driver, as it is currently broken (#136065,136941,149907,143401,143234) * Tue Mar 01 2005 Soeren Sandmann 6.8.2-4 - Fix somehow empty patch file xsane-0.95-3 ------------ * Wed Mar 02 2005 Tim Waugh 0.95-3 - Rebuild for new GCC. From ndbecker2 at verizon.net Thu Mar 3 15:39:32 2005 From: ndbecker2 at verizon.net (Neal Becker) Date: Thu, 03 Mar 2005 10:39:32 -0500 Subject: unionfs-1.0.9 works Message-ID: Just to let you know, I tested unionfs-1.0.9 on 2.6.9-1.724_FC3 (x86_64), and it seems to work fine. Another interesting addition for FC4? From shahms at shahms.com Thu Mar 3 16:00:13 2005 From: shahms at shahms.com (Shahms King) Date: Thu, 03 Mar 2005 08:00:13 -0800 Subject: unionfs-1.0.9 works In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1109865613.11074.50.camel@shahms.mesd.k12.or.us> On Thu, 2005-03-03 at 10:39 -0500, Neal Becker wrote: > Just to let you know, I tested unionfs-1.0.9 on 2.6.9-1.724_FC3 (x86_64), > and it seems to work fine. Another interesting addition for FC4? unionfs seems like the perfect compliment to Stateless, hint, hint. -- Shahms E. King Multnomah ESD Public Key: http://shahms.mesd.k12.or.us/~sking/shahms.asc Fingerprint: 1612 054B CE92 8770 F1EA AB1B FEAB 3636 45B2 D75B -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part URL: From kyrre at solution-forge.net Thu Mar 3 16:23:58 2005 From: kyrre at solution-forge.net (Kyrre Ness Sjobak) Date: Thu, 03 Mar 2005 17:23:58 +0100 Subject: Who is broken when hotplug,udev and hal are causing high cpu load? In-Reply-To: <4226DB54.90406@feuerpokemon.de> References: <4226DB54.90406@feuerpokemon.de> Message-ID: <1109867037.3448.0.camel@localhost.localdomain> tor, 03.03.2005 kl. 10.39 skrev dragoran: > I bought a new card usb2 card reader. Sometimes when I plug a sd card > into it all hotplug programs cause 60-80% cpu load and nothing happens > (no mount) sometimes it just works. > I want to fill this into bugzilla but dunno against what? > When this happens dmesg reports many Buffer I/O erros. I always have to unplug/replug my USB card reader when i insert a card for the pc to discover it From kyrre at solution-forge.net Thu Mar 3 16:26:19 2005 From: kyrre at solution-forge.net (Kyrre Ness Sjobak) Date: Thu, 03 Mar 2005 17:26:19 +0100 Subject: Hacking modversions In-Reply-To: <1109796584.16819.0.camel@cutter> References: <1109709742.15242.8.camel@baythorne.infradead.org> <1109717812.15915.9.camel@dyckola> <1109718603.14010.23.camel@daxter.boston.redhat.com> <1109788544.30922.21.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1109796584.16819.0.camel@cutter> Message-ID: <1109867179.3448.2.camel@localhost.localdomain> ons, 02.03.2005 kl. 21.49 skrev seth vidal: > >> is available. However, kernel-module-foobar is not updated yet so the > >> update transaction fail (ok, maybe it's something other than Conflicts, > >> expert packagers would know). > >*snip* > > > >Or will yum just bail out "hey there is a conflict here, so i won't do > >ANYTHING AT ALL!!!*? > > If there is an explicit conflict, yes, yum will exit and report the > conflicting packages. > > -sv > Why not inform you of the situation, and update the packages for which there are no problems? From jkeating at j2solutions.net Thu Mar 3 16:47:40 2005 From: jkeating at j2solutions.net (Jesse Keating) Date: Thu, 03 Mar 2005 08:47:40 -0800 Subject: Targetting OEM's (Re: reducing distribution CD count) In-Reply-To: <20050303100114.17622.qmail@web8501.mail.in.yahoo.com> References: <20050303100114.17622.qmail@web8501.mail.in.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1109868460.4902.17.camel@localhost.localdomain> On Thu, 2005-03-03 at 02:01 -0800, Rahul Sundaram wrote: > > yes. thats part of the solution. thanks for the > pointer. However fedora projects needs to do something > like this in a official way. maybe update the ISO > images every other week or so with all the updates > till then. > Targetting OEM's probably requires more than just this As an OEM thats not going to work. We master the original CDs with our logos and Fedora's logos and such. This is a rather large cost at release time, but we have to do it in a big chunk. To do this every week is insane. Instead we maintain an 'update' CD we burn manually and sticker label that we send w/ the system for re-install purposes. Making this CD available for use DURING install is a good goal. -- Jesse Keating RHCE (http://geek.j2solutions.net) Fedora Legacy Team (http://www.fedoralegacy.org) GPG Public Key (http://geek.j2solutions.net/jkeating.j2solutions.pub) Was I helpful? Let others know: http://svcs.affero.net/rm.php?r=jkeating -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part URL: From katzj at redhat.com Thu Mar 3 16:59:27 2005 From: katzj at redhat.com (Jeremy Katz) Date: Thu, 03 Mar 2005 11:59:27 -0500 Subject: Targetting OEM's (Re: reducing distribution CD count) In-Reply-To: <1109868460.4902.17.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <20050303100114.17622.qmail@web8501.mail.in.yahoo.com> <1109868460.4902.17.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <1109869168.3333.30.camel@bree.local.net> On Thu, 2005-03-03 at 08:47 -0800, Jesse Keating wrote: > On Thu, 2005-03-03 at 02:01 -0800, Rahul Sundaram wrote: > > yes. thats part of the solution. thanks for the > > pointer. However fedora projects needs to do something > > like this in a official way. maybe update the ISO > > images every other week or so with all the updates > > till then. > > Targetting OEM's probably requires more than just this > > As an OEM thats not going to work. We master the original CDs with our > logos and Fedora's logos and such. This is a rather large cost at > release time, but we have to do it in a big chunk. To do this every > week is insane. Instead we maintain an 'update' CD we burn manually and > sticker label that we send w/ the system for re-install purposes. > Making this CD available for use DURING install is a good goal. Unfortunately, if you try to use it during the install process, you end up having to switch CDs a bazillion times due to package ordering concerns. That or you have to do some ugly things with precaching packages to be installed on the hard drive. And that's assuming there aren't significant dependency changes that throw things more for a loop :/ Jeremy From jkeating at j2solutions.net Thu Mar 3 17:10:21 2005 From: jkeating at j2solutions.net (Jesse Keating) Date: Thu, 03 Mar 2005 09:10:21 -0800 Subject: Targetting OEM's (Re: reducing distribution CD count) In-Reply-To: <1109869168.3333.30.camel@bree.local.net> References: <20050303100114.17622.qmail@web8501.mail.in.yahoo.com> <1109868460.4902.17.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1109869168.3333.30.camel@bree.local.net> Message-ID: <1109869821.4902.25.camel@localhost.localdomain> On Thu, 2005-03-03 at 11:59 -0500, Jeremy Katz wrote: > Unfortunately, if you try to use it during the install process, you > end > up having to switch CDs a bazillion times due to package ordering > concerns. That or you have to do some ugly things with precaching > packages to be installed on the hard drive. > > And that's assuming there aren't significant dependency changes that > throw things more for a loop :/ sure, for inline usage. What about something less elegant, like 'Do you have an update CD? Oh you do? Lets install these updates now'. Sure it's ugly in that we already installed the package once, but it gets the job done. Thats essentially what I'm going now somehwhat manually w/ our post-install CDs. -- Jesse Keating RHCE (http://geek.j2solutions.net) Fedora Legacy Team (http://www.fedoralegacy.org) GPG Public Key (http://geek.j2solutions.net/jkeating.j2solutions.pub) Was I helpful? Let others know: http://svcs.affero.net/rm.php?r=jkeating -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part URL: From aoliva at redhat.com Thu Mar 3 18:01:57 2005 From: aoliva at redhat.com (Alexandre Oliva) Date: 03 Mar 2005 15:01:57 -0300 Subject: reducing distribution CD count In-Reply-To: <27767.192.54.193.137.1109856202.squirrel@rousalka.dyndns.org> References: <200503011358.j21Dw2st000363@leto.astradyne.corp> <604aa7910503011358404ec6b3@mail.gmail.com> <200503030804.28115.czar@czarc.net> <27767.192.54.193.137.1109856202.squirrel@rousalka.dyndns.org> Message-ID: On Mar 3, 2005, "Nicolas Mailhot" wrote: > This is pretty trivial to do with a small script that calls yum in a temp > root and tells it to look at on-cd repodata. Only if everything fits in a single medium. Since FE is quickly approaching the size of a 4.7GB DVD, what are the odds? -- Alexandre Oliva http://www.ic.unicamp.br/~oliva/ Red Hat Compiler Engineer aoliva@{redhat.com, gcc.gnu.org} Free Software Evangelist oliva@{lsd.ic.unicamp.br, gnu.org} From abo at kth.se Thu Mar 3 18:03:46 2005 From: abo at kth.se (Alexander =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Bostr=F6m?=) Date: Thu, 03 Mar 2005 19:03:46 +0100 Subject: rawhide report: 20050301 changes In-Reply-To: References: <200503011908.j21J8lsr013948@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <1109716755.19111.11.camel@tudor.e.kth.se> Message-ID: <1109873027.19111.16.camel@tudor.e.kth.se> ons 2005-03-02 klockan 10:05 -0600 skrev Jason L Tibbitts III: > Looks like Tomas Mraz was listening. Yeah, that's great! By the way, I'll be surprised if this change breaks anything. /abo From Nicolas.Mailhot at laPoste.net Thu Mar 3 18:13:12 2005 From: Nicolas.Mailhot at laPoste.net (Nicolas Mailhot) Date: Thu, 03 Mar 2005 19:13:12 +0100 Subject: reducing distribution CD count In-Reply-To: References: <200503011358.j21Dw2st000363@leto.astradyne.corp> <604aa7910503011358404ec6b3@mail.gmail.com> <200503030804.28115.czar@czarc.net> <27767.192.54.193.137.1109856202.squirrel@rousalka.dyndns.org> Message-ID: <1109873592.21206.5.camel@rousalka.dyndns.org> Le jeudi 03 mars 2005 ? 15:01 -0300, Alexandre Oliva a ?crit : > On Mar 3, 2005, "Nicolas Mailhot" wrote: > > > This is pretty trivial to do with a small script that calls yum in a temp > > root and tells it to look at on-cd repodata. > > Only if everything fits in a single medium. Since FE is quickly > approaching the size of a 4.7GB DVD, what are the odds? Surely FE is not so interlinked it should be possible to do independent update disks, right ? Oh wait - I can see the problem if the updated part is a core package that caused 3/4th of FE to be rebuilt;( Regards, -- Nicolas Mailhot -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: Ceci est une partie de message num?riquement sign?e URL: From joe at galway.net Thu Mar 3 18:54:39 2005 From: joe at galway.net (Joe Desbonnet) Date: Thu, 03 Mar 2005 18:54:39 +0000 Subject: A more efficient up2date service using binary diffs Message-ID: <42275D6F.7020705@galway.net> The 'up2date' is a great service, but serveral months after a core release, the bandwidth required to update a freshly installed machine is almost as much as that required to install in the first place. I did a quick experiment: Using the bsdiff binary diff utility (see http://www.daemonology.net/bsdiff/) I compared kernel-2.6.9-1.667.i586.rpm in the FC3/i386 distibution with kernel-2.6.10-1.737_FC3.i586.rpm in the updates. I converted the RPM to a cpio archive with the rpm2cpio utility before running bsdiff. The resulting diff file was 6.2MB in size (compared to 16MB for the entire RPM). I also checked openoffice.org-i18n-1.1.2-10.i386.rpm in the FC3/i386 distribution with openoffice.org-i18n-1.1.2-11.5.fc3.i386.rpm in the updates. The resulting diff file [*] was 1MB (compared to 166MB for the RPM)! Has anyone thought about improving the up2date service by offering diff files in addition to the .rpm files? Joe. [*] (This comparison was more tricky as I didn't have enough RAM to perform the diff directly. Instead I had to split the files into smaller chunks and do a separate diff on each chunk. I guess you would need almost 2GB of RAM to use bsdiff on the OpenOffice RPMs directly. However this memory requirement is for generation of the diff. The patch utility does not require much memory). From aoliva at redhat.com Thu Mar 3 19:33:56 2005 From: aoliva at redhat.com (Alexandre Oliva) Date: 03 Mar 2005 16:33:56 -0300 Subject: A more efficient up2date service using binary diffs In-Reply-To: <42275D6F.7020705@galway.net> References: <42275D6F.7020705@galway.net> Message-ID: On Mar 3, 2005, Joe Desbonnet wrote: > Has anyone thought about improving the up2date service by offering > diff files in addition to the .rpm files? Yup, see mail thread in this very last by the end of January last year, and many others :-) -- Alexandre Oliva http://www.ic.unicamp.br/~oliva/ Red Hat Compiler Engineer aoliva@{redhat.com, gcc.gnu.org} Free Software Evangelist oliva@{lsd.ic.unicamp.br, gnu.org} From eric at snowmoon.com Thu Mar 3 19:55:40 2005 From: eric at snowmoon.com (Eric Warnke) Date: Thu, 03 Mar 2005 14:55:40 -0500 Subject: reducing distribution CD count In-Reply-To: <1109873592.21206.5.camel@rousalka.dyndns.org> References: <200503011358.j21Dw2st000363@leto.astradyne.corp> <604aa7910503011358404ec6b3@mail.gmail.com> <200503030804.28115.czar@czarc.net> <27767.192.54.193.137.1109856202.squirrel@rousalka.dyndns.org> <1109873592.21206.5.camel@rousalka.dyndns.org> Message-ID: <42276BBC.4000806@snowmoon.com> All this talk and not much action on the reduction in CD count. I did some poking and proding of FC3 to see what we could get it down to. I discovered that base had a bad dependancy issue that cuased much more to be pulled into a base install than was necessary becase kdebindings was claiming ownership of /usr/lib/python2.3. Once I started using base+updates everything sorted itself out nicely. Basicly I require 115mb of RPM's ( decompressed ~250mb in about 45 seconds ) in order to bootstrap a system up to the point where yum becomes usable. I then copy resolv.conf and chroot into the system. I can then run yum install [package] without problem. It turned out to be much easier than I expected and I'm thinking of continuing to use this process moving forward to build a simple yum based net install system in house. I figure I can modify the rescue cd to accomplish this task, possibly having enough room to also add a basic gnome install. I think some of the scripts were failing because of some undeclared dependancies on files that need to be created by an installer, specifically /etc/fstab, so if someone has documentation on bootstrapping a Fedora based system that would be helpful. Cheers, Eric Warnke System Administrator - Research IT SUNY at Albany -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 252 bytes Desc: OpenPGP digital signature URL: From moe at blagblagblag.org Thu Mar 3 20:35:05 2005 From: moe at blagblagblag.org (jeff) Date: Thu, 3 Mar 2005 13:35:05 -0700 Subject: reducing distribution CD count In-Reply-To: <42276BBC.4000806@snowmoon.com> References: <200503011358.j21Dw2st000363@leto.astradyne.corp> <1109873592.21206.5.camel@rousalka.dyndns.org> <42276BBC.4000806@snowmoon.com> Message-ID: <200503031335.05497.moe@blagblagblag.org> Eric Warnke wrote: > All this talk and not much action on the reduction in CD > count. > > I did some poking and proding of FC3 to see what we could get > it down to. I discovered that base had a bad dependancy > issue that cuased much more to be pulled into a base install > than was necessary becase kdebindings was claiming ownership > of /usr/lib/python2.3. Once I started using base+updates > everything sorted itself out nicely. > > Basicly I require 115mb of RPM's ( decompressed ~250mb in > about 45 seconds ) in order to bootstrap a system up to the > point where yum becomes usable. I then copy resolv.conf and > chroot into the system. I can then run yum install [package] > without problem. It turned out to be much easier than I > expected and I'm thinking of continuing to use this process > moving forward to build a simple yum based net install system > in house. I figure I can modify the rescue cd to accomplish > this task, possibly having enough room to also add a basic > gnome install. > > I think some of the scripts were failing because of some > undeclared dependancies on files that need to be created by > an installer, specifically /etc/fstab, so if someone has > documentation on bootstrapping a Fedora based system that > would be helpful. I made an installable fc3 version down to 95 megs of RPMs for a total ISO size of 288M (*.img are bigger than needed and could be reduced too). Peek here: ftp://ftp.blagblagblag.org/pub/BLAG/contrib/minifc3/ -Jeff From tadams-lists at myrealbox.com Thu Mar 3 20:52:45 2005 From: tadams-lists at myrealbox.com (Trever L. Adams) Date: Thu, 03 Mar 2005 13:52:45 -0700 Subject: OO.org2 Message-ID: <1109883166.5179.4.camel@localhost.localdomain> So, it is in a beta candidate release now. The question is, is it going to be considered for FC4 or is FC4 going to be 1.1.x? Trever -- "Black holes are where God divided by zero." -- Unknown From kyrre at solution-forge.net Thu Mar 3 21:39:39 2005 From: kyrre at solution-forge.net (Kyrre Ness Sjobak) Date: Thu, 03 Mar 2005 22:39:39 +0100 Subject: rawhide report: 20050302 changes In-Reply-To: <422648B9.8070300@insitesinc.com> References: <200503021815.j22IFnMu027490@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <422648B9.8070300@insitesinc.com> Message-ID: <1109885979.3448.5.camel@localhost.localdomain> tor, 03.03.2005 kl. 00.14 skrev Michael Favia: > Build System wrote: > > >hpijs-1.7.1-3 > >------------- > >* Tue Mar 01 2005 Tim Waugh 1.7.1-3 > >- Rebuilt for new GCC. > > > > > Isnt hplip the preferred driver assortment from HP these days? Im > unaware of any conflicts so i dont mean to step on anyones toes but is > there any reason they arent being included in rawhide/for fc4? The > project unifies hpijs and provides a unified single and multi-function > connectivity solution to some 300 hp models (printing, faxing, scanning, > photo-card access, and device management ). It also seems to have worked > a good number of the bugs out and seems to be the recommended default > from HP. The driver architecture sure looks pretty: > http://hpinkjet.sourceforge.net/architecture.php and it works for me > locally for sometime. > > -mf Well, i personaly use the old driver (hpdj?) for a HP2000C Inkjet. Terrible print quality and speed, but at least it dosn't believe the paper is 2 metres wide... Kyrre From kyrre at solution-forge.net Thu Mar 3 21:44:08 2005 From: kyrre at solution-forge.net (Kyrre Ness Sjobak) Date: Thu, 03 Mar 2005 22:44:08 +0100 Subject: rawhide report: 20050301 changes In-Reply-To: <1109819929.4045.10.camel@trevally.redfishdemo.com> References: <200503011908.j21J8lsr013948@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <1109788217.30922.19.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1109806409.3652.1.camel@trevally.redfishdemo.com> <1109813967.19398.1.camel@cutter> <1109819929.4045.10.camel@trevally.redfishdemo.com> Message-ID: <1109886247.3448.9.camel@localhost.localdomain> tor, 03.03.2005 kl. 04.18 skrev Rodd Clarkson: > On Wed, 2005-03-02 at 20:39 -0500, seth vidal wrote: > >On Thu, 2005-03-03 at 10:33 +1100, Rodd Clarkson wrote: > >>On Wed, 2005-03-02 at 19:30 +0100, Kyrre Ness Sjobak wrote: > >>>> Removed package gcc4 > >>> > >>>Hmm? Didn't somebody just say "fc4 has gcc 4 as default"?!? > >> > >>Well, after that barrage of responses, I think Kyrre might have learnt > >>something (maybe not to ask in the future) > >> > >>Kyrre, don't feel victimized over this. None of them slept well last > >>night and they just needed to get out the angst. ;-] > > > >I don't think anyone meant any harm to Kyrre. It's just a series of > >uncoordinated responses. > > I sure it was just a coincidence. Maybe I should have wrapped my > remarks in a tags. ;-] Hilfe! That *was* a storm. Thanks for caring... First, saw the list of replies just going on and on... Hmm... have raised something important. *click* first mail "dont feel victimized over this"... wtf? After all, i probably should have seen that gcc4 now is gcc-4.0. But how will gcc3 be shipped? gcc-compat (as usual? brings up the whole so-version conflict... I think i shall let that rest in the sand. Kyrre From kyrre at solution-forge.net Thu Mar 3 21:48:54 2005 From: kyrre at solution-forge.net (Kyrre Ness Sjobak) Date: Thu, 03 Mar 2005 22:48:54 +0100 Subject: Intel Pro Wireless cards In-Reply-To: <422698F3.7090201@snowmoon.com> References: <4223505B.20402@snowmoon.com> <4223CFA8.2000308@insitesinc.com> <1109819951.4045.11.camel@trevally.redfishdemo.com> <422698F3.7090201@snowmoon.com> Message-ID: <1109886533.3448.12.camel@localhost.localdomain> tor, 03.03.2005 kl. 05.56 skrev Eric Warnke: > I know this will open a large can of worms, so please take this message > as mearly a way of opening a dialog on the subject. > > Objecive 2 of the Fedora "contract" specifies that it should be built > exclusivly from open source software. > > But is firmware software? It is more like a document, image, or other > fixed item. What about Creative Commons "by" and "by-nd" licensed > documentation are those items locked out of Fedora as well? > > I think we should re-evaluate the belief that locking out "free as in > beer" firmware ( and all firmware is only "free as in beer" unless they > provide the source ) is the proper action for the community when these > files enable open source operating systems to interact with otherwise > propratary hardware. I think that the first objective of the "contract" > is to provide a general operating system platform equivilant to other > competing systems must be evaluated before locking these files out. To > say that these types of firmware are no longer welcome I think will hurt > us long term as the hardware get smarter and more flexable. > Communications hardware especially that are generally bound by one or > more legal body to constrain it's abilities. Hardware manufactures who > open their hardware to blanket hacking risk loosing the license to sell > the hardware, so don't expect them to open the firmware as that is > legally not an option for them. > > Is this lock out based on ideology or reality. Including "free as in > beer" firmware does not compromise the ability to redistribute Fedora > freely and I think it moves us closer to the goal of a genreal-purpose > operating system out of the box. It improves user feedback and reduces > problamatic and frustrating installs for both users and the people that > are drawn in to help new users get past these repetitive and common > problems. > > Cheers, > Eric IMO firmware is just a part of the hardware. It's not something running on the main CPU etc. Besides, the chances to get it opened, are probably really small From perbj at stanford.edu Thu Mar 3 22:13:09 2005 From: perbj at stanford.edu (Per Bjornsson) Date: Thu, 03 Mar 2005 14:13:09 -0800 Subject: rawhide report: 20050301 changes In-Reply-To: <1109886247.3448.9.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <200503011908.j21J8lsr013948@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <1109788217.30922.19.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1109806409.3652.1.camel@trevally.redfishdemo.com> <1109813967.19398.1.camel@cutter> <1109819929.4045.10.camel@trevally.redfishdemo.com> <1109886247.3448.9.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <1109887989.5463.23.camel@localhost.localdomain> On Thu, 2005-03-03 at 22:44 +0100, Kyrre Ness Sjobak wrote: > After all, i probably should have seen that gcc4 now is gcc-4.0. But how > will gcc3 be shipped? gcc-compat (as usual? brings up the whole > so-version conflict... I think i shall let that rest in the sand. Wait... care to explain what the problem is? As far as I can tell, compat-gcc contains GCC 3.3. and gcc contains GCC 4. There shouldn't be any need to ship both GCC 3.4 and 4.0 for ABI reasons; they are supposed to be compatible, and thus libstdc++ will keep the same major soversion. (I guess that the reason for shipping compat-gcc at all is to be able to provide a complete LSB environment? Or is anything in the distro actually built with the compat toolchain?) /Per -- Per Bjornsson Ph.D. Candidate, Department of Applied Physics, Stanford University From paul at all-the-johnsons.co.uk Thu Mar 3 23:10:59 2005 From: paul at all-the-johnsons.co.uk (Paul) Date: Thu, 03 Mar 2005 23:10:59 +0000 Subject: OO.org2 In-Reply-To: <1109883166.5179.4.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <1109883166.5179.4.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <1109891460.5035.1.camel@localhost.localdomain> Hi, > So, it is in a beta candidate release now. The question is, is it going > to be considered for FC4 or is FC4 going to be 1.1.x? FC4 has slipped from the schedule slightly, so it the chances are that if OOo2 is released (say) 1st week of April as a release, it stands a good chance of being in. Of course, I don't work for RH, so could be just speaking out of my backside on that one. TTFN Paul -- "I like blinking me" - Helen, Big Brother 2 contestant -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part URL: From paul at all-the-johnsons.co.uk Thu Mar 3 23:14:13 2005 From: paul at all-the-johnsons.co.uk (Paul) Date: Thu, 03 Mar 2005 23:14:13 +0000 Subject: Current kernel problems (2.6.11-1.1164_FC4) + Qt Message-ID: <1109891653.5035.6.camel@localhost.localdomain> Hi, Looks like both sound and network is somewhat broken with the newest version of the kernel. Sound - no cards detected (fine under 2.6.10-1.1155_FC4) Network - found the card, but gave an error which meant nothing from the outside world was allowed (fine under 2.6.10-1.1155_FC4) Qt - seems somewhat broken (tab handles are all over the place) TTFN Paul -- "I like blinking me" - Helen, Big Brother 2 contestant -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part URL: From notting at redhat.com Thu Mar 3 23:45:16 2005 From: notting at redhat.com (Bill Nottingham) Date: Thu, 3 Mar 2005 18:45:16 -0500 Subject: rawhide report: 20050301 changes In-Reply-To: <1109887989.5463.23.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <200503011908.j21J8lsr013948@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <1109788217.30922.19.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1109806409.3652.1.camel@trevally.redfishdemo.com> <1109813967.19398.1.camel@cutter> <1109819929.4045.10.camel@trevally.redfishdemo.com> <1109886247.3448.9.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1109887989.5463.23.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <20050303234516.GA16048@nostromo.devel.redhat.com> Per Bjornsson (perbj at stanford.edu) said: > Wait... care to explain what the problem is? As far as I can tell, > compat-gcc contains GCC 3.3. and gcc contains GCC 4. There > shouldn't be any need to ship both GCC 3.4 and 4.0 for ABI reasons; they > are supposed to be compatible, and thus libstdc++ will keep the same > major soversion. It's compatible for C and C++. Not so for Fortran and JAva. > (I guess that the reason for shipping compat-gcc at all > is to be able to provide a complete LSB environment? Or is anything in > the distro actually built with the compat toolchain?) OpenOffice *may* be. It doesn't build with gcc4, as I recall. Bill From rodd at clarkson.id.au Thu Mar 3 23:45:35 2005 From: rodd at clarkson.id.au (Rodd Clarkson) Date: Fri, 04 Mar 2005 10:45:35 +1100 Subject: Intel Pro Wireless cards In-Reply-To: <20050302023140.GA7955@redhat.com> References: <4223505B.20402@snowmoon.com> <1109612007.14468.7.camel@dcbw.boston.redhat.com> <1109724106.3724.19.camel@trevally.redfishdemo.com> <20050302005919.GF2421@stanford.edu> <1109730582.3599.4.camel@trevally.redfishdemo.com> <20050302023140.GA7955@redhat.com> Message-ID: <1109893535.15096.9.camel@trevally.redfishdemo.com> On Tue, 2005-03-01 at 21:31 -0500, Dave Jones wrote: > it's been on my todo list for a while. I'll get to it this week. > rawhide will get it in the next day or two hopefully. > fc2/fc3 will probably be in the update after next. > > Dave > Dave, Noted that 'strings ipw2200.ko | less' on kernel-2.6.11-1.1166_FC4 now shows: <6>ipw2200: Intel(R) PRO/Wireless 2200/2915 Network Driver, 1.0.0 so I think it's time to say, "Thank you very much." Thank you very much! Rodd From rodd at clarkson.id.au Thu Mar 3 23:50:48 2005 From: rodd at clarkson.id.au (Rodd Clarkson) Date: Fri, 04 Mar 2005 10:50:48 +1100 Subject: Current kernel problems (2.6.11-1.1164_FC4) + Qt In-Reply-To: <1109891653.5035.6.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <1109891653.5035.6.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <1109893848.15096.11.camel@trevally.redfishdemo.com> On Thu, 2005-03-03 at 23:14 +0000, Paul wrote: > Looks like both sound and network is somewhat broken with the newest > version of the kernel. > > Sound - no cards detected (fine under 2.6.10-1.1155_FC4) > Network - found the card, but gave an error which meant nothing from the > outside world was allowed (fine under 2.6.10-1.1155_FC4) Paul, There are similar problems with 2.6.11-1.1166_FC4. Dave Jones (who does the kernel stuff) said that it's related to this bug: bugzilla 150150 Rodd -- >From the pain come the dream >From the dream come the vision >From the vision come the people >From the people come the power >From this power come the change - Peter Gabriel From elanthis at awesomeplay.com Fri Mar 4 00:20:10 2005 From: elanthis at awesomeplay.com (Sean Middleditch) Date: Thu, 03 Mar 2005 19:20:10 -0500 Subject: Current kernel problems (2.6.11-1.1164_FC4) + Qt In-Reply-To: <1109891653.5035.6.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <1109891653.5035.6.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <1109895610.6111.2.camel@stargrazer.home.awesomeplay.com> On Thu, 2005-03-03 at 23:14 +0000, Paul wrote: > Hi, > > Looks like both sound and network is somewhat broken with the newest > version of the kernel. > > Sound - no cards detected (fine under 2.6.10-1.1155_FC4) > Network - found the card, but gave an error which meant nothing from the > outside world was allowed (fine under 2.6.10-1.1155_FC4) Just manually add a default route as a short-term workaround. For my network, with 192.168.1.2 as the gateway, it's su -c '/bin/route add -net default gw 192.168.1.2' > Qt - seems somewhat broken (tab handles are all over the place) > > TTFN > > Paul > -- > fedora-devel-list mailing list > fedora-devel-list at redhat.com > http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-list -- Sean Middleditch From elanthis at awesomeplay.com Fri Mar 4 00:21:41 2005 From: elanthis at awesomeplay.com (Sean Middleditch) Date: Thu, 03 Mar 2005 19:21:41 -0500 Subject: rawhide report: 20050301 changes In-Reply-To: <1109887989.5463.23.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <200503011908.j21J8lsr013948@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <1109788217.30922.19.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1109806409.3652.1.camel@trevally.redfishdemo.com> <1109813967.19398.1.camel@cutter> <1109819929.4045.10.camel@trevally.redfishdemo.com> <1109886247.3448.9.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1109887989.5463.23.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <1109895701.6111.5.camel@stargrazer.home.awesomeplay.com> On Thu, 2005-03-03 at 14:13 -0800, Per Bjornsson wrote: > On Thu, 2005-03-03 at 22:44 +0100, Kyrre Ness Sjobak wrote: > > After all, i probably should have seen that gcc4 now is gcc-4.0. But how > > will gcc3 be shipped? gcc-compat (as usual? brings up the whole > > so-version conflict... I think i shall let that rest in the sand. > > Wait... care to explain what the problem is? As far as I can tell, > compat-gcc contains GCC 3.3. and gcc contains GCC 4. There > shouldn't be any need to ship both GCC 3.4 and 4.0 for ABI reasons; they > are supposed to be compatible, and thus libstdc++ will keep the same > major soversion. (I guess that the reason for shipping compat-gcc at all > is to be able to provide a complete LSB environment? Or is anything in > the distro actually built with the compat toolchain?) While C/C++ may be ABI compatible, they are not API. I just committed some changes to my own C++ projects to make them compile on GCC 4.0, for example. A lot of C++ software especially may not build on GCC 4.0 until they've been ported (or "bugfixed" depending on how you look at the changes). > > /Per > > -- > Per Bjornsson > Ph.D. Candidate, Department of Applied Physics, Stanford University > -- Sean Middleditch From paul at all-the-johnsons.co.uk Fri Mar 4 00:20:07 2005 From: paul at all-the-johnsons.co.uk (Paul) Date: Fri, 04 Mar 2005 00:20:07 +0000 Subject: Current kernel problems (2.6.11-1.1164_FC4) + Qt In-Reply-To: <1109895610.6111.2.camel@stargrazer.home.awesomeplay.com> References: <1109891653.5035.6.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1109895610.6111.2.camel@stargrazer.home.awesomeplay.com> Message-ID: <1109895608.5035.16.camel@localhost.localdomain> Hi, > > Sound - no cards detected (fine under 2.6.10-1.1155_FC4) > > Network - found the card, but gave an error which meant nothing from the > > outside world was allowed (fine under 2.6.10-1.1155_FC4) > > Just manually add a default route as a short-term workaround. For my > network, with 192.168.1.2 as the gateway, it's > > su -c '/bin/route add -net default gw 192.168.1.2' Doesn't fix the sound problem though - it's somewhat important to what I need. TTFN Paul -- "I like blinking me" - Helen, Big Brother 2 contestant -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part URL: From smooge at gmail.com Fri Mar 4 00:41:19 2005 From: smooge at gmail.com (Stephen J. Smoogen) Date: Thu, 3 Mar 2005 17:41:19 -0700 Subject: Package pruning for FC4 and beyond In-Reply-To: <422092F8.4050003@snowmoon.com> References: <422007DD.1020404@snowmoon.com> <42207BEB.7020000@snowmoon.com> <422086A8.7020200@snowmoon.com> <604aa79105022607043d109bf1@mail.gmail.com> <422092F8.4050003@snowmoon.com> Message-ID: <80d7e4090503031641182ede91@mail.gmail.com> On Sat, 26 Feb 2005 10:17:12 -0500, Eric Warnke wrote: > Jeff, > > This was meant to spark discussion... not to be the end all be all. > > Jeff Spaleta wrote: > > how are you checking for deps? the libtiff deps isnt somthing > > obscure.. its required by gtk2. > > I just want to make sure you aren't wasting your time using a depcheck > > method thats going to be highly unreliable. Are you looking at the > > deps in fc3 or in rawhide? I'm not sure looking at the dep chains in > > fc3 gives an accurate picture for the sake of this discussion. > > I could not find a rpmdb for rawhide. If you wish to send me one I > would be more than happy to use it. I have been using rpm -w > --whatrequires under the full fc3 rpmdb. > > >>dasher - obscure alternate input method ! 10MB > > > > uhm... thats almost an offensive comment... a11y elements are very > > important... just be glad you don't need them. > > If it is used by kde or gnomes accessability feature and used by someone > ( anyone ) I will remove it from consiteration. > > Your other objections are noted, but I stand by freeradius as a > specialty package probably better served in extras. freeradius is used a lot on mixed windows/unix enviroments. You might as well kill kerberos if you kill that one. -- Stephen J Smoogen. CSIRT/Linux System Administrator From skvidal at phy.duke.edu Fri Mar 4 00:47:53 2005 From: skvidal at phy.duke.edu (seth vidal) Date: Thu, 03 Mar 2005 19:47:53 -0500 Subject: Package pruning for FC4 and beyond In-Reply-To: <80d7e4090503031641182ede91@mail.gmail.com> References: <422007DD.1020404@snowmoon.com> <42207BEB.7020000@snowmoon.com> <422086A8.7020200@snowmoon.com> <604aa79105022607043d109bf1@mail.gmail.com> <422092F8.4050003@snowmoon.com> <80d7e4090503031641182ede91@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1109897273.23585.0.camel@cutter> > freeradius is used a lot on mixed windows/unix enviroments. You might > as well kill kerberos if you kill that one. > to be fair, it's not killing, it's just moving. and to my knowledge nothing links to freeradius like things link to krb5. -sv From smooge at gmail.com Fri Mar 4 00:47:45 2005 From: smooge at gmail.com (Stephen J. Smoogen) Date: Thu, 3 Mar 2005 17:47:45 -0700 Subject: Freeradius 1.0.2 Message-ID: <80d7e40905030316471ee1e398@mail.gmail.com> Our freeradius server guys were wondering if an updated .src.rpm was coming into rawhide soon? They are back compiling the fedora rpms to red hat enterprise 3 due to some security plan and development issues that require it. -- Stephen J Smoogen. CSIRT/Linux System Administrator From skvidal at phy.duke.edu Fri Mar 4 00:56:23 2005 From: skvidal at phy.duke.edu (seth vidal) Date: Thu, 03 Mar 2005 19:56:23 -0500 Subject: Freeradius 1.0.2 In-Reply-To: <80d7e40905030316471ee1e398@mail.gmail.com> References: <80d7e40905030316471ee1e398@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1109897783.23585.2.camel@cutter> On Thu, 2005-03-03 at 17:47 -0700, Stephen J. Smoogen wrote: > Our freeradius server guys were wondering if an updated .src.rpm was > coming into rawhide soon? They are back compiling the fedora rpms to > red hat enterprise 3 due to some security plan and development issues > that require it. > yet another good reason to move freeradius to extras. :) -sv From jmkacz at gmail.com Fri Mar 4 01:47:23 2005 From: jmkacz at gmail.com (Jonathan Kaczynski) Date: Thu, 3 Mar 2005 20:47:23 -0500 Subject: Fedora Desktop question Message-ID: <1811aa01050303174765086b44@mail.gmail.com> Hi, I was looking through the Fedora website for information on how Fedora handles all those window managers / desktop environments installed at the same time without affecting each other. I found this page (http://fedora.redhat.com/projects/desktop/) and that is why I am posting to this list. Thank you, Jon From rodd at clarkson.id.au Fri Mar 4 02:11:06 2005 From: rodd at clarkson.id.au (Rodd Clarkson) Date: Fri, 04 Mar 2005 13:11:06 +1100 Subject: rawhide report: 20050303 changes In-Reply-To: <200503031552.j23Fqqer007404@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> References: <200503031552.j23Fqqer007404@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> Message-ID: <1109902266.15096.27.camel@trevally.redfishdemo.com> On Thu, 2005-03-03 at 10:52 -0500, Build System wrote: > diskdumputils-1.0.1-3 > --------------------- > * Wed Mar 02 2005 Dave Anderson 1.0.1-3 > - rebuild with gcc 4. This has had dependancy problems for the last two days. Anyone else seeing this? [rodd at trevally ~]$ sudo yum update Password: Setting up Update Process Setting up Repos development 100% |=========================| 1.1 kB 00:00 Reading repository metadata in from local files developmen: ################################################## 3602/3602 Resolving Dependencies --> Populating transaction set with selected packages. Please wait. ---> Package diskdumputils.i386 0:1.0.1-3 set to be updated --> Running transaction check --> Processing Dependency: devlabel for package: diskdumputils --> Finished Dependency Resolution Error: Missing Dependency: devlabel is needed by package diskdumputils [rodd at trevally ~]$ From cra at WPI.EDU Fri Mar 4 02:16:23 2005 From: cra at WPI.EDU (Chuck R. Anderson) Date: Thu, 3 Mar 2005 21:16:23 -0500 Subject: rawhide report: 20050303 changes In-Reply-To: <1109902266.15096.27.camel@trevally.redfishdemo.com> References: <200503031552.j23Fqqer007404@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <1109902266.15096.27.camel@trevally.redfishdemo.com> Message-ID: <20050304021623.GB10206@angus.ind.WPI.EDU> On Fri, Mar 04, 2005 at 01:11:06PM +1100, Rodd Clarkson wrote: > > diskdumputils-1.0.1-3 > > --------------------- > > * Wed Mar 02 2005 Dave Anderson 1.0.1-3 > > - rebuild with gcc 4. > > This has had dependancy problems for the last two days. Anyone else > seeing this? Yes, and firstboot won't run due to a a failed attempt to import gnomevfs. From rodd at clarkson.id.au Fri Mar 4 02:19:33 2005 From: rodd at clarkson.id.au (Rodd Clarkson) Date: Fri, 04 Mar 2005 13:19:33 +1100 Subject: rawhide report: 20050303 changes In-Reply-To: <1109902266.15096.27.camel@trevally.redfishdemo.com> References: <200503031552.j23Fqqer007404@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <1109902266.15096.27.camel@trevally.redfishdemo.com> Message-ID: <1109902773.15096.30.camel@trevally.redfishdemo.com> On Fri, 2005-03-04 at 13:11 +1100, Rodd Clarkson wrote: > Resolving Dependencies > --> Populating transaction set with selected packages. Please wait. > ---> Package diskdumputils.i386 0:1.0.1-3 set to be updated > --> Running transaction check > --> Processing Dependency: devlabel for package: diskdumputils > --> Finished Dependency Resolution > Error: Missing Dependency: devlabel is needed by package diskdumputils Having a look around I guess that devlabel is related to this: http://linux.dell.com/devlabel/devlabel.html However, I can't see a package called devlabel in rawhide, so maybe it's been named something different? Or, maybe it just has been overlooked and never made it to rawhide. Rodd From Fedora at TQMcube.com Fri Mar 4 02:31:54 2005 From: Fedora at TQMcube.com (David Cary Hart) Date: Thu, 03 Mar 2005 21:31:54 -0500 Subject: kernel-2.6.11-1.1166_FC4.src.rpm Message-ID: <1109903514.3374.5.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> I don't see an option to build a source package. %define buildup %define buildsmp %define buildxen %define builddoc What happened to buildsrc? Did I miss something somewhere? -- Total Quality Management - A Commitment to Excellence Fight Spam: http://www.tqmcube.com/rbldnsd.htm Daily Updates: rsync -t \ tqmcube.com::spamlists/[README.htm][clients][dynamic][relays][asiaspam] http://www.tqmcube.com/spam_trap.htm From mbneto at gmail.com Fri Mar 4 02:33:13 2005 From: mbneto at gmail.com (mbneto) Date: Thu, 3 Mar 2005 22:33:13 -0400 Subject: Current kernel problems (2.6.11-1.1164_FC4) + Qt In-Reply-To: <1109895608.5035.16.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <1109891653.5035.6.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1109895610.6111.2.camel@stargrazer.home.awesomeplay.com> <1109895608.5035.16.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <5cf776b8050303183365e64109@mail.gmail.com> This problem has been aroun for a while (at least from 1140>) in my case. From ivazquez at ivazquez.net Fri Mar 4 02:38:31 2005 From: ivazquez at ivazquez.net (Ignacio Vazquez-Abrams) Date: Thu, 03 Mar 2005 21:38:31 -0500 Subject: kernel-2.6.11-1.1166_FC4.src.rpm In-Reply-To: <1109903514.3374.5.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> References: <1109903514.3374.5.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> Message-ID: <1109903911.7231.20.camel@ignacio.ignacio.lan> On Thu, 2005-03-03 at 21:31 -0500, David Cary Hart wrote: > What happened to buildsrc? Did I miss something somewhere? It died a while back. Use the SRPM instead. -- Ignacio Vazquez-Abrams http://fedora.ivazquez.net/ -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part URL: From Fedora at TQMcube.com Fri Mar 4 02:44:57 2005 From: Fedora at TQMcube.com (David Cary Hart) Date: Thu, 03 Mar 2005 21:44:57 -0500 Subject: kernel-2.6.11-1.1166_FC4.src.rpm In-Reply-To: <1109903911.7231.20.camel@ignacio.ignacio.lan> References: <1109903514.3374.5.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> <1109903911.7231.20.camel@ignacio.ignacio.lan> Message-ID: <1109904297.3374.11.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> On Thu, 2005-03-03 at 21:38 -0500, Ignacio Vazquez-Abrams wrote: > On Thu, 2005-03-03 at 21:31 -0500, David Cary Hart wrote: > > What happened to buildsrc? Did I miss something somewhere? > > It died a while back. Use the SRPM instead. WHAT SRPM? Note that I am referring to "src.rpm" from which I have always been able to build source. The result should be kernel- sourcecode-2.6.11-1.1166_FC4.rpmbuild.i686.rpm. This was accomplished through: %define buildup 0 %define buildsmp 0 %define buildxen 0 %define builddoc 0 %define buildsrc 1 > > -- > fedora-devel-list mailing list > fedora-devel-list at redhat.com > http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-list -- Total Quality Management - A Commitment to Excellence Fight Spam: http://www.tqmcube.com/rbldnsd.htm Daily Updates: rsync -t \ tqmcube.com::spamlists/[README.htm][clients][dynamic][relays][asiaspam] http://www.tqmcube.com/spam_trap.htm From jspaleta at gmail.com Fri Mar 4 02:48:34 2005 From: jspaleta at gmail.com (Jeff Spaleta) Date: Thu, 3 Mar 2005 21:48:34 -0500 Subject: rawhide report: 20050303 changes In-Reply-To: <1109902773.15096.30.camel@trevally.redfishdemo.com> References: <200503031552.j23Fqqer007404@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <1109902266.15096.27.camel@trevally.redfishdemo.com> <1109902773.15096.30.camel@trevally.redfishdemo.com> Message-ID: <604aa79105030318484e603f1e@mail.gmail.com> On Fri, 04 Mar 2005 13:19:33 +1100, Rodd Clarkson wrote: > However, I can't see a package called devlabel in rawhide, so maybe it's > been named something different? > > Or, maybe it just has been overlooked and never made it to rawhide. Or maybe it was removed from fedora core prior to fc3 and the new diskdumputils package has a packaging error. The diskdumputils specfile has an explicit requires on devlabel but devlabel hasnt been available in rawhide afaict since before fc3 release....hmmmm. The package changlog summaries for diskdumputils don't explicitly indicate why the requires on devlabel was recreated. The only mention in the changelog of anything relevant to devlabel (when compared to the devlabel in fc2) is from sep 2004 right around the time devlabel was removed from rawhide... double hmmmm. Sep 03 2004 - Always load scsi_dump and ide-dump because scsi_uniq_id becomes obsolete. scsi_uniq_id is provided by the devlabel package in fc2 and according to the build reports generated to this list devlabel was dropped from rawhide on 20040928. Furthermore i'm doing a grep of all the files in the diskdumputils and im not seeing any references to anything devlabel related. Perhaps someone with better cvs foo than I can delve into the cvs tree for diskdumputils and see if adding the devlabel requires back in actually makes any sense at all. Personally a think an rhel specific Requires on devlabel got accidentally added into the rawhide tree for diskdumputils, and its already filed https://bugzilla.redhat.com/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=150165 -jef From seanlkml at sympatico.ca Fri Mar 4 02:46:58 2005 From: seanlkml at sympatico.ca (Sean) Date: Thu, 3 Mar 2005 21:46:58 -0500 (EST) Subject: kernel-2.6.11-1.1166_FC4.src.rpm In-Reply-To: <1109904297.3374.11.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> References: <1109903514.3374.5.camel@dch.TQMcube.com><1109903911.7231.20.camel@ignacio.ignacio.lan> <1109904297.3374.11.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> Message-ID: <2483.10.10.10.24.1109904418.squirrel@linux1> On Thu, March 3, 2005 9:44 pm, David Cary Hart said: > On Thu, 2005-03-03 at 21:38 -0500, Ignacio Vazquez-Abrams wrote: >> On Thu, 2005-03-03 at 21:31 -0500, David Cary Hart wrote: >> > What happened to buildsrc? Did I miss something somewhere? >> >> It died a while back. Use the SRPM instead. > > WHAT SRPM? Note that I am referring to "src.rpm" from which I have > always been able to build source. The result should be kernel- > sourcecode-2.6.11-1.1166_FC4.rpmbuild.i686.rpm. This was accomplished > through: > Hi David, It's been widely discussed and is mentioned in the release notes. There is no real need for kernel-source as it duplicates the contents of the src.rpm itself. See: http://fcp.homelinux.org/modules/smartfaq/faq.php?faqid=1 Cheers, Sean From Fedora at TQMcube.com Fri Mar 4 02:55:54 2005 From: Fedora at TQMcube.com (David Cary Hart) Date: Thu, 03 Mar 2005 21:55:54 -0500 Subject: kernel-2.6.11-1.1166_FC4.src.rpm In-Reply-To: <2483.10.10.10.24.1109904418.squirrel@linux1> References: <1109903514.3374.5.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> <1109903911.7231.20.camel@ignacio.ignacio.lan> <1109904297.3374.11.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> <2483.10.10.10.24.1109904418.squirrel@linux1> Message-ID: <1109904954.3374.16.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> On Thu, 2005-03-03 at 21:46 -0500, Sean wrote: > On Thu, March 3, 2005 9:44 pm, David Cary Hart said: > > On Thu, 2005-03-03 at 21:38 -0500, Ignacio Vazquez-Abrams wrote: > >> On Thu, 2005-03-03 at 21:31 -0500, David Cary Hart wrote: > >> > What happened to buildsrc? Did I miss something somewhere? > >> > >> It died a while back. Use the SRPM instead. > > > > WHAT SRPM? Note that I am referring to "src.rpm" from which I have > > always been able to build source. The result should be kernel- > > sourcecode-2.6.11-1.1166_FC4.rpmbuild.i686.rpm. This was accomplished > > through: > > > > Hi David, > > It's been widely discussed and is mentioned in the release notes. There > is no real need for kernel-source as it duplicates the contents of the > src.rpm itself. > > See: http://fcp.homelinux.org/modules/smartfaq/faq.php?faqid=1 > No. What has been widely discussed is the elimination of the pre- compiled kernel-source. HOWEVER, I have always been able to compile the kernel-source myself from the src.rpm. The current src.rpm does not have the code necessary for creating kernel-source. There is no way to customize the FC4 kernel without hacking the config files which is a VERY bad idea. I am very well aware of the FC3 release notes. In fact: http://www.tqmcube.com/fc3_custom_kernel.htm -- Total Quality Management - A Commitment to Excellence Fight Spam: http://www.tqmcube.com/rbldnsd.htm Daily Updates: rsync -t \ tqmcube.com::spamlists/[README.htm][clients][dynamic][relays][asiaspam] http://www.tqmcube.com/spam_trap.htm From dcbw at redhat.com Fri Mar 4 02:57:21 2005 From: dcbw at redhat.com (Dan Williams) Date: Thu, 03 Mar 2005 21:57:21 -0500 Subject: OO.org2 In-Reply-To: <1109891460.5035.1.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <1109883166.5179.4.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1109891460.5035.1.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <1109905041.24321.1.camel@dcbw.boston.redhat.com> On Thu, 2005-03-03 at 23:10 +0000, Paul wrote: > Hi, > > > So, it is in a beta candidate release now. The question is, is it going > > to be considered for FC4 or is FC4 going to be 1.1.x? > > FC4 has slipped from the schedule slightly, so it the chances are that > if OOo2 is released (say) 1st week of April as a release, it stands a > good chance of being in. > > Of course, I don't work for RH, so could be just speaking out of my > backside on that one. Caolan has had packages building for quite a while now, and if the damn thing doesn't keep failing to build on PPC, it should be out in Rawhide by early next week. Last I heard, the release for OOo 2.0 was going to be "April/May", and since FC4 is slated for a June release, chances of OOo 2.0 Final being in FC4 a looking good. Dan From seanlkml at sympatico.ca Fri Mar 4 03:03:28 2005 From: seanlkml at sympatico.ca (Sean) Date: Thu, 3 Mar 2005 22:03:28 -0500 (EST) Subject: kernel-2.6.11-1.1166_FC4.src.rpm In-Reply-To: <1109904954.3374.16.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> References: <1109903514.3374.5.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> <1109903911.7231.20.camel@ignacio.ignacio.lan> <1109904297.3374.11.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> <2483.10.10.10.24.1109904418.squirrel@linux1> <1109904954.3374.16.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> Message-ID: <2625.10.10.10.24.1109905408.squirrel@linux1> On Thu, March 3, 2005 9:55 pm, David Cary Hart said: > No. What has been widely discussed is the elimination of the pre- > compiled kernel-source. HOWEVER, I have always been able to compile the > kernel-source myself from the src.rpm. The current src.rpm does not have > the code necessary for creating kernel-source. There is no way to > customize the FC4 kernel without hacking the config files which is a > VERY bad idea. Think you'll find that that this change doesn't prevent what you want to accomplish. Just means you have to adapt. Cheers, Sean From balay at fastmail.fm Fri Mar 4 03:17:03 2005 From: balay at fastmail.fm (Satish Balay) Date: Thu, 3 Mar 2005 21:17:03 -0600 (CST) Subject: kernel-2.6.11-1.1166_FC4.src.rpm In-Reply-To: <1109904954.3374.16.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> References: <1109903514.3374.5.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> <1109903911.7231.20.camel@ignacio.ignacio.lan> <1109904297.3374.11.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> <2483.10.10.10.24.1109904418.squirrel@linux1> <1109904954.3374.16.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> Message-ID: On Thu, 3 Mar 2005, David Cary Hart wrote: > There is no way to customize the FC4 kernel without hacking the > config files which is a VERY bad idea. I've managed to build kernel.rpm [from .src.rpm] - with config modifications primarily specified in .spec file - so no need for kernel-source To disable all the extra debugging in rawhide kernels - I have the following mods in the kernel-2.6.spec file: -------------- BuildKernel() { make -s mrproper cp configs/$Config .config # personal modifications to disable a bunch of debug flags perl -p -i -e "s/^CONFIG_DEBUG_SLAB.*/CONFIG_DEBUG_SLAB=n/" .config perl -p -i -e "s/^CONFIG_DEBUG_BUGVERBOSE.*/CONFIG_DEBUG_BUGVERBOSE=n/" .config perl -p -i -e "s/^CONFIG_DEBUG_PAGEALLOC.*/CONFIG_DEBUG_PAGEALLOC=n/" .config perl -p -i -e "s/^CONFIG_DEBUG_HIGHMEM.*/CONFIG_DEBUG_HIGHMEM=n/" .config -------------- And if you need to add patches - list them as any other patch specified in the .spec file, and rebuild with: rpmbuild -ba --target=i686 kernel-2.6.spec Personally - I think this is much easier to maintain [when moving the changes to an updated fedora kernel] than with kernel-source Satish From mattdm at mattdm.org Fri Mar 4 03:22:47 2005 From: mattdm at mattdm.org (Matthew Miller) Date: Thu, 3 Mar 2005 22:22:47 -0500 Subject: kernel-2.6.11-1.1166_FC4.src.rpm In-Reply-To: <1109904297.3374.11.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> References: <1109903514.3374.5.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> <1109903911.7231.20.camel@ignacio.ignacio.lan> <1109904297.3374.11.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> Message-ID: <20050304032247.GA31737@jadzia.bu.edu> On Thu, Mar 03, 2005 at 09:44:57PM -0500, David Cary Hart wrote: > WHAT SRPM? Note that I am referring to "src.rpm" from which I have > always been able to build source. The result should be kernel- "To build source" is kind of an oxymoron, isn't it? -- Matthew Miller mattdm at mattdm.org Boston University Linux ------> From mattdm at mattdm.org Fri Mar 4 03:24:24 2005 From: mattdm at mattdm.org (Matthew Miller) Date: Thu, 3 Mar 2005 22:24:24 -0500 Subject: kernel-2.6.11-1.1166_FC4.src.rpm In-Reply-To: <1109904954.3374.16.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> References: <1109903514.3374.5.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> <1109903911.7231.20.camel@ignacio.ignacio.lan> <1109904297.3374.11.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> <2483.10.10.10.24.1109904418.squirrel@linux1> <1109904954.3374.16.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> Message-ID: <20050304032424.GB31737@jadzia.bu.edu> On Thu, Mar 03, 2005 at 09:55:54PM -0500, David Cary Hart wrote: > No. What has been widely discussed is the elimination of the pre- > compiled kernel-source. HOWEVER, I have always been able to compile the > kernel-source myself from the src.rpm. The current src.rpm does not have > the code necessary for creating kernel-source. There is no way to > customize the FC4 kernel without hacking the config files which is a > VERY bad idea. I don't get it -- you're already rebuilding the kernel source RPM. Why is it even a slightly bad idea to add your customizations at that level? Sounds like a _excellent_ idea, in fact. -- Matthew Miller mattdm at mattdm.org Boston University Linux ------> From Fedora at TQMcube.com Fri Mar 4 03:26:00 2005 From: Fedora at TQMcube.com (David Cary Hart) Date: Thu, 03 Mar 2005 22:26:00 -0500 Subject: kernel-2.6.11-1.1166_FC4.src.rpm In-Reply-To: References: <1109903514.3374.5.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> <1109903911.7231.20.camel@ignacio.ignacio.lan> <1109904297.3374.11.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> <2483.10.10.10.24.1109904418.squirrel@linux1> <1109904954.3374.16.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> Message-ID: <1109906760.3374.32.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> On Thu, 2005-03-03 at 21:17 -0600, Satish Balay wrote: > On Thu, 3 Mar 2005, David Cary Hart wrote: > > > There is no way to customize the FC4 kernel without hacking the > > config files which is a VERY bad idea. > > I've managed to build kernel.rpm [from .src.rpm] - with config > modifications primarily specified in .spec file - so no need for > kernel-source Have you tried to build a custom kernel from, SPECIFICALLY, kernel-2.6.11-1.1166_FC4.src.rpm? -- Total Quality Management - A Commitment to Excellence Fight Spam: http://www.tqmcube.com/rbldnsd.htm Daily Updates: rsync -t \ tqmcube.com::spamlists/[README.htm][clients][dynamic][relays][asiaspam] http://www.tqmcube.com/spam_trap.htm From balay at fastmail.fm Fri Mar 4 03:37:36 2005 From: balay at fastmail.fm (Satish Balay) Date: Thu, 3 Mar 2005 21:37:36 -0600 (CST) Subject: kernel-2.6.11-1.1166_FC4.src.rpm In-Reply-To: <1109906760.3374.32.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> References: <1109903514.3374.5.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> <1109903911.7231.20.camel@ignacio.ignacio.lan> <1109904297.3374.11.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> <2483.10.10.10.24.1109904418.squirrel@linux1> <1109904954.3374.16.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> <1109906760.3374.32.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> Message-ID: On Thu, 3 Mar 2005, David Cary Hart wrote: > On Thu, 2005-03-03 at 21:17 -0600, Satish Balay wrote: > > On Thu, 3 Mar 2005, David Cary Hart wrote: > > > > > There is no way to customize the FC4 kernel without hacking the > > > config files which is a VERY bad idea. > > > > I've managed to build kernel.rpm [from .src.rpm] - with config > > modifications primarily specified in .spec file - so no need for > > kernel-source > > Have you tried to build a custom kernel from, SPECIFICALLY, > kernel-2.6.11-1.1166_FC4.src.rpm? The kernel I'm currently using is built from kernel-2.6.10-1.1154_FC4.src.rpm and running on FC3. I haven't ventured into the newer versions - as they have been updated for gcc4 [gcc4 breakages shouldn't matter for FC3/gcc3.4 - but still, I felt it easier to just continue with the 1154 I had - and upgrade the kernel version to 2.6.11 release in the spec file. Satish From Fedora at TQMcube.com Fri Mar 4 03:37:19 2005 From: Fedora at TQMcube.com (David Cary Hart) Date: Thu, 03 Mar 2005 22:37:19 -0500 Subject: kernel-2.6.11-1.1166_FC4.src.rpm In-Reply-To: <20050304032424.GB31737@jadzia.bu.edu> References: <1109903514.3374.5.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> <1109903911.7231.20.camel@ignacio.ignacio.lan> <1109904297.3374.11.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> <2483.10.10.10.24.1109904418.squirrel@linux1> <1109904954.3374.16.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> <20050304032424.GB31737@jadzia.bu.edu> Message-ID: <1109907439.3374.44.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> On Thu, 2005-03-03 at 22:24 -0500, Matthew Miller wrote: > On Thu, Mar 03, 2005 at 09:55:54PM -0500, David Cary Hart wrote: > > No. What has been widely discussed is the elimination of the pre- > > compiled kernel-source. HOWEVER, I have always been able to compile the > > kernel-source myself from the src.rpm. The current src.rpm does not have > > the code necessary for creating kernel-source. There is no way to > > customize the FC4 kernel without hacking the config files which is a > > VERY bad idea. > > I don't get it -- you're already rebuilding the kernel source RPM. Why is it > even a slightly bad idea to add your customizations at that level? Sounds > like a _excellent_ idea, in fact. > The config files, themselves have a "DO NOT EDIT" legend. Text editing these is perilous because they are ambiguous. Moreover, using the Linux tools (make config or make menuconfig) eliminates the potential for selecting mutually exclusive options. In addition, the Linux tools automatically add dependent options. You cannot do either by editing a text file. Kernel rpm builds are different from most other rpm builds. In most other cases, customizing the package means customizing the ./configure options which are clearly apparent in the spec file. That's simply not the case with kernels. > -- > Matthew Miller mattdm at mattdm.org > Boston University Linux ------> -- Total Quality Management - A Commitment to Excellence Fight Spam: http://www.tqmcube.com/rbldnsd.htm Daily Updates: rsync -t \ tqmcube.com::spamlists/[README.htm][clients][dynamic][relays][asiaspam] http://www.tqmcube.com/spam_trap.htm From mattdm at mattdm.org Fri Mar 4 04:32:44 2005 From: mattdm at mattdm.org (Matthew Miller) Date: Thu, 3 Mar 2005 23:32:44 -0500 Subject: kernel-2.6.11-1.1166_FC4.src.rpm In-Reply-To: <1109907439.3374.44.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> References: <1109903514.3374.5.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> <1109903911.7231.20.camel@ignacio.ignacio.lan> <1109904297.3374.11.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> <2483.10.10.10.24.1109904418.squirrel@linux1> <1109904954.3374.16.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> <20050304032424.GB31737@jadzia.bu.edu> <1109907439.3374.44.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> Message-ID: <20050304043244.GA1120@jadzia.bu.edu> On Thu, Mar 03, 2005 at 10:37:19PM -0500, David Cary Hart wrote: > The config files, themselves have a "DO NOT EDIT" legend. Text editing > these is perilous because they are ambiguous. Moreover, using the Linux > tools (make config or make menuconfig) eliminates the potential for > selecting mutually exclusive options. In addition, the Linux tools > automatically add dependent options. You cannot do either by editing a > text file. Okay, that all sounds reasonable, but must be missing something here in your chain of logic getting from this to your complaint. Why not use the config tools? > Kernel rpm builds are different from most other rpm builds. In most > other cases, customizing the package means customizing the ./configure > options which are clearly apparent in the spec file. That's simply not > the case with kernels. In most cases that I deal with, customizing the package means adding additional patches or source files. The kernel RPM is kind of big and crazy, but fundamentally no different in this respect. -- Matthew Miller mattdm at mattdm.org Boston University Linux ------> From mattdm at mattdm.org Fri Mar 4 04:41:14 2005 From: mattdm at mattdm.org (Matthew Miller) Date: Thu, 3 Mar 2005 23:41:14 -0500 Subject: kernel-2.6.11-1.1166_FC4.src.rpm In-Reply-To: <20050304043244.GA1120@jadzia.bu.edu> References: <1109903514.3374.5.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> <1109903911.7231.20.camel@ignacio.ignacio.lan> <1109904297.3374.11.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> <2483.10.10.10.24.1109904418.squirrel@linux1> <1109904954.3374.16.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> <20050304032424.GB31737@jadzia.bu.edu> <1109907439.3374.44.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> <20050304043244.GA1120@jadzia.bu.edu> Message-ID: <20050304044114.GA1802@jadzia.bu.edu> On Thu, Mar 03, 2005 at 11:32:44PM -0500, Matthew Miller wrote: > Okay, that all sounds reasonable, but must be missing something here in your ^ should read "but I must be missing" -- Matthew Miller mattdm at mattdm.org Boston University Linux ------> From pbrobinson at gmail.com Fri Mar 4 04:55:10 2005 From: pbrobinson at gmail.com (Peter Robinson) Date: Fri, 4 Mar 2005 12:55:10 +0800 Subject: Freeradius 1.0.2 In-Reply-To: <1109897783.23585.2.camel@cutter> References: <80d7e40905030316471ee1e398@mail.gmail.com> <1109897783.23585.2.camel@cutter> Message-ID: <5256d0b05030320557a2973cb@mail.gmail.com> > > Our freeradius server guys were wondering if an updated .src.rpm was > > coming into rawhide soon? They are back compiling the fedora rpms to > > red hat enterprise 3 due to some security plan and development issues > > that require it. > > > > yet another good reason to move freeradius to extras. :) I'd disagree. In a corporate environment I think a radius server is essential. I use it for auth for dialup, VPN, wireless and all sorts of other things so I don't need multiple user lists all around the place. Pete From skvidal at phy.duke.edu Fri Mar 4 05:07:54 2005 From: skvidal at phy.duke.edu (seth vidal) Date: Fri, 04 Mar 2005 00:07:54 -0500 Subject: Freeradius 1.0.2 In-Reply-To: <5256d0b05030320557a2973cb@mail.gmail.com> References: <80d7e40905030316471ee1e398@mail.gmail.com> <1109897783.23585.2.camel@cutter> <5256d0b05030320557a2973cb@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1109912874.23585.36.camel@cutter> On Fri, 2005-03-04 at 12:55 +0800, Peter Robinson wrote: > > > Our freeradius server guys were wondering if an updated .src.rpm was > > > coming into rawhide soon? They are back compiling the fedora rpms to > > > red hat enterprise 3 due to some security plan and development issues > > > that require it. > > > > > > > yet another good reason to move freeradius to extras. :) > > I'd disagree. In a corporate environment I think a radius server is > essential. I use it for auth for dialup, VPN, wireless and all sorts > of other things so I don't need multiple user lists all around the > place. I agree it is essential! That's why you want someone maintaining it more actively in extras. Someone who uses it every day, someone who relies on it. Red hat's people are great but rarely does a packager have to use all of his/her packages every day. This is what extras gives us. The ability to have the people most affected and most involved in the use of a package maintaining it. -sv From twaugh at redhat.com Thu Mar 3 22:36:38 2005 From: twaugh at redhat.com (Tim Waugh) Date: Thu, 3 Mar 2005 22:36:38 +0000 Subject: rawhide report: 20050302 changes In-Reply-To: <1109885979.3448.5.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <200503021815.j22IFnMu027490@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <422648B9.8070300@insitesinc.com> <1109885979.3448.5.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <20050303223636.GE3626@redhat.com> Haven't had time to get hplip in yet, and it looks like it will miss Fedora Core this time round. :-( Tim. */ -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: not available URL: From buildsys at redhat.com Fri Mar 4 12:42:07 2005 From: buildsys at redhat.com (Build System) Date: Fri, 4 Mar 2005 07:42:07 -0500 Subject: rawhide report: 20050304 changes Message-ID: <200503041242.j24Cg7qf029831@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> New package eclipse-bugzilla Eclipse Bugzilla plug-in New package eclipse-pydev Eclipse Python development plug-in Removed package ots Removed package aiksaurus Removed package libgnomedb Removed package libgda Removed package enchant Removed package bluez-bluefw Removed package dbh Removed package rpmdb-fedora Updated Packages: HelixPlayer-1:1.0.3-4 --------------------- * Thu Mar 03 2005 Ray Strode 1:1.0.3-4 - Update to 1.0.3 to fix 150098 and 150103. - Add some execshield foo to stop some execstack regressions - Add libogg-devel build req to tame compiler - Use compat-gcc because gcc 4.0 is being difficult ImageMagick-6.0.7.1-7 --------------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Matthias Clasen 6.0.7.1-7 - rebuild with gcc4 - remove an extraneous vsnprintf prototype which causes gcc4 to complain Xaw3d-1.5E-4 ------------ * Thu Mar 03 2005 Than Ngo 1.5E-4 - rebuilt alchemist-1.0.36-1 ------------------ * Thu Mar 03 2005 Tim Waugh 1.0.36-1 - Rebuild for new GCC. audit-0.6.5-1 ------------- * Thu Mar 03 2005 Steve Grubb 0.6.5-1 - Lots of code cleanups - Added write_pid function to auditd - Added audit_log to libaudit - Don't check file length in foreground mode of auditd - Added *if_enabled functions to send messages only if audit system is enabled - If syscall name is unknown when printing rules, use the syscall number - Rework the build system to produce singly threaded public libraries - Create a multithreaded version of libaudit for the audit daemon's use authconfig-4.6.11-1 ------------------- * Fri Mar 04 2005 Tomas Mraz - 4.6.11-1 - changed version propagation * Thu Mar 03 2005 Tomas Mraz - updated translations - fixed build on gcc4 * Wed Feb 23 2005 Tomas Mraz - 4.6.10-1 - updated translations bluez-utils-2.15-2 ------------------ * Thu Mar 03 2005 David Woodhouse 2.15-2 - Don't abort if dbus isn't available at startup; try again when we actually need it booty-0.49-1 ------------ * Thu Mar 03 2005 Chris Lumens 0.49-1 - Don't use deprecated whrandom module anymore. chkconfig-1.3.18-1 ------------------ * Thu Mar 03 2005 Bill Nottingham 1.3.18-1 - actually return an error code if changing a service info fails chkfontpath-1.10.0-4 -------------------- * Fri Feb 11 2005 Mike A. Harris 1.10.0-4 - Rebuilt with gcc 4 for FC4 crash-3.10-13 ------------- * Thu Mar 03 2005 Dave Anderson 3.10-13 - Compiler error- and warning-related fixes for gcc 4 build. - Update to enhance x86 and x86_64 gdb disassembly output so as to symbolically display call targets from kernel module text without requiring module debuginfo data. - Fix hole where an ia64 vmcore could be mistakenly accepted as a usable dumpfile on an x86_64 machine, leading eventually to a non-related error message. * Wed Mar 02 2005 Dave Anderson 3.10-12 - rebuild (gcc 4) ctags-5.5.4-3 ------------- * Thu Mar 03 2005 Than Ngo 5.5.4-3 - rebuilt diskdumputils-1.0.1-6 --------------------- * Thu Mar 03 2005 Akira Imamura 1.0.1-6 - Remove obsolete devlabel Requires: dos2unix-3.1-23 --------------- * Thu Mar 03 2005 Mike A. Harris 3.1-23 - Bump and rebuild for FC4, using gcc 4. eject-2.0.13-14 --------------- * Thu Mar 03 2005 Than Ngo 2.0.13-14 - rebuilt elilo-3.4-11 ------------ * Thu Mar 03 2005 Jeremy Katz - 3.4-11 - rebuild with gcc4 eog-2.9.0-2 ----------- * Thu Mar 03 2005 Marco Pesenti Gritti 2.9.0-2 - Rebuild epiphany-1.5.8-1 ---------------- * Thu Mar 03 2005 Marco Pesenti Gritti - 1.5.8-1 - Update to 1.5.8 ethereal-0.10.9-2 ----------------- * Fri Mar 04 2005 Radek Vokal 0.10.9-2 - gcc4 rebuilt ethtool-3-1 ----------- * Thu Mar 03 2005 Jeff Garzik - Update to version 3. - Use %buildroot macro, rather than RPM_BUILD_ROOT env var, as recommended by RPM packaging guidelines. * Sun Feb 27 2005 Florian La Roche - Copyright: -> License evince-0.1.5-2 -------------- * Thu Mar 03 2005 Marco Pesenti Gritti - 0.1.5-2 - Rebuild file-4.13-2 ----------- * Fri Mar 04 2005 Radek Vokal - 4.13-2 - gcc4 rebuilt file-roller-2.9.92-1 -------------------- * Thu Mar 03 2005 Marco Pesenti Gritti 2.9.92-1 - Update to 2.9.92 finger-0.17-28 -------------- * Fri Mar 04 2005 Radek Vokal 0.17-28 - gcc4 rebuilt fonts-ISO8859-2-1.0-14 ---------------------- * Thu Mar 03 2005 Mike A. Harris - 1.0-14 - *cough* Rebuild for FC4 with gcc 4 *cough* gedit-1:2.9.7-1 --------------- * Thu Mar 03 2005 Marco Pesenti Gritti 1:2.9.7-1 - Update to 2.9.7 gjdoc-0.7.1-4 ------------- * Thu Mar 03 2005 Andrew Overholt 0.7.1-4 - Add workaround for extraneous directory on x86_64. - Remove ia64 due to gcc backend bug. gnbd-kernel-2.6.10-0.7 ---------------------- gnome-utils-1:2.9.92-2 ---------------------- * Thu Mar 03 2005 Marco Pesenti Gritti 1:2.9.92-2 - Rebuild gnu-efi-3.0a-7 -------------- * Thu Mar 03 2005 Jeremy Katz - 3.0a-7 - rebuild with gcc 4 gthumb-2.6.3-2 -------------- * Thu Mar 03 2005 Marco Pesenti Gritti 2.6.3-2 - Rebuild isicom-3.05-17 -------------- * Thu Mar 03 2005 Mike A. Harris 3.05-17 - Rebuilt with gcc 4 for FC4. - Changed Prereq to Requires(post), Requires(postun) * Tue Jun 15 2004 Elliot Lee 3.05-16 - rebuilt * Fri Feb 13 2004 Elliot Lee 3.05-15 - rebuilt java-1.4.2-gcj-compat-0:1.4.2.0-40jpp_6rh ----------------------------------------- * Thu Mar 03 2005 Thomas Fitzsimmons - 0:1.4.2.0-40jpp_6rh - Import java-gcj-compat 1.0.18. * Thu Mar 03 2005 Thomas Fitzsimmons - 0:1.4.2.0-40jpp_5rh - Update descriptions. kde-i18n-1:3.4.0-0.rc1.2 ------------------------ * Thu Mar 03 2005 Than Ngo 1:3.4.0-0.rc1.2 - fix build problem * Tue Mar 01 2005 Than Ngo 1:3.4.0-0.rc1.1 - 3.4.0 rc1 * Sat Feb 19 2005 Than Ngo 1:3.3.92-0.1 - KDE-3.4 beta2 kernel-2.6.11-1.1170_FC4 ------------------------ * Fri Mar 04 2005 Dave Jones - Finger the programs that try to read from /dev/mem. - Improve spinlock debugging a little. * Thu Mar 03 2005 Dave Jones - Fix up the unresolved symbols problem. * Thu Mar 03 2005 Rik van Riel - upgrade to new Xen snapshot (requires new xen RPM, too) kudzu-1.1.111-1 --------------- * Thu Mar 03 2005 Bill Nottingham 1.1.111-1 - handle -q/--quiet libao-0.8.5-3 ------------- * Thu Mar 03 2005 John (J5) Palmieri 0.8.5-3 - rebuild with gcc 4.0 libmusicbrainz-2.0.2-14 ----------------------- * Thu Mar 03 2005 John (J5) Palmieri 2.0.2-14 - Add patch to fix percision cast error to compile correctly on s390x * Thu Mar 03 2005 John (J5) Palmieri 2.0.2-13 - rebuild with gcc 4.0 lvm2-2.01.06-1.0 ---------------- * Thu Mar 03 2005 Alasdair Kergon - 2.01.06-1.0 - Allow anaconda to suppress warning messages. mod_auth_mysql-1:2.6.1-4 ------------------------ * Thu Mar 03 2005 Joe Orton 1:2.6.1-4 - pass -Wall/-Werror to apxs via -Wc, mod_auth_pgsql-2.0.1-7 ---------------------- * Fri Mar 04 2005 Joe Orton 2.0.1-7 - fix possible crashes (Mirko Streckenbach, #150087) mod_python-3.1.4-2 ------------------ * Fri Mar 04 2005 Joe Orton 3.1.4-2 - rebuild nautilus-cd-burner-2.9.8-1 -------------------------- * Thu Mar 03 2005 Alex Larsson 2.9.8-1 - Update to 2.9.8 pinfo-0.6.8-10 -------------- * Thu Mar 03 2005 Mike A. Harris 0.6.8-10 - Rebuilt with gcc 4 for FC4 - Replaced Prereq: with Requires(post,preun) pump-0.8.21-3 ------------- * Thu Mar 03 2005 Jeremy Katz - 0.8.21-3 - rebuild python-twisted-1.3.0-4 ---------------------- * Thu Mar 03 2005 Jeremy Katz - 1.3.0-4 - rebuild for gcc 4 rhpl-0.153-2 ------------ * Thu Mar 03 2005 Jeremy Katz - 0.153-2 - rebuild with gcc4 shadow-utils-2:4.0.7-1 ---------------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Peter Vrabec - upgrade 2:4.0.7-1 system-config-printer-0.6.124-1 ------------------------------- * Thu Mar 03 2005 Tim Waugh 0.6.124-1 - 0.6.124: - Rebuild for new GCC. traceroute-1.4a12-26 -------------------- * Fri Mar 04 2005 Radek Vokal 1.4a12-26 - gcc4 rebuilt ttcp-1.12-13 ------------ * Fri Mar 04 2005 Radek Vokal - 1.12-13 - gcc4 rebuilt units-1.80-12 ------------- * Thu Mar 03 2005 Harald Hoyer - rebuilt unix2dos-2.2-25 --------------- * Thu Mar 03 2005 Mike A. Harris 2.2-25 - Rebuild with gcc 4 for FC4 * Wed Oct 20 2004 Miloslav Trmac 2.2-24 - Don't just delete the original file when destination and current directory are on different filesystems * Mon Oct 11 2004 Tim Waugh 2.2-23 - Apply H J Lu's patch to preserve file mode (bug #91332). utempter-0.5.5-6 ---------------- * Thu Mar 03 2005 Mike A. Harris 0.5.5-6 - Rebuilt with gcc 4 for FC4 * Tue Jun 15 2004 Elliot Lee 0.5.5-5 - rebuilt * Tue Apr 20 2004 Mike A. Harris 0.5.5-4 - Build 0.5.5-1 version as 0.5.5-1.2.1EL.0 for RHEL 2.1 erratum - Build 0.5.5-1 version as 0.5.5-1.3EL.0 for RHEL 3 erratum - Build 0.5.5-1 version as 0.5.5-2.RHL9.0 for RHL 9 erratum - Build 0.5.5-1 version as 0.5.5-3.FC1.0 for Fedora Core 1 erratum - Build 0.5.5-1 version as 0.5.5-4 for Fedora Core 2 development head w3c-libwww-5.4.0-13 ------------------- * Thu Mar 03 2005 Harald Hoyer - rebuilt wvdial-1.54.0-5 --------------- * Thu Mar 03 2005 Harald Hoyer - rebuilt xcdroast-0.98a15-10 ------------------- * Thu Mar 03 2005 Harald Hoyer - rebuilt xrestop-0.2-5 ------------- * Thu Mar 03 2005 Mike A. Harris 0.2-5 - Rebuilt with gcc 4 for FC4. xsri-1:2.1.0-9 -------------- * Thu Mar 03 2005 Mike A. Harris 2.1.0-9 - I seem to have just unknowingly won the xsri package in a game of package roulette. I pledge my allegiance to make it the best eye-candy app on the desktop for 2005. - Rebuilt with gcc 4 for FC4 - Make rpm install section export RPM_OPT_FLAGS in CFLAGS zisofs-tools-1.0.6-3 -------------------- * Thu Mar 03 2005 Harald Hoyer - rebuilt From fedora-devel at camperquake.de Fri Mar 4 12:53:58 2005 From: fedora-devel at camperquake.de (Ralf Ertzinger) Date: Fri, 4 Mar 2005 13:53:58 +0100 Subject: rawhide report: 20050304 changes In-Reply-To: <200503041242.j24Cg7qf029831@porkchop.devel.redhat.com>; from buildsys@redhat.com on Fri, Mar 04, 2005 at 07:42:07AM -0500 References: <200503041242.j24Cg7qf029831@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> Message-ID: <20050304135358.A9644@ryoko.camperquake.de> On Fri, Mar 04, 2005 at 07:42:07AM -0500, Build System wrote: > Removed package ots Would it be possible to add a one-liner stating a reason for the removal? From riel at redhat.com Fri Mar 4 13:00:07 2005 From: riel at redhat.com (Rik van Riel) Date: Fri, 4 Mar 2005 08:00:07 -0500 (EST) Subject: fedora+xen question In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Thu, 3 Mar 2005, anil prasad wrote: > I downloaded fedora packages for Xen hypervisor. In kernel-xen0-devel > package, i see missing .c files in all directories. Only Makefiles are > present. > > What else should i do to get kernel-xen0-devel package compiled? You should download the kernel .src.rpm. The kernel-devel packages only have header files, for compilation of 3rd party kernel modules. They do not have the sources. -- "Debugging is twice as hard as writing the code in the first place. Therefore, if you write the code as cleverly as possible, you are, by definition, not smart enough to debug it." - Brian W. Kernighan From malists at epon.ro Fri Mar 4 13:11:17 2005 From: malists at epon.ro (Marius Andreiana) Date: Fri, 04 Mar 2005 15:11:17 +0200 Subject: removing xcdroast (was Re: rawhide report: 20050304 changes) In-Reply-To: <200503041242.j24Cg7qf029831@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> References: <200503041242.j24Cg7qf029831@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> Message-ID: <1109941877.30747.21.camel@marte.biciclete.ro> On Fri, 2005-03-04 at 07:42 -0500, Build System wrote: > xcdroast-0.98a15-10 > ------------------- > * Thu Mar 03 2005 Harald Hoyer > - rebuilt Is this still used? There's already k3b which works and looks great and nautilus-cd-burner. -- Marius Andreiana Epon Business Applications http://www.epon.ro From dragoran at feuerpokemon.de Fri Mar 4 13:10:09 2005 From: dragoran at feuerpokemon.de (dragoran) Date: Fri, 04 Mar 2005 14:10:09 +0100 Subject: Who is broken when hotplug,udev and hal are causing high cpu load? In-Reply-To: <1109867037.3448.0.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <4226DB54.90406@feuerpokemon.de> <1109867037.3448.0.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <42285E31.30200@feuerpokemon.de> Kyrre Ness Sjobak schrieb: >tor, 03.03.2005 kl. 10.39 skrev dragoran: > > >>I bought a new card usb2 card reader. Sometimes when I plug a sd card >>into it all hotplug programs cause 60-80% cpu load and nothing happens >>(no mount) sometimes it just works. >>I want to fill this into bugzilla but dunno against what? >>When this happens dmesg reports many Buffer I/O erros. >> >> > >I always have to unplug/replug my USB card reader when i insert a card >for the pc to discover it > > > this isn't normal =>bug! my problem seems to be solved with 2.6.10-1.770_FC3 From jharnish at ci.grand-rapids.mi.us Fri Mar 4 13:17:28 2005 From: jharnish at ci.grand-rapids.mi.us (Harnish, Joseph) Date: Fri, 4 Mar 2005 08:17:28 -0500 Subject: removing xcdroast (was Re: rawhide report: 20050304 changes) Message-ID: <221C759285B78647AEE6181FD6AF36A70F71D0D7@bambi.grand-rapids.mi.us> I wouldn't mind if it were replaced with Graveman. -----Original Message----- From: fedora-devel-list-bounces at redhat.com [mailto:fedora-devel-list-bounces at redhat.com] On Behalf Of Marius Andreiana Sent: Friday, March 04, 2005 8:11 AM To: fedora-devel Subject: removing xcdroast (was Re: rawhide report: 20050304 changes) On Fri, 2005-03-04 at 07:42 -0500, Build System wrote: > xcdroast-0.98a15-10 > ------------------- > * Thu Mar 03 2005 Harald Hoyer > - rebuilt Is this still used? There's already k3b which works and looks great and nautilus-cd-burner. -- Marius Andreiana Epon Business Applications http://www.epon.ro -- fedora-devel-list mailing list fedora-devel-list at redhat.com http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-list -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From rdieter at math.unl.edu Fri Mar 4 13:18:54 2005 From: rdieter at math.unl.edu (Rex Dieter) Date: Fri, 04 Mar 2005 07:18:54 -0600 Subject: rawhide report: 20050304 changes In-Reply-To: <20050304135358.A9644@ryoko.camperquake.de> References: <200503041242.j24Cg7qf029831@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <20050304135358.A9644@ryoko.camperquake.de> Message-ID: <4228603E.7070803@math.unl.edu> Ralf Ertzinger wrote: > On Fri, Mar 04, 2005 at 07:42:07AM -0500, Build System wrote: > > >>Removed package ots > > > Would it be possible to add a one-liner stating a reason for the > removal? I believe it was used only by abiword, which is (also) going to extras. -- Rex From rdieter at math.unl.edu Fri Mar 4 13:19:42 2005 From: rdieter at math.unl.edu (Rex Dieter) Date: Fri, 04 Mar 2005 07:19:42 -0600 Subject: rawhide report: 20050304 changes In-Reply-To: <200503041242.j24Cg7qf029831@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> References: <200503041242.j24Cg7qf029831@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> Message-ID: <4228606E.7020001@math.unl.edu> > ImageMagick-6.0.7.1-7 > --------------------- > * Wed Mar 02 2005 Matthias Clasen 6.0.7.1-7 > - rebuild with gcc4 > - remove an extraneous vsnprintf prototype which causes > gcc4 to complain Please update to something relatively recent. It's easy: http://bugzilla.redhat.com/bugzilla/113951 -- Rex From fedora-devel at camperquake.de Fri Mar 4 13:22:21 2005 From: fedora-devel at camperquake.de (Ralf Ertzinger) Date: Fri, 4 Mar 2005 14:22:21 +0100 Subject: rawhide report: 20050304 changes In-Reply-To: <4228603E.7070803@math.unl.edu>; from rdieter@math.unl.edu on Fri, Mar 04, 2005 at 07:18:54AM -0600 References: <200503041242.j24Cg7qf029831@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <20050304135358.A9644@ryoko.camperquake.de> <4228603E.7070803@math.unl.edu> Message-ID: <20050304142221.B9644@ryoko.camperquake.de> On Fri, Mar 04, 2005 at 07:18:54AM -0600, Rex Dieter wrote: > I believe it was used only by abiword, which is (also) going to extras. Sorry for the misunderstanding, this was a more general request, not specific to this package. From arjanv at redhat.com Fri Mar 4 13:34:31 2005 From: arjanv at redhat.com (Arjan van de Ven) Date: Fri, 04 Mar 2005 14:34:31 +0100 Subject: rawhide report: 20050304 changes In-Reply-To: <20050304135358.A9644@ryoko.camperquake.de> References: <200503041242.j24Cg7qf029831@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <20050304135358.A9644@ryoko.camperquake.de> Message-ID: <1109943272.6293.92.camel@laptopd505.fenrus.org> On Fri, 2005-03-04 at 13:53 +0100, Ralf Ertzinger wrote: > On Fri, Mar 04, 2005 at 07:42:07AM -0500, Build System wrote: > > > Removed package ots > > Would it be possible to add a one-liner stating a reason for the > removal? > the way the infrastructure works right now that's not possible :( the script detects something went away, but there is no place where a reason is stored. -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part URL: From n3npq at nc.rr.com Fri Mar 4 14:58:59 2005 From: n3npq at nc.rr.com (Jeff Johnson) Date: Fri, 04 Mar 2005 09:58:59 -0500 Subject: rawhide report: 20050304 changes In-Reply-To: <200503041242.j24Cg7qf029831@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> References: <200503041242.j24Cg7qf029831@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> Message-ID: <422877B3.1090706@nc.rr.com> Build System wrote: >Removed package rpmdb-fedora > I'm quite sure this package will be missed. R.I.P. Off to setup and maintain incrementally on the client with rpm. 73 de Jeff From jakub at redhat.com Fri Mar 4 14:02:33 2005 From: jakub at redhat.com (Jakub Jelinek) Date: Fri, 4 Mar 2005 09:02:33 -0500 Subject: rawhide report: 20050304 changes In-Reply-To: <422877B3.1090706@nc.rr.com> References: <200503041242.j24Cg7qf029831@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <422877B3.1090706@nc.rr.com> Message-ID: <20050304140233.GQ853@devserv.devel.redhat.com> On Fri, Mar 04, 2005 at 09:58:59AM -0500, Jeff Johnson wrote: > Build System wrote: > > >Removed package rpmdb-fedora > > > > I'm quite sure this package will be missed. Isn't all that info in repodata already anyway? So just need a tool that will query it... Jakub From n3npq at nc.rr.com Fri Mar 4 15:06:01 2005 From: n3npq at nc.rr.com (Jeff Johnson) Date: Fri, 04 Mar 2005 10:06:01 -0500 Subject: rawhide report: 20050304 changes In-Reply-To: <20050304140233.GQ853@devserv.devel.redhat.com> References: <200503041242.j24Cg7qf029831@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <422877B3.1090706@nc.rr.com> <20050304140233.GQ853@devserv.devel.redhat.com> Message-ID: <42287959.4000104@nc.rr.com> Jakub Jelinek wrote: >On Fri, Mar 04, 2005 at 09:58:59AM -0500, Jeff Johnson wrote: > > >>Build System wrote: >> >> >> >>>Removed package rpmdb-fedora >>> >>> >>> >>I'm quite sure this package will be missed. >> >> > >Isn't all that info in repodata already anyway? > Nope. >So just need a tool that will query it... > > Hint: A tool to marshall xml ain't exactly a database. No matter, I've been waiting to write a depsolver in rpm for a very very long time. 73 de Jeff From skvidal at phy.duke.edu Fri Mar 4 14:31:37 2005 From: skvidal at phy.duke.edu (seth vidal) Date: Fri, 04 Mar 2005 09:31:37 -0500 Subject: rawhide report: 20050304 changes In-Reply-To: <20050304140233.GQ853@devserv.devel.redhat.com> References: <200503041242.j24Cg7qf029831@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <422877B3.1090706@nc.rr.com> <20050304140233.GQ853@devserv.devel.redhat.com> Message-ID: <1109946697.23585.65.camel@cutter> On Fri, 2005-03-04 at 09:02 -0500, Jakub Jelinek wrote: > On Fri, Mar 04, 2005 at 09:58:59AM -0500, Jeff Johnson wrote: > > Build System wrote: > > > > >Removed package rpmdb-fedora > > > > > > > I'm quite sure this package will be missed. > > Isn't all that info in repodata already anyway? > So just need a tool that will query it... So here's what we have right now. Yum in cvs is now incrementally building an sqlite db of the repodata from the repositories you have enabled in your config. Then Panu Matilainen has been working on a tool called repoquery which lets you query that database in much the same way you'd query the rpmdb-fedora. -sv From Fedora at TQMcube.com Fri Mar 4 15:47:58 2005 From: Fedora at TQMcube.com (David Cary Hart) Date: Fri, 04 Mar 2005 10:47:58 -0500 Subject: Follow-up - kernel.src Issue Message-ID: <1109951279.9166.19.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> To avoid confusion: YES. I am FULLY aware that Fedora no longer provides kernel-source.rpm. That is NOT what I am looking for. This question now pertains to kernel-2.6.11-1.1170_FC4.src.rpm. Note, I am referring to kernel-2.6.11-1.1170_FC4.SRC.rpm. I had originally posted regarding kernel-2.6.11-1.1166_FC4.src.rpm. Up to now, we have been able to create kernel-source.rpm from src.rpm. That is - seemingly - NO LONGER POSSIBLE. %buildsrc and the routines it referred to in the 2.6.10 series are no longer included in the spec file. If Fedora now intends to resume distributing kernel-source then this is a non-issue. However, that has not been the case with the two 2.6.11 rawhide releases. Correct me if I am wrong but this new format allows for creating a custom FC kernel only by text editing the config files which (IMO) is a VERY bad idea. Without "make config" it is possible to select conflicting options or to omit dependent options. Can I get an "official" comment - please? -- Total Quality Management - A Commitment to Excellence Fight Spam: http://www.tqmcube.com/rbldnsd.htm Daily Updates: rsync -t \ tqmcube.com::spamlists/[README.htm][clients][dynamic][relays][asiaspam] http://www.tqmcube.com/spam_trap.htm From ivazquez at ivazquez.net Fri Mar 4 15:53:08 2005 From: ivazquez at ivazquez.net (Ignacio Vazquez-Abrams) Date: Fri, 04 Mar 2005 10:53:08 -0500 Subject: removing xcdroast (was Re: rawhide report: 20050304 changes) In-Reply-To: <221C759285B78647AEE6181FD6AF36A70F71D0D7@bambi.grand-rapids.mi.us> References: <221C759285B78647AEE6181FD6AF36A70F71D0D7@bambi.grand-rapids.mi.us> Message-ID: <1109951588.7231.25.camel@ignacio.ignacio.lan> On Fri, 2005-03-04 at 08:17 -0500, Harnish, Joseph wrote: > I wouldn't mind if it were replaced with Graveman. I took a look at xcdroast for the first time in a very long time and I'm inclined to agree. Primitive as graveman is, it's much cleaner than xcdroast. -- Ignacio Vazquez-Abrams http://fedora.ivazquez.net/ -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part URL: From fedora at wir-sind-cool.org Fri Mar 4 15:54:21 2005 From: fedora at wir-sind-cool.org (Michael Schwendt) Date: Fri, 4 Mar 2005 16:54:21 +0100 Subject: Follow-up - kernel.src Issue In-Reply-To: <1109951279.9166.19.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> References: <1109951279.9166.19.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> Message-ID: <20050304165421.544b9420.fedora@wir-sind-cool.org> On Fri, 04 Mar 2005 10:47:58 -0500, David Cary Hart wrote: > To avoid confusion: > > YES. I am FULLY aware that Fedora no longer provides kernel-source.rpm. > That is NOT what I am looking for. > > This question now pertains to kernel-2.6.11-1.1170_FC4.src.rpm. Note, I > am referring to kernel-2.6.11-1.1170_FC4.SRC.rpm. I had originally > posted regarding kernel-2.6.11-1.1166_FC4.src.rpm. > > Up to now, we have been able to create kernel-source.rpm from src.rpm. > That is - seemingly - NO LONGER POSSIBLE. %buildsrc and the routines it > referred to in the 2.6.10 series are no longer included in the spec > file. > > If Fedora now intends to resume distributing kernel-source then this is > a non-issue. However, that has not been the case with the two 2.6.11 > rawhide releases. > > Correct me if I am wrong but this new format allows for creating a > custom FC kernel only by text editing the config files which (IMO) is a > VERY bad idea. Without "make config" it is possible to select > conflicting options or to omit dependent options. Why don't you use "make config"? > Can I get an "official" comment - please? I think your problem is that you simply refuse to use the existing kernel src.rpm package. And you don't explain what doesn't work for you or what makes you think you could not use "make config" any longer. From Fedora at TQMcube.com Fri Mar 4 16:04:46 2005 From: Fedora at TQMcube.com (David Cary Hart) Date: Fri, 04 Mar 2005 11:04:46 -0500 Subject: Follow-up - kernel.src Issue In-Reply-To: <20050304165421.544b9420.fedora@wir-sind-cool.org> References: <1109951279.9166.19.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> <20050304165421.544b9420.fedora@wir-sind-cool.org> Message-ID: <1109952286.9166.28.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> On Fri, 2005-03-04 at 16:54 +0100, Michael Schwendt wrote: > > > > Correct me if I am wrong but this new format allows for creating a > > custom FC kernel only by text editing the config files which (IMO) is a > > VERY bad idea. Without "make config" it is possible to select > > conflicting options or to omit dependent options. > > Why don't you use "make config"? > > > Can I get an "official" comment - please? > > I think your problem is that you simply refuse to use the existing kernel > src.rpm package. And you don't explain what doesn't work for you or what > makes you think you could not use "make config" any longer. > This is REALLY getting frustrating. Have you ever installed a kernel.src.rpm package? How, prey tell, would you use "make config" to create a custom kernel? Here's my procedure to this point: http://www.tqmcube.com/fc3_custom_kernel.htm Please explain the steps to create a custom kernel now that %buildsrc has been eliminated from the spec file. -- Total Quality Management - A Commitment to Excellence Fight Spam: http://www.tqmcube.com/rbldnsd.htm Daily Updates: rsync -t \ tqmcube.com::spamlists/[README.htm][clients][dynamic][relays][asiaspam] http://www.tqmcube.com/spam_trap.htm From shahms at shahms.com Fri Mar 4 16:07:48 2005 From: shahms at shahms.com (Shahms King) Date: Fri, 04 Mar 2005 08:07:48 -0800 Subject: Follow-up - kernel.src Issue In-Reply-To: <20050304165421.544b9420.fedora@wir-sind-cool.org> References: <1109951279.9166.19.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> <20050304165421.544b9420.fedora@wir-sind-cool.org> Message-ID: <1109952468.11074.60.camel@shahms.mesd.k12.or.us> On Fri, 2005-03-04 at 16:54 +0100, Michael Schwendt wrote: > On Fri, 04 Mar 2005 10:47:58 -0500, David Cary Hart wrote: *snip* > > Correct me if I am wrong but this new format allows for creating a > > custom FC kernel only by text editing the config files which (IMO) is a > > VERY bad idea. Without "make config" it is possible to select > > conflicting options or to omit dependent options. You are, fortunately, wrong on this point. I created a custom kernel (RPM no less) just last night after using 'make gconfig' to choose the options. Here's a quick HOWTO for building and customizing a kernel RPM: rpm -ivh kernel.src.rpm rpmbuild -bp kernel-2.6.spec cd $RPM_BUILD_DIR/kernel-2.6.x/linux-2.6.x cp $RPM_SOURCE_DIR/kernel-2.6.x-$arch.config .config make {x,g,menu,}config cp .config $RPM_SOURCE_DIR/kernel-2.6.x-$arch.config cd $RPM_SPEC_DIR/ rpmbuild -bb --target=$arch kernel-2.6.spec If you don't want to build an RPM, it's easier. > Why don't you use "make config"? > > > Can I get an "official" comment - please? > > I think your problem is that you simply refuse to use the existing kernel > src.rpm package. And you don't explain what doesn't work for you or what > makes you think you could not use "make config" any longer. To be fair, it is (mildly) more difficult to get the kernel source installed in a form where one can run "make config". Not much more, but the above steps are more difficult than: "rpm -Uvh kernel-source.rpm; cd /usr/src/linux-2.6;make config" -- Shahms E. King Multnomah ESD Public Key: http://shahms.mesd.k12.or.us/~sking/shahms.asc Fingerprint: 1612 054B CE92 8770 F1EA AB1B FEAB 3636 45B2 D75B -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part URL: From kyrre at solution-forge.net Fri Mar 4 16:12:03 2005 From: kyrre at solution-forge.net (Kyrre Ness Sjobak) Date: Fri, 04 Mar 2005 17:12:03 +0100 Subject: rawhide report: 20050302 changes In-Reply-To: <1109885979.3448.5.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <200503021815.j22IFnMu027490@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <422648B9.8070300@insitesinc.com> <1109885979.3448.5.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <1109952722.3440.6.camel@localhost.localdomain> tor, 03.03.2005 kl. 22.39 skrev Kyrre Ness Sjobak: > tor, 03.03.2005 kl. 00.14 skrev Michael Favia: > > Build System wrote: > > > > >hpijs-1.7.1-3 > > >------------- > > >* Tue Mar 01 2005 Tim Waugh 1.7.1-3 > > >- Rebuilt for new GCC. > > > > > > > > Isnt hplip the preferred driver assortment from HP these days? Im > > unaware of any conflicts so i dont mean to step on anyones toes but is > > there any reason they arent being included in rawhide/for fc4? The > > project unifies hpijs and provides a unified single and multi-function > > connectivity solution to some 300 hp models (printing, faxing, scanning, > > photo-card access, and device management ). It also seems to have worked > > a good number of the bugs out and seems to be the recommended default > > from HP. The driver architecture sure looks pretty: > > http://hpinkjet.sourceforge.net/architecture.php and it works for me > > locally for sometime. > > > > -mf > > Well, i personaly use the old driver (hpdj?) for a HP2000C Inkjet. > Terrible print quality and speed, but at least it dosn't believe the > paper is 2 metres wide... > > Kyrre *offtopic* btw. the rh cups maintainer did a great job trying to fix the bug :) From kyrre at solution-forge.net Fri Mar 4 16:14:04 2005 From: kyrre at solution-forge.net (Kyrre Ness Sjobak) Date: Fri, 04 Mar 2005 17:14:04 +0100 Subject: rawhide report: 20050301 changes In-Reply-To: <1109887989.5463.23.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <200503011908.j21J8lsr013948@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <1109788217.30922.19.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1109806409.3652.1.camel@trevally.redfishdemo.com> <1109813967.19398.1.camel@cutter> <1109819929.4045.10.camel@trevally.redfishdemo.com> <1109886247.3448.9.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1109887989.5463.23.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <1109952843.3440.8.camel@localhost.localdomain> tor, 03.03.2005 kl. 23.13 skrev Per Bjornsson: > On Thu, 2005-03-03 at 22:44 +0100, Kyrre Ness Sjobak wrote: > > After all, i probably should have seen that gcc4 now is gcc-4.0. But how > > will gcc3 be shipped? gcc-compat (as usual? brings up the whole > > so-version conflict... I think i shall let that rest in the sand. > > Wait... care to explain what the problem is? As far as I can tell, > compat-gcc contains GCC 3.3. and gcc contains GCC 4. There > shouldn't be any need to ship both GCC 3.4 and 4.0 for ABI reasons; they > are supposed to be compatible, and thus libstdc++ will keep the same > major soversion. (I guess that the reason for shipping compat-gcc at all > is to be able to provide a complete LSB environment? Or is anything in > the distro actually built with the compat toolchain?) > > /Per It might not be a huge problem for gcc, but when you are dealing with libs with more than 2 so-versions installed, it might. From Fedora at TQMcube.com Fri Mar 4 16:17:25 2005 From: Fedora at TQMcube.com (David Cary Hart) Date: Fri, 04 Mar 2005 11:17:25 -0500 Subject: Follow-up - kernel.src Issue In-Reply-To: <1109952468.11074.60.camel@shahms.mesd.k12.or.us> References: <1109951279.9166.19.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> <20050304165421.544b9420.fedora@wir-sind-cool.org> <1109952468.11074.60.camel@shahms.mesd.k12.or.us> Message-ID: <1109953045.9166.37.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> On Fri, 2005-03-04 at 08:07 -0800, Shahms King wrote: > You are, fortunately, wrong on this point. I created a custom kernel > (RPM no less) just last night after using 'make gconfig' to choose the > options. Here's a quick HOWTO for building and customizing a kernel RPM: > > rpm -ivh kernel.src.rpm > rpmbuild -bp kernel-2.6.spec > > cd $RPM_BUILD_DIR/kernel-2.6.x/linux-2.6.x > cp $RPM_SOURCE_DIR/kernel-2.6.x-$arch.config .config > > make {x,g,menu,}config > > cp .config $RPM_SOURCE_DIR/kernel-2.6.x-$arch.config > > cd $RPM_SPEC_DIR/ > rpmbuild -bb --target=$arch kernel-2.6.spec > > If you don't want to build an RPM, it's easier. > OK, that eliminates manually applying the patches. However, it seems like considerably more work than just spinning out a kernel-source.rpm from src.rpm. Moreover, it lacks the portability of kernel-source.rpm. Again, I'm NOT asking for a distribution of kernel-source; Just retaining the options. I just don't understand why the change was made. It fixed what weren't broke. > -- > fedora-devel-list mailing list > fedora-devel-list at redhat.com > http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-list -- Total Quality Management - A Commitment to Excellence Fight Spam: http://www.tqmcube.com/rbldnsd.htm Daily Updates: rsync -t \ tqmcube.com::spamlists/[README.htm][clients][dynamic][relays][asiaspam] http://www.tqmcube.com/spam_trap.htm From overholt at redhat.com Fri Mar 4 16:18:08 2005 From: overholt at redhat.com (Andrew Overholt) Date: Fri, 4 Mar 2005 11:18:08 -0500 Subject: fedora-devel-java-list Message-ID: <20050304161808.GB16343@redhat.com> I don't think the new list was announced here. If you're interested in Fedora java-related topics, check out: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-java-list Andrew From balay at fastmail.fm Fri Mar 4 16:20:07 2005 From: balay at fastmail.fm (Satish Balay) Date: Fri, 4 Mar 2005 10:20:07 -0600 (CST) Subject: Follow-up - kernel.src Issue In-Reply-To: <1109951279.9166.19.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> References: <1109951279.9166.19.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> Message-ID: On Fri, 4 Mar 2005, David Cary Hart wrote: > Correct me if I am wrong but this new format allows for creating a > custom FC kernel only by text editing the config files which (IMO) is a > VERY bad idea. Without "make config" it is possible to select > conflicting options or to omit dependent options. Hmm.. What does 'make nonint_oldconfig' in the kernel-2.6.spec file do? I thought it checks the .config file - and will barf it it detects something wrong. Satish From balay at fastmail.fm Fri Mar 4 16:26:13 2005 From: balay at fastmail.fm (Satish Balay) Date: Fri, 4 Mar 2005 10:26:13 -0600 (CST) Subject: Follow-up - kernel.src Issue In-Reply-To: <1109953045.9166.37.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> References: <1109951279.9166.19.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> <20050304165421.544b9420.fedora@wir-sind-cool.org> <1109952468.11074.60.camel@shahms.mesd.k12.or.us> <1109953045.9166.37.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> Message-ID: On Fri, 4 Mar 2005, David Cary Hart wrote: > OK, that eliminates manually applying the patches. Why do you want to do that - when you can automate this in the spec file? > Moreover, it lacks the portability of kernel-source.rpm. tar up - after 'rpmbuild -bp' - and you get the same thing. Satish From steve at silug.org Fri Mar 4 16:45:19 2005 From: steve at silug.org (Steven Pritchard) Date: Fri, 4 Mar 2005 10:45:19 -0600 Subject: slapcat daily cron job? Message-ID: <20050304164519.GA15432@osiris.silug.org> I posted this to bugzilla a while back... https://bugzilla.redhat.com/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=148972 Can anyone think of a reason why it would be bad for openldap to include a script to do a nightly slapcat dump to a file? If not, I included the script, logrotate entry, and spec patch in that bugzilla ticket, so if someone @redhat could look at it, I'd appreciate it greatly. :-) Steve -- Steven Pritchard - K&S Pritchard Enterprises, Inc. Email: steve at kspei.com http://www.kspei.com/ Phone: (618)398-3000 Mobile: (618)567-7320 From n3npq at nc.rr.com Fri Mar 4 17:52:36 2005 From: n3npq at nc.rr.com (Jeff Johnson) Date: Fri, 04 Mar 2005 12:52:36 -0500 Subject: rawhide report: 20050304 changes In-Reply-To: <1109946697.23585.65.camel@cutter> References: <200503041242.j24Cg7qf029831@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <422877B3.1090706@nc.rr.com> <20050304140233.GQ853@devserv.devel.redhat.com> <1109946697.23585.65.camel@cutter> Message-ID: <4228A064.1000703@nc.rr.com> seth vidal wrote: >On Fri, 2005-03-04 at 09:02 -0500, Jakub Jelinek wrote: > > >>On Fri, Mar 04, 2005 at 09:58:59AM -0500, Jeff Johnson wrote: >> >> >>>Build System wrote: >>> >>> >>> >>>>Removed package rpmdb-fedora >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>I'm quite sure this package will be missed. >>> >>> >>Isn't all that info in repodata already anyway? >>So just need a tool that will query it... >> >> > >So here's what we have right now. > >Yum in cvs is now incrementally building an sqlite db of the repodata >from the repositories you have enabled in your config. > > Not known, but not unexpected either. I mean, I *did* add sqlite nee sqlite3 to FC, didn't I? >Then Panu Matilainen has been working on a tool called repoquery which >lets you query that database in much the same way you'd query the >rpmdb-fedora. > Yup, known. Have fun! 73 de Jeff From harald at redhat.com Fri Mar 4 16:56:08 2005 From: harald at redhat.com (Harald Hoyer) Date: Fri, 04 Mar 2005 17:56:08 +0100 Subject: What users want... Message-ID: <42289328.6040707@redhat.com> To give you an impression what users want and what maybe qualifies to being in Core, if it is FOSS :) 2004 LinuxQuestions.org Members Choice Award Winners Announced Browser of the Year - Firefox (77.12%) Distribution of the Year - Slackware (19.36%) LiveCD Distribution of the Year - Knoppix (57.69%) Database of the Year - MySQL (53.51%) Desktop Environment of the Year - KDE (58.25%) Window Manager of the Year - Fluxbox (31.14%) Office Suite of the Year - OpenOffice.org (84.85%) Word Processor of the Year - oowriter (63.75%) Spreadsheet of the Year - oocalc (57.57%) Audio Multimedia Application of the Year - XMMS (45.83%) Video Multimedia Application of the Year - mplayer (49.85%) Security App of the Year - nmap (37.14%) Hardening App of the Year - SELinux (68.65%) Editor of the Year - vi/vim (36.37%) Web Development Editor of the Year - Quanta (50.88%) IDE of the Year - Kdevelop (37.77%) Mail Client of the Year - Thunderbird (47.60%) Open Source Game of the Year - Frozen Bubble (25.52%) Commercial Game of the Year - UT2004 (38.86%) Windows on Linux App of the Year - Wine (42.59%) File Manager of the Year - Konqueror (30.59%) Messaging App of the Year - Gaim (56.00%) Graphics App of the Year - GIMP (72.82%) MTA of the Year - PostFix (45.57%) From: http://www.linuxquestions.org/questions/t286716.html See also http://www.linuxquestions.org/questions/f62 for details of each category. Btw, Fedora is on number 2 of the distributions of choice. From ghenry at suretecsystems.com Fri Mar 4 17:06:02 2005 From: ghenry at suretecsystems.com (Gavin Henry) Date: Fri, 4 Mar 2005 17:06:02 -0000 (GMT) Subject: slapcat daily cron job? In-Reply-To: <20050304164519.GA15432@osiris.silug.org> References: <20050304164519.GA15432@osiris.silug.org> Message-ID: <58683.193.195.148.66.1109955962.squirrel@webmail.suretecsystems.com> > I posted this to bugzilla a while back... > > https://bugzilla.redhat.com/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=148972 > > Can anyone think of a reason why it would be bad for openldap to > include a script to do a nightly slapcat dump to a file? > > If not, I included the script, logrotate entry, and spec patch in that > bugzilla ticket, so if someone @redhat could look at it, I'd > appreciate it greatly. :-) I think that this a good idea and it's good that the script shuts down the ldap server, as you can only do a slapcat on a running server, if it's a bdb/hdb backend. IMHO, I think that this backup decision should ultimately be left up to the admin, as it's a security risk having the whole ldap tree in plain text, even though it's owned be root. Gavin. From nphilipp at redhat.com Fri Mar 4 17:17:19 2005 From: nphilipp at redhat.com (Nils Philippsen) Date: Fri, 04 Mar 2005 18:17:19 +0100 Subject: slapcat daily cron job? In-Reply-To: <58683.193.195.148.66.1109955962.squirrel@webmail.suretecsystems.com> References: <20050304164519.GA15432@osiris.silug.org> <58683.193.195.148.66.1109955962.squirrel@webmail.suretecsystems.com> Message-ID: <1109956640.20869.70.camel@gibraltar.stuttgart.redhat.com> On Fri, 2005-03-04 at 17:06 +0000, Gavin Henry wrote: > > > I posted this to bugzilla a while back... > > > > https://bugzilla.redhat.com/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=148972 > > > > Can anyone think of a reason why it would be bad for openldap to > > include a script to do a nightly slapcat dump to a file? > > > > If not, I included the script, logrotate entry, and spec patch in that > > bugzilla ticket, so if someone @redhat could look at it, I'd > > appreciate it greatly. :-) > > I think that this a good idea and it's good that the script shuts down the > ldap server, as you can only do a slapcat on a running server, if it's a > bdb/hdb backend. Mind that this in itself can be seen as a slight DOS -- some sites need LDAP for authentication issues. > IMHO, I think that this backup decision should ultimately be left up to > the admin, as it's a security risk having the whole ldap tree in plain > text, even though it's owned be root. In the same vein you could argue that we should have nightly pg_dumpalls etc. I'd say that backups should be left to the administrator instead. Provide the scripts as examples of how to do a backup, but leave it as that. If openldap tends to eat the directory, this needs to be fixed rather than installing such a backup script by default (which is not a real fix). Nils -- Nils Philippsen / Red Hat / nphilipp at redhat.com "They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety." -- B. Franklin, 1759 PGP fingerprint: C4A8 9474 5C4C ADE3 2B8F 656D 47D8 9B65 6951 3011 From notting at redhat.com Fri Mar 4 17:27:00 2005 From: notting at redhat.com (Bill Nottingham) Date: Fri, 4 Mar 2005 12:27:00 -0500 Subject: rawhide report: 20050304 changes In-Reply-To: <20050304135358.A9644@ryoko.camperquake.de> References: <200503041242.j24Cg7qf029831@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <20050304135358.A9644@ryoko.camperquake.de> Message-ID: <20050304172700.GA8420@nostromo.devel.redhat.com> Ralf Ertzinger (fedora-devel at camperquake.de) said: > > Removed package ots > > Would it be possible to add a one-liner stating a reason for the > removal? It's an automated script running that compares the previous tree to the current one; without some database of this information somewhere, it's really not impossible to grab. Bill From steve at silug.org Fri Mar 4 17:44:26 2005 From: steve at silug.org (Steven Pritchard) Date: Fri, 4 Mar 2005 11:44:26 -0600 Subject: slapcat daily cron job? In-Reply-To: <1109956640.20869.70.camel@gibraltar.stuttgart.redhat.com> References: <20050304164519.GA15432@osiris.silug.org> <58683.193.195.148.66.1109955962.squirrel@webmail.suretecsystems.com> <1109956640.20869.70.camel@gibraltar.stuttgart.redhat.com> Message-ID: <20050304174426.GB15432@osiris.silug.org> On Fri, Mar 04, 2005 at 06:17:19PM +0100, Nils Philippsen wrote: > In the same vein you could argue that we should have nightly pg_dumpalls > etc. I'd say that backups should be left to the administrator instead. > Provide the scripts as examples of how to do a backup, but leave it as > that. Except that, generally speaking, if any other database server blows up, the system still functions. When openldap blows up, if you are using it for authentication, bad things happen. > If openldap tends to eat the directory, this needs to be fixed > rather than installing such a backup script by default (which is not > a real fix). I don't think the two are mutually exclusive. Again, I'm just using the example of rpm, which has a cron job that dumps to /var/log/rpmpkgs. That's *really* helped me a couple of times now... Steve -- Steven Pritchard - K&S Pritchard Enterprises, Inc. Email: steve at kspei.com http://www.kspei.com/ Phone: (618)398-3000 Mobile: (618)567-7320 From notting at redhat.com Fri Mar 4 17:51:17 2005 From: notting at redhat.com (Bill Nottingham) Date: Fri, 4 Mar 2005 12:51:17 -0500 Subject: rawhide report: 20050304 changes In-Reply-To: <200503041242.j24Cg7qf029831@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> References: <200503041242.j24Cg7qf029831@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> Message-ID: <20050304175117.GD8420@nostromo.devel.redhat.com> Since someone asked.... Build System (buildsys at redhat.com) said: > Removed package ots > Removed package aiksaurus > Removed package libgnomedb > Removed package libgda > Removed package enchant These were all dependencies of the recently moved abiword and gnumeric; nothing else depends on them. > Removed package bluez-bluefw The firmware loader in this was obsolete with the 2.6 kernel, and the firmware itself was not FOSS. > Removed package dbh This was part of the XFCE stack; it is following XFCE to Extras. > Removed package rpmdb-fedora We're attempting to cut down on the many copies of RPM metadata in the OS. Bill From ghenry at suretecsystems.com Fri Mar 4 17:55:23 2005 From: ghenry at suretecsystems.com (Gavin Henry) Date: Fri, 4 Mar 2005 17:55:23 -0000 (GMT) Subject: slapcat daily cron job? In-Reply-To: <1109956640.20869.70.camel@gibraltar.stuttgart.redhat.com> References: <20050304164519.GA15432@osiris.silug.org><58683.193.195.148.66.1109955962.squirrel@webmail.suretecsystems.com> <1109956640.20869.70.camel@gibraltar.stuttgart.redhat.com> Message-ID: <60619.193.195.148.66.1109958923.squirrel@webmail.suretecsystems.com> > On Fri, 2005-03-04 at 17:06 +0000, Gavin Henry wrote: >> >> > I posted this to bugzilla a while back... >> > >> > https://bugzilla.redhat.com/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=148972 >> > >> > Can anyone think of a reason why it would be bad for openldap to >> > include a script to do a nightly slapcat dump to a file? >> > >> > If not, I included the script, logrotate entry, and spec patch in that >> > bugzilla ticket, so if someone @redhat could look at it, I'd >> > appreciate it greatly. :-) >> >> I think that this a good idea and it's good that the script shuts down >> the >> ldap server, as you can only do a slapcat on a running server, if it's a >> bdb/hdb backend. > > Mind that this in itself can be seen as a slight DOS -- some sites need > LDAP for authentication issues. Yes, I forgot that part. Remember, LDAP can be used for mail alias lookup, dns, printers etc. etc. These things need to be run all night. Good point. > >> IMHO, I think that this backup decision should ultimately be left up to >> the admin, as it's a security risk having the whole ldap tree in plain >> text, even though it's owned be root. > > In the same vein you could argue that we should have nightly pg_dumpalls > etc. I'd say that backups should be left to the administrator instead. > Provide the scripts as examples of how to do a backup, but leave it as > that. If openldap tends to eat the directory, this needs to be fixed > rather than installing such a backup script by default (which is not a > real fix). > > Nils > -- > Nils Philippsen / Red Hat / nphilipp at redhat.com > "They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary > safety deserve neither liberty nor safety." -- B. Franklin, 1759 > PGP fingerprint: C4A8 9474 5C4C ADE3 2B8F 656D 47D8 9B65 6951 3011 > > -- > fedora-devel-list mailing list > fedora-devel-list at redhat.com > http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-list > From n3npq at nc.rr.com Fri Mar 4 19:09:38 2005 From: n3npq at nc.rr.com (Jeff Johnson) Date: Fri, 04 Mar 2005 14:09:38 -0500 Subject: rawhide report: 20050304 changes In-Reply-To: <20050304175117.GD8420@nostromo.devel.redhat.com> References: <200503041242.j24Cg7qf029831@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <20050304175117.GD8420@nostromo.devel.redhat.com> Message-ID: <4228B272.1040903@nc.rr.com> Bill Nottingham wrote: >g XFCE to Extras. > > > >>Removed package rpmdb-fedora >> >> > >We're attempting to cut down on the many copies of RPM metadata >in the OS. > > Understood. Too bad you decided to throw out the original complete data in favor of the cloned and incomplete xml copy that still (afaik) fetches headers using http after reading rpm-metadata. But byte ranges are so so so cool! 73 de Jeff From moe at blagblagblag.org Fri Mar 4 18:16:57 2005 From: moe at blagblagblag.org (jeff) Date: Fri, 4 Mar 2005 11:16:57 -0700 Subject: removing xcdroast (was Re: rawhide report: 20050304 changes) In-Reply-To: <1109951588.7231.25.camel@ignacio.ignacio.lan> References: <221C759285B78647AEE6181FD6AF36A70F71D0D7@bambi.grand-rapids.mi.us> <1109951588.7231.25.camel@ignacio.ignacio.lan> Message-ID: <200503041116.57304.moe@blagblagblag.org> Ignacio Vazquez-Abrams wrote: > On Fri, 2005-03-04 at 08:17 -0500, Harnish, Joseph wrote: > > I wouldn't mind if it were replaced with Graveman. > > I took a look at xcdroast for the first time in a very long > time and I'm inclined to agree. Primitive as graveman is, > it's much cleaner than xcdroast. graveman is a nice "it just works" application. It also "just works" for newbies. It detects writers easily/automajicaklly. It can convert ogg (& mp3...) to audio CD format, so files don't need to be re-encoded by hand. The author said he'll incorporate burning playlists to audio CDs too, after I requested the feature. It does DVDs. It can copy CDs, with a straightforward interface. The developer also will encorporate a "save project" feature in future releases. Did I mention it's simple yet featureful? After trying a number of different burners, this is the one. It has the features "experienced" burners want, yet is sooper easy to use. It should be the stock burner, imho... graveman +2 :) -Jeff From nphilipp at redhat.com Fri Mar 4 19:55:23 2005 From: nphilipp at redhat.com (Nils Philippsen) Date: Fri, 04 Mar 2005 20:55:23 +0100 Subject: slapcat daily cron job? In-Reply-To: <20050304174426.GB15432@osiris.silug.org> References: <20050304164519.GA15432@osiris.silug.org> <58683.193.195.148.66.1109955962.squirrel@webmail.suretecsystems.com> <1109956640.20869.70.camel@gibraltar.stuttgart.redhat.com> <20050304174426.GB15432@osiris.silug.org> Message-ID: <1109966124.6560.10.camel@gibraltar.stuttgart.redhat.com> On Fri, 2005-03-04 at 11:44 -0600, Steven Pritchard wrote: > On Fri, Mar 04, 2005 at 06:17:19PM +0100, Nils Philippsen wrote: > > In the same vein you could argue that we should have nightly pg_dumpalls > > etc. I'd say that backups should be left to the administrator instead. > > Provide the scripts as examples of how to do a backup, but leave it as > > that. > > Except that, generally speaking, if any other database server blows > up, the system still functions. When openldap blows up, if you are > using it for authentication, bad things happen. Point taken, but: usually there is more important data in a database than in an LDAP directory. If there is data loss in the former it tends to cost serious money, in the latter it may be a mere nuisance. Not that I want to downplay the effects of a damaged LDAP directory, but to be consistent we would have to introduce automatic backups for everything: databases, LDAP, file systems, mail spools, ... all the while everything concerning backups is largely policy-ridden, i.e. some will want to backup onto disk, some onto tape, some want this and some want that backup program. In my eyes, backups are not a serious contender for the "default works for 90%" award ;-). > > If openldap tends to eat the directory, this needs to be fixed > > rather than installing such a backup script by default (which is not > > a real fix). > > I don't think the two are mutually exclusive. > > Again, I'm just using the example of rpm, which has a cron job that > dumps to /var/log/rpmpkgs. That's *really* helped me a couple of > times now... Yes, it does. But a real backup would help in this case as well, if not better. Nils -- Nils Philippsen / Red Hat / nphilipp at redhat.com "They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety." -- B. Franklin, 1759 PGP fingerprint: C4A8 9474 5C4C ADE3 2B8F 656D 47D8 9B65 6951 3011 From caolanm at redhat.com Fri Mar 4 19:45:10 2005 From: caolanm at redhat.com (Caolan McNamara) Date: Fri, 04 Mar 2005 19:45:10 +0000 Subject: OO.org2 In-Reply-To: <1109905041.24321.1.camel@dcbw.boston.redhat.com> References: <1109883166.5179.4.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1109891460.5035.1.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1109905041.24321.1.camel@dcbw.boston.redhat.com> Message-ID: <1109965510.2966.12.camel@sheol.homelinux.org> On Thu, 2005-03-03 at 21:57 -0500, Dan Williams wrote: > On Thu, 2005-03-03 at 23:10 +0000, Paul wrote: > > Hi, > > > > > So, it is in a beta candidate release now. The question is, is it going > > > to be considered for FC4 or is FC4 going to be 1.1.x? > > > > FC4 has slipped from the schedule slightly, so it the chances are that > > if OOo2 is released (say) 1st week of April as a release, it stands a > > good chance of being in. > > > > Of course, I don't work for RH, so could be just speaking out of my > > backside on that one. > > Caolan has had packages building for quite a while now, and if the damn > thing doesn't keep failing to build on PPC, it should be out in Rawhide > by early next week. Last I heard, the release for OOo 2.0 was going to > be "April/May", and since FC4 is slated for a June release, chances of > OOo 2.0 Final being in FC4 a looking good. After an astonishing 20 hour build 1.9.81 should materialize soon. There are some known non-specific to fedora bugs so searching the qa.openoffice.org for your symptoms is likely to explain most problems, but feel free to log issues for unreported upstream issues against openoffice.org's fedora bugzilla component. If gcj/java guys want to poke at the java stuff that builds the helpcontent2 directory to speed up the slowest build part, that would be appreciated :-) C. From kyrre at solution-forge.net Fri Mar 4 19:36:24 2005 From: kyrre at solution-forge.net (Kyrre Ness Sjobak) Date: Fri, 04 Mar 2005 20:36:24 +0100 Subject: Who is broken when hotplug,udev and hal are causing high cpu load? In-Reply-To: <42285E31.30200@feuerpokemon.de> References: <4226DB54.90406@feuerpokemon.de> <1109867037.3448.0.camel@localhost.localdomain> <42285E31.30200@feuerpokemon.de> Message-ID: <1109962204.3440.11.camel@localhost.localdomain> fre, 04.03.2005 kl. 14.10 skrev dragoran: > Kyrre Ness Sjobak schrieb: > > >tor, 03.03.2005 kl. 10.39 skrev dragoran: > > > > > >>I bought a new card usb2 card reader. Sometimes when I plug a sd card > >>into it all hotplug programs cause 60-80% cpu load and nothing happens > >>(no mount) sometimes it just works. > >>I want to fill this into bugzilla but dunno against what? > >>When this happens dmesg reports many Buffer I/O erros. > >> > >> > > > >I always have to unplug/replug my USB card reader when i insert a card > >for the pc to discover it > > > > > > > this isn't normal =>bug! > my problem seems to be solved with 2.6.10-1.770_FC3 I thougth it was the card reader borking, not the kernel... I am going to do a round in bugzilla tonigth, reporting all the bugs i know - but does there exist a bug number for this bug? I don't experience any other problems exept "cant mount before card reader plug in/out ->works From kyrre at solution-forge.net Fri Mar 4 19:36:36 2005 From: kyrre at solution-forge.net (Kyrre Ness Sjobak) Date: Fri, 04 Mar 2005 20:36:36 +0100 Subject: Dbus and security - a few questions Message-ID: <1109962702.3440.20.camel@localhost.localdomain> As a desktop/server Linux user (and spare time developer which really needs a good GTK/C book in order to be able to contribute more back to the comunity), i am thrilled to see the new posibilities dbus opens for user-friendly interaction. But a bit concerned as well (probably because i don't know much about dbus) over security issues. As far as i understand, dbus is a framework for aplications running on the same computer to comunicate. Great. It is often used to connect backend (often running as root, doing stuff with system configuration), and frontend (often running as any user which happens to have user access to the system). One example is NetworkManager - which is great for primarily single user laptops. But as this system grows, and more and more apps hook up - what are the exploitation risks? Could one f.ex. buffer overflow a privilegued app trough the dbus "network"? Which/what kind of services will be turned on by default in future fedora installations? Ofcource, having NetworkManager running on a shell server would be a problem so NetworkManager would probably never be turned on by default, but where are the border cases? Such things. Kyrre Ness Sj?b?k From kyrre at solution-forge.net Fri Mar 4 19:37:04 2005 From: kyrre at solution-forge.net (Kyrre Ness Sjobak) Date: Fri, 04 Mar 2005 20:37:04 +0100 Subject: fc3 install hangs at "configuring kernel parameters" In-Reply-To: <421BC906.3010907@smsonline.com> References: <1109043083.29658.5.camel@localhost.localdomain> <421AAE99.8030705@tlarson.com> <20050222112021.GA28474@devserv.devel.redhat.com> <421B714E.2080701@tlarson.com> <20050222184552.GA1444243@hiwaay.net> <421B8B4F.3020107@tlarson.com> <1109101520.15038.40.camel@opus.phy.duke.edu> <421BBE4F.1090009@donut.dk> <421BC906.3010907@smsonline.com> Message-ID: <1109964984.3440.22.camel@localhost.localdomain> ons, 23.02.2005 kl. 01.06 skrev Bill Rees: > Hi All, > I've tried installing FC3 several times with differing setups and > for each install, the final reboot hangs right as "configuring kernel > parameters" prints out. What is going on at this stage and what may be > the problem? I've done one FC3 install before on the same motherboard > (shuttle AK32v3.1) that worked just fine. The only difference I can see > is the processor is different (faster). > > Any thoughts anyone? I'm going to try a live cd image boot and > replace the kernel with a 2.6.8 variant and see if that makes any > difference. > Boot the system in single user mode. run "firstboot". next time you reboot it will work w/o trouble. From shiva at sewingwitch.com Fri Mar 4 19:37:26 2005 From: shiva at sewingwitch.com (Kenneth Porter) Date: Fri, 04 Mar 2005 11:37:26 -0800 Subject: kernel-2.6.11-1.1166_FC4.src.rpm In-Reply-To: <1109904954.3374.16.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> References: <1109903514.3374.5.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> <1109903911.7231.20.camel@ignacio.ignacio.lan> <1109904297.3374.11.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> <2483.10.10.10.24.1109904418.squirrel@linux1> <1109904954.3374.16.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> Message-ID: <2F4A43BA2E0275A78739487D@[10.169.6.246]> --On Thursday, March 03, 2005 9:55 PM -0500 David Cary Hart wrote: > I have always been able to compile the kernel-source myself from the > src.rpm. The current src.rpm does not have the code necessary for > creating kernel-source. rpm -i kernel-xxx.src.rpm rpmbuild -bp SPECS/kernel.spec The only difference is that the sources are now in BUILD/kernel, not /usr/src/linux. What else do you need? From mpeters at mac.com Fri Mar 4 19:45:56 2005 From: mpeters at mac.com (Michael A. Peters) Date: Fri, 04 Mar 2005 19:45:56 +0000 Subject: What users want... In-Reply-To: <42289328.6040707@redhat.com> (from harald@redhat.com on Fri Mar 4 08:56:08 2005) References: <42289328.6040707@redhat.com> Message-ID: <1109965556l.7872l.0l@devel.mpeters.us> On 03/04/2005 08:56:08 AM, Harald Hoyer wrote: > To give you an impression what users want and what maybe qualifies to > being in Core, if it is FOSS :) > > 2004 LinuxQuestions.org Members Choice Award Winners Announced Those kind of things never impress me personally. -- Michael A. Peters http://mpeters.us/ From johnp at redhat.com Fri Mar 4 20:17:44 2005 From: johnp at redhat.com (John (J5) Palmieri) Date: Fri, 04 Mar 2005 15:17:44 -0500 Subject: Dbus and security - a few questions In-Reply-To: <1109962702.3440.20.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <1109962702.3440.20.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <1109967465.21378.32.camel@remedyz.boston.redhat.com> On Fri, 2005-03-04 at 20:36 +0100, Kyrre Ness Sjobak wrote: > As a desktop/server Linux user (and spare time developer which really > needs a good GTK/C book in order to be able to contribute more back to > the comunity), i am thrilled to see the new posibilities dbus opens for > user-friendly interaction. But a bit concerned as well (probably because > i don't know much about dbus) over security issues. > > As far as i understand, dbus is a framework for aplications running on > the same computer to comunicate. Great. It is often used to connect > backend (often running as root, doing stuff with system configuration), > and frontend (often running as any user which happens to have user > access to the system). One example is NetworkManager - which is great > for primarily single user laptops. > > But as this system grows, and more and more apps hook up - what are the > exploitation risks? Could one f.ex. buffer overflow a privilegued app > trough the dbus "network"? Which/what kind of services will be turned on > by default in future fedora installations? Ofcource, having > NetworkManager running on a shell server would be a problem so > NetworkManager would probably never be turned on by default, but where > are the border cases? > > Such things. > > Kyrre Ness Sj?b?k Have you read my article? http://www.redhat.com/magazine/003jan05/features/dbus/ It specifically deals with d-bus security. D-Bus is a trusted component of the system so yes, if there is a vulnerability in d-bus or one of the apps running over d-bus it could be used as an exploit. However d-bus is built with security in mind and whenever we allow an application to export normally restricted functionality we do so very carefully using d-bus's security mechanism to make sure only users who should get that functionality are able to use it. It is similar to the risks of setuid binaries. Of course d-bus also has the ability to enhance security in many ways outlined by the article. BTW the idea is for NetworkManager to one day be the only way to configure networking. Of course it has a long way to go before it can become the default. -- John (J5) Palmieri Associate Software Engineer Desktop Group Red Hat, Inc. Blog: http://martianrock.com From ich at frank-schmitt.net Fri Mar 4 18:55:50 2005 From: ich at frank-schmitt.net (Frank Schmitt) Date: Fri, 04 Mar 2005 19:55:50 +0100 Subject: rawhide report: 20050304 changes References: <200503041242.j24Cg7qf029831@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <20050304175117.GD8420@nostromo.devel.redhat.com> <4228B272.1040903@nc.rr.com> Message-ID: Jeff Johnson writes: > Too bad you decided to throw out the original complete data in favor of > the cloned > and incomplete xml copy that still (afaik) fetches headers using http > after reading rpm-metadata. > > But byte ranges are so so so cool! I don't really understand the consequences: Does this mean, e.g. rpm -qi foo will not work anymore? BTW: There are quite many people out there who don't like yum and up2date but use apt instead. -- Did you ever realize how much text fits in eighty columns? If you now consider that a signature usually consists of up to four lines, this gives you enough space to spread a tremendous amount of information with your messages. So seize this opportunity and don't waste your signature with bullshit nobody will read. From eric at snowmoon.com Fri Mar 4 20:25:39 2005 From: eric at snowmoon.com (Eric Warnke) Date: Fri, 04 Mar 2005 15:25:39 -0500 Subject: rawhide report: 20050304 changes In-Reply-To: References: <200503041242.j24Cg7qf029831@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <20050304175117.GD8420@nostromo.devel.redhat.com> <4228B272.1040903@nc.rr.com> Message-ID: <4228C443.8090002@snowmoon.com> Frank Schmitt wrote: >I don't really understand the consequences: Does this mean, e.g. >rpm -qi foo will not work anymore? BTW: There are quite many people out >there who don't like yum and up2date but use apt instead. > > > That will still work fine if foo is installed. All they are removng is the pre-built package database. For people that just have to have the oly functionality they can build the database with rpm -i --justdb --dbpath /path/to/db /path/to/all/RPMS/* Cheers, Eric -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 252 bytes Desc: OpenPGP digital signature URL: From skvidal at phy.duke.edu Fri Mar 4 20:33:09 2005 From: skvidal at phy.duke.edu (seth vidal) Date: Fri, 04 Mar 2005 15:33:09 -0500 Subject: rawhide report: 20050304 changes In-Reply-To: References: <200503041242.j24Cg7qf029831@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <20050304175117.GD8420@nostromo.devel.redhat.com> <4228B272.1040903@nc.rr.com> Message-ID: <1109968389.23585.142.camel@cutter> > I don't really understand the consequences: Does this mean, e.g. > rpm -qi foo will not work anymore? BTW: There are quite many people out > there who don't like yum and up2date but use apt instead. > rpm -qi works just fine - that acts on your INSTALLED packages. repoquery is about an rpm -q type commands for the repositories. -sv From feliciano.matias at free.fr Fri Mar 4 20:33:43 2005 From: feliciano.matias at free.fr (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?F=E9liciano?= Matias) Date: Fri, 04 Mar 2005 21:33:43 +0100 Subject: fedora-devel-java-list In-Reply-To: <20050304161808.GB16343@redhat.com> References: <20050304161808.GB16343@redhat.com> Message-ID: <1109968423.22563.1.camel@one.myworld> Le vendredi 04 mars 2005 ? 11:18 -0500, Andrew Overholt a ?crit : > I don't think the new list was announced here. If you're interested in > Fedora java-related topics, check out: > > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-java-list More importantly, this mailing (and many other) is not in : http://fedora.redhat.com/participate/communicate/ -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: Ceci est une partie de message num?riquement sign?e URL: From fitzsim at redhat.com Fri Mar 4 20:36:40 2005 From: fitzsim at redhat.com (Thomas Fitzsimmons) Date: Fri, 04 Mar 2005 15:36:40 -0500 Subject: OO.org2 In-Reply-To: <1109965510.2966.12.camel@sheol.homelinux.org> References: <1109883166.5179.4.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1109891460.5035.1.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1109905041.24321.1.camel@dcbw.boston.redhat.com> <1109965510.2966.12.camel@sheol.homelinux.org> Message-ID: <1109968600.18132.30.camel@tortoise.toronto.redhat.com> On Fri, 2005-03-04 at 19:45 +0000, Caolan McNamara wrote: >On Thu, 2005-03-03 at 21:57 -0500, Dan Williams wrote: >> On Thu, 2005-03-03 at 23:10 +0000, Paul wrote: >> > Hi, >> > >> > > So, it is in a beta candidate release now. The question is, is it going >> > > to be considered for FC4 or is FC4 going to be 1.1.x? >> > >> > FC4 has slipped from the schedule slightly, so it the chances are that >> > if OOo2 is released (say) 1st week of April as a release, it stands a >> > good chance of being in. >> > >> > Of course, I don't work for RH, so could be just speaking out of my >> > backside on that one. >> >> Caolan has had packages building for quite a while now, and if the damn >> thing doesn't keep failing to build on PPC, it should be out in Rawhide >> by early next week. Last I heard, the release for OOo 2.0 was going to >> be "April/May", and since FC4 is slated for a June release, chances of >> OOo 2.0 Final being in FC4 a looking good. > >After an astonishing 20 hour build 1.9.81 should materialize soon. There >are some known non-specific to fedora bugs so searching the >qa.openoffice.org for your symptoms is likely to explain most problems, >but feel free to log issues for unreported upstream issues against >openoffice.org's fedora bugzilla component. > >If gcj/java guys want to poke at the java stuff that builds the >helpcontent2 directory to speed up the slowest build part, that would be >appreciated :-) > Are you building bytecode or native objects? The rawhide java-1.4.2-gcj-compat-devel has a fix to make ecj run natively which speeds up bytecode compilation 2-3 times. We're planning on natively-compiling rawhide ant -- that will likely further reduce build times. (Just curious: do these new package build against libjawt.so?) Tom From feliciano.matias at free.fr Fri Mar 4 20:36:42 2005 From: feliciano.matias at free.fr (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?F=E9liciano?= Matias) Date: Fri, 04 Mar 2005 21:36:42 +0100 Subject: What users want... In-Reply-To: <42289328.6040707@redhat.com> References: <42289328.6040707@redhat.com> Message-ID: <1109968602.22563.5.camel@one.myworld> Le vendredi 04 mars 2005 ? 17:56 +0100, Harald Hoyer a ?crit : > To give you an impression what users want and what maybe qualifies to being in > Core, if it is FOSS :) > > 2004 LinuxQuestions.org Members Choice Award Winners Announced > > Browser of the Year - Firefox (77.12%) > Distribution of the Year - Slackware (19.36%) Ubuntu is the distribution of the *year* 2004. Sorry Fedora :-) -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: Ceci est une partie de message num?riquement sign?e URL: From carwyn at carwyn.com Fri Mar 4 20:42:06 2005 From: carwyn at carwyn.com (Carwyn Edwards) Date: Fri, 04 Mar 2005 20:42:06 +0000 Subject: OO.org2 In-Reply-To: <1109968600.18132.30.camel@tortoise.toronto.redhat.com> References: <1109883166.5179.4.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1109891460.5035.1.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1109905041.24321.1.camel@dcbw.boston.redhat.com> <1109965510.2966.12.camel@sheol.homelinux.org> <1109968600.18132.30.camel@tortoise.toronto.redhat.com> Message-ID: <4228C81E.3090705@carwyn.com> Thomas Fitzsimmons wrote: >We're planning on >natively-compiling rawhide ant > Will this have an alternatives setup so that you can run a non native ant too? Carwyn From dcbw at redhat.com Fri Mar 4 20:45:21 2005 From: dcbw at redhat.com (Dan Williams) Date: Fri, 04 Mar 2005 15:45:21 -0500 Subject: OO.org2 In-Reply-To: <1109968600.18132.30.camel@tortoise.toronto.redhat.com> References: <1109883166.5179.4.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1109891460.5035.1.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1109905041.24321.1.camel@dcbw.boston.redhat.com> <1109965510.2966.12.camel@sheol.homelinux.org> <1109968600.18132.30.camel@tortoise.toronto.redhat.com> Message-ID: <1109969121.2057.3.camel@dcbw.boston.redhat.com> On Fri, 2005-03-04 at 15:36 -0500, Thomas Fitzsimmons wrote: > On Fri, 2005-03-04 at 19:45 +0000, Caolan McNamara wrote: > >On Thu, 2005-03-03 at 21:57 -0500, Dan Williams wrote: > >> On Thu, 2005-03-03 at 23:10 +0000, Paul wrote: > >> > Hi, > >> > > >> > > So, it is in a beta candidate release now. The question is, is it going > >> > > to be considered for FC4 or is FC4 going to be 1.1.x? > >> > > >> > FC4 has slipped from the schedule slightly, so it the chances are that > >> > if OOo2 is released (say) 1st week of April as a release, it stands a > >> > good chance of being in. > >> > > >> > Of course, I don't work for RH, so could be just speaking out of my > >> > backside on that one. > >> > >> Caolan has had packages building for quite a while now, and if the damn > >> thing doesn't keep failing to build on PPC, it should be out in Rawhide > >> by early next week. Last I heard, the release for OOo 2.0 was going to > >> be "April/May", and since FC4 is slated for a June release, chances of > >> OOo 2.0 Final being in FC4 a looking good. > > > >After an astonishing 20 hour build 1.9.81 should materialize soon. There > >are some known non-specific to fedora bugs so searching the > >qa.openoffice.org for your symptoms is likely to explain most problems, > >but feel free to log issues for unreported upstream issues against > >openoffice.org's fedora bugzilla component. > > > >If gcj/java guys want to poke at the java stuff that builds the > >helpcontent2 directory to speed up the slowest build part, that would be > >appreciated :-) > > > > Are you building bytecode or native objects? The rawhide > java-1.4.2-gcj-compat-devel has a fix to make ecj run natively which > speeds up bytecode compilation 2-3 times. We're planning on > natively-compiling rawhide ant -- that will likely further reduce build > times. That would be 'gij' at this time. /usr/bin/gij -Dgnu.gcj.runtime.VMClassLoader.library_control=never - Djava.library.path=/usr/src/build/532736- i386/BUILD/SRC680_m81/solver/680/unxlngi6.pro/lib - cp .:../../unxlngi6.pro/class::/usr/src/build/532736- i386/BUILD/SRC680_m81/solver/680/unxlngi6.pro/bin/jaxp.jar:/usr/src/build/532736-i386/BUILD/SRC680_m81/solver/680/unxlngi6.pro/bin/parser.jar:/usr/src/build/532736-i386/BUILD/SRC680_m81/solver/680/unxlngi6.pro/bin/xt.jar:/usr/src/build/532736-i386/BUILD/SRC680_m81/solver/680/unxlngi6.pro/bin/unoil.jar:/usr/src/build/532736-i386/BUILD/SRC680_m81/solver/680/unxlngi6.pro/bin/ridl.jar:/usr/src/build/532736-i386/BUILD/SRC680_m81/solver/680/unxlngi6.pro/bin/jurt.jar:/usr/src/build/532736-i386/BUILD/SRC680_m81/solver/680/unxlngi6.pro/bin/jut.jar:/usr/src/build/532736-i386/BUILD/SRC680_m81/solver/680/unxlngi6.pro/bin/xmlsearch.jar:/usr/src/build/532736-i386/BUILD/SRC680_m81/solver/680/unxlngi6.pro/bin/db.jar:/usr/src/build/532736-i386/BUILD/SRC680_m81/solver/680/unxlngi6.pro/bin/xmlsearch.jar:/usr/src/build/532736-i386/BUILD/SRC680_m81/solver/680/unxlngi6.pro/bin/xmlhelp.jar com.sun.star.help.HelpLinker @/tmp/mkfRPrRw As an example. This particular step of the process is done quite a few times, and even just this one invocation of gij took 5 minutes in my observation last night on bugs.build (900Mhz Xeon). Caolan has more details, he was going to look at compiling a native binary of HelpLinker soon. Dan From fitzsim at redhat.com Fri Mar 4 20:48:00 2005 From: fitzsim at redhat.com (Thomas Fitzsimmons) Date: Fri, 04 Mar 2005 15:48:00 -0500 Subject: OO.org2 In-Reply-To: <4228C81E.3090705@carwyn.com> References: <1109883166.5179.4.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1109891460.5035.1.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1109905041.24321.1.camel@dcbw.boston.redhat.com> <1109965510.2966.12.camel@sheol.homelinux.org> <1109968600.18132.30.camel@tortoise.toronto.redhat.com> <4228C81E.3090705@carwyn.com> Message-ID: <1109969280.18132.36.camel@tortoise.toronto.redhat.com> On Fri, 2005-03-04 at 20:42 +0000, Carwyn Edwards wrote: >Thomas Fitzsimmons wrote: > >>We're planning on >>natively-compiling rawhide ant >> >Will this have an alternatives setup so that you can run a non native >ant too? > No, that isn't needed. The java and javac alternatives cover this. If they point to java-1.4.2-gcj-compat and java-1.4.2-gcj-compat-devel ant will run natively on a completely Free Software stack. If they point to a proprietary SDK then ant will run interpreted/JIT'ed on the non-free JVM. Tom From fedora at wir-sind-cool.org Fri Mar 4 20:48:25 2005 From: fedora at wir-sind-cool.org (Michael Schwendt) Date: Fri, 4 Mar 2005 21:48:25 +0100 Subject: rawhide report: 20050304 changes In-Reply-To: <4228C443.8090002@snowmoon.com> References: <200503041242.j24Cg7qf029831@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <20050304175117.GD8420@nostromo.devel.redhat.com> <4228B272.1040903@nc.rr.com> <4228C443.8090002@snowmoon.com> Message-ID: <20050304214825.78a40292.fedora@wir-sind-cool.org> On Fri, 04 Mar 2005 15:25:39 -0500, Eric Warnke wrote: > Frank Schmitt wrote: > > >I don't really understand the consequences: Does this mean, e.g. > >rpm -qi foo will not work anymore? BTW: There are quite many people out > >there who don't like yum and up2date but use apt instead. > > > > > > > > That will still work fine if foo is installed. All they are removng is > the pre-built package database. > > For people that just have to have the oly functionality they can build > the database with rpm -i --justdb --dbpath /path/to/db /path/to/all/RPMS/* More options are needed, at least --noscripts --notriggers, and an added rpm --initdb --dbpath ... first. From fitzsim at redhat.com Fri Mar 4 20:54:52 2005 From: fitzsim at redhat.com (Thomas Fitzsimmons) Date: Fri, 04 Mar 2005 15:54:52 -0500 Subject: OO.org2 In-Reply-To: <1109969121.2057.3.camel@dcbw.boston.redhat.com> References: <1109883166.5179.4.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1109891460.5035.1.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1109905041.24321.1.camel@dcbw.boston.redhat.com> <1109965510.2966.12.camel@sheol.homelinux.org> <1109968600.18132.30.camel@tortoise.toronto.redhat.com> <1109969121.2057.3.camel@dcbw.boston.redhat.com> Message-ID: <1109969692.23370.1.camel@tortoise.toronto.redhat.com> On Fri, 2005-03-04 at 15:45 -0500, Dan Williams wrote: >On Fri, 2005-03-04 at 15:36 -0500, Thomas Fitzsimmons wrote: >> On Fri, 2005-03-04 at 19:45 +0000, Caolan McNamara wrote: >> >On Thu, 2005-03-03 at 21:57 -0500, Dan Williams wrote: >> >> On Thu, 2005-03-03 at 23:10 +0000, Paul wrote: >> >> > Hi, >> >> > >> >> > > So, it is in a beta candidate release now. The question is, is it going >> >> > > to be considered for FC4 or is FC4 going to be 1.1.x? >> >> > >> >> > FC4 has slipped from the schedule slightly, so it the chances are that >> >> > if OOo2 is released (say) 1st week of April as a release, it stands a >> >> > good chance of being in. >> >> > >> >> > Of course, I don't work for RH, so could be just speaking out of my >> >> > backside on that one. >> >> >> >> Caolan has had packages building for quite a while now, and if the damn >> >> thing doesn't keep failing to build on PPC, it should be out in Rawhide >> >> by early next week. Last I heard, the release for OOo 2.0 was going to >> >> be "April/May", and since FC4 is slated for a June release, chances of >> >> OOo 2.0 Final being in FC4 a looking good. >> > >> >After an astonishing 20 hour build 1.9.81 should materialize soon. There >> >are some known non-specific to fedora bugs so searching the >> >qa.openoffice.org for your symptoms is likely to explain most problems, >> >but feel free to log issues for unreported upstream issues against >> >openoffice.org's fedora bugzilla component. >> > >> >If gcj/java guys want to poke at the java stuff that builds the >> >helpcontent2 directory to speed up the slowest build part, that would be >> >appreciated :-) >> > >> >> Are you building bytecode or native objects? The rawhide >> java-1.4.2-gcj-compat-devel has a fix to make ecj run natively which >> speeds up bytecode compilation 2-3 times. We're planning on >> natively-compiling rawhide ant -- that will likely further reduce build >> times. > >That would be 'gij' at this time. > >/usr/bin/gij -Dgnu.gcj.runtime.VMClassLoader.library_control=never - >Djava.library.path=/usr/src/build/532736- >i386/BUILD/SRC680_m81/solver/680/unxlngi6.pro/lib - >cp .:../../unxlngi6.pro/class::/usr/src/build/532736- >i386/BUILD/SRC680_m81/solver/680/unxlngi6.pro/bin/jaxp.jar:/usr/src/build/532736-i386/BUILD/SRC680_m81/solver/680/unxlngi6.pro/bin/parser.jar:/usr/src/build/532736-i386/BUILD/SRC680_m81/solver/680/unxlngi6.pro/bin/xt.jar:/usr/src/build/532736-i386/BUILD/SRC680_m81/solver/680/unxlngi6.pro/bin/unoil.jar:/usr/src/build/532736-i386/BUILD/SRC680_m81/solver/680/unxlngi6.pro/bin/ridl.jar:/usr/src/build/532736-i386/BUILD/SRC680_m81/solver/680/unxlngi6.pro/bin/jurt.jar:/usr/src/build/532736-i386/BUILD/SRC680_m81/solver/680/unxlngi6.pro/bin/jut.jar:/usr/src/build/532736-i386/BUILD/SRC680_m81/solver/680/unxlngi6.pro/bin/xmlsearch.jar:/usr/src/build/532736-i386/BUILD/SRC680_m81/solver/680/unxlngi6.pro/bin/db.jar:/usr/src/build/532736-i386/BUILD/SRC680_m81/solver/680/unxlngi6.pro/bin/xmlsearch.jar:/usr/src/build/532736-i386/BUILD/SRC680_m81/solver/680/unxlngi6.pro/bin/xmlhelp.jar com.sun.star.help.HelpLinker @/tmp/mkfRPrRw > >As an example. This particular step of the process is done quite a few >times, and even just this one invocation of gij took 5 minutes in my >observation last night on bugs.build (900Mhz Xeon). Caolan has more >details, he was going to look at compiling a native binary of HelpLinker >soon. > Yeah, compile the HelpLinker jar file to a specially-named shared object (e.g. lib-com-sun-star-help.so), then make sure LD_LIBRARY_PATH points the the .so's location. Then you can run the same command and gij will find and load the .so and run com.sun.star.help.HelpLinker natively. Tom From tromey at redhat.com Fri Mar 4 21:02:55 2005 From: tromey at redhat.com (Tom Tromey) Date: 04 Mar 2005 14:02:55 -0700 Subject: OO.org2 In-Reply-To: <1109969121.2057.3.camel@dcbw.boston.redhat.com> References: <1109883166.5179.4.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1109891460.5035.1.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1109905041.24321.1.camel@dcbw.boston.redhat.com> <1109965510.2966.12.camel@sheol.homelinux.org> <1109968600.18132.30.camel@tortoise.toronto.redhat.com> <1109969121.2057.3.camel@dcbw.boston.redhat.com> Message-ID: >>>>> "Dan" == Dan Williams writes: Dan> That would be 'gij' at this time. Ok. Dan> /usr/bin/gij -Dgnu.gcj.runtime.VMClassLoader.library_control=never - [ .. evil command line .. ] Dan> com.sun.star.help.HelpLinker @/tmp/mkfRPrRw Dan> This particular step of the process is done quite a few times, Dan> and even just this one invocation of gij took 5 minutes in my Dan> observation last night on bugs.build (900Mhz Xeon). Caolan has Dan> more details, he was going to look at compiling a native binary Dan> of HelpLinker soon. The simplest way to do this with gcj 4 is to set up a .db that maps classes to .so files. Then compile each .jar to a .so (with -findirect-dispatch) and add each to the database. Finally, tell gij about this database when running. This requires no application changes; it is how we have compiled eclipse, jonas, derby, etc. Here's an overview on how to set this up: http://gcc.gnu.org/wiki/How%20to%20BC%20compile%20with%20GCJ We should probably move this discussion to fedora-devel-java-list... Internally we've talked a bit about things like having a default systemwide .db (so no special 'gij' invocation needed) and having boilerplate scripts (or rpm macros) to compile .jars and load them into a .db. Tom From jspaleta at gmail.com Fri Mar 4 21:12:30 2005 From: jspaleta at gmail.com (Jeff Spaleta) Date: Fri, 4 Mar 2005 16:12:30 -0500 Subject: rawhide report: 20050304 changes In-Reply-To: <4228C443.8090002@snowmoon.com> References: <200503041242.j24Cg7qf029831@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <20050304175117.GD8420@nostromo.devel.redhat.com> <4228B272.1040903@nc.rr.com> <4228C443.8090002@snowmoon.com> Message-ID: <604aa7910503041312407ebe2c@mail.gmail.com> On Fri, 04 Mar 2005 15:25:39 -0500, Eric Warnke wrote: > Frank Schmitt wrote: > For people that just have to have the oly functionality they can build > the database with rpm -i --justdb --dbpath /path/to/db /path/to/all/RPMS/* Assuming of course they have a full cache of rpms available locally and not on the network. Speaking from my own perspective most of what I have used a local copy of the rpmdb for is dependancy information. But when I'm trying to debug something or confirm a reported problem I have used the rpmdb for other queries so that I dont have to pull the rpms from the net... especially in previous rounds of development/test release cycles. I'm pretty sure at one time or another I have used queries for: --scripts --triggers --obsoletes --conflicts in an effort to identify one particular package problem or another. If I can get access to the same information via queries of repodata I won't be impacted at all. Even if I can't recover queries against something like scripts.. being able to make queries against the requires/provides for the full set Core+Extras packages will be far more useful to most of the troubleshooting that i end up looking into. Though i will say the dirty little trick of running an rpm -e --test against the full rpmdb to see what depends on a particular package was a mighty useful dirty trick. It would be very useful to have something as simple in the repoquery worldview to accomplish the same thing. Hmm now that I think about it.. i think Seth told me that Panu had some leafnode code already that can do this. -jef"doesn't speak for himself.. i speak for my puppet and my puppeteer speaks for me"spaleta From fitzsim at redhat.com Fri Mar 4 21:12:55 2005 From: fitzsim at redhat.com (Thomas Fitzsimmons) Date: Fri, 04 Mar 2005 16:12:55 -0500 Subject: OO.org2 In-Reply-To: <1109969692.23370.1.camel@tortoise.toronto.redhat.com> References: <1109883166.5179.4.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1109891460.5035.1.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1109905041.24321.1.camel@dcbw.boston.redhat.com> <1109965510.2966.12.camel@sheol.homelinux.org> <1109968600.18132.30.camel@tortoise.toronto.redhat.com> <1109969121.2057.3.camel@dcbw.boston.redhat.com> <1109969692.23370.1.camel@tortoise.toronto.redhat.com> Message-ID: <1109970775.23370.4.camel@tortoise.toronto.redhat.com> On Fri, 2005-03-04 at 15:54 -0500, Thomas Fitzsimmons wrote: >On Fri, 2005-03-04 at 15:45 -0500, Dan Williams wrote: >>On Fri, 2005-03-04 at 15:36 -0500, Thomas Fitzsimmons wrote: >>> On Fri, 2005-03-04 at 19:45 +0000, Caolan McNamara wrote: >>> >On Thu, 2005-03-03 at 21:57 -0500, Dan Williams wrote: >>> >> On Thu, 2005-03-03 at 23:10 +0000, Paul wrote: >>> >> > Hi, >>> >> > >>> >> > > So, it is in a beta candidate release now. The question is, is it going >>> >> > > to be considered for FC4 or is FC4 going to be 1.1.x? >>> >> > >>> >> > FC4 has slipped from the schedule slightly, so it the chances are that >>> >> > if OOo2 is released (say) 1st week of April as a release, it stands a >>> >> > good chance of being in. >>> >> > >>> >> > Of course, I don't work for RH, so could be just speaking out of my >>> >> > backside on that one. >>> >> >>> >> Caolan has had packages building for quite a while now, and if the damn >>> >> thing doesn't keep failing to build on PPC, it should be out in Rawhide >>> >> by early next week. Last I heard, the release for OOo 2.0 was going to >>> >> be "April/May", and since FC4 is slated for a June release, chances of >>> >> OOo 2.0 Final being in FC4 a looking good. >>> > >>> >After an astonishing 20 hour build 1.9.81 should materialize soon. There >>> >are some known non-specific to fedora bugs so searching the >>> >qa.openoffice.org for your symptoms is likely to explain most problems, >>> >but feel free to log issues for unreported upstream issues against >>> >openoffice.org's fedora bugzilla component. >>> > >>> >If gcj/java guys want to poke at the java stuff that builds the >>> >helpcontent2 directory to speed up the slowest build part, that would be >>> >appreciated :-) >>> > >>> >>> Are you building bytecode or native objects? The rawhide >>> java-1.4.2-gcj-compat-devel has a fix to make ecj run natively which >>> speeds up bytecode compilation 2-3 times. We're planning on >>> natively-compiling rawhide ant -- that will likely further reduce build >>> times. >> >>That would be 'gij' at this time. >> >>/usr/bin/gij -Dgnu.gcj.runtime.VMClassLoader.library_control=never - >>Djava.library.path=/usr/src/build/532736- >>i386/BUILD/SRC680_m81/solver/680/unxlngi6.pro/lib - >>cp .:../../unxlngi6.pro/class::/usr/src/build/532736- >>i386/BUILD/SRC680_m81/solver/680/unxlngi6.pro/bin/jaxp.jar:/usr/src/build/532736-i386/BUILD/SRC680_m81/solver/680/unxlngi6.pro/bin/parser.jar:/usr/src/build/532736-i386/BUILD/SRC680_m81/solver/680/unxlngi6.pro/bin/xt.jar:/usr/src/build/532736-i386/BUILD/SRC680_m81/solver/680/unxlngi6.pro/bin/unoil.jar:/usr/src/build/532736-i386/BUILD/SRC680_m81/solver/680/unxlngi6.pro/bin/ridl.jar:/usr/src/build/532736-i386/BUILD/SRC680_m81/solver/680/unxlngi6.pro/bin/jurt.jar:/usr/src/build/532736-i386/BUILD/SRC680_m81/solver/680/unxlngi6.pro/bin/jut.jar:/usr/src/build/532736-i386/BUILD/SRC680_m81/solver/680/unxlngi6.pro/bin/xmlsearch.jar:/usr/src/build/532736-i386/BUILD/SRC680_m81/solver/680/unxlngi6.pro/bin/db.jar:/usr/src/build/532736-i386/BUILD/SRC680_m81/solver/680/unxlngi6.pro/bin/xmlsearch.jar:/usr/src/build/532736-i386/BUILD/SRC680_m81/solver/680/unxlngi6.pro/bin/xmlhelp.jar com.sun.star.help.HelpLinker @/tmp/mkfRPrRw >> >>As an example. This particular step of the process is done quite a few >>times, and even just this one invocation of gij took 5 minutes in my >>observation last night on bugs.build (900Mhz Xeon). Caolan has more >>details, he was going to look at compiling a native binary of HelpLinker >>soon. >> > >Yeah, compile the HelpLinker jar file to a specially-named shared object >(e.g. lib-com-sun-star-help.so), then make sure LD_LIBRARY_PATH points >the the .so's location. Then you can run the same command and gij will >find and load the .so and run com.sun.star.help.HelpLinker natively. > Actually, this won't work with library_control=never so you'd better do it the way Tromey recommended. Tom From zaitcev at redhat.com Fri Mar 4 21:16:23 2005 From: zaitcev at redhat.com (Pete Zaitcev) Date: Fri, 4 Mar 2005 13:16:23 -0800 Subject: gam_server eats CPU Message-ID: <20050304131623.5566a3ce@localhost.localdomain> Hi, guys: I have a situation where an application makes small writes to a file. In such a case, gam_server hogs the CPU. Here's a screen capture from top(1): top - 11:15:58 up 1:19, 4 users, load average: 1.88, 0.71, 0.34 Tasks: 82 total, 1 running, 81 sleeping, 0 stopped, 0 zombie Cpu(s): 9.7% us, 78.0% sy, 0.0% ni, 6.0% id, 0.0% wa, 5.3% hi, 1.0% si Mem: 515688k total, 457868k used, 57820k free, 36652k buffers Swap: 554232k total, 0k used, 554232k free, 259560k cached PID USER PR NI VIRT RES SHR S %CPU %MEM TIME+ COMMAND 3729 zaitcev 25 0 3412 1232 856 S 80.3 0.2 1:35.21 gam_server 3988 root 16 0 3576 404 348 S 4.3 0.1 0:06.84 cat 3313 root 15 0 63572 16m 6228 S 1.7 3.3 0:42.10 X 3450 zaitcev 16 0 38088 16m 10m S 1.7 3.3 0:10.03 nautilus 3454 zaitcev 15 0 36680 14m 8624 S 0.7 2.8 0:14.44 gnome-terminal 3444 zaitcev 16 0 13468 7328 6056 S 0.3 1.4 0:06.38 metacity 3497 zaitcev 16 0 21336 9940 7700 S 0.3 1.9 0:03.52 wnck-applet 1 root 16 0 1684 552 480 S 0.0 0.1 0:00.61 init I run Fedora Core 3 with Nautilus enabled, and so I cannot just remove Gamin and be happy. Does anyone have any ideas what do about this? -- Pete P.S. In case anyone is interested in details, this is what happened. I was looking at some USB problems with usbmon and noticed that usbmon drops about 0.7% packets. At first I thought it was something with SMM BIOS or whatnot. But then I noticed that CPU is eaten by Gamin and this apparently causes cat to starve sometimes. Usbmon produces a stream of records which are captured with: cat /sys/kernel/debug/usbmon/1t > x.dump It is rather lightweight, without any massive copying of data by the kernel. E.g. the USB traffic itself creates much more copying and memory and cache usage. From walters at redhat.com Fri Mar 4 21:25:04 2005 From: walters at redhat.com (Colin Walters) Date: Fri, 04 Mar 2005 16:25:04 -0500 Subject: Dbus and security - a few questions In-Reply-To: <1109967465.21378.32.camel@remedyz.boston.redhat.com> References: <1109962702.3440.20.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1109967465.21378.32.camel@remedyz.boston.redhat.com> Message-ID: <1109971504.4271.9.camel@nexus.verbum.private> On Fri, 2005-03-04 at 15:17 -0500, John (J5) Palmieri wrote: > It is similar to the risks of setuid >binaries. I would say D-BUS is a lot better than setuid binaries; you have to write a setuid binary very carefully because it can be influenced by the parent process (environment variables, filesystem namespace, etc). The D-BUS library does validation of the raw message formats, and I think it's much easier to validate arguments to a method than to do all the work involved in writing a setuid binary. From pmatilai at welho.com Fri Mar 4 21:32:46 2005 From: pmatilai at welho.com (Panu Matilainen) Date: Fri, 04 Mar 2005 23:32:46 +0200 Subject: rawhide report: 20050304 changes In-Reply-To: <604aa7910503041312407ebe2c@mail.gmail.com> References: <200503041242.j24Cg7qf029831@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <20050304175117.GD8420@nostromo.devel.redhat.com> <4228B272.1040903@nc.rr.com> <4228C443.8090002@snowmoon.com> <604aa7910503041312407ebe2c@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1109971966.19762.31.camel@chip.laiskiainen.org> On Fri, 2005-03-04 at 16:12 -0500, Jeff Spaleta wrote: > On Fri, 04 Mar 2005 15:25:39 -0500, Eric Warnke wrote: > > Frank Schmitt wrote: > > For people that just have to have the oly functionality they can build > > the database with rpm -i --justdb --dbpath /path/to/db /path/to/all/RPMS/* > > Assuming of course they have a full cache of rpms available locally > and not on the network. > > Speaking from my own perspective most of what I have used a local copy > of the rpmdb for is dependancy information. But when I'm trying to > debug something or confirm a reported problem I have used the rpmdb > for other queries so that I dont have to pull the rpms from the net... > especially in previous rounds of development/test release cycles. I'm > pretty sure at one time or another I have used queries for: > --scripts > --triggers > --obsoletes > --conflicts > in an effort to identify one particular package problem or another. > > If I can get access to the same information via queries of repodata I > won't be impacted at all. Even if I can't recover queries against > something like scripts.. being able to make queries against the > requires/provides for the full set Core+Extras packages will be far > more useful to most of the troubleshooting that i end up looking > into. Scripts and triggers aren't part of the current repodata info but *could* added to the "other" stuff along with changelogs where they wont slow down typical depsolving activities. Pretty much everything else is, and will be possible to query through repoquery, and some things which haven't been possible will be, along with your favorite --queryformat tricks (at least the basic ones :) : [pmatilai at chip repoquery]$ ./repoquery.py -a --qf "%{name} %{summary}" | head -5 xosview An X Window System utility for monitoring system resources. pango System for layout and rendering of internationalized text. gimp-devel GIMP plugin and extension development kit fluxbox Fluxbox is a windowmanager that is based on Blackbox. gnome-libs The main GNOME libraries. > > Though i will say the dirty little trick of running an rpm -e --test > against the full rpmdb to see what depends on a particular package was > a mighty useful dirty trick. It would be very useful to have something > as simple in the repoquery worldview to accomplish the same thing. Hmm > now that I think about it.. i think Seth told me that Panu had some > leafnode code already that can do this. The leafnode thing is a bit different, but what you're asking for is already possible with the prototype/in-progress repoquery: the first is direct dependencies on "openssl" package, the second is openssl and everything it provides against all configured repositories: [pmatilai at chip repoquery]$ ./repoquery.py --whatrequires openssl|wc -l 21 [pmatilai at chip repoquery]$ ./repoquery.py --whatrequires --resolve openssl|wc -l 157 - Panu - From skvidal at phy.duke.edu Fri Mar 4 21:37:04 2005 From: skvidal at phy.duke.edu (seth vidal) Date: Fri, 04 Mar 2005 16:37:04 -0500 Subject: Dbus and security - a few questions In-Reply-To: <1109971504.4271.9.camel@nexus.verbum.private> References: <1109962702.3440.20.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1109967465.21378.32.camel@remedyz.boston.redhat.com> <1109971504.4271.9.camel@nexus.verbum.private> Message-ID: <1109972224.23585.159.camel@cutter> On Fri, 2005-03-04 at 16:25 -0500, Colin Walters wrote: > On Fri, 2005-03-04 at 15:17 -0500, John (J5) Palmieri wrote: > > > It is similar to the risks of setuid > >binaries. > > I would say D-BUS is a lot better than setuid binaries; you have to > write a setuid binary very carefully because it can be influenced by the > parent process (environment variables, filesystem namespace, etc). The > D-BUS library does validation of the raw message formats, and I think > it's much easier to validate arguments to a method than to do all the > work involved in writing a setuid binary. okay, then let's see if this is a useful purpose for dbus. Hypothetical: Let's say I need a root-running daemon that can actually make chroots and submit items into chroots to be built. Would it be reasonable and safe to use dbus to send these requests to the daemon? Is there any way of restricting or validating WHO sent it? -sv From veillard at redhat.com Fri Mar 4 21:35:47 2005 From: veillard at redhat.com (Daniel Veillard) Date: Fri, 4 Mar 2005 16:35:47 -0500 Subject: gam_server eats CPU In-Reply-To: <20050304131623.5566a3ce@localhost.localdomain> References: <20050304131623.5566a3ce@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <20050304213547.GD22613@redhat.com> On Fri, Mar 04, 2005 at 01:16:23PM -0800, Pete Zaitcev wrote: > I have a situation where an application makes small writes to a file. > In such a case, gam_server hogs the CPU. Here's a screen capture from > top(1): [...] > I run Fedora Core 3 with Nautilus enabled, and so I cannot just remove > Gamin and be happy. Does anyone have any ideas what do about this? Are you running gamin-0.0.25 ? > P.S. In case anyone is interested in details, this is what happened. > I was looking at some USB problems with usbmon and noticed that usbmon > drops about 0.7% packets. At first I thought it was something with SMM > BIOS or whatnot. But then I noticed that CPU is eaten by Gamin and > this apparently causes cat to starve sometimes. Usbmon produces a > stream of records which are captured with: > cat /sys/kernel/debug/usbmon/1t > x.dump > It is rather lightweight, without any massive copying of data by the > kernel. E.g. the USB traffic itself creates much more copying and > memory and cache usage. dnotify, you know the ugly notification kernel interface, send gam_server one signal on every write to any file in the directories monitored. It then has to sort out which file is modified in that directory to report to the watching application. Gamin *do* try to do flow control the kernel does not do, by switching to polling every second on directories which seems busy. Best way to fix the problem for good: Get rid of dnotify, and bring inotify or any sane interface in the kernel, i.e. make sure your fellow kernel hackers don't force us to keep relying on this utter crap interface. Daniel -- Daniel Veillard | Red Hat Desktop team http://redhat.com/ veillard at redhat.com | libxml GNOME XML XSLT toolkit http://xmlsoft.org/ http://veillard.com/ | Rpmfind RPM search engine http://rpmfind.net/ From jspaleta at gmail.com Fri Mar 4 21:48:04 2005 From: jspaleta at gmail.com (Jeff Spaleta) Date: Fri, 4 Mar 2005 16:48:04 -0500 Subject: rawhide report: 20050304 changes In-Reply-To: <1109971966.19762.31.camel@chip.laiskiainen.org> References: <200503041242.j24Cg7qf029831@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <20050304175117.GD8420@nostromo.devel.redhat.com> <4228B272.1040903@nc.rr.com> <4228C443.8090002@snowmoon.com> <604aa7910503041312407ebe2c@mail.gmail.com> <1109971966.19762.31.camel@chip.laiskiainen.org> Message-ID: <604aa7910503041348e000bbf@mail.gmail.com> On Fri, 04 Mar 2005 23:32:46 +0200, Panu Matilainen wrote: > Scripts and triggers aren't part of the current repodata info but > *could* added to the "other" stuff along with changelogs where they wont > slow down typical depsolving activities. Well when I run across a need to check a trigger related report from someone in -test-list... say like in fc4t3... expect me to scream and stomp my feet about it. The scipts check..sadly..i seem to run across more frequently as I poke around. I'll probably stomp around about getting access to the scripts in the 'other' repodata a fair bit as i run into 'i wish i could check this' situations. And im pretty sure I've already had to poke into the scripts of some core updates..where even the ondisk core rpmdb didn't help, but where the repodata for the scripts would have. > [pmatilai at chip repoquery]$ ./repoquery.py -a --qf "%{name} %{summary}" | Do you have a full summary of avialable tags that i can use in -repoquery's --qf? rpm --querytags lists a lot of them.. and I'd like to have a somewhat accurate list of what repoquery understands out of that longer list that rpm knows about. I just don't want to have to guess at the overlap. > The leafnode thing is a bit different, but what you're asking for is > already possible with the prototype/in-progress repoquery: the first is > direct dependencies on "openssl" package, the second is openssl and > everything it provides against all configured repositories: > > [pmatilai at chip repoquery]$ ./repoquery.py --whatrequires openssl|wc -l > 21 > [pmatilai at chip repoquery]$ ./repoquery.py --whatrequires --resolve > openssl|wc -l > 157 that --resolve switch seems to fill the role if i understand it right. -jef From walters at redhat.com Fri Mar 4 21:56:37 2005 From: walters at redhat.com (Colin Walters) Date: Fri, 04 Mar 2005 16:56:37 -0500 Subject: Dbus and security - a few questions In-Reply-To: <1109972224.23585.159.camel@cutter> References: <1109962702.3440.20.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1109967465.21378.32.camel@remedyz.boston.redhat.com> <1109971504.4271.9.camel@nexus.verbum.private> <1109972224.23585.159.camel@cutter> Message-ID: <1109973397.4271.28.camel@nexus.verbum.private> On Fri, 2005-03-04 at 16:37 -0500, seth vidal wrote: >Let's say I need a root-running daemon that can actually make chroots >and submit items into chroots to be built. Would it be reasonable and >safe to use dbus to send these requests to the daemon? Is there any way >of restricting or validating WHO sent it? Yes; D-BUS includes a policy framework for restricting messages that can be sent. See J5's article and the D-BUS docs, or browse /etc/dbus-1/system.d for examples. D-BUS can also act as a SELinux userspace object manager; right now it can basically just control raw flow between two domains using the "send_msg" permission; so you could ensure for example that a process running with type user_t can't converse with a process with type yourdaemon_t. Future plans include labeled interfaces for more fine-grained control. From pmatilai at welho.com Fri Mar 4 22:22:01 2005 From: pmatilai at welho.com (Panu Matilainen) Date: Sat, 05 Mar 2005 00:22:01 +0200 Subject: rawhide report: 20050304 changes In-Reply-To: <604aa7910503041348e000bbf@mail.gmail.com> References: <200503041242.j24Cg7qf029831@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <20050304175117.GD8420@nostromo.devel.redhat.com> <4228B272.1040903@nc.rr.com> <4228C443.8090002@snowmoon.com> <604aa7910503041312407ebe2c@mail.gmail.com> <1109971966.19762.31.camel@chip.laiskiainen.org> <604aa7910503041348e000bbf@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1109974922.19762.47.camel@chip.laiskiainen.org> On Fri, 2005-03-04 at 16:48 -0500, Jeff Spaleta wrote: > On Fri, 04 Mar 2005 23:32:46 +0200, Panu Matilainen wrote: > > Scripts and triggers aren't part of the current repodata info but > > *could* added to the "other" stuff along with changelogs where they wont > > slow down typical depsolving activities. > > Well when I run across a need to check a trigger related report from > someone in -test-list... say like in fc4t3... expect me to scream and > stomp my feet about it. > The scipts check..sadly..i seem to run across more frequently as I > poke around. I'll probably stomp around about getting access to the > scripts in the 'other' repodata a fair bit as i run into 'i wish i > could check this' situations. And im pretty sure I've already had to > poke into the scripts of some core updates..where even the ondisk core > rpmdb didn't help, but where the repodata for the scripts would have. Yep. Seth, what do you think? The scripts and triggers amount to far less data than the changelog information that's currently there... maybe createrepo should add those to other.xml as well? > > > [pmatilai at chip repoquery]$ ./repoquery.py -a --qf "%{name} %{summary}" | > > Do you have a full summary of avialable tags that i can use in > -repoquery's --qf? > rpm --querytags lists a lot of them.. and I'd like to have a somewhat > accurate list of what repoquery understands out of that longer list > that rpm knows about. I just don't want to have to guess at the > overlap. I don't have a list, but you can get an idea by looking at the repodata files - everything in there can be (eventually) queried. Some day I'd like to actually have "full" rpm --qf emulation for even stuff like --qf "[* %{CHANGELOGTIME:day} %{CHANGELOGNAME}\n\n% {CHANGELOGTEXT}\n\n]'" but I'm concentrating on the basics ATM :) > > > The leafnode thing is a bit different, but what you're asking for is > > already possible with the prototype/in-progress repoquery: the first is > > direct dependencies on "openssl" package, the second is openssl and > > everything it provides against all configured repositories: > > > > [pmatilai at chip repoquery]$ ./repoquery.py --whatrequires openssl|wc -l > > 21 > > [pmatilai at chip repoquery]$ ./repoquery.py --whatrequires --resolve > > openssl|wc -l > > 157 > > that --resolve switch seems to fill the role if i understand it right. Yup, if I understood correctly your question it'll do what you want. - Panu - From green at redhat.com Fri Mar 4 22:31:46 2005 From: green at redhat.com (Anthony Green) Date: Fri, 04 Mar 2005 14:31:46 -0800 Subject: fedora-devel-java-list In-Reply-To: <1109968423.22563.1.camel@one.myworld> References: <20050304161808.GB16343@redhat.com> <1109968423.22563.1.camel@one.myworld> Message-ID: <1109975506.7344.51.camel@localhost.localdomain> On Fri, 2005-03-04 at 21:33 +0100, F?liciano Matias wrote: > Le vendredi 04 mars 2005 ? 11:18 -0500, Andrew Overholt a ?crit : > > I don't think the new list was announced here. If you're interested in > > Fedora java-related topics, check out: > > > > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-java-list > > More importantly, this mailing (and many other) is not in : > http://fedora.redhat.com/participate/communicate/ Yes, I asked about that when I originally announced fedora-devel-java- list. I don't know how those pages are maintained. Pointers welcome! AG From hp at redhat.com Fri Mar 4 22:54:42 2005 From: hp at redhat.com (Havoc Pennington) Date: Fri, 04 Mar 2005 17:54:42 -0500 Subject: Dbus and security - a few questions In-Reply-To: <1109962702.3440.20.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <1109962702.3440.20.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <1109976882.31782.21.camel@localhost.localdomain> On Fri, 2005-03-04 at 20:36 +0100, Kyrre Ness Sjobak wrote: > > But as this system grows, and more and more apps hook up - what are the > exploitation risks? Could one f.ex. buffer overflow a privilegued app > trough the dbus "network"? Which/what kind of services will be turned on > by default in future fedora installations? Ofcource, having > NetworkManager running on a shell server would be a problem so > NetworkManager would probably never be turned on by default, but where > are the border cases? There's certainly security here to think about. dbus provides fairly fine-grained firewall-style functionality, plus the selinux integration, but in the end a system daemon that takes requests via dbus has to be written with security in mind. dbus can guarantee that the daemon only gets messages of type foo with arguments a, b, c of types string, int, double; but the daemon is responsible for ensuring that it won't crash if the int is set to INT_MAX or whatever. Basically dbus handles a lot of the parsing/authentication/connection-establishing sort of issues but the app still has to validate that data is within expected parameters. Keep in mind that dbus has two separate running processes, one is the systemwide used to talk to system daemons, the other is just running as the user within the user's session like any other app. Havoc From paul at all-the-johnsons.co.uk Fri Mar 4 22:59:30 2005 From: paul at all-the-johnsons.co.uk (Paul) Date: Fri, 04 Mar 2005 22:59:30 +0000 Subject: Annoying problem with the latest rawhide evolution Message-ID: <1109977171.14972.44.camel@localhost.localdomain> Hi, I have multiple folders set in my inbox with a pile of filters which sends the emails to them. The filters and folders still work as well as they did many moons ago. The problem currently is if I delete an email from the "mine" folder (stuff directly to me), it appears in the general "Inbox" folder as deleted email (it's there with a line through it). Is anyone else seeing this? If they are, I'll bugzilla it. TTFN Paul -- "I like blinking me" - Helen, Big Brother 2 contestant -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part URL: From zaitcev at redhat.com Sat Mar 5 00:24:45 2005 From: zaitcev at redhat.com (Pete Zaitcev) Date: Fri, 4 Mar 2005 16:24:45 -0800 Subject: gam_server eats CPU In-Reply-To: References: <20050304131623.5566a3ce@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <20050304162445.3bc86b0e@localhost.localdomain> On Fri, 4 Mar 2005 16:35:47 -0500 Daniel Veillard wrote: > On Fri, Mar 04, 2005 at 01:16:23PM -0800, Pete Zaitcev wrote: > > I have a situation where an application makes small writes to a file. > > In such a case, gam_server hogs the CPU. Here's a screen capture from > > top(1): > [...] > > I run Fedora Core 3 with Nautilus enabled, and so I cannot just remove > > Gamin and be happy. Does anyone have any ideas what do about this? > > Are you running gamin-0.0.25 ? I wasn't, but I have found out that it's the same with gamin-0.0.25. Also, I looked at the strace dump. It's quite strange. At first, gam_server does its poll cycles. Everything seems ok... Then: ................. poll([{fd=13, events=0}, {fd=14, events=POLLIN}, {fd=15, events=POLLIN}, {fd=16, events=POLLIN}, {fd=17, events=POLLIN}, {fd=13, events=POLLIN}, {fd=3, events=POLLIN}], 7, 972) = 0 gettimeofday({1109981438, 502778}, NULL) = 0 time(NULL) = 1109981438 stat64("/q/zaitcev", {st_mode=S_IFDIR|0755, st_size=4096, ...}) = 0 stat64("/q/zaitcev", {st_mode=S_IFDIR|0755, st_size=4096, ...}) = 0 open("/q/zaitcev", O_RDONLY) = 23 fcntl64(23, F_SETSIG, 0x22) = 0 fcntl64(23, 0x402 /* F_??? */, 0x8000003e) = 0 --- SIGRT_2 (Real-time signal 0) @ 0 (0) --- write(12, "bogus", 5) = 5 rt_sigreturn(0x17) = 0 --- SIGRT_2 (Real-time signal 0) @ 0 (0) --- write(12, "bogus", 5) = 5 rt_sigreturn(0x17) = 0 --- SIGRT_2 (Real-time signal 0) @ 0 (0) --- write(12, "bogus", 5) = 5 rt_sigreturn(0x17) = 0 ........ These signal things go on and on without end. Descriptor 12 is a pipe, not a socket. The whole thing runs under stock 2.6.11 with CONFIG_DNOTIFY=y. As far as I can tell, inotify is not included into the kernel. -- Pete From rgammon at real.com Sat Mar 5 00:54:13 2005 From: rgammon at real.com (Ryan Gammon) Date: Fri, 04 Mar 2005 16:54:13 -0800 Subject: [Redhat-private-dev] Executable stack In-Reply-To: <4228E400.4020405@real.com> References: <4228E400.4020405@real.com> Message-ID: <42290335.2020605@real.com> Hi guys, The mail below makes it seem like: colorcvt.so cvt1.so vidsite.so ... all require an executable stack in the Helix Player shipping with Fedora. Any tips on how we can go about figuring out how to fix this? I've cc'd video-dev at helixcommunity.org -- it'd be helpful if any follow-ups could go to this list as well. Thanks! -------- Original Message -------- Subject: Re: Fedora Core 4 test 1 freeze ahead Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2005 11:42:49 +0100 From: Arjan van de Ven Reply-To: Development discussions related to Fedora Core To: os-devel-list at redhat.com CC: fedora-devel-list at redhat.com References: On Fri, Feb 04, 2005 at 04:29:41PM -0500, Elliot Lee wrote: > Yes, it's that time again... > > Although the FC4 schedule hasn't been finalized yet, we do need to try to > stick to the preliminary one until it's decided otherwise. Fedora Core 4 > test 1 is currently slated to come out on February 21st, which means that > I would fall in love with you all over again if you did your part to make > sure the tree was installable and free of broken dependencies & conflicts > by Valentine's Day (Monday, February 14th). > > The goal for FC4test1 is to "get something out there" - it may not be > fully baked, but it does need to pass basic sanity tests, be able to > install and avoid killing people's systems. One of the ways > non-developers > can help is by trying to install from rawhide and yelling loudly about > any > showstopper (i.e. hard disk-destroying) problems. oh another thing we need to resolve is the over-abundance of execshield-disabling libaries and binaries in the distro. the following list (made by Marc Cox) is what we shipped as such in rhel4; if you're the owner of any of these packages/files please seriously consider fixing these. If you don't know how or what or otherwise have questions, do not hesitate to ask via email (on this list or off list) or on IRC; for security reasons we really need to reduce this list to almost nothing. anaconda-runtime-10.1.1.13-1.i386 ./usr/lib/anaconda-runtime/loader/init: stack=RWE anaconda-runtime-10.1.1.13-1.i386 ./usr/lib/anaconda-runtime/loader/loader: stack=RWE libgcj-3.4.3-9.EL4.i386 ./usr/lib/libgcj.so.5.0.0: stack=RWE gcc-gnat-3.4.3-9.EL4.i386 ./usr/bin/gnatbind: stack=RWE gcc-gnat-3.4.3-9.EL4.i386 ./usr/bin/gnatls: stack=RWE gcc-gnat-3.4.3-9.EL4.i386 ./usr/bin/gnatmake: stack=RWE gcc-gnat-3.4.3-9.EL4.i386 ./usr/libexec/gcc/i386-redhat-linux/3.4.3/gnat1: stack=RWE libgnat-3.4.3-9.EL4.i386 ./usr/lib/libgnat-3.4.so.1: stack=RWE compat-libstdc++-296-2.96-132.7.2.i386 ./usr/lib/libstdc++-3-libc6.2-2-2.10.0.so: stack=RWE xorg-x11-6.8.1-23.EL.i386 ./usr/X11R6/lib/modules/dri/gamma_dri.so: stack=RWE xorg-x11-6.8.1-23.EL.i386 ./usr/X11R6/lib/modules/dri/i810_dri.so: stack=RWE xorg-x11-6.8.1-23.EL.i386 ./usr/X11R6/lib/modules/dri/i915_dri.so: stack=RWE xorg-x11-6.8.1-23.EL.i386 ./usr/X11R6/lib/modules/dri/mga_dri.so: stack=RWE xorg-x11-6.8.1-23.EL.i386 ./usr/X11R6/lib/modules/dri/r128_dri.so: stack=RWE xorg-x11-6.8.1-23.EL.i386 ./usr/X11R6/lib/modules/dri/r200_dri.so: stack=RWE xorg-x11-6.8.1-23.EL.i386 ./usr/X11R6/lib/modules/dri/radeon_dri.so: stack=RWE xorg-x11-6.8.1-23.EL.i386 ./usr/X11R6/lib/modules/dri/tdfx_dri.so: stack=RWE xorg-x11-libs-6.8.1-23.EL.i386 ./usr/X11R6/lib/libOSMesa.so.4.0: stack=RWE gstreamer-0.8.7-4.EL.0.i386 ./usr/lib/gstreamer-0.8/libgstgetbits.so: stack=RWE alsa-lib-1.0.6-4.i386 ./lib/libasound.so.2.0.0: stack=RWE grub-0.95-3.1.i386 ./sbin/grub: stack=RWE kernel-utils-2.4-13.1.48.i386 ./usr/sbin/x86info: stack=RWE valgrind-2.2.0-5.EL4.i386 ./usr/lib/valgrind/libpthread.so: stack=RWE gstreamer-plugins-0.8.5-1.EL.0.i386 ./usr/lib/gstreamer-0.8/libgsthermescolorspace.so: stack=RWE gstreamer-plugins-0.8.5-1.EL.0.i386 ./usr/lib/gstreamer-0.8/libgstvideoscale.so: stack=RWE HelixPlayer-1.0.1.gold-8EL.i386 ./usr/lib/helix/codecs/colorcvt.so: stack=RWE HelixPlayer-1.0.1.gold-8EL.i386 ./usr/lib/helix/codecs/cvt1.so: stack=RWE HelixPlayer-1.0.1.gold-8EL.i386 ./usr/lib/helix/plugins/vidsite.so: stack=RWE mkinitrd-4.1.18-2.i386 ./sbin/nash: stack=RWE bogl-0.1.18-4.i386 ./usr/lib/libbogl.so.0.1: stack=RWE dietlibc-0.27-4.i386 ./usr/bin/diet: stack=RWE SDL-1.2.7-8.i386 ./usr/lib/libSDL-1.2.so.0.7.0: stack=RWE xmms-1.2.10-9.i386 ./usr/lib/xmms/Visualization/libbscope.so: stack=RWE guile-1.6.4-14.i386 ./usr/lib/libqthreads.so.12.3.0: stack=RWE net-tools-1.60-37.i386 ./sbin/netplugd: stack=RWE module-init-tools-3.1-0.pre5.3.i386 ./sbin/insmod.static: stack=RWE libdv-0.103-1.i386 ./usr/lib/libdv.so.4.0.1: stack=RWE gdk-pixbuf-0.22.0-15.1.i386 ./usr/lib/libgdk_pixbuf.so.2.0.0: stack=RWE gdk-pixbuf-0.22.0-15.1.i386 ./usr/lib/libgdk_pixbuf_xlib.so.2.0.0: stack=RWE libsilc-0.9.12-7.i386 ./usr/lib/libsilc-1.0.so.2.1.0: stack=RWE gnupg-1.2.6-1.i386 ./usr/bin/gpg: stack=RWE gnupg-1.2.6-1.i386 ./usr/bin/gpgv: stack=RWE flac-1.1.0-7.i386 ./usr/lib/libFLAC.so.4.1.2: stack=RWE beecrypt-3.1.0-6.i386 ./usr/lib/libbeecrypt.so.6.2.0: stack=RWE -- Ryan Gammon rgammon at real.com Developer for Helix Player https://player.helixcommunity.org From roland at redhat.com Sat Mar 5 01:10:50 2005 From: roland at redhat.com (Roland McGrath) Date: Fri, 4 Mar 2005 17:10:50 -0800 Subject: [Redhat-private-dev] Executable stack In-Reply-To: Ryan Gammon's message of Friday, 4 March 2005 16:54:13 -0800 <42290335.2020605@real.com> Message-ID: <200503050110.j251AoGW001302@magilla.sf.frob.com> This comes up so often that I think someone (maybe even me?) must have written a few scripts to help with this, and certainly a FAQ or something. It's quite easy to track down how this comes about if you have a build of the thing in question and examine its object files. By checking the ELF section headers of each individual object file, you can see which ones have the executable-stack marker--it only takes one to get the entire DSO or program binary marked executable. Roughly, "readelf -S x.o | grep GNU-stack". X marks the spot. :-) Once you've located the object files in question and found their sources, there are two common cases that are producing this. One is assembly code (usually .s or .S files); bare assembly files get no marker, and no marker defaults to meaning marked executable. In the assembly code, just add: .section .note.GNU-stack .previous That is, unless you think the assembly code might actually use executable stack. That you'll have to figure out, but it's an unusual thing for some assembly code to do. If it does, make that: .section .note.GNU-stack, "x". The other common situation is nested functions (a GCC extension in C code). These can sometimes be made nested inline functions, and optimized away. Other times it's not hard to just make them static functions. Sometimes nested functions are nice to have and it makes the code hairier to avoid them, so you just want to leave them and acknowledge that executable stack is going to be required for that program or library. From pri.rhl3 at iadonisi.to Sat Mar 5 02:05:15 2005 From: pri.rhl3 at iadonisi.to (Paul Iadonisi) Date: Fri, 04 Mar 2005 21:05:15 -0500 Subject: kernel-2.6.11-1.1166_FC4.src.rpm In-Reply-To: <1109907439.3374.44.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> References: <1109903514.3374.5.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> <1109903911.7231.20.camel@ignacio.ignacio.lan> <1109904297.3374.11.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> <2483.10.10.10.24.1109904418.squirrel@linux1> <1109904954.3374.16.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> <20050304032424.GB31737@jadzia.bu.edu> <1109907439.3374.44.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> Message-ID: <1109988315.6713.18.camel@md.local.linuxlobbyist.org> On Thu, 2005-03-03 at 22:37 -0500, David Cary Hart wrote: > On Thu, 2005-03-03 at 22:24 -0500, Matthew Miller wrote: > > On Thu, Mar 03, 2005 at 09:55:54PM -0500, David Cary Hart wrote: > > > No. What has been widely discussed is the elimination of the pre- > > > compiled kernel-source. HOWEVER, I have always been able to compile the > > > kernel-source myself from the src.rpm. The current src.rpm does not have > > > the code necessary for creating kernel-source. There is no way to > > > customize the FC4 kernel without hacking the config files which is a > > > VERY bad idea. > > > > I don't get it -- you're already rebuilding the kernel source RPM. Why is it > > even a slightly bad idea to add your customizations at that level? Sounds > > like a _excellent_ idea, in fact. It is an excellent an idea. And it's one that I've been doing for over five years with, I would wager, far fewer problems than using a 'binary' kernel-source rpm (or kernel-sourcecode in its later incarnations) and the upstream tools to build a kernel. It always struck me as just plain wrong to have a full kernel source tree that it's heavily modified by the kernel build process itself when that tree is managed by rpm. I substantially defeated the purpose of having it managed by rpm. And it left detritus around when you removed the rpm. Lots of it. Even when I had it installed on many of my systems, I typically used it only for reference, or to copy over to subdir in my home dir to build a test kernel there. One thing Mr. Hart has mentioned though is a problem, but absolutely not 'perilous'. Don't worry about the 'do-not-edit' warnings in the config files. They are there because the upstream kernel build tools put them there, not because it was a conscious decision by the kernel rpm packager. Sometimes CONFIG_* dependencies and conflicts can be a bear to deal with, but in most cases they are quite simple. Just a quick look at the Kconfig file in the area you are changing usually reveals what else you may need to change. But when that fails, just copy the relevant config file to '.config' in the kernel dir, do 'make oldconfig' (I believe) and pick your options. When your done, you have a .config that you can copy back to the proper name for your rpm build to pick up. Oh, and don't forget to change your Release: tag to something meaningful before doing 'rpmbuild -ba' on your spec file. This 'new way' takes some getting used to, but in the end, having your custom kernel managed by rpm, in most cases, makes your admin job much more manageable. -- -Paul Iadonisi Senior System Administrator Red Hat Certified Engineer / Local Linux Lobbyist Ever see a penguin fly? -- Try Linux. GPL all the way: Sell services, don't lease secrets From loony at loonybin.org Sat Mar 5 02:08:35 2005 From: loony at loonybin.org (Peter Arremann) Date: Fri, 4 Mar 2005 21:08:35 -0500 Subject: 64bit clean AMD64? Message-ID: <200503042108.35646.loony@loonybin.org> All, I was trying to install a 64bit clean (no 32bit code) version of FC3 and rawhide this week and I was wondering why there is no good option for this? On a webserver I don't need to have a 32bit firefox plugin - but even if I deselect all graphical stuff, I still get some i386 packages in there... What is the future direction on this? When I look at OSF/1 or the IA64 bit versions of most Linux distributions I get jealous on how clean their environment is... For most server environments, 32bit versions of libraries you don't need are just clutter... Peter. From pri.rhl3 at iadonisi.to Sat Mar 5 02:17:04 2005 From: pri.rhl3 at iadonisi.to (Paul Iadonisi) Date: Fri, 04 Mar 2005 21:17:04 -0500 Subject: Follow-up - kernel.src Issue In-Reply-To: <1109953045.9166.37.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> References: <1109951279.9166.19.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> <20050304165421.544b9420.fedora@wir-sind-cool.org> <1109952468.11074.60.camel@shahms.mesd.k12.or.us> <1109953045.9166.37.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> Message-ID: <1109989024.6713.27.camel@md.local.linuxlobbyist.org> On Fri, 2005-03-04 at 11:17 -0500, David Cary Hart wrote: [snip] > OK, that eliminates manually applying the patches. However, it seems > like considerably more work than just spinning out a kernel-source.rpm > from src.rpm. Moreover, it lacks the portability of kernel-source.rpm. > Again, I'm NOT asking for a distribution of kernel-source; Just > retaining the options. See my earlier post where I discuss why I think kernel-source[code] has always been weird ;-). It is, of course, my own opinion. > I just don't understand why the change was made. It fixed what weren't > broke. Well there is one problem with that statement: because the kernel- source[code] rpm is not built, AFAIK, for any of Red Hat's builds (neither FC nor RHEL), that spec file code will, if it has not already, suffer from bit rot. Which means another thread every month about why kernel-sourcecode should or shouldn't be re-introduced. Which will mean more people pissed off and more bruised egos. But I digress... In my view, since there is no kernel-source[code] 'binary' rpm packaged included in the distribution, then it should be left up to the maintainer of the kernel rpm whether or not to maintain, ignore, or remove that spec file code. It seems the maintainer has spoken. -- -Paul Iadonisi Senior System Administrator Red Hat Certified Engineer / Local Linux Lobbyist Ever see a penguin fly? -- Try Linux. GPL all the way: Sell services, don't lease secrets From eric at snowmoon.com Sat Mar 5 02:37:48 2005 From: eric at snowmoon.com (Eric Warnke) Date: Fri, 04 Mar 2005 21:37:48 -0500 Subject: Developer Introduction: Eric Warnke Message-ID: <42291B7C.6050000@snowmoon.com> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Evening all, Figured I have been making enough problems on the list I might as well formally introduce myself and try to get myself in a position to cause even more trouble ;-) I am currently employed at the State University of New York ( SUNY ) at Albany as a Systems Administrator in the Research IT department. One of the nice things about my current position is that I have access to many interesting platforms. Right now we have a mixture of pSeries (ppc64), Intel, Intel 64bit, and G4's. Fedora has been playing an ever increasing role in our infrastructure because of it's functionality and flexibility. My employer has also cleared the way to me utilizing the ppc64 platform as a possible build platform for Fedora. I have been using Linux in some form since 1993 and have been using it professionally since 1996. In that time I have managed and programmed on Linux and many Unix operating systems. With necessity being the mother of invention I developed the first php_ldap module for use with our internal authentication mechanism. I have also submitted patches for other FOSS projects including Samba, wine, and mozilla. I am hoping to get more involved with the Fedora project by becoming a maintainer. I would love to take over the maintenance of the currently abandoned parchive tool, add the newer par2cmdline tool, and the BioInformatics tools (bioperl, gibbs, hmmer, mpiblast, and NCBI-tools) that I have been creating and maintaining for our research cluster. At this point I have the paperwork, I have access to several different platforms including the most popular x86, x86_64, and ppc. I have included two src.rpm's as examples of my own work. I also have many rpm's that have been collected, cleaned up, repackaged, and rebuild for FC3. I am also more than willing to take ownership of random abandoned packages as long as I have a way to test them. I have already asked a few people informally for sponsorship, but this is a formal request to gain access to maintain the above packages and more as time goes on. I have the paperwork done and ready to go. http://opus.snowmoon.com/~eric/min12xxw-0.0.6-1.src.rpm http://s02.rit.albany.edu/mirror/rit-fedora-extras/SRPM/par2cmdline-0.4-1.src.rpm Cheers, Eric Warnke Systems Administrator - Research IT SUNY at Albany -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.2.6 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iD8DBQFCKRt8kwuR5SGLYlkRAodrAKCgA6AbjIJlXnWZkstjLiziWlvVvQCffUYv dsHYMylMIoZmrlgdb8uHLLo= =r+vf -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From thomasz at hostmaster.org Sat Mar 5 03:00:21 2005 From: thomasz at hostmaster.org (Thomas Zehetbauer) Date: Sat, 05 Mar 2005 04:00:21 +0100 Subject: 64bit clean AMD64? In-Reply-To: <200503042108.35646.loony@loonybin.org> References: <200503042108.35646.loony@loonybin.org> Message-ID: <1109991621.4491.39.camel@hostmaster.org> You always get some unnecessary packages, even with pure bitness installations, for example pcmcia-cs, just remove them manually. Tom -- T h o m a s Z e h e t b a u e r ( TZ251 ) PGP encrypted mail preferred - KeyID 96FFCB89 finger thomasz at hostmaster.org for key Why do you call your dog 1234? My admin told me not to name my password after my dog. -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 481 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part URL: From jerone at gmail.com Sat Mar 5 03:38:46 2005 From: jerone at gmail.com (Jerone Young) Date: Fri, 4 Mar 2005 21:38:46 -0600 Subject: 64bit clean AMD64? In-Reply-To: <1109991621.4491.39.camel@hostmaster.org> References: <200503042108.35646.loony@loonybin.org> <1109991621.4491.39.camel@hostmaster.org> Message-ID: <9f50a7a00503041938f388c6b@mail.gmail.com> I would question what you mean by "clean". It is clean already. 64-bit libraries and 32-bit libraries are clearly separated and there is no confusion. Most of your apps are compiled 64-bit , some with 32-bit libraries for backward compatibility. Not every app (open office for instance) is 64-bit ready. You know the difference is that IA-64 has NO backward compatibility with anything else. There is a lot of software that written for Linux (non open source of course) that is compiled for 32-bit Linux (the most popular Linux). Your system is going to run at the same speed with or without 32-bit libraries. Also as mentioned above you can just manually remove them if they bother you that much. But you may one day need a program that is not 64-bit ready. I think your wining is ridiculous. On Sat, 05 Mar 2005 04:00:21 +0100, Thomas Zehetbauer wrote: > You always get some unnecessary packages, even with pure bitness > installations, for example pcmcia-cs, just remove them manually. > > Tom > > -- > T h o m a s Z e h e t b a u e r ( TZ251 ) > PGP encrypted mail preferred - KeyID 96FFCB89 > finger thomasz at hostmaster.org for key > > Why do you call your dog 1234? > My admin told me not to name my password after my dog. > > > -- > fedora-devel-list mailing list > fedora-devel-list at redhat.com > http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-list > > > From loony at loonybin.org Sat Mar 5 03:50:03 2005 From: loony at loonybin.org (Peter Arremann) Date: Fri, 4 Mar 2005 22:50:03 -0500 Subject: 64bit clean AMD64? In-Reply-To: <9f50a7a00503041938f388c6b@mail.gmail.com> References: <200503042108.35646.loony@loonybin.org> <1109991621.4491.39.camel@hostmaster.org> <9f50a7a00503041938f388c6b@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <200503042250.03811.loony@loonybin.org> On Friday 04 March 2005 22:38, Jerone Young wrote: >?I think your wining is ridiculous. Wasn't aware anyone was whining :-) I was simply wondering about the future direction - for servers I could care less about openoffice - I need a system that works well. Since FC is the prototype for RHEL and RH is more open to giving out info about future FC releases than EL, it's in my opinion a valid question. I think I was pretty clean with the examples of Tru64 and IA64 Linux what I meant with 64bit clean. I meant the platform as a whole, not a specific piece of software. If you have a better name for that I'd love to hear it. Peter. From jspaleta at gmail.com Sat Mar 5 03:58:38 2005 From: jspaleta at gmail.com (Jeff Spaleta) Date: Fri, 4 Mar 2005 22:58:38 -0500 Subject: 64bit clean AMD64? In-Reply-To: <200503042250.03811.loony@loonybin.org> References: <200503042108.35646.loony@loonybin.org> <1109991621.4491.39.camel@hostmaster.org> <9f50a7a00503041938f388c6b@mail.gmail.com> <200503042250.03811.loony@loonybin.org> Message-ID: <604aa791050304195846ae1232@mail.gmail.com> On Fri, 4 Mar 2005 22:50:03 -0500, Peter Arremann wrote: > On Friday 04 March 2005 22:38, Jerone Young wrote: > > I think your wining is ridiculous. > > Wasn't aware anyone was whining :-) > I was simply wondering about the future direction - for servers I could care > less about openoffice - I need a system that works well. Since FC is the > prototype for RHEL and RH is more open to giving out info about future FC > releases than EL, it's in my opinion a valid question. > I think I was pretty clean with the examples of Tru64 and IA64 Linux what I > meant with 64bit clean. I meant the platform as a whole, not a specific piece > of software. If you have a better name for that I'd love to hear it. what istall type are you actually doing in the installer? are you doing a minimal install or server? 'server' as a default install type is a rather generic concept.. and is not going to meet any single person's definition completely. To really setup a server for specific tasks requires customization you aren't going to be able to rely on a default install type in the installer to give you exactly what you want. Why isn't kickstart file creation enough flexibility to create the system the specific system that you want? There is room in the ecosystem for an array of pre-baked kickstart files if there are people in the community willing to work on them..collect them.. and maintain them. -jef"mmmmm beer"spaleta From feliciano.matias at free.fr Sat Mar 5 05:36:35 2005 From: feliciano.matias at free.fr (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?F=E9liciano?= Matias) Date: Sat, 05 Mar 2005 06:36:35 +0100 Subject: fedora-devel-java-list In-Reply-To: <1109975506.7344.51.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <20050304161808.GB16343@redhat.com> <1109968423.22563.1.camel@one.myworld> <1109975506.7344.51.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <1110000995.27640.1.camel@one.myworld> Le vendredi 04 mars 2005 ? 14:31 -0800, Anthony Green a ?crit : > On Fri, 2005-03-04 at 21:33 +0100, F?liciano Matias wrote: > > Le vendredi 04 mars 2005 ? 11:18 -0500, Andrew Overholt a ?crit : > > > I don't think the new list was announced here. If you're interested in > > > Fedora java-related topics, check out: > > > > > > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-java-list > > > > More importantly, this mailing (and many other) is not in : > > http://fedora.redhat.com/participate/communicate/ > > Yes, I asked about that when I originally announced fedora-devel-java- > list. I don't know how those pages are maintained. Pointers welcome! Hopefully all mailings are here : http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/ -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: Ceci est une partie de message num?riquement sign?e URL: From alan at balclutha.org Sat Mar 5 06:27:19 2005 From: alan at balclutha.org (Alan Milligan) Date: Sat, 05 Mar 2005 17:27:19 +1100 Subject: RPM depresolving Message-ID: <42295147.9000204@balclutha.org> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Hi, I'd like to add my two cents worth to this conversation ;) We need to get a definitive answer to this in somewhere like the rhpl package. The solution should involve a creating a directed acyclic graph (DAG) class, populated from the Requires (or BuildRequires). The smart thing to do is to have this class define an __add__ method so that we can collate requires across packages (as represented by their DAG's). I've spent some time googling for some decent Python DAG classes, and have yet to find anything that does these additions. I have some stuff that I've done in conjunction with our builder at https://build.last-bastion.net. I feel it's a little simplistic, and would love to replace it with something better. But in terms of seeing it all in action, please visit https://build.last-bastion.net/RPMBuilder/SRPMS/FC3/item200089254 (requires section), and https://build.last-bastion.net/RPMBuilder/RPMS/i386/item221593639/distro_dependencies I'm absolutely available to help out with anyone elses effort. Alan -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.2.4 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iD8DBQFCKVFHCfroLk4EZpkRArHsAJ9GNop1zSDSHILCU/AknIBghMx9/ACgpALx aJyVv9aXlJajkox1dr0Vbos= =c4XG -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From veillard at redhat.com Sat Mar 5 10:20:09 2005 From: veillard at redhat.com (Daniel Veillard) Date: Sat, 5 Mar 2005 05:20:09 -0500 Subject: gam_server eats CPU In-Reply-To: <20050304162445.3bc86b0e@localhost.localdomain> References: <20050304131623.5566a3ce@localhost.localdomain> <20050304162445.3bc86b0e@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <20050305102009.GI22613@redhat.com> On Fri, Mar 04, 2005 at 04:24:45PM -0800, Pete Zaitcev wrote: > On Fri, 4 Mar 2005 16:35:47 -0500 Daniel Veillard wrote: > > On Fri, Mar 04, 2005 at 01:16:23PM -0800, Pete Zaitcev wrote: > > > > I have a situation where an application makes small writes to a file. > > > In such a case, gam_server hogs the CPU. Here's a screen capture from > > > top(1): > > [...] > > > I run Fedora Core 3 with Nautilus enabled, and so I cannot just remove > > > Gamin and be happy. Does anyone have any ideas what do about this? > > > > Are you running gamin-0.0.25 ? > > I wasn't, but I have found out that it's the same with gamin-0.0.25. > Also, I looked at the strace dump. It's quite strange. At first, > gam_server does its poll cycles. Everything seems ok... Then: > > ................. > poll([{fd=13, events=0}, {fd=14, events=POLLIN}, {fd=15, events=POLLIN}, {fd=16, events=POLLIN}, {fd=17, events=POLLIN}, {fd=13, events=POLLIN}, {fd=3, events=POLLIN}], 7, 972) = 0 > gettimeofday({1109981438, 502778}, NULL) = 0 > time(NULL) = 1109981438 > stat64("/q/zaitcev", {st_mode=S_IFDIR|0755, st_size=4096, ...}) = 0 > stat64("/q/zaitcev", {st_mode=S_IFDIR|0755, st_size=4096, ...}) = 0 > open("/q/zaitcev", O_RDONLY) = 23 > fcntl64(23, F_SETSIG, 0x22) = 0 > fcntl64(23, 0x402 /* F_??? */, 0x8000003e) = 0 > --- SIGRT_2 (Real-time signal 0) @ 0 (0) --- > write(12, "bogus", 5) = 5 > rt_sigreturn(0x17) = 0 > --- SIGRT_2 (Real-time signal 0) @ 0 (0) --- > write(12, "bogus", 5) = 5 > rt_sigreturn(0x17) = 0 > --- SIGRT_2 (Real-time signal 0) @ 0 (0) --- > write(12, "bogus", 5) = 5 > rt_sigreturn(0x17) = 0 > ........ > > These signal things go on and on without end. Descriptor 12 is a pipe, > not a socket. > > The whole thing runs under stock 2.6.11 with CONFIG_DNOTIFY=y. > As far as I can tell, inotify is not included into the kernel. Okay, then please open a bugzilla entry specifying a way to reproduce this, I will look at it closely then. thanks, Daniel P.S. Please subscribe to the gamin list if further posting is needed, thanks. -- Daniel Veillard | Red Hat Desktop team http://redhat.com/ veillard at redhat.com | libxml GNOME XML XSLT toolkit http://xmlsoft.org/ http://veillard.com/ | Rpmfind RPM search engine http://rpmfind.net/ From mike at navi.cx Sat Mar 5 12:14:52 2005 From: mike at navi.cx (Mike Hearn) Date: Sat, 05 Mar 2005 12:14:52 +0000 Subject: [Redhat-private-dev] Executable stack References: <42290335.2020605@real.com> <200503050110.j251AoGW001302@magilla.sf.frob.com> Message-ID: On Fri, 04 Mar 2005 17:10:50 -0800, Roland McGrath wrote: > Once you've located the object files in question and found their sources, > there are two common cases that are producing this. One is assembly code > (usually .s or .S files); bare assembly files get no marker, and no marker > defaults to meaning marked executable. In the assembly code, just add: > > .section .note.GNU-stack > .previous This is what you have to do for inline assembly as well, yes? From jakub at redhat.com Sat Mar 5 12:08:24 2005 From: jakub at redhat.com (Jakub Jelinek) Date: Sat, 5 Mar 2005 07:08:24 -0500 Subject: [Redhat-private-dev] Executable stack In-Reply-To: References: <42290335.2020605@real.com> <200503050110.j251AoGW001302@magilla.sf.frob.com> Message-ID: <20050305120824.GX853@devserv.devel.redhat.com> On Sat, Mar 05, 2005 at 12:14:52PM +0000, Mike Hearn wrote: > On Fri, 04 Mar 2005 17:10:50 -0800, Roland McGrath wrote: > > Once you've located the object files in question and found their sources, > > there are two common cases that are producing this. One is assembly code > > (usually .s or .S files); bare assembly files get no marker, and no marker > > defaults to meaning marked executable. In the assembly code, just add: > > > > .section .note.GNU-stack > > .previous > > This is what you have to do for inline assembly as well, yes? No. For inline assembly, the compiler assumes they don't need executable stack, unless told otherwise. Jakub From buildsys at redhat.com Sat Mar 5 12:41:06 2005 From: buildsys at redhat.com (Build System) Date: Sat, 5 Mar 2005 07:41:06 -0500 Subject: rawhide report: 20050305 changes Message-ID: <200503051241.j25Cf6AX008650@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> New package eclipse-cdt C/C++ Development Tools (CDT) plugin for Eclipse Removed package giftrans Removed package cdecl Removed package ncftp Removed package cdlabelgen Removed package jed Removed package cproto Removed package ftpcopy Removed package nedit Removed package routed Removed package MagicPoint Removed package dmalloc Removed package qmkbootdisk Updated Packages: NetworkManager-0.4-1.cvs20050304.3.0 ------------------------------------ * Fri Mar 04 2005 Dan Williams 0.3.4-1.cvs20050304 - Pull from latest CVS HEAD - Rebuild for gcc 4.0 * Tue Feb 22 2005 Dan Williams 0.3.3-2.cvs20050222 - Update from CVS PyQt-3.14-1 ----------- * Fri Mar 04 2005 Than Ngo 3.14-1 - 3.14 adjtimex-1.13-16 ---------------- * Fri Mar 04 2005 Jindrich Novy 1.13-16 - rebuilt with gcc4 apr-util-0.9.6-2 ---------------- * Fri Mar 04 2005 Joe Orton 0.9.6-2 - rebuild arts-8:1.4.0-0.rc1.4 -------------------- * Fri Mar 04 2005 Than Ngo 8:1.4.0-0.rc1.4 - rebuilt against gcc-4.0.0-0.31 beecrypt-4.1.2-2 ---------------- * Fri Mar 04 2005 Jeff Johnson 4.1.2-2 - rebuild with gcc4. bogl-0:0.1.18-7 --------------- * Fri Mar 04 2005 Miloslav Trmac - 0:0.1.18-7 - Add missing includes in bogl-0.1.18-rh.patch - Rebuild with gcc 4 bug-buddy-1:2.9.92-1 -------------------- * Sat Mar 05 2005 Christopher Aillon 2.9.92-1 - Update to 2.9.92 - Build against GCC 4.0 * Fri Feb 11 2005 Matthias Clasen 2.9.91-1 - Update to 2.9.91 bzip2-1.0.2-15 -------------- * Fri Mar 04 2005 Jiri Ryska - rebuilt cman-kernel-2.6.11-0.3 ---------------------- crypto-utils-2.1-6 ------------------ * Fri Mar 04 2005 Joe Orton 2.1-6 - rebuild cvs-1.11.19-3 ------------- * Thu Mar 03 2005 Martin Stransky 1.11.19-3 - add xinetd config file (#136929) - add proxy-support patch (#144297) cyrus-imapd-2.2.10-11.4.fc4 --------------------------- * Fri Mar 04 2005 John Dennis - 2.2.10-11.4.fc4 - fix gcc4 build problems * Thu Mar 03 2005 John Dennis 2.2.10-11.3.fc4 - bump rev for build db4-4.3.27-2 ------------ * Fri Mar 04 2005 Jeff Johnson 4.3.27-2 - rebuild with gcc4. ddd-3.3.10-2 ------------ * Fri Mar 04 2005 Than Ngo 3.3.10-2 - rebuilt against gcc-4 device-mapper-1.01.00-1.1 ------------------------- * Fri Mar 04 2005 Alasdair Kergon - 1.01.00-1.1 - Rebuild requested for gcc update. dlm-kernel-2.6.11-0.2 --------------------- doxygen-1:1.4.1-2 ----------------- * Fri Mar 04 2005 Than Ngo 1:1.4.1-2 - rebuilt against gcc-4 eclipse-1:3.1.0_fc-0.M5.10 -------------------------- * Fri Mar 04 2005 Andrew Overholt 3.1.0_fc-0.M5.10 - Add proper mozilla version. - Don't build eclipseAdaptor.jar.so in order to work around plugin building problems. eclipse-bugzilla-1:0.1.0_fc-5 ----------------------------- eclipse-changelog-1:2.0.1_fc-16 ------------------------------- * Sat Mar 05 2005 Phil Muldoon 2.0.1-16 - Added BuildRequires eclipse-pydev - Added BuildRequires eclipse-cdt - Removed -g gcc option * Fri Mar 04 2005 Phil Muldoon 2.0.1-15 - Added python(pydev) parser to core - Addex x86_64 back to ExclusiveArch eclipse-pydev-1:0.9.0_fc-4 -------------------------- fbset-2.1-20 ------------ * Fri Mar 04 2005 Jidnrich Novy 2.1-20 - rebuilt with gcc4 firefox-0:1.0.1-4 ----------------- * Fri Mar 04 2005 Christopher Aillon 0:1.0.1-4 - Build against gcc4, add build patches to do so. * Thu Mar 03 2005 Christopher Aillon 0:1.0.1-3 - Remerge firefox-1.0-pango-selection.patch - Add execshield patches for ia64 and ppc - BuildRequires libgnome-devel, libgnomeui-devel fontconfig-2.2.3-12 ------------------- * Fri Mar 04 2005 David Zeuthen - 2.2.3-12 - Rebuild * Fri Mar 04 2005 David Zeuthen - 2.2.3-11 - Rebuild * Fri Mar 04 2005 David Zeuthen - 2.2.3-10 - Rebuild freetype-2.1.9-2 ---------------- * Fri Mar 04 2005 David Zeuthen - 2.1.9-2 - Rebuild ftp-0.17-25 ----------- * Fri Mar 04 2005 Jiri Ryska - rebuilt * Wed Jan 12 2005 Tim Waugh 0.17-24 - Rebuilt for new readline. * Wed Dec 15 2004 Tim Waugh - Call setlocale() so that readline works correctly (bug #142265). gcc-4.0.0-0.31 -------------- gftp-1:2.0.18-2 --------------- * Fri Mar 04 2005 David Zeuthen 2.0.18-2 - Rebuild gnbd-kernel-2.6.11-0.4 ---------------------- gnome-menus-2.9.90-4 -------------------- * Fri Mar 04 2005 Jeremy Katz - 2.9.90-4 - fix 64bit pointer problem that caused the panel to crash gnome-print-1:0.37-11 --------------------- * Fri Mar 04 2005 David Zeuthen 1:0.37-10 - Rebuild gnome-system-monitor-2.9.91-2 ----------------------------- * Fri Mar 04 2005 David Zeuthen 2.9.91-2 - Rebuild gnome-themes-2.9.95-1 --------------------- * Sat Mar 05 2005 Matthias Clasen - 2.9.95-1 - Update to 2.9.95 gnome-vfs-extras-0.2.0-11 ------------------------- * Fri Mar 04 2005 David Zeuthen - s/Copyright/License/ * Fri Mar 04 2005 David Zeuthen - Rebuild gphoto2-2.1.5-4 --------------- * Fri Mar 04 2005 Tim Waugh 2.1.5-4 - Disable docs until gtk-doc is fixed (GNOME bug #169087). - Rebuilt for new GCC. gpm-1.20.1-71 ------------- * Fri Mar 04 2005 Petr Rockai - rebuilt * Mon Feb 14 2005 Adrian Havill - rebuilt gzip-1.3.3-16 ------------- * Fri Mar 04 2005 Jiri Ryska - rebuilt hexedit-1.2.10-4 ---------------- * Fri Mar 04 2005 Jindrich Novy 1.2.10-4 - rebuilt with gcc4 hpoj-0.91-13 ------------ * Fri Mar 04 2005 Tim Waugh 0.91-13 - Further build problem fixing. * Tue Mar 01 2005 Tomas Mraz - fix build with gcc4 - rebuild with openssl-0.9.7e im-sdk-1:12.1.1-7.svn2208 ------------------------- * Fri Mar 04 2005 Akira TAGOH - 1:12.1.1-7.svn2208 - iiimgcf-commit-after-reset-ic-r2235.patch: emit commit signal after resetting IC was done to avoid the double-commit. - xiiimp-fix-double-encoded-utf8.patch: applied to fix the double-encoded utf-8 problem. (#138618) iproute-2.6.10-2 ---------------- * Fri Mar 04 2005 Radek Vokal 2.6.10-2 - gcc4 rebuilt iputils-20020927-20 ------------------- * Fri Mar 04 2005 Radek Vokal 20020927-20 - arping fix for infiniband (#150156) ipv6calc-0.48-3 --------------- * Fri Mar 04 2005 Radek Vokal 0.48-3 - gcc4 rebuilt isicom-3.05-18 -------------- * Sat Mar 05 2005 Florian La Roche - fix typo joe-3.1-8 --------- * Fri Mar 04 2005 Ivana Varekova 3.1-8 - rebuilt jpilot-0.99.7-6 --------------- * Fri Mar 04 2005 Ivana Varekova 0.99.7-6 - rebuilt jwhois-3.2.2-11 --------------- * Fri Mar 04 2005 Miloslav Trmac - 3.2.2-11 - Rebuild with gcc 4 kbd-1.12-6 ---------- * Fri Mar 04 2005 Miloslav Trmac - 1.12-6 - Rebuild with gcc4 kdeadmin-7:3.4.0-0.rc1.2 ------------------------ * Fri Mar 04 2005 Than Ngo 7:3.4.0-0.rc1.2 - rebuilt against gcc-4.0.0-0.31 kdeartwork-3.4.0-0.rc1.2 ------------------------ * Fri Mar 04 2005 Than Ngo 3.4.0-0.rc1.2 - rebuilt against gcc-4.0.0-0.31 kdebase-6:3.4.0-0.rc1.4 ----------------------- * Fri Mar 04 2005 Than Ngo 6:3.4.0-0.rc1.4 - rebuilt against gcc-4.0.0-0.31 kdegames-6:3.4.0-0.rc1.2 ------------------------ * Fri Mar 04 2005 Than Ngo 6:3.4.0-0.rc1.2 - rebuilt against gcc-4.0.0-0.31 kdegraphics-7:3.4.0-0.rc1.2 --------------------------- * Fri Mar 04 2005 Than Ngo 7:3.4.0-0.rc1.2 - rebuilt against gcc-4.0.0-0.31 kdelibs-6:3.4.0-0.rc1.4 ----------------------- * Fri Mar 04 2005 Than Ngo 6:3.4.0-0.rc1.4 - rebuilt against gcc-4.0.0-0.31 kdemultimedia-6:3.4.0-0.rc1.2 ----------------------------- * Fri Mar 04 2005 Than Ngo 6:3.4.0-0.rc1.2 - rebuilt against gcc-4.0.0-0.31 kdenetwork-7:3.4.0-0.rc1.2 -------------------------- * Fri Mar 04 2005 Than Ngo 7:3.4.0-0.rc1.2 - rebuilt against gcc-4.0.0-0.31 kdepim-6:3.4.0-0.rc1.3 ---------------------- * Fri Mar 04 2005 Than Ngo 6:3.4.0-0.rc1.3 - rebuilt against gcc-4.0.0-0.31 kdeutils-6:3.4.0-0.rc1.2 ------------------------ * Fri Mar 04 2005 Than Ngo 6:3.4.0-0.rc1.2 - rebuilt against gcc-4.0.0-0.31 kdevelop-9:3.2.0-0.rc1.2 ------------------------ * Fri Mar 04 2005 Than Ngo 9:3.2.0-0.rc1.2 - rebuilt against gcc-4.0.0-0.31 kernel-2.6.11-1.1171_FC4 ------------------------ krb5-auth-dialog-0.2-2 ---------------------- less-382-7 ---------- * Fri Mar 04 2005 Jindrich Novy 382-7 - rebuilt with gcc4 libIDL-0.8.5-2 -------------- * Fri Mar 04 2005 David Zeuthen 0.8.5-2 - Rebuild libgnomeprintui22-2.8.2-2 ------------------------- * Fri Mar 04 2005 David Zeuthen - 2.8.2.-2 - Rebuild libgtk-java-2.6.0-3 ------------------- * Fri Mar 04 2005 Thomas Fitzsimmons 2.6.0-3 - Add x86_64. * Fri Mar 04 2005 Thomas Fitzsimmons - 2.6.0-2 - Remove x86_64. - Remove ppc64. - Require java-devel for build, for javadoc. * Wed Mar 02 2005 Thomas Fitzsimmons - 2.6.0-1 - Import libgtk-java 2.6.0. - Add ppc and ppc64. libgtop2-2.9.91-2 ----------------- * Fri Mar 04 2005 David Zeuthen - 2.9.91-2 - Rebuild libidn-0.5.13-2 --------------- * Fri Mar 04 2005 Joe Orton 0.5.13-2 - rebuild libuser-0.53.3-1 ---------------- * Sat Mar 05 2005 Miloslav Trmac - 0.53.3-1 - Don't silently ignore some I/O errors - Don't include a Cyrus SASL v1 header file when libldap links to v2 (#150046) - Rebuild with gcc 4 lslk-1.29-15 ------------ * Fri Mar 04 2005 Jindrich Novy 1.29-15 - rebuilt with gcc4 mod_auth_kerb-5.0-3 ------------------- * Fri Mar 04 2005 Joe Orton 5.0-3 - fix build with GCC 4 - only add "auth_kerb_module" symbol to dynamic symbol table mod_authz_ldap-0.26-3 --------------------- * Fri Mar 04 2005 Joe Orton 0.26-3 - rebuild mozilla-37:1.7.5-5 ------------------ * Sat Mar 05 2005 Christopher Aillon 37:1.7.5-5 - Add upstream fix to reduce round trips to xserver during remote control - Remerge firefox-1.0-pango-selection.patch - Add execshield patches for ia64 and ppc - Add upstream fix to call g_set_application_name - Compile against GCC 4.0 * Sat Feb 26 2005 Christopher Aillon 37:1.7.5-4 - Request the correct system colors mrtg-2.11.1-2 ------------- * Fri Mar 04 2005 Miloslav Trmac - 2.11.1-2 - Rebuild with gcc 4 mt-st-0.8-4 ----------- * Fri Mar 04 2005 Jindrich Novy 0.8-4 - rebuilt with gcc4 nc-1.10-25 ---------- * Fri Mar 04 2005 Radek Vokal 1.10-25 - gcc4 rebuilt * Wed Dec 22 2004 Radek Vokal 1.10-24 - enabling telnet support (#143498) - removed static linking - array range fixed * Mon Nov 01 2004 Radek Vokal 1.10-23 - return value of help function fixed (#137785) newt-perl-1.08-8 ---------------- * Fri Mar 04 2005 Joe Orton 1.08-8 - rebuild openoffice.org-1:1.9.81-1 ------------------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Caolan McNamara 1:1.9.81-1 - bump to 1.9.81 - drop integrated openoffice.org-1.9.77.ooo42152.gnomevfs.patch - with --with-system-stdlibs rm -f $RPM_BUILD_ROOT//usr/lib/openoffice.org1.9.81/program/libgcc_s.so.* rm -f $RPM_BUILD_ROOT//usr/lib/openoffice.org1.9.81/program/libstdc++.so.* becomes redundant - --with-system-icu & --with-system-db3 no longer in --with-system-libs - sc needs another file in exceptions because of system-boost - drop integrated ooo#43297# * Wed Mar 02 2005 Caolan McNamara 1:1.9.80-1 - move to openoffice.org - gcc4 patch * Tue Mar 01 2005 Caolan McNamara 1:1.9.80-4 - new ms-langpack - bump from libgcj4 to libgcj >= 4.0.0 - so drop fc4uselibgcj_fc4 patch pango-1.8.1-2 ------------- * Fri Mar 04 2005 Owen Taylor - 1.8.1-1 - Update to 1.8.1 pcre-5.0-4 ---------- * Fri Mar 04 2005 Joe Orton 5.0-4 - rebuild psacct-6.3.2-37 --------------- * Fri Mar 04 2005 Ivana Varekova 6.3.2-37 - rebuilt qt-1:3.3.4-9 ------------ * Fri Mar 04 2005 Than Ngo 1:3.3.4-9 - fix buildkey issue with gcc-4 * Fri Mar 04 2005 Than Ngo 1:3.3.4-8 - rebuilt against gcc-4.0.0-0.31 redhat-artwork-0.120-7 ---------------------- * Fri Mar 04 2005 Than Ngo 0.120-7 - rebuild against new gcc-4.0.0-0.31 sip-4.2-1 --------- * Fri Mar 04 2005 Than Ngo 4.2-1 - 4.2 slocate-2.7-16 -------------- * Fri Mar 04 2005 Miloslav Trmac - 2.7-16 - Fix crash when no filesystems are pruned - Rebuild with gcc 4 splint-3.1.1-5 -------------- * Fri Mar 04 2005 Jeff Johnson 3.1.1-5 - rebuild with gcc4. subversion-1.1.3-4 ------------------ * Fri Mar 04 2005 Joe Orton 1.1.3-4 - rebuild system-config-network-1.3.23-1 ------------------------------ * Fri Mar 04 2005 Harald Hoyer - 1.3.23 - update to new gnome/gtk/glade system-config-securitylevel-1.5.1-1 ----------------------------------- * Fri Mar 04 2005 Chris Lumens 1.5.0-2 - Rebuilt for gcc4. - Fixed a msgid typo (#150193), rebuilt .pot file. tftp-0.40-4 ----------- * Fri Mar 04 2005 Radek Vokal 0.40-4 - gcc4 rebuilt vnc-4.1-0.1 ----------- * Thu Mar 03 2005 Tim Waugh 4.0-0.1 - 4.1 (but still 4.0 Java viewer for the moment). - Removed sparc patch. - Fixed VNC module link line (from upstream). webalizer-2.01_10-28 -------------------- * Fri Mar 04 2005 Joe Orton 2.01_10-28 - rebuild xchat-1:2.4.1-4 --------------- * Sat Mar 05 2005 Christopher Aillon 1:2.4.1-4 - Rebuild against GCC 4.0 xen-2-20050302 -------------- * Fri Mar 04 2005 Rik van Riel 2-20050303 - finally got everything to compile with gcc4 -Wall -Werror * Thu Mar 03 2005 Rik van Riel 2-20050303 - upgrade to last night's Xen-unstable snapshot - drop printf warnings patch, which is upstream now yelp-2.9.3-2 ------------ * Sat Mar 05 2005 Christopher Aillon 2.9.3-2 - Rebuild against GCC 4.0 zlib-1.2.2.2-2 -------------- * Fri Mar 04 2005 Jeff Johnson 1.2.2.2-2 - rebuild with gcc4. From paul at all-the-johnsons.co.uk Sat Mar 5 14:37:46 2005 From: paul at all-the-johnsons.co.uk (Paul) Date: Sat, 05 Mar 2005 14:37:46 +0000 Subject: gfortran Message-ID: <1110033466.25485.9.camel@localhost.localdomain> Hi, Just a quick question about gfortran. Which standard is this upto? The last time I used g77 was in 1999 and it was F77 (it was the RISC OS version which lagged somewhat, from memory, it was gcc 2.7.2). I seem to remember some effort being made to bring it up to F95, but lost contact with developments from there. TTFN Paul -- "I like blinking me" - Helen, Big Brother 2 contestant -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part URL: From dnovillo at redhat.com Sat Mar 5 14:46:01 2005 From: dnovillo at redhat.com (Diego Novillo) Date: Sat, 05 Mar 2005 09:46:01 -0500 Subject: gfortran In-Reply-To: <1110033466.25485.9.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <1110033466.25485.9.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <4229C629.8050808@redhat.com> Paul wrote: > Just a quick question about gfortran. Which standard is this upto? > F95. http://gcc.gnu.org/fortran/ Diego. From hichetu at gmail.com Sat Mar 5 15:07:52 2005 From: hichetu at gmail.com (Chetan Raj) Date: Sat, 5 Mar 2005 20:37:52 +0530 Subject: Eclipse On Fedora Message-ID: <27b710b105030507071936cd6d@mail.gmail.com> Hi All, Why aren't we shipping Eclipse by default on Fedora? Eclipse is definetely a good IDE for development. And why does Eclipse 3.1 crash on FC3? -- Chetan From kyrre at solution-forge.net Sat Mar 5 15:08:20 2005 From: kyrre at solution-forge.net (Kyrre Ness Sjobak) Date: Sat, 05 Mar 2005 16:08:20 +0100 Subject: Including OO templates in fc4 Message-ID: <1110035299.6541.24.camel@localhost.localdomain> To many people (lacking artistic skill etc), templates really makes it simpler to create documents (presentations especially). But none of those are included in our distribution of OpenOffice, our main office suite. Maybe it should? I don't know whats included in upstream OO, but at least there are some templates to be found at http://ooextras.sourceforge.net/ I know that we are aleady pushed for space, but including a few kb's of templates to the huge package OO already is, seems nothing but reasonable, especially considering the end-user benefit. Kyrre Ness Sj?b?k From eric at snowmoon.com Sat Mar 5 15:24:34 2005 From: eric at snowmoon.com (Eric Warnke) Date: Sat, 05 Mar 2005 10:24:34 -0500 Subject: Eclipse On Fedora In-Reply-To: <27b710b105030507071936cd6d@mail.gmail.com> References: <27b710b105030507071936cd6d@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <4229CF32.5030000@snowmoon.com> Chetan, Eclipse has not shiped with Fedora up till this point because there has been no FOSS java to run it on. It would have been useless without a copyrighted third party download. Starting in FC4 Eclipse and it's tools will be supported under gcj and it's libraries. Cheers, Eric Chetan Raj wrote: >Hi All, > >Why aren't we shipping Eclipse by default on Fedora? > >Eclipse is definetely a good IDE for development. > >And why does Eclipse 3.1 crash on FC3? > >-- Chetan > > > -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 252 bytes Desc: OpenPGP digital signature URL: From pmuldoon at redhat.com Sat Mar 5 15:30:28 2005 From: pmuldoon at redhat.com (Phil Muldoon) Date: Sat, 05 Mar 2005 09:30:28 -0600 Subject: Eclipse On Fedora In-Reply-To: <27b710b105030507071936cd6d@mail.gmail.com> References: <27b710b105030507071936cd6d@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1110036628.7422.21.camel@localhost.localdomain> On Sat, 2005-03-05 at 20:37 +0530, Chetan Raj wrote: > Hi All, > > Why aren't we shipping Eclipse by default on Fedora? We are shipping a natively build Eclipse for Fedora 4 forward with Python, C/C++, integrated Bugzilla and Changelog support. As well as the normal Java environment. The development and maturity free Java stack has just now allowed us to work on bringing it to you. > Eclipse is definetely a good IDE for development. I agree ;) > And why does Eclipse 3.1 crash on FC3? Hmmm what installation/environment are you using? BTW we wrote up a message on fedora-devel-java-list at redhat.com on how to get native built Eclipse 3.1 working via rawhide if you are interested. As with all software in rawhide, stability caveats are present. Regards Phil Muldoon From jwboyer at jdub.homelinux.org Sat Mar 5 15:49:05 2005 From: jwboyer at jdub.homelinux.org (Josh Boyer) Date: Sat, 05 Mar 2005 09:49:05 -0600 Subject: Including OO templates in fc4 In-Reply-To: <1110035299.6541.24.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <1110035299.6541.24.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <1110037746.1479.29.camel@jdub.homelinux.org> On Sat, 2005-03-05 at 16:08 +0100, Kyrre Ness Sjobak wrote: > To many people (lacking artistic skill etc), templates really makes it > simpler to create documents (presentations especially). But none of > those are included in our distribution of OpenOffice, our main office > suite. Maybe it should? > > I don't know whats included in upstream OO, but at least there are some > templates to be found at http://ooextras.sourceforge.net/ > > I know that we are aleady pushed for space, but including a few kb's of > templates to the huge package OO already is, seems nothing but > reasonable, especially considering the end-user benefit. I think this is a Fedora Extras candidate. Entire packages that are only a few KiBs are being pushed out to Extras, so I don't think we want to add anything that isn't needed to the core OO package. Now you just need to find a maintainer. You could even volunteer to do it yourself on the fedora-extras list. josh From dennis at ausil.us Sat Mar 5 16:20:00 2005 From: dennis at ausil.us (Dennis Gilmore) Date: Sat, 5 Mar 2005 10:20:00 -0600 Subject: Including OO templates in fc4 In-Reply-To: <1110037746.1479.29.camel@jdub.homelinux.org> References: <1110035299.6541.24.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1110037746.1479.29.camel@jdub.homelinux.org> Message-ID: <200503051020.01633.dennis@ausil.us> Once upon a time Saturday 05 March 2005 9:49 am, Josh Boyer wrote: > On Sat, 2005-03-05 at 16:08 +0100, Kyrre Ness Sjobak wrote: > I think this is a Fedora Extras candidate. Entire packages that are > only a few KiBs are being pushed out to Extras, so I don't think we want > to add anything that isn't needed to the core OO package. > > Now you just need to find a maintainer. You could even volunteer to do > it yourself on the fedora-extras list. OOo extas is already in extras it has a bug ive been meaning to report it requires openoffice not openoffice.org so it wont install. -- Dennis Gilmore RHCE http://www.ausil.us From ml-fedora at fathomssen.de Sat Mar 5 16:37:02 2005 From: ml-fedora at fathomssen.de (Frederick Alexander Thomssen) Date: Sat, 5 Mar 2005 17:37:02 +0100 Subject: dbus-qt Message-ID: <200503051737.02475.ml-fedora@fathomssen.de> hi, once dbus-qt was removed from fedora because there was no use for it. but now kde 3.4 supports dbus-qt for the media:/ protocol which indicated if a new device was connected. so there now is a use for dbus-qt so i think it ought to be included. freddy -- Frederick Alexander Thomssen From loony at loonybin.org Sat Mar 5 16:43:51 2005 From: loony at loonybin.org (Peter Arremann) Date: Sat, 5 Mar 2005 11:43:51 -0500 Subject: 64bit clean AMD64? In-Reply-To: <604aa791050304195846ae1232@mail.gmail.com> References: <200503042108.35646.loony@loonybin.org> <200503042250.03811.loony@loonybin.org> <604aa791050304195846ae1232@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <200503051143.51926.loony@loonybin.org> On Friday 04 March 2005 22:58, Jeff Spaleta wrote: > what istall type are you actually doing in the installer? are you > doing a minimal install or server? 'server' as a default install type > is a rather generic concept.. and is not going to meet any single > person's definition completely. To really setup a server for specific > tasks requires customization you aren't going to be able to rely on a > default install type in the installer to give you exactly what you > want. Why isn't kickstart file creation enough flexibility to create > the system the specific system that you want? There is room in the > ecosystem for an array of pre-baked kickstart files if there are > people in the community willing to work on them..collect them.. and > maintain them. > > -jef"mmmmm beer"spaleta Jeff, its a custom install - when you get to the selection of installed packages the following components were selected: Textbased Internet Server Configuration Tools Web Server Mail Server FTP Serever Mysql Database (add php-mysql) Development Tools Administration Tools System Tools (add am-utils) With that, in both FC3 and Rawhide you still get some 32bit rpms. From the installer there is no way to tell what will end up installing 32bit stuff. So I went ahead and tried install a AMD64 box with FC3 and the packages above, I then "rpm -qa --queryformat="%{name}-%{version}-%{release}.%{arch}\n" | grep i386 | xargs rpm -e" After that I had a box without 32bit packages... Then I do a yum update to get the latest updates (that was about 3 weeks ago) and when I get back it showed that boost for some reason wanted to install "some" i386 packages - 142 of them to be exact... I'm sure that was just a packaging error of some form (dependency to -devel package I think) but when trying to figure out if there is a way to prevent this, I found no good answer... Peter. From jspaleta at gmail.com Sat Mar 5 17:16:40 2005 From: jspaleta at gmail.com (Jeff Spaleta) Date: Sat, 5 Mar 2005 12:16:40 -0500 Subject: 64bit clean AMD64? In-Reply-To: <200503051143.51926.loony@loonybin.org> References: <200503042108.35646.loony@loonybin.org> <200503042250.03811.loony@loonybin.org> <604aa791050304195846ae1232@mail.gmail.com> <200503051143.51926.loony@loonybin.org> Message-ID: <604aa791050305091678d58c3e@mail.gmail.com> On Sat, 5 Mar 2005 11:43:51 -0500, Peter Arremann wrote: > I'm sure that was just a packaging error of some form (dependency to -devel > package I think) but when trying to figure out if there is a way to prevent > this, I found no good answer... preventing packaging problems... no there is no good answer... packagers make mistakes. If you feel that one specific case with boost was a packaging problem it needs to be filed as a bug. -jef From johnp at redhat.com Sat Mar 5 17:21:04 2005 From: johnp at redhat.com (John (J5) Palmieri) Date: Sat, 05 Mar 2005 12:21:04 -0500 Subject: dbus-qt In-Reply-To: <200503051737.02475.ml-fedora@fathomssen.de> References: <200503051737.02475.ml-fedora@fathomssen.de> Message-ID: <1110043263.2451.35.camel@localhost.localdomain> On Sat, 2005-03-05 at 11:37, Frederick Alexander Thomssen wrote: > hi, > > once dbus-qt was removed from fedora because there was no use for it. but now > kde 3.4 supports dbus-qt for the media:/ protocol which indicated if a new > device was connected. so there now is a use for dbus-qt so i think it ought > to be included. Does an app in fedora core require it? When you say the media:/ protocol indicates if a new device is connected, does it listen to dbus signals or does it propagate them itself? For device connection there is already a freedesktop standard for propagating device additions and removals called HAL. Also does kde 3.4 compile against the qt-dbus bindings in CVS? So far the qt bindings in CVS have not been passing a dist check on my fedora box. This may be a candidate for extras if I can figure out how to split packages between extras and core when they come from the same spec. I also have no objection into getting into core provided there is a real need. I am hesitant to put it in if the API is still in flux since the apps that use it and the version of dbus we ship may get out of sync. -- J5 From roli at israel-jugendtag.ch Sat Mar 5 17:27:24 2005 From: roli at israel-jugendtag.ch (=?ISO-8859-15?Q?Roland_K=E4ser?=) Date: Sat, 05 Mar 2005 18:27:24 +0100 Subject: MySQL Version Message-ID: <4229EBFC.2070907@israel-jugendtag.ch> Hi all Sorry for this eventually dumb question: Why does fedora not contain mysql 4 or grater? Kind regards Roland Kaeser From ml-fedora at fathomssen.de Sat Mar 5 17:30:00 2005 From: ml-fedora at fathomssen.de (Frederick Alexander Thomssen) Date: Sat, 5 Mar 2005 18:30:00 +0100 Subject: MySQL Version In-Reply-To: <4229EBFC.2070907@israel-jugendtag.ch> References: <4229EBFC.2070907@israel-jugendtag.ch> Message-ID: <200503051830.00903.ml-fedora@fathomssen.de> On Saturday 05 March 2005 18:27, Roland K?ser wrote: > Hi all > > Sorry for this eventually dumb question: Why does fedora not contain > mysql 4 or grater? > > Kind regards > > Roland Kaeser it does - fedora core devel [fathomssen at fathomssen fathomssen]$ rpm -q mysql mysql-4.1.9-1 freddy -- Frederick Alexander Thomssen From roli at israel-jugendtag.ch Sat Mar 5 17:36:25 2005 From: roli at israel-jugendtag.ch (=?ISO-8859-15?Q?Roland_K=E4ser?=) Date: Sat, 05 Mar 2005 18:36:25 +0100 Subject: MySQL Version In-Reply-To: <200503051830.00903.ml-fedora@fathomssen.de> References: <4229EBFC.2070907@israel-jugendtag.ch> <200503051830.00903.ml-fedora@fathomssen.de> Message-ID: <4229EE19.20000@israel-jugendtag.ch> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From eric at snowmoon.com Sat Mar 5 17:40:48 2005 From: eric at snowmoon.com (Eric Warnke) Date: Sat, 05 Mar 2005 12:40:48 -0500 Subject: MySQL Version In-Reply-To: <4229EE19.20000@israel-jugendtag.ch> References: <4229EBFC.2070907@israel-jugendtag.ch> <200503051830.00903.ml-fedora@fathomssen.de> <4229EE19.20000@israel-jugendtag.ch> Message-ID: <4229EF20.60208@snowmoon.com> yum --enablerepo=development list MySQL\* Cheers, Eric Roland K?ser wrote: > Hello > > Sorry, which fedora version? I'm using 1,2 and 3 but I cannot find it. > Am I a little bit behind the trend? > > Roland > > Frederick Alexander Thomssen schrieb: > >>On Saturday 05 March 2005 18:27, Roland K?ser wrote: >> >> >>>Hi all >>> >>>Sorry for this eventually dumb question: Why does fedora not contain >>>mysql 4 or grater? >>> >>>Kind regards >>> >>>Roland Kaeser >>> >>> >> >>it does - fedora core devel >> >>[fathomssen at fathomssen fathomssen]$ rpm -q mysql >>mysql-4.1.9-1 >> >>freddy >> >> >> > -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 252 bytes Desc: OpenPGP digital signature URL: From jspaleta at gmail.com Sat Mar 5 17:41:09 2005 From: jspaleta at gmail.com (Jeff Spaleta) Date: Sat, 5 Mar 2005 12:41:09 -0500 Subject: dbus-qt In-Reply-To: <1110043263.2451.35.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <200503051737.02475.ml-fedora@fathomssen.de> <1110043263.2451.35.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <604aa79105030509411e8211cc@mail.gmail.com> On Sat, 05 Mar 2005 12:21:04 -0500, John (J5) Palmieri wrote: > This may be a candidate for extras if I > can figure out how to split packages between extras and core when they > come from the same spec. Uhm... from the same spec... so far all discussion that I've seen extras/core items need to have seperate srpms. bugzilla does components by srpm with extras and core get seperate listings in bugzilla. -jef From skvidal at phy.duke.edu Sat Mar 5 17:42:59 2005 From: skvidal at phy.duke.edu (seth vidal) Date: Sat, 05 Mar 2005 12:42:59 -0500 Subject: MySQL Version In-Reply-To: <4229EF20.60208@snowmoon.com> References: <4229EBFC.2070907@israel-jugendtag.ch> <200503051830.00903.ml-fedora@fathomssen.de> <4229EE19.20000@israel-jugendtag.ch> <4229EF20.60208@snowmoon.com> Message-ID: <1110044579.18949.0.camel@opus.phy.duke.edu> On Sat, 2005-03-05 at 12:40 -0500, Eric Warnke wrote: > yum --enablerepo=development list MySQL\* > I don't know how many ways I can say this: telling a person who is clearly a user to install things out of devel/rawhide is like handing a 6yr old a loaded pistol. don't do this. it's a BAD idea. -sv From david at fubar.dk Sat Mar 5 17:51:04 2005 From: david at fubar.dk (David Zeuthen) Date: Sat, 05 Mar 2005 12:51:04 -0500 Subject: dbus-qt In-Reply-To: <1110043263.2451.35.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <200503051737.02475.ml-fedora@fathomssen.de> <1110043263.2451.35.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <1110045064.3441.5.camel@daxter.boston.redhat.com> On Sat, 2005-03-05 at 12:21 -0500, John (J5) Palmieri wrote: >On Sat, 2005-03-05 at 11:37, Frederick Alexander Thomssen wrote: >> hi, >> >> once dbus-qt was removed from fedora because there was no use for it. but now >> kde 3.4 supports dbus-qt for the media:/ protocol which indicated if a new >> device was connected. so there now is a use for dbus-qt so i think it ought >> to be included. > >Does an app in fedora core require it? When you say the media:/ >protocol indicates if a new device is connected, does it listen to dbus >signals or does it propagate them itself? For device connection there >is already a freedesktop standard for propagating device additions and >removals called HAL. Also does kde 3.4 compile against the qt-dbus >bindings in CVS? So far the qt bindings in CVS have not been passing a >dist check on my fedora box. This may be a candidate for extras if I >can figure out how to split packages between extras and core when they >come from the same spec. I also have no objection into getting into >core provided there is a real need. I am hesitant to put it in if the >API is still in flux since the apps that use it and the version of dbus >we ship may get out of sync. It appears to use hal 0.4.x and dbus 0.23.x cf. http://www.archivum.info/kde-core-devel at kde.org/2004-12/msg00290.html If the Qt bindings for D-BUS 0.30 is/gets in a usable state, we should look at writing a patch so it can speak to hal 0.5.x - it shouldn't be much work at all; updating the Qt D-bindings to the new D-BUS is the big thing that needs to work. David From kyrre at solution-forge.net Sat Mar 5 17:50:51 2005 From: kyrre at solution-forge.net (Kyrre Ness Sjobak) Date: Sat, 05 Mar 2005 18:50:51 +0100 Subject: Including OO templates in fc4 In-Reply-To: <1110037746.1479.29.camel@jdub.homelinux.org> References: <1110035299.6541.24.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1110037746.1479.29.camel@jdub.homelinux.org> Message-ID: <1110045050.6541.27.camel@localhost.localdomain> l?r, 05.03.2005 kl. 16.49 skrev Josh Boyer: > On Sat, 2005-03-05 at 16:08 +0100, Kyrre Ness Sjobak wrote: > > To many people (lacking artistic skill etc), templates really makes it > > simpler to create documents (presentations especially). But none of > > those are included in our distribution of OpenOffice, our main office > > suite. Maybe it should? > > > > I don't know whats included in upstream OO, but at least there are some > > templates to be found at http://ooextras.sourceforge.net/ > > > > I know that we are aleady pushed for space, but including a few kb's of > > templates to the huge package OO already is, seems nothing but > > reasonable, especially considering the end-user benefit. > > I think this is a Fedora Extras candidate. Entire packages that are > only a few KiBs are being pushed out to Extras, so I don't think we want > to add anything that isn't needed to the core OO package. > > Now you just need to find a maintainer. You could even volunteer to do > it yourself on the fedora-extras list. > > josh I probably could, but i simply just don't think this is an extras candidate. Users simply expect templates to be there, or at least a box "you need to install xxx from yyy to get templates". From eric at snowmoon.com Sat Mar 5 17:51:36 2005 From: eric at snowmoon.com (Eric Warnke) Date: Sat, 05 Mar 2005 12:51:36 -0500 Subject: MySQL Version In-Reply-To: <1110044579.18949.0.camel@opus.phy.duke.edu> References: <4229EBFC.2070907@israel-jugendtag.ch> <200503051830.00903.ml-fedora@fathomssen.de> <4229EE19.20000@israel-jugendtag.ch> <4229EF20.60208@snowmoon.com> <1110044579.18949.0.camel@opus.phy.duke.edu> Message-ID: <4229F1A8.5080609@snowmoon.com> seth vidal wrote: >On Sat, 2005-03-05 at 12:40 -0500, Eric Warnke wrote: > > >>yum --enablerepo=development list MySQL\* >> >> >> > >I don't know how many ways I can say this: > >telling a person who is clearly a user to install things out of >devel/rawhide is like handing a 6yr old a loaded pistol. > > > That's why I used the list command and not an install command. Should we treat users on the development list like idiots? If you don't want users looking into development, then you should take the repo out of release versions of Fedora Core. Cheers, Eric -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 252 bytes Desc: OpenPGP digital signature URL: From ivazquez at ivazquez.net Sat Mar 5 17:53:34 2005 From: ivazquez at ivazquez.net (Ignacio Vazquez-Abrams) Date: Sat, 05 Mar 2005 12:53:34 -0500 Subject: MySQL Version In-Reply-To: <4229EE19.20000@israel-jugendtag.ch> References: <4229EBFC.2070907@israel-jugendtag.ch> <200503051830.00903.ml-fedora@fathomssen.de> <4229EE19.20000@israel-jugendtag.ch> Message-ID: <1110045214.7231.31.camel@ignacio.ignacio.lan> On Sat, 2005-03-05 at 18:36 +0100, Roland K?ser wrote: > Hello > > Sorry, which fedora version? I'm using 1,2 and 3 but I cannot find it. > Am I a little bit behind the trend? > > Roland http://fedora.ivazquez.net/yum/3/i386/RPMS.alternatives/ Don't forget to grab mysqlclient10. -- Ignacio Vazquez-Abrams http://fedora.ivazquez.net/ -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part URL: From skvidal at phy.duke.edu Sat Mar 5 17:55:58 2005 From: skvidal at phy.duke.edu (seth vidal) Date: Sat, 05 Mar 2005 12:55:58 -0500 Subject: MySQL Version In-Reply-To: <4229F1A8.5080609@snowmoon.com> References: <4229EBFC.2070907@israel-jugendtag.ch> <200503051830.00903.ml-fedora@fathomssen.de> <4229EE19.20000@israel-jugendtag.ch> <4229EF20.60208@snowmoon.com> <1110044579.18949.0.camel@opus.phy.duke.edu> <4229F1A8.5080609@snowmoon.com> Message-ID: <1110045358.18949.2.camel@opus.phy.duke.edu> > > > That's why I used the list command and not an install command. Should > we treat users on the development list like idiots? If you don't want > users looking into development, then you should take the repo out of > release versions of Fedora Core. No, I think we should judge by the fact that this user didn't know what the devel repository was that he isn't ready for the baby-eating pain that is rawhide. -sv From ml-fedora at fathomssen.de Sat Mar 5 17:56:30 2005 From: ml-fedora at fathomssen.de (Frederick Alexander Thomssen) Date: Sat, 5 Mar 2005 18:56:30 +0100 Subject: dbus-qt In-Reply-To: <1110045064.3441.5.camel@daxter.boston.redhat.com> References: <200503051737.02475.ml-fedora@fathomssen.de> <1110043263.2451.35.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1110045064.3441.5.camel@daxter.boston.redhat.com> Message-ID: <200503051856.30420.ml-fedora@fathomssen.de> On Saturday 05 March 2005 18:51, David Zeuthen wrote: > On Sat, 2005-03-05 at 12:21 -0500, John (J5) Palmieri wrote: > >On Sat, 2005-03-05 at 11:37, Frederick Alexander Thomssen wrote: > >> hi, > >> > >> once dbus-qt was removed from fedora because there was no use for it. > >> but now kde 3.4 supports dbus-qt for the media:/ protocol which > >> indicated if a new device was connected. so there now is a use for > >> dbus-qt so i think it ought to be included. > > > >Does an app in fedora core require it? When you say the media:/ > >protocol indicates if a new device is connected, does it listen to dbus > >signals or does it propagate them itself? For device connection there > >is already a freedesktop standard for propagating device additions and > >removals called HAL. Also does kde 3.4 compile against the qt-dbus > >bindings in CVS? So far the qt bindings in CVS have not been passing a > >dist check on my fedora box. This may be a candidate for extras if I > >can figure out how to split packages between extras and core when they > >come from the same spec. I also have no objection into getting into > >core provided there is a real need. I am hesitant to put it in if the > >API is still in flux since the apps that use it and the version of dbus > >we ship may get out of sync. > > It appears to use hal 0.4.x and dbus 0.23.x cf. > > http://www.archivum.info/kde-core-devel at kde.org/2004-12/msg00290.html > > If the Qt bindings for D-BUS 0.30 is/gets in a usable state, we should > look at writing a patch so it can speak to hal 0.5.x - it shouldn't be > much work at all; updating the Qt D-bindings to the new D-BUS is the big > thing that needs to work. > > David well, just saw it in kdebase/config.log configure:50348: checking for DBus configure: 50362: /opt/kde/include/dbus/dbus.h configure: 50362: /usr/include/dbus/dbus.h configure: 50362: /usr/local/include/dbus/dbus.h configure: 50362: /usr/include/dbus-1.0/dbus/dbus.h taking that configure: 50379: /opt/kde/include/dbus/dbus-arch-deps.h configure: 50379: /usr/lib/dbus-1.0/include/dbus/dbus-arch-deps.h taking that configure: 50401: /opt/kde/lib/libdbus-1.so configure: 50401: /usr/lib/libdbus-1.so taking that configure:50417: result: headers /usr/include/dbus-1.0 /usr/lib/dbus-1.0/include libraries /usr/lib configure:50430: checking for DBus-Qt bindings configure: 50444: /opt/kde/include/dbus/connection.h configure: 50444: /usr/include/dbus/connection.h configure: 50444: /usr/local/include/dbus/connection.h configure: 50444: /usr/include/dbus-1.0/dbus/connection.h configure: 50444: /usr/local/include/dbus-1.0/dbus/connection.h configure: 50471: /opt/kde/lib/libdbus-qt-1.so configure: 50471: /usr/lib/libdbus-qt-1.so configure: 50471: /usr/local/lib/libdbus-qt-1.so configure:50491: result: searched but not found configure:50501: checking if the HAL backend for media:/ sould be compiled configure:50516: result: no freddy -- Frederick Alexander Thomssen From thacker at math.cornell.edu Sat Mar 5 17:58:44 2005 From: thacker at math.cornell.edu (John Thacker) Date: Sat, 5 Mar 2005 12:58:44 -0500 Subject: rawhide report: 20050305 changes In-Reply-To: <200503051241.j25Cf6AX008650@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> References: <200503051241.j25Cf6AX008650@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> Message-ID: <20050305175844.GA6810@thacker.dyndns.org> On Sat, Mar 05, 2005 at 07:41:06AM -0500, Build System wrote: > fontconfig-2.2.3-12 > ------------------- > * Fri Mar 04 2005 David Zeuthen - 2.2.3-12 > - Rebuild > > * Fri Mar 04 2005 David Zeuthen - 2.2.3-11 > - Rebuild > > * Fri Mar 04 2005 David Zeuthen - 2.2.3-10 > - Rebuild *grumble* Should be building the newly released fontconfig 2.3.0 in order to fix bugs 107952, 138783, etc. I'm sure it'll get in eventually, but it's something I *really* want for FC4. John Thacker -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: not available URL: From johnp at redhat.com Sat Mar 5 17:59:59 2005 From: johnp at redhat.com (John (J5) Palmieri) Date: Sat, 05 Mar 2005 12:59:59 -0500 Subject: dbus-qt In-Reply-To: <1110045064.3441.5.camel@daxter.boston.redhat.com> References: <200503051737.02475.ml-fedora@fathomssen.de> <1110043263.2451.35.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1110045064.3441.5.camel@daxter.boston.redhat.com> Message-ID: <1110045599.2451.52.camel@localhost.localdomain> On Sat, 2005-03-05 at 12:51, David Zeuthen wrote: > On Sat, 2005-03-05 at 12:21 -0500, John (J5) Palmieri wrote: > >On Sat, 2005-03-05 at 11:37, Frederick Alexander Thomssen wrote: > >> hi, > >> > >> once dbus-qt was removed from fedora because there was no use for it. but now > >> kde 3.4 supports dbus-qt for the media:/ protocol which indicated if a new > >> device was connected. so there now is a use for dbus-qt so i think it ought > >> to be included. > > > >Does an app in fedora core require it? When you say the media:/ > >protocol indicates if a new device is connected, does it listen to dbus > >signals or does it propagate them itself? For device connection there > >is already a freedesktop standard for propagating device additions and > >removals called HAL. Also does kde 3.4 compile against the qt-dbus > >bindings in CVS? So far the qt bindings in CVS have not been passing a > >dist check on my fedora box. This may be a candidate for extras if I > >can figure out how to split packages between extras and core when they > >come from the same spec. I also have no objection into getting into > >core provided there is a real need. I am hesitant to put it in if the > >API is still in flux since the apps that use it and the version of dbus > >we ship may get out of sync. > > It appears to use hal 0.4.x and dbus 0.23.x cf. > > http://www.archivum.info/kde-core-devel at kde.org/2004-12/msg00290.html > > If the Qt bindings for D-BUS 0.30 is/gets in a usable state, we should > look at writing a patch so it can speak to hal 0.5.x - it shouldn't be > much work at all; updating the Qt D-bindings to the new D-BUS is the big > thing that needs to work. > > David In which case someone needs to do the work of getting the Qt-dbus bindings up to par and KDE ported before I will consider enabling it. I don't know if I will feel comfortable enabling it until D-BUS goes 1.0 (which should be soon). Note that by Monday D-BUS 0.3.0 will be in rawhide. -- J5 From fedora at wir-sind-cool.org Sat Mar 5 18:03:25 2005 From: fedora at wir-sind-cool.org (Michael Schwendt) Date: Sat, 5 Mar 2005 19:03:25 +0100 Subject: Including OO templates in fc4 In-Reply-To: <200503051020.01633.dennis@ausil.us> References: <1110035299.6541.24.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1110037746.1479.29.camel@jdub.homelinux.org> <200503051020.01633.dennis@ausil.us> Message-ID: <20050305190325.58e1cd64.fedora@wir-sind-cool.org> On Sat, 5 Mar 2005 10:20:00 -0600, Dennis Gilmore wrote: > Once upon a time Saturday 05 March 2005 9:49 am, Josh Boyer wrote: > > On Sat, 2005-03-05 at 16:08 +0100, Kyrre Ness Sjobak wrote: > > > I think this is a Fedora Extras candidate. Entire packages that are > > only a few KiBs are being pushed out to Extras, so I don't think we want > > to add anything that isn't needed to the core OO package. > > > > Now you just need to find a maintainer. You could even volunteer to do > > it yourself on the fedora-extras list. > OOo extas is already in extras it has a bug ive been meaning to report it > requires openoffice not openoffice.org so it wont install. It was removed since it didn't contain anything not included in the Fedora Core OOo packages. From david at fubar.dk Sat Mar 5 18:08:39 2005 From: david at fubar.dk (David Zeuthen) Date: Sat, 05 Mar 2005 13:08:39 -0500 Subject: dbus-qt In-Reply-To: <1110045599.2451.52.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <200503051737.02475.ml-fedora@fathomssen.de> <1110043263.2451.35.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1110045064.3441.5.camel@daxter.boston.redhat.com> <1110045599.2451.52.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <1110046119.3441.14.camel@daxter.boston.redhat.com> On Sat, 2005-03-05 at 12:59 -0500, John (J5) Palmieri wrote: >In which case someone needs to do the work of getting the Qt-dbus >bindings up to par and KDE ported before I will consider enabling it. Certainly. > I don't know if I will feel comfortable enabling it until D-BUS goes 1.0 >(which should be soon). If it's actively maintained and it works, it shouldn't be different from other bindings we ship though. > Note that by Monday D-BUS 0.3.0 will be in >rawhide. No, that would be 0.30cvssomething cause the python bindings since 0.30 needed some work - someone really ought to do a real D-BUS release before then so we don't have to ship a CVS snapshot. David From johnp at redhat.com Sat Mar 5 18:16:09 2005 From: johnp at redhat.com (John (J5) Palmieri) Date: Sat, 05 Mar 2005 13:16:09 -0500 Subject: dbus-qt In-Reply-To: <1110046119.3441.14.camel@daxter.boston.redhat.com> References: <200503051737.02475.ml-fedora@fathomssen.de> <1110043263.2451.35.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1110045064.3441.5.camel@daxter.boston.redhat.com> <1110045599.2451.52.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1110046119.3441.14.camel@daxter.boston.redhat.com> Message-ID: <1110046568.2451.57.camel@localhost.localdomain> On Sat, 2005-03-05 at 13:08, David Zeuthen wrote: > On Sat, 2005-03-05 at 12:59 -0500, John (J5) Palmieri wrote: > >In which case someone needs to do the work of getting the Qt-dbus > >bindings up to par and KDE ported before I will consider enabling it. > > Certainly. > > > I don't know if I will feel comfortable enabling it until D-BUS goes 1.0 > >(which should be soon). > > If it's actively maintained and it works, it shouldn't be different from > other bindings we ship though. > > > Note that by Monday D-BUS 0.3.0 will be in > >rawhide. > > No, that would be 0.30cvssomething cause the python bindings since 0.30 > needed some work - someone really ought to do a real D-BUS release > before then so we don't have to ship a CVS snapshot. > Ya, ya ;-) I'm going to try to do a release today but like I said the qt bindings aren't passing dist check so I'll ask on the dbus list about them and see what their status is. Was hoping Joe was going to do this but he probably ran into the same problems I did and didn't have time to resolve them. -- J5 From carlos.efr at mail.telepac.pt Sat Mar 5 18:37:02 2005 From: carlos.efr at mail.telepac.pt (Carlos Rodrigues) Date: Sat, 05 Mar 2005 18:37:02 +0000 Subject: Why is FC3 stuck with Thunderbird 0.9? Message-ID: <4229FC4E.40105@mail.telepac.pt> I know that this probably was already asked a million times, I don't remember ever reading an answer? Firefox already got several updates, for 1.0, 1.0.1 and now another 1.0.1, but Thunderbird never got any. I've been using Thunderbird from development and it works just fine (much better than FC3's firefox, which has a bunck of broken stuff in comparison with the mozilla.org release), so I see no reason not to do an update. Another example is Mozilla, which has had some security issues fixed in recent versions but FC3 never got past 1.7.3. So, summing it up... is there any strong reason for not updating Thunderbird on FC3? -- Carlos Rodrigues url: http://tudo-sobre-nada.blogspot.com From johnp at redhat.com Sat Mar 5 18:40:53 2005 From: johnp at redhat.com (John (J5) Palmieri) Date: Sat, 05 Mar 2005 13:40:53 -0500 Subject: Why is FC3 stuck with Thunderbird 0.9? In-Reply-To: <4229FC4E.40105@mail.telepac.pt> References: <4229FC4E.40105@mail.telepac.pt> Message-ID: <1110048053.2451.61.camel@localhost.localdomain> On Sat, 2005-03-05 at 13:37, Carlos Rodrigues wrote: > I know that this probably was already asked a million times, I don't > remember ever reading an answer? > > Firefox already got several updates, for 1.0, 1.0.1 and now another > 1.0.1, but Thunderbird never got any. > > I've been using Thunderbird from development and it works just fine > (much better than FC3's firefox, which has a bunck of broken stuff in > comparison with the mozilla.org release), so I see no reason not to do > an update. > > Another example is Mozilla, which has had some security issues fixed in > recent versions but FC3 never got past 1.7.3. > > So, summing it up... is there any strong reason for not updating > Thunderbird on FC3? > > -- > Carlos Rodrigues > > url: http://tudo-sobre-nada.blogspot.com Because FC3 is released? Newer versions will show up in FC4 which is not too far away. Security errata is backported to FC3. -- J5 From jspaleta at gmail.com Sat Mar 5 18:55:39 2005 From: jspaleta at gmail.com (Jeff Spaleta) Date: Sat, 5 Mar 2005 13:55:39 -0500 Subject: MySQL Version In-Reply-To: <4229F1A8.5080609@snowmoon.com> References: <4229EBFC.2070907@israel-jugendtag.ch> <200503051830.00903.ml-fedora@fathomssen.de> <4229EE19.20000@israel-jugendtag.ch> <4229EF20.60208@snowmoon.com> <1110044579.18949.0.camel@opus.phy.duke.edu> <4229F1A8.5080609@snowmoon.com> Message-ID: <604aa79105030510555b3c75cd@mail.gmail.com> On Sat, 05 Mar 2005 12:51:36 -0500, Eric Warnke wrote: > That's why I used the list command and not an install command. Should > we treat users on the development list like idiots? If you don't want > users looking into development, then you should take the repo out of > release versions of Fedora Core. Its not about treating them like idiots. In this case... and in many cases.. users are ignorant of what the development tree actually is in relation to the release trees. Just pointing them to the rawhide tree.. and acknowledging that it exists does not help inform them of what to expect and does not prepare them for the basic facts of life associated with mitigating rawhide related breakage. Whether or not a user decided to use rawhide packages is up to them.. but its very important they make an informed decision about the matter. If you are going to point someone to the development tree.. its vital you take the time to try to explain to them what the rawhide tree is and what to expect from it. On good days rawhide eats babies on bad days rawhide will lay waste to whole civilizations. Rawhide can only be used effectively it is appropriately feared and respected. Anyone who pulls from rawhide erronously thinking its similar to updates-released or even updates-testing for a core release.. is ill-informed and should not using rawhide. Its up to us, the experienced testers to make sure new users/testers come the the bloody rawhide feast with the appropriate state of mind. -jef From hp at redhat.com Sat Mar 5 19:02:35 2005 From: hp at redhat.com (Havoc Pennington) Date: Sat, 05 Mar 2005 14:02:35 -0500 Subject: Why is FC3 stuck with Thunderbird 0.9? In-Reply-To: <1110048053.2451.61.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <4229FC4E.40105@mail.telepac.pt> <1110048053.2451.61.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <1110049355.1895.13.camel@localhost.localdomain> On Sat, 2005-03-05 at 13:40 -0500, John (J5) Palmieri wrote: > > Because FC3 is released? Newer versions will show up in FC4 which is > not too far away. Security errata is backported to FC3. That's not really true, we can do a version update in FC3 if we want (in fact I'm pretty sure Chris would do that rather than spend time backporting) I think the answer is more "nobody has gotten around to it" Havoc From ad+lists at uni-x.org Sat Mar 5 19:05:34 2005 From: ad+lists at uni-x.org (Alexander Dalloz) Date: Sat, 05 Mar 2005 20:05:34 +0100 Subject: MySQL Version In-Reply-To: <4229EBFC.2070907@israel-jugendtag.ch> References: <4229EBFC.2070907@israel-jugendtag.ch> Message-ID: <1110049534.30132.10.camel@serendipity.dogma.lan> Am Sa, den 05.03.2005 schrieb Roland K?ser um 18:27: > Sorry for this eventually dumb question: Why does fedora not contain > mysql 4 or grater? > Roland Kaeser Besides the technical side you already got answers about (keyword rawhide packages) the background why Fedora up to now does not ship MySQL 4.x is simply the fact that the MySQL FOSS exception was published and accepted by Red Hat when FC3 was nearly finished for releasing. So it came too late to integrate it into FC3. The current development tree (aka rawhide) contains the newer version and next FC release 4 will contain it (just like recently released RHEL4). Please search the list archive for more background information and several long and heated discussions about the MySQL issue. Alexander -- Alexander Dalloz | Enger, Germany | GPG http://pgp.mit.edu 0xB366A773 legal statement: http://www.uni-x.org/legal.html Fedora Core 2 GNU/Linux on Athlon with kernel 2.6.10-1.14_FC2smp Serendipity 20:00:24 up 12 days, 7:09, load average: 0.31, 0.62, 0.57 -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: Dies ist ein digital signierter Nachrichtenteil URL: From eric at snowmoon.com Sat Mar 5 19:06:37 2005 From: eric at snowmoon.com (Eric Warnke) Date: Sat, 05 Mar 2005 14:06:37 -0500 Subject: MySQL Version In-Reply-To: <604aa79105030510555b3c75cd@mail.gmail.com> References: <4229EBFC.2070907@israel-jugendtag.ch> <200503051830.00903.ml-fedora@fathomssen.de> <4229EE19.20000@israel-jugendtag.ch> <4229EF20.60208@snowmoon.com> <1110044579.18949.0.camel@opus.phy.duke.edu> <4229F1A8.5080609@snowmoon.com> <604aa79105030510555b3c75cd@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <422A033D.7010200@snowmoon.com> Jeff Spaleta wrote: >On Sat, 05 Mar 2005 12:51:36 -0500, Eric Warnke wrote: > > >>That's why I used the list command and not an install command. Should >>we treat users on the development list like idiots? If you don't want >>users looking into development, then you should take the repo out of >>release versions of Fedora Core. >> >> > >Its not about treating them like idiots. In this case... and in many >cases.. users are ignorant of what the development tree actually is in >relation to the release trees. Just pointing them to the rawhide >tree.. and acknowledging that it exists does not help inform them of >what to expect and does not prepare them for the basic facts of life >associated with mitigating rawhide related breakage. > > Then why include Rawhide repos in release Fedora? It's a simple question. Why not ship it included, but commented out so that a user has to take some action other than using yum to enable it? Cheers, Eric -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 252 bytes Desc: OpenPGP digital signature URL: From skvidal at phy.duke.edu Sat Mar 5 19:09:05 2005 From: skvidal at phy.duke.edu (seth vidal) Date: Sat, 05 Mar 2005 14:09:05 -0500 Subject: MySQL Version In-Reply-To: <422A033D.7010200@snowmoon.com> References: <4229EBFC.2070907@israel-jugendtag.ch> <200503051830.00903.ml-fedora@fathomssen.de> <4229EE19.20000@israel-jugendtag.ch> <4229EF20.60208@snowmoon.com> <1110044579.18949.0.camel@opus.phy.duke.edu> <4229F1A8.5080609@snowmoon.com> <604aa79105030510555b3c75cd@mail.gmail.com> <422A033D.7010200@snowmoon.com> Message-ID: <1110049745.18949.4.camel@opus.phy.duke.edu> > Then why include Rawhide repos in release Fedora? It's a simple > question. Why not ship it included, but commented out so that a user > has to take some action other than using yum to enable it? > it's disabled by default so they have to add a --enablerepo in order to use it. it is an extra command you have to: 1. know exists 2. know how to use -sv From eric at snowmoon.com Sat Mar 5 19:12:00 2005 From: eric at snowmoon.com (Eric Warnke) Date: Sat, 05 Mar 2005 14:12:00 -0500 Subject: MySQL Version In-Reply-To: <1110049745.18949.4.camel@opus.phy.duke.edu> References: <4229EBFC.2070907@israel-jugendtag.ch> <200503051830.00903.ml-fedora@fathomssen.de> <4229EE19.20000@israel-jugendtag.ch> <4229EF20.60208@snowmoon.com> <1110044579.18949.0.camel@opus.phy.duke.edu> <4229F1A8.5080609@snowmoon.com> <604aa79105030510555b3c75cd@mail.gmail.com> <422A033D.7010200@snowmoon.com> <1110049745.18949.4.camel@opus.phy.duke.edu> Message-ID: <422A0480.4090506@snowmoon.com> seth vidal wrote: >it's disabled by default so they have to add a --enablerepo in order to >use it. > > Seth, I would say that is different because --enablerepo is something most user learn to use because of 3rd part repos and FedoraFAQ. It's one of the first things users who want to add additional non-FOSS software learns. Cheers, Eric -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 252 bytes Desc: OpenPGP digital signature URL: From skvidal at phy.duke.edu Sat Mar 5 19:13:50 2005 From: skvidal at phy.duke.edu (seth vidal) Date: Sat, 05 Mar 2005 14:13:50 -0500 Subject: MySQL Version In-Reply-To: <422A0480.4090506@snowmoon.com> References: <4229EBFC.2070907@israel-jugendtag.ch> <200503051830.00903.ml-fedora@fathomssen.de> <4229EE19.20000@israel-jugendtag.ch> <4229EF20.60208@snowmoon.com> <1110044579.18949.0.camel@opus.phy.duke.edu> <4229F1A8.5080609@snowmoon.com> <604aa79105030510555b3c75cd@mail.gmail.com> <422A033D.7010200@snowmoon.com> <1110049745.18949.4.camel@opus.phy.duke.edu> <422A0480.4090506@snowmoon.com> Message-ID: <1110050030.18949.6.camel@opus.phy.duke.edu> > >it's disabled by default so they have to add a --enablerepo in order to > >use it. > > > > > Seth, > > I would say that is different because --enablerepo is something most > user learn to use because of 3rd part repos and FedoraFAQ. It's one of > the first things users who want to add additional non-FOSS software learns. > one of the first things users learn to use is an editor. and they could use that to disable commenting out! I think enabled=0 is enough protection. -sv From jspaleta at gmail.com Sat Mar 5 19:26:01 2005 From: jspaleta at gmail.com (Jeff Spaleta) Date: Sat, 5 Mar 2005 14:26:01 -0500 Subject: MySQL Version In-Reply-To: <422A0480.4090506@snowmoon.com> References: <4229EBFC.2070907@israel-jugendtag.ch> <200503051830.00903.ml-fedora@fathomssen.de> <4229EE19.20000@israel-jugendtag.ch> <4229EF20.60208@snowmoon.com> <1110044579.18949.0.camel@opus.phy.duke.edu> <4229F1A8.5080609@snowmoon.com> <604aa79105030510555b3c75cd@mail.gmail.com> <422A033D.7010200@snowmoon.com> <1110049745.18949.4.camel@opus.phy.duke.edu> <422A0480.4090506@snowmoon.com> Message-ID: <604aa791050305112650cadffb@mail.gmail.com> On Sat, 05 Mar 2005 14:12:00 -0500, Eric Warnke wrote: > I would say that is different because --enablerepo is something most > user learn to use because of 3rd part repos and FedoraFAQ. It's one of > the first things users who want to add additional non-FOSS software learns. There is no way right now in yum to discover the named of repositories to enable. A user is never exposed to the name for rawhide while interacting with the system at all. The only way someone knows to is if they have been told about it.. or they have gone into the .repo files and read the labels. I really dont see how this is different than a commented out section people will uncomment out things to enable them.. even fedorafaq used this approach before enablerepo was available as a switch. Its a very simple guideline... if you tell someone about rawhide... take the time to give them your personal understanding of what its suppose to be used for. Do not give them a chance to assume its tested update or just another 3rd party repo. Its simply about being responsible and making sure you do your boy scout best to inform people. For people who find the label for rawhide by looking at the .repo file... its probably a good idea to add a few sentences of text that try to give an brief explanation about what rawhide actually is. I'll file an RFE about that today. -jef From caillon at redhat.com Sat Mar 5 19:53:01 2005 From: caillon at redhat.com (Christopher Aillon) Date: Sat, 05 Mar 2005 14:53:01 -0500 Subject: Why is FC3 stuck with Thunderbird 0.9? In-Reply-To: <4229FC4E.40105@mail.telepac.pt> References: <4229FC4E.40105@mail.telepac.pt> Message-ID: <422A0E1D.2010209@redhat.com> Carlos Rodrigues wrote: > I know that this probably was already asked a million times, I don't > remember ever reading an answer? > > Firefox already got several updates, for 1.0, 1.0.1 and now another > 1.0.1, but Thunderbird never got any. > > I've been using Thunderbird from development and it works just fine > (much better than FC3's firefox, which has a bunck of broken stuff in > comparison with the mozilla.org release), so I see no reason not to do > an update. > > Another example is Mozilla, which has had some security issues fixed in > recent versions but FC3 never got past 1.7.3. > > So, summing it up... is there any strong reason for not updating > Thunderbird on FC3? > Honestly? The answer is just that I haven't gotten around to it. Firefox was the priority since that is one of our default apps -- the others aren't. Thunderbird 1.0.1 and Mozilla 1.7.6 are right around the corner, so at this juncture, It may be best to wait a few more days. I'm in an upstream meeting this Monday where I'll find out more about when the next releases are out, and I'll push out updates then if they seem to be too far out. From rodd at clarkson.id.au Sat Mar 5 21:00:11 2005 From: rodd at clarkson.id.au (Rodd Clarkson) Date: Sun, 06 Mar 2005 08:00:11 +1100 Subject: Including OO templates in fc4 In-Reply-To: <1110045050.6541.27.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <1110035299.6541.24.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1110037746.1479.29.camel@jdub.homelinux.org> <1110045050.6541.27.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <1110056411.29024.4.camel@goose> On Sat, 2005-03-05 at 18:50 +0100, Kyrre Ness Sjobak wrote: > l?r, 05.03.2005 kl. 16.49 skrev Josh Boyer: > > On Sat, 2005-03-05 at 16:08 +0100, Kyrre Ness Sjobak wrote: > > > I know that we are aleady pushed for space, but including a few kb's of > > > templates to the huge package OO already is, seems nothing but > > > reasonable, especially considering the end-user benefit. > > > > I think this is a Fedora Extras candidate. Entire packages that are > > only a few KiBs are being pushed out to Extras, so I don't think we want > > to add anything that isn't needed to the core OO package. > I probably could, but i simply just don't think this is an extras > candidate. Users simply expect templates to be there, or at least a box > "you need to install xxx from yyy to get templates". > As I understand it, many (all) of the packages being moved from Core to Extras are being 'pushed out' (as you put it) because they offer duplicate functionality. In the case of adding some templates for OOo, then your wouldn't be adding another package for which the functionality was already available (but might not be your preferred package), you are actually adding very useful functionality for many, many users who will only use Fedora for word processing, web browsing and email (a fairly simply, but standard set of uses for the vast majority of desktop users who may do one or two other things, but will almost always do these things). Rodd From Nicolas.Mailhot at laPoste.net Sat Mar 5 21:26:49 2005 From: Nicolas.Mailhot at laPoste.net (Nicolas Mailhot) Date: Sat, 05 Mar 2005 22:26:49 +0100 Subject: Including OO templates in fc4 In-Reply-To: <1110056411.29024.4.camel@goose> References: <1110035299.6541.24.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1110037746.1479.29.camel@jdub.homelinux.org> <1110045050.6541.27.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1110056411.29024.4.camel@goose> Message-ID: <1110058010.6966.3.camel@rousalka.dyndns.org> Le dimanche 06 mars 2005 ? 08:00 +1100, Rodd Clarkson a ?crit : > On Sat, 2005-03-05 at 18:50 +0100, Kyrre Ness Sjobak wrote: > > l?r, 05.03.2005 kl. 16.49 skrev Josh Boyer: > > > On Sat, 2005-03-05 at 16:08 +0100, Kyrre Ness Sjobak wrote: > > > > > I know that we are aleady pushed for space, but including a few kb's of > > > > templates to the huge package OO already is, seems nothing but > > > > reasonable, especially considering the end-user benefit. > > > > > > I think this is a Fedora Extras candidate. Entire packages that are > > > only a few KiBs are being pushed out to Extras, so I don't think we want > > > to add anything that isn't needed to the core OO package. > > > I probably could, but i simply just don't think this is an extras > > candidate. Users simply expect templates to be there, or at least a box > > "you need to install xxx from yyy to get templates". > > > As I understand it, many (all) of the packages being moved from Core to > Extras are being 'pushed out' (as you put it) because they offer > duplicate functionality. > > In the case of adding some templates for OOo, then your wouldn't be > adding another package for which the functionality was already available > (but might not be your preferred package), you are actually adding very > useful functionality for many, many users who will only use Fedora for > word processing, web browsing and email I agree a few carefully selected templates belong in core (maybe only one that uses fedora colors;) - don't underestimate the marketing value of this kind of stuff) but the bulk of them is clearly extras material. Regards, -- Nicolas Mailhot -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part URL: From jspaleta at gmail.com Sat Mar 5 21:51:37 2005 From: jspaleta at gmail.com (Jeff Spaleta) Date: Sat, 5 Mar 2005 16:51:37 -0500 Subject: Including OO templates in fc4 In-Reply-To: <1110045050.6541.27.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <1110035299.6541.24.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1110037746.1479.29.camel@jdub.homelinux.org> <1110045050.6541.27.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <604aa79105030513513e62e5ce@mail.gmail.com> On Sat, 05 Mar 2005 18:50:51 +0100, Kyrre Ness Sjobak wrote: > I probably could, but i simply just don't think this is an extras > candidate. Users simply expect templates to be there, or at least a box > "you need to install xxx from yyy to get templates". Users expect which templates to be there? You could problably make a case for a few very specific templates.. IF upstream oo.org also includes them. But you certaintly can't argue that all possible extra oo.org templates need to be in Core. In fact.. i regard templates as being similar to something like a theme or a skin or a background. The vast majority of these things should not be in Core... the vast majority shouldn't even be in system packages at all and probably should be installed into a user's home directory as user data instead of system data. The thought of downloading all possible templates in one package disturbs me as much as the thought of having seperate packages for each template makes me ill. A dialog box on how to get templates is something that you should talk to upstream oo.org about implementing. -jef"it will be fun when someone writes a macro script to generate randomized impress templates and submits them every hour to ooextras"spaleta From rodd at clarkson.id.au Sat Mar 5 22:31:13 2005 From: rodd at clarkson.id.au (Rodd Clarkson) Date: Sun, 06 Mar 2005 09:31:13 +1100 Subject: Including OO templates in fc4 In-Reply-To: <604aa79105030513513e62e5ce@mail.gmail.com> References: <1110035299.6541.24.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1110037746.1479.29.camel@jdub.homelinux.org> <1110045050.6541.27.camel@localhost.localdomain> <604aa79105030513513e62e5ce@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1110061873.29024.17.camel@goose> On Sat, 2005-03-05 at 16:51 -0500, Jeff Spaleta wrote: > On Sat, 05 Mar 2005 18:50:51 +0100, Kyrre Ness Sjobak > In fact.. i regard templates as being similar to something like a > theme or a skin or a background. The vast majority of these things > should not be in Core... the vast majority shouldn't even be in system > packages at all and probably should be installed into a user's home > directory as user data instead of system data. The thought of > downloading all possible templates in one package disturbs me as much > as the thought of having seperate packages for each template makes me > ill. > > A dialog box on how to get templates is something that you should talk > to upstream oo.org about implementing. This is fine. As long as these things are available, because while they might be an annoyance for experienced users (who generally know what they want and don't want) they are an expected part of a 'new users' desktop. almost the first thing a new user does with their 'operating system' is have a look at the different backgrounds and look what games are available. Having things like this available, but not installed isn't a great way to sell the virtues of Linux or Fedora Core to them. Personally, I don't ever recall using a template for anything, but I'm amazed by the number of people who look for template almost immediately on opening OOo to see what it can do. It's also worth noting that many of these users aren't connected 24/7 (they aren't that interested in technology, they just want to type a letter and print it) and the hassle of having to 'log onto the internet' just to get a template is going to be a huge negative to them ('Word just comes with these templates by default', they'll think, ignoring the fact that Word also comes with a $400 price tag because they think that it's just a small part of the price of their computer). I don't think that things like backgrounds, themes and OOo templates should be installed by default unless the 'Desktop' option is install, but the desktop user should be able to have them installed and will most likely expect it. Keep in mind, most users are more concerned with the fact that there is 'no solitaire' installed on their computer than that fact that their operating system might be a bug riddle, security hole ridden pile of crap. And these same users are going to far more concerned about the lack of templates for OOo than the fact that they don't NEED to run virus and spyware detection software. Rodd From jspaleta at gmail.com Sat Mar 5 22:44:47 2005 From: jspaleta at gmail.com (Jeff Spaleta) Date: Sat, 5 Mar 2005 17:44:47 -0500 Subject: Including OO templates in fc4 In-Reply-To: <1110061873.29024.17.camel@goose> References: <1110035299.6541.24.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1110037746.1479.29.camel@jdub.homelinux.org> <1110045050.6541.27.camel@localhost.localdomain> <604aa79105030513513e62e5ce@mail.gmail.com> <1110061873.29024.17.camel@goose> Message-ID: <604aa79105030514445430da86@mail.gmail.com> On Sun, 06 Mar 2005 09:31:13 +1100, Rodd Clarkson wrote: > I don't think that things like backgrounds, themes and OOo templates > should be installed by default unless the 'Desktop' option is install, > but the desktop user should be able to have them installed and will most > likely expect it. Be specific... you certaintly cant mean that you think people expect ALL of the possible variations of this crap to be installed. You have to strike a balance. you have a few backgrounds... you have a few themes.... and if oo.org upstream includes templates.. then a few oo.org templates as well. Do the upstream oo.org releases include any templates? That's the first question that has to be answered. if not.. i dont see why fedora should be including any. Just packing up everything at ooextras and shipping it would be horrid.. just like packing up everthing from art.gnome.org would be horrid. If upstream oo.org releases are shipping templates then those 'select' templates should be evaluated at the fedora distribution level. -jef From michael.favia at insitesinc.com Sat Mar 5 22:52:44 2005 From: michael.favia at insitesinc.com (Michael Favia) Date: Sat, 05 Mar 2005 16:52:44 -0600 Subject: Including OO templates in fc4 In-Reply-To: <604aa79105030513513e62e5ce@mail.gmail.com> References: <1110035299.6541.24.