From burke at thealmquists.net Sun Mar 1 02:07:43 2009 From: burke at thealmquists.net (Almquist Burke) Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2009 20:07:43 -0600 Subject: [K12OSN] OT: Apple Imac lab In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On Feb 27, 2009, at 12:15 PM, David Hopkins wrote: > Ok, I have been asked to determine if it makes sense to acquire a lab > of Apple Imac ( www.apple.com/imac/specs ) and then PXE boot them when > they are not being used for video/audio processing classes. I know I > could configure them to mount home directories for users but that is > not what I'm being asked about. I'd prefer to stay with thin clients > except as far as I know there aren't any simple, easy-to-use > video/audio editing packages that 'just work' on thin clients. This is > for grades 5-8. Perhaps the ability to run local apps with K12Linux > solves this? > I wouldn't do AV editing on thin clients. In general, it's one of the more demanding things a client can do. Also, why buy expensive, high end macines if you aren't going to use that kind of performance. What you CAN do is buy lab of iMacs, just enough for AV editing (or any other really intensive applications), and hook them up as workstations that authenticate using LDAP and allow users access to their home file system using NFS, CIFS, or AFP etc. What I usually recommend in a school setting, is putting LDAP and NFS and/or CIFS home directories on a central server, probably CENTOS5, or something else really stable. It doesn't need a ton of horse power, mostly just RAM and and really good storage system (like raid 5 on some fast disks. Then your iMacs and the server(s) for your thin client lab(s) can authenticate and share storage on a central system. This also let's you run the latest/greatest LTSP on your thin clients without mucking around with their logins and data, since you keep that on a more stable server (makes upgrading the thin client server easier too, since there isn't much important data on it. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.7 (Darwin) iEYEARECAAYFAkmp7fAACgkQxWV7OPa/g5EwTACdGIoOV5TkB+BKC8dHHexSPD/T KEgAnjnZiZmrrWa9RuUMc5l4hoGcEMjU =/6cH -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From peter at scheie.homedns.org Sun Mar 1 05:54:24 2009 From: peter at scheie.homedns.org (Peter Scheie) Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2009 23:54:24 -0600 Subject: [K12OSN] OT: Apple Imac lab In-Reply-To: References: <1235770879.20787.12.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <49AA2310.7070103@scheie.homedns.org> Not to put too fine a point on it, but you should let the powers that be know that the acquisition cost is a minor part of the TCO. The major part is in supporting the machines, keeping them running, etc. With LTSP, you mostly support one machine, the server, with a little overhead for the clients. If they get 20 Macs, make sure everyone, and I mean everyone, knows the cost of supporting them will be 20 times the cost of the LTSP lab. Linux, done properly, is cheaper in the short run and MUCH cheaper in the long run. Peter David Hopkins wrote: >> It sounds like this teacher is wanting MAC up front, period. You said >> yourself " I don't like the idea". I bet you would be better off just >> letting this teacher run her Imacs as Imacs and not try doing the thin >> client thing. Reason I say this, been there done that,with someone with >> this mindset. Don't mean to sound so negative here, but from what I read >> here you are setting yourself up for one of the "I told you Thin Clients >> would not work" already. Remember this is a woman you are dealing >> with:). > > She is supportive of thin clients mostly but would definitely prefer > to move to all Macs if allowed (predominately because of video/audio > issues). What she doesn't want is MS products. Personally, I'd > prefer to stay with thin clients if possible but we already have a mix > of MS/Apple/Linux in the school. What I am worried about is starting > back down the slippery slope to all desktop systems which is where > this particular request is leading. There is a history behind it (a > little more about it below) > >> We set up 24 Imacs about 3 years ago and the slot load cd Imacs worked >> fine with sound, usb sticks , flash. The tray load( this is an easy way >> of distunguishing the different models), I could never get video to come >> up right.I can not remember what model of video card these had. But that >> has been about 4-5 versions ago of K12ltsp. The only reason we got rid >> of these Imacs was the new Super "wanted all the PC's to look the same". >> Go figure. >> You may like the challenge of making these work,which is cool, but I >> think I would just let her run with whatever she wants to use MAC >> related and save yourself some grief ,down the road. >> Let us know what transpires as things develop. > > That is why I am leery of Macs and PXE boot (netboot?). Actually, I am > somewhat past enjoying the challenge of trying to make things work > most days. I like stability and maintainability with no surprises. I > know I have to move to the latest K12Linux release for my servers > which is about all the excitement I want in the near term. I am > rather certain that once we add this Mac lab there will be an > immediate request for another laptop lab "because we have so many Macs > already" (already heard that in the context of the existing Mac > wireless lab). The current financial situation is such that it might > not happen but the school has been able to save so much money based on > using K12LTSP that ironically funding is available to remove most of > the thin clients. > > I'll definitely keep the list updated on what happens. There are some > meetings (State level) to discuss thin clients as a possible > state-wide model and moving from them to Macs right now at NCS would > be devastating to that possibility. > > Sincerely, > Dave Hopkins > > _______________________________________________ > K12OSN mailing list > K12OSN at redhat.com > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > For more info see > From mr.rcollins at gmail.com Sun Mar 1 14:19:39 2009 From: mr.rcollins at gmail.com (Ryan Collins) Date: Sun, 01 Mar 2009 09:19:39 -0500 Subject: [K12OSN] OT: Apple Imac lab In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <49AA997B.4060506@gmail.com> Almquist Burke wrote: > What you CAN do is buy lab of iMacs, just enough for AV editing (or > any other really intensive applications), and hook them up as > workstations that authenticate using LDAP and allow users access to > their home file system using NFS, CIFS, or AFP etc. What I usually > recommend in a school setting, is putting LDAP and NFS and/or CIFS home > directories on a central server, probably CENTOS5, or something else > really stable. It doesn't need a ton of horse power, mostly just RAM and > and really good storage system (like raid 5 on some fast disks. I'm going to second this. I hate to say this, and will probably be kicked off this list :-), but 20" iMacs running OS X Leopard will blow away anything you could provide by running them as thin clients. Plus if you share their home directory, their Desktop and Documents folder will stay the same whether they are on a thin-client in your building or under OS X. In my HS, the students log into Windows, LTSP, or OS X, and are greeted with the same Desktop and Documents. Remember, use the best tool for the job. Just install any software that you use on your thin clients under OS X (OpenOffice.org, Firefox, Scribus, Gimp, Audacity, etc.). You may want to look at getting a copy of Apple Remote Desktop too (it costs $300 though). You can remotely install software and keep the lab up to date from one machine. Bonus points if you dual boot them into Linux and OS X. :-D -- Ryan Collins - Technology Coordinator - Kenton City Schools Blog: http://ryancollins.org/wp/ -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: mr_rcollins.vcf Type: text/x-vcard Size: 161 bytes Desc: not available URL: From mr.rcollins at gmail.com Sun Mar 1 14:21:22 2009 From: mr.rcollins at gmail.com (Ryan Collins) Date: Sun, 01 Mar 2009 09:21:22 -0500 Subject: [K12OSN] OT: Apple Imac lab In-Reply-To: <49AA2310.7070103@scheie.homedns.org> References: <1235770879.20787.12.camel@localhost.localdomain> <49AA2310.7070103@scheie.homedns.org> Message-ID: <49AA99E2.2000509@gmail.com> Peter Scheie wrote: > Not to put too fine a point on it, but you should let the powers that be > know that the acquisition cost is a minor part of the TCO. The major > part is in supporting the machines, keeping them running, etc. With > LTSP, you mostly support one machine, the server, with a little overhead > for the clients. If they get 20 Macs, make sure everyone, and I mean > everyone, knows the cost of supporting them will be 20 times the cost of > the LTSP lab. Linux, done properly, is cheaper in the short run and > MUCH cheaper in the long run. TCO for 24 machines will basically be the same as a lab of thin clients, especially if you purchase a copy of Apple Remote Desktop. From one machine you can update the lab, install software, change settings, etc. -- Ryan Collins - Technology Coordinator - Kenton City Schools Blog: http://ryancollins.org/wp/ -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: mr_rcollins.vcf Type: text/x-vcard Size: 161 bytes Desc: not available URL: From dahopkins429 at gmail.com Sun Mar 1 15:36:13 2009 From: dahopkins429 at gmail.com (David Hopkins) Date: Sun, 1 Mar 2009 10:36:13 -0500 Subject: [K12OSN] OT: Apple Imac lab In-Reply-To: <49AA99E2.2000509@gmail.com> References: <1235770879.20787.12.camel@localhost.localdomain> <49AA2310.7070103@scheie.homedns.org> <49AA99E2.2000509@gmail.com> Message-ID: >> Not to put too fine a point on it, but you should let the powers that be >> know that the acquisition cost is a minor part of the TCO. ?The major part >> is in supporting the machines, keeping them running, etc. ?With LTSP, you >> mostly support one machine, the server, with a little overhead for the >> clients. ?If they get 20 Macs, make sure everyone, and I mean everyone, >> knows the cost of supporting them will be 20 times the cost of the LTSP lab. >> ?Linux, done properly, is cheaper in the short run and MUCH cheaper in the >> long run. > > TCO for 24 machines will basically be the same as a lab of thin clients, > especially if you purchase a copy of Apple Remote Desktop. From one machine > you can update the lab, install software, change settings, etc. For Linux, I can implement rdist and update servers. For Windows it is WSUS? Or one of the OSS alternatives. As I said above, this quickly degenerates into "remove all thin client technology and replace everything with Macs". That is part of the agenda which is being pushed. Once you have the lab, then you advocate to convert the libraries (for compatibility since the student and teachers will need to be compliant with the tech lab), then you add the classrooms since the libary isn't always available, then for the wireless labs, you upgrade for compatibility. In a couple of years, thin client tech is removed, costs have skyrocketed and going back isn't an option. Next would be the 3-5 year replacement cycle which would amount to 50K-100K/yr given the current number of systems in the school. So ... I'm just trying to really nail down the required functionality and meet that, trying to remain OS agnostic as much as possible. Going from Windows to thin clients on 'upgrades' isn't that difficult most of the time, but the Achille's heel on this is still sound/video editing. Even if could be done by adding a dedicated video/audio app server it would be worth it to avoid the slippery slope. Sincerely, Dave Hopkins From tuxnician at gmail.com Sun Mar 1 15:59:27 2009 From: tuxnician at gmail.com (Jason Yeoman) Date: Sun, 1 Mar 2009 10:59:27 -0500 Subject: [K12OSN] OT: Apple Imac lab In-Reply-To: References: <1235770879.20787.12.camel@localhost.localdomain> <49AA2310.7070103@scheie.homedns.org> <49AA99E2.2000509@gmail.com> Message-ID: <697a67d60903010759m60656af7jc6bffac14c137963@mail.gmail.com> Where I work our secondary schools each have a mac lab (including the art department) and it's used for multimedia, video editing etc. The rest of the school is XP with some classes having an entire lab of XP machines. If students need to work on the Macs they will have to wait until one becomes available (outside their regular classroom time). What kind of compatibility are they looking for between the macs and the ltsp clients? Outside of the lab what do they want to do with the other machines? Open Office is available for both Mac and Linux, Firefox etc. If they don't need to do anything more than video editing then using the ltsp would probably be the best option. > As I said above, this quickly degenerates into "remove all thin client > technology and replace everything with Macs". ?That is part of the > agenda which is being pushed. ?Once you have the lab, then you > advocate to convert the libraries (for compatibility since the student > and teachers will need to be compliant with the tech lab), then you > add the classrooms since the libary isn't always available, then for > the wireless labs, you upgrade for compatibility. ?In a couple of > years, thin client tech is removed, costs have skyrocketed and going > back isn't an option. ?Next would be the 3-5 year replacement cycle > which would amount to 50K-100K/yr given the current number of systems > in the school. So ... I'm just trying to really nail down the required > functionality and meet that, trying to remain OS agnostic as much as > possible. ?Going from Windows to thin clients on 'upgrades' isn't that > difficult most of the time, but the Achille's heel on this is still > sound/video editing. ?Even if could be done by adding a ?dedicated > video/audio app server it would be worth it to avoid the slippery > slope. From peter at scheie.homedns.org Sun Mar 1 17:17:57 2009 From: peter at scheie.homedns.org (Peter Scheie) Date: Sun, 01 Mar 2009 11:17:57 -0600 Subject: [K12OSN] OT: Apple Imac lab In-Reply-To: <49AA99E2.2000509@gmail.com> References: <1235770879.20787.12.camel@localhost.localdomain> <49AA2310.7070103@scheie.homedns.org> <49AA99E2.2000509@gmail.com> Message-ID: <49AAC345.3080600@scheie.homedns.org> Ryan Collins wrote: > Peter Scheie wrote: >> Not to put too fine a point on it, but you should let the powers that >> be know that the acquisition cost is a minor part of the TCO. The >> major part is in supporting the machines, keeping them running, etc. >> With LTSP, you mostly support one machine, the server, with a little >> overhead for the clients. If they get 20 Macs, make sure everyone, >> and I mean everyone, knows the cost of supporting them will be 20 >> times the cost of the LTSP lab. Linux, done properly, is cheaper in >> the short run and MUCH cheaper in the long run. > > TCO for 24 machines will basically be the same as a lab of thin clients, > especially if you purchase a copy of Apple Remote Desktop. From one > machine you can update the lab, install software, change settings, etc. > No, it's not. TCO is not just a measure of updates and the effor they require. All those fat clients have several more variables by definition than do thin clients, which must all be managed; the cost difference increases as the machines age and hardware becomes more likely to fail; performance varies as some clients are replace sooner than others; consistency quickly falls apart, driving up management costs. I agree that video editing is probably not something one would want to do on thin clients. My point is that the people who say 'We want to do video editing' have to understand the the short and long-term costs of such a setup are potentially exorbitant, which seems questionable for an application that will be used, what? Maybe two hours per week? That's less than 7% of the time kids are in school (assuming 30 hours per week). And that assumes that all students use this app, which isn't likely. A technological approach that costs more than twice as much up front, more than that over five years (what kind of shape will those Macs be in 5 year? 7 years?) for something that is used less than 10% of the time by a minority of students seems like a ridiculous idea. I think Burke arguably had the best idea, with some caveats: Create a small Mac lab for the video editing, but have it piggyback on the LTSP server for authentication and home dirs. LTSP lab(s) should be the default configuration throughout the school since it will provide 90% of what students need; and use a *small* Mac lab for such a specialized app. And make it clear how and why that lab costs more and provides less than the rest of the computing system (LTSP). Frankly, as a parent, I'd rather have the money spent on a(nother) teacher's aide. Peter From asmo.koskinen at arkki.info Sun Mar 1 16:09:39 2009 From: asmo.koskinen at arkki.info (Asmo Koskinen) Date: Sun, 01 Mar 2009 18:09:39 +0200 Subject: [K12OSN] OT: Apple Imac lab In-Reply-To: References: <1235770879.20787.12.camel@localhost.localdomain> <49AA2310.7070103@scheie.homedns.org> <49AA99E2.2000509@gmail.com> Message-ID: <49AAB343.8090305@arkki.info> David Hopkins kirjoitti: > Going from Windows to thin clients on 'upgrades' isn't that > difficult most of the time, but the Achille's heel on this is still > sound/video editing. Just a thought... Kino, Kdenlive, Ardourd2, Rosegarden, Hydrogen... are there really so bad? Here is one example about Studio, 12 fast and powerful audio/video PC workstations. http://asmokoskinen.blip.tv/file/1170407/ Sorry for my language... 1) Free programs 2) Free formats 3) Pupils can install and continue using these programs freely at the home That video (not Full HD Quicktime, but hey...) was made just with Kino - if pupils has something to say (ideas), there are free tools to do that at the school or at the home... Best Regards Asmo Koskinen. From asmo.koskinen at arkki.info Sun Mar 1 16:37:38 2009 From: asmo.koskinen at arkki.info (Asmo Koskinen) Date: Sun, 01 Mar 2009 18:37:38 +0200 Subject: [K12OSN] OT: Apple Imac lab In-Reply-To: <49AAB343.8090305@arkki.info> References: <1235770879.20787.12.camel@localhost.localdomain> <49AA2310.7070103@scheie.homedns.org> <49AA99E2.2000509@gmail.com> <49AAB343.8090305@arkki.info> Message-ID: <49AAB9D2.1050808@arkki.info> Asmo Koskinen kirjoitti: > Here is one example about Studio, 12 fast and powerful audio/video PC > workstations. And on that very same school we have about 100 thin clients with two servers. Most of time they use thin clients at the classrooms (we have 2 pupils/1 thin client in almost every classroom), but when they need audio/video or heavy use of flash/java/internet programs they go to the that Studio (classroom). Best Regards Asmo Koskinen. From lmowery at tech.washk12.org Sun Mar 1 17:22:38 2009 From: lmowery at tech.washk12.org (Lee Mowery) Date: Sun, 1 Mar 2009 10:22:38 -0700 Subject: [K12OSN] Re: OT: Apple Imac lab Message-ID: <73a04be80903010922y7cd9abc8o529de3423058e0bd@mail.gmail.com> Does thin client labs and thick client labs integrate well together? I am new to this and am trying various thin client labs before I try out some thick client labs. Would it be possible to keep using CentOS and have 20 other computers dedicated as thick clients that could do the audio/video while still have the same OS and desktop? I am thinking of a scenario where you have a LTSP server servicing a basic lab and a thick client server servicing machines dedicated to audio/video. The client machines in a thick lab wouldn't need to be that powerful would they? Does CentOS or K12Linux by Fedora have that option where in can do either thin or thick? -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From burke at thealmquists.net Sun Mar 1 18:48:23 2009 From: burke at thealmquists.net (Almquist Burke) Date: Sun, 1 Mar 2009 12:48:23 -0600 Subject: [K12OSN] OT: Apple Imac lab In-Reply-To: <49AA997B.4060506@gmail.com> References: <49AA997B.4060506@gmail.com> Message-ID: -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On Mar 1, 2009, at 8:19 AM, Ryan Collins wrote: > I'm going to second this. I hate to say this, and will probably be > kicked off this list :-), but 20" iMacs running OS X Leopard will > blow away anything you could provide by running them as thin clients. A 20" iMac is a great machine, but I don't think it's practical for a school to administer a whole fleet expensive (to buy and administer) and powerful machines when 90% of the time they don't need that kind of power. When schools try to standardize on that kind of high-end technology, they either waste a lot of money that would be better spent elsewhere, can't afford enough useable computers to go around, or they have to cut back in other areas in order to maintain the extravagant level of technology spending. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.7 (Darwin) iEYEARECAAYFAkmq2HcACgkQxWV7OPa/g5HuxQCfQYMovsA99tZUNbFW8ekc8Ouq +XAAnRbZldp+WmFg9FuxPQQ0g5clN44F =qjfA -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From burke at thealmquists.net Sun Mar 1 19:36:36 2009 From: burke at thealmquists.net (Almquist Burke) Date: Sun, 1 Mar 2009 13:36:36 -0600 Subject: [K12OSN] OT: Apple Imac lab In-Reply-To: <49AAB343.8090305@arkki.info> References: <1235770879.20787.12.camel@localhost.localdomain> <49AA2310.7070103@scheie.homedns.org> <49AA99E2.2000509@gmail.com> <49AAB343.8090305@arkki.info> Message-ID: -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On Mar 1, 2009, at 10:09 AM, Asmo Koskinen wrote: > David Hopkins kirjoitti: > >> Going from Windows to thin clients on 'upgrades' isn't that >> difficult most of the time, but the Achille's heel on this is still >> sound/video editing. > > Just a thought... > > Kino, Kdenlive, Ardourd2, Rosegarden, Hydrogen... are there really > so bad? > I wasn't questioning whether you could do A/V editing on Linux. I don't have a lot of experience with the various software packages for that, so I can't really compare that experience on different platforms and software packages. I was just suggesting that anything that is really hardware intensive (like A/V editing, encoding, or moderately demanding video games) really DOES need to run locally on a workstation powerful enough to support that activity. Thin clients aren't really a good idea for a demanding application like that, hence my suggestion to have a small lab of real (quote-unquote) workstations but have them authenticate and get NFS /home from the same server as your thin clients. I have saved document from DavidTrask and Matt Odquist on how to set this up for OS X workstations. I'm not sure if it's online anymore, so if you are interested I'd be happy to post it. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.7 (Darwin) iEYEARECAAYFAkmq48QACgkQxWV7OPa/g5Gq+ACfUnH3yveuS4XmqIBTowEoTf10 R1AAn0o1uNInmDRTX29wsbf/h9a4Arzl =a+wr -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From asmo.koskinen at arkki.info Sun Mar 1 19:56:52 2009 From: asmo.koskinen at arkki.info (Asmo Koskinen) Date: Sun, 01 Mar 2009 21:56:52 +0200 Subject: [K12OSN] OT: Apple Imac lab In-Reply-To: References: <1235770879.20787.12.camel@localhost.localdomain> <49AA2310.7070103@scheie.homedns.org> <49AA99E2.2000509@gmail.com> <49AAB343.8090305@arkki.info> Message-ID: <49AAE884.2060300@arkki.info> Almquist Burke kirjoitti: > I wasn't questioning whether you could do A/V editing on Linux. I do understand that. Best Regards Asmo Koskinen. From rowens at ptd.net Sun Mar 1 20:06:42 2009 From: rowens at ptd.net (Rob Owens) Date: Sun, 1 Mar 2009 15:06:42 -0500 Subject: [K12OSN] OT: Apple Imac lab In-Reply-To: References: <1235770879.20787.12.camel@localhost.localdomain> <49AA2310.7070103@scheie.homedns.org> <49AA99E2.2000509@gmail.com> Message-ID: <20090301200642.GB22835@aurora.owens.net> On Sun, Mar 01, 2009 at 10:36:13AM -0500, David Hopkins wrote: > >> Not to put too fine a point on it, but you should let the powers that be > >> know that the acquisition cost is a minor part of the TCO. ?The major part > >> is in supporting the machines, keeping them running, etc. ?With LTSP, you > >> mostly support one machine, the server, with a little overhead for the > >> clients. ?If they get 20 Macs, make sure everyone, and I mean everyone, > >> knows the cost of supporting them will be 20 times the cost of the LTSP lab. > >> ?Linux, done properly, is cheaper in the short run and MUCH cheaper in the > >> long run. > > > > TCO for 24 machines will basically be the same as a lab of thin clients, > > especially if you purchase a copy of Apple Remote Desktop. From one machine > > you can update the lab, install software, change settings, etc. > > For Linux, I can implement rdist and update servers. For Windows it > is WSUS? Or one of the OSS alternatives. > > As I said above, this quickly degenerates into "remove all thin client > technology and replace everything with Macs". That is part of the > agenda which is being pushed. Once you have the lab, then you > advocate to convert the libraries (for compatibility since the student > and teachers will need to be compliant with the tech lab), then you > add the classrooms since the libary isn't always available, then for > the wireless labs, you upgrade for compatibility. In a couple of > years, thin client tech is removed, costs have skyrocketed and going > back isn't an option. Next would be the 3-5 year replacement cycle > which would amount to 50K-100K/yr given the current number of systems > in the school. So ... I'm just trying to really nail down the required > functionality and meet that, trying to remain OS agnostic as much as > possible. Going from Windows to thin clients on 'upgrades' isn't that > difficult most of the time, but the Achille's heel on this is still > sound/video editing. Even if could be done by adding a dedicated > video/audio app server it would be worth it to avoid the slippery > slope. > David, I think your argument above is very valid, and it should probably be your primary argument to the administration. "I don't want to spend money on Macs for a video lab, because I'm afraid we'll end up spending money on Macs in areas where they're not needed". The solution doesn't have to be "don't buy Macs for the video lab". The school could instead implement a "standard computer package", probably based on LTSP, and require special authorization (and paperwork, expert witnesses, etc) to spend more. That could help prevent the slippery slope that you're concerned about, but it would also not lock out non-LTSP systems. I know you're a volunteer there, so maybe you're not in a position to impose that kind of approval system. But you should probably suggest it to the powers that be. -Rob From mel at melwade.com Sun Mar 1 21:00:28 2009 From: mel at melwade.com (Mel Wade) Date: Sun, 1 Mar 2009 13:00:28 -0800 Subject: [K12OSN] Server boots to console Message-ID: <43080f460903011300k4318a510se321ef0d125fed86@mail.gmail.com> It seems like I've run into this before. I just installed K12LSTP 5EL and the server boots to the console (text) rather the the GUI/kde. The inittab has runlevel 5 as the default... -- Mel Wade "A common mistake people make when trying to design something completely foolproof is to underestimate the ingenuity of complete fools." - Douglas Adams http://www.melwade.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From brcisna at eazylivin.net Sun Mar 1 21:27:02 2009 From: brcisna at eazylivin.net (Barry R Cisna) Date: Sun, 01 Mar 2009 15:27:02 -0600 Subject: [K12OSN] Server boots to console Message-ID: <1235942822.19916.16.camel@localhost.localdomain> Mel, Was this a fresh install of EL5? What video chipset is on this server? I assume you got the GUI in the install portion of EL5? If the below suggestions do not work,by chance,pop in an old pci video card and see if EL5 did not id the onboard video chip for some reason. Highly unlikely,though. Make sure your inittab has entries identical to this: ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ id:5:initdefault: # System initialization. si::sysinit:/etc/rc.d/rc.sysinit l0:0:wait:/etc/rc.d/rc 0 l1:1:wait:/etc/rc.d/rc 1 l2:2:wait:/etc/rc.d/rc 2 l3:3:wait:/etc/rc.d/rc 3 l4:4:wait:/etc/rc.d/rc 4 l5:5:wait:/etc/rc.d/rc 5 l6:6:wait:/etc/rc.d/rc 6 # Trap CTRL-ALT-DELETE ca::ctrlaltdel:/sbin/shutdown -t3 -r now # When our UPS tells us power has failed, assume we have a few minutes # of power left. Schedule a shutdown for 2 minutes from now. # This does, of course, assume you have powerd installed and your # UPS connected and working correctly. pf::powerfail:/sbin/shutdown -f -h +2 "Power Failure; System Shutting Down" # If power was restored before the shutdown kicked in, cancel it. pr:12345:powerokwait:/sbin/shutdown -c "Power Restored; Shutdown Cancelled" # Run gettys in standard runlevels 1:2345:respawn:/sbin/mingetty tty1 2:2345:respawn:/sbin/mingetty tty2 3:2345:respawn:/sbin/mingetty tty3 4:2345:respawn:/sbin/mingetty tty4 5:2345:respawn:/sbin/mingetty tty5 6:2345:respawn:/sbin/mingetty tty6 # Run xdm in runlevel 5 x:5:respawn:/etc/X11/prefdm -nodaemon ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ ,,this is default and I would guess you are seeing exactly the above. ,,,if so, do this in a terminal as root: vi /etc/hosts ,,,make sure you have an entry of 127.0.0.1 localhost.localdomain localhost ,,,at the top of hosts file. I bet you only have an IPV6 entry here,(and not the 127.0.0.1) Once you add the above entry reboot the server and hopefully you have a login box showing. Let us know what your findings are. Take Care, Barry Cisna From mel at melwade.com Sun Mar 1 21:32:12 2009 From: mel at melwade.com (Mel Wade) Date: Sun, 1 Mar 2009 13:32:12 -0800 Subject: [K12OSN] Server boots to console In-Reply-To: <1235942822.19916.16.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <1235942822.19916.16.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <43080f460903011332x65c94d27la171c12bc0eae920@mail.gmail.com> Yes, fresh install. I got it to work finally. I did a CTRL-ALT-F7 and then rebooted after logging in there. Now it boots to the GUI. Hmmm... -- Mel Wade "A common mistake people make when trying to design something completely foolproof is to underestimate the ingenuity of complete fools." - Douglas Adams http://www.melwade.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mr.rcollins at gmail.com Sun Mar 1 23:09:27 2009 From: mr.rcollins at gmail.com (Ryan Collins) Date: Sun, 01 Mar 2009 18:09:27 -0500 Subject: [K12OSN] OT: Apple Imac lab In-Reply-To: References: <1235770879.20787.12.camel@localhost.localdomain> <49AA2310.7070103@scheie.homedns.org> <49AA99E2.2000509@gmail.com> Message-ID: <49AB15A7.2050105@gmail.com> David Hopkins wrote: > As I said above, this quickly degenerates into "remove all thin client > technology and replace everything with Macs". That is part of the > agenda which is being pushed. Once you have the lab, then you > advocate to convert the libraries (for compatibility since the student > and teachers will need to be compliant with the tech lab), then you > add the classrooms since the libary isn't always available, then for > the wireless labs, you upgrade for compatibility. I thought this was for a video editing/multimedia lab? As long as you standardize your software around OSS, they can't use the "let's install this in the library for compatibility argument". Your student's will be working on their multimedia projects on the individual machines, not across the network (in fact, I partition the drives in our multimedia lab and the students are instructed to save their projects on the Temp partition. That way I can re-image the machines without losing any projects). If your students are using Firefox/Openoffice.org, etc. they can run that everywhere. You can set the Mac lab to authenticate and store the user home directories on your LTSP server. -- Ryan Collins - Technology Coordinator - Kenton City Schools Blog: http://ryancollins.org/wp/ -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: mr_rcollins.vcf Type: text/x-vcard Size: 161 bytes Desc: not available URL: From mr.rcollins at gmail.com Sun Mar 1 23:20:56 2009 From: mr.rcollins at gmail.com (Ryan Collins) Date: Sun, 01 Mar 2009 18:20:56 -0500 Subject: [K12OSN] OT: Apple Imac lab In-Reply-To: <49AAC345.3080600@scheie.homedns.org> References: <1235770879.20787.12.camel@localhost.localdomain> <49AA2310.7070103@scheie.homedns.org> <49AA99E2.2000509@gmail.com> <49AAC345.3080600@scheie.homedns.org> Message-ID: <49AB1858.2090908@gmail.com> Peter Scheie wrote: >> TCO for 24 machines will basically be the same as a lab of thin >> clients, especially if you purchase a copy of Apple Remote Desktop. >> From one machine you can update the lab, install software, change >> settings, etc. >> > No, it's not. TCO is not just a measure of updates and the effor they > require. All those fat clients have several more variables by > definition than do thin clients, which must all be managed; the cost > difference increases as the machines age and hardware becomes more > likely to fail; performance varies as some clients are replace sooner > than others; consistency quickly falls apart, driving up management > costs. The beauty of Macs is the standardization and reliability. It doesn't matter if machines are replaced with newer machines, one image can re-image all of them. You aren't hunting for drivers. I've got one Intel image for OS X 10.5.5 that goes on every single Intel Mac we have, from the Mac mini, to a couple of different revisions of the iMac. As for reliability, with only 24 machines you will probably run that lab for 5-10 years without a failure. (maybe a hard drive, but those aren't hard to replace if the machine is out of warranty). As for me, I still have All-in-one G3 macs from 1998 running as thick-clients to my LTSP server. Macs last forever. http://ryancollins.org/u/1r > I think Burke arguably had the best idea, with some caveats: Create a > small Mac lab for the video editing, but have it piggyback on the LTSP > server for authentication and home dirs. LTSP lab(s) should be the > default configuration throughout the school since it will provide 90% of > what students need; and use a *small* Mac lab for such a specialized > app. And make it clear how and why that lab costs more and provides > less than the rest of the computing system (LTSP). Frankly, as a parent, > I'd rather have the money spent on a(nother) teacher's aide. I agree completely with this and think it would be a very good direction to go. I can understand why the teacher wants to have Macs for a multimedia course. It's very difficult if not impossible to compete against Garageband, iMovie, Keynote, and iPhoto with OSS solutions. Someone else said in this thread, the best tool for the job. That's why I support OS X, Linux, and Windows. -- Ryan Collins - Technology Coordinator - Kenton City Schools Blog: http://ryancollins.org/wp/ -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: mr_rcollins.vcf Type: text/x-vcard Size: 161 bytes Desc: not available URL: From microman at cmosnetworks.com Mon Mar 2 03:48:32 2009 From: microman at cmosnetworks.com (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?=22Terrell_Prud=E9_Jr=2E=22?