From unwosu at redhat.com Mon May 1 16:18:22 2006 From: unwosu at redhat.com (uzoma nwosu) Date: Mon, 01 May 2006 12:18:22 -0400 Subject: [Fedora-music-list] Late Introduction Message-ID: <445634CE.7030409@redhat.com> Hello, I'm Uzoma Nwosu. I'm a Level 1 Support Engineer in GSS. Just started in January. Can't say I have any skills. I've been a techno dj for almost 17 years, now. My radio show was one of the early shows unofficially broadcasting over the net on wxyc (I didn't set up the first stream, my dj partner at the time did while he was at Sunsite). I throw parties. And I am one of the organizers of signal: the southeast electronic music festival (www.signalfest.com). What I would hope that we can do is really get the cream of the crop audio apps in fedora extras. I would really love to see audio have a higher profile in the linux community. And I gladly help in any way that I can to promote this. As for hardware, I've got a SB Live, and an Audigy (can't remember which one). I'll have an old custom built Amd 1800 with 300Gb drive and 512Mb RAM that I can donate once I get my new machine in. I know some of you are way more technical that I'll ever be but can we have a dialog of the big picture as far as apps are concerned? What is the criteria for bringing programs in? Is there any way that we not bring 10 billion audio tools that do the same thing? Oh, and here are a few apps that I am interesting in helping to bring in: Mixxx - the closest usable digital dj app that I've found LMMS - Because it actually works like Fruity Loops a good for early adoption for novices Rosegarden - Haven't played with it but here it is solid Ardour - Played with it, looks solid, wish it had docs That's probably thinking way too far ahead, but I wanted to get that out there. Uzoma From dburney at redhat.com Mon May 1 20:16:07 2006 From: dburney at redhat.com (David Burney) Date: Mon, 01 May 2006 16:16:07 -0400 Subject: [Fedora-music-list] Late Introduction In-Reply-To: <445634CE.7030409@redhat.com> References: <445634CE.7030409@redhat.com> Message-ID: <44566C87.4030902@redhat.com> Uzoma, Greg DeK and I were meeting today and your email spawned an idea-- its time for those of us interested within Red Hat to hold an internal opensourceapalooza of some sort. Greg says he'll take the lead. Our team will gladly facilitate. David uzoma nwosu wrote: > Hello, I'm Uzoma Nwosu. I'm a Level 1 Support Engineer in GSS. Just > started in January. Can't say I have any skills. I've been a techno > dj for almost 17 years, now. My radio show was one of the early shows > unofficially broadcasting over the net on wxyc (I didn't set up the > first stream, my dj partner at the time did while he was at Sunsite). > I throw parties. And I am one of the organizers of signal: the > southeast electronic music festival (www.signalfest.com). > > What I would hope that we can do is really get the cream of the crop > audio apps in fedora extras. I would really love to see audio have a > higher profile in the linux community. And I gladly help in any way > that I can to promote this. > > As for hardware, I've got a SB Live, and an Audigy (can't remember > which one). I'll have an old custom built Amd 1800 with 300Gb drive > and 512Mb RAM that I can donate once I get my new machine in. > > I know some of you are way more technical that I'll ever be but can we > have a dialog of the big picture as far as apps are concerned? What > is the criteria for bringing programs in? Is there any way that we > not bring 10 billion audio tools that do the same thing? Oh, and here > are a few apps that I am interesting in helping to bring in: > > Mixxx - the closest usable digital dj app that I've found > LMMS - Because it actually works like Fruity Loops a good for early > adoption for novices > Rosegarden - Haven't played with it but here it is solid > Ardour - Played with it, looks solid, wish it had docs > > That's probably thinking way too far ahead, but I wanted to get that > out there. > > Uzoma > > _______________________________________________ > Fedora-music-list mailing list > Fedora-music-list at redhat.com > http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-music-list From nando at ccrma.Stanford.EDU Mon May 1 22:17:00 2006 From: nando at ccrma.Stanford.EDU (Fernando Lopez-Lezcano) Date: Mon, 01 May 2006 15:17:00 -0700 Subject: [Fedora-music-list] Late Introduction In-Reply-To: <445634CE.7030409@redhat.com> References: <445634CE.7030409@redhat.com> Message-ID: <1146521820.31720.35.camel@cmn3.stanford.edu> On Mon, 2006-05-01 at 12:18 -0400, uzoma nwosu wrote: > Hello, I'm Uzoma Nwosu. I'm a Level 1 Support Engineer in GSS. Just > started in January. Can't say I have any skills. I've been a techno dj > for almost 17 years, now. My radio show was one of the early shows > unofficially broadcasting over the net on wxyc (I didn't set up the > first stream, my dj partner at the time did while he was at Sunsite). I > throw parties. And I am one of the organizers of signal: the southeast > electronic music festival (www.signalfest.com). > > What I would hope that we can do is really get the cream of the crop > audio apps in fedora extras. I would really love to see audio have a > higher profile in the linux community. And I gladly help in any way > that I can to promote this. > > As for hardware, I've got a SB Live, and an Audigy (can't remember which > one). I'll have an old custom built Amd 1800 with 300Gb drive and 512Mb > RAM that I can donate once I get my new machine in. > > I know some of you are way more technical that I'll ever be but can we > have a dialog of the big picture as far as apps are concerned? You could start by taking a look at what's currently available in the Planet CCRMA repository (which I created and maintain), surf to: http://ccrma.stanford.edu/planetccrma/software/ (the version numbers are a bit off right now but the links to the individual program web pages should take you to them). > What is the criteria for bringing programs in? I presume that the same core criteria that works for Fedora Extras. > Is there any way that we not bring 10 billion audio tools that do > the same thing? [there are not _that_ many :-] Hopefully there will be not that much redundancy, but if you say, for example, midi sequencers - there are several of them, some just midi, some do other things as well, some are loop based, some are track oriented, so it would be really hard to pick one. In other categories there are clear winners, but you get the picture, not so easy to decide what's "duplicate functionality". I _have_ done some culling over time, and some of the packages that are on the web site are not available for later versions of the core operating system as they are superseeded by better versions. One example I could point out is the patch bay programs for the alsa midi sequencer and for Jack. I'm currently only building Qjackctl which does both - but I may include also one for MIDI only. > Oh, and here are a > few apps that I am interesting in helping to bring in: > > Mixxx - the closest usable digital dj app that I've found > LMMS - Because it actually works like Fruity Loops a good for early > adoption for novices > Rosegarden - Haven't played with it but here it is solid > Ardour - Played with it, looks solid, wish it had docs It has some... http://ardour.org/manual -- Fernando From nando at ccrma.Stanford.EDU Tue May 2 18:52:34 2006 From: nando at ccrma.Stanford.EDU (Fernando Lopez-Lezcano) Date: Tue, 02 May 2006 11:52:34 -0700 Subject: [Fedora-music-list] [Fwd: [PlanetCCRMA] fedora core 5 support: a start] Message-ID: <1146595954.5605.37.camel@cmn3.stanford.edu> FYI: Just sent to the Planet CCRMA lists... -------- Forwarded Message -------- From: Fernando Lopez-Lezcano To: planetccrmanews at ccrma.Stanford.EDU, planetccrma at ccrma.Stanford.EDU Subject: [PlanetCCRMA] fedora core 5 support: a start Date: Tue, 02 May 2006 11:43:39 -0700 Hi all and thanks for the patience :-) Here's a start, a few Planet CCRMA packages for FC5. This of course does not mean you should install FC5 right now, but if you can't wait and want to try some things out (I know many of you have _already_ installed FC5 :-) then this is a beginning... but only for good sports, as Bill Schottstaedt would say... [BTW, FC4 users, don't despair, all these shiny new versions of packages should percolate to previous FC versions soon] So... Planet CCRMA on FC5 is yum based. First thing to do after installing fc5 is: rpm -Uvh http://ccrma.stanford.edu/planetccrma/mirror/fedora/linux/planetccrma/5/i386/planetccrma-repo-1.0-2.rhfc5.ccrma.noarch.rpm (wow, that's a long url...) This will install a yum configuration file that points to the Planet CCRMA repositories (two of them right now), plus a mirror of Fedora Extras. At this point Planet CCRMA depends on Extras, so that has to be there. There are also pointers to updates and the core os but those are disabled by default. You can edit this file and enable them if you want: /etc/yum.repos.d/planetccrma.repo Plus you can look at the existing packages here, courtesy of repoview: http://ccrma.stanford.edu/planetccrma/mirror/fedora/linux/planetccrma/5/i386/repodata/ http://ccrma.stanford.edu/planetccrma/mirror/fedora/linux/planetcore/5/i386/repodata/ You probably should edit another yum preference. By default (out of the box) yum keeps just the last two kernels installed. If experience is any guide you will want to keep more of them. Edit this file and disable this plugin: /etc/yum/pluginconf.d/installonlyn.conf After that you will manage kernels and decide which to keep and which to erase. To install the latest and greatest kernel: yum install planetccrma-core-edge or yum install planetccrma-core-edge-smp (for a multiprocessor kernel) This will get you (today) 2.6.16.9 plus Ingo Molnar's realtime preemption patch 2.6.16-rt17 configured as PREEMPT_RT (the best option but the most "bleeding edge"). This was all done on top of Fedora's 1.2080 kernel - a pain because I had to tweak Ingo's patch a bit, and hopefully that was done correctly. It should have the good side effect of being closer to the configuration that Fedora chooses, that is, should be a little bit more compatible with FC than plain vanilla 2.6.16.x (as I used to do before). Remains to be seen how long I'll be able to do this. One more difference (for gurus), I have built these kernels with 4KSTACKS=n - there were a couple of stack overflows with that on and the realtime preempt patch. A notch down in performance is: yum install planetccrma-core or yum install planetccrma-core-smp That will get you the same thing as the previous one but with Ingo's patch configured as PREEMPT_DESKTOP. It may help when PREEMPT_RT does not work on your hardware. Both selections will bring in some additional goodies as usual. Those include 1.0.11 final ALSA kernel modules, ALSA firmware, tools and oss packages, the rtirq script that optimizes IRQ priorities for best realtime sound performance and a patched PAM that will give you complete access to SCHED_FIFO for best performance, and the ability to hang the machine as well :-) Current kernels are named: kernel-2.6.16-1.2080.13.rrt.rhfc5.ccrma.i686.rpm for the PREEMPT_RT one, and kernel-2.6.16-1.2080.13.rdt.rhfc5.ccrma.i686.rpm for the PREEMPT_DESKTOP kernel (and the smp and i586 variations as well) There are some music packages, after all the kernel should be invisible and does not make music (unless you try to old trick of cat'ting the kernel image to a sound device... turn down the volume first! :-) Currently: jack 0.101.0-0.2.cvs qjackctl 0.2.20-1 liblrdf 0.4.0 (and raptor 1.4.9) lash 0.5.1 fluidsynth 1.0.7a-1 qsynth 0.2.5-1 ardour 0.99.3-1 I build the CAPS LADSPA plugin collection but it has a problem with selinux - for some reason Ardour is not allowed to load them, sigh, I still have to do research on this so I'll wait a bit before releasing them. I'll see if that also happens with other plugin collections... If you like to excersice the mouse you can try installing yumex for something similar to good 'ol synaptic. More packages will be forthcoming... Enjoy! -- Fernando _______________________________________________ PlanetCCRMA mailing list PlanetCCRMA at ccrma.stanford.edu http://ccrma-mail.stanford.edu/mailman/listinfo/planetccrma From gdk at redhat.com Wed May 3 15:57:44 2006 From: gdk at redhat.com (Greg DeKoenigsberg) Date: Wed, 3 May 2006 11:57:44 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [Fedora-music-list] [Fwd: [PlanetCCRMA] Planet CCRMA menu tree for fcx] (fwd) Message-ID: Check this. --g ------------------------------------------------------------- Greg DeKoenigsberg || Fedora Project || fedoraproject.org Be an Ambassador || http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Ambassadors ------------------------------------------------------------- ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Tue, 02 May 2006 23:08:19 -0700 From: Fernando Lopez-Lezcano To: Greg DeKoenigsberg Cc: nando at ccrma.Stanford.EDU Subject: [Fwd: [PlanetCCRMA] Planet CCRMA menu tree for fcx] Just to keep you up to date on relevant stuff... (let me know the moment I send too much stuff to your account :-) -------- Forwarded Message -------- From: Fernando Lopez-Lezcano To: planetccrma at ccrma.Stanford.EDU Subject: [PlanetCCRMA] Planet CCRMA menu tree for fcx Date: Tue, 02 May 2006 22:50:15 -0700 Hi all... I'm starting work on the Planet CCRMA menu tree for fc5[*] - which will later percolate to previous fc versions (I think I know now what I need to do, at least on fc5, some tests today were successful). It used to be (in fc3) that the menu tree _and_ the desktop entries were all part of the Planet CCRMA menu packages. There were several reasons for this, but all (I think) are historical at this point (mainly because I started working on the menus long after I released the packages and I did not want to rerelease everything just to fix them). It makes sense now to fix this before starting to release more stuff (the "menuable" packages I released are not that many so far), and incorporate the categories into the .desktop files included in the packages themselves. The way this would work is that the most important or unique packages (good luck defining what that is!) would show up automatically in the "Sound and Video" menu, and those, and the rest, would be (more or less) neatly organized in the Planet CCRMA submenu tree. If the "planetccrma-menus" package is not installed you would