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1110037746.1479.29.camel@jdub.homelinux.org> <1110045050.6541.27.camel@localhost.localdomain> <604aa79105030513513e62e5ce@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <422A383C.2060900@insitesinc.com> Jeff Spaleta wrote: >On Sat, 05 Mar 2005 18:50:51 +0100, Kyrre Ness Sjobak > wrote: > > >>I probably could, but i simply just don't think this is an extras >>candidate. Users simply expect templates to be there, or at least a box >>"you need to install xxx from yyy to get templates". >> >> > >Users expect which templates to be there? You could problably make a >case for a few very specific templates.. IF upstream oo.org also >includes them. But you certaintly can't argue that all possible extra >oo.org templates need to be in Core. > >In fact.. i regard templates as being similar to something like a >theme or a skin or a background. The vast majority of these things >should not be in Core... the vast majority shouldn't even be in system >packages at all and probably should be installed into a user's home >directory as user data instead of system data. The thought of >downloading all possible templates in one package disturbs me as much >as the thought of having seperate packages for each template makes me >ill. > To this end you would like to be able to update the Templates package[s] on its its/their own best schedule. By breaking it apart you provide improved functionality IMO. -mf From dcbw at redhat.com Sat Mar 5 23:01:51 2005 From: dcbw at redhat.com (Dan Williams) Date: Sat, 5 Mar 2005 18:01:51 -0500 (EST) Subject: Including OO templates in fc4 In-Reply-To: <1110035299.6541.24.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <1110035299.6541.24.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: On Sat, 5 Mar 2005, Kyrre Ness Sjobak wrote: > To many people (lacking artistic skill etc), templates really makes it > simpler to create documents (presentations especially). But none of > those are included in our distribution of OpenOffice, our main office > suite. Maybe it should? > > I don't know whats included in upstream OO, but at least there are some > templates to be found at http://ooextras.sourceforge.net/ > > I know that we are aleady pushed for space, but including a few kb's of > templates to the huge package OO already is, seems nothing but > reasonable, especially considering the end-user benefit. This is probably a good thing to do. For example, there are also templates at documentation.openoffice.org, like an Org Chart, an Excellence Award, etc. There are also quite a few at ooextras. A select # should probably get added to the base package since they don't really take up much space, perhaps another 500k or so for a few. Dan From jonathansavage at gmail.com Sat Mar 5 23:40:34 2005 From: jonathansavage at gmail.com (Jon Savage) Date: Sat, 5 Mar 2005 15:40:34 -0800 Subject: Including OO templates in fc4 In-Reply-To: References: <1110035299.6541.24.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <2ad7cea10503051540409aa41c@mail.gmail.com> FWIW I don't think the templates should be included in extras- getting them from OO.org is trivial at worst. Sheesh if I can do it anyone can. Bests JS From byte at aeon.com.my Sun Mar 6 03:53:15 2005 From: byte at aeon.com.my (Colin Charles) Date: Sun, 06 Mar 2005 11:53:15 +0800 Subject: fedora-devel-java-list In-Reply-To: <1109975506.7344.51.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <20050304161808.GB16343@redhat.com> <1109968423.22563.1.camel@one.myworld> <1109975506.7344.51.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <1110081195.5743.314.camel@arena.soho.bytebot.net> On Fri, 2005-03-04 at 14:31 -0800, Anthony Green wrote: > > > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-java-list > > > > More importantly, this mailing (and many other) is not in : > > http://fedora.redhat.com/participate/communicate/ > > Yes, I asked about that when I originally announced fedora-devel-java- > list. I don't know how those pages are maintained. Pointers welcome! Sopwith can fix this now; soon, the website will be in cvs, and that'll be even better -- Colin Charles, byte at aeon.com.my http://www.bytebot.net/ "First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win." -- Mohandas Gandhi From macfisherman at gmail.com Sun Mar 6 02:28:07 2005 From: macfisherman at gmail.com (Jeff Macdonald) Date: Sat, 5 Mar 2005 21:28:07 -0500 Subject: any plans to symlink /etc/lvm to /boot? Message-ID: <45ae903705030518287912f60e@mail.gmail.com> I had the unpleasant experience of having my system not booting because I had apparently messed up adding a new whole disk to the volume group. The LVM tools create backup data in /etc/lvm/backup. However, since root uses LVM, there's little chance in actually being able to use the backup data if the volume group goes bad. Since /boot is a normal partition and accessible in a rescue situation, wouldn't it make more sense to have /etc/lvm be a symlink to /boot/lvm? This way the data should be available. -- Jeff Macdonald Ayer, MA From buildsys at redhat.com Sun Mar 6 13:10:35 2005 From: buildsys at redhat.com (Build System) Date: Sun, 6 Mar 2005 08:10:35 -0500 Subject: rawhide report: 20050306 changes Message-ID: <200503061310.j26DAZBt004953@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> Updated Packages: ElectricFence-2.2.2-20 ---------------------- * Sat Mar 05 2005 Jakub Jelinek 2.2.2-20 - rebuilt with GCC 4 dejagnu-1:1.4.4-4 ----------------- * Sat Mar 05 2005 Jakub Jelinek 1:1.4.4-4 - rebuilt with GCC 4 efax-0.9-24 ----------- * Sat Mar 05 2005 Than Ngo 0.9-24 - rebuilt elinks-0.10.2-2 --------------- * Sat Mar 05 2005 Karel Zak 0.10.2-2 - rebuilt epiphany-1.5.8-2 ---------------- * Sat Mar 05 2005 Christopher Aillon - 1.5.8-2 - Rebuild freeglut-2.2.0-16 ----------------- * Sat Mar 05 2005 Mike A. Harris 2.2.0-16 - Added freeglut-2.2.0-gcc4-fix-invalid-lvalue-in-assignment-cvsps-392-393.patch to fix "invalid lvalue in assignment" bugs reported by gcc 4 - Added "-Wall" to CFLAGS in specfile. * Thu Mar 03 2005 Mike A. Harris 2.2.0-15 - Rebuild with gcc 4 for FC4 development genromfs-0.5.1-3 ---------------- * Sat Mar 05 2005 Jakub Jelinek 0.5.1-3 - rebuilt with GCC 4 glibc-2.3.4-12 -------------- * Sat Mar 05 2005 Jakub Jelinek 2.3.4-12 - fix tst-chk{2,3} - fix up AS_NEEDED directive in /usr/lib64/libc.so - BuildReq binutils >= 2.15.94.0.2-1 for AS_NEEDED, in glibc-devel Conflict with binutils < 2.15.94.0.2-1 * Thu Mar 03 2005 Jakub Jelinek 2.3.4-11 - update from CVS - fix execvp (#149290) - fix dlclose (#145810) - clear padding in gconv-modules.cache (#146614, BZ#776) - rebuilt with GCC4 - changed __GLIBC_MINOR__ for now back to 3 - back out the newly added GLIBC_2.4 *_chk routines, instead do the checking in macros * Sat Feb 12 2005 Jakub Jelinek 2.3.4-10 - hopefully fix interaction with prelink (#147655) java-1.4.2-gcj-compat-0:1.4.2.0-40jpp_7rh ----------------------------------------- * Sat Mar 05 2005 Thomas Fitzsimmons - 0:1.4.2.0-40jpp_7rh - Import java-gcj-compat 1.0.19. kdbg-1:1.2.10-2 --------------- * Sat Mar 05 2005 Than Ngo 1:1.2.10-2 - rebuilt kdeedu-3.4.0-0.rc1.2 -------------------- * Fri Mar 04 2005 Than Ngo 3.4.0-0.rc1.2 - rebuilt against gcc-4.0.0-0.31 kdesdk-3.4.0-0.rc1.2 -------------------- * Sat Mar 05 2005 Than Ngo 2:3.4.0-0.rc1.2 - fix gcc4 build problem * Mon Feb 28 2005 Than Ngo 3.4.0-0.rc1.1 - KDE 3.4.0 rc1 * Tue Feb 22 2005 Than Ngo 2:3.3.92-0.1 - KDE-3.4 beta2 kdewebdev-6:3.4.0-0.rc1.2 ------------------------- * Fri Mar 04 2005 Than Ngo 6:3.4.0-0.rc1.2 - rebuilt against gcc-4.0.0-0.31 lha-1.14i-19 ------------ * Sat Mar 05 2005 Than Ngo 1.14i-19 - rebuilt libgconf-java-2.9.92-1 ---------------------- * Sat Mar 05 2005 Thomas Fitzsimmons - 2.9.92-1 - Import libgconf-java 2.9.92. libglade-java-2.9.92-1 ---------------------- * Fri Mar 04 2005 Thomas Fitzsimmons - 2.9.92-1 - Import libglade-java 2.9.92. libgnome-java-2.9.92-1 ---------------------- * Fri Mar 04 2005 Thomas Fitzsimmons - 2.9.92-1 - Require libgtk-java and java for build. - Import libgnome-java 2.9.92. lockdev-1.0.1-7 --------------- * Sat Mar 05 2005 Karel Zak 1.0.1-6 - rebuilt lrzsz-0.12.20-21 ---------------- * Sat Mar 05 2005 Than Ngo 0.12.20-21 - rebuilt lsof-4.74-3 ----------- * Sat Mar 05 2005 Karel Zak 4.74-3 - rebuilt ltrace-0.3.36-3 --------------- * Sat Mar 05 2005 Jakub Jelinek 0.3.36-3 - rebuilt with GCC 4 * Tue Dec 14 2004 Jakub Jelinek 0.3.36-2 - make x86_64 ltrace trace both 32-bit and 64-bit binaries (#141955, IT#55600) - fix tracing across execve - fix printf-style format handling on 64-bit arches * Thu Nov 18 2004 Jakub Jelinek 0.3.36-1 - update to 0.3.36 mktemp-3:1.5-23 --------------- * Sat Mar 05 2005 Than Ngo 3:1.5-23 - rebuilt mozplugger-1.7.1-3 ------------------ * Sat Mar 05 2005 Than Ngo 1.7.1-3 - rebuild mysql-4.1.10-2 -------------- * Sat Mar 05 2005 Tom Lane 4.1.10-2 - Need -fno-strict-aliasing in at least one place, probably more. - Work around some C spec violations in mysql. * Fri Feb 18 2005 Tom Lane 4.1.10-1 - Update to MySQL 4.1.10. open-1.4-24 ----------- * Sat Mar 05 2005 Than Ngo 1.4-24 - rebuilt * Tue Feb 15 2005 Than Ngo 1.4-23 - use $RPM_OPT_FLAGS * Wed Feb 09 2005 Than Ngo 1.4-22 - rebuilt openoffice.org-1:1.9.82-1 ------------------------- * Fri Mar 04 2005 Caolan McNamara 1:1.9.82-1 - bump to 1.9.82 - drop integrated openoffice.org-1.9.75.ooo42251.copyright.patch - drop integrated workspace-systempython2.patch - drop integrated openoffice.org-1.9.77.ooo41026.unxlngi6.patch - drop integrated openoffice.org-1.9.77.ooo42457.ppclink.patch - add openoffice.org-1.9.82.NONE.noznow.patch for ppc prelink-0.3.4-2 --------------- * Sat Mar 05 2005 Jakub Jelinek 0.3.4-2 - rebuilt with GCC 4 procinfo-18-15 -------------- * Sat Mar 05 2005 Karel Zak 18-15 - rebuilt procps-3.2.5-2 -------------- * Sat Mar 05 2005 Karel Zak 3.2.5-2 - rebuilt psmisc-21.5-4 ------------- * Sat Mar 05 2005 Karel Zak 21.5-4 - fixed problem with perl expression in the build .spec section * Sat Mar 05 2005 Karel Zak 21.5-3 - rebuilt rsh-0.17-29 ----------- * Sat Mar 05 2005 Karel Zak 0.17-29 - rebuilt sed-4.1.2-5 ----------- * Sat Mar 05 2005 Jakub Jelinek 4.1.2-5 - rebuilt with GCC 4 talk-0.17-28 ------------ * Sat Mar 05 2005 Miloslav Trmac - 0.17-28 - Rebuild with gcc 4 tcsh-6.13-13 ------------ * Sat Mar 05 2005 Miloslav Trmac - 6.13-13 - Rebuild with gcc 4 tmpwatch-2.9.2-2 ---------------- * Sat Mar 05 2005 Miloslav Trmac - 2.9.2-2 - Rebuild with gcc 4 transfig-1:3.2.4-11 ------------------- * Sat Mar 05 2005 Than Ngo 1:3.2.4-11 - rebuild tvtime-0.9.15-4 --------------- * Sat Mar 05 2005 Than Ngo 0.9.15-4 - rebuilt valgrind-callgrind-0.9.9-2 -------------------------- * Sat Mar 05 2005 Jakub Jelinek 0.9.9-2 - rebuilt with GCC 4 wordtrans-1.1pre13-10 --------------------- * Sat Mar 05 2005 Than Ngo 1.1pre13-10 - rebuilt xpdf-1:3.00-18 -------------- * Sat Mar 05 2005 Than Ngo 1:3.00-18 - rebuilt From mbneto at gmail.com Sun Mar 6 13:28:50 2005 From: mbneto at gmail.com (mbneto) Date: Sun, 6 Mar 2005 09:28:50 -0400 Subject: rawhide report: 20050306 changes In-Reply-To: <200503061310.j26DAZBt004953@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> References: <200503061310.j26DAZBt004953@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> Message-ID: <5cf776b805030605286144813a@mail.gmail.com> I've been unable to test the new packages due to a libcrypto.x problem. Is this solved in the latest round of packages? How can I skip the problematic packages in order to upgrade/test the rest ? On Sun, 6 Mar 2005 08:10:35 -0500, Build System wrote: > > > Updated Packages: > > ElectricFence-2.2.2-20 > ---------------------- > * Sat Mar 05 2005 Jakub Jelinek 2.2.2-20 > - rebuilt with GCC 4 > > dejagnu-1:1.4.4-4 > ----------------- > * Sat Mar 05 2005 Jakub Jelinek 1:1.4.4-4 > - rebuilt with GCC 4 > > efax-0.9-24 > ----------- > * Sat Mar 05 2005 Than Ngo 0.9-24 > - rebuilt > > elinks-0.10.2-2 > --------------- > * Sat Mar 05 2005 Karel Zak 0.10.2-2 > - rebuilt > > epiphany-1.5.8-2 > ---------------- > * Sat Mar 05 2005 Christopher Aillon - 1.5.8-2 > - Rebuild > > freeglut-2.2.0-16 > ----------------- > * Sat Mar 05 2005 Mike A. Harris 2.2.0-16 > - Added freeglut-2.2.0-gcc4-fix-invalid-lvalue-in-assignment-cvsps-392-393.patch > to fix "invalid lvalue in assignment" bugs reported by gcc 4 > - Added "-Wall" to CFLAGS in specfile. > > * Thu Mar 03 2005 Mike A. Harris 2.2.0-15 > - Rebuild with gcc 4 for FC4 development > > genromfs-0.5.1-3 > ---------------- > * Sat Mar 05 2005 Jakub Jelinek 0.5.1-3 > - rebuilt with GCC 4 > > glibc-2.3.4-12 > -------------- > * Sat Mar 05 2005 Jakub Jelinek 2.3.4-12 > - fix tst-chk{2,3} > - fix up AS_NEEDED directive in /usr/lib64/libc.so > - BuildReq binutils >= 2.15.94.0.2-1 for AS_NEEDED, in > glibc-devel Conflict with binutils < 2.15.94.0.2-1 > > * Thu Mar 03 2005 Jakub Jelinek 2.3.4-11 > - update from CVS > - fix execvp (#149290) > - fix dlclose (#145810) > - clear padding in gconv-modules.cache (#146614, BZ#776) > - rebuilt with GCC4 > - changed __GLIBC_MINOR__ for now back to 3 > - back out the newly added GLIBC_2.4 *_chk routines, instead > do the checking in macros > > * Sat Feb 12 2005 Jakub Jelinek 2.3.4-10 > - hopefully fix interaction with prelink (#147655) > > java-1.4.2-gcj-compat-0:1.4.2.0-40jpp_7rh > ----------------------------------------- > * Sat Mar 05 2005 Thomas Fitzsimmons - 0:1.4.2.0-40jpp_7rh > - Import java-gcj-compat 1.0.19. > > kdbg-1:1.2.10-2 > --------------- > * Sat Mar 05 2005 Than Ngo 1:1.2.10-2 > - rebuilt > > kdeedu-3.4.0-0.rc1.2 > -------------------- > * Fri Mar 04 2005 Than Ngo 3.4.0-0.rc1.2 > - rebuilt against gcc-4.0.0-0.31 > > kdesdk-3.4.0-0.rc1.2 > -------------------- > * Sat Mar 05 2005 Than Ngo 2:3.4.0-0.rc1.2 > - fix gcc4 build problem > > * Mon Feb 28 2005 Than Ngo 3.4.0-0.rc1.1 > - KDE 3.4.0 rc1 > > * Tue Feb 22 2005 Than Ngo 2:3.3.92-0.1 > - KDE-3.4 beta2 > > kdewebdev-6:3.4.0-0.rc1.2 > ------------------------- > * Fri Mar 04 2005 Than Ngo 6:3.4.0-0.rc1.2 > - rebuilt against gcc-4.0.0-0.31 > > lha-1.14i-19 > ------------ > * Sat Mar 05 2005 Than Ngo 1.14i-19 > - rebuilt > > libgconf-java-2.9.92-1 > ---------------------- > * Sat Mar 05 2005 Thomas Fitzsimmons - 2.9.92-1 > - Import libgconf-java 2.9.92. > > libglade-java-2.9.92-1 > ---------------------- > * Fri Mar 04 2005 Thomas Fitzsimmons - 2.9.92-1 > - Import libglade-java 2.9.92. > > libgnome-java-2.9.92-1 > ---------------------- > * Fri Mar 04 2005 Thomas Fitzsimmons - 2.9.92-1 > - Require libgtk-java and java for build. > - Import libgnome-java 2.9.92. > > lockdev-1.0.1-7 > --------------- > * Sat Mar 05 2005 Karel Zak 1.0.1-6 > - rebuilt > > lrzsz-0.12.20-21 > ---------------- > * Sat Mar 05 2005 Than Ngo 0.12.20-21 > - rebuilt > > lsof-4.74-3 > ----------- > * Sat Mar 05 2005 Karel Zak 4.74-3 > - rebuilt > > ltrace-0.3.36-3 > --------------- > * Sat Mar 05 2005 Jakub Jelinek 0.3.36-3 > - rebuilt with GCC 4 > > * Tue Dec 14 2004 Jakub Jelinek 0.3.36-2 > - make x86_64 ltrace trace both 32-bit and 64-bit binaries (#141955, > IT#55600) > - fix tracing across execve > - fix printf-style format handling on 64-bit arches > > * Thu Nov 18 2004 Jakub Jelinek 0.3.36-1 > - update to 0.3.36 > > mktemp-3:1.5-23 > --------------- > * Sat Mar 05 2005 Than Ngo 3:1.5-23 > - rebuilt > > mozplugger-1.7.1-3 > ------------------ > * Sat Mar 05 2005 Than Ngo 1.7.1-3 > - rebuild > > mysql-4.1.10-2 > -------------- > * Sat Mar 05 2005 Tom Lane 4.1.10-2 > - Need -fno-strict-aliasing in at least one place, probably more. > - Work around some C spec violations in mysql. > > * Fri Feb 18 2005 Tom Lane 4.1.10-1 > - Update to MySQL 4.1.10. > > open-1.4-24 > ----------- > * Sat Mar 05 2005 Than Ngo 1.4-24 > - rebuilt > > * Tue Feb 15 2005 Than Ngo 1.4-23 > - use $RPM_OPT_FLAGS > > * Wed Feb 09 2005 Than Ngo 1.4-22 > - rebuilt > > openoffice.org-1:1.9.82-1 > ------------------------- > * Fri Mar 04 2005 Caolan McNamara 1:1.9.82-1 > - bump to 1.9.82 > - drop integrated openoffice.org-1.9.75.ooo42251.copyright.patch > - drop integrated workspace-systempython2.patch > - drop integrated openoffice.org-1.9.77.ooo41026.unxlngi6.patch > - drop integrated openoffice.org-1.9.77.ooo42457.ppclink.patch > - add openoffice.org-1.9.82.NONE.noznow.patch for ppc > > prelink-0.3.4-2 > --------------- > * Sat Mar 05 2005 Jakub Jelinek 0.3.4-2 > - rebuilt with GCC 4 > > procinfo-18-15 > -------------- > * Sat Mar 05 2005 Karel Zak 18-15 > - rebuilt > > procps-3.2.5-2 > -------------- > * Sat Mar 05 2005 Karel Zak 3.2.5-2 > - rebuilt > > psmisc-21.5-4 > ------------- > * Sat Mar 05 2005 Karel Zak 21.5-4 > - fixed problem with perl expression in the build .spec section > > * Sat Mar 05 2005 Karel Zak 21.5-3 > - rebuilt > > rsh-0.17-29 > ----------- > * Sat Mar 05 2005 Karel Zak 0.17-29 > - rebuilt > > sed-4.1.2-5 > ----------- > * Sat Mar 05 2005 Jakub Jelinek 4.1.2-5 > - rebuilt with GCC 4 > > talk-0.17-28 > ------------ > * Sat Mar 05 2005 Miloslav Trmac - 0.17-28 > - Rebuild with gcc 4 > > tcsh-6.13-13 > ------------ > * Sat Mar 05 2005 Miloslav Trmac - 6.13-13 > - Rebuild with gcc 4 > > tmpwatch-2.9.2-2 > ---------------- > * Sat Mar 05 2005 Miloslav Trmac - 2.9.2-2 > - Rebuild with gcc 4 > > transfig-1:3.2.4-11 > ------------------- > * Sat Mar 05 2005 Than Ngo 1:3.2.4-11 > - rebuild > > tvtime-0.9.15-4 > --------------- > * Sat Mar 05 2005 Than Ngo 0.9.15-4 > - rebuilt > > valgrind-callgrind-0.9.9-2 > -------------------------- > * Sat Mar 05 2005 Jakub Jelinek 0.9.9-2 > - rebuilt with GCC 4 > wordtrans-1.1pre13-10 > --------------------- > * Sat Mar 05 2005 Than Ngo 1.1pre13-10 > - rebuilt > > xpdf-1:3.00-18 > -------------- > * Sat Mar 05 2005 Than Ngo 1:3.00-18 > - rebuilt > > -- > fedora-devel-list mailing list > fedora-devel-list at redhat.com > http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-list > From Nicolas.Mailhot at laPoste.net Sun Mar 6 14:00:35 2005 From: Nicolas.Mailhot at laPoste.net (Nicolas Mailhot) Date: Sun, 06 Mar 2005 15:00:35 +0100 Subject: rawhide report: 20050306 changes In-Reply-To: <5cf776b805030605286144813a@mail.gmail.com> References: <200503061310.j26DAZBt004953@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <5cf776b805030605286144813a@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1110117636.25575.14.camel@rousalka.dyndns.org> Le dimanche 06 mars 2005 ? 09:28 -0400, mbneto a ?crit : > > openoffice.org-1:1.9.82-1 > > ------------------------- > > * Fri Mar 04 2005 Caolan McNamara 1:1.9.82-1 > > - bump to 1.9.82 > > - drop integrated openoffice.org-1.9.75.ooo42251.copyright.patch > > - drop integrated workspace-systempython2.patch > > - drop integrated openoffice.org-1.9.77.ooo41026.unxlngi6.patch > > - drop integrated openoffice.org-1.9.77.ooo42457.ppclink.patch > > - add openoffice.org-1.9.82.NONE.noznow.patch for ppc ooimpress crashes on startup here, don't really have time to investigate why. -- Nicolas Mailhot -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part URL: From thesource at ldb-jab.org Sun Mar 6 16:14:55 2005 From: thesource at ldb-jab.org (Lawrence Bowie) Date: Sun, 06 Mar 2005 11:14:55 -0500 Subject: look command not working properly In-Reply-To: <1110117636.25575.14.camel@rousalka.dyndns.org> References: <200503061310.j26DAZBt004953@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <5cf776b805030605286144813a@mail.gmail.com> <1110117636.25575.14.camel@rousalka.dyndns.org> Message-ID: <422B2C7F.3020906@ldb-jab.org> This command works well on SuSE ... but not on Core 3 .. ldb at fishbutt:/home/ldb> look america ldb at fishbutt:/home/ldb> look american ldb at fishbutt:/home/ldb> look amer Amer Amer. AmerInd AmerSp Amerada America American Americana Americanese Americanisation Americanise Americanised Americaniser Americanising Americanism Americanist Americanistic Americanitis Americanization Americanize Americanized Americanizer Americanizing Americanly Americano Americano-european Americanoid Americanos Americaward Americawards Americomania Americophobe Americus Amerigo Amerika Amerimnon Amerind Amerindian Amerindic Amero Amersfoort Amersham Amery From dwmw2 at infradead.org Sun Mar 6 18:39:28 2005 From: dwmw2 at infradead.org (David Woodhouse) Date: Sun, 06 Mar 2005 18:39:28 +0000 Subject: rawhide report: 20050306 changes In-Reply-To: <1110117636.25575.14.camel@rousalka.dyndns.org> References: <200503061310.j26DAZBt004953@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <5cf776b805030605286144813a@mail.gmail.com> <1110117636.25575.14.camel@rousalka.dyndns.org> Message-ID: <1110134369.4108.7.camel@localhost.localdomain> On Sun, 2005-03-06 at 15:00 +0100, Nicolas Mailhot wrote: > Le dimanche 06 mars 2005 ? 09:28 -0400, mbneto a ?crit : > > > > openoffice.org-1:1.9.82-1 > > ooimpress crashes on startup here, don't really have time to investigate > why. Likewise with 1.9.81-1. It starts up OK with a blank presentation, and just segfaults on exit. If you try looking for templates it dies immediately. -- dwmw2 From remco at rvt.com Sun Mar 6 18:49:15 2005 From: remco at rvt.com (Remco Treffkorn) Date: Sun, 6 Mar 2005 10:49:15 -0800 Subject: look command not working properly In-Reply-To: <422B2C7F.3020906@ldb-jab.org> References: <200503061310.j26DAZBt004953@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <1110117636.25575.14.camel@rousalka.dyndns.org> <422B2C7F.3020906@ldb-jab.org> Message-ID: <200503061049.15930.remco@rvt.com> On Sunday 06 March 2005 08:14, Lawrence Bowie wrote: > This command works well on SuSE ... but not on Core 3 .. > > > ldb at fishbutt:/home/ldb> look america > ldb at fishbutt:/home/ldb> look american > ldb at fishbutt:/home/ldb> look amer > Amer > Amer. Off topic here, but: Try 'look america /usr/share/dict/words'. Then read the man page about the -f and -d flag. Then see the dict file and find that it is not sorted with the default (-f) look assumes for the user dict file. I can't decide if the dict is wrong, or the look default... -- Remco Treffkorn (RT445) HAM DC2XT remco at rvt.com (831) 685-1201 From pri.rhl3 at iadonisi.to Sun Mar 6 18:49:38 2005 From: pri.rhl3 at iadonisi.to (Paul Iadonisi) Date: Sun, 06 Mar 2005 13:49:38 -0500 Subject: look command not working properly In-Reply-To: <422B2C7F.3020906@ldb-jab.org> References: <200503061310.j26DAZBt004953@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <5cf776b805030605286144813a@mail.gmail.com> <1110117636.25575.14.camel@rousalka.dyndns.org> <422B2C7F.3020906@ldb-jab.org> Message-ID: <1110134978.29222.20.camel@md.local.linuxlobbyist.org> On Sun, 2005-03-06 at 11:14 -0500, Lawrence Bowie wrote: > This command works well on SuSE ... but not on Core 3 .. Interesting, but: 1) This is not on topic for fedora-devel 2) Don't "Reply" to a message unless it's really a reply to a message 3) File a bug against Fedora Core 3 at http://bugzilla.redhat.com/ *sigh* -- -Paul Iadonisi Senior System Administrator Red Hat Certified Engineer / Local Linux Lobbyist Ever see a penguin fly? -- Try Linux. GPL all the way: Sell services, don't lease secrets From kyrre at solution-forge.net Sun Mar 6 18:57:53 2005 From: kyrre at solution-forge.net (Kyrre Ness Sjobak) Date: Sun, 06 Mar 2005 19:57:53 +0100 Subject: Including OO templates in fc4 In-Reply-To: <604aa79105030514445430da86@mail.gmail.com> References: <1110035299.6541.24.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1110037746.1479.29.camel@jdub.homelinux.org> <1110045050.6541.27.camel@localhost.localdomain> <604aa79105030513513e62e5ce@mail.gmail.com> <1110061873.29024.17.camel@goose> <604aa79105030514445430da86@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1110135473.3440.7.camel@localhost.localdomain> l?r, 05.03.2005 kl. 23.44 skrev Jeff Spaleta: > On Sun, 06 Mar 2005 09:31:13 +1100, Rodd Clarkson wrote: > > I don't think that things like backgrounds, themes and OOo templates > > should be installed by default unless the 'Desktop' option is install, > > but the desktop user should be able to have them installed and will most > > likely expect it. > > Be specific... you certaintly cant mean that you think people expect > ALL of the possible variations of this crap to be installed. You have > to strike a balance. you have a few backgrounds... you have a few > themes.... and if oo.org upstream includes templates.. then a few > oo.org templates as well. > > Do the upstream oo.org releases include any templates? That's the > first question that has to be answered. if not.. i dont see why fedora > should be including any. Just packing up everything at ooextras and > shipping it would be horrid.. just like packing up everthing from > art.gnome.org would be horrid. If upstream oo.org releases are > shipping templates then those 'select' templates should be evaluated > at the fedora distribution level. Nobody has ever asked for entire ooextras to be in core. Just a few, select good templates - ooextras was just one example of a source for such templates. Maybe not more than five or so. But *some*. Having seen how mac users and iWork users expect templates, i don't see any reason why Linux users shouln't. It is just a matter of making the user more productive in making contenent and publishing it, without having to waste time and energy on figuring out how to make a nice layout. From kyrre at solution-forge.net Sun Mar 6 18:58:54 2005 From: kyrre at solution-forge.net (Kyrre Ness Sjobak) Date: Sun, 06 Mar 2005 19:58:54 +0100 Subject: Including OO templates in fc4 In-Reply-To: <1110058010.6966.3.camel@rousalka.dyndns.org> References: <1110035299.6541.24.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1110037746.1479.29.camel@jdub.homelinux.org> <1110045050.6541.27.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1110056411.29024.4.camel@goose> <1110058010.6966.3.camel@rousalka.dyndns.org> Message-ID: <1110135533.3440.9.camel@localhost.localdomain> l?r, 05.03.2005 kl. 22.26 skrev Nicolas Mailhot: > Le dimanche 06 mars 2005 ? 08:00 +1100, Rodd Clarkson a ?crit : > > On Sat, 2005-03-05 at 18:50 +0100, Kyrre Ness Sjobak wrote: > > > l?r, 05.03.2005 kl. 16.49 skrev Josh Boyer: > > > > On Sat, 2005-03-05 at 16:08 +0100, Kyrre Ness Sjobak wrote: > > > > > > > I know that we are aleady pushed for space, but including a few kb's of > > > > > templates to the huge package OO already is, seems nothing but > > > > > reasonable, especially considering the end-user benefit. > > > > > > > > I think this is a Fedora Extras candidate. Entire packages that are > > > > only a few KiBs are being pushed out to Extras, so I don't think we want > > > > to add anything that isn't needed to the core OO package. > > > > > I probably could, but i simply just don't think this is an extras > > > candidate. Users simply expect templates to be there, or at least a box > > > "you need to install xxx from yyy to get templates". > > > > > As I understand it, many (all) of the packages being moved from Core to > > Extras are being 'pushed out' (as you put it) because they offer > > duplicate functionality. > > > > In the case of adding some templates for OOo, then your wouldn't be > > adding another package for which the functionality was already available > > (but might not be your preferred package), you are actually adding very > > useful functionality for many, many users who will only use Fedora for > > word processing, web browsing and email > > I agree a few carefully selected templates belong in core (maybe only > one that uses fedora colors;) - don't underestimate the marketing value > of this kind of stuff) but the bulk of them is clearly extras material. > Agreed. Put some good ones in core, and the bulk in extras. From kms at passback.co.uk Sun Mar 6 19:00:43 2005 From: kms at passback.co.uk (Keith Sharp) Date: Sun, 06 Mar 2005 19:00:43 +0000 Subject: rawhide report: 20050306 changes In-Reply-To: <1110134369.4108.7.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <200503061310.j26DAZBt004953@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <5cf776b805030605286144813a@mail.gmail.com> <1110117636.25575.14.camel@rousalka.dyndns.org> <1110134369.4108.7.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <1110135643.22897.22.camel@animal.passback.co.uk> On Sun, 2005-03-06 at 18:39 +0000, David Woodhouse wrote: > On Sun, 2005-03-06 at 15:00 +0100, Nicolas Mailhot wrote: > > Le dimanche 06 mars 2005 ? 09:28 -0400, mbneto a ?crit : > > > > > > openoffice.org-1:1.9.82-1 > > > > ooimpress crashes on startup here, don't really have time to investigate > > why. > > Likewise with 1.9.81-1. It starts up OK with a blank presentation, and > just segfaults on exit. If you try looking for templates it dies > immediately. When I was running Caolans builds previously I found that you needed to have the correct gnome-vfs version or you got a crash on every file access. The error was quite obvious if you ran the app from the command line. Dunno if this is of any help... Keith. From thesource at ldb-jab.org Sun Mar 6 19:08:27 2005 From: thesource at ldb-jab.org (Lawrence Bowie) Date: Sun, 06 Mar 2005 14:08:27 -0500 Subject: look command not working properly In-Reply-To: <1110134978.29222.20.camel@md.local.linuxlobbyist.org> References: <200503061310.j26DAZBt004953@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <5cf776b805030605286144813a@mail.gmail.com> <1110117636.25575.14.camel@rousalka.dyndns.org> <422B2C7F.3020906@ldb-jab.org> <1110134978.29222.20.camel@md.local.linuxlobbyist.org> Message-ID: <422B552B.1070004@ldb-jab.org> I was making sure it was not just me dude .. take it easy and reserve your comments unnecessary comments .. LDB Paul Iadonisi wrote: >On Sun, 2005-03-06 at 11:14 -0500, Lawrence Bowie wrote: > > >>This command works well on SuSE ... but not on Core 3 .. >> >> > > Interesting, but: > >1) This is not on topic for fedora-devel >2) Don't "Reply" to a message unless it's really a reply to a message >3) File a bug against Fedora Core 3 at http://bugzilla.redhat.com/ > >*sigh* > > > From jspaleta at gmail.com Sun Mar 6 19:09:35 2005 From: jspaleta at gmail.com (Jeff Spaleta) Date: Sun, 6 Mar 2005 14:09:35 -0500 Subject: Including OO templates in fc4 In-Reply-To: <1110135473.3440.7.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <1110035299.6541.24.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1110037746.1479.29.camel@jdub.homelinux.org> <1110045050.6541.27.camel@localhost.localdomain> <604aa79105030513513e62e5ce@mail.gmail.com> <1110061873.29024.17.camel@goose> <604aa79105030514445430da86@mail.gmail.com> <1110135473.3440.7.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <604aa7910503061109513ce8de@mail.gmail.com> On Sun, 06 Mar 2005 19:57:53 +0100, Kyrre Ness Sjobak wrote: > Maybe not more than five or so. But *some*. Does upstream oo.org builds include any templates? How about you work upstream and get 5 GOOD templates for oo.org into the upstream defaults for oo.org that would be available in all oo.org builds for all of oo.org's supported operating systems. Focusing this effort inside fedora absolutely makes little sense to me. Whatever arguments you make for the expectation of fedora users.. holds just as well for oo.org users on every operating system oo.org supports. Get five good templates into the oo.org upstream defaults.. and those will naturally be obvious candidates for inclusion in fedora.. and every other distros as well as oo.org on windows. OO.org's real strength is being available cross-platform... and i think default templates should be implemented in a way that are consistently available cross-platform. This will be accomplished if people work with oo.org upstream.. this will not be accomplished if people focus solely on getting templates into fedora. -jef From pri.rhl3 at iadonisi.to Sun Mar 6 19:13:43 2005 From: pri.rhl3 at iadonisi.to (Paul Iadonisi) Date: Sun, 06 Mar 2005 14:13:43 -0500 Subject: look command not working properly In-Reply-To: <422B552B.1070004@ldb-jab.org> References: <200503061310.j26DAZBt004953@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <5cf776b805030605286144813a@mail.gmail.com> <1110117636.25575.14.camel@rousalka.dyndns.org> <422B2C7F.3020906@ldb-jab.org> <1110134978.29222.20.camel@md.local.linuxlobbyist.org> <422B552B.1070004@ldb-jab.org> Message-ID: <1110136423.29222.24.camel@md.local.linuxlobbyist.org> On Sun, 2005-03-06 at 14:08 -0500, Lawrence Bowie wrote: > I was making sure it was not just me dude .. take it easy and reserve > your comments > unnecessary comments .. Unnecessary? I wouldn't say that. Curt? Yeah, and apologies for that. It was a knee jerk reaction to some of my pet peeves. -- -Paul Iadonisi Senior System Administrator Red Hat Certified Engineer / Local Linux Lobbyist Ever see a penguin fly? -- Try Linux. GPL all the way: Sell services, don't lease secrets From kyrre at solution-forge.net Sun Mar 6 20:05:34 2005 From: kyrre at solution-forge.net (Kyrre Ness Sjobak) Date: Sun, 06 Mar 2005 21:05:34 +0100 Subject: Including OO templates in fc4 In-Reply-To: <604aa7910503061109513ce8de@mail.gmail.com> References: <1110035299.6541.24.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1110037746.1479.29.camel@jdub.homelinux.org> <1110045050.6541.27.camel@localhost.localdomain> <604aa79105030513513e62e5ce@mail.gmail.com> <1110061873.29024.17.camel@goose> <604aa79105030514445430da86@mail.gmail.com> <1110135473.3440.7.camel@localhost.localdomain> <604aa7910503061109513ce8de@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1110139534.3440.13.camel@localhost.localdomain> s?n, 06.03.2005 kl. 20.09 skrev Jeff Spaleta: > On Sun, 06 Mar 2005 19:57:53 +0100, Kyrre Ness Sjobak > wrote: > > Maybe not more than five or so. But *some*. > > Does upstream oo.org builds include any templates? How about you work > upstream and get 5 GOOD templates for oo.org into the upstream > defaults for oo.org that would be available in all oo.org builds for > all of oo.org's supported operating systems. Focusing this effort > inside fedora absolutely makes little sense to me. Whatever arguments > you make for the expectation of fedora users.. holds just as well for > oo.org users on every operating system oo.org supports. > Get five good templates into the oo.org upstream defaults.. and those > will naturally be obvious candidates for inclusion in fedora.. and > every other distros as well as oo.org on windows. > > OO.org's real strength is being available cross-platform... and i > think default templates should be implemented in a way that are > consistently available cross-platform. This will be accomplished if > people work with oo.org upstream.. this will not be accomplished if > people focus solely on getting templates into fedora. > > -jef Good idea, even if i do think it shouldn't be necessary to start with upstream - do it in fedora, se that it works well. Show upstream "hey this works well!". BTW do you (or generally users of this list) have any opinions on which one should be submitted - i ask of the same reason i ask for templates - my design judging skills are terrible. Kyrre Sj?b?k From iago.rubio at hispalinux.es Sun Mar 6 20:08:56 2005 From: iago.rubio at hispalinux.es (Iago Rubio) Date: Sun, 06 Mar 2005 21:08:56 +0100 Subject: [OT] Re: look command not working properly In-Reply-To: <422B552B.1070004@ldb-jab.org> References: <200503061310.j26DAZBt004953@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <5cf776b805030605286144813a@mail.gmail.com> <1110117636.25575.14.camel@rousalka.dyndns.org> <422B2C7F.3020906@ldb-jab.org> <1110134978.29222.20.camel@md.local.linuxlobbyist.org> <422B552B.1070004@ldb-jab.org> Message-ID: <1110139736.9249.34.camel@speedy.iagorubio.net> On Sun, 2005-03-06 at 14:08 -0500, Lawrence Bowie wrote: > I was making sure it was not just me dude .. take it easy and reserve > your comments > unnecessary comments .. I don't think Paul comments were unnecessary. Thread hijacking bothers lot's of people. Read any mailing list netiquette paper and you'll find Paul was not wrong at all when pointed: 2) Don't "Reply" to a message unless it's really a reply to a message. As example you've just messed this thread completely in my thread aware mail client (evolution). Pick this paper if you don't want to google around: http://linux.sgms-centre.com/misc/netiquette.php Then you could read this http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/PostIsOffTopic and you'll know Paul was not wrong at all when he pointed: 1) This is not on topic for fedora-devel 3) File a bug against Fedora Core 3 at http://bugzilla.redhat.com/ As you can see it was nothing personal, and he did not wanted to bother you. He was just pointing some guidelines you should know. Regards. -- Iago Rubio From arjan at infradead.org Thu Mar 3 12:35:03 2005 From: arjan at infradead.org (Arjan van de Ven) Date: Thu, 03 Mar 2005 13:35:03 +0100 Subject: Intel Pro Wireless cards In-Reply-To: <422702C5.5090507@snowmoon.com> References: <4223505B.20402@snowmoon.com> <4223CFA8.2000308@insitesinc.com> <1109819951.4045.11.camel@trevally.redfishdemo.com> <422698F3.7090201@snowmoon.com> <20050303075523.GA21380@chrys.ms.mff.cuni.cz> <422702C5.5090507@snowmoon.com> Message-ID: <1109853304.9988.13.camel@laptopd505.fenrus.org> > I just think that someone with the appropriate level of knowledge should > review the license to see if will truly prevent redistribution of the > software. Based on my reading of the license it does stop copying and > it's license clauses are no more burdensom than the GPL in their > requirements. last time I looked the license was different for end users and "os distributors". The end user one was as you describe, but the other one needed special permission. From selinux at gmail.com Sun Mar 6 20:48:19 2005 From: selinux at gmail.com (Tom London) Date: Sun, 6 Mar 2005 12:48:19 -0800 Subject: rawhide report: 20050306 changes In-Reply-To: <1110135643.22897.22.camel@animal.passback.co.uk> References: <200503061310.j26DAZBt004953@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <5cf776b805030605286144813a@mail.gmail.com> <1110117636.25575.14.camel@rousalka.dyndns.org> <1110134369.4108.7.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1110135643.22897.22.camel@animal.passback.co.uk> Message-ID: <4c4ba153050306124862e13e7d@mail.gmail.com> On Sun, 06 Mar 2005 19:00:43 +0000, Keith Sharp wrote: > On Sun, 2005-03-06 at 18:39 +0000, David Woodhouse wrote: > When I was running Caolans builds previously I found that you needed to > have the correct gnome-vfs version or you got a crash on every file > access. The error was quite obvious if you ran the app from the command > line. > > Dunno if this is of any help... > > Keith. I made this work by 'yum install'-ing the seperate package 'openoffice.org-writer'. oowriter (and the gnome icon) now works. Also 'yum install openoffice.org-impress', but ooimpress still dies and asks for 'crash_report'. openoffice.org-calc seems not to have been rebuilt for latest openoffice.org-core. Guessing the new packages should have all installed automagically, but package/dependency issue of some sort is being worked out.... tom -- Tom London From remco at beryllium.net Sun Mar 6 21:36:20 2005 From: remco at beryllium.net (Remco Poelstra) Date: Sun, 06 Mar 2005 22:36:20 +0100 Subject: Printing system proposal Message-ID: <422B77D4.9010408@beryllium.net> Hi, It's very quiet on this list about printing, so I thought it would be a nice idea to put forward a proposal. I don't know if there are internal redhat discussions about this subject, but I think I'll find out soon :). It's a rahter lengthy explanation with a diagram so I put it up here: www.beryllium.net/~remco/printingproposal.html Kind regards, Remco Poelstra From jspaleta at gmail.com Sun Mar 6 22:06:47 2005 From: jspaleta at gmail.com (Jeff Spaleta) Date: Sun, 6 Mar 2005 17:06:47 -0500 Subject: Printing system proposal In-Reply-To: <422B77D4.9010408@beryllium.net> References: <422B77D4.9010408@beryllium.net> Message-ID: <604aa791050306140651612405@mail.gmail.com> On Sun, 06 Mar 2005 22:36:20 +0100, Remco Poelstra wrote: > Hi, > > It's very quiet on this list about printing, look back in the archives.. there is a thread started on feb 1st Subject: system-config-printer. -jef From remco at beryllium.net Sun Mar 6 22:23:52 2005 From: remco at beryllium.net (Remco Poelstra) Date: Sun, 06 Mar 2005 23:23:52 +0100 Subject: Printing system proposal In-Reply-To: <604aa791050306140651612405@mail.gmail.com> References: <422B77D4.9010408@beryllium.net> <604aa791050306140651612405@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <422B82F8.5050000@beryllium.net> Jeff Spaleta wrote: > look back in the archives.. there is a thread started on feb 1st > Subject: system-config-printer. A thread a month ago, with no real results (as far as I can judge) is not really something I call 'active'. Remco Poelstra From jspaleta at gmail.com Sun Mar 6 23:09:09 2005 From: jspaleta at gmail.com (Jeff Spaleta) Date: Sun, 6 Mar 2005 18:09:09 -0500 Subject: Printing system proposal In-Reply-To: <422B82F8.5050000@beryllium.net> References: <422B77D4.9010408@beryllium.net> <604aa791050306140651612405@mail.gmail.com> <422B82F8.5050000@beryllium.net> Message-ID: <604aa7910503061509567ac811@mail.gmail.com> On Sun, 06 Mar 2005 23:23:52 +0100, Remco Poelstra wrote: > A thread a month ago, with no real results (as far as I can judge) is > not really something I call 'active'. i'm just making sure you have read it... as a reference. You wanted to have an understanding of what red hat internal discussion was.... that thread is probably the best discussion to-date on this list concerning printing configuration and was conducted primarily among red hat developers who are spending some effort on the issue. More likely than not more discussion relating to that thread has continued between tim and john elsewhere, since tim gave every indication that he was seeking input on something he was 'actively' working on the issue of replacing s-c-printer. John's posts in the thread detailing how desktop printing confuration is currently handled seems particularly relevant to your proposal... so i wanted to make sure you have read it.. so that you would be better prepared to talk specifics with the specific red hat developers. -jef"give me an R. give me an E. give me a S. give me an E. give me an A. give me an R. give me a C. give me an H. What's that spell!"spaleta From mattdm at mattdm.org Sun Mar 6 23:34:04 2005 From: mattdm at mattdm.org (Matthew Miller) Date: Sun, 6 Mar 2005 18:34:04 -0500 Subject: Follow-up - kernel.src Issue In-Reply-To: <1109951279.9166.19.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> References: <1109951279.9166.19.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> Message-ID: <20050306233404.GA28064@jadzia.bu.edu> On Fri, Mar 04, 2005 at 10:47:58AM -0500, David Cary Hart wrote: > Correct me if I am wrong but this new format allows for creating a > custom FC kernel only by text editing the config files which (IMO) is a > VERY bad idea. Without "make config" it is possible to select > conflicting options or to omit dependent options. Okay, you're wrong. The Fedora kernels did nothing to patch out the configuration tools. You can use "make config" to your heart's content. -- Matthew Miller mattdm at mattdm.org Boston University Linux ------> From mattdm at mattdm.org Sun Mar 6 23:40:19 2005 From: mattdm at mattdm.org (Matthew Miller) Date: Sun, 6 Mar 2005 18:40:19 -0500 Subject: What users want... In-Reply-To: <42289328.6040707@redhat.com> References: <42289328.6040707@redhat.com> Message-ID: <20050306234019.GB28064@jadzia.bu.edu> On Fri, Mar 04, 2005 at 05:56:08PM +0100, Harald Hoyer wrote: > 2004 LinuxQuestions.org Members Choice Award Winners Announced ^^^^ [...] > Open Source Game of the Year - Frozen Bubble (25.52%) Wow, givien that Frozen Bubble -- nice game that it is -- hasn't had a new release since 1.0.0 in February 2003, that's kind of a sad statement on open source games. -- Matthew Miller mattdm at mattdm.org Boston University Linux ------> From rodd at clarkson.id.au Mon Mar 7 00:41:09 2005 From: rodd at clarkson.id.au (Rodd Clarkson) Date: Mon, 07 Mar 2005 11:41:09 +1100 Subject: Including OO templates in fc4 In-Reply-To: <604aa7910503061109513ce8de@mail.gmail.com> References: <1110035299.6541.24.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1110037746.1479.29.camel@jdub.homelinux.org> <1110045050.6541.27.camel@localhost.localdomain> <604aa79105030513513e62e5ce@mail.gmail.com> <1110061873.29024.17.camel@goose> <604aa79105030514445430da86@mail.gmail.com> <1110135473.3440.7.camel@localhost.localdomain> <604aa7910503061109513ce8de@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1110156069.3687.4.camel@trevally.redfishdemo.com> On Sun, 2005-03-06 at 14:09 -0500, Jeff Spaleta wrote: > On Sun, 06 Mar 2005 19:57:53 +0100, Kyrre Ness Sjobak > wrote: > > Maybe not more than five or so. But *some*. > > Does upstream oo.org builds include any templates? How about you work > upstream and get 5 GOOD templates for oo.org into the upstream > defaults for oo.org that would be available in all oo.org builds for > all of oo.org's supported operating systems. I'm sory, but what a bollocks of an argument. By this same reasoning, Redhat and Fedora would never have fooled with the menu layout for Gnome because what's good enough from upstream is good enough for RH/Fedora There are plenty of packages that RH/Fedora change to meet the specific needs of their distro. Another example is the exclusion of gnome-desktop-backgrounds which seems to be very much like you suggest that Fedora should be doing with backgrounds. Gnome-desktop-backgrounds is officially part of gnome-2.10 so why isn't Fedora shipping it. It's good enough for upstream. So lets not argue that because OOo doesn't ship templates, Fedora shouldn't because history speaks otherwise. If you don't want templates included then just say it. Sorry if this seems a little rude. ;-] Rodd From jspaleta at gmail.com Mon Mar 7 00:42:12 2005 From: jspaleta at gmail.com (Jeff Spaleta) Date: Sun, 6 Mar 2005 19:42:12 -0500 Subject: What users want... In-Reply-To: <20050306234019.GB28064@jadzia.bu.edu> References: <42289328.6040707@redhat.com> <20050306234019.GB28064@jadzia.bu.edu> Message-ID: <604aa791050306164216d72058@mail.gmail.com> On Sun, 6 Mar 2005 18:40:19 -0500, Matthew Miller wrote: > Wow, givien that Frozen Bubble -- nice game that it is -- hasn't had a new > release since 1.0.0 in February 2003, that's kind of a sad statement on open > source games. or its a sad statement about the cross-section of users who actually responded/created the poll. If you actually take the time to read the whole thread at linuxquestions you will see several interesting games mentioned for inclusion into the poll that were not added for voting. You need to take this sort of poll with a grain of salt... a grain the size of a dump truck. You can not make a strong statement using the result of this poll... all you can say is that a majority of people who felt like voting from within the community of registered linuxquestions users chose frozen-bubble out of the available poll choices. The poll choices were not a best-of-breed selection by any rational measure. The list of available poll choices has the quality of a slashdot poll... its a complete throw away poll. If you take this poll or the results of this poll seriously... you probably read theonion and consider it real news. There were only 764 people who voted in that category, I wouldn't exactly call that number representative of even the linuxquestions user community and i definitely wouldn't even begin to suggest that 764 people represent the open source community at large. -jef"goes back to playing trigger.. with one of today's randomly generated terrain maps"spaleta From rodd at clarkson.id.au Mon Mar 7 00:42:55 2005 From: rodd at clarkson.id.au (Rodd Clarkson) Date: Mon, 07 Mar 2005 11:42:55 +1100 Subject: What users want... In-Reply-To: <20050306234019.GB28064@jadzia.bu.edu> References: <42289328.6040707@redhat.com> <20050306234019.GB28064@jadzia.bu.edu> Message-ID: <1110156175.3687.6.camel@trevally.redfishdemo.com> On Sun, 2005-03-06 at 18:40 -0500, Matthew Miller wrote: > On Fri, Mar 04, 2005 at 05:56:08PM +0100, Harald Hoyer wrote: > > 2004 LinuxQuestions.org Members Choice Award Winners Announced > ^^^^ > [...] > > Open Source Game of the Year - Frozen Bubble (25.52%) > > Wow, givien that Frozen Bubble -- nice game that it is -- hasn't had a new > release since 1.0.0 in February 2003, that's kind of a sad statement on open > source games. Or maybe it's an indication of how seriously open source developers take a 1.0.0 release ;-] If it's not ready, then don't say it is... Rodd From rodd at clarkson.id.au Mon Mar 7 00:49:08 2005 From: rodd at clarkson.id.au (Rodd Clarkson) Date: Mon, 07 Mar 2005 11:49:08 +1100 Subject: Intel Pro Wireless cards In-Reply-To: <1109893535.15096.9.camel@trevally.redfishdemo.com> References: <4223505B.20402@snowmoon.com> <1109612007.14468.7.camel@dcbw.boston.redhat.com> <1109724106.3724.19.camel@trevally.redfishdemo.com> <20050302005919.GF2421@stanford.edu> <1109730582.3599.4.camel@trevally.redfishdemo.com> <20050302023140.GA7955@redhat.com> <1109893535.15096.9.camel@trevally.redfishdemo.com> Message-ID: <1110156549.3687.10.camel@trevally.redfishdemo.com> > Noted that 'strings ipw2200.ko | less' on kernel-2.6.11-1.1166_FC4 now > shows: > > <6>ipw2200: Intel(R) PRO/Wireless 2200/2915 Network Driver, 1.0.0 > > so I think it's time to say, "Thank you very much." Just a quick question. Was there a reason why the ipw2200 drivers weren't updated to 1.0.1, instead of 1.0.0? A look at a changes from 1.0.0 to 1.0.1 seem worthwhile and it was released on Feb 08, 05 so should be well tested. Fixed #559: iwconfig rate support (thanks to Florian Hackenberger) NOTE: Configuring a subset of rates that excludes mandatory rates by your AP may result in not being able to associate with your AP. * Improved link signal quality calculation (thanks to Bill Moss) * Added additional debug output during scan to dump all 16 bits of capability field to IEEE80211_DL_SCAN output * Added support for Intel PRO/Wireless 2225BG Network Connection adapter * Removed trailing whitespace on lines in code (thanks to Henrik Brix Andersen) * Yanked script trace (-x) from helper scripts (thanks to Henrik Brix Andersen) * Fixed a problem with sensitivity threshold during association (thanks to Raphael Slinckx for troubleshooting with me on IRC for three days) * Added iwpriv for turning forcing long preamble support: iwpriv eth1 set_preamble 1|0 * Possible fixes for #542 and #377 support for short preamble * Fixed #563 compilation warning on 2.6.11-rc2 (thanks to Henrik Brix Andersen) * Fixed locked BSSID reporting channel number (thanks to Pedro Ramalhais) * Fixed type-o with scan watchdog timeout message (thanks to Pedro Ramalhais) * Changed logic for displaying get_mode output so the code is easier to follow (thanks to Pedro Ramalhais) * Added initial support for WPA (thanks to Yi Zhu) -- tested with wpa_supplicant (either tip w/ ipw driver, or with -Dipw2100) with both CCMP and TKIP * Fixed problem with CCMP not working due to uninitialized 802.11 header fields (thanks to Pedro Ramalhais) * Fixed unload script to unload the ieee80211 modules in the correct order R. From jspaleta at gmail.com Mon Mar 7 01:02:52 2005 From: jspaleta at gmail.com (Jeff Spaleta) Date: Sun, 6 Mar 2005 20:02:52 -0500 Subject: Including OO templates in fc4 In-Reply-To: <1110156069.3687.4.camel@trevally.redfishdemo.com> References: <1110035299.6541.24.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1110037746.1479.29.camel@jdub.homelinux.org> <1110045050.6541.27.camel@localhost.localdomain> <604aa79105030513513e62e5ce@mail.gmail.com> <1110061873.29024.17.camel@goose> <604aa79105030514445430da86@mail.gmail.com> <1110135473.3440.7.camel@localhost.localdomain> <604aa7910503061109513ce8de@mail.gmail.com> <1110156069.3687.4.camel@trevally.redfishdemo.com> Message-ID: <604aa791050306170219cdb01e@mail.gmail.com> On Mon, 07 Mar 2005 11:41:09 +1100, Rodd Clarkson wrote: > So lets not argue that because OOo doesn't ship templates, Fedora > shouldn't because history speaks otherwise. If you don't want templates > included then just say it. I want templates included in a way that actually makes sense for OOo. OOo's best feature is cross-platform development focus. If everyone things its a good idea to include a few default templates... those default templates should be available by default on ANY OOo install on ANY OS that OOo works on. This discussion is about user expectation compared to default functionality in applicions found in other operating system. Both MS and Apple products have been mentioned as a justification for the expectation that templates be available. I argue that the biggest expectation is that OOo operate in a cross-platform way. If you really care about users expactations for users who have experience using MS or Apple products.. you will move this discussion upstream to OOo so that users of OOo on MS and Apple systems can take advantage of the outcome of the discussion. This is not a fedora specific issue.. this is an upstream OOo project issue... one important enough to take upstream and discuss with upstream developers FIRST. The user expectations as described in arguments in this thread impact OOo on ALL operating systems that OOo supports. The first few default templates should be selected by OOo to set the baseline expectation as to what functionality OOo includes by default. This should not be something fedora users dictate to the rest of the OOo userbase simply because fedora was the first distro to include templates. OOo upstream needs a chance to select the default set of templates ALL OOo should expect to be installed. I do not believe that distributions should be including new default functionality into an application until after a discussion of that functionality has occured as part of upstream development, so that the project developers get a chance to describe what the new default functionality should look like. This is doubly critical for applications that have signficant cross-platform penetration like OOo. If you want to package templates in extras... fine... but if you want to start defining new default functionality inside OOo... go upstream and have the discussion there first... so OOo can have consistent default templates across all operating systems that OOo runs on.. so all users can expect the same OOo functionality no matter what underlying system OOo runs on. -jef From eric at snowmoon.com Mon Mar 7 01:03:13 2005 From: eric at snowmoon.com (Eric Warnke) Date: Sun, 06 Mar 2005 20:03:13 -0500 Subject: Intel Pro Wireless cards In-Reply-To: <1110156549.3687.10.camel@trevally.redfishdemo.com> References: <4223505B.20402@snowmoon.com> <1109612007.14468.7.camel@dcbw.boston.redhat.com> <1109724106.3724.19.camel@trevally.redfishdemo.com> <20050302005919.GF2421@stanford.edu> <1109730582.3599.4.camel@trevally.redfishdemo.com> <20050302023140.GA7955@redhat.com> <1109893535.15096.9.camel@trevally.redfishdemo.com> <1110156549.3687.10.camel@trevally.redfishdemo.com> Message-ID: <422BA851.8070301@snowmoon.com> Rodd Clarkson wrote: >>Noted that 'strings ipw2200.ko | less' on kernel-2.6.11-1.1166_FC4 now >>shows: >> >><6>ipw2200: Intel(R) PRO/Wireless 2200/2915 Network Driver, 1.0.0 >> >>so I think it's time to say, "Thank you very much." >> >> > >Just a quick question. Was there a reason why the ipw2200 drivers >weren't updated to 1.0.1, instead of 1.0.0? > > Probably becuase the odd ending number represnets a development driver, not stable. 1.0.2 will be the next stable release. Cheers, Eric -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 252 bytes Desc: OpenPGP digital signature URL: From rodd at clarkson.id.au Mon Mar 7 01:10:17 2005 From: rodd at clarkson.id.au (Rodd Clarkson) Date: Mon, 07 Mar 2005 12:10:17 +1100 Subject: Intel Pro Wireless cards In-Reply-To: <422BA851.8070301@snowmoon.com> References: <4223505B.20402@snowmoon.com> <1109612007.14468.7.camel@dcbw.boston.redhat.com> <1109724106.3724.19.camel@trevally.redfishdemo.com> <20050302005919.GF2421@stanford.edu> <1109730582.3599.4.camel@trevally.redfishdemo.com> <20050302023140.GA7955@redhat.com> <1109893535.15096.9.camel@trevally.redfishdemo.com> <1110156549.3687.10.camel@trevally.redfishdemo.com> <422BA851.8070301@snowmoon.com> Message-ID: <1110157817.3687.17.camel@trevally.redfishdemo.com> On Sun, 2005-03-06 at 20:03 -0500, Eric Warnke wrote: > >Just a quick question. Was there a reason why the ipw2200 drivers > >weren't updated to 1.0.1, instead of 1.0.0? > Probably becuase the odd ending number represnets a development driver, > not stable. 1.0.2 will be the next stable release. Ah, that's good answer. All these different version numbering schemes can get confusing (and I just assumed it was a little like gnome or the kernel). Rodd From otaylor at redhat.com Mon Mar 7 01:44:50 2005 From: otaylor at redhat.com (Owen Taylor) Date: Sun, 06 Mar 2005 20:44:50 -0500 Subject: Intel Pro Wireless cards In-Reply-To: <1110156549.3687.10.camel@trevally.redfishdemo.com> References: <4223505B.20402@snowmoon.com> <1109612007.14468.7.camel@dcbw.boston.redhat.com> <1109724106.3724.19.camel@trevally.redfishdemo.com> <20050302005919.GF2421@stanford.edu> <1109730582.3599.4.camel@trevally.redfishdemo.com> <20050302023140.GA7955@redhat.com> <1109893535.15096.9.camel@trevally.redfishdemo.com> <1110156549.3687.10.camel@trevally.redfishdemo.com> Message-ID: <422BB212.9030800@redhat.com> Rodd Clarkson wrote: >>Noted that 'strings ipw2200.ko | less' on kernel-2.6.11-1.1166_FC4 now >>shows: >> >><6>ipw2200: Intel(R) PRO/Wireless 2200/2915 Network Driver, 1.0.0 >> >>so I think it's time to say, "Thank you very much." > > > Just a quick question. Was there a reason why the ipw2200 drivers > weren't updated to 1.0.1, instead of 1.0.0? 1.0.1 is an unstable release. To quote ipw2200.sourceforge.net: Stable versions can be identified by the last digit of the version number being a 0 (zero). All other releases are development snapshots. Regards, Owen From hillview at paradise.net.nz Mon Mar 7 02:24:11 2005 From: hillview at paradise.net.nz (Ian Laurenson) Date: Mon, 07 Mar 2005 15:24:11 +1300 Subject: Including OO templates in fc4 In-Reply-To: <604aa791050306170219cdb01e@mail.gmail.com> References: <1110035299.6541.24.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1110037746.1479.29.camel@jdub.homelinux.org> <1110045050.6541.27.camel@localhost.localdomain> <604aa79105030513513e62e5ce@mail.gmail.com> <1110061873.29024.17.camel@goose> <604aa79105030514445430da86@mail.gmail.com> <1110135473.3440.7.camel@localhost.localdomain> <604aa7910503061109513ce8de@mail.gmail.com> <1110156069.3687.4.camel@trevally.redfishdemo.com> <604aa791050306170219cdb01e@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1110162251.2393.92.camel@localhost> On Mon, 2005-03-07 at 14:02, Jeff Spaleta wrote: [snip] > This is not a fedora specific issue.. this is an upstream OOo project > issue... one important enough to take upstream and discuss with > upstream developers FIRST. [snip] This discussion has been taken upstream to OpenOffice.org see: http://www.openoffice.org/servlets/ReadMsg?list=discuss&msgNo=47529 so I hope you Fedora Core developers don't mind my sharing some ideas here. I do not have any official position or responsibility within OpenOffice.org - simply a keen member of the community. I have been actively writing macros and documentation for OpenOffice.org. See: http://homepages.paradise.net.nz/hillview/OOo/ An initiative by Daniel Carrera has been to put together a package of templates, art and macros for OpenOffice.org. See: http://website.openoffice.org/tryouts/dcarrera/download/contribute.html While this is a reasonable stop-gap measure, I personally don't see it as a good long term solution. My proposed idea follows. Write a template and extension installer. This is being worked on at the moment and the expertise that you people could bring to this project would be of immense value. I have put together a first attempt at a wizard to help people select available templates and extensions, and at the click of a button download and install them. The draft wizard can be found here: http://qa.openoffice.org/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=43532 Part of this system is the ability for users to rate and review templates and extensions. Thus if the Fedora Core team wanted to include OpenOffice.org templates and extensions then they could use the rating and reviews and a basis for which ones to include. The idea has been positively received and expanded upon by J?rgen Schmidt a Sun employee as can seen here: http://api.openoffice.org/servlets/ReadMsg?list=dev&msgNo=12326 I look forward to your discussion and input to a template and extension installer for OpenOffice.org. Thanks, Ian Laurenson From fedora at darkpixel.com Mon Mar 7 05:07:49 2005 From: fedora at darkpixel.com (Aaron C. de Bruyn) Date: Sun, 6 Mar 2005 21:07:49 -0800 Subject: What users want... In-Reply-To: <42289328.6040707@redhat.com> References: <42289328.6040707@redhat.com> Message-ID: <200503062107.49427.fedora@darkpixel.com> On Friday 04 March 2005 08:56, Harald Hoyer wrote: > To give you an impression what users want and what maybe qualifies to being > in Core, if it is FOSS :) > > 2004 LinuxQuestions.org Members Choice Award Winners Announced > > Distribution of the Year - Slackware (19.36%) There was an ambulance agency on the west coast that needed to purchase a new vehicle. They wanted to pick a vehicle that was the most 'visible' on the road so people would see it and not run into them. They considered red, white, and even lime green vehicles. To come to a decision, they poured over insurance statistics to find out what color ambulance has been in the least number of wrecks. They picked the one color ambulance that had never been involved in an accident. Three weeks ago they took delivery of their brand-new black ambulance. It was promptly involved in an accident when someone backed into it...at night. Now the statistics can read that 100% of all black ambulances have been involved in an accident. Remember this: There are three types of lies; lies, damn lies, and statistics. Slackware just got the 'pity vote' because everyone thought Andrew was going to die. (It's a joke--laugh!) -- Aaron C. de Bruyn aaron at darkpixel.com From johnp at redhat.com Mon Mar 7 05:11:18 2005 From: johnp at redhat.com (John (J5) Palmieri) Date: Mon, 07 Mar 2005 00:11:18 -0500 Subject: Printing system proposal In-Reply-To: <604aa7910503061509567ac811@mail.gmail.com> References: <422B77D4.9010408@beryllium.net> <604aa791050306140651612405@mail.gmail.com> <422B82F8.5050000@beryllium.net> <604aa7910503061509567ac811@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1110172278.2451.100.camel@localhost.localdomain> On Sun, 2005-03-06 at 18:09, Jeff Spaleta wrote: > On Sun, 06 Mar 2005 23:23:52 +0100, Remco Poelstra wrote: > > A thread a month ago, with no real results (as far as I can judge) is > > not really something I call 'active'. > > i'm just making sure you have read it... as a reference. You wanted > to have an understanding of what red hat internal discussion was.... > that thread is probably the best discussion to-date on this list > concerning printing configuration and was conducted primarily among > red hat developers who are spending some effort on the issue. More > likely than not more discussion relating to that thread has continued > between tim and john elsewhere, since tim gave every indication that > he was seeking input on something he was 'actively' working on the > issue of replacing s-c-printer. > > John's posts in the thread detailing how desktop printing confuration > is currently handled seems particularly relevant to your proposal... > so i wanted to make sure you have read it.. so that you would be > better prepared to talk specifics with the specific red hat > developers. We would like to have input on how the printing system should work from outside developers but Jeff is right here. You need to understand how it currently works and what decisions have been made concerning the printing system. Having some design that does not take into account what has already been discussed is of no use to anyone. There have been numerous pitfalls I had run into in designing the current desktop auto configuration system in FC3 and have insight into what needs to be fixed which was somewhat reflected in the previous thread. One month is not a huge amount of time as I don't think everything will be fixed in the core 4 time frame. The core desktop team currently have been busy porting to the new dbus and hal api's. That is almost done and on our agenda is to get back to the printing issues. At that point I will look more closely at your proposal. BTW you need to illustrate the system/session split in your proposal. On an initial glance the flow looks wrong to me (things like you will never get cups accepting dbus commands directly). It needs to be more detailed. Thanks. -- J5 From nicolas.mailhot at laposte.net Mon Mar 7 08:42:48 2005 From: nicolas.mailhot at laposte.net (Nicolas Mailhot) Date: Mon, 7 Mar 2005 09:42:48 +0100 (CET) Subject: Including OO templates in fc4 In-Reply-To: <1110162251.2393.92.camel@localhost> References: <1110035299.6541.24.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1110037746.1479.29.camel@jdub.homelinux.org> <1110045050.6541.27.camel@localhost.localdomain> <604aa79105030513513e62e5ce@mail.gmail.com> <1110061873.29024.17.camel@goose> <604aa79105030514445430da86@mail.gmail.com> <1110135473.3440.7.camel@localhost.localdomain> <604aa7910503061109513ce8de@mail.gmail.com> <1110156069.3687.4.camel@trevally.redfishdemo.com> <604aa791050306170219cdb01e@mail.gmail.com> <1110162251.2393.92.camel@localhost> Message-ID: <16835.192.54.193.137.1110184968.squirrel@rousalka.dyndns.org> On Lun 7 mars 2005 3:24, Ian Laurenson a ?crit : > Write a template and extension installer. This is being worked on at the > moment and the expertise that you people could bring to this project > would be of immense value. I have put together a first attempt at a > wizard to help people select available templates and extensions, and at > the click of a button download and install them. The draft wizard can be > found here: > http://qa.openoffice.org/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=43532 > > Part of this system is the ability for users to rate and review > templates and extensions. Thus if the Fedora Core team wanted to include > OpenOffice.org templates and extensions then they could use the rating > and reviews and a basis for which ones to include. Please don't. I can understand lots of other OSs have big problems distributing stuff but Linux distributions haven't. Modern Linux distributions are all package-based. On a package-based system any stuff not installed via the native packaging system is a cause of much annoyance and grief. I could write you a long list of other "extension" auto-download systems that are already hated on FC (CPAN, Maven, emacs/xemacs, firefox extensions, etc...) Please focus on making good themes available. People will take care of the rest. As the firefox example showed not only auto-download systems are useless but they actually cause big problems because stuff is not installable in a normal way without human intervention anymore (among other things - I won't went all my frustration with them here) I know for developpers types hacking another system is much more fun than producing booring stuff like templates. In this case I'm pretty sure a lot of people would prefer you fix something else in openoffice.org instead of inflicting yet another auto-downloader/installer on us. Regards, -- Nicolas Mailhot From nicu_fedora at nicubunu.ro Mon Mar 7 11:20:57 2005 From: nicu_fedora at nicubunu.ro (Nicu Buculei) Date: Mon, 07 Mar 2005 13:20:57 +0200 Subject: Including OO templates in fc4 In-Reply-To: <422C33B3.8000107@apsro.com> References: <422C33B3.8000107@apsro.com> Message-ID: <422C3919.4000408@nicubunu.ro> Ian Laurenson wrote: > > I do not have any official position or responsibility within > OpenOffice.org - simply a keen member of the community. I have been > actively writing macros and documentation for OpenOffice.org. See: > http://homepages.paradise.net.nz/hillview/OOo/ my position inside OpenOffice.org is very small (co-lead of a Native Language project) but i believe i can offer a valuable view > An initiative by Daniel Carrera has been to put together a package of > templates, art and macros for OpenOffice.org. See: > http://website.openoffice.org/tryouts/dcarrera/download/contribute.html at the time, i tried to help Daniel in pushing his package but without great success. this theme, of including extras in OOo to put it at least on the same level with Star Office, appear periodically, have many supporters in the community, but does not get to any real results. > While this is a reasonable stop-gap measure, I personally don't see it > as a good long term solution. My proposed idea follows. > > Write a template and extension installer. This is being worked on at the > moment and the expertise that you people could bring to this project > would be of immense value. I have put together a first attempt at a > wizard to help people select available templates and extensions, and at > the click of a button download and install them. you mean something like the existing font installer and dictionary installer? Fedora has it's own package management and should use it because is better > I look forward to your discussion and input to a template and extension > installer for OpenOffice.org. i want to propose more: why not include also (in Extras, of course) a clipart package, based on the Open Clip Art Library (www.openclipart.org, in the soon to be announced new release we have around 2900 images) to increase the value added in the Fedora's OOo -- nicu From mbneto at gmail.com Mon Mar 7 12:01:31 2005 From: mbneto at gmail.com (mbneto) Date: Mon, 7 Mar 2005 08:01:31 -0400 Subject: Resolving dependencies (libcrypto.so.4...) Message-ID: <5cf776b8050307040161ed14f1@mail.gmail.com> Hi, I've been unable to upgrade to the latest packages with the same error messages: Error: Unable to satisfy dependencies Error: Package ntp needs libcrypto.so.4, this is not available. Error: Package libwvstreams needs libssl.so.4, this is not available. Error: Package pyOpenSSL needs libcrypto.so.4, this is not available. Error: Package dhcpv6_client needs libcrypto.so.4, this is not available. Error: Package stunnel needs libssl.so.4, this is not available. Error: Package openvpn needs libssl.so.4, this is not available. Error: Package nmap needs libcrypto.so.4, this is not available. Error: Package stunnel needs libcrypto.so.4, this is not available. Error: Package nmap needs libssl.so.4, this is not available. Error: Package desktop-printing needs libssl.so.4, this is not available. Error: Package lftp needs libssl.so.4, this is not available. Error: Package xmlsec1-openssl needs libssl.so.4, this is not available. Error: Package lftp needs libcrypto.so.4, this is not available. Error: Package perl-Crypt-SSLeay needs libcrypto.so.4, this is not available. Error: Package perl-Crypt-SSLeay needs libssl.so.4, this is not available. Error: Package xmlsec1-openssl needs libcrypto.so.4, this is not available. Error: Package ipsec-tools needs libcrypto.so.4, this is not available. Error: Package python needs libcrypto.so.4, this is not available. Error: Package python needs libssl.so.4, this is not available. Error: Package xine needs libssl.so.4, this is not available. Error: Package pam_ccreds needs libcrypto.so.4, this is not available. Error: Package desktop-printing needs libcrypto.so.4, this is not available. Error: Package xine needs libcrypto.so.4, this is not available. Error: Package pyOpenSSL needs libssl.so.4, this is not available. Error: Package openvpn needs libcrypto.so.4, this is not available. Error: Package libwvstreams needs libcrypto.so.4, this is not available. Any ideas of how can I bypass such restrictions ? - mb From buildsys at redhat.com Mon Mar 7 12:30:13 2005 From: buildsys at redhat.com (Build System) Date: Mon, 7 Mar 2005 07:30:13 -0500 Subject: rawhide report: 20050307 changes Message-ID: <200503071230.j27CUDcv003377@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> New package fonts-indic Free Indian truetype/opentype fonts New package ncurses4 A backwards compatible version of ncurses. Updated Packages: MyODBC-2.50.39-24 ----------------- * Sun Mar 06 2005 Tom Lane 2.50.39-24 - Rebuild with gcc4. MySQL-python-1.0.0-3 -------------------- * Sun Mar 06 2005 Tom Lane 1.0.0-3 - Rebuild with gcc4. anaconda-10.2.0.25-1 -------------------- * Sun Mar 06 2005 Peter Jones 10.2.0.25-1 - Empty blacklist in upgrade.py (notting, #142893) - Add new font package names (katzj) - Yet another fix of autopart with lvm (pjones) aspell-12:0.50.5-6 ------------------ * Mon Mar 07 2005 Ivana Varekova 12:0.05.5-6 - rebuilt * Thu Jan 13 2005 Adrian Havill 12:0.50.5-5 - added aspell-pt_BR to the obsoletes * Fri Nov 12 2004 Warren Togami 12:0.50.5-4 - rebuild expect-5.43.0-1 --------------- * Mon Mar 07 2005 Jens Petersen - 5.43.0-1 - run test make target by default - can be turned off with --without check * Sat Mar 05 2005 Robert Scheck - update to 5.43.0 (150369) - no longer need expect-5.39.0-64bit-82547.patch, expect-5.38.0-autopasswd-9917.patch and expect-5.42-mkpasswd-verbose-user-141454.patch - run aclocal and configure with current autoconf (116777) - buildrequire autoconf and automake instead of autoconf213 gaim-1:1.1.4-4 -------------- * Sun Mar 06 2005 Warren Togami 1:1.1.4-4 - 144: POSIX functions became macros, build fix (#150429) - 145: Fix non-proxy yahoo file transfer - 146: Fix non-proxy yahoo buddy icons * Fri Mar 04 2005 Warren Togami 1:1.1.4-3 - 143: Gadu Gadu protocol crash fix (#149984) gdk-pixbuf-1:0.22.0-17 ---------------------- * Mon Mar 07 2005 Matthias Clasen - 1:0.22.0-17 - Mark libraries as non-execstack glibc-2.3.4-14 -------------- * Sun Mar 06 2005 Roland McGrath 2.3.4-14 - fix bits/socket2.h macro typos gnome-icon-theme-2.9.91-2 ------------------------- * Mon Mar 07 2005 Matthias Clasen - 2.9.91-2 - Fix %post gnome-themes-2.9.95-2 --------------------- * Sun Mar 06 2005 Matthias Clasen - 2.9.95-2 - Fix %post script (#146661) kbd-1.12-7 ---------- * Sun Mar 06 2005 Miloslav Trmac - 1.12-7 - Don't run ldconfig - Don't strip executables kdeaddons-3.4.0-0.rc1.2 ----------------------- * Sun Mar 06 2005 Than Ngo 3.4.0-0.rc1.2 - rebuilt against gcc-4 * Tue Mar 01 2005 Than Ngo 3.4.0-0.rc1.1 - 3.4.0 rc1 * Wed Feb 16 2005 Than Ngo 3.3.92-0.1 - KDE 3.4 Beta2 kdebindings-3.4.0-0.rc1.2 ------------------------- * Sat Mar 05 2005 Than Ngo 3.4.0-0.rc1.2 - fix gcc4 build problem * Mon Feb 28 2005 Than Ngo 3.4.0-0.rc1.1 - KDE 3.4.0 rc1 * Tue Feb 22 2005 Than Ngo 3.3.92-0.1 - KDE 3.4 beta2 kernel-2.6.11-1.1176_FC4 ------------------------ * Sun Mar 06 2005 Dave Jones - Forward port some FC3 patches that got lost. libdbi-0.6.5-11 --------------- * Sun Mar 06 2005 Tom Lane 0.6.5-11 - Rebuild with gcc4. libgail-gnome-1.1.0-3 --------------------- * Sun Mar 06 2005 Matthias Clasen 1.1.0-3 - Add a BuildRequires for gnome-panel-devel (#137544) - Include the .pc file (#119742) macutils-2.0b3-32 ----------------- * Mon Mar 07 2005 Jindrich Novy 2.0b3-32 - fix inclusion of missing headers and duplicated extern declarations that caused problems with gcc4 - rebuilt with gcc4 mtx-1.2.18-8 ------------ * Mon Mar 07 2005 Jindrich Novy 1.2.18-8 - fix type confusion in SCSI_writet(), SCSI_readt(), slow_memcopy() and slow_bzero() - rebuilt with gcc4 mysql-4.1.10-3 -------------- * Sun Mar 06 2005 Tom Lane 4.1.10-3 - Fix package Requires: interdependencies. mysqlclient10-3.23.58-5 ----------------------- * Sun Mar 06 2005 Tom Lane 3.23.58-5 - Rebuild with gcc4. ncurses-5.4-16 -------------- * Sun Mar 06 2005 Petr Rockai - rebuild newt-0.51.6-7 ------------- * Sun Mar 06 2005 Petr Rockai - rebuild * Mon Nov 08 2004 Jeremy Katz - 0.51.6-6 - rebuild for python 2.4 * Fri Oct 15 2004 Adrian Havill 0.51.6-5 - only do gpmclose if gpmopen succeeed (#118530) redhat-artwork-0.120-8 ---------------------- * Sun Mar 06 2005 Matthias Clasen 0.120-8 - Fix %post script (#146560) unixODBC-2.2.10-3 ----------------- * Mon Mar 07 2005 Tom Lane 2.2.10-3 - Rebuild with gcc4. unzip-5.51-10 ------------- * Mon Mar 07 2005 Ivana Varekova 5.51-10 - rebuilt xorg-x11-6.8.2-7 ---------------- * Fri Mar 04 2005 Soeren Sandmann 6.8.2-7 - Fix crash on fonts with NULL bits (#145546) * Wed Mar 02 2005 Mike A. Harris 6.8.2-1.FC3.6test - Rebuild 6.8.2-6 as 6.8.2-1.FC3.6test for Fedora Core 3 testing release xterm-200-4 ----------- * Sun Mar 06 2005 Mike A. Harris 200-4 - Added libtermcap-devel and utempter to BuildRequires - Changed BuildRequires from XFree86-devel to xorg-x11-devel * Sun Mar 06 2005 Mike A. Harris 200-3 - Rebuild with gcc 4 for FC4 development zip-2.3-30 ---------- * Mon Mar 07 2005 Ivana Varekova 2.3-30 - rebuilt From acbk at zeelandnet.nl Mon Mar 7 13:19:29 2005 From: acbk at zeelandnet.nl (h.breimer) Date: Mon, 7 Mar 2005 14:19:29 +0100 Subject: Resolving dependencies (libcrypto.so.4...) In-Reply-To: <5cf776b8050307040161ed14f1@mail.gmail.com> References: <5cf776b8050307040161ed14f1@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20050307141929.3b90e101.acbk@zeelandnet.nl> On Mon, 7 Mar 2005 08:01:31 -0400 mbneto wrote: > Hi, > > I've been unable to upgrade to the latest packages with the same error > messages: Error: Unable to satisfy dependencies > Error: Package ntp needs libcrypto.so.4, this is not available. > Error: Package libwvstreams needs libssl.so.4, this is not available. > Error: Package pyOpenSSL needs libcrypto.so.4, this is not available. > Error: Package dhcpv6_client needs libcrypto.so.4, this is not > Any ideas of how can I bypass such restrictions ? > > - mb > I downloaded openssl-0.9.7e-3 from the development tree rpm -i openssl-0.9.7e-3 Now I had both the lib...so.4 and the ...so.5 libs in my box. Yum update did its work after this. Remember to rpm -e openssl-0.9.7a-46 later when all packages are over to the new version. Enjoy the bumpy ride and avoid the baby-eating horror-gurus! success! Henk From rat at mujmail.cz Mon Mar 7 14:53:39 2005 From: rat at mujmail.cz (RAT) Date: Mon, 07 Mar 2005 15:53:39 +0100 Subject: Error: missing dep: libgtkhtml-3.1.so.11 Message-ID: <1110207219.7848.3.camel@localhost.localdomain> I'm trying to update gnome and evolution from devel branch but I'm facing this dependecy problem Error: missing dep: libgtkhtml-3.1.so.11 Seems like this library is not included in the devel branch. -- RAT From tvujec at redhat.com Mon Mar 7 14:09:40 2005 From: tvujec at redhat.com (Tomislav Vujec) Date: Mon, 07 Mar 2005 15:09:40 +0100 Subject: Intel Pro Wireless cards References: <4223505B.20402@snowmoon.com> <1109612007.14468.7.camel@dcbw.boston.redhat.com> <1109724106.3724.19.camel@trevally.redfishdemo.com> <20050302005919.GF2421@stanford.edu> <1109730582.3599.4.camel@trevally.redfishdemo.com> <20050302023140.GA7955@redhat.com> <1109893535.15096.9.camel@trevally.redfishdemo.com> <1110156549.3687.10.camel@trevally.redfishdemo.com> Message-ID: On Mon, 07 Mar 2005 11:49:08 +1100, Rodd Clarkson wrote: > A look at a changes from 1.0.0 to 1.0.1 seem worthwhile and it was > released on Feb 08, 05 so should be well tested. Although 1.0.1 has a number of bug fixes, it also contains a number of uncompleted new features, and it is considered unstable. The next stable will be 1.1.0. I hate this version scheme, but it's not under my influence. However, 1.0.1 is the first release supporting WPA, but it breaks a lot of stuff for people using NetworkManager to connect wireless on less then ideal link quality. Regards, Tomislav From rjune at bravegnuworld.com Mon Mar 7 14:51:33 2005 From: rjune at bravegnuworld.com (Richard June) Date: Mon, 7 Mar 2005 09:51:33 -0500 Subject: Including OO templates in fc4 In-Reply-To: <422C3919.4000408@nicubunu.ro> References: <422C33B3.8000107@apsro.com> <422C3919.4000408@nicubunu.ro> Message-ID: <200503070951.36472.rjune@bravegnuworld.com> [snip] > i want to propose more: why not include also (in Extras, of course) a > clipart package, based on the Open Clip Art Library > (www.openclipart.org, in the soon to be announced new release we have > around 2900 images) to increase the value added in the Fedora's OOo I've already created a package based on the open clipart stuff http://kc.lumensoftware.com/~rjune/clipart/openclipart.rpm I'll post the srpm later, just as soon as I've found it. -- Public Key available Here: http://www.bravegnuworld.com/~rjune/pubkey.asc -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: not available URL: From ph18 at cornell.edu Mon Mar 7 15:14:35 2005 From: ph18 at cornell.edu (Paul A. Houle) Date: Mon, 07 Mar 2005 10:14:35 -0500 Subject: 64bit clean AMD64? In-Reply-To: <200503042108.35646.loony@loonybin.org> References: <200503042108.35646.loony@loonybin.org> Message-ID: On Fri, 4 Mar 2005 21:08:35 -0500, Peter Arremann wrote: > > What is the future direction on this? When I look at OSF/1 or the IA64 > bit > versions of most Linux distributions I get jealous on how clean their > environment is... For most server environments, 32bit versions of > libraries > you don't need are just clutter... > Funny enough, many operating system for Ultrasparc (both Solaris and Debian Linux) decide to run a 32-bit userspace under a 64-bit kernel. I think things are different with SPARC than with AMD64; AMD64 not only widens registers, but it adds more registers. Some things run faster in 64-bit mode in AMD64. On the other hand, applications that handle a lot of pointers will bulk up substantially in 64-bit mode: 32-bit binaries will lose less RAM. If you're running, say, mod_perl, under Apache prefork, or even a Java system that burns a lot of RAM, you might be better off running in 32-bit mode than 64-bit mode. From dr at cluenet.de Mon Mar 7 16:53:36 2005 From: dr at cluenet.de (Daniel Roesen) Date: Mon, 7 Mar 2005 17:53:36 +0100 Subject: Including OO templates in fc4 In-Reply-To: <1110058010.6966.3.camel@rousalka.dyndns.org> References: <1110035299.6541.24.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1110037746.1479.29.camel@jdub.homelinux.org> <1110045050.6541.27.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1110056411.29024.4.camel@goose> <1110058010.6966.3.camel@rousalka.dyndns.org> Message-ID: <20050307165336.GA22144@srv01.cluenet.de> On Sat, Mar 05, 2005 at 10:26:49PM +0100, Nicolas Mailhot wrote: > I agree a few carefully selected templates belong in core (maybe only > one that uses fedora colors;) - don't underestimate the marketing value > of this kind of stuff) but the bulk of them is clearly extras material. Actually, the bulk of them are straight for the trashcan. Especially the OOImpress templates. Regards, Daniel -- CLUE-RIPE -- Jabber: dr at cluenet.de -- dr at IRCnet -- PGP: 0xA85C8AA0 From mihamina at mail.rktmb.org Mon Mar 7 17:37:09 2005 From: mihamina at mail.rktmb.org (Rakotomandimby (R12y) Mihamina) Date: Mon, 07 Mar 2005 18:37:09 +0100 Subject: ices spec request for comment. Message-ID: <1110217030.5150.24.camel@fctmp> Hello, I'm new to the list :-) I looked for an Ices2 package for Fedora but did not find. So i decided to just look for some spec file and then try to deal with it... I found some interesting and simple spec files here: http://www.livna.org/~anvil/fedora/spec/ Do you know this repository? what's you opinion about the quality of the spec files it has? I would like you comments on how I modify the Ices spec file to suit my use (I dont check out Ices from CVS). May be there is some modification to optimize it? You can find my spec file attached. -- ASPO Infog?rance http://aspo.rktmb.org/activites/infogerance Unofficial FAQ fcolc http://faq.fcolc.eu.org/ LUG sur Orl?ans et alentours (France). T?l : 02 34 08 26 04 / 06 33 26 13 14 -------------- next part -------------- Summary: Primary source client for icecast 2.0. Name: ices Version: 2.0.1 Release: 1.FC3 Epoch: 0 License: GPL Group: Applications/Multimedia URL: http://www.icecast.org/ Source0: %{name}-%{version}.tar.gz BuildRoot: %{_tmppath}/%{name}-%{version}-%{release}-buildroot BuildRequires: autoconf automake libtool BuildRequires: libvorbis-devel libshout-devel libxml2-devel # ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- %description Primary source client for icecast 2.0. # ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- %prep %setup # #rm -f m4/shout.m4 #aclocal -I m4 #autoheader #libtoolize --automake #automake -a #autoconf # # ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- %build %configure make %{?_smp_mflags} # %{__mv} -f %{buildroot}/usr/share/ices/* %{buildroot}%{_docdir}/%{name}-%{version}/ # ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- %install %makeinstall # ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- %clean rm -rf $RPM_BUILD_ROOT # ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- %files %defattr(-,root,root,-) %doc AUTHORS COPYING README TODO conf/*.xml %doc /usr/share/ices/* %{_bindir}/%{name} # ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- %changelog * Wed May 28 2003 Dams 0:2.0-0.fdr.0.1.cvs20030528 - Updated cvs snapshot and rebuilt - No longer need the patch * Mon May 26 2003 Dams - Initial build. From fedora at wir-sind-cool.org Mon Mar 7 17:47:08 2005 From: fedora at wir-sind-cool.org (Michael Schwendt) Date: Mon, 7 Mar 2005 18:47:08 +0100 Subject: ices spec request for comment. In-Reply-To: <1110217030.5150.24.camel@fctmp> References: <1110217030.5150.24.camel@fctmp> Message-ID: <20050307184708.52fd2f02.fedora@wir-sind-cool.org> On Mon, 07 Mar 2005 18:37:09 +0100, Rakotomandimby (R12y) Mihamina wrote: > Hello, > I'm new to the list :-) > > I looked for an Ices2 package for Fedora but did not find. > So i decided to just look for some spec file and then try to deal with > it... > I found some interesting and simple spec files here: > http://www.livna.org/~anvil/fedora/spec/ > > Do you know this repository? what's you opinion about the quality of the > spec files it has? That's private web space. But in case you meant to refer to http://rpm.livna.org instead, it's a community project. If you disagree with anything in the published packages, submit a bug report at http://bugzilla.livna.org From ivazquez at ivazquez.net Mon Mar 7 18:00:13 2005 From: ivazquez at ivazquez.net (Ignacio Vazquez-Abrams) Date: Mon, 07 Mar 2005 13:00:13 -0500 Subject: ices spec request for comment. In-Reply-To: <1110217030.5150.24.camel@fctmp> References: <1110217030.5150.24.camel@fctmp> Message-ID: <1110218413.8441.10.camel@ignacio.ignacio.lan> On Mon, 2005-03-07 at 18:37 +0100, Rakotomandimby (R12y) Mihamina wrote: > I looked for an Ices2 package for Fedora but did not find. I adapted it from the Mandrake package. http://fedora.ivazquez.net/yum/3/i386/RPMS.ivazquez/ices-2.0.1-0.iva.0.i386.rpm http://fedora.ivazquez.net/yum/3/i386/SRPMS.ivazquez/ices-2.0.1-0.iva.0.src.rpm -- Ignacio Vazquez-Abrams http://fedora.ivazquez.net/ -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part URL: From dr at cluenet.de Mon Mar 7 18:03:49 2005 From: dr at cluenet.de (Daniel Roesen) Date: Mon, 7 Mar 2005 19:03:49 +0100 Subject: Proposal: swap epic for irssi In-Reply-To: <1106157742.6970.439.camel@serendipity.dogma.lan> References: <1106022929.6105.106.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1106157742.6970.439.camel@serendipity.dogma.lan> Message-ID: <20050307180349.GB22144@srv01.cluenet.de> On Wed, Jan 19, 2005 at 07:02:23PM +0100, Alexander Dalloz wrote: > > For FC-4, what would folk think about removing epic and replacing it > > with irssi in Core? > > > > irssi currently sits in Extras, and we could very likely just move epic > > to Extras after the swap. > > I think this is a good idea as there are certainly much more irssi users > than epic fans. irssi is actively developed and has powerful features > like the proxy ability. Agreed. Regards, Daniel -- CLUE-RIPE -- Jabber: dr at cluenet.de -- dr at IRCnet -- PGP: 0xA85C8AA0 From rahulsundaram at yahoo.co.in Mon Mar 7 18:09:46 2005 From: rahulsundaram at yahoo.co.in (Rahul Sundaram) Date: Mon, 7 Mar 2005 10:09:46 -0800 (PST) Subject: Including OO templates in fc4 In-Reply-To: <1110156069.3687.4.camel@trevally.redfishdemo.com> Message-ID: <20050307180946.58187.qmail@web8508.mail.in.yahoo.com> Hi > I'm sory, but what a bollocks of an argument. no. its not > > By this same reasoning, Redhat and Fedora would > never have fooled with > the menu layout for Gnome because what's good enough > from upstream is > good enough for RH/Fedora actually the rules have changed. fedora has the upstream mantra while redhat linux usually backported security and bug fixes and generally acting more of a middleman > Gnome-desktop-backgrounds > is officially part of gnome-2.10 so why isn't Fedora > shipping it. It's > good enough for upstream. good question. can any of the gnome developers in here answer that and how about gnome system tools too > > So lets not argue that because OOo doesn't ship > templates, Fedora > shouldn't because history speaks otherwise. much of the history doesnt apply to fedora ===== Regards Rahul Sundaram __________________________________ Celebrate Yahoo!'s 10th Birthday! Yahoo! Netrospective: 100 Moments of the Web http://birthday.yahoo.com/netrospective/ From hillview at paradise.net.nz Mon Mar 7 21:32:36 2005 From: hillview at paradise.net.nz (Ian Laurenson) Date: Tue, 08 Mar 2005 10:32:36 +1300 Subject: Including OO templates in fc4 In-Reply-To: <16835.192.54.193.137.1110184968.squirrel@rousalka.dyndns.org> References: <1110035299.6541.24.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1110037746.1479.29.camel@jdub.homelinux.org> <1110045050.6541.27.camel@localhost.localdomain> <604aa79105030513513e62e5ce@mail.gmail.com> <1110061873.29024.17.camel@goose> <604aa79105030514445430da86@mail.gmail.com> <1110135473.3440.7.camel@localhost.localdomain> <604aa7910503061109513ce8de@mail.gmail.com> <1110156069.3687.4.camel@trevally.redfishdemo.com> <604aa791050306170219cdb01e@mail.gmail.com> <1110162251.2393.92.camel@localhost> <16835.192.54.193.137.1110184968.squirrel@rousalka.dyndns.org> Message-ID: <1110231156.2387.51.camel@localhost> Reply in-line. On Mon, 2005-03-07 at 21:42, Nicolas Mailhot wrote: > On Lun 7 mars 2005 3:24, Ian Laurenson a ?crit : > > > Write a template and extension installer. This is being worked on at the > > moment and the expertise that you people could bring to this project > > would be of immense value. I have put together a first attempt at a > > wizard to help people select available templates and extensions, and at > > the click of a button download and install them. The draft wizard can be > > found here: > > http://qa.openoffice.org/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=43532 > > > > Part of this system is the ability for users to rate and review > > templates and extensions. Thus if the Fedora Core team wanted to include > > OpenOffice.org templates and extensions then they could use the rating > > and reviews and a basis for which ones to include. > > > Please don't. I can understand lots of other OSs have big problems > distributing stuff but Linux distributions haven't. Modern Linux > distributions are all package-based. On a package-based system any stuff > not installed via the native packaging system is a cause of much annoyance > and grief. I could write you a long list of other "extension" > auto-download systems that are already hated on FC (CPAN, Maven, > emacs/xemacs, firefox extensions, etc...) > OpenOffice.org already has a package installation "feature". In OpenOffice.org 1.1.x a UNO package needed to be placed in a folder called uno_packages and a separate program run called pkgchk without Openoffice.org running. In 1.9.x the ability to install UNO packages while OpenOffice.org is still running has been introduced (Tools > Package Manager...). The most common request that I receive is for a system that makes it easy for people to select, download and install OpenOffice.org extensions - and thus my interest in it. While RPM may be the best solution for RPM based Linux distributions, what about non RPM based systems? On an RPM based system how would I go about making an RPM package for an OpenOffice.org UNO package? Is there a way that users can have the best of both worlds? For those that are using an RPM based system that they can use both RPM based OpenOffice.org extensions or the OpenOffice.org UNO package installer and that the appropriate registrations are occurring as required for both systems. My rationale for replying to this thread was to suggest a system on which a decision could be made for which templates / extensions should be included in fc4. That this system is in its very early stages and, as your email points out, the expertise of the fc developers would be of immense value so that we don't inadvertently create headaches for other package management systems. > Please focus on making good themes available. People will take care of the > rest. As the firefox example showed not only auto-download systems are > useless but they actually cause big problems because stuff is not > installable in a normal way without human intervention anymore (among > other things - I won't went all my frustration with them here) > > I know for developpers types hacking another system is much more fun than > producing booring stuff like templates. In this case I'm pretty sure a lot > of people would prefer you fix something else in openoffice.org instead of > inflicting yet another auto-downloader/installer on us. I have worked on and am working on templates (and documentation). A consistent way for all users of OpenOffice.org to be able to find templates, know that they have been checked, and get installed in a sensible place, would mean that more people would develop templates knowing that they are more likely to be used. Some constructive discussion on how an RPM based system can work well for all OpenOffice.org users would be great! Even better would be if through communication a system can be found that will work not only for OpenOffice.org but also for those other "annoyances" such as Firefox. Thanks, Ian Laurenson From Nicolas.Mailhot at laPoste.net Mon Mar 7 21:59:06 2005 From: Nicolas.Mailhot at laPoste.net (Nicolas Mailhot) Date: Mon, 07 Mar 2005 22:59:06 +0100 Subject: Including OO templates in fc4 In-Reply-To: <1110231156.2387.51.camel@localhost> References: <1110035299.6541.24.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1110037746.1479.29.camel@jdub.homelinux.org> <1110045050.6541.27.camel@localhost.localdomain> <604aa79105030513513e62e5ce@mail.gmail.com> <1110061873.29024.17.camel@goose> <604aa79105030514445430da86@mail.gmail.com> <1110135473.3440.7.camel@localhost.localdomain> <604aa7910503061109513ce8de@mail.gmail.com> <1110156069.3687.4.camel@trevally.redfishdemo.com> <604aa791050306170219cdb01e@mail.gmail.com> <1110162251.2393.92.camel@localhost> <16835.192.54.193.137.1110184968.squirrel@rousalka.dyndns.org> <1110231156.2387.51.camel@localhost> Message-ID: <1110232747.11362.17.camel@rousalka.dyndns.org> Le mardi 08 mars 2005 ? 10:32 +1300, Ian Laurenson a ?crit : > Is there a way that users can have the best of both worlds? For those > that are using an RPM based system that they can use both RPM based > OpenOffice.org extensions or the OpenOffice.org UNO package installer > and that the appropriate registrations are occurring as required for > both systems. And there you are deeply wrong. Anyone will rpm or deb experience will tell you mixed installations are a great way to go mad after a while. > Some constructive discussion on how an RPM based system can work well > for all OpenOffice.org users would be great! Even better would be if > through communication a system can be found that will work not only for > OpenOffice.org but also for those other "annoyances" such as Firefox. I'm sorry you take it like this. All I can say is, if you think what I wrote is over the line, well that's nothing compared to what will be headed your way the day the auto-download stuff starts being promoted for Linux distributions. I tried to give you a friendly warning. Non native packaging is not a maybe but a never here. Native packages are in the end 99% of what's a distribution is about. But since you insist, I'll let you discover it by yourself. I have no more wish than anyone else to be caught in the middle of a crossfire I didn't started. -- Nicolas Mailhot -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part URL: From florin at andrei.myip.org Mon Mar 7 22:31:55 2005 From: florin at andrei.myip.org (Florin Andrei) Date: Mon, 07 Mar 2005 14:31:55 -0800 Subject: fedora on a flash drive Message-ID: <1110234715.5962.20.camel@stantz.corp.sgi.com> Crazy idea: Say i'll install Fedora on a machine that has a Compact Flash drive as the main drive (store the root filesystem) plus a normal HDD for /var-like stuff. Think - it's some kind of "appliance" (note the quotes) that's doing one thing, that has a SQL backend. The system is headless and must run unattended. The OS should sit on the Flash, mounted read-wite but seldom accessed in write mode. The DB per se will be on the "real" hard-drive, along with other write-often directories. Why Flash? The OS must survive power crashes and other nasty events without ever failing. If the data storage (which is on a regular HDD) fails, the OS will simply rebuild it, but in order to do that it must not fail itself. Q1: Do you think it's too crazy a project to fly? :-) Q2: Ideally, /etc should be on the Flash, along with other config-specific directories. Flash has a problem with being written too often, but all configs must stay on the Flash for reasons mentioned above. Actual question: which directories would you put on the Flash in such a situation? (besides /etc) Also, /etc has some files which are written to quite often. How would you get rid of those? Q3: Are there any filesystems that are better for Flash, in that they "spread" the writes across multiple blocks? Ext3 and any other journalised FSs should be avoided, right? (due to concentrating lots of writes in the journal) I could probably use Knoppix or something like that, but i'm so much more familiar with Fedora. -- Florin Andrei http://florin.myip.org/ From hillview at paradise.net.nz Mon Mar 7 22:55:49 2005 From: hillview at paradise.net.nz (Ian Laurenson) Date: Tue, 08 Mar 2005 11:55:49 +1300 Subject: Including OO templates in fc4 In-Reply-To: <1110232747.11362.17.camel@rousalka.dyndns.org> References: <1110035299.6541.24.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1110037746.1479.29.camel@jdub.homelinux.org> <1110045050.6541.27.camel@localhost.localdomain> <604aa79105030513513e62e5ce@mail.gmail.com> <1110061873.29024.17.camel@goose> <604aa79105030514445430da86@mail.gmail.com> <1110135473.3440.7.camel@localhost.localdomain> <604aa7910503061109513ce8de@mail.gmail.com> <1110156069.3687.4.camel@trevally.redfishdemo.com> <604aa791050306170219cdb01e@mail.gmail.com> <1110162251.2393.92.camel@localhost> <16835.192.54.193.137.1110184968.squirrel@rousalka.dyndns.org> <1110231156.2387.51.camel@localhost> <1110232747.11362.17.camel@rousalka.dyndns.org> Message-ID: <1110236149.2387.77.camel@localhost> On Tue, 2005-03-08 at 10:59, Nicolas Mailhot wrote: > Le mardi 08 mars 2005 ? 10:32 +1300, Ian Laurenson a ?crit : > > > Is there a way that users can have the best of both worlds? For those > > that are using an RPM based system that they can use both RPM based > > OpenOffice.org extensions or the OpenOffice.org UNO package installer > > and that the appropriate registrations are occurring as required for > > both systems. > > And there you are deeply wrong. Anyone will rpm or deb experience will > tell you mixed installations are a great way to go mad after a while. > > > Some constructive discussion on how an RPM based system can work well > > for all OpenOffice.org users would be great! Even better would be if > > through communication a system can be found that will work not only for > > OpenOffice.org but also for those other "annoyances" such as Firefox. > > I'm sorry you take it like this. > > All I can say is, if you think what I wrote is over the line, well > that's nothing compared to what will be headed your way the day the > auto-download stuff starts being promoted for Linux distributions. > > I tried to give you a friendly warning. Non native packaging is not a > maybe but a never here. Native packages are in the end 99% of what's a > distribution is about. But since you insist, I'll let you discover it by > yourself. I have no more wish than anyone else to be caught in the > middle of a crossfire I didn't started. We seem to be at cross purposes. I am trying to bounce ideas to find a workable solution but it would appear that my tone is too confrontational. My sincerest apologies - Ian Laurenson From dwmw2 at infradead.org Mon Mar 7 22:47:54 2005 From: dwmw2 at infradead.org (David Woodhouse) Date: Mon, 07 Mar 2005 22:47:54 +0000 Subject: fedora on a flash drive In-Reply-To: <1110234715.5962.20.camel@stantz.corp.sgi.com> References: <1110234715.5962.20.camel@stantz.corp.sgi.com> Message-ID: <1110235674.4591.32.camel@localhost.localdomain> On Mon, 2005-03-07 at 14:31 -0800, Florin Andrei wrote: > Why Flash? The OS must survive power crashes and other nasty events > without ever failing. I would recommend that you don't use Compact Flash. Most Compact Flash cards just aren't that reliable. Do some powerfail testing -- automatically cut power to a live system very few minutes for a week or two. See what happens. > Q1: Do you think it's too crazy a project to fly? :-) No, plenty of people do it -- just not with CF :) > Q2: > Ideally, /etc should be on the Flash, along with other config-specific > directories. Flash has a problem with being written too often, but all > configs must stay on the Flash for reasons mentioned above. > Actual question: which directories would you put on the Flash in such a > situation? (besides /etc) > Also, /etc has some files which are written to quite often. How would > you get rid of those? Take a look at the Familiar distribution for ideas on this (http://familiar.handhelds.org/). They handle it by using symlinks into a ramfs /var as appropriate, and untarring the initial contents of that ramfs in a /linuxrc script. > Q3: Are there any filesystems that are better for Flash, in that they > "spread" the writes across multiple blocks? > Ext3 and any other journalised FSs should be avoided, right? (due to > concentrating lots of writes in the journal) For CF or other devices which don't really appear as flash but instead pretend to be a block device, there's not a lot you can use which makes much sense. For _real_ flash you'd use JFFS2. -- dwmw2 From ivazquez at ivazquez.net Mon Mar 7 22:56:11 2005 From: ivazquez at ivazquez.net (Ignacio Vazquez-Abrams) Date: Mon, 07 Mar 2005 17:56:11 -0500 Subject: fedora on a flash drive In-Reply-To: <1110234715.5962.20.camel@stantz.corp.sgi.com> References: <1110234715.5962.20.camel@stantz.corp.sgi.com> Message-ID: <1110236171.8441.18.camel@ignacio.ignacio.lan> On Mon, 2005-03-07 at 14:31 -0800, Florin Andrei wrote: > Q1: Do you think it's too crazy a project to fly? :-) It's not like it hasn't been done before. No names spring to mind, but I'm sure it has been. > Q2: > Ideally, /etc should be on the Flash, along with other config-specific > directories. Flash has a problem with being written too often, but all > configs must stay on the Flash for reasons mentioned above. > Actual question: which directories would you put on the Flash in such a > situation? (besides /etc) /bin and /sbin. /dev goes on a RAM drive and use udev or run MAKEDEV in the initrd. > Also, /etc has some files which are written to quite often. How would > you get rid of those? Symlinks to the hard drive or a RAM drive. -- Ignacio Vazquez-Abrams http://fedora.ivazquez.net/ -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part URL: From sopwith at redhat.com Mon Mar 7 23:09:35 2005 From: sopwith at redhat.com (Elliot Lee) Date: Mon, 7 Mar 2005 18:09:35 -0500 (EST) Subject: What users want... In-Reply-To: <42289328.6040707@redhat.com> References: <42289328.6040707@redhat.com> Message-ID: On Fri, 4 Mar 2005, Harald Hoyer wrote: > To give you an impression what users want and what maybe qualifies to being in > Core, if it is FOSS :) The survey is good at measuring which project can whip its users into the biggest frenzy, but not much else. > 2004 LinuxQuestions.org Members Choice Award Winners Announced Something that would be cool would be to build a voting/poll system that allows doing proper surveys of Fedora users. I've got ideas if anyone is interested in making it happen! Best, -- Elliot From lsomike at futzin.com Mon Mar 7 23:13:29 2005 From: lsomike at futzin.com (Mike Klinke) Date: Mon, 7 Mar 2005 17:13:29 -0600 Subject: fedora on a flash drive In-Reply-To: <1110234715.5962.20.camel@stantz.corp.sgi.com> References: <1110234715.5962.20.camel@stantz.corp.sgi.com> Message-ID: <200503071713.30150.lsomike@futzin.com> On Monday 07 March 2005 16:31, Florin Andrei wrote: > > Why Flash? The OS must survive power crashes and other nasty > events without ever failing. If the data storage (which is on a > regular HDD) fails, the OS will simply rebuild it, but in order > to do that it must not fail itself. > Flash is probably the last thing to use for anything critical, especially if you're concerned about voltage fluctuations. From working with several different microcontrollers I can attest to its delicacy when voltage starts moving around. When you have the time take a look at the causes of failure on several of our space probes, the last notable flash memory failure was the first of the two most recent Mars rovers shortly after it landed. Regards, Mike Klinke From florin at andrei.myip.org Mon Mar 7 23:23:24 2005 From: florin at andrei.myip.org (Florin Andrei) Date: Mon, 07 Mar 2005 15:23:24 -0800 Subject: fedora on a flash drive In-Reply-To: <200503071713.30150.lsomike@futzin.com> References: <1110234715.5962.20.camel@stantz.corp.sgi.com> <200503071713.30150.lsomike@futzin.com> Message-ID: <1110237804.5962.34.camel@stantz.corp.sgi.com> On Mon, 2005-03-07 at 17:13 -0600, Mike Klinke wrote: > Flash is probably the last thing to use for anything critical, > especially if you're concerned about voltage fluctuations. From > working with several different microcontrollers I can attest to its > delicacy when voltage starts moving around. So then... a normal HDD, with critical partitions mounted "sync"? I've actually seen quite a few appliances that are really custom-built PCs running Linux and using normal HDDs. I just wonder what they're doing to assure it won't get stuck in fsck, or worse, if the power fails. Speaking of which, what's the "official" Fedora way :-) to tell fsck to just go ahead fix the disk and don't ask anything? -- Florin Andrei http://florin.myip.org/ From dwmw2 at infradead.org Mon Mar 7 23:32:44 2005 From: dwmw2 at infradead.org (David Woodhouse) Date: Mon, 07 Mar 2005 23:32:44 +0000 Subject: fedora on a flash drive In-Reply-To: <200503071713.30150.lsomike@futzin.com> References: <1110234715.5962.20.camel@stantz.corp.sgi.com> <200503071713.30150.lsomike@futzin.com> Message-ID: <1110238364.4591.43.camel@localhost.localdomain> On Mon, 2005-03-07 at 17:13 -0600, Mike Klinke wrote: > Flash is probably the last thing to use for anything critical, > especially if you're concerned about voltage fluctuations. I assume you mean CompactFlash, not just 'flash'? -- dwmw2 From dmalcolm at redhat.com Mon Mar 7 23:34:59 2005 From: dmalcolm at redhat.com (David Malcolm) Date: Mon, 07 Mar 2005 18:34:59 -0500 Subject: Error: missing dep: libgtkhtml-3.1.so.11 In-Reply-To: <1110207219.7848.3.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <1110207219.7848.3.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <1110238499.16571.12.camel@cassandra.boston.redhat.com> On Mon, 2005-03-07 at 15:53 +0100, RAT wrote: > >I'm trying to update gnome and evolution from devel branch but I'm >facing this dependecy problem > >Error: missing dep: libgtkhtml-3.1.so.11 > >Seems like this library is not included in the devel branch. That looks like a fairly old gtkhtml dependency to me - what version of Evolution are you trying to install? Is something else introducing that dependency? From lsomike at futzin.com Mon Mar 7 23:56:47 2005 From: lsomike at futzin.com (Mike Klinke) Date: Mon, 7 Mar 2005 17:56:47 -0600 Subject: fedora on a flash drive In-Reply-To: <1110238364.4591.43.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <1110234715.5962.20.camel@stantz.corp.sgi.com> <200503071713.30150.lsomike@futzin.com> <1110238364.4591.43.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <200503071756.47859.lsomike@futzin.com> On Monday 07 March 2005 17:32, DW wrote: > On Mon, 2005-03-07 at 17:13 -0600, Mike Klinke wrote: > > Flash is probably the last thing to use for anything critical, > > especially if you're concerned about voltage fluctuations. > > I assume you mean CompactFlash, not just 'flash'? My own experiences with failure have been in a few of the more popular microcontroller's that have suffered from relatively minor fluctuating voltage levels that I wouldn't have expected to result in corrupted data. I'd trust flash in situations where what's stored there can be rebuilt, say, from ROM, HD, or transferred in over some type of communications port. I wouldn't trust it "never to fail", as it just seems to corrupt too often. Regards, Mike Klinke From dwmw2 at infradead.org Mon Mar 7 23:59:20 2005 From: dwmw2 at infradead.org (David Woodhouse) Date: Mon, 07 Mar 2005 23:59:20 +0000 Subject: fedora on a flash drive In-Reply-To: <200503071756.47859.lsomike@futzin.com> References: <1110234715.5962.20.camel@stantz.corp.sgi.com> <200503071713.30150.lsomike@futzin.com> <1110238364.4591.43.camel@localhost.localdomain> <200503071756.47859.lsomike@futzin.com> Message-ID: <1110239960.4591.45.camel@localhost.localdomain> On Mon, 2005-03-07 at 17:56 -0600, Mike Klinke wrote: > > I assume you mean CompactFlash, not just 'flash'? > > My own experiences with failure have been in a few of the more > popular microcontroller's that have suffered from relatively minor > fluctuating voltage levels that I wouldn't have expected to result > in corrupted data. Microcontroller? I assume you mean CompactFlash, not just 'flash'? -- dwmw2 From alan at redhat.com Tue Mar 8 00:14:17 2005 From: alan at redhat.com (Alan Cox) Date: Mon, 7 Mar 2005 19:14:17 -0500 Subject: fedora on a flash drive In-Reply-To: <1110234715.5962.20.camel@stantz.corp.sgi.com> References: <1110234715.5962.20.camel@stantz.corp.sgi.com> Message-ID: <20050308001417.GA16477@devserv.devel.redhat.com> On Mon, Mar 07, 2005 at 02:31:55PM -0800, Florin Andrei wrote: > Q1: Do you think it's too crazy a project to fly? :-) I've seen similar but done different ways. The init on the CF bootstraps the system by running sanity checks on the disk. It then does one of two things #1 If the sanity check passes, chroots (it was pre the root swivel stuff) and execs /sbin/init. #2 If it fails, it rebuilds the disk environment from the flash and puts everything there. That wasn't trying to save configuration changes merely to restore a pre arranged 'boot' configuration off the CF. > Q3: Are there any filesystems that are better for Flash, in that they > "spread" the writes across multiple blocks? > Ext3 and any other journalised FSs should be avoided, right? (due to > concentrating lots of writes in the journal) Decent CF cards use wear levelling (its actually log structured internally). If you buy your CF from Micron (ie crucical) it comes with a lifetime warranty so it's their problem 8) Also for maximum reliability turn off the write cache on the hard disk. From alan at redhat.com Tue Mar 8 00:18:10 2005 From: alan at redhat.com (Alan Cox) Date: Mon, 7 Mar 2005 19:18:10 -0500 Subject: fedora on a flash drive In-Reply-To: <1110237804.5962.34.camel@stantz.corp.sgi.com> References: <1110234715.5962.20.camel@stantz.corp.sgi.com> <200503071713.30150.lsomike@futzin.com> <1110237804.5962.34.camel@stantz.corp.sgi.com> Message-ID: <20050308001810.GC16477@devserv.devel.redhat.com> On Mon, Mar 07, 2005 at 03:23:24PM -0800, Florin Andrei wrote: > I've actually seen quite a few appliances that are really custom-built > PCs running Linux and using normal HDDs. I just wonder what they're > doing to assure it won't get stuck in fsck, or worse, if the power > fails. The Equiinet Netpilot just uses ext3 but with the bootstrap partition arranged to contain only read-only content so that it is very unlikely that it will fail to fsck. Ext3 with data-logging enabled and disk write cache off is very reliable. > Speaking of which, what's the "official" Fedora way :-) to tell fsck to > just go ahead fix the disk and don't ask anything? Add "-y" 8) From florin at andrei.myip.org Tue Mar 8 00:29:46 2005 From: florin at andrei.myip.org (Florin Andrei) Date: Mon, 07 Mar 2005 16:29:46 -0800 Subject: fedora on a flash drive In-Reply-To: <20050308001417.GA16477@devserv.devel.redhat.com> References: <1110234715.5962.20.camel@stantz.corp.sgi.com> <20050308001417.GA16477@devserv.devel.redhat.com> Message-ID: <1110241786.5962.41.camel@stantz.corp.sgi.com> On Mon, 2005-03-07 at 19:14 -0500, Alan Cox wrote: > On Mon, Mar 07, 2005 at 02:31:55PM -0800, Florin Andrei wrote: > > Q1: Do you think it's too crazy a project to fly? :-) > > I've seen similar but done different ways. The init on the CF bootstraps the > system by running sanity checks on the disk. It then does one of two things > > #1 If the sanity check passes, chroots (it was pre the root swivel stuff) > and execs /sbin/init. > > #2 If it fails, it rebuilds the disk environment from the flash and puts > everything there. Hah! That's exactly what i was thinking! :-) > Decent CF cards use wear levelling (its actually log structured internally). > If you buy your CF from Micron (ie crucical) it comes with a lifetime > warranty so it's their problem 8) But how about all those scary stories about CF (un)reliability that i keep hearing? I mean, let's accept that CF may fail after X power failures. But a normal HDD can also fail due to mechanical shocks, etc. Just using a normal HDD would be much simpler. OTOH, maybe it's just me, but i've had so many issues with fsck... (probably i'm too old and i keep remembering bad stuff since the days of Ext2) -- Florin Andrei http://florin.myip.org/ From florin at andrei.myip.org Tue Mar 8 00:38:38 2005 From: florin at andrei.myip.org (Florin Andrei) Date: Mon, 07 Mar 2005 16:38:38 -0800 Subject: fedora on a flash drive In-Reply-To: <20050308001810.GC16477@devserv.devel.redhat.com> References: <1110234715.5962.20.camel@stantz.corp.sgi.com> <200503071713.30150.lsomike@futzin.com> <1110237804.5962.34.camel@stantz.corp.sgi.com> <20050308001810.GC16477@devserv.devel.redhat.com> Message-ID: <1110242318.5962.47.camel@stantz.corp.sgi.com> On Mon, 2005-03-07 at 19:18 -0500, Alan Cox wrote: > Ext3 with data-logging enabled and disk write cache off is very reliable. Would "mount -o sync" add any reliability to that? -- Florin Andrei http://florin.myip.org/ From overholt at redhat.com Tue Mar 8 01:07:23 2005 From: overholt at redhat.com (Andrew Overholt) Date: Mon, 7 Mar 2005 20:07:23 -0500 Subject: What users want... In-Reply-To: References: <42289328.6040707@redhat.com> Message-ID: <20050308010723.GA24738@redhat.com> * Elliot Lee [2005-03-07 18:10]: > > Something that would be cool would be to build a voting/poll system that > allows doing proper surveys of Fedora users. I've got ideas if anyone is > interested in making it happen! Something like the Debian Popularity Contest? http://popcon.debian.org I'd be interested in implementing something similar for Fedora. Andrew From michael.favia at insitesinc.com Tue Mar 8 02:38:54 2005 From: michael.favia at insitesinc.com (Michael Favia) Date: Mon, 07 Mar 2005 20:38:54 -0600 Subject: What users want... In-Reply-To: <20050308010723.GA24738@redhat.com> References: <42289328.6040707@redhat.com> <20050308010723.GA24738@redhat.com> Message-ID: <422D103E.9070502@insitesinc.com> Andrew Overholt wrote: >* Elliot Lee [2005-03-07 18:10]: > > >>Something that would be cool would be to build a voting/poll system that >>allows doing proper surveys of Fedora users. I've got ideas if anyone is >>interested in making it happen! >> >> > >Something like the Debian Popularity Contest? > >http://popcon.debian.org > >I'd be interested in implementing something similar for Fedora. > > Or [optional] Yum integration via proposed new plugin system to report installation statistics from kind souls. -mf From jcornett at insight.rr.com Tue Mar 8 03:53:56 2005 From: jcornett at insight.rr.com (Jim Cornette) Date: Mon, 07 Mar 2005 22:53:56 -0500 Subject: Resolving dependencies (libcrypto.so.4...) In-Reply-To: <20050307141929.3b90e101.acbk@zeelandnet.nl> References: <5cf776b8050307040161ed14f1@mail.gmail.com> <20050307141929.3b90e101.acbk@zeelandnet.nl> Message-ID: <422D21D4.10401@insight.rr.com> h.breimer wrote: > On Mon, 7 Mar 2005 08:01:31 -0400 > mbneto wrote: > > >>Hi, >> >>I've been unable to upgrade to the latest packages with the same error >>messages: Error: Unable to satisfy dependencies >>Error: Package ntp needs libcrypto.so.4, this is not available. >>Error: Package libwvstreams needs libssl.so.4, this is not available. >>Error: Package pyOpenSSL needs libcrypto.so.4, this is not available. >>Error: Package dhcpv6_client needs libcrypto.so.4, this is not > > >>Any ideas of how can I bypass such restrictions ? >> >>- mb >> > > I downloaded openssl-0.9.7e-3 from the development tree > rpm -i openssl-0.9.7e-3 > Now I had both the lib...so.4 and the ...so.5 libs in my box. > Yum update did its work after this. > > Remember to rpm -e openssl-0.9.7a-46 later when all packages are over to > the new version. > > Enjoy the bumpy ride and avoid the baby-eating horror-gurus! > > success! > Henk > Mutt required the so.4 versions for two of the libs that you mentioned. I upgraded via ftp to rawhide and it installed the later so.5 versions. Anyway, making a symlink from the so.5 symlink to an so.4 symlink allowed mutt to work. What other programs "require" the so.4 versions that are in development? Jim ls -la lib*so.{4,5} lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 19 Mar 7 22:21 libcrypto.so.4 -> /lib/libcrypto.so.5 lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 19 Mar 4 12:29 libcrypto.so.5 -> libcrypto.so.0.9.7e lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 16 Mar 7 22:20 libssl.so.4 -> /lib/libssl.so.5 lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 16 Mar 4 12:29 libssl.so.5 -> libssl.so.0.9.7e From ivg2 at cornell.edu Tue Mar 8 04:18:50 2005 From: ivg2 at cornell.edu (Ivan Gyurdiev) Date: Mon, 07 Mar 2005 23:18:50 -0500 Subject: Rpmbuild/permissions/nvidia module Message-ID: <1110255531.20660.16.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> I have a question about how rpmbuild works. The livna nvidia kernel module package installs the following two files: /lib/modules/2.6.11-1.1171_FC4/kernel/drivers/video/nvidia /lib/modules/2.6.11-1.1171_FC4/kernel/drivers/video/nvidia/nvidia.ko ... never mind the kernel number. Now, I can verify that after the install stage (rpmbuild -bi), there exists a module directory, and a module inside it in the /var/tmp root. They both have permission mask 755. However, if I install the resultant rpm, the nvidia folder gets installed with mask 644 (??), and the module inside it with mask 644 (vs. 744 for everything else). This causes depmod to fail with dac_override denials in strict policy selinux. Now, Question 1: Is the permission mask in /var/tmp following the install stage supposed to match the final permissions? Question 2: If so, why is it 755/755, and not 755/744, which seems right judging by other modules installed. Question 3: What makes it change from 755/755 to 644/644 (which is completely wrong) between the install stage and the final rpm. -- Ivan Gyurdiev Cornell University From reuben-fedora-devel at reub.net Tue Mar 8 04:28:59 2005 From: reuben-fedora-devel at reub.net (Reuben Farrelly) Date: Tue, 08 Mar 2005 17:28:59 +1300 Subject: Resolving dependencies (libcrypto.so.4...) In-Reply-To: <422D21D4.10401@insight.rr.com> References: <5cf776b8050307040161ed14f1@mail.gmail.com> <20050307141929.3b90e101.acbk@zeelandnet.nl> <422D21D4.10401@insight.rr.com> Message-ID: <422D2A0B.6070607@reub.net> Hi, Jim Cornette wrote: >> I downloaded openssl-0.9.7e-3 from the development tree >> rpm -i openssl-0.9.7e-3 Now I had both the lib...so.4 and the ...so.5 >> libs in my box. >> Yum update did its work after this. >> >> Remember to rpm -e openssl-0.9.7a-46 later when all packages are over to >> the new version. >> >> Enjoy the bumpy ride and avoid the baby-eating horror-gurus! >> >> success! >> Henk >> > > Mutt required the so.4 versions for two of the libs that you mentioned. > I upgraded via ftp to rawhide and it installed the later so.5 versions. > > Anyway, making a symlink from the so.5 symlink to an so.4 symlink > allowed mutt to work. > > What other programs "require" the so.4 versions that are in development? > > Jim Here are some: [root at tornado postfix]# rpm -e openssl097a error: Failed dependencies: libcrypto.so.4 is needed by (installed) spamassassin-3.0.2-1.i386 libcrypto.so.4 is needed by (installed) mutt-1.4.2.1-1.i386 libcrypto.so.4 is needed by (installed) pyOpenSSL-0.6-1.p23.1.i386 libcrypto.so.4 is needed by (installed) perl-Crypt-SSLeay-0.51-5.i386 libcrypto.so.4 is needed by (installed) ruby-libs-1.8.2-4.i386 libcrypto.so.4 is needed by (installed) ntp-4.2.0.a.20040617-6.i386 libcrypto.so.4 is needed by (installed) libwvstreams-3.75.0-3.i386 libcrypto.so.4 is needed by (installed) python-2.4-4.i386 libcrypto.so.4 is needed by (installed) lftp-3.0.13-1.i386 libssl.so.4 is needed by (installed) spamassassin-3.0.2-1.i386 libssl.so.4 is needed by (installed) mutt-1.4.2.1-1.i386 libssl.so.4 is needed by (installed) pyOpenSSL-0.6-1.p23.1.i386 libssl.so.4 is needed by (installed) perl-Crypt-SSLeay-0.51-5.i386 libssl.so.4 is needed by (installed) ruby-libs-1.8.2-4.i386 libssl.so.4 is needed by (installed) libwvstreams-3.75.0-3.i386 libssl.so.4 is needed by (installed) python-2.4-4.i386 libssl.so.4 is needed by (installed) lftp-3.0.13-1.i386 It would be really nice if the owners of those packages scheduled a nightly rebuild of them all so that the openssl097a package is no longer required. (I'm not sure adding 9 or so bugzilla reports with "please rebuild" is that useful to anyone so I'll desist on that one..). Perhaps there are issues rebuilding some of them with the newer gcc4 in rawhide though? :( Reuben From fedora-devel at tlarson.com Tue Mar 8 05:10:54 2005 From: fedora-devel at tlarson.com (Tyler Larson) Date: Mon, 07 Mar 2005 22:10:54 -0700 Subject: fedora on a flash drive In-Reply-To: <1110234715.5962.20.camel@stantz.corp.sgi.com> References: <1110234715.5962.20.camel@stantz.corp.sgi.com> Message-ID: <422D33DE.0@tlarson.com> Florin Andrei wrote: > Why Flash? The OS must survive power crashes and other nasty events > without ever failing. If the data storage (which is on a regular HDD) > fails, the OS will simply rebuild it, but in order to do that it must > not fail itself. There's certainly nothing unusual about running Linux from Flash ROM--Linksys does it :)--but doing so to increase reliability only makes sense if the dangers you're worried about can be solved by switching storage media. A perfect reason to use flash media instead of hard disks is the moving parts issue. If your installation is subject to shock or vibration, hard disks are disasters waiting to happen. If you can eliminate the cooling fans too, you can have a zero-moving-parts computer, which can can be wonderful. I can't come up with any possible reason why storing your data on a flash drive would make you any safer against a power failure. Journaling (and disabling hw cache) does that for you. If you lose power in the middle of a write with a journaled fs, you may lose your data (nothing can protect you there), but at least your filesystem will be in a consistent state. Remember, "consistent" doesn't mean "what you wanted", it means "safe to use". If you're writing to an SQL database when you lose power, your tables may not be in a consistent state, but at least the OS will boot. Certain RDBMS makers take great pride in their ability to maintain consistent state even after a power failure--but not all can do it. If you're worried about storage device failure, RAID might be for you. If you're worried about power failure, a UPS may be in your future--get the kind that can signal the computer to shut down. If you're worried about damage to/by moving parts, Flash media is perfect. Choose the fix that bests suits your problem. That's what I say. Unless, of course, your fix is to use one of those gumstix computers. You're allowed to use those to fix anything. I've been searching for a year for a valid excuse ..er.. problem to solve with one of those. From lsomike at futzin.com Tue Mar 8 05:54:55 2005 From: lsomike at futzin.com (Mike Klinke) Date: Mon, 7 Mar 2005 23:54:55 -0600 Subject: fedora on a flash drive Message-ID: <200503072354.55270.lsomike@futzin.com> On Monday 07 March 2005 17:59, DW wrote: > Microcontroller? I assume you mean CompactFlash, not just > 'flash'? No, I'm talking about the memory type; as in "EEPROM vs flash", being byte eraseable vs block eraseable, respectively. Perhaps these will clarify: http://www.netrino.com/Publications/Glossary/MemoryTypes.html http://klabs.org/DEI/References/design_guidelines/nasa_guidelines/n vm/nvm.htm Regards, Mike Klinke From rat at mujmail.cz Tue Mar 8 08:34:28 2005 From: rat at mujmail.cz (RAT) Date: Tue, 08 Mar 2005 09:34:28 +0100 Subject: Error: missing dep: libgtkhtml-3.1.so.11 In-Reply-To: <1110238499.16571.12.camel@cassandra.boston.redhat.com> References: <1110207219.7848.3.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1110238499.16571.12.camel@cassandra.boston.redhat.com> Message-ID: <1110270868.28444.3.camel@localhost.localdomain> On Mon, 2005-03-07 at 18:34 -0500, David Malcolm wrote: > On Mon, 2005-03-07 at 15:53 +0100, RAT wrote: > > > >I'm trying to update gnome and evolution from devel branch but I'm > >facing this dependecy problem > > > >Error: missing dep: libgtkhtml-3.1.so.11 > > > >Seems like this library is not included in the devel branch. > That looks like a fairly old gtkhtml dependency to me - what version of > Evolution are you trying to install? Is something else introducing that > dependency? I'm trying to get evolution from devel tree, eg. the latest 2.1.6 release It fails on Error: missing dep: libgtkhtml-3.1.so.11 for pkg gnotime or if I'm trying to get gnome packages first I fail on Error: missing dep: libgtkhtml-3.1.so.11 for pkg balsa -- RAT From mpeters at mac.com Tue Mar 8 08:58:20 2005 From: mpeters at mac.com (Michael A. Peters) Date: Tue, 08 Mar 2005 08:58:20 +0000 Subject: Rpmbuild/permissions/nvidia module In-Reply-To: <1110255531.20660.16.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> (from ivg2@cornell.edu on Mon Mar 7 20:18:50 2005) References: <1110255531.20660.16.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> Message-ID: <1110272300l.6207l.0l@devel.funkyres.us> On 03/07/2005 08:18:50 PM, Ivan Gyurdiev wrote: > > Question 3: > What makes it change from 755/755 to 644/644 (which is completely > wrong) > between the install stage and the final rpm. Specify the permissions in the spec file and that shouldn't be a problem %files %attr(0755,root,root) /path/to/module.ko Why it is happening I do not know - I've never personally seen a case where permissions are different is a resulting rpm than they were in the buildroot - except when specified as different in the spec file. -- Michael A. Peters http://mpeters.us/ From jon at jonshouse.co.uk Tue Mar 8 09:08:18 2005 From: jon at jonshouse.co.uk (Unknown) Date: Tue, 08 Mar 2005 09:08:18 +0000 Subject: fedora on a flash drive In-Reply-To: <20050308001810.GC16477@devserv.devel.redhat.com> References: <1110234715.5962.20.camel@stantz.corp.sgi.com> <200503071713.30150.lsomike@futzin.com> <1110237804.5962.34.camel@stantz.corp.sgi.com> <20050308001810.GC16477@devserv.devel.redhat.com> Message-ID: <1110272898.27901.35.camel@jonspc> On Mon, 2005-03-07 at 19:18 -0500, Alan Cox wrote: > On Mon, Mar 07, 2005 at 03:23:24PM -0800, Florin Andrei wrote: > > I've actually seen quite a few appliances that are really custom-built > > PCs running Linux and using normal HDDs. I just wonder what they're > > doing to assure it won't get stuck in fsck, or worse, if the power > > fails. Its worth remembering that if you O/S and application partition is read only then it shouldn't degrade. The product I work on just checks the partition with the data stored in it, if the partition fails fsck then the machine simply reformats it and reboots ! Jon From ivg2 at cornell.edu Tue Mar 8 09:27:04 2005 From: ivg2 at cornell.edu (Ivan Gyurdiev) Date: Tue, 08 Mar 2005 04:27:04 -0500 Subject: Rpmbuild/permissions/nvidia module In-Reply-To: <1110272300l.6207l.0l@devel.funkyres.us> References: <1110255531.20660.16.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> <1110272300l.6207l.0l@devel.funkyres.us> Message-ID: <1110274025.2597.1.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> On Tue, 2005-03-08 at 08:58 +0000, Michael A. Peters wrote: > On 03/07/2005 08:18:50 PM, Ivan Gyurdiev wrote: > > > > > Question 3: > > What makes it change from 755/755 to 644/644 (which is completely > > wrong) > > between the install stage and the final rpm. > > > Specify the permissions in the spec file and that shouldn't be a > problem > > %files > %attr(0755,root,root) /path/to/module.ko > > Why it is happening I do not know - I've never personally seen a case > where permissions are different is a resulting rpm than they were in > the buildroot - except when specified as different in the spec file. Indeed - did not notice. Thank you for the info. %if 0%{build_kernelmod} %files -n kernel-module-nvidia-%{kernel} %defattr(0644,root,root,-) %dir /lib/modules/%{kernel}/%{modpath} /lib/modules/%{kernel}/%{modpath}/nvidia.ko %endif #build_kernelmod -- Ivan Gyurdiev Cornell University From alan at redhat.com Tue Mar 8 10:08:18 2005 From: alan at redhat.com (Alan Cox) Date: Tue, 8 Mar 2005 05:08:18 -0500 Subject: fedora on a flash drive In-Reply-To: <1110242318.5962.47.camel@stantz.corp.sgi.com> References: <1110234715.5962.20.camel@stantz.corp.sgi.com> <200503071713.30150.lsomike@futzin.com> <1110237804.5962.34.camel@stantz.corp.sgi.com> <20050308001810.GC16477@devserv.devel.redhat.com> <1110242318.5962.47.camel@stantz.corp.sgi.com> Message-ID: <20050308100818.GB1798@devserv.devel.redhat.com> On Mon, Mar 07, 2005 at 04:38:38PM -0800, Florin Andrei wrote: > On Mon, 2005-03-07 at 19:18 -0500, Alan Cox wrote: > > Ext3 with data-logging enabled and disk write cache off is very reliable. > Would "mount -o sync" add any reliability to that? I don't think so. When you have full logging your fs should always come back sane providing you have disk write cache off. I'm not the expert however From remco at beryllium.net Tue Mar 8 21:32:40 2005 From: remco at beryllium.net (Remco Poelstra) Date: Tue, 08 Mar 2005 22:32:40 +0100 Subject: Printing system proposal In-Reply-To: <604aa7910503061509567ac811@mail.gmail.com> References: <422B77D4.9010408@beryllium.net> <604aa791050306140651612405@mail.gmail.com> <422B82F8.5050000@beryllium.net> <604aa7910503061509567ac811@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <422E19F8.5050002@beryllium.net> Jeff Spaleta wrote: > John's posts in the thread detailing how desktop printing confuration > is currently handled seems particularly relevant to your proposal... > so i wanted to make sure you have read it.. so that you would be > better prepared to talk specifics with the specific red hat Ah, I see, thank you. Since you quoted another line of me, I tought you meant something else. I've read the thread and I thought my ideas were somewhat compatible with the current ideas/implementation. Since the reply of John was somewhat of the same content, I'll consider my design to be uncompatible and think it all over again :). Remco From remco at beryllium.net Tue Mar 8 21:36:55 2005 From: remco at beryllium.net (Remco Poelstra) Date: Tue, 08 Mar 2005 22:36:55 +0100 Subject: Printing system proposal In-Reply-To: <1110172278.2451.100.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <422B77D4.9010408@beryllium.net> <604aa791050306140651612405@mail.gmail.com> <422B82F8.5050000@beryllium.net> <604aa7910503061509567ac811@mail.gmail.com> <1110172278.2451.100.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <422E1AF7.8070502@beryllium.net> John (J5) Palmieri wrote: > porting to the new dbus and hal api's. That is almost done and on our > agenda is to get back to the printing issues. At that point I will look > more closely at your proposal. Good to hear that it's on the agenda, because after some 40 years, unix deserves a good printingsystem. > BTW you need to illustrate the system/session split in your proposal. > On an initial glance the flow looks wrong to me (things like you will > never get cups accepting dbus commands directly). It needs to be more > detailed. Thanks. Hmm, from your reply I make up that DBUS works in a different way than I think. I'll read into it and come back with a better/different proposal. Anyway nice to hear that RH is interested in the view of "outsiders". Remco Poelstra From warren at togami.com Tue Mar 8 10:35:50 2005 From: warren at togami.com (Warren Togami) Date: Tue, 08 Mar 2005 00:35:50 -1000 Subject: vte for FC3/FC4 testing Message-ID: <422D8006.6000806@togami.com> Seeing that nobody at RH changed vte since November 2004, I went ahead and made this test package. Since changes to vte are usually quite sensitive I am testing it out-of-tree first. If you are annoyed by the glacial slowness of FC3 gnome-terminal, try the below packages. http://people.redhat.com/wtogami/temp/vte-FC3/ http://people.redhat.com/wtogami/temp/vte-FC4/ * Mon Mar 07 2005 Warren Togami 0.11.12-1 - upgrade to 0.11.12 - remove upstreamed patches (0-2, 5-9) - disable patch3, either not needed anymore, or needs rewriting - reverse patch4, because upstream merged its horrible brokenness - test Novell's excessive malloc for new terminals patch v3 (GNOME #160993) Some TODO items... 1) Test the above packages. Is it any worse in rendering stuff than the previous FC3 or FC4 vte? I hope to push something similar to FC3 updates and FC4 soon. 2) It seems that upstream made a new vte-0.11.12 release with most of Fedora's patches + more stuff. This is good. Unfortunately they also merged Patch4: vte-0.11.11-fix-update-order.patch which was commented out since late October since it totally screwed up rendering [1]. This is bad. Makes me wonder if they actually TESTED 0.11.12 before releasing it upstream... So anyway all I did was uncomment the patch4 and add -R to reverse it, and it seems to be working fine. I totally don't know anything about GNOME upstream development, so it would be great if someone could make sure this is reversed upstream too. 3) Patch3: vte-0.11.11-vertical-scroll-ctrl-seq.patch clashes in this new version. It seems that part of it was introduced in the new upstream version. For now I commented it out. Can someone figure out if this patch is no longer needed, or needs to be rewritten? Thanks, Warren Togami wtogami at redhat.com [1] Run gnome-terminal, type ls, hit ENTER a few times. What should be the bash prompt turned into a black bar. You'll see lots of similar rendering trouble while building something too... like vte. From nicolas.mailhot at laposte.net Tue Mar 8 10:41:53 2005 From: nicolas.mailhot at laposte.net (Nicolas Mailhot) Date: Tue, 8 Mar 2005 11:41:53 +0100 (CET) Subject: Printing system proposal In-Reply-To: <422E1AF7.8070502@beryllium.net> References: <422B77D4.9010408@beryllium.net> <604aa791050306140651612405@mail.gmail.com> <422B82F8.5050000@beryllium.net> <604aa7910503061509567ac811@mail.gmail.com> <1110172278.2451.100.camel@localhost.localdomain> <422E1AF7.8070502@beryllium.net> Message-ID: <52191.192.54.193.137.1110278513.squirrel@rousalka.dyndns.org> On Mar 8 mars 2005 22:36, Remco Poelstra a ?crit : > John (J5) Palmieri wrote: >> porting to the new dbus and hal api's. That is almost done and on our >> agenda is to get back to the printing issues. At that point I will look >> more closely at your proposal. > > Good to hear that it's on the agenda, because after some 40 years, unix > deserves a good printingsystem. It's a pity new components like cups solve the driver problem while /dev/nulling parts like routing that were the strength of lprng and friends. (is cups still unable to do something as stupid as queue alaiasing ?) -- Nicolas Mailhot From dwmw2 at infradead.org Tue Mar 8 11:18:50 2005 From: dwmw2 at infradead.org (David Woodhouse) Date: Tue, 08 Mar 2005 11:18:50 +0000 Subject: fedora on a flash drive In-Reply-To: <200503071756.47859.lsomike@futzin.com> References: <1110234715.5962.20.camel@stantz.corp.sgi.com> <200503071713.30150.lsomike@futzin.com> <1110238364.4591.43.camel@localhost.localdomain> <200503071756.47859.lsomike@futzin.com> Message-ID: <1110280730.16158.130.camel@hades.cambridge.redhat.com> On Mon, 2005-03-07 at 17:56 -0600, Mike Klinke wrote: > My own experiences with failure have been in a few of the more > popular microcontroller's that have suffered from relatively minor > fluctuating voltage levels that I wouldn't have expected to result > in corrupted data. I'd trust flash in situations where what's > stored there can be rebuilt, say, from ROM, HD, or transferred in > over some type of communications port. I wouldn't trust it "never > to fail", as it just seems to corrupt too often. Powerfail testing on NOR flash devices with JFFS2 showed up a few interesting failure modes which can be worked around, but nothing particularly worrying. However, powerfail testing isn't the same as running the board with 'fluctuating voltage levels'. That sounds like bad board design. If I run my CPU with 'fluctuating voltage levels' I'd expect it to go a little apeshit too :) -- dwmw2 From kmaraas at broadpark.no Tue Mar 8 12:02:59 2005 From: kmaraas at broadpark.no (Kjartan Maraas) Date: Tue, 08 Mar 2005 13:02:59 +0100 Subject: vte for FC3/FC4 testing In-Reply-To: <422D8006.6000806@togami.com> References: <422D8006.6000806@togami.com> Message-ID: <1110283379.5194.12.camel@localhost.localdomain> tir, 08,.03.2005 kl. 00.35 -1000, skrev Warren Togami: > Seeing that nobody at RH changed vte since November 2004, I went ahead > and made this test package. Since changes to vte are usually quite > sensitive I am testing it out-of-tree first. If you are annoyed by the > glacial slowness of FC3 gnome-terminal, try the below packages. I tried adjusting VTE_DISPLAY_TIMEOUT and VTE_COALESCE_TIMEOUT to find the best compromise between speed and smooth output in the terminal and I *think* I found something that should be ok. If others want to experiment with those values to see if it can be improved further that would be nice. The other speedups are partly from the patches already in FC3 and also some new performance patches from Benjamin Otte. > > http://people.redhat.com/wtogami/temp/vte-FC3/ > http://people.redhat.com/wtogami/temp/vte-FC4/ > > * Mon Mar 07 2005 Warren Togami 0.11.12-1 > - upgrade to 0.11.12 > - remove upstreamed patches (0-2, 5-9) > - disable patch3, either not needed anymore, or needs rewriting > - reverse patch4, because upstream merged its horrible brokenness > - test Novell's excessive malloc for new terminals patch v3 > (GNOME #160993) > Great that this went in so it can get more testing before inclusion upstream. I think Novell are shipping with this patch in SuSE 9.3 also. > Some TODO items... > 1) Test the above packages. Is it any worse in rendering stuff than the > previous FC3 or FC4 vte? I hope to push something similar to FC3 > updates and FC4 soon. > > 2) It seems that upstream made a new vte-0.11.12 release with most of > Fedora's patches + more stuff. This is good. > > Unfortunately they also merged Patch4: > vte-0.11.11-fix-update-order.patch which was commented out since late > October since it totally screwed up rendering [1]. This is bad. Makes > me wonder if they actually TESTED 0.11.12 before releasing it upstream... > Of course it was tested. Nobody reported any problems with rendering with the patch included and I can't reproduce the problems you're describing myself either. I tried building stuff cat'ing large amounts of text ls + ENTER etc. > So anyway all I did was uncomment the patch4 and add -R to reverse it, > and it seems to be working fine. I totally don't know anything about > GNOME upstream development, so it would be great if someone could make > sure this is reversed upstream too. > There were references to the patch in bugzilla.gnome.org where it was said to be working also. I'll try to find the details. > 3) Patch3: vte-0.11.11-vertical-scroll-ctrl-seq.patch clashes in this > new version. It seems that part of it was introduced in the new > upstream version. For now I commented it out. Can someone figure out > if this patch is no longer needed, or needs to be rewritten? > I noticed that too when I was applying the patches from Fedora. Revision 1.405 of vte.c in GNOME CVS is the one that causes the conflict I think. It looks like the patch can be dropped maybe? > [1] Run gnome-terminal, type ls, hit ENTER a few times. What should be > the bash prompt turned into a black bar. You'll see lots of similar > rendering trouble while building something too... like vte. > As I said, I can't reproduce any of this here. Do you have pointers to reports of these problems in bugzilla or anywhere else? Cheers Kjartan From olga.moreira at gmail.com Tue Mar 8 12:05:52 2005 From: olga.moreira at gmail.com (Olga Moreira) Date: Tue, 8 Mar 2005 13:05:52 +0100 Subject: FC2 and winxp dual-boot Message-ID: Good morning, Yesterday I've installed FC2 on my laptop not knowing about the bug concerning the disk geometry. Although, I can boot windows xp without problems but the disk geometry was changed indeed. I wish to fix this problem. As far as I understood, today, the solution lies on the two command lines: sfdisk -d /dev/hda | sfdisk --no-reread -H255 /dev/hda Will that be enough o fix the problem? regards, Olga From buildsys at redhat.com Tue Mar 8 12:25:58 2005 From: buildsys at redhat.com (Build System) Date: Tue, 8 Mar 2005 07:25:58 -0500 Subject: rawhide report: 20050308 changes Message-ID: <200503081225.j28CPwd6004417@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> New package jakarta-commons-modeler Jakarta Commons Modeler Package New package jessie A free implementation of the Java Secure Sockets Extension New package mx4j Open source implementation of JMX Java API New package python-urlgrabber A high-level cross-protocol url-grabber New package struts11 Web application framework New package tomcat5 Apache Servlet/JSP Engine, RI for Servlet 2.4/JSP 2.0 API Removed package ncurses4 Removed package bonobo Updated Packages: Canna-3.7p3-13 -------------- * Mon Mar 07 2005 Akira TAGOH - 3.7p3-13 - stop to sort the words on some dictionaries during making the binary dictionaries. Guppi-0.40.3-23 --------------- * Mon Mar 07 2005 Bill Nottingham 0.40.3-23 - fix gcc4 build - disable bonobo NetworkManager-0.4-1.cvs20050307.3.0 ------------------------------------ * Mon Mar 07 2005 Ray Strode 0.4-1.cvs20050307 - Pull from latest CVS HEAD - Commit broken NetworkManager to satisfy to dbus dependency alsa-lib-1.0.8-4.devel ---------------------- * Mon Mar 07 2005 Martin Stransky 1.0.8-4.devel - gcc4 patch alsa-utils-1.0.8-3 ------------------ * Mon Mar 07 2005 Martin Stransky - rebuilt * Wed Feb 16 2005 Martin Stransky 1.0.8-2 - fix #148011 (add gettext-devel to BuildRequires) - add $RPM_OPT_FLAGS to CFLAGS * Wed Jan 26 2005 Martin Stransky 1.0.8-1 - update to 1.0.8 - temporarily removed alsa-lauch.patch anaconda-10.2.0.27-1 -------------------- * Mon Mar 07 2005 Peter Jones - 20.2.0.27-1 - supress lvm fd warning messages - fewer log messages when growing partitions - clamp LVs to pesize during grow * Mon Mar 07 2005 Jeremy Katz - 10.2.0.26-1 - urlgrabber stuff is in its own package now * Sun Mar 06 2005 Peter Jones - 10.2.0.25-1 - Empty blacklist in upgrade.py (notting, #142893) - Add new font package names (katzj) - Yet another fix of autopart with lvm (pjones) aqbanking-1.0.4beta-2 --------------------- aqhbci-1.0.2beta-2 ------------------ at-3.1.8-66_FC4 --------------- * Mon Mar 07 2005 Jason Vas Dias 3.1.8-66 - fix bug 150131: atd should not relinquish root privilege if - doing su(1) equivalent with PAM . * Tue Jan 25 2005 Jason Vas Dias 3.1.8-64 - bugs 5160/146132: add PAM authentication control to atd * Tue Oct 05 2004 Jason Vas Dias 3.1.8-60 - fix bug 131510: no_export env. var. blacklisting should not - remove 'SHELL' when only 'SHELLOPTS' is blacklisted. - at(1) man-page should not say 'commands are run with /bin/sh' - and should explain usage of SHELL environement variable and - details of blacklisted variables. authd-1.4.3-1.devel ------------------- * Mon Mar 07 2005 Martin Stransky - 1.4.3-1.devel - update to 1.4.3 - gcc4.0 patch - add post-uninstall reconfiguration (#150460) * Mon Feb 14 2005 Adrian Havill - rebuilt * Fri Oct 15 2004 Adrian Havill - 1.4.2-8 - tweak setting of uid/gid for key file so systems with no prior ident user/group don't generate a warning (#135837) awesfx-0.5.0d-2 --------------- * Mon Mar 07 2005 Martin Stransky - rebuilt bind-22:9.3.1rc1-4_FC4 ---------------------- * Mon Mar 07 2005 Jason Vas Dias - 22:9.3.1rc1-4 - Rebuild with gcc4 / glibc-2.3.4-14. binutils-2.15.94.0.2-4 ---------------------- * Mon Mar 07 2005 Jakub Jelinek 2.15.94.0.2-4 - rebuilt with GCC 4 bootparamd-0.17-22.devel ------------------------ * Thu Feb 17 2005 Martin Stransky - rebuilt * Thu Jan 13 2005 Martin Stransky 0.17-20.devel - fix DNS look-up extension patch (#144933) * Mon Dec 20 2004 Martin Stransky - fast DNS look-up extension busybox-1:1.00-4 ---------------- * Mon Mar 07 2005 Ivana Varekova - 1.00-4 - rebuilt cups-1:1.1.23-13 ---------------- * Mon Mar 07 2005 John (J5) Palmieri 1:1.1.23-13 - Fixed up dbus patch to work with dbus 0.31 cvs-1.11.19-4 ------------- * Mon Mar 07 2005 Martin Stransky 1.11.19-4 - remove check of HTTP_PROXY variable (#150434) dbus-0.31-1 ----------- * Mon Mar 07 2005 John (J5) Palmieri - 0.31-1 - update to upstream version 0.31 - take out user has same id patch (merged upstream) - udi patch updated - dbus-daemon-1 renamed to dbus-daemon - dbus-glib-tool renamed to dbus-binding-tool - force gcc33 because pyrex generate improper lvalue code - disable audit patch for now desktop-printing-0.18-4 ----------------------- * Mon Mar 07 2005 John (J5) Palmieri 0.18-4 - Rebuild for dbus 0.31 * Fri Feb 25 2005 John (J5) Palmieri 0.18-3 - Added new hal and dbus api backport patch dhcp-10:3.0.2-3 --------------- * Mon Mar 07 2005 Jason Vas Dias 10.3.0.2-3 - rebuild for gcc4/glibc-2.3.4-14; fix bad memset dovecot-0.99.14-2.fc4 --------------------- * Mon Mar 07 2005 John Dennis 0.99.14-2.fc4 - bump rev for gcc4 build e2fsprogs-1.36-1.3 ------------------ * Mon Feb 21 2005 Stephen C. Tweedie 1.36-1.2 - Re-enable resize2fs - Add bigendian byte-swapping fix when growing the gdt table * Fri Feb 11 2005 Stephen C. Tweedie 1.36-1.1 - Fix for >=4TB devices * Fri Feb 11 2005 Stephen C. Tweedie 1.36-1 - Update to e2fsprogs-1.36 ecj-2.1.3-5 ----------- * Mon Sep 27 2004 Gary Benson 2.1.3-5 - Rebuild with new katana. * Thu Jul 22 2004 Gary Benson 2.1.3-4 - Build without bootstrap-ant. - Split out lib-org-eclipse-jdt-internal-compiler.so. * Tue Jul 06 2004 Gary Benson 2.1.3-3 - Fix ecj-devel's dependencies. ecj-1:3.1-0.M4.9 ---------------- * Mon Mar 07 2005 Andrew Overholt 1:3.1.0.M4.9 - Don't build for ppc or ia64. eclipse-bugzilla-1:0.1.0_fc-6 ----------------------------- * Mon Mar 07 2005 Jeff Pound 0.1.0-6_fc - Rebuild including icons dir, xml, and properties files. file-4.13-3 ----------- * Mon Mar 07 2005 Radek Vokal - 4.13-3 - check for shared libs before fs dump files (#149868) g-wrap-1.3.4-8 -------------- * Mon Mar 07 2005 Bill Nottingham 1.3.4-8 - rebuild gal-1:0.24-6 ------------ * Mon Mar 07 2005 Bill Nottingham 0.24-6 - don't buildrequire/require gnome-vfs * Wed Nov 10 2004 Karsten Hopp 0.24-5 - add BuildRequires: gdk-pixbuf-devel gnome-python2-2.9.5-1 --------------------- * Mon Mar 07 2005 Jeremy Katz - 2.9.5-1 - update to 2.9.5 gnome-vfs2-2.9.91-8 ------------------- * Mon Mar 07 2005 David Zeuthen - 2.9.91-8 - More gcc 4.0 build fixes * Mon Mar 07 2005 David Zeuthen - 2.9.91-7 - Rebuild * Mon Mar 07 2005 David Zeuthen - 2.9.91-6 - Fix for gcc 4.0 build gnome-volume-manager-1.1.3-3 ---------------------------- * Mon Mar 07 2005 John (J5) Palmieri - 1.1.3-3 - Fixed up hal-api patch * Fri Feb 25 2005 John (J5) Palmieri - 1.1.3-2 - Reenable BuildPrereq for hal-devel * Wed Feb 23 2005 John (J5) Palmieri - 1.1.3-1 - Update to upstream version - add patch to update to the new hal-0.5.0 API - took out locking patch as it was added upstream - took out policy-after-explicit-mount-only patch as it was added upstream - removed /usr/share/control-center-2.0/capplets/* glob - added /usr/share/applications/gnome-volume-properties.desktop gnucash-1.8.11-2 ---------------- * Mon Mar 07 2005 Bill Nottingham 1.8.11-2 - rebuild against bonobo-less Guppi, gtkhtml gsl-1.6-2 --------- * Mon Mar 07 2005 Ivana Varekova 1.6-2 - rebuilt * Thu Jan 06 2005 Ivana Varekova 1.6-1 - update to 1.6 * Wed Dec 15 2004 Ivana Varekova - fix bug #142696 gsl-config outputs invalid flags on multilib 64-bit architectures gtkhtml-1.1.9-11 ---------------- * Mon Mar 07 2005 Bill Nottingham - 1.1.9-11 - fix build with gcc4 - turn off bonobo support * Mon Jun 21 2004 David Malcolm - 1.1.9-10 - Added fix for gcc 3.4 * Tue Jun 15 2004 Elliot Lee - rebuilt hal-0.5.0-2 ----------- * Mon Mar 07 2005 David Zeuthen 0.5.0-2 - Update to upstream release 0.5.0 * Thu Jan 27 2005 David Zeuthen 0.4.7-2 - Add patch that should close #146316 * Mon Jan 24 2005 David Zeuthen 0.4.7-1 - New upstream release. - Should close #145921, #145750, #145293, #145256 hal-cups-utils-0.5.3-2 ---------------------- * Mon Mar 07 2005 John (J5) Palmieri - 0.5.3-1 - Add a build reqiures and requires for dbus >= 0.31 - Rebuild with HAL 0.5.0 and D-BUS 0.31 - Add hal fdi file to match printers to the hal_lpadmin callout * Fri Mar 04 2005 John (J5) Palmieri - 0.5.3-1 - Integrate patches and make 0.5.3 release * Fri Mar 04 2005 John (J5) Palmieri - 0.5.2-11 - Added get_udi_from_env patch which gets the UDI of the printer from the UDI env variable set by hal if the UDI is not given on the command line - Made sure fdi file installs in correct place and executes hal_lpadmin correctly - changed the check if printer code to check string lists now initscripts-8.05-1 ------------------ * Mon Mar 07 2005 Bill Nottingham 8.05-1 - ipv6 cleanups () - rc.sysinit: fix rngd check (#130350) ... then turn it off entirely - rc.sysinit: get rid of duplicate date printout (#149795) - ifdown: handle being called on down devices better - handle saved resolv.conf on all device types - fix network-functions cleanup - netfs: fix _netdev unmounting (#147610, ) - dhcp release cleanups () - ifup-bnep: bluetooth update - more ipsec stuff (#147001, ) inn-2.4.2-2 ----------- * Mon Mar 07 2005 Martin Stransky - rebuilt ipsec-tools-0.5-2 ----------------- * Sat Mar 05 2005 Uwe Beck 0.5-2 - now racoon use /etc/racoon/racoon.conf as default - add the /var/racoon directory for racoon.sock joystick-1.2.15-20 ------------------ * Mon Mar 07 2005 Than Ngo 1.2.15-20 - rebuilt libgnomecups-0.1.14-3 --------------------- * Fri Mar 04 2005 John (J5) Palmieri 0.1.14-3 - edit dbus patch - don't free const variable mailcap-2.1.19-1 ---------------- * Mon Mar 07 2005 Bill Nottingham 2.1.19-1 - s/ggv/evince/ (#150509) mailman-3:2.1.5-35.fc4 ---------------------- * Mon Mar 07 2005 John Dennis 3:2.1.5-35.fc4 - bump rev for gcc4 build * Wed Mar 02 2005 John Dennis - 3:2.1.5-34.fc4 - fix bug #150065, provide migration script for new FHS installation make-1:3.80-7 ------------- * Mon Mar 07 2005 Jakub Jelinek 3.80-7 - rebuilt with GCC 4 man-1.5p-1 ---------- * Mon Mar 07 2005 Ivana Varekova 1.5m2-14 - rebuilt new version #147716 * Fri Mar 04 2005 Ivana Varekova 1.5m2-13 - rebuilt * Mon Feb 14 2005 Adrian Havill - rebuilt man-pages-1.67-6 ---------------- * Mon Mar 07 2005 Jindrich Novy 1.67-6 - unify fs.5 patches together to get rid of the bogus fs.5.orig.gz shipped among man5 pages - bump release to 6 to avoid conflicts with RHEL4/FC3 man-pages * Wed Aug 25 2004 Adrian Havill 1.67-3 - make resolver clearer and less bind-focused (#126696) * Fri Aug 20 2004 Adrian Havill 1.67-2 - updated to latest - getrpcent/setrpcent typo (#73836) - add new resolver.5 page (#126557) - add SHM_HUGETLB option to shmget (#128837) minicom-2.00.0-21 ----------------- * Mon Mar 07 2005 Martin Stransky - gcc4 patch module-init-tools-3.1-1 ----------------------- mutt-5:1.4.2.1-2 ---------------- * Mon Mar 07 2005 Bill Nottingham 5:1.4.2.1-2 - rebuild against new openssl - fix build with gcc4 nautilus-cd-burner-2.9.8-2 -------------------------- * Mon Mar 07 2005 David Zeuthen 2.9.8-2 - Build with patches for new hal/dbus API and fix locking of drive netatalk-3:2.0.2-2 ------------------ * Mon Mar 07 2005 Jason Vas Dias - Fix for gcc4 compilation: extern_ucreator.patch passwd-0.69-2 ------------- * Mon Mar 07 2005 Jindrich Novy 0.69-2 - rebuilt with gcc4 pkgconfig-1:0.15.0-5 -------------------- * Mon Mar 07 2005 Matthias Clasen 1:0.15.0-5 - fix an overflow policycoreutils-1.21.21-1 ------------------------- * Tue Mar 01 2005 Dan Walsh 1.21.21-1 * Merged load_policy and genhomedircon patch from Dan Walsh. pygtk2-2.6.0-2 -------------- * Mon Mar 07 2005 Jeremy Katz - 2.6.0-2 - fix build with gcc4 - add pygtk-demo * Mon Mar 07 2005 Jeremy Katz - 2.6.0-1 - 2.6.0 recode-3.6-16 ------------- * Mon Mar 07 2005 Than Ngo 3.6-16 - cleanup * Sat Mar 05 2005 Than Ngo 3.6-15 - rebuilt rp-pppoe-3.5-27 --------------- * Mon Mar 07 2005 Than Ngo 3.5-27 - rebuiult rpm-4.4.1-6 ----------- * Mon Mar 07 2005 Jeremy Katz - 4.4.1-6 - fix build with new glibc * Mon Mar 07 2005 Jeremy Katz - 4.4.1-5 - disable hkp by default selinux-policy-strict-1.21.15-6 ------------------------------- * Mon Mar 07 2005 Dan Walsh 1.21.15-6 - Add many Ivan Gyurdiev cleanups selinux-policy-targeted-1.21.15-6 --------------------------------- * Mon Mar 07 2005 Dan Walsh 1.21.15-6 - Add many Ivan Gyurdiev cleanups setarch-1.7-2 ------------- * Mon Mar 07 2005 Jindrich Novy 1.7-2 - rebuilt with gcc4 sharutils-4.2.1-25 ------------------ * Mon Mar 07 2005 Than Ngo 4.2.1-25 - cleanup * Sat Mar 05 2005 Than Ngo 4.2.1-24 - rebuilt slrn-0.9.8.1-4 -------------- * Mon Mar 07 2005 Jindrich Novy 0.9.8.1-4 - fix type confusions reported by gcc4 - add RPM_OPT_FLAGS to CFLAGS - rebuilt with gcc4 sysstat-5.0.5-9.fc ------------------ * Mon Mar 07 2005 Ivana Varekova 5.0.5-9.fc - rebuilt (add gcc4fix, update lib64ini) * Fri Mar 04 2005 Ivana Varekova 5.0.5-7.fc - rebuilt * Thu Sep 30 2004 Charles Bennett 5.0.5-5.fc - bring in filename and append-msg patch - append-msg adds verbose text for when saNN data file cpu count - does not match cpu count on the currently running system tcpdump-14:3.8.2-11 ------------------- * Mon Mar 07 2005 Martin Stransky - rebuilt udev-050-9 ---------- * Mon Mar 07 2005 Warren Togami - 050-9 - fixed rh#150462 (udev DRI permissions) which-2.16-6 ------------ * Mon Mar 07 2005 Than Ngo 2.16-6 - rebuilt xfig-3.2.4-9 ------------ * Mon Mar 07 2005 Than Ngo 3.2.4-9 - cleanup * Sat Mar 05 2005 Than Ngo 3.2.4-8 - rebuilt yum-2.3.1-1 ----------- * Mon Mar 07 2005 Jeremy Katz - 2.3.1-1 - update to 2.3.1 - urlgrabber is split out into its own package now - require python-sqlite3 From fedora-devel at camperquake.de Tue Mar 8 12:35:14 2005 From: fedora-devel at camperquake.de (Ralf Ertzinger) Date: Tue, 8 Mar 2005 13:35:14 +0100 Subject: rawhide report: 20050308 changes In-Reply-To: <200503081225.j28CPwd6004417@porkchop.devel.redhat.com>; from buildsys@redhat.com on Tue, Mar 08, 2005 at 07:25:58AM -0500 References: <200503081225.j28CPwd6004417@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> Message-ID: <20050308133514.A24362@ryoko.camperquake.de> On Tue, Mar 08, 2005 at 07:25:58AM -0500, Build System wrote: > Removed package ncurses4 Well, that was a short life. From tarjei.knapstad at predichem.com Tue Mar 8 14:58:59 2005 From: tarjei.knapstad at predichem.com (Tarjei Knapstad) Date: Tue, 08 Mar 2005 15:58:59 +0100 Subject: rawhide report: 20050308 changes In-Reply-To: <20050308133514.A24362@ryoko.camperquake.de> References: <200503081225.j28CPwd6004417@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <20050308133514.A24362@ryoko.camperquake.de> Message-ID: <1110293939.22077.0.camel@tarjei.predichem.nett> On Tue, 2005-03-08 at 13:35, Ralf Ertzinger wrote: > On Tue, Mar 08, 2005 at 07:25:58AM -0500, Build System wrote: > > > Removed package ncurses4 > > Well, that was a short life. I'd assume it's going into extras because nothing in core depends on this older version. -- Tarjei From Fedora at TQMcube.com Tue Mar 8 16:06:54 2005 From: Fedora at TQMcube.com (David Cary Hart) Date: Tue, 08 Mar 2005 11:06:54 -0500 Subject: Bug Reporting Question Message-ID: <1110298014.3087.1.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> I installed Evolution 2.2 today (which is remarkably stable). Do I report bugs to Fedora, Ximian or both? -- Total Quality Management - A Commitment to Excellence Fight Spam: http://www.tqmcube.com/rbldnsd.htm Real Time Updates: rsync -t \ tqmcube.com::spamlists/[README.htm][clients][dynamic][relays][asiaspam] http://www.tqmcube.com/spam_trap.htm From rahulsundaram at yahoo.co.in Tue Mar 8 16:18:11 2005 From: rahulsundaram at yahoo.co.in (Rahul Sundaram) Date: Tue, 8 Mar 2005 08:18:11 -0800 (PST) Subject: Bug Reporting Question In-Reply-To: 6667 Message-ID: <20050308161811.26667.qmail@web8502.mail.in.yahoo.com> --- David Cary Hart wrote: > I installed Evolution 2.2 today (which is remarkably > stable). Do I > report bugs to Fedora, Ximian or both? if its stable what are you filing bugs about? :-) anyway you can file it bugzilla.redhat.com Regards Rahul Sundaram __________________________________ Celebrate Yahoo!'s 10th Birthday! Yahoo! Netrospective: 100 Moments of the Web http://birthday.yahoo.com/netrospective/ From Fedora at TQMcube.com Tue Mar 8 16:24:41 2005 From: Fedora at TQMcube.com (David Cary Hart) Date: Tue, 08 Mar 2005 11:24:41 -0500 Subject: Bug Reporting Question In-Reply-To: <20050308161811.26667.qmail@web8502.mail.in.yahoo.com> References: <20050308161811.26667.qmail@web8502.mail.in.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1110299081.3087.7.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> On Tue, 2005-03-08 at 08:18 -0800, Rahul Sundaram wrote: > --- David Cary Hart wrote: > > I installed Evolution 2.2 today (which is remarkably > > stable). Do I > > report bugs to Fedora, Ximian or both? > > if its stable what are you filing bugs about? :-) > Stability and flaws are not mutually exclusive. There remain a couple of NNTP problems which are of little consequence to me since Ev is far from a viable Usenet client. > anyway you can file it bugzilla.redhat.com > Well I know that I CAN. So you are saying that filing to b-r-c is preferable to ximian? -- Total Quality Management - A Commitment to Excellence Fight Spam: http://www.tqmcube.com/rbldnsd.htm Real Time Updates: rsync -t \ tqmcube.com::spamlists/[README.htm][clients][dynamic][relays][asiaspam] http://www.tqmcube.com/spam_trap.htm From rahulsundaram at yahoo.co.in Tue Mar 8 16:46:06 2005 From: rahulsundaram at yahoo.co.in (Rahul Sundaram) Date: Tue, 8 Mar 2005 08:46:06 -0800 (PST) Subject: FC2 and winxp dual-boot In-Reply-To: 6667 Message-ID: <20050308164606.65216.qmail@web8507.mail.in.yahoo.com> --- Olga Moreira wrote: > Good morning, > Yesterday I've installed FC2 on my laptop not > knowing about the bug > concerning the disk geometry. Although, I can boot > windows xp without > problems but the disk geometry was changed indeed. > I wish to fix this > problem. As far as I understood, today, the solution > lies on the two > command lines: > sfdisk -d /dev/hda | sfdisk --no-reread -H255 > /dev/hda > Will that be enough o fix the problem? > Google is your friend http://www.ces.clemson.edu/linux/fc2.shtml Regards Rahul Sundaram __________________________________ Celebrate Yahoo!'s 10th Birthday! Yahoo! Netrospective: 100 Moments of the Web http://birthday.yahoo.com/netrospective/ From notting at redhat.com Tue Mar 8 16:53:56 2005 From: notting at redhat.com (Bill Nottingham) Date: Tue, 8 Mar 2005 11:53:56 -0500 Subject: rawhide report: 20050308 changes In-Reply-To: <20050308133514.A24362@ryoko.camperquake.de> References: <200503081225.j28CPwd6004417@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <20050308133514.A24362@ryoko.camperquake.de> Message-ID: <20050308165356.GB10764@nostromo.devel.redhat.com> Ralf Ertzinger (fedora-devel at camperquake.de) said: > On Tue, Mar 08, 2005 at 07:25:58AM -0500, Build System wrote: > > > Removed package ncurses4 > > Well, that was a short life. It was actually removed well before Fedora Core *2*. Not sure why it suddenly made an appearance yesterday, but it's been silenced. :) Bill From mattdm at mattdm.org Tue Mar 8 17:08:46 2005 From: mattdm at mattdm.org (Matthew Miller) Date: Tue, 8 Mar 2005 12:08:46 -0500 Subject: Bug Reporting Question In-Reply-To: <1110298014.3087.1.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> References: <1110298014.3087.1.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> Message-ID: <20050308170846.GA5471@jadzia.bu.edu> On Tue, Mar 08, 2005 at 11:06:54AM -0500, David Cary Hart wrote: > I installed Evolution 2.2 today (which is remarkably stable). Do I > report bugs to Fedora, Ximian or both? In general, report packaging/build problems to Fedora, and actual issues with the program upstream. -- Matthew Miller mattdm at mattdm.org Boston University Linux ------> From jspaleta at gmail.com Tue Mar 8 17:14:07 2005 From: jspaleta at gmail.com (Jeff Spaleta) Date: Tue, 8 Mar 2005 12:14:07 -0500 Subject: Bug Reporting Question In-Reply-To: <1110298014.3087.1.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> References: <1110298014.3087.1.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> Message-ID: <604aa79105030809146e4936ef@mail.gmail.com> On Tue, 08 Mar 2005 11:06:54 -0500, David Cary Hart wrote: > I installed Evolution 2.2 today (which is remarkably stable). Do I > report bugs to Fedora, Ximian or both? evolution 2.2 from where? I don't see evolution 2.2 in today's development tree. If you aren't using an evo package built by red hat for fedora core, I'm not sure wise it is to file bugs against fedora's bugzilla. To generalize Matthew's advice a bit. In general, report packaging/build problems to the package vendor and actual program bugs upstream. If this evo 2.2 package is not built by red hat you'll need to use the appropriate package vendor's bugzilla for packaging issues. -jef From rahulsundaram at yahoo.co.in Tue Mar 8 17:18:04 2005 From: rahulsundaram at yahoo.co.in (Rahul Sundaram) Date: Tue, 8 Mar 2005 09:18:04 -0800 (PST) Subject: wireless drivers: OpenBSD Message-ID: <20050308171804.42609.qmail@web8505.mail.in.yahoo.com> Hi Since we had a recent discussion about wireless drivers and associated firmware I believe this would be useful information particularly to the Linux kernel hackers http://kerneltrap.org/node/4818?PHPSESSID=a74a700b8610fb193546198995c44c2c Regards Rahul Sundaram __________________________________ Celebrate Yahoo!'s 10th Birthday! Yahoo! Netrospective: 100 Moments of the Web http://birthday.yahoo.com/netrospective/ From prarit at sgi.com Tue Mar 8 17:19:28 2005 From: prarit at sgi.com (Prarit Bhargava) Date: Tue, 08 Mar 2005 12:19:28 -0500 Subject: [ANNOUNCE]: Fedora ia64 List Message-ID: <422DDEA0.5030508@sgi.com> If you're interested in helping out on ia64 Fedora Core development, please sign up at https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-ia64-list P. From fedora-devel at camperquake.de Tue Mar 8 17:21:55 2005 From: fedora-devel at camperquake.de (Ralf Ertzinger) Date: Tue, 8 Mar 2005 18:21:55 +0100 Subject: Bug Reporting Question In-Reply-To: <20050308170846.GA5471@jadzia.bu.edu> References: <1110298014.3087.1.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> <20050308170846.GA5471@jadzia.bu.edu> Message-ID: <20050308182155.625c5292@nausicaa.camperquake.de> Hi. Matthew Miller wrote: > In general, report packaging/build problems to Fedora, and actual issues > with the program upstream. This may be tricky since the casual user has absolutely no clue what patches RH applied to the packages (and upstream does not know that, either). -- "I sense much NT in you. NT leads to Blue Screen, Blue Screen leads to downtime, downtime leads to suffering. NT is the path to the Dark Side." From Fedora at TQMcube.com Tue Mar 8 17:29:35 2005 From: Fedora at TQMcube.com (David Cary Hart) Date: Tue, 08 Mar 2005 12:29:35 -0500 Subject: Bug Reporting Question In-Reply-To: <604aa79105030809146e4936ef@mail.gmail.com> References: <1110298014.3087.1.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> <604aa79105030809146e4936ef@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1110302975.16400.5.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> On Tue, 2005-03-08 at 12:14 -0500, Jeff Spaleta wrote: > evolution 2.2 from where? I don't see evolution 2.2 in today's > development tree. If you aren't using an evo package built by red hat > for fedora core, I'm not sure wise it is to file bugs against fedora's > bugzilla. > > To generalize Matthew's advice a bit. > In general, report packaging/build problems to the package vendor and > actual program bugs upstream. If this evo 2.2 package is not built by > red hat you'll need to use the appropriate package vendor's bugzilla > for packaging issues. > This is a source build. Might bug reporting - possibly - be useful to the developers in advance of the Fedora build? Might this not - possibly - lead to patch development? Be assured that I am not asking rhetorically. -- Total Quality Management - A Commitment to Excellence Fight Spam: http://www.tqmcube.com/rbldnsd.htm Real Time Updates: rsync -t \ tqmcube.com::spamlists/[README.htm][clients][dynamic][relays][asiaspam] http://www.tqmcube.com/spam_trap.htm From rahulsundaram at yahoo.co.in Tue Mar 8 17:47:55 2005 From: rahulsundaram at yahoo.co.in (Rahul Sundaram) Date: Tue, 8 Mar 2005 09:47:55 -0800 (PST) Subject: Bug Reporting Question In-Reply-To: 6667 Message-ID: <20050308174755.74968.qmail@web8507.mail.in.yahoo.com> Hi > This is a source build. Might bug reporting - > possibly - be useful to > the developers in advance of the Fedora build? Might > this not - possibly > - lead to patch development? Be assured that I am > not asking > rhetorically. File it in the novell bugzilla site then. If its useful Red Hat developers can look into that later Regards Rahul Sundaram __________________________________ Celebrate Yahoo!'s 10th Birthday! Yahoo! Netrospective: 100 Moments of the Web http://birthday.yahoo.com/netrospective/ From mattdm at mattdm.org Tue Mar 8 17:51:19 2005 From: mattdm at mattdm.org (Matthew Miller) Date: Tue, 8 Mar 2005 12:51:19 -0500 Subject: Bug Reporting Question In-Reply-To: <20050308182155.625c5292@nausicaa.camperquake.de> References: <1110298014.3087.1.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> <20050308170846.GA5471@jadzia.bu.edu> <20050308182155.625c5292@nausicaa.camperquake.de> Message-ID: <20050308175119.GA7953@jadzia.bu.edu> On Tue, Mar 08, 2005 at 06:21:55PM +0100, Ralf Ertzinger wrote: > This may be tricky since the casual user has absolutely no clue what patches > RH applied to the packages (and upstream does not know that, either). A good point, and I'm sure part of the reason for Fedora's policy of tracking upstream as closely as possible with minimal patching. -- Matthew Miller mattdm at mattdm.org Boston University Linux ------> From nman64 at n-man.com Tue Mar 8 18:08:34 2005 From: nman64 at n-man.com (Patrick Barnes) Date: Tue, 08 Mar 2005 12:08:34 -0600 Subject: Bug Reporting Question In-Reply-To: <20050308182155.625c5292@nausicaa.camperquake.de> References: <1110298014.3087.1.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> <20050308170846.GA5471@jadzia.bu.edu> <20050308182155.625c5292@nausicaa.camperquake.de> Message-ID: <422DEA22.1050409@n-man.com> Ralf Ertzinger wrote: >Hi. > >Matthew Miller wrote: > > > >>In general, report packaging/build problems to Fedora, and actual issues >>with the program upstream. >> >> > >This may be tricky since the casual user has absolutely no clue what patches >RH applied to the packages (and upstream does not know that, either). > > > About the only way around that is to follow the age-old advice of downloading, building and installing the latest (reads: CVS) version from the original developer of the program in question to see if the bug is still present, and report it only if it is. At that point, you would know if it were a problem with a Fedora patch or not. Otherwise, best practice is exactly as stated above. Just make sure that you let the upstream team know that you are testing on a Fedora system. Additionally, if the problem does not exist upstream, you might be able to create a patch that fixes the problem downstream and submit it as an interim fix until the new version makes it downstream. From michael.favia at insitesinc.com Tue Mar 8 18:10:17 2005 From: michael.favia at insitesinc.com (Michael Favia) Date: Tue, 08 Mar 2005 12:10:17 -0600 Subject: wireless drivers: OpenBSD In-Reply-To: <20050308171804.42609.qmail@web8505.mail.in.yahoo.com> References: <20050308171804.42609.qmail@web8505.mail.in.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <422DEA89.1070406@insitesinc.com> Rahul Sundaram wrote: >Hi > >Since we had a recent discussion about wireless >drivers and associated firmware I believe this would >be useful information particularly to the Linux kernel >hackers > > >http://kerneltrap.org/node/4818?PHPSESSID=a74a700b8610fb193546198995c44c2c > > Good find. Thanks for the link. -mf From jspaleta at gmail.com Tue Mar 8 18:16:53 2005 From: jspaleta at gmail.com (Jeff Spaleta) Date: Tue, 8 Mar 2005 13:16:53 -0500 Subject: Bug Reporting Question In-Reply-To: <1110302975.16400.5.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> References: <1110298014.3087.1.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> <604aa79105030809146e4936ef@mail.gmail.com> <1110302975.16400.5.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> Message-ID: <604aa791050308101658272479@mail.gmail.com> On Tue, 08 Mar 2005 12:29:35 -0500, David Cary Hart wrote: > This is a source build. Might bug reporting - possibly - be useful to > the developers in advance of the Fedora build? Might this not - possibly > - lead to patch development? Be assured that I am not asking > rhetorically. I think i can pretty savely say that pre-emptive bug reports which anticipate problems for packages that don't even exist yet are not something fedora developers are going to want want to see. If its a source build... file the problem upstream. Fedora developers 'should' be watching upstream. Patch development should happen upstream as much as possible and then back ported if needed at the distribution level when it comes time to package this source code up. There is more than enough clutter in fedora's bugzilla right now to keep developers busy... pre-emptive bugs reports for issues that might not even exist in the upstream code by the time the codebase is packaged in fedora seems like a waste of everyone's time. -jef From Nicolas.Mailhot at laPoste.net Tue Mar 8 19:02:36 2005 From: Nicolas.Mailhot at laPoste.net (Nicolas Mailhot) Date: Tue, 08 Mar 2005 20:02:36 +0100 Subject: Including OO templates in fc4 In-Reply-To: <1110236149.2387.77.camel@localhost> References: <1110035299.6541.24.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1110037746.1479.29.camel@jdub.homelinux.org> <1110045050.6541.27.camel@localhost.localdomain> <604aa79105030513513e62e5ce@mail.gmail.com> <1110061873.29024.17.camel@goose> <604aa79105030514445430da86@mail.gmail.com> <1110135473.3440.7.camel@localhost.localdomain> <604aa7910503061109513ce8de@mail.gmail.com> <1110156069.3687.4.camel@trevally.redfishdemo.com> <604aa791050306170219cdb01e@mail.gmail.com> <1110162251.2393.92.camel@localhost> <16835.192.54.193.137.1110184968.squirrel@rousalka.dyndns.org> <1110231156.2387.51.camel@localhost> <1110232747.11362.17.camel@rousalka.dyndns.org> <1110236149.2387.77.camel@localhost> Message-ID: <1110308556.25559.48.camel@rousalka.dyndns.org> Le mardi 08 mars 2005 ? 11:55 +1300, Ian Laurenson a ?crit : > We seem to be at cross purposes. I am trying to bounce ideas to find a > workable solution but it would appear that my tone is too > confrontational. Ok, maybe I reacted a bit quickly too. If you really want good Linux support (and not treat it like windows and wonder when users start complaining) you need to provide a repository of linux packages (basically just a ftp/http server with native packages and a few index files that help Linux autodownloaders know what you provide). The hard part is though now all Linux distribution packages have more or less the same properties they don't all use the same on-disk format. So you will probably need relays for every single Linux distribution you care about (ok realistically a rpm release + a deb release + a tar.gz release should cover almost everyone). So for example you'll need a contact in Fedora Extras or rpmforge, another in PLF, another in Debian. Now the nice part is since all the Linux packaging systems are very close from a functional POW they all more or less have the same needs : - very strict version numbering - releases in tar.bz2 with strict naming and internal layout - installation must be possible in a fully automated way (no human intervention at all, for example from a cron) and avoid changing common files (a Linux package "owns" files, they are checksummed and digitally signed. If a package tries to modify a file owned by another package things can get ugly fast) The last point is where common auto-downloaders fail : they either fail to work without human supervision (mozilla, firefox) or try to modify files already owned by other parts of the system (CPAN, (x)emacs, maven...) This might seems mightily restrictive (and it is) but the end result is when one file on the system has a problem you know what package owns it and fixing this package is sufficient to heal the system. This is why Fedora Core for example can afford its fast releases - if it had to do an audit of all the files interactions each time like under Windows seamless upgrades would not be possible. Regards, -- Nicolas Mailhot -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part URL: From rahulsundaram at yahoo.co.in Tue Mar 8 19:13:43 2005 From: rahulsundaram at yahoo.co.in (Rahul Sundaram) Date: Tue, 8 Mar 2005 11:13:43 -0800 (PST) Subject: Including OO templates in fc4 In-Reply-To: 6667 Message-ID: <20050308191343.89641.qmail@web8509.mail.in.yahoo.com> Hi > > The hard part is though now all Linux distribution > packages have more or > less the same properties they don't all use the same > on-disk format. So > you will probably need relays for every single Linux > distribution you > care about (ok realistically a rpm release + a deb > release + a tar.gz > release should cover almost everyone). or better use the autopackage(.org) to create a distro neutral package. they are about to release a 1.0 release very shortly Regards Rahul Sundaram __________________________________ Celebrate Yahoo!'s 10th Birthday! Yahoo! Netrospective: 100 Moments of the Web http://birthday.yahoo.com/netrospective/ From terraformers at gmx.net Tue Mar 8 19:10:29 2005 From: terraformers at gmx.net (Lars) Date: Tue, 08 Mar 2005 20:10:29 +0100 Subject: rawhide report: 20050308 changes References: <200503081225.j28CPwd6004417@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> Message-ID: i get these yum errors when updating. Error: Missing Dependency: libhal.so.0 is needed by package gnome-utils Error: Missing Dependency: libdbus-glib-1.so.0 is needed by package evolution Error: Missing Dependency: libdbus-1.so.0 is needed by package gnome-utils Error: Missing Dependency: libdbus-1.so.0 is needed by package evolution Error: Missing Dependency: libhal.so.0 is needed by package hal cheers L From iago.rubio at hispalinux.es Tue Mar 8 19:40:39 2005 From: iago.rubio at hispalinux.es (Iago Rubio) Date: Tue, 08 Mar 2005 20:40:39 +0100 Subject: Bug Reporting Question In-Reply-To: <1110299081.3087.7.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> References: <20050308161811.26667.qmail@web8502.mail.in.yahoo.com> <1110299081.3087.7.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> Message-ID: <1110310839.22203.48.camel@speedy.iagorubio.net> On Tue, 2005-03-08 at 11:24 -0500, David Cary Hart wrote: > Well I know that I CAN. So you are saying that filing to b-r-c is > preferable to ximian? I don't think so. If it's a source package from upstream, it have nothing to do with fedora. You should file this bug on Ximian's bugzilla if you downloaded the sources from Ximian, or if it's a upstream problem consistent with upstream sources. Regards. -- Iago Rubio From Curtis at GreenKey.net Tue Mar 8 19:42:18 2005 From: Curtis at GreenKey.net (Curtis Doty) Date: Tue, 8 Mar 2005 11:42:18 -0800 (PST) Subject: ethereal rpm tweaks Message-ID: <200503081942.j28JgJu12103@alopias.GreenKey.net> I just noticed that the Fedora ethereal rpm requests net-snmp support but it is never actually turned on. If this is a bug, the solution is to explicitly enable the ssl crypto library; then net-snmp support will compile in too. Also, I've found the concurrent dns feature quite handy and have had success compiling against Dag's adns rpm. I've not bothered to try the one in extras. Current: Compiled with GLib 2.4.8, with libpcap 0.8.3, with libz 1.2.1.2, without libpcre, without UCD-SNMP or Net-SNMP, without ADNS. Proposed: Compiled with GLib 2.4.8, with libpcap 0.8.3, with libz 1.2.1.2, without libpcre, with Net-SNMP 5.1.2, with ADNS. Linked is an example diff which also includes a few missing build deps. http://www.greenkey.net/~curtis/rpm/src/SPECPATCH/ethereal-0.10.9/ethereal.spec.patch.html ../C From Nicolas.Mailhot at laPoste.net Tue Mar 8 19:43:28 2005 From: Nicolas.Mailhot at laPoste.net (Nicolas Mailhot) Date: Tue, 08 Mar 2005 20:43:28 +0100 Subject: Including OO templates in fc4 In-Reply-To: <20050308191343.89641.qmail@web8509.mail.in.yahoo.com> References: <20050308191343.89641.qmail@web8509.mail.in.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1110311008.25559.65.camel@rousalka.dyndns.org> Le mardi 08 mars 2005 ? 11:13 -0800, Rahul Sundaram a ?crit : > Hi > > > > > The hard part is though now all Linux distribution > > packages have more or > > less the same properties they don't all use the same > > on-disk format. So > > you will probably need relays for every single Linux > > distribution you > > care about (ok realistically a rpm release + a deb > > release + a tar.gz > > release should cover almost everyone). > > or better use the autopackage(.org) to create a distro > neutral package. they are about to release a 1.0 > release very shortly A lot of people distrust autopackage because by letting every random project release its binaries the way it wants it sidesteps the sanity and consistency checks a real distro does. So yes by all means do provide autopackages too. Just don't expect them to supersede all the rest. regards, -- Nicolas Mailhot -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part URL: From rahulsundaram at yahoo.co.in Tue Mar 8 19:44:01 2005 From: rahulsundaram at yahoo.co.in (Rahul Sundaram) Date: Tue, 8 Mar 2005 11:44:01 -0800 (PST) Subject: ethereal rpm tweaks In-Reply-To: 6667 Message-ID: <20050308194401.59586.qmail@web8504.mail.in.yahoo.com> --- Curtis Doty wrote: > I just noticed that the Fedora ethereal rpm requests > net-snmp support but > it is never actually turned on. If this is a bug, > the solution is to > explicitly enable the ssl crypto library; then > net-snmp support will > compile in too. > > Also, I've found the concurrent dns feature quite > handy and have had > success compiling against Dag's adns rpm. I've not > bothered to try the one > in extras. > > Current: > Compiled with GLib 2.4.8, with libpcap 0.8.3, with > libz 1.2.1.2, > without libpcre, without UCD-SNMP or Net-SNMP, > without ADNS. > > Proposed: > Compiled with GLib 2.4.8, with libpcap 0.8.3, with > libz 1.2.1.2, > without libpcre, with Net-SNMP 5.1.2, with ADNS. > > Linked is an example diff which also includes a few > missing build deps. > http://www.greenkey.net/~curtis/rpm/src/SPECPATCH/ethereal-0.10.9/ethereal.spec.patch.html > it would be a good idea to put this in bugzilla.redhat.com Regards Rahul Sundaram __________________________________ Celebrate Yahoo!'s 10th Birthday! Yahoo! Netrospective: 100 Moments of the Web http://birthday.yahoo.com/netrospective/ From rahulsundaram at yahoo.co.in Tue Mar 8 19:50:37 2005 From: rahulsundaram at yahoo.co.in (Rahul Sundaram) Date: Tue, 8 Mar 2005 11:50:37 -0800 (PST) Subject: Including OO templates in fc4 In-Reply-To: 6667 Message-ID: <20050308195037.94489.qmail@web8509.mail.in.yahoo.com> Hi > A lot of people distrust autopackage because by > letting every random > project release its binaries the way it wants it > sidesteps the sanity > and consistency checks a real distro does. not true since not a lot of people dont use autopackage at all yet. if you mean they distrust the distributed model of letting upstream developers release the binaries themselves instead of relying on the centralised and distro redundant centralised repository model then they dont the usefulness of a distro neutral packaging method. besides autopackage has planned rpm integration for a future version. you should take any valid complaints to the developers themselves and give them a chance to explain the logic. > > So yes by all means do provide autopackages too. > Just don't expect them > to supersede all the rest. no need to play the popularity game here Regards Rahul Sundaram __________________________________ Celebrate Yahoo!'s 10th Birthday! Yahoo! Netrospective: 100 Moments of the Web http://birthday.yahoo.com/netrospective/ From katzj at redhat.com Tue Mar 8 20:00:14 2005 From: katzj at redhat.com (Jeremy Katz) Date: Tue, 08 Mar 2005 15:00:14 -0500 Subject: rawhide report: 20050308 changes In-Reply-To: References: <200503081225.j28CPwd6004417@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> Message-ID: <1110312015.25477.0.camel@bree.local.net> On Tue, 2005-03-08 at 20:10 +0100, Lars wrote: > i get these yum errors when updating. > > Error: Missing Dependency: libhal.so.0 is needed by package gnome-utils > Error: Missing Dependency: libdbus-glib-1.so.0 is needed by package evolution > Error: Missing Dependency: libdbus-1.so.0 is needed by package gnome-utils > Error: Missing Dependency: libdbus-1.so.0 is needed by package evolution > Error: Missing Dependency: libhal.so.0 is needed by package hal The remaining packages were working on being fixed up and rebuilt earlier today. So should hopefully be fixed for tomorrow. Jeremy From Nicolas.Mailhot at laPoste.net Tue Mar 8 20:06:57 2005 From: Nicolas.Mailhot at laPoste.net (Nicolas Mailhot) Date: Tue, 08 Mar 2005 21:06:57 +0100 Subject: Including OO templates in fc4 In-Reply-To: <20050308195037.94489.qmail@web8509.mail.in.yahoo.com> References: <20050308195037.94489.qmail@web8509.mail.in.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1110312428.25559.74.camel@rousalka.dyndns.org> Le mardi 08 mars 2005 ? 11:50 -0800, Rahul Sundaram a ?crit : > Hi > > > A lot of people distrust autopackage because by > > letting every random > > project release its binaries the way it wants it > > sidesteps the sanity > > and consistency checks a real distro does. > > not true since not a lot of people dont use > autopackage at all yet. if you mean they distrust the > distributed model of letting upstream developers > release the binaries themselves instead of relying on > the centralised and distro redundant centralised > repository model then they dont the usefulness of a > distro neutral packaging method. besides autopackage > has planned rpm integration for a future version. you > should take any valid complaints to the developers > themselves and give them a chance to explain the > logic. I'm not here to argue the pros and cons of autopackage. The fact is autopackage has not convinced an overwhelming majority of Linux users yet, and therefore it would be stupid of OpenOffice.org (which is not in the Linux packaging market and only wants to distribute its stuff as widely as possible) to back autopackage exclusively. If I wanted to give partisan advice like you seem to I wouldn't have mentioned both debs and rpms in the message you replied to. -- Nicolas Mailhot -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part URL: From rahulsundaram at yahoo.co.in Tue Mar 8 20:18:56 2005 From: rahulsundaram at yahoo.co.in (Rahul Sundaram) Date: Tue, 8 Mar 2005 12:18:56 -0800 (PST) Subject: Including OO templates in fc4 In-Reply-To: 6667 Message-ID: <20050308201856.88012.qmail@web8501.mail.in.yahoo.com> Hi > I'm not here to argue the pros and cons of > autopackage. > > The fact is autopackage has not convinced an > overwhelming majority of > Linux users yet, and therefore it would be stupid of > OpenOffice.org > (which is not in the Linux packaging market and only > wants to distribute > its stuff as widely as possible) to back autopackage > exclusively. Popularity shouldnt prevent anyone from using something if it suits them. autopackage is not yet "famous" because it is just about have a 1.0 release and will only maintain API/ABI stability from that point. btw many popular software like abiword,gimp, inkscape etc already have autopackaged versions Regards Rahul Sundaram __________________________________ Celebrate Yahoo!'s 10th Birthday! Yahoo! Netrospective: 100 Moments of the Web http://birthday.yahoo.com/netrospective/ From wtogami at redhat.com Tue Mar 8 20:20:51 2005 From: wtogami at redhat.com (Warren Togami) Date: Tue, 08 Mar 2005 10:20:51 -1000 Subject: vte for FC3/FC4 testing In-Reply-To: <1110283379.5194.12.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <422D8006.6000806@togami.com> <1110283379.5194.12.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <422E0923.5060501@redhat.com> Kjartan Maraas wrote: > > > I tried adjusting VTE_DISPLAY_TIMEOUT and VTE_COALESCE_TIMEOUT to find > the best compromise between speed and smooth output in the terminal and > I *think* I found something that should be ok. If others want to > experiment with those values to see if it can be improved further that > would be nice. The other speedups are partly from the patches already in > FC3 and also some new performance patches from Benjamin Otte. Thanks for your efforts! >>* Mon Mar 07 2005 Warren Togami 0.11.12-1 >>- upgrade to 0.11.12 >>- remove upstreamed patches (0-2, 5-9) >>- disable patch3, either not needed anymore, or needs rewriting >>- reverse patch4, because upstream merged its horrible brokenness >>- test Novell's excessive malloc for new terminals patch v3 >> (GNOME #160993) >> > > Great that this went in so it can get more testing before inclusion > upstream. I think Novell are shipping with this patch in SuSE 9.3 also. I just pushed this package to FC4. Not sure if it will make FC4test1, but we'll see. I didn't get a chance to try your 0.11.13 yet. Maybe we can consider it for rawhide sometime after test1. >>2) It seems that upstream made a new vte-0.11.12 release with most of >>Fedora's patches + more stuff. This is good. >> >>Unfortunately they also merged Patch4: >>vte-0.11.11-fix-update-order.patch which was commented out since late >>October since it totally screwed up rendering [1]. This is bad. Makes >>me wonder if they actually TESTED 0.11.12 before releasing it upstream... >> > > Of course it was tested. Nobody reported any problems with rendering > with the patch included and I can't reproduce the problems you're > describing myself either. I tried building stuff cat'ing large amounts > of text ls + ENTER etc. http://people.redhat.com/wtogami/temp/vte-badpatch.png http://people.redhat.com/wtogami/temp/vte-badpatch2.png Uncommented the Patch4 reverse and this is what happens. Entire lines fail to render and instead you get that black box, which appears to be the cursor. If you click on the terminal or ALT-TAB twice, then the en > >>[1] Run gnome-terminal, type ls, hit ENTER a few times. What should be >>the bash prompt turned into a black bar. You'll see lots of similar >>rendering trouble while building something too... like vte. >> > > As I said, I can't reproduce any of this here. Do you have pointers to > reports of these problems in bugzilla or anywhere else? > Sorry I should have been less accusatory in my language, especially since... this is actually Red Hat's fault. IIRC back in October Ray Strode merged that patch on the request of Owen. I complained loudly because of the bad behavior in those screenshots above. So Ray commented out the patch, but kept it in the SRPM for later review which never happened. Then on February 16 you asked him for details about the Fedora vte patches, and he included that disabled patch in his reply. He wrote, "fix-update-order - an owen patch to make sure the screen is fully redrawn before scrolling. I think owen said this patch had issues, but people wanted it anyway I think, so i applied it." I am puzzled why others are unable to reproduce that behavior. It happens so readily on my FC3 desktop. Warren Togami wtogami at redhat.com From jspaleta at gmail.com Tue Mar 8 20:26:15 2005 From: jspaleta at gmail.com (Jeff Spaleta) Date: Tue, 8 Mar 2005 15:26:15 -0500 Subject: Including OO templates in fc4 In-Reply-To: <20050308201856.88012.qmail@web8501.mail.in.yahoo.com> References: <20050308201856.88012.qmail@web8501.mail.in.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <604aa79105030812265efc1295@mail.gmail.com> On Tue, 8 Mar 2005 12:18:56 -0800 (PST), Rahul Sundaram > autopackage is not yet > "famous" because it is just about have a 1.0 release > and will only maintain API/ABI stability from that > point. I'm pretty sure you mean imfamous. -jef"name the movie:Ah, Dusty! Infamous is when you're more than famous! "spaleta From Nicolas.Mailhot at laPoste.net Tue Mar 8 20:34:45 2005 From: Nicolas.Mailhot at laPoste.net (Nicolas Mailhot) Date: Tue, 08 Mar 2005 21:34:45 +0100 Subject: vte for FC3/FC4 testing In-Reply-To: <422E0923.5060501@redhat.com> References: <422D8006.6000806@togami.com> <1110283379.5194.12.camel@localhost.localdomain> <422E0923.5060501@redhat.com> Message-ID: <1110314094.27193.6.camel@rousalka.dyndns.org> Le mardi 08 mars 2005 ? 10:20 -1000, Warren Togami a ?crit : > Kjartan Maraas wrote: > > > >>[1] Run gnome-terminal, type ls, hit ENTER a few times. What should be > >>the bash prompt turned into a black bar. You'll see lots of similar > >>rendering trouble while building something too... like vte. > >> > > > > As I said, I can't reproduce any of this here. Do you have pointers to > > reports of these problems in bugzilla or anywhere else? > > > > Sorry I should have been less accusatory in my language, especially > since... this is actually Red Hat's fault. IIRC back in October Ray > Strode merged that patch on the request of Owen. I complained loudly > because of the bad behavior in those screenshots above. So Ray > commented out the patch, but kept it in the SRPM for later review which > never happened. > > Then on February 16 you asked him for details about the Fedora vte > patches, and he included that disabled patch in his reply. He wrote, > "fix-update-order - an owen patch to make sure the screen is fully > redrawn before scrolling. I think owen said this patch had issues, but > people wanted it anyway I think, so i applied it." > > I am puzzled why others are unable to reproduce that behavior. It > happens so readily on my FC3 desktop. I can confirm I've often had strange behaviour in gnome-term in the past (usually all-black overlay in a new tab/terminal that's supposed to be black-on-wheat when the system is loaded). Can't say if it's still the case though. regards, -- Nicolas Mailhot -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part URL: From wtogami at redhat.com Tue Mar 8 20:46:32 2005 From: wtogami at redhat.com (Warren Togami) Date: Tue, 08 Mar 2005 10:46:32 -1000 Subject: vte for FC3/FC4 testing In-Reply-To: <1110314094.27193.6.camel@rousalka.dyndns.org> References: <422D8006.6000806@togami.com> <1110283379.5194.12.camel@localhost.localdomain> <422E0923.5060501@redhat.com> <1110314094.27193.6.camel@rousalka.dyndns.org> Message-ID: <422E0F28.1090103@redhat.com> Nicolas Mailhot wrote: > > I can confirm I've often had strange behaviour in gnome-term in the past > (usually all-black overlay in a new tab/terminal that's supposed to be > black-on-wheat when the system is loaded). > > Can't say if it's still the case though. > That is a separate issue having to do with timing, fixed with patches in FC4 since around November. Warren Togami wtogami at redhat.com From pmatilai at welho.com Tue Mar 8 20:47:27 2005 From: pmatilai at welho.com (Panu Matilainen) Date: Tue, 08 Mar 2005 22:47:27 +0200 Subject: vte for FC3/FC4 testing In-Reply-To: <1110314094.27193.6.camel@rousalka.dyndns.org> References: <422D8006.6000806@togami.com> <1110283379.5194.12.camel@localhost.localdomain> <422E0923.5060501@redhat.com> <1110314094.27193.6.camel@rousalka.dyndns.org> Message-ID: <1110314847.27720.11.camel@chip.laiskiainen.org> On Tue, 2005-03-08 at 21:34 +0100, Nicolas Mailhot wrote: > > Then on February 16 you asked him for details about the Fedora vte > > patches, and he included that disabled patch in his reply. He wrote, > > "fix-update-order - an owen patch to make sure the screen is fully > > redrawn before scrolling. I think owen said this patch had issues, but > > people wanted it anyway I think, so i applied it." > > > > I am puzzled why others are unable to reproduce that behavior. It > > happens so readily on my FC3 desktop. > > I can confirm I've often had strange behaviour in gnome-term in the past > (usually all-black overlay in a new tab/terminal that's supposed to be > black-on-wheat when the system is loaded). > > Can't say if it's still the case though. That's nearly 100% reproducable for me, been since RHL 9/FC1'is and still present in FC3. Just open up a new gnome-terminal and hit shift- crtl-n two times, on the last tab every cell without text in it is black. IIRC the patches in this package http://fedora.laiskiainen.org/SRPMS.patches/vte-0.11.11-0.fc2.1.src.rpm made that problem disappear, along with speeding it up enormously but it's been a while and I might be wrong :-/ - Panu - From pmatilai at welho.com Tue Mar 8 20:52:45 2005 From: pmatilai at welho.com (Panu Matilainen) Date: Tue, 08 Mar 2005 22:52:45 +0200 Subject: vte for FC3/FC4 testing In-Reply-To: <1110314847.27720.11.camel@chip.laiskiainen.org> References: <422D8006.6000806@togami.com> <1110283379.5194.12.camel@localhost.localdomain> <422E0923.5060501@redhat.com> <1110314094.27193.6.camel@rousalka.dyndns.org> <1110314847.27720.11.camel@chip.laiskiainen.org> Message-ID: <1110315165.27720.13.camel@chip.laiskiainen.org> On Tue, 2005-03-08 at 22:47 +0200, Panu Matilainen wrote: > On Tue, 2005-03-08 at 21:34 +0100, Nicolas Mailhot wrote: > > > > Then on February 16 you asked him for details about the Fedora vte > > > patches, and he included that disabled patch in his reply. He wrote, > > > "fix-update-order - an owen patch to make sure the screen is fully > > > redrawn before scrolling. I think owen said this patch had issues, but > > > people wanted it anyway I think, so i applied it." > > > > > > I am puzzled why others are unable to reproduce that behavior. It > > > happens so readily on my FC3 desktop. > > > > I can confirm I've often had strange behaviour in gnome-term in the past > > (usually all-black overlay in a new tab/terminal that's supposed to be > > black-on-wheat when the system is loaded). > > > > Can't say if it's still the case though. > > That's nearly 100% reproducable for me, been since RHL 9/FC1'is and > still present in FC3. Just open up a new gnome-terminal and hit shift- > crtl-n two times, on the last tab every cell without text in it is > black. IIRC the patches in this package > http://fedora.laiskiainen.org/SRPMS.patches/vte-0.11.11-0.fc2.1.src.rpm > made that problem disappear, along with speeding it up enormously but > it's been a while and I might be wrong :-/ Oh and with vte-0.11.12-0.FC3 I'm not able to reproduce the "black screen" problem anymore. - Panu - From thacker at math.cornell.edu Tue Mar 8 20:58:17 2005 From: thacker at math.cornell.edu (John Thacker) Date: Tue, 8 Mar 2005 15:58:17 -0500 Subject: vte for FC3/FC4 testing In-Reply-To: <1110314847.27720.11.camel@chip.laiskiainen.org> References: <422D8006.6000806@togami.com> <1110283379.5194.12.camel@localhost.localdomain> <422E0923.5060501@redhat.com> <1110314094.27193.6.camel@rousalka.dyndns.org> <1110314847.27720.11.camel@chip.laiskiainen.org> Message-ID: <20050308205817.GA18113@thacker.dyndns.org> On Tue, Mar 08, 2005 at 10:47:27PM +0200, Panu Matilainen wrote: > > That's nearly 100% reproducable for me, been since RHL 9/FC1'is and > still present in FC3. Just open up a new gnome-terminal and hit shift- > crtl-n two times, on the last tab every cell without text in it is > black. IIRC the patches in this package > http://fedora.laiskiainen.org/SRPMS.patches/vte-0.11.11-0.fc2.1.src.rpm > made that problem disappear, along with speeding it up enormously but > it's been a while and I might be wrong :-/ Not as annoying as the ugly terminal clutter when scrolling in mutt. But all that has been fixed in FC4 for a while. Actually, IMO, FC3 ought to update vte to include these fixes. I just grabbed the rawhide version a while ago to keep from having to hit CTRL-L half the time I scrolled while reading mail. John Thacker -- "In the minds of the public, prices apparently go up when businesses suddenly start to feel greedier. Economists, in contrast, expect businesses to be greedy year-in, year-out; but depending on market conditions, greed may call for prices to go up, go down, or stay the same."-- Bryan Caplan -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: not available URL: From perbj at stanford.edu Tue Mar 8 21:22:02 2005 From: perbj at stanford.edu (Per Bjornsson) Date: Tue, 08 Mar 2005 13:22:02 -0800 Subject: vte for FC3/FC4 testing In-Reply-To: <422E0923.5060501@redhat.com> References: <422D8006.6000806@togami.com> <1110283379.5194.12.camel@localhost.localdomain> <422E0923.5060501@redhat.com> Message-ID: <1110316922.5126.62.camel@localhost.localdomain> On Tue, 2005-03-08 at 10:20 -1000, Warren Togami wrote: > I just pushed this package to FC4. Not sure if it will make FC4test1, > but we'll see. I didn't get a chance to try your 0.11.13 yet. Maybe we > can consider it for rawhide sometime after test1. Any chance to get an FC3 update as well? Not only is the vte in FC3 slow, it also has really annoying rendering bugs (easily seen e.g. in nano, https://bugzilla.redhat.com/beta/show_bug.cgi?id=127972 ). Until today I was using a rawhide version I rebuilt some time ago (per comment in that bug report); I've given your new version (0.11.12-0.FC3) a spin and I haven't hit any problems yet. In fact, I think it fixes a couple of residual problems that I had (but I can't tell for sure yet since I couldn't figure out exactly how to reproduce them, it was mainly occasional screen corruption when scrolling a lot). It would be wonderful if you could shove this version into FC3 updates-testing ASAP and see if others have the same experience. Thanks, Per -- Per Bjornsson Ph.D. Candidate, Department of Applied Physics, Stanford University From seyman at wanadoo.fr Tue Mar 8 21:33:45 2005 From: seyman at wanadoo.fr (Emmanuel Seyman) Date: Tue, 8 Mar 2005 22:33:45 +0100 Subject: vte for FC3/FC4 testing In-Reply-To: <20050308205817.GA18113@thacker.dyndns.org> References: <422D8006.6000806@togami.com> <1110283379.5194.12.camel@localhost.localdomain> <422E0923.5060501@redhat.com> <1110314094.27193.6.camel@rousalka.dyndns.org> <1110314847.27720.11.camel@chip.laiskiainen.org> <20050308205817.GA18113@thacker.dyndns.org> Message-ID: <20050308213345.GA29542@orient.maison.moi> On Tue, Mar 08, 2005 at 03:58:17PM -0500, John Thacker wrote: > > Not as annoying as the ugly terminal clutter when scrolling in mutt. > But all that has been fixed in FC4 for a while. Actually, IMO, FC3 > ought to update vte to include these fixes. I just grabbed the rawhide > version a while ago to keep from having to hit CTRL-L half the time > I scrolled while reading mail. Upgrading to Rawhide's vte didn't completely solve it for me but Warren's package looks much better. See the last comment on bug 139294. https://bugzilla.redhat.com/beta/show_bug.cgi?id=139294 Emmanuel From wtogami at redhat.com Tue Mar 8 21:41:34 2005 From: wtogami at redhat.com (Warren Togami) Date: Tue, 08 Mar 2005 11:41:34 -1000 Subject: vte for FC3/FC4 testing In-Reply-To: <1110316922.5126.62.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <422D8006.6000806@togami.com> <1110283379.5194.12.camel@localhost.localdomain> <422E0923.5060501@redhat.com> <1110316922.5126.62.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <422E1C0E.4020601@redhat.com> Per Bjornsson wrote: > On Tue, 2005-03-08 at 10:20 -1000, Warren Togami wrote: > >>I just pushed this package to FC4. Not sure if it will make FC4test1, >>but we'll see. I didn't get a chance to try your 0.11.13 yet. Maybe we >>can consider it for rawhide sometime after test1. > > > Any chance to get an FC3 update as well? Not only is the vte in FC3 > slow, it also has really annoying rendering bugs (easily seen e.g. in > nano, https://bugzilla.redhat.com/beta/show_bug.cgi?id=127972 ). > > Until today I was using a rawhide version I rebuilt some time ago (per > comment in that bug report); I've given your new version (0.11.12-0.FC3) > a spin and I haven't hit any problems yet. In fact, I think it fixes a > couple of residual problems that I had (but I can't tell for sure yet > since I couldn't figure out exactly how to reproduce them, it was mainly > occasional screen corruption when scrolling a lot). It would be > wonderful if you could shove this version into FC3 updates-testing ASAP > and see if others have the same experience. > It seems that this 0.11.12 based package is much better than FC3, but I am more concerned about long-term runtime problems. Keep testing it, and stress it hard, try to make it break. If nobody complains for a while then we'll push this to FC3 updates. Warren Togami wtogami at redhat.com From perbj at stanford.edu Tue Mar 8 21:57:22 2005 From: perbj at stanford.edu (Per Bjornsson) Date: Tue, 08 Mar 2005 13:57:22 -0800 Subject: vte for FC3/FC4 testing In-Reply-To: <422E1C0E.4020601@redhat.com> References: <422D8006.6000806@togami.com> <1110283379.5194.12.camel@localhost.localdomain> <422E0923.5060501@redhat.com> <1110316922.5126.62.camel@localhost.localdomain> <422E1C0E.4020601@redhat.com> Message-ID: <1110319043.5126.74.camel@localhost.localdomain> On Tue, 2005-03-08 at 11:41 -1000, Warren Togami wrote: > It seems that this 0.11.12 based package is much better than FC3, but I > am more concerned about long-term runtime problems. Keep testing it, > and stress it hard, try to make it break. If nobody complains for a > while then we'll push this to FC3 updates. OK. Considering how quickly I (and apparently many others) broke the FC3 version I sort of think that the wider testing that sticking it in updates-testing would get you could be beneficial. People who use packages from there should expect to have to find problems, it's a testing repository after all, and it doesn't seem that this update could cause data corruption or anything like that. In any case, I'll certainly keep this package for now and see what I can do to kill it. ;) Cheers, Per -- Per Bjornsson Ph.D. Candidate, Department of Applied Physics, Stanford University From george.liu at ussj.ricoh.com Wed Mar 9 00:44:10 2005 From: george.liu at ussj.ricoh.com (George Liu) Date: Tue, 8 Mar 2005 16:44:10 -0800 Subject: Can someone direct me to the source code of "Printer Configuration Tool?" Message-ID: <8B8709E6C8B8784583FA9C7C013CB451061BB0@etd1.etd.ussj.ricoh.com> -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From johnp at redhat.com Wed Mar 9 00:45:54 2005 From: johnp at redhat.com (John (J5) Palmieri) Date: Tue, 08 Mar 2005 19:45:54 -0500 Subject: Can someone direct me to the source code of "Printer Configuration Tool?" In-Reply-To: <8B8709E6C8B8784583FA9C7C013CB451061BB0@etd1.etd.ussj.ricoh.com> References: <8B8709E6C8B8784583FA9C7C013CB451061BB0@etd1.etd.ussj.ricoh.com> Message-ID: <1110329154.20497.100.camel@localhost.localdomain> What are you looking for? You can get the source by downloading the srpm and installing them. There are a number of printer configuration packages such as system-config-printer or hal-cups-utils that work together to provide the fedora printing configuration system. -- J5 From rodd at clarkson.id.au Wed Mar 9 01:53:38 2005 From: rodd at clarkson.id.au (Rodd Clarkson) Date: Wed, 09 Mar 2005 12:53:38 +1100 Subject: system-config-network launches bug-buddy, but bug-buddy doesn't include bugzilla.redhat.com entries Message-ID: <1110333218.4625.16.camel@localhost.localdomain> Hmmm, maybe that subject is too long ;-] system-config-network has failed to start for me for the past few days. I'm sure that smarter minds that I know this and are working on it (or maybe I'm stupid to presume) but I've noticed something even weirder as part of this crash. When system-config-network crashes, bug-buddy opens to allow you to report the crash. However, in the report window, Select a Product or Application doesn't list either system-config-network, or any bugzilla.redhat.com packages which makes it a lot hard to file bug reports on this. Also, it's got some nasty implications for bugzilla.gnome.org because it's likely that they will get many of these reports (that have nothing to do with gnome), placing extra load on the gnome developers. I seems that if system-config-network (and presumably system-config-*) is to use bug-buddy for bug reports, then items in bugzilla.redhat.com need to be included in the list of Products or Applications. Rodd From rodd at clarkson.id.au Wed Mar 9 02:10:10 2005 From: rodd at clarkson.id.au (Rodd Clarkson) Date: Wed, 09 Mar 2005 13:10:10 +1100 Subject: system-config-network launches bug-buddy, but bug-buddy doesn't include bugzilla.redhat.com entries In-Reply-To: <1110333218.4625.16.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <1110333218.4625.16.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <1110334210.4625.19.camel@localhost.localdomain> On Wed, 2005-03-09 at 12:53 +1100, Rodd Clarkson wrote: > Hmmm, maybe that subject is too long ;-] > > system-config-network has failed to start for me for the past few days. > I'm sure that smarter minds that I know this and are working on it (or > maybe I'm stupid to presume) but I've noticed something even weirder as > part of this crash. Replying to one's self: Stupid to assume. Went and check bugzilla.redhat.com and found nothing about this crash (that I could see) Posted bug report: https://bugzilla.redhat.com/beta/show_bug.cgi?id=150633 Rodd From smooge at gmail.com Wed Mar 9 02:34:07 2005 From: smooge at gmail.com (Stephen J. Smoogen) Date: Tue, 8 Mar 2005 19:34:07 -0700 Subject: Package pruning for FC4 and beyond In-Reply-To: <1109897273.23585.0.camel@cutter> References: <422007DD.1020404@snowmoon.com> <42207BEB.7020000@snowmoon.com> <422086A8.7020200@snowmoon.com> <604aa79105022607043d109bf1@mail.gmail.com> <422092F8.4050003@snowmoon.com> <80d7e4090503031641182ede91@mail.gmail.com> <1109897273.23585.0.camel@cutter> Message-ID: <80d7e40905030818345231c61e@mail.gmail.com> On Thu, 03 Mar 2005 19:47:53 -0500, seth vidal wrote: > > > freeradius is used a lot on mixed windows/unix enviroments. You might > > as well kill kerberos if you kill that one. > > > > to be fair, it's not killing, it's just moving. > > and to my knowledge nothing links to freeradius like things link to > krb5. > That is true. Sorry.. its been a crappy set of weeks in .gov land and should give a bit more lag time before posting. [Or as Tim Powers used to say.. if Smooge says something sort of angry like he will post a retraction later :)] -- Stephen J Smoogen. CSIRT/Linux System Administrator From smooge at gmail.com Wed Mar 9 02:36:12 2005 From: smooge at gmail.com (Stephen J. Smoogen) Date: Tue, 8 Mar 2005 19:36:12 -0700 Subject: Freeradius 1.0.2 In-Reply-To: <1109912874.23585.36.camel@cutter> References: <80d7e40905030316471ee1e398@mail.gmail.com> <1109897783.23585.2.camel@cutter> <5256d0b05030320557a2973cb@mail.gmail.com> <1109912874.23585.36.camel@cutter> Message-ID: <80d7e40905030818365cab03cb@mail.gmail.com> On Fri, 04 Mar 2005 00:07:54 -0500, seth vidal wrote: > On Fri, 2005-03-04 at 12:55 +0800, Peter Robinson wrote: > > > > Our freeradius server guys were wondering if an updated .src.rpm was > > > > coming into rawhide soon? They are back compiling the fedora rpms to > > > > red hat enterprise 3 due to some security plan and development issues > > > > that require it. > > > > > > > > > > yet another good reason to move freeradius to extras. :) > > > > I'd disagree. In a corporate environment I think a radius server is > > essential. I use it for auth for dialup, VPN, wireless and all sorts > > of other things so I don't need multiple user lists all around the > > place. > > I agree it is essential! That's why you want someone maintaining it more > actively in extras. Someone who uses it every day, someone who relies on > it. I think the problem is that a lot of us in the corporate enviroment are using Fedora to track what is going on in the next Red Hat Enterprise.. and when things go off to Extras it looks like a larger workload for us to keep up on. -- Stephen J Smoogen. CSIRT/Linux System Administrator From florin at andrei.myip.org Wed Mar 9 03:04:39 2005 From: florin at andrei.myip.org (Florin Andrei) Date: Tue, 08 Mar 2005 19:04:39 -0800 Subject: fedora on a flash drive In-Reply-To: <20050308001810.GC16477@devserv.devel.redhat.com> References: <1110234715.5962.20.camel@stantz.corp.sgi.com> <200503071713.30150.lsomike@futzin.com> <1110237804.5962.34.camel@stantz.corp.sgi.com> <20050308001810.GC16477@devserv.devel.redhat.com> Message-ID: <1110337479.6197.1.camel@rivendell.home.local> On Mon, 2005-03-07 at 19:18 -0500, Alan Cox wrote: > Ext3 with data-logging enabled and disk write cache off is > very reliable. Alan, you're evil. :-) I did that on the root partition but i didn't knew about rootflags=data=journal in grub.conf :-/ Now i added the rootflags to it (using the rescue CD) but the system is still not booting properly. :-( Hmmm... I'm missing something here... -- Florin Andrei http://florin.myip.org/ From florin at andrei.myip.org Wed Mar 9 03:22:03 2005 From: florin at andrei.myip.org (Florin Andrei) Date: Tue, 08 Mar 2005 19:22:03 -0800 Subject: fedora on a flash drive In-Reply-To: <1110337479.6197.1.camel@rivendell.home.local> References: <1110234715.5962.20.camel@stantz.corp.sgi.com> <200503071713.30150.lsomike@futzin.com> <1110237804.5962.34.camel@stantz.corp.sgi.com> <20050308001810.GC16477@devserv.devel.redhat.com> <1110337479.6197.1.camel@rivendell.home.local> Message-ID: <1110338523.6197.3.camel@rivendell.home.local> On Tue, 2005-03-08 at 19:04 -0800, Florin Andrei wrote: > On Mon, 2005-03-07 at 19:18 -0500, Alan Cox wrote: > > > Ext3 with data-logging enabled and disk write cache off is > > very reliable. > > Alan, you're evil. :-) I did that on the root partition but i didn't > knew about rootflags=data=journal in grub.conf :-/ > Now i added the rootflags to it (using the rescue CD) but the system is > still not booting properly. :-( Rebuilding the initrd fixed it. that was scary... -- Florin Andrei http://florin.myip.org/ From mihai at xcyb.org Wed Mar 9 07:57:35 2005 From: mihai at xcyb.org (Mihai Maties) Date: Wed, 9 Mar 2005 09:57:35 +0200 Subject: Drop libdbi in FC4 Message-ID: <200503090957.35618@xcyb0rg> I filed a bug last summer about the libdbi package being extremely outdated. ( https://bugzilla.redhat.com/beta/show_bug.cgi?id=126421 ). Considering the fact that no other core package requires libdbi I believe that this package definitely belongs in Extras and not in Core. I am willing to maintain libdbi in Extras but I cannot do that as long as FC keeps providing the old version. Mihai -- This message was scanned for spam and viruses by BitDefender. For more information please visit http://linux.bitdefender.com/ From fherrera at onirica.com Wed Mar 9 08:30:15 2005 From: fherrera at onirica.com (Fernando Herrera) Date: Wed, 09 Mar 2005 09:30:15 +0100 Subject: system-config-network launches bug-buddy, but bug-buddy doesn't include bugzilla.redhat.com entries In-Reply-To: <1110333218.4625.16.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <1110333218.4625.16.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <1110357015.17147.33.camel@dyckola> El mi??, 09-03-2005 a las 12:53 +1100, Rodd Clarkson escribi??: > Hmmm, maybe that subject is too long ;-] > > system-config-network has failed to start for me for the past few days. > I'm sure that smarter minds that I know this and are working on it (or > maybe I'm stupid to presume) but I've noticed something even weirder as > part of this crash. > > When system-config-network crashes, bug-buddy opens to allow you to > report the crash. However, in the report window, Select a Product or > Application doesn't list either system-config-network, or any > bugzilla.redhat.com packages which makes it a lot hard to file bug > reports on this. > > Also, it's got some nasty implications for bugzilla.gnome.org because > it's likely that they will get many of these reports (that have nothing > to do with gnome), placing extra load on the gnome developers. > > I seems that if system-config-network (and presumably system-config-*) > is to use bug-buddy for bug reports, then items in bugzilla.redhat.com > need to be included in the list of Products or Applications. Every application linking with libgnomeui is showing by default the gnome-crash-dialog when SIGSEGV signal is received. It allows the user to launch bug-buddy. Setting the env var GNOME_DISABLE_CRASH_DIALOG would disable this dialog. If you want to get automagically bug-buddy reports sent to bugzilla.redhat.com for Fedora specific applications you would need: a) add X-GNOME-Bugzilla-* fields to .desktop files b) Provide bugzilla.redhat.com/{config.xml,products.xml,mostfreqs.xml} files c) Add th b.r.c a procmailrc script to import the submitted mail (in the future this is supposed to be migrated to a XML-RPC interface) Another intermediate solution between disabling bug-buddy and adding full support for it would be modify bug-buddy for checking bugzilla info for the crashed application, and if it is not present, show a dialog like this: "Problems with this application should be manually informed to your vendor, please go to [BTS url based on get_distro_name function] and paste copy this report there" Salu2 ______________________________________________ Renovamos el Correo Yahoo!: ?250 MB GRATIS! Nuevos servicios, m?s seguridad http://correo.yahoo.es From radekvokal at gmail.com Wed Mar 9 09:51:52 2005 From: radekvokal at gmail.com (Radek =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Vok=E1l?=) Date: Wed, 09 Mar 2005 10:51:52 +0100 Subject: ethereal rpm tweaks In-Reply-To: <200503081942.j28JgJu12103@alopias.GreenKey.net> References: <200503081942.j28JgJu12103@alopias.GreenKey.net> Message-ID: <1110361912.23127.0.camel@localhost.localdomain> On Tue, 2005-03-08 at 11:42 -0800, Curtis Doty wrote: > Linked is an example diff which also includes a few missing build deps. > http://www.greenkey.net/~curtis/rpm/src/SPECPATCH/ethereal-0.10.9/ethereal.spec.patch.html > > ../C > Thanks for the link, I'll look at it and commit the changes .. Radek From radekvokal at gmail.com Wed Mar 9 11:43:11 2005 From: radekvokal at gmail.com (Radek =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Vok=E1l?=) Date: Wed, 09 Mar 2005 12:43:11 +0100 Subject: ethereal rpm tweaks In-Reply-To: <200503081942.j28JgJu12103@alopias.GreenKey.net> References: <200503081942.j28JgJu12103@alopias.GreenKey.net> Message-ID: <1110368591.23127.8.camel@localhost.localdomain> On Tue, 2005-03-08 at 11:42 -0800, Curtis Doty wrote: > Proposed: > Compiled with GLib 2.4.8, with libpcap 0.8.3, with libz 1.2.1.2, > without libpcre, with Net-SNMP 5.1.2, with ADNS. Ok, from your tweaks only -with-ssl survives. I can't link ethereal with package from extras - adns. Radek From anil411 at gmail.com Wed Mar 9 10:58:44 2005 From: anil411 at gmail.com (anil prasad) Date: Wed, 9 Mar 2005 16:28:44 +0530 Subject: Problem booting domain0 kernel Message-ID: Hi All, I am using kernel-2.6.11-1.1176_FC4.src.rpm alongwith xen-2-20050302.src.rpm. At the time of booting, domain0 kernel gets stuck in init/main.c::start_kernel::local_irq_enable() routine. It looks like, domain0 kernel has problem de-referencing HYPERVISOR_shared_info members. Has anybody seen this problem? Thanks, Anil. From buildsys at redhat.com Wed Mar 9 13:00:50 2005 From: buildsys at redhat.com (Build System) Date: Wed, 9 Mar 2005 08:00:50 -0500 Subject: rawhide report: 20050309 changes Message-ID: <200503091300.j29D0o8q009628@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> New package compat-gcc-296 2.96-RH compatibility libraries New package compat-gcc-32 The compatibility GNU Compiler Collection New package poppler Pdf rendering library New package texi2html A highly customizable texinfo to HTML and other formats translator Removed package gnome-vfs-extras Removed package Omni Removed package wl Removed package mew Removed package flim Removed package ddskk Removed package aspell-ia Updated Packages: amanda-2.4.4p4-3 ---------------- * Tue Mar 08 2005 Jay Fenlason 2.4.4p4-3 - rebuild with gcc4 arptables_jf-0:0.0.8-4 ---------------------- * Tue Mar 08 2005 Jay Fenlason 0.0.8-3 - rebuilt with gcc4 at-3.1.8-68_FC4 --------------- * Tue Mar 08 2005 Jason Vas Dias 3.1.8-68 - Put PAM authentication check in 'check_permissions()', so - user can know when using at(1) if PAM permission is denied. * Tue Mar 08 2005 Jason Vas Dias 3.1.8-67 - better fix for bug 150131: change DAEMON_USERNAME and - DAEMON_GROUPNAME to 'root' . audit-0.6.6-1 ------------- * Tue Mar 08 2005 Steve Grubb 0.6.6-1 - Fix audit_set_pid to try to read a reply, but its non-fatal if no reply. - Remove the read status during init - Change to using pthreads sync mechanism for stopping system - Worker thread should ignore all signals - Change main loop to use select for inbound event handling - Gave pam_loginuid a "failok" option for testing bluez-pin-0.24-2 ---------------- * Tue Mar 08 2005 John (J5) Palmieri 0.24-2 - Add patch to update to ne dbus 0.31 api bluez-utils-2.15-4 ------------------ * Tue Mar 08 2005 John (J5) Palmieri 2.15-4 - fixup new_dbus_api patch * Tue Mar 08 2005 John (J5) Palmieri 2.15-3 - add patch to update to new dbus-0.31 api dbus-0.31-2 ----------- * Tue Mar 08 2005 John (J5) Palmieri - 0.31-2 - Remove precompiled init script and let the sources generate it eclipse-bugzilla-1:0.1.0_fc-7 ----------------------------- * Mon Mar 07 2005 Jeff Pound 0.1.0-7_fc - Fix query dialog UI. enscript-1.6.1-31 ----------------- * Tue Mar 08 2005 Tim Waugh 1.6.1-31 - Fixed po files (bug #149859). evince-0.1.7-1 -------------- * Tue Mar 08 2005 Marco Pesenti Gritti - 0.1.7-1 - Update to 0.1.7 - Install the new schemas * Tue Mar 08 2005 Marco Pesenti Gritti - 0.1.6-1 - Update to 0.1.6 - Add poppler dependency evolution-2.2.0-2 ----------------- * Tue Mar 08 2005 David Malcolm - 2.2.0-2 - actually add source tarball this time * Tue Mar 08 2005 David Malcolm - 2.2.0-1 - 2.2.0 - Removed patch for GCC 4 fix as this is now in upstream tarball - Updated requirements: * gtkhtml3 from 3.5.7 to 3.6.0 * libgal2 from 2.3.5 to 2.4.0 * eds from 1.1.6 to 1.2.0 * Tue Mar 08 2005 David Malcolm - 2.1.6-3 - rebuild (to use latest DBus library) evolution-connector-2.2.0-1 --------------------------- * Wed Mar 09 2005 David Malcolm - 2.2.0-1 - 2.2.0 - Updated evolution dependency to 2.2.0 evolution-data-server-1.2.0-2 ----------------------------- * Tue Mar 08 2005 David Malcolm - 1.2.0-2 - Added a patch to deal with glibc defining a macro called "read" * Tue Mar 08 2005 David Malcolm - 1.2.0-1 - 1.2.0 - Removed patch for GCC 4 as this is now in upstream tarball evolution-webcal-2.2.0-1 ------------------------ * Wed Mar 09 2005 David Malcolm - 2.2.0-1 - updated from 2.1.92 to 2.2.0 expat-1.95.8-6 -------------- * Tue Mar 08 2005 Joe Orton 1.95.8-6 - rebuild firefox-0:1.0.1-5 ----------------- * Tue Mar 08 2005 Christopher Aillon 0:1.0.1-5 - Add patch to compile against new fortified glibc macros gnome-utils-1:2.9.92-3 ---------------------- * Tue Mar 08 2005 John (J5) Palmieri 1:2.9.92-3 - Fixed up gfloppy for new HAL 0.5.0 api gnupg-1.4.0-2 ------------- * Tue Mar 08 2005 Nalin Dahyabhai 1.4.0-2 - build asm modules with -Wa,--noexecstack gtkhtml3-3.6.0-2 ---------------- * Wed Mar 09 2005 David Malcolm - 3.6.0-2 - rebuild * Tue Mar 08 2005 David Malcolm - 3.6.0-1 - 3.6.0 hal-0.5.0-3 ----------- * Tue Mar 08 2005 David Zeuthen 0.5.0-3 - Rebuild * Mon Mar 07 2005 David Zeuthen 0.5.0-2 - Update to upstream release 0.5.0 * Thu Jan 27 2005 David Zeuthen 0.4.7-2 - Add patch that should close #146316 k3b-0:0.11.17-2 --------------- * Tue Mar 08 2005 Than Ngo 0:0.11.17-2 - rebuilt against gcc-4 kernel-2.6.11-1.1177_FC4 ------------------------ * Tue Mar 08 2005 Dave Jones - Change SELinux execute-related permission checking. (#149819) lam-2:7.1.1-3 ------------- * Tue Mar 08 2005 Jason Vas Dias - add test for f95 to configure * Mon Mar 07 2005 Florian La Roche - require gcc-gfortran instead of gcc-g77 lftp-3.1.0-1 ------------ * Tue Mar 08 2005 Jason Vas Dias 3.1.0-1 - Upgrade to upstream verson 3.1.0; remove patch for broken libtool * Tue Mar 08 2005 Joe Orton 3.0.13-2 - rebuild libexif-0.5.12-7 ---------------- * Tue Mar 08 2005 Marco Pesenti Gritti - Add libexif-0.5.12-buffer-overflow.patch libgal2-2:2.4.0-1 ----------------- * Tue Mar 08 2005 David Malcolm - 2:2.4.0-1 - 2.4.0 libofx-0.7.0-2 -------------- * Tue Mar 08 2005 Bill Nottingham 0.7.0-2 - fix build with gcc4 libselinux-1.21.13-1 -------------------- * Tue Mar 08 2005 Dan Walsh 1.21.13-1 - Update from NSA * Fixed bug in matchpathcon_filespec_add() - failure to clear fl_head. libsepol-1.3.8-1 ---------------- * Tue Mar 08 2005 Dan Walsh 1.3.8-1 - Update to latest from NSA * Cleaned up error handling in sepol_genusers and sepol_genbools. mailx-8.1.1-44 -------------- * Tue Mar 08 2005 Jiri Ryska - changed Copyright to License in mailx.spec * Fri Mar 04 2005 Jiri Ryska - rebuilt * Fri Feb 18 2005 Jiri Ryska - updated patch mailx-8.1.1-bug134837.patch mozilla-37:1.7.5-6 ------------------ * Tue Mar 08 2005 Christopher Aillon 37:1.7.5-6 - Add patch to compile against new fortified glibc macros ntp-4.2.0.a.20040617-7 ---------------------- * Tue Mar 08 2005 Jiri Ryska - removed -Werror - patched for gcc4 and rebuilt openoffice.org-1:1.9.83-1 ------------------------- * Fri Mar 04 2005 Caolan McNamara 1:1.9.83-1 - dump to 1.9.83 - drop integrated workspace.gcj2 - add Requires for libwpd which is now pulled in from the system - add openoffice.org-1.9.83.ooo43995.wptypedetect.patch - add openoffice.org-1.9.83.ooo44377.icunotusingfpic.patch because icudata isn't being compiled with -fpic perl-3:5.8.6-4 -------------- * Tue Mar 08 2005 Chip Turner - 3:5.8.6-4 - add patch to put site_perl and vendor_perl before core perl dirs, to allow for overriding modules * Sat Jan 29 2005 Warren Togami - 3:5.8.6-3 - bugzilla: 127025, fix strip warnings * Tue Jan 18 2005 Chip Turner - 3:5.8.6-2 - bugzilla: 145448, fix invalid utf8 in changelog perl-Crypt-SSLeay-0.51-6 ------------------------ * Tue Mar 08 2005 Joe Orton 0.51-6 - rebuild policycoreutils-1.21.22-1 ------------------------- * Tue Mar 08 2005 Dan Walsh 1.21.22-1 - Cleanup error reporting pvm-3.4.5-3_FC4 --------------- * Tue Mar 08 2005 Jason Vas Dias 3.4.5-3_FC4 - GCC4 build: fix forward declaration of Pvmtevdid (globals.h) python-urlgrabber-2.9.6-1 ------------------------- * Tue Mar 08 2005 Jeremy Katz - 2.9.6-1 - update to 2.9.6 quagga-0:0.98.2-2 ----------------- * Tue Mar 08 2005 Jay Fenlason 0.98.2-2 - New upstream version, inclues my -gcc4 patch, and a patch from Vladimir Ivanov selinux-doc-1.17.7-2 -------------------- * Tue Mar 08 2005 Dan Walsh 1.17.7-2 - Build against latest version of jadetex * Mon Feb 21 2005 Dan Walsh 1.17.7-1 - Upgrade to match NSA * Updated CREDITS. selinux-policy-strict-1.21.15-8 ------------------------------- * Tue Mar 08 2005 Dan Walsh 1.21.15-7 - Fix rpc_pipefs reg expression found by Eric Paris - Fix sendmail - Add ftpd_anon_rw_t selinux-policy-targeted-1.21.15-9 --------------------------------- * Tue Mar 08 2005 Dan Walsh 1.21.15-8 - Add back in dhcpc.te to targeted - remove java_domain - Fix rpc_pipefs reg expression found by Eric Paris - Fix sendmail - Add ftpd_anon_rw_t sound-juicer-2.9.91-3 --------------------- * Tue Mar 08 2005 John (J5) Palmieri 2.9.91-3 - Build in rawhide - Disable build on s390 and s390x * Fri Feb 25 2005 John (J5) Palmieri 2.9.91-2 - Reenabled BuildRequires for hal-devel >= 0.5.0 - Added (Build)Requires for nautilus-cd-burner(-devel) >= 2.9.6 * Wed Feb 23 2005 John (J5) Palmieri 2.9.91-1 - New upstream version (version jump resulted from sound-juicer using gnome versioning scheme) system-config-bind-4.0.0-4 -------------------------- thunderbird-0:1.0-5 ------------------- * Tue Mar 08 2005 Christopher Aillon 1.0-5 - Add patch to compile against new fortified glibc macros * Sat Mar 05 2005 Christopher Aillon 1.0-4 - Rebuild against GCC 4.0 - Add execshield patches - Minor specfile cleanup * Mon Dec 20 2004 Christopher Aillon 1.0-3 - Rebuild vte-0.11.12-1 ------------- * Mon Mar 07 2005 Warren Togami 0.11.12-1 - upgrade to 0.11.12 - remove upstreamed patches (0-2, 5-9) - remove patch3, clashes and probably not needed anymore - reverse patch4, because upstream merged this broken patch - test Novell's excessive malloc for new terminals patch v3 (GNOME #160993) x3270-3.3.3.b2-1 ---------------- * Tue Mar 08 2005 Karsten Hopp 3.3.3.b2-1 - update to b2, which fixes a segfault when login is done with an entry in .ibm_hosts (via emulate_input) xinetd-2:2.3.13-6 ----------------- * Thu Feb 17 2005 Jay Fenlason 2:2.3.13-6 - include new patch to allow gcc4 to compile xinetd. xmlsec1-1.2.7-4 --------------- * Tue Mar 08 2005 Daniel Veillard 1.2.7-4 - rebuilt with gcc4 From fedora-devel at camperquake.de Wed Mar 9 13:37:14 2005 From: fedora-devel at camperquake.de (Ralf Ertzinger) Date: Wed, 9 Mar 2005 14:37:14 +0100 Subject: rawhide report: 20050309 changes In-Reply-To: <200503091300.j29D0o8q009628@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> References: <200503091300.j29D0o8q009628@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> Message-ID: <20050309143714.7f0e7535@nausicaa.camperquake.de> Moin. Build System wrote: > New package compat-gcc-296 > 2.96-RH compatibility libraries What need that? > Removed package Omni My whole printing system seems to depend on that. Was the remove intentional? smart> remove Omni Removed packages (6): Omni-0.9.2-3 at i386 desktop-printing-0.18-2 at i386 system-config-printer-0.6.124-1 at i386 Omni-foomatic-0.9.2-3 at i386 hal-cups-utils-0.5.2-9 at i386 system-config-printer-gui-0.6.124-1 at i386 -- Canonical List of bits on the Internet: 0 1 From twaugh at redhat.com Wed Mar 9 14:18:06 2005 From: twaugh at redhat.com (Tim Waugh) Date: Wed, 9 Mar 2005 14:18:06 +0000 Subject: rawhide report: 20050309 changes In-Reply-To: <20050309143714.7f0e7535@nausicaa.camperquake.de> References: <200503091300.j29D0o8q009628@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <20050309143714.7f0e7535@nausicaa.camperquake.de> Message-ID: <20050309141806.GE6739@redhat.com> On Wed, Mar 09, 2005 at 02:37:14PM +0100, Ralf Ertzinger wrote: > My whole printing system seems to depend on that. Was the remove > intentional? Yes, intentional. See current CVS for system-config-printer, where this dependency is severed. Tim. */ -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: not available URL: From dmalcolm at redhat.com Wed Mar 9 15:21:39 2005 From: dmalcolm at redhat.com (Dave Malcolm) Date: Wed, 09 Mar 2005 10:21:39 -0500 Subject: Bug Reporting Question In-Reply-To: <1110298014.3087.1.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> References: <1110298014.3087.1.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> Message-ID: <1110381699.3122.22.camel@localhost.localdomain> On Tue, 2005-03-08 at 11:06, David Cary Hart wrote: > I installed Evolution 2.2 today (which is remarkably stable). Do I > report bugs to Fedora, Ximian or both? It sounds like you built it yourself, in which case report bugs upstream to bugzilla.ximian.com (I built "official" evo 2.2 packages yesterday; they landed in Rawhide this morning). Otherwise, if using a Fedora package, you have to make an judgement call as to whether the problem is specific to Fedora, or a general problem from upstream, and file accordingly. Of course, this assumes you have a fair knowledge of the internals of the code/packaging process etc which many users won't have (and probably shouldn't be expected to). Ideally you should check both upstream and downstream bugzillas for duplicates. When in doubt, file upstream (bugzilla.ximian.com for Evolution), and make it clear which distro the problem was seen on, and exactly which package. If it looks like I've messed up the build or there's some other Fedora-specific problem, then file in bugzilla.redhat.com - but we try to do as much as possible upstream. And if a bug seems to us to be in the wrong bugzilla, we'll try to refile it. Hope all that makes sense Dave From joe at galway.net Wed Mar 9 15:35:17 2005 From: joe at galway.net (Joe Desbonnet) Date: Wed, 09 Mar 2005 15:35:17 +0000 Subject: A more efficient up2date service using binary diffs Message-ID: <422F17B5.5070402@galway.net> From what I can tell nobody is interested in implementing a rpm.diff system right now (please correct me if I am wrong). One of the problems raised in earlier threads is that the RPMs need to be available on the updating computer to apply the patches to. It is feasible -- if such a system can be demonstrated to work -- to have the option at install time to keep the RPMs of installed packages on disk? Sure, there is a disk space penalty -- but for a dialup user the bandwidth savings would make up for that. Even with my 512Kbps DSL line I find the OpenOffice upgrades burdensome. Also having the signed RPMs on disk may have other uses: eg verify the integrity of an installation (compare files with those in the RPM). Fix/refresh installation.. etc. Joe. On 03 Mar 2005 16:33:56 -0300, Alexandre Oliva wrote: > On Mar 3, 2005, Joe Desbonnet wrote: > > > Has anyone thought about improving the up2date service by offering > > diff files in addition to the .rpm files? > > Yup, see mail thread in this very last by the end of January last > year, and many others :-) > > -- > Alexandre Oliva http://www.ic.unicamp.br/~oliva/ > Red Hat Compiler Engineer aoliva@{redhat.com, gcc.gnu.org} > Free Software Evangelist oliva@{lsd.ic.unicamp.br, gnu.org} > From cra at WPI.EDU Wed Mar 9 15:42:25 2005 From: cra at WPI.EDU (Chuck R. Anderson) Date: Wed, 9 Mar 2005 10:42:25 -0500 Subject: A more efficient up2date service using binary diffs In-Reply-To: <422F17B5.5070402@galway.net> References: <422F17B5.5070402@galway.net> Message-ID: <20050309154225.GB15009@angus.ind.WPI.EDU> On Wed, Mar 09, 2005 at 03:35:17PM +0000, Joe Desbonnet wrote: > From what I can tell nobody is interested in implementing a rpm.diff > system right now (please correct me if I am wrong). > > One of the problems raised in earlier threads is that the RPMs need to > be available on the updating computer to apply the patches to. They are already often available in /var/cache/yum/ or /var/spool/up2date or /var/spool/repackage if you have rollbacks enabled. From kyrre at solution-forge.net Wed Mar 9 15:53:43 2005 From: kyrre at solution-forge.net (Kyrre Ness Sjobak) Date: Wed, 09 Mar 2005 16:53:43 +0100 Subject: A more efficient up2date service using binary diffs In-Reply-To: <422F17B5.5070402@galway.net> References: <422F17B5.5070402@galway.net> Message-ID: <1110383623.3448.8.camel@localhost.localdomain> ons, 09.03.2005 kl. 16.35 skrev Joe Desbonnet: > From what I can tell nobody is interested in implementing a rpm.diff > system right now (please correct me if I am wrong). Haven't SuSE already done this? From skvidal at phy.duke.edu Wed Mar 9 15:59:55 2005 From: skvidal at phy.duke.edu (seth vidal) Date: Wed, 09 Mar 2005 10:59:55 -0500 Subject: A more efficient up2date service using binary diffs In-Reply-To: <1110383623.3448.8.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <422F17B5.5070402@galway.net> <1110383623.3448.8.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <1110383996.31871.28.camel@cutter> On Wed, 2005-03-09 at 16:53 +0100, Kyrre Ness Sjobak wrote: > ons, 09.03.2005 kl. 16.35 skrev Joe Desbonnet: > > From what I can tell nobody is interested in implementing a rpm.diff > > system right now (please correct me if I am wrong). > > Haven't SuSE already done this? and don't the Zen/Red Carpet people HATE IT? -sv From jdesbonnet at gmail.com Wed Mar 9 16:28:30 2005 From: jdesbonnet at gmail.com (Joe Desbonnet) Date: Wed, 9 Mar 2005 16:28:30 +0000 Subject: A more efficient up2date service using binary diffs In-Reply-To: <1110383996.31871.28.camel@cutter> References: <422F17B5.5070402@galway.net> <1110383623.3448.8.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1110383996.31871.28.camel@cutter> Message-ID: <1cef3e95050309082839ba4beb@mail.gmail.com> Any reason why people hate it? I really can't see any downsides to this as an enhancement to the current system. I think the logic needed is something like this: The up2date system checks if a RPM of software to be updated is available locally. If not, up2date carries on as normal. If the RPM is available it checks for a suitable diff file in the archive. If found it downloads the diff, applies the patch and passes the resulting RPM for processing as normal. If there is no diff, up2date downloads the full RPM as normal. Joe. > > and don't the Zen/Red Carpet people HATE IT? > > From skvidal at phy.duke.edu Wed Mar 9 16:35:26 2005 From: skvidal at phy.duke.edu (seth vidal) Date: Wed, 09 Mar 2005 11:35:26 -0500 Subject: A more efficient up2date service using binary diffs In-Reply-To: <1cef3e95050309082839ba4beb@mail.gmail.com> References: <422F17B5.5070402@galway.net> <1110383623.3448.8.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1110383996.31871.28.camel@cutter> <1cef3e95050309082839ba4beb@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1110386126.31871.33.camel@cutter> On Wed, 2005-03-09 at 16:28 +0000, Joe Desbonnet wrote: > Any reason why people hate it? I really can't see any downsides to > this as an enhancement to the current system. > I mean the programmers. the folks who maintain it. -sv From jspaleta at gmail.com Wed Mar 9 16:34:27 2005 From: jspaleta at gmail.com (Jeff Spaleta) Date: Wed, 9 Mar 2005 11:34:27 -0500 Subject: A more efficient up2date service using binary diffs In-Reply-To: <1cef3e95050309082839ba4beb@mail.gmail.com> References: <422F17B5.5070402@galway.net> <1110383623.3448.8.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1110383996.31871.28.camel@cutter> <1cef3e95050309082839ba4beb@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <604aa79105030908341a6c7345@mail.gmail.com> On Wed, 9 Mar 2005 16:28:30 +0000, Joe Desbonnet wrote: > Any reason why people hate it? I really can't see any downsides to > this as an enhancement to the current system. Perhaps.. this is a good point for you to go talk to the zen/Red Carpet developers about their experiences trying to support the patch rpm feature. We can outline what seems to be logically intuitive workflow and navel gaze for long periods of time. But if you are really interested in this approach i think its important for you to get perspective on whats already being worked on so that you can be a much more effective advocate if you still are interested after reviewing the development efforts already on going to deal with the patch rpm issues. -jef From m.a.young at durham.ac.uk Wed Mar 9 16:50:40 2005 From: m.a.young at durham.ac.uk (M A Young) Date: Wed, 9 Mar 2005 16:50:40 +0000 (GMT) Subject: A more efficient up2date service using binary diffs In-Reply-To: <422F17B5.5070402@galway.net> References: <422F17B5.5070402@galway.net> Message-ID: On Wed, 9 Mar 2005, Joe Desbonnet wrote: > From what I can tell nobody is interested in implementing a rpm.diff > system right now (please correct me if I am wrong). > > One of the problems raised in earlier threads is that the RPMs need to > be available on the updating computer to apply the patches to. I wrote a proof of concept tool to make and apply rpm deltas a while ago (using rpm libraries and xdelta), see http://compsoc.dur.ac.uk/~may/rpmdelta/ I haven't do anything with it recently but I do occasionally use it to save bandwidth on openoffice patches. Michael Young From rahulsundaram at yahoo.co.in Wed Mar 9 16:56:14 2005 From: rahulsundaram at yahoo.co.in (Rahul Sundaram) Date: Wed, 9 Mar 2005 08:56:14 -0800 (PST) Subject: Freeradius 1.0.2 In-Reply-To: 6667 Message-ID: <20050309165614.29571.qmail@web8507.mail.in.yahoo.com> Hi > I think the problem is that a lot of us in the > corporate enviroment > are using Fedora to track what is going on in the > next Red Hat > Enterprise.. and when things go off to Extras it > looks like a larger > workload for us to keep up on. > it doesnt necessarily have to be. fedora extras will be enabled by default. kickstart and anaconda integration can follow Regards Rahul Sundaram __________________________________ Celebrate Yahoo!'s 10th Birthday! Yahoo! Netrospective: 100 Moments of the Web http://birthday.yahoo.com/netrospective/ From notting at redhat.com Wed Mar 9 16:56:25 2005 From: notting at redhat.com (Bill Nottingham) Date: Wed, 9 Mar 2005 11:56:25 -0500 Subject: rawhide report: 20050309 changes In-Reply-To: <20050309143714.7f0e7535@nausicaa.camperquake.de> References: <200503091300.j29D0o8q009628@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <20050309143714.7f0e7535@nausicaa.camperquake.de> Message-ID: <20050309165625.GB19986@nostromo.devel.redhat.com> Ralf Ertzinger (fedora-devel at camperquake.de) said: > > New package compat-gcc-296 > > 2.96-RH compatibility libraries > > What need that? It's mainly just for shipping libstdc++ from that version. Bill From rdieter at math.unl.edu Wed Mar 9 16:59:02 2005 From: rdieter at math.unl.edu (Rex Dieter) Date: Wed, 09 Mar 2005 10:59:02 -0600 Subject: Freeradius 1.0.2 In-Reply-To: <20050309165614.29571.qmail@web8507.mail.in.yahoo.com> References: <20050309165614.29571.qmail@web8507.mail.in.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <422F2B56.7020101@math.unl.edu> Rahul Sundaram wrote: >>I think the problem is that a lot of us in the >>corporate enviroment >>are using Fedora to track what is going on in the >>next Red Hat >>Enterprise.. and when things go off to Extras it >>looks like a larger >>workload for us to keep up on. > it doesnt necessarily have to be. fedora extras will > be enabled by default. kickstart and anaconda > integration can follow I may have missed something, but when did anyone say "extras" (currently *Fedora* extras) were going to be available for Red Hat Enterprise? (I'd love it to be...) -- Rex From jakub at redhat.com Wed Mar 9 16:59:53 2005 From: jakub at redhat.com (Jakub Jelinek) Date: Wed, 9 Mar 2005 11:59:53 -0500 Subject: rawhide report: 20050309 changes In-Reply-To: <20050309165625.GB19986@nostromo.devel.redhat.com> References: <200503091300.j29D0o8q009628@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <20050309143714.7f0e7535@nausicaa.camperquake.de> <20050309165625.GB19986@nostromo.devel.redhat.com> Message-ID: <20050309165953.GI853@devserv.devel.redhat.com> On Wed, Mar 09, 2005 at 11:56:25AM -0500, Bill Nottingham wrote: > Ralf Ertzinger (fedora-devel at camperquake.de) said: > > > New package compat-gcc-296 > > > 2.96-RH compatibility libraries > > > > What need that? > > It's mainly just for shipping libstdc++ from that version. Well, it is just the libstdc++ and libgcc.a from that version, nothing else. And, FC3/rawhide included this before, just packaged in the big compat-gcc which has been replaced by compat-gcc-296 and compat-gcc-32. Jakub From harald at redhat.com Wed Mar 9 17:29:44 2005 From: harald at redhat.com (Harald Hoyer) Date: Wed, 09 Mar 2005 18:29:44 +0100 Subject: removing xcdroast (was Re: rawhide report: 20050304 changes) In-Reply-To: <1109941877.30747.21.camel@marte.biciclete.ro> References: <200503041242.j24Cg7qf029831@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <1109941877.30747.21.camel@marte.biciclete.ro> Message-ID: <422F3288.8040509@redhat.com> Marius Andreiana wrote: > On Fri, 2005-03-04 at 07:42 -0500, Build System wrote: > >>xcdroast-0.98a15-10 >>------------------- >>* Thu Mar 03 2005 Harald Hoyer >>- rebuilt > > Is this still used? There's already k3b which works and looks great and > nautilus-cd-burner. > Well nautilus-cd-burner may not provide enough for those, who do not want to use ANY kde app. I am all for removing it.. (or move to extras) From jspaleta at gmail.com Wed Mar 9 17:34:03 2005 From: jspaleta at gmail.com (Jeff Spaleta) Date: Wed, 9 Mar 2005 12:34:03 -0500 Subject: removing xcdroast (was Re: rawhide report: 20050304 changes) In-Reply-To: <422F3288.8040509@redhat.com> References: <200503041242.j24Cg7qf029831@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <1109941877.30747.21.camel@marte.biciclete.ro> <422F3288.8040509@redhat.com> Message-ID: <604aa791050309093434f8e7f6@mail.gmail.com> On Wed, 09 Mar 2005 18:29:44 +0100, Harald Hoyer > Well nautilus-cd-burner may not provide enough for those, who do not > want to use ANY kde app. have those sorts of people looked at gtk+ based graveman.. which is in extras already? -jef From Fedora at TQMcube.com Wed Mar 9 17:53:29 2005 From: Fedora at TQMcube.com (David Cary Hart) Date: Wed, 09 Mar 2005 12:53:29 -0500 Subject: Bug Reporting Question In-Reply-To: <1110381699.3122.22.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <1110298014.3087.1.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> <1110381699.3122.22.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <1110390809.12065.5.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> On Wed, 2005-03-09 at 10:21 -0500, Dave Malcolm wrote: > On Tue, 2005-03-08 at 11:06, David Cary Hart wrote: > > I installed Evolution 2.2 today (which is remarkably stable). Do I > > report bugs to Fedora, Ximian or both? > It sounds like you built it yourself, in which case report bugs upstream > to bugzilla.ximian.com (I built "official" evo 2.2 packages yesterday; > they landed in Rawhide this morning). Thanks. I'm working on the compilations as I write. - - - - ----------- > Hope all that makes sense It does. -- Total Quality Management - A Commitment to Excellence Fight Spam: http://www.tqmcube.com/rbldnsd.htm Real Time Updates: rsync -t \ tqmcube.com::spamlists/[README.htm][clients][dynamic][relays][asiaspam] http://www.tqmcube.com/spam_trap.htm From kyrre at solution-forge.net Wed Mar 9 17:58:14 2005 From: kyrre at solution-forge.net (Kyrre Ness Sjobak) Date: Wed, 09 Mar 2005 18:58:14 +0100 Subject: A more efficient up2date service using binary diffs In-Reply-To: <1cef3e95050309082839ba4beb@mail.gmail.com> References: <422F17B5.5070402@galway.net> <1110383623.3448.8.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1110383996.31871.28.camel@cutter> <1cef3e95050309082839ba4beb@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1110391094.3448.18.camel@localhost.localdomain> ons, 09.03.2005 kl. 17.28 skrev Joe Desbonnet: > Any reason why people hate it? I really can't see any downsides to > this as an enhancement to the current system. > > I think the logic needed is something like this: > The up2date system checks if a RPM of software to be updated is > available locally. If not, up2date carries on as normal. If the RPM is > available it checks for a suitable diff file in the archive. If found > it downloads the diff, applies the patch and passes the resulting RPM > for processing as normal. If there is no diff, up2date downloads the > full RPM as normal. > > Joe. That could be one way to do it, saving bandwidth for users and mirrors. But it would require the "old" version to be accessible locally, but if you're on a modem/ISDN line, having some gig's extra used on your HDD is way better than to download a couple of hundred MB extra. So if you do have this archive (FC5 anaconda install option - install local rpm repository?), yum (sorry Seth...) would download the correct patch, apply it to the old rpm in order to create a new, fresh rpm, and then update using that? Hmm.. That implementation wouldn't be to bad, as nothing in rpm itself (etc) would need to be changed, the change to yum would probably not be enormous (correct me if I'm wrong), and it would be great for many users and mirrors. Kyrre From rdieter at math.unl.edu Wed Mar 9 18:05:02 2005 From: rdieter at math.unl.edu (Rex Dieter) Date: Wed, 09 Mar 2005 12:05:02 -0600 Subject: A more efficient up2date service using binary diffs In-Reply-To: <1110391094.3448.18.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <422F17B5.5070402@galway.net> <1110383623.3448.8.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1110383996.31871.28.camel@cutter> <1cef3e95050309082839ba4beb@mail.gmail.com> <1110391094.3448.18.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <422F3ACE.7010309@math.unl.edu> Kyrre Ness Sjobak wrote: > So if you do have this archive (FC5 anaconda install option - install > local rpm repository?), yum (sorry Seth...) would download the correct > patch, apply it to the old rpm in order to create a new, fresh rpm, and > then update using that? Yeah, and then *every* revision of the rpm needs to be made available in order to construct every possible patch (unless *only* patches from the base rpm are ever released, which, IMO, would be bad in other ways). This has been discussed ad-nauseum on this list before. In short, it's a *lot* of work, for *little* relative gain (at best). It's not worth it. -- Rex From rc040203 at freenet.de Wed Mar 9 18:08:28 2005 From: rc040203 at freenet.de (Ralf Corsepius) Date: Wed, 09 Mar 2005 19:08:28 +0100 Subject: A more efficient up2date service using binary diffs In-Reply-To: <604aa79105030908341a6c7345@mail.gmail.com> References: <422F17B5.5070402@galway.net> <1110383623.3448.8.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1110383996.31871.28.camel@cutter> <1cef3e95050309082839ba4beb@mail.gmail.com> <604aa79105030908341a6c7345@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1110391709.7140.333.camel@mccallum.corsepiu.local> On Wed, 2005-03-09 at 11:34 -0500, Jeff Spaleta wrote: > On Wed, 9 Mar 2005 16:28:30 +0000, Joe Desbonnet wrote: > > Any reason why people hate it? I really can't see any downsides to > > this as an enhancement to the current system. > > Perhaps.. this is a good point for you to go talk to the zen/Red > Carpet developers about their experiences trying to support the patch > rpm feature. FWIW: SuSE has abandoned patch-rpms. They now (IIRC, since SuSE-9.2), use delta-rpms (cf. ftp://ftp.suse.com/suse/i386/update/9.2/deltas). Both, patch- and delta- rpms are reported to be usable with apt. Ralf From jspaleta at gmail.com Wed Mar 9 18:23:29 2005 From: jspaleta at gmail.com (Jeff Spaleta) Date: Wed, 9 Mar 2005 13:23:29 -0500 Subject: A more efficient up2date service using binary diffs In-Reply-To: <422F3ACE.7010309@math.unl.edu> References: <422F17B5.5070402@galway.net> <1110383623.3448.8.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1110383996.31871.28.camel@cutter> <1cef3e95050309082839ba4beb@mail.gmail.com> <1110391094.3448.18.camel@localhost.localdomain> <422F3ACE.7010309@math.unl.edu> Message-ID: <604aa79105030910233c19ddae@mail.gmail.com> On Wed, 09 Mar 2005 12:05:02 -0600, Rex Dieter wrote: > (unless *only* patches from the > base rpm are ever released, which, IMO, would be bad in other ways). That's not even concievable with Fedora Extras. Fedora Extras from all discussion I've seen is to be primarily a rolling release model, it would be difficult to define a 'base' rpm for Extras Packages. > This has been discussed ad-nauseum on this list before. In short, it's > a *lot* of work, for *little* relative gain (at best). It's not worth it. While I don't think i would actively encourage people to work on this.. from a manhour priority perspective... if interested parties are intent on spending their personal time on this.. I would say there is only one way forward..and that is incrementally. Instead of fighting to convince developers for existing projects to include new functionality they have reserverations about... build a stand-alone tool set that can be used to generate the deltas and then re-generate the rpms on the clientside for the distro package management tools to use. Find a subset of mirrors to offer that service and get people to test it. First get a stand-alone implementation tha can be used to layer the experimental functionality over existing tools... before worrying about integrating that functionality into existing tools. -jef"at the very least.. it will be a learning experience for those invovled.. like all good failing efforts are"spaleta From kyrre at solution-forge.net Wed Mar 9 18:32:10 2005 From: kyrre at solution-forge.net (Kyrre Ness Sjobak) Date: Wed, 09 Mar 2005 19:32:10 +0100 Subject: A more efficient up2date service using binary diffs In-Reply-To: <422F3ACE.7010309@math.unl.edu> References: <422F17B5.5070402@galway.net> <1110383623.3448.8.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1110383996.31871.28.camel@cutter> <1cef3e95050309082839ba4beb@mail.gmail.com> <1110391094.3448.18.camel@localhost.localdomain> <422F3ACE.7010309@math.unl.edu> Message-ID: <1110393130.3448.32.camel@localhost.localdomain> ons, 09.03.2005 kl. 19.05 skrev Rex Dieter: > Kyrre Ness Sjobak wrote: > > > So if you do have this archive (FC5 anaconda install option - install > > local rpm repository?), yum (sorry Seth...) would download the correct > > patch, apply it to the old rpm in order to create a new, fresh rpm, and > > then update using that? > > Yeah, and then *every* revision of the rpm needs to be made available in > order to construct every possible patch (unless *only* patches from the > base rpm are ever released, which, IMO, would be bad in other ways). > The alternatives are clearly step-by-step upgrades (cumulative - requires less bandwitdh but more client processing) or base-to-all (more to download but less cpu usage) upgrades. Having patches between every posibillity would be insane at best. So yeah, some change would have to be made to createrepo as well. > This has been discussed ad-nauseum on this list before. In short, it's > a *lot* of work, for *little* relative gain (at best). It's not worth it. > I you have ever had to keep a fc system updated using a 64 kilobit/s metered dialup, you wouldn't call it a "little" gain. Mostly *i* was able to update my laptop at school and then copy it over to apt's (i was using apt at the time) cache and doing the installing, and then burning cd's to other dialup-using friends with the updates once in a while, you wouldn't call it a small gain. But a request to the original poster (or anybody interested): could you do a binary diff between two openoffice versions, and post how big they where, and how big the diff is? Pluss which versions, and how many steps (versions) between them? As said, this method doesn't have to change rpm itself, as it generates the original rpm on the users end. Kyrre From brugolsky at telemetry-investments.com Wed Mar 9 18:47:45 2005 From: brugolsky at telemetry-investments.com (Bill Rugolsky Jr.) Date: Wed, 9 Mar 2005 13:47:45 -0500 Subject: A more efficient up2date service using binary diffs In-Reply-To: <604aa79105030910233c19ddae@mail.gmail.com> References: <422F17B5.5070402@galway.net> <1110383623.3448.8.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1110383996.31871.28.camel@cutter> <1cef3e95050309082839ba4beb@mail.gmail.com> <1110391094.3448.18.camel@localhost.localdomain> <422F3ACE.7010309@math.unl.edu> <604aa79105030910233c19ddae@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20050309184745.GA25869@ti64.telemetry-investments.com> On Wed, Mar 09, 2005 at 01:23:29PM -0500, Jeff Spaleta wrote: > While I don't think i would actively encourage people to work on > this.. from a manhour priority perspective... if interested parties > are intent on spending their personal time on this.. I would say there > is only one way forward..and that is incrementally. Instead of > fighting to convince developers for existing projects to include new > functionality they have reserverations about... build a stand-alone > tool set that can be used to generate the deltas and then re-generate > the rpms on the clientside for the distro package management tools to > use. Find a subset of mirrors to offer that service and get people to > test it. First get a stand-alone implementation tha can be used to > layer the experimental functionality over existing tools... before > worrying about integrating that functionality into existing tools. That's a good idea. I'd start here: http://zsync.moria.org.uk/ Yep, client-side rsync. I don't know the patent status in the US (Google for earlier discussions), and don't want to know. Get it before the EU becomes a police state too. :-( It should be an afternoon's work to combine the above with: http://rpmrebuild.sourceforge.net/ and have a tool that will mirror update directories that contains .zsync files. Run some tests locally, then convince a repository in the free world to give it whirl. If it works out, perhaps the signatures could go in a repository metadata file. Regards, Bill Rugolsky From skvidal at phy.duke.edu Wed Mar 9 19:05:31 2005 From: skvidal at phy.duke.edu (seth vidal) Date: Wed, 09 Mar 2005 14:05:31 -0500 Subject: A more efficient up2date service using binary diffs In-Reply-To: <20050309184745.GA25869@ti64.telemetry-investments.com> References: <422F17B5.5070402@galway.net> <1110383623.3448.8.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1110383996.31871.28.camel@cutter> <1cef3e95050309082839ba4beb@mail.gmail.com> <1110391094.3448.18.camel@localhost.localdomain> <422F3ACE.7010309@math.unl.edu> <604aa79105030910233c19ddae@mail.gmail.com> <20050309184745.GA25869@ti64.telemetry-investments.com> Message-ID: <1110395131.31871.65.camel@cutter> > That's a good idea. I'd start here: > > http://zsync.moria.org.uk/ > > Yep, client-side rsync. I don't know the patent status in the US > (Google for earlier discussions), and don't want to know. Get it > before the EU becomes a police state too. :-( > > It should be an afternoon's work to combine the above with: > > http://rpmrebuild.sourceforge.net/ > > and have a tool that will mirror update directories that contains > .zsync files. Run some tests locally, then convince a repository > in the free world to give it whirl. If it works out, perhaps the > signatures could go in a repository metadata file. > Let us know how your afternoon goes. -sv From jdesbonnet at gmail.com Wed Mar 9 19:03:11 2005 From: jdesbonnet at gmail.com (Joe Desbonnet) Date: Wed, 9 Mar 2005 19:03:11 +0000 Subject: A more efficient up2date service using binary diffs In-Reply-To: <1110393130.3448.32.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <422F17B5.5070402@galway.net> <1110383623.3448.8.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1110383996.31871.28.camel@cutter> <1cef3e95050309082839ba4beb@mail.gmail.com> <1110391094.3448.18.camel@localhost.localdomain> <422F3ACE.7010309@math.unl.edu> <1110393130.3448.32.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <1cef3e95050309110335197fd9@mail.gmail.com> Actually it was OpenOffice that got me started on this in the first place: bsdiff of openoffice.org-i18n-1.1.2-10.i386.rpm (in the FC3/i386 distribution) with openoffice.org-i18n-1.1.2-11.5.fc3.i386.rpm in the updates. The resulting diff file was 1MB (compared to 166MB for the RPM)! Two notes on this: 1) the comparison was done on the cpio archive generated with rpm2cpio. 2) bsdiff needs *lots* of memory to generate the diff (patching is not so resource intensive), so I had to split the cpio into 20MB chunks and do the comparisons on the chunks. If I was actually able to do the comparison on the entire file I suspect that the resulting diff would have been significantly smaller than 1MB! So in conclusion: 1MB (or less) for diff vs 166MB for full RPM. I agree with Jeff: a stand alone system that can demonstrate the benefits would be a good first step. Joe. On Wed, 09 Mar 2005 19:32:10 +0100, Kyrre Ness Sjobak wrote: > But a request to the original poster (or anybody interested): could you > do a binary diff between two openoffice versions, and post how big they > where, and how big the diff is? Pluss which versions, and how many steps > (versions) between them? From pbruna at linuxcenterla.com Wed Mar 9 19:15:56 2005 From: pbruna at linuxcenterla.com (Patricio Bruna V) Date: Wed, 09 Mar 2005 16:15:56 -0300 Subject: palm and fedora Message-ID: <1110395756.3090.1.camel@cluster2> hi, i have a PALM T3, when i try to sync, or just "pilot-xfer -l" the connection died before it suppose to. i configure the perms and setup udev to work ok, but it keeping diying -- Patricio Bruna pbruna at linuxcenterla.com Red Hat Certified Engineer Jefe Soporte y Operaciones LinuxCenter S.A. Canada 239, 5to piso, Providencia, Chile http://www.linuxcenterla.com +56-2-2745000 From jkeating at j2solutions.net Wed Mar 9 19:21:44 2005 From: jkeating at j2solutions.net (Jesse Keating) Date: Wed, 09 Mar 2005 11:21:44 -0800 Subject: Freeradius 1.0.2 In-Reply-To: <422F2B56.7020101@math.unl.edu> References: <20050309165614.29571.qmail@web8507.mail.in.yahoo.com> <422F2B56.7020101@math.unl.edu> Message-ID: <1110396104.5489.155.camel@jkeating2.hq.pogolinux.com> On Wed, 2005-03-09 at 10:59 -0600, Rex Dieter wrote: > > >>I think the problem is that a lot of us in the > >>corporate enviroment > >>are using Fedora to track what is going on in the > >>next Red Hat > >>Enterprise.. and when things go off to Extras it > >>looks like a larger > >>workload for us to keep up on. > > > it doesnt necessarily have to be. fedora extras will > > be enabled by default. kickstart and anaconda > > integration can follow > > I may have missed something, but when did anyone say > "extras" (currently > *Fedora* extras) were going to be available for Red Hat Enterprise? > (I'd love it to be...) It's not, nor was that eluded to. The original statement was that Fedora is used to look at what might be in the next Enterprise, and getting Extras on Fedora adds work, which it doesn't. Nothing about Extras being in Enterprise, nor about packages in Extras not being included in Enterprise. -- Jesse Keating RHCE (geek.j2solutions.net) Fedora Legacy Team (www.fedoralegacy.org) GPG Public Key (geek.j2solutions.net/jkeating.j2solutions.pub) Was I helpful? Let others know: http://svcs.affero.net/rm.php?r=jkeating From mbneto at gmail.com Wed Mar 9 19:29:26 2005 From: mbneto at gmail.com (mbneto) Date: Wed, 9 Mar 2005 15:29:26 -0400 Subject: sendmail: Bad IPLOCALPORT value after upgrade Message-ID: <5cf776b80503091129439a8a0a@mail.gmail.com> Hi, After yesterday's upgrade my sendmail stopped working. My messages shows sendmail[4048]: Bad IPLOCALPORT value Any tips ? I've looked my .mc, generated the .cf again but no luck. Running sendmail 8.13.3-1.1, kernel 2.6.11-1.1176_FC4. - mb From jspaleta at gmail.com Wed Mar 9 19:30:51 2005 From: jspaleta at gmail.com (Jeff Spaleta) Date: Wed, 9 Mar 2005 14:30:51 -0500 Subject: A more efficient up2date service using binary diffs In-Reply-To: <1cef3e95050309110335197fd9@mail.gmail.com> References: <422F17B5.5070402@galway.net> <1110383623.3448.8.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1110383996.31871.28.camel@cutter> <1cef3e95050309082839ba4beb@mail.gmail.com> <1110391094.3448.18.camel@localhost.localdomain> <422F3ACE.7010309@math.unl.edu> <1110393130.3448.32.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1cef3e95050309110335197fd9@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <604aa7910503091130609b492c@mail.gmail.com> On Wed, 9 Mar 2005 19:03:11 +0000, Joe Desbonnet > 2) bsdiff needs *lots* of memory to generate the diff Hard numbers on resource use.. its always better if you can produce them. Things are always about tradeoffs and client side benefits must be weighed against serverside resource constraints... and the only way to do that is to give relevant resource numbers for all resources of concern. Focusing on the resource the benefits.. is not going to win over people concerned about other aspects. I think everyone will stipulate to the fact that patches or deltas tend to save bandwidth if all you have to transfer over the wire are the patches or deltas.. that's never been in dispute. The dispute is... is it worth it to implement. And you can't answer that question till you start looking at other resource constraints. -jef From iago.rubio at hispalinux.es Wed Mar 9 19:40:21 2005 From: iago.rubio at hispalinux.es (Iago Rubio) Date: Wed, 09 Mar 2005 20:40:21 +0100 Subject: removing xcdroast (was Re: rawhide report: 20050304 changes) In-Reply-To: <604aa791050309093434f8e7f6@mail.gmail.com> References: <200503041242.j24Cg7qf029831@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <1109941877.30747.21.camel@marte.biciclete.ro> <422F3288.8040509@redhat.com> <604aa791050309093434f8e7f6@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1110397222.15313.33.camel@speedy.iagorubio.net> On Wed, 2005-03-09 at 12:34 -0500, Jeff Spaleta wrote: > On Wed, 09 Mar 2005 18:29:44 +0100, Harald Hoyer > > Well nautilus-cd-burner may not provide enough for those, who do not > > want to use ANY kde app. > > have those sorts of people looked at gtk+ based graveman.. which is in > extras already? I think it's quite difficult right now for users to test graveman, as most users are not aware of extras, and upstream rpms depends on libmad, that's not in Core. Those users that are not willing to touch their yum.conf files - so only aware of packages on the base and released updates repos - are unable to take a look at graveman right now. They will have to wait for extras in yum.conf - in next release - to take a look at this, then I'm almost sure xcdroast could be dropped. Just a couple of doubts - just lack of knowledge, as I did not tested graveman: Is it capable of writing multi session disks ? Is it capable of writing bootable disks ? I haven't found too much information on the graveman site about this, just one bug report of graveman being unable to write multi session CDs. I would be a pity to loose those features, even while graveman UI looks so promising. Thanks in advance for your answers. -- Iago Rubio From eric at snowmoon.com Wed Mar 9 19:43:39 2005 From: eric at snowmoon.com (Eric Warnke) Date: Wed, 09 Mar 2005 14:43:39 -0500 Subject: removing xcdroast (was Re: rawhide report: 20050304 changes) In-Reply-To: <1110397222.15313.33.camel@speedy.iagorubio.net> References: <200503041242.j24Cg7qf029831@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <1109941877.30747.21.camel@marte.biciclete.ro> <422F3288.8040509@redhat.com> <604aa791050309093434f8e7f6@mail.gmail.com> <1110397222.15313.33.camel@speedy.iagorubio.net> Message-ID: <422F51EB.3080205@snowmoon.com> Iago Rubio wrote: >Those users that are not willing to touch their yum.conf files - so only >aware of packages on the base and released updates repos - are unable to >take a look at graveman right now. > >They will have to wait for extras in yum.conf - in next release - to >take a look at this, then I'm almost sure xcdroast could be dropped. > > Why not update yum in FC3 updates with the new repo? That way once they do a normal update they will have access to extras. Cheers, Eric -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 252 bytes Desc: OpenPGP digital signature URL: From kyrre at solution-forge.net Wed Mar 9 19:48:21 2005 From: kyrre at solution-forge.net (Kyrre Ness Sjobak) Date: Wed, 09 Mar 2005 20:48:21 +0100 Subject: removing xcdroast (was Re: rawhide report: 20050304 changes) In-Reply-To: <422F51EB.3080205@snowmoon.com> References: <200503041242.j24Cg7qf029831@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <1109941877.30747.21.camel@marte.biciclete.ro> <422F3288.8040509@redhat.com> <604aa791050309093434f8e7f6@mail.gmail.com> <1110397222.15313.33.camel@speedy.iagorubio.net> <422F51EB.3080205@snowmoon.com> Message-ID: <1110397700.3448.35.camel@localhost.localdomain> ons, 09.03.2005 kl. 20.43 skrev Eric Warnke: > Iago Rubio wrote: > > >Those users that are not willing to touch their yum.conf files - so only > >aware of packages on the base and released updates repos - are unable to > >take a look at graveman right now. > > > >They will have to wait for extras in yum.conf - in next release - to > >take a look at this, then I'm almost sure xcdroast could be dropped. > > > > > > Why not update yum in FC3 updates with the new repo? That way once they > do a normal update they will have access to extras. > > Cheers, > Eric > > ______________________________________________________________________ Exept that it would introduce a change in a "stable" OS - how would that effect the users who have already installed extras? BTW that wouldn't be yum, but more like fedora-release... From marcdeslauriers at videotron.ca Wed Mar 9 22:11:24 2005 From: marcdeslauriers at videotron.ca (Marc Deslauriers) Date: Wed, 09 Mar 2005 17:11:24 -0500 Subject: rawhide report: 20050309 changes In-Reply-To: <20050309165625.GB19986@nostromo.devel.redhat.com> References: <200503091300.j29D0o8q009628@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <20050309143714.7f0e7535@nausicaa.camperquake.de> <20050309165625.GB19986@nostromo.devel.redhat.com> Message-ID: <1110406284.20297.2.camel@mdlinux> On Wed, 2005-03-09 at 11:56 -0500, Bill Nottingham wrote: > Ralf Ertzinger (fedora-devel at camperquake.de) said: > > > New package compat-gcc-296 > > > 2.96-RH compatibility libraries > > > > What need that? > > It's mainly just for shipping libstdc++ from that version. Doesn't Oracle need 2.96 too? Marc. -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part URL: From m.a.young at durham.ac.uk Wed Mar 9 22:23:13 2005 From: m.a.young at durham.ac.uk (M A Young) Date: Wed, 9 Mar 2005 22:23:13 +0000 (GMT) Subject: A more efficient up2date service using binary diffs In-Reply-To: <604aa7910503091130609b492c@mail.gmail.com> References: <422F17B5.5070402@galway.net> <1110383623.3448.8.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1110383996.31871.28.camel@cutter> <1cef3e95050309082839ba4beb@mail.gmail.com> <1110391094.3448.18.camel@localhost.localdomain> <422F3ACE.7010309@math.unl.edu> <1110393130.3448.32.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1cef3e95050309110335197fd9@mail.gmail.com> <604aa7910503091130609b492c@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On Wed, 9 Mar 2005, Jeff Spaleta wrote: > Hard numbers on resource use.. its always better if you can produce them. > Things are always about tradeoffs and client side benefits must be > weighed against serverside resource constraints... and the only way to > do that is to give relevant resource numbers for all resources of > concern. Focusing on the resource the benefits.. is not going to win > over people concerned about other aspects. I think everyone will > stipulate to the fact that patches or deltas tend to save bandwidth if > all you have to transfer over the wire are the patches or deltas.. > that's never been in dispute. The dispute is... is it worth it to > implement. And you can't answer that question till you start looking > at other resource constraints. >From what I remember when I looked at this a while ago, if you use rsync you need uncompressed rpms on the server and client (or dynamically uncompress a file each time) to sync between, and you need to compress the rsync communications or else the uncompressed differences may be bigger than the rpms anyway. If you generate a static delta file, such as with xdelta, you need something like twice the size of the uncompressed rpm in disk space, and probably once the size in memory to create the delta, and the same disc space to regenerate the rpm on the client, but you can get big savings on bandwidth, particularly when there have been minor changes to a huge rpm, though at other times the delta is almost as big as the new rpm. Michael Young From cra at WPI.EDU Wed Mar 9 22:29:30 2005 From: cra at WPI.EDU (Chuck R. Anderson) Date: Wed, 9 Mar 2005 17:29:30 -0500 Subject: A more efficient up2date service using binary diffs In-Reply-To: References: <422F17B5.5070402@galway.net> <1110383623.3448.8.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1110383996.31871.28.camel@cutter> <1cef3e95050309082839ba4beb@mail.gmail.com> <1110391094.3448.18.camel@localhost.localdomain> <422F3ACE.7010309@math.unl.edu> <1110393130.3448.32.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1cef3e95050309110335197fd9@mail.gmail.com> <604aa7910503091130609b492c@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20050309222930.GE15009@angus.ind.WPI.EDU> On Wed, Mar 09, 2005 at 10:23:13PM +0000, M A Young wrote: > From what I remember when I looked at this a while ago, if you use rsync > you need uncompressed rpms on the server and client (or dynamically > uncompress a file each time) to sync between, and you need to compress the > rsync communications or else the uncompressed differences may be bigger > than the rpms anyway. No, you only need to start compressing with the rsync zlib patch, which makes zlib compression rsync-friendly. From nphilipp at redhat.com Thu Mar 10 01:11:27 2005 From: nphilipp at redhat.com (Nils Philippsen) Date: Thu, 10 Mar 2005 02:11:27 +0100 Subject: rawhide report: 20050309 changes In-Reply-To: <1110406284.20297.2.camel@mdlinux> References: <200503091300.j29D0o8q009628@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <20050309143714.7f0e7535@nausicaa.camperquake.de> <20050309165625.GB19986@nostromo.devel.redhat.com> <1110406284.20297.2.camel@mdlinux> Message-ID: <1110417088.5092.2.camel@gibraltar.stuttgart.redhat.com> On Wed, 2005-03-09 at 17:11 -0500, Marc Deslauriers wrote: > On Wed, 2005-03-09 at 11:56 -0500, Bill Nottingham wrote: > > Ralf Ertzinger (fedora-devel at camperquake.de) said: > > > > New package compat-gcc-296 > > > > 2.96-RH compatibility libraries > > > > > > What need that? > > > > It's mainly just for shipping libstdc++ from that version. > > Doesn't Oracle need 2.96 too? Having its libgcc and libstdc++ is sufficient if you use a wrapper like this (where /usr/bin/gcc.bin is the original gcc since Oracle's scripts apparently can't use anything else than /usr/bin/gcc): --- 8< --- #!/bin/bash if type -path gcc296 >&/dev/null; then # RHEL3 exec gcc296 "$@" else # Wrap gcc so that it uses version 2.96 of the libgcc library to link # Oracle binaries exec /usr/bin/gcc.bin -B /usr/lib/gcc-lib/i386-redhat-linux/2.96 - static-libgcc "$@" fi --- >8 --- Nils -- Nils Philippsen / Red Hat / nphilipp at redhat.com "They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety." -- B. Franklin, 1759 PGP fingerprint: C4A8 9474 5C4C ADE3 2B8F 656D 47D8 9B65 6951 3011 From jakub at redhat.com Wed Mar 9 22:35:06 2005 From: jakub at redhat.com (Jakub Jelinek) Date: Wed, 9 Mar 2005 17:35:06 -0500 Subject: rawhide report: 20050309 changes In-Reply-To: <1110417088.5092.2.camel@gibraltar.stuttgart.redhat.com> References: <200503091300.j29D0o8q009628@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <20050309143714.7f0e7535@nausicaa.camperquake.de> <20050309165625.GB19986@nostromo.devel.redhat.com> <1110406284.20297.2.camel@mdlinux> <1110417088.5092.2.camel@gibraltar.stuttgart.redhat.com> Message-ID: <20050309223506.GK853@devserv.devel.redhat.com> On Thu, Mar 10, 2005 at 02:11:27AM +0100, Nils Philippsen wrote: > On Wed, 2005-03-09 at 17:11 -0500, Marc Deslauriers wrote: > > On Wed, 2005-03-09 at 11:56 -0500, Bill Nottingham wrote: > > > Ralf Ertzinger (fedora-devel at camperquake.de) said: > > > > > New package compat-gcc-296 > > > > > 2.96-RH compatibility libraries > > > > > > > > What need that? > > > > > > It's mainly just for shipping libstdc++ from that version. > > > > Doesn't Oracle need 2.96 too? > > Having its libgcc and libstdc++ is sufficient if you use a wrapper like > this (where /usr/bin/gcc.bin is the original gcc since Oracle's scripts > apparently can't use anything else than /usr/bin/gcc): > > --- 8< --- > #!/bin/bash > > if type -path gcc296 >&/dev/null; then > # RHEL3 > exec gcc296 "$@" > else > # Wrap gcc so that it uses version 2.96 of the libgcc library to link > # Oracle binaries > exec /usr/bin/gcc.bin -B /usr/lib/gcc-lib/i386-redhat-linux/2.96 -static-libgcc "$@" -B argument should be / terminated, i.e. -B /usr/lib/gcc-lib/i386-redhat-linux/2.96/ Jakub From louisg00 at bellsouth.net Thu Mar 10 00:12:25 2005 From: louisg00 at bellsouth.net (Louis Garcia) Date: Wed, 09 Mar 2005 19:12:25 -0500 Subject: rawhide report: 20050309 changes Message-ID: <1110413545.6440.2.camel@tiger> > > My whole printing system seems to depend on that. Was the remove > > intentional? > > Yes, intentional. See current CVS for system-config-printer, where > this dependency is severed. > > Tim. So were are the printer drivers coming from now that Omni is gone? -Louis From rodd at clarkson.id.au Thu Mar 10 01:29:28 2005 From: rodd at clarkson.id.au (Rodd Clarkson) Date: Thu, 10 Mar 2005 12:29:28 +1100 Subject: hald causing stutters Message-ID: <1110418168.8126.5.camel@jellyfish.redfishdemo.com> Since updating last night, I've notice that my system is stuttering. The UI will pause for a moment and then go along and then pause, and then go along and well you get what I mean by stuttering. Watching my CPU use, I get a spike every 5 seconds (a cheap one thousand and one, two thousand and two quess). Looking at top, I see hald taking a good chunk of CPU about the same time as the spike occurs. This is really quite annoying. It's essentially a pause in your UI every 5 seconds or so, including music that's playing and the likes. Is anyone else seeing this (and hopefully addressing it)? And does someone have a stop gap for it until it's resolved? Rodd From rees at ddcom.co.jp Thu Mar 10 02:08:28 2005 From: rees at ddcom.co.jp (Joel) Date: Thu, 10 Mar 2005 11:08:28 +0900 Subject: dns poisoning? Message-ID: <20050310105008.9458.REES@ddcom.co.jp> Sorry for the cross-post. I just tried to access bugzilla.redhat.com on a MSWxp box (Firefox) and got a certificate dialog. (You know, "This certificate does not appear to be valid. Etc." which is really poor wording, anyway.) I panicked and cancelled (good) without looking at the certificate first (bad). Shut down Firefox. Went to my FC box and tried from there. Access completed as it has in the past, redirecting me successfully to https without any certificate dialog. So I tried again from the MSWxp box and this time there was no certificate dialog. It connected me via ssl the way it usually does. There was a lot of news yesterday about dns poisoning. Anyone else seen something like this? From rodd at clarkson.id.au Thu Mar 10 02:20:02 2005 From: rodd at clarkson.id.au (Rodd Clarkson) Date: Thu, 10 Mar 2005 13:20:02 +1100 Subject: A more efficient up2date service using binary diffs In-Reply-To: <422F3ACE.7010309@math.unl.edu> References: <422F17B5.5070402@galway.net> <1110383623.3448.8.