=) Date: Sun, 01 Mar 2009 22:48:32 -0500 Subject: [K12OSN] OT: Apple Imac lab In-Reply-To: <49AB1858.2090908@gmail.com> References: <1235770879.20787.12.camel@localhost.localdomain> <49AA2310.7070103@scheie.homedns.org> <49AA99E2.2000509@gmail.com> <49AAC345.3080600@scheie.homedns.org> <49AB1858.2090908@gmail.com> Message-ID: <49AB5710.10805@cmosnetworks.com> Ryan Collins wrote: > I agree completely with this and think it would be a very good > direction to go. I can understand why the teacher wants to have Macs > for a multimedia course. It's very difficult if not impossible to > compete against Garageband, iMovie, Keynote, and iPhoto with OSS > solutions. > Then let that teacher pay for part of it somehow. Say, maybe a 10% cut in either her pay or (more likely) some pet program of hers? Let's see just how important those expensive Macs are to her. Those who think that OSS has a problem "competing" against Apple's proprietary offerings might want to speak with Paul Nelson more about that. He's an actual classroom teacher in Riverdale School District in the Portland, OR area and one of the earliest adopters of K12LTSP. He might be able to shed some light for you. > Someone else said in this thread, the best tool for the job. That's > why I support OS X, Linux, and Windows. > Microsoft Windows is a tool whose only use is vendor lock-in. That's why I no longer support Microsoft Windows. --TP From dmahalko at gmail.com Mon Mar 2 04:03:09 2009 From: dmahalko at gmail.com (Dale Mahalko) Date: Sun, 1 Mar 2009 22:03:09 -0600 Subject: [K12OSN] OT: Apple Imac lab In-Reply-To: References: <49AA997B.4060506@gmail.com> Message-ID: On Sun, Mar 1, 2009 at 12:48 PM, Almquist Burke wrote: > A 20" iMac is a great machine, but I don't think it's practical for a > school to administer a whole fleet expensive (to buy and administer) and > powerful machines when 90% of the time they don't need that kind of power. I am lurking this list. Just want to mention that compared even to normal (non-thin) PC desktops, Apple has done a great job of forcing people to buy very expensive all-new hardware every few years. Integrating the screen with the CPU is brilliant from a marketing perspective, because when your CPU is old and slow in just a few years but the LCD is still nearly brand new, you still must discard the whole thing including your huge LCD. That integrated LCD allows them to stick another couple hundred in markup into their sleek all-in-one design, though it is also a massive waste of still-functional and usable display hardware. The Mac Mini is almost an afterthought of a product since Apple can't mark it up as much as the integrated slab. I don't believe there is any way to "cannibalize" a five-year old Mac all-in-one, to connect the huge high quality LCD to an external computer that is way faster than the old Mac guts.. - Dale -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From dahopkins429 at gmail.com Mon Mar 2 04:49:59 2009 From: dahopkins429 at gmail.com (David Hopkins) Date: Sun, 1 Mar 2009 23:49:59 -0500 Subject: [K12OSN] OT: Apple Imac lab In-Reply-To: <20090301200642.GB22835@aurora.owens.net> References: <1235770879.20787.12.camel@localhost.localdomain> <49AA2310.7070103@scheie.homedns.org> <49AA99E2.2000509@gmail.com> <20090301200642.GB22835@aurora.owens.net> Message-ID: Rob, and everyone else that has responded. Thanks for vote of confidence on this. I've read all the responses and I'll try to address them in this response. > I think your argument above is very valid, and it should probably be your primary argument to the administration. ?"I don't want to spend > money on Macs for a video lab, because I'm afraid we'll end up spending money on Macs in areas where they're not needed". Yep ... biggest concern. The discussion about 10% usage for video/audio is also valid but I learned some more details as well. There are some new state level standards (Web 2.0) that dictate that students will learn video/audio packages (not sure why, it really feels like the 'must learn MS Office debate a decade ago and the must learn DBase approach I saw before that in Florida). So, have to have the capability, somehow. IF (and it is a big IF) I can get buy-in to make this a very restricted special case scenario the lab could approach. That requires that there is a line drawn though. Now, the teacher has already added that she'll want all the packages on the thin clients on the Macs but ... she doesn't want OpenOffice on the Macs because 'it doesn't work right'. Instead she wants a different package. And we need to order the Type-to-Learn package for the Macs as well. So, the 'usage creep' has already started and the lab isn't even ordered. *SIGH ... > The solution doesn't have to be "don't buy Macs for the video lab". The school could instead implement a "standard computer package", > probably based on LTSP, and require special authorization (and paperwork, expert witnesses, etc) to spend more. That could help prevent > the slippery slope that you're concerned about, but it would also not lock out non-LTSP systems. So far this has been done except that newer staff and adminstrative staff in particular coming in from the other schools aren't buying into thin clients quite as much. They acknowledge that the uptime statistics are phenomenal (less than 4 hours of downtime this year to this point and part of that was a power failure that took out the school) but then they say "We can do the same with Windows as well" which I'll admit can be done with a huge investment of resources. They also acknowledge the ease of use and ability to sit anywhere and work is also fantastic. TeacherTool is very very popular as well. Does it work with FC10? I have to check. Next topic: To address the central file server, authentication and such. This is exactly the scenario I already use and have described before but I'll relist it here. I have LDAP/Samba authentication (Thanks David Trask and Matt!) with a secondary authentication server as well, file server with channel bonded output to handle the load, channel bonding on my main backbone between switches (I forget the actual type off the top of my head but amer.com switches support linking multiple ports between switches) to further remove bandwidth issues, heavily loaded servers on a single 24 port GigE switch which removes switch-to-switch network traffic completely in many cases, 2 Windows Terminal Servers, separate system to run backups (BackUPPC is EXCELLENT, thanks Les!), 6 LTSP servers running LTSP CentOS based, separate wireless network with filtering between it and the main network (firewalled), 200+ thin clients, 90+ printers. It does just work. All of this cost less than the estimated cost of retrofitting a single classroom to be the new Mac lab when you include the cost of the new Macs. > I know you're a volunteer there, so maybe you're not in a position to impose that kind of approval system. ?But you should probably suggest > it to the powers that be. I'm lucky in this respect. I started volunteering at the school when the school consisted of the School Director and a secretary working out of an office at the YMCA during the planning phase. I handled the IT since (with support from this list). I have a lot of 'capital' to spend based on how things currently work. In fact, this Wednesday there is supposed to be a meeting as part of a truly independent task force requested by the new Governor to look at IT in the state. (The chairwoman isn't even from the state and has no vested interests to worry about) A representative from the task force is coming to see how NCS "does IT" to determine if the model should be looked at as a possible solution state-wide. I wrote a letter that has been sent to this task force (if you'd like a copy, let me know). Again, there are many people who participate in this list that deserve tremendous amounts of credit for how successful NCS's IT solution is. I will absolutely be giving credit to everyone I can think of at this coming meeting. What will be the outcome of the meeting? I honestly don't know. I do know that if we have to then say "but we can't meet current state standards" using it, then it won't be as effective. Budget issues: There is tremendous resistance within parts of the DOE to going this route. Unfortunately for them, Delaware is looking at a 20% reduction in the state budget next year across the board and the new Governor is very open minded to new ideas and approaches. This is the best chance I've seen in 8 years to really get some attention. And the timing of the Mac lab couldn't be worse? But, everything works out in the end. I'm sure that will be the case here as well. Again, thanks for all the different viewpoints and suggestions to my question. They have been very helpful in letting me get a better handle on the multiple issues/concerns/approaches that exist. Sincerely, Dave Hopkins From Steven at SimplyCircus.com Mon Mar 2 05:51:28 2009 From: Steven at SimplyCircus.com (Steven Santos) Date: Mon, 2 Mar 2009 00:51:28 -0500 Subject: [K12OSN] OT: Apple Imac lab In-Reply-To: References: <1235770879.20787.12.camel@localhost.localdomain> <49AA2310.7070103@scheie.homedns.org> <49AA99E2.2000509@gmail.com> <20090301200642.GB22835@aurora.owens.net> Message-ID: Dave, Stick to your guns on the OO.o for the Macs, as I think that?s the big slippery slope. You volunteer your time adminning the Linux boxes. Adding this lab of Mac's will add a significant amount of work to you. What I don't understand is why you agreed to take on that extra work. If I were you, I would drop a few "this is a LOT of work I am not sure I can do on a volunteer basis... We may need to look at a support contract for all these Macs..." If you have a few quotes from Mac shops about supporting that lab with comparable uptime to the LTSP system (is that 99.999 or 99.9999 uptime...), I think you will find a lot more traction for your side of things. Just make sure to spec the quotes correctly so that they have to interface seamlessly with the existing servers, have the ability to netboot as LTSP/Win workstation, and whatever else you can think of. I strongly suspect such a contract will cost many times more than the lab itself. --- Steven Santos Director, Simply Circus, Inc. Email: Steven at SimplyCircus.com Mail: 14 Pierrepont Road Newton, MA 02462 Phone: 617-527-0667 Web: www.SimplyCircus.com > -----Original Message----- > From: k12osn-bounces at redhat.com [mailto:k12osn-bounces at redhat.com] On > Behalf Of David Hopkins > Sent: Sunday, March 01, 2009 11:50 PM > To: Support list for open source software in schools. > Subject: Re: [K12OSN] OT: Apple Imac lab > > Rob, and everyone else that has responded. > > Thanks for vote of confidence on this. I've read all the responses > and I'll try to address them in this response. > > > I think your argument above is very valid, and it should probably be > your primary argument to the administration. ?"I don't want to spend > > money on Macs for a video lab, because I'm afraid we'll end up > spending money on Macs in areas where they're not needed". > > Yep ... biggest concern. The discussion about 10% usage for > video/audio is also valid but I learned some more details as well. > There are some new state level standards (Web 2.0) that dictate that > students will learn video/audio packages (not sure why, it really > feels like the 'must learn MS Office debate a decade ago and the must > learn DBase approach I saw before that in Florida). So, have to have > the capability, somehow. IF (and it is a big IF) I can get buy-in to > make this a very restricted special case scenario the lab could > approach. That requires that there is a line drawn though. Now, the > teacher has already added that she'll want all the packages on the > thin clients on the Macs but ... she doesn't want OpenOffice on the > Macs because 'it doesn't work right'. Instead she wants a different > package. And we need to order the Type-to-Learn package for the Macs > as well. So, the 'usage creep' has already started and the lab isn't > even ordered. *SIGH ... > > > The solution doesn't have to be "don't buy Macs for the video lab". > The school could instead implement a "standard computer package", > > probably based on LTSP, and require special authorization (and > paperwork, expert witnesses, etc) to spend more. That could help > prevent > > the slippery slope that you're concerned about, but it would also not > lock out non-LTSP systems. > > So far this has been done except that newer staff and adminstrative > staff in particular coming in from the other schools aren't buying > into thin clients quite as much. They acknowledge that the uptime > statistics are phenomenal (less than 4 hours of downtime this year to > this point and part of that was a power failure that took out the > school) but then they say "We can do the same with Windows as well" > which I'll admit can be done with a huge investment of resources. They > also acknowledge the ease of use and ability to sit anywhere and work > is also fantastic. TeacherTool is very very popular as well. Does it > work with FC10? I have to check. > > Next topic: To address the central file server, authentication and > such. This is exactly the scenario I already use and have described > before but I'll relist it here. I have LDAP/Samba authentication > (Thanks David Trask and Matt!) with a secondary authentication server > as well, file server with channel bonded output to handle the load, > channel bonding on my main backbone between switches (I forget the > actual type off the top of my head but amer.com switches support > linking multiple ports between switches) to further remove bandwidth > issues, heavily loaded servers on a single 24 port GigE switch which > removes switch-to-switch network traffic completely in many cases, 2 > Windows Terminal Servers, separate system to run backups (BackUPPC is > EXCELLENT, thanks Les!), 6 LTSP servers running LTSP CentOS based, > separate wireless network with filtering between it and the main > network (firewalled), 200+ thin clients, 90+ printers. It does just > work. All of this cost less than the estimated cost of retrofitting a > single classroom to be the new Mac lab when you include the cost of > the new Macs. > > > I know you're a volunteer there, so maybe you're not in a position to > impose that kind of approval system. ?But you should probably suggest > > it to the powers that be. > > I'm lucky in this respect. I started volunteering at the school when > the school consisted of the School Director and a secretary working > out of an office at the YMCA during the planning phase. I handled the > IT since (with support from this list). I have a lot of 'capital' to > spend based on how things currently work. In fact, this Wednesday > there is supposed to be a meeting as part of a truly independent task > force requested by the new Governor to look at IT in the state. (The > chairwoman isn't even from the state and has no vested interests to > worry about) A representative from the task force is coming to see > how NCS "does IT" to determine if the model should be looked at as a > possible solution state-wide. I wrote a letter that has been sent to > this task force (if you'd like a copy, let me know). Again, there are > many people who participate in this list that deserve tremendous > amounts of credit for how successful NCS's IT solution is. I will > absolutely be giving credit to everyone I can think of at this coming > meeting. What will be the outcome of the meeting? I honestly don't > know. I do know that if we have to then say "but we can't meet current > state standards" using it, then it won't be as effective. > > Budget issues: There is tremendous resistance within parts of the DOE > to going this route. Unfortunately for them, Delaware is looking at a > 20% reduction in the state budget next year across the board and the > new Governor is very open minded to new ideas and approaches. This is > the best chance I've seen in 8 years to really get some attention. And > the timing of the Mac lab couldn't be worse? But, everything works > out in the end. I'm sure that will be the case here as well. > > Again, thanks for all the different viewpoints and suggestions to my > question. They have been very helpful in letting me get a better > handle on the multiple issues/concerns/approaches that exist. > > Sincerely, > Dave Hopkins > > _______________________________________________ > K12OSN mailing list > K12OSN at redhat.com > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > For more info see From lesmikesell at gmail.com Mon Mar 2 06:55:18 2009 From: lesmikesell at gmail.com (Les Mikesell) Date: Mon, 02 Mar 2009 00:55:18 -0600 Subject: [K12OSN] OT: Apple Imac lab In-Reply-To: References: <1235770879.20787.12.camel@localhost.localdomain> <49AA2310.7070103@scheie.homedns.org> <49AA99E2.2000509@gmail.com> <20090301200642.GB22835@aurora.owens.net> Message-ID: <49AB82D6.5080700@gmail.com> Steven Santos wrote: > Dave, > > Stick to your guns on the OO.o for the Macs, as I think that?s the big > slippery slope. > > You volunteer your time adminning the Linux boxes. Adding this lab of Mac's > will add a significant amount of work to you. What I don't understand is > why you agreed to take on that extra work. > > If I were you, I would drop a few "this is a LOT of work I am not sure I can > do on a volunteer basis... We may need to look at a support contract for all > these Macs..." Macs - a lot of work??? I think you'll have a bit of a credibility problem with that. Expensive, yes, but... > If you have a few quotes from Mac shops about supporting > that lab with comparable uptime to the LTSP system (is that 99.999 or > 99.9999 uptime...), You might need some spares to make that number - with either system. > I think you will find a lot more traction for your side > of things. Just make sure to spec the quotes correctly so that they have to > interface seamlessly with the existing servers, have the ability to netboot > as LTSP/Win workstation, and whatever else you can think of. I strongly > suspect such a contract will cost many times more than the lab itself. If you want to use fully-loaded Macs as clients to an LTSP system, the easy way is to run the NX client with freenx on the server. -- Les Mikesell lesmikesell at gmail.com From graham at theingots.org.nz Mon Mar 2 11:18:18 2009 From: graham at theingots.org.nz (Graham Lauder) Date: Tue, 3 Mar 2009 00:18:18 +1300 Subject: [K12OSN] OT: Apple Imac lab In-Reply-To: References: <1235770879.20787.12.camel@localhost.localdomain> <20090301200642.GB22835@aurora.owens.net> Message-ID: <200903030018.19163.graham@theingots.org.nz> On Mon, 02 Mar 2009 17:49:59 David Hopkins wrote: > Rob, and everyone else that has responded. Hi David, > > Thanks for vote of confidence on this. I've read all the responses > and I'll try to address them in this response. > > > I think your argument above is very valid, and it should probably be your > > primary argument to the administration. ?"I don't want to spend money on > > Macs for a video lab, because I'm afraid we'll end up spending money on > > Macs in areas where they're not needed". > > Yep ... biggest concern. The discussion about 10% usage for > video/audio is also valid but I learned some more details as well. > There are some new state level standards (Web 2.0) that dictate that > students will learn video/audio packages (not sure why, it really > feels like the 'must learn MS Office debate a decade ago and the must > learn DBase approach I saw before that in Florida). So, have to have > the capability, somehow. Stick with Linux fat clients and use Rosegarden / Audacity for sound and Cinelerra / Avidemux / Kino for video and remind the teacher that Lord of the Rings and everything produced by Weta Studios is/was done on Linux. > IF (and it is a big IF) I can get buy-in to > make this a very restricted special case scenario the lab could > approach. That requires that there is a line drawn though. Now, the > teacher has already added that she'll want all the packages on the > thin clients on the Macs but ... she doesn't want OpenOffice on the > Macs because 'it doesn't work right'. Instead she wants a different > package. And we need to order the Type-to-Learn package for the Macs > as well. So, the 'usage creep' has already started and the lab isn't > even ordered. *SIGH ... She is obviously referring to the old X11 port of OOo, she might need to be brought up to date with the 3.0.1 Mac port. That was after all the major point of 3.0. > > > The solution doesn't have to be "don't buy Macs for the video lab". The > > school could instead implement a "standard computer package", probably > > based on LTSP, and require special authorization (and paperwork, expert > > witnesses, etc) to spend more. That could help prevent the slippery > > slope that you're concerned about, but it would also not lock out > > non-LTSP systems. > > So far this has been done except that newer staff and adminstrative > staff in particular coming in from the other schools aren't buying > into thin clients quite as much. They acknowledge that the uptime > statistics are phenomenal (less than 4 hours of downtime this year to > this point and part of that was a power failure that took out the > school) but then they say "We can do the same with Windows as well" > which I'll admit can be done with a huge investment of resources. They > also acknowledge the ease of use and ability to sit anywhere and work > is also fantastic. TeacherTool is very very popular as well. Does it > work with FC10? I have to check. > > Next topic: To address the central file server, authentication and > such. This is exactly the scenario I already use and have described > before but I'll relist it here. I have LDAP/Samba authentication > (Thanks David Trask and Matt!) with a secondary authentication server > as well, file server with channel bonded output to handle the load, > channel bonding on my main backbone between switches (I forget the > actual type off the top of my head but amer.com switches support > linking multiple ports between switches) to further remove bandwidth > issues, heavily loaded servers on a single 24 port GigE switch which > removes switch-to-switch network traffic completely in many cases, 2 > Windows Terminal Servers, separate system to run backups (BackUPPC is > EXCELLENT, thanks Les!), 6 LTSP servers running LTSP CentOS based, > separate wireless network with filtering between it and the main > network (firewalled), 200+ thin clients, 90+ printers. It does just > work. All of this cost less than the estimated cost of retrofitting a > single classroom to be the new Mac lab when you include the cost of > the new Macs. > > > I know you're a volunteer there, so maybe you're not in a position to > > impose that kind of approval system. ?But you should probably suggest it > > to the powers that be. > > I'm lucky in this respect. I started volunteering at the school when > the school consisted of the School Director and a secretary working > out of an office at the YMCA during the planning phase. I handled the > IT since (with support from this list). I have a lot of 'capital' to > spend based on how things currently work. In fact, this Wednesday > there is supposed to be a meeting as part of a truly independent task > force requested by the new Governor to look at IT in the state. (The > chairwoman isn't even from the state and has no vested interests to > worry about) A representative from the task force is coming to see > how NCS "does IT" to determine if the model should be looked at as a > possible solution state-wide. I wrote a letter that has been sent to > this task force (if you'd like a copy, let me know). Again, there are > many people who participate in this list that deserve tremendous > amounts of credit for how successful NCS's IT solution is. I will > absolutely be giving credit to everyone I can think of at this coming > meeting. What will be the outcome of the meeting? I honestly don't > know. I do know that if we have to then say "but we can't meet current > state standards" using it, then it won't be as effective. > > Budget issues: There is tremendous resistance within parts of the DOE > to going this route. Unfortunately for them, Delaware is looking at a > 20% reduction in the state budget next year across the board and the > new Governor is very open minded to new ideas and approaches. This is > the best chance I've seen in 8 years to really get some attention. And > the timing of the Mac lab couldn't be worse? But, everything works > out in the end. I'm sure that will be the case here as well. > > Again, thanks for all the different viewpoints and suggestions to my > question. They have been very helpful in letting me get a better > handle on the multiple issues/concerns/approaches that exist. > > Sincerely, > Dave Hopkins > > _______________________________________________ > K12OSN mailing list > K12OSN at redhat.com > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > For more info see -- Graham Lauder, INGOTs Assessor Trainer (International Grades in Office Technologies) http://www.theingots.org OpenOffice.org MarCon (Marketing Contact) NZ http://marketing.openoffice.org/contacts.html Open Opportunities ltd. Open Technologies Training and Migration Consultants OOoGear: For the Well dressed OOo Advocate http://ooogear.co.nz From mr.rcollins at gmail.com Mon Mar 2 13:15:14 2009 From: mr.rcollins at gmail.com (Ryan Collins) Date: Mon, 02 Mar 2009 08:15:14 -0500 Subject: [K12OSN] OT: Apple Imac lab In-Reply-To: <49AB5710.10805@cmosnetworks.com> References: <1235770879.20787.12.camel@localhost.localdomain> <49AA2310.7070103@scheie.homedns.org> <49AA99E2.2000509@gmail.com> <49AAC345.3080600@scheie.homedns.org> <49AB1858.2090908@gmail.com> <49AB5710.10805@cmosnetworks.com> Message-ID: <49ABDBE2.8070604@gmail.com> Terrell Prud? Jr. wrote: >> I agree completely with this and think it would be a very good >> direction to go. I can understand why the teacher wants to have Macs >> for a multimedia course. It's very difficult if not impossible to >> compete against Garageband, iMovie, Keynote, and iPhoto with OSS >> solutions. > > Then let that teacher pay for part of it somehow. Say, maybe a 10% cut > in either her pay or (more likely) some pet program of hers? Let's see > just how important those expensive Macs are to her. I think we're losing sight of our job in supporting technology in the school. It's my job to provide my students with the most opportunities. The best tool for the job. I'm a major proponent of OSS in our district, with over 100 thin clients, so don't think I'm bashing LTSP or OSS (why would I be a member of this list for over 3 or 4 years if I didn't), but I also know where OSS doesn't cut it. > Those who think that OSS has a problem "competing" against Apple's > proprietary offerings might want to speak with Paul Nelson more about > that. He's an actual classroom teacher in Riverdale School District in > the Portland, OR area and one of the earliest adopters of K12LTSP. He > might be able to shed some light for you. You can't honestly say that Audacity is a better tool for students than Garageband? Kino/Cinelerra to iMovie? I want my students to be able to produce. I have the utmost respectfor Paul Nelson and Eric Harrison. Without them, I wouldn't be running LTSP. Their work has been integral to us re-purposing old machines as useful clients. >> Someone else said in this thread, the best tool for the job. That's >> why I support OS X, Linux, and Windows. > > Microsoft Windows is a tool whose only use is vendor lock-in. That's > why I no longer support Microsoft Windows. And once the only tool you have is a hammer, every problem looks like a nail. We are all fighting the fight, but we shouldn't let ideologies hinder out students. -- Ryan Collins - Technology Coordinator - Kenton City Schools Blog: http://ryancollins.org/wp/ -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: mr_rcollins.vcf Type: text/x-vcard Size: 161 bytes Desc: not available URL: From mr.rcollins at gmail.com Mon Mar 2 13:21:19 2009 From: mr.rcollins at gmail.com (Ryan Collins) Date: Mon, 02 Mar 2009 08:21:19 -0500 Subject: [K12OSN] OT: Apple Imac lab In-Reply-To: References: <49AA997B.4060506@gmail.com> Message-ID: <49ABDD4F.6020603@gmail.com> Dale Mahalko wrote: > I am lurking this list. Just want to mention that compared even to normal > (non-thin) PC desktops, Apple has done a great job of forcing people to buy > very expensive all-new hardware every few years. > > Integrating the screen with the CPU is brilliant from a marketing > perspective, because when your CPU is old and slow in just a few years but > the LCD is still nearly brand new, you still must discard the whole thing > including your huge LCD. Am I the only person on this list running Macs? The great thing about Macs is their longevity. That's why TCO of Macs are low. I've still got 10 1/2 year old Macs running (they're now thick-client terminals for a LTSP server). I have two labs of iMacs from 2000-2001 running as thin-clients. By the time we're done with a machine, it's useless. :-) -- Ryan Collins - Technology Coordinator - Kenton City Schools Blog: http://ryancollins.org/wp/ -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: mr_rcollins.vcf Type: text/x-vcard Size: 161 bytes Desc: not available URL: From simpsond at leopards.k12.ar.us Mon Mar 2 13:33:34 2009 From: simpsond at leopards.k12.ar.us (Doug Simpson) Date: Mon, 02 Mar 2009 07:33:34 -0600 Subject: [K12OSN] OT: Apple Imac lab In-Reply-To: <49ABDD4F.6020603@gmail.com> References: <49AA997B.4060506@gmail.com> <49ABDD4F.6020603@gmail.com> Message-ID: <49AB8BCD.550C.0078.0@leopards.k12.ar.us> That isn't much better longevity than we get here! Last week we removed from service some PC's that were several years old when I started working here 11 years ago. They still run and were used on a daily basis. We are replacing the lab they were in with new units, but they run fine as they were. . .Just outdated. . . DS Doug Simpson Technology Specialist De Queen Public Schools De Queen, AR simpsond at leopards.k12.ar.us "A Dollar Saved is a Dollar Earned" >>> Ryan Collins 3/2/2009 7:21 AM >>> Dale Mahalko wrote: > I am lurking this list. Just want to mention that compared even to normal > (non-thin) PC desktops, Apple has done a great job of forcing people to buy > very expensive all-new hardware every few years. > > Integrating the screen with the CPU is brilliant from a marketing > perspective, because when your CPU is old and slow in just a few years but > the LCD is still nearly brand new, you still must discard the whole thing > including your huge LCD. Am I the only person on this list running Macs? The great thing about Macs is their longevity. That's why TCO of Macs are low. I've still got 10 1/2 year old Macs running (they're now thick-client terminals for a LTSP server). I have two labs of iMacs from 2000-2001 running as thin-clients. By the time we're done with a machine, it's useless. :-) -- Ryan Collins - Technology Coordinator - Kenton City Schools Blog: http://ryancollins.org/wp/ From mr.rcollins at gmail.com Mon Mar 2 13:49:27 2009 From: mr.rcollins at gmail.com (Ryan Collins) Date: Mon, 02 Mar 2009 08:49:27 -0500 Subject: [K12OSN] OT: Apple Imac lab In-Reply-To: References: <1235770879.20787.12.camel@localhost.localdomain> <49AA2310.7070103@scheie.homedns.org> <49AA99E2.2000509@gmail.com> <20090301200642.GB22835@aurora.owens.net> Message-ID: <49ABE3E7.3080100@gmail.com> David Hopkins wrote: > Now, the teacher has already added that she'll want all the packages > on the thin clients on the Macs but ... she doesn't want OpenOffice > on the Macs because 'it doesn't work right'. Instead she wants a > different package. And we need to order the Type-to-Learn package for > the Macs as well. So, the 'usage creep' has already started and the > lab isn't even ordered. *SIGH ... She needs to look at OOo 3.0.1, it works fine. If she wants something more "Maccy", look at NeoOffice. Whoa, I thought this was a multimedia lab. What's Type-to-learn doing in there? Are you running this on the thin-clients? (* I hate taking instructional time out for teaching typing. That's the biggest waste of resources. Get the students on the machine, they'll learn how to type. I've never had a typing class and can type 70wpm. *) > So far this has been done except that newer staff and adminstrative > staff in particular coming in from the other schools aren't buying > into thin clients quite as much. They acknowledge that the uptime > statistics are phenomenal (less than 4 hours of downtime this year to > this point and part of that was a power failure that took out the > school) but then they say "We can do the same with Windows as well" > which I'll admit can be done with a huge investment of resources. For those naysayers, you really need to talk about the initial and ongoing costs. The most resistance I've had is the English dept. at the HS. They're complaining about the lack of a grammar checker, and the Language Tools plugin for OOo doesn't cut it. > They also acknowledge the ease of use and ability to sit anywhere and > work is also fantastic. Who runs a district where you can't do this? > Budget issues: There is tremendous resistance within parts of the DOE > to going this route. Unfortunately for them, Delaware is looking at > a 20% reduction in the state budget next year across the board and > the new Governor is very open minded to new ideas and approaches. > This is the best chance I've seen in 8 years to really get some > attention. And the timing of the Mac lab couldn't be worse? But, > everything works out in the end. I'm sure that will be the case here > as well. I've been running thin-clients since the 02-03 school year, but it's only been in the past 1 or 2 years that the state of Ohio has finally decided that thin-clients might be a direction to go. Hopefully the NJ DOE will realize the savings in time and money. Be vocal on the costs. 24 machines x $1,149 is $27,576. That's a lot of money. Also be aware that schools can still buy the 17" iMac for $899 ($21,576), so that might come up if the money isn't there for the 20" iMacs. You won't be able to use TCO figures, since Macs have such a low TCO. BTW, where was the $40K figure coming from? -- Ryan Collins - Technology Coordinator - Kenton City Schools Blog: http://ryancollins.org/wp/ -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: mr_rcollins.vcf Type: text/x-vcard Size: 161 bytes Desc: not available URL: From lesmikesell at gmail.com Mon Mar 2 14:35:44 2009 From: lesmikesell at gmail.com (Les Mikesell) Date: Mon, 02 Mar 2009 08:35:44 -0600 Subject: [K12OSN] OT: Apple Imac lab In-Reply-To: <49ABE3E7.3080100@gmail.com> References: <1235770879.20787.12.camel@localhost.localdomain> <49AA2310.7070103@scheie.homedns.org> <49AA99E2.2000509@gmail.com> <20090301200642.GB22835@aurora.owens.net> <49ABE3E7.3080100@gmail.com> Message-ID: <49ABEEC0.8010707@gmail.com> Ryan Collins wrote: > >> They also acknowledge the ease of use and ability to sit anywhere and >> work is also fantastic. > > Who runs a district where you can't do this? How many places can do video editing at a reasonable speed while sitting anywhere? -- Les Mikesell lesmikesell at gmail.com From rowens at ptd.net Mon Mar 2 14:43:07 2009 From: rowens at ptd.net (Rob Owens) Date: Mon, 2 Mar 2009 09:43:07 -0500 Subject: [K12OSN] OT: Apple Imac lab In-Reply-To: <49ABE3E7.3080100@gmail.com> References: <1235770879.20787.12.camel@localhost.localdomain> <49AA2310.7070103@scheie.homedns.org> <49AA99E2.2000509@gmail.com> <20090301200642.GB22835@aurora.owens.net> <49ABE3E7.3080100@gmail.com> Message-ID: <20090302144307.GB27725@aurora.owens.net> On Mon, Mar 02, 2009 at 08:49:27AM -0500, Ryan Collins wrote: > David Hopkins wrote: >> Now, the teacher has already added that she'll want all the packages >> on the thin clients on the Macs but ... she doesn't want OpenOffice >> on the Macs because 'it doesn't work right'. Instead she wants a >> different package. And we need to order the Type-to-Learn package for >> the Macs as well. So, the 'usage creep' has already started and the >> lab isn't even ordered. *SIGH ... > > She needs to look at OOo 3.0.1, it works fine. If she wants something > more "Maccy", look at NeoOffice. > > Whoa, I thought this was a multimedia lab. What's Type-to-learn doing in > there? Are you running this on the thin-clients? > I agree. In high school my science class had an oven for doing experiments, but you weren't allowed to heat your lunch in it. The woodshop had a band saw, but you weren't allowed to use it to slice your sandwich. These tools were bought for a special purpose, and for general use you were expected to use a general-purpose tool (a microwave oven and a plastic knife). > (* I hate taking instructional time out for teaching typing. That's the > biggest waste of resources. Get the students on the machine, they'll > learn how to type. I've never had a typing class and can type 70wpm. *) > >> So far this has been done except that newer staff and adminstrative >> staff in particular coming in from the other schools aren't buying >> into thin clients quite as much. They acknowledge that the uptime >> statistics are phenomenal (less than 4 hours of downtime this year to >> this point and part of that was a power failure that took out the >> school) but then they say "We can do the same with Windows as well" >> which I'll admit can be done with a huge investment of resources. > > For those naysayers, you really need to talk about the initial and > ongoing costs. > > The most resistance I've had is the English dept. at the HS. They're > complaining about the lack of a grammar checker, and the Language Tools > plugin for OOo doesn't cut it. > Rhetorical question: why is the English Dept. teaching their students to rely on a grammar checker? -Rob From rowens at ptd.net Mon Mar 2 14:50:22 2009 From: rowens at ptd.net (Rob Owens) Date: Mon, 2 Mar 2009 09:50:22 -0500 Subject: [K12OSN] OT: Apple Imac lab In-Reply-To: <49ABDBE2.8070604@gmail.com> References: <1235770879.20787.12.camel@localhost.localdomain> <49AA2310.7070103@scheie.homedns.org> <49AA99E2.2000509@gmail.com> <49AAC345.3080600@scheie.homedns.org> <49AB1858.2090908@gmail.com> <49AB5710.10805@cmosnetworks.com> <49ABDBE2.8070604@gmail.com> Message-ID: <20090302145021.GC27725@aurora.owens.net> On Mon, Mar 02, 2009 at 08:15:14AM -0500, Ryan Collins wrote: > Terrell Prud? Jr. wrote: >>> I agree completely with this and think it would be a very good >>> direction to go. I can understand why the teacher wants to have Macs >>> for a multimedia course. It's very difficult if not impossible to >>> compete against Garageband, iMovie, Keynote, and iPhoto with OSS >>> solutions. >> >> Then let that teacher pay for part of it somehow. Say, maybe a 10% cut >> in either her pay or (more likely) some pet program of hers? Let's see >> just how important those expensive Macs are to her. > > I think we're losing sight of our job in supporting technology in the > school. It's my job to provide my students with the most opportunities. > The best tool for the job. > > I'm a major proponent of OSS in our district, with over 100 thin > clients, so don't think I'm bashing LTSP or OSS (why would I be a member > of this list for over 3 or 4 years if I didn't), but I also know where > OSS doesn't cut it. > >> Those who think that OSS has a problem "competing" against Apple's >> proprietary offerings might want to speak with Paul Nelson more about >> that. He's an actual classroom teacher in Riverdale School District in >> the Portland, OR area and one of the earliest adopters of K12LTSP. He >> might be able to shed some light for you. > > You can't honestly say that Audacity is a better tool for students than > Garageband? Kino/Cinelerra to iMovie? I want my students to be able to > produce. > I'm not sure if it matters which is better. I've heard so many of us say "teach concepts, not software" when it comes to office applications, and I think the same should apply here. David, you should try running Audacity on the thin clients like this: esddsp audacity Audacity doesn't support ESD natively, but esddsp will force its sound output to go through ESD (you probably already know this). It's not perfect, though, so make sure you test it. You could also try that with the video applications, but I've found that it sometimes causes the audio and video to become offset from each other in time. Actually, that was while using "padsp avidemux" -- padsp does for pulseaudio what esddsp does for ESD. -Rob From mr.rcollins at gmail.com Mon Mar 2 15:04:15 2009 From: mr.rcollins at gmail.com (Ryan Collins) Date: Mon, 02 Mar 2009 10:04:15 -0500 Subject: [K12OSN] OT: Apple Imac lab In-Reply-To: <49ABEEC0.8010707@gmail.com> References: <1235770879.20787.12.camel@localhost.localdomain> <49AA2310.7070103@scheie.homedns.org> <49AA99E2.2000509@gmail.com> <20090301200642.GB22835@aurora.owens.net> <49ABE3E7.3080100@gmail.com> <49ABEEC0.8010707@gmail.com> Message-ID: <49ABF56F.1040606@gmail.com> Les Mikesell wrote: > Ryan Collins wrote: >> >>> They also acknowledge the ease of use and ability to sit anywhere and >>> work is also fantastic. >> >> Who runs a district where you can't do this? > > How many places can do video editing at a reasonable speed while sitting > anywhere? The response wasn't toward video editing, I guess I cut too much out. In my district they could do video editing from any OS X machine they have logged into, the problem would be the 500MB quota. -- Ryan Collins - Technology Coordinator - Kenton City Schools Blog: http://ryancollins.org/wp/ -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: mr_rcollins.vcf Type: text/x-vcard Size: 161 bytes Desc: not available URL: From mr.rcollins at gmail.com Mon Mar 2 15:09:13 2009 From: mr.rcollins at gmail.com (Ryan Collins) Date: Mon, 02 Mar 2009 10:09:13 -0500 Subject: [K12OSN] OT: Apple Imac lab In-Reply-To: <20090302144307.GB27725@aurora.owens.net> References: <1235770879.20787.12.camel@localhost.localdomain> <49AA2310.7070103@scheie.homedns.org> <49AA99E2.2000509@gmail.com> <20090301200642.GB22835@aurora.owens.net> <49ABE3E7.3080100@gmail.com> <20090302144307.GB27725@aurora.owens.net> Message-ID: <49ABF699.4000803@gmail.com> Rob Owens wrote: > Rhetorical question: why is the English Dept. teaching their students to rely on a grammar checker? That was my question. I've showed them that the research shows that grammar checking isn't reliable and that it has a negative effect on their teaching, but to no avail. They've been spoiled since the Mac version of Office has a decent grammar checker (35% accuracy) versus the Windows version of Office (0%, although Word 97 did do better at 24%): http://ryancollins.org/u/1s BTW, here are my links about the subject: http://delicious.com/mr.rcollins/grammar+english -- Ryan Collins - Technology Coordinator - Kenton City Schools Blog: http://ryancollins.org/wp/ -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: mr_rcollins.vcf Type: text/x-vcard Size: 161 bytes Desc: not available URL: From simpsond at leopards.k12.ar.us Mon Mar 2 15:23:05 2009 From: simpsond at leopards.k12.ar.us (Doug Simpson) Date: Mon, 02 Mar 2009 09:23:05 -0600 Subject: [K12OSN] OT: Apple Imac lab In-Reply-To: <49ABF699.4000803@gmail.com> References: <1235770879.20787.12.camel@localhost.localdomain> <49AA2310.7070103@scheie.homedns.org> <49AA99E2.2000509@gmail.com> <20090301200642.GB22835@aurora.owens.net> <49ABE3E7.3080100@gmail.com> <20090302144307.GB27725@aurora.owens.net><20090302144307.GB27725@aurora.owens.net> <49ABF699.4000803@gmail.com> Message-ID: <49ABA578.550C.0078.0@leopards.k12.ar.us> Probably for the same reason that they teach kids to rely on a calculator in math classes. We were not allowed to have them in any of our math classes. . . Well, about all they'd do was add, subtract multiply and divide, and maybe a memory function anyway. . . This does not mean that a calculator makes it easier, but they need to learn *how* to *do* the problem first, then learn to use the calculator to do it faster and more accurately. JMHO - YMMV Doug Doug Simpson Technology Specialist De Queen Public Schools De Queen, AR simpsond at leopards.k12.ar.us "A Dollar Saved is a Dollar Earned" >>> Ryan Collins 3/2/2009 9:09 AM >>> Rob Owens wrote: > Rhetorical question: why is the English Dept. teaching their students to rely on a grammar checker? That was my question. I've showed them that the research shows