just get the "Sound and Video" menu with the crucial packages there. There are two aspects to this, one is how to split apps into categories, and the second is what visible names to give the categories. Things can be fixed later but the internal category names in the .desktop files will stay for a while, I imagine. Anyway, a good start is better than nothing. So it would be good to take a look at the old tree to see how it looks today, so, this is what I used to do (comments through the list, "_" would be transformed into " " for the menu text): ALSA_Mixers (probably should be changed to just "Mixers"?, hmm, or "Soundcard control"?, this includes general purpose mixers like gamix and card specific programs like echomixer, hdspmixer, envy24control, etc) Digital_Processing Drumming DSSI_Plugins Graphics Jack_Apps (maybe a better name would be just "Jack"? or "Jack_and_friends"?) LADSPA_Plugins MIDI (sequencers _and_ midi utilities) Miscellanea Multitrack Notation Patch_Bays Players Programming Recorders Sequencers (maybe "Sequencers" is redundant given that we have midi already?, not to my eyes at least for now) Sound_Editors Synthesis (should this be part of "Digital Processing"?) System (this should probably go, it contained only "Synaptic" - which really does not belong there - and I can't think of anything else that belongs here) Trackers Video ("Video" could be split, I guess, but that could be done later) [maybe another category for "measuring instruments"? Like jaaa, japa, kmidimon, etc?, can't think of a proper name for that] Each one of the submenus has entries for starting up the app, and then two additional submenus, one for documentation (with links to the online web pages for each program and local documentation when available), and another one for "extra" applications that could be bumped from the main submenu into the subsubmenu. The submenus don't appear if there's nothing in them. In some occasions there could be documentation links and _no_ entry for the program itself, a perfect example is ecasound. It is a command line utility but very very useful. Having it in the menu somewhere is good because it raises awareness of the program for users that don't venture to the command line. I used to have also another submenu for popping up man pages, probably overkill (and something that could be added later). Applications can map into more than one category of course, I'm attaching a file that has a dump of what my old script created so that you can see what I mean. Some examples: ardour:Jack_Apps ardour:Multitrack ardour:Recorders or should we have an "Audio Workstations" category, whatever that means? rosegarden4:MIDI rosegarden4:Notation rosegarden4:Sequencers zynaddsubfx:Jack_Apps zynaddsubfx:MIDI zynaddsubfx:Synthesis freqtweak:Digital_Processing freqtweak:Jack_Apps libfishsound:Programming libgig:Programming liblo:Programming liblrdf:Programming liblscp:Programming liboggz:Programming ... and more ... Anyway, you get the idea. Obviously any categorization will leave someone unhappy but it is better to have something rather than nothing (as is proven by the humongous "Audio and Video" menu in fc4). I'll move fast on this as it has to be somehow solved before I start releasing more packages for fc5 (each package will have the category names hardwired into its .desktop file). One more problem is the contents of the .desktop entries themselves. Usability is not always a priority for linux audio software developers :-) Some packages, if not started with the proper command line incantation just die without warning and that's not good. For example, Jack clients. Some pop up a window and say something if Jack is not already running, others just die and print something to stderr, which will mean that if you start them from a menu you don't see anything. When I generated the Planet CCRMA specific .desktop entries separately from the packages this was less of a problem as I could, for example, make the command line "qjackctl /usr/bin/ardour" in the .desktop file and then qjackctl would first start jack and then spawn ardour and everyone would be happy. A second invocation of a different program from the menu, for example "qjackctl aeolus -J" would find the first instance of qjackctl and then just start aeolus, etc, etc. But this all predicates on qjackctl being there already, which you could mandate through explicit "Requires:" in the packages, but that's certainly overkill (there's no real need for qjackctl to be there, you could be starting Jack in a terminal and all Jack clients would be perfectly happy!). So I feel inclined to just assume that Jack is actually running (for programs that are Jack clients, of course) and just add the command line switches that some programs need to tell them they should use Jack. That can/will break using those programs from the menu with just ALSA, for example. But well, you can't have everything. Otherwise those programs will break when trying to use Jack. Tricks can be done with scripts so that they capture stderr and pop up a window with its contents when the program exits with an error code but then you have to either include the script everywhere or test for it or whatever and again everything is more complicated which is bad. Anyway, that would be a band-aid and not a cure (which would be to fix the program so that it does reasonable things when run from a menu). Enough for now. Wow, this was long... anyone still reading? :-) Any thoughts? -- Fernando From nando at ccrma.Stanford.EDU Sat May 6 22:20:56 2006 From: nando at ccrma.Stanford.EDU (Fernando Lopez-Lezcano) Date: Sat, 06 May 2006 15:20:56 -0700 Subject: [Fedora-music-list] Re: [PlanetCCRMA] Fedora Extras In-Reply-To: <1146943503.2910.71.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <1146943503.2910.71.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <1146954056.19702.8.camel@cmn3.stanford.edu> On Sat, 2006-05-06 at 12:25 -0700, Anthony Green wrote: > Hi Fernando, > > Andy Shevchenko submitted jack-audio-connection-kit to Fedora Extras > for review a few weeks ago. I didn't see much happening on the > PlanetCCRMA FC5 front, so I subsequently submitted a collection of audio > apps: http://people.redhat.com/green/FE/FC5/ . These are virtually all > updates of your PlanetCCRMA packages (updated upstream sources, spec > files changes for FE compatibility, etc). Oh well, he/you could have copied me, I guess. I _am_ actively working on packages, same thing (new versions, etc, etc). Which spec files have you worked on? Furthermore, I've been emailing with Greg DeKoenigsberg (he's part of the Fedora Extras steering committee) and he set up a mailing list of people interested in getting Planet CCRMA to be a part of Extras... you could also take a look there. > A few months ago there was a discussion on this list about moving some > packages from PlanetCCRMA to Extras. I took the JACK submission as a > cue and started submitting. Sigh, I was not aware that Jack had already been submitted. I have been terribly busy ('till last weekend) and just now I'm having some time to restart work on this. > I believe there's a group of people interested in helping maintain > audio apps in Extras. What is your position on this now? No problem at all. The more people that participate the better. It'd be nice to be aware of what's happening. > I just read your recent post about starting to work on the FC5 > PlanetCCRMA. If I may be so bold, why not use this opportunity to push > apps/libraries into FE, while maintaining the custom kernel in > PlanetCCRMA? The Extras contributor infrastructure is stable and easy > to use. There's also been discussion of creating an Audio SIG for > Extras (with our own list, wiki site, etc). What do you think? As I said, no problem. But I would appreciate if people don't reinvent the wheel and create specs from scratch given that they are available from Planet CCRMA (and I have worked on them for so long). I have to become a member myself of Extras contributors and was hoping to do that "real soon now". -- Fernando From nando at ccrma.Stanford.EDU Sat May 6 22:24:12 2006 From: nando at ccrma.Stanford.EDU (Fernando Lopez-Lezcano) Date: Sat, 06 May 2006 15:24:12 -0700 Subject: [Fedora-music-list] Re: [PlanetCCRMA] Fedora Extras In-Reply-To: <1146943503.2910.71.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <1146943503.2910.71.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <1146954252.19702.12.camel@cmn3.stanford.edu> On Sat, 2006-05-06 at 12:25 -0700, Anthony Green wrote: > [MUNCH] > PlanetCCRMA? The Extras contributor infrastructure is stable and easy > to use. There's also been discussion of creating an Audio SIG for > Extras (with our own list, wiki site, etc). What do you think? At least the list is already there: Fedora-music-list mailing list Fedora-music-list at redhat.com http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-music-list -- Fernando From green at redhat.com Sat May 6 23:14:42 2006 From: green at redhat.com (Anthony Green) Date: Sat, 06 May 2006 16:14:42 -0700 Subject: [Fedora-music-list] Intro & packages submitted Message-ID: <1146957282.2910.112.camel@localhost.localdomain> Thanks again, Fernando, for pointing out the existence of this list. I missed the intros from last month, so here's mine... My name is Anthony Green. I live in Portland, OR and have worked at Red Hat (and Cygnus prior to that) for over 10 years, although in a non-Engineering capacity for most of that time. I package a small handful of apps for Fedora Extras (mostly java-related). For the curious, here's a summary of packages I've submitted to FE for review... ardour https://bugzilla.redhat.com/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=189315 caps LADSPA plugins https://bugzilla.redhat.com/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=190045 dssi https://bugzilla.redhat.com/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=189892 fluidsynth https://bugzilla.redhat.com/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=189886 hexter-dssi https://bugzilla.redhat.com/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=190027 hydrogen https://bugzilla.redhat.com/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=190040 lash https://bugzilla.redhat.com/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=189884 liblo https://bugzilla.redhat.com/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=189891 liblrdf https://bugzilla.redhat.com/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=189313 raptor (This one has been ACCEPTED) swh-plugins (This one has been ACCEPTED) vkeybd https://bugzilla.redhat.com/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=189889 whysynth-dssi https://bugzilla.redhat.com/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=190029 Many of these depend on Andy's jack-audio-connection-kit submission. https://bugzilla.redhat.com/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=183912 I think the biggest problem right now is the FE sponsor/reviewer bottleneck. jack-audio-connection-kit has been in the works for two months now. AG From nando at ccrma.Stanford.EDU Sat May 6 23:38:26 2006 From: nando at ccrma.Stanford.EDU (Fernando Lopez-Lezcano) Date: Sat, 06 May 2006 16:38:26 -0700 Subject: [Fedora-music-list] Re: [PlanetCCRMA] Fedora Extras In-Reply-To: <1146955787.2910.91.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <1146943503.2910.71.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1146954056.19702.8.camel@cmn3.stanford.edu> <1146955787.2910.91.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <1146958706.19955.16.camel@cmn3.stanford.edu> On Sat, 2006-05-06 at 15:49 -0700, Anthony Green wrote: > On Sat, 2006-05-06 at 15:20 -0700, Fernando Lopez-Lezcano wrote: > > Which spec files have you worked on? > > They're all listed here: http://people.redhat.com/green/FE/FC5 Hey great!! Too bad you did not sync with me, I've been working this two last weeks on pretty much the same stuff. But there are things that I don't have which is great! What has delayed me this past week is work on the menu system (I'm pretty much done and I was going to release a bunch of packages later today). If I may suggest a couple of things after a quick look, ladcca is not longer needed - I imagine it is there only as a result of previous builds? I would drop qjackconnect in favor of qjackctl, the later is the canonical jack server control app (and also sports a midi patchbay). I added a patch for lash so that it does not need an entry in /etc/services for the lash service (it will use the default instead). You will be able to pick this later today from the srpm. DSSI is now up to 0.9.1 and fluidsynth-dssi is a separate package (finally!). Are you planning on packaging the Hydrogen kits separately? I used to have a separate package but I merged them into the main package a while back... the example drumkits and demo songs are very useful for demos, with them (or at least some of them) it is easy to just fire up hydrogen and get sound out of it. Another question... have you tried caps with ardour? I'm having problems with that combination, selinux complains about something and the caps collection does not get loaded at all. > > > A few months ago there was a discussion on this list about moving some > > > packages from PlanetCCRMA to Extras. I took the JACK submission as a > > > cue and started submitting. > > > > Sigh, I was not aware that Jack had already been submitted. > > Yes, two months ago: > https://bugzilla.redhat.com/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=183912 > > I only noticed last month. I didn't... I could have answered a lot of those questions really fast... What should be packaged today, at least till that patch makes it into cvs (that was going to happen a couple of days ago) is the clock_fix branch of Jack cvs. Otherwise Jack will have problems in Athlon X2 machines... > > As I said, no problem. But I would appreciate if people don't reinvent > > the wheel and create specs from scratch given that they are available > > from Planet CCRMA (and I have worked on them for so long). > > Yes, of course. You've done great work. All of the packages I've > submitted are based on your spec files, with the changelog history > preserved. See the ardour spec file, for example: > http://people.redhat.com/green/FE/FC5/ardour.spec Thanks, most probably most of it will be "trimmed", right? There was a discussion long ago about keeping only a certain ammount of history in the changelog. I don't know what became of that - I think they were scavenging for space to avoid including one more disk in the base distro. -- Fernando From green at redhat.com Sat May 6 23:55:42 2006 From: green at redhat.com (Anthony Green) Date: Sat, 06 May 2006 16:55:42 -0700 Subject: [Fedora-music-list] Re: [PlanetCCRMA] Fedora Extras In-Reply-To: <1146958706.19955.16.camel@cmn3.stanford.edu> References: <1146943503.2910.71.