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1110383996.31871.28.camel@cutter> <1cef3e95050309082839ba4beb@mail.gmail.com> <1110391094.3448.18.camel@localhost.localdomain> <422F3ACE.7010309@math.unl.edu> Message-ID: <1110421202.8126.12.camel@jellyfish.redfishdemo.com> On Wed, 2005-03-09 at 12:05 -0600, Rex Dieter wrote: > Yeah, and then *every* revision of the rpm needs to be made available in > order to construct every possible patch (unless *only* patches from the > base rpm are ever released, which, IMO, would be bad in other ways). Or, you could generate one patch for each release (based on the release before it) and then apply multiple patches. So, if you have the following releases: 1.0.0 1.0.1 1.0.1.1 1.0.2 1.0.3 You would have four patches and someone updating from 1.0.1 to 1.0.3 would need to download and apply three patches which should still be a huge saving over having to download a single RPM. Yes, it would be more than just grabbing a single patch from 1.0.1 to 1.0.3, but probably not a lot different since changes are often made to different parts of the file. It would however simplify the number of patches that need to be maintained while trying to achieve the objective of making it faster for people on limited connections (or people who just want to update quick) to do so. If the system was really smart, it might look at the size of patches to be downloaded, compared with the size of the RPM and then decide which would be better. Rodd From trashbin at gmail.com Thu Mar 10 06:00:27 2005 From: trashbin at gmail.com (Trash Bin) Date: Wed, 9 Mar 2005 22:00:27 -0800 Subject: Why is FC3 stuck with Thunderbird 0.9? In-Reply-To: <422A0E1D.2010209@redhat.com> References: <4229FC4E.40105@mail.telepac.pt> <422A0E1D.2010209@redhat.com> Message-ID: > Honestly? The answer is just that I haven't gotten around to it. > Firefox was the priority since that is one of our default apps -- the > others aren't. Thunderbird 1.0.1 and Mozilla 1.7.6 are right around the > corner, so at this juncture, It may be best to wait a few more days. > I'm in an upstream meeting this Monday where I'll find out more about > when the next releases are out, and I'll push out updates then if they > seem to be too far out. What is the status now? From jdesbonnet at gmail.com Thu Mar 10 08:14:45 2005 From: jdesbonnet at gmail.com (Joe Desbonnet) Date: Thu, 10 Mar 2005 08:14:45 +0000 Subject: A more efficient up2date service using binary diffs In-Reply-To: <1110421202.8126.12.camel@jellyfish.redfishdemo.com> References: <422F17B5.5070402@galway.net> <1110383623.3448.8.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1110383996.31871.28.camel@cutter> <1cef3e95050309082839ba4beb@mail.gmail.com> <1110391094.3448.18.camel@localhost.localdomain> <422F3ACE.7010309@math.unl.edu> <1110421202.8126.12.camel@jellyfish.redfishdemo.com> Message-ID: <1cef3e9505031000145aa96c4a@mail.gmail.com> Here is my (draft) idea as to how to explore this further. The advantage of this approach is that it can work as a separate 3rd party add on software without any modification to the existing software. I have to confess I'm currently not very familiar with the inner workings of up2date, apt, yum etc, so maybe there are gotchas here I havn't thought about. A RPM repository proxy server runs on the local computer. This proxy server will be configured with the following information: * Location of locally stored RPMs (/var/spool/up2date, copies of install CDs etc) * Location of online RPM repositories * Location of RPM diff/delta reposities Yum/up2date/apt is configured to point to this local server as the repository. When the proxy server receives a request for a RPM, it checks the diff repository and obtains a list of diffs that apply to that RPM. It then checks the local cache to see what RPMs are available. If there is a suitable match, the downloads the diff, applies the patch, checks the integrity of the resulting RPM and passes the RPM back to the calling software (yum/up2date whatever). If no diff is found, it just downloads the RPM and passes it on directly. A copy of any new RPM (obtained by diff or by whole) is keep in a cache for possible use later. Obviously a separate project is to produce a tool that can automatically crunch a diff/delta repository out of a standard RPM repository. Any flaws in this idea? If not I'll consider taking it on. Joe. From seyman at wanadoo.fr Thu Mar 10 08:17:31 2005 From: seyman at wanadoo.fr (Emmanuel Seyman) Date: Thu, 10 Mar 2005 09:17:31 +0100 Subject: palm and fedora In-Reply-To: <1110395756.3090.1.camel@cluster2> References: <1110395756.3090.1.camel@cluster2> Message-ID: <20050310081731.GB7241@orient.maison.moi> On Wed, Mar 09, 2005 at 04:15:56PM -0300, Patricio Bruna V wrote: > > hi, i have a PALM T3, when i try to sync, or just "pilot-xfer -l" the > connection died before it suppose to. > > i configure the perms and setup udev to work ok, but it keeping diying These two pages helped me set it up. Try them out and if it still doesn't work, send a mail to fedora-list at redhat.com (fedora-devel isn't an end-user list) giving as much details as possible. http://fedoranews.org/tchung/gnome-pilot/ http://www.clasohm.com/blog/one-entry?entry_id=12096 From iago.rubio at hispalinux.es Thu Mar 10 08:33:48 2005 From: iago.rubio at hispalinux.es (Iago Rubio) Date: Thu, 10 Mar 2005 09:33:48 +0100 Subject: [OT] Re: dns poisoning? In-Reply-To: <20050310105008.9458.REES@ddcom.co.jp> References: <20050310105008.9458.REES@ddcom.co.jp> Message-ID: <1110443628.16182.35.camel@speedy.iagorubio.net> On Thu, 2005-03-10 at 11:08 +0900, Joel wrote: > Sorry for the cross-post. It's off topic here. It's the fedora development list, not the redhat support list. It even could be off topic for the redhat support crew, and you should contact your ISP reporting possible attacks on their DNS servers. Only if you know the redhat DNSs have been taken down - hijacked - you should contact redhat - not the fedora's development list. > I just tried to access bugzilla.redhat.com on a MSWxp box (Firefox) and > got a certificate dialog. (You know, "This certificate does not appear > to be valid. Etc." which is really poor wording, anyway.) There are more words in the firefox certificate dialog. > I panicked and cancelled (good) Bad, no need for panic, and you lost what had happened. Even while anyone was able to drive a man-in-the-middle attack, I'll not eat your box just for reading the certificate or going to the spoofed page. To "panic and unplug" is one of the worst things you can do when an attack is in place. You will get clueless about what had happen. > without looking at the certificate first > (bad). Agree. > Shut down Firefox. Went to my FC box and tried from there. Access > completed as it has in the past, redirecting me successfully to https > without any certificate dialog. So I tried again from the MSWxp box and > this time there was no certificate dialog. It connected me via ssl the > way it usually does. > > There was a lot of news yesterday about dns poisoning. If both boxes used the same DNS server, both boxes should have been fooled. Frankly, I don't see a reason for anyone to spend the effort of driving a man-in-the-middle attack on bugzilla. To harvest a bugzilla password ? Sounds weird, uh ? > Anyone else seen something like this? Unfortunately you don't know what had happened so it's quite difficult to say if anyone seen ... what ? I'll be better for the next time to try to pick all information you can to identify the problem. -- Iago Rubio From skvidal at phy.duke.edu Thu Mar 10 08:55:45 2005 From: skvidal at phy.duke.edu (seth vidal) Date: Thu, 10 Mar 2005 03:55:45 -0500 Subject: A more efficient up2date service using binary diffs In-Reply-To: <1cef3e9505031000145aa96c4a@mail.gmail.com> References: <422F17B5.5070402@galway.net> <1110383623.3448.8.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1110383996.31871.28.camel@cutter> <1cef3e95050309082839ba4beb@mail.gmail.com> <1110391094.3448.18.camel@localhost.localdomain> <422F3ACE.7010309@math.unl.edu> <1110421202.8126.12.camel@jellyfish.redfishdemo.com> <1cef3e9505031000145aa96c4a@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1110444945.31871.145.camel@cutter> On Thu, 2005-03-10 at 08:14 +0000, Joe Desbonnet wrote: > Here is my (draft) idea as to how to explore this further. The > advantage of this approach is that it can work as a separate 3rd party > add on software without any modification to the existing software. I > have to confess I'm currently not very familiar with the inner > workings of up2date, apt, yum etc, so maybe there are gotchas here I > havn't thought about. Make sure you support byte-range requests. Yum uses http byte-range requests to download the header of the rpms directly from the rpms on the remote site. Most proxies can deal with that but it's just something to be aware of. -sv From nphilipp at redhat.com Thu Mar 10 20:57:48 2005 From: nphilipp at redhat.com (Nils Philippsen) Date: Thu, 10 Mar 2005 21:57:48 +0100 Subject: rawhide report: 20050309 changes In-Reply-To: <20050309223506.GK853@devserv.devel.redhat.com> References: <200503091300.j29D0o8q009628@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <20050309143714.7f0e7535@nausicaa.camperquake.de> <20050309165625.GB19986@nostromo.devel.redhat.com> <1110406284.20297.2.camel@mdlinux> <1110417088.5092.2.camel@gibraltar.stuttgart.redhat.com> <20050309223506.GK853@devserv.devel.redhat.com> Message-ID: <1110488268.8882.6.camel@gibraltar.stuttgart.redhat.com> On Wed, 2005-03-09 at 17:35 -0500, Jakub Jelinek wrote: > On Thu, Mar 10, 2005 at 02:11:27AM +0100, Nils Philippsen wrote: > > --- 8< --- > > #!/bin/bash > > > > if type -path gcc296 >&/dev/null; then > > # RHEL3 > > exec gcc296 "$@" > > else > > # Wrap gcc so that it uses version 2.96 of the libgcc library to link > > # Oracle binaries > > exec /usr/bin/gcc.bin -B /usr/lib/gcc-lib/i386-redhat-linux/2.96 -static-libgcc "$@" > > -B argument should be / terminated, i.e. -B /usr/lib/gcc-lib/i386-redhat-linux/2.96/ Good to know, will change that immediately (it's a script SAP customers get when installing Oracle on RHEL/x86). Thanks, Nils -- Nils Philippsen / Red Hat / nphilipp at redhat.com "They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety." -- B. Franklin, 1759 PGP fingerprint: C4A8 9474 5C4C ADE3 2B8F 656D 47D8 9B65 6951 3011 From pnasrat at redhat.com Thu Mar 10 10:26:28 2005 From: pnasrat at redhat.com (Paul Nasrat) Date: Thu, 10 Mar 2005 10:26:28 +0000 Subject: A more efficient up2date service using binary diffs In-Reply-To: <20050309222930.GE15009@angus.ind.WPI.EDU> References: <422F17B5.5070402@galway.net> <1110383623.3448.8.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1110383996.31871.28.camel@cutter> <1cef3e95050309082839ba4beb@mail.gmail.com> <1110391094.3448.18.camel@localhost.localdomain> <422F3ACE.7010309@math.unl.edu> <1110393130.3448.32.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1cef3e95050309110335197fd9@mail.gmail.com> <604aa7910503091130609b492c@mail.gmail.com> <20050309222930.GE15009@angus.ind.WPI.EDU> Message-ID: <1110450389.4032.2.camel@anu.eridu> On Wed, 2005-03-09 at 17:29 -0500, Chuck R. Anderson wrote: > On Wed, Mar 09, 2005 at 10:23:13PM +0000, M A Young wrote: > > From what I remember when I looked at this a while ago, if you use rsync > > you need uncompressed rpms on the server and client (or dynamically > > uncompress a file each time) to sync between, and you need to compress the > > rsync communications or else the uncompressed differences may be bigger > > than the rpms anyway. > > No, you only need to start compressing with the rsync zlib patch, > which makes zlib compression rsync-friendly. https://svn.uhulinux.hu/packages/dev/zlib/patches/02-rsync.patch rpm's internal zlib has this, not sure if it's in rawhide zlib though. Paul From twaugh at redhat.com Thu Mar 10 10:48:43 2005 From: twaugh at redhat.com (Tim Waugh) Date: Thu, 10 Mar 2005 10:48:43 +0000 Subject: rawhide report: 20050309 changes In-Reply-To: <1110413545.6440.2.camel@tiger> References: <1110413545.6440.2.camel@tiger> Message-ID: <20050310104843.GC29604@redhat.com> On Wed, Mar 09, 2005 at 07:12:25PM -0500, Louis Garcia wrote: > So were are the printer drivers coming from now that Omni is gone? Which model of printer are you asking about? There is some overlap between the models that Omni provided drivers for and the models that are driven by (for example) gimp-print and hpijs. Tim. */ -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: not available URL: From ee21rh at surrey.ac.uk Thu Mar 10 11:03:26 2005 From: ee21rh at surrey.ac.uk (Richard Hughes) Date: Thu, 10 Mar 2005 11:03:26 +0000 (UTC) Subject: hald causing stutters References: <1110418168.8126.5.camel@jellyfish.redfishdemo.com> Message-ID: Rodd Clarkson clarkson.id.au> writes: > Watching my CPU use, I get a spike every 5 seconds (a cheap one thousand > and one, two thousand and two quess). > This is really quite annoying. It's essentially a pause in your UI > every 5 seconds or so, including music that's playing and the likes. Oops. The new acpi check code polls every 5 seconds to support laptops that don't give ACPI events. I'm not sure why the poll would cause such a massive chunk of CPU. David, perhaps we can make this configurable? > Is anyone else seeing this (and hopefully addressing it)? And does > someone have a stop gap for it until it's resolved? I see a small spike, but with no interruption to music playing etc. Richard Hughes. From arjanv at redhat.com Thu Mar 10 11:20:12 2005 From: arjanv at redhat.com (Arjan van de Ven) Date: Thu, 10 Mar 2005 12:20:12 +0100 Subject: hald causing stutters In-Reply-To: References: <1110418168.8126.5.camel@jellyfish.redfishdemo.com> Message-ID: <1110453613.6291.71.camel@laptopd505.fenrus.org> On Thu, 2005-03-10 at 11:03 +0000, Richard Hughes wrote: > Rodd Clarkson clarkson.id.au> writes: > > Watching my CPU use, I get a spike every 5 seconds (a cheap one thousand > > and one, two thousand and two quess). > > This is really quite annoying. It's essentially a pause in your UI > > every 5 seconds or so, including music that's playing and the likes. > > Oops. The new acpi check code polls every 5 seconds to support laptops that > don't give ACPI events. I'm not sure why the poll would cause such a massive > chunk of CPU. David, the BIOS can take however long it wants to report certain things. Polling for battery can easily take a few dozen miliseconds. Asking more complex stuff can take longer. It's really better to never poll ;( (I realize the user experience isnt great there if the bios is crippled, but well.....) -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part URL: From lkml at mac.com Thu Mar 10 11:22:10 2005 From: lkml at mac.com (Felipe Alfaro Solana) Date: Thu, 10 Mar 2005 12:22:10 +0100 Subject: dns poisoning? In-Reply-To: <20050310105008.9458.REES@ddcom.co.jp> References: <20050310105008.9458.REES@ddcom.co.jp> Message-ID: On 10 Mar 2005, at 03:08, Joel wrote: > I just tried to access bugzilla.redhat.com on a MSWxp box (Firefox) and > got a certificate dialog. (You know, "This certificate does not appear > to be valid. Etc." which is really poor wording, anyway.) > > I panicked and cancelled (good) without looking at the certificate > first > (bad). Shut down Firefox. Went to my FC box and tried from there. > Access > completed as it has in the past, redirecting me successfully to https > without any certificate dialog. So I tried again from the MSWxp box and > this time there was no certificate dialog. It connected me via ssl the > way it usually does. > > There was a lot of news yesterday about dns poisoning. > > Anyone else seen something like this? No. From rodd at clarkson.id.au Thu Mar 10 12:12:27 2005 From: rodd at clarkson.id.au (Rodd Clarkson) Date: Thu, 10 Mar 2005 23:12:27 +1100 Subject: hald causing stutters In-Reply-To: <1110453613.6291.71.camel@laptopd505.fenrus.org> References: <1110418168.8126.5.camel@jellyfish.redfishdemo.com> <1110453613.6291.71.camel@laptopd505.fenrus.org> Message-ID: <1110456747.4421.9.camel@goose> On Thu, 2005-03-10 at 12:20 +0100, Arjan van de Ven wrote: > On Thu, 2005-03-10 at 11:03 +0000, Richard Hughes wrote: > > Rodd Clarkson clarkson.id.au> writes: > > > Watching my CPU use, I get a spike every 5 seconds (a cheap one thousand > > > and one, two thousand and two quess). > > > This is really quite annoying. It's essentially a pause in your UI > > > every 5 seconds or so, including music that's playing and the likes. > > > > Oops. The new acpi check code polls every 5 seconds to support laptops that > > don't give ACPI events. I'm not sure why the poll would cause such a massive > > chunk of CPU. David, > > the BIOS can take however long it wants to report certain things. > Polling for battery can easily take a few dozen miliseconds. Asking more > complex stuff can take longer. > It's really better to never poll ;( > (I realize the user experience isnt great there if the bios is crippled, > but well.....) I don't know what you would define as crippled, but I'm on a 4 day old Dell Inspiron 8600 with a 2GHz processor, 768MB Ram. Interestingly, and this may have nothing to do with it, but even though I have a 780MB swap partition and fstab seems to have picked it up, it doesn't seem to be 'enabled'. I mention this because I've heard that the kernel likes to have 'some' swap space. fdisk /dev/hda shows: Disk /dev/hda: 60.0 GB, 60011642880 bytes 255 heads, 63 sectors/track, 7296 cylinders Units = cylinders of 16065 * 512 = 8225280 bytes Device Boot Start End Blocks Id System /dev/hda1 1 6 48163+ de Dell Utility /dev/hda2 7 372 2939895 7 HPFS/NTFS /dev/hda3 373 715 2755147+ db CP/M / CTOS / ... /dev/hda4 716 7296 52861882+ 5 Extended /dev/hda5 * 716 725 80293+ 83 Linux /dev/hda6 726 1745 8193118+ 83 Linux /dev/hda7 1746 1843 787153+ 82 Linux swap / Solaris /dev/hda8 1844 5158 26627706 83 Linux less /etc/fstab shows: # This file is edited by fstab-sync - see 'man fstab-sync' for details LABEL=/ / ext3 defaults 1 1 LABEL=/boot /boot ext3 defaults 1 2 none /dev/pts devpts gid=5,mode=620 0 0 none /dev/shm tmpfs defaults 0 0 LABEL=/home /home ext3 defaults 1 2 none /proc proc defaults 0 0 none /sys sysfs defaults 0 0 LABEL=SWAP-hda7 swap swap defaults 0 0 less /proc/meminfo shows MemTotal: 774344 kB MemFree: 11500 kB Buffers: 26664 kB Cached: 255784 kB SwapCached: 0 kB Active: 381484 kB Inactive: 166756 kB HighTotal: 0 kB HighFree: 0 kB LowTotal: 774344 kB LowFree: 11500 kB SwapTotal: 0 kB SwapFree: 0 kB Dirty: 0 kB Writeback: 0 kB Mapped: 324336 kB Slab: 201824 kB CommitLimit: 387172 kB Committed_AS: 998888 kB PageTables: 4052 kB VmallocTotal: 245752 kB VmallocUsed: 3332 kB VmallocChunk: 242204 kB HugePages_Total: 0 HugePages_Free: 0 Hugepagesize: 4096 kB From stickster at gmail.com Thu Mar 10 12:26:00 2005 From: stickster at gmail.com (Paul W. Frields) Date: Thu, 10 Mar 2005 07:26:00 -0500 Subject: hald causing stutters In-Reply-To: <1110456747.4421.9.camel@goose> References: <1110418168.8126.5.camel@jellyfish.redfishdemo.com> <1110453613.6291.71.camel@laptopd505.fenrus.org> <1110456747.4421.9.camel@goose> Message-ID: <1110457560.4895.6.camel@localhost.localdomain> On Thu, 2005-03-10 at 23:12 +1100, Rodd Clarkson wrote: > > > > Watching my CPU use, I get a spike every 5 seconds (a cheap one thousand > > > > and one, two thousand and two quess). [...snip...] > I don't know what you would define as crippled, but I'm on a 4 day old > Dell Inspiron 8600 with a 2GHz processor, 768MB Ram. > > Interestingly, and this may have nothing to do with it, but even though > I have a 780MB swap partition and fstab seems to have picked it up, it > doesn't seem to be 'enabled'. I mention this because I've heard that > the kernel likes to have 'some' swap space. > > fdisk /dev/hda shows: > > Disk /dev/hda: 60.0 GB, 60011642880 bytes > 255 heads, 63 sectors/track, 7296 cylinders > Units = cylinders of 16065 * 512 = 8225280 bytes > > Device Boot Start End Blocks Id System > /dev/hda1 1 6 48163+ de Dell Utility > /dev/hda2 7 372 2939895 7 HPFS/NTFS > /dev/hda3 373 715 2755147+ db CP/M / CTOS / ... > /dev/hda4 716 7296 52861882+ 5 Extended > /dev/hda5 * 716 725 80293+ 83 Linux > /dev/hda6 726 1745 8193118+ 83 Linux > /dev/hda7 1746 1843 787153+ 82 Linux swap / Solaris > /dev/hda8 1844 5158 26627706 83 Linux > > less /etc/fstab shows: > > # This file is edited by fstab-sync - see 'man fstab-sync' for details > LABEL=/ / ext3 defaults 1 1 > LABEL=/boot /boot ext3 defaults 1 2 > none /dev/pts devpts gid=5,mode=620 0 0 > none /dev/shm tmpfs defaults 0 0 > LABEL=/home /home ext3 defaults 1 2 > none /proc proc defaults 0 0 > none /sys sysfs defaults 0 0 > LABEL=SWAP-hda7 swap swap defaults 0 0 > > less /proc/meminfo shows > > MemTotal: 774344 kB > MemFree: 11500 kB > Buffers: 26664 kB > Cached: 255784 kB > SwapCached: 0 kB > Active: 381484 kB > Inactive: 166756 kB > HighTotal: 0 kB > HighFree: 0 kB > LowTotal: 774344 kB > LowFree: 11500 kB > SwapTotal: 0 kB > SwapFree: 0 kB > Dirty: 0 kB > Writeback: 0 kB > Mapped: 324336 kB > Slab: 201824 kB > CommitLimit: 387172 kB > Committed_AS: 998888 kB > PageTables: 4052 kB > VmallocTotal: 245752 kB > VmallocUsed: 3332 kB > VmallocChunk: 242204 kB > HugePages_Total: 0 > HugePages_Free: 0 > Hugepagesize: 4096 kB I may be out of touch since I'm not using a rawhide kernel, but I don't believe swap space supports an e2label, and would be surprised if that has changed. Try changing your /etc/fstab like so: /dev/hda7 swap swap defaults 0 0 Maybe someone more knowledgeable could point out whether this discrepancy would result in the symptoms you're observing. -- Paul W. Frields, RHCE From buildsys at redhat.com Thu Mar 10 12:37:57 2005 From: buildsys at redhat.com (Build System) Date: Thu, 10 Mar 2005 07:37:57 -0500 Subject: rawhide report: 20050310 changes Message-ID: <200503101237.j2ACbvWx017272@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> Removed package dlm-kernel Removed package cman-kernel Removed package gnbd-kernel Removed package w3m-el Removed package dlm-kernel Removed package gnbd-kernel Removed package cman-kernel Removed package tora Removed package GFS-kernel Removed package cman Removed package dlm Removed package gnbd Updated Packages: audit-0.6.7-1 ------------- * Wed Mar 09 2005 Steve Grubb 0.6.7-1 - Fixed bug setting loginuid - Added num_logs to configure number of logs when rotating - Added code for rotating logs bind-22:9.3.1rc1-5 ------------------ * Wed Mar 09 2005 Jason Vas Dias - 22.9.2.1rc1-5 - fix bug 150288: h_errno not being accessed / set correctly in libbind booty-0.50-1 ------------ * Wed Mar 09 2005 Chris Lumens 0.50-1 - Make sure to write out a --driveorder parameter in the kickstart file (#140446). - Do a better job of ignoring volume groups - for instance, if the user has changed the group's name away from our assumed VolGroupXX (#150630). ccs-0.24-1.1 ------------ cups-1:1.1.23-14 ---------------- * Thu Mar 10 2005 Tim Waugh 1:1.1.23-14 - Fixed up dbus patch so that it compiles. * Wed Mar 09 2005 John (J5) Palmieri - Fix up dbus patch curl-7.13.1-1 ------------- * Wed Mar 09 2005 Ivana Varekova 7.13.1-1 - rebuilt (7.13.1) cvs-1.11.19-5 ------------- * Wed Mar 09 2005 Martin Stransky 1.11.19-5 - fix newline issue in log (#64182) desktop-printing-0.18-6 ----------------------- * Wed Mar 09 2005 Matthias Clasen 0.18-6 - Install an icon (#137653) eclipse-1:3.1.0_fc-0.M5.12 -------------------------- * Mon Mar 07 2005 Ben Konrath 3.1.0_fc-0.M5.12 - Add activeHelpSample.jar patch. - Change to Fedora M-build splash screen. - Add find patch courtesy Ziga Mahkovec (RH#149927#) - Build native stuff with -O2 on i386. * Mon Mar 07 2005 Andrew Overholt 3.1.0_fc-0.M5.11 - Add s390 and s390x patches. - Don't build for them, though, due to gcc bug and Eclipse building issue. - Add xorg-x11-devel BuildRequires. * Fri Mar 04 2005 Andrew Overholt 3.1.0_fc-0.M5.10 - Add proper mozilla version. - Don't build eclipseAdaptor.jar.so in order to work around plugin building problems. emacspeak-21.0-2 ---------------- * Wed Mar 09 2005 Jens Petersen - 21.0-2 - rebuild with gcc 4 epiphany-1.5.8-3 ---------------- * Wed Mar 09 2005 Christopher Aillon - 1.5.8-3 - Depend on mozilla 1.7.6 evolution-2.2.0-4 ----------------- * Wed Mar 09 2005 Christopher Aillon - 2.2.0-4 - Depend on mozilla 1.7.6 * Wed Mar 09 2005 David Malcolm - 2.2.0-3 - added patch from upstream for bug XB-73192, fixing missing "Mark as Read/Unread" context menu items * Tue Mar 08 2005 David Malcolm - 2.2.0-2 - actually add source tarball this time filesystem-2.3.1-1 ------------------ * Wed Mar 09 2005 Bill Nottingham 2.3.1-1 - don't ship /usr/lib64/X11 in general (#147077) firstboot-1.3.39-3 ------------------ * Wed Mar 09 2005 Elliot Lee - 1.3.39-3 - Rebuild for FC4test1 * Tue Dec 14 2004 Adrian Likins - 1.3.39-2 - really fix #138727 (was looking for cdroms in the wrong place) * Tue Dec 14 2004 Adrian Likins - 1.3.38-1 - fix #138727 (patch from katzj) - latest translations foomatic-3.0.2-17 ----------------- * Wed Mar 09 2005 Tim Waugh 3.0.2-17 - Make Omni optional. - ... and disable it. gcc-4.0.0-0.32 -------------- gdm-1:2.6.0.7-4 --------------- * Wed Mar 09 2005 Than Ngo 1:2.6.0.7-4 - add OnlyShowIn=GNOME; * Mon Feb 28 2005 Ray Strode 1:2.6.0.7-3 - seteuid/egid as user before testing for presence of user's home directory (fixes bug 149899) gimp-2:2.2.4-3 -------------- * Wed Mar 09 2005 Nils Philippsen - prevent gifload plugin from crashing when loading files with bogus frame size (#150677, #150678) * Wed Mar 02 2005 Nils Philippsen - don't barf when building with gcc 4.0 * Wed Feb 23 2005 Nils Philippsen - version 2.2.4 - require newer versions of gtk2 (#143840), glib2 and pango hwdata-0.152-1 -------------- * Wed Mar 09 2005 Bill Nottingham 0.152-1 - fix qlogic driver mappings, add upgradelist mappings for the modules that changed names (#150621) isdn4k-utils-3.2-26 ------------------- * Wed Mar 09 2005 Than Ngo 3.2-26 - update cvs snapshot - fix gcc4 build problem * Sat Mar 05 2005 Than Ngo 3.2-25 - rebuilt libbonoboui-2.8.1-2 ------------------- * Wed Mar 09 2005 Than Ngo 2.8.1-2 - add OnlyShowIn=GNOME; libusb-0.1.10a-1 ---------------- * Wed Mar 09 2005 Tim Waugh 0.1.10a-1 - 0.1.10a. libxml2-2.6.17-6 ---------------- * Wed Mar 02 2005 Daniel Veillard 2.6.17-6 - fix for the aliasing error breaking up on s390 and gcc4 * Wed Mar 02 2005 Daniel Veillard 2.6.17-5 - rebuilt for gcc4 libxslt-1.1.12-5 ---------------- * Wed Mar 09 2005 Daniel Veillard 1.1.12-5 - rebuilt again * Wed Mar 02 2005 Daniel Veillard 1.1.12-4 - rebuilt for gcc4 magma-1.0-0.pre20.0.3 --------------------- mdadm-1.9.0-1 ------------- * Wed Mar 09 2005 Doug Ledford 1.9.0-1 - Initial upgrade to 1.9.0 and update of doc files - Fix an s390 build error mozilla-37:1.7.6-0.cvs.20050309 ------------------------------- * Wed Mar 09 2005 Christopher Aillon 37:1.7.6-0.cvs.20050309 - Update to latest 1.7.6 branch from CVS. netpbm-10.26.4-2 ---------------- * Wed Mar 09 2005 Jindrich Novy 10.26.4-2 - add .gcc4 patch to fix some missing declarations of headers, some pointer signedness mismatches, remove xmalloc2 - rebuilt with gcc4 * Thu Mar 03 2005 Jindrich Novy 10.26.4-1 - update to netpbm-10.26.4, remove jbig, hpcd - this version fixes #149924 - regenerate man pages (don't include man pages without binaries - #146863) policycoreutils-1.21.22-2 ------------------------- * Wed Mar 09 2005 Dan Walsh 1.21.22-2 - Fix genhomedircon to not put bad userad error in file_contexts.homedir rhpl-0.157-1 ------------ * Wed Mar 09 2005 Peter Jones - 0.157-1 - get rid of "constructors" in favor of a Unit class and "units", which works like the old constructors. - rework storage.Size.__str__ to be much cleaner - make clamp/unclamp/shrink return self. * Wed Mar 09 2005 Peter Jones - 0.156-1 - added NonNegativeIntegerDescriptor - changed storage.Size to allow for displaying 1GB as 1024MB * Wed Mar 09 2005 Harald Hoyer - 0.155-1 - fixed segfault #150449 with s/strcpy/strncpy/ in ethtool selinux-policy-strict-1.21.16-2 ------------------------------- * Wed Mar 09 2005 Dan Walsh 1.21.16-2 - Add in ifconfig and hostname to make dhcpc work * Wed Mar 09 2005 Dan Walsh 1.21.16-1 - Rebuild to fix bad policycoreutils - fix ftpd_selinux man page - Update to latest from NSA * Tue Mar 08 2005 Dan Walsh 1.21.15-8 - Add back in dhcpc.te to targeted - remove java_domain - Fix rpc_pipefs reg expression found by Eric Paris - Fix sendmail - Add ftpd_anon_rw_t selinux-policy-targeted-1.21.16-4 --------------------------------- * Wed Mar 09 2005 Dan Walsh 1.21.16-4 - Add in ifconfig and hostname to make dhcpc work - Add dontaudit for some net_admin calls - Add users directory to targeted * Wed Mar 09 2005 Dan Walsh 1.21.16-1 - Rebuild to fix bad policycoreutils - fix ftpd_selinux man page - Update to latest from NSA shared-mime-info-0.15-11 ------------------------ * Wed Mar 09 2005 David Zeuthen - 0.15-11 - Add mimetypes for OOo2 (#150546) sqlite-3.1.2-1 -------------- * Wed Mar 09 2005 Jeff Johnson 3.1.2-1 - rename to "sqlite" from "sqlite3" (#149719, #150012). subversion-1.1.3-6 ------------------ * Wed Mar 09 2005 Joe Orton 1.1.3-6 - fix svn_load_dirs File::Path version requirement * Tue Mar 08 2005 Joe Orton 1.1.3-5 - add -java subpackage for javahl libraries (Anthony Green, #116202) system-config-printer-0.6.125-1 ------------------------------- * Wed Mar 09 2005 Tim Waugh 0.6.125-1 - 0.6.125: - Don't require Omni. system-config-samba-1.2.27-1 ---------------------------- * Wed Mar 09 2005 Nils Philippsen - 1.2.27-1 - let users configure whether a share is browsable ("visible") or not ("hidden") * Wed Feb 16 2005 Nils Philippsen - use UIManager when possible to avoid deprecation warnings (#134367, #143678) tcl-8.4.9-3 ----------- * Wed Mar 09 2005 Jens Petersen - 8.4.9-3 - rebuild with gcc 4 * Tue Dec 14 2004 Jens Petersen - 8.4.9-2 - move tclConfig.sh into -devel (Axel Thimm, 142724) * Thu Dec 09 2004 Jens Petersen - 8.4.9-1 - new stable release tk-8.4.9-3 ---------- * Wed Mar 09 2005 Jens Petersen - 8.4.9-3 - tk-devel requires tcl-devel and xorg-x11-devel instead of XFree86-devel - use sed instead of perl for fixing tkConfig.sh - buildrequire sed instead of perl - buildrequire xorg-x11-devel instead of XFree86-devel - rebuild with gcc 4 xen-2-20050308 -------------- * Wed Mar 09 2005 Rik van Riel 2-20050308 - upgrade to last night's snapshot - new compile fix patch * Sun Mar 06 2005 Rik van Riel 2-20050305 - the gcc4 compile patches are now upstream - upgrade to last night's snapshot, drop patches locally yelp-2.6.3-1 ------------ * Wed Sep 22 2004 Christopher Aillon 2.6.3-1 - Update to 2.6.3 * Fri Sep 03 2004 Matthias Clasen 2.6.2-2 - fix an translation problem * Tue Aug 31 2004 Alex Larsson 2.6.2-1 - update to 2.6.2 yelp-2.9.3-3 ------------ * Wed Mar 09 2005 Christopher Aillon 2.9.3-3 - Depend on mozilla 1.7.6 From pmatilai at welho.com Thu Mar 10 13:20:49 2005 From: pmatilai at welho.com (Panu Matilainen) Date: Thu, 10 Mar 2005 15:20:49 +0200 (EET) Subject: Fedora repository layout proposal Message-ID: While testing repoquery I noticed that the FC updates repository metadata doesn't include the SRPMS directories at all. So far nothing has used the SRPMS information but that's changing: yum-src for doing things like installing build-dependencies is planned/in the works and repoquery can already use that info, for example: [pmatilai at chip ~]$ repoquery.py --source -l yum yum-2.1.11.tar.gz yum-ia32e-2.1.11.patch yum.conf.fedora yum.spec Would be nice to have this fixed, at least in FC4 but why not FC3 updates as well, shouldn't be terribly hard :) While at it, it might make sense to split out the repository metadata somewhat as suggested by Seth here: https://lists.dulug.duke.edu/pipermail/yum-devel/2005-March/000833.html In short: split SRPMS, debuginfo and the actual binaries to separate repositories: most people will never need the debuginfo and source packages yet having all those lumped into the main repodata slows down yum operations and causes unnecessary network traffic as well. - Panu - From n3npq at nc.rr.com Thu Mar 10 14:30:24 2005 From: n3npq at nc.rr.com (Jeff Johnson) Date: Thu, 10 Mar 2005 09:30:24 -0500 Subject: Fedora repository layout proposal In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <42305A00.1090504@nc.rr.com> Panu Matilainen wrote: > > While testing repoquery I noticed that the FC updates repository > metadata doesn't include the SRPMS directories at all. So far nothing > has used the SRPMS information but that's changing: yum-src for doing > things like installing build-dependencies is planned/in the works and > repoquery can already use that info, for example: > [pmatilai at chip ~]$ repoquery.py --source -l yum > yum-2.1.11.tar.gz > yum-ia32e-2.1.11.patch > yum.conf.fedora > yum.spec > > Would be nice to have this fixed, at least in FC4 but why not FC3 > updates as well, shouldn't be terribly hard :) > > While at it, it might make sense to split out the repository metadata > somewhat as suggested by Seth here: > https://lists.dulug.duke.edu/pipermail/yum-devel/2005-March/000833.html > In short: split SRPMS, debuginfo and the actual binaries to separate > repositories: most people will never need the debuginfo and source > packages yet having all those lumped into the main repodata slows down > yum operations and causes unnecessary network traffic as well. > If you are going to split out SRPMS/debuginfo (wise imho), then you should also consider splitting multilib arches into seperate repositories. The rationale for splitting say, i386 from x86_64, is to simplify package choices at a repo affinity level, rather than based on multilib coloring, so that single arch platforms are easier to set-up and maintain. 73 de Jeff From fedora-devel at camperquake.de Thu Mar 10 13:33:52 2005 From: fedora-devel at camperquake.de (Ralf Ertzinger) Date: Thu, 10 Mar 2005 14:33:52 +0100 Subject: GCC warning, whom to blame? Message-ID: <20050310143352.1c830160@nausicaa.camperquake.de> Hi. I am getting a GCC error while compiling a package (which is not part of FC), and I'd like to know if this is a gcc4 bug (which I think it is): The compile dies with: configfile.c:87:73: error: macro "read" passed 4 arguments, but takes just 3 configfile.c: In function 'xmms_cfg_read_value': configfile.c:86: warning: return makes integer from pointer without a cast configfile.c:95:66: error: macro "read" passed 4 arguments, but takes just 3 configfile.c: In function 'xmms_cfg_write_value': configfile.c:94: warning: statement with no effect The line in question reads: 82 gboolean xmms_cfg_read_value(ConfigFile * config_file, 83 const gchar * section, const gchar * key, 84 XmmsCfgValueType value_type, gpointer * value) 85 { 86 return xmms_cfg_value_type_func[value_type].read(config_file, 87 section, key, value); 88 } I think glibc implemets the read system call as a macro, and GCC tries to apply this macro to the .read part above. Am I correct? If yes, is GCC correct in doing this? -- 24 hours in a day, 24 beers in a case. Coincidence? I think not. From jakub at redhat.com Thu Mar 10 13:42:22 2005 From: jakub at redhat.com (Jakub Jelinek) Date: Thu, 10 Mar 2005 08:42:22 -0500 Subject: GCC warning, whom to blame? In-Reply-To: <20050310143352.1c830160@nausicaa.camperquake.de> References: <20050310143352.1c830160@nausicaa.camperquake.de> Message-ID: <20050310134221.GR853@devserv.devel.redhat.com> On Thu, Mar 10, 2005 at 02:33:52PM +0100, Ralf Ertzinger wrote: > I am getting a GCC error while compiling a package (which is not part of FC), > and I'd like to know if this is a gcc4 bug (which I think it is): > > The compile dies with: > > configfile.c:87:73: error: macro "read" passed 4 arguments, but takes just 3 > configfile.c: In function 'xmms_cfg_read_value': > configfile.c:86: warning: return makes integer from pointer without a cast > configfile.c:95:66: error: macro "read" passed 4 arguments, but takes just 3 > configfile.c: In function 'xmms_cfg_write_value': > configfile.c:94: warning: statement with no effect > > > The line in question reads: > > 82 gboolean xmms_cfg_read_value(ConfigFile * config_file, > 83 const gchar * section, const gchar * key, > 84 XmmsCfgValueType value_type, gpointer * value) > 85 { > 86 return xmms_cfg_value_type_func[value_type].read(config_file, > 87 section, key, value); > 88 } > > I think glibc implemets the read system call as a macro, and GCC tries to > apply this macro to the .read part above. Am I correct? If yes, is GCC > correct in doing this? This is a bug in xmms or whatever this snippet is from. POSIX allows (the vast majority of) functions it defines to be also defined as function-like macros. You can either #undef read after including system headers and before you start using it for something else, or prevent it from being expanded as function-like macro: > 86 return (xmms_cfg_value_type_func[value_type].read) (config_file, > 87 section, key, value); The latter solution is preferrable, as that doesn't prevent checking of normal read calls in the same source. That said, we might be changing some of the -D_FORTIFY_SOURCE={1,2} checking wrapper macros to extern inline functions, so code like this would continue working as is (though e.g. memcpy etc. macros are more likely to stay). Which doesn't mean the applications shouldn't be fixed. Jakub From mclasen at redhat.com Thu Mar 10 13:43:31 2005 From: mclasen at redhat.com (Matthias Clasen) Date: Thu, 10 Mar 2005 08:43:31 -0500 Subject: GCC warning, whom to blame? In-Reply-To: <20050310143352.1c830160@nausicaa.camperquake.de> References: <20050310143352.1c830160@nausicaa.camperquake.de> Message-ID: <1110462211.5714.1.camel@golem.boston.redhat.com> On Thu, 2005-03-10 at 14:33 +0100, Ralf Ertzinger wrote: > Hi. > > I am getting a GCC error while compiling a package (which is not part of FC), > and I'd like to know if this is a gcc4 bug (which I think it is): > > The compile dies with: > > configfile.c:87:73: error: macro "read" passed 4 arguments, but takes just 3 > configfile.c: In function 'xmms_cfg_read_value': > configfile.c:86: warning: return makes integer from pointer without a cast > configfile.c:95:66: error: macro "read" passed 4 arguments, but takes just 3 > configfile.c: In function 'xmms_cfg_write_value': > configfile.c:94: warning: statement with no effect > > > The line in question reads: > > 82 gboolean xmms_cfg_read_value(ConfigFile * config_file, > 83 const gchar * section, const gchar * key, > 84 XmmsCfgValueType value_type, gpointer * value) > 85 { > 86 return xmms_cfg_value_type_func[value_type].read(config_file, > 87 section, key, value); > 88 } > > I think glibc implemets the read system call as a macro, and GCC tries to > apply this macro to the .read part above. Am I correct? If yes, is GCC > correct in doing this? > Posix explicitly allows this. Using standard function names in that way is just a bad idea, like to using C++ keywords. One way to work around this is to use (read) instead of read (the parens prevent macro expansion). Matthias From fedora-devel at camperquake.de Thu Mar 10 13:46:33 2005 From: fedora-devel at camperquake.de (Ralf Ertzinger) Date: Thu, 10 Mar 2005 14:46:33 +0100 Subject: GCC warning, whom to blame? In-Reply-To: <20050310134221.GR853@devserv.devel.redhat.com> References: <20050310143352.1c830160@nausicaa.camperquake.de> <20050310134221.GR853@devserv.devel.redhat.com> Message-ID: <20050310144633.2d860876@nausicaa.camperquake.de> Hi. Jakub Jelinek wrote: > The latter solution is preferrable, as that doesn't prevent checking of > normal read calls in the same source. OK, thanks. -- Ray's Rule of Precision: Measure with a micrometer. Mark with chalk. Cut with an axe. Brian's Corollary: Hope like hell. From alan at redhat.com Thu Mar 10 14:32:56 2005 From: alan at redhat.com (Alan Cox) Date: Thu, 10 Mar 2005 09:32:56 -0500 Subject: hald causing stutters In-Reply-To: References: <1110418168.8126.5.camel@jellyfish.redfishdemo.com> Message-ID: <20050310143256.GA30059@devserv.devel.redhat.com> On Thu, Mar 10, 2005 at 11:03:26AM +0000, Richard Hughes wrote: > Oops. The new acpi check code polls every 5 seconds to support laptops that > don't give ACPI events. I'm not sure why the poll would cause such a massive > chunk of CPU. David, perhaps we can make this configurable? It traps into the SMM BIOS and what happens then is BIOS dependant. You'll probably find it also makes your clock go out over time as well. Alan From ottohaliburton at comcast.net Thu Mar 10 14:45:31 2005 From: ottohaliburton at comcast.net (Otto Haliburton) Date: Thu, 10 Mar 2005 08:45:31 -0600 Subject: Fedora repository layout proposal In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <003501c5257f$cfb8db80$4901a8c0@C515816A> > -----Original Message----- > From: fedora-devel-list-bounces at redhat.com [mailto:fedora-devel-list- > bounces at redhat.com] On Behalf Of Panu Matilainen > Sent: Thursday, March 10, 2005 7:21 AM > To: fedora-devel-list at redhat.com > Subject: Fedora repository layout proposal > > > While testing repoquery I noticed that the FC updates repository metadata > doesn't include the SRPMS directories at all. So far nothing has used the > SRPMS information but that's changing: yum-src for doing things like > installing build-dependencies is planned/in the works and repoquery can > already use that info, for example: > [pmatilai at chip ~]$ repoquery.py --source -l yum > yum-2.1.11.tar.gz > yum-ia32e-2.1.11.patch > yum.conf.fedora > yum.spec > > Would be nice to have this fixed, at least in FC4 but why not FC3 updates > as well, shouldn't be terribly hard :) > > While at it, it might make sense to split out the repository metadata > somewhat as suggested by Seth here: > https://lists.dulug.duke.edu/pipermail/yum-devel/2005-March/000833.html > In short: split SRPMS, debuginfo and the actual binaries to separate > repositories: most people will never need the debuginfo and source > packages yet having all those lumped into the main repodata slows down yum > operations and causes unnecessary network traffic as well. > > - Panu - > maybe this is the reason that if you select the update source flag with up2date it doesn't work. From Fedora at TQMcube.com Thu Mar 10 15:01:52 2005 From: Fedora at TQMcube.com (David Cary Hart) Date: Thu, 10 Mar 2005 10:01:52 -0500 Subject: Release Notes Suggestion Message-ID: <1110466912.3045.6.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> Suggest "psmouse.proto=exps" or you will be bombarded with no-tap issues. Not that most people read the damned things anyway. BTW, this isn't in bootparam(7) (which could use an update and, perhaps, an HTML version). -- Total Quality Management - A Commitment to Excellence Fight Spam: http://www.tqmcube.com/rbldnsd.htm Real Time Updates: rsync -t \ tqmcube.com::spamlists/[README.htm][clients][dynamic][relays][asiaspam] http://www.tqmcube.com/spam_trap.htm From cra at WPI.EDU Thu Mar 10 15:06:06 2005 From: cra at WPI.EDU (Chuck R. Anderson) Date: Thu, 10 Mar 2005 10:06:06 -0500 Subject: Release Notes Suggestion In-Reply-To: <1110466912.3045.6.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> References: <1110466912.3045.6.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> Message-ID: <20050310150606.GE30899@angus.ind.WPI.EDU> On Thu, Mar 10, 2005 at 10:01:52AM -0500, David Cary Hart wrote: > Suggest "psmouse.proto=exps" or you will be bombarded with no-tap > issues. Not that most people read the damned things anyway. Tapping works fine on all my touchpads without any special options. From fedora-devel at camperquake.de Thu Mar 10 15:06:36 2005 From: fedora-devel at camperquake.de (Ralf Ertzinger) Date: Thu, 10 Mar 2005 16:06:36 +0100 Subject: Release Notes Suggestion In-Reply-To: <1110466912.3045.6.camel@dch.TQMcube.com>; from Fedora@TQMcube.com on Thu, Mar 10, 2005 at 10:01:52AM -0500 References: <1110466912.3045.6.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> Message-ID: <20050310160636.A19606@ryoko.camperquake.de> On Thu, Mar 10, 2005 at 10:01:52AM -0500, David Cary Hart wrote: > Suggest "psmouse.proto=exps" or you will be bombarded with no-tap > issues. Not that most people read the damned things anyway. Uhm.... with the switch to FC3 I was able to drop this on my GFs laptop (using the included synaptics driver instead) From Fedora at TQMcube.com Thu Mar 10 15:10:49 2005 From: Fedora at TQMcube.com (David Cary Hart) Date: Thu, 10 Mar 2005 10:10:49 -0500 Subject: Release Notes Suggestion In-Reply-To: <20050310150606.GE30899@angus.ind.WPI.EDU> References: <1110466912.3045.6.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> <20050310150606.GE30899@angus.ind.WPI.EDU> Message-ID: <1110467449.3045.9.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> On Thu, 2005-03-10 at 10:06 -0500, Chuck R. Anderson wrote: > On Thu, Mar 10, 2005 at 10:01:52AM -0500, David Cary Hart wrote: > > Suggest "psmouse.proto=exps" or you will be bombarded with no-tap > > issues. Not that most people read the damned things anyway. > > Tapping works fine on all my touchpads without any special options. > Sorry, I should have indicated that 2.6.11 kernels turn off ALPS hardware tapping by default. -- Total Quality Management - A Commitment to Excellence Fight Spam: http://www.tqmcube.com/rbldnsd.htm Real Time Updates: rsync -t \ tqmcube.com::spamlists/[README.htm][clients][dynamic][relays][asiaspam] http://www.tqmcube.com/spam_trap.htm From camilo at mesias.co.uk Thu Mar 10 15:12:51 2005 From: camilo at mesias.co.uk (Cam) Date: Thu, 10 Mar 2005 15:12:51 +0000 Subject: Release Notes Suggestion In-Reply-To: <20050310160636.A19606@ryoko.camperquake.de> References: <1110466912.3045.6.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> <20050310160636.A19606@ryoko.camperquake.de> Message-ID: <423063F3.10706@mesias.co.uk> Ralf Ertzinger wrote: > Uhm.... with the switch to FC3 I was able to drop this on my GFs laptop > (using the included synaptics driver instead) I found the synaptics driver was erratic. I can't be more precise but it was hard to use. Maybe the acceleration was unfamiliar or the dragging at edges was strange... I added psmouse.proto=imps which 'cured' the problem. -Cam -- camilo at mesias.co.uk <-- From pnasrat at redhat.com Thu Mar 10 15:43:01 2005 From: pnasrat at redhat.com (Paul Nasrat) Date: Thu, 10 Mar 2005 15:43:01 +0000 Subject: Release Notes Suggestion In-Reply-To: <1110467449.3045.9.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> References: <1110466912.3045.6.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> <20050310150606.GE30899@angus.ind.WPI.EDU> <1110467449.3045.9.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> Message-ID: <1110469382.4032.29.camel@anu.eridu> On Thu, 2005-03-10 at 10:10 -0500, David Cary Hart wrote: > On Thu, 2005-03-10 at 10:06 -0500, Chuck R. Anderson wrote: > > On Thu, Mar 10, 2005 at 10:01:52AM -0500, David Cary Hart wrote: > > > Suggest "psmouse.proto=exps" or you will be bombarded with no-tap > > > issues. Not that most people read the damned things anyway. > > > > Tapping works fine on all my touchpads without any special options. > > > Sorry, I should have indicated that 2.6.11 kernels turn off ALPS > hardware tapping by default. ALPS tapping didn't work beforehand IIRC, as it was just being picked up as a PS/2 mouse. As it's not a regression I don't think we should note it. For test2 I should have the synaptics driver configuring ALPS pads correctly. Paul From pnasrat at redhat.com Thu Mar 10 15:44:38 2005 From: pnasrat at redhat.com (Paul Nasrat) Date: Thu, 10 Mar 2005 15:44:38 +0000 Subject: Release Notes Suggestion In-Reply-To: <423063F3.10706@mesias.co.uk> References: <1110466912.3045.6.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> <20050310160636.A19606@ryoko.camperquake.de> <423063F3.10706@mesias.co.uk> Message-ID: <1110469479.4032.31.camel@anu.eridu> On Thu, 2005-03-10 at 15:12 +0000, Cam wrote: > Ralf Ertzinger wrote: > > > Uhm.... with the switch to FC3 I was able to drop this on my GFs laptop > > (using the included synaptics driver instead) > > I found the synaptics driver was erratic. I can't be more precise but it > was hard to use. Maybe the acceleration was unfamiliar or the dragging > at edges was strange... I added psmouse.proto=imps which 'cured' the > problem. Bug reports would have been useful - most things are configurable in the driver so if you just want tap we could do that. I should look at a config tool for it I guess. Paul From Fedora at TQMcube.com Thu Mar 10 15:47:53 2005 From: Fedora at TQMcube.com (David Cary Hart) Date: Thu, 10 Mar 2005 10:47:53 -0500 Subject: Release Notes Suggestion In-Reply-To: <1110469382.4032.29.camel@anu.eridu> References: <1110466912.3045.6.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> <20050310150606.GE30899@angus.ind.WPI.EDU> <1110467449.3045.9.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> <1110469382.4032.29.camel@anu.eridu> Message-ID: <1110469673.9731.4.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> On Thu, 2005-03-10 at 15:43 +0000, Paul Nasrat wrote: > ALPS tapping didn't work beforehand IIRC, as it was just being picked up > as a PS/2 mouse. As it's not a regression I don't think we should note > it. > It has worked perfectly ("out of the box") in FC1, 2 and 3. Only with the introduction of 2.6.11 has this been an issue. > For test2 I should have the synaptics driver configuring ALPS pads > correctly. Good luck. -- Total Quality Management - A Commitment to Excellence Fight Spam: http://www.tqmcube.com/rbldnsd.htm Real Time Updates: rsync -t \ tqmcube.com::spamlists/[README.htm][clients][dynamic][relays][asiaspam] http://www.tqmcube.com/spam_trap.htm From Fedora at TQMcube.com Thu Mar 10 15:54:17 2005 From: Fedora at TQMcube.com (David Cary Hart) Date: Thu, 10 Mar 2005 10:54:17 -0500 Subject: Release Notes Suggestion In-Reply-To: <1110469673.9731.4.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> References: <1110466912.3045.6.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> <20050310150606.GE30899@angus.ind.WPI.EDU> <1110467449.3045.9.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> <1110469382.4032.29.camel@anu.eridu> <1110469673.9731.4.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> Message-ID: <1110470057.9731.10.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> On Thu, 2005-03-10 at 10:47 -0500, David Cary Hart wrote: > On Thu, 2005-03-10 at 15:43 +0000, Paul Nasrat wrote: > > > ALPS tapping didn't work beforehand IIRC, as it was just being picked up > > as a PS/2 mouse. As it's not a regression I don't think we should note > > it. > > > It has worked perfectly ("out of the box") in FC1, 2 and 3. Only with > the introduction of 2.6.11 has this been an issue. Sorry. Wrong answer. Since 2.6.11 it is identified as ALPS. kernel: ALPS Touchpad (Glidepoint) detected kernel: Disabling hardware tapping kernel: input: AlpsPS/2 ALPS TouchPad on isa0060/serio1 > -- > Total Quality Management - A Commitment to Excellence > Fight Spam: http://www.tqmcube.com/rbldnsd.htm > Real Time Updates: rsync -t \ > tqmcube.com::spamlists/[README.htm][clients][dynamic][relays][asiaspam] > http://www.tqmcube.com/spam_trap.htm > -- Total Quality Management - A Commitment to Excellence Fight Spam: http://www.tqmcube.com/rbldnsd.htm Real Time Updates: rsync -t \ tqmcube.com::spamlists/[README.htm][clients][dynamic][relays][asiaspam] http://www.tqmcube.com/spam_trap.htm From caillon at redhat.com Thu Mar 10 16:29:17 2005 From: caillon at redhat.com (Christopher Aillon) Date: Thu, 10 Mar 2005 11:29:17 -0500 Subject: Why is FC3 stuck with Thunderbird 0.9? In-Reply-To: References: <4229FC4E.40105@mail.telepac.pt> <422A0E1D.2010209@redhat.com> Message-ID: <423075DD.3040608@redhat.com> Trash Bin wrote: >>Honestly? The answer is just that I haven't gotten around to it. >>Firefox was the priority since that is one of our default apps -- the >>others aren't. Thunderbird 1.0.1 and Mozilla 1.7.6 are right around the >>corner, so at this juncture, It may be best to wait a few more days. >>I'm in an upstream meeting this Monday where I'll find out more about >>when the next releases are out, and I'll push out updates then if they >>seem to be too far out. > > What is the status now? Upstream releases to be out soon. Stay tuned for more. From kyrre at solution-forge.net Thu Mar 10 16:27:52 2005 From: kyrre at solution-forge.net (Kyrre Ness Sjobak) Date: Thu, 10 Mar 2005 17:27:52 +0100 Subject: rawhide report: 20050309 changes In-Reply-To: <20050310104843.GC29604@redhat.com> References: <1110413545.6440.2.camel@tiger> <20050310104843.GC29604@redhat.com> Message-ID: <1110472072.3447.0.camel@localhost.localdomain> tor, 10.03.2005 kl. 11.48 skrev Tim Waugh: > On Wed, Mar 09, 2005 at 07:12:25PM -0500, Louis Garcia wrote: > > > So were are the printer drivers coming from now that Omni is gone? > > Which model of printer are you asking about? There is some overlap > between the models that Omni provided drivers for and the models that > are driven by (for example) gimp-print and hpijs. > > Tim. > */ Gimp-print?!? Great quality, but *slooow*... You ain't going to provide some printers with *only* gimp-print? From barryn at pobox.com Thu Mar 10 16:29:15 2005 From: barryn at pobox.com (Barry K. Nathan) Date: Thu, 10 Mar 2005 08:29:15 -0800 Subject: rawhide report: 20050310 changes In-Reply-To: <200503101237.j2ACbvWx017272@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> References: <200503101237.j2ACbvWx017272@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> Message-ID: <20050310162914.GE30940@ip68-4-98-123.oc.oc.cox.net> On Thu, Mar 10, 2005 at 07:37:57AM -0500, Build System wrote: [snip...] > Removed package GFS-kernel [snip...] Is this just a build glitch, or is GFS really being removed? -Barry K. Nathan From terraformers at gmx.net Thu Mar 10 16:20:44 2005 From: terraformers at gmx.net (Lars) Date: Thu, 10 Mar 2005 17:20:44 +0100 Subject: rawhide report: 20050310 changes References: <200503101237.j2ACbvWx017272@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> Message-ID: after updating yum says: Traceback (most recent call last): File "/usr/bin/yum", line 15, in ? yummain.main(sys.argv[1:]) File "/usr/share/yum-cli/yummain.py", line 72, in main result, resultmsgs = do() File "/usr/share/yum-cli/cli.py", line 462, in doCommands return self.updatePkgs() File "/usr/share/yum-cli/cli.py", line 960, in updatePkgs self.doUpdateSetup() File "__init__.py", line 228, in doUpdateSetup File "sqlitesack.py", line 225, in returnObsoletes File "/usr/src/build/515186-i386/install//usr/lib/python2.4/site-packages/sqlite/main.py", line 104, in __getitem__ KeyError: 'PACKAGES.PKGID' guess python-sqlite needs an update. best L From kyrre at solution-forge.net Thu Mar 10 16:38:11 2005 From: kyrre at solution-forge.net (Kyrre Ness Sjobak) Date: Thu, 10 Mar 2005 17:38:11 +0100 Subject: A more efficient up2date service using binary diffs In-Reply-To: <1110444945.31871.145.camel@cutter> References: <422F17B5.5070402@galway.net> <1110383623.3448.8.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1110383996.31871.28.camel@cutter> <1cef3e95050309082839ba4beb@mail.gmail.com> <1110391094.3448.18.camel@localhost.localdomain> <422F3ACE.7010309@math.unl.edu> <1110421202.8126.12.camel@jellyfish.redfishdemo.com> <1cef3e9505031000145aa96c4a@mail.gmail.com> <1110444945.31871.145.camel@cutter> Message-ID: <1110472691.3447.2.camel@localhost.localdomain> tor, 10.03.2005 kl. 09.55 skrev seth vidal: > On Thu, 2005-03-10 at 08:14 +0000, Joe Desbonnet wrote: > > Here is my (draft) idea as to how to explore this further. The > > advantage of this approach is that it can work as a separate 3rd party > > add on software without any modification to the existing software. I > > have to confess I'm currently not very familiar with the inner > > workings of up2date, apt, yum etc, so maybe there are gotchas here I > > havn't thought about. > > Make sure you support byte-range requests. Yum uses http byte-range > requests to download the header of the rpms directly from the rpms on > the remote site. Most proxies can deal with that but it's just something > to be aware of. Can't yum use "file" style access to get the rpm's? From ibm21 at cam.ac.uk Thu Mar 10 16:44:07 2005 From: ibm21 at cam.ac.uk (Ian Malone) Date: Thu, 10 Mar 2005 16:44:07 +0000 Subject: emacs in FC4 In-Reply-To: <20050310150625.31E0E73CB0@hormel.redhat.com> References: <20050310150625.31E0E73CB0@hormel.redhat.com> Message-ID: <42307957.9040801@cam.ac.uk> (I think this is the right list. If not please direct me to the correct one.) What version of emacs will FC4 ship with? I notice the development packages contain emacs-common-21.3-25 dated 8th Mar and FC3 updates has emacs-common-21.3-21 dated 8th Feb (which is what is on my machine). 21.4 was released 6th Feb. While I haven't used that yet, my emacs from CVS (21.3.50.1 vs 21.3.1 for the current package) contains a fix for bugzilla 113126 (marked upstream) which is not included in emacs-common-21.3-21. It also has nifty gtk menus and other features. So: are there plans to have 21.4 in FC4? And where do I find out this kind of information in future (someone must be writing this kind of thing down)? -- imalone From david at fubar.dk Thu Mar 10 16:45:09 2005 From: david at fubar.dk (David Zeuthen) Date: Thu, 10 Mar 2005 11:45:09 -0500 Subject: hald causing stutters In-Reply-To: <20050310143256.GA30059@devserv.devel.redhat.com> References: <1110418168.8126.5.camel@jellyfish.redfishdemo.com> <20050310143256.GA30059@devserv.devel.redhat.com> Message-ID: <1110473109.3404.51.camel@daxter.boston.redhat.com> On Thu, 2005-03-10 at 09:32 -0500, Alan Cox wrote: > On Thu, Mar 10, 2005 at 11:03:26AM +0000, Richard Hughes wrote: > > Oops. The new acpi check code polls every 5 seconds to support laptops that > > don't give ACPI events. I'm not sure why the poll would cause such a massive > > chunk of CPU. David, perhaps we can make this configurable? > > It traps into the SMM BIOS and what happens then is BIOS dependant. You'll > probably find it also makes your clock go out over time as well. > This should probably be fixed in hal then, no question about it. The problem is that we don't get the ACPI events over the /proc/acpi/event channel so we have to poll (and, I, for one, hate polling as much as the next guy). It's probably worth seeing what the battery applets do; Rodd, what battery applet have you been using where this is not an issue? (before the new hal 0.5.0 package, that is) Thanks, David From nman64 at n-man.com Thu Mar 10 16:44:33 2005 From: nman64 at n-man.com (Patrick Barnes) Date: Thu, 10 Mar 2005 10:44:33 -0600 Subject: Can someone verify: no obsolete of openoffice.org-libs by openoffice.org-core Message-ID: <42307971.1010200@n-man.com> Can anyone verify that openoffice.org-core (rawhide) does not obsolete openoffice.org-libs (FC3) as it should? If this is the case, it is a problem we need to correct to allow yum updates from FC3 to Rawhide. From twaugh at redhat.com Thu Mar 10 16:50:30 2005 From: twaugh at redhat.com (Tim Waugh) Date: Thu, 10 Mar 2005 16:50:30 +0000 Subject: rawhide report: 20050309 changes In-Reply-To: <1110472072.3447.0.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <1110413545.6440.2.camel@tiger> <20050310104843.GC29604@redhat.com> <1110472072.3447.0.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <20050310165030.GJ29604@redhat.com> On Thu, Mar 10, 2005 at 05:27:52PM +0100, Kyrre Ness Sjobak wrote: > Gimp-print?!? Great quality, but *slooow*... > You ain't going to provide some printers with *only* gimp-print? Feel free to have a go at getting omni-xml to work. If we can, then we can ship a form of Omni in a much smaller package. Tim. */ -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: not available URL: From jspaleta at gmail.com Thu Mar 10 16:51:08 2005 From: jspaleta at gmail.com (Jeff Spaleta) Date: Thu, 10 Mar 2005 11:51:08 -0500 Subject: rawhide report: 20050310 changes In-Reply-To: References: <200503101237.j2ACbvWx017272@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> Message-ID: <604aa79105031008516cca4095@mail.gmail.com> On Thu, 10 Mar 2005 17:20:44 +0100, Lars wrote: > guess python-sqlite needs an update. not only that.. but rpm-devel requires sqlite3-devel so rpm needs an update as well for a dep fix. -jef From cra at WPI.EDU Thu Mar 10 17:11:56 2005 From: cra at WPI.EDU (Chuck R. Anderson) Date: Thu, 10 Mar 2005 12:11:56 -0500 Subject: A more efficient up2date service using binary diffs In-Reply-To: <1110472691.3447.2.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <422F17B5.5070402@galway.net> <1110383623.3448.8.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1110383996.31871.28.camel@cutter> <1cef3e95050309082839ba4beb@mail.gmail.com> <1110391094.3448.18.camel@localhost.localdomain> <422F3ACE.7010309@math.unl.edu> <1110421202.8126.12.camel@jellyfish.redfishdemo.com> <1cef3e9505031000145aa96c4a@mail.gmail.com> <1110444945.31871.145.camel@cutter> <1110472691.3447.2.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <20050310171156.GG15009@angus.ind.WPI.EDU> On Thu, Mar 10, 2005 at 05:38:11PM +0100, Kyrre Ness Sjobak wrote: > Can't yum use "file" style access to get the rpm's? yes. From notting at redhat.com Thu Mar 10 17:21:26 2005 From: notting at redhat.com (Bill Nottingham) Date: Thu, 10 Mar 2005 12:21:26 -0500 Subject: rawhide report: 20050310 changes In-Reply-To: <20050310162914.GE30940@ip68-4-98-123.oc.oc.cox.net> References: <200503101237.j2ACbvWx017272@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <20050310162914.GE30940@ip68-4-98-123.oc.oc.cox.net> Message-ID: <20050310172126.GC24517@nostromo.devel.redhat.com> Barry K. Nathan (barryn at pobox.com) said: > On Thu, Mar 10, 2005 at 07:37:57AM -0500, Build System wrote: > [snip...] > > Removed package GFS-kernel > [snip...] > > Is this just a build glitch, or is GFS really being removed? Removed until it's rebuilt to match the kernel; otherwise, it's not very useful. Bill From arjanv at redhat.com Thu Mar 10 17:32:33 2005 From: arjanv at redhat.com (Arjan van de Ven) Date: Thu, 10 Mar 2005 18:32:33 +0100 Subject: rawhide report: 20050310 changes In-Reply-To: <20050310172126.GC24517@nostromo.devel.redhat.com> References: <200503101237.j2ACbvWx017272@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <20050310162914.GE30940@ip68-4-98-123.oc.oc.cox.net> <20050310172126.GC24517@nostromo.devel.redhat.com> Message-ID: <1110475954.6291.118.camel@laptopd505.fenrus.org> On Thu, 2005-03-10 at 12:21 -0500, Bill Nottingham wrote: > Barry K. Nathan (barryn at pobox.com) said: > > On Thu, Mar 10, 2005 at 07:37:57AM -0500, Build System wrote: > > [snip...] > > > Removed package GFS-kernel > > [snip...] > > > > Is this just a build glitch, or is GFS really being removed? > > Removed until it's rebuilt to match the kernel; otherwise, it's > not very useful. can we just stick it inside the kernel rpm instead? that solves the entire issue... -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part URL: From jspaleta at gmail.com Thu Mar 10 17:48:52 2005 From: jspaleta at gmail.com (Jeff Spaleta) Date: Thu, 10 Mar 2005 12:48:52 -0500 Subject: rawhide report: 20050310 changes In-Reply-To: <1110475954.6291.118.camel@laptopd505.fenrus.org> References: <200503101237.j2ACbvWx017272@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <20050310162914.GE30940@ip68-4-98-123.oc.oc.cox.net> <20050310172126.GC24517@nostromo.devel.redhat.com> <1110475954.6291.118.camel@laptopd505.fenrus.org> Message-ID: <604aa7910503100948705e7baf@mail.gmail.com> On Thu, 10 Mar 2005 18:32:33 +0100, Arjan van de Ven wrote: > can we just stick it inside the kernel rpm instead? that solves the > entire issue... >From the perspective of Core.. sure it solves it... everytime Core developers want a specialized kernel module thats not in upstream.. they can choose to deviate and patch it into the kernel. Though every time that happens it weakens the stated Fedora Core objectives statement about doing as much as upstream as possible and opens the door wider for community requests to include even more patches to the fedora kernel. So over time you either cave in to pressure to add popular patches adding maintainership burden... or you inspire community ill-will by ignoring reasonable patch requests on the grounds that core developers don't have the time or resources for the extras functionality patches. But what you have no accomplished is facilitate a way for community to step up and maintain the non-upstream kernel functionality inside the fedora project. >From the perspective of Fedora project in general... this isn't a solution at all...it just pushes the issue outward to the poor packagers who are going to want to include kernel modules in Fedora Extras. This issue of how to best maintain addon kernel modules is not going to go away... and giving Core developers an easy excuse to ignore the technical difficulties isn't going to help come up with consistent solutions to the problems. -jef From kyrre at solution-forge.net Thu Mar 10 18:31:46 2005 From: kyrre at solution-forge.net (Kyrre Ness Sjobak) Date: Thu, 10 Mar 2005 19:31:46 +0100 Subject: A more efficient up2date service using binary diffs In-Reply-To: <20050310171156.GG15009@angus.ind.WPI.EDU> References: <422F17B5.5070402@galway.net> <1110383623.3448.8.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1110383996.31871.28.camel@cutter> <1cef3e95050309082839ba4beb@mail.gmail.com> <1110391094.3448.18.camel@localhost.localdomain> <422F3ACE.7010309@math.unl.edu> <1110421202.8126.12.camel@jellyfish.redfishdemo.com> <1cef3e9505031000145aa96c4a@mail.gmail.com> <1110444945.31871.145.camel@cutter> <1110472691.3447.2.camel@localhost.localdomain> <20050310171156.GG15009@angus.ind.WPI.EDU> Message-ID: <1110479506.3447.6.camel@localhost.localdomain> tor, 10.03.2005 kl. 18.11 skrev Chuck R. Anderson: > On Thu, Mar 10, 2005 at 05:38:11PM +0100, Kyrre Ness Sjobak wrote: > > Can't yum use "file" style access to get the rpm's? > > yes. Then what are the proxy needed for? Just make a folder with the necessary repodata and "compiled" (ie. with diffs applied) rpm's, and tell yum to use that? From jdesbonnet at gmail.com Thu Mar 10 18:59:51 2005 From: jdesbonnet at gmail.com (Joe Desbonnet) Date: Thu, 10 Mar 2005 18:59:51 +0000 Subject: A more efficient up2date service using binary diffs In-Reply-To: <1110479506.3447.6.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <422F17B5.5070402@galway.net> <1cef3e95050309082839ba4beb@mail.gmail.com> <1110391094.3448.18.camel@localhost.localdomain> <422F3ACE.7010309@math.unl.edu> <1110421202.8126.12.camel@jellyfish.redfishdemo.com> <1cef3e9505031000145aa96c4a@mail.gmail.com> <1110444945.31871.145.camel@cutter> <1110472691.3447.2.camel@localhost.localdomain> <20050310171156.GG15009@angus.ind.WPI.EDU> <1110479506.3447.6.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <1cef3e9505031010591c8c7591@mail.gmail.com> That would be one way of doing it. But I was hoping for a solution that would allow the nice(ish) GUI up2date system to be used transparently. If it works out I suspect I'll have command line tools + the proxy option. BTW: is there any decent documentation on up2date (ie the system, not the program) Joe. On Thu, 10 Mar 2005 19:31:46 +0100, Kyrre Ness Sjobak wrote: > tor, 10.03.2005 kl. 18.11 skrev Chuck R. Anderson: > > Then what are the proxy needed for? Just make a folder with the > necessary repodata and "compiled" (ie. with diffs applied) rpm's, and > tell yum to use that? From riel at redhat.com Thu Mar 10 19:05:33 2005 From: riel at redhat.com (Rik van Riel) Date: Thu, 10 Mar 2005 14:05:33 -0500 (EST) Subject: rawhide report: 20050310 changes In-Reply-To: <604aa7910503100948705e7baf@mail.gmail.com> References: <200503101237.j2ACbvWx017272@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <20050310162914.GE30940@ip68-4-98-123.oc.oc.cox.net> <20050310172126.GC24517@nostromo.devel.redhat.com> <1110475954.6291.118.camel@laptopd505.fenrus.org> <604aa7910503100948705e7baf@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On Thu, 10 Mar 2005, Jeff Spaleta wrote: > From the perspective of Fedora project in general... this isn't a > solution at all... This issue of how to best maintain addon kernel > modules is not going to go away... and giving Core developers an easy > excuse to ignore the technical difficulties isn't going to help come up > with consistent solutions to the problems. Agreed, we want a better solution for building external kernel modules. There are dozens of GPL drivers out there that would be good candidates for extras, and our own GFS module. While I don't have time myself to do everything for such an infrastructure, I'd be more than happy to help out and get such infrastructure ready to merge. I'd imagine that Chris might be interested, too ;) -- "Debugging is twice as hard as writing the code in the first place. Therefore, if you write the code as cleverly as possible, you are, by definition, not smart enough to debug it." - Brian W. Kernighan From rahulsundaram at yahoo.co.in Thu Mar 10 19:08:10 2005 From: rahulsundaram at yahoo.co.in (Rahul Sundaram) Date: Thu, 10 Mar 2005 11:08:10 -0800 (PST) Subject: rawhide report: 20050310 changes In-Reply-To: 6667 Message-ID: <20050310190810.17249.qmail@web8510.mail.in.yahoo.com> Hi There are dozens of GPL drivers out > there > that would be good candidates for extras, and our > own GFS > module. > is there any plans to merge GFS upstream? Regards Rahul Sundaram __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Small Business - Try our new resources site! http://smallbusiness.yahoo.com/resources/ From cfeist at redhat.com Thu Mar 10 19:15:06 2005 From: cfeist at redhat.com (Chris Feist) Date: Thu, 10 Mar 2005 13:15:06 -0600 Subject: rawhide report: 20050310 changes In-Reply-To: References: <200503101237.j2ACbvWx017272@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <20050310162914.GE30940@ip68-4-98-123.oc.oc.cox.net> <20050310172126.GC24517@nostromo.devel.redhat.com> <1110475954.6291.118.camel@laptopd505.fenrus.org> <604aa7910503100948705e7baf@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <42309CBA.6060708@redhat.com> Rik van Riel wrote: > On Thu, 10 Mar 2005, Jeff Spaleta wrote: > > Agreed, we want a better solution for building external > kernel modules. There are dozens of GPL drivers out there > that would be good candidates for extras, and our own GFS > module. > > While I don't have time myself to do everything for such > an infrastructure, I'd be more than happy to help out and > get such infrastructure ready to merge. I'd imagine that > Chris might be interested, too ;) > Yes I would definately be interested in this... :-) Another note, we've pulled out the GFS-kernel packages for now because we would like to get them in the FC4 RH Kernel which would make kernel matching issues go away. Thanks, Chris From cfeist at redhat.com Thu Mar 10 19:19:55 2005 From: cfeist at redhat.com (Chris Feist) Date: Thu, 10 Mar 2005 13:19:55 -0600 Subject: rawhide report: 20050310 changes In-Reply-To: <20050310190810.17249.qmail@web8510.mail.in.yahoo.com> References: <20050310190810.17249.qmail@web8510.mail.in.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <42309DDB.8060900@redhat.com> Rahul Sundaram wrote: > is there any plans to merge GFS upstream? No short term plans, but eventually we'd like to merge it upstream. From kyrre at solution-forge.net Thu Mar 10 19:30:10 2005 From: kyrre at solution-forge.net (Kyrre Ness Sjobak) Date: Thu, 10 Mar 2005 20:30:10 +0100 Subject: A more efficient up2date service using binary diffs In-Reply-To: <1cef3e9505031010591c8c7591@mail.gmail.com> References: <422F17B5.5070402@galway.net> <1cef3e95050309082839ba4beb@mail.gmail.com> <1110391094.3448.18.camel@localhost.localdomain> <422F3ACE.7010309@math.unl.edu> <1110421202.8126.12.camel@jellyfish.redfishdemo.com> <1cef3e9505031000145aa96c4a@mail.gmail.com> <1110444945.31871.145.camel@cutter> <1110472691.3447.2.camel@localhost.localdomain> <20050310171156.GG15009@angus.ind.WPI.EDU> <1110479506.3447.6.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1cef3e9505031010591c8c7591@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1110483010.3447.10.camel@localhost.localdomain> But... Aren't up2date on its way out, while "yum" is The New Way? With Pup in fc4, there should also be a nice'ish gui frontend to yum that does everything up2date (the gui end of it), better? tor, 10.03.2005 kl. 19.59 skrev Joe Desbonnet: > That would be one way of doing it. But I was hoping for a solution > that would allow the nice(ish) GUI up2date system to be used > transparently. If it works out I suspect I'll have command line tools > + the proxy option. > > BTW: is there any decent documentation on up2date (ie the system, not > the program) > > Joe. > > > > On Thu, 10 Mar 2005 19:31:46 +0100, Kyrre Ness Sjobak > wrote: > > tor, 10.03.2005 kl. 18.11 skrev Chuck R. Anderson: > > > > Then what are the proxy needed for? Just make a folder with the > > necessary repodata and "compiled" (ie. with diffs applied) rpm's, and > > tell yum to use that? From skvidal at phy.duke.edu Thu Mar 10 19:31:35 2005 From: skvidal at phy.duke.edu (seth vidal) Date: Thu, 10 Mar 2005 14:31:35 -0500 Subject: A more efficient up2date service using binary diffs In-Reply-To: <1110483010.3447.10.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <422F17B5.5070402@galway.net> <1cef3e95050309082839ba4beb@mail.gmail.com> <1110391094.3448.18.camel@localhost.localdomain> <422F3ACE.7010309@math.unl.edu> <1110421202.8126.12.camel@jellyfish.redfishdemo.com> <1cef3e9505031000145aa96c4a@mail.gmail.com> <1110444945.31871.145.camel@cutter> <1110472691.3447.2.camel@localhost.localdomain> <20050310171156.GG15009@angus.ind.WPI.EDU> <1110479506.3447.6.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1cef3e9505031010591c8c7591@mail.gmail.com> <1110483010.3447.10.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <1110483095.19164.19.camel@opus.phy.duke.edu> On Thu, 2005-03-10 at 20:30 +0100, Kyrre Ness Sjobak wrote: > But... Aren't up2date on its way out, while "yum" is The New Way? With > Pup in fc4, there should also be a nice'ish gui frontend to yum that > does everything up2date (the gui end of it), better? > That's probably up to rh's internal processes. I think making things work with up2date and yum makes sense b/c it doesn't tie you down to one way of doing things. -sv From kyrre at solution-forge.net Thu Mar 10 19:32:20 2005 From: kyrre at solution-forge.net (Kyrre Ness Sjobak) Date: Thu, 10 Mar 2005 20:32:20 +0100 Subject: hald causing stutters In-Reply-To: <1110418168.8126.5.camel@jellyfish.redfishdemo.com> References: <1110418168.8126.5.camel@jellyfish.redfishdemo.com> Message-ID: <1110483139.3447.12.camel@localhost.localdomain> tor, 10.03.2005 kl. 02.29 skrev Rodd Clarkson: > Since updating last night, I've notice that my system is stuttering. > The UI will pause for a moment and then go along and then pause, and > then go along and well you get what I mean by stuttering. > > Watching my CPU use, I get a spike every 5 seconds (a cheap one thousand > and one, two thousand and two quess). > > Looking at top, I see hald taking a good chunk of CPU about the same > time as the spike occurs. > > This is really quite annoying. It's essentially a pause in your UI > every 5 seconds or so, including music that's playing and the likes. > > Is anyone else seeing this (and hopefully addressing it)? And does > someone have a stop gap for it until it's resolved? > > "Stutters" is what i have sometimes seen NetworkManager produce - very visible when playing a DVD... From kyrre at solution-forge.net Thu Mar 10 19:34:01 2005 From: kyrre at solution-forge.net (Kyrre Ness Sjobak) Date: Thu, 10 Mar 2005 20:34:01 +0100 Subject: A more efficient up2date service using binary diffs In-Reply-To: <1110483095.19164.19.camel@opus.phy.duke.edu> References: <422F17B5.5070402@galway.net> <1cef3e95050309082839ba4beb@mail.gmail.com> <1110391094.3448.18.camel@localhost.localdomain> <422F3ACE.7010309@math.unl.edu> <1110421202.8126.12.camel@jellyfish.redfishdemo.com> <1cef3e9505031000145aa96c4a@mail.gmail.com> <1110444945.31871.145.camel@cutter> <1110472691.3447.2.camel@localhost.localdomain> <20050310171156.GG15009@angus.ind.WPI.EDU> <1110479506.3447.6.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1cef3e9505031010591c8c7591@mail.gmail.com> <1110483010.3447.10.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1110483095.19164.19.camel@opus.phy.duke.edu> Message-ID: <1110483241.3447.15.camel@localhost.localdomain> tor, 10.03.2005 kl. 20.31 skrev seth vidal: > On Thu, 2005-03-10 at 20:30 +0100, Kyrre Ness Sjobak wrote: > > But... Aren't up2date on its way out, while "yum" is The New Way? With > > Pup in fc4, there should also be a nice'ish gui frontend to yum that > > does everything up2date (the gui end of it), better? > > > > That's probably up to rh's internal processes. I think making things > work with up2date and yum makes sense b/c it doesn't tie you down to one > way of doing things. > Yes. But standards are a great thing, and yum is good, on its way to greatness. All it really needs (imo...) is a good gui and some speedup. Thank you for bringing yum to Fedora! :) Kyrre Ness Sj?b?k From skvidal at phy.duke.edu Thu Mar 10 19:45:55 2005 From: skvidal at phy.duke.edu (seth vidal) Date: Thu, 10 Mar 2005 14:45:55 -0500 Subject: A more efficient up2date service using binary diffs In-Reply-To: <1110483241.3447.15.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <422F17B5.5070402@galway.net> <1cef3e95050309082839ba4beb@mail.gmail.com> <1110391094.3448.18.camel@localhost.localdomain> <422F3ACE.7010309@math.unl.edu> <1110421202.8126.12.camel@jellyfish.redfishdemo.com> <1cef3e9505031000145aa96c4a@mail.gmail.com> <1110444945.31871.145.camel@cutter> <1110472691.3447.2.camel@localhost.localdomain> <20050310171156.GG15009@angus.ind.WPI.EDU> <1110479506.3447.6.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1cef3e9505031010591c8c7591@mail.gmail.com> <1110483010.3447.10.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1110483095.19164.19.camel@opus.phy.duke.edu> <1110483241.3447.15.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <1110483955.19164.26.camel@opus.phy.duke.edu> > Yes. But standards are a great thing, and yum is good, on its way to > greatness. All it really needs (imo...) is a good gui and some speedup. speedup? Have you tried yum from rawhide? the sqlite backend makes things REALLY light memory-wise and once you do the first cache of the metadata the run time speed is fantastic. -sv From m.a.young at durham.ac.uk Thu Mar 10 20:09:01 2005 From: m.a.young at durham.ac.uk (M A Young) Date: Thu, 10 Mar 2005 20:09:01 +0000 (GMT) Subject: A more efficient up2date service using binary diffs In-Reply-To: <1110450389.4032.2.camel@anu.eridu> References: <422F17B5.5070402@galway.net> <1110383623.3448.8.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1110383996.31871.28.camel@cutter> <1cef3e95050309082839ba4beb@mail.gmail.com> <1110391094.3448.18.camel@localhost.localdomain> <422F3ACE.7010309@math.unl.edu> <1110393130.3448.32.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1cef3e95050309110335197fd9@mail.gmail.com> <604aa7910503091130609b492c@mail.gmail.com> <20050309222930.GE15009@angus.ind.WPI.EDU> <1110450389.4032.2.camel@anu.eridu> Message-ID: On Thu, 10 Mar 2005, Paul Nasrat wrote: > On Wed, 2005-03-09 at 17:29 -0500, Chuck R. Anderson wrote: > > No, you only need to start compressing with the rsync zlib patch, > > which makes zlib compression rsync-friendly. > > https://svn.uhulinux.hu/packages/dev/zlib/patches/02-rsync.patch > > rpm's internal zlib has this, not sure if it's in rawhide zlib though. That is very interesting - I hadn't seen it before, though I would imagine the rpms have to be a bit bigger and the bandwidth increases over the minimum possible. I don't think the option is being used on current rpms. Michael Young From rodd at clarkson.id.au Thu Mar 10 20:30:52 2005 From: rodd at clarkson.id.au (Rodd Clarkson) Date: Fri, 11 Mar 2005 07:30:52 +1100 Subject: hald causing stutters In-Reply-To: <1110473109.3404.51.camel@daxter.boston.redhat.com> References: <1110418168.8126.5.camel@jellyfish.redfishdemo.com> <20050310143256.GA30059@devserv.devel.redhat.com> <1110473109.3404.51.camel@daxter.boston.redhat.com> Message-ID: <1110486653.4839.5.camel@goose> On Thu, 2005-03-10 at 11:45 -0500, David Zeuthen wrote: > This should probably be fixed in hal then, no question about it. That would be nice ;-] > The > problem is that we don't get the ACPI events over the /proc/acpi/event > channel so we have to poll (and, I, for one, hate polling as much as the > next guy). > > It's probably worth seeing what the battery applets do; Rodd, what > battery applet have you been using where this is not an issue? (before > the new hal 0.5.0 package, that is) I'm using the gnome battery applet included in gnome. I've been using this pre-0.5.0 and it wasn't giving me anything like this grief. (/me thinks back and realizes that something had been blipping on his CPU monitor about every five seconds but the blips had been miniscule and hadn't affect performance (for me at least)) Rodd From david at fubar.dk Thu Mar 10 20:42:49 2005 From: david at fubar.dk (David Zeuthen) Date: Thu, 10 Mar 2005 15:42:49 -0500 Subject: hald causing stutters In-Reply-To: <1110486653.4839.5.camel@goose> References: <1110418168.8126.5.camel@jellyfish.redfishdemo.com> <20050310143256.GA30059@devserv.devel.redhat.com> <1110473109.3404.51.camel@daxter.boston.redhat.com> <1110486653.4839.5.camel@goose> Message-ID: <1110487370.3404.73.camel@daxter.boston.redhat.com> On Fri, 2005-03-11 at 07:30 +1100, Rodd Clarkson wrote: > I'm using the gnome battery applet included in gnome. I've been using > this pre-0.5.0 and it wasn't giving me anything like this grief. So, it turns out that this applet poll every thirty seconds. I'm currently running a new hal package through the build system that polls every thirty seconds (instead of every five) and only reads files from /proc/acpi once on every poll (instead of four times). This should address these issues, at least in terms of not sucking anymore that the bespoke applet. David From camilo at mesias.co.uk Thu Mar 10 20:42:38 2005 From: camilo at mesias.co.uk (Cam) Date: Thu, 10 Mar 2005 20:42:38 +0000 Subject: Release Notes Suggestion In-Reply-To: <1110469479.4032.31.camel@anu.eridu> References: <1110466912.3045.6.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> <20050310160636.A19606@ryoko.camperquake.de> <423063F3.10706@mesias.co.uk> <1110469479.4032.31.camel@anu.eridu> Message-ID: <4230B13E.3050403@mesias.co.uk> Paul > Bug reports would have been useful - most things are configurable in the > driver so if you just want tap we could do that. I did some more investigation into the erratic behaviour and was amazed. If you drag up and down along the right-hand edge of the pad, you get events for mouse buttons 4 and 5 (aka the scroll wheel). If you drag left and right along the right-hand edge of the pad, you get events for mouse buttons 6 and 7. I had no idea what these were mapped to, but they sometimes act like a horizontal scroll wheel. In Mozilla they do next and previous in the page history. If you tap the pad once you get a single mouse click. If you do a double-tap you get a click-and-drag. If you tap with one finger you get mouse button 1 clicks or drags If you tap with two fingers you get mouse button 2 clicks / drags If you tap with three fingers you get mouse button 3 clicks / drags I dont remember seeing any documentation about these features anywhere - not even in the literature that came with the laptop. > I should look at a config tool for it I guess. That sounds useful :) -Cam From richard at hughsie.com Thu Mar 10 22:10:40 2005 From: richard at hughsie.com (Richard Hughes) Date: Thu, 10 Mar 2005 22:10:40 +0000 Subject: rawhide report: 20050310 changes In-Reply-To: <200503101237.j2ACbvWx017272@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> References: <200503101237.j2ACbvWx017272@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> Message-ID: <1110492640.5141.5.camel@localhost.localdomain> On Thu, 2005-03-10 at 07:37 -0500, Build System wrote: > gdm-1:2.6.0.7-4 > --------------- > * Wed Mar 09 2005 Than Ngo 1:2.6.0.7-4 > - add OnlyShowIn=GNOME; > > * Mon Feb 28 2005 Ray Strode 1:2.6.0.7-3 > - seteuid/egid as user before testing for presence of > user's home directory (fixes bug 149899) Killed my system. Did my daily update to rawhide, and on next boot, my 2.2GHz starts acting like a 166MHz. Logging on on tty1 as root (which took a few minutes..), top showed gdm-binary taking 100% CPU. On a hunch, I killed syslogd, which returned my system to it's normal behaviour. Looking at /var/log/messages: Mar 10 21:52:17 hughsie gdm[4331]: Can't set EGID to user GID Mar 10 21:52:47 hughsie last message repeated 47940 times Mar 10 21:53:41 hughsie last message repeated 84935 times Mar 10 21:53:41 hughsie exiting on signal 15 Went back to gdm-2.6.0.5-6 and all is okay. Plus, yum is busted: [root at hughsie hughsie]# yum update Setting up Update Process Setting up Repos development 100% |=========================| 1.1 kB extras 100% |=========================| 951 B Reading repository metadata in from local files Traceback (most recent call last): File "/usr/bin/yum", line 15, in ? yummain.main(sys.argv[1:]) File "/usr/share/yum-cli/yummain.py", line 72, in main result, resultmsgs = do() File "/usr/share/yum-cli/cli.py", line 462, in doCommands return self.updatePkgs() File "/usr/share/yum-cli/cli.py", line 960, in updatePkgs self.doUpdateSetup() File "__init__.py", line 228, in doUpdateSetup File "sqlitesack.py", line 225, in returnObsoletes File "/usr/src/build/515186-i386/install//usr/lib/python2.4/site-packages/sqlite/main.py", line 104, in __getitem__ KeyError: 'PACKAGES.PKGID' Bleeding edge bites :-) Richard Hughes From mike at netlyncs.com Tue Mar 8 22:45:03 2005 From: mike at netlyncs.com (Mike Chambers) Date: Tue, 08 Mar 2005 16:45:03 -0600 Subject: vte for FC3/FC4 testing In-Reply-To: <422D8006.6000806@togami.com> References: <422D8006.6000806@togami.com> Message-ID: <1110321904.2824.0.camel@scrappy.netlyncs.com> On Tue, 2005-03-08 at 00:35 -1000, Warren Togami wrote: > Seeing that nobody at RH changed vte since November 2004, I went ahead > and made this test package. Since changes to vte are usually quite > sensitive I am testing it out-of-tree first. If you are annoyed by the > glacial slowness of FC3 gnome-terminal, try the below packages. > > http://people.redhat.com/wtogami/temp/vte-FC3/ > http://people.redhat.com/wtogami/temp/vte-FC4/ Ok, this is a very stupid question, but *how* do you start this terminal to get it running? For the life of me I can't seem to find the command (scratches head and feels ashamed)! -- Mike Chambers Madisonville, KY "It's always better to hurt a little now, than to hurt a lot later!" From brugolsky at telemetry-investments.com Thu Mar 10 23:25:52 2005 From: brugolsky at telemetry-investments.com (Bill Rugolsky Jr.) Date: Thu, 10 Mar 2005 18:25:52 -0500 Subject: rawhide report: 20050310 changes In-Reply-To: <42309CBA.6060708@redhat.com> References: <200503101237.j2ACbvWx017272@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <20050310162914.GE30940@ip68-4-98-123.oc.oc.cox.net> <20050310172126.GC24517@nostromo.devel.redhat.com> <1110475954.6291.118.camel@laptopd505.fenrus.org> <604aa7910503100948705e7baf@mail.gmail.com> <42309CBA.6060708@redhat.com> Message-ID: <20050310232552.GA27026@ti64.telemetry-investments.com> On Thu, Mar 10, 2005 at 01:15:06PM -0600, Chris Feist wrote: > Rik van Riel wrote: > >While I don't have time myself to do everything for such > >an infrastructure, I'd be more than happy to help out and > >get such infrastructure ready to merge. I'd imagine that > >Chris might be interested, too ;) > > > > Yes I would definately be interested in this... :-) Is there some obvious reason why DKMS, http://linux.dell.com/projects.shtml#dkms is an _unacceptable_ starting point? Bill Rugolsky From notting at redhat.com Thu Mar 10 23:25:25 2005 From: notting at redhat.com (Bill Nottingham) Date: Thu, 10 Mar 2005 18:25:25 -0500 Subject: rawhide report: 20050310 changes In-Reply-To: <1110492640.5141.5.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <200503101237.j2ACbvWx017272@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <1110492640.5141.5.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <20050310232525.GA10053@nostromo.devel.redhat.com> Richard Hughes (richard at hughsie.com) said: > Killed my system. Did my daily update to rawhide, and on next boot, my > 2.2GHz starts acting like a 166MHz. https://bugzilla.redhat.com/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=150745 Bill From thacker at math.cornell.edu Thu Mar 10 23:43:10 2005 From: thacker at math.cornell.edu (John Thacker) Date: Thu, 10 Mar 2005 18:43:10 -0500 Subject: vte for FC3/FC4 testing In-Reply-To: <1110321904.2824.0.camel@scrappy.netlyncs.com> References: <422D8006.6000806@togami.com> <1110321904.2824.0.camel@scrappy.netlyncs.com> Message-ID: <20050310234310.GA31505@thacker.dyndns.org> On Tue, Mar 08, 2005 at 04:45:03PM -0600, Mike Chambers wrote: > On Tue, 2005-03-08 at 00:35 -1000, Warren Togami wrote: > > Seeing that nobody at RH changed vte since November 2004, I went ahead > > and made this test package. Since changes to vte are usually quite > > sensitive I am testing it out-of-tree first. If you are annoyed by the > > glacial slowness of FC3 gnome-terminal, try the below packages. > > > > http://people.redhat.com/wtogami/temp/vte-FC3/ > > http://people.redhat.com/wtogami/temp/vte-FC4/ > > Ok, this is a very stupid question, but *how* do you start this terminal > to get it running? For the life of me I can't seem to find the command > (scratches head and feels ashamed)! Not that stupid. Vte is a virtual terminal emulator widget used by gnome-terminal. In other words, updating vte affects the terminal properties of gnome-terminal, so just restart gnome-terminal. John Thacker -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: not available URL: From caillon at redhat.com Thu Mar 10 23:47:19 2005 From: caillon at redhat.com (Christopher Aillon) Date: Thu, 10 Mar 2005 18:47:19 -0500 Subject: vte for FC3/FC4 testing In-Reply-To: <1110321904.2824.0.camel@scrappy.netlyncs.com> References: <422D8006.6000806@togami.com> <1110321904.2824.0.camel@scrappy.netlyncs.com> Message-ID: <4230DC87.8040603@redhat.com> Mike Chambers wrote: > On Tue, 2005-03-08 at 00:35 -1000, Warren Togami wrote: > >>Seeing that nobody at RH changed vte since November 2004, I went ahead >>and made this test package. Since changes to vte are usually quite >>sensitive I am testing it out-of-tree first. If you are annoyed by the >>glacial slowness of FC3 gnome-terminal, try the below packages. >> >>http://people.redhat.com/wtogami/temp/vte-FC3/ >>http://people.redhat.com/wtogami/temp/vte-FC4/ > > > Ok, this is a very stupid question, but *how* do you start this terminal > to get it running? For the life of me I can't seem to find the command > (scratches head and feels ashamed)! `gnome-terminal` Or, Right click on Desktop > New Terminal (assuming you haven't changed your default terminal) From n3npq at nc.rr.com Fri Mar 11 01:23:30 2005 From: n3npq at nc.rr.com (Jeff Johnson) Date: Thu, 10 Mar 2005 20:23:30 -0500 Subject: A more efficient up2date service using binary diffs In-Reply-To: References: <422F17B5.5070402@galway.net> <1110383623.3448.8.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1110383996.31871.28.camel@cutter> <1cef3e95050309082839ba4beb@mail.gmail.com> <1110391094.3448.18.camel@localhost.localdomain> <422F3ACE.7010309@math.unl.edu> <1110393130.3448.32.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1cef3e95050309110335197fd9@mail.gmail.com> <604aa7910503091130609b492c@mail.gmail.com> <20050309222930.GE15009@angus.ind.WPI.EDU> <1110450389.4032.2.camel@anu.eridu> Message-ID: <4230F312.8040105@nc.rr.com> M A Young wrote: >On Thu, 10 Mar 2005, Paul Nasrat wrote: > > > >>On Wed, 2005-03-09 at 17:29 -0500, Chuck R. Anderson wrote: >> >> >>>No, you only need to start compressing with the rsync zlib patch, >>>which makes zlib compression rsync-friendly. >>> >>> >>https://svn.uhulinux.hu/packages/dev/zlib/patches/02-rsync.patch >> >>rpm's internal zlib has this, not sure if it's in rawhide zlib though. >> >> > >That is very interesting - I hadn't seen it before, though I would imagine >the rpms have to be a bit bigger and the bandwidth increases over the >minimum possible. I don't think the option is being used on current rpms. > You would be wrong. 73 de Jeff From Curtis at GreenKey.net Fri Mar 11 00:30:10 2005 From: Curtis at GreenKey.net (Curtis Doty) Date: Thu, 10 Mar 2005 16:30:10 -0800 Subject: ethereal rpm tweaks In-Reply-To: <1110368591.23127.8.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <200503081942.j28JgJu12103@alopias.GreenKey.net> <1110368591.23127.8.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <4230E692.7030301@GreenKey.net> Radek Vok?l wrote: >On Tue, 2005-03-08 at 11:42 -0800, Curtis Doty wrote: > > >>Proposed: >>Compiled with GLib 2.4.8, with libpcap 0.8.3, with libz 1.2.1.2, >>without libpcre, with Net-SNMP 5.1.2, with ADNS. >> >> > >Ok, from your tweaks only -with-ssl survives. I can't link ethereal with >package from extras - adns. > > Understood. Which is sorta why I brought it up. Maybe we should revisit the discussion to move ethereal out of core and into extras or wherever? Of course it has the prior mentioned security ramifications. Drinking from a firehose is always exhilarating. And in my case, I'd prefer a current and fully loaded set of functionality in extras rather than a crippled subset in core. ../C From petersen at redhat.com Fri Mar 11 01:13:55 2005 From: petersen at redhat.com (Jens Petersen) Date: Fri, 11 Mar 2005 10:13:55 +0900 Subject: emacs in FC4 In-Reply-To: <42307957.9040801@cam.ac.uk> References: <20050310150625.31E0E73CB0@hormel.redhat.com> <42307957.9040801@cam.ac.uk> Message-ID: <4230F0D3.2030403@redhat.com> Ian Malone wrote: > 21.4 was released 6th Feb. While I haven't used that yet, my emacs > from CVS (21.3.50.1 vs 21.3.1 for the current package) contains a fix > for bugzilla 113126 (marked upstream) which is not included in > emacs-common-21.3-21. It also has nifty gtk menus and other features. Thanks for bringing this up. Well 21.4 was a quiet security fix minor release for the movemail format string vulnerability (also fixed in emacs-21.3-21). > While I haven't used that yet, my emacs > from CVS (21.3.50.1 vs 21.3.1 for the current package) contains a fix > for bugzilla 113126 (marked upstream) which is not included in > emacs-common-21.3-21. It also has nifty gtk menus and other features. It seems the next major release will now be numbered 22.1 but we'll have to wait a little longer yet for that I guess. > So: are there plans to have 21.4 in FC4? Good question: since there seems to be quite a bit of confusion around the version numbering of the next major release, I wonder if it isn't better to just keep emacs at 21.3 for fc4 unless the major release should be ready in time... In addition the documentation in 21.4 still refers to 21.3. Jens From rees at ddcom.co.jp Fri Mar 11 01:46:03 2005 From: rees at ddcom.co.jp (Joel) Date: Fri, 11 Mar 2005 10:46:03 +0900 Subject: [NNOT] Re: dns poisoning? In-Reply-To: <1110443628.16182.35.camel@speedy.iagorubio.net> References: <20050310105008.9458.REES@ddcom.co.jp> <1110443628.16182.35.camel@speedy.iagorubio.net> Message-ID: <20050311101958.B60F.REES@ddcom.co.jp> On Thu, 10 Mar 2005 09:33:48 +0100 Iago Rubio wrote > On Thu, 2005-03-10 at 11:08 +0900, Joel wrote: > > Sorry for the cross-post. > > It's off topic here. Really? You don't want to talk about it on the developers' list if someone might be attempting to subvert developers' resources to mount an indirect attack on redhat's servers? > It's the fedora development list, not the redhat > support list. > > It even could be off topic for the redhat support crew, and you should > contact your ISP reporting possible attacks on their DNS servers. That's one place to contact, but the techniques talked about over last weekend included using virii, spyware, etc., being used to compromise _local_ dns caches. > Only if you know the redhat DNSs have been taken down - hijacked - you > should contact redhat - not the fedora's development list. Two reasons for posting this to the two lists I did, one is that I felt it warranted a general heads-up, the other is that I _personally_ wanted to get a bead on the range of the attack. Since nobody else is responding, I'm suspecting I need to dig into this stupid MSWxxx box's registry and look around. Nonetheless, the heads-up is not particularly off-topic. I'm not the only one who posts to this list from an MSWxxx box for the convenience of the company. > > I just tried to access bugzilla.redhat.com on a MSWxp box (Firefox) and > > got a certificate dialog. (You know, "This certificate does not appear > > to be valid. Etc." which is really poor wording, anyway.) > > There are more words in the firefox certificate dialog. > > > I panicked and cancelled (good) > > Bad, no need for panic, and you lost what had happened. On this list I assumed that would go without saying. But it is probably worth emphasizing that panicking is always bad, and getting information should always take priority. > Even while > anyone was able to drive a man-in-the-middle attack, I'll not eat your > box just for reading the certificate or going to the spoofed page. > > To "panic and unplug" is one of the worst things you can do when an > attack is in place. You will get clueless about what had happen. > > > without looking at the certificate first > > (bad). > > Agree. > > > Shut down Firefox. Went to my FC box and tried from there. Access > > completed as it has in the past, redirecting me successfully to https > > without any certificate dialog. So I tried again from the MSWxp box and > > this time there was no certificate dialog. It connected me via ssl the > > way it usually does. > > > > There was a lot of news yesterday about dns poisoning. > > If both boxes used the same DNS server, both boxes should have been > fooled. ... assuming the poison was not put in the MSWindows box's own cache by some malware, which was one of the techniques mentioned last weekend. > Frankly, I don't see a reason for anyone to spend the effort of driving > a man-in-the-middle attack on bugzilla. > > To harvest a bugzilla password ? Sounds weird, uh ? Hey, since the reputation of Linux is now under attack, I'm not going to assume anything is too weird to try. Besides, indirect attacks are known to be at least as likely to find open doors as direct attacks. > > Anyone else seen something like this? > > Unfortunately you don't know what had happened so it's quite difficult > to say if anyone seen ... what ? And I'm still kicking myself for that. I'm _not_ looking forward to taking a long hike through an MSWindows box's registry, particularly when the boss is likely to insist that I not do it on company time. May be cheaper in the boss's pov to just back out my data and re-install. (Do I really need to be verbose about that, too?) > I'll be better for the next time to try to pick all information you can > to identify the problem. Which is why I figured the heads-up was important. If someone else sees this, hopefully they will remember to look at the cert before they cancel. -- Joel Rees digitcom, inc. ???????? Kobe, Japan +81-78-672-8800 ** ** From riel at redhat.com Fri Mar 11 02:25:25 2005 From: riel at redhat.com (Rik van Riel) Date: Thu, 10 Mar 2005 21:25:25 -0500 (EST) Subject: rawhide report: 20050310 changes In-Reply-To: <20050310232552.GA27026@ti64.telemetry-investments.com> References: <200503101237.j2ACbvWx017272@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <20050310162914.GE30940@ip68-4-98-123.oc.oc.cox.net> <20050310172126.GC24517@nostromo.devel.redhat.com> <1110475954.6291.118.camel@laptopd505.fenrus.org> <604aa7910503100948705e7baf@mail.gmail.com> <42309CBA.6060708@redhat.com> <20050310232552.GA27026@ti64.telemetry-investments.com> Message-ID: On Thu, 10 Mar 2005, Bill Rugolsky Jr. wrote: > Is there some obvious reason why DKMS, > > http://linux.dell.com/projects.shtml#dkms > > is an _unacceptable_ starting point? Well, people are looking at a system to build precompiled driver packages, for GFS in Fedora Core and some other drivers in Fedora Extras. I suspect DKMS would be a suitable starting point, but I haven't looked into the details enough to know for sure. -- "Debugging is twice as hard as writing the code in the first place. Therefore, if you write the code as cleverly as possible, you are, by definition, not smart enough to debug it." - Brian W. Kernighan From ivg2 at cornell.edu Fri Mar 11 06:06:03 2005 From: ivg2 at cornell.edu (Ivan Gyurdiev) Date: Fri, 11 Mar 2005 01:06:03 -0500 Subject: /usr/include/limits.h nested too deeply (gnome-vfs builds without fam support) Message-ID: <1110521163.23916.7.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> Hi, I would like to know what the proper bugzilla component is for this bug: gnome-vfs2, gamin, autoconf, gcc, or glibc-headers. Gnome-vfs2 CVS builds without Fam support on my machine, and I believe is built without Fam support in Fedora as well. The fam check fails: configure:36924: checking fam.h usability configure:36936: gcc -c -g -O2 conftest.c >&5 In file included from /usr/include/limits.h:124, from /usr/include/limits.h:124, from /usr/include/limits.h:124, from /usr/include/limits.h:124, from /usr/include/limits.h:124, from /usr/include/limits.h:124, from /usr/include/limits.h:124, from /usr/include/limits.h:124, .... from /usr/include/fam.h:34, from conftest.c:177: /usr/include/limits.h:124:26: error: #include nested too deeply /usr/include/limits.h:144:30: error: #include nested too deeply /usr/include/limits.h:148:30: error: #include nested too deeply /usr/include/limits.h:152:29: error: #include nested too deeply ... In file included from /usr/include/limits.h:144, from /usr/include/limits.h:124, ... /usr/include/bits/posix1_lim.h:153:28: error: #include nested too deeply ... In file included from /usr/include/limits.h:152, from /usr/include/limits.h:124, ... /usr/include/bits/xopen_lim.h:34:28: error: #include nested too deeply -- Ivan Gyurdiev Cornell University From linux00 at kornet.net Fri Mar 11 07:36:14 2005 From: linux00 at kornet.net (sangu) Date: Fri, 11 Mar 2005 16:36:14 +0900 Subject: /usr/include/limits.h nested too deeply (gnome-vfs builds without fam support) In-Reply-To: <1110520898194450.0.ppp10@ppp10> References: <1110520898194450.0.ppp10@ppp10> Message-ID: <1110526575.3507.2.camel@sangu.sangu.net> https://bugzilla.redhat.com/beta/show_bug.cgi?id=150169#c9 2005-03-11 (?), 01:06 -0500, Ivan Gyurdiev ???: > Hi, I would like to know what the proper bugzilla component is for this > bug: gnome-vfs2, gamin, autoconf, gcc, or glibc-headers. > > Gnome-vfs2 CVS builds without Fam support on my machine, and I believe > is built without Fam support in Fedora as well. The fam check fails: > > configure:36924: checking fam.h usability > configure:36936: gcc -c -g -O2 conftest.c >&5 > In file included from /usr/include/limits.h:124, > from /usr/include/limits.h:124, > from /usr/include/limits.h:124, > from /usr/include/limits.h:124, > from /usr/include/limits.h:124, > from /usr/include/limits.h:124, > from /usr/include/limits.h:124, > from /usr/include/limits.h:124, > .... > > from /usr/include/fam.h:34, > from conftest.c:177: > /usr/include/limits.h:124:26: error: #include nested too deeply > /usr/include/limits.h:144:30: error: #include nested too deeply > /usr/include/limits.h:148:30: error: #include nested too deeply > /usr/include/limits.h:152:29: error: #include nested too deeply > > ... > In file included from /usr/include/limits.h:144, > from /usr/include/limits.h:124, > ... > /usr/include/bits/posix1_lim.h:153:28: error: #include nested too deeply > ... > > In file included from /usr/include/limits.h:152, > from /usr/include/limits.h:124, > ... > /usr/include/bits/xopen_lim.h:34:28: error: #include nested too deeply > > -- > Ivan Gyurdiev > Cornell University > From jdesbonnet at gmail.com Fri Mar 11 10:36:49 2005 From: jdesbonnet at gmail.com (Joe Desbonnet) Date: Fri, 11 Mar 2005 10:36:49 +0000 Subject: A more efficient up2date service using binary diffs In-Reply-To: <4230F312.8040105@nc.rr.com> References: <422F17B5.5070402@galway.net> <422F3ACE.7010309@math.unl.edu> <1110393130.3448.32.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1cef3e95050309110335197fd9@mail.gmail.com> <604aa7910503091130609b492c@mail.gmail.com> <20050309222930.GE15009@angus.ind.WPI.EDU> <1110450389.4032.2.camel@anu.eridu> <4230F312.8040105@nc.rr.com> Message-ID: <1cef3e95050311023654e1bba9@mail.gmail.com> Some preliminary results from building a archive of rpm deltas from the FC3 updates directory which are very encouraging. I've been running it overnight (only a 750MHz P3) and it has built about 700 deltas so far. Mean size of delta comparted to whole RPM: 13.5% About half of the deltas are under 5% of whole RPM. One in four are under 2% of the whole RPM. I will post more detailed stats when I've completed this experiment. Joe. From buildsys at redhat.com Fri Mar 11 12:29:16 2005 From: buildsys at redhat.com (Build System) Date: Fri, 11 Mar 2005 07:29:16 -0500 Subject: rawhide report: 20050311 changes Message-ID: <200503111229.j2BCTG11026013@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> New package cryptsetup-luks A utility for setting up encrypted filesystems Updated Packages: checkpolicy-1.22-1 ------------------ * Thu Mar 10 2005 Dan Walsh 1.22-1 - Update to NSA Release devhelp-0.9.3-4 --------------- * Wed Mar 09 2005 Christopher Aillon 0.9.3-4 - Depend on mozilla 1.7.6 * Sat Mar 05 2005 Christopher Aillon 0.9.3-3 - Rebuild against GCC 4.0 dia-1:0.94-7 ------------ * Wed Mar 09 2005 Caolan McNamara - rh#150305# add dia-0.94-fallbacktoxpmicons.patch * Wed Mar 02 2005 Caolan McNamara - rebuild with gcc4 - gnome#169019# gcc4 patch * Fri Sep 03 2004 Matthias Clasen - Fix a problem with the help patch dictd-1.9.7-7 ------------- * Thu Mar 10 2005 Bill Nottingham 1.9.7-7 - prereq chkconfig evolution-2.2.0-5 ----------------- * Thu Mar 10 2005 David Malcolm - 2.2.0-5 - Added patch for changes to DBus API in version 0.31 (#150671) - Removed explicit run-time spec-file requirement on mozilla. The Mozilla NSS API/ABI stabilised by version 1.7.3 The libraries are always located in the libdir However, the headers are in /usr/include/mozilla-1.7.6 and so they move each time the mozilla version changes. So we no longer have an explicit mozilla run-time requirement in the specfile; a requirement on the appropriate NSS and NSPR .so files is automagically generated on build. We have an explicit, exact build-time version, so that we can find the headers (without invoking an RPM query from the spec file; to do so is considered bad practice) - Introduced mozilla_build_version, to replace mozilla_version foomatic-3.0.2-18 ----------------- * Thu Mar 10 2005 Tim Waugh 3.0.2-18 - Updated db to 20050310. gdm-1:2.6.0.7-5 --------------- * Fri Mar 11 2005 Alexandre Oliva 1:2.6.0.7-5 - fix patch for bug 149899 (fixes bug 150745) ghostscript-7.07-40 ------------------- * Thu Mar 10 2005 Tim Waugh 7.07-40 - Build igcrej.c with -O0 to work around bug #150771. hwbrowser-0.20-1 ---------------- * Mon Feb 07 2005 Nils Philippsen 0.20-1 - fix deprecation warnings (#147268) * Wed Feb 02 2005 Jeremy Katz 0.19-2 - fix pygtk2-libglade requirement * Tue Feb 01 2005 Nils Philippsen 0.19-1 - don't divide by zero with certain USB floppies (#142835, patch by Stuart Hayes) libselinux-1.22-1 ----------------- * Thu Mar 10 2005 Dan Walsh 1.22-1 - Update from NSA libsepol-1.4-1 -------------- * Thu Mar 10 2005 Dan Walsh 1.4-1 - Update to latest from NSA net-snmp-5.2.1-5 ---------------- * Wed Mar 09 2005 Radek Vokal - 5.2.1-5 - 64bit needed some changes, was causing timeouts on 64bit archs!? - affects bugs #125432 and #132058 policycoreutils-1.22-2 ---------------------- * Thu Mar 10 2005 Dan Walsh 1.22-2 - Update to released version from NSA - Patch genhomedircon to handle passwd in different places. selinux-doc-1.18-1 ------------------ * Thu Mar 10 2005 Dan Walsh 1.18-1 - Update to NSA Release version selinux-policy-strict-1.22.1-2 ------------------------------ * Thu Mar 10 2005 Dan Walsh 1.22.1-2 - Fix filecontext.homedirs handling * Thu Mar 10 2005 Dan Walsh 1.22.1-1 - Update to latest from NSA - Dontaudit pam_timestamp calls to utmp * Wed Mar 09 2005 Dan Walsh 1.21.16-3 - Add in ifconfig and hostname to make dhcpc work - Add dontaudit for some net_admin calls selinux-policy-targeted-1.22.1-2 -------------------------------- * Thu Mar 10 2005 Dan Walsh 1.22.1-2 - Fix filecontext.homedirs handling * Thu Mar 10 2005 Dan Walsh 1.22.1-1 - Update to latest from NSA - Dontaudit pam_timestamp calls to utmp vnc-4.1-0.2 ----------- * Thu Mar 10 2005 Tim Waugh 4.1-0.2 - Improved render patch from Peter ??strand. * Thu Mar 03 2005 Tim Waugh 4.1-0.1 - 4.1 (but still 4.0 Java viewer for the moment). - Removed sparc patch. - Fixed VNC module link line (from upstream). * Wed Mar 02 2005 Tim Waugh 4.0-15 - Upgraded base package to xorg-x11-6.8.2-6. - Rebuild for new GCC. From fedora-devel at camperquake.de Fri Mar 11 14:04:57 2005 From: fedora-devel at camperquake.de (Ralf Ertzinger) Date: Fri, 11 Mar 2005 15:04:57 +0100 Subject: rawhide report: 20050310 changes In-Reply-To: <20050310232552.GA27026@ti64.telemetry-investments.com> References: <200503101237.j2ACbvWx017272@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <20050310162914.GE30940@ip68-4-98-123.oc.oc.cox.net> <20050310172126.GC24517@nostromo.devel.redhat.com> <1110475954.6291.118.camel@laptopd505.fenrus.org> <604aa7910503100948705e7baf@mail.gmail.com> <42309CBA.6060708@redhat.com> <20050310232552.GA27026@ti64.telemetry-investments.com> Message-ID: <20050311150457.7132159f@nausicaa.camperquake.de> Hi. "Bill Rugolsky Jr." wrote: > Is there some obvious reason why DKMS, > > http://linux.dell.com/projects.shtml#dkms > > is an _unacceptable_ starting point? It would require to make the development package a requirement for every install. Currently the desktop install comes without a compiler. -- 'cause I've got Schweden on my mind. From pbruna at linuxcenterla.com Fri Mar 11 14:37:10 2005 From: pbruna at linuxcenterla.com (Patricio Bruna V) Date: Fri, 11 Mar 2005 11:37:10 -0300 Subject: Sound not working Message-ID: <1110551831.3709.2.camel@cluster2> Hi, i just installed kernel#2.6.11-1.1177_FC4 and the sound stop working. i can listen if i plug the headphones, but the speaker are mute. my soundcard is, says lspci: Intel Corporation 82801DB/DBL/DBM (ICH4/ICH4-L/ICH4-M) AC'97 Audio Controller (rev 01) and uses the module snd_intel8x0m,snd_intel8x0 any hints? -- Patricio Bruna pbruna at linuxcenterla.com Red Hat Certified Engineer Jefe Soporte y Operaciones LinuxCenter S.A. Canada 239, 5to piso, Providencia, Chile http://www.linuxcenterla.com +56-2-2745000 From pbruna at linuxcenterla.com Fri Mar 11 14:54:16 2005 From: pbruna at linuxcenterla.com (Patricio Bruna V) Date: Fri, 11 Mar 2005 11:54:16 -0300 Subject: Sound not working In-Reply-To: <1110551831.3709.2.camel@cluster2> References: <1110551831.3709.2.camel@cluster2> Message-ID: <1110552856.4131.0.camel@cluster2> El vie, 11-03-2005 a las 11:37 -0300, Patricio Bruna V escribi?: > Hi, i just installed kernel#2.6.11-1.1177_FC4 and the sound stop > working. > i can listen if i plug the headphones, but the speaker are mute. > my soundcard is, says lspci: > Intel Corporation 82801DB/DBL/DBM (ICH4/ICH4-L/ICH4-M) AC'97 Audio > Controller (rev 01) > > and uses the module snd_intel8x0m,snd_intel8x0 > > any hints? Now working, i just delete /etc/sysconfig/hwconf -- Patricio Bruna pbruna at linuxcenterla.com Red Hat Certified Engineer Jefe Soporte y Operaciones LinuxCenter S.A. Canada 239, 5to piso, Providencia, Chile http://www.linuxcenterla.com +56-2-2745000 From jharnish at ci.grand-rapids.mi.us Fri Mar 11 14:54:07 2005 From: jharnish at ci.grand-rapids.mi.us (Harnish, Joseph) Date: Fri, 11 Mar 2005 09:54:07 -0500 Subject: Yum errors after yesterdays update Message-ID: <221C759285B78647AEE6181FD6AF36A70F84D3B0@bambi.grand-rapids.mi.us> After updating yesterday I now get this error from Yum: Setting up Update Process Setting up Repos development 100% |=========================| 1.1 kB 00:00 base 100% |=========================| 1.1 kB 00:00 Reading repository metadata in from local files Traceback (most recent call last): File "/usr/bin/yum", line 15, in ? yummain.main(sys.argv[1:]) File "/usr/share/yum-cli/yummain.py", line 72, in main result, resultmsgs = do() File "/usr/share/yum-cli/cli.py", line 462, in doCommands return self.updatePkgs() File "/usr/share/yum-cli/cli.py", line 960, in updatePkgs self.doUpdateSetup() File "__init__.py", line 228, in doUpdateSetup File "sqlitesack.py", line 225, in returnObsoletes File "/usr/src/build/515186-i386/install//usr/lib/python2.4/site-packages/sqlite/ main.py", line 104, in __getitem__ KeyError: 'PACKAGES.PKGID' I nuked the sqlite files in /var/cache/yum/development but it still fails. Any ideas? Thanks Joe -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jspaleta at gmail.com Fri Mar 11 14:59:24 2005 From: jspaleta at gmail.com (Jeff Spaleta) Date: Fri, 11 Mar 2005 09:59:24 -0500 Subject: Yum errors after yesterdays update In-Reply-To: <221C759285B78647AEE6181FD6AF36A70F84D3B0@bambi.grand-rapids.mi.us> References: <221C759285B78647AEE6181FD6AF36A70F84D3B0@bambi.grand-rapids.mi.us> Message-ID: <604aa79105031106596bc4a1fb@mail.gmail.com> On Fri, 11 Mar 2005 09:54:07 -0500, Harnish, Joseph wrote: > I nuked the sqlite files in /var/cache/yum/development but it still fails. you need to install the older sqlite3 package which sqlite package replaces. you should not install the sqlite packages again until there is an update for python-sqlite* -jef From Fedora at TQMcube.com Fri Mar 11 15:00:53 2005 From: Fedora at TQMcube.com (David Cary Hart) Date: Fri, 11 Mar 2005 10:00:53 -0500 Subject: Is There an ETA to Rawhide on Postfix 2.20? Message-ID: <1110553253.16351.8.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> Thanks -- Total Quality Management - A Commitment to Excellence Fight Spam: http://www.tqmcube.com/rbldnsd.htm Real Time Updates: rsync -t \ tqmcube.com::spamlists/[README.htm][clients][dynamic][relays][asiaspam] http://www.tqmcube.com/spam_trap.htm From njp at santram.co.uk Fri Mar 11 15:03:44 2005 From: njp at santram.co.uk (Neil J. Patel) Date: Fri, 11 Mar 2005 15:03:44 +0000 Subject: inotify & gamin In-Reply-To: <1110553253.16351.8.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> References: <1110553253.16351.8.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> Message-ID: <4231B350.5060402@santram.co.uk> Hi, I wanted to know if the fc4 kernals will ship with inotify, and/if gamin will be built to support this ? Neil From shahms at shahms.com Fri Mar 11 15:08:48 2005 From: shahms at shahms.com (Shahms King) Date: Fri, 11 Mar 2005 07:08:48 -0800 Subject: inotify & gamin In-Reply-To: <4231B350.5060402@santram.co.uk> References: <1110553253.16351.8.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> <4231B350.5060402@santram.co.uk> Message-ID: <1110553728.4713.66.camel@shahms.mesd.k12.or.us> On Fri, 2005-03-11 at 15:03 +0000, Neil J. Patel wrote: > Hi, > > I wanted to know if the fc4 kernals will ship with inotify, and/if > gamin will be built to support this ? > > Neil "When it's accepted in the mainline kernel" -- Shahms E. King Multnomah ESD Public Key: http://shahms.mesd.k12.or.us/~sking/shahms.asc Fingerprint: 1612 054B CE92 8770 F1EA AB1B FEAB 3636 45B2 D75B -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part URL: From njp at santram.co.uk Fri Mar 11 15:08:37 2005 From: njp at santram.co.uk (Neil J. Patel) Date: Fri, 11 Mar 2005 15:08:37 +0000 Subject: Is There an ETA to Rawhide on Postfix 2.20? In-Reply-To: <1110553253.16351.8.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> References: <1110553253.16351.8.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> Message-ID: <4231B475.6030000@santram.co.uk> sorry, thunderbird is playing up.... ...or it could be me :( Neil From njp at santram.co.uk Fri Mar 11 15:09:49 2005 From: njp at santram.co.uk (Neil J. Patel) Date: Fri, 11 Mar 2005 15:09:49 +0000 Subject: Inotify & gamin Message-ID: <4231B4BD.5080804@santram.co.uk> Hi, I wanted to know if the fc4 kernals will ship with inotify, and/if gamin will be built to support this ? Neil From jharnish at ci.grand-rapids.mi.us Fri Mar 11 15:11:04 2005 From: jharnish at ci.grand-rapids.mi.us (Harnish, Joseph) Date: Fri, 11 Mar 2005 10:11:04 -0500 Subject: Yum errors after yesterdays update Message-ID: <221C759285B78647AEE6181FD6AF36A70F84D3CE@bambi.grand-rapids.mi.us> Cool. That did the trick. Thanks Jef. Joe -----Original Message----- From: fedora-devel-list-bounces at redhat.com [mailto:fedora-devel-list-bounces at redhat.com] On Behalf Of Jeff Spaleta Sent: Friday, March 11, 2005 9:59 AM To: Development discussions related to Fedora Core Subject: Re: Yum errors after yesterdays update On Fri, 11 Mar 2005 09:54:07 -0500, Harnish, Joseph wrote: > I nuked the sqlite files in /var/cache/yum/development but it still fails. you need to install the older sqlite3 package which sqlite package replaces. you should not install the sqlite packages again until there is an update for python-sqlite* -jef -- fedora-devel-list mailing list fedora-devel-list at redhat.com http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-list -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From fedora-devel at camperquake.de Fri Mar 11 15:26:28 2005 From: fedora-devel at camperquake.de (Ralf Ertzinger) Date: Fri, 11 Mar 2005 16:26:28 +0100 Subject: Self-Introduction: Ralf Ertzinger Message-ID: <20050311162628.3bcd937c@nausicaa.camperquake.de> Hi. I have been reading (and writing) on this list for some time, but have not made a formal introduction yet. Sorry for that, this shall be remedied. My full (legal) name is Ralf Ertzinger. I live in Kiel, northern Germany, and am a student of meteorology, currently writing my diploma thesis. I am working part time for a local company providing meteorological services doing model implementation and system administration. I have worked for a local ISP before, doing system and network administration. I have been working with RPM for several years for local packaging, none of this has been published. My immediate goal is to get the beep media player into FE, longer term to try and get enlighenment CVS into FE. If time permits, I am willing to do QA, if time permits. I have not taken part in any open source projects, yet. I am fluent in perl, bash, not-so-fluent in PHP, I can read C and fix things if the code is not too obfuscated, but I do not really like the language. Partial FORTRAN, hardly python. I can think of no good reason why anyone not knowing me in person ought to trust me more than necessary, after all, I could have made all this up. I did not, but you can not reliably check this. My current signature was randomly generated. I swear. I have a gpg key, but not for the address I am currently posting with. The key is for ralf at camperquake.de and ralf at skytale.net, is available at the ususal places, and reads like this: [sun at nausicaa ~ :) 7]$ gpg --fingerprint ralf at camperquake.de pub 1024D/08DBE734 2003-04-02 Key fingerprint = D730 32DF DC4F 6217 11A7 A712 A3C3 5151 08DB E734 uid Ralf Ertzinger uid Ralf Ertzinger sub 2048g/5AA35A72 2003-04-02 -- "This isn't all true." -- Steven Wright From david at fubar.dk Fri Mar 11 16:16:33 2005 From: david at fubar.dk (David Zeuthen) Date: Fri, 11 Mar 2005 11:16:33 -0500 Subject: hald causing stutters In-Reply-To: <1110487370.3404.73.camel@daxter.boston.redhat.com> References: <1110418168.8126.5.camel@jellyfish.redfishdemo.com> <20050310143256.GA30059@devserv.devel.redhat.com> <1110473109.3404.51.camel@daxter.boston.redhat.com> <1110486653.4839.5.camel@goose> <1110487370.3404.73.camel@daxter.boston.redhat.com> Message-ID: <1110557794.4203.22.camel@daxter.boston.redhat.com> On Thu, 2005-03-10 at 15:42 -0500, David Zeuthen wrote: > I'm currently running a new hal package through the build system that > polls every thirty seconds (instead of every five) and only reads files > from /proc/acpi once on every poll (instead of four times). This should > address these issues, at least in terms of not sucking anymore that the > bespoke applet. > It seems my upload didn't make todays Rawhide; anyway, you may find i386 and source RPM's here http://people.redhat.com/davidz/hal-0.5pre/ Also, Rodd tested this for me offlist and gave it the Thumbs Up(tm), so all is good now. We now return to your regular f-d-l programming :-) David From ml-fedora at fathomssen.de Fri Mar 11 16:22:14 2005 From: ml-fedora at fathomssen.de (Frederick Alexander Thomssen) Date: Fri, 11 Mar 2005 17:22:14 +0100 Subject: hald causing stutters In-Reply-To: References: <1110418168.8126.5.camel@jellyfish.redfishdemo.com> Message-ID: <200503111722.14310.ml-fedora@fathomssen.de> On Thursday 10 March 2005 12:03, Richard Hughes wrote: > Rodd Clarkson clarkson.id.au> writes: > > Watching my CPU use, I get a spike every 5 seconds (a cheap one thousand > > and one, two thousand and two quess). > > This is really quite annoying. It's essentially a pause in your UI > > every 5 seconds or so, including music that's playing and the likes. > > Oops. The new acpi check code polls every 5 seconds to support laptops that > don't give ACPI events. I'm not sure why the poll would cause such a > massive chunk of CPU. David, perhaps we can make this configurable? > > > Is anyone else seeing this (and hopefully addressing it)? And does > > someone have a stop gap for it until it's resolved? > > I see a small spike, but with no interruption to music playing etc. On my laptop (centrino 1,7 with 512 mb ram) the music interrupts. Even typing is hard because it misses some letters... freddy > > Richard Hughes. -- Frederick Alexander Thomssen From rahulsundaram at yahoo.co.in Fri Mar 11 16:28:47 2005 From: rahulsundaram at yahoo.co.in (Rahul Sundaram) Date: Fri, 11 Mar 2005 08:28:47 -0800 (PST) Subject: Inotify & gamin In-Reply-To: 6667 Message-ID: <20050311162847.75146.qmail@web8505.mail.in.yahoo.com> --- "Neil J. Patel" wrote: > Hi, > > I wanted to know if the fc4 kernals will ship > with inotify, and/if > gamin will be built to support this ? > gamin already checks for inotify before falling back on dnotify. The actual inotify feature will have to merged upstream probably before fc can ship it Regards Rahul Sundaram __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Small Business - Try our new resources site! http://smallbusiness.yahoo.com/resources/ From johnp at redhat.com Fri Mar 11 16:37:05 2005 From: johnp at redhat.com (John (J5) Palmieri) Date: Fri, 11 Mar 2005 11:37:05 -0500 Subject: hald causing stutters In-Reply-To: <200503111722.14310.ml-fedora@fathomssen.de> References: <1110418168.8126.5.camel@jellyfish.redfishdemo.com> <200503111722.14310.ml-fedora@fathomssen.de> Message-ID: <1110559025.22504.72.camel@localhost.localdomain> On Fri, 2005-03-11 at 11:22, Frederick Alexander Thomssen wrote: > On Thursday 10 March 2005 12:03, Richard Hughes wrote: > > Rodd Clarkson clarkson.id.au> writes: > > > Watching my CPU use, I get a spike every 5 seconds (a cheap one thousand > > > and one, two thousand and two quess). > > > This is really quite annoying. It's essentially a pause in your UI > > > every 5 seconds or so, including music that's playing and the likes. > > > > Oops. The new acpi check code polls every 5 seconds to support laptops that > > don't give ACPI events. I'm not sure why the poll would cause such a > > massive chunk of CPU. David, perhaps we can make this configurable? > > > > > Is anyone else seeing this (and hopefully addressing it)? And does > > > someone have a stop gap for it until it's resolved? > > > > I see a small spike, but with no interruption to music playing etc. > > On my laptop (centrino 1,7 with 512 mb ram) the music interrupts. Even typing > is hard because it misses some letters... > > freddy > > > > > Richard Hughes. Davidz fixed this and it should be going into rawhide soon. Test packages are here or you can wait until rawhide is update: http://people.redhat.com/davidz/hal-0.5pre/ hal-0.5.0.cvs20050310-1 -- J5 From tibbs at math.uh.edu Fri Mar 11 17:18:56 2005 From: tibbs at math.uh.edu (Jason L Tibbitts III) Date: Fri, 11 Mar 2005 11:18:56 -0600 Subject: rawhide report: 20050310 changes In-Reply-To: <20050311150457.7132159f@nausicaa.camperquake.de> (Ralf Ertzinger's message of "Fri, 11 Mar 2005 15:04:57 +0100") References: <200503101237.j2ACbvWx017272@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <20050310162914.GE30940@ip68-4-98-123.oc.oc.cox.net> <20050310172126.GC24517@nostromo.devel.redhat.com> <1110475954.6291.118.camel@laptopd505.fenrus.org> <604aa7910503100948705e7baf@mail.gmail.com> <42309CBA.6060708@redhat.com> <20050310232552.GA27026@ti64.telemetry-investments.com> <20050311150457.7132159f@nausicaa.camperquake.de> Message-ID: >>>>> "RE" == Ralf Ertzinger writes: RE> It would require to make the development package a requirement for RE> every install. Only if you use DKMS as is. But if you take it as a starting point (i.e. what Mr. Rugolsky suggested) and make its output not an installed module but a kernel-module-whatever RPM then end users wouldn't need the development packages. I guess the question is whether DKMS can be so modified and if so whether the result would be better than whatever other solutions people have come up with. - J< From jharnish at ci.grand-rapids.mi.us Fri Mar 11 17:34:32 2005 From: jharnish at ci.grand-rapids.mi.us (Harnish, Joseph) Date: Fri, 11 Mar 2005 12:34:32 -0500 Subject: rawhide report: 20050310 changes Message-ID: <221C759285B78647AEE6181FD6AF36A70F84D451@bambi.grand-rapids.mi.us> The main developers of DKMS are on the linux-poweredge at dell dot com mailing list. They would be able to help shed some light on this. Joe -----Original Message----- From: fedora-devel-list-bounces at redhat.com [mailto:fedora-devel-list-bounces at redhat.com] On Behalf Of Jason L Tibbitts III Sent: Friday, March 11, 2005 12:19 PM To: Development discussions related to Fedora Core Subject: Re: rawhide report: 20050310 changes >>>>> "RE" == Ralf Ertzinger writes: RE> It would require to make the development package a requirement for RE> every install. Only if you use DKMS as is. But if you take it as a starting point (i.e. what Mr. Rugolsky suggested) and make its output not an installed module but a kernel-module-whatever RPM then end users wouldn't need the development packages. I guess the question is whether DKMS can be so modified and if so whether the result would be better than whatever other solutions people have come up with. - J< -- fedora-devel-list mailing list fedora-devel-list at redhat.com http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-list -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From cmadams at hiwaay.net Fri Mar 11 17:35:27 2005 From: cmadams at hiwaay.net (Chris Adams) Date: Fri, 11 Mar 2005 11:35:27 -0600 Subject: rawhide report: 20050310 changes In-Reply-To: References: <200503101237.j2ACbvWx017272@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <20050310162914.GE30940@ip68-4-98-123.oc.oc.cox.net> <20050310172126.GC24517@nostromo.devel.redhat.com> <1110475954.6291.118.camel@laptopd505.fenrus.org> <604aa7910503100948705e7baf@mail.gmail.com> <42309CBA.6060708@redhat.com> <20050310232552.GA27026@ti64.telemetry-investments.com> <20050311150457.7132159f@nausicaa.camperquake.de> Message-ID: <20050311173527.GD1538407@hiwaay.net> Once upon a time, Jason L Tibbitts III said: > Only if you use DKMS as is. But if you take it as a starting point > (i.e. what Mr. Rugolsky suggested) and make its output not an > installed module but a kernel-module-whatever RPM then end users > wouldn't need the development packages. Someone can build and distribute kernel module RPMs today; they don't need DKMS for that. DKMS is a way for someone to distribute source so that users don't have to care that they updated to a new kernel. If they still have to download an RPM for the updated module, then nothing has changed. -- Chris Adams Systems and Network Administrator - HiWAAY Internet Services I don't speak for anybody but myself - that's enough trouble. From eric at snowmoon.com Fri Mar 11 17:52:21 2005 From: eric at snowmoon.com (Eric Warnke) Date: Fri, 11 Mar 2005 12:52:21 -0500 Subject: rawhide report: 20050310 changes In-Reply-To: <20050311173527.GD1538407@hiwaay.net> References: <200503101237.j2ACbvWx017272@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <20050310162914.GE30940@ip68-4-98-123.oc.oc.cox.net> <20050310172126.GC24517@nostromo.devel.redhat.com> <1110475954.6291.118.camel@laptopd505.fenrus.org> <604aa7910503100948705e7baf@mail.gmail.com> <42309CBA.6060708@redhat.com> <20050310232552.GA27026@ti64.telemetry-investments.com> <20050311150457.7132159f@nausicaa.camperquake.de> <20050311173527.GD1538407@hiwaay.net> Message-ID: <4231DAD5.7080304@snowmoon.com> I this this whole thread just echoed the fact that we need to evaluate how kernels get installed and updated. The current solution works, but is tenuous at best and can break systems. We need a better way, possibly have a way for rpm to link to other rpm's so that yum understands that you are now dealing with a situation where updating one without the other could be a problem. I could see that feature benefit other parts of the system where tight coupling between two packages could take place. The other issue that yum needs to address at some point is security updates vs everything else. I may wish to only take updates that close actual or theoretical security issues and right now I would have to sift through every package that needs updating to see if that is the case. Cheers, Eric Chris Adams wrote: >Once upon a time, Jason L Tibbitts III said: > > >>Only if you use DKMS as is. But if you take it as a starting point >>(i.e. what Mr. Rugolsky suggested) and make its output not an >>installed module but a kernel-module-whatever RPM then end users >>wouldn't need the development packages. >> >> > >Someone can build and distribute kernel module RPMs today; they don't >need DKMS for that. DKMS is a way for someone to distribute source so >that users don't have to care that they updated to a new kernel. If >they still have to download an RPM for the updated module, then nothing >has changed. > > > -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 251 bytes Desc: OpenPGP digital signature URL: From jspaleta at gmail.com Fri Mar 11 17:52:38 2005 From: jspaleta at gmail.com (Jeff Spaleta) Date: Fri, 11 Mar 2005 12:52:38 -0500 Subject: rawhide report: 20050310 changes In-Reply-To: <20050311173527.GD1538407@hiwaay.net> References: <200503101237.j2ACbvWx017272@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <20050310172126.GC24517@nostromo.devel.redhat.com> <1110475954.6291.118.camel@laptopd505.fenrus.org> <604aa7910503100948705e7baf@mail.gmail.com> <42309CBA.6060708@redhat.com> <20050310232552.GA27026@ti64.telemetry-investments.com> <20050311150457.7132159f@nausicaa.camperquake.de> <20050311173527.GD1538407@hiwaay.net> Message-ID: <604aa79105031109522ff1ead1@mail.gmail.com> On Fri, 11 Mar 2005 11:35:27 -0600, Chris Adams wrote: > Someone can build and distribute kernel module RPMs today; they don't > need DKMS for that. I think the idea is to create some infrastructure inside the build system so that new kernel module packages can be automatically spun up when a new kernel update lands... minimizing the lag between the availability of a new kernel in Core and new kernel addon modules in Core and Extras. The goal.. being able to release the full set of kernel module addon packages at the same time that a kernel update is released. DKMS as a starting point for buildsystem infrastructure to trigger automated module package rebuilds is not completely left-field, but there might be simplier script solutions that can trigger off of buildrequires in the srpms. Then of course you still have to work through the packaging issues that will allow updates to kernel module packages to install seemlessly when installing the new kernel. -jef From brugolsky at telemetry-investments.com Fri Mar 11 18:12:48 2005 From: brugolsky at telemetry-investments.com (Bill Rugolsky Jr.) Date: Fri, 11 Mar 2005 13:12:48 -0500 Subject: rawhide report: 20050310 changes In-Reply-To: References: <200503101237.j2ACbvWx017272@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <20050310162914.GE30940@ip68-4-98-123.oc.oc.cox.net> <20050310172126.GC24517@nostromo.devel.redhat.com> <1110475954.6291.118.camel@laptopd505.fenrus.org> <604aa7910503100948705e7baf@mail.gmail.com> <42309CBA.6060708@redhat.com> <20050310232552.GA27026@ti64.telemetry-investments.com> <20050311150457.7132159f@nausicaa.camperquake.de> Message-ID: <20050311181248.GC25403@ti64.telemetry-investments.com> On Fri, Mar 11, 2005 at 11:18:56AM -0600, Jason L Tibbitts III wrote: > RE> It would require to make the development package a requirement for > RE> every install. > > Only if you use DKMS as is. But if you take it as a starting point > (i.e. what Mr. Rugolsky suggested) and make its output not an > installed module but a kernel-module-whatever RPM then end users > wouldn't need the development packages. The development suite is definitely an issue for lean installs. Though I must admit to being somewhat bemused by folks who can install Java, Python, Perl CPAN, etc., yet think that a C compiler is bloat. Fedora is, after all, a free and open source operating system, written primarily in C! The "security benefit" of not having a C compiler is a red herring. Nevertheless, there are valid reasons to not have a development environment on every host; I have solid-state routers with only 256MB of flash storage running a stripped-down variant of FC1. My custom kernel packages for those machines omits everything under /lib/modules/`uname -r`/build/. There is no choice but to either build out-of-tree drivers into the package, or get/build the driver packages from elsewhere (as I have done for the WAN drivers). DKMS supports this paradigm with mktarball/ldtarball, which I'd rather be RPMS, for all the usual reasons. In the "usual" lean install, where the kernel package contains the requisite build tree, one could proxy the compilation/linkage using something like distcc. If it works on the Zaurus, it can work for Fedora! :-) It is fine to put all sorts of out-of-tree drivers in Fedora Extras or some other repository, and it would be nice if those repositories built binary drivers for each "official" kernel. But what about kernels in testing, Rawhide, Dave Jones's personal ftp directory, Arjan's -ac RPMS, and self-built kernels? Fedora is not RHEL. If we want folks to test new kernel releases [cf. LKML "RFD: Kernel release numbering" discussion], we need to lower the barrier to doing so, even if that enables the user to shoot himself with a bazooka. The problem with just dropping DKMS and similar solutions into the existing automated infrastructure is that failures are not captured adequately by the package dependency solver logic. If failures occur, they are not readily detected, and then one has a kernel installed that may have a broken configuration. Hooking /sbin/new-kernel-pkg to install driver module RPMS presents the problem that if dependencies are determined dynamically by a scriptlet, there is no mechanism to communicate that to the top-level package manager (in order to retrieve the packages, if necessary), or to insert them into an RPM transaction. It's unclear to me whether it is possible or kosher to initiate a new transaction from a post-install scriptlet, and whether that would confuse all of the package managers. In any case, there is no robust mechanism for dealing with failures. /sbin/new-kernel-pkg should not be building an initramfs and updating the bootloader configuration unless the locally-defined module dependencies are satisfied. But how to structure the control flow is unclear. My preferred solution would be a generic extension to the package managers that simply allows some packages to be built from source as part of a multi-transaction update. The build script needs some mechanism to call back into the package manager in order to satisfy additional build dependencies, etc. Unfortunately, the end result is probably something akin to the various automated build environments. Perhaps something less bloated is sufficient for the special case of kernel, though many free software architectures support third-party plugins, and it would be useful to solve the problem once. Then again, perhaps this is all outside of the scope of the Fedora Project, and should remain a feature of source-orient package management systems like Portage. Regards, Bill Rugolsky From czar at czarc.net Fri Mar 11 18:34:35 2005 From: czar at czarc.net (Gene C.) Date: Fri, 11 Mar 2005 13:34:35 -0500 Subject: Fedora repository layout proposal In-Reply-To: <42305A00.1090504@nc.rr.com> References: <42305A00.1090504@nc.rr.com> Message-ID: <200503111334.35942.czar@czarc.net> On Thursday 10 March 2005 09:30, Jeff Johnson wrote: > If you are going to split out SRPMS/debuginfo (wise imho), then you > should also consider splitting > multilib arches into seperate repositories. I also believe that splitting might be a good idea. That said, do you (Jeff) mean that on a x86_64 system, the i386 multilib updates would be pulled from the i386 repo rather than from the x86_64 repo as it now does? I can see lots of benefits (less disk space on mirrors) but also a potential problem -- when updating a package for multiple architectures, you need to make sure that it builds on all architectures supported or none of the updated packages gets propagated to their respective repositories ... otherwise, things could get out-of-sync easily. -- Gene From skvidal at phy.duke.edu Fri Mar 11 18:41:10 2005 From: skvidal at phy.duke.edu (seth vidal) Date: Fri, 11 Mar 2005 13:41:10 -0500 Subject: rawhide report: 20050310 changes In-Reply-To: <4231DAD5.7080304@snowmoon.com> References: <200503101237.j2ACbvWx017272@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <20050310162914.GE30940@ip68-4-98-123.oc.oc.cox.net> <20050310172126.GC24517@nostromo.devel.redhat.com> <1110475954.6291.118.camel@laptopd505.fenrus.org> <604aa7910503100948705e7baf@mail.gmail.com> <42309CBA.6060708@redhat.com> <20050310232552.GA27026@ti64.telemetry-investments.com> <20050311150457.7132159f@nausicaa.camperquake.de> <20050311173527.GD1538407@hiwaay.net> <4231DAD5.7080304@snowmoon.com> Message-ID: <1110566470.24545.6.camel@opus.phy.duke.edu> > The other issue that yum needs to address at some point is security > updates vs everything else. I may wish to only take updates that close > actual or theoretical security issues and right now I would have to sift > through every package that needs updating to see if that is the case. then we need a way of storing metadata about update severity. -sv From davej at redhat.com Fri Mar 11 18:56:18 2005 From: davej at redhat.com (Dave Jones) Date: Fri, 11 Mar 2005 13:56:18 -0500 Subject: inotify & gamin In-Reply-To: <4231B350.5060402@santram.co.uk> References: <1110553253.16351.8.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> <4231B350.5060402@santram.co.uk> Message-ID: <20050311185618.GB4185@redhat.com> On Fri, Mar 11, 2005 at 03:03:44PM +0000, Neil J. Patel wrote: > I wanted to know if the fc4 kernals will ship with inotify Only when it gets merged upstream. The interface still seems to be in flux, and various details are still being worked out it seems, which makes it a dangerous thing to merge at this time. Dave From paul at all-the-johnsons.co.uk Fri Mar 11 20:32:11 2005 From: paul at all-the-johnsons.co.uk (Paul) Date: Fri, 11 Mar 2005 20:32:11 +0000 Subject: USB card reader gone again Message-ID: <1110573132.4974.7.camel@localhost.localdomain> Hi, I'm using the 2.6.11-1.1177_FC4 kernel and am trying to get my 7 in 1 card reader to read an SD card from my camera. This has worked in the past by me including options scsi_mod max_luns=8 and then /sbin/mkinitrd -f /boot/initrd-2.6.11-1.1177_FC4 /boot/2.6.11-1.1177_FC4 and a reboot and that's all that is required - it certainly has worked in the past. /sbin/lsusb is showing Bus 003 Device 007: ID 55aa:b012 OnSpec Electronic, Inc. Bus 003 Device 002: ID 03f0:3004 Hewlett-Packard which is the card reader and my printer respectively. /proc/bus/usb/devices shows T: Bus=03 Lev=00 Prnt=00 Port=00 Cnt=00 Dev#= 1 Spd=12 MxCh= 3 B: Alloc= 0/900 us ( 0%), #Int= 0, #Iso= 0 D: Ver= 1.10 Cls=09(hub ) Sub=00 Prot=00 MxPS= 8 #Cfgs= 1 P: Vendor=0000 ProdID=0000 Rev= 2.06 S: Manufacturer=Linux 2.6.11-1.1177_FC4 ohci_hcd S: Product=OHCI Host Controller S: SerialNumber=0000:00:02.1 C:* #Ifs= 1 Cfg#= 1 Atr=e0 MxPwr= 0mA I: If#= 0 Alt= 0 #EPs= 1 Cls=09(hub ) Sub=00 Prot=00 Driver=hub E: Ad=81(I) Atr=03(Int.) MxPS= 2 Ivl=255ms T: Bus=03 Lev=01 Prnt=01 Port=00 Cnt=01 Dev#= 2 Spd=12 MxCh= 0 D: Ver= 1.10 Cls=00(>ifc ) Sub=00 Prot=00 MxPS= 8 #Cfgs= 1 P: Vendor=03f0 ProdID=3004 Rev= 1.00 S: Manufacturer=Hewlett-Packard S: Product=DeskJet 980C S: SerialNumber=ES16B190F0OF C:* #Ifs= 1 Cfg#= 1 Atr=c0 MxPwr= 2mA I: If#= 0 Alt= 0 #EPs= 2 Cls=07(print) Sub=01 Prot=02 Driver=usblp E: Ad=81(I) Atr=02(Bulk) MxPS= 64 Ivl=0ms E: Ad=02(O) Atr=02(Bulk) MxPS= 64 Ivl=0ms T: Bus=03 Lev=01 Prnt=01 Port=02 Cnt=02 Dev#= 7 Spd=12 MxCh= 0 D: Ver= 1.10 Cls=00(>ifc ) Sub=00 Prot=00 MxPS= 8 #Cfgs= 1 P: Vendor=55aa ProdID=b012 Rev= 1.01 C:* #Ifs= 1 Cfg#= 1 Atr=80 MxPwr=200mA I: If#= 0 Alt= 0 #EPs= 2 Cls=08(stor.) Sub=06 Prot=50 Driver=usb-storage E: Ad=01(O) Atr=02(Bulk) MxPS= 64 Ivl=0ms E: Ad=82(I) Atr=02(Bulk) MxPS= 64 Ivl=0ms So it is showing up. Any ideas on how to get this working again or should I bugzilla it? It has worked in the past. TTFN Paul -- "I like blinking me" - Helen, Big Brother 2 contestant -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part URL: From davej at redhat.com Fri Mar 11 20:36:28 2005 From: davej at redhat.com (Dave Jones) Date: Fri, 11 Mar 2005 15:36:28 -0500 Subject: USB card reader gone again In-Reply-To: <1110573132.4974.7.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <1110573132.4974.7.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <20050311203628.GD4185@redhat.com> On Fri, Mar 11, 2005 at 08:32:11PM +0000, Paul wrote: > Hi, > > I'm using the 2.6.11-1.1177_FC4 kernel and am trying to get my 7 in 1 > card reader to read an SD card from my camera. This has worked in the > past by me including > > options scsi_mod max_luns=8 > > and then > > /sbin/mkinitrd -f /boot/initrd-2.6.11-1.1177_FC4 /boot/2.6.11-1.1177_FC4 With the FC4 kernels you shouldn't need to do any of this. We now scan all LUNs by default. > Any ideas on how to get this working again or should I bugzilla it? It > has worked in the past. dmesg output would be useful. Dave From n3npq at nc.rr.com Fri Mar 11 21:44:07 2005 From: n3npq at nc.rr.com (Jeff Johnson) Date: Fri, 11 Mar 2005 16:44:07 -0500 Subject: Fedora repository layout proposal In-Reply-To: <200503111334.35942.czar@czarc.net> References: <42305A00.1090504@nc.rr.com> <200503111334.35942.czar@czarc.net> Message-ID: <42321127.4020703@nc.rr.com> Gene C. wrote: >On Thursday 10 March 2005 09:30, Jeff Johnson wrote: > > >>If you are going to split out SRPMS/debuginfo (wise imho), then you >>should also consider splitting >>multilib arches into seperate repositories. >> >> > >I also believe that splitting might be a good idea. > >That said, do you (Jeff) mean that on a x86_64 system, the i386 multilib >updates would be pulled from the i386 repo rather than from the x86_64 repo >as it now does? > > Yep, that's exactly what I meant. FWIW, multilib packages are combined in a single directory at the last possible moment, otherwise the entire packaging process that ends up in a repository is per-arch. >I can see lots of benefits (less disk space on mirrors) but also a potential >problem -- when updating a package for multiple architectures, you need to >make sure that it builds on all architectures supported or none of the >updated packages gets propagated to their respective repositories ... >otherwise, things could get out-of-sync easily. > > Issues like out-of-sync, or multiple architecture updates, are not made any worse by separating, say, i386 and x86_64 and moarch packages,. Having the packages in different directories (including noarch) is perhaps easier to understand and debug than having everything slopped into a single repository directory. OTOH, where the packages are located, including *.src.rpm and *-debuginfo*.rpm, ultimately makes little difference if tools are designed to filter according to convention. The filtering is more easily implemented, and more obvious to most users, if packages are in separate directories imho. 73 de Jeff From paul at all-the-johnsons.co.uk Fri Mar 11 20:48:51 2005 From: paul at all-the-johnsons.co.uk (Paul) Date: Fri, 11 Mar 2005 20:48:51 +0000 Subject: USB card reader gone again In-Reply-To: <20050311203628.GD4185@redhat.com> References: <1110573132.4974.7.camel@localhost.localdomain> <20050311203628.GD4185@redhat.com> Message-ID: <1110574131.4974.12.camel@localhost.localdomain> Hi, > > /sbin/mkinitrd -f /boot/initrd-2.6.11-1.1177_FC4 /boot/2.6.11-1.1177_FC4 > > With the FC4 kernels you shouldn't need to do any of this. > We now scan all LUNs by default. Neat! > > Any ideas on how to get this working again or should I bugzilla it? It > > has worked in the past. > > dmesg output would be useful. Here it is. Linux version 2.6.11-1.1177_FC4 (bhcompile at bugs.build.redhat.com) (gcc version 4.0.0 20050302 (Red Hat 4.0.0-0.31)) #1 Tue Mar 8 17:32:31 EST 2005 BIOS-provided physical RAM map: BIOS-e820: 0000000000000000 - 000000000009fc00 (usable) BIOS-e820: 000000000009fc00 - 00000000000a0000 (reserved) BIOS-e820: 00000000000f0000 - 0000000000100000 (reserved) BIOS-e820: 0000000000100000 - 000000003fff0000 (usable) BIOS-e820: 000000003fff0000 - 000000003fff3000 (ACPI NVS) BIOS-e820: 000000003fff3000 - 0000000040000000 (ACPI data) BIOS-e820: 00000000fec00000 - 00000000fec01000 (reserved) BIOS-e820: 00000000fee00000 - 00000000fee01000 (reserved) BIOS-e820: 00000000ffff0000 - 0000000100000000 (reserved) 127MB HIGHMEM available. 896MB LOWMEM available. Using x86 segment limits to approximate NX protection On node 0 totalpages: 262128 DMA zone: 4096 pages, LIFO batch:1 Normal zone: 225280 pages, LIFO batch:16 HighMem zone: 32752 pages, LIFO batch:7 DMI 2.3 present. ACPI: RSDP (v000 Nvidia ) @ 0x000f6a70 ACPI: RSDT (v001 Nvidia AWRDACPI 0x42302e31 AWRD 0x01010101) @ 0x3fff3000 ACPI: FADT (v001 Nvidia AWRDACPI 0x42302e31 AWRD 0x01010101) @ 0x3fff3040 ACPI: MADT (v001 Nvidia AWRDACPI 0x42302e31 AWRD 0x01010101) @ 0x3fff74c0 ACPI: DSDT (v001 NVIDIA AWRDACPI 0x00001000 MSFT 0x0100000c) @ 0x00000000 ACPI: PM-Timer IO Port: 0x1008 Allocating PCI resources starting at 40000000 (gap: 40000000:bec00000) Built 1 zonelists Kernel command line: ro root=LABEL=/ rhgb quiet Initializing CPU#0 CPU 0 irqstacks, hard=c045a000 soft=c0459000 PID hash table entries: 4096 (order: 12, 65536 bytes) Detected 1663.838 MHz processor. Using pmtmr for high-res timesource Console: colour VGA+ 80x25 Dentry cache hash table entries: 131072 (order: 7, 524288 bytes) Inode-cache hash table entries: 65536 (order: 6, 262144 bytes) Memory: 1033028k/1048512k available (2528k kernel code, 14708k reserved, 688k data, 184k init, 131008k highmem) Checking if this processor honours the WP bit even in supervisor mode... Ok. Calibrating delay loop... 3293.18 BogoMIPS (lpj=1646592) Security Framework v1.0.0 initialized SELinux: Initializing. SELinux: Starting in permissive mode selinux_register_security: Registering secondary module capability Capability LSM initialized as secondary Mount-cache hash table entries: 512 (order: 0, 4096 bytes) CPU: After generic identify, caps: 0383fbff c1cbfbff 00000000 00000000 00000000 00000000 00000000 CPU: After vendor identify, caps: 0383fbff c1cbfbff 00000000 00000000 00000000 00000000 00000000 CPU: L1 I Cache: 64K (64 bytes/line), D cache 64K (64 bytes/line) CPU: L2 Cache: 256K (64 bytes/line) CPU: After all inits, caps: 0383f3f7 c1cbfbff 00000000 00000020 00000000 00000000 00000000 Intel machine check architecture supported. Intel machine check reporting enabled on CPU#0. CPU: AMD Sempron(tm) 2400+ stepping 01 Enabling fast FPU save and restore... done. Enabling unmasked SIMD FPU exception support... done. Checking 'hlt' instruction... OK. ACPI: setting ELCR to 0200 (from 0e20) checking if image is initramfs... it is Freeing initrd memory: 965k freed NET: Registered protocol family 16 PCI: PCI BIOS revision 2.10 entry at 0xfaab0, last bus=2 PCI: Using configuration type 1 mtrr: v2.0 (20020519) ACPI: Subsystem revision 20050211 ACPI: Interpreter enabled ACPI: Using PIC for interrupt routing ACPI: PCI Root Bridge [PCI0] (00:00) PCI: Probing PCI hardware (bus 00) PCI: nForce2 C1 Halt Disconnect fixup ACPI: PCI Interrupt Routing Table [\_SB_.PCI0._PRT] ACPI: PCI Interrupt Routing Table [\_SB_.PCI0.HUB0._PRT] ACPI: PCI Interrupt Routing Table [\_SB_.PCI0.AGPB._PRT] ACPI: PCI Interrupt Link [LNK1] (IRQs 3 4 5 6 7 9 *10 11 12 14 15) ACPI: PCI Interrupt Link [LNK2] (IRQs 3 4 5 6 7 9 10 *11 12 14 15) ACPI: PCI Interrupt Link [LNK3] (IRQs 3 4 5 6 7 *9 10 11 12 14 15) ACPI: PCI Interrupt Link [LNK4] (IRQs 3 4 *5 6 7 9 10 11 12 14 15) ACPI: PCI Interrupt Link [LNK5] (IRQs 3 4 5 6 7 9 10 11 12 14 15) *0, disabled. ACPI: PCI Interrupt Link [LUBA] (IRQs 3 4 5 6 7 *9 10 11 12 14 15) ACPI: PCI Interrupt Link [LUBB] (IRQs 3 4 *5 6 7 9 10 11 12 14 15) ACPI: PCI Interrupt Link [LMAC] (IRQs 3 4 5 6 7 9 10 11 12 14 15) *0, disabled. ACPI: PCI Interrupt Link [LAPU] (IRQs 3 4 5 6 7 9 10 11 12 14 15) *0, disabled. ACPI: PCI Interrupt Link [LACI] (IRQs 3 4 5 6 7 9 10 *11 12 14 15) ACPI: PCI Interrupt Link [LMCI] (IRQs 3 4 5 6 7 9 10 11 12 14 15) *0, disabled. ACPI: PCI Interrupt Link [LSMB] (IRQs 3 4 5 6 7 9 10 *11 12 14 15) ACPI: PCI Interrupt Link [LUB2] (IRQs 3 4 5 6 7 9 *10 11 12 14 15) ACPI: PCI Interrupt Link [LFIR] (IRQs 3 4 5 6 7 9 10 11 12 14 15) *0, disabled. ACPI: PCI Interrupt Link [L3CM] (IRQs 3 4 5 6 7 9 10 11 12 14 15) *0, disabled. ACPI: PCI Interrupt Link [LIDE] (IRQs 3 4 5 6 7 9 10 11 12 14 15) *0, disabled. ACPI: PCI Interrupt Link [APC1] (IRQs *16), disabled. ACPI: PCI Interrupt Link [APC2] (IRQs *17), disabled. ACPI: PCI Interrupt Link [APC3] (IRQs *18), disabled. ACPI: PCI Interrupt Link [APC4] (IRQs *19), disabled. ACPI: PCI Interrupt Link [APC5] (IRQs *16), disabled. ACPI: PCI Interrupt Link [APCF] (IRQs 20 21 22) *0, disabled. ACPI: PCI Interrupt Link [APCG] (IRQs 20 21 22) *0, disabled. ACPI: PCI Interrupt Link [APCH] (IRQs 20 21 22) *0, disabled. ACPI: PCI Interrupt Link [APCI] (IRQs 20 21 22) *0, disabled. ACPI: PCI Interrupt Link [APCJ] (IRQs 20 21 22) *0, disabled. ACPI: PCI Interrupt Link [APCK] (IRQs 20 21 22) *0, disabled. ACPI: PCI Interrupt Link [APCS] (IRQs *23), disabled. ACPI: PCI Interrupt Link [APCL] (IRQs 20 21 22) *0, disabled. ACPI: PCI Interrupt Link [APCM] (IRQs 20 21 22) *0, disabled. ACPI: PCI Interrupt Link [AP3C] (IRQs 20 21 22) *0, disabled. ACPI: PCI Interrupt Link [APCZ] (IRQs 20 21 22) *0, disabled. Linux Plug and Play Support v0.97 (c) Adam Belay pnp: PnP ACPI init pnp: PnP ACPI: found 15 devices usbcore: registered new driver usbfs usbcore: registered new driver hub PCI: Using ACPI for IRQ routing ** PCI interrupts are no longer routed automatically. If this ** causes a device to stop working, it is probably because the ** driver failed to call pci_enable_device(). As a temporary ** workaround, the "pci=routeirq" argument restores the old ** behavior. If this argument makes the device work again, ** please email the output of "lspci" to bjorn.helgaas at hp.com ** so I can fix the driver. pnp: 00:00: ioport range 0x1000-0x107f could not be reserved pnp: 00:00: ioport range 0x1080-0x10ff has been reserved pnp: 00:00: ioport range 0x1400-0x147f has been reserved pnp: 00:00: ioport range 0x1480-0x14ff could not be reserved pnp: 00:00: ioport range 0x1800-0x187f has been reserved pnp: 00:00: ioport range 0x1880-0x18ff has been reserved pnp: 00:01: ioport range 0x1c00-0x1c3f has been reserved pnp: 00:01: ioport range 0x2000-0x203f has been reserved apm: BIOS version 1.2 Flags 0x07 (Driver version 1.16ac) apm: overridden by ACPI. audit: initializing netlink socket (disabled) audit(1110572046.192:0): initialized highmem bounce pool size: 64 pages Total HugeTLB memory allocated, 0 VFS: Disk quotas dquot_6.5.1 Dquot-cache hash table entries: 1024 (order 0, 4096 bytes) SELinux: Registering netfilter hooks Initializing Cryptographic API ksign: Installing public key data Loading keyring - Added public key E69E6B4890A9DEBB - User ID: Red Hat, Inc. (Kernel Module GPG key) pci_hotplug: PCI Hot Plug PCI Core version: 0.5 isapnp: Scanning for PnP cards... isapnp: No Plug & Play device found Real Time Clock Driver v1.12 Linux agpgart interface v0.100 (c) Dave Jones agpgart: Detected NVIDIA nForce2 chipset agpgart: Maximum main memory to use for agp memory: 941M agpgart: AGP aperture is 64M @ 0xd0000000 [drm] Initialized drm 1.0.0 20040925 serio: i8042 AUX port at 0x60,0x64 irq 12 serio: i8042 KBD port at 0x60,0x64 irq 1 Serial: 8250/16550 driver $Revision: 1.90 $ 76 ports, IRQ sharing enabled ttyS0 at I/O 0x3f8 (irq = 4) is a 16550A ttyS1 at I/O 0x2f8 (irq = 3) is a 16550A ttyS0 at I/O 0x3f8 (irq = 4) is a 16550A ttyS1 at I/O 0x2f8 (irq = 3) is a 16550A io scheduler noop registered io scheduler anticipatory registered io scheduler deadline registered io scheduler cfq registered RAMDISK driver initialized: 16 RAM disks of 16384K size 1024 blocksize Uniform Multi-Platform E-IDE driver Revision: 7.00alpha2 ide: Assuming 33MHz system bus speed for PIO modes; override with idebus=xx NFORCE2: IDE controller at PCI slot 0000:00:09.0 NFORCE2: chipset revision 162 NFORCE2: not 100% native mode: will probe irqs later NFORCE2: BIOS didn't set cable bits correctly. Enabling workaround. NFORCE2: 0000:00:09.0 (rev a2) UDMA133 controller ide0: BM-DMA at 0xf000-0xf007, BIOS settings: hda:DMA, hdb:DMA ide1: BM-DMA at 0xf008-0xf00f, BIOS settings: hdc:DMA, hdd:DMA Probing IDE interface ide0... hda: HDS722580VLAT20, ATA DISK drive hdb: Maxtor 6Y120L0, ATA DISK drive ide0 at 0x1f0-0x1f7,0x3f6 on irq 14 Probing IDE interface ide1... hdc: LG DVD-ROM DRD-8160B, ATAPI CD/DVD-ROM drive hdd: COMBO-52X16C, ATAPI CD/DVD-ROM drive ide1 at 0x170-0x177,0x376 on irq 15 HPT370A: IDE controller at PCI slot 0000:01:08.0 ACPI: PCI Interrupt Link [LNK1] enabled at IRQ 10 PCI: setting IRQ 10 as level-triggered ACPI: PCI interrupt 0000:01:08.0[A] -> GSI 10 (level, low) -> IRQ 10 HPT370A: chipset revision 4 HPT37X: using 33MHz PCI clock HPT370A: 100% native mode on irq 10 ide2: BM-DMA at 0xb800-0xb807, BIOS settings: hde:pio, hdf:pio ide3: BM-DMA at 0xb808-0xb80f, BIOS settings: hdg:DMA, hdh:DMA Probing IDE interface ide2... hde: IOMEGA ZIP 250 ATAPI, ATAPI FLOPPY drive hdf: _NEC DVD_RW ND-3500AG, ATAPI CD/DVD-ROM drive ide2 at 0xa800-0xa807,0xac02 on irq 10 Probing IDE interface ide3... hdg: Maxtor 6Y120L0, ATA DISK drive hdh: Maxtor 6Y120L0, ATA DISK drive ide3 at 0xb000-0xb007,0xb402 on irq 10 Probing IDE interface ide4... Probing IDE interface ide5... hda: max request size: 1024KiB hda: Host Protected Area detected. current capacity is 160834367 sectors (82347 MB) native capacity is 160836480 sectors (82348 MB) hda: Host Protected Area disabled. hda: 160836480 sectors (82348 MB) w/1794KiB Cache, CHS=16383/255/63, UDMA(100) hda: cache flushes supported hda: hda1 hda3 hda4 < hda5 hda6 hda7 hda8 > hdb: max request size: 128KiB hdb: 240121728 sectors (122942 MB) w/2048KiB Cache, CHS=65535/16/63, UDMA(133) hdb: cache flushes supported hdb: hdb1 hdb2 hdg: max request size: 128KiB hdg: 240121728 sectors (122942 MB) w/2048KiB Cache, CHS=65535/16/63, UDMA(100) hdg: cache flushes supported hdg: hdg1 hdg2 hdh: max request size: 128KiB hdh: 240121728 sectors (122942 MB) w/2048KiB Cache, CHS=65535/16/63, UDMA(100) hdh: cache flushes supported hdh: hdh1 hdc: ATAPI 48X DVD-ROM drive, 512kB Cache, UDMA(33) Uniform CD-ROM driver Revision: 3.20 hdd: ATAPI 52X DVD-ROM CD-R/RW drive, 2048kB Cache, UDMA(33) hdf: ATAPI 48X DVD-ROM DVD-R CD-R/RW drive, 2048kB Cache ide-floppy driver 0.99.newide hde: No disk in drive hde: 0kB, 0/64/32 CHS, 4096 kBps, 512 sector size, 2941 rpm usbcore: registered new driver hiddev usbcore: registered new driver usbhid drivers/usb/input/hid-core.c: v2.0:USB HID core driver mice: PS/2 mouse device common for all mice input: AT Translated Set 2 keyboard on isa0060/serio0 input: GenPS/2 Genius Wheel Mouse on isa0060/serio1 md: md driver 0.90.1 MAX_MD_DEVS=256, MD_SB_DISKS=27 NET: Registered protocol family 2 IP: routing cache hash table of 2048 buckets, 64Kbytes TCP established hash table entries: 262144 (order: 9, 2097152 bytes) TCP bind hash table entries: 65536 (order: 8, 1835008 bytes) TCP: Hash tables configured (established 262144 bind 65536) Initializing IPsec netlink socket NET: Registered protocol family 1 NET: Registered protocol family 17 ACPI wakeup devices: HUB0 HUB1 USB0 USB1 USB2 F139 MMAC MMCI UAR1 ACPI: (supports S0 S1 S4 S5) Freeing unused kernel memory: 184k freed SCSI subsystem initialized ACPI: PCI Interrupt Link [LNK2] enabled at IRQ 11 PCI: setting IRQ 11 as level-triggered ACPI: PCI interrupt 0000:01:09.0[A] -> GSI 11 (level, low) -> IRQ 11 ahc_pci:1:9:0: Host Adapter Bios disabled. Using default SCSI device parameters scsi0 : Adaptec AIC7XXX EISA/VLB/PCI SCSI HBA DRIVER, Rev 6.2.36 aic7850: Single Channel A, SCSI Id=7, 3/253 SCBs device-mapper: 4.4.0-ioctl (2005-01-12) initialised: dm-devel at redhat.com EXT3-fs: INFO: recovery required on readonly filesystem. EXT3-fs: write access will be enabled during recovery. kjournald starting. Commit interval 5 seconds EXT3-fs: hda1: orphan cleanup on readonly fs ext3_orphan_cleanup: deleting unreferenced inode 687450 ext3_orphan_cleanup: deleting unreferenced inode 688864 EXT3-fs: hda1: 2 orphan inodes deleted EXT3-fs: recovery complete. EXT3-fs: mounted filesystem with ordered data mode. security: 3 users, 5 roles, 583 types, 60 bools security: 54 classes, 70968 rules SELinux: Completing initialization. SELinux: Setting up existing superblocks. SELinux: initialized (dev hda1, type ext3), uses xattr SELinux: initialized (dev tmpfs, type tmpfs), uses transition SIDs SELinux: initialized (dev selinuxfs, type selinuxfs), uses genfs_contexts SELinux: initialized (dev mqueue, type mqueue), not configured for labeling SELinux: initialized (dev hugetlbfs, type hugetlbfs), not configured for labeling SELinux: initialized (dev devpts, type devpts), uses transition SIDs SELinux: initialized (dev eventpollfs, type eventpollfs), uses genfs_contexts SELinux: initialized (dev tmpfs, type tmpfs), uses transition SIDs SELinux: initialized (dev futexfs, type futexfs), uses genfs_contexts SELinux: initialized (dev pipefs, type pipefs), uses task SIDs SELinux: initialized (dev sockfs, type sockfs), uses task SIDs SELinux: initialized (dev proc, type proc), uses genfs_contexts SELinux: initialized (dev bdev, type bdev), uses genfs_contexts SELinux: initialized (dev rootfs, type rootfs), uses genfs_contexts SELinux: initialized (dev sysfs, type sysfs), uses genfs_contexts SELinux: initialized (dev usbfs, type usbfs), uses genfs_contexts Floppy drive(s): fd0 is 1.44M FDC 0 is a post-1991 82077 8139too Fast Ethernet driver 0.9.27 ACPI: PCI interrupt 0000:01:0b.0[A] -> GSI 10 (level, low) -> IRQ 10 eth0: RealTek RTL8139 at 0xc000, 00:0f:ea:54:48:15, IRQ 10 eth0: Identified 8139 chip type 'RTL-8100B/8139D' ACPI: PCI Interrupt Link [LNK4] enabled at IRQ 5 PCI: setting IRQ 5 as level-triggered ACPI: PCI interrupt 0000:01:07.0[A] -> GSI 5 (level, low) -> IRQ 5 ACPI: PCI Interrupt Link [LACI] enabled at IRQ 11 ACPI: PCI interrupt 0000:00:06.0[A] -> GSI 11 (level, low) -> IRQ 11 PCI: Setting latency timer of device 0000:00:06.0 to 64 intel8x0_measure_ac97_clock: measured 49314 usecs intel8x0: clocking to 47500 gameport: pci0000:01:07.1 speed 877 kHz i2c_adapter i2c-0: nForce2 SMBus adapter at 0x1c00 i2c_adapter i2c-1: nForce2 SMBus adapter at 0x2000 Linux video capture interface: v1.00 bttv: driver version 0.9.15 loaded bttv: using 8 buffers with 2080k (520 pages) each for capture bttv: Bt8xx card found (0). ACPI: PCI Interrupt Link [LNK3] enabled at IRQ 9 PCI: setting IRQ 9 as level-triggered ACPI: PCI interrupt 0000:01:0a.0[A] -> GSI 9 (level, low) -> IRQ 9 bttv0: Bt878 (rev 17) at 0000:01:0a.0, irq: 9, latency: 32, mmio: 0xd8000000 bttv0: detected: Pinnacle PCTV [card=39], PCI subsystem ID is 11bd:0012 bttv0: using: Pinnacle PCTV Studio/Rave [card=39,autodetected] bttv0: gpio: en=00000000, out=00000000 in=00fffbff [init] bttv0: i2c: checking for MSP34xx @ 0x80... found bttv0: pinnacle/mt: id=2 info="PAL+SECAM / stereo" radio=yes bttv0: using tuner=33 bttv0: i2c: checking for MSP34xx @ 0x80... found msp34xx: init: chip=MSP3410G-B11 +nicam +simple +simpler +radio mode=simple msp3410: daemon started bttv0: i2c: checking for TDA9875 @ 0xb0... not found bttv0: i2c: checking for TDA7432 @ 0x8a... not found tda9885/6/7: chip found @ 0x96 tuner: chip found at addr 0xc0 i2c-bus bt878 #0 [sw] tuner: type set to 33 (MT20xx universal) by bt878 #0 [sw] tuner: microtune: companycode=3cbf part=42 rev=2f tuner: microtune MT2050 found, OK bttv0: registered device video0 bttv0: registered device vbi0 bttv0: registered device radio0 bttv0: PLL: 28636363 => 35468950 .. ok bt878: AUDIO driver version 0.0.0 loaded bt878: Bt878 AUDIO function found (0). ACPI: PCI interrupt 0000:01:0a.1[A] -> GSI 9 (level, low) -> IRQ 9 bt878(0): Bt878 (rev 17) at 01:0a.1, irq: 9, latency: 32, memory: 0xd8001000 ACPI: PCI Interrupt Link [LUB2] enabled at IRQ 10 ACPI: PCI interrupt 0000:00:02.2[C] -> GSI 10 (level, low) -> IRQ 10 ehci_hcd 0000:00:02.2: EHCI Host Controller PCI: Setting latency timer of device 0000:00:02.2 to 64 ehci_hcd 0000:00:02.2: irq 10, pci mem 0xdd004000 ehci_hcd 0000:00:02.2: new USB bus registered, assigned bus number 1 PCI: cache line size of 64 is not supported by device 0000:00:02.2 ehci_hcd 0000:00:02.2: park 0 ehci_hcd 0000:00:02.2: USB 2.0 initialized, EHCI 1.00, driver 10 Dec 2004 hub 1-0:1.0: USB hub found hub 1-0:1.0: 6 ports detected ohci_hcd: 2004 Nov 08 USB 1.1 'Open' Host Controller (OHCI) Driver (PCI) ACPI: PCI Interrupt Link [LUBA] enabled at IRQ 9 ACPI: PCI interrupt 0000:00:02.0[A] -> GSI 9 (level, low) -> IRQ 9 ohci_hcd 0000:00:02.0: OHCI Host Controller PCI: Setting latency timer of device 0000:00:02.0 to 64 ohci_hcd 0000:00:02.0: irq 9, pci mem 0xdd002000 ohci_hcd 0000:00:02.0: new USB bus registered, assigned bus number 2 hub 2-0:1.0: USB hub found hub 2-0:1.0: 3 ports detected ACPI: PCI Interrupt Link [LUBB] enabled at IRQ 5 ACPI: PCI interrupt 0000:00:02.1[B] -> GSI 5 (level, low) -> IRQ 5 ohci_hcd 0000:00:02.1: OHCI Host Controller PCI: Setting latency timer of device 0000:00:02.1 to 64 ohci_hcd 0000:00:02.1: irq 5, pci mem 0xdd003000 ohci_hcd 0000:00:02.1: new USB bus registered, assigned bus number 3 hub 3-0:1.0: USB hub found hub 3-0:1.0: 3 ports detected ieee1394: Initialized config rom entry `ip1394' ohci1394: $Rev: 1223 $ Ben Collins ACPI: PCI interrupt 0000:01:07.2[B] -> GSI 10 (level, low) -> IRQ 10 ohci1394: fw-host0: OHCI-1394 1.1 (PCI): IRQ=[10] MMIO=[dc004000-dc0047ff] Max Packet=[2048] usb 3-1: new full speed USB device using ohci_hcd and address 2 usb 3-2: new full speed USB device using ohci_hcd and address 3 usb 3-2: device descriptor read/64, error -110 usb 3-2: device descriptor read/64, error -110 usb 3-2: new full speed USB device using ohci_hcd and address 4 usb 3-2: device descriptor read/64, error -110 ieee1394: Host added: ID:BUS[0-01:1023] GUID[00023c00210900fa] usb 3-2: device descriptor read/64, error -110 ACPI: Power Button (FF) [PWRF] usb 3-2: new full speed USB device using ohci_hcd and address 5 ibm_acpi: ec object not found md: Autodetecting RAID arrays. md: autorun ... md: ... autorun DONE. usb 3-2: device not accepting address 5, error -110 cdrom: open failed. hde: No disk in drive usb 3-2: new full speed USB device using ohci_hcd and address 6 cdrom: open failed. cdrom: open failed. usb 3-2: device not accepting address 6, error -110 usb 3-3: new full speed USB device using ohci_hcd and address 7 EXT3 FS on hda1, internal journal SELinux: initialized (dev tmpfs, type tmpfs), uses transition SIDs kjournald starting. Commit interval 5 seconds EXT3 FS on hda5, internal journal EXT3-fs: mounted filesystem with ordered data mode. SELinux: initialized (dev hda5, type ext3), uses xattr kjournald starting. Commit interval 5 seconds EXT3 FS on hdb1, internal journal EXT3-fs: mounted filesystem with ordered data mode. SELinux: initialized (dev hdb1, type ext3), uses xattr kjournald starting. Commit interval 5 seconds EXT3 FS on hdb2, internal journal EXT3-fs: mounted filesystem with ordered data mode. SELinux: initialized (dev hdb2, type ext3), uses xattr kjournald starting. Commit interval 5 seconds EXT3 FS on hdg1, internal journal EXT3-fs: mounted filesystem with ordered data mode. SELinux: initialized (dev hdg1, type ext3), uses xattr kjournald starting. Commit interval 5 seconds EXT3 FS on hdg2, internal journal EXT3-fs: mounted filesystem with ordered data mode. SELinux: initialized (dev hdg2, type ext3), uses xattr kjournald starting. Commit interval 5 seconds EXT3 FS on hdh1, internal journal EXT3-fs: mounted filesystem with ordered data mode. SELinux: initialized (dev hdh1, type ext3), uses xattr SELinux: initialized (dev ramfs, type ramfs), uses genfs_contexts audit(1110572085.251:0): avc: denied { read } for pid=1476 exe=/sbin/ifconfig path=/init dev=rootfs ino=12 scontext=user_u:system_r:ifconfig_t tcontext=system_u:object_r:root_t tclass=file NET: Registered protocol family 10 Disabled Privacy Extensions on device c03e9640(lo) IPv6 over IPv4 tunneling driver Initializing USB Mass Storage driver... scsi1 : SCSI emulation for USB Mass Storage devices usbcore: registered new driver usb-storage USB Mass Storage support registered. usb-storage: device found at 7 usb-storage: waiting for device to settle before scanning drivers/usb/class/usblp.c: usblp0: USB Bidirectional printer dev 2 if 0 alt 0 proto 2 vid 0x03F0 pid 0x3004 usbcore: registered new driver usblp drivers/usb/class/usblp.c: v0.13: USB Printer Device Class driver audit(1110572105.287:0): avc: denied { execmod } for pid=1477 comm=X path=/usr/lib/tls/libnvidia-tls.so.1.0.6629 dev=hda5 ino=265639 scontext=user_u:system_r:initrc_t tcontext=system_u:object_r:lib_t tclass=file audit(1110572105.885:0): avc: denied { execmod } for pid=1477 comm=X path=/usr/X11R6/lib/modules/extensions/libglx.so.1.0.6629 dev=hda5 ino=3205226 scontext=user_u:system_r:initrc_t tcontext=root:object_r:lib_t tclass=file Adding 294904k swap on /dev/VolGroup00/LogVol01. Priority:-1 extents:1 Adding 1566328k swap on /dev/hda3. Priority:-2 extents:1 SELinux: initialized (dev binfmt_misc, type binfmt_misc), uses genfs_contexts ip_tables: (C) 2000-2002 Netfilter core team ip_conntrack version 2.1 (8191 buckets, 65528 max) - 272 bytes per conntrack eth0: link up, 100Mbps, full-duplex, lpa 0x45E1 audit(1110572117.067:0): avc: denied { read } for pid=3432 exe=/sbin/dhclient name=dhclient-eth0.leases dev=hda1 ino=1750855 scontext=user_u:system_r:dhcpc_t tcontext=system_u:object_r:var_lib_t tclass=file audit(1110572117.067:0): avc: denied { write } for pid=3432 exe=/sbin/dhclient name=dhclient-eth0.leases dev=hda1 ino=1750855 scontext=user_u:system_r:dhcpc_t tcontext=system_u:object_r:var_lib_t tclass=file audit(1110572117.068:0): avc: denied { getattr } for pid=3432 exe=/sbin/dhclient path=/var/lib/dhcp/dhclient-eth0.leases dev=hda1 ino=1750855 scontext=user_u:system_r:dhcpc_t tcontext=system_u:object_r:var_lib_t tclass=file audit(1110572117.070:0): avc: denied { read } for pid=3433 exe=/bin/bash name=libtermcap.so.2.0.8 dev=hda1 ino=686937 scontext=user_u:system_r:dhcpc_t tcontext=system_u:object_r:file_t tclass=file audit(1110572117.070:0): avc: denied { getattr } for pid=3433 exe=/bin/bash path=/lib/libtermcap.so.2.0.8 dev=hda1 ino=686937 scontext=user_u:system_r:dhcpc_t tcontext=system_u:object_r:file_t tclass=file audit(1110572117.070:0): avc: denied { execute } for pid=3433 comm=dhclient-script path=/lib/libtermcap.so.2.0.8 dev=hda1 ino=686937 scontext=user_u:system_r:dhcpc_t tcontext=system_u:object_r:file_t tclass=file audit(1110572121.389:0): avc: denied { append } for pid=3520 exe=/sbin/syslogd name=messages dev=hda1 ino=1750996 scontext=user_u:system_r:syslogd_t tcontext=system_u:object_r:file_t tclass=file audit(1110572121.389:0): avc: denied { ioctl } for pid=3520 exe=/sbin/syslogd path=/var/log/messages dev=hda1 ino=1750996 scontext=user_u:system_r:syslogd_t tcontext=system_u:object_r:file_t tclass=file eth0: no IPv6 routers present audit(1110572129.254:0): avc: denied { read write } for pid=3697 exe=/usr/sbin/cupsd name=error_log dev=hda1 ino=1750992 scontext=user_u:system_r:cupsd_t tcontext=system_u:object_r:file_t tclass=file audit(1110572129.254:0): avc: denied { setattr } for pid=3697 exe=/usr/sbin/cupsd name=error_log dev=hda1 ino=1750992 scontext=user_u:system_r:cupsd_t tcontext=system_u:object_r:file_t tclass=file audit(1110572129.679:0): avc: denied { getattr } for pid=3698 exe=/bin/bash path=/lib/libtermcap.so.2.0.8 dev=hda1 ino=686937 scontext=user_u:system_r:cupsd_t tcontext=system_u:object_r:file_t tclass=file audit(1110572129.679:0): avc: denied { execute } for pid=3698 comm=sh path=/lib/libtermcap.so.2.0.8 dev=hda1 ino=686937 scontext=user_u:system_r:cupsd_t tcontext=system_u:object_r:file_t tclass=file parport: PnPBIOS parport detected. parport0: PC-style at 0x378 (0x778), irq 7 [PCSPP,TRISTATE] lp0: using parport0 (interrupt-driven). lp0: console ready usb 3-3: reset full speed USB device using ohci_hcd and address 7 usb 3-3: hald timed out on ep0in usb 3-3: hald timed out on ep0in usb 3-3: hald timed out on ep0in scsi: Device offlined - not ready after error recovery: host 1 channel 0 id 0 lun 0 usb-storage: device scan complete usb 3-3: usbfs: USBDEVFS_CONTROL failed cmd sane-find-scann rqt 128 rq 6 len 2 ret -110 usb 3-3: usbfs: USBDEVFS_CONTROL failed cmd sane-find-scann rqt 128 rq 6 len 2 ret -110 usb 3-3: usbfs: USBDEVFS_CONTROL failed cmd sane-find-scann rqt 128 rq 6 len 2 ret -110 usb 3-3: usbfs: USBDEVFS_CONTROL failed cmd sane-find-scann rqt 128 rq 6 len 2 ret -110 One other odd thing is that if I double click on the "computer" icon, none of my CD, DVD or Zip drives show and inserting a disc into the drive is not auto-mounting, so the problem may be elsewhere. TTFN Paul -- "I like blinking me" - Helen, Big Brother 2 contestant -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part URL: From david at fubar.dk Fri Mar 11 21:05:30 2005 From: david at fubar.dk (David Zeuthen) Date: Fri, 11 Mar 2005 16:05:30 -0500 Subject: USB card reader gone again In-Reply-To: <1110574131.4974.12.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <1110573132.4974.7.camel@localhost.localdomain> <20050311203628.GD4185@redhat.com> <1110574131.4974.12.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <1110575131.4203.93.camel@daxter.boston.redhat.com> On Fri, 2005-03-11 at 20:48 +0000, Paul wrote: > usb 3-3: reset full speed USB device using ohci_hcd and address 7 > usb 3-3: hald timed out on ep0in > usb 3-3: hald timed out on ep0in > usb 3-3: hald timed out on ep0in Here I can see that you're running hal 0.4.7, right? > scsi: Device offlined - not ready after error recovery: host 1 channel 0 > id 0 lun 0 > usb-storage: device scan complete usb-storage driver is broken; news at 11. > One other odd thing is that if I double click on the "computer" icon, > none of my CD, DVD or Zip drives show and inserting a disc into the > drive is not auto-mounting, so the problem may be elsewhere. Problem is that the kernel puts hald in state D so most things related to auto configuration of storage devices in user space just stops to work. This is sort-of "fixed" in hal 0.5.0 (which just entered Rawhide) since we do fs probing etc. in separate processes. Unplugging/replugging the reader with the new hald might fix up things but only on the surface since hald child processes might be hanging in state D. YMMV, but it works for me and a USB 2.0 card reader that exhibits the same behavior - there's only so many hoops we can jump through to work around broken drivers. Cheers, David From davej at redhat.com Fri Mar 11 21:04:22 2005 From: davej at redhat.com (Dave Jones) Date: Fri, 11 Mar 2005 16:04:22 -0500 Subject: USB card reader gone again In-Reply-To: <1110574131.4974.12.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <1110573132.4974.7.camel@localhost.localdomain> <20050311203628.GD4185@redhat.com> <1110574131.4974.12.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <20050311210422.GF4185@redhat.com> On Fri, Mar 11, 2005 at 08:48:51PM +0000, Paul wrote: > usb 3-3: reset full speed USB device using ohci_hcd and address 7 > usb 3-3: hald timed out on ep0in > usb 3-3: hald timed out on ep0in > usb 3-3: hald timed out on ep0in > scsi: Device offlined - not ready after error recovery: host 1 channel 0 id 0 lun 0 So, this is why your card reader doesn't show up. Why it does this is a mystery to me right now. Could you file this in bugzilla please ? Out of curiousity, can you try the 2.6.11 kernel at http://people.redhat.com/davej/kernels/Fedora/FC3/RPMS.kernel/ and let me know if that has the same problem ? You'll need to install it with rpm --oldpackage probably. Dave From m.a.young at durham.ac.uk Fri Mar 11 21:22:09 2005 From: m.a.young at durham.ac.uk (M A Young) Date: Fri, 11 Mar 2005 21:22:09 +0000 (GMT) Subject: A more efficient up2date service using binary diffs Message-ID: On Thu, 10 Mar 2005, Jeff Johnson wrote: > M A Young wrote: > >That is very interesting - I hadn't seen it before, though I would imagine > >the rpms have to be a bit bigger and the bandwidth increases over the > >minimum possible. I don't think the option is being used on current rpms. > > > > You would be wrong. Are you saying this option is turned on for current Fedora/RedHat rpms because I made a quick comparison between two FC3 update rpms, which suggested it wasn't. Michael Young From paul at all-the-johnsons.co.uk Fri Mar 11 21:22:42 2005 From: paul at all-the-johnsons.co.uk (Paul) Date: Fri, 11 Mar 2005 21:22:42 +0000 Subject: USB card reader gone again In-Reply-To: <1110575131.4203.93.camel@daxter.boston.redhat.com> References: <1110573132.4974.7.camel@localhost.localdomain> <20050311203628.GD4185@redhat.com> <1110574131.4974.12.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1110575131.4203.93.camel@daxter.boston.redhat.com> Message-ID: <1110576163.4974.17.camel@localhost.localdomain> Hi, > > usb 3-3: reset full speed USB device using ohci_hcd and address 7 > > usb 3-3: hald timed out on ep0in > > usb 3-3: hald timed out on ep0in > > usb 3-3: hald timed out on ep0in > > Here I can see that you're running hal 0.4.7, right? Nope. rpm -q hal hal-0.5.0-3 I did a large update this afternoon (been in hospital for a week) > > scsi: Device offlined - not ready after error recovery: host 1 channel 0 > > id 0 lun 0 > > usb-storage: device scan complete > > > > usb-storage driver is broken; news at 11. Ouch. It explains this problem. TTFN Paul -- "I like blinking me" - Helen, Big Brother 2 contestant -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part URL: From paul at all-the-johnsons.co.uk Fri Mar 11 21:23:46 2005 From: paul at all-the-johnsons.co.uk (Paul) Date: Fri, 11 Mar 2005 21:23:46 +0000 Subject: USB card reader gone again In-Reply-To: <20050311210422.GF4185@redhat.com> References: <1110573132.4974.7.camel@localhost.localdomain> <20050311203628.GD4185@redhat.com> <1110574131.4974.12.camel@localhost.localdomain> <20050311210422.GF4185@redhat.com> Message-ID: <1110576226.4974.19.camel@localhost.localdomain> Hi, > > usb 3-3: reset full speed USB device using ohci_hcd and address 7 > > usb 3-3: hald timed out on ep0in > > usb 3-3: hald timed out on ep0in > > usb 3-3: hald timed out on ep0in > > scsi: Device offlined - not ready after error recovery: host 1 channel 0 id 0 lun 0 > > So, this is why your card reader doesn't show up. > Why it does this is a mystery to me right now. > Could you file this in bugzilla please ? Consider it done. > Out of curiousity, can you try the 2.6.11 kernel at > http://people.redhat.com/davej/kernels/Fedora/FC3/RPMS.kernel/ > and let me know if that has the same problem ? > You'll need to install it with rpm --oldpackage probably. Downloading it now. Should know in the next 10 minutes or so. TTFN Paul -- "I like blinking me" - Helen, Big Brother 2 contestant -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part URL: From david at fubar.dk Fri Mar 11 21:30:57 2005 From: david at fubar.dk (David Zeuthen) Date: Fri, 11 Mar 2005 16:30:57 -0500 Subject: USB card reader gone again In-Reply-To: <1110576163.4974.17.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <1110573132.4974.7.camel@localhost.localdomain> <20050311203628.GD4185@redhat.com> <1110574131.4974.12.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1110575131.4203.93.camel@daxter.boston.redhat.com> <1110576163.4974.17.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <1110576657.12842.3.camel@daxter.boston.redhat.com> On Fri, 2005-03-11 at 21:22 +0000, Paul wrote: > Hi, > > > > usb 3-3: reset full speed USB device using ohci_hcd and address 7 > > > usb 3-3: hald timed out on ep0in > > > usb 3-3: hald timed out on ep0in > > > usb 3-3: hald timed out on ep0in > > > > Here I can see that you're running hal 0.4.7, right? > > Nope. > > rpm -q hal > hal-0.5.0-3 > That's interesting, this shouldn't happen - please open a bug on hal for this and attach the output of 'hald --daemon=no --verbose=yes --retain-privileges'; and after it breaks, the output of 'ps aux|grep hald'. You probably need disable the haldaemon service before this with '/sbin/chkconfig --level 5 haldaemon off' and then reboot. Thanks, David From n3npq at nc.rr.com Fri Mar 11 23:08:16 2005 From: n3npq at nc.rr.com (Jeff Johnson) Date: Fri, 11 Mar 2005 18:08:16 -0500 Subject: A more efficient up2date service using binary diffs In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <423224E0.3000005@nc.rr.com> M A Young wrote: >On Thu, 10 Mar 2005, Jeff Johnson wrote: > > > >>M A Young wrote: >> >> >>>That is very interesting - I hadn't seen it before, though I would imagine >>>the rpms have to be a bit bigger and the bandwidth increases over the >>>minimum possible. I don't think the option is being used on current rpms. >>> >>> >>> >>You would be wrong. >> >> >Are you saying this option is turned on for current Fedora/RedHat rpms >because I made a quick comparison between two FC3 update rpms, which >suggested it wasn't. > > This patch https://svn.uhulinux.hu/packages/dev/zlib/patches/02-rsync.patch is in rpm-4.4.1 and on by default. If the payloads in FC4 are not rsyncable right now, then it's because beehive is using an older version of rpm ... checking ... yep, current rpm payloads should be rsync ready: $ rpm -q --qf '%{rpmversion}\n' perl 4.4.1 It's early yet, will probably take a while longer to populate a significant number of packages with rsyncable payloads. And someone other than me will have to add the "fuzzy" patch (or equivalent) to rsync, and to document that, indeed, there is a significant win to rsync ready *.rpm payloads. 73 de Jeff From paul at all-the-johnsons.co.uk Fri Mar 11 22:24:14 2005 From: paul at all-the-johnsons.co.uk (Paul) Date: Fri, 11 Mar 2005 22:24:14 +0000 Subject: USB card reader gone again In-Reply-To: <20050311210422.GF4185@redhat.com> References: <1110573132.4974.7.camel@localhost.localdomain> <20050311203628.GD4185@redhat.com> <1110574131.4974.12.camel@localhost.localdomain> <20050311210422.GF4185@redhat.com> Message-ID: <1110579854.4991.1.camel@localhost.localdomain> Hi, > Out of curiousity, can you try the 2.6.11 kernel at > http://people.redhat.com/davej/kernels/Fedora/FC3/RPMS.kernel/ > and let me know if that has the same problem ? Yep. Get the same problem. I have noticed that hald is failing to start on boot up, but I can start it from a terminal window (this is using your version of the kernel, not the rawhide version). However, the USB card reader still doesn't appear - everything else does though (CD/DVD and Zip) TTFN Paul -- "I like blinking me" - Helen, Big Brother 2 contestant -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part URL: From sopwith at redhat.com Fri Mar 11 22:31:46 2005 From: sopwith at redhat.com (Elliot Lee) Date: Fri, 11 Mar 2005 17:31:46 -0500 Subject: Test1 delayed until Tuesday Message-ID: <200503112231.j2BMVk13021420@ostrich-deluxe.devel.redhat.com> Hi hackers, Due to a respin and a resulting delay in making available to mirrors, Test1 will be public on Tuesday the 15th at earliest. Sorry for the delay - hope you try it out nonetheless. Best, -- Elliot From david at fubar.dk Fri Mar 11 22:36:47 2005 From: david at fubar.dk (David Zeuthen) Date: Fri, 11 Mar 2005 17:36:47 -0500 Subject: USB card reader gone again In-Reply-To: <1110579854.4991.1.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <1110573132.4974.7.camel@localhost.localdomain> <20050311203628.GD4185@redhat.com> <1110574131.4974.12.camel@localhost.localdomain> <20050311210422.GF4185@redhat.com> <1110579854.4991.1.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <1110580607.4862.3.camel@daxter.boston.redhat.com> On Fri, 2005-03-11 at 22:24 +0000, Paul wrote: > Hi, > > > Out of curiousity, can you try the 2.6.11 kernel at > > http://people.redhat.com/davej/kernels/Fedora/FC3/RPMS.kernel/ > > and let me know if that has the same problem ? > > Yep. Get the same problem. > > I have noticed that hald is failing to start on boot up, but I can start > it from a terminal window (this is using your version of the kernel, not > the rawhide version). However, the USB card reader still doesn't appear > - everything else does though (CD/DVD and Zip) Few questions: 1. does hald appear to work when starting from a terminal window? E.g. can you run lshal or hal-device-manager? (remember to run it as root with --daemon=no --verbose=yes --retain-privileges) 2. Is the situation the same with the 2.6.11-1.1177_FC4 kernel you original had problems with? In either case, please file a bug so we can take the discussion there. David From kyrre at solution-forge.net Fri Mar 11 22:50:29 2005 From: kyrre at solution-forge.net (Kyrre Ness Sjobak) Date: Fri, 11 Mar 2005 23:50:29 +0100 Subject: A more efficient up2date service using binary diffs In-Reply-To: <1110483955.19164.26.camel@opus.phy.duke.edu> References: <422F17B5.5070402@galway.net> <1cef3e95050309082839ba4beb@mail.gmail.com> <1110391094.3448.18.camel@localhost.localdomain> <422F3ACE.7010309@math.unl.edu> <1110421202.8126.12.camel@jellyfish.redfishdemo.com> <1cef3e9505031000145aa96c4a@mail.gmail.com> <1110444945.31871.145.camel@cutter> <1110472691.3447.2.camel@localhost.localdomain> <20050310171156.GG15009@angus.ind.WPI.EDU> <1110479506.3447.6.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1cef3e9505031010591c8c7591@mail.gmail.com> <1110483010.3447.10.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1110483095.19164.19.camel@opus.phy.duke.edu> <1110483241.3447.15.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1110483955.19164.26.camel@opus.phy.duke.edu> Message-ID: <1110575310.5618.6.camel@localhost.localdomain> tor, 10.03.2005 kl. 20.45 skrev seth vidal: > > Yes. But standards are a great thing, and yum is good, on its way to > > greatness. All it really needs (imo...) is a good gui and some speedup. > > speedup? Have you tried yum from rawhide? the sqlite backend makes > things REALLY light memory-wise and once you do the first cache of the > metadata the run time speed is fantastic. > > > -sv Really? As fast as apt (couldn't resist...)? (When) will it hit FC3-stable? Is it fc3-compatible (i don't have any rawhide machines lying around, sorry), so i can just yum it in from rawhide to my fc3-box? If so - great work! Can't wait to test it! :) Kyrre From paul at all-the-johnsons.co.uk Fri Mar 11 22:52:12 2005 From: paul at all-the-johnsons.co.uk (Paul) Date: Fri, 11 Mar 2005 22:52:12 +0000 Subject: USB card reader gone again In-Reply-To: <1110580607.4862.3.camel@daxter.boston.redhat.com> References: <1110573132.4974.7.camel@localhost.localdomain> <20050311203628.GD4185@redhat.com> <1110574131.4974.12.camel@localhost.localdomain> <20050311210422.GF4185@redhat.com> <1110579854.4991.1.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1110580607.4862.3.camel@daxter.boston.redhat.com> Message-ID: <1110581533.4728.4.camel@localhost.localdomain> Hi, > Few questions: > > 1. does hald appear to work when starting from a terminal window? E.g. > can you run lshal or hal-device-manager? (remember to run it as root > with --daemon=no --verbose=yes --retain-privileges) Can't find either lshal or hal-device-manager on my system so can't say. > 2. Is the situation the same with the 2.6.11-1.1177_FC4 kernel you > original had problems with? Yes. I'll open a bugzilla report on this (hal) rather than the kernel as this looks more likely given my devices reappear after running haldaemon from /etc/init.d TTFN Paul -- "I like blinking me" - Helen, Big Brother 2 contestant -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part URL: From david at fubar.dk Fri Mar 11 22:58:17 2005 From: david at fubar.dk (David Zeuthen) Date: Fri, 11 Mar 2005 17:58:17 -0500 Subject: USB card reader gone again In-Reply-To: <1110581533.4728.4.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <1110573132.4974.7.camel@localhost.localdomain> <20050311203628.GD4185@redhat.com> <1110574131.4974.12.camel@localhost.localdomain> <20050311210422.GF4185@redhat.com> <1110579854.4991.1.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1110580607.4862.3.camel@daxter.boston.redhat.com> <1110581533.4728.4.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <1110581898.4862.9.camel@daxter.boston.redhat.com> On Fri, 2005-03-11 at 22:52 +0000, Paul wrote: > Hi, > > > Few questions: > > > > 1. does hald appear to work when starting from a terminal window? E.g. > > can you run lshal or hal-device-manager? (remember to run it as root > > with --daemon=no --verbose=yes --retain-privileges) > > Can't find either lshal or hal-device-manager on my system so can't say. Hmmm [davidz at daxter hal]$ rpm -qf /usr/bin/lshal hal-0.5.0.cvs20050310-1 [davidz at daxter hal]$ rpm -qf /usr/bin/hal-device-manager hal-gnome-0.5.0.cvs20050310-1 > > > 2. Is the situation the same with the 2.6.11-1.1177_FC4 kernel you > > original had problems with? > > Yes. > > I'll open a bugzilla report on this (hal) rather than the kernel as this > looks more likely given my devices reappear after running haldaemon > from /etc/init.d Don't get your hopes high, it won't fix the original problem with usb-storage getting busted, but hald should cope with that. Thanks, David From paul at all-the-johnsons.co.uk Fri Mar 11 23:04:06 2005 From: paul at all-the-johnsons.co.uk (Paul) Date: Fri, 11 Mar 2005 23:04:06 +0000 Subject: USB card reader gone again In-Reply-To: <1110581898.4862.9.camel@daxter.boston.redhat.com> References: <1110573132.4974.7.camel@localhost.localdomain> <20050311203628.GD4185@redhat.com> <1110574131.4974.12.camel@localhost.localdomain> <20050311210422.GF4185@redhat.com> <1110579854.4991.1.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1110580607.4862.3.camel@daxter.boston.redhat.com> <1110581533.4728.4.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1110581898.4862.9.camel@daxter.boston.redhat.com> Message-ID: <1110582247.4728.7.camel@localhost.localdomain> Hi, > > Can't find either lshal or hal-device-manager on my system so can't say. > > Hmmm > > [davidz at daxter hal]$ rpm -qf /usr/bin/lshal > hal-0.5.0.cvs20050310-1 hal-0.5.0-3 > [davidz at daxter hal]$ rpm -qf /usr/bin/hal-device-manager > hal-gnome-0.5.0.cvs20050310-1 Doesn't exist at all on this box (/usr/bin/hal-device-manager not found). Has it been chucked out of the rawhide rpm? > > I'll open a bugzilla report on this (hal) rather than the kernel as this > > looks more likely given my devices reappear after running haldaemon > > from /etc/init.d > > Don't get your hopes high, it won't fix the original problem with > usb-storage getting busted, but hald should cope with that. Thanks. TTFN Paul -- "I like blinking me" - Helen, Big Brother 2 contestant -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part URL: From david at fubar.dk Fri Mar 11 23:10:07 2005 From: david at fubar.dk (David Zeuthen) Date: Fri, 11 Mar 2005 18:10:07 -0500 Subject: USB card reader gone again In-Reply-To: <1110582247.4728.7.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <1110573132.4974.7.camel@localhost.localdomain> <20050311203628.GD4185@redhat.com> <1110574131.4974.12.camel@localhost.localdomain> <20050311210422.GF4185@redhat.com> <1110579854.4991.1.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1110580607.4862.3.camel@daxter.boston.redhat.com> <1110581533.4728.4.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1110581898.4862.9.camel@daxter.boston.redhat.com> <1110582247.4728.7.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <1110582607.4862.18.camel@daxter.boston.redhat.com> On Fri, 2005-03-11 at 23:04 +0000, Paul wrote: > > [davidz at daxter hal]$ rpm -qf /usr/bin/lshal > > hal-0.5.0.cvs20050310-1 > > hal-0.5.0-3 Well, lshal have been in the hal rpms since the very first version so it's definitely also in hal-0.5.0-3 - I just checked and it indeed is. > > [davidz at daxter hal]$ rpm -qf /usr/bin/hal-device-manager > > hal-gnome-0.5.0.cvs20050310-1 > > Doesn't exist at all on this box (/usr/bin/hal-device-manager not > found). Has it been chucked out of the rawhide rpm? Nah, you need to install the hal-gnome RPM yourself - it's not in the default install :-) > > > I'll open a bugzilla report on this (hal) rather than the kernel as this > > > looks more likely given my devices reappear after running haldaemon > > > from /etc/init.d > > > > Don't get your hopes high, it won't fix the original problem with > > usb-storage getting busted, but hald should cope with that. > > Thanks. Thanks, David From Matt_Domsch at dell.com Fri Mar 11 23:16:48 2005 From: Matt_Domsch at dell.com (Matt Domsch) Date: Fri, 11 Mar 2005 17:16:48 -0600 Subject: rawhide report: 20050310 changes In-Reply-To: <20050311150457.7132159f@nausicaa.camperquake.de> References: <200503101237.j2ACbvWx017272@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <20050310162914.GE30940@ip68-4-98-123.oc.oc.cox.net> <20050310172126.GC24517@nostromo.devel.redhat.com> <1110475954.6291.118.camel@laptopd505.fenrus.org> <604aa7910503100948705e7baf@mail.gmail.com> <42309CBA.6060708@redhat.com> <20050310232552.GA27026@ti64.telemetry-investments.com> <20050311150457.7132159f@nausicaa.camperquake.de> Message-ID: <20050311231648.GA29498@lists.us.dell.com> On Fri, Mar 11, 2005 at 03:04:57PM +0100, Ralf Ertzinger wrote: > Hi. > > "Bill Rugolsky Jr." wrote: > > > Is there some obvious reason why DKMS, > > > > http://linux.dell.com/projects.shtml#dkms > > > > is an _unacceptable_ starting point? > > It would require to make the development package a requirement for > every install. This is false. DKMS can work equally well with tarballs/RPMs of prebuilt kernel modules, or (if you've got a compiler) it builds from source for the kernels you've got installed. > Currently the desktop install comes without a compiler. And in the Dell factory install process, even though the compiler may get installed, we definitely don't want it to have to run. Hence the tarballs/RPMs containing prebuilt modules. I agree it would be nice for the Fedora kernel build system to automatically generate RPMs containing prebuilt modules for each new kernel that comes out. In this case, the build system would simply invoke DKMS {build, mkrpm} commands to accomplish this, for each kernel version / architecture / extra module. Not really all that tricky, it's what Dell does for our extra modules often. Thanks, Matt -- Matt Domsch Software Architect Dell Linux Solutions linux.dell.com & www.dell.com/linux Linux on Dell mailing lists @ http://lists.us.dell.com From Matt_Domsch at dell.com Fri Mar 11 23:18:20 2005 From: Matt_Domsch at dell.com (Matt Domsch) Date: Fri, 11 Mar 2005 17:18:20 -0600 Subject: rawhide report: 20050310 changes In-Reply-To: References: <200503101237.j2ACbvWx017272@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <20050310162914.GE30940@ip68-4-98-123.oc.oc.cox.net> <20050310172126.GC24517@nostromo.devel.redhat.com> <1110475954.6291.118.camel@laptopd505.fenrus.org> <604aa7910503100948705e7baf@mail.gmail.com> <42309CBA.6060708@redhat.com> <20050310232552.GA27026@ti64.telemetry-investments.com> <20050311150457.7132159f@nausicaa.camperquake.de> Message-ID: <20050311231820.GB29498@lists.us.dell.com> On Fri, Mar 11, 2005 at 11:18:56AM -0600, Jason L Tibbitts III wrote: > I guess the question is whether DKMS can be so modified and if so > whether the result would be better than whatever other solutions > people have come up with. # dkms build -m foo -v version -k some_kernel_version -a some_arch # (repeat for different -k -a values) # dkms mkrpm -m foo -v version [ -k some_kernel_version -a some_arch ... ] Thanks, Matt -- Matt Domsch Software Architect Dell Linux Solutions linux.dell.com & www.dell.com/linux Linux on Dell mailing lists @ http://lists.us.dell.com From perbj at stanford.edu Sat Mar 12 00:45:31 2005 From: perbj at stanford.edu (Per Bjornsson) Date: Fri, 11 Mar 2005 16:45:31 -0800 Subject: A more efficient up2date service using binary diffs In-Reply-To: <1110575310.5618.6.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <422F17B5.5070402@galway.net> <1cef3e95050309082839ba4beb@mail.gmail.com> <1110391094.3448.18.camel@localhost.localdomain> <422F3ACE.7010309@math.unl.edu> <1110421202.8126.12.camel@jellyfish.redfishdemo.com> <1cef3e9505031000145aa96c4a@mail.gmail.com> <1110444945.31871.145.camel@cutter> <1110472691.3447.2.camel@localhost.localdomain> <20050310171156.GG15009@angus.ind.WPI.EDU> <1110479506.3447.6.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1cef3e9505031010591c8c7591@mail.gmail.com> <1110483010.3447.10.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1110483095.19164.19.camel@opus.phy.duke.edu> <1110483241.3447.15.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1110483955.19164.26.camel@opus.phy.duke.edu> <1110575310.5618.6.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <1110588331.5215.26.camel@localhost.localdomain> On Fri, 2005-03-11 at 23:50 +0100, Kyrre Ness Sjobak wrote: > Really? As fast as apt (couldn't resist...)? (When) will it hit > FC3-stable? Unlikely I think, if nothing else because the speed improvements to some extent come from using an SQLite database backend, and SQLite isn't in FC3. > Is it fc3-compatible (i don't have any rawhide machines > lying around, sorry), so i can just yum it in from rawhide to my > fc3-box? Don't do that! Well, unless you want an enormously large chunk of Rawhide on your box. Rawhide yum is built against Python 2.4 while the Python version in FC3 is 2.3. Thus if you update Yum you'll pull in Python 2.4 which will in turn pull in everything written in Python which will in turn pull in hordes of other stuff. (This is assuming that the deps are all set up right; otherwise you might end up with a bunch of broken crap instead.) Since you aren't already running rawhide on the box, I gather that this really isn't what you want! Sorry to be the bearer of bad news, Per -- Per Bjornsson Ph.D. Candidate, Department of Applied Physics, Stanford University From jspaleta at gmail.com Sat Mar 12 02:02:37 2005 From: jspaleta at gmail.com (Jeff Spaleta) Date: Fri, 11 Mar 2005 21:02:37 -0500 Subject: A more efficient up2date service using binary diffs In-Reply-To: <1110588331.5215.26.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <422F17B5.5070402@galway.net> <20050310171156.GG15009@angus.ind.WPI.EDU> <1110479506.3447.6.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1cef3e9505031010591c8c7591@mail.gmail.com> <1110483010.3447.10.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1110483095.19164.19.camel@opus.phy.duke.edu> <1110483241.3447.15.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1110483955.19164.26.camel@opus.phy.duke.edu> <1110575310.5618.6.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1110588331.5215.26.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <604aa79105031118024ff528b4@mail.gmail.com> On Fri, 11 Mar 2005 16:45:31 -0800, Per Bjornsson wrote: > Don't do that! Well, unless you want an enormously large chunk of > Rawhide on your box. Rawhide yum is built against Python 2.4 while the > Python version in FC3 is 2.3. Thus if you update Yum you'll pull in > Python 2.4 which will in turn pull in everything written in Python which > will in turn pull in hordes of other stuff. (This is assuming that the > deps are all set up right; otherwise you might end up with a bunch of > broken crap instead.) Since you aren't already running rawhide on the > box, I gather that this really isn't what you want! src.rpms are provided for a reason..... rebuilding the python based packages with a build environment that has python2.3 instead of python2.4 will place python modules accordingly. And I'm unware of any python2.4 specific fixes in the yum codebase that would prevent a rebuild from working. You can definitely rebuild the sqlite3, python-sqlite3, python-urlgrabber and yum packages from rawhide on fc3 without pulling in any other rawhide components. And so far on my fc3 with my personal rebuilds of these rawhide packages i've not seen any obvious problems with yum operation. -jef"mmmmm all you can eat meat on swords mmmmm... i should have been born brazilian"spaleta From mricon at gmail.com Sat Mar 12 02:21:55 2005 From: mricon at gmail.com (Konstantin Ryabitsev) Date: Fri, 11 Mar 2005 21:21:55 -0500 Subject: A more efficient up2date service using binary diffs In-Reply-To: <1110588331.5215.26.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <422F17B5.5070402@galway.net> <20050310171156.GG15009@angus.ind.WPI.EDU> <1110479506.3447.6.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1cef3e9505031010591c8c7591@mail.gmail.com> <1110483010.3447.10.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1110483095.19164.19.camel@opus.phy.duke.edu> <1110483241.3447.15.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1110483955.19164.26.camel@opus.phy.duke.edu> <1110575310.5618.6.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1110588331.5215.26.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: On Fri, 11 Mar 2005 16:45:31 -0800, Per Bjornsson wrote: > Don't do that! Well, unless you want an enormously large chunk of > Rawhide on your box. Rawhide yum is built against Python 2.4 while the > Python version in FC3 is 2.3. Thus if you update Yum you'll pull in > Python 2.4 which will in turn pull in everything written in Python which > will in turn pull in hordes of other stuff. (This is assuming that the > deps are all set up right; otherwise you might end up with a bunch of > broken crap instead.) Since you aren't already running rawhide on the > box, I gather that this really isn't what you want! You can use the devel yum on FC3. The steps: 1. Enable FC3 extras in your yum repositories. 2. Run "yum install sqlite" 3. Get yum and urlgrabber SRPMs from rawhide 4. Rebuild 5. Install both 6. Enjoy speedy yum Note that it's slower than it used to be on initial metadata import, since it has to insert a whole bunch of data into an sqlite database, but then it flies. No more pickling/unpickling -- it's all instantly there. (One thing you may want to do is get rid of mirrorlists in your fedora-updates.repo, since they can be out of sync and cause metadata parsing each time. Pick a mirror and stick to it.) Regards, -- Konstantin Ryabitsev Zlotniks, INC From ivazquez at ivazquez.net Sat Mar 12 02:05:48 2005 From: ivazquez at ivazquez.net (Ignacio Vazquez-Abrams) Date: Fri, 11 Mar 2005 21:05:48 -0500 Subject: A more efficient up2date service using binary diffs In-Reply-To: <1110588331.5215.26.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <422F17B5.5070402@galway.net> <1cef3e95050309082839ba4beb@mail.gmail.com> <1110391094.3448.18.camel@localhost.localdomain> <422F3ACE.7010309@math.unl.edu> <1110421202.8126.12.camel@jellyfish.redfishdemo.com> <1cef3e9505031000145aa96c4a@mail.gmail.com> <1110444945.31871.145.camel@cutter> <1110472691.3447.2.camel@localhost.localdomain> <20050310171156.GG15009@angus.ind.WPI.EDU> <1110479506.3447.6.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1cef3e9505031010591c8c7591@mail.gmail.com> <1110483010.3447.10.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1110483095.19164.19.camel@opus.phy.duke.edu> <1110483241.3447.15.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1110483955.19164.26.camel@opus.phy.duke.edu> <1110575310.5618.6.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1110588331.5215.26.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <1110593148.9344.14.camel@ignacio.ignacio.lan> On Fri, 2005-03-11 at 16:45 -0800, Per Bjornsson wrote: > On Fri, 2005-03-11 at 23:50 +0100, Kyrre Ness Sjobak wrote: > > Is it fc3-compatible (i don't have any rawhide machines > > lying around, sorry), so i can just yum it in from rawhide to my > > fc3-box? > > Don't do that! Well, unless you want an enormously large chunk of > Rawhide on your box. Rawhide yum is built against Python 2.4 while the > Python version in FC3 is 2.3. Thus if you update Yum you'll pull in > Python 2.4 which will in turn pull in everything written in Python which > will in turn pull in hordes of other stuff. http://fedora.ivazquez.net/yum/3/i386/RPMS.alternatives/yum-2.3.1-0.iva.0.noarch.rpm The deps are in the same dir. -- Ignacio Vazquez-Abrams http://fedora.ivazquez.net/ -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part URL: From dag at wieers.com Sat Mar 12 06:30:13 2005 From: dag at wieers.com (Dag Wieers) Date: Sat, 12 Mar 2005 07:30:13 +0100 (CET) Subject: rawhide report: 20050310 changes In-Reply-To: <20050311231820.GB29498@lists.us.dell.com> References: <200503101237.j2ACbvWx017272@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <20050310162914.GE30940@ip68-4-98-123.oc.oc.cox.net> <20050310172126.GC24517@nostromo.devel.redhat.com> <1110475954.6291.118.camel@laptopd505.fenrus.org> <604aa7910503100948705e7baf@mail.gmail.com> <42309CBA.6060708@redhat.com> <20050310232552.GA27026@ti64.telemetry-investments.com> <20050311150457.7132159f@nausicaa.camperquake.de> <20050311231820.GB29498@lists.us.dell.com> Message-ID: On Fri, 11 Mar 2005, Matt Domsch wrote: > On Fri, Mar 11, 2005 at 11:18:56AM -0600, Jason L Tibbitts III wrote: > > I guess the question is whether DKMS can be so modified and if so > > whether the result would be better than whatever other solutions > > people have come up with. > > # dkms build -m foo -v version -k some_kernel_version -a some_arch > # (repeat for different -k -a values) And how does this work with the 2.6 kernel ? Is it capable to build for different architectures from the same sources without the need of touching them ? I thought that was the main problem nowadays with 2.6, building the kernel modules as user for different archs without having to copy parts or the whole kernel tree. If it can do that, I may have to integrate dkms into my buildsystem :) -- dag wieers, dag at wieers.com, http://dag.wieers.com/ -- [all I want is a warm bed and a kind word and unlimited power] From rodd at clarkson.id.au Sat Mar 12 11:30:11 2005 From: rodd at clarkson.id.au (Rodd Clarkson) Date: Sat, 12 Mar 2005 22:30:11 +1100 Subject: Test1 delayed until Tuesday In-Reply-To: <200503112231.j2BMVk13021420@ostrich-deluxe.devel.redhat.com> References: <200503112231.j2BMVk13021420@ostrich-deluxe.devel.redhat.com> Message-ID: <1110627011.3607.3.camel@goose> On Fri, 2005-03-11 at 17:31 -0500, Elliot Lee wrote: > Due to a respin and a resulting delay in making available to mirrors, > Test1 will be public on Tuesday the 15th at earliest. Sorry for the > delay - hope you try it out nonetheless. You can't be serious! The first two weeks delay of test1 was unacceptable, but this last day it beyond belief. I for one can assure you that I won't be downloading test1 as a result of this delay. Seriously, what sort of a half arsed outfit is this! Rodd PS. Before you flame me I'm kidding. 8-] From buildsys at redhat.com Sat Mar 12 12:25:45 2005 From: buildsys at redhat.com (Build System) Date: Sat, 12 Mar 2005 07:25:45 -0500 Subject: rawhide report: 20050312 changes Message-ID: <200503121225.j2CCPjam011676@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> New package libdbi-drivers Database-specific drivers for libdbi Removed package python-sqlite3 Removed package sqlite3 Updated Packages: bind-24:9.3.1-1_FC4 ------------------- * Fri Mar 11 2005 Jason Vas Dias - 24:9.3.1-1_FC4 - Upgrade to ISC BIND 9.3.1 (final release) released today. * Wed Mar 09 2005 Jason Vas Dias - 22.9.3.1rc1-5 - fix bug 150288: h_errno not being accessed / set correctly in libbind - add libbind man-pages from bind-8.4.6 * Mon Mar 07 2005 Jason Vas Dias - 22:9.3.1rc1-4 - Rebuild with gcc4 / glibc-2.3.4-14. eclipse-changelog-1:2.0.1_fc-17 ------------------------------- * Thu Mar 10 2005 Phil Muldoon 2.0.1-17 - Redo arches - Clean up BuildRequires gcc-4.0.0-0.33 -------------- * Fri Mar 11 2005 Jakub Jelinek 4.0.0-0.33 - update from gcc-4_0-branch - PRs c++/20142, c++/20186, c++/20208, c++/20375, libgcj/20389, rtl-opt/20412 - fix s390* reload issue (Ulrich Weigand, #150115) - fix CSE on hard registers with different modes (Zdenek Dvorak, #150115, PR middle-end/20249) - fix PR middle-end/18628 (Alexandre Oliva) - fix miscompilation of python (Alexandre Oliva, PR target/20126) - fix ICE when taking address of a member function in template (Kriang Lerdsuwanakij, PR c++/20381) - require exact libgcj = %{version}-%{release} in libgcj-src (#150800) - make sure src*.zip is left out of libgcj package gd-2.0.32-3 ----------- * Thu Mar 10 2005 Than Ngo 2.0.32-3 - move gdlib-config in devel * Wed Mar 02 2005 Phil Knirsch 2.0.32-2 - bump release and rebuild with gcc 4 * Wed Nov 03 2004 Phil Knirsch 2.0.32-1 - Update to 2.0.32 which includes all the security fixes glib2-2.6.3-4 ------------- * Fri Mar 11 2005 Matthias Clasen - 2.6.3-4 - Fix #150817 * Fri Mar 04 2005 Matthias Clasen - 2.6.3-3 - Rebuild gnome-python2-2.10.0-1 ---------------------- * Fri Mar 11 2005 John (J5) Palmieri - 2.10.0 - update to 2.10.0 - add a Requires line for gnome-python2-gnomevfs gphoto2-2.1.5-5 --------------- * Fri Mar 11 2005 Tim Waugh 2.1.5-5 - Rebuild with GCC 4 fixes. - Disable docs again until gtk-doc is fixed (GNOME bug #169087). * Fri Mar 04 2005 Tim Waugh - Re-enable docs. hal-0.5.0.cvs20050310-1 ----------------------- * Thu Mar 10 2005 David Zeuthen 0.5.0.cvs20050310-1 - Snapshot from CVS; should fix ACPI issues reported on f-d-l kbd-1.12-8 ---------- * Sat Mar 12 2005 Miloslav Trmac - 1.12-8 - Fix violation of C alias rules (#150440) libdbi-0.7.2-2 -------------- * Fri Mar 11 2005 Tom Lane 0.7.2-2 - Packaging improvements per discussion with sopwith. * Thu Mar 10 2005 Tom Lane 0.7.2-1 - Import new libdbi version, splitting libdbi-drivers into a separate SRPM so we can track new upstream packaging. lvm2-2.01.07-1.3 ---------------- * Tue Mar 08 2005 Alasdair Kergon - 2.01.07-1.3 * Tue Mar 08 2005 Alasdair Kergon - 2.01.07-1.2 * Tue Mar 08 2005 Alasdair Kergon - 2.01.07-1.1 - Suppress some new compiler messages. * Tue Mar 08 2005 Alasdair Kergon - 2.01.07-1.0 - Remove build directory from built-in path. - Extra /dev scanning required for clustered operation. magma-1.0-0.pre20.0.3 --------------------- mysql-4.1.10a-1 --------------- * Fri Mar 11 2005 Tom Lane 4.1.10a-1 - Update to MySQL 4.1.10a to fix security vulnerabilities (bz#150868, for CAN-2005-0711, and bz#150871 for CAN-2005-0709, CAN-2005-0710). nautilus-cd-burner-2.10.0-1 --------------------------- * Fri Mar 11 2005 John (J5) Palmieri 2.10.0-1 - Update to 2.10.0 - exclude s390 and s390x from build nut-2.0.1-1 ----------- * Thu Mar 10 2005 Than Ngo 2.0.1-1 - 2.0.1 - fix uninit local variable, #131773 postgresql-8.0.1-5 ------------------ * Fri Mar 11 2005 Tom Lane 8.0.1-5 - Remove unwanted rpath specification from pgtcl (bz#150649) * Wed Mar 02 2005 Tom Lane 8.0.1-4 - Attach Obsoletes: declarations for rh-postgresql to subpackages (bz#144435) - Make Requires: and Prereq: package linkages specify release not only version, as per recent mailing list discussion. * Tue Mar 01 2005 Tomas Mraz 8.0.1-3 - rebuild with openssl-0.9.7e python-sqlite-1.1.6-1 --------------------- rpm-4.4.1-7 ----------- * Wed Mar 09 2005 Jeff Johnson 4.4.1-7 - rebuild against renamed sqlite package (#149719). selinux-policy-strict-1.23.1-1 ------------------------------ * Fri Mar 11 2005 Dan Walsh 1.23.1-1 - Update from NSA - Fixes for fs_daemon - Add gift from Ivan Gyurdiev * Thu Mar 10 2005 Dan Walsh 1.22.1-3 - Add consoletype.te to targeted policy - Fix filecontext.homedirs handling * Thu Mar 10 2005 Dan Walsh 1.22.1-1 - Update to latest from NSA - Dontaudit pam_timestamp calls to utmp selinux-policy-targeted-1.23.1-1 -------------------------------- * Fri Mar 11 2005 Dan Walsh 1.23.1-1 - Update from NSA - Fixes for fs_daemon - Add gift from Ivan Gyurdiev * Thu Mar 10 2005 Dan Walsh 1.22.1-3 - Add consoletype.te - Fix filecontext.homedirs handling * Thu Mar 10 2005 Dan Walsh 1.22.1-1 - Update to latest from NSA - Dontaudit pam_timestamp calls to utmp sendmail-8.13.3-1.2 ------------------- * Thu Mar 10 2005 Jason Vas Dias 8.13.3-1.2 - fix libbind include path - use /usr/include/bind/netdb.h, no - /usr/include/netdb.h - bug: 150339 sound-juicer-2.10.0-1 --------------------- * Fri Mar 11 2005 John (J5) Palmieri 2.10.0-1 - Update to upstream version 2.10.0 sqlite-3.1.2-1 -------------- * Wed Mar 09 2005 Jeff Johnson 3.1.2-1 - rename to "sqlite" from "sqlite3" (#149719, #150012). xorg-x11-6.8.2-10 ----------------- * Fri Mar 11 2005 Mike A. Harris 6.8.2-10 - Re-enable xorg-x11-6.8.2-xnest-shape-fix.patch which has been updated now for 6.8.2 by Mark McLoughlin (#148763) * Thu Mar 10 2005 Mike A. Harris 6.8.2-9 - Disable xorg-x11-6.8.2-xnest-shape-fix.patch added in 6.8.2-8, as it does not compile. * Thu Mar 10 2005 Mike A. Harris 6.8.2-1.FC3.8test - Rebuild 6.8.2-8 as 6.8.2-1.FC3.8test for Fedora Core 3 testing release From Matt_Domsch at dell.com Sat Mar 12 13:44:23 2005 From: Matt_Domsch at dell.com (Matt Domsch) Date: Sat, 12 Mar 2005 07:44:23 -0600 Subject: DKMS usage (was: rawhide report: 20050310 changes) In-Reply-To: References: <20050310172126.GC24517@nostromo.devel.redhat.com> <1110475954.6291.118.camel@laptopd505.fenrus.org> <604aa7910503100948705e7baf@mail.gmail.com> <42309CBA.6060708@redhat.com> <20050310232552.GA27026@ti64.telemetry-investments.com> <20050311150457.7132159f@nausicaa.camperquake.de> <20050311231820.GB29498@lists.us.dell.com> Message-ID: <20050312134423.GA13158@lists.us.dell.com> On Sat, Mar 12, 2005 at 07:30:13AM +0100, Dag Wieers wrote: > On Fri, 11 Mar 2005, Matt Domsch wrote: > > > On Fri, Mar 11, 2005 at 11:18:56AM -0600, Jason L Tibbitts III wrote: > > > I guess the question is whether DKMS can be so modified and if so > > > whether the result would be better than whatever other solutions > > > people have come up with. > > > > # dkms build -m foo -v version -k some_kernel_version -a some_arch > > # (repeat for different -k -a values) > > And how does this work with the 2.6 kernel ? Is it capable to build for > different architectures from the same sources without the need of touching > them ? > > I thought that was the main problem nowadays with 2.6, building the kernel > modules as user for different archs without having to copy parts or the > whole kernel tree. > > If it can do that, I may have to integrate dkms into my buildsystem :) Yes, it can. It uses the headers/Makefile left in /lib/modules/${kernelversion}/build/ from the kernel RPM. (That is, <= FC3, as I see FC4-rawhide will require kernel-devel packages be installed on the build system, no real big suprise there though). The multiple-architecture thing gets a little tricky, I have to admit. /lib/modules/`uname -r`/ doesn't take in having multiple architectures on the file system. But that's OK, DKMS can be passed --kernelsourcedir=source-location and --config=kernel-.config-location to override its default attempts of /lib/modules/${kernelversion}, so you just unpack the other-arch RPMs into a new /path/to/${arch}/lib/modules/${kernelversion} and point DKMS at it. Thanks, Matt -- Matt Domsch Software Architect Dell Linux Solutions linux.dell.com & www.dell.com/linux Linux on Dell mailing lists @ http://lists.us.dell.com From mbneto at gmail.com Sat Mar 12 14:33:15 2005 From: mbneto at gmail.com (mbneto) Date: Sat, 12 Mar 2005 10:33:15 -0400 Subject: rawhide report: 20050312 changes In-Reply-To: <200503121225.j2CCPjam011676@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> References: <200503121225.j2CCPjam011676@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> Message-ID: <5cf776b805031206332cb7b1c5@mail.gmail.com> Any chance they will come back or extras-only ? > Removed package python-sqlite3 > > Removed package sqlite3 > From m.a.young at durham.ac.uk Sat Mar 12 14:43:19 2005 From: m.a.young at durham.ac.uk (M A Young) Date: Sat, 12 Mar 2005 14:43:19 +0000 (GMT) Subject: A more efficient up2date service using binary diffs In-Reply-To: <423224E0.3000005@nc.rr.com> References: <423224E0.3000005@nc.rr.com> Message-ID: On Fri, 11 Mar 2005, Jeff Johnson wrote: > This patch > https://svn.uhulinux.hu/packages/dev/zlib/patches/02-rsync.patch > is in rpm-4.4.1 and on by default. > > If the payloads in FC4 are not rsyncable right now, then it's because > beehive is using an > older version of rpm ... checking ... yep, current rpm payloads should > be rsync ready: > > $ rpm -q --qf '%{rpmversion}\n' perl > 4.4.1 It seems the option isn't active for FC3 and its updates (which is what I had tested) so I have repeated the test with a couple of RPMs from different rawhide mirrors using xdelta, which uses a similar algorithm to rsync, and found the following sizes libgcj-4.0.0-0.31.i386.rpm 13942525 libgcj-4.0.0-0.32.i386.rpm 13950302 xdelta of rpms 6911651 xdelta of header + cpio 3723074 thus there is a significent saving in size for small changes, though you can do even better with more processing. Also from my experience with openoffice rpm library rpms don't diff as well as other packages, so the typical saving might be better than this example. Michael Young From dennis at ausil.us Sat Mar 12 14:46:11 2005 From: dennis at ausil.us (Dennis Gilmore) Date: Sat, 12 Mar 2005 08:46:11 -0600 Subject: rawhide report: 20050312 changes In-Reply-To: <5cf776b805031206332cb7b1c5@mail.gmail.com> References: <200503121225.j2CCPjam011676@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <5cf776b805031206332cb7b1c5@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <200503120846.13546.dennis@ausil.us> Once upon a time Saturday 12 March 2005 8:33 am, mbneto wrote: > Any chance they will come back or extras-only ? > > > Removed package python-sqlite3 > > > > Removed package sqlite3 Probably not since they were renamed to sqlite and python-sqlite so there not needed -- Dennis Gilmore RHCE http://www.ausil.us From bdpepple at ameritech.net Sat Mar 12 14:50:03 2005 From: bdpepple at ameritech.net (Brian Pepple) Date: Sat, 12 Mar 2005 09:50:03 -0500 Subject: rawhide report: 20050312 changes In-Reply-To: <5cf776b805031206332cb7b1c5@mail.gmail.com> References: <200503121225.j2CCPjam011676@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <5cf776b805031206332cb7b1c5@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1110639003.12692.0.camel@localhost.localdomain> On Sat, 2005-03-12 at 10:33 -0400, mbneto wrote: > Any chance they will come back or extras-only ? > > > Removed package python-sqlite3 > > > > Removed package sqlite3 > > > Read the rest of the changes, the package was renamed. /B -- Brian Pepple gpg --keyserver pgp.mit.edu --recv-keys 810CC15E BD5E 6F9E 8688 E668 8F5B CBDE 326A E936 810C C15E -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part URL: From kyrre at solution-forge.net Sat Mar 12 15:54:56 2005 From: kyrre at solution-forge.net (Kyrre Ness Sjobak) Date: Sat, 12 Mar 2005 16:54:56 +0100 Subject: rawhide report: 20050312 changes In-Reply-To: <200503120846.13546.dennis@ausil.us> References: <200503121225.j2CCPjam011676@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <5cf776b805031206332cb7b1c5@mail.gmail.com> <200503120846.13546.dennis@ausil.us> Message-ID: <1110642896.3470.3.camel@localhost.localdomain> l?r, 12.03.2005 kl. 15.46 skrev Dennis Gilmore: > Once upon a time Saturday 12 March 2005 8:33 am, mbneto wrote: > > Any chance they will come back or extras-only ? > > > > > Removed package python-sqlite3 > > > > > > Removed package sqlite3 > Probably not since they were renamed to sqlite and python-sqlite so there > not needed > yum needs them, so they won't go away From kyrre at solution-forge.net Sat Mar 12 15:56:42 2005 From: kyrre at solution-forge.net (Kyrre Ness Sjobak) Date: Sat, 12 Mar 2005 16:56:42 +0100 Subject: A more efficient up2date service using binary diffs In-Reply-To: References: <423224E0.3000005@nc.rr.com> Message-ID: <1110643001.3470.5.camel@localhost.localdomain> l?r, 12.03.2005 kl. 15.43 skrev M A Young: > On Fri, 11 Mar 2005, Jeff Johnson wrote: > > > This patch > > https://svn.uhulinux.hu/packages/dev/zlib/patches/02-rsync.patch > > is in rpm-4.4.1 and on by default. > > > > If the payloads in FC4 are not rsyncable right now, then it's because > > beehive is using an > > older version of rpm ... checking ... yep, current rpm payloads should > > be rsync ready: > > > > $ rpm -q --qf '%{rpmversion}\n' perl > > 4.4.1 > > It seems the option isn't active for FC3 and its updates (which is what I > had tested) so I have repeated the test with a couple of RPMs from > different rawhide mirrors using xdelta, which uses a similar algorithm to > rsync, and found the following sizes > > libgcj-4.0.0-0.31.i386.rpm 13942525 > libgcj-4.0.0-0.32.i386.rpm 13950302 > xdelta of rpms 6911651 > xdelta of header + cpio 3723074 > > thus there is a significent saving in size for small changes, though you > can do even better with more processing. Also from my experience with > openoffice rpm library rpms don't diff as well as other packages, so the > typical saving might be better than this example. > > Michael Young Just wondering: Are you doing the diffs on the data the package contains, or the compressed version of it? From m.a.young at durham.ac.uk Sat Mar 12 17:17:50 2005 From: m.a.young at durham.ac.uk (M A Young) Date: Sat, 12 Mar 2005 17:17:50 +0000 (GMT) Subject: A more efficient up2date service using binary diffs In-Reply-To: <1110643001.3470.5.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <423224E0.3000005@nc.rr.com> <1110643001.3470.5.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: On Sat, 12 Mar 2005, Kyrre Ness Sjobak wrote: > l?r, 12.03.2005 kl. 15.43 skrev M A Young: > > It seems the option isn't active for FC3 and its updates (which is what I > > had tested) so I have repeated the test with a couple of RPMs from > > different rawhide mirrors using xdelta, which uses a similar algorithm to > > rsync, and found the following sizes > > > > libgcj-4.0.0-0.31.i386.rpm 13942525 > > libgcj-4.0.0-0.32.i386.rpm 13950302 > > xdelta of rpms 6911651 > > xdelta of header + cpio 3723074 > > Just wondering: Are you doing the diffs on the data the package > contains, or the compressed version of it? Both. The first figure is the xdelta of the raw rpms, without doing anything to them, the second is the xdelta of the rpm header and the uncompressed cpio archive concatenated together. Note that xdelta compresses its result, with xdelta compression turned off, the sizes are xdelta of rpms (no compression) 7025625 xdelta of header + cpio (no comp.) 8604163 Michael Young From n3npq at nc.rr.com Sat Mar 12 18:17:24 2005 From: n3npq at nc.rr.com (Jeff Johnson) Date: Sat, 12 Mar 2005 13:17:24 -0500 Subject: A more efficient up2date service using binary diffs In-Reply-To: References: <423224E0.3000005@nc.rr.com> Message-ID: <42333234.8080106@nc.rr.com> M A Young wrote: >On Fri, 11 Mar 2005, Jeff Johnson wrote: > > > >>This patch >> https://svn.uhulinux.hu/packages/dev/zlib/patches/02-rsync.patch >>is in rpm-4.4.1 and on by default. >> >>If the payloads in FC4 are not rsyncable right now, then it's because >>beehive is using an >>older version of rpm ... checking ... yep, current rpm payloads should >>be rsync ready: >> >>$ rpm -q --qf '%{rpmversion}\n' perl >>4.4.1 >> >> > >It seems the option isn't active for FC3 and its updates (which is what I >had tested) so I have repeated the test with a couple of RPMs from >different rawhide mirrors using xdelta, which uses a similar algorithm to >rsync, and found the following sizes > > Yep, rpm-4.4.1 is not in FC3, and so *.rpm payloads are not prepared with the zlib equiv of gzip --rsyncable. >libgcj-4.0.0-0.31.i386.rpm 13942525 >libgcj-4.0.0-0.32.i386.rpm 13950302 >xdelta of rpms 6911651 >xdelta of header + cpio 3723074 > >thus there is a significent saving in size for small changes, though you >can do even better with more processing. Also from my experience with >openoffice rpm library rpms don't diff as well as other packages, so the >typical saving might be better than this example. > > Hint: xdelta is the wrong approach, because both packages have to exist on either client or (more likely) server, leading to a combinatorial complexity of deltas to manage for all possible updates. Try rdiff from librsync instead. 73 de Jeff From jdesbonnet at gmail.com Sat Mar 12 19:08:52 2005 From: jdesbonnet at gmail.com (Joe Desbonnet) Date: Sat, 12 Mar 2005 19:08:52 +0000 Subject: A more efficient up2date service using binary diffs In-Reply-To: <42333234.8080106@nc.rr.com> References: <423224E0.3000005@nc.rr.com> <42333234.8080106@nc.rr.com> Message-ID: <1cef3e95050312110859b2bf28@mail.gmail.com> I'm currenly focusing on improving the download time for clients over limited bandwidth connections... so perhaps there is a bigger picture which I'm ignoring (eg mirror updates). I would propose that a tool build the delta repository. No need for humans to get involved in that activity. I would also propose that only deltas against the RPMs in the original distribution are produced. Joe. On Sat, 12 Mar 2005 13:17:24 -0500, Jeff Johnson wrote: > > > Hint: xdelta is the wrong approach, because both packages have to exist > on either client or (more likely) server, > leading to a combinatorial complexity of deltas to manage for all > possible updates. > > Try rdiff from librsync instead. > > 73 de Jeff > > -- > fedora-devel-list mailing list > fedora-devel-list at redhat.com > http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-list > From zaitcev at redhat.com Sun Mar 13 01:40:00 2005 From: zaitcev at redhat.com (Pete Zaitcev) Date: Sat, 12 Mar 2005 17:40:00 -0800 Subject: USB card reader gone again In-Reply-To: References: <1110573132.4974.7.camel@localhost.localdomain> <20050311203628.GD4185@redhat.com> <1110574131.4974.12.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <20050312174000.4a446e19@localhost.localdomain> On Fri, 11 Mar 2005 16:04:22 -0500 Dave Jones wrote: > On Fri, Mar 11, 2005 at 08:48:51PM +0000, Paul wrote: > > usb 3-3: reset full speed USB device using ohci_hcd and address 7 > > usb 3-3: hald timed out on ep0in > > usb 3-3: hald timed out on ep0in > > usb 3-3: hald timed out on ep0in > > scsi: Device offlined - not ready after error recovery: host 1 channel 0 id 0 lun 0 > > So, this is why your card reader doesn't show up. > Why it does this is a mystery to me right now. This is cute, too: usb 3-1: new full speed USB device using ohci_hcd and address 2 <----- printer works ok on port #1 usb 3-2: new full speed USB device using ohci_hcd and address 3 usb 3-2: device descriptor read/64, error -110 usb 3-2: device descriptor read/64, error -110 usb 3-2: new full speed USB device using ohci_hcd and address 4 usb 3-2: device descriptor read/64, error -110 usb 3-2: device descriptor read/64, error -110 usb 3-2: new full speed USB device using ohci_hcd and address 5 usb 3-2: device not accepting address 5, error -110 usb 3-2: new full speed USB device using ohci_hcd and address 6 usb 3-2: device not accepting address 6, error -110 <----- something is connected but does not work, or the hub signals presence wrongly on port #2 (scanner?) usb 3-3: new full speed USB device using ohci_hcd and address 7 usb-storage: device found at 7 usb-storage: waiting for device to settle before scanning <----- Yay, storage on port #3 And then, the asynchronous scanning fails. -- Pete From n3npq at nc.rr.com Sun Mar 13 03:07:35 2005 From: n3npq at nc.rr.com (Jeff Johnson) Date: Sat, 12 Mar 2005 22:07:35 -0500 Subject: A more efficient up2date service using binary diffs In-Reply-To: <1cef3e95050312110859b2bf28@mail.gmail.com> References: <423224E0.3000005@nc.rr.com> <42333234.8080106@nc.rr.com> <1cef3e95050312110859b2bf28@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <4233AE77.2090803@nc.rr.com> Joe Desbonnet wrote: >I'm currenly focusing on improving the download time for clients over >limited bandwidth connections... so perhaps there is a bigger picture >which I'm ignoring (eg mirror updates). > > rdiff is more than mirror fodder, produces a file on the client that is sent to server, which can then produce a delta that is sent back to the client. The uploaded file and the downloaded delta are way smaller than the original file, and the advantage is that the delta can be generated without both packages resident on the same machine. >I would propose that a tool build the delta repository. No need for >humans to get involved in that activity. > > Humans are always involved, and deltas are gonna add a large number of files that need to be produced, tested, maintained, and otherwise handled. >I would also propose that only deltas against the RPMs in the original >distribution are produced. > > Sure you can make up rules that simplify the problem. Not gonna work in practice, there is too much diversity for "original distribution" to satisfy a majority of users imho. 73 de Jeff From ricpride at yahoo.com Sun Mar 13 04:00:26 2005 From: ricpride at yahoo.com (Ric Ya) Date: Sat, 12 Mar 2005 20:00:26 -0800 (PST) Subject: Wireless Internet Connection problemo! Message-ID: <20050313040026.90535.qmail@web50910.mail.yahoo.com> Hello everyone! I'm brand new to the Fedora Core. I recently download Core 3 and it seems cool so far. I am currently having a problem trying to access the internet with my wireless card. I know in Windows, for me, it was simple. Put in CD and install drivers. I tried to use the CD, but it wasn't working. I tried to click on Setup.exe and so forth. The wireless card I am using is a Linksys Wireless B 802.11b Model # WMP11. Not sure if that helps, but hopefully it does. Anyways, I'm brand new to this and I want to setup a home server and serve the net, but I need to get my connection up. Thanks! If you have any questions that would help you out on how to fix this issue, please ask away. RIC --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Make Yahoo! your home page -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mpeters at mac.com Sun Mar 13 04:50:15 2005 From: mpeters at mac.com (Michael A. Peters) Date: Sun, 13 Mar 2005 04:50:15 +0000 Subject: Wireless Internet Connection problemo! In-Reply-To: <20050313040026.90535.qmail@web50910.mail.yahoo.com> (from ricpride@yahoo.com on Sat Mar 12 20:00:26 2005) References: <20050313040026.90535.qmail@web50910.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1110689415l.6245l.0l@devel.mpeters.local> On 03/12/2005 08:00:26 PM, Ric Ya wrote: > Hello everyone! > > I'm brand new to the Fedora Core. I recently download Core 3 and it > seems cool so far. > > I am currently having a problem trying to access the internet with my > wireless card. I know in Windows, for me, it was simple. Put in CD > and > install drivers. I tried to use the CD, but it wasn't working. I > tried > to click on Setup.exe and so forth. The wireless card I am using is a > Linksys Wireless B 802.11b Model # WMP11. Not sure if that helps, but > hopefully it does. Anyways, I'm brand new to this and I want to setup > a home server and serve the net, but I need to get my connection up. > > Thanks! I'm guessing that card uses a broadcom chipset, but you should find out whatever it is that it uses first. lspci might list it. Might be hard to find, though. For me - this is what the entry looks like in lspci : [mpeters at devel ~]$ /sbin/lspci |grep "802\.11" 01:07.0 Ethernet controller: Atheros Communications, Inc. AR5212 802.11abg NIC (rev 01) That tells me it is an Atheros chip - and I know for atheros I can use madwifi (not part of Fedora Core, but installs fine) If what you have is broadcom, you may be able to use ndiswrapper - but I have no experience with that at all. -- Michael A. Peters http://mpeters.us/ From rodd at clarkson.id.au Sun Mar 13 06:00:59 2005 From: rodd at clarkson.id.au (Rodd Clarkson) Date: Sun, 13 Mar 2005 17:00:59 +1100 Subject: Wireless Internet Connection problemo! In-Reply-To: <20050313040026.90535.qmail@web50910.mail.yahoo.com> References: <20050313040026.90535.qmail@web50910.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1110693659.3607.10.camel@goose> On Sat, 2005-03-12 at 20:00 -0800, Ric Ya wrote: > Hello everyone! > > I'm brand new to the Fedora Core. I recently download Core 3 and it > seems cool so far. I'm glad you like it. > > I am currently having a problem trying to access the internet with my > wireless card. I know in Windows, for me, it was simple. Put in CD and > install drivers. I tried to use the CD, but it wasn't working. I tried > to click on Setup.exe and so forth. The wireless card I am using is a > Linksys Wireless B 802.11b Model # WMP11. Not sure if that helps, but > hopefully it does. Anyways, I'm brand new to this and I want to setup > a home server and serve the net, but I need to get my connection up. I'm not sure how to solve your problem. However, this list is not the place to be asking this sort of question. If you look at the sign up page for the list you would note that it says "THIS IS NOT A SUPPORT LIST. THIS LIST IS FOR CORE DEVELOPMENT DISCUSSION ONLY." Members of this list are usually happy to answer package related problems to do with the current rawhide development, but you question is of a more general nature. You might be better off asking this type of question on fedora-list. You can subscribe on this page: http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Good luck with finding your answer. Rodd > From dragoran at feuerpokemon.de Sun Mar 13 06:34:55 2005 From: dragoran at feuerpokemon.de (dragoran) Date: Sun, 13 Mar 2005 07:34:55 +0100 Subject: CONFIG_X86_CPUFREQ_NFORCE2 not set? Message-ID: <4233DF0F.6060209@feuerpokemon.de> Why is CONFIG_X86_CPUFREQ_NFORCE2 disabled in fc kernels? From pbrobinson at gmail.com Sun Mar 13 06:47:31 2005 From: pbrobinson at gmail.com (Peter Robinson) Date: Sun, 13 Mar 2005 14:47:31 +0800 Subject: CONFIG_X86_CPUFREQ_NFORCE2 not set? In-Reply-To: <4233DF0F.6060209@feuerpokemon.de> References: <4233DF0F.6060209@feuerpokemon.de> Message-ID: <5256d0b050312224748d3f929@mail.gmail.com> > Why is CONFIG_X86_CPUFREQ_NFORCE2 disabled in fc kernels? As it seems to be for most of the CPU Scaling. I think the Intel Speed Step is as well (Is the original speedstep supported or only the later incarnations? Pete From dragoran at feuerpokemon.de Sun Mar 13 07:17:16 2005 From: dragoran at feuerpokemon.de (dragoran) Date: Sun, 13 Mar 2005 08:17:16 +0100 Subject: CONFIG_X86_CPUFREQ_NFORCE2 not set? In-Reply-To: <5256d0b050312224748d3f929@mail.gmail.com> References: <4233DF0F.6060209@feuerpokemon.de> <5256d0b050312224748d3f929@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <4233E8FC.9070504@feuerpokemon.de> Peter Robinson wrote: >>Why is CONFIG_X86_CPUFREQ_NFORCE2 disabled in fc kernels? >> >> > >As it seems to be for most of the CPU Scaling. I think the Intel Speed >Step is as well (Is the original speedstep supported or only the later >incarnations? > >Pete > > > CONFIG_X86_SPEEDSTEP_CENTRINO=y CONFIG_X86_SPEEDSTEP_CENTRINO_ACPI=y CONFIG_X86_SPEEDSTEP_CENTRINO_TABLE=y CONFIG_X86_SPEEDSTEP_ICH=y CONFIG_X86_SPEEDSTEP_SMI=m CONFIG_X86_SPEEDSTEP_LIB=y # CONFIG_X86_CPUFREQ_NFORCE2 is not set From arcofdescent at gmail.com Sun Mar 13 07:46:18 2005 From: arcofdescent at gmail.com (Rohan Romanus Almeida) Date: Sun, 13 Mar 2005 13:16:18 +0530 Subject: Wireless Internet Connection problemo! In-Reply-To: <20050313040026.90535.qmail@web50910.mail.yahoo.com> References: <20050313040026.90535.qmail@web50910.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <777aada2050312234662700f37@mail.gmail.com> Hello, Check these site: http://linux-wlan.org I successfully set up my wireless and home network with the help of this site. -- Rohan On Sat, 12 Mar 2005 20:00:26 -0800 (PST), Ric Ya wrote: > Hello everyone! > > I'm brand new to the Fedora Core. I recently download Core 3 and it seems > cool so far. > > I am currently having a problem trying to access the internet with my > wireless card. I know in Windows, for me, it was simple. Put in CD and > install drivers. I tried to use the CD, but it wasn't working. I tried to > click on Setup.exe and so forth. The wireless card I am using is a Linksys > Wireless B 802.11b Model # WMP11. Not sure if that helps, but hopefully it > does. Anyways, I'm brand new to this and I want to setup a home server and > serve the net, but I need to get my connection up. > > Thanks! > > If you have any questions that would help you out on how to fix this issue, > please ask away. > > RIC > > ________________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > Make Yahoo! your home page > > > -- > fedora-devel-list mailing list > fedora-devel-list at redhat.com > http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-list > > -- __ Rohan From davej at redhat.com Sun Mar 13 07:54:25 2005 From: davej at redhat.com (Dave Jones) Date: Sun, 13 Mar 2005 02:54:25 -0500 Subject: CONFIG_X86_CPUFREQ_NFORCE2 not set? In-Reply-To: <4233DF0F.6060209@feuerpokemon.de> References: <4233DF0F.6060209@feuerpokemon.de> Message-ID: <20050313075424.GA25814@redhat.com> On Sun, Mar 13, 2005 at 07:34:55AM +0100, dragoran wrote: > Why is CONFIG_X86_CPUFREQ_NFORCE2 disabled in fc kernels? It's relatively new, has had very little upstream feedback, and doesn't really bring much in terms of power saving, whilst potentially destabilising the system. Dave From davej at redhat.com Sun Mar 13 07:55:09 2005 From: davej at redhat.com (Dave Jones) Date: Sun, 13 Mar 2005 02:55:09 -0500 Subject: CONFIG_X86_CPUFREQ_NFORCE2 not set? In-Reply-To: <5256d0b050312224748d3f929@mail.gmail.com> References: <4233DF0F.6060209@feuerpokemon.de> <5256d0b050312224748d3f929@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20050313075508.GB25814@redhat.com> On Sun, Mar 13, 2005 at 02:47:31PM +0800, Peter Robinson wrote: > > Why is CONFIG_X86_CPUFREQ_NFORCE2 disabled in fc kernels? > > As it seems to be for most of the CPU Scaling. Not true. Dave From ivg2 at cornell.edu Sun Mar 13 08:39:11 2005 From: ivg2 at cornell.edu (Ivan Gyurdiev) Date: Sun, 13 Mar 2005 03:39:11 -0500 Subject: Old kernel RPMS Message-ID: <1110703151.3170.7.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> My nvidia driver crashes again - no logs, no error messages, no info of any kind. Only happens when running OpenGL games after several minutes of gameplay - screen goes to gray diagonal lines, and the system's completely frozen. Happens with 6629, and 7167 - suspects are kernel and gcc4 compiler (since I remember 6629 used to work at some point). This is going to be extremely unpleasant to debug. So, I'd like to try old kernel rpm's. Where can I find any? I don't have any kernels installed older than 1170. -- Ivan Gyurdiev Cornell University From ml-fedora at fathomssen.de Sun Mar 13 08:39:36 2005 From: ml-fedora at fathomssen.de (Frederick Alexander Thomssen) Date: Sun, 13 Mar 2005 09:39:36 +0100 Subject: Old kernel RPMS In-Reply-To: <1110703151.3170.7.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> References: <1110703151.3170.7.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> Message-ID: <200503130939.37080.ml-fedora@fathomssen.de> You should google for them (e.g. use as google query "kernel-2.6.10-1.1143_FC4" rpm fedora ) - there will be some servers that still have this rpm. but don't rely on google's results - they may be cached so it's possible that google tells you the kernel still exists on a page but the page is already up-to-date. so just check some pages. freddy On Sunday 13 March 2005 09:39, Ivan Gyurdiev wrote: > My nvidia driver crashes again - no logs, no error messages, no info of > any kind. Only happens when running OpenGL games after several minutes > of gameplay - screen goes to gray diagonal lines, and the system's > completely frozen. Happens with 6629, and 7167 - > suspects are kernel and gcc4 compiler (since I remember 6629 used to > work at some point). This is going to be extremely unpleasant to debug. > > So, I'd like to try old kernel rpm's. > Where can I find any? I don't have any kernels installed older than > 1170. > > -- > Ivan Gyurdiev > Cornell University -- Frederick Alexander Thomssen From arjanv at redhat.com Sun Mar 13 08:52:02 2005 From: arjanv at redhat.com (Arjan van de Ven) Date: Sun, 13 Mar 2005 09:52:02 +0100 Subject: Old kernel RPMS In-Reply-To: <1110703151.3170.7.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> References: <1110703151.3170.7.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> Message-ID: <1110703923.6278.38.camel@laptopd505.fenrus.org> On Sun, 2005-03-13 at 03:39 -0500, Ivan Gyurdiev wrote: > suspects are kernel and gcc4 compiler (since I remember 6629 used to > work at some point). and... the driver. -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part URL: From ivg2 at cornell.edu Sun Mar 13 12:11:29 2005 From: ivg2 at cornell.edu (Ivan Gyurdiev) Date: Sun, 13 Mar 2005 07:11:29 -0500 Subject: Old kernel RPMS In-Reply-To: <1110703923.6278.38.camel@laptopd505.fenrus.org> References: <1110703151.3170.7.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> <1110703923.6278.38.camel@laptopd505.fenrus.org> Message-ID: <1110715889.3170.25.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> On Sun, 2005-03-13 at 09:52 +0100, Arjan van de Ven wrote: > On Sun, 2005-03-13 at 03:39 -0500, Ivan Gyurdiev wrote: > > > suspects are kernel and gcc4 compiler (since I remember 6629 used to > > work at some point). > > and... the driver. Well, the driver stayed the same, while the kernel changed, and made the driver stop working. As far as I'm concerned, the kernel broke it. Whether the fault is in the kernel, or driver, the end result is the same - it doesn't work anymore, and I have to downgrade to a kernel compatible with the nvidia driver (at least for running OpenGL). -- Ivan Gyurdiev Cornell University From ml-fedora at fathomssen.de Sun Mar 13 12:08:42 2005 From: ml-fedora at fathomssen.de (Frederick Alexander Thomssen) Date: Sun, 13 Mar 2005 13:08:42 +0100 Subject: Old kernel RPMS In-Reply-To: <1110715889.3170.25.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> References: <1110703151.3170.7.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> <1110703923.6278.38.camel@laptopd505.fenrus.org> <1110715889.3170.25.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> Message-ID: <200503131308.42776.ml-fedora@fathomssen.de> but - er - you are not using a precompiled (rpm) driver, do you? freddy On Sunday 13 March 2005 13:11, Ivan Gyurdiev wrote: > On Sun, 2005-03-13 at 09:52 +0100, Arjan van de Ven wrote: > > On Sun, 2005-03-13 at 03:39 -0500, Ivan Gyurdiev wrote: > > > suspects are kernel and gcc4 compiler (since I remember 6629 used to > > > work at some point). > > > > and... the driver. > > Well, the driver stayed the same, while the kernel changed, and made the > driver stop working. As far as I'm concerned, the kernel broke it. > Whether the fault is in the kernel, or driver, the end result is the > same - it doesn't work anymore, and I have to downgrade to > a kernel compatible with the nvidia driver (at least for running > OpenGL). > > -- > Ivan Gyurdiev > Cornell University -- Frederick Alexander Thomssen From ivg2 at cornell.edu Sun Mar 13 12:26:30 2005 From: ivg2 at cornell.edu (Ivan Gyurdiev) Date: Sun, 13 Mar 2005 07:26:30 -0500 Subject: Old kernel RPMS In-Reply-To: <200503131308.42776.ml-fedora@fathomssen.de> References: <1110703151.3170.7.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> <1110703923.6278.38.camel@laptopd505.fenrus.org> <1110715889.3170.25.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> <200503131308.42776.ml-fedora@fathomssen.de> Message-ID: <1110716790.3170.31.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> On Sun, 2005-03-13 at 13:08 +0100, Frederick Alexander Thomssen wrote: > but - er - you are not using a precompiled (rpm) driver, do you? Yes, I am using a precompiled driver - it's the Nvidia graphics card driver. Yes, it happens to be in an rpm package - the one from Livna.org. -- Ivan Gyurdiev Cornell University From buildsys at redhat.com Sun Mar 13 12:40:53 2005 From: buildsys at redhat.com (Build System) Date: Sun, 13 Mar 2005 07:40:53 -0500 Subject: rawhide report: 20050313 changes Message-ID: <200503131240.j2DCerph005792@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> Updated Packages: evince-0.1.8-1 -------------- * Sat Mar 12 2005 Marco Pesenti Gritti - 0.1.8-1 - Update to 0.1.8 poppler-0.1.2-1 --------------- vnc-4.1.1-2 ----------- * Fri Mar 11 2005 Tim Waugh 4.1.1-2 - 4.1.1 (with 4.1 Java viewer). - No longer need module patch. From kyrre at solution-forge.net Sun Mar 13 15:28:19 2005 From: kyrre at solution-forge.net (Kyrre Ness Sjobak) Date: Sun, 13 Mar 2005 16:28:19 +0100 Subject: Old kernel RPMS In-Reply-To: <1110716790.3170.31.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> References: <1110703151.3170.7.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> <1110703923.6278.38.camel@laptopd505.fenrus.org> <1110715889.3170.25.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> <200503131308.42776.ml-fedora@fathomssen.de> <1110716790.3170.31.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> Message-ID: <1110727699.3447.3.camel@localhost.localdomain> s?n, 13.03.2005 kl. 13.26 skrev Ivan Gyurdiev: > On Sun, 2005-03-13 at 13:08 +0100, Frederick Alexander Thomssen wrote: > > but - er - you are not using a precompiled (rpm) driver, do you? > > Yes, I am using a precompiled driver - it's the Nvidia graphics card > driver. Yes, it happens to be in an rpm package - the one from > Livna.org. > > > -- > Ivan Gyurdiev > Cornell University Strange that it actually loads at all. Is the rpm compiled for your kernel? Do Livna provide rpm's compiled for rawhide theese days? You will have to recompile the kernel interface part of it. Maybe doing a rpmbuild on the coresponding srpm will do? Kyrre From jspaleta at gmail.com Sun Mar 13 17:46:43 2005 From: jspaleta at gmail.com (Jeff Spaleta) Date: Sun, 13 Mar 2005 12:46:43 -0500 Subject: Old kernel RPMS In-Reply-To: <1110716790.3170.31.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> References: <1110703151.3170.7.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> <1110703923.6278.38.camel@laptopd505.fenrus.org> <1110715889.3170.25.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> <200503131308.42776.ml-fedora@fathomssen.de> <1110716790.3170.31.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> Message-ID: <604aa79105031309462ea47e82@mail.gmail.com> On Sun, 13 Mar 2005 07:26:30 -0500, Ivan Gyurdiev wrote: > Yes, I am using a precompiled driver - it's the Nvidia graphics card > driver. Yes, it happens to be in an rpm package - the one from > Livna.org. This discussion is not appropriate for fedora-devel-list. Your original question was much better suited for fedora-test-list. And frankly I'm baffled about your comments here... considering that you are active in the livna bugzilla tickets and haven't reported these apparently new problems to the packagers via livna bugzilla. And FYI i played like 4 hours of vegastrike last night on the 2.6.11-1.1177_FC4smp with the kernel with nvidia-glx-1.0.6629-0.lvn.7.src.rpm from bug 358 with absolutely no problem. If you continue to see problems.. please report then in the appropriate open livna ticket. -jef From derek.p.moore at gmail.com Sun Mar 13 18:28:59 2005 From: derek.p.moore at gmail.com (Derek Moore) Date: Sun, 13 Mar 2005 12:28:59 -0600 Subject: rawhide report: 20050312 changes Message-ID: > xorg-x11-6.8.2-10 > ----------------- > * Fri Mar 11 2005 Mike A. Harris 6.8.2-10 > - Re-enable xorg-x11-6.8.2-xnest-shape-fix.patch which has been updated now > for 6.8.2 by Mark McLoughlin (#148763) > > * Thu Mar 10 2005 Mike A. Harris 6.8.2-9 > - Disable xorg-x11-6.8.2-xnest-shape-fix.patch added in 6.8.2-8, as it does > not compile. > > * Thu Mar 10 2005 Mike A. Harris 6.8.2-1.FC3.8test > - Rebuild 6.8.2-8 as 6.8.2-1.FC3.8test for Fedora Core 3 testing release I track Rawhide on my Toshiba Tecra 8200 laptop. It has a Trident CyberBladeXP video card. When I finished syncing to Rawhide yesterday, which included upgrading X to the above quoted packages, my X display quit working. Instead of normal operation, I get a completely white screen. For the first few seconds of X starting up, I can see the "x"-shaped mouse cursor, but then that disappears into the whiteness, too. If I switch out of X and to a virtual terminal, or if I kill X and get thrown back to a virtual terminal, the video card stays garbled and I can't use the terminals. Most of the time the terminals are black with white vertical strips every character column, but a few times it turned the terminal background orange and the characters yellow. I tried rebuilding the SRPM for X.Org in FC3 Updates, so I could downgrade and get a working X again, but the compile didn't seem to want to succeed with GCC 4.0. (I haven't yet tried installing the binary RPMs from FC3 Updates, I suppose they'll install if I have the proper compat packages installed.) Anyways, I just thought I'd report that X.Org 6.8.2 doesn't play well with Trident CyberBladeXPs. Other than that, thanks much for the high-quality, bleeding-edge, surprisingly-stable Rawhide fun! Peace out, Derek From janina at rednote.net Sun Mar 13 18:26:49 2005 From: janina at rednote.net (Janina Sajka) Date: Sun, 13 Mar 2005 13:26:49 -0500 Subject: Alsa Drivers Missing In The FC4 Kernel Message-ID: <20050313182649.GA3658@rednote.net> I'm looking at the configs in the 2.6.11-1.1177_FC4 kernel source rpm and note that the hdsp alsa driver is "not configured," and the three Echo Indigo drivers are not even mentioned. I'm wondering what's up with this. These happen to be my two preferred devices right now. Anyone know? -- Janina Sajka Phone: +1.202.494.7040 Partner, Capital Accessibility LLC http://www.CapitalAccessibility.Com Chair, Accessibility Workgroup Free Standards Group (FSG) janina at freestandards.org http://a11y.org If Linux can't solve your computing problem, you need a different problem. From ivg2 at cornell.edu Sun Mar 13 18:36:13 2005 From: ivg2 at cornell.edu (Ivan Gyurdiev) Date: Sun, 13 Mar 2005 13:36:13 -0500 Subject: Old kernel RPMS In-Reply-To: <604aa79105031309462ea47e82@mail.gmail.com> References: <1110703151.3170.7.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> <1110703923.6278.38.camel@laptopd505.fenrus.org> <1110715889.3170.25.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> <200503131308.42776.ml-fedora@fathomssen.de> <1110716790.3170.31.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> <604aa79105031309462ea47e82@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1110738973.31728.18.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> > This discussion is not appropriate for fedora-devel-list. Your > original question was much better suited for fedora-test-list. Look, all I wanted to know is how to find some old kernel rpms. I expected there to be some form of archive somewhere, and it seemed to me like the developers should know where it is. I apologize if no such thing exists, and that's EOT. I don't see why this question is so inappropriate and irrelevant for this list. In fact, it seems highly relevant to me, and I think there should be a policy to keep backup versions of rpms in a centralized place. I have needed such a thing on many occasions to determine what was broken, or recover my system from a horrific crash, due to Rawhide. > And frankly I'm baffled about your comments here... considering that > you are active in the livna bugzilla tickets and haven't reported > these apparently new problems to the packagers via livna bugzilla. ... I do not believe I have enough information at this point to file a valuable bug report. I wanted to test old kernels to determine the point of failure first. I also wanted to know whether problems can arise from the interaction between gcc4-compiled kernel, and binary kernel modules, and felt that the list was a more appropriate place to ask this question. -- Ivan Gyurdiev Cornell University From ml-fedora at fathomssen.de Sun Mar 13 18:34:43 2005 From: ml-fedora at fathomssen.de (Frederick Alexander Thomssen) Date: Sun, 13 Mar 2005 19:34:43 +0100 Subject: rawhide report: 20050312 changes In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <200503131934.43848.ml-fedora@fathomssen.de> edit your grub boot line and add a 3 at the end of the "kernel"-line - so fedora will boot into runlevel 3 (text) and you probably can correct the error (see /var/log/Xorg.0.log). freddy On Sunday 13 March 2005 19:28, Derek Moore wrote: > > xorg-x11-6.8.2-10 > > ----------------- > > * Fri Mar 11 2005 Mike A. Harris 6.8.2-10 > > - Re-enable xorg-x11-6.8.2-xnest-shape-fix.patch which has been updated > > now for 6.8.2 by Mark McLoughlin (#148763) > > > > * Thu Mar 10 2005 Mike A. Harris 6.8.2-9 > > - Disable xorg-x11-6.8.2-xnest-shape-fix.patch added in 6.8.2-8, as it > > does not compile. > > > > * Thu Mar 10 2005 Mike A. Harris 6.8.2-1.FC3.8test > > - Rebuild 6.8.2-8 as 6.8.2-1.FC3.8test for Fedora Core 3 testing release > > I track Rawhide on my Toshiba Tecra 8200 laptop. It has a Trident > CyberBladeXP video card. > > When I finished syncing to Rawhide yesterday, which included upgrading > X to the above quoted packages, my X display quit working. Instead of > normal operation, I get a completely white screen. For the first few > seconds of X starting up, I can see the "x"-shaped mouse cursor, but > then that disappears into the whiteness, too. > > If I switch out of X and to a virtual terminal, or if I kill X and get > thrown back to a virtual terminal, the video card stays garbled and I > can't use the terminals. Most of the time the terminals are black > with white vertical strips every character column, but a few times it > turned the terminal background orange and the characters yellow. > > I tried rebuilding the SRPM for X.Org in FC3 Updates, so I could > downgrade and get a working X again, but the compile didn't seem to > want to succeed with GCC 4.0. (I haven't yet tried installing the > binary RPMs from FC3 Updates, I suppose they'll install if I have the > proper compat packages installed.) > > Anyways, I just thought I'd report that X.Org 6.8.2 doesn't play well > with Trident CyberBladeXPs. > > Other than that, thanks much for the high-quality, bleeding-edge, > surprisingly-stable Rawhide fun! > > Peace out, > > Derek -- Frederick Alexander Thomssen From pri.rhl3 at iadonisi.to Sun Mar 13 18:59:16 2005 From: pri.rhl3 at iadonisi.to (Paul Iadonisi) Date: Sun, 13 Mar 2005 13:59:16 -0500 Subject: Old kernel RPMS In-Reply-To: <1110738973.31728.18.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> References: <1110703151.3170.7.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> <1110703923.6278.38.camel@laptopd505.fenrus.org> <1110715889.3170.25.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> <200503131308.42776.ml-fedora@fathomssen.de> <1110716790.3170.31.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> <604aa79105031309462ea47e82@mail.gmail.com> <1110738973.31728.18.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> Message-ID: <1110740356.20672.21.camel@md.local.linuxlobbyist.org> On Sun, 2005-03-13 at 13:36 -0500, Ivan Gyurdiev wrote: [snip] > I don't see why this question is so inappropriate and irrelevant for > this list. In fact, it seems highly relevant to me, and I think > there should be a policy to keep backup versions of rpms in a > centralized place. I have needed such a thing on many occasions to > determine what was broken, or recover my system from a horrific crash, > due to Rawhide. I'm afraid I have to agree with Ivan here, Jeff. This is most definitely *highly* relevant to this list. I've never mentioned it myself before, but I have been meaning to bring it up. I'm sure hoping it doesn't start a flamewar or anything, but I do think it's important to bring up. The discussion belongs here, IMO, and not on fedora-test because it also applies to updates for released versions. What I'm referring to is the relatively quick disappearance of previous updates, as well previous versions from rawhide. A concern I've had about official updates disappearing, at least with respect to GPL/LGPL licensed software, is that these older updates should be made available for as long as the GPL requires (3 years?). Currently, they disappear when new updates show up (or shortly thereafter). I wouldn't worry about the licensing issue too much with rawhide given that it is 'in development' stuff, but it's still a bit extreme, IMO, for previous versions to disappear from the download.fedora.redhat.com immediately on appearance of the next version. I'm not naive, here: I do know that keeping two or three versions around means significant disk space concerns, not just for Red Hat, but for all the mirrors. Maybe a separate tree that a maximum of three versions could be maintained and instead of the rawhide update mechanism doing 'rm ', it could do 'mv /'. Mirrors can choose to mirror the backup dir or not. That's simplified of course, but I'm trying to promote some discussion of this. It's burned me more than once. -- -Paul Iadonisi Senior System Administrator Red Hat Certified Engineer / Local Linux Lobbyist Ever see a penguin fly? -- Try Linux. GPL all the way: Sell services, don't lease secrets From ottohaliburton at comcast.net Sun Mar 13 19:08:17 2005 From: ottohaliburton at comcast.net (Otto Haliburton) Date: Sun, 13 Mar 2005 13:08:17 -0600 Subject: Old kernel RPMS In-Reply-To: <1110740356.20672.21.camel@md.local.linuxlobbyist.org> Message-ID: <003401c52800$03c59a80$4901a8c0@C515816A> > -----Original Message----- > From: fedora-devel-list-bounces at redhat.com [mailto:fedora-devel-list- > bounces at redhat.com] On Behalf Of Paul Iadonisi > Sent: Sunday, March 13, 2005 12:59 PM > To: Development discussions related to Fedora Core > Subject: Re: Old kernel RPMS > > On Sun, 2005-03-13 at 13:36 -0500, Ivan Gyurdiev wrote: > > [snip] > > > I don't see why this question is so inappropriate and irrelevant for > > this list. In fact, it seems highly relevant to me, and I think > > there should be a policy to keep backup versions of rpms in a > > centralized place. I have needed such a thing on many occasions to > > determine what was broken, or recover my system from a horrific crash, > > due to Rawhide. > > I'm afraid I have to agree with Ivan here, Jeff. This is most > definitely *highly* relevant to this list. > I've never mentioned it myself before, but I have been meaning to > bring it up. I'm sure hoping it doesn't start a flamewar or anything, > but I do think it's important to bring up. The discussion belongs here, > IMO, and not on fedora-test because it also applies to updates for > released versions. > What I'm referring to is the relatively quick disappearance of > previous updates, as well previous versions from rawhide. A concern > I've had about official updates disappearing, at least with respect to > GPL/LGPL licensed software, is that these older updates should be made > available for as long as the GPL requires (3 years?). Currently, they > disappear when new updates show up (or shortly thereafter). > I wouldn't worry about the licensing issue too much with rawhide given > that it is 'in development' stuff, but it's still a bit extreme, IMO, > for previous versions to disappear from the download.fedora.redhat.com > immediately on appearance of the next version. > I'm not naive, here: I do know that keeping two or three versions > around means significant disk space concerns, not just for Red Hat, but > for all the mirrors. Maybe a separate tree that a maximum of three > versions could be maintained and instead of the rawhide update mechanism > doing 'rm ', it could do 'mv /'. Mirrors can > choose to mirror the backup dir or not. > That's simplified of course, but I'm trying to promote some discussion > of this. It's burned me more than once. > -- well, my 02c is to get rid of the list police, the time spent on what is appropriate for the list and what is inappropriate for the list is as big a waste of bandwidth as the original thread. If a response is made to an inquiry then it is appropriate otherwise it will die as all threads eventually do. Now see, I've wasted bandwidth by making my response. From michael.favia at insitesinc.com Sun Mar 13 20:07:46 2005 From: michael.favia at insitesinc.com (Michael Favia) Date: Sun, 13 Mar 2005 14:07:46 -0600 Subject: Old kernel RPMS In-Reply-To: <003401c52800$03c59a80$4901a8c0@C515816A> References: <003401c52800$03c59a80$4901a8c0@C515816A> Message-ID: <42349D92.80508@insitesinc.com> Otto Haliburton wrote: >well, my 02c is to get rid of the list police, the time spent on what is >appropriate for the list and what is inappropriate for the list is as big a >waste of bandwidth as the original thread. If a response is made to an >inquiry then it is appropriate otherwise it will die as all threads >eventually do. Now see, I've wasted bandwidth by making my response. > > I disagree. Responding encourages future attempts and will build like a snowball. Politely explaining the purpose of the list and the nature of their offtopic post is much etter longterm IMO. I have issues everyday that i would appreciate feedback from the experience developers/users on this list but recognize that time is valuable and that if they had time to spare to help my problem they'll read the appropriate list. The polite negative responses serve as a reminder to the silent operatives out there (like me) that this isnt the place to ask even though the people here do know the answer. However the original posters question was ontopic IMO and i have run into the unavailability kernel issue myself a number of times. -mf From bobgus at rcn.com Sun Mar 13 20:08:45 2005 From: bobgus at rcn.com (Bob Gustafson) Date: Sun, 13 Mar 2005 14:08:45 -0600 Subject: Old kernel RPMS In-Reply-To: <1110715889.3170.25.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> References: <1110703923.6278.38.camel@laptopd505.fenrus.org> <1110703151.3170.7.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> <1110703923.6278.38.camel@laptopd505.fenrus.org> Message-ID: >On Sun, 2005-03-13 at 09:52 +0100, Arjan van de Ven wrote: >> On Sun, 2005-03-13 at 03:39 -0500, Ivan Gyurdiev wrote: >> >> > suspects are kernel and gcc4 compiler (since I remember 6629 used to >> > work at some point). >> >> and... the driver. > >Well, the driver stayed the same, while the kernel changed, and made the >driver stop working. As far as I'm concerned, the kernel broke it. >Whether the fault is in the kernel, or driver, the end result is the >same - it doesn't work anymore, and I have to downgrade to >a kernel compatible with the nvidia driver (at least for running >OpenGL). > >-- >Ivan Gyurdiev >Cornell University > >-- The release and release-update channels still have kernels made with gcc-3.4 That may be too far back for you though. BobG From ottohaliburton at comcast.net Sun Mar 13 20:20:37 2005 From: ottohaliburton at comcast.net (Otto Haliburton) Date: Sun, 13 Mar 2005 14:20:37 -0600 Subject: Old kernel RPMS In-Reply-To: <42349D92.80508@insitesinc.com> Message-ID: <003501c5280a$1ecf8e30$4901a8c0@C515816A> > Otto Haliburton wrote: > > >well, my 02c is to get rid of the list police, the time spent on what is > >appropriate for the list and what is inappropriate for the list is as big > a > >waste of bandwidth as the original thread. If a response is made to an > >inquiry then it is appropriate otherwise it will die as all threads > >eventually do. Now see, I've wasted bandwidth by making my response. > > > > > I disagree. Responding encourages future attempts and will build like a > snowball. Politely explaining the purpose of the list and the nature of > their offtopic post is much etter longterm IMO. I have issues everyday > that i would appreciate feedback from the experience developers/users on > this list but recognize that time is valuable and that if they had time > to spare to help my problem they'll read the appropriate list. The > polite negative responses serve as a reminder to the silent operatives > out there (like me) that this isnt the place to ask even though the > people here do know the answer. > > However the original posters question was ontopic IMO and i have run > into the unavailability kernel issue myself a number of times. > well, it seems to me that you don't need the list police, you are doing the job yourself, if it ain't important enough for you to ask then you don't need to send it to the list, but further more if you do send it to the list then, it will be ignored if there are answer readily available for you. Ideally, each person will search the knowledgebase prior to posting, and if you do this, most of the time you will find the solution to your problems. The problem that I see, is the one that is currently happening. One person thinks it is inappropriate and another thinks it is appropriate. Further, there is no such thing as a gentle negative. So, get rid of the list police and ignore inappropriate postings!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! From davej at redhat.com Sun Mar 13 20:39:22 2005 From: davej at redhat.com (Dave Jones) Date: Sun, 13 Mar 2005 15:39:22 -0500 Subject: Alsa Drivers Missing In The FC4 Kernel In-Reply-To: <20050313182649.GA3658@rednote.net> References: <20050313182649.GA3658@rednote.net> Message-ID: <20050313203922.GB29867@redhat.com> On Sun, Mar 13, 2005 at 01:26:49PM -0500, Janina Sajka wrote: > I'm looking at the configs in the 2.6.11-1.1177_FC4 kernel source rpm > and note that the hdsp alsa driver is "not configured," and the three > Echo Indigo drivers are not even mentioned. > > I'm wondering what's up with this. These happen to be my two preferred > devices right now. Anyone know? When they first got merged they didn't build. Same was true of quite a few options that have probably been fixed since then. The config files need some review before FC4 final. I've enabled CONFIG_SND_HDSP for the next build. What config options relate to the other three drivers you mention ? Nothing obvious jumps out at me, and grep -i indigo in the sound directory turned up nothing. Dave From m.a.young at durham.ac.uk Sun Mar 13 20:44:15 2005 From: m.a.young at durham.ac.uk (M A Young) Date: Sun, 13 Mar 2005 20:44:15 +0000 (GMT) Subject: A more efficient up2date service using binary diffs In-Reply-To: <42333234.8080106@nc.rr.com> References: <423224E0.3000005@nc.rr.com> <42333234.8080106@nc.rr.com> Message-ID: On Sat, 12 Mar 2005, Jeff Johnson wrote: > Hint: xdelta is the wrong approach, because both packages have to exist > on either client or (more likely) server, > leading to a combinatorial complexity of deltas to manage for all > possible updates. > > Try rdiff from librsync instead. I think it depends what you are aiming for. xdelta on the header combined with the uncompressed cpio still gives you the minimal byte transfer, which may be the best solution for really low bandwidth but requires both rpms to be on the server to generate the delta, and the old rpm to be on the client. As to which delta to store on the server the minimal bandwidth solution would be to generate deltas to the latest rpm from each of the preceding rpms, but this would need every rpm (or the first and incremental deltas) to generate. On the other hand rdiff is much more flexible at the cost of a larger bandwidth usage. For example to generate the deltas from all the previous rpms to the current one you just need the current rpm and signature files from all previous rpms, not the complete rpms, so there are advantages at the server end. Also if you could set up some sort of rdiff server which takes a signature file and an rpm name and returns a delta, you probably don't need any rpm on the client machine, as you could use something like rpmrebuild to construct an rpm from installed files and send the signature from that. I am repeating my figures below, and adding similar figures from rdiff as well as xdelta for comparison. Michael Young libgcj-4.0.0-0.31.i386.rpm 13942525 libgcj-4.0.0-0.32.i386.rpm 13950302 xdelta of rpms 6911651 same (no compression) 7025625 xdelta of header + cpio 3723074 same (no compression) 8604163 rdiff of rpms 7310525 same (gzipped) 7159019 rdiff signature of 1st rpm 81708 rdiff of header + cpio 17870597 same (gzipped) 5582770 rdiff signature 190476 From n3npq at nc.rr.com Sun Mar 13 22:03:51 2005 From: n3npq at nc.rr.com (Jeff Johnson) Date: Sun, 13 Mar 2005 17:03:51 -0500 Subject: A more efficient up2date service using binary diffs In-Reply-To: References: <423224E0.3000005@nc.rr.com> <42333234.8080106@nc.rr.com> Message-ID: <4234B8C7.2000305@nc.rr.com> M A Young wrote: >On Sat, 12 Mar 2005, Jeff Johnson wrote: > > >>Hint: xdelta is the wrong approach, because both packages have to exist >>on either client or (more likely) server, >>leading to a combinatorial complexity of deltas to manage for all >>possible updates. >> >>Try rdiff from librsync instead. >> >> > >I think it depends what you are aiming for. xdelta on the header combined >with the uncompressed cpio still gives you the minimal byte transfer, >which may be the best solution for really low bandwidth but requires both >rpms to be on the server to generate the delta, and the old rpm to be on >the client. As to which delta to store on the server the minimal bandwidth >solution would be to generate deltas to the latest rpm from each of the >preceding rpms, but this would need every rpm (or the first and >incremental deltas) to generate. > >On the other hand rdiff is much more flexible at the cost of a larger >bandwidth usage. For example to generate the deltas from all the previous >rpms to the current one you just need the current rpm and signature files >from all previous rpms, not the complete rpms, so there are advantages at >the server end. Also if you could set up some sort of rdiff server which >takes a signature file and an rpm name and returns a delta, you probably >don't need any rpm on the client machine, as you could use something like >rpmrebuild to construct an rpm from installed files and send the signature >from that. > > Yep. >I am repeating my figures below, and adding similar figures from rdiff as >well as xdelta for comparison. > > Michael Young > >libgcj-4.0.0-0.31.i386.rpm 13942525 >libgcj-4.0.0-0.32.i386.rpm 13950302 >xdelta of rpms 6911651 >same (no compression) 7025625 >xdelta of header + cpio 3723074 >same (no compression) 8604163 >rdiff of rpms 7310525 >same (gzipped) 7159019 >rdiff signature of 1st rpm 81708 >rdiff of header + cpio 17870597 >same (gzipped) 5582770 >rdiff signature 190476 > > Thanks for publishing the numbers. 73 de Jeff From janina at rednote.net Sun Mar 13 22:32:40 2005 From: janina at rednote.net (Janina Sajka) Date: Sun, 13 Mar 2005 17:32:40 -0500 Subject: Alsa Drivers Missing In The FC4 Kernel In-Reply-To: <20050313203922.GB29867@redhat.com> References: <20050313182649.GA3658@rednote.net> <20050313203922.GB29867@redhat.com> Message-ID: <20050313223240.GB3658@rednote.net> Dave Jones writes: > On Sun, Mar 13, 2005 at 01:26:49PM -0500, Janina Sajka wrote: > > I'm looking at the configs in the 2.6.11-1.1177_FC4 kernel source rpm > > and note that the hdsp alsa driver is "not configured," and the three > > Echo Indigo drivers are not even mentioned. > > > > I'm wondering what's up with this. These happen to be my two preferred > > devices right now. Anyone know? > > When they first got merged they didn't build. > Same was true of quite a few options that have probably been > fixed since then. The config files need some review before FC4 final. > > I've enabled CONFIG_SND_HDSP for the next build. What config options > relate to the other three drivers you mention ? Nothing obvious > jumps out at me, and grep -i indigo in the sound directory > turned up nothing. FC4 kernels will be alsa 1.0.8, no? The Echo cards are supported for the first time in 1.0.8. There are quite a few, and they tend toward the high-end, audio professional level. The alsa-driver config file, toplevel.config, lists them as: CONFIG_SND_DARLA20=m CONFIG_FW_LOADER=m CONFIG_SND_GINA20=m CONFIG_SND_LAYLA20=m CONFIG_SND_DARLA24=m CONFIG_SND_GINA24=m CONFIG_SND_LAYLA24=m CONFIG_SND_MONA=m CONFIG_SND_MIA=m CONFIG_SND_GINA3G=m CONFIG_SND_LAYLA3G=m CONFIG_SND_INDIGO=m The Indigos are PCMCIA. All of these, including the hdsp, also require alsa-firmware and alsa-tools. Thanks. > > Dave > > > -- > fedora-devel-list mailing list > fedora-devel-list at redhat.com > http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-list -- Janina Sajka Phone: +1.202.494.7040 Partner, Capital Accessibility LLC http://www.CapitalAccessibility.Com Chair, Accessibility Workgroup Free Standards Group (FSG) janina at freestandards.org http://a11y.org If Linux can't solve your computing problem, you need a different problem. From seanlkml at sympatico.ca Sun Mar 13 23:06:28 2005 From: seanlkml at sympatico.ca (Sean) Date: Sun, 13 Mar 2005 18:06:28 -0500 (EST) Subject: Old kernel RPMS In-Reply-To: <1110740356.20672.21.camel@md.local.linuxlobbyist.org> References: <1110703151.3170.7.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> <1110703923.6278.38.camel@laptopd505.fenrus.org> <1110715889.3170.25.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> <200503131308.42776.ml-fedora@fathomssen.de> <1110716790.3170.31.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> <604aa79105031309462ea47e82@mail.gmail.com> <1110738973.31728.18.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> <1110740356.20672.21.camel@md.local.linuxlobbyist.org> Message-ID: <1594.10.10.10.24.1110755188.squirrel@linux1> On Sun, March 13, 2005 1:59 pm, Paul Iadonisi said: I'm afraid I have to agree with Jeff here, Paul. > What I'm referring to is the relatively quick disappearance of > previous updates, as well previous versions from rawhide. A concern > I've had about official updates disappearing, at least with respect to > GPL/LGPL licensed software, is that these older updates should be made > available for as long as the GPL requires (3 years?). Currently, they No, you're only required to provide 3 year availability if you neglect to distribute source code along with object code in the first place. Notice that section 3b of the GPLv2 is not enforced if distribution is carried out in accordance with section 3a. > disappear when new updates show up (or shortly thereafter). > I wouldn't worry about the licensing issue too much with rawhide given > that it is 'in development' stuff, but it's still a bit extreme, IMO, > for previous versions to disappear from the download.fedora.redhat.com > immediately on appearance of the next version. > I'm not naive, here: I do know that keeping two or three versions > around means significant disk space concerns, not just for Red Hat, but > for all the mirrors. Maybe a separate tree that a maximum of three > versions could be maintained and instead of the rawhide update mechanism > doing 'rm ', it could do 'mv /'. Mirrors can > choose to mirror the backup dir or not. > That's simplified of course, but I'm trying to promote some discussion > of this. It's burned me more than once. Anyone who sees a need for this service could provide it for themselves or for others. But developers probably have less of a need for this than testers do. Sean From pri.rhl3 at iadonisi.to Sun Mar 13 23:29:58 2005 From: pri.rhl3 at iadonisi.to (Paul Iadonisi) Date: Sun, 13 Mar 2005 18:29:58 -0500 Subject: Old kernel RPMS In-Reply-To: <1594.10.10.10.24.1110755188.squirrel@linux1> References: <1110703151.3170.7.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> <1110703923.6278.38.camel@laptopd505.fenrus.org> <1110715889.3170.25.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> <200503131308.42776.ml-fedora@fathomssen.de> <1110716790.3170.31.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> <604aa79105031309462ea47e82@mail.gmail.com> <1110738973.31728.18.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> <1110740356.20672.21.camel@md.local.linuxlobbyist.org> <1594.10.10.10.24.1110755188.squirrel@linux1> Message-ID: <1110756598.20672.51.camel@md.local.linuxlobbyist.org> On Sun, 2005-03-13 at 18:06 -0500, Sean wrote: > On Sun, March 13, 2005 1:59 pm, Paul Iadonisi said: > > I'm afraid I have to agree with Jeff here, Paul. Well...I don't! So there! ;-) > No, you're only required to provide 3 year availability if you neglect to > distribute source code along with object code in the first place. Notice > that section 3b of the GPLv2 is not enforced if distribution is carried > out in accordance with section 3a. Ah. I'll have to take a closer look at that. Makes sense, though. It *seemed* to me that Red Hat was in compliance, but it's not like I read the GPL that often, so I was recalling the part about making it available for three years, but not the other relevant parts. Who would read it often? Like any license, it's written in drab legalese. > Anyone who sees a need for this service could provide it for themselves or > for others. There was at least one mirror that had two or three (or more) revs back, but for the life of me I can't remember which one, and haven't been able to find it again. > But developers probably have less of a need for this than > testers do. Possibly. I suppose developers can always use cvs to get what they need. But that still leaves out the problem of older official updates to releases disappearing. I'll see if I can find that mirror that kept multiple revs of rpms in rawhide...maybe it also had multiple revs back in the updates as well. -- -Paul Iadonisi Senior System Administrator Red Hat Certified Engineer / Local Linux Lobbyist Ever see a penguin fly? -- Try Linux. GPL all the way: Sell services, don't lease secrets From perbj at stanford.edu Mon Mar 14 00:00:12 2005 From: perbj at stanford.edu (Per Bjornsson) Date: Sun, 13 Mar 2005 16:00:12 -0800 Subject: Old kernel RPMS In-Reply-To: <1110756598.20672.51.camel@md.local.linuxlobbyist.org> References: <1110703151.3170.7.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> <1110703923.6278.38.camel@laptopd505.fenrus.org> <1110715889.3170.25.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> <200503131308.42776.ml-fedora@fathomssen.de> <1110716790.3170.31.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> <604aa79105031309462ea47e82@mail.gmail.com> <1110738973.31728.18.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> <1110740356.20672.21.camel@md.local.linuxlobbyist.org> <1594.10.10.10.24.1110755188.squirrel@linux1> <1110756598.20672.51.camel@md.local.linuxlobbyist.org> Message-ID: <1110758413.5182.44.camel@localhost.localdomain> On Sun, 2005-03-13 at 18:29 -0500, Paul Iadonisi wrote: > Possibly. I suppose developers can always use cvs to get what they > need. But that still leaves out the problem of older official updates > to releases disappearing. I'll see if I can find that mirror that kept > multiple revs of rpms in rawhide...maybe it also had multiple revs back > in the updates as well. Probably all of them, otherwise they aren't really mirrors as far as I can see: http://download.fedora.redhat.com/pub/fedora/linux/core/updates/3/i386/ appears to contain several revs when they have been issued. updates- testing I'm less sure about though, but the real releases do seem to be kept around - and since the ones that made it into updates-testing and got superseded before they were released often had somewhat severe problems I don't really think that the lack of an updates-testing archive is all that much of a problem. /Per -- Per Bjornsson Ph.D. Candidate, Department of Applied Physics, Stanford University From wtogami at redhat.com Mon Mar 14 00:06:01 2005 From: wtogami at redhat.com (Warren Togami) Date: Sun, 13 Mar 2005 14:06:01 -1000 Subject: Old kernel RPMS In-Reply-To: <1110740356.20672.21.camel@md.local.linuxlobbyist.org> References: <1110703151.3170.7.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> <1110703923.6278.38.camel@laptopd505.fenrus.org> <1110715889.3170.25.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> <200503131308.42776.ml-fedora@fathomssen.de> <1110716790.3170.31.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> <604aa79105031309462ea47e82@mail.gmail.com> <1110738973.31728.18.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> <1110740356.20672.21.camel@md.local.linuxlobbyist.org> Message-ID: <4234D569.4050600@redhat.com> Paul Iadonisi wrote: > What I'm referring to is the relatively quick disappearance of > previous updates, as well previous versions from rawhide. A concern > I've had about official updates disappearing, at least with respect to > GPL/LGPL licensed software, is that these older updates should be made > available for as long as the GPL requires (3 years?). Currently, they > disappear when new updates show up (or shortly thereafter). http://cvs.fedora.redhat.com/ Nothing stops you from checking out the appropriate tag and getting the exact source of the older package that disappeared. Warren Togami wtogami at redhat.com From jdesbonnet at gmail.com Mon Mar 14 01:59:07 2005 From: jdesbonnet at gmail.com (Joe Desbonnet) Date: Mon, 14 Mar 2005 01:59:07 +0000 Subject: A more efficient up2date service using binary diffs In-Reply-To: References: <423224E0.3000005@nc.rr.com> <42333234.8080106@nc.rr.com> Message-ID: <1cef3e9505031317593461f7d2@mail.gmail.com> I have more results from my experiments in RPM delta compression. I've posted the results so far here: http://www.wombat.ie/software/rpmdc/index.shtml Conclusion so far: assuming someone has the distribution RPMs available then an entire update repository (about 1GB) can be generated from 200MB of files. I hope to post my code once I clean it up a bit (it's implemented in Java currently). Must check out rdiff also... Joe. On Sun, 13 Mar 2005 20:44:15 +0000 (GMT), M A Young wrote: > > libgcj-4.0.0-0.31.i386.rpm 13942525 > libgcj-4.0.0-0.32.i386.rpm 13950302 > xdelta of rpms 6911651 > same (no compression) 7025625 > xdelta of header + cpio 3723074 > same (no compression) 8604163 > rdiff of rpms 7310525 > same (gzipped) 7159019 > rdiff signature of 1st rpm 81708 > rdiff of header + cpio 17870597 > same (gzipped) 5582770 > rdiff signature 190476 > From ivg2 at cornell.edu Mon Mar 14 03:20:10 2005 From: ivg2 at cornell.edu (Ivan Gyurdiev) Date: Sun, 13 Mar 2005 22:20:10 -0500 Subject: Old kernel RPMS In-Reply-To: <4234D569.4050600@redhat.com> References: <1110703151.3170.7.