that grammar checking isn't reliable and that it has a negative effect on their teaching, but to no avail. They've been spoiled since the Mac version of Office has a decent grammar checker (35% accuracy) versus the Windows version of Office (0%, although Word 97 did do better at 24%): http://ryancollins.org/u/1s BTW, here are my links about the subject: http://delicious.com/mr.rcollins/grammar+english -- Ryan Collins - Technology Coordinator - Kenton City Schools Blog: http://ryancollins.org/wp/ From dahopkins429 at gmail.com Mon Mar 2 15:26:49 2009 From: dahopkins429 at gmail.com (David Hopkins) Date: Mon, 2 Mar 2009 10:26:49 -0500 Subject: [K12OSN] OT: Apple Imac lab In-Reply-To: <20090302145021.GC27725@aurora.owens.net> References: <1235770879.20787.12.camel@localhost.localdomain> <49AA2310.7070103@scheie.homedns.org> <49AA99E2.2000509@gmail.com> <49AAC345.3080600@scheie.homedns.org> <49AB1858.2090908@gmail.com> <49AB5710.10805@cmosnetworks.com> <49ABDBE2.8070604@gmail.com> <20090302145021.GC27725@aurora.owens.net> Message-ID: >> You can't honestly say that Audacity is a better tool for students than >> Garageband? Kino/Cinelerra to iMovie? I want my students to be able to >> produce. >> > I'm not sure if it matters which is better. ?I've heard so many of us say "teach concepts, not software" when it comes to office applications, and I > think the same should apply here. > > David, you should try running Audacity on the thin clients like this: ?esddsp audacity It is difficult to compete with Garageband and the rest. I have run audacity (centos5.2) and while the sound works, the microphone doesn't. She insists that she has to have the microphones, video capture, apps ... yep ... take what the latest Mac can do and those are the specs. I see her point. And I didn't mean to lead the list down this path but hopefully it is proving to be a useful discussion. From cisna-barry at wc235.k12.il.us Mon Mar 2 15:28:15 2009 From: cisna-barry at wc235.k12.il.us (Barry Cisna) Date: Mon, 02 Mar 2009 09:28:15 -0600 Subject: [K12OSN] OT: Apple Imac lab Message-ID: <1236007695.31351.16.camel@hi2.wc235.k12.il.us> I agree with the sentiments of Terrell and Almquist. Bottom line, some of these teachers are not realistic in what they *think* they need to do the job . If the $$ were coming out of their own pocket,I would bet TC's would be more than adequate 99% of the time:). End of story. Most teachers have never had to be in the *real world* private sector,(as yours truly), were a profit has to be turned to remain viable. They are used to the limitless Joe Taxpayer money tree being available to dip from. I look at this way, if you were running the company and your dollars are being the source and someone wanted this type of setup for the demands that are at hand, would you Ok the go ahead with this? I guess I am too practical. The big 'ol power gobbling Imacs they are wanting is fine for someone working for Disney's high end production and such. These kids will never touch the upper 75% of power that these machines would be capable of. But I am sure David has to wrangle with not being the goat in this episode! You have to try and 'pacify' everyone in an school scenario, I have found. There are more than enough applications Open Source to do the things wanting done here and if they have patience and use realistic video resolutions could be done on TC's ,although not nearly as quickly as an thick client regardless of power. Bottom line ,again. From I what I see here, I'd let whoever,is spearheading this,do what they want and simply steer clear of any input. In the end you'll save yourself lots of jabbing if you try and suggest otherwise. Just my 1 cents. Take Care, Barry Cisna From dahopkins429 at gmail.com Mon Mar 2 15:41:29 2009 From: dahopkins429 at gmail.com (David Hopkins) Date: Mon, 2 Mar 2009 10:41:29 -0500 Subject: [K12OSN] OT: Apple Imac lab In-Reply-To: <49ABE3E7.3080100@gmail.com> References: <1235770879.20787.12.camel@localhost.localdomain> <49AA2310.7070103@scheie.homedns.org> <49AA99E2.2000509@gmail.com> <20090301200642.GB22835@aurora.owens.net> <49ABE3E7.3080100@gmail.com> Message-ID: >> Now, the teacher has already added that she'll want all the packages >> on the thin clients on the Macs but ... she doesn't want OpenOffice >> on the Macs because 'it doesn't work right'. ?Instead she wants a >> different package. And we need to order the Type-to-Learn package for >> the Macs as well. ?So, the 'usage creep' has already started and the >> lab isn't even ordered. *SIGH ... > > She needs to look at OOo 3.0.1, it works fine. If she wants something more > "Maccy", look at NeoOffice. > > Whoa, I thought this was a multimedia lab. What's Type-to-learn doing in > there? Are you running this on the thin-clients? It is a multimedia lab but the same instructor covers both. Grades 5/6 get TTL plus other stuff, Grades 7/8 get video/audio plus other stuff. There will not be a lab 100% dedicated to video/audio that has any non-use time. > The most resistance I've had is the English dept. at the HS. They're > complaining about the lack of a grammar checker, and the Language Tools > plugin for OOo doesn't cut it. > >> They also acknowledge the ease of use and ability to sit anywhere and >> work is also fantastic. > > Who runs a district where you can't do this? If you're referring to roaming profiles, I have not seen them implemented with the 'sit anywhere and have every single capability you have anywhere else' ever done. Even at my job where we have a $50M+ IT budget I can't just decide I want to do high-end modeling work on any system I find myself at. Basic word processing, sure. Roaming profiles also put a huge strain on the network and with wireless it becomes a nightmare. If you are referring to network shares and mapped drives, then yes, that is a given. Except in many schools where the letter "C" still means a particular harddisk. Most people aren't really exposed to the concept of network shares/mapped drives/mount points. They click 'save' and the document is 'somewhere'. With LTSP that 'somewhere' is normally on the file server. We are still 'educating' new teachers that when they need to print a document or something, they don't have to go back up to 'their computer' to locate it. They are amazed that they can just log in in the library and have it look exactly like it looks at 'their computer'. The jobs the teachers do with the kids is a job I can't do ... it just isn't something I can do. Similarly, they don't always 'get it' wrt thin clients and IT. > I've been running thin-clients since the 02-03 school year, but it's only > been in the past 1 or 2 years that the state of Ohio has finally decided > that thin-clients might be a direction to go. Hopefully the NJ DOE will > realize the savings in time and money. Other states are starting to look which is why I tend to think we are reaching a tipping point. Indiana (I think) also has been at the forefront on this. > Be vocal on the costs. 24 machines x $1,149 is $27,576. That's a lot of > money. Also be aware that schools can still buy the 17" iMac for $899 > ($21,576), so that might come up if the money isn't there for the 20" iMacs. > You won't be able to use TCO figures, since Macs have such a low TCO. BTW, > where was the $40K figure coming from? that was the number for 35 systems. State stds for classroom size vary by grade. We have to cover not just that but also off-time usage when multiple teachers want to bring in classes at the same time to a room, or send down groups of students as well. Sincerely, Dave Hopkins From dahopkins429 at gmail.com Mon Mar 2 15:49:46 2009 From: dahopkins429 at gmail.com (David Hopkins) Date: Mon, 2 Mar 2009 10:49:46 -0500 Subject: [K12OSN] OT: Apple Imac lab In-Reply-To: References: <1235770879.20787.12.camel@localhost.localdomain> <49AA2310.7070103@scheie.homedns.org> <49AA99E2.2000509@gmail.com> <20090301200642.GB22835@aurora.owens.net> Message-ID: > You volunteer your time adminning the Linux boxes. ?Adding this lab of Mac's > will add a significant amount of work to you. ?What I don't understand is > why you agreed to take on that extra work. Up until now it really hasn't been that much work, about 8 hours each week except during the summer when it does get a little hectic. Also, the goal is to show that there are alternative approaches and this is part of that effort. >.... ?Just make sure to spec the quotes correctly so that they have to > interface seamlessly with the existing servers, have the ability to netboot > as LTSP/Win workstation, and whatever else you can think of. ?I strongly > suspect such a contract will cost many times more than the lab itself. Not in the context of support on the Macs but the school has asked for quotes on maintaining the overall network (what I do at the moment in my volunteer status). Vendors come in, see the network, learn how much time is spent maintaining it and so far, none have even offered the school a official quote. Some has said that they don't maintain Linux-based solutions. Others have commented that their bid would have to start at $100K. My goal is to get the State DOE IT to finally 'buy in' and start doing this .. and that is why this Wednesday meeting is so interesting. Sincerely, Dave Hopkins From dahopkins429 at gmail.com Mon Mar 2 16:02:06 2009 From: dahopkins429 at gmail.com (David Hopkins) Date: Mon, 2 Mar 2009 11:02:06 -0500 Subject: [K12OSN] OT: Apple Imac lab In-Reply-To: <1236007695.31351.16.camel@hi2.wc235.k12.il.us> References: <1236007695.31351.16.camel@hi2.wc235.k12.il.us> Message-ID: > I agree with the sentiments of Terrell and Almquist. Bottom line, some > of these teachers are not realistic in what they *think* they need to do > the job . If the $$ ?were coming out of their own pocket,I would bet > TC's would be more than adequate 99% of the time:). End of story. > Most teachers have never had to be in the *real world* private > sector,(as yours truly), were a profit has to be turned to remain > viable. They are used to the limitless Joe Taxpayer money tree being > available to dip from. Thanks! I often feel this way. > I look at this way, if you were running the company and your dollars are > being the source and someone wanted this type of setup for the demands > that are at hand, would you Ok the go ahead with this? I guess I am too > practical. The attitude that 'it is in the budget so we have to spend it' just drives me up the wall. I prefer zero-based budgeting: You don't have a budget, you have to justify every single expense and show the benefit each and every time. It takes a lot of thought and effort to do this though. And, I work for the US gov as a research engineer, I see lots of money spent and it is painful at times, especially around Sept when the order goes out to 'spend all remaining funds in the budget'. I am hoping that the current fiscal crisis can change that attitude. > The big 'ol power gobbling Imacs they are wanting is fine for someone > working for Disney's high end production and such. These kids will never > touch the upper 75% of power that these machines would be capable of. > But I am sure David has to wrangle with not being the goat in this > episode! You have to try and 'pacify' everyone in an school scenario, I > have found. Yep, but what is ironic is that if they really want to teach how special effects are done, having a bunch of low power thin clients that can be flipped into a 'render farm' for simple scenes would teach them so much more. Or just distributed computational processing in general. All of your serious high end computing uses clusters in this way and thin clients can be turned into a 'cluster' with a little effort. Shoot, my analyses at work typically require 128-256 processors and 100's Gb of memory to run in a reasonable amount of time(say a few days). If we want kids to really get a jump on math and science, we should be introducing them to this aspect of 'real computing' early on. > There are more than enough applications Open Source to do the things > wanting done here and if they have patience and use realistic video > resolutions could be done on TC's ,although not nearly as quickly as an > thick client regardless of power. Just need a change in mindset, that is true. > Bottom line ,again. From I what I see here, I'd let whoever,is > spearheading this,do what they want and simply steer clear of any input. > In the end you'll save yourself lots of jabbing if you try and suggest > otherwise. I'm thinking of changing my name to Don Quixote ... Sincerely, Dave Hopkins From simpsond at leopards.k12.ar.us Mon Mar 2 16:11:57 2009 From: simpsond at leopards.k12.ar.us (Doug Simpson) Date: Mon, 02 Mar 2009 10:11:57 -0600 Subject: [K12OSN] OT: Apple Imac lab In-Reply-To: References: <1236007695.31351.16.camel@hi2.wc235.k12.il.us> Message-ID: <49ABB0EC.550C.0078.0@leopards.k12.ar.us> I agree with the "spend it because it is there" not because it was needed thing! It sickens me to see the waste in public education. We have software and hardware that has never been used or some even touched! And, we're buying more of the same crap that won't get used or touched! Makes me SICK! DS Doug Simpson Technology Specialist De Queen Public Schools De Queen, AR simpsond at leopards.k12.ar.us "A Dollar Saved is a Dollar Earned" >>> David Hopkins 3/2/2009 10:02 AM >>> > I agree with the sentiments of Terrell and Almquist. Bottom line, some > of these teachers are not realistic in what they *think* they need to do > the job . If the $$ were coming out of their own pocket,I would bet > TC's would be more than adequate 99% of the time:). End of story. > Most teachers have never had to be in the *real world* private > sector,(as yours truly), were a profit has to be turned to remain > viable. They are used to the limitless Joe Taxpayer money tree being > available to dip from. Thanks! I often feel this way. > I look at this way, if you were running the company and your dollars are > being the source and someone wanted this type of setup for the demands > that are at hand, would you Ok the go ahead with this? I guess I am too > practical. The attitude that 'it is in the budget so we have to spend it' just drives me up the wall. I prefer zero-based budgeting: You don't have a budget, you have to justify every single expense and show the benefit each and every time. It takes a lot of thought and effort to do this though. And, I work for the US gov as a research engineer, I see lots of money spent and it is painful at times, especially around Sept when the order goes out to 'spend all remaining funds in the budget'. I am hoping that the current fiscal crisis can change that attitude. > The big 'ol power gobbling Imacs they are wanting is fine for someone > working for Disney's high end production and such. These kids will never > touch the upper 75% of power that these machines would be capable of. > But I am sure David has to wrangle with not being the goat in this > episode! You have to try and 'pacify' everyone in an school scenario, I > have found. Yep, but what is ironic is that if they really want to teach how special effects are done, having a bunch of low power thin clients that can be flipped into a 'render farm' for simple scenes would teach them so much more. Or just distributed computational processing in general. All of your serious high end computing uses clusters in this way and thin clients can be turned into a 'cluster' with a little effort. Shoot, my analyses at work typically require 128-256 processors and 100's Gb of memory to run in a reasonable amount of time(say a few days). If we want kids to really get a jump on math and science, we should be introducing them to this aspect of 'real computing' early on. > There are more than enough applications Open Source to do the things > wanting done here and if they have patience and use realistic video > resolutions could be done on TC's ,although not nearly as quickly as an > thick client regardless of power. Just need a change in mindset, that is true. > Bottom line ,again. From I what I see here, I'd let whoever,is > spearheading this,do what they want and simply steer clear of any input. > In the end you'll save yourself lots of jabbing if you try and suggest > otherwise. I'm thinking of changing my name to Don Quixote ... Sincerely, Dave Hopkins _______________________________________________ K12OSN mailing list K12OSN at redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn For more info see From k12ltsp at rwcinc.net Mon Mar 2 16:23:21 2009 From: k12ltsp at rwcinc.net (Patrick Fleming) Date: Mon, 02 Mar 2009 09:23:21 -0700 Subject: [K12OSN] OT: Apple Imac lab In-Reply-To: <49ABF699.4000803@gmail.com> References: <1235770879.20787.12.camel@localhost.localdomain> <49AA2310.7070103@scheie.homedns.org> <49AA99E2.2000509@gmail.com> <20090301200642.GB22835@aurora.owens.net> <49ABE3E7.3080100@gmail.com> <20090302144307.GB27725@aurora.owens.net> <49ABF699.4000803@gmail.com> Message-ID: <49AC07F9.30004@rwcinc.net> Ryan Collins wrote: > Rob Owens wrote: >> Rhetorical question: why is the English Dept. teaching their students >> to rely on a grammar checker? Maybe you can justify the more expensive software by getting rid of the teachers since the software they want replaces them anyway. The teachers in my district don't know grammar themselves, I have yet to see anything beyond a single sentence that manages to properly use grammar, spelling and correct use of quotes. I recently read an email regarding the budget slashing happening in our state where the fifth grade teacher used "one fail swoop" instead of, "one fell swoop". I thought they had to be college educated to get their teaching certificate. /rant off > > That was my question. I've showed them that the research shows that > grammar checking isn't reliable and that it has a negative effect on > their teaching, but to no avail. > > They've been spoiled since the Mac version of Office has a decent > grammar checker (35% accuracy) versus the Windows version of Office (0%, > although Word 97 did do better at 24%): > http://ryancollins.org/u/1s > > BTW, here are my links about the subject: > http://delicious.com/mr.rcollins/grammar+english > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > _______________________________________________ > K12OSN mailing list > K12OSN at redhat.com > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > For more info see From jim.c.christiansen at gmail.com Mon Mar 2 21:20:49 2009 From: jim.c.christiansen at gmail.com (Jim Christiansen) Date: Mon, 2 Mar 2009 14:20:49 -0700 Subject: [K12OSN] Where is K12LTSP at? Message-ID: <8b88203f0903021320v38eb9a94ra50797f7107e32de@mail.gmail.com> Thank you everyone for bringing me up to date. Is most everyone here using the most current Centos based K12LTSP based on LTSP 4.2? If most are using this version is it because it is an longterm supported and stable system? My 4 servers are very reliable. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From burke at thealmquists.net Tue Mar 3 00:26:26 2009 From: burke at thealmquists.net (Almquist Burke) Date: Mon, 2 Mar 2009 18:26:26 -0600 Subject: [K12OSN] OT: Apple Imac lab In-Reply-To: References: <1235770879.20787.12.camel@localhost.localdomain> <49AA2310.7070103@scheie.homedns.org> <49AA99E2.2000509@gmail.com> <20090301200642.GB22835@aurora.owens.net> <49ABE3E7.3080100@gmail.com> Message-ID: <0C771D99-41F0-4F97-8D03-9269F943206B@thealmquists.net> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On Mar 2, 2009, at 9:41 AM, David Hopkins wrote: >>> Now, the teacher has already added that she'll want all the packages >>> on the thin clients on the Macs but ... she doesn't want OpenOffice >>> on the Macs because 'it doesn't work right'. Instead she wants a >>> different package. And we need to order the Type-to-Learn package >>> for >>> the Macs as well. So, the 'usage creep' has already started and the >>> lab isn't even ordered. *SIGH ... >> >> She needs to look at OOo 3.0.1, it works fine. If she wants >> something more >> "Maccy", look at NeoOffice. >> >> Whoa, I thought this was a multimedia lab. What's Type-to-learn >> doing in >> there? Are you running this on the thin-clients? > > It is a multimedia lab but the same instructor covers both. Grades 5/6 > get TTL plus other stuff, Grades 7/8 get video/audio plus other stuff. > There will not be a lab 100% dedicated to video/audio that has any > non-use time. What are you using instead of TTL right now? What does she propose to use instead of OpenOffice (and what doesn't "work right" on OO)? The objective is to fight what I call "workstation creep" that comes with running software on standalone PCs/Macs. You tell her (and the powers that be) that you understand and agree with her request to use the iMacs for video editing because you need higher powered machines for that, and the software she wants for audio/video editing is built into them. (If you feel VERY strongly about proprietary software in general, you could try Linux workstations with audacity and Cinnerella/Kino) But you object to using the iMac for other things that could be done on your thing clients (unless they want to boot the iMac into LTSP). And explain why. Generally the teacher either: intentionally using this as a trojan horse to move the whole place to OS X on Apple. OR Doesn't see the harm in buying and installing TTL and Office for Mac since SHE already had the hardware and OS to support it. You have to point out that 1) Kids wanting to use those wonderful applications will be unable to use them anywhere else in the building, or at home (what if they want to use TTL, but the lab is full). Unless they have a Mac and pay for their own copy, which could get expensive for the kids. OR 2) You have to convert the entire school to the iMac (substitute Win/ Dell here for a teacher who has this same creepitits with Windows workstations). Which would be expensive for the school because the hardware and software is more expensive upfront, has to be replaced more often, is easier to break, and requires more work to maintain than LTSP thin clients. Plus, the students can get all the OSS programs in LTSP for free and use them at home. Explain that your rule is that K12Linux based (or insert other LTSP distro here) thin clients are the standard platform for the above reasons, and that ANY exceptions to this rule require proof that it is absolutely necessary. Point out that exceptions are fine, and you ARE making one here for her to do AV editing, so long as they don't become the rule. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.7 (Darwin) iEYEARECAAYFAkmseTIACgkQxWV7OPa/g5GgwgCfdH/6JTnfuAbiuTHSefdyvtN1 VQQAnjd3YRbrXdZP8tMzLkYeciG/Q5EH =ahak -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From rowens at ptd.net Tue Mar 3 01:26:47 2009 From: rowens at ptd.net (Rob Owens) Date: Mon, 2 Mar 2009 20:26:47 -0500 Subject: [K12OSN] Where is K12LTSP at? In-Reply-To: <8b88203f0903021320v38eb9a94ra50797f7107e32de@mail.gmail.com> References: <8b88203f0903021320v38eb9a94ra50797f7107e32de@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20090303012647.GB32073@aurora.owens.net> On Mon, Mar 02, 2009 at 02:20:49PM -0700, Jim Christiansen wrote: > Thank you everyone for bringing me up to date. Is most everyone here using > the most current Centos based K12LTSP based on LTSP 4.2? > > If most are using this version is it because it is an longterm supported and > stable system? My 4 servers are very reliable. I was using CentOS based K12LTSP because of the long term support. I had it installed in a manufacturing company in NJ. They are still using it, but I am no longer there. At home I am using Debian with a combination of LTSP 5 and LTSP 4.2 (for a couple of very old clients). I'm using Debian because it's reliable (not that other distros aren't), I like it, and it has fairly long term support. The main reason I'm using LTSP 5 is to keep up on the latest stuff, and because I felt it required less tinkering in lts.conf for most thin clients. -Rob From scott at hosef.org Tue Mar 3 02:02:43 2009 From: scott at hosef.org (R. Scott Belford) Date: Mon, 2 Mar 2009 16:02:43 -1000 Subject: [K12OSN] Where is K12LTSP at? In-Reply-To: <20090303012647.GB32073@aurora.owens.net> References: <8b88203f0903021320v38eb9a94ra50797f7107e32de@mail.gmail.com> <20090303012647.GB32073@aurora.owens.net> Message-ID: On Mon, Mar 2, 2009 at 3:26 PM, Rob Owens wrote: > On Mon, Mar 02, 2009 at 02:20:49PM -0700, Jim Christiansen wrote: >> Thank you everyone for bringing me up to date. Is most everyone here using >> the most current Centos based K12LTSP based on LTSP 4.2? -------8<------snip----------8<---------- > > At home I am using Debian with a combination of LTSP 5 and LTSP 4.2 (for a > couple of very old clients). I'm using Debian because it's reliable (not > that other distros aren't), I like it, and it has fairly long term support. > > The main reason I'm using LTSP 5 is to keep up on the latest stuff, and > because I felt it required less tinkering in lts.conf for most thin > clients. Thanks to Asmo, one of the most productive testers I have ever seen, I read, on the edubuntu list, about this great how-to for running LTSP5 and 4.2 on Debian Lenny. This how-to is from the modest Rob Owens. Thank-you, Rob. Nicely done. It will be helpful for many. http://wiki.ltsp.org/twiki/bin/view/Ltsp/Ltsp5SameServerLTSP42 > > -Rob --scott From moon at smbis.com Tue Mar 3 02:46:15 2009 From: moon at smbis.com (Moon) Date: Mon, 02 Mar 2009 21:46:15 -0500 Subject: [K12OSN] Where is K12LTSP at? In-Reply-To: References: <8b88203f0902230922x6690c69blf5cd058909e96c62@mail.gmail.com> <20090223192108.GB26900@aurora.owens.net> <49A42D31.3030603@redhat.com> Message-ID: <1236048375.27861.4.camel@t3002.localdomain> What has been your experience with DRBL for the following: 1. Boot time 2. Reliability 3. Scalability - as in how many TCs have you seen running simultaneously one one server? Server specs.? 4. TC performance compared to LTSP and stand-alone workstation On Tue, 2009-02-24 at 09:45 -1000, R. Scott Belford wrote: > On Tue, Feb 24, 2009 at 7:24 AM, Warren Togami wrote: > > > K12LTSP EL5 uses the ancient LTSP-4.2. This is beneficial in that you get > > security updates for the server and desktop applications on the server until > > the year 2014. Ubuntu and Debian releases do not last nearly *that* long. > > Keep in mind that if you use DRBL, then your support extends across > multiple distributions that will last well beyond 2014. You can run > DRBL on Fedora or Centos, as well as Ubuntu or Debian. I can boot my > newer gbook, asus eeepc, acer aspire, and various Atom-based chipsets > from it, as well as my ancient hardware. > > --scott > > _______________________________________________ > K12OSN mailing list > K12OSN at redhat.com > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > For more info see -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From moon at smbis.com Tue Mar 3 02:59:28 2009 From: moon at smbis.com (Moon) Date: Mon, 02 Mar 2009 21:59:28 -0500 Subject: [K12OSN] Where is K12LTSP at? In-Reply-To: <49A42D31.3030603@redhat.com> References: <8b88203f0902230922x6690c69blf5cd058909e96c62@mail.gmail.com> <20090223192108.GB26900@aurora.owens.net> <49A42D31.3030603@redhat.com> Message-ID: <1236049168.27861.15.camel@t3002.localdomain> Warren, I noticed you stated you have an AMD Geode thin client in your lab. What video driver are you using/specifying in the lts.conf for that client? I have a Alix1.D AMD LX800 Geode based thin client that the video doesn't work too well with K12LTSP or K12Linux, it defaults to vesa. I would like to get better video performance on both K12LTSP and K12Linux. It also has a problem with the audio on the K12LTSP due to no support for the CS5535, there is no snd_cs5535audio driver available in K12LTSP. Thanks Charlie On Tue, 2009-02-24 at 12:24 -0500, Warren Togami wrote: > Rob Owens wrote: > > If you're looking for something longer life than Fedora / LTSP 5, you > > could try Debian Lenny or Ubuntu Hardy, both with LTSP 5. Or you > > could stick with CentOS / LTSP 4.2. I know there's also an OpenSuse > > implementation of LTSP 5, but I don't know much about that > > distribution or its life cycle. > > http://k12ltsp.org/mediawiki/index.php/Main_Page > "K12LTSP is considered to be LEGACY software that is usable with old > hardware until CentOS5 support ends in the year 2014. If you need modern > LTSP 5.x features or modern client hardware, then you will want to use > K12Linux.org." > > K12LTSP EL5 uses the ancient LTSP-4.2. This is beneficial in that you > get security updates for the server and desktop applications on the > server until the year 2014. Ubuntu and Debian releases do not last > nearly *that* long. > > The other benefit of K12LTSP EL5 is it works with more ancient client > hardware due its ancient version of X and kernel. This is also a > detriment though... because lots of modern client hardware will not work > at all. > > K12Linux F10 has the benefit of modern LTSP5 features like sound, local > storage devices, local apps support, and modern X allows modern client > hardware to work. The drawbacks however are: > > * Modern X broke some older client hardware. These are upstream x.org > bugs. They will only be fixed if people take the time to file the bugs > upstream instead of just complain about them. I personally don't have > time nor hardware to work on this. I have a dozen different modern thin > clients of AMD Geode, VIA, Intel and Radeon chipsets and they all work > great with K12Linux. > * It needs more RAM on the client, at least 128MB to be safe. > * Support ends early 2010. > > The support problem isn't too bad. Just use K12Linux F10 until K12Linux > EL6 (RHEL6 + EPEL6) is out. Then upgrade once into that version which > will be supported for many years thereafter. > > Warren Togami > wtogami at redhat.com > > > > > Somewhere on the LTSP wiki I think there are instructions for how to > > use an Ubuntu-based chroot environment on any other distro. There's > > a guy on the ltsp-discuss list who uses LTSP 5 on CentOS in this way. > > _______________________________________________ > K12OSN mailing list > K12OSN at redhat.com > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > For more info see -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From microman at cmosnetworks.com Tue Mar 3 05:51:47 2009 From: microman at cmosnetworks.com (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?=22Terrell_Prud=E9_Jr=2E=22?=) Date: Tue, 03 Mar 2009 00:51:47 -0500 Subject: [K12OSN] Where is K12LTSP at? In-Reply-To: <8b88203f0903021320v38eb9a94ra50797f7107e32de@mail.gmail.com> References: <8b88203f0903021320v38eb9a94ra50797f7107e32de@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <49ACC573.6000301@cmosnetworks.com> I currently run 5EL. Up until just last year, I was still running 4.2EL! Why? No *compelling* reason to upgrade. The chief reason I upgraded to 5EL last year is simply because I wanted to try out the new version, just for fun. I could've stayed with 4.2EL until the year 2012, as it's supported until then and is, like 5EL, solid as a rock. "If it ain't broke, don't fix it." --TP _______________________________ Do you GNU ? Microsoft Free since 2003 --the ultimate antivirus protection! Jim Christiansen wrote: > Thank you everyone for bringing me up to date. Is most everyone here > using the most current Centos based K12LTSP based on LTSP 4.2? > > If most are using this version is it because it is an longterm > supported and stable system? My 4 servers are very reliable. > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > _______________________________________________ > K12OSN mailing list > K12OSN at redhat.com > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > For more info see -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mr.rcollins at gmail.com Tue Mar 3 15:47:38 2009 From: mr.rcollins at gmail.com (Ryan Collins) Date: Tue, 03 Mar 2009 10:47:38 -0500 Subject: [K12OSN] OT: any OpenOffice vs. MS Office studies/cases out there? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <49AD511A.20904@gmail.com> massonpj at delhi.edu wrote: > So to Ryan's point, I think we do ourselves a disservice by promoting open > source, rather than promoting the applications (please do not infer that I > think this group or anyone on this thread is doing so). What, for example, > was the threshold for organizations to switch from Word Perfect to Word, > from Eudora to Outlook, from Mac's to PC's, and maybe now back again? Why > do folks use Firefox rather than IE, or more specifically Google rather > than Yahoo? Wow, that was an excellent post on the topic. It seems like no one remembers when everything was Lotus/Wordperfect. Just as they fell, Microsoft will fall, and something else will take its place. Right now, with the economy and Microsoft stumbling with Vista, Open Source has the best chance of making some inroads, just as Firefox has against IE. Microsoft needs Windows 7 to hit it out of the ball park. Now, does anyone have some sort of framework or set of procedures already in place that they can share on how technology is chosen, purchased, and implemented? -- Ryan Collins - Technology Coordinator - Kenton City Schools Blog: http://ryancollins.org/wp/ -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: mr_rcollins.vcf Type: text/x-vcard Size: 161 bytes Desc: not available URL: From visentind at hdsb.ca Tue Mar 3 19:16:44 2009 From: visentind at hdsb.ca (Dan Visentin) Date: Tue, 03 Mar 2009 14:16:44 -0500 Subject: [K12OSN] 845G intel video problem? Message-ID: Howdy! I've been running K12LTSP (v4.2) for several years now and have decided to look into upgrading to ltsp5. System is currently Centos/ltsp4.2 and clients boot fine. I have downloaded the k12linux live CD (x86_64) and it works great for some clients but the clients we have problems with clients with 82845G intel graphics chips. Screen only displays the gradient blue background and the input box. You can move the mouse around and even enter some text (sort of) in the text box but that's about it. I tried: changing the resolution to 800x600 setting XSERVER = intel and a few other things but no dice. Suggestions? System is a paired Opteron dual core with 8GB RAM Dan Visentin Computer Engineering and Science, Business Team 2200, MMRAMBOTICS.CA M. M. Robinson High School -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mm at gcug.de Tue Mar 3 20:13:24 2009 From: mm at gcug.de (Marcus Moeller) Date: Tue, 3 Mar 2009 21:13:24 +0100 Subject: [K12OSN] k12LTSP Documentation Message-ID: <14e58b610903031213n4c66f229u54b5d42c8832a7a1@mail.gmail.com> Good Evening, I am trying to set up a k12LTSP based solution and wonder where to find recent documentation and installation instructions. Most of the articles on the wiki seems to be outdated and it is not really clear which direction is focused (Fedora, CentOS, something else). I personally prefer a CentOS based solution as it's long term supported. Best Regards Marcus From bmead at lane.k12.or.us Tue Mar 3 20:20:47 2009 From: bmead at lane.k12.or.us (Bob Mead) Date: Tue, 03 Mar 2009 12:20:47 -0800 Subject: [K12OSN] k12LTSP Documentation In-Reply-To: <14e58b610903031213n4c66f229u54b5d42c8832a7a1@mail.gmail.com> References: <14e58b610903031213n4c66f229u54b5d42c8832a7a1@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <49AD911F.4080703@lane.k12.or.us> Marcus Moeller wrote: > Good Evening, > > I am trying to set up a k12LTSP based solution and wonder where to > find recent documentation and installation instructions. Most of the > articles on the wiki seems to be outdated and it is not really clear > which direction is focused (Fedora, CentOS, something else). I > personally prefer a CentOS based solution as it's long term supported. > There is some excellent documentation here : http://www.k12ltsp.org/mediawiki/index.php/Main_Page for Centos based or here: http://k12ltsp.org/server.html for fedora based. Cheers ~bob -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: bmead.vcf Type: text/x-vcard Size: 199 bytes Desc: not available URL: From mm at gcug.de Tue Mar 3 20:24:20 2009 From: mm at gcug.de (Marcus Moeller) Date: Tue, 3 Mar 2009 21:24:20 +0100 Subject: [K12OSN] k12LTSP Documentation In-Reply-To: <49AD911F.4080703@lane.k12.or.us> References: <14e58b610903031213n4c66f229u54b5d42c8832a7a1@mail.gmail.com> <49AD911F.4080703@lane.k12.or.us> Message-ID: <14e58b610903031224t4310f70ct7d3353fdeb3a17c6@mail.gmail.com> Dear Bob, >> I am trying to set up a k12LTSP based solution and wonder where to >> find recent documentation and installation instructions. Most of the >> articles on the wiki seems to be outdated and it is not really clear >> which direction is focused (Fedora, CentOS, something else). I >> personally prefer a CentOS based solution as it's long term supported. >> > > There is some excellent documentation here : > ?http://www.k12ltsp.org/mediawiki/index.php/Main_Page ? for Centos based or If you take a look at: http://www.k12ltsp.org/mediawiki/index.php/Software Installation you will be linked to a static site: http://k12ltsp.org/install.html where images are missing and which is related to old Fedora versions. I agree, there is a lot of information on the wiki but which one to choose? Most of it seems to be really outdated. Maybe it has been useful for previous versions, but for now? Best Regards Marcus From bmead at lane.k12.or.us Tue Mar 3 20:45:55 2009 From: bmead at lane.k12.or.us (Bob Mead) Date: Tue, 03 Mar 2009 12:45:55 -0800 Subject: [K12OSN] k12LTSP Documentation In-Reply-To: <14e58b610903031224t4310f70ct7d3353fdeb3a17c6@mail.gmail.com> References: <14e58b610903031213n4c66f229u54b5d42c8832a7a1@mail.gmail.com> <49AD911F.4080703@lane.k12.or.us> <14e58b610903031224t4310f70ct7d3353fdeb3a17c6@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <49AD9703.3030706@lane.k12.or.us> Marcus: > > > If you take a look at: > > http://www.k12ltsp.org/mediawiki/index.php/Software > > Installation > > you will be linked to a static site: http://k12ltsp.org/install.html > where images are missing and which is related to old Fedora versions. > > I agree, there is a lot of information on the wiki but which one to > choose? Most of it seems to be really outdated. Maybe it has been > useful for previous versions, but for now? > > I too had the same frustrating experience of not finding what I needed in one place. For myself, I worked up a Centos based server which failed to work in the classroom/lab where I deployed it. I'm now trying a ubuntu based server, and having a lot of difficulties in getting my t/c to boot. I've looked at the fedora ltsp server on a usb stick, couldn't get that to write to a stick - I don't run fedora anywhere here. All of this is to replace our aging ltsp4.2 server on FC6 which will not run an app we need for testing (Oaks secure browser). We have (as most of us here do - I presume) a collection of old technology we use as t/c's that just do not want to work with the newer implementations of ltsp. Kinda sucks to have to get rid of that old junk just to run the shiny new server and IMHO, moves us farther away from the ideals on which ltsp is based. So, best of luck choosing and let us know how you make out when you do decide. ~bob -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: bmead.vcf Type: text/x-vcard Size: 199 bytes Desc: not available URL: From mm at gcug.de Tue Mar 3 20:50:05 2009 From: mm at gcug.de (Marcus Moeller) Date: Tue, 3 Mar 2009 21:50:05 +0100 Subject: [K12OSN] k12LTSP Documentation In-Reply-To: <49AD9703.3030706@lane.k12.or.us> References: <14e58b610903031213n4c66f229u54b5d42c8832a7a1@mail.gmail.com> <49AD911F.4080703@lane.k12.or.us> <14e58b610903031224t4310f70ct7d3353fdeb3a17c6@mail.gmail.com> <49AD9703.3030706@lane.k12.or.us> Message-ID: <14e58b610903031250i2b5c10bai7e5403d882b38a66@mail.gmail.com> Good Evening. > I too had the same