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1146954056.19702.8.camel@cmn3.stanford.edu> <1146955787.2910.91.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1146958706.19955.16.camel@cmn3.stanford.edu> Message-ID: <1146959742.2910.122.camel@localhost.localdomain> On Sat, 2006-05-06 at 16:38 -0700, Fernando Lopez-Lezcano wrote: > Hey great!! Too bad you did not sync with me, I've been working this two > last weeks on pretty much the same stuff. But there are things that I > don't have which is great! What has delayed me this past week is work on > the menu system (I'm pretty much done and I was going to release a bunch > of packages later today). I'll see if there's anything I should take from your spec files. > If I may suggest a couple of things after a quick look, ladcca is not > longer needed - I imagine it is there only as a result of previous > builds? Yes, I didn't submit that to Extras and don't plan to. I built it for vkeybd, but then realized it would better to port vkeydb to LASH instead (which I did). > I would drop qjackconnect in favor of qjackctl, the later is the > canonical jack server control app (and also sports a midi patchbay). Yes, I'm not planning on submitting qjackconnect to Extras either. My recent post to fedora-music-list lists the packages I've submitted so far. > I > added a patch for lash so that it does not need an entry > in /etc/services for the lash service (it will use the default instead). > You will be able to pick this later today from the srpm. I'll grab that. > DSSI is now up > to 0.9.1 and fluidsynth-dssi is a separate package (finally!). Ok, thanks for pointing that out. > Are you > planning on packaging the Hydrogen kits separately? I used to have a > separate package but I merged them into the main package a while back... > the example drumkits and demo songs are very useful for demos, with them > (or at least some of them) it is easy to just fire up hydrogen and get > sound out of it. I didn't know there was a PlanetCCRMA hydrogen package, so I wrote this one from scratch. I bundled everything in the hydrogen package (kits & demos), for the same reason. > Another question... have you tried caps with ardour? I'm having problems > with that combination, selinux complains about something and the caps > collection does not get loaded at all. I'm one of those bad hackers who disables selinux. I'll enable and see what happens. > What should be packaged today, at least till that patch makes it into > cvs (that was going to happen a couple of days ago) is the clock_fix > branch of Jack cvs. Otherwise Jack will have problems in Athlon X2 > machines... You should mention this here: https://bugzilla.redhat.com/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=183912 > Thanks, most probably most of it will be "trimmed", right? There was a > discussion long ago about keeping only a certain ammount of history in > the changelog. I don't know what became of that - I think they were > scavenging for space to avoid including one more disk in the base > distro. Hmm.. I have no plans to trim the history. Perhaps somebody will mention this during the review bugzilla. AG From nando at ccrma.Stanford.EDU Sun May 7 00:36:53 2006 From: nando at ccrma.Stanford.EDU (Fernando Lopez-Lezcano) Date: Sat, 06 May 2006 17:36:53 -0700 Subject: [Fedora-music-list] Re: [PlanetCCRMA] Fedora Extras In-Reply-To: <1146959742.2910.122.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <1146943503.2910.71.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1146954056.19702.8.camel@cmn3.stanford.edu> <1146955787.2910.91.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1146958706.19955.16.camel@cmn3.stanford.edu> <1146959742.2910.122.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <1146962213.19955.32.camel@cmn3.stanford.edu> On Sat, 2006-05-06 at 16:55 -0700, Anthony Green wrote: > On Sat, 2006-05-06 at 16:38 -0700, Fernando Lopez-Lezcano wrote: > > Hey great!! Too bad you did not sync with me, I've been working this two > > last weeks on pretty much the same stuff. But there are things that I > > don't have which is great! What has delayed me this past week is work on > > the menu system (I'm pretty much done and I was going to release a bunch > > of packages later today). > > I'll see if there's anything I should take from your spec files. And viceversa, I see you did a bunch of improvements in the ardour spec file! BTW, you may know something about this... I'm working on what used to be the Planet CCRMA menu. I had this on fc3, then could not make it work as is in fc4 but it is time I readded it, and I just did that for fc5 (and will percolate to fc4). It basically an (optional) submenu of the Audio/Video applications submenu where the apps are categorized. But the question is about the Fedora Audio/Video menu. Currently there is no "More Audio/Video Applications" entry in the applications menu xml file, but there is a "Multimedia-More.directory" directory file. So I'm adding a merged "More..." submenu in my optional planetccrma-menus package so that I can push "not so important apps" from the main Audio/Video menu - otherwise it becomes really really long with the full set of Planet CCRMA applications (if the optional planetccrma-menus is not installed they will just not appear in the menu system). What would be the category for those? I seem to remember something like this used to be: AudioVideo-Extra. Would this be fine? (I'm doing that for now) > [MUNCH] > > I would drop qjackconnect in favor of qjackctl, the later is the > > canonical jack server control app (and also sports a midi patchbay). > > Yes, I'm not planning on submitting qjackconnect to Extras either. My > recent post to fedora-music-list lists the packages I've submitted so > far. Oh, I had not seen it. Sigh, I'm soooo behind on so many fronts :-) > > I added a patch for lash so that it does not need an entry > > in /etc/services for the lash service (it will use the default instead). > > You will be able to pick this later today from the srpm. > > I'll grab that. > > > DSSI is now up > > to 0.9.1 and fluidsynth-dssi is a separate package (finally!). > > Ok, thanks for pointing that out. > > > Are you > > planning on packaging the Hydrogen kits separately? I used to have a > > separate package but I merged them into the main package a while back... > > the example drumkits and demo songs are very useful for demos, with them > > (or at least some of them) it is easy to just fire up hydrogen and get > > sound out of it. > > I didn't know there was a PlanetCCRMA hydrogen package, so I wrote this > one from scratch. I bundled everything in the hydrogen package (kits & > demos), for the same reason. Hmmm, maybe I'm looking at the wrong spec file, it looks like your hydrogen package does not have any drumkits in it? > > Another question... have you tried caps with ardour? I'm having problems > > with that combination, selinux complains about something and the caps > > collection does not get loaded at all. > > I'm one of those bad hackers who disables selinux. I'll enable and see > what happens. Let me know what happens and if you find a workaround. I imagine some sort of magic chcon has to be done on the libraries at build time... > > What should be packaged today, at least till that patch makes it into > > cvs (that was going to happen a couple of days ago) is the clock_fix > > branch of Jack cvs. Otherwise Jack will have problems in Athlon X2 > > machines... > > You should mention this here: > https://bugzilla.redhat.com/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=183912 I will, thanks for pointing this out to me. -- Fernando From green at redhat.com Sun May 7 01:10:19 2006 From: green at redhat.com (Anthony Green) Date: Sat, 06 May 2006 18:10:19 -0700 Subject: [Fedora-music-list] Re: [PlanetCCRMA] Fedora Extras In-Reply-To: <1146962213.19955.32.camel@cmn3.stanford.edu> References: <1146943503.2910.71.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1146954056.19702.8.camel@cmn3.stanford.edu> <1146955787.2910.91.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1146958706.19955.16.camel@cmn3.stanford.edu> <1146959742.2910.122.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1146962213.19955.32.camel@cmn3.stanford.edu> Message-ID: <1146964220.2910.132.camel@localhost.localdomain> On Sat, 2006-05-06 at 17:36 -0700, Fernando Lopez-Lezcano wrote: > And viceversa, I see you did a bunch of improvements in the ardour spec > file! The Extras contribution process, while often slow, is extremely useful. > What would be the category for those? I seem to remember something like > this used to be: AudioVideo-Extra. Would this be > fine? (I'm doing that for now) I'm really not an expert in these things. My suggestion is to contribute it to Fedora Extras and it will be discussed as part of the review process. > Hmmm, maybe I'm looking at the wrong spec file, it looks like your > hydrogen package does not have any drumkits in it? They all get picked up in the %files section by... %{_datadir}/hydrogen AG From florin at andrei.myip.org Mon May 8 19:28:57 2006 From: florin at andrei.myip.org (Florin Andrei) Date: Mon, 08 May 2006 12:28:57 -0700 Subject: [Fedora-music-list] congrats Message-ID: <1147116537.11502.15.camel@stantz.corp.sgi.com> I always thought that merging PlanetCCRMA and Extras makes a lot of sense, and I also made some noises on the Planet mailing list. I'm glad to see that something has been started. -- Florin Andrei http://florin.myip.org/ From gdk at redhat.com Mon May 8 19:38:13 2006 From: gdk at redhat.com (Greg DeKoenigsberg) Date: Mon, 8 May 2006 15:38:13 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [Fedora-music-list] congrats In-Reply-To: <1147116537.11502.15.camel@stantz.corp.sgi.com> References: <1147116537.11502.15.camel@stantz.corp.sgi.com> Message-ID: Does that mean you're volunteering to support a few of the packages? ;-) --g ------------------------------------------------------------- Greg DeKoenigsberg || Fedora Project || fedoraproject.org Be an Ambassador || http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Ambassadors ------------------------------------------------------------- On Mon, 8 May 2006, Florin Andrei wrote: > I always thought that merging PlanetCCRMA and Extras makes a lot of > sense, and I also made some noises on the Planet mailing list. I'm glad > to see that something has been started. > > -- > Florin Andrei > > http://florin.myip.org/ > > > _______________________________________________ > Fedora-music-list mailing list > Fedora-music-list at redhat.com > http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-music-list > From florin at andrei.myip.org Mon May 8 19:51:59 2006 From: florin at andrei.myip.org (Florin Andrei) Date: Mon, 08 May 2006 12:51:59 -0700 Subject: [Fedora-music-list] congrats In-Reply-To: References: <1147116537.11502.15.camel@stantz.corp.sgi.com> Message-ID: <1147117919.12705.0.camel@stantz.corp.sgi.com> On Mon, 2006-05-08 at 15:38 -0400, Greg DeKoenigsberg wrote: > Does that mean you're volunteering to support a few of the packages? ;-) I am extremely busy right now, but I will once the emergency passes. -- Florin Andrei http://florin.myip.org/ From green at redhat.com Mon May 8 21:16:53 2006 From: green at redhat.com (Anthony Green) Date: Mon, 08 May 2006 14:16:53 -0700 Subject: [Fedora-music-list] package naming question: muse -vs - MusE Message-ID: <1147123014.2910.248.camel@localhost.localdomain> There are some discussions about merging parts of PlanetCCRMA into Fedora Extras. One of the problems has to do with package namespace conflicts. For instance, PlanetCCRMA has had a "muse" package for many years (http://www.muse-sequencer.org). But now FE has an emacs extension package called "muse". So, assuming the emacs extension package can't be renamed, we need a new name for the musical muse package. One of the suggestions was to use the official project spelling of "MusE" for the package name. Do the Extras packaging guidelines allow this (having both MusE and muse package)? AG From notting at redhat.com Mon May 8 21:32:08 2006 From: notting at redhat.com (Bill Nottingham) Date: Mon, 8 May 2006 17:32:08 -0400 Subject: [Fedora-music-list] Re: package naming question: muse -vs - MusE In-Reply-To: <1147123014.2910.248.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <1147123014.2910.248.