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> <1110703923.6278.38.camel@laptopd505.fenrus.org> <1110715889.3170.25.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> <200503131308.42776.ml-fedora@fathomssen.de> <1110716790.3170.31.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> <604aa79105031309462ea47e82@mail.gmail.com> <1110738973.31728.18.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> <1110740356.20672.21.camel@md.local.linuxlobbyist.org> <4234D569.4050600@redhat.com> Message-ID: <1110770411.4427.19.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> On Sun, 2005-03-13 at 14:06 -1000, Warren Togami wrote: > Paul Iadonisi wrote: > > What I'm referring to is the relatively quick disappearance of > > previous updates, as well previous versions from rawhide. A concern > > I've had about official updates disappearing, at least with respect to > > GPL/LGPL licensed software, is that these older updates should be made > > available for as long as the GPL requires (3 years?). Currently, they > > disappear when new updates show up (or shortly thereafter). > > http://cvs.fedora.redhat.com/ > Nothing stops you from checking out the appropriate tag and getting the > exact source of the older package that disappeared. Ok, thank you I will do exactly this. That's all I wanted to know - I hadn't thought of using the CVS server, as I never actually use that for anything.... but it would still be nice if you could type "yum rewind packageX," and have X and all its dependencies rolled back to the previous version :) -- Ivan Gyurdiev Cornell University From laroche at redhat.com Mon Mar 14 07:18:35 2005 From: laroche at redhat.com (Florian La Roche) Date: Mon, 14 Mar 2005 08:18:35 +0100 Subject: A more efficient up2date service using binary diffs In-Reply-To: <1cef3e9505031317593461f7d2@mail.gmail.com> References: <423224E0.3000005@nc.rr.com> <42333234.8080106@nc.rr.com> <1cef3e9505031317593461f7d2@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20050314071835.GA4018@dudweiler.stuttgart.redhat.com> On Mon, Mar 14, 2005 at 01:59:07AM +0000, Joe Desbonnet wrote: > I have more results from my experiments in RPM delta compression. I've posted > the results so far here: http://www.wombat.ie/software/rpmdc/index.shtml > > Conclusion so far: assuming someone has the distribution RPMs > available then an entire > update repository (about 1GB) can be generated from 200MB of files. > > I hope to post my code once I clean it up a bit (it's implemented in > Java currently). > > Must check out rdiff also... I've done tests some time ago that showed a 4.8 factor to reduce bandwidth needs for RHEL update releases. Big drawback will be the need of the previous packages, so this might again be only something for a local server to download updates, but not for normal client machines. Still the savings look very nice, so I think we should continue looking at this. greetings, Florian La Roche From peter.backlund at home.se Mon Mar 14 10:21:11 2005 From: peter.backlund at home.se (Peter Backlund) Date: Mon, 14 Mar 2005 11:21:11 +0100 Subject: yum/python/sqlite b0rkage in Rawhide Message-ID: <42356597.7040703@home.se> Hello. I'm running into this problem on Rawhide when running any yum operation that downloads anything other than metadata. Some of you may recognize it: Reading repository metadata in from local files Traceback (most recent call last): File "/usr/bin/yum", line 15, in ? yummain.main(sys.argv[1:]) File "/usr/share/yum-cli/yummain.py", line 72, in main result, resultmsgs = do() File "/usr/share/yum-cli/cli.py", line 462, in doCommands return self.updatePkgs() File "/usr/share/yum-cli/cli.py", line 960, in updatePkgs self.doUpdateSetup() File "__init__.py", line 228, in doUpdateSetup File "sqlitesack.py", line 225, in returnObsoletes File "/usr/src/build/539311-i386/install//usr/lib/python2.4/site-packages/sqlite/main.py", line 104, in __getitem__ KeyError: 'PACKAGES.PKGID' These are the package versions that I _think_ are relevant: [root at localhost ~]# rpm -qa \*sqlite\* python yum rpm\* rpm-libs-4.4.1-7 yum-2.3.1-1 rpm-build-4.4.1-7 sqlite-3.1.2-1 python-sqlite-1.1.6-1 rpm-python-4.4.1-7 python-2.4-4 rpm-4.4.1-7 Tried yum clean all, but the problem persists. /Peter From nicolas.mailhot at laposte.net Mon Mar 14 10:21:08 2005 From: nicolas.mailhot at laposte.net (Nicolas Mailhot) Date: Mon, 14 Mar 2005 11:21:08 +0100 (CET) Subject: yum/python/sqlite b0rkage in Rawhide In-Reply-To: <42356597.7040703@home.se> References: <42356597.7040703@home.se> Message-ID: <18568.192.54.193.137.1110795668.squirrel@rousalka.dyndns.org> On Lun 14 mars 2005 11:21, Peter Backlund a ?crit : > Hello. > > I'm running into this problem on Rawhide when running any yum operation > that downloads anything other than metadata. Some of you may recognize it: My yum blocks the update to latest rpm because yum is not built for the new sqlite (not sqlite3) packages Or did someone release a new yum package that is non-functional ? -- Nicolas Mailhot From peter.backlund at home.se Mon Mar 14 10:33:00 2005 From: peter.backlund at home.se (Peter Backlund) Date: Mon, 14 Mar 2005 11:33:00 +0100 Subject: yum/python/sqlite b0rkage in Rawhide In-Reply-To: <18568.192.54.193.137.1110795668.squirrel@rousalka.dyndns.org> References: <42356597.7040703@home.se> <18568.192.54.193.137.1110795668.squirrel@rousalka.dyndns.org> Message-ID: Nicolas Mailhot wrote: > On Lun 14 mars 2005 11:21, Peter Backlund a ?crit : > >>Hello. >> >>I'm running into this problem on Rawhide when running any yum operation >>that downloads anything other than metadata. Some of you may recognize it: > > > My yum blocks the update to latest rpm because yum is not built for the > new sqlite (not sqlite3) packages I had this problem with rpm 4.4.1-6 too, and with the older sqlite3-3.0.8 packages. I manually updated rpm and sqlite to the present versions, but the problem remained. /Peter From laroche at redhat.com Mon Mar 14 10:29:26 2005 From: laroche at redhat.com (Florian La Roche) Date: Mon, 14 Mar 2005 11:29:26 +0100 Subject: yum/python/sqlite b0rkage in Rawhide In-Reply-To: <18568.192.54.193.137.1110795668.squirrel@rousalka.dyndns.org> References: <42356597.7040703@home.se> <18568.192.54.193.137.1110795668.squirrel@rousalka.dyndns.org> Message-ID: <20050314102926.GB4932@dudweiler.stuttgart.redhat.com> > Or did someone release a new yum package that is non-functional ? I've pushed off a new yum to fix the requires, but I haven't actually tested if that also gives a working yum then. ;-( greetings, Florian La Roche From rodd at clarkson.id.au Mon Mar 14 10:36:27 2005 From: rodd at clarkson.id.au (Rodd Clarkson) Date: Mon, 14 Mar 2005 21:36:27 +1100 Subject: yum/python/sqlite b0rkage in Rawhide In-Reply-To: References: <42356597.7040703@home.se> <18568.192.54.193.137.1110795668.squirrel@rousalka.dyndns.org> Message-ID: <1110796587.4364.2.camel@goose> On Mon, 2005-03-14 at 11:33 +0100, Peter Backlund wrote: > Nicolas Mailhot wrote: > > On Lun 14 mars 2005 11:21, Peter Backlund a ?crit : > > > >>Hello. > >> > >>I'm running into this problem on Rawhide when running any yum operation > >>that downloads anything other than metadata. Some of you may recognize it: > > > > > > My yum blocks the update to latest rpm because yum is not built for the > > new sqlite (not sqlite3) packages > > I had this problem with rpm 4.4.1-6 too, and with the older > sqlite3-3.0.8 packages. I manually updated rpm and sqlite to the present > versions, but the problem remained. I'm guessing you used --force to get these to install. The current yum needs the older sqlite3 and won't work unless built against the newer version. Hopefully we'll see a newer yum soon in rawhide. Rodd From thomas.hille at nightsabers.org Mon Mar 14 11:40:23 2005 From: thomas.hille at nightsabers.org (Thomas Hille) Date: Mon, 14 Mar 2005 12:40:23 +0100 Subject: A more efficient up2date service using binary diffs In-Reply-To: <20050314071835.GA4018@dudweiler.stuttgart.redhat.com> References: <423224E0.3000005@nc.rr.com> <42333234.8080106@nc.rr.com> <1cef3e9505031317593461f7d2@mail.gmail.com> <20050314071835.GA4018@dudweiler.stuttgart.redhat.com> Message-ID: <1110800423.5843.13.camel@ice-dragon.ddn.de> Am Montag, den 14.03.2005, 08:18 +0100 schrieb Florian La Roche: > On Mon, Mar 14, 2005 at 01:59:07AM +0000, Joe Desbonnet wrote: > > I have more results from my experiments in RPM delta compression. I've posted > > the results so far here: http://www.wombat.ie/software/rpmdc/index.shtml > > > > Conclusion so far: assuming someone has the distribution RPMs > > available then an entire > > update repository (about 1GB) can be generated from 200MB of files. > > > > I hope to post my code once I clean it up a bit (it's implemented in > > Java currently). > > > > Must check out rdiff also... > > I've done tests some time ago that showed a 4.8 factor to reduce bandwidth > needs for RHEL update releases. Big drawback will be the need of the previous > packages, so this might again be only something for a local server to > download updates, but not for normal client machines. > Still the savings look very nice, so I think we should continue looking at > this. Just to give my 2 cents.... The drawback you talk about could be eliminated, when you diff not the whole rpm, but instead for the single files in it. - These are present on the client machine. Then the only problem that arises are corrupted files. So you would need to check the md5 before. Maybe doing the diff on the single files also could help compress the rpms, that were not compressible using the whole rpm (omni-foomatic etc.) Nevertheless, the recent OOo update makes me believe, that we should really think about anything that reduces bandwidth (even in the time of common broadband access). Thomas From n3npq at nc.rr.com Mon Mar 14 13:32:28 2005 From: n3npq at nc.rr.com (Jeff Johnson) Date: Mon, 14 Mar 2005 08:32:28 -0500 Subject: A more efficient up2date service using binary diffs In-Reply-To: <1110800423.5843.13.camel@ice-dragon.ddn.de> References: <423224E0.3000005@nc.rr.com> <42333234.8080106@nc.rr.com> <1cef3e9505031317593461f7d2@mail.gmail.com> <20050314071835.GA4018@dudweiler.stuttgart.redhat.com> <1110800423.5843.13.camel@ice-dragon.ddn.de> Message-ID: <4235926C.1040004@nc.rr.com> Thomas Hille wrote: >Am Montag, den 14.03.2005, 08:18 +0100 schrieb Florian La Roche: > > >>On Mon, Mar 14, 2005 at 01:59:07AM +0000, Joe Desbonnet wrote: >> >> >>>I have more results from my experiments in RPM delta compression. I've posted >>>the results so far here: http://www.wombat.ie/software/rpmdc/index.shtml >>> >>>Conclusion so far: assuming someone has the distribution RPMs >>>available then an entire >>>update repository (about 1GB) can be generated from 200MB of files. >>> >>>I hope to post my code once I clean it up a bit (it's implemented in >>>Java currently). >>> >>>Must check out rdiff also... >>> >>> >>I've done tests some time ago that showed a 4.8 factor to reduce bandwidth >>needs for RHEL update releases. Big drawback will be the need of the previous >>packages, so this might again be only something for a local server to >>download updates, but not for normal client machines. >>Still the savings look very nice, so I think we should continue looking at >>this. >> >> > >Just to give my 2 cents.... > >The drawback you talk about could be eliminated, when you diff not the >whole rpm, but instead for the single files in it. - These are present >on the client machine. Then the only problem that arises are corrupted >files. So you would need to check the md5 before. > > Yep. All this has been known since 1998, see rpm-list at redhat.com archives.. Josh McDonald, the xdelta guy, even had a proof-of-concept implementation in (iirc) xdelta-0.18 for *.rpm packages. Ooops, Red Hat chose not to maintain archives, too bad. >Maybe doing the diff on the single files also could help compress the >rpms, that were not compressible using the whole rpm (omni-foomatic >etc.) > >Nevertheless, the recent OOo update makes me believe, that we should >really think about anything that reduces bandwidth (even in the time of >common broadband access). > > I ask: If you have to rip apart a *.rpm package into it's components in order to achieve the goal of minimal bandwidth used to transfer a package, then what exactly is the point of putting the contents in a *.rpm package in the first place? 73 de Jeff From buildsys at redhat.com Mon Mar 14 12:37:22 2005 From: buildsys at redhat.com (Build System) Date: Mon, 14 Mar 2005 07:37:22 -0500 Subject: rawhide report: 20050314 changes Message-ID: <200503141237.j2ECbM7h014957@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> Updated Packages: dia-1:0.94-8 ------------ * Mon Mar 14 2005 Caolan McNamara - rh#150942# add BuildRequires ethereal-0.10.10-1 ------------------ * Mon Mar 14 2005 Radek Vokal 0.10.10-1 - new release, fixes three security and stability-related issues: - a buffer overflow in the Etheric dissector. (CAN-2005-0704) - the GPRS-LLC dissector could crash if the "ignore cipher bit" option was enabled. (CAN-2005-0705) - a buffer overflow in the 3GPP2 A11 dissector (CAN-2005-0699) - a buffer overflow in the IAPP dissector. - a bug in the JXTA dissector could make Ethereal crash. - a bug in the sFlow dissector could make Ethereal crash. kdepim-6:3.4.0-0.rc1.4 ---------------------- * Sun Mar 13 2005 Than Ngo 6:3.4.0-0.rc1.4 - rebuilt against pilot-link-0.12 libxml2-2.6.18-1 ---------------- * Sun Mar 13 2005 Daniel Veillard - upstream release 2.6.18 see http://xmlsoft.org/news.html * Thu Jan 02 2003 Daniel Veillard - integrated drv_libxml2 xml.sax driver from St?phane Bidoul - provides the new XmlTextReader interfaces based on C# XML APIs * Wed Oct 23 2002 Daniel Veillard - revamped the spec file, cleaned up some rpm building problems libxslt-1.1.13-1 ---------------- * Sun Mar 13 2005 Daniel Veillard - upstream release 1.1.13 see http://xmlsoft.org/XSLT/news.html * Sun Nov 02 2003 Daniel Veillard - cleanup, removal of the deprecated breakpoint library and automated libxml2 dependancy level in the generated spec file. * Wed Oct 23 2002 Daniel Veillard - revamped the spec file, cleaned up some rpm building problems mozilla-37:1.7.6-0.cvs.20050313 ------------------------------- * Sun Mar 13 2005 Christopher Aillon 37:1.7.6-0.cvs.20050313 - Update to latest 1.7.6 branch from CVS. mrtg-2.11.1-3 ------------- * Sun Mar 13 2005 Miloslav Trmac - 2.11.1-3 - Fix Timezone[] handling in html output (#149296) netpbm-10.26.4-3 ---------------- * Mon Mar 14 2005 Jindrich Novy 10.26.4-3 - fix overflow checking of integers with incompatible endianess causing problems using xwdtopnm (#147790) pilot-link-1:0.12.0-0.pre2.0 ---------------------------- * Sun Mar 13 2005 Than Ngo 0.12.0-0.pre2.0 - 0.12.0-pre2 - fix build gcc 4 problem shadow-utils-2:4.0.7-3 ---------------------- * Mon Mar 14 2005 Peter Vrabec - gcc4 fix (#150994) 2:4.0.7-3 * Mon Mar 07 2005 Peter Vrabec - man pages cs,es,ko,ru,zh_CN,zh_TW to UTF-8 vsftpd-2.0.2-1 -------------- * Mon Mar 14 2005 Radek Vokal 2.0.2-1 - update to new version, several bug fixes yum-2.3.1-2 ----------- * Mon Mar 14 2005 Florian La Roche - python-sqlite3 -> python-sqlite From cra at WPI.EDU Mon Mar 14 13:32:18 2005 From: cra at WPI.EDU (Chuck R. Anderson) Date: Mon, 14 Mar 2005 08:32:18 -0500 Subject: Old kernel RPMS In-Reply-To: <1110770411.4427.19.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> References: <1110703151.3170.7.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> <1110703923.6278.38.camel@laptopd505.fenrus.org> <1110715889.3170.25.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> <200503131308.42776.ml-fedora@fathomssen.de> <1110716790.3170.31.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> <604aa79105031309462ea47e82@mail.gmail.com> <1110738973.31728.18.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> <1110740356.20672.21.camel@md.local.linuxlobbyist.org> <4234D569.4050600@redhat.com> <1110770411.4427.19.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> Message-ID: <20050314133218.GC29104@angus.ind.WPI.EDU> On Sun, Mar 13, 2005 at 10:20:10PM -0500, Ivan Gyurdiev wrote: > Ok, thank you I will do exactly this. That's all I wanted to know - I > hadn't thought of using the CVS server, as I never actually use that for > anything.... but it would still be nice if you could type "yum rewind > packageX," and have X and all its dependencies rolled back to the > previous version :) up2date has a feature where is supports rollbacks. It repackages the files into an rpm stored in /var/spool/repackage. From wtogami at redhat.com Mon Mar 14 13:54:50 2005 From: wtogami at redhat.com (Warren Togami) Date: Mon, 14 Mar 2005 03:54:50 -1000 Subject: Old kernel RPMS In-Reply-To: <20050314133218.GC29104@angus.ind.WPI.EDU> References: <1110703151.3170.7.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> <1110703923.6278.38.camel@laptopd505.fenrus.org> <1110715889.3170.25.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> <200503131308.42776.ml-fedora@fathomssen.de> <1110716790.3170.31.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> <604aa79105031309462ea47e82@mail.gmail.com> <1110738973.31728.18.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> <1110740356.20672.21.camel@md.local.linuxlobbyist.org> <4234D569.4050600@redhat.com> <1110770411.4427.19.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> <20050314133218.GC29104@angus.ind.WPI.EDU> Message-ID: <423597AA.9040801@redhat.com> Chuck R. Anderson wrote: > On Sun, Mar 13, 2005 at 10:20:10PM -0500, Ivan Gyurdiev wrote: > >>Ok, thank you I will do exactly this. That's all I wanted to know - I >>hadn't thought of using the CVS server, as I never actually use that for >>anything.... but it would still be nice if you could type "yum rewind >>packageX," and have X and all its dependencies rolled back to the >>previous version :) > > > up2date has a feature where is supports rollbacks. It repackages the > files into an rpm stored in /var/spool/repackage. > "repackages" part is extremely scary. I hope nobody expects that to be reliable and supported. Warren Togami wtogami at redhat.com From selinux at gmail.com Mon Mar 14 14:28:27 2005 From: selinux at gmail.com (Tom London) Date: Mon, 14 Mar 2005 06:28:27 -0800 Subject: yum/python/sqlite b0rkage in Rawhide In-Reply-To: <20050314102926.GB4932@dudweiler.stuttgart.redhat.com> References: <42356597.7040703@home.se> <18568.192.54.193.137.1110795668.squirrel@rousalka.dyndns.org> <20050314102926.GB4932@dudweiler.stuttgart.redhat.com> Message-ID: <4c4ba15305031406287f16e990@mail.gmail.com> On Mon, 14 Mar 2005 11:29:26 +0100, Florian La Roche wrote: > I've pushed off a new yum to fix the requires, but I haven't > actually tested if that also gives a working yum then. ;-( > > greetings, > > Florian La Roche Downloaded and installed. Still fails with sqlite confusion: Guessing needs more than just fixing the requires.... tom -- Tom London From cturner at redhat.com Mon Mar 14 14:30:53 2005 From: cturner at redhat.com (Chip Turner) Date: Mon, 14 Mar 2005 09:30:53 -0500 Subject: Old kernel RPMS In-Reply-To: <423597AA.9040801@redhat.com> (Warren Togami's message of "Mon, 14 Mar 2005 03:54:50 -1000") References: <1110703151.3170.7.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> <1110703923.6278.38.camel@laptopd505.fenrus.org> <1110715889.3170.25.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> <200503131308.42776.ml-fedora@fathomssen.de> <1110716790.3170.31.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> <604aa79105031309462ea47e82@mail.gmail.com> <1110738973.31728.18.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> <1110740356.20672.21.camel@md.local.linuxlobbyist.org> <4234D569.4050600@redhat.com> <1110770411.4427.19.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> <20050314133218.GC29104@angus.ind.WPI.EDU> <423597AA.9040801@redhat.com> Message-ID: Warren Togami writes: > Chuck R. Anderson wrote: >> On Sun, Mar 13, 2005 at 10:20:10PM -0500, Ivan Gyurdiev wrote: >> >>>Ok, thank you I will do exactly this. That's all I wanted to know - I >>>hadn't thought of using the CVS server, as I never actually use that for >>>anything.... but it would still be nice if you could type "yum rewind >>>packageX," and have X and all its dependencies rolled back to the >>> previous version :) >> up2date has a feature where is supports rollbacks. It repackages >> the files into an rpm stored in /var/spool/repackage. >> > > "repackages" part is extremely scary. I hope nobody expects that to > be reliable and supported. Indeed... not to mention they aren't the original RPMs, just whatever is on disk when the rpm gets removed. Sadly, it is a lonely remnant of an abandoned development path. Chip -- Chip Turner cturner at redhat.com Red Hat, Inc. From skvidal at phy.duke.edu Mon Mar 14 14:34:59 2005 From: skvidal at phy.duke.edu (seth vidal) Date: Mon, 14 Mar 2005 09:34:59 -0500 Subject: yum/python/sqlite b0rkage in Rawhide In-Reply-To: <4c4ba15305031406287f16e990@mail.gmail.com> References: <42356597.7040703@home.se> <18568.192.54.193.137.1110795668.squirrel@rousalka.dyndns.org> <20050314102926.GB4932@dudweiler.stuttgart.redhat.com> <4c4ba15305031406287f16e990@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1110810899.28874.37.camel@cutter> > Downloaded and installed. Still fails with sqlite confusion: > > Guessing needs more than just fixing the requires.... > please provide the following: rpm -q yum rpm sqlite python-sqlite rpm -ql python-sqlite | grep _sqlite.so thanks. -sv From selinux at gmail.com Mon Mar 14 14:34:50 2005 From: selinux at gmail.com (Tom London) Date: Mon, 14 Mar 2005 06:34:50 -0800 Subject: yum/python/sqlite b0rkage in Rawhide In-Reply-To: <1110810899.28874.37.camel@cutter> References: <42356597.7040703@home.se> <18568.192.54.193.137.1110795668.squirrel@rousalka.dyndns.org> <20050314102926.GB4932@dudweiler.stuttgart.redhat.com> <4c4ba15305031406287f16e990@mail.gmail.com> <1110810899.28874.37.camel@cutter> Message-ID: <4c4ba153050314063471c2d30c@mail.gmail.com> On Mon, 14 Mar 2005 09:34:59 -0500, seth vidal wrote: > > > Downloaded and installed. Still fails with sqlite confusion: > > > > Guessing needs more than just fixing the requires.... > > > > please provide the following: > > rpm -q yum rpm sqlite python-sqlite > rpm -ql python-sqlite | grep _sqlite.so > > thanks. > -sv > [root at tlondon Downloads]# rpm -q yum rpm sqlite python-sqlite yum-2.3.1-2 rpm-4.4.1-7 sqlite-3.1.2-1 python-sqlite-1.1.6-1 [root at tlondon Downloads]# [root at tlondon Downloads]# rpm -ql python-sqlite | grep _sqlite.so /usr/lib/python2.4/site-packages/_sqlite.so [root at tlondon Downloads]# Hope this helps! tom -- Tom London From kyrre at solution-forge.net Mon Mar 14 15:01:53 2005 From: kyrre at solution-forge.net (Kyrre Ness Sjobak) Date: Mon, 14 Mar 2005 16:01:53 +0100 Subject: Old kernel RPMS In-Reply-To: <1110758413.5182.44.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <1110703151.3170.7.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> <1110703923.6278.38.camel@laptopd505.fenrus.org> <1110715889.3170.25.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> <200503131308.42776.ml-fedora@fathomssen.de> <1110716790.3170.31.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> <604aa79105031309462ea47e82@mail.gmail.com> <1110738973.31728.18.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> <1110740356.20672.21.camel@md.local.linuxlobbyist.org> <1594.10.10.10.24.1110755188.squirrel@linux1> <1110756598.20672.51.camel@md.local.linuxlobbyist.org> <1110758413.5182.44.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <1110812513.5775.4.camel@localhost.localdomain> man, 14.03.2005 kl. 01.00 skrev Per Bjornsson: > On Sun, 2005-03-13 at 18:29 -0500, Paul Iadonisi wrote: > > > Possibly. I suppose developers can always use cvs to get what they > > need. But that still leaves out the problem of older official updates > > to releases disappearing. I'll see if I can find that mirror that kept > > multiple revs of rpms in rawhide...maybe it also had multiple revs back > > in the updates as well. > > Probably all of them, otherwise they aren't really mirrors as far as I > can see: > http://download.fedora.redhat.com/pub/fedora/linux/core/updates/3/i386/ > appears to contain several revs when they have been issued. updates- > testing I'm less sure about though, but the real releases do seem to be > kept around - and since the ones that made it into updates-testing and > got superseded before they were released often had somewhat severe > problems I don't really think that the lack of an updates-testing > archive is all that much of a problem. > > /Per OTOH, somebody migth have the rpm in question in /var/cache/yum From kyrre at solution-forge.net Mon Mar 14 15:16:04 2005 From: kyrre at solution-forge.net (Kyrre Ness Sjobak) Date: Mon, 14 Mar 2005 16:16:04 +0100 Subject: A more efficient up2date service using binary diffs In-Reply-To: <20050314071835.GA4018@dudweiler.stuttgart.redhat.com> References: <423224E0.3000005@nc.rr.com> <42333234.8080106@nc.rr.com> <1cef3e9505031317593461f7d2@mail.gmail.com> <20050314071835.GA4018@dudweiler.stuttgart.redhat.com> Message-ID: <1110813363.5775.18.camel@localhost.localdomain> man, 14.03.2005 kl. 08.18 skrev Florian La Roche: > On Mon, Mar 14, 2005 at 01:59:07AM +0000, Joe Desbonnet wrote: > > I have more results from my experiments in RPM delta compression. I've posted > > the results so far here: http://www.wombat.ie/software/rpmdc/index.shtml > > > > Conclusion so far: assuming someone has the distribution RPMs > > available then an entire > > update repository (about 1GB) can be generated from 200MB of files. > > > > I hope to post my code once I clean it up a bit (it's implemented in > > Java currently). > > > > Must check out rdiff also... > > I've done tests some time ago that showed a 4.8 factor to reduce bandwidth > needs for RHEL update releases. Big drawback will be the need of the previous > packages, so this might again be only something for a local server to > download updates, but not for normal client machines. > Still the savings look very nice, so I think we should continue looking at > this. What if we made some steps here: 1. place an option in anaconda to copy all rpm's to disk. Put them in say, /var/cache/yum/whatever/is/under/here/again 2. Create the stuff as a independent program, say rpmpatch (sympnosis: "rpmpatch oldrpm.rpm newrpm.prpm" which outputs newrpm.rpm). This way, it can also be used manually 3. make the master repository also create prpm's - which then will be mirrored. 4. make yum check if: - are there any "old" rpm's lying around localy - are there any new prpm's in the repository - if many steps - is it a smaller download to get, say two prpm's, and patch incrementally untill you get the wanted rpm? If yes to theese three - get the prpm, not the full rpm. (get headers the usual old way - byte-ranges from the full rpm's) If no to any of theese - get the full rpm's, just as we do today. 5. When yum has finished downloading, use rpmpatch (maybe making it acessable as a libary, not only a cmd-line program) to generate the full rpm. Install it through old "rpm -Uvh" (or libary equalient) as it normally would. This way it will add very little complexity. No change to mirrors, no change to rpm itself. Only a little change on the "master repo". A new program on the client, a little change to yum to make it get the prpm's instead of the full rpms, patch to generate full rpm, and install the usual way. Kyrre From katzj at redhat.com Mon Mar 14 15:25:21 2005 From: katzj at redhat.com (Jeremy Katz) Date: Mon, 14 Mar 2005 10:25:21 -0500 Subject: DKMS usage (was: rawhide report: 20050310 changes) In-Reply-To: <20050312134423.GA13158@lists.us.dell.com> References: <20050310172126.GC24517@nostromo.devel.redhat.com> <1110475954.6291.118.camel@laptopd505.fenrus.org> <604aa7910503100948705e7baf@mail.gmail.com> <42309CBA.6060708@redhat.com> <20050310232552.GA27026@ti64.telemetry-investments.com> <20050311150457.7132159f@nausicaa.camperquake.de> <20050311231820.GB29498@lists.us.dell.com> <20050312134423.GA13158@lists.us.dell.com> Message-ID: <1110813921.4909.15.camel@bree.local.net> On Sat, 2005-03-12 at 07:44 -0600, Matt Domsch wrote: > Yes, it can. It uses the headers/Makefile left in > /lib/modules/${kernelversion}/build/ from the kernel RPM. (That is, > <= FC3, as I see FC4-rawhide will require kernel-devel packages be > installed on the build system, no real big suprise there though). ... > The multiple-architecture thing gets a little tricky, I have to > admit. /lib/modules/`uname -r`/ doesn't take in having multiple > architectures on the file system. But that's OK, DKMS can be passed > --kernelsourcedir=source-location and And kernel-devel actually helps the multiple architecture situation since the kernel-devel packages install into architecture dependent paths so that you can have as many of them installed as you want. Jeremy From Brian.Edginton at ge.com Mon Mar 14 15:42:55 2005 From: Brian.Edginton at ge.com (Edginton, Brian (GE Healthcare)) Date: Mon, 14 Mar 2005 09:42:55 -0600 Subject: source for isolinux.bin Message-ID: <42BB180FA5BC094B8859720526D89B6603FE48A1@MKEMLVEM04.e2k.ad.ge.com> I have googled to try and find the source for isolinux.bin and haven't been successful. Does anyone here know where it can be found? Thanks, edge From jspaleta at gmail.com Mon Mar 14 15:41:46 2005 From: jspaleta at gmail.com (Jeff Spaleta) Date: Mon, 14 Mar 2005 10:41:46 -0500 Subject: yum/python/sqlite b0rkage in Rawhide In-Reply-To: <4c4ba15305031406287f16e990@mail.gmail.com> References: <42356597.7040703@home.se> <18568.192.54.193.137.1110795668.squirrel@rousalka.dyndns.org> <20050314102926.GB4932@dudweiler.stuttgart.redhat.com> <4c4ba15305031406287f16e990@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <604aa7910503140741c48688@mail.gmail.com> On Mon, 14 Mar 2005 06:28:27 -0800, Tom London wrote: > Downloaded and installed. Still fails with sqlite confusion: > > Guessing needs more than just fixing the requires.... the weird part is... this started with the name change of the sqlite package. Not that I am encouraging anyone to attempt this.. because if you do it wrong rpm stops working... but if you force the downgrade of just the sqlite package back to sqlite3 everything works again. Which seems a bit odd to me. Its almost like the new sqlite package included more than just a name change. The old sqlite3 package provides the same set of libraries as the renamed sqlite which the _sqlite.so from python-sqlite AND python-sqlite3 happily link against. /usr/lib/libsqlite3.so.0 is the specific library of interest I think. Disregarding packaging deps for yum and python-sqlite/python-sqlite3 I can get yum-2.3.1-2 or yum-2.3.1-1 with python-sqlite or python-sqlite3 with sqlite3 working using rpm-4.4.1-7 No combination of packages provides a working yum with the renamed sqlite package on my system. Naively this makes me think that something significant changed inside the sqlite package when it was renamed to sqlite from sqlite3. Let me repeat my previous dire warning. If anyone wants to attempt to reproduce my results for confirmation.... make sure you backup /usr/lib/libsqlite3.so.0 first before you start trying to force a downgrade of sqlite to sqlite3. rpm will not start unless /usr/lib/libsqlite3.so.0 is there to link against so make sure you make a backup copy of that library to use in case it gets erased during your testing operations. -jef"a sqlite3 package by any othername, appearently don't smell as sweet as you would think"spaleta From eric at snowmoon.com Mon Mar 14 15:44:43 2005 From: eric at snowmoon.com (Eric Warnke) Date: Mon, 14 Mar 2005 10:44:43 -0500 Subject: source for isolinux.bin In-Reply-To: <42BB180FA5BC094B8859720526D89B6603FE48A1@MKEMLVEM04.e2k.ad.ge.com> References: <42BB180FA5BC094B8859720526D89B6603FE48A1@MKEMLVEM04.e2k.ad.ge.com> Message-ID: <4235B16B.8060208@snowmoon.com> Edginton, Brian (GE Healthcare) wrote: >I have googled to try and find the source for isolinux.bin and haven't been successful. Does anyone here know where it can be found? > >Thanks, > edge > > > http://www.kernel.org/pub/linux/utils/boot/syslinux/syslinux-3.07.tar.gz isolinux.asm looks like the source file. Cheers, Eric -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 251 bytes Desc: OpenPGP digital signature URL: From dag at wieers.com Mon Mar 14 16:07:39 2005 From: dag at wieers.com (Dag Wieers) Date: Mon, 14 Mar 2005 17:07:39 +0100 (CET) Subject: A more efficient up2date service using binary diffs In-Reply-To: <4235926C.1040004@nc.rr.com> References: <423224E0.3000005@nc.rr.com> <42333234.8080106@nc.rr.com> <1cef3e9505031317593461f7d2@mail.gmail.com> <20050314071835.GA4018@dudweiler.stuttgart.redhat.com> <1110800423.5843.13.camel@ice-dragon.ddn.de> <4235926C.1040004@nc.rr.com> Message-ID: On Mon, 14 Mar 2005, Jeff Johnson wrote: > I ask: > > If you have to rip apart a *.rpm package into it's components in order to > achieve the goal of minimal bandwidth used to transfer a package, > then what exactly is the point of putting the contents in a *.rpm > package in the first place? Wait a minute, why don't we just distribute a CVS repository and SPEC files and leave the building up to the system ? Wouldn't that be a neat idea, we could use Makefiles or shellscripts as glue ? :) -- dag wieers, dag at wieers.com, http://dag.wieers.com/ -- [all I want is a warm bed and a kind word and unlimited power] From jspaleta at gmail.com Mon Mar 14 16:11:06 2005 From: jspaleta at gmail.com (Jeff Spaleta) Date: Mon, 14 Mar 2005 11:11:06 -0500 Subject: yum/python/sqlite b0rkage in Rawhide In-Reply-To: <604aa7910503140741c48688@mail.gmail.com> References: <42356597.7040703@home.se> <18568.192.54.193.137.1110795668.squirrel@rousalka.dyndns.org> <20050314102926.GB4932@dudweiler.stuttgart.redhat.com> <4c4ba15305031406287f16e990@mail.gmail.com> <604aa7910503140741c48688@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <604aa79105031408113b06b778@mail.gmail.com> On Mon, 14 Mar 2005 10:41:46 -0500, Jeff Spaleta wrote: > Naively this makes me think that > something significant changed inside the sqlite package when it was > renamed to sqlite from sqlite3. A little more evidence to indicate something inside libsqlite3.so.0.8.6 is different between sqlite and sqlite3 packages. I replace just the libsqlite3.so.0.8.6 file from sqlite package with the version from sqlite3 package and yum works again. The is something different about the libsqlite3.so.0.8.6 file between package versions. Here's my procedure: Force the installation of sqlite3-3.0.8-3.i386.rpm using yum-2.3.1-2 python-sqlite-1.1.6-1 rpm-4.4.1-7 make sure rpm -V sqlite3 returns clean make sure yum will operate yum check-update is enough to check cp /usr/lib/libsqlite3.so.0.8.6 somewhere safe update to sqlite-3.1.2-1 make sure rpm -V sqlite returns clean yum check-update will blow up mv saved copy of libsqlite3.so.0.8.6 back to /usr/lib/ rpm -V sqlite returns S.5....T. /usr/lib/libsqlite3.so.0.8.6 yum check-update works again. Was there ever a published sqlite3 package for version 3.1.2? The problem could be associated with internal sqlite library change between 3.1.2 and 3.0.8. -jef From eric.tanguy at univ-nantes.fr Mon Mar 14 15:37:18 2005 From: eric.tanguy at univ-nantes.fr (Eric Tanguy) Date: Mon, 14 Mar 2005 16:37:18 +0100 Subject: TV Tuner problem Message-ID: <1110814638.12325.3.camel@localhost.localdomain> I send an email to this list because i tried a lot of thing to solve my problem and maybe it could be a module problem : modprobing bttv seems to give good results and all is autodetected : bttv: driver version 0.9.15 loaded bttv: using 8 buffers with 2080k (520 pages) each for capture bttv: Bt8xx card found (0). ACPI: PCI interrupt 0000:01:07.0[A] -> GSI 11 (level, low) -> IRQ 11 bttv0: Bt878 (rev 17) at 0000:01:07.0, irq: 11, latency: 64, mmio: 0xeb800000 bttv0: detected: Pinnacle PCTV [card=39], PCI subsystem ID is 11bd:0012 bttv0: using: Pinnacle PCTV Studio/Rave [card=39,autodetected] bttv0: gpio: en=00000000, out=00000000 in=00fff3ff [init] bttv0: i2c: checking for MSP34xx @ 0x80... not found bttv0: pinnacle/mt: id=4 info="PAL+SECAM / mono" radio=no bttv0: using tuner=33 bttv0: i2c: checking for MSP34xx @ 0x80... not found bttv0: i2c: checking for TDA9875 @ 0xb0... not found bttv0: i2c: checking for TDA7432 @ 0x8a... not found tda9885/6/7: chip found @ 0x96 tuner: chip found at addr 0xc0 i2c-bus bt878 #0 [sw] tuner: type set to 33 (MT20xx universal) by bt878 #0 [sw] tuner: microtune: companycode=3cbf part=42 rev=2f tuner: microtune MT2050 found, OK bttv0: registered device video0 bttv0: registered device vbi0 bttv0: PLL: 28636363 => 35468950 . ok The problem is i receive no signal in tvtime whereas this card works fine under windows. It seems the system cannot set the right tuner frequency : mt2050_set_if_freq failed with -121 Someone could help me ? -- Eric Tanguy | Nantes, France Key : A4B8368F | Key Server : subkeys.pgp.net Fedora Core release 3 (Heidelberg) sur athlon kernel 2.6.10-1.770_FC3 -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: Ceci est une partie de message num?riquement sign?e URL: From jharnish at ci.grand-rapids.mi.us Mon Mar 14 16:25:55 2005 From: jharnish at ci.grand-rapids.mi.us (Harnish, Joseph) Date: Mon, 14 Mar 2005 11:25:55 -0500 Subject: A more efficient up2date service using binary diffs Message-ID: <221C759285B78647AEE6181FD6AF36A70F84D7DE@bambi.grand-rapids.mi.us> Gentoo? -----Original Message----- From: fedora-devel-list-bounces at redhat.com [mailto:fedora-devel-list-bounces at redhat.com] On Behalf Of Dag Wieers Sent: Monday, March 14, 2005 11:08 AM To: Development discussions related to Fedora Core Subject: Re: A more efficient up2date service using binary diffs On Mon, 14 Mar 2005, Jeff Johnson wrote: > I ask: > > If you have to rip apart a *.rpm package into it's components in order to > achieve the goal of minimal bandwidth used to transfer a package, > then what exactly is the point of putting the contents in a *.rpm > package in the first place? Wait a minute, why don't we just distribute a CVS repository and SPEC files and leave the building up to the system ? Wouldn't that be a neat idea, we could use Makefiles or shellscripts as glue ? :) -- dag wieers, dag at wieers.com, http://dag.wieers.com/ -- [all I want is a warm bed and a kind word and unlimited power] -- fedora-devel-list mailing list fedora-devel-list at redhat.com http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-list -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From rhl-devel-list at lnx.ro Mon Mar 14 16:26:55 2005 From: rhl-devel-list at lnx.ro (Dumitru Ciobarcianu) Date: Mon, 14 Mar 2005 18:26:55 +0200 Subject: A more efficient up2date service using binary diffs In-Reply-To: References: <423224E0.3000005@nc.rr.com> <42333234.8080106@nc.rr.com> <1cef3e9505031317593461f7d2@mail.gmail.com> <20050314071835.GA4018@dudweiler.stuttgart.redhat.com> <1110800423.5843.13.camel@ice-dragon.ddn.de> <4235926C.1040004@nc.rr.com> Message-ID: <1110817616.9819.50.camel@DustPuppy.LNX.RO> ?n data de Lu, 14-03-2005 la 17:07 +0100, Dag Wieers a scris: > Wait a minute, why don't we just distribute a CVS repository and SPEC > files and leave the building up to the system ? Wouldn't that be a neat > idea, we could use Makefiles or shellscripts as glue ? :) Don't forget the USE flags and especially --omg-optimize ... :) :) -- Cioby From davej at redhat.com Mon Mar 14 16:47:22 2005 From: davej at redhat.com (Dave Jones) Date: Mon, 14 Mar 2005 11:47:22 -0500 Subject: Alsa Drivers Missing In The FC4 Kernel In-Reply-To: <20050313223240.GB3658@rednote.net> References: <20050313182649.GA3658@rednote.net> <20050313203922.GB29867@redhat.com> <20050313223240.GB3658@rednote.net> Message-ID: <20050314164722.GA1799@redhat.com> On Sun, Mar 13, 2005 at 05:32:40PM -0500, Janina Sajka wrote: > FC4 kernels will be alsa 1.0.8, no? It will be whatever matches what the ALSA folks get merged in 2.6.12. > The Echo cards are supported for the > first time in 1.0.8. There are quite a few, and they tend toward the > high-end, audio professional level. The alsa-driver config file, > toplevel.config, lists them as: > > CONFIG_SND_DARLA20=m > CONFIG_FW_LOADER=m > CONFIG_SND_GINA20=m > CONFIG_SND_LAYLA20=m > CONFIG_SND_DARLA24=m > CONFIG_SND_GINA24=m > CONFIG_SND_LAYLA24=m > CONFIG_SND_MONA=m > CONFIG_SND_MIA=m > CONFIG_SND_GINA3G=m > CONFIG_SND_LAYLA3G=m > CONFIG_SND_INDIGO=m None of these options seem present in the current kernel. It's not uncommon for the userspace tools to claim support for drivers that aren't yet merged. Hopefully they'll catch up by 2.6.12 Dave From fedora at wir-sind-cool.org Mon Mar 14 17:25:28 2005 From: fedora at wir-sind-cool.org (Michael Schwendt) Date: Mon, 14 Mar 2005 18:25:28 +0100 Subject: yum/python/sqlite b0rkage in Rawhide In-Reply-To: <604aa79105031408113b06b778@mail.gmail.com> References: <42356597.7040703@home.se> <18568.192.54.193.137.1110795668.squirrel@rousalka.dyndns.org> <20050314102926.GB4932@dudweiler.stuttgart.redhat.com> <4c4ba15305031406287f16e990@mail.gmail.com> <604aa7910503140741c48688@mail.gmail.com> <604aa79105031408113b06b778@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20050314182528.1be664a6.fedora@wir-sind-cool.org> On Mon, 14 Mar 2005 11:11:06 -0500, Jeff Spaleta wrote: > Was there ever a published sqlite3 package for version 3.1.2? I don't think so. Just for the record, SQLite 3.1.2 is the first stable version of the v3 series. > The > problem could be associated with internal sqlite library change > between 3.1.2 and 3.0.8. Interestingly, the sqlite package now upgrades sqlite 2.8.16 from Fedora Extras. This creates a jump from libsqlite.so to libsqlite3.so and breaks ABI and API. I forgot again which sqlite users we have in Fedora Extras, "kannel" was one of them, I think. From terraformers at gmx.net Mon Mar 14 16:56:11 2005 From: terraformers at gmx.net (Lars) Date: Mon, 14 Mar 2005 17:56:11 +0100 Subject: rawhide report: 20050314 changes References: <200503141237.j2ECbM7h014957@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> Message-ID: had to exclude pilot-link because of: Error: Missing Dependency: libpisock.so.8 is needed by package evolution Error: Missing Dependency: libpisock.so.8 is needed by package gnome-pilot L From harald at redhat.com Mon Mar 14 17:28:47 2005 From: harald at redhat.com (Harald Hoyer) Date: Mon, 14 Mar 2005 18:28:47 +0100 Subject: A more efficient up2date service using binary diffs In-Reply-To: <422F3ACE.7010309@math.unl.edu> References: <422F17B5.5070402@galway.net> <1110383623.3448.8.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1110383996.31871.28.camel@cutter> <1cef3e95050309082839ba4beb@mail.gmail.com> <1110391094.3448.18.camel@localhost.localdomain> <422F3ACE.7010309@math.unl.edu> Message-ID: <4235C9CF.3030308@redhat.com> Rex Dieter wrote: > Yeah, and then *every* revision of the rpm needs to be made available in > order to construct every possible patch (unless *only* patches from the > base rpm are ever released, which, IMO, would be bad in other ways). why? The server has the FC-3 released rpm, the newest update rpm, and the newest delta from the released to the newest. client checks for new rpm if there is a new one: if there is not a local released-rpm (maybe on CD): if there is an old update and old delta?: reconstruct the released rpm, by reverse delta download the delta apply delta to the released-rpm > newest install newest-rpm else: download the newest-rpm download the delta (to later create the released-rpm) install newest-rpm else: download the delta apply delta to the released-rpm > newest install newest-rpm The update app could ask to insert the appropriate CD to get the released-rpm. From jspaleta at gmail.com Mon Mar 14 17:45:56 2005 From: jspaleta at gmail.com (Jeff Spaleta) Date: Mon, 14 Mar 2005 12:45:56 -0500 Subject: yum/python/sqlite b0rkage in Rawhide In-Reply-To: <20050314182528.1be664a6.fedora@wir-sind-cool.org> References: <42356597.7040703@home.se> <18568.192.54.193.137.1110795668.squirrel@rousalka.dyndns.org> <20050314102926.GB4932@dudweiler.stuttgart.redhat.com> <4c4ba15305031406287f16e990@mail.gmail.com> <604aa7910503140741c48688@mail.gmail.com> <604aa79105031408113b06b778@mail.gmail.com> <20050314182528.1be664a6.fedora@wir-sind-cool.org> Message-ID: <604aa79105031409455dab2e96@mail.gmail.com> On Mon, 14 Mar 2005 18:25:28 +0100, Michael Schwendt wrote: >I don't think so. Just for the record, SQLite 3.1.2 is the first stable > version of the v3 series. yeah even upstreams 3.1.5 release seems to be affected according to to some ongoing testing by some people on irc. Appearently there has been a change in the allowed sql syntax. Considering that 3.1.x is suppose to be backwards compatible with the 3.0.x series, this feels like an upstream bug to me. Poking at the upstream bugzilla i see similar issues regard some syntax regressions but not the exact problem being experienced here. It could be a bug.. or it could be a configurable syntax parsing rule issue. > Interestingly, the sqlite package now upgrades sqlite 2.8.16 from Fedora > Extras. This creates a jump from libsqlite.so to libsqlite3.so and > breaks ABI and API Yeah thats a little added wrinkle for sure, consider this a wonderful multiversion test case for Fedora Extras packaging guidelines. -jef"names have been withheld to protect the innocent"spaleta From kyrre at solution-forge.net Mon Mar 14 18:33:08 2005 From: kyrre at solution-forge.net (Kyrre Ness Sjobak) Date: Mon, 14 Mar 2005 19:33:08 +0100 Subject: yum/python/sqlite b0rkage in Rawhide In-Reply-To: <604aa79105031409455dab2e96@mail.gmail.com> References: <42356597.7040703@home.se> <18568.192.54.193.137.1110795668.squirrel@rousalka.dyndns.org> <20050314102926.GB4932@dudweiler.stuttgart.redhat.com> <4c4ba15305031406287f16e990@mail.gmail.com> <604aa7910503140741c48688@mail.gmail.com> <604aa79105031408113b06b778@mail.gmail.com> <20050314182528.1be664a6.fedora@wir-sind-cool.org> <604aa79105031409455dab2e96@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1110825188.5775.26.camel@localhost.localdomain> man, 14.03.2005 kl. 18.45 skrev Jeff Spaleta: > On Mon, 14 Mar 2005 18:25:28 +0100, Michael Schwendt > wrote: > >I don't think so. Just for the record, SQLite 3.1.2 is the first stable > > version of the v3 series. > > yeah even upstreams 3.1.5 release seems to be affected according to to > some ongoing testing by some people on irc. Appearently there has been > a change in the allowed sql syntax. Considering that 3.1.x is suppose > to be backwards compatible with the 3.0.x series, this feels like an > upstream bug to me. Poking at the upstream bugzilla i see similar > issues regard some syntax regressions but not the exact problem being > experienced here. It could be a bug.. or it could be a configurable > syntax parsing rule issue. > > > Interestingly, the sqlite package now upgrades sqlite 2.8.16 from Fedora > > Extras. This creates a jump from libsqlite.so to libsqlite3.so and > > breaks ABI and API > > Yeah thats a little added wrinkle for sure, consider this a wonderful > multiversion test case for Fedora Extras packaging guidelines. > > -jef"names have been withheld to protect the innocent"spaleta Then who should provide the sqlite-compat? extras (it won't be compat for fc3)? base? Or maybe its time to consider naming it sqlite3 and sqlite2... From kyrre at solution-forge.net Mon Mar 14 18:39:24 2005 From: kyrre at solution-forge.net (Kyrre Ness Sjobak) Date: Mon, 14 Mar 2005 19:39:24 +0100 Subject: A more efficient up2date service using binary diffs In-Reply-To: <4235C9CF.3030308@redhat.com> References: <422F17B5.5070402@galway.net> <1110383623.3448.8.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1110383996.31871.28.camel@cutter> <1cef3e95050309082839ba4beb@mail.gmail.com> <1110391094.3448.18.camel@localhost.localdomain> <422F3ACE.7010309@math.unl.edu> <4235C9CF.3030308@redhat.com> Message-ID: <1110825564.5775.31.camel@localhost.localdomain> man, 14.03.2005 kl. 18.28 skrev Harald Hoyer: > Rex Dieter wrote: > > Yeah, and then *every* revision of the rpm needs to be made available in > > order to construct every possible patch (unless *only* patches from the > > base rpm are ever released, which, IMO, would be bad in other ways). > > why? > The server has the FC-3 released rpm, the newest update rpm, and the newest > delta from the released to the newest. > > client checks for new rpm > if there is a new one: > if there is not a local released-rpm (maybe on CD): > if there is an old update and old delta?: > reconstruct the released rpm, by reverse delta > download the delta > apply delta to the released-rpm > newest > install newest-rpm > else: > download the newest-rpm > download the delta (to later create the released-rpm) > install newest-rpm > else: > download the delta > apply delta to the released-rpm > newest > install newest-rpm > > The update app could ask to insert the appropriate CD to get the released-rpm. We can't make a system be dependent on using CD's. Either it uses old versions stored on *disk* (anaconda install option - if you are on a broadband, it isn't worth it. If you are on a modem, copy all rpm's to some place), or it downloads the whole thing. Please no "please insert CD 3!" "CD3? I did a network install?!?" "please insert CD3" "OMG!!!" From fedora at wir-sind-cool.org Mon Mar 14 19:01:08 2005 From: fedora at wir-sind-cool.org (Michael Schwendt) Date: Mon, 14 Mar 2005 20:01:08 +0100 Subject: yum/python/sqlite b0rkage in Rawhide In-Reply-To: <1110825188.5775.26.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <42356597.7040703@home.se> <18568.192.54.193.137.1110795668.squirrel@rousalka.dyndns.org> <20050314102926.GB4932@dudweiler.stuttgart.redhat.com> <4c4ba15305031406287f16e990@mail.gmail.com> <604aa7910503140741c48688@mail.gmail.com> <604aa79105031408113b06b778@mail.gmail.com> <20050314182528.1be664a6.fedora@wir-sind-cool.org> <604aa79105031409455dab2e96@mail.gmail.com> <1110825188.5775.26.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <20050314200108.035edd1b.fedora@wir-sind-cool.org> On Mon, 14 Mar 2005 19:33:08 +0100, Kyrre Ness Sjobak wrote: > > >I don't think so. Just for the record, SQLite 3.1.2 is the first stable > > > version of the v3 series. > > > > yeah even upstreams 3.1.5 release seems to be affected according to to > > some ongoing testing by some people on irc. Appearently there has been > > a change in the allowed sql syntax. Considering that 3.1.x is suppose > > to be backwards compatible with the 3.0.x series, this feels like an > > upstream bug to me. Poking at the upstream bugzilla i see similar > > issues regard some syntax regressions but not the exact problem being > > experienced here. It could be a bug.. or it could be a configurable > > syntax parsing rule issue. > > > > > Interestingly, the sqlite package now upgrades sqlite 2.8.16 from Fedora > > > Extras. This creates a jump from libsqlite.so to libsqlite3.so and > > > breaks ABI and API > > > > Yeah thats a little added wrinkle for sure, consider this a wonderful > > multiversion test case for Fedora Extras packaging guidelines. > > > > -jef"names have been withheld to protect the innocent"spaleta > > Then who should provide the sqlite-compat? extras (it won't be compat > for fc3)? base? Or maybe its time to consider naming it sqlite3 and > sqlite2... Well, it started as sqlite3, with good reason. Look: -rwxr-xr-x root root 29844 /usr/bin/sqlite3 lrwxrwxrwx root root 19 /usr/lib/libsqlite3.so.0 -rwxr-xr-x root root 316204 /usr/lib/libsqlite3.so.0.8.6 -rw-r--r-- root root 52690 /usr/include/sqlite3.h -rw-r--r-- root root 403624 /usr/lib/libsqlite3.a -rwxr-xr-x root root 819 /usr/lib/libsqlite3.la lrwxrwxrwx root root 19 /usr/lib/libsqlite3.so -rw-r--r-- root root 231 /usr/lib/pkgconfig/sqlite3.pc Sure, the v2 sqlite package could be rename to sqlite0 or sqlite2 if it will still be needed. But that's not the point. From skvidal at phy.duke.edu Mon Mar 14 19:03:05 2005 From: skvidal at phy.duke.edu (seth vidal) Date: Mon, 14 Mar 2005 14:03:05 -0500 Subject: yum/python/sqlite b0rkage in Rawhide In-Reply-To: <20050314200108.035edd1b.fedora@wir-sind-cool.org> References: <42356597.7040703@home.se> <18568.192.54.193.137.1110795668.squirrel@rousalka.dyndns.org> <20050314102926.GB4932@dudweiler.stuttgart.redhat.com> <4c4ba15305031406287f16e990@mail.gmail.com> <604aa7910503140741c48688@mail.gmail.com> <604aa79105031408113b06b778@mail.gmail.com> <20050314182528.1be664a6.fedora@wir-sind-cool.org> <604aa79105031409455dab2e96@mail.gmail.com> <1110825188.5775.26.camel@localhost.localdomain> <20050314200108.035edd1b.fedora@wir-sind-cool.org> Message-ID: <1110826985.23972.30.camel@opus.phy.duke.edu> > Well, it started as sqlite3, with good reason. Look: > > -rwxr-xr-x root root 29844 /usr/bin/sqlite3 > lrwxrwxrwx root root 19 /usr/lib/libsqlite3.so.0 > -rwxr-xr-x root root 316204 /usr/lib/libsqlite3.so.0.8.6 > -rw-r--r-- root root 52690 /usr/include/sqlite3.h > -rw-r--r-- root root 403624 /usr/lib/libsqlite3.a > -rwxr-xr-x root root 819 /usr/lib/libsqlite3.la > lrwxrwxrwx root root 19 /usr/lib/libsqlite3.so > -rw-r--r-- root root 231 /usr/lib/pkgconfig/sqlite3.pc > > Sure, the v2 sqlite package could be rename to sqlite0 or sqlite2 if it > will still be needed. But that's not the point. I asked for it to be changed from sqlite3 to sqlite b/c it made little sense to me that the package should be named sqlite3 when we weren't providing sqlite(any number) in the rest of the distro. add to that the the upstream package name is sqlite, not sqlite3 and I didn't see a compelling reason to have an odd ball virtual provide (and dep) for the package. -sv From fedora at wir-sind-cool.org Mon Mar 14 19:18:46 2005 From: fedora at wir-sind-cool.org (Michael Schwendt) Date: Mon, 14 Mar 2005 20:18:46 +0100 Subject: yum/python/sqlite b0rkage in Rawhide In-Reply-To: <1110826985.23972.30.camel@opus.phy.duke.edu> References: <42356597.7040703@home.se> <18568.192.54.193.137.1110795668.squirrel@rousalka.dyndns.org> <20050314102926.GB4932@dudweiler.stuttgart.redhat.com> <4c4ba15305031406287f16e990@mail.gmail.com> <604aa7910503140741c48688@mail.gmail.com> <604aa79105031408113b06b778@mail.gmail.com> <20050314182528.1be664a6.fedora@wir-sind-cool.org> <604aa79105031409455dab2e96@mail.gmail.com> <1110825188.5775.26.camel@localhost.localdomain> <20050314200108.035edd1b.fedora@wir-sind-cool.org> <1110826985.23972.30.camel@opus.phy.duke.edu> Message-ID: <20050314201846.3f7305cc.fedora@wir-sind-cool.org> On Mon, 14 Mar 2005 14:03:05 -0500, seth vidal wrote: > > > Well, it started as sqlite3, with good reason. Look: > > > > -rwxr-xr-x root root 29844 /usr/bin/sqlite3 > > lrwxrwxrwx root root 19 /usr/lib/libsqlite3.so.0 > > -rwxr-xr-x root root 316204 /usr/lib/libsqlite3.so.0.8.6 > > -rw-r--r-- root root 52690 /usr/include/sqlite3.h > > -rw-r--r-- root root 403624 /usr/lib/libsqlite3.a > > -rwxr-xr-x root root 819 /usr/lib/libsqlite3.la > > lrwxrwxrwx root root 19 /usr/lib/libsqlite3.so > > -rw-r--r-- root root 231 /usr/lib/pkgconfig/sqlite3.pc > > > > Sure, the v2 sqlite package could be rename to sqlite0 or sqlite2 if it > > will still be needed. But that's not the point. > > I asked for it to be changed from sqlite3 to sqlite b/c it made little > sense to me that the package should be named sqlite3 when we weren't > providing sqlite(any number) in the rest of the distro. There is little reason to argue about the package name as sqlite3 would have been just fine, but... > add to that the the upstream package name is sqlite, not sqlite3 and I > didn't see a compelling reason to have an odd ball virtual provide (and > dep) for the package. ... such a virtual provides would have been the wrong thing to do, if one wanted to make a separate "sqlite" package coexist with the "sqlite3" package. Upstream has chosen a different namespace, so the versions can coexist (SQLite 2.8.16 is libsqlite.so.0.8.6). From ph18 at cornell.edu Mon Mar 14 19:25:25 2005 From: ph18 at cornell.edu (Paul A. Houle) Date: Mon, 14 Mar 2005 14:25:25 -0500 Subject: A more efficient up2date service using binary diffs In-Reply-To: <1110825564.5775.31.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <422F17B5.5070402@galway.net> <1110383623.3448.8.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1110383996.31871.28.camel@cutter> <1cef3e95050309082839ba4beb@mail.gmail.com> <1110391094.3448.18.camel@localhost.localdomain> <422F3ACE.7010309@math.unl.edu> <4235C9CF.3030308@redhat.com> <1110825564.5775.31.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: I was thinking about this stuff four years ago when I couldn't get DSL at home and it was absolutely painful to update RH 7 (or was it 8?) with up2date. The most obscene case was that up2date made me download 20 megs of font files to fix a a bad configuration file. If we were designing this kind of system as if users mattered, it might make more sense to make it files-centric rather than rpm-centric. I really hate the idea of making the system count on having rpms available, because I'm not so good about keeping the original disks around. (Plus the survival of optical disks is hit-or-miss. I've had some disks that lasted 8 years after getting treated with moderate care, and I've had other ones that I couldn't read after walking them across campus.) It seems just as feasable to send diffs of the ~files~ rather than diffs of the ~rpms~; if we're going to go through the bother of implementing something like this, it makes sense to make something that "just works" rather than another one of these things that almost works (or rather, works if you have the disks, works if you are ready to pull the disks out if you have yum, kinda might work if you have a network install, maybe it won't work.) This should be thought of as an optimization. If the files on the disk don't checksum match the rpm database, we ought to download and install the new rpm. ---- I've always wondered if the Red Hat Network would have been more profitable if it had been less wasteful of bandwidth. From Philip.R.Schaffner at NASA.gov Mon Mar 14 19:44:55 2005 From: Philip.R.Schaffner at NASA.gov (Phil Schaffner) Date: Mon, 14 Mar 2005 14:44:55 -0500 Subject: source for isolinux.bin In-Reply-To: <4235B16B.8060208@snowmoon.com> References: <4235B16B.8060208@snowmoon.com> Message-ID: <1110829495.29071.58.camel@wx1.larc.nasa.gov> On Mon, 2005-03-14 at 09:44 -0600, Eric Warnke wrote: > Edginton, Brian (GE Healthcare) wrote: > > >I have googled to try and find the source for isolinux.bin and > haven't been successful. Does anyone here know where it can be found? > > > >Thanks, > > edge > > > > > > > > http://www.kernel.org/pub/linux/utils/boot/syslinux/syslinux-3.07.tar.gz > > isolinux.asm looks like the source file. Or ... $ rpm -qilp http://download.fedora.redhat.com/pub/fedora/linux/core/development/SRPMS/syslinux-3.07-1.src.rpm Name : syslinux Relocations: (not relocatable) Version : 3.07 Vendor: Red Hat, Inc. Release : 1 Build Date: Fri 14 Jan 2005 04:59:54 PM EST Install Date: (not installed) Build Host: crowe.devel.redhat.com Group : Applications/System Source RPM: (none) Size : 1053269 License: GPL Signature : DSA/SHA1, Mon 21 Feb 2005 12:58:17 PM EST, Key ID da84cbd430c9ecf8 Packager : Red Hat, Inc. Summary : A simple kernel loader which boots from a FAT filesystem. Description : SYSLINUX is a boot loader for the Linux operating system which can operate off MS-DOS floppies. It is intended to simplify first-time installation of Linux, rescue disks, and provide other uses for boot floppies. A SYSLINUX floppy can be manipulated using standard MS-DOS (or any other OS that can access an MS-DOS filesystem) tools (once it has been created), and requires only an approximately 7K DOS program or approximately 13K Linux program to create it in the first place. It also includes PXELINUX, a program to boot off a network server using a boot PROM compatible with the Intel PXE (Pre-Execution Environment) specification. syslinux-2.08-x86_64.patch syslinux-3.07.tar.bz2 syslinux.spec Phil From michael.favia at insitesinc.com Mon Mar 14 20:35:22 2005 From: michael.favia at insitesinc.com (Michael Favia) Date: Mon, 14 Mar 2005 14:35:22 -0600 Subject: TV Tuner problem In-Reply-To: <1110814638.12325.3.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <1110814638.12325.3.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <4235F58A.7030809@insitesinc.com> Eric Tanguy wrote: >I send an email to this list because i tried a lot of thing to solve my >problem and maybe it could be a module problem : > > Sorry this is an off topic post. Please see the description of this mailing list and post your questions to fedora-list or fedora-test-list depending on your installation. -mf From Fedora at TQMcube.com Mon Mar 14 20:54:01 2005 From: Fedora at TQMcube.com (David Cary Hart) Date: Mon, 14 Mar 2005 15:54:01 -0500 Subject: FC4 Test Prep Message-ID: <1110833641.11700.22.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> I'm thinking about install FC4T1 on my laptop on separate partitions. This will then be a triple-boot. Are there any issues with logical (in contrast to primary) partitions? Is there anything else I need to know related to this? -- ________________________________________________________________________ Kill Spam at the Source: http://www.TQMcube.com/spam_trap.htm Today's Spam Trap Adds: http://www.TQMcube.com/BlockedToday RBLDNSD HowTo: http://www.TQMcube.com/rbldnsd.htm From michael.favia at insitesinc.com Mon Mar 14 21:08:21 2005 From: michael.favia at insitesinc.com (Michael Favia) Date: Mon, 14 Mar 2005 15:08:21 -0600 Subject: FC4 Test Prep In-Reply-To: <1110833641.11700.22.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> References: <1110833641.11700.22.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> Message-ID: <4235FD45.4030106@insitesinc.com> David Cary Hart wrote: >I'm thinking about install FC4T1 on my laptop on separate partitions. >This will then be a triple-boot. Are there any issues with logical (in >contrast to primary) partitions? Is there anything else I need to know >related to this? > > Fedora-test-list perhaps? -mf From wtogami at redhat.com Mon Mar 14 21:16:37 2005 From: wtogami at redhat.com (Warren Togami) Date: Mon, 14 Mar 2005 11:16:37 -1000 Subject: vte for FC3/FC4 testing In-Reply-To: <422E1C0E.4020601@redhat.com> References: <422D8006.6000806@togami.com> <1110283379.5194.12.camel@localhost.localdomain> <422E0923.5060501@redhat.com> <1110316922.5126.62.camel@localhost.localdomain> <422E1C0E.4020601@redhat.com> Message-ID: <4235FF35.1010305@redhat.com> Warren Togami wrote: > Per Bjornsson wrote: > >> On Tue, 2005-03-08 at 10:20 -1000, Warren Togami wrote: >> >>> I just pushed this package to FC4. Not sure if it will make >>> FC4test1, but we'll see. I didn't get a chance to try your 0.11.13 >>> yet. Maybe we can consider it for rawhide sometime after test1. >> >> >> >> Any chance to get an FC3 update as well? Not only is the vte in FC3 >> slow, it also has really annoying rendering bugs (easily seen e.g. in >> nano, https://bugzilla.redhat.com/beta/show_bug.cgi?id=127972 ). >> >> Until today I was using a rawhide version I rebuilt some time ago (per >> comment in that bug report); I've given your new version (0.11.12-0.FC3) >> a spin and I haven't hit any problems yet. In fact, I think it fixes a >> couple of residual problems that I had (but I can't tell for sure yet >> since I couldn't figure out exactly how to reproduce them, it was mainly >> occasional screen corruption when scrolling a lot). It would be >> wonderful if you could shove this version into FC3 updates-testing ASAP >> and see if others have the same experience. >> > > It seems that this 0.11.12 based package is much better than FC3, but I > am more concerned about long-term runtime problems. Keep testing it, > and stress it hard, try to make it break. If nobody complains for a > while then we'll push this to FC3 updates. > Just as I had feared, long runtime with heavy activity shows signs of a memory leak. I don't have time to debug this anytime soon. So it would be appropriate to push this to FC3 updates only if the current FC3 vte also has memory leaks. It probably does. Can somebody confirm? Warren Togami wtogami at redhat.com From Fedora at TQMcube.com Mon Mar 14 21:17:13 2005 From: Fedora at TQMcube.com (David Cary Hart) Date: Mon, 14 Mar 2005 16:17:13 -0500 Subject: FC4 Test Prep In-Reply-To: <4235FD45.4030106@insitesinc.com> References: <1110833641.11700.22.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> <4235FD45.4030106@insitesinc.com> Message-ID: <1110835033.11700.25.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> On Mon, 2005-03-14 at 15:08 -0600, Michael Favia wrote: > David Cary Hart wrote: > > >I'm thinking about install FC4T1 on my laptop on separate partitions. > >This will then be a triple-boot. Are there any issues with logical (in > >contrast to primary) partitions? Is there anything else I need to know > >related to this? > > > > > Fedora-test-list perhaps? > -mf > Oooops. You're correct. Sorry about that. -- ________________________________________________________________________ Kill Spam at the Source: http://www.TQMcube.com/spam_trap.htm Today's Spam Trap Adds: http://www.TQMcube.com/BlockedToday RBLDNSD HowTo: http://www.TQMcube.com/rbldnsd.htm From kyrre at solution-forge.net Mon Mar 14 21:46:40 2005 From: kyrre at solution-forge.net (Kyrre Ness Sjobak) Date: Mon, 14 Mar 2005 22:46:40 +0100 Subject: A more efficient up2date service using binary diffs In-Reply-To: References: <422F17B5.5070402@galway.net> <1110383623.3448.8.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1110383996.31871.28.camel@cutter> <1cef3e95050309082839ba4beb@mail.gmail.com> <1110391094.3448.18.camel@localhost.localdomain> <422F3ACE.7010309@math.unl.edu> <4235C9CF.3030308@redhat.com> <1110825564.5775.31.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <1110836800.5775.126.camel@localhost.localdomain> man, 14.03.2005 kl. 20.25 skrev Paul A. Houle: > I was thinking about this stuff four years ago when I couldn't get DSL at > home and it was absolutely painful to update RH 7 (or was it 8?) with > up2date. > > The most obscene case was that up2date made me download 20 megs of font > files to fix a a bad configuration file. > > If we were designing this kind of system as if users mattered, it might > make more sense to make it files-centric rather than rpm-centric. I > really hate the idea of making the system count on having rpms available, > because I'm not so good about keeping the original disks around. (Plus > the survival of optical disks is hit-or-miss. I've had some disks that > lasted 8 years after getting treated with moderate care, and I've had > other ones that I couldn't read after walking them across campus.) > > It seems just as feasable to send diffs of the ~files~ rather than diffs > of the ~rpms~; if we're going to go through the bother of implementing > something like this, it makes sense to make something that "just works" > rather than another one of these things that almost works (or rather, > works if you have the disks, works if you are ready to pull the disks out > if you have yum, kinda might work if you have a network install, maybe > it won't work.) > > This should be thought of as an optimization. If the files on the > disk don't checksum match the rpm database, we ought to download and > install the new rpm. > > ---- > > I've always wondered if the Red Hat Network would have been more > profitable if it had been less wasteful of bandwidth. Files: think scripts that are run when the rpm is installed... _I_ think we should let rpm be rpm, and rather focus about how to *get* the new rpm's to the users, not how we can hack up rpm itself to do some weird half-baked thing. Harddisk are cheap those days, compared to internet, if you are on a dial-up. So i guess most dialup users will be satisfyed with an option to copy all the base rpm's to the harddrive, even if it migth be a waste of disk space. Those on broadband migth chose to save themselves some diskspace, and rather download more (exactly like they do today). When i was on dialup (untill christmas this year), i used to first download the rpm's to my laptop at scool, carry them home on its harddrive (never underestimate the bandwith of a bus with a laptop rolling down a small road!), copy them over to /var/cache/{apt|yum}, and update. It worked. Kindof. But some kind of prpm would be better. Kyrre From Matt_Domsch at dell.com Mon Mar 14 22:02:30 2005 From: Matt_Domsch at dell.com (Matt Domsch) Date: Mon, 14 Mar 2005 16:02:30 -0600 Subject: Request: contributor to put DKMS into Fedora Extras Message-ID: <20050314220230.GA25858@lists.us.dell.com> Dell's lawyers have a couple concerns with the Fedora Corporate Contributors Agreement. Until those get settled, I and my teammates can't become official Contributors. But, we'd like to see DKMS (http://linux.dell.com/dkms) included into Fedora Extras ASAP. Given recent discussions on-list, several people think that's a good idea. To that end, would any of the current approved contributors care to contribute DKMS into Extras? It's GPL of course. Then at some future date, we can negotiate to transfer ownership to Gary Lerhaupt once Dell has official contributor status. Thanks, Matt -- Matt Domsch Software Architect Dell Linux Solutions linux.dell.com & www.dell.com/linux Linux on Dell mailing lists @ http://lists.us.dell.com From utku at citlembik.com.tr Tue Mar 15 00:36:46 2005 From: utku at citlembik.com.tr (Utku Altunkaya) Date: Tue, 15 Mar 2005 02:36:46 +0200 Subject: mysqli extension for PHP5 in FC4 Message-ID: <42362E1E.5010702@citlembik.com.tr> Since the current FC4 development tree includes PHP 5.0.3 and MySQL 4.1.10a, wouldn't it be more appropriate to provide the php-mysqli extension in the distribution instead of (or together with) the old php-mysql extension? Are there any plans to add mysqli to FC4? From jdesbonnet at gmail.com Mon Mar 14 19:05:17 2005 From: jdesbonnet at gmail.com (Joe Desbonnet) Date: Mon, 14 Mar 2005 19:05:17 +0000 Subject: A more efficient up2date service using binary diffs In-Reply-To: <1110825564.5775.31.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <422F17B5.5070402@galway.net> <1110383623.3448.8.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1110383996.31871.28.camel@cutter> <1cef3e95050309082839ba4beb@mail.gmail.com> <1110391094.3448.18.camel@localhost.localdomain> <422F3ACE.7010309@math.unl.edu> <4235C9CF.3030308@redhat.com> <1110825564.5775.31.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <1cef3e9505031411054c5d4917@mail.gmail.com> Given that large disks are far more common than broadband access I think this would be an acceptable option (default option?) at install time. What would be useful is a tool to allow the user to delete/trim this cache if they are running low on disk space and have the option to rebuild it later via the network or using the install CDs. Joe. > We can't make a system be dependent on using CD's. Either it uses old > versions stored on *disk* (anaconda install option - if you are on a > broadband, it isn't worth it. If you are on a modem, copy all rpm's to > some place), or it downloads the whole thing. Please no "please insert > CD 3!" "CD3? I did a network install?!?" "please insert CD3" "OMG!!!" From loony at loonybin.org Tue Mar 15 02:13:28 2005 From: loony at loonybin.org (Peter Arremann) Date: Mon, 14 Mar 2005 21:13:28 -0500 Subject: mysqli extension for PHP5 in FC4 In-Reply-To: <42362E1E.5010702@citlembik.com.tr> References: <42362E1E.5010702@citlembik.com.tr> Message-ID: <200503142113.29733.loony@loonybin.org> On Monday 14 March 2005 19:36, Utku Altunkaya wrote: > Since the current FC4 development tree includes PHP 5.0.3 and MySQL > 4.1.10a, wouldn't it be more appropriate to provide the php-mysqli > extension in the distribution instead of (or together with) the old > php-mysql extension? Are there any plans to add mysqli to FC4? I second this request - mysqli is very important when it comes to mysql 4.1 integration... It would be a same to not provide it in FC4. Peter. From thacker at math.cornell.edu Tue Mar 15 02:33:39 2005 From: thacker at math.cornell.edu (John Thacker) Date: Mon, 14 Mar 2005 21:33:39 -0500 Subject: Rebuild libtool for FC3 test update Message-ID: <20050315023339.GA7085@thacker.dyndns.org> New gcc test update for FC3, but libtool explicitly requires the gcc version it was built against. Error: Missing Dependency: gcc = 3.4.2 is needed by package libtool Rebuild and push a libtool test update for FC3 as well, if someone would. John Thacker -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: not available URL: From jcornett at insight.rr.com Tue Mar 15 04:33:16 2005 From: jcornett at insight.rr.com (Jim Cornette) Date: Mon, 14 Mar 2005 23:33:16 -0500 Subject: yum/python/sqlite b0rkage in Rawhide In-Reply-To: <1110810899.28874.37.camel@cutter> References: <42356597.7040703@home.se> <18568.192.54.193.137.1110795668.squirrel@rousalka.dyndns.org> <20050314102926.GB4932@dudweiler.stuttgart.redhat.com> <4c4ba15305031406287f16e990@mail.gmail.com> <1110810899.28874.37.camel@cutter> Message-ID: <4236658C.6080707@insight.rr.com> seth vidal wrote: >>Downloaded and installed. Still fails with sqlite confusion: >> >>Guessing needs more than just fixing the requires.... >> > > > please provide the following: > > rpm -q yum rpm sqlite python-sqlite > rpm -ql python-sqlite | grep _sqlite.so > > > thanks. > -sv > > The latest upgrades applied show the below on my system. Th symptoms are the same. The mix might be different (ftp upgrade via mirror and boot.iso) Jim -~]$ rpm -q yum rpm sqlite python-sqlite yum-2.3.1-2 rpm-4.4.1-7 sqlite-3.1.2-1 python-sqlite-1.1.6-1 - rpm -ql python-sqlite | grep _sqlite.so /usr/lib/python2.4/site-packages/_sqlite.so =>=> From jdesbonnet at gmail.com Mon Mar 14 19:48:14 2005 From: jdesbonnet at gmail.com (Joe Desbonnet) Date: Mon, 14 Mar 2005 19:48:14 +0000 Subject: A more efficient up2date service using binary diffs In-Reply-To: References: <422F17B5.5070402@galway.net> <1110383623.3448.8.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1110383996.31871.28.camel@cutter> <1cef3e95050309082839ba4beb@mail.gmail.com> <1110391094.3448.18.camel@localhost.localdomain> <422F3ACE.7010309@math.unl.edu> <4235C9CF.3030308@redhat.com> <1110825564.5775.31.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <1cef3e95050314114834560c03@mail.gmail.com> The problem with the file centric approach is that it is a radical departure from the system that's in place at the moment (the system being more than software: it's the whole process of creating packages, testing and managing all that). I think if this feature has any chance of making it into Fedora it must be implemented as a layer on-top of the software that's already there. Joe. On Mon, 14 Mar 2005 14:25:25 -0500, Paul A. Houle wrote: > If we were designing this kind of system as if users mattered, it might > make more sense to make it files-centric rather than rpm-centric. I > really hate the idea of making the system count on having rpms available, > because I'm not so good about keeping the original disks around. (Plus > the survival of optical disks is hit-or-miss. I've had some disks that > lasted 8 years after getting treated with moderate care, and I've had > other ones that I couldn't read after walking them across campus.) > > It seems just as feasable to send diffs of the ~files~ rather than diffs > of the ~rpms~; if we're going to go through the bother of implementing > something like this, it makes sense to make something that "just works" > rather than another one of these things that almost works (or rather, > works if you have the disks, works if you are ready to pull the disks out > if you have yum, kinda might work if you have a network install, maybe > it won't work.) > > This should be thought of as an optimization. If the files on the > disk don't checksum match the rpm database, we ought to download and > install the new rpm. > > ---- > > I've always wondered if the Red Hat Network would have been more > profitable if it had been less wasteful of bandwidth. > > -- > fedora-devel-list mailing list > fedora-devel-list at redhat.com > http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-list > From herrold at owlriver.com Tue Mar 15 07:15:10 2005 From: herrold at owlriver.com (R P Herrold) Date: Tue, 15 Mar 2005 02:15:10 -0500 (EST) Subject: fedora-d-rh] Re: yum/python/sqlite b0rkage in Rawhide In-Reply-To: <604aa79105031408113b06b778@mail.gmail.com> References: <42356597.7040703@home.se> <18568.192.54.193.137.1110795668.squirrel@rousalka.dyndns.org> <20050314102926.GB4932@dudweiler.stuttgart.redhat.com> <4c4ba15305031406287f16e990@mail.gmail.com> <604aa7910503140741c48688@mail.gmail.com> <604aa79105031408113b06b778@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On Mon, 14 Mar 2005, Jeff Spaleta wrote: > On Mon, 14 Mar 2005 10:41:46 -0500, Jeff Spaleta wrote: >> Naively this makes me think that >> something significant changed inside the sqlite package when it was >> renamed to sqlite from sqlite3. > Was there ever a published sqlite3 package for version 3.1.2? The > problem could be associated with internal sqlite library change > between 3.1.2 and 3.0.8. I intentionally packaged the sqlite3 carried into core separately from sqlite-2, because as the upstream author of the sqlite package notes, in his doco on on his website, the two may happily co-exist, and carry differing sonames. The 'latest and greatest mentality' folks felt they knew best, and that 'there should be only one', that people should not use sqlite-2 under its previous name, and broke things without a transition plan. Welcome to RawHide ;) -- Russ Herrold From jdesbonnet at gmail.com Mon Mar 14 12:11:27 2005 From: jdesbonnet at gmail.com (Joe Desbonnet) Date: Mon, 14 Mar 2005 12:11:27 +0000 Subject: A more efficient up2date service using binary diffs In-Reply-To: <1110800423.5843.13.camel@ice-dragon.ddn.de> References: <423224E0.3000005@nc.rr.com> <42333234.8080106@nc.rr.com> <1cef3e9505031317593461f7d2@mail.gmail.com> <20050314071835.GA4018@dudweiler.stuttgart.redhat.com> <1110800423.5843.13.camel@ice-dragon.ddn.de> Message-ID: <1cef3e95050314041145a6f5a0@mail.gmail.com> Indeed there are serveral approaches to this problem, all with their upsides and downsides. I'm currently treating the cpio archive as one big file, and you're probably right -- treating it a file system may yield better results. I'll add it to my todo list. Right now I'm working on a proof-of-concept prototype: A proxy webserver (or FTP server) running locally (on the client or on the client's LAN) which will pretend to be a full repository. In reality it will be trying to serve as many requests as possible by downloading deltas and applying them to locally stored RPMs from the original distribution. Naturally it will cache anything that's downloaded also. My design criteria are: 1. No modification to the existing software (yum, up2date etc) 2. Delta repository must be automatically built and maintained 3. Delta repository must be nothing more than a FTP/HTTP server Because of #2 and #3 I'm going to keep things as simple as possible for the moment. Joe. On Mon, 14 Mar 2005 12:40:23 +0100, Thomas Hille wrote: > Maybe doing the diff on the single files also could help compress the > rpms, that were not compressible using the whole rpm (omni-foomatic > etc.) From symbiont at berlios.de Tue Mar 15 07:29:59 2005 From: symbiont at berlios.de (Jeff Pitman) Date: Tue, 15 Mar 2005 15:29:59 +0800 Subject: fedora-d-rh] Re: yum/python/sqlite b0rkage in Rawhide In-Reply-To: References: <42356597.7040703@home.se> <604aa79105031408113b06b778@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <200503151530.00575.symbiont@berlios.de> On Tuesday 15 March 2005 15:15, R P Herrold wrote: > The 'latest and greatest mentality' folks felt they knew best, > and that 'there should be only one', that people should not > use sqlite-2 under its previous name, and broke things > without a transition plan. ?Welcome to RawHide ;) I'm wondering if a libsuch-and-suchX.Y naming policy would have just made this an easy thing to deal with. After re-packaging compat-db and doing similar with tcl/tk backports to earlier Redhat flavors, I now lean to the side that believes compat-type packages are *not* the way to go. Compat packages are tarpits. (wrt a potential transition plan, of course.) -- -jeff From symbiont at berlios.de Tue Mar 15 07:32:16 2005 From: symbiont at berlios.de (Jeff Pitman) Date: Tue, 15 Mar 2005 15:32:16 +0800 Subject: A more efficient up2date service using binary diffs In-Reply-To: <4235926C.1040004@nc.rr.com> References: <1110800423.5843.13.camel@ice-dragon.ddn.de> <4235926C.1040004@nc.rr.com> Message-ID: <200503151532.16814.symbiont@berlios.de> On Monday 14 March 2005 21:32, Jeff Johnson wrote: > Yep. All this has been known since 1998, see rpm-list at redhat.com > archives.. Weren't we chatting about this on IRC dealing with Fuzzy so that diffs could come across between version upgrades? Or was that a different topic entirely? (Never got into that, by the way...) -- -jeff From harald at redhat.com Tue Mar 15 10:30:04 2005 From: harald at redhat.com (Harald Hoyer) Date: Tue, 15 Mar 2005 11:30:04 +0100 Subject: A more efficient up2date service using binary diffs In-Reply-To: <1110825564.5775.31.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <422F17B5.5070402@galway.net> <1110383623.3448.8.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1110383996.31871.28.camel@cutter> <1cef3e95050309082839ba4beb@mail.gmail.com> <1110391094.3448.18.camel@localhost.localdomain> <422F3ACE.7010309@math.unl.edu> <4235C9CF.3030308@redhat.com> <1110825564.5775.31.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <4236B92C.40804@redhat.com> Kyrre Ness Sjobak wrote: > We can't make a system be dependent on using CD's. Either it uses old > versions stored on *disk* (anaconda install option - if you are on a > broadband, it isn't worth it. If you are on a modem, copy all rpm's to > some place), or it downloads the whole thing. Please no "please insert > CD 3!" "CD3? I did a network install?!?" "please insert CD3" "OMG!!!" > Come on! This could me be made configurable!!! Have you ever seen a checkbox like this: "Don't ask me this question again!"??? From thomas.hille at nightsabers.org Tue Mar 15 10:33:58 2005 From: thomas.hille at nightsabers.org (Thomas Hille) Date: Tue, 15 Mar 2005 11:33:58 +0100 Subject: A more efficient up2date service using binary diffs In-Reply-To: <1cef3e95050314041145a6f5a0@mail.gmail.com> References: <423224E0.3000005@nc.rr.com> <42333234.8080106@nc.rr.com> <1cef3e9505031317593461f7d2@mail.gmail.com> <20050314071835.GA4018@dudweiler.stuttgart.redhat.com> <1110800423.5843.13.camel@ice-dragon.ddn.de> <1cef3e95050314041145a6f5a0@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1110882838.5843.26.camel@ice-dragon.ddn.de> Am Montag, den 14.03.2005, 12:11 +0000 schrieb Joe Desbonnet: > My design criteria are: > 1. No modification to the existing software (yum, up2date etc) > 2. Delta repository must be automatically built and maintained > 3. Delta repository must be nothing more than a FTP/HTTP server > > Because of #2 and #3 I'm going to keep things as simple as possible > for the moment. > Do you want to do this via a standard ftp/http server (something like apache) and build the repository via a cron-job, or do you intend to write your own server, which implements all functions? Either way this approach sounds good. This way you should be able showcase the results easily to a broad user base. What language do you use - still java? I haven't used java for 2-3 years now, I'm more into PHP and Python at the moment. - But when you need a helping hand, mail me. Thomas From jdesbonnet at gmail.com Tue Mar 15 11:29:08 2005 From: jdesbonnet at gmail.com (Joe Desbonnet) Date: Tue, 15 Mar 2005 11:29:08 +0000 Subject: A more efficient up2date service using binary diffs In-Reply-To: <1110882838.5843.26.camel@ice-dragon.ddn.de> References: <423224E0.3000005@nc.rr.com> <42333234.8080106@nc.rr.com> <1cef3e9505031317593461f7d2@mail.gmail.com> <20050314071835.GA4018@dudweiler.stuttgart.redhat.com> <1110800423.5843.13.camel@ice-dragon.ddn.de> <1cef3e95050314041145a6f5a0@mail.gmail.com> <1110882838.5843.26.camel@ice-dragon.ddn.de> Message-ID: <1cef3e9505031503297f274a8b@mail.gmail.com> Right now it's a Java webapp running in Tomcat. I realize that this may not be practical for "production" use, but I find this environment productive. Once it is stable it might be possible to remove the Tomcat dependency. Maybe it can be compiled to native with gcj (?). If Java is a problem (FC4 comes with Java by default?) porting to Python shouldn't be a huge task. The delta repository builder is logically a separate tool, but I will bundle both in the same webapp for the moment. It could be invoked by a 'wget' request scheduled by cron. I hope to have a first release in about a week. If it turns out to be useful I will be looking for suggestions on the delta repository layout, delta file format etc Joe. On Tue, 15 Mar 2005 11:33:58 +0100, Thomas Hille wrote: > > Do you want to do this via a standard ftp/http server (something like > apache) and build the repository via a cron-job, or do you intend to > write your own server, which implements all functions? > > Either way this approach sounds good. This way you should be able > showcase the results easily to a broad user base. > > What language do you use - still java? I haven't used java for 2-3 years > now, I'm more into PHP and Python at the moment. - But when you need a > helping hand, mail me. > > > Thomas > > -- > fedora-devel-list mailing list > fedora-devel-list at redhat.com > http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-list > From ville.skytta at iki.fi Tue Mar 15 11:46:50 2005 From: ville.skytta at iki.fi (Ville =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Skytt=E4?=) Date: Tue, 15 Mar 2005 13:46:50 +0200 Subject: DKMS usage (was: rawhide report: 20050310 changes) In-Reply-To: <1110813921.4909.15.camel@bree.local.net> References: <20050310172126.GC24517@nostromo.devel.redhat.com> <1110475954.6291.118.camel@laptopd505.fenrus.org> <604aa7910503100948705e7baf@mail.gmail.com> <42309CBA.6060708@redhat.com> <20050310232552.GA27026@ti64.telemetry-investments.com> <20050311150457.7132159f@nausicaa.camperquake.de> <20050311231820.GB29498@lists.us.dell.com> <20050312134423.GA13158@lists.us.dell.com> <1110813921.4909.15.camel@bree.local.net> Message-ID: <1110887210.14285.283.camel@bobcat.mine.nu> On Mon, 2005-03-14 at 10:25 -0500, Jeremy Katz wrote: > And kernel-devel actually helps the multiple architecture situation > since the kernel-devel packages install into architecture dependent > paths so that you can have as many of them installed as you want. Alas, it doesn't work currently due to other thinkos in the implementation. https://bugzilla.redhat.com/147553 From buildsys at redhat.com Tue Mar 15 12:57:47 2005 From: buildsys at redhat.com (Build System) Date: Tue, 15 Mar 2005 07:57:47 -0500 Subject: rawhide report: 20050315 changes Message-ID: <200503151257.j2FCvl4h006599@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> Removed package magma Removed package ccs Removed package GFS Removed package magma-plugins Removed package iddev Removed package gulm Removed package fence Removed package rgmanager Removed package ccs Removed package magma Updated Packages: NetworkManager-0.4-1.cvs20050315.3.0 ------------------------------------ * Tue Mar 15 2005 Ray Strode 0.4-1.cvs20050315 - Pull from latest CVS HEAD (hopefully works again) acl-2.2.23-8 ------------ anaconda-10.2.0.28-1 -------------------- * Mon Mar 14 2005 Jeremy Katz - 10.2.0.28-1 - fix swap detection on upgrade (pjones) - don't use os.read to make a buffer of '\x00' (pjones) - move availRaidLevels to raid.py from fsset.py (pjones) - fix Xvnc parameters (clumens, #150498) - unmount loopback-mounted ISO images to free loop0 (clumens, #150887) - fix warnings about gtk.TRUE and gtk.FALSE, partly based on a patch from Colin Walters. (pjones) - sqlite3->sqlite (pnasrat) - support longer package names in hdlist (pnasrat, #146820) - Fix handling of --debug (Ingo Pakleppa, #150920, #150925) - Fix for font location changes (#150889) - More cjk text shuffling (#149039) * Mon Mar 07 2005 Peter Jones - 10.2.0.27-1 - supress lvm fd warning messages - fewer log messages when growing partitions - clamp LVs to pesize during grow * Mon Mar 07 2005 Jeremy Katz - 10.2.0.26-1 - urlgrabber stuff is in its own package now arts-8:1.4.0-0.rc1.5 -------------------- * Mon Mar 14 2005 Than Ngo 8:1.4.0-0.rc1.5 - fix build problem at-spi-1.6.3-1 -------------- * Mon Mar 14 2005 Matthias Clasen 1.6.2-1 - Update to 1.6.3 atk-1.9.1-1 ----------- * Mon Mar 14 2005 Matthias Clasen - 1.9.1-1 - Update to 1.9.1 audit-0.6.8-1 ------------- * Thu Mar 10 2005 Steve Grubb 0.6.8-1 - removed the pam_loginuid library - its going to pam autoconvert-0.3.7-16 -------------------- * Mon Mar 14 2005 Karsten Hopp 0.3.7-16 - Copyright -> License bison-2.0-5 ----------- * Mon Mar 14 2005 Roland McGrath - 2.0-5 - rebuilt cvs-1.11.19-6 ------------- * Mon Mar 14 2005 Martin Stransky 1.11.19-6 - add '/' to invalid RCS tag characters (#56162) dasher-3.2.15-1 --------------- * Mon Mar 14 2005 3.2.15-1 - Update to 3.2.15 - Require a new enough libwnck dtach-0.7-1 ----------- * Mon Mar 14 2005 Lon Hohberger - Upgrade to 0.7 evince-0.1.9-1 -------------- * Sat Mar 12 2005 Marco Pesenti Gritti - 0.1.9-1 - Update to 0.1.9 evolution-2.2.0-10 ------------------ * Mon Mar 14 2005 David Malcolm - 2.2.0-10 - disabled pilot-link support for now so that we have an evolution package; more patching is needed to get this to work with pilot-link-0.12 * Mon Mar 14 2005 David Malcolm - 2.2.0-9 - another attempt at porting to pilot-link 0.12 * Mon Mar 14 2005 David Malcolm - 2.2.0-8 - Added patch to deal with changes to pilot-link from 0.11->0.12 findutils-1:4.2.18-3 -------------------- * Mon Mar 14 2005 Tim Waugh 1:4.2.18-3 - Applied patch from Robert Scheck to fix compilation with GCC 4 (bug #151031). gnome-mag-0.12.0-1 ------------------ * Mon Mar 14 2005 Matthias Clasen 0.12-1 - Update to 0.12.0 gnome-panel-2.10.0-1 -------------------- * Mon Mar 14 2005 Matthias Clasen 2.10.0-1 - Update to 2.10.0 - Bump BuildRequires for libwnck - Update patches * Fri Mar 04 2005 Mark McLoughlin 2.9.91-4 - Fix a BuildRequires gnome-system-monitor-2.10.0-1 ----------------------------- * Mon Mar 14 2005 Matthias Clasen 2.10.0-1 - Update to 2.10.0 - Bump BuildRequires for libwnck - Remove libgnomesu-removing patch gnome-themes-2.10.0-1 --------------------- * Mon Mar 14 2005 Matthias Clasen - 2.10.0-1 - Update to 2.10.0 gnopernicus-0.10.4-1 -------------------- * Mon Mar 14 2005 Matthias Clasen 0.10.4-1 - Update to 0.10.4 gok-1.0.2-1 ----------- * Mon Mar 14 2005 Matthias Clasen 1.0.2-1 - Update to 1.0.2 gtk2-engines-2.6.2-1 -------------------- * Mon Mar 14 2005 Matthias Clasen 2.6.2-1 - Update to 2.6.2 h2ps-2.06-14 ------------ * Tue Mar 15 2005 Lawrence Lim - rebuilt ipsec-tools-0.5-3 ----------------- * Mon Mar 14 2005 Bill Nottingham 0.5-3 - add patch for DoS (CAN-2005-0398, #145532) ipvsadm-1.24-7 -------------- * Mon Mar 14 2005 Lon Hohberger 1.24-7 - rebuilt kdebase-6:3.4.0-0.rc1.6 ----------------------- * Mon Mar 14 2005 Than Ngo 6:3.4.0-0.rc1.6 - default font setting Sans/Monospace - apply patch to fix the shift cursor left/right strangeness * Thu Mar 10 2005 Than Ngo 6:3.4.0-0.rc1.5 - apply patch (Hans de Goede) to fix incompatibilities between konsole/xterm, #138191 kdelibs-6:3.4.0-0.rc1.5 ----------------------- * Mon Mar 14 2005 Than Ngo 3.4.0-0.rc1.5 - default font setting Sans/Monospace libgnomecanvas-2.10.0-1 ----------------------- * Mon Mar 14 2005 Matthias Clasen - 2.10.0-1 - update to 2.10.0 libpfm-3.0-4 ------------ * Mon Mar 14 2005 Will Cohen - Bump rebuild with gcc4. libwnck-2.10.0-1 ---------------- * Mon Mar 14 2005 Matthias Clasen 2.10.0-1 - Update to 2.10.0 libwvstreams-3.75.0-5 --------------------- * Mon Mar 14 2005 Harald Hoyer 3.75.0-5 - gcc4 patch added * Wed Mar 02 2005 Jindrich Novy 3.75.0-4 - rebuilt libxml2-2.6.18-2 ---------------- * Mon Mar 14 2005 Daniel Veillard 2.6.18-2 -removing the .la libxslt-1.1.13-2 ---------------- * Mon Mar 14 2005 Daniel Veillard 1.1.13-2 -removing the .la linuxwacom-0:0.6.6-3 -------------------- * Mon Mar 14 2005 Kristian H??gsberg 0:0.6.6-3 - Rebuilding with gcc 4.0. * Thu Feb 10 2005 Kristian H??gsberg - 0:0.6.6-2 - Bump release. * Thu Feb 10 2005 Kristian H??gsberg - 0:0.6.6-1 - Add patch to set the necessary preprocessor flags on 64 bit archs. lsof-4.74-5 ----------- * Mon Mar 14 2005 Karel Zak 4.74-5 - src.rpm cleanup module-init-tools-3.1-2 ----------------------- * Mon Mar 14 2005 Bill Nottingham 3.1-2 - buildreq: docbook-utils (#151070) * Mon Mar 07 2005 Bill Nottingham 3.1-1 - update to 3.1 final mx-2.0.6-2 ---------- * Mon Mar 14 2005 Mihai Ibanescu 2.0.6-2 - Rebuilt * Wed Feb 02 2005 Elliot Lee 2.0.6-1 - Rebuild with python 2.4 * Tue Jun 15 2004 Elliot Lee - rebuilt mx4j-1:2.1.0-1jpp_2fc --------------------- * Mon Mar 14 2005 Gary Benson 0:2.1.0-1jpp_2fc - Install mx4j.jar as the jmxri.jar alternative instead of mx4j-jmx.jar. From Anthony Green . nhpf-1.42-9 ----------- * Tue Mar 15 2005 Lawrence Lim - rebuilt oprofile-0.8.1-14 ----------------- * Mon Mar 14 2005 Will Cohen - Bump rebuild with gcc4. pam-0.78-7 ---------- * Mon Mar 14 2005 Tomas Mraz 0.78-7 - add pam_loginuid module for setting the the login uid for auditing purposes (by Steve Grubb) * Thu Mar 10 2005 Tomas Mraz 0.78-6 - add functionality for running handler executables from pam_console when console lock was obtained/lost - removed patches merged to pam-redhat parted-1.6.21-3 --------------- * Mon Mar 14 2005 Chris Lumens 1.6.21-3 - Include patches from parted CVS for new gcc4 warnings. pciutils-2.1.99.test8-8 ----------------------- * Mon Mar 14 2005 Bill Nottingham - 2.1.99.test8-8 - add patch for glibc macros (#151032, ) prelink-0.3.4-3 --------------- * Mon Mar 14 2005 Jakub Jelinek 0.3.4-3 - fix relocation of .debug_loc (#150194) python-2.4-6 ------------ * Mon Mar 14 2005 Mihai Ibanescu 2.4-6 - building the docs from a different source rpm, to decouple bootstrapping python from having tetex installed rhythmbox-0.8.8-2 ----------------- * Mon Mar 14 2005 Colin Walters - 0.8.8-2 - Rebuild for GCC4 strace-4.5.10-1 --------------- * Mon Mar 14 2005 Roland McGrath - 4.5.10-1 - Fix select handling on nonstandard fd_set sizes. - Don't print errors for null file name pointers. - Fix initial execve output with -i (#143365). * Fri Feb 04 2005 Roland McGrath - 4.5.9-2 - update ia64 syscall list (#146245) - fix x86_64 syscall argument extraction for 32-bit processes (#146093) - fix -e signal=NAME parsing (#143362) - fix x86_64 exit_group syscall handling - improve socket ioctl printing (#138223) - code cleanups (#143369, #143370) - improve mount flags printing (#141932) - support symbolic printing of x86_64 arch_prctl parameters (#142667) - fix potential crash in getxattr printing * Tue Oct 19 2004 Roland McGrath - 4.5.8-1 - fix multithreaded exit handling (#132150, #135254) - fix ioctl name matching (#129808) - print RTC_* ioctl structure contents (#58606) - grok epoll_* syscalls (#134463) - grok new RLIMIT_* values (#133594) - print struct cmsghdr contents for sendmsg (#131689) - fix clock_* and timer_* argument output (#131420) system-config-bind-4.0.0-4.1 ---------------------------- system-config-samba-1.2.28-1 ---------------------------- * Tue Mar 15 2005 Nils Philippsen - 1.2.28-1 - fix dialog when share name is missing (#135119) again tar-1.15.1-4 ------------ * Mon Mar 14 2005 Peter Vrabec - gcc4 fix (#150993) 1.15.1-4 texinfo-4.8-4 ------------- * Mon Mar 14 2005 Tim Waugh 4.8-4 - Requires tetex (bug #151075). tomcat5-0:5.0.30-1jpp_2fc ------------------------- * Mon Mar 14 2005 Gary Benson 0:5.0.30-1jpp_2fc - Rebuild to pick up mx4j changes. vim-1:6.3.064-1 --------------- * Mon Mar 14 2005 Karsten Hopp 6.3.064-1 - patchlevel 64 - fix selinux warning (#150126) From janina at rednote.net Tue Mar 15 13:42:03 2005 From: janina at rednote.net (Janina Sajka) Date: Tue, 15 Mar 2005 08:42:03 -0500 Subject: Alsa Drivers Missing In The FC4 Kernel In-Reply-To: <20050314164722.GA1799@redhat.com> References: <20050313182649.GA3658@rednote.net> <20050313203922.GB29867@redhat.com> <20050313223240.GB3658@rednote.net> <20050314164722.GA1799@redhat.com> Message-ID: <20050315134203.GC3658@rednote.net> Dave Jones writes: > On Sun, Mar 13, 2005 at 05:32:40PM -0500, Janina Sajka wrote: > > > FC4 kernels will be alsa 1.0.8, no? > > It will be whatever matches what the ALSA folks get merged in 2.6.12. > > > The Echo cards are supported for the > > first time in 1.0.8. There are quite a few, and they tend toward the > > high-end, audio professional level. The alsa-driver config file, > > toplevel.config, lists them as: > > > > CONFIG_SND_DARLA20=m > > CONFIG_FW_LOADER=m > > CONFIG_SND_GINA20=m > > CONFIG_SND_LAYLA20=m > > CONFIG_SND_DARLA24=m > > CONFIG_SND_GINA24=m > > CONFIG_SND_LAYLA24=m > > CONFIG_SND_MONA=m > > CONFIG_SND_MIA=m > > CONFIG_SND_GINA3G=m > > CONFIG_SND_LAYLA3G=m > > CONFIG_SND_INDIGO=m > > None of these options seem present in the current kernel. > It's not uncommon for the userspace tools to claim support > for drivers that aren't yet merged. > Hopefully they'll catch up by 2.6.12 OK. I understand now. Thanks. > > Dave > > -- > fedora-devel-list mailing list > fedora-devel-list at redhat.com > http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-list -- Janina Sajka Phone: +1.202.494.7040 Partner, Capital Accessibility LLC http://www.CapitalAccessibility.Com Chair, Accessibility Workgroup Free Standards Group (FSG) janina at freestandards.org http://a11y.org If Linux can't solve your computing problem, you need a different problem. From eric.tanguy at univ-nantes.fr Tue Mar 15 15:08:07 2005 From: eric.tanguy at univ-nantes.fr (Eric Tanguy) Date: Tue, 15 Mar 2005 16:08:07 +0100 Subject: TV Tuner problem In-Reply-To: <1110886704.924.35.camel@tweedy.ksc.nasa.gov> References: <1110840619.9346.2.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1110886704.924.35.camel@tweedy.ksc.nasa.gov> Message-ID: <1110899287.3946.3.camel@localhost.localdomain> Le mardi 15 mars 2005 ? 06:38 -0500, Bob Chiodini a ?crit : > On Mon, 2005-03-14 at 23:50 +0100, Eric Tanguy wrote: > > i tried a lot of thing to solve my problem and maybe it could be a > > module problem : > > modprobing bttv seems to give good results and all is autodetected (the > > tuner seems to be the right one) : > > bttv: driver version 0.9.15 loaded > > bttv: using 8 buffers with 2080k (520 pages) each for capture > > bttv: Bt8xx card found (0). > > ACPI: PCI interrupt 0000:01:07.0[A] -> GSI 11 (level, low) -> IRQ 11 > > bttv0: Bt878 (rev 17) at 0000:01:07.0, irq: 11, latency: 64, mmio: > > 0xeb800000 > > bttv0: detected: Pinnacle PCTV [card=39], PCI subsystem ID is 11bd:0012 > > bttv0: using: Pinnacle PCTV Studio/Rave [card=39,autodetected] > > bttv0: gpio: en=00000000, out=00000000 in=00fff3ff [init] > > bttv0: i2c: checking for MSP34xx @ 0x80... not found > > bttv0: pinnacle/mt: id=4 info="PAL+SECAM / mono" radio=no > > bttv0: using tuner=33 > > bttv0: i2c: checking for MSP34xx @ 0x80... not found > > bttv0: i2c: checking for TDA9875 @ 0xb0... not found > > bttv0: i2c: checking for TDA7432 @ 0x8a... not found > > tda9885/6/7: chip found @ 0x96 > > tuner: chip found at addr 0xc0 i2c-bus bt878 #0 [sw] > > tuner: type set to 33 (MT20xx universal) by bt878 #0 [sw] > > tuner: microtune: companycode=3cbf part=42 rev=2f > > tuner: microtune MT2050 found, OK > > bttv0: registered device video0 > > bttv0: registered device vbi0 > > bttv0: PLL: 28636363 => 35468950 . ok > > > > The problem is i receive no signal in tvtime whereas this card works > > fine under windows. It seems the system cannot set the right tuner > > frequency : > > > > mt2050_set_if_freq failed with -121 > > > > Someone could help me ? > > Eric, > > Take a look at this thread. > > http://groups-beta.google.com/group/linux.kernel/browse_thread/thread/58bd50364a5b47d8/81b8dfdd7bed9d95?q=linux+Pinnacle+PCTV+rave+tuner#81b8dfdd7bed9d95 > > It looks like there is a patch. Also, one of the posters said it worked > in 2.6.9. Do you have a 2.6.9 version of the kernel still around? > > BTW: I don't see why your question was off-topic on the "other list". > > Bob... > Yes you are right. I try the old 2.6.9-1.667 kernel instead of the actual 2.6.10-1.770_FC3 one and my tv tuner works fine. So it would be a kernel module problem and if i can't ask this kind of questions on the devel list i don't where i can ... Thanks Eric -- Eric Tanguy | Nantes, France Key : A4B8368F | Key Server : subkeys.pgp.net Fedora Core release 3 (Heidelberg) sur athlon kernel 2.6.9-1.667 -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: Ceci est une partie de message num?riquement sign?e URL: From harald at redhat.com Tue Mar 15 15:44:45 2005 From: harald at redhat.com (Harald Hoyer) Date: Tue, 15 Mar 2005 16:44:45 +0100 Subject: Old kernel RPMS In-Reply-To: <1110703151.3170.7.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> References: <1110703151.3170.7.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> Message-ID: <423702ED.7050108@redhat.com> Ivan Gyurdiev wrote: > My nvidia driver crashes again - no logs, no error messages, no info of > any kind. Only happens when running OpenGL games after several minutes > of gameplay - screen goes to gray diagonal lines, and the system's > completely frozen. Happens with 6629, and 7167 - > suspects are kernel and gcc4 compiler (since I remember 6629 used to > work at some point). This is going to be extremely unpleasant to debug. and this is really no thermal problem? (just asking) From bpm at ec-group.com Tue Mar 15 15:55:45 2005 From: bpm at ec-group.com (Brian Millett) Date: Tue, 15 Mar 2005 09:55:45 -0600 Subject: rawhide report: 20050315 changes In-Reply-To: <200503151257.j2FCvl4h006599@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> References: <200503151257.j2FCvl4h006599@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> Message-ID: <1110902146.19569.5.camel@localhost.localdomain> On Tue, 2005-03-15 at 07:57 -0500, Build System wrote: > NetworkManager-0.4-1.cvs20050315.3.0 > ------------------------------------ > * Tue Mar 15 2005 Ray Strode 0.4-1.cvs20050315 > - Pull from latest CVS HEAD (hopefully works again) No it did not, but I thought, what the heck and did the same. I just pulled the latest (03/15/05 9:00 am CST) and tried to compile it for rawhide, latest (today) updates. Had to make some cosmetic patches to get it to compile with gcc4 and I am sure they are "wrong" but it compiled. [bpm]$ diff -wruN nm-netlink-monitor.c~ nm-netlink-monitor.c --- nm-netlink-monitor.c~ 2005-03-14 23:30:14.000000000 -0600 +++ nm-netlink-monitor.c 2005-03-15 09:39:23.000000000 -0600 @@ -568,10 +568,10 @@ NmNetlinkMonitor *monitor) { GError *error; - gchar *received_bytes; + gchar *received_bytes=""; gboolean processing_is_done; - gsize num_received_bytes; - guint num_bytes_to_process; + gsize num_received_bytes=0; + guint num_bytes_to_process=0; struct nlmsghdr *header; if (io_condition == NM_NETLINK_MONITOR_ERROR_CONDITIONS) did the hokey-pokey configure, automake, dance. It works. :-) Thanks for the idea. -- Brian Millett - [ Londo and Sinclair, "A Voice in the Wilderness I"] "Commander, what will you do if you find anything of value down there?" 'Hmm, the odds of that are pretty small. It's probably just an automated homing beacon left over from hundreds of years ago.' "Yes, but if it isn't, will you tell me?" 'No!' "Just making sure we know where we stand." -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part URL: From ivg2 at cornell.edu Tue Mar 15 16:03:46 2005 From: ivg2 at cornell.edu (Ivan Gyurdiev) Date: Tue, 15 Mar 2005 11:03:46 -0500 Subject: Old kernel RPMS In-Reply-To: <423702ED.7050108@redhat.com> References: <1110703151.3170.7.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> <423702ED.7050108@redhat.com> Message-ID: <1110902626.4599.3.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> On Tue, 2005-03-15 at 16:44 +0100, Harald Hoyer wrote: > Ivan Gyurdiev wrote: > > My nvidia driver crashes again - no logs, no error messages, no info of > > any kind. Only happens when running OpenGL games after several minutes > > of gameplay - screen goes to gray diagonal lines, and the system's > > completely frozen. Happens with 6629, and 7167 - > > suspects are kernel and gcc4 compiler (since I remember 6629 used to > > work at some point). This is going to be extremely unpleasant to debug. > > and this is really no thermal problem? (just asking) thermal.. as in overheating problem? I sure hope not - it worked fine until recently. I am starting to get suspicious, however, because yesterday it locked up with the nv driver. It also locked up earlier when not running any openGL apps. So.. the problem is either the kernel or the card. I will turn on sysrq and investigate. I see no Oops or panic in the log as is.. -- Ivan Gyurdiev Cornell University From Fedora at TQMcube.com Tue Mar 15 16:55:20 2005 From: Fedora at TQMcube.com (David Cary Hart) Date: Tue, 15 Mar 2005 11:55:20 -0500 Subject: GCC4 Portability Message-ID: <1110905720.18889.4.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> Sorry. I know as much about C as I do about B12. If I compile an rpm with gcc4, are there any problems associated with installing that rpm on a machine running FC3 that I need to understand? Thanks -- ________________________________________________________________________ Kill Spam at the Source: http://www.TQMcube.com/spam_trap.htm Today's Spam Trap Adds: http://www.TQMcube.com/BlockedToday RBLDNSD HowTo: http://www.TQMcube.com/rbldnsd.htm From iago.rubio at hispalinux.es Tue Mar 15 16:55:32 2005 From: iago.rubio at hispalinux.es (Iago Rubio) Date: Tue, 15 Mar 2005 17:55:32 +0100 Subject: rawhide report: 20050315 changes In-Reply-To: <1110902146.19569.5.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <200503151257.j2FCvl4h006599@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <1110902146.19569.5.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <1110905733.22596.8.camel@speedy.iagorubio.net> On Tue, 2005-03-15 at 09:55 -0600, Brian Millett wrote: > Had to make some cosmetic patches to get it to compile with gcc4 and I > am sure they are "wrong" but it compiled. > > [bpm]$ diff -wruN nm-netlink-monitor.c~ nm-netlink-monitor.c > --- nm-netlink-monitor.c~ 2005-03-14 23:30:14.000000000 -0600 > +++ nm-netlink-monitor.c 2005-03-15 09:39:23.000000000 -0600 > @@ -568,10 +568,10 @@ > NmNetlinkMonitor *monitor) > { > GError *error; > - gchar *received_bytes; > + gchar *received_bytes=""; > gboolean processing_is_done; > - gsize num_received_bytes; > - guint num_bytes_to_process; > + gsize num_received_bytes=0; > + guint num_bytes_to_process=0; > struct nlmsghdr *header; Frankly, I don't see how this could fix the build. May be it's being used -Werror in the gcc command line ? -- Iago Rubio From bpm at ec-group.com Tue Mar 15 17:03:32 2005 From: bpm at ec-group.com (Brian Millett) Date: Tue, 15 Mar 2005 11:03:32 -0600 Subject: rawhide report: 20050315 changes In-Reply-To: <1110905733.22596.8.camel@speedy.iagorubio.net> References: <200503151257.j2FCvl4h006599@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <1110902146.19569.5.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1110905733.22596.8.camel@speedy.iagorubio.net> Message-ID: <1110906212.19569.7.camel@localhost.localdomain> On Tue, 2005-03-15 at 17:55 +0100, Iago Rubio wrote: > On Tue, 2005-03-15 at 09:55 -0600, Brian Millett wrote: > > Had to make some cosmetic patches to get it to compile with gcc4 and I > > am sure they are "wrong" but it compiled. > > > > [bpm]$ diff -wruN nm-netlink-monitor.c~ nm-netlink-monitor.c > > --- nm-netlink-monitor.c~ 2005-03-14 23:30:14.000000000 -0600 > > +++ nm-netlink-monitor.c 2005-03-15 09:39:23.000000000 -0600 > > @@ -568,10 +568,10 @@ > > NmNetlinkMonitor *monitor) > > { > > GError *error; > > - gchar *received_bytes; > > + gchar *received_bytes=""; > > gboolean processing_is_done; > > - gsize num_received_bytes; > > - guint num_bytes_to_process; > > + gsize num_received_bytes=0; > > + guint num_bytes_to_process=0; > > struct nlmsghdr *header; > > Frankly, I don't see how this could fix the build. > > May be it's being used -Werror in the gcc command line ? > -- > Iago Rubio > Why yes it is. (from Makefile) CC = gcc CCDEPMODE = depmode=gcc3 CFLAGS = -Wall -Werror -std=gnu89 -g -O2 -Wno-unused -Wno-strict-aliasing -Wno-sign-compare -Wdeclaration-after-statement -Wno-pointer-sign CPP = gcc -E So I do not know what or why the difference. -- Brian Millett - [ Londo and Timov, "Soul Mates"] "They're merely expressing their feelings for me." 'I can do that." [Timov slaps Londo] -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part URL: From terraformers at gmx.net Tue Mar 15 17:29:30 2005 From: terraformers at gmx.net (Lars) Date: Tue, 15 Mar 2005 18:29:30 +0100 Subject: rawhide report: 20050315 changes References: <200503151257.j2FCvl4h006599@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> Message-ID: had to yum --exclude for a working update: --exclude=sqlite --exclude=libwnck --exclude=gnome-system-monitor --exclude=gnome-panel --exclude=gok --exclude=gtk2-engines because sqlite: sqlite still makes my yum barf. re-installed sqlite3 instead and it works ok for me. libwnck: Error: Missing Dependency: libwnck-1.so.4 is needed by package usermode-gtk Error: Missing Dependency: libwnck-1.so.4 is needed by package gnome-applets gnome-system-monitor, gnome-panel, gok: because they depend on the updated libwnck, and its excluded to make usermode-gtk and gnome-applets happy. Error: Missing Dependency: libwnck >= 2.9.92 is needed by package gnome-system-monitor Error: Missing Dependency: libwnck-1.so.16 is needed by package gnome-panel Error: Missing Dependency: libwnck >= 2.9.92 is needed by package gnome-panel Error: Missing Dependency: libwnck-1.so.16 is needed by package gnome-system-monitor Error: Missing Dependency: libwnck-1.so.16 is needed by package gok gtk2-engines: clashes with gnome-themes-extras (from fedora extras) Transaction Check Error: file /usr/lib/gtk-2.0/2.4.0/engines/libindustrial.so from install of gtk2-engines-2.6.2-1 conflicts with file from package gnome-themes-extras-0.8.0-2 file /usr/share/themes/Industrial/gtk-2.0/gtkrc from install of gtk2-engines-2.6.2-1 conflicts with file from package gnome-themes-extras-0.8.0-2 cheers L From kmaraas at broadpark.no Tue Mar 15 17:09:30 2005 From: kmaraas at broadpark.no (Kjartan Maraas) Date: Tue, 15 Mar 2005 18:09:30 +0100 Subject: vte for FC3/FC4 testing In-Reply-To: <4235FF35.1010305@redhat.com> References: <422D8006.6000806@togami.com> <1110283379.5194.12.camel@localhost.localdomain> <422E0923.5060501@redhat.com> <1110316922.5126.62.camel@localhost.localdomain> <422E1C0E.4020601@redhat.com> <4235FF35.1010305@redhat.com> Message-ID: <1110906570.3297.1.camel@localhost.localdomain> man, 14,.03.2005 kl. 11.16 -1000, skrev Warren Togami: > Warren Togami wrote: > > Per Bjornsson wrote: > > > >> On Tue, 2005-03-08 at 10:20 -1000, Warren Togami wrote: > >> > >>> I just pushed this package to FC4. Not sure if it will make > >>> FC4test1, but we'll see. I didn't get a chance to try your 0.11.13 > >>> yet. Maybe we can consider it for rawhide sometime after test1. > >> > >> > >> > >> Any chance to get an FC3 update as well? Not only is the vte in FC3 > >> slow, it also has really annoying rendering bugs (easily seen e.g. in > >> nano, https://bugzilla.redhat.com/beta/show_bug.cgi?id=127972 ). > >> > >> Until today I was using a rawhide version I rebuilt some time ago (per > >> comment in that bug report); I've given your new version (0.11.12-0.FC3) > >> a spin and I haven't hit any problems yet. In fact, I think it fixes a > >> couple of residual problems that I had (but I can't tell for sure yet > >> since I couldn't figure out exactly how to reproduce them, it was mainly > >> occasional screen corruption when scrolling a lot). It would be > >> wonderful if you could shove this version into FC3 updates-testing ASAP > >> and see if others have the same experience. > >> > > > > It seems that this 0.11.12 based package is much better than FC3, but I > > am more concerned about long-term runtime problems. Keep testing it, > > and stress it hard, try to make it break. If nobody complains for a > > while then we'll push this to FC3 updates. > > > > Just as I had feared, long runtime with heavy activity shows signs of a > memory leak. I don't have time to debug this anytime soon. > Could you describe the activity pattern to make it easier to reproduce? I've run gnome-terminal under valgrind with no signs of leaks, but not for a long time. > So it would be appropriate to push this to FC3 updates only if the > current FC3 vte also has memory leaks. It probably does. Can somebody > confirm? > Also, I reverted the questionable fedora patch in CVS and added the latest patch for the memory consumption problems. It now shares the matching stuff and struct _vte_termcap between terminals and should use a lot less memory with multiple tabs. I think one of the previous versions of this patch had leaks that were fixed later, so that might be worth checking out. Cheers Kjartan From kmaraas at broadpark.no Tue Mar 15 01:22:54 2005 From: kmaraas at broadpark.no (Kjartan Maraas) Date: Tue, 15 Mar 2005 02:22:54 +0100 Subject: vte for FC3/FC4 testing In-Reply-To: <4235FF35.1010305@redhat.com> References: <422D8006.6000806@togami.com> <1110283379.5194.12.camel@localhost.localdomain> <422E0923.5060501@redhat.com> <1110316922.5126.62.camel@localhost.localdomain> <422E1C0E.4020601@redhat.com> <4235FF35.1010305@redhat.com> Message-ID: <1110849774.8013.2.camel@localhost.localdomain> man, 14,.03.2005 kl. 11.16 -1000, skrev Warren Togami: > Warren Togami wrote: > > Per Bjornsson wrote: > > > >> On Tue, 2005-03-08 at 10:20 -1000, Warren Togami wrote: > >> > >>> I just pushed this package to FC4. Not sure if it will make > >>> FC4test1, but we'll see. I didn't get a chance to try your 0.11.13 > >>> yet. Maybe we can consider it for rawhide sometime after test1. > >> > >> > >> > >> Any chance to get an FC3 update as well? Not only is the vte in FC3 > >> slow, it also has really annoying rendering bugs (easily seen e.g. in > >> nano, https://bugzilla.redhat.com/beta/show_bug.cgi?id=127972 ). > >> > >> Until today I was using a rawhide version I rebuilt some time ago (per > >> comment in that bug report); I've given your new version (0.11.12-0.FC3) > >> a spin and I haven't hit any problems yet. In fact, I think it fixes a > >> couple of residual problems that I had (but I can't tell for sure yet > >> since I couldn't figure out exactly how to reproduce them, it was mainly > >> occasional screen corruption when scrolling a lot). It would be > >> wonderful if you could shove this version into FC3 updates-testing ASAP > >> and see if others have the same experience. > >> > > > > It seems that this 0.11.12 based package is much better than FC3, but I > > am more concerned about long-term runtime problems. Keep testing it, > > and stress it hard, try to make it break. If nobody complains for a > > while then we'll push this to FC3 updates. > > > > Just as I had feared, long runtime with heavy activity shows signs of a > memory leak. I don't have time to debug this anytime soon. > Could you describe the activity pattern to make it easier to reproduce? I've run gnome-terminal under valgrind with no signs of leaks, but not for a long time. > So it would be appropriate to push this to FC3 updates only if the > current FC3 vte also has memory leaks. It probably does. Can somebody > confirm? > Also, I reverted the questionable fedora patch in CVS and added the latest patch for the memory consumption problems. It now shares the matching stuff and struct _vte_termcap between terminals and should use a lot less memory with multiple tabs. I think one of the previous versions of this patch had leaks that were fixed later, so that might be worth checking out. Cheers Kjartan From iago.rubio at hispalinux.es Tue Mar 15 18:25:33 2005 From: iago.rubio at hispalinux.es (Iago Rubio) Date: Tue, 15 Mar 2005 19:25:33 +0100 Subject: rawhide report: 20050315 changes In-Reply-To: <1110906212.19569.7.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <200503151257.j2FCvl4h006599@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <1110902146.19569.5.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1110905733.22596.8.camel@speedy.iagorubio.net> <1110906212.19569.7.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <1110911133.27647.26.camel@speedy.iagorubio.net> On Tue, 2005-03-15 at 11:03 -0600, Brian Millett wrote: > On Tue, 2005-03-15 at 17:55 +0100, Iago Rubio wrote: > > On Tue, 2005-03-15 at 09:55 -0600, Brian Millett wrote: > > > Had to make some cosmetic patches to get it to compile with gcc4 and I > > > am sure they are "wrong" but it compiled. > > > > > > [bpm]$ diff -wruN nm-netlink-monitor.c~ nm-netlink-monitor.c > > > --- nm-netlink-monitor.c~ 2005-03-14 23:30:14.000000000 -0600 > > > +++ nm-netlink-monitor.c 2005-03-15 09:39:23.000000000 -0600 > > > @@ -568,10 +568,10 @@ > > > NmNetlinkMonitor *monitor) > > > { > > > GError *error; > > > - gchar *received_bytes; > > > + gchar *received_bytes=""; > > > gboolean processing_is_done; > > > - gsize num_received_bytes; > > > - guint num_bytes_to_process; > > > + gsize num_received_bytes=0; > > > + guint num_bytes_to_process=0; > > > struct nlmsghdr *header; > > > > Frankly, I don't see how this could fix the build. > > > > May be it's being used -Werror in the gcc command line ? > > Why yes it is. (from Makefile) > CC = gcc > CCDEPMODE = depmode=gcc3 > CFLAGS = -Wall -Werror -std=gnu89 -g -O2 -Wno-unused > -Wno-strict-aliasing -Wno-sign-compare -Wdeclaration-after-statement > -Wno-pointer-sign > CPP = gcc -E > > So I do not know what or why the difference. -Werror will stop compilation on warnings. I think it should be better to take out the -Werror and let the sources untouched, as to randomly initialize variables could make things fail. Taking out -Werror, you will be able to compile, and will let the warnings inform other developers about this problem. Initializing the variables this way you achieve the opposite of what the developer wanted. He wanted to care of small glitches so he decided to convert warnings in error. You're blindly hiding the warnings, and it can make debugging more painful. In the case you don't care about this, I recommend at least initialize also the gchar* variable to 0. gchar *received_bytes=0; This way if it's g_freed anywhere - at least - it won't segfault. Just my 2 - euro - cents. -- Iago Rubio From aoliva at redhat.com Tue Mar 15 18:42:21 2005 From: aoliva at redhat.com (Alexandre Oliva) Date: 15 Mar 2005 15:42:21 -0300 Subject: A more efficient up2date service using binary diffs In-Reply-To: <4235C9CF.3030308@redhat.com> References: <422F17B5.5070402@galway.net> <1110383623.3448.8.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1110383996.31871.28.camel@cutter> <1cef3e95050309082839ba4beb@mail.gmail.com> <1110391094.3448.18.camel@localhost.localdomain> <422F3ACE.7010309@math.unl.edu> <4235C9CF.3030308@redhat.com> Message-ID: On Mar 14, 2005, Harald Hoyer wrote: > reconstruct the released rpm, by reverse delta xdelta and rsync batches aren't reversible; something like diff/patch, that is reversible, takes far more space. -- Alexandre Oliva http://www.ic.unicamp.br/~oliva/ Red Hat Compiler Engineer aoliva@{redhat.com, gcc.gnu.org} Free Software Evangelist oliva@{lsd.ic.unicamp.br, gnu.org} From rstrode at redhat.com Tue Mar 15 18:43:40 2005 From: rstrode at redhat.com (Ray Strode) Date: Tue, 15 Mar 2005 13:43:40 -0500 Subject: rawhide report: 20050315 changes In-Reply-To: <200503151257.j2FCvl4h006599@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> References: <200503151257.j2FCvl4h006599@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> Message-ID: <1110912220.9875.1.camel@localhost.localdomain> Hi, > NetworkManager-0.4-1.cvs20050315.3.0 > ------------------------------------ > * Tue Mar 15 2005 Ray Strode 0.4-1.cvs20050315 > - Pull from latest CVS HEAD (hopefully works again) So I never actually updated the source tarball when i pushed this through beehive. It'll be fixed in the next rawhide update. --Ray Strode From rstrode at redhat.com Tue Mar 15 18:46:29 2005 From: rstrode at redhat.com (Ray Strode) Date: Tue, 15 Mar 2005 13:46:29 -0500 Subject: rawhide report: 20050315 changes In-Reply-To: <1110902146.19569.5.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <200503151257.j2FCvl4h006599@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <1110902146.19569.5.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <1110912389.9875.4.camel@localhost.localdomain> Hi, > Had to make some cosmetic patches to get it to compile with gcc4 and I > am sure they are "wrong" but it compiled. I think I fixed these issues in upstream CVS this morning. From aoliva at redhat.com Tue Mar 15 18:49:13 2005 From: aoliva at redhat.com (Alexandre Oliva) Date: 15 Mar 2005 15:49:13 -0300 Subject: A more efficient up2date service using binary diffs In-Reply-To: <1cef3e95050314041145a6f5a0@mail.gmail.com> References: <423224E0.3000005@nc.rr.com> <42333234.8080106@nc.rr.com> <1cef3e9505031317593461f7d2@mail.gmail.com> <20050314071835.GA4018@dudweiler.stuttgart.redhat.com> <1110800423.5843.13.camel@ice-dragon.ddn.de> <1cef3e95050314041145a6f5a0@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On Mar 14, 2005, Joe Desbonnet wrote: > Indeed there are serveral approaches to this problem, all with their > upsides and downsides. I'm currently treating the cpio archive as one > big file, and you're probably right -- treating it a file system may > yield better results. I doubt it. In several cases, files get packaged in different directories or have names changed because of a version change, and then per-file deltas or rsync of individual files won't save you anything, but rsync of the entire archive will be able to pick up the unchanging bits. -- Alexandre Oliva http://www.ic.unicamp.br/~oliva/ Red Hat Compiler Engineer aoliva@{redhat.com, gcc.gnu.org} Free Software Evangelist oliva@{lsd.ic.unicamp.br, gnu.org} From mike at navi.cx Tue Mar 15 19:55:40 2005 From: mike at navi.cx (Mike Hearn) Date: Tue, 15 Mar 2005 19:55:40 +0000 Subject: GCC4 Portability References: <1110905720.18889.4.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> Message-ID: On Tue, 15 Mar 2005 11:55:20 -0500, David Cary Hart wrote: > Sorry. I know as much about C as I do about B12. > > If I compile an rpm with gcc4, are there any problems associated with > installing that rpm on a machine running FC3 that I need to understand? Yes, this is a total swamp. I suggest you read this: http://autopackage.org/docs/devguide/ch07.html It's a little out of date, doesn't cover all the issues, is inaccurate in places etc but AFAIK it's the only documentation on this stuff that exists. The issue is likely to be not so much gcc4 as glibc, though gcc can cause occasional issues as well. If you only want to go back one revision of Fedora though you should not encounter any of them. You can use the apbuild tool to automatically fix many of these problems. thanks -mike From Fedora at TQMcube.com Tue Mar 15 20:10:34 2005 From: Fedora at TQMcube.com (David Cary Hart) Date: Tue, 15 Mar 2005 15:10:34 -0500 Subject: GCC4 Portability In-Reply-To: References: <1110905720.18889.4.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> Message-ID: <1110917434.18889.20.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> On Tue, 2005-03-15 at 19:55 +0000, Mike Hearn wrote: > On Tue, 15 Mar 2005 11:55:20 -0500, David Cary Hart wrote: > > Sorry. I know as much about C as I do about B12. > > > > If I compile an rpm with gcc4, are there any problems associated with > > installing that rpm on a machine running FC3 that I need to understand? > > Yes, this is a total swamp. I suggest you read this: > > http://autopackage.org/docs/devguide/ch07.htm > > It's a little out of date, doesn't cover all the issues, is inaccurate in > places etc but AFAIK it's the only documentation on this stuff that exists. That's a remarkably authoritative and credible document then -;) It's also beyond my level of comprehension but I get the idea. It's worse than I thought. If I'm reading this correctly then the reverse is also a potential problem (using FC3 rpms in FC4 test 1). > > The issue is likely to be not so much gcc4 as glibc, though gcc can cause > occasional issues as well. If you only want to go back one revision of > Fedora though you should not encounter any of them. > > You can use the apbuild tool to automatically fix many of these problems. Hmm. Sorry I asked but thanks. I'm downloading FC4T1 now. This WILL be interesting. -- ________________________________________________________________________ Kill Spam at the Source: http://www.TQMcube.com/spam_trap.htm Today's Spam Trap Adds: http://www.TQMcube.com/BlockedToday RBLDNSD HowTo: http://www.TQMcube.com/rbldnsd.htm From perbj at stanford.edu Tue Mar 15 20:29:11 2005 From: perbj at stanford.edu (Per Bjornsson) Date: Tue, 15 Mar 2005 12:29:11 -0800 Subject: GCC4 Portability In-Reply-To: <1110917434.18889.20.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> References: <1110905720.18889.4.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> <1110917434.18889.20.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> Message-ID: <1110918552.5171.16.camel@localhost.localdomain> On Tue, 2005-03-15 at 15:10 -0500, David Cary Hart wrote: > On Tue, 2005-03-15 at 19:55 +0000, Mike Hearn wrote: > > On Tue, 15 Mar 2005 11:55:20 -0500, David Cary Hart wrote: > > > Sorry. I know as much about C as I do about B12. > > > > > > If I compile an rpm with gcc4, are there any problems associated with > > > installing that rpm on a machine running FC3 that I need to understand? > > > > Yes, this is a total swamp. I suggest you read this: > > > > http://autopackage.org/docs/devguide/ch07.html > > > > It's a little out of date, doesn't cover all the issues, is inaccurate in > > places etc but AFAIK it's the only documentation on this stuff that exists. > > That's a remarkably authoritative and credible document then -;) It's > also beyond my level of comprehension but I get the idea. It's worse > than I thought. If I'm reading this correctly then the reverse is also a > potential problem (using FC3 rpms in FC4 test 1). Then you're not really reading it correctly though; "build on older, run on newer" binary compatibility works _much_ better than the other way around (and it can certainly be argued that this is also much more important; if you want a binary to work on lots of platforms you just compile it on the oldest one you care about - it can be a chroot if everything is set up correctly, look around e.g. for Mach and maybe Red Hat ABE if you're looking into RHEL). As long as the compiler ABI is the same (basically this is pretty much always true for C and it's supposed to be true for the GCC 3.4->4.0 changeover for C++) and the right libraries are available there shouldn't be a problem. If there is a problem, that's a bug, provided that you do have the right library versions available. Cheers, Per -- Per Bjornsson Ph.D. Candidate, Department of Applied Physics, Stanford University From bpm at ec-group.com Tue Mar 15 21:28:25 2005 From: bpm at ec-group.com (Brian Millett) Date: Tue, 15 Mar 2005 15:28:25 -0600 Subject: rawhide report: 20050315 changes In-Reply-To: <1110911133.27647.26.camel@speedy.iagorubio.net> References: <200503151257.j2FCvl4h006599@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <1110902146.19569.5.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1110905733.22596.8.camel@speedy.iagorubio.net> <1110906212.19569.7.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1110911133.27647.26.camel@speedy.iagorubio.net> Message-ID: <1110922105.19569.10.camel@localhost.localdomain> On Tue, 2005-03-15 at 19:25 +0100, Iago Rubio wrote: > On Tue, 2005-03-15 at 11:03 -0600, Brian Millett wrote: > > On Tue, 2005-03-15 at 17:55 +0100, Iago Rubio wrote: > > > On Tue, 2005-03-15 at 09:55 -0600, Brian Millett wrote: > > > > Had to make some cosmetic patches to get it to compile with gcc4 and I > > > > am sure they are "wrong" but it compiled. > > > > > > > > [bpm]$ diff -wruN nm-netlink-monitor.c~ nm-netlink-monitor.c > > > > --- nm-netlink-monitor.c~ 2005-03-14 23:30:14.000000000 -0600 > > > > +++ nm-netlink-monitor.c 2005-03-15 09:39:23.000000000 -0600 > > > > @@ -568,10 +568,10 @@ > > > > NmNetlinkMonitor *monitor) > > > > { > > > > GError *error; > > > > - gchar *received_bytes; > > > > + gchar *received_bytes=""; > > > > gboolean processing_is_done; > > > > - gsize num_received_bytes; > > > > - guint num_bytes_to_process; > > > > + gsize num_received_bytes=0; > > > > + guint num_bytes_to_process=0; > > > > struct nlmsghdr *header; > > > > > > Frankly, I don't see how this could fix the build. > > > > > > May be it's being used -Werror in the gcc command line ? > > > > Why yes it is. (from Makefile) > > CC = gcc > > CCDEPMODE = depmode=gcc3 > > CFLAGS = -Wall -Werror -std=gnu89 -g -O2 -Wno-unused > > -Wno-strict-aliasing -Wno-sign-compare -Wdeclaration-after-statement > > -Wno-pointer-sign > > CPP = gcc -E > > > > So I do not know what or why the difference. > > -Werror will stop compilation on warnings. > > I think it should be better to take out the -Werror and let the sources > untouched, as to randomly initialize variables could make things fail. > > Taking out -Werror, you will be able to compile, and will let the > warnings inform other developers about this problem. > > Initializing the variables this way you achieve the opposite of what the > developer wanted. He wanted to care of small glitches so he decided to > convert warnings in error. > > You're blindly hiding the warnings, and it can make debugging more > painful. > > In the case you don't care about this, I recommend at least initialize > also the gchar* variable to 0. > > gchar *received_bytes=0; > > This way if it's g_freed anywhere - at least - it won't segfault. > > Just my 2 - euro - cents. Muchicimas gracias. -- Brian Millett - [ Londo, "Believers"] "Unfortunately, we *are* on a budget here." -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part URL: From thomas.hille at nightsabers.org Tue Mar 15 21:51:43 2005 From: thomas.hille at nightsabers.org (Thomas Hille) Date: Tue, 15 Mar 2005 22:51:43 +0100 Subject: A more efficient up2date service using binary diffs In-Reply-To: References: <423224E0.3000005@nc.rr.com> <42333234.8080106@nc.rr.com> <1cef3e9505031317593461f7d2@mail.gmail.com> <20050314071835.GA4018@dudweiler.stuttgart.redhat.com> <1110800423.5843.13.camel@ice-dragon.ddn.de> <1cef3e95050314041145a6f5a0@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1110923503.27320.29.camel@ice-dragon.ddn.de> Am Dienstag, den 15.03.2005, 15:49 -0300 schrieb Alexandre Oliva: > On Mar 14, 2005, Joe Desbonnet wrote: > > > Indeed there are serveral approaches to this problem, all with their > > upsides and downsides. I'm currently treating the cpio archive as one > > big file, and you're probably right -- treating it a file system may > > yield better results. > > I doubt it. In several cases, files get packaged in different > directories or have names changed because of a version change, and > then per-file deltas or rsync of individual files won't save you > anything, but rsync of the entire archive will be able to pick up the > unchanging bits. But I don't think that changing names/paths occur that often (I may be wrong here, but I doubt it). This could be tested out easily and a final version might either decide wich of the two methods (single file or multiple ones) to use on a per rpm basis or try to find the new name or new location of the file. But that is the future, a simple implementation would come first. The other argument against using the whole rpm would be resources: memory consumption is O(n) according to Joe's nice page with the test results. And time is O((n+m) log n) according to the bsdiff site. And having big packages like OOo or kernel reducing the input-file-size would do a great job in reducing needed resources. While I need say that I also see the problem of having to strip a nice packaged rpm apart before doing the diff involves some more code in to get the job done. Which in turn involves more errors. Thomas From toshio at tiki-lounge.com Tue Mar 15 23:12:05 2005 From: toshio at tiki-lounge.com (Toshio Kuratomi) Date: Tue, 15 Mar 2005 15:12:05 -0800 Subject: A more efficient up2date service using binary diffs In-Reply-To: <1110923503.27320.29.camel@ice-dragon.ddn.de>; from thomas.hille@nightsabers.org on Tue, Mar 15, 2005 at 10:51:43PM +0100 References: <423224E0.3000005@nc.rr.com> <42333234.8080106@nc.rr.com> <1cef3e9505031317593461f7d2@mail.gmail.com> <20050314071835.GA4018@dudweiler.stuttgart.redhat.com> <1110800423.5843.13.camel@ice-dragon.ddn.de> <1cef3e95050314041145a6f5a0@mail.gmail.com> <1110923503.27320.29.camel@ice-dragon.ddn.de> Message-ID: <20050315151205.A25119@tiki-lounge.com> On Tue, Mar 15, 2005 at 10:51:43PM +0100, Thomas Hille wrote: > > While I need say that I also see the problem of having to strip a nice > packaged rpm apart before doing the diff involves some more code in to > get the job done. Which in turn involves more errors. > diff'ing files also ignores file permissions and rpm package metadata. -Toshio From mrsam at courier-mta.com Tue Mar 15 23:48:53 2005 From: mrsam at courier-mta.com (Sam Varshavchik) Date: Tue, 15 Mar 2005 18:48:53 -0500 Subject: GCC4 Portability References: <1110905720.18889.4.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> Message-ID: David Cary Hart writes: > Sorry. I know as much about C as I do about B12. > > If I compile an rpm with gcc4, are there any problems associated with > installing that rpm on a machine running FC3 that I need to understand? If you're compiling C++ code you probably need to install gcc4's libstdc++ on FC3, in order to run C++ code. Pure C code should be ok. RPM is fairly good at automatically figuring out these things by itself. Try installing the package with rpm. If rpm complains that's something's missing, it's not going to work. If rpm installs the package without whining, you're probably ok. -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: not available URL: From m.a.young at durham.ac.uk Wed Mar 16 00:13:34 2005 From: m.a.young at durham.ac.uk (M A Young) Date: Wed, 16 Mar 2005 00:13:34 +0000 (GMT) Subject: A more efficient up2date service using binary diffs In-Reply-To: <1110923503.27320.29.camel@ice-dragon.ddn.de> References: <423224E0.3000005@nc.rr.com> <42333234.8080106@nc.rr.com> <1cef3e9505031317593461f7d2@mail.gmail.com> <20050314071835.GA4018@dudweiler.stuttgart.redhat.com> <1110800423.5843.13.camel@ice-dragon.ddn.de> <1cef3e95050314041145a6f5a0@mail.gmail.com> <1110923503.27320.29.camel@ice-dragon.ddn.de> Message-ID: On Tue, 15 Mar 2005, Thomas Hille wrote: > But I don't think that changing names/paths occur that often (I may be > wrong here, but I doubt it). One place this does happen is docs files where the path depends on the rpm version. > The other argument against using the whole rpm would be resources: > memory consumption is O(n) according to Joe's nice page with the test > results. And time is O((n+m) log n) according to the bsdiff site. And > having big packages like OOo or kernel reducing the input-file-size > would do a great job in reducing needed resources. Splitting rpms up will save processing resources, but is likely to take up a bit more bandwidth due to the per file overheads. It certainly won't save bandwidth as the deltas ignore anything that is the same at both ends. The real solution is to split up rpms a bit more and not having huge single rpms that are the size of a CD when decompressed. Fortunately it seems people agree with me, as it looks like openoffice.org will be in smaller pieces in FC4. Michael Young From thomas.hille at nightsabers.org Wed Mar 16 00:44:13 2005 From: thomas.hille at nightsabers.org (Thomas Hille) Date: Wed, 16 Mar 2005 01:44:13 +0100 Subject: A more efficient up2date service using binary diffs In-Reply-To: <20050315151205.A25119@tiki-lounge.com> References: <423224E0.3000005@nc.rr.com> <42333234.8080106@nc.rr.com> <1cef3e9505031317593461f7d2@mail.gmail.com> <20050314071835.GA4018@dudweiler.stuttgart.redhat.com> <1110800423.5843.13.camel@ice-dragon.ddn.de> <1cef3e95050314041145a6f5a0@mail.gmail.com> <1110923503.27320.29.camel@ice-dragon.ddn.de> <20050315151205.A25119@tiki-lounge.com> Message-ID: <1110933853.27320.44.camel@ice-dragon.ddn.de> Am Dienstag, den 15.03.2005, 15:12 -0800 schrieb Toshio Kuratomi: > On Tue, Mar 15, 2005 at 10:51:43PM +0100, Thomas Hille wrote: > > > > While I need say that I also see the problem of having to strip a nice > > packaged rpm apart before doing the diff involves some more code in to > > get the job done. Which in turn involves more errors. > > > diff'ing files also ignores file permissions and rpm package metadata. Don't get me wrong here. I just meant to diff two rpms in a way, were you take apart the two rpms diff their content, (including _all_ metadata of course) put the diffs in some kind of container (prpms?). Then, when the end-user would update the old installed rpm would be used in conjunction with the diff-container to produce a new current rpm. Maybe my point was not clear because I also mentioned single files on the end-users computer. What I meant there was, you could recreate the old installed rpm out of data mostly already present on the end-users computer, instead of having to keep a copy of the rpm around. Thomas From cra at WPI.EDU Wed Mar 16 02:21:57 2005 From: cra at WPI.EDU (Chuck R. Anderson) Date: Tue, 15 Mar 2005 21:21:57 -0500 Subject: A more efficient up2date service using binary diffs In-Reply-To: <1110933853.27320.44.camel@ice-dragon.ddn.de> References: <42333234.8080106@nc.rr.com> <1cef3e9505031317593461f7d2@mail.gmail.com> <20050314071835.GA4018@dudweiler.stuttgart.redhat.com> <1110800423.5843.13.camel@ice-dragon.ddn.de> <1cef3e95050314041145a6f5a0@mail.gmail.com> <1110923503.27320.29.camel@ice-dragon.ddn.de> <20050315151205.A25119@tiki-lounge.com> <1110933853.27320.44.camel@ice-dragon.ddn.de> Message-ID: <20050316022157.GE28313@angus.ind.WPI.EDU> On Wed, Mar 16, 2005 at 01:44:13AM +0100, Thomas Hille wrote: > Don't get me wrong here. I just meant to diff two rpms in a way, were > you take apart the two rpms diff their content, (including _all_ > metadata of course) put the diffs in some kind of container (prpms?). > Then, when the end-user would update the old installed rpm would be used > in conjunction with the diff-container to produce a new current rpm. I wonder if Jigdo would work. The component files would be downloaded separately, along with the jigdo template file. These would be combined on the client end to form the original rpm file, identical in every way. From alan at balclutha.org Wed Mar 16 06:51:48 2005 From: alan at balclutha.org (Alan Milligan) Date: Wed, 16 Mar 2005 17:51:48 +1100 Subject: gutenprint-5.0.0 (was gimp-print) Message-ID: <4237D784.7010403@balclutha.org> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Hi, I'm wanting to package gutenprint as I need the Epson R200 CD printing features not present in gimp-print-4.2.7 It's a little unclear to me if this package is supposed to obsolete gimp-print, I'm assuming it does. I've built gutenprint using the gimp-print spec as a template. But while all of the gui tools work, the whole cups/lpr thing is broken - I can't get anything into the print queue. I've not played with Unix printing in years, and was wondering if anybody's got further with packaging this than I. Alan -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.2.4 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iD8DBQFCN9eECfroLk4EZpkRAvJlAJ9yFvXv6Dp8krr6bBp/G25XwHUrZACghDtu pacR0aLf1mK31bOZi2n3GCk= =MunW -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From paul at all-the-johnsons.co.uk Wed Mar 16 10:37:07 2005 From: paul at all-the-johnsons.co.uk (Paul) Date: Wed, 16 Mar 2005 10:37:07 +0000 Subject: bugzilla down? Message-ID: <1110969427.7631.67.camel@localhost.localdomain> Hi, I keep getting error 500 when trying to access bugzilla from an email report. Is there a problem with it? TTFN Paul -- "It is often said that something cannot be libel if it is the truth. This has had to be amended to 'something cannot be libel if it is the truth or if the bank balance says otherwise'" - US Today -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part URL: From buildsys at redhat.com Wed Mar 16 12:27:21 2005 From: buildsys at redhat.com (Build System) Date: Wed, 16 Mar 2005 07:27:21 -0500 Subject: rawhide report: 20050316 changes Message-ID: <200503161227.j2GCRLRO025357@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> Removed package Glide3 Updated Packages: NetworkManager-0.4-3.cvs20050315.3.0 ------------------------------------ * Tue Mar 15 2005 Ray Strode 0.4-3.cvs20050315 - Pull from latest CVS HEAD * Tue Mar 15 2005 Ray Strode 0.4-2.cvs20050315 - Upload new source tarball (woops) attr-2.4.16-5 ------------- bash-3.0-30 ----------- * Tue Mar 15 2005 Tim Waugh 3.0-30 - Fix PS1 expansion crash when PWD is unset (bg #151116). coreutils-5.2.1-42 ------------------ * Mon Mar 14 2005 Tim Waugh 5.2.1-42 - Fixed pam patch. - Fixed broken configure test. - Fixed build with GCC 4 (bug #151045). dia-1:0.94-9 ------------ * Wed Mar 16 2005 Caolan McNamara - rh#151207# add Requires gamin-0.0.26-1 -------------- * Tue Mar 15 2005 Daniel Veillard 0.0.26-1 - Fix an include problem showing up with gcc4 - Fix the crash on failed tree assert bug #150471 based on patch from Dean Brettle - removed an incompatibility with SGI FAM #149822 * Tue Mar 01 2005 Daniel Veillard 0.0.25-1 - Fix a configure problem reported by Martin Schlemmer - Fix the /media/* and /mnt/* mount blocking problems from 0.0.24 e.g. #142637 - Fix the monitoring of directory using poll and not kernel * Fri Feb 18 2005 Daniel Veillard 0.0.24-1 - more documentation - lot of serious bug fixes including Gnome Desktop refresh bug - extending the framework for more debug (configure --enable-debug-api) - extending the python bindings for watching the same resource multiple times and adding debug framework support - growing the regression tests a lot based on python bindings - inotify-0.19 patch from John McCutchan - renamed python private module to _gamin to follow Python PEP 8 gcc-4.0.0-0.34 -------------- * Tue Mar 15 2005 Jakub Jelinek 4.0.0-0.34 - update from gcc-4_0-branch - PRs c++/20157, c++/20280, fortran/16907, fortran/20323, fortran/20361, fortran/20467, libfortran/20124, middle-end/19331, other/20326, rtl-optimization/20306, target/20288, target/20415 - add Req/BuildReq for glib2 and libart_lgpl (#150923) - fix up gnat_ug_unw.info* @direntry (#150948) - fix occassional parallel build failures in Ada stage1 gnome-pilot-conduits-2.0.12-5 ----------------------------- * Tue Mar 15 2005 David Malcolm - 2.0.12-5 - added patch to get it to build against pilot-link-0.12 API * Mon Mar 14 2005 David Malcolm - 2.0.12-4 - rebuilt against pilot-link-0.12 iproute-2.6.11-1 ---------------- * Tue Mar 15 2005 Radek Vokal 2.6.11-1 - update to iproute-2.6.11 iprutils-2.0.13.7-2 ------------------- * Wed Mar 16 2005 Paul Nasrat - 2.0.13.7-2 - rebuild - missing buildrequires * Thu Feb 24 2005 Paul Nasrat - 2.0.13.7-1 - Update to 2.0.13.7 (#144654) - Project moved location to sourceforge java-1.4.2-gcj-compat-0:1.4.2.0-40jpp_12rh ------------------------------------------ * Tue Mar 15 2005 Thomas Fitzsimmons - 0:1.4.2.0-40jpp_12rh - Don't re-run rebuild-security-providers. * Tue Mar 15 2005 Thomas Fitzsimmons - 0:1.4.2.0-40jpp_11rh - Add jaas and jta provides. * Tue Mar 08 2005 Thomas Fitzsimmons - 0:1.4.2.0-40jpp_10rh - Import java-gcj-compat 1.0.22. - Symlink jaas.jar, jdbc-stdext.jar, jndi.jar and jta.jar to libgcj.jar. jessie-0:1.0.0-2 ---------------- jpackage-utils-0:1.6.2-1jpp_5rh ------------------------------- * Tue Mar 08 2005 Thomas Fitzsimmons - 0:1.6.2-1jpp_5rh - Install security directory in /etc. man-1.5p-2 ---------- * Wed Mar 16 2005 Ivana Varekova 1.5p-2 - fix bug 140178 - correct one typo - fix bug 140202 - problem with makewhatis exit (patch 13) - fix bug 140207 - problem with makewhatis -u (patch 14) the fixed version update information about man-pages which are less then one day old (it is used in day update) (man-pages may be fixed) - fix bug 140729 - makewhatis removed to /usr/sbin - fix bug 146631 - two-part locale dir-name is support (patch 15) - changed makewhatis version * Mon Mar 07 2005 Ivana Varekova 1.5p-1 - rebuilt new version #147716 * Fri Mar 04 2005 Ivana Varekova 1.5m2-13 - rebuilt man-pages-ja-20050315-1 ----------------------- * Tue Mar 15 2005 Akira TAGOH - 20050315-1 - updates to 20050315. mkinitrd-4.2.3-1 ---------------- * Tue Mar 15 2005 Peter Jones - 4.2.2-1 - Fix accidental formatting of data in grub.conf (#151118, from proski at gnu.org) mtools-3.9.9-12 --------------- * Tue Mar 15 2005 Tim Waugh 3.9.9-12 - Fix build (bug #151135). openoffice.org-1:1.9.84-1 ------------------------- * Wed Mar 09 2005 Caolan McNamara 1:1.9.84-1 - bump to 1.9.84 - describe what language is in which langpack, drop some unsupported ones - ppc should build hsqldb now - disable qadevOOo for now until gcj3 workspace is fully integrated - gcc20465 breaks ooo build perl-Net-DNS-0.48-2 ------------------- * Tue Mar 15 2005 Warren Togami 0.48-2 - exclude ia64 for now due to Bug #151127 pfmon-3.0-6 ----------- * Tue Mar 15 2005 Will Cohen - Correct passing RPM_OPT_FLAGS. - Correct field to match /usr/include/bits/siginfo.h. policycoreutils-1.23.1-1 ------------------------ * Tue Mar 15 2005 Dan Walsh 1.23.1-1 - Update to released version from NSA * Merged rewrite of genhomedircon by Eric Paris. * Changed fixfiles to relabel jfs since it now supports security xattrs (as of 2.6.11). Removed reiserfs until 2.6.12 is released with fixed support for reiserfs and selinux. ppc64-utils-0.7-9 ----------------- * Tue Mar 15 2005 Paul Nasrat - 0.7-9 - Rebuild * Wed Oct 20 2004 Jeremy Katz - 0.7-8 - add some more error handling to new mkzimage * Wed Oct 20 2004 Jeremy Katz - 0.7-7 - New mkzimage script from dhowells that works with the zImage.stub in our 2.6 kernels - use mktemp instead of predictable filenames in /tmp - use the zImage.lds in the package instead of output by the script ruby-1.8.2-5 ------------ * Tue Mar 15 2005 Akira TAGOH - 1.8.2-5 - rebuilt selinux-policy-strict-1.23.2-1 ------------------------------ * Tue Mar 15 2005 Dan Walsh 1.23.2-1 - Update from NSA * Merged diffs from Dan Walsh. Dan's patch includes Ivan Gyurdiev's gift policy. * Made sysadm_r the first role for root, so root's home will be labled as sysadm_home_dir_t instead of staff_home_dir_t. * Modified fs_use and Makefile to reflect jfs now supporting security xattrs. selinux-policy-targeted-1.23.2-1 -------------------------------- * Tue Mar 15 2005 Dan Walsh 1.23.2-1 - Update from NSA * Merged diffs from Dan Walsh. Dan's patch includes Ivan Gyurdiev's gift policy. * Made sysadm_r the first role for root, so root's home will be labled as sysadm_home_dir_t instead of staff_home_dir_t. * Modified fs_use and Makefile to reflect jfs now supporting security xattrs. spamassassin-3.0.2-2 -------------------- * Tue Mar 15 2005 Warren Togami - 3.0.2-2 - exclude ia64 for now due to Bug #151127 synaptics-0:0.14.0-2 -------------------- * Tue Mar 15 2005 Paul Nasrat - 0:0.14.0-2 - Rebuild system-config-securitylevel-1.5.2-1 ----------------------------------- * Tue Mar 15 2005 Dan Walsh 1.5.2-1 - Update booleand/tunable descriptions usermode-1.79-2 --------------- * Tue Mar 15 2005 Matthias Clasen 1.79-2 - rebuild against new libwnck vixie-cron-1:4.1-26_FC4 ----------------------- * Tue Mar 15 2005 Jason Vas Dias - 4.1-26_FC4 - fix bug 151145: segfault if cronjob runs without any SELinux user - security context (eg. in a broken chroot environment) yaboot-1.3.12-9 --------------- * Tue Mar 15 2005 Paul Nasrat - 1.3.12-9 - GCC 4 rebuild yum-2.3.1-3 ----------- * Tue Mar 15 2005 Jeremy Katz - 2.3.1-3 - add patch from gijs for sqlite changes From jlaska at redhat.com Wed Mar 16 13:17:11 2005 From: jlaska at redhat.com (James Laska) Date: Wed, 16 Mar 2005 08:17:11 -0500 Subject: bugzilla down? In-Reply-To: <1110969427.7631.67.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <1110969427.7631.67.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <1110979031.22948.22.camel@localhost.localdomain> Please try purging your bugzilla browser cookies and trying again. Thanks, James Laska On Wed, 2005-03-16 at 10:37 +0000, Paul wrote: > Hi, > > I keep getting error 500 when trying to access bugzilla from an email > report. Is there a problem with it? > > TTFN > > Paul > -- > fedora-devel-list mailing list > fedora-devel-list at redhat.com > http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-list From jkt at redhat.com Wed Mar 16 13:20:40 2005 From: jkt at redhat.com (Jay Turner) Date: Wed, 16 Mar 2005 14:20:40 +0100 Subject: bugzilla down? In-Reply-To: <1110969427.7631.67.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <1110969427.7631.67.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <20050316132040.GO5489@redhat.com> On Wed, Mar 16, 2005 at 10:37:07AM +0000, Paul wrote: > Hi, > > I keep getting error 500 when trying to access bugzilla from an email > report. Is there a problem with it? We cut over to the version of the site which has been in beta for quite some time and it appears that cookies from the old site are wreaking havoc on the new site. Try removing all of your bugzilla.redhat.com cookies and trying again. That should do the trick for you. Enjoy the new site :-) - jkt -- --*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*--* Jay Turner, QA Technical Lead jkt at redhat.com Red Hat, Inc. If A equals success, then the formula is: A = X + Y + Z, X is work. Y is play. Z is keep your mouth shut. - Albert Einstein From paul at all-the-johnsons.co.uk Wed Mar 16 13:24:40 2005 From: paul at all-the-johnsons.co.uk (Paul) Date: Wed, 16 Mar 2005 13:24:40 +0000 Subject: gnome-pilot and gnome-applets Message-ID: <1110979480.7631.78.camel@localhost.localdomain> Hi, Can these please be rebuilt as they're currently stopping yum from updating (they rely on libwnck-1.so.4 and libpisock.so.8 which have now been updated)? Thanks TTFN Paul -- "It is often said that something cannot be libel if it is the truth. This has had to be amended to 'something cannot be libel if it is the truth or if the bank balance says otherwise'" - US Today -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part URL: From ph18 at cornell.edu Wed Mar 16 13:38:44 2005 From: ph18 at cornell.edu (Paul A. Houle) Date: Wed, 16 Mar 2005 08:38:44 -0500 Subject: A more efficient up2date service using binary diffs In-Reply-To: <20050316022157.GE28313@angus.ind.WPI.EDU> References: <42333234.8080106@nc.rr.com> <1cef3e9505031317593461f7d2@mail.gmail.com> <20050314071835.GA4018@dudweiler.stuttgart.redhat.com> <1110800423.5843.13.camel@ice-dragon.ddn.de> <1cef3e95050314041145a6f5a0@mail.gmail.com> <1110923503.27320.29.camel@ice-dragon.ddn.de> <20050315151205.A25119@tiki-lounge.com> <1110933853.27320.44.camel@ice-dragon.ddn.de> <20050316022157.GE28313@angus.ind.WPI.EDU> Message-ID: On Tue, 15 Mar 2005 21:21:57 -0500, Chuck R. Anderson wrote: > On Wed, Mar 16, 2005 at 01:44:13AM +0100, Thomas Hille wrote: >> Don't get me wrong here. I just meant to diff two rpms in a way, were >> you take apart the two rpms diff their content, (including _all_ >> metadata of course) put the diffs in some kind of container (prpms?). >> Then, when the end-user would update the old installed rpm would be used >> in conjunction with the diff-container to produce a new current rpm. > > I wonder if Jigdo would work. The component files would be downloaded > separately, along with the jigdo template file. These would be > combined on the client end to form the original rpm file, identical in > every way. > Something along these lines might make sense. We really have to think about the ease of use standards set by the competition. I recently had to buy a Mac mini for some consulting work, and really, Mac OS X makes any Linux distribution look bad. I doubt either Windows Update or the equivalent under Mac OS X has a granularity as coarse as rpms. Neither of those requires that you keep your OS disk around or burns up 4G on your disk with packages. Perhaps Fedora can get away with looking like somebody's science project, but for what RHEL costs (six arms and five legs,) I think users would expect a little more. From mike at navi.cx Wed Mar 16 13:41:38 2005 From: mike at navi.cx (Mike Hearn) Date: Wed, 16 Mar 2005 13:41:38 +0000 Subject: GCC4 Portability References: <1110905720.18889.4.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> <1110917434.18889.20.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> <1110918552.5171.16.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: On Tue, 15 Mar 2005 12:29:11 -0800, Per Bjornsson wrote: > Then you're not really reading it correctly though; "build on older, run > on newer" binary compatibility works _much_ better than the other way > around Right, however you still have issues with library versions changing (and typically, the compat- packages are not installed by default). thanks -mike From jdesbonnet at gmail.com Wed Mar 16 14:06:55 2005 From: jdesbonnet at gmail.com (Joe Desbonnet) Date: Wed, 16 Mar 2005 14:06:55 +0000 Subject: A more efficient up2date service using binary diffs In-Reply-To: References: <42333234.8080106@nc.rr.com> <20050314071835.GA4018@dudweiler.stuttgart.redhat.com> <1110800423.5843.13.camel@ice-dragon.ddn.de> <1cef3e95050314041145a6f5a0@mail.gmail.com> <1110923503.27320.29.camel@ice-dragon.ddn.de> <20050315151205.A25119@tiki-lounge.com> <1110933853.27320.44.camel@ice-dragon.ddn.de> <20050316022157.GE28313@angus.ind.WPI.EDU> Message-ID: <1cef3e9505031606061a6e2cbe@mail.gmail.com> We have to set realistic expectations here. There seems to be some reluctance within Redhat to upgrade the current update mechanism. I doubt we will get any of their programmers working on it. So whatever is likely to work must be do-able by one or two people in a few months. That, IMHO, means working with the RPM system. RPMs have been part of Redhat since the beginning (it can be argued that it's what put Redhat on the Linux map in the first place). I firmly believe that a repository of deltas that can be applied to the existing RPMs to produce update RPMs in addition to the usual download the whole RPM approach can yield a speed increase of x 4 or better for those on narrow band links. Keeping a GB or two of RPMs on disk to enable this to happen is, I believe, a very small price to pay -- especially if the user can choose if they want to or not. I disagree that Windows does not require you to keep your OS distribution on disk. I believe most machines sold with XP come with complete re-install kits, often kept in a hidden partition. Joe. On Wed, 16 Mar 2005 08:38:44 -0500, Paul A. Houle wrote: > On Tue, 15 Mar 2005 21:21:57 -0500, Chuck R. Anderson wrote: > We really have to think about the ease of use standards set by the > competition. I recently had to buy a Mac mini for some consulting work, > and really, Mac OS X makes any Linux distribution look bad. > > I doubt either Windows Update or the equivalent under Mac OS X has a > granularity as coarse as rpms. Neither of those requires that you keep > your OS disk around or burns up 4G on your disk with packages. > From Nigel.Metheringham at dev.intechnology.co.uk Wed Mar 16 14:31:41 2005 From: Nigel.Metheringham at dev.intechnology.co.uk (Nigel Metheringham) Date: Wed, 16 Mar 2005 14:31:41 +0000 Subject: A more efficient up2date service using binary diffs In-Reply-To: <1cef3e9505031606061a6e2cbe@mail.gmail.com> References: <42333234.8080106@nc.rr.com> <20050314071835.GA4018@dudweiler.stuttgart.redhat.com> <1110800423.5843.13.camel@ice-dragon.ddn.de> <1cef3e95050314041145a6f5a0@mail.gmail.com> <1110923503.27320.29.camel@ice-dragon.ddn.de> <20050315151205.A25119@tiki-lounge.com> <1110933853.27320.44.camel@ice-dragon.ddn.de> <20050316022157.GE28313@angus.ind.WPI.EDU> <1cef3e9505031606061a6e2cbe@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1110983501.6211.29.camel@angua.localnet> On Wed, 2005-03-16 at 14:06 +0000, Joe Desbonnet wrote: > We have to set realistic expectations here. There seems to be some > reluctance within Redhat to upgrade the current update mechanism. I > doubt we will get any of their programmers working on it. There is an additional restriction:- * It will be much harder to sell this if special software - especially any server (which would likely give firewall problems anyway) or web server plugin is required to support this. Remember that there are a load of Red Hat/Fedora mirror sites. Lots of them do not get a lot of attention, and some of the biggest and best connected would also be loath to putting extra software on to facilitate this. So the ideal is something that just works with http and/or ftp. Byte range fetches are probably OK (for http). Requiring an rsync server would make things more difficult, although potentially do-able (but remember that sometimes rsync paths are rather different to the http ones). Nigel. -- [ Nigel Metheringham Nigel.Metheringham at InTechnology.co.uk ] [ - Comments in this message are my own and not ITO opinion/policy - ] From eric.tanguy at univ-nantes.fr Wed Mar 16 14:31:50 2005 From: eric.tanguy at univ-nantes.fr (Eric Tanguy) Date: Wed, 16 Mar 2005 15:31:50 +0100 (CET) Subject: TV Tuner problem In-Reply-To: <1110899287.3946.3.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <1110840619.9346.2.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1110886704.924.35.camel@tweedy.ksc.nasa.gov> <1110899287.3946.3.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <10133.213.215.209.170.1110983510.squirrel@213.215.209.170> > Le mardi 15 mars 2005 ?? 06:38 -0500, Bob Chiodini a ??crit : >> On Mon, 2005-03-14 at 23:50 +0100, Eric Tanguy wrote: >> > i tried a lot of thing to solve my problem and maybe it could be a >> > module problem : >> > modprobing bttv seems to give good results and all is autodetected >> (the >> > tuner seems to be the right one) : >> > bttv: driver version 0.9.15 loaded >> > bttv: using 8 buffers with 2080k (520 pages) each for capture >> > bttv: Bt8xx card found (0). >> > ACPI: PCI interrupt 0000:01:07.0[A] -> GSI 11 (level, low) -> IRQ 11 >> > bttv0: Bt878 (rev 17) at 0000:01:07.0, irq: 11, latency: 64, mmio: >> > 0xeb800000 >> > bttv0: detected: Pinnacle PCTV [card=39], PCI subsystem ID is >> 11bd:0012 >> > bttv0: using: Pinnacle PCTV Studio/Rave [card=39,autodetected] >> > bttv0: gpio: en=00000000, out=00000000 in=00fff3ff [init] >> > bttv0: i2c: checking for MSP34xx @ 0x80... not found >> > bttv0: pinnacle/mt: id=4 info="PAL+SECAM / mono" radio=no >> > bttv0: using tuner=33 >> > bttv0: i2c: checking for MSP34xx @ 0x80... not found >> > bttv0: i2c: checking for TDA9875 @ 0xb0... not found >> > bttv0: i2c: checking for TDA7432 @ 0x8a... not found >> > tda9885/6/7: chip found @ 0x96 >> > tuner: chip found at addr 0xc0 i2c-bus bt878 #0 [sw] >> > tuner: type set to 33 (MT20xx universal) by bt878 #0 [sw] >> > tuner: microtune: companycode=3cbf part=42 rev=2f >> > tuner: microtune MT2050 found, OK >> > bttv0: registered device video0 >> > bttv0: registered device vbi0 >> > bttv0: PLL: 28636363 => 35468950 . ok >> > >> > The problem is i receive no signal in tvtime whereas this card works >> > fine under windows. It seems the system cannot set the right tuner >> > frequency : >> > >> > mt2050_set_if_freq failed with -121 >> > >> > Someone could help me ? >> >> Eric, >> >> Take a look at this thread. >> >> http://groups-beta.google.com/group/linux.kernel/browse_thread/thread/58bd50364a5b47d8/81b8dfdd7bed9d95?q=linux+Pinnacle+PCTV+rave+tuner#81b8dfdd7bed9d95 >> >> It looks like there is a patch. Also, one of the posters said it worked >> in 2.6.9. Do you have a 2.6.9 version of the kernel still around? >> >> BTW: I don't see why your question was off-topic on the "other list". >> >> Bob... >> > Yes you are right. I try the old 2.6.9-1.667 kernel instead of the > actual 2.6.10-1.770_FC3 one and my tv tuner works fine. > So it would be a kernel module problem and if i can't ask this kind of > questions on the devel list i don't where i can ... > Thanks > Eric > > No answer ? What can i do ?? Eric From pbruna at linuxcenterla.com Wed Mar 16 14:59:56 2005 From: pbruna at linuxcenterla.com (Patricio Bruna V) Date: Wed, 16 Mar 2005 10:59:56 -0400 Subject: fglrx (ati radeon drivers) Message-ID: <1110985196.11443.1.camel@cluster2> i just upgrade my kernel (2.6.11-1.1177_FC4) and GCC (GCC4) and fglrx stop compiling well. any ideas why? -- Patricio Bruna pbruna at linuxcenterla.com Red Hat Certified Engineer Jefe Soporte y Operaciones LinuxCenter S.A. Canada 239, 5to piso, Providencia, Chile http://www.linuxcenterla.com +56-2-2745000 From dwmw2 at infradead.org Wed Mar 16 14:57:38 2005 From: dwmw2 at infradead.org (David Woodhouse) Date: Wed, 16 Mar 2005 14:57:38 +0000 Subject: fglrx (ati radeon drivers) In-Reply-To: <1110985196.11443.1.camel@cluster2> References: <1110985196.11443.1.camel@cluster2> Message-ID: <1110985058.16158.301.camel@hades.cambridge.redhat.com> On Wed, 2005-03-16 at 10:59 -0400, Patricio Bruna V wrote: > i just upgrade my kernel (2.6.11-1.1177_FC4) and GCC (GCC4) and fglrx > stop compiling well. > any ideas why? Trying my utmost to keep the reply as comprehensive and informative as the question... "because it's broken". Off-topic for this list, too. -- dwmw2 From paul at all-the-johnsons.co.uk Wed Mar 16 15:22:00 2005 From: paul at all-the-johnsons.co.uk (Paul) Date: Wed, 16 Mar 2005 15:22:00 +0000 Subject: usb_storage Message-ID: <1110986521.7631.82.camel@localhost.localdomain> Hi, Any signs of usb_storage being fixed? I could really do with being able to use my internal card reader... TTFN Paul -- "It is often said that something cannot be libel if it is the truth. This has had to be amended to 'something cannot be libel if it is the truth or if the bank balance says otherwise'" - US Today -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part URL: From Fedora at TQMcube.com Wed Mar 16 15:59:47 2005 From: Fedora at TQMcube.com (David Cary Hart) Date: Wed, 16 Mar 2005 10:59:47 -0500 Subject: Kernel du Jour? Message-ID: <1110988787.8353.8.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> Korg released YAKV this morning - 2.6.11.4 (unfortunately without a change log). Does this suggest a problem or is there a new release policy? Fedora rawhide - at least thus far - doesn't seem to have updated for any of the sub-versions. Is there a reason for that? -- ________________________________________________________________________ Kill Spam at the Source: http://www.TQMcube.com/spam_trap.htm Today's Spam Trap Adds: http://www.TQMcube.com/BlockedToday RBLDNSD HowTo: http://www.TQMcube.com/rbldnsd.htm From fedora-devel at camperquake.de Wed Mar 16 16:01:52 2005 From: fedora-devel at camperquake.de (Ralf Ertzinger) Date: Wed, 16 Mar 2005 17:01:52 +0100 Subject: Kernel du Jour? In-Reply-To: <1110988787.8353.8.camel@dch.TQMcube.com>; from Fedora@TQMcube.com on Wed, Mar 16, 2005 at 10:59:47AM -0500 References: <1110988787.8353.8.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> Message-ID: <20050316170152.A9463@ryoko.camperquake.de> On Wed, Mar 16, 2005 at 10:59:47AM -0500, David Cary Hart wrote: > Korg released YAKV this morning - 2.6.11.4 (unfortunately without a > change log). Does this suggest a problem or is there a new release > policy? Fedora rawhide - at least thus far - doesn't seem to have > updated for any of the sub-versions. Is there a reason for that? fedora-devel tracks Linus' kernel (or a version thereof), I think. From pbruna at linuxcenterla.com Wed Mar 16 16:08:32 2005 From: pbruna at linuxcenterla.com (Patricio Bruna V) Date: Wed, 16 Mar 2005 12:08:32 -0400 Subject: fglrx (ati radeon drivers) In-Reply-To: <1110985058.16158.301.camel@hades.cambridge.redhat.com> References: <1110985196.11443.1.camel@cluster2> <1110985058.16158.301.camel@hades.cambridge.redhat.com> Message-ID: <1110989312.12024.2.camel@cluster2> El mi?, 16-03-2005 a las 14:57 +0000, David Woodhouse escribi?: > On Wed, 2005-03-16 at 10:59 -0400, Patricio Bruna V wrote: > > i just upgrade my kernel (2.6.11-1.1177_FC4) and GCC (GCC4) and fglrx > > stop compiling well. > > any ideas why? > > Trying my utmost to keep the reply as comprehensive and informative as > the question... "because it's broken". > > Off-topic for this list, too. Off-topic? so where i should ask? -- Patricio Bruna pbruna at linuxcenterla.com Red Hat Certified Engineer Jefe Soporte y Operaciones LinuxCenter S.A. Canada 239, 5to piso, Providencia, Chile http://www.linuxcenterla.com +56-2-2745000 From nutello at sweetness.com Wed Mar 16 16:07:15 2005 From: nutello at sweetness.com (Rudi Chiarito) Date: Wed, 16 Mar 2005 17:07:15 +0100 Subject: Kernel du Jour? In-Reply-To: <20050316170152.A9463@ryoko.camperquake.de> References: <1110988787.8353.8.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> <20050316170152.A9463@ryoko.camperquake.de> Message-ID: <20050316160715.GA30778@plain.rackshack.net> On Wed, Mar 16, 2005 at 05:01:52PM +0100, Ralf Ertzinger wrote: > fedora-devel tracks Linus' kernel (or a version thereof), I think. I think it's mostly Alan's -ac kernels, which seem to be supersets of 2.6.x.y. -- Rudi From linville at redhat.com Wed Mar 16 16:10:34 2005 From: linville at redhat.com (John W. Linville) Date: Wed, 16 Mar 2005 11:10:34 -0500 Subject: Kernel du Jour? In-Reply-To: <1110988787.8353.8.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> References: <1110988787.8353.8.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> Message-ID: <20050316161034.GG22493@redhat.com> On Wed, Mar 16, 2005 at 10:59:47AM -0500, David Cary Hart wrote: > Korg released YAKV this morning - 2.6.11.4 (unfortunately without a > change log). Does this suggest a problem or is there a new release > policy? Fedora rawhide - at least thus far - doesn't seem to have > updated for any of the sub-versions. Is there a reason for that? The four-part release numbers are (mostly) a new thing -- an effort to provide stabilized branches between three-part releases on the not-as-stable-as-it-used-to-be main 2.6 branch. Dave Jones will have to speak on the policy we have or will adopt regarding taking updates from four-part releases... Either way, I wouldn't worry too much if I were you... :-) John -- John W. Linville linville at redhat.com From johnp at redhat.com Wed Mar 16 16:12:46 2005 From: johnp at redhat.com (John (J5) Palmieri) Date: Wed, 16 Mar 2005 11:12:46 -0500 Subject: fglrx (ati radeon drivers) In-Reply-To: <1110989312.12024.2.camel@cluster2> References: <1110985196.11443.1.camel@cluster2> <1110985058.16158.301.camel@hades.cambridge.redhat.com> <1110989312.12024.2.camel@cluster2> Message-ID: <1110989566.5469.3.camel@remedyz.boston.redhat.com> On Wed, 2005-03-16 at 12:08 -0400, Patricio Bruna V wrote: > El mi?, 16-03-2005 a las 14:57 +0000, David Woodhouse escribi?: > > On Wed, 2005-03-16 at 10:59 -0400, Patricio Bruna V wrote: > > > i just upgrade my kernel (2.6.11-1.1177_FC4) and GCC (GCC4) and fglrx > > > stop compiling well. > > > any ideas why? > > > > Trying my utmost to keep the reply as comprehensive and informative as > > the question... "because it's broken". > > > > Off-topic for this list, too. > Off-topic? so where i should ask? >From http://fedora.redhat.com/participate/communicate/ fedora-list - For users of Fedora Core releases. If you want help with a problem installing or using Fedora Core, this is the list for you. fedora-test-list - For testers of Fedora Core test releases. If you would like to discuss experiences using Fedora Core TEST releases, this is the list for you. fedora-devel-list - For developers, developers, developers. If you are interested in helping create Fedora Core releases, this is the list for you. So depending which release of fedora you are on fedora-list or fedora-test-list would be your best bets. -- John (J5) Palmieri Associate Software Engineer Desktop Group Red Hat, Inc. Blog: http://martianrock.com From ph18 at cornell.edu Wed Mar 16 16:18:04 2005 From: ph18 at cornell.edu (Paul A. Houle) Date: Wed, 16 Mar 2005 11:18:04 -0500 Subject: A more efficient up2date service using binary diffs In-Reply-To: <1cef3e9505031606061a6e2cbe@mail.gmail.com> References: <42333234.8080106@nc.rr.com> <20050314071835.GA4018@dudweiler.stuttgart.redhat.com> <1110800423.5843.13.camel@ice-dragon.ddn.de> <1cef3e95050314041145a6f5a0@mail.gmail.com> <1110923503.27320.29.camel@ice-dragon.ddn.de> <20050315151205.A25119@tiki-lounge.com> <1110933853.27320.44.camel@ice-dragon.ddn.de> <20050316022157.GE28313@angus.ind.WPI.EDU> <1cef3e9505031606061a6e2cbe@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On Wed, 16 Mar 2005 14:06:55 +0000, Joe Desbonnet wrote: > > Keeping a GB or two of RPMs on disk to enable this to happen is, I > believe, a very small price to pay -- especially if the user can > choose if they want to or not. I disagree that Windows does not > require you to keep your OS distribution on disk. I believe most > machines sold with XP come with complete re-install kits, often kept > in a hidden partition. > Well that's really an interesting idea. If we're going to keep a copy of the rpms around, we might as well get the most milage we can out of them. I don't really know if it would help me in my real use scenarios. When I've had a Linux install trashed it's either been a blown disk or hacked machine (who knows what they'll do to the reinstall kit.) From arjanv at redhat.com Wed Mar 16 16:18:35 2005 From: arjanv at redhat.com (Arjan van de Ven) Date: Wed, 16 Mar 2005 17:18:35 +0100 Subject: fglrx (ati radeon drivers) In-Reply-To: <1110989312.12024.2.camel@cluster2> References: <1110985196.11443.1.camel@cluster2> <1110985058.16158.301.camel@hades.cambridge.redhat.com> <1110989312.12024.2.camel@cluster2> Message-ID: <1110989916.6292.26.camel@laptopd505.fenrus.org> On Wed, 2005-03-16 at 12:08 -0400, Patricio Bruna V wrote: > El mi?, 16-03-2005 a las 14:57 +0000, David Woodhouse escribi?: > > On Wed, 2005-03-16 at 10:59 -0400, Patricio Bruna V wrote: > > > i just upgrade my kernel (2.6.11-1.1177_FC4) and GCC (GCC4) and fglrx > > > stop compiling well. > > > any ideas why? > > > > Trying my utmost to keep the reply as comprehensive and informative as > > the question... "because it's broken". > > > > Off-topic for this list, too. > Off-topic? so where i should ask? the ATI support forum for their non open source drivers... -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part URL: From eric at snowmoon.com Wed Mar 16 16:40:55 2005 From: eric at snowmoon.com (Eric Warnke) Date: Wed, 16 Mar 2005 11:40:55 -0500 Subject: A more efficient up2date service using binary diffs In-Reply-To: <1110983501.6211.29.camel@angua.localnet> References: <42333234.8080106@nc.rr.com> <20050314071835.GA4018@dudweiler.stuttgart.redhat.com> <1110800423.5843.13.camel@ice-dragon.ddn.de> <1cef3e95050314041145a6f5a0@mail.gmail.com> <1110923503.27320.29.camel@ice-dragon.ddn.de> <20050315151205.A25119@tiki-lounge.com> <1110933853.27320.44.camel@ice-dragon.ddn.de> <20050316022157.GE28313@angus.ind.WPI.EDU> <1cef3e9505031606061a6e2cbe@mail.gmail.com> <1110983501.6211.29.camel@angua.localnet> Message-ID: <42386197.4080408@snowmoon.com> This has got me thinking, if the binary diffs are just byte range replacement from existing RPM's why store the new rpm and the diff files? Why not just include the range metadata information in the repo and then yum ( or whatever ) could use http/ftp byte range requests on the new rpm + the cached older rpm to build the new rpm. By storing just the diff metadata we get away without forcing a kind of double storage on the mirrors, we have no need for additional protocols, and I think it just simplifies everyone's life. Diffrence metadata will continue to drop as more "diff friendly" rpm's are built. Changes to the way diff's are done can also be kept as part of the metadata so that future releases can change diff format without breaking backwards compatibility. Cheers, Eric Nigel Metheringham wrote: >On Wed, 2005-03-16 at 14:06 +0000, Joe Desbonnet wrote: > > >>We have to set realistic expectations here. There seems to be some >>reluctance within Redhat to upgrade the current update mechanism. I >>doubt we will get any of their programmers working on it. >> >> > >There is an additional restriction:- > * It will be much harder to sell this if special software - > especially any server (which would likely give firewall problems > anyway) or web server plugin is required to support this. > >Remember that there are a load of Red Hat/Fedora mirror sites. Lots of >them do not get a lot of attention, and some of the biggest and best >connected would also be loath to putting extra software on to facilitate >this. > >So the ideal is something that just works with http and/or ftp. Byte >range fetches are probably OK (for http). Requiring an rsync server >would make things more difficult, although potentially do-able (but >remember that sometimes rsync paths are rather different to the http >ones). > > Nigel. > > > -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 251 bytes Desc: OpenPGP digital signature URL: From sopwith at redhat.com Wed Mar 16 17:28:00 2005 From: sopwith at redhat.com (Elliot Lee) Date: Wed, 16 Mar 2005 12:28:00 -0500 Subject: Fedora Project Mailing Lists reminder Message-ID: This is a reminder of the mailing lists for the Fedora Project, and the purpose of each list. You can view this information at http://fedora.redhat.com/participate/communicate/ When you're using these mailing lists, please take the time to choose the one that is most appropriate to your post. If you don't know the right mailing list to use for a question or discussion, please contact me. This will help you get the best possible answer for your question, and keep other list subscribers happy! Mailing Lists Mailing lists are email addresses which send email to all users subscribed to the mailing list. Sending an email to a mailing list reaches all users interested in discussing a specific topic and users available to help other users with the topic. The following mailing lists are available. To subscribe, send email to -request at redhat.com (replace with the desired mailing list name such as fedora-list) with the word subscribe in the subject. fedora-announce-list - Announcements of changes and events. To stay aware of news, subscribe to this list. fedora-list - For users of releases. If you want help with a problem installing or using , this is the list for you. fedora-test-list - For testers of test releases. If you would like to discuss experiences using TEST releases, this is the list for you. fedora-devel-list - For developers, developers, developers. If you are interested in helping create releases, this is the list for you. fedora-extras-list - For users and developers of Fedora Extras fedora-docs-list - For participants of the docs project fedora-desktop-list - For discussions about desktop issues such as user interfaces, artwork, and usability fedora-config-list - For discussions about the development of configuration tools fedora-tools-list - For discussions about the toolchain (gcc, gdb, etc...) within Fedora fedora-devel-java-list - For discussions about Java-related Fedora development fedora-patches-list - For submitting patches to Fedora maintainers, and used in line with BugWeek fedora-legacy-announce - For announcements about the Fedora Legacy Project fedora-legacy-list - For discussions about the Fedora Legacy Project fedora-selinux-list - For discussions about the Fedora SELinux Project fedora-marketing-list - For discussions about marketing and expanding the Fedora user base fedora-de-list - For discussions about Fedora in the German language fedora-es-list - For discussions about Fedora in the Spanish language fedora-ja-list - For discussions about Fedora in the Japanese language fedora-i18n-list - For discussions about the internationalization of Fedora Core fedora-trans-list - For discussions about translating the software and documentation associated with the Fedora Project German: fedora-trans-de French: fedora-trans-fr Spanish: fedora-trans-es Italian: fedora-trans-it Brazilian Portuguese: fedora-trans-pt_br Japanese: fedora-trans-ja Korean: fedora-trans-ko Simplified Chinese: fedora-trans-zh_cn Traditional Chinese: fedora-trans-zh_tw From bennet at redhat.com Wed Mar 16 18:03:52 2005 From: bennet at redhat.com (Karen Bennet) Date: Wed, 16 Mar 2005 13:03:52 -0500 Subject: fedora-devel-java-list In-Reply-To: <1109975506.7344.51.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <20050304161808.GB16343@redhat.com> <1109968423.22563.1.camel@one.myworld> <1109975506.7344.51.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <42387508.2070803@redhat.com> fedora-devel-java-list mailing list will be on the fedora.redhat.com/participate/communicate web page within the hour. Anthony Green wrote: >On Fri, 2005-03-04 at 21:33 +0100, F?liciano Matias wrote: > > >>Le vendredi 04 mars 2005 ? 11:18 -0500, Andrew Overholt a ?crit : >> >> >>>I don't think the new list was announced here. If you're interested in >>>Fedora java-related topics, check out: >>> >>>https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-java-list >>> >>> >>More importantly, this mailing (and many other) is not in : >>http://fedora.redhat.com/participate/communicate/ >> >> > >Yes, I asked about that when I originally announced fedora-devel-java- >list. I don't know how those pages are maintained. Pointers welcome! > >AG > > > > From davej at redhat.com Wed Mar 16 18:24:47 2005 From: davej at redhat.com (Dave Jones) Date: Wed, 16 Mar 2005 13:24:47 -0500 Subject: Kernel du Jour? In-Reply-To: <1110988787.8353.8.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> References: <1110988787.8353.8.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> Message-ID: <20050316182447.GD22927@redhat.com> On Wed, Mar 16, 2005 at 10:59:47AM -0500, David Cary Hart wrote: > Korg released YAKV this morning - 2.6.11.4 (unfortunately without a > change log). Does this suggest a problem or is there a new release > policy? Fedora rawhide - at least thus far - doesn't seem to have > updated for any of the sub-versions. Is there a reason for that? FC2 is probably going to stay on 2.6.10 until end of life. It's only going to get security fixes from now on. I toyed with the idea of doing another rebase to .11 before EOL, but the problem is rebasing brings just as many bugs as it fixes, and it would mean we'd need to make a bunch of userspace updates again. Given rebasing the kernel would just create work for a bunch of people, I chose the safe but boring option. FC3 has a rebase to 2.6.11.x in progress. Madmen^WEarly-adopters can grab this from http://people.redhat.com/davej/kernels/Fedora/FC3 It'll go to updates-testing really soon, its finally passing my basic sanity tests, and userspace seems to work ok without any other updates. (Though you can guarantee I've missed something). FC4 is aiming for a 2.6.12 release, so it's on 2.6.11 for test1 In a day or so, it'll jump to 2.6.11-bkX Dave From Fedora at TQMcube.com Wed Mar 16 18:57:49 2005 From: Fedora at TQMcube.com (David Cary Hart) Date: Wed, 16 Mar 2005 13:57:49 -0500 Subject: Kernel du Jour? In-Reply-To: <20050316182447.GD22927@redhat.com> References: <1110988787.8353.8.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> <20050316182447.GD22927@redhat.com> Message-ID: <1110999469.8353.18.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> On Wed, 2005-03-16 at 13:24 -0500, Dave Jones wrote: > FC3 has a rebase to 2.6.11.x in progress. Madmen^WEarly-adopters > can grab this from http://people.redhat.com/davej/kernels/Fedora/FC3 > It'll go to updates-testing really soon, its finally passing my > basic sanity tests, and userspace seems to work ok without any > other updates. (Though you can guarantee I've missed something). > > FC4 is aiming for a 2.6.12 release, so it's on 2.6.11 for test1 > In a day or so, it'll jump to 2.6.11-bkX > > Dave Thanks Dave. So the interim releases by Linus will continue on a regular basis for all future kernels? I notice that FC has typically included at least some snapshot (.bkx) material anyway, as the kernel matures (or at least I thought so). -- ________________________________________________________________________ Kill Spam at the Source: http://www.TQMcube.com/spam_trap.htm Today's Spam Trap Adds: http://www.TQMcube.com/BlockedToday RBLDNSD HowTo: http://www.TQMcube.com/rbldnsd.htm From davej at redhat.com Wed Mar 16 19:10:53 2005 From: davej at redhat.com (Dave Jones) Date: Wed, 16 Mar 2005 14:10:53 -0500 Subject: Kernel du Jour? In-Reply-To: <1110999469.8353.18.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> References: <1110988787.8353.8.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> <20050316182447.GD22927@redhat.com> <1110999469.8353.18.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> Message-ID: <20050316191053.GE22927@redhat.com> On Wed, Mar 16, 2005 at 01:57:49PM -0500, David Cary Hart wrote: > On Wed, 2005-03-16 at 13:24 -0500, Dave Jones wrote: > > > FC3 has a rebase to 2.6.11.x in progress. Madmen^WEarly-adopters > > can grab this from http://people.redhat.com/davej/kernels/Fedora/FC3 > > It'll go to updates-testing really soon, its finally passing my > > basic sanity tests, and userspace seems to work ok without any > > other updates. (Though you can guarantee I've missed something). > > > > FC4 is aiming for a 2.6.12 release, so it's on 2.6.11 for test1 > > In a day or so, it'll jump to 2.6.11-bkX > > > > Dave > Thanks Dave. So the interim releases by Linus will continue on a regular > basis for all future kernels? Yes, except for when a release is nearing end of life, due to the resources needed to clean up any fallout afterwards. > I notice that FC has typically included at > least some snapshot (.bkx) material anyway, as the kernel matures (or at > least I thought so). Ideally, -bk snapshots only end up in rawhide. Though with Fedora releases being uncoupled from upstream kernel releases the two don't always match up, so sometimes in the past we've had to ship a release with -rc4-bk8 or so, and then when the real point release has happened, we've pushed it out as an update. After a release, I tend to stay away from -bk snapshots as so much can (and usually does) break on a daily basis. In the past post-release I've picked up Alan's -ac patchset as a quick-and-easy way to scoop up most of the fixes that we've got. Hopefully 2.6.x.y will work out well so we can use that without needing to take some of the more experimental bits from Alans tree. Dave From Axel.Thimm at ATrpms.net Wed Mar 16 18:37:52 2005 From: Axel.Thimm at ATrpms.net (Axel Thimm) Date: Wed, 16 Mar 2005 19:37:52 +0100 Subject: GFS removed??? (was: rawhide report: 20050315 changes) In-Reply-To: <200503151257.j2FCvl4h006599@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> References: <200503151257.j2FCvl4h006599@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> Message-ID: <20050316183752.GB9082@neu.nirvana> On Tue, Mar 15, 2005 at 07:57:47AM -0500, Build System wrote: > Removed package magma > Removed package ccs > Removed package GFS > Removed package magma-plugins > Removed package iddev > Removed package gulm > Removed package fence > Removed package rgmanager > Removed package ccs > Removed package magma Why? -- Axel.Thimm at ATrpms.net -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: not available URL: From sopwith at redhat.com Wed Mar 16 20:00:21 2005 From: sopwith at redhat.com (Elliot Lee) Date: Wed, 16 Mar 2005 15:00:21 -0500 (EST) Subject: GFS removed??? (was: rawhide report: 20050315 changes) In-Reply-To: <20050316183752.GB9082@neu.nirvana> References: <200503151257.j2FCvl4h006599@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <20050316183752.GB9082@neu.nirvana> Message-ID: On Wed, 16 Mar 2005, Axel Thimm wrote: > On Tue, Mar 15, 2005 at 07:57:47AM -0500, Build System wrote: > > Removed package magma > > Removed package ccs > > Removed package GFS > > Removed package magma-plugins > > Removed package iddev > > Removed package gulm > > Removed package fence > > Removed package rgmanager > > Removed package ccs > > Removed package magma > > Why? Because the kernel support is not included yet. The maintainer of these packages asked for them to be removed until that happens. Cheers, -- Elliot From kyrre at solution-forge.net Wed Mar 16 20:07:09 2005 From: kyrre at solution-forge.net (Kyrre Ness Sjobak) Date: Wed, 16 Mar 2005 21:07:09 +0100 Subject: TV Tuner problem In-Reply-To: <10133.213.215.209.170.1110983510.squirrel@213.215.209.170> References: <1110840619.9346.2.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1110886704.924.35.camel@tweedy.ksc.nasa.gov> <1110899287.3946.3.camel@localhost.localdomain> <10133.213.215.209.170.1110983510.squirrel@213.215.209.170> Message-ID: <1111003628.3458.0.camel@localhost.localdomain> ons, 16.03.2005 kl. 15.31 skrev Eric Tanguy: > > Le mardi 15 mars 2005 ? 06:38 -0500, Bob Chiodini a ??crit : > >> On Mon, 2005-03-14 at 23:50 +0100, Eric Tanguy wrote: > >> > i tried a lot of thing to solve my problem and maybe it could be a > >> > module problem : > >> > modprobing bttv seems to give good results and all is autodetected > >> (the > >> > tuner seems to be the right one) : > >> > bttv: driver version 0.9.15 loaded > >> > bttv: using 8 buffers with 2080k (520 pages) each for capture > >> > bttv: Bt8xx card found (0). > >> > ACPI: PCI interrupt 0000:01:07.0[A] -> GSI 11 (level, low) -> IRQ 11 > >> > bttv0: Bt878 (rev 17) at 0000:01:07.0, irq: 11, latency: 64, mmio: > >> > 0xeb800000 > >> > bttv0: detected: Pinnacle PCTV [card=39], PCI subsystem ID is > >> 11bd:0012 > >> > bttv0: using: Pinnacle PCTV Studio/Rave [card=39,autodetected] > >> > bttv0: gpio: en=00000000, out=00000000 in=00fff3ff [init] > >> > bttv0: i2c: checking for MSP34xx @ 0x80... not found > >> > bttv0: pinnacle/mt: id=4 info="PAL+SECAM / mono" radio=no > >> > bttv0: using tuner=33 > >> > bttv0: i2c: checking for MSP34xx @ 0x80... not found > >> > bttv0: i2c: checking for TDA9875 @ 0xb0... not found > >> > bttv0: i2c: checking for TDA7432 @ 0x8a... not found > >> > tda9885/6/7: chip found @ 0x96 > >> > tuner: chip found at addr 0xc0 i2c-bus bt878 #0 [sw] > >> > tuner: type set to 33 (MT20xx universal) by bt878 #0 [sw] > >> > tuner: microtune: companycode=3cbf part=42 rev=2f > >> > tuner: microtune MT2050 found, OK > >> > bttv0: registered device video0 > >> > bttv0: registered device vbi0 > >> > bttv0: PLL: 28636363 => 35468950 . ok > >> > > >> > The problem is i receive no signal in tvtime whereas this card works > >> > fine under windows. It seems the system cannot set the right tuner > >> > frequency : > >> > > >> > mt2050_set_if_freq failed with -121 > >> > > >> > Someone could help me ? > >> > >> Eric, > >> > >> Take a look at this thread. > >> > >> http://groups-beta.google.com/group/linux.kernel/browse_thread/thread/58bd50364a5b47d8/81b8dfdd7bed9d95?q=linux+Pinnacle+PCTV+rave+tuner#81b8dfdd7bed9d95 > >> > >> It looks like there is a patch. Also, one of the posters said it worked > >> in 2.6.9. Do you have a 2.6.9 version of the kernel still around? > >> > >> BTW: I don't see why your question was off-topic on the "other list". > >> > >> Bob... > >> > > Yes you are right. I try the old 2.6.9-1.667 kernel instead of the > > actual 2.6.10-1.770_FC3 one and my tv tuner works fine. > > So it would be a kernel module problem and if i can't ask this kind of > > questions on the devel list i don't where i can ... > > Thanks > > Eric > > > > > No answer ? What can i do ?? > Eric Bugzilla it? From Axel.Thimm at ATrpms.net Wed Mar 16 20:13:13 2005 From: Axel.Thimm at ATrpms.net (Axel Thimm) Date: Wed, 16 Mar 2005 21:13:13 +0100 Subject: GFS removed??? (was: rawhide report: 20050315 changes) In-Reply-To: References: <200503151257.j2FCvl4h006599@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <20050316183752.GB9082@neu.nirvana> Message-ID: <20050316201313.GJ9082@neu.nirvana> On Wed, Mar 16, 2005 at 03:00:21PM -0500, Elliot Lee wrote: > On Wed, 16 Mar 2005, Axel Thimm wrote: > > > On Tue, Mar 15, 2005 at 07:57:47AM -0500, Build System wrote: > > > Removed package magma > > > Removed package ccs > > > Removed package GFS > > > Removed package magma-plugins > > > Removed package iddev > > > Removed package gulm > > > Removed package fence > > > Removed package rgmanager > > > Removed package ccs > > > Removed package magma > > > > Why? > > Because the kernel support is not included yet. The maintainer of these > packages asked for them to be removed until that happens. All they needed as a mandatory kernel patch was the distributed flock, which was there since 2.6.9 or so. Or do you mean that the GFS' kernel support (which was in these packages) is going to become a patch to the kernel? IMHO it was cleaner as an external kernel module solution and would also give a nicer layering idiom to RHEL4 w/o having to replace the kernel. -- Axel.Thimm at ATrpms.net -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: not available URL: From davej at redhat.com Wed Mar 16 20:20:58 2005 From: davej at redhat.com (Dave Jones) Date: Wed, 16 Mar 2005 15:20:58 -0500 Subject: GFS removed??? (was: rawhide report: 20050315 changes) In-Reply-To: <20050316201313.GJ9082@neu.nirvana> References: <200503151257.j2FCvl4h006599@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <20050316183752.GB9082@neu.nirvana> <20050316201313.GJ9082@neu.nirvana> Message-ID: <20050316202058.GI22927@redhat.com> On Wed, Mar 16, 2005 at 09:13:13PM +0100, Axel Thimm wrote: > On Wed, Mar 16, 2005 at 03:00:21PM -0500, Elliot Lee wrote: > > On Wed, 16 Mar 2005, Axel Thimm wrote: > > > > > On Tue, Mar 15, 2005 at 07:57:47AM -0500, Build System wrote: > > > > Removed package magma > > > > Removed package ccs > > > > Removed package GFS > > > > Removed package magma-plugins > > > > Removed package iddev > > > > Removed package gulm > > > > Removed package fence > > > > Removed package rgmanager > > > > Removed package ccs > > > > Removed package magma > > > > > > Why? > > > > Because the kernel support is not included yet. The maintainer of these > > packages asked for them to be removed until that happens. > > All they needed as a mandatory kernel patch was the distributed flock, > which was there since 2.6.9 or so. > > Or do you mean that the GFS' kernel support (which was in these > packages) is going to become a patch to the kernel? IMHO it was > cleaner as an external kernel module solution and would also give a > nicer layering idiom to RHEL4 w/o having to replace the kernel. FWIW, I'd rather see this done as an external module also. If for no other reason than as a demonstration that external modules can be packaged correctly. If they can't, lets fix that. Rik van Riel has been picking up the slack on kernel-devel the last few days, as I've been swamped with other stuff. Dropping the module seems to imply I'm about to get a patch adding GFS to the rawhide kernel. I'm not thrilled by that idea at all. Being part of the kernel tree means that if I rebase to a -bk snapshot that makes it not compile, it gets dropped until it gets fixed, so being merged there is no better off than the current situation of needing rebuilding each time theres a new kernel. Unrelated sidenote: I'm also less than excited about including stuff in our kernel (even though it is shiny new Red Hat toys) that hasn't had any upstream review yet. When is this getting proposed for inclusion in -mm ? Lets fix this problem properly. Dave From zaitcev at redhat.com Wed Mar 16 21:25:36 2005 From: zaitcev at redhat.com (Pete Zaitcev) Date: Wed, 16 Mar 2005 13:25:36 -0800 Subject: usb_storage In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20050316132536.2c968d17@localhost.localdomain> On Wed, 16 Mar 2005 15:22:00 +0000 Paul wrote: > Any signs of usb_storage being fixed? > > I could really do with being able to use my internal card reader... What are you talking about? -- Pete From Axel.Thimm at ATrpms.net Wed Mar 16 21:31:17 2005 From: Axel.Thimm at ATrpms.net (Axel Thimm) Date: Wed, 16 Mar 2005 22:31:17 +0100 Subject: GFS removed??? (was: rawhide report: 20050315 changes) In-Reply-To: <20050316202058.GI22927@redhat.com> References: <200503151257.j2FCvl4h006599@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <20050316183752.GB9082@neu.nirvana> <20050316201313.GJ9082@neu.nirvana> <20050316202058.GI22927@redhat.com> Message-ID: <20050316213117.GK9082@neu.nirvana> On Wed, Mar 16, 2005 at 03:20:58PM -0500, Dave Jones wrote: > On Wed, Mar 16, 2005 at 09:13:13PM +0100, Axel Thimm wrote: > > On Wed, Mar 16, 2005 at 03:00:21PM -0500, Elliot Lee wrote: > > > On Wed, 16 Mar 2005, Axel Thimm wrote: > > > > > > > On Tue, Mar 15, 2005 at 07:57:47AM -0500, Build System wrote: > > > > > Removed package magma > > > > > Removed package ccs > > > > > Removed package GFS > > > > > Removed package magma-plugins > > > > > Removed package iddev > > > > > Removed package gulm > > > > > Removed package fence > > > > > Removed package rgmanager > > > > > Removed package ccs > > > > > Removed package magma > > > > > > > > Why? > > > > > > Because the kernel support is not included yet. The maintainer of these > > > packages asked for them to be removed until that happens. > > > > All they needed as a mandatory kernel patch was the distributed > > flock, which was there since 2.6.9 or so. > > > > Or do you mean that the GFS' kernel support (which was in these > > packages) is going to become a patch to the kernel? IMHO it was > > cleaner as an external kernel module solution and would also give > > a nicer layering idiom to RHEL4 w/o having to replace the kernel. > > FWIW, I'd rather see this done as an external module also. If for > no other reason than as a demonstration that external modules can be > packaged correctly. If they can't, lets fix that. Perhaps the packaging of kernel modules at ATrpms can be an example for this. There are a couple of dozen of kernel module projects being packaged at ATrpms for the last couple of years proving this scheme to work beautifully. For instance all GFS kernel parts are in foo-kmdl-`uname -r` package names making them unique per kernel. That way parallel kernel installations do not upgrade each others kernel modules but kernel modules still get properly upgraded within each kernel. http://atrpms.net/dist/fc3/cluster/ It doesn't use kernel-devel (since no such thing exists for FC <= 3), but a similar approach embedded into ATrpms' build system allowing to access kernel source configured and prepared for the targetted kernel. -- Axel.Thimm at ATrpms.net -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: not available URL: From skvidal at phy.duke.edu Wed Mar 16 21:54:24 2005 From: skvidal at phy.duke.edu (seth vidal) Date: Wed, 16 Mar 2005 16:54:24 -0500 Subject: GFS removed??? (was: rawhide report: 20050315 changes) In-Reply-To: <20050316213117.GK9082@neu.nirvana> References: <200503151257.j2FCvl4h006599@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <20050316183752.GB9082@neu.nirvana> <20050316201313.GJ9082@neu.nirvana> <20050316202058.GI22927@redhat.com> <20050316213117.GK9082@neu.nirvana> Message-ID: <1111010064.30523.73.camel@opus.phy.duke.edu> > It doesn't use kernel-devel (since no such thing exists for FC <= 3), > but a similar approach embedded into ATrpms' build system allowing to > access kernel source configured and prepared for the targetted kernel. or you could just read ville's post about this to fedora-maintainers or -extras iirc. -sv From paul at all-the-johnsons.co.uk Wed Mar 16 22:12:32 2005 From: paul at all-the-johnsons.co.uk (Paul) Date: Wed, 16 Mar 2005 22:12:32 +0000 Subject: FUDCON 1 Message-ID: <1111011152.8014.20.camel@localhost.localdomain> Hi, Any chance that us in Europe can have a FUDCon? I know the US is big, but there are lots of people over this side who can't get to the US, but could get to somewhere in Europe easier (such as London). It's annoyed me that both Novell and Fedora have done this now, especially as a large number of contributors to Novell products are UK and Europe based! TTFN Paul -- "It is often said that something cannot be libel if it is the truth. This has had to be amended to 'something cannot be libel if it is the truth or if the bank balance says otherwise'" - US Today -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part URL: From ghenry at suretecsystems.com Wed Mar 16 22:15:50 2005 From: ghenry at suretecsystems.com (Gavin Henry) Date: Wed, 16 Mar 2005 22:15:50 +0000 Subject: FUDCON 1 In-Reply-To: <1111011152.8014.20.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <1111011152.8014.20.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <200503162215.50744.ghenry@suretecsystems.com> On Wednesday 16 Mar 2005 22:12, Paul wrote: > Hi, > > Any chance that us in Europe can have a FUDCon? I know the US is big, > but there are lots of people over this side who can't get to the US, but > could get to somewhere in Europe easier (such as London). > > It's annoyed me that both Novell and Fedora have done this now, > especially as a large number of contributors to Novell products are UK > and Europe based! > > TTFN > > Paul +1 vote! -- Kind Regards, Gavin Henry. Managing Director. T +44 (0) 1224 279484 M +44 (0) 7930 323266 F +44 (0) 1224 742001 E ghenry at suretecsystems.com Open Source. Open Solutions(tm). http://www.suretecsystems.com/ From skvidal at phy.duke.edu Wed Mar 16 22:17:24 2005 From: skvidal at phy.duke.edu (seth vidal) Date: Wed, 16 Mar 2005 17:17:24 -0500 Subject: FUDCON 1 In-Reply-To: <1111011152.8014.20.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <1111011152.8014.20.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <1111011444.30523.76.camel@opus.phy.duke.edu> On Wed, 2005-03-16 at 22:12 +0000, Paul wrote: > Hi, > > Any chance that us in Europe can have a FUDCon? I know the US is big, > but there are lots of people over this side who can't get to the US, but > could get to somewhere in Europe easier (such as London). > > It's annoyed me that both Novell and Fedora have done this now, > especially as a large number of contributors to Novell products are UK > and Europe based! > not really a devel issue - more for fedora-marketing-list but fudcon 2 will be at LinuxTag in late June, iirc. you should contact alex maier at red hat about participating! -sv From fedora-devel at camperquake.de Wed Mar 16 22:22:00 2005 From: fedora-devel at camperquake.de (Ralf Ertzinger) Date: Wed, 16 Mar 2005 23:22:00 +0100 Subject: FUDCON 1 In-Reply-To: <1111011444.30523.76.camel@opus.phy.duke.edu> References: <1111011152.8014.20.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1111011444.30523.76.camel@opus.phy.duke.edu> Message-ID: <20050316232200.0e41cc5d@nausicaa.camperquake.de> Hi. seth vidal wrote: > not really a devel issue - more for fedora-marketing-list but fudcon 2 > will be at LinuxTag in late June, iirc. Wohooo! -- "Fare evasion also adds a much needed element of excitement to the otherwise dull trek to work." -- Ronald Seegers From Frederic.Hornain at GB.BE Wed Mar 16 22:24:43 2005 From: Frederic.Hornain at GB.BE (Hornain Frederic) Date: Wed, 16 Mar 2005 23:24:43 +0100 Subject: FUDCON 1 Message-ID: Hello, Completly agree with Paul!!! Why do not we have a Fedora event in Europe ?... and why not ? One for each continent? Cause developpers are all around the world, are they ??? BR Fred -----Original Message----- From: fedora-devel-list-bounces at redhat.com [mailto:fedora-devel-list-bounces at redhat.com]On Behalf Of Paul Sent: Wednesday, March 16, 2005 11:13 PM To: Development discussions related to Fedora Core Subject: FUDCON 1 Hi, Any chance that us in Europe can have a FUDCon? I know the US is big, but there are lots of people over this side who can't get to the US, but could get to somewhere in Europe easier (such as London). It's annoyed me that both Novell and Fedora have done this now, especially as a large number of contributors to Novell products are UK and Europe based! TTFN Paul -- "It is often said that something cannot be libel if it is the truth. This has had to be amended to 'something cannot be libel if it is the truth or if the bank balance says otherwise'" - US Today From skvidal at phy.duke.edu Wed Mar 16 22:24:56 2005 From: skvidal at phy.duke.edu (seth vidal) Date: Wed, 16 Mar 2005 17:24:56 -0500 Subject: FUDCON 1 In-Reply-To: <20050316232200.0e41cc5d@nausicaa.camperquake.de> References: <1111011152.8014.20.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1111011444.30523.76.camel@opus.phy.duke.edu> <20050316232200.0e41cc5d@nausicaa.camperquake.de> Message-ID: <1111011896.30523.82.camel@opus.phy.duke.edu> On Wed, 2005-03-16 at 23:22 +0100, Ralf Ertzinger wrote: > Hi. > > seth vidal wrote: > > > not really a devel issue - more for fedora-marketing-list but fudcon 2 > > will be at LinuxTag in late June, iirc. > > Wohooo! contact Alex or the fedora-marketing-list about it, though. I'm just pulling things from memory and I could be wrong. :) -sv From paul at all-the-johnsons.co.uk Wed Mar 16 22:26:32 2005 From: paul at all-the-johnsons.co.uk (Paul) Date: Wed, 16 Mar 2005 22:26:32 +0000 Subject: FUDCON 1 In-Reply-To: <1111011444.30523.76.camel@opus.phy.duke.edu> References: <1111011152.8014.20.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1111011444.30523.76.camel@opus.phy.duke.edu> Message-ID: <1111011992.8014.23.camel@localhost.localdomain> Hi, > > It's annoyed me that both Novell and Fedora have done this now, > > especially as a large number of contributors to Novell products are UK > > and Europe based! > > > not really a devel issue - more for fedora-marketing-list but fudcon 2 > will be at LinuxTag in late June, iirc. Well, it is and isn't, but hey, I've seen you on the streamcast and feel much happier. I hate emails, the inability to put names to faces... > you should contact alex maier at red hat about participating! Got an email addy? TTFN Paul -- "It is often said that something cannot be libel if it is the truth. This has had to be amended to 'something cannot be libel if it is the truth or if the bank balance says otherwise'" - US Today -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part URL: From skvidal at phy.duke.edu Wed Mar 16 22:26:25 2005 From: skvidal at phy.duke.edu (seth vidal) Date: Wed, 16 Mar 2005 17:26:25 -0500 Subject: FUDCON 1 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1111011985.30523.85.camel@opus.phy.duke.edu> On Wed, 2005-03-16 at 23:24 +0100, Hornain Frederic wrote: > Hello, > > Completly agree with Paul!!! > > Why do not we have a Fedora event in Europe ?... and why not ? One for each continent? > Cause developpers are all around the world, are they ??? > I think everyone agrees with you. There's no argument here, at all, hence why FUDCon2 is being planned for linuxtag. Go Talk to Alex Maier and/or the Fedora Marketing list to find out how you can help. -sv From paul at all-the-johnsons.co.uk Wed Mar 16 22:27:39 2005 From: paul at all-the-johnsons.co.uk (Paul) Date: Wed, 16 Mar 2005 22:27:39 +0000 Subject: FUDCON 1 In-Reply-To: <1111011896.30523.82.camel@opus.phy.duke.edu> References: <1111011152.8014.20.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1111011444.30523.76.camel@opus.phy.duke.edu> <20050316232200.0e41cc5d@nausicaa.camperquake.de> <1111011896.30523.82.camel@opus.phy.duke.edu> Message-ID: <1111012060.8014.24.camel@localhost.localdomain> Hi, > and I could be wrong. :) Nahhhhhhhhhhhhhh ;-p TTFN Paul -- "It is often said that something cannot be libel if it is the truth. This has had to be amended to 'something cannot be libel if it is the truth or if the bank balance says otherwise'" - US Today -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part URL: From skvidal at phy.duke.edu Wed Mar 16 22:27:22 2005 From: skvidal at phy.duke.edu (seth vidal) Date: Wed, 16 Mar 2005 17:27:22 -0500 Subject: FUDCON 1 In-Reply-To: <1111011992.8014.23.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <1111011152.8014.20.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1111011444.30523.76.camel@opus.phy.duke.edu> <1111011992.8014.23.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <1111012042.30523.86.camel@opus.phy.duke.edu> On Wed, 2005-03-16 at 22:26 +0000, Paul wrote: > Hi, > > > > It's annoyed me that both Novell and Fedora have done this now, > > > especially as a large number of contributors to Novell products are UK > > > and Europe based! > > > > > not really a devel issue - more for fedora-marketing-list but fudcon 2 > > will be at LinuxTag in late June, iirc. > > Well, it is and isn't, but hey, I've seen you on the streamcast and feel > much happier. I hate emails, the inability to put names to faces... > > > you should contact alex maier at red hat about participating! > > Got an email addy? > try alex at fedoraproject.org I think that will get to her. -sv From jos at xos.nl Wed Mar 16 22:39:24 2005 From: jos at xos.nl (Jos Vos) Date: Wed, 16 Mar 2005 23:39:24 +0100 Subject: FUDCON 1 In-Reply-To: <1111011152.8014.20.camel@localhost.localdomain>; from paul@all-the-johnsons.co.uk on Wed, Mar 16, 2005 at 10:12:32PM +0000 References: <1111011152.8014.20.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <20050316233924.A26537@xos037.xos.nl> On Wed, Mar 16, 2005 at 10:12:32PM +0000, Paul wrote: > Any chance that us in Europe can have a FUDCon? I know the US is big, > but there are lots of people over this side who can't get to the US, but > could get to somewhere in Europe easier (such as London). Well... London is not really the center of Europe ;-), due to both its geographical position and the fact that it lies on an island. Sorry, couldn't resist... :-) For the rest I agree. -- -- Jos Vos -- X/OS Experts in Open Systems BV | Phone: +31 20 6938364 -- Amsterdam, The Netherlands | Fax: +31 20 6948204 From byte at aeon.com.my Thu Mar 17 00:28:28 2005 From: byte at aeon.com.my (Colin Charles) Date: Thu, 17 Mar 2005 11:28:28 +1100 Subject: FUDCON 1 In-Reply-To: <1111011896.30523.82.camel@opus.phy.duke.edu> References: <1111011152.8014.20.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1111011444.30523.76.camel@opus.phy.duke.edu> <20050316232200.0e41cc5d@nausicaa.camperquake.de> <1111011896.30523.82.camel@opus.phy.duke.edu> Message-ID: <1111019309.17429.122.camel@arena.soho.bytebot.net> On Wed, 2005-03-16 at 17:24 -0500, seth vidal wrote: > > > not really a devel issue - more for fedora-marketing-list but > fudcon 2 > > > will be at LinuxTag in late June, iirc. > > > > Wohooo! > > contact Alex or the fedora-marketing-list about it, though. I'm just > pulling things from memory and I could be wrong. :) This is true; Alex is a good contact point; better still, plan it in the open at fedora-marketing-list at redhat.com (yes, you need to subscribe at http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-marketing-list) -- Colin Charles, byte at aeon.com.my http://www.bytebot.net/ "First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win." -- Mohandas Gandhi From kzak at redhat.com Thu Mar 17 00:33:28 2005 From: kzak at redhat.com (Karel Zak) Date: Thu, 17 Mar 2005 01:33:28 +0100 Subject: packages list Message-ID: <1111019608.4169.175.camel@petra> Hi, I would like to offer my rpmreport script for fedora project. It's still under development, but the HTML output is already usable. The __example__ you can found at: http://docs.linux.cz/rpmreport-html/ it's with details about all files, changelogs and resolved dependences. I can generate it for FC1,FC2,FC3 and we can put it on http://fedora.redhat.com/docs/package-list/ where is now pretty old list of packages. Karel -- Karel Zak From skvidal at phy.duke.edu Thu Mar 17 02:08:07 2005 From: skvidal at phy.duke.edu (seth vidal) Date: Wed, 16 Mar 2005 21:08:07 -0500 Subject: packages list In-Reply-To: <1111019608.4169.175.camel@petra> References: <1111019608.4169.175.camel@petra> Message-ID: <1111025287.5267.4.camel@cutter> On Thu, 2005-03-17 at 01:33 +0100, Karel Zak wrote: > Hi, > > I would like to offer my rpmreport script for fedora project. It's still > under development, but the HTML output is already usable. The > __example__ you can found at: > > http://docs.linux.cz/rpmreport-html/ > > it's with details about all files, changelogs and resolved dependences. > I can generate it for FC1,FC2,FC3 and we can put it on > http://fedora.redhat.com/docs/package-list/ where is now pretty old list > of packages. > Have you looked at: http://linux.duke.edu/projects/mini/repoview/ ? The only item that it doesn't have from what you've described is the resolved dependencies. repoview is being used for this sort of thing at fedora extras, now. -sv From thuforuk at yahoo.co.uk Thu Mar 17 03:08:10 2005 From: thuforuk at yahoo.co.uk (Dariusz J. Garbowski) Date: Thu, 17 Mar 2005 03:08:10 +0000 Subject: packages list In-Reply-To: <1111025287.5267.4.camel@cutter> References: <1111019608.4169.175.camel@petra> <1111025287.5267.4.camel@cutter> Message-ID: <4238F49A.1030107@yahoo.co.uk> On 03/17/2005 02:08 AM, seth vidal wrote: > On Thu, 2005-03-17 at 01:33 +0100, Karel Zak wrote: > >>Hi, >> >>I would like to offer my rpmreport script for fedora project. It's still >>under development, but the HTML output is already usable. The >>__example__ you can found at: >> >> http://docs.linux.cz/rpmreport-html/ >> >>it's with details about all files, changelogs and resolved dependences. >>I can generate it for FC1,FC2,FC3 and we can put it on >>http://fedora.redhat.com/docs/package-list/ where is now pretty old list >>of packages. >> > > > Have you looked at: http://linux.duke.edu/projects/mini/repoview/ ? > > The only item that it doesn't have from what you've described is the > resolved dependencies. Seth, have you looked at Karel's example? It does have more: - list of files in rpm - links to bugzilla bugs (also from changelog!) - dependencies - packages in updates - browse by all packages/groups What it does not seem to have is a link to download the package. I'm sure I missed some features in both scripts ;-) Example usage of Karel's view: browsing by package groups shows that there is a "User Interface/Desktop" group with only one package - gnome-keyring-manager. Shouldn't it be like many other packages in "User Interface/Desktops" group? Click on "bugzilla" link while viewing gnome-keyring-manager page queries bugzilla where one can clearly see that this issue is reported as bug #147903: "Group tag inconsistency". Very nice feature! Regards, Dariusz From skvidal at phy.duke.edu Thu Mar 17 03:21:24 2005 From: skvidal at phy.duke.edu (seth vidal) Date: Wed, 16 Mar 2005 22:21:24 -0500 Subject: packages list In-Reply-To: <4238F49A.1030107@yahoo.co.uk> References: <1111019608.4169.175.camel@petra> <1111025287.5267.4.camel@cutter> <4238F49A.1030107@yahoo.co.uk> Message-ID: <1111029684.5267.14.camel@cutter> > Seth, have you looked at Karel's example? It does have more: > i'd like to look at the code :) > Example usage of Karel's view: browsing by package groups shows that > there is a "User Interface/Desktop" group with only one package - > gnome-keyring-manager. Shouldn't it be like many other packages in "User > Interface/Desktops" group? Click on "bugzilla" link while viewing > gnome-keyring-manager page queries bugzilla where one can clearly see > that this issue is reported as bug #147903: "Group tag inconsistency". > Very nice feature! in general rpmgroups should be dropped. They're just this side of useless for classification. -sv From mricon at gmail.com Thu Mar 17 03:56:13 2005 From: mricon at gmail.com (Konstantin Ryabitsev) Date: Wed, 16 Mar 2005 22:56:13 -0500 Subject: packages list In-Reply-To: <4238F49A.1030107@yahoo.co.uk> References: <1111019608.4169.175.camel@petra> <1111025287.5267.4.camel@cutter> <4238F49A.1030107@yahoo.co.uk> Message-ID: On Thu, 17 Mar 2005 03:08:10 +0000, Dariusz J. Garbowski wrote: > - list of files in rpm I haven't included it since I don't think it's useful to have in a HTML page. > - links to bugzilla bugs (also from changelog!) RepoView is distribution-agnostic, so treating #{number} as a link to redhat's bugzilla is not necessarily the best idea, especially since changelogs can mention bugs from a gnome bugzilla, or from a very large number of others. > - dependencies I've considered it, but again, have not found that useful for someone who is looking at a package listing on the web. I may still add it, but "hidden" by default using styles, so clicking on a "[+] show dependencies" link will unhide it -- possibly the same with files. The concern is -- how much larger will that make the html files? There are packages with a gajillion bajillion files and dependencies. I think having a way to list files and dependencies from a package manager interface would make more sense. Overall, I think that dependencies and files is not something people would be interested in when looking at packages provided by a repository. The purpose of yum is to make dependencies something that "just happens," and looking at a large listing of stuff like "libpthread.so.0(GLIBC_2.3.2)" or "rpmlib(PayloadFilesHavePrefix) <= 4.0-1" will just cause users' eyes glaze over with the resulting sentiment of "Linux is too hard!" I was trying to present the visitor with information that would be relevant for them to evaluate whether they want that package or not. > - packages in updates Theoretically useful, but that would require pulling in RPM bindings to figure out what is an update to what... *shudder* > - browse by all packages/groups Repoview does this when there is a groups file. :) > Example usage of Karel's view: browsing by package groups shows that > there is a "User Interface/Desktop" group with only one package - > gnome-keyring-manager. Shouldn't it be like many other packages in "User > Interface/Desktops" group? RPM groups are useless. I've deliberately ignored them. Regards, -- Konstantin Ryabitsev Zlotniks, INC From stefan.zechmeister at gmx.at Wed Mar 16 20:43:20 2005 From: stefan.zechmeister at gmx.at (Stefan Zechmeister) Date: Wed, 16 Mar 2005 21:43:20 +0100 Subject: fglrx (ati radeon drivers) References: <1110985196.11443.1.camel@cluster2> <1110985058.16158.301.camel@hades.cambridge.redhat.com> <1110989312.12024.2.camel@cluster2> Message-ID: On Wed, 16 Mar 2005 12:08:32 -0400, Patricio Bruna V wrote: > El mi?, 16-03-2005 a las 14:57 +0000, David Woodhouse escribi?: >> On Wed, 2005-03-16 at 10:59 -0400, Patricio Bruna V wrote: >> > i just upgrade my kernel (2.6.11-1.1177_FC4) and GCC (GCC4) and fglrx >> > stop compiling well. >> > any ideas why? >> >> Trying my utmost to keep the reply as comprehensive and informative as >> the question... "because it's broken". >> >> Off-topic for this list, too. > Off-topic? so where i should ask? > > -- > Patricio Bruna > pbruna at linuxcenterla.com > Red Hat Certified Engineer > Jefe Soporte y Operaciones LinuxCenter S.A. > Canada 239, 5to piso, Providencia, Chile > http://www.linuxcenterla.com +56-2-2745000 look here: http://ati.cchtml.com/show_bug.cgi?id=110 bye stefan zechmeister From kzak at redhat.com Thu Mar 17 08:06:51 2005 From: kzak at redhat.com (Karel Zak) Date: Thu, 17 Mar 2005 09:06:51 +0100 Subject: packages list In-Reply-To: <4238F49A.1030107@yahoo.co.uk> References: <1111019608.4169.175.camel@petra> <1111025287.5267.4.camel@cutter> <4238F49A.1030107@yahoo.co.uk> Message-ID: <1111046811.4169.204.camel@petra> On Thu, 2005-03-17 at 03:08 +0000, Dariusz J. Garbowski wrote: > On 03/17/2005 02:08 AM, seth vidal wrote: > > On Thu, 2005-03-17 at 01:33 +0100, Karel Zak wrote: > > > >>Hi, > >> > >>I would like to offer my rpmreport script for fedora project. It's still > >>under development, but the HTML output is already usable. The > >>__example__ you can found at: > >> > >> http://docs.linux.cz/rpmreport-html/ > >> > >>it's with details about all files, changelogs and resolved dependences. > >>I can generate it for FC1,FC2,FC3 and we can put it on > >>http://fedora.redhat.com/docs/package-list/ where is now pretty old list > >>of packages. > >> > > > > > > Have you looked at: http://linux.duke.edu/projects/mini/repoview/ ? It looks good. > Seth, have you looked at Karel's example? It does have more: > > - list of files in rpm > - links to bugzilla bugs (also from changelog!) > - dependencies > - packages in updates > - browse by all packages/groups > > What it does not seem to have is a link to download the package. It's simple add it. There is missing more things like signature of package. My idea is add also some statistics (number of changes, compare update activity between FCn and FCn+1, ...). Karel -- Karel Zak From nicolas.mailhot at laposte.net Thu Mar 17 08:10:47 2005 From: nicolas.mailhot at laposte.net (Nicolas Mailhot) Date: Thu, 17 Mar 2005 09:10:47 +0100 (CET) Subject: packages list In-Reply-To: References: <1111019608.4169.175.camel@petra> <1111025287.5267.4.camel@cutter> <4238F49A.1030107@yahoo.co.uk> Message-ID: <16376.192.54.193.35.1111047047.squirrel@rousalka.dyndns.org> On Jeu 17 mars 2005 4:56, Konstantin Ryabitsev a ?crit : > On Thu, 17 Mar 2005 03:08:10 +0000, Dariusz J. Garbowski >> - dependencies > > I've considered it, but again, have not found that useful for someone > who is looking at a package listing on the web. I may still add it, > but "hidden" by default using styles, so clicking on a "[+] show > dependencies" link will unhide it -- possibly the same with files. The > concern is -- how much larger will that make the html files? There are > packages with a gajillion bajillion files and dependencies. I think > having a way to list files and dependencies from a package manager > interface would make more sense. Dependencies are *very* important for browsing packages on the web. You *do* want to know if an innocuous-looking package will pull in qt, kde, java or another big packageset. A lot of the times the problems a package might have derive directly from the deps it needs. Regards, -- Nicolas Mailhot From skvidal at phy.duke.edu Thu Mar 17 08:14:08 2005 From: skvidal at phy.duke.edu (seth vidal) Date: Thu, 17 Mar 2005 03:14:08 -0500 Subject: packages list In-Reply-To: <16376.192.54.193.35.1111047047.squirrel@rousalka.dyndns.org> References: <1111019608.4169.175.camel@petra> <1111025287.5267.4.camel@cutter> <4238F49A.1030107@yahoo.co.uk> <16376.192.54.193.35.1111047047.squirrel@rousalka.dyndns.org> Message-ID: <1111047248.5267.56.camel@cutter> > Dependencies are *very* important for browsing packages on the web. > You *do* want to know if an innocuous-looking package will pull in qt, > kde, java or another big packageset. Why? isn't that what the pkg mgmt tools are for? > A lot of the times the problems a package might have derive directly from > the deps it needs. again, how's it helpful to user who just wants to browse? I agree with Icon, it just makes things confusing and cluttery. -sv From nicolas.mailhot at laposte.net Thu Mar 17 08:15:24 2005 From: nicolas.mailhot at laposte.net (Nicolas Mailhot) Date: Thu, 17 Mar 2005 09:15:24 +0100 (CET) Subject: FUDCON 1 In-Reply-To: <20050316233924.A26537@xos037.xos.nl> References: <1111011152.8014.20.camel@localhost.localdomain> <20050316233924.A26537@xos037.xos.nl> Message-ID: <25499.192.54.193.35.1111047324.squirrel@rousalka.dyndns.org> On Mer 16 mars 2005 23:39, Jos Vos a ?crit : > On Wed, Mar 16, 2005 at 10:12:32PM +0000, Paul wrote: > >> Any chance that us in Europe can have a FUDCon? I know the US is big, >> but there are lots of people over this side who can't get to the US, but >> could get to somewhere in Europe easier (such as London). > > Well... London is not really the center of Europe ;-), due to both its > geographical position and the fact that it lies on an island. > > Sorry, couldn't resist... :-) > > For the rest I agree. Some place like Brussels might be better placed indeed. And why do a separate convention ? Completing an existing event (FOSDEM, GUADEC...) would simplify things for a lot of people. -- Nicolas Mailhot From skvidal at phy.duke.edu Thu Mar 17 08:19:13 2005 From: skvidal at phy.duke.edu (seth vidal) Date: Thu, 17 Mar 2005 03:19:13 -0500 Subject: FUDCON 1 In-Reply-To: <25499.192.54.193.35.1111047324.squirrel@rousalka.dyndns.org> References: <1111011152.8014.20.camel@localhost.localdomain> <20050316233924.A26537@xos037.xos.nl> <25499.192.54.193.35.1111047324.squirrel@rousalka.dyndns.org> Message-ID: <1111047553.5267.58.camel@cutter> > Some place like Brussels might be better placed indeed. And why do a > separate convention ? Completing an existing event (FOSDEM, GUADEC...) > would simplify things for a lot of people. > read the rest of the thread. fudcon2 will be at linuxtag. -sv From kzak at redhat.com Thu Mar 17 08:22:32 2005 From: kzak at redhat.com (Karel Zak) Date: Thu, 17 Mar 2005 09:22:32 +0100 Subject: packages list In-Reply-To: References: <1111019608.4169.175.camel@petra> <1111025287.5267.4.camel@cutter> <4238F49A.1030107@yahoo.co.uk> Message-ID: <1111047752.4169.221.camel@petra> On Wed, 2005-03-16 at 22:56 -0500, Konstantin Ryabitsev wrote: > On Thu, 17 Mar 2005 03:08:10 +0000, Dariusz J. Garbowski > wrote: > > - list of files in rpm > > I haven't included it since I don't think it's useful to have in a HTML page. > > > - links to bugzilla bugs (also from changelog!) > > RepoView is distribution-agnostic, so treating #{number} as a link to > redhat's bugzilla is not necessarily the best idea, especially since > changelogs can mention bugs from a gnome bugzilla, or from a very > large number of others. Yes, you're right. But I think 80% of all #{number} are pointers to RH bugzilla. It's enough. By the way it support links to CAN- DB too. > > - dependencies > > I've considered it, but again, have not found that useful for someone > who is looking at a package listing on the web. I may still add it, We have different view on problem. I want to make it useful for developers and package maintainers too. For this there are dependences and details about all files in all supported architectures of package. If I will prepare nice web page for users only, I'm sure that I will use your script rather than my. (Hmm.. maybe we can for official fedora web pages use your repoview and for internal RH developers use my script with all FC+RHEL...). > but "hidden" by default using styles, so clicking on a "[+] show > dependencies" link will unhide it -- possibly the same with files. The > concern is -- how much larger will that make the html files? There are It's 400Mb of HTML for FC3+updates ;-( Karel -- Karel Zak From nicolas.mailhot at laposte.net Thu Mar 17 08:25:34 2005 From: nicolas.mailhot at laposte.net (Nicolas Mailhot) Date: Thu, 17 Mar 2005 09:25:34 +0100 (CET) Subject: packages list In-Reply-To: <1111047248.5267.56.camel@cutter> References: <1111019608.4169.175.camel@petra> <1111025287.5267.4.camel@cutter> <4238F49A.1030107@yahoo.co.uk> <16376.192.54.193.35.1111047047.squirrel@rousalka.dyndns.org> <1111047248.5267.56.camel@cutter> Message-ID: <50661.192.54.193.35.1111047934.squirrel@rousalka.dyndns.org> On Jeu 17 mars 2005 9:14, seth vidal a ?crit : > again, how's it helpful to user who just wants to browse? > > I agree with Icon, it just makes things confusing and cluttery. The user that just wants to browse is probably as opiniated as a normal user and will want to skip packages that use a tech he disagrees with Since thanksfully package description does not include the full package DNA this user will need the dep list somewhere. Regards, -- Nicolas Mailhot From alan at balclutha.org Thu Mar 17 08:35:02 2005 From: alan at balclutha.org (Alan Milligan) Date: Thu, 17 Mar 2005 19:35:02 +1100 Subject: package list In-Reply-To: <20050317081904.BCEF273290@hormel.redhat.com> References: <20050317081904.BCEF273290@hormel.redhat.com> Message-ID: <42394136.6090207@balclutha.org> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 I am about to release our own variant: https://build.last-bastion.net This uses Zope and Plone and as such offers customisability (of both look and processing), workflow, collaboration portal, and a whole lot more. What you are seeing here is just the anonymous user view. This also contains a complete restricted-access management API to build and manage distros. I am very interested in getting together interested parties to work on BastionLinuxLite - a genuinely minimal distro. All pre-release-announcement comments welcome. Alan -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.2.4 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iD8DBQFCOUE2CfroLk4EZpkRAmJUAJ4g+3PpF76VaMMsctCiitdCrKKoIQCfTyp8 V8oqKCnVQLJE0IqQX40A+/8= =CIVZ -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From kyrre at solution-forge.net Thu Mar 17 08:44:34 2005 From: kyrre at solution-forge.net (Kyrre Ness Sjobak) Date: Thu, 17 Mar 2005 09:44:34 +0100 Subject: A more efficient up2date service using binary diffs In-Reply-To: <1110983501.6211.29.camel@angua.localnet> References: <42333234.8080106@nc.rr.com> <20050314071835.GA4018@dudweiler.stuttgart.redhat.com> <1110800423.5843.13.camel@ice-dragon.ddn.de> <1cef3e95050314041145a6f5a0@mail.gmail.com> <1110923503.27320.29.camel@ice-dragon.ddn.de> <20050315151205.A25119@tiki-lounge.com> <1110933853.27320.44.camel@ice-dragon.ddn.de> <20050316022157.GE28313@angus.ind.WPI.EDU> <1cef3e9505031606061a6e2cbe@mail.gmail.com> <1110983501.6211.29.camel@angua.localnet> Message-ID: <1111049074.3353.13.camel@localhost.localdomain> ons, 16.03.2005 kl. 15.31 skrev Nigel Metheringham: > On Wed, 2005-03-16 at 14:06 +0000, Joe Desbonnet wrote: > > We have to set realistic expectations here. There seems to be some > > reluctance within Redhat to upgrade the current update mechanism. I > > doubt we will get any of their programmers working on it. > > There is an additional restriction:- > * It will be much harder to sell this if special software - > especially any server (which would likely give firewall problems > anyway) or web server plugin is required to support this. > > Remember that there are a load of Red Hat/Fedora mirror sites. Lots of > them do not get a lot of attention, and some of the biggest and best > connected would also be loath to putting extra software on to facilitate > this. > > So the ideal is something that just works with http and/or ftp. Byte > range fetches are probably OK (for http). Requiring an rsync server > would make things more difficult, although potentially do-able (but > remember that sometimes rsync paths are rather different to the http > ones). > > Nigel. Why make it so hard, as to put the workload of generating the diffs to the mirrors? As far as i understand, mirrors use some kind of script (using rsync?) to copy the contnent of one served resource to their own disk, and serve it from there. They copy the contnent of a directory from one server to another, and serve it using a run of the mill ftp/http-server, hopefully suporting byte-ranges. So... Why should we put the load of generating the prpm's to the mirrors? Why not do that on the main fedora update server - the one that the mirrors mirror? Of cource, we could put them in a separate directory, so mirrors could easily choose to mirror them or not. But main point is: Do the "dirty work" of generating the prpms on the fedora update server (or maybe even the build system). Then upload prpms (newest version -2 -> newest version and newest version -1 -> newest version and base-version -> newest version, to cater for such things as "haven't updated in a while" and "somebody shipped to updates to the package in one day") and the full rpms. This way, yum can use the full rpm's the way it does today to get headers from byte-ranges, and for those who doesn't want to store a lot of base-rpm's on disk, for those who want to easily have a friend etc. burn a disk of updates (some people just doesn't have any network), for people installing new apps from scratch. When yum has decided what to do, it downloads the prpm's (if the user has the base rpm, if not it just get the full updated rpm), patches the old rpm lying on disk to generate a new rpm, and install that as usual. From kyrre at solution-forge.net Thu Mar 17 09:27:17 2005 From: kyrre at solution-forge.net (Kyrre Ness Sjobak) Date: Thu, 17 Mar 2005 10:27:17 +0100 Subject: packages list In-Reply-To: <1111029684.5267.14.camel@cutter> References: <1111019608.4169.175.camel@petra> <1111025287.5267.4.camel@cutter> <4238F49A.1030107@yahoo.co.uk> <1111029684.5267.14.camel@cutter> Message-ID: <1111051637.3353.26.camel@localhost.localdomain> tor, 17.03.2005 kl. 04.21 skrev seth vidal: > > Seth, have you looked at Karel's example? It does have more: > > > > i'd like to look at the code :) > > > > Example usage of Karel's view: browsing by package groups shows that > > there is a "User Interface/Desktop" group with only one package - > > gnome-keyring-manager. Shouldn't it be like many other packages in "User > > Interface/Desktops" group? Click on "bugzilla" link while viewing > > gnome-keyring-manager page queries bugzilla where one can clearly see > > that this issue is reported as bug #147903: "Group tag inconsistency". > > Very nice feature! > > in general rpmgroups should be dropped. They're just this side of > useless for classification. > > -sv They are usefull when browsing for apps in programs such as synaptic (when you don't know exactly which app to install, you just want to try out a few and pick the one you like best. Games are a common usage for that ;) ) From Nigel.Metheringham at dev.intechnology.co.uk Thu Mar 17 09:28:40 2005 From: Nigel.Metheringham at dev.intechnology.co.uk (Nigel Metheringham) Date: Thu, 17 Mar 2005 09:28:40 +0000 Subject: A more efficient up2date service using binary diffs In-Reply-To: <1111049074.3353.13.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <42333234.8080106@nc.rr.com> <20050314071835.GA4018@dudweiler.stuttgart.redhat.com> <1110800423.5843.13.camel@ice-dragon.ddn.de> <1cef3e95050314041145a6f5a0@mail.gmail.com> <1110923503.27320.29.camel@ice-dragon.ddn.de> <20050315151205.A25119@tiki-lounge.com> <1110933853.27320.44.camel@ice-dragon.ddn.de> <20050316022157.GE28313@angus.ind.WPI.EDU> <1cef3e9505031606061a6e2cbe@mail.gmail.com> <1110983501.6211.29.camel@angua.localnet> <1111049074.3353.13.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <1111051720.20402.3.camel@angua.localnet> On Thu, 2005-03-17 at 09:44 +0100, Kyrre Ness Sjobak wrote: > Why make it so hard, as to put the workload of generating the diffs to > the mirrors? As far as i understand, mirrors use some kind of script > (using rsync?) to copy the contnent of one served resource to their own > disk, and serve it from there. They copy the contnent of a directory > from one server to another, and serve it using a run of the mill > ftp/http-server, hopefully suporting byte-ranges. Absolutely. The problem I was addressing is that people seemed to be coming up with more and more complex schemes (ie breaking rpms into individual files) which could be very difficult to implement without needing a smart server. While we are using 3rd party mirrors to distribute updates we will need to have absolutely minimal requirements on the server to be smart - pure dumb file serving over an existing protocol, maybe leveraging byte ranges as the bleeding edge of requirements. Nigel. -- [ Nigel Metheringham Nigel.Metheringham at InTechnology.co.uk ] [ - Comments in this message are my own and not ITO opinion/policy - ] From Axel.Thimm at ATrpms.net Thu Mar 17 09:30:19 2005 From: Axel.Thimm at ATrpms.net (Axel Thimm) Date: Thu, 17 Mar 2005 10:30:19 +0100 Subject: GFS removed??? (was: rawhide report: 20050315 changes) In-Reply-To: <1111010064.30523.73.camel@opus.phy.duke.edu> References: <200503151257.j2FCvl4h006599@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <20050316183752.GB9082@neu.nirvana> <20050316201313.GJ9082@neu.nirvana> <20050316202058.GI22927@redhat.com> <20050316213117.GK9082@neu.nirvana> <1111010064.30523.73.camel@opus.phy.duke.edu> Message-ID: <20050317093019.GD21731@neu.nirvana> On Wed, Mar 16, 2005 at 04:54:24PM -0500, seth vidal wrote: > > It doesn't use kernel-devel (since no such thing exists for FC <= 3), > > but a similar approach embedded into ATrpms' build system allowing to > > access kernel source configured and prepared for the targetted kernel. > > or you could just read ville's post about this to fedora-maintainers or > -extras iirc. Well, Ville wanted to subscribe me to fedora-maintainers two weeks ago, but obviously this was not possible. W/o knowing the contents of his post, the situation is that there are working mechanisms in the field giving a semi-defacto standard. If there is no reason to reinvent the wheel, adopting it would be the cleanest and easiest solution. BTW there is a bad list inflation at fedora that clutters topics across them. You mentioned two others, fedora-devel could be as well a candidate (after all we are discussing right now on this), as well as fedora-packaging. I understand why the lists are being created, but probably having that many lists is hurting more than it serves. Just my 2?. -- Axel.Thimm at ATrpms.net -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: not available URL: From Nigel.Metheringham at dev.intechnology.co.uk Thu Mar 17 09:31:33 2005 From: Nigel.Metheringham at dev.intechnology.co.uk (Nigel Metheringham) Date: Thu, 17 Mar 2005 09:31:33 +0000 Subject: FUDCON 1 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1111051893.20402.6.camel@angua.localnet> On Wed, 2005-03-16 at 23:24 +0100, Hornain Frederic wrote: > Why do not we have a Fedora event in Europe ?... and why not ? One for each continent? FUDCON Antartica now booking - several thousand penguins and maybe the occasional human. [No Killer Whales please]. -- [ Nigel Metheringham Nigel.Metheringham at InTechnology.co.uk ] [ - Comments in this message are my own and not ITO opinion/policy - ] From aportal at univ-montp2.fr Thu Mar 17 09:44:41 2005 From: aportal at univ-montp2.fr (Alain PORTAL) Date: Thu, 17 Mar 2005 10:44:41 +0100 Subject: FC3 Package request: evms-2.5.2 Message-ID: <200503171044.41927.aportal@univ-montp2.fr> X-BeenThere: fedora-devel-list at redhat.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: junk Reply-To: Development discussions related to Fedora Core List-Id: Development discussions related to Fedora Core List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 17 Mar 2005 09:33:56 -0000 Hi all, For my own use, I built a package of evms to manage logicals volumes on my new computer that I plan to submit on Fedora Extras. I am not really in easy with logicals volumes and evms. So, I should want to know if there is somebody that have experience with this software and have tips to give me. Spec file is based on the one provided by the tarball. Regards. -- Alain PORTAL -- Service Commun de Microscopie ?lectronique Universit? de Montpellier II -- Case Courrier 087 Place Eug?ne Bataillon -- 34095 Montpellier Cedex 05 T?l. : 04 67 14 37 35 -- Fax. : 04 67 14 37 37 NO WORD ATTACHMENTS: http://www.fsf.org/philosophy/no-word-attachments.fr.html http://www.giromini.org/usenet-fr/repondre.html From byte at aeon.com.my Thu Mar 17 09:48:16 2005 From: byte at aeon.com.my (Colin Charles) Date: Thu, 17 Mar 2005 20:48:16 +1100 Subject: FC3 Package request: evms-2.5.2 In-Reply-To: <200503171044.41927.aportal@univ-montp2.fr> References: <200503171044.41927.aportal@univ-montp2.fr> Message-ID: <1111052896.17429.189.camel@arena.soho.bytebot.net> On Thu, 2005-03-17 at 10:44 +0100, Alain PORTAL wrote: > For my own use, I built a package of evms to manage logicals volumes > on my > new computer that I plan to submit on Fedora Extras. > I am not really in easy with logicals volumes and evms. So, I should > want to > know if there is somebody that have experience with this software and > have > tips to give me. > Spec file is based on the one provided by the tarball. fedora-extras-list at redhat.com is the right place for Extras submissions (however, if something on the Web pointed you to this list, please inform us so we can fix it) -- Colin Charles, byte at aeon.com.my http://www.bytebot.net/ "First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win." -- Mohandas Gandhi From eric.tanguy at univ-nantes.fr Thu Mar 17 09:56:34 2005 From: eric.tanguy at univ-nantes.fr (Eric Tanguy) Date: Thu, 17 Mar 2005 10:56:34 +0100 (CET) Subject: TV Tuner problem In-Reply-To: <1111003628.3458.0.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <1110840619.9346.2.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1110886704.924.35.camel@tweedy.ksc.nasa.gov> <1110899287.3946.3.camel@localhost.localdomain> <10133.213.215.209.170.1110983510.squirrel@213.215.209.170> <1111003628.3458.0.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <57043.213.215.209.170.1111053394.squirrel@213.215.209.170> > ons, 16.03.2005 kl. 15.31 skrev Eric Tanguy: >> > Le mardi 15 mars 2005 ? 06:38 -0500, Bob Chiodini a ??crit : >> >> On Mon, 2005-03-14 at 23:50 +0100, Eric Tanguy wrote: >> >> > i tried a lot of thing to solve my problem and maybe it could be a >> >> > module problem : >> >> > modprobing bttv seems to give good results and all is autodetected >> >> (the >> >> > tuner seems to be the right one) : >> >> > bttv: driver version 0.9.15 loaded >> >> > bttv: using 8 buffers with 2080k (520 pages) each for capture >> >> > bttv: Bt8xx card found (0). >> >> > ACPI: PCI interrupt 0000:01:07.0[A] -> GSI 11 (level, low) -> IRQ >> 11 >> >> > bttv0: Bt878 (rev 17) at 0000:01:07.0, irq: 11, latency: 64, mmio: >> >> > 0xeb800000 >> >> > bttv0: detected: Pinnacle PCTV [card=39], PCI subsystem ID is >> >> 11bd:0012 >> >> > bttv0: using: Pinnacle PCTV Studio/Rave [card=39,autodetected] >> >> > bttv0: gpio: en=00000000, out=00000000 in=00fff3ff [init] >> >> > bttv0: i2c: checking for MSP34xx @ 0x80... not found >> >> > bttv0: pinnacle/mt: id=4 info="PAL+SECAM / mono" radio=no >> >> > bttv0: using tuner=33 >> >> > bttv0: i2c: checking for MSP34xx @ 0x80... not found >> >> > bttv0: i2c: checking for TDA9875 @ 0xb0... not found >> >> > bttv0: i2c: checking for TDA7432 @ 0x8a... not found >> >> > tda9885/6/7: chip found @ 0x96 >> >> > tuner: chip found at addr 0xc0 i2c-bus bt878 #0 [sw] >> >> > tuner: type set to 33 (MT20xx universal) by bt878 #0 [sw] >> >> > tuner: microtune: companycode=3cbf part=42 rev=2f >> >> > tuner: microtune MT2050 found, OK >> >> > bttv0: registered device video0 >> >> > bttv0: registered device vbi0 >> >> > bttv0: PLL: 28636363 => 35468950 . ok >> >> > >> >> > The problem is i receive no signal in tvtime whereas this card >> works >> >> > fine under windows. It seems the system cannot set the right tuner >> >> > frequency : >> >> > >> >> > mt2050_set_if_freq failed with -121 >> >> > >> >> > Someone could help me ? >> >> >> >> Eric, >> >> >> >> Take a look at this thread. >> >> >> >> http://groups-beta.google.com/group/linux.kernel/browse_thread/thread/58bd50364a5b47d8/81b8dfdd7bed9d95?q=linux+Pinnacle+PCTV+rave+tuner#81b8dfdd7bed9d95 >> >> >> >> It looks like there is a patch. Also, one of the posters said it >> worked >> >> in 2.6.9. Do you have a 2.6.9 version of the kernel still around? >> >> >> >> BTW: I don't see why your question was off-topic on the "other >> list". >> >> >> >> Bob... >> >> >> > Yes you are right. I try the old 2.6.9-1.667 kernel instead of the >> > actual 2.6.10-1.770_FC3 one and my tv tuner works fine. >> > So it would be a kernel module problem and if i can't ask this kind of >> > questions on the devel list i don't where i can ... >> > Thanks >> > Eric >> > >> > >> No answer ? What can i do ?? >> Eric > > Bugzilla it? > > Yes but where because i'm a newbie : kernel ? FC3 ? bttv ? ... Maybe the problem is solved in 2.6.11 kernel ? Is it safe to try the 2.6.11 FC4 kernel from the devel tree on FC3 ? Thanks Eric From fedora at leemhuis.info Thu Mar 17 10:11:41 2005 From: fedora at leemhuis.info (Thorsten Leemhuis) Date: Thu, 17 Mar 2005 11:11:41 +0100 Subject: GFS removed??? (was: rawhide report: 20050315 changes) In-Reply-To: <20050317093019.GD21731@neu.nirvana> References: <200503151257.j2FCvl4h006599@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <20050316183752.GB9082@neu.nirvana> <20050316201313.GJ9082@neu.nirvana> <20050316202058.GI22927@redhat.com> <20050316213117.GK9082@neu.nirvana> <1111010064.30523.73.camel@opus.phy.duke.edu> <20050317093019.GD21731@neu.nirvana> Message-ID: <1111054301.4354.3.camel@thl.ct.heise.de> Am Donnerstag, den 17.03.2005, 10:30 +0100 schrieb Axel Thimm: > On Wed, Mar 16, 2005 at 04:54:24PM -0500, seth vidal wrote: > > > It doesn't use kernel-devel (since no such thing exists for FC <= 3), > > > but a similar approach embedded into ATrpms' build system allowing to > > > access kernel source configured and prepared for the targetted kernel. > > > > or you could just read ville's post about this to fedora-maintainers or > > -extras iirc. [...] > W/o knowing the contents of his post, Axel, read: https://www.redhat.com/archives/fedora-maintainers/2005-March/msg00096.html HTH CU thl From Axel.Thimm at ATrpms.net Thu Mar 17 10:28:37 2005 From: Axel.Thimm at ATrpms.net (Axel Thimm) Date: Thu, 17 Mar 2005 11:28:37 +0100 Subject: GFS removed??? (was: rawhide report: 20050315 changes) In-Reply-To: <1111054301.4354.3.camel@thl.ct.heise.de> References: <200503151257.j2FCvl4h006599@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <20050316183752.GB9082@neu.nirvana> <20050316201313.GJ9082@neu.nirvana> <20050316202058.GI22927@redhat.com> <20050316213117.GK9082@neu.nirvana> <1111010064.30523.73.camel@opus.phy.duke.edu> <20050317093019.GD21731@neu.nirvana> <1111054301.4354.3.camel@thl.ct.heise.de> Message-ID: <20050317102837.GE21731@neu.nirvana> On Thu, Mar 17, 2005 at 11:11:41AM +0100, Thorsten Leemhuis wrote: > Am Donnerstag, den 17.03.2005, 10:30 +0100 schrieb Axel Thimm: > > On Wed, Mar 16, 2005 at 04:54:24PM -0500, seth vidal wrote: > > > > It doesn't use kernel-devel (since no such thing exists for FC <= 3), > > > > but a similar approach embedded into ATrpms' build system allowing to > > > > access kernel source configured and prepared for the targetted kernel. > > > > > > or you could just read ville's post about this to fedora-maintainers or > > > -extras iirc. > [...] > > W/o knowing the contents of his post, > > Axel, read: > https://www.redhat.com/archives/fedora-maintainers/2005-March/msg00096.html Thanks, as I see it Ville discussed setting up the infrastructure to build kernel modules against. What I miss is the discussion of the kernel modules themselves, e.g. what is the proposed naming/versioning scheme. It was a long discussion, but I think finally we all agreed that `uname -r` has to be part of the kernel module _name_, while the version/release tags are standard ones (wrt the module's source). The proposed naming from my side is foo-kmdl-`uname -r`. It's short, sorts well with the rest of foo, doesn't need any yum/up2date/apt/smart special handling and users have already accepted this. Still wrt to the list inflation and closure, no being able to participate to the discussion of such fundamental parts is non-open for the least to say ... -- Axel.Thimm at ATrpms.net -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: not available URL: From aportal at univ-montp2.fr Thu Mar 17 10:47:49 2005 From: aportal at univ-montp2.fr (Alain PORTAL) Date: Thu, 17 Mar 2005 11:47:49 +0100 Subject: FC3 Package request: evms-2.5.2 In-Reply-To: <1111052896.17429.189.camel@arena.soho.bytebot.net> References: <200503171044.41927.aportal@univ-montp2.fr> <1111052896.17429.189.camel@arena.soho.bytebot.net> Message-ID: <200503171147.49256.aportal@univ-montp2.fr> Le jeudi 17 Mars 2005 10:48, Colin Charles a ?crit : > fedora-extras-list at redhat.com is the right place for Extras submissions Sorry :-) > (however, if something on the Web pointed you to this list, please > inform us so we can fix it) No, I wasn't up2dated... Regards. -- Alain PORTAL -- Service Commun de Microscopie ?lectronique Universit? de Montpellier II -- Case Courrier 087 Place Eug?ne Bataillon -- 34095 Montpellier Cedex 05 T?l. : 04 67 14 37 35 -- Fax. : 04 67 14 37 37 NO WORD ATTACHMENTS: http://www.fsf.org/philosophy/no-word-attachments.fr.html http://www.giromini.org/usenet-fr/repondre.html From fedora at leemhuis.info Thu Mar 17 10:38:20 2005 From: fedora at leemhuis.info (Thorsten Leemhuis) Date: Thu, 17 Mar 2005 11:38:20 +0100 Subject: GFS removed??? (was: rawhide report: 20050315 changes) In-Reply-To: <20050317102837.GE21731@neu.nirvana> References: <200503151257.j2FCvl4h006599@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <20050316183752.GB9082@neu.nirvana> <20050316201313.GJ9082@neu.nirvana> <20050316202058.GI22927@redhat.com> <20050316213117.GK9082@neu.nirvana> <1111010064.30523.73.camel@opus.phy.duke.edu> <20050317093019.GD21731@neu.nirvana> <1111054301.4354.3.camel@thl.ct.heise.de> <20050317102837.GE21731@neu.nirvana> Message-ID: <1111055900.4354.8.camel@thl.ct.heise.de> Am Donnerstag, den 17.03.2005, 11:28 +0100 schrieb Axel Thimm: > On Thu, Mar 17, 2005 at 11:11:41AM +0100, Thorsten Leemhuis wrote: > > Am Donnerstag, den 17.03.2005, 10:30 +0100 schrieb Axel Thimm: > > > On Wed, Mar 16, 2005 at 04:54:24PM -0500, seth vidal wrote: > > > > > It doesn't use kernel-devel (since no such thing exists for FC <= 3), > > > > > but a similar approach embedded into ATrpms' build system allowing to > > > > > access kernel source configured and prepared for the targetted kernel. > > > > > > > > or you could just read ville's post about this to fedora-maintainers or > > > > -extras iirc. > > [...] > > > W/o knowing the contents of his post, > > Axel, read: > > https://www.redhat.com/archives/fedora-maintainers/2005-March/msg00096.html > > Thanks, as I see it Ville discussed setting up the infrastructure to > build kernel modules against. What I miss is the discussion of the > kernel modules themselves, e.g. what is the proposed naming/versioning > scheme. http://www.fedoraproject.org/wiki/PackageNamingGuidelines Section 9, Addon Packages (kernel modules) > The proposed naming from my side is foo-kmdl-`uname -r`. It's short, > sorts well with the rest of foo, doesn't need any > yum/up2date/apt/smart special handling and users have already accepted > this. There was a discussion on this on one of the other fedora-lists. But afaik Spot is still working on the big, great, working kernel-module- package solution... From Axel.Thimm at ATrpms.net Thu Mar 17 10:50:00 2005 From: Axel.Thimm at ATrpms.net (Axel Thimm) Date: Thu, 17 Mar 2005 11:50:00 +0100 Subject: GFS removed??? (was: rawhide report: 20050315 changes) In-Reply-To: <1111055900.4354.8.camel@thl.ct.heise.de> References: <20050316183752.GB9082@neu.nirvana> <20050316201313.GJ9082@neu.nirvana> <20050316202058.GI22927@redhat.com> <20050316213117.GK9082@neu.nirvana> <1111010064.30523.73.camel@opus.phy.duke.edu> <20050317093019.GD21731@neu.nirvana> <1111054301.4354.3.camel@thl.ct.heise.de> <20050317102837.GE21731@neu.nirvana> <1111055900.4354.8.camel@thl.ct.heise.de> Message-ID: <20050317105000.GJ21731@neu.nirvana> On Thu, Mar 17, 2005 at 11:38:20AM +0100, Thorsten Leemhuis wrote: > Am Donnerstag, den 17.03.2005, 11:28 +0100 schrieb Axel Thimm: > > On Thu, Mar 17, 2005 at 11:11:41AM +0100, Thorsten Leemhuis wrote: > > > Am Donnerstag, den 17.03.2005, 10:30 +0100 schrieb Axel Thimm: > > > > On Wed, Mar 16, 2005 at 04:54:24PM -0500, seth vidal wrote: > > > > > > It doesn't use kernel-devel (since no such thing exists for FC <= 3), > > > > > > but a similar approach embedded into ATrpms' build system allowing to > > > > > > access kernel source configured and prepared for the targetted kernel. > > > > > > > > > > or you could just read ville's post about this to fedora-maintainers or > > > > > -extras iirc. > > > [...] > > > > W/o knowing the contents of his post, > > > Axel, read: > > > https://www.redhat.com/archives/fedora-maintainers/2005-March/msg00096.html > > > > Thanks, as I see it Ville discussed setting up the infrastructure to > > build kernel modules against. What I miss is the discussion of the > > kernel modules themselves, e.g. what is the proposed naming/versioning > > scheme. > > http://www.fedoraproject.org/wiki/PackageNamingGuidelines > > Section 9, Addon Packages (kernel modules) which is rather broken due to not embedding uname -r into the package name. :( And this probably shows once again that having too many lists is a Real Bad Thing. fedora-packaging creates a (broken) standard for kernel modules while fedora-maintainers creates a standard for the infrastructure that these packages are supposed to use. Both discussions have to be carried on the same list. > > The proposed naming from my side is foo-kmdl-`uname -r`. It's short, > > sorts well with the rest of foo, doesn't need any > > yum/up2date/apt/smart special handling and users have already accepted > > this. > > There was a discussion on this on one of the other fedora-lists. But > afaik Spot is still working on the big, great, working kernel-module- > package solution... There is a working solution at ATrpms. -- Axel.Thimm at ATrpms.net -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: not available URL: From robert.chiodini-1 at ksc.nasa.gov Thu Mar 17 11:48:02 2005 From: robert.chiodini-1 at ksc.nasa.gov (Bob Chiodini) Date: Thu, 17 Mar 2005 06:48:02 -0500 Subject: TV Tuner problem In-Reply-To: <57043.213.215.209.170.1111053394.squirrel@213.215.209.170> References: <1110840619.9346.2.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1110886704.924.35.camel@tweedy.ksc.nasa.gov> <1110899287.3946.3.camel@localhost.localdomain> <10133.213.215.209.170.1110983510.squirrel@213.215.209.170> <1111003628.3458.0.camel@localhost.localdomain> <57043.213.215.209.170.1111053394.squirrel@213.215.209.170> Message-ID: <1111060082.10657.34.camel@tweedy.ksc.nasa.gov> On Thu, 2005-03-17 at 10:56 +0100, Eric Tanguy wrote: > > ons, 16.03.2005 kl. 15.31 skrev Eric Tanguy: > >> > Le mardi 15 mars 2005 ? 06:38 -0500, Bob Chiodini a ??crit : > >> >> On Mon, 2005-03-14 at 23:50 +0100, Eric Tanguy wrote: > >> >> > i tried a lot of thing to solve my problem and maybe it could be a > >> >> > module problem : > >> >> > modprobing bttv seems to give good results and all is autodetected > >> >> (the > >> >> > tuner seems to be the right one) : > >> >> > bttv: driver version 0.9.15 loaded > >> >> > bttv: using 8 buffers with 2080k (520 pages) each for capture > >> >> > bttv: Bt8xx card found (0). > >> >> > ACPI: PCI interrupt 0000:01:07.0[A] -> GSI 11 (level, low) -> IRQ > >> 11 > >> >> > bttv0: Bt878 (rev 17) at 0000:01:07.0, irq: 11, latency: 64, mmio: > >> >> > 0xeb800000 > >> >> > bttv0: detected: Pinnacle PCTV [card=39], PCI subsystem ID is > >> >> 11bd:0012 > >> >> > bttv0: using: Pinnacle PCTV Studio/Rave [card=39,autodetected] > >> >> > bttv0: gpio: en=00000000, out=00000000 in=00fff3ff [init] > >> >> > bttv0: i2c: checking for MSP34xx @ 0x80... not found > >> >> > bttv0: pinnacle/mt: id=4 info="PAL+SECAM / mono" radio=no > >> >> > bttv0: using tuner=33 > >> >> > bttv0: i2c: checking for MSP34xx @ 0x80... not found > >> >> > bttv0: i2c: checking for TDA9875 @ 0xb0... not found > >> >> > bttv0: i2c: checking for TDA7432 @ 0x8a... not found > >> >> > tda9885/6/7: chip found @ 0x96 > >> >> > tuner: chip found at addr 0xc0 i2c-bus bt878 #0 [sw] > >> >> > tuner: type set to 33 (MT20xx universal) by bt878 #0 [sw] > >> >> > tuner: microtune: companycode=3cbf part=42 rev=2f > >> >> > tuner: microtune MT2050 found, OK > >> >> > bttv0: registered device video0 > >> >> > bttv0: registered device vbi0 > >> >> > bttv0: PLL: 28636363 => 35468950 . ok > >> >> > > >> >> > The problem is i receive no signal in tvtime whereas this card > >> works > >> >> > fine under windows. It seems the system cannot set the right tuner > >> >> > frequency : > >> >> > > >> >> > mt2050_set_if_freq failed with -121 > >> >> > > >> >> > Someone could help me ? > >> >> > >> >> Eric, > >> >> > >> >> Take a look at this thread. > >> >> > >> >> http://groups-beta.google.com/group/linux.kernel/browse_thread/thread/58bd50364a5b47d8/81b8dfdd7bed9d95?q=linux+Pinnacle+PCTV+rave+tuner#81b8dfdd7bed9d95 > >> >> > >> >> It looks like there is a patch. Also, one of the posters said it > >> worked > >> >> in 2.6.9. Do you have a 2.6.9 version of the kernel still around? > >> >> > >> >> BTW: I don't see why your question was off-topic on the "other > >> list". > >> >> > >> >> Bob... > >> >> > >> > Yes you are right. I try the old 2.6.9-1.667 kernel instead of the > >> > actual 2.6.10-1.770_FC3 one and my tv tuner works fine. > >> > So it would be a kernel module problem and if i can't ask this kind of > >> > questions on the devel list i don't where i can ... > >> > Thanks > >> > Eric > >> > > >> > > >> No answer ? What can i do ?? > >> Eric > > > > Bugzilla it? > > > > > > Yes but where because i'm a newbie : kernel ? FC3 ? bttv ? ... > Maybe the problem is solved in 2.6.11 kernel ? Is it safe to try the > 2.6.11 FC4 kernel from the devel tree on FC3 ? > Thanks > > Eric > Eric, Try installing (not upgrading) to the Rawhide (FC4) kernel. I've got rawhide running here at 2.6.11-1.1177_FC4. Download the proper kernel RPM from: http://download.fedora.redhat.com/pub/fedora/linux/core/development/i386/Fedora/RPMS/ Run rpm --test -ivh kernel-.rpm. The test option should tell you whether there are any additional dependencies. If that passes then remove the --test option and run again, to actually do the install. Doing an install instead of an upgrade will preserve your earlier kernel versions. Bob... From jdesbonnet at gmail.com Thu Mar 17 12:07:06 2005 From: jdesbonnet at gmail.com (Joe Desbonnet) Date: Thu, 17 Mar 2005 12:07:06 +0000 Subject: A more efficient up2date service using binary diffs In-Reply-To: <1111051720.20402.3.camel@angua.localnet> References: <42333234.8080106@nc.rr.com> <1110923503.27320.29.camel@ice-dragon.ddn.de> <20050315151205.A25119@tiki-lounge.com> <1110933853.27320.44.camel@ice-dragon.ddn.de> <20050316022157.GE28313@angus.ind.WPI.EDU> <1cef3e9505031606061a6e2cbe@mail.gmail.com> <1110983501.6211.29.camel@angua.localnet> <1111049074.3353.13.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1111051720.20402.3.camel@angua.localnet> Message-ID: <1cef3e95050317040716ef0c83@mail.gmail.com> The idea of being able to randomly access portions of a new update RPM by doing byte range requests is interesting. It could in theory reduce the size of the delta file. However this only saves on mirror *disk space*. It does not reduce bandwidth consumption: the client still has to download this either in the delta file or by separate byte range requests. Looking at the size of the updates directory of the FC3/i386 (8GB+) I doubt that mirror maintainers would notice another GB or two. Anyhow, I would propose that any such delta RPM system allow more than one delta algorithm to be used, so if people come up with clever algorithms in future we can seamlessly incorporate it into the system without breaking anything already out there. Joe. On Thu, 17 Mar 2005 09:28:40 +0000, Nigel Metheringham wrote: > > While we are using 3rd party mirrors to distribute updates we will need > to have absolutely minimal requirements on the server to be smart - pure > dumb file serving over an existing protocol, maybe leveraging byte > ranges as the bleeding edge of requirements. > From Nigel.Metheringham at dev.intechnology.co.uk Thu Mar 17 12:26:04 2005 From: Nigel.Metheringham at dev.intechnology.co.uk (Nigel Metheringham) Date: Thu, 17 Mar 2005 12:26:04 +0000 Subject: A more efficient up2date service using binary diffs In-Reply-To: <1cef3e95050317040716ef0c83@mail.gmail.com> References: <42333234.8080106@nc.rr.com> <1110923503.27320.29.camel@ice-dragon.ddn.de> <20050315151205.A25119@tiki-lounge.com> <1110933853.27320.44.camel@ice-dragon.ddn.de> <20050316022157.GE28313@angus.ind.WPI.EDU> <1cef3e9505031606061a6e2cbe@mail.gmail.com> <1110983501.6211.29.camel@angua.localnet> <1111049074.3353.13.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1111051720.20402.3.camel@angua.localnet> <1cef3e95050317040716ef0c83@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1111062365.20402.26.camel@angua.localnet> On Thu, 2005-03-17 at 12:07 +0000, Joe Desbonnet wrote: > Looking at the size of the updates directory of the FC3/i386 (8GB+) I > doubt that mirror maintainers would notice another GB or two. Don't you believe that. Many of the smaller mirrors are really hurting under Fedora at present - the damn distribution is growing at a horrific rate. Now the best thing would be to lose the DVD images (replace them with jigdo templates), and even better the CD images too although it may be harder to do this with legacy expectations. Every Fedora distribution is currently triplicated - unpacked, CD isos and DVD isos all containing the same data. Nigel. -- [ Nigel Metheringham Nigel.Metheringham at InTechnology.co.uk ] [ - Comments in this message are my own and not ITO opinion/policy - ] From buildsys at redhat.com Thu Mar 17 12:33:31 2005 From: buildsys at redhat.com (Build System) Date: Thu, 17 Mar 2005 07:33:31 -0500 Subject: rawhide report: 20050317 changes Message-ID: <200503171233.j2HCXVv2025986@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> New package latex2html Converts LaTeX documents to HTML Removed package fsh Removed package lilo Removed package memprof Removed package compat-pwdb Updated Packages: MAKEDEV-3.18-1 -------------- * Tue Mar 15 2005 Nalin Dahyabhai 3.18-1 - update to 10 February devices-2.6+.txt: - remove vtx - remove vttunner - add mga_vid - add infiniband - add biometrics - add ttyVR,cuvr - add ipath - restruct symlink target creation to exact (-X) mode * Thu Jan 20 2005 Nalin Dahyabhai 3.17-1 - update to 7 January 2005 devices.txt: - add midishare - move cpu/*/microcode to cpu/microcode to match udev's behavior (#144887) - create targets of symlinks if they don't exist acpid-1.0.4-1 ------------- * Wed Mar 16 2005 Bill Nottingham - 1.0.4-1 - update to 1.0.4 adjtimex-1.20-1 --------------- * Wed Mar 16 2005 Jindrich Novy 1.20-1 - update to 1.20 - update .glibc patch - drop .getopt, .fixman, .gcc3 patches anacron-2.3-34 -------------- * Wed Mar 16 2005 Jason Vas Dias 2.3-34 - Rebuild with gcc4 in FC4. apmd-1:3.2.2-1 -------------- * Wed Mar 16 2005 Bill Nottingham -1:3.2.2-1 - update to 3.2.2 (#115650, #125561) - fix some ordering issues in apmscript (#92297) - make /usr/bin/apm return errors sanely (#128405) - fix obviousl wrong sound code (#141463) bg5ps-1.3.0-18 -------------- * Thu Mar 17 2005 Leon Ho - rebuild brltty-3.2-10 ------------- * Wed Mar 16 2005 Bill Nottingham 3.2-10 - rebuild cdparanoia-alpha9.8-25 ---------------------- * Wed Mar 16 2005 Peter Jones alpha9.8-25 - gcc4 rebuild and CFLAGS change ckermit-8.0.211-1 ----------------- * Tue Mar 15 2005 Nalin Dahyabhai 8.0.211-1 - update to 211 * Mon Feb 28 2005 Nalin Dahyabhai - remove now-unnecessary use of krb5_init_ets() cracklib-2.8.1-1 ---------------- * Wed Mar 16 2005 Nalin Dahyabhai 2.8.1-1 - update to 2.8.1 - moves dictionary to new default location under %{_datadir} -- the dictionary format is the same across all architectures - renames "packer" to "cracklib-packer" - conflict with cracklib-dicts < 2.8, where the on-disk format was not compatible on 64-bit arches due to now-fixed cleanliness bugs - move binaries for manipulating and checking words against dictionaries from -dicts into the main package dvgrab-1.7-3 ------------ * Wed Mar 16 2005 Elliot Lee - rebuilt evolution-data-server-1.0.4-3 ----------------------------- * Mon Feb 21 2005 David Malcolm - 1.0.4-3 - updated libsoup requirement from 2.2.1 to 2.2.2 * Mon Feb 21 2005 David Malcolm - 1.0.4-2 - updated sources * Mon Feb 21 2005 David Malcolm - 1.0.4-1 - Update from upstream stable release 1.0.2 to 1.0.4 - Add run-time requirements on libgnomeui, libgnome - Add build-time requirements on libgnomeui-devel, libgnome-devel, bison, libtool - Removed patch for x86_64 build; this is now in upstream tarball - Updated localization code from evolution-data-server-1.5.mo to evolution-data-server-1.0.mo, to match change in upstream tarball fetchmail-6.2.5-7 ----------------- * Wed Mar 16 2005 Nalin Dahyabhai 6.2.5-7 - stop using one of the libkrb5 private functions fonts-indic-1.9-2 ----------------- * Thu Mar 17 2005 Leon Ho 1.9-2 - Renaming s/panjabi/punjabi/ to fit the name in glibc gnome-applets-1:2.10.0-1 ------------------------ * Wed Mar 16 2005 Matthias Clasen - 2.10.0-1 - Rebuild against new libwnck - Update to 2.10.0 - Drop upstreamed patch gnome-media-2.10.0-1 -------------------- * Wed Mar 16 2005 Colin Walters 2.10.0-1 - Update to 2.10.0 gnome-pilot-2.0.12-9 -------------------- * Wed Mar 16 2005 David Malcolm - 2.0.12-9 - fixed missing $RPM_BUILD_ROOT in move of conduits files; do it in install stanza instead of build - include the version in build root * Wed Mar 16 2005 David Malcolm - 2.0.12-8 - added various patches I missed to CVS * Wed Mar 16 2005 David Malcolm - 2.0.12-7 - move conduits file from /usr/share/gnome-pilot/conduits to /usr/LIB_DIR/gnome-pilot/conduits (bz #135304) - initial attempt at porting to pilot-link 0.12 API - disabled backup conduit for now gnome-spell-1.0.5-10 -------------------- * Wed Mar 16 2005 David Malcolm - 1.0.5-10 - rebuild with GCC 4 gnupg-1.4.1-1 ------------- * Wed Mar 16 2005 Nalin Dahyabhai 1.4.1-1 - update to 1.4.1 grub-0.95-12 ------------ * Wed Mar 16 2005 Peter Jones 0.95-12 - Make installing on a partition work again when not using raid gthumb-2.6.4-1 -------------- * Wed Mar 16 2005 John (J5) Palmieri - 2.6.4-1 - Update to upstream version 2.6.4 gtkspell-2.0.7-3 ---------------- * Wed Mar 16 2005 David Malcolm - 2.0.7-3 - rebuild with GCC 4 hesiod-3.0.2-31 --------------- * Wed Mar 16 2005 Nalin Dahyabhai 3.0.2-31 - rebuild iiimf-le-xcin-0.1.7-12 ---------------------- * Thu Mar 17 2005 Leon Ho - 0.1.7-12 - rebuild kdeaccessibility-1:3.4.0-1 -------------------------- * Wed Mar 16 2005 Than Ngo 1:3.4.0-1 - KDE 3.4.0 final kdebase-6:3.4.0-0.rc1.7 ----------------------- * Wed Mar 16 2005 Than Ngo 6:3.4.0-0.rc1.7 - apply gcc4 hack (Dirk M??ller) to avoid konqueror crash kdelibs-6:3.4.0-0.rc1.6 ----------------------- * Wed Mar 16 2005 Than Ngo 6:3.4.0-0.rc1.6 - new snapshot from KDE_3_4_BRANCH * Mon Mar 14 2005 Than Ngo 6:3.4.0-0.rc1.5 - default font setting Sans/Monospace * Fri Mar 04 2005 Than Ngo 6:3.4.0-0.rc1.4 - rebuilt against gcc-4.0.0-0.31 krb5-1.4-2 ---------- * Wed Mar 16 2005 Nalin Dahyabhai 1.4-2 - don't include into the telnet client when we're not using curses krbafs-1.2.2-7 -------------- * Wed Mar 16 2005 Nalin Dahyabhai 1.2.2-7 - rebuild libaio-0.3.103-6 ---------------- * Wed Mar 16 2005 Jeff Moyer - 0.3.103-6 - Rebuild with gcc 4. libavc1394-0.4.1-8 ------------------ * Wed Mar 16 2005 Elliot Lee - rebuilt libdv-0:0.103-4 --------------- * Wed Mar 16 2005 Elliot Lee - rebuilt libgcrypt-1.2.1-1 ----------------- * Wed Mar 16 2005 Nalin Dahyabhai - update to 1.2.1 libraw1394-1.1.0-3 ------------------ * Wed Mar 16 2005 Elliot Lee - rebuilt libsilc-0:0.9.12-9 ------------------ * Wed Mar 16 2005 Elliot Lee - rebuilt libtabe-0.2.6-13 ---------------- * Thu Mar 17 2005 Leon Ho - rebuilt libtermcap-2.0.8-40 ------------------- * Wed Mar 16 2005 Nalin Dahyabhai 2.0.8-40 - rebuild libtool-1.5.14.multilib2-6 -------------------------- * Wed Mar 16 2005 Elliot Lee - rebuilt libxklavier-1.14-2 ------------------ * Wed Mar 16 2005 David Zeuthen 1.14-2 - Rebuild m2crypto-0.13-2 --------------- * Wed Mar 16 2005 Nalin Dahyabhai 0.13-2 - rebuild make-1:3.80-6 ------------- * Mon Dec 13 2004 Jakub Jelinek 3.80-6 - refuse -jN where N is bigger than PIPE_BUF (#142691, #17374) * Thu Oct 07 2004 Jakub Jelinek 3.80-5 - add URL rpm tag (#134799) * Tue Jun 15 2004 Elliot Lee - rebuilt mc-1:4.6.1a-0.5 --------------- * Thu Mar 03 2005 Jindrich Novy 4.6.1a-0.5 - update from CVS - sync the .utf8 patch with upstream - fix infinite loop hang when copying/deleting some strangely named files (#150569) - drop BuildRequires to gettext, XFree86-devel -> xorg-x11-devel - don't define umode_t on ppc64 memtest86+-1.51-2 ----------------- * Wed Mar 16 2005 Elliot Lee - rebuilt mgetty-1.1.31-4 --------------- * Wed Mar 16 2005 Jason Vas Dias 1.1.31-4 - Rebuild for gcc4 net-tools-1.60-49 ----------------- * Wed Mar 16 2005 Elliot Lee - rebuilt nss_db-2.2-31 ------------- * Wed Mar 16 2005 Nalin Dahyabhai 2.2-31 - rebuild with new gcc, missed it by that much nss_ldap-234-2 -------------- * Wed Mar 16 2005 Nalin Dahyabhai 234-2 - rebuild openssh-3.9p1-13 ---------------- * Wed Mar 16 2005 Elliot Lee - rebuilt openssl097a-0.9.7a-2 -------------------- * Wed Mar 16 2005 Elliot Lee - rebuilt pam_ccreds-1-6 -------------- * Wed Mar 16 2005 John Dennis 1-6 - bump rev for gcc4 build * Wed Mar 16 2005 Dan Williams pam_ccreds-1-5 - rebuild to pick up new libcrypto.so.5 pam_krb5-2.1.5-1 ---------------- * Wed Mar 16 2005 Nalin Dahyabhai - 2.1.5-1 - update to 2.1.5 pam_passwdqc-0.7.6-1 -------------------- * Wed Mar 16 2005 Nalin Dahyabhai 0.7.6-1 - update to 0.7.6, refines random= flag pam_smb-1.1.7-6 --------------- * Wed Mar 16 2005 Nalin Dahyabhai 1.1.7-6 - rebuild pmake-1:1.45-17 --------------- * Wed Mar 16 2005 Jakub Jelinek 1.45-17 - rebuilt with GCC 4 pnm2ppa-1:1.04-13 ----------------- * Wed Mar 16 2005 Tim Waugh 1:1.04-13 - Rebuild for new GCC. psutils-1.17-25 --------------- * Wed Mar 16 2005 Tim Waugh 1.17-25 - Rebuild for new GCC. pwlib-1.8.3-2 ------------- * Thu Mar 17 2005 Christopher Aillon 1.8.3-2 - Rebuild pyOpenSSL-0.6-1.p24.3 --------------------- * Mon Mar 14 2005 Mihai Ibanescu 0.6-1.p24.3 - rebuilt * Mon Mar 07 2005 Tomas Mraz 0.6-1.p23.2 - rebuild with openssl-0.9.7e pyparted-1.6.9-3 ---------------- * Wed Mar 16 2005 Chris Lumens 1.6.9-3 - Updated for gcc4 and python2.4. Fixed build warnings. python-ldap-0:2.0.6-2 --------------------- * Wed Mar 16 2005 Dan Williams - 0:2.0.6-2 - rebuilt to pick up new libssl.so.5 redhat-lsb-1.3-10 ----------------- * Thu Mar 17 2005 Leon Ho 1.3-10 rhgb-0.16.2-3 ------------- * Wed Mar 16 2005 David Zeuthen 0.16.2-3 - Rebuild scrollkeeper-0.3.14-4 --------------------- * Wed Mar 16 2005 David Zeuthen - Rebuild setuptool-1.17.1-1 ------------------ * Wed Mar 16 2005 Nalin Dahyabhai 1.17.1-1 - add a short README detailing the setuptool config file format squid-7:2.5.STABLE9-2 --------------------- * Tue Mar 15 2005 Jay Fenlason 7:2.5.STABLE9-2 - New upstream version, with 14 upstream patches. stardict-2.4.4-3 ---------------- * Thu Mar 17 2005 Leon Ho 2.4.4-3 - rebuilt stunnel-4.08-1 -------------- * Wed Mar 16 2005 Nalin Dahyabhai 4.08-1 - update to 4.08 - build stunnel as a PIE binary syslinux-3.07-2 --------------- * Wed Mar 16 2005 Peter Jones - 3.07-2 - gcc4 update system-config-bind-4.0.0-4.2 ---------------------------- termcap-1:5.4-4 --------------- * Wed Mar 16 2005 Nalin Dahyabhai 1:5.4-4 - resynchronize with ncurses package tix-1:8.1.4-100 --------------- * Thu Mar 17 2005 Jens Petersen - 1:8.1.4-100 - rebuild with gcc 4 tn5250-0.16.5-5 --------------- * Thu Mar 17 2005 Karsten Hopp 0.16.5-5 - rebuild with gcc-4 umb-scheme-3.2-38 ----------------- * Thu Mar 17 2005 Jindrich Novy 3.2-38 - rebuilt util-linux-2.12p-3 ------------------ * Wed Mar 16 2005 Elliot Lee - rebuilt vlock-1.3-18 ------------ * Wed Mar 16 2005 Elliot Lee - rebuilt xferstats-2.16-13 ----------------- * Wed Mar 16 2005 Than Ngo 2.16-13 - rebuilt against gcc 4 From dwmw2 at infradead.org Thu Mar 17 12:51:20 2005 From: dwmw2 at infradead.org (David Woodhouse) Date: Thu, 17 Mar 2005 12:51:20 +0000 Subject: rawhide report: 20050317 changes In-Reply-To: <200503171233.j2HCXVv2025986@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> References: <200503171233.j2HCXVv2025986@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> Message-ID: <1111063881.21825.16.camel@hades.cambridge.redhat.com> On Thu, 2005-03-17 at 07:33 -0500, Build System wrote: > evolution-data-server-1.0.4-3 > ----------------------------- > * Mon Feb 21 2005 David Malcolm - 1.0.4-3 Que? -- dwmw2 From kyrre at solution-forge.net Thu Mar 17 13:40:27 2005 From: kyrre at solution-forge.net (Kyrre Ness Sjobak) Date: Thu, 17 Mar 2005 14:40:27 +0100 Subject: TV Tuner problem In-Reply-To: <57043.213.215.209.170.1111053394.squirrel@213.215.209.170> References: <1110840619.9346.2.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1110886704.924.35.camel@tweedy.ksc.nasa.gov> <1110899287.3946.3.camel@localhost.localdomain> <10133.213.215.209.170.1110983510.squirrel@213.215.209.170> <1111003628.3458.0.camel@localhost.localdomain> <57043.213.215.209.170.1111053394.squirrel@213.215.209.170> Message-ID: <1111066827.3353.31.camel@localhost.localdomain> tor, 17.03.2005 kl. 10.56 skrev Eric Tanguy: > > ons, 16.03.2005 kl. 15.31 skrev Eric Tanguy: > >> > Le mardi 15 mars 2005 ? 06:38 -0500, Bob Chiodini a ??crit : > >> >> On Mon, 2005-03-14 at 23:50 +0100, Eric Tanguy wrote: > >> >> > i tried a lot of thing to solve my problem and maybe it could be a > >> >> > module problem : > >> >> > modprobing bttv seems to give good results and all is autodetected > >> >> (the > >> >> > tuner seems to be the right one) : > >> >> > bttv: driver version 0.9.15 loaded > >> >> > bttv: using 8 buffers with 2080k (520 pages) each for capture > >> >> > bttv: Bt8xx card found (0). > >> >> > ACPI: PCI interrupt 0000:01:07.0[A] -> GSI 11 (level, low) -> IRQ > >> 11 > >> >> > bttv0: Bt878 (rev 17) at 0000:01:07.0, irq: 11, latency: 64, mmio: > >> >> > 0xeb800000 > >> >> > bttv0: detected: Pinnacle PCTV [card=39], PCI subsystem ID is > >> >> 11bd:0012 > >> >> > bttv0: using: Pinnacle PCTV Studio/Rave [card=39,autodetected] > >> >> > bttv0: gpio: en=00000000, out=00000000 in=00fff3ff [init] > >> >> > bttv0: i2c: checking for MSP34xx @ 0x80... not found > >> >> > bttv0: pinnacle/mt: id=4 info="PAL+SECAM / mono" radio=no > >> >> > bttv0: using tuner=33 > >> >> > bttv0: i2c: checking for MSP34xx @ 0x80... not found > >> >> > bttv0: i2c: checking for TDA9875 @ 0xb0... not found > >> >> > bttv0: i2c: checking for TDA7432 @ 0x8a... not found > >> >> > tda9885/6/7: chip found @ 0x96 > >> >> > tuner: chip found at addr 0xc0 i2c-bus bt878 #0 [sw] > >> >> > tuner: type set to 33 (MT20xx universal) by bt878 #0 [sw] > >> >> > tuner: microtune: companycode=3cbf part=42 rev=2f > >> >> > tuner: microtune MT2050 found, OK > >> >> > bttv0: registered device video0 > >> >> > bttv0: registered device vbi0 > >> >> > bttv0: PLL: 28636363 => 35468950 . ok > >> >> > > >> >> > The problem is i receive no signal in tvtime whereas this card > >> works > >> >> > fine under windows. It seems the system cannot set the right tuner > >> >> > frequency : > >> >> > > >> >> > mt2050_set_if_freq failed with -121 > >> >> > > >> >> > Someone could help me ? > >> >> > >> >> Eric, > >> >> > >> >> Take a look at this thread. > >> >> > >> >> http://groups-beta.google.com/group/linux.kernel/browse_thread/thread/58bd50364a5b47d8/81b8dfdd7bed9d95?q=linux+Pinnacle+PCTV+rave+tuner#81b8dfdd7bed9d95 > >> >> > >> >> It looks like there is a patch. Also, one of the posters said it > >> worked > >> >> in 2.6.9. Do you have a 2.6.9 version of the kernel still around? > >> >> > >> >> BTW: I don't see why your question was off-topic on the "other > >> list". > >> >> > >> >> Bob... > >> >> > >> > Yes you are right. I try the old 2.6.9-1.667 kernel instead of the > >> > actual 2.6.10-1.770_FC3 one and my tv tuner works fine. > >> > So it would be a kernel module problem and if i can't ask this kind of > >> > questions on the devel list i don't where i can ... > >> > Thanks > >> > Eric > >> > > >> > > >> No answer ? What can i do ?? > >> Eric > > > > Bugzilla it? > > > > > > Yes but where because i'm a newbie : kernel ? FC3 ? bttv ? ... > Maybe the problem is solved in 2.6.11 kernel ? Is it safe to try the > 2.6.11 FC4 kernel from the devel tree on FC3 ? > Thanks > > Eric > > I don't know if the bttv driver works or not - my bttv card is lying in its box, and i am not going to dig out my computer from all the stuff it is buryed beneath in order to test. Go to bugzilla, select product fedora -> fedora 3, component kernel, and enter the output of "uname -a" (or better - the correct rpm from "rpm -qa | grep kernel" - it probably a few will show up. Select the buggy one. Type what is wrong, how you reproduce it, etc. It's really easy. Kyrre From alan at redhat.com Thu Mar 17 13:59:02 2005 From: alan at redhat.com (Alan Cox) Date: Thu, 17 Mar 2005 08:59:02 -0500 Subject: FUDCON 1 In-Reply-To: <20050316233924.A26537@xos037.xos.nl> References: <1111011152.8014.20.camel@localhost.localdomain> <20050316233924.A26537@xos037.xos.nl> Message-ID: <20050317135902.GA19886@devserv.devel.redhat.com> On Wed, Mar 16, 2005 at 11:39:24PM +0100, Jos Vos wrote: > Well... London is not really the center of Europe ;-), due to both its > geographical position and the fact that it lies on an island. Half the people who reside in it don't think London is even in Europe either ;) From alan at redhat.com Thu Mar 17 14:05:45 2005 From: alan at redhat.com (Alan Cox) Date: Thu, 17 Mar 2005 09:05:45 -0500 Subject: A more efficient up2date service using binary diffs In-Reply-To: <1111062365.20402.26.camel@angua.localnet> References: <20050315151205.A25119@tiki-lounge.com> <1110933853.27320.44.camel@ice-dragon.ddn.de> <20050316022157.GE28313@angus.ind.WPI.EDU> <1cef3e9505031606061a6e2cbe@mail.gmail.com> <1110983501.6211.29.camel@angua.localnet> <1111049074.3353.13.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1111051720.20402.3.camel@angua.localnet> <1cef3e95050317040716ef0c83@mail.gmail.com> <1111062365.20402.26.camel@angua.localnet> Message-ID: <20050317140545.GC19886@devserv.devel.redhat.com> On Thu, Mar 17, 2005 at 12:26:04PM +0000, Nigel Metheringham wrote: > with jigdo templates), and even better the CD images too although it may > be harder to do this with legacy expectations. Every Fedora > distribution is currently triplicated - unpacked, CD isos and DVD isos > all containing the same data. This looks an interesting MSC project for someone - to write a user space (FUSE) Jigdofs so you can magic the CD and DVD images out of thin air. From rdieter at math.unl.edu Thu Mar 17 14:07:51 2005 From: rdieter at math.unl.edu (Rex Dieter) Date: Thu, 17 Mar 2005 08:07:51 -0600 Subject: rawhide report: 20050317 changes In-Reply-To: <200503171233.j2HCXVv2025986@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> References: <200503171233.j2HCXVv2025986@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> Message-ID: <42398F37.7070501@math.unl.edu> Build System wrote: > kdebase-6:3.4.0-0.rc1.7 > kdelibs-6:3.4.0-0.rc1.6 Why still kde-3.4.0-rc1? 3.4.0(final) has been available to packagers now for 2+ weeks. -- Rex From fedora at wir-sind-cool.org Thu Mar 17 14:09:36 2005 From: fedora at wir-sind-cool.org (Michael Schwendt) Date: Thu, 17 Mar 2005 15:09:36 +0100 Subject: FC3 Package request: evms-2.5.2 In-Reply-To: <200503171147.49256.aportal@univ-montp2.fr> References: <200503171044.41927.aportal@univ-montp2.fr> <1111052896.17429.189.camel@arena.soho.bytebot.net> <200503171147.49256.aportal@univ-montp2.fr> Message-ID: <20050317150936.42d3bc49.fedora@wir-sind-cool.org> On Thu, 17 Mar 2005 11:47:49 +0100, Alain PORTAL wrote: > Le jeudi 17 Mars 2005 10:48, Colin Charles a ?crit : > > > fedora-extras-list at redhat.com is the right place for Extras submissions > > Sorry :-) > > > (however, if something on the Web pointed you to this list, please > > inform us so we can fix it) > > No, I wasn't up2dated... Surprising, since I sent out a mass-mail to many addresses found in bugzilla.fedora.us and your one was on that list, too. That mail explicitly contained a pointer to the fedora-extras-list website. Hmmm... From mhtran at us.ibm.com Thu Mar 17 14:10:08 2005 From: mhtran at us.ibm.com (Mike Tran) Date: Thu, 17 Mar 2005 08:10:08 -0600 Subject: FC3 Package request: evms-2.5.2 In-Reply-To: <200503171044.41927.aportal@univ-montp2.fr> References: <200503171044.41927.aportal@univ-montp2.fr> Message-ID: <42398FC0.10700@us.ibm.com> Alain PORTAL wrote: >Hi all, > >For my own use, I built a package of evms to manage logicals volumes on my >new computer that I plan to submit on Fedora Extras. >I am not really in easy with logicals volumes and evms. So, I should want to >know if there is somebody that have experience with this software and have >tips to give me. >Spec file is based on the one provided by the tarball. > >Regards. > > > Hi Alain, Coincidently, I emailed the this list admin yesterday for EVMS inclusion :) If you already built a package of EVMS, please submit on Fedora Extras. -- Thanks, Mike T. From aportal at univ-montp2.fr Thu Mar 17 14:27:07 2005 From: aportal at univ-montp2.fr (Alain PORTAL) Date: Thu, 17 Mar 2005 15:27:07 +0100 Subject: FC3 Package request: evms-2.5.2 In-Reply-To: <20050317150936.42d3bc49.fedora@wir-sind-cool.org> References: <200503171044.41927.aportal@univ-montp2.fr> <200503171147.49256.aportal@univ-montp2.fr> <20050317150936.42d3bc49.fedora@wir-sind-cool.org> Message-ID: <200503171527.07531.aportal@univ-montp2.fr> Le jeudi 17 Mars 2005 15:09, Michael Schwendt a ?crit : > > No, I wasn't up2dated... > > Surprising, since I sent out a mass-mail to many addresses found > in bugzilla.fedora.us and your one was on that list, too. That mail > explicitly contained a pointer to the fedora-extras-list website. > > Hmmm... That's only my fault.... I had many work last months, so I didn't proofly read all my mails. I'm really sorry Regards. -- Alain PORTAL -- Service Commun de Microscopie ?lectronique Universit? de Montpellier II -- Case Courrier 087 Place Eug?ne Bataillon -- 34095 Montpellier Cedex 05 T?l. : 04 67 14 37 35 -- Fax. : 04 67 14 37 37 NO WORD ATTACHMENTS: http://www.fsf.org/philosophy/no-word-attachments.fr.html http://www.giromini.org/usenet-fr/repondre.html From aportal at univ-montp2.fr Thu Mar 17 14:38:39 2005 From: aportal at univ-montp2.fr (Alain PORTAL) Date: Thu, 17 Mar 2005 15:38:39 +0100 Subject: FC3 Package request: evms-2.5.2 In-Reply-To: <42398FC0.10700@us.ibm.com> References: <200503171044.41927.aportal@univ-montp2.fr> <42398FC0.10700@us.ibm.com> Message-ID: <200503171538.39135.aportal@univ-montp2.fr> Le jeudi 17 Mars 2005 15:10, Mike Tran a ?crit : > Coincidently, I emailed the this list admin yesterday for EVMS inclusion > :) ;-) > If you already built a package of EVMS, please submit on Fedora > : Extras. Built is nearly ended. As I didn't proofly read discussion on the list, I just want to be sure that what I saw this morning here: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/NewPackageProcess is correct "If the package has any translations, add BuildRequires: gettext-devel. If you don't, your package will probably fail to build in the buildroot." Is this really gettext-devel, not gettext? Regards -- Alain PORTAL -- Service Commun de Microscopie ?lectronique Universit? de Montpellier II -- Case Courrier 087 Place Eug?ne Bataillon -- 34095 Montpellier Cedex 05 T?l. : 04 67 14 37 35 -- Fax. : 04 67 14 37 37 NO WORD ATTACHMENTS: http://www.fsf.org/philosophy/no-word-attachments.fr.html http://www.giromini.org/usenet-fr/repondre.html From jspaleta at gmail.com Thu Mar 17 14:30:09 2005 From: jspaleta at gmail.com (Jeff Spaleta) Date: Thu, 17 Mar 2005 09:30:09 -0500 Subject: A more efficient up2date service using binary diffs In-Reply-To: <1111049074.3353.13.