frustrating experience of not finding what I needed in > one place. For myself, I worked up a Centos based server which failed to > work in the classroom/lab where I deployed it. I'm now trying a ubuntu based > server, and having a lot of difficulties in getting my t/c to boot. I've > looked at the fedora ltsp server on a usb stick, couldn't get that to write > to a stick - I don't run fedora anywhere here. All of this is to replace our > aging ltsp4.2 server on FC6 which will not run an app we need for testing > (Oaks secure browser). We have (as most of us here do - I presume) a > collection of old technology we use as t/c's that just do not want to work > with the newer implementations of ltsp. Kinda sucks to have to get rid of > that old junk just to run the shiny new server and IMHO, moves us farther > away from the ideals on which ltsp is based. > > So, best of luck choosing and let us know how you make out when you do > decide. The question is if it would perhaps make more sense to transfer l12LTSP into an official 'CentOS project'. Here, the documentation could be re-organized and some stuff could be re-worked. I am also not sure if it really make sense to offer install media but a good repo containing all necessary packages. Maybe someone who is responsible for the current development could post a comment, here. Best Regards Marcus From brcisna at eazylivin.net Tue Mar 3 21:36:21 2009 From: brcisna at eazylivin.net (Barry R Cisna) Date: Tue, 03 Mar 2009 15:36:21 -0600 Subject: [K12OSN] 845G intel video problem? Message-ID: <1236116181.16374.7.camel@localhost.localdomain> Hi Dan, On one of the TC's that the video does not come up correctly, set up your lts.conf file to enable a shell. On this TC drop to a shell prompt and issue; lspci See what the video card and the other information along with it as far as id etc are,as compared to your older version of ltsp. This is at least a starting point for halving the problem hopefully. try setting for this client in your lts.conf file; XSERVER=i810 Here is a good link for various spinoffs of this chipset. http://www.xfree86.org/~dawes/845driver.html Hope this helps. Take Care, Barry Cisna From rmiller at seminole.k12.ga.us Tue Mar 3 22:20:48 2009 From: rmiller at seminole.k12.ga.us (Ronnie Miller) Date: Tue, 3 Mar 2009 17:20:48 -0500 (EST) Subject: [K12OSN] Installing OpenOffice 3 in Centos5 Message-ID: <61790.71.30.26.205.1236118848.squirrel@mail.seminole.k12.ga.us> I recently tried to install OpenOffice 3 in my Centos5 K12LTSP lab. Before installing, I uninstalled version 2.3 and ran the installer included in the OO3 zipped file. I was logged onto the server as root when I ran it. After installing, I was able to run OO3, but I had to find the program files and execute them and create menu items manually. I tried to create icons for the individual users (28 of them) on the default menu using Sabayon to see if it would push it out to the others, with no luck. Everytime I'd create the menu item, it would disappear when I went back into Sabayon. I was able to use the "send icon to all users" script on the root's desktop, but my problem with that is the students will many times delete the icons. I enjoy the "Add or Remove Software" feature as I'm not extremely fluent with Linux, but this doesn't work with OO3. Is there a way to install OO3 and make it available for ALL users and have it appear as an Application Menu item? In the meantime, I re-installed 2.3 so that the lab is usable. Thanks for any help. -- Ronnie Miller Technology Specialist Seminole County Schools 800 S. Woolfork Ave. Donalsonville, GA 39845 229.524.5235 Ext. 227 -- This message has been scanned for viruses and dangerous content by MailScanner, and is believed to be clean. From peter at scheie.homedns.org Wed Mar 4 03:08:19 2009 From: peter at scheie.homedns.org (Peter Scheie) Date: Tue, 03 Mar 2009 21:08:19 -0600 Subject: [K12OSN] k12LTSP Documentation In-Reply-To: <14e58b610903031250i2b5c10bai7e5403d882b38a66@mail.gmail.com> References: <14e58b610903031213n4c66f229u54b5d42c8832a7a1@mail.gmail.com> <49AD911F.4080703@lane.k12.or.us> <14e58b610903031224t4310f70ct7d3353fdeb3a17c6@mail.gmail.com> <49AD9703.3030706@lane.k12.or.us> <14e58b610903031250i2b5c10bai7e5403d882b38a66@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <49ADF0A3.8030104@scheie.homedns.org> K12LTSP-EL5, which is LTSP 4.2 running on Centos 5, works well with older client hardware. It's solid, and unless your needs change, it works quite reliably. It's age is irrelevant, and updates to the base OS are still coming out. To install it, just boot the server from the DVD and choose the default installation options; you'll have a server all set to go in about 30 minutes. However, as time passes, people often want to do more with their LTSP setups, things like automatically detecting new sound & video chips and running applications on the clients because they have the hardware to support this. To do these things, and to address a variety of other issues, LTSP 5 implementations, such as K12Linux, use the packages that come from the distributions, and people from various distributions have gotten much more involved in the process. This makes it easier to update the client software so that it can handle things like newer video chipsets found in the clients, but at the expense of possibly not working with older hardware. The dichotomy is this: 'Bob' has shiny new 2Ghz clients with 2GB RAM that he wants to use to handle some of the software load so he doesn't need as hefty a server; 'Sara' has old 200mhz PIIs with 64MB but has a decent server. The software can't really stretch to fit with well with both scenarios. But being FOSS, the older version(s) will always be available to anyone who wants it. No sales rep has a commission riding on you upgrading to the latest version. If K12LTSP EL5 works with your hardware and does what you need, don't worry about what version it is or how new or old it is; to do so is to buy into the marketing mania that drives many institutions to waste money on things they don't really need. You can, incidently, update individual applications on the server, as some have done, for example, with OpenOffice.org. It's not automatic, but it can be done. Or just setup a separate server to host the new application, using a more modern OS. With LTSP, it's all remote display anyway; users won't know that it's coming from a different server. A Centos-based K12Linux will come eventually, but because RHEL/Centos 5 don't contain some significant necessary pieces for supporting LTSP 5, I suspect that it won't happen until RHEL/Centos 6 are out (and I've not heard of a timetable for that). I still deploy K12LTSP EL5 in small offices and schools, using old PCs as clients, and it works just fine thankyouverymuch. The lifespan of Fedora is too short to install K12Linux in these settings. Stability is more important than flashy in these cases. In other cases, K12Linux is more appropriate. I use what fits. Others on this list do likewise. As for the wiki, it's a community effort, meaning people document problems and solutions as they encounter them. There's no real coordination. If there's something missing that you wish were there, add it. This is a user-based project. BTW, for anyone having trouble getting K12Linux installed onto a USB stick, consider unetbootin (http://unetbootin.sourceforge.net/) which will install (almost) any ISO file onto a USB stick. Peter Marcus Moeller wrote: > Good Evening. > >> I too had the same frustrating experience of not finding what I needed in >> one place. For myself, I worked up a Centos based server which failed to >> work in the classroom/lab where I deployed it. I'm now trying a ubuntu based >> server, and having a lot of difficulties in getting my t/c to boot. I've >> looked at the fedora ltsp server on a usb stick, couldn't get that to write >> to a stick - I don't run fedora anywhere here. All of this is to replace our >> aging ltsp4.2 server on FC6 which will not run an app we need for testing >> (Oaks secure browser). We have (as most of us here do - I presume) a >> collection of old technology we use as t/c's that just do not want to work >> with the newer implementations of ltsp. Kinda sucks to have to get rid of >> that old junk just to run the shiny new server and IMHO, moves us farther >> away from the ideals on which ltsp is based. >> >> So, best of luck choosing and let us know how you make out when you do >> decide. > > The question is if it would perhaps make more sense to transfer > l12LTSP into an official 'CentOS project'. Here, the documentation > could be re-organized and some stuff could be re-worked. I am also not > sure if it really make sense to offer install media but a good repo > containing all necessary packages. > > Maybe someone who is responsible for the current development could > post a comment, here. > > Best Regards > Marcus > > _______________________________________________ > K12OSN mailing list > K12OSN at redhat.com > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > For more info see > From peter at scheie.homedns.org Wed Mar 4 03:16:19 2009 From: peter at scheie.homedns.org (Peter Scheie) Date: Tue, 03 Mar 2009 21:16:19 -0600 Subject: [K12OSN] Installing OpenOffice 3 in Centos5 In-Reply-To: <61790.71.30.26.205.1236118848.squirrel@mail.seminole.k12.ga.us> References: <61790.71.30.26.205.1236118848.squirrel@mail.seminole.k12.ga.us> Message-ID: <49ADF283.1060702@scheie.homedns.org> The icons on the panel probably call /usr/bin/openoffice.org-2.0 or similar. Try this: - Install OOo 3. - mv /usr/bin/openoffice.org-2.0 /usr/bin/openoffice.org-2.0.orig - ln -s /usr/bin/openoffice.org-2.0 Now, when users click on the icons on the panel, it should call the new version. Peter Ronnie Miller wrote: > I recently tried to install OpenOffice 3 in my Centos5 K12LTSP lab. Before > installing, I uninstalled version 2.3 and ran the installer included in > the OO3 zipped file. I was logged onto the server as root when I ran it. > > After installing, I was able to run OO3, but I had to find the program > files and execute them and create menu items manually. I tried to create > icons for the individual users (28 of them) on the default menu using > Sabayon to see if it would push it out to the others, with no luck. > Everytime I'd create the menu item, it would disappear when I went back > into Sabayon. > > I was able to use the "send icon to all users" script on the root's > desktop, but my problem with that is the students will many times delete > the icons. > > I enjoy the "Add or Remove Software" feature as I'm not extremely fluent > with Linux, but this doesn't work with OO3. Is there a way to install OO3 > and make it available for ALL users and have it appear as an Application > Menu item? In the meantime, I re-installed 2.3 so that the lab is usable. > > Thanks for any help. > From robark at gmail.com Wed Mar 4 03:41:59 2009 From: robark at gmail.com (Robert Arkiletian) Date: Tue, 3 Mar 2009 19:41:59 -0800 Subject: [K12OSN] k12LTSP Documentation In-Reply-To: <49ADF0A3.8030104@scheie.homedns.org> References: <14e58b610903031213n4c66f229u54b5d42c8832a7a1@mail.gmail.com> <49AD911F.4080703@lane.k12.or.us> <14e58b610903031224t4310f70ct7d3353fdeb3a17c6@mail.gmail.com> <49AD9703.3030706@lane.k12.or.us> <14e58b610903031250i2b5c10bai7e5403d882b38a66@mail.gmail.com> <49ADF0A3.8030104@scheie.homedns.org> Message-ID: On Tue, Mar 3, 2009 at 7:08 PM, Peter Scheie wrote: > K12LTSP-EL5, which is LTSP 4.2 running on Centos 5, works well with older > client hardware. It's solid, and unless your needs change, it works quite > reliably. It's age is irrelevant, and updates to the base OS are still > coming out. To install it, just boot the server from the DVD and choose the > default installation options; you'll have a server all set to go in about 30 > minutes. > > However, as time passes, people often want to do more with their LTSP > setups, things like automatically detecting new sound & video chips and > running applications on the clients because they have the hardware to > support this. To do these things, and to address a variety of other issues, > LTSP 5 implementations, such as K12Linux, use the packages that come from > the distributions, and people from various distributions have gotten much > more involved in the process. This makes it easier to update the client > software so that it can handle things like newer video chipsets found in the > clients, but at the expense of possibly not working with older hardware. > The dichotomy is this: 'Bob' has shiny new 2Ghz clients with 2GB RAM that > he wants to use to handle some of the software load so he doesn't need as > hefty a server; 'Sara' has old 200mhz PIIs with 64MB but has a decent > server. The software can't really stretch to fit with well with both > scenarios. But being FOSS, the older version(s) will always be available to > anyone who wants it. No sales rep has a commission riding on you upgrading > to the latest version. If K12LTSP EL5 works with your hardware and does what > you need, don't worry about what version it is or how new or old it is; to > do so is to buy into the marketing mania that drives many institutions to > waste money on things they don't really need. You can, incidently, update > individual applications on the server, as some have done, for example, with > OpenOffice.org. It's not automatic, but it can be done. Or just setup a > separate server to host the new application, using a more modern OS. With > LTSP, it's all remote display anyway; users won't know that it's coming from > a different server. > > A Centos-based K12Linux will come eventually, but because RHEL/Centos 5 > don't contain some significant necessary pieces for supporting LTSP 5, I > suspect that it won't happen until RHEL/Centos 6 are out (and I've not heard > of a timetable for that). > > I still deploy K12LTSP EL5 in small offices and schools, using old PCs as > clients, and it works just fine thankyouverymuch. The lifespan of Fedora is > too short to install K12Linux in these settings. Stability is more > important than flashy in these cases. In other cases, K12Linux is more > appropriate. I use what fits. Others on this list do likewise. > > As for the wiki, it's a community effort, meaning people document problems > and solutions as they encounter them. There's no real coordination. If > there's something missing that you wish were there, add it. This is a > user-based project. > > BTW, for anyone having trouble getting K12Linux installed onto a USB stick, > consider unetbootin (http://unetbootin.sourceforge.net/) which will install > (almost) any ISO file onto a USB stick. > > Peter Excellent explanation of the situation Peter, very insightful and accurate. BTW RHEL6 is *rumored* to be coming out in the first half of 2010 and be based mainly on Fedora 11. I suspect ext4 will be a big new feature. -- Robert Arkiletian Eric Hamber Secondary, Vancouver, Canada From wtogami at redhat.com Wed Mar 4 04:08:49 2009 From: wtogami at redhat.com (Warren Togami) Date: Tue, 03 Mar 2009 23:08:49 -0500 Subject: [K12OSN] OT: Apple Imac lab In-Reply-To: References: <49A83181.5040101@cmosnetworks.com> Message-ID: <49ADFED1.2030409@redhat.com> R. Scott Belford wrote: > > You will be in luck, David. Your new Mac hardware is Intel based, and > you ought to find success with the latest K12Linux. At the very > least, you will find some enthusiastic debugging support until it gets > there. This is not the case. Those new Intel Macs use EFI instead of BIOS with PXE. EFI netboot is a bit non-standardized, especially Apple's screwed version of EFI. I'm not sure if any distribution has Apple EFI netboot support yet. Warren Togami wtogami at redhat.com From einfeldt at gmail.com Wed Mar 4 04:34:16 2009 From: einfeldt at gmail.com (Christian Einfeldt) Date: Tue, 3 Mar 2009 20:34:16 -0800 Subject: [K12OSN] OT: Apple Imac lab In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4b5781040903032034n5d140d3aj304aac020a350a76@mail.gmail.com> hi, I am a level one tech support for a Xubuntu LDAP lab in San Francisco, California. We are documenting our work for a movie called the Digital Tipping Point. You can see the first teacher video from that experiment here: http://www.archive.org/details/e-dv593_elmer_rivera_a_2009_feb_001.ogg http://www.archive.org/details/e-dv593_elmer_rivera_b_2009_feb_001.ogg Based on my experience there, which is limited, as I am just the level one tech, I would say that it is going to be a nightmare for you to pull video across a network, even if it is an LDAP network with the apps running locally on the clients, let alone have the apps running on the server. The server will take a huge hit. Even with an LDAP setup, which sees only files (and not apps) running across the network, you are looking at big lag times and poor performance for those machines. There are plenty of decent video editing apps for Linux, but I wouldn't run any of them across a network of middle schoolers (we are a middle school). I would just try to dual boot the machines and run the video locally. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From robark at gmail.com Wed Mar 4 07:15:10 2009 From: robark at gmail.com (Robert Arkiletian) Date: Tue, 3 Mar 2009 23:15:10 -0800 Subject: [K12OSN] Possible to access an external MS AD ? Message-ID: I'm wondering if a Windows box inside an LTSP lan (which therefore would get it's IP from the LTSP server) can access (auth user) to a MS AD server which is external to the LTSP lan? I think the answer is NO but I just want to verify with the list. -- Robert Arkiletian Eric Hamber Secondary, Vancouver, Canada From cisna-barry at wc235.k12.il.us Wed Mar 4 12:12:41 2009 From: cisna-barry at wc235.k12.il.us (Barry Cisna) Date: Wed, 04 Mar 2009 06:12:41 -0600 Subject: [K12OSN] Possible to access an external MS AD ? Message-ID: <1236168761.5852.5.camel@hi2.wc235.k12.il.us> Robert, This should not be a problem. in AD you have to setup : ForestDnsZones_ _sites + Site1 + Site2 Bottom line, This (somehow) replicates data between the two boxes. We do this here, at school. Here is a not so good link to get started: http://www.mombu.com/microsoft/windows-server-dns/t-forestdnszones-and-domaindnszones-replication-134884.html Hope this helps some. Take Care, Barry Cisna From scott at hosef.org Wed Mar 4 12:42:09 2009 From: scott at hosef.org (R. Scott Belford) Date: Wed, 4 Mar 2009 02:42:09 -1000 Subject: [K12OSN] OT: Apple Imac lab In-Reply-To: <49ADFED1.2030409@redhat.com> References: <49A83181.5040101@cmosnetworks.com> <49ADFED1.2030409@redhat.com> Message-ID: On Tue, Mar 3, 2009 at 6:08 PM, Warren Togami wrote: > R. Scott Belford wrote: >> >> You will be in luck, David. Your new Mac hardware is Intel based, and >> you ought to find success with the latest K12Linux. At the very >> least, you will find some enthusiastic debugging support until it gets >> there. > > This is not the case. Those new Intel Macs use EFI instead of BIOS with > PXE. EFI netboot is a bit non-standardized, especially Apple's screwed > version of EFI. I'm not sure if any distribution has Apple EFI netboot > support yet. Yes. You are right. My complete oversight. Thanks for catching it. It's funny, because today, well, I guess yesterday and today since I am on HST, I've been kludging around with all the variations of clients/servers, fat and thin. I tried using a .zlilo image in my menu.lst grub setup on a dual-booting MacBook Pro as a way of at least testing the concept, but the sky2 module is not available in an etherboot/gxe image. Kudos for the work on the K12Linux live distro. The manual setup was generally trivial. Below are links to photos of an Acer 'netbook' booting from an Asus eeepc 'server' running the K12Linux Live release on a usb flash drive. The first is just a picture. The second is a photograph of Top running on the server where the load is being carried. Sound and local devices work great. http://links.hosef.org/k12linuxnetbooks http://links.hosef.org/k12linuxserverload > > Warren Togami > wtogami at redhat.com --scott From scott at hosef.org Wed Mar 4 13:04:25 2009 From: scott at hosef.org (R. Scott Belford) Date: Wed, 4 Mar 2009 03:04:25 -1000 Subject: [K12OSN] OT: Apple Imac lab In-Reply-To: <4b5781040903032034n5d140d3aj304aac020a350a76@mail.gmail.com> References: <4b5781040903032034n5d140d3aj304aac020a350a76@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: 2009/3/3 Christian Einfeldt : > > Based on my experience there, which is limited, as I am just the level one > tech, I would say that it is going to be a nightmare for you to pull video > across a network, even if it is an LDAP network with the apps running > locally on the clients, let alone have the apps running on the server. The > server will take a huge hit. Even with an LDAP setup, which sees only files > (and not apps) running across the network, you are looking at big lag times > and poor performance for those machines. > > There are plenty of decent video editing apps for Linux, but I wouldn't run > any of them across a network of middle schoolers (we are a middle school). > > I would just try to dual boot the machines and run the video locally. You, Christian, are far more than a "level-one" anything. I think that it is generally accepted that using new Mac hardware is a waste if applied as a thin client. Les said it best when suggesting that freenx/nomachine be used for client services. I was suggesting DRBL in its default fat client mode. This now seems sketchy with Mac hardware and EFI, but it is proven with the pc platform. I do not know enough about NFS and its capacity to move large files. I cannot imagine that it can supersede a local drive. However, consider this scenario: The 'netbook' that is used outside of class to capture video, is etherbooted at school as a 'fat' client, and the data on its hard drive is edited with the applications available in the classroom using its local CPU. Or, it is etherbooted at school as a thin client, but the server has 32 cores, and only 3 students are rendering files. If the server is virtualized, then during the day perhaps this metal provides LDAP/NFS, DRBL, LTSP, Proxying, etc., but, after hours this same metal provides a rendering virtual server while the others servers are shut down. Below are pictures of a DRBL server powering a client. Both are 'netbooks', and the shots show the boot menu, the login window, and a shot of TOP, on both the client and server, displaying the CPU load on the 'fat' client. You also see a shot of a 16gb SD disk mounted on the client, but not on the server. http://links.hosef.org/drbllocalmode http://links.hosef.org/topfatclient http://links.hosef.org/drbllocalmedia http://links.hosef.org/drblbooting http://links.hosef.org/drbllogin This last photo is of the DRBL 'netbook' server, the 'netbook' client, and a 'netbook' running Ubuntu, with a windowed NX session connected to a virtualized instance of Ubuntu that has authenticated from a virtualized instance of a Centos4 NFS/LDAP/SAMBA server hosted on a Centos5 Xen server. The NX connection is wireless, runs across the public internet to a school 25 miles from here, and it has sound. http://links.hosef.org/3specialbooks We don't have iMovie, but we can't do any of this with the Mac, yet. --scott From scott at hosef.org Wed Mar 4 13:21:24 2009 From: scott at hosef.org (R. Scott Belford) Date: Wed, 4 Mar 2009 03:21:24 -1000 Subject: [K12OSN] Where is K12LTSP at? In-Reply-To: <1236048375.27861.4.camel@t3002.localdomain> References: <8b88203f0902230922x6690c69blf5cd058909e96c62@mail.gmail.com> <20090223192108.GB26900@aurora.owens.net> <49A42D31.3030603@redhat.com> <1236048375.27861.4.camel@t3002.localdomain> Message-ID: 2009/3/2 Moon : > What has been your experience with DRBL for the following: > > 1. Boot time As fast as the network - pretty much the same booting experience as the k12ltsp/k12linux, etc. > 2. Reliability DRBL is just a project that pre-scripts some really cool behavior from standard packages. So, since you can install DRBL (diskless remote booting linux) on pretty much any distro, reliability is a function of the team behind the distro. > 3. Scalability - as in how many TCs have you seen running simultaneously one > one server? Server specs.? I have multicast imaged 25 clients at once using Clonezilla on DRBL. Kristian just spoke at SCALE about DRBL in 'pod' settings of 4 or 5 clients. You have to consider this - you can, by default, configure DRBL to be a fat and a thin client server. The client's behavior can be pre-determined by MAC address, it can be determined by the user's interaction, or it can be determined by setting the default boot option. If you are booting fat clients, then you need very little CPU horsepower, but you need bandwidth and disk i/o. I have noticed, when running Top with a 1s refresh, that NFSD is barely hit when I boot a fat client. I have not tested this in scale beyond 5 clients. It is scary impressive, but it is also just NFS/NIS/DHCP/TFTP, etc. If you are booting thin clients, then you need the horsepower on the server. I have not tested this in scale, but I do know that you have to enable XDMCP in order for the thin-client element to work. I imagine the same scalability as the K12LTSP, but, I really don't know. > 4. TC performance compared to LTSP and stand-alone workstation For me, it seems that modern thin clients are well served with K12Linux. I hope that some of this makes its way into an EL release. For older clients, as has been stated, the K12LTSP el is still so very good. Of course we are now learning about how to run both, as in LTSP5 and LTSP4.2, on the same server. However, I am discovering just how good the fat client world can be, and 'older' hardware for us is a PII and PIII nowadays. For this, I am in love with DRBL on any distro, including redhat or centos or fedora. I am intrigued by the default NFS/NIS integration in DRBL since, aside from security concerns, this is a great, out-of-the-box, central authentication and roaming profile solution. I shared this photo in another post, but, this is the CPU load on a fat client. There is nearly no load on the server. https://links.hosef.org/topfatclient --scott From lesmikesell at gmail.com Wed Mar 4 13:54:09 2009 From: lesmikesell at gmail.com (Les Mikesell) Date: Wed, 04 Mar 2009 07:54:09 -0600 Subject: [K12OSN] Possible to access an external MS AD ? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <49AE8801.8030001@gmail.com> Robert Arkiletian wrote: > I'm wondering if a Windows box inside an LTSP lan (which therefore > would get it's IP from the LTSP server) can access (auth user) to a > MS AD server which is external to the LTSP lan? > > I think the answer is NO but I just want to verify with the list. I think it can if the domain is a DNS domain that the LTSP server forwards (if it is a registered public domain it should just work - if it is local you need to configure as a secondary for that domain or forward all DNS through it) - and your ports are mostly open on outbound NAT. Note that windows boxes will cache authentication so if they have previously been on the main LAN, the same user(s) will still be able to log in for a while, so troubleshooting can be confusing. -- Les Mikesell lesmikesell at gmail.com From mr.rcollins at gmail.com Wed Mar 4 15:17:10 2009 From: mr.rcollins at gmail.com (Ryan Collins) Date: Wed, 04 Mar 2009 10:17:10 -0500 Subject: [K12OSN] OT: Apple Imac lab In-Reply-To: <49ADFED1.2030409@redhat.com> References: <49A83181.5040101@cmosnetworks.com> <49ADFED1.2030409@redhat.com> Message-ID: <49AE9B76.1030602@gmail.com> Warren Togami wrote: > R. Scott Belford wrote: >> >> You will be in luck, David. Your new Mac hardware is Intel based, and >> you ought to find success with the latest K12Linux. At the very >> least, you will find some enthusiastic debugging support until it gets >> there. > > This is not the case. Those new Intel Macs use EFI instead of BIOS with > PXE. EFI netboot is a bit non-standardized, especially Apple's screwed > version of EFI. I'm not sure if any distribution has Apple EFI netboot > support yet. This might help: http://refit.sourceforge.net/ -- Ryan Collins - Technology Coordinator - Kenton City Schools Blog: http://ryancollins.org/wp/ -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: mr_rcollins.vcf Type: text/x-vcard Size: 170 bytes Desc: not available URL: From cisna-barry at wc235.k12.il.us Wed Mar 4 19:50:04 2009 From: cisna-barry at wc235.k12.il.us (Barry Cisna) Date: Wed, 04 Mar 2009 13:50:04 -0600 Subject: [K12OSN] phaser 850 13.004.43 Message-ID: <1236196204.11733.0.camel@hi2.wc235.k12.il.us> From burke at thealmquists.net Wed Mar 4 23:37:39 2009 From: burke at thealmquists.net (Almquist Burke) Date: Wed, 4 Mar 2009 17:37:39 -0600 Subject: [K12OSN] OT: Apple Imac lab In-Reply-To: <4b5781040903032034n5d140d3aj304aac020a350a76@mail.gmail.com> References: <4b5781040903032034n5d140d3aj304aac020a350a76@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On Mar 3, 2009, at 10:34 PM, Christian Einfeldt wrote: > Based on my experience there, which is limited, as I am just the > level one tech, I would say that it is going to be a nightmare for > you to pull video across a network, even if it is an LDAP network > with the apps running locally on the clients, let alone have the > apps running on the server. The server will take a huge hit. Even > with an LDAP setup, which sees only files (and not apps) running > across the network, you are looking at big lag times and poor > performance for those machines. Strictly speaking LDAP is really just for authentication, groups, etc, it doesn't take up much network traffic. I'd suspect the issue you are having is storing the video files on a network share (like your /home folder mounted over NFS). Then all the I/O is going to have to travel over the network. You could still have LDAP and /home mounted over NFS, just don't put your AV files on there when you are working with them. That stuff needs it's own storage! -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.7 (Darwin) iEYEARECAAYFAkmvEMMACgkQxWV7OPa/g5GkLQCfRJ1bQCxksLDBdeQVYIVLDZ98 IokAnirX8gZgToJBxdgsOny3NH9BCG2g =momi -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From robark at gmail.com Thu Mar 5 00:07:26 2009 From: robark at gmail.com (Robert Arkiletian) Date: Wed, 4 Mar 2009 16:07:26 -0800 Subject: [K12OSN] Where is K12LTSP at? In-Reply-To: References: <8b88203f0902230922x6690c69blf5cd058909e96c62@mail.gmail.com> <20090223192108.GB26900@aurora.owens.net> <49A42D31.3030603@redhat.com> <1236048375.27861.4.camel@t3002.localdomain> Message-ID: On 3/4/09, R. Scott Belford wrote: > 2009/3/2 Moon : >> What has been your experience with DRBL for the following: >> >> 1. Boot time > > As fast as the network - pretty much the same booting experience as > the k12ltsp/k12linux, etc. > >> 2. Reliability > > DRBL is just a project that pre-scripts some really cool behavior from > standard packages. So, since you can install DRBL (diskless remote > booting linux) on pretty much any distro, reliability is a function of > the team behind the distro. > >> 3. Scalability - as in how many TCs have you seen running simultaneously >> one >> one server? Server specs.? > > I have multicast imaged 25 clients at once using Clonezilla on DRBL. > Kristian just spoke at SCALE about DRBL in 'pod' settings of 4 or 5 > clients. You have to consider this - you can, by default, configure > DRBL to be a fat and a thin client server. The client's behavior can > be pre-determined by MAC address, it can be determined by the user's > interaction, or it can be determined by setting the default boot > option. > > If you are booting fat clients, then you need very little CPU > horsepower, but you need bandwidth and disk i/o. I have noticed, when > running Top with a 1s refresh, that NFSD is barely hit when I boot a > fat client. I have not tested this in scale beyond 5 clients. It is > scary impressive, but it is also just NFS/NIS/DHCP/TFTP, etc. > Kamloops school district uses a DRBL-like home grown solution for all schools. One server per school. They tested booting 120 clients. I thought disk i/o would go through the roof but it didn't. After the first system boots everything is in the cache of the server, so subsequent requests for the same data (which is exactly the case for booting) doesn't hit the disk. So the network becomes the bottleneck. So they bonded 2 gigabit nics to the switch. 802.3ad Link Aggregation. Clients are 100Mbps NOT 1000Mbps. DRBL servers are just file servers so they can handle many more clients than LTSP servers. Programs do take a *bit* longer to launch but once up, they are fast. Provided you have good/powerful clients. Also, second time launch of a program (eg. Firefox) is much faster since the client kernel caches app memory. 2GB is $25 USD now. Plus there is nothing special required for local devices or sound. The only thing that's not local is the disk. > If you are booting thin clients, then you need the horsepower on the > server. I have not tested this in scale, but I do know that you have > to enable XDMCP in order for the thin-client element to work. I > imagine the same scalability as the K12LTSP, but, I really don't know. > >> 4. TC performance compared to LTSP and stand-alone workstation > > For me, it seems that modern thin clients are well served with > K12Linux. I hope that some of this makes its way into an EL release. > For older clients, as has been stated, the K12LTSP el is still so very > good. Of course we are now learning about how to run both, as in > LTSP5 and LTSP4.2, on the same server. > > However, I am discovering just how good the fat client world can be, > and 'older' hardware for us is a PII and PIII nowadays. For this, I > am in love with DRBL on any distro, including redhat or centos or > fedora. I am intrigued by the default NFS/NIS integration in DRBL > since, aside from security concerns, this is a great, out-of-the-box, > central authentication and roaming profile solution. > > I shared this photo in another post, but, this is the CPU load on a > fat client. There is nearly no load on the server. > > https://links.hosef.org/topfatclient > > --scott > > _______________________________________________ > K12OSN mailing list > K12OSN at redhat.com > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > For more info see > -- Robert Arkiletian Eric Hamber Secondary, Vancouver, Canada From carl at snarlnet.com Thu Mar 5 01:26:27 2009 From: carl at snarlnet.com (Carl Keil) Date: Wed, 04 Mar 2009 17:26:27 -0800 Subject: [K12OSN] OT - Setting up Samba on k12ltsp for Ubuntu and XP clients? Message-ID: <49AF2A43.8080702@snarlnet.com> Hey, I'm running an old server (the Fedora 6 version of k12ltsp). I'm trying to set up a Samba share on it that people can access equally easily from Ubuntu 8.04 or Windows XP clients. The Windows clients seem to work how I want them to, but the Ubuntu clients are acting weird. I'm going through the "Places" menu and adding the server via "Connect to Server" selecting "Windows Share" and typing in the IP/share name etc. Then it asks for the password. When I type in the password and click OK, sometimes it "takes" and sometimes it doesn't. Even when it works it pops up an error message saying that the share wasn't mounted. But when you go back to "Places" it's there. Also, I have 2 shares, one of them works as above, and seems OK once you get in. But the other shows up, and you can create files and folders, but then you can't edit them in applications or save them from within applications. Even though you just created them. This is for a school of mixed ages. None of this is user friendly enough on Ubuntu. I thought about doing an NFS share of the same directories. But someone on this list a long time ago warned me against "mixing" shares as both NFS and Samba. He said stuff could get all bolluxed up. Does anyone have a "HowTo" or a good link that will walk me through a good setup? I've been googling and everything is assuming that I've got an Ubuntu server serving Ubuntu and XP clients. I've tried adapting the suggestions in there with no luck. Thanks, ck From rowens at ptd.net Thu Mar 5 02:39:41 2009 From: rowens at ptd.net (Rob Owens) Date: Wed, 4 Mar 2009 21:39:41 -0500 Subject: [K12OSN] OT - Setting up Samba on k12ltsp for Ubuntu and XP clients? In-Reply-To: <49AF2A43.8080702@snarlnet.com> References: <49AF2A43.8080702@snarlnet.com> Message-ID: <20090305023941.GA6155@aurora.owens.net> Longshot: do all the Linux machines have the same WORKGROUP specified in smb.conf? I'm not sure if the "Connect to Server" dialog cares about that or not, but I'd check it if you don't have any other leads. -Rob On Wed, Mar 04, 2009 at 05:26:27PM -0800, Carl Keil wrote: > Hey, > > I'm running an old server (the Fedora 6 version of k12ltsp). I'm trying > to set up a Samba share on it that people can access equally easily from > Ubuntu 8.04 or Windows XP clients. The Windows clients seem to work how > I want them to, but the Ubuntu clients are acting weird. I'm going > through the "Places" menu and adding the server via "Connect to Server" > selecting "Windows Share" and typing in the IP/share name etc. Then it > asks for the password. When I type in the password and click OK, > sometimes it "takes" and sometimes it doesn't. Even when it works it > pops up an error message saying that the share wasn't mounted. But when > you go back to "Places" it's there. Also, I have 2 shares, one of them > works as above, and seems OK once you get in. But the other shows up, > and you can create files and folders, but then you can't edit them in > applications or save them from within applications. Even though you > just created them. > > This is for a school of mixed ages. None of this is user friendly > enough on Ubuntu. I thought about doing an NFS share of the same > directories. But someone on this list a long time ago warned me against > "mixing" shares as both NFS and Samba. He said stuff could get all > bolluxed up. > > Does anyone have a "HowTo" or a good link that will walk me through a > good setup? I've been googling and everything is assuming that I've got > an Ubuntu server serving Ubuntu and XP clients. I've tried adapting the > suggestions in there with no luck. > > Thanks, > > ck > > _______________________________________________ > K12OSN mailing list > K12OSN at redhat.com > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > For more info see From carl at snarlnet.com Thu Mar 5 06:36:15 2009 From: carl at snarlnet.com (Carl Keil) Date: Wed, 04 Mar 2009 22:36:15 -0800 Subject: [K12OSN] OT - Setting up Samba on k12ltsp for Ubuntu and XP clients? Message-ID: <49AF72DF.3000707@snarlnet.com> Thanks for the reply. I never looked at any sort of smb config on the clients. It is weird because when I browse "WORKGROUP" on the network, other servers (XP machines that have Windows File Sharing turned on) show up, but not my Samba Server. I'll try poking around in there. > Longshot: do all the Linux machines have the same WORKGROUP specified in smb.conf? I'm not sure if the "Connect to Server" dialog cares about that or > not, but I'd check it if you don't have any other leads. > > -Rob > > On Wed, Mar 04, 2009 at 05:26:27PM -0800, Carl Keil wrote: > > Hey, > > > > I'm running an old server (the Fedora 6 version of k12ltsp). I'm trying > > to set up a Samba share on it that people can access equally easily from > > Ubuntu 8.04 or Windows XP clients. The Windows clients seem to work how > > I want them to, but the Ubuntu clients are acting weird. I'm going > > through the "Places" menu and adding the server via "Connect to Server" > > selecting "Windows Share" and typing in the IP/share name etc. Then it > > asks for the password. When I type in the password and click OK, > > sometimes it "takes" and sometimes it doesn't. Even when it works it > > pops up an error message saying that the share wasn't mounted. But when > > you go back to "Places" it's there. Also, I have 2 shares, one of them > > works as above, and seems OK once you get in. But the other shows up, > > and you can create files and folders, but then you can't edit them in > > applications or save them from within applications. Even though you > > just created them. > > > > This is for a school of mixed ages. None of this is user friendly > > enough on Ubuntu. I thought about doing an NFS share of the same > > directories. But someone on this list a long time ago warned me against > > "mixing" shares as both NFS and Samba. He said stuff could get all > > bolluxed up. > > > > Does anyone have a "HowTo" or a good link that will walk me through a > > good setup? I've been googling and everything is assuming that I've got > > an Ubuntu server serving Ubuntu and XP clients. I've tried adapting the > > suggestions in there with no luck. From jahnigl at hotmail.com Thu Mar 5 14:17:40 2009 From: jahnigl at hotmail.com (Lance Jahnig) Date: Thu, 5 Mar 2009 08:17:40 -0600 Subject: [K12OSN] phaser 850 13.004.43 In-Reply-To: <1236196204.11733.0.camel@hi2.wc235.k12.il.us> References: <1236196204.11733.0.camel@hi2.wc235.k12.il.us> Message-ID: 13,004.43: TCH_JS_LEFT_SLOW The left jet stack heater is not heating at all, or is heating too slowly. Ensure the printer is not located next to an air-conditioning duct. Check that the printhead-to-drum gap is not too close (the drum can act as a heatsink). Inspect the printer wiring. Replace the printhead. -------------------------------------------------- From: "Barry Cisna" Sent: Wednesday, March 04, 2009 1:50 PM To: "K12LTSP List Archives" Subject: [K12OSN] phaser 850 13.004.43 > > > _______________________________________________ > K12OSN mailing list > K12OSN at redhat.com > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > For more info see > From simpsond at leopards.k12.ar.us Thu Mar 5 16:38:52 2009 From: simpsond at leopards.k12.ar.us (Doug Simpson) Date: Thu, 05 Mar 2009 10:38:52 -0600 Subject: [K12OSN] iptables ? help Message-ID: <49AFABBB.550C.0078.0@leopards.k12.ar.us> One network has 192.168.x.x numbers (in that lab) and the other network has 10.40.x.x numbers (the rest of the network). When booted, it works fine and all, but if you go to a console (ALT-F1-F5) you see all the traffic. Is there a setting to make it not display everything to the console? It makes the console unusable. Iptables is running and that is dumping everything to the console. Is there a way to stop this? Thanks Doug Doug Simpson Technology Specialist De Queen Public Schools De Queen, AR simpsond at leopards.k12.ar.us "A Dollar Saved is a Dollar Earned" Doug Simpson Technology Specialist De Queen Public Schools De Queen, AR simpsond at leopards.k12.ar.us "A Dollar Saved is a Dollar Earned" From dyoung at mesd.k12.or.us Thu Mar 5 16:44:08 2009 From: dyoung at mesd.k12.or.us (Dan Young) Date: Thu, 5 Mar 2009 08:44:08 -0800 Subject: [K12OSN] iptables ? help In-Reply-To: <49AFABBB.550C.0078.0@leopards.k12.ar.us> References: <49AFABBB.550C.0078.0@leopards.k12.ar.us> Message-ID: <994441ae0903050844o19ac198dw2a0189c5b2292a5b@mail.gmail.com> On Thu, Mar 5, 2009 at 8:38 AM, Doug Simpson wrote: > Iptables is running and that is dumping everything to the console. Do your iptables rules have a LOG target in them? -- Dan Young Multnomah ESD - Technology Services 503-257-1562 From simpsond at leopards.k12.ar.us Thu Mar 5 16:47:36 2009 From: simpsond at leopards.k12.ar.us (Doug Simpson) Date: Thu, 05 Mar 2009 10:47:36 -0600 Subject: [K12OSN] iptables ? help In-Reply-To: <994441ae0903050844o19ac198dw2a0189c5b2292a5b@mail.gmail.com> References: <49AFABBB.550C.0078.0@leopards.k12.ar.us> <994441ae0903050844o19ac198dw2a0189c5b2292a5b@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <49AFADC8.550C.0078.0@leopards.k12.ar.us> When I said "iptables" I told you all I know about iptables. . . In other words, I have no idea. . . This is new territory to me. . . DS Doug Simpson Technology Specialist De Queen Public Schools De Queen, AR simpsond at leopards.k12.ar.us "A Dollar Saved is a Dollar Earned" >>> Dan Young 3/5/2009 10:44 AM >>> On Thu, Mar 5, 2009 at 8:38 AM, Doug Simpson wrote: > Iptables is running and that is dumping everything to the console. Do your iptables rules have a LOG target in them? -- Dan Young Multnomah ESD - Technology Services 503-257-1562 _______________________________________________ K12OSN mailing list K12OSN at redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn For more info see From microman at cmosnetworks.com Thu Mar 5 17:22:09 2009 From: microman at cmosnetworks.com (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?