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <20060508213208.GB23374@devserv.devel.redhat.com> Anthony Green (green at redhat.com) said: > There are some discussions about merging parts of PlanetCCRMA into > Fedora Extras. One of the problems has to do with package namespace > conflicts. For instance, PlanetCCRMA has had a "muse" package for many > years (http://www.muse-sequencer.org). But now FE has an emacs > extension package called "muse". So, assuming the emacs extension > package can't be renamed, we need a new name for the musical muse > package. > > One of the suggestions was to use the official project spelling of > "MusE" for the package name. Do the Extras packaging guidelines allow > this (having both MusE and muse package)? Some combination of CVS, bugzilla, and/or the buildsystem I suspect would break. Frankly, I'd rename the emacs thing emacs-muse, but that's just me. :) Bill From green at redhat.com Mon May 8 21:48:23 2006 From: green at redhat.com (Anthony Green) Date: Mon, 08 May 2006 14:48:23 -0700 Subject: [Fedora-music-list] Re: package naming question: muse -vs - MusE In-Reply-To: <20060508213208.GB23374@devserv.devel.redhat.com> References: <1147123014.2910.248.camel@localhost.localdomain> <20060508213208.GB23374@devserv.devel.redhat.com> Message-ID: <1147124903.2910.263.camel@localhost.localdomain> On Mon, 2006-05-08 at 17:32 -0400, Bill Nottingham wrote: > Some combination of CVS, bugzilla, and/or the buildsystem I suspect would > break. > > Frankly, I'd rename the emacs thing emacs-muse, but that's just me. :) It's not just you. A few of us are of the same opinion. Unfortunately the emacs muse package is now in Extras. Is it too late to rename it? The name is a problem for anybody with mixed Extras & PlanetCCRMA repositories. AG From ajs at ajs.com Mon May 8 23:12:39 2006 From: ajs at ajs.com (Aaron Sherman) Date: Mon, 08 May 2006 19:12:39 -0400 Subject: [Fedora-music-list] Re: package naming question: muse -vs - MusE In-Reply-To: <20060508213208.GB23374@devserv.devel.redhat.com> References: <1147123014.2910.248.camel@localhost.localdomain> <20060508213208.GB23374@devserv.devel.redhat.com> Message-ID: <445FD067.2010605@ajs.com> Bill Nottingham wrote: > Anthony Green (green at redhat.com) said: > >> There are some discussions about merging parts of PlanetCCRMA into >> Fedora Extras. One of the problems has to do with package namespace >> conflicts. For instance, PlanetCCRMA has had a "muse" package for many >> years (http://www.muse-sequencer.org). But now FE has an emacs >> extension package called "muse". >> >> One of the suggestions was to use the official project spelling of >> "MusE" for the package name. Do the Extras packaging guidelines allow >> this (having both MusE and muse package)? >> Some combination of CVS, bugzilla, and/or the buildsystem I suspect would >> break. >> >> Frankly, I'd rename the emacs thing emacs-muse, but that's just me. :) >> Why not call the CCRMA packages "-CCRMA"? That way there's no conflicts. If this is just a spec file change, it won't affect CVS, and it's a relatively trivial build change. As for Bugzilla... well, I don't know what kind of automatic hooks the software has into submitting bug reports, but it should not be hard to strip the trailing -CCRMA for submitting. However, in this one case, I agree with the idea that if muse is an emacs add-on, it should probably be emacs-muse. From Christian.Iseli at licr.org Mon May 8 22:39:00 2006 From: Christian.Iseli at licr.org (Christian.Iseli at licr.org) Date: Tue, 09 May 2006 00:39:00 +0200 Subject: [Fedora-music-list] Re: package naming question: muse -vs - MusE In-Reply-To: Message from Bill Nottingham of "Mon, 08 May 2006 17:32:08 EDT." <20060508213208.GB23374@devserv.devel.redhat.com> Message-ID: <200605082332.k48NVxed008677@mx1.redhat.com> notting at redhat.com said: > Anthony Green (green at redhat.com) said: > > One of the suggestions was to use the official project spelling of > > "MusE" for the package name. Do the Extras packaging guidelines allow > > this (having both MusE and muse package)? Let's please not go that route... even though I can't find anything in the guidelines that mention this case (yet...) > Some combination of CVS, bugzilla, and/or the buildsystem I suspect would > break. Yes, and for the end user it might get quite confusing... > Frankly, I'd rename the emacs thing emacs-muse, but that's just me. :) Not just you. If RPM can handle this, maybe an emacs-muse package that Provides muse for a short while... I think spot wanted to explicitly mention emacs/xemacs in the addon packages section. Cheers, Christian From florin at andrei.myip.org Mon May 8 23:46:33 2006 From: florin at andrei.myip.org (Florin Andrei) Date: Mon, 08 May 2006 16:46:33 -0700 Subject: [Fedora-music-list] Re: package naming question: muse -vs - MusE In-Reply-To: <445FD067.2010605@ajs.com> References: <1147123014.2910.248.camel@localhost.localdomain> <20060508213208.GB23374@devserv.devel.redhat.com> <445FD067.2010605@ajs.com> Message-ID: <1147131993.12705.12.camel@stantz.corp.sgi.com> On Mon, 2006-05-08 at 19:12 -0400, Aaron Sherman wrote: > However, in this one case, I agree with the idea that if muse is an > emacs add-on, it should probably be emacs-muse. A similar situation exists currently in the CCRMA repo - the LADSPA plugins are not called ladspa- but instead just . That can be confusing at times. There should be a rule or something to give names to the plugins and add-ons based on the parent application. -- Florin Andrei http://florin.myip.org/ From ed at edblack.com Mon May 8 23:50:46 2006 From: ed at edblack.com (Ed Black) Date: Mon, 08 May 2006 19:50:46 -0400 Subject: [Fedora-music-list] Congratulations! Message-ID: <445FD956.2050204@edblack.com> When I was a grad student at Carnegie Tech (now Carnegie Mellon) I used to dream of a cadre of programmers whose sole aim was to make the world a better place. Now that I am sixty, my coding days are over, but with every day Linux make my dream come true. We are almost there, keep up the great work and a heartfelt congratulations. Yer Pal, Ed Black, Ph.D. From green at redhat.com Tue May 9 01:31:57 2006 From: green at redhat.com (Anthony Green) Date: Mon, 08 May 2006 18:31:57 -0700 Subject: [Fedora-music-list] Re: package naming question: muse -vs - MusE In-Reply-To: <1147131993.12705.12.camel@stantz.corp.sgi.com> References: <1147123014.2910.248.camel@localhost.localdomain> <20060508213208.GB23374@devserv.devel.redhat.com> <445FD067.2010605@ajs.com> <1147131993.12705.12.camel@stantz.corp.sgi.com> Message-ID: <1147138317.2910.276.camel@localhost.localdomain> On Mon, 2006-05-08 at 16:46 -0700, Florin Andrei wrote: > There should be a rule or something to give names to the plugins and > add-ons based on the parent application. I think something like that makes sense. When I submitted hexter and whysynth for review, I called them hexter-dssi and whysynth-dssi. AG From nando at ccrma.Stanford.EDU Tue May 9 01:38:31 2006 From: nando at ccrma.Stanford.EDU (Fernando Lopez-Lezcano) Date: Mon, 08 May 2006 18:38:31 -0700 Subject: [Fedora-music-list] Re: package naming question: muse -vs - MusE In-Reply-To: <1147131993.12705.12.camel@stantz.corp.sgi.com> References: <1147123014.2910.248.camel@localhost.localdomain> <20060508213208.GB23374@devserv.devel.redhat.com> <445FD067.2010605@ajs.com> <1147131993.12705.12.camel@stantz.corp.sgi.com> Message-ID: <1147138711.5758.8.camel@cmn3.stanford.edu> On Mon, 2006-05-08 at 16:46 -0700, Florin Andrei wrote: > On Mon, 2006-05-08 at 19:12 -0400, Aaron Sherman wrote: > > > However, in this one case, I agree with the idea that if muse is an > > emacs add-on, it should probably be emacs-muse. > > A similar situation exists currently in the CCRMA repo - the LADSPA > plugins are not called ladspa- but instead just > . That can be confusing at times. Hmmm, is that a real rule for Fedora packages? See: http://fedoraproject.org/extras/5/i386/repodata/repoview/swh-plugins-0-0.4.14-6.fc5.html -- Fernando From nando at ccrma.Stanford.EDU Tue May 9 01:52:46 2006 From: nando at ccrma.Stanford.EDU (Fernando Lopez-Lezcano) Date: Mon, 08 May 2006 18:52:46 -0700 Subject: [Fedora-music-list] Re: package naming question: muse -vs - MusE In-Reply-To: <445FD067.2010605@ajs.com> References: <1147123014.2910.248.camel@localhost.localdomain> <20060508213208.GB23374@devserv.devel.redhat.com> <445FD067.2010605@ajs.com> Message-ID: <1147139566.5758.14.camel@cmn3.stanford.edu> On Mon, 2006-05-08 at 19:12 -0400, Aaron Sherman wrote: > Bill Nottingham wrote: > > Anthony Green (green at redhat.com) said: > > > >> There are some discussions about merging parts of PlanetCCRMA into > >> Fedora Extras. One of the problems has to do with package namespace > >> conflicts. For instance, PlanetCCRMA has had a "muse" package for many > >> years (http://www.muse-sequencer.org). But now FE has an emacs > >> extension package called "muse". > >> > >> One of the suggestions was to use the official project spelling of > >> "MusE" for the package name. Do the Extras packaging guidelines allow > >> this (having both MusE and muse package)? > >> Some combination of CVS, bugzilla, and/or the buildsystem I suspect would > >> break. > >> > >> Frankly, I'd rename the emacs thing emacs-muse, but that's just me. :) > > Why not call the CCRMA packages "-CCRMA"? That way there's no > conflicts. Because they are not part of CCRMA. Same reason for not naming extras packages "extras-whatever". -- Fernando > If this is just a spec file change, it won't affect CVS, and > it's a relatively trivial build change. As for Bugzilla... well, I don't > know what kind of automatic hooks the software has into submitting bug > reports, but it should not be hard to strip the trailing -CCRMA for > submitting. > > However, in this one case, I agree with the idea that if muse is an > emacs add-on, it should probably be emacs-muse. From green at redhat.com Tue May 9 01:58:43 2006 From: green at redhat.com (Anthony Green) Date: Mon, 08 May 2006 18:58:43 -0700 Subject: [Fedora-music-list] Re: package naming question: muse -vs - MusE In-Reply-To: <1147138711.5758.8.camel@cmn3.stanford.edu> References: <1147123014.2910.248.camel@localhost.localdomain> <20060508213208.GB23374@devserv.devel.redhat.com> <445FD067.2010605@ajs.com> <1147131993.12705.12.camel@stantz.corp.sgi.com> <1147138711.5758.8.camel@cmn3.stanford.edu> Message-ID: <1147139923.2910.292.camel@localhost.localdomain> On Mon, 2006-05-08 at 18:38 -0700, Fernando Lopez-Lezcano wrote: > > A similar situation exists currently in the CCRMA repo - the LADSPA > > plugins are not called ladspa- but instead just > > . That can be confusing at times. > > Hmmm, is that a real rule for Fedora packages? > See: > http://fedoraproject.org/extras/5/i386/repodata/repoview/swh-plugins-0-0.4.14-6.fc5.html No, it's not a rule. Every once in a while there are package name rule discussions (my personal "favorite" is perennial java-FOO discussion), but, AFAIK, there have never been rules for plugins, etc. When I added swh-plugins to Extras, I just used the name from CCRMA. If I were to do it from scratch, I think maybe I would have used swh-ladspa, or something like that. But I don't think it matters enough to change now. AG From nando at ccrma.Stanford.EDU Tue May 9 02:09:23 2006 From: nando at ccrma.Stanford.EDU (Fernando Lopez-Lezcano) Date: Mon, 08 May 2006 19:09:23 -0700 Subject: [Fedora-music-list] Re: package naming question: muse -vs - MusE In-Reply-To: <1147139923.2910.292.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <1147123014.2910.248.camel@localhost.localdomain> <20060508213208.GB23374@devserv.devel.redhat.com> <445FD067.2010605@ajs.com> <1147131993.12705.12.camel@stantz.corp.sgi.com> <1147138711.5758.8.camel@cmn3.stanford.edu> <1147139923.2910.292.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <1147140563.5758.21.camel@cmn3.stanford.edu> On Mon, 2006-05-08 at 18:58 -0700, Anthony Green wrote: > On Mon, 2006-05-08 at 18:38 -0700, Fernando Lopez-Lezcano wrote: > > > A similar situation exists currently in the CCRMA repo - the LADSPA > > > plugins are not called ladspa- but instead just > > > . That can be confusing at times. > > > > Hmmm, is that a real rule for Fedora packages? > > See: > > http://fedoraproject.org/extras/5/i386/repodata/repoview/swh-plugins-0-0.4.14-6.fc5.html > > No, it's not a rule. Every once in a while there are package name rule > discussions (my personal "favorite" is perennial java-FOO discussion), > but, AFAIK, there have never been rules for plugins, etc. > > When I added swh-plugins to Extras, I just used the name from CCRMA. If > I were to do it from scratch, I think maybe I would have used > swh-ladspa, or something like that. But I don't think it matters > enough to change now. Ok... I'm not sure if it would be worth releasing the plugins I'm about to release for fc5 (in the Planet CCRMA world so far) with ladspa-whatever naming or not. Most probably not till there is some consensus (otherwise I may be forced to switch again to something else - would not be the first time something like that happened to me :-). [I already have something like this, I name the pd external packages pd-whatever] -- Fernando From mojofunk at gmail.com Tue May 9 06:31:54 2006 From: mojofunk at gmail.com (Tim Mayberry) Date: Tue, 9 May 2006 16:31:54 +1000 Subject: [Fedora-music-list] Alsa tools and firmware Message-ID: <4bb03be40605082331va2f91a3i966bcb4eea19e1ef@mail.gmail.com> Hello all, It seems the alsa-tools package in fedora extras is crippled as I found out a little while ago https://bugzilla.redhat.com/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=186858 and there is no alsa-firmware package in FE. This is a bit of a problem for people like myself who use audio devices that need firmware to be loaded into the device before it can be used. In the past I used the planet CCRMA alsa packages and more recently I built and installed the alsa-tools and alsa-firmware packages from source tarballs because at the time planet CCRMA didn't support FC5. Although I greatly appreciate the work of Fernando and others at CCRMA, I don't really like the idea of replacing the whole alsa stack when as far as I'm aware it isn't really necessary. I believe the alsa-firmware package is not available in FE because of policy, assuming that is still the case it would mean that the alsa-firmware package would need to be hosted in an external repository. I'm not aware of a precedent of a package in the Fedora Extras repository depending on a package in an external repository but it doesn't sound like a good idea if it can be avoided. In this case it can by removing the crippled alsa-tools package from Fedora Extras and keeping it an external repository along with the alsa-firmware package. I'm not sure if this would be the best solution or if there are issues that meant it wouldn't be possible but I would like to help in making it easier for Fedora to support these devices as getting them to work at the moment is frustrating(at least to me) and beyond the capability of what I would expect from the "average user". Thoughts and ideas welcome... Tim. From fedora at leemhuis.info Tue May 9 07:24:59 2006 From: fedora at leemhuis.info (Thorsten Leemhuis) Date: Tue, 09 May 2006 09:24:59 +0200 Subject: [Fedora-music-list] Alsa tools and firmware In-Reply-To: <4bb03be40605082331va2f91a3i966bcb4eea19e1ef@mail.gmail.com> References: <4bb03be40605082331va2f91a3i966bcb4eea19e1ef@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1147159499.4115.69.camel@thl.ct.heise.de> Am Dienstag, den 09.05.2006, 16:31 +1000 schrieb Tim Mayberry: > It seems the alsa-tools package in fedora extras is crippled as I > found out a little while ago > https://bugzilla.redhat.com/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=186858 and there > is no alsa-firmware package in FE. That partly my fault. > This is a bit of a problem for people like myself who use audio > devices that need firmware to be loaded into the device before it can > be used. In the past I used the planet CCRMA alsa packages and more > recently I built and installed the