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <42333234.8080106@nc.rr.com> <1110923503.27320.29.camel@ice-dragon.ddn.de> <20050315151205.A25119@tiki-lounge.com> <1110933853.27320.44.camel@ice-dragon.ddn.de> <20050316022157.GE28313@angus.ind.WPI.EDU> <1cef3e9505031606061a6e2cbe@mail.gmail.com> <1110983501.6211.29.camel@angua.localnet> <1111049074.3353.13.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <604aa79105031706304219a147@mail.gmail.com> On Thu, 17 Mar 2005 09:44:34 +0100, Kyrre Ness Sjobak > So... Why should we put the load of generating the prpm's to the > mirrors? Initially... proof-of-concept. The easiest path to full integration of this into the build/release system is incremental. Come up with an implementation, or two.. find a few mirrors willing to work with you to host the necessary serverside scripts... advertise the clientside scripts... so people in he community can start chewing on it. You are going to have to take a layered approach to this initially, where both the needed client and server side processes are essentially addons that do not disturb the existing infrastructure and toolspace. Expecting both the existing buildsystem and the existing distro tools to spin up direct support for vaporware patch/delta package implementations is most definitely out of place and only serves to keep this discussion from moving forward. You can talk till your blue in the face about what the ideal system should like, but until people in the community who are interested come up with a usable implementation that can be real-world tested, continued discussion about how cool it would be if Fedora's build/release/mirror system handled this is just navel gazing. I don't think I've seen ANY evidence that the people you need to convince, who have some decision making power as to how the Fedora build/release/mirror system operates are convinced this is worth it. And at this point I don't think further discussion without an implementation of some of these ideas is going to change anyone's minds. Getting a sample server and client implementation out is your best chance of seeing any progess on this. -jef From skvidal at phy.duke.edu Thu Mar 17 14:30:59 2005 From: skvidal at phy.duke.edu (seth vidal) Date: Thu, 17 Mar 2005 09:30:59 -0500 Subject: GFS removed??? (was: rawhide report: 20050315 changes) In-Reply-To: <20050317105000.GJ21731@neu.nirvana> References: <20050316183752.GB9082@neu.nirvana> <20050316201313.GJ9082@neu.nirvana> <20050316202058.GI22927@redhat.com> <20050316213117.GK9082@neu.nirvana> <1111010064.30523.73.camel@opus.phy.duke.edu> <20050317093019.GD21731@neu.nirvana> <1111054301.4354.3.camel@thl.ct.heise.de> <20050317102837.GE21731@neu.nirvana> <1111055900.4354.8.camel@thl.ct.heise.de> <20050317105000.GJ21731@neu.nirvana> Message-ID: <1111069859.5267.61.camel@cutter> > There is a working solution at ATrpms. But it's not a solution derived from consensus. -sv From paul at all-the-johnsons.co.uk Thu Mar 17 14:57:29 2005 From: paul at all-the-johnsons.co.uk (Paul) Date: Thu, 17 Mar 2005 14:57:29 +0000 Subject: FUDCON 1 In-Reply-To: <20050317135902.GA19886@devserv.devel.redhat.com> References: <1111011152.8014.20.camel@localhost.localdomain> <20050316233924.A26537@xos037.xos.nl> <20050317135902.GA19886@devserv.devel.redhat.com> Message-ID: <1111071450.8014.41.camel@localhost.localdomain> Hi, > > Well... London is not really the center of Europe ;-), due to both its > > geographical position and the fact that it lies on an island. > > Half the people who reside in it don't think London is even in Europe either ;) Those who know my opinions of the UK capital will know that to even suggest holding something like FUDCON there shows how desperate folks are to have one! TTFN Paul "The happiest I've ever been was coming out of London after then 2003 UK Linux Expo working out how big a nuke would be required to wipe it clean off the map" Johnson -- "It is often said that something cannot be libel if it is the truth. This has had to be amended to 'something cannot be libel if it is the truth or if the bank balance says otherwise'" - US Today -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part URL: From fedora at wir-sind-cool.org Thu Mar 17 15:06:40 2005 From: fedora at wir-sind-cool.org (Michael Schwendt) Date: Thu, 17 Mar 2005 16:06:40 +0100 Subject: FC3 Package request: evms-2.5.2 In-Reply-To: <200503171538.39135.aportal@univ-montp2.fr> References: <200503171044.41927.aportal@univ-montp2.fr> <42398FC0.10700@us.ibm.com> <200503171538.39135.aportal@univ-montp2.fr> Message-ID: <20050317160640.09c85ee7.fedora@wir-sind-cool.org> On Thu, 17 Mar 2005 15:38:39 +0100, Alain PORTAL wrote: > Le jeudi 17 Mars 2005 15:10, Mike Tran a ?crit : > > > Coincidently, I emailed the this list admin yesterday for EVMS inclusion > > :) > > ;-) > > > If you already built a package of EVMS, please submit on Fedora > > : Extras. > > Built is nearly ended. As I didn't proofly read discussion on the list, I just > want to be sure that what I saw this morning here: > http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/NewPackageProcess is correct > "If the package has any translations, add BuildRequires: gettext-devel. If you > don't, your package will probably fail to build in the buildroot." > > Is this really gettext-devel, not gettext? No, gettext. The separate gettext-devel has other use. From aportal at univ-montp2.fr Thu Mar 17 15:53:24 2005 From: aportal at univ-montp2.fr (Alain PORTAL) Date: Thu, 17 Mar 2005 16:53:24 +0100 Subject: FC3 Package request: evms-2.5.2 In-Reply-To: <42398FC0.10700@us.ibm.com> References: <200503171044.41927.aportal@univ-montp2.fr> <42398FC0.10700@us.ibm.com> Message-ID: <200503171653.24376.aportal@univ-montp2.fr> Le jeudi 17 Mars 2005 15:10, Mike Tran a ?crit : > Coincidently, I emailed the this list admin yesterday for EVMS inclusion > > :) If you already built a package of EVMS, please submit on Fedora > : Extras. Package is built. Unfortunately, I'm really out of date and I submit it here: http://bugzilla.fedora.us/show_bug.cgi?id=2455 Sorry, I won't do it again ;-) Regards. -- Alain PORTAL -- Service Commun de Microscopie ?lectronique Universit? de Montpellier II -- Case Courrier 087 Place Eug?ne Bataillon -- 34095 Montpellier Cedex 05 T?l. : 04 67 14 37 35 -- Fax. : 04 67 14 37 37 NO WORD ATTACHMENTS: http://www.fsf.org/philosophy/no-word-attachments.fr.html http://www.giromini.org/usenet-fr/repondre.html From aportal at univ-montp2.fr Thu Mar 17 16:06:58 2005 From: aportal at univ-montp2.fr (Alain PORTAL) Date: Thu, 17 Mar 2005 17:06:58 +0100 Subject: FC3 Package request: evms-2.5.2 In-Reply-To: <20050317160640.09c85ee7.fedora@wir-sind-cool.org> References: <200503171044.41927.aportal@univ-montp2.fr> <200503171538.39135.aportal@univ-montp2.fr> <20050317160640.09c85ee7.fedora@wir-sind-cool.org> Message-ID: <200503171706.58858.aportal@univ-montp2.fr> Le jeudi 17 Mars 2005 16:06, Michael Schwendt a ?crit : > No, gettext. The separate gettext-devel has other use. Good, that 's what I made because I remarked that I haven't gettext-devel installed, and I success to build. Humm... sorry for my english. Regards. -- Alain PORTAL -- Service Commun de Microscopie ?lectronique Universit? de Montpellier II -- Case Courrier 087 Place Eug?ne Bataillon -- 34095 Montpellier Cedex 05 T?l. : 04 67 14 37 35 -- Fax. : 04 67 14 37 37 NO WORD ATTACHMENTS: http://www.fsf.org/philosophy/no-word-attachments.fr.html http://www.giromini.org/usenet-fr/repondre.html From dmalcolm at redhat.com Thu Mar 17 16:12:27 2005 From: dmalcolm at redhat.com (David Malcolm) Date: Thu, 17 Mar 2005 11:12:27 -0500 Subject: rawhide report: 20050317 changes In-Reply-To: <1111063881.21825.16.camel@hades.cambridge.redhat.com> References: <200503171233.j2HCXVv2025986@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <1111063881.21825.16.camel@hades.cambridge.redhat.com> Message-ID: <1111075948.5361.99.camel@cassandra.boston.redhat.com> On Thu, 2005-03-17 at 12:51 +0000, David Woodhouse wrote: > On Thu, 2005-03-17 at 07:33 -0500, Build System wrote: > > evolution-data-server-1.0.4-3 > > ----------------------------- > > * Mon Feb 21 2005 David Malcolm - 1.0.4-3 > > Que? > FC3 update; got pushed last night; am writing the announcement now From mattdm at mattdm.org Thu Mar 17 16:17:24 2005 From: mattdm at mattdm.org (Matthew Miller) Date: Thu, 17 Mar 2005 11:17:24 -0500 Subject: ethereal rpm tweaks In-Reply-To: <1110368591.23127.8.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <200503081942.j28JgJu12103@alopias.GreenKey.net> <1110368591.23127.8.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <20050317161724.GA19503@jadzia.bu.edu> On Wed, Mar 09, 2005 at 12:43:11PM +0100, Radek Vok?l wrote: > > Compiled with GLib 2.4.8, with libpcap 0.8.3, with libz 1.2.1.2, > > without libpcre, with Net-SNMP 5.1.2, with ADNS. > Ok, from your tweaks only -with-ssl survives. I can't link ethereal with > package from extras - adns. Sorry to jump in a bit late here. If someone _has_ adns installed, the build picks it up and links against it. May be good to explicitly disable ADNS, so as to not accidentally make "polluted" builds. (Also, if you include ADNS, it makes a complaint when you run ethereal if you are using "options rotate" in resolv.conf. *sigh*.) -- Matthew Miller mattdm at mattdm.org Boston University Linux ------> From mattdm at mattdm.org Thu Mar 17 16:21:37 2005 From: mattdm at mattdm.org (Matthew Miller) Date: Thu, 17 Mar 2005 11:21:37 -0500 Subject: FUDCON 1 In-Reply-To: <1111011444.30523.76.camel@opus.phy.duke.edu> References: <1111011152.8014.20.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1111011444.30523.76.camel@opus.phy.duke.edu> Message-ID: <20050317162137.GB19503@jadzia.bu.edu> On Wed, Mar 16, 2005 at 05:17:24PM -0500, seth vidal wrote: > not really a devel issue - more for fedora-marketing-list but fudcon 2 > will be at LinuxTag in late June, iirc. How is this numbering going to work? If (when!) we have another FUDcon at BU next year, is it going to end up being FUDcon 6? Won't this confuse me? Aren't I confused enough already? -- Matthew Miller mattdm at mattdm.org Boston University Linux ------> From dwmw2 at infradead.org Thu Mar 17 16:22:20 2005 From: dwmw2 at infradead.org (David Woodhouse) Date: Thu, 17 Mar 2005 16:22:20 +0000 Subject: rawhide report: 20050317 changes In-Reply-To: <1111075948.5361.99.camel@cassandra.boston.redhat.com> References: <200503171233.j2HCXVv2025986@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <1111063881.21825.16.camel@hades.cambridge.redhat.com> <1111075948.5361.99.camel@cassandra.boston.redhat.com> Message-ID: <1111076541.24487.46.camel@hades.cambridge.redhat.com> On Thu, 2005-03-17 at 11:12 -0500, David Malcolm wrote: > FC3 update; got pushed last night; am writing the announcement now I was wondering what it was doing in the rawhide update. It looks like it gets inherited for ppc64 because we don't build e-d-s 1.2.0 there. -- dwmw2 From mattdm at mattdm.org Thu Mar 17 16:23:42 2005 From: mattdm at mattdm.org (Matthew Miller) Date: Thu, 17 Mar 2005 11:23:42 -0500 Subject: packages list In-Reply-To: <1111029684.5267.14.camel@cutter> References: <1111019608.4169.175.camel@petra> <1111025287.5267.4.camel@cutter> <4238F49A.1030107@yahoo.co.uk> <1111029684.5267.14.camel@cutter> Message-ID: <20050317162342.GC19503@jadzia.bu.edu> On Wed, Mar 16, 2005 at 10:21:24PM -0500, seth vidal wrote: > in general rpmgroups should be dropped. They're just this side of > useless for classification. I think they should changed to be: "Core" or "Extras". -- Matthew Miller mattdm at mattdm.org Boston University Linux ------> From dag at wieers.com Thu Mar 17 16:26:15 2005 From: dag at wieers.com (Dag Wieers) Date: Thu, 17 Mar 2005 17:26:15 +0100 (CET) Subject: GFS removed??? (was: rawhide report: 20050315 changes) In-Reply-To: <1111069859.5267.61.camel@cutter> References: <20050316183752.GB9082@neu.nirvana> <20050316201313.GJ9082@neu.nirvana> <20050316202058.GI22927@redhat.com> <20050316213117.GK9082@neu.nirvana> <1111010064.30523.73.camel@opus.phy.duke.edu> <20050317093019.GD21731@neu.nirvana> <1111054301.4354.3.camel@thl.ct.heise.de> <20050317102837.GE21731@neu.nirvana> <1111055900.4354.8.camel@thl.ct.heise.de> <20050317105000.GJ21731@neu.nirvana> <1111069859.5267.61.camel@cutter> Message-ID: On Thu, 17 Mar 2005, seth vidal wrote: > > > There is a working solution at ATrpms. > > But it's not a solution derived from consensus. You mean 'consensus on a closed mailinglist' ? -- dag wieers, dag at wieers.com, http://dag.wieers.com/ -- [all I want is a warm bed and a kind word and unlimited power] From ivg2 at cornell.edu Thu Mar 17 16:29:10 2005 From: ivg2 at cornell.edu (Ivan Gyurdiev) Date: Thu, 17 Mar 2005 11:29:10 -0500 Subject: Video Problems [Re: Old kernel RPMS ] In-Reply-To: <1110738973.31728.18.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> References: <1110703151.3170.7.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> <1110703923.6278.38.camel@laptopd505.fenrus.org> <1110715889.3170.25.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> <200503131308.42776.ml-fedora@fathomssen.de> <1110716790.3170.31.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> <604aa79105031309462ea47e82@mail.gmail.com> <1110738973.31728.18.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> Message-ID: <1111076951.3415.17.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> > ... I do not believe I have enough information at this point > to file a valuable bug report. I wanted to test old kernels > to determine the point of failure first. I also wanted to know > whether problems can arise from the interaction between gcc4-compiled > kernel, and binary kernel modules, and felt that the list was a more > appropriate place to ask this question. Okay, I have some more info now. More importantly, I think I have a reproducible test case. Setup ================================================================ I haven't had time to go look for old kernels and test, however I can confirm the crash I am dealing with occurs on kernels 1171-1177. I couldn't get 1170 to boot. I am experiencing instability with BOTH the nv open source driver, and the nvidia closed source driver. Additionally I am running X with the RENDER extension. I tried turning that off, and it makes no difference. Given the reproducible behavior, I think overheating is an unlikely source of the problem. It is possible I am dealing with another type of hardware failure, but I'd like to think not, since the hardware is rather new. Types of Crashes =============================== Crash 1: Garbage displayed on screen... diagonal waves or some other nonsense Crash 2: Monitor goes to standby (or whatever it's called that it does when it's switching resolutions, like before starting X). The above two occur with the nv driver. System does not respond to sysrq. Crash 3: Random freeze in the middle of what I'm doing. Screen freezes to a standstill. System responds to sysrq. Sysrq-p shows X to be active. I can provide more info if you'd like. This occurs with the nvidia binary driver. Gnome-Terminal ================================= Gnome-terminal seems to make the system crash in a reproducible fashion. By crash I mean crash type 1 or 2 (I've abandoned the nvidia driver for now while resolving this problem). It crashes most of the time when opening the first terminal. I believe it crashes the time if the area the first terminal covers overlaps another application. I'd have to do more testing to be absolutely sure, but that's what it seems to do. If the terminal manages to open successfully, I can move it around and do whatever, and it will not crash. The crash occurs when opening the terminal, and not later. Transparency is enabled in the gnome-terminal. I've also seen Crash 1 or 2 in other contexts, while not opening the terminal, but those are not very reproducible. I've seen it crash immediately after the Fedora boot screen, as well as while doing a cat on a large file in an already-open gnome-terminal. I've also seen it turn off and on (Crash 2) forever after leaving it on for a long time with xscreensaver on. So - any ideas? Perhaps X is at fault? -- Ivan Gyurdiev Cornell University From cra at WPI.EDU Thu Mar 17 16:26:05 2005 From: cra at WPI.EDU (Chuck R. Anderson) Date: Thu, 17 Mar 2005 11:26:05 -0500 Subject: GFS removed??? (was: rawhide report: 20050315 changes) In-Reply-To: References: <20050316202058.GI22927@redhat.com> <20050316213117.GK9082@neu.nirvana> <1111010064.30523.73.camel@opus.phy.duke.edu> <20050317093019.GD21731@neu.nirvana> <1111054301.4354.3.camel@thl.ct.heise.de> <20050317102837.GE21731@neu.nirvana> <1111055900.4354.8.camel@thl.ct.heise.de> <20050317105000.GJ21731@neu.nirvana> <1111069859.5267.61.camel@cutter> Message-ID: <20050317162605.GD16763@angus.ind.WPI.EDU> On Thu, Mar 17, 2005 at 05:26:15PM +0100, Dag Wieers wrote: > On Thu, 17 Mar 2005, seth vidal wrote: > > > There is a working solution at ATrpms. > > > > But it's not a solution derived from consensus. > > You mean 'consensus on a closed mailinglist' ? Last time I checked fedora-packaging wasn't closed. From ivg2 at cornell.edu Thu Mar 17 16:46:45 2005 From: ivg2 at cornell.edu (Ivan Gyurdiev) Date: Thu, 17 Mar 2005 11:46:45 -0500 Subject: Video Problems [Re: Old kernel RPMS ] In-Reply-To: <1111076951.3415.17.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> References: <1110703151.3170.7.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> <1110703923.6278.38.camel@laptopd505.fenrus.org> <1110715889.3170.25.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> <200503131308.42776.ml-fedora@fathomssen.de> <1110716790.3170.31.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> <604aa79105031309462ea47e82@mail.gmail.com> <1110738973.31728.18.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> <1111076951.3415.17.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> Message-ID: <1111078005.3429.2.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> > I believe > it crashes the time if the area the first terminal covers overlaps > another application. I'd have to do more testing to be absolutely sure, Okay, it seems like that's not really true. What is true, however, is that gnome-terminal has a particularly high chance of crashing my system on open compared to other applications which run reliably. -- Ivan Gyurdiev Cornell University From nholland at tisys.org Thu Mar 17 17:12:02 2005 From: nholland at tisys.org (Nils Holland) Date: Thu, 17 Mar 2005 18:12:02 +0100 Subject: FUDCON 1 In-Reply-To: <20050317162137.GB19503@jadzia.bu.edu> References: <1111011152.8014.20.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1111011444.30523.76.camel@opus.phy.duke.edu> <20050317162137.GB19503@jadzia.bu.edu> Message-ID: <1111079522.8235.3.camel@candice.tisys.org> On Thu, 2005-03-17 at 11:21 -0500, Matthew Miller wrote: > On Wed, Mar 16, 2005 at 05:17:24PM -0500, seth vidal wrote: > > not really a devel issue - more for fedora-marketing-list but fudcon 2 > > will be at LinuxTag in late June, iirc. > > How is this numbering going to work? If (when!) we have another FUDcon at > BU next year, is it going to end up being FUDcon 6? Won't this confuse me? > Aren't I confused enough already? Well ... probably the numbering should simply happen according to the place the event takes place. For example, the thing at LinuxTag could be called "FUDcon Europe 1" or even better "FUDcon Germany 1". Then, a similiar event in - for example - France would be "FUDcon France 1". An another event at BT in a year would simply be "FUDcon 2" (I wouldn't start calling this "FUDcon USA 2" or something - I figure that the event in the US will be kind of the "main thing", so it just gets called "FUDcon". Only a suggestion, of course. Greetings, Nils From cra at WPI.EDU Thu Mar 17 17:18:32 2005 From: cra at WPI.EDU (Chuck R. Anderson) Date: Thu, 17 Mar 2005 12:18:32 -0500 Subject: FUDCON 1 In-Reply-To: <1111079522.8235.3.camel@candice.tisys.org> References: <1111011152.8014.20.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1111011444.30523.76.camel@opus.phy.duke.edu> <20050317162137.GB19503@jadzia.bu.edu> <1111079522.8235.3.camel@candice.tisys.org> Message-ID: <20050317171832.GD19264@angus.ind.WPI.EDU> On Thu, Mar 17, 2005 at 06:12:02PM +0100, Nils Holland wrote: > On Thu, 2005-03-17 at 11:21 -0500, Matthew Miller wrote: > > On Wed, Mar 16, 2005 at 05:17:24PM -0500, seth vidal wrote: > > > not really a devel issue - more for fedora-marketing-list but fudcon 2 > > > will be at LinuxTag in late June, iirc. > > > > How is this numbering going to work? If (when!) we have another FUDcon at > > BU next year, is it going to end up being FUDcon 6? Won't this confuse me? > > Aren't I confused enough already? > > Well ... probably the numbering should simply happen according to the > place the event takes place. For example, the thing at LinuxTag could be > called "FUDcon Europe 1" or even better "FUDcon Germany 1". Then, a > similiar event in - for example - France would be "FUDcon France 1". An > another event at BT in a year would simply be "FUDcon 2" (I wouldn't > start calling this "FUDcon USA 2" or something - I figure that the event > in the US will be kind of the "main thing", so it just gets called > "FUDcon". Nah, it is better to have a unique number for each event. NANOG just keeps incrementing their meeting number, and they meet 3 times a year. They are up to NANOG 34. From fedora-devel at camperquake.de Thu Mar 17 17:18:54 2005 From: fedora-devel at camperquake.de (Ralf Ertzinger) Date: Thu, 17 Mar 2005 18:18:54 +0100 Subject: FUDCON 1 In-Reply-To: <20050317162137.GB19503@jadzia.bu.edu>; from mattdm@mattdm.org on Thu, Mar 17, 2005 at 11:21:37AM -0500 References: <1111011152.8014.20.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1111011444.30523.76.camel@opus.phy.duke.edu> <20050317162137.GB19503@jadzia.bu.edu> Message-ID: <20050317181854.A28655@ryoko.camperquake.de> On Thu, Mar 17, 2005 at 11:21:37AM -0500, Matthew Miller wrote: > How is this numbering going to work? I suggest increasing the number after "FudCON" by one for each new event. The only problem is that you do not want multiple events at the same time, but otherwise..... From jspaleta at gmail.com Thu Mar 17 17:24:19 2005 From: jspaleta at gmail.com (Jeff Spaleta) Date: Thu, 17 Mar 2005 12:24:19 -0500 Subject: Video Problems [Re: Old kernel RPMS ] In-Reply-To: <1111076951.3415.17.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> References: <1110703151.3170.7.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> <1110703923.6278.38.camel@laptopd505.fenrus.org> <1110715889.3170.25.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> <200503131308.42776.ml-fedora@fathomssen.de> <1110716790.3170.31.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> <604aa79105031309462ea47e82@mail.gmail.com> <1110738973.31728.18.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> <1111076951.3415.17.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> Message-ID: <604aa79105031709242b2f809d@mail.gmail.com> On Thu, 17 Mar 2005 11:29:10 -0500, Ivan Gyurdiev wrote: > Okay, I have some more info now. More importantly, I think I have a > reproducible test case. > > Setup > ================================================================ > I haven't had time to go look for old kernels and test, however > I can confirm the crash I am dealing with occurs on kernels 1171-1177. > I couldn't get 1170 to boot. I am experiencing instability with BOTH > the nv open source driver, and the nvidia closed source driver. I have absolutely no problems using any of these kernels with nv or nvidia drivers with my geforce2 card... as my increasing cash pile in vegastrike will attest. I use gnome-terminal pretty much every second of every day..i even launch vegastrike from it. I've seen none of your crasher situations. Can we please move this discussion to fedora-test-list, which is the more appropriate forum for continued troubleshooting among testers. I'm more than happy to help you identify what the problem is, if its software, via system comparison in a long thread... if we do it in the appropriate place. -jef"did i mention i play vegastrike, because I do.. i play it.. and I'm not as ashamed of that fact as I probably should be"spaleta From dag at wieers.com Thu Mar 17 17:35:07 2005 From: dag at wieers.com (Dag Wieers) Date: Thu, 17 Mar 2005 18:35:07 +0100 (CET) Subject: GFS removed??? (was: rawhide report: 20050315 changes) In-Reply-To: <20050317162605.GD16763@angus.ind.WPI.EDU> References: <20050316202058.GI22927@redhat.com> <20050316213117.GK9082@neu.nirvana> <1111010064.30523.73.camel@opus.phy.duke.edu> <20050317093019.GD21731@neu.nirvana> <1111054301.4354.3.camel@thl.ct.heise.de> <20050317102837.GE21731@neu.nirvana> <1111055900.4354.8.camel@thl.ct.heise.de> <20050317105000.GJ21731@neu.nirvana> <1111069859.5267.61.camel@cutter> <20050317162605.GD16763@angus.ind.WPI.EDU> Message-ID: On Thu, 17 Mar 2005, Chuck R. Anderson wrote: > On Thu, Mar 17, 2005 at 05:26:15PM +0100, Dag Wieers wrote: > > On Thu, 17 Mar 2005, seth vidal wrote: > > > > There is a working solution at ATrpms. > > > > > > But it's not a solution derived from consensus. > > > > You mean 'consensus on a closed mailinglist' ? > > Last time I checked fedora-packaging wasn't closed. The consensus about kernel-module packaging was not on fedora-packaging. -- dag wieers, dag at wieers.com, http://dag.wieers.com/ -- [all I want is a warm bed and a kind word and unlimited power] From Axel.Thimm at ATrpms.net Thu Mar 17 17:36:25 2005 From: Axel.Thimm at ATrpms.net (Axel Thimm) Date: Thu, 17 Mar 2005 18:36:25 +0100 Subject: GFS removed??? (was: rawhide report: 20050315 changes) In-Reply-To: <20050317162605.GD16763@angus.ind.WPI.EDU> References: <20050316213117.GK9082@neu.nirvana> <1111010064.30523.73.camel@opus.phy.duke.edu> <20050317093019.GD21731@neu.nirvana> <1111054301.4354.3.camel@thl.ct.heise.de> <20050317102837.GE21731@neu.nirvana> <1111055900.4354.8.camel@thl.ct.heise.de> <20050317105000.GJ21731@neu.nirvana> <1111069859.5267.61.camel@cutter> <20050317162605.GD16763@angus.ind.WPI.EDU> Message-ID: <20050317173625.GV21731@neu.nirvana> On Thu, Mar 17, 2005 at 11:26:05AM -0500, Chuck R. Anderson wrote: > On Thu, Mar 17, 2005 at 05:26:15PM +0100, Dag Wieers wrote: > > On Thu, 17 Mar 2005, seth vidal wrote: > > > > There is a working solution at ATrpms. > > > > > > But it's not a solution derived from consensus. As the author of yum, you certainly know better. Fedora Core just adopted yum in FC1, there was no "let's do it from scratch for the sake of consensus". > > You mean 'consensus on a closed mailinglist' ? Out of my mouth. > Last time I checked fedora-packaging wasn't closed. Check fedora-maintainers. The best you can do is _read_ through the discussions. That's not an open development model as Fedora advertises itself to be. -- Axel.Thimm at ATrpms.net -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: not available URL: From terraformers at gmx.net Thu Mar 17 17:18:39 2005 From: terraformers at gmx.net (Lars) Date: Thu, 17 Mar 2005 18:18:39 +0100 Subject: rawhide report: 20050317 changes References: <200503171233.j2HCXVv2025986@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> Message-ID: dear buildsystem scrollkeeper from this update segfaults (x86). example yum update output: Cleanup : gok ##################### [ 92/108] /var/tmp/rpm-tmp.10716: line 1: 2889 Segmentation fault scrollkeeper-update error: %postun(gok-1.0.1-2.i386) scriptlet failed, exit status 139 this resulted in having two versions of gok installed. downgraded scrollkeeper to the fc4t1 version and it doesn't segfault anymore. L From jspaleta at gmail.com Thu Mar 17 17:48:14 2005 From: jspaleta at gmail.com (Jeff Spaleta) Date: Thu, 17 Mar 2005 12:48:14 -0500 Subject: GFS removed??? (was: rawhide report: 20050315 changes) In-Reply-To: <20050317173625.GV21731@neu.nirvana> References: <20050316213117.GK9082@neu.nirvana> <20050317093019.GD21731@neu.nirvana> <1111054301.4354.3.camel@thl.ct.heise.de> <20050317102837.GE21731@neu.nirvana> <1111055900.4354.8.camel@thl.ct.heise.de> <20050317105000.GJ21731@neu.nirvana> <1111069859.5267.61.camel@cutter> <20050317162605.GD16763@angus.ind.WPI.EDU> <20050317173625.GV21731@neu.nirvana> Message-ID: <604aa791050317094841279f51@mail.gmail.com> On Thu, 17 Mar 2005 18:36:25 +0100, Axel Thimm wrote: > Check fedora-maintainers. The best you can do is _read_ through the > discussions. That's not an open development model as Fedora advertises > itself to be. You are free to begin the process of becoming a package maintainer for packages in Extras, if you desire it. So that you have the ability to be a part of discussions among maintainers of Core and Extras as a peer. -jef From Axel.Thimm at ATrpms.net Thu Mar 17 18:02:49 2005 From: Axel.Thimm at ATrpms.net (Axel Thimm) Date: Thu, 17 Mar 2005 19:02:49 +0100 Subject: GFS removed??? (was: rawhide report: 20050315 changes) In-Reply-To: <604aa791050317094841279f51@mail.gmail.com> References: <20050317093019.GD21731@neu.nirvana> <1111054301.4354.3.camel@thl.ct.heise.de> <20050317102837.GE21731@neu.nirvana> <1111055900.4354.8.camel@thl.ct.heise.de> <20050317105000.GJ21731@neu.nirvana> <1111069859.5267.61.camel@cutter> <20050317162605.GD16763@angus.ind.WPI.EDU> <20050317173625.GV21731@neu.nirvana> <604aa791050317094841279f51@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20050317180249.GZ21731@neu.nirvana> On Thu, Mar 17, 2005 at 12:48:14PM -0500, Jeff Spaleta wrote: > On Thu, 17 Mar 2005 18:36:25 +0100, Axel Thimm wrote: > > Check fedora-maintainers. The best you can do is _read_ through the > > discussions. That's not an open development model as Fedora advertises > > itself to be. > > You are free to begin the process of becoming a package maintainer for > packages in Extras, if you desire it. So that you have the ability to > be a part of discussions among maintainers of Core and Extras as a > peer. So that's why the list is closed and important content is moving there. -- Axel.Thimm at ATrpms.net -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: not available URL: From jkeating at j2solutions.net Thu Mar 17 18:19:37 2005 From: jkeating at j2solutions.net (Jesse Keating) Date: Thu, 17 Mar 2005 10:19:37 -0800 Subject: Looking for some Python dbus/hal help Message-ID: <1111083577.31967.83.camel@jkeating2.hq.pogolinux.com> I need to plug into hal through dbus in python a bit. So I'm looking for some good documentation that covers dbus and hal, specifically ways to find hal entries for kernels and devices and such. I've 'borrowed' some code from system-config-packages, namely: # get the devices from HAL bus = dbus.Bus (dbus.Bus.TYPE_SYSTEM) hal_service = bus.get_service ('org.freedesktop.Hal') hal_manager = hal_service.get_object ('/org/freedesktop/Hal/Manager', 'org.freedesktop.Hal.Manager') volume = hal_manager.FindDeviceStringMatch('volume.label', label)[0] # Look for our disk label, return first one props = hal_service.get_object(volume, "org.freedesktop.Hal.Device").GetAllProperties() # Get all the properties of the volume mount = props['volume.mount_point'] # Get the mount point and return it... But I'm looking for alternatives to the 'FindDeviceStringMatch' and it's friends. Can anybody help out as I pour through the sources to these modules? -- Jesse Keating RHCE (geek.j2solutions.net) Fedora Legacy Team (www.fedoralegacy.org) GPG Public Key (geek.j2solutions.net/jkeating.j2solutions.pub) Was I helpful? Let others know: http://svcs.affero.net/rm.php?r=jkeating From kyrre at solution-forge.net Thu Mar 17 18:22:35 2005 From: kyrre at solution-forge.net (Kyrre Ness Sjobak) Date: Thu, 17 Mar 2005 19:22:35 +0100 Subject: A more efficient up2date service using binary diffs In-Reply-To: <604aa79105031706304219a147@mail.gmail.com> References: <42333234.8080106@nc.rr.com> <1110923503.27320.29.camel@ice-dragon.ddn.de> <20050315151205.A25119@tiki-lounge.com> <1110933853.27320.44.camel@ice-dragon.ddn.de> <20050316022157.GE28313@angus.ind.WPI.EDU> <1cef3e9505031606061a6e2cbe@mail.gmail.com> <1110983501.6211.29.camel@angua.localnet> <1111049074.3353.13.camel@localhost.localdomain> <604aa79105031706304219a147@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1111083754.3353.39.camel@localhost.localdomain> tor, 17.03.2005 kl. 15.30 skrev Jeff Spaleta: > On Thu, 17 Mar 2005 09:44:34 +0100, Kyrre Ness Sjobak > > So... Why should we put the load of generating the prpm's to the > > mirrors? > > Initially... proof-of-concept. The easiest path to full integration of > this into the build/release system is incremental. Come up with an > implementation, or two.. find a few mirrors willing to work with you > to host the necessary serverside scripts... advertise the clientside > scripts... so people in he community can start chewing on it. You are > going to have to take a layered approach to this initially, where both > the needed client and server side processes are essentially addons > that do not disturb the existing infrastructure and toolspace. > Expecting both the existing buildsystem and the existing distro tools > to spin up direct support for vaporware patch/delta package > implementations is most definitely out of place and only serves to > keep this discussion from moving forward. > > You can talk till your blue in the face about what the ideal system > should like, but until people in the community who are interested come > up with a usable implementation that can be real-world tested, > continued discussion about how cool it would be if Fedora's > build/release/mirror system handled this is just navel gazing. I > don't think I've seen ANY evidence that the people you need to > convince, who have some decision making power as to how the Fedora > build/release/mirror system operates are convinced this is worth it. > And at this point I don't think further discussion without an > implementation of some of these ideas is going to change anyone's > minds. Getting a sample server and client implementation out is your > best chance of seeing any progess on this. > > -jef Of cource. This has to be given extensive testing before getting rolled in as *the* way of doing things... From johnp at redhat.com Thu Mar 17 18:26:32 2005 From: johnp at redhat.com (John (J5) Palmieri) Date: Thu, 17 Mar 2005 13:26:32 -0500 Subject: Looking for some Python dbus/hal help In-Reply-To: <1111083577.31967.83.camel@jkeating2.hq.pogolinux.com> References: <1111083577.31967.83.camel@jkeating2.hq.pogolinux.com> Message-ID: <1111083992.6953.15.camel@remedyz.boston.redhat.com> On Thu, 2005-03-17 at 10:19 -0800, Jesse Keating wrote: > I need to plug into hal through dbus in python a bit. So I'm looking > for some good documentation that covers dbus and hal, specifically ways > to find hal entries for kernels and devices and such. > > I've 'borrowed' some code from system-config-packages, namely: > > # get the devices from HAL > bus = dbus.Bus (dbus.Bus.TYPE_SYSTEM) > hal_service = bus.get_service ('org.freedesktop.Hal') > hal_manager = hal_service.get_object > ('/org/freedesktop/Hal/Manager', 'org.freedesktop.Hal.Manager') > volume = hal_manager.FindDeviceStringMatch('volume.label', label)[0] > # Look for our disk label, return first one > props = hal_service.get_object(volume, > "org.freedesktop.Hal.Device").GetAllProperties() # Get all the > properties of the volume > > mount = props['volume.mount_point'] # Get the mount point and return > it... > > But I'm looking for alternatives to the 'FindDeviceStringMatch' and it's > friends. Can anybody help out as I pour through the sources to these > modules? Probably best to ask this on the hal list. You just need to get the dbus interface that hal exports which is contained in the HAL specification on http://www.freedesktop.org/Software/hal. -- John (J5) Palmieri Associate Software Engineer Desktop Group Red Hat, Inc. Blog: http://martianrock.com From kyrre at solution-forge.net Thu Mar 17 18:30:52 2005 From: kyrre at solution-forge.net (Kyrre Ness Sjobak) Date: Thu, 17 Mar 2005 19:30:52 +0100 Subject: Old kernel RPMS In-Reply-To: <1110902626.4599.3.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> References: <1110703151.3170.7.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> <423702ED.7050108@redhat.com> <1110902626.4599.3.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> Message-ID: <1111084251.3353.42.camel@localhost.localdomain> tir, 15.03.2005 kl. 17.03 skrev Ivan Gyurdiev: > On Tue, 2005-03-15 at 16:44 +0100, Harald Hoyer wrote: > > Ivan Gyurdiev wrote: > > > My nvidia driver crashes again - no logs, no error messages, no info of > > > any kind. Only happens when running OpenGL games after several minutes > > > of gameplay - screen goes to gray diagonal lines, and the system's > > > completely frozen. Happens with 6629, and 7167 - > > > suspects are kernel and gcc4 compiler (since I remember 6629 used to > > > work at some point). This is going to be extremely unpleasant to debug. > > > > and this is really no thermal problem? (just asking) > > thermal.. as in overheating problem? I sure hope not - it worked fine > until recently. I am starting to get suspicious, however, because > yesterday it locked up with the nv driver. It also locked up earlier > when not running any openGL apps. So.. the problem is either the kernel > or the card. I will turn on sysrq and investigate. I see no Oops or > panic in the log as is.. > > -- > Ivan Gyurdiev > Cornell University Try to boot into a really low runlevel (few-no services), and do something cpu intensive (transcode a video or something). Then wait for oops'es to appear on the console... At least you then can rule out video card overheating From jspaleta at gmail.com Thu Mar 17 18:42:35 2005 From: jspaleta at gmail.com (Jeff Spaleta) Date: Thu, 17 Mar 2005 13:42:35 -0500 Subject: Openness: Apache as a guiding model (was Re: GFS removed??? ) In-Reply-To: <20050317180249.GZ21731@neu.nirvana> References: <20050317093019.GD21731@neu.nirvana> <20050317102837.GE21731@neu.nirvana> <1111055900.4354.8.camel@thl.ct.heise.de> <20050317105000.GJ21731@neu.nirvana> <1111069859.5267.61.camel@cutter> <20050317162605.GD16763@angus.ind.WPI.EDU> <20050317173625.GV21731@neu.nirvana> <604aa791050317094841279f51@mail.gmail.com> <20050317180249.GZ21731@neu.nirvana> Message-ID: <604aa791050317104261c98955@mail.gmail.com> On Thu, 17 Mar 2005 19:02:49 +0100, Axel Thimm wrote: > So that's why the list is closed and important content is moving > there. I think you and I have very different definitions of closed. Putting the semantics of open/closed terminology aside for a minute.. I don't think its irrational to expect people who are actively contributing to Extras to have a prominent say in how the policies of Extras are implemented. There is a way for you to become a part of that peer group, and have a seat at the table. If you don't desire to be a contributor , that's understandable. But you have to realize that if you choose not to become one you most likely have less impact on how the system evolves as decisions are being made. Back to the issue of Would you call Apache's organizational structure closed? Apache Foundation has several mailinglists that are committer only: http://www.apache.org/foundation/mailinglists.html Several of those Foundation lists.. aren't even publicly accessible for review. And yet I would call Apache an open, collaborative, community process.. which is exactly what Apache calls themselves. If you feel Apache isn't an open process either... fine.. "open" is rather open to intepretation. Just be aware that what's going inside Fedora is not out-of-step with how Apache organizes things and calibrate your indignation accordingly. In Apache's model a committer is nearly the same as what an Extras contributor is defined to be right now: http://www.apache.org/foundation/how-it-works.html#committers And Apache's "Foundation Community Mailing List" seems very much like the Fedora's "fedora-maintainers" list to me. Committer equivalent level access.. with a public archive for review. You are free to continue to stand outside the process, if becoming a maintainer isn't something you desire, but please let's dial down the sensationalized language about open versus closed like its a black and white issue. -jef From jkeating at j2solutions.net Thu Mar 17 18:43:11 2005 From: jkeating at j2solutions.net (Jesse Keating) Date: Thu, 17 Mar 2005 10:43:11 -0800 Subject: Looking for some Python dbus/hal help In-Reply-To: <1111083992.6953.15.camel@remedyz.boston.redhat.com> References: <1111083577.31967.83.camel@jkeating2.hq.pogolinux.com> <1111083992.6953.15.camel@remedyz.boston.redhat.com> Message-ID: <1111084991.31967.89.camel@jkeating2.hq.pogolinux.com> On Thu, 2005-03-17 at 13:26 -0500, John (J5) Palmieri wrote: > > Probably best to ask this on the hal list. You just need to get the > dbus interface that hal exports which is contained in the HAL > specification on http://www.freedesktop.org/Software/hal. > I'll join that list. I've looked through the hal stuff, but they really just reference what KINDS of things you can find in which name space, but they don't cover the python modules to actually GET to these namespaces and infos. Thats what I'm missing ): -- Jesse Keating RHCE (geek.j2solutions.net) Fedora Legacy Team (www.fedoralegacy.org) GPG Public Key (geek.j2solutions.net/jkeating.j2solutions.pub) Was I helpful? Let others know: http://svcs.affero.net/rm.php?r=jkeating From pjones at redhat.com Thu Mar 17 19:07:38 2005 From: pjones at redhat.com (Peter Jones) Date: Thu, 17 Mar 2005 14:07:38 -0500 Subject: usb_storage In-Reply-To: <20050316132536.2c968d17@localhost.localdomain> References: <20050316132536.2c968d17@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <1111086458.5327.1.camel@localhost.localdomain> On Wed, 2005-03-16 at 13:25 -0800, Pete Zaitcev wrote: > On Wed, 16 Mar 2005 15:22:00 +0000 Paul wrote: > > > Any signs of usb_storage being fixed? > > > > I could really do with being able to use my internal card reader... > > What are you talking about? This stuff, I bet: Mar 17 14:06:26 localhost kernel: usb 1-4: device descriptor read/64, error -71 Mar 17 14:06:33 localhost kernel: usb 1-4: new high speed USB device using ehci_hcd and address 34 Mar 17 14:06:33 localhost kernel: ehci_hcd 0000:00:1d.7: port 4 reset error -110Mar 17 14:06:33 localhost kernel: hub 1-0:1.0: hub_port_status failed (err = -32) Mar 17 14:06:33 localhost kernel: usb 1-4: device descriptor read/64, error -71 Mar 17 14:06:34 localhost kernel: usb 1-4: new high speed USB device using ehci_hcd and address 37 Mar 17 14:06:34 localhost kernel: ehci_hcd 0000:00:1d.7: port 4 reset error -110Mar 17 14:06:34 localhost kernel: hub 1-0:1.0: hub_port_status failed (err = -32) (this is what happens when I plug a SanDisk usb 2 CF reader in on my laptop) -- Peter From Axel.Thimm at ATrpms.net Thu Mar 17 19:12:35 2005 From: Axel.Thimm at ATrpms.net (Axel Thimm) Date: Thu, 17 Mar 2005 20:12:35 +0100 Subject: Openness: Apache as a guiding model (was Re: GFS removed??? ) In-Reply-To: <604aa791050317104261c98955@mail.gmail.com> References: <20050317102837.GE21731@neu.nirvana> <1111055900.4354.8.camel@thl.ct.heise.de> <20050317105000.GJ21731@neu.nirvana> <1111069859.5267.61.camel@cutter> <20050317162605.GD16763@angus.ind.WPI.EDU> <20050317173625.GV21731@neu.nirvana> <604aa791050317094841279f51@mail.gmail.com> <20050317180249.GZ21731@neu.nirvana> <604aa791050317104261c98955@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20050317191235.GE21731@neu.nirvana> For one I fail to see any connection of the issues at hand (GFS kernel modules) with extras, so forcing people to contribute to extras just because they want to contribute to FC/RHEL seems to be very wrong. Furthermore your definition of "openness" would even apply to the US goverment. Sorry for top posting, your mails are just too long. On Thu, Mar 17, 2005 at 01:42:35PM -0500, Jeff Spaleta wrote: > On Thu, 17 Mar 2005 19:02:49 +0100, Axel Thimm wrote: > > So that's why the list is closed and important content is moving > > there. > > I think you and I have very different definitions of closed. Putting > the semantics of open/closed terminology aside for a minute.. I don't > think its irrational to expect people who are actively contributing to > Extras to have a prominent say in how the policies of Extras are > implemented. There is a way for you to become a part of that peer > group, and have a seat at the table. If you don't desire to be a > contributor , that's understandable. But you have to realize that if > you choose not to become one you most likely have less impact on how > the system evolves as decisions are being made. > > Back to the issue of > Would you call Apache's organizational structure closed? > Apache Foundation has several mailinglists that are committer only: > http://www.apache.org/foundation/mailinglists.html > Several of those Foundation lists.. aren't even publicly accessible > for review. And yet I would call Apache an open, collaborative, > community process.. which is exactly what Apache calls themselves. If > you feel Apache isn't an open process either... fine.. "open" is > rather open to intepretation. Just be aware that what's going inside > Fedora is not out-of-step with how Apache organizes things and > calibrate your indignation accordingly. In Apache's model a committer > is nearly the same as what an Extras contributor is defined to be > right now: > http://www.apache.org/foundation/how-it-works.html#committers > And Apache's "Foundation Community Mailing List" seems very much like > the Fedora's "fedora-maintainers" list to me. Committer equivalent > level access.. with a public archive for review. > > You are free to continue to stand outside the process, if becoming a > maintainer isn't something you desire, but please let's dial down the > sensationalized language about open versus closed like its a black and > white issue. > > -jef > -- Axel.Thimm at ATrpms.net -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: not available URL: From jkeating at j2solutions.net Thu Mar 17 19:18:36 2005 From: jkeating at j2solutions.net (Jesse Keating) Date: Thu, 17 Mar 2005 11:18:36 -0800 Subject: Openness: Apache as a guiding model (was Re: GFS removed??? ) In-Reply-To: <20050317191235.GE21731@neu.nirvana> References: <20050317102837.GE21731@neu.nirvana> <1111055900.4354.8.camel@thl.ct.heise.de> <20050317105000.GJ21731@neu.nirvana> <1111069859.5267.61.camel@cutter> <20050317162605.GD16763@angus.ind.WPI.EDU> <20050317173625.GV21731@neu.nirvana> <604aa791050317094841279f51@mail.gmail.com> <20050317180249.GZ21731@neu.nirvana> <604aa791050317104261c98955@mail.gmail.com> <20050317191235.GE21731@neu.nirvana> Message-ID: <1111087116.31967.102.camel@jkeating2.hq.pogolinux.com> On Thu, 2005-03-17 at 20:12 +0100, Axel Thimm wrote: > For one I fail to see any connection of the issues at hand (GFS kernel > modules) with extras, so forcing people to contribute to extras just > because they want to contribute to FC/RHEL seems to be very wrong. Extras is the entry point to the Fedora Project. Fedora Project is the entry point to RHEL. Why is this so hard to understand? -- Jesse Keating RHCE (geek.j2solutions.net) Fedora Legacy Team (www.fedoralegacy.org) GPG Public Key (geek.j2solutions.net/jkeating.j2solutions.pub) Was I helpful? Let others know: http://svcs.affero.net/rm.php?r=jkeating From byte at aeon.com.my Thu Mar 17 19:23:20 2005 From: byte at aeon.com.my (Colin Charles) Date: Fri, 18 Mar 2005 06:23:20 +1100 Subject: Openness: Apache as a guiding model (was Re: GFS removed??? ) In-Reply-To: <20050317191235.GE21731@neu.nirvana> References: <20050317102837.GE21731@neu.nirvana> <1111055900.4354.8.camel@thl.ct.heise.de> <20050317105000.GJ21731@neu.nirvana> <1111069859.5267.61.camel@cutter> <20050317162605.GD16763@angus.ind.WPI.EDU> <20050317173625.GV21731@neu.nirvana> <604aa791050317094841279f51@mail.gmail.com> <20050317180249.GZ21731@neu.nirvana> <604aa791050317104261c98955@mail.gmail.com> <20050317191235.GE21731@neu.nirvana> Message-ID: <1111087400.17429.260.camel@arena.soho.bytebot.net> On Thu, 2005-03-17 at 20:12 +0100, Axel Thimm wrote: > For one I fail to see any connection of the issues at hand (GFS kernel > modules) with extras, so forcing people to contribute to extras just > because they want to contribute to FC/RHEL seems to be very wrong. You mentioned kernel module packaging, and a post was referenced that was stuck on fedora-maintainers. You complained that this wasn't exactly a very open way of doing things Jef mentioned becoming an Extras packager, so that you get on the fedora-maintainers list. And now you fail to see the connection? >From the fedora-maintainers listinfo page: "This is the list for maintainers of packages in Fedora Core and Fedora Extras. Subscription to this list is contingent on one of these two criteria." So, if you get involved with the process, you get on the list. Otherwise, following the discussion is still possible, thanks to fedora- maintainers-readonly Now what's incredibly unfair with getting involved with the process to contribute to The Fedora Project? No one's forcing you to contribute to Extras; you just have to meet one of the two criteria Warmest regards. -- Colin Charles, byte at aeon.com.my http://www.bytebot.net/ "First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win." -- Mohandas Gandhi From Axel.Thimm at ATrpms.net Thu Mar 17 19:25:42 2005 From: Axel.Thimm at ATrpms.net (Axel Thimm) Date: Thu, 17 Mar 2005 20:25:42 +0100 Subject: Openness: Apache as a guiding model (was Re: GFS removed??? ) In-Reply-To: <1111087116.31967.102.camel@jkeating2.hq.pogolinux.com> References: <20050317105000.GJ21731@neu.nirvana> <1111069859.5267.61.camel@cutter> <20050317162605.GD16763@angus.ind.WPI.EDU> <20050317173625.GV21731@neu.nirvana> <604aa791050317094841279f51@mail.gmail.com> <20050317180249.GZ21731@neu.nirvana> <604aa791050317104261c98955@mail.gmail.com> <20050317191235.GE21731@neu.nirvana> <1111087116.31967.102.camel@jkeating2.hq.pogolinux.com> Message-ID: <20050317192542.GA6398@neu.nirvana> On Thu, Mar 17, 2005 at 11:18:36AM -0800, Jesse Keating wrote: > On Thu, 2005-03-17 at 20:12 +0100, Axel Thimm wrote: > > For one I fail to see any connection of the issues at hand (GFS kernel > > modules) with extras, so forcing people to contribute to extras just > > because they want to contribute to FC/RHEL seems to be very wrong. > > Extras is the entry point to the Fedora Project. Fedora Project is the > entry point to RHEL. Why is this so hard to understand? So this list should be scraped? And GFS will make its reappearance in Fedora Extras? -- Axel.Thimm at ATrpms.net -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: not available URL: From jkeating at j2solutions.net Thu Mar 17 19:28:09 2005 From: jkeating at j2solutions.net (Jesse Keating) Date: Thu, 17 Mar 2005 11:28:09 -0800 Subject: Openness: Apache as a guiding model (was Re: GFS removed??? ) In-Reply-To: <20050317192542.GA6398@neu.nirvana> References: <20050317105000.GJ21731@neu.nirvana> <1111069859.5267.61.camel@cutter> <20050317162605.GD16763@angus.ind.WPI.EDU> <20050317173625.GV21731@neu.nirvana> <604aa791050317094841279f51@mail.gmail.com> <20050317180249.GZ21731@neu.nirvana> <604aa791050317104261c98955@mail.gmail.com> <20050317191235.GE21731@neu.nirvana> <1111087116.31967.102.camel@jkeating2.hq.pogolinux.com> <20050317192542.GA6398@neu.nirvana> Message-ID: <1111087689.31967.105.camel@jkeating2.hq.pogolinux.com> On Thu, 2005-03-17 at 20:25 +0100, Axel Thimm wrote: > > Extras is the entry point to the Fedora Project. Fedora Project is > the > > entry point to RHEL. Why is this so hard to understand? > > So this list should be scraped? And GFS will make its reappearance in > Fedora Extras? Why should this list be scrapped? Lots of people develop on Fedora or for Fedora. And what does the above have to do w/ GFS? -- Jesse Keating RHCE (geek.j2solutions.net) Fedora Legacy Team (www.fedoralegacy.org) GPG Public Key (geek.j2solutions.net/jkeating.j2solutions.pub) Was I helpful? Let others know: http://svcs.affero.net/rm.php?r=jkeating From jkeating at j2solutions.net Thu Mar 17 19:30:11 2005 From: jkeating at j2solutions.net (Jesse Keating) Date: Thu, 17 Mar 2005 11:30:11 -0800 Subject: Openness: Apache as a guiding model (was Re: GFS removed??? ) In-Reply-To: <1111087689.31967.105.camel@jkeating2.hq.pogolinux.com> References: <20050317105000.GJ21731@neu.nirvana> <1111069859.5267.61.camel@cutter> <20050317162605.GD16763@angus.ind.WPI.EDU> <20050317173625.GV21731@neu.nirvana> <604aa791050317094841279f51@mail.gmail.com> <20050317180249.GZ21731@neu.nirvana> <604aa791050317104261c98955@mail.gmail.com> <20050317191235.GE21731@neu.nirvana> <1111087116.31967.102.camel@jkeating2.hq.pogolinux.com> <20050317192542.GA6398@neu.nirvana> <1111087689.31967.105.camel@jkeating2.hq.pogolinux.com> Message-ID: <1111087811.31967.108.camel@jkeating2.hq.pogolinux.com> On Thu, 2005-03-17 at 11:28 -0800, Jesse Keating wrote: > Why should this list be scrapped? Lots of people develop on Fedora or > for Fedora. To be specific: Fedora-devel is about software development. Fedora- maintainers is about maintaining packages, not necessarily about developing software. -- Jesse Keating RHCE (geek.j2solutions.net) Fedora Legacy Team (www.fedoralegacy.org) GPG Public Key (geek.j2solutions.net/jkeating.j2solutions.pub) Was I helpful? Let others know: http://svcs.affero.net/rm.php?r=jkeating From Axel.Thimm at ATrpms.net Thu Mar 17 19:31:21 2005 From: Axel.Thimm at ATrpms.net (Axel Thimm) Date: Thu, 17 Mar 2005 20:31:21 +0100 Subject: Openness: Apache as a guiding model (was Re: GFS removed??? ) In-Reply-To: <1111087400.17429.260.camel@arena.soho.bytebot.net> References: <20050317105000.GJ21731@neu.nirvana> <1111069859.5267.61.camel@cutter> <20050317162605.GD16763@angus.ind.WPI.EDU> <20050317173625.GV21731@neu.nirvana> <604aa791050317094841279f51@mail.gmail.com> <20050317180249.GZ21731@neu.nirvana> <604aa791050317104261c98955@mail.gmail.com> <20050317191235.GE21731@neu.nirvana> <1111087400.17429.260.camel@arena.soho.bytebot.net> Message-ID: <20050317193121.GB6398@neu.nirvana> On Fri, Mar 18, 2005 at 06:23:20AM +1100, Colin Charles wrote: > On Thu, 2005-03-17 at 20:12 +0100, Axel Thimm wrote: > > For one I fail to see any connection of the issues at hand (GFS kernel > > modules) with extras, so forcing people to contribute to extras just > > because they want to contribute to FC/RHEL seems to be very wrong. > > You mentioned kernel module packaging, and a post was referenced that > was stuck on fedora-maintainers. You complained that this wasn't exactly > a very open way of doing things > > Jef mentioned becoming an Extras packager, so that you get on the > fedora-maintainers list. And now you fail to see the connection? Yes, because this is not a subject to be discussed on a closed list. It certainly affects more than extras, core and rhel. In fact this discussion is more about ISVs like the dozens of 3rd party repos and driver packagers. > >From the fedora-maintainers listinfo page: > "This is the list for maintainers of packages in Fedora Core and Fedora > Extras. Subscription to this list is contingent on one of these two > criteria." > > So, if you get involved with the process, you get on the list. I'm not talking about maintaining any specific package, this is about infrastructure and naming/versioning schemes. > Otherwise, following the discussion is still possible, thanks to fedora- > maintainers-readonly > > Now what's incredibly unfair with getting involved with the process to > contribute to The Fedora Project? No one's forcing you to contribute to > Extras; you just have to meet one of the two criteria AFAIK a signed agreement is needed. -- Axel.Thimm at ATrpms.net -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: not available URL: From jspaleta at gmail.com Thu Mar 17 19:34:27 2005 From: jspaleta at gmail.com (Jeff Spaleta) Date: Thu, 17 Mar 2005 14:34:27 -0500 Subject: Openness: Apache as a guiding model (was Re: GFS removed??? ) In-Reply-To: <20050317193121.GB6398@neu.nirvana> References: <20050317105000.GJ21731@neu.nirvana> <20050317162605.GD16763@angus.ind.WPI.EDU> <20050317173625.GV21731@neu.nirvana> <604aa791050317094841279f51@mail.gmail.com> <20050317180249.GZ21731@neu.nirvana> <604aa791050317104261c98955@mail.gmail.com> <20050317191235.GE21731@neu.nirvana> <1111087400.17429.260.camel@arena.soho.bytebot.net> <20050317193121.GB6398@neu.nirvana> Message-ID: <604aa791050317113458343607@mail.gmail.com> On Thu, 17 Mar 2005 20:31:21 +0100, Axel Thimm wrote: > AFAIK a signed agreement is needed. again, like apache..... if you have problems with the language in the agreement that can be addressed if you point out specific issues that need to be clarified. A comparison to apache's contributor agreement is instructive. -jef From Axel.Thimm at ATrpms.net Thu Mar 17 19:37:50 2005 From: Axel.Thimm at ATrpms.net (Axel Thimm) Date: Thu, 17 Mar 2005 20:37:50 +0100 Subject: Openness: Apache as a guiding model (was Re: GFS removed??? ) In-Reply-To: <1111087689.31967.105.camel@jkeating2.hq.pogolinux.com> <20050317192542.GA6398@neu.nirvana> References: <1111069859.5267.61.camel@cutter> <20050317162605.GD16763@angus.ind.WPI.EDU> <20050317173625.GV21731@neu.nirvana> <604aa791050317094841279f51@mail.gmail.com> <20050317180249.GZ21731@neu.nirvana> <604aa791050317104261c98955@mail.gmail.com> <20050317191235.GE21731@neu.nirvana> <1111087116.31967.102.camel@jkeating2.hq.pogolinux.com> <20050317192542.GA6398@neu.nirvana> Message-ID: <20050317193750.GC6398@neu.nirvana> On Thu, Mar 17, 2005 at 11:28:09AM -0800, Jesse Keating wrote: > On Thu, 2005-03-17 at 20:25 +0100, Axel Thimm wrote: > > > Extras is the entry point to the Fedora Project. Fedora Project > > > is the entry point to RHEL. Why is this so hard to understand? > > > > So this list should be scraped? And GFS will make its reappearance > > in Fedora Extras? > > Why should this list be scrapped? Lots of people develop on Fedora > or for Fedora. Like myself doing lots of kernel module builds including such for GFS. So why am I suddenly forced to become an official contributor to Fedora Extras just to take part to a discussion that is really not related to Fedora Extras? > And what does the above have to do w/ GFS? You removed too much of my reply: On Thu, Mar 17, 2005 at 08:25:42PM +0100, Axel Thimm wrote: > On Thu, Mar 17, 2005 at 11:18:36AM -0800, Jesse Keating wrote: > > On Thu, 2005-03-17 at 20:12 +0100, Axel Thimm wrote: > > > For one I fail to see any connection of the issues at hand (GFS kernel > > > modules) with extras, so forcing people to contribute to extras just > > > because they want to contribute to FC/RHEL seems to be very wrong. -- Axel.Thimm at ATrpms.net -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: not available URL: From Axel.Thimm at ATrpms.net Thu Mar 17 19:41:46 2005 From: Axel.Thimm at ATrpms.net (Axel Thimm) Date: Thu, 17 Mar 2005 20:41:46 +0100 Subject: Openness: Apache as a guiding model (was Re: GFS removed??? ) In-Reply-To: <1111087811.31967.108.camel@jkeating2.hq.pogolinux.com> References: <20050317162605.GD16763@angus.ind.WPI.EDU> <20050317173625.GV21731@neu.nirvana> <604aa791050317094841279f51@mail.gmail.com> <20050317180249.GZ21731@neu.nirvana> <604aa791050317104261c98955@mail.gmail.com> <20050317191235.GE21731@neu.nirvana> <1111087116.31967.102.camel@jkeating2.hq.pogolinux.com> <20050317192542.GA6398@neu.nirvana> <1111087689.31967.105.camel@jkeating2.hq.pogolinux.com> <1111087811.31967.108.camel@jkeating2.hq.pogolinux.com> Message-ID: <20050317194146.GD6398@neu.nirvana> On Thu, Mar 17, 2005 at 11:30:11AM -0800, Jesse Keating wrote: > On Thu, 2005-03-17 at 11:28 -0800, Jesse Keating wrote: > > Why should this list be scrapped? Lots of people develop on Fedora or > > for Fedora. > > To be specific: Fedora-devel is about software development. Fedora- > maintainers is about maintaining packages, not necessarily about > developing software. This sounds more like fedora-packaging, or would you have a distinctive mark for the differences fedora-packaging vs fedora-maintainers (the former being a normal open list). Yes, there are too many lists at Fedora and making them closed or read-only does not help. -- Axel.Thimm at ATrpms.net -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: not available URL: From jkeating at j2solutions.net Thu Mar 17 19:42:12 2005 From: jkeating at j2solutions.net (Jesse Keating) Date: Thu, 17 Mar 2005 11:42:12 -0800 Subject: Openness: Apache as a guiding model (was Re: GFS removed??? ) In-Reply-To: <20050317193121.GB6398@neu.nirvana> References: <20050317105000.GJ21731@neu.nirvana> <1111069859.5267.61.camel@cutter> <20050317162605.GD16763@angus.ind.WPI.EDU> <20050317173625.GV21731@neu.nirvana> <604aa791050317094841279f51@mail.gmail.com> <20050317180249.GZ21731@neu.nirvana> <604aa791050317104261c98955@mail.gmail.com> <20050317191235.GE21731@neu.nirvana> <1111087400.17429.260.camel@arena.soho.bytebot.net> <20050317193121.GB6398@neu.nirvana> Message-ID: <1111088532.31967.122.camel@jkeating2.hq.pogolinux.com> On Thu, 2005-03-17 at 20:31 +0100, Axel Thimm wrote: > Yes, because this is not a subject to be discussed on a closed > list. It certainly affects more than extras, core and rhel. In fact > this discussion is more about ISVs like the dozens of 3rd party repos > and driver packagers. Unfortunately it's not possible to open discussion about this type of stuff to every joe-bob that happens to make a package, and expect anything to get done in any reasonable amount of time. Contribution to Extras of Core grants you a voice in the discussion of package maintainership and certain levels of infrastructure. Same style of setup that projects like, oh, I don't know, Apache use. -- Jesse Keating RHCE (geek.j2solutions.net) Fedora Legacy Team (www.fedoralegacy.org) GPG Public Key (geek.j2solutions.net/jkeating.j2solutions.pub) Was I helpful? Let others know: http://svcs.affero.net/rm.php?r=jkeating From Axel.Thimm at ATrpms.net Thu Mar 17 19:46:42 2005 From: Axel.Thimm at ATrpms.net (Axel Thimm) Date: Thu, 17 Mar 2005 20:46:42 +0100 Subject: Openness: Apache as a guiding model (was Re: GFS removed??? ) In-Reply-To: <604aa791050317113458343607@mail.gmail.com> References: <20050317162605.GD16763@angus.ind.WPI.EDU> <20050317173625.GV21731@neu.nirvana> <604aa791050317094841279f51@mail.gmail.com> <20050317180249.GZ21731@neu.nirvana> <604aa791050317104261c98955@mail.gmail.com> <20050317191235.GE21731@neu.nirvana> <1111087400.17429.260.camel@arena.soho.bytebot.net> <20050317193121.GB6398@neu.nirvana> <604aa791050317113458343607@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20050317194642.GE6398@neu.nirvana> On Thu, Mar 17, 2005 at 02:34:27PM -0500, Jeff Spaleta wrote: > On Thu, 17 Mar 2005 20:31:21 +0100, Axel Thimm wrote: > > AFAIK a signed agreement is needed. > > again, like apache..... Please stop draining apache into the muds. The realities there are different altogether. No development list/discussion is closed there. I don't want to sign any agreement to be able to express my opinions, especially when they are unrelated to what the issue is about ... ?!?! > if you have problems with the language in the agreement that can be > addressed if you point out specific issues that need to be clarified. > A comparison to apache's contributor agreement is instructive. Yeah, right, make me an an-alphabet now. -- Axel.Thimm at ATrpms.net -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: not available URL: From Axel.Thimm at ATrpms.net Thu Mar 17 19:52:57 2005 From: Axel.Thimm at ATrpms.net (Axel Thimm) Date: Thu, 17 Mar 2005 20:52:57 +0100 Subject: Openness: Apache as a guiding model (was Re: GFS removed??? ) In-Reply-To: <1111088532.31967.122.camel@jkeating2.hq.pogolinux.com> References: <20050317162605.GD16763@angus.ind.WPI.EDU> <20050317173625.GV21731@neu.nirvana> <604aa791050317094841279f51@mail.gmail.com> <20050317180249.GZ21731@neu.nirvana> <604aa791050317104261c98955@mail.gmail.com> <20050317191235.GE21731@neu.nirvana> <1111087400.17429.260.camel@arena.soho.bytebot.net> <20050317193121.GB6398@neu.nirvana> <1111088532.31967.122.camel@jkeating2.hq.pogolinux.com> Message-ID: <20050317195257.GF6398@neu.nirvana> On Thu, Mar 17, 2005 at 11:42:12AM -0800, Jesse Keating wrote: > On Thu, 2005-03-17 at 20:31 +0100, Axel Thimm wrote: > > Yes, because this is not a subject to be discussed on a closed > > list. It certainly affects more than extras, core and rhel. In fact > > this discussion is more about ISVs like the dozens of 3rd party repos > > and driver packagers. > > Unfortunately it's not possible to open discussion about this type > of stuff to every joe-bob that happens to make a package, and expect > anything to get done in any reasonable amount of time. Contribution > to Extras of Core grants you a voice in the discussion of package > maintainership and certain levels of infrastructure. Same style of > setup that projects like, oh, I don't know, Apache use. OK, fine with me. You are loosing significant input (I'm not the only 3rd party repo maintainer that ist staying out of closed doors), but I hope you'll get to a decent result anyhow. Let's close this thread before someone mentiones that discussion moved to a closed list due to moise levels here (not noting that the noise was not generated by joe-bob, but by the main actors ...) -- Axel.Thimm at ATrpms.net -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: not available URL: From jkeating at j2solutions.net Thu Mar 17 19:53:55 2005 From: jkeating at j2solutions.net (Jesse Keating) Date: Thu, 17 Mar 2005 11:53:55 -0800 Subject: Openness: Apache as a guiding model (was Re: GFS removed??? ) In-Reply-To: <20050317194146.GD6398@neu.nirvana> References: <20050317162605.GD16763@angus.ind.WPI.EDU> <20050317173625.GV21731@neu.nirvana> <604aa791050317094841279f51@mail.gmail.com> <20050317180249.GZ21731@neu.nirvana> <604aa791050317104261c98955@mail.gmail.com> <20050317191235.GE21731@neu.nirvana> <1111087116.31967.102.camel@jkeating2.hq.pogolinux.com> <20050317192542.GA6398@neu.nirvana> <1111087689.31967.105.camel@jkeating2.hq.pogolinux.com> <1111087811.31967.108.camel@jkeating2.hq.pogolinux.com> <20050317194146.GD6398@neu.nirvana> Message-ID: <1111089235.31967.131.camel@jkeating2.hq.pogolinux.com> On Thu, 2005-03-17 at 20:41 +0100, Axel Thimm wrote: > This sounds more like fedora-packaging, or would you have a > distinctive mark for the differences fedora-packaging vs > fedora-maintainers (the former being a normal open list). Yes, there > are too many lists at Fedora and making them closed or read-only does > not help. Not exactly. Fedora-packaging was a list space tossed up to discuss/create an authoritative packaging guideline for Core/Extras/Legacy/etc.. Again, smaller the number of participants w/ stakes the faster decisions can be made and implemented. Not all the maintainers are interested in such discussion, so why add noise? A lot of maintainers just want a guideline to be created, so they can follow it. Different topics. Personally, I like that the lists for Fedora are being clearly segregated. This allows me to keep better track of the subjects I actually care about by subscribing only to those lists. Big general lists mean that I have to sift through tons of email I care not about to find (and usually miss) something I DO care about. -- Jesse Keating RHCE (geek.j2solutions.net) Fedora Legacy Team (www.fedoralegacy.org) GPG Public Key (geek.j2solutions.net/jkeating.j2solutions.pub) Was I helpful? Let others know: http://svcs.affero.net/rm.php?r=jkeating From skvidal at phy.duke.edu Thu Mar 17 20:01:34 2005 From: skvidal at phy.duke.edu (seth vidal) Date: Thu, 17 Mar 2005 15:01:34 -0500 Subject: Openness: Apache as a guiding model (was Re: GFS removed??? ) In-Reply-To: <20050317194642.GE6398@neu.nirvana> References: <20050317162605.GD16763@angus.ind.WPI.EDU> <20050317173625.GV21731@neu.nirvana> <604aa791050317094841279f51@mail.gmail.com> <20050317180249.GZ21731@neu.nirvana> <604aa791050317104261c98955@mail.gmail.com> <20050317191235.GE21731@neu.nirvana> <1111087400.17429.260.camel@arena.soho.bytebot.net> <20050317193121.GB6398@neu.nirvana> <604aa791050317113458343607@mail.gmail.com> <20050317194642.GE6398@neu.nirvana> Message-ID: <1111089694.24344.16.camel@cutter> > Please stop draining apache into the muds. The realities there are > different altogether. No development list/discussion is closed there. yes it is. go look. Many of their lists are not public. http://apache.org/foundation/mailinglists.html -sv From Axel.Thimm at ATrpms.net Thu Mar 17 20:02:45 2005 From: Axel.Thimm at ATrpms.net (Axel Thimm) Date: Thu, 17 Mar 2005 21:02:45 +0100 Subject: Openness: Apache as a guiding model (was Re: GFS removed??? ) In-Reply-To: <1111089235.31967.131.camel@jkeating2.hq.pogolinux.com> References: <604aa791050317094841279f51@mail.gmail.com> <20050317180249.GZ21731@neu.nirvana> <604aa791050317104261c98955@mail.gmail.com> <20050317191235.GE21731@neu.nirvana> <1111087116.31967.102.camel@jkeating2.hq.pogolinux.com> <20050317192542.GA6398@neu.nirvana> <1111087689.31967.105.camel@jkeating2.hq.pogolinux.com> <1111087811.31967.108.camel@jkeating2.hq.pogolinux.com> <20050317194146.GD6398@neu.nirvana> <1111089235.31967.131.camel@jkeating2.hq.pogolinux.com> Message-ID: <20050317200245.GG6398@neu.nirvana> On Thu, Mar 17, 2005 at 11:53:55AM -0800, Jesse Keating wrote: > On Thu, 2005-03-17 at 20:41 +0100, Axel Thimm wrote: > > This sounds more like fedora-packaging, or would you have a > > distinctive mark for the differences fedora-packaging vs > > fedora-maintainers (the former being a normal open list). Yes, there > > are too many lists at Fedora and making them closed or read-only does > > not help. > > Not exactly. Fedora-packaging was a list space tossed up to > discuss/create an authoritative packaging guideline for > Core/Extras/Legacy/etc.. OK, then I guess the discussion should have happened there and not fedora-maintainers. > Again, smaller the number of participants w/ stakes the faster > decisions can be made and implemented. Not all the maintainers are > interested in such discussion, so why add noise? A lot of > maintainers just want a guideline to be created, so they can follow > it. Different topics. > > Personally, I like that the lists for Fedora are being clearly > segregated. This allows me to keep better track of the subjects I > actually care about by subscribing only to those lists. Big general > lists mean that I have to sift through tons of email I care not about to > find (and usually miss) something I DO care about. > -- Axel.Thimm at ATrpms.net -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: not available URL: From ihok at hotmail.com Thu Mar 17 20:14:55 2005 From: ihok at hotmail.com (Jack Tanner) Date: Thu, 17 Mar 2005 15:14:55 -0500 Subject: packages list Message-ID: The list of files in rpms is one of the handiest services available from rhn.redhat.com. I'll die and go to heaven if the dependency info's there too. The basic reason is that it makes it trivial to look up things without logging into your PC, or if your PC is down, or if you're not running that particular version of Fedora, etc. You could search across the files of all packages, just for the price of getting indexed by Google. It'd be nice if the complete file attributes were there, including permissions, size and modification time. Imagine if there were a checksum there, too: "Hm, my system might be 0wned. I wonder what the authoritative metadata is for these files." Imagine if you could compare how the list of files in an rpm changed during the rpm's history... At the risk of sounding like a a tard Barlow, this is a case of "information wants to be free." You have no idea what kind of uses people might have for this information. A web interface to it would be really great. Otherwise, rpmdb turns into "the deep web." From jspaleta at gmail.com Thu Mar 17 20:17:30 2005 From: jspaleta at gmail.com (Jeff Spaleta) Date: Thu, 17 Mar 2005 15:17:30 -0500 Subject: Openness: Apache as a guiding model (was Re: GFS removed??? ) In-Reply-To: <20050317194642.GE6398@neu.nirvana> References: <20050317173625.GV21731@neu.nirvana> <604aa791050317094841279f51@mail.gmail.com> <20050317180249.GZ21731@neu.nirvana> <604aa791050317104261c98955@mail.gmail.com> <20050317191235.GE21731@neu.nirvana> <1111087400.17429.260.camel@arena.soho.bytebot.net> <20050317193121.GB6398@neu.nirvana> <604aa791050317113458343607@mail.gmail.com> <20050317194642.GE6398@neu.nirvana> Message-ID: <604aa79105031712173de55fb3@mail.gmail.com> On Thu, 17 Mar 2005 20:46:42 +0100, Axel Thimm wrote: > I don't want to sign any agreement to be able to express my opinions, > especially when they are unrelated to what the issue is about ... ?!?! I believe you are freely expressing your opinions.. on this list.. without a problem. And you are able to subscribe to the read-only list and follow maintainer discussions. As maintainer discussions develop and you feel you have something to say... you can either talk directly with a maintainer privately(if you have a good working relationship with that maintainer, I would imagine private email to voice your opinions could be very effective) or bring it up here for wider discussion. And I equally firmly believe that people who are subscribed to this list as well as the fedora-maintainer list will evaluate the merit of your opinions and incorporate the salient information you provide in whatever on-going discussion the maintainers are having among themselves and reach a consensous among themselves. How maintainers inside Core and Extras decide to deal with kernel modules..is one such discussion. I'm sure as we move forward, if you continue to decline the opportunity to become an Extras maintainer, you will have opinions about many other discussions the fedora contributors want to reach concensous on inside the scope of the Fedora process. I think history has proven that you'll find a way to express those opinions. I have complete faith that you will truimph in all such future endeavors to voice your concerns. If you are under the assumption that opinions stated here will go unnoticed, thats a problem. Let me correct that problem now. I can absolutely garuntee you that your opinions have been noticed and individual maintainers who are subscribed to both lists are aware of your opinions. Whether or not maintainers who are listening to the -devel-list incorporate your ideas, or bring them to the maintainers-only list for infrastructure discussion is a personal decision each maintainer will make on an invidual basis. But be assured, -devel-list is not completely ignored, there are maintainers who make an effort to watch discussion in this list. And I'm sure as time goes on, how feedback about specific the maintainership is handled will evolve. But, again, people who commit to becoming contributors inside the process have a more direct impact on discussion with a seat at the decision making table. -jef"like sands through an hourglass...so are the days of our lives"spaleta From kyrre at solution-forge.net Thu Mar 17 21:38:51 2005 From: kyrre at solution-forge.net (Kyrre Ness Sjobak) Date: Thu, 17 Mar 2005 22:38:51 +0100 Subject: Video Problems [Re: Old kernel RPMS ] In-Reply-To: <1111076951.3415.17.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> References: <1110703151.3170.7.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> <1110703923.6278.38.camel@laptopd505.fenrus.org> <1110715889.3170.25.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> <200503131308.42776.ml-fedora@fathomssen.de> <1110716790.3170.31.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> <604aa79105031309462ea47e82@mail.gmail.com> <1110738973.31728.18.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> <1111076951.3415.17.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> Message-ID: <1111095531.3353.46.camel@localhost.localdomain> tor, 17.03.2005 kl. 17.29 skrev Ivan Gyurdiev: > > ... I do not believe I have enough information at this point > > to file a valuable bug report. I wanted to test old kernels > > to determine the point of failure first. I also wanted to know > > whether problems can arise from the interaction between gcc4-compiled > > kernel, and binary kernel modules, and felt that the list was a more > > appropriate place to ask this question. > > Okay, I have some more info now. More importantly, I think I have a > reproducible test case. > > Setup > ================================================================ > I haven't had time to go look for old kernels and test, however > I can confirm the crash I am dealing with occurs on kernels 1171-1177. > I couldn't get 1170 to boot. I am experiencing instability with BOTH > the nv open source driver, and the nvidia closed source driver. > Additionally I am running X with the RENDER extension. I tried > turning that off, and it makes no difference. Given the reproducible > behavior, I think overheating is an unlikely source of the problem. > It is possible I am dealing with another type of hardware failure, but > I'd like to think not, since the hardware is rather new. > > Types of Crashes > =============================== > Crash 1: Garbage displayed on screen... diagonal waves or some other > nonsense > > Crash 2: Monitor goes to standby (or whatever it's called that it does > when it's switching resolutions, like before starting X). > > The above two occur with the nv driver. System does not respond to > sysrq. > > Crash 3: Random freeze in the middle of what I'm doing. Screen freezes > to a standstill. System responds to sysrq. Sysrq-p shows X to be active. > I can provide more info if you'd like. > > This occurs with the nvidia binary driver. I experienced *exactly* those things when i used a Voodo 3 PCI card (lines rolling across monitor etc) - but the system didn't actually *crash*, i was (sometimes, at least) able to ssh into it, and reboot it. I think i was also able to (blindly) switch to a viritual console and hit control+alt+del. I personally blamed this on the card, as the problem went away the moment i switched it for a nvidia geforce 2 Mx pci. This was during late FC1 days. Kyrre From thomas.hille at nightsabers.org Thu Mar 17 22:13:13 2005 From: thomas.hille at nightsabers.org (Thomas Hille) Date: Thu, 17 Mar 2005 23:13:13 +0100 Subject: Video Problems [Re: Old kernel RPMS ] In-Reply-To: <1111076951.3415.17.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> References: <1110703151.3170.7.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> <1110703923.6278.38.camel@laptopd505.fenrus.org> <1110715889.3170.25.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> <200503131308.42776.ml-fedora@fathomssen.de> <1110716790.3170.31.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> <604aa79105031309462ea47e82@mail.gmail.com> <1110738973.31728.18.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> <1111076951.3415.17.camel@cobra.ivg2.net> Message-ID: <1111097593.27320.58.camel@ice-dragon.ddn.de> Am Donnerstag, den 17.03.2005, 11:29 -0500 schrieb Ivan Gyurdiev: > Crash 3: Random freeze in the middle of what I'm doing. Screen freezes > to a standstill. System responds to sysrq. Sysrq-p shows X to be active. > I can provide more info if you'd like. > > This occurs with the nvidia binary driver. > > I had the exact same behavior, I first thought it was some update, but I finally resolved it being the chipset getting too hot. Installing an additional fan resolved it. - And believe me, I _NEVER_ would have thought the chipset could overheat 5 minutes after boot and the other time it worked for days without a reboot. Especially while my board, a tyan thunder, was said to be extremely stable. (well now it is: uptime 15 days, no reboot in sight) Thomas From riel at redhat.com Thu Mar 17 22:30:56 2005 From: riel at redhat.com (Rik van Riel) Date: Thu, 17 Mar 2005 17:30:56 -0500 (EST) Subject: Xen SMP bug + workaround Message-ID: Hi, today's Xen RPM is broken, in that it doesn't boot on SMP systems and/or systems with HT CPUs. The obvious workaround is to boot xen with 'nosmp'. I'll try to get the bug sorted out with the upstream Xen maintainers. -- "Debugging is twice as hard as writing the code in the first place. Therefore, if you write the code as cleverly as possible, you are, by definition, not smart enough to debug it." - Brian W. Kernighan From nman64 at n-man.com Thu Mar 17 23:32:59 2005 From: nman64 at n-man.com (Patrick Barnes) Date: Thu, 17 Mar 2005 17:32:59 -0600 Subject: Firefox search plugin for RH's Bugzilla available Message-ID: <423A13AB.10408@n-man.com> This might be considered off-topic, but for all those who are interested, I have produced a search plugin for Firefox that allows quick searching of Red Hat's Bugzilla through Google. It could be quite handy for searching existing bugs. Get it from http://fedora.n-man.com/ -Patrick "The N-Man" Barnes nman64 at n-man.com From ghenry at suretecsystems.com Thu Mar 17 23:46:53 2005 From: ghenry at suretecsystems.com (Gavin Henry) Date: Thu, 17 Mar 2005 23:46:53 +0000 Subject: Firefox search plugin for RH's Bugzilla available In-Reply-To: <423A13AB.10408@n-man.com> References: <423A13AB.10408@n-man.com> Message-ID: <200503172346.54389.ghenry@suretecsystems.com> On Thursday 17 Mar 2005 23:32, Patrick Barnes wrote: > This might be considered off-topic, but for all those who are > interested, I have produced a search plugin for Firefox that allows > quick searching of Red Hat's Bugzilla through Google. It could be quite > handy for searching existing bugs. > > Get it from http://fedora.n-man.com/ I'll give this a try ;-) > > -Patrick "The N-Man" Barnes > nman64 at n-man.com -- Kind Regards, Gavin Henry. Managing Director. T +44 (0) 1224 279484 M +44 (0) 7930 323266 F +44 (0) 1224 742001 E ghenry at suretecsystems.com Open Source. Open Solutions(tm). http://www.suretecsystems.com/ From steve at silug.org Fri Mar 18 00:01:01 2005 From: steve at silug.org (Steven Pritchard) Date: Thu, 17 Mar 2005 18:01:01 -0600 Subject: Xen SMP bug + workaround In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20050318000101.GA20302@osiris.silug.org> On Thu, Mar 17, 2005 at 05:30:56PM -0500, Rik van Riel wrote: > today's Xen RPM is broken, in that it doesn't boot on SMP > systems and/or systems with HT CPUs. The obvious workaround > is to boot xen with 'nosmp'. This isn't new breakage, is it? I haven't been able to boot my dual PIII test box with Xen for a while now... (Of course I hadn't thought of "nosmp", which works as expected.) Steve -- Steven Pritchard - K&S Pritchard Enterprises, Inc. Email: steve at kspei.com http://www.kspei.com/ Phone: (618)398-3000 Mobile: (618)567-7320 From byte at aeon.com.my Fri Mar 18 00:08:23 2005 From: byte at aeon.com.my (Colin Charles) Date: Fri, 18 Mar 2005 11:08:23 +1100 Subject: Openness: Apache as a guiding model (was Re: GFS removed??? ) In-Reply-To: <20050317195257.GF6398@neu.nirvana> References: <20050317162605.GD16763@angus.ind.WPI.EDU> <20050317173625.GV21731@neu.nirvana> <604aa791050317094841279f51@mail.gmail.com> <20050317180249.GZ21731@neu.nirvana> <604aa791050317104261c98955@mail.gmail.com> <20050317191235.GE21731@neu.nirvana> <1111087400.17429.260.camel@arena.soho.bytebot.net> <20050317193121.GB6398@neu.nirvana> <1111088532.31967.122.camel@jkeating2.hq.pogolinux.com> <20050317195257.GF6398@neu.nirvana> Message-ID: <1111104503.17429.280.camel@arena.soho.bytebot.net> On Thu, 2005-03-17 at 20:52 +0100, Axel Thimm wrote: > OK, fine with me. You are loosing significant input (I'm not the only > 3rd party repo maintainer that ist staying out of closed doors), but I > hope you'll get to a decent result anyhow. If you are talking about packaging guidelines and want to further provide input, please use fedora-packaging list Maybe it was an oversight for Ville to post to fedora-maintainers, but if you had been reading the readonly copy of that list, you'd have definitely been able to spot such a grave error, and move said discussion to -packaging > Let's close this thread before someone mentiones that discussion moved > to a closed list due to moise levels here (not noting that the noise This is not a development related discussion, but more a problem you find in the way the project is run. fedora-list might be a better avenue for this, but you're right, its getting seriously off-topic for a development list > was not generated by joe-bob, but by the main actors ...) Surely you're not gender biased towards actresses -- Colin Charles, byte at aeon.com.my http://www.bytebot.net/ "First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win." -- Mohandas Gandhi From symbiont at berlios.de Fri Mar 18 01:32:00 2005 From: symbiont at berlios.de (Jeff Pitman) Date: Fri, 18 Mar 2005 09:32:00 +0800 Subject: FUDCON 1 In-Reply-To: <20050317162137.GB19503@jadzia.bu.edu> References: <1111011152.8014.20.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1111011444.30523.76.camel@opus.phy.duke.edu> <20050317162137.GB19503@jadzia.bu.edu> Message-ID: <200503180932.00575.symbiont@berlios.de> On Friday 18 March 2005 00:21, Matthew Miller wrote: > How is this numbering going to work? We're all packagers here! Maybe it should be a release tag. Or use some pre-release tag scheme. I don't know, something like: 0.fdr.1-2005 and then increment: 0.fdr.2-2005. -- -jeff From jos at xos.nl Fri Mar 18 01:47:10 2005 From: jos at xos.nl (Jos Vos) Date: Fri, 18 Mar 2005 02:47:10 +0100 Subject: FUDCON 1 In-Reply-To: <200503180932.00575.symbiont@berlios.de>; from symbiont@berlios.de on Fri, Mar 18, 2005 at 09:32:00AM +0800 References: <1111011152.8014.20.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1111011444.30523.76.camel@opus.phy.duke.edu> <20050317162137.GB19503@jadzia.bu.edu> <200503180932.00575.symbiont@berlios.de> Message-ID: <20050318024710.A32507@xos037.xos.nl> On Fri, Mar 18, 2005 at 09:32:00AM +0800, Jeff Pitman wrote: > We're all packagers here! Maybe it should be a release tag. Or use some > pre-release tag scheme. I don't know, something like: 0.fdr.1-2005 > and then increment: 0.fdr.2-2005. Let's not forget to use "epoch" to make these versions not *too* understandable for most people! ;-) -- -- Jos Vos -- X/OS Experts in Open Systems BV | Phone: +31 20 6938364 -- Amsterdam, The Netherlands | Fax: +31 20 6948204 From mattdm at mattdm.org Fri Mar 18 02:48:03 2005 From: mattdm at mattdm.org (Matthew Miller) Date: Thu, 17 Mar 2005 21:48:03 -0500 Subject: FUDCON 1 In-Reply-To: <200503180932.00575.symbiont@berlios.de> References: <1111011152.8014.20.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1111011444.30523.76.camel@opus.phy.duke.edu> <20050317162137.GB19503@jadzia.bu.edu> <200503180932.00575.symbiont@berlios.de> Message-ID: <20050318024803.GB5874@jadzia.bu.edu> On Fri, Mar 18, 2005 at 09:32:00AM +0800, Jeff Pitman wrote: > On Friday 18 March 2005 00:21, Matthew Miller wrote: > > How is this numbering going to work? > We're all packagers here! Maybe it should be a release tag. Or use some > pre-release tag scheme. I don't know, something like: 0.fdr.1-2005 > and then increment: 0.fdr.2-2005. Great suggestion. Of course, since we already had "1", we'll have to set Epoch. -- Matthew Miller mattdm at mattdm.org Boston University Linux ------> From dag at wieers.com Fri Mar 18 02:54:31 2005 From: dag at wieers.com (Dag Wieers) Date: Fri, 18 Mar 2005 03:54:31 +0100 (CET) Subject: Openness: Apache as a guiding model (was Re: GFS removed??? ) In-Reply-To: <1111104503.17429.280.camel@arena.soho.bytebot.net> References: <20050317162605.GD16763@angus.ind.WPI.EDU> <20050317173625.GV21731@neu.nirvana> <604aa791050317094841279f51@mail.gmail.com> <20050317180249.GZ21731@neu.nirvana> <604aa791050317104261c98955@mail.gmail.com> <20050317191235.GE21731@neu.nirvana> <1111087400.17429.260.camel@arena.soho.bytebot.net> <20050317193121.GB6398@neu.nirvana> <1111088532.31967.122.camel@jkeating2.hq.pogolinux.com> <20050317195257.GF6398@neu.nirvana> <1111104503.17429.280.camel@arena.soho.bytebot.net> Message-ID: On Fri, 18 Mar 2005, Colin Charles wrote: > On Thu, 2005-03-17 at 20:52 +0100, Axel Thimm wrote: > > OK, fine with me. You are loosing significant input (I'm not the only > > 3rd party repo maintainer that ist staying out of closed doors), but I > > hope you'll get to a decent result anyhow. > > If you are talking about packaging guidelines and want to further > provide input, please use fedora-packaging list > > Maybe it was an oversight for Ville to post to fedora-maintainers, but > if you had been reading the readonly copy of that list, you'd have > definitely been able to spot such a grave error, and move said > discussion to -packaging Colin, Ville was kind enough to inform us (Axel and me) about the ongoing kernel-module packaging discussion on fedora-maintainers and wanted us to be involved a few weeks ago. Apparently it was not possible to move this discussion to fedora-packaging and it wasn't possible for Axel to provide input on fedora-maintainers, as it was closed. (Not sure whether it was already read-only back then as I was told it was closed) I'm not that much involved, except that I talk in defense of Axel. He was being blamed for having an unacceptable implementation because it wasn't based on consensus. It would have been more honest if was said that it wasn't acceptable because Axel does not belong to the fedora maintainers. As that's a requirement to join the discussion. I don't think he even has had the opportunity to display his solution. Everything else has been a fluff of hot air, politics and prejudice. There's no reason for blaming Axel now that he didn't try to force the discussion on another mailinglist, while everyone else that responded until now is praising the fact that this is a closed mailinglist and how well it serves the fedora maintainers. I just wonder what would have been said if he did try and force it on another mailinglist. I wonder why Axel still bothers anyhow... -- dag wieers, dag at wieers.com, http://dag.wieers.com/ -- [all I want is a warm bed and a kind word and unlimited power] From geoffocal at optushome.com.au Fri Mar 18 02:55:46 2005 From: geoffocal at optushome.com.au (Geoff O'Callaghan) Date: Fri, 18 Mar 2005 13:55:46 +1100 Subject: s390 install images Message-ID: <423A4332.6010505@optushome.com.au> Hi all, So where can I find the Fedora installer img files... eg. [ ] hdstg2.img 17-Mar-2005 05:18 15M [ ] netstg2.img 17-Mar-2005 05:18 15M [ ] stage2.img That would normally live in http://download.fedora.redhat.com/pub/fedora/linux/core/development/390/Fedora/base/ yes, i know s390(x) aren't official fedora platforms, but I'm happy to have a fiddle and report bugs :-) After hunting I found them on one of the rawhide mirrors, namely http://www.opensourcemirrors.org/linux/fedora/core/development/s390/Fedora/base/ but they seem to have problems... ie. * transferring www.opensourcemirrors.org/l inux/fedora/core/development/s390/Fedora/base/stage2.img to a fd * copied 59473920 bytes to /tmp/ramfs/stage2.img (complete) * mntloop loop0 on /mnt/runtime as /tmp/ramfs/stage2.img fd is 20 * got url ftp://www.opensourcemirrors.org/linux/fedora/core/development/s390 Unable to identify CD-ROM format. VFS: Can't find an ext2 filesystem on dev loop0. and anaconda promptly falls over with... Welcome to the Red Hat Linux install environment 1.1 for S/390 login: root Welcome to the Red Hat Linux install environment 1.1 for S/390 Running anaconda, the Fedora Core system installer - please wait... Traceback (most recent call last): File "/usr/bin/anaconda", line 358, in ? from exception import handleException File "/usr/lib/anaconda/exception.py", line 24, in ? import rpm File "/usr/lib/python2.4/site-packages/rpm/__init__.py", line 7, in ? from _rpm import * ImportError: libssl.so.4: cannot open shared object file: No such file or directory So, my questions are : Where are the real installer .img files for s/390 and where are the mirrors getting their copies from because I can't find the 'original' file on download.fedora.redhat.com -goc- From notting at redhat.com Fri Mar 18 05:27:13 2005 From: notting at redhat.com (Bill Nottingham) Date: Fri, 18 Mar 2005 00:27:13 -0500 Subject: s390 install images In-Reply-To: <423A4332.6010505@optushome.com.au> References: <423A4332.6010505@optushome.com.au> Message-ID: <20050318052713.GA1257@nostromo.devel.redhat.com> Geoff O'Callaghan (geoffocal at optushome.com.au) said: > Hi all, > > So where can I find the Fedora installer img files... eg. > [ ] hdstg2.img 17-Mar-2005 05:18 15M > [ ] netstg2.img 17-Mar-2005 05:18 15M > [ ] stage2.img > > That would normally live in > http://download.fedora.redhat.com/pub/fedora/linux/core/development/390/Fedora/base/ If they're not there, that means they didn't build for some reason. Looking at the logs, it's because there's no s390 kernel. Without that, well.... :) Looks like the last s390 kernel to build was 2.6.10-1.1155_FC4. Bill From mpeters at mac.com Fri Mar 18 07:54:06 2005 From: mpeters at mac.com (Michael A. Peters) Date: Fri, 18 Mar 2005 07:54:06 +0000 Subject: FUDCON 1 In-Reply-To: <1111051893.20402.6.camel@angua.localnet> (from Nigel.Metheringham@dev.intechnology.co.uk on Thu Mar 17 01:31:33 2005) References: <1111051893.20402.6.camel@angua.localnet> Message-ID: <1111132446l.2158l.0l@devel.mpeters.local> On 03/17/2005 01:31:33 AM, Nigel Metheringham wrote: > On Wed, 2005-03-16 at 23:24 +0100, Hornain Frederic wrote: > > Why do not we have a Fedora event in Europe ?... and why not ? One > for each continent? > > FUDCON Antartica now booking - several thousand penguins and maybe > the > occasional human. [No Killer Whales please]. LOL! -- Michael A. Peters http://mpeters.us/ From mpeters at mac.com Fri Mar 18 07:58:33 2005 From: mpeters at mac.com (Michael A. Peters) Date: Fri, 18 Mar 2005 07:58:33 +0000 Subject: FUDCON 1 In-Reply-To: <20050317135902.GA19886@devserv.devel.redhat.com> (from alan@redhat.com on Thu Mar 17 05:59:02 2005) References: <1111011152.8014.20.camel@localhost.localdomain> <20050316233924.A26537@xos037.xos.nl> <20050317135902.GA19886@devserv.devel.redhat.com> Message-ID: <1111132713l.2158l.1l@devel.mpeters.local> On 03/17/2005 05:59:02 AM, Alan Cox wrote: > On Wed, Mar 16, 2005 at 11:39:24PM +0100, Jos Vos wrote: > > Well... London is not really the center of Europe ;-), due to both > its > > geographical position and the fact that it lies on an island. > > Half the people who reside in it don't think London is even in Europe > either ;) Isn't it part of the United States? I mean they are with us whenever we unilaterally act :p -- Michael A. Peters http://mpeters.us/ From davej at redhat.com Fri Mar 18 08:09:23 2005 From: davej at redhat.com (Dave Jones) Date: Fri, 18 Mar 2005 03:09:23 -0500 Subject: s390 install images In-Reply-To: <20050318052713.GA1257@nostromo.devel.redhat.com> References: <423A4332.6010505@optushome.com.au> <20050318052713.GA1257@nostromo.devel.redhat.com> Message-ID: <20050318080923.GA2509@redhat.com> On Fri, Mar 18, 2005 at 12:27:13AM -0500, Bill Nottingham wrote: > Geoff O'Callaghan (geoffocal at optushome.com.au) said: > > Hi all, > > > > So where can I find the Fedora installer img files... eg. > > [ ] hdstg2.img 17-Mar-2005 05:18 15M > > [ ] netstg2.img 17-Mar-2005 05:18 15M > > [ ] stage2.img > > > > That would normally live in > > http://download.fedora.redhat.com/pub/fedora/linux/core/development/390/Fedora/base/ > > If they're not there, that means they didn't build for some reason. > Looking at the logs, it's because there's no s390 kernel. Without > that, well.... :) > > Looks like the last s390 kernel to build was 2.6.10-1.1155_FC4. Right before we cut over to gcc4. The compile hasn't been fixed up for non-tier1 architectures yet. Dave From martin at egholm-nielsen.dk Fri Mar 18 09:01:16 2005 From: martin at egholm-nielsen.dk (Martin Egholm Nielsen) Date: Fri, 18 Mar 2005 10:01:16 +0100 Subject: Running with vm.overcommit_memory=2 In-Reply-To: <4214EB24.50300@tlarson.com> References: <20050217143021.35815547@nausicaa.camperquake.de> <42149DC5.7000903@math.unl.edu> <20050217153249.1dbd35f8@nausicaa.camperquake.de> <1108651092.30182.17.camel@linux.local> <4214EB24.50300@tlarson.com> Message-ID: >> But the kernel has been known to behave strangely when it does not have >> ANY swap space at all. Even 10MB could solve the problem. > That would, then, point to a kernel bug that needs to be fixed. Swap > space is a luxury that not all systems have. Most embedded environments > don't even have disks. > Adding swap isn't a solution--it's a workaround. If, indeed, it *does* > fix your problem, you should include that detail in your bug report. Anything new on this? I'm seeing the same problem - and I'm running embedded, hence no swap possible... BR, Martin Egholm From nicolas.mailhot at laposte.net Fri Mar 18 09:15:33 2005 From: nicolas.mailhot at laposte.net (Nicolas Mailhot) Date: Fri, 18 Mar 2005 10:15:33 +0100 (CET) Subject: Openness: Apache as a guiding model (was Re: GFS removed??? ) In-Reply-To: References: <20050317162605.GD16763@angus.ind.WPI.EDU> <20050317173625.GV21731@neu.nirvana> <604aa791050317094841279f51@mail.gmail.com> <20050317180249.GZ21731@neu.nirvana> <604aa791050317104261c98955@mail.gmail.com> <20050317191235.GE21731@neu.nirvana> <1111087400.17429.260.camel@arena.soho.bytebot.net> <20050317193121.GB6398@neu.nirvana> <1111088532.31967.122.camel@jkeating2.hq.pogolinux.com> <20050317195257.GF6398@neu.nirvana> <1111104503.17429.280.camel@arena.soho.bytebot.net> Message-ID: <12901.192.54.193.35.1111137333.squirrel@rousalka.dyndns.org> On Ven 18 mars 2005 3:54, Dag Wieers a ?crit : > Everything else has been a fluff of hot air, politics and prejudice. Speaking as an innocent bystander (I have never used external kernel module packages nor do I intend to) I concur. Moreover I'm saddened to see all the little walls people are erecting in the project these days, with closed lists, list inflation, etc which are all part of a deliberate attempt by some to keep the outside world from getting involved too closely with the project. Which is not to say Fedora project members have no right to steer it wherever they want, only that it was not what was promised publicly and it starts reeking of the old fedora.us private club mentality. Choosing to ignore Axel's input on this subject is so utterly ridiculous from a technical point of view one can only conclude other considerations are taking over now. -- Nicolas Mailhot From dragoran at feuerpokemon.de Fri Mar 18 13:09:37 2005 From: dragoran at feuerpokemon.de (dragoran) Date: Fri, 18 Mar 2005 14:09:37 +0100 Subject: usb_storage In-Reply-To: <20050316132536.2c968d17@localhost.localdomain> References: <20050316132536.2c968d17@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <423AD311.7010107@feuerpokemon.de> Pete Zaitcev schrieb: >On Wed, 16 Mar 2005 15:22:00 +0000 Paul wrote: > > > >>Any signs of usb_storage being fixed? >> >>I could really do with being able to use my internal card reader... >> >> > >What are you talking about? > >-- Pete > > > just search the list for card reader ..... From buildsys at redhat.com Fri Mar 18 13:10:06 2005 From: buildsys at redhat.com (Build System) Date: Fri, 18 Mar 2005 08:10:06 -0500 Subject: rawhide report: 20050318 changes Message-ID: <200503181310.j2IDA6dw024446@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> New package ircii An Internet Relay Chat (IRC) client. New package python-docs Documentation for the Python programming language. Removed package ufraw Removed package ttfprint Updated Packages: GConf2-2.10.0-1 --------------- * Thu Mar 17 2005 Ray Strode 2.10.0-1 - Update to 2.10.0 * Mon Feb 07 2005 Mark McLoughlin 2.9.91-1 - Update to 2.9.91 * Fri Jan 28 2005 Matthias Clasen 2.9.2-1 - Update to 2.9.2 MAKEDEV-3.19-1 -------------- * Thu Mar 17 2005 Nalin Dahyabhai 3.19-1 - skip over subdirectories in /etc/makedev.d (#150766) instead of spitting out an error (or warning, if -i was used) and quitting OpenIPMI-1.4.11-4 ----------------- * Thu Mar 17 2005 Phil Knirsch 1.4.11-4 - gcc4 rebuild fixes - Added missing gdbm-devel buildprereq arts-8:1.4.0-1 -------------- * Thu Mar 17 2005 Than Ngo 8:1.4.0-1 - KDE 3.4.0 release audiofile-1:0.2.6-2 ------------------- * Thu Mar 17 2005 John (J5) Palmieri - 0.2.6-2 - rebuild for gcc 4.0 audit-0.6.9-1 ------------- * Thu Mar 17 2005 Steve Grubb 0.6.9-1 - Added patch for filesystem watch - Added version information to audit start message - Change netlink code to use ack in order to get error notification cdicconf-0.2-11 --------------- * Thu Mar 17 2005 Akira TAGOH - 0.2-11 - rebuilt control-center-1:2.10.0-1 ------------------------- * Thu Mar 17 2005 Ray Strode - 2.10.0-1 - Update to upstream version 2.10.0 - Add some -Wno-error foo to calm gswitchit cpio-2.6-5 ---------- * Thu Mar 17 2005 Peter Vrabec - rebuild 2.6-5 cracklib-2.8.2-1 ---------------- * Thu Mar 17 2005 Nalin Dahyabhai 2.8.2-1 - update to 2.8.2 cvs-1.11.19-7 ------------- * Thu Mar 17 2005 Martin Stransky 1.11.19-7 - fix NULL pointer comparsion (#63365) dosfstools-2.10-2 ----------------- * Thu Mar 17 2005 Peter Vrabec 2.10-2 - rebuild epic-4:1.0.1-20 --------------- * Thu Mar 17 2005 Peter Vrabec 4:1.0.1-20 - rebuild eruby-1.0.5-5 ------------- * Thu Mar 17 2005 Akira TAGOH - 1.0.5-5 - rebuilt evolution-2.2.1-1 ----------------- * Thu Mar 17 2005 David Malcolm - 2.2.1-1 - 2.2.1 - Updated requirements: * gtkhtml3 from 3.6.0 to 3.6.1 * libgal2 from 2.4.0 to 2.4.1 * eds from 1.2.0 to 1.2.1 - Added rum-time requirement on gnome-vfs2; updated version requirement from 2.0 to 2.4 - The new-mail-notify plugin will not be built for now since the upstream configure test now checks for dbus-glib-1 version <= 0.23.4 (to minimise problems caused by the API change) * Mon Mar 14 2005 David Malcolm - 2.2.0-10 - disabled pilot-link support for now so that we have an evolution package; more patching is needed to get this to work with pilot-link-0.12 * Mon Mar 14 2005 David Malcolm - 2.2.0-9 - another attempt at porting to pilot-link 0.12 evolution-data-server-1.2.1-1 ----------------------------- * Thu Mar 17 2005 David Malcolm - 1.2.1-1 - 1.2.1 * Thu Mar 10 2005 David Malcolm - 1.2.0-3 - Removed explicit run-time spec-file requirement on mozilla. The Mozilla NSS API/ABI stabilised by version 1.7.3 The libraries are always located in the libdir However, the headers are in /usr/include/mozilla-1.7.6 and so they move each time the mozilla version changes. So we no longer have an explicit mozilla run-time requirement in the specfile; a requirement on the appropriate NSS and NSPR .so files is automagically generated on build. We have an explicit, exact build-time version, so that we can find the headers (without invoking an RPM query from the spec file; to do so is considered bad practice) - Introduced mozilla_build_version, to replace mozilla_version - Set mozilla_build_version to 1.7.6 to reflect current state of tree * Tue Mar 08 2005 David Malcolm - 1.2.0-2 - Added a patch to deal with glibc defining a macro called "read" findutils-1:4.2.20-1 -------------------- * Thu Mar 17 2005 Tim Waugh 1:4.2.20-1 - 4.2.20. gconf-editor-2.10.0-1 --------------------- * Thu Mar 17 2005 Ray Strode - 2.10.0-1 - Update to upstream version 2.10.0 gedit-1:2.10.0-1 ---------------- * Thu Mar 17 2005 Ray Strode - 2.10.0-1 - Update to upstream version 2.10.0 gjdoc-0.7.3-1 ------------- * Tue Mar 15 2005 Andrew Overholt 0.7.3-1 - New version. * Wed Mar 09 2005 Andrew Overholt 0.7.2-1 - New version. gnome-desktop-2.10.0-1 ---------------------- * Thu Mar 17 2005 Ray Strode - 2.10.0-1 - Update to upstream version 2.10.0 gnome-doc-utils-0.1.3-1 ----------------------- gnome-menus-2.10.0-1 -------------------- * Thu Mar 17 2005 Ray Strode - 2.10.0-1 - Update to upstream version 2.10.0 gnome-netstatus-2.10.0-1 ------------------------ * Thu Mar 17 2005 Ray Strode - 2.10.0-1 - Update to upstream version 2.10.0 gnome-nettool-1.2.0-1 --------------------- * Thu Mar 17 2005 Ray Strode - 1.2.0-1 - Update to upstream version 1.2.0 gnome-session-2.10.0-1 ---------------------- * Thu Mar 17 2005 Ray Strode - 2.10.0-1 - Update to upstream version 2.10.0 gnome-themes-2.10.0-2 --------------------- * Thu Mar 17 2005 Matthias Clasen - 2.10.0-2 - Include Clearlooks themes, version 0.4 gstreamer-0.8.9-4 ----------------- * Thu Mar 17 2005 Colin Walters 0.8.9-4 - Rebuild to make it through beehive * Thu Mar 03 2005 John (J5) Palmieri 0.8.9-3 - add gstreamer-0.8.9-cast-fix.patch which casts the variable before sending it into the macro - update openjade hack to refrence xml-dtd-4.2-1.0-26 * Thu Mar 03 2005 John (J5) Palmieri 0.8.9-2 - rebuild with gcc 4.0 gtk2-engines-2.6.2-2 -------------------- * Thu Mar 17 2005 Matthias Clasen 2.6.2-2 - Include the Clearlooks engine, version 0.4 gtkhtml3-3.6.1-1 ---------------- * Thu Mar 17 2005 David Malcolm - 3.6.1-1 - 3.6.1 gtksourceview-1.2.0-1 --------------------- * Thu Mar 17 2005 Ray Strode - 1.2.0-1 - Update to upstream version 1.2.0 iiimf-le-chinput-0.3-17 ----------------------- * Thu Mar 17 2005 Warren Togami 0.3-17 - rebuild with gcc4 * Wed Dec 01 2004 Yu Shao 0.3-16 - fix bug 141090, Clear lookup window after switching IC - fix bug 140692, Aux is not up on IA64 * Wed Nov 24 2004 Yu Shao 0.3-15 - fix bug 136135, LE aux window not displayed after switching LE to it java-1.4.2-gcj-compat-0:1.4.2.0-40jpp_13rh ------------------------------------------ * Thu Mar 17 2005 Thomas Fitzsimmons - 0:1.4.2.0-40jpp_13rh - Uncomment rebuild-security-providers. - Require jessie >= 1.0.0-3. jessie-0:1.0.0-3 ---------------- kakasi-2.3.4-19 --------------- * Thu Mar 17 2005 Akira TAGOH - 2.3.4-19 - rebuilt kcc-2.3-24 ---------- * Thu Mar 17 2005 Akira TAGOH - 2.3-24 - rebuilt kdeaddons-3.4.0-1 ----------------- * Thu Mar 17 2005 Than Ngo 3.4.0-1 - 3.4.0 release kdebase-6:3.4.0-1 ----------------- * Thu Mar 17 2005 Than Ngo 6:3.4.0-1 - 3.4.0 release kdelibs-6:3.4.0-1 ----------------- * Thu Mar 17 2005 Than Ngo 6:3.4.0-1 - 3.4.0 release kdepim-6:3.4.0-1 ---------------- * Thu Mar 17 2005 Than Ngo 6:3.4.0-1 - 3.4.0 release kernel-2.6.11-1.1185_FC4 ------------------------ * Thu Mar 17 2005 Rik van Riel - upgrade to latest upstream Xen code * Tue Mar 15 2005 Rik van Riel - add Provides: headers for external kernel modules (#149249) - move build & source symlinks from kernel-*-devel to kernel-* (#149210) - fix xen0 and xenU devel %post scripts to use /usr/src/kernels (#149210) * Thu Mar 10 2005 Dave Jones - Reenable advansys driver for x86 kon2-0.3.9b-26 -------------- * Thu Mar 17 2005 Akira TAGOH - 0.3.9b-26 - rebuilt - fixed a build fails with gcc4. libgal2-2:2.4.1-1 ----------------- * Thu Mar 17 2005 David Malcolm - 2:2.4.1-1 - 2.4.1 libgtk-java-2.6.1-1 ------------------- * Wed Mar 16 2005 Thomas Fitzsimmons - 2.6.1-3 - Import libgtk-java 2.6.1. libselinux-1.23.2-1 ------------------- * Thu Mar 17 2005 Dan Walsh 1.23.2-1 - Update from NSA * Merged destructors patch from Tomas Mraz. * Thu Mar 17 2005 Dan Walsh 1.23.1-1 - Update from NSA * Added set_matchpathcon_flags() function for setting flags controlling operation of matchpathcon. MATCHPATHCON_BASEONLY means only process the base file_contexts file, not file_contexts.homedirs or file_contexts.local, and is for use by setfiles -c. * Updated matchpathcon.3 man page. libsepol-1.5.2-1 ---------------- * Thu Mar 17 2005 Dan Walsh 1.5.2-1 - Update to latest from NSA * Added man page for sepol_check_context. * Added man page for sepol_genusers function. * Merged man pages for genpolusers and chkcon from Manoj Srivastava. libsoup-2.2.3-2 --------------- * Thu Mar 17 2005 David Malcolm - 2.2.3-2 - explicitly enable gtk-doc support * Thu Mar 17 2005 David Malcolm - 2.2.3-1 - 2.2.3 logrotate-3.7.1-9 ----------------- * Thu Mar 17 2005 Dan Walsh 3.7.1-9 - Add selinux_getenforce() calls to work when not in enforcing mode * Thu Mar 17 2005 Peter Vrabec 3.7.1-8 - rebuild lv-4.51-5 --------- * Thu Mar 17 2005 Akira TAGOH - 4.51-5 - rebuilt * Thu Feb 10 2005 Akira TAGOH - 4.51-4 - rebuilt * Tue Jun 15 2004 Elliot Lee - rebuilt metacity-2.9.21-2 ----------------- * Thu Mar 17 2005 Matthias Clasen 2.9.21-2 - Switch to Clearlooks as default theme mkbootdisk-1.5.2-5 ------------------ * Thu Mar 17 2005 Peter Vrabec 1.5.2-5 - rebuild mkinitrd-4.2.4-1 ---------------- * Thu Mar 17 2005 Peter Jones - 4.2.4-1 - don't do vgmknodes at all for lvm * Tue Mar 15 2005 Peter Jones - 4.2.3-1 - use --ignorelockingfailure with lvm commands in the initrd, and only activate the volume / is on. (#151172) namazu-2.0.14-2 --------------- * Thu Mar 17 2005 Akira TAGOH - 2.0.14-2 - rebuilt ncompress-4.2.4-42 ------------------ * Fri Mar 18 2005 Peter Vrabec - rebuilt nkf-2.04-5 ---------- * Thu Mar 17 2005 Akira TAGOH - 2.04-5 - rebuilt nvi-m17n-1.79-20040401.23 ------------------------- * Thu Mar 17 2005 Akira TAGOH - 1.79-20040401.23 - rebuilt openhpi-1.9.2-5 --------------- * Thu Mar 17 2005 Phil Knirsch 1.9.2-5 - Fixed gcc4 rebuild problems * Wed Mar 02 2005 Phil Knirsch 1.9.2-4 - bump release and rebuild with gcc 4 pax-3.0-11 ---------- * Fri Mar 18 2005 Peter Vrabec 3.0-11 - rebuilt perl-3:5.8.6-5 -------------- * Thu Mar 17 2005 Jason Vas Dias - 3:5.8.6-5 - bug 151127: fix to use libresolv instead of libbind (perl-5.8.6-libresolv.patch). * Tue Mar 08 2005 Chip Turner - 3:5.8.6-4 - add patch to put site_perl and vendor_perl before core perl dirs, to allow for overriding modules * Sat Jan 29 2005 Warren Togami - 3:5.8.6-3 - bugzilla: 127025, fix strip warnings perl-Net-DNS-0.48-3 ------------------- * Thu Mar 17 2005 Warren Togami 0.48-3 - reinclude ia64, thanks jvdias policycoreutils-1.23.2-1 ------------------------ * Thu Mar 17 2005 Dan Walsh 1.23.2-1 - Update to version from NSA * Changed setfiles -c to call set_matchpathcon_flags(3) to turn off processing of .homedirs and .local. procmail-3.22-16 ---------------- * Fri Mar 18 2005 Peter Vrabec 3.22-16 - rebuilt procps-3.2.5-3 -------------- * Thu Mar 17 2005 Karel Zak 3.2.5-3 - fix top crashes when terminal window is resized (#149319) pwlib-1.8.4-1 ------------- * Fri Mar 18 2005 Daniel Veillard 1.8.4-1 - Updated to 1.8.4 from gnomemeeting release 1.8.1 - cleanup and update of the spec file pyOpenSSL-0.6-1.p24.4 --------------------- * Thu Mar 17 2005 Mihai Ibanescu 0.6-1.p24.4 - rebuilt rhnlib-1.8-6.p24.1 ------------------ * Thu Mar 17 2005 Mihai Ibanescu 1.8-6.p24.1 - rebuild rwho-0.17-25 ------------ * Thu Mar 17 2005 Phil Knirsch 0.17-25 - gcc4 rebuild fixes * Wed Mar 02 2005 Phil Knirsch 0.17-24 - bump release and rebuild with gcc 4 scrollkeeper-0.3.14-5 --------------------- * Wed Mar 16 2005 David Zeuthen 0.3.14-5 - Fix segfault (#151385) sed-4.1.4-1 ----------- * Thu Mar 17 2005 Jakub Jelinek 4.1.4-1 - update to 4.1.4 sendmail-8.13.3-2 ----------------- * Thu Mar 17 2005 Thomas Woerner 8.13.3-2 - dropped direct support for bind: no bind in confLIBSEARCH anymore, using libresolv again slang-1.4.9-17 -------------- * Fri Mar 18 2005 Petr Rockai - 1.4.9-17 - Patch to compile with gcc4 by Robert Scheck (#151029). (Weeird, probably on march 2nd the used buildroot wasn't updated with gcc4 yet?). star-1.5a54-2 ------------- * Fri Mar 18 2005 Peter Vrabec - rebuilt * Mon Nov 22 2004 Peter Vrabec - upgrade 1.5a54-1 & rebuild * Mon Oct 25 2004 Peter Vrabec - fix dependencie (#123770) system-config-nfs-1.3.0-1 ------------------------- * Thu Mar 17 2005 Nils Philippsen 1.3.0-1 - revamp NFS backend code completely - convert UI to libglade tzdata-2005g-2 -------------- * Thu Mar 17 2005 Jakub Jelinek 2005g-2 - 2005g - fixes for Uruguay - include README and Theory from tzcode tarball in /usr/share/doc; Theory includes a good summary of how the timezone data files are supposed to be named valgrind-1:2.2.0-10 ------------------- * Thu Mar 17 2005 Jakub Jelinek 2.2.0-10 - rebuilt with GCC 4 * Tue Feb 08 2005 Jakub Jelinek 2.2.0-8 - avoid unnecessary use of nested functions for pthread_once cleanup * Mon Dec 06 2004 Jakub Jelinek 2.2.0-7 - update URL (#141873) vnc-4.1.1-3 ----------- * Thu Mar 17 2005 Tim Waugh 4.1.1-3 - Disable render by default (+render turns it back on). w3m-0.5.1-7 ----------- * Thu Mar 17 2005 Akira TAGOH - 0.5.1-7 - rebuilt - w3m-0.5.1-gcc4.patch: applied to fix the build fails with gcc4. (#151136: Robert Scheck) xchat-1:2.4.2-1 --------------- * Thu Mar 17 2005 Christopher Aillon 1:2.4.2-1 - Update to 2.4.2 From skvidal at phy.duke.edu Fri Mar 18 13:18:01 2005 From: skvidal at phy.duke.edu (seth vidal) Date: Fri, 18 Mar 2005 08:18:01 -0500 Subject: FUDCON 1 In-Reply-To: <1111132713l.2158l.1l@devel.mpeters.local> References: <1111011152.8014.20.camel@localhost.localdomain> <20050316233924.A26537@xos037.xos.nl> <20050317135902.GA19886@devserv.devel.redhat.com> <1111132713l.2158l.1l@devel.mpeters.local> Message-ID: <1111151881.30200.41.camel@cutter> > Isn't it part of the United States? > I mean they are with us whenever we unilaterally act :p > Let's stop this thread, please. If you want to talk about politics take it offlist. If you want to talk about fudcon take it fedora-marketing-list. Thanks! -sv From paul at all-the-johnsons.co.uk Fri Mar 18 13:22:44 2005 From: paul at all-the-johnsons.co.uk (Paul) Date: Fri, 18 Mar 2005 13:22:44 +0000 Subject: Q on yum cleanup Message-ID: <1111152164.8014.97.camel@localhost.localdomain> Hi, After yum has done the installs, it performs a cleanup. During the last cleanup (yesterday), I had a minor spike which was caught, but seems to have disrupted yum so that it crashed (anything in a terminal window died - nothing else did though which is plain weird!). What does the cleanup do and will any damage have happened? TTFN Paul -- "It is often said that something cannot be libel if it is the truth. This has had to be amended to 'something cannot be libel if it is the truth or if the bank balance says otherwise'" - US Today -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part URL: From skvidal at phy.duke.edu Fri Mar 18 13:25:47 2005 From: skvidal at phy.duke.edu (seth vidal) Date: Fri, 18 Mar 2005 08:25:47 -0500 Subject: Q on yum cleanup In-Reply-To: <1111152164.8014.97.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <1111152164.8014.97.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <1111152347.30200.45.camel@cutter> On Fri, 2005-03-18 at 13:22 +0000, Paul wrote: > Hi, > > After yum has done the installs, it performs a cleanup. During the last > cleanup (yesterday), I had a minor spike which was caught, but seems to > have disrupted yum so that it crashed (anything in a terminal window > died - nothing else did though which is plain weird!). > > What does the cleanup do and will any damage have happened? > what cleanup are you talking about? what command were you running at the time your terminals died? -sv From paul at all-the-johnsons.co.uk Fri Mar 18 13:28:18 2005 From: paul at all-the-johnsons.co.uk (Paul) Date: Fri, 18 Mar 2005 13:28:18 +0000 Subject: Q on yum cleanup In-Reply-To: <1111152347.30200.45.camel@cutter> References: <1111152164.8014.97.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1111152347.30200.45.camel@cutter> Message-ID: <1111152498.8014.105.camel@localhost.localdomain> Hi, > > What does the cleanup do and will any damage have happened? > what cleanup are you talking about? After yum does the install of the rpms, the next thing it does is to say "cleaning up " > what command were you running at the time your terminals died? yum -y update TTFN Paul -- "It is often said that something cannot be libel if it is the truth. This has had to be amended to 'something cannot be libel if it is the truth or if the bank balance says otherwise'" - US Today -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part URL: From skvidal at phy.duke.edu Fri Mar 18 13:36:38 2005 From: skvidal at phy.duke.edu (seth vidal) Date: Fri, 18 Mar 2005 08:36:38 -0500 Subject: Q on yum cleanup In-Reply-To: <1111152498.8014.105.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <1111152164.8014.97.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1111152347.30200.45.camel@cutter> <1111152498.8014.105.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <1111152998.30200.48.camel@cutter> On Fri, 2005-03-18 at 13:28 +0000, Paul wrote: > Hi, > > > > What does the cleanup do and will any damage have happened? > > what cleanup are you talking about? > > After yum does the install of the rpms, the next thing it does is to say > "cleaning up " > Right, that means it is removing the older version of the package that's still on the system. You need to look at your installed packages: yum list installed and look for duplicates, remove the older packages with: yum remove package-ver-rel.arch -sv From fedora-devel at camperquake.de Fri Mar 18 13:43:56 2005 From: fedora-devel at camperquake.de (Ralf Ertzinger) Date: Fri, 18 Mar 2005 14:43:56 +0100 Subject: Q on yum cleanup In-Reply-To: <1111152998.30200.48.camel@cutter> References: <1111152164.8014.97.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1111152347.30200.45.camel@cutter> <1111152498.8014.105.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1111152998.30200.48.camel@cutter> Message-ID: <20050318144356.073e3b11@nausicaa.camperquake.de> Hi. seth vidal wrote: > and look for duplicates, remove the older packages with: > yum remove package-ver-rel.arch Whenever such things happen, I use this to find duplicates: rpm -aq --queryformat "%{NAME}\n" | sort | uniq -c | grep -v -E " *1 " -- There is only room for so many penguins in any one house. -- Tesla's Diary, Aug 23 2004 From skvidal at phy.duke.edu Fri Mar 18 13:48:49 2005 From: skvidal at phy.duke.edu (seth vidal) Date: Fri, 18 Mar 2005 08:48:49 -0500 Subject: Q on yum cleanup In-Reply-To: <20050318144356.073e3b11@nausicaa.camperquake.de> References: <1111152164.8014.97.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1111152347.30200.45.camel@cutter> <1111152498.8014.105.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1111152998.30200.48.camel@cutter> <20050318144356.073e3b11@nausicaa.camperquake.de> Message-ID: <1111153729.30200.56.camel@cutter> On Fri, 2005-03-18 at 14:43 +0100, Ralf Ertzinger wrote: > Hi. > > seth vidal wrote: > > > and look for duplicates, remove the older packages with: > > yum remove package-ver-rel.arch > > Whenever such things happen, I use this to find duplicates: > > rpm -aq --queryformat "%{NAME}\n" | sort | uniq -c | grep -v -E " *1 " > handy dandy. Cool. -sv From fedora-devel at camperquake.de Fri Mar 18 13:56:32 2005 From: fedora-devel at camperquake.de (Ralf Ertzinger) Date: Fri, 18 Mar 2005 14:56:32 +0100 Subject: Q on yum cleanup In-Reply-To: <20050318144356.073e3b11@nausicaa.camperquake.de> References: <1111152164.8014.97.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1111152347.30200.45.camel@cutter> <1111152498.8014.105.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1111152998.30200.48.camel@cutter> <20050318144356.073e3b11@nausicaa.camperquake.de> Message-ID: <20050318145632.30d76690@nausicaa.camperquake.de> Hi. Ralf Ertzinger wrote: > rpm -aq --queryformat "%{NAME}\n" | sort | uniq -c | grep -v -E " *1 " Oh, and please keep in mind that there are some packages which can be installed multiple times without problems. On my system I have gpg-pubkey, kernel and kernel-devel. -- "There are two major products that come out of Berkeley: LSD and Unix. We don't believe this to be a coincidence." -- Jeremy S. Anderson From jspaleta at gmail.com Fri Mar 18 14:45:01 2005 From: jspaleta at gmail.com (Jeff Spaleta) Date: Fri, 18 Mar 2005 09:45:01 -0500 Subject: Openness: Apache as a guiding model (was Re: GFS removed??? ) In-Reply-To: <12901.192.54.193.35.1111137333.squirrel@rousalka.dyndns.org> References: <604aa791050317104261c98955@mail.gmail.com> <20050317191235.GE21731@neu.nirvana> <1111087400.17429.260.camel@arena.soho.bytebot.net> <20050317193121.GB6398@neu.nirvana> <1111088532.31967.122.camel@jkeating2.hq.pogolinux.com> <20050317195257.GF6398@neu.nirvana> <1111104503.17429.280.camel@arena.soho.bytebot.net> <12901.192.54.193.35.1111137333.squirrel@rousalka.dyndns.org> Message-ID: <604aa791050318064518bbf946@mail.gmail.com> On Fri, 18 Mar 2005 10:15:33 +0100 (CET), Nicolas Mailhot wrote: > Choosing to ignore Axel's input on this subject is so utterly ridiculous > from a technical point of view one can only conclude other considerations > are taking over now. This is completely and utterly wrong. No one is being ignored. Let me be clear... opinions expressed in -devel-list are not ignored. Axel is not being ignored. He's expressed an opinion, its been heard. Whether contributors inside the Fedora project incorporate Axel's ideas into the Extras will be self-evident eventually. From what has been said here, clearly Ville wants to know Axel's opinion.. and if thats the case Ville will most likely incorporate anything he finds useful in any of his contributions to fedora contributor-wide discussions. I would find it rather odd and malicious if Ville now ignored Axel, considering Ville has explicitly desired Axel's input. While the situation hasn't been handled well as it could have in this case, I think what Ville has done to reach-out to people outside the current contributor pool to gather opinions is exactly the correct model that needs to be followed. Maintainers with good working relationships with outside individuals act as advocates for those outside view points for any maintainer-wide discussion about policy and infrastructure decisions. But at the end of the day.. the decision rests on the shoulder of those inside the process. There is a big difference between being ignored and having a seat at the table when its time to make decisions. You can have a measure of influence and input without being at that table. This is especially true, if you have a good working relationship with people inside the process. But if you want to be an active participant when it comes to making a decision, that requires making a commitment to being a contributor inside the project. The longer someone with strongly diverging opinions continues to stand outside the process... the more likely the process will continue to evolve away from what they want. People who choose not to contribute, get less of a say on internal policies. Less say does not equal being ignored. There is a significant distinction between having your opinion heard and being a party to the decision making process. -jef From cra at WPI.EDU Fri Mar 18 14:59:40 2005 From: cra at WPI.EDU (Chuck R. Anderson) Date: Fri, 18 Mar 2005 09:59:40 -0500 Subject: Q on yum cleanup In-Reply-To: <20050318144356.073e3b11@nausicaa.camperquake.de> References: <1111152164.8014.97.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1111152347.30200.45.camel@cutter> <1111152498.8014.105.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1111152998.30200.48.camel@cutter> <20050318144356.073e3b11@nausicaa.camperquake.de> Message-ID: <20050318145940.GA18511@angus.ind.WPI.EDU> On Fri, Mar 18, 2005 at 02:43:56PM +0100, Ralf Ertzinger wrote: > rpm -aq --queryformat "%{NAME}\n" | sort | uniq -c | grep -v -E " *1 " uniq -d or sort | uniq -c | sort -n works nicely too. From paul at all-the-johnsons.co.uk Fri Mar 18 15:12:47 2005 From: paul at all-the-johnsons.co.uk (Paul) Date: Fri, 18 Mar 2005 15:12:47 +0000 Subject: Mono Message-ID: <1111158767.2858.5.camel@localhost.localdomain> Hi, Just to let you know that mono and the other main bits are now all happy with gcc4 - there had been a problem with libgdiplus failing to compile, but that's now been fixed. What is the procedure if I want to adopt it for putting into the extras section? TTFN Paul -- "It is often said that something cannot be libel if it is the truth. This has had to be amended to 'something cannot be libel if it is the truth or if the bank balance says otherwise'" - US Today -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part URL: From skvidal at phy.duke.edu Fri Mar 18 15:35:06 2005 From: skvidal at phy.duke.edu (seth vidal) Date: Fri, 18 Mar 2005 10:35:06 -0500 Subject: Mono In-Reply-To: <1111158767.2858.5.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <1111158767.2858.5.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <1111160106.2378.1.camel@cutter> On Fri, 2005-03-18 at 15:12 +0000, Paul wrote: > Hi, > > Just to let you know that mono and the other main bits are now all happy > with gcc4 - there had been a problem with libgdiplus failing to compile, > but that's now been fixed. > > What is the procedure if I want to adopt it for putting into the extras > section? > 1. be on the right list - fedora-extras, not fedora-devel 2. search the fedora-extras list for the discussion of mono and why it can't go in. -sv From Fedora at TQMcube.com Fri Mar 18 15:47:29 2005 From: Fedora at TQMcube.com (David Cary Hart) Date: Fri, 18 Mar 2005 10:47:29 -0500 Subject: Rawhide NetworkManager Message-ID: <1111160849.32293.23.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> Is NM still dependent upon Bind? Does it still silently clobber resolv.conf? README: At this time, it does not support static IP addresses on network interfaces, and requires DHCP to be used instead. NEWS: Support static IP addresses, Dan Williams I assume that "NEWS" is correct. OTOH then wouldn't it be preferable to use static IPs on the devices? -- ________________________________________________________________________ Kill Spam at the Source: http://www.TQMcube.com/spam_trap.htm Today's Spam Trap Adds: http://www.TQMcube.com/BlockedToday RBLDNSD HowTo: http://www.TQMcube.com/rbldnsd.htm From iago.rubio at hispalinux.es Fri Mar 18 15:48:57 2005 From: iago.rubio at hispalinux.es (Iago Rubio) Date: Fri, 18 Mar 2005 16:48:57 +0100 Subject: Mono In-Reply-To: <1111158767.2858.5.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <1111158767.2858.5.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <1111160938.17480.73.camel@speedy.iagorubio.net> On Fri, 2005-03-18 at 15:12 +0000, Paul wrote: > Hi, > > Just to let you know that mono and the other main bits are now all happy > with gcc4 - there had been a problem with libgdiplus failing to compile, > but that's now been fixed. > > What is the procedure if I want to adopt it for putting into the extras > section? AFAIK there're patent issues with Mono. This has been recently posted by Warren Togami on the Extras list. http://web.archive.org/web/20030609164123/http://mailserver.di.unipi.it/pipermail/dotnet-sscli/msg00218.html Greg DeKoenigsberg posted: "I will bring this issue to counsel once again. I presume that the answer will be the same, but one never knows. Legal issues are tracked at: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/FedoraLegalIssues " It seems it's time to wait for the counsel for an answer. -- Iago Rubio From notting at redhat.com Fri Mar 18 16:44:00 2005 From: notting at redhat.com (Bill Nottingham) Date: Fri, 18 Mar 2005 11:44:00 -0500 Subject: rawhide report: 20050318 changes In-Reply-To: <200503181310.j2IDA6dw024446@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> References: <200503181310.j2IDA6dw024446@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> Message-ID: <20050318164400.GA11393@nostromo.devel.redhat.com> Build System (buildsys at redhat.com) said: > New package ircii > An Internet Relay Chat (IRC) client. Um, we haven't shipped this package since 7.2. Why is it gettting built and updated now? In any case, re-deprecating. Bill From Fedora at TQMcube.com Fri Mar 18 17:34:21 2005 From: Fedora at TQMcube.com (David Cary Hart) Date: Fri, 18 Mar 2005 12:34:21 -0500 Subject: NetworkManager-0.4-3.cvs20050315.3.0 Build Errors Message-ID: <1111167261.32293.29.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> I selected FC3 in the spec and have tried repeatedly to compile. Same error when compiling from source. NetworkManagerDbus.c:992: error: `DBUS_INTERFACE_DBUS' undeclared (first use in this function) NetworkManagerDbus.c:992: error: (Each undeclared identifier is reported only once NetworkManagerDbus.c:992: error: for each function it appears in.) NetworkManagerDbus.c: In function `nm_dbus_init': NetworkManagerDbus.c:1220: error: syntax error before "DBUS_INTERFACE_DBUS" NetworkManagerDbus.c:1225: warning: implicit declaration of function `dbus_bus_request_name' make[2]: *** [NetworkManager-NetworkManagerDbus.o] Error 1 make[2]: Leaving directory `/usr/src/redhat/BUILD/NetworkManager-0.4/src' make[1]: *** [all-recursive] Error 1 make[1]: Leaving directory `/usr/src/redhat/BUILD/NetworkManager-0.4' make: *** [all] Error 2 error: Bad exit status from /var/tmp/rpm-tmp.91237 (%build) -- ________________________________________________________________________ Kill Spam at the Source: http://www.TQMcube.com/spam_trap.htm Today's Spam Trap Adds: http://www.TQMcube.com/BlockedToday RBLDNSD HowTo: http://www.TQMcube.com/rbldnsd.htm From aoliva at redhat.com Fri Mar 18 17:55:54 2005 From: aoliva at redhat.com (Alexandre Oliva) Date: 18 Mar 2005 14:55:54 -0300 Subject: A more efficient up2date service using binary diffs In-Reply-To: <20050317140545.GC19886@devserv.devel.redhat.com> References: <20050315151205.A25119@tiki-lounge.com> <1110933853.27320.44.camel@ice-dragon.ddn.de> <20050316022157.GE28313@angus.ind.WPI.EDU> <1cef3e9505031606061a6e2cbe@mail.gmail.com> <1110983501.6211.29.camel@angua.localnet> <1111049074.3353.13.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1111051720.20402.3.camel@angua.localnet> <1cef3e95050317040716ef0c83@mail.gmail.com> <1111062365.20402.26.camel@angua.localnet> <20050317140545.GC19886@devserv.devel.redhat.com> Message-ID: On Mar 17, 2005, Alan Cox wrote: > On Thu, Mar 17, 2005 at 12:26:04PM +0000, Nigel Metheringham wrote: >> with jigdo templates), and even better the CD images too although it may >> be harder to do this with legacy expectations. Every Fedora >> distribution is currently triplicated - unpacked, CD isos and DVD isos >> all containing the same data. > This looks an interesting MSC project for someone - to write a user space > (FUSE) Jigdofs so you can magic the CD and DVD images out of thin air. The attached scripts could be a starting point. The rsync batch to create the DVD out of the CD isos is only 60MB, and the other way round creates ~15MB files. Reconstructing a tarball of the x86_64 SRPMS given the i386 SRPMS takes about 60MBs too. I have other scripts (not posted) to extract file lists from isos and create rsync-priming isos out of a local copy of rawhide. However, I didn't see much point in pursuing this for this case, given that it's a pain to obtain the exploded tree in the first place, unless you happen to have access to an rsync server offering them. It's far more network-efficient to obtain the isos and then explode them, than the other way round. -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: release-cat2rsync Type: application/octet-stream Size: 4829 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: cat2rsyncbatch Type: application/octet-stream Size: 3313 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- -- Alexandre Oliva http://www.ic.unicamp.br/~oliva/ Red Hat Compiler Engineer aoliva@{redhat.com, gcc.gnu.org} Free Software Evangelist oliva@{lsd.ic.unicamp.br, gnu.org} From kyrre at solution-forge.net Fri Mar 18 18:08:44 2005 From: kyrre at solution-forge.net (Kyrre Ness Sjobak) Date: Fri, 18 Mar 2005 19:08:44 +0100 Subject: Mono In-Reply-To: <1111160106.2378.1.camel@cutter> References: <1111158767.2858.5.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1111160106.2378.1.camel@cutter> Message-ID: <1111169324.3340.0.camel@localhost.localdomain> fre, 18.03.2005 kl. 16.35 skrev seth vidal: > On Fri, 2005-03-18 at 15:12 +0000, Paul wrote: > > Hi, > > > > Just to let you know that mono and the other main bits are now all happy > > with gcc4 - there had been a problem with libgdiplus failing to compile, > > but that's now been fixed. > > > > What is the procedure if I want to adopt it for putting into the extras > > section? > > > > 1. be on the right list - fedora-extras, not fedora-devel > 2. search the fedora-extras list for the discussion of mono and why it > can't go in. > > -sv > I am just wondering: I Java (gcj) can go, then why can't Mono? Microsoft got busted for bringing their own Java... What is the difference? From bdpepple at ameritech.net Fri Mar 18 18:17:27 2005 From: bdpepple at ameritech.net (Brian Pepple) Date: Fri, 18 Mar 2005 13:17:27 -0500 Subject: Mono In-Reply-To: <1111169324.3340.0.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <1111158767.2858.5.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1111160106.2378.1.camel@cutter> <1111169324.3340.0.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <1111169847.19143.1.camel@localhost.localdomain> On Fri, 2005-03-18 at 19:08 +0100, Kyrre Ness Sjobak wrote: > fre, 18.03.2005 kl. 16.35 skrev seth vidal: > > > > 1. be on the right list - fedora-extras, not fedora-devel > > 2. search the fedora-extras list for the discussion of mono and why it > > can't go in. > > > > -sv > > > > I am just wondering: I Java (gcj) can go, then why can't Mono? Microsoft > got busted for bringing their own Java... What is the difference? > This has been discussed. Refer to the archives. /B -- Brian Pepple gpg --keyserver pgp.mit.edu --recv-keys 810CC15E BD5E 6F9E 8688 E668 8F5B CBDE 326A E936 810C C15E -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part URL: From johnp at redhat.com Fri Mar 18 18:24:36 2005 From: johnp at redhat.com (John (J5) Palmieri) Date: Fri, 18 Mar 2005 13:24:36 -0500 Subject: NetworkManager-0.4-3.cvs20050315.3.0 Build Errors In-Reply-To: <1111167261.32293.29.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> References: <1111167261.32293.29.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> Message-ID: <1111170276.6953.17.camel@remedyz.boston.redhat.com> On Fri, 2005-03-18 at 12:34 -0500, David Cary Hart wrote: > I selected FC3 in the spec and have tried repeatedly to compile. Same > error when compiling from source. > > NetworkManagerDbus.c:992: error: `DBUS_INTERFACE_DBUS' undeclared (first > use in this function) > NetworkManagerDbus.c:992: error: (Each undeclared identifier is reported > only once > NetworkManagerDbus.c:992: error: for each function it appears in.) > NetworkManagerDbus.c: In function `nm_dbus_init': > NetworkManagerDbus.c:1220: error: syntax error before > "DBUS_INTERFACE_DBUS" > NetworkManagerDbus.c:1225: warning: implicit declaration of function > `dbus_bus_request_name' > make[2]: *** [NetworkManager-NetworkManagerDbus.o] Error 1 > make[2]: Leaving directory > `/usr/src/redhat/BUILD/NetworkManager-0.4/src' > make[1]: *** [all-recursive] Error 1 > make[1]: Leaving directory `/usr/src/redhat/BUILD/NetworkManager-0.4' > make: *** [all] Error 2 > error: Bad exit status from /var/tmp/rpm-tmp.91237 (%build) > Do you have the latest D-BUS devel packages installed? You should have 0.31. -- John (J5) Palmieri Associate Software Engineer Desktop Group Red Hat, Inc. Blog: http://martianrock.com From Fedora at TQMcube.com Fri Mar 18 18:27:35 2005 From: Fedora at TQMcube.com (David Cary Hart) Date: Fri, 18 Mar 2005 13:27:35 -0500 Subject: NetworkManager-0.4-3.cvs20050315.3.0 Build Errors In-Reply-To: <1111170276.6953.17.camel@remedyz.boston.redhat.com> References: <1111167261.32293.29.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> <1111170276.6953.17.camel@remedyz.boston.redhat.com> Message-ID: <1111170455.32293.36.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> On Fri, 2005-03-18 at 13:24 -0500, John (J5) Palmieri wrote: > On Fri, 2005-03-18 at 12:34 -0500, David Cary Hart wrote: > > I selected FC3 in the spec and have tried repeatedly to compile. Same > > error when compiling from source. > > > > NetworkManagerDbus.c:992: error: `DBUS_INTERFACE_DBUS' undeclared (first > > use in this function) > > NetworkManagerDbus.c:992: error: (Each undeclared identifier is reported > > only once > > NetworkManagerDbus.c:992: error: for each function it appears in.) > > NetworkManagerDbus.c: In function `nm_dbus_init': > > NetworkManagerDbus.c:1220: error: syntax error before > > "DBUS_INTERFACE_DBUS" > > NetworkManagerDbus.c:1225: warning: implicit declaration of function > > `dbus_bus_request_name' > > make[2]: *** [NetworkManager-NetworkManagerDbus.o] Error 1 > > make[2]: Leaving directory > > `/usr/src/redhat/BUILD/NetworkManager-0.4/src' > > make[1]: *** [all-recursive] Error 1 > > make[1]: Leaving directory `/usr/src/redhat/BUILD/NetworkManager-0.4' > > make: *** [all] Error 2 > > error: Bad exit status from /var/tmp/rpm-tmp.91237 (%build) > > > > Do you have the latest D-BUS devel packages installed? You should have > 0.31. No. %define build_fc3 1 %define build_rhel4 0 %define build_fc4 0 %if %{build_fc3} %define dbus_version 0.22 %endif -- ________________________________________________________________________ Kill Spam at the Source: http://www.TQMcube.com/spam_trap.htm Today's Spam Trap Adds: http://www.TQMcube.com/BlockedToday RBLDNSD HowTo: http://www.TQMcube.com/rbldnsd.htm From johnp at redhat.com Fri Mar 18 18:34:46 2005 From: johnp at redhat.com (John (J5) Palmieri) Date: Fri, 18 Mar 2005 13:34:46 -0500 Subject: NetworkManager-0.4-3.cvs20050315.3.0 Build Errors In-Reply-To: <1111170455.32293.36.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> References: <1111167261.32293.29.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> <1111170276.6953.17.camel@remedyz.boston.redhat.com> <1111170455.32293.36.camel@dch.TQMcube.com> Message-ID: <1111170886.6953.22.camel@remedyz.boston.redhat.com> On Fri, 2005-03-18 at 13:27 -0500, David Cary Hart wrote: > On Fri, 2005-03-18 at 13:24 -0500, John (J5) Palmieri wrote: > > On Fri, 2005-03-18 at 12:34 -0500, David Cary Hart wrote: > > > I selected FC3 in the spec and have tried repeatedly to compile. Same > > > error when compiling from source. > > > > > > NetworkManagerDbus.c:992: error: `DBUS_INTERFACE_DBUS' undeclared (first > > > use in this function) > > > NetworkManagerDbus.c:992: error: (Each undeclared identifier is reported > > > only once > > > NetworkManagerDbus.c:992: error: for each function it appears in.) > > > NetworkManagerDbus.c: In function `nm_dbus_init': > > > NetworkManagerDbus.c:1220: error: syntax error before > > > "DBUS_INTERFACE_DBUS" > > > NetworkManagerDbus.c:1225: warning: implicit declaration of function > > > `dbus_bus_request_name' > > > make[2]: *** [NetworkManager-NetworkManagerDbus.o] Error 1 > > > make[2]: Leaving directory > > > `/usr/src/redhat/BUILD/NetworkManager-0.4/src' > > > make[1]: *** [all-recursive] Error 1 > > > make[1]: Leaving directory `/usr/src/redhat/BUILD/NetworkManager-0.4' > > > make: *** [all] Error 2 > > > error: Bad exit status from /var/tmp/rpm-tmp.91237 (%build) > > > > > > > Do you have the latest D-BUS devel packages installed? You should have > > 0.31. > > No. > > %define build_fc3 1 > %define build_rhel4 0 > %define build_fc4 0 > > %if %{build_fc3} > %define dbus_version 0.22 > %endif Ah, NetworkManager has been forked to allow for the migration to the new D-Bus and HAL APIs. The logic for selecting distributions should have been cleaned out of the RPM. They were mainly there to deal with the minor API changes that dbus-0.23 introduced. 0.31 was such a huge change that we needed to fork. -- John (J5) Palmieri Associate Software Engineer Desktop Group Red Hat, Inc. Blog: http://martianrock.com From paul at all-the-johnsons.co.uk Fri Mar 18 18:38:30 2005 From: paul at all-the-johnsons.co.uk (Paul) Date: Fri, 18 Mar 2005 18:38:30 +0000 Subject: Gnome panel menus Message-ID: <1111171110.5407.1.camel@localhost.localdomain> Hi, Anyone else seeing that all except the redhat/gnome menu on the panel have vanished? Is this due to moving to 2.10 of gnome and having to renew the menus or is it something else? TTFN Paul -- "It is often said that something cannot be libel if it is the truth. This has had to be amended to 'something cannot be libel if it is the truth or if the bank balance says otherwise'" - US Today -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part URL: From florin at andrei.myip.org Fri Mar 18 19:04:03 2005 From: florin at andrei.myip.org (Florin Andrei) Date: Fri, 18 Mar 2005 11:04:03 -0800 Subject: fork bomb attack Message-ID: <1111172643.4928.2.camel@stantz.corp.sgi.com> http://www.securityfocus.com/columnists/308?ref=rssdebia Quotes: "I wrote up a very simple bourne shell script on my work machine, which runs Mandrake Linux, and executed it under my non-privileged account. Within seconds, the machine was brought to its knees -- totally crippled and unusable. I stared at my screen in disbelief for a few moments, totally stunned with what had just happened." "I then proceeded to fork bomb every Unix machine I could get my hands on. My FreeBSD server at home shrugged it off (even after inviting other connected users to try), as did my OpenBSD gateway. This, too, is exactly what I expected to happen." "Next, I asked several my associates who use Linux to try it out on their machines, and we didn't have to go far to find more Linux distributions that succumbed to the same painfully effective fork bomb attack. Both Gentoo and Red Hat followed in the footsteps of Mandrake, and each died quicker than you can say "unreasonable default settings." I'll quickly mention here that Debian did not suffer the same fate as the others; congrats to the Debian development team." "For the record, I hope that anyone out there running Linux is just as surprised as I was that this ancient attack still works on the default installation of so many high profile Linux distributions. I personally don't understand how usability can supersede security when the consequences are so grave." -- Florin Andrei http://florin.myip.org/ From davej at redhat.com Fri Mar 18 19:33:26 2005 From: davej at redhat.com (Dave Jones) Date: Fri, 18 Mar 2005 14:33:26 -0500 Subject: fork bomb attack In-Reply-To: <1111172643.4928.2.camel@stantz.corp.sgi.com> References: <1111172643.4928.2.camel@stantz.corp.sgi.com> Message-ID: <20050318193326.GG24385@redhat.com> On Fri, Mar 18, 2005 at 11:04:03AM -0800, Florin Andrei wrote: > http://www.securityfocus.com/columnists/308?ref=rssdebia > > Quotes: > "I wrote up a very simple bourne shell script on my work machine, which > runs Mandrake Linux, and executed it under my non-privileged account. > Within seconds, the machine was brought to its knees -- totally crippled > and unusable. I stared at my screen in disbelief for a few moments, > totally stunned with what had just happened." The only news here is that securityfocus really will print any crap thats submitted. I look forward to the followup article. "I was stunned that I could just pull the power cable out of the wall and Linux would do nothing to prevent this denial of service". man ulimit If we set strict ulimits by default we'd have people writing articles like "Fedora is teh suck, I can't malloc more than xMB in a single process" What's fit for one configuration may not be for another. One size most definitly does not fit all. Dave From fedora-devel at camperquake.de Fri Mar 18 19:37:39 2005 From: fedora-devel at camperquake.de (Ralf Ertzinger) Date: Fri, 18 Mar 2005 20:37:39 +0100 Subject: fork bomb attack In-Reply-To: <20050318193326.GG24385@redhat.com> References: <1111172643.4928.2.camel@stantz.corp.sgi.com> <20050318193326.GG24385@redhat.com> Message-ID: <20050318203739.1f11ca2b@nausicaa.camperquake.de> Hi. Dave Jones wrote: > If we set strict ulimits by default we'd have people writing articles > like "Fedora is teh suck, I can't malloc more than xMB in a single > process" What's fit for one configuration may not be for another. > One size most definitly does not fit all. Especially as the article is quite uninformative about the resource that was exhausted. My FD has a ulimit on the number of processes, and I did not set that, and it has been this way for some time, I think. -- alias person = man From fedora at wir-sind-cool.org Fri Mar 18 20:09:12 2005 From: fedora at wir-sind-cool.org (Michael Schwendt) Date: Fri, 18 Mar 2005 21:09:12 +0100 Subject: fork bomb attack In-Reply-To: <20050318203739.1f11ca2b@nausicaa.camperquake.de> References: <1111172643.4928.2.camel@stantz.corp.sgi.com> <20050318193326.GG24385@redhat.com> <20050318203739.1f11ca2b@nausicaa.camperquake.de> Message-ID: <20050318210912.174d6d99.fedora@wir-sind-cool.org> On Fri, 18 Mar 2005 20:37:39 +0100, Ralf Ertzinger wrote: > Hi. > > Dave Jones wrote: > > > If we set strict ulimits by default we'd have people writing articles > > like "Fedora is teh suck, I can't malloc more than xMB in a single > > process" What's fit for one configuration may not be for another. > > One size most definitly does not fit all. > > Especially as the article is quite uninformative about the resource > that was exhausted. My FD has a ulimit on the number of processes, > and I did not set that, and it has been this way for some time, I think. The default ulimit on max user processes is so high, it doesn't serve as protection. An admin must find much tighter limits to make a box more secure against fork bomb DoS attacks. From gmaxwell at gmail.com Fri Mar 18 20:09:23 2005 From: gmaxwell at gmail.com (Gregory Maxwell) Date: Fri, 18 Mar 2005 15:09:23 -0500 Subject: Regression testing Message-ID: A number of pieces of software included in Fedora have automated regression tests included with their source. I think it would be handy if there was a way to easily install and run these tests in a uniform fashion. One way to accomplish this would be to have the spec optionally build a packagename-regression rpm, which includes the scripts and data needed to perform the automated regression testing. During testing users could choose to install all the available regression rpms, and run the tests. Even a fairly limited set of tests would likely do a good job at finding problems due to lower level infrastructure changes (gcc bugs, glibc, kernel, etc). Furthermore, distribution wide uniform regression testing would encourage the creation of regression test suites for all packages... Right now, no one will likely run a regression suite for 'bc', so no one bothers writing one... but it would get run as part of a distribution wide testing. If all the silly little apps had some basic testing we would be much more likely to catch bugs in the system as a whole. It would also be useful to track the performance of these tests, so that performance regressions on various platforms could be spotted and addressed early on, and not just reactively. Am I totally off the mark here? Has work been done on this front already? From skvidal at phy.duke.edu Fri Mar 18 20:21:07 2005 From: skvidal at phy.duke.edu (seth vidal) Date: Fri, 18 Mar 2005 15:21:07 -0500 Subject: rawhide report: 20050318 changes In-Reply-To: <20050318164400.GA11393@nostromo.devel.redhat.com> References: <200503181310.j2IDA6dw024446@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <20050318164400.GA11393@nostromo.devel.redhat.com> Message-ID: <1111177267.4830.8.camel@cutter> On Fri, 2005-03-18 at 11:44 -0500, Bill Nottingham wrote: > Build System (buildsys at redhat.com) said: > > New package ircii > > An Internet Relay Chat (IRC) client. > > Um, we haven't shipped this package since 7.2. Why is it > gettting built and updated now? In any case, re-deprecating. > can we pull in irssi from extras and drop epic while you're on irc clients? -sv From cmadams at hiwaay.net Fri Mar 18 20:25:10 2005 From: cmadams at hiwaay.net (Chris Adams) Date: Fri, 18 Mar 2005 14:25:10 -0600 Subject: Regression testing In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20050318202510.GA1073925@hiwaay.net> Once upon a time, Gregory Maxwell said: > One way to accomplish this would be to have the spec optionally build > a packagename-regression rpm, which includes the scripts and data > needed to perform the automated regression testing. Some regression tests are designed to be run in the build tree, so building a package is probably not the best way to do this (the OpenSSH tests are this way for example). A better idea would be for the %build or %install stage (as appropriate) to optionally run such tests, so if they fail, the RPM doesn't build. -- Chris Adams Systems and Network Administrator - HiWAAY Internet Services I don't speak for anybody but myself - that's enough trouble. From thesource at ldb-jab.org Fri Mar 18 20:56:00 2005 From: thesource at ldb-jab.org (Lawrence Bowie) Date: Fri, 18 Mar 2005 15:56:00 -0500 Subject: fork bomb attack In-Reply-To: <20050318210912.174d6d99.fedora@wir-sind-cool.org> References: <1111172643.4928.2.camel@stantz.corp.sgi.com> <20050318193326.GG24385@redhat.com> <20050318203739.1f11ca2b@nausicaa.camperquake.de> <20050318210912.174d6d99.fedora@wir-sind-cool.org> Message-ID: <423B4060.1030304@ldb-jab.org> I agree. I think the default is 16384. on RHEL 3, Fedora and SuSE it really slows the server down as a normal user and it takes a few for the server to recover. I guess a "good" security conscience admin. can possibly prevent such slowdown but it would be nice for it to come from the vendor or the community first. :) Thanks, LDB Michael Schwendt wrote: >On Fri, 18 Mar 2005 20:37:39 +0100, Ralf Ertzinger wrote: > > > >>Hi. >> >>Dave Jones wrote: >> >> >> >>>If we set strict ulimits by default we'd have people writing articles >>>like "Fedora is teh suck, I can't malloc more than xMB in a single >>>process" What's fit for one configuration may not be for another. >>>One size most definitly does not fit all. >>> >>> >>Especially as the article is quite uninformative about the resource >>that was exhausted. My FD has a ulimit on the number of processes, >>and I did not set that, and it has been this way for some time, I think. >> >> > >The default ulimit on max user processes is so high, it doesn't serve as >protection. An admin must find much tighter limits to make a box more >secure against fork bomb DoS attacks. > > > From andreas at conectiva.com.br Fri Mar 18 21:01:13 2005 From: andreas at conectiva.com.br (Andreas Hasenack) Date: Fri, 18 Mar 2005 18:01:13 -0300 Subject: fork bomb attack In-Reply-To: <20050318210912.174d6d99.fedora@wir-sind-cool.org> References: <1111172643.4928.2.camel@stantz.corp.sgi.com> <20050318193326.GG24385@redhat.com> <20050318203739.1f11ca2b@nausicaa.camperquake.de> <20050318210912.174d6d99.fedora@wir-sind-cool.org> Message-ID: <20050318210113.GE13068@conectiva.com.br> On Fri, Mar 18, 2005 at 09:09:12PM +0100, Michael Schwendt wrote: > On Fri, 18 Mar 2005 20:37:39 +0100, Ralf Ertzinger wrote: > > > Hi. > > > > Dave Jones wrote: > > > > > If we set strict ulimits by default we'd have people writing articles > > > like "Fedora is teh suck, I can't malloc more than xMB in a single > > > process" What's fit for one configuration may not be for another. > > > One size most definitly does not fit all. > > > > Especially as the article is quite uninformative about the resource > > that was exhausted. My FD has a ulimit on the number of processes, > > and I did not set that, and it has been this way for some time, I think. > > The default ulimit on max user processes is so high, it doesn't serve as > protection. An admin must find much tighter limits to make a box more > secure against fork bomb DoS attacks. What are the limits on the BSD machines he used for his tests? From enrico.scholz at informatik.tu-chemnitz.de Fri Mar 18 21:05:15 2005 From: enrico.scholz at informatik.tu-chemnitz.de (Enrico Scholz) Date: Fri, 18 Mar 2005 22:05:15 +0100 Subject: Regression testing In-Reply-To: <20050318202510.GA1073925@hiwaay.net> (Chris Adams's message of "Fri, 18 Mar 2005 14:25:10 -0600") References: <20050318202510.GA1073925@hiwaay.net> Message-ID: <87acp04qd0.fsf@kosh.ultra.csn.tu-chemnitz.de> cmadams at hiwaay.net (Chris Adams) writes: > Some regression tests are designed to be run in the build tree, so > building a package is probably not the best way to do this (the OpenSSH > tests are this way for example). > > A better idea would be for the %build or %install stage (as > appropriate) Please use %check for such tests. This makes it easy, to bypass them with '--define check\ exit\ 0'; %build or %install would require manual editing of the .spec-file Enrico -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 480 bytes Desc: not available URL: From gmaxwell at gmail.com Fri Mar 18 21:26:42 2005 From: gmaxwell at gmail.com (Gregory Maxwell) Date: Fri, 18 Mar 2005 16:26:42 -0500 Subject: Regression testing In-Reply-To: <20050318202510.GA1073925@hiwaay.net> References: <20050318202510.GA1073925@hiwaay.net> Message-ID: On Fri, 18 Mar 2005 14:25:10 -0600, Chris Adams wrote: > Some regression tests are designed to be run in the build tree, so > building a package is probably not the best way to do this (the OpenSSH > tests are this way for example). Actually, every one that I can think of using has been invoked via make on the source tree... The question then should be, is that really the most correct way to go about testing? I think the reason we see it done that way today is that putting the testing into the makefile is pretty expedient for the developer rather than the code is being compiled with special testing shims (such tests would be of reduced usefulness when were talking about complete system testing anyways, since the shims might conceal compiler bugs for example). It would be useful for packages to use a standardized regression testing framework (something to account for the tests, handle optional/mandatory logic, perform random input testing if requested, etc).. I haven't gone looking, but it seems like something that probably already exists. > A better idea would be for the %build or %install stage (as appropriate) > to optionally run such tests, so if they fail, the RPM doesn't build. Well the performance implications of doing the regression tests for every build may be considerable. ... I wouldn't want to discourage packages from having a nice exhaustive and time consuming set of tests. It would be nice to decouple compiling from testing... For example, if a user has a machine that is misbehaving it might be useful ask them to through it in a regression testing loop overnight with the hope of finding a more consistent way to trigger the bug. Separate regression tests could find their way into the policies of companies and even into purchasing contracts "server must be able complete the entire Fedora Core 5 regression suite, the PostGresSQL regression test must complete within 3 hours" etc.. This could only be a good thing. From shiva at sewingwitch.com Fri Mar 18 21:35:01 2005 From: shiva at sewingwitch.com (Kenneth Porter) Date: Fri, 18 Mar 2005 13:35:01 -0800 Subject: Regression testing In-Reply-To: <87acp04qd0.fsf@kosh.ultra.csn.tu-chemnitz.de> References: <20050318202510.GA1073925@hiwaay.net> <87acp04qd0.fsf@kosh.ultra.csn.tu-chemnitz.de> Message-ID: <3DB1C312833204D29E0830E1@[10.169.6.246]> --On Friday, March 18, 2005 10:05 PM +0100 Enrico Scholz wrote: > Please use %check for such tests. This makes it easy, to bypass them > with '--define check\ exit\ 0'; %build or %install would require manual > editing of the .spec-file What is %check? A standard macro? A standard build stage? Or something new? (I don't recall seeing it mentioned in Maximum RPM.) From enrico.scholz at informatik.tu-chemnitz.de Fri Mar 18 22:47:56 2005 From: enrico.scholz at informatik.tu-chemnitz.de (Enrico Scholz) Date: Fri, 18 Mar 2005 23:47:56 +0100 Subject: Regression testing In-Reply-To: <3DB1C312833204D29E0830E1@[10.169.6.246]> (Kenneth Porter's message of "Fri, 18 Mar 2005 13:35:01 -0800") References: <20050318202510.GA1073925@hiwaay.net> <87acp04qd0.fsf@kosh.ultra.csn.tu-chemnitz.de> <3DB1C312833204D29E0830E1@[10.169.6.246]> Message-ID: <87y8ck371f.fsf@kosh.ultra.csn.tu-chemnitz.de> shiva at sewingwitch.com (Kenneth Porter) writes: >> Please use %check for such tests. This makes it easy, to bypass them >> with '--define check\ exit\ 0'; %build or %install would require manual >> editing of the .spec-file > > What is %check? A standard macro? A standard build stage? A build stage which will be executed after %install. > Or something new? (I don't recall seeing it mentioned in Maximum RPM.) It exists for a while already but was added after Maximum RPM. Enrico -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 480 bytes Desc: not available URL: From ville.skytta at iki.fi Fri Mar 18 22:53:21 2005 From: ville.skytta at iki.fi (Ville =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Skytt=E4?=) Date: Sat, 19 Mar 2005 00:53:21 +0200 Subject: Regression testing In-Reply-To: <87y8ck371f.fsf@kosh.ultra.csn.tu-chemnitz.de> References: <20050318202510.GA1073925@hiwaay.net> <87acp04qd0.fsf@kosh.ultra.csn.tu-chemnitz.de> <3DB1C312833204D29E0830E1@[10.169.6.246]> <87y8ck371f.fsf@kosh.ultra.csn.tu-chemnitz.de> Message-ID: <1111186401.2566.84.camel@bobcat.mine.nu> On Fri, 2005-03-18 at 23:47 +0100, Enrico Scholz wrote: > shiva at sewingwitch.com (Kenneth Porter) writes: > > >> Please use %check for such tests. This makes it easy, to bypass them > >> with '--define check\ exit\ 0'; %build or %install would require manual > >> editing of the .spec-file > > > > What is %check? A standard macro? A standard build stage? > > A build stage which will be executed after %install. > > > > Or something new? (I don't recall seeing it mentioned in Maximum RPM.) > > It exists for a while already but was added after Maximum RPM. In rpm 4.2, that is. Anyway, it has been described in the max-rpm CVS snapshot for some time: http://rpm-devel.colug.net/max-rpm/s1-rpm-specref-scripts.html#S3-RPM-SPECREF-CHECK From terraformers at gmx.net Fri Mar 18 23:10:10 2005 From: terraformers at gmx.net (Lars) Date: Sat, 19 Mar 2005 00:10:10 +0100 Subject: rawhide report: 20050318 changes References: <200503181310.j2IDA6dw024446@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> Message-ID: > gnome-desktop-2.10.0-1 > ---------------------- > * Thu Mar 17 2005 Ray Strode - 2.10.0-1 > - Update to upstream version 2.10.0 when using the new (& verry nice!) clearlooks theme (or any other theme using the gnome icons) there is no icon for "Office" in the menu, because gnome-desktop doesn't provide /usr/share/pixmaps/gnome-applications.png which is used by linking from /usr/share/icons/hicolor/48x48/apps/redhat-office.png provided by gnome-icon-theme. ah and by the way, please give gedit and the bonobo component browser an working icon too :) ps. nice to have rawhide reports in the testing-list now! cheers L From shiva at sewingwitch.com Fri Mar 18 23:21:29 2005 From: shiva at sewingwitch.com (Kenneth Porter) Date: Fri, 18 Mar 2005 15:21:29 -0800 Subject: Regression testing In-Reply-To: <1111186401.2566.84.camel@bobcat.mine.nu> References: <20050318202510.GA1073925@hiwaay.net> <87acp04qd0.fsf@kosh.ultra.csn.tu-chemnitz.de> <3DB1C312833204D29E0830E1@[10.169.6.246]> <87y8ck371f.fsf@kosh.ultra.csn.tu-chemnitz.de> <1111186401.2566.84.camel@bobcat.mine.nu> Message-ID: --On Saturday, March 19, 2005 12:53 AM +0200 VilleSkytt? wrote: > In rpm 4.2, that is. > Anyway, it has been described in the max-rpm CVS snapshot for some time: > http://rpm-devel.colug.net/max-rpm/s1-rpm-specref-scripts.html#S3-RPM-SPE > CREF-CHECK CPAN modules often have a "make test" phase, so that looks like a good enhancement to implement in the RPM::Specfile package. There was a long thread not long ago on the Subversion mailing list about whether end users should run tests when installing from a source RPM (consensus was "yes") so that SRPM could also benefit. (Its tests take quite awhile.) From peter.backlund at home.se Sat Mar 19 01:02:21 2005 From: peter.backlund at home.se (Peter Backlund) Date: Sat, 19 Mar 2005 02:02:21 +0100 Subject: xloadimage Message-ID: <1111194141.5480.0.camel@localhost.localdomain> Just noticed the security update for xloadimage...there's a candidate for deprecation. It doesn't even handle png files! /Peter From naheemzaffar at gmail.com Sat Mar 19 01:35:56 2005 From: naheemzaffar at gmail.com (Naheem Zaffar) Date: Sat, 19 Mar 2005 01:35:56 +0000 Subject: AntiVirus? Message-ID: <3adc77210503181735711e04a0@mail.gmail.com> Since Fedora is supposed to be a general purpose OS, are there any plans to add any type of AV software? I know that virii are not big problems in the linux world, but its better to be prepared (after if linux gets the penetration, attempts will be made...) There is a list of Linux A/V (GPL and commercial) on this site: http://www.linux.org/apps/all/System/Anti-Virus.html However all of the GPL A/V are console based, but one should be chosen as a default install IMO. (which one is probably a packaging-list discussion, however the wider discussion on antivirus software also needs to be addressed, and this IMO is the place.) From cra at WPI.EDU Sat Mar 19 01:46:23 2005 From: cra at WPI.EDU (Chuck R. Anderson) Date: Fri, 18 Mar 2005 20:46:23 -0500 Subject: AntiVirus? In-Reply-To: <3adc77210503181735711e04a0@mail.gmail.com> References: <3adc77210503181735711e04a0@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20050319014623.GE18511@angus.ind.WPI.EDU> On Sat, Mar 19, 2005 at 01:35:56AM +0000, Naheem Zaffar wrote: > Since Fedora is supposed to be a general purpose OS, are there any > plans to add any type of AV software? AV is the wrong solution to the problem. From notting at redhat.com Sat Mar 19 01:57:11 2005 From: notting at redhat.com (Bill Nottingham) Date: Fri, 18 Mar 2005 20:57:11 -0500 Subject: xloadimage In-Reply-To: <1111194141.5480.0.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <1111194141.5480.0.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <20050319015711.GA5217@nostromo.devel.redhat.com> Peter Backlund (peter.backlund at home.se) said: > Just noticed the security update for xloadimage...there's a candidate > for deprecation. It doesn't even handle png files! Have you looked at the devel tree? :) Bill From geoffocal at optushome.com.au Sat Mar 19 02:14:30 2005 From: geoffocal at optushome.com.au (Geoff O'Callaghan) Date: Sat, 19 Mar 2005 13:14:30 +1100 Subject: AntiVirus? In-Reply-To: <20050319014623.GE18511@angus.ind.WPI.EDU> References: <3adc77210503181735711e04a0@mail.gmail.com> <20050319014623.GE18511@angus.ind.WPI.EDU> Message-ID: <423B8B06.7080701@optushome.com.au> Chuck R. Anderson wrote: > On Sat, Mar 19, 2005 at 01:35:56AM +0000, Naheem Zaffar wrote: > >>Since Fedora is supposed to be a general purpose OS, are there any >>plans to add any type of AV software? > > > AV is the wrong solution to the problem. > Maybe so, but if you're using Fedora to 'serve' data for Windows boxes (eg. via Samba) then server based scanning can make sense and therefore requires an AV solution. Personally I use clamav. -goc- From pri.rhl3 at iadonisi.to Sat Mar 19 02:49:15 2005 From: pri.rhl3 at iadonisi.to (Paul Iadonisi) Date: Fri, 18 Mar 2005 21:49:15 -0500 Subject: AntiVirus? In-Reply-To: <423B8B06.7080701@optushome.com.au> References: <3adc77210503181735711e04a0@mail.gmail.com> <20050319014623.GE18511@angus.ind.WPI.EDU> <423B8B06.7080701@optushome.com.au> Message-ID: <1111200555.31995.3.camel@md.local.linuxlobbyist.org> On Sat, 2005-03-19 at 13:14 +1100, Geoff O'Callaghan wrote: > Chuck R. Anderson wrote: > > On Sat, Mar 19, 2005 at 01:35:56AM +0000, Naheem Zaffar wrote: > > > >>Since Fedora is supposed to be a general purpose OS, are there any > >>plans to add any type of AV software? > > > > > > AV is the wrong solution to the problem. > > > > Maybe so, but if you're using Fedora to 'serve' data for Windows boxes > (eg. via Samba) then server based scanning can make sense and therefore > requires an AV solution. Personally I use clamav. Both Chuck and Geoff are correct, IMO. AV is the wrong solution to the *alleged* future problem with Linux viruses. Go read http://www.linuxmafia.com/~rick/faq/index.php?page=virus for a good debunking of that threat, as well as some good entertainment ;-). But something like clamav to protect *Windows clients* in a GNU/Linux based server environment does makes sense. At least until FOSS takes over the world. -- -Paul Iadonisi Senior System Administrator Red Hat Certified Engineer / Local Linux Lobbyist Ever see a penguin fly? -- Try Linux. GPL all the way: Sell services, don't lease secrets From wtogami at redhat.com Sat Mar 19 03:14:21 2005 From: wtogami at redhat.com (Warren Togami) Date: Fri, 18 Mar 2005 17:14:21 -1000 Subject: Regression testing In-Reply-To: References: <20050318202510.GA1073925@hiwaay.net> <87acp04qd0.fsf@kosh.ultra.csn.tu-chemnitz.de> <3DB1C312833204D29E0830E1@[10.169.6.246]> <87y8ck371f.fsf@kosh.ultra.csn.tu-chemnitz.de> <1111186401.2566.84.camel@bobcat.mine.nu> Message-ID: <423B990D.7090501@redhat.com> Kenneth Porter wrote: > --On Saturday, March 19, 2005 12:53 AM +0200 VilleSkytt? > wrote: > >> In rpm 4.2, that is. >> Anyway, it has been described in the max-rpm CVS snapshot for some time: >> http://rpm-devel.colug.net/max-rpm/s1-rpm-specref-scripts.html#S3-RPM-SPE >> CREF-CHECK > > > CPAN modules often have a "make test" phase, so that looks like a good > enhancement to implement in the RPM::Specfile package. > > There was a long thread not long ago on the Subversion mailing list > about whether end users should run tests when installing from a source > RPM (consensus was "yes") so that SRPM could also benefit. (Its tests > take quite awhile.) Quite often software, especially many perl modules, require network tests during "make test". We may need to make a policy for Fedora that such tests *must* be in a %check section, because we may want the the build system to totally disallow network access for security reasons. Warren Togami wtogami at redhat.com From fedora-devel at tlarson.com Sat Mar 19 04:23:31 2005 From: fedora-devel at tlarson.com (Tyler Larson) Date: Fri, 18 Mar 2005 21:23:31 -0700 Subject: fork bomb attack In-Reply-To: <20050318210912.174d6d99.fedora@wir-sind-cool.org> References: <1111172643.4928.2.camel@stantz.corp.sgi.com> <20050318193326.GG24385@redhat.com> <20050318203739.1f11ca2b@nausicaa.camperquake.de> <20050318210912.174d6d99.fedora@wir-sind-cool.org> Message-ID: <423BA943.1050706@tlarson.com> Michael Schwendt wrote: > > The default ulimit on max user processes is so high, it doesn't serve as > protection. An admin must find much tighter limits to make a box more > secure against fork bomb DoS attacks. > Fork bombs have always been of little concern to admins. They do relatively little damage and are completely traceable. The perpetrator does little more than land himself in a lot of hot water. In most cases, the threat of disciplinary action is enough protection--it's not an attack that can be launched anonymously. In the extremely rare case where fork bomb protection is a big enough concern to warrant reducing the process limits, the administrator can impose whatever ulimit he wants. However, this is the exception rather than the rule. From mricon at gmail.com Sat Mar 19 05:09:38 2005 From: mricon at gmail.com (Konstantin Ryabitsev) Date: Sat, 19 Mar 2005 00:09:38 -0500 Subject: fork bomb attack In-Reply-To: <423BA943.1050706@tlarson.com> References: <1111172643.4928.2.camel@stantz.corp.sgi.com> <20050318193326.GG24385@redhat.com> <20050318203739.1f11ca2b@nausicaa.camperquake.de> <20050318210912.174d6d99.fedora@wir-sind-cool.org> <423BA943.1050706@tlarson.com> Message-ID: On Fri, 18 Mar 2005 21:23:31 -0700, Tyler Larson wrote: > Fork bombs have always been of little concern to admins. They do > relatively little damage and are completely traceable. The perpetrator > does little more than land himself in a lot of hot water. In most cases, > the threat of disciplinary action is enough protection--it's not an > attack that can be launched anonymously. I fully agree. We have a very effective way of dealing with fork bombs and other user stupidity and/or misguided maliciousness -- an Acceptable Usage Policy with a Termination clause, and a handy steel pipe to perform the actual termination. If you have a piece of infrastructure that will suffer if a user drains it of resources, then you shouldn't have users logging in to that machine in the first place. If it's a shared resource for users whom you don't entirely trust, then by all means, set up various limits, but I don't think ulimits should be enabled on a default installation. After all, that machine with all its resources is there precisely because someone needs to use it (and in case of physicists -- to abuse it. Badly.). Regards, -- Konstantin Ryabitsev Zlotniks, INC From byte at aeon.com.my Sat Mar 19 07:42:39 2005 From: byte at aeon.com.my (Colin Charles) Date: Sat, 19 Mar 2005 18:42:39 +1100 Subject: rawhide report: 20050318 changes In-Reply-To: <1111177267.4830.8.camel@cutter> References: <200503181310.j2IDA6dw024446@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <20050318164400.GA11393@nostromo.devel.redhat.com> <1111177267.4830.8.camel@cutter> Message-ID: <1111218160.18284.103.camel@arena.soho.bytebot.net> On Fri, 2005-03-18 at 15:21 -0500, seth vidal wrote: > > > New package ircii > > > An Internet Relay Chat (IRC) client. > > > > Um, we haven't shipped this package since 7.2. Why is it > > gettting built and updated now? In any case, re-deprecating. > > > > can we pull in irssi from extras and drop epic while you're on irc > clients? Just to add that the maintainer of epic agreed to drop it and bring irssi instead pvrabec did so: Message-ID: <42231A8A.1080702 at redhat.com> Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2005 14:20:10 +0100 (Tue, 00:20 EST) -- Colin Charles, byte at aeon.com.my http://www.bytebot.net/ "First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win." -- Mohandas Gandhi From buildsys at redhat.com Sat Mar 19 13:04:56 2005 From: buildsys at redhat.com (Build System) Date: Sat, 19 Mar 2005 08:04:56 -0500 Subject: rawhide report: 20050319 changes Message-ID: <200503191304.j2JD4uDK020288@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> New package jsch Pure Java implementation of SSH2 New package jzlib JZlib re-implementation of zlib in pure Java Removed package ircii Removed package ttfonts-indic Updated Packages: ImageMagick-6.2.0.7-2 --------------------- * Wed Mar 16 2005 - 6.2.0.7-2 - Update to 6.2.0 to fix a number of security issues: - Drop a lot of upstreamed patches eel2-2.10.0-1 ------------- * Fri Mar 18 2005 David Zeuthen 2.10.0-1 - New upstream version emacs-21.3-26 ------------- * Wed Mar 09 2005 Jens Petersen - 21.3-26 - rebuild with gcc 4.0 - add emacs-21.3-gcc4.patch for emacsclient * Mon Feb 28 2005 Jens Petersen - 21.3-25 - add tramp-2.1.3 to site-lisp (David Woodhouse, 149703) - move removal of info dir to after its installation - add tramp-init.el to put tramp into load-path * Thu Feb 24 2005 Jens Petersen - 21.3-24 - mark default.el as a noreplace config file (Pawel Salek, 149310) - only set keyboard-coding-system in xterms to fix problem with input Latin characters becoming prefixes and making emacs loop (Eddahbi Karim, 126007) - make emacs-el own its lisp directories - run latex-mode-hook in latex-mode (Martin Biely, 144083) - add emacs-21.3-latex-mode-hook-144083.patch evolution-2.2.1.1-1 ------------------- * Fri Mar 18 2005 David Malcolm - 2.2.1.1-1 - 2.1.1.1 file-roller-2.10.0-1 -------------------- * Fri Mar 18 2005 David Zeuthen 2.10.0-1 - New upstream version gaim-1:1.2.0-1 -------------- * Fri Mar 18 2005 Warren Togami 1:1.2.0-1 - update to 1.2.0 (minor bug fixes) * Mon Mar 07 2005 Warren Togami 1:1.1.4-5 - Copy before modifying prefs.xml gnome-keyring-0.4.2-1 --------------------- * Fri Mar 18 2005 David Zeuthen 0.4.2-1 - New upstream version gnome-vfs2-2.10.0-2 ------------------- * Fri Mar 18 2005 David Zeuthen 2.10.0-2 - Drop a patch that was applied upstream * Fri Mar 18 2005 David Zeuthen 2.10.0-1 - New upstream version gnomemeeting-1.0.2-8 -------------------- * Wed Aug 18 2004 Daniel Reed 1.0.2-8 - remove ExcludeArch * Thu Aug 12 2004 Daniel Reed 1.0.2-7 - ExcludeArch: ppc64 to temporarily work around #129699 * Wed Aug 11 2004 Daniel Reed 1.0.2-6 - remove ExclusiveArch gnomemeeting-1.2.1-1 -------------------- * Fri Mar 18 2005 Daniel Veillard 1.2.1-1 - Update to new version 1.2.1 * Thu Mar 17 2005 Christopher Aillon - 1.2.0-6 - Rebuild hal-0.5.0.cvs20050318-1 ----------------------- * Fri Mar 18 2005 David Zeuthen 0.5.0.cvs20050318-1 - Snapshot from upstream CVS; should fix selinux labeling problems for /etc/fstab entries hal-cups-utils-0.5.3-3 ---------------------- * Fri Mar 18 2005 Warren Togami 1.3.0-2 - Remove unnecessary explicit kernel dep (#146142) - Fixed out of bounds accesses (#131848): Thanks to Steve Grubb for the patch - Adapted iptables-config to reference to modprobe.conf (#150143) - Remove misleading message (#140154): Thanks to Ulrich Drepper for the patch kdeadmin-7:3.4.0-1 ------------------ * Fri Mar 18 2005 Than Ngo 7:3.4.0-1 - 3.4.0 kdeartwork-3.4.0-1 ------------------ * Fri Mar 18 2005 Than Ngo 3.4.0-1 - 3.4.0 kdebindings-3.4.0-1 ------------------- * Fri Mar 18 2005 Than Ngo 3.4.0-1 - 3.4.0 kdeedu-3.4.0-1 -------------- * Fri Mar 18 2005 Than Ngo 3.4.0-1 - 3.4.0 kdegames-6:3.4.0-1 ------------------ * Fri Mar 18 2005 Than Ngo 6:3.4.0-1 - 3.4.0 kdegraphics-7:3.4.0-1 --------------------- * Fri Mar 18 2005 Than Ngo 7:3.4.0-1 - 3.4.0 kdemultimedia-6:3.4.0-1 ----------------------- * Fri Mar 18 2005 Than Ngo 6:3.4.0-1 - 3.4.0 kdenetwork-7:3.4.0-1 -------------------- * Fri Mar 18 2005 Than Ngo 7:3.4.0-1 - 3.4.0 kdepim-6:3.4.0-2 ---------------- * Fri Mar 18 2005 Than Ngo 6:3.4.0-2 - fix broken dependencies on kdepim-devel #151508 kdesdk-3.4.0-1 -------------- * Fri Mar 18 2005 Than Ngo 2:3.4.0-1 - 3.4.0 kdeutils-6:3.4.0-1 ------------------ * Fri Mar 18 2005 Than Ngo 6:3.4.0-1 - 3.4.0 kdevelop-9:3.2.0-1 ------------------ * Fri Mar 18 2005 Than Ngo 9:3.2.0-1 - 3.2.0 kdewebdev-6:3.4.0-1 ------------------- * Sat Mar 19 2005 Than Ngo 6:3.4.0-1 - 3.4.0 libgnome-2.9.1-3 ---------------- * Fri Mar 18 2005 Matthias Clasen - 2.9.1-3 - Fix the build on s390 * Thu Mar 17 2005 Matthias Clasen - 2.9.1-2 - Switch to Clearlooks as default gtk theme, gnome as default icon theme * Thu Jan 27 2005 Matthias Clasen - 2.9.1-1 - Update to 2.9.1 libgnomecups-0.2.0-1 -------------------- * Fri Mar 18 2005 David Zeuthen - 0.2.0-1 - New upstream version; drop patches that are upstreamed libgnomeprint22-2.10.1-2 ------------------------ * Fri Mar 18 2005 David Zeuthen - 2.10.1-2 - Require libgnomecups >= 0.2.0-1 and rebuild * Fri Mar 18 2005 David Zeuthen - 2.10.1-1 - New upstream version; drop the async patches as they are now upstream libgnomeprintui22-2.10.1-1 -------------------------- * Fri Mar 18 2005 David Zeuthen - 2.10.1-1 - New upstream version - drop a patch that was merged upstream libtermcap-2.0.8-41 ------------------- * Fri Mar 18 2005 Nalin Dahyabhai 2.0.8-41 - don't trip over capabilities which end in '^' or '\' - don't accept numbers with '8' or '9' in them as valid octal numbers openh323-1.15.3-1 ----------------- * Fri Mar 18 2005 Daniel Veillard 1.15.3-1 - update of the version from gnomemeeting-1.2.1 - cleanup of the spec file * Thu Mar 17 2005 Christopher Aillon 1.15.2-3 - Rebuild postfix-2:2.2.1-1 ----------------- * Fri Mar 18 2005 Thomas Woerner 2:2.2.1-1 - new version 2.2.1 - allow to start postfix without alias_database (#149657) * Fri Mar 11 2005 Thomas Woerner 2:2.2.0-1 - new version 2.2.0 - cleanup of spec file: removed external TLS and IPV6 patches, removed smtp_sasl_proto patch - dropped samples directory till there are good examples again (was TLS and IPV6) - v2.2.0 fixes code problems: #132798 and #137858 selinux-policy-strict-1.23.3-2 ------------------------------ * Fri Mar 18 2005 Dan Walsh 1.23.3-2 - Allow cups/lpd to bind to a port * Thu Mar 17 2005 Dan Walsh 1.23.3-1 - Update from NSA * Added policy for nx_server from Thomas Bleher. * Added policies for clockspeed, daemontools, djbdns, ucspi-tcp, and publicfile from Petre Rodan. selinux-policy-targeted-1.23.3-2 -------------------------------- * Fri Mar 18 2005 Dan Walsh 1.23.3-2 - Allow cups/lpd to bind to a port * Thu Mar 17 2005 Dan Walsh 1.23.3-1 - Update from NSA * Added policy for nx_server from Thomas Bleher. * Added policies for clockspeed, daemontools, djbdns, ucspi-tcp, and publicfile from Petre Rodan. system-config-bind-4.0.0-4.3 ---------------------------- system-config-nfs-1.3.1-1 ------------------------- * Fri Mar 18 2005 Nils Philippsen 1.3.1-1 - make nohide, mp, fsid options configurable system-config-services-0.8.20-1 ------------------------------- * Fri Mar 18 2005 Nils Philippsen 0.8.20-1 - don't read from /dev/null when restarting xinetd/services to prevent hangs - build toolbar in glade to avoid DeprecationWarnings (#134978) - dynamic, translated column titles for runlevel columns vim-1:6.3.066-1 --------------- * Fri Mar 18 2005 Karsten Hopp 6.3.066-1 - patchlevel 66 From rms at 1407.org Sat Mar 19 12:37:46 2005 From: rms at 1407.org (Rui Miguel Seabra) Date: Sat, 19 Mar 2005 12:37:46 +0000 Subject: fork bomb attack In-Reply-To: <423BA943.1050706@tlarson.com> References: <1111172643.4928.2.camel@stantz.corp.sgi.com> <20050318193326.GG24385@redhat.com> <20050318203739.1f11ca2b@nausicaa.camperquake.de> <20050318210912.174d6d99.fedora@wir-sind-cool.org> <423BA943.1050706@tlarson.com> Message-ID: <1111235867.3582.5.camel@roque> On Fri, 2005-03-18 at 21:23 -0700, Tyler Larson wrote: > Fork bombs have always been of little concern to admins. They do > relatively little damage and are completely traceable. The perpetrator > does little more than land himself in a lot of hot water. In most cases, > the threat of disciplinary action is enough protection--it's not an > attack that can be launched anonymously. They are definitely not of little concern. A fork bomb on the DNS server launched through some other bug would cause some interesting harm. > In the extremely rare case where fork bomb protection is a big enough > concern to warrant reducing the process limits, the administrator can > impose whatever ulimit he wants. However, this is the exception rather > than the rule. Yes. But I don't envisage an user of fedora with 16k processes, do you? I agree that the limit is insanely high. Rui -- + No matter how much you do, you never do enough -- unknown + Whatever you do will be insignificant, | but it is very important that you do it -- Gandhi + So let's do it...? Please AVOID sending me WORD, EXCEL or POWERPOINT attachments. See http://www.fsf.org/philosophy/no-word-attachments.html -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part URL: From ville.skytta at iki.fi Sat Mar 19 14:00:19 2005 From: ville.skytta at iki.fi (Ville =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Skytt=E4?=) Date: Sat, 19 Mar 2005 16:00:19 +0200 Subject: Openness: Apache as a guiding model (was Re: GFS removed??? ) In-Reply-To: <604aa791050318064518bbf946@mail.gmail.com> References: <604aa791050317104261c98955@mail.gmail.com> <20050317191235.GE21731@neu.nirvana> <1111087400.17429.260.camel@arena.soho.bytebot.net> <20050317193121.GB6398@neu.nirvana> <1111088532.31967.122.camel@jkeating2.hq.pogolinux.com> <20050317195257.GF6398@neu.nirvana> <1111104503.17429.280.camel@arena.soho.bytebot.net> <12901.192.54.193.35.1111137333.squirrel@rousalka.dyndns.org> <604aa791050318064518bbf946@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1111240819.8997.84.camel@bobcat.mine.nu> On Fri, 2005-03-18 at 09:45 -0500, Jeff Spaleta wrote: > On Fri, 18 Mar 2005 10:15:33 +0100 (CET), Nicolas Mailhot > wrote: > > Choosing to ignore Axel's input on this subject is so utterly ridiculous > > from a technical point of view one can only conclude other considerations > > are taking over now. > > This is completely and utterly wrong. No one is being ignored. > Let me be clear... opinions expressed in -devel-list are not ignored. > Axel is not being ignored. He's expressed an opinion, its been heard. > Whether contributors inside the Fedora project incorporate Axel's > ideas into the Extras will be self-evident eventually. From what has > been said here, clearly Ville wants to know Axel's opinion.. and if > thats the case Ville will most likely incorporate anything he finds > useful in any of his contributions to fedora contributor-wide > discussions. Right. And sorry about the late reply. I think I could have prevented some of the crap flying around this time by following this list more closer and responding earlier, my bad. > I would find it rather odd and malicious if Ville now > ignored Axel, considering Ville has explicitly desired Axel's input. My goal is the exact opposite of ignoring people who have valuable contributions to the issue at hand. To prevent further guesswork, an essay on political short term history follows. (Regarding the input seen in this thread, I haven't really noticed any that I would consider being in the scope of my RFD, more on that at end of this mail.) There's a lot of IMO's and "I'd like"s here on purpose. Please note that I have absolutely no authority on the issue at hand, just happened to start the discussion this time, and presented my POV. Dams, Thorsten, and I discussed in private mail about importing the fedora.us kernel-module-devel to livna.org since various module packages therein already depend on it, and Extras/Core alone doesn't currently provide "good enough" infrastructure for building those kernel module packages. (Various bits have been already improved in the latest Rawhide kernel(-devel) packages, but there's still room for improvement.) At some point, Warren was brought into the discussion, and he suggested discussing this once more on a mailing list to see if we could find a way to benefit a wider audience instead of just applying a livna.org specific solution. He suggested -maintainers due to the noise involved with these discussions in earlier tries eg. on this list. I wasn't entirely comfortable with using -maintainers, but had no better suggestions; the earlier related noise levels on this list had been unacceptable and had resulted in things actually being _worse_ than before the "discussion". I thought -maintainers would be better than private mail, which would also have been an option. Anyway, I thought Axel's and Dag's opinions, input, and experience would be valuable, they do package a lot of kernel modules for a big set of vanilla and custom kernels for a wide user base. Rik (who was also brought into the PM discussion shortly after Warren) agreed, so I pinged Axel and Dag to see if they were interested, and they were. I notified the previously Cc'd folks in the PM thread above about that, and suggested Axel and Dag would be subscribed to -maintainers in order to be able to participate in this discussion. At this point, I wondered whether I wanted to engage in this discussion one more time in the first place due to earlier somewhat bad experiences where the discussion had turned away from technical issues to nonsense, so I didn't act immediately. Then, I got busy with other stuff for a week or so. After that week or so, I noticed Rik had started to incorporate some of my Bugzilla'd RFE's to the Rawhide packages, so I rushed to post the request for discussion to -maintainers before it would be too late to discuss things and sanity check those RFE's. Many eyes etc. My mistake was to not ensure that the suggestion/request for subscribing Axel and Dag actually reached people who can do something about making that happen, sorry about that. Now: who should this subscription request be sent to? It's not too late yet, the discussion on -maintainers hasn't really started. Thorsten responded to the list, and I got a few "seconded, well thought out" -like private mails, but that's about it. In the meantime, feel free to comment on this list, or the Bugzilla'd RFE's mentioned in my RFD, or send me private mail and I'll forward the opinions. But I'd like everyone to stay within the "infrastructure" scope for now. How to name the module packages and how to get depsolvers to Do The Right Thing with pulling them in in various scenarios is more or less an orthogonal issue, and anyway one that _can_ be tackled separately. And because it can, IMO it also should, due to the whole big picture of kernel module packaging being a relatively wide and complex one. So, let's avoid the political/personal fuss, keep things technical, get the basic building blocks done first, then proceed to the naming/depsolver part, ok? Keeping the noise level down only improves one's chances of being heard, no matter where the discussion goes on. Thanks in advance! From thomas.hille at nightsabers.org Sat Mar 19 14:13:47 2005 From: thomas.hille at nightsabers.org (Thomas Hille) Date: Sat, 19 Mar 2005 15:13:47 +0100 Subject: fork bomb attack In-Reply-To: <1111235867.3582.5.camel@roque> References: <1111172643.4928.2.camel@stantz.corp.sgi.com> <20050318193326.GG24385@redhat.com> <20050318203739.1f11ca2b@nausicaa.camperquake.de> <20050318210912.174d6d99.fedora@wir-sind-cool.org> <423BA943.1050706@tlarson.com> <1111235867.3582.5.camel@roque> Message-ID: <1111241627.11774.14.camel@ice-dragon.ddn.de> Am Samstag, den 19.03.2005, 12:37 +0000 schrieb Rui Miguel Seabra: > On Fri, 2005-03-18 at 21:23 -0700, Tyler Larson wrote: > > Fork bombs have always been of little concern to admins. They do > > relatively little damage and are completely traceable. The perpetrator > > does little more than land himself in a lot of hot water. In most cases, > > the threat of disciplinary action is enough protection--it's not an > > attack that can be launched anonymously. > > They are definitely not of little concern. A fork bomb on the DNS server > launched through some other bug would cause some interesting harm. Sorry, but an admin that allows user to log into a dns server is either stupid or ignorant. And when somebody would be able to log into it via a bug, you should first fix that bug since there are other more efficient ways to "get rid" of the dns server. (like overloading the network interface with traffic) > > In the extremely rare case where fork bomb protection is a big enough > > concern to warrant reducing the process limits, the administrator can > > impose whatever ulimit he wants. However, this is the exception rather > > than the rule. > > Yes. But I don't envisage an user of fedora with 16k processes, do you? > > I agree that the limit is insanely high. 16k is high, but definitely not insanely. On a smp webserver the "apache" user has no problem starting 1k to 2k processes. And having read a recent review on one of Germany's it-magazine about Delta's new 8-way Opteron with 64GB main memory and up to 4 gigabit network- connections I don't think 16k processes is impossible. - It simply depends on what the machine does and what resources the machine has. (BTW the 8-way machine comes with linux preloaded) -Thomas From kyrre at solution-forge.net Sat Mar 19 14:20:50 2005 From: kyrre at solution-forge.net (Kyrre Ness Sjobak) Date: Sat, 19 Mar 2005 15:20:50 +0100 Subject: fork bomb attack In-Reply-To: <1111241627.11774.14.camel@ice-dragon.ddn.de> References: <1111172643.4928.2.camel@stantz.corp.sgi.com> <20050318193326.GG24385@redhat.com> <20050318203739.1f11ca2b@nausicaa.camperquake.de> <20050318210912.174d6d99.fedora@wir-sind-cool.org> <423BA943.1050706@tlarson.com> <1111235867.3582.5.camel@roque> <1111241627.11774.14.camel@ice-dragon.ddn.de> Message-ID: <1111242049.3336.36.camel@localhost.localdomain> l?r, 19.03.2005 kl. 15.13 skrev Thomas Hille: > Am Samstag, den 19.03.2005, 12:37 +0000 schrieb Rui Miguel Seabra: > > On Fri, 2005-03-18 at 21:23 -0700, Tyler Larson wrote: > > > Fork bombs have always been of little concern to admins. They do > > > relatively little damage and are completely traceable. The perpetrator > > > does little more than land himself in a lot of hot water. In most cases, > > > the threat of disciplinary action is enough protection--it's not an > > > attack that can be launched anonymously. > > > > They are definitely not of little concern. A fork bomb on the DNS server > > launched through some other bug would cause some interesting harm. > > Sorry, but an admin that allows user to log into a dns server is either > stupid or ignorant. And when somebody would be able to log into it via a > bug, you should first fix that bug since there are other more efficient > ways to "get rid" of the dns server. (like overloading the network > interface with traffic) I don't think he talked about "log into" - i think he meant "broke into through a hole in the dns-server". That there then migth be worse thing to do than forkbomb it, is another matter... But bugs in (preinstalled) system software has also been known to cause a resource exhaustion. I had cups do this to me once (try sending a 400 mb postscript to gimpprint on a 128 MB RAM computer), or print to a remote machine called "localhost" - thats effectively a forkbomb... From thomas.hille at nightsabers.org Sat Mar 19 14:45:33 2005 From: thomas.hille at nightsabers.org (Thomas Hille) Date: Sat, 19 Mar 2005 15:45:33 +0100 Subject: fork bomb attack In-Reply-To: <1111242049.3336.36.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <1111172643.4928.2.camel@stantz.corp.sgi.com> <20050318193326.GG24385@redhat.com> <20050318203739.1f11ca2b@nausicaa.camperquake.de> <20050318210912.174d6d99.fedora@wir-sind-cool.org> <423BA943.1050706@tlarson.com> <1111235867.3582.5.camel@roque> <1111241627.11774.14.camel@ice-dragon.ddn.de> <1111242049.3336.36.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <1111243533.11774.18.camel@ice-dragon.ddn.de> Am Samstag, den 19.03.2005, 15:20 +0100 schrieb Kyrre Ness Sjobak: > > But bugs in (preinstalled) system software has also been known to cause > a resource exhaustion. I had cups do this to me once (try sending a 400 > mb postscript to gimpprint on a 128 MB RAM computer), or print to a > remote machine called "localhost" - thats effectively a forkbomb... That's what I wanted to point out in my previous post: you can bring the system down with 2 processes (or some other way) while having a running system with several thousand processes, that does it's job. -Thomas From pri.rhl3 at iadonisi.to Sat Mar 19 14:49:42 2005 From: pri.rhl3 at iadonisi.to (Paul Iadonisi) Date: Sat, 19 Mar 2005 09:49:42 -0500 Subject: fork bomb attack In-Reply-To: <1111242049.3336.36.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <1111172643.4928.2.camel@stantz.corp.sgi.com> <20050318193326.GG24385@redhat.com> <20050318203739.1f11ca2b@nausicaa.camperquake.de> <20050318210912.174d6d99.fedora@wir-sind-cool.org> <423BA943.1050706@tlarson.com> <1111235867.3582.5.camel@roque> <1111241627.11774.14.camel@ice-dragon.ddn.de> <1111242049.3336.36.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <1111243782.4779.1.camel@md.local.linuxlobbyist.org> On Sat, 2005-03-19 at 15:20 +0100, Kyrre Ness Sjobak wrote: [snip] > or print to a > remote machine called "localhost" - thats effectively a forkbomb... Ewe! That sounds like an insanely simple exploit. Anyone want to confirm this? If it's that easy, I'd call it bug. -- -Paul Iadonisi Senior System Administrator Red Hat Certified Engineer / Local Linux Lobbyist Ever see a penguin fly? -- Try Linux. GPL all the way: Sell services, don't lease secrets From mricon at gmail.com Sat Mar 19 14:48:23 2005 From: mricon at gmail.com (Konstantin Ryabitsev) Date: Sat, 19 Mar 2005 09:48:23 -0500 Subject: fork bomb attack In-Reply-To: <1111242049.3336.36.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <1111172643.4928.2.camel@stantz.corp.sgi.com> <20050318193326.GG24385@redhat.com> <20050318203739.1f11ca2b@nausicaa.camperquake.de> <20050318210912.174d6d99.fedora@wir-sind-cool.org> <423BA943.1050706@tlarson.com> <1111235867.3582.5.camel@roque> <1111241627.11774.14.camel@ice-dragon.ddn.de> <1111242049.3336.36.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: On Sat, 19 Mar 2005 15:20:50 +0100, Kyrre Ness Sjobak wrote: > But bugs in (preinstalled) system software has also been known to cause > a resource exhaustion. I had cups do this to me once (try sending a 400 > mb postscript to gimpprint on a 128 MB RAM computer), or print to a > remote machine called "localhost" - thats effectively a forkbomb... No, that's a computer with not enough memory. :) We have an OOM-killer for such cases. A "denial of service" that results when someone tries to run a large application with insufficient system resources is not a security concern -- it's a feature. It's the same as trying to buy a BMW when you only have enough money for a used Ford -- you'll get a denial of service from the dealership, too. ;) Besides, you can't ulimit a process running as root anyway. Can you? Regards, -- Konstantin Ryabitsev Zlotniks, INC From technoyippie at gmail.com Sat Mar 19 15:56:08 2005 From: technoyippie at gmail.com (Inertia) Date: Sat, 19 Mar 2005 09:56:08 -0600 Subject: fork bomb attack In-Reply-To: <1111241627.11774.14.camel@ice-dragon.ddn.de> References: <1111172643.4928.2.camel@stantz.corp.sgi.com> <20050318193326.GG24385@redhat.com> <20050318203739.1f11ca2b@nausicaa.camperquake.de> <20050318210912.174d6d99.fedora@wir-sind-cool.org> <423BA943.1050706@tlarson.com> <1111235867.3582.5.camel@roque> <1111241627.11774.14.camel@ice-dragon.ddn.de> Message-ID: <1111247768.4345.3.camel@sligh.nmrc.org> On Sat, 2005-03-19 at 15:13 +0100, Thomas Hille wrote: > connections I don't think 16k processes is impossible. - It simply > depends on what the machine does and what resources the machine has. > (BTW the 8-way machine comes with linux preloaded) Just a thought, but could the ulimit (and, presumably, other minor settings such as this) be added to the installclass in anaconda? So if a user installs a "server" it would have tighter restrictions than a "personal desktop"? -inertia From kyrre at solution-forge.net Sat Mar 19 16:04:54 2005 From: kyrre at solution-forge.net (Kyrre Ness Sjobak) Date: Sat, 19 Mar 2005 17:04:54 +0100 Subject: fork bomb attack In-Reply-To: <1111243782.4779.1.camel@md.local.linuxlobbyist.org> References: <1111172643.4928.2.camel@stantz.corp.sgi.com> <20050318193326.GG24385@redhat.com> <20050318203739.1f11ca2b@nausicaa.camperquake.de> <20050318210912.174d6d99.fedora@wir-sind-cool.org> <423BA943.1050706@tlarson.com> <1111235867.3582.5.camel@roque> <1111241627.11774.14.camel@ice-dragon.ddn.de> <1111242049.3336.36.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1111243782.4779.1.camel@md.local.linuxlobbyist.org> Message-ID: <1111248293.3336.50.camel@localhost.localdomain> l?r, 19.03.2005 kl. 15.49 skrev Paul Iadonisi: > On Sat, 2005-03-19 at 15:20 +0100, Kyrre Ness Sjobak wrote: > > [snip] > > > or print to a > > remote machine called "localhost" - thats effectively a forkbomb... > > Ewe! That sounds like an insanely simple exploit. Anyone want to > confirm this? If it's that easy, I'd call it bug. I tried reporting it, but it was closed as a "configuration error". Oh dear, having somebody walk up to your (wireless) nettwork, connecting a laptop with hostname "localhost" sharing a printer, and pressing print on one of the connected public terminals (which, just to make it funny, are thin clients). What effectively happens, is that the terminal sends the job to localhost - i.e. itself, which sends the job to localhost, which sends the job to localhost. I also guess they are all waiting for some confirmation "yup, printing finished" etc. Guess what happens to /var/spool/cups... Personally, would suggest that cups should do some kinds of sanity checking on the hostnames it recives - such as "do they map to the same host (IP) that sent the broadcast pacage? If not, just use the IP and screw the hostname - at least internally in CUPS." But if it *shows* a "thrusted" printserver (such as TopSecretPrinter at Securehost") name, but really sends it to "PostscriptDumpPassthrough at SpyHost" (Spyhost claiming it is Securehost, cups see it, guesses it is a misconfig - and ignores, sending to SpyHost), things could get really interesting... Kyrre Ness Sj?b?k From kyrre at solution-forge.net Sat Mar 19 16:10:22 2005 From: kyrre at solution-forge.net (Kyrre Ness Sjobak) Date: Sat, 19 Mar 2005 17:10:22 +0100 Subject: fork bomb attack In-Reply-To: References: <1111172643.4928.2.camel@stantz.corp.sgi.com> <20050318193326.GG24385@redhat.com> <20050318203739.1f11ca2b@nausicaa.camperquake.de> <20050318210912.174d6d99.fedora@wir-sind-cool.org> <423BA943.1050706@tlarson.com> <1111235867.3582.5.camel@roque> <1111241627.11774.14.camel@ice-dragon.ddn.de> <1111242049.3336.36.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <1111248622.3336.57.camel@localhost.localdomain> l?r, 19.03.2005 kl. 15.48 skrev Konstantin Ryabitsev: > On Sat, 19 Mar 2005 15:20:50 +0100, Kyrre Ness Sjobak > wrote: > > But bugs in (preinstalled) system software has also been known to cause > > a resource exhaustion. I had cups do this to me once (try sending a 400 > > mb postscript to gimpprint on a 128 MB RAM computer), or print to a > > remote machine called "localhost" - thats effectively a forkbomb... > > No, that's a computer with not enough memory. :) We have an OOM-killer > for such cases. A "denial of service" that results when someone tries > to run a large application with insufficient system resources is not a > security concern -- it's a feature. It's the same as trying to buy a > BMW when you only have enough money for a used Ford -- you'll get a > denial of service from the dealership, too. ;) > OOMkiller? I have lost all faith in that #"!%?#%?#... Situation: You have: 1. ghostscript, eating about all RAM and all SWAP (a 128 MB computer is configured with a helluva lot of swap, and it probably has a slow disk to, so getting *there* took a while...) 2. gnome-panel 3. gaim 4. a buch of other small tray applets etc. Which three++ did you think OOM killed? > Besides, you can't ulimit a process running as root anyway. Can you? Never tried. From kyrre at solution-forge.net Sat Mar 19 16:11:39 2005 From: kyrre at solution-forge.net (Kyrre Ness Sjobak) Date: Sat, 19 Mar 2005 17:11:39 +0100 Subject: Mono In-Reply-To: <1111169847.19143.1.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <1111158767.2858.5.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1111160106.2378.1.camel@cutter> <1111169324.3340.0.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1111169847.19143.1.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <1111248699.3336.59.camel@localhost.localdomain> fre, 18.03.2005 kl. 19.17 skrev Brian Pepple: > On Fri, 2005-03-18 at 19:08 +0100, Kyrre Ness Sjobak wrote: > > fre, 18.03.2005 kl. 16.35 skrev seth vidal: > > > > > > 1. be on the right list - fedora-extras, not fedora-devel > > > 2. search the fedora-extras list for the discussion of mono and why it > > > can't go in. > > > > > > -sv > > > > > > > I am just wondering: I Java (gcj) can go, then why can't Mono? Microsoft > > got busted for bringing their own Java... What is the difference? > > > > This has been discussed. Refer to the archives. > > /B which list? i have kept a close eye on this since last summer, and haven't heard anything about such a dicussion. From skvidal at phy.duke.edu Sat Mar 19 16:16:17 2005 From: skvidal at phy.duke.edu (seth vidal) Date: Sat, 19 Mar 2005 11:16:17 -0500 Subject: Mono In-Reply-To: <1111248699.3336.59.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <1111158767.2858.5.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1111160106.2378.1.camel@cutter> <1111169324.3340.0.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1111169847.19143.1.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1111248699.3336.59.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <1111248978.7461.32.camel@cutter> > which list? i have kept a close eye on this since last summer, and > haven't heard anything about such a dicussion. This list: https://www.redhat.com/archives/fedora-extras-list/2005-March/thread.html it's been discussed twice in this month so far. -sv From leachman_ss at yahoo.com Sat Mar 19 16:50:09 2005 From: leachman_ss at yahoo.com (mike avery) Date: Sat, 19 Mar 2005 08:50:09 -0800 (PST) Subject: AntiVirus? Message-ID: <20050319165009.12729.qmail@web52903.mail.yahoo.com> But something like clamav to protect *Windows clients* in a GNU/Linux based server environment does makes sense. At least until FOSS takes over the world. -- -Paul Iadonisi Senior System Administrator Red Hat Certified Engineer / Local Linux Lobbyist Ever see a penguin fly? -- Try Linux. GPL all the way: Sell services, don't lease secrets ------------------------------ Virus scanning is important for those deploying SMTP relays which may either: - Serve Windows clients - Relay or forward messages to outside parties who may have Windows clients Leaving out an AV solution seems like an amateur mistake to make. Of course, people can always go and fetch AV software themselves, but if it can be included in the base system, all the better. We can't presume to know or expect how people will use the system. We can be sure that inclusion of AV software will never be looked upon as a bad decision. __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Small Business - Try our new resources site! http://smallbusiness.yahoo.com/resources/ From cra at WPI.EDU Sat Mar 19 17:02:51 2005 From: cra at WPI.EDU (Chuck R. Anderson) Date: Sat, 19 Mar 2005 12:02:51 -0500 Subject: AntiVirus? In-Reply-To: <20050319165009.12729.qmail@web52903.mail.yahoo.com> References: <20050319165009.12729.qmail@web52903.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20050319170251.GB29293@angus.ind.WPI.EDU> On Sat, Mar 19, 2005 at 08:50:09AM -0800, mike avery wrote: > But something like clamav to protect *Windows clients* > in a GNU/Linux based server environment does makes > sense. At least until FOSS takes over the world. clamav is already in Extras. From susan_geller at speakeasy.net Sat Mar 19 17:03:39 2005 From: susan_geller at speakeasy.net (susan_geller at speakeasy.net) Date: Sat, 19 Mar 2005 17:03:39 +0000 Subject: gimp-2.2.4-0.fc3.3 man pages Message-ID: It looks like the man pages intalled with gimp have somewhat unusual names: $ rpm -ql gimp | grep /usr/share/man /usr/share/man/man1/gimp-2.2.1.gz /usr/share/man/man1/gimp-remote-2.2.1.gz /usr/share/man/man1/gimptool-2.0.1.gz /usr/share/man/man5/gimprc-2.2.5.gz So you have to say: $ man gimp-2.2 Instead of just: $ man gimp Has anyone considered adding commands like: $ ln -s /usr/share/man/man1/gimp-2.2.1.gz /usr/share/man/man1/gimp.1.gz to the rpm post install script? Thanks, Susan From smooge at gmail.com Sat Mar 19 17:24:19 2005 From: smooge at gmail.com (Stephen J. Smoogen) Date: Sat, 19 Mar 2005 10:24:19 -0700 Subject: Regression testing In-Reply-To: <423B990D.7090501@redhat.com> References: <20050318202510.GA1073925@hiwaay.net> <87acp04qd0.fsf@kosh.ultra.csn.tu-chemnitz.de> <3DB1C312833204D29E0830E1@10.169.6.246> <87y8ck371f.fsf@kosh.ultra.csn.tu-chemnitz.de> <1111186401.2566.84.camel@bobcat.mine.nu> <423B990D.7090501@redhat.com> Message-ID: <80d7e409050319092418615576@mail.gmail.com> On Fri, 18 Mar 2005 17:14:21 -1000, Warren Togami wrote: > Kenneth Porter wrote: > > --On Saturday, March 19, 2005 12:53 AM +0200 VilleSkytt? > > wrote: > > > >> In rpm 4.2, that is. > >> Anyway, it has been described in the max-rpm CVS snapshot for some time: > >> http://rpm-devel.colug.net/max-rpm/s1-rpm-specref-scripts.html#S3-RPM-SPE > >> CREF-CHECK > > > > > > CPAN modules often have a "make test" phase, so that looks like a good > > enhancement to implement in the RPM::Specfile package. > > > > There was a long thread not long ago on the Subversion mailing list > > about whether end users should run tests when installing from a source > > RPM (consensus was "yes") so that SRPM could also benefit. (Its tests > > take quite awhile.) > > Quite often software, especially many perl modules, require network > tests during "make test". We may need to make a policy for Fedora that > such tests *must* be in a %check section, because we may want the the > build system to totally disallow network access for security reasons. > Yes.. this causes all kinds of alarms in certain places when people forget that the perl modules try to do network access tests. -- Stephen J Smoogen. CSIRT/Linux System Administrator From pri.rhl3 at iadonisi.to Sat Mar 19 17:52:10 2005 From: pri.rhl3 at iadonisi.to (Paul Iadonisi) Date: Sat, 19 Mar 2005 12:52:10 -0500 Subject: AntiVirus? In-Reply-To: <20050319170251.GB29293@angus.ind.WPI.EDU> References: <20050319165009.12729.qmail@web52903.mail.yahoo.com> <20050319170251.GB29293@angus.ind.WPI.EDU> Message-ID: <1111254730.4779.4.camel@md.local.linuxlobbyist.org> On Sat, 2005-03-19 at 12:02 -0500, Chuck R. Anderson wrote: > On Sat, Mar 19, 2005 at 08:50:09AM -0800, mike avery wrote: > > But something like clamav to protect *Windows clients* > > in a GNU/Linux based server environment does makes > > sense. At least until FOSS takes over the world. > > clamav is already in Extras. Watch yer attribution. That was me, not Mike Avery. Nevertheless, thanks. I thought I had noticed it when I perused FC3 extras when it was first announced. -- -Paul Iadonisi Senior System Administrator Red Hat Certified Engineer / Local Linux Lobbyist Ever see a penguin fly? -- Try Linux. GPL all the way: Sell services, don't lease secrets From fedora at wir-sind-cool.org Sat Mar 19 18:24:24 2005 From: fedora at wir-sind-cool.org (Michael Schwendt) Date: Sat, 19 Mar 2005 19:24:24 +0100 Subject: AntiVirus? In-Reply-To: <1111254730.4779.4.camel@md.local.linuxlobbyist.org> References: <20050319165009.12729.qmail@web52903.mail.yahoo.com> <20050319170251.GB29293@angus.ind.WPI.EDU> <1111254730.4779.4.camel@md.local.linuxlobbyist.org> Message-ID: <20050319192424.603c8aec.fedora@wir-sind-cool.org> On Sat, 19 Mar 2005 12:52:10 -0500, Paul Iadonisi wrote: > On Sat, 2005-03-19 at 12:02 -0500, Chuck R. Anderson wrote: > > On Sat, Mar 19, 2005 at 08:50:09AM -0800, mike avery wrote: > > > But something like clamav to protect *Windows clients* > > > in a GNU/Linux based server environment does makes > > > sense. At least until FOSS takes over the world. > > > > clamav is already in Extras. > > Watch yer attribution. That was me, not Mike Avery. Nevertheless, > thanks. I thought I had noticed it when I perused FC3 extras when it > was first announced. > In a message formatted like this, it is not obvious who wrote what: https://www.redhat.com/archives/fedora-devel-list/2005-March/msg01188.html From Nicolas.Mailhot at laPoste.net Sat Mar 19 18:26:30 2005 From: Nicolas.Mailhot at laPoste.net (Nicolas Mailhot) Date: Sat, 19 Mar 2005 19:26:30 +0100 Subject: Openness: Apache as a guiding model (was Re: GFS removed??? ) In-Reply-To: <1111240819.8997.84.camel@bobcat.mine.nu> References: <604aa791050317104261c98955@mail.gmail.com> <20050317191235.GE21731@neu.nirvana> <1111087400.17429.260.camel@arena.soho.bytebot.net> <20050317193121.GB6398@neu.nirvana> <1111088532.31967.122.camel@jkeating2.hq.pogolinux.com> <20050317195257.GF6398@neu.nirvana> <1111104503.17429.280.camel@arena.soho.bytebot.net> <12901.192.54.193.35.1111137333.squirrel@rousalka.dyndns.org> <604aa791050318064518bbf946@mail.gmail.com> <1111240819.8997.84.camel@bobcat.mine.nu> Message-ID: <1111256790.1783.23.camel@rousalka.dyndns.org> Le samedi 19 mars 2005 ? 16:00 +0200, Ville Skytt? a ?crit : > On Fri, 2005-03-18 at 09:45 -0500, Jeff Spaleta wrote: > > On Fri, 18 Mar 2005 10:15:33 +0100 (CET), Nicolas Mailhot > > wrote: > > > Choosing to ignore Axel's input on this subject is so utterly ridiculous > > > from a technical point of view one can only conclude other considerations > > > are taking over now. > > I would find it rather odd and malicious if Ville now > > ignored Axel, considering Ville has explicitly desired Axel's input. > My goal is the exact opposite of ignoring people who have valuable > contributions to the issue at hand. Ville, I don't think anyone ever suspected you (except for rhetorical purposes). I do personally find the weight technicalities took in this thread very disquieting and unhealthy. Will the Fedora project internal rules be ever important enough to justify the ritual killing of the brother that jumped over a line traced on the ground? ? (just to show that what we've seen is very human and sadly nothing new) ? Romulus & Remus for those who've forgotten their classics -- Nicolas Mailhot -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part URL: From carlos.efr at mail.telepac.pt Sat Mar 19 19:04:07 2005 From: carlos.efr at mail.telepac.pt (Carlos Rodrigues) Date: Sat, 19 Mar 2005 19:04:07 +0000 Subject: fork bomb attack In-Reply-To: <20050318193326.GG24385@redhat.com> References: <1111172643.4928.2.camel@stantz.corp.sgi.com> <20050318193326.GG24385@redhat.com> Message-ID: <423C77A7.6090300@mail.telepac.pt> Dave Jones wrote: > If we set strict ulimits by default we'd have people writing articles like > "Fedora is teh suck, I can't malloc more than xMB in a single process" > What's fit for one configuration may not be for another. > One size most definitly does not fit all. The BSDs didn't seem vulnerable to this issue, and I don't see people going around in circles screaming about it. So, they seem to have chosen some "one size fits almost all" limits. Maybe those could be chosen for Fedora/RedHat too, and let people with a need for huge numbers of processes increase them. Those kind of people should also know how to do "man ulimit". When one advocates in favor of unix-like systems (as opposed to Windows systems) mentioning "convenience vs. security", it is embarassing to be given counter-examples like fork-bombs. -- Carlos Rodrigues url: http://tudo-sobre-nada.blogspot.com From thomas.hille at nightsabers.org Sat Mar 19 19:26:26 2005 From: thomas.hille at nightsabers.org (Thomas Hille) Date: Sat, 19 Mar 2005 20:26:26 +0100 Subject: fork bomb attack In-Reply-To: <423C77A7.6090300@mail.telepac.pt> References: <1111172643.4928.2.camel@stantz.corp.sgi.com> <20050318193326.GG24385@redhat.com> <423C77A7.6090300@mail.telepac.pt> Message-ID: <1111260386.11774.28.camel@ice-dragon.ddn.de> Am Samstag, den 19.03.2005, 19:04 +0000 schrieb Carlos Rodrigues: > Dave Jones wrote: > > If we set strict ulimits by default we'd have people writing articles like > > "Fedora is teh suck, I can't malloc more than xMB in a single process" > > What's fit for one configuration may not be for another. > > One size most definitly does not fit all. > > The BSDs didn't seem vulnerable to this issue, and I don't see people > going around in circles screaming about it. So, they seem to have chosen > some "one size fits almost all" limits. > > Maybe those could be chosen for Fedora/RedHat too, and let people with a > need for huge numbers of processes increase them. Those kind of people > should also know how to do "man ulimit". > > When one advocates in favor of unix-like systems (as opposed to Windows > systems) mentioning "convenience vs. security", it is embarassing to be > given counter-examples like fork-bombs. I don't think the BSD guys just choose a good ulimit, it is probably done in some other way. Maybe something like quotas for cpu time per user and not only per process. - Just a guess, I don't know. The thing is, you need only 10 processes wich are very resource hungry (memory, cpu time and/or hd access) and you get the same result. You don't need some thousand for that. But you are absolutely right- "convenience vs. security" is not a good argument here. Are there any articles on the net on why BSD and Debian weren't affected? While there are more and more sites reporting this, none could come up with any background information. -Thomas From iago.rubio at hispalinux.es Sat Mar 19 20:54:50 2005 From: iago.rubio at hispalinux.es (Iago Rubio) Date: Sat, 19 Mar 2005 21:54:50 +0100 Subject: fork bomb attack In-Reply-To: <423C77A7.6090300@mail.telepac.pt> References: <1111172643.4928.2.camel@stantz.corp.sgi.com> <20050318193326.GG24385@redhat.com> <423C77A7.6090300@mail.telepac.pt> Message-ID: <1111265691.16111.26.camel@speedy.iagorubio.net> On Sat, 2005-03-19 at 19:04 +0000, Carlos Rodrigues wrote: > Dave Jones wrote: [snip] > Maybe those could be chosen for Fedora/RedHat too, and let people with a > need for huge numbers of processes increase them. Those kind of people > should also know how to do "man ulimit". I think it's the other way around. A user that should give shell access to untrusted third parties on a machine with valuable resources, is not a user but a sysadmin and should know - at least - how to set less permissive ulimits. Desktop users sitting in front of their single-user PCs, should not know a word about "man ulimit" to use their boxes at full power. > When one advocates in favor of unix-like systems (as opposed to > Windows systems) mentioning "convenience vs. security", it is > embarassing to be given counter-examples like fork-bombs. I would be very funny to listen to someone saying, "Yeah, I picked 50 virus through Outlook this month, but if I get a shell account in your box I can fork bomb it." -- Iago Rubio From mike at navi.cx Sat Mar 19 21:06:46 2005 From: mike at navi.cx (Mike Hearn) Date: Sat, 19 Mar 2005 21:06:46 +0000 Subject: AntiVirus? References: <3adc77210503181735711e04a0@mail.gmail.com> <20050319014623.GE18511@angus.ind.WPI.EDU> Message-ID: On Fri, 18 Mar 2005 20:46:23 -0500, Chuck R. Anderson wrote: > AV is the wrong solution to the problem. Active defence combined with passive defence will always beat purely passive defence. thanks -mike From alan at redhat.com Sat Mar 19 21:03:55 2005 From: alan at redhat.com (Alan Cox) Date: Sat, 19 Mar 2005 16:03:55 -0500 Subject: fork bomb attack In-Reply-To: <1111248293.3336.50.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <1111172643.4928.2.camel@stantz.corp.sgi.com> <20050318193326.GG24385@redhat.com> <20050318203739.1f11ca2b@nausicaa.camperquake.de> <20050318210912.174d6d99.fedora@wir-sind-cool.org> <423BA943.1050706@tlarson.com> <1111235867.3582.5.camel@roque> <1111241627.11774.14.camel@ice-dragon.ddn.de> <1111242049.3336.36.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1111243782.4779.1.camel@md.local.linuxlobbyist.org> <1111248293.3336.50.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <20050319210355.GC27590@devserv.devel.redhat.com> On Sat, Mar 19, 2005 at 05:04:54PM +0100, Kyrre Ness Sjobak wrote: > I tried reporting it, but it was closed as a "configuration error". Oh > dear, having somebody walk up to your (wireless) nettwork, connecting a > laptop with hostname "localhost" sharing a printer, and pressing print > on one of the connected public terminals (which, just to make it funny, Whoever closed it IMHO made a mistake (or failed to include enough info on what was wrong with your configuration). I've forwarded it on to vendor-sec for analysis/comment. Alan From alan at redhat.com Sat Mar 19 21:05:07 2005 From: alan at redhat.com (Alan Cox) Date: Sat, 19 Mar 2005 16:05:07 -0500 Subject: fork bomb attack In-Reply-To: <1111248622.3336.57.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <1111172643.4928.2.camel@stantz.corp.sgi.com> <20050318193326.GG24385@redhat.com> <20050318203739.1f11ca2b@nausicaa.camperquake.de> <20050318210912.174d6d99.fedora@wir-sind-cool.org> <423BA943.1050706@tlarson.com> <1111235867.3582.5.camel@roque> <1111241627.11774.14.camel@ice-dragon.ddn.de> <1111242049.3336.36.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1111248622.3336.57.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <20050319210507.GD27590@devserv.devel.redhat.com> On Sat, Mar 19, 2005 at 05:10:22PM +0100, Kyrre Ness Sjobak wrote: > OOMkiller? I have lost all faith in that #"!%?#%?#... Situation: > You have: Depends what mode you are using. Mode 2 overcommit will ensure that processes get told "no memory" at a sane point. It still doesn't deal with who dies because there is no right answer (especially on a multi-user box ;)) From alan at redhat.com Sat Mar 19 21:07:27 2005 From: alan at redhat.com (Alan Cox) Date: Sat, 19 Mar 2005 16:07:27 -0500 Subject: fork bomb attack In-Reply-To: <423C77A7.6090300@mail.telepac.pt> References: <1111172643.4928.2.camel@stantz.corp.sgi.com> <20050318193326.GG24385@redhat.com> <423C77A7.6090300@mail.telepac.pt> Message-ID: <20050319210727.GF27590@devserv.devel.redhat.com> On Sat, Mar 19, 2005 at 07:04:07PM +0000, Carlos Rodrigues wrote: > The BSDs didn't seem vulnerable to this issue, and I don't see people > going around in circles screaming about it. So, they seem to have chosen > some "one size fits almost all" limits. I disagree. I can crash the BSD's effortlessly with a slight variant of it. Its a matter of what the attack was tuned to zap From gmaxwell at gmail.com Sat Mar 19 21:37:20 2005 From: gmaxwell at gmail.com (Gregory Maxwell) Date: Sat, 19 Mar 2005 16:37:20 -0500 Subject: Regression testing In-Reply-To: <423B990D.7090501@redhat.com> References: <20050318202510.GA1073925@hiwaay.net> <87acp04qd0.fsf@kosh.ultra.csn.tu-chemnitz.de> <3DB1C312833204D29E0830E1@10.169.6.246> <87y8ck371f.fsf@kosh.ultra.csn.tu-chemnitz.de> <1111186401.2566.84.camel@bobcat.mine.nu> <423B990D.7090501@redhat.com> Message-ID: On Fri, 18 Mar 2005 17:14:21 -1000, Warren Togami wrote: > Quite often software, especially many perl modules, require network > tests during "make test". We may need to make a policy for Fedora that > such tests *must* be in a %check section, because we may want the the > build system to totally disallow network access for security reasons. It would likely be useful to establish what sort of tests are acceptable from a %check section... Remote network tests might be useful for some things, but they really aren't appropriate for inclusion in built time tests. Perhaps if tests were split into a compact/exhaustive subsets they could be included in the exhaustive set. What sorts of restrictions would be acceptable for build time testing of packages? Memory consumption? wall clock on platform x? temporary disk space usage? From thuforuk at yahoo.co.uk Sat Mar 19 21:39:21 2005 From: thuforuk at yahoo.co.uk (Dariusz J. Garbowski) Date: Sat, 19 Mar 2005 21:39:21 +0000 Subject: packages list In-Reply-To: <1111047752.4169.221.camel@petra> References: <1111019608.4169.175.camel@petra> <1111025287.5267.4.camel@cutter> <4238F49A.1030107@yahoo.co.uk> <1111047752.4169.221.camel@petra> Message-ID: <423C9C09.3070807@yahoo.co.uk> On 03/17/2005 08:22 AM, Karel Zak wrote: > On Wed, 2005-03-16 at 22:56 -0500, Konstantin Ryabitsev wrote: > >>On Thu, 17 Mar 2005 03:08:10 +0000, Dariusz J. Garbowski >> wrote: > We have different view on problem. I want to make it useful for > developers and package maintainers too. For this there are dependences > and details about all files in all supported architectures of package. > > If I will prepare nice web page for users only, I'm sure that I will use > your script rather than my. (Hmm.. maybe we can for official fedora web > pages use your repoview and for internal RH developers use my script > with all FC+RHEL...). I for one would prefer your script. Shows useful information. I feel that keeping it hidden on some closed server is a shame. Personally I really hate when people underestimate user's intelligence -- have some faith! I hope that the result of your script will be available somewhere to browse. Regards, Dariusz From gmaxwell at gmail.com Sat Mar 19 21:51:43 2005 From: gmaxwell at gmail.com (Gregory Maxwell) Date: Sat, 19 Mar 2005 16:51:43 -0500 Subject: AntiVirus? In-Reply-To: References: <3adc77210503181735711e04a0@mail.gmail.com> <20050319014623.GE18511@angus.ind.WPI.EDU> Message-ID: On Sat, 19 Mar 2005 21:06:46 +0000, Mike Hearn wrote: > Active defence combined with passive defence will always beat purely > passive defence. If an untrusted source can execute code on your computer the game is over. Antivirus makes sense when thats all you can do, ... when you're on a platform of proprietary software with no ability to test or improve the code running there. T he viruses and worms that have grown up on windows have now reached a level of sophistication that simple pattern matching isn't good enough... They are encrypted, they are patching the running OS, etc. The halting problem tells us that determining the behavior of complex code is an intractable problem. It is now *much* easier to make a secure system than it is to make a naughtycode scanner thats worth a darn. Lets worry about antivirus software if the day ever comes that mass-spreading pathogens outpace the communities ability to actually fix the code, until then using such tools would only slow our pace of fixing actual bugs... Virus scanners don't generally solve the problem of one-off attacks by qualified and determined adversaries, which is a much more dangerous threat in many ways... Fixing bugs stops them and they also stop the bulk spreading stuff, and fixing bugs is something we can do in the free software world that is much harder in the proprietary code world. From jspaleta at gmail.com Sat Mar 19 22:05:06 2005 From: jspaleta at gmail.com (Jeff Spaleta) Date: Sat, 19 Mar 2005 17:05:06 -0500 Subject: packages list In-Reply-To: References: <1111019608.4169.175.camel@petra> <1111025287.5267.4.camel@cutter> <4238F49A.1030107@yahoo.co.uk> Message-ID: <604aa791050319140529309070@mail.gmail.com> On Wed, 16 Mar 2005 22:56:13 -0500, Konstantin Ryabitsev wrote: > I've considered it, but again, have not found that useful for someone > who is looking at a package listing on the web. I may still add it, > but "hidden" by default using styles, so clicking on a "[+] show > dependencies" link will unhide it -- possibly the same with files. The > concern is -- how much larger will that make the html files? There are > packages with a gajillion bajillion files and dependencies. I think > having a way to list files and dependencies from a package manager > interface would make more sense. And I could argue it would make more sense to be able to browse via a package manager... via the same logic you just used here... thus removing the need for this sort of webpage altogether. I have no problem with the dep info normally being hidden by default for the web pages in an effort to not overwhelm the casual user. But the dep info is valuable information to browse through at a central location, as valuable as package name browsing depending on you goals. Some segments of the userbase do actually care about what deps get pulled in. When looking for applications that perform a function, knowing if it needs mono or java or kde or gnome or whatever does actually matter sometimes. -jef From lkml at mac.com Sat Mar 19 22:21:05 2005 From: lkml at mac.com (Felipe Alfaro Solana) Date: Sat, 19 Mar 2005 23:21:05 +0100 Subject: AntiVirus? In-Reply-To: References: <3adc77210503181735711e04a0@mail.gmail.com> <20050319014623.GE18511@angus.ind.WPI.EDU> Message-ID: <1139393e7b9c494c5231d9895b89a0eb@mac.com> On 19 Mar 2005, at 22:06, Mike Hearn wrote: > On Fri, 18 Mar 2005 20:46:23 -0500, Chuck R. Anderson wrote: >> AV is the wrong solution to the problem. > > Active defence combined with passive defence will always beat purely > passive defence. I wouldn't say AV could be considered active defense, but reactive. What's more, any AV is totally useless against new or customized attacks, much like in medicine. Thus, for me any AV is one of a passive/reactive countermeasure. From mpeters at mac.com Sat Mar 19 23:05:48 2005 From: mpeters at mac.com (Michael A. Peters) Date: Sat, 19 Mar 2005 23:05:48 +0000 Subject: gimp-2.2.4-0.fc3.3 man pages In-Reply-To: (from susan_geller@speakeasy.net on Sat Mar 19 09:03:39 2005) References: Message-ID: <1111273548l.8478l.3l@devel.mpeters.local> On 03/19/2005 09:03:39 AM, susan_geller at speakeasy.net wrote: > > It looks like the man pages intalled with gimp have somewhat unusual > names: > > $ rpm -ql gimp | grep /usr/share/man > /usr/share/man/man1/gimp-2.2.1.gz > /usr/share/man/man1/gimp-remote-2.2.1.gz > /usr/share/man/man1/gimptool-2.0.1.gz > /usr/share/man/man5/gimprc-2.2.5.gz > > So you have to say: > $ man gimp-2.2 > > Instead of just: > $ man gimp I'm guessing it is gimp Makefile doing that so you can have gimp 2.2 installaed parallel with other versions. Perhaps a bugzilla should be filed. -- Michael A. Peters http://mpeters.us/ From paul at all-the-johnsons.co.uk Sun Mar 20 00:07:34 2005 From: paul at all-the-johnsons.co.uk (Paul) Date: Sun, 20 Mar 2005 00:07:34 +0000 Subject: Mono In-Reply-To: <1111248699.3336.59.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <1111158767.2858.5.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1111160106.2378.1.camel@cutter> <1111169324.3340.0.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1111169847.19143.1.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1111248699.3336.59.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <1111277254.9137.66.camel@localhost.localdomain> Hi, > which list? i have kept a close eye on this since last summer, and > haven't heard anything about such a dicussion. mono-extras - lots of talk about it currently TTFN Paul -- "It is often said that something cannot be libel if it is the truth. This has had to be amended to 'something cannot be libel if it is the truth or if the bank balance says otherwise'" - US Today -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part URL: From skvidal at phy.duke.edu Sun Mar 20 00:20:21 2005 From: skvidal at phy.duke.edu (seth vidal) Date: Sat, 19 Mar 2005 19:20:21 -0500 Subject: packages list In-Reply-To: <423C9C09.3070807@yahoo.co.uk> References: <1111019608.4169.175.camel@petra> <1111025287.5267.4.camel@cutter> <4238F49A.1030107@yahoo.co.uk> <1111047752.4169.221.camel@petra> <423C9C09.3070807@yahoo.co.uk> Message-ID: <1111278021.11240.3.camel@cutter> > I for one would prefer your script. Shows useful information. I feel > that keeping it hidden on some closed server is a shame. How is it a closed server?? It's mirrored, everywhere. ANYONE can access the information. There's nothing closed about it at all. > Personally I really hate when people underestimate user's intelligence > -- have some faith! No, I've been a sysadmin for a long time and I've followed the HIG discussions with gnome. They're right, too much information overwhelms people. period. -sv From cmadams at hiwaay.net Sun Mar 20 02:14:55 2005 From: cmadams at hiwaay.net (Chris Adams) Date: Sat, 19 Mar 2005 20:14:55 -0600 Subject: Regression testing In-Reply-To: References: <20050318202510.GA1073925@hiwaay.net> <87acp04qd0.fsf@kosh.ultra.csn.tu-chemnitz.de> <3DB1C312833204D29E0830E1@10.169.6.246> <87y8ck371f.fsf@kosh.ultra.csn.tu-chemnitz.de> <1111186401.2566.84.camel@bobcat.mine.nu> <423B990D.7090501@redhat.com> Message-ID: <20050320021455.GB542307@hiwaay.net> Once upon a time, Gregory Maxwell said: > Remote network tests might be useful for some things, but they really > aren't appropriate for inclusion in built time tests. Perhaps if tests > were split into a compact/exhaustive subsets they could be included in > the exhaustive set. How else do you run regression tests on an FTP client (for example)? The perl package that does network connections during "make test" (I've only seen one IIRC) does it because the modules are network client modules; the only real way to test them is to connect to network servers. Since OpenSSH includes both a server and a client, it can test both against each other. -- Chris Adams Systems and Network Administrator - HiWAAY Internet Services I don't speak for anybody but myself - that's enough trouble. From gmaxwell at gmail.com Sun Mar 20 03:00:59 2005 From: gmaxwell at gmail.com (Gregory Maxwell) Date: Sat, 19 Mar 2005 22:00:59 -0500 Subject: Regression testing In-Reply-To: <20050320021455.GB542307@hiwaay.net> References: <20050318202510.GA1073925@hiwaay.net> <87acp04qd0.fsf@kosh.ultra.csn.tu-chemnitz.de> <3DB1C312833204D29E0830E1@10.169.6.246> <87y8ck371f.fsf@kosh.ultra.csn.tu-chemnitz.de> <1111186401.2566.84.camel@bobcat.mine.nu> <423B990D.7090501@redhat.com> <20050320021455.GB542307@hiwaay.net> Message-ID: On Sat, 19 Mar 2005 20:14:55 -0600, Chris Adams wrote: > How else do you run regression tests on an FTP client (for example)? By including a FTP server, of course. ;) But more seriously, .. you don't.. Or rather you don't put such tests in the same class of tests with tens of thousands of other tests which can happily be run with in a more limited environment. The idea being is that if you have a thousand packages with a thousand different testing requirements none of them will be tested at all, because everyone will disable the tests because they fail in on completely sane systems and the effort of sorting out which is a real failure and which is something silly is too much, especially for a package you're not familiar with. If instead you split tests into two classes, an extensive class with arbratarly tall requirements, and a basic class which should never fail you will likely get a lot more useful testing... and those that really care about a packages extensive tests will still undertake the additional effort to execute them. > The perl package that does network connections during "make test" (I've > only seen one IIRC) does it because the modules are network client > modules; the only real way to test them is to connect to network > servers. Well if anyone really cared they could override the socket calls with a testing shim... a lot of work for not much gain.... but it's exactly the sort of thing that should eventually be done for important infrastructure components that don't change often (libc stuff for example). Waiting for real users to encounter bugs in production is not really acceptable when it can be avoided via testing... But with the number of packages in a distro, and the complexity of the overall system... the myriad of potential interactions, we miss a lot of potential issues when regression testing is limited to the core developer running on his single system before issuing a new release. > Since OpenSSH includes both a server and a client, it can test both > against each other. And it would be fantastic for it to do that... From zaitcev at redhat.com Sun Mar 20 03:03:41 2005 From: zaitcev at redhat.com (Pete Zaitcev) Date: Sat, 19 Mar 2005 19:03:41 -0800 Subject: usb_storage In-Reply-To: References: <20050316132536.2c968d17@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <20050319190341.1331a0f4@localhost.localdomain> On Thu, 17 Mar 2005 14:07:38 -0500 Peter Jones wrote: > > > I could really do with being able to use my internal card reader... > > > > What are you talking about? > > This stuff, I bet: > > Mar 17 14:06:26 localhost kernel: usb 1-4: device descriptor read/64, error -71 >[...] > (this is what happens when I plug a SanDisk usb 2 CF reader in on my > laptop) This is a little better than the silly mail which started the thread, but is not good enough, Peter. At least let me know what kernel you're running and what was the last kernel working (needless to say, with the same reader, same laptop, same port), please. Thanks, -- Pete From cmadams at hiwaay.net Sun Mar 20 03:05:04 2005 From: cmadams at hiwaay.net (Chris Adams) Date: Sat, 19 Mar 2005 21:05:04 -0600 Subject: Regression testing In-Reply-To: References: <20050318202510.GA1073925@hiwaay.net> <87acp04qd0.fsf@kosh.ultra.csn.tu-chemnitz.de> <3DB1C312833204D29E0830E1@10.169.6.246> <87y8ck371f.fsf@kosh.ultra.csn.tu-chemnitz.de> <1111186401.2566.84.camel@bobcat.mine.nu> <423B990D.7090501@redhat.com> <20050320021455.GB542307@hiwaay.net> Message-ID: <20050320030504.GD542307@hiwaay.net> Once upon a time, Gregory Maxwell said: > > Since OpenSSH includes both a server and a client, it can test both > > against each other. > > And it would be fantastic for it to do that... It does. When I build my OpenSSH RPMs, I do a "rpmbuild -ba", and when that is done I "cd ../BUILD/openssh-*; make tests" (on Tru64 I have to "SUDO=`which sudo` make tests"). If there's a failure, I remove the built RPMs and work on it. In an ideal world, regression tests wouldn't be a part the RPM or .spec file; they'd be done by the packager (I understand that that isn't very realistic though). -- Chris Adams Systems and Network Administrator - HiWAAY Internet Services I don't speak for anybody but myself - that's enough trouble. From gmaxwell at gmail.com Sun Mar 20 03:22:53 2005 From: gmaxwell at gmail.com (Gregory Maxwell) Date: Sat, 19 Mar 2005 22:22:53 -0500 Subject: Regression testing In-Reply-To: <20050320030504.GD542307@hiwaay.net> References: <20050318202510.GA1073925@hiwaay.net> <3DB1C312833204D29E0830E1@10.169.6.246> <87y8ck371f.fsf@kosh.ultra.csn.tu-chemnitz.de> <1111186401.2566.84.camel@bobcat.mine.nu> <423B990D.7090501@redhat.com> <20050320021455.GB542307@hiwaay.net> <20050320030504.GD542307@hiwaay.net> Message-ID: On Sat, 19 Mar 2005 21:05:04 -0600, Chris Adams wrote: > Once upon a time, Gregory Maxwell said: > > > Since OpenSSH includes both a server and a client, it can test both > > > against each other. > > > > And it would be fantastic for it to do that... > > It does. > > When I build my OpenSSH RPMs, I do a "rpmbuild -ba", and when that is > done I "cd ../BUILD/openssh-*; make tests" (on Tru64 I have to > "SUDO=`which sudo` make tests"). If there's a failure, I remove the > built RPMs and work on it. > > In an ideal world, regression tests wouldn't be a part the RPM or .spec > file; they'd be done by the packager (I understand that that isn't very > realistic though). Thats a fine for testing on a specific example on each platform, but I think an ideal world where any user at any time could request tests be performed on their software... not just to catch bugs in the packages directly, but to catch bugs that arise from other parts of their system. (i.e. libc and kernel bugs found due to irregularities in application level tests) Testing at the packaging point is important.. No package with tests should be distributed if the tests fail in any important way, and just about all packages have tests.... Putting the tests in the build process would help keep them from being missed, ... It would be a rosy future indeed if all package had a good set of tests, the binary RPMs had flags to indicate they were run and passed at build, and distro policy was to never ship (whatever that means in a world moving more and more to online distribution) an untested package. ... We're a long way off from that, but it's certainly possible. Writing tests could well work out to be another task performed by those who want to contribute to free software but whom can't, for whatever reason, contribute substantially to the coding itself. But testing comes in many kinds and should be done in many places... If more packages had 'random input workout' test rigs, I'd gladly run them in the idle time of quite a few boxes, and potentially catch a bug or two. From riel at redhat.com Sun Mar 20 06:07:32 2005 From: riel at redhat.com (Rik van Riel) Date: Sun, 20 Mar 2005 01:07:32 -0500 (EST) Subject: Xen SMP bug + workaround In-Reply-To: <20050318000101.GA20302@osiris.silug.org> References: <20050318000101.GA20302@osiris.silug.org> Message-ID: On Thu, 17 Mar 2005, Steven Pritchard wrote: > On Thu, Mar 17, 2005 at 05:30:56PM -0500, Rik van Riel wrote: > > today's Xen RPM is broken, in that it doesn't boot on SMP > > systems and/or systems with HT CPUs. The obvious workaround > > is to boot xen with 'nosmp'. > > This isn't new breakage, is it? I haven't been able to boot my dual > PIII test box with Xen for a while now... (Of course I hadn't thought > of "nosmp", which works as expected.) Indeed, it's been broken for a bit, I just hadn't noticed it yet. We're still tracking down the source, once the bug is fixed you'll see it in the rawhide report ;) -- "Debugging is twice as hard as writing the code in the first place. Therefore, if you write the code as cleverly as possible, you are, by definition, not smart enough to debug it." - Brian W. Kernighan From paul at all-the-johnsons.co.uk Sun Mar 20 10:38:11 2005 From: paul at all-the-johnsons.co.uk (Paul) Date: Sun, 20 Mar 2005 10:38:11 +0000 Subject: usb_storage In-Reply-To: <20050319190341.1331a0f4@localhost.localdomain> References: <20050316132536.2c968d17@localhost.localdomain> <20050319190341.1331a0f4@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <1111315091.9137.86.camel@localhost.localdomain> Hi, > > Mar 17 14:06:26 localhost kernel: usb 1-4: device descriptor read/64, error -71 > >[...] > > (this is what happens when I plug a SanDisk usb 2 CF reader in on my > > laptop) > > This is a little better than the silly mail which started the thread, > but is not good enough, Peter. At least let me know what kernel you're > running and what was the last kernel working (needless to say, with the > same reader, same laptop, same port), please. Latest rawhide kernel, latest HAL, latest everything. My internal USB card reader is not reading cards despite being happily recognised by HAL. TTFN Paul -- "It is often said that something cannot be libel if it is the truth. This has had to be amended to 'something cannot be libel if it is the truth or if the bank balance says otherwise'" - US Today -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part URL: From wtogami at redhat.com Sun Mar 20 10:56:43 2005 From: wtogami at redhat.com (Warren Togami) Date: Sun, 20 Mar 2005 00:56:43 -1000 Subject: RFC: rpm auto-glib version enforcement Message-ID: <423D56EB.6030106@redhat.com> # Require Binary Compatible glib %define glib_ver %(pkg-config --modversion glib-2.0 | cut -d. -f 1,2) Requires: glib2 >= %{glib_ver} I added this to gaim.spec a while ago because users were installing rawhide gaim compiled against glib2-2.6.x on FC3, which has glib2-2.4.x. gaim was then crashing because: 1) applications compiled against a newer glib are not backwards ABI compatible. AFAIK glib is supposed to be only forward ABI compatible. [1] 2) glib does not use verisoned so names 3) so rpm auto-dep cannot enforce compatible glib ABI version # Require Binary Compatible glib %define glib_ver %(pkg-config --modversion glib-2.0 | cut -d. -f 1,2) Requires: glib2 >= %{glib_ver} What the above spec chunk does is read the pkgconfig file contained in glib2-devel, and cut out the the major and minor version. That version is used to make an artificial RPM dependency on glib versions that are supposed to be ABI compatible with the package. While it is totally unsupported for a user to install packages from newer distributions on older distributions, they do it anyway. It causes upset feelings, confusion, and a waste of time with bogus reports. But there may be a simple and robust way to automate and avoid this problem. Proposal: RPM (via redhat-rpm-config?) should implicitly add something like the above spec blob in order to enforce glib ABI dep, but *only* if the binary payload actually links to glib. Thoughts? Is this feasible to implement in a clean way? Will this fail in any corner cases? [1] https://bugzilla.redhat.com/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=149190 This is unrelated to the above RFC, but if I understand this correctly, glib2-2.6 g_stat() changed in such a way that breaks ABI forward compat. Somebody that knows glib better can verify or explain this? Or maybe it was already fixed upstream. From thuforuk at yahoo.co.uk Sun Mar 20 11:06:16 2005 From: thuforuk at yahoo.co.uk (Dariusz J. Garbowski) Date: Sun, 20 Mar 2005 11:06:16 +0000 Subject: packages list In-Reply-To: <1111278021.11240.3.camel@cutter> References: <1111019608.4169.175.camel@petra> <1111025287.5267.4.camel@cutter> <4238F49A.1030107@yahoo.co.uk> <1111047752.4169.221.camel@petra> <423C9C09.3070807@yahoo.co.uk> <1111278021.11240.3.camel@cutter> Message-ID: <423D5928.4040604@yahoo.co.uk> On 03/20/2005 12:20 AM, seth vidal wrote: >>I for one would prefer your script. Shows useful information. I feel >>that keeping it hidden on some closed server is a shame. > > > How is it a closed server?? It's mirrored, everywhere. ANYONE can access > the information. There's nothing closed about it at all. You cut a bit too much from my post (actually part of Karel's post): >> If I will prepare nice web page for users only, I'm sure that I will use >> your script rather than my. (Hmm.. maybe we can for official fedora web >> pages use your repoview and for internal RH developers use my script with all FC+RHEL...). I understood (perhaps wrong) that Karel proposed hosting results of his script on some internal RH server. Was I wrong? Repoview of extras is of course open -- at least I could browse it :-) I do not deny that there might be place for both, repoview and Karel's, views of repositories. It does not even have to be on the same server. Just to be clear: I like repoview. It's just Karel's script seems even more useful to me. >>Personally I really hate when people underestimate user's intelligence >>-- have some faith! > > > No, I've been a sysadmin for a long time and I've followed the HIG > discussions with gnome. They're right, too much information overwhelms > people. period. There we go again -- being a long time (years!) believer in Gnome, that it eventually gets to some good balance, I'm starting to loose my faith :(( Lack of information is as bad as too much information (if not worse). But let's just stop this discussion here. We won't get anywhere and this mailing list definitely does not need a flamewar, does it? ;-) Regards, Dariusz From list at bistromatic.de Sun Mar 20 11:17:56 2005 From: list at bistromatic.de (Lars Hamann) Date: Sun, 20 Mar 2005 12:17:56 +0100 Subject: anaconda mkfs.xfs problem Message-ID: <1111317477.12430.51.camel@arthur.sinus> Hi, installing fc4t1 I found, a anaconda/xfs problem. Anaconda was unable to format a xfs-partition. The bug report (#151378) was closed with "wontfix", because xfs is unsupported. While this is fine with me, I wondered how anaconda-xfs support was broken, because it works in fc3. So I looked into it myself and found the problem in fsset.py. anaconda-10.1.0.2 did the following: rc = iutil.execWithRedirect("/usr/sbin/mkfs.xfs", ["mkfs.xfs", "-f", "-l", "internal", devicePath ], stdout = "/dev/tty5", stderr = "/dev/tty5") anaconda-10.2.0.28 changed that to: rc = iutil.execWithRedirect("/usr/sbin/mkfs.xfs", ["mkfs.xfs", "-f", "-l", "internal", "-i size=" + str(entry.bytesPerInode), devicePath ], stdout = "/dev/tty5", stderr = "/dev/tty5") This is wrong in two ways. First this line is executed as: mkfs.xfs "-f" "-l" "internal" "-i size=4096" >/dev/tty5 2>&1 But "-i size=4096" is not one parameter. It must be two parameters. And second, xfs max inode size is 2048 (as far as I know). So I think that change should be reverted or it should be changed to something like: xfsBytesPerInode = 2048 if entry.bytesPerInode < 2048: xfsBytesPerInode = entry.bytesPerInode rc = iutil.execWithRedirect("/usr/sbin/mkfs.xfs", ["mkfs.xfs", "-f", "-l", "internal", "-i", "size=" + str(xfsBytesPerInode), devicePath ], stdout = "/dev/tty5", stderr = "/dev/tty5") (please excuse my bad python, it's not my native language :) So what can I do? Can I reopen the bug or something? Regards, Lars -- Lars Hamann From buildsys at redhat.com Sun Mar 20 13:14:55 2005 From: buildsys at redhat.com (Build System) Date: Sun, 20 Mar 2005 08:14:55 -0500 Subject: rawhide report: 20050320 changes Message-ID: <200503201314.j2KDEtHO011442@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> Updated Packages: glibc-2.3.4-16 -------------- * Sun Mar 20 2005 Jakub Jelinek 2.3.4-16 - fix pread with -D_FILE_OFFSET_BITS=64 (#151573) * Sat Mar 19 2005 Jakub Jelinek 2.3.4-15 - update from CVS - better fix for the dlclose bug (#145810, #150414) - fix regex crash on case insensitive search in zh_CN locale (#151215) - fix malloc_trim (BZ#779) - with -D_FORTIFY_SOURCE=*, avoid defining read and a bunch of others as function-like macros, there are too many broken programs out there - add %dir /usr/lib64/gconv to glibc's file list (#151372) libidn-0.5.15-1 --------------- * Sun Mar 20 2005 Joe Orton 0.5.15-1 - update to 0.5.15 nautilus-cd-burner-2.10.0-2 --------------------------- * Sat Mar 19 2005 Florian La Roche - "," is no delim for ExcludeArch openoffice.org-1:1.9.85-1 ------------------------- * Tue Mar 15 2005 Caolan McNamara 1:1.9.85-1 - bump to latest version - add the contrib non-core dictionaries, and allow them to be split up between the languagepacks - use gcj-dbtool during build pam-0.78-8 ---------- * Fri Mar 18 2005 Tomas Mraz 0.78-8 - remove ownership and permissions handling from pam_console call pam_console_apply as a handler instead * Mon Mar 14 2005 Tomas Mraz 0.78-7 - add pam_loginuid module for setting the the login uid for auditing purposes (by Steve Grubb) * Thu Mar 10 2005 Tomas Mraz 0.78-6 - add functionality for running handler executables from pam_console when console lock was obtained/lost - removed patches merged to pam-redhat perl-Compress-Zlib-1.33-7 ------------------------- * Sat Mar 19 2005 Joe Orton 1.33-7 - rebuild perl-XML-LibXML-1.58-2 ---------------------- splint-3.1.1-6 -------------- * Sat Mar 19 2005 Miloslav Trmac - 3.1.1-6 - Ship the manual in PDF instead of HTML with missing images (#62434) system-config-nfs-1.3.3-1 ------------------------- * Sat Mar 19 2005 Nils Philippsen 1.3.3-1 - install python files as well... * Sat Mar 19 2005 Nils Philippsen 1.3.2-1 - install glade file From mike at navi.cx Sun Mar 20 14:16:18 2005 From: mike at navi.cx (Mike Hearn) Date: Sun, 20 Mar 2005 14:16:18 +0000 Subject: AntiVirus? References: <3adc77210503181735711e04a0@mail.gmail.com> <20050319014623.GE18511@angus.ind.WPI.EDU> Message-ID: On Sat, 19 Mar 2005 16:51:43 -0500, Gregory Maxwell wrote: > If an untrusted source can execute code on your computer the game is over. Web browsers do that all the time with JavaScript. So it's not over, you just have to be careful. > Antivirus makes sense when thats all you can do, ... when you're on a > platform of proprietary software with no ability to test or improve the > code running there. No, anti-virus makes sense because the moment a bug is fixed the fix does not appear on peoples systems. Online update for most Linux distros is useless for dialup users, and worse most online update sites can be taken down by a well timed DDoS anyway. > The viruses and worms that have grown up on windows have now reached a > level of sophistication that simple pattern matching isn't good > enough... I disagree. While it's true that you can write very sophisticated viruses, the most prevalent viruses are actually very simple. A virus scanner doesn't have to work 100% of the time to be useful. > Lets worry about antivirus software if the day ever comes that > mass-spreading pathogens outpace the communities ability to actually fix > the code, until then using such tools would only slow our pace of fixing > actual bugs... As already pointed out, bugfixes don't instantly appear on peoples desktops. There are still a significant number of people running completely unpatched, out of the box Red Hat 9 installs. This situation will not change anytime soon, no matter how much we might like it to. > Virus scanners don't generally solve the problem of > one-off attacks by qualified and determined adversaries, which is a much > more dangerous threat in many ways... Fixing bugs stops them and they > also stop the bulk spreading stuff, and fixing bugs is something we can > do in the free software world that is much harder in the proprietary > code world. If that was true then nothing on my desktop would ever crash, and everything would have wonderful usability. That's clearly wrong, therefore I think it's also wrong that being open source gives people immunity to bugs (of which there will always be more). Developing a native anti-virus system *now* before the shit hits the fan, can only be a good idea. If nothing ever happens, then it was merely wasted effort. Hell, if I had infinite amounts of spare time I'd do it, it's an interesting enough problem. Saying that bugfixing is a suitable replacement implies that Windows users who enabled automatic update don't need a virus scanner anymore, which I'm not convinced is true. thanks -mike From mike at navi.cx Sun Mar 20 14:19:07 2005 From: mike at navi.cx (Mike Hearn) Date: Sun, 20 Mar 2005 14:19:07 +0000 Subject: RFC: rpm auto-glib version enforcement References: <423D56EB.6030106@redhat.com> Message-ID: On Sun, 20 Mar 2005 00:56:43 -1000, Warren Togami wrote: > But there may be a simple and robust way to automate and avoid > this problem. There is, you can apply 1-level symbol versions and RPM will use them to understand library minor versions. This is easy to do though it *MUST* be done upstream. Doing this downstream will strongly risk breaking binary compatibility with other distributions which is unacceptable. Fortunately the patch to add 1-level (as opposed to multi-level like glibc itself uses) symbol versioning is fairly trivial. The hardest part is figuring out which symbols are exported by which versions but I expect given a set of RPMs it could be automated. Doing this for glib (or indeed the entire GTK+ stack) would be a nice feature improvement for the next major release I'd think, but obviously you'd need to take this to gtk-devel-list. thanks -mike From roli at israel-jugendtag.ch Sun Mar 20 15:25:45 2005 From: roli at israel-jugendtag.ch (=?ISO-8859-15?Q?Roland_K=E4ser?=) Date: Sun, 20 Mar 2005 16:25:45 +0100 Subject: Bugzilla Target for Rawhide Message-ID: <423D95F9.9060508@israel-jugendtag.ch> Hi all First of all: Congratulations for the FC4 Relase. I downloaded it and tried something with it. This probably the best Redhat (Fedora) release ever. It contains still some bugs I whould like to post. But on the bottom line it looks very good. Special the xen and gfs I'm currently testing (only xen) can become our company internal core technology for failover. Many thanks Roland K?ser Systems Administrator *SWISS TECHNOLOGIES* -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From roli at israel-jugendtag.ch Sun Mar 20 15:28:17 2005 From: roli at israel-jugendtag.ch (=?ISO-8859-15?Q?Roland_K=E4ser?=) Date: Sun, 20 Mar 2005 16:28:17 +0100 Subject: LDAP Message-ID: <423D9691.2000807@israel-jugendtag.ch> Hello all Short question. Based on the big improvement to the authenication configuration, whould it not be possible to integrate and ldap authentication (ldap server setup on distribution install) for the user accounts additionally to the passwd/shadow mechanism? Thanks Roland Kaeser Roland K?ser Systems Administrator *SWISS TECHNOLOGIES* -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From Axel.Thimm at ATrpms.net Sun Mar 20 15:45:24 2005 From: Axel.Thimm at ATrpms.net (Axel Thimm) Date: Sun, 20 Mar 2005 16:45:24 +0100 Subject: RFC: rpm auto-glib version enforcement In-Reply-To: <423D56EB.6030106@redhat.com> References: <423D56EB.6030106@redhat.com> Message-ID: <20050320154524.GA6647@neu.nirvana> On Sun, Mar 20, 2005 at 12:56:43AM -1000, Warren Togami wrote: > # Require Binary Compatible glib > %define glib_ver %(pkg-config --modversion glib-2.0 | cut -d. -f 1,2) > Requires: glib2 >= %{glib_ver} > > I added this to gaim.spec a while ago because users were installing > rawhide gaim compiled against glib2-2.6.x on FC3, which has glib2-2.4.x. > gaim was then crashing because: > > 1) applications compiled against a newer glib are not backwards ABI > compatible. AFAIK glib is supposed to be only forward ABI compatible. [1] > 2) glib does not use verisoned so names > 3) so rpm auto-dep cannot enforce compatible glib ABI version > > # Require Binary Compatible glib > %define glib_ver %(pkg-config --modversion glib-2.0 | cut -d. -f 1,2) > Requires: glib2 >= %{glib_ver} > > What the above spec chunk does is read the pkgconfig file contained in > glib2-devel, and cut out the the major and minor version. That version > is used to make an artificial RPM dependency on glib versions that are > supposed to be ABI compatible with the package. > > While it is totally unsupported for a user to install packages from > newer distributions on older distributions, they do it anyway. It > causes upset feelings, confusion, and a waste of time with bogus > reports. But there may be a simple and robust way to automate and avoid > this problem. > > > Proposal: > RPM (via redhat-rpm-config?) should implicitly add something like the > above spec blob in order to enforce glib ABI dep, but *only* if the > binary payload actually links to glib. > > Thoughts? > Is this feasible to implement in a clean way? > Will this fail in any corner cases? Supporting a broken library versioning scheme by automated rpm workarounds doesn't sound like a good idea. You are better off trying to educate upstream authors to start bumping up the major version every decade or so ... If you start doing so with glib2 you'l have to do the same with pango, gtk2, atk, ... (... doesn't stop ...) > [1] > https://bugzilla.redhat.com/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=149190 > This is unrelated to the above RFC, but if I understand this correctly, > glib2-2.6 g_stat() changed in such a way that breaks ABI forward compat. > Somebody that knows glib better can verify or explain this? Or maybe > it was already fixed upstream. > -- Axel.Thimm at ATrpms.net -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: not available URL: From rstrode at redhat.com Sun Mar 20 16:00:39 2005 From: rstrode at redhat.com (Ray Strode) Date: Sun, 20 Mar 2005 11:00:39 -0500 Subject: rawhide report: 20050318 changes In-Reply-To: References: <200503181310.j2IDA6dw024446@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> Message-ID: <1111334439.4052.1.camel@localhost.localdomain> Hi, > when using the new (& verry nice!) clearlooks theme (or any other theme > using the gnome icons) there is no icon for "Office" in the menu, because > gnome-desktop doesn't provide /usr/share/pixmaps/gnome-applications.png > which is used by linking from > /usr/share/icons/hicolor/48x48/apps/redhat-office.png provided by > gnome-icon-theme. > > ah and by the way, please give gedit and the bonobo component browser > an working icon too :) Can you file a bug report about these issues so they don't get forgotton about? Thanks, Ray Strode From gmaxwell at gmail.com Sun Mar 20 16:11:09 2005 From: gmaxwell at gmail.com (Gregory Maxwell) Date: Sun, 20 Mar 2005 11:11:09 -0500 Subject: AntiVirus? In-Reply-To: References: <3adc77210503181735711e04a0@mail.gmail.com> <20050319014623.GE18511@angus.ind.WPI.EDU> Message-ID: On Sun, 20 Mar 2005 14:16:18 +0000, Mike Hearn wrote: > On Sat, 19 Mar 2005 16:51:43 -0500, Gregory Maxwell wrote: > > If an untrusted source can execute code on your computer the game is over. > > Web browsers do that all the time with JavaScript. So it's not over, you > just have to be careful. The context you removed my text from was referring to 'removing' malicious after it's loose on a system... Fundamentally it's a very difficult problem, and it has no relation to running sandboxed code. If, through things like SElinux, someday we find the typical system is running almost entirely sandboxed software than the rules change substantially in the favor of security. But once something has escaped it's sandbox we're back to it being very difficult to remove. > No, anti-virus makes sense because the moment a bug is fixed the > fix does not appear on peoples systems. Online update for most Linux > distros is useless for dialup users, and worse most online update sites > can be taken down by a well timed DDoS anyway. Fixes don't magically appear... But code to detect instances of exploitation of the bug are magically written, and magically appear on systems? If download times are really the crux of the issue, then we should develop a binary patching service. Xdelta diffs for little bug fixes will likely end up being much smaller than 'anti-virus' definitions. > > The viruses and worms that have grown up on windows have now reached a > > level of sophistication that simple pattern matching isn't good > > enough... > > I disagree. While it's true that you can write very sophisticated viruses, > the most prevalent viruses are actually very simple. A virus scanner > doesn't have to work 100% of the time to be useful. The malware of the day on windows these days is binary patching the shell to hide their files, and the task manager to hide their operation. Some are patching the kernel now, but thats not supercommon yet, but thats only because it's not needed to defeat the current generation of antivirus protection. Long before windows ends it's reign of terror this arms race process will have caused superior malware which is near impossible to remove to become commonplace. There is no reason to think the malware authors will forget all their skills when they reset their sights on Linux desktops. > As already pointed out, bugfixes don't instantly appear on peoples > desktops. There are still a significant number of people running > completely unpatched, out of the box Red Hat 9 installs. This situation > will not change anytime soon, no matter how much we might like it to. Antivirus software and antivirus updates don't instantly appear on peoples desktops. Any solution that makes antivirus updates instantly appear can make bug fixes instantly appear. Furthermore, as microsoft has found out because of their shoddy fixing practices: There can be instances of a bug exploit per security bug... If you write detection code to catch an instance, a new one will just come out much faster than you can write more detection code.. You need to match the security hole.. but once you've done that, you might as well fix it. > > Virus scanners don't generally solve the problem of > > one-off attacks by qualified and determined adversaries, which is a much > > more dangerous threat in many ways... Fixing bugs stops them and they > > also stop the bulk spreading stuff, and fixing bugs is something we can > > do in the free software world that is much harder in the proprietary > > code world. > > If that was true then nothing on my desktop would ever crash, and > everything would have wonderful usability. That's clearly wrong, therefore > I think it's also wrong that being open source gives people immunity to > bugs (of which there will always be more). **shrugs** I have had no crashes on my fc3 laptop. :) But of course, in using linux since 1994 I've seen my share of buggy code.... I wasn't claiming that free software was bug free, but rather this: In the windows world, If I'm someone concerned about security and I detect a hole in some windows program. .. My only legal options are to scream and cry about it, and maybe write some anti-virus code to catch it being exploited. If the creator of the software doesn't care, I'm pretty much out of luck for getting a real fix. In the free software world, if I find a bug I have the right to fix it, and the ability to share my fix... Which will likely be quickly accepted into the mainline code, since I did all the work already. > Developing a native anti-virus system *now* before the shit hits the fan, > can only be a good idea. It's already done, see clamav, so it's a moot point. Also other tools list host and network based IDSes can be put to work on this application. [snip] > Saying that bugfixing is a suitable > replacement implies that Windows users who enabled automatic update don't > need a virus scanner anymore, which I'm not convinced is true. It's an entirely different game in windows. The system is fundamentally insecure, and users have been conditioned through years of social norms to perform unsafe behaviors. It's very difficult to live a life as a windows user without routinely downloading executing binaries from unaccountable random places on the Internet. With linux, it's quite reasonable to only run software that comes from a handful of widely used package repositories. This whole discussion is really offtopic for this list, I feel stupid for participating in it. :) From ghenry at suretecsystems.com Sun Mar 20 16:32:31 2005 From: ghenry at suretecsystems.com (Gavin Henry) Date: Sun, 20 Mar 2005 16:32:31 +0000 Subject: LDAP In-Reply-To: <423D9691.2000807@israel-jugendtag.ch> References: <423D9691.2000807@israel-jugendtag.ch> Message-ID: <200503201632.31942.ghenry@suretecsystems.com> On Sunday 20 Mar 2005 15:28, Roland K?ser wrote: > Hello all > > Short question. Based on the big improvement to the authenication > configuration, whould it not be possible to integrate and ldap > authentication (ldap server setup on distribution install) for the user > accounts additionally to the passwd/shadow mechanism? Is it not better to only create a root user, then run "setup" to implement a LDAP auth system? Each workstation should retain a root user incase the LDAP server becomes unavailable. -- Kind Regards, Gavin Henry. Managing Director. T +44 (0) 1224 279484 M +44 (0) 7930 323266 F +44 (0) 1224 742001 E ghenry at suretecsystems.com Open Source. Open Solutions(tm). http://www.suretecsystems.com/ From otaylor at redhat.com Sun Mar 20 16:39:34 2005 From: otaylor at redhat.com (Owen Taylor) Date: Sun, 20 Mar 2005 11:39:34 -0500 Subject: RFC: rpm auto-glib version enforcement In-Reply-To: <20050320154524.GA6647@neu.nirvana> References: <423D56EB.6030106@redhat.com> <20050320154524.GA6647@neu.nirvana> Message-ID: <1111336774.9124.87.camel@huygens> On Sun, 2005-03-20 at 16:45 +0100, Axel Thimm wrote: > > Thoughts? > > Is this feasible to implement in a clean way? > > Will this fail in any corner cases? > > Supporting a broken library versioning scheme by automated rpm > workarounds doesn't sound like a good idea. You are better off trying > to educate upstream authors to start bumping up the major version > every decade or so ... > > If you start doing so with glib2 you'l have to do the same with pango, > gtk2, atk, ... (... doesn't stop ...) Why would we change the major version of GLib when we haven't broken binary compatibility? As you say, if you change the major version of GLib, you have to change the major version of *every single library that depends on glib*. We're not going to do that. Using new symbol versions for the symbols we introduce in new versions of GLib would be a nice touch and would help RPM figure things out; but: - It can't be done retroactively. There's no way (save ugly and inefficient alias hacks) to introduce symbols for GLib 2.2, 2.4, 2.6 - It's hard to do in a way that won't break the build on non-GCC, non-ELF platforms without support in libtool. But if someone wanted to tackle making the GLib symbol handling yet more complicated to get versions for 2.8 symbols, I think it could be a useful (upstream) contribution. > > [1] > > https://bugzilla.redhat.com/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=149190 > > This is unrelated to the above RFC, but if I understand this correctly, > > glib2-2.6 g_stat() changed in such a way that breaks ABI forward compat. > > Somebody that knows glib better can verify or explain this? Or maybe > > it was already fixed upstream. http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=167942 maybe. g_stat() is new in 2.6 so there's clearly no backwards/forward compat problem, but there was a problem if the app and library didn't match in terms of large file support. Regards, Owen -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part URL: From otaylor at redhat.com Sun Mar 20 16:51:38 2005 From: otaylor at redhat.com (Owen Taylor) Date: Sun, 20 Mar 2005 11:51:38 -0500 Subject: RFC: rpm auto-glib version enforcement In-Reply-To: <423D56EB.6030106@redhat.com> References: <423D56EB.6030106@redhat.com> Message-ID: <1111337498.9124.98.camel@huygens> On Sun, 2005-03-20 at 00:56 -1000, Warren Togami wrote: > # Require Binary Compatible glib > %define glib_ver %(pkg-config --modversion glib-2.0 | cut -d. -f 1,2) > Requires: glib2 >= %{glib_ver} > > I added this to gaim.spec a while ago because users were installing > rawhide gaim compiled against glib2-2.6.x on FC3, which has glib2-2.4.x. > gaim was then crashing because: > > 1) applications compiled against a newer glib are not backwards ABI > compatible. AFAIK glib is supposed to be only forward ABI compatible. [1] > 2) glib does not use verisoned so names > 3) so rpm auto-dep cannot enforce compatible glib ABI version Your use of backwards/forward compatible here is reversed from what we use in the GTK+ project. Backwards compatibility means that the library is compatible with older applications. Forwards compatibility means that the applications compiled with newer libraries work with older applications... something we only guarantee within a stable series. > # Require Binary Compatible glib > %define glib_ver %(pkg-config --modversion glib-2.0 | cut -d. -f 1,2) > Requires: glib2 >= %{glib_ver} > > What the above spec chunk does is read the pkgconfig file contained in > glib2-devel, and cut out the the major and minor version. That version > is used to make an artificial RPM dependency on glib versions that are > supposed to be ABI compatible with the package. > > While it is totally unsupported for a user to install packages from > newer distributions on older distributions, they do it anyway. It > causes upset feelings, confusion, and a waste of time with bogus > reports. But there may be a simple and robust way to automate and avoid > this problem. I think it's inappropriate to add this sort of thing to particular spec files ... while it may solve some user problems, the accumulation of this type of cruft is going to make the spec files unmaintainable. Doing it in the redhat-config-rpm would make more sense ... but I'm not really sure there is anything special about glib. Other than libc, the number of libraries we ship that add new symbol versions for newly added symbols is close to zero. GLib-2.6 perhaps is a little more of any issue than many because the expansion of g_return_if_fail() changed to include a new symbol, but RPM cannot correctly find the required version of *any* library that introduces new symbols without symbol versioning. Regards, Owen -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part URL: From Axel.Thimm at ATrpms.net Sun Mar 20 17:20:03 2005 From: Axel.Thimm at ATrpms.net (Axel Thimm) Date: Sun, 20 Mar 2005 18:20:03 +0100 Subject: RFC: rpm auto-glib version enforcement In-Reply-To: <1111336774.9124.87.camel@huygens> References: <423D56EB.6030106@redhat.com> <20050320154524.GA6647@neu.nirvana> <1111336774.9124.87.camel@huygens> Message-ID: <20050320172003.GB10956@neu.nirvana> On Sun, Mar 20, 2005 at 11:39:34AM -0500, Owen Taylor wrote: > On Sun, 2005-03-20 at 16:45 +0100, Axel Thimm wrote: > > > > Thoughts? > > > Is this feasible to implement in a clean way? > > > Will this fail in any corner cases? > > > > Supporting a broken library versioning scheme by automated rpm > > workarounds doesn't sound like a good idea. You are better off trying > > to educate upstream authors to start bumping up the major version > > every decade or so ... > > > > If you start doing so with glib2 you'l have to do the same with pango, > > gtk2, atk, ... (... doesn't stop ...) > > Why would we change the major version of GLib when we haven't broken > binary compatibility? Isn't compatibility broken (be it forward or backward), if I build against glib 2.6, but ldd still allows runtime linking against glib 2.4 which is missing symbols? That's not an rpm issue (therfore also nothing rpm should try to save), it seems to break at a lower level. -- Axel.Thimm at ATrpms.net -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: not available URL: From otaylor at redhat.com Sun Mar 20 18:03:34 2005 From: otaylor at redhat.com (Owen Taylor) Date: Sun, 20 Mar 2005 13:03:34 -0500 Subject: RFC: rpm auto-glib version enforcement In-Reply-To: <20050320172003.GB10956@neu.nirvana> References: <423D56EB.6030106@redhat.com> <20050320154524.GA6647@neu.nirvana> <1111336774.9124.87.camel@huygens> <20050320172003.GB10956@neu.nirvana> Message-ID: <1111341814.9124.108.camel@huygens> On Sun, 2005-03-20 at 18:20 +0100, Axel Thimm wrote: > On Sun, Mar 20, 2005 at 11:39:34AM -0500, Owen Taylor wrote: > > On Sun, 2005-03-20 at 16:45 +0100, Axel Thimm wrote: > > > > > > Thoughts? > > > > Is this feasible to implement in a clean way? > > > > Will this fail in any corner cases? > > > > > > Supporting a broken library versioning scheme by automated rpm > > > workarounds doesn't sound like a good idea. You are better off trying > > > to educate upstream authors to start bumping up the major version > > > every decade or so ... > > > > > > If you start doing so with glib2 you'l have to do the same with pango, > > > gtk2, atk, ... (... doesn't stop ...) > > > > Why would we change the major version of GLib when we haven't broken > > binary compatibility? > > Isn't compatibility broken (be it forward or backward), if I build > against glib 2.6, but ldd still allows runtime linking against glib > 2.4 which is missing symbols? Not under any normal definition of compatibility break. Normally, extending the compatibility of a library is considered to be permissible. It would be hard to make progress otherwise. soname changes to base libraries are very bad news. Symbol versioning (in the original Solaris version, not the extended GNU version) was intended to allow labeling new symbols in a new version of a library as such, but it's hard to use in a cross-platform library. Regards, Owen -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part URL: From nphilipp at redhat.com Sun Mar 20 18:10:12 2005 From: nphilipp at redhat.com (Nils Philippsen) Date: Sun, 20 Mar 2005 19:10:12 +0100 Subject: Bugzilla Target for Rawhide In-Reply-To: <423D95F9.9060508@israel-jugendtag.ch> References: <423D95F9.9060508@israel-jugendtag.ch> Message-ID: <1111342212.26208.2.camel@gibraltar.stuttgart.redhat.com> On Sun, 2005-03-20 at 16:25 +0100, Roland K?ser wrote: > Hi all > > First of all: Congratulations for the FC4 Relase. I downloaded it and > tried something with it. This probably the best Redhat (Fedora) > release ever. > It contains still some bugs I whould like to post. But on the bottom > line it looks very good. Special the xen and gfs I'm currently testing > (only xen) can become our company internal core technology for > failover. You have noticed that this was FC4 _test1_, haven't you? The actual final release is planned for June, see: http://fedora.redhat.com/participate/schedule/ Nils -- Nils Philippsen / Red Hat / nphilipp at redhat.com "They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety." -- B. Franklin, 1759 PGP fingerprint: C4A8 9474 5C4C ADE3 2B8F 656D 47D8 9B65 6951 3011 From nphilipp at redhat.com Sun Mar 20 18:14:42 2005 From: nphilipp at redhat.com (Nils Philippsen) Date: Sun, 20 Mar 2005 19:14:42 +0100 Subject: gimp-2.2.4-0.fc3.3 man pages In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1111342482.26208.5.camel@gibraltar.stuttgart.redhat.com> On Sat, 2005-03-19 at 17:03 +0000, susan_geller at speakeasy.net wrote: > It looks like the man pages intalled with gimp have somewhat unusual names: > > $ rpm -ql gimp | grep /usr/share/man > /usr/share/man/man1/gimp-2.2.1.gz > /usr/share/man/man1/gimp-remote-2.2.1.gz > /usr/share/man/man1/gimptool-2.0.1.gz > /usr/share/man/man5/gimprc-2.2.5.gz > > So you have to say: > $ man gimp-2.2 > > Instead of just: > $ man gimp > > Has anyone considered adding commands like: > $ ln -s /usr/share/man/man1/gimp-2.2.1.gz /usr/share/man/man1/gimp.1.gz > to the rpm post install script? please open a Bugzilla ticket for this one. Thanks, Nils -- Nils Philippsen / Red Hat / nphilipp at redhat.com "They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety." -- B. Franklin, 1759 PGP fingerprint: C4A8 9474 5C4C ADE3 2B8F 656D 47D8 9B65 6951 3011 From lkml at mac.com Sun Mar 20 18:16:52 2005 From: lkml at mac.com (Felipe Alfaro Solana) Date: Sun, 20 Mar 2005 19:16:52 +0100 Subject: LDAP In-Reply-To: <423D9691.2000807@israel-jugendtag.ch> References: <423D9691.2000807@israel-jugendtag.ch> Message-ID: <35d29cfa483e65c753bb8a2285d6ea80@mac.com> On 20 Mar 2005, at 16:28, Roland K?ser wrote: > Hello all Please, avoid posting in HTML... Thanks. From derek.p.moore at gmail.com Sun Mar 20 18:20:04 2005 From: derek.p.moore at gmail.com (Derek Moore) Date: Sun, 20 Mar 2005 12:20:04 -0600 Subject: rawhide report: 20050318 changes In-Reply-To: <1111334439.4052.1.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <200503181310.j2IDA6dw024446@porkchop.devel.redhat.com> <1111334439.4052.1.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: >> there is no icon for "Office" in the menu > > Can you file a bug report about these issues so they don't get forgotton > about? It also appears as though GnuCash is missing its icon. Did anyone file a "missing icons" bug yet? What's its #? I'll add GnuCash to the bug... From Axel.Thimm at ATrpms.net Sun Mar 20 18:28:05 2005 From: Axel.Thimm at ATrpms.net (Axel Thimm) Date: Sun, 20 Mar 2005 19:28:05 +0100 Subject: RFC: rpm auto-glib version enforcement In-Reply-To: <1111341814.9124.108.camel@huygens> References: <423D56EB.6030106@redhat.com> <20050320154524.GA6647@neu.nirvana> <1111336774.9124.87.camel@huygens> <20050320172003.GB10956@neu.nirvana> <1111341814.9124.108.camel@huygens> Message-ID: <20050320182805.GC10956@neu.nirvana> On Sun, Mar 20, 2005 at 01:03:34PM -0500, Owen Taylor wrote: > On Sun, 2005-03-20 at 18:20 +0100, Axel Thimm wrote: > > On Sun, Mar 20, 2005 at 11:39:34AM -0500, Owen Taylor wrote: > > > On Sun, 2005-03-20 at 16:45 +0100, Axel Thimm wrote: > > > > > > > > Thoughts? > > > > > Is this feasible to implement in a clean way? > > > > > Will this fail in any corner cases? > > > > > > > > Supporting a broken library versioning scheme by automated rpm > > > > workarounds doesn't sound like a good idea. You are better off trying > > > > to educate upstream authors to start bumping up the major version > > > > every decade or so ... > > > > > > > > If you start doing so with glib2 you'l have to do the same with pango, > > > > gtk2, atk, ... (... doesn't stop ...) > > > > > > Why would we change the major version of GLib when we haven't broken > > > binary compatibility? > > > > Isn't compatibility broken (be it forward or backward), if I build > > against glib 2.6, but ldd still allows runtime linking against glib > > 2.4 which is missing symbols? > > Not under any normal definition of compatibility break. That's like splitting hairs ;) The bottom line is that there is breakage. The pieces lie around in bugzilla and Warren's hands. Whether we call it compatibility breakness or otheriwse broken is secondary (although I would call this broken forward compatibility). > Normally, extending the compatibility of a library is considered to > be permissible. The proper use of sonames is to define an explicit set of signatures and symbols, no more no less. Unfortunately this is being tresspassed all the time so that doing so has become normal. For some libs (like glibc) this would indeed be very cumbersome, as each change would bump up the lib's major. Extending the interface of the library is backwards, but not forwards compatible. You always break forward-compatibility when not changing the soname. > It would be hard to make progress otherwise. soname changes to base > libraries are very bad news. That's why base libs should very carefully be considered for interface changes. But if there needs to be one, you need to bite the soname-bumping bullet, or live with breaking forward-compatibility. I mean, look at glib2, it hasn't bumped it's major since RH7.3 and I only checked that far back. It is quite possible, that at the end glib2 will have the same soname over a decade, with the newer lib being 10 times as big ... > Symbol versioning (in the original Solaris version, not the extended > GNU version) was intended to allow labeling new symbols in a new > version of a library as such, but it's hard to use in a > cross-platform library. Anyway, probably the sanest thing to do is to accept forward compatibility breakage and tell people mixing rawhide, fc3 and fc4t1 not to do so. Nothing breaks under normal usage, only the use cases where users were to impatient and pulled in a partial rawhide onto their system. -- Axel.Thimm at ATrpms.net -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: not available URL: From abo at kth.se Sun Mar 20 18:31:25 2005 From: abo at kth.se (Alexander =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Bostr=F6m?=) Date: Sun, 20 Mar 2005 19:31:25 +0100 Subject: LDAP In-Reply-To: <35d29cfa483e65c753bb8a2285d6ea80@mac.com> References: <423D9691.2000807@israel-jugendtag.ch> <35d29cfa483e65c753bb8a2285d6ea80@mac.com> Message-ID: <1111343485.18941.7.camel@tudor.e.kth.se> s?n 2005-03-20 klockan 19:16 +0100 skrev Felipe Alfaro Solana: > On 20 Mar 2005, at 16:28, Roland K?ser wrote: > > > Hello all > > Please, avoid posting in HTML... It was a multipart/alternative message with both HTML and plain text. There's nothing wrong with those. (I would actually *prefer* if people would send such messages instead of just the plain text, as long as the HTML is sane. No colours, backgrounds and fancy fonts, just