=22Terrell_Prud=E9_Jr=2E=22?=) Date: Thu, 05 Mar 2009 12:22:09 -0500 Subject: [K12OSN] OT - Setting up Samba on k12ltsp for Ubuntu and XP clients? In-Reply-To: <49AF2A43.8080702@snarlnet.com> References: <49AF2A43.8080702@snarlnet.com> Message-ID: <49B00A41.2080701@cmosnetworks.com> Carl Keil wrote: > Hey, > > I'm running an old server (the Fedora 6 version of k12ltsp). Please upgrade to K12LTSP 5EL. No security updates for Fedora 6 since December 2007. You don't want your server to get compromised. > I'm trying to set up a Samba share on it that people can access > equally easily from Ubuntu 8.04 or Windows XP clients. The Windows > clients seem to work how I want them to, but the Ubuntu clients are > acting weird. I'm going through the "Places" menu and adding the > server via "Connect to Server" selecting "Windows Share" and typing in > the IP/share name etc. Then it asks for the password. When I type in > the password and click OK, sometimes it "takes" and sometimes it > doesn't. Even when it works it pops up an error message saying that > the share wasn't mounted. But when you go back to "Places" it's > there. Also, I have 2 shares, one of them works as above, and seems > OK once you get in. But the other shows up, and you can create files > and folders, but then you can't edit them in applications or save them > from within applications. Even though you just created them. Just as a test--assuming all your WORKGROUP settings are the same--try installing Konqueror on *one* Ubuntu 8.04 machine and entering the following URL, adjusted for your server/share: smb://myserver/myshare and see if that works. That's how I access SMB shares from my Ubuntu box at the office. > > This is for a school of mixed ages. None of this is user friendly > enough on Ubuntu. I thought about doing an NFS share of the same > directories. But someone on this list a long time ago warned me > against "mixing" shares as both NFS and Samba. He said stuff could > get all bolluxed up. Nah, that's not a problem. I used to do this all the time with NFS, Samba, *and* Netatalk. What he's probably referring to is something called file locking. Sure, that could be a factor if two or more folks are trying to write to the same file, but that can be an issue in any heterogeneous (read: not entirely MS Windows) environment. Applying appropriate access permissions eliminates that issue anyway. > > Does anyone have a "HowTo" or a good link that will walk me through a > good setup? I've been googling and everything is assuming that I've > got an Ubuntu server serving Ubuntu and XP clients. I've tried > adapting the suggestions in there with no luck. If there is one, www.howtoforge.com is the first place I'd look. They've got distro-specific how-to's for lots of subjects. --TP From microman at cmosnetworks.com Thu Mar 5 17:24:02 2009 From: microman at cmosnetworks.com (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?=22Terrell_Prud=E9_Jr=2E=22?=) Date: Thu, 05 Mar 2009 12:24:02 -0500 Subject: [K12OSN] iptables ? help In-Reply-To: <49AFADC8.550C.0078.0@leopards.k12.ar.us> References: <49AFABBB.550C.0078.0@leopards.k12.ar.us> <994441ae0903050844o19ac198dw2a0189c5b2292a5b@mail.gmail.com> <49AFADC8.550C.0078.0@leopards.k12.ar.us> Message-ID: <49B00AB2.1000206@cmosnetworks.com> Make thyself root, and give us the output from the following command. iptables -L That means "iptables, List all the rules, please." --TP Doug Simpson wrote: > When I said "iptables" I told you all I know about iptables. . . > In other words, I have no idea. . . > > This is new territory to me. . . > > DS > > Doug Simpson > Technology Specialist > De Queen Public Schools > De Queen, AR > simpsond at leopards.k12.ar.us > "A Dollar Saved is a Dollar Earned" > > > >>>> Dan Young 3/5/2009 10:44 AM >>> >>>> > On Thu, Mar 5, 2009 at 8:38 AM, Doug Simpson > wrote: > >> Iptables is running and that is dumping everything to the console. >> > > Do your iptables rules have a LOG target in them? > > -- > Dan Young > Multnomah ESD - Technology Services > 503-257-1562 > > _______________________________________________ > K12OSN mailing list > K12OSN at redhat.com > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > For more info see > > > _______________________________________________ > K12OSN mailing list > K12OSN at redhat.com > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > For more info see > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From simpsond at leopards.k12.ar.us Thu Mar 5 18:23:00 2009 From: simpsond at leopards.k12.ar.us (Doug Simpson) Date: Thu, 05 Mar 2009 12:23:00 -0600 Subject: [K12OSN] iptables ? help In-Reply-To: <49B00AB2.1000206@cmosnetworks.com> References: <49AFABBB.550C.0078.0@leopards.k12.ar.us> <994441ae0903050844o19ac198dw2a0189c5b2292a5b@mail.gmail.com> <49AFADC8.550C.0078.0@leopards.k12.ar.us><49AFADC8.550C.0078.0@leopards.k12.ar.us> <49B00AB2.1000206@cmosnetworks.com> Message-ID: <49AFC423.550C.0078.0@leopards.k12.ar.us> I can get to the console as root. . . But, when I ALT-F1 (or 2- 5) the stuff is scrolling by on the screen and it is impossible to see what you are typing or whatever. . . I will get that somehow, though. . . Thanks for assistance! DS Doug Simpson Technology Specialist De Queen Public Schools De Queen, AR simpsond at leopards.k12.ar.us "A Dollar Saved is a Dollar Earned" >>> "Terrell Prud? Jr." 3/5/2009 11:24 AM >>> Make thyself root, and give us the output from the following command. iptables -L That means "iptables, List all the rules, please." --TP Doug Simpson wrote: > When I said "iptables" I told you all I know about iptables. . . > In other words, I have no idea. . . > > This is new territory to me. . . > > DS > > Doug Simpson > Technology Specialist > De Queen Public Schools > De Queen, AR > simpsond at leopards.k12.ar.us > "A Dollar Saved is a Dollar Earned" > > > >>>> Dan Young 3/5/2009 10:44 AM >>> >>>> > On Thu, Mar 5, 2009 at 8:38 AM, Doug Simpson > wrote: > >> Iptables is running and that is dumping everything to the console. >> > > Do your iptables rules have a LOG target in them? > > -- > Dan Young > Multnomah ESD - Technology Services > 503-257-1562 > > _______________________________________________ > K12OSN mailing list > K12OSN at redhat.com > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > For more info see > > > _______________________________________________ > K12OSN mailing list > K12OSN at redhat.com > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > For more info see > From rasher at paragould.k12.ar.us Thu Mar 5 18:38:58 2009 From: rasher at paragould.k12.ar.us (Rob Asher) Date: Thu, 05 Mar 2009 12:38:58 -0600 Subject: [K12OSN] iptables ? help In-Reply-To: <49AFC423.550C.0078.0@leopards.k12.ar.us> References: <49AFABBB.550C.0078.0@leopards.k12.ar.us> <994441ae0903050844o19ac198dw2a0189c5b2292a5b@mail.gmail.com> <49AFADC8.550C.0078.0@leopards.k12.ar.us><49AFADC8.550C.0078.0@leopards.k12.ar.us> <49B00AB2.1000206@cmosnetworks.com><49B00AB2.1000206@cmosnetworks.com> <49AFC423.550C.0078.0@leopards.k12.ar.us> Message-ID: <49AFC7DA.0172.0037.0@paragould.k12.ar.us> Assuming a redhat distro, you could "/etc/init.d/iptables stop" or "service iptables stop" and then "cat /etc/sysconfig/iptables" and "cat /etc/sysconfig/ip6tables" or just the "iptables -L". Restart iptables!!! Rob ------------------------------------- Rob Asher Network Systems Technician Paragould School District (870)236-7744 Ext. 169 >>> "Doug Simpson" 3/5/2009 12:23 PM >>> I can get to the console as root. . . But, when I ALT-F1 (or 2- 5) the stuff is scrolling by on the screen and it is impossible to see what you are typing or whatever. . . I will get that somehow, though. . . Thanks for assistance! DS Doug Simpson Technology Specialist De Queen Public Schools De Queen, AR simpsond at leopards.k12.ar.us "A Dollar Saved is a Dollar Earned" >>> "Terrell Prud? Jr." 3/5/2009 11:24 AM >>> Make thyself root, and give us the output from the following command. iptables -L That means "iptables, List all the rules, please." --TP Doug Simpson wrote: > When I said "iptables" I told you all I know about iptables. . . > In other words, I have no idea. . . > > This is new territory to me. . . > > DS > > Doug Simpson > Technology Specialist > De Queen Public Schools > De Queen, AR > simpsond at leopards.k12.ar.us > "A Dollar Saved is a Dollar Earned" > > > >>>> Dan Young 3/5/2009 10:44 AM >>> >>>> > On Thu, Mar 5, 2009 at 8:38 AM, Doug Simpson > wrote: > >> Iptables is running and that is dumping everything to the console. >> > > Do your iptables rules have a LOG target in them? > > -- > Dan Young > Multnomah ESD - Technology Services > 503-257-1562 > > _______________________________________________ > K12OSN mailing list > K12OSN at redhat.com > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > For more info see > > > _______________________________________________ > K12OSN mailing list > K12OSN at redhat.com > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > For more info see > _______________________________________________ K12OSN mailing list K12OSN at redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn For more info see ---------- This message has been scanned for viruses and dangerous content by the Paragould School District MailScanner, and is believed to be clean. ---------- This message has been scanned for viruses and dangerous content by the Paragould School District MailScanner, and is believed to be clean. From rowens at ptd.net Thu Mar 5 18:56:56 2009 From: rowens at ptd.net (Rob Owens) Date: Thu, 5 Mar 2009 13:56:56 -0500 Subject: [K12OSN] iptables ? help In-Reply-To: <49AFC423.550C.0078.0@leopards.k12.ar.us> References: <49AFABBB.550C.0078.0@leopards.k12.ar.us> <994441ae0903050844o19ac198dw2a0189c5b2292a5b@mail.gmail.com> <49B00AB2.1000206@cmosnetworks.com> <49AFC423.550C.0078.0@leopards.k12.ar.us> Message-ID: <20090305185656.GA8621@aurora.owens.net> You could also do it with a terminal window when logged into a GUI. -Rob On Thu, Mar 05, 2009 at 12:23:00PM -0600, Doug Simpson wrote: > I can get to the console as root. . . > > But, when I ALT-F1 (or 2- 5) the stuff is scrolling by on the screen > and it is impossible to see what you are typing or whatever. . . > > I will get that somehow, though. . . > > Thanks for assistance! > > DS > > > Doug Simpson > Technology Specialist > De Queen Public Schools > De Queen, AR > simpsond at leopards.k12.ar.us > "A Dollar Saved is a Dollar Earned" > > > >>> "Terrell Prud? Jr." 3/5/2009 11:24 AM > >>> > Make thyself root, and give us the output from the following command. > > iptables -L > > That means "iptables, List all the rules, please." > > --TP > > Doug Simpson wrote: > > When I said "iptables" I told you all I know about iptables. . . > > In other words, I have no idea. . . > > > > This is new territory to me. . . > > > > DS > > > > Doug Simpson > > Technology Specialist > > De Queen Public Schools > > De Queen, AR > > simpsond at leopards.k12.ar.us > > "A Dollar Saved is a Dollar Earned" > > > > > > > >>>> Dan Young 3/5/2009 10:44 AM >>> > >>>> > > On Thu, Mar 5, 2009 at 8:38 AM, Doug Simpson > > wrote: > > > >> Iptables is running and that is dumping everything to the console. > >> > > > > Do your iptables rules have a LOG target in them? > > > > -- > > Dan Young > > Multnomah ESD - Technology Services > > 503-257-1562 > > > > _______________________________________________ > > K12OSN mailing list > > K12OSN at redhat.com > > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > > For more info see > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > K12OSN mailing list > > K12OSN at redhat.com > > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > > For more info see > > > > _______________________________________________ > K12OSN mailing list > K12OSN at redhat.com > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > For more info see From khaipi at gmail.com Thu Mar 5 20:21:06 2009 From: khaipi at gmail.com (khaipi) Date: Thu, 5 Mar 2009 21:21:06 +0100 Subject: [K12OSN] problem with Fedora USB livecreater Message-ID: <5a9e4f6f0903051221t59fad0e1hdee64dbabb4c2402@mail.gmail.com> Dear All, I have got a problem with K12Linux USB livercreater. [creator:707] Problem determining free space: (21, 'GetDiskFreeSpace', 'Das Gerat ist nicht bereit.') [creator:707] Problem determining free space: (21, 'GetDiskFreeSpace', 'Das Gerat ist nicht bereit.') No handlers could be found for logger "liveusb.creator" My USB is 2 GB and Persistent Storage is 300 MB. best regards, Koko -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From k12ltsp at rwcinc.net Fri Mar 6 02:50:38 2009 From: k12ltsp at rwcinc.net (Patrick Fleming) Date: Thu, 05 Mar 2009 19:50:38 -0700 Subject: [K12OSN] iptables ? help In-Reply-To: <49AFC7DA.0172.0037.0@paragould.k12.ar.us> References: <49AFABBB.550C.0078.0@leopards.k12.ar.us> <994441ae0903050844o19ac198dw2a0189c5b2292a5b@mail.gmail.com> <49AFADC8.550C.0078.0@leopards.k12.ar.us><49AFADC8.550C.0078.0@leopards.k12.ar.us> <49B00AB2.1000206@cmosnetworks.com><49B00AB2.1000206@cmosnetworks.com> <49AFC423.550C.0078.0@leopards.k12.ar.us> <49AFC7DA.0172.0037.0@paragould.k12.ar.us> Message-ID: <49B08F7E.9050607@rwcinc.net> Rob Asher wrote: > Assuming a redhat distro, you could "/etc/init.d/iptables stop" or > "service iptables stop" and then "cat /etc/sysconfig/iptables" and "cat > /etc/sysconfig/ip6tables" or just the >"iptables -L". Restart > iptables!!! This would only give the rules that are loaded when iptables is stopped. You want all of the rules. The cat commands above should work with that. > > Rob > > > ------------------------------------- > Rob Asher > Network Systems Technician > Paragould School District > (870)236-7744 Ext. 169 > > >>>> "Doug Simpson" 3/5/2009 12:23 PM >>> > I can get to the console as root. . . > > But, when I ALT-F1 (or 2- 5) the stuff is scrolling by on the screen > and it is impossible to see what you are typing or whatever. . . > > I will get that somehow, though. . . > > Thanks for assistance! > > DS > > > Doug Simpson > Technology Specialist > De Queen Public Schools > De Queen, AR > simpsond at leopards.k12.ar.us > "A Dollar Saved is a Dollar Earned" > > >>>> "Terrell Prud? Jr." 3/5/2009 11:24 AM >>>> > Make thyself root, and give us the output from the following command. > > iptables -L > > That means "iptables, List all the rules, please." > > --TP > > Doug Simpson wrote: >> When I said "iptables" I told you all I know about iptables. . . >> In other words, I have no idea. . . >> >> This is new territory to me. . . >> >> DS >> >> Doug Simpson >> Technology Specialist >> De Queen Public Schools >> De Queen, AR >> simpsond at leopards.k12.ar.us >> "A Dollar Saved is a Dollar Earned" >> >> >> >>>>> Dan Young 3/5/2009 10:44 AM >>> >>>>> >> On Thu, Mar 5, 2009 at 8:38 AM, Doug Simpson >> wrote: >> >>> Iptables is running and that is dumping everything to the console. >>> >> Do your iptables rules have a LOG target in them? >> >> -- >> Dan Young >> Multnomah ESD - Technology Services >> 503-257-1562 >> >> _______________________________________________ >> K12OSN mailing list >> K12OSN at redhat.com >> https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn >> For more info see >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> K12OSN mailing list >> K12OSN at redhat.com >> https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn >> For more info see >> > > _______________________________________________ > K12OSN mailing list > K12OSN at redhat.com > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > For more info see > > ---------- > > This message has been scanned for viruses and > dangerous content by the Paragould School District > MailScanner, and is believed to be clean. > > > ---------- > > This message has been scanned for viruses and > dangerous content by the Paragould School District > MailScanner, and is believed to be clean. > > _______________________________________________ > K12OSN mailing list > K12OSN at redhat.com > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > For more info see > From dahopkins429 at gmail.com Fri Mar 6 15:09:41 2009 From: dahopkins429 at gmail.com (David Hopkins) Date: Fri, 6 Mar 2009 10:09:41 -0500 Subject: [K12OSN] Where is K12LTSP at? In-Reply-To: <49A456C2.6030602@redhat.com> References: <8b88203f0902230922x6690c69blf5cd058909e96c62@mail.gmail.com> <49A456C2.6030602@redhat.com> Message-ID: Revisiting this with an update. I was able to boot my x86_64 servers via the USB LiveServer but had a couple of glitches. 1) I don't allow DHCP on the switch that the servers share, so I disabled Network Manager and manually assigned the IP address, subnet mask, gateway. Tested by pinging various systems within the network. 2) Configured the second ethernet card to serve the clients. Booted a few different types of hardware and they seem to work. 3) But ... web browsing did not work. I have to use a proxy and after setting the proxy setting (either at the console for liveuser or at a thin client with either liveuser or a test account) I get an error message that FF is configured to use a proxy and the connection is being refused. Very strange as I obviously don't have that issue with the current release. 4) Sound seemed to work but until I can get FF to proxy correctly, I can't test the ability to use what-used-to-be UnitedStreaming or other video/audio repositories. And ... any documentation on the new locations of all the config files? This has changed. Ideally I will be changing the ltsp settings back to the 192.168 address range so I don't have to change all my pre-defined thin clients as well as printers. It should be 1 or 2 files that have to be edited (dhcpd.conf would be one?) Thanks! Dave Hopkins On Tue, Feb 24, 2009 at 3:21 PM, Warren Togami wrote: > David Hopkins wrote: >> >> I am using the Centos5 version on all my servers (6 LTSP servers, 200+ >> thin clients, 4 other servers at present). I know I am not getting the >> latest/greatest that LTSP provides but I've also seen people reporting >> issues and I just haven't had the time to sort out if K12Linux will >> run on the thin client hardware that I have available. In particular, >> I have a lot of Via EPIA 533-based thin clients that the school >> purchased. These have to work or else I cannot justify the switch. > > https://fedorahosted.org/k12linux/wiki/LiveServer > Tried this? K12Linux Live Server media will allow you to try K12Linux in > demo mode with your existing network of thin clients, without risking the > hard drive of your server. > >> However, the only real driving reason for me to upgrade is to >> finally, once-and-for-all, get sound working properly with support for >> local microphones as well. That is the driving issue for me (and if > > Last I heard none of the distributions of LTSP5 have microphones working. > This might be mainly an issue of nobody working on it yet though. > > Warren Togami > wtogami at redhat.com > > _______________________________________________ > K12OSN mailing list > K12OSN at redhat.com > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > For more info see > From microman at cmosnetworks.com Fri Mar 6 17:21:48 2009 From: microman at cmosnetworks.com (=?UTF-8?B?IlRlcnJlbGwgUHJ1ZMOpIEpyLiI=?=) Date: Fri, 06 Mar 2009 12:21:48 -0500 Subject: [K12OSN] iptables ? help In-Reply-To: <49AFC423.550C.0078.0@leopards.k12.ar.us> References: <49AFABBB.550C.0078.0@leopards.k12.ar.us> <994441ae0903050844o19ac198dw2a0189c5b2292a5b@mail.gmail.com> <49AFADC8.550C.0078.0@leopards.k12.ar.us><49AFADC8.550C.0078.0@leopards.k12.ar.us> <49B00AB2.1000206@cmosnetworks.com> <49AFC423.550C.0078.0@leopards.k12.ar.us> Message-ID: <49B15BAC.5000004@cmosnetworks.com> Ah, in that case, try SSH'ing into the box and doing it. You shouldn't see the console messages from an SSH session. --TP _______________________________ Do you GNU ? Microsoft Free since 2003 --the ultimate antivirus protection! Doug Simpson wrote: > I can get to the console as root. . . > > But, when I ALT-F1 (or 2- 5) the stuff is scrolling by on the screen > and it is impossible to see what you are typing or whatever. . . > > I will get that somehow, though. . . > > Thanks for assistance! > > DS > > > Doug Simpson > Technology Specialist > De Queen Public Schools > De Queen, AR > simpsond at leopards.k12.ar.us > "A Dollar Saved is a Dollar Earned" > > > >>>> "Terrell Prud? Jr." 3/5/2009 11:24 AM >>>> >>>> > Make thyself root, and give us the output from the following command. > > iptables -L > > That means "iptables, List all the rules, please." > > --TP > > Doug Simpson wrote: > >> When I said "iptables" I told you all I know about iptables. . . >> In other words, I have no idea. . . >> >> This is new territory to me. . . >> >> DS >> >> Doug Simpson >> Technology Specialist >> De Queen Public Schools >> De Queen, AR >> simpsond at leopards.k12.ar.us >> "A Dollar Saved is a Dollar Earned" >> >> >> >> >>>>> Dan Young 3/5/2009 10:44 AM >>> >>>>> >>>>> >> On Thu, Mar 5, 2009 at 8:38 AM, Doug Simpson >> wrote: >> >> >>> Iptables is running and that is dumping everything to the console. >>> >>> >> Do your iptables rules have a LOG target in them? >> >> -- >> Dan Young >> Multnomah ESD - Technology Services >> 503-257-1562 >> >> _______________________________________________ >> K12OSN mailing list >> K12OSN at redhat.com >> https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn >> For more info see >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> K12OSN mailing list >> K12OSN at redhat.com >> https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn >> For more info see >> >> > > _______________________________________________ > K12OSN mailing list > K12OSN at redhat.com > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > For more info see > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From simpsond at leopards.k12.ar.us Fri Mar 6 18:21:57 2009 From: simpsond at leopards.k12.ar.us (Doug Simpson) Date: Fri, 06 Mar 2009 12:21:57 -0600 Subject: [K12OSN] iptables ? help In-Reply-To: <49B15BAC.5000004@cmosnetworks.com> References: <49AFABBB.550C.0078.0@leopards.k12.ar.us> <994441ae0903050844o19ac198dw2a0189c5b2292a5b@mail.gmail.com> <49AFADC8.550C.0078.0@leopards.k12.ar.us><49AFADC8.550C.0078.0@leopards.k12.ar.us> <49B00AB2.1000206@cmosnetworks.com> <49AFC423.550C.0078.0@leopards.k12.ar.us><49AFC423.550C.0078.0@leopards.k12.ar.us> <49B15BAC.5000004@cmosnetworks.com> Message-ID: <49B11564.550C.0078.0@leopards.k12.ar.us> Debian doesn't install sshd by default and I was in a hurry. . . Don't have it on there. . . Will keep working to get that on there. . . Once that is done, I'll be back. . . Thanks! Doug Doug Simpson Technology Specialist De Queen Public Schools De Queen, AR simpsond at leopards.k12.ar.us "A Dollar Saved is a Dollar Earned" >>> "Terrell Prud? Jr." 3/6/2009 11:21 AM >>> Ah, in that case, try SSH'ing into the box and doing it. You shouldn't see the console messages from an SSH session. --TP _______________________________ Do you GNU ? Microsoft Free since 2003 --the ultimate antivirus protection! Doug Simpson wrote: > I can get to the console as root. . . > > But, when I ALT-F1 (or 2- 5) the stuff is scrolling by on the screen > and it is impossible to see what you are typing or whatever. . . > > I will get that somehow, though. . . > > Thanks for assistance! > > DS > > > Doug Simpson > Technology Specialist > De Queen Public Schools > De Queen, AR > simpsond at leopards.k12.ar.us > "A Dollar Saved is a Dollar Earned" > > > >>>> "Terrell Prud? Jr." 3/5/2009 11:24 AM >>>> >>>> > Make thyself root, and give us the output from the following command. > > iptables -L > > That means "iptables, List all the rules, please." > > --TP > > Doug Simpson wrote: > >> When I said "iptables" I told you all I know about iptables. . . >> In other words, I have no idea. . . >> >> This is new territory to me. . . >> >> DS >> >> Doug Simpson >> Technology Specialist >> De Queen Public Schools >> De Queen, AR >> simpsond at leopards.k12.ar.us >> "A Dollar Saved is a Dollar Earned" >> >> >> >> >>>>> Dan Young 3/5/2009 10:44 AM >>> >>>>> >>>>> >> On Thu, Mar 5, 2009 at 8:38 AM, Doug Simpson >> wrote: >> >> >>> Iptables is running and that is dumping everything to the console. >>> >>> >> Do your iptables rules have a LOG target in them? >> >> -- >> Dan Young >> Multnomah ESD - Technology Services >> 503-257-1562 >> >> _______________________________________________ >> K12OSN mailing list >> K12OSN at redhat.com >> https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn >> For more info see >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> K12OSN mailing list >> K12OSN at redhat.com >> https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn >> For more info see >> >> > > _______________________________________________ > K12OSN mailing list > K12OSN at redhat.com > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > For more info see > From microman at cmosnetworks.com Fri Mar 6 18:37:39 2009 From: microman at cmosnetworks.com (=?UTF-8?B?IlRlcnJlbGwgUHJ1ZMOpIEpyLiI=?=) Date: Fri, 06 Mar 2009 13:37:39 -0500 Subject: [K12OSN] iptables ? help In-Reply-To: <49B11564.550C.0078.0@leopards.k12.ar.us> References: <49AFABBB.550C.0078.0@leopards.k12.ar.us> <994441ae0903050844o19ac198dw2a0189c5b2292a5b@mail.gmail.com> <49AFADC8.550C.0078.0@leopards.k12.ar.us><49AFADC8.550C.0078.0@leopards.k12.ar.us> <49B00AB2.1000206@cmosnetworks.com> <49AFC423.550C.0078.0@leopards.k12.ar.us><49AFC423.550C.0078.0@leopards.k12.ar.us> <49B15BAC.5000004@cmosnetworks.com> <49B11564.550C.0078.0@leopards.k12.ar.us> Message-ID: <49B16D73.5030004@cmosnetworks.com> Yeah, neither does Ubuntu. But that's an easy apt-get. Let us know. --TP _______________________________ Do you GNU ? Microsoft Free since 2003 --the ultimate antivirus protection! Doug Simpson wrote: > Debian doesn't install sshd by default and I was in a hurry. . . > > Don't have it on there. . . > > Will keep working to get that on there. . . > > Once that is done, I'll be back. . . > > Thanks! > > Doug > > > Doug Simpson > Technology Specialist > De Queen Public Schools > De Queen, AR > simpsond at leopards.k12.ar.us > "A Dollar Saved is a Dollar Earned" > > > >>>> "Terrell Prud? Jr." 3/6/2009 11:21 AM >>>> >>>> > Ah, in that case, try SSH'ing into the box and doing it. You shouldn't > > see the console messages from an SSH session. > > --TP > _______________________________ > Do you GNU ? > Microsoft Free since 2003 --the ultimate > antivirus protection! > > > Doug Simpson wrote: > >> I can get to the console as root. . . >> >> But, when I ALT-F1 (or 2- 5) the stuff is scrolling by on the screen >> and it is impossible to see what you are typing or whatever. . . >> >> I will get that somehow, though. . . >> >> Thanks for assistance! >> >> DS >> >> >> Doug Simpson >> Technology Specialist >> De Queen Public Schools >> De Queen, AR >> simpsond at leopards.k12.ar.us >> "A Dollar Saved is a Dollar Earned" >> >> >> >> >>>>> "Terrell Prud? Jr." 3/5/2009 11:24 AM >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >> Make thyself root, and give us the output from the following >> > command. > >> iptables -L >> >> That means "iptables, List all the rules, please." >> >> --TP >> >> Doug Simpson wrote: >> >> >>> When I said "iptables" I told you all I know about iptables. . . >>> In other words, I have no idea. . . >>> >>> This is new territory to me. . . >>> >>> DS >>> >>> Doug Simpson >>> Technology Specialist >>> De Queen Public Schools >>> De Queen, AR >>> simpsond at leopards.k12.ar.us >>> "A Dollar Saved is a Dollar Earned" >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>>>>> Dan Young 3/5/2009 10:44 AM >>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>> On Thu, Mar 5, 2009 at 8:38 AM, Doug Simpson >>> wrote: >>> >>> >>> >>>> Iptables is running and that is dumping everything to the console. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>> Do your iptables rules have a LOG target in them? >>> >>> -- >>> Dan Young >>> Multnomah ESD - Technology Services >>> 503-257-1562 >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> K12OSN mailing list >>> K12OSN at redhat.com >>> https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn >>> For more info see >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> K12OSN mailing list >>> K12OSN at redhat.com >>> https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn >>> For more info see >>> >>> >>> >> _______________________________________________ >> K12OSN mailing list >> K12OSN at redhat.com >> https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn >> For more info see >> >> > > _______________________________________________ > K12OSN mailing list > K12OSN at redhat.com > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > For more info see > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From simpsond at leopards.k12.ar.us Fri Mar 6 18:41:15 2009 From: simpsond at leopards.k12.ar.us (Doug Simpson) Date: Fri, 06 Mar 2009 12:41:15 -0600 Subject: [K12OSN] iptables ? help In-Reply-To: <20090305185656.GA8621@aurora.owens.net> References: <49AFABBB.550C.0078.0@leopards.k12.ar.us> <994441ae0903050844o19ac198dw2a0189c5b2292a5b@mail.gmail.com> <49B00AB2.1000206@cmosnetworks.com> <49AFC423.550C.0078.0@leopards.k12.ar.us> <20090305185656.GA8621@aurora.owens.net> Message-ID: <49B119EA.550C.0078.0@leopards.k12.ar.us> Yeah, can do it that way, but it is remote to here. . .Guess I'll just have to get my hands on it. It would be easier f someone could just tell me how to turn off the output to the console from iptables. . . But, when I get a chance to get where it is, I'll do the iptables -L as I was told. . . Thanks for all of the replies. DS Doug Simpson Technology Specialist De Queen Public Schools De Queen, AR simpsond at leopards.k12.ar.us "A Dollar Saved is a Dollar Earned" >>> Rob Owens 3/5/2009 12:56 PM >>> You could also do it with a terminal window when logged into a GUI. -Rob On Thu, Mar 05, 2009 at 12:23:00PM -0600, Doug Simpson wrote: > I can get to the console as root. . . > > But, when I ALT-F1 (or 2- 5) the stuff is scrolling by on the screen > and it is impossible to see what you are typing or whatever. . . > > I will get that somehow, though. . . > > Thanks for assistance! > > DS > > > Doug Simpson > Technology Specialist > De Queen Public Schools > De Queen, AR > simpsond at leopards.k12.ar.us > "A Dollar Saved is a Dollar Earned" > > > >>> "Terrell Prud? Jr." 3/5/2009 11:24 AM > >>> > Make thyself root, and give us the output from the following command. > > iptables -L > > That means "iptables, List all the rules, please." > > --TP > > Doug Simpson wrote: > > When I said "iptables" I told you all I know about iptables. . . > > In other words, I have no idea. . . > > > > This is new territory to me. . . > > > > DS > > > > Doug Simpson > > Technology Specialist > > De Queen Public Schools > > De Queen, AR > > simpsond at leopards.k12.ar.us > > "A Dollar Saved is a Dollar Earned" > > > > > > > >>>> Dan Young 3/5/2009 10:44 AM >>> > >>>> > > On Thu, Mar 5, 2009 at 8:38 AM, Doug Simpson > > wrote: > > > >> Iptables is running and that is dumping everything to the console. > >> > > > > Do your iptables rules have a LOG target in them? > > > > -- > > Dan Young > > Multnomah ESD - Technology Services > > 503-257-1562 > > > > _______________________________________________ > > K12OSN mailing list > > K12OSN at redhat.com > > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > > For more info see > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > K12OSN mailing list > > K12OSN at redhat.com > > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > > For more info see > > > > _______________________________________________ > K12OSN mailing list > K12OSN at redhat.com > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > For more info see _______________________________________________ K12OSN mailing list K12OSN at redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn For more info see From dyoung at mesd.k12.or.us Fri Mar 6 18:50:00 2009 From: dyoung at mesd.k12.or.us (Dan Young) Date: Fri, 6 Mar 2009 10:50:00 -0800 Subject: [K12OSN] iptables ? help In-Reply-To: <49B119EA.550C.0078.0@leopards.k12.ar.us> References: <49AFABBB.550C.0078.0@leopards.k12.ar.us> <994441ae0903050844o19ac198dw2a0189c5b2292a5b@mail.gmail.com> <49B00AB2.1000206@cmosnetworks.com> <49AFC423.550C.0078.0@leopards.k12.ar.us> <20090305185656.GA8621@aurora.owens.net> <49B119EA.550C.0078.0@leopards.k12.ar.us> Message-ID: <994441ae0903061050o753332a3m6400cd53837934a@mail.gmail.com> On Fri, Mar 6, 2009 at 10:41 AM, Doug Simpson wrote: > It would be easier f someone could just tell me how to turn off the > output to the console from iptables. . . You have an iptables rule with LOG as the target. You need to alter that rule or change the logging behavior. This seems relevant: http://linux.derkeiler.com/Mailing-Lists/Debian/2006-06/msg02162.html -- Dan Young Multnomah ESD - Technology Services 503-257-1562 From morris_r at 4j.lane.edu Fri Mar 6 18:56:14 2009 From: morris_r at 4j.lane.edu (Roger Morris) Date: Fri, 6 Mar 2009 10:56:14 -0800 (PST) Subject: [K12OSN] iptables ? help In-Reply-To: <49B119EA.550C.0078.0@leopards.k12.ar.us> Message-ID: <252107049.792871236365774931.JavaMail.root@mail2.4j.lane.edu> Check in /etc/syslog.conf see if there is a line that has something like: kern.* /dev/console Add a # to the beginning of the line like this: #kern.