alsa-tools and alsa-firmware > packages from source tarballs because at the time planet CCRMA didn't > support FC5. The old plan was to move alsa-firmware to livna. The current plan is to solve the problems with alsa-firmware and ship what can be shipped. Someone (Legal, FESCo) simply has to say what files from alsa-firmware are okay for Extras, and what not. The last I heard was this: ---- > I maintained some alsa-firmware in the old fedora.us days. During the > transition to Fedora Extras the package got "lost" -- it was unclear if > the files in it were okay for the official Fedora Extras. See > https://bugzilla.redhat.com/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=143249#c3 > > We dropped it then and forwarded the issue to legal. It got lost or was > forgotten, I can't remember. But I'd like to get this solved now that > someone asked for a Extras package of alsa-firmware in bugzilla. > > So, where were the problems? Here is the main one: > > > $ file ./mixartloader/miXart8.elf > > ./mixartloader/miXart8.elf: ELF 32-bit MSB executable, PowerPC or cisco 4500, version 1 (SYSV), statically linked, not stripped That is a pretty big problem. Some of this is probably ok for FE, but only those bits which are not libraries or binaries. ---- I got distracted at that point -- so there is no real list what's oky for Extras and what not. > Although I greatly appreciate the work of Fernando and others at > CCRMA, I don't really like the idea of replacing the whole alsa stack > when as far as I'm aware it isn't really necessary. I believe the > alsa-firmware package is not available in FE because of policy, > assuming that is still the case it would mean that the alsa-firmware > package would need to be hosted in an external repository. Livna is willing to help here for those bits that can't be in Extras. > I'm not aware of a precedent of a package in the Fedora Extras > repository depending on a package in an external repository [...] Not possible. > In this case it > can by removing the crippled alsa-tools package from Fedora Extras and > keeping it an external repository along with the alsa-firmware > package. We should split alsa-firmware -- the "mostly free" parts should land in Extras, the others in Livna. Are you interested in doing this. I simply have no time for it ATM, never really was interested this alsa-firmware stuff and I don't even have hardware to test. Are you interested in driving this forward? You can of course count on my help. CU thl From gdk at redhat.com Tue May 9 14:34:13 2006 From: gdk at redhat.com (Greg DeKoenigsberg) Date: Tue, 9 May 2006 10:34:13 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [Fedora-music-list] Alsa tools and firmware In-Reply-To: <4bb03be40605082331va2f91a3i966bcb4eea19e1ef@mail.gmail.com> References: <4bb03be40605082331va2f91a3i966bcb4eea19e1ef@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Sounds like the fundamental question to be answered is whether alsa-firmware can be packaged in Extras-land. From the bug, looks like Thorsten is on it. --g ------------------------------------------------------------- Greg DeKoenigsberg || Fedora Project || fedoraproject.org Be an Ambassador || http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Ambassadors ------------------------------------------------------------- On Tue, 9 May 2006, Tim Mayberry wrote: > Hello all, > > It seems the alsa-tools package in fedora extras is crippled as I > found out a little while ago > https://bugzilla.redhat.com/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=186858 and there > is no alsa-firmware package in FE. > > This is a bit of a problem for people like myself who use audio > devices that need firmware to be loaded into the device before it can > be used. In the past I used the planet CCRMA alsa packages and more > recently I built and installed the alsa-tools and alsa-firmware > packages from source tarballs because at the time planet CCRMA didn't > support FC5. > > Although I greatly appreciate the work of Fernando and others at > CCRMA, I don't really like the idea of replacing the whole alsa stack > when as far as I'm aware it isn't really necessary. I believe the > alsa-firmware package is not available in FE because of policy, > assuming that is still the case it would mean that the alsa-firmware > package would need to be hosted in an external repository. > > I'm not aware of a precedent of a package in the Fedora Extras > repository depending on a package in an external repository but it > doesn't sound like a good idea if it can be avoided. In this case it > can by removing the crippled alsa-tools package from Fedora Extras and > keeping it an external repository along with the alsa-firmware > package. > > I'm not sure if this would be the best solution or if there are issues > that meant it wouldn't be possible but I would like to help in making > it easier for Fedora to support these devices as getting them to work > at the moment is frustrating(at least to me) and beyond the capability > of what I would expect from the "average user". > > Thoughts and ideas welcome... > > Tim. > > _______________________________________________ > Fedora-music-list mailing list > Fedora-music-list at redhat.com > http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-music-list > From nando at ccrma.Stanford.EDU Tue May 9 20:01:08 2006 From: nando at ccrma.Stanford.EDU (Fernando Lopez-Lezcano) Date: Tue, 09 May 2006 13:01:08 -0700 Subject: [Fedora-music-list] congrats In-Reply-To: <1147117919.12705.0.camel@stantz.corp.sgi.com> References: <1147116537.11502.15.camel@stantz.corp.sgi.com> <1147117919.12705.0.camel@stantz.corp.sgi.com> Message-ID: <1147204868.22392.26.camel@cmn3.stanford.edu> On Mon, 2006-05-08 at 12:51 -0700, Florin Andrei wrote: > On Mon, 2006-05-08 at 15:38 -0400, Greg DeKoenigsberg wrote: > > Does that mean you're volunteering to support a few of the packages? ;-) > > I am extremely busy right now, but I will once the emergency passes. That'd be greatly appreciated... -- Fernando From nando at ccrma.Stanford.EDU Wed May 10 00:09:08 2006 From: nando at ccrma.Stanford.EDU (Fernando Lopez-Lezcano) Date: Tue, 09 May 2006 17:09:08 -0700 Subject: [Fedora-music-list] package submitted (qjackctl) Message-ID: <1147219748.22392.55.camel@cmn3.stanford.edu> qjackctl: https://bugzilla.redhat.com/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=191239 Indispensable gui for using Jack! :-) First package submission, I need a sponsor!! -- Fernando From mojofunk at gmail.com Wed May 10 02:43:16 2006 From: mojofunk at gmail.com (Tim Mayberry) Date: Wed, 10 May 2006 12:43:16 +1000 Subject: [Fedora-music-list] Alsa tools and firmware In-Reply-To: <4bb03be40605091926h27005573me9060d481e6d814d@mail.gmail.com> References: <4bb03be40605082331va2f91a3i966bcb4eea19e1ef@mail.gmail.com> <1147159499.4115.69.camel@thl.ct.heise.de> <4bb03be40605091926h27005573me9060d481e6d814d@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <4bb03be40605091943l49d273b1rd503a8c0fee202d5@mail.gmail.com> Sorry I didn't mean to reply to Thorsten off-list. On 5/10/06, Tim Mayberry wrote: > On 5/9/06, Thorsten Leemhuis wrote: > > Am Dienstag, den 09.05.2006, 16:31 +1000 schrieb Tim Mayberry: > > > > The old plan was to move alsa-firmware to livna. The current plan is to > > solve the problems with alsa-firmware and ship what can be shipped. > > Someone (Legal, FESCo) simply has to say what files from alsa-firmware > > are okay for Extras, and what not. The last I heard was this: > > > > ---- > > > > > I maintained some alsa-firmware in the old fedora.us days. During the > > > transition to Fedora Extras the package got "lost" -- it was unclear if > > > the files in it were okay for the official Fedora Extras. See > > > https://bugzilla.redhat.com/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=143249#c3 > > > > > > We dropped it then and forwarded the issue to legal. It got lost or was > > > forgotten, I can't remember. But I'd like to get this solved now that > > > someone asked for a Extras package of alsa-firmware in bugzilla. > > > > > > So, where were the problems? Here is the main one: > > > > > > > $ file ./mixartloader/miXart8.elf > > > > ./mixartloader/miXart8.elf: ELF 32-bit MSB executable, PowerPC or cisco 4500, version 1 (SYSV), statically linked, not stripped > > > > That is a pretty big problem. > > > > Some of this is probably ok for FE, but only those bits which are not > > libraries or binaries. > > > > As I remember this issue was debated a fair bit on the debian lists a > while back, I didn't follow it too closely but I think they ended up > splitting the alsa-tools source package into alsa-tools and > alsa-firmware-loaders, with alsa-tools corresponding to roughly what > is in the FE alsa-tools package currently and alsa-firmware-loaders > being what is not. You then have to download the alsa-firmware > package from the ALSA website and configure it etc, which is not at > all ideal and I'm not suggesting it but it would still be better than > it is currently. > > I haven't been able to find a clear explanation of the Fedora Extras > policy on packaging firmware but I haven't looked that hard > yet(perhaps you could offer some pointers), I'd be surprised if any of > the files in alsa-firmware would be able to be ok for FE. > > > We should split alsa-firmware -- the "mostly free" parts should land in > > Extras, the others in Livna. Are you interested in doing this. I simply > > have no time for it ATM, never really was interested this alsa-firmware > > stuff and I don't even have hardware to test. Are you interested in > > driving this forward? You can of course count on my help. > > The problem then becomes defining what can and cannot be packaged and > where. I'm quite willing to help driving this forward but I am not > qualified to work through any legal issues. I'd rather solve this > problem more quickly on a technical level if possible, even if it is > only somewhat temporary until a better arrangement can be worked out. > > It seems like you are suggesting splitting the upstream alsa-tools and > alsa-firmware into 4 or 5 packages that would then reside in 2 > separate repositories... > > FE repo: > > alsa-tools.srpm -> alsa-tools.rpm, alsa-firmware-loaders-for-free-firmware.rpm > alsa-firmware.srpm -> alsa-firmware-free.rpm (If there is such a thing) > > Livna/other repo: > > alsa-tools.srpm -> alsa-firmware-loaders-for-non-free-firmware.rpm > alsa-firmware.srpm -> alsa-firmware-non-free.rpm > > Apart from all the obvious issues with something like that there is > still then the problem that some of the tools from the alsa-tools > package are still indirectly dependent on non-free firmware unless you > further split the packages. > > I think I would prefer to modify the alsa-tools package so that it > builds everything from the upstream source including firmware loaders > as there are no legal issues with that as far as I know(only with the > firmware itself). Then for an alsa-firmware rpm to reside in an > external repository and require alsa-tools from FE. > > Or alternatively, do what debian has done and split alsa-tools into > alsa-tools and alsa-firmware-loaders and have an externally hosted > alsa-firmware package dependent on alsa-firmware-loaders. > > I'm a bit rushed today so I hope that all came out alright. I look > forward to help resolving this issue. > > Tim. > From phil at pricom.com.au Wed May 10 03:06:28 2006 From: phil at pricom.com.au (Philip Rhoades) Date: Wed, 10 May 2006 13:06:28 +1000 Subject: [Fedora-music-list] Congratulations! In-Reply-To: <445FD956.2050204@edblack.com> References: <445FD956.2050204@edblack.com> Message-ID: <1147230388.23982.6.camel@prix.pricom.com.au> Ed, This is a bit off-topic but I agree with your sentiments. I came to coding later - I am 54 now but started off as a biologist and although I am not interested in hacking all day, every day anymore - I still like it. Why do you say your coding days are over - not interested anymore or you don't feel you are up to the new stuff? Regards, Phil. On Mon, 2006-05-08 at 19:50 -0400, Ed Black wrote: > When I was a grad student at Carnegie Tech (now Carnegie Mellon) I used > to dream of a cadre of programmers whose sole aim was to make the world > a better place. Now that I am sixty, my coding days are over, but with > every day Linux make my dream come true. We are almost there, keep up > the great work and a heartfelt congratulations. > > Yer Pal, > Ed Black, Ph.D. > > _______________________________________________ > Fedora-music-list mailing list > Fedora-music-list at redhat.com > http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-music-list > -- Philip Rhoades Pricom Pty Limited (ACN 003 252 275 ABN 91 003 252 275) GPO Box 3411 Sydney NSW 2001 Australia Mobile: +61:(0)411-185-652 Fax: +61:(0)2-8221-9599 E-mail: phil at pricom.com.au From fedora at leemhuis.info Wed May 10 04:48:58 2006 From: fedora at leemhuis.info (Thorsten Leemhuis) Date: Wed, 10 May 2006 06:48:58 +0200 Subject: [Fedora-music-list] Alsa tools and firmware In-Reply-To: <4bb03be40605091943l49d273b1rd503a8c0fee202d5@mail.gmail.com> References: <4bb03be40605082331va2f91a3i966bcb4eea19e1ef@mail.gmail.com> <1147159499.4115.69.camel@thl.ct.heise.de> <4bb03be40605091926h27005573me9060d481e6d814d@mail.gmail.com> <4bb03be40605091943l49d273b1rd503a8c0fee202d5@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1147236538.20034.11.camel@thl.ct.heise.de> Am Mittwoch, den 10.05.2006, 12:43 +1000 schrieb Tim Mayberry: > Sorry I didn't mean to reply to Thorsten off-list. It really gets more and more confusing -- some of the Fedora mailing list use ugly things ling mangling Subjects (Like the [Fedora-music-list]), others don't (which is good). The same with reply to -- some of our lists mangle the "Reply to" so each reply goes to the list. Others (like this list) don't do that. That's really really confusing and annoying. I think it's time for a general Fedora mailing list policy so all (most?) of our lists use the same behavior. CU thl From seg at haxxed.com Wed May 10 08:40:47 2006 From: seg at haxxed.com (Callum Lerwick) Date: Wed, 10 May 2006 03:40:47 -0500 Subject: [Fedora-music-list] Media Production SIG and Rosegarden Message-ID: <1147250449.4040.53.camel@localhost.localdomain> Hello everyone. I needed Rosegarden for a class, and since CCRMA isn't built for FC5 and x86_64, I attempted to build the CCRMA source package myself. And discovered I needed