,
, , ,

, 
,  etc.)

Regarding the actual question: I seem to recall that specifying an LDAP
server in the the Kickstart configuration will cause it to be used both
for account information and for user authentication (password hashes).

/abo




From cmadams at hiwaay.net  Sun Mar 20 18:45:38 2005
From: cmadams at hiwaay.net (Chris Adams)
Date: Sun, 20 Mar 2005 12:45:38 -0600
Subject: LDAP
In-Reply-To: <1111343485.18941.7.camel@tudor.e.kth.se>
References: <423D9691.2000807@israel-jugendtag.ch>
	<35d29cfa483e65c753bb8a2285d6ea80@mac.com>
	<1111343485.18941.7.camel@tudor.e.kth.se>
Message-ID: <20050320184538.GA1504326@hiwaay.net>

Once upon a time, Alexander Bostrm  said:
> It was a multipart/alternative message with both HTML and plain text.
> There's nothing wrong with those. (I would actually *prefer* if people
> would send such messages instead of just the plain text, as long as the
> HTML is sane. No colours, backgrounds and fancy fonts, just 
, 
,
> , , 
, 
,  etc.)

Multipart/alternative text and HTML is the worst waste there is.  The
vast majority of the time, the HTML markup is just auto-generated stuff,
so all it really ends up being is a more than double-size message.

Mostly such email is spam (I drop such messages to my main mailbox).
-- 
Chris Adams 
Systems and Network Administrator - HiWAAY Internet Services
I don't speak for anybody but myself - that's enough trouble.



From cmadams at hiwaay.net  Sun Mar 20 18:49:11 2005
From: cmadams at hiwaay.net (Chris Adams)
Date: Sun, 20 Mar 2005 12:49:11 -0600
Subject: RFC: rpm auto-glib version enforcement
In-Reply-To: <20050320172003.GB10956@neu.nirvana>
References: <423D56EB.6030106@redhat.com> <20050320154524.GA6647@neu.nirvana>
	<1111336774.9124.87.camel@huygens>
	<20050320172003.GB10956@neu.nirvana>
Message-ID: <20050320184911.GB1504326@hiwaay.net>

Once upon a time, Axel Thimm  said:
> Isn't compatibility broken (be it forward or backward), if I build
> against glib 2.6, but ldd still allows runtime linking against glib
> 2.4 which is missing symbols?

Tru64's shared library versioning allows a library to say it is
compatible with older versions, but still have binaries built against
the new library require the new library.  For example, you can have the
library be version 3 (so all binaries linked against it require version
3) but say it is still compatible with version 2.

Is there a way to do something similar with Linux and/or ELF?
-- 
Chris Adams 
Systems and Network Administrator - HiWAAY Internet Services
I don't speak for anybody but myself - that's enough trouble.



From roli at israel-jugendtag.ch  Sun Mar 20 19:13:27 2005
From: roli at israel-jugendtag.ch (=?UTF-8?B?Um9sYW5kIEvDpHNlcg==?=)
Date: Sun, 20 Mar 2005 20:13:27 +0100
Subject: Bugzilla Target for Rawhide
In-Reply-To: <1111342212.26208.2.camel@gibraltar.stuttgart.redhat.com>
References: <423D95F9.9060508@israel-jugendtag.ch>
	<1111342212.26208.2.camel@gibraltar.stuttgart.redhat.com>
Message-ID: <423DCB57.2060803@israel-jugendtag.ch>

Hello

Of corse I'm aware of this. But just the Test 1 version looks very good.

Roland

Nils Philippsen schrieb:

>On Sun, 2005-03-20 at 16:25 +0100, Roland K?ser wrote:
>  
>
>>Hi all
>>
>>First of all: Congratulations for the FC4 Relase. I downloaded it and
>>tried something with it. This probably the best Redhat (Fedora)
>>release ever. 
>>It contains still some bugs I whould like to post. But on the bottom
>>line it looks very good. Special the xen and gfs I'm currently testing
>>(only xen) can become our company internal core technology for
>>failover. 
>>    
>>
>
>You have noticed that this was FC4 _test1_, haven't you? The actual
>final release is planned for June, see:
>http://fedora.redhat.com/participate/schedule/
>
>Nils
>  
>

-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: 

From rdieter at math.unl.edu  Sun Mar 20 19:20:33 2005
From: rdieter at math.unl.edu (Rex Dieter)
Date: Sun, 20 Mar 2005 13:20:33 -0600 (CST)
Subject: RFC: rpm auto-glib version enforcement
In-Reply-To: <423D56EB.6030106@redhat.com>
References: <423D56EB.6030106@redhat.com>
Message-ID: 

On Sun, 20 Mar 2005, Warren Togami wrote:

> # Require Binary Compatible glib
> %define glib_ver %(pkg-config --modversion glib-2.0 | cut -d. -f 1,2)
> Requires:       glib2 >= %{glib_ver}
...>
> Proposal:
> RPM (via redhat-rpm-config?) should implicitly add something like the above 
> spec blob in order to enforce glib ABI dep, but *only* if the binary payload 
> actually links to  glib.

I do similar stuff (like your glib_ver) in most kde-redhat packages for 
qt/kdelibs dependancies.  It's the cleanest/easiest workaround, at least 
until upstream packages choose to implement versioning for new 
symbols/functions (which, IMO, is the proper solution to this problem).

IMO, it would be best to leave such hacks out of 
redhat-rpm-config primarily because it is not *always* necessary, and 
should probably be handled in a case-by-case, package-by-package basis.

-- Rex



From roli at israel-jugendtag.ch  Sun Mar 20 19:21:20 2005
From: roli at israel-jugendtag.ch (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Roland_K=E4ser?=)
Date: Sun, 20 Mar 2005 20:21:20 +0100
Subject: LDAP
In-Reply-To: <20050320184538.GA1504326@hiwaay.net>
References: <423D9691.2000807@israel-jugendtag.ch>	<35d29cfa483e65c753bb8a2285d6ea80@mac.com>	<1111343485.18941.7.camel@tudor.e.kth.se>
	<20050320184538.GA1504326@hiwaay.net>
Message-ID: <423DCD30.4050308@israel-jugendtag.ch>

Hello

Sorry, but just because Your mail client isn't able to display this, 
makes it not worse! What's wrong, having text formating and colors in a 
email? Whould you prefer reading internet pages just in plain text? Or 
reading a book without any formatting? The additional code in html 
transports additional information! And by the way: The mail was written 
using Thunderbird not with the outlook virus catcher.

Roland

Chris Adams schrieb:

>Once upon a time, Alexander Bostrm  said:
>  
>
>>It was a multipart/alternative message with both HTML and plain text.
>>There's nothing wrong with those. (I would actually *prefer* if people
>>would send such messages instead of just the plain text, as long as the
>>HTML is sane. No colours, backgrounds and fancy fonts, just 
, 
,
>>, , 
, 
,  etc.)
>>    
>>
>
>Multipart/alternative text and HTML is the worst waste there is.  The
>vast majority of the time, the HTML markup is just auto-generated stuff,
>so all it really ends up being is a more than double-size message.
>
>Mostly such email is spam (I drop such messages to my main mailbox).
>  
>



From ghenry at suretecsystems.com  Sun Mar 20 19:25:21 2005
From: ghenry at suretecsystems.com (Gavin Henry)
Date: Sun, 20 Mar 2005 19:25:21 +0000
Subject: [Getting OP] Re: LDAP
In-Reply-To: <423DCD30.4050308@israel-jugendtag.ch>
References: <423D9691.2000807@israel-jugendtag.ch>
	<20050320184538.GA1504326@hiwaay.net>
	<423DCD30.4050308@israel-jugendtag.ch>
Message-ID: <200503201925.22248.ghenry@suretecsystems.com>

> >Multipart/alternative text and HTML is the worst waste there is.  The
> >vast majority of the time, the HTML markup is just auto-generated stuff,
> >so all it really ends up being is a more than double-size message.
> >
> >Mostly such email is spam (I drop such messages to my main mailbox).

Getting way, way off topic.

Are there any more answers to the original question?

-- 
Kind Regards,

Gavin Henry.
Managing Director.

T +44 (0) 1224 279484
M +44 (0) 7930 323266
F +44 (0) 1224 742001
E ghenry at suretecsystems.com

Open Source. Open Solutions(tm).

http://www.suretecsystems.com/



From jon at jonshouse.co.uk  Sun Mar 20 19:28:10 2005
From: jon at jonshouse.co.uk (Jonathan Andrews)
Date: Sun, 20 Mar 2005 19:28:10 +0000
Subject: Ethernet card, cable link state ?
Message-ID: <1111346890.1710.11.camel@jonspc>

Sorry if this is off topic, but i've googled myself into a corner.

Whats the best way to check the cable link state for an ethernet
connection under core 3 ? I assumed that I would find something in /proc
- but so far nothing seems to toggle between cable connected and cable
disconnected.  eth0 is up.

Is the link state tracked for all eth devices, the linux device driver I
book implies it is.

Any pointers at docs would be very helpful at this point.

Cheers,
Jon





From nphilipp at redhat.com  Sun Mar 20 19:28:40 2005
From: nphilipp at redhat.com (Nils Philippsen)
Date: Sun, 20 Mar 2005 20:28:40 +0100
Subject: Ethernet card, cable link state ?
In-Reply-To: <1111346890.1710.11.camel@jonspc>
References: <1111346890.1710.11.camel@jonspc>
Message-ID: <1111346920.26208.32.camel@gibraltar.stuttgart.redhat.com>

On Sun, 2005-03-20 at 19:28 +0000, Jonathan Andrews wrote:
> Sorry if this is off topic, but i've googled myself into a corner.
> 
> Whats the best way to check the cable link state for an ethernet
> connection under core 3 ? I assumed that I would find something in /proc
> - but so far nothing seems to toggle between cable connected and cable
> disconnected.  eth0 is up.
> 
> Is the link state tracked for all eth devices, the linux device driver I
> book implies it is.
> 
> Any pointers at docs would be very helpful at this point.

Try "ethtool eth0" and go from there.

Nils
-- 
     Nils Philippsen    /    Red Hat    /    nphilipp at redhat.com
"They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary
 safety deserve neither liberty nor safety."     -- B. Franklin, 1759
 PGP fingerprint:  C4A8 9474 5C4C ADE3 2B8F  656D 47D8 9B65 6951 3011



From mike at navi.cx  Sun Mar 20 19:39:35 2005
From: mike at navi.cx (Mike Hearn)
Date: Sun, 20 Mar 2005 19:39:35 +0000
Subject: RFC: rpm auto-glib version enforcement
References: <423D56EB.6030106@redhat.com> <20050320154524.GA6647@neu.nirvana>
	<1111336774.9124.87.camel@huygens>
	<20050320172003.GB10956@neu.nirvana>
Message-ID: 

On Sun, 20 Mar 2005 18:20:03 +0100, Axel Thimm wrote:
> Isn't compatibility broken (be it forward or backward), if I build
> against glib 2.6, but ldd still allows runtime linking against glib
> 2.4 which is missing symbols?

No, that's just a side effect of lazy fixup. The symbol isn't relocated
until its needed, which means you can eg click a menu item and have the
app abort because it called a symbol that was missing.

Adding 1-level symbol versions (which is supported by Solaris, Linux,
and possibly FreeBSD too but not Windows or MacOS) solves this problem by
giving the linker an efficient way to check the correct minor version is
available at runtime. If it's missing, the app terminates at startup
instead of at some unpredictable point in the future and even better, RPM
can check at install time.

As Owen has said though, very few libraries do this and it's hard to
introduce retro-actively. Getting upstream authors to do it would be a
long term project, but that's not a big deal, this isn't a huge
stop-the-presses problem either.

One possible hack would to be get RPM to invoke the linker on each
binary in a mode where it performs all the relocations ahead of time then
aborts. I think there is actually already such a mode, ldd is just a shell
script that uses it. That way you can check that all the symbols it needs
are present. But this is a big hack and not a replacement for symvers
because RPM only finds it out *after* the install, not at dep checking
time.

thanks -mike



From nhruby at uga.edu  Sun Mar 20 19:31:47 2005
From: nhruby at uga.edu (nathan r. hruby)
Date: Sun, 20 Mar 2005 14:31:47 -0500 (EST)
Subject: Ethernet card, cable link state ?
In-Reply-To: <1111346890.1710.11.camel@jonspc>
References: <1111346890.1710.11.camel@jonspc>
Message-ID: 

On Sun, 20 Mar 2005, Jonathan Andrews wrote:

> Sorry if this is off topic, but i've googled myself into a corner.
>

It is off topic and sounds like a fedora-list question, please see:
http://www.fedoraproject.org/wiki/PostIsOffTopic

> Whats the best way to check the cable link state for an ethernet
> connection under core 3 ? I assumed that I would find something in /proc
> - but so far nothing seems to toggle between cable connected and cable
> disconnected.  eth0 is up.
>

But the answer is either ethtool or mii-tool.

Please point all replies at fedora-list,

Thanks!

-n
-- 
-------------------------------------------
nathan hruby 
uga enterprise information technology services
production systems support
metaphysically wrinkle-free
-------------------------------------------



From mike at navi.cx  Sun Mar 20 19:48:01 2005
From: mike at navi.cx (Mike Hearn)
Date: Sun, 20 Mar 2005 19:48:01 +0000
Subject: AntiVirus?
References: <3adc77210503181735711e04a0@mail.gmail.com>
	<20050319014623.GE18511@angus.ind.WPI.EDU>
	
	
	
	
Message-ID: 

On Sun, 20 Mar 2005 11:11:09 -0500, Gregory Maxwell wrote:
> Fixes don't magically appear... But code to detect instances of
> exploitation of the bug are magically written, and magically appear on
> systems?

Well, this is a good point. It's possible though to write generic scanners
that detect suspicious behaviour. Also generally AV definitions are much
smaller than software patches. Binary patch RPMs could help with that.

I think it is often easier to write a AV detection update than a bugfix
update though, especially if the flaw is a design issue and not a simple
typo/mis-use of strcpy.

> If download times are really the crux of the issue, then we should
> develop a binary patching service. Xdelta diffs for little bug fixes
> will likely end up being much smaller than 'anti-virus' definitions.

I'm not so sure, some fixes can be quite large. But I don't have any
numbers either way so maybe you are right.

> The malware of the day on windows these days is binary patching the
> shell to hide their files, and the task manager to hide their operation.

Yes, I know. Still there are many viruses (as opposed to spyware) which
just exploit a buffer overflow and replicate, or even just mail/IM
themselves to people in the address book. 

> Long before windows ends it's reign of terror this arms race process
> will have caused  superior malware which is near impossible to remove to
> become commonplace. There is no  reason to think the malware authors
> will forget all their skills when they reset their sights on Linux
> desktops.

Indeed, you are right that it's an arms race. Unfortunately we are in the
unfortunate position here: without some way to try and clean up after a
widespread outbreak we are relying on getting lucky every time, but the
bad guys only need to get lucky once or twice.

> In the windows world, If I'm someone concerned about security and I
> detect a hole in some windows program. .. My only legal options are to
> scream and cry about it, and maybe write some anti-virus code to catch
> it being exploited. If the creator of the software doesn't care, I'm
> pretty much out of luck for getting a real fix.
> 
> In the free software world, if I find a bug I have the right to fix it,
> and the ability to share my fix... Which will likely be quickly accepted
> into the mainline code, since I did all the work already.

Yes, that's true if it's still maintained. But most exploits are for the
OS or OS-level services. How often do you hear about Photoshop viruses? Or
Half-Life viruses?

> It's already done, see clamav, so it's a moot point. Also other tools
> list host and network based IDSes can be put to work on this
> application.

Well ClamAV is a server product for detecting Windows viruses, right? It's
not an end-user level product for the Linux desktop.

> It's an entirely different game in windows. The system is fundamentally
> insecure, and users have been conditioned through years of social norms
> to perform unsafe behaviors.  It's very difficult to live a life as a
> windows user without routinely downloading executing binaries from
> unaccountable random places on the Internet. With linux, it's quite
> reasonable to only run software that comes from a handful of widely used
> package repositories.

Oh well I'm not convinced that works better either :) After all, who
audited all the code going into Fedora Extras? Including all 100,000 lines
of configure script? Hmm, I think we trust upstream ...

thanks -mike



From czar at czarc.net  Sun Mar 20 20:48:23 2005
From: czar at czarc.net (Gene C.)
Date: Sun, 20 Mar 2005 15:48:23 -0500
Subject: RFC: rpm auto-glib version enforcement
In-Reply-To: <423D56EB.6030106@redhat.com>
References: <423D56EB.6030106@redhat.com>
Message-ID: <200503201548.23348.czar@czarc.net>

On Sunday 20 March 2005 05:56, Warren Togami wrote:
> I added this to gaim.spec a while ago because users were installing
> rawhide gaim compiled against glib2-2.6.x on FC3, which has glib2-2.4.x.
> ? gaim was then crashing because:
>
> 1) applications compiled against a newer glib are not backwards ABI
> compatible. ?AFAIK glib is supposed to be only forward ABI compatible. [1]
> 2) glib does not use verisoned so names
> 3) so rpm auto-dep cannot enforce compatible glib ABI version

Warren -- anyone who takes a binary package from an up-level release and tries 
to run it on a down-level system will likely get problems (e.g., from rawhide 
on FC3).  While newbies may not understand this, experienced users should.

Somehow, there needs to be education that taking packages from up-level (e.g., 
rawhide) to be run on a down-level system MUST be rebuilt on the down-level 
systems.

I certainly understand your frustration with these "extra" bugzilla reports 
but there must be a better way than kluging the spec files.
-- 
Gene



From wtogami at redhat.com  Sun Mar 20 20:51:22 2005
From: wtogami at redhat.com (Warren Togami)
Date: Sun, 20 Mar 2005 10:51:22 -1000
Subject: RFC: rpm auto-glib version enforcement
In-Reply-To: <200503201548.23348.czar@czarc.net>
References: <423D56EB.6030106@redhat.com> <200503201548.23348.czar@czarc.net>
Message-ID: <423DE24A.4000800@redhat.com>

Gene C. wrote:
> On Sunday 20 March 2005 05:56, Warren Togami wrote:
> 
>>I added this to gaim.spec a while ago because users were installing
>>rawhide gaim compiled against glib2-2.6.x on FC3, which has glib2-2.4.x.
>>  gaim was then crashing because:
>>
>>1) applications compiled against a newer glib are not backwards ABI
>>compatible.  AFAIK glib is supposed to be only forward ABI compatible. [1]
>>2) glib does not use verisoned so names
>>3) so rpm auto-dep cannot enforce compatible glib ABI version
> 
> 
> Warren -- anyone who takes a binary package from an up-level release and tries 
> to run it on a down-level system will likely get problems (e.g., from rawhide 
> on FC3).  While newbies may not understand this, experienced users should.
> 
> Somehow, there needs to be education that taking packages from up-level (e.g., 
> rawhide) to be run on a down-level system MUST be rebuilt on the down-level 
> systems.
> 
> I certainly understand your frustration with these "extra" bugzilla reports 
> but there must be a better way than kluging the spec files.

"there must be a better way than kluging the spec files"
And I did propose a way that does this automatically without kludging 
spec files.

Warren Togami
wtogami at redhat.com



From bernd.bartmann at gmail.com  Sun Mar 20 20:56:36 2005
From: bernd.bartmann at gmail.com (Bernd Bartmann)
Date: Sun, 20 Mar 2005 21:56:36 +0100
Subject: Status of USB install support in FC4 Test1?
Message-ID: <6c18a4f05032012568db6393@mail.gmail.com>

Hi,

what's the status in FC4 Test1 for install support to USB storage
devices. FC3 only seems to allow installation to USB storage devices
in expert mode and even then you have to manually created an initrd
with support for the USB storage modules. Is there any progress in
this area planned for FC4?

Thanks in advance,
Bernd.



From mike at navi.cx  Sun Mar 20 21:13:15 2005
From: mike at navi.cx (Mike Hearn)
Date: Sun, 20 Mar 2005 21:13:15 +0000
Subject: RFC: rpm auto-glib version enforcement
References: <423D56EB.6030106@redhat.com> <200503201548.23348.czar@czarc.net>
Message-ID: 

On Sun, 20 Mar 2005 15:48:23 -0500, Gene C. wrote:
> Somehow, there needs to be education that taking packages from up-level (e.g., 
> rawhide) to be run on a down-level system MUST be rebuilt on the down-level 
> systems.

Well, or we could fix the problems that make it hard to build on newer and
run on older. This isn't rocket science, nor is it a problem that affects
Windows developers. 

In other words this isn't some fundamental unchangeable thing, it's just a
side effect of eg, not using versioned headers, library instability
(fortunately not affecting the GTK/GNOME stack) etc etc.

thanks -mike



From Nicolas.Mailhot at laPoste.net  Sun Mar 20 21:09:34 2005
From: Nicolas.Mailhot at laPoste.net (Nicolas Mailhot)
Date: Sun, 20 Mar 2005 22:09:34 +0100
Subject: AntiVirus?
In-Reply-To: 
References: <3adc77210503181735711e04a0@mail.gmail.com>
	<20050319014623.GE18511@angus.ind.WPI.EDU>
	
	
	
	
	
Message-ID: <1111352977.26693.1.camel@rousalka.dyndns.org>

Le dimanche 20 mars 2005 ? 19:48 +0000, Mike Hearn a ?crit :
> On Sun, 20 Mar 2005 11:11:09 -0500, Gregory Maxwell wrote:

> > It's already done, see clamav, so it's a moot point. Also other tools
> > list host and network based IDSes can be put to work on this
> > application.
> 
> Well ClamAV is a server product for detecting Windows viruses, right? It's
> not an end-user level product for the Linux desktop.

These days any end-user will have an inbox filled with mail worms
Clamav saves the day here

-- 
Nicolas Mailhot
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From gmaxwell at gmail.com  Sun Mar 20 21:10:03 2005
From: gmaxwell at gmail.com (Gregory Maxwell)
Date: Sun, 20 Mar 2005 16:10:03 -0500
Subject: AntiVirus?
In-Reply-To: 
References: <3adc77210503181735711e04a0@mail.gmail.com>
	<20050319014623.GE18511@angus.ind.WPI.EDU>
	
	
	
	
	
Message-ID: 

On Sun, 20 Mar 2005 19:48:01 +0000, Mike Hearn  wrote:
> On Sun, 20 Mar 2005 11:11:09 -0500, Gregory Maxwell wrote:
> > Fixes don't magically appear... But code to detect instances of
> > exploitation of the bug are magically written, and magically appear on
> > systems?
> 
> Well, this is a good point. It's possible though to write generic scanners
> that detect suspicious behaviour. Also generally AV definitions are much
> smaller than software patches. Binary patch RPMs could help with that.

Sure but generic scanners become easier to work around.. it's really
is a fundamentally hard problem to determine what a program is doing.
 
> I think it is often easier to write a AV detection update than a bugfix
> update though, especially if the flaw is a design issue and not a simple
> typo/mis-use of strcpy.

Nah.. It's easier to catch a specific instance of an exploit than to
write a fix in some cases, but to write generic detection code you
must understand the bug..   It's pretty uncommon for security holes to
be difficult to fix, except in a few cases with insecure protocols...
and in those cases it's easier to just put exploit detection code in
the app, until you can get around to replacing it with something
secure.

> I'm not so sure, some fixes can be quite large. But I don't have any
> numbers either way so maybe you are right.

I've used xdelta in the past on update rpms... they are small.. but
with current practice of not backporting fixes, they might end up
bigger.
 
> Yes, I know. Still there are many viruses (as opposed to spyware) which
> just exploit a buffer overflow and replicate, or even just mail/IM
> themselves to people in the address book.

It's useless to only attack viruses, spyware is by *far* the bigger
problem on windows desktops these days, and antiviruses are usually
ineffective at stopping worms (since the whole internet gets infected
before someone can identify the spreading method).
 
> Indeed, you are right that it's an arms race. Unfortunately we are in the
> unfortunate position here: without some way to try and clean up after a
> widespread outbreak we are relying on getting lucky every time, but the
> bad guys only need to get lucky once or twice.

It's not even an arms race.. Once someone has gotten root priv code to
run on your system  it's terribly difficult to remove it.  There are
quite a few linux rootkits today that are harder than a reinstall to
remove, and even once you've done that you fundamentally can't be sure
that the system is secure.
 
> Yes, that's true if it's still maintained. But most exploits are for the
> OS or OS-level services. How often do you hear about Photoshop viruses? Or
> Half-Life viruses?

I'd say the majority of malicious code on windows desktops these days
is coming in via outlook and internet explorer... often exploiting
bugs there.   It's much easier to make the basic OS secure than the
apps..  This is why things like SE linux are important, if we can
sufficiently sandbox all the applications it might not matter that
much if we can secure them or not.

> Well ClamAV is a server product for detecting Windows viruses, right? It's
> not an end-user level product for the Linux desktop.

ClamAV is a cross platform antivirus package that supports both server
scanning techniques (such as operating as a milter) and desktop style
virus scanner support (intercepting file IO).  It has definitions for
the existing linux viruses and worms, in addition to all the windows
cruft.  As I said, it's a solved problem.

There are quite a few host based IDS systems that do a pretty good job
of anomaly detection... from tools as simple as tripwire, to much more
complex tools like the monitoring code included with the honeypot
toolset and snort.

None of this makes it possible to be sure your machine is secure once
it's been exploited.

> > It's an entirely different game in windows. The system is fundamentally
> > insecure, and users have been conditioned through years of social norms
> > to perform unsafe behaviors.  It's very difficult to live a life as a
> > windows user without routinely downloading executing binaries from
> > unaccountable random places on the Internet. With linux, it's quite
> > reasonable to only run software that comes from a handful of widely used
> > package repositories.
> 
> Oh well I'm not convinced that works better either :) After all, who
> audited all the code going into Fedora Extras? Including all 100,000 lines
> of configure script? Hmm, I think we trust upstream ...

Perhaps no one did... but it's likely that it *could* be caught... If
I toss up some website with nasty windows binaries I could get
thousands of people with very little risk of detection, and very
little accountability chain to track me down.

You mentioned before that you thought it would be interesting to write
antivirus software, but since thats already been done, ... might I
suggest something more interesting:

Write software code that tracks changes to packages and detects
changes that might introduce security weaknesses.  It's also a
difficult problem, but probably an easier problem than antivirus in
the long run... It would be useful today (since as you pointed out,
bugs are added, often unintentionally), and isn't quite as vulnerable
to the antivirus arms race.



From gmaxwell at gmail.com  Sun Mar 20 21:27:14 2005
From: gmaxwell at gmail.com (Gregory Maxwell)
Date: Sun, 20 Mar 2005 16:27:14 -0500
Subject: AntiVirus?
In-Reply-To: <1111352977.26693.1.camel@rousalka.dyndns.org>
References: <3adc77210503181735711e04a0@mail.gmail.com>
	<20050319014623.GE18511@angus.ind.WPI.EDU>
	
	
	
	
	
	<1111352977.26693.1.camel@rousalka.dyndns.org>
Message-ID: 

On Sun, 20 Mar 2005 22:09:34 +0100, Nicolas Mailhot
 wrote:
> These days any end-user will have an inbox filled with mail worms
> Clamav saves the day here

hah How true.. Yes, I too find it useful as a spam filter.. Don't care
much about it's antivirus abilities, but it's great for spam
filtering. :)



From rodd at clarkson.id.au  Sun Mar 20 23:17:50 2005
From: rodd at clarkson.id.au (Rodd Clarkson)
Date: Mon, 21 Mar 2005 10:17:50 +1100
Subject: Ethernet card, cable link state ?
In-Reply-To: <1111346920.26208.32.camel@gibraltar.stuttgart.redhat.com>
References: <1111346890.1710.11.camel@jonspc>
	<1111346920.26208.32.camel@gibraltar.stuttgart.redhat.com>
Message-ID: <1111360670.3663.7.camel@jellyfish.redfishdemo.com>


> > Is the link state tracked for all eth devices, the linux device driver I
> > book implies it is.
> > 
> > Any pointers at docs would be very helpful at this point.
> 
> Try "ethtool eth0" and go from there.

Hmmm, while on this (and I think this is a devel related issue)...

I've just moved from a Compaq Armada to a Dell Latitude and one of the
first things I noticed was that during boot-up the network card in the
Dell seems to think it's 'plugged-in' even when there is no cable there.

For example, when the compaq booted, it would note that there was no
cable connected and just move on (instead of stalling while trying to
start a netword card that wasn't connected).  The Dell, however, stalls
for a while, trying to establish the impossible (a wired connection
without a cable).

Is this a bug, and if so, should it be reported?  The wired connection
(when I've used it) seems to work well, although I haven't given it
anything stressful to really test it.


Rodd



From mike at navi.cx  Sun Mar 20 23:29:12 2005
From: mike at navi.cx (Mike Hearn)
Date: Sun, 20 Mar 2005 23:29:12 +0000
Subject: AntiVirus?
References: <3adc77210503181735711e04a0@mail.gmail.com>
	<20050319014623.GE18511@angus.ind.WPI.EDU>
	
	
	
	
	
	
Message-ID: 

On Sun, 20 Mar 2005 16:10:03 -0500, Gregory Maxwell wrote:
> I've used xdelta in the past on update rpms... they are small.. but
> with current practice of not backporting fixes, they might end up
> bigger.

Yeah, OK. It'd be nice to have them anyway, the sheer volume of updates
makes them a pain to install even on ADSL.
  
> It's useless to only attack viruses, spyware is by *far* the bigger
> problem on windows desktops these days, and antiviruses are usually
> ineffective at stopping worms (since the whole internet gets infected
> before someone can identify the spreading method).

Right. Actually I have a prototype SELinux "quarantine zone" policy file
open in emacs right now. I've been writing a packaging/installer system
for a while and the spyware question is common enough to be in the FAQ:

  http://www.autopackage.org/faq.html#4_3

Not saying it's the right solution, but it's something I (we) have been
thinking about a fair bit.

> It's not even an arms race.. Once someone has gotten root priv code to
> run on your system  it's terribly difficult to remove it.  There are
> quite a few linux rootkits today that are harder than a reinstall to
> remove, and even once you've done that you fundamentally can't be sure
> that the system is secure.

There are rootkits that can't be removed by a format/reinstall? How does
that work?

> ClamAV is a cross platform antivirus package that supports both server
> scanning techniques (such as operating as a milter) and desktop style
> virus scanner support (intercepting file IO).  It has definitions for
> the existing linux viruses and worms, in addition to all the windows
> cruft.  As I said, it's a solved problem.

Ah interesting, I eat my words then. I guess you are right, solved problem
(though it'd have to be installed by default I guess, with some GUI?)

> Write software code that tracks changes to packages and detects changes
> that might introduce security weaknesses.  It's also a difficult
> problem, but probably an easier problem than antivirus in the long
> run... It would be useful today (since as you pointed out, bugs are
> added, often unintentionally), and isn't quite as vulnerable to the
> antivirus arms race.

The new GCC mudflap system might help here. I don't know how badly it hits
performance but I seem to recall reading it was meant to be used during
development only, so I guess a fair bit ... 

I think it'd be more interesting to try developing some kind of
whitelist/trust system to counter spyware/malware. Still it's a good idea.

Thanks for correcting some of my misconceptions!

-mike



From agentunix at gmail.com  Sun Mar 20 23:26:08 2005
From: agentunix at gmail.com (Zachary Napora)
Date: Sun, 20 Mar 2005 15:26:08 -0800
Subject: AntiVirus?
In-Reply-To: 
References: <3adc77210503181735711e04a0@mail.gmail.com>
	<20050319014623.GE18511@angus.ind.WPI.EDU>
	
	
	
	
	
	
	
Message-ID: 

> 
> There are rootkits that can't be removed by a format/reinstall? How does
> that work?
> 
I've seen some rootkits that actually install into the hardware of the
computer, if that is what he is talking about.



From gmaxwell at gmail.com  Sun Mar 20 23:47:41 2005
From: gmaxwell at gmail.com (Gregory Maxwell)
Date: Sun, 20 Mar 2005 18:47:41 -0500
Subject: AntiVirus?
In-Reply-To: 
References: <3adc77210503181735711e04a0@mail.gmail.com>
	<20050319014623.GE18511@angus.ind.WPI.EDU>
	
	
	
	
	
	
	
Message-ID: 

On Sun, 20 Mar 2005 23:29:12 +0000, Mike Hearn  wrote:
> Right. Actually I have a prototype SELinux "quarantine zone" policy file
> open in emacs right now. I've been writing a packaging/installer system
> for a while and the spyware question is common enough to be in the FAQ:

What would be neat is for somone to make a version of GLIBC that can
live inside a seccomp jail, a little loader that can prelink an
executable with that glibc and put it in  the jail,  and an interface
that lets you "yes / no" syscalls. :)
 
> Not saying it's the right solution, but it's something I (we) have been
> thinking about a fair bit.

The commentary there on the lack of signing is a little weird....  If
I setup a mirror repo, people need to trust *me* to use it unless the
packages are signed.. Even if they are only signed by some package
site ... it's far less likely that they will be compromised there on
that site rather than mine (they won't intentionally compromise the
files because they have a reputation to uphold, and lots of people use
their output so it's more likely that bad things would get noticed
than just some packages off my system).

It's not perfect security, but it is a big additional hurdle.

 
> > It's not even an arms race.. Once someone has gotten root priv code to
> > run on your system  it's terribly difficult to remove it.  There are
> > quite a few linux rootkits today that are harder than a reinstall to
> > remove, and even once you've done that you fundamentally can't be sure
> > that the system is secure.
> 
> There are rootkits that can't be removed by a format/reinstall? How does
> that work?

Hah. No, I meant that you might as well reformat/reinstall because the
rootkit is so darn hard to remove, pointing to the futility of
antivirus type techniques (esp generic ones).

Of course, irremovable security breaches *are* possible.. Flash the
bios to patch cpu microcode ....  It's not that unrealistic, .. you
make some FP exception change pump the system into ring zero.. Then
later you attack again, make some jailed code push the exception and
then start overwriting kernel memory. :)    But that wasn't what I was
talking about.

> > ClamAV is a cross platform antivirus package that supports both server
> > scanning techniques (such as operating as a milter) and desktop style
> > virus scanner support (intercepting file IO).  It has definitions for
> > the existing linux viruses and worms, in addition to all the windows
> > cruft.  As I said, it's a solved problem.
> 
> Ah interesting, I eat my words then. I guess you are right, solved problem
> (though it'd have to be installed by default I guess, with some GUI?)

Since it's already there, and it's clear that it will be much more
useful prior to the arms race (you argue that it will be somewhat
useful after the arms race, I argue that it will not be useful at
all.... Time will tell, I suppose) why don't we allow those that need
the highest level of protection install it themselves now and get the
benefit of the full pre-arms race gain, ... and only make it a default
once it's clear that it's needed.... Maximizing whatever gain it has,
and giving more time for better security measures to be created.

> > Write software code that tracks changes to packages and detects changes
> > that might introduce security weaknesses.  It's also a difficult
> The new GCC mudflap system might help here. I don't know how badly it hits
> performance but I seem to recall reading it was meant to be used during
> development only, so I guess a fair bit ...

It's not going to find very much, really, perhaps if coupled with a
pretty good regression suite with random test cases. :)    Source code
analysis has a lot more potential, especially if you're working with
the assumption that the original code is secure and you're just
looking for patches that break it.

> I think it'd be more interesting to try developing some kind of
> whitelist/trust system to counter spyware/malware. Still it's a good idea.

The problem is that you'd only want to whitelist audited code.. And
with the pace of development it's not clear that it's reasonable to
keep enough code well enough audited to warrant such a system....

Another approach would be to make strong jails the norm, greatly
reducing the amount of code that must be audited to produce a trusted
environment.

Refactoring apps, apis, and user expectations to accept running most
applications in a highly jailed environment... plus improving the
performance and scalability of our jails would be a good step in this
direction. i.e. why does gaim need to access any of the file system
outside of ~/.gaim? ... The only obvious exception is file transfers,
... the file transfer system could work by having another little
program that poped up and asked for which file, and communicated over
a socket back to the more heavily jailed gaim... The file program
could be simple enough to be proven secure (if not for the fact that
it must call GTK).

But getting developers and users to understand that they need to build
their apps in this way when the can is a huge challenge...  Getting
selinux to scale to supporting several different finegrained security
policies for every application on the system, much less getting the
selinux aware package maintainers to scale, will be a challenge as
well. :)

> Thanks for correcting some of my misconceptions!

No problem.



From mike at navi.cx  Mon Mar 21 00:39:52 2005
From: mike at navi.cx (Mike Hearn)
Date: Mon, 21 Mar 2005 00:39:52 +0000
Subject: AntiVirus?
References: <3adc77210503181735711e04a0@mail.gmail.com>
	<20050319014623.GE18511@angus.ind.WPI.EDU>
	
	
	
	
	
	
	
	
Message-ID: 

On Sun, 20 Mar 2005 18:47:41 -0500, Gregory Maxwell wrote:
> The commentary there on the lack of signing is a little weird....  If
> I setup a mirror repo, people need to trust *me* to use it unless the
> packages are signed.. 

Ah well the context of that FAQ is for a distributed 3rd party
installer/package hybrid system. So there are no repositories. Projects
like Gaim can (and do) provide their own binary packages independent of
distributions. So, while you *can* sign packages, without some web or
heirarchy of trust it means little as they will typically be mirrored only
by SourceForge or somesuch ...

It doesn't mean we won't do it, it just means it needs careful thought and
implementation.

> Hah. No, I meant that you might as well reformat/reinstall because the
> rootkit is so darn hard to remove, pointing to the futility of
> antivirus type techniques (esp generic ones).

Ah well, yes. But only if there are kernel exploits, I guess. 

> Since it's already there, and it's clear that it will be much more
> useful prior to the arms race (you argue that it will be somewhat
> useful after the arms race, I argue that it will not be useful at
> all.... Time will tell, I suppose) why don't we allow those that need
> the highest level of protection install it themselves now and get the
> benefit of the full pre-arms race gain, ... and only make it a default
> once it's clear that it's needed.... Maximizing whatever gain it has,
> and giving more time for better security measures to be created.

Hmm. I guess that makes sense. If it becomes clear that it's needed
installing it by default is not a hard change to make.

> It's not going to find very much, really, perhaps if coupled with a
> pretty good regression suite with random test cases. :)    Source code
> analysis has a lot more potential, especially if you're working with
> the assumption that the original code is secure and you're just
> looking for patches that break it.

OK. I don't know much about that type of analysis.

> The problem is that you'd only want to whitelist audited code.. And
> with the pace of development it's not clear that it's reasonable to
> keep enough code well enough audited to warrant such a system....

In the FAQ/NOTES file I argue that it's better to be liberal with
whitelisting and then have a good revocation system. IOW it's more about
stopping people once they proved untrustworthy rather than attempting to
ascertain the danger of their code beforehand. Once user reports of "this
program is spying on me!" start rolling in you can revoke those packages.

> Refactoring apps, apis, and user expectations to accept running most
> applications in a highly jailed environment... plus improving the
> performance and scalability of our jails would be a good step in this
> direction. i.e. why does gaim need to access any of the file system
> outside of ~/.gaim? ... The only obvious exception is file transfers,
> ... the file transfer system could work by having another little
> program that poped up and asked for which file, and communicated over
> a socket back to the more heavily jailed gaim... The file program
> could be simple enough to be proven secure (if not for the fact that
> it must call GTK).

Yes. That is sort of the theory behind SELinux. Splitting programs into
multiple components like that is what my 3rd year dissertation will be on
(just have to get it approved, pretty likely to happen). More
specifically, it's on a fast local form of RPC that requires minimal code
changes - sort of a more generic form of what Colin Walters has been
doing with imsep except for any library or sub-module, not just gdk-pixbuf
loaders.

> But getting developers and users to understand that they need to build
> their apps in this way when the can is a huge challenge...  Getting
> selinux to scale to supporting several different finegrained security
> policies for every application on the system, much less getting the
> selinux aware package maintainers to scale, will be a challenge as
> well. :)

Oh yes, there's a lot of work still to do :)

thanks -mike



From jdesbonnet at gmail.com  Mon Mar 21 00:37:13 2005
From: jdesbonnet at gmail.com (Joe Desbonnet)
Date: Mon, 21 Mar 2005 00:37:13 +0000
Subject: fc4test1 bugs
Message-ID: <1cef3e9505032016374587d1f6@mail.gmail.com>

Is it acceptable to report fc4test1 bugs here or should they go
straight into bugzilla? Two things I noticed while installing:

Trying to install from ISO images on local HDD option failed. I tried
with an external USB drive and then an IDE drive. It failed to find
the images on both occasions (yes I'm sure I got the path correct).

Also: it would be nice to be able to specify the network port for the
HTTP install option. Right now it assumes port 80.

Like a previous post today, it would be really, really nice to be 
able to install on a USB drive without having to make new initrds etc.

Joe.



From jspaleta at gmail.com  Mon Mar 21 01:32:27 2005
From: jspaleta at gmail.com (Jeff Spaleta)
Date: Sun, 20 Mar 2005 20:32:27 -0500
Subject: fc4test1 bugs
In-Reply-To: <1cef3e9505032016374587d1f6@mail.gmail.com>
References: <1cef3e9505032016374587d1f6@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <604aa7910503201732697a4973@mail.gmail.com>

On Mon, 21 Mar 2005 00:37:13 +0000, Joe Desbonnet  wrote:
> Is it acceptable to report fc4test1 bugs here or should they go
> straight into bugzilla? Two things I noticed while installing:


fedora-test-list is for discussion...but bugzilla is the only way to
make sure your bug is actually seen by the correct package maintainer.
fedora-devel-list is not the most appropriate place for bug
discussions.

-jef



From walters at redhat.com  Mon Mar 21 03:02:47 2005
From: walters at redhat.com (Colin Walters)
Date: Sun, 20 Mar 2005 22:02:47 -0500
Subject: AntiVirus?
In-Reply-To: 
References: <3adc77210503181735711e04a0@mail.gmail.com>
	<20050319014623.GE18511@angus.ind.WPI.EDU>
	
	
	
	
	
	
	
	
Message-ID: <1111374167.4592.42.camel@nexus.verbum.private>

On Sun, 2005-03-20 at 18:47 -0500, Gregory Maxwell wrote:
> On Sun, 20 Mar 2005 23:29:12 +0000, Mike Hearn  wrote:
> > Right. Actually I have a prototype SELinux "quarantine zone" policy file
> > open in emacs right now. I've been writing a packaging/installer system
> > for a while and the spyware question is common enough to be in the FAQ:
> 
> What would be neat is for somone to make a version of GLIBC that can
> live inside a seccomp jail, a little loader that can prelink an
> executable with that glibc and put it in  the jail,  and an interface
> that lets you "yes / no" syscalls. :)

Prompting the user for access control decisions at the level of system
calls is not useful unless your target audience is solely "Linux kernel
developer"; i.e. .01% of Fedora users at best.  Even at a much higher
level you have to assume that if you prompt for this kind of stuff, 50%
of the time they're going to get it wrong.  









From hp at redhat.com  Mon Mar 21 03:39:22 2005
From: hp at redhat.com (Havoc Pennington)
Date: Sun, 20 Mar 2005 22:39:22 -0500
Subject: AntiVirus?
In-Reply-To: <1111374167.4592.42.camel@nexus.verbum.private>
References: <3adc77210503181735711e04a0@mail.gmail.com>
	<20050319014623.GE18511@angus.ind.WPI.EDU>
	
	
	
	
	
	
	
	
	<1111374167.4592.42.camel@nexus.verbum.private>
Message-ID: <1111376363.12804.1.camel@localhost.localdomain>

On Sun, 2005-03-20 at 22:02 -0500, Colin Walters wrote:
> On Sun, 2005-03-20 at 18:47 -0500, Gregory Maxwell wrote:
> > On Sun, 20 Mar 2005 23:29:12 +0000, Mike Hearn  wrote:
> > > Right. Actually I have a prototype SELinux "quarantine zone" policy file
> > > open in emacs right now. I've been writing a packaging/installer system
> > > for a while and the spyware question is common enough to be in the FAQ:
> > 
> > What would be neat is for somone to make a version of GLIBC that can
> > live inside a seccomp jail, a little loader that can prelink an
> > executable with that glibc and put it in  the jail,  and an interface
> > that lets you "yes / no" syscalls. :)
> 
> Prompting the user for access control decisions at the level of system
> calls is not useful unless your target audience is solely "Linux kernel
> developer"; i.e. .01% of Fedora users at best.  Even at a much higher
> level you have to assume that if you prompt for this kind of stuff, 50%
> of the time they're going to get it wrong.  

I think you mean 99.9% ;-)

Havoc




From notting at redhat.com  Mon Mar 21 03:47:22 2005
From: notting at redhat.com (Bill Nottingham)
Date: Sun, 20 Mar 2005 22:47:22 -0500
Subject: rawhide report: 20050318 changes
In-Reply-To: <1111218160.18284.103.camel@arena.soho.bytebot.net>
References: <200503181310.j2IDA6dw024446@porkchop.devel.redhat.com>
	<20050318164400.GA11393@nostromo.devel.redhat.com>
	<1111177267.4830.8.camel@cutter>
	<1111218160.18284.103.camel@arena.soho.bytebot.net>
Message-ID: <20050321034722.GB10610@nostromo.devel.redhat.com>

Colin Charles (byte at aeon.com.my) said: 
> > can we pull in irssi from extras and drop epic while you're on irc
> > clients?
> 
> Just to add that the maintainer of epic agreed to drop it and bring
> irssi instead
> 
> pvrabec did so:
> Message-ID: <42231A8A.1080702 at redhat.com>
> Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2005 14:20:10 +0100  (Tue, 00:20 EST)

OK, whenever he wants to build it....

Bill



From gmaxwell at gmail.com  Mon Mar 21 03:51:12 2005
From: gmaxwell at gmail.com (Gregory Maxwell)
Date: Sun, 20 Mar 2005 22:51:12 -0500
Subject: AntiVirus?
In-Reply-To: <1111374167.4592.42.camel@nexus.verbum.private>
References: <3adc77210503181735711e04a0@mail.gmail.com>
	
	
	
	
	
	
	
	
	<1111374167.4592.42.camel@nexus.verbum.private>
Message-ID: 

On Sun, 20 Mar 2005 22:02:47 -0500, Colin Walters  wrote:
> On Sun, 2005-03-20 at 18:47 -0500, Gregory Maxwell wrote:
> > On Sun, 20 Mar 2005 23:29:12 +0000, Mike Hearn  wrote:
> > > Right. Actually I have a prototype SELinux "quarantine zone" policy file
> > > open in emacs right now. I've been writing a packaging/installer system
> > > for a while and the spyware question is common enough to be in the FAQ:
> >
> > What would be neat is for somone to make a version of GLIBC that can
> > live inside a seccomp jail, a little loader that can prelink an
> > executable with that glibc and put it in  the jail,  and an interface
> > that lets you "yes / no" syscalls. :)
> 
> Prompting the user for access control decisions at the level of system
> calls is not useful unless your target audience is solely "Linux kernel
> developer"; i.e. .01% of Fedora users at best.  Even at a much higher
> level you have to assume that if you prompt for this kind of stuff, 50%
> of the time they're going to get it wrong.

Well I was thinking along the lines of the author of one of those
antivirus/worm tools,  but you're right.. it would only ever be used
... and other tools like debuggers work just as well for many things. 
(plus I recall there was a syscall intercepting expect toolkit thing
published elseware)



From nphilipp at redhat.com  Mon Mar 21 08:25:01 2005
From: nphilipp at redhat.com (Nils Philippsen)
Date: Mon, 21 Mar 2005 09:25:01 +0100
Subject: Ethernet card, cable link state ?
In-Reply-To: <1111360670.3663.7.camel@jellyfish.redfishdemo.com>
References: <1111346890.1710.11.camel@jonspc>
	<1111346920.26208.32.camel@gibraltar.stuttgart.redhat.com>
	<1111360670.3663.7.camel@jellyfish.redfishdemo.com>
Message-ID: <1111393501.8759.1.camel@gibraltar.stuttgart.redhat.com>

Rodd,

On Mon, 2005-03-21 at 10:17 +1100, Rodd Clarkson wrote:

> I've just moved from a Compaq Armada to a Dell Latitude and one of the
> first things I noticed was that during boot-up the network card in the
> Dell seems to think it's 'plugged-in' even when there is no cable there.
> 
> For example, when the compaq booted, it would note that there was no
> cable connected and just move on (instead of stalling while trying to
> start a netword card that wasn't connected).  The Dell, however, stalls
> for a while, trying to establish the impossible (a wired connection
> without a cable).
> 
> Is this a bug, and if so, should it be reported?  The wired connection
> (when I've used it) seems to work well, although I haven't given it
> anything stressful to really test it.

please verify what ethtool reports when the cable isn't plugged in (and
mii-tool while you're at it). If the hardware doesn't tell the software
that the cable's not plugged in, there's not much we can do...

Nils
-- 
     Nils Philippsen    /    Red Hat    /    nphilipp at redhat.com
"They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary
 safety deserve neither liberty nor safety."     -- B. Franklin, 1759
 PGP fingerprint:  C4A8 9474 5C4C ADE3 2B8F  656D 47D8 9B65 6951 3011



From nphilipp at redhat.com  Mon Mar 21 08:30:32 2005
From: nphilipp at redhat.com (Nils Philippsen)
Date: Mon, 21 Mar 2005 09:30:32 +0100
Subject: fc4test1 bugs
In-Reply-To: <604aa7910503201732697a4973@mail.gmail.com>
References: <1cef3e9505032016374587d1f6@mail.gmail.com>
	<604aa7910503201732697a4973@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <1111393832.8759.5.camel@gibraltar.stuttgart.redhat.com>

On Sun, 2005-03-20 at 20:32 -0500, Jeff Spaleta wrote:
> On Mon, 21 Mar 2005 00:37:13 +0000, Joe Desbonnet  wrote:
> > Is it acceptable to report fc4test1 bugs here or should they go
> > straight into bugzilla? Two things I noticed while installing:
> 
> 
> fedora-test-list is for discussion...but bugzilla is the only way to
> make sure your bug is actually seen by the correct package maintainer.
> fedora-devel-list is not the most appropriate place for bug
> discussions.

Regarding bugs, the devel lists are more intended for discussing how a
particular bug can be solved rather than reporting the bug.

Nils
-- 
     Nils Philippsen    /    Red Hat    /    nphilipp at redhat.com
"They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary
 safety deserve neither liberty nor safety."     -- B. Franklin, 1759
 PGP fingerprint:  C4A8 9474 5C4C ADE3 2B8F  656D 47D8 9B65 6951 3011



From rodd at clarkson.id.au  Mon Mar 21 10:25:27 2005
From: rodd at clarkson.id.au (Rodd Clarkson)
Date: Mon, 21 Mar 2005 21:25:27 +1100
Subject: Ethernet card, cable link state ?
In-Reply-To: <1111393501.8759.1.camel@gibraltar.stuttgart.redhat.com>
References: <1111346890.1710.11.camel@jonspc>
	<1111346920.26208.32.camel@gibraltar.stuttgart.redhat.com>
	<1111360670.3663.7.camel@jellyfish.redfishdemo.com>
	<1111393501.8759.1.camel@gibraltar.stuttgart.redhat.com>
Message-ID: <1111400727.3528.7.camel@localhost.localdomain>

On Mon, 2005-03-21 at 09:25 +0100, Nils Philippsen wrote:

> please verify what ethtool reports when the cable isn't plugged in (and
> mii-tool while you're at it). If the hardware doesn't tell the software
> that the cable's not plugged in, there's not much we can do...

[root at localhost ~]# mii-tool eth0
  No MII transceiver present!.
[root at localhost ~]# ethtool eth0
Settings for eth0:
Cannot get device settings: Resource temporarily unavailable
        Current message level: 0x000000ff (255)
        Link detected: yes
[root at localhost ~]#



Rodd



From reuben-fedora-devel at reub.net  Mon Mar 21 12:31:33 2005
From: reuben-fedora-devel at reub.net (Reuben Farrelly)
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 00:31:33 +1200
Subject: OpenNTPD inclusion on Fedora Core
Message-ID: <6.2.1.2.2.20050322001945.01dc1720@tornado.reub.net>

Hi,

Haven't seen anything come through on this list or in the archives about 
OpenNTPD:

http://www.openntpd.org/

http://bulabula.org/papers/opencon04/ntpd/ makes for interesting reading.

I suspect we are past the time to get it in to FC4, but it looks like it 
might be a great alternative to the more traditional ntpd in the future.

What are peoples thoughts/ideas/plans/sentiments for inclusion in FC?


reuben


-------------------------------------------------------------
Reuben Farrelly                         Auckland, New Zealand 



From buildsys at redhat.com  Mon Mar 21 13:08:15 2005
From: buildsys at redhat.com (Build System)
Date: Mon, 21 Mar 2005 08:08:15 -0500
Subject: rawhide report: 20050321 changes
Message-ID: <200503211308.j2LD8FS9012630@porkchop.devel.redhat.com>

 

 
Updated Packages:

4Suite-1.0-7.a4
---------------
* Sun Mar 20 2005 Miloslav Trmac  - 1.0-7.a4
- Fix format string on 64-bit platforms

* Sat Mar 19 2005 Miloslav Trmac  - 1.0-6.a4
- Fix build with gcc 4
- Update to 4Suite-1.0a4

* Wed Mar 16 2005 Elliot Lee 
- rebuilt

kernel-2.6.11-1.1191_FC4
------------------------
* Fri Mar 18 2005 Dave Jones 
- kjournald release race. (#146344)
- 2.6.12rc1

ttmkfdir-3.0.9-16
-----------------
* Sun Mar 20 2005 Yu Shao  3.0.9-16
- rebuild with GCC 4



From nphilipp at redhat.com  Mon Mar 21 13:13:49 2005
From: nphilipp at redhat.com (Nils Philippsen)
Date: Mon, 21 Mar 2005 14:13:49 +0100
Subject: Ethernet card, cable link state ?
In-Reply-To: <1111400727.3528.7.camel@localhost.localdomain>
References: <1111346890.1710.11.camel@jonspc>
	<1111346920.26208.32.camel@gibraltar.stuttgart.redhat.com>
	<1111360670.3663.7.camel@jellyfish.redfishdemo.com>
	<1111393501.8759.1.camel@gibraltar.stuttgart.redhat.com>
	<1111400727.3528.7.camel@localhost.localdomain>
Message-ID: <1111410829.13972.15.camel@wombat.tiptoe.de>

On Mon, 2005-03-21 at 21:25 +1100, Rodd Clarkson wrote:
> On Mon, 2005-03-21 at 09:25 +0100, Nils Philippsen wrote:
> 
> > please verify what ethtool reports when the cable isn't plugged in (and
> > mii-tool while you're at it). If the hardware doesn't tell the software
> > that the cable's not plugged in, there's not much we can do...
> 
> [root at localhost ~]# mii-tool eth0
>   No MII transceiver present!.
> [root at localhost ~]# ethtool eth0
> Settings for eth0:
> Cannot get device settings: Resource temporarily unavailable
>         Current message level: 0x000000ff (255)
>         Link detected: yes
> [root at localhost ~]#

So this seems to be a bug in the driver or below (hardware), though the
"Cannot get device settings: Resource temporarily unavailable" message
indicates some other problem(s) as well... strange.

Nils
-- 
     Nils Philippsen    /    Red Hat    /    nphilipp at redhat.com
"They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary
 safety deserve neither liberty nor safety."     -- B. Franklin, 1759
 PGP fingerprint:  C4A8 9474 5C4C ADE3 2B8F  656D 47D8 9B65 6951 3011



From pekkas at netcore.fi  Mon Mar 21 13:20:35 2005
From: pekkas at netcore.fi (Pekka Savola)
Date: Mon, 21 Mar 2005 15:20:35 +0200 (EET)
Subject: OpenNTPD inclusion on Fedora Core
In-Reply-To: <6.2.1.2.2.20050322001945.01dc1720@tornado.reub.net>
References: <6.2.1.2.2.20050322001945.01dc1720@tornado.reub.net>
Message-ID: 

On Tue, 22 Mar 2005, Reuben Farrelly wrote:
> I suspect we are past the time to get it in to FC4, but it looks like it 
> might be a great alternative to the more traditional ntpd in the future.
>
> What are peoples thoughts/ideas/plans/sentiments for inclusion in FC?

It may not be fully baked yet, but it has some promise.  Take a look 
at:

http://bradknowles.typepad.com/considered_harmful/2005/03/update_openntpd.html
http://www.advogato.org/person/dtucker/diary.html?start=52
and/or google for "openntpd harmful"

-- 
Pekka Savola                 "You each name yourselves king, yet the
Netcore Oy                    kingdom bleeds."
Systems. Networks. Security. -- George R.R. Martin: A Clash of Kings



From ph18 at cornell.edu  Mon Mar 21 13:35:32 2005
From: ph18 at cornell.edu (Paul A. Houle)
Date: Mon, 21 Mar 2005 08:35:32 -0500
Subject: AntiVirus?
In-Reply-To: <1111374167.4592.42.camel@nexus.verbum.private>
References: <3adc77210503181735711e04a0@mail.gmail.com>
	<20050319014623.GE18511@angus.ind.WPI.EDU>
	
	
	
	
	
	
	
	
	<1111374167.4592.42.camel@nexus.verbum.private>
Message-ID: 

On Sun, 20 Mar 2005 22:02:47 -0500, Colin Walters   
wrote:

>
> Prompting the user for access control decisions at the level of system
> calls is not useful unless your target audience is solely "Linux kernel
> developer"; i.e. .01% of Fedora users at best.  Even at a much higher
> level you have to assume that if you prompt for this kind of stuff, 50%
> of the time they're going to get it wrong.
>

	I've seen security products that do something like this on Windows.  I  
had something like that running during the virus crisis of Summer 2003,   
and it didn't stop the machine from falling apart (Was it Gator?  Some  
toxic waste that rode in on Kazaa's boots?  Did I actually click on one of  
the 200,000 viruses I got in the mail?  Was it the antivirus program?) and  
was just one more thing that helped make the machine unusual.

	Seems to me that we don't need anything radical to run a process in a box  
with a limited set of system calls available;  this can be done with  
ptrace or selinux,  and the next obvious step is to beef up those APIs if  
they aren't quite adequate for what you want to do.

	One of the reasons why security products for Windows are so bad is that  
there isn't really a firewall API in Windows so every firewall product  
finds a set of hooks that look good and then they pray that they don't  
blow up the network stack.  It makes sense to provide APIs that will let  
people do things like that in a reasonable way,  because otherwise they'll  
do them in an unreasonable way.



From ph18 at cornell.edu  Mon Mar 21 13:40:01 2005
From: ph18 at cornell.edu (Paul A. Houle)
Date: Mon, 21 Mar 2005 08:40:01 -0500
Subject: OpenNTPD inclusion on Fedora Core
In-Reply-To: 
References: <6.2.1.2.2.20050322001945.01dc1720@tornado.reub.net>
	
Message-ID: 

On Mon, 21 Mar 2005 15:20:35 +0200 (EET), Pekka Savola   
wrote:

> On Tue, 22 Mar 2005, Reuben Farrelly wrote:
>> I suspect we are past the time to get it in to FC4, but it looks like  
>> it might be a great alternative to the more traditional ntpd in the  
>> future.
>>

	Well,  I've always been a little worried about NTP.  The US military runs  
well-publicized and well-used NTP servers,  and they wouldn't be doing  
what we pay them to do if they weren't ready to slip somebody a bad packet  
when duty calls.

	How does SELinux apply to NTP in FC4?



From pekkas at netcore.fi  Mon Mar 21 13:49:04 2005
From: pekkas at netcore.fi (Pekka Savola)
Date: Mon, 21 Mar 2005 15:49:04 +0200 (EET)
Subject: OpenNTPD inclusion on Fedora Core
In-Reply-To: 
References: <6.2.1.2.2.20050322001945.01dc1720@tornado.reub.net>
	
	
Message-ID: 

On Mon, 21 Mar 2005, Paul A. Houle wrote:
> 	How does SELinux apply to NTP in FC4?

Well, you don't need SELinux.  NTPD as shipped runs by default as user 
'ntp' (AFAIR), and can be chrooted as well.  OpenNTPD takes the 
functional separation a bit further.  About the only thing a "bad 
packet" can cause is adjusting your clock.. whether that's bad or not 
is debatable.

-- 
Pekka Savola                 "You each name yourselves king, yet the
Netcore Oy                    kingdom bleeds."
Systems. Networks. Security. -- George R.R. Martin: A Clash of Kings



From mattdm at mattdm.org  Mon Mar 21 14:46:34 2005
From: mattdm at mattdm.org (Matthew Miller)
Date: Mon, 21 Mar 2005 09:46:34 -0500
Subject: OpenNTPD inclusion on Fedora Core
In-Reply-To: <6.2.1.2.2.20050322001945.01dc1720@tornado.reub.net>
References: <6.2.1.2.2.20050322001945.01dc1720@tornado.reub.net>
Message-ID: <20050321144634.GA9913@jadzia.bu.edu>

On Tue, Mar 22, 2005 at 12:31:33AM +1200, Reuben Farrelly wrote:
> Haven't seen anything come through on this list or in the archives about 
> OpenNTPD:

I think there's been some discussion before. I'm basically for it, although
we wouldn't want to jump ship on the existing, working program without some
good testing. Perhaps the best approach interim approach is to configure the
existing ntp with the 'alternatives' system a la sendmail/postfix/exim, and
then add openntpd to extras?

-- 
Matthew Miller           mattdm at mattdm.org        
Boston University Linux      ------>                



From laroche at redhat.com  Mon Mar 21 14:55:05 2005
From: laroche at redhat.com (Florian La Roche)
Date: Mon, 21 Mar 2005 15:55:05 +0100
Subject: OpenNTPD inclusion on Fedora Core
In-Reply-To: <20050321144634.GA9913@jadzia.bu.edu>
References: <6.2.1.2.2.20050322001945.01dc1720@tornado.reub.net>
	<20050321144634.GA9913@jadzia.bu.edu>
Message-ID: <20050321145505.GA7068@dudweiler.stuttgart.redhat.com>

On Mon, Mar 21, 2005 at 09:46:34AM -0500, Matthew Miller wrote:
> On Tue, Mar 22, 2005 at 12:31:33AM +1200, Reuben Farrelly wrote:
> > Haven't seen anything come through on this list or in the archives about 
> > OpenNTPD:
> 
> I think there's been some discussion before. I'm basically for it, although
> we wouldn't want to jump ship on the existing, working program without some
> good testing. Perhaps the best approach interim approach is to configure the
> existing ntp with the 'alternatives' system a la sendmail/postfix/exim, and
> then add openntpd to extras?

alternatives is really a bad hack. With existing rpm functionality you can
already make sure only one of them is installed (if they should really overlap,
which sounds unlikely for ntp) and then the remaining item is to teach
anaconda about multiple conflicting rpm packages.

Having several MTA packages installed is also very confusing, so I'd rather
go into any "non-alternatives" direction if at all possible.

greetings,

Florian La Roche



From gmaxwell at gmail.com  Mon Mar 21 15:01:44 2005
From: gmaxwell at gmail.com (Gregory Maxwell)
Date: Mon, 21 Mar 2005 10:01:44 -0500
Subject: OpenNTPD inclusion on Fedora Core
In-Reply-To: <20050321144634.GA9913@jadzia.bu.edu>
References: <6.2.1.2.2.20050322001945.01dc1720@tornado.reub.net>
	<20050321144634.GA9913@jadzia.bu.edu>
Message-ID: 

On Mon, 21 Mar 2005 09:46:34 -0500, Matthew Miller  wrote:
> I think there's been some discussion before. I'm basically for it, although
> we wouldn't want to jump ship on the existing, working program without some
> good testing. Perhaps the best approach interim approach is to configure the
> existing ntp with the 'alternatives' system a la sendmail/postfix/exim, and
> then add openntpd to extras?

A move to openntpd without careful consideration would be a major
mistake.  OpenNTP has the advantage of simplicity, but it lacks much
of the algorithmic sophistication in the official NTPv4. For example,
the huff/puff filter which does a great job of improving NTP
performance for hosts on tight pipes. This will translate into worse
time keeping, increased levels of ntp related network traffic, and
worse handling of network outages. (more accurate clocks need less
frequent updates, on most systems once locked ntpd is pretty good at
keeping subsecond alignment even if the network is gone for a long
chunk of time)

If we are willing to throw away the algorithmic sophistication of
ntpd, then we should strongly consider just implementing a SNTP
client.  A sntp client would meet the basic clock setting needs of
most users, and would be even simpler than the openntp client. It
would also avoid misleading users by failing to provide the level of
algorithmic sophistication  expected from ntpd.

I wasn't aware of NTP being a substantial security worry,  I think
there is still a lot of mileage to be had with the existing app before
complete replacement is needed.



From ph18 at cornell.edu  Mon Mar 21 15:19:55 2005
From: ph18 at cornell.edu (Paul A. Houle)
Date: Mon, 21 Mar 2005 10:19:55 -0500
Subject: AntiVirus?
In-Reply-To: <1111200555.31995.3.camel@md.local.linuxlobbyist.org>
References: <3adc77210503181735711e04a0@mail.gmail.com>
	<20050319014623.GE18511@angus.ind.WPI.EDU>
	<423B8B06.7080701@optushome.com.au>
	<1111200555.31995.3.camel@md.local.linuxlobbyist.org>
Message-ID: 

On Fri, 18 Mar 2005 21:49:15 -0500, Paul Iadonisi   
wrote:

>
>   Both Chuck and Geoff are correct, IMO.  AV is the wrong solution to
> the *alleged* future problem with Linux viruses.  Go read
> http://www.linuxmafia.com/~rick/faq/index.php?page=virus for a good
> debunking of that threat, as well as some good entertainment ;-).
>   But something like clamav to protect *Windows clients* in a GNU/Linux
> based server environment does makes sense.  At least until FOSS takes
> over the world.

	The arguments in that essay are specious,  IMO.

	The root privilege separation would be no barrier to making an e-mail  
worm that propagates on Linux systems,  or a "botnet" that can launch  
attacks on other network hosts.

	It's true that the root separation limits the damage that a hostile  
program can do,  but it doesn't eliminate it,  and in the area of network  
attacks,  the restrictions are quite limited.  (Yeah,  you need root to do  
an ICMP flood,  but a UDP flood does the same damages and confounds  
sysadmins more;  there are lots of phun things you can do with packets,   
but you can make any server go off the air without root privilege if you  
control 6000 bots.)

	The 'immunity' of Linux and MacOS X is mainly immunological and  
cultural.  People who use those OSes don't assume they can mail a binary  
to random people and expect them to run it.  So mail clients require a few  
more clicks to do it in Linux (but not MacOS X;)  nobody expects to fill  
up a Linux machine with commercial junkware,  so nobody bothers writing  
spyware that hitches a ride on it.  "root" separation does make the junk  
easier to remove than it would be otherwise,  but doesn't stop it from  
being a problem.

	When it comes down to it,  the number of vulnerable machines that run  
non-Windows operating systems just isn't enough to get over the  
percolation threshold that makes many kind of worm attacks worthwhile.

	Privilege escalation attacks are legion in all operating systems,  and  
it's a good bet to assume that there will be some way to break root in  
FC4.  Assuming that many people don't patch,  this 'identical  
configuration' could be worth attacking if it goes over the percolation  
threshold.

------

	I'm no fan of AV software.  It causes problems.  (For instance,  during a  
virus crisis I have to turn it off if I want to read my e-mail,  because  
it will b0rk my e-mail program otherwise.)  We had problems at a place  
where we worked because our AV filter was being triggered by an ordinary  
english string that happened to be inside a common virus.

       The trouble with the whole "digital immune system" paradigm is that  
same as that of the real immune system.  Our immune system is full of  
interlocks designed to prevent it from attacking 'self' cells.  For  
instance,  an immune receptor on a T- or B- cell won't get activated  
unless co-receptors get activated,  and B-cells won't pump out antibodies  
until they get confirmation from a helper T-cell that there really is a  
problem.

	Despite all that,  almost 10% of people in the US are walking around with  
an asthma inhaler.  50 million Americans have allergies...  Anything that  
tries to recognize "bad" patterns of bits or "bad" patterns of bad  
software behavior is going to have false alarms that sometimes makes the  
machine inoperable.



From mike at navi.cx  Mon Mar 21 15:36:26 2005
From: mike at navi.cx (Mike Hearn)
Date: Mon, 21 Mar 2005 15:36:26 +0000
Subject: AntiVirus?
References: <3adc77210503181735711e04a0@mail.gmail.com>
	<20050319014623.GE18511@angus.ind.WPI.EDU>
	
	
	
	
	
	
	
	
	<1111374167.4592.42.camel@nexus.verbum.private>
	
Message-ID: 

On Mon, 21 Mar 2005 08:35:32 -0500, Paul A. Houle wrote:
> 	One of the reasons why security products for Windows are so bad is that  
> there isn't really a firewall API in Windows so every firewall product  
> finds a set of hooks that look good and then they pray that they don't  
> blow up the network stack.

There is a firewall API, at least in Windows XP SP2+. 

The main reason they all suck is that they're all based on badly flawed
assumptions that have no relation to usability, eg "I can ask users to
confirm each outgoing connection and they will make the right choice".

This is clearly ridiculous, if I had a pound for every time I've been
asked by friends whether they should allow XYZ app to connect to the
internet I'd be a rich man. It's pretty much a textbook case of why you
shouldn't ask users to make complicated security decisions.

Even worse, from the perspective of malware authors it's trivial to hide
yourself so the programs identify is obfuscated or appears benign. So
asking these questions achieves nothing and just confuses users - bad
plan!

thanks -mike



From ronny-vlug at vlugnet.org  Mon Mar 21 15:46:18 2005
From: ronny-vlug at vlugnet.org (Ronny Buchmann)
Date: Mon, 21 Mar 2005 16:46:18 +0100
Subject: RFC: Re: Bugzilla Target for Rawhide
In-Reply-To: <423D95F9.9060508@israel-jugendtag.ch>
References: <423D95F9.9060508@israel-jugendtag.ch>
Message-ID: <200503211646.19457.ronny-vlug@vlugnet.org>

Reading the subject, I'd like to propose to have different bugzilla targets 
for rawhide for every release.
Currently we have rawhide-1.0 for rawhide since the beginning.
I think it would be better to have fc4-devel (fc5-devel ...). So it would be 
easier to search for bugs in fc4(test1,devel,release) and the result wouldn't 
show bugs ten years old.

-- 
http://LinuxWiki.org/RonnyBuchmann



From lkml at mac.com  Mon Mar 21 15:53:02 2005
From: lkml at mac.com (Felipe Alfaro Solana)
Date: Mon, 21 Mar 2005 16:53:02 +0100
Subject: OpenNTPD inclusion on Fedora Core
In-Reply-To: 
References: <6.2.1.2.2.20050322001945.01dc1720@tornado.reub.net>
	
	
	
Message-ID: 

On 21 Mar 2005, at 14:49, Pekka Savola wrote:

> On Mon, 21 Mar 2005, Paul A. Houle wrote:
>> 	How does SELinux apply to NTP in FC4?
>
> Well, you don't need SELinux.  NTPD as shipped runs by default as user 
> 'ntp' (AFAIR), and can be chrooted as well.  OpenNTPD takes the 
> functional separation a bit further.  About the only thing a "bad 
> packet" can cause is adjusting your clock.. whether that's bad or not 
> is debatable.

I would say maliciously adjusting the clock is very bad, from a 
security perspective ;-)



From kyrre at solution-forge.net  Mon Mar 21 16:54:29 2005
From: kyrre at solution-forge.net (Kyrre Ness Sjobak)
Date: Mon, 21 Mar 2005 17:54:29 +0100
Subject: fork bomb attack
In-Reply-To: <20050319210507.GD27590@devserv.devel.redhat.com>
References: <1111172643.4928.2.camel@stantz.corp.sgi.com>
	<20050318193326.GG24385@redhat.com>
	<20050318203739.1f11ca2b@nausicaa.camperquake.de>
	<20050318210912.174d6d99.fedora@wir-sind-cool.org>
	<423BA943.1050706@tlarson.com> <1111235867.3582.5.camel@roque>
	<1111241627.11774.14.camel@ice-dragon.ddn.de>
	<1111242049.3336.36.camel@localhost.localdomain>
	
	<1111248622.3336.57.camel@localhost.localdomain>
	<20050319210507.GD27590@devserv.devel.redhat.com>
Message-ID: <1111424069.3331.234.camel@localhost.localdomain>

l?r, 19.03.2005 kl. 22.05 skrev Alan Cox:
> On Sat, Mar 19, 2005 at 05:10:22PM +0100, Kyrre Ness Sjobak wrote:
> > OOMkiller? I have lost all faith in that #"!%?#%?#... Situation:
> > You have:
> 
> Depends what mode you are using. Mode 2 overcommit will ensure that processes
> get told "no memory" at a sane point. It still doesn't deal with who dies 
> because there is no right answer (especially on a multi-user box ;))

This was a pretty much out-of-the-box configured fedora 3 test 2, i
believe. It shouldn't behave that way...

Anyway, it ended with me loosing my temper and pulling the box'es
powercord out of the wall (as my login attemts only resulted in
timeouts...).



From dragoran at feuerpokemon.de  Mon Mar 21 16:55:08 2005
From: dragoran at feuerpokemon.de (dragoran)
Date: Mon, 21 Mar 2005 17:55:08 +0100
Subject: Who is broken when hotplug,udev and hal are causing high cpu
 load?
In-Reply-To: <42285E31.30200@feuerpokemon.de>
References: <4226DB54.90406@feuerpokemon.de>	<1109867037.3448.0.camel@localhost.localdomain>
	<42285E31.30200@feuerpokemon.de>
Message-ID: <423EFC6C.1080106@feuerpokemon.de>

dragoran schrieb:

> Kyrre Ness Sjobak schrieb:
>
>> tor, 03.03.2005 kl. 10.39 skrev dragoran:
>>  
>>
>>> I bought a new card usb2 card reader. Sometimes when I plug a sd 
>>> card into it all hotplug programs cause 60-80% cpu load and nothing 
>>> happens (no mount) sometimes it just works.
>>> I want to fill this into bugzilla but dunno against what?
>>> When this happens dmesg reports many Buffer I/O erros.
>>>   
>>
>>
>> I always have to unplug/replug my USB card reader when i insert a card
>> for the pc to discover it
>>
>>  
>>
> this isn't normal =>bug!
> my problem seems to be solved with 2.6.10-1.770_FC3
>
no it isn't solved It happend again (3 times know today) , so I reopend 
the bug...
what could be causing this?



From tjb at unh.edu  Mon Mar 21 18:32:33 2005
From: tjb at unh.edu (Thomas J. Baker)
Date: Mon, 21 Mar 2005 13:32:33 -0500
Subject: rawhide report: 20050318 changes
In-Reply-To: <200503181310.j2IDA6dw024446@porkchop.devel.redhat.com>
References: <200503181310.j2IDA6dw024446@porkchop.devel.redhat.com>
Message-ID: <1111429953.1747.11.camel@wintermute.sr.unh.edu>

On Fri, 2005-03-18 at 08:10 -0500, Build System wrote:

> Removed package ufraw
> 

Will ufraw be moving to extras?

tjb
---
=======================================================================
| Thomas Baker                                  email: tjb at unh.edu    |
| Systems Programmer                                                  |
| Research Computing Center                     voice: (603) 862-4490 |
| University of New Hampshire                     fax: (603) 862-1761 |
| 332 Morse Hall                                                      |
| Durham, NH 03824 USA              http://wintermute.sr.unh.edu/~tjb |
=======================================================================



From hhoffman at ip-solutions.net  Mon Mar 21 19:12:45 2005
From: hhoffman at ip-solutions.net (Harry Hoffman)
Date: Mon, 21 Mar 2005 14:12:45 -0500
Subject: NTP doesn't seem to be available when installing
Message-ID: <423F1CAD.8090009@ip-solutions.net>

Hi All,

I'm doing a custom install of FC3 and I can't seem to find the option 
for selecting NTP in the package list.

Is it missing or is it me?

Thanks,
Harry



From susan_geller at speakeasy.net  Mon Mar 21 19:29:30 2005
From: susan_geller at speakeasy.net (susan_geller at speakeasy.net)
Date: Mon, 21 Mar 2005 19:29:30 +0000
Subject: gimp-2.2.4-0.fc3.3 man pages
Message-ID: 

> > It looks like the man pages intalled with gimp have somewhat unusual names:
> > 
> > $ rpm -ql gimp | grep /usr/share/man
> > /usr/share/man/man1/gimp-2.2.1.gz
> > /usr/share/man/man1/gimp-remote-2.2.1.gz
> > /usr/share/man/man1/gimptool-2.0.1.gz
> > /usr/share/man/man5/gimprc-2.2.5.gz
> > 
> > So you have to say:
> > $ man gimp-2.2
> > 
> > Instead of just:
> > $ man gimp
> > 
> > Has anyone considered adding commands like:
> > $ ln -s /usr/share/man/man1/gimp-2.2.1.gz /usr/share/man/man1/gimp.1.gz
> > to the rpm post install script?
> 
> please open a Bugzilla ticket for this one.
> 
> Thanks,
> Nils

OK.  It is in as: "Bug 151693: gimp man pages have non-standard names"

Susan





From rdieter at math.unl.edu  Mon Mar 21 19:31:09 2005
From: rdieter at math.unl.edu (Rex Dieter)
Date: Mon, 21 Mar 2005 13:31:09 -0600
Subject: NTP doesn't seem to be available when installing
In-Reply-To: <423F1CAD.8090009@ip-solutions.net>
References: <423F1CAD.8090009@ip-solutions.net>
Message-ID: <423F20FD.4030803@math.unl.edu>

Harry Hoffman wrote:

> I'm doing a custom install of FC3 and I can't seem to find the option 
> for selecting NTP in the package list.

AFAIK, it's in by default.


-- Rex



From sitsofe at yahoo.com  Mon Mar 21 20:16:30 2005
From: sitsofe at yahoo.com (Sitsofe Wheeler)
Date: Mon, 21 Mar 2005 20:16:30 +0000
Subject: OpenNTPD inclusion on Fedora Core
References: <6.2.1.2.2.20050322001945.01dc1720@tornado.reub.net>
Message-ID: 

Reuben Farrelly wrote:

> What are peoples thoughts/ideas/plans/sentiments for inclusion in FC?

Please don't include this, at least not as it stands.

Everyone I know who metions "try OpenNTPD" either hasn't actually tried it
or has only tried it with other machines running OpenNTPD. It turns out
that ntp.org's ntpd won't EVER trust an OpenNTPD server to sync off (you
can force the issue with an ntpdate but if left to collect stats and work
out trustworthiness it would rather use the local clock or just remain out
of sync than sync off OpenNTPD). My last test was done against OpenNTPD
3.6.1.

I'm also not 100% sure whether OpenNTPD explicitly handles things like the
Kiss of Death packet...

It's a project with plenty of promise but it's still in its infancy with
regard to becoming more than an SNTP server. Give it a year to grow then
assess again.



From fedora-devel at tlarson.com  Mon Mar 21 21:01:35 2005
From: fedora-devel at tlarson.com (Tyler Larson)
Date: Mon, 21 Mar 2005 14:01:35 -0700
Subject: OpenNTPD inclusion on Fedora Core
In-Reply-To: 
References: <6.2.1.2.2.20050322001945.01dc1720@tornado.reub.net>	
	
Message-ID: <423F362F.6030108@tlarson.com>

Paul A. Houle wrote:
> On Mon, 21 Mar 2005 15:20:35 +0200 (EET), Pekka Savola 
>   wrote:
>     Well,  I've always been a little worried about NTP.  The US military 
> runs  well-publicized and well-used NTP servers,  and they wouldn't be 
> doing  what we pay them to do if they weren't ready to slip somebody a 
> bad packet  when duty calls.
> 

The US military isn't the only group that runs NTP servers. They keep time 
because they *have* to. GPS (among other things) depends on it. We simply ask 
them what time it is because they happen to know. Conspiracy theories aside, 
NTP is robust enough to react sanely when "slipped" a "bad packet"--not to 
mention the dubious tactical usefulness of telling the general public the 
wrong time.

NTP does time synchronization. It isn't designed to keep the clocks accurate, 
it's designed to keep them synchronized. "Accurate" really is defined by the 
user as far as time sync is concerned. You set up a master time server, and it 
is definitive of accurate for your domain--everyone else syncs off of it.

If your organization REALLY needs to know what the correct time is, and REALLY 
can't depend on any external entity (like the evil US empire), then your 
organization REALLY needs to run its own atomic clock. NTP will allow it. NTP 
isn't the problem.



From rodd at clarkson.id.au  Mon Mar 21 21:05:43 2005
From: rodd at clarkson.id.au (Rodd Clarkson)
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 08:05:43 +1100
Subject: Ethernet card, cable link state ?
In-Reply-To: <1111410829.13972.15.camel@wombat.tiptoe.de>
References: <1111346890.1710.11.camel@jonspc>
	<1111346920.26208.32.camel@gibraltar.stuttgart.redhat.com>
	<1111360670.3663.7.camel@jellyfish.redfishdemo.com>
	<1111393501.8759.1.camel@gibraltar.stuttgart.redhat.com>
	<1111400727.3528.7.camel@localhost.localdomain>
	<1111410829.13972.15.camel@wombat.tiptoe.de>
Message-ID: <1111439143.3535.0.camel@goose>

On Mon, 2005-03-21 at 14:13 +0100, Nils Philippsen wrote:

> > [root at localhost ~]# mii-tool eth0
> >   No MII transceiver present!.
> > [root at localhost ~]# ethtool eth0
> > Settings for eth0:
> > Cannot get device settings: Resource temporarily unavailable
> >         Current message level: 0x000000ff (255)
> >         Link detected: yes
> > [root at localhost ~]#
> 
> So this seems to be a bug in the driver or below (hardware), though the
> "Cannot get device settings: Resource temporarily unavailable" message
> indicates some other problem(s) as well... strange.

So is this bugzilla fodder?


Rodd



From zaitcev at redhat.com  Mon Mar 21 22:58:31 2005
From: zaitcev at redhat.com (Pete Zaitcev)
Date: Mon, 21 Mar 2005 14:58:31 -0800
Subject: Status of USB install support in FC4 Test1?
In-Reply-To: 
References: 
Message-ID: <20050321145831.1220730c@localhost.localdomain>

On Sun, 20 Mar 2005 21:56:36 +0100 Bernd Bartmann  wrote:

> what's the status in FC4 Test1 for install support to USB storage
> devices. FC3 only seems to allow installation to USB storage devices
> in expert mode and even then you have to manually created an initrd
> with support for the USB storage modules. Is there any progress in
> this area planned for FC4?

No, I'm not aware of anything. Maybe Jeremy knows?

Also please pardon me asking, but why would you want this? It sounds like
a crackpot idea to me. Do you want to have something like Fedoppix on
a USB flash key? I am very interested to know what is the intended
application of such install.

Greetings,
-- Pete



From fedora-devel at camperquake.de  Mon Mar 21 23:08:18 2005
From: fedora-devel at camperquake.de (Ralf Ertzinger)
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 00:08:18 +0100
Subject: Status of USB install support in FC4 Test1?
In-Reply-To: <20050321145831.1220730c@localhost.localdomain>
References: 
	<20050321145831.1220730c@localhost.localdomain>
Message-ID: <20050322000818.29de7b6c@nausicaa.camperquake.de>

Hi.

Pete Zaitcev  wrote:

> Also please pardon me asking, but why would you want this? It sounds
> like a crackpot idea to me. Do you want to have something like Fedoppix
> on a USB flash key? I am very interested to know what is the intended
> application of such install.

Well, per se there is nothing wrong with disks in external enclosures,
is there? Assume I'd like to install FC on an Mac Mini, using an external
large disk (be it USB or FireWire) for the Linux install and keeping
the internal disk for OSX?

-- 
Trust the computer industry to shorten "Year 2000" to Y2K. It was this
kind of thinking that caused the problem in the first place.



From pjones at redhat.com  Mon Mar 21 23:10:14 2005
From: pjones at redhat.com (Peter Jones)
Date: Mon, 21 Mar 2005 18:10:14 -0500
Subject: anaconda mkfs.xfs problem
In-Reply-To: <1111317477.12430.51.camel@arthur.sinus>
References: <1111317477.12430.51.camel@arthur.sinus>
Message-ID: <1111446614.14015.21.camel@localhost.localdomain>

On Sun, 2005-03-20 at 12:17 +0100, Lars Hamann wrote:

> So what can I do? Can I reopen the bug or something?

Make a patch.  Test it.  Mail it here once it works.
-- 
        Peter



From ianburrell at gmail.com  Mon Mar 21 23:24:59 2005
From: ianburrell at gmail.com (Ian Burrell)
Date: Mon, 21 Mar 2005 15:24:59 -0800
Subject: OpenNTPD inclusion on Fedora Core
In-Reply-To: 
References: <6.2.1.2.2.20050322001945.01dc1720@tornado.reub.net>
	
	
Message-ID: 

On Mon, 21 Mar 2005 08:40:01 -0500, Paul A. Houle  wrote:
>         Well,  I've always been a little worried about NTP.  The US military runs
> well-publicized and well-used NTP servers,  and they wouldn't be doing
> what we pay them to do if they weren't ready to slip somebody a bad packet
> when duty calls.
> 

You shouldn't be using the usno.navy.mil NTP servers since they are
overloaded.  Redhat provides a time server, clock.redhat.com, which
gets its time from CDMA which gets it from GPS.  Most of the public
NTP servers in pool.ntp.org get their time from GPS or CDMA.  Some may
even have their own atomic clocks.

Also, any one organization would have a hard time sending time to
change your clock.  ntpd has some sophisticated ways to find bad
clocks and ignore them.  This is a good reason to stick with ntpd
instead of OpenNTPD.  NTP isn't authenticated so there are attacks,
like blocking all other sources and sending bad packets.  But that is
much likely to come from hackers, not the Naval Observatory.

If you are concerned about security, buy your own GPS receiver.  If
you are really paranoid, buy your own atomic clock.

 - Ian



From gmaxwell at gmail.com  Mon Mar 21 23:30:52 2005
From: gmaxwell at gmail.com (Gregory Maxwell)
Date: Mon, 21 Mar 2005 18:30:52 -0500
Subject: OpenNTPD inclusion on Fedora Core
In-Reply-To: 
References: <6.2.1.2.2.20050322001945.01dc1720@tornado.reub.net>
	
	
	
Message-ID: 

On Mon, 21 Mar 2005 15:24:59 -0800, Ian Burrell  wrote:

> Also, any one organization would have a hard time sending time to
> change your clock.  ntpd has some sophisticated ways to find bad
> clocks and ignore them.  This is a good reason to stick with ntpd
> instead of OpenNTPD.  NTP isn't authenticated so there are attacks,
> like blocking all other sources and sending bad packets.  But that is
> much likely to come from hackers, not the Naval Observatory.
> 
> If you are concerned about security, buy your own GPS receiver.  If
> you are really paranoid, buy your own atomic clock.

Minor correction:  NTP can be authenticated just fine, but you need to
establish a relationship with the server operator to be set up...
Usually a few emails are all thats required... and there are more than
a few that are willing.



From jdesbonnet at gmail.com  Mon Mar 21 23:47:30 2005
From: jdesbonnet at gmail.com (Joe Desbonnet)
Date: Mon, 21 Mar 2005 23:47:30 +0000
Subject: Status of USB install support in FC4 Test1?
In-Reply-To: <20050321145831.1220730c@localhost.localdomain>
References: 
	<20050321145831.1220730c@localhost.localdomain>
Message-ID: <1cef3e9505032115476b80b4ac@mail.gmail.com>

On Mon, 21 Mar 2005 14:58:31 -0800, Pete Zaitcev  wrote:
> 
> Also please pardon me asking, but why would you want this? It sounds like
> a crackpot idea to me. Do you want to have something like Fedoppix on
> a USB flash key? I am very interested to know what is the intended
> application of such install.
> 

I want to try FC4test1. Both my IDE slots are used up and almost full.
I have a few old IDE drives lying around and I picked up an USB-IDE
adapter recently for about $30. I'd like to try
FC4test1 on that, because that's the only way I can get to use it right now.

USB storage does not necessarly mean flash media.

Joe.



From naoki at valuecommerce.com  Tue Mar 22 01:42:28 2005
From: naoki at valuecommerce.com (Naoki)
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 10:42:28 +0900
Subject: rawhide report: 20050319 changes
In-Reply-To: <200503191304.j2JD4uDK020288@porkchop.devel.redhat.com>
References: <200503191304.j2JD4uDK020288@porkchop.devel.redhat.com>
Message-ID: <1111455748.12909.21.camel@dragon.sys.intra>

Umm... Why ?

On Sat, 2005-03-19 at 08:04 -0500, Build System wrote:
> New package jsch
>         Pure Java implementation of SSH2




From gmaxwell at gmail.com  Tue Mar 22 01:55:30 2005
From: gmaxwell at gmail.com (Gregory Maxwell)
Date: Mon, 21 Mar 2005 20:55:30 -0500
Subject: rawhide report: 20050319 changes
In-Reply-To: <1111455748.12909.21.camel@dragon.sys.intra>
References: <200503191304.j2JD4uDK020288@porkchop.devel.redhat.com>
	<1111455748.12909.21.camel@dragon.sys.intra>
Message-ID: 

On Tue, 22 Mar 2005 10:42:28 +0900, Naoki  wrote:
> On Sat, 2005-03-19 at 08:04 -0500, Build System wrote:
> > New package jsch
> >         Pure Java implementation of SSH2
> Umm... Why ?

To provide secure connectivity to the users of a pure java X server, of course.



From naoki at valuecommerce.com  Tue Mar 22 02:19:59 2005
From: naoki at valuecommerce.com (Naoki)
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 11:19:59 +0900
Subject: rawhide report: 20050319 changes
In-Reply-To: 
References: <200503191304.j2JD4uDK020288@porkchop.devel.redhat.com>
	<1111455748.12909.21.camel@dragon.sys.intra>
	
Message-ID: <1111457999.12909.34.camel@dragon.sys.intra>


> > > New package jsch
> > >         Pure Java implementation of SSH2
> > Umm... Why ?
> 
> To provide secure connectivity to the users of a pure java X server, of course.

Cheers Gregory, it's all clear now :)

So the X server you're talking about is http://www.jcraft.com/weirdx/ ?
The note down the bottom explains the Jsch bit.

I'm just wondering why a java X server and SSH client are not in fedora
extras?

Or is there some advantage to it over xorg & openssh that I'm not aware
of ?



From green at redhat.com  Tue Mar 22 03:01:07 2005
From: green at redhat.com (Anthony Green)
Date: Mon, 21 Mar 2005 19:01:07 -0800
Subject: rawhide report: 20050319 changes
In-Reply-To: <1111455748.12909.21.camel@dragon.sys.intra>
References: <200503191304.j2JD4uDK020288@porkchop.devel.redhat.com>
	<1111455748.12909.21.camel@dragon.sys.intra>
Message-ID: <1111460467.5247.3.camel@localhost.localdomain>

On Tue, 2005-03-22 at 10:42 +0900, Naoki wrote:
> Umm... Why ?
> 
> On Sat, 2005-03-19 at 08:04 -0500, Build System wrote:
> > New package jsch
> >         Pure Java implementation of SSH2
> 

jsch is a library (not command line tool) used by two large applications
in FC: ant and Eclipse.

The part of ant using jsch was disabled in the build.  Presumably this
will be changed soon.

Eclipse already has its own copy of jsch.  I believe somebody plans on
removing that and making it use this common version.

AG




From jdesbonnet at gmail.com  Tue Mar 22 03:09:07 2005
From: jdesbonnet at gmail.com (Joe Desbonnet)
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 03:09:07 +0000
Subject: A more efficient up2date service using binary diffs
In-Reply-To: 
References: <20050315151205.A25119@tiki-lounge.com>
	
	<1cef3e9505031606061a6e2cbe@mail.gmail.com>
	<1110983501.6211.29.camel@angua.localnet>
	<1111049074.3353.13.camel@localhost.localdomain>
	<1111051720.20402.3.camel@angua.localnet>
	<1cef3e95050317040716ef0c83@mail.gmail.com>
	<1111062365.20402.26.camel@angua.localnet>
	<20050317140545.GC19886@devserv.devel.redhat.com>
	
Message-ID: <1cef3e9505032119097b58affc@mail.gmail.com>

The first version of my delta compression RPM virtual repository /
proxy server is ready. This is just a proof-of-concept at the moment,
but it may be good enough to be useful to some. Here are the release
notes: http://www.wombat.ie/software/rpmdc/releasenotes-0.1.0.html

Right now you need to have the following to get it to work:
  * Jakarta Tomcat 4.1.31 
  * Sun JDK 1.4.2

It may work with other servlet containers and JavaVMs but that is the
only combination I had time to test so far. If it proves useful it
should be possible to remove the Tomcat dependency and perhaps compile
to navative with gcj (?).

I've created a delta repository to work with this software here:
http://rpmdelta.wombat.ie/rpmdelta/fc3/i386/

That repository covers most of the updates for FC3/i386 and is only
250MB in size (compared to over 1GB for the RPMs).

The release is available here:
http://www.wombat.ie/software/rpmdc/downloads/rpmdc-0.1.0.tar.gz

Joe.



From green at redhat.com  Tue Mar 22 03:29:18 2005
From: green at redhat.com (Anthony Green)
Date: Mon, 21 Mar 2005 19:29:18 -0800
Subject: A more efficient up2date service using binary diffs
In-Reply-To: <1cef3e9505032119097b58affc@mail.gmail.com>
References: <20050315151205.A25119@tiki-lounge.com>
	
	<1cef3e9505031606061a6e2cbe@mail.gmail.com>
	<1110983501.6211.29.camel@angua.localnet>
	<1111049074.3353.13.camel@localhost.localdomain>
	<1111051720.20402.3.camel@angua.localnet>
	<1cef3e95050317040716ef0c83@mail.gmail.com>
	<1111062365.20402.26.camel@angua.localnet>
	<20050317140545.GC19886@devserv.devel.redhat.com>
	
	<1cef3e9505032119097b58affc@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <1111462159.5247.16.camel@localhost.localdomain>

On Tue, 2005-03-22 at 03:09 +0000, Joe Desbonnet wrote:
> It may work with other servlet containers and JavaVMs but that is the
> only combination I had time to test so far. If it proves useful it
> should be possible to remove the Tomcat dependency and perhaps compile
> to navative with gcj (?).

No need!  This appears to work out of the box with the FC4 tomcat5 by
simply copying the war file into the webapps directory and restarting
tomcat5.  I just tried it.  This is with the fully free gcj-based
execution environment in FC4.

Your webapp classes could also be natively compiled with a little bit of
effort. You currently need to explode the war file, compile the .jar
and .class files and add them to the system classmap database.  Perhaps
gcj should be taught about .war files.  I will file a bug against gcj.

Thanks,

AG




From naoki at valuecommerce.com  Tue Mar 22 04:23:26 2005
From: naoki at valuecommerce.com (Naoki)
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 13:23:26 +0900
Subject: rawhide report: 20050319 changes
In-Reply-To: <1111460467.5247.3.camel@localhost.localdomain>
References: <200503191304.j2JD4uDK020288@porkchop.devel.redhat.com>
	<1111455748.12909.21.camel@dragon.sys.intra>
	<1111460467.5247.3.camel@localhost.localdomain>
Message-ID: <1111465406.12909.43.camel@dragon.sys.intra>


> jsch is a library (not command line tool) used by two large applications
> in FC: ant and Eclipse.

Well answered Anthony, thank you. 



From dcbw at redhat.com  Tue Mar 22 05:57:06 2005
From: dcbw at redhat.com (Dan Williams)
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 00:57:06 -0500 (EST)
Subject: Ethernet card, cable link state ?
In-Reply-To: <1111439143.3535.0.camel@goose>
References: <1111346890.1710.11.camel@jonspc>
	<1111346920.26208.32.camel@gibraltar.stuttgart.redhat.com>
	<1111360670.3663.7.camel@jellyfish.redfishdemo.com>
	<1111393501.8759.1.camel@gibraltar.stuttgart.redhat.com>
	<1111400727.3528.7.camel@localhost.localdomain>
	<1111410829.13972.15.camel@wombat.tiptoe.de>
	<1111439143.3535.0.camel@goose>
Message-ID: 

On Tue, 22 Mar 2005, Rodd Clarkson wrote:
> On Mon, 2005-03-21 at 14:13 +0100, Nils Philippsen wrote:
> 
> > > [root at localhost ~]# mii-tool eth0
> > >   No MII transceiver present!.
> > > [root at localhost ~]# ethtool eth0
> > > Settings for eth0:
> > > Cannot get device settings: Resource temporarily unavailable
> > >         Current message level: 0x000000ff (255)
> > >         Link detected: yes
> > > [root at localhost ~]#
> > 
> > So this seems to be a bug in the driver or below (hardware), though the
> > "Cannot get device settings: Resource temporarily unavailable" message
> > indicates some other problem(s) as well... strange.
> 
> So is this bugzilla fodder?

Most definitely, assign it to "kernel" component, and make sure you include the 
output of "lspci" and "lsmod" so that we can find out exactly what network card 
you have and what driver you're using.

Dan



From dcbw at redhat.com  Tue Mar 22 06:06:53 2005
From: dcbw at redhat.com (Dan Williams)
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 01:06:53 -0500 (EST)
Subject: Rawhide NetworkManager
In-Reply-To: <1111160849.32293.23.camel@dch.TQMcube.com>
References: <1111160849.32293.23.camel@dch.TQMcube.com>
Message-ID: 

On Fri, 18 Mar 2005, David Cary Hart wrote:
> Is NM still dependent upon Bind? Does it still silently clobber resolv.conf?
> 
> README: At this time, it does not support static IP addresses on
> network interfaces, and requires DHCP to be used instead.

The readme is wrong...

> NEWS: Support static IP addresses, Dan Williams
> 
> I assume that "NEWS" is correct. OTOH then wouldn't it be preferable to use static IPs on the devices?

So yes, we do honor distro-specific static IP config files, _except_ for DNS 
entries in resolv.conf, mainly because nobody has figured it out yet.  We need 
to know which file NM should copy the DNS info from (on Fedora, where does the 
information entered into the DNS tab of system-config-network get stored, and 
how do you change it for multiple profiles?).

Dan



From dragoran at feuerpokemon.de  Tue Mar 22 06:48:23 2005
From: dragoran at feuerpokemon.de (dragoran)
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 07:48:23 +0100
Subject: Rawhide NetworkManager
In-Reply-To: 
References: <1111160849.32293.23.camel@dch.TQMcube.com>
	
Message-ID: <423FBFB7.6010400@feuerpokemon.de>

Dan Williams wrote:

>On Fri, 18 Mar 2005, David Cary Hart wrote:
>  
>
>>Is NM still dependent upon Bind? Does it still silently clobber resolv.conf?
>>
>>README: At this time, it does not support static IP addresses on
>>network interfaces, and requires DHCP to be used instead.
>>    
>>
>
>The readme is wrong...
>
>  
>
>>NEWS: Support static IP addresses, Dan Williams
>>
>>I assume that "NEWS" is correct. OTOH then wouldn't it be preferable to use static IPs on the devices?
>>    
>>
>
>So yes, we do honor distro-specific static IP config files, _except_ for DNS 
>entries in resolv.conf, mainly because nobody has figured it out yet.  We need 
>to know which file NM should copy the DNS info from (on Fedora, where does the 
>information entered into the DNS tab of system-config-network get stored, and 
>how do you change it for multiple profiles?).
>
>Dan
>
>  
>
/etc/sysconfig/networking/profiles//resolv.conf



From gauravp at hclcomnet.co.in  Tue Mar 22 07:12:01 2005
From: gauravp at hclcomnet.co.in (gaurav)
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 12:42:01 +0530
Subject: Stateless linux
Message-ID: <423FC541.4030106@hclcomnet.co.in>


Hi list,
        I am interested in stateless Linux project  and would like to 
volunteer  for its beta tester ... I will try roll this out in my brother's 
school and after that  co workers on my office plus also would like to 
contribute to its development ....help it to take to next level :-)

I would like to know what state this project is in ? is anybody involved 
in active testing/ testing development ? Do you need beta tester ...

all like minded (stateless  people ;-) ) pl let me know if interested

Regards,
gaurav






From roli at israel-jugendtag.ch  Tue Mar 22 10:52:40 2005
From: roli at israel-jugendtag.ch (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Roland_K=E4ser?=)
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 11:52:40 +0100
Subject: LDAP
In-Reply-To: <423DCD30.4050308@israel-jugendtag.ch>
References: <423D9691.2000807@israel-jugendtag.ch>	<35d29cfa483e65c753bb8a2285d6ea80@mac.com>	<1111343485.18941.7.camel@tudor.e.kth.se>	<20050320184538.GA1504326@hiwaay.net>
	<423DCD30.4050308@israel-jugendtag.ch>
Message-ID: <423FF8F8.7090009@israel-jugendtag.ch>

Hello

Can we please discuss this point about an preinstalled LDAP Server on 
System Install for storing user account data by default?

Roland Kaeser


Roland K?ser wrote:

> Hello
>
> Sorry, but just because Your mail client isn't able to display this, 
> makes it not worse! What's wrong, having text formating and colors in 
> a email? Whould you prefer reading internet pages just in plain text? 
> Or reading a book without any formatting? The additional code in html 
> transports additional information! And by the way: The mail was 
> written using Thunderbird not with the outlook virus catcher.
>
> Roland
>
> Chris Adams schrieb:
>
>> Once upon a time, Alexander Bostrm  said:
>>  
>>
>>> It was a multipart/alternative message with both HTML and plain text.
>>> There's nothing wrong with those. (I would actually *prefer* if people
>>> would send such messages instead of just the plain text, as long as the
>>> HTML is sane. No colours, backgrounds and fancy fonts, just 
, 
,
>>> , , 
, 
,  etc.)
>>>   
>>
>>
>> Multipart/alternative text and HTML is the worst waste there is.  The
>> vast majority of the time, the HTML markup is just auto-generated stuff,
>> so all it really ends up being is a more than double-size message.
>>
>> Mostly such email is spam (I drop such messages to my main mailbox).
>>  
>>
>



From roli at israel-jugendtag.ch  Tue Mar 22 10:54:04 2005
From: roli at israel-jugendtag.ch (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Roland_K=E4ser?=)
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 11:54:04 +0100
Subject: Yum Groups
Message-ID: <423FF94C.7050208@israel-jugendtag.ch>

Hello

Is there a list of all avialable Yum groups for "-y groupinstall" ?

I tried the RPM package groups but Yum can't find (for sample) the group 
Development as in the RPM Package groups.

Roland Kaeser



From ad+lists at uni-x.org  Tue Mar 22 11:04:05 2005
From: ad+lists at uni-x.org (Alexander Dalloz)
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 12:04:05 +0100
Subject: Yum Groups
In-Reply-To: <423FF94C.7050208@israel-jugendtag.ch>
References: <423FF94C.7050208@israel-jugendtag.ch>
Message-ID: <1111489445.7005.264.camel@serendipity.dogma.lan>

Am Di, den 22.03.2005 schrieb Roland K?ser um 11:54:

> Is there a list of all avialable Yum groups for "-y groupinstall" ?

Wrong group for this kind of question. Please use "For users of Fedora
Core releases " in future.

> I tried the RPM package groups but Yum can't find (for sample) the group 
> Development as in the RPM Package groups.

man yum? --> grouplist

> Roland Kaeser

Alexander


-- 
Alexander Dalloz | Enger, Germany | GPG http://pgp.mit.edu 0xB366A773
legal statement: http://www.uni-x.org/legal.html
Fedora Core 2 GNU/Linux on Athlon with kernel 2.6.10-1.770_FC2smp 
Serendipity 12:01:37 up 5 days, 9:57, load average: 0.35, 0.61, 0.62 
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From kyrre at solution-forge.net  Tue Mar 22 11:14:43 2005
From: kyrre at solution-forge.net (Kyrre Ness Sjobak)
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 12:14:43 +0100
Subject: usb_storage
In-Reply-To: <1111315091.9137.86.camel@localhost.localdomain>
References: 
	<20050316132536.2c968d17@localhost.localdomain>
	
	<20050319190341.1331a0f4@localhost.localdomain>
	<1111315091.9137.86.camel@localhost.localdomain>
Message-ID: <1111490082.3328.60.camel@localhost.localdomain>

s?n, 20.03.2005 kl. 11.38 skrev Paul:
> Hi,
> 
> > > Mar 17 14:06:26 localhost kernel: usb 1-4: device descriptor read/64, error -71
> > >[...]
> > > (this is what happens when I plug a SanDisk usb 2 CF reader in on my
> > > laptop)
> > 
> > This is a little better than the silly mail which started the thread,
> > but is not good enough, Peter. At least let me know what kernel you're
> > running and what was the last kernel working (needless to say, with the
> > same reader, same laptop, same port), please.
> 
> Latest rawhide kernel, latest HAL, latest everything. My internal USB
> card reader is not reading cards despite being happily recognised by
> HAL.

That reminds me of something. When i use my 5in1 usb cardreader
(external), i have to unplug/plug it after i have inserted a new card
before it would read it. Somebody told me it was some kind of kernel
bug... Could you try that - and maybe open a bugzilla ticket?

Kyrre



From dragoran at feuerpokemon.de  Tue Mar 22 11:22:23 2005
From: dragoran at feuerpokemon.de (dragoran)
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 12:22:23 +0100
Subject: usb_storage
In-Reply-To: <1111490082.3328.60.camel@localhost.localdomain>
References: 	<20050316132536.2c968d17@localhost.localdomain>		<20050319190341.1331a0f4@localhost.localdomain>	<1111315091.9137.86.camel@localhost.localdomain>
	<1111490082.3328.60.camel@localhost.localdomain>
Message-ID: <423FFFEF.906@feuerpokemon.de>

Kyrre Ness Sjobak wrote:

>s?n, 20.03.2005 kl. 11.38 skrev Paul:
>  
>
>>Hi,
>>
>>    
>>
>>>>Mar 17 14:06:26 localhost kernel: usb 1-4: device descriptor read/64, error -71
>>>>[...]
>>>>(this is what happens when I plug a SanDisk usb 2 CF reader in on my
>>>>laptop)
>>>>        
>>>>
>>>This is a little better than the silly mail which started the thread,
>>>but is not good enough, Peter. At least let me know what kernel you're
>>>running and what was the last kernel working (needless to say, with the
>>>same reader, same laptop, same port), please.
>>>      
>>>
>>Latest rawhide kernel, latest HAL, latest everything. My internal USB
>>card reader is not reading cards despite being happily recognised by
>>HAL.
>>    
>>
>
>That reminds me of something. When i use my 5in1 usb cardreader
>(external), i have to unplug/plug it after i have inserted a new card
>before it would read it. Somebody told me it was some kind of kernel
>bug... Could you try that - and maybe open a bugzilla ticket?
>
>Kyrre
>
>  
>
https://bugzilla.redhat.com/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=150175



From paul at all-the-johnsons.co.uk  Tue Mar 22 11:28:57 2005
From: paul at all-the-johnsons.co.uk (Paul)
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 11:28:57 +0000
Subject: usb_storage
In-Reply-To: <1111490082.3328.60.camel@localhost.localdomain>
References: 
	<20050316132536.2c968d17@localhost.localdomain>
	
	<20050319190341.1331a0f4@localhost.localdomain>
	<1111315091.9137.86.camel@localhost.localdomain>
	<1111490082.3328.60.camel@localhost.localdomain>
Message-ID: <1111490937.5050.25.camel@localhost.localdomain>

Hi,

> > Latest rawhide kernel, latest HAL, latest everything. My internal USB
> > card reader is not reading cards despite being happily recognised by
> > HAL.
> 
> That reminds me of something. When i use my 5in1 usb cardreader
> (external), i have to unplug/plug it after i have inserted a new card
> before it would read it. Somebody told me it was some kind of kernel
> bug... Could you try that - and maybe open a bugzilla ticket?

I'm not seeing that on my laptop currently, only the one I've described
for the internal one.

(from dmesg)
usb 3-2: device not accepting address 4, error -110
usb 3-2: new full speed USB device using ohci_hcd and address 5
cdrom: open failed.
usb 3-2: device descriptor read/64, error -110
cdrom: open failed.
usb 3-2: device descriptor read/64, error -110
usb 3-2: new full speed USB device using ohci_hcd and address 6
usb 3-2: device descriptor read/64, error -110
usb 3-2: device descriptor read/64, error -110
usb 3-3: new full speed USB device using ohci_hcd and address 7

What is error -110?

TTFN

Paul
-- 
"It is often said that something cannot be libel if it is the truth.
This has had to be amended to 'something cannot be libel if it is the
truth or if the bank balance says otherwise'" - US Today
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From mharris at www.linux.org.uk  Tue Mar 22 11:35:37 2005
From: mharris at www.linux.org.uk (Mike A. Harris)
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 06:35:37 -0500
Subject: xinitrc m0x0Cn and you.
Message-ID: <42400309.5060203@www.linux.org.uk>

I'm currently exploring further modularization of the xinitrc
package, with the following goals in mind:

1) Maximize modularization of all scripts included, in an effort
    to make for a modular "drop-in" solution, which window managers
    and desktop environments can use, simply by dropping in the
    appropriate startup scripts to start their respective
    environments up.

2) Minimize xinitrc package maintenance via modularization,
    hopefully providing additional robustness in the process.

3) Enable 3rd party window manager rpm packagers to provide
    drop-in "it works" functionality that integrates with the
    system without requiring changes to the core of xinitrc.


There are several bugs in bugzilla which I'm hoping to address
by these changes.  Most of the requests are requesting xinitrc
to be enhanced to handle various window managers, such as
XFCE, enlightenment, or others.  By genericizing this, I'm
hoping I can provide a simple framework that enables 3rd
parties to just drop in scripts that enable their packages to
work out of the box once installed, without anyone ever
needing to request changes to xinitrc again.

While this concept may (or may not) sound like a large task, it
is seemingly a very very small and simple task IMHO.  I've
attached a very small and simple patch to implement a solution
to this problem to the following bugzilla report:

https://bugzilla.redhat.com/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=142260

Please review the bug, the proposed solution, and provide
any constructive feedback you can directly into the bug
report rather than replying to this email, so that your
thoughts and suggestions are tracked all in one place.

Thanks in advance for any constructive suggestions or feedback.

TTYL



From mharris at www.linux.org.uk  Tue Mar 22 12:01:57 2005
From: mharris at www.linux.org.uk (Mike A. Harris)
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 07:01:57 -0500
Subject: Regression testing
In-Reply-To: <20050318202510.GA1073925@hiwaay.net>
References: 
	<20050318202510.GA1073925@hiwaay.net>
Message-ID: <42400935.20705@www.linux.org.uk>

Chris Adams wrote:
> Once upon a time, Gregory Maxwell  said:
> 
>>One way to accomplish this would be to have the spec optionally build
>>a packagename-regression rpm, which includes the scripts and data
>>needed to perform the automated regression testing.
> 
> 
> Some regression tests are designed to be run in the build tree, so
> building a package is probably not the best way to do this (the OpenSSH
> tests are this way for example).
> 
> A better idea would be for the %build or %install stage (as appropriate)
> to optionally run such tests, so if they fail, the RPM doesn't build.

The openssh tests also consume 99.9% of all CPUs even in 8way boxes, and
do this for like 16 hours straight.  This has caused massive buildsystem
contention in the past when we did have it enabled.

I agree that enabling post build regression tests is in general a good
idea, but before anyone enables tests in a given package, they should
determine how much buildsystem load the tests may cause, and for what
length of time, and also be mindful that the buildsystem is a shared
resource used by numerous people.

For tests that pound the buildsystem(s), they should be disabled by
default IMHO, and only enabled every now and then when the buildsystem
is very idle, and never at peak times of building.

Just some thoughts..




From jdesbonnet at gmail.com  Tue Mar 22 12:04:49 2005
From: jdesbonnet at gmail.com (Joe Desbonnet)
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 12:04:49 +0000
Subject: RPM questions
Message-ID: <1cef3e9505032204045fc278d0@mail.gmail.com>

Some quick questions about RPMs:

1. What is the 'correct' method of arranging a set of update RPMs for
a given package in chronological order? I'm currently using the file
timestamp, but can I rely on mirror servers to preserve timestamps? At
first I thought sorting by file name would work until I encountered
kernel-2.6.9 and kernel-2.6.10 :)   I see there is a build date field
in the RPM header. Is that guaranteed to be in the correct order?

2. I need a quick and dirty way to get to calculate the payload offset
within an RPM. I'm developing in Java so I can't use the RPM
development libraries.

I'm currently using the following code (it's in Java -- but I think
it's obvious what's going on). At the end 'loc' holds the payload
offset. It works for all RPMs in the FC3 distribution, *but* I had to
fix the size of the signature structSize to 216 (a few RPMs reported
212 ?!). Obviously, despite working, I'm doing sometime wrong.


		// din is a InputStream for the RPM file. 
		// din.skip(n) skips forward n bytes.
		// din.read() reads a byte from the stream
		// din.readInt() reads a 32 bit int (4 bytes) from the stream
	
		// skip lead
		din.skip(96);
		int loc = 96;

		if (!((din.read() == 0x8e) && (din.read() == 0xad)
				&& (din.read() == 0xe8) && (din.read() == 0x01))) {
			System.err.println("start of signature magic not found");
			return -1;
		}

		din.skip(4);
		int nIndexEntries = din.readInt();
		int structSize = din.readInt();

		// TODO: why this?   <-- here is my problem: some rpms  reported
		// 212, but if I used this value it failed. If I fix structSize to 216 all
		// the RPMs in the FC3 distribution work !
		if (structSize==212) {
			structSize=216;
		}
		
		din.skip(nIndexEntries * 16 + structSize);
		loc += 16 + nIndexEntries * 16 + structSize;

		if (!((din.read() == 0x8e) && (din.read() == 0xad)
				&& (din.read() == 0xe8) && (din.read() == 0x01))) {
			System.err.println("start of header magic not found");
			return -1;
		}

		din.skip(4);
		nIndexEntries = din.readInt();
		structSize = din.readInt();

		din.skip(nIndexEntries * 16 + structSize);
		loc += 16 + nIndexEntries * 16 + structSize;

Thanks,
Joe.



From bernd.bartmann at gmail.com  Tue Mar 22 12:10:37 2005
From: bernd.bartmann at gmail.com (Bernd Bartmann)
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 13:10:37 +0100
Subject: Status of USB install support in FC4 Test1?
In-Reply-To: <20050321145831.1220730c@localhost.localdomain>
References: 
	<20050321145831.1220730c@localhost.localdomain>
Message-ID: <6c18a4f050322041085b0a5a@mail.gmail.com>

On Mon, 21 Mar 2005 14:58:31 -0800, Pete Zaitcev  wrote:
> On Sun, 20 Mar 2005 21:56:36 +0100 Bernd Bartmann  wrote:
> 
> > what's the status in FC4 Test1 for install support to USB storage
> > devices. FC3 only seems to allow installation to USB storage devices
> > in expert mode and even then you have to manually created an initrd
> > with support for the USB storage modules. Is there any progress in
> > this area planned for FC4?
> 
> No, I'm not aware of anything. Maybe Jeremy knows?
> 
> Also please pardon me asking, but why would you want this? It sounds like
> a crackpot idea to me. Do you want to have something like Fedoppix on
> a USB flash key? I am very interested to know what is the intended
> application of such install.

The intended application is a completely hard disk and fan-less system
- no rotating parts --> no mechanical problems (broken fans or hdds).
With 4GB and even 8GB CF-Cards and a passively cooled VIA C3 CPU
available it is easy to build such a system as a thin client or
firewall machine.

BTW: I have FC4T1 now up and running in such a way. But I still had to
do some dirty work to get this going. Please see bug #151690 for a
short description.

cu,
Bernd.



From mitr at volny.cz  Tue Mar 22 12:12:03 2005
From: mitr at volny.cz (Miloslav Trmac)
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 13:12:03 +0100
Subject: RPM questions
In-Reply-To: <1cef3e9505032204045fc278d0@mail.gmail.com>
References: <1cef3e9505032204045fc278d0@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <20050322121159.GC13176@chrys.ms.mff.cuni.cz>

On Tue, Mar 22, 2005 at 12:04:49PM +0000, Joe Desbonnet wrote:
> 1. What is the 'correct' method of arranging a set of update RPMs for
> a given package in chronological order? I'm currently using the file
> timestamp, but can I rely on mirror servers to preserve timestamps? At
> first I thought sorting by file name would work until I encountered
> kernel-2.6.9 and kernel-2.6.10 :)   I see there is a build date field
> in the RPM header. Is that guaranteed to be in the correct order?
Really chronological or e:v-r?

> 		// TODO: why this?   <-- here is my problem: some rpms  reported
> 		// 212, but if I used this value it failed. If I fix structSize to 216 all
> 		// the RPMs in the FC3 distribution work !
> 		if (structSize==212) {
> 			structSize=216;
> 		}
The file offset of the header must be divisible by 8, just skip
enough bytes to achieve the needed alignment.
	Mirek



From mitr at volny.cz  Tue Mar 22 12:20:16 2005
From: mitr at volny.cz (Miloslav Trmac)
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 13:20:16 +0100
Subject: xinitrc m0x0Cn and you.
In-Reply-To: <42400309.5060203@www.linux.org.uk>
References: <42400309.5060203@www.linux.org.uk>
Message-ID: <20050322122013.GD13176@chrys.ms.mff.cuni.cz>

Hello,
On Tue, Mar 22, 2005 at 06:35:37AM -0500, Mike A. Harris wrote:
> I'm currently exploring further modularization of the xinitrc
> package, with the following goals in mind:
Let me suggest
4) Avoid introducing new interfaces when there already is
a consensus in a related field.

In particular, .desktop files in /usr/share/xsession seems
to be the consensus among GDM and KDM, and should be usable
for xinitrc too.
	Mirek



From kyrre at solution-forge.net  Tue Mar 22 12:40:07 2005
From: kyrre at solution-forge.net (Kyrre Ness Sjobak)
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 13:40:07 +0100
Subject: fedora-directory-server?
Message-ID: <1111495207.3328.85.camel@localhost.localdomain>

While reporting a bug in bugzilla, I came over a courious option -
"fedora directory server". What is this? Google only turned up with a
closed mailing list with closed archives - and something about the
acquisition of the Netscape directory...

While bugzilla gives me some hints (database, security/access control,
different UI's, migration etc - but no bugs...), and the mentioned
acquisition some more - but it is definitely leaving me rather
curious... What is this thing? When will it be released?

Kyrre Ness Sj?b?k



From rdieter at math.unl.edu  Tue Mar 22 12:59:31 2005
From: rdieter at math.unl.edu (Rex Dieter)
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 06:59:31 -0600
Subject: xinitrc m0x0Cn and you.
In-Reply-To: <20050322122013.GD13176@chrys.ms.mff.cuni.cz>
References: <42400309.5060203@www.linux.org.uk>
	<20050322122013.GD13176@chrys.ms.mff.cuni.cz>
Message-ID: <424016B3.6000906@math.unl.edu>

Miloslav Trmac wrote:
> Hello,
> On Tue, Mar 22, 2005 at 06:35:37AM -0500, Mike A. Harris wrote:
> 
>>I'm currently exploring further modularization of the xinitrc
>>package, with the following goals in mind:
> 
> Let me suggest
> 4) Avoid introducing new interfaces when there already is
> a consensus in a related field.
> 
> In particular, .desktop files in /usr/share/xsession seems
> to be the consensus among GDM and KDM, and should be usable
> for xinitrc too.

Yeah, but now you want xinitrc, a bash shell script to parse .desktop 
files?  (Not that it would be *that* hard to pick out the line Exec= or 
TryExec= entry)

-- Rex



From rdieter at math.unl.edu  Tue Mar 22 13:05:24 2005
From: rdieter at math.unl.edu (Rex Dieter)
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 07:05:24 -0600
Subject: xinitrc m0x0Cn and you.
In-Reply-To: <42400309.5060203@www.linux.org.uk>
References: <42400309.5060203@www.linux.org.uk>
Message-ID: <42401814.6080700@math.unl.edu>

Mike A. Harris wrote:
> I'm currently exploring further modularization of the xinitrc
> package, with the following goals in mind:
> 
> 1) Maximize modularization of all scripts included, in an effort
...
> 2) Minimize xinitrc package maintenance via modularization,
...
> 3) Enable 3rd party window manager rpm packagers to provide
>    drop-in "it works" functionality that integrates with the
>    system without requiring changes to the core of xinitrc.
...
> While this concept may (or may not) sound like a large task, it
> is seemingly a very very small and simple task IMHO.  I've
> attached a very small and simple patch to implement a solution
> to this problem to the following bugzilla report:
> https://bugzilla.redhat.com/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=142260

I had done the essentially the same thing in a couple months ago:
http://bugzilla.redhat.com/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=122941#c12
but my suggested patch also removes all switchdesk references, and 
hard-coded references to gnome/kde (as well as gdm/kdm).


-- Rex



From buildsys at redhat.com  Tue Mar 22 13:29:23 2005
From: buildsys at redhat.com (Build System)
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 08:29:23 -0500
Subject: rawhide report: 20050322 changes
Message-ID: <200503221329.j2MDTNU5024771@porkchop.devel.redhat.com>

 

 
Updated Packages:

anaconda-10.2.0.29-1
--------------------
* Mon Mar 21 2005 Jeremy Katz  - 10.2.0.29-1
- Fix beta nag translation
- Fix button growing (clumens, #151208)
- Add libstdc++ for images (clumens)
- Clean up congrats screen (clumens, #149526)
- Fix CD ejecting in loader (pnasrat, #151232)
- Exclude Xen kernels from everything install (#151490)
- Add reserve_size for ppc to leave room on disc1 (#151234)
- Add some more locales

elinks-0.10.3-1
---------------
* Mon Mar 21 2005 Karel Zak  0.10.3-1
- sync with upstream; stable 0.10.3

firefox-0:1.0.1-6
-----------------
* Tue Mar 22 2005 Christopher Aillon  0:1.0.1-6
- Add patch to fix italic rendering errors with certain fonts (e.g. Tahoma)
- Re-enable jsd since there is now a venkman version that works with Firefox.

gcc-4.0.0-0.35
--------------
* Mon Mar 21 2005 Jakub Jelinek   4.0.0-0.35
- update from CVS
  - PRs ada/18727, ada/19140, ada/19408, ada/19900, ada/20255, ada/20344,
	c++/20240, c++/20333, fortran/18525, fortran/18827, java/20522,
	libfortran/20257, libfortran/20480, libgcj/20251, middle-end/15700,
	middle-end/20225, middle-end/20493, target/18251, target/18380,
	target/18551, tree-optimization/17454, tree-optimization/20474
- replace 3.4 with 4.0 in gcc %description and libgcc Summary (#151327)
- don't hardcode full path to gcc in c89 and c99 wrapper scripts (#151620)
- fix loop optimizer with loops that after tree optimization are entered
  after the loop body (Alexandre Oliva, PR rtl-optimization/20290, #150020)
- fix handling of jump tables at the end of scope with -g1 (#151466)
- BuildRequire gmp-devel with mpfr support
- tighten up rpm requires between subpackages

gnome-keyring-manager-0.0.4-3
-----------------------------
* Mon Mar 21 2005 David Zeuthen  0.0.4-3
- Fix Group tag for consistency (#147903)
gnome-system-monitor-2.10.0-2
-----------------------------
* Mon Mar 21 2005 David Zeuthen  2.10.0-2
- Build with selinux support (#139896)

gzip-1.3.5-1
------------
* Tue Mar 22 2005 Tomas Mraz  1.3.5-1
- upstream 1.3.5
- dropped long ago obsolete dirinfo patch
- escape file names in zgrep (#123012)

kdebase-6:3.4.0-2
-----------------
* Mon Mar 21 2005 Than Ngo  6:3.4.0-2
- add konsole in desktop menu

krb5-auth-dialog-0.2-3
----------------------

libxklavier-2.0-1
-----------------
* Mon Mar 21 2005 David Zeuthen  2.0-1
- Update to latest upstream version

man-1.5p-3
----------
* Tue Mar 22 2005 Ivana Varekova  1.5p-3
- fix bug 142673 - bugs in man2html

mc-1:4.6.1a-0.6
---------------
* Mon Mar 21 2005 Jindrich Novy  4.6.1a-0.6
- fix refusal to chdir/start file action when spaces are typed in
  command prompt and Enter is pressed (#151637)
- undefinition of umode_t for ppc64 is no more needed

mdadm-1.9.0-2.fc4
-----------------
* Mon Mar 21 2005 Doug Ledford  1.9.0-2
- Build mdadm.static and mdassemble (static as well) to be used in initrd
  images

mtools-3.9.9-13
---------------
* Mon Mar 21 2005 Tim Waugh  3.9.9-13
- Fixed memset() usage bug.

nautilus-2.10.0-1
-----------------
* Mon Mar 21 2005 David Zeuthen  2.10.0-1
- Update to latest upstream version; tweak requires

* Thu Mar 03 2005 Alex Larsson  2.9.91-2
- Rebuild

* Fri Feb 11 2005 Matthias Clasen  - 2.9.91-1
- Update to 2.9.91

openoffice.org-1:1.9.87-1
-------------------------
* Sat Mar 19 2005 Caolan McNamara  1:1.9.87-1
- bump to latest version
- rh#151356# stick to 2.0 pathname to keep user settings during pre-release cycle
- drop integrated workspace-gcj3.patch
- drop integrated openoffice.org-1.9.83.ooo44377.icunotusingfpic.patch
- add openoffice.org-1.9.87.gccXXXXX.bean.patch to temporariy work around spurious gcj symbol
- drop unnecessary openoffice.org-1.9.82.NONE.qadevOOogcj.patch
- merge patches that skip boring modules
- scboost issue now part of gccfour workspace
- openoffice.org-1.9.87.NONE.wizards.broken.patch wizards build with gcj, but don't register
- reshuffle direct install to a simple warn not error on missing files, and hijack PKGFORMAT to
  transport direct install flags
- libxmlsec name changed
- java-filter subpackage like upstream now that they build with gcj
- backport openoffice.org-1.9.87.ooo43538.sfx2.patch for rh#151594#
- add requires on appropiate fonts for some langpacks

oprofile-0.8.2-2
----------------
* Mon Mar 21 2005 Will Cohen 
- Bump release.
- Rebase on 0.8.2 release.

rdesktop-1.4.0-1
----------------
* Mon Mar 21 2005 David Zeuthen  1.4.0-1
- New upstream version; drop some patches that is now upstream
- Require xorg-x11-devel instead of XFree86-devel for building

redhat-menus-3.7.1-7
--------------------
* Mon Mar 21 2005 Than Ngo  3.7.1-7
- add mssing kwrite/kate/kedit, kcontrol center, System setting
  in menu #147121, #12218, #1221811, #143937
- get rid of capplets from preferences.menu, #149233
- fix icon entry in desktop file #143336

rpm-4.4.1-8
-----------
* Mon Mar 21 2005 Paul Nasrat  4.4.1-8
- Add devel requires libselinux-devel
- Fileconflicts as FC3 (#151609)

system-config-nfs-1.3.4-1
-------------------------
* Mon Mar 21 2005 Nils Philippsen  1.3.4-1
- warn user about parse errors in /etc/exports

system-config-printer-0.6.126-1
-------------------------------
* Mon Mar 21 2005 Tim Waugh  0.6.126-1
- 0.6.126:
  - Add bn_IN translation.
  - Fixed bool handling (bug #151161).
  - Avoid gtk/TRUE/FALSE.

xfig-3.2.4-10
-------------
* Mon Mar 21 2005 Than Ngo  3.2.4-10
- fix font warning #116542

xinitrc-4.0.15-1
----------------
* Mon Mar 21 2005 Mike A. Harris  4.0.15-1
- Added fix for Xsession spawned ssh-agent continuing to run after user logs
  out, which causes buildup of ssh-agent processes. (#138747,134494)

* Mon Mar 07 2005 Mike A. Harris  4.0.14-2
- Added Requires: xterm, because the "failsafe" configuration requires xterm
  unconditionally.



From mharris at www.linux.org.uk  Tue Mar 22 14:01:31 2005
From: mharris at www.linux.org.uk (Mike A. Harris)
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 09:01:31 -0500
Subject: xinitrc m0x0Cn and you.
In-Reply-To: <42401814.6080700@math.unl.edu>
References: <42400309.5060203@www.linux.org.uk> <42401814.6080700@math.unl.edu>
Message-ID: <4240253B.6060702@www.linux.org.uk>

Rex Dieter wrote:
> Mike A. Harris wrote:
> 
>> I'm currently exploring further modularization of the xinitrc
>> package, with the following goals in mind:
>>
>> 1) Maximize modularization of all scripts included, in an effort
> 
> ...
> 
>> 2) Minimize xinitrc package maintenance via modularization,
> 
> ...
> 
>> 3) Enable 3rd party window manager rpm packagers to provide
>>    drop-in "it works" functionality that integrates with the
>>    system without requiring changes to the core of xinitrc.
> 
> ...
> 
>> While this concept may (or may not) sound like a large task, it
>> is seemingly a very very small and simple task IMHO.  I've
>> attached a very small and simple patch to implement a solution
>> to this problem to the following bugzilla report:
>> https://bugzilla.redhat.com/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=142260
> 
> 
> I had done the essentially the same thing in a couple months ago:
> http://bugzilla.redhat.com/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=122941#c12
> but my suggested patch also removes all switchdesk references, and 
> hard-coded references to gnome/kde (as well as gdm/kdm).

Hmm, yes "Xclients.d" might be a better name for the directory than
Xsession.d is.  The same script could be used both for *dm startup
and startx presumeably.



From vherva at viasys.com  Tue Mar 22 14:58:06 2005
From: vherva at viasys.com (Ville Herva)
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 16:58:06 +0200
Subject: Q on yum cleanup
In-Reply-To: <20050318144356.073e3b11@nausicaa.camperquake.de>
References: <1111152164.8014.97.camel@localhost.localdomain>
	<1111152347.30200.45.camel@cutter>
	<1111152498.8014.105.camel@localhost.localdomain>
	<1111152998.30200.48.camel@cutter>
	<20050318144356.073e3b11@nausicaa.camperquake.de>
Message-ID: <20050322145806.GL15993@viasys.com>

On Fri, Mar 18, 2005 at 02:43:56PM +0100, you [Ralf Ertzinger] wrote:
> Hi.
> 
> seth vidal  wrote:
> 
> > and look for duplicates, remove the older packages with:
> > yum remove package-ver-rel.arch
> 
> Whenever such things happen, I use this to find duplicates:
> 
> rpm -aq --queryformat "%{NAME}\n" | sort | uniq -c | grep -v -E " *1 "

Hmm, I found a few.

Recently, "yum update" has often halted in the middle of updating, usually
in the clean up phase. According to strace, it waits for a futex (sorry, I
didn't save the strace log, will do if it happens again). I've had to kill
-KILL it, HUP nor TERM are not enough. After this, it apparently leaves the
other package version in place, for example:

 > rpm -q xfig
 xfig-3.2.4-7.i386.rpm
 xfig-3.2.4-9.i386.rpm

(xfig is just an example, there were tens of duplicate packages).

I tried "yum remove xfig-3.2.4-7.i386", but after that "rpm -q xfig" still
said xfig was installed twice. I did rpm -e xfig-3.2.4-7 (which I *though*
should be safe), but after that, rpm -q -V xfig-3.2.4-9 said a bunch of
stuff in /usr/share/doc/xfig/html/ and elsewhere were missing. The same
happened with other duplicate packages as well. Nothing fatal was missing,
the binaries were still there, mostly documentation was missing (apparently
somehow shared or identical between the rpm versions.) A reinstall or next
upgrade will of course fix this. ("yum reinstall xfig", "yum install --force
xfig" or "yum download xfig && rpm -U --force .../xfig.rpm" would be nice in
this case.)

Which of these symptoms are to be expected, and are the missing files
related to the rpm bug recently reported to the fedora devel list?

PS: "yum --force install" would be nice for other reasons, too. For example
"yum --force install gkrellm" when I have custom compiled kernel, and it
complains about too old kernel. Please don't flame, a simple "no" will do
:). I understand this is considered too dirty...


-- v -- 

v at iki.fi



From nphilipp at redhat.com  Tue Mar 22 15:08:54 2005
From: nphilipp at redhat.com (Nils Philippsen)
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 16:08:54 +0100
Subject: ufraw, was: rawhide report: 20050318 changes
In-Reply-To: <1111429953.1747.11.camel@wintermute.sr.unh.edu>
References: <200503181310.j2IDA6dw024446@porkchop.devel.redhat.com>
	<1111429953.1747.11.camel@wintermute.sr.unh.edu>
Message-ID: <1111504134.7279.7.camel@wombat.tiptoe.de>

On Mon, 2005-03-21 at 13:32 -0500, Thomas J. Baker wrote:
> On Fri, 2005-03-18 at 08:10 -0500, Build System wrote:
> 
> > Removed package ufraw
> > 
> 
> Will ufraw be moving to extras?

Good idea, if anybody would sponsor me on that I'll update the ufraw
packages from FC3 to what is current and import it into Extras CVS.

Nils
-- 
     Nils Philippsen    /    Red Hat    /    nphilipp at redhat.com
"They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary
 safety deserve neither liberty nor safety."     -- B. Franklin, 1759
 PGP fingerprint:  C4A8 9474 5C4C ADE3 2B8F  656D 47D8 9B65 6951 3011



From nphilipp at redhat.com  Tue Mar 22 15:11:06 2005
From: nphilipp at redhat.com (Nils Philippsen)
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 16:11:06 +0100
Subject: gimp-2.2.4-0.fc3.3 man pages
In-Reply-To: 
References: 
Message-ID: <1111504266.7279.10.camel@wombat.tiptoe.de>

On Mon, 2005-03-21 at 19:29 +0000, susan_geller at speakeasy.net wrote:

> > please open a Bugzilla ticket for this one.
> > 
> > Thanks,
> > Nils
> 
> OK.  It is in as: "Bug 151693: gimp man pages have non-standard names"

Fixed in Rawhide in gimp-2.2.4-5, will be contained in the next FC3
update (I don't want to push a 10MB update just for a mere 3 missing
symlinks).

Nils
-- 
     Nils Philippsen    /    Red Hat    /    nphilipp at redhat.com
"They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary
 safety deserve neither liberty nor safety."     -- B. Franklin, 1759
 PGP fingerprint:  C4A8 9474 5C4C ADE3 2B8F  656D 47D8 9B65 6951 3011



From roli at israel-jugendtag.ch  Tue Mar 22 15:14:18 2005
From: roli at israel-jugendtag.ch (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Roland_K=E4ser?=)
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 16:14:18 +0100
Subject: rawhide report: 20050322 changes
In-Reply-To: <200503221329.j2MDTNU5024771@porkchop.devel.redhat.com>
References: <200503221329.j2MDTNU5024771@porkchop.devel.redhat.com>
Message-ID: <4240364A.1060309@israel-jugendtag.ch>

Hello

 > anaconda-10.2.0.29-1
 > --------------------
Does it exist a roadmap for the xen integration of anarconda? (To 
install fedora as xen guest system)?

Roland Kaeser


Build System wrote:
>  
> 
>  
> Updated Packages:
> 
> anaconda-10.2.0.29-1
> --------------------
> * Mon Mar 21 2005 Jeremy Katz  - 10.2.0.29-1
> - Fix beta nag translation
> - Fix button growing (clumens, #151208)
> - Add libstdc++ for images (clumens)
> - Clean up congrats screen (clumens, #149526)
> - Fix CD ejecting in loader (pnasrat, #151232)
> - Exclude Xen kernels from everything install (#151490)
> - Add reserve_size for ppc to leave room on disc1 (#151234)
> - Add some more locales
> 
> elinks-0.10.3-1
> ---------------
> * Mon Mar 21 2005 Karel Zak  0.10.3-1
> - sync with upstream; stable 0.10.3
> 
> firefox-0:1.0.1-6
> -----------------
> * Tue Mar 22 2005 Christopher Aillon  0:1.0.1-6
> - Add patch to fix italic rendering errors with certain fonts (e.g. Tahoma)
> - Re-enable jsd since there is now a venkman version that works with Firefox.
> 
> gcc-4.0.0-0.35
> --------------
> * Mon Mar 21 2005 Jakub Jelinek   4.0.0-0.35
> - update from CVS
>   - PRs ada/18727, ada/19140, ada/19408, ada/19900, ada/20255, ada/20344,
> 	c++/20240, c++/20333, fortran/18525, fortran/18827, java/20522,
> 	libfortran/20257, libfortran/20480, libgcj/20251, middle-end/15700,
> 	middle-end/20225, middle-end/20493, target/18251, target/18380,
> 	target/18551, tree-optimization/17454, tree-optimization/20474
> - replace 3.4 with 4.0 in gcc %description and libgcc Summary (#151327)
> - don't hardcode full path to gcc in c89 and c99 wrapper scripts (#151620)
> - fix loop optimizer with loops that after tree optimization are entered
>   after the loop body (Alexandre Oliva, PR rtl-optimization/20290, #150020)
> - fix handling of jump tables at the end of scope with -g1 (#151466)
> - BuildRequire gmp-devel with mpfr support
> - tighten up rpm requires between subpackages
> 
> gnome-keyring-manager-0.0.4-3
> -----------------------------
> * Mon Mar 21 2005 David Zeuthen  0.0.4-3
> - Fix Group tag for consistency (#147903)
> gnome-system-monitor-2.10.0-2
> -----------------------------
> * Mon Mar 21 2005 David Zeuthen  2.10.0-2
> - Build with selinux support (#139896)
> 
> gzip-1.3.5-1
> ------------
> * Tue Mar 22 2005 Tomas Mraz  1.3.5-1
> - upstream 1.3.5
> - dropped long ago obsolete dirinfo patch
> - escape file names in zgrep (#123012)
> 
> kdebase-6:3.4.0-2
> -----------------
> * Mon Mar 21 2005 Than Ngo  6:3.4.0-2
> - add konsole in desktop menu
> 
> krb5-auth-dialog-0.2-3
> ----------------------
> 
> libxklavier-2.0-1
> -----------------
> * Mon Mar 21 2005 David Zeuthen  2.0-1
> - Update to latest upstream version
> 
> man-1.5p-3
> ----------
> * Tue Mar 22 2005 Ivana Varekova  1.5p-3
> - fix bug 142673 - bugs in man2html
> 
> mc-1:4.6.1a-0.6
> ---------------
> * Mon Mar 21 2005 Jindrich Novy  4.6.1a-0.6
> - fix refusal to chdir/start file action when spaces are typed in
>   command prompt and Enter is pressed (#151637)
> - undefinition of umode_t for ppc64 is no more needed
> 
> mdadm-1.9.0-2.fc4
> -----------------
> * Mon Mar 21 2005 Doug Ledford  1.9.0-2
> - Build mdadm.static and mdassemble (static as well) to be used in initrd
>   images
> 
> mtools-3.9.9-13
> ---------------
> * Mon Mar 21 2005 Tim Waugh  3.9.9-13
> - Fixed memset() usage bug.
> 
> nautilus-2.10.0-1
> -----------------
> * Mon Mar 21 2005 David Zeuthen  2.10.0-1
> - Update to latest upstream version; tweak requires
> 
> * Thu Mar 03 2005 Alex Larsson  2.9.91-2
> - Rebuild
> 
> * Fri Feb 11 2005 Matthias Clasen  - 2.9.91-1
> - Update to 2.9.91
> 
> openoffice.org-1:1.9.87-1
> -------------------------
> * Sat Mar 19 2005 Caolan McNamara  1:1.9.87-1
> - bump to latest version
> - rh#151356# stick to 2.0 pathname to keep user settings during pre-release cycle
> - drop integrated workspace-gcj3.patch
> - drop integrated openoffice.org-1.9.83.ooo44377.icunotusingfpic.patch
> - add openoffice.org-1.9.87.gccXXXXX.bean.patch to temporariy work around spurious gcj symbol
> - drop unnecessary openoffice.org-1.9.82.NONE.qadevOOogcj.patch
> - merge patches that skip boring modules
> - scboost issue now part of gccfour workspace
> - openoffice.org-1.9.87.NONE.wizards.broken.patch wizards build with gcj, but don't register
> - reshuffle direct install to a simple warn not error on missing files, and hijack PKGFORMAT to
>   transport direct install flags
> - libxmlsec name changed
> - java-filter subpackage like upstream now that they build with gcj
> - backport openoffice.org-1.9.87.ooo43538.sfx2.patch for rh#151594#
> - add requires on appropiate fonts for some langpacks
> 
> oprofile-0.8.2-2
> ----------------
> * Mon Mar 21 2005 Will Cohen 
> - Bump release.
> - Rebase on 0.8.2 release.
> 
> rdesktop-1.4.0-1
> ----------------
> * Mon Mar 21 2005 David Zeuthen  1.4.0-1
> - New upstream version; drop some patches that is now upstream
> - Require xorg-x11-devel instead of XFree86-devel for building
> 
> redhat-menus-3.7.1-7
> --------------------
> * Mon Mar 21 2005 Than Ngo  3.7.1-7
> - add mssing kwrite/kate/kedit, kcontrol center, System setting
>   in menu #147121, #12218, #1221811, #143937
> - get rid of capplets from preferences.menu, #149233
> - fix icon entry in desktop file #143336
> 
> rpm-4.4.1-8
> -----------
> * Mon Mar 21 2005 Paul Nasrat  4.4.1-8
> - Add devel requires libselinux-devel
> - Fileconflicts as FC3 (#151609)
> 
> system-config-nfs-1.3.4-1
> -------------------------
> * Mon Mar 21 2005 Nils Philippsen  1.3.4-1
> - warn user about parse errors in /etc/exports
> 
> system-config-printer-0.6.126-1
> -------------------------------
> * Mon Mar 21 2005 Tim Waugh  0.6.126-1
> - 0.6.126:
>   - Add bn_IN translation.
>   - Fixed bool handling (bug #151161).
>   - Avoid gtk/TRUE/FALSE.
> 
> xfig-3.2.4-10
> -------------
> * Mon Mar 21 2005 Than Ngo  3.2.4-10
> - fix font warning #116542
> 
> xinitrc-4.0.15-1
> ----------------
> * Mon Mar 21 2005 Mike A. Harris  4.0.15-1
> - Added fix for Xsession spawned ssh-agent continuing to run after user logs
>   out, which causes buildup of ssh-agent processes. (#138747,134494)
> 
> * Mon Mar 07 2005 Mike A. Harris  4.0.14-2
> - Added Requires: xterm, because the "failsafe" configuration requires xterm
>   unconditionally.
> 



From dcbw at redhat.com  Tue Mar 22 15:15:24 2005
From: dcbw at redhat.com (Dan Williams)
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 10:15:24 -0500
Subject: Rawhide NetworkManager
In-Reply-To: <423FBFB7.6010400@feuerpokemon.de>
References: <1111160849.32293.23.camel@dch.TQMcube.com>
	
	<423FBFB7.6010400@feuerpokemon.de>
Message-ID: <1111504525.6338.2.camel@dcbw.boston.redhat.com>

On Tue, 2005-03-22 at 07:48 +0100, dragoran wrote:
> Dan Williams wrote:
> >So yes, we do honor distro-specific static IP config files, _except_ for DNS 
> >entries in resolv.conf, mainly because nobody has figured it out yet.  We need 
> >to know which file NM should copy the DNS info from (on Fedora, where does the 
> >information entered into the DNS tab of system-config-network get stored, and 
> >how do you change it for multiple profiles?).
> >
> >Dan
> >
> >  
> >
> /etc/sysconfig/networking/profiles//resolv.conf

Ok, next question is:

1) How do you know which profile is begin used at any given time?

Dan



From pjones at redhat.com  Tue Mar 22 15:25:10 2005
From: pjones at redhat.com (Peter Jones)
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 10:25:10 -0500
Subject: Regression testing
In-Reply-To: <42400935.20705@www.linux.org.uk>
References: 
	<20050318202510.GA1073925@hiwaay.net> <42400935.20705@www.linux.org.uk>
Message-ID: <1111505110.29748.31.camel@localhost.localdomain>

Chris Adams wrote:
> Some regression tests are designed to be run in the build tree, so
> building a package is probably not the best way to do this (the OpenSSH
> tests are this way for example).
>
> A better idea would be for the %build or %install stage (as appropriate)
> to optionally run such tests, so if they fail, the RPM doesn't build.

I think this is a bad answer.  If we're trying to save cycles at build
time, it'd be better to split them into the set of "critical" tests and
"really important" tests.  The "critical" ones would test the
functionality that the package *must* provide for the rest of the
distro, and would run during the build.  The "really important" ones
would be packaged in a separate file (like -debuginfo is) and could be
run out of band.

On Tue, 2005-03-22 at 07:01 -0500, Mike A. Harris wrote:
> The openssh tests also consume 99.9% of all CPUs even in 8way boxes, and
> do this for like 16 hours straight.  This has caused massive buildsystem
> contention in the past when we did have it enabled.

Again, this is a great example where should run a limited test during
the build, and a more elaborate test later.

I think Greg Maxwell said (sorry if I get the attributions wrong, your
indentation isn't obvious):
> One way to accomplish this would be to have the spec optionally build
> a packagename-regression rpm, which includes the scripts and data
> needed to perform the automated regression testing.

This is a good idea.  It'd be ideal to make sure the tests are packaged
in such a way that they could be run later, against a built package.
That would allow:

1) the ability to ship the packages on CDs and such without including
   the extra bloat of the test code.  This is also true of tests that
   run during the build, of course.
2) the ability not to run the tests during the build.  Clearly, there
   are some tests that should be run at build time, but a full test
   suite is not really required.  With openssl, being able to generate
   and use keys needed for ssh and https is probably near all you
   really need to do to say the build completed ok.
3) the ability for moderately-trusted individuals in the community to
   help with the burden of running test suites, which also allows them
   to show that they're making a useful contribution.  People who do a
   good job of making sure tests are run correctly, and figuring out
   why failures happen would be good candidates to invite to the
   maintainers mailing list.

On Tue, 2005-03-22 at 07:01 -0500, Mike A. Harris wrote:
> I agree that enabling post build regression tests is in general a good
> idea, but before anyone enables tests in a given package, they should
> determine how much buildsystem load the tests may cause, and for what
> length of time, and also be mindful that the buildsystem is a shared
> resource used by numerous people.

They should also take into account what rate of false-negative results
is acceptable before the tests become too much of a burden.  For
example, several months ago I built a big pile of CPAN modules on
x86_64, and a very large number of their self-tests failed for
essentially bogus reasons.  I can't imagine ppc/ppc64/s390/s390x is any
_better_.

> For tests that pound the buildsystem(s), they should be disabled by
> default IMHO, and only enabled every now and then when the buildsystem
> is very idle, and never at peak times of building.

I don't think we should have to *change* the package (contents or .spec)
to determine if the tests run.  Those that test for functionality that's
critical to other Fedora packages should be run at build time if at all
possible, other tests are nice to run, but can really be delayed until
later.

-- 
        Peter



From paul at all-the-johnsons.co.uk  Tue Mar 22 15:28:28 2005
From: paul at all-the-johnsons.co.uk (Paul)
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 15:28:28 +0000
Subject: rawhide report: 20050322 changes
In-Reply-To: <4240364A.1060309@israel-jugendtag.ch>
References: <200503221329.j2MDTNU5024771@porkchop.devel.redhat.com>
	<4240364A.1060309@israel-jugendtag.ch>
Message-ID: <1111505308.5050.67.camel@localhost.localdomain>

Hi,

> > openoffice.org-1:1.9.87-1
> > -------------------------
> > * Sat Mar 19 2005 Caolan McNamara  1:1.9.87-1

Anyone else getting the error "unable to find suitable windowing system,
exitting" (or something similar) when OOo is updated?

TTFN

Paul
-- 
"It is often said that something cannot be libel if it is the truth.
This has had to be amended to 'something cannot be libel if it is the
truth or if the bank balance says otherwise'" - US Today
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From bdpepple at ameritech.net  Tue Mar 22 15:30:38 2005
From: bdpepple at ameritech.net (Brian Pepple)
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 10:30:38 -0500
Subject: ufraw
In-Reply-To: <1111504134.7279.7.camel@wombat.tiptoe.de>
References: <200503181310.j2IDA6dw024446@porkchop.devel.redhat.com>
	<1111429953.1747.11.camel@wintermute.sr.unh.edu>
	<1111504134.7279.7.camel@wombat.tiptoe.de>
Message-ID: <1111505438.11565.2.camel@localhost.localdomain>

On Tue, 2005-03-22 at 16:08 +0100, Nils Philippsen wrote:
> Good idea, if anybody would sponsor me on that I'll update the ufraw
> packages from FC3 to what is current and import it into Extras CVS.

Nils, I'll sponsor you.  Sounds like a good package to add to Extras.

/B
-- 
Brian Pepple 

gpg --keyserver pgp.mit.edu --recv-keys 810CC15E
BD5E 6F9E 8688 E668 8F5B  CBDE 326A E936 810C C15E
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From nphilipp at redhat.com  Tue Mar 22 15:37:13 2005
From: nphilipp at redhat.com (Nils Philippsen)
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 16:37:13 +0100
Subject: Rawhide NetworkManager
In-Reply-To: 
References: <1111160849.32293.23.camel@dch.TQMcube.com>
	
Message-ID: <1111505833.7279.19.camel@wombat.tiptoe.de>

On Tue, 2005-03-22 at 01:06 -0500, Dan Williams wrote:
> On Fri, 18 Mar 2005, David Cary Hart wrote:
> > Is NM still dependent upon Bind? Does it still silently clobber resolv.conf?
> > 
> > README: At this time, it does not support static IP addresses on
> > network interfaces, and requires DHCP to be used instead.
> 
> The readme is wrong...
> 
> > NEWS: Support static IP addresses, Dan Williams
> > 
> > I assume that "NEWS" is correct. OTOH then wouldn't it be preferable to use static IPs on the devices?
> 
> So yes, we do honor distro-specific static IP config files, _except_ for DNS 
> entries in resolv.conf, mainly because nobody has figured it out yet.  We need 
> to know which file NM should copy the DNS info from (on Fedora, where does the 
> information entered into the DNS tab of system-config-network get stored, and 
> how do you change it for multiple profiles?).

Related (and my info here is based on FC3, so if this is different now
my question should probably be as well):

What are the specific reasons to use an internal DHCP client instead of
e.g. dhclient -- with the latter, I could (and did) use custom
configuration files (to request some no standard DHCP options) as well
as exit hooks which determined which network I plugged into and set up
some custom things according to that information (e.g. forwarders for
privoxy, named (with a static resolv.conf), ...).

I realize there is NetworkManagerDispatcher and that it runs scripts
from /etc/networkmanager but the information I have in these scripts is
awfully few (it lacks e.g. the domain name or the timeserver and other
such nifties I have when using dhclient).

Nils
-- 
     Nils Philippsen    /    Red Hat    /    nphilipp at redhat.com
"They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary
 safety deserve neither liberty nor safety."     -- B. Franklin, 1759
 PGP fingerprint:  C4A8 9474 5C4C ADE3 2B8F  656D 47D8 9B65 6951 3011



From katzj at redhat.com  Tue Mar 22 15:41:33 2005
From: katzj at redhat.com (Jeremy Katz)
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 10:41:33 -0500
Subject: rawhide report: 20050322 changes
In-Reply-To: <4240364A.1060309@israel-jugendtag.ch>
References: <200503221329.j2MDTNU5024771@porkchop.devel.redhat.com>
	<4240364A.1060309@israel-jugendtag.ch>
Message-ID: <1111506094.20157.37.camel@bree.local.net>

On Tue, 2005-03-22 at 16:14 +0100, Roland K?ser wrote:
>  > anaconda-10.2.0.29-1
>  > --------------------
> Does it exist a roadmap for the xen integration of anarconda? (To 
> install fedora as xen guest system)?

There are bits and pieces on the Fedora virtualization project page
(http://fedora.redhat.com/projects/virtualization), at least of what
the tasks are.  And then there's more specifics in my head.  I'll try to
put some of the stuff in my head down in words sometime this week.

Jeremy



From tibbs at math.uh.edu  Tue Mar 22 15:44:02 2005
From: tibbs at math.uh.edu (Jason L Tibbitts III)
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 09:44:02 -0600
Subject: Regression testing
In-Reply-To: <42400935.20705@www.linux.org.uk> (Mike A. Harris's message of
	"Tue, 22 Mar 2005 07:01:57 -0500")
References: 
	<20050318202510.GA1073925@hiwaay.net>
	<42400935.20705@www.linux.org.uk>
Message-ID: 

>>>>> "MAH" == Mike A Harris  writes:

MAH> The openssh tests also consume 99.9% of all CPUs even in 8way
MAH> boxes, and do this for like 16 hours straight.

Are they broken or just very thorough?  Is there a reasonable subset
that could be run in a reasonable amount of time that would still make
sure that, say, the compiler didn't miscompile some bit of code?

Having a test suite that takes two weeks to run on a box that a mere
mortal might own seems counterproductive, if the goal is to have mere
mortals running it.

 - J<



From tibbs at math.uh.edu  Tue Mar 22 15:48:58 2005
From: tibbs at math.uh.edu (Jason L Tibbitts III)
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 09:48:58 -0600
Subject: LDAP
In-Reply-To: <423FF8F8.7090009@israel-jugendtag.ch> (Roland
	=?iso-8859-1?q?K=E4ser's?= message of "Tue, 22 Mar 2005 11:52:40 +0100")
References: <423D9691.2000807@israel-jugendtag.ch>
	<35d29cfa483e65c753bb8a2285d6ea80@mac.com>
	<1111343485.18941.7.camel@tudor.e.kth.se>
	<20050320184538.GA1504326@hiwaay.net>
	<423DCD30.4050308@israel-jugendtag.ch>
	<423FF8F8.7090009@israel-jugendtag.ch>
Message-ID: 

>>>>> "RK" == Roland K?ser  writes:

RK> Hello Can we please discuss this point about an preinstalled LDAP
RK> Server on System Install for storing user account data by default?

Are you advocating the elimination of /etc/passwd and /etc/shadow
altogether, or just storing all user accounts in LDAP?  For a regular
desktop machine not integrated into a larger computing environment,
this would seem to be overkill.  For a machine that has to integrate
into a network, this is already done.

So what's left?  A standalone machine with a large number of users?

 - J<



From nphilipp at redhat.com  Tue Mar 22 15:52:51 2005
From: nphilipp at redhat.com (Nils Philippsen)
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 16:52:51 +0100
Subject: [Fwd: ufraw, was: rawhide report: 20050318 changes]
Message-ID: <1111506771.7279.21.camel@wombat.tiptoe.de>

Wrong list address, reposting.

-------- Forwarded Message --------
From: Nils Philippsen 
To: fedora.extras-list at redhat.com
Cc: tjb at unh.edu, Development discussions related to Fedora Core 
Subject: ufraw, was: rawhide report: 20050318 changes
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 16:08:54 +0100
On Mon, 2005-03-21 at 13:32 -0500, Thomas J. Baker wrote:
> On Fri, 2005-03-18 at 08:10 -0500, Build System wrote:
> 
> > Removed package ufraw
> > 
> 
> Will ufraw be moving to extras?

Good idea, if anybody would sponsor me on that I'll update the ufraw
packages from FC3 to what is current and import it into Extras CVS.

Nils
-- 
     Nils Philippsen    /    Red Hat    /    nphilipp at redhat.com
"They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary
 safety deserve neither liberty nor safety."     -- B. Franklin, 1759
 PGP fingerprint:  C4A8 9474 5C4C ADE3 2B8F  656D 47D8 9B65 6951 3011



From dcbw at redhat.com  Tue Mar 22 15:56:52 2005
From: dcbw at redhat.com (Dan Williams)
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 10:56:52 -0500
Subject: Rawhide NetworkManager
In-Reply-To: <1111505833.7279.19.camel@wombat.tiptoe.de>
References: <1111160849.32293.23.camel@dch.TQMcube.com>
	
	<1111505833.7279.19.camel@wombat.tiptoe.de>
Message-ID: <1111507012.6338.13.camel@dcbw.boston.redhat.com>

On Tue, 2005-03-22 at 16:37 +0100, Nils Philippsen wrote:
> What are the specific reasons to use an internal DHCP client instead of
> e.g. dhclient -- with the latter, I could (and did) use custom
> configuration files (to request some no standard DHCP options) as well
> as exit hooks which determined which network I plugged into and set up
> some custom things according to that information (e.g. forwarders for
> privoxy, named (with a static resolv.conf), ...).

1) Better error detection.  Since DHCP is an integral part of the
connection process, we need to determine at least 3 states: a) success,
b) failure, c) timeout.  This is necessary for wireless connections,
where there is no way to determine whether or not your WEP key is wrong,
therefore we need fairly detailed transaction outcome information.  I've
since learned that some of this functionality is exposed via OMAPI, but
I'm unsure how much.

2) dhclient-script.  This stomps all over what NetworkManager is
supposed to do and is incompatible with NetworkManager.  Anything that
interfaced with NetworkManager would have to supercede dhclient-script
and pass information to NM if it were running.

3) Full access to DHCP options.  NetworkManager provides a DBUS API for
applications to access DHCP options returned by the server.  For
example, ntpd could listen to NetworkManager events and then restart
itself with the new server address without ever having to read a config
file.  xchat could listen to events and find out the corporate IRC
server to connect to without ever needing user intervention.  There's a
wealth of information passed along in DHCP options that applications can
use.  I'm unaware of any method that "dhclient" has that could provide
this information to NetworkManager.

In the ideal world, there would be a DBUS wrapper to dhclient that
exposed what was needed.  That wrapper could communicate with dhclient
through OMAPI, but it would be better to just make dhclient DBUS-aware
in the first place to cut down on the "hordes of daemons" syndrome.  In
this manner, dhclient could publish its own DHCP options interface and
NetworkManager wouldn't need to care about it.  NM would simply become a
dbus client of dhclient.

Part of the idea here is to NOT use the "hack tower of shell scripts"
that are (1) hard to upgrade, (2) hard to cleanly augment, and (3) quite
prone to error.  ie, touching resolv.conf from 5 different places, which
presumes that resolv.conf follows the same format all the time (it does
not).

Dan




From terraformers at gmx.net  Tue Mar 22 15:59:30 2005
From: terraformers at gmx.net (Lars)
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 16:59:30 +0100
Subject: rawhide report: 20050322 changes
References: <200503221329.j2MDTNU5024771@porkchop.devel.redhat.com>
Message-ID: 

On Tue, 22 Mar 2005 08:29:23 -0500, Build System wrote:

...
> redhat-menus-3.7.1-7
> --------------------
> * Mon Mar 21 2005 Than Ngo  3.7.1-7
> - add mssing kwrite/kate/kedit, kcontrol center, System setting
>   in menu #147121, #12218, #1221811, #143937
> - get rid of capplets from preferences.menu, #149233
> - fix icon entry in desktop file #143336> 

somehow i have now most of the "places" and "desktop" menu 
entries in the main gnome menu?
maybe a show-only-in-kde is missing here?

L





From dnjinc at wowway.com  Tue Mar 22 16:02:27 2005
From: dnjinc at wowway.com (Demond James)
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 11:02:27 -0500
Subject: rawhide report: 20050322 changes
In-Reply-To: <1111505308.5050.67.camel@localhost.localdomain>
References: <200503221329.j2MDTNU5024771@porkchop.devel.redhat.com>	<4240364A.1060309@israel-jugendtag.ch>
	<1111505308.5050.67.camel@localhost.localdomain>
Message-ID: <42404193.8010104@wowway.com>

Paul wrote:

>Hi,
>
>  
>
>>>openoffice.org-1:1.9.87-1
>>>-------------------------
>>>* Sat Mar 19 2005 Caolan McNamara  1:1.9.87-1
>>>      
>>>
>
>Anyone else getting the error "unable to find suitable windowing system,
>exitting" (or something similar) when OOo is updated?
>
>TTFN
>
>Paul
>  
>
[localhost ~]$ oowriter
javaldx: Could not find a Java Runtime Environment!
no suitable windowing system found, exiting.

I've been getting this error since I install FC4test1 and there has been 
no change with the two recent updates.  Is there a bugzilla entry for this?

Demond
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From roli at israel-jugendtag.ch  Tue Mar 22 16:07:53 2005
From: roli at israel-jugendtag.ch (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Roland_K=E4ser?=)
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 17:07:53 +0100
Subject: LDAP
In-Reply-To: 
References: <423D9691.2000807@israel-jugendtag.ch>	<35d29cfa483e65c753bb8a2285d6ea80@mac.com>	<1111343485.18941.7.camel@tudor.e.kth.se>	<20050320184538.GA1504326@hiwaay.net>	<423DCD30.4050308@israel-jugendtag.ch>	<423FF8F8.7090009@israel-jugendtag.ch>
	
Message-ID: <424042D9.3080407@israel-jugendtag.ch>

Hello

 > Are you advocating the elimination of /etc/passwd and /etc/shadow
 > altogether, or just storing all user accounts in LDAP?

No, I don't wanna "switch" to LDAP. I suggesting only to have an 
installation option under "Authentification configuration" to install an 
LDAP Server instead of using /etc/passwd and /etc/shadow. Not as an 
average replacement just as an installation option such as using 
winbindd, NIS, or Kerberos in case of installing a network server to 
have these work on the ldap server done by the installation rater than 
doing it later by hand.

Roland


Jason L Tibbitts III wrote:
>>>>>>"RK" == Roland K?ser  writes:
> 
> 
> RK> Hello Can we please discuss this point about an preinstalled LDAP
> RK> Server on System Install for storing user account data by default?
> 
> Are you advocating the elimination of /etc/passwd and /etc/shadow
> altogether, or just storing all user accounts in LDAP?  For a regular
> desktop machine not integrated into a larger computing environment,
> this would seem to be overkill.  For a machine that has to integrate
> into a network, this is already done.
> 
> So what's left?  A standalone machine with a large number of users?
> 
>  - J<
> 



From rahulsundaram at yahoo.co.in  Tue Mar 22 15:13:49 2005
From: rahulsundaram at yahoo.co.in (Rahul Sundaram)
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 07:13:49 -0800 (PST)
Subject: fedora-directory-server?
In-Reply-To: 6667
Message-ID: <20050322151349.78986.qmail@web8508.mail.in.yahoo.com>

fed
--- Kyrre Ness Sjobak 
wrote:
> While reporting a bug in bugzilla, I came over a
> courious option -
> "fedora directory server". What is this? Google only
> turned up with a
> closed mailing list with closed archives - and
> something about the
> acquisition of the Netscape directory...

http://www.0xdeadbeef.com/html/2005/01/ (scroll to the
bottom)

http://www.0xdeadbeef.com/html/2005/02/

Regards
Rahul Sundaram


		
__________________________________ 
Do you Yahoo!? 
Yahoo! Small Business - Try our new resources site!
http://smallbusiness.yahoo.com/resources/ 



From paul at all-the-johnsons.co.uk  Tue Mar 22 16:17:58 2005
From: paul at all-the-johnsons.co.uk (Paul)
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 16:17:58 +0000
Subject: rawhide report: 20050322 changes
In-Reply-To: <42404193.8010104@wowway.com>
References: <200503221329.j2MDTNU5024771@porkchop.devel.redhat.com>
	<4240364A.1060309@israel-jugendtag.ch>
	<1111505308.5050.67.camel@localhost.localdomain>
	<42404193.8010104@wowway.com>
Message-ID: <1111508279.5050.69.camel@localhost.localdomain>

Hi,

> no suitable windowing system found, exiting.
> 
> I've been getting this error since I install FC4test1 and there has
> been no change with the two recent updates.  Is there a bugzilla entry
> for this?

https://bugzilla.redhat.com/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=151800

Not sure about the java error - I have a feeling it can be ignored.

TTFN

Paul
-- 
"It is often said that something cannot be libel if it is the truth.
This has had to be amended to 'something cannot be libel if it is the
truth or if the bank balance says otherwise'" - US Today
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From terraformers at gmx.net  Tue Mar 22 16:17:26 2005
From: terraformers at gmx.net (Lars)
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 17:17:26 +0100
Subject: rawhide report: 20050322 changes
References: <200503221329.j2MDTNU5024771@porkchop.devel.redhat.com>
	<4240364A.1060309@israel-jugendtag.ch>
	<1111505308.5050.67.camel@localhost.localdomain>
Message-ID: 

On Tue, 22 Mar 2005 15:28:28 +0000, Paul wrote:

> Hi,
> 
>> > openoffice.org-1:1.9.87-1
>> > -------------------------
>> > * Sat Mar 19 2005 Caolan McNamara  1:1.9.87-1
> 
> Anyone else getting the error "unable to find suitable windowing system,
> exitting" (or something similar) when OOo is updated?
>

yes, i get the same error here with this version.

cheers
L





From carwyn at carwyn.com  Tue Mar 22 16:18:45 2005
From: carwyn at carwyn.com (Carwyn Edwards)
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 16:18:45 +0000
Subject: LDAP
In-Reply-To: <424042D9.3080407@israel-jugendtag.ch>
References: <423D9691.2000807@israel-jugendtag.ch>	<35d29cfa483e65c753bb8a2285d6ea80@mac.com>	<1111343485.18941.7.camel@tudor.e.kth.se>	<20050320184538.GA1504326@hiwaay.net>	<423DCD30.4050308@israel-jugendtag.ch>	<423FF8F8.7090009@israel-jugendtag.ch>	
	<424042D9.3080407@israel-jugendtag.ch>
Message-ID: <42404565.5080004@carwyn.com>

Roland K?ser wrote:

> I suggesting only to have an installation option under 
> "Authentification configuration" to install an LDAP Server instead of 
> using /etc/passwd and /etc/shadow.


I think "instead of using /etc/passwd and /etc/shadow" is misleading. 
Many setups that use LDAP for user auth/info still use /etc/passwd for 
system level accounts.

I agree though, the whole LDAP/Kerberos server side setup is far more 
fiddly than it needs to be atm.

Carwyn



From roli at israel-jugendtag.ch  Tue Mar 22 16:34:23 2005
From: roli at israel-jugendtag.ch (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Roland_K=E4ser?=)
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 17:34:23 +0100
Subject: LDAP
In-Reply-To: <42404565.5080004@carwyn.com>
References: <423D9691.2000807@israel-jugendtag.ch>	<35d29cfa483e65c753bb8a2285d6ea80@mac.com>	<1111343485.18941.7.camel@tudor.e.kth.se>	<20050320184538.GA1504326@hiwaay.net>	<423DCD30.4050308@israel-jugendtag.ch>	<423FF8F8.7090009@israel-jugendtag.ch>		<424042D9.3080407@israel-jugendtag.ch>
	<42404565.5080004@carwyn.com>
Message-ID: <4240490F.2060201@israel-jugendtag.ch>

Hello

 > I think "instead of using /etc/passwd and /etc/shadow" is misleading.
 > Many setups that use LDAP for user auth/info still use /etc/passwd for
 > system level accounts.

May be an option to have the "system accounts" in /etc/passwd and the 
user accounts in the ldap server. But the possibility to install the 
system that way directly from anarconda whould be a big improvement. 
Indeed a package for managing the ldap server afterwards whould be a 
dependency to this concept. Maybe IMC from idealix etc.
Including a PKI (using LDAP and/or kerberos) whould give this a complete 
new glance on the security site (maybe with mail (evolution, 
thunderbird) direct integration etc.
Sorry for my a bit ebullient coming ideas but I see already primary 
target in having a M$ 2003 server replacement which even the M$ admins 
whould prefer before the 2003 server. And in the light of the Novell 
Linux and NDS (edirectory) efforts, a option to install a directory 
server becomes more and more a central role of linux.

Roland



Carwyn Edwards wrote:
> Roland K?ser wrote:
> 
>> I suggesting only to have an installation option under 
>> "Authentification configuration" to install an LDAP Server instead of 
>> using /etc/passwd and /etc/shadow.
> 
> 
> 
> I think "instead of using /etc/passwd and /etc/shadow" is misleading. 
> Many setups that use LDAP for user auth/info still use /etc/passwd for 
> system level accounts.
> 
> I agree though, the whole LDAP/Kerberos server side setup is far more 
> fiddly than it needs to be atm.
> 
> Carwyn
> 



From nicolas.mailhot at laposte.net  Tue Mar 22 16:33:45 2005
From: nicolas.mailhot at laposte.net (Nicolas Mailhot)
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 17:33:45 +0100 (CET)
Subject: LDAP
In-Reply-To: <424042D9.3080407@israel-jugendtag.ch>
References: <423D9691.2000807@israel-jugendtag.ch>	<35d29cfa483e65c753bb8a2285d6ea80@mac.com>	<1111343485.18941.7.camel@tudor.e.kth.se>	<20050320184538.GA1504326@hiwaay.net>	<423DCD30.4050308@israel-jugendtag.ch>	<423FF8F8.7090009@israel-jugendtag.ch>
	
	<424042D9.3080407@israel-jugendtag.ch>
Message-ID: <12926.192.54.193.35.1111509225.squirrel@rousalka.dyndns.org>


On Mar 22 mars 2005 17:07, Roland K?ser a ?crit :
> Hello
>
>  > Are you advocating the elimination of /etc/passwd and /etc/shadow
>  > altogether, or just storing all user accounts in LDAP?
>
> No, I don't wanna "switch" to LDAP. I suggesting only to have an
> installation option under "Authentification configuration" to install an
> LDAP Server instead of using /etc/passwd and /etc/shadow. Not as an
> average replacement just as an installation option such as using
> winbindd, NIS, or Kerberos in case of installing a network server to
> have these work on the ldap server done by the installation rater than
> doing it later by hand.

This is one of the things that can be controled via a kickstart file

-- 
Nicolas Mailhot



From roli at israel-jugendtag.ch  Tue Mar 22 16:40:53 2005
From: roli at israel-jugendtag.ch (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Roland_K=E4ser?=)
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 17:40:53 +0100
Subject: LDAP
In-Reply-To: <12926.192.54.193.35.1111509225.squirrel@rousalka.dyndns.org>
References: <423D9691.2000807@israel-jugendtag.ch>	<35d29cfa483e65c753bb8a2285d6ea80@mac.com>	<1111343485.18941.7.camel@tudor.e.kth.se>	<20050320184538.GA1504326@hiwaay.net>	<423DCD30.4050308@israel-jugendtag.ch>	<423FF8F8.7090009@israel-jugendtag.ch>		<424042D9.3080407@israel-jugendtag.ch>
	<12926.192.54.193.35.1111509225.squirrel@rousalka.dyndns.org>
Message-ID: <42404A95.50701@israel-jugendtag.ch>

 > This is one of the things that can be controled via a kickstart file

Including LDAP Server Setup with the default entries and the PAM/NSS 
configuration?

Roland


Nicolas Mailhot wrote:
> On Mar 22 mars 2005 17:07, Roland K?ser a ?crit :
> 
>>Hello
>>
>> > Are you advocating the elimination of /etc/passwd and /etc/shadow
>> > altogether, or just storing all user accounts in LDAP?
>>
>>No, I don't wanna "switch" to LDAP. I suggesting only to have an
>>installation option under "Authentification configuration" to install an
>>LDAP Server instead of using /etc/passwd and /etc/shadow. Not as an
>>average replacement just as an installation option such as using
>>winbindd, NIS, or Kerberos in case of installing a network server to
>>have these work on the ldap server done by the installation rater than
>>doing it later by hand.
> 
> 
> This is one of the things that can be controled via a kickstart file
> 



From nicolas.mailhot at laposte.net  Tue Mar 22 16:50:38 2005
From: nicolas.mailhot at laposte.net (Nicolas Mailhot)
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 17:50:38 +0100 (CET)
Subject: LDAP
In-Reply-To: <42404A95.50701@israel-jugendtag.ch>
References: <423D9691.2000807@israel-jugendtag.ch>	<35d29cfa483e65c753bb8a2285d6ea80@mac.com>	<1111343485.18941.7.camel@tudor.e.kth.se>	<20050320184538.GA1504326@hiwaay.net>	<423DCD30.4050308@israel-jugendtag.ch>	<423FF8F8.7090009@israel-jugendtag.ch>		<424042D9.3080407@israel-jugendtag.ch>
	<12926.192.54.193.35.1111509225.squirrel@rousalka.dyndns.org>
	<42404A95.50701@israel-jugendtag.ch>
Message-ID: <45971.192.54.193.35.1111510238.squirrel@rousalka.dyndns.org>


On Mar 22 mars 2005 17:40, Roland K?ser a ?crit :
>  > This is one of the things that can be controled via a kickstart file
>
> Including LDAP Server Setup with the default entries and the PAM/NSS
> configuration?

No specifying you're installing a system on an ldap-controlled network


-- 
Nicolas Mailhot



From nicolas.mailhot at laposte.net  Tue Mar 22 16:50:44 2005
From: nicolas.mailhot at laposte.net (Nicolas Mailhot)
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 17:50:44 +0100 (CET)
Subject: LDAP
In-Reply-To: <42404A95.50701@israel-jugendtag.ch>
References: <423D9691.2000807@israel-jugendtag.ch>	<35d29cfa483e65c753bb8a2285d6ea80@mac.com>	<1111343485.18941.7.camel@tudor.e.kth.se>	<20050320184538.GA1504326@hiwaay.net>	<423DCD30.4050308@israel-jugendtag.ch>	<423FF8F8.7090009@israel-jugendtag.ch>		<424042D9.3080407@israel-jugendtag.ch>
	<12926.192.54.193.35.1111509225.squirrel@rousalka.dyndns.org>
	<42404A95.50701@israel-jugendtag.ch>
Message-ID: <46094.192.54.193.35.1111510244.squirrel@rousalka.dyndns.org>


On Mar 22 mars 2005 17:40, Roland K?ser a ?crit :
>  > This is one of the things that can be controled via a kickstart file
>
> Including LDAP Server Setup with the default entries and the PAM/NSS
> configuration?

No specifying you're installing a system on an ldap-controlled network


-- 
Nicolas Mailhot



From pjones at redhat.com  Tue Mar 22 16:50:43 2005
From: pjones at redhat.com (Peter Jones)
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 11:50:43 -0500
Subject: Regression testing
In-Reply-To: 
References: 
	<20050318202510.GA1073925@hiwaay.net> <42400935.20705@www.linux.org.uk>
	
Message-ID: <1111510243.29748.33.camel@localhost.localdomain>

On Tue, 2005-03-22 at 09:44 -0600, Jason L Tibbitts III wrote:
> >>>>> "MAH" == Mike A Harris  writes:
> 
> MAH> The openssh tests also consume 99.9% of all CPUs even in 8way
> MAH> boxes, and do this for like 16 hours straight.
> 
> Are they broken or just very thorough?  Is there a reasonable subset
> that could be run in a reasonable amount of time that would still make
> sure that, say, the compiler didn't miscompile some bit of code?
> 
> Having a test suite that takes two weeks to run on a box that a mere
> mortal might own seems counterproductive, if the goal is to have mere
> mortals running it.

Well, part of this particular case is a scheduling problem -- openssh's
test suite doesn't use SMP, IIRC, but we don't schedule something else
to build when the box isn't fully utilized.

-- 
        Peter



From zaitcev at redhat.com  Tue Mar 22 17:04:40 2005
From: zaitcev at redhat.com (Pete Zaitcev)
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 09:04:40 -0800
Subject: Status of USB install support in FC4 Test1?
In-Reply-To: <6c18a4f050322013656b032ce@mail.gmail.com>
References: 
	<20050321145831.1220730c@localhost.localdomain>
	<6c18a4f050322013656b032ce@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <20050322090440.4ce396d3@localhost.localdomain>

On Tue, 22 Mar 2005 10:36:05 +0100 Bernd Bartmann  wrote:
> On Mon, 21 Mar 2005 14:58:31 -0800, Pete Zaitcev  wrote:
> > On Sun, 20 Mar 2005 21:56:36 +0100 Bernd Bartmann  wrote:
> > 
> > > what's the status in FC4 Test1 for install support to USB storage
> > > devices. []

> > Also please pardon me asking, but why would you want this? It sounds like
> > a crackpot idea to me. Do you want to have something like Fedoppix on
> > a USB flash key? I am very interested to know what is the intended
> > application of such install.

> The intended application is a completely hard disk and fan-less system
> - no rotating parts --> no mechanical problems (broken fans or hdds).
> With 4GB and even 8GB CF-Cards and a passively cooled VIA C3 CPU
> available it is easy to build such a system as a thin client or
> firewall machine.

Bernd, thank you for the explanation. You forgot to mention that your
CF card is inserted into a USB adapter, but it's documented in the bug.
This seems like an imaginative use, so perhaps we ought to support
running from those, although I would rather see a special distro for
things like these, such as the one in MDK's Small Router project.

BTW, I am afraid you may be in for a surprise, as (most) CF cards do
not have built-in write levelling and using ext3 on those might cause
a premature failure.

-- Pete



From nphilipp at redhat.com  Tue Mar 22 17:06:24 2005
From: nphilipp at redhat.com (Nils Philippsen)
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 18:06:24 +0100
Subject: Rawhide NetworkManager
In-Reply-To: <1111507012.6338.13.camel@dcbw.boston.redhat.com>
References: <1111160849.32293.23.camel@dch.TQMcube.com>
	
	<1111505833.7279.19.camel@wombat.tiptoe.de>
	<1111507012.6338.13.camel@dcbw.boston.redhat.com>
Message-ID: <1111511184.7279.36.camel@wombat.tiptoe.de>

On Tue, 2005-03-22 at 10:56 -0500, Dan Williams wrote:

> 3) Full access to DHCP options.  NetworkManager provides a DBUS API for
> applications to access DHCP options returned by the server.  For
> example, ntpd could listen to NetworkManager events and then restart
> itself with the new server address without ever having to read a config
> file.  xchat could listen to events and find out the corporate IRC
> server to connect to without ever needing user intervention.  There's a
> wealth of information passed along in DHCP options that applications can
> use.  I'm unaware of any method that "dhclient" has that could provide
> this information to NetworkManager.

Again, I currently use FC3 stuff, so I'm not sure how this applies here,
but when I last looked at it, only few information where passed to the
NMTester.py script in the examples directory. Maybe I got things wrong
(perhaps the app has to ask for DHCP specific stuff -- I'm a complete
neophyte when it comes to dbus e.a.), but I didn't see any information
related to DHCP there. Furthermore: AFAIK DHCP options get only
transmitted from the server when the client asks for them, so how would
I go about "custom" DHCP options I wanted to evaluate?

> In the ideal world, there would be a DBUS wrapper to dhclient that
> exposed what was needed.  That wrapper could communicate with dhclient
> through OMAPI, but it would be better to just make dhclient DBUS-aware
> in the first place to cut down on the "hordes of daemons" syndrome.  In
> this manner, dhclient could publish its own DHCP options interface and
> NetworkManager wouldn't need to care about it.  NM would simply become a
> dbus client of dhclient.

That'd indeed be good, it would only leave me to finally learn dbus a
bit more.

Nils
-- 
     Nils Philippsen    /    Red Hat    /    nphilipp at redhat.com
"They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary
 safety deserve neither liberty nor safety."     -- B. Franklin, 1759
 PGP fingerprint:  C4A8 9474 5C4C ADE3 2B8F  656D 47D8 9B65 6951 3011



From bernd.bartmann at gmail.com  Tue Mar 22 17:25:10 2005
From: bernd.bartmann at gmail.com (Bernd Bartmann)
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 18:25:10 +0100
Subject: Status of USB install support in FC4 Test1?
In-Reply-To: <20050322090440.4ce396d3@localhost.localdomain>
References: 
	<20050321145831.1220730c@localhost.localdomain>
	<6c18a4f050322013656b032ce@mail.gmail.com>
	<20050322090440.4ce396d3@localhost.localdomain>
Message-ID: <6c18a4f05032209255877a48f@mail.gmail.com>

On Tue, 22 Mar 2005 09:04:40 -0800, Pete Zaitcev  wrote:
> On Tue, 22 Mar 2005 10:36:05 +0100 Bernd Bartmann  wrote:
> > The intended application is a completely hard disk and fan-less system
> > - no rotating parts --> no mechanical problems (broken fans or hdds).
> > With 4GB and even 8GB CF-Cards and a passively cooled VIA C3 CPU
> > available it is easy to build such a system as a thin client or
> > firewall machine.
> 
> Bernd, thank you for the explanation. You forgot to mention that your
> CF card is inserted into a USB adapter, but it's documented in the bug.
> This seems like an imaginative use, so perhaps we ought to support
> running from those, although I would rather see a special distro for
> things like these, such as the one in MDK's Small Router project.
> 
> BTW, I am afraid you may be in for a surprise, as (most) CF cards do
> not have built-in write levelling and using ext3 on those might cause
> a premature failure.

Usage of a CF cards is just a little playground for me. Anyway it
would be good if the mkinitrd problem for usb-storage devices could be
fixed in anaconda. Other USB storage devices like external HDDs would
then be supported as well. If you don't want to enable usb storage
support in anaconda in general because of the possible boot problems
then at least it would be good to have it in expert mode.

Do you know any CF card vendor that provides this build-in write
levelling or should I use another filesystem type?

Thanks,
Bernd.



From dcbw at redhat.com  Tue Mar 22 17:42:24 2005
From: dcbw at redhat.com (Dan Williams)
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 12:42:24 -0500
Subject: Rawhide NetworkManager
In-Reply-To: <1111511184.7279.36.camel@wombat.tiptoe.de>
References: <1111160849.32293.23.camel@dch.TQMcube.com>
	
	<1111505833.7279.19.camel@wombat.tiptoe.de>
	<1111507012.6338.13.camel@dcbw.boston.redhat.com>
	<1111511184.7279.36.camel@wombat.tiptoe.de>
Message-ID: <1111513344.8928.15.camel@dcbw.boston.redhat.com>

On Tue, 2005-03-22 at 18:06 +0100, Nils Philippsen wrote:
> On Tue, 2005-03-22 at 10:56 -0500, Dan Williams wrote:
> 
> > 3) Full access to DHCP options.  NetworkManager provides a DBUS API for
> > applications to access DHCP options returned by the server.  For
> > example, ntpd could listen to NetworkManager events and then restart
> > itself with the new server address without ever having to read a config
> > file.  xchat could listen to events and find out the corporate IRC
> > server to connect to without ever needing user intervention.  There's a
> > wealth of information passed along in DHCP options that applications can
> > use.  I'm unaware of any method that "dhclient" has that could provide
> > this information to NetworkManager.
> 
> Again, I currently use FC3 stuff, so I'm not sure how this applies here,
> but when I last looked at it, only few information where passed to the
> NMTester.py script in the examples directory. Maybe I got things wrong
> (perhaps the app has to ask for DHCP specific stuff -- I'm a complete

Yes, the app must ask for the dhcp options itself.  This should be
fairly easy from Python.  In pseudo code:

object_path = "/org/freedesktop/NetworkManager/DhcpOptions"
interface = "org.freedesktop.NetworkManager.DhcpOptions"

type = dbus_call(object_path, interface, "getType", "NTP Servers")
if type == DBUS_TYPE_ARRAY
    ip_ary = dbus_call(object_path, interface, "getIntegerv", "NTP
Servers")
    ip = ip_ary[0]
else
    ip = dbus_call(object_path, interface, "getInteger", "NTP Servers")

and now "ip" contains the uint32 representation of an IP address for the
first ntp server returned by the DHCP server, if any.  Remember that the
server can return an arbitrary # of servers.

In the future, the DHCP options API from NetworkManager will always
return an array, even for options that can only have 1 item.  That
greatly simplifies bindings and code.

> neophyte when it comes to dbus e.a.), but I didn't see any information
> related to DHCP there. Furthermore: AFAIK DHCP options get only
> transmitted from the server when the client asks for them, so how would
> I go about "custom" DHCP options I wanted to evaluate?

The client can request DHCP options from the server, but the server
doesn't necessarily have to provide them.  The server is also free to
provide more options than the client asked for I believe.

Dan



From roozbeh at farsiweb.info  Tue Mar 22 17:44:40 2005
From: roozbeh at farsiweb.info (Roozbeh Pournader)
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 22:14:40 +0430
Subject: rawhide report: 20050322 changes
In-Reply-To: <200503221329.j2MDTNU5024771@porkchop.devel.redhat.com>
References: <200503221329.j2MDTNU5024771@porkchop.devel.redhat.com>
Message-ID: <1111513480.24613.2.camel@tameshk.bamdad.org>

On Tue, 2005-03-22 at 08:29 -0500, Build System wrote:
> krb5-auth-dialog-0.2-3
> ----------------------

This fails to install: 

https://bugzilla.redhat.com/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=151820

roozbeh



From tibbs at math.uh.edu  Tue Mar 22 17:55:29 2005
From: tibbs at math.uh.edu (Jason L Tibbitts III)
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 11:55:29 -0600
Subject: LDAP
In-Reply-To: <42404565.5080004@carwyn.com> (Carwyn Edwards's message of
	"Tue, 22 Mar 2005 16:18:45 +0000")
References: <423D9691.2000807@israel-jugendtag.ch>
	<35d29cfa483e65c753bb8a2285d6ea80@mac.com>
	<1111343485.18941.7.camel@tudor.e.kth.se>
	<20050320184538.GA1504326@hiwaay.net>
	<423DCD30.4050308@israel-jugendtag.ch>
	<423FF8F8.7090009@israel-jugendtag.ch>
	
	<424042D9.3080407@israel-jugendtag.ch> <42404565.5080004@carwyn.com>
Message-ID: 

>>>>> "CE" == Carwyn Edwards  writes:

CE> I agree though, the whole LDAP/Kerberos server side setup is far
CE> more fiddly than it needs to be atm.

And yet, having been through this myself, I can't see a general way to
make it much easier.  Maybe some automated setup could work for one
specific case (self-signed certificates, kerberos server and LDAP
server on same machine, kerberos realm same as domain name, no
replication, and a host of other simplifying assumptions).

Actually I found that Fedora was rather well prepared for this kind of
thing.  I didn't have to edit /etc/init.d scripts, which is a big
plus.  The only thing I really missed was more automatic support for
Kerberos database propagation.  LDAP was very clean, with slurpd
starting automatically after specifying a replogfile in slapd.conf.

It's going to be a complex system no matter how much automation anyone
does.  What's really needed is better documentation of how the pieces
are supposed to fit together.

 - J<



From Peter.Dedecker at vtk2.UGent.be  Tue Mar 22 17:56:38 2005
From: Peter.Dedecker at vtk2.UGent.be (Peter Dedecker)
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 17:56:38 +0000
Subject: Stateless linux
In-Reply-To: <423FC541.4030106@hclcomnet.co.in>
References: <423FC541.4030106@hclcomnet.co.in>
Message-ID: <42405C56.8060507@VTK.UGent.be>

Gaurav wrote:
>        I am interested in stateless Linux project  and would like to 
> volunteer  for its beta tester ... I will try roll this out in my 
> brother's school and after that  co workers on my office plus also would 
> like to contribute to its development ....help it to take to next level :-)

Nice

> I would like to know what state this project is in ? is anybody involved 
> in active testing/ testing development ? Do you need beta tester ...

It isn't in active development right now.  At Red Hat, they don't even 
know if they'll continue it.  But if they continue it, there'll be a 
team working on it.

> all like minded (stateless  people ;-) ) pl let me know if interested

You can see my experiences at 
http://blog.eikke.com/index.php/fedorastateless

Good luck!

-- 
Peter Dedecker                      Peter.Dedecker at VTK.UGent.be
Studentenvertegenwoordiger          VTK Computerpraeses
Isabellakaai 124 - 9000 Gent        GSM: 0486/15.23.20
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From caolanm at redhat.com  Tue Mar 22 18:54:21 2005
From: caolanm at redhat.com (Caolan McNamara)
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 18:54:21 +0000
Subject: rawhide report: 20050322 changes
In-Reply-To: <1111508279.5050.69.camel@localhost.localdomain>
References: <200503221329.j2MDTNU5024771@porkchop.devel.redhat.com>
	<4240364A.1060309@israel-jugendtag.ch>
	<1111505308.5050.67.camel@localhost.localdomain>
	<42404193.8010104@wowway.com>
	<1111508279.5050.69.camel@localhost.localdomain>
Message-ID: <1111517661.9595.0.camel@sheol.homelinux.org>

On Tue, 2005-03-22 at 16:17 +0000, Paul wrote:
> Hi,
> 
> > no suitable windowing system found, exiting.
> > 
> > I've been getting this error since I install FC4test1 and there has
> > been no change with the two recent updates.  Is there a bugzilla entry
> > for this?
> 
> https://bugzilla.redhat.com/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=151800
> 
> Not sure about the java error - I have a feeling it can be ignored.

Yeah, ignore the java error. Extra requires on libgcj should remove that
relatively spurious warning methinks. I'm respinning 1.9.87-2 which will
probably do away with the crash.

C.



From jskohli at gmail.com  Tue Mar 22 18:51:17 2005
From: jskohli at gmail.com (Jaswinder Singh Kohli)
Date: Wed, 23 Mar 2005 00:21:17 +0530
Subject: usb_storage
In-Reply-To: <1111490937.5050.25.camel@localhost.localdomain>
References: 
	<20050316132536.2c968d17@localhost.localdomain>
	
	<20050319190341.1331a0f4@localhost.localdomain>
	<1111315091.9137.86.camel@localhost.localdomain>
	<1111490082.3328.60.camel@localhost.localdomain>
	<1111490937.5050.25.camel@localhost.localdomain>
Message-ID: <27ecd44905032210513a962443@mail.gmail.com>

Hi,

I am sorry to diverge a little from the main topic, since we are
talking about USB
Devices storage that is,  is there a way in determining all the
devices hooked using
 usb-storage driver in the system, and knowing there created respective devices.

for example, if i connect usb key, udev creates a entry in /dev.
the respective entry is created in fstab, and a directory is created
in /media folder.

How to find out, what all such devices are connected, so as i can
mount is programmatically and use is for backup or otherwise....

Thanks... and sorry for being offtopic


On Tue, 22 Mar 2005 11:28:57 +0000, Paul  wrote:
> Hi,
> 
> > > Latest rawhide kernel, latest HAL, latest everything. My internal USB
> > > card reader is not reading cards despite being happily recognised by
> > > HAL.
> >
> > That reminds me of something. When i use my 5in1 usb cardreader
> > (external), i have to unplug/plug it after i have inserted a new card
> > before it would read it. Somebody told me it was some kind of kernel
> > bug... Could you try that - and maybe open a bugzilla ticket?
> 
> I'm not seeing that on my laptop currently, only the one I've described
> for the internal one.
> 
> (from dmesg)
> usb 3-2: device not accepting address 4, error -110
> usb 3-2: new full speed USB device using ohci_hcd and address 5
> cdrom: open failed.
> usb 3-2: device descriptor read/64, error -110
> cdrom: open failed.
> usb 3-2: device descriptor read/64, error -110
> usb 3-2: new full speed USB device using ohci_hcd and address 6
> usb 3-2: device descriptor read/64, error -110
> usb 3-2: device descriptor read/64, error -110
> usb 3-3: new full speed USB device using ohci_hcd and address 7
> 
> What is error -110?
> 
> TTFN
> 
> Paul
> --
> "It is often said that something cannot be libel if it is the truth.
> This has had to be amended to 'something cannot be libel if it is the
> truth or if the bank balance says otherwise'" - US Today
> 
> 
> --
> fedora-devel-list mailing list
> fedora-devel-list at redhat.com
> http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-list
> 
> 
> 


-- 
Regards
JSK
jskohli (AT) gmail (DOT) com



From skvidal at phy.duke.edu  Tue Mar 22 19:02:32 2005
From: skvidal at phy.duke.edu (seth vidal)
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 14:02:32 -0500
Subject: Q on yum cleanup
In-Reply-To: <20050322145806.GL15993@viasys.com>
References: <1111152164.8014.97.camel@localhost.localdomain>
	<1111152347.30200.45.camel@cutter>
	<1111152498.8014.105.camel@localhost.localdomain>
	<1111152998.30200.48.camel@cutter>
	<20050318144356.073e3b11@nausicaa.camperquake.de>
	<20050322145806.GL15993@viasys.com>
Message-ID: <1111518152.19235.39.camel@cutter>


> PS: "yum --force install" would be nice for other reasons, too. For example
> "yum --force install gkrellm" when I have custom compiled kernel, and it
> complains about too old kernel. Please don't flame, a simple "no" will do
> :). I understand this is considered too dirty...
> 

no.

-sv




From Nicolas.Mailhot at laPoste.net  Tue Mar 22 19:21:17 2005
From: Nicolas.Mailhot at laPoste.net (Nicolas Mailhot)
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 20:21:17 +0100
Subject: Q on yum cleanup
In-Reply-To: <1111518152.19235.39.camel@cutter>
References: <1111152164.8014.97.camel@localhost.localdomain>
	<1111152347.30200.45.camel@cutter>
	<1111152498.8014.105.camel@localhost.localdomain>
	<1111152998.30200.48.camel@cutter>
	<20050318144356.073e3b11@nausicaa.camperquake.de>
	<20050322145806.GL15993@viasys.com> <1111518152.19235.39.camel@cutter>
Message-ID: <1111519277.21406.8.camel@rousalka.dyndns.org>

Le mardi 22 mars 2005 ? 14:02 -0500, seth vidal a ?crit :
> > PS: "yum --force install" would be nice for other reasons, too. For example
> > "yum --force install gkrellm" when I have custom compiled kernel, and it
> > complains about too old kernel. Please don't flame, a simple "no" will do
> > :). I understand this is considered too dirty...
> > 
> 
> no.

OTOH a shorthand for --exclude would be welcome.
Sometimes on rawhide you end up with several lines of this stuff just to
get around a bad build state.

Or if you don't like this, at least modify exclude to accept a list of
packages.

Regards,

-- 
Nicolas Mailhot
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From fedora-devel at camperquake.de  Tue Mar 22 19:33:57 2005
From: fedora-devel at camperquake.de (Ralf Ertzinger)
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 20:33:57 +0100
Subject: Rawhide NetworkManager
In-Reply-To: <1111504525.6338.2.camel@dcbw.boston.redhat.com>
References: <1111160849.32293.23.camel@dch.TQMcube.com>
	
	<423FBFB7.6010400@feuerpokemon.de>
	<1111504525.6338.2.camel@dcbw.boston.redhat.com>
Message-ID: <20050322203357.065d8266@nausicaa.camperquake.de>

Hi.

Dan Williams  wrote:

> Ok, next question is:
> 
> 1) How do you know which profile is begin used at any given time?

Like this:

#!/usr/bin/python

import sys

if not "/usr/share/system-config-network" in sys.path:
    sys.path.append("/usr/share/system-config-network")

if not "/usr/share/system-config-network/netconfpkg/" in sys.path:
    sys.path.append("/usr/share/system-config-network/netconfpkg")

from netconfpkg import *

print getProfileList().getActiveProfile().ProfileName;


-- 
Transported to a surreal landscape, a young girl kills the first woman
she meets and then teams up with three complete stangers to kill again.
  -- TV listing for the movie, The Wizard of Oz, in the Marin Paper.



From jspaleta at gmail.com  Tue Mar 22 19:35:34 2005
From: jspaleta at gmail.com (Jeff Spaleta)
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 14:35:34 -0500
Subject: Q on yum cleanup
In-Reply-To: <1111519277.21406.8.camel@rousalka.dyndns.org>
References: <1111152164.8014.97.camel@localhost.localdomain>
	<1111152347.30200.45.camel@cutter>
	<1111152498.8014.105.camel@localhost.localdomain>
	<1111152998.30200.48.camel@cutter>
	<20050318144356.073e3b11@nausicaa.camperquake.de>
	<20050322145806.GL15993@viasys.com> <1111518152.19235.39.camel@cutter>
	<1111519277.21406.8.camel@rousalka.dyndns.org>
Message-ID: <604aa79105032211351bfedaab@mail.gmail.com>

On Tue, 22 Mar 2005 20:21:17 +0100, Nicolas Mailhot
 wrote:
> OTOH a shorthand for --exclude would be welcome.
> Sometimes on rawhide you end up with several lines of this stuff just to
> get around a bad build state.

I think designing features specifically meant to make it easy to
workaround typical rawhide breakage.. is probably not a good way to go
about picking features to expose to users out of the metaphysical
feature multiverse... even in a cli interface.

Would it be better to move away from the --exclude list concept
completely, and have yum report back to you a list of packages that
can not be updated and give you a chance to exclude the whole list
interactively and proceed with the rest of the updates?

yum update
...yum thinks a bit...
dude there are like 17 out of 34 packages i can't actually update
because of unresolvable deps. Heres the list:
....yum lists packages that can not be updated....
Would you like me to exclude this set of packages and attempt to
update the rest?
 uhm... sure.
...yum thinks a bit...
Here are the list of 17 package updates for you to review would
you like to proceed?
yes
...yum continues as usual...

-jef



From sig at netdot.net  Tue Mar 22 19:44:09 2005
From: sig at netdot.net (Aaron VanDevender)
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 13:44:09 -0600
Subject: Self-Introduction: Aaron VanDevender
Message-ID: <1111520650.6034.26.camel@vandvndr.physics.uiuc.edu>

1. Aaron Pace VanDevender
2. Aaron Pace VanDevender
3. Ph. D. candidate in physics
4. University of Illinois at Urbana-Champaign
5. I would like to see a complete multimedia stack in Fedora Extras
6. contributor to Red Hat/Fedora
   contributor to guile
   scheme, C/C++, perl.
7.
pub  1024D/05BB7DFF 1999-10-15 Aaron Pace VanDevender 
     Key fingerprint = ECAA 4CBF D369 7495 D0E8  7DBD 4CEB A89B 05BB 7DFF
sub  2048g/DE22F95E 1999-10-15


-- 

sig at netdot.net
Plead the First.



From vherva at viasys.com  Tue Mar 22 19:46:27 2005
From: vherva at viasys.com (Ville Herva)
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 21:46:27 +0200
Subject: Q on yum cleanup
In-Reply-To: <20050322145806.GL15993@viasys.com>
References: <1111152164.8014.97.camel@localhost.localdomain>
	<1111152347.30200.45.camel@cutter>
	<1111152498.8014.105.camel@localhost.localdomain>
	<1111152998.30200.48.camel@cutter>
	<20050318144356.073e3b11@nausicaa.camperquake.de>
	<20050322145806.GL15993@viasys.com>
Message-ID: <20050322194627.GM15993@viasys.com>

On Tue, Mar 22, 2005 at 04:58:06PM +0200, you [Ville Herva] wrote:
> On Fri, Mar 18, 2005 at 02:43:56PM +0100, you [Ralf Ertzinger] wrote:
> > Hi.
> > 
> > seth vidal  wrote:
> > 
> > > and look for duplicates, remove the older packages with:
> > > yum remove package-ver-rel.arch
> > 
> > Whenever such things happen, I use this to find duplicates:
> > 
> > rpm -aq --queryformat "%{NAME}\n" | sort | uniq -c | grep -v -E " *1 "
> 
> Hmm, I found a few.
> 
> Recently, "yum update" has often halted in the middle of updating, usually
> in the clean up phase. According to strace, it waits for a futex (sorry, I
> didn't save the strace log, will do if it happens again). I've had to kill
> -KILL it, HUP nor TERM are not enough. After this, it apparently leaves the
> other package version in place, for example:

FWIW, it hung again, this time "rpm -e", not yum. 

--8<-----------------------------------------------------------------------
>strace -p 3717
Process 3717 attached - interrupt to quit
futex(0x808c938, FUTEX_WAIT, 1, NULL 
Process 3717 detached
>lsof -p 3717
COMMAND  PID USER   FD   TYPE DEVICE     SIZE    NODE NAME
rpm     3717 root  cwd    DIR    3,4     2864       2 /scratch
rpm     3717 root  rtd    DIR    3,2     4096       2 /
rpm     3717 root  txt    REG    3,2    81056 1261578 /bin/rpm
rpm     3717 root  mem    REG    3,2   126612 1130601 /lib/ld-2.3.4.so
rpm     3717 root  mem    REG    3,2  1465764 1196043 /lib/tls/libc-2.3.4.so
rpm     3717 root  mem    REG    3,2   189312 1196044 /lib/tls/libm-2.3.4.so
rpm     3717 root  mem    REG    3,2    16292 1133037 /lib/libdl-2.3.4.so
rpm     3717 root  mem    REG    3,2    69012  218351 /usr/lib/libelf-0.101.so
rpm     3717 root  mem    REG    3,2   107576  220160 /usr/lib/libneon.so.24.0.7
rpm     3717 root  mem    REG    3,2    70540  214506 /usr/lib/libz.so.1.2.2.2
rpm     3717 root  mem    REG    3,2   101952 1196045 /lib/tls/libpthread-2.3.4.so
rpm     3717 root  mem    REG    3,2   317652  220095 /usr/lib/libsqlite3.so.0.8.6
rpm     3717 root  mem    REG    3,2   125160  218470 /usr/lib/libexpat.so.0.5.0
rpm     3717 root  mem    REG    3,2   288436  213949 /usr/lib/libbeecrypt.so.6.4.0
rpm     3717 root  mem    REG    3,2    76336 1133039 /lib/libresolv-2.3.4.so
rpm     3717 root  mem    REG    3,2    49344 1196037 /lib/tls/librt-2.3.4.so
rpm     3717 root  mem    REG    3,2    60556 1133045 /lib/libselinux.so.1
rpm     3717 root  mem    REG    3,2     7072 1133040 /lib/libcom_err.so.2.1
rpm     3717 root  mem    REG    3,2     9576  214427 /usr/lib/libkrb5support.so.0.0
rpm     3717 root  mem    REG    3,2   140712  220166 /usr/lib/libk5crypto.so.3.0
rpm     3717 root  mem    REG    3,2   427096  220168 /usr/lib/libkrb5.so.3.2
rpm     3717 root  mem    REG    3,2    88944  220170 /usr/lib/libgssapi_krb5.so.2.2
rpm     3717 root  mem    REG    3,2   965996 1133041 /lib/libcrypto.so.0.9.7e
rpm     3717 root  mem    REG    3,2   213544 1133042 /lib/libssl.so.0.9.7e
rpm     3717 root  mem    REG    3,2    67628  218346 /usr/lib/libbz2.so.1.0.2
rpm     3717 root  mem    REG    3,2   450560 1081480 /var/lib/rpm/__db.003
rpm     3717 root  mem    REG    3,2  1318912 1081370 /var/lib/rpm/__db.002
rpm     3717 root  mem    REG    3,2    38628 1130610 /lib/libgcc_s-4.0.0-20050321.so.1
rpm     3717 root  mem    REG    3,2   829532  219850 /usr/lib/libstdc++.so.6.0.4
rpm     3717 root  mem    REG    3,2    27300  213344 /usr/lib/libpopt.so.0.0.0
rpm     3717 root  mem    REG    3,2   434472  220734 /usr/lib/librpmio-4.4.so
rpm     3717 root  mem    REG    3,2  1017672  220727 /usr/lib/librpmdb-4.4.so
rpm     3717 root  mem    REG    3,2   352672  220177 /usr/lib/librpm-4.4.so
rpm     3717 root  mem    REG    3,2    24576 1081369 /var/lib/rpm/__db.001
rpm     3717 root    0u   CHR  136,1                3 /dev/pts/1
rpm     3717 root    1u   CHR  136,1                3 /dev/pts/1
rpm     3717 root    2u   CHR  136,1                3 /dev/pts/1
rpm     3717 root    3u   REG    3,2 41730048 1082675 /var/lib/rpm/Packages
rpm     3717 root    4u   REG    3,2 10416128 1082677 /var/lib/rpm/Basenames
rpm     3717 root    5u   REG    3,2    45056 1082676 /var/lib/rpm/Name
rpm     3717 root    6u   REG    3,2    12288 1082690 /var/lib/rpm/Pubkeys
rpm     3717 root    7uW  REG    3,2        0 1082155 /var/lib/rpm/__db.000
rpm     3717 root    8u   REG    3,2    12288 1082688 /var/lib/rpm/Triggername
rpm     3717 root    9u   CHR  136,1                3 /dev/pts/1
--8<-----------------------------------------------------------------------

After "kill -KILL 3717" and "rm /var/lib/rpm/__db.00*" rpm -e worked.

I've already done "rm /var/lib/rpm/__db.00*" quite a few times and "rpm
--rebuild db" a few times. The hang appears to happen pretty randomly. Any
ideas?


-- v -- 

v at iki.fi



From skvidal at phy.duke.edu  Tue Mar 22 19:47:26 2005
From: skvidal at phy.duke.edu (seth vidal)
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 14:47:26 -0500
Subject: Self-Introduction: Aaron VanDevender
In-Reply-To: <1111520650.6034.26.camel@vandvndr.physics.uiuc.edu>
References: <1111520650.6034.26.camel@vandvndr.physics.uiuc.edu>
Message-ID: <1111520846.19235.54.camel@cutter>

> 5. I would like to see a complete multimedia stack in Fedora Extras
what does that mean?

-sv




From Nicolas.Mailhot at laPoste.net  Tue Mar 22 19:51:55 2005
From: Nicolas.Mailhot at laPoste.net (Nicolas Mailhot)
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 20:51:55 +0100
Subject: Q on yum cleanup
In-Reply-To: <604aa79105032211351bfedaab@mail.gmail.com>
References: <1111152164.8014.97.camel@localhost.localdomain>
	<1111152347.30200.45.camel@cutter>
	<1111152498.8014.105.camel@localhost.localdomain>
	<1111152998.30200.48.camel@cutter>
	<20050318144356.073e3b11@nausicaa.camperquake.de>
	<20050322145806.GL15993@viasys.com> <1111518152.19235.39.camel@cutter>
	<1111519277.21406.8.camel@rousalka.dyndns.org>
	<604aa79105032211351bfedaab@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <1111521116.21406.20.camel@rousalka.dyndns.org>

Le mardi 22 mars 2005 ? 14:35 -0500, Jeff Spaleta a ?crit :
> On Tue, 22 Mar 2005 20:21:17 +0100, Nicolas Mailhot
>  wrote:
> > OTOH a shorthand for --exclude would be welcome.
> > Sometimes on rawhide you end up with several lines of this stuff just to
> > get around a bad build state.
> 
> I think designing features specifically meant to make it easy to
> workaround typical rawhide breakage.. is probably not a good way to go
> about picking features to expose to users out of the metaphysical
> feature multiverse... even in a cli interface.
> 
> Would it be better to move away from the --exclude list concept
> completely, and have yum report back to you a list of packages that
> can not be updated and give you a chance to exclude the whole list
> interactively and proceed with the rest of the updates?
> 
> yum update
> ...yum thinks a bit...
> dude there are like 17 out of 34 packages i can't actually update
> because of unresolvable deps. Heres the list:
> ....yum lists packages that can not be updated....
> Would you like me to exclude this set of packages and attempt to
> update the rest?
>  uhm... sure.
> ...yum thinks a bit...
> Here are the list of 17 package updates for you to review would
> you like to proceed?
> yes
> ...yum continues as usual...

This would do as well.

I know Seth just hates Rawhide, multiple conflicting repositories and
all the real-world stuff that makes his baby so much more convoluted
than what he wanted to do at first. So my cunning plan is to nudge him
in the direction I wanted yum to take from day one, hoping he's been
exposed to Fedora Devel long enough it no longer rubs him too much in
the wrong places.

Your proposal OTOH might be a little too obvious to be accepted at this
stage;)

Regards,

-- 
Nicolas Mailhot
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From cmadams at hiwaay.net  Tue Mar 22 19:52:19 2005
From: cmadams at hiwaay.net (Chris Adams)
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 13:52:19 -0600
Subject: Regression testing
In-Reply-To: 
References: 
	<20050318202510.GA1073925@hiwaay.net>
	<42400935.20705@www.linux.org.uk>
	
Message-ID: <20050322195219.GA1327758@hiwaay.net>

Once upon a time, Jason L Tibbitts III  said:
> >>>>> "MAH" == Mike A Harris  writes:
> MAH> The openssh tests also consume 99.9% of all CPUs even in 8way
> MAH> boxes, and do this for like 16 hours straight.
> 
> Are they broken or just very thorough?  Is there a reasonable subset
> that could be run in a reasonable amount of time that would still make
> sure that, say, the compiler didn't miscompile some bit of code?

I would say something was broken.  I have run the OpenSSH tests on a
single 620MHz Alpha (that was otherwise idle) in about 5 minutes.  The
only way I can see an 8 CPU system taking 16 hours would be if it was 8
8088s.

-- 
Chris Adams 
Systems and Network Administrator - HiWAAY Internet Services
I don't speak for anybody but myself - that's enough trouble.



From a.kurtz at hardsun.net  Tue Mar 22 19:58:22 2005
From: a.kurtz at hardsun.net (Aaron Kurtz)
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 11:58:22 -0800
Subject: Q on yum cleanup
In-Reply-To: <604aa79105032211351bfedaab@mail.gmail.com>
References: <1111152164.8014.97.camel@localhost.localdomain>
	<1111152347.30200.45.camel@cutter>
	<1111152498.8014.105.camel@localhost.localdomain>
	<1111152998.30200.48.camel@cutter>
	<20050318144356.073e3b11@nausicaa.camperquake.de>
	<20050322145806.GL15993@viasys.com> <1111518152.19235.39.camel@cutter>
	<1111519277.21406.8.camel@rousalka.dyndns.org>
	<604aa79105032211351bfedaab@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <1111521502.28156.30.camel@rydia.hardsun.net>

On Tue, 2005-03-22 at 14:35 -0500, Jeff Spaleta wrote:

> I think designing features specifically meant to make it easy to
> workaround typical rawhide breakage.. is probably not a good way to go
> about picking features to expose to users out of the metaphysical
> feature multiverse... even in a cli interface.
> 
> Would it be better to move away from the --exclude list concept
> completely, and have yum report back to you a list of packages that
> can not be updated and give you a chance to exclude the whole list
> interactively and proceed with the rest of the updates?

yum shell.
That said, I'm not quite sure how to use it, but Seth Vidal has an
example that does just that somewhere.
-- 
Aaron Kurtz        GPG Key ID: ED588CF2



From zaitcev at redhat.com  Tue Mar 22 20:10:01 2005
From: zaitcev at redhat.com (Pete Zaitcev)
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 12:10:01 -0800
Subject: usb_storage
In-Reply-To: 
References: 
	<20050316132536.2c968d17@localhost.localdomain>
	
	<20050319190341.1331a0f4@localhost.localdomain>
	<1111315091.9137.86.camel@localhost.localdomain>
	<1111490082.3328.60.camel@localhost.localdomain>
	
Message-ID: <20050322121001.55bf3772@localhost.localdomain>

On Tue, 22 Mar 2005 11:28:57 +0000 Paul  wrote:

> (from dmesg)
> usb 3-2: device not accepting address 4, error -110
> usb 3-2: new full speed USB device using ohci_hcd and address 5
> cdrom: open failed.
> usb 3-2: device descriptor read/64, error -110
> cdrom: open failed.

Looks like Peter lost his bet. :-)

> What is error -110?

It is a high level timeout. The device accepted the control transfer,
but did not send a reply over some significant amount of time (a few
seconds). This means that the lower level sequencer in the device
continues to operate.

In Peter's case, -71 means that the device is dead like a brick.
Usually it happens when it's completely crashed or is executing
an internal cold reset after a crash.

The difference is rather academic at this point. The important thing
to understand is that there is no single root case for these failures.
Some folks say, "let's introduce an exclusion, never send control transfer
together with bulk transfer and it will be all right". Bzzzzt, false.
It will help some devices, no doubt, but not all (it also breaks
those devices which REQUIRE several transfers at once). Other people
try adding delays into random places in the enumeration sequence. I tried
refactoring enumeration (helps a lot for my USB flash keys, does not
help my iPod).

The answer is to deploy a variety of measures with strict regression
testing (which means SLOW and GRADUAL deployment): caching of descriptor
strings by kernel so "cat /proc/bus/usb/devices" does not hit devices,
less aggressive polling by HAL and switchover to non-polled, event
driven modes in HAL, refactoring and correct delays of enumeration.

All the while this goes on, developers need bug reports, but they do not
need things like "Any signs of usb_storage being fixed?"

Bug reports MUST include:
 - dmesg or other applicable logs (terminal captures) and use scenarios.
 - /proc/bus/usb/devices
 - last kernel release working (if any)
 - kernel release not working
 - HAL & hotplug releases

Bug reports must never include words "latest" and "current". If I see
them, I ignore the report (Why? Because it takes hot iron to extract
info and then users just feel wronged anyway, so why bother). You can
use word "rawhide", but it's redundant. Include actual output of
uname -a, rpm -q, or cat /proc/version.

Best wishes,
-- Pete



From paul at all-the-johnsons.co.uk  Tue Mar 22 20:20:11 2005
From: paul at all-the-johnsons.co.uk (Paul)
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 20:20:11 +0000
Subject: DVD burning goosed?
Message-ID: <1111522811.5050.82.camel@localhost.localdomain>

Hi,

Using kernel 2.6.11-1.1185_FC4, k3b-0.11.17-2, mkisofs-2.01.1-8.

I'm trying to burn to my NEC 3500a dual layer DVD burner and it
permanently crashes out at 9% of the burn. The burner is physically
sound (burns CDs fine, reads DVDs fine, burns about 9% of the disc
fine ;-p) and I'm using brand new Bulkpaq 4x DVD-R discs (which I've
used plenty of times before now).

At 9%, the burn dies - irrespective of if I'm using nautilus-burner or
k3b with the following error

System
-----------------------
K3b Version:0.11.17 
KDE Version: 3.4.0-1 Red Hat
QT Version: 3.3.4

growisofs
-----------------------
Warning: creating filesystem that does not conform to ISO-9660.
INFO: UTF-8 character encoding detected by locale settings.
 Assuming UTF-8 encoded filenames on source filesystem,
 use -input-charset to override.
/dev/hdf: engaging DVD-R DAO upon user request...
/dev/hdf: reserving 1999424 blocks
/dev/hdf: "Current Write Speed" is 4.1x1385KBps.
  0.03% done, estimate finish Thu Mar 24 18:17:48 2005
 
  8.00% done, estimate finish Tue Mar 22 21:20:04 2005
  8.03% done, estimate finish Tue Mar 22 21:20:03 2005
:-( unable to WRITE at LBA=272d0h: Input/output error
:-( write failed: Input/output error
/dev/hdf: flushing cache
:-( unable to FLUSH CACHE: Input/output error
:-[ SYNCHRONOUS FLUSH CACHE failed with SK=2h/ASC=04h/ACQ=01h]: Resource
temporarily unavailable

growisofs comand:
-----------------------
/usr/bin/growisofs -Z /dev/hdf -use-the-force-luke=notray
-use-the-force-luke=tty -use-the-force-luke=dao -dvd-compat -speed=6
-overburn -gui -graft-points -volid Features -volset  -appid K3B THE CD
KREATOR VERSION 0.11.12 (C) 2003 SEBASTIAN TRUEG AND THE K3B TEAM
-publisher  -preparer K3b - Version 0.11.12 -sysid LINUX -volset-size 1
-volset-seqno 1 -sort /tmp/kde-paul/k3b36KXbc.tmp -rational-rock
-hide-list /tmp/kde-paul/k3b1tUicb.tmp -udf -untranslated-filenames
-iso-level 2 -path-list /tmp/kde-paul/k3bjPtb1b.tmp 

Is this likely to be a burner fault or is DVD burning currently a bit
broken? I've not tried this using another kernel - it's been a while
since I did any burning.

TTFN

Paul
-- 
"It is often said that something cannot be libel if it is the truth.
This has had to be amended to 'something cannot be libel if it is the
truth or if the bank balance says otherwise'" - US Today
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From paul at all-the-johnsons.co.uk  Tue Mar 22 20:23:40 2005
From: paul at all-the-johnsons.co.uk (Paul)
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 20:23:40 +0000
Subject: usb_storage
In-Reply-To: <20050322121001.55bf3772@localhost.localdomain>
References: 
	<20050316132536.2c968d17@localhost.localdomain>
	
	<20050319190341.1331a0f4@localhost.localdomain>
	<1111315091.9137.86.camel@localhost.localdomain>
	<1111490082.3328.60.camel@localhost.localdomain>
	
	<20050322121001.55bf3772@localhost.localdomain>
Message-ID: <1111523021.5050.87.camel@localhost.localdomain>

Hi,

> > (from dmesg)
> > usb 3-2: device not accepting address 4, error -110
> > usb 3-2: new full speed USB device using ohci_hcd and address 5
> > cdrom: open failed.
> > usb 3-2: device descriptor read/64, error -110
> > cdrom: open failed.
> 
> Looks like Peter lost his bet. :-)

Yay! I hereby claim my unused Windows licences for sticking over noisy
bullfrog's mouths! ;-p

> > What is error -110?
> 
> It is a high level timeout. The device accepted the control transfer,
> but did not send a reply over some significant amount of time (a few
> seconds). This means that the lower level sequencer in the device
> continues to operate.

Thanks. I thought it may have been something like that having seen it on
something else.

> The answer is to deploy a variety of measures with strict regression
> testing (which means SLOW and GRADUAL deployment): caching of descriptor
> strings by kernel so "cat /proc/bus/usb/devices" does not hit devices,
> less aggressive polling by HAL and switchover to non-polled, event
> driven modes in HAL, refactoring and correct delays of enumeration.

Is that going to happen before FC4 hits paydirt?

> All the while this goes on, developers need bug reports, but they do not
> need things like "Any signs of usb_storage being fixed?"

Yeah. Really sorry about that - I was very drunk when I posted that.

> Bug reports must never include words "latest" and "current". If I see
> them, I ignore the report (Why? Because it takes hot iron to extract
> info and then users just feel wronged anyway, so why bother). 

Some of us like the hot poker treatment!!!!

> You can
> use word "rawhide", but it's redundant. Include actual output of
> uname -a, rpm -q, or cat /proc/version.

Do you want me to file this problem into bugzilla and if so, what
component does it need filing under?

TTFN

Paul
-- 
"It is often said that something cannot be libel if it is the truth.
This has had to be amended to 'something cannot be libel if it is the
truth or if the bank balance says otherwise'" - US Today
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From dcbw at redhat.com  Tue Mar 22 20:38:49 2005
From: dcbw at redhat.com (Dan Williams)
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 15:38:49 -0500
Subject: Rawhide NetworkManager
In-Reply-To: <20050322203357.065d8266@nausicaa.camperquake.de>
References: <1111160849.32293.23.camel@dch.TQMcube.com>
	
	<423FBFB7.6010400@feuerpokemon.de>
	<1111504525.6338.2.camel@dcbw.boston.redhat.com>
	<20050322203357.065d8266@nausicaa.camperquake.de>
Message-ID: <1111523929.8928.20.camel@dcbw.boston.redhat.com>

On Tue, 2005-03-22 at 20:33 +0100, Ralf Ertzinger wrote:
> Hi.
> 
> Dan Williams  wrote:
> 
> > Ok, next question is:
> > 
> > 1) How do you know which profile is begin used at any given time?
> 
> Like this:
> 
> #!/usr/bin/python
> 
> import sys
> 
> if not "/usr/share/system-config-network" in sys.path:
>     sys.path.append("/usr/share/system-config-network")
> 
> if not "/usr/share/system-config-network/netconfpkg/" in sys.path:
>     sys.path.append("/usr/share/system-config-network/netconfpkg")
> 
> from netconfpkg import *
> 
> print getProfileList().getActiveProfile().ProfileName;
> 

Need some way to do it from C, preferably without 'popen("profile-
check.py")' :)

Dan



From zaitcev at redhat.com  Tue Mar 22 20:46:06 2005
From: zaitcev at redhat.com (Pete Zaitcev)
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 12:46:06 -0800
Subject: usb_storage
In-Reply-To: <1111523021.5050.87.camel@localhost.localdomain>
References: 
	<20050316132536.2c968d17@localhost.localdomain>
	
	<20050319190341.1331a0f4@localhost.localdomain>
	<1111315091.9137.86.camel@localhost.localdomain>
	<1111490082.3328.60.camel@localhost.localdomain>
	
	<20050322121001.55bf3772@localhost.localdomain>
	<1111523021.5050.87.camel@localhost.localdomain>
Message-ID: <20050322124606.039b7257@localhost.localdomain>

On Tue, 22 Mar 2005 20:23:40 +0000 Paul  wrote:

> > The answer is to deploy a variety of measures with strict regression
> > testing (which means SLOW and GRADUAL deployment): caching of descriptor
> > strings by kernel so "cat /proc/bus/usb/devices" does not hit devices,
> > less aggressive polling by HAL and switchover to non-polled, event
> > driven modes in HAL, refactoring and correct delays of enumeration.
> 
> Is that going to happen before FC4 hits paydirt?

I think it's on case by case basis, sorry. Some devices will be fixed,
some won't. In the latter case, it's "yum update" time. From my point
of view, this hamster wheel never stops.

> Do you want me to file this problem into bugzilla and if so, what
> component does it need filing under?

File against kernel, please. If HAL is involved, I can easily file
a new bug or reassign it.

-- Pete



From bdpepple at ameritech.net  Tue Mar 22 20:57:15 2005
From: bdpepple at ameritech.net (Brian Pepple)
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 15:57:15 -0500
Subject: DVD burning goosed?
In-Reply-To: <1111522811.5050.82.camel@localhost.localdomain>
References: <1111522811.5050.82.camel@localhost.localdomain>
Message-ID: <1111525035.18891.2.camel@localhost.localdomain>

On Tue, 2005-03-22 at 20:20 +0000, Paul wrote:
> I'm trying to burn to my NEC 3500a dual layer DVD burner and it
> permanently crashes out at 9% of the burn. The burner is physically
> sound (burns CDs fine, reads DVDs fine, burns about 9% of the disc
> fine ;-p) and I'm using brand new Bulkpaq 4x DVD-R discs (which I've
> used plenty of times before now).

Wrong list.

http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/PostIsOffTopic

/B
-- 
Brian Pepple 

gpg --keyserver pgp.mit.edu --recv-keys 810CC15E
BD5E 6F9E 8688 E668 8F5B  CBDE 326A E936 810C C15E
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From linuxhippy at verizon.net  Tue Mar 22 21:53:48 2005
From: linuxhippy at verizon.net (Marty Huntzberry)
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 16:53:48 -0500
Subject: FC4-Test 1 review
Message-ID: <20050322165348.218f5d60.linuxhippy@verizon.net>

I downloaded FC4-Test 1 and installed it ok on an old 450 MHz P3 with 320 MB RAM.  I customized the install to give me KDE only (my pc performance is slower with KDE than other desktops-I'm thinking about reinstalling with GNOME as my desktop instead).  This is on my personal home pc.

I was frustrated to find that xmms would not stream radio and neither would juk.  I tried to get the needed mp3 plugins using yum and was informed that I needed keys which would not download.  

Why this mp3 problem?  It's existed since Red Hat and from what I read businesses need (for legal reasons) to buy a mp3 license.  Understandable-but is Fedora Core aimed at the same market as Red Hat?  I thought FC was more of a home computer market while Red Hat is taking on the business market.

Marty



From bdpepple at ameritech.net  Tue Mar 22 21:57:00 2005
From: bdpepple at ameritech.net (Brian Pepple)
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 16:57:00 -0500
Subject: FC4-Test 1 review
In-Reply-To: <20050322165348.218f5d60.linuxhippy@verizon.net>
References: <20050322165348.218f5d60.linuxhippy@verizon.net>
Message-ID: <1111528620.20840.1.camel@localhost.localdomain>

On Tue, 2005-03-22 at 16:53 -0500, Marty Huntzberry wrote:
> I downloaded FC4-Test 1 and installed it ok on an old 450 MHz P3 with 320 MB RAM.  I customized the install to give me KDE only (my pc performance is slower with KDE than other desktops-I'm thinking about reinstalling with GNOME as my desktop instead).  This is on my personal home pc.
> 
> I was frustrated to find that xmms would not stream radio and neither would juk.  I tried to get the needed mp3 plugins using yum and was informed that I needed keys which would not download.  
> 
> Why this mp3 problem?  It's existed since Red Hat and from what I read businesses need (for legal reasons) to buy a mp3 license.  Understandable-but is Fedora Core aimed at the same market as Red Hat?  I thought FC was more of a home computer market while Red Hat is taking on the business market.

Wrong list.
http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/PostIsOffTopic

/B
-- 
Brian Pepple 

gpg --keyserver pgp.mit.edu --recv-keys 810CC15E
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From ogle at OCF.Berkeley.EDU  Tue Mar 22 22:06:23 2005
From: ogle at OCF.Berkeley.EDU (Glen Kim)
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 14:06:23 -0800 (PST)
Subject: Status of USB install support in FC4 Test1?
In-Reply-To: <20050321145831.1220730c@localhost.localdomain>
References: 
	<20050321145831.1220730c@localhost.localdomain>
Message-ID: 

On Mon, 21 Mar 2005, Pete Zaitcev wrote:

[snip]
>
> Also please pardon me asking, but why would you want this? It sounds like
> a crackpot idea to me. Do you want to have something like Fedoppix on
> a USB flash key? I am very interested to know what is the intended
> application of such install.

 	Well, personally speaking, I had an experience with USB booting 
that was more esoteric but just as useful.  I had put a hdd I was not 
longer using with FC1 in a USB enclosure, and was trying to boot my laptop 
off it.  Obviously it didn't work, but it would have been nice if it did!



From remco at rvt.com  Tue Mar 22 22:39:08 2005
From: remco at rvt.com (Remco Treffkorn)
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 14:39:08 -0800
Subject: Rawhide NetworkManager
In-Reply-To: <423FBFB7.6010400@feuerpokemon.de>
References: <1111160849.32293.23.camel@dch.TQMcube.com>
	
	<423FBFB7.6010400@feuerpokemon.de>
Message-ID: <200503221439.09611.remco@rvt.com>

On Monday 21 March 2005 22:48, dragoran wrote:
>
> /etc/sysconfig/networking/profiles//resolv.conf

That made me look around in /etc/sysconfig/networking a bit.
I was a bit surprised by the following:

-rw-r--r--  3 root root 215 Feb 10 
11:58 /etc/sysconfig/networking/devices/ifcfg-eth1
-rw-r--r--  3 root root 215 Feb 10 
11:58 /etc/sysconfig/networking/profiles/default/ifcfg-eth1
-rw-r--r--  3 root root 215 Feb 10 
11:58 /etc/sysconfig/network-scripts/ifcfg-eth1

This is the 'ls -l' output for the three files.
Why do we need the files in tree places, even if it's just links?

Is there documentation I should read to understand what is going on?

How are networking/profiles used?

Any pointers, please...

Cheers,
Remco

-- 
Remco Treffkorn (RT445)
HAM DC2XT
remco at rvt.com   (831) 685-1201



From roli at israel-jugendtag.ch  Tue Mar 22 22:53:11 2005
From: roli at israel-jugendtag.ch (=?ISO-8859-15?Q?Roland_K=E4ser?=)
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 23:53:11 +0100
Subject: FC4 Test 1 and Matrox G550 (no text consoles)
Message-ID: <4240A1D7.1030003@israel-jugendtag.ch>

Hallo

I've installed the FC4 Test 1 on a System with a Matrox G550. The start 
of the XServer causes the unusability of the text consoles. It seems 
that the xorg G550 driver reconfigures the Graphics card on a low level 
so even when the X is terminated (in runlevel 3) the text consoles 
remains unusable. Does anybody have an idea of this behavior?
I've installed the same distribution on a machine with a ATI card with a 
normal behavior when switching to text consoles or stoping the X (in 
runlevel 3). Has there been some major changes in the xorg Matrox driver?

Roland Kaeser



From dwmw2 at infradead.org  Tue Mar 22 22:52:58 2005
From: dwmw2 at infradead.org (David Woodhouse)
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 22:52:58 +0000
Subject: rawhide report: 20050319 changes
In-Reply-To: <1111460467.5247.3.camel@localhost.localdomain>
References: <200503191304.j2JD4uDK020288@porkchop.devel.redhat.com>
	<1111455748.12909.21.camel@dragon.sys.intra>
	<1111460467.5247.3.camel@localhost.localdomain>
Message-ID: <1111531979.4533.5.camel@localhost.localdomain>

On Mon, 2005-03-21 at 19:01 -0800, Anthony Green wrote:
> jsch is a library (not command line tool) used by two large
> applications in FC: ant and Eclipse.

Is this what's responsible for the Eclipse ':extssh:' CVS access method
which ignores the ProxyCommand and other directives in my ~/.ssh/config
and the keys in my ssh-agent, and which isn't Kerberos-enabled even
though the version of OpenSSH installed on the system is? Why is this
any better than using the real OpenSSH client?

I thought we had a brand-new policy of "no duplicate functionality",
which we've even taken to the extent of dropping packages which overlap
but still provide functionality which isn't available elsewhere.

What is the overriding reason for providing _this_ particular
duplication, in violation of that policy? Are we actually _serious_
about that policy? We don't seem to be being very consistent about it.

-- 
dwmw2



From cra at WPI.EDU  Tue Mar 22 22:57:58 2005
From: cra at WPI.EDU (Chuck R. Anderson)
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 17:57:58 -0500
Subject: Rawhide NetworkManager
In-Reply-To: <200503221439.09611.remco@rvt.com>
References: <1111160849.32293.23.camel@dch.TQMcube.com>
	
	<423FBFB7.6010400@feuerpokemon.de>
	<200503221439.09611.remco@rvt.com>
Message-ID: <20050322225758.GF1808@angus.ind.WPI.EDU>

On Tue, Mar 22, 2005 at 02:39:08PM -0800, Remco Treffkorn wrote:
> Why do we need the files in tree places, even if it's just links?
> Is there documentation I should read to understand what is going on?
> How are networking/profiles used?
> Any pointers, please...

The existence of a file/hardlink in a directory makes it a member of
that profile.  It is intended that there be e.g. multiple
ifcfg-eth0Profile files, one for each Profile, even if they configure
the same hardware device.  When you activate a specific profile, all
the network devices that are not a member of that profile are
deactivated, and all the ones that are a member of that profile are
activated.  Hardlinking allows the same "virtual device configuration"
to be shared with multiple profiles.

It took me a while of playing with system-config-network and looking
at the generated file tree to figure out the paradigm.  I must say it
is strange and non-intuitive.



From paul at all-the-johnsons.co.uk  Tue Mar 22 23:18:40 2005
From: paul at all-the-johnsons.co.uk (Paul)
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 23:18:40 +0000
Subject: DVD burning goosed?
In-Reply-To: <1111525035.18891.2.camel@localhost.localdomain>
References: <1111522811.5050.82.camel@localhost.localdomain>
	<1111525035.18891.2.camel@localhost.localdomain>
Message-ID: <1111533520.5050.94.camel@localhost.localdomain>

Hi

> > I'm trying to burn to my NEC 3500a dual layer DVD burner and it
> > permanently crashes out at 9% of the burn. The burner is physically
> > sound (burns CDs fine, reads DVDs fine, burns about 9% of the disc
> > fine ;-p) and I'm using brand new Bulkpaq 4x DVD-R discs (which I've
> > used plenty of times before now).
> 
> Wrong list.

How is software supplied in rawhide being discussed on this list on the
wrong list?

I'm trying to see if there is currently a problem with the software in
rawhide which can be causing DVD writing problems - you know, the stuff
which needs to be found and fixed before FC4 goes live properly?

TTFN

Paul
-- 
"It is often said that something cannot be libel if it is the truth.
This has had to be amended to 'something cannot be libel if it is the
truth or if the bank balance says otherwise'" - US Today
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From paul at all-the-johnsons.co.uk  Tue Mar 22 23:23:50 2005
From: paul at all-the-johnsons.co.uk (Paul)
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 23:23:50 +0000
Subject: usb_storage
In-Reply-To: <20050322124606.039b7257@localhost.localdomain>
References: 
	<20050316132536.2c968d17@localhost.localdomain>
	
	<20050319190341.1331a0f4@localhost.localdomain>
	<1111315091.9137.86.camel@localhost.localdomain>
	<1111490082.3328.60.camel@localhost.localdomain>
	
	<20050322121001.55bf3772@localhost.localdomain>
	<1111523021.5050.87.camel@localhost.localdomain>
	<20050322124606.039b7257@localhost.localdomain>
Message-ID: <1111533831.5050.96.camel@localhost.localdomain>

Hi,

> File against kernel, please. If HAL is involved, I can easily file
> a new bug or reassign it.

https://bugzilla.redhat.com/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=151848

Done.

TTFN

Paul
-- 
"It is often said that something cannot be libel if it is the truth.
This has had to be amended to 'something cannot be libel if it is the
truth or if the bank balance says otherwise'" - US Today
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From nhruby at uga.edu  Tue Mar 22 23:39:34 2005
From: nhruby at uga.edu (nathan r. hruby)
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 18:39:34 -0500 (EST)
Subject: rawhide report: 20050319 changes
In-Reply-To: <1111531979.4533.5.camel@localhost.localdomain>
References: <200503191304.j2JD4uDK020288@porkchop.devel.redhat.com>
	<1111455748.12909.21.camel@dragon.sys.intra>
	<1111460467.5247.3.camel@localhost.localdomain>
	<1111531979.4533.5.camel@localhost.localdomain>
Message-ID: 

On Tue, 22 Mar 2005, David Woodhouse wrote:


> I thought we had a brand-new policy of "no duplicate functionality",
> which we've even taken to the extent of dropping packages which overlap
> but still provide functionality which isn't available elsewhere.

Maybe you should apply for maintainership of OpenSSH in Extras ;-)

-n
-- 
-------------------------------------------
nathan hruby 
uga enterprise information technology services
production systems support
metaphysically wrinkle-free
-------------------------------------------



From jspaleta at gmail.com  Tue Mar 22 23:54:22 2005
From: jspaleta at gmail.com (Jeff Spaleta)
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 18:54:22 -0500
Subject: rawhide report: 20050319 changes
In-Reply-To: <1111531979.4533.5.camel@localhost.localdomain>
References: <200503191304.j2JD4uDK020288@porkchop.devel.redhat.com>
	<1111455748.12909.21.camel@dragon.sys.intra>
	<1111460467.5247.3.camel@localhost.localdomain>
	<1111531979.4533.5.camel@localhost.localdomain>
Message-ID: <604aa79105032215543a63d042@mail.gmail.com>

On Tue, 22 Mar 2005 22:52:58 +0000, David Woodhouse  wrote:
> I thought we had a brand-new policy of "no duplicate functionality",
> which we've even taken to the extent of dropping packages which overlap
> but still provide functionality which isn't available elsewhere.

Can you point me to an example of a library, a library used in another
package still in Core that has been removed because it was deemed a
duplication?  Its one thing to talk about application level
duplication.. its quite another to talk about duplication at the level
of libraries.  I honestly can't come up with an example of a library
being removed from Core, that was still in use by an application in
Core thus resulting in a loss of functionality in the application
which is still a part of Core.  Libraries like ones used by abiword
for example, where moved to extras because abiword was the only
application in Core currently using those libraries and thus were not
impacted by the move of the library.

My understanding is the duplication policy is aimed at the application
level and not at the library level primarly.  In the case of ant and
eclipse, if the jsch solution is limited compared to openssh perhaps
the best long term path is to make sure these applications can use
openssh libraries as a replacement of jcsh, and jcsh in turn can be
dropped. Until these applications can use openssh in this way however,
i don't see this as a problem nor as cutting against the policy of
preventing as much application duplication as possible.

-jef



From rodd at clarkson.id.au  Tue Mar 22 23:55:43 2005
From: rodd at clarkson.id.au (Rodd Clarkson)
Date: Wed, 23 Mar 2005 10:55:43 +1100
Subject: DVD burning goosed?
In-Reply-To: <1111533520.5050.94.camel@localhost.localdomain>
References: <1111522811.5050.82.camel@localhost.localdomain>
	<1111525035.18891.2.camel@localhost.localdomain>
	<1111533520.5050.94.camel@localhost.localdomain>
Message-ID: <1111535743.3741.5.camel@jellyfish.redfishdemo.com>

On Tue, 2005-03-22 at 23:18 +0000, Paul wrote:
> Hi
> 
> > > I'm trying to burn to my NEC 3500a dual layer DVD burner and it
> > > permanently crashes out at 9% of the burn. The burner is physically
> > > sound (burns CDs fine, reads DVDs fine, burns about 9% of the disc
> > > fine ;-p) and I'm using brand new Bulkpaq 4x DVD-R discs (which I've
> > > used plenty of times before now).
> > 
> > Wrong list.
> 
> How is software supplied in rawhide being discussed on this list on the
> wrong list?
> 
> I'm trying to see if there is currently a problem with the software in
> rawhide which can be causing DVD writing problems - you know, the stuff
> which needs to be found and fixed before FC4 goes live properly?

I guess because the list set up for this type of discussion is
fedora-test-list.  While things are quiet (before test releases are
made) people on this list will often answer these questions, but when
the lists are hot (like now) it's preferred that these questions go to
the appropriate list.  Before FC4-t1, both lists were getting minimal
traffic.  Since the release, fedora-test-list is getting about 90 or 100
messages a day and the fedora-devel is getting about 50.

If you look at http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-list
you notice in big capital letters: THIS IS NOT A SUPPORT LIST. THIS LIST
IS FOR CORE DEVELOPMENT DISCUSSION ONLY.

I guess it's a fine line of distinction, but your question really is a
'support' question.  fedora-devel is more about where development is
going, not what's not working.


Rodd



From overholt at redhat.com  Tue Mar 22 23:58:00 2005
From: overholt at redhat.com (Andrew Overholt)
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 18:58:00 -0500
Subject: rawhide report: 20050319 changes
In-Reply-To: <1111460467.5247.3.camel@localhost.localdomain>
References: <200503191304.j2JD4uDK020288@porkchop.devel.redhat.com>
	<1111455748.12909.21.camel@dragon.sys.intra>
	<1111460467.5247.3.camel@localhost.localdomain>
Message-ID: <20050322235800.GA27430@redhat.com>

* Anthony Green  [2005-03-21 22:07]:
> 
> Eclipse already has its own copy of jsch.  I believe somebody plans on
> removing that and making it use this common version.

This was my motivation.  Eclipse includes lots of things own as jars that
don't get rebuilt during the build procedure.  jsch is one of them.  jzlib
was necessary as a dependency of jsch.  lucene is next on my list.  Now we
can symlink out of the Eclipse build and runtime directories to jars we
have on the system (and that we built ourselves).

Andrew



From bdpepple at ameritech.net  Wed Mar 23 00:05:03 2005
From: bdpepple at ameritech.net (Brian Pepple)
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 19:05:03 -0500
Subject: DVD burning goosed?
In-Reply-To: <1111533520.5050.94.camel@localhost.localdomain>
References: <1111522811.5050.82.camel@localhost.localdomain>
	<1111525035.18891.2.camel@localhost.localdomain>
	<1111533520.5050.94.camel@localhost.localdomain>
Message-ID: <1111536303.25370.2.camel@localhost.localdomain>

On Tue, 2005-03-22 at 23:18 +0000, Paul wrote:
> Hi
> 
> > > I'm trying to burn to my NEC 3500a dual layer DVD burner and it
> > > permanently crashes out at 9% of the burn. The burner is physically
> > > sound (burns CDs fine, reads DVDs fine, burns about 9% of the disc
> > > fine ;-p) and I'm using brand new Bulkpaq 4x DVD-R discs (which I've
> > > used plenty of times before now).
> > 
> > Wrong list.
> 
> How is software supplied in rawhide being discussed on this list on the
> wrong list?
> 
> I'm trying to see if there is currently a problem with the software in
> rawhide which can be causing DVD writing problems - you know, the stuff
> which needs to be found and fixed before FC4 goes live properly?

As was stated in the wiki, it should be directed to fedora-test-list.

/B
-- 
Brian Pepple 

gpg --keyserver pgp.mit.edu --recv-keys 810CC15E
BD5E 6F9E 8688 E668 8F5B  CBDE 326A E936 810C C15E
-------------- next part --------------
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URL: 

From green at redhat.com  Wed Mar 23 00:18:29 2005
From: green at redhat.com (Anthony Green)
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 16:18:29 -0800
Subject: rawhide report: 20050319 changes
In-Reply-To: <20050322235800.GA27430@redhat.com>
References: <200503191304.j2JD4uDK020288@porkchop.devel.redhat.com>
	<1111455748.12909.21.camel@dragon.sys.intra>
	<1111460467.5247.3.camel@localhost.localdomain>
	<20050322235800.GA27430@redhat.com>
Message-ID: <1111537110.5163.95.camel@dhcp-172-16-25-146.sfbay.redhat.com>

On Tue, 2005-03-22 at 18:58 -0500, Andrew Overholt wrote:
> This was my motivation.  Eclipse includes lots of things own as jars that
> don't get rebuilt during the build procedure.  jsch is one of them.  jzlib
> was necessary as a dependency of jsch.  lucene is next on my list.  Now we
> can symlink out of the Eclipse build and runtime directories to jars we
> have on the system (and that we built ourselves).

I think we should do a round of this with OO.o as well.  It ships with a
number of jars which should really be their own packages (and are
currently JPackaged).  hsqldb and rhino are two good examples. 

This serves two purposes: exposing more functionality to users and
removing duplication.  (There are probably a dozen SRPMS in FC that
include their own private copy of berkeley db.  This is something can
try to avoid with all the new java bits.)

AG





From pbrobinson at gmail.com  Wed Mar 23 01:28:24 2005
From: pbrobinson at gmail.com (Peter Robinson)
Date: Wed, 23 Mar 2005 09:28:24 +0800
Subject: fedora-directory-server?
In-Reply-To: <1111495207.3328.85.camel@localhost.localdomain>
References: <1111495207.3328.85.camel@localhost.localdomain>
Message-ID: <5256d0b0503221728323f3628@mail.gmail.com>

On Tue, 22 Mar 2005 13:40:07 +0100, Kyrre Ness Sjobak
 wrote:
> While reporting a bug in bugzilla, I came over a courious option -
> "fedora directory server". What is this? Google only turned up with a
> closed mailing list with closed archives - and something about the
> acquisition of the Netscape directory...
> 
> While bugzilla gives me some hints (database, security/access control,
> different UI's, migration etc - but no bugs...), and the mentioned
> acquisition some more - but it is definitely leaving me rather
> curious... What is this thing? When will it be released?

They bought a chunk of the old netscape products last year. It
included the directory server, certificate server and some other
stuff. They are planning to release it as open source over 6 to 12
months (from september) as part of their total open source solution so
I'd expect to see it start to appear of the next couple of months.

You can read the official redhat press here 
http://www.redhat.com/about/presscenter/2004/press_neighbor.html

Pete



From smooge at gmail.com  Wed Mar 23 01:48:58 2005
From: smooge at gmail.com (Stephen J. Smoogen)
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 18:48:58 -0700
Subject: Stateless linux
In-Reply-To: <42405C56.8060507@VTK.UGent.be>
References: <423FC541.4030106@hclcomnet.co.in> <42405C56.8060507@VTK.UGent.be>
Message-ID: <80d7e4090503221748a649641@mail.gmail.com>

On Tue, 22 Mar 2005 17:56:38 +0000, Peter Dedecker
 wrote:
> Gaurav wrote:
> >        I am interested in stateless Linux project  and would like to
> > volunteer  for its beta tester ... I will try roll this out in my
> > brother's school and after that  co workers on my office plus also would
> > like to contribute to its development ....help it to take to next level :-)
> 
> Nice
> 
> > I would like to know what state this project is in ? is anybody involved
> > in active testing/ testing development ? Do you need beta tester ...
> 
> It isn't in active development right now.  At Red Hat, they don't even
> know if they'll continue it.  But if they continue it, there'll be a
> team working on it.
> 

Well maybe Red Hat should talk to they have been selling to  in the US
Government networks. There is a major need for a packaged conformed
stateless linux product for various networks. The defense department
and energy departments are needing to put 1000's of computers as
diskless nodes. Having say RHEL-4 with a stateless station should be a
good selling point.


> > all like minded (stateless  people ;-) ) pl let me know if interested
> 
> You can see my experiences at
> http://blog.eikke.com/index.php/fedorastateless
> 
> Good luck!
> 
> --
> Peter Dedecker                      Peter.Dedecker at VTK.UGent.be
> Studentenvertegenwoordiger          VTK Computerpraeses
> Isabellakaai 124 - 9000 Gent        GSM: 0486/15.23.20
> 
> 
> --
> fedora-devel-list mailing list
> fedora-devel-list at redhat.com
> http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-list
> 
> 
> 


-- 
Stephen J Smoogen.
CSIRT/Linux System Administrator



From vherva at viasys.com  Wed Mar 23 07:00:38 2005
From: vherva at viasys.com (Ville Herva)
Date: Wed, 23 Mar 2005 09:00:38 +0200
Subject: yum/rpm hangs on futex wait - kernel bug?
In-Reply-To: <20050322194627.GM15993@viasys.com>
References: <1111152164.8014.97.camel@localhost.localdomain>
	<1111152347.30200.45.camel@cutter>
	<1111152498.8014.105.camel@localhost.localdomain>
	<1111152998.30200.48.camel@cutter>
	<20050318144356.073e3b11@nausicaa.camperquake.de>
	<20050322145806.GL15993@viasys.com>
	<20050322194627.GM15993@viasys.com>
Message-ID: <20050323070038.GN15993@viasys.com>

On Tue, Mar 22, 2005 at 09:46:27PM +0200, you [Ville Herva] wrote:
> >
> > Recently, "yum update" has often halted in the middle of updating, usually
> > in the clean up phase. According to strace, it waits for a futex (sorry, I
> > didn't save the strace log, will do if it happens again). I've had to kill
> > -KILL it, HUP nor TERM are not enough. After this, it apparently leaves the
> > other package version in place, for example:
> 
> FWIW, it hung again, this time "rpm -e", not yum. 
> 
> --8<-----------------------------------------------------------------------
> >strace -p 3717
> Process 3717 attached - interrupt to quit
> futex(0x808c938, FUTEX_WAIT, 1, NULL 
> Process 3717 detached
> --8<-----------------------------------------------------------------------
> 
> After "kill -KILL 3717" and "rm /var/lib/rpm/__db.00*" rpm -e worked.
> 
> I've already done "rm /var/lib/rpm/__db.00*" quite a few times and "rpm
> --rebuild db" a few times. The hang appears to happen pretty randomly. Any
> ideas?

This might just be related to the kernel problem described in thread
starting from here:

http://marc.free.net.ph/message/20050322.035910.7a290828.en.html



-- v -- 

v at iki.fi



From skvidal at phy.duke.edu  Wed Mar 23 07:33:00 2005
From: skvidal at phy.duke.edu (seth vidal)
Date: Wed, 23 Mar 2005 02:33:00 -0500
Subject: Q on yum cleanup
In-Reply-To: <1111521116.21406.20.camel@rousalka.dyndns.org>
References: <1111152164.8014.97.camel@localhost.localdomain>
	<1111152347.30200.45.camel@cutter>
	<1111152498.8014.105.camel@localhost.localdomain>
	<1111152998.30200.48.camel@cutter>
	<20050318144356.073e3b11@nausicaa.camperquake.de>
	<20050322145806.GL15993@viasys.com> <1111518152.19235.39.camel@cutter>
	<1111519277.21406.8.camel@rousalka.dyndns.org>
	<604aa79105032211351bfedaab@mail.gmail.com>
	<1111521116.21406.20.camel@rousalka.dyndns.org>
Message-ID: <1111563181.28357.58.camel@cutter>


> This would do as well.
> 
> I know Seth just hates Rawhide, multiple conflicting repositories and
> all the real-world stuff that makes his baby so much more convoluted
> than what he wanted to do at first. So my cunning plan is to nudge him
> in the direction I wanted yum to take from day one, hoping he's been
> exposed to Fedora Devel long enough it no longer rubs him too much in
> the wrong places.
> 
> Your proposal OTOH might be a little too obvious to be accepted at this
> stage;)

Right now any plans for making yum pass over broken deps is not going to
happen.

However, I think I may have a compromise position that I'm trying (in my
copious free time) to work on.

Essentially you set drop_me_to_shell_on_error=True in your yum.conf and
if yum gets a certain set of problems it will maintain state and drop
you to the yum shell to fend for yourself. This means that you'll be
able to muck with the transaction set and packages yum thinks is
available and then rerun the transaction.

Right now things to do:
 - a fair bit of additional items in the shell
 - write the handler for exiting from the cli to the shell on errors
 - test all of it out :)

hth
-sv




From caolanm at redhat.com  Wed Mar 23 08:37:43 2005
From: caolanm at redhat.com (Caolan McNamara)
Date: Wed, 23 Mar 2005 08:37:43 +0000
Subject: rawhide report: 20050319 changes
In-Reply-To: <1111537110.5163.95.camel@dhcp-172-16-25-146.sfbay.redhat.com>
References: <200503191304.j2JD4uDK020288@porkchop.devel.redhat.com>
	<1111455748.12909.21.camel@dragon.sys.intra>
	<1111460467.5247.3.camel@localhost.localdomain>
	<20050322235800.GA27430@redhat.com>
	<1111537110.5163.95.camel@dhcp-172-16-25-146.sfbay.redhat.com>
Message-ID: <1111567063.12179.4.camel@sheol.homelinux.org>

On Tue, 2005-03-22 at 16:18 -0800, Anthony Green wrote:
> On Tue, 2005-03-22 at 18:58 -0500, Andrew Overholt wrote:
> > This was my motivation.  Eclipse includes lots of things own as jars that
> > don't get rebuilt during the build procedure.  jsch is one of them.  jzlib
> > was necessary as a dependency of jsch.  lucene is next on my list.  Now we
> > can symlink out of the Eclipse build and runtime directories to jars we
> > have on the system (and that we built ourselves).
> 
> I think we should do a round of this with OO.o as well.  It ships with a
> number of jars which should really be their own packages (and are
> currently JPackaged).  hsqldb and rhino are two good examples. 

Yeah, I've done this for nearly all there other stock libraries. For the
java things the Ooo rhino has a small patchset applied to it (which
additionally makes it not compile with gcj out of the box), so it's not
the stock rhino. On the other hand hsqldb is a good candidate as its a
stock 1.8.0RC3 hsqldb, as too is beanshell.

C.



From gauravp at hclcomnet.co.in  Wed Mar 23 08:46:02 2005
From: gauravp at hclcomnet.co.in (gaurav)
Date: Wed, 23 Mar 2005 14:16:02 +0530
Subject: Stateless linux
In-Reply-To: <80d7e4090503221748a649641@mail.gmail.com>
References: <423FC541.4030106@hclcomnet.co.in> <42405C56.8060507@VTK.UGent.be>
	<80d7e4090503221748a649641@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <42412CCA.1010401@hclcomnet.co.in>

so ...will stateless linux is going to be included in fc 4  or not ??

Stephen J. Smoogen wrote:

>On Tue, 22 Mar 2005 17:56:38 +0000, Peter Dedecker
> wrote:
>  
>
>>Gaurav wrote:
>>    
>>
>>>       I am interested in stateless Linux project  and would like to
>>>volunteer  for its beta tester ... I will try roll this out in my
>>>brother's school and after that  co workers on my office plus also would
>>>like to contribute to its development ....help it to take to next level :-)
>>>      
>>>
>>Nice
>>
>>    
>>
>>>I would like to know what state this project is in ? is anybody involved
>>>in active testing/ testing development ? Do you need beta tester ...
>>>      
>>>
>>It isn't in active development right now.  At Red Hat, they don't even
>>know if they'll continue it.  But if they continue it, there'll be a
>>team working on it.
>>
>>    
>>
>
>Well maybe Red Hat should talk to they have been selling to  in the US
>Government networks. There is a major need for a packaged conformed
>stateless linux product for various networks. The defense department
>and energy departments are needing to put 1000's of computers as
>diskless nodes. Having say RHEL-4 with a stateless station should be a
>good selling point.
>
>
>  
>
>>>all like minded (stateless  people ;-) ) pl let me know if interested
>>>      
>>>
>>You can see my experiences at
>>http://blog.eikke.com/index.php/fedorastateless
>>
>>Good luck!
>>
>>--
>>Peter Dedecker                      Peter.Dedecker at VTK.UGent.be
>>Studentenvertegenwoordiger          VTK Computerpraeses
>>Isabellakaai 124 - 9000 Gent        GSM: 0486/15.23.20
>>
>>
>>--
>>fedora-devel-list mailing list
>>fedora-devel-list at redhat.com
>>http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-list
>>
>>
>>
>>    
>>
>
>
>  
>



From lfarkas at bppiac.hu  Wed Mar 23 08:54:07 2005
From: lfarkas at bppiac.hu (Farkas Levente)
Date: Wed, 23 Mar 2005 09:54:07 +0100
Subject: named log with selinux
Message-ID: <42412EAF.3030807@bppiac.hu>

hi,
it seems there is no named_log_t defined in the current selinux policy 
files (both on rhel4 and fc3). it would be useful to define such even if 
the current default named don't log enything somebody (like me) would 
like to log something. and got the following errors:
---------------------------------
Mar 23 09:40:34 blue kernel: audit(1111567234.309:0): avc:  denied  { 
search } for  pid=2775 exe=/usr/sbin/named name=log dev=md0 ino=4669462 
scontext=root:system_r:named_t tcontext=system_u:object_r:var_log_t 
tclass=dir
Mar 23 09:40:34 blue named[2774]: logging channel 'update_log' file 
'/var/log/named-update': permission denied
Mar 23 09:40:34 blue kernel: audit(1111567234.309:0): avc:  denied  { 
search } for  pid=2775 exe=/usr/sbin/named name=log dev=md0 ino=4669462 
scontext=root:system_r:named_t tcontext=system_u:object_r:var_log_t 
tclass=dir
Mar 23 09:40:34 blue named[2774]: logging channel 'query_log' file 
'/var/log/named-query': permission denied
Mar 23 09:40:34 blue kernel: audit(1111567234.310:0): avc:  denied  { 
search } for  pid=2775 exe=/usr/sbin/named name=log dev=md0 ino=4669462 
scontext=root:system_r:named_t tcontext=system_u:object_r:var_log_t 
tclass=dir
Mar 23 09:40:34 blue named[2774]: logging channel 'security_log' file 
'/var/log/named-auth': permission denied
---------------------------------
what more (i don't know why) when i try to relabel the log files to 
named_t i've got these errors:
---------------------------------
Mar 23 09:50:54 blue kernel: audit(1111567854.706:0): avc:  denied  { 
relabelto } for  pid=2922 exe=/usr/bin/chcon name=named-auth dev=md0 
ino=4670608 scontext=root:system_r:unconfined_t 
tcontext=root:object_r:named_t tclass=file
Mar 23 09:50:54 blue kernel: audit(1111567854.707:0): avc:  denied  { 
relabelto } for  pid=2922 exe=/usr/bin/chcon name=named-query dev=md0 
ino=4670491 scontext=root:system_r:unconfined_t 
tcontext=root:object_r:named_t tclass=file
Mar 23 09:50:54 blue kernel: audit(1111567854.707:0): avc:  denied  { 
relabelto } for  pid=2922 exe=/usr/bin/chcon name=named-update dev=md0 
ino=4669631 scontext=root:system_r:unconfined_t 
tcontext=root:object_r:named_t tclass=file
---------------------------------
any tip?
thanks in advance.
yours.


-- 
   Levente                               "Si vis pacem para bellum!"



From nicolas.mailhot at laposte.net  Wed Mar 23 09:07:28 2005
From: nicolas.mailhot at laposte.net (Nicolas Mailhot)
Date: Wed, 23 Mar 2005 10:07:28 +0100 (CET)
Subject: rawhide report: 20050319 changes
In-Reply-To: <1111537110.5163.95.camel@dhcp-172-16-25-146.sfbay.redhat.com>
References: <200503191304.j2JD4uDK020288@porkchop.devel.redhat.com>
	<1111455748.12909.21.camel@dragon.sys.intra>
	<1111460467.5247.3.camel@localhost.localdomain>
	<20050322235800.GA27430@redhat.com>
	<1111537110.5163.95.camel@dhcp-172-16-25-146.sfbay.redhat.com>
Message-ID: <15625.192.54.193.35.1111568848.squirrel@rousalka.dyndns.org>


On Mer 23 mars 2005 1:18, Anthony Green a ?crit :
> On Tue, 2005-03-22 at 18:58 -0500, Andrew Overholt wrote:
>> This was my motivation.  Eclipse includes lots of things own as jars
>> that
>> don't get rebuilt during the build procedure.  jsch is one of them.
>> jzlib
>> was necessary as a dependency of jsch.  lucene is next on my list.  Now
>> we
>> can symlink out of the Eclipse build and runtime directories to jars we
>> have on the system (and that we built ourselves).
>
> I think we should do a round of this with OO.o as well.  It ships with a
> number of jars which should really be their own packages (and are
> currently JPackaged).  hsqldb and rhino are two good examples.
>
> This serves two purposes: exposing more functionality to users and
> removing duplication.  (There are probably a dozen SRPMS in FC that
> include their own private copy of berkeley db.  This is something can
> try to avoid with all the new java bits.)

Another jar that is widely reused but pretty difficult to package
separately is the ldap access jar bundled with mozilla (aka ldapsdk)

Right now I think we ship a prebuild jar in a separate rpm, because you
can't even built it from sources without pulling out a large part of the
moz C++ tree too (I know several packagers gave up on it after trying to
do something with moz's standalone source dump)

Now that Fedora has some form of java support built-in it's probably time
to build it with mozilla in a mozilla-something rpm that obsoletes the
standalone package we have.

Regards,

-- 
Nicolas Mailhot



From nicolas.mailhot at laposte.net  Wed Mar 23 09:23:14 2005
From: nicolas.mailhot at laposte.net (Nicolas Mailhot)
Date: Wed, 23 Mar 2005 10:23:14 +0100 (CET)
Subject: DVD burning goosed?
In-Reply-To: <1111535743.3741.5.camel@jellyfish.redfishdemo.com>
References: <1111522811.5050.82.camel@localhost.localdomain>
	<1111525035.18891.2.camel@localhost.localdomain>
	<1111533520.5050.94.camel@localhost.localdomain>
	<1111535743.3741.5.camel@jellyfish.redfishdemo.com>
Message-ID: <54302.192.54.193.35.1111569794.squirrel@rousalka.dyndns.org>


On Mer 23 mars 2005 0:55, Rodd Clarkson a ?crit :

> If you look at http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-list
> you notice in big capital letters: THIS IS NOT A SUPPORT LIST. THIS LIST
> IS FOR CORE DEVELOPMENT DISCUSSION ONLY.
>
> I guess it's a fine line of distinction, but your question really is a
> 'support' question.  fedora-devel is more about where development is
> going, not what's not working.

The test list is described as applying to test releases only.
Rawhide is not a formal test release.
I guess if someone wanted to apply all the list rules strictly now we'd
find rawhide bug reports belong nowhere (except in bugzilla, but ML
reports and bugzilla are not exactly the same thing)

Regards,

-- 
Nicolas Mailhot



From byte at aeon.com.my  Wed Mar 23 09:51:46 2005
From: byte at aeon.com.my (Colin Charles)
Date: Wed, 23 Mar 2005 20:51:46 +1100
Subject: Status of USB install support in FC4 Test1?
In-Reply-To: <20050322000818.29de7b6c@nausicaa.camperquake.de>
References: 
	<20050321145831.1220730c@localhost.localdomain>
	<20050322000818.29de7b6c@nausicaa.camperquake.de>
Message-ID: <1111571506.5733.91.camel@arena.soho.bytebot.net>

On Tue, 2005-03-22 at 00:08 +0100, Ralf Ertzinger wrote:
> > Also please pardon me asking, but why would you want this? It sounds
> > like a crackpot idea to me. Do you want to have something like
> Fedoppix
> > on a USB flash key? I am very interested to know what is the
> intended
> > application of such install.
> 
> Well, per se there is nothing wrong with disks in external enclosures,
> is there? Assume I'd like to install FC on an Mac Mini, using an
> external
> large disk (be it USB or FireWire) for the Linux install and keeping
> the internal disk for OSX?

Or if someone has time and is inclined to, take a gander at the patches
YDL did, so that they got YDL4 booting off a Firewire-based iPod

So while you're not getting a LiveCD, most "new" machines have options
to boot off USB (x86), and you've got Macs that most certainly boot off
Firewire (and USB), so maybe there's some future/interest in such a
project
-- 
Colin Charles, byte at aeon.com.my
http://www.bytebot.net/
"First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, 
then you win." -- Mohandas Gandhi



From paul at all-the-johnsons.co.uk  Wed Mar 23 10:17:16 2005
From: paul at all-the-johnsons.co.uk (Paul)
Date: Wed, 23 Mar 2005 10:17:16 +0000
Subject: DVD burning goosed?
In-Reply-To: <54302.192.54.193.35.1111569794.squirrel@rousalka.dyndns.org>
References: <1111522811.5050.82.camel@localhost.localdomain>
	<1111525035.18891.2.camel@localhost.localdomain>
	<1111533520.5050.94.camel@localhost.localdomain>
	<1111535743.3741.5.camel@jellyfish.redfishdemo.com>
	<54302.192.54.193.35.1111569794.squirrel@rousalka.dyndns.org>
Message-ID: <1111573036.5050.118.camel@localhost.localdomain>

Hi,

> > I guess it's a fine line of distinction, but your question really is a
> > 'support' question.  fedora-devel is more about where development is
> > going, not what's not working.
> 
> The test list is described as applying to test releases only.
> Rawhide is not a formal test release.
> I guess if someone wanted to apply all the list rules strictly now we'd
> find rawhide bug reports belong nowhere (except in bugzilla, but ML
> reports and bugzilla are not exactly the same thing)

I've filed it in the test list and the devel list. Given that it's a
rawhide issue (and this is where I normally check before adding it into
bugzilla - even when test versions are out), I'd of thought here was the
right place - it certainly is/has been for OOo and Kernel issues.

Perhaps there should be a distinction made.

-test for those who get their updates from the test yum repository
-devel for those who get their updates from the devel yum repository

That would make life a lot simpler!

TTFN

Paul
(still stuck over the DVD irrespective of the list used!)
-- 
"It is often said that something cannot be libel if it is the truth.
This has had to be amended to 'something cannot be libel if it is the
truth or if the bank balance says otherwise'" - US Today
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From dragoran at feuerpokemon.de  Wed Mar 23 11:11:12 2005
From: dragoran at feuerpokemon.de (dragoran)
Date: Wed, 23 Mar 2005 12:11:12 +0100
Subject: Rawhide NetworkManager
In-Reply-To: <1111504525.6338.2.camel@dcbw.boston.redhat.com>
References: <1111160849.32293.23.camel@dch.TQMcube.com>		<423FBFB7.6010400@feuerpokemon.de>
	<1111504525.6338.2.camel@dcbw.boston.redhat.com>
Message-ID: <42414ED0.1000605@feuerpokemon.de>

Dan Williams wrote:

>On Tue, 2005-03-22 at 07:48 +0100, dragoran wrote:
>  
>
>>Dan Williams wrote:
>>    
>>
>>>So yes, we do honor distro-specific static IP config files, _except_ for DNS 
>>>entries in resolv.conf, mainly because nobody has figured it out yet.  We need 
>>>to know which file NM should copy the DNS info from (on Fedora, where does the 
>>>information entered into the DNS tab of system-config-network get stored, and 
>>>how do you change it for multiple profiles?).
>>>
>>>Dan
>>>
>>> 
>>>
>>>      
>>>
>>/etc/sysconfig/networking/profiles//resolv.conf
>>    
>>
>
>Ok, next question is:
>
>1) How do you know which profile is begin used at any given time?
>
>Dan
>
>  
>
dunno... I was unable to figure it out :(
wouldn't it be easier just to ask the maintainer of system-config-network?



From powers.jason at jimmy.harvard.edu  Wed Mar 23 11:59:40 2005
From: powers.jason at jimmy.harvard.edu (Jason Powers)
Date: Wed, 23 Mar 2005 06:59:40 -0500
Subject: Stateless linux
In-Reply-To: <42412CCA.1010401@hclcomnet.co.in>
References: <423FC541.4030106@hclcomnet.co.in>
	<42405C56.8060507@VTK.UGent.be>	<80d7e4090503221748a649641@mail.gmail.com>
	<42412CCA.1010401@hclcomnet.co.in>
Message-ID: <42415A2C.9080809@jimmy.harvard.edu>

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

My guess is it will still be in testing. We used it last year when the
docs on the site were still sort of current, and it worked pretty well
at my office. However, I am unable to contribute code, so if you don't
know how to read over the python it's hard to troubleshoot.

Try to get it from cvs and pick through the instructions on the project
site, it's fairly easy, but in order to use it for diskless terminals
you pretty much have to have control over your router (we don't).

Still, even with what's there it makes a good system for backups and
mass installs.

At the Fedora Conference in Boston, Havoc talked about it a bit, and
there was interest among the attendees, but I get the impression they
didn't have anyone outside redhat contributing code, so they weren't
really pursuing it.

It's a shame because it was a lot easier than LTSP to get configured.
I'm still going to use it here one way or another, but it could be six
months before I can sit down and add anything to their code.

Jason

gaurav wrote:
| so ...will stateless linux is going to be included in fc 4  or not ??
|
| Stephen J. Smoogen wrote:
|
|> On Tue, 22 Mar 2005 17:56:38 +0000, Peter Dedecker
|>  wrote:
|>
|>
|>> Gaurav wrote:
|>>
|>>
|>>>       I am interested in stateless Linux project  and would like to
|>>> volunteer  for its beta tester ... I will try roll this out in my
|>>> brother's school and after that  co workers on my office plus also
|>>> would
|>>> like to contribute to its development ....help it to take to next
|>>> level :-)
|>>>
|>>
|>> Nice
|>>
|>>
|>>
|>>> I would like to know what state this project is in ? is anybody
|>>> involved
|>>> in active testing/ testing development ? Do you need beta tester ...
|>>>
|>>
|>> It isn't in active development right now.  At Red Hat, they don't even
|>> know if they'll continue it.  But if they continue it, there'll be a
|>> team working on it.
|>>
|>>
|>
|>
|> Well maybe Red Hat should talk to they have been selling to  in the US
|> Government networks. There is a major need for a packaged conformed
|> stateless linux product for various networks. The defense department
|> and energy departments are needing to put 1000's of computers as
|> diskless nodes. Having say RHEL-4 with a stateless station should be a
|> good selling point.
|>
|>
|>
|>
|>>> all like minded (stateless  people ;-) ) pl let me know if interested
|>>>
|>>
|>> You can see my experiences at
|>> http://blog.eikke.com/index.php/fedorastateless
|>>
|>> Good luck!
|>>
|>> --
|>> Peter Dedecker                      Peter.Dedecker at VTK.UGent.be
|>> Studentenvertegenwoordiger          VTK Computerpraeses
|>> Isabellakaai 124 - 9000 Gent        GSM: 0486/15.23.20
|>>
|>>
|>> --
|>> fedora-devel-list mailing list
|>> fedora-devel-list at redhat.com
|>> http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-list
|>>
|>>
|>>
|>>
|>
|>
|>
|>
|>
|
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iD8DBQFCQVosTYWmZxo5gP0RAlM2AJ46ZrUXeJtgUGtXODq3QiMmicOnSACdFOX2
weXNYnbeTggr7A4pVYjAyYs=
=IedX
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From rahulsundaram at gmail.com  Wed Mar 23 11:54:40 2005
From: rahulsundaram at gmail.com (Rahul Sundaram)
Date: Wed, 23 Mar 2005 17:24:40 +0530
Subject: FC4 Test 1 and Matrox G550 (no text consoles)
In-Reply-To: <4240A1D7.1030003@israel-jugendtag.ch>
References: <4240A1D7.1030003@israel-jugendtag.ch>
Message-ID: 

On Tue, 22 Mar 2005 23:53:11 +0100, Roland K?ser
 wrote:
> Hallo
> 
> I've installed the FC4 Test 1 on a System with a Matrox G550. The start
> of the XServer causes the unusability of the text consoles. It seems
> that the xorg G550 driver reconfigures the Graphics card on a low level
> so even when the X is terminated (in runlevel 3) the text consoles
> remains unusable. Does anybody have an idea of this behavior?

off topic here. post to the fedora test list
-- 
Regards,
Rahul Sundaram



From gauravp at hclcomnet.co.in  Wed Mar 23 12:06:58 2005
From: gauravp at hclcomnet.co.in (gaurav)
Date: Wed, 23 Mar 2005 17:36:58 +0530
Subject: Stateless linux
In-Reply-To: <42415A2C.9080809@jimmy.harvard.edu>
References: <423FC541.4030106@hclcomnet.co.in><42405C56.8060507@VTK.UGent.be
	>	<80d7e4090503221748a649641@mail.gmail.com><42412CCA.1010401@hclcomnet.co
	.	in> <42415A2C.9080809@jimmy.harvard.edu>
Message-ID: <42415BE2.7090703@hclcomnet.co.in>

I was just  wondering how hard this concept of state less Linux will be 
to port to other distro (like debian) ? any idea if there code written 
od code written specifically for fedora or its just collection of 
unities and scripts . if some could just point me fc specific code wud 
be great :-)


Jason Powers wrote:

> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> Hash: SHA1
>
> My guess is it will still be in testing. We used it last year when the
> docs on the site were still sort of current, and it worked pretty well
> at my office. However, I am unable to contribute code, so if you don't
> know how to read over the python it's hard to troubleshoot.
>
> Try to get it from cvs and pick through the instructions on the project
> site, it's fairly easy, but in order to use it for diskless terminals
> you pretty much have to have control over your router (we don't).
>
> Still, even with what's there it makes a good system for backups and
> mass installs.
>
> At the Fedora Conference in Boston, Havoc talked about it a bit, and
> there was interest among the attendees, but I get the impression they
> didn't have anyone outside redhat contributing code, so they weren't
> really pursuing it.
>
> It's a shame because it was a lot easier than LTSP to get configured.
> I'm still going to use it here one way or another, but it could be six
> months before I can sit down and add anything to their code.
>
> Jason
>
> gaurav wrote:
> | so ...will stateless linux is going to be included in fc 4  or not ??
> |
> | Stephen J. Smoogen wrote:
> |
> |> On Tue, 22 Mar 2005 17:56:38 +0000, Peter Dedecker
> |>  wrote:
> |>
> |>
> |>> Gaurav wrote:
> |>>
> |>>
> |>>>       I am interested in stateless Linux project  and would like to
> |>>> volunteer  for its beta tester ... I will try roll this out in my
> |>>> brother's school and after that  co workers on my office plus also
> |>>> would
> |>>> like to contribute to its development ....help it to take to next
> |>>> level :-)
> |>>>
> |>>
> |>> Nice
> |>>
> |>>
> |>>
> |>>> I would like to know what state this project is in ? is anybody
> |>>> involved
> |>>> in active testing/ testing development ? Do you need beta tester ...
> |>>>
> |>>
> |>> It isn't in active development right now.  At Red Hat, they don't 
> even
> |>> know if they'll continue it.  But if they continue it, there'll be a
> |>> team working on it.
> |>>
> |>>
> |>
> |>
> |> Well maybe Red Hat should talk to they have been selling to  in the US
> |> Government networks. There is a major need for a packaged conformed
> |> stateless linux product for various networks. The defense department
> |> and energy departments are needing to put 1000's of computers as
> |> diskless nodes. Having say RHEL-4 with a stateless station should be a
> |> good selling point.
> |>
> |>
> |>
> |>
> |>>> all like minded (stateless  people ;-) ) pl let me know if 
> interested
> |>>>
> |>>
> |>> You can see my experiences at
> |>> http://blog.eikke.com/index.php/fedorastateless
> |>>
> |>> Good luck!
> |>>
> |>> --
> |>> Peter Dedecker                      Peter.Dedecker at VTK.UGent.be
> |>> Studentenvertegenwoordiger          VTK Computerpraeses
> |>> Isabellakaai 124 - 9000 Gent        GSM: 0486/15.23.20
> |>>
> |>>
> |>> --
> |>> fedora-devel-list mailing list
> |>> fedora-devel-list at redhat.com
> |>> http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-list
> |>>
> |>>
> |>>
> |>>
> |>
> |>
> |>
> |>
> |>
> |
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
> Version: GnuPG v1.4.0 (MingW32)
>
> iD8DBQFCQVosTYWmZxo5gP0RAlM2AJ46ZrUXeJtgUGtXODq3QiMmicOnSACdFOX2
> weXNYnbeTggr7A4pVYjAyYs=
> =IedX
> -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
>



From rahulsundaram at yahoo.co.in  Wed Mar 23 12:15:43 2005
From: rahulsundaram at yahoo.co.in (Rahul Sundaram)
Date: Wed, 23 Mar 2005 04:15:43 -0800 (PST)
Subject: Stateless linux
In-Reply-To: <42415BE2.7090703@hclcomnet.co.in>
Message-ID: <20050323121543.82712.qmail@web8501.mail.in.yahoo.com>


--- gaurav  wrote:

> I was just  wondering how hard this concept of state
> less Linux will be 
> to port to other distro (like debian) ? any idea if
> there code written 
> od code written specifically for fedora or its just
> collection of 
> unities and scripts . 

its in a highly experimental stage now. once its
complete it can definitely be ported to other
distributions if people work on it. if you have a
interest in it poke into the current code in cvs yourself

Regards
Rahul Sundaram


		
__________________________________ 
Do you Yahoo!? 
Yahoo! Mail - Easier than ever with enhanced search. Learn more. 
http://info.mail.yahoo.com/mail_250



From fedora at wir-sind-cool.org  Wed Mar 23 12:22:13 2005
From: fedora at wir-sind-cool.org (Michael Schwendt)
Date: Wed, 23 Mar 2005 13:22:13 +0100
Subject: FC4 Test 1 and Matrox G550 (no text consoles)
In-Reply-To: <4240A1D7.1030003@israel-jugendtag.ch>
References: <4240A1D7.1030003@israel-jugendtag.ch>
Message-ID: <20050323132213.2f897731.fedora@wir-sind-cool.org>

On Tue, 22 Mar 2005 23:53:11 +0100, Roland K?ser wrote:

> Hallo
> 
> I've installed the FC4 Test 1 on a System with a Matrox G550. The start 
> of the XServer causes the unusability of the text consoles. It seems 
> that the xorg G550 driver reconfigures the Graphics card on a low level 
> so even when the X is terminated (in runlevel 3) the text consoles 
> remains unusable. Does anybody have an idea of this behavior?
> I've installed the same distribution on a machine with a ATI card with a 
> normal behavior when switching to text consoles or stoping the X (in 
> runlevel 3). Has there been some major changes in the xorg Matrox driver?
> 
> Roland Kaeser
> 

It's in bugzilla.redhat.com already, e.g. http://bugzilla.redhat.com/151252 and,
IIRC, also affects other graphics adapters and chipsets.




From gauravp at hclcomnet.co.in  Wed Mar 23 12:52:58 2005
From: gauravp at hclcomnet.co.in (gaurav)
Date: Wed, 23 Mar 2005 18:22:58 +0530
Subject: Stateless linux
In-Reply-To: <20050323121543.82712.qmail@web8501.mail.in.yahoo.com>
References: <20050323121543.82712.qmail@web8501.mail.in.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <424166AA.3090304@hclcomnet.co.in>

Rahul Sundaram wrote:

>--- gaurav  wrote:
>
>  
>
>>I was just  wondering how hard this concept of state
>>less Linux will be 
>>to port to other distro (like debian) ? any idea if
>>there code written 
>>od code written specifically for fedora or its just
>>collection of 
>>unities and scripts . 
>>    
>>
>
>its in a highly experimental stage now. once its
>complete it can definitely be ported to other
>distributions if people work on it. if you have a
>interest in it poke into the current code in cvs yourself
>  
>
i  would request  Redhat (if possible) to   start a new mailing  list  
dedicated to stateless  linux where a group dedicated developers can 
work  as I think this project has huge potential  :-)

>Regards
>Rahul Sundaram
>
>
>		
>__________________________________ 
>Do you Yahoo!? 
>Yahoo! Mail - Easier than ever with enhanced search. Learn more. 
>http://info.mail.yahoo.com/mail_250
>
>  
>



From roli at israel-jugendtag.ch  Wed Mar 23 13:03:41 2005
From: roli at israel-jugendtag.ch (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Roland_K=E4ser?=)
Date: Wed, 23 Mar 2005 14:03:41 +0100
Subject: FC4 Test 1 and Matrox G550 (no text consoles)
In-Reply-To: <20050323132213.2f897731.fedora@wir-sind-cool.org>
References: <4240A1D7.1030003@israel-jugendtag.ch>
	<20050323132213.2f897731.fedora@wir-sind-cool.org>
Message-ID: <4241692D.1050706@israel-jugendtag.ch>

Hello

I've searched in bugzilla but could not find any bug description related 
to. Sorry not searched good enough.

Roland

Michael Schwendt wrote:
> On Tue, 22 Mar 2005 23:53:11 +0100, Roland K?ser wrote:
> 
> 
>>Hallo
>>
>>I've installed the FC4 Test 1 on a System with a Matrox G550. The start 
>>of the XServer causes the unusability of the text consoles. It seems 
>>that the xorg G550 driver reconfigures the Graphics card on a low level 
>>so even when the X is terminated (in runlevel 3) the text consoles 
>>remains unusable. Does anybody have an idea of this behavior?
>>I've installed the same distribution on a machine with a ATI card with a 
>>normal behavior when switching to text consoles or stoping the X (in 
>>runlevel 3). Has there been some major changes in the xorg Matrox driver?
>>
>>Roland Kaeser
>>
> 
> 
> It's in bugzilla.redhat.com already, e.g. http://bugzilla.redhat.com/151252 and,
> IIRC, also affects other graphics adapters and chipsets.
> 
> 



From jdesbonnet at gmail.com  Wed Mar 23 13:22:20 2005
From: jdesbonnet at gmail.com (Joe Desbonnet)
Date: Wed, 23 Mar 2005 13:22:20 +0000
Subject: A more efficient up2date service using binary diffs
In-Reply-To: <1cef3e9505032119097b58affc@mail.gmail.com>
References: <20050315151205.A25119@tiki-lounge.com>
	<1cef3e9505031606061a6e2cbe@mail.gmail.com>
	<1110983501.6211.29.camel@angua.localnet>
	<1111049074.3353.13.camel@localhost.localdomain>
	<1111051720.20402.3.camel@angua.localnet>
	<1cef3e95050317040716ef0c83@mail.gmail.com>
	<1111062365.20402.26.camel@angua.localnet>
	<20050317140545.GC19886@devserv.devel.redhat.com>
	
	<1cef3e9505032119097b58affc@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <1cef3e95050323052215f31859@mail.gmail.com>

Just a quick followup: I finally managed to cobble together a machine
so that I could do a full test (FC3 fresh install -> current).
Unfortunately a bug in the 0.1.0 release prevented the test from
working -- I wasn't handlng byte range requests properly. That's fixed
now and I'll post a new release in the next 1 or 2 days once I've
finished testing.

Interim results are encouraging: overall bandwidth savings between 66
- 78% (at the expense of local processing power -- those with slow
machines on fast links may not benefit).

Joe.


On Tue, 22 Mar 2005 03:09:07 +0000, Joe Desbonnet  wrote:
> The first version of my delta compression RPM virtual repository /
> proxy server is ready. This is just a proof-of-concept at the moment,
> but it may be good enough to be useful to some. Here are the release
> notes: http://www.wombat.ie/software/rpmdc/releasenotes-0.1.0.html
> 
> Right now you need to have the following to get it to work:
>   * Jakarta Tomcat 4.1.31
>   * Sun JDK 1.4.2
> 
> It may work with other servlet containers and JavaVMs but that is the
> only combination I had time to test so far. If it proves useful it
> should be possible to remove the Tomcat dependency and perhaps compile
> to navative with gcj (?).
> 
> I've created a delta repository to work with this software here:
> http://rpmdelta.wombat.ie/rpmdelta/fc3/i386/
> 
> That repository covers most of the updates for FC3/i386 and is only
> 250MB in size (compared to over 1GB for the RPMs).
> 
> The release is available here:
> http://www.wombat.ie/software/rpmdc/downloads/rpmdc-0.1.0.tar.gz
> 
> Joe.
>



From buildsys at redhat.com  Wed Mar 23 13:24:55 2005
From: buildsys at redhat.com (Build System)
Date: Wed, 23 Mar 2005 08:24:55 -0500
Subject: rawhide report: 20050323 changes
Message-ID: <200503231324.j2NDOtrq010402@porkchop.devel.redhat.com>

 

 
Updated Packages:

Pyrex-0:0.9.3-1
---------------
* Tue Mar 22 2005 Jeremy Katz  - 0.9.3-0
- update to 0.9.3
- add patch to fix generated code to build with gcc4
- require python-abi and python-devel instead of conflicting with 
  newer python-devel

anaconda-10.2.0.30-1
--------------------
* Tue Mar 22 2005 Chris Lumens  10.2.0.30-1
- Try harder on the libstdc++ include.
- Fix /etc/resolv.conf fir interactive kickstart installs (#151472).

eclipse-1:3.1.0_fc-0.M5.13
--------------------------
* Fri Mar 18 2005 Andrew Overholt  3.1.0_fc-0.M5.13
- Re-add compilation of resources.jar.
- Backport bootstrapping patch.
- Add Requires: java-1.4.2-gcj-compat.
- Modified find patch courtesy Ziga Mahkovec (RH#149927#).
- Compile with -O2 on ppc as well.
- Add jsch, jakarta-commons-modeler, and mx4j symlinking.
- Make use of gcj-dbtool -f to create databases in install.
- Use system-wide classmap.db.
- Remove *.jarswithnativelibs from files sections.
- Update mozilla dependency.

* Mon Mar 07 2005 Ben Konrath  3.1.0_fc-0.M5.12
- Add activeHelpSample.jar patch.
- Change to Fedora M-build splash screen.
- Add find patch courtesy Ziga Mahkovec (RH#149927#)
- Build native stuff with -O2 on i386.

* Mon Mar 07 2005 Andrew Overholt  3.1.0_fc-0.M5.11
- Add s390 and s390x patches.
- Don't build for them, though, due to gcc bug and Eclipse building issue.
- Add xorg-x11-devel BuildRequires.

gdb-6.3.0.0-1.3
---------------
* Tue Mar 22 2005 Jeff Johnston 	6.3.0.0-1.3
- Bump up release number.

* Thu Mar 17 2005 Jeff Johnston 	6.3.0.0-1.1
- Remove warnings that cause errors when compiled with gcc4 and -Werror.

* Wed Mar 16 2005 Elliot Lee 
- rebuilt

gimp-2:2.2.4-5
--------------
* Tue Mar 22 2005 Nils Philippsen 
- install convenience symlinks for man pages

* Fri Mar 11 2005 Nils Philippsen 
- don't refer to freefonts and sharefonts in %description

gzip-1.3.5-2
------------
* Tue Mar 22 2005 Tomas Mraz  1.3.5-2
- upstream 1.3.5
- dropped long ago obsolete dirinfo patch
- escape file names in zgrep (#123012)
- make stack in match.S nonexecutable

* Fri Mar 04 2005 Jiri Ryska 
- rebuilt

* Mon Dec 13 2004 Ivana Varekova 
- fix patch - remove brackets

hal-0.5.0.cvs20050322b-1
------------------------
* Tue Mar 22 2005 David Zeuthen  0.5.0.cvs20050322b-1
- Another new snapshot from upstream CVS

* Tue Mar 22 2005 David Zeuthen  0.5.0.cvs20050322-1
- New snapshot from upstream CVS

krb5-auth-dialog-0.2-5
----------------------
* Tue Mar 22 2005 Nalin Dahyabhai  0.2-5
- Change Requires: krb5 to krb5-libs, repeat $ -> % fix for build requirements.
lvm2-2.01.08-1.0
----------------
* Tue Mar 22 2005 Alasdair Kergon  - 2.01.08-1.0
- Improve detection of external changes affecting internal cache.
- Add clustered VG attribute.
- Suppress rmdir opendir error message.

mozilla-37:1.7.6-2
------------------
* Tue Mar 22 2005 Christopher Aillon  37:1.7.6-2
- Update to 1.7.6 final version
- Add patch from blizzard to hopefully fix issue with italic rendering
  with some fonts (e.g. Tahoma)

* Wed Mar 16 2005 Christopher Aillon 
- Correct the location for the gre.conf to /etc/gre.d/

perl-RPM2-0.66-9
----------------
* Tue Mar 22 2005 Joe Orton  0.66-9
- rebuild

python-ldap-0:2.0.6-4
---------------------
* Tue Mar 22 2005 Warren Togami  - 2.0.6-4
- add LICENCE (#150842)
- simplify python reqs
- remove invalid rpath

ruby-1.8.2-6
------------
* Tue Mar 22 2005 Akira TAGOH  - 1.8.2-6
- ruby-1.8.2-strscan-memset.patch: fixed an wrong usage of memset(3).

selinux-policy-strict-1.23.4-3
------------------------------
* Tue Mar 22 2005 Dan Walsh  1.23.4-3
- More tightening of name_connect
- Cleanups to httpd_unconfined_script_t

* Mon Mar 21 2005 Dan Walsh  1.23.4-1
- Update from NSA
- Add logfile tmpfs_t associate privs
- Start adding name_connect code
- Add httpd_unconfined_script_t

selinux-policy-targeted-1.23.4-3
--------------------------------
* Tue Mar 22 2005 Dan Walsh  1.23.4-3
- More tightening of name_connect
- Cleanups to httpd_unconfined_script_t

* Mon Mar 21 2005 Dan Walsh  1.23.4-1
- Update from NSA
- Add logfile tmpfs_t associate privs
- Start adding name_connect code
- Add httpd_unconfined_script_t

sip-4.2.1-1
-----------
* Wed Mar 23 2005 Than Ngo  4.2.1-1
- 4.2.1

strace-4.5.11-1
---------------
* Tue Mar 22 2005 Roland McGrath  - 4.5.11-1
- Build tweaks.
- Note 4.5.10 select fix (#151570).

subversion-1.1.3-8
------------------
* Tue Mar 22 2005 Joe Orton  1.1.3-8
- further swig bindings fix (upstream via Max Bowsher, #151798)
- fix perl File::Path dependency in filter-requires.sh

* Tue Mar 22 2005 Joe Orton  1.1.3-7
- restore swig bindings support (from upstream via Max Bowsher, #141343)
- tweak SELinux commentary in default subversion.conf

system-config-nfs-1.3.5-1
-------------------------
* Tue Mar 22 2005 Nils Philippsen  1.3.5-1
- don't always show parse error dialog

tftp-0.40-5
-----------
* Wed Mar 23 2005 Radek Vokal  0.40-5
- use tftp-xinetd from tarball (#143589)

uucp-1.07-8
-----------
* Wed Mar 23 2005 Peter Vrabec  1.07-8
- add texi2html to BuildRequires

* Wed Mar 16 2005 Peter Vrabec 
- include the default xinetd file

vsftpd-2.0.3-1
--------------
* Wed Mar 23 2005 Radek Vokal  2.0.3-1
- new release, fixes #106416 and #134541

* Mon Mar 14 2005 Radek Vokal  2.0.3-pre2
- prerelease, fixes IPv6 issues

xdelta-1.1.3-16
---------------
* Wed Mar 23 2005 Jindrich Novy  1.1.3-16
- fix conflicting storage classes that causes build failure with gcc4
- gcc4 warnfixes
- create backups for patches
- drop libtool BuildRequires
- rebuild with gcc4

xscreensaver-1:4.21-1
---------------------
* Sun Mar 20 2005 Ray Strode  1:4.21-1
- Update to xscreensaver-4.21.
- Update spec file to better match new upstream spec file.



From sds at tycho.nsa.gov  Wed Mar 23 13:40:56 2005
From: sds at tycho.nsa.gov (Stephen Smalley)
Date: Wed, 23 Mar 2005 08:40:56 -0500
Subject: named log with selinux
In-Reply-To: <42412EAF.3030807@bppiac.hu>
References: <42412EAF.3030807@bppiac.hu>
Message-ID: <1111585256.21107.37.camel@moss-spartans.epoch.ncsc.mil>

On Wed, 2005-03-23 at 09:54 +0100, Farkas Levente wrote:
> it seems there is no named_log_t defined in the current selinux policy 
> files (both on rhel4 and fc3). it would be useful to define such even if 
> the current default named don't log enything somebody (like me) would 
> like to log something. and got the following errors:

File a bug against the policy, please, and next time, please post to
fedora-selinux-list.

> what more (i don't know why) when i try to relabel the log files to 
> named_t i've got these errors:
> ---------------------------------
> Mar 23 09:50:54 blue kernel: audit(1111567854.706:0): avc:  denied  { 
> relabelto } for  pid=2922 exe=/usr/bin/chcon name=named-auth dev=md0 
> ino=4670608 scontext=root:system_r:unconfined_t 
> tcontext=root:object_r:named_t tclass=file

named_t is for the named process, not for any files (except for the
associated /proc/pid entries for the named process), which is why this
is being denied.  You want log_domain(named) added to the named policy
so that a named_log_t type will be defined and used for any log files
created by named under /var/log.

-- 
Stephen Smalley 
National Security Agency



From mls at suse.de  Wed Mar 23 13:54:48 2005
From: mls at suse.de (Michael Schroeder)
Date: Wed, 23 Mar 2005 14:54:48 +0100
Subject: A more efficient up2date service using binary diffs
In-Reply-To: <1cef3e95050323052215f31859@mail.gmail.com>
References: <1cef3e9505031606061a6e2cbe@mail.gmail.com>
	<1110983501.6211.29.camel@angua.localnet>
	<1111049074.3353.13.camel@localhost.localdomain>
	<1111051720.20402.3.camel@angua.localnet>
	<1cef3e95050317040716ef0c83@mail.gmail.com>
	<1111062365.20402.26.camel@angua.localnet>
	<20050317140545.GC19886@devserv.devel.redhat.com>
	
	<1cef3e9505032119097b58affc@mail.gmail.com>
	<1cef3e95050323052215f31859@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <20050323135448.GA9461@suse.de>

On Wed, Mar 23, 2005 at 01:22:20PM +0000, Joe Desbonnet wrote:
> Just a quick followup: I finally managed to cobble together a machine
> so that I could do a full test (FC3 fresh install -> current).
> Unfortunately a bug in the 0.1.0 release prevented the test from
> working -- I wasn't handlng byte range requests properly. That's fixed
> now and I'll post a new release in the next 1 or 2 days once I've
> finished testing.
> 
> Interim results are encouraging: overall bandwidth savings between 66
> - 78% (at the expense of local processing power -- those with slow
> machines on fast links may not benefit).

Hmm, compression rate should even be a bit better than that, at
least that's what we (SuSE) see with the deltarpms.

As most of you don't seem to know how our deltarpms work (and
as I'm the author ;-) ) here's a short description:

Our deltarpms are a binary diff of the rpm payload with the cpio
header information dropped, i.e. only the file contents. Files
with verify flags indicating that they might change (e.g. config
files) are excluded from the diff.

Because of this, applying a deltarpm can work with either the old
rpm or files from the filesystem, i.e. there's no need to keep
the old rpms. As one can't be 100% sure that the files are still
intact one can test if a deltarpm would apply, for this check only
the so called signature is necessary. So the update process can
first get the signature, test if the delta would work, and fall
back to the full rpm if the test fails.

The code is available from
    ftp://ftp.suse.com/pub/projects/deltarpm/deltarpm-2.2.tar.bz2

Creating and applying deltarpms is very easy:

    makedeltarpm oldrpm newrpm deltarpm

creates deltarpm,

    applydeltarpm deltarpm newrpm2

re-creates newrpm. You can also use

    applydeltarpm -r oldrpm deltarpm newrpm2

if you don't want to use files from the filesystem. Check out the 
manpage for more options. Makedeltarpm uses a modified bsdiff which
uses a hash instead of a suffix array to speed things up.

Btw, Seth Vidal claimed that the Zen/Red Carpet people hate deltarpms.
I don't know why he thinks so, they don't even know about deltarpms,
how could they hate them?

Cheers,
  Michael.

-- 
Michael Schroeder                                   mls at suse.de
main(_){while(_=~getchar())putchar(~_-1/(~(_|32)/13*2-11)*13);}



From paul at all-the-johnsons.co.uk  Wed Mar 23 13:58:24 2005
From: paul at all-the-johnsons.co.uk (Paul)
Date: Wed, 23 Mar 2005 13:58:24 +0000
Subject: rawhide report: 20050323 changes
In-Reply-To: <200503231324.j2NDOtrq010402@porkchop.devel.redhat.com>
References: <200503231324.j2NDOtrq010402@porkchop.devel.redhat.com>
Message-ID: <1111586304.5050.137.camel@localhost.localdomain>

Hi,

> Updated Packages:

OOo not make it in time? Drat!

TTFN

Paul
-- 
"It is often said that something cannot be libel if it is the truth.
This has had to be amended to 'something cannot be libel if it is the
truth or if the bank balance says otherwise'" - US Today
-------------- next part --------------
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From cra at WPI.EDU  Wed Mar 23 14:31:42 2005
From: cra at WPI.EDU (Chuck R. Anderson)
Date: Wed, 23 Mar 2005 09:31:42 -0500
Subject: DVD burning goosed?
In-Reply-To: <1111573036.5050.118.camel@localhost.localdomain>
References: <1111522811.5050.82.camel@localhost.localdomain>
	<1111525035.18891.2.camel@localhost.localdomain>
	<1111533520.5050.94.camel@localhost.localdomain>
	<1111535743.3741.5.camel@jellyfish.redfishdemo.com>
	<54302.192.54.193.35.1111569794.squirrel@rousalka.dyndns.org>
	<1111573036.5050.118.camel@localhost.localdomain>
Message-ID: <20050323143142.GB26367@angus.ind.WPI.EDU>

On Wed, Mar 23, 2005 at 10:17:16AM +0000, Paul wrote:
> -test for those who get their updates from the test yum repository
> -devel for those who get their updates from the devel yum repository

There is no test update repository, though.  Everyone who uses a test
release gets updates from the development repository.  I think
devel/rawhide testing/bug discussion should go in fedora-test-list,
leaving fedora-devel-list for software development discussions.



From nphilipp at redhat.com  Wed Mar 23 15:38:27 2005
From: nphilipp at redhat.com (Nils Philippsen)
Date: Wed, 23 Mar 2005 16:38:27 +0100
Subject: Rawhide NetworkManager
In-Reply-To: <1111513344.8928.15.camel@dcbw.boston.redhat.com>
References: <1111160849.32293.23.camel@dch.TQMcube.com>
	
	<1111505833.7279.19.camel@wombat.tiptoe.de>
	<1111507012.6338.13.camel@dcbw.boston.redhat.com>
	<1111511184.7279.36.camel@wombat.tiptoe.de>
	<1111513344.8928.15.camel@dcbw.boston.redhat.com>
Message-ID: <1111592307.25135.27.camel@wombat.tiptoe.de>

On Tue, 2005-03-22 at 12:42 -0500, Dan Williams wrote:
> On Tue, 2005-03-22 at 18:06 +0100, Nils Philippsen wrote:
> > On Tue, 2005-03-22 at 10:56 -0500, Dan Williams wrote:
> > 
> > > 3) Full access to DHCP options.  NetworkManager provides a DBUS API for
> > > applications to access DHCP options returned by the server.  For
> > > example, ntpd could listen to NetworkManager events and then restart
> > > itself with the new server address without ever having to read a config
> > > file.  xchat could listen to events and find out the corporate IRC
> > > server to connect to without ever needing user intervention.  There's a
> > > wealth of information passed along in DHCP options that applications can
> > > use.  I'm unaware of any method that "dhclient" has that could provide
> > > this information to NetworkManager.
> > 
> > Again, I currently use FC3 stuff, so I'm not sure how this applies here,
> > but when I last looked at it, only few information where passed to the
> > NMTester.py script in the examples directory. Maybe I got things wrong
> > (perhaps the app has to ask for DHCP specific stuff -- I'm a complete
> 
> Yes, the app must ask for the dhcp options itself.  This should be
> fairly easy from Python.  In pseudo code:
> 
> object_path = "/org/freedesktop/NetworkManager/DhcpOptions"
> interface = "org.freedesktop.NetworkManager.DhcpOptions"
> 
> type = dbus_call(object_path, interface, "getType", "NTP Servers")
> if type == DBUS_TYPE_ARRAY
>     ip_ary = dbus_call(object_path, interface, "getIntegerv", "NTP
> Servers")
>     ip = ip_ary[0]
> else
>     ip = dbus_call(object_path, interface, "getInteger", "NTP Servers")

Hmm, I couldn't make much heads or tails out of it, mostly because I
don't know what's pseudo in there and what not ;-), anyway: "dbus_call"
isn't wrapped in python. I tried to access the DHCP options like this:

--- 8< ---
import dbus

service = 'org.freedesktop.NetworkManager'
object_path = "/org/freedesktop/NetworkManager/DhcpOptions"
interface = "org.freedesktop.NetworkManager.DhcpOptions"

bus = dbus.Bus (dbus.Bus.TYPE_SYSTEM)
NWM_service = bus.get_service (service)
dhcpOptions = NWM_service.get_object (object_path, interface)
--- >8 ---

but the resulting dhcpOptions options doesn't have many methods to begin
with:

dhcpOptions: ['__doc__', '__getattr__', '__init__', '__module__',
'_interface', '_object_path', '_service', 'connect_to_signal']

Any clues for me here?

> and now "ip" contains the uint32 representation of an IP address for the
> first ntp server returned by the DHCP server, if any.  Remember that the
> server can return an arbitrary # of servers.
> 
> In the future, the DHCP options API from NetworkManager will always
> return an array, even for options that can only have 1 item.  That
> greatly simplifies bindings and code.
> 
> > neophyte when it comes to dbus e.a.), but I didn't see any information
> > related to DHCP there. Furthermore: AFAIK DHCP options get only
> > transmitted from the server when the client asks for them, so how would
> > I go about "custom" DHCP options I wanted to evaluate?
> 
> The client can request DHCP options from the server, but the server
> doesn't necessarily have to provide them.  The server is also free to
> provide more options than the client asked for I believe.

I found that you don't e.g. get the interface-mtu unless you ask for it.
It would be good if people could set it somewhere, even more so for non-
standard custom options that you want to be able to ask from NWM later
on in some python script (assuming you get it working of course).

Nils
-- 
     Nils Philippsen    /    Red Hat    /    nphilipp at redhat.com
"They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary
 safety deserve neither liberty nor safety."     -- B. Franklin, 1759
 PGP fingerprint:  C4A8 9474 5C4C ADE3 2B8F  656D 47D8 9B65 6951 3011



From rstrode at redhat.com  Wed Mar 23 16:37:27 2005
From: rstrode at redhat.com (Ray Strode)
Date: Wed, 23 Mar 2005 11:37:27 -0500
Subject: Rawhide NetworkManager
In-Reply-To: <1111592307.25135.27.camel@wombat.tiptoe.de>
References: <1111160849.32293.23.camel@dch.TQMcube.com>
	
	<1111505833.7279.19.camel@wombat.tiptoe.de>
	<1111507012.6338.13.camel@dcbw.boston.redhat.com>
	<1111511184.7279.36.camel@wombat.tiptoe.de>
	<1111513344.8928.15.camel@dcbw.boston.redhat.com>
	<1111592307.25135.27.camel@wombat.tiptoe.de>
Message-ID: <1111595848.5004.4.camel@localhost.localdomain>

Hi Nils,
> import dbus
> 
> service = 'org.freedesktop.NetworkManager'
> object_path = "/org/freedesktop/NetworkManager/DhcpOptions"
> interface = "org.freedesktop.NetworkManager.DhcpOptions"
> 
> bus = dbus.Bus (dbus.Bus.TYPE_SYSTEM)
> NWM_service = bus.get_service (service)
> dhcpOptions = NWM_service.get_object (object_path, interface)
> --- >8 ---
> 
> but the resulting dhcpOptions options doesn't have many methods to begin
> with:
> 
> dhcpOptions: ['__doc__', '__getattr__', '__init__', '__module__',
> '_interface', '_object_path', '_service', 'connect_to_signal']
The python bindings to dbus don't know about methods ahead of time.  You
just have to call them and see what happens.
e.g.,
type = dhcpOptions.getType("NTP Servers")

--Ray




From nphilipp at redhat.com  Wed Mar 23 17:32:09 2005
From: nphilipp at redhat.com (Nils Philippsen)
Date: Wed, 23 Mar 2005 18:32:09 +0100
Subject: Rawhide NetworkManager
In-Reply-To: <1111595848.5004.4.camel@localhost.localdomain>
References: <1111160849.32293.23.camel@dch.TQMcube.com>
	
	<1111505833.7279.19.camel@wombat.tiptoe.de>
	<1111507012.6338.13.camel@dcbw.boston.redhat.com>
	<1111511184.7279.36.camel@wombat.tiptoe.de>
	<1111513344.8928.15.camel@dcbw.boston.redhat.com>
	<1111592307.25135.27.camel@wombat.tiptoe.de>
	<1111595848.5004.4.camel@localhost.localdomain>
Message-ID: <1111599130.18546.1.camel@wombat.tiptoe.de>

On Wed, 2005-03-23 at 11:37 -0500, Ray Strode wrote:
> Hi Nils,
> > import dbus
> > 
> > service = 'org.freedesktop.NetworkManager'
> > object_path = "/org/freedesktop/NetworkManager/DhcpOptions"
> > interface = "org.freedesktop.NetworkManager.DhcpOptions"
> > 
> > bus = dbus.Bus (dbus.Bus.TYPE_SYSTEM)
> > NWM_service = bus.get_service (service)
> > dhcpOptions = NWM_service.get_object (object_path, interface)
> > --- >8 ---
> > 
> > but the resulting dhcpOptions options doesn't have many methods to begin
> > with:
> > 
> > dhcpOptions: ['__doc__', '__getattr__', '__init__', '__module__',
> > '_interface', '_object_path', '_service', 'connect_to_signal']
> The python bindings to dbus don't know about methods ahead of time.  You
> just have to call them and see what happens.
> e.g.,
> type = dhcpOptions.getType("NTP Servers")

Hmm, how can I find out what methods a remote object implements -- dir()
obviously doesn't tell me there is getType(), but it worked kind of:

Traceback (most recent call last):
  File "./NetworkManagerTinkerer.py", line 18, in ?
    print dhcpOptions.getType ('NTP Servers')
  File "/usr/lib/python2.3/site-packages/dbus.py", line 208, in __call__
    reply_message = self._connection.send_with_reply_and_block(message,
5000)
  File "dbus_bindings.pyx", line 557, in
dbus_bindings.Connection.send_with_reply_and_block
dbus_bindings.DBusException: The requested DHCP option does not exist.

Thanks,
Nils
-- 
     Nils Philippsen    /    Red Hat    /    nphilipp at redhat.com
"They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary
 safety deserve neither liberty nor safety."     -- B. Franklin, 1759
 PGP fingerprint:  C4A8 9474 5C4C ADE3 2B8F  656D 47D8 9B65 6951 3011



From dcbw at redhat.com  Wed Mar 23 17:35:54 2005
From: dcbw at redhat.com (Dan Williams)
Date: Wed, 23 Mar 2005 12:35:54 -0500
Subject: Rawhide NetworkManager
In-Reply-To: <1111599130.18546.1.camel@wombat.tiptoe.de>
References: <1111160849.32293.23.camel@dch.TQMcube.com>
	
	<1111505833.7279.19.camel@wombat.tiptoe.de>
	<1111507012.6338.13.camel@dcbw.boston.redhat.com>
	<1111511184.7279.36.camel@wombat.tiptoe.de>
	<1111513344.8928.15.camel@dcbw.boston.redhat.com>
	<1111592307.25135.27.camel@wombat.tiptoe.de>
	<1111595848.5004.4.camel@localhost.localdomain>
	<1111599130.18546.1.camel@wombat.tiptoe.de>
Message-ID: <1111599354.7764.2.camel@dcbw.boston.redhat.com>

On Wed, 2005-03-23 at 18:32 +0100, Nils Philippsen wrote:
> Traceback (most recent call last):
>   File "./NetworkManagerTinkerer.py", line 18, in ?
>     print dhcpOptions.getType ('NTP Servers')
>   File "/usr/lib/python2.3/site-packages/dbus.py", line 208, in __call__
>     reply_message = self._connection.send_with_reply_and_block(message,
> 5000)
>   File "dbus_bindings.pyx", line 557, in
> dbus_bindings.Connection.send_with_reply_and_block
> dbus_bindings.DBusException: The requested DHCP option does not exist.

Ok, try "getType(41)" instead...  Technically you can pass both the
string or the DHCP Option ID and it should match the string->option ID
internally if you pass a string, but perhaps there's a bug there.

Dan



From Fedora at TQMcube.com  Wed Mar 23 18:26:18 2005
From: Fedora at TQMcube.com (David Cary Hart)
Date: Wed, 23 Mar 2005 13:26:18 -0500
Subject: Rawhide NetworkManager
In-Reply-To: <1111599130.18546.1.camel@wombat.tiptoe.de>
References: <1111160849.32293.23.camel@dch.TQMcube.com>
	
	<1111505833.7279.19.camel@wombat.tiptoe.de>
	<1111507012.6338.13.camel@dcbw.boston.redhat.com>
	<1111511184.7279.36.camel@wombat.tiptoe.de>
	<1111513344.8928.15.camel@dcbw.boston.redhat.com>
	<1111592307.25135.27.camel@wombat.tiptoe.de>
	<1111595848.5004.4.camel@localhost.localdomain>
	<1111599130.18546.1.camel@wombat.tiptoe.de>
Message-ID: <1111602378.24684.3.camel@dch.TQMcube.com>

I'm beginning to wonder if a bridge might not be a better solution. I've
tried and it creates too much latency but I suspect that it can be tuned
and, ultimately, provide a better solution than NetworkManager.
-- 
________________________________________________________________________
Kill Spam at the Source: http://www.TQMcube.com/spam_trap.htm
Today's Spam Trap Adds:  http://www.TQMcube.com/BlockedToday
RBLDNSD HowTo:           http://www.TQMcube.com/rbldnsd.htm



From dcbw at redhat.com  Wed Mar 23 18:33:00 2005
From: dcbw at redhat.com (Dan Williams)
Date: Wed, 23 Mar 2005 13:33:00 -0500
Subject: Rawhide NetworkManager
In-Reply-To: <1111599130.18546.1.camel@wombat.tiptoe.de>
References: <1111160849.32293.23.camel@dch.TQMcube.com>
	
	<1111505833.7279.19.camel@wombat.tiptoe.de>
	<1111507012.6338.13.camel@dcbw.boston.redhat.com>
	<1111511184.7279.36.camel@wombat.tiptoe.de>
	<1111513344.8928.15.camel@dcbw.boston.redhat.com>
	<1111592307.25135.27.camel@wombat.tiptoe.de>
	<1111595848.5004.4.camel@localhost.localdomain>
	<1111599130.18546.1.camel@wombat.tiptoe.de>
Message-ID: <1111602780.7764.5.camel@dcbw.boston.redhat.com>

On Wed, 2005-03-23 at 18:32 +0100, Nils Philippsen wrote:
> Hmm, how can I find out what methods a remote object implements -- dir()
> obviously doesn't tell me there is getType(), but it worked kind of:
> 
> Traceback (most recent call last):
>   File "./NetworkManagerTinkerer.py", line 18, in ?
>     print dhcpOptions.getType ('NTP Servers')
>   File "/usr/lib/python2.3/site-packages/dbus.py", line 208, in __call__
>     reply_message = self._connection.send_with_reply_and_block(message,
> 5000)
>   File "dbus_bindings.pyx", line 557, in
> dbus_bindings.Connection.send_with_reply_and_block
> dbus_bindings.DBusException: The requested DHCP option does not exist.

The other issue here might be that the server didn't reply with this
option at all.  Which itself might be because we didn't explicitly
request it, or because it just doesn't have that option set.  For
example, the office DHCP servers return the NTP server option, but
wireless routers usually do not.  This is what just happened to me when
I switched to a wireless connection here at the office.  I suspect that
apps will have to have intelligent fallbacks.

Dan



From johnp at redhat.com  Wed Mar 23 21:00:57 2005
From: johnp at redhat.com (John (J5) Palmieri)
Date: Wed, 23 Mar 2005 16:00:57 -0500
Subject: Rawhide NetworkManager
In-Reply-To: <1111599130.18546.1.camel@wombat.tiptoe.de>
References: <1111160849.32293.23.camel@dch.TQMcube.com>
	
	<1111505833.7279.19.camel@wombat.tiptoe.de>
	<1111507012.6338.13.camel@dcbw.boston.redhat.com>
	<1111511184.7279.36.camel@wombat.tiptoe.de>
	<1111513344.8928.15.camel@dcbw.boston.redhat.com>
	<1111592307.25135.27.camel@wombat.tiptoe.de>
	<1111595848.5004.4.camel@localhost.localdomain>
	<1111599130.18546.1.camel@wombat.tiptoe.de>
Message-ID: <1111611658.30014.18.camel@remedyz.boston.redhat.com>

On Wed, 2005-03-23 at 18:32 +0100, Nils Philippsen wrote:
> On Wed, 2005-03-23 at 11:37 -0500, Ray Strode wrote:
> > Hi Nils,
> > > import dbus
> > > 
> > > service = 'org.freedesktop.NetworkManager'
> > > object_path = "/org/freedesktop/NetworkManager/DhcpOptions"
> > > interface = "org.freedesktop.NetworkManager.DhcpOptions"
> > > 
> > > bus = dbus.Bus (dbus.Bus.TYPE_SYSTEM)
> > > NWM_service = bus.get_service (service)
> > > dhcpOptions = NWM_service.get_object (object_path, interface)
> > > --- >8 ---
> > > 
> > > but the resulting dhcpOptions options doesn't have many methods to begin
> > > with:
> > > 
> > > dhcpOptions: ['__doc__', '__getattr__', '__init__', '__module__',
> > > '_interface', '_object_path', '_service', 'connect_to_signal']
> > The python bindings to dbus don't know about methods ahead of time.  You
> > just have to call them and see what happens.
> > e.g.,
> > type = dhcpOptions.getType("NTP Servers")
> 
> Hmm, how can I find out what methods a remote object implements -- dir()
> obviously doesn't tell me there is getType(), but it worked kind of:
> 
> Traceback (most recent call last):
>   File "./NetworkManagerTinkerer.py", line 18, in ?
>     print dhcpOptions.getType ('NTP Servers')
>   File "/usr/lib/python2.3/site-packages/dbus.py", line 208, in __call__
>     reply_message = self._connection.send_with_reply_and_block(message,
> 5000)
>   File "dbus_bindings.pyx", line 557, in
> dbus_bindings.Connection.send_with_reply_and_block
> dbus_bindings.DBusException: The requested DHCP option does not exist.

You can't unless NetworkManager exports introspection.  I want to
implement it in the python bindings when I have time (in which case I
might be able to get dir() to work) but the service must also export the
introspection data.  The best way to find out about interfaces is to
read the NetworkManager spec or troll through the code.

-- 
John (J5) Palmieri
Associate Software Engineer
Desktop Group
Red Hat, Inc.
Blog: http://martianrock.com



From sig at netdot.net  Wed Mar 23 21:19:53 2005
From: sig at netdot.net (Aaron VanDevender)
Date: Wed, 23 Mar 2005 15:19:53 -0600
Subject: Self-Introduction: Aaron VanDevender
In-Reply-To: <1111520846.19235.54.camel@cutter>
References: <1111520650.6034.26.camel@vandvndr.physics.uiuc.edu>
	<1111520846.19235.54.camel@cutter>
Message-ID: <1111612794.6034.88.camel@vandvndr.physics.uiuc.edu>


I would like to see packages for JACK, rose garden, pitivi, transcode,
maybe even some low-latency kernel stuff, cinelerra, maya, CinePaint,
and OpenEXR. Basically, things you need to create sound and video, from
lowlevel device stuff, to libraries, on up to end user applications.
Obviously which packages to include will require some good judgment with
respect to MP3, CSS and some of the more legally dubious standards, but
there is still a whole bunch of good patent free multimedia stuff out
there, especially things which are based on gstreamer where the
troublesome codecs can be factored out, and possibly added in later if
need be.

On Tue, 2005-03-22 at 14:47 -0500, seth vidal wrote:
> > 5. I would like to see a complete multimedia stack in Fedora Extras
> what does that mean?
> 
> -sv
> 
> 
-- 

sig at netdot.net
Plead the First.



From rodd at clarkson.id.au  Wed Mar 23 21:29:06 2005
From: rodd at clarkson.id.au (Rodd Clarkson)
Date: Thu, 24 Mar 2005 08:29:06 +1100
Subject: DVD burning goosed?
In-Reply-To: <54302.192.54.193.35.1111569794.squirrel@rousalka.dyndns.org>
References: <1111522811.5050.82.camel@localhost.localdomain>
	<1111525035.18891.2.camel@localhost.localdomain>
	<1111533520.5050.94.camel@localhost.localdomain>
	<1111535743.3741.5.camel@jellyfish.redfishdemo.com>
	<54302.192.54.193.35.1111569794.squirrel@rousalka.dyndns.org>
Message-ID: <1111613346.3694.1.camel@jellyfish.redfishdemo.com>


> The test list is described as applying to test releases only.
> Rawhide is not a formal test release.
> I guess if someone wanted to apply all the list rules strictly now we'd
> find rawhide bug reports belong nowhere (except in bugzilla, but ML
> reports and bugzilla are not exactly the same thing)

Given that FC4-test1 has been released and that rawhide is the
repository for this test version, I would have thought that this
qualifies fedora-test-list quite nicely.


Rodd



From tromey at redhat.com  Wed Mar 23 22:47:07 2005
From: tromey at redhat.com (Tom Tromey)
Date: 23 Mar 2005 15:47:07 -0700
Subject: Self-Introduction: Aaron VanDevender
In-Reply-To: <1111612794.6034.88.camel@vandvndr.physics.uiuc.edu>
References: <1111520650.6034.26.camel@vandvndr.physics.uiuc.edu>
	<1111520846.19235.54.camel@cutter>
	<1111612794.6034.88.camel@vandvndr.physics.uiuc.edu>
Message-ID: 

>>>>> "Aaron" == Aaron VanDevender  writes:

Aaron> I would like to see packages for JACK, rose garden, pitivi, transcode,
Aaron> maybe even some low-latency kernel stuff, cinelerra, maya, CinePaint,
Aaron> and OpenEXR. Basically, things you need to create sound and video, from
Aaron> lowlevel device stuff, to libraries, on up to end user applications.

I use Planet CCRMA as a source for a lot of this stuff.
Having it in Extras would be nice though, at least if that meant it
got rebuilt on FC's schedule.

Tom



From list at bistromatic.de  Wed Mar 23 22:53:16 2005
From: list at bistromatic.de (Lars Hamann)
Date: Wed, 23 Mar 2005 23:53:16 +0100
Subject: anaconda mkfs.xfs problem
In-Reply-To: <1111446614.14015.21.camel@localhost.localdomain>
References: <1111317477.12430.51.camel@arthur.sinus>
	<1111446614.14015.21.camel@localhost.localdomain>
Message-ID: <1111618396.6581.11.camel@arthur.sinus>

On Mon, 2005-03-21 at 18:10 -0500, Peter Jones wrote:

> > So what can I do? Can I reopen the bug or something?
> 
> Make a patch.  Test it.  Mail it here once it works.

Ok. The attached patch will fix bug #151378.
At least it worked for me. The patch is against anaconda-10.2.0.28.

Regards,
   Lars

BTW: I was unable to use a anaconda-update-floppy with fc4t1. The
installer offers only HDs and CD-ROMs as updates source. Is this
intentional?  

-- 
Lars Hamann 
-------------- next part --------------
A non-text attachment was scrubbed...
Name: anaconda_mkfs_xfs.patch
Type: text/x-patch
Size: 937 bytes
Desc: not available
URL: 

From brent at linux.wku.edu  Wed Mar 23 23:11:20 2005
From: brent at linux.wku.edu (Brent Norris)
Date: Wed, 23 Mar 2005 17:11:20 -0600
Subject: PHP5 and Mysqli
Message-ID: <1111619480.17257.11.camel@Diablo>

I have read the messages a couple of days ago about the mysqli interface
for FC4.  Was there any decision made on that?

Personally I have tried compiling PHP5 with mysqli, but I don't seem to
be getting the RPM built right.  Has anyone here gotten it done
correctly that would like to share the result or how to do it?

It would seem like the logical thing to include in the new version since
it ships with the mysql version that it was meant for.
-- 
Brent Norris (http://brentnorris.net)
Assistant Technology Coordinator, Edmonson County Schools



From wtogami at redhat.com  Thu Mar 24 09:32:21 2005
From: wtogami at redhat.com (Warren Togami)
Date: Wed, 23 Mar 2005 23:32:21 -1000
Subject: rawhide report: 20050323 changes
In-Reply-To: <1111586304.5050.137.camel@localhost.localdomain>
References: <200503231324.j2NDOtrq010402@porkchop.devel.redhat.com>
	<1111586304.5050.137.camel@localhost.localdomain>
Message-ID: <42428925.7070407@redhat.com>

Paul wrote:
> Hi,
> 
> 
>>Updated Packages:
> 
> 
> OOo not make it in time? Drat!
> 
> TTFN
> 
> Paul
> 

Please stop posting on this list unless you have something useful to add 
to the development processes of Fedora.  Thus far 80% of your posts have 
been either off-topic support questions or just plain annoying.

Warren Togami
wtogami at redhat.com



From nphilipp at redhat.com  Thu Mar 24 09:59:53 2005
From: nphilipp at redhat.com (Nils Philippsen)
Date: Thu, 24 Mar 2005 10:59:53 +0100
Subject: Rawhide NetworkManager
In-Reply-To: <1111602780.7764.5.camel@dcbw.boston.redhat.com>
References: <1111160849.32293.23.camel@dch.TQMcube.com>
	
	<1111505833.7279.19.camel@wombat.tiptoe.de>
	<1111507012.6338.13.camel@dcbw.boston.redhat.com>
	<1111511184.7279.36.camel@wombat.tiptoe.de>
	<1111513344.8928.15.camel@dcbw.boston.redhat.com>
	<1111592307.25135.27.camel@wombat.tiptoe.de>
	<1111595848.5004.4.camel@localhost.localdomain>
	<1111599130.18546.1.camel@wombat.tiptoe.de>
	<1111602780.7764.5.camel@dcbw.boston.redhat.com>
Message-ID: <1111658393.6676.9.camel@gibraltar.stuttgart.redhat.com>

On Wed, 2005-03-23 at 13:33 -0500, Dan Williams wrote:
> On Wed, 2005-03-23 at 18:32 +0100, Nils Philippsen wrote:
> > Hmm, how can I find out what methods a remote object implements -- dir()
> > obviously doesn't tell me there is getType(), but it worked kind of:
> > 
> > Traceback (most recent call last):
> >   File "./NetworkManagerTinkerer.py", line 18, in ?
> >     print dhcpOptions.getType ('NTP Servers')
> >   File "/usr/lib/python2.3/site-packages/dbus.py", line 208, in __call__
> >     reply_message = self._connection.send_with_reply_and_block(message,
> > 5000)
> >   File "dbus_bindings.pyx", line 557, in
> > dbus_bindings.Connection.send_with_reply_and_block
> > dbus_bindings.DBusException: The requested DHCP option does not exist.
> 
> The other issue here might be that the server didn't reply with this
> option at all.  Which itself might be because we didn't explicitly
> request it, or because it just doesn't have that option set.  For
> example, the office DHCP servers return the NTP server option, but
> wireless routers usually do not.  This is what just happened to me when
> I switched to a wireless connection here at the office.  I suspect that
> apps will have to have intelligent fallbacks.

That's more or less what I have in mind -- try to get the DHCP option
(well, ask for it first -- e.g. I have configured my internal DHCP
server to deliver NTP servers if asked), see if it makes sense ;-) and
if one of either fails, set a default based on the network identified
(through domain names e.a.), whack some services and the like.

Nils
-- 
     Nils Philippsen    /    Red Hat    /    nphilipp at redhat.com
"They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary
 safety deserve neither liberty nor safety."     -- B. Franklin, 1759
 PGP fingerprint:  C4A8 9474 5C4C ADE3 2B8F  656D 47D8 9B65 6951 3011



From nicolas.mailhot at laposte.net  Thu Mar 24 10:08:08 2005
From: nicolas.mailhot at laposte.net (Nicolas Mailhot)
Date: Thu, 24 Mar 2005 11:08:08 +0100 (CET)
Subject: DVD burning goosed?
In-Reply-To: <1111613346.3694.1.camel@jellyfish.redfishdemo.com>
References: <1111522811.5050.82.camel@localhost.localdomain>
	<1111525035.18891.2.camel@localhost.localdomain>
	<1111533520.5050.94.camel@localhost.localdomain>
	<1111535743.3741.5.camel@jellyfish.redfishdemo.com>
	<54302.192.54.193.35.1111569794.squirrel@rousalka.dyndns.org>
	<1111613346.3694.1.camel@jellyfish.redfishdemo.com>
Message-ID: <30412.192.54.193.35.1111658888.squirrel@rousalka.dyndns.org>


On Mer 23 mars 2005 22:29, Rodd Clarkson a ?crit :
>
>> The test list is described as applying to test releases only.
>> Rawhide is not a formal test release.
>> I guess if someone wanted to apply all the list rules strictly now we'd
>> find rawhide bug reports belong nowhere (except in bugzilla, but ML
>> reports and bugzilla are not exactly the same thing)
>
> Given that FC4-test1 has been released and that rawhide is the
> repository for this test version, I would have thought that this
> qualifies fedora-test-list quite nicely.

Maybe now, but later ?
At what point is Rawhide sufficiently close to a test release to qualify
for fedora-test-list ? Always ? Only for a few weeks after a test release
? Only when it matches the formal test release ?

Regards,

-- 
Nicolas Mailhot



From jorton at redhat.com  Thu Mar 24 10:20:51 2005
From: jorton at redhat.com (Joe Orton)
Date: Thu, 24 Mar 2005 10:20:51 +0000
Subject: PHP5 and Mysqli
In-Reply-To: <1111619480.17257.11.camel@Diablo>
References: <1111619480.17257.11.camel@Diablo>
Message-ID: <20050324102051.GA8210@redhat.com>

On Wed, Mar 23, 2005 at 05:11:20PM -0600, Brent Norris wrote:
> I have read the messages a couple of days ago about the mysqli interface
> for FC4.  Was there any decision made on that?
> 
> Personally I have tried compiling PHP5 with mysqli, but I don't seem to
> be getting the RPM built right.  Has anyone here gotten it done
> correctly that would like to share the result or how to do it?
> 
> It would seem like the logical thing to include in the new version since
> it ships with the mysql version that it was meant for.

Yup, agreed.  I had thought that the modules would conflict but this
doesn't seem to be the case, so we can package them both in php-mysql.

There is a bug in the configure script which means it won't build
properly; I'm just testing the patches to make it all work.

Regards,

joe



From brent at linux.wku.edu  Thu Mar 24 11:43:17 2005
From: brent at linux.wku.edu (Brent Norris)
Date: Thu, 24 Mar 2005 05:43:17 -0600
Subject: PHP5 and Mysqli
In-Reply-To: <20050324102051.GA8210@redhat.com>
References: <1111619480.17257.11.camel@Diablo>
	<20050324102051.GA8210@redhat.com>
Message-ID: <1111664597.30571.2.camel@Diablo>

On Thu, 2005-03-24 at 10:20 +0000, Joe Orton wrote:
> Yup, agreed.  I had thought that the modules would conflict but this
> doesn't seem to be the case, so we can package them both in php-mysql.
> 
> There is a bug in the configure script which means it won't build
> properly; I'm just testing the patches to make it all work.
> 
> Regards,
> 
> joe

Awesome.  If you need any help on testing that please let me know.  I
have a client that is eager to get this stuff up and running and this is
a big priority for me.

Thanks
-- 
Brent Norris (http://brentnorris.net)
Assistant Technology Coordinator, Edmonson County Schools



From jorton at redhat.com  Thu Mar 24 13:07:10 2005
From: jorton at redhat.com (Joe Orton)
Date: Thu, 24 Mar 2005 13:07:10 +0000
Subject: PHP5 and Mysqli
In-Reply-To: <1111664597.30571.2.camel@Diablo>
References: <1111619480.17257.11.camel@Diablo>
	<20050324102051.GA8210@redhat.com>
	<1111664597.30571.2.camel@Diablo>
Message-ID: <20050324130710.GA12790@redhat.com>

On Thu, Mar 24, 2005 at 05:43:17AM -0600, Brent Norris wrote:
> On Thu, 2005-03-24 at 10:20 +0000, Joe Orton wrote:
> > Yup, agreed.  I had thought that the modules would conflict but this
> > doesn't seem to be the case, so we can package them both in php-mysql.
> > 
> > There is a bug in the configure script which means it won't build
> > properly; I'm just testing the patches to make it all work.
> > 
> > Regards,
> > 
> > joe
> 
> Awesome.  If you need any help on testing that please let me know.  I
> have a client that is eager to get this stuff up and running and this is
> a big priority for me.

It's on its way to Raw Hide now; a simple test of the OO interface works
fine here - let me know how you get on.  Source RPM here:

http://people.redhat.com/jorton/misc/php-5.0.3-4.src.rpm

Regards,

joe



From buildsys at redhat.com  Thu Mar 24 13:10:02 2005
From: buildsys at redhat.com (Build System)
Date: Thu, 24 Mar 2005 08:10:02 -0500
Subject: rawhide report: 20050324 changes
Message-ID: <200503241310.j2ODA23S020030@porkchop.devel.redhat.com>

 

 
Updated Packages:

PyQt-3.14.1-1
-------------
* Wed Mar 23 2005 Than Ngo  3.14.1-1
- 3.14.1

a2ps-4.13b-46
-------------
* Wed Mar 23 2005 Tim Waugh  4.13b-46
- Make pdiff default to not requiring wdiff (bug #68537).

am-utils-5:6.0.9-12
-------------------
* Thu Mar 24 2005 Peter Vrabec  6.0.9-12
-fix the am-utils part of #143118 by implementing the util-linux
 mtab locking scheme into am-utils automounter, patch and testing
 by Daniel Berrange , improved locking
 algorithm by  (which allows for several 
 hundred or even thousand of parallel makes to finish 
 successfully and keep /etc/mtab in sync with /proc/mounts  as well)

* Thu Mar 17 2005 Peter Vrabec 
- rebuild by gcc4

anaconda-10.2.0.31-1
--------------------
* Wed Mar 23 2005 Chris Lumens  10.2.0.31-1
- Add libgcc for images.
- Rewrite language handling.
- Fix readImageFromFile deprecation warning (katzj).
- Don't hide groups which just have metapkgs (katzj, #149182).
- Load SELinux booleans (katzj, #151896).

dbus-0.31-4
-----------
* Wed Mar 23 2005 John (J5) Palmieri  - 0.31-4
- Pyrex has been patched to generate gcc4.0 complient code
- Rebuild for gcc4.0

* Wed Mar 16 2005 John (J5) Palmieri  - 0.31-3
- change compat-gcc requirement to compat-gcc-32
- rebuild with gcc 3.2

eclipse-bugzilla-1:0.1.0_fc-8
-----------------------------
* Wed Mar 23 2005 Andrew Overholt  0.1.0_fc-8
- Update with new gcj-dbtool stuff.
- Fix Requires.
- Remove *.jarswithnativelibs.

eclipse-cdt-1:3.0.0_fc-0.M5.1
-----------------------------
* Wed Mar 23 2005 Phil Muldoon  3.0.0-1
- Updated to upstream CDT 3.0.0 M5 sources
- Removed Source1 (rhdocs) for now
- Removed libhover patch until updated
- Added eclipse-cdt-platform-build-linux.patch
- Added eclipse-cdt-sdk-build-linux.patch
- Stopped tests build for now (Added eclipse-cdt-no-tests.patch)
- Added Requires gcc-java (bz# 151866)
- Added new central db logic

eclipse-changelog-1:2.0.1_fc-18
-------------------------------
* Wed Mar 23 2005 Andrew Overholt  2.0.1_fc-18
- Update with new gcj-dbtool stuff.
- Fix Requires.
- Remove *.jarswithnativelibs.

elfutils-0.103-2
----------------
* Wed Mar 23 2005 Jakub Jelinek  0.103-2
- update to 0.103

evolution-2.2.1.1-2
-------------------
* Wed Mar 23 2005 David Malcolm  - 2.2.1.1-2
- Add patch for upstream bug XB73844 (should now be able to accept meeting requests)

firefox-0:1.0.2-1
-----------------
* Wed Mar 23 2005 Christopher Aillon  0:1.0.2-1
- Firefox 1.0.2

gnome-menus-2.10.1-1
--------------------
* Wed Mar 23 2005 Mark McLoughlin  2.10.1-1
- Update to 2.10.1

gzip-1.3.5-3
------------
* Wed Mar 23 2005 Tomas Mraz  1.3.5-3
- don't use the asm code again as it's slower than the gcc compiled one
- convert the .spec to UTF-8

jwhois-3.2.2-12
---------------
* Wed Mar 23 2005 Miloslav Trmac  - 3.2.2-12
- Update to upstream CVS config as of Mar 23 2005 (#151900)
  Remove now unnecessary typos.patch

kde-i18n-1:3.4.0-1
------------------

kdenetwork-7:3.4.0-2
--------------------
* Wed Mar 23 2005 Than Ngo  7:3.4.0-2
- 3_4_BRANCH CVS fixes

kdepim-6:3.4.0-4
----------------
* Wed Mar 23 2005 Than Ngo  6:3.4.0-4
- add lockdev support patch in kandy from Peter Rockai #84143
- add missing kandy icons #141165

* Mon Mar 21 2005 Than Ngo  6:3.4.0-3
- cleanup build dependencies #151673

libmusicbrainz-2.1.1-1
----------------------
* Wed Mar 23 2005 John (J5) Palmieri  2.1.1-1
- Update to upstream version 2.1.1
- Removed libmusicbrainz-2.0.2-missing-return.patch
- Removed libmusicbrainz-2.0.2-conf.patch

lsof-4.74-6
-----------
* Wed Mar 23 2005 Karel Zak  4.74-6
- fix "lsof -b" hangs if a process is stuck in disk-wait/NFS (#131712)

make-1:3.80-7
-------------
* Mon Mar 07 2005 Jakub Jelinek  3.80-7
- rebuilt with GCC 4

mkinitrd-4.2.6-1
----------------
* Wed Mar 23 2005 Peter Jones  - 4.2.6-1
- work correctly with "set -o noclobber"
- wait longer after modprobe of usb-storage
- fix a wrong error output file

* Tue Mar 22 2005 Peter Jones  - 4.2.5-1
- handle mount-by-uuid for root correctly (##148756)

openoffice.org-1:1.9.87-2
-------------------------
* Tue Mar 22 2005 Caolan McNamara  1:1.9.87-2
- unpackaged libraries
- try out more lenient LOCALE acceptence for rh#151357#

pam-0.78-9
----------
* Wed Mar 23 2005 Tomas Mraz  0.78-9
- fix wrong logging in pam_console handlers
- add executing ainit handler for alsa sound dmix
- #147879, #112777 - change permissions for dri devices

parted-1.6.22-1
---------------
* Wed Mar 23 2005 Chris Lumens  1.6.22-1
- Updated to 1.6.22.
- Get rid of separate gc4 patch that's now included upstream.
- Take Mac LVM patch from parted CVS.

qt-1:3.3.4-10
-------------
* Wed Mar 23 2005 Than Ngo  1:3.3.4-10
- add GtkStyle patch from Peter Backlund #141125

redhat-artwork-0.121-1
----------------------
* Wed Mar 23 2005 Than Ngo  0.121-1
- 0.121
- Add qt Bluecurve fixes and improvements from Peter Backlund

redhat-rpm-config-8.0.34-1
--------------------------
* Wed Mar 23 2005 Elliot Lee  8.0.34-1
- Bug fixes
- Cflags change by drepper

* Wed Feb 09 2005 Elliot Lee  8.0.33-1
- Change -D to -Wp,-D to make java happy
- Add -D_FORTIFY_SOURCE=2 to global cflags (as per Jakub & Arjan's request)

* Fri Oct 01 2004 Bill Nottingham  8.0.32-1
- allow all symbol versioning in find_requires - matches RPM internal
  behavior

selinux-policy-strict-1.23.4-4
------------------------------
* Wed Mar 23 2005 Dan Walsh  1.23.4-4
- Allow named, nscd to log to /var/log directory
- Allow cups to create ptal_var_run_t files

selinux-policy-targeted-1.23.4-4
--------------------------------
* Wed Mar 23 2005 Dan Walsh  1.23.4-4
- Allow named, nscd to log to /var/log directory
- Allow cups to create ptal_var_run_t files

system-config-bind-4.0.0-4.4
----------------------------

system-config-kickstart-2.5.21-2
--------------------------------
* Wed Mar 23 2005 Chris Lumens  2.5.21-2
- Rebuilt translation files.

* Wed Mar 23 2005 Chris Lumens  2.5.21-1
- Add SELinux support to the firewall page (#148966).
- Fix gtk deprecation warnings.

thunderbird-0:1.0.2-1
---------------------
* Wed Mar 23 2005 Christopher Aillon  1.0.2-1
- Thunderbird 1.0.2

vim-1:6.3.067-1
---------------
* Wed Mar 23 2005 Karsten Hopp  6.3.067-1
- Newly created files got execute permission (caused by patch 66)

xorg-x11-6.8.2-13
-----------------
* Wed Mar 23 2005 Kristian H??gsberg  6.8.2-13
- Add XFree86-4.1.0-xpm-security-fix-CAN-2005-0605.patch (#150040).

* Wed Mar 16 2005 Soeren Sandmann  6.8.2-12
- Add xorg-x11-6.8.2-cursor-flicker.patch (#144022)
- Fix xorg-x11-6.8.2-XScreenSaverQueryInfo-crash-fix.patch so it will apply

* Tue Mar 15 2005 Mike A. Harris  6.8.2-11
- Added xorg-x11-6.8.2-config-StaticNeedsPicForShared.patch for (#108026)
- Removed StaticNeedsPicForShared from host.def section
- Added xorg-x11-6.8.2-XScreenSaverQueryInfo-crash-fix.patch to fix (#147890)



From smooge at gmail.com  Thu Mar 24 14:54:11 2005
From: smooge at gmail.com (Stephen J. Smoogen)
Date: Thu, 24 Mar 2005 07:54:11 -0700
Subject: Stateless linux
In-Reply-To: <424166AA.3090304@hclcomnet.co.in>
References: <20050323121543.82712.qmail@web8501.mail.in.yahoo.com>
	<424166AA.3090304@hclcomnet.co.in>
Message-ID: <80d7e40905032406546c7a2794@mail.gmail.com>

Actually, I was waiting for some sort of larger announcement and mailing list
myself. I had put a very little time into it.. but couldnt see who
else was wanting it or doing anything on it. Having a mailing list
would be useful.


On Wed, 23 Mar 2005 18:22:58 +0530, gaurav  wrote:
> Rahul Sundaram wrote:
> 
> >--- gaurav  wrote:
> >
> >
> >
> >>I was just  wondering how hard this concept of state
> >>less Linux will be
> >>to port to other distro (like debian) ? any idea if
> >>there code written
> >>od code written specifically for fedora or its just
> >>collection of
> >>unities and scripts .
> >>
> >>
> >
> >its in a highly experimental stage now. once its
> >complete it can definitely be ported to other
> >distributions if people work on it. if you have a
> >interest in it poke into the current code in cvs yourself
> >
> >
> i  would request  Redhat (if possible) to   start a new mailing  list
> dedicated to stateless  linux where a group dedicated developers can
> work  as I think this project has huge potential  :-)
> 
> >Regards
> >Rahul Sundaram
> >
> >
> >
> >__________________________________
> >Do you Yahoo!?
> >Yahoo! Mail - Easier than ever with enhanced search. Learn more.
> >http://info.mail.yahoo.com/mail_250
> >
> >
> >
> 
> --
> fedora-devel-list mailing list
> fedora-devel-list at redhat.com
> http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-list
> 


-- 
Stephen J Smoogen.
CSIRT/Linux System Administrator



From kaspars at os.lv  Thu Mar 24 15:36:04 2005
From: kaspars at os.lv (Kaspars)
Date: Thu, 24 Mar 2005 17:36:04 +0200
Subject: problem with updated yum...
Message-ID: <4242DE64.1060803@os.lv>


  Hi,

  I don`t know it is correct list for q. if not sorry, I reply to pointed...
  So problem is with yum... I installed new fresh FC3 and wanted to update:
[root at os root]# yum -y update
Setting up Update Process
Setting up Repos
Cannot find a valid baseurl for repo: base

ok, I search, found the problem mostly depend on that I don`t have 
correct DNS server... (and there is now nice button in network to save 
dns changes, only network ip).

So it started to work... but then I don`t have connection to 
international trafic (yea, I live in coutry where international and 
local trafic is different prices :) and I use proxy to get updates...
So again it is not working. what I do:
#http_proxy="http://proxi.ip:port/"
#yum -y updated
Becouse I like to automated what I do again sometime, I put in script:
#!/bin/sh
http_proxy="http://proxi.ip:port/" && yum -y updated
I run script and now it working :)
strange..
maybe there is problem with new updated bash?
I like to understand what is problem...

thanks,
Casper




From skvidal at phy.duke.edu  Thu Mar 24 15:38:00 2005
From: skvidal at phy.duke.edu (seth vidal)
Date: Thu, 24 Mar 2005 10:38:00 -0500
Subject: problem with updated yum...
In-Reply-To: <4242DE64.1060803@os.lv>
References: <4242DE64.1060803@os.lv>
Message-ID: <1111678681.5444.90.camel@cutter>

> So it started to work... but then I don`t have connection to 
> international trafic (yea, I live in coutry where international and 
> local trafic is different prices :) and I use proxy to get updates...
> So again it is not working. what I do:
> #http_proxy="http://proxi.ip:port/"
> #yum -y updated


make the above:

export http_proxy="http://proxy.ip:port/"
yum -y update

and it will probably work.

-sv




From kaspars at os.lv  Thu Mar 24 16:23:54 2005
From: kaspars at os.lv (Kaspars)
Date: Thu, 24 Mar 2005 18:23:54 +0200
Subject: problem with updated yum...
In-Reply-To: <1111678681.5444.90.camel@cutter>
References: <4242DE64.1060803@os.lv> <1111678681.5444.90.camel@cutter>
Message-ID: <4242E99A.6070304@os.lv>


hmm, thanks it worked :)

btw, somebody can point me how to make that yum use my configurated best 
point to update, not try some random site?

and how hard is to make local yum repository?
In my country we have problem with internacional trafic and I`m 
interested to make local server where you can point yum to update and 
write how-to in our language...

seth vidal wrote:
>>So it started to work... but then I don`t have connection to 
>>international trafic (yea, I live in coutry where international and 
>>local trafic is different prices :) and I use proxy to get updates...
>>So again it is not working. what I do:
>>#http_proxy="http://proxi.ip:port/"
>>#yum -y updated
> 
> 
> 
> make the above:
> 
> export http_proxy="http://proxy.ip:port/"
> yum -y update
> 
> and it will probably work.
> 
> -sv
> 
> 



From nman64 at n-man.com  Thu Mar 24 17:12:51 2005
From: nman64 at n-man.com (Patrick Barnes)
Date: Thu, 24 Mar 2005 11:12:51 -0600
Subject: OT: Re: problem with updated yum...
In-Reply-To: <4242E99A.6070304@os.lv>
References: <4242DE64.1060803@os.lv> <1111678681.5444.90.camel@cutter>
	<4242E99A.6070304@os.lv>
Message-ID: <4242F513.2060107@n-man.com>

Kaspars wrote:

>
> hmm, thanks it worked :)
>
> btw, somebody can point me how to make that yum use my configurated
> best point to update, not try some random site?
>
> and how hard is to make local yum repository?
> In my country we have problem with internacional trafic and I`m
> interested to make local server where you can point yum to update and
> write how-to in our language...
>
To setup your server:
    Set up a cron job to use wget or rsync to mirror your favorite
mirror daily.
    Make the tree available on your webserver.
    Write and publish your how-to.

To configure yum to use your server:
    Edit /etc/yum.repos.d/*
    Comment out the mirrorlist and baseurl lines.
    In each file, enter a new baseurl line that looks like this:
       baseurl=http://yourservername/yourfedoratree/repositoryname
       (eg.
baseurl=http://www.kaspersserver.com/fedora/linux/core/3/i386/os )

Ask any further questions on Google or fedora-list at redhat.com

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From j.w.r.degoede at hhs.nl  Thu Mar 24 20:37:33 2005
From: j.w.r.degoede at hhs.nl (Hans de Goede)
Date: Thu, 24 Mar 2005 21:37:33 +0100
Subject: RPM installed but unowned files and dirs
Message-ID: <4243250D.4090609@hhs.nl>

Hi,

After upgrading from RedHat -> test -> rawhide -> RedHat -> test -> test 
-> rawhide -> FC -> test ->rawhide -> fc -> etc.

My system has become a bit of a mess, so I decided todo a rpm -qf on 
every file and dir and grep for " not owned by any package"

Which resulted in a shocking 6000 hits!

So I decided to write a script which undertook the task of cleaning all 
this mess for me in the true unix spirit. This script has been attached 
for you're reading and (ab)using pleasure.

Be warned no guarantees what soever, this might eat your HD etc. This 
script is only intented for people who have everything except files 
under /home managed by RPM if you have manually installed software it 
will NUKE this including software installed under /usr/local !

If you take a look at the script you'll see that the find for removing 
files contains quite a lott of excludes, these I believe are all 
packaging bugs!

Also the script ends by generating a list of dirs which after the 
cleanup are not owned by any package, see attachment 2.

I've already entered some of these in bugzilla but gave up when I saw 
how many there are, should I enter these in bugzilla?

Regards,

Hans
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From gregbell at znet.com  Thu Mar 24 20:47:02 2005
From: gregbell at znet.com (Greg Bell)
Date: Fri, 25 Mar 2005 07:47:02 +1100 (EST)
Subject: Yum sessions?
Message-ID: 


I've been reading some threads on (and experiencing) yum's slowness.  Not
sure if its been suggested yet, but could yum be session based?  If after
all the time-consuming on-disk cache reading (MD Read #### ), yum gave a
command prompt, I could yum list, yum info, and finally yum install, all
with only one read of repository metadata from local files...

This would also make yum play nice with a GUI.

Just a suggestion.  Thanks for all the hard work developers!

~Greg Bell



From fedora-devel at camperquake.de  Thu Mar 24 20:50:25 2005
From: fedora-devel at camperquake.de (Ralf Ertzinger)
Date: Thu, 24 Mar 2005 21:50:25 +0100
Subject: Yum sessions?
In-Reply-To: 
References: 
Message-ID: <20050324215025.72756e49@nausicaa.camperquake.de>

Hi.

Greg Bell  wrote:

> I've been reading some threads on (and experiencing) yum's slowness.

The current version in rawhide is quite fast.

-- 
Angie chalks another Blue, mother smiles, she did it too...
		-- Marillion, "Garden Party"



From jspaleta at gmail.com  Thu Mar 24 20:52:03 2005
From: jspaleta at gmail.com (Jeff Spaleta)
Date: Thu, 24 Mar 2005 15:52:03 -0500
Subject: RPM installed but unowned files and dirs
In-Reply-To: <4243250D.4090609@hhs.nl>
References: <4243250D.4090609@hhs.nl>
Message-ID: <604aa79105032412527f072598@mail.gmail.com>

On Thu, 24 Mar 2005 21:37:33 +0100, Hans de Goede  wrote:
> I've already entered some of these in bugzilla but gave up when I saw
> how many there are, should I enter these in bugzilla?

How exactly are  you determining which component to file about for
unowned directories?  You have to try to make a determination of
directory ownership based on what packages own files down inside the
directory or else you really can't be sure what package was suppose to
own the directory to begin with.
If any of these unowned directories are empty.. you really can't be
sure which package is the culprit, nor even which package vendor, if
this system ever saw any packages from a second vendor.

For example  /usr/man/man3 in your list... I don't seem to have that
on any of my systems.. not my fc2 or fc3 or my rawhide system.

And on my fc2 system /usr/man/man1  contains only files i have
installed from packages from Non redhat and Non Fedora Core/Extras
locations (namely packages I've hacked together... once again proving
I can't package worth crap)

On my stock+updated fc3 system.. i don't even have /usr/man/  directory.

-jef



From chris at beowulf.net  Thu Mar 24 20:58:40 2005
From: chris at beowulf.net (Chris Stankaitis)
Date: Thu, 24 Mar 2005 15:58:40 -0500
Subject: append only file system - selinux?
Message-ID: <42432A00.1010309@beowulf.net>

here is my issue, for security certification purposes I need to be able 
to create an append only file system for logs, such that no one *even 
root* will be able to futz with the log files on my log server.

my problem is that to the best of my knowledge (and I do hope I am wrong 
and corrected here) this can not be done on the kernel level in 
RHEL/Fedora, I can chattr a log append only but any root user can take 
the flag off, clean up the stuff in the log they don't want seen and 
re-chattr the file.

I know on BSD variants you can set this on an OS level, thus to subvert 
the logs you would need to reboot, change the setting, do your dirty 
work, reboot again turn the setting back etc... basically VERY trackable 
given the fact that the box needs to be rebooted a few time..

I really want to avoid having to run a BSD variant. but if that is what 
I need to do to get the functionality I will.

I am sure that others have come up with this problem with regards to 
security compliance.  what are you guys doing.

If there is no 2.4 kernel solution, is there a 2.6/selinux solution to 
my problem? that would not allow anyone (even root) to do anything but 
append to logs?

Thank you in advance for the advice.



From j.w.r.degoede at hhs.nl  Thu Mar 24 21:05:25 2005
From: j.w.r.degoede at hhs.nl (Hans de Goede)
Date: Thu, 24 Mar 2005 22:05:25 +0100
Subject: RPM installed but unowned files and dirs
In-Reply-To: <604aa79105032412527f072598@mail.gmail.com>
References: <4243250D.4090609@hhs.nl>
	<604aa79105032412527f072598@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <42432B95.7020104@hhs.nl>

Jeff Spaleta wrote:
> On Thu, 24 Mar 2005 21:37:33 +0100, Hans de Goede  wrote:
> 
>>I've already entered some of these in bugzilla but gave up when I saw
>>how many there are, should I enter these in bugzilla?
> 
> 
> How exactly are  you determining which component to file about for
> unowned directories?
So far I have based this on which package owns files in the dir for 
example db4 puts files in /lib/tls/i?86 and /usr/lib/tls/i?86 so I've 
filed a bug against db4, although I think maybe glibc would be a better 
target for the bug. So it is a mix between file against owner of files 
in dir (as done for db4) and common sense, I used db4 assuming that the 
db4 maintainer would reassing the bug to glibc if he concidered this a 
glibc bug.

>  You have to try to make a determination of
> directory ownership based on what packages own files down inside the
> directory or else you really can't be sure what package was suppose to
> own the directory to begin with.
Exactly.

> If any of these unowned directories are empty.. you really can't be
> sure which package is the culprit, nor even which package vendor, if
> this system ever saw any packages from a second vendor.
> 
They aren't my script nuckes any unowned empty dirs and does this 
recursivly untill there are no more before building the list of unowned 
dirs.

> For example  /usr/man/man3 in your list... I don't seem to have that
> on any of my systems.. not my fc2 or fc3 or my rawhide system.
> 
> And on my fc2 system /usr/man/man1  contains only files i have
> installed from packages from Non redhat and Non Fedora Core/Extras
> locations (namely packages I've hacked together... once again proving
> I can't package worth crap)
> 
> On my stock+updated fc3 system.. i don't even have /usr/man/  directory.

Thats from the libc 5 compatibility stuff:

[hans at cq229 ~]$ rpm -qf /usr/man/man3/dlopen.3.gz
ld.so-1.9.5-13

I'm not claiming this is a perfect list, but most are real bugs, I've 
already removed the easy not an FC bug candidates from the list, but 
missed this one.

The real problem ones are perl and python modules, I had a lot of 
/usr/lib/python-1.? dirs which all contained dirs from modules which 
were never cleaned up, because they were unowned. Same for perl.

Still the question should I walk through this list and file them all?
Concidering how easy to fix these are the repsonse to the ones I've 
filed sofar (about 1 week ago) are less then overwelming. Some got the 
keyword easy fix tagged to them, fixing them is about as much work....

Regards,

Hans




From jspaleta at gmail.com  Thu Mar 24 21:02:14 2005
From: jspaleta at gmail.com (Jeff Spaleta)
Date: Thu, 24 Mar 2005 16:02:14 -0500
Subject: Yum sessions?
In-Reply-To: 
References: 
Message-ID: <604aa791050324130277880fe7@mail.gmail.com>

On Fri, 25 Mar 2005 07:47:02 +1100 (EST), Greg Bell  wrote:
> command prompt, I could yum list, yum info, and finally yum install, all
> with only one read of repository metadata from local files...

as Ralf has pointed out... the yum in rawhide is much faster
concerning some operations. If my understanding is correct, the yum in
rawhide builds a sqlite database when needed and then queries the
database instead of trying to reload all the information into memory
with every yum operation.  With the rawhide version of yum, multiple
runs of yum where the information on the mirrors is unchanging results
in much quicker response thanks to the local sqlite database. The
sqlite database is only rebuilt if yum detects a change in the
metadata at the contacted mirror.

Though you can still speed up things even further for some operations
like list and info where you don't need to contact a mirror to
download any packages.
yum makecache   (freshen the local cache of all the metadata)
yum -C list    
yum -C info

but if you dont have the packages and the headers downloaded locally
to the cache yum -C install  isn't going to work, so it might not be
as useful to you as the other 2 commands.

If you have to go out and touch the network... that means examining
the metadata at the mirror and potentially rebuilding the local
database of information.

-jef



From jspaleta at gmail.com  Thu Mar 24 21:08:04 2005
From: jspaleta at gmail.com (Jeff Spaleta)
Date: Thu, 24 Mar 2005 16:08:04 -0500
Subject: RPM installed but unowned files and dirs
In-Reply-To: <42432B95.7020104@hhs.nl>
References: <4243250D.4090609@hhs.nl>
	<604aa79105032412527f072598@mail.gmail.com> <42432B95.7020104@hhs.nl>
Message-ID: <604aa791050324130878749c70@mail.gmail.com>

On Thu, 24 Mar 2005 22:05:25 +0100, Hans de Goede  wrote:
> I'm not claiming this is a perfect list, but most are real bugs, I've
> already removed the easy not an FC bug candidates from the list, but
> missed this one.

I wonder... is this a job for the repoquery script that people have
been pimping?
Can we get a full summary of information about unowned directories by
examining the owned files of all the packages in Core and seeing which
directory trees are explicitly not included in that list? Instead of
doing a full install running rpm -qf like mad?  If we can script this
with repoquery just against the repository metadata it will be far
easier for everyone to keep up with this as packages churn.

-jef



From alan at redhat.com  Fri Mar 25 00:11:12 2005
From: alan at redhat.com (Alan Cox)
Date: Thu, 24 Mar 2005 19:11:12 -0500
Subject: append only file system - selinux?
In-Reply-To: <42432A00.1010309@beowulf.net>
References: <42432A00.1010309@beowulf.net>
Message-ID: <20050325001112.GA30906@devserv.devel.redhat.com>

On Thu, Mar 24, 2005 at 03:58:40PM -0500, Chris Stankaitis wrote:
> and corrected here) this can not be done on the kernel level in 
> RHEL/Fedora, I can chattr a log append only but any root user can take 
> the flag off, clean up the stuff in the log they don't want seen and 
> re-chattr the file.

SELinux allows you to write rules to do this

> I know on BSD variants you can set this on an OS level, thus to subvert 
> the logs you would need to reboot, change the setting, do your dirty 

Or a kernel security hole in either. 

> If there is no 2.4 kernel solution, is there a 2.6/selinux solution to 
> my problem? that would not allow anyone (even root) to do anything but 
> append to logs?

You also have to give up X and a few other serivces (as with BSD) but yes you
can do it



From menno-fedora at freshfoo.com  Fri Mar 25 01:12:06 2005
From: menno-fedora at freshfoo.com (Menno Smits)
Date: Fri, 25 Mar 2005 11:12:06 +1000
Subject: Yum sessions?
In-Reply-To: 
References: 
Message-ID: <42436566.9080102@freshfoo.com>

Greg Bell wrote:
> I've been reading some threads on (and experiencing) yum's slowness.  Not
> sure if its been suggested yet, but could yum be session based?  If after
> all the time-consuming on-disk cache reading (MD Read #### ), yum gave a
> command prompt, I could yum list, yum info, and finally yum install, all
> with only one read of repository metadata from local files...

The newer versions of yum are generally much faster and use MUCH less 
RAM through the use of an sqlite cache.

A "yum shell" feature also exists that does exactly what you're asking 
for. Here's an example:

----< snip >------------------------------------------------------

# yum shell
Setting up Yum Shell
 > list updates
Setting up Repos
core                      100% |=========================| 1.1 kB    00:00
dag                       100% |=========================| 1.1 kB    00:01
livna                     100% |=========================|  951 B    00:00
updates                   100% |=========================|  951 B    00:00
freshrpms                 100% |=========================|  951 B    00:00
extras                    100% |=========================|  951 B    00:00
Reading repository metadata in from local files
primary.xml.gz            100% |=========================| 750 kB    00:33
dag       : ################################################## 2023/2023
Added 15 new packages, deleted 12 old in 3.67 seconds
primary.xml.gz            100% |=========================| 304 kB    00:04
updates   : ################################################## 742/742
Added 3 new packages, deleted 1 old in 2.75 seconds
extras    : ################################################## 1002/1002
Added 3 new packages, deleted 0 old in 1.03 seconds
Excluding Packages in global exclude list
Finished
Updated Packages
system-config-services.noarch            0.8.21-0.fc3.1         updates
thunderbird.i386                         1.0.2-1.3.2            updates
 > list updates
Updated Packages
system-config-services.noarch            0.8.21-0.fc3.1         updates
thunderbird.i386                         1.0.2-1.3.2            updates
 > info thunderbird
Installed Packages
Name   : thunderbird
Arch   : i386
Version: 1.0.2
Release: 1.3.1
Size   : 28 M
Repo   : installed
Summary: Mozilla Thunderbird mail/newsgroup client

Description:
  Mozilla Thunderbird is a standalone mail and newsgroup client.


Available Packages
Name   : thunderbird
Arch   : i386
Version: 1.0.2
Release: 1.3.2
Size   : 10 M
Repo   : updates
Summary: Mozilla Thunderbird mail/newsgroup client
Description:
  Mozilla Thunderbird is a standalone mail and newsgroup client.

 > update
Setting up Update Process
 > run
Transaction Listing:
   Update: system-config-services.noarch 0:0.8.21-0.fc3.1 - updates
   Update: thunderbird.i386 0:1.0.2-1.3.2 - updates
Total download size: 10 M
Is this ok [y/N]: y
Downloading Packages:
(1/2): thunderbird-1.0.2- 100% |=========================|  10 MB    03:34
(2/2): system-config-serv 100% |=========================| 133 kB    00:02
Running Transaction Test
thunderbird-1.0.2-1.3.2.i 100% |=========================|  63 kB    00:00
system-config-services-0. 100% |=========================|  23 kB    00:00
Finished Transaction Test
Transaction Test Succeeded
Running Transaction
   Updating  : system-config-services       ######################### [1/4]
   Updating  : thunderbird                  ######################### [2/4]
   Cleanup   : thunderbird                  ######################### [3/4]
   Cleanup   : system-config-services       ######################### [4/4]

Updated: system-config-services.noarch 0:0.8.21-0.fc3.1 thunderbird.i386 
0:1.0.2-1.3.2
Finished Transaction
 > quit
Leaving Shell

----< snip >------------------------------------------------------

You should be able to find all this in the version of yum currently in 
rawhide.


Regards,
Menno



From pgsery at swcp.com  Fri Mar 25 04:55:25 2005
From: pgsery at swcp.com (Paul Sery)
Date: Thu, 24 Mar 2005 21:55:25 -0700
Subject: Stateless Linux
In-Reply-To: <424397D0.6030703@swcp.com>
References: <4243975E.5090009@swcp.com> <424397D0.6030703@swcp.com>
Message-ID: <424399BD.70004@swcp.com>

Yup. Red Hat is missing out on a large niche. There's a big movement to 
convert
to diskless thinclients whereever possible. If RH doesn't do it, then 
someone else will.

-Paul Sery

Stephen J. Smoogen wrote:

> Well maybe Red Hat should talk to they have been selling to  in the US
> Government networks. There is a major need for a packaged conformed
> stateless linux product for various networks. The defense department
> and energy departments are needing to put 1000's of computers as
> diskless nodes. Having say RHEL-4 with a stateless station should be a
> good selling point.
>
> Stephen J. Smoogen
>
>> On Tue, 22 Mar 2005 17:56:38 +0000, Peter Dedecker
>>  wrote:
>>
>>> Gaurav wrote:
>>> >        I am interested in stateless Linux project  and would like to
>>> > volunteer  for its beta tester ... I will try roll this out in my
>>> > brother's school and after that  co workers on my office plus also 
>>> would
>>> > like to contribute to its development ....help it to take to next 
>>> level :-)
>>>
>>> Nice
>>>
>>> > I would like to know what state this project is in ? is anybody 
>>> involved
>>> > in active testing/ testing development ? Do you need beta tester ...
>>>
>>> It isn't in active development right now.  At Red Hat, they don't even
>>> know if they'll continue it.  But if they continue it, there'll be a
>>> team working on it.
>>>



From technojoecoolusa at charter.net  Fri Mar 25 05:56:27 2005
From: technojoecoolusa at charter.net (Joseph Wagner)
Date: Thu, 24 Mar 2005 23:56:27 -0600
Subject: RFC: Optimizing for 386 (Part 2)
Message-ID: <200503242356.27998.technojoecoolusa@charter.net>

Hello Linux Naysayers!

You may remember about two months ago I started a flame war asking why RPM 
packages were still optimized for 386. ?The best answer I heard said that 
the powers-that-be do not believe there would be a noticeable improvement, 
and if I wanted to affect real change I would need to prove them wrong.

So I've set out to do just that.

I'm here today to announce the Hypersonic Penguins project.

http://www.hypersonicpenguins.org

Details are spelled out on the website, so I won't repeat them here. ?
However, I will summarize by saying it has RPM packages optimized for 686.

You are invited to download them, install them, and tell me how wrong you 
were when you see the faster speed.

I'm being charged a premium for bandwidth, so please download only the 
packages you have installed.

Thank you for your time and your tolerance.

Joseph D. Wagner



From vasis.g at gmail.com  Fri Mar 25 06:02:00 2005
From: vasis.g at gmail.com (Vasis G)
Date: Fri, 25 Mar 2005 11:32:00 +0530
Subject: (no subject)
Message-ID: 




From j.w.r.degoede at hhs.nl  Fri Mar 25 07:04:21 2005
From: j.w.r.degoede at hhs.nl (Hans de Goede)
Date: Fri, 25 Mar 2005 08:04:21 +0100
Subject: RPM installed but unowned files and dirs
In-Reply-To: <604aa791050324130878749c70@mail.gmail.com>
References: <4243250D.4090609@hhs.nl>	<604aa79105032412527f072598@mail.gmail.com>
	<42432B95.7020104@hhs.nl>
	<604aa791050324130878749c70@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4243B7F5.1060106@hhs.nl>



Jeff Spaleta wrote:
> On Thu, 24 Mar 2005 22:05:25 +0100, Hans de Goede  wrote:
> 
>>I'm not claiming this is a perfect list, but most are real bugs, I've
>>already removed the easy not an FC bug candidates from the list, but
>>missed this one.
> 
> 
> I wonder... is this a job for the repoquery script that people have
> been pimping?
> Can we get a full summary of information about unowned directories by
> examining the owned files of all the packages in Core and seeing which
> directory trees are explicitly not included in that list? Instead of
> doing a full install running rpm -qf like mad?  If we can script this
> with repoquery just against the repository metadata it will be far
> easier for everyone to keep up with this as packages churn.
> 

That could work, I was actually thinking about making rpmbuild check for 
unowned dirs during rpm building, like it does for unpackaged files now.

The idea: If a package contains a file which is in a dir (component) 
which is not owned by, filesystem or any of its dependencies, complain.
Preferrably complain loudly (as in refuse to write the final RPM)

Regards,

Hans



From elanthis at awesomeplay.com  Fri Mar 25 08:24:06 2005
From: elanthis at awesomeplay.com (Sean Middleditch)
Date: Fri, 25 Mar 2005 03:24:06 -0500
Subject: RFC: Optimizing for 386 (Part 2)
In-Reply-To: <200503242356.27998.technojoecoolusa@charter.net>
References: <200503242356.27998.technojoecoolusa@charter.net>
Message-ID: <1111739046.19895.16.camel@stargrazer.home.awesomeplay.com>

On Thu, 2005-03-24 at 23:56 -0600, Joseph Wagner wrote:
> Hello Linux Naysayers!
> 
> You may remember about two months ago I started a flame war asking why RPM 
> packages were still optimized for 386.  The best answer I heard said that 
> the powers-that-be do not believe there would be a noticeable improvement, 
> and if I wanted to affect real change I would need to prove them wrong.
> 
> So I've set out to do just that.
> 
> I'm here today to announce the Hypersonic Penguins project.
> 
> http://www.hypersonicpenguins.org
> 
> Details are spelled out on the website, so I won't repeat them here.  
> However, I will summarize by saying it has RPM packages optimized for 686.

No, they aren't.  Not a single objective benchmark or measurement.  Just
"it feels faster" with no proof that it's not just a placebo effect.
You might have set out to prove something, but you haven't even started
to do so yet.  Show some benchmarks.  Show how much quicker the X
rendering show.  Show how much smaller the latency is.  Prove it.

That build server is about as mis-quoted as it could be.  What do you
need a Radeon 9600 in a build server for?  DVD-RW?  Water-cooled case?
You think of getting the best CPUs on the market - two of them - and 4GB
of RAM, but only ask for a paltry 80GB 7200 disk?  Either you have no
clue what you're doing, or you're trying to scam people into buying your
new gaming box for you.  Either way, I certainly hope nobody gives you
any money for that thing.  *snicker* We just sold 80 old Pentium's at my
workplace, to people planning on giving them to grand parents, children,
and so on - thankfully Fedora will run on them.  You might look into
getting some old machines - a setup like that could make an excellent
build farm and cost no more than one or two hundred bucks.

> 
> You are invited to download them, install them, and tell me how wrong you 
> were when you see the faster speed.
> 
> I'm being charged a premium for bandwidth, so please download only the 
> packages you have installed.
> 
> Thank you for your time and your tolerance.
> 
> Joseph D. Wagner
> 
-- 
Sean Middleditch 



From buildsys at redhat.com  Fri Mar 25 13:14:27 2005
From: buildsys at redhat.com (Build System)
Date: Fri, 25 Mar 2005 08:14:27 -0500
Subject: rawhide report: 20050325 changes
Message-ID: <200503251314.j2PDERvI019297@porkchop.devel.redhat.com>

 

 
Updated Packages:

anaconda-10.2.0.32-1
--------------------
* Thu Mar 24 2005 Jeremy Katz  - 10.2.0.32-1
- Switch theme to clearlooks
- Add new Solaris partition id
- Mark some more strings for translation
- Fix xfs fs creation (Lars Hamann, #151378)

bluez-utils-2.15-5
------------------
* Fri Mar 25 2005 Florian La Roche 
- make sure post/postun end with a "exit 0"

coreutils-5.2.1-43
------------------
* Thu Mar 24 2005 Tim Waugh  5.2.1-43
- Removed patch that adds -C option to install(1).

dhcp-10:3.0.2-4
---------------
* Thu Mar 24 2005 Florian La Roche 
- add "exit 0" to post script

dhcpv6-0.10-12
--------------
* Fri Mar 25 2005 Florian La Roche 
- add "exit 0" to postun script

dia-1:0.94-10
-------------
* Fri Mar 25 2005 Florian La Roche 
- add PreReq: for scrollkeeper-update

gcc-4.0.0-0.37
--------------
* Thu Mar 24 2005 Jakub Jelinek   4.0.0-0.37
- fix PR middle-end/20622

* Thu Mar 24 2005 Jakub Jelinek   4.0.0-0.36
- update from CVS
  - PRs c++/19769, c++/19980, c++/20147, c++/20147, c++/20461, c++/20463,
	c++/20465, c++/20499, c++/20536, libfortran/18025, libgcj/11085,
	libgcj/14892, libgcj/18083, libgcj/2641, libgcj/9854, libstdc++/20352,
	libstdc++/20577, middle-end/20539, middle-end/20557, other/20564,
	target/20166, target/20561
  - fix PRE causing miscompilation of sudo (Daniel Berlin, #151632,
    PR tree-optimization/20601)
- fix PR rtl-optimization/20532 (Alexandre Oliva)

gdb-6.3.0.0-1.6
---------------
* Thu Mar 24 2005 Jeff Johnston 	6.3.0.0-1.6
- Bump up release number.

* Thu Mar 24 2005 Jeff Johnston 	6.3.0.0-1.4
- Fix printing of inherited members of C++ classes.
- Fix for Bugzilla 146835.

gphoto2-2.1.5-6
---------------
* Thu Mar 24 2005 Michael Schwendt  2.1.5-6
- Avoid creation of bad rpaths by removing libtool hacks from spec.

* Thu Mar 24 2005 Tim Waugh 
- Disable docs again until gtk-doc is fixed (GNOME bug #169087).

* Mon Mar 21 2005 Tim Waugh 
- Fixed memset() usage bug.

kernel-2.6.11-1.1202_FC4
------------------------
* Thu Mar 24 2005 Dave Jones 
- rebuild

* Tue Mar 22 2005 Dave Jones 
- Fix several instances of swapped arguments to memset()
- 2.6.12rc1-bk1

mc-1:4.6.1a-0.7
---------------
* Thu Mar 24 2005 Jindrich Novy  4.6.1a-0.7
- update from CVS
- sync with .utf8 patch
- add displaying of username/hostname in xterm title

net-snmp-5.2.1-6
----------------
* Thu Mar 24 2005 Radek Vokal  - 5.2.1-6
- fixed unexpected length for type ASN_UNSIGNED (#151892)
- fixed uptime problems on ia64

openssh-4.0p1-1
---------------
* Thu Mar 24 2005 Tomas Mraz  4.0p1-1
- upgrade to 4.0p1
- remove obsolete groups patch

php-5.0.3-4
-----------
* Thu Mar 24 2005 Joe Orton  5.0.3-4
- package mysqli extension in php-mysql
- really enable pcntl (#142903)
- don't build with --enable-safe-mode (#148969)
- use "Instant Client" libraries for oci8 module (Kai Bolay, #149873)

planner-0.13-1
--------------
* Thu Mar 24 2005 Dan Williams  - 0.13-1
- Update to 0.13

samba-0:3.0.11-6
----------------
* Thu Mar 24 2005 Florian La Roche 
- add a "exit 0" to the postun of the main samba package

selinux-policy-strict-1.23.5-1
------------------------------
* Wed Mar 23 2005 Dan Walsh  1.23.5-1
- Update to latest from NSA

selinux-policy-targeted-1.23.5-1
--------------------------------
* Wed Mar 23 2005 Dan Walsh  1.23.5-1
- Update to latest from NSA

spamassassin-3.0.2-5
--------------------
* Thu Mar 24 2005 Florian La Roche 
- add "exit 0" to postun script

* Thu Mar 24 2005 Joe Orton  3.0.2-4
- package the NOTICE file

* Thu Mar 17 2005 Warren Togami  - 3.0.2-3
- reinclude ia64, thanks jvdias

system-config-printer-0.6.128-1
-------------------------------
* Thu Mar 24 2005 Tim Waugh  0.6.128-1
- 0.6.128:
  - Invalidate cache after PPD import.

* Thu Mar 24 2005 Tim Waugh  0.6.127-1
- 0.6.127:
  - Cache foomatic data for faster load time.

system-config-securitylevel-1.5.3-1
-----------------------------------
* Thu Mar 24 2005 Chris Lumens  1.5.3-1
- Rebuild .pot file.
- Return translatable strings for SELinux page (Ronny Buchmann, #152059).
- Fix GTK deprecation warnings.

system-config-services-0.8.21-1
-------------------------------
* Thu Mar 24 2005 Nils Philippsen  0.8.21-1
- connect toggled signals of service/runlevel checkboxes to enable saving again
  (#151982)
- consolidate on_optRL*_toggled
- connect delete_event of mainWindow to ask whether things should be saved
  before quitting
- tab -> space indentation to avoid ambiguity
- change some typos

vnc-4.1.1-4
-----------
* Thu Mar 24 2005 Tim Waugh  4.1.1-4
- Upgraded base package to xorg-x11-6.8.2-13.



From jonathansavage at gmail.com  Fri Mar 25 14:06:26 2005
From: jonathansavage at gmail.com (Jon Savage)
Date: Fri, 25 Mar 2005 06:06:26 -0800
Subject: RFC: Optimizing for 386 (Part 2)
In-Reply-To: <200503242356.27998.technojoecoolusa@charter.net>
References: <200503242356.27998.technojoecoolusa@charter.net>
Message-ID: <2ad7cea10503250606bcb705c@mail.gmail.com>

>You may remember about two months ago I started a flame war asking why RPM
>packages were still optimized for 386.  The best answer I heard said that
>the powers-that-be do not believe there would be a noticeable improvement,
>and if I wanted to affect real change I would need to prove them wrong.
>So I've set out to do just that.

> I'm being charged a premium for bandwidth, so please download only the
> packages you have installed.
A yum repo would be nice...
Also quantifiable *reproducabile* benchmark testing would go a long
way towards showing whether or not actual rather than perceived
performance improvements have in fact been made.
-- 
Bests,
Jon



From arjanv at redhat.com  Fri Mar 25 14:24:35 2005
From: arjanv at redhat.com (Arjan van de Ven)
Date: Fri, 25 Mar 2005 15:24:35 +0100
Subject: RFC: Optimizing for 386 (Part 2)
In-Reply-To: <200503242356.27998.technojoecoolusa@charter.net>
References: <200503242356.27998.technojoecoolusa@charter.net>
Message-ID: <1111760676.6312.72.camel@laptopd505.fenrus.org>

On Thu, 2005-03-24 at 23:56 -0600, Joseph Wagner wrote:
> Hello Linux Naysayers!
> 
> You may remember about two months ago I started a flame war asking why RPM 
> packages were still optimized for 386.  The best answer I heard said that 
> the powers-that-be do not believe there would be a noticeable improvement, 
> and if I wanted to affect real change I would need to prove them wrong.

I heard something somewhat different ;-)

The compiler folks at Red Hat benchmark this *all the time*. Basically
for every new spin of the compiler. The *compiler* has one difference in
the code it generates with the current fedora settings and an "i686"
setting as you would call it, and that is the use of the cmov
instruction. 

Our benchmarks (which are unfortunately not publishable due to
restrictions imposed by the benchmark) show that cmov is a small gain
for some processors, but is actually a small loss for the current
generation pIV processors. For most processors (including all AMD ones)
it just doesn't make any measurable difference at all.

(with "small" you should think of in the order of 5% in a cpu bound
setup; if you're not cpu bound all this doesn't matter anyway)


Now, if you want to actually build a distro with different compiler
flags that actually are really different in a more significant way, I
would suggest that you experiment with the -Os flag, eg optimize for
code size. The effects of optimizing for size are less well known,
because in a compiler output microbenchmark (as mentioned above) you
will see some stuff getting somewhat worse, but there is a macro effect
that can compensate because code takes less space, eg you can save cache
and even disk IOs potentially. (note for cmov there is no such macro
effect)


I don't want to tell you that you shouldn't do what you're going to do,
I just want to suggest to read the posts again about why the fedora
flags are what they are (and those decisions are made based on
measurements and based on information provided by the people who wrote
the compiler, eg who know what those flags actually do), and that if you
still want to do an experiment, that you do one which actually has a
chance of making a real difference...

-------------- next part --------------
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From derek.p.moore at gmail.com  Fri Mar 25 15:34:08 2005
From: derek.p.moore at gmail.com (Derek Moore)
Date: Fri, 25 Mar 2005 09:34:08 -0600
Subject: RFC: Optimizing for 386 (Part 2)
In-Reply-To: <1111739046.19895.16.camel@stargrazer.home.awesomeplay.com>
References: <200503242356.27998.technojoecoolusa@charter.net>
	<1111739046.19895.16.camel@stargrazer.home.awesomeplay.com>
Message-ID: 

> No, they aren't.  Not a single objective benchmark or measurement.  Just
> "it feels faster" with no proof that it's not just a placebo effect.
> You might have set out to prove something, but you haven't even started
> to do so yet.  Show some benchmarks.  Show how much quicker the X
> rendering show.  Show how much smaller the latency is.  Prove it.

He did the hard part of recompiling the distro, and he probably wanted
to get that released to users as soon as possible.

> of RAM, but only ask for a paltry 80GB 7200 disk?  Either you have no
> clue what you're doing, or you're trying to scam people into buying your
> new gaming box for you.  Either way, I certainly hope nobody gives you
> any money for that thing.  *snicker*

There's no need to be a prick in public.

He's not the only one that believes compiler optimizations have an
effect at runtime (if he was, Gentoo wouldn't exist).

Now that he's done the hard part of rebuilding the distro, and is
providing it to everyone at his cost, hopefully users of his packages
will submit quantitative and qualitative benchmarks of their favorite
components.

Then again, his RFC was to the attention of "Linux Naysayers", so I
guess he was expecting and inviting the response of rude and
inconsiderate folks like yourself.

Derek



From walters at redhat.com  Fri Mar 25 15:47:36 2005
From: walters at redhat.com (Colin Walters)
Date: Fri, 25 Mar 2005 10:47:36 -0500
Subject: append only file system - selinux?
In-Reply-To: <42432A00.1010309@beowulf.net>
References: <42432A00.1010309@beowulf.net>
Message-ID: <1111765656.3932.61.camel@nexus.verbum.private>

On Thu, 2005-03-24 at 15:58 -0500, Chris Stankaitis wrote:

> If there is no 2.4 kernel solution, is there a 2.6/selinux solution to 
> my problem? that would not allow anyone (even root) to do anything but 
> append to logs?

Yes, definitely.  SELinux provides a fine-grained "append" permission
for files that one can grant to specific domains for specific file types
(such as log files).

How exactly you implement this depends on which threats you are trying
to counter.  If you are simply trying to prevent a compromised daemon
program which runs as uid 0 from changing logs, you could probably stick
with the default Fedora "targeted" policy, which for a number of daemons
such as Apache HTTPD already enforces this restriction.  If you have
daemons outside the targeted set, it is typically not too difficult to
pull in the relevant policy from the "strict" into targeted, although
there are a few gotchas which we can help with on fedora-selinux-list.

In order to confine user logins (e.g. someone logging in as root via
sshd), you will need to use the "strict" policy.  You then have to make
a decision on exactly what permissions to grant to the login.  One
option is to simply place root into the user_r role (i.e. not sysadm_r).
There, the login is restricted in a way similar in effect to a Linux
non-zero uid.  However, system administration such as restarting daemons
is not possible.

It is theoretically possible to have a role similar to sysadm_r/sysadm_t
but that prevents direct access to log files.  However, it seems very
likely to me that someone with privileges similar to sysadm_t could
indirectly influence log files in other ways; e.g. by simply installing
a malicious version of a daemon package.  I imagine the same is true of
the BSD securitylevel, of course.

One nice thing about SELinux though is that you can use a tool such as
"apol" to find all of those means of influence; i.e. what is the
information flow from user_t to httpd_log_t.  With BSD security levels
you don't have any such assurance.

If you have more questions about SELinux, please ask on
fedora-selinux-list.




From jspaleta at gmail.com  Fri Mar 25 16:22:09 2005
From: jspaleta at gmail.com (Jeff Spaleta)
Date: Fri, 25 Mar 2005 11:22:09 -0500
Subject: RFC: Optimizing for 386 (Part 2)
In-Reply-To: 
References: <200503242356.27998.technojoecoolusa@charter.net>
	<1111739046.19895.16.camel@stargrazer.home.awesomeplay.com>
	
Message-ID: <604aa79105032508221d574f36@mail.gmail.com>

On Fri, 25 Mar 2005 09:34:08 -0600, Derek Moore  wrote:
> He's not the only one that believes compiler optimizations have an
> effect at runtime (if he was, Gentoo wouldn't exist).

I believe that a diet of nothing but krispy kreme doughnuts will help
me lose weight and reduce my blood pressure.  I 'feel' lighter and my
blood 'feels' less pressurized when i squeeze my arm with my hand. 
I'm waiting to get a full physical after my diet book hits the best
sellers list and my diet has become a fashionable nationwide fad.

Its hard to take anybody serviously who references 3rd party "studies"
without an attempt at citation. If he's read these studies and they
are publicly available for review, then they should be citable if not
directly linkable. If only red hat's internal benchmarks were
publishable, a lot of the noise surrounding this issue would
evaporate.

-jef"my blood doesn't 'flow'.. its more like a syrupy ooze"spaleta



From dragoran at feuerpokemon.de  Fri Mar 25 16:40:06 2005
From: dragoran at feuerpokemon.de (dragoran)
Date: Fri, 25 Mar 2005 17:40:06 +0100
Subject: RFC: Optimizing for 386 (Part 2)
In-Reply-To: <604aa79105032508221d574f36@mail.gmail.com>
References: <200503242356.27998.technojoecoolusa@charter.net>	<1111739046.19895.16.camel@stargrazer.home.awesomeplay.com>	
	<604aa79105032508221d574f36@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <42443EE6.6070006@feuerpokemon.de>

Jeff Spaleta wrote:

>On Fri, 25 Mar 2005 09:34:08 -0600, Derek Moore  wrote:
>  
>
>>He's not the only one that believes compiler optimizations have an
>>effect at runtime (if he was, Gentoo wouldn't exist).
>>    
>>
>
>I believe that a diet of nothing but krispy kreme doughnuts will help
>me lose weight and reduce my blood pressure.  I 'feel' lighter and my
>blood 'feels' less pressurized when i squeeze my arm with my hand. 
>I'm waiting to get a full physical after my diet book hits the best
>sellers list and my diet has become a fashionable nationwide fad.
>
>Its hard to take anybody serviously who references 3rd party "studies"
>without an attempt at citation. If he's read these studies and they
>are publicly available for review, then they should be citable if not
>directly linkable. If only red hat's internal benchmarks were
>publishable, a lot of the noise surrounding this issue would
>evaporate.
>
>-jef"my blood doesn't 'flow'.. its more like a syrupy ooze"spaleta
>
>  
>
I have written an app that messures the memory write throughtput.
I played abit with the mtune and march switches and result was that i386 
and i686 doesn't make a difference. But if I use athlonxp (my box has an 
athlonxp cpu) it shows better result.
I have an other box with a pentium 4 cpu I will test on it when I have 
some time.
Here are the results:
-mtune=pentium4 -march=i386: 958.7 MB/s
-mtune=pentium4 -march=i386: 958.7 MB/s
-mtune=pentium4 -march=pentium4: 958.7 MB/s
-mtune=athlon-xp -march=i386: 1032.44 MB/s
-mtune=athlon-xp -march=i686: 1032.44 MB/s
-mtune=athlon-xp -march=athlon-xp: 1032.44 MB/s



From chris at beowulf.net  Fri Mar 25 16:50:05 2005
From: chris at beowulf.net (Chris Stankaitis)
Date: Fri, 25 Mar 2005 11:50:05 -0500
Subject: append only file system - selinux?
In-Reply-To: <1111765656.3932.61.camel@nexus.verbum.private>
References: <42432A00.1010309@beowulf.net>
	<1111765656.3932.61.camel@nexus.verbum.private>
Message-ID: <4244413D.1040902@beowulf.net>

Colin Walters wrote:
> On Thu, 2005-03-24 at 15:58 -0500, Chris Stankaitis wrote:
> 
> 
>>If there is no 2.4 kernel solution, is there a 2.6/selinux solution to 
>>my problem? that would not allow anyone (even root) to do anything but 
>>append to logs?
> 
> 
> Yes, definitely.  SELinux provides a fine-grained "append" permission
> for files that one can grant to specific domains for specific file types
> (such as log files).
> 
> How exactly you implement this depends on which threats you are trying
> to counter.  If you are simply trying to prevent a compromised daemon
> program which runs as uid 0 from changing logs, you could probably stick
> with the default Fedora "targeted" policy, which for a number of daemons
> such as Apache HTTPD already enforces this restriction.  If you have
> daemons outside the targeted set, it is typically not too difficult to
> pull in the relevant policy from the "strict" into targeted, although
> there are a few gotchas which we can help with on fedora-selinux-list.
> 
> In order to confine user logins (e.g. someone logging in as root via
> sshd), you will need to use the "strict" policy.  You then have to make
> a decision on exactly what permissions to grant to the login.  One
> option is to simply place root into the user_r role (i.e. not sysadm_r).
> There, the login is restricted in a way similar in effect to a Linux
> non-zero uid.  However, system administration such as restarting daemons
> is not possible.
> 
> It is theoretically possible to have a role similar to sysadm_r/sysadm_t
> but that prevents direct access to log files.  However, it seems very
> likely to me that someone with privileges similar to sysadm_t could
> indirectly influence log files in other ways; e.g. by simply installing
> a malicious version of a daemon package.  I imagine the same is true of
> the BSD securitylevel, of course.
> 
> One nice thing about SELinux though is that you can use a tool such as
> "apol" to find all of those means of influence; i.e. what is the
> information flow from user_t to httpd_log_t.  With BSD security levels
> you don't have any such assurance.
> 
> If you have more questions about SELinux, please ask on
> fedora-selinux-list.
> 
> 

Esentially as I mentioned what we need to create is a centralized 
logging server where all our boxes will log to, which in itself is setup 
in a way so that even root can not modify the logs without it being 
painfully obvious that the server had been compromised.  We would be 
turning off logrotate, the box would be a minimal install, with it's 
only function to run a logger which would write local messages, as well 
as take in the logs from all other servers.

The issue comes when you have to try and restrict root from doing 
something :)  I'll pop onto the selinux list and start getting better 
aquainted with the in's and out's of selinux and the functions which 
could let us acomplish this.

--Chris



From walters at redhat.com  Fri Mar 25 17:29:13 2005
From: walters at redhat.com (Colin Walters)
Date: Fri, 25 Mar 2005 12:29:13 -0500
Subject: append only file system - selinux?
In-Reply-To: <4244413D.1040902@beowulf.net>
References: <42432A00.1010309@beowulf.net>
	<1111765656.3932.61.camel@nexus.verbum.private>
	<4244413D.1040902@beowulf.net>
Message-ID: <1111771753.3932.83.camel@nexus.verbum.private>

On Fri, 2005-03-25 at 11:50 -0500, Chris Stankaitis wrote:

> Esentially as I mentioned what we need to create is a centralized 
> logging server where all our boxes will log to, which in itself is setup 
> in a way so that even root can not modify the logs without it being 
> painfully obvious that the server had been compromised.  

I guess the question is - what requirements for system administration do
you have?  Will the machine run sshd?  Should the "root" user be able to
perform administration over sshd?  If so, what kinds of administration?
Restarting daemons?  Installing packages?  Rebooting?

> We would be 
> turning off logrotate, the box would be a minimal install, with it's 
> only function to run a logger which would write local messages, as well 
> as take in the logs from all other servers.

If the machine is only running syslogd exposed to the network, i.e. no
sshd, then I think you're already basically there with the syslogd
policy in Fedora.  A compromised or buggy syslogd (even though it runs
as uid 0) can only append to log files.  For example, try this:

yum install setools-gui
apol -p /etc/selinux/targeted/policy/policy.18

Then click on the "Analysis" tab.  Then "Direct Information Flow".  In
the starting type box, enter "syslogd_t".  In the "Find end types" box,
enter ".*_log_t$" (i.e. all types ending in _log_t).  Then click "New".
Under the "Direct Information Flow Tree", click var_log_t (which is the
type of /var/log/messages, which is what you're primarily concerned
with).  Note that apol tells you the direct flow from syslogd_t to
var_log_t is:

 allow syslogd_t var_log_t : file { ioctl create getattr setattr append link };

The important thing to note here is that there is no "write" permission
granted from the syslogd_t domain to files with type var_log_t; only
"append".

You can also see transitive flows by using the "Transitive Information
Flow" tab.

> The issue comes when you have to try and restrict root from doing 
> something :)  

Right; that's why I'm trying to get more clarification from you as to
exactly what "root" means and what that user needs to be able to do.



From ph18 at cornell.edu  Fri Mar 25 17:33:04 2005
From: ph18 at cornell.edu (Paul A. Houle)
Date: Fri, 25 Mar 2005 12:33:04 -0500
Subject: RFC: Optimizing for 386 (Part 2)
In-Reply-To: 
References: <200503242356.27998.technojoecoolusa@charter.net>
	<1111739046.19895.16.camel@stargrazer.home.awesomeplay.com>
	
Message-ID: 

On Fri, 25 Mar 2005 09:34:08 -0600, Derek Moore   
wrote:

>
>> of RAM, but only ask for a paltry 80GB 7200 disk?  Either you have no
>> clue what you're doing, or you're trying to scam people into buying your
>> new gaming box for you.  Either way, I certainly hope nobody gives you
>> any money for that thing.  *snicker*

	People who grew up using PC's usually think SCSI disks are a big waste
of money.  My experience is that they're 2-3x faster for doing compiles.   
If I had a little
money to spend on building a compile system,  I'd seriously consider  
getting a few
9GB SCSI drives off ebay and using them for a temp directory to do  
compiles on.

>
> He's not the only one that believes compiler optimizations have an
> effect at runtime (if he was, Gentoo wouldn't exist).

      People who've tested it have observed that Gentoo is slower than most  
Linux distributions,  in particular,  Red Hat.

> Now that he's done the hard part of rebuilding the distro, and is
> providing it to everyone at his cost, hopefully users of his packages
> will submit quantitative and qualitative benchmarks of their favorite
> components.
>

	I'd really like to see what difference the Intel compiler makes.

	Another interesting question is what to do on AMD64.  We know that some  
things run faster in 32-bvbit mode and others run faster in 64-bit mode.   
(RAM use is different too,  which has knock-on effects on performance.)

	Solaris (both for SPARC and x86) ships with a 32-bit userspace and both  
32-bit and 64-bit kernels;  this has the nice effect that you can install  
Solaris 10 on any x86 box with one set of disks.  I think this is a good  
decision for SPARC (Debian does this for SPARC) but it's probably not so  
good on x86,  which benefits from the extra registers in x86-64.

	Still,  there might be some people who'd like an x86-64 kernel with a  
32-bit userspace (it would work like a Xeon box with PAE;  a good setup  
for a mod_perl web server with >4G of RAM.)  For top performance,  one  
could imagine shipping a 32-bit or 64-bit binary depending on what's  
fastest for a particular app.



From remco at rvt.com  Fri Mar 25 20:00:23 2005
From: remco at rvt.com (Remco Treffkorn)
Date: Fri, 25 Mar 2005 12:00:23 -0800
Subject: append only file system - selinux?
In-Reply-To: <4244413D.1040902@beowulf.net>
References: <42432A00.1010309@beowulf.net>
	<1111765656.3932.61.camel@nexus.verbum.private>
	<4244413D.1040902@beowulf.net>
Message-ID: <200503251200.24176.remco@rvt.com>

On Friday 25 March 2005 08:50, Chris Stankaitis wrote:
> Esentially as I mentioned what we need to create is a centralized
> logging server where all our boxes will log to, which in itself is setup
> in a way so that even root can not modify the logs without it being
> painfully obvious that the server had been compromised.  We would be
> turning off logrotate, the box would be a minimal install, with it's
> only function to run a logger which would write local messages, as well
> as take in the logs from all other servers.

So why not just prevent any logins on this box? No users, no root login 
allowed.

Admin would have to be done using a rescue CD or something similar.

-- 
Remco Treffkorn (RT445)
HAM DC2XT
remco at rvt.com   (831) 685-1201



From daly at rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu  Fri Mar 25 18:58:41 2005
From: daly at rio.sci.ccny.cuny.edu (Tim Daly)
Date: Fri, 25 Mar 2005 13:58:41 -0500
Subject: append only file system - selinux?
In-Reply-To: <42432A00.1010309@beowulf.net> (message from Chris Stankaitis on
	Thu, 24 Mar 2005 15:58:40 -0500)
References: <42432A00.1010309@beowulf.net>
Message-ID: <200503251858.NAA26331@springbok.sci.ccny.cuny.edu>

Chris,

>here is my issue, for security certification purposes I need to be able 
>to create an append only file system for logs, such that no one *even 
>root* will be able to futz with the log files on my log server.

Write the files to CD-Rom in multi-session mode. It may even be the case
that there is a continuous-journal kind of file system (one in which the
journal is never collapsed). Such a file system would just continuously
write the file system to CD. This is conceptually a write-once tape.

Since you're not creating file logs at CD rates (one hopes) there will
be a window where someone could modify a log entry before you write it
to a session.

Tim Daly



From pjones at redhat.com  Fri Mar 25 20:39:14 2005
From: pjones at redhat.com (Peter Jones)
Date: Fri, 25 Mar 2005 15:39:14 -0500
Subject: RFC: Optimizing for 386 (Part 2)
In-Reply-To: 
References: <200503242356.27998.technojoecoolusa@charter.net>
	<1111739046.19895.16.camel@stargrazer.home.awesomeplay.com>
	
Message-ID: <1111783155.25844.15.camel@localhost.localdomain>

On Fri, 2005-03-25 at 09:34 -0600, Derek Moore wrote:
[Sean's text skipped]
> There's no need to be a prick in public.

Oh please, read what he's responding to.

On Thu, 2005-03-24 at 23:56 -0600, Joseph Wagner wrote:
> Hello Linux Naysayers!

No comment.

> You may remember about two months ago I started a flame war asking why RPM 
> packages were still optimized for 386.  The best answer I heard said that 
> the powers-that-be do not believe there would be a noticeable improvement, 
> and if I wanted to affect real change I would need to prove them wrong.

As I recall, the best answers were that we do optimize for newer cpus,
we just don't use the compiler flag which tells gcc to generate _one
more instruction_ (!) which would make the binaries unusable on older
processors.  Where that one instruction would makes a significant
difference, we build target-specific packages, such as we do with glibc
and the kernel.

It's also been mentioned that several packages include hand-coded
assembly which uses many more features of newer cpus than would code
generated by gcc with different optimization options.  Those routines
are typically selected at runtime, meaning the packages themselves are
still for the i386 arch.

On Fri, 2005-03-25 at 09:34 -0600, Derek Moore wrote:
> He's not the only one that believes compiler optimizations have an
> effect at runtime (if he was, Gentoo wouldn't exist).

No, he's not the only one of this opinion, but he is the one clearly
ignoring the relevant threads on the subject.

It's really easy to be very frustrated on this subject.  In the presence
of clear and useful information as to the reasoning for the choice of
the CFLAGS used in Fedora, we have to ignorant people slamming the right
decisions again and again and again.

> Now that he's done the hard part of rebuilding the distro

That's really not the hard part.  At worst, it's the *slow* part.  See,
we ship the distro with these things called "source rpms", and they're
pretty neat.  They include instructions on how to build themselves, and
we also provide tools that can use those instructions to automatically
build *for* you!

-- 
        Peter



From warren at togami.com  Fri Mar 25 22:33:41 2005
From: warren at togami.com (Warren Togami)
Date: Fri, 25 Mar 2005 12:33:41 -1000
Subject: RFC: Optimizing for 386 (Part 2)
In-Reply-To: 
References: <200503242356.27998.technojoecoolusa@charter.net>	<1111739046.19895.16.camel@stargrazer.home.awesomeplay.com>
	
Message-ID: <424491C5.7060105@togami.com>

Derek Moore wrote:
> 
> He's not the only one that believes compiler optimizations have an
> effect at runtime (if he was, Gentoo wouldn't exist).

http://funroll-loops.org/

Warren



From mattdm at mattdm.org  Sat Mar 26 05:11:28 2005
From: mattdm at mattdm.org (Matthew Miller)
Date: Sat, 26 Mar 2005 00:11:28 -0500
Subject: RFC: Optimizing for 386 (Part 2)
In-Reply-To: <1111783155.25844.15.camel@localhost.localdomain>
References: <200503242356.27998.technojoecoolusa@charter.net>
	<1111739046.19895.16.camel@stargrazer.home.awesomeplay.com>
	
	<1111783155.25844.15.camel@localhost.localdomain>
Message-ID: <20050326051128.GA15726@jadzia.bu.edu>

On Fri, Mar 25, 2005 at 03:39:14PM -0500, Peter Jones wrote:
> It's really easy to be very frustrated on this subject.  In the presence
> of clear and useful information as to the reasoning for the choice of
> the CFLAGS used in Fedora, we have to ignorant people slamming the right
> decisions again and again and again.

We could change it so i386 packages are instead "x86_32".




(Um, not serious, by the way.)

-- 
Matthew Miller           mattdm at mattdm.org        
Boston University Linux      ------>                



From symbiont at berlios.de  Sat Mar 26 06:20:50 2005
From: symbiont at berlios.de (Jeff Pitman)
Date: Sat, 26 Mar 2005 14:20:50 +0800
Subject: RFC: Optimizing for 386 (Part 2)
In-Reply-To: <424491C5.7060105@togami.com>
References: <200503242356.27998.technojoecoolusa@charter.net>
	
	<424491C5.7060105@togami.com>
Message-ID: <200503261420.51166.symbiont@berlios.de>

On Saturday 26 March 2005 06:33, Warren Togami wrote:
> http://funroll-loops.org/

That was about as intelligent as the following:

http://www.eglug.org/node/491

If people want to experiment, let them, even if they might be wrong.  
Their time.  Flaming doesn't help anyone.  

The obvious response to all of this is that benchmarks are needed.  Once 
that is out in the open along with method of capturing the data, then 
someone will be proven right.

-- 
-jeff



From buildsys at redhat.com  Sat Mar 26 12:59:53 2005
From: buildsys at redhat.com (Build System)
Date: Sat, 26 Mar 2005 07:59:53 -0500
Subject: rawhide report: 20050326 changes
Message-ID: <200503261259.j2QCxrHk015333@porkchop.devel.redhat.com>

 

 
Updated Packages:

NetworkManager-0.4-4.cvs20050315.3.0
------------------------------------
* Fri Mar 25 2005 Christopher Aillon  0.4-4.cvs20050315
- Update the GTK+ theme icon cache on (un)install

anaconda-10.2.0.33-1
--------------------
* Fri Mar 25 2005 Bill Nottingham  - 10.2.0.33-1
- fix typo in partedUtils.py

control-center-1:2.10.0-2
-------------------------
* Fri Mar 25 2005 Christopher Aillon  2.10.0-2
- Update the GTK+ theme icon cache on (un)install

desktop-printing-0.18-7
-----------------------
* Fri Mar 25 2005 Christopher Aillon  0.18-7
- Update the GTK+ theme icon cache on (un)install

eclipse-1:3.1.0_fc-0.M5.14
--------------------------
* Fri Mar 25 2005 Christopher Aillon  3.1.0_fc-0.M5.14
- Update the GTK+ theme icon cache on (un)install

* Fri Mar 18 2005 Andrew Overholt  3.1.0_fc-0.M5.13
- Re-add compilation of resources.jar.
- Backport bootstrapping patch.
- Add Requires: java-1.4.2-gcj-compat.
- Modified find patch courtesy Ziga Mahkovec (RH#149927#).
- Compile with -O2 on ppc as well.
- Add jsch, jakarta-commons-modeler, and mx4j symlinking.
- Make use of gcj-dbtool -f to create databases in install.
- Use system-wide classmap.db.
- Remove *.jarswithnativelibs from files sections.
- Update mozilla dependency.

* Mon Mar 07 2005 Ben Konrath  3.1.0_fc-0.M5.12
- Add activeHelpSample.jar patch.
- Change to Fedora M-build splash screen.
- Add find patch courtesy Ziga Mahkovec (RH#149927#)
- Build native stuff with -O2 on i386.

firefox-0:1.0.2-2
-----------------
* Fri Mar 25 2005 Christopher Aillon  0:1.0.2-2
- Make the "browser.link.open_external" pref work (David Fraser)

gconf-editor-2.10.0-2
---------------------
* Fri Mar 25 2005 Christopher Aillon  2.10.0-2
- Update the GTK+ theme icon cache on (un)install

gdm-1:2.6.0.7-6
---------------
* Fri Mar 25 2005 Christopher Aillon  1:2.6.0.7-6
- Update the GTK+ theme icon cache on (un)install

gimp-2:2.2.4-6
--------------
* Fri Mar 25 2005 Christopher Aillon 
- Update the GTK+ theme icon cache on (un)install

glibc-2.3.4-18
--------------
* Fri Mar 25 2005 Jakub Jelinek  2.3.4-18
- fix build on 64-bit arches with new GCC

* Thu Mar 24 2005 Jakub Jelinek  2.3.4-17
- update from CVS
  - fix LD_AUDIT in LinuxThreads ld.so
  - fix calloc with M_PERTURB
  - fix error handling in pthread_create with PTHREAD_EXPLICIT_SCHED
    on ppc*/ia64/alpha/mips (BZ#801)
  - fix a typo in WINDOWS-31J charmap (#151739)
  - fix NIS ypprot_err (#151469)

gnome-applets-1:2.10.0-2
------------------------
* Fri Mar 25 2005 Christopher Aillon  2.10.0-2
- Update the GTK+ theme icon cache on (un)install

gnome-netstatus-2.10.0-2
------------------------
* Fri Mar 25 2005 Christopher Aillon  2.10.0-2
- Update the GTK+ theme icon cache on (un)install

gnome-panel-2.10.0-2
--------------------
* Fri Mar 25 2005 Christopher Aillon  2.10.0-2
- Update the GTK+ theme icon cache on (un)install

gnome-terminal-2.10.0-1
-----------------------
* Fri Mar 25 2005 Christopher Aillon  2.10.0-1
- Update to 2.10.0

hicolor-icon-theme-0.7-2
------------------------
* Fri Mar 25 2005 Christopher Aillon  0.7-2
- Update the GTK+ theme icon cache on (un)install

slocate-2.7-17
--------------
* Fri Mar 25 2005 Miloslav Trmac  - 2.7-17
- Update to debian slocate_2.7-4 (#151710)
- Fix comment parsing in /etc/updatedb.conf (#135952)
- Exclude /var/spool/squid and /var/spool/cups (#150388)
- Remove 'export' lines from /etc/updatedb.conf to avoid the false impression
  that the file is a shell script

system-config-date-1.7.15-2
---------------------------
* Fri Mar 25 2005 Christopher Aillon  1.17.15-2
- Update the GTK+ theme icon cache on (un)install

system-config-display-1.0.25-2
------------------------------
* Fri Mar 25 2005 Christopher Aillon  1.0.25-2
- Update the GTK+ theme icon cache on (un)install

system-config-keyboard-1.2.5-2
------------------------------
* Fri Mar 25 2005 Christopher Aillon  1.2.5-2
- Update the GTK+ theme icon cache on (un)install

system-config-kickstart-2.5.21-3
--------------------------------
* Fri Mar 25 2005 Christopher Aillon  2.5.21-3
- Update the GTK+ theme icon cache on (un)install

system-config-language-1.1.8-2
------------------------------
* Fri Mar 25 2005 Christopher Aillon  1.1.8-2
- Update the GTK+ theme icon cache on (un)install

system-config-nfs-1.3.5-2
-------------------------
* Fri Mar 25 2005 Christopher Aillon  1.3.5-2
- Update the GTK+ theme icon cache on (un)install

system-config-rootpassword-1.1.6-2
----------------------------------
* Fri Mar 25 2005 Christopher Aillon  1.1.6-2
- Update the GTK+ theme icon cache on (un)install

system-config-samba-1.2.28-2
----------------------------
* Fri Mar 25 2005 Christopher Aillon  1.2.28-2
- Update the GTK+ theme icon cache on (un)install

system-config-securitylevel-1.5.3-2
-----------------------------------
* Fri Mar 25 2005 Christopher Aillon  1.5.3-2
- Update the GTK+ theme icon cache on (un)install

system-config-services-0.8.21-2
-------------------------------
* Fri Mar 25 2005 Christopher Aillon  0.8.21-2
- Update the GTK+ theme icon cache on (un)install

system-config-soundcard-1.2.10-2
--------------------------------
* Fri Mar 25 2005 Christopher Aillon  1.2.10-2
- Update the GTK+ theme icon cache on (un)install

system-config-users-1.2.28-2
----------------------------
* Fri Mar 25 2005 Christopher Aillon  1.2.28-2
- Update the GTK+ theme icon cache on (un)install

talk-0.17-29
------------
* Fri Mar 25 2005 Miloslav Trmac  - 0.17-29
- Fix spurious 0x9a ("^Z") on window resize

tcsh-6.14-1
-----------
* Fri Mar 25 2005 Miloslav Trmac  - 6.14-1
- Update to tcsh-6.14.00

tvtime-0.9.15-5
---------------
* Fri Mar 25 2005 Christopher Aillon  0.9.15-5
- Update the GTK+ theme icon cache on (un)install

vino-2.10.0-1
-------------
* Fri Mar 25 2005 Christopher Aillon  2.10.0-1
- Update to 2.10.0
- Update the GTK+ theme icon cache on (un)install

vnc-4.1.1-5
-----------
* Fri Mar 25 2005 Christopher Aillon  4.1.1-5
- Update the GTK+ theme icon cache on (un)install

x3270-3.3.3.b2-2
----------------
* Fri Mar 25 2005 Christopher Aillon  3.3.3.b2-2
- Update the GTK+ theme icon cache on (un)install

xchat-1:2.4.2-2
---------------
* Fri Mar 25 2005 Christopher Aillon  1:2.4.2-2
- Add user's away message to right click menu, if known



From urs.rau at uk.om.org  Sat Mar 26 13:27:43 2005
From: urs.rau at uk.om.org (Urs Rau)
Date: Sat, 26 Mar 2005 13:27:43 +0000
Subject: question about samba.spec (3.0.11-6 FC4_3.90)
Message-ID: <4245634F.609@uk.om.org>

Dear Jay Fenlason and/or Tim Waugh,

Could one of you please confirm I need to quickly roll my own samba 
3.0.13 rpm, for a modified FC2 machine, as we are currently using 
3.0.11-4 (rebuilt from your 3.0.11-4  FC4_3.90) and have run into a 
couple problems with printing, and I am using your FC4 test1_3.90 
3.0.11-6 as a "template". So far I think I understand your spec file but 
in the part

# copy Red Hat specific scripts
cp %{SOURCE5} packaging/RedHat/
cp %{SOURCE6} packaging/RedHat/
cp %{SOURCE7} packaging/RedHat/
cp %{SOURCE8} packaging/RedHat/winbind.init

shouldn't this be

# copy Fedora specific scripts
cp %{SOURCE5} packaging/Fedora/
cp %{SOURCE6} packaging/Fedora/
cp %{SOURCE7} packaging/Fedora/
cp %{SOURCE8} packaging/Fedora/winbind.init

Seeing that this is a fedora rpm ?

What I am hoping to achieve is that I can test this new 3.0.13 while 
everybody is out and then be ready on Tuesday morning with a fixed samba 
3.0.13.

Thanks for any pointers on this anybody can give me.

Regards,

-- 
Urs Rau
Head of Operations (Admin, Finance & IT)
Operation Mobilisation
UK National Office



From thacker at math.cornell.edu  Sat Mar 26 14:38:27 2005
From: thacker at math.cornell.edu (John Thacker)
Date: Sat, 26 Mar 2005 09:38:27 -0500
Subject: rawhide report: 20050326 changes
In-Reply-To: <200503261259.j2QCxrHk015333@porkchop.devel.redhat.com>
References: <200503261259.j2QCxrHk015333@porkchop.devel.redhat.com>
Message-ID: <20050326143827.GA14049@thacker.dyndns.org>

On Sat, Mar 26, 2005 at 07:59:53AM -0500, Build System wrote:

> NetworkManager-0.4-4.cvs20050315.3.0
> control-center-1:2.10.0-2
> desktop-printing-0.18-7
> eclipse-1:3.1.0_fc-0.M5.14
> gconf-editor-2.10.0-2
> gdm-1:2.6.0.7-6
> gimp-2:2.2.4-6
> gnome-applets-1:2.10.0-2
> gnome-netstatus-2.10.0-2
> gnome-panel-2.10.0-2
> hicolor-icon-theme-0.7-2
> system-config-date-1.7.15-2
> system-config-display-1.0.25-2
> system-config-keyboard-1.2.5-2
> system-config-kickstart-2.5.21-3
> system-config-language-1.1.8-2
> system-config-nfs-1.3.5-2
> system-config-rootpassword-1.1.6-2
> system-config-samba-1.2.28-2
> system-config-securitylevel-1.5.3-2
> system-config-services-0.8.21-2
> system-config-soundcard-1.2.10-2
> system-config-users-1.2.28-2
> tvtime-0.9.15-5
> vino-2.10.0-1
> vnc-4.1.1-5
> x3270-3.3.3.b2-2
> ----------------
> * Fri Mar 25 2005 Christopher Aillon  3.3.3.b2-2
> - Update the GTK+ theme icon cache on (un)install

So all these have the same changes, and all of them contain the same
wrong post% and postun% script.  They all say 
 if [-x /usr/bin/gtk-update-icon-cache ]; then
  	 gtk-update-icon-cache %{_datadir}/icons/hicolor
 fi

when they should say

 if [ -x /usr/bin/gtk-update-icon-cache ]; then
	 gtk-update-icon-cache %{_datadir}/icons/hicolor
 fi

No space, "[-x" instead of "[ -x".  This gives a bunch of nasty
  Updating  : vnc                          ####################### [19/75]
/var/tmp/rpm-tmp.41538: line 2: [-x: command not found

type errors, and the scripts aren't actually run.

John Thacker
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From mike at navi.cx  Sat Mar 26 16:41:21 2005
From: mike at navi.cx (Mike Hearn)
Date: Sat, 26 Mar 2005 16:41:21 +0000
Subject: rawhide report: 20050326 changes
References: <200503261259.j2QCxrHk015333@porkchop.devel.redhat.com>
	<20050326143827.GA14049@thacker.dyndns.org>
Message-ID: 

On Sat, 26 Mar 2005 09:38:27 -0500, John Thacker wrote:
>  if [-x /usr/bin/gtk-update-icon-cache ]; then
>   	 gtk-update-icon-cache %{_datadir}/icons/hicolor
>  fi

Why is this even necessary, surely GTK+ should automatically update the
cache? There's no mention of having to run this command in the spec
(obviously). Does this mean if you follow the spec to the letter, it
still won't work until you deal with implementation details of a toolkit?

thanks -mike



From johnp at redhat.com  Sat Mar 26 16:41:11 2005
From: johnp at redhat.com (John (J5) Palmieri)
Date: Sat, 26 Mar 2005 11:41:11 -0500
Subject: rawhide report: 20050326 changes
In-Reply-To: 
References: <200503261259.j2QCxrHk015333@porkchop.devel.redhat.com>
	<20050326143827.GA14049@thacker.dyndns.org>
	
Message-ID: <1111855272.15388.56.camel@localhost.localdomain>

On Sat, 2005-03-26 at 16:41 +0000, Mike Hearn wrote:
> On Sat, 26 Mar 2005 09:38:27 -0500, John Thacker wrote:
> >  if [-x /usr/bin/gtk-update-icon-cache ]; then
> >   	 gtk-update-icon-cache %{_datadir}/icons/hicolor
> >  fi
> 
> Why is this even necessary, surely GTK+ should automatically update the
> cache? There's no mention of having to run this command in the spec
> (obviously). Does this mean if you follow the spec to the letter, it
> still won't work until you deal with implementation details of a toolkit?
> 
> thanks -mike

I believe it has to run as root or you would have this huge cache for
each user.  Actually I don't think it is all that big right now but
there are plans that will make the cache huge in the future.  There has
been some discussion on having a daemon or cron job do this work but for
right now the post scrip is the simple solution.
 
-- 
J5



From mike at navi.cx  Sat Mar 26 19:08:41 2005
From: mike at navi.cx (Mike Hearn)
Date: Sat, 26 Mar 2005 19:08:41 +0000
Subject: rawhide report: 20050326 changes
References: <200503261259.j2QCxrHk015333@porkchop.devel.redhat.com>
	<20050326143827.GA14049@thacker.dyndns.org>
	
	<1111855272.15388.56.camel@localhost.localdomain>
Message-ID: 

On Sat, 26 Mar 2005 11:41:11 -0500, John (J5) Palmieri wrote:
> I believe it has to run as root or you would have this huge cache for
> each user.  Actually I don't think it is all that big right now but
> there are plans that will make the cache huge in the future.  There has
> been some discussion on having a daemon or cron job do this work but for
> right now the post scrip is the simple solution.

OK so it's not actually necessary, if the cache is stale things still
work? If so then yes a cron job or whatever would be perfect.

thanks -mike




From johnp at redhat.com  Sat Mar 26 19:27:34 2005
From: johnp at redhat.com (John (J5) Palmieri)
Date: Sat, 26 Mar 2005 14:27:34 -0500
Subject: rawhide report: 20050326 changes
In-Reply-To: 
References: <200503261259.j2QCxrHk015333@porkchop.devel.redhat.com>
	<20050326143827.GA14049@thacker.dyndns.org>
	
	<1111855272.15388.56.camel@localhost.localdomain>
	
Message-ID: <1111865255.15388.60.camel@localhost.localdomain>

On Sat, 2005-03-26 at 19:08 +0000, Mike Hearn wrote:

> OK so it's not actually necessary, if the cache is stale things still
> work? If so then yes a cron job or whatever would be perfect.

I think Matthias was saying that we need to add the ability for dealing
with stale caches but that it would be trivial to add.
 
--
J5 



From elprodigio at gmail.com  Sun Mar 27 08:26:25 2005
From: elprodigio at gmail.com (Didier Casse)
Date: Sun, 27 Mar 2005 16:26:25 +0800
Subject: RFC: Optimizing for 386 (Part 2)
In-Reply-To: 
References: <200503242356.27998.technojoecoolusa@charter.net>
	<1111739046.19895.16.camel@stargrazer.home.awesomeplay.com>
	
Message-ID: <513a3b305032700262e769ae9@mail.gmail.com>

On Fri, 25 Mar 2005 09:34:08 -0600, Derek Moore  wrote:
> He's not the only one that believes compiler optimizations have an
> effect at runtime (if he was, Gentoo wouldn't exist).

Another breed called Arch Linux seems to believe that i686-optimized
packagers would be better than the i386-optimized ones.

http://www.archlinux.org/about.php

I came across this a while ago, that's why I ask a simlar question in
the fedora-list mailing list.

A friend told me that he felt the power with arch linux. He used
Fedora before and complained that Fedora was getting bloated and
claimed arch linux was delivering more performance. Oh well I can't
really compare or couldn't verify it but I'm really happy with Fedora.

-- 
Cheers,
Didier.

------------
Didier F.B Casse | PhD candidate | LiMiNT Beamline
Singapore Synchrotron Light Source (SSLS), 5 Research Link, Singapore 117603
Email: elprodigioREMOVE_THIS_ANTISPAM_MOJO at gmail.com|
Web: http://ssls.nus.edu.sg | GPG Key 1024D/B3C57D01 2004-06-23



From dragoran at feuerpokemon.de  Sun Mar 27 08:31:57 2005
From: dragoran at feuerpokemon.de (dragoran)
Date: Sun, 27 Mar 2005 10:31:57 +0200
Subject: RFC: Optimizing for 386 (Part 2)
In-Reply-To: <513a3b305032700262e769ae9@mail.gmail.com>
References: <200503242356.27998.technojoecoolusa@charter.net>	<1111739046.19895.16.camel@stargrazer.home.awesomeplay.com>	
	<513a3b305032700262e769ae9@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <42466F7D.4000908@feuerpokemon.de>

Didier Casse wrote:

>On Fri, 25 Mar 2005 09:34:08 -0600, Derek Moore  wrote:
>  
>
>>He's not the only one that believes compiler optimizations have an
>>effect at runtime (if he was, Gentoo wouldn't exist).
>>    
>>
>
>Another breed called Arch Linux seems to believe that i686-optimized
>packagers would be better than the i386-optimized ones.
>
>http://www.archlinux.org/about.php
>
>I came across this a while ago, that's why I ask a simlar question in
>the fedora-list mailing list.
>
>A friend told me that he felt the power with arch linux. He used
>Fedora before and complained that Fedora was getting bloated and
>claimed arch linux was delivering more performance. Oh well I can't
>really compare or couldn't verify it but I'm really happy with Fedora.
>
>  
>
I tryed arch linux but it wasn't faster than fedora (the only difference 
was that it takes much longer to boot with default config) ... they also 
have kernel and glibc rpms for pentium4 and athlon.



From buildsys at redhat.com  Sun Mar 27 13:01:38 2005
From: buildsys at redhat.com (Build System)
Date: Sun, 27 Mar 2005 08:01:38 -0500
Subject: rawhide report: 20050327 changes
Message-ID: <200503271301.j2RD1cYK031319@porkchop.devel.redhat.com>

 

 
Updated Packages:

kernel-2.6.11-1.1208_FC4
------------------------
* Sun Mar 27 2005 Dave Jones 
- 2.6.12rc1-bk2

rdesktop-1.4.0-2
----------------
* Sat Mar 26 2005 Jose Pedro Oliveira  - 1.4.0-2
- Use the %configure macro (rdesktop now has a real configure file).
- Patch rdesktop-optflags.patch no longer needed.
- Add several missing doc files.



From alan at redhat.com  Sun Mar 27 14:52:20 2005
From: alan at redhat.com (Alan Cox)
Date: Sun, 27 Mar 2005 09:52:20 -0500
Subject: RFC: Optimizing for 386 (Part 2)
In-Reply-To: 
References: <200503242356.27998.technojoecoolusa@charter.net>
	<1111739046.19895.16.camel@stargrazer.home.awesomeplay.com>
	
	
Message-ID: <20050327145220.GA3908@devserv.devel.redhat.com>

On Fri, Mar 25, 2005 at 12:33:04PM -0500, Paul A. Houle wrote:
> money to spend on building a compile system,  I'd seriously consider  
> getting a few 9GB SCSI drives off ebay and using them for a temp directory 
> to do  compiles on.

At current prices its even more effective IMHO to get a box with 2-4GB of RAM and
just load the entire compile environment into ramdisk, cvs checkout the
devel code off disk into ramdisk and build in ram



From kaspars at os.lv  Sun Mar 27 16:46:07 2005
From: kaspars at os.lv (Kaspars)
Date: Sun, 27 Mar 2005 19:46:07 +0300
Subject: Firefox slows down pc......
Message-ID: <4246E34F.5010500@os.lv>


  Hi,

  I search and don`t see that there is topic about my problem yet and 
don`t know is this here...
  I`m using fresh FC3 reinstalled for week and updated, problem is that 
something like to eat my pc power and I found that it is firefox... New 
firefox when opened couple tabs (last 5) and all try to download some 
site was fulling my memory/processor, top of the "top":
19.0 10.1   2:10.66 firefox-bin
10.2 50.3  11:52.26 X
and load start to fullfill: load average: 5.31, 3.43, 1.98

Last time load was go so high that something kill some process and pc 
freeze. Only reboot help...
So I`m thinking what to do, I have all updated etc. Start to think to 
compile maybe by my self ff. Don`t know what to do...
Pc is year old Toshiba Satellite with p4 and 256ram.


Casper



From jfm512 at free.fr  Sun Mar 27 18:40:46 2005
From: jfm512 at free.fr (Jean Francois Martinez)
Date: Sun, 27 Mar 2005 20:40:46 +0200
Subject: RFC: Optimizing for 386 (Part 2)
In-Reply-To: 
References: <200503242356.27998.technojoecoolusa@charter.net>
	<1111739046.19895.16.camel@stargrazer.home.awesomeplay.com>
	
Message-ID: <1111948846.6501.133.camel@agnes.fremen.dune>

On Fri, 2005-03-25 at 09:34 -0600, Derek Moore wrote:
> > No, they aren't.  Not a single objective benchmark or measurement.  Just
> > "it feels faster" with no proof that it's not just a placebo effect.
> > You might have set out to prove something, but you haven't even started
> > to do so yet.  Show some benchmarks.  Show how much quicker the X
> > rendering show.  Show how much smaller the latency is.  Prove it.
> 
> He did the hard part of recompiling the distro, and he probably wanted
> to get that released to users as soon as possible.
> 
> > of RAM, but only ask for a paltry 80GB 7200 disk?  Either you have no
> > clue what you're doing, or you're trying to scam people into buying your
> > new gaming box for you.  Either way, I certainly hope nobody gives you
> > any money for that thing.  *snicker*
> 
> There's no need to be a prick in public.
> 
> He's not the only one that believes compiler optimizations have an
> effect at runtime (if he was, Gentoo wouldn't exist).
> 

And at one point there were people who believed they could get rich
by transmuting lead into gold. 

That kind of uberhackers tends to have some points in common

1) They are completely unaware of some trivial economic concepts like
"Return on Investment".  Let's give a practical example:  Assume my box
spends a week building Gentoo/Fedora with super-super-super-optimized
compiling flags and I get a 10% improvement at pure-CPU tasks.  That
means I will need 10 weeks (2 months and half) to recover my investment
but this is assumming a) I don't power off my machine  b) my machine
ever has something to do instead of simply waiting for keyboard input
c) that thing being done is a pure CPU task, ie no disk I/O  d) Bug
fixes and security alerts don't force me to upgrade (and thus recompile)
any significant piece of software.  

2) They tend to completely ignore the issues involved when building
software: Autoconf will build a binary according of what software is
installed in the box.  If something is missing at times it aborts the
building but most of the time it will just silently build a package
without the "optional" feature.  Then you spend days struggling with
Samba and wondering why the damned thing doesn't work with active
directory or doesn't support ACLs.  And it could be worse: imagine
when the problem is not your software not finding the "optional"
library but that when the library was built it didn't find that other
library with that nifty feature.  Did I mention that when you start
playing that kind of games you introduce a variability who makes
nearly impossible to support you?

3) They haven't read the gcc manual.  They don't know about the 
-mcpu= and the -march= distinction and I have seen a guy recommend
recompiling the kernel with -03.  Hint: at that time -O3 was just
an abbreviation for "-O3 -finline-functions" and having the
compiler try to inline functions in a program, like the kernel,
where the programmer has already inlined the useful functions will only
SLOW it.  

4)  They don't cross-check assertions, they don't quantify,
they don't run benchmarks and the rare times they do they
compare apples and oranges.  This could be acceptable for art
students but we are supposed to be engineers isn't it?
As an example I ran on an article who discussed the need of
doing a burn-in test when you get a new computer and that
while Linux distros don't come with a deidcted burn in program
"you have a very good test who is compiling the kernel".   Of
course the assertion is silly: compiling the kernel does zero
FPU instructions, about zero MMX instructions and on an Athlon
2000 the processor spends over 40% of the time doing nothing
(I measured it :-)) and thus cooling.  In fact compiling the
kernel raised the temperature of my Athlon by a mere 5 degrees
Celsius ie it is completely useless for detecting flaky 
processors.  The author of the article was Arnold Robbins, Gentoo's
author.

BTW: On Fedora 3, gcc 3.4.2, athlon XP 2000+
 I ran the nbyte benchmark after compiling it a la RedHat
ie  "-O2 -mcpu=i686" and with "-O2 -march=athlon-xp"
The optimized program was 4% faster at the memory tests,
15% at the integer tests (due to being 50% faster on one test)
and only 0.8% faster on floating point.  It was not done
"scientifically" ie no daemons, no network, same processor temperature
at start of test.  It was done with same kernel and same glibc.
A kernel optimized for athlon would have had zero influence since
the test spends very little time in kernel mode, an optimized
glibc (like when you recompile entirely your distribution) could
have had some effect specially for the FP tests.  However RedHat
does not compile the glibc with -mcpu=i686 but with -march=i686
and this is only 3 or 4% slower on an Athlon than -march=athlon.  
Using the SSE unit for floating point in the libm would have
improved results but since SSE doesn't suppport double precision
it would create an interesting problem for maintaining the
Makefile.  Using -mfpmath=sse for compiling the benchmark itself
produced zero improvements: I think most/all FP work is done through
calls to the libm. 

    
-- 
Jean Francois Martinez 



From ivg2 at cornell.edu  Sun Mar 27 19:49:16 2005
From: ivg2 at cornell.edu (Ivan Gyurdiev)
Date: Sun, 27 Mar 2005 14:49:16 -0500
Subject: Gnome panel menus
In-Reply-To: <1111171110.5407.1.camel@localhost.localdomain>
References: <1111171110.5407.1.camel@localhost.localdomain>
Message-ID: <1111952957.24791.4.camel@cobra.ivg2.net>

On Fri, 2005-03-18 at 18:38 +0000, Paul wrote:
> Hi,
> 
> Anyone else seeing that all except the redhat/gnome menu on the panel
> have vanished? Is this due to moving to 2.10 of gnome and having to
> renew the menus or is it something else?

Yes - what is going on with the menus?
First the preferences/system settings disappeared, for the last few
months. I decided that's because they're in Places/Desktop (if you're
using the Menu Bar as opposed to the single menu). So I started using
that. Now, however, it's all back in the main menu, and it duplicates
the things in Places/Desktop on the Menu Bar. Make up your minds..
I was just starting to like how the Menu Bar works, separating apps
from the other stuff. It's more logical that way.

-- 
Ivan Gyurdiev 
Cornell University



From ivg2 at cornell.edu  Sun Mar 27 20:24:09 2005
From: ivg2 at cornell.edu (Ivan Gyurdiev)
Date: Sun, 27 Mar 2005 15:24:09 -0500
Subject: Gnome panel menus
In-Reply-To: <1111952957.24791.4.camel@cobra.ivg2.net>
References: <1111171110.5407.1.camel@localhost.localdomain>
	<1111952957.24791.4.camel@cobra.ivg2.net>
Message-ID: <1111955049.30110.20.camel@cobra.ivg2.net>

... and the names are still pretty random.

First, there's things that lack description, like:

LyX, Evolution, NmapFE, Eclipse, VI ImProved, pitivi..


Then, all the jpackage names make no sense at all:

jEdit, logfactor 5, jalopy settings, chainsaw

Then, there's the storm of players. I have one of each: "Audio Player",
"Media Player", "Music Player",  "Movie Player", and a "Multimedia
Player." Helix is just a "Player".

How about this:

Rhythmbox Music Player 
(or just Music Player, if the GNOME 
 name-removal policy still applies)
Xmms Music Player

Helix Movie Player
Xine Movie Player
Totem Movie Player
Mplayer Movie Player

(and it would be nice if this was sorted by the Music/Movie portion of
the name too)

Then, there's things with unclear description, like:

"Marlin sample editor" - this edits something, but the name doesn't tell
me what it is - "samples"?

-- 
Ivan Gyurdiev 
Cornell University



From lkml at mac.com  Sun Mar 27 23:31:21 2005
From: lkml at mac.com (Felipe Alfaro Solana)
Date: Mon, 28 Mar 2005 01:31:21 +0200
Subject: What's happening to Xen?
Message-ID: 

Hello,

I see that Xen hasn't been updated for a while. Also, the kernel-xen0 
and kernel-xenU packages have disappeared, and the latest 1208 kernels 
have Xen support disabled as it doesn't compile yet.

Any official information on the status of Xen? Is it possible to 
publish the 1185 series of kernels, that had support for Xen, 
somewhere?

Thanks.



From loony at loonybin.org  Mon Mar 28 00:14:10 2005
From: loony at loonybin.org (Peter Arremann)
Date: Sun, 27 Mar 2005 19:14:10 -0500
Subject: What's happening to Xen?
In-Reply-To: 
References: 
Message-ID: <200503271914.11000.loony@loonybin.org>

On Sunday 27 March 2005 18:31, Felipe Alfaro Solana wrote:
> Hello,
>
> I see that Xen hasn't been updated for a while. Also, the kernel-xen0
> and kernel-xenU packages have disappeared, and the latest 1208 kernels
> have Xen support disabled as it doesn't compile yet.
>
> Any official information on the status of Xen? Is it possible to
> publish the 1185 series of kernels, that had support for Xen,
> somewhere?
>
> Thanks.

There was a discussion about that on the -test list today already... 
Its a known iss and is being worked...

>On Sun, Mar 27, 2005 at 12:55:38PM -0500, Paul Iadonisi wrote:
> >   Methinks this code in the kernel spec file is backwards:
> > =-=-=
> > %define FC3 0
> > %define FC4 1
> > 
> > %define buildup 1
> > %define buildsmp 1
> > %if %{FC4}
> > %define buildxen 0
> > %endif
> > =-=-=
> > 
> >   The '%define buildxen 0' should be '%define buildxen 1', should it
> > not?  They've been missing for a few releases, up to the current 1208
> > kernel.
>
> Its currently broken, so turned off deliberatly.
>
>               Dave



From thuforuk at yahoo.co.uk  Mon Mar 28 00:34:23 2005
From: thuforuk at yahoo.co.uk (Dariusz J. Garbowski)
Date: Mon, 28 Mar 2005 01:34:23 +0100
Subject: Gnome panel menus
In-Reply-To: <1111955049.30110.20.camel@cobra.ivg2.net>
References: <1111171110.5407.1.camel@localhost.localdomain>	<1111952957.24791.4.camel@cobra.ivg2.net>
	<1111955049.30110.20.camel@cobra.ivg2.net>
Message-ID: <4247510F.5080006@yahoo.co.uk>

On 03/27/2005 09:24 PM, Ivan Gyurdiev wrote:
> Then, there's the storm of players. I have one of each: "Audio Player",
> "Media Player", "Music Player",  "Movie Player", and a "Multimedia
> Player." Helix is just a "Player".
> 
> How about this:
> 
> Rhythmbox Music Player 
> (or just Music Player, if the GNOME 
>  name-removal policy still applies)
> Xmms Music Player
> 
> Helix Movie Player
> Xine Movie Player
> Totem Movie Player
> Mplayer Movie Player

+1

"Movie Player", "PDF Viewer", "Email", "Browser", whatever... These 
names, although perhaps more helpful for those who are unfamiliar or 
less familiar with Linux software, are quite meaningless for those who 
know what app exactly they want to run. What will start when I choose 
"Some player" or "Some viewer" thing? Worse, it changes from release to 
release and from distro to distro... This is one of the reasons why I 
find myself avoiding menus completely and still running everything from 
commandline -- at least I know what I run ;-)

I like proposed naming scheme and I see it used sometimes, e.g. by Dag's 
packages. Would be nice if it became standard naming convention.

Regards,
Dariusz



From ivg2 at cornell.edu  Mon Mar 28 01:34:06 2005
From: ivg2 at cornell.edu (Ivan Gyurdiev)
Date: Sun, 27 Mar 2005 20:34:06 -0500
Subject: Gnome panel menus
In-Reply-To: <4247510F.5080006@yahoo.co.uk>
References: <1111171110.5407.1.camel@localhost.localdomain>
	<1111952957.24791.4.camel@cobra.ivg2.net>
	<1111955049.30110.20.camel@cobra.ivg2.net>
	<4247510F.5080006@yahoo.co.uk>
Message-ID: <1111973647.1119.32.camel@cobra.ivg2.net>


> "Movie Player", "PDF Viewer", "Email", "Browser", whatever... These 
> names, although perhaps more helpful for those who are unfamiliar or 
> less familiar with Linux software, are quite meaningless for those who 
> know what app exactly they want to run. What will start when I choose 
> "Some player" or "Some viewer" thing? Worse, it changes from release to 
> release and from distro to distro... This is one of the reasons why I 
> find myself avoiding menus completely and still running everything from 
> commandline -- at least I know what I run ;-)
> 
> I like proposed naming scheme and I see it used sometimes, e.g. by Dag's 
> packages. Would be nice if it became standard naming convention.

My complaint (at least one of them) was that the suffix ("X player")
differs for every player, and that's annoying. I think one or two
suffixes should be used, and names should be sorted by suffix.

Your complaint is different - you're saying that some apps only have
suffix, and no name, and that's a bad thing. IIRC the policy decided
upon was to make the GNOME defaults have no name, and other applications
in the same category have a name. This was so that new users wouldn't be
confused, while users knowledgeable enough could go and install
something else in addition to the defaults, and be able to tell it
apart. There was a whole discussion about this, and people w/ power (not
me) decided to accept this convention. I can't remember where the
discussion was - either on bugzilla, or somewhere on gnome/freedesktop
lists.

What I find annoying is that whatever convention was accepted
is not being followed at all. I pointed out a bunch of packages with 
no suffix in my original mail, as well as how the suffix differs for no
reason. There's also one Audio Player, and one Music Player, and I
that's two apps w/out names in the same category, which is *bad*.

-- 
Ivan Gyurdiev 
Cornell University



From mclasen at redhat.com  Mon Mar 28 02:13:12 2005
From: mclasen at redhat.com (Matthias Clasen)
Date: Sun, 27 Mar 2005 21:13:12 -0500
Subject: rawhide report: 20050326 changes
In-Reply-To: 
References: <200503261259.j2QCxrHk015333@porkchop.devel.redhat.com>
	<20050326143827.GA14049@thacker.dyndns.org>
	
	<1111855272.15388.56.camel@localhost.localdomain>
	
Message-ID: <1111975992.3185.2.camel@x1-6-00-50-fc-70-9f-e0>

On Sat, 2005-03-26 at 19:08 +0000, Mike Hearn wrote:
> On Sat, 26 Mar 2005 11:41:11 -0500, John (J5) Palmieri wrote:
> > I believe it has to run as root or you would have this huge cache for
> > each user.  Actually I don't think it is all that big right now but
> > there are plans that will make the cache huge in the future.  There has
> > been some discussion on having a daemon or cron job do this work but for
> > right now the post scrip is the simple solution.
> 
> OK so it's not actually necessary, if the cache is stale things still
> work? If so then yes a cron job or whatever would be perfect.
> 
> thanks -mike
> 
> 

If gtk recognizes the cache as stale, then yes, it ignores it. But in
order mark it as stale, apps installing new icons must change the mtime
of the toplevel theme directory (following the icon theme spec). Thus we
would need a %post even if we had a cron job.

Matthias




From florin at andrei.myip.org  Mon Mar 28 04:56:40 2005
From: florin at andrei.myip.org (Florin Andrei)
Date: Sun, 27 Mar 2005 20:56:40 -0800
Subject: glibc-kernheaders not enough
Message-ID: <1111985800.27891.19.camel@rivendell.home.local>

Apparently, the kernel headers provided with Fedora are not enough in
some situations. Here's a generic case:

http://snort-inline.sourceforge.net/FAQ.html#compiling

And here's a concrete one:

http://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/message.php?msg_id=11296216

Any guidelines or "best practices" for such cases?

-- 
Florin Andrei

http://florin.myip.org/



From arjanv at redhat.com  Mon Mar 28 07:45:46 2005
From: arjanv at redhat.com (Arjan van de Ven)
Date: Mon, 28 Mar 2005 09:45:46 +0200
Subject: glibc-kernheaders not enough
In-Reply-To: <1111985800.27891.19.camel@rivendell.home.local>
References: <1111985800.27891.19.camel@rivendell.home.local>
Message-ID: <1111995946.6297.83.camel@laptopd505.fenrus.org>

On Sun, 2005-03-27 at 20:56 -0800, Florin Andrei wrote:
> Apparently, the kernel headers provided with Fedora are not enough in

the assumption that they are kernel headers is not right

> And here's a concrete one:
> 
> http://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/message.php?msg_id=11296216

 /lib/modules/2.6.10-1.770_FC3/build/include/linux/config.h:6:2: #error
 including kernel header in userspace; use the glibc headers instead!
 In file included

that's the kernel headers not the glibc-kernheaders

-------------- next part --------------
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From florin at andrei.myip.org  Mon Mar 28 08:42:02 2005
From: florin at andrei.myip.org (Florin Andrei)
Date: Mon, 28 Mar 2005 00:42:02 -0800
Subject: glibc-kernheaders not enough
In-Reply-To: <1111995946.6297.83.camel@laptopd505.fenrus.org>
References: <1111985800.27891.19.camel@rivendell.home.local>
	<1111995946.6297.83.camel@laptopd505.fenrus.org>
Message-ID: <1111999322.32635.66.camel@rivendell.home.local>

On Mon, 2005-03-28 at 09:45 +0200, Arjan van de Ven wrote:
> On Sun, 2005-03-27 at 20:56 -0800, Florin Andrei wrote:
> > Apparently, the kernel headers provided with Fedora are not enough in
> 
> the assumption that they are kernel headers is not right



Arjan, do you know the joke with the helicopter pilot flying through the
fog nearby the Microsoft campus? (*)

Anyway, what i'm saying is, you pointed out all i did wrong, but offered
nothing towards solving the problem i raised.
If you look at the snort-inline FAQ i posted, they solve the problem by
unpacking the kernel source, moving /usr/include/linux off the way and
replacing it with parts of the kernel source. I was saying that this is
a very ugly thing on an RPM-managed system and i asked what is
considered "best practices" in such cases on Fedora.


(*)
Pilot: "Where am i?"
Guy at window in a tall building: "In a helicopter, flying through the
fog."
Pilot: "Oh thanks, now i know this is the Microsoft campus."
Guy: "How did you figure?"
Pilot: "You offered me an answer that was perfectly true, yet perfectly
useless."

No offense, i hope. :-)

-- 
Florin Andrei

http://florin.myip.org/



From sopwith at redhat.com  Mon Mar 28 09:58:26 2005
From: sopwith at redhat.com (Elliot Lee)
Date: Mon, 28 Mar 2005 04:58:26 -0500 (EST)
Subject: FC4test2 freeze heads-up
Message-ID: 

Hi all,

The freeze for FC4test2 is scheduled for April 4. Practically speaking,
for you this means that this is a last call for bug reports to have
considered for fixing in that milestone. Remember, if it's not in
bugzilla, it doesn't exist! :-)

Best,
-- Elliot



From kyrre at solution-forge.net  Mon Mar 28 10:24:05 2005
From: kyrre at solution-forge.net (Kyrre Ness Sjobak)
Date: Mon, 28 Mar 2005 12:24:05 +0200
Subject: Firefox slows down pc......
In-Reply-To: <4246E34F.5010500@os.lv>
References: <4246E34F.5010500@os.lv>
Message-ID: <1112005445.3349.23.camel@localhost.localdomain>

s?n, 27.03.2005 kl. 18.46 skrev Kaspars:
>   Hi,
> 
>   I search and don`t see that there is topic about my problem yet and 
> don`t know is this here...
>   I`m using fresh FC3 reinstalled for week and updated, problem is that 
> something like to eat my pc power and I found that it is firefox... New 
> firefox when opened couple tabs (last 5) and all try to download some 
> site was fulling my memory/processor, top of the "top":
> 19.0 10.1   2:10.66 firefox-bin
> 10.2 50.3  11:52.26 X
> and load start to fullfill: load average: 5.31, 3.43, 1.98
> 
> Last time load was go so high that something kill some process and pc 
> freeze. Only reboot help...
> So I`m thinking what to do, I have all updated etc. Start to think to 
> compile maybe by my self ff. Don`t know what to do...
> Pc is year old Toshiba Satellite with p4 and 256ram.
> 
> 
> Casper

Just wondering: Do you have a bunch of flashy flash animations open?
Flash tend to eat cpu for breakfast...



From mike at navi.cx  Mon Mar 28 12:17:01 2005
From: mike at navi.cx (Mike Hearn)
Date: Mon, 28 Mar 2005 13:17:01 +0100
Subject: rawhide report: 20050326 changes
References: <200503261259.j2QCxrHk015333@porkchop.devel.redhat.com>
	<20050326143827.GA14049@thacker.dyndns.org>
	
	<1111855272.15388.56.camel@localhost.localdomain>
	
	<1111975992.3185.2.camel@x1-6-00-50-fc-70-9f-e0>
Message-ID: 

On Sun, 27 Mar 2005 21:13:12 -0500, Matthias Clasen wrote:
> If gtk recognizes the cache as stale, then yes, it ignores it. But in
> order mark it as stale, apps installing new icons must change the mtime
> of the toplevel theme directory (following the icon theme spec). Thus we
> would need a %post even if we had a cron job.

By the top level theme directory do you mean /usr/share/icons or
/usr/share/icons/$themename? The spec seemed a bit ambiguous on that point.

thanks -mike



From rdieter at math.unl.edu  Mon Mar 28 12:47:40 2005
From: rdieter at math.unl.edu (Rex Dieter)
Date: Mon, 28 Mar 2005 06:47:40 -0600
Subject: menus, Name/GenericName
In-Reply-To: <4247510F.5080006@yahoo.co.uk>
References: <1111171110.5407.1.camel@localhost.localdomain>	<1111952957.24791.4.camel@cobra.ivg2.net>	<1111955049.30110.20.camel@cobra.ivg2.net>
	<4247510F.5080006@yahoo.co.uk>
Message-ID: <4247FCEC.1020808@math.unl.edu>

Dariusz J. Garbowski wrote:

> "Movie Player", "PDF Viewer", "Email", "Browser", whatever... These 
> names, although perhaps more helpful for those who are unfamiliar or 
> less familiar with Linux software, are quite meaningless for those who 
> know what app exactly they want to run. What will start when I choose 
> "Some player" or "Some viewer" thing? Worse, it changes from release to 
> release and from distro to distro... This is one of the reasons why I 
> find myself avoiding menus completely and still running everything from 
> commandline -- at least I know what I run ;-)

Amen brother.  I've harped on that several times.

IMO, the correct/proper solution is already available.  The (free) 
.desktop standard already allows for each app to have
Name=
GenericName=

So, if Evolution's case,
Name=Evolution
GenericName=Email

and it is up the the menuing system to display these.  KDE allows for 
display options:
Name only
Name (Generic Name)
GenericName (Name)

I'm guessing the reason this hadn't yet been adopted by Fedora Core is 
because Gnome didn't support the use of GenericName (hopefully that's 
not the case anymore).

-- Rex



From buildsys at redhat.com  Mon Mar 28 13:04:23 2005
From: buildsys at redhat.com (Build System)
Date: Mon, 28 Mar 2005 08:04:23 -0500
Subject: rawhide report: 20050328 changes
Message-ID: <200503281304.j2SD4N4m016380@porkchop.devel.redhat.com>

 

 
Updated Packages:

gd-2.0.33-1
-----------
* Tue Mar 22 2005 Than Ngo  2.0.33-1
- 2.0.33 #150717
- apply the patch from Jose Pedro Oliveira
  - Added the release macro to the subpackages requirements versioning
  - Handled the gdlib-config movement to gd-devel in a differment manner
  - Added fontconfig-devel to the build requirements
  - Added xorg-x11-devel to the build requirements (Xpm)
  - Removed explicit /sbin/ldconfig requirement (gd rpm)
  - Removed explicit perl requirement (gd-progs rpm)
  - Added several missing documentation files (including the license file)
  - Replaced %makeinstall by make install DESTDIR=...

* Thu Mar 10 2005 Than Ngo  2.0.32-3
- move gdlib-config in devel

* Wed Mar 02 2005 Phil Knirsch  2.0.32-2
- bump release and rebuild with gcc 4

memtest86+-1.55-1
-----------------
* Sun Mar 27 2005 Warren Togami  - 1.55-1
- 1.55

w3m-0.5.1-8
-----------
* Mon Mar 28 2005 Akira TAGOH  - 0.5.1-8
- w3m-cvs-20050328.patch: updated to CVS snapshot to support gtk2.



From ivg2 at cornell.edu  Mon Mar 28 13:16:36 2005
From: ivg2 at cornell.edu (Ivan Gyurdiev)
Date: Mon, 28 Mar 2005 08:16:36 -0500
Subject: menus, Name/GenericName
In-Reply-To: <4247FCEC.1020808@math.unl.edu>
References: <1111171110.5407.1.camel@localhost.localdomain>
	<1111952957.24791.4.camel@cobra.ivg2.net>
	<1111955049.30110.20.camel@cobra.ivg2.net>
	<4247510F.5080006@yahoo.co.uk> <4247FCEC.1020808@math.unl.edu>
Message-ID: <1112015796.1514.208.camel@cobra.ivg2.net>

On Mon, 2005-03-28 at 06:47 -0600, Rex Dieter wrote:
> Dariusz J. Garbowski wrote:
> 
> > "Movie Player", "PDF Viewer", "Email", "Browser", whatever... These 
> > names, although perhaps more helpful for those who are unfamiliar or 
> > less familiar with Linux software, are quite meaningless for those who 
> > know what app exactly they want to run. What will start when I choose 
> > "Some player" or "Some viewer" thing? Worse, it changes from release to 
> > release and from distro to distro... This is one of the reasons why I 
> > find myself avoiding menus completely and still running everything from 
> > commandline -- at least I know what I run ;-)
> 
> Amen brother.  I've harped on that several times.
> 
> IMO, the correct/proper solution is already available.  The (free) 
> .desktop standard already allows for each app to have
> Name=
> GenericName=
> 
> So, if Evolution's case,
> Name=Evolution
> GenericName=Email

IIRC that was also rejected, because it didn't work with translations
when combining the two names (left-to-right, right-to-left text?)

For non-defaults I think it was decided:
Name=Evolution Email
GenericName=Email  (or whatever the translation is).

Then Name would be displayed. Too bad that convention's also not being
followed.

See, this looks perfect to me, because you should be able to sort on the
GenericName field and have things show up next to each other. I
suggested sorting, but nobody cared last time. OTOH would sorting on
GenericName create the same language problems as combining the two
names?

-- 
Ivan Gyurdiev 
Cornell University



From rdieter at math.unl.edu  Mon Mar 28 13:29:51 2005
From: rdieter at math.unl.edu (Rex Dieter)
Date: Mon, 28 Mar 2005 07:29:51 -0600
Subject: menus, Name/GenericName
In-Reply-To: <1112015796.1514.208.camel@cobra.ivg2.net>
References: <1111171110.5407.1.camel@localhost.localdomain>	<1111952957.24791.4.camel@cobra.ivg2.net>	<1111955049.30110.20.camel@cobra.ivg2.net>	<4247510F.5080006@yahoo.co.uk>
	<4247FCEC.1020808@math.unl.edu>
	<1112015796.1514.208.camel@cobra.ivg2.net>
Message-ID: <424806CF.1040602@math.unl.edu>

Ivan Gyurdiev wrote:
> On Mon, 2005-03-28 at 06:47 -0600, Rex Dieter wrote:
> 
>>Dariusz J. Garbowski wrote:
>>
>>
>>>"Movie Player", "PDF Viewer", "Email", "Browser", whatever... These 
>>>names, although perhaps more helpful for those who are unfamiliar or 
>>>less familiar with Linux software, are quite meaningless for those who 
>>>know what app exactly they want to run. What will start when I choose 
>>>"Some player" or "Some viewer" thing? Worse, it changes from release to 
>>>release and from distro to distro... This is one of the reasons why I 
>>>find myself avoiding menus completely and still running everything from 
>>>commandline -- at least I know what I run ;-)
>>
>>Amen brother.  I've harped on that several times.
>>
>>IMO, the correct/proper solution is already available.  The (free) 
>>.desktop standard already allows for each app to have
>>Name=
>>GenericName=
>>
>>So, if Evolution's case,
>>Name=Evolution
>>GenericName=Email
> 
> 
> IIRC that was also rejected, because it didn't work with translations
> when combining the two names (left-to-right, right-to-left text?)

Huh?  What's broken about
Name (GenericName)
and/or
(GenericName) Name
???

Never have I seen it suggested that Name and GenericName be simply 
concatenated.  (Don't forget the parens).

If Fedora doesn't agree with this, they ought work upstream with 
freedesktop.org instead of inventing a new (more broken IMO) 
standard/scheme.

> For non-defaults I think it was decided:
> Name=Evolution Email
> GenericName=Email  (or whatever the translation is).

Which looks retarded for KDE users using either "Name (GenericName)" or 
"GenericName (Name)" menu displays.

-- Rex



From ivg2 at cornell.edu  Mon Mar 28 13:53:35 2005
From: ivg2 at cornell.edu (Ivan Gyurdiev)
Date: Mon, 28 Mar 2005 08:53:35 -0500
Subject: menus, Name/GenericName
In-Reply-To: <424806CF.1040602@math.unl.edu>
References: <1111171110.5407.1.camel@localhost.localdomain>
	<1111952957.24791.4.camel@cobra.ivg2.net>
	<1111955049.30110.20.camel@cobra.ivg2.net>	<4247510F.5080006@yahoo.co.uk>
	<4247FCEC.1020808@math.unl.edu>
	<1112015796.1514.208.camel@cobra.ivg2.net>
	<424806CF.1040602@math.unl.edu>
Message-ID: <1112018016.1514.246.camel@cobra.ivg2.net>


> Huh?  What's broken about
> Name (GenericName)
> and/or
> (GenericName) Name
> ???
> 
> Never have I seen it suggested that Name and GenericName be simply 
> concatenated.  (Don't forget the parens).

Well I have... on a bugzilla. 
I couldn't figure out why that is either - I can imagine
problems if languages read right-to-left, but I don't know exactly.

> If Fedora doesn't agree with this, they ought work upstream with 
> freedesktop.org instead of inventing a new (more broken IMO) 
> standard/scheme.

I think it was the freedesktop people that pointed this out.
I even saw a beta standard somewhere including that.
You'll make me dig this up, but I don't have time right now - I will 
post some links later.

> > For non-defaults I think it was decided:
> > Name=Evolution Email
> > GenericName=Email  (or whatever the translation is).
> 
> Which looks retarded for KDE users using either "Name (GenericName)" or 
> "GenericName (Name)" menu displays.

Well, I use GNOME, so I don't know about that.
Anyway, as a proof that I'm not dreaming all of this look at the Firefox
and Gnumeric menu entries.

-- 
Ivan Gyurdiev 
Cornell University



From rdieter at math.unl.edu  Mon Mar 28 13:56:20 2005
From: rdieter at math.unl.edu (Rex Dieter)
Date: Mon, 28 Mar 2005 07:56:20 -0600
Subject: menus, Name/GenericName
In-Reply-To: <1112018016.1514.246.camel@cobra.ivg2.net>
References: <1111171110.5407.1.camel@localhost.localdomain>	<1111952957.24791.4.camel@cobra.ivg2.net>	<1111955049.30110.20.camel@cobra.ivg2.net>	<4247510F.5080006@yahoo.co.uk>	<4247FCEC.1020808@math.unl.edu>	<1112015796.1514.208.camel@cobra.ivg2.net>	<424806CF.1040602@math.unl.edu>
	<1112018016.1514.246.camel@cobra.ivg2.net>
Message-ID: <42480D04.3010608@math.unl.edu>

Ivan Gyurdiev wrote:

>>Never have I seen it suggested that Name and GenericName be simply 
>>concatenated.  (Don't forget the parens).

> Well I have... on a bugzilla. 
> I couldn't figure out why that is either - I can imagine
> problems if languages read right-to-left, but I don't know exactly.

Right, which is one reason why I think simple concatenation is not a 
good idea, though I wouldn't mind it being added as a display option... 
similar to KDE's options of Name (GenericName), GenericName (Name)... 
(as long as I'm not forced to use it).

-- Rex



From ivg2 at cornell.edu  Mon Mar 28 14:15:05 2005
From: ivg2 at cornell.edu (Ivan Gyurdiev)
Date: Mon, 28 Mar 2005 09:15:05 -0500
Subject: menus, Name/GenericName
In-Reply-To: <42480D04.3010608@math.unl.edu>
References: <1111171110.5407.1.camel@localhost.localdomain>
	<1111952957.24791.4.camel@cobra.ivg2.net>
	<1111955049.30110.20.camel@cobra.ivg2.net>	<4247510F.5080006@yahoo.co.uk>
	<4247FCEC.1020808@math.unl.edu>	<1112015796.1514.208.camel@cobra.ivg2.net>
	<424806CF.1040602@math.unl.edu>
	<1112018016.1514.246.camel@cobra.ivg2.net>
	<42480D04.3010608@math.unl.edu>
Message-ID: <1112019305.5811.3.camel@cobra.ivg2.net>

On Mon, 2005-03-28 at 07:56 -0600, Rex Dieter wrote:
> Ivan Gyurdiev wrote:
> 
> >>Never have I seen it suggested that Name and GenericName be simply 
> >>concatenated.  (Don't forget the parens).
> 
> > Well I have... on a bugzilla. 
> > I couldn't figure out why that is either - I can imagine
> > problems if languages read right-to-left, but I don't know exactly.
> 
> Right, which is one reason why I think simple concatenation is not a 
> good idea, though I wouldn't mind it being added as a display option... 
> similar to KDE's options of Name (GenericName), GenericName (Name)... 
> (as long as I'm not forced to use it).

cc-ed the person that was clarifying this to me at the time
(bclark at redhat.com)

People are asking what the freedesktop HIG says, the menus are still a
mess, and there's confusion - see entire thread. Thank you 
for fixing some of the menu bugs...

-- 
Ivan Gyurdiev 
Cornell University



From mclasen at redhat.com  Mon Mar 28 14:12:32 2005
From: mclasen at redhat.com (Matthias Clasen)
Date: Mon, 28 Mar 2005 09:12:32 -0500
Subject: rawhide report: 20050326 changes
In-Reply-To: 
References: <200503261259.j2QCxrHk015333@porkchop.devel.redhat.com>
	<20050326143827.GA14049@thacker.dyndns.org>
	
	<1111855272.15388.56.camel@localhost.localdomain>
	
	<1111975992.3185.2.camel@x1-6-00-50-fc-70-9f-e0>
	
Message-ID: <1112019152.28956.12.camel@golem.boston.redhat.com>

On Mon, 2005-03-28 at 13:17 +0100, Mike Hearn wrote:
> On Sun, 27 Mar 2005 21:13:12 -0500, Matthias Clasen wrote:
> > If gtk recognizes the cache as stale, then yes, it ignores it. But in
> > order mark it as stale, apps installing new icons must change the mtime
> > of the toplevel theme directory (following the icon theme spec). Thus we
> > would need a %post even if we had a cron job.
> 
> By the top level theme directory do you mean /usr/share/icons or
> /usr/share/icons/$themename? The spec seemed a bit ambiguous on that point.
> 

/usr/share/icons/$themename




From fedora-devel at camperquake.de  Mon Mar 28 14:31:27 2005
From: fedora-devel at camperquake.de (Ralf Ertzinger)
Date: Mon, 28 Mar 2005 16:31:27 +0200
Subject: FC4test2 freeze heads-up
In-Reply-To: 
References: 
Message-ID: <20050328163127.4228fe0e@nausicaa.camperquake.de>

Moin.

Elliot Lee  wrote:

> The freeze for FC4test2 is scheduled for April 4. Practically speaking,
> for you this means that this is a last call for bug reports to have
> considered for fixing in that milestone. Remember, if it's not in
> bugzilla, it doesn't exist! :-)

Is there a way to mark bugs for this release? I'd like to promote
https://bugzilla.redhat.com/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=151978
Otherwise users of older Macs (those having a R128 card) will not get
a working X.

-- 
"For my birthday I got a humidifier and a de-humidifier... I put them in
the same room and let them fight it out..."
        	-- Steven Wright



From jdesbonnet at gmail.com  Mon Mar 28 15:03:00 2005
From: jdesbonnet at gmail.com (Joe Desbonnet)
Date: Mon, 28 Mar 2005 16:03:00 +0100
Subject: Virtual update repository using RPM deltas
Message-ID: <1cef3e9505032807031184d4be@mail.gmail.com>

I've fixed a few bugs in my experimental virtual update repository.
This is ideal for anyone with a fast computer and a slow internet
connection. You can expect savings of up to 70% in bandwidth when
updating packages.

A Tomcat server (or similar) is required. 

The release notes to the latest version is here:
http://www.wombat.ie/software/rpmdc/releasenotes-0.1.1.html

The distribution is here:
http://www.wombat.ie/software/rpmdc/downloads/rpmdc-0.1.1.tar.gz

I've updated my delta repository (see
http://rpmdelta.wombat.ie/rpmdelta/fc3/i386/)
however as I only have about 200MB of free space, not all the packages
were included.

I would like to thank  Michael Schroeder from SuSE for pointing out
that he's already got an excellent system already working for the SuSE
distribution. His delta RPM software compares the content of an RPM on
a file by file basis (I'm currently just treating the RPM as one
binary blob after expanding the cpio archive). It seems that this
approach yields  better compression and requires less CPU cycles and
memory to generate the delta files. If there is interest I'll explore
this approach next.

Joe.



From bobgus at rcn.com  Mon Mar 28 15:22:50 2005
From: bobgus at rcn.com (Bob Gustafson)
Date: Mon, 28 Mar 2005 09:22:50 -0600
Subject: USB host to host connection ??
Message-ID: 

I have a Compaq USB 2.0 Link adapter which has a wart in the middle of the
cable containing a Prolific Technology Inc. 2501 chip and unknown
microprocessor and memory, etc.

It is to connect a Gateway Solo 2150 laptop (new disk with Fedora 3 -
pretty well updated using CDROMs and updates burned to CDROM) with desktop
Fedora3smp.

Most everything else works nicely (tested on the desktop) - watching the
/var/log/messages, I can plug in a Keyspan USB serial, Macintosh USB
keyboard, Yahoo mini optical mouse, Flash USB drive - marvelous actions and
everything cites works as expected. Keyboard takes over as console
keyboard, Flash drive icon appears on desktop - marvelous.

However, the host to host only puts one line in the log file:

Mar 26 12:07:04 hoho2 kernel: usb 1-4: USB disconnect, address 3
Mar 26 12:07:10 hoho2 kernel: usb 1-4: new high speed USB device using
ehci_hcd and address 4

(Actually two lines - one when I pulled it out, the 2nd when I pushed it in).

The other end of the cable is plugged into the Gateway (to get power..)
although it does not seem to make it more intelligent at this stage.

I updated hotplug and udev (to 50) and set DEBUG=true on udev. (on desktop)

Reading through the man pages and documentation on hotplug and udev, it is
not so clear as to whether hotplug is even working on my system (no
hotplugd daemon), or whether it should. Lots of documentation, but then
words later saying, Oh, if you have a 2.6 system .. something else happens.

It would be nice to have a doc that tells where an event comes into the
system at the begining, and then it is passed off to xyz, which then passes
if off to abc.. Sort of the ankle bone connected to the leg bone, connected
to the knee bone song.

The Compaq gadget came with a mini-CD, but it is for Windows only. Maybe
there is something essential here?

Hoping for a clue

Bob Gustafson

[root at hoho2 ~]# cd /sys/bus/usb
[root at hoho2 usb]# ls
devices  drivers
[root at hoho2 usb]# cd devices
[root at hoho2 devices]# ls
1-0:1.0  1-4  1-4:1.0  2-0:1.0  3-0:1.0  4-0:1.0  usb1  usb2  usb3  usb4
[root at hoho2 devices]# cd 1-4
[root at hoho2 1-4]# ls
1-4:1.0              bDeviceSubClass     configuration  idVendor      serial
bcdDevice            bmAttributes        detach_state   manufacturer  speed
bConfigurationValue  bMaxPower           devnum         maxchild      version
bDeviceClass         bNumConfigurations  driver         power
bDeviceProtocol      bNumInterfaces      idProduct      product
[root at hoho2 1-4]# cat idProduct
2501
[root at hoho2 1-4]# cat manufacturer
Prolific Technology Inc.
[root at hoho2 1-4]#

--
fedora-list mailing list
fedora-list at redhat.com
To unsubscribe: http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list



From cra at WPI.EDU  Mon Mar 28 15:52:04 2005
From: cra at WPI.EDU (Chuck R. Anderson)
Date: Mon, 28 Mar 2005 10:52:04 -0500
Subject: Virtual update repository using RPM deltas
In-Reply-To: <1cef3e9505032807031184d4be@mail.gmail.com>
References: <1cef3e9505032807031184d4be@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <20050328155204.GS25414@angus.ind.WPI.EDU>

On Mon, Mar 28, 2005 at 04:03:00PM +0100, Joe Desbonnet wrote:
> I would like to thank  Michael Schroeder from SuSE for pointing out
> that he's already got an excellent system already working for the SuSE
> distribution. His delta RPM software compares the content of an RPM on
> a file by file basis (I'm currently just treating the RPM as one
> binary blob after expanding the cpio archive). It seems that this
> approach yields  better compression and requires less CPU cycles and
> memory to generate the delta files. If there is interest I'll explore
> this approach next.

Would you be interested in exploring using librsync against old cached
RPMS in /var/cache/yum and the update RPMS on the server?  If this
works well, then no special repositories need be generated.  Then we
can investigate repackaging filesystem files back into RPM files
instead of relying on locally cached RPM packages.



From caillon at redhat.com  Mon Mar 28 16:20:21 2005
From: caillon at redhat.com (Christopher Aillon)
Date: Mon, 28 Mar 2005 11:20:21 -0500
Subject: rawhide report: 20050326 changes
In-Reply-To: <20050326143827.GA14049@thacker.dyndns.org>
References: <200503261259.j2QCxrHk015333@porkchop.devel.redhat.com>
	<20050326143827.GA14049@thacker.dyndns.org>
Message-ID: <42482EC5.6020301@redhat.com>

John Thacker wrote:
> On Sat, Mar 26, 2005 at 07:59:53AM -0500, Build System wrote:
> 
>>x3270-3.3.3.b2-2
>>----------------
>>* Fri Mar 25 2005 Christopher Aillon  3.3.3.b2-2
>>- Update the GTK+ theme icon cache on (un)install
> 
> 
> So all these have the same changes, and all of them contain the same
> wrong post% and postun% script. 

Should be fixed in tomorrow's rawhide.



From dag at wieers.com  Mon Mar 28 21:50:03 2005
From: dag at wieers.com (Dag Wieers)
Date: Mon, 28 Mar 2005 23:50:03 +0200 (CEST)
Subject: RFC: Optimizing for 386 (Part 2)
In-Reply-To: <20050327145220.GA3908@devserv.devel.redhat.com>
References: <200503242356.27998.technojoecoolusa@charter.net>
	<1111739046.19895.16.camel@stargrazer.home.awesomeplay.com>
	
	
	<20050327145220.GA3908@devserv.devel.redhat.com>
Message-ID: 

On Sun, 27 Mar 2005, Alan Cox wrote:

> On Fri, Mar 25, 2005 at 12:33:04PM -0500, Paul A. Houle wrote:
> > money to spend on building a compile system,  I'd seriously consider  
> > getting a few 9GB SCSI drives off ebay and using them for a temp directory 
> > to do  compiles on.
> 
> At current prices its even more effective IMHO to get a box with 2-4GB of RAM and
> just load the entire compile environment into ramdisk, cvs checkout the
> devel code off disk into ramdisk and build in ram

That's actually what I'm doing too with DAR. I use a bind-mounted /dev/shm 
as my builddir.

--   dag wieers,  dag at wieers.com,  http://dag.wieers.com/   --
[all I want is a warm bed and a kind word and unlimited power]



From pbrobinson at gmail.com  Tue Mar 29 04:08:41 2005
From: pbrobinson at gmail.com (Peter Robinson)
Date: Tue, 29 Mar 2005 12:08:41 +0800
Subject: Firefox slows down pc......
In-Reply-To: <1112005445.3349.23.camel@localhost.localdomain>
References: <4246E34F.5010500@os.lv>
	<1112005445.3349.23.camel@localhost.localdomain>
Message-ID: <5256d0b05032820085060954d@mail.gmail.com>

> s?n, 27.03.2005 kl. 18.46 skrev Kaspars:
> >   Hi,
> >
> >   I search and don`t see that there is topic about my problem yet and
> > don`t know is this here...
> >   I`m using fresh FC3 reinstalled for week and updated, problem is that
> > something like to eat my pc power and I found that it is firefox... New
> > firefox when opened couple tabs (last 5) and all try to download some
> > site was fulling my memory/processor, top of the "top":
> > 19.0 10.1   2:10.66 firefox-bin
> > 10.2 50.3  11:52.26 X
> > and load start to fullfill: load average: 5.31, 3.43, 1.98
> >
> > Last time load was go so high that something kill some process and pc
> > freeze. Only reboot help...
> > So I`m thinking what to do, I have all updated etc. Start to think to
> > compile maybe by my self ff. Don`t know what to do...
> > Pc is year old Toshiba Satellite with p4 and 256ram.
> >
> >
> > Casper
> 
> Just wondering: Do you have a bunch of flashy flash animations open?
> Flash tend to eat cpu for breakfast...

I have a similar problem with no flash (don't even have it installed)
where for some sites firefox cpu usage will go through the roof. The
site I find this happens the most often is actually the Fedora
downloads page where you have a listing for the entire distro seems to
just kill firefox but if you go to a mirror its OK rather annoying
since I'm often behind a firewall with no ftp access.

(eg http://download.fedora.redhat.com/pub/fedora/linux/core/3/i386/os/Fedora/RPMS/
)

Cheers
Pete



From caillon at redhat.com  Tue Mar 29 06:51:42 2005
From: caillon at redhat.com (Christopher Aillon)
Date: Tue, 29 Mar 2005 01:51:42 -0500
Subject: Firefox slows down pc......
In-Reply-To: <4246E34F.5010500@os.lv>
References: <4246E34F.5010500@os.lv>
Message-ID: <4248FAFE.1000401@redhat.com>

Kaspars wrote:
> 
>  Hi,
> 
>  I search and don`t see that there is topic about my problem yet and 
> don`t know is this here...
>  I`m using fresh FC3 reinstalled for week and updated, problem is that 
> something like to eat my pc power and I found that it is firefox... New 
> firefox when opened couple tabs (last 5) and all try to download some 
> site was fulling my memory/processor, top of the "top":
> 19.0 10.1   2:10.66 firefox-bin
> 10.2 50.3  11:52.26 X
> and load start to fullfill: load average: 5.31, 3.43, 1.98
> 
> Last time load was go so high that something kill some process and pc 
> freeze. Only reboot help...
> So I`m thinking what to do, I have all updated etc. Start to think to 
> compile maybe by my self ff. Don`t know what to do...
> Pc is year old Toshiba Satellite with p4 and 256ram.

Compiling yourself probably won't help much to alleviate the problem since we already do optimize it quite a bit.  However, if you care to do some debugging and profiling work, and can quantify a specific area of performance hit, and file a bug (and dare I say provide a patch?) that would be great.  See e.g. the docs at http://lxr.mozilla.org/mozilla/source/tools/jprof/README.html or you can use the profiler of your choice.

At the very least, do try and figure out what specific webpage is causing the performance hit and if you can narrow it down further to which specific piece of the page that is even better, and then make sure a bug is filed on it.

And finally, the suggestion you probably don't want to hear: more RAM is probably a good option especially since you will likely get a good bang for the buck here.  You're running at the minimum recommended amount for an FC3 graphical install, and keeping several large, image/animation heavy, etc. web pages in memory will almost certainly cause you pain.  I bet that an upgrade to even 512MB will give you a substantial benefit, even outside of the browser space.



From caillon at redhat.com  Tue Mar 29 06:56:34 2005
From: caillon at redhat.com (Christopher Aillon)
Date: Tue, 29 Mar 2005 01:56:34 -0500
Subject: Firefox slows down pc......
In-Reply-To: <5256d0b05032820085060954d@mail.gmail.com>
References: <4246E34F.5010500@os.lv>	<1112005445.3349.23.camel@localhost.localdomain>
	<5256d0b05032820085060954d@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4248FC22.3010909@redhat.com>

Peter Robinson wrote:
 > I have a similar problem with no flash (don't even have it installed)
> where for some sites firefox cpu usage will go through the roof. The
> site I find this happens the most often is actually the Fedora
> downloads page where you have a listing for the entire distro seems to
> just kill firefox but if you go to a mirror its OK rather annoying
> since I'm often behind a firewall with no ftp access.
> 
> (eg http://download.fedora.redhat.com/pub/fedora/linux/core/3/i386/os/Fedora/RPMS/
> )

This is caused by the large amount of content being rendered in a 
.  If we turn on IndexOptions HTMLTable, we can probably get much better performance out of the browser here.  Even older browsers such as lynx, w3m, links, etc handle tables fine, AFAIK.

I just quickly hacked together a script and converted the HTML to use tables.  The difference is actually very noticable:

http://people.redhat.com/caillon/ftp-current.html
vs.
http://people.redhat.com/caillon/ftp-tables.html

My script wasn't perfect, so it isn't as pretty as it could have been I guess, but you get the idea.



From marcel at mesa.nl  Tue Mar 29 07:35:31 2005
From: marcel at mesa.nl (Marcel J.E. Mol)
Date: Tue, 29 Mar 2005 09:35:31 +0200
Subject: Firefox slows down pc......
In-Reply-To: <4248FC22.3010909@redhat.com>
References: <4246E34F.5010500@os.lv>
	<1112005445.3349.23.camel@localhost.localdomain>
	<5256d0b05032820085060954d@mail.gmail.com>
	<4248FC22.3010909@redhat.com>
Message-ID: <20050329073531.GA13827@joshua.mesa.nl>

On Tue, Mar 29, 2005 at 01:56:34AM -0500, Christopher Aillon wrote:
> Peter Robinson wrote:
> > I have a similar problem with no flash (don't even have it installed)
> >where for some sites firefox cpu usage will go through the roof. The
> >site I find this happens the most often is actually the Fedora
> >downloads page where you have a listing for the entire distro seems to
> >just kill firefox but if you go to a mirror its OK rather annoying
> >since I'm often behind a firewall with no ftp access.
> >
> >(eg 
> >http://download.fedora.redhat.com/pub/fedora/linux/core/3/i386/os/Fedora/RPMS/
> >)
> 
> This is caused by the large amount of content being rendered in a 
.  
> If we turn on IndexOptions HTMLTable, we can probably get much better 
> performance out of the browser here.  Even older browsers such as lynx, 
> w3m, links, etc handle tables fine, AFAIK.
> 
> I just quickly hacked together a script and converted the HTML to use 
> tables.  The difference is actually very noticable:
> 
> http://people.redhat.com/caillon/ftp-current.html
> vs.
> http://people.redhat.com/caillon/ftp-tables.html
> 
> My script wasn't perfect, so it isn't as pretty as it could have been I 
> guess, but you get the idea.

Well, the tables version is much more readable and indeed is much quicker.
Maybe now it is possible to list the full package names, instead of the cut
off versions like "Glide3-devel-20010520-33.i386.rpm" instead of
"Glide3-devel-20010520-33.i386..>"

-Marcel
-- 
     ======--------         Marcel J.E. Mol                MESA Consulting B.V.
    =======---------        ph. +31-(0)6-54724868          P.O. Box 112
    =======---------        marcel at mesa.nl                 2630 AC  Nootdorp
__==== www.mesa.nl ---____U_n_i_x______I_n_t_e_r_n_e_t____ The Netherlands ____
 They couldn't think of a number,           Linux user 1148  --  counter.li.org
    so they gave me a name!  -- Rupert Hine  --  www.ruperthine.com



From skvidal at phy.duke.edu  Tue Mar 29 07:42:06 2005
From: skvidal at phy.duke.edu (seth vidal)
Date: Tue, 29 Mar 2005 02:42:06 -0500
Subject: Firefox slows down pc......
In-Reply-To: <20050329073531.GA13827@joshua.mesa.nl>
References: <4246E34F.5010500@os.lv>
	<1112005445.3349.23.camel@localhost.localdomain>
	<5256d0b05032820085060954d@mail.gmail.com>
	<4248FC22.3010909@redhat.com>
	<20050329073531.GA13827@joshua.mesa.nl>
Message-ID: <1112082126.14183.41.camel@cutter>


> Well, the tables version is much more readable and indeed is much quicker.
> Maybe now it is possible to list the full package names, instead of the cut
> off versions like "Glide3-devel-20010520-33.i386.rpm" instead of
> "Glide3-devel-20010520-33.i386..>"

What if we used repoview (http://linux.duke.edu/projects/repoview) for
that index. Just like we're using in fedora extras:
http://download.fedora.redhat.com/pub/fedora/linux/extras/3/i386/repodata/

How does that render for you?

-sv




From caillon at redhat.com  Tue Mar 29 07:53:27 2005
From: caillon at redhat.com (Christopher Aillon)
Date: Tue, 29 Mar 2005 02:53:27 -0500
Subject: Firefox slows down pc......
In-Reply-To: <1112082126.14183.41.camel@cutter>
References: <4246E34F.5010500@os.lv>	<1112005445.3349.23.camel@localhost.localdomain>	<5256d0b05032820085060954d@mail.gmail.com>	<4248FC22.3010909@redhat.com>	<20050329073531.GA13827@joshua.mesa.nl>
	<1112082126.14183.41.camel@cutter>
Message-ID: <42490977.8020304@redhat.com>

seth vidal wrote:
 > What if we used repoview (http://linux.duke.edu/projects/repoview) 

404.  Google says the correct URL is: http://linux.duke.edu/projects/mini/repoview/



From skvidal at phy.duke.edu  Tue Mar 29 08:03:36 2005
From: skvidal at phy.duke.edu (seth vidal)
Date: Tue, 29 Mar 2005 03:03:36 -0500
Subject: Firefox slows down pc......
In-Reply-To: <42490977.8020304@redhat.com>
References: <4246E34F.5010500@os.lv>
	<1112005445.3349.23.camel@localhost.localdomain>
	<5256d0b05032820085060954d@mail.gmail.com>	<4248FC22.3010909@redhat.com>
	<20050329073531.GA13827@joshua.mesa.nl>
	<1112082126.14183.41.camel@cutter> <42490977.8020304@redhat.com>
Message-ID: <1112083416.14183.43.camel@cutter>

On Tue, 2005-03-29 at 02:53 -0500, Christopher Aillon wrote:
> seth vidal wrote:
>  > What if we used repoview (http://linux.duke.edu/projects/repoview) 
> 
> 404.  Google says the correct URL is: http://linux.duke.edu/projects/mini/repoview/

whoops, sorry, thanks.

-sv




From marcel at mesa.nl  Tue Mar 29 08:14:47 2005
From: marcel at mesa.nl (Marcel J.E. Mol)
Date: Tue, 29 Mar 2005 10:14:47 +0200
Subject: Firefox slows down pc......
In-Reply-To: <1112082126.14183.41.camel@cutter>
References: <4246E34F.5010500@os.lv>
	<1112005445.3349.23.camel@localhost.localdomain>
	<5256d0b05032820085060954d@mail.gmail.com>
	<4248FC22.3010909@redhat.com>
	<20050329073531.GA13827@joshua.mesa.nl>
	<1112082126.14183.41.camel@cutter>
Message-ID: <20050329081447.GB13827@joshua.mesa.nl>

On Tue, Mar 29, 2005 at 02:42:06AM -0500, seth vidal wrote:
> 
> > Well, the tables version is much more readable and indeed is much quicker.
> > Maybe now it is possible to list the full package names, instead of the cut
> > off versions like "Glide3-devel-20010520-33.i386.rpm" instead of
> > "Glide3-devel-20010520-33.i386..>"
> 
> What if we used repoview (http://linux.duke.edu/projects/repoview) for
> that index. Just like we're using in fedora extras:
> http://download.fedora.redhat.com/pub/fedora/linux/extras/3/i386/repodata/
> 
> How does that render for you?

Fine. Quite quick although its list of packages is much smaller..
Can it also show size and date/time of each package?

-Marcel
-- 
     ======--------         Marcel J.E. Mol                MESA Consulting B.V.
    =======---------        ph. +31-(0)6-54724868          P.O. Box 112
    =======---------        marcel at mesa.nl                 2630 AC  Nootdorp
__==== www.mesa.nl ---____U_n_i_x______I_n_t_e_r_n_e_t____ The Netherlands ____
 They couldn't think of a number,           Linux user 1148  --  counter.li.org
    so they gave me a name!  -- Rupert Hine  --  www.ruperthine.com



From marcel at mesa.nl  Tue Mar 29 08:18:18 2005
From: marcel at mesa.nl (Marcel J.E. Mol)
Date: Tue, 29 Mar 2005 10:18:18 +0200
Subject: Firefox slows down pc......
In-Reply-To: <20050329073531.GA13827@joshua.mesa.nl>
References: <4246E34F.5010500@os.lv>
	<1112005445.3349.23.camel@localhost.localdomain>
	<5256d0b05032820085060954d@mail.gmail.com>
	<4248FC22.3010909@redhat.com>
	<20050329073531.GA13827@joshua.mesa.nl>
Message-ID: <20050329081817.GC13827@joshua.mesa.nl>

On Tue, Mar 29, 2005 at 09:35:31AM +0200, Marcel J.E. Mol wrote:
> On Tue, Mar 29, 2005 at 01:56:34AM -0500, Christopher Aillon wrote:
> > Peter Robinson wrote:
> > > I have a similar problem with no flash (don't even have it installed)
> > >where for some sites firefox cpu usage will go through the roof. The
> > >site I find this happens the most often is actually the Fedora
> > >downloads page where you have a listing for the entire distro seems to
> > >just kill firefox but if you go to a mirror its OK rather annoying
> > >since I'm often behind a firewall with no ftp access.
> > >
> > >(eg 
> > >http://download.fedora.redhat.com/pub/fedora/linux/core/3/i386/os/Fedora/RPMS/
> > >)
> > 
> > This is caused by the large amount of content being rendered in a 
.  
> > If we turn on IndexOptions HTMLTable, we can probably get much better 
> > performance out of the browser here.  Even older browsers such as lynx, 
> > w3m, links, etc handle tables fine, AFAIK.
> > 
> > I just quickly hacked together a script and converted the HTML to use 
> > tables.  The difference is actually very noticable:
> > 
> > http://people.redhat.com/caillon/ftp-current.html
> > vs.
> > http://people.redhat.com/caillon/ftp-tables.html
> > 
> > My script wasn't perfect, so it isn't as pretty as it could have been I 
> > guess, but you get the idea.
> 
> Well, the tables version is much more readable and indeed is much quicker.
> Maybe now it is possible to list the full package names, instead of the cut
> off versions like "Glide3-devel-20010520-33.i386.rpm" instead of
> "Glide3-devel-20010520-33.i386..>"

I redid the test and also ran them on mozilla. On both the current version takes 
along time, the tables version is quicker. But mozilla is quicker than firefox!
(gkrellm cpu bar shows 100% cpu while page is loading, and the bars for mozilla
are much smaller than for firefox).

-Marcel
-- 
     ======--------         Marcel J.E. Mol                MESA Consulting B.V.
    =======---------        ph. +31-(0)6-54724868          P.O. Box 112
    =======---------        marcel at mesa.nl                 2630 AC  Nootdorp
__==== www.mesa.nl ---____U_n_i_x______I_n_t_e_r_n_e_t____ The Netherlands ____
 They couldn't think of a number,           Linux user 1148  --  counter.li.org
    so they gave me a name!  -- Rupert Hine  --  www.ruperthine.com



From marcel at mesa.nl  Tue Mar 29 08:27:32 2005
From: marcel at mesa.nl (Marcel J.E. Mol)
Date: Tue, 29 Mar 2005 10:27:32 +0200
Subject: Firefox slows down pc......
In-Reply-To: <4246E34F.5010500@os.lv>
References: <4246E34F.5010500@os.lv>
Message-ID: <20050329082732.GD13827@joshua.mesa.nl>

On Sun, Mar 27, 2005 at 07:46:07PM +0300, Kaspars wrote:
> 
>  Hi,
> 
>  I search and don`t see that there is topic about my problem yet and 
> don`t know is this here...
>  I`m using fresh FC3 reinstalled for week and updated, problem is that 
> something like to eat my pc power and I found that it is firefox... New 
> firefox when opened couple tabs (last 5) and all try to download some 
> site was fulling my memory/processor, top of the "top":
> 19.0 10.1   2:10.66 firefox-bin
> 10.2 50.3  11:52.26 X
> and load start to fullfill: load average: 5.31, 3.43, 1.98
> 
> Last time load was go so high that something kill some process and pc 
> freeze. Only reboot help...
> So I`m thinking what to do, I have all updated etc. Start to think to 
> compile maybe by my self ff. Don`t know what to do...
> Pc is year old Toshiba Satellite with p4 and 256ram.
 

Attached is a testcase that shows high cpu usage for both firefox and mozilla.
It contains a few animated gifs. I resize my browser so the bottom part of the 
page, including the animated gif in it, is outside the window. There are still 
4 instances of the same gif visable.  CPU usage in this case is just a few %.

Now when I scroll the bottom part into view so that the 5th instance of the gif
becomes visible, cpu usage rises to 30% or 40%!

If other people can reproduce this I can file a bugzilla...

-Marcel
-- 
     ======--------         Marcel J.E. Mol                MESA Consulting B.V.
    =======---------        ph. +31-(0)6-54724868          P.O. Box 112
    =======---------        marcel at mesa.nl                 2630 AC  Nootdorp
__==== www.mesa.nl ---____U_n_i_x______I_n_t_e_r_n_e_t____ The Netherlands ____
 They couldn't think of a number,           Linux user 1148  --  counter.li.org
    so they gave me a name!  -- Rupert Hine  --  www.ruperthine.com
-------------- next part --------------
A non-text attachment was scrubbed...
Name: testhtml.tgz
Type: application/x-gzip
Size: 23129 bytes
Desc: not available
URL: 

From marcel at mesa.nl  Tue Mar 29 08:32:29 2005
From: marcel at mesa.nl (Marcel J.E. Mol)
Date: Tue, 29 Mar 2005 10:32:29 +0200
Subject: Firefox slows down pc......
In-Reply-To: <20050329082732.GD13827@joshua.mesa.nl>
References: <4246E34F.5010500@os.lv> <20050329082732.GD13827@joshua.mesa.nl>
Message-ID: <20050329083229.GE13827@joshua.mesa.nl>

On Tue, Mar 29, 2005 at 10:27:32AM +0200, Marcel J.E. Mol wrote:
> On Sun, Mar 27, 2005 at 07:46:07PM +0300, Kaspars wrote:
> > 
> >  Hi,
> > 
> >  I search and don`t see that there is topic about my problem yet and 
> > don`t know is this here...
> >  I`m using fresh FC3 reinstalled for week and updated, problem is that 
> > something like to eat my pc power and I found that it is firefox... New 
> > firefox when opened couple tabs (last 5) and all try to download some 
> > site was fulling my memory/processor, top of the "top":
> > 19.0 10.1   2:10.66 firefox-bin
> > 10.2 50.3  11:52.26 X
> > and load start to fullfill: load average: 5.31, 3.43, 1.98
> > 
> > Last time load was go so high that something kill some process and pc 
> > freeze. Only reboot help...
> > So I`m thinking what to do, I have all updated etc. Start to think to 
> > compile maybe by my self ff. Don`t know what to do...
> > Pc is year old Toshiba Satellite with p4 and 256ram.
>  
> 
> Attached is a testcase that shows high cpu usage for both firefox and mozilla.
> It contains a few animated gifs. I resize my browser so the bottom part of the 
> page, including the animated gif in it, is outside the window. There are still 
> 4 instances of the same gif visable.  CPU usage in this case is just a few %.
> 
> Now when I scroll the bottom part into view so that the 5th instance of the gif
> becomes visible, cpu usage rises to 30% or 40%!
> 
> If other people can reproduce this I can file a bugzilla...

I see this effect in mozilla and firefox, but not in konqueror.

-Marcel
-- 
     ======--------         Marcel J.E. Mol                MESA Consulting B.V.
    =======---------        ph. +31-(0)6-54724868          P.O. Box 112
    =======---------        marcel at mesa.nl                 2630 AC  Nootdorp
__==== www.mesa.nl ---____U_n_i_x______I_n_t_e_r_n_e_t____ The Netherlands ____
 They couldn't think of a number,           Linux user 1148  --  counter.li.org
    so they gave me a name!  -- Rupert Hine  --  www.ruperthine.com



From thuforuk at yahoo.co.uk  Tue Mar 29 08:39:22 2005
From: thuforuk at yahoo.co.uk (Dariusz J. Garbowski)
Date: Tue, 29 Mar 2005 09:39:22 +0100
Subject: Firefox slows down pc......
In-Reply-To: <4248FC22.3010909@redhat.com>
References: <4246E34F.5010500@os.lv>	<1112005445.3349.23.camel@localhost.localdomain>	<5256d0b05032820085060954d@mail.gmail.com>
	<4248FC22.3010909@redhat.com>
Message-ID: <4249143A.9080802@yahoo.co.uk>

On 03/29/2005 07:56 AM, Christopher Aillon wrote:
> Peter Robinson wrote:
>  > I have a similar problem with no flash (don't even have it installed)
> 
>> where for some sites firefox cpu usage will go through the roof. The
>> site I find this happens the most often is actually the Fedora
>> downloads page where you have a listing for the entire distro seems to
>> just kill firefox but if you go to a mirror its OK rather annoying
>> since I'm often behind a firewall with no ftp access.
>>
>> (eg 
>> http://download.fedora.redhat.com/pub/fedora/linux/core/3/i386/os/Fedora/RPMS/ 
>>
>> )
> 
> 
> This is caused by the large amount of content being rendered in a 
> 
.  If we turn on IndexOptions HTMLTable, we can probably get much 
> better performance out of the browser here.  Even older browsers such as 
> lynx, w3m, links, etc handle tables fine, AFAIK.

Still Firefox from Fedora Core 3 compared to mozilla nightly downloaded 
from mozilla.org is about 2x slower loading this page:

Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.8b2) Gecko/20050326 - about 
9 seconds

Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.7.6) Gecko/20050323 
Firefox/1.0.2 Fedora/1.0.2-1.3.1 - about 19 seconds

Is such a difference expected?

Am I comparing apples to oranges (very recent nightly build vs. stable 
release/mozilla vs. firfox)?

Regards,
Dariusz



From jgotts at linuxsavvy.com  Tue Mar 29 09:02:46 2005
From: jgotts at linuxsavvy.com (John Gotts)
Date: Tue, 29 Mar 2005 04:02:46 -0500
Subject: FC3: gnome-libs API broken with 1.4.1.2.90-32
Message-ID: <200503290902.j2T92kog011722@umpire.fmfts.net>

We've had the same code in our software since 2000:

	GnomeFileEntry *fe;
	gchar buf[1024];

--->	sprintf(buf, "%s", gnome_file_entry_get_full_path(fe, TRUE));

[Edited for brevity.]

The seg fault with Fedora Core 3:

#0  0x007e0490 in strcpy () from /lib/tls/libc.so.6
(gdb) bt
#0  0x007e0490 in strcpy () from /lib/tls/libc.so.6
#1  

Either the API changed or somebody broke something inside
gnome_file_entry_get_full_path().  Fortunately, the file entry widget was for
future use, so I completely removed its use in our code.

Please, resist all urges to make any changes, albeit helpful, to Gtk 1.x and
GNOME 1.x.  That's what 2.x is for.  Don't break legacy applications.

Thanks and have a great day,
John

-- 
John GOTTS   http://linuxsavvy.com/staff/jgotts



From jgotts at linuxsavvy.com  Tue Mar 29 09:16:32 2005
From: jgotts at linuxsavvy.com (John Gotts)
Date: Tue, 29 Mar 2005 04:16:32 -0500
Subject: FC3: gnome-libs API broken with 1.4.1.2.90-32 
In-Reply-To: Your message of "Tue, 29 Mar 2005 04:02:46 EST."
	<200503290902.j2T92kog011722@umpire.fmfts.net> 
Message-ID: <200503290916.j2T9GWSr011957@umpire.fmfts.net>

In message <200503290902.j2T92kog011722 at umpire.fmfts.net>, John Gotts writes:

>Either the API changed or somebody broke something inside
>gnome_file_entry_get_full_path().

Correction, -32 from RHL 9 works fine, while -44 from FC3 fails.

John

-- 
John GOTTS   http://linuxsavvy.com/staff/jgotts



From fedora at wir-sind-cool.org  Tue Mar 29 09:23:57 2005
From: fedora at wir-sind-cool.org (Michael Schwendt)
Date: Tue, 29 Mar 2005 11:23:57 +0200
Subject: FC3: gnome-libs API broken with 1.4.1.2.90-32
In-Reply-To: <200503290902.j2T92kog011722@umpire.fmfts.net>
References: <200503290902.j2T92kog011722@umpire.fmfts.net>
Message-ID: <20050329112357.4fac19ba.fedora@wir-sind-cool.org>

On Tue, 29 Mar 2005 04:02:46 -0500, John Gotts wrote:

> We've had the same code in our software since 2000:
> 
> 	GnomeFileEntry *fe;
> 	gchar buf[1024];
> 
> --->	sprintf(buf, "%s", gnome_file_entry_get_full_path(fe, TRUE));
> 
> [Edited for brevity.]
> 
> The seg fault with Fedora Core 3:
> 
> #0  0x007e0490 in strcpy () from /lib/tls/libc.so.6
> (gdb) bt
> #0  0x007e0490 in strcpy () from /lib/tls/libc.so.6
> #1  

What value did it return that made strcpy crash?

gnome_file_entry_get_full_path may return NULL, too, so your code (whether
edited for brevity or not) should do some error checking at least.



From jgotts at linuxsavvy.com  Tue Mar 29 09:40:31 2005
From: jgotts at linuxsavvy.com (John Gotts)
Date: Tue, 29 Mar 2005 04:40:31 -0500
Subject: FC3: gnome-libs API broken with 1.4.1.2.90-32 
In-Reply-To: Your message of "Tue, 29 Mar 2005 11:23:57 +0200."
	<20050329112357.4fac19ba.fedora@wir-sind-cool.org> 
Message-ID: <200503290940.j2T9eV66012147@umpire.fmfts.net>

In message <20050329112357.4fac19ba.fedora at wir-sind-cool.org>, Michael Schwendt
 writes:

>What value did it return that made strcpy crash?

No idea, the strcpy crash is internal to gnome_file_entry_get_full_path().  The
bad change came in between -32 and -44 (see my other message).

>gnome_file_entry_get_full_path may return NULL, too, so your code (whether
>edited for brevity or not) should do some error checking at least.

The code had:

	if (strcmp(buf, "(null)") == 0)
		*buf = '\0';

Ugly, but it works.  At the time (and possibly still today)
gnome_file_entry_get_full_path() was undocumented, and this functionality was
not complete so I didn't spend a lot of time reverse engineering this function.

John

-- 
John GOTTS   http://linuxsavvy.com/staff/jgotts



From hk at isphuset.no  Tue Mar 29 11:04:53 2005
From: hk at isphuset.no (Hans Kristian Rosbach)
Date: Tue, 29 Mar 2005 13:04:53 +0200
Subject: Named resulting in OOM condition
Message-ID: <1112094293.2643.9.camel@linux.local>

We are running a simple caching named process on a separate
computer here. Every two weeks it needs to be rebooted due
to running out of memory. It can survive for a while further
on swap, but that slows things down terribly.

After restarting named the memory is still in use according
to 'free':
             total       used       free     shared    buffers    
cached
Mem:        775664     760064      15600          0        736     
11884
-/+ buffers/cache:     747444      28220
Swap:      1566296       9108    1557188

But according to ps all processes use a 0.0-0.6% ram. (ps -Ae vx)

from slabinfo I got the following interesting lines:
biovec-(256)         256    256   3072    2    2 : tunables   24   12   
0 : slabdata    128    128      0
biovec-128           256    260   1536    5    2 : tunables   24   12   
0 : slabdata     52     52      0
biovec-64            256    260    768    5    1 : tunables   54   27   
0 : slabdata     52     52      0
biovec-16            256    260    192   20    1 : tunables  120   60   
0 : slabdata     13     13      0
biovec-4             256    305     64   61    1 : tunables  120   60   
0 : slabdata      5      5      0
biovec-1          6341638 6342238     16  226    1 : tunables  120  
60    0 : slabdata  28063  28063      0
bio               6341638 6341798     96   41    1 : tunables  120  
60    0 : slabdata 154678 154678      0

Seems like bio is taking up nearly all the memory, what can cause this?
Any way to force it to go away? =)

This problem has been there for a long time, we have this problem on
all our nameservers but always thought it was a bug due to us reloading
a huge config every half hour. 2GB ram makes those boxes run for a few
months before they need a reboot.

But this caching nameserver should not be such a special case, and since
it caches all our RBL queries it seems to run out of memory much faster.

This problem has followed us atleast since FC2-test2, and now FC3.
I just upgraded to bind-9.2.5-1, but I seriously doubt that it will have
any significant effect.

Ideas?

-HK



From roozbeh at farsiweb.info  Tue Mar 29 12:11:08 2005
From: roozbeh at farsiweb.info (Roozbeh Pournader)
Date: Tue, 29 Mar 2005 16:41:08 +0430
Subject: menus, Name/GenericName
In-Reply-To: <1112018016.1514.246.camel@cobra.ivg2.net>
References: <1111171110.5407.1.camel@localhost.localdomain>
	<1111952957.24791.4.camel@cobra.ivg2.net>
	<1111955049.30110.20.camel@cobra.ivg2.net>	<4247510F.5080006@yahoo.co.uk>
	<4247FCEC.1020808@math.unl.edu>
	<1112015796.1514.208.camel@cobra.ivg2.net>
	<424806CF.1040602@math.unl.edu>
	<1112018016.1514.246.camel@cobra.ivg2.net>
Message-ID: <1112098268.5798.8.camel@tameshk.bamdad.org>

On Mon, 2005-03-28 at 08:53 -0500, Ivan Gyurdiev wrote:
> I couldn't figure out why that is either - I can imagine
> problems if languages read right-to-left, but I don't know exactly.

There won't be a problem with RTL languages. Don't worry. The Unicode
Bidirectional algorithm () takes
care of that.

roozbeh




From buildsys at redhat.com  Tue Mar 29 12:58:07 2005
From: buildsys at redhat.com (Build System)
Date: Tue, 29 Mar 2005 07:58:07 -0500
Subject: rawhide report: 20050329 changes
Message-ID: <200503291258.j2TCw7r3004997@porkchop.devel.redhat.com>

 

Removed package im-sdk

Updated Packages:

control-center-1:2.10.0-3
-------------------------
* Mon Mar 28 2005 Christopher Aillon 
- rebuilt

desktop-printing-0.18-8
-----------------------
* Mon Mar 28 2005 Christopher Aillon 
- rebuilt

eclipse-1:3.1.0_fc-0.M5.15
--------------------------
* Mon Mar 28 2005 Christopher Aillon 
- rebuilt

elfutils-0.104-2
----------------
* Mon Mar 28 2005 Roland McGrath  - 0.104-2
- update to 0.104

eog-2.10.0-1
------------
* Mon Mar 28 2005 Matthias Clasen  2.10.0-1
- Update to 2.10.0

firefox-0:1.0.2-3
-----------------
* Mon Mar 28 2005 Christopher Aillon  0:1.0.2-3
- Updated firefox icon (https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=261679)
- Fix for some more cursor issues in textareas (149991, 150002, 152089)

flac-1.1.2-1
------------
* Mon Mar 28 2005 John (J5) Palmieri  1.1.2-1
- Update to upstream version 1.1.2
- Replace flac-1.1.0-libtool.patch with flac-1.1.2-libtool.patch

gconf-editor-2.10.0-3
---------------------
* Mon Mar 28 2005 Christopher Aillon 
- rebuilt

gdk-pixbuf-1:0.22.0-18
----------------------
* Mon Mar 28 2005 Matthias Clasen  - 1:0.22.0-18
- Fix a double free in the bmp loader

gdm-1:2.6.0.7-7
---------------
* Mon Mar 28 2005 Christopher Aillon 
- rebuilt

gimp-2:2.2.4-9
--------------
* Mon Mar 28 2005 Matthias Clasen 
- Rebuild against newer libexif

* Mon Mar 28 2005 Christopher Aillon 
- rebuilt

gnome-applets-1:2.10.0-3
------------------------
* Mon Mar 28 2005 Christopher Aillon 
- rebuilt

gnome-netstatus-2.10.0-3
------------------------
* Mon Mar 28 2005 Christopher Aillon 
- rebuilt

gnome-panel-2.10.0-3
--------------------
* Mon Mar 28 2005 Christopher Aillon 
- rebuilt

gnome-python2-extras-2.10.0-2.1
-------------------------------
* Mon Mar 28 2005 John (J5) Palmieri  - 2.10.0-2.1
- Retag and rebuild
gphoto2-2.1.5-7
---------------
* Mon Mar 28 2005 Matthias Clasen 
- Rebuild against newer libexif

* Thu Mar 24 2005 Warren Togami 
- BR libtool, pkgconfig

* Thu Mar 24 2005 Tim Waugh 
- Disable docs again until gtk-doc is fixed (GNOME bug #169087).

gstreamer-plugins-0.8.8-2
-------------------------
* Sun Mar 27 2005 John (J5) Palmieri  - 0.8.8-2
- disabled building Hermes because it is not needed and doesn't
  compile with gcc4.0.  If upstream fixes it we can reenable

* Wed Mar 23 2005 John (J5) Palmieri  - 0.8.8-1
- Update to upstream version 0.8.8
- Rebuild for libmusicbrainz 2.1.1

gthumb-2.6.4-2
--------------
* Mon Mar 28 2005 Matthias Clasen  
- Rebuild against newer libexif

hicolor-icon-theme-0.7-3
------------------------
* Mon Mar 28 2005 Christopher Aillon 
- rebuilt

hwdata-0.153-1
--------------
* Mon Mar 28 2005 Bill Nottingham  0.153-1
- update the framebuffer blacklist

iiimf-1:12.1.1-10.svn2390
-------------------------
* Mon Mar 28 2005 Jens Petersen  - 1:12.1.1-10.svn2390
- update to svn2390
- add macros le_targets to set LE_TARGETS to build instead of specifying
  extra LEs with builddirs
  - thaiLE is still in builddirs for now since it needs to be bootstrapped
- define iiim_user and iiim_service macros and use them
- revert iiimd service to iiim for now to avoid breaking updates
- make sure iiimd owns unix domain socket after upgrade

* Fri Mar 25 2005 Christopher Aillon  - 1:12.1.1-9.svn2388
- Update the GTK+ theme icon cache on (un)install

* Fri Mar 25 2005 Jens Petersen  - 1:12.1.1-8.svn2388
- source package renamed from im-sdk to iiimf
- update to svn2388
  - update htt_xbe-rh-fix-build-20040203.patch,
    im-sdk-rh-fix-build-20040203.patch, leif-sch_le_sun-fix-build.patch,
    leif-tch_le_sun-fix-build.patch, 
  - no longer need iiim.init-retryonerror.patch, iiimgcf-rh-autotools.patch,
    im-sdk-bin_dir.patch, im-sdk-rh-autotools.patch,
    leif-sampleja3-fix-gcc4.patch,
    xiiimp-fix-double-encoded-utf8-r2272-138618.patch,
    im-sdk-11.4-sun-le-asia.patch, im-sdk-11.4-sun-le-korean.patch,
    leif-sch_le_sun-fix-build.patch, leif-sun-zh-disable.patch,
    leif-tch_le_sun-fix-build.patch
  - move csconv subpackage into iiimf-le-libs
    - csconv buildrequires gettext-devel for iconv.m4
  - update im_dir to libdir/iiim, and instle and uninstle
  - im_includedir is now under /usr/include following new file layout
  - turn on iiimqcf again
    - update iiimqcf.pro-build.patch to link to libs in buildtree
  - note libEIMIL is no longer installed
  - update xinput.d-iiimf to iiimx (Akira Tagoh)
  - README.iiimecf is no longer needed (Akira Tagoh)
  - add init.d-iiimd-RH.patch to fix iiimd path
  - update pre/post scripts to use iiimd instead of htt for daemon and its user
    (Akira Tagoh)
- cleanup %build and %install
  - no longer find and replace /usr/lib/im by hand for multilib
  - use script based on toplevel build target instead of make config with
    CONFIGDIR and building subdirs by hand
    - macro builddirs lists subdirs to build
    - building of optional LEs is switched on by defining _with_LENAME macros
    - config_options carries configure options passed now to autogen.sh
  - use toplevel install target with builddirs too instead of installing
    each subdir by hand
  - buildrequire automake and autoconf, not automake16
  - define im_aclocal and le_dir and use them
  - add leif-default-LEs-built.patch to only build default, unit, hangul and
    canna LEs by default in leif/
- remove im-sdk-xft-ac.patch, since PKG_CHECK_MODULES is provided by pkgconfig

ipsec-tools-0.5-4
-----------------
* Mon Mar 28 2005 Bill Nottingham  0.5-4
- fix 64-bit issue in setph1attr() ()

krb5-1.4-3
----------
* Wed Mar 23 2005 Nalin Dahyabhai  1.4-3
- drop krshd patch for now

* Thu Mar 17 2005 Nalin Dahyabhai 
- add draft fix from Tom Yu for slc_add_reply() buffer overflow (CAN-2005-0469)
- add draft fix from Tom Yu for env_opt_add() buffer overflow (CAN-2005-0468)

* Wed Mar 16 2005 Nalin Dahyabhai  1.4-2
- don't include  into the telnet client when we're not using curses

libexif-0.6.12-1
----------------
* Mon Mar 28 2005 Matthias Clasen 
- Update to 0.6.12

memtest86+-1.55.1-1
-------------------
* Mon Mar 28 2005 Warren Togami  - 1.55.1-1
- 1.55.1 fixes K8

nautilus-2.10.0-2
-----------------
* Mon Mar 28 2005 Matthias Clasen  2.10.0-2
- Rebuild against newer libexif

slocate-2.7-18
--------------
* Mon Mar 28 2005 Miloslav Trmac  - 2.7-18
- Drop unnecessary BuildRequires: autoconf
- Remove /mnt/floppy from PRUNEPATHS, it's in /media now

sound-juicer-0.5.14-1.FC3.0
---------------------------
* Thu Nov 18 2004 Colin Walters  0.5.14-1.FC3.0
- Backport fixes from devel:
- Actually enable HAL support (fixes multiple CDROM case, deprecated ioctl usage)
- Add sound-juicer-idle-safety.patch (bug 137847)
- BR hal-devel

* Wed Oct 13 2004 Colin Walters  0.5.14-1
- New upstream
- This release fixes corruption on re-read, upstream 153085
- Remove upstreamed sound-juicer-0.5.13-prefs-crash.patch

* Mon Oct 04 2004 Colin Walters  0.5.13-2
- Apply patch to avoid prefs crash

sound-juicer-2.10.0-2
---------------------
* Wed Mar 23 2005 John (J5) Palmieri  2.10.0-2
- Rebuild for libmusicbrainz-2.1.1

sysklogd-1.4.1-28_FC4
---------------------
* Mon Mar 28 2005 Jason Vas Dias  1.4.1rh-30
- Fix bug 152319: potential ctime() deadlock in domark() when called
-                 from signal handler

system-config-date-1.7.15-3
---------------------------
* Mon Mar 28 2005 Christopher Aillon 
- rebuilt

system-config-display-1.0.25-3
------------------------------
* Mon Mar 28 2005 Christopher Aillon 
- rebuilt

system-config-keyboard-1.2.5-3
------------------------------
* Mon Mar 28 2005 Christopher Aillon 
- rebuilt

system-config-kickstart-2.5.21-4
--------------------------------
* Mon Mar 28 2005 Christopher Aillon 
- rebuilt

system-config-language-1.1.8-3
------------------------------
* Mon Mar 28 2005 Christopher Aillon 
- rebuilt

system-config-nfs-1.3.5-3
-------------------------
* Mon Mar 28 2005 Christopher Aillon 
- rebuilt

system-config-rootpassword-1.1.6-3
----------------------------------
* Mon Mar 28 2005 Christopher Aillon 
- rebuilt

system-config-samba-1.2.28-3
----------------------------
* Mon Mar 28 2005 Christopher Aillon 
- rebuilt

system-config-securitylevel-1.5.3-3
-----------------------------------
* Mon Mar 28 2005 Christopher Aillon 
- rebuilt

system-config-services-0.8.21-3
-------------------------------
* Mon Mar 28 2005 Christopher Aillon 
- rebuilt

system-config-soundcard-1.2.10-3
--------------------------------
* Mon Mar 28 2005 Christopher Aillon 
- rebuilt

system-config-users-1.2.28-3
----------------------------
* Mon Mar 28 2005 Christopher Aillon 
- rebuilt

tvtime-0.9.15-6
---------------
* Mon Mar 28 2005 Christopher Aillon 
- rebuilt

udev-050-10
-----------
* Mon Mar 28 2005 Warren Togami  - 050-10
- own default and net dirs (#151368 Hans de Goede)

valgrind-1:2.4.0-1
------------------
* Sun Mar 27 2005 Colin Walters  2.4.0-1
- New upstream version 
- Update valgrind-2.2.0-regtest.patch to 2.4.0; required minor
  massaging
- Disable valgrind-2.1.2-4G.patch for now; Not going to touch this,
  and Fedora does not ship 4G kernel by default anymore
- Remove upstreamed valgrind-2.2.0.ioctls.patch
- Remove obsolete valgrind-2.2.0-warnings.patch; Code is no longer
  present
- Remove upstreamed valgrind-2.2.0-valgrind_h.patch
- Remove obsolete valgrind-2.2.0-unnest.patch and
  valgrind-2.0.0-pthread-stacksize.patch; valgrind no longer
  includes its own pthread library

vino-2.10.0-2
-------------
* Mon Mar 28 2005 Christopher Aillon 
- rebuilt

vnc-4.1.1-6
-----------
* Mon Mar 28 2005 Christopher Aillon 
- rebuilt

x3270-3.3.3.b2-3
----------------
* Mon Mar 28 2005 Christopher Aillon 
- rebuilt

xchat-1:2.4.2-3
---------------
* Mon Mar 28 2005 Christopher Aillon  1:2.4.2-3
- Fix crash when right clicking users whose away msg is unknown.

xen-2-20050328
--------------
* Mon Mar 28 2005 Rik van Riel  2-20050328
- do not yet upgrade to new hypervisor ;)
- add barrier to fix SMP boot bug
- add tags target
- add zlib-devel build requires (#150952)



From skvidal at phy.duke.edu  Tue Mar 29 13:48:40 2005
From: skvidal at phy.duke.edu (seth vidal)
Date: Tue, 29 Mar 2005 08:48:40 -0500
Subject: Firefox slows down pc......
In-Reply-To: <20050329081447.GB13827@joshua.mesa.nl>
References: <4246E34F.5010500@os.lv>
	<1112005445.3349.23.camel@localhost.localdomain>
	<5256d0b05032820085060954d@mail.gmail.com>
	<4248FC22.3010909@redhat.com>
	<20050329073531.GA13827@joshua.mesa.nl>
	<1112082126.14183.41.camel@cutter>
	<20050329081447.GB13827@joshua.mesa.nl>
Message-ID: <1112104121.14183.47.camel@cutter>


> Fine. Quite quick although its list of packages is much smaller..
> Can it also show size and date/time of each package?

It does - click on any package and you get the size date and time.

-sv




From terraformers at gmx.net  Tue Mar 29 14:16:29 2005
From: terraformers at gmx.net (Lars)
Date: Tue, 29 Mar 2005 16:16:29 +0200
Subject: rawhide report: 20050329 changes
References: <200503291258.j2TCw7r3004997@porkchop.devel.redhat.com>
Message-ID: 

some yum update errors for rawhide-20050329:



  Updating  : gnome-applets                ####################### [17/76]
/usr/share/gnome/help/stickynotes_applet/C/stickynotes_applet.xml:228: element figure: validity error : ID stickynotes-using-left-fig already defined
  

                                         ^
/usr/share/gnome/help/char-palette/C/char-palette.xml:298: element figure: validity error : ID applet-fig already defined
        

                               ^
  Cleanup   : gnome-applets                ####################### [42/76]
/sbin/ldconfig: relative path `1' used to build cache
error: %postun(gnome-applets-2.10.0-2.i386) scriptlet failed, exit status 1

  Cleanup   : system-config-keyboard       ####################### [51/76]
/var/tmp/rpm-tmp.57077: line 2: [-x: command not found

  Cleanup   : gnome-panel                  ####################### [53/76]
/var/tmp/rpm-tmp.27208: line 3: [-x: command not found

  Cleanup   : hicolor-icon-theme           ####################### [54/76]
/var/tmp/rpm-tmp.27208: line 2: [-x: command not found

  Cleanup   : system-config-soundcard      ####################### [57/76]
/var/tmp/rpm-tmp.94317: line 2: [-x: command not found

  Cleanup   : vino                         ####################### [58/76]
/var/tmp/rpm-tmp.94317: line 2: [-x: command not found

  Cleanup   : desktop-printing             ####################### [60/76]
/var/tmp/rpm-tmp.68479: line 2: [-x: command not found

  Cleanup   : gdm                          ####################### [62/76]
/var/tmp/rpm-tmp.12317: line 4: [-x: command not found

  Cleanup   : gimp                         ####################### [64/76]
/var/tmp/rpm-tmp.95329: line 6: [-x: command not found

  Cleanup   : system-config-language       ####################### [66/76]
/var/tmp/rpm-tmp.44747: line 2: [-x: command not found

  Cleanup   : system-config-rootpassword   ####################### [67/76]
/var/tmp/rpm-tmp.13739: line 2: [-x: command not found

  Cleanup   : system-config-display        ####################### [68/76]
/var/tmp/rpm-tmp.13739: line 2: [-x: command not found

  Cleanup   : system-config-users          ####################### [70/76]
/var/tmp/rpm-tmp.43235: line 2: [-x: command not found

  Cleanup   : system-config-services       ####################### [71/76]
/var/tmp/rpm-tmp.43235: line 2: [-x: command not found

  Cleanup   : system-config-date           ####################### [72/76]
/var/tmp/rpm-tmp.58168: line 2: [-x: command not found

  Cleanup   : gconf-editor                 ####################### [75/76]
/var/tmp/rpm-tmp.43871: line 2: [-x: command not found
Must set the GCONF_CONFIG_SOURCE environment variable
error: %postun(gconf-editor-2.10.0-2.i386) scriptlet failed, exit status 1

  Cleanup   : gnome-netstatus              ####################### [76/76]
/var/tmp/rpm-tmp.43871: line 2: [-x: command not found



L





From skvidal at phy.duke.edu  Tue Mar 29 14:29:14 2005
From: skvidal at phy.duke.edu (seth vidal)
Date: Tue, 29 Mar 2005 09:29:14 -0500
Subject: rawhide report: 20050329 changes
In-Reply-To: 
References: <200503291258.j2TCw7r3004997@porkchop.devel.redhat.com>
	
Message-ID: <1112106554.14183.49.camel@cutter>

On Tue, 2005-03-29 at 16:16 +0200, Lars wrote:
> some yum update errors for rawhide-20050329:
> 
> 

You realize that none of those are yum errors, right? That the errors
are in the packages.

I'm mentioning this b/c I get more than enough bug reports w/o having
things like you listed  assigned to me, too.

-sv




From terraformers at gmx.net  Tue Mar 29 15:14:22 2005
From: terraformers at gmx.net (Lars)
Date: Tue, 29 Mar 2005 17:14:22 +0200
Subject: rawhide report: 20050329 changes
References: <200503291258.j2TCw7r3004997@porkchop.devel.redhat.com>
	
	<1112106554.14183.49.camel@cutter>
Message-ID: 

On Tue, 29 Mar 2005 09:29:14 -0500, seth vidal wrote:

> On Tue, 2005-03-29 at 16:16 +0200, Lars wrote:
>> some yum update errors for rawhide-20050329:
>> 
>> 
> 
> You realize that none of those are yum errors, right? That the errors
> are in the packages.
> 
> I'm mentioning this b/c I get more than enough bug reports w/o having
> things like you listed  assigned to me, too.
> 
> -sv


yes shure.
for me yum rocks and is the update "heaven" i searched so long :)
you have done a *really* great job putting this together, 
thanks a lot!

i only wanted to make it clear that i used yum to update, because
there is still the other updater up2date, right?
(haven't used this one for ages ;)

maybe i should leave the term yum out next time,
to make it clear it's that baby-eating-beast-called-rawhide and not the
update tool itself.


btw. i fixed the two update erros (gnome-applets, gconf-editor)
with an "rpm -e --noscripts" and a 2nd --forced update on them.


thanks again,
Lars





From jspaleta at gmail.com  Tue Mar 29 15:17:35 2005
From: jspaleta at gmail.com (Jeff Spaleta)
Date: Tue, 29 Mar 2005 10:17:35 -0500
Subject: rawhide report: 20050329 changes
In-Reply-To: 
References: <200503291258.j2TCw7r3004997@porkchop.devel.redhat.com>
	
Message-ID: <604aa791050329071769d91780@mail.gmail.com>

On Tue, 29 Mar 2005 16:16:29 +0200, Lars  wrote:
>   Cleanup   : system-config-keyboard       ####################### [51/76]
> /var/tmp/rpm-tmp.57077: line 2: [-x: command not found

All the [-x errors you see in the clean up stage are the result of
postuninstall script errors in the versions of the packages you had
already installed.  The updates for
system-config-keyboard and other packages were produced to fix this
[-x packaging error which affected both postinstall and postuninstall
scripts in the package.

Observant testers have already seen this [-x error last week when the
broken packages were placed into rawhide. There really is no reason to
be surprised by these errors. This issue was discussed last week on
the fedora-test-list. The cleanup stage messages are an obvious
side-effect of the underlying problem that the package updates are
addressing.

I would encourage you to follow the discussions about the test
releases and development tree updates in the fedora-test-list.

-jef



From skvidal at phy.duke.edu  Tue Mar 29 15:19:53 2005
From: skvidal at phy.duke.edu (seth vidal)
Date: Tue, 29 Mar 2005 10:19:53 -0500
Subject: rawhide report: 20050329 changes
In-Reply-To: 
References: <200503291258.j2TCw7r3004997@porkchop.devel.redhat.com>
	
	<1112106554.14183.49.camel@cutter>
	
Message-ID: <1112109593.14183.51.camel@cutter>


> maybe i should leave the term yum out next time,
> to make it clear it's that baby-eating-beast-called-rawhide and not the
> update tool itself.


Thanks. I only mentioned it b/c I get a lot of 'yum broken foo' reports
when in reality yum didn't break anything. Yum just applied a package
that was internally broken.

-sv




From dnjinc at wowway.com  Tue Mar 29 15:45:21 2005
From: dnjinc at wowway.com (Demond James)
Date: Tue, 29 Mar 2005 10:45:21 -0500
Subject: rawhide report: 20050329 changes
In-Reply-To: <200503291258.j2TCw7r3004997@porkchop.devel.redhat.com>
References: <200503291258.j2TCw7r3004997@porkchop.devel.redhat.com>
Message-ID: <42497811.9010404@wowway.com>

Build System wrote:

> 
>
>Removed package im-sdk
>
>Updated Packages:
>
>flac-1.1.2-1
>------------
>* Mon Mar 28 2005 John (J5) Palmieri  1.1.2-1
>- Update to upstream version 1.1.2
>- Replace flac-1.1.0-libtool.patch with flac-1.1.2-libtool.patch
> Disable docs again until gtk-doc is fixed (GNOME bug #169087).
>
>gstreamer-plugins-0.8.8-2
>-------------------------
>* Sun Mar 27 2005 John (J5) Palmieri  - 0.8.8-2
>- disabled building Hermes because it is not needed and doesn't
>  compile with gcc4.0.  If upstream fixes it we can reenable
>
>* Wed Mar 23 2005 John (J5) Palmieri  - 0.8.8-1
>- Update to upstream version 0.8.8
>- Rebuild for libmusicbrainz 2.1.1
>
>valgrind-1:2.4.0-1
>------------------
>* Sun Mar 27 2005 Colin Walters  2.4.0-1
>- New upstream version 
>- Update valgrind-2.2.0-regtest.patch to 2.4.0; required minor
>  massaging
>- Disable valgrind-2.1.2-4G.patch for now; Not going to touch this,
>  and Fedora does not ship 4G kernel by default anymore
>- Remove upstreamed valgrind-2.2.0.ioctls.patch
>- Remove obsolete valgrind-2.2.0-warnings.patch; Code is no longer
>  present
>- Remove upstreamed valgrind-2.2.0-valgrind_h.patch
>- Remove obsolete valgrind-2.2.0-unnest.patch and
>  valgrind-2.0.0-pthread-stacksize.patch; valgrind no longer
>  includes its own pthread library
>
>
>
>  
>
Missing Dependencies in todays Rawhide.
k3b, valgrind-callgrind & vorbis-tools need to be rebuilt.

Error: Missing Dependency: libFLAC.so.4()(64bit) is needed by package k3b
Error: Missing Dependency: valgrind = 1:2.2.0 is needed by package
valgrind-callgrind
Error: Missing Dependency: libFLAC.so.4()(64bit) is needed by package flac
Error: Missing Dependency: libFLAC++.so.2()(64bit) is needed by package k3b
Error: Missing Dependency: libFLAC.so.4()(64bit) is needed by package
vorbis-tools
Error: Missing Dependency: libOggFLAC.so.1()(64bit) is needed by package
vorbis-tools




From terraformers at gmx.net  Tue Mar 29 15:45:18 2005
From: terraformers at gmx.net (Lars)
Date: Tue, 29 Mar 2005 17:45:18 +0200
Subject: rawhide report: 20050329 changes
References: <200503291258.j2TCw7r3004997@porkchop.devel.redhat.com>
	
	<604aa791050329071769d91780@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: 

On Tue, 29 Mar 2005 10:17:35 -0500, Jeff Spaleta wrote:

> On Tue, 29 Mar 2005 16:16:29 +0200, Lars  wrote:
>>   Cleanup   : system-config-keyboard       ####################### [51/76]
>> /var/tmp/rpm-tmp.57077: line 2: [-x: command not found
> 
> All the [-x errors you see in the clean up stage are the result of
> postuninstall script errors in the versions of the packages you had
> already installed.  The updates for
> system-config-keyboard and other packages were produced to fix this
> [-x packaging error which affected both postinstall and postuninstall
> scripts in the package.
> 
> Observant testers have already seen this [-x error last week when the
> broken packages were placed into rawhide. There really is no reason to
> be surprised by these errors. This issue was discussed last week on
> the fedora-test-list. The cleanup stage messages are an obvious
> side-effect of the underlying problem that the package updates are
> addressing.
> 
> I would encourage you to follow the discussions about the test
> releases and development tree updates in the fedora-test-list.
> 
> -jef

thanks,

already read up in the list that they are harmless packaging
issues.
wanted to mention them here in the test-list, so others
know "they are not alone" and it's not only their test-system's fault.
reports from others helped me a *lot* in the past for testing daily
rawhide cuts, and deciding what to exclude.

of course i usually answer in the test-list and not in the devel-list,
but the rawhide reports are distributed to both now (which is nice imho).


btw.
fixed the only "real" two update-errors gnome-applets and gconf-editor,
with "rpm -e --noscripts" and a 2nd --forced
update on them. (had them installed two times)
now all plays nice again.


best
Lars





From thacker at math.cornell.edu  Tue Mar 29 15:59:12 2005
From: thacker at math.cornell.edu (John Thacker)
Date: Tue, 29 Mar 2005 10:59:12 -0500
Subject: rawhide report: 20050329 changes
In-Reply-To: 
References: <200503291258.j2TCw7r3004997@porkchop.devel.redhat.com>
	
Message-ID: <20050329155912.GA17231@thacker.dyndns.org>

On Tue, Mar 29, 2005 at 04:16:29PM +0200, Lars wrote:
>   Updating  : gnome-applets                ####################### [17/76]
> /usr/share/gnome/help/stickynotes_applet/C/stickynotes_applet.xml:228: element figure: validity error : ID stickynotes-using-left-fig already defined
>   

>                                          ^
> /usr/share/gnome/help/char-palette/C/char-palette.xml:298: element figure: validity error : ID applet-fig already defined
>         

>                                ^

These are upstream bugs.  Someone made a few typos when checking in 
documentation and has duplicate XML IDs.  The second one has been fixed in 
CVS upstream:
http://cvs.gnome.org/viewcvs/gnome-applets/charpick/help/C/char-palette.xml?rev=1.10&view=log

The other one I made a bug upstream in GNOME Bugzilla, although it hasn't
been confirmed yet or fixed:
http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=171728

It's also pretty easy to patch to fix, so we could create local bugs for
it and get it patched.  It doesn't really seem to keep the documentation
from working properly, just create this XML validity error.

John Thacker
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From knutjbj at online.no  Tue Mar 29 16:52:40 2005
From: knutjbj at online.no (Knut J Bjuland)
Date: Tue, 29 Mar 2005 18:52:40 +0200
Subject: BUG: using smp_processor_id() in preemptible whe enable preemt in
 2.6.10-1.8FC#
Message-ID: <424987D8.70402@online.no>

When I custom compile kernel-2.6.11-1.8_FC3 i get these error messages.
BUG: using smp_processor_id() in preemptible [00000001] code: 
cons.saver/3644
caller is load_elf_binary+0xabe/0xd60. I am send along log off dmesesg, 
patching and building off this custom kernel along with .config. These 
error messages was log before starting X and the kernel was untainted. I 
believe this is an bug with the interaction between exce-shield and 
preemtiv. It appeared in Linux 2.6.11, and was to present in kernel 2.6.10.

kobject_hotplug: /sbin/hotplug vc seq=441 HOME=/ PATH=/sbin:/bin:/usr/sbin:/usr/bin ACTION=add DEVPATH=/class/vc/vcsa1 SUBSYSTEM=vc

 [] smp_processor_id+0x92/0xa4
 [] arch_add_exec_range+0x4d/0x6f
 [] load_elf_binary+0x427/0xd60
 [] search_binary_handler+0xd6/0x30c
 [] do_execve+0x16f/0x212
 [] sys_execve+0x2f/0x94
 [] syscall_call+0x7/0xb
BUG: using smp_processor_id() in preemptible [00000001] code: hotplug/461
caller is load_elf_binary+0xabe/0xd60
 [] dump_stack+0x17/0x19
 [] smp_processor_id+0x92/0xa4
 [] load_elf_binary+0xabe/0xd60<3>BUG: using smp_processor_id() in preemptible [00000001] code: hotplug/462
caller is arch_add_exec_range+0x4d/0x6f
 [] dump_stack+0x17/0x19
 [] smp_processor_id+0x92/0xa4
 [] arch_add_exec_range+0x4d/0x6f
 [] load_elf_binary+0x427/0xd60
 [] search_binary_handler+0xd6/0x30c
 [] do_execve+0x16f/0x212
 [] sys_execve+0x2f/0x94
 [] syscall_call+0x7/0xb
BUG: using smp_processor_id() in preemptible [00000001] code: hotplug/462



From thomasz at hostmaster.org  Tue Mar 29 21:42:21 2005
From: thomasz at hostmaster.org (Thomas Zehetbauer)
Date: Tue, 29 Mar 2005 23:42:21 +0200
Subject: OpenNTPD inclusion on Fedora Core
In-Reply-To: 
References: <6.2.1.2.2.20050322001945.01dc1720@tornado.reub.net>
	
	
	
Message-ID: <1112132541.5482.195.camel@hostmaster.org>

On Mon, 2005-03-21 at 15:49 +0200, Pekka Savola wrote:
> Well, you don't need SELinux.  NTPD as shipped runs by default as user 
> 'ntp' (AFAIR), and can be chrooted as well.  OpenNTPD takes the 
> functional separation a bit further.  About the only thing a "bad 
> packet" can cause is adjusting your clock.. whether that's bad or not 
> is debatable.

ONLY if they can introduce more outlyers to your NTP server/network than
the algorithm can identify and even then they would be limited to
adjustments smaller than 1000s at a time.

Tom

-- 
  T h o m a s   Z e h e t b a u e r   ( TZ251 )
  PGP encrypted mail preferred - KeyID 96FFCB89
      finger thomasz at hostmaster.org for key

The reasonable man adapts himself to the world;
the unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself.
Therefore, all progress depends on the unreasonable man.
        - George Bernard Shaw



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From windenntw at gmail.com  Wed Mar 30 05:22:10 2005
From: windenntw at gmail.com (Antonio Vargas)
Date: Wed, 30 Mar 2005 07:22:10 +0200
Subject: Firefox slows down pc......
In-Reply-To: <20050329083229.GE13827@joshua.mesa.nl>
References: <4246E34F.5010500@os.lv> <20050329082732.GD13827@joshua.mesa.nl>
	<20050329083229.GE13827@joshua.mesa.nl>
Message-ID: <69304d1105032921225ae650da@mail.gmail.com>

On Tue, 29 Mar 2005 10:32:29 +0200, Marcel J.E. Mol  wrote:
> On Tue, Mar 29, 2005 at 10:27:32AM +0200, Marcel J.E. Mol wrote:
> > On Sun, Mar 27, 2005 at 07:46:07PM +0300, Kaspars wrote:
> > >
> > >  Hi,
> > >
> > >  I search and don`t see that there is topic about my problem yet and
> > > don`t know is this here...
> > >  I`m using fresh FC3 reinstalled for week and updated, problem is that
> > > something like to eat my pc power and I found that it is firefox... New
> > > firefox when opened couple tabs (last 5) and all try to download some
> > > site was fulling my memory/processor, top of the "top":
> > > 19.0 10.1   2:10.66 firefox-bin
> > > 10.2 50.3  11:52.26 X
> > > and load start to fullfill: load average: 5.31, 3.43, 1.98
> > >
> > > Last time load was go so high that something kill some process and pc
> > > freeze. Only reboot help...
> > > So I`m thinking what to do, I have all updated etc. Start to think to
> > > compile maybe by my self ff. Don`t know what to do...
> > > Pc is year old Toshiba Satellite with p4 and 256ram.
> >
> >
> > Attached is a testcase that shows high cpu usage for both firefox and mozilla.
> > It contains a few animated gifs. I resize my browser so the bottom part of the
> > page, including the animated gif in it, is outside the window. There are still
> > 4 instances of the same gif visable.  CPU usage in this case is just a few %.
> >
> > Now when I scroll the bottom part into view so that the 5th instance of the gif
> > becomes visible, cpu usage rises to 30% or 40%!
> >
> > If other people can reproduce this I can file a bugzilla...
> 
> I see this effect in mozilla and firefox, but not in konqueror.
> 
> -Marcel

this is cpu cache effects: 4 gifs at XxY rendered resolution fit ok in
data caches but 5th one spills. perhaps konqueror uses less mem and
thus it can fit 5 and not 6, or it already does not fit 4 and it then
feels equally slow with 4 and 5.

> --
>      ======--------         Marcel J.E. Mol                MESA Consulting B.V.
>     =======---------        ph. +31-(0)6-54724868          P.O. Box 112
>     =======---------        marcel at mesa.nl                 2630 AC  Nootdorp
> __==== www.mesa.nl ---____U_n_i_x______I_n_t_e_r_n_e_t____ The Netherlands ____
>  They couldn't think of a number,           Linux user 1148  --  counter.li.org
>     so they gave me a name!  -- Rupert Hine  --  www.ruperthine.com
> 
> --
> fedora-devel-list mailing list
> fedora-devel-list at redhat.com
> http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-list
> 


-- 
Greetz, Antonio Vargas aka winden of network

http://wind.codepixel.com/

Las cosas no son lo que parecen, excepto cuando parecen lo que si son.



From gauravp at hclcomnet.co.in  Wed Mar 30 06:13:46 2005
From: gauravp at hclcomnet.co.in (gaurav)
Date: Wed, 30 Mar 2005 11:43:46 +0530
Subject: Oracle 9i and FC3/RHEL 4 howto
Message-ID: <424A439A.3000801@hclcomnet.co.in>



http://www.pagux.com/oracle9ionfedora3.html

might be helpful if you ever need to install Oracle 9i on fedora 3 or 
RHEL 4

I will also write a pre-install script stuff soon

I also want to thank Jean Francois for helping me out on most tricky part :-) 

Regards,
Gaurav






From byte at aeon.com.my  Wed Mar 30 06:17:32 2005
From: byte at aeon.com.my (Colin Charles)
Date: Wed, 30 Mar 2005 16:17:32 +1000
Subject: Firefox search plugin for RH's Bugzilla available
In-Reply-To: <423A13AB.10408@n-man.com>
References: <423A13AB.10408@n-man.com>
Message-ID: <1112163452.8582.130.camel@arena.soho.bytebot.net>

On Thu, 2005-03-17 at 17:32 -0600, Patrick Barnes wrote:
> This might be considered off-topic, but for all those who are 
> interested, I have produced a search plugin for Firefox that allows 
> quick searching of Red Hat's Bugzilla through Google.  It could be
> quite 
> handy for searching existing bugs.
> 
> Get it from http://fedora.n-man.com/

I can't seem to access your site, so I went around to writing my own
(for Core, Extras and Legacy):

	http://www.arenatechniques.com/firefox/

It needs to be placed in /usr/lib/firefox-1.0.2/searchplugins

Don't forget to get the rhbz.png that I liberally stole from the favicon
at rhbz. Usage is simple, just enter some search terms and it finds
bugzilla entries back for you

This doesn't use Google, it uses the RHBZ interface directly. What would
next be nifty to do (when I have more time, or if anyone volunteers) is
to use quicksearch.js at RHBZ and then allow even bug numbers to be
entered in...

And then, today on IRC I find out that there's already:
	http://askingforthirds.org/rh_bugzilla/

So maybe thats what we should be using :)
-- 
Colin Charles, byte at aeon.com.my
http://www.bytebot.net/
"First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, 
then you win." -- Mohandas Gandhi



From marcel at mesa.nl  Wed Mar 30 06:49:20 2005
From: marcel at mesa.nl (Marcel J.E. Mol)
Date: Wed, 30 Mar 2005 08:49:20 +0200
Subject: Firefox slows down pc......
In-Reply-To: <69304d1105032921225ae650da@mail.gmail.com>
References: <4246E34F.5010500@os.lv> <20050329082732.GD13827@joshua.mesa.nl>
	<20050329083229.GE13827@joshua.mesa.nl>
	<69304d1105032921225ae650da@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <20050330064920.GA28182@joshua.mesa.nl>

On Wed, Mar 30, 2005 at 07:22:10AM +0200, Antonio Vargas wrote:
> On Tue, 29 Mar 2005 10:32:29 +0200, Marcel J.E. Mol  wrote:
> > On Tue, Mar 29, 2005 at 10:27:32AM +0200, Marcel J.E. Mol wrote:
> > > On Sun, Mar 27, 2005 at 07:46:07PM +0300, Kaspars wrote:
> > > >
> > > >  Hi,
> > > >
> > > >  I search and don`t see that there is topic about my problem yet and
> > > > don`t know is this here...
> > > >  I`m using fresh FC3 reinstalled for week and updated, problem is that
> > > > something like to eat my pc power and I found that it is firefox... New
> > > > firefox when opened couple tabs (last 5) and all try to download some
> > > > site was fulling my memory/processor, top of the "top":
> > > > 19.0 10.1   2:10.66 firefox-bin
> > > > 10.2 50.3  11:52.26 X
> > > > and load start to fullfill: load average: 5.31, 3.43, 1.98
> > > >
> > > > Last time load was go so high that something kill some process and pc
> > > > freeze. Only reboot help...
> > > > So I`m thinking what to do, I have all updated etc. Start to think to
> > > > compile maybe by my self ff. Don`t know what to do...
> > > > Pc is year old Toshiba Satellite with p4 and 256ram.
> > >
> > >
> > > Attached is a testcase that shows high cpu usage for both firefox and mozilla.
> > > It contains a few animated gifs. I resize my browser so the bottom part of the
> > > page, including the animated gif in it, is outside the window. There are still
> > > 4 instances of the same gif visable.  CPU usage in this case is just a few %.
> > >
> > > Now when I scroll the bottom part into view so that the 5th instance of the gif
> > > becomes visible, cpu usage rises to 30% or 40%!
> > >
> > > If other people can reproduce this I can file a bugzilla...
> > 
> > I see this effect in mozilla and firefox, but not in konqueror.
> > 
> > -Marcel
> 
> this is cpu cache effects: 4 gifs at XxY rendered resolution fit ok in
> data caches but 5th one spills. perhaps konqueror uses less mem and
> thus it can fit 5 and not 6, or it already does not fit 4 and it then
> feels equally slow with 4 and 5.

That could explain it perhaps. When I remove the gifs from the top part 
one by one the extra cpu usage when getting the bottom part in view is getting
less.
But opening mozilla and konquere at the same time, konqueror showing all gifs and
mozilla with the bottom part hidden show no extra cpu usage. Again moving the
bottom part in view in mozilla (so I see all animations in both mozilla and
konqueror at the same time) gives a sudden increase in cpu usage.

I also created simple html page with increasing numbers of this animated gif and
even with 20 of them in view cpu usages stays practically 0%!

I think there must be something more...

-Marcel



From rahulsundaram at yahoo.co.in  Wed Mar 30 06:52:13 2005
From: rahulsundaram at yahoo.co.in (Rahul Sundaram)
Date: Tue, 29 Mar 2005 22:52:13 -0800 (PST)
Subject: menus, Name/GenericName
In-Reply-To: 6667
Message-ID: <20050330065213.50599.qmail@web8508.mail.in.yahoo.com>

Hi

> 
> People are asking what the freedesktop HIG says, the
> menus are still a
> mess, and there's confusion - see entire thread.
> Thank you 
> for fixing some of the menu bugs...

does something called "freedesktop HIG" even exist?

Regards
Rahul Sundaram


		
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From rahulsundaram at yahoo.co.in  Wed Mar 30 07:09:38 2005
From: rahulsundaram at yahoo.co.in (Rahul Sundaram)
Date: Tue, 29 Mar 2005 23:09:38 -0800 (PST)
Subject: Oracle 9i and FC3/RHEL 4 howto
In-Reply-To: 6667
Message-ID: <20050330070938.24076.qmail@web8507.mail.in.yahoo.com>


--- gaurav  wrote:
> 
> 
> http://www.pagux.com/oracle9ionfedora3.html
> 
> might be helpful if you ever need to install Oracle
> 9i on fedora 3 or 
> RHEL 4
> 

if you are the author you can post in fedora docs list
and get it hosted in fedora.redhat.com/docs

Regards
Rahul Sundaram


		
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From ivg2 at cornell.edu  Wed Mar 30 07:26:59 2005
From: ivg2 at cornell.edu (Ivan Gyurdiev)
Date: Wed, 30 Mar 2005 02:26:59 -0500
Subject: menus, Name/GenericName
In-Reply-To: <20050330065213.50599.qmail@web8508.mail.in.yahoo.com>
References: <20050330065213.50599.qmail@web8508.mail.in.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <1112167619.1699.1.camel@cobra.ivg2.net>

On Tue, 2005-03-29 at 22:52 -0800, Rahul Sundaram wrote:
> Hi
> 
> > 
> > People are asking what the freedesktop HIG says, the
> > menus are still a
> > mess, and there's confusion - see entire thread.
> > Thank you 
> > for fixing some of the menu bugs...
> 
> does something called "freedesktop HIG" even exist?

No, but I meant the specification for the .desktop file,
and the GNOME HiG.

-- 
Ivan Gyurdiev 
Cornell University



From kwade at redhat.com  Wed Mar 30 09:14:14 2005
From: kwade at redhat.com (Karsten Wade)
Date: Wed, 30 Mar 2005 01:14:14 -0800
Subject: Self-Introduction:  Karsten Wade
Message-ID: <1112174054.9412.159.camel@erato.phig.org>

About time I did one of these herethat it matters ...

1. Karsten G. Wade
2. Santa Cruz, CA, USA
3. Technical Writer
4. Red Hat, Inc.
5. Goals in Fedora Project:

# Packages?
* Currently I want to see the PDF problems resolved in the DocBook
toolchain in Fedora Core.  Some of us are experimenting with FOP, we'll
see how that turns out.  If you are interested in this, please join
fedora-docs-list at redhat.com and join the discussions.  I don't know yet
what packages this will include, but when I do know, I'll want to see
them in FC.

# QA?
* I already do QA, mainly when doing documentation.  Doc writers find
the strangest bugs ...

# Else?
* As the newly minted project leader for the Fedora Docs Project (FDP),
I have a special interest in seeing the Fedora Project be well
documented.

* More Fedora in developing nations, end-users and developers alike.
This means stronger internationalization, bigger translation community,
more documentation for all levels of users.

6. Historical quals:

# Past projects?
* Member of the FDP since inception (Aug. 2003), current project leader.

* Worked on SELinux project since it's inclusion in Fedora Core, writing
the release notes entries, Fedora SELinux FAQ, and being as helpful as I
can on fedora-selinux-list and #fedora-selinux (nick: quaid).

# Languages/skills?
* I am a fairly good sysadmin with weak scripting skills and no real
programming languages.

* My DocBook/XML is pretty strong, my XSL-fu and CSS-fu are weak but
growing.

* I was a consultant service provider for Red Hat and VA Linux, so I
have seen and worked in a lot of real world Linux environments.  I tend
to be service oriented, i.e., helpful. :)  This means I'm full of
opinions.

# Trust?
* Briefly -- most of the Fedora developers from Red Hat and many of the
non-Red Hat developers have worked with me.  I have met even Warren f2f.
Finally, I have this shiny medallion here ... swinging ... swinging ...
swinging slowly in front of your eyes ... meaning ... meaning ...
meaning I'm trustful ... you are feeling very trusting of me, aren't
you?  Mmm?  Good ... very good ... when you wake up you will feel
refreshed and relaxed, like you just roused yourself from a daydream and
had a good stretch ... you will remember none of this conversation ...
except you will remember to trust me ... ready?  one ... two ... three,
awaken!

Trust me now?

# GPG

pub  1024D/AD0E0C41 2003-11-26 Karsten G. Wade (quaid|phig)

     Key fingerprint = 2680 DBFD D968 3141 0115  5F1B D992 0E06 AD0E
0C41
uid                            Karsten Wade 
sub  1024g/C07806E8 2003-11-26



-- 
Karsten Wade, RHCE * Sr. Tech Writer * http://people.redhat.com/kwade/
gpg fingerprint:  2680 DBFD D968 3141 0115    5F1B D992 0E06 AD0E 0C41   
                       Red Hat SELinux Guide
http://www.redhat.com/docs/manuals/enterprise/RHEL-4-Manual/selinux-guide/
-------------- next part --------------
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From n0td1scl0s3d at hotmail.com  Wed Mar 30 10:07:06 2005
From: n0td1scl0s3d at hotmail.com (not disclosed)
Date: Wed, 30 Mar 2005 10:07:06 +0000
Subject: kernel source code
Message-ID: 


Dear All,

RE: In order to eliminate the redundancy inherent in providing a separate 
package for the kernel source code when that source code already exists in 
the kernel's .src.rpm file, Fedora Core 3 no longer includes the 
kernel-source package. - 
http://fedora.redhat.com/docs/release-notes/fc3/x86/

I think this is a big mistake - kernel-source didn't harm anyone and 
removing it hugely increases the amount of hassle involved in any kernel 
upgrade.  You have to accept that fedora users will be using stuff that lies 
outside the fedora world of nicely packaged programs and this means that 
users need the source code.  The hassle involved with this elimination of 
the kernel source code package is irritating enough for us to consider using 
another distro when we come to change from FC2.

Please put the kernel sourcecode back.

Cheers,

SA

_________________________________________________________________
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From peter.backlund at home.se  Wed Mar 30 10:25:30 2005
From: peter.backlund at home.se (Peter Backlund)
Date: Wed, 30 Mar 2005 12:25:30 +0200
Subject: kernel source code
In-Reply-To: 
References: 
Message-ID: <1112178330.9432.4.camel@localhost.localdomain>

ons 2005-03-30 klockan 10:07 +0000 skrev not disclosed:
> Dear All,
> RE: In order to eliminate the redundancy inherent in providing a separate 
> package for the kernel source code when that source code already exists in 
> the kernel's .src.rpm file, Fedora Core 3 no longer includes the 
> kernel-source package. - 
> http://fedora.redhat.com/docs/release-notes/fc3/x86/
> 
> I think this is a big mistake - kernel-source didn't harm anyone and 
> removing it hugely increases the amount of hassle involved in any kernel 
> upgrade.  You have to accept that fedora users will be using stuff that lies 
> outside the fedora world of nicely packaged programs and this means that 
> users need the source code.  

What do they need it for, exactly?

> The hassle involved with this elimination of 
> the kernel source code package is irritating enough for us to consider using 
> another distro when we come to change from FC2.

Did you read the instructions in the release notes for obtaining a
buildable kernel source tree?

/Peter





From n0td1scl0s3d at hotmail.com  Wed Mar 30 10:26:18 2005
From: n0td1scl0s3d at hotmail.com (not disclosed)
Date: Wed, 30 Mar 2005 10:26:18 +0000
Subject: kernel source code
In-Reply-To: <1112178330.9432.4.camel@localhost.localdomain>
Message-ID: 


We need it for building drivers which aren't included in the fedora distros 
- not everything in the world is rpm based.  We also need it to customize 
the kernels.

I have around 20 machines running fc2, (they are all running different 
kernels one different processors with different hardware)- the extra hassle 
involved here (and it is a fiddly task) makes it easier to switch to another 
distro.

Not everything is rpm'd - this change is an huge pain in the arse. I don't 
see how including this package inconveniences anyone.

SA






>From: Peter Backlund 
>Reply-To: Development discussions related to Fedora Core 
>
>To: fedora-devel-list at redhat.com
>Subject: Re: kernel source code
>Date: Wed, 30 Mar 2005 12:25:30 +0200
>
>ons 2005-03-30 klockan 10:07 +0000 skrev not disclosed:
> > Dear All,
> > RE: In order to eliminate the redundancy inherent in providing a 
>separate
> > package for the kernel source code when that source code already exists 
>in
> > the kernel's .src.rpm file, Fedora Core 3 no longer includes the
> > kernel-source package. -
> > http://fedora.redhat.com/docs/release-notes/fc3/x86/
> >
> > I think this is a big mistake - kernel-source didn't harm anyone and
> > removing it hugely increases the amount of hassle involved in any kernel
> > upgrade.  You have to accept that fedora users will be using stuff that 
>lies
> > outside the fedora world of nicely packaged programs and this means that
> > users need the source code.
>
>What do they need it for, exactly?
>
> > The hassle involved with this elimination of
> > the kernel source code package is irritating enough for us to consider 
>using
> > another distro when we come to change from FC2.
>
>Did you read the instructions in the release notes for obtaining a
>buildable kernel source tree?
>
>/Peter
>
>
>
>--
>fedora-devel-list mailing list
>fedora-devel-list at redhat.com
>http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-list

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From rahulsundaram at yahoo.co.in  Wed Mar 30 10:26:37 2005
From: rahulsundaram at yahoo.co.in (Rahul Sundaram)
Date: Wed, 30 Mar 2005 02:26:37 -0800 (PST)
Subject: kernel source code
In-Reply-To: 6667
Message-ID: <20050330102637.94106.qmail@web8510.mail.in.yahoo.com>

Hi

> 
> I think this is a big mistake - kernel-source didn't
> harm anyone 

it was duplicating stuff already in the srpms



and 
> removing it hugely increases the amount of hassle
> involved in any kernel 
> upgrade.

depends on whether you did a rebuild or not



  You have to accept that fedora users will
> be using stuff that lies 
> outside the fedora world of nicely packaged programs
> and this means that 
> users need the source code.  

they can use the srpm




Regards
Rahul Sundaram


		
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Yahoo! Mail - 250MB free storage. Do more. Manage less. 
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From mpeters at mac.com  Wed Mar 30 10:32:18 2005
From: mpeters at mac.com (Michael A. Peters)
Date: Wed, 30 Mar 2005 10:32:18 +0000
Subject: kernel source code
In-Reply-To: <1112178330.9432.4.camel@localhost.localdomain> (from
	peter.backlund@home.se on Wed Mar 30 02:25:30 2005)
References: 
	<1112178330.9432.4.camel@localhost.localdomain>
Message-ID: <1112178738l.6462l.0l@devel.mpeters.local>


On 03/30/2005 02:25:30 AM, Peter Backlund wrote:

> 
> What do they need it for, exactly?

Me personally?
Nothing - none of the add-on kernel modules I have used required a  
kernel source package to build. I know I don't speak for everyone,  
but ...

-- 
Michael A. Peters
http://mpeters.us/





From wtogami at redhat.com  Wed Mar 30 10:31:23 2005
From: wtogami at redhat.com (Warren Togami)
Date: Wed, 30 Mar 2005 00:31:23 -1000
Subject: kernel source code
In-Reply-To: 
References: 
Message-ID: <424A7FFB.60804@redhat.com>

not disclosed wrote:
> 
> We need it for building drivers which aren't included in the fedora 
> distros - not everything in the world is rpm based.  We also need it to 
> customize the kernels.

Did you miss the part about NOT NEEDING kernel source in order to build 
modules against that kernel?  FC2 and FC3 kernel provides headers that 
are sufficient 99% of the time, while FC4 split that out into 
kernel-devel which serves a similar purpose.

If you look at the 3rd party kernel module packages like nvidia or 
vmware, they build against these headers.

Warren Togami
wtogami at redhat.com



From n0td1scl0s3d at hotmail.com  Wed Mar 30 10:42:54 2005
From: n0td1scl0s3d at hotmail.com (not disclosed)
Date: Wed, 30 Mar 2005 10:42:54 +0000
Subject: kernel source code
In-Reply-To: <424A7FFB.60804@redhat.com>
Message-ID: 


What exactly is the problem with including kernel-sourcecode?

It makes it easy to take someone else's driver and compile it against your 
source, it makes it easy to nobble the source and recompile - I have spent 
the last hour trying to install the source from
the src rpm following the instructions in 
http://fedora.redhat.com/docs/release-notes/fc3/x86/
and I still don't have the source code so I still can't compile my drivers.  
  I can't be arsed to repeat
this 20 times when I shift from fc2 in my lab - with the kernel-sourcecode 
package I would "yum install kernel-sourcecode" and be done.

Removing the kernel-sourcecode is a retrograde step that goes against the 
principle of packaging
stuff up - you are forcing the end user to learn a lot of largely useless, 
arbitrary code rubbish in order to achieve their task.  The annoying thing 
is that it doesn't seem to be saving anyone anything. The idea that it 
causes harm by duplicating things that are available in the source is daft - 
if you followed this to its conclusion then you would stop distributingmost 
binaries.

SA



>From: Warren Togami 
>Reply-To: Development discussions related to Fedora Core 
>
>To: Development discussions related to Fedora Core 
>
>Subject: Re: kernel source code
>Date: Wed, 30 Mar 2005 00:31:23 -1000
>
>not disclosed wrote:
>>
>>We need it for building drivers which aren't included in the fedora 
>>distros - not everything in the world is rpm based.  We also need it to 
>>customize the kernels.
>
>Did you miss the part about NOT NEEDING kernel source in order to build 
>modules against that kernel?  FC2 and FC3 kernel provides headers that are 
>sufficient 99% of the time, while FC4 split that out into kernel-devel 
>which serves a similar purpose.
>
>If you look at the 3rd party kernel module packages like nvidia or vmware, 
>they build against these headers.
>
>Warren Togami
>wtogami at redhat.com
>
>--
>fedora-devel-list mailing list
>fedora-devel-list at redhat.com
>http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-list

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From ghenry at suretecsystems.com  Wed Mar 30 10:57:03 2005
From: ghenry at suretecsystems.com (Gavin Henry)
Date: Wed, 30 Mar 2005 11:57:03 +0100 (BST)
Subject: Oracle 9i and FC3/RHEL 4 howto
In-Reply-To: <424A439A.3000801@hclcomnet.co.in>
References: <424A439A.3000801@hclcomnet.co.in>
Message-ID: <39505.193.195.148.66.1112180223.squirrel@webmail.suretecsystems.com>


>
>
> http://www.pagux.com/oracle9ionfedora3.html
>
> might be helpful if you ever need to install Oracle 9i on fedora 3 or
> RHEL 4
>
> I will also write a pre-install script stuff soon
>
> I also want to thank Jean Francois for helping me out on most tricky part
> :-)

10g?


-- 
Kind Regards,

Gavin Henry.
Managing Director.

T +44 (0) 1224 279484
M +44 (0) 7930 323266
F +44 (0) 1224 742001
E ghenry at suretecsystems.com

Open Source. Open Solutions(tm).

http://www.suretecsystems.com/



From n0td1scl0s3d at hotmail.com  Wed Mar 30 11:00:20 2005
From: n0td1scl0s3d at hotmail.com (not disclosed)
Date: Wed, 30 Mar 2005 11:00:20 +0000
Subject: kernel source code
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: 


Can anyone enlighten me as to what this is supposed to mean?

      In order to eliminate the redundancy inherent in providing a separate 
package for the kernel source code when that source code already exists in 
the kernel's .src.rpm file, Fedora Core 3 no longer includes the 
kernel-source package. Users that require access to the kernel sources can 
find them in the kernel .src.rpm file. To create an exploded source tree 
from this file, perform the following steps (note that  refers to 
the version specification for your currently-running kernel):
         1.            Obtain the kernel-.src.rpm file from one of 
the following sources:
DONE
         2.            Install kernel-.src.rpm (given the default 
RPM configuration, the files this package contains will be written to 
/usr/src/redhat/)
Presumably rpm -i ....src.rpm - DONE
         3.            Change directory to /usr/src/redhat/SPECS/, and issue 
the following command:
            rpmbuild -bp --target= kernel.spec
            (Where  is the desired target architecture.)
DONE
            On a default RPM configuration, the kernel tree will be located 
in /usr/src/redhat/BUILD/.
         4.            In resulting tree, the configurations for the 
specific kernels shipped in Fedora Core 3 are in the /configs/ directory. 
For example, the i686 SMP configuration file is named 
/configs/kernel--i686-smp.config. Issue the following command to 
place the desired configuration file in the proper place for building:

            cp  ./.config
Errr- where are you supposed to be when you do this (cadidates are in this 
case /usr/src/redhat/BUILD/kernel-2.6.10/linux-2.6.10/configs or 
/usr/src/redhat/SPECS/)

         5.            Issue the following command:

            make oldconfig
Errr - where are you supposed to be in this case? presumably where there is  
the top level makefile is?


And where are the sources supposed to end up? the directory 
/usr/src/redhat/BUILD/kernel-2.6.10/linux-2.6.10 doesn't seem very 
general... I guess it is appropriate to copy this to /usr/src?

I did have one minor complaint about the behaviour of yum and 
kernel-sourcecode before and that was that yum insisted in deleting 
sourcecodes from other kernel versions making it a pain to upgrade gently.  
Still it was easier than this...


Thanks,

SA

>From: "not disclosed" 
>Reply-To: Development discussions related to Fedora Core 
>
>To: fedora-devel-list at redhat.com
>Subject: Re: kernel source code
>Date: Wed, 30 Mar 2005 10:42:54 +0000
>
>
>What exactly is the problem with including kernel-sourcecode?
>
>It makes it easy to take someone else's driver and compile it against your 
>source, it makes it easy to nobble the source and recompile - I have spent 
>the last hour trying to install the source from
>the src rpm following the instructions in 
>http://fedora.redhat.com/docs/release-notes/fc3/x86/
>and I still don't have the source code so I still can't compile my drivers. 
>   I can't be arsed to repeat
>this 20 times when I shift from fc2 in my lab - with the kernel-sourcecode 
>package I would "yum install kernel-sourcecode" and be done.
>
>Removing the kernel-sourcecode is a retrograde step that goes against the 
>principle of packaging
>stuff up - you are forcing the end user to learn a lot of largely useless, 
>arbitrary code rubbish in order to achieve their task.  The annoying thing 
>is that it doesn't seem to be saving anyone anything. The idea that it 
>causes harm by duplicating things that are available in the source is daft 
>- if you followed this to its conclusion then you would stop 
>distributingmost binaries.
>
>SA
>
>
>
>>From: Warren Togami 
>>Reply-To: Development discussions related to Fedora Core 
>>
>>To: Development discussions related to Fedora Core 
>>
>>Subject: Re: kernel source code
>>Date: Wed, 30 Mar 2005 00:31:23 -1000
>>
>>not disclosed wrote:
>>>
>>>We need it for building drivers which aren't included in the fedora 
>>>distros - not everything in the world is rpm based.  We also need it to 
>>>customize the kernels.
>>
>>Did you miss the part about NOT NEEDING kernel source in order to build 
>>modules against that kernel?  FC2 and FC3 kernel provides headers that are 
>>sufficient 99% of the time, while FC4 split that out into kernel-devel 
>>which serves a similar purpose.
>>
>>If you look at the 3rd party kernel module packages like nvidia or vmware, 
>>they build against these headers.
>>
>>Warren Togami
>>wtogami at redhat.com
>>
>>--
>>fedora-devel-list mailing list
>>fedora-devel-list at redhat.com
>>http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-list
>
>_________________________________________________________________
>FREE pop-up blocking with the new MSN Toolbar - get it now! 
>http://toolbar.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200415ave/direct/01/
>
>--
>fedora-devel-list mailing list
>fedora-devel-list at redhat.com
>http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-list

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From iago.rubio at hispalinux.es  Wed Mar 30 12:19:52 2005
From: iago.rubio at hispalinux.es (Iago Rubio)
Date: Wed, 30 Mar 2005 14:19:52 +0200
Subject: kernel source code
In-Reply-To: 
References: 
Message-ID: <1112185192.10862.54.camel@speedy.iagorubio.net>

On Wed, 2005-03-30 at 10:42 +0000, not disclosed wrote:
> What exactly is the problem with including kernel-sourcecode?
> 
> It makes it easy to take someone else's driver and compile it against your 
> source, it makes it easy to nobble the source and recompile - I have spent 
> the last hour trying to install the source from
> the src rpm following the instructions in 
> http://fedora.redhat.com/docs/release-notes/fc3/x86/
> and I still don't have the source code so I still can't compile my drivers.  

Did you looked at /usr/src/redhat/BUILD ?

>   I can't be arsed to repeat
> this 20 times when I shift from fc2 in my lab - with the kernel-sourcecode 
> package I would "yum install kernel-sourcecode" and be done.

Please, read the *whole* instructions in the release  notes.

> Removing the kernel-sourcecode is a retrograde step that goes against the 
> principle of packaging
> stuff up - you are forcing the end user to learn a lot of largely useless, 
> arbitrary code rubbish in order to achieve their task.

No, users that rebuilds their rpm packages know exactly how to manage
source rpms.

Your words are a prove, that a separate kernel source package just
developed in users a bogus idea of how to manage source packages on rpm
based distros.

You've got the binaries in the rpm and the sources in the src.rpm, for
all packages. Why the kernel sources should be an exception ?

>   The annoying thing 
> is that it doesn't seem to be saving anyone anything. The idea that it 
> causes harm by duplicating things that are available in the source is daft - 
> if you followed this to its conclusion then you would stop distributingmost 
> binaries.

This is complately pointless.

To make a symlink from /usr/src/linux
to /usr/src/redhat/BUILD/kernel*/linux* to match your previous build
environment is not a hard task, is it ?

ITOH in the release notes and in Warren's repply to your mail, you can
read there's *no need* of kernel source code to build third party
drivers - in most cases. I have no kernel source code, and built the
nvidia driver not once, but one time for each kernel upgrade.

Is this so difficult to understand ?

I was painfull to download the whole kernel source code, and build it,
just to get a sane environment to build the nvidia driver. 

Now to build third party drivers is much easier for me.
-- 
Iago Rubio



From seyman at wanadoo.fr  Wed Mar 30 12:26:08 2005
From: seyman at wanadoo.fr (Emmanuel Seyman)
Date: Wed, 30 Mar 2005 14:26:08 +0200
Subject: kernel source code
In-Reply-To: 
References: <424A7FFB.60804@redhat.com>
	
Message-ID: <20050330122608.GA10159@orient.maison.moi>

On Wed, Mar 30, 2005 at 10:42:54AM +0000, not disclosed wrote:
> 
> What exactly is the problem with including kernel-sourcecode?

It's a huge file (30+ Mb?) that you are trying to force everybody
to download and that very few people need (even the people who
believe they need it aren't always right).

Teeling people to grab the kernel src.rpm solves this problem.
People who need the source still have, those who don't need it
can stop downloading it over and over again.

> It makes it easy to take someone else's driver and compile it against your 

You should not need the kernel source to recompile a driver.

> source, it makes it easy to nobble the source and recompile - I have spent 
> the last hour trying to install the source from
> the src rpm following the instructions in 
> http://fedora.redhat.com/docs/release-notes/fc3/x86/

???

This took me all of two minutes.

Emmanuel



From n0td1scl0s3d at hotmail.com  Wed Mar 30 12:48:50 2005
From: n0td1scl0s3d at hotmail.com (not disclosed)
Date: Wed, 30 Mar 2005 12:48:50 +0000
Subject: kernel source code
In-Reply-To: <20050330122608.GA10159@orient.maison.moi>
Message-ID: 


Just so you all know - yes I do need the whole source code to compile my 
drivers - also I do know that  people won't need the kernel-sourcecode 
and that the headers will suffice but this isn't the case here.  
people won't be compiling drivers anyway.  As for the convenience (it isn't 
hard to put a link in.... etc) no it isn't but it is a time wasting pain in 
the arse to find out where rpm puts all this rubbish - just because I use FC 
doesn't mean I am endowed with special pyschic powers that mean I (end user) 
automatically know what (you developer / packager) know and therefore it 
isn't reasonable to assume that I know where to put the link - it takes time 
to find this out and this is wasted time.

In order to save people the deadful inconvenience of downloading the kernel 
source as opposed to the kernel headers you could just tell people that - 
the kernel-sourcecode package still remains useful and a valuable time 
saving resource.

I am detecting a degree of hostility from the posts I have received, a kind 
of "if you don't do it our way get stuffed" attitude which is rather 
unhelpful and rather charmless.  I am guessing that if this is 
representative of the powers that be in the FC development community that 
the chances of the the kernel source code  being put back in the distro are 
rather slim at this point.  In which case thanks very much for nothing, I'll 
find another distro.

SA

>From: Emmanuel Seyman 
>Reply-To: Development discussions related to Fedora Core 
>
>To: Development discussions related to Fedora Core 
>
>Subject: Re: kernel source code
>Date: Wed, 30 Mar 2005 14:26:08 +0200
>
>On Wed, Mar 30, 2005 at 10:42:54AM +0000, not disclosed wrote:
> >
> > What exactly is the problem with including kernel-sourcecode?
>
>It's a huge file (30+ Mb?) that you are trying to force everybody
>to download and that very few people need (even the people who
>believe they need it aren't always right).
>
>Teeling people to grab the kernel src.rpm solves this problem.
>People who need the source still have, those who don't need it
>can stop downloading it over and over again.
>
> > It makes it easy to take someone else's driver and compile it against 
>your
>
>You should not need the kernel source to recompile a driver.
>
> > source, it makes it easy to nobble the source and recompile - I have 
>spent
> > the last hour trying to install the source from
> > the src rpm following the instructions in
> > http://fedora.redhat.com/docs/release-notes/fc3/x86/
>
>???
>
>This took me all of two minutes.
>
>Emmanuel
>
>--
>fedora-devel-list mailing list
>fedora-devel-list at redhat.com
>http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-list

_________________________________________________________________
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From buildsys at redhat.com  Wed Mar 30 13:06:18 2005
From: buildsys at redhat.com (Build System)
Date: Wed, 30 Mar 2005 08:06:18 -0500
Subject: rawhide report: 20050330 changes
Message-ID: <200503301306.j2UD6IYd012076@porkchop.devel.redhat.com>

 

 
Updated Packages:

anaconda-10.2.0.36-1
--------------------
* Tue Mar 29 2005 Jeremy Katz  - 10.2.0.36-1
- tree build fix

* Tue Mar 29 2005 Jeremy Katz  - 10.2.0.35-1
- dead files can't really be installed (aka, fix the build)

* Tue Mar 29 2005 Chris Lumens  10.2.0.34-1
- Adjust pcmcia module loading for new in-kernel ds (pjones, #151235)
- Make the rescue images identify which arch they're for (pjones, #151501)
- Delete LV snapshots before the parent LV (pjones, #151524)
- Check various forms of a language nick.
- Allow setting MTU on the command line (katzj, #151789)
- Remove dead code in config file handling and sparc booting (katzj)
- Product name and path simplification (katzj)
- Fixes for lang-table format change (katzj, clumens)

beecrypt-4.1.2-3
----------------
* Tue Mar 29 2005 Paul Nasrat  4.1.2-3
- Disable beecrypt-java (#151294)

binutils-2.15.94.0.2.2-1
------------------------
* Tue Mar 29 2005 Jakub Jelinek  2.15.94.0.2.2-1
- update to 2.15.94.0.2.2
- speed up walk_wild_section (Robert O'Callahan)

coreutils-5.2.1-44
------------------
* Tue Mar 29 2005 Tim Waugh  5.2.1-44
- Added "stale utmp" patch from upstream.

cryptsetup-luks-1.0-1
---------------------
* Tue Mar 29 2005 Bill Nottingham  1.0-1
- update to 1.0

device-mapper-1.01.01-1.0
-------------------------
* Tue Mar 29 2005 Alasdair Kergon  - 1.01.01-1.0
- Update dmsetup man page.
- Replicate devmap_name output with dmsetup info -c --noheadings -o name.

flac-1.1.2-2
------------
* Tue Mar 29 2005 John (J5) Palmieri  1.1.2-2
- Rebuild (flac picked up a dependancy on it's older version)

gdm-1:2.6.0.7-8
---------------
* Tue Mar 29 2005 Ray Strode  1:2.6.0.7-8
- Add a --wait-for-bootup cmdline option.

gimp-2:2.2.4-10
---------------
* Tue Mar 29 2005 Nils Philippsen 
- revert gtk requirement change

gnome-media-2.10.0-2
--------------------
* Tue Mar 29 2005 John (J5) Palmieri  2.10.0-2
- Added a devel package

gnome-themes-2.10.0-3
---------------------

gnome-vfs2-2.10.0-3
-------------------
* Tue Mar 29 2005 David Zeuthen  2.10.0-3
- Rebuild

gstreamer-plugins-0.8.8-3
-------------------------
* Tue Mar 29 2005 John (J5) Palmieri  - 0.8.8-3
- Added Requires: GConf-devel to the devel package

gtk2-engines-2.6.2-3
--------------------
* Tue Mar 29 2005 Matthias Clasen  2.6.2-3
- Update to Clearlooks 0.5

hotplug-3:2004_09_23-4
----------------------
* Tue Mar 29 2005 Bill Nottingham  3:2004_09_23-4
- remove obsolete usbutils requirement

httpd-2.0.53-6
--------------
* Tue Mar 29 2005 Joe Orton  2.0.53-6
- update default httpd.conf:
 * clarify the comments on AddDefaultCharset usage (#135821)
 * remove all the AddCharset default extensions
 * don't load mod_imap by default
 * synch with upstream 2.0.53 httpd-std.conf
- mod_ssl: set user from SSLUserName in access hook (upstream #31418)
- htdigest: fix permissions of created files (upstream #33765)
- remove htsslpass

kdegraphics-7:3.4.0-2
---------------------
* Wed Mar 30 2005 Florian La Roche 
- try rebuilding

libselinux-1.23.3-1
-------------------
* Tue Mar 29 2005 Dan Walsh  1.23.2-3
- Update from NSA

* Wed Mar 23 2005 Dan Walsh  1.23.2-2
- Better handling of booleans

libsepol-1.5.2-2
----------------
* Thu Mar 24 2005 Dan Walsh  1.5.2-2
- Handle booleans.local

libwpd-0.8.0-3
--------------
* Wed Mar 30 2005 Caolan McNamara  0.8.0-3
- rh#152503# add some Requires for -devel package

lynx-2.8.5-23
-------------
* Tue Mar 29 2005 Tim Waugh  2.8.5-23
- Fixed fix for bug #90302 (bug #152146).

netpbm-10.27-1
--------------
* Tue Mar 29 2005 Jindrich Novy  10.27-1
- update to the new 10.27 release
- update .security2, .security patch
- regenerate man pages
- remove jbig, hpcd
- remove config_template from /usr
- don't create symlink to pamtopnm

nfs-utils-1.0.7-5
-----------------
* Tue Mar 29 2005 Steve Dickson  1.0.7-4
- Fixed a compile error on x86_64 machines in the gss code.
- Updated the statd-notify-hostname.patch to eliminate 
  a segmentation fault in rpc.statd when an network 
  interface was down. (bz 151828)

* Sat Mar 19 2005 Steve Dickson  1.0.7-3
- Changed xlog to use LOG_INFO instead of LOG_DEBUG
  so debug messages will appear w/out any config
  changes to syslog.conf.
- Reworked how /etc/exports is setup (bz 151389)

* Wed Mar 02 2005 Steve Dickson  1.0.7-2
- Tied the rpcsecgss debugging in with gssd and
  svcgssd debugging

perl-HTML-Tagset-3.04-1
-----------------------
* Tue Mar 29 2005 Robert Scheck  3.04-1
- upgrade to 3.04 and spec file cleanup (#140914, #150360)

pyxf86config-0.3.19-4
---------------------
* Tue Mar 29 2005 Warren Togami  - 0.3.19-4
- #138263 broken preun #142419 auto pyver

selinux-policy-strict-1.23.5-2
------------------------------
* Wed Mar 23 2005 Dan Walsh  1.23.5-2
- Handle booleans.local
- Add policy to handle ssh-keysign

selinux-policy-targeted-1.23.5-2
--------------------------------
* Wed Mar 23 2005 Dan Walsh  1.23.5-2
- Handle booleans.local

shadow-utils-2:4.0.7-4
----------------------
* Tue Mar 29 2005 Peter Vrabec   2:4.0.7-4
- use newgrp binary
- newgrp don't ask for password if user's default GID = group ID,
  ask for password if there is some in /etc/gshadow 
  and in /etc/group is 'x' (#149997)

slocate-2.7-19
--------------
* Tue Mar 29 2005 Miloslav Trmac  - 2.7-19
- Add updatedb.conf(5) (#135952)

system-config-securitylevel-1.5.4-1
-----------------------------------
* Tue Mar 29 2005 Chris Lumens  1.5.4-1
- Add HTTPS as a separate option instead of implying it with HTTP.
  (#145628).
- Have the menu option and comment mention firewalling (#124266).
- When reading in the config, use service names instead of port numbers in
  the other ports field (#128541).
- Rebuild .pot file for string changes.

* Mon Mar 28 2005 Christopher Aillon  1.5.3-3
- rebuilt

* Fri Mar 25 2005 Christopher Aillon  1.5.3-2
- Update the GTK+ theme icon cache on (un)install

telnet-1:0.17-35
----------------
* Thu Mar 17 2005 Harald Hoyer  - 1:0.17-35
- fixed CAN-2005-468 and CAN-2005-469

valgrind-1:2.4.0-2
------------------
* Wed Mar 30 2005 Colin Walters  2.4.0-2
- resurrect the non-upstreamed part of valgrind_h patch
- remove 2.1.2-4G patch, seems to be upstreamed
- resurrect passing -fno-builtin in memcheck tests

vorbis-tools-1:1.0.1-6
----------------------
* Tue Mar 29 2005 John (J5) Palmieri  1:1.0.1-6
- rebuild for flac 1.1.2

words-3.0-5
-----------
* Tue Mar 29 2005 Karel Zak  3-2
- replace word list with much better Moby Project words list (#61395)
- revise %description; ispell/aspell no longer uses words

* Mon Sep 27 2004 Adrian Havill  2-23
- rebuilt

* Fri Feb 13 2004 Elliot Lee 
- rebuilt



From rahulsundaram at yahoo.co.in  Wed Mar 30 13:11:32 2005
From: rahulsundaram at yahoo.co.in (Rahul Sundaram)
Date: Wed, 30 Mar 2005 05:11:32 -0800 (PST)
Subject: kernel source code
In-Reply-To: 6667
Message-ID: <20050330131132.35094.qmail@web8505.mail.in.yahoo.com>


--- not disclosed  wrote:
> 
> Just so you all know - yes I do need the whole
> source code to compile my 
> drivers - also I do know that  people won't
> need the kernel-sourcecode 
> and that the headers will suffice but this isn't the
> case here.  

if most people dont require kernel-source there is no
point in providing it in addition to srpms. 

Regards
Rahul Sundaram


		
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From kyrre at solution-forge.net  Wed Mar 30 13:22:39 2005
From: kyrre at solution-forge.net (Kyrre Ness Sjobak)
Date: Wed, 30 Mar 2005 15:22:39 +0200
Subject: USB host to host connection ??
In-Reply-To: 
References: 
Message-ID: <1112188959.3429.20.camel@localhost.localdomain>

man, 28.03.2005 kl. 17.22 skrev Bob Gustafson:
> I have a Compaq USB 2.0 Link adapter which has a wart in the middle of the
> cable containing a Prolific Technology Inc. 2501 chip and unknown
> microprocessor and memory, etc.
> 
> It is to connect a Gateway Solo 2150 laptop (new disk with Fedora 3 -
> pretty well updated using CDROMs and updates burned to CDROM) with desktop
> Fedora3smp.
> 
> Most everything else works nicely (tested on the desktop) - watching the
> /var/log/messages, I can plug in a Keyspan USB serial, Macintosh USB
> keyboard, Yahoo mini optical mouse, Flash USB drive - marvelous actions and
> everything cites works as expected. Keyboard takes over as console
> keyboard, Flash drive icon appears on desktop - marvelous.
> 
> However, the host to host only puts one line in the log file:
> 
> Mar 26 12:07:04 hoho2 kernel: usb 1-4: USB disconnect, address 3
> Mar 26 12:07:10 hoho2 kernel: usb 1-4: new high speed USB device using
> ehci_hcd and address 4
> 
> (Actually two lines - one when I pulled it out, the 2nd when I pushed it in).
> 
> The other end of the cable is plugged into the Gateway (to get power..)
> although it does not seem to make it more intelligent at this stage.
> 
> I updated hotplug and udev (to 50) and set DEBUG=true on udev. (on desktop)
> 
> Reading through the man pages and documentation on hotplug and udev, it is
> not so clear as to whether hotplug is even working on my system (no
> hotplugd daemon), or whether it should. Lots of documentation, but then
> words later saying, Oh, if you have a 2.6 system .. something else happens.
> 
> It would be nice to have a doc that tells where an event comes into the
> system at the begining, and then it is passed off to xyz, which then passes
> if off to abc.. Sort of the ankle bone connected to the leg bone, connected
> to the knee bone song.
> 
> The Compaq gadget came with a mini-CD, but it is for Windows only. Maybe
> there is something essential here?
> 
> Hoping for a clue
> 
> Bob Gustafson
> 
> [root at hoho2 ~]# cd /sys/bus/usb
> [root at hoho2 usb]# ls
> devices  drivers
> [root at hoho2 usb]# cd devices
> [root at hoho2 devices]# ls
> 1-0:1.0  1-4  1-4:1.0  2-0:1.0  3-0:1.0  4-0:1.0  usb1  usb2  usb3  usb4
> [root at hoho2 devices]# cd 1-4
> [root at hoho2 1-4]# ls
> 1-4:1.0              bDeviceSubClass     configuration  idVendor      serial
> bcdDevice            bmAttributes        detach_state   manufacturer  speed
> bConfigurationValue  bMaxPower           devnum         maxchild      version
> bDeviceClass         bNumConfigurations  driver         power
> bDeviceProtocol      bNumInterfaces      idProduct      product
> [root at hoho2 1-4]# cat idProduct
> 2501
> [root at hoho2 1-4]# cat manufacturer
> Prolific Technology Inc.
> [root at hoho2 1-4]#
> 
> --
> fedora-list mailing list
> fedora-list at redhat.com
> To unsubscribe: http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list

I know it's not exactly what you are asking for - but using a twisted
ethernet cable and two ethernet cards are probably a *lot* easyer...



From nicolas.mailhot at laposte.net  Wed Mar 30 13:25:03 2005
From: nicolas.mailhot at laposte.net (Nicolas Mailhot)
Date: Wed, 30 Mar 2005 15:25:03 +0200 (CEST)
Subject: kernel source code
In-Reply-To: 
References: <20050330122608.GA10159@orient.maison.moi>
	
Message-ID: <53804.192.54.193.35.1112189103.squirrel@rousalka.dyndns.org>


On Mer 30 mars 2005 14:48, not disclosed a ?crit :
>
> Just so you all know - yes I do need the whole source code to compile my
> drivers - also I do know that  people won't need the
> kernel-sourcecode
> and that the headers will suffice but this isn't the case here. 
> people won't be compiling drivers anyway.

Right. And because yours is the exceptionnal case, there is no reason for
the distribution to bend over to accomodate you.

Building external modules is a dangerous and intrusive operation - you
should not do it if you do not know what you're doing, and that includes
understanding a minimum your distribution inner workings - of which rpm is
a key part.

I find it rather strange that after claiming you have to maintain several
systems running Fedora you display such a strong aversion to rpm. rpm is
the core tech used to ease (multiple) software deployments on rpm-based
distributions. If you can't stand Fedora's way of managing software, why
the heck are you running several FC instances in the first place ?

-- 
Nicolas Mailhot



From abo at kth.se  Wed Mar 30 13:48:22 2005
From: abo at kth.se (Alexander =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Bostr=F6m?=)
Date: Wed, 30 Mar 2005 15:48:22 +0200
Subject: kernel source code
In-Reply-To: 
References: 
Message-ID: <1112190503.9949.19.camel@tudor.e.kth.se>

ons 2005-03-30 klockan 12:48 +0000 skrev not disclosed:

> I am detecting a degree of hostility from the posts I have received,

Yes, because you only state your personal preference, without including
any *new* arguments. We've had the discussion before. If you want to
actually make an impression and convince people that you're worth
listening to you need to concentrate on *new* arguments that people
haven't heard before, and you also need to show that you are aware of
the whole picture.

For example, do you know that the distribution is on a very tight space
budget? If you want a 30M package to be included, you really need to say
what other package should be excluded instead. (An no, saying "add
another CD" isn't useful, because that's another discussion we've had
already.)

This is a good start which you should have included in you first mail:

> Just so you all know - yes I do need the whole source code to compile my 
> drivers

But it would be nice to know what exactly it is that's missing from the
headers package.

If your argument really is "I need to compile my own kernel but I don't
want to learn how to build RPM:s" then you should just say so.

/abo




From seyman at wanadoo.fr  Wed Mar 30 13:24:02 2005
From: seyman at wanadoo.fr (Emmanuel Seyman)
Date: Wed, 30 Mar 2005 15:24:02 +0200
Subject: kernel source code
In-Reply-To: 
References: <20050330122608.GA10159@orient.maison.moi>
	
Message-ID: <20050330132402.GA10404@orient.maison.moi>

On Wed, Mar 30, 2005 at 12:48:50PM +0000, not disclosed wrote:
> 
> - just because I use FC doesn't mean I am endowed with special pyschic 
> powers that mean I (end user) automatically know what (you developer / 
> packager) know and therefore it isn't reasonable to assume that I know 
> where to put the link - it takes time to find this out and this is wasted 
> time.

The Release Notes clearly state where the source tree is going to end up.
This is no excuse.

> I am detecting a degree of hostility from the posts I have received, a kind 
> of "if you don't do it our way get stuffed" attitude which is rather 
> unhelpful and rather charmless.  I am guessing that if this is 

If you prefer helpful posts, then may I suggest:

- using a real name while communicating with us
- searching the archives before bringing this topic up yet another time
- reading the Release Notes
- sprouting stuff like "if you followed this to its conclusion then you would
  stop distributing most binaries." which I can't find to be very productive.

> representative of the powers that be in the FC development community that 
> the chances of the the kernel source code  being put back in the distro are 
> rather slim at this point.  In which case thanks very much for nothing, 
> I'll find another distro.

Debian is the only distribution that packages kernel source as binaries, IIRC.

Emmanuel



From terraformers at gmx.net  Wed Mar 30 14:11:52 2005
From: terraformers at gmx.net (Lars)
Date: Wed, 30 Mar 2005 16:11:52 +0200
Subject: rawhide report: 20050330 changes
References: <200503301306.j2UD6IYd012076@porkchop.devel.redhat.com>
Message-ID: 

> On Wed, 30 Mar 2005 08:06:18 -0500, Build System wrote:

just for the record


file /usr/bin/newgrp from install of shadow-utils-4.0.7-4 
conflicts with file from package util-linux-2.12p-3

file /usr/share/man/man1/newgrp.1.gz from install of
shadow-utils-4.0.7-4 conflicts with file from package util-linux-2.12p-3


cheers
L




From casimiro.barreto at gmail.com  Wed Mar 30 14:15:54 2005
From: casimiro.barreto at gmail.com (Casimiro de Almeida Barreto)
Date: Wed, 30 Mar 2005 11:15:54 -0300
Subject: Problems in update file (yum)
Message-ID: <424AB49A.5040205@gmail.com>

Hello,

The last update files for xorg causes the following error:

[root at 200 packages]# rpm -Uvh --force --repackage --aid --noorder *rpm
A preparar...               ########################################### 
[100%]
Repackaging...
   1:xorg-x11               ########################################### 
[100%]
Upgrading...
   1:xorg-x11               ########################################### 
[100%]
erro: a abertura do pacote falhou no ficheiro /usr/X11R6/lib/X11/xkb: 
cpio: stat falhou - Muitos n?veis de links simb?licos
[root at 200 packages]#



From thacker at math.cornell.edu  Wed Mar 30 14:32:22 2005
From: thacker at math.cornell.edu (John Thacker)
Date: Wed, 30 Mar 2005 09:32:22 -0500
Subject: rawhide report: 20050330 changes
In-Reply-To: <200503301306.j2UD6IYd012076@porkchop.devel.redhat.com>
References: <200503301306.j2UD6IYd012076@porkchop.devel.redhat.com>
Message-ID: <20050330143222.GA19915@thacker.dyndns.org>

On Wed, Mar 30, 2005 at 08:06:18AM -0500, Build System wrote:
> gstreamer-plugins-0.8.8-3
> -------------------------
> * Tue Mar 29 2005 John (J5) Palmieri  - 0.8.8-3
> - Added Requires: GConf-devel to the devel package

Shouldn't this be "Requires: GConf2-devel" instead?  Or am I wrong?
Is there anything that actually requires gtk1 in gstreamer-plugins-devel?

John Thacker
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From rahulsundaram at gmail.com  Wed Mar 30 14:32:30 2005
From: rahulsundaram at gmail.com (Rahul Sundaram)
Date: Wed, 30 Mar 2005 20:02:30 +0530
Subject: Named resulting in OOM condition
In-Reply-To: <1112094293.2643.9.camel@linux.local>
References: <1112094293.2643.9.camel@linux.local>
Message-ID: 

On Tue, 29 Mar 2005 13:04:53 +0200, Hans Kristian Rosbach
 wrote:
> We are running a simple caching named process on a separate
> computer here. Every two weeks it needs to be rebooted due
> to running out of memory. It can survive for a while further
> on swap, but that slows things down terribly.
> 
> After restarting named the memory is still in use according
> to 'free':
>              total       used       free     shared    buffers
> cached
> Mem:        775664     760064      15600          0        736
> 11884
> -/+ buffers/cache:     747444      28220
> Swap:      1566296       9108    1557188
> 
> But according to ps all processes use a 0.0-0.6% ram. (ps -Ae vx)
> 
> from slabinfo I got the following interesting lines:
> biovec-(256)         256    256   3072    2    2 : tunables   24   12
> 0 : slabdata    128    128      0
> biovec-128           256    260   1536    5    2 : tunables   24   12
> 0 : slabdata     52     52      0
> biovec-64            256    260    768    5    1 : tunables   54   27
> 0 : slabdata     52     52      0
> biovec-16            256    260    192   20    1 : tunables  120   60
> 0 : slabdata     13     13      0
> biovec-4             256    305     64   61    1 : tunables  120   60
> 0 : slabdata      5      5      0
> biovec-1          6341638 6342238     16  226    1 : tunables  120
> 60    0 : slabdata  28063  28063      0
> bio               6341638 6341798     96   41    1 : tunables  120
> 60    0 : slabdata 154678 154678      0
> 
> Seems like bio is taking up nearly all the memory, what can cause this?
> Any way to force it to go away? =)
> 
> This problem has been there for a long time, we have this problem on
> all our nameservers but always thought it was a bug due to us reloading
> a huge config every half hour. 2GB ram makes those boxes run for a few
> months before they need a reboot.
> 
> But this caching nameserver should not be such a special case, and since
> it caches all our RBL queries it seems to run out of memory much faster.
> 
> This problem has followed us atleast since FC2-test2, and now FC3.
> I just upgraded to bind-9.2.5-1, but I seriously doubt that it will have
> any significant effect.
> 
> Ideas?
> 

file a bug report in bugzilla.redhat.com


-- 
Regards,
Rahul Sundaram



From iago.rubio at hispalinux.es  Wed Mar 30 15:03:25 2005
From: iago.rubio at hispalinux.es (Iago Rubio)
Date: Wed, 30 Mar 2005 17:03:25 +0200
Subject: Problems in update file (rpm)
In-Reply-To: <424AB49A.5040205@gmail.com>
References: <424AB49A.5040205@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <1112195005.12893.9.camel@speedy.iagorubio.net>

I'm with seth about we should stop naming yum on each update error
report.

I don't see any yum invocation here.

On Wed, 2005-03-30 at 11:15 -0300, Casimiro de Almeida Barreto wrote:
> Hello,
> 
> The last update files for xorg causes the following error:
> 
> [root at 200 packages]# rpm -Uvh --force --repackage --aid --noorder *rpm
> A preparar...               ########################################### 
> [100%]
> Repackaging...
>    1:xorg-x11               ########################################### 
> [100%]
> Upgrading...
>    1:xorg-x11               ########################################### 
> [100%]
> erro: a abertura do pacote falhou no ficheiro /usr/X11R6/lib/X11/xkb: 
> cpio: stat falhou - Muitos n?veis de links simb?licos

error: package opening failed at file /usr/X11R6/lib/X11/xkb:
cpio: stat failed - Too much symbolic link levels.

Portuguese error reports are non really helpful when most on this list
are English speakers :)
-- 
Iago Rubio



From fedora at wir-sind-cool.org  Wed Mar 30 15:15:38 2005
From: fedora at wir-sind-cool.org (Michael Schwendt)
Date: Wed, 30 Mar 2005 17:15:38 +0200
Subject: rawhide report: 20050330 changes
In-Reply-To: <20050330143222.GA19915@thacker.dyndns.org>
References: <200503301306.j2UD6IYd012076@porkchop.devel.redhat.com>
	<20050330143222.GA19915@thacker.dyndns.org>
Message-ID: <20050330171538.3c4460bb.fedora@wir-sind-cool.org>

On Wed, 30 Mar 2005 09:32:22 -0500, John Thacker wrote:

> On Wed, Mar 30, 2005 at 08:06:18AM -0500, Build System wrote:
> > gstreamer-plugins-0.8.8-3
> > -------------------------
> > * Tue Mar 29 2005 John (J5) Palmieri  - 0.8.8-3
> > - Added Requires: GConf-devel to the devel package
> 
> Shouldn't this be "Requires: GConf2-devel" instead? 

Yes, and that's what the original bug report said. ;)



From symbiont at berlios.de  Wed Mar 30 15:43:33 2005
From: symbiont at berlios.de (Jeff Pitman)
Date: Wed, 30 Mar 2005 23:43:33 +0800
Subject: Oracle 9i and FC3/RHEL 4 howto
In-Reply-To: <39505.193.195.148.66.1112180223.squirrel@webmail.suretecsystems.com>
References: <424A439A.3000801@hclcomnet.co.in>
	<39505.193.195.148.66.1112180223.squirrel@webmail.suretecsystems.com>
Message-ID: <200503302343.33246.symbiont@berlios.de>

On Wednesday 30 March 2005 18:57, Gavin Henry wrote:
> 10g?

10g is easy!  

Jaw-dropper is getting 9i working.  Bravo!

-- 
-jeff



From dwmw2 at infradead.org  Wed Mar 30 16:14:41 2005
From: dwmw2 at infradead.org (David Woodhouse)
Date: Wed, 30 Mar 2005 17:14:41 +0100
Subject: kernel source code
In-Reply-To: 
References: 
Message-ID: <1112199282.24487.297.camel@hades.cambridge.redhat.com>

On Wed, 2005-03-30 at 12:48 +0000, not disclosed wrote:
> Just so you all know - yes I do need the whole source code to compile
> my drivers 

Explain in more detail. Most people who claim this are wrong.

-- 
dwmw2



From Nicolas.Mailhot at laPoste.net  Wed Mar 30 16:58:08 2005
From: Nicolas.Mailhot at laPoste.net (Nicolas Mailhot)
Date: Wed, 30 Mar 2005 18:58:08 +0200
Subject: Oracle 9i and FC3/RHEL 4 howto
In-Reply-To: <200503302343.33246.symbiont@berlios.de>
References: <424A439A.3000801@hclcomnet.co.in>
	<39505.193.195.148.66.1112180223.squirrel@webmail.suretecsystems.com>
	<200503302343.33246.symbiont@berlios.de>
Message-ID: <1112201892.28553.5.camel@rousalka.dyndns.org>

Le mercredi 30 mars 2005 ? 23:43 +0800, Jeff Pitman a ?crit :
> On Wednesday 30 March 2005 18:57, Gavin Henry wrote:
> > 10g?
> 
> 10g is easy!  
> 
> Jaw-dropper is getting 9i working.  Bravo!

Oracle is slowly turning into an installable linux product. 8i was
mind-wreaking, 9i is annoying, 10g almost there.

Having the java utilities work more often than they crash helps a bit of
course.

-- 
Nicolas Mailhot
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From riel at redhat.com  Wed Mar 30 17:58:56 2005
From: riel at redhat.com (Rik van Riel)
Date: Wed, 30 Mar 2005 12:58:56 -0500 (EST)
Subject: kernel source code
In-Reply-To: 
References: 
Message-ID: 

On Wed, 30 Mar 2005, not disclosed wrote:

> Just so you all know - yes I do need the whole source code to compile my
> drivers - also I do know that  people won't need the kernel-sourcecode
> and that the headers will suffice but this isn't the case here.

It would help if you explained exactly which files you need
that are missing from the kernel-devel RPM.  If there aren't
too many of them, those could probably be added to the
kernel-devel package, solving your problem.

-- 
"Debugging is twice as hard as writing the code in the first place.
Therefore, if you write the code as cleverly as possible, you are,
by definition, not smart enough to debug it." - Brian W. Kernighan



From kwade at redhat.com  Wed Mar 30 19:04:58 2005
From: kwade at redhat.com (Karsten Wade)
Date: Wed, 30 Mar 2005 11:04:58 -0800
Subject: kernel source code
In-Reply-To: 
References: 
Message-ID: <1112209498.9412.162.camel@erato.phig.org>

On Wed, 2005-03-30 at 12:48 +0000, not disclosed wrote:
> Just so you all know - yes I do need the whole source code to compile my 
> drivers - also I do know that  people won't need the kernel-sourcecode 
> and that the headers will suffice but this isn't the case here.  
> people won't be compiling drivers anyway.  As for the convenience (it isn't 
> hard to put a link in.... etc) no it isn't but it is a time wasting pain in 
> the arse to find out where rpm puts all this rubbish - just because I use FC 
> doesn't mean I am endowed with special pyschic powers that mean I (end user) 
> automatically know what (you developer / packager) know and therefore it 
> isn't reasonable to assume that I know where to put the link - it takes time 
> to find this out and this is wasted time.

Please file a bug against the release notes if they fail to make it
clear where files are located.  It would be helpful if you can show the
incorrect information and what you think it should say.

- Karsten
-- 
Karsten Wade, RHCE * Sr. Tech Writer * http://people.redhat.com/kwade/
gpg fingerprint:  2680 DBFD D968 3141 0115    5F1B D992 0E06 AD0E 0C41   
                       Red Hat SELinux Guide
http://www.redhat.com/docs/manuals/enterprise/RHEL-4-Manual/selinux-guide/
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From dawid_gajownik at o2.pl  Wed Mar 30 20:04:16 2005
From: dawid_gajownik at o2.pl (Dawid Gajownik)
Date: Wed, 30 Mar 2005 22:04:16 +0200
Subject: kernel source code
In-Reply-To: 
References: 
	
Message-ID: <424B0640.7070406@o2.pl>

Dnia 03/30/2005 07:58 PM, U?ytkownik Rik van Riel napisa?:

> It would help if you explained exactly which files you need
> that are missing from the kernel-devel RPM.

I'm not the author of this thread, but I have problem with
lirc-0.7.1pre3 (actually, not only me ->
http://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/message.php?msg_id=10414981 )

I run:

./configure --with-driver=kworld \
--with-kerneldir=/lib/modules/`uname -r`/build/

After 'make' I got this error:

/home/y4kk0/usr/src/lirc-0.7.1pre3/drivers/lirc_gpio/lirc_gpio.c:52:41:
../drivers/media/video/bttv.h: No such file or directory
/home/y4kk0/usr/src/lirc-0.7.1pre3/drivers/lirc_gpio/lirc_gpio.c:53:42:
../drivers/media/video/bttvp.h: No such file or directory

and compilation fails :/ Should kernel-devel package contain those
header files or the problem is somewhere else?

If it makes any differance, I use kernel-2.6.11-1.7_FC3 on my FC3 :)

-- 

  ^_*

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From n0td1scl0s3d at hotmail.com  Wed Mar 30 22:38:42 2005
From: n0td1scl0s3d at hotmail.com (not disclosed)
Date: Wed, 30 Mar 2005 22:38:42 +0000
Subject: kernel source code
In-Reply-To: <53804.192.54.193.35.1112189103.squirrel@rousalka.dyndns.org>
Message-ID: 


We use RPM for convenience - also FC for convenience - we could and probably 
will use another distro if the kernel source code remains unpackaged.  I use 
debian for my computer servers, we will probably switch to debian or another 
apt-get distro.  Personally I like yum and rarely touch rpm directly - it is 
not obvious or easily documented to find out where RPM puts stuff or what it 
does. I don't have space for learing another load of complicated switches 
and options to find out.  since it is about convenience I will switch to 
something more conveneint.



>From: "Nicolas Mailhot" 
>Reply-To: Development discussions related to Fedora Core 
>
>To: "Development discussions related to Fedora Core" 
>
>CC: fedora-devel-list at redhat.com
>Subject: Re: kernel source code
>Date: Wed, 30 Mar 2005 15:25:03 +0200 (CEST)
>
>
>On Mer 30 mars 2005 14:48, not disclosed a ?crit :
> >
> > Just so you all know - yes I do need the whole source code to compile my
> > drivers - also I do know that  people won't need the
> > kernel-sourcecode
> > and that the headers will suffice but this isn't the case here. 
> > people won't be compiling drivers anyway.
>
>Right. And because yours is the exceptionnal case, there is no reason for
>the distribution to bend over to accomodate you.
>
>Building external modules is a dangerous and intrusive operation - you
>should not do it if you do not know what you're doing, and that includes
>understanding a minimum your distribution inner workings - of which rpm is
>a key part.
>
>I find it rather strange that after claiming you have to maintain several
>systems running Fedora you display such a strong aversion to rpm. rpm is
>the core tech used to ease (multiple) software deployments on rpm-based
>distributions. If you can't stand Fedora's way of managing software, why
>the heck are you running several FC instances in the first place ?
>
>--
>Nicolas Mailhot
>
>--
>fedora-devel-list mailing list
>fedora-devel-list at redhat.com
>http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-list

_________________________________________________________________
Express yourself instantly with MSN Messenger! Download today it's FREE! 
http://messenger.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200471ave/direct/01/



From n0td1scl0s3d at hotmail.com  Wed Mar 30 22:39:51 2005
From: n0td1scl0s3d at hotmail.com (not disclosed)
Date: Wed, 30 Mar 2005 22:39:51 +0000
Subject: kernel source code
In-Reply-To: <1112190503.9949.19.camel@tudor.e.kth.se>
Message-ID: 


What is missing from the headers -> the kernel source code!

>From: Alexander Bostr?m 
>Reply-To: Development discussions related to Fedora Core 
>
>To: Development discussions related to Fedora Core 
>
>Subject: Re: kernel source code
>Date: Wed, 30 Mar 2005 15:48:22 +0200
>
>ons 2005-03-30 klockan 12:48 +0000 skrev not disclosed:
>
> > I am detecting a degree of hostility from the posts I have received,
>
>Yes, because you only state your personal preference, without including
>any *new* arguments. We've had the discussion before. If you want to
>actually make an impression and convince people that you're worth
>listening to you need to concentrate on *new* arguments that people
>haven't heard before, and you also need to show that you are aware of
>the whole picture.
>
>For example, do you know that the distribution is on a very tight space
>budget? If you want a 30M package to be included, you really need to say
>what other package should be excluded instead. (An no, saying "add
>another CD" isn't useful, because that's another discussion we've had
>already.)
>
>This is a good start which you should have included in you first mail:
>
> > Just so you all know - yes I do need the whole source code to compile my
> > drivers
>
>But it would be nice to know what exactly it is that's missing from the
>headers package.
>
>If your argument really is "I need to compile my own kernel but I don't
>want to learn how to build RPM:s" then you should just say so.
>
>/abo
>
>
>--
>fedora-devel-list mailing list
>fedora-devel-list at redhat.com
>http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-list

_________________________________________________________________
Express yourself instantly with MSN Messenger! Download today it's FREE! 
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From n0td1scl0s3d at hotmail.com  Wed Mar 30 22:44:50 2005
From: n0td1scl0s3d at hotmail.com (not disclosed)
Date: Wed, 30 Mar 2005 22:44:50 +0000
Subject: kernel source code
In-Reply-To: <1112199282.24487.297.camel@hades.cambridge.redhat.com>
Message-ID: 


Examples: comedi doesn't compile without the source, we need to rip stuff 
from the drivers as example code in volatile kernel source (last example 
MTRR register contol / SMP safety under "hyper threading IA32" /  INT size 
x86_64 are the last issue I can remember) and need to make kernel mods (HID 
driver / labjack).




>From: David Woodhouse 
>Reply-To: Development discussions related to Fedora Core 
>
>To: Development discussions related to Fedora Core 
>
>Subject: Re: kernel source code
>Date: Wed, 30 Mar 2005 17:14:41 +0100
>
>On Wed, 2005-03-30 at 12:48 +0000, not disclosed wrote:
> > Just so you all know - yes I do need the whole source code to compile
> > my drivers
>
>Explain in more detail. Most people who claim this are wrong.
>
>--
>dwmw2
>
>--
>fedora-devel-list mailing list
>fedora-devel-list at redhat.com
>http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-list

_________________________________________________________________
FREE pop-up blocking with the new MSN Toolbar - get it now! 
http://toolbar.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200415ave/direct/01/



From cra at WPI.EDU  Wed Mar 30 22:47:40 2005
From: cra at WPI.EDU (Chuck R. Anderson)
Date: Wed, 30 Mar 2005 17:47:40 -0500
Subject: kernel source code
In-Reply-To: 
References: <1112190503.9949.19.camel@tudor.e.kth.se>
	
Message-ID: <20050330224740.GA1584@angus.ind.WPI.EDU>

On Wed, Mar 30, 2005 at 10:39:51PM +0000, not disclosed wrote:
> What is missing from the headers -> the kernel source code!

You don't need glibc source code to compile linux userspace apps, so 
why do you need kernel source code to compile kernel modules?  You 
still haven't told us what you need to compile that requires the full 
kernel source.

Why don't you complain about the lack of a glibc-sourcecode or
gnome-sourcecode or xorg-x11-sourcecode RPM which makes it
"inconvenient" to compile your own versions?



From n0td1scl0s3d at hotmail.com  Wed Mar 30 22:51:00 2005
From: n0td1scl0s3d at hotmail.com (not disclosed)
Date: Wed, 30 Mar 2005 22:51:00 +0000
Subject: kernel source code
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: 


I am signing out of this thread - I have the distinct feeling that the 
source code is not going to be magically restored which seems to be for 
reasons of space rather than anything else.  The source code is very useful 
to us and is normally the first optional package we stick on a bare bones 
system before updating.  The current instructions for the src?rpm leave 
quite a lot to be desired in my opinion.  It looks like the best all-round 
solution is to move to another distro at the next upgrade cycle, probably 
debian which we already use and trust.

Cheers,

SA

_________________________________________________________________
Don't just search. Find. Check out the new MSN Search! 
http://search.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200636ave/direct/01/



From cra at WPI.EDU  Wed Mar 30 23:00:47 2005
From: cra at WPI.EDU (Chuck R. Anderson)
Date: Wed, 30 Mar 2005 18:00:47 -0500
Subject: kernel source code
In-Reply-To: 
References: <1112199282.24487.297.camel@hades.cambridge.redhat.com>
	
Message-ID: <20050330230047.GA1738@angus.ind.WPI.EDU>

On Wed, Mar 30, 2005 at 10:44:50PM +0000, not disclosed wrote:
> Examples: comedi doesn't compile without the source, we need to rip stuff 
> from the drivers as example code in volatile kernel source (last example 
> MTRR register contol / SMP safety under "hyper threading IA32" /  INT size 
> x86_64 are the last issue I can remember) and need to make kernel mods (HID 
> driver / labjack).

Yuck.  Comedi should fix their build system so it works properly
without ugly hacks to the kernel source tree, and then push their code 
into the official kernel.



From rstrode at redhat.com  Wed Mar 30 23:03:29 2005
From: rstrode at redhat.com (Ray Strode)
Date: Wed, 30 Mar 2005 18:03:29 -0500
Subject: FC3: gnome-libs API broken with 1.4.1.2.90-32
In-Reply-To: <200503290902.j2T92kog011722@umpire.fmfts.net>
References: <200503290902.j2T92kog011722@umpire.fmfts.net>
Message-ID: <1112223809.3671.7.camel@localhost.localdomain>

Hi, 
> We've had the same code in our software since 2000:
> 
> 	GnomeFileEntry *fe;
> 	gchar buf[1024];
> 
> --->	sprintf(buf, "%s", gnome_file_entry_get_full_path(fe, TRUE));
> 
...
>        if (strcmp(buf, "(null)") == 0)
>                *buf = '\0';

get_full_path allocates memory for you. sprintf is a bad idea because
there is no bounds checking, you're leaking the memory that
get_full_path allocates, and you're not supposed to pass NULL to sprintf
when it wants a character array.  doing if (strcmp(buf, "(null)") is
bad, too.

instead do:
gchar *buf;
...
buf = gnome_file_entry_get_full_path (fe, TRUE));

Then you can check for NULL;

if (buf == NULL)
   buf = g_strdup ("");

and then call g_free when you're done with it.

> Fortunately, the file entry widget was for
> future use, so I completely removed its use in our code.
That's an even better idea.

--Ray



From sopwith at redhat.com  Wed Mar 30 23:38:02 2005
From: sopwith at redhat.com (Elliot Lee)
Date: Wed, 30 Mar 2005 18:38:02 -0500 (EST)
Subject: Call for FC4t2 release notes!
Message-ID: 

Hey all,

Just a reminder that there's just under a week left to complete release
notes for Fedora Core 4 test2.

The best way to help with the release notes is to join the Fedora Docs
Project. You can find more info at
http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/FedoraDocsProject - your help is definitely
wanted!

Actually submitting a release notes change means going to
http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/FedoraDocs_2fRelNotes_2fCore4Test1RelNotes
and clicking on the 'pre-filled bugzilla request' link. Or you can e-mail
relnotes at fedoraproject.org, and Karsten Wade (the courageous new FDP
leader) will handle your e-mail. Please use bugzilla if at all possible.

What information needs submitting for release notes?
	. Current information on hardware requirements
	. Information on changes that have occurred since Fedora Core 3
		. Explanations of the package additions and removals
	. Removals of information that is no longer necessary for FC4
	. General "I think users need to know this information about this 
	release" submissions.

Thanks in advance,
-- Elliot



From pri.rhl3 at iadonisi.to  Thu Mar 31 00:33:31 2005
From: pri.rhl3 at iadonisi.to (Paul Iadonisi)
Date: Wed, 30 Mar 2005 19:33:31 -0500
Subject: kernel source code
In-Reply-To: 
References: 
Message-ID: <1112229211.19646.14.camel@md.local.linuxlobbyist.org>

On Wed, 2005-03-30 at 22:51 +0000, not disclosed wrote:
> I am signing out of this thread - I have the distinct feeling that the 

  Yet another hit-and-run, flame-throwing posters.  For starters, go
read http://www.catb.org/~esr/faqs/smart-questions.html.  Then, examine
your own attitude in the tone of your posts.
  From what I can tell, the respondents to this thread have been plenty
accommodating, especially given the NUMEROUS times this has been
discussed.
  The basic answer is that if you *do* need the kernel source to build
kernel modules, then the build process for that module is broken.  There
has certainly been disagreement on this list about the best way to
provide a build environment for kernel modules, but I believe the latest
incarnation of that (kernel-devel to match each kernel) meets the needs
that many have discussed on this list in the past.
  As you've noticed, you're not going to find much support for restoring
the old, broken way of doing things.  Such is life.  Fedora Core isn't
for everyone.  If another distribution meets your needs better, by all
means, use it.


-- 
-Paul Iadonisi
 Senior System Administrator
 Red Hat Certified Engineer / Local Linux Lobbyist
 Ever see a penguin fly?  --  Try Linux.
 GPL all the way: Sell services, don't lease secrets



From byte at aeon.com.my  Thu Mar 31 00:45:47 2005
From: byte at aeon.com.my (Colin Charles)
Date: Thu, 31 Mar 2005 10:45:47 +1000
Subject: Stateless linux
In-Reply-To: <80d7e40905032406546c7a2794@mail.gmail.com>
References: <20050323121543.82712.qmail@web8501.mail.in.yahoo.com>
	<424166AA.3090304@hclcomnet.co.in>
	<80d7e40905032406546c7a2794@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <1112229947.8582.271.camel@arena.soho.bytebot.net>

On Thu, 2005-03-24 at 07:54 -0700, Stephen J. Smoogen wrote:
> Actually, I was waiting for some sort of larger announcement and mailing list
> myself. I had put a very little time into it.. but couldnt see who
> else was wanting it or doing anything on it. Having a mailing list
> would be useful.

It was however decided till the traffic on f-d-l got too high, there
would be no stateless linux list. So, why not just use f-d-l in the
meantime?

Quoting Rahul:
> > i  would request  Redhat (if possible) to   start a new mailing  list
> > dedicated to stateless  linux where a group dedicated developers can
> > work  as I think this project has huge potential  :-)

This is an excellent place for the *external* community to step up and
start hacking. Remember, Fedora is a Red Hat sponsored, community
project
-- 
Colin Charles, byte at aeon.com.my
http://www.bytebot.net/
"First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, 
then you win." -- Mohandas Gandhi



From jgotts at linuxsavvy.com  Thu Mar 31 00:42:15 2005
From: jgotts at linuxsavvy.com (John Gotts)
Date: Wed, 30 Mar 2005 19:42:15 -0500
Subject: FC3: gnome-libs API broken with 1.4.1.2.90-32 
In-Reply-To: Your message of "Wed, 30 Mar 2005 18:03:29 EST."
	<1112223809.3671.7.camel@localhost.localdomain> 
Message-ID: <200503310042.j2V0gGFx024975@umpire.fmfts.net>

In message <1112223809.3671.7.camel at localhost.localdomain>, Ray Strode writes:

>> We've had the same code in our software since 2000:

>> 	GnomeFileEntry *fe;
>> 	gchar buf[1024];

>> --->	sprintf(buf, "%s", gnome_file_entry_get_full_path(fe, TRUE));

>...
>>        if (strcmp(buf, "(null)") == 0)
>>                *buf = '\0';

>get_full_path allocates memory for you. sprintf is a bad idea because
>there is no bounds checking, you're leaking the memory that
>get_full_path allocates, and you're not supposed to pass NULL to sprintf
>when it wants a character array.  doing if (strcmp(buf, "(null)") is
>bad, too.

>instead do:
>gchar *buf;
>...
>buf = gnome_file_entry_get_full_path (fe, TRUE));

>Then you can check for NULL;

>if (buf == NULL)
>   buf = g_strdup ("");

>and then call g_free when you're done with it.

>> Fortunately, the file entry widget was for
>> future use, so I completely removed its use in our code.
>That's an even better idea.

It's an incredibly wasteful exercise to criticize three lines of code that was
intended to demonstrate that a stable (5+ year old) library was broken.

I provided a test case that was part of a far larger project, approximately
200,000 lines of code and 3.5 MB of Glade files.  Every project that large has
flaws, but even if that microscopic and unused part of our project was written
to the high standards of the used parts of the project, the gnome-libs library
would still have crashed.

I'm sure you are a wonderful programmer, but your programming lessons are
misdirected.

John

-- 
John GOTTS   http://linuxsavvy.com/staff/jgotts



From shiva at sewingwitch.com  Thu Mar 31 01:03:00 2005
From: shiva at sewingwitch.com (Kenneth Porter)
Date: Wed, 30 Mar 2005 17:03:00 -0800
Subject: netfilter modules (was: kernel source code)
In-Reply-To: <424A7FFB.60804@redhat.com>
References: 
	<424A7FFB.60804@redhat.com>
Message-ID: <2DC8C845122867BDEF35B0C0@[10.0.0.14]>

--On Wednesday, March 30, 2005 12:31 AM -1000 Warren Togami 
 wrote:

> Did you miss the part about NOT NEEDING kernel source in order to build
> modules against that kernel?  FC2 and FC3 kernel provides headers that
> are sufficient 99% of the time, while FC4 split that out into
> kernel-devel which serves a similar purpose.

BTW, has anyone attempted to build netfilter modules using the kernel build 
system? It would be nice to be able to try out some of the experimental 
stuff without having to build a full custom kernel. (I'd particularly like 
to use the U32 match module to detect/block some malicious UDP packets.) 
IIRC, most of the modules include a matching userspace shared object that's 
used by the iptables binary so of course that would also be needed, but in 
principle one could package the two together.




From johnp at redhat.com  Thu Mar 31 01:33:07 2005
From: johnp at redhat.com (John (J5) Palmieri)
Date: Wed, 30 Mar 2005 20:33:07 -0500
Subject: FC3: gnome-libs API broken with 1.4.1.2.90-32
In-Reply-To: <200503310042.j2V0gGFx024975@umpire.fmfts.net>
References: <200503310042.j2V0gGFx024975@umpire.fmfts.net>
Message-ID: <1112232787.6984.14.camel@localhost.localdomain>

On Wed, 2005-03-30 at 19:42, John Gotts wrote:
> In message <1112223809.3671.7.camel at localhost.localdomain>, Ray Strode writes:
> 
> >> We've had the same code in our software since 2000:
> 
> >> 	GnomeFileEntry *fe;
> >> 	gchar buf[1024];
> 
> >> --->	sprintf(buf, "%s", gnome_file_entry_get_full_path(fe, TRUE));
> 
> >...
> >>        if (strcmp(buf, "(null)") == 0)
> >>                *buf = '\0';
> 
> >get_full_path allocates memory for you. sprintf is a bad idea because
> >there is no bounds checking, you're leaking the memory that
> >get_full_path allocates, and you're not supposed to pass NULL to sprintf
> >when it wants a character array.  doing if (strcmp(buf, "(null)") is
> >bad, too.
> 
> >instead do:
> >gchar *buf;
> >...
> >buf = gnome_file_entry_get_full_path (fe, TRUE));
> 
> >Then you can check for NULL;
> 
> >if (buf == NULL)
> >   buf = g_strdup ("");
> 
> >and then call g_free when you're done with it.
> 
> >> Fortunately, the file entry widget was for
> >> future use, so I completely removed its use in our code.
> >That's an even better idea.
> 
> It's an incredibly wasteful exercise to criticize three lines of code that was
> intended to demonstrate that a stable (5+ year old) library was broken.

I don't think Ray was criticizing the three lines of code but just
pointing out the misuse of the API.  API's are written with certain
assumptions.  If you deviate from those assumptions the code may break
at some later date no matter how long it had been working in the past
(i.e. the code may have been working because of a bug in the API that
was later fixed).

BTW your stack trace is no good.  There is no context where the strcpy
is happening.  Are you sure it isn't crashing in the sprintf?  Try
separating the code and perhaps it will make it easier to debug or at
least break and try to step into that code.

--
J5



From caillon at redhat.com  Thu Mar 31 03:25:18 2005
From: caillon at redhat.com (Christopher Aillon)
Date: Wed, 30 Mar 2005 22:25:18 -0500
Subject: rawhide report: 20050330 changes
In-Reply-To: <200503301306.j2UD6IYd012076@porkchop.devel.redhat.com>
References: <200503301306.j2UD6IYd012076@porkchop.devel.redhat.com>
Message-ID: <424B6D9E.6000900@redhat.com>

Build System wrote:
> gimp-2:2.2.4-10
> ---------------
> * Tue Mar 29 2005 Nils Philippsen 
> - revert gtk requirement change

Out of curiosity, why was this done?  gtk-update-icon-cache does not exist in gtk2-2.4.14 and thus the %post and %postun scripts now fail when on a system with that version of gtk2.



From wbeebe at gmail.com  Thu Mar 31 04:26:52 2005
From: wbeebe at gmail.com (William Beebe)
Date: Wed, 30 Mar 2005 23:26:52 -0500
Subject: kernel source code
In-Reply-To: <1112229211.19646.14.camel@md.local.linuxlobbyist.org>
References: 
	<1112229211.19646.14.camel@md.local.linuxlobbyist.org>
Message-ID: 

I like Fedora for many reasons, not the least of which is I can pull a
stock kernel off kernel.org, build it, and boot it, with FC3. With
nothing more than the normal download-unpack-and-make dance I can run
with the bleeding edge (or the latest fixes, depending on your point
of view).

Having said that I support the current change to how sources are
supplied as long as this state of affairs continues. I look at my
experiences with my other distro here at home, SuSE 9.1. With SuSE I
have had the devil's own time learning how to build a stock kernel
that will boot with SuSE. For the longest it would stop after
unpacking the kernel and right before booting the root device, saying
it couldn't find the bloody thing. So if for some reason FC starts to
behave like SuSE with regards to stock kernels, well, I don't what
I'll do. Cry into my beer, I guess. And go buy a Mac.

As a satisfied customer all I ask is please fix what you break before
I find out about it :)

Thanks for everything.

On Wed, 30 Mar 2005 19:33:31 -0500, Paul Iadonisi  wrote:
> On Wed, 2005-03-30 at 22:51 +0000, not disclosed wrote:
> > I am signing out of this thread - I have the distinct feeling that the
> 
>   Yet another hit-and-run, flame-throwing posters.  For starters, go
> read http://www.catb.org/~esr/faqs/smart-questions.html.  Then, examine
> your own attitude in the tone of your posts.
>   From what I can tell, the respondents to this thread have been plenty
> accommodating, especially given the NUMEROUS times this has been
> discussed.
>   The basic answer is that if you *do* need the kernel source to build
> kernel modules, then the build process for that module is broken.  There
> has certainly been disagreement on this list about the best way to
> provide a build environment for kernel modules, but I believe the latest
> incarnation of that (kernel-devel to match each kernel) meets the needs
> that many have discussed on this list in the past.
>   As you've noticed, you're not going to find much support for restoring
> the old, broken way of doing things.  Such is life.  Fedora Core isn't
> for everyone.  If another distribution meets your needs better, by all
> means, use it.
> 
> --
> -Paul Iadonisi
>  Senior System Administrator
>  Red Hat Certified Engineer / Local Linux Lobbyist
>  Ever see a penguin fly?  --  Try Linux.
>  GPL all the way: Sell services, don't lease secrets
> 
> --
> fedora-devel-list mailing list
> fedora-devel-list at redhat.com
> http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-list
>



From rahulsundaram at yahoo.co.in  Thu Mar 31 04:34:26 2005
From: rahulsundaram at yahoo.co.in (Rahul Sundaram)
Date: Wed, 30 Mar 2005 20:34:26 -0800 (PST)
Subject: Stateless linux
In-Reply-To: 6667
Message-ID: <20050331043426.79575.qmail@web8505.mail.in.yahoo.com>

Hi

> 
> Quoting Rahul:
> > > i  would request  Redhat (if possible) to  
> start a new mailing  list
> > > dedicated to stateless  linux where a group
> dedicated developers can
> > > work  as I think this project has huge potential
>  :-)

your MUA is misleading. I never said this

Regards
Rahul Sundaram


		
__________________________________ 
Do you Yahoo!? 
Make Yahoo! your home page 
http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs



From davej at redhat.com  Thu Mar 31 04:35:49 2005
From: davej at redhat.com (Dave Jones)
Date: Wed, 30 Mar 2005 23:35:49 -0500
Subject: kernel source code
In-Reply-To: 
References: 
	<1112229211.19646.14.camel@md.local.linuxlobbyist.org>
	
Message-ID: <20050331043549.GC23124@redhat.com>

On Wed, Mar 30, 2005 at 11:26:52PM -0500, William Beebe wrote:
 > I like Fedora for many reasons, not the least of which is I can pull a
 > stock kernel off kernel.org, build it, and boot it, with FC3. With
 > nothing more than the normal download-unpack-and-make dance I can run
 > with the bleeding edge (or the latest fixes, depending on your point
 > of view).
 > 
 > Having said that I support the current change to how sources are
 > supplied as long as this state of affairs continues. I look at my
 > experiences with my other distro here at home, SuSE 9.1. With SuSE I
 > have had the devil's own time learning how to build a stock kernel
 > that will boot with SuSE. For the longest it would stop after
 > unpacking the kernel and right before booting the root device, saying
 > it couldn't find the bloody thing. So if for some reason FC starts to
 > behave like SuSE with regards to stock kernels, well, I don't what
 > I'll do. Cry into my beer, I guess. And go buy a Mac.

We've been pretty good in this regard for FC2/FC3, but we're not
perfect by any means. We've had some deviation away from mainline at times.
The one that sticks in my mind most recently is the patch we added to
FC3 to allow SELinux attributes on tmpfs -- A few folks noticed
that things went a bit funny when they tried to run with a stock 2.6.9
[the actual patch turned up in mainline in 2.6.10]
We do try to not merge stuff that's going to cause such grief though.
That one only got in because it was pretty much a required feature
for usable SELinux in FC3, and 2.6.10 was a way off when FC3 was released.
Actually by the time most people had installed FC3, ISTR it was actually
merged in 2.6.10rc too, so it was only a problem for folks not wanting
to apply prepatches, or -ac/-mm patches.

When we're not hacking Fedora kernels, some of us work on upstream
too, so it's in our best interests to make sure we can continue to
do so :-)

 > As a satisfied customer all I ask is please fix what you break before
 > I find out about it :)

It seems we did :-)

		Dave



From rahulsundaram at yahoo.co.in  Thu Mar 31 04:36:22 2005
From: rahulsundaram at yahoo.co.in (Rahul Sundaram)
Date: Wed, 30 Mar 2005 20:36:22 -0800 (PST)
Subject: Call for FC4t2 release notes!
In-Reply-To: 6667
Message-ID: <20050331043622.32422.qmail@web8509.mail.in.yahoo.com>


--- Elliot Lee  wrote:
> Hey all,
> 
> Just a reminder that there's just under a week left
> to complete release
> notes for Fedora Core 4 test2.
> 
> The best way to help with the release notes is to
> join the Fedora Docs
> Project. You can find more info at
> http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/FedoraDocsProject -
> your help is definitely
> wanted!
> 
> Actually submitting a release notes change means
> going to
>
http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/FedoraDocs_2fRelNotes_2fCore4Test1RelNotes
> and clicking on the 'pre-filled bugzilla request'
> link. Or you can e-mail
> relnotes at fedoraproject.org, and Karsten Wade (the
> courageous new FDP
> leader) will handle your e-mail. Please use bugzilla
> if at all possible.
> 
> What information needs submitting for release notes?
> 	. Current information on hardware requirements
> 	. Information on changes that have occurred since
> Fedora Core 3
> 		. Explanations of the package additions and
> removals
> 	. Removals of information that is no longer
> necessary for FC4
> 	. General "I think users need to know this
> information about this 
> 	release" submissions.
> 
> Thanks in advance,
> -- Elliot
> 

It would be good to CC to the docs list too for
discussions related to it 

Regards
Rahul Sundaram


		
__________________________________ 
Do you Yahoo!? 
Yahoo! Small Business - Try our new resources site!
http://smallbusiness.yahoo.com/resources/ 



From NOS at Utel.no  Thu Mar 31 07:43:05 2005
From: NOS at Utel.no (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?=22Nils_O=2E_Sel=E5sdal=22?=)
Date: Thu, 31 Mar 2005 09:43:05 +0200
Subject: Only link needed libraries.
Message-ID: <424BAA09.10508@Utel.no>

Hi folks,
Just read a recent OSNews article;
http://www.osnews.com/story.php?news_id=10152
Basically, Gnome - and others, link in way too many libraries.
This can be dealt with by using e.g. -Wl,--as-needed .

Something Fedora should consider ?
Better "fixed" elsewhere ?

-- 
Nils O. Sel?sdal
www.utelsystems.com



From mpeters at mac.com  Thu Mar 31 08:49:43 2005
From: mpeters at mac.com (Michael A. Peters)
Date: Thu, 31 Mar 2005 08:49:43 +0000
Subject: kernel source code
In-Reply-To:  (from
	n0td1scl0s3d@hotmail.com on Wed Mar 30 04:48:50 2005)
References: 
Message-ID: <1112258983l.6266l.3l@devel.mpeters.local>


On 03/30/2005 04:48:50 AM, not disclosed wrote:

> I am detecting a degree of hostility from the posts I have received,  
> a kind of "if you don't do it our way get stuffed" attitude

Ironic

-- 
Michael A. Peters
http://mpeters.us/





From warren at togami.com  Thu Mar 31 10:49:28 2005
From: warren at togami.com (Warren Togami)
Date: Thu, 31 Mar 2005 00:49:28 -1000
Subject: FC4 perl module upgrades/cleanups
Message-ID: <424BD5B8.5070605@togami.com>

Right now I'm looking at cleaning up and upgrading all perl modules in 
FC4.  The specs of many of the perl modules have ancient crap that 
should be cleaned up and modernized.  Among the stuff I want to do:

https://www.redhat.com/archives/fedora-packaging/2005-March/msg00095.html
https://www.redhat.com/archives/fedora-packaging/2005-March/msg00096.html
https://www.redhat.com/archives/fedora-packaging/2005-March/msg00097.html
* Remove brp-compress calls from all packages, as it isn't doing 
anything useful.  (Right?)

* Update URL and Source0 to actual modern CPAN addresses.

* Clear out most of the trival to minor perl-* FC bugs, which are mainly 
"upgrade this" and "fix the spec".

* Requires: perl(:MODULE_COMPAT_%(eval "`%{__perl} -V:version`"; echo 
$version))
Do we want this in all perl packages, both regular arch and noarch?

* %define _use_internal_dependency_generator 0
Many of the ancient specs have this.  Might be nice to get rid of it, 
but it will require some careful verification comparing the before and 
after in order to be sure the rpm-auto-dep isn't demanding bad 
dependencies like Win32 crap.  Is this worth doing?  Need your opinions.

* Identify all modules that have a newer version available in CPAN. 
Would be nice if we had a script to compare a devel CVS checkout to CPAN 
and output a list with URLs or something.

Contributors like Ville, Robert and Jose have been very helpful in 
submitting good spec rewrites for perl packages in the past.  So I hope 
the community can help with cleaned up spec unidiffs (along with version 
upgrades) to be submitted to Bugzilla, one report per package.  Perhaps 
discuss here who will do which package.  I'll do some myself.

Thoughts?

Warren Togami
wtogami at redhat.com



From gauravp at hclcomnet.co.in  Thu Mar 31 11:10:18 2005
From: gauravp at hclcomnet.co.in (gaurav)
Date: Thu, 31 Mar 2005 16:40:18 +0530
Subject: OO bug
Message-ID: <424BDA9A.7030005@hclcomnet.co.in>

Hi,
 there is critqal error in OO ...in any OO doc right click on spelling 
mistake ...... machine will go into zombie and entire machine will hang 
till end of time or till you restart .....this problem is not there OO 2 
beta
Is there any patch for this ??

Regards,
gaurav



From wtogami at redhat.com  Thu Mar 31 11:17:11 2005
From: wtogami at redhat.com (Warren Togami)
Date: Thu, 31 Mar 2005 01:17:11 -1000
Subject: OO bug
In-Reply-To: <424BDA9A.7030005@hclcomnet.co.in>
References: <424BDA9A.7030005@hclcomnet.co.in>
Message-ID: <424BDC37.8010505@redhat.com>

gaurav wrote:
> Hi,
> there is critqal error in OO ...in any OO doc right click on spelling 
> mistake ...... machine will go into zombie and entire machine will hang 
> till end of time or till you restart .....this problem is not there OO 2 
> beta
> Is there any patch for this ??

http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-list
You are off-topic in this mailing list.  fedora-devel-list is not for 
user support questions.  Please refer to any of the links from this page 
  in order to find an appropriate place to ask this question.

This list only for the discussion of distribution development.

Warren Togami
wtogami at redhat.com



From remco at beryllium.net  Thu Mar 31 11:18:15 2005
From: remco at beryllium.net (Remco Poelstra)
Date: Thu, 31 Mar 2005 13:18:15 +0200 (CEST)
Subject: OO bug
In-Reply-To: <424BDA9A.7030005@hclcomnet.co.in>
References: <424BDA9A.7030005@hclcomnet.co.in>
Message-ID: <1256.131.155.20.112.1112267895.squirrel@webmail.beryllium.net>

> Hi,
> there is critqal error in OO ...in any OO doc right click on spelling
> mistake ...... machine will go into zombie and entire machine will hang
> till end of time or till you restart .....this problem is not there OO 2
> beta Is there any patch for this ??

Uninstall any dictionaries you don't need.

Remco Poelstra




From fedora-devel-list.listman at linuxnetz.de  Thu Mar 31 11:35:16 2005
From: fedora-devel-list.listman at linuxnetz.de (Robert Scheck)
Date: Thu, 31 Mar 2005 13:35:16 +0200
Subject: FC4 perl module upgrades/cleanups
In-Reply-To: <424BD5B8.5070605@togami.com>
References: <424BD5B8.5070605@togami.com>
Message-ID: <20050331113516.GA19929@hurricane.linuxnetz.de>

Hi Warren and folks,

On Thu, 31 Mar 2005, Warren Togami wrote:
> * Remove brp-compress calls from all packages, as it isn't doing 
> anything useful.  (Right?)

Right, at my Fedora Core Development system, /usr/lib/rpm/brp-compress vs.
/usr/lib/rpm/redhat/brp-compress only differs in calling gunzip/bunzip2
with or without the parameter "-f". 

> * Requires: perl(:MODULE_COMPAT_%(eval "`%{__perl} -V:version`"; echo 
> $version))
> Do we want this in all perl packages, both regular arch and noarch?

My personal opinion is all perl packages, because it shouldn't hurt or
break anything. Far from it! It can help to make sure, that the perl
dependencies are okay.
 
> * %define _use_internal_dependency_generator 0
> Many of the ancient specs have this.  Might be nice to get rid of it, 
> but it will require some careful verification comparing the before and 
> after in order to be sure the rpm-auto-dep isn't demanding bad 
> dependencies like Win32 crap.  Is this worth doing?  Need your opinions.

I'm not really familiar with _use_internal_dependency_generator in the
reference of perl, but if it isn't needed, we should avoid it.
 
> * Identify all modules that have a newer version available in CPAN. 
> Would be nice if we had a script to compare a devel CVS checkout to CPAN 
> and output a list with URLs or something.
> 
> Contributors like Ville, Robert and Jose have been very helpful in 
> submitting good spec rewrites for perl packages in the past.  So I hope 
> the community can help with cleaned up spec unidiffs (along with version 
> upgrades) to be submitted to Bugzilla, one report per package.  Perhaps 
> discuss here who will do which package.  I'll do some myself.

As of today, many perl packages have duplicate reports named differently.
Maybe we can open something like a tracker bug for the corresponding
perl packages and add the different/similar wishes, duplicates etc to them
for having a better overview what's to do for which package? 

> Thoughts?

* We should run "make test" at every package (if available of course) and
  non-conditional - if it fails, something is wrong.

* Lots of the perl-* spec files have a part, where a ugly file list for the
  %files section is generated. RPM has nice macros, which should replace
  this file lists mostly (see: grep %perl_ /usr/lib/rpm/macros). And we
  should have a look, that the packages also own their perl directories (if
  possible); Ville, Jose and Warren already started in past solving this.

* Most perl packages are named perl-Foo-Bar and the CPAN "realname" is
  Foo-Bar, we shouldn't define a separate variable for this as some
  packages currently do, normally, the CPAN name is only needed at setup -q
  -n Foo-Bar-%{version}. Macrofying is generally okay, but we're not
  generating tons of spec files like DAG or so.

* Valid Group and License values! See /usr/share/doc/rpm-4.4.1/GROUPS and
  COPYING/README/... file of the corresponding package. Groups like
  Applications/CAN, Applications/Perl, Perl/CAN etc are not valid.

* Update the %doc sections, some packages don't have this section, but the
  CPAN packages normally contain some useful files like README, ChangeLog.

Did I forget something?

Robert



From wtogami at redhat.com  Thu Mar 31 11:47:39 2005
From: wtogami at redhat.com (Warren Togami)
Date: Thu, 31 Mar 2005 01:47:39 -1000
Subject: FC4 perl module upgrades/cleanups
In-Reply-To: <20050331113516.GA19929@hurricane.linuxnetz.de>
References: <424BD5B8.5070605@togami.com>
	<20050331113516.GA19929@hurricane.linuxnetz.de>
Message-ID: <424BE35B.9080000@redhat.com>

Robert Scheck wrote:
> 
>>* Identify all modules that have a newer version available in CPAN. 
>>Would be nice if we had a script to compare a devel CVS checkout to CPAN 
>>and output a list with URLs or something.
>>
>>Contributors like Ville, Robert and Jose have been very helpful in 
>>submitting good spec rewrites for perl packages in the past.  So I hope 
>>the community can help with cleaned up spec unidiffs (along with version 
>>upgrades) to be submitted to Bugzilla, one report per package.  Perhaps 
>>discuss here who will do which package.  I'll do some myself.
> 
> 
> As of today, many perl packages have duplicate reports named differently.
> Maybe we can open something like a tracker bug for the corresponding
> perl packages and add the different/similar wishes, duplicates etc to them
> for having a better overview what's to do for which package? 

I don't know if a tracker would be the best idea.  The key goal I think 
we need here is to form a Fedora perl team, who receives notification of 
all perl bugs and makes decisions about perl* package changes.  If a 
tracker would be the best way to do this, then fine.

Another option would be auto-CC in Bugzilla, where I can specify people 
who should automatically be added CC to certain components.  I can put 
Fedora perl team members in here.  I would prefer this.  Thoughts?

> 
> * We should run "make test" at every package (if available of course) and
>   non-conditional - if it fails, something is wrong.

This would be acceptable only if those tests NEVER TOUCH THE NETWORK. 
It is completely unnacceptable for rpmbuild to use the network.

There are other possible dangers in enabling "make test", some of which 
were discusssed on this list in the "Regression testing" thread.  For 
now DO NOT enable this until we discuss this a lot more.

> 
> * Most perl packages are named perl-Foo-Bar and the CPAN "realname" is
>   Foo-Bar, we shouldn't define a separate variable for this as some
>   packages currently do, normally, the CPAN name is only needed at setup -q
>   -n Foo-Bar-%{version}. Macrofying is generally okay, but we're not
>   generating tons of spec files like DAG or so.

I really don't care about this.  My mind leans slightly toward the "keep 
the spec as simple as possible" and wants to avoid unnecessary macros. 
This however would make sense if the macroified name is used many times 
in the spec, but I don't think this is the case here.

> 
> * Valid Group and License values! See /usr/share/doc/rpm-4.4.1/GROUPS and
>   COPYING/README/... file of the corresponding package. Groups like
>   Applications/CAN, Applications/Perl, Perl/CAN etc are not valid.

Thanks for reminding us.  Ugh...

We also need to seriously consider redoing those GROUPS one of these 
days, but this is far beyond the scope of this perl cleanup.

> 
> * Update the %doc sections, some packages don't have this section, but the
>   CPAN packages normally contain some useful files like README, ChangeLog.

If they are tiny, then fine.  Otherwise I'm wary because we really have 
   to avoid further bloating the distribution.  I look forward to the 
day of 2 DVD's for FC installation...

Warren Togami
wtogami at redhat.com



From wtogami at redhat.com  Thu Mar 31 11:56:33 2005
From: wtogami at redhat.com (Warren Togami)
Date: Thu, 31 Mar 2005 01:56:33 -1000
Subject: FC4 perl module upgrades/cleanups
In-Reply-To: <424BD5B8.5070605@togami.com>
References: <424BD5B8.5070605@togami.com>
Message-ID: <424BE571.8050609@redhat.com>

FC4test2 freeze is coming real soon, so most of these perl spec changes 
will not happen until after it unfreezes in order to avoid the risk of 
breaking deps.  I will however try to upgrade CPAN module versions 
before the freeze without changing deps.

Chip Turner just mentioned that he wants to fix up cpanflute2 to just 
auto-re-generate all these specs.  So it may be best to discuss the 
implementation details of this rather than dozens of manual changes to 
packages.  Wait until Chip chimes in on this thread.

Warren Togami
wtogami at redhat.com



From jorton at redhat.com  Thu Mar 31 12:09:12 2005
From: jorton at redhat.com (Joe Orton)
Date: Thu, 31 Mar 2005 13:09:12 +0100
Subject: FC4 perl module upgrades/cleanups
In-Reply-To: <424BD5B8.5070605@togami.com>
References: <424BD5B8.5070605@togami.com>
Message-ID: <20050331120912.GA3604@redhat.com>

On Thu, Mar 31, 2005 at 12:49:28AM -1000, Warren Togami wrote:
> * Remove brp-compress calls from all packages, as it isn't doing 
> anything useful.  (Right?)

I think it was necessary for packages with a generated filelist since it
ensures the man pages get gzipped *before* creating the filelist.  If
they get gzipped after %install the filelist is out of sync with the
install root.

At least perl-Compress-Zlib doesn't build any more, but it's easy to fix
in the sed pipeline.

joe



From dwmw2 at infradead.org  Thu Mar 31 13:02:10 2005
From: dwmw2 at infradead.org (David Woodhouse)
Date: Thu, 31 Mar 2005 14:02:10 +0100
Subject: kernel source code
In-Reply-To: <424B0640.7070406@o2.pl>
References: 
	
	<424B0640.7070406@o2.pl>
Message-ID: <1112274131.24487.320.camel@hades.cambridge.redhat.com>

On Wed, 2005-03-30 at 22:04 +0200, Dawid Gajownik wrote:
> After 'make' I got this error:
> 
> /home/y4kk0/usr/src/lirc-0.7.1pre3/drivers/lirc_gpio/lirc_gpio.c:52:41:
> ../drivers/media/video/bttv.h: No such file or directory
> /home/y4kk0/usr/src/lirc-0.7.1pre3/drivers/lirc_gpio/lirc_gpio.c:53:42:
> ../drivers/media/video/bttvp.h: No such file or directory

If those header files are intended for use by code outside the
drivers/media/video directory of the kernel tree, then they should be in
include/linux/ somewhere instead of where they are.

It _would_ be possible to include those in the kernel-devel package, but
it's probably better to get them moved in the upstream kernel.

-- 
dwmw2



From buildsys at redhat.com  Thu Mar 31 13:37:26 2005
From: buildsys at redhat.com (Build System)
Date: Thu, 31 Mar 2005 08:37:26 -0500
Subject: rawhide report: 20050331 changes
Message-ID: <200503311337.j2VDbQil029683@porkchop.devel.redhat.com>

 

 
Updated Packages:

OpenIPMI-1.4.11-5
-----------------
* Wed Mar 30 2005 Phil Knirsch  1.4.11-5
- Correctly put libs in the proper packages

anaconda-10.2.0.37-1
--------------------
* Wed Mar 30 2005 Jeremy Katz  - 10.2.0.37-1
- try not using maxcpus=1 for arches which still had it
- don't use the reserved variable name str (sopwith)
- various language fixups (clumens)

control-center-1:2.10.0-4
-------------------------
* Wed Mar 30 2005 Warren Togami  2.10.0-4
- fix ldconfig (#152575)

gail-1.8.2-3
------------
* Wed Mar 30 2005 Matthias Clasen  1.8.2-3
- Remove .la files

gcc-4.0.0-0.38
--------------
* Wed Mar 30 2005 Jakub Jelinek   4.0.0-0.38
- update from CVS
  - PRs libfortran/15332, libfortran/19678, libfortran/19679,
	libfortran/20163, middle-end/20263, middle-end/20491,
	rtl-optimization/20249, target/15491, target/20617, tree-opt/19108,
	tree-optimization/19108
- fix edge redirection (Alexandre Oliva, #152149, PR tree-optimization/20640)

gdb-6.3.0.0-1.9
---------------
* Wed Mar 30 2005 Jeff Johnston    6.3.0.0-1.9
- Bump up release number.

* Wed Mar 30 2005 Jeff Johnston 	6.3.0.0-1.7
- Add proper vsyscall page support for ia64.

* Thu Mar 24 2005 Jeff Johnston    6.3.0.0-1.6
- Bump up release number.

gedit-1:2.10.0-2
----------------
* Tue Mar 29 2005 Warren Togami  - 2.10.0-2
- devel req libgnomeprintui22-devel for pkgconfig (#152487)

gnome-bluetooth-0.5.1-12
------------------------
* Thu Mar 31 2005 Harald Hoyer  - 0.5.1-12
- removed base requirement from libs

* Tue Mar 29 2005 Warren Togami  - 0.5.1-11
- devel req glib2-devel libbtctl-devel for pkgconfig (#152488)

gnome-mag-0.12.0-2
------------------
* Wed Mar 30 2005 Matthias Clasen  0.12-2
- Add a missing Requires (#152493)

gnopernicus-0.10.5-1
--------------------
* Wed Mar 30 2005 Matthias Clasen  0.10.5-1
- Update to 0.10.5
- Split off a devel package (#152169)

gok-1.0.3-1
-----------
* Wed Mar 30 2005 Matthias Clasen  1.0.3-1
- Update to 1.0.3
- Add missing Requires (#152489)

gstreamer-plugins-0.8.8-4
-------------------------
* Wed Mar 30 2005 John (J5) Palmieri  - 0.8.8-4
- s/GConf-devel/GConf2-devel

hwdata-0.155-1
--------------
* Wed Mar 30 2005 Dan Williams  0.155-1
- Add a boatload of BenQ, Acer, Sony, NEC, Mitsubishi, and Dell monitors

* Wed Mar 30 2005 Dan Williams  0.154-1
- Add Typhoon Speednet Wireless PCMCIA Card mapping to atmel_cs driver

initscripts-8.06-1
------------------
* Wed Mar 30 2005 Bill Nottingham  8.06-1
- handle alternate VLAN naming schemes (#115001, )
- ifup-ipsec: handle non-ascii keys (#150552)
- add proper ipsec route (#146169, #140654)
- add a restorecon for /tmp to rc.sysinit
- document ONHOTPLUG in sysconfig.txt
- fix mistranslation (#151120)
- don't return 1 for stopping a process if it isn't running at all
- don't explicitly set fwd polices for ipsec traffic. Let setkey
  handle it.

jpilot-0.99.8-0.pre8.1
----------------------
* Wed Mar 30 2005 Than Ngo  0.99.8-0.pre8.1
- 0.99.8-pre8
- cleanup specfile
- disable rpath
- update desktop file

k3b-0:0.11.23-2
---------------
* Wed Mar 30 2005 Harald Hoyer  0:0.11.23-1
- update to 0.11.23

* Fri Mar 25 2005 David Hill  0:0.11.22-1
- update to 0.11.22

kdemultimedia-6:3.4.0-2
-----------------------
* Wed Mar 30 2005 Than Ngo  6:3.4.0-2
- buildrequires libmusicbrainz, libtunepimp if Juk enable

kernel-2.6.11-1.1219_FC4
------------------------
* Wed Mar 30 2005 Rik van Riel 
- fix Xen kernel compilation (pci, page table, put_user, execshield, ...)
- reenable Xen kernel compilation

* Tue Mar 29 2005 Rik van Riel 
- apply Xen patches again (they don't compile yet, though)
- Use uname in kernel-devel directories (#145914)
- add uname-based kernel-devel provisions (#152357)
- make sure /usr/share/doc/kernel-doc-%{kversion} is owned by a
  package, so it will get removed again on uninstall/upgrade (#130667)

* Mon Mar 28 2005 Dave Jones 
- Don't generate debuginfo files if 1 isnt set. (#152268)

libbtctl-0.4.1-6
----------------
* Wed Mar 30 2005 Warren Togami  0.4.1-6
- devel req glib2-devel for pkgconfig (#152497)

libgail-gnome-1.1.0-5
---------------------
* Wed Mar 30 2005 Matthias Clasen  1.1.0-4
- Split off a -devel package.  (#152499)

libuser-0.53.3-2
----------------
* Wed Mar 30 2005 Miloslav Trmac  - 0.53.3-2
- Add Requires: glib2-devel to libuser-devel (#152501)
- Run ldconfig using %post{,un} -p to let RPM play tricks

mkinitrd-4.2.7-1
----------------
* Wed Mar 30 2005 Peter Jones  - 4.2.7-1
- unmount what filesystems we can from the initramfs
- close appropriate files before spawning init

net-snmp-5.2.1-7
----------------
* Thu Mar 31 2005 Radek Vokal  - 5.2.1-7
- agentx double free error fix 

net-tools-1.60-50
-----------------
* Wed Mar 30 2005 Radek Vokal  1.60-50
- added mii-diag tool
- added newer ether-wake
- remove useless -i option from ifconfig
- stop trimming interface names (#152457)

netatalk-3:2.0.2-3
------------------
* Wed Mar 30 2005 Florian La Roche 
- quick fix: rm -f /usr/include/netatalk/at.h until this
  is resolved the correct way

openhpi-2.0.3-2
---------------
* Wed Mar 30 2005 Phil Knirsch  2.0.3-1
- Moved the pkgconfig files to the devel package (#152507)
- Update to openhpi-2.0.3
- Had to manually disable ipmi support for now until openhpi builds correctly
  against it again
- Dropped net-snmp-config patch, not needed anymore

openoffice.org-1:1.9.88-4
-------------------------
* Mon Mar 28 2005 Christopher Aillon 
- rebuilt

* Fri Mar 25 2005 Christopher Aillon  1:1.9.88-2
- Update the GTK+ theme icon cache on (un)install

* Tue Mar 22 2005 Caolan McNamara  1:1.9.88-1
- bump to 1.9.88
- submit openoffice.org-1.9.84.ooo45725.lingucomponent.contribdict.patch upstream
- drop integrated openoffice.org-1.9.87.ooo43538.sfx2.patch
- openoffice.org-1.9.87.oooXXXXX.fragments.patch build problem of some kind
- add a check for non -fpic libs
- allow switching spec to build with gcc3 and gcj4, kudos Fridrich Strba
- jump to hsqldb 1.8.0RC9 in advance of 1.9.89 to fix our hsqldb issues

openssl-0.9.7f-1
----------------
* Wed Mar 30 2005 Tomas Mraz  0.9.7f-1
- reenable optimizations on ppc64 and assembly code on ia64
- upgrade to new upstream version (no soname bump needed)
- disable thread test - it was testing the backport of the
  RSA blinding - no longer needed
- added support for changing serial number to 
  Makefile.certificate (#151188)
- make ca-bundle.crt a config file (#118903)

* Tue Mar 01 2005 Tomas Mraz  0.9.7e-3
- libcrypto shouldn't depend on libkrb5 (#135961)

* Mon Feb 28 2005 Tomas Mraz  0.9.7e-2
- rebuild

php-5.0.3-5
-----------
* Wed Mar 30 2005 Joe Orton  5.0.3-5
- BuildRequire mysql-devel >= 4.1
- don't mark php.ini as noreplace to make upgrades work (#152171)
- fix subpackage descriptions (#152628)
- fix memset(,,0) in Zend (thanks to Dave Jones)
- fix various compiler warnings in Zend

pkgconfig-1:0.15.0-6
--------------------
* Wed Mar 30 2005 Matthias Clasen  1:0.15.0-6
- add --print-requires and --print-provide options

planner-0.13-2
--------------
* Wed Mar 30 2005 Caolan McNamara  - 0.13-2
- fiddle Requires

redhat-artwork-0.121-2
----------------------
* Wed Mar 30 2005 Matthias Clasen  0.121-2
- Make Clearlooks the default theme

rhpl-0.158-1
------------
* Thu Mar 31 2005 Harald Hoyer  - 0.158-1
- fixed buffer overflow #151948

totem-1.0.1-1
-------------
* Tue Mar 01 2005 John (J5) Palmieri  - 1.0.1-1
- Update to upstream version 1.0.1
- Break out devel package

util-linux-2.12p-4
------------------
* Fri Mar 25 2005 Karel Zak  2.12p-4
- added /var/log/lastlog to util-linux (#151635)
- disabled 'newgrp' in util-linux (enabled in shadow-utils) (#149997, #151613)
- improved mtab lock (#143118)
- fixed ipcs typo (#151156)
- implemented mount workaround for duplicated labels (#116300)

* Wed Mar 16 2005 Elliot Lee  2.12p-3
- rebuilt

* Fri Feb 25 2005 Steve Dickson  2.12p-2
- Changed nfsmount to only use reserve ports when necessary
  (bz# 141773)

valgrind-callgrind-0.9.10.cvs20050330-1
---------------------------------------
* Wed Mar 30 2005 Dan Williams  0.9.10.cvs20050330-1
- Update to cvs, which compiles with valgrind 2.4.x



From Joe.Hoot at itec.suny.edu  Thu Mar 31 13:57:47 2005
From: Joe.Hoot at itec.suny.edu (Joe.Hoot at itec.suny.edu)
Date: Thu, 31 Mar 2005 08:57:47 -0500
Subject: Xen - Fedora Core 3 - kernel-xen0 and xenU missing from yum?
Message-ID: 

Hi all,

I've recently installed Fedora Core 4 Test 1 and got xen working.  This 
was about a week ago.  Before I finished getting Xen installed using yum 
and the HOWTO resources below, I had issues getting yum to find 
kernel-xen0 and kernel-xenU.  I searched and searched and finally found 
the rpms in the development tree on Fedora's main download section.  But 
in any case, once I found them and pointed yum to that repository, I 
rebooted and was able to boot into my dom0 kernel.  I played with xen 
briefly and quickly ran into an issue where I rebooted the domain and 
python spiked my cpu on dom0.  I ran into a few other issues as well, but 
I don't recall the details exactly.  So I decided to reinstall my dom0 
using Fedora Core 3, since this is what the HOWTO's were based off of.

After installing Core 3 and setting my fedora-development.repo to enabled 
(all others to disabled), I ran "yum update" successfully.  I rebooted 
into my new kernel (2.6.11-1.1208_FC4).  I tried searching for kernel-xen0 
and kernel-xenU using yum and have been unable to find it this time.  I 
looked in fedora's main download server and didn't see it there anymore.


1) Does anyone know where I can get these rpms?
2) If not, has anyone had luck compiling the unstable source over the past 
few days?

I've also tried to manually install the xen source, but have issues where 
there seems to be some source code issues that prevent it from being 
compiled?  Maybe something to do with gcc-4.0?

[root at xen01 src]# tar zxf xen-unstable-src.tgz 
[root at xen01 src]# head xen-unstable/C
ChangeLog  Config.mk  COPYING 
[root at xen01 src]# head xen-unstable/ChangeLog 
ChangeSet at 1.1382, 2005-03-28 22:51:31+01:00, kaf24 at firebug.cl.cam.ac.uk
  merge
ChangeSet at 1.1159.256.74, 2005-03-28 22:45:46+01:00, 
kaf24 at firebug.cl.cam.ac.uk
  Add a tags target to the Xen Makefile.
  Signed-off-by: Rik van Riel 
  Signed-off-by: Keir Fraser 
ChangeSet at 1.1381, 2005-03-28 22:16:12+01:00, kaf24 at firebug.cl.cam.ac.uk
  Merge firebug.cl.cam.ac.uk:/local/scratch/kaf24/xen-2.0-testing.bk
[root at xen01 src]# cd xen-unstable
[root at xen01 xen-unstable]# make dist
....60-70 lines of compilation....
gcc -g -nostdinc -fno-builtin -fno-common -fno-strict-aliasing 
-iwithprefix include -Wall -Werror -Wno-format -pipe 
-I/usr/src/xen-unstable/xen/include -Wno-pointer-arith -Wredundant-decls 
-O3 -fomit-frame-pointer -msoft-float -m32 -march=i686 -DNDEBUG -c 
multicall.c -o multicall.o
gcc -g -nostdinc -fno-builtin -fno-common -fno-strict-aliasing 
-iwithprefix include -Wall -Werror -Wno-format -pipe 
-I/usr/src/xen-unstable/xen/include -Wno-pointer-arith -Wredundant-decls 
-O3 -fomit-frame-pointer -msoft-float -m32 -march=i686 -DNDEBUG -c 
page_alloc.c -o page_alloc.o
page_alloc.c:618: error: static declaration of ?page_scrub_lock? follows 
non-static declaration
/usr/src/xen-unstable/xen/include/xen/mm.h:42: error: previous declaration 
of ?page_scrub_lock? was here
make[2]: *** [page_alloc.o] Error 1
make[2]: Leaving directory `/usr/src/xen-unstable/xen/common'
make[1]: *** [/usr/src/xen-unstable/xen/xen] Error 2
make[1]: Leaving directory `/usr/src/xen-unstable/xen'
make: *** [xen] Error 2
[root at xen01 xen-unstable]#



RESOURCES:

http://www.ibm.com/developerworks/linux/library/l-xen/

and

http://www.fedoraproject.org/wiki/FedoraXenQuickstart

Thanks,
Joe

_____________________________
SUNY - ITEC
Information Technology Exchange Center
Systems Programmer/Analyst
E-mail: Joe.Hoot at itec.suny.edu
Office: (716)878-4644
Cell: (716)908-6292
Fax: (716)878-3485
_____________________________
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From jspaleta at gmail.com  Thu Mar 31 14:02:34 2005
From: jspaleta at gmail.com (Jeff Spaleta)
Date: Thu, 31 Mar 2005 09:02:34 -0500
Subject: rawhide report: 20050330 changes
In-Reply-To: <424B6D9E.6000900@redhat.com>
References: <200503301306.j2UD6IYd012076@porkchop.devel.redhat.com>
	<424B6D9E.6000900@redhat.com>
Message-ID: <604aa79105033106027ec26b1@mail.gmail.com>

On Wed, 30 Mar 2005 22:25:18 -0500, Christopher Aillon
 wrote:
> Out of curiosity, why was this done?  gtk-update-icon-cache does not exist in 
> gtk2-2.4.14 and thus the %post and %postun scripts now fail when on a system 
> with that version of gtk2.

Sounds like gimp's requirements need to be changed to require gtk2 >= 2.6.4
Right now gimp-2.2.4-10 requires gtk2 >= 2.4.14, which isn't a valid
requirement if
gtk-update-icon-cache is going to be used in the scripts.

-jef



From mclasen at redhat.com  Thu Mar 31 14:10:28 2005
From: mclasen at redhat.com (Matthias Clasen)
Date: Thu, 31 Mar 2005 09:10:28 -0500
Subject: rawhide report: 20050330 changes
In-Reply-To: <604aa79105033106027ec26b1@mail.gmail.com>
References: <200503301306.j2UD6IYd012076@porkchop.devel.redhat.com>
	<424B6D9E.6000900@redhat.com>
	<604aa79105033106027ec26b1@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <1112278228.11397.10.camel@golem.boston.redhat.com>

On Thu, 2005-03-31 at 09:02 -0500, Jeff Spaleta wrote:
> On Wed, 30 Mar 2005 22:25:18 -0500, Christopher Aillon
>  wrote:
> > Out of curiosity, why was this done?  gtk-update-icon-cache does not exist in 
> > gtk2-2.4.14 and thus the %post and %postun scripts now fail when on a system 
> > with that version of gtk2.
> 
> Sounds like gimp's requirements need to be changed to require gtk2 >= 2.6.4
> Right now gimp-2.2.4-10 requires gtk2 >= 2.4.14, which isn't a valid
> requirement if
> gtk-update-icon-cache is going to be used in the scripts.


Wasn't the whole if [-x fun done in order to avoid a hard dependency on
GTK+ 2.6 ?

Matthias





From roli at israel-jugendtag.ch  Thu Mar 31 14:37:04 2005
From: roli at israel-jugendtag.ch (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Roland_K=E4ser?=)
Date: Thu, 31 Mar 2005 16:37:04 +0200
Subject: Fedora 4 XEN and Kernel 2.4xenU
Message-ID: <424C0B10.90503@israel-jugendtag.ch>

Hello

I'm currently testing xen for internal failover usage.
I would like to ask if there is a package with the kernel-2.4.2xenU 
available on fedora 4 and if its possible to run kernel-2.4xenU kernels 
on a kernel 2.6 dom0 system?

Roland Kaeser



From cmadams at hiwaay.net  Thu Mar 31 14:59:31 2005
From: cmadams at hiwaay.net (Chris Adams)
Date: Thu, 31 Mar 2005 08:59:31 -0600
Subject: FC4 perl module upgrades/cleanups
In-Reply-To: <424BD5B8.5070605@togami.com>
References: <424BD5B8.5070605@togami.com>
Message-ID: <20050331145931.GA1150192@hiwaay.net>

Once upon a time, Warren Togami  said:
> * Remove brp-compress calls from all packages, as it isn't doing 
> anything useful.  (Right?)

For packages that build the filelist in %install, it is needed
(otherwise the filenames change).

Alternately, packages that build the filelist could use something like:

perl -lpi -e '$_.="*"if(m!^(/usr/share/man|/usr/lib/perl5/man)!)' filelist

> * %define _use_internal_dependency_generator 0
> Many of the ancient specs have this.  Might be nice to get rid of it, 
> but it will require some careful verification comparing the before and 
> after in order to be sure the rpm-auto-dep isn't demanding bad 
> dependencies like Win32 crap.  Is this worth doing?  Need your opinions.

I only use it when I need to strip out a dependency.  When I need it, I
put the following in my %install:

# Strip out some dependencies
cat > find-requires.sh <<'EOF'
exec %{__find_requires} "$@" | egrep -v '^perl\((Crypt::IDEA|Term::ReadKey)\)$'
EOF
chmod +x find-requires.sh
%define _use_internal_dependency_generator 0
%define __find_requires %{_builddir}/%{buildsubdir}/find-requires.sh

I prefer doing it this way instead of with an extra Source*: script;
this way, the script is generated on the fly (especially useful when
using the same SRPM on multiple platforms, where find-requires may not
be in /usr/lib/rpm).  It also makes the stripped out dependencies part
of the spec file directly.

> Contributors like Ville, Robert and Jose have been very helpful in 
> submitting good spec rewrites for perl packages in the past.  So I hope 
> the community can help with cleaned up spec unidiffs (along with version 
> upgrades) to be submitted to Bugzilla, one report per package.  Perhaps 
> discuss here who will do which package.  I'll do some myself.

If I can get some time (and my spec files are acceptable), I would be
glad to help.  Here is a quick list of apparent older versions in
rawhide compared to CPAN:

Archive-Tar      rawhide 1.08     CPAN:1.23
BSD-Resource     rawhide 1.23     CPAN:1.24
Bit-Vector       rawhide 6.3      CPAN:6.4
Compress-Zlib    rawhide 1.33     CPAN:1.34
DBD-Pg           rawhide 1.31     CPAN:1.40
DBI              rawhide 1.40     CPAN:1.48
Date-Calc        rawhide 5.3      CPAN:5.4
Digest-SHA1      rawhide 2.07     CPAN:2.10
File-MMagic      rawhide 1.21     CPAN:1.22
Frontier-RPC     rawhide 0.06     CPAN:0.07b4
HTML-Parser      rawhide 3.35     CPAN:3.45
Net-DNS          rawhide 0.48     CPAN:0.49
PDL              rawhide 2.4.1    CPAN:2.4.2
TermReadKey      rawhide 2.20     CPAN:2.30
Text-Kakasi      rawhide 1.05     CPAN:2.04
Time-HiRes       rawhide 1.55     CPAN:1.66
URI              rawhide 1.30     CPAN:1.35
XML-Twig         rawhide 3.13     CPAN:3.17
libwww-perl      rawhide 5.79     CPAN:5.803
libxml-perl      rawhide 0.07     CPAN:0.08

-- 
Chris Adams 
Systems and Network Administrator - HiWAAY Internet Services
I don't speak for anybody but myself - that's enough trouble.



From n3npq at nc.rr.com  Thu Mar 31 16:06:17 2005
From: n3npq at nc.rr.com (Jeff Johnson)
Date: Thu, 31 Mar 2005 11:06:17 -0500
Subject: FC4 perl module upgrades/cleanups
In-Reply-To: <20050331145931.GA1150192@hiwaay.net>
References: <424BD5B8.5070605@togami.com> <20050331145931.GA1150192@hiwaay.net>
Message-ID: <424C1FF9.9020404@nc.rr.com>

Chris Adams wrote:

>>* %define _use_internal_dependency_generator 0
>>Many of the ancient specs have this.  Might be nice to get rid of it, 
>>but it will require some careful verification comparing the before and 
>>after in order to be sure the rpm-auto-dep isn't demanding bad 
>>dependencies like Win32 crap.  Is this worth doing?  Need your opinions.
>>    
>>
>
>I only use it when I need to strip out a dependency.  When I need it, I
>put the following in my %install:
>
># Strip out some dependencies
>cat > find-requires.sh <<'EOF'
>exec %{__find_requires} "$@" | egrep -v '^perl\((Crypt::IDEA|Term::ReadKey)\)$'
>EOF
>chmod +x find-requires.sh
>%define _use_internal_dependency_generator 0
>%define __find_requires %{_builddir}/%{buildsubdir}/find-requires.sh
>
>I prefer doing it this way instead of with an extra Source*: script;
>this way, the script is generated on the fly (especially useful when
>using the same SRPM on multiple platforms, where find-requires may not
>be in /usr/lib/rpm).  It also makes the stripped out dependencies part
>of the spec file directly.
>  
>

Adding

     %define _use_internal_dependency_generator 0

is very much the wrong thing to do with any package that includes elf32/elf64 modules.

And there is loss of functionality if/when %_use_internal_dependency_generator is used
for any package, as dependencies are not attached to files.

The mechanism was intended to to assist bootstrapping multilib, not for serious packaging usage.

73 de Jeff





From toshio at tiki-lounge.com  Thu Mar 31 14:28:18 2005
From: toshio at tiki-lounge.com (Toshio)
Date: Thu, 31 Mar 2005 09:28:18 -0500
Subject: Only link needed libraries.
In-Reply-To: <424BAA09.10508@Utel.no>
References: <424BAA09.10508@Utel.no>
Message-ID: <1112279299.31636.10.camel@Madison.badger.com>

On Thu, 2005-03-31 at 09:43 +0200, "Nils O. Sel?sdal" wrote:
> Hi folks,
> Just read a recent OSNews article;
> http://www.osnews.com/story.php?news_id=10152
> Basically, Gnome - and others, link in way too many libraries.
> This can be dealt with by using e.g. -Wl,--as-needed .
> 
I think the article is misleading.  I bet running ldd on the binaries
will show both binaries require the same set of libraries to run.
(pkgconfig is encoding interlibrary dependencies and supplying them to
the linker to add to the binary.  On Linux, the libraries can encode
this information themselves.  The result in either case is that the
program loads all the required libraries.)  So all it's saved is some
bookkeeping in the executable.

-Toshio
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From rdieter at math.unl.edu  Thu Mar 31 15:21:58 2005
From: rdieter at math.unl.edu (Rex Dieter)
Date: Thu, 31 Mar 2005 09:21:58 -0600
Subject: FC4 perl module upgrades/cleanups
In-Reply-To: <424C1FF9.9020404@nc.rr.com>
References: <424BD5B8.5070605@togami.com> <20050331145931.GA1150192@hiwaay.net>
	<424C1FF9.9020404@nc.rr.com>
Message-ID: 

Jeff Johnson wrote:

> Adding
>     %define _use_internal_dependency_generator 0
> is very much the wrong thing to do with any package that includes 
> elf32/elf64 modules.
...
> The mechanism was intended to to assist bootstrapping multilib, not for 
> serious packaging usage.

So what do you suggest doing when the internal dep generator yields 
incorrect/bogus results?

-- Rex



From lkml at mac.com  Thu Mar 31 15:40:21 2005
From: lkml at mac.com (Felipe Alfaro Solana)
Date: Thu, 31 Mar 2005 17:40:21 +0200
Subject: Fedora 4 XEN and Kernel 2.4xenU
In-Reply-To: <424C0B10.90503@israel-jugendtag.ch>
References: <424C0B10.90503@israel-jugendtag.ch>
Message-ID: 

On 31 Mar 2005, at 16:37, Roland K?ser wrote:

> Hello
>
> I'm currently testing xen for internal failover usage.
> I would like to ask if there is a package with the kernel-2.4.2xenU 
> available on fedora 4 and if its possible to run kernel-2.4xenU 
> kernels on a kernel 2.6 dom0 system?

AFAIK, there is no kernel-2.4.2-xenU package available right now, 
neither in RawHide nor in Fedora Core 4 test 1 (2.4.2 is a very ancient 
kernel). However, you should be able to grab Xen sources from 
xen.sf.net and compile a 2.4 kernel yourself. Also, I think running a 
guest 2.4-xenU guest inside a 2.6-dom0 is a perfectly valid scenario.



From cmadams at hiwaay.net  Thu Mar 31 15:41:50 2005
From: cmadams at hiwaay.net (Chris Adams)
Date: Thu, 31 Mar 2005 09:41:50 -0600
Subject: FC4 perl module upgrades/cleanups
In-Reply-To: <424C1FF9.9020404@nc.rr.com>
References: <424BD5B8.5070605@togami.com> <20050331145931.GA1150192@hiwaay.net>
	<424C1FF9.9020404@nc.rr.com>
Message-ID: <20050331154150.GB1150192@hiwaay.net>

Once upon a time, Jeff Johnson  said:
> Adding
> 
>     %define _use_internal_dependency_generator 0
> 
> is very much the wrong thing to do with any package that includes 
> elf32/elf64 modules.
> 
> And there is loss of functionality if/when 
> %_use_internal_dependency_generator is used
> for any package, as dependencies are not attached to files.
> 
> The mechanism was intended to to assist bootstrapping multilib, not for 
> serious packaging usage.

So how do you override bogus auto-generated dependencies?  For perl
modules, it is not practical to have to patch out bits of code that
won't be called on a particular platform just to avoid invalid
dependencies.

I suggested a "NoRequires:" for RPM a while back but got shot down.
AFAIK the only way to do it today is to use the above %define and filter
things out.

-- 
Chris Adams 
Systems and Network Administrator - HiWAAY Internet Services
I don't speak for anybody but myself - that's enough trouble.



From lowen at pari.edu  Thu Mar 31 02:30:31 2005
From: lowen at pari.edu (Lamar Owen)
Date: Wed, 30 Mar 2005 21:30:31 -0500
Subject: kernel source code
In-Reply-To: 
References: 
Message-ID: <200503302130.31554.lowen@pari.edu>

On Wednesday 30 March 2005 17:44, not disclosed wrote:
> Examples: comedi doesn't compile without the source, we need to rip stuff
> from the drivers as example code in volatile kernel source (last example
> MTRR register contol / SMP safety under "hyper threading IA32" /  INT size
> x86_64 are the last issue I can remember) and need to make kernel mods (HID
> driver / labjack).

Yeah, the labjack stuff and comedi are kindof broken.  But, getting 
kernel-sourcecode yourself isn't very hard. 

What you might investigate is integrating the labjack stuff and comedi into 
your own custom kernel RPM that you build on a single host, push to your own 
internal yum repository, and stay with convenient RPM packaging.  This is the 
correct way of doing it, and then you don't have to build the stuff on your 
controller PC's (that is what you are needed machine control stuff like 
labjack (we have nearly a dozen of those handy beasts here at PARI doing 
telescope control), right?).  Integrating the patches yourself in the spec 
isn't very hard and saves all kinds of space on your control PC's.

And the chances of comedi getting into the kernel could be kindof slim.
-- 
Lamar Owen
Director of Information Technology
Pisgah Astronomical Research Institute
1 PARI Drive
Rosman, NC  28772
(828)862-5554
www.pari.edu



From n3npq at nc.rr.com  Thu Mar 31 17:34:01 2005
From: n3npq at nc.rr.com (Jeff Johnson)
Date: Thu, 31 Mar 2005 12:34:01 -0500
Subject: FC4 perl module upgrades/cleanups
In-Reply-To: <20050331154150.GB1150192@hiwaay.net>
References: <424BD5B8.5070605@togami.com> <20050331145931.GA1150192@hiwaay.net>
	<424C1FF9.9020404@nc.rr.com> <20050331154150.GB1150192@hiwaay.net>
Message-ID: <424C3489.3090000@nc.rr.com>

Chris Adams wrote:

>Once upon a time, Jeff Johnson  said:
>  
>
>>Adding
>>
>>    %define _use_internal_dependency_generator 0
>>
>>is very much the wrong thing to do with any package that includes 
>>elf32/elf64 modules.
>>
>>And there is loss of functionality if/when 
>>%_use_internal_dependency_generator is used
>>for any package, as dependencies are not attached to files.
>>
>>The mechanism was intended to to assist bootstrapping multilib, not for 
>>serious packaging usage.
>>    
>>
>
>So how do you override bogus auto-generated dependencies?  For perl
>modules, it is not practical to have to patch out bits of code that
>won't be called on a particular platform just to avoid invalid
>dependencies.
>  
>

Override %__perl_requires and filter as before.

>I suggested a "NoRequires:" for RPM a while back but got shot down.
>AFAIK the only way to do it today is to use the above %define and filter
>things out.
>  
>

Adding syntax to *.spec creates instant legacy problems building with older
versions of rpm.

73 de Jeff




From n3npq at nc.rr.com  Thu Mar 31 17:36:00 2005
From: n3npq at nc.rr.com (Jeff Johnson)
Date: Thu, 31 Mar 2005 12:36:00 -0500
Subject: FC4 perl module upgrades/cleanups
In-Reply-To: 
References: <424BD5B8.5070605@togami.com> <20050331145931.GA1150192@hiwaay.net>
	<424C1FF9.9020404@nc.rr.com> 
Message-ID: <424C3500.9080003@nc.rr.com>

Rex Dieter wrote:

> Jeff Johnson wrote:
>
>> Adding
>>     %define _use_internal_dependency_generator 0
>> is very much the wrong thing to do with any package that includes 
>> elf32/elf64 modules.
>
> ...
>
>> The mechanism was intended to to assist bootstrapping multilib, not 
>> for serious packaging usage.
>
>
> So what do you suggest doing when the internal dep generator yields 
> incorrect/bogus results?


The internal dep generator is *NOT* yielding incorrect/bogus 
dependencies, the per-perl script
is yielding incorrect/bogus dependencies because regexes are mis-firing.

You are confused.

73 de Jeff





From rdieter at math.unl.edu  Thu Mar 31 16:44:55 2005
From: rdieter at math.unl.edu (Rex Dieter)
Date: Thu, 31 Mar 2005 10:44:55 -0600
Subject: FC4 perl module upgrades/cleanups
In-Reply-To: <424C3500.9080003@nc.rr.com>
References: <424BD5B8.5070605@togami.com>
	<20050331145931.GA1150192@hiwaay.net>	<424C1FF9.9020404@nc.rr.com>
	 <424C3500.9080003@nc.rr.com>
Message-ID: <424C2907.5080405@math.unl.edu>

Jeff Johnson wrote:
> Rex Dieter wrote:
> 
>> Jeff Johnson wrote:
>>
>>> Adding
>>>     %define _use_internal_dependency_generator 0
>>> is very much the wrong thing to do with any package that includes 
>>> elf32/elf64 modules.
>>
>>
>> ...
>>
>>> The mechanism was intended to to assist bootstrapping multilib, not 
>>> for serious packaging usage.
>>
>>
>>
>> So what do you suggest doing when the internal dep generator yields 
>> incorrect/bogus results?
> 
> 
> 
> The internal dep generator is *NOT* yielding incorrect/bogus 
> dependencies, the per-perl script
> is yielding incorrect/bogus dependencies because regexes are mis-firing.
> 
> You are confused.

Semantics.  Whatever.

My point being that incorrect deps/reqs *are* being generated from time 
to time.  How to fix/workaround that?

-- Rex



From n3npq at nc.rr.com  Thu Mar 31 17:51:04 2005
From: n3npq at nc.rr.com (Jeff Johnson)
Date: Thu, 31 Mar 2005 12:51:04 -0500
Subject: FC4 perl module upgrades/cleanups
In-Reply-To: <424C2907.5080405@math.unl.edu>
References: <424BD5B8.5070605@togami.com> <20050331145931.GA1150192@hiwaay.net>
	<424C1FF9.9020404@nc.rr.com> 
	<424C3500.9080003@nc.rr.com> <424C2907.5080405@math.unl.edu>
Message-ID: <424C3888.5070804@nc.rr.com>

Rex Dieter wrote:

> Jeff Johnson wrote:
>
>> Rex Dieter wrote:
>>
>>> Jeff Johnson wrote:
>>>
>>>> Adding
>>>>     %define _use_internal_dependency_generator 0
>>>> is very much the wrong thing to do with any package that includes 
>>>> elf32/elf64 modules.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> ...
>>>
>>>> The mechanism was intended to to assist bootstrapping multilib, not 
>>>> for serious packaging usage.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> So what do you suggest doing when the internal dep generator yields 
>>> incorrect/bogus results?
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> The internal dep generator is *NOT* yielding incorrect/bogus 
>> dependencies, the per-perl script
>> is yielding incorrect/bogus dependencies because regexes are mis-firing.
>>
>> You are confused.
>
>
> Semantics.  Whatever.


No correctness. Disabling the internal dependency generator is not at 
all trhe right thing to
do for any perl packaging that includes elf32/elf64 that is expected to 
install correctly
in a multilib environment.

>
> My point being that incorrect deps/reqs *are* being generated from 
> time to time.  How to fix/workaround that?


Override %__perl_requires and filter as before.

73 de Jeff




From rdieter at math.unl.edu  Thu Mar 31 16:57:36 2005
From: rdieter at math.unl.edu (Rex Dieter)
Date: Thu, 31 Mar 2005 10:57:36 -0600
Subject: FC4 perl module upgrades/cleanups
In-Reply-To: <424C3888.5070804@nc.rr.com>
References: <424BD5B8.5070605@togami.com>
	<20050331145931.GA1150192@hiwaay.net>	<424C1FF9.9020404@nc.rr.com>
		<424C3500.9080003@nc.rr.com>
	<424C2907.5080405@math.unl.edu> <424C3888.5070804@nc.rr.com>
Message-ID: <424C2C00.2090104@math.unl.edu>

Jeff Johnson wrote:
> Rex Dieter wrote:

>>>> So what do you suggest doing when the internal dep generator yields 
>>>> incorrect/bogus results?

>>> The internal dep generator is *NOT* yielding incorrect/bogus 
>>> dependencies, the per-perl script
>>> is yielding incorrect/bogus dependencies because regexes are mis-firing.
>>>
>>> You are confused.

>> Semantics.  Whatever.

> No correctness. Disabling the internal dependency generator is not at 

... There is no dispute that this is bad, in general.

>> My point being that incorrect deps/reqs *are* being generated from 
>> time to time.  How to fix/workaround that?

> Override %__perl_requires and filter as before.

In what rpm version was __perl_requires introduced?  I've tried to use 
it from time-to-time, and it doesn't seem to work with older versions of 
rpm (or perhaps I didn't try hard enough).

-- Rex



From cmadams at hiwaay.net  Thu Mar 31 17:02:14 2005
From: cmadams at hiwaay.net (Chris Adams)
Date: Thu, 31 Mar 2005 11:02:14 -0600
Subject: FC4 perl module upgrades/cleanups
In-Reply-To: <424C3489.3090000@nc.rr.com>
References: <424BD5B8.5070605@togami.com> <20050331145931.GA1150192@hiwaay.net>
	<424C1FF9.9020404@nc.rr.com> <20050331154150.GB1150192@hiwaay.net>
	<424C3489.3090000@nc.rr.com>
Message-ID: <20050331170214.GE1150192@hiwaay.net>

Once upon a time, Jeff Johnson  said:
> Adding syntax to *.spec creates instant legacy problems building with older
> versions of rpm.

When was %__perl_requires added to RPM?

If the spec file language is now frozen for all time, why bother
breaking old spec files (things like Copyright: vs. License:)?

Instead of a standardized solution with RPM, we have over 2 dozen
packages in FC that have their own ad-hoc (and in a bunch of cases
apparently incorrect) solution.

-- 
Chris Adams 
Systems and Network Administrator - HiWAAY Internet Services
I don't speak for anybody but myself - that's enough trouble.



From n3npq at nc.rr.com  Thu Mar 31 18:10:39 2005
From: n3npq at nc.rr.com (Jeff Johnson)
Date: Thu, 31 Mar 2005 13:10:39 -0500
Subject: FC4 perl module upgrades/cleanups
In-Reply-To: <20050331170214.GE1150192@hiwaay.net>
References: <424BD5B8.5070605@togami.com> <20050331145931.GA1150192@hiwaay.net>
	<424C1FF9.9020404@nc.rr.com> <20050331154150.GB1150192@hiwaay.net>
	<424C3489.3090000@nc.rr.com> <20050331170214.GE1150192@hiwaay.net>
Message-ID: <424C3D1F.20902@nc.rr.com>

Chris Adams wrote:

>Once upon a time, Jeff Johnson  said:
>  
>
>>Adding syntax to *.spec creates instant legacy problems building with older
>>versions of rpm.
>>    
>>
>
>When was %__perl_requires added to RPM?
>  
>

rpm-4.2.

>If the spec file language is now frozen for all time, why bother
>breaking old spec files (things like Copyright: vs. License:)?
>  
>

I did not say "frozen", I said that NoRequires: adds instant legacy 
issues building
packages with older versions of rpm.

Copyright: vs. License: change happened years and years ago, and still comes
up as an issue every 6 months or so *even though the two tags have been 
synonyms* since implementation.
It was time to clarify and simplify the issue imho.

>Instead of a standardized solution with RPM, we have over 2 dozen
>packages in FC that have their own ad-hoc (and in a bunch of cases
>apparently incorrect) solution.
>  
>

So fix the packages rather than honking
   %_use_internal_dependency_generator 0
as a (wrong!) solution.

73 de Jeff




From ph18 at cornell.edu  Thu Mar 31 17:31:30 2005
From: ph18 at cornell.edu (Paul A. Houle)
Date: Thu, 31 Mar 2005 12:31:30 -0500
Subject: Stateless linux
In-Reply-To: <1112229947.8582.271.camel@arena.soho.bytebot.net>
References: <20050323121543.82712.qmail@web8501.mail.in.yahoo.com>
	<424166AA.3090304@hclcomnet.co.in>
	<80d7e40905032406546c7a2794@mail.gmail.com>
	<1112229947.8582.271.camel@arena.soho.bytebot.net>
Message-ID: 

On Thu, 31 Mar 2005 10:45:47 +1000, Colin Charles  wrote:

> On Thu, 2005-03-24 at 07:54 -0700, Stephen J. Smoogen wrote:
>> Actually, I was waiting for some sort of larger announcement and  
>> mailing list
>> myself. I had put a very little time into it.. but couldnt see who
>> else was wanting it or doing anything on it. Having a mailing list
>> would be useful.
>
> It was however decided till the traffic on f-d-l got too high, there
> would be no stateless linux list. So, why not just use f-d-l in the
> meantime?
>

	Curiosity about stateless linux was one of the reasons I joined f-d-l.   
I've heard very little about stateless linux in the last month --  
certainly there is another other stuff going on f-d-l that it doesn't seem  
like a comfortable place to discuss stateless linux.

	On the other hand,  it could be that stateless linux is dead in the water  
and there wouldn't be enoug of a critical mass to sustain discussion  
elsewhere.



From ville.skytta at iki.fi  Thu Mar 31 17:11:01 2005
From: ville.skytta at iki.fi (Ville =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Skytt=E4?=)
Date: Thu, 31 Mar 2005 20:11:01 +0300
Subject: FC4 perl module upgrades/cleanups
In-Reply-To: <20050331120912.GA3604@redhat.com>
References: <424BD5B8.5070605@togami.com> <20050331120912.GA3604@redhat.com>
Message-ID: <1112289061.31596.80.camel@bobcat.mine.nu>

On Thu, 2005-03-31 at 13:09 +0100, Joe Orton wrote:
> On Thu, Mar 31, 2005 at 12:49:28AM -1000, Warren Togami wrote:
> > * Remove brp-compress calls from all packages, as it isn't doing 
> > anything useful.  (Right?)
> 
> I think it was necessary for packages with a generated filelist since it
> ensures the man pages get gzipped *before* creating the filelist.  If
> they get gzipped after %install the filelist is out of sync with the
> install root.

Good point, I completely forgot about this (I've not used filelists like
this in a loooong time).  So brp-compress shouldn't be blindly removed.



From lkml at mac.com  Thu Mar 31 18:12:08 2005
From: lkml at mac.com (Felipe Alfaro Solana)
Date: Thu, 31 Mar 2005 20:12:08 +0200
Subject: Xen - Fedora Core 3 - kernel-xen0 and xenU missing from yum?
Message-ID: <2fe12b17622b6b4fa693791fc22a2303@mac.com>

On 31 Mar 2005, at 15:57, Joe.Hoot at itec.suny.edu wrote:

> Hi all,

Hi... Please, don't use HTML when posting. It causes problems for 
people reading this list in digest mode.

> After installing Core 3 and setting my fedora-development.repo to 
> enabled (all others to disabled), I ran "yum update" successfully. ?I 
> rebooted into my new kernel (2.6.11-1.1208_FC4). ?I tried searching 
> for kernel-xen0 and kernel-xenU using yum and have been unable to find 
> it this time. ?I looked in fedora's main download server and didn't 
> see it there anymore.
>
> 1) Does anyone know where I can get these rpms?

By the time you read this, new 2.6.11-1.1219_FC4 xen0 and xenU kernels 
should have appeared in RawHide.

> 2) If not, has anyone had luck compiling the unstable source over the 
> past few days?

Not till today, thanks to Rik :-)

> I've also tried to manually install the xen source, but have issues 
> where there seems to be some source code issues that prevent it from 
> being compiled? ?Maybe something to do with gcc-4.0?

Yep.



From meastman at cct.lsu.edu  Thu Mar 31 18:30:38 2005
From: meastman at cct.lsu.edu (Matthew Eastman)
Date: Thu, 31 Mar 2005 12:30:38 -0600
Subject: Stateless linux
In-Reply-To: 
References: <20050323121543.82712.qmail@web8501.mail.in.yahoo.com>	<424166AA.3090304@hclcomnet.co.in>	<80d7e40905032406546c7a2794@mail.gmail.com>	<1112229947.8582.271.camel@arena.soho.bytebot.net>
	
Message-ID: <424C41CE.8030502@cct.lsu.edu>

Paul A. Houle wrote:
> On Thu, 31 Mar 2005 10:45:47 +1000, Colin Charles  wrote:
> 
>> On Thu, 2005-03-24 at 07:54 -0700, Stephen J. Smoogen wrote:
>>
>>> Actually, I was waiting for some sort of larger announcement and  
>>> mailing list
>>> myself. I had put a very little time into it.. but couldnt see who
>>> else was wanting it or doing anything on it. Having a mailing list
>>> would be useful.
>>
>>
>> It was however decided till the traffic on f-d-l got too high, there
>> would be no stateless linux list. So, why not just use f-d-l in the
>> meantime?
> 
>     Curiosity about stateless linux was one of the reasons I joined 
> f-d-l.   I've heard very little about stateless linux in the last month 
> --  certainly there is another other stuff going on f-d-l that it 
> doesn't seem  like a comfortable place to discuss stateless linux.
> 
>     On the other hand,  it could be that stateless linux is dead in the 
> water  and there wouldn't be enoug of a critical mass to sustain 
> discussion  elsewhere.

I would really like to see the stateless project be revived. It seems 
like it is a good idea, and I know several people, including myself, who 
have implemented alternatives after realizing that stateless was no 
longer being developed. I would be willing to help in this cause if 
there are enough other people for this to worthwhile.

-- 
Matthew Eastman
Center for Computation & Technology
Louisiana State University



From roli at israel-jugendtag.ch  Thu Mar 31 19:10:12 2005
From: roli at israel-jugendtag.ch (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Roland_K=E4ser?=)
Date: Thu, 31 Mar 2005 21:10:12 +0200
Subject: Fedora 4 XEN and Kernel 2.4xenU
In-Reply-To: 
References: <424C0B10.90503@israel-jugendtag.ch>
	
Message-ID: <424C4B14.90400@israel-jugendtag.ch>

Hello

No, what I ment, is that the xen distro from camebridge brings patches 
for kernel 2.9.10xenU and 2.4.29xenU. Shouldn't these are be part of 
FC4? Not only the 2.6 kernels.
In many cases there are complex installations on Redhat 8 or 9 which 
should be integratedable into a server consolidation.

Roland

Felipe Alfaro Solana schrieb:

> On 31 Mar 2005, at 16:37, Roland K?ser wrote:
>
>> Hello
>>
>> I'm currently testing xen for internal failover usage.
>> I would like to ask if there is a package with the kernel-2.4.2xenU 
>> available on fedora 4 and if its possible to run kernel-2.4xenU 
>> kernels on a kernel 2.6 dom0 system?
>
>
> AFAIK, there is no kernel-2.4.2-xenU package available right now, 
> neither in RawHide nor in Fedora Core 4 test 1 (2.4.2 is a very 
> ancient kernel). However, you should be able to grab Xen sources from 
> xen.sf.net and compile a 2.4 kernel yourself. Also, I think running a 
> guest 2.4-xenU guest inside a 2.6-dom0 is a perfectly valid scenario.
>



From pri.rhl3 at iadonisi.to  Thu Mar 31 19:11:01 2005
From: pri.rhl3 at iadonisi.to (Paul Iadonisi)
Date: Thu, 31 Mar 2005 14:11:01 -0500
Subject: Fedora 4 XEN and Kernel 2.4xenU
In-Reply-To: <424C4B14.90400@israel-jugendtag.ch>
References: <424C0B10.90503@israel-jugendtag.ch>
	
	<424C4B14.90400@israel-jugendtag.ch>
Message-ID: <1112296261.25220.8.camel@tuxpaq>

On Thu, 2005-03-31 at 21:10 +0200, Roland K?ser wrote:
> Hello
> 
> No, what I ment, is that the xen distro from camebridge brings patches 
> for kernel 2.9.10xenU and 2.4.29xenU. Shouldn't these are be part of 
> FC4? Not only the 2.6 kernels.
> In many cases there are complex installations on Redhat 8 or 9 which 
> should be integratedable into a server consolidation.

  Hmm, I hadn't thought of that.  But as desirable as that sounds, I
strongly suspect that this would increase the complexity of kernel
building and maintenance for FC4 and beyond.  If there's much demand for
it, it could be picked up by one of the alternative repositories (some
of them, if I'm not mistaken, collectively known as rpmforge, now).

-- 
-Paul Iadonisi
 Senior System Administrator
 Red Hat Certified Engineer / Local Linux Lobbyist
 Ever see a penguin fly?  --  Try Linux.
 GPL all the way: Sell services, don't lease secrets



From roli at israel-jugendtag.ch  Thu Mar 31 19:20:09 2005
From: roli at israel-jugendtag.ch (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Roland_K=E4ser?=)
Date: Thu, 31 Mar 2005 21:20:09 +0200
Subject: Fedora 4 XEN and Kernel 2.4xenU
In-Reply-To: <1112296261.25220.8.camel@tuxpaq>
References: <424C0B10.90503@israel-jugendtag.ch>		<424C4B14.90400@israel-jugendtag.ch>
	<1112296261.25220.8.camel@tuxpaq>
Message-ID: <424C4D69.7050206@israel-jugendtag.ch>

Hello

> this would increase the complexity of kernel
> building and maintenance for FC4 and beyond.

Why? Its just an other rpm packages which provides the kernel 2.4.29. The xen distro contributes the packages for it. Just a new spec and a new srpm. Should take (I'm not yet a specialist for building rpms for xen) around a half hour to create the package.

Roland


Paul Iadonisi schrieb:

>On Thu, 2005-03-31 at 21:10 +0200, Roland K?ser wrote:
>  
>
>>Hello
>>
>>No, what I ment, is that the xen distro from camebridge brings patches 
>>for kernel 2.9.10xenU and 2.4.29xenU. Shouldn't these are be part of 
>>FC4? Not only the 2.6 kernels.
>>In many cases there are complex installations on Redhat 8 or 9 which 
>>should be integratedable into a server consolidation.
>>    
>>
>
>  Hmm, I hadn't thought of that.  But as desirable as that sounds, I
>strongly suspect that this would increase the complexity of kernel
>building and maintenance for FC4 and beyond.  If there's much demand for
>it, it could be picked up by one of the alternative repositories (some
>of them, if I'm not mistaken, collectively known as rpmforge, now).
>
>  
>



From pri.rhl3 at iadonisi.to  Thu Mar 31 19:33:12 2005
From: pri.rhl3 at iadonisi.to (Paul Iadonisi)
Date: Thu, 31 Mar 2005 14:33:12 -0500
Subject: Fedora 4 XEN and Kernel 2.4xenU
In-Reply-To: <424C4D69.7050206@israel-jugendtag.ch>
References: <424C0B10.90503@israel-jugendtag.ch>
	
	<424C4B14.90400@israel-jugendtag.ch> <1112296261.25220.8.camel@tuxpaq>
	<424C4D69.7050206@israel-jugendtag.ch>
Message-ID: <1112297593.25220.16.camel@tuxpaq>

On Thu, 2005-03-31 at 21:20 +0200, Roland K?ser wrote:
> Hello
> 
> > this would increase the complexity of kernel
> > building and maintenance for FC4 and beyond.
> 
> Why? Its just an other rpm packages which provides the kernel 2.4.29.
> The xen distro contributes the packages for it. Just a new spec and a
> new srpm. Should take (I'm not yet a specialist for building rpms for
> xen) around a half hour to create the package.

  Just another rpm?  You can't be serious.  We're talking another
kernel, here.  Let's ask Dave Jones (whom I believe is the current
kernel rpm maintainer) how much he fancies maintaining multiple kernel
rpms per release of Fedora Core and/or Red Hat Enterprise Linux that is
different than upstream and that has to be kept up to date security-
wise.  (If you think it would only be for one release, you would only
need to wait to witness the endless threads from hell about why Red Hat
should not drop 2.4 xen rpms from Fedora Core 13 / Red Hat Enterprise
Linux 9.)
  Add to that the necessity to test various combinations of xen0 <->
xenU kernels once you start mixing 2.4/2.6 kernels.  Not that it can't
be done, just keep in perspective the magnitude of the work.  Any
volunteers?



From davej at redhat.com  Thu Mar 31 19:45:27 2005
From: davej at redhat.com (Dave Jones)
Date: Thu, 31 Mar 2005 14:45:27 -0500
Subject: Fedora 4 XEN and Kernel 2.4xenU
In-Reply-To: <1112297593.25220.16.camel@tuxpaq>
References: <424C0B10.90503@israel-jugendtag.ch>
	
	<424C4B14.90400@israel-jugendtag.ch>
	<1112296261.25220.8.camel@tuxpaq>
	<424C4D69.7050206@israel-jugendtag.ch>
	<1112297593.25220.16.camel@tuxpaq>
Message-ID: <20050331194526.GB17355@redhat.com>

On Thu, Mar 31, 2005 at 02:33:12PM -0500, Paul Iadonisi wrote:
 > On Thu, 2005-03-31 at 21:20 +0200, Roland K?ser wrote:
 > > Hello
 > > 
 > > > this would increase the complexity of kernel
 > > > building and maintenance for FC4 and beyond.
 > > 
 > > Why? Its just an other rpm packages which provides the kernel 2.4.29.
 > > The xen distro contributes the packages for it. Just a new spec and a
 > > new srpm. Should take (I'm not yet a specialist for building rpms for
 > > xen) around a half hour to create the package.
 > 
 >   Just another rpm?  You can't be serious.  We're talking another
 > kernel, here.  Let's ask Dave Jones (whom I believe is the current
 > kernel rpm maintainer) how much he fancies maintaining multiple kernel
 > rpms per release of Fedora Core and/or Red Hat Enterprise Linux that is
 > different than upstream and that has to be kept up to date security-
 > wise.  

I don't see any particular benefit offered by running a 2.4 kernel
in a 2.6 Xen host.  If 2.6 doesn't do something for you that 2.4 does,
that needs fixing. 2.4 is a dead end wrt new development. I'm surprised
to hear the Xen folks still support it.

I have no plans whatsoever to build another 2.4 kernel for Fedora,
so unless some loony decides to take this on as a fedora-extras
project (and there are so many more worthwhile projects that could
be done imo), it won't happen.

		Dave



From roli at israel-jugendtag.ch  Thu Mar 31 19:56:27 2005
From: roli at israel-jugendtag.ch (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Roland_K=E4ser?=)
Date: Thu, 31 Mar 2005 21:56:27 +0200
Subject: Fedora 4 XEN and Kernel 2.4xenU
In-Reply-To: <20050331194526.GB17355@redhat.com>
References: <424C0B10.90503@israel-jugendtag.ch>		<424C4B14.90400@israel-jugendtag.ch>	<1112296261.25220.8.camel@tuxpaq>	<424C4D69.7050206@israel-jugendtag.ch>	<1112297593.25220.16.camel@tuxpaq>
	<20050331194526.GB17355@redhat.com>
Message-ID: <424C55EB.4090106@israel-jugendtag.ch>

Hello

 >I don't see any particular benefit offered by running a 2.4 kernel in 
a 2.6 Xen host.
Have You ever tried to install a Oracle 9 on "modern" fedora release? I 
can sing some songs about this crap. (The oracle not the Fedora).
So if we need to run the oracle servers as xen instance we NEED to have 
a redhat 9 for sample. And some other applications servers (special in 
the enterprise computing area)  are not ready for the kernel 2.6, the 
new threading library changes or the new glibc or its failed in case of 
other library parts which are to new on fedora releases.


By the way: If there is a useful howto to compile xen and xenU, xen0 
kernels and also a test protocol for testing this kernels for the live 
fedora release I would like to try to maintain the 2.4xenU kernel for 
fedora.

Roland


Dave Jones schrieb:

>On Thu, Mar 31, 2005 at 02:33:12PM -0500, Paul Iadonisi wrote:
> > On Thu, 2005-03-31 at 21:20 +0200, Roland K?ser wrote:
> > > Hello
> > > 
> > > > this would increase the complexity of kernel
> > > > building and maintenance for FC4 and beyond.
> > > 
> > > Why? Its just an other rpm packages which provides the kernel 2.4.29.
> > > The xen distro contributes the packages for it. Just a new spec and a
> > > new srpm. Should take (I'm not yet a specialist for building rpms for
> > > xen) around a half hour to create the package.
> > 
> >   Just another rpm?  You can't be serious.  We're talking another
> > kernel, here.  Let's ask Dave Jones (whom I believe is the current
> > kernel rpm maintainer) how much he fancies maintaining multiple kernel
> > rpms per release of Fedora Core and/or Red Hat Enterprise Linux that is
> > different than upstream and that has to be kept up to date security-
> > wise.  
>
>I don't see any particular benefit offered by running a 2.4 kernel
>in a 2.6 Xen host.  If 2.6 doesn't do something for you that 2.4 does,
>that needs fixing. 2.4 is a dead end wrt new development. I'm surprised
>to hear the Xen folks still support it.
>
>I have no plans whatsoever to build another 2.4 kernel for Fedora,
>so unless some loony decides to take this on as a fedora-extras
>project (and there are so many more worthwhile projects that could
>be done imo), it won't happen.
>
>		Dave
>
>  
>



From nphilipp at redhat.com  Thu Mar 31 20:41:02 2005
From: nphilipp at redhat.com (Nils Philippsen)
Date: Thu, 31 Mar 2005 22:41:02 +0200
Subject: rawhide report: 20050330 changes
In-Reply-To: <424B6D9E.6000900@redhat.com>
References: <200503301306.j2UD6IYd012076@porkchop.devel.redhat.com>
	<424B6D9E.6000900@redhat.com>
Message-ID: <1112301662.9588.7.camel@wombat.tiptoe.de>

On Wed, 2005-03-30 at 22:25 -0500, Christopher Aillon wrote:
> Build System wrote:
> > gimp-2:2.2.4-10
> > ---------------
> > * Tue Mar 29 2005 Nils Philippsen 
> > - revert gtk requirement change
> 
> Out of curiosity, why was this done?

Mainly maintainability -- without that change I don't have to do
anything besides using a different release tag between Rawhide/FC4 and
FC3. You could argue that FC4 gimp needs gtk >= 2.6.x because it was
built with it (I don't know whether apps built with 2.6.x could be run
against 2.4.x, I doubt it) but I don't want to encode that in the source
RPM/spec file.

>   gtk-update-icon-cache does not exist in gtk2-2.4.14 and thus the %
> post and %postun scripts now fail when on a system with that version
> of gtk2.

Nope (you should know, you wrote the scriptlet in question ;-):

[...]
if [ -x /usr/bin/gtk-update-icon-cache ]; then
  gtk-update-icon-cache %{_datadir}/icons/hicolor
fi
[...]

Nils
-- 
     Nils Philippsen    /    Red Hat    /    nphilipp at redhat.com
"They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary
 safety deserve neither liberty nor safety."     -- B. Franklin, 1759
 PGP fingerprint:  C4A8 9474 5C4C ADE3 2B8F  656D 47D8 9B65 6951 3011



From peter.backlund at home.se  Thu Mar 31 22:20:54 2005
From: peter.backlund at home.se (Peter Backlund)
Date: Fri, 01 Apr 2005 00:20:54 +0200
Subject: rawhide report: 20050331 changes
In-Reply-To: <200503311337.j2VDbQil029683@porkchop.devel.redhat.com>
References: <200503311337.j2VDbQil029683@porkchop.devel.redhat.com>
Message-ID: <1112307654.4644.5.camel@localhost.localdomain>

> redhat-artwork-0.121-2
> ----------------------
> * Wed Mar 30 2005 Matthias Clasen  0.121-2
> - Make Clearlooks the default theme

Hmm, what is going on? Bluecurve is being dropped in favor of (the
Bluecurve-based) Clearlooks theme?

/Peter