* /dev/console Restart syslog. Roger ----- Original Message ----- From: "Doug Simpson" To: "Support list for open source software in schools." Sent: Friday, March 6, 2009 10:41:15 AM GMT -08:00 US/Canada Pacific Subject: Re: [K12OSN] iptables ? help Yeah, can do it that way, but it is remote to here. . .Guess I'll just have to get my hands on it. It would be easier f someone could just tell me how to turn off the output to the console from iptables. . . But, when I get a chance to get where it is, I'll do the iptables -L as I was told. . . Thanks for all of the replies. DS Doug Simpson Technology Specialist De Queen Public Schools De Queen, AR simpsond at leopards.k12.ar.us "A Dollar Saved is a Dollar Earned" >>> Rob Owens 3/5/2009 12:56 PM >>> You could also do it with a terminal window when logged into a GUI. -Rob On Thu, Mar 05, 2009 at 12:23:00PM -0600, Doug Simpson wrote: > I can get to the console as root. . . > > But, when I ALT-F1 (or 2- 5) the stuff is scrolling by on the screen > and it is impossible to see what you are typing or whatever. . . > > I will get that somehow, though. . . > > Thanks for assistance! > > DS > > > Doug Simpson > Technology Specialist > De Queen Public Schools > De Queen, AR > simpsond at leopards.k12.ar.us > "A Dollar Saved is a Dollar Earned" > > > >>> "Terrell Prud? Jr." 3/5/2009 11:24 AM > >>> > Make thyself root, and give us the output from the following command. > > iptables -L > > That means "iptables, List all the rules, please." > > --TP > > Doug Simpson wrote: > > When I said "iptables" I told you all I know about iptables. . . > > In other words, I have no idea. . . > > > > This is new territory to me. . . > > > > DS > > > > Doug Simpson > > Technology Specialist > > De Queen Public Schools > > De Queen, AR > > simpsond at leopards.k12.ar.us > > "A Dollar Saved is a Dollar Earned" > > > > > > > >>>> Dan Young 3/5/2009 10:44 AM >>> > >>>> > > On Thu, Mar 5, 2009 at 8:38 AM, Doug Simpson > > wrote: > > > >> Iptables is running and that is dumping everything to the console. > >> > > > > Do your iptables rules have a LOG target in them? > > > > -- > > Dan Young > > Multnomah ESD - Technology Services > > 503-257-1562 > > > > _______________________________________________ > > K12OSN mailing list > > K12OSN at redhat.com > > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > > For more info see > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > K12OSN mailing list > > K12OSN at redhat.com > > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > > For more info see > > > > _______________________________________________ > K12OSN mailing list > K12OSN at redhat.com > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > For more info see _______________________________________________ K12OSN mailing list K12OSN at redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn For more info see _______________________________________________ K12OSN mailing list K12OSN at redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn For more info see From dahopkins429 at gmail.com Fri Mar 6 19:43:58 2009 From: dahopkins429 at gmail.com (David Hopkins) Date: Fri, 6 Mar 2009 14:43:58 -0500 Subject: [K12OSN] Where is K12LTSP at? In-Reply-To: References: <8b88203f0902230922x6690c69blf5cd058909e96c62@mail.gmail.com> <49A456C2.6030602@redhat.com> Message-ID: And another update. Clicking on Install to Hard Drive and the installation hangs at "Performing post-installation filesystem changes" I have let it run for 2 hours at this point. Any ideas? If not, I'll download FC10 installation CD/DVD and run the install that way, then add the LTSP stuff, and finally add the K12LTSP packages. Sincerely, Dave Hopkins On Fri, Mar 6, 2009 at 10:09 AM, David Hopkins wrote: > Revisiting this with an update. > > I was able to boot my x86_64 servers via the USB LiveServer but had a > couple of glitches. > > 1) I don't allow DHCP on the switch that the servers share, so I > disabled Network Manager and manually assigned the IP address, subnet > mask, gateway. ?Tested by pinging various systems within the network. > 2) Configured the second ethernet card to serve the clients. Booted a > few different types of hardware and they seem to work. > 3) But ... web browsing did not work. I have to use a proxy and after > setting the proxy setting (either at the console for liveuser or at a > thin client with either liveuser or a test account) I get an error > message that FF is configured to use a proxy and the connection is > being refused. Very strange as I obviously don't have that issue with > the current release. > 4) Sound seemed to work but until I can get FF to proxy correctly, I > can't test the ability to use what-used-to-be UnitedStreaming or other > video/audio repositories. > > And ... any documentation on the new locations of all the config > files? ?This has changed. ?Ideally I will be changing the ltsp > settings back to the 192.168 address range so I don't have to change > all my pre-defined thin clients as well as printers. ?It should be 1 > or 2 files that have to be edited (dhcpd.conf would be one?) > > Thanks! > Dave Hopkins > > > On Tue, Feb 24, 2009 at 3:21 PM, Warren Togami wrote: >> David Hopkins wrote: >>> >>> I am using the Centos5 version on all my servers (6 LTSP servers, 200+ >>> thin clients, 4 other servers at present). I know I am not getting the >>> latest/greatest that LTSP provides but I've also seen people reporting >>> issues and I just haven't had the time to sort out if K12Linux will >>> run on the thin client hardware that I have available. ?In particular, >>> I have a lot of Via EPIA 533-based thin clients that the school >>> purchased. ?These have to work or else I cannot justify the switch. >> >> https://fedorahosted.org/k12linux/wiki/LiveServer >> Tried this? ?K12Linux Live Server media will allow you to try K12Linux in >> demo mode with your existing network of thin clients, without risking the >> hard drive of your server. >> >>> However, ?the only real driving reason for me to upgrade is to >>> finally, once-and-for-all, get sound working properly with support for >>> local microphones as well. ?That is the driving issue for me (and if >> >> Last I heard none of the distributions of LTSP5 have microphones working. >> ?This might be mainly an issue of nobody working on it yet though. >> >> Warren Togami >> wtogami at redhat.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> K12OSN mailing list >> K12OSN at redhat.com >> https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn >> For more info see >> > From dahopkins429 at gmail.com Sat Mar 7 18:55:46 2009 From: dahopkins429 at gmail.com (David Hopkins) Date: Sat, 7 Mar 2009 13:55:46 -0500 Subject: [K12OSN] Where is K12LTSP at? In-Reply-To: References: <8b88203f0902230922x6690c69blf5cd058909e96c62@mail.gmail.com> <49A456C2.6030602@redhat.com> Message-ID: And ... another update. I downloaded the DVD and ran the install. After installation, I get unable to access resume device error mounting dev root on sysroot as ext3 Which apparently seems to be related to mkinitrd being screwed up during an update? My swap has the UUID=LONGSTRINGOFCHARACTERS issue. A bug report for this is https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=471729 I am still waiting to see if a yum update followed by a rebuild using the updated mkinitrd will fix this. So far with all these issues I have spent many many more hours than I had planned and I'm still not even close to sorting out if local apps will even work for me. Seems to be issues there are well according to what I can find on the wiki. I'd be ecstatic if there is a simple description of how to get local apps working (and verified). Sincerely, Dave Hopkins On Fri, Mar 6, 2009 at 2:43 PM, David Hopkins wrote: > And another update. Clicking on Install to Hard Drive and the > installation hangs at "Performing post-installation filesystem > changes" ?I have let it run for 2 hours at this point. ?Any ideas? ?If > not, I'll download FC10 installation CD/DVD and run the install that > way, then add the LTSP stuff, and finally add the K12LTSP packages. > > Sincerely, > Dave Hopkins > > > On Fri, Mar 6, 2009 at 10:09 AM, David Hopkins wrote: >> Revisiting this with an update. >> >> I was able to boot my x86_64 servers via the USB LiveServer but had a >> couple of glitches. >> >> 1) I don't allow DHCP on the switch that the servers share, so I >> disabled Network Manager and manually assigned the IP address, subnet >> mask, gateway. ?Tested by pinging various systems within the network. >> 2) Configured the second ethernet card to serve the clients. Booted a >> few different types of hardware and they seem to work. >> 3) But ... web browsing did not work. I have to use a proxy and after >> setting the proxy setting (either at the console for liveuser or at a >> thin client with either liveuser or a test account) I get an error >> message that FF is configured to use a proxy and the connection is >> being refused. Very strange as I obviously don't have that issue with >> the current release. >> 4) Sound seemed to work but until I can get FF to proxy correctly, I >> can't test the ability to use what-used-to-be UnitedStreaming or other >> video/audio repositories. >> >> And ... any documentation on the new locations of all the config >> files? ?This has changed. ?Ideally I will be changing the ltsp >> settings back to the 192.168 address range so I don't have to change >> all my pre-defined thin clients as well as printers. ?It should be 1 >> or 2 files that have to be edited (dhcpd.conf would be one?) >> >> Thanks! >> Dave Hopkins >> >> >> On Tue, Feb 24, 2009 at 3:21 PM, Warren Togami wrote: >>> David Hopkins wrote: >>>> >>>> I am using the Centos5 version on all my servers (6 LTSP servers, 200+ >>>> thin clients, 4 other servers at present). I know I am not getting the >>>> latest/greatest that LTSP provides but I've also seen people reporting >>>> issues and I just haven't had the time to sort out if K12Linux will >>>> run on the thin client hardware that I have available. ?In particular, >>>> I have a lot of Via EPIA 533-based thin clients that the school >>>> purchased. ?These have to work or else I cannot justify the switch. >>> >>> https://fedorahosted.org/k12linux/wiki/LiveServer >>> Tried this? ?K12Linux Live Server media will allow you to try K12Linux in >>> demo mode with your existing network of thin clients, without risking the >>> hard drive of your server. >>> >>>> However, ?the only real driving reason for me to upgrade is to >>>> finally, once-and-for-all, get sound working properly with support for >>>> local microphones as well. ?That is the driving issue for me (and if >>> >>> Last I heard none of the distributions of LTSP5 have microphones working. >>> ?This might be mainly an issue of nobody working on it yet though. >>> >>> Warren Togami >>> wtogami at redhat.com >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> K12OSN mailing list >>> K12OSN at redhat.com >>> https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn >>> For more info see >>> >> > From moon at smbis.com Sat Mar 7 21:16:37 2009 From: moon at smbis.com (Moon) Date: Sat, 07 Mar 2009 16:16:37 -0500 Subject: [K12OSN] Where is K12LTSP at? In-Reply-To: <1236049168.27861.15.camel@t3002.localdomain> References: <8b88203f0902230922x6690c69blf5cd058909e96c62@mail.gmail.com> <20090223192108.GB26900@aurora.owens.net> <49A42D31.3030603@redhat.com> <1236049168.27861.15.camel@t3002.localdomain> Message-ID: <1236460597.13761.9.camel@t3002.localdomain> Warren, could you let me know what video driver you use for the AMD Geode thin client? Thanks Charlie On Mon, 2009-03-02 at 21:59 -0500, Moon wrote: > Warren, I noticed you stated you have an AMD Geode thin client in your > lab. What video driver are you using/specifying in the lts.conf for > that client? I have a Alix1.D AMD LX800 Geode based thin client that > the video doesn't work too well with K12LTSP or K12Linux, it defaults > to vesa. I would like to get better video performance on both K12LTSP > and K12Linux. It also has a problem with the audio on the K12LTSP due > to no support for the CS5535, there is no snd_cs5535audio driver > available in K12LTSP. > > Thanks > > Charlie > > On Tue, 2009-02-24 at 12:24 -0500, Warren Togami wrote: > > > Rob Owens wrote: > > > If you're looking for something longer life than Fedora / LTSP 5, you > > > could try Debian Lenny or Ubuntu Hardy, both with LTSP 5. Or you > > > could stick with CentOS / LTSP 4.2. I know there's also an OpenSuse > > > implementation of LTSP 5, but I don't know much about that > > > distribution or its life cycle. > > > > http://k12ltsp.org/mediawiki/index.php/Main_Page > > "K12LTSP is considered to be LEGACY software that is usable with old > > hardware until CentOS5 support ends in the year 2014. If you need modern > > LTSP 5.x features or modern client hardware, then you will want to use > > K12Linux.org." > > > > K12LTSP EL5 uses the ancient LTSP-4.2. This is beneficial in that you > > get security updates for the server and desktop applications on the > > server until the year 2014. Ubuntu and Debian releases do not last > > nearly *that* long. > > > > The other benefit of K12LTSP EL5 is it works with more ancient client > > hardware due its ancient version of X and kernel. This is also a > > detriment though... because lots of modern client hardware will not work > > at all. > > > > K12Linux F10 has the benefit of modern LTSP5 features like sound, local > > storage devices, local apps support, and modern X allows modern client > > hardware to work. The drawbacks however are: > > > > * Modern X broke some older client hardware. These are upstream x.org > > bugs. They will only be fixed if people take the time to file the bugs > > upstream instead of just complain about them. I personally don't have > > time nor hardware to work on this. I have a dozen different modern thin > > clients of AMD Geode, VIA, Intel and Radeon chipsets and they all work > > great with K12Linux. > > * It needs more RAM on the client, at least 128MB to be safe. > > * Support ends early 2010. > > > > The support problem isn't too bad. Just use K12Linux F10 until K12Linux > > EL6 (RHEL6 + EPEL6) is out. Then upgrade once into that version which > > will be supported for many years thereafter. > > > > Warren Togami > > wtogami at redhat.com > > > > > > > > Somewhere on the LTSP wiki I think there are instructions for how to > > > use an Ubuntu-based chroot environment on any other distro. There's > > > a guy on the ltsp-discuss list who uses LTSP 5 on CentOS in this way. > > > > _______________________________________________ > > K12OSN mailing list > > K12OSN at redhat.com > > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > > For more info see > > _______________________________________________ > K12OSN mailing list > K12OSN at redhat.com > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > For more info see -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mfpacheco at hotmail.com Sat Mar 7 23:00:36 2009 From: mfpacheco at hotmail.com (Michael Pacheco) Date: Sat, 7 Mar 2009 23:00:36 +0000 Subject: [K12OSN] LTSP 5 and RDESKTOP Message-ID: Hi, I've been searching for a good set of instructions on getting an LDM_AUTOLOGIN user to run a script to autoconnect with rdesktop to a Win2k3 TS box. I've tried: ############# [00:08:02:09:CC:F9] LDM_AUTOLOGIN=true LDM_USERNAME=user1 LDM_PASSWORD=xyz123 LDM_REMOTECMD=/usr/bin/rdesktop -f 10.10.x.x ############# [00:08:02:09:CC:F9] LDM_AUTOLOGIN=true LDM_USERNAME=user1 LDM_PASSWORD=xyz123 LDM_REMOTECMD=/usr/bin/tslogin.sh /--------- tslogin.sh contents #!/bin/bash /usr/bin/rdesktop -f 10.10.x.x I've also looked at the Edubunto screen.d rdesktop scripts - but their RDP_OPTIONS vars are not listed in the lts_parameters.txt so I'm not sure if they will work Should I install rdesktop into the chroot environment and set the users .profile to run rdesktop? I'd like to leave the chroot enviroment alone for LTSP upgrades .. but at this point I'm just not sure. If anyone has an idea .. I'm running the K12LTSP distro (FEDORA 10) straight from the site. Thanks. Mike _________________________________________________________________ Windows Live?: Life without walls. http://windowslive.com/explore?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_allup_1a_explore_032009 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From dahopkins429 at gmail.com Sun Mar 8 01:05:34 2009 From: dahopkins429 at gmail.com (David Hopkins) Date: Sat, 7 Mar 2009 20:05:34 -0500 Subject: [K12OSN] Where is K12LTSP at? In-Reply-To: References: <8b88203f0902230922x6690c69blf5cd058909e96c62@mail.gmail.com> <49A456C2.6030602@redhat.com> Message-ID: Finally, I managed to find the right google search. The issue is a bug in mkinitrd and how it handles i2o controllers. A bug report has been submitted now twice on this issue. I don't know who has the 'pull' to actually get this resolved but the bug is https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=476277 I spent all day trying to resolve this with various options to mkinitrd (even using a version posted here: https://bugzilla.redhat.com/attachment.cgi?id=330620 ) which has the same bug. Seeing as how simple it is to fix this bug (you make two very simple changes as shown below ) I would hope it actually makes it into the next patch of mkinitrd. Anaconda works but mkinitrd fails. >From the prior bug report by Hibbard T. Smith, JR ---------------------------- diff -cr mkinitrd-6.0.71/mkinitrd mkinitrd-6.0.71-patched/mkinitrd *** mkinitrd-6.0.71/mkinitrd 2008-11-12 14:02:43.000000000 -0500 --- mkinitrd-6.0.71-patched/mkinitrd 2008-12-12 13:47:05.000000000 -0500 *************** *** 191,198 **** fi # special cases ! if [ "$modName" = "i2o_block" ]; then ! eval $subcmd i2o_core eval $subcmd -i2o_pci modName="i2o_block" elif [ "$modName" = "ppa" ]; then --- 191,198 ---- fi # special cases ! if [ "$modName" = "i2o_core" ]; then ! eval $subcmd i2o_block eval $subcmd -i2o_pci modName="i2o_block" elif [ "$modName" = "ppa" ]; then ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Sincerely, Dave Hopkins On Sat, Mar 7, 2009 at 1:55 PM, David Hopkins wrote: > And ... another update. ?I downloaded the DVD and ran the install. > After installation, I get > > unable to access resume device > error mounting dev root on sysroot as ext3 > > Which apparently seems to be related to mkinitrd being screwed up > during an update? ?My swap has the UUID=LONGSTRINGOFCHARACTERS issue. > > A bug report for this is https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=471729 > > I am still waiting to see if a yum update followed by a rebuild using > the updated mkinitrd will fix this. > > So far with all these issues I have spent many many more hours than I > had planned and I'm still not even close to sorting out if local apps > will even work for me. ?Seems to be issues there are well according to > what I can find on the wiki. ?I'd be ecstatic if there is a simple > description of how to get local apps working (and verified). > > Sincerely, > Dave Hopkins > > On Fri, Mar 6, 2009 at 2:43 PM, David Hopkins wrote: >> And another update. Clicking on Install to Hard Drive and the >> installation hangs at "Performing post-installation filesystem >> changes" ?I have let it run for 2 hours at this point. ?Any ideas? ?If >> not, I'll download FC10 installation CD/DVD and run the install that >> way, then add the LTSP stuff, and finally add the K12LTSP packages. >> >> Sincerely, >> Dave Hopkins >> >> >> On Fri, Mar 6, 2009 at 10:09 AM, David Hopkins wrote: >>> Revisiting this with an update. >>> >>> I was able to boot my x86_64 servers via the USB LiveServer but had a >>> couple of glitches. >>> >>> 1) I don't allow DHCP on the switch that the servers share, so I >>> disabled Network Manager and manually assigned the IP address, subnet >>> mask, gateway. ?Tested by pinging various systems within the network. >>> 2) Configured the second ethernet card to serve the clients. Booted a >>> few different types of hardware and they seem to work. >>> 3) But ... web browsing did not work. I have to use a proxy and after >>> setting the proxy setting (either at the console for liveuser or at a >>> thin client with either liveuser or a test account) I get an error >>> message that FF is configured to use a proxy and the connection is >>> being refused. Very strange as I obviously don't have that issue with >>> the current release. >>> 4) Sound seemed to work but until I can get FF to proxy correctly, I >>> can't test the ability to use what-used-to-be UnitedStreaming or other >>> video/audio repositories. >>> >>> And ... any documentation on the new locations of all the config >>> files? ?This has changed. ?Ideally I will be changing the ltsp >>> settings back to the 192.168 address range so I don't have to change >>> all my pre-defined thin clients as well as printers. ?It should be 1 >>> or 2 files that have to be edited (dhcpd.conf would be one?) >>> >>> Thanks! >>> Dave Hopkins >>> >>> >>> On Tue, Feb 24, 2009 at 3:21 PM, Warren Togami wrote: >>>> David Hopkins wrote: >>>>> >>>>> I am using the Centos5 version on all my servers (6 LTSP servers, 200+ >>>>> thin clients, 4 other servers at present). I know I am not getting the >>>>> latest/greatest that LTSP provides but I've also seen people reporting >>>>> issues and I just haven't had the time to sort out if K12Linux will >>>>> run on the thin client hardware that I have available. ?In particular, >>>>> I have a lot of Via EPIA 533-based thin clients that the school >>>>> purchased. ?These have to work or else I cannot justify the switch. >>>> >>>> https://fedorahosted.org/k12linux/wiki/LiveServer >>>> Tried this? ?K12Linux Live Server media will allow you to try K12Linux in >>>> demo mode with your existing network of thin clients, without risking the >>>> hard drive of your server. >>>> >>>>> However, ?the only real driving reason for me to upgrade is to >>>>> finally, once-and-for-all, get sound working properly with support for >>>>> local microphones as well. ?That is the driving issue for me (and if >>>> >>>> Last I heard none of the distributions of LTSP5 have microphones working. >>>> ?This might be mainly an issue of nobody working on it yet though. >>>> >>>> Warren Togami >>>> wtogami at redhat.com >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> K12OSN mailing list >>>> K12OSN at redhat.com >>>> https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn >>>> For more info see >>>> >>> >> > From dtrask at vcsvikings.org Sun Mar 8 06:45:55 2009 From: dtrask at vcsvikings.org (David Trask) Date: Sun, 08 Mar 2009 01:45:55 -0500 Subject: [K12OSN] New FOSSed web site is LIVE! FOSSed 2009 register today! Message-ID: (this email is open source...feel free to spread it far and WIDE...help us get the word out!) Hi all! The new FOSSed web site is LIVE at http://www.fossed.com FOSSed 2009 is shaping up to be the best ever! Lots of new topics, sessions, and presenters! As the world of technology changes...so do we! One important thing hasn't changed though...the price. Thanks to the fine folks at Gould Academy, we've been able to keep the price of the conference low again this year. Yup! That's right! Just $495 includes EVERYTHING! The conference, your room, your meals, and even the banquet! ($455 for off-campus participants) You'll get a chance to immerse yourself in the experience that is FOSSed. Come, join us this year! Learn all about Open Source and Web 2.0 technologies and how they can translate into better learning for your students as well as substantial money savings for your schools! Register today at http://www.fossed.com Lot's of great information, pictures, the 2009 FOSSed flyer, and so much more on the site! We really hope to see you this year at FOSSed David Trask FOSSed 2009 copperdoggy at gmail.com http://www.fossed.com David N. Trask Technology Teacher/Director Vassalboro Community School dtrask at vcsvikings.org (207)923-3100 From brcisna at eazylivin.net Sun Mar 8 13:05:09 2009 From: brcisna at eazylivin.net (Barry R Cisna) Date: Sun, 08 Mar 2009 08:05:09 -0500 Subject: [K12OSN] LTSP 5 and RDESKTOP Message-ID: <1236517509.29686.7.camel@localhost.localdomain> Hi Michael, It is a little unclear as to what you are wanting to do with Rdesktop? Are you wanting for a particular user *only* to log into your Win'03TS at any given TC? I assume you still want the majority of the TC's to log into the actual K12LTSP server,and only a select few users to the Win'03TS? Why not just enable the rdesktop screen in lts.conf and each user can choose what server by simply CTL-ALT-F1,or F2 ,or F3. With about 2 minutes of instructions,by you to the whole group, on how to do this you are home free! They will still have to enter their username/password manually for the Win'03TS of course. They can surely manage to do that without to much fuss I would think,,:-). Barry Cisna From brcisna at eazylivin.net Sun Mar 8 13:30:12 2009 From: brcisna at eazylivin.net (Barry R Cisna) Date: Sun, 08 Mar 2009 08:30:12 -0500 Subject: [K12OSN] K12LTSP/K12Linux 'crusaders' Message-ID: <1236519012.29686.31.camel@localhost.localdomain> Hello List, Background: Been using k12ltsp since the first version K12ltsp here. Has anyone else on list thought the same as me in that, " I wonder if k12ltsp/k12linux would be more accepted in schools if someone was out promoting the merits k12ltsp/k12linux"? I know something like this would be hard to organize with everyone doing stuff like this "out of the goodness of their heart". Just like everything else if there is no money involved no one is much interested. I see firsthand how schools just for the most part are a "monkey see, monkey do" type of atmosphere. If school A that neighbors school B buys all macs one year,the next year school B thinks they should be having macs. Also as I have stated many a time. The first thing that comes out of the mouths of the higher ups when stating that k12ltsp is free is" If it is free it can not be very good quality",,,or " How much longer will it be free". I know a few years ago Steve Hargedon was traveling around 'on his own' giving talks in regards to the advantages of k12lltsp,and haven't seen him on the list here for quite some time. I went to one of Steve's presentations when He was here in out part of the country, as a matter of fact and am guessing at that time, there were about 30 people that showed up that evening. Just wondered,if a good sharp 2 hour presentation by someone or a group of a few k12ltsp/k12linux crusaders would be of any benefit? This may be borderline of making k12ltsp/k12linux seem 'commercialized',though too? I DO know one thing with the situation that is REALLY coming on in regards to budgets for schools across the board I would think some of the money hander outers would be more apt to start focusing on something that has potential for money saved. The only downside I would see to all of this,is that many a "network guy/gal" would be out of a job in time,,:-) Just fire up K12ltsp/k12linux server at the start of school year ,add users, and let er go! Just a thought. Easier said than done, I know. Barry Cisna From dahopkins429 at gmail.com Sun Mar 8 15:21:12 2009 From: dahopkins429 at gmail.com (David Hopkins) Date: Sun, 8 Mar 2009 11:21:12 -0400 Subject: [K12OSN] k12linux login issues Message-ID: I have followed the instructions here: https://fedorahosted.org/k12linux/wiki/InstallGuide I now can boot my test thin client and I get a login screen. However, I can't log in with any accounts. I get Verifying Password and then that fails and ldm (?) resets the screen. I can log in with these accounts at the console. Any ideas about what I need to change get this working? And, when this works, my next challenge is to figure out how local apps work so that I can get FF with flash and video working properly (which is the entire reason for this upgrade). Sincerely, Dave Hopkins From rowens at ptd.net Sun Mar 8 17:55:48 2009 From: rowens at ptd.net (Rob Owens) Date: Sun, 8 Mar 2009 13:55:48 -0400 Subject: [K12OSN] k12linux login issues In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20090308175548.GA8497@aurora.owens.net> On Sun, Mar 08, 2009 at 11:21:12AM -0400, David Hopkins wrote: > I have followed the instructions here: > https://fedorahosted.org/k12linux/wiki/InstallGuide > > I now can boot my test thin client and I get a login screen. However, > I can't log in with any accounts. I get Verifying Password and then > that fails and ldm (?) resets the screen. I can log in with these > accounts at the console. Any ideas about what I need to change get > this working? > > And, when this works, my next challenge is to figure out how local > apps work so that I can get FF with flash and video working properly > (which is the entire reason for this upgrade). > This thread might be slightly outdated, but maybe it'll help when you get to local apps: http://www.mail-archive.com/ltsp-discuss at lists.sourceforge.net/msg35357.html -Rob From dahopkins429 at gmail.com Sun Mar 8 18:40:07 2009 From: dahopkins429 at gmail.com (David Hopkins) Date: Sun, 8 Mar 2009 14:40:07 -0400 Subject: [K12OSN] k12linux login issues In-Reply-To: <20090308175548.GA8497@aurora.owens.net> References: <20090308175548.GA8497@aurora.owens.net> Message-ID: I got the answer on the ltsp irc channel. I had to rerun ltsp-update-sshkeys. Logins now work, sound in FF works, flash is working, so at least it is a step in the right direction. I'm installing FF now (and then have to install flash, totem and ??? On Sun, Mar 8, 2009 at 1:55 PM, Rob Owens wrote: > On Sun, Mar 08, 2009 at 11:21:12AM -0400, David Hopkins wrote: >> I have followed the instructions here: >> https://fedorahosted.org/k12linux/wiki/InstallGuide >> >> I now can boot my test thin client and I get a login screen. However, >> I can't log in with any accounts. ?I get Verifying Password and then >> that fails and ldm (?) resets the screen. ?I can log in with these >> accounts at the console. ?Any ideas about what I need to change get >> this working? >> >> And, when this works, my next challenge is to figure out how local >> apps work so that I can get FF with flash and video working properly >> (which is the entire reason for this upgrade). >> > This thread might be slightly outdated, but maybe it'll help when you get > to local apps: > http://www.mail-archive.com/ltsp-discuss at lists.sourceforge.net/msg35357.html > > -Rob > > _______________________________________________ > K12OSN mailing list > K12OSN at redhat.com > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > For more info see > From dahopkins429 at gmail.com Sun Mar 8 19:22:07 2009 From: dahopkins429 at gmail.com (David Hopkins) Date: Sun, 8 Mar 2009 15:22:07 -0400 Subject: [K12OSN] k12linux login issues In-Reply-To: References: <20090308175548.GA8497@aurora.owens.net> Message-ID: Ok, so next thing to sort out ... why doesn't DNS from the thin client work? I can launch and xterm. Then, nslookup shows that the correct DNS server is set, but it can't be contacted. I have iptables and ip6tables turned off. Do I need transparent proxy (squidor something like that) enabled? Or is there another way to get the DNS requests forwarded without making the LTSP server a caching naming server? Sincerely, Dave Hopkins On Sun, Mar 8, 2009 at 2:40 PM, David Hopkins wrote: > I got the answer on the ltsp irc channel. ?I had to rerun > ltsp-update-sshkeys. ?Logins now work, sound in FF works, flash is > working, so at least it is a step in the right direction. ?I'm > installing FF now (and then have to install flash, totem and ??? > > On Sun, Mar 8, 2009 at 1:55 PM, Rob Owens wrote: >> On Sun, Mar 08, 2009 at 11:21:12AM -0400, David Hopkins wrote: >>> I have followed the instructions here: >>> https://fedorahosted.org/k12linux/wiki/InstallGuide >>> >>> I now can boot my test thin client and I get a login screen. However, >>> I can't log in with any accounts. ?I get Verifying Password and then >>> that fails and ldm (?) resets the screen. ?I can log in with these >>> accounts at the console. ?Any ideas about what I need to change get >>> this working? >>> >>> And, when this works, my next challenge is to figure out how local >>> apps work so that I can get FF with flash and video working properly >>> (which is the entire reason for this upgrade). >>> >> This thread might be slightly outdated, but maybe it'll help when you get >> to local apps: >> http://www.mail-archive.com/ltsp-discuss at lists.sourceforge.net/msg35357.html >> >> -Rob >> >> _______________________________________________ >> K12OSN mailing list >> K12OSN at redhat.com >> https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn >> For more info see >> > From dahopkins429 at gmail.com Sun Mar 8 21:58:38 2009 From: dahopkins429 at gmail.com (David Hopkins) Date: Sun, 8 Mar 2009 17:58:38 -0400 Subject: [K12OSN] k12linux login issues In-Reply-To: References: <20090308175548.GA8497@aurora.owens.net> Message-ID: The solution is iptables which I had turned off for testing ... adding them back and enabling masquerading and now it works. There are still a couple of things that are not quite right though with FF, Totem, Java, Flash as a local app though. The most annoying is an error message everytime I launch FF as the local app. It is apparently related dbus_launch and orbit files? I am not sure how to get around that though. It started after I added Totem as the media player (done so that I'd have the same media player as FC10 uses by default). But this is working much better even though it isn't exactly a turn-key operation. Thanks for the excellent work! Sincerely, Dave Hopkins On Sun, Mar 8, 2009 at 3:22 PM, David Hopkins wrote: > Ok, so next thing to sort out ... why doesn't DNS from the thin client > work? ?I can launch and xterm. Then, nslookup shows that the correct > DNS server is set, but it can't be contacted. I have iptables and > ip6tables turned off. ?Do I need transparent proxy (squidor something > like that) enabled? ?Or is there another way to get the DNS requests > forwarded without making the LTSP server a caching naming server? > > Sincerely, > Dave Hopkins > > > > On Sun, Mar 8, 2009 at 2:40 PM, David Hopkins wrote: >> I got the answer on the ltsp irc channel. ?I had to rerun >> ltsp-update-sshkeys. ?Logins now work, sound in FF works, flash is >> working, so at least it is a step in the right direction. ?I'm >> installing FF now (and then have to install flash, totem and ??? >> >> On Sun, Mar 8, 2009 at 1:55 PM, Rob Owens wrote: >>> On Sun, Mar 08, 2009 at 11:21:12AM -0400, David Hopkins wrote: >>>> I have followed the instructions here: >>>> https://fedorahosted.org/k12linux/wiki/InstallGuide >>>> >>>> I now can boot my test thin client and I get a login screen. However, >>>> I can't log in with any accounts. ?I get Verifying Password and then >>>> that fails and ldm (?) resets the screen. ?I can log in with these >>>> accounts at the console. ?Any ideas about what I need to change get >>>> this working? >>>> >>>> And, when this works, my next challenge is to figure out how local >>>> apps work so that I can get FF with flash and video working properly >>>> (which is the entire reason for this upgrade). >>>> >>> This thread might be slightly outdated, but maybe it'll help when you get >>> to local apps: >>> http://www.mail-archive.com/ltsp-discuss at lists.sourceforge.net/msg35357.html >>> >>> -Rob >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> K12OSN mailing list >>> K12OSN at redhat.com >>> https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn >>> For more info see >>> >> > From wtogami at redhat.com Mon Mar 9 07:48:05 2009 From: wtogami at redhat.com (Warren Togami) Date: Mon, 09 Mar 2009 03:48:05 -0400 Subject: [K12OSN] k12linux login issues In-Reply-To: References: <20090308175548.GA8497@aurora.owens.net> Message-ID: <49B4C9B5.1060402@redhat.com> David Hopkins wrote: > The solution is iptables which I had turned off for testing ... adding > them back and enabling masquerading and now it works. Could you please note this somewhere on the k12linux.org wiki? > > There are still a couple of things that are not quite right though > with FF, Totem, Java, Flash as a local app though. The most annoying > is an error message everytime I launch FF as the local app. It is > apparently related dbus_launch and orbit files? I am not sure how to > get around that though. It started after I added Totem as the media > player (done so that I'd have the same media player as FC10 uses by > default). Firefox lacks one of the needed dependencies to have it stop complaining about dbus. You need to manually install one of the dbus packages... it might be dbus-glib, but I don't recall exactly. > > But this is working much better even though it isn't exactly a > turn-key operation. Thanks for the excellent work! It sounds like most of your problems are due to the i2o problem. The developers have long been under the impression that "nobody uses i2o" thus it hasn't been a priority. I fixed i2o several years ago, but I haven't had hardware to test it for 4 years now. It is a rare controller, but it is disappointing that the developers failed to look at this submitted patch for several months. To be fair however, the bug was not properly marked as [PATCH]. I wrote to the mkinitrd maintainer to ask that this be fixed for F11 Beta and F10 updates. Warren Togami wtogami at redhat.com From khaipi at gmail.com Tue Mar 10 23:48:30 2009 From: khaipi at gmail.com (khaipi) Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2009 00:48:30 +0100 Subject: [K12OSN] compatible with MicroClient TC ? Message-ID: <5a9e4f6f0903101648t2fe79133l383703157a7ec4a4@mail.gmail.com> Dear All, I would like to ask our K12 Linux is compatible with MicroClient TC ? The MicroClient TC is a small, energy efficient, and inexpensive computer ideal to be used as a thin client. The MicroClient TC uses a 300 Mhz VIA VT8500 RISC CPU. The MicroClient TC is a complete solution that includes 256MB to 512MB on board DDR2-400 RAM. It also includes 1GB to 4GB solid state storage. http://www.norhtec.com/products/mctc/index.html regards, Thomas -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From sbarar at gmail.com Wed Mar 11 15:02:55 2009 From: sbarar at gmail.com (Sudev Barar) Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2009 20:32:55 +0530 Subject: [K12OSN] compatible with MicroClient TC ? In-Reply-To: <5a9e4f6f0903101648t2fe79133l383703157a7ec4a4@mail.gmail.com> References: <5a9e4f6f0903101648t2fe79133l383703157a7ec4a4@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <774593a20903110802v63d5c3b1oc50e1350bf6dff8@mail.gmail.com> 2009/3/11 khaipi : > The MicroClient TC is a small, energy efficient, and inexpensive computer > ideal to be used as a thin client. The MicroClient TC uses a 300 Mhz VIA > VT8500 RISC CPU. The MicroClient TC is a complete solution that includes > 256MB to 512MB on board DDR2-400 RAM. It also includes 1GB to 4GB solid > state storage. I have about 30 devices in our networks, Works okay with k12 but you need to load with light weight manager like IceWM (like we do) or similar. The response is a bit slow, especially if there are three four program running concurrently. And USB 1 only is supported. The next level device works perfectly but is more costly. -- Regards, Sudev Barar Read http://blog.sudev.in for topics ranging from here to there. PS: I know most of people do not follow email niceties (mostly they are not aware) but if you follow bottom post/in-line post style of email conversations it becomes a whole lot easier to carry on meaningful dialogue and you can snip out what is not meaningful too. Most people just hit reply button and top post leaving prior message appended uselessly at bottom. See if you can adopt this style and persuade others. In case you are already doing this ..... great, spread the message. From brcisna at eazylivin.net Wed Mar 11 20:44:01 2009 From: brcisna at eazylivin.net (Barry R Cisna) Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2009 15:44:01 -0500 Subject: [K12OSN] compatible with MicroClient TC ? Message-ID: <1236804241.29716.3.camel@localhost.localdomain> Khaipi, The MicroClient will work AOK,without a hitch. The ZERO sound /noise will spoil you very quick!. Some think these are a bit slow. I wouldn't ever trade off the being a tad slow,zero moving parts,,for all the fan noise other units produce. Let us know how things go.Most school enviornments kids will never bog these down, at all. Take Care, Barry Cisna From willems.leo at googlemail.com Fri Mar 13 01:45:50 2009 From: willems.leo at googlemail.com (Leo Willems) Date: Fri, 13 Mar 2009 09:45:50 +0800 Subject: [K12OSN] How to get ThinClient LAN finding DHCP and booting? Message-ID: <3fabbdc20903121845o3d861bd2r5ecbc132a84bbfe1@mail.gmail.com> Dear friends, I recently installed a K12LINUX F10 server with two NICs (eth0 and eth1). eth0 is connected to the LAN and the K12 server get a IP via DHCP and is online. eth1 is connected to the ThinClient LAN, separate network switch. The ThinClients can not find a DHCP server and don't boot. How to make sure the DHCP is running on the K12 server on eth1? And make sure the ThinClient are booting from the server? There is a 'virtual' NIC ltspbr0. What is it for? Thanks Leo From dahopkins429 at gmail.com Fri Mar 13 02:26:11 2009 From: dahopkins429 at gmail.com (David Hopkins) Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2009 22:26:11 -0400 Subject: [K12OSN] How to get ThinClient LAN finding DHCP and booting? In-Reply-To: <3fabbdc20903121845o3d861bd2r5ecbc132a84bbfe1@mail.gmail.com> References: <3fabbdc20903121845o3d861bd2r5ecbc132a84bbfe1@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: ltspbr0 is the new way that the interface