the latest Rosegarden to build with GCC 4.1, which changed to scons, which has some icky bugs, one of which I fixed with a patch from Fernando I dug up on a mailing list, then I discovered a bug in mock, etc... And since I went through all the effort I submitted it to Extras. https://bugzilla.redhat.com/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=189322 I did a lot of googling trying to find out if there was any activity as far as merging CCRMA into Extras and found nothing recent. (It appears this list was created shortly *after* I looked...) I had intended to email Fernando directly but never got around to it. Heh. I could use some advice on what to do about the timing problem... (Been meaning to take that up on Rosegarden's mailing list...) I took it upon myself to slap up a quickie SIG page on the wiki: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Extras/SIGs/MediaProduction I chose the name Media Production. Media allows us to include video as well (Cinelerra). Production emphasizes that distribution and consumption (patented codecs, media players, PVRs, streaming servers...) do not fall directly under the SIG's focus. So does "Media Production SIG" sound good to everyone? I've been doing my best to hurry up the review of jack. Its finals week(s) so I'm busy, sleep deprived, and stressed out, however one of my finals *is* for Digital Synth & Composition, so I can justify spending at least some time on audio stuff. :) -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part URL: From ajs at ajs.com Wed May 10 11:17:49 2006 From: ajs at ajs.com (Aaron Sherman) Date: Wed, 10 May 2006 07:17:49 -0400 Subject: [Fedora-music-list] Alsa tools and firmware In-Reply-To: <1147236538.20034.11.camel@thl.ct.heise.de> References: <4bb03be40605082331va2f91a3i966bcb4eea19e1ef@mail.gmail.com> <1147159499.4115.69.camel@thl.ct.heise.de> <4bb03be40605091926h27005573me9060d481e6d814d@mail.gmail.com> <4bb03be40605091943l49d273b1rd503a8c0fee202d5@mail.gmail.com> <1147236538.20034.11.camel@thl.ct.heise.de> Message-ID: <4461CBDD.6050909@ajs.com> Thorsten Leemhuis wrote: > It really gets more and more confusing -- some of the Fedora mailing > list use ugly things ling mangling Subjects (Like the > [Fedora-music-list]), others don't (which is good). > This is essential, and many of us would not be able to subscribe to low-volume lists if they didn't identify themselves in the subject of their mail. The other option is to post-process the subject through procmail in order to munge the subject myself, but then my replies look odd, and I have to make an extra effort for every list. > The same with reply to -- some of our lists mangle the "Reply to" so > each reply goes to the list. Others (like this list) don't do that. > That's really really confusing and annoying. > Reply-to munging is a matter of the list policy. Many lists prefer that threads not migrate off-list by accident. By setting a reply-to, the risk becomes private messages going to the list. Some list admins prefer it that way. I'm actually on one list that combines the worst of both worlds: no reply-to change, and the list will bounce any mail that includes any other To or Cc targets :-/ > I think it's time for a general Fedora mailing list policy so all > (most?) of our lists use the same behavior. > Hrm... The Fedora mailing lists are probably too diverse at this point to impose anything that sweeping to all of them. From ed at edblack.com Wed May 10 11:56:15 2006 From: ed at edblack.com (Ed Black) Date: Wed, 10 May 2006 07:56:15 -0400 Subject: [Fedora-music-list] muse? MusE? emacs-muse? Not if we want to make Linux Fedora public friendly. Message-ID: <4461D4DF.3060105@edblack.com> I would suggest a nice simple easy to refer to name that Jolene Sixpack can remember and, more importantly, use. Put away the geek speak folks. If nothing else do what the Beatles did and call it an Apple. That may P.O. a few folks, but you can't copyright fruit. Perhaps L-Apple or lapple for Linux Apple. or Fapple for Fedora Apple or FedApple whoopsie - too scary. Keep up the great work pals and I might add that exyum went bananas (hey another good name) when I tried to load just about anything from CCRMA. Of course, I am an early adopter and am running core 5. Yer Pal, Ed Black, Ph.D. From notting at redhat.com Wed May 10 15:51:57 2006 From: notting at redhat.com (Bill Nottingham) Date: Wed, 10 May 2006 11:51:57 -0400 Subject: [Fedora-music-list] Alsa tools and firmware In-Reply-To: <4461CBDD.6050909@ajs.com> References: <4bb03be40605082331va2f91a3i966bcb4eea19e1ef@mail.gmail.com> <1147159499.4115.69.camel@thl.ct.heise.de> <4bb03be40605091926h27005573me9060d481e6d814d@mail.gmail.com> <4bb03be40605091943l49d273b1rd503a8c0fee202d5@mail.gmail.com> <1147236538.20034.11.camel@thl.ct.heise.de> <4461CBDD.6050909@ajs.com> Message-ID: <20060510155157.GB573@devserv.devel.redhat.com> Aaron Sherman (ajs at ajs.com) said: > Thorsten Leemhuis wrote: > >It really gets more and more confusing -- some of the Fedora mailing > >list use ugly things ling mangling Subjects (Like the > >[Fedora-music-list]), others don't (which is good). > > > This is essential, and many of us would not be able to subscribe to > low-volume lists if they didn't identify themselves in the subject of > their mail. The other option is to post-process the subject through > procmail in order to munge the subject myself, but then my replies look > odd, and I have to make an extra effort for every list. I'm confused... if you have procmail available, why do you need subject tagging to make separate lists useful? Bill From nando at ccrma.Stanford.EDU Wed May 10 17:25:36 2006 From: nando at ccrma.Stanford.EDU (Fernando Lopez-Lezcano) Date: Wed, 10 May 2006 10:25:36 -0700 Subject: [Fedora-music-list] muse? MusE? emacs-muse? Not if we want to make Linux Fedora public friendly. In-Reply-To: <4461D4DF.3060105@edblack.com> References: <4461D4DF.3060105@edblack.com> Message-ID: <1147281936.26851.2.camel@cmn3.stanford.edu> On Wed, 2006-05-10 at 07:56 -0400, Ed Black wrote: > [MUNCH] Keep up the great work pals and I might > add that exyum went bananas (hey another good name) when I tried to load > just about anything from CCRMA. Of course, I am an early adopter and am > running core 5. I'm not sure I follow... did you have problems? [plus there's a lot missing still from the fc5 build of Planet CCRMA] -- Fernando From nando at ccrma.Stanford.EDU Wed May 10 17:57:00 2006 From: nando at ccrma.Stanford.EDU (Fernando Lopez-Lezcano) Date: Wed, 10 May 2006 10:57:00 -0700 Subject: [Fedora-music-list] Media Production SIG and Rosegarden In-Reply-To: <1147250449.4040.53.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <1147250449.4040.53.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <1147283820.26851.16.camel@cmn3.stanford.edu> On Wed, 2006-05-10 at 03:40 -0500, Callum Lerwick wrote: > Hello everyone. I needed Rosegarden for a class, and since CCRMA isn't > built for FC5 and x86_64, I attempted to build the CCRMA source package > myself. And discovered I needed the latest Rosegarden to build with GCC > 4.1, which changed to scons, which has some icky bugs, one of which I > fixed with a patch from Fernando I dug up on a mailing list, then I > discovered a bug in mock, etc... And since I went through all the effort > I submitted it to Extras. > > https://bugzilla.redhat.com/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=189322 > > I did a lot of googling trying to find out if there was any activity as > far as merging CCRMA into Extras and found nothing recent. (It appears > this list was created shortly *after* I looked...) I had intended to > email Fernando directly but never got around to it. Heh. Oh well... :-) Too bad we did not coordinate efforts for this... I have rosegarden4 for fc5 now. > I could use some advice on what to do about the timing problem... (Been > meaning to take that up on Rosegarden's mailing list...) You are using just the regular Fedora kernels, right? They have HZ=250 which is regretful for this type of work (you mention that in bugzilla)... the Planet CCRMA kernels still using HZ=1000 :-p I tried booting into 2096_FC5 and yes, I get the warning. Other things I tried: setting it to rtc in rosegarden and upping the user frequency to 1024 (there is a /sys thing you can use to do this). The first time I tried to start rosegarden after that the system froze solid (reset button was the only way out). After rebooting rosegarden starts, but still issues the warning - but according to the messages it prints it appears to have switched to using rtc. Maybe we could do timing tests to confirm the resolution... I guess this is something to ask questions about in the rosegarden list. One thing to note is that the rtc preference (at least) is sticky, that is the next time I start rosegarden it shows that. Still, the messages printed suggest that rosegarden is first using "auto", and then switching to rtc. > I took it upon myself to slap up a quickie SIG page on the wiki: > > http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Extras/SIGs/MediaProduction > > I chose the name Media Production. Media allows us to include video as > well (Cinelerra). Production emphasizes that distribution and > consumption (patented codecs, media players, PVRs, streaming servers...) > do not fall directly under the SIG's focus. > > So does "Media Production SIG" sound good to everyone? Sounds good to me. That has always been the focus of Planet CCRMA (ie: creating content). > I've been doing my best to hurry up the review of jack. Its finals > week(s) so I'm busy, sleep deprived, and stressed out, however one of my > finals *is* for Digital Synth & Composition, so I can justify spending > at least some time on audio stuff. :) Yep, jack is in the critical path of a lot of packages. -- Fernando From pdman at aproximation.org Sat May 20 22:56:42 2006 From: pdman at aproximation.org (thewade) Date: Sat, 20 May 2006 15:56:42 -0700 Subject: [Fedora-music-list] CCRMA kernel in FC5? Message-ID: <20060520155642.beh5i2sb78cco8o4@moon.aproximation.org> Hello, I am seriously looking at upgrading to FC5 primarily because it is reported to be an openGL 2.0 compliant system and Gem (a visualization labrary for PD) is now requiring openGL 2.0 for full Gem functionality. But I am a long time CCRMA fan and the packages and kernel offered by CCRMA for FC4 really make my musical life easier. And so I ask: is there an FC5 CCRMA kernel and packages repository yet? I would really love to not have to go back to building my own kernels using Ingo M.'s patches and then having to build all my sound tools myself using rpmbuild. Thank you all, -wade From green at redhat.com Sat May 20 23:31:38 2006 From: green at redhat.com (Anthony Green) Date: Sat, 20 May 2006 16:31:38 -0700 Subject: [Fedora-music-list] CCRMA kernel in FC5? In-Reply-To: <20060520155642.beh5i2sb78cco8o4@moon.aproximation.org> References: <20060520155642.beh5i2sb78cco8o4@moon.aproximation.org> Message-ID: <1148167898.3874.9.camel@localhost.localdomain> On Sat, 2006-05-20 at 15:56 -0700, thewade wrote: > But I am a long time CCRMA fan and the packages and kernel offered by > CCRMA for FC4 really make my musical life easier. And so I ask: is > there an FC5 CCRMA kernel and packages repository yet? I don't think there's a kernel, but there are other packages. See: http://ccrma.stanford.edu/planetccrma/mirror/fedora/linux/planetccrma/5/i386/repodata/index.html A couple of those packages have subsequently been merged into Fedora Extras. jack-audio-connection-kit just found a Extras sponsor today, so I expect many other packages should be arriving in Extras soon. > I would really love to not have to go back to building my own kernels > using Ingo M.'s patches and then having to build all my sound tools > myself using rpmbuild. The stock kernel works well enough for me. Just follow the directions in /usr/share/doc/jack-audio-connection-kit-0.101.1/README.Fedora. AG From florin at andrei.myip.org Sun May 21 03:41:00 2006 From: florin at andrei.myip.org (Florin Andrei) Date: Sat, 20 May 2006 20:41:00 -0700 Subject: [Fedora-music-list] CCRMA kernel in FC5? In-Reply-To: <1148167898.3874.9.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <20060520155642.beh5i2sb78cco8o4@moon.aproximation.org> <1148167898.3874.9.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <1148182860.3203.0.camel@rivendell.home.local> On Sat, 2006-05-20 at 16:31 -0700, Anthony Green wrote: > The stock kernel works well enough for me. +1 Didn't use a customized kernel in a very long time. -- Florin Andrei http://florin.myip.org/ From pdman at aproximation.org Sun May 21 03:56:54 2006 From: pdman at aproximation.org (thewade) Date: Sat, 20 May 2006 20:56:54 -0700 Subject: [Fedora-music-list] CCRMA kernel in FC5? In-Reply-To: <1148182860.3203.0.camel@rivendell.home.local> References: <20060520155642.beh5i2sb78cco8o4@moon.aproximation.org> <1148167898.3874.9.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1148182860.3203.0.camel@rivendell.home.local> Message-ID: <20060520205654.040qnw5da8sgcwk4@moon.aproximation.org> Quoting Florin Andrei : > On Sat, 2006-05-20 at 16:31 -0700, Anthony Green wrote: > >> The stock kernel works well enough for me. > > +1 > > Didn't use a customized kernel in a very long time. I do some heavy realtime signal processing in PD and I found that the realtime.so kernel module allowed my applications to run at a higher priority then gnome and everything else. This removed many problems I had when I was processing something and dragged or changed windows for example. I set a guid for my audio apps and my system processing capabilities improved dramaticaly. As far as I know the realtime kernel module, sometimes called the LSM module, is not a part of the mainline Fedora Core kernel(s). Is it now? It used to require a PAM patch and I think a rebuild of the kernel. If I wasn't doing realtime stuff then I would probably agree with you. Thanks for the help! -thewade From seg at haxxed.com Sun May 21 06:23:07 2006 From: seg at haxxed.com (Callum Lerwick) Date: Sun, 21 May 2006 01:23:07 -0500 Subject: [Fedora-music-list] CCRMA kernel in FC5? In-Reply-To: <20060520205654.040qnw5da8sgcwk4@moon.aproximation.org> References: <20060520155642.beh5i2sb78cco8o4@moon.aproximation.org> <1148167898.3874.9.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1148182860.3203.0.camel@rivendell.home.local> <20060520205654.040qnw5da8sgcwk4@moon.aproximation.org> Message-ID: <1148192589.16686.27.camel@localhost.localdomain> On Sat, 2006-05-20 at 20:56 -0700, thewade wrote: > As far as I know the realtime kernel module, sometimes called the LSM > module, is not a part of the mainline Fedora Core kernel(s). Is it now? > It used to require a PAM patch and I think a rebuild of the kernel. From what I remember reading in Kernel Traffic, upstream didn't like the LSM approach. They came up with the rlimit approach instead, which has been merged upstream and is supported in FC5. That's what we're using in jack's README.Fedora. > If I wasn't doing realtime stuff then I would probably agree with you. How low do you need to go? On my Athlon 64 3000+ system, I can run jack reliably at a period size of 256, on the motherboard's cheezy onboard sound. Any lower and it overruns like mad. Which makes sense, according to qjackcontrol that's a latency of 10.7ms at 48khz. Given the stock kernel has a 250hz timer, that gives you a nyquist scheduling frequency of 125hz, which is a period of 8ms. With a stock kernel I don't think we can go any lower than 8ms. I think that's probably good enough for most users. Maybe CCRMA can continue to supply kernels for those who demand more. Now if only I could get Rosegarden to stop complaining... Packaging alternative kernels in Extras is a can of worms I don't think anyone is in a rush to open. But as far as I know its not yet totally out of the question... -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part URL: From pdman at aproximation.org Sun May 21 06:47:56 2006 From: pdman at aproximation.org (thewade) Date: Sat, 20 May 2006 23:47:56 -0700 Subject: [Fedora-music-list] CCRMA kernel in FC5? In-Reply-To: <1148192589.16686.27.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <20060520155642.beh5i2sb78cco8o4@moon.aproximation.org> <1148167898.3874.9.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1148182860.3203.0.camel@rivendell.home.local> <20060520205654.040qnw5da8sgcwk4@moon.aproximation.org> <1148192589.16686.27.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <20060520234756.9rblvu00occ8ko84@moon.aproximation.org> Quoting Callum Lerwick : > On Sat, 2006-05-20 at 20:56 -0700, thewade wrote: >> As far as I know the realtime kernel module, sometimes called the LSM >> module, is not a part of the mainline Fedora Core kernel(s). Is it now? >> It used to require a PAM patch and I think a rebuild of the kernel. > > From what I remember reading in Kernel Traffic, upstream didn't like the > LSM approach. They came up with the rlimit approach instead, which has > been merged upstream and is supported in FC5. That's what we're using in > jack's README.Fedora. No no, I am wrong and you are right. I remember this, that rlimits was preffered over the LSM module. Great! >> If I wasn't doing realtime stuff then I would probably agree with you. > > How low do you need to go? > > On my Athlon 64 3000+ system, I can run jack reliably at a period size > of 256, on the motherboard's cheezy onboard sound. Any lower and it > overruns like mad. Which makes sense, according to qjackcontrol that's a > latency of 10.7ms at 48khz. Given the stock kernel has a 250hz timer, > that gives you a nyquist scheduling frequency of 125hz, which is a > period of 8ms. With a stock kernel I don't think we can go any lower > than 8ms. I am using and Athalon 64 3400+ in i386 mode because PD doesn't handle 64 bit tables well yet, and a Hammerfall HDSP card. I would be satisified with less then 10ms (I think I am between 5ms and 8ms now) because that still allows me to do a large amount of processing without too much lag for live performances. Any lower and the numper of computations I can do without generating XRUNS decreases. Any higher and there starts to be an echo or slapback effect when I play live (which sadly doesnt happen much these days). > I think that's probably good enough for most users. Maybe CCRMA can > continue to supply kernels for those who demand more. Now if only I > could get Rosegarden to stop complaining... I haven't used rosegarden. Its primarily MIDI stuff, right? I use PD, Audacity, and I am learning Ardour. PD rocks but the other two still need a few UI improvements to be the Soundforge and Sonar I am used too in Winblows land. Also I need to put linux on my iPod so I can play flac files... > Packaging alternative kernels in Extras is a can of worms I don't think > anyone is in a rush to open. But as far as I know its not yet totally > out of the question... I have no problem adding the CCRMA repo to my yum.repos.d directory, as I do now with FC4. What is the advantage of including CCRMA in Fedora Extras? Just default install inclusion I imagine. -wade From phil at pricom.com.au Sun May 21 06:52:46 2006 From: phil at pricom.com.au (Philip Rhoades) Date: Sun, 21 May 2006 16:52:46 +1000 Subject: [Fedora-music-list] Learning to read music via computer Message-ID: <1148194366.17227.16.camel@prix.pricom.com.au> People, I am a bit of lurker on this list - I have a general interest in music (I am a biologist but work as an IT professional). I have been using Fedora and RH for a long time so this a probably a good group to ask the question: Is there FC5 compatible software around for teaching yourself to read music? I guess I need to at least have an epiano keyboard with midi interface? Thanks, Phil. -- Philip Rhoades Pricom Pty Limited (ACN 003 252 275 ABN 91 003 252 275) GPO Box 3411 Sydney NSW 2001 Australia Mobile: +61:(0)411-185-652 Fax: +61:(0)2-8221-9599 E-mail: phil at pricom.com.au From green at redhat.com Sun May 21 10:13:47 2006 From: green at redhat.com (Anthony Green) Date: Sun, 21 May 2006 03:13:47 -0700 Subject: [Fedora-music-list] CCRMA kernel in FC5? In-Reply-To: <20060520234756.9rblvu00occ8ko84@moon.aproximation.org> References: <20060520155642.beh5i2sb78cco8o4@moon.aproximation.org> <1148167898.3874.9.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1148182860.3203.0.camel@rivendell.home.local> <20060520205654.040qnw5da8sgcwk4@moon.aproximation.org> <1148192589.16686.27.camel@localhost.localdomain> <20060520234756.9rblvu00occ8ko84@moon.aproximation.org> Message-ID: <1148206427.3874.21.camel@localhost.localdomain> On Sat, 2006-05-20 at 23:47 -0700, thewade wrote: > I have no problem adding the CCRMA repo to my yum.repos.d directory, as > I do now with FC4. What is the advantage of including CCRMA in Fedora > Extras? Just default install inclusion I imagine. Off the top of my head.. - It's easier for more people to contribute - It should eliminate the problem of conflicts between Core/Extras and PlanetCCRMA - It should eliminate the lag between an FC release and package availability - It should be easier to support non-x86 hosts (PPC, for instance) The downside is that each package has to go through a relatively lengthy review process before it can get included. However, in my limited experience, packages are usually better off for having gone through this review. For instance, see what I'm going through with ardour... https://bugzilla.redhat.com/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=189315 AG From nando at ccrma.Stanford.EDU Sun May 21 18:53:12 2006 From: nando at ccrma.Stanford.EDU (Fernando Lopez-Lezcano) Date: Sun, 21 May 2006 11:53:12 -0700 Subject: [Fedora-music-list] CCRMA kernel in FC5? In-Reply-To: <1148167898.3874.9.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <20060520155642.beh5i2sb78cco8o4@moon.aproximation.org> <1148167898.3874.9.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <1148237592.3925.7.camel@cmn3.stanford.edu> On Sat, 2006-05-20 at 16:31 -0700, Anthony Green wrote: > On Sat, 2006-05-20 at 15:56 -0700, thewade wrote: > > But I am a long time CCRMA fan and the packages and kernel offered by > > CCRMA for FC4 really make my musical life easier. And so I ask: is > > there an FC5 CCRMA kernel and packages repository yet? > > I don't think there's a kernel, but there are other packages. See: > > http://ccrma.stanford.edu/planetccrma/mirror/fedora/linux/planetccrma/5/i386/repodata/index.html But also look at... http://ccrma.stanford.edu/planetccrma/mirror/fedora/linux/planetcore/5/i386/repodata/index.html > A couple of those packages have subsequently been merged into Fedora > Extras. jack-audio-connection-kit just found a Extras sponsor today, so > I expect many other packages should be arriving in Extras soon. > > > I would really love to not have to go back to building my own kernels > > using Ingo M.'s patches and then having to build all my sound tools > > myself using rpmbuild. > > The stock kernel works well enough for me. Just follow the directions > in /usr/share/doc/jack-audio-connection-kit-0.101.1/README.Fedora. Nit picking, of course, those directions only tell you how to get memory locking and realtime scheduler access as a normal non-root user. Those have been a given for Planet CCRMA users for quite a while :-) While for many users the stock kernel will be enough, those that want to use very small buffers for good realtime response for synthesis or digital signal processing will find the standard kernel will not be enough (ie: they will experience more xruns than with one patched with Ingo's kernel) -- Fernando From nando at ccrma.Stanford.EDU Sun May 21 18:54:57 2006 From: nando at ccrma.Stanford.EDU (Fernando Lopez-Lezcano) Date: Sun, 21 May 2006 11:54:57 -0700 Subject: [Fedora-music-list] CCRMA kernel in FC5? In-Reply-To: <20060520155642.beh5i2sb78cco8o4@moon.aproximation.org> References: <20060520155642.beh5i2sb78cco8o4@moon.aproximation.org> Message-ID: <1148237697.3925.9.camel@cmn3.stanford.edu> On Sat, 2006-05-20 at 15:56 -0700, thewade wrote: > Hello, > > I am seriously looking at upgrading to FC5 primarily because it is > reported to be an openGL 2.0 compliant system and Gem (a visualization > labrary for PD) is now requiring openGL 2.0 for full Gem functionality. > > But I am a long time CCRMA fan and the packages and kernel offered by > CCRMA for FC4 really make my musical life easier. And so I ask: is > there an FC5 CCRMA kernel and packages repository yet? Yes, there is one (or rather, two). > I would really love to not have to go back to building my own kernels > using Ingo M.'s patches and then having to build all my sound tools > myself using rpmbuild. The install stuff has not made it to the web site yet, it was advertised in the Planet CCRMA mailing lists, see this thread: http://ccrma-mail.stanford.edu/pipermail/planetccrmanews/2006-May/000034.html That should get you started... Enjoy! -- Fernando From mharris at mharris.ca Tue May 23 15:20:37 2006 From: mharris at mharris.ca (Mike A. Harris) Date: Tue, 23 May 2006 11:20:37 -0400 Subject: [Fedora-music-list] Please remove subject prefix from list messages. Message-ID: <44732845.2090702@mharris.ca> Can the list maintainer please remove the [fedora-music-list] junk from the mailing list subject line? It's 2006 now, and I believe the majority of people subscribing to mailing lists have long since realized how to filter mail using X-BeenThere, or whatever other preferred methods. There is no good reason to plaster the list name in the subject of every single message. All other Fedora and Red Hat lists consistently do not have this junk in the subject line. What's more is that if there are people who /do/ prefer to have that junk there, they can add it back to their own messages locally using procmail, and sed or formail. Thanks in advance. -- Mike A. Harris * Open Source Advocate * http://mharris.ca Proud Canadian. From kwade at redhat.com Tue May 23 16:16:39 2006 From: kwade at redhat.com (Karsten Wade) Date: Tue, 23 May 2006 09:16:39 -0700 Subject: [Fedora-music-list] Please remove subject prefix from list messages. In-Reply-To: <44732845.2090702@mharris.ca> References: <44732845.2090702@mharris.ca> Message-ID: <1148401000.2457.941.camel@erato.phig.org> On Tue, 2006-05-23 at 11:20 -0400, Mike A. Harris wrote: > Can the list maintainer please remove the [fedora-music-list] junk > from the mailing list subject line? It's 2006 now, and I believe > the majority of people subscribing to mailing lists have long since > realized how to filter mail using X-BeenThere, or whatever other > preferred methods. > > There is no good reason to plaster the list name in the subject of > every single message. All other Fedora and Red Hat lists consistently > do not have this junk in the subject line. What's more is that > if there are people who /do/ prefer to have that junk there, they > can add it back to their own messages locally using procmail, > and sed or formail. Hear hear, etc. I had to create this page to point to your post forever, because it is a succinct answer to something that bugs me. There are lists I cannot read because of the subject line clutter. http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/MailinglistGuidelines/SubjectLineJunk That said, there is an appropriate fedora-music-list-admin at redhat.com address you could send this to, and for that I award you with: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/PostIsOffTopic - Karsten, pedant and laughing about it ;-) -- Karsten Wade, RHCE * Sr. Editor * http://people.redhat.com/kwade/ gpg fingerprint: 2680 DBFD D968 3141 0115 5F1B D992 0E06 AD0E 0C41 Fedora Documentation Project http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/DocsProject -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part URL: From seg at haxxed.com Tue May 23 19:24:38 2006 From: seg at haxxed.com (Callum Lerwick) Date: Tue, 23 May 2006 14:24:38 -0500 Subject: [Fedora-music-list] Please remove subject prefix from list messages. In-Reply-To: <44732845.2090702@mharris.ca> References: <44732845.2090702@mharris.ca> Message-ID: <1148412280.5164.15.camel@localhost.localdomain> On Tue, 2006-05-23 at 11:20 -0400, Mike A. Harris wrote: > Can the list maintainer please remove the [fedora-music-list] junk > from the mailing list subject line? It's 2006 now, and I believe > the majority of people subscribing to mailing lists have long since > realized how to filter mail using X-BeenThere, or whatever other > preferred methods. I like it. (And no, I'm not filtering based on it) I'm on a bazillion mailing lists, and its not really worth the trouble to me to set up a filter for the low traffic ones. Mailing lists are an ugly fossil of a kludge anyway. Sadly there's nothing that's widely standard that can quite take the place. NNTP is close, but the lack of server side user state is a big downer IMHO. IMAP could almost do it, it has server side user state, but its only designed for reading, not posting. Also its a hideous, ambiguously defined, difficult to parse protocol according to the Citadel developers. Sadly, its the only thing widely supported by most mail clients. Citadel could do it. http://www.citadel.org/ I was working on packaging it a while back. My original intent for becoming an Extras contributor was to submit Citadel... Its on this summer's to do list. :) -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part URL: From mharris at mharris.ca Thu May 25 13:09:05 2006 From: mharris at mharris.ca (Mike A. Harris) Date: Thu, 25 May 2006 09:09:05 -0400 Subject: [Fedora-music-list] Please remove subject prefix from list messages. In-Reply-To: <1148401000.2457.941.camel@erato.phig.org> References: <44732845.2090702@mharris.ca> <1148401000.2457.941.camel@erato.phig.org> Message-ID: <4475AC71.7070207@mharris.ca> Karsten Wade wrote: > On Tue, 2006-05-23 at 11:20 -0400, Mike A. Harris wrote: >> Can the list maintainer please remove the [fedora-music-list] junk >> from the mailing list subject line? It's 2006 now, and I believe >> the majority of people subscribing to mailing lists have long since >> realized how to filter mail using X-BeenThere, or whatever other >> preferred methods. >> >> There is no good reason to plaster the list name in the subject of >> every single message. All other Fedora and Red Hat lists consistently >> do not have this junk in the subject line. What's more is that >> if there are people who /do/ prefer to have that junk there, they >> can add it back to their own messages locally using procmail, >> and sed or formail. > > Hear hear, etc. I had to create this page to point to your post > forever, because it is a succinct answer to something that bugs me. > There are lists I cannot read because of the subject line clutter. > > http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/MailinglistGuidelines/SubjectLineJunk Heh, thanks. ;) > That said, there is an appropriate fedora-music-list-admin at redhat.com > address you could send this to, and for that I award you with: > > http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/PostIsOffTopic Indeed.. I have to admit that I was rather reactionary at first, rather than taking the time to go to the list page and directly email the list admin (of whom I had no idea). I should have known better, because it makes no difference what list it is, who is hosting it, or what the standards are for every single other list hosted on the same site (ie: every single Fedora and Red Hat list for example) - there is always at least one person who will argue vehemently for including the stupid subject clutter because "they like it" or whatever. I hang my head in shame for being the catalyst for the invocation of that nonsense. Anyhow, I've emailed the real list owner now privately, to politely request the list be reconfigured to have the same configuration as the rest of the Fedora and Red Hat lists for consistency. As an added bonus for those who prefer the ugly list name in subject crap - you can add it back to any mailing list you are on with procmail: :0: * X-BeenThere: fedora-music-list at redhat.com * Subject: \/ | sed -e "[fedora-music-list] $MATCH" fedora-music-list Enjoy. > - Karsten, pedant and laughing about it ;-) :) -- Mike A. Harris * Open Source Advocate * http://mharris.ca Proud Canadian. From phil at pricom.com.au Thu May 25 14:53:36 2006 From: phil at pricom.com.au (Philip Rhoades) Date: Fri, 26 May 2006 00:53:36 +1000 Subject: [Fedora-music-list] Please remove subject prefix from list messages. In-Reply-To: <4475AC71.7070207@mharris.ca> References: <44732845.2090702@mharris.ca> <1148401000.2457.941.camel@erato.phig.org> <4475AC71.7070207@mharris.ca> Message-ID: <1148568816.15511.3.camel@prix.pricom.com.au> Karsten, > I should have known better, because it makes no difference what > list it is, who is hosting it, or what the standards are for > every single other list hosted on the same site (ie: every single > Fedora and Red Hat list for example) - there is always at least > one person who will argue vehemently for including the stupid > subject clutter because "they like it" or whatever. I hang my > head in shame for being the catalyst for the invocation of that > nonsense. I like it. > As an added bonus for those who prefer the ugly list name in > subject crap - you can add it back to any mailing list you > are on with procmail: > > :0: > * X-BeenThere: fedora-music-list at redhat.com > * Subject: \/ > | sed -e "[fedora-music-list] $MATCH" > fedora-music-list Why should I have to do that? Leave it as it is. Phil. -- Philip Rhoades Pricom Pty Limited (ACN 003 252 275 ABN 91 003 252 275) GPO Box 3411 Sydney NSW 2001 Australia Mobile: +61:(0)411-185-652 Fax: +61:(0)2-8221-9599 E-mail: phil at pricom.com.au From billcrawford1970 at gmail.com Thu May 25 15:35:12 2006 From: billcrawford1970 at gmail.com (Bill Crawford) Date: Thu, 25 May 2006 16:35:12 +0100 Subject: [Fedora-music-list] Please remove subject prefix from list messages. In-Reply-To: <1148568816.15511.3.camel@prix.pricom.com.au> References: <44732845.2090702@mharris.ca> <4475AC71.7070207@mharris.ca> <1148568816.15511.3.camel@prix.pricom.com.au> Message-ID: <200605251635.13791.billcrawford1970@googlemail.com> Le Jeudi 25 Mai 2006 15:53, Philip Rhoades a ?crit?: > I like it. I hate it. > Why should I have to do that? Why should I have to put up with it? ;) > Leave it as it is. Not going to argue any more, life's too short ... > Phil. -- Bill (smiling) From pdman at aproximation.org Sat May 27 23:53:04 2006 From: pdman at aproximation.org (thewade) Date: Sat, 27 May 2006 16:53:04 -0700 Subject: [Fedora-music-list] CCRMA kernel in FC5? In-Reply-To: <1148206427.3874.21.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <20060520155642.beh5i2sb78cco8o4@moon.aproximation.org> <1148167898.3874.9.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1148182860.3203.0.camel@rivendell.home.local> <20060520205654.040qnw5da8sgcwk4@moon.aproximation.org> <1148192589.16686.27.camel@localhost.localdomain> <20060520234756.9rblvu00occ8ko84@moon.aproximation.org> <1148206427.3874.21.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <20060527165304.wnehof2zms4ks0gw@moon.aproximation.org> I have sucuessfuly install fedora core 5 but I can't seem to run yum -y update because of my ccrma yum repo. Could someone give me an iea of how my planetCCRMA.repo should look? I ask because the url Fernando posted looks different the the url's in my repo that worked for FC4. My planetCCRMA.repo: [os] name=Fedora Core $releasever - $basearch - Updates baseurl=http://ccrma.stanford.edu/planetccrma/repodata/fedora/$releasever/core/os/ enabled=1 gpgcheck=1 gpgkey=http://ccrma.stanford.edu/planetccrma/apt/configuration/all/RPM-GPG-KEY.planetccrma.txt [updates] name=Fedora Core $releasever - $basearch - Updates baseurl=http://ccrma.stanford.edu/planetccrma/repodata/fedora/$releasever/core/updates/ enabled=1 gpgcheck=1 gpgkey=http://ccrma.stanford.edu/planetccrma/apt/configuration/all/RPM-GPG-KEY.planetccrma.txt [planetccrma] name=Fedora Core $releasever - $basearch - Planet CCRMA Apps baseurl=http://ccrma.stanford.edu/planetccrma/repodata/fedora/$releasever/planetccrma/ enabled=1 gpgcheck=1 gpgkey=http://ccrma.stanford.edu/planetccrma/apt/configuration/all/RPM-GPG-KEY.planetccrma.txt [planetcore] name=Fedora Core $releasever - $basearch - Planet CCRMA Core baseurl=http://ccrma.stanford.edu/planetccrma/repodata/fedora/$releasever/planetcore/ enabled=1 gpgcheck=1 gpgkey=http://ccrma.stanford.edu/planetccrma/apt/configuration/all/RPM-GPG-KEY.planetccrma.txt [planetedge] name=Fedora Core $releasever - $basearch - Planet CCRMA Core baseurl=http://ccrma.stanford.edu/planetccrma/repodata/fedora/$releasever/planetedge/ enabled=1 gpgcheck=1 gpgkey=http://ccrma.stanford.edu/planetccrma/apt/configuration/all/RPM-GPG-KEY.planetccrma.txt And the latest version of Gem works in FC5 without disabeling ARB! Sweet! Now to test audio... THanks all! -wade From nando at ccrma.Stanford.EDU Sun May 28 01:40:02 2006 From: nando at ccrma.Stanford.EDU (Fernando Pablo Lopez-Lezcano) Date: Sat, 27 May 2006 18:40:02 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Fedora-music-list] CCRMA kernel in FC5? In-Reply-To: <20060527165304.wnehof2zms4ks0gw@moon.aproximation.org> References: <20060520155642.beh5i2sb78cco8o4@moon.aproximation.org> <1148167898.3874.9.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1148182860.3203.0.camel@rivendell.home.local> <20060520205654.040qnw5da8sgcwk4@moon.aproximation.org> <1148192589.16686.27.camel@localhost.localdomain> <20060520234756.9rblvu00occ8ko84@moon.aproximation.org> <1148206427.3874.21.camel@localhost.localdomain> <20060527165304.wnehof2zms4ks0gw@moon.aproximation.org> Message-ID: On Sat, 27 May 2006, thewade wrote: > I have sucuessfuly install fedora core 5 but I can't seem to run yum -y > update because of my ccrma yum repo. Could someone give me an iea of how my > planetCCRMA.repo should look? I ask because the url Fernando posted looks > different the the url's in my repo that worked for FC4. It is different, the fc5 url is inside the repository itself and not a separate directory as before. See this for some instructions: http://ccrma-mail.stanford.edu/pipermail/planetccrmanews/2006-May/000034.html Install the configuration package and you should be up and running. -- Fernando > > My planetCCRMA.repo: > [os] > name=Fedora Core $releasever - $basearch - Updates > baseurl=http://ccrma.stanford.edu/planetccrma/repodata/fedora/$releasever/core/os/ > enabled=1 > gpgcheck=1 > gpgkey=http://ccrma.stanford.edu/planetccrma/apt/configuration/all/RPM-GPG-KEY.planetccrma.txt > > [updates] > name=Fedora Core $releasever - $basearch - Updates > baseurl=http://ccrma.stanford.edu/planetccrma/repodata/fedora/$releasever/core/updates/ > enabled=1 > gpgcheck=1 > gpgkey=http://ccrma.stanford.edu/planetccrma/apt/configuration/all/RPM-GPG-KEY.planetccrma.txt > > [planetccrma] > name=Fedora Core $releasever - $basearch - Planet CCRMA Apps > baseurl=http://ccrma.stanford.edu/planetccrma/repodata/fedora/$releasever/planetccrma/ > enabled=1 > gpgcheck=1 > gpgkey=http://ccrma.stanford.edu/planetccrma/apt/configuration/all/RPM-GPG-KEY.planetccrma.txt > > [planetcore] > name=Fedora Core $releasever - $basearch - Planet CCRMA Core > baseurl=http://ccrma.stanford.edu/planetccrma/repodata/fedora/$releasever/planetcore/ > enabled=1 > gpgcheck=1 > gpgkey=http://ccrma.stanford.edu/planetccrma/apt/configuration/all/RPM-GPG-KEY.planetccrma.txt > > [planetedge] > name=Fedora Core $releasever - $basearch - Planet CCRMA Core > baseurl=http://ccrma.stanford.edu/planetccrma/repodata/fedora/$releasever/planetedge/ > enabled=1 > gpgcheck=1 > gpgkey=http://ccrma.stanford.edu/planetccrma/apt/configuration/all/RPM-GPG-KEY.planetccrma.txt > > And the latest version of Gem works in FC5 without disabeling ARB! Sweet! Now > to test audio... > > THanks all! > -wade > > _______________________________________________ > Fedora-music-list mailing list > Fedora-music-list at redhat.com > http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-music-list > From green at redhat.com Tue May 30 20:05:50 2006 From: green at redhat.com (Anthony Green) Date: Tue, 30 May 2006 13:05:50 -0700 Subject: [Fedora-music-list] jack and sound servers Message-ID: <1149019550.6060.99.camel@localhost.localdomain> Good news... jack-audio-connection-kit is in extras-development. Also, about 6 months too late, I watched some of the videos from the Boston FUDCon a few months ago... http://torrent.fedoraproject.org/torrents/FUDConBoston2006.torrent The videos include a talk about sound on Linux, and it touches on jack, LADSPA, etc. The presenter, Chris Montgomery, talks about a plan to write a new sound server for Fedora that will satisfy both real- and non-real-time audio applications. I don't know if anything has come of that yet, but it would be interesting to hear an update if anybody here has one. AG From jordan at jdnash.org Wed May 31 16:33:34 2006 From: jordan at jdnash.org (Jordan Nash) Date: Wed, 31 May 2006 12:33:34 -0400 Subject: [Fedora-music-list] Re: Fedora-music-list Digest, Vol 2, Issue 14 In-Reply-To: <20060531160024.CFD6F733F7@hormel.redhat.com> References: <20060531160024.CFD6F733F7@hormel.redhat.com> Message-ID: <1149093214.9566.0.camel@jordan.nash.net> I also thought that it was an interesting talk. I'd be interested in hearing the status of this project as well. -Jordan On Wed, 2006-05-31 at 12:00 -0400, fedora-music-list-request at redhat.com wrote: > Send Fedora-music-list mailing list submissions to > fedora-music-list at redhat.com > > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit > http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-music-list > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to > fedora-music-list-request at redhat.com > > You can reach the person managing the list at > fedora-music-list-owner at redhat.com > > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific > than "Re: Contents of Fedora-music-list digest..." > > > Today's Topics: > > 1. jack and sound servers (Anthony Green) > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Message: 1 > Date: Tue, 30 May 2006 13:05:50 -0700 > From: Anthony Green > Subject: [Fedora-music-list] jack and sound servers > To: fedora-music-list at redhat.com > Message-ID: <1149019550.6060.99.camel at localhost.localdomain> > Content-Type: text/plain > > Good news... jack-audio-connection-kit is in extras-development. > > Also, about 6 months too late, I watched some of the videos from the > Boston FUDCon a few months ago... > http://torrent.fedoraproject.org/torrents/FUDConBoston2006.torrent > > The videos include a talk about sound on Linux, and it touches on jack, > LADSPA, etc. The presenter, Chris Montgomery, talks about a plan to > write a new sound server for Fedora that will satisfy both real- and > non-real-time audio applications. I don't know if anything has come of > that yet, but it would be interesting to hear an update if anybody here > has one. > > AG > > > > > ------------------------------ > > _______________________________________________ > Fedora-music-list mailing list > Fedora-music-list at redhat.com > http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-music-list > > > End of Fedora-music-list Digest, Vol 2, Issue 14 > ************************************************ > >