is set up. eth1 needs to be slaved to ltspbr0. See: https://fedorahosted.org/k12linux/wiki/NetworkSetup for A Permanent Network Setup. Sincerely, Dave Hopkins On Thu, Mar 12, 2009 at 9:45 PM, Leo Willems wrote: > Dear friends, > > I recently installed a K12LINUX F10 server with two NICs (eth0 and > eth1). eth0 is connected to the LAN and the K12 server get a IP via > DHCP and is online. eth1 is connected to the ThinClient LAN, ?separate > network switch. > > The ThinClients can not find a DHCP server and don't boot. How to make > sure the DHCP is running on the K12 server on eth1? And make sure the > ThinClient are booting from the server? > > There is a 'virtual' NIC ltspbr0. What is it for? > > Thanks > Leo > > _______________________________________________ > K12OSN mailing list > K12OSN at redhat.com > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > For more info see > From willems.leo at googlemail.com Fri Mar 13 06:45:55 2009 From: willems.leo at googlemail.com (Leo Willems) Date: Fri, 13 Mar 2009 14:45:55 +0800 Subject: [K12OSN] How to get ThinClient LAN finding DHCP and booting? In-Reply-To: References: <3fabbdc20903121845o3d861bd2r5ecbc132a84bbfe1@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <3fabbdc20903122345p1f5fb5f3i181eab113c833d65@mail.gmail.com> Thanks for the fast reply. A Permanent Network Setup 1. open /etc/sysconfig/network-scripts/ifcfg-ethN where the "N" in ethN 2. add BRIDGE=ltspbr0, and make sure that NM_CONTROLLED=no and ONBOOT=yes 3. restart the service network and NetworkManager, either from System -> Administration -> Services in the GUI, or by running service network restart and service NetworkManager restart in the terminal as the root user /etc/sysconfig/network-scripts/ ifcfg-lo ifdown-isdn ifup-aliases ifup-plip ifup-wireless ifcfg-ltspbr0 ifdown-post ifup-bnep ifup-plusb init.ipv6-global ifdown ifdown-ppp ifup-eth ifup-post net.hotplug ifdown-bnep ifdown-routes ifup-ippp ifup-ppp network-functions ifdown-eth ifdown-sit ifup-ipsec ifup-routes network-functions-ipv6 ifdown-ippp ifdown-sl ifup-ipv6 ifup-sit ifdown-ipsec ifdown-tunnel ifup-ipx ifup-sl ifdown-ipv6 ifup ifup-isdn ifup-tunnel I can not find any ifcfg-eth1 here. What to do? On Fri, Mar 13, 2009 at 10:26 AM, David Hopkins wrote: > ltspbr0 is the new way that the interface is set up. ?eth1 needs to be > slaved to ltspbr0. ?See: > https://fedorahosted.org/k12linux/wiki/NetworkSetup ?for A Permanent > Network Setup. > > Sincerely, > Dave Hopkins > > > On Thu, Mar 12, 2009 at 9:45 PM, Leo Willems wrote: >> Dear friends, >> >> I recently installed a K12LINUX F10 server with two NICs (eth0 and >> eth1). eth0 is connected to the LAN and the K12 server get a IP via >> DHCP and is online. eth1 is connected to the ThinClient LAN, ?separate >> network switch. >> >> The ThinClients can not find a DHCP server and don't boot. How to make >> sure the DHCP is running on the K12 server on eth1? And make sure the >> ThinClient are booting from the server? >> >> There is a 'virtual' NIC ltspbr0. What is it for? >> >> Thanks >> Leo From warren at togami.com Fri Mar 13 08:38:47 2009 From: warren at togami.com (Warren Togami) Date: Fri, 13 Mar 2009 04:38:47 -0400 Subject: [K12OSN] How to get ThinClient LAN finding DHCP and booting? In-Reply-To: <3fabbdc20903122345p1f5fb5f3i181eab113c833d65@mail.gmail.com> References: <3fabbdc20903121845o3d861bd2r5ecbc132a84bbfe1@mail.gmail.com> <3fabbdc20903122345p1f5fb5f3i181eab113c833d65@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <49BA1B97.1040604@togami.com> Leo Willems wrote: > Thanks for the fast reply. > > A Permanent Network Setup > > 1. open /etc/sysconfig/network-scripts/ifcfg-ethN where the "N" in ethN > 2. add BRIDGE=ltspbr0, and make sure that NM_CONTROLLED=no and ONBOOT=yes > 3. restart the service network and NetworkManager, either from System > -> Administration -> Services in the GUI, or by running service > network restart and service NetworkManager restart in the terminal as > the root user > > > /etc/sysconfig/network-scripts/ > ifcfg-lo ifdown-isdn ifup-aliases ifup-plip ifup-wireless > ifcfg-ltspbr0 ifdown-post ifup-bnep ifup-plusb init.ipv6-global > ifdown ifdown-ppp ifup-eth ifup-post net.hotplug ifdown-bnep > ifdown-routes ifup-ippp ifup-ppp network-functions ifdown-eth > ifdown-sit ifup-ipsec ifup-routes network-functions-ipv6 ifdown-ippp > ifdown-sl ifup-ipv6 ifup-sit ifdown-ipsec ifdown-tunnel ifup-ipx > ifup-sl ifdown-ipv6 ifup ifup-isdn ifup-tunnel > > > I can not find any ifcfg-eth1 here. > > What to do? http://alt.fedoraproject.org/pub/alt/ltsp/k12linux-live-docs/k12linux-quick-start-guide.html There are several ways to do this, but do steps 1 through 15. Note that you need to modify the instructions slightly because your device is named differently. Warren From whitetr6 at gmail.com Fri Mar 13 14:56:45 2009 From: whitetr6 at gmail.com (Mark Creamer) Date: Fri, 13 Mar 2009 10:56:45 -0400 Subject: [K12OSN] Spanish language educational software Message-ID: <1f81f7e00903130756tb2d7e43xdb1934586452b0f6@mail.gmail.com> I am working on a project to deploy a LTSP server and some thin clients in a Spanish language (Latin American) school. I'd like to see if anyone can direct me to Spanish language software titles that will work well in this environment, for children in the K-4 range. The children and most of the teachers speak Spanish only. Thanks for any direction you can provide. -- Mark -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From asmo.koskinen at arkki.info Fri Mar 13 15:21:16 2009 From: asmo.koskinen at arkki.info (Asmo Koskinen) Date: Fri, 13 Mar 2009 17:21:16 +0200 Subject: [K12OSN] Spanish language educational software In-Reply-To: <1f81f7e00903130756tb2d7e43xdb1934586452b0f6@mail.gmail.com> References: <1f81f7e00903130756tb2d7e43xdb1934586452b0f6@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <49BA79EC.70907@arkki.info> Mark Creamer kirjoitti: > The children and most of the teachers speak Spanish only. Thanks for any direction you can > provide. http://www.linex.org/joomlaex/ Best Regards Asmo Koskinen. From ahodson at elp.rr.com Sat Mar 14 00:34:57 2009 From: ahodson at elp.rr.com (ahodson at elp.rr.com) Date: Sat, 14 Mar 2009 0:34:57 +0000 Subject: [K12OSN] Spanish language educational software In-Reply-To: <49BA79EC.70907@arkki.info> Message-ID: <20090314003502.502AE.291526.root@hrndva-web24-z01> In addition to the Linux Extremadura (from Spain) many users also use the Spanish version of the Brazilian Poseidon Linux (http://www.es.poseidonlinux.org/) - As you may be able to guess by the name, it is popular with scientists, especially oceanographers, but it has a number of the expected apps such as Open Office, etc. cheers Alan Hodson MEd http://links.episd.org/ El Paso, TX -=o=- ---- Asmo Koskinen wrote: > Mark Creamer kirjoitti: > > > The children and most of the teachers speak Spanish only. Thanks for any direction you can > > provide. > > http://www.linex.org/joomlaex/ > > Best Regards Asmo Koskinen. > > _______________________________________________ > K12OSN mailing list > K12OSN at redhat.com > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > For more info see From khaipi at gmail.com Sat Mar 14 15:08:21 2009 From: khaipi at gmail.com (khaipi) Date: Sat, 14 Mar 2009 16:08:21 +0100 Subject: [K12OSN] compatible with MicroClient TC ? In-Reply-To: <1236804241.29716.3.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <1236804241.29716.3.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <5a9e4f6f0903140808u6c879122o3217bfca9605dcc@mail.gmail.com> Sudev Barar and Barry Cisna, Thankyou very much. Do you know any other Low Power ( under 10 watt) cheap PC or Terminal PC for school.? regards, Thomas On Wed, Mar 11, 2009 at 9:44 PM, Barry R Cisna wrote: > Khaipi, > > The MicroClient will work AOK,without a hitch. The ZERO sound /noise > will spoil you very quick!. Some think these are a bit slow. I wouldn't > ever trade off the being a tad slow,zero moving parts,,for all the fan > noise other units produce. Let us know how things go.Most school > enviornments kids will never bog these down, at all. > > Take Care, > Barry Cisna > > > _______________________________________________ > K12OSN mailing list > K12OSN at redhat.com > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > For more info see > From mizak at worldnet.att.net Sat Mar 14 19:32:35 2009 From: mizak at worldnet.att.net (Michael J. Izak) Date: Sat, 14 Mar 2009 12:32:35 -0700 Subject: [K12OSN] Installing LTSP 5 over Fedora 10 Message-ID: <49BC0653.7010609@worldnet.att.net> Hello everybody. I have Fedora 10 installed on my PC. I wish to install LTSP 5 over it. I do not want Fedora 10 Live installed because it does not allow me to use Thunderbird. The LTSP page telling me "how" to install LTSP on Fedora 10 has instructions that are not very clear to me and instead tells me to use Live instead. I don't know my way around Linux that well so I consider myself a beginner. Is there instructions how to modify F10 to work with LTSP 5? Thank you From dahopkins429 at gmail.com Sat Mar 14 19:39:59 2009 From: dahopkins429 at gmail.com (David Hopkins) Date: Sat, 14 Mar 2009 15:39:59 -0400 Subject: [K12OSN] Installing LTSP 5 over Fedora 10 In-Reply-To: <49BC0653.7010609@worldnet.att.net> References: <49BC0653.7010609@worldnet.att.net> Message-ID: On Sat, Mar 14, 2009 at 3:32 PM, Michael J. Izak wrote: > Hello everybody. > > I have Fedora 10 installed on my PC. I wish to install LTSP 5 over it. ? I > do not want Fedora 10 Live installed because it does not allow me to use > Thunderbird. ? The LTSP page telling me "how" to install LTSP on Fedora 10 > has instructions that are not very clear to me and instead tells me to use > Live instead. > I don't know my way around Linux that well so I consider myself a beginner. > ?Is there instructions how to modify F10 to work with LTSP 5? > Thank you Try starting here: https://fedorahosted.org/k12linux/wiki/InstallGuide It does work but I'm certain there will be a couple of spots that just aren't clear. Alternatively, couldn't you install the live version and then use yum install thunderbird to install thunderbird? From burke at thealmquists.net Sat Mar 14 19:43:02 2009 From: burke at thealmquists.net (Almquist Burke) Date: Sat, 14 Mar 2009 14:43:02 -0500 Subject: [K12OSN] Installing LTSP 5 over Fedora 10 In-Reply-To: <49BC0653.7010609@worldnet.att.net> References: <49BC0653.7010609@worldnet.att.net> Message-ID: <3E159578-E3BA-448C-B5CB-57FC60B70E2F@thealmquists.net> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On Mar 14, 2009, at 2:32 PM, Michael J. Izak wrote: > Hello everybody. > > I have Fedora 10 installed on my PC. I wish to install LTSP 5 over > it. I do not want Fedora 10 Live installed because it does not > allow me to use Thunderbird. The LTSP page telling me "how" to > install LTSP on Fedora 10 has instructions that are not very clear > to me and instead tells me to use Live instead. > I don't know my way around Linux that well so I consider myself a > beginner. Is there instructions how to modify F10 to work with > LTSP 5? > Thank you > Is this what you were looking at https://fedorahosted.org/k12linux/ wiki/InstallGuide -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.7 (Darwin) iEYEARECAAYFAkm8CMYACgkQxWV7OPa/g5FCAgCfSLKJC7Eo/Xm8TcfQ7vzxNP7G eDkAn224UCekSm+uvU8zcWpoMuAVRx00 =D1BC -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From rowens at ptd.net Sat Mar 14 19:55:49 2009 From: rowens at ptd.net (Rob Owens) Date: Sat, 14 Mar 2009 15:55:49 -0400 Subject: [K12OSN] Installing LTSP 5 over Fedora 10 In-Reply-To: <49BC0653.7010609@worldnet.att.net> References: <49BC0653.7010609@worldnet.att.net> Message-ID: <20090314195549.GA25488@aurora.owens.net> On Sat, Mar 14, 2009 at 12:32:35PM -0700, Michael J. Izak wrote: > Hello everybody. > > I have Fedora 10 installed on my PC. I wish to install LTSP 5 over it. > I do not want Fedora 10 Live installed because it does not allow me to > use Thunderbird. The LTSP page telling me "how" to install LTSP on > Fedora 10 has instructions that are not very clear to me and instead > tells me to use Live instead. > > I don't know my way around Linux that well so I consider myself a > beginner. Is there instructions how to modify F10 to work with LTSP 5? > > Thank you > If you don't know Linux too well, you might consider using K12LTSP. It's very easy to set up, even for people who've never used Linux before. The downside is it uses older LTSP technology (LTSP 4.2), and it's a complete distribution so it would replace your Fedora 10 install. K12LTSP 5 EL is based on CentOS 5. http://k12ltsp.org/mediawiki/index.php/DownLoad -Rob From mizak at worldnet.att.net Sat Mar 14 20:42:21 2009 From: mizak at worldnet.att.net (Michael J. Izak) Date: Sat, 14 Mar 2009 13:42:21 -0700 Subject: [K12OSN] Installing LTSP 5 over Fedora 10 In-Reply-To: References: <49BC0653.7010609@worldnet.att.net> Message-ID: <49BC16AD.1070805@worldnet.att.net> This is exactly the page I was talking about that was not very clear. I started out with Fedora 6 LTSP version two or three years ago and it worked very well. It had thunderbird and firefox in it. Now the centos version don't have thunderbird. I need thunderbird. I guess nobody thought of maintaining continuity with the software carried from Fedora 6 to the Centos when they were building the Centos version. That's why after reading the LTSP wiki page it seemed all I needed was Fedora 10 install DVD because the LTSP software is already intergrated into the Fedora 10. Now it seems LTSP is not part of F10 because I can't find any LTSP packages when during the pre-install phase of F10. I thought I was hearing for some years LTSP was gonna be part of F8, then F9, and F10? Myth? I can't do a yum install on the live version. I get back errors which I don't understand which I gave up. MJI David Hopkins wrote: > On Sat, Mar 14, 2009 at 3:32 PM, Michael J. Izak wrote: > >> Hello everybody. >> >> I have Fedora 10 installed on my PC. I wish to install LTSP 5 over it. I >> do not want Fedora 10 Live installed because it does not allow me to use >> Thunderbird. The LTSP page telling me "how" to install LTSP on Fedora 10 >> has instructions that are not very clear to me and instead tells me to use >> Live instead. >> I don't know my way around Linux that well so I consider myself a beginner. >> Is there instructions how to modify F10 to work with LTSP 5? >> Thank you >> > > Try starting here: https://fedorahosted.org/k12linux/wiki/InstallGuide > > It does work but I'm certain there will be a couple of spots that just > aren't clear. > > Alternatively, couldn't you install the live version and then use > > yum install thunderbird > > to install thunderbird? > > _______________________________________________ > K12OSN mailing list > K12OSN at redhat.com > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > For more info see > > From dahopkins429 at gmail.com Sat Mar 14 22:08:42 2009 From: dahopkins429 at gmail.com (David Hopkins) Date: Sat, 14 Mar 2009 15:08:42 -0700 Subject: [K12OSN] OT: multimedia and proxy hosts Message-ID: I finally got all the apps added on FC10 + LTSP5 to allow playing videos at the NASA site: http://www.nasa.gov/home/index.htm To do this, I installed mplayer and gecko-multimedia as local apps via yum. I also installed the MS codecs and such as well. To get rid of the dbus error for FF, I installed dbus-x11. Doing all of this gave me the capabilities that I needed to justify a test at the school. But after bringing the system to the school, I find that multimedia has stopped working for a few reasons. 1) NetworkManager: I have had to remove NetworkManager so that none of the interfaces are controlled by it. It is just simpler to specify the fixed IP address for my server for eth0. 2) iptables? I still have to use iptables -t nat -A POSTROUTING -o eth0 -j MASQUERADE every time I start the server. 3) /opt/ltsp/i386//etc/resolv.conf was not set correctly. It was using the DNS settings from my home and not the settings for the school. I just copied the servers /etc/resolv.conf over and it is fixed (it seems) 4) speed ... it is much slower at the school than at home. Could be the thin clients (Optiplex GX50) but everything launches slower than at home where I was using a 100Mb switch. I have fixed all of these. BUT ... 5) Running FF as a local app works except that when I go to the NASA site and try to play a video that uses mms (say the Kepler video), all it says is "CONNECTING" ... it never connects. This works perfectly from home. My only guess on why is that it is somehow related to the fact I have to use a proxy (the state has the entire education network behind a proxy). SO .... how do I tell the plugin to use a proxy? Videos on cnn work,but they launch in the browser. The NASA site brings up a new window for the video and I am just guessing that the proxy isn't set correctly for it. Once I get this fixed, I'll gladly write it all up. Especially as I don't want to have to re-invent it again. Sincerely, Dave Hopkins From burke at thealmquists.net Sat Mar 14 23:10:34 2009 From: burke at thealmquists.net (Almquist Burke) Date: Sat, 14 Mar 2009 18:10:34 -0500 Subject: [K12OSN] Installing LTSP 5 over Fedora 10 In-Reply-To: <49BC16AD.1070805@worldnet.att.net> References: <49BC0653.7010609@worldnet.att.net> <49BC16AD.1070805@worldnet.att.net> Message-ID: <78EB5496-681B-4EA1-82E6-F33CCBC03342@thealmquists.net> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 I'm going to right a longer follow up post on the history of LTSP, which you may already know, but might make some of the weird lineage things I'm talking about below a little more clear. On Mar 14, 2009, at 3:42 PM, Michael J. Izak wrote: > I started out with Fedora 6 LTSP version two or three years ago and > it worked very well. It had thunderbird and firefox in it. > Now the centos version don't have thunderbird. I need thunderbird. > I guess nobody thought of maintaining continuity with the software > carried from Fedora 6 to the Centos when they were building the > Centos version. So the CentOS 5 version of K12LTSP (aka K12LTSP-EL) wasn't designed as an "upgrade" to FC 6. The problem is that Fedora 6 isn't supported anymore, which is what K12LTSP 6 was based upon. So people who want to use the "old" LTSP 4.2 on a stable platform that still gets security updates need to move to it. K12LTSP-EL is more like its cousin to K12LTSP, because it uses the slower changing, but more stable, CentOS instead of Fedora. The K12LTSP project really only maintains the K12LTSP-EL branch now, because it's the only LTSP 4.2 branch that still gets security updates. AFAIK, all the "next generation" LTSP 5+ stuff on Fedora and the CentOS 6 work is now part of the K12Linux project. The continuity is from version to version of CentOS and Fedora. There isn't anything to stop you from installing Thunderbird on CentOS (or K12LTSP EL, which is CentOS with the LTSP stuff build into the installer) or Fedora. > That's why after reading the LTSP wiki page it seemed all I needed > was Fedora 10 install DVD because the LTSP software is already > intergrated into the Fedora 10. > Now it seems LTSP is not part of F10 because I can't find any LTSP > packages when during the pre-install phase of F10. I thought I was > hearing for some years LTSP was gonna be part of F8, then F9, and > F10? Myth? > I can't do a yum install on the live version. I get back errors > which I don't understand which I gave up. > I think I see where the confusion is coming from. You can install LTSP on a vanilla FC9 or FC10 system, but the plain Fedora installer doesn't do that automatically. That's what the installGuide page was for. It was instructions on installing LTSP on a system that already had a recent version of Fedora (9 or 10) on it. If you wanted something more like K12LTSP, which was already setup for you, then you want to use the K12Linux (or the "old" K12LTSP EL, which is LTSP 4.2 and CentOS) K12Linux is a LiveUSB or LiveCD that allows you to demo K12Linux. It also lets you do a permanent install of Fedora; one that already includes the LTSP software pre-configured to run out of the box (much like K12LTSP used to do for Fedora), you only need to follow the network setup stuff to get it running. I'm guessing you were trying to install Thunderbird when you were still running from the LiveCD. You can't install software to an OS that is running from the LiveCD (the CD is read-only). You need to either install FC + LTSP per the instruction page or install K12Linux. If you want to actually install K12Linux, you need to run the installer that is on the desktop. By default you simply boot into the LiveCD which is just a demo. Then you just follow the network setup guide and you are off and running. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.7 (Darwin) iEYEARECAAYFAkm8OWoACgkQxWV7OPa/g5F0YwCfdo1fJCic1eFgdZQT+AyWvAC7 gJ4AnjjYbxMe4rvAKAt55gdCbE4q8Bh6 =2OUT -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From brcisna at eazylivin.net Sat Mar 14 23:30:50 2009 From: brcisna at eazylivin.net (Barry R Cisna) Date: Sat, 14 Mar 2009 18:30:50 -0500 Subject: [K12OSN] hplip + TC + Photosmart 7760 Message-ID: <1237073450.16185.25.camel@localhost.localdomain> Hello List, Has anyone by chance been able to get an HP Photosmart 7760 printer setup with hplip on a TC via the usb connection? I can make this printer work fine with the JetDirect setup,but when using the ' hp-makeuri ' to add the printer to the hplip list I get "device not found". I also tried adding it manually via the cups web gui and it shows up 'green' but still hp-toolbox says" device unplugged or powered down. When this TC boots you do see the printer listed/connected along with usb-mass-storage-device (photocard reader). I listed this at the hplip forum but this is pretty much a one off setup for most folks there (being TC connected). My entry for this printer in cups: hp:/net/photosmart_7700_series? I figure if the native 'hp-makeuri' command does not see the printer attached,the above entry is probably mute.:( Entry for the printer in lts.conf for the TC; [ws002] PRINTER_0_DEVICE = /dev/usb/lp0 PRINTER_0_TYPE = U I also tried this entry [ws002] PRINTER_0_DEVICE = /dev/usb/lp0 PRINTER_0_TYPE = U PRINTER_1_DEVICE = /dev/bus/usb/lp1 # read hplip uses this path? PRINTER_1_TYPE = U Cups logs shows nothing to point to what is failing cause the printer is never 'connected'. This entry in cups DOES work socket://:9100 Wanting to use hplip for this teacher to access his photocard reader on this printer via hp-toolbox, hp-unload. K12LTSP5 / Centos 5 Default installed hplip and updated to latest hplip 3.9.2 package with same results. Thanks, Barry Cisna From jkinney at localnetsolutions.com Sat Mar 14 23:45:54 2009 From: jkinney at localnetsolutions.com (James P. Kinney III) Date: Sat, 14 Mar 2009 19:45:54 -0400 Subject: [K12OSN] K12LTSP/K12Linux 'crusaders' In-Reply-To: <1236519012.29686.31.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <1236519012.29686.31.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <1237074354.23823.16.camel@merlin.localnetsolutions.com> What is needed is something that looks like a "sales force" front for all Linux to "sell" into the schools. What I have seen is schools will buy stuff (whether is works or not!) because a sales person convinces them that they will get benefit XYZ with the product and they will get detriment ABC without the product. School purchasing officers understand this process. They understand purchase means spend cash to get product. They don't understand "product is free. buy support". Most schools have "support" in house. What that support can provide varies all over the board and usually does NOT include Linux :( So the "sale force" has to sell "installed seats" while not violating the spirit and letter of the GPL (which strictly forbids per seat licensing of the code!) by only selling a package of installed code with support - no exceptions. Add in a training program for existing school admins to start getting them up to speed on Linux and it might work. On Sun, 2009-03-08 at 08:30 -0500, Barry R Cisna wrote: > Hello List, > > Background: Been using k12ltsp since the first version K12ltsp here. > Has anyone else on list thought the same as me in that, " I wonder if > k12ltsp/k12linux would be more accepted in schools if someone was out > promoting the merits k12ltsp/k12linux"? I know something like this would > be hard to organize with everyone doing stuff like this "out of the > goodness of their heart". Just like everything else if there is no money > involved no one is much interested. > I see firsthand how schools just for the most part are a "monkey see, > monkey do" type of atmosphere. If school A that neighbors school B buys > all macs one year,the next year school B thinks they should be having > macs. > Also as I have stated many a time. The first thing that comes out of the > mouths of the higher ups when stating that k12ltsp is free is" If it is > free it can not be very good quality",,,or " How much longer will it be > free". > I know a few years ago Steve Hargedon was traveling around 'on his own' > giving talks in regards to the advantages of k12lltsp,and haven't seen > him on the list here for quite some time. I went to one of Steve's > presentations when He was here in out part of the country, as a matter > of fact and am guessing at that time, there were about 30 people that > showed up that evening. > Just wondered,if a good sharp 2 hour presentation by someone or a group > of a few k12ltsp/k12linux crusaders would be of any benefit? This may be > borderline of making k12ltsp/k12linux seem 'commercialized',though too? > I DO know one thing with the situation that is REALLY coming on in > regards to budgets for schools across the board I would think some of > the money hander outers would be more apt to start focusing on something > that has potential for money saved. > The only downside I would see to all of this,is that many a "network > guy/gal" would be out of a job in time,,:-) > Just fire up K12ltsp/k12linux server at the start of school year ,add > users, and let er go! > Just a thought. Easier said than done, I know. > > Barry Cisna > > > _______________________________________________ > K12OSN mailing list > K12OSN at redhat.com > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > For more info see > -- James P. Kinney III CEO & Director of Engineering Local Net Solutions,LLC http://www.localnetsolutions.com GPG ID: 829C6CA7 James P. Kinney III (M.S. Physics) Fingerprint = 3C9E 6366 54FC A3FE BA4D 0659 6190 ADC3 829C 6CA7 -- This message has been scanned for viruses and dangerous content by MailScanner, and is believed to be clean. From microman at cmosnetworks.com Sat Mar 14 23:46:23 2009 From: microman at cmosnetworks.com (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?=22Terrell_Prud=E9_Jr=2E=22?=) Date: Sat, 14 Mar 2009 19:46:23 -0400 Subject: [K12OSN] Installing LTSP 5 over Fedora 10 In-Reply-To: <49BC16AD.1070805@worldnet.att.net> References: <49BC0653.7010609@worldnet.att.net> <49BC16AD.1070805@worldnet.att.net> Message-ID: <49BC41CF.5010505@cmosnetworks.com> Of course the CentOS version has Thunderbird! I'm using it on K12LTSP 5EL right now to write this very email. Evolution is installed by default, true, but T-Bird is most definitely in the Yum repositories. Here's the proof from my own K12LTSP 5EL server. [microman at takhisis ~]$ rpm -q thunderbird thunderbird-2.0.0.19-1.el5.centos [microman at takhisis ~]$ Just do a "yum install thunderbird", and you will be a happy ranchero. :-) --TP _______________________________ Do you GNU ? Microsoft Free since 2003 --the ultimate antivirus protection! Michael J. Izak wrote: > This is exactly the page I was talking about that was not very clear. > > I started out with Fedora 6 LTSP version two or three years ago and it > worked very well. It had thunderbird and firefox in it. Now the > centos version don't have thunderbird. I need thunderbird. I guess > nobody thought of maintaining continuity with the software carried > from Fedora 6 to the Centos when they were building the Centos version. > That's why after reading the LTSP wiki page it seemed all I needed was > Fedora 10 install DVD because the LTSP software is already intergrated > into the Fedora 10. Now it seems LTSP is not part of F10 because I > can't find any LTSP packages when during the pre-install phase of > F10. I thought I was hearing for some years LTSP was gonna be part of > F8, then F9, and F10? Myth? > > I can't do a yum install on the live version. I get back errors which > I don't understand which I gave up. > > MJI > > David Hopkins wrote: >> On Sat, Mar 14, 2009 at 3:32 PM, Michael J. Izak >> wrote: >> >>> Hello everybody. >>> >>> I have Fedora 10 installed on my PC. I wish to install LTSP 5 over >>> it. I >>> do not want Fedora 10 Live installed because it does not allow me to >>> use >>> Thunderbird. The LTSP page telling me "how" to install LTSP on >>> Fedora 10 >>> has instructions that are not very clear to me and instead tells me >>> to use >>> Live instead. >>> I don't know my way around Linux that well so I consider myself a >>> beginner. >>> Is there instructions how to modify F10 to work with LTSP 5? >>> Thank you >>> >> >> Try starting here: https://fedorahosted.org/k12linux/wiki/InstallGuide >> >> It does work but I'm certain there will be a couple of spots that just >> aren't clear. >> >> Alternatively, couldn't you install the live version and then use >> >> yum install thunderbird >> >> to install thunderbird? >> >> _______________________________________________ >> K12OSN mailing list >> K12OSN at redhat.com >> https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn >> For more info see >> >> > > _______________________________________________ > K12OSN mailing list > K12OSN at redhat.com > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > For more info see -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From brcisna at eazylivin.net Sat Mar 14 23:49:08 2009 From: brcisna at eazylivin.net (Barry R Cisna) Date: Sat, 14 Mar 2009 18:49:08 -0500 Subject: [K12OSN] OT: multimedia and proxy hosts Message-ID: <1237074548.21175.10.camel@localhost.localdomain> Hi Dave, If I understand correctly you do not have actual access to your school's proxy server? A workaround would be to call whoever runs it,and have them 'disable' this server from using the proxy,even if temporarily to see if this fixes your 'connecting' only problem. Or, have them whitelist the url of the site(s) you are running the videos from. Even at that it is possible that the proxy will make your server 'confused' say for instance in redirecting to another url to start the video clip. Also did you hard code in FF,and 'Network proxy' of server settings,the actual proxy ip and port number to see if you can make your videos work this way? Sidenote: I have quite a time getting yum to work correctly with the proxy server we have after umpteen updates of firmware on the proxy server. Used to not have any probs. Even entering the proxy ip/port# as in many suggestions found on the net yum fails almost all the time.Have to bypass the proxy until this is done. Take Care, Barry Cisna From burke at thealmquists.net Sat Mar 14 23:59:46 2009 From: burke at thealmquists.net (Almquist Burke) Date: Sat, 14 Mar 2009 18:59:46 -0500 Subject: [K12OSN] hplip + TC + Photosmart 7760 In-Reply-To: <1237073450.16185.25.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <1237073450.16185.25.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <328D5ACF-8D7E-4234-AC18-4136FA79B636@thealmquists.net> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On Mar 14, 2009, at 6:30 PM, Barry R Cisna wrote: > K12LTSP5 / Centos 5 > Default installed hplip and updated to latest hplip 3.9.2 package with > same results. > I was under the impression that LTSP 5 would never fully work on CentOS5 because the core software on it was simply too old to support some of the stuff LTSP 5 depends on. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.7 (Darwin) iEYEARECAAYFAkm8RPIACgkQxWV7OPa/g5EO6wCfQxmEFxyDsVexqIm1ice52i0i Y2QAn2p9mdD+bjRE3u9ymYb8/N6Zi39W =0bPB -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From burke at thealmquists.net Sun Mar 15 00:30:29 2009 From: burke at thealmquists.net (Almquist Burke) Date: Sat, 14 Mar 2009 19:30:29 -0500 Subject: [K12OSN] An LTSP History In-Reply-To: <49BC0653.7010609@worldnet.att.net> References: <49BC0653.7010609@worldnet.att.net> Message-ID: <31443FAC-65CD-492F-AB2B-BDB2F7F2F018@thealmquists.net> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 I'm sensing some confusion here on the list about LTSP, K12LTSP, and K12Linux. All of you old timers here probably know this stuff already (and please correct me if I'm wrong about anything). But if you are trying to get your head wrapped around K12Linux, K12LTSP, LTSP, etc. then this is a good place to start. Once upon a time, you had LTSP, the Linux Terminal Server Project. LTSP was a special program (more like it's own mini distribution, I think they used Redhat's setup and pared it way down to the minimum that they needed) that you would install in it's own directory, and then configure the server so that thin clients would do something called "network booting". Meaning, that when they started up, the BIOS would try to get an OS, but not from a local hard drive, it would look out on the network and ask a server to provide it with one. A server with LTSP properly installed and configured, would provide an OS just big enough to provide login/desktop session to the server. At that point, the user was really just using his/her desktop "remotely" on the server. This was big, because it meant the thin clients could be relatively low powered hardware that didn't need to be "maintained" and replaced like a normal PC desktop. All the software ran was on the server, so you really only had to maintain the LTSP server(s) instead of many, many individual PCs. Sure, they weren't good for things like high end 3D gaming or intensive A/V work, but for most "computer lab" type situations, it was cheeper and easier to build and maintain than a lab full of individual PC workstations. But installing LTSP and configuring DHCP, TFTP, NFS, etc. on each Linux distribution was a lot of work, and many less technical people were simply not going to spend the time and effort to get something like this running. So a couple LTSP users decided to setup a "pre- configured" version of LTSP based on Redhat, and later, Fedora (when Redhat stopped doing the shrink wrapped desktop software) called, K12LTSP. K12LTSP was simply a customized Redhat/Fedora install CD that added LTSP and K12 applications install options to the installer. This would automatically install LTSP to run and serve clients connected to whatever it's primary ethernet connection. A secondary ethernet card would provide access to the rest of the LAN or internet, if you had one. This went on for a number of years, until the LTSP developers had an epiphany. A lot of the work they were doing wasn't working on the LTSP specific challenges (like making local devices like CD and USB stick work seamlessly, remote sound, etc), they were spending a lot of time keeping low level OS stuff current. The stuff that got the thin clients to network boot properly, detect hardware, etc. This was stuff that every linux distribution does (updating to the latest kernels and other low level software) and since LTSP was really it's own very minimal distribution, they had to duplicate all this work too. This was how things worked until version 5. They said, instead of building a distribution of LTSP that people build, install, and configure on each distribution, we'll create a spec and let each distribution build their own LTSP implementation, freeing us up to work on the little bit of software that all LTSP implementations will need in common, such as better login manager, something to handle local device connections like USBDrives and soundcards, etc. This is how LTSP 5 works. With this change, the LTSP community, which used to be dominated by K12LTSP and DebianEDU, is now balanced with a significant number SuSE and Ubuntu users. Since they all share fewer bits in common than they used to, this means that answering an LTSP question has become more difficult. That's why the version and distro information have become so much more important for answering questions. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.7 (Darwin) iEYEARECAAYFAkm8TCUACgkQxWV7OPa/g5GAngCeN68MqTQUAY4xzUQu+fi4uNE3 DYUAn3gM/cJhiELzuB+Miw2dI1IZp40k =xAHf -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From dahopkins429 at gmail.com Sun Mar 15 04:07:52 2009 From: dahopkins429 at gmail.com (David Hopkins) Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2009 00:07:52 -0400 Subject: [K12OSN] OT: multimedia and proxy hosts In-Reply-To: <1237074548.21175.10.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <1237074548.21175.10.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: Barry, > If I understand correctly you do not have actual access to your school's > proxy server? Or, have them > whitelist the url of the site(s) you are running the videos from. > Even at that it is possible that the proxy will make your server > 'confused' say for instance in redirecting to another url to start the > video clip. A workaround would be to call whoever runs it,and have > them 'disable' this server from using the proxy,even if temporarily to > see if this fixes your 'connecting' only problem. It isn't the school's but the state DOE's proxy server. The entire education network is routed through a Blue Coat proxy system. So, they are not going to let us bypass it under any circumstances. They also block streaming video/audio from various sites, so I'll have to see if they can whitelist the NASA site. > Also did you hard code in FF,and 'Network proxy' of server settings,the > actual proxy ip and port number to see if you can make your videos work > this way? Yep, this is pretty standard since without it, no web browsing ever works. > Sidenote: I have quite a time getting yum to work correctly with the > proxy server we have after umpteen updates of firmware on the proxy > server. Used to not have any probs. Even entering the proxy ip/port# as > in many suggestions found on the net yum fails almost all the time.Have > to bypass the proxy until this is done. I have had to actually bring systems from the school to my home network to run a patch when the proxy server has been patched at times. It is why I have a dedicated firewall at home with my network behind it. Though normally setting http_proxy works for yum. From gjk_lists at rogers.com Sun Mar 15 12:03:28 2009 From: gjk_lists at rogers.com (Gustav J Kramer) Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2009 08:03:28 -0400 Subject: [K12OSN] hplip + TC + Photosmart 7760 In-Reply-To: <1237073450.16185.25.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <1237073450.16185.25.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <1237118608.7225.38.camel@localhost.localdomain> On Sat, 2009-03-14 at 18:30 -0500, Barry R Cisna wrote: > Hello List, > > Has anyone by chance been able to get an HP Photosmart 7760 printer > setup with hplip on a TC via the usb connection? > I can make this printer work fine with the JetDirect setup,but when > using the ' hp-makeuri ' to add the printer to the hplip > list I get "device not found". Barry, When I looked into this a few years ago with an officejet I found that the "JetDirect" emulator for Linux does not provide the full functionality that a true JetDirect hardware device does. AFAIK the part that is missing is the bidirectional communication capability. I think it can pass basic status info but full communication with the server is not possible. If I recall correctly, there are two daemons that need to run on the machine that the printer is hooked up to and it was those daemons that provided the communication to hp toolbox. I think they were hpssd & hpiod. I tried to get them to run on my thin client but didn't really know what I was doing so didn't have much luck in sorting out the needed dependencies. In the end I used it for printing only and booted in to Windows when I needed to scan. When I life cycled the printer I replaced with a networked version and haven't looked back. With the progress that has been made with local apps you may be able to install hplip on the tc which should provide you with everything hp toolbox offers. I might point out, before you go through a whole lot of trouble, that the card reader throughput on my officejet is abysmal. I mean, it's really really slow. It's to the point that, although it sits right in front of me, if I have a memory card I have to dump I will dig out my camera bag and plug in my stand alone card reader rather than use the one integrated into my OJ. YMMV with the photosmart, but, you may want to test it hooked up to a machine running hplip before you go too far down that path. You may find that using the jetdirect emulator with hpijs and buying a seperate card reader (they're cheap enough) is your best bet. - gustav From brcisna at eazylivin.net Sun Mar 15 12:45:22 2009 From: brcisna at eazylivin.net (Barry R Cisna) Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2009 07:45:22 -0500 Subject: [K12OSN] hplip + TC + Photosmart 7760 Message-ID: <1237121122.19692.11.camel@localhost.localdomain> Gustav, Thanks for the heads up on the slowness of the card reader. Makes sense about the two daemons having to run 'inside' the client to work for advanced features stuff. All of the 'actual' Jetdirect/network printers that add to hplip works fine,so the usb attached must be the show stopper. AB: I wasn't real clear. This is K12LTSP5 EL, I guess is the official release name . It probably seemed what I mentioned was ltsp5 on top of el/Centos5. Sorry bout that. We like to stay behind the times here in this part of the country anyways!,,,:) I was going to try plugging this printer into the server just to see what kind of results I get,but at this point I think I am just beating a dead horse. I will tell this individual to buy him a usb card reader and go for it. Thanks again. Barry Cisna From rowens at ptd.net Sun Mar 15 19:28:39 2009 From: rowens at ptd.net (Rob Owens) Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2009 15:28:39 -0400 Subject: [K12OSN] OT: multimedia and proxy hosts In-Reply-To: References: <1237074548.21175.10.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <20090315192839.GA28142@aurora.owens.net> On Sun, Mar 15, 2009 at 12:07:52AM -0400, David Hopkins wrote: > > Sidenote: I have quite a time getting yum to work correctly with the > > proxy server we have after umpteen updates of firmware on the proxy > > server. Used to not have any probs. Even entering the proxy ip/port# as > > in many suggestions found on the net yum fails almost all the time.Have > > to bypass the proxy until this is done. > > I have had to actually bring systems from the school to my home > network to run a patch when the proxy server has been patched at > times. It is why I have a dedicated firewall at home with my network > behind it. Though normally setting http_proxy works for yum. > I prematurely deleted your original email, so I'm not sure if you've already tried this: export http_proxy=http://myproxy:9999 (where 9999 is the port number) I've used that to direct certain traffic to a proxy server, but I haven't tried it with yum or any streaming videos. Note that it only applies to commands run in the same terminal, and I'm not sure how it works if you were to try to run it from a launcher or something similar. -Rob From rowens at ptd.net Sun Mar 15 19:33:11 2009 From: rowens at ptd.net (Rob Owens) Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2009 15:33:11 -0400 Subject: [K12OSN] K12LTSP/K12Linux 'crusaders' In-Reply-To: <1237074354.23823.16.camel@merlin.localnetsolutions.com> References: <1236519012.29686.31.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1237074354.23823.16.camel@merlin.localnetsolutions.com> Message-ID: <20090315193311.GB28142@aurora.owens.net> Sounds like free software in general could use a master database for its "sales force". If one existed, I'd sign up. It would be great to be able to input my location and my specialties, so that anybody in my general area could contact me for support or a demo or a sales pitch, etc. -Rob On Sat, Mar 14, 2009 at 07:45:54PM -0400, James P. Kinney III wrote: > What is needed is something that looks like a "sales force" front for > all Linux to "sell" into the schools. > > What I have seen is schools will buy stuff (whether is works or not!) > because a sales person convinces them that they will get benefit XYZ > with the product and they will get detriment ABC without the product. > School purchasing officers understand this process. They understand > purchase means spend cash to get product. They don't understand "product > is free. buy support". Most schools have "support" in house. What that > support can provide varies all over the board and usually does NOT > include Linux :( > > So the "sale force" has to sell "installed seats" while not violating > the spirit and letter of the GPL (which strictly forbids per seat > licensing of the code!) by only selling a package of installed code with > support - no exceptions. Add in a training program for existing school > admins to start getting them up to speed on Linux and it might work. > > On Sun, 2009-03-08 at 08:30 -0500, Barry R Cisna wrote: > > Hello List, > > > > Background: Been using k12ltsp since the first version K12ltsp here. > > Has anyone else on list thought the same as me in that, " I wonder if > > k12ltsp/k12linux would be more accepted in schools if someone was out > > promoting the merits k12ltsp/k12linux"? I know something like this would > > be hard to organize with everyone doing stuff like this "out of the > > goodness of their heart". Just like everything else if there is no money > > involved no one is much interested. > > I see firsthand how schools just for the most part are a "monkey see, > > monkey do" type of atmosphere. If school A that neighbors school B buys > > all macs one year,the next year school B thinks they should be having > > macs. > > Also as I have stated many a time. The first thing that comes out of the > > mouths of the higher ups when stating that k12ltsp is free is" If it is > > free it can not be very good quality",,,or " How much longer will it be > > free". > > I know a few years ago Steve Hargedon was traveling around 'on his own' > > giving talks in regards to the advantages of k12lltsp,and haven't seen > > him on the list here for quite some time. I went to one of Steve's > > presentations when He was here in out part of the country, as a matter > > of fact and am guessing at that time, there were about 30 people that > > showed up that evening. > > Just wondered,if a good sharp 2 hour presentation by someone or a group > > of a few k12ltsp/k12linux crusaders would be of any benefit? This may be > > borderline of making k12ltsp/k12linux seem 'commercialized',though too? > > I DO know one thing with the situation that is REALLY coming on in > > regards to budgets for schools across the board I would think some of > > the money hander outers would be more apt to start focusing on something > > that has potential for money saved. > > The only downside I would see to all of this,is that many a "network > > guy/gal" would be out of a job in time,,:-) > > Just fire up K12ltsp/k12linux server at the start of school year ,add > > users, and let er go! > > Just a thought. Easier said than done, I know. > > > > Barry Cisna > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > K12OSN mailing list > > K12OSN at redhat.com > > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > > For more info see > > > -- > James P. Kinney III > CEO & Director of Engineering > Local Net Solutions,LLC > http://www.localnetsolutions.com > > GPG ID: 829C6CA7 James P. Kinney III (M.S. Physics) > > Fingerprint = 3C9E 6366 54FC A3FE BA4D 0659 6190 ADC3 829C 6CA7 > > > -- > This message has been scanned for viruses and > dangerous content by MailScanner, and is > believed to be clean. > > _______________________________________________ > K12OSN mailing list > K12OSN at redhat.com > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > For more info see From microman at cmosnetworks.com Sun Mar 15 21:30:04 2009 From: microman at cmosnetworks.com (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?=22Terrell_Prud=E9_Jr=2E=22?=) Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2009 17:30:04 -0400 Subject: [K12OSN] K12LTSP/K12Linux 'crusaders' In-Reply-To: <20090315193311.GB28142@aurora.owens.net> References: <1236519012.29686.31.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1237074354.23823.16.camel@merlin.localnetsolutions.com> <20090315193311.GB28142@aurora.owens.net> Message-ID: <49BD735C.1060709@cmosnetworks.com> Such a database did indeed exist. Red Hat maintained something that, IIRC, was called "Friends of Red Hat." You'd sign up, and if anybody in your area needed help with (especially Red Hat) GNU/Linux, they could call or email you. It doesn't seem to be around anymore, though, so I guess it wasn't all that successful. Perhaps with the economy in the toilet, now might be a better time to try it. BUT.... Any database like that, in order to be successful, would need to keep "OPM Addiction" in mind. That's why so many school districts (our chief target audience) go with SuprDeluX ThingaMaJig. Yet these same people drive beat-up old 4-cylinder cars to and from schools and complain about gas prices. So remember that when considering any such database. Anything that, to them, smacks of "tie-dye, pony-tail, hippie" will be summarily dismissed. It's got to look and feel "corporate". --TP _______________________________ Do you GNU ? Microsoft Free since 2003 --the ultimate antivirus protection! Rob Owens wrote: > Sounds like free software in general could use a master database for its "sales force". If one existed, I'd sign up. It would be > great to be able to input my location and my specialties, so that anybody in my general area could contact me for support or a demo or > a sales pitch, etc. > > -Rob > > On Sat, Mar 14, 2009 at 07:45:54PM -0400, James P. Kinney III wrote: > >> What is needed is something that looks like a "sales force" front for >> all Linux to "sell" into the schools. >> >> What I have seen is schools will buy stuff (whether is works or not!) >> because a sales person convinces them that they will get benefit XYZ >> with the product and they will get detriment ABC without the product. >> School purchasing officers understand this process. They understand >> purchase means spend cash to get product. They don't understand "product >> is free. buy support". Most schools have "support" in house. What that >> support can provide varies all over the board and usually does NOT >> include Linux :( >> >> So the "sale force" has to sell "installed seats" while not violating >> the spirit and letter of the GPL (which strictly forbids per seat >> licensing of the code!) by only selling a package of installed code with >> support - no exceptions. Add in a training program for existing school >> admins to start getting them up to speed on Linux and it might work. >> >> On Sun, 2009-03-08 at 08:30 -0500, Barry R Cisna wrote: >> >>> Hello List, >>> >>> Background: Been using k12ltsp since the first version K12ltsp here. >>> Has anyone else on list thought the same as me in that, " I wonder if >>> k12ltsp/k12linux would be more accepted in schools if someone was out >>> promoting the merits k12ltsp/k12linux"? I know something like this would >>> be hard to organize with everyone doing stuff like this "out of the >>> goodness of their heart". Just like everything else if there is no money >>> involved no one is much interested. >>> I see firsthand how schools just for the most part are a "monkey see, >>> monkey do" type of atmosphere. If school A that neighbors school B buys >>> all macs one year,the next year school B thinks they should be having >>> macs. >>> Also as I have stated many a time. The first thing that comes out of the >>> mouths of the higher ups when stating that k12ltsp is free is" If it is >>> free it can not be very good quality",,,or " How much longer will it be >>> free". >>> I know a few years ago Steve Hargedon was traveling around 'on his own' >>> giving talks in regards to the advantages of k12lltsp,and haven't seen >>> him on the list here for quite some time. I went to one of Steve's >>> presentations when He was here in out part of the country, as a matter >>> of fact and am guessing at that time, there were about 30 people that >>> showed up that evening. >>> Just wondered,if a good sharp 2 hour presentation by someone or a group >>> of a few k12ltsp/k12linux crusaders would be of any benefit? This may be >>> borderline of making k12ltsp/k12linux seem 'commercialized',though too? >>> I DO know one thing with the situation that is REALLY coming on in >>> regards to budgets for schools across the board I would think some of >>> the money hander outers would be more apt to start focusing on something >>> that has potential for money saved. >>> The only downside I would see to all of this,is that many a "network >>> guy/gal" would be out of a job in time,,:-) >>> Just fire up K12ltsp/k12linux server at the start of school year ,add >>> users, and let er go! >>> Just a thought. Easier said than done, I know. >>> >>> Barry Cisna >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> K12OSN mailing list >>> K12OSN at redhat.com >>> https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn >>> For more info see >>> >>> >> -- >> James P. Kinney III >> CEO & Director of Engineering >> Local Net Solutions,LLC >> http://www.localnetsolutions.com >> >> GPG ID: 829C6CA7 James P. Kinney III (M.S. Physics) >> >> Fingerprint = 3C9E 6366 54FC A3FE BA4D 0659 6190 ADC3 829C 6CA7 >> >> >> -- >> This message has been scanned for viruses and >> dangerous content by MailScanner, and is >> believed to be clean. >> >> _______________________________________________ >> K12OSN mailing list >> K12OSN at redhat.com >> https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn >> For more info see >> > > _______________________________________________ > K12OSN mailing list > K12OSN at redhat.com > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > For more info see > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From nils at breun.nl Sun Mar 15 21:56:56 2009 From: nils at breun.nl (Nils Breunese) Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2009 22:56:56 +0100 Subject: [K12OSN] K12LTSP/K12Linux 'crusaders' In-Reply-To: <20090315193311.GB28142@aurora.owens.net> References: <1236519012.29686.31.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1237074354.23823.16.camel@merlin.localnetsolutions.com> <20090315193311.GB28142@aurora.owens.net> Message-ID: <435159D7-51E8-4EE8-8C66-9218D3E1409B@breun.nl> Rob Owens wrote: > Sounds like free software in general could use a master database for > its "sales force". If one existed, I'd sign up. It would be > great to be able to input my location and my specialties, so that > anybody in my general area could contact me for support or a demo or > a sales pitch, etc. You could just start a group on LinkedIn for this. Nils Breunese. From gjk_lists at rogers.com Mon Mar 16 02:41:38 2009 From: gjk_lists at rogers.com (Gustav J Kramer) Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2009 22:41:38 -0400 Subject: [K12OSN] hplip + TC + Photosmart 7760 In-Reply-To: <1237121122.19692.11.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <1237121122.19692.11.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <1237171298.26179.16.camel@localhost.localdomain> On Sun, 2009-03-15 at 07:45 -0500, Barry R Cisna wrote: > Gustav, > > Thanks for the heads up on the slowness of the card reader. Makes sense > about the two daemons having to run 'inside' the client to work for > advanced features stuff. > All of the 'actual' Jetdirect/network printers that add to hplip works > fine,so the usb attached must be the show stopper. My pleasure, FWIW there _is_ a USB Jetdirect printserver that should work with hplip if the printer supports it. Mine did and I priced one out - at the time the best that I could do was around $200. I quickly decided against it since it would be obsolete once I life cycled that printer. The card reader, on the other hand, is cheap and can be moved from machine to machine. Cheers, - gustav From willems.leo at googlemail.com Mon Mar 16 05:40:22 2009 From: willems.leo at googlemail.com (Leo Willems) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 13:40:22 +0800 Subject: [K12OSN] How to get ThinClient LAN finding DHCP and booting? In-Reply-To: <49BA1B97.1040604@togami.com> References: <3fabbdc20903121845o3d861bd2r5ecbc132a84bbfe1@mail.gmail.com> <3fabbdc20903122345p1f5fb5f3i181eab113c833d65@mail.gmail.com> <49BA1B97.1040604@togami.com> Message-ID: <3fabbdc20903152240h2cf853car90a15c1d744eccd3@mail.gmail.com> On Fri, Mar 13, 2009 at 4:38 PM, Warren Togami wrote: > Leo Willems wrote: >> >> Thanks for the fast reply. >> >> A Permanent Network Setup >> >> 1. open /etc/sysconfig/network-scripts/ifcfg-ethN where the "N" in ethN >> 2. add BRIDGE=ltspbr0, and make sure that NM_CONTROLLED=no and ONBOOT=yes >> 3. restart the service network and NetworkManager, either from System >> -> Administration -> Services in the GUI, or by running service >> network restart and service NetworkManager restart in the terminal as >> the root user >> >> >> /etc/sysconfig/network-scripts/ >> ifcfg-lo ifdown-isdn ifup-aliases ifup-plip ifup-wireless >> ifcfg-ltspbr0 ifdown-post ifup-bnep ifup-plusb init.ipv6-global >> ifdown ifdown-ppp ifup-eth ifup-post net.hotplug ifdown-bnep >> ifdown-routes ifup-ippp ifup-ppp network-functions ifdown-eth >> ifdown-sit ifup-ipsec ifup-routes ?network-functions-ipv6 ifdown-ippp >> ifdown-sl ifup-ipv6 ifup-sit ifdown-ipsec ifdown-tunnel ifup-ipx >> ifup-sl ifdown-ipv6 ifup ifup-isdn ifup-tunnel >> >> >> I can not find any ifcfg-eth1 here. >> >> What to do? > > http://alt.fedoraproject.org/pub/alt/ltsp/k12linux-live-docs/k12linux-quick-start-guide.html > There are several ways to do this, but do steps 1 through 15. ?Note that you > need to modify the instructions slightly because your device is named > differently. > > Warren > Thanks Guys! really fast help. Terminal server works on eth1! 1. added eth0 and eth1 -> System -> Administration -> Network (first in DHCP mode) 2. 'slaved' eth1 to ltspbr0 in /etc/sysconfig/network-scripts/ifcfg-eth1 # Please read /usr/share/doc/initscripts-*/sysconfig.txt # for the documentation of these parameters. TYPE=Ethernet DEVICE=eth1 HWADDR=00:10:5a:82:48:55 BOOTPROTO=dhcp ONBOOT=yes USERCTL=no PEERDNS=yes IPV6INIT=no BRIDGE=ltspbr0 NM_CONTROLLED=no 3. restart network and network manager -> System -> Administration -> Services From jjjggg at hotmail.com Mon Mar 16 13:09:06 2009 From: jjjggg at hotmail.com (J G) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 09:09:06 -0400 Subject: [K12OSN] Jammin 125 sound settings In-Reply-To: References: <20090219022202.GB6380@aurora.owens.net> Message-ID: I got a few Jammin 125s running on an up-to-date K12LTSP 5.0EL. Video works fine but no audio. I read the archives and before I go nuts debugging, I just want to verify my lts.conf settings with someone who has it working: SOUND = Y SOUND_DAEMON = nasd SMODULE_01 = cx5530 Also, is anyone using a Jammin 125 with K12Linux F10 and does it work with video and sound? Thanks. _________________________________________________________________ Hotmail? is up to 70% faster. Now good news travels really fast. http://windowslive.com/online/hotmail?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_HM_70faster_032009 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From rowens at ptd.net Mon Mar 16 13:43:32 2009 From: rowens at ptd.net (Rob Owens) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 09:43:32 -0400 Subject: [K12OSN] K12LTSP/K12Linux 'crusaders' In-Reply-To: <435159D7-51E8-4EE8-8C66-9218D3E1409B@breun.nl> References: <1236519012.29686.31.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1237074354.23823.16.camel@merlin.localnetsolutions.com> <20090315193311.GB28142@aurora.owens.net> <435159D7-51E8-4EE8-8C66-9218D3E1409B@breun.nl> Message-ID: <20090316134332.GC3616@aurora.owens.net> On Sun, Mar 15, 2009 at 10:56:56PM +0100, Nils Breunese wrote: > Rob Owens wrote: > >> Sounds like free software in general could use a master database for >> its "sales force". If one existed, I'd sign up. It would be >> great to be able to input my location and my specialties, so that >> anybody in my general area could contact me for support or a demo or >> a sales pitch, etc. > > You could just start a group on LinkedIn for this. Apparently there are already a ton of Linux-related groups on LinkedIn. I'm looking through them now. Thanks for the idea. http://www.linkedin.com/groupsDirectory -Rob From k12ltsp at rwcinc.net Mon Mar 16 14:03:35 2009 From: k12ltsp at rwcinc.net (Patrick Fleming) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 07:03:35 -0700 Subject: [K12OSN] K12LTSP/K12Linux 'crusaders' In-Reply-To: <1237074354.23823.16.camel@merlin.localnetsolutions.com> References: <1236519012.29686.31.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1237074354.23823.16.camel@merlin.localnetsolutions.com> Message-ID: <49BE5C37.9080506@rwcinc.net> James P. Kinney III wrote: > > So the "sale force" has to sell "installed seats" while not violating > the spirit and letter of the GPL (which strictly forbids per seat > licensing of the code!) by only selling a package of installed code with > support - no exceptions. Add in a training program for existing school > admins to start getting them up to speed on Linux and it might work. > You can sell per seat, per user, per server or whatever other method you want to. There is nothing in the GPL that prevents this. RedHat does it, Novell does it. The only thing the GPL prevents is lockout - if someone wants the source, they get the source. I hope that I'm misunderstanding your use of "strictly forbids per seat licensing" From lesmikesell at gmail.com Mon Mar 16 15:00:07 2009 From: lesmikesell at gmail.com (Les Mikesell) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 10:00:07 -0500 Subject: [K12OSN] K12LTSP/K12Linux 'crusaders' In-Reply-To: <49BE5C37.9080506@rwcinc.net> References: <1236519012.29686.31.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1237074354.23823.16.camel@merlin.localnetsolutions.com> <49BE5C37.9080506@rwcinc.net> Message-ID: <49BE6977.9050602@gmail.com> Patrick Fleming wrote: > >> So the "sale force" has to sell "installed seats" while not violating >> the spirit and letter of the GPL (which strictly forbids per seat >> licensing of the code!) by only selling a package of installed code with >> support - no exceptions. Add in a training program for existing school >> admins to start getting them up to speed on Linux and it might work. >> > > You can sell per seat, per user, per server or whatever other method you > want to. There is nothing in the GPL that prevents this. RedHat does it, > Novell does it. The only thing the GPL prevents is lockout - if someone > wants the source, they get the source. I hope that I'm misunderstanding > your use of "strictly forbids per seat licensing" What the GPL says is: 6. Each time you redistribute the Program (or any work based on the Program), the recipient automatically receives a license from the original licensor to copy, distribute or modify the Program subject to these terms and conditions. You may not impose any further restrictions on the recipients' exercise of the rights granted herein. I'm sure RedHat has some reason to believe that their restriction against installing licensed copies on additional machines is legal, but I've never been to understand how they reconcile that. There is no distinction between binaries and source here, and no exceptions for how you impose those restrictions. As long as they make the source available so projects like Centos can exist, I doubt if anyone will challenge them on it, though. -- Les Mikesell lesmikesell at gmail.com From DLWillson at TheGeek.NU Mon Mar 16 15:38:19 2009 From: DLWillson at TheGeek.NU (David L. Willson) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 09:38:19 -0600 (MDT) Subject: [K12OSN] K12LTSP/K12Linux 'crusaders' In-Reply-To: <22369755.66191237217375607.JavaMail.root@zimbra.thegeek.nu> Message-ID: <3625113.66231237217899707.JavaMail.root@zimbra.thegeek.nu> > > You can sell per seat, per user, per server or whatever other method > you > > want to. There is nothing in the GPL that prevents this. RedHat does > it, > > Novell does it. The only thing the GPL prevents is lockout - if > someone > > wants the source, they get the source. I hope that I'm > misunderstanding > > your use of "strictly forbids per seat licensing" > > What the GPL says is: > > 6. Each time you redistribute the Program (or any work based on > the > Program), the recipient automatically receives a license from the > original licensor to copy, distribute or modify the Program subject > to > these terms and conditions. You may not impose any further > restrictions on the recipients' exercise of the rights granted > herein. > > I'm sure RedHat has some reason to believe that their restriction > against installing licensed copies on additional machines is legal, > but > I've never been to understand how they reconcile that. There is no > distinction between binaries and source here, and no exceptions for > how > you impose those restrictions. As long as they make the source > available so projects like Centos can exist, I doubt if anyone will > challenge them on it, though. As I understand things, Red Hat is and has always been an ardent supporter of Free software. While Novell seems not to understand the word "Free" the same way, they too, are bound by the terms of the GPL. Red Hat does ~not~ restrict redistribution of their modified Linux kernel, or anything else covered by the GPL. They do not, however, offer their original artwork or trademarks under the GPL. You may neither modify nor redistribute those two things. They provide documentation for stripping them out, which makes it easier to "re-spin" Red Hat into distributions like CentOS. What Red Hat primarily sells "seats" of, is access to the Red Hat Network, which is the only supported system update methodology. I am neither a lawyer nor a representative of Red Hat Software, just an enthusiast like you all. From microman at cmosnetworks.com Mon Mar 16 20:54:43 2009 From: microman at cmosnetworks.com (=?UTF-8?B?IlRlcnJlbGwgUHJ1ZMOpIEpyLiI=?=) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 16:54:43 -0400 Subject: [K12OSN] K12LTSP/K12Linux 'crusaders' In-Reply-To: <3625113.66231237217899707.JavaMail.root@zimbra.thegeek.nu> References: <3625113.66231237217899707.JavaMail.root@zimbra.thegeek.nu> Message-ID: <49BEBC93.7030900@cmosnetworks.com> >> I'm sure RedHat has some reason to believe that their restriction >> against installing licensed copies on additional machines is legal, >> but >> I've never been to understand how they reconcile that. There is no >> distinction between binaries and source here, and no exceptions for >> how >> you impose those restrictions. As long as they make the source >> available so projects like Centos can exist, I doubt if anyone will >> challenge them on it, though. >> > > As I understand things, Red Hat is and has always been an ardent supporter of Free software. While Novell seems not to understand the word "Free" the same way, they too, are bound by the terms of the GPL. Red Hat does ~not~ restrict redistribution of their modified Linux kernel, or anything else covered by the GPL. They do not, however, offer their original artwork or trademarks under the GPL. You may neither modify nor redistribute those two things. They provide documentation for stripping them out, which makes it easier to "re-spin" Red Hat into distributions like CentOS. What Red Hat primarily sells "seats" of, is access to the Red Hat Network, which is the only supported system update methodology. I am neither a lawyer nor a representative of Red Hat Software, just an enthusiast like you all. > Yup, that's correct. Terra Soft (now Fixstars) does exactly the same thing with their license for Yellow Dog Linux. The software is free; the trademarks are not. Even Eric S. Raymond remarked on the cleverness of Red Hat's way of doing this. I talked with some folks at Red Hat at their Raleigh, NC headquarters, and that's how they explained it. It's also how Matt Szulik explained it during his tenure there. I even asked Richard Stallman about that during a lecture in 2007, and he said yup, that's fine by the GPL. So yes, Red Hat remains a dedicated supporter of Free Software, and there is no legal challenge here to make. The CentOS team itself have remarked on the fact that there are no similar clones of SuSE like there are for RHEL. --TP -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jkinney at localnetsolutions.com Mon Mar 16 21:02:49 2009 From: jkinney at localnetsolutions.com (James P. Kinney III) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 17:02:49 -0400 Subject: [K12OSN] K12LTSP/K12Linux 'crusaders' In-Reply-To: <49BEBC93.7030900@cmosnetworks.com> References: <3625113.66231237217899707.JavaMail.root@zimbra.thegeek.nu> <49BEBC93.7030900@cmosnetworks.com> Message-ID: <1237237369.12982.5.camel@merlin.localnetsolutions.com> On Mon, 2009-03-16 at 16:54 -0400, "Terrell Prud? Jr." wrote: > So yes, Red Hat remains a dedicated supporter of Free Software, and > there is no legal challenge here to make. The CentOS team itself have > remarked on the fact that there are no similar clones of SuSE like > there are for RHEL. ...trying to avoid making a snide comment about the desirability of Novell/SuSe... -- James P. Kinney III CEO & Director of Engineering Local Net Solutions,LLC http://www.localnetsolutions.com GPG ID: 829C6CA7 James P. Kinney III (M.S. Physics) Fingerprint = 3C9E 6366 54FC A3FE BA4D 0659 6190 ADC3 829C 6CA7 -- This message has been scanned for viruses and dangerous content by MailScanner, and is believed to be clean. From scott at hosef.org Thu Mar 19 15:46:57 2009 From: scott at hosef.org (R. Scott Belford) Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2009 10:46:57 -0500 Subject: [K12OSN] Perplexing Samba LDAP issue Message-ID: Aloha I am finding myself a bit stumped at the moment by the following error when adding a user to a Centos 4 based samba/ldap/nfs server. [root at localhost ~]# smbldap-useradd alohak12osn Error: context csn exists before context prefix does at /usr/sbin//smbldap_tools.pm line 1187. Things had been fine until a power outage took down the server. I had to do DB recovery to restore LDAP to functionality, but it now seems that something else is corrupted. I've done some searching without luck, yet. I am hoping that one of you have seen or been stumped by this before. Any suggestions would be most appreciated. --scott From reb at taco.com Thu Mar 19 16:09:20 2009 From: reb at taco.com (Phydeaux) Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2009 12:09:20 -0400 Subject: [K12OSN] Support for local USB devices Message-ID: <20090319160922.4ED5E615737@althea.taco.com> Hi! We've still got an issue trying to get USB devices working on our clients. This is becoming a real problem for us. Has anyone else run into this issue or can anyone suggest a fix? Do USB devices work on the clients for anyone else? The bug report is here: https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=484580 reb From rowens at ptd.net Thu Mar 19 16:12:02 2009 From: rowens at ptd.net (Rob Owens) Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2009 12:12:02 -0400 Subject: [K12OSN] Perplexing Samba LDAP issue In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20090319161202.GH5362@aurora.owens.net> On Thu, Mar 19, 2009 at 10:46:57AM -0500, R. Scott Belford wrote: > Aloha > > I am finding myself a bit stumped at the moment by the following error > when adding a user to a Centos 4 based samba/ldap/nfs server. > > [root at localhost ~]# smbldap-useradd alohak12osn > Error: context csn exists before context prefix does at > /usr/sbin//smbldap_tools.pm line 1187. > > Things had been fine until a power outage took down the server. I had > to do DB recovery to restore LDAP to functionality, but it now seems > that something else is corrupted. I've done some searching without > luck, yet. I am hoping that one of you have seen or been stumped by > this before. Any suggestions would be most appreciated. > Just a wild guess: I googled csn and it looks like it's a timestamp of sorts. Is your system time/date correct? The other thing I'd do is check ldap.conf, libnss-ldap.conf, pam_ldap.conf, and nsswitch.conf against your backups to see if they got corrupted. What does line 1187 of smbldap_tools.pm say? Maybe that'll give some clues. -Rob From jthomas at bittware.com Thu Mar 19 16:13:11 2009 From: jthomas at bittware.com (j.w. thomas) Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2009 12:13:11 -0400 Subject: [K12OSN] Documenting the Network Message-ID: <49C26F17.7040006@bittware.com> How do you guys document your networking environment? I am the sole admin of a small system, and it just seems bad practice for the sole repository of all that info to be my head. For one, my head is notoriously unreliable for that sort of thing. Also, it can't be backed up. Right now I have a small setup with a firewall, an ltsp server, five clients, a wireless connection, and a stand-alone workstation. More to come later (printers, more services, etc). I'm planning to fire up an svn server to use as a repo for all the /etc directories on all the machines. I also have a text file with descriptions of every technical detail I could think to put in it: equipment specs, models, location, function, wireless encryption keys, power feeds (i.e., ups or not), ip addresses, services, etc. I intend to draw a network map tonight, and I'm going to print that and the text file out and keep them in the network closet, maybe hanging on the wall. I'm also thinking that I will write the root passwords down on a piece of paper, seal it in an envelope, and put it in the network closet. That might seem like a bad idea, but if they can get in the network closet, they can already pwn the system. A sealed envelope would provide for an easy way to get the info should something happen to me, and would provide a pretty decent indication that the info had been accessed. Kind of an "In case of emergency, break glass" approach. Is there a better way to store all this info? Maybe some software (FLOSS only please) has been written to deal with this already? What do you guys do? -- Jim Thomas Principal Applications Engineer Bittware, Inc jthomas at bittware.com http://www.bittware.com (603) 226-0404 x536 The sooner you get behind, the more time you'll have to catch up From rowens at ptd.net Thu Mar 19 17:05:34 2009 From: rowens at ptd.net (Rob Owens) Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2009 13:05:34 -0400 Subject: [K12OSN] Documenting the Network In-Reply-To: <49C26F17.7040006@bittware.com> References: <49C26F17.7040006@bittware.com> Message-ID: <20090319170534.GI5362@aurora.owens.net> On Thu, Mar 19, 2009 at 12:13:11PM -0400, j.w. thomas wrote: > How do you guys document your networking environment? > > I am the sole admin of a small system, and it just seems bad practice > for the sole repository of all that info to be my head. For one, my > head is notoriously unreliable for that sort of thing. Also, it can't > be backed up. > > Right now I have a small setup with a firewall, an ltsp server, five > clients, a wireless connection, and a stand-alone workstation. More to > come later (printers, more services, etc). > > I'm planning to fire up an svn server to use as a repo for all the /etc > directories on all the machines. I also have a text file with > descriptions of every technical detail I could think to put in it: > equipment specs, models, location, function, wireless encryption keys, > power feeds (i.e., ups or not), ip addresses, services, etc. > I'd use BackupPC to backup all the /etc directories (and /usr/local and whatever else is important to you). -Rob From lesmikesell at gmail.com Thu Mar 19 17:34:14 2009 From: lesmikesell at gmail.com (Les Mikesell) Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2009 12:34:14 -0500 Subject: [K12OSN] Documenting the Network In-Reply-To: <20090319170534.GI5362@aurora.owens.net> References: <49C26F17.7040006@bittware.com> <20090319170534.GI5362@aurora.owens.net> Message-ID: <49C28216.3020308@gmail.com> Rob Owens wrote: > On Thu, Mar 19, 2009 at 12:13:11PM -0400, j.w. thomas wrote: >> How do you guys document your networking environment? >> >> I am the sole admin of a small system, and it just seems bad practice >> for the sole repository of all that info to be my head. For one, my >> head is notoriously unreliable for that sort of thing. Also, it can't >> be backed up. >> >> Right now I have a small setup with a firewall, an ltsp server, five >> clients, a wireless connection, and a stand-alone workstation. More to >> come later (printers, more services, etc). >> >> I'm planning to fire up an svn server to use as a repo for all the /etc >> directories on all the machines. I also have a text file with >> descriptions of every technical detail I could think to put in it: >> equipment specs, models, location, function, wireless encryption keys, >> power feeds (i.e., ups or not), ip addresses, services, etc. >> > I'd use BackupPC to backup all the /etc directories (and /usr/local and > whatever else is important to you). I like the idea of subversion. I've used CVS in the past for my dns files, cisco configs that are tftp'd to a linux server and a few other odds and ends. It is really nice when combined with viewvc (a web interface that will let you browse either cvs or subversion histories, see side-by-side color-coded diffs of any 2 versions, etc.). However it always seemed like too much trouble to turn an existing directory tree (/etc) into a checked-out svn workspace. Maybe that has gotten easier with the current version and the sparse checkout options, though. Has anyone come up with a way to make the files from similar machines appear as branches with a common history? -- Les Mikesell lesmikesell at gmail.com From dhuckaby at paasda.org Thu Mar 19 17:36:33 2009 From: dhuckaby at paasda.org (Huck) Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2009 10:36:33 -0700 Subject: [K12OSN] Documenting the Network In-Reply-To: <20090319170534.GI5362@aurora.owens.net> References: <49C26F17.7040006@bittware.com> <20090319170534.GI5362@aurora.owens.net> Message-ID: <49C282A1.7080301@paasda.org> You might want to check out 'spiceworks'... Rob Owens wrote: > On Thu, Mar 19, 2009 at 12:13:11PM -0400, j.w. thomas wrote: >> How do you guys document your networking environment? >> >> I am the sole admin of a small system, and it just seems bad practice >> for the sole repository of all that info to be my head. For one, my >> head is notoriously unreliable for that sort of thing. Also, it can't >> be backed up. >> >> Right now I have a small setup with a firewall, an ltsp server, five >> clients, a wireless connection, and a stand-alone workstation. More to >> come later (printers, more services, etc). >> >> I'm planning to fire up an svn server to use as a repo for all the /etc >> directories on all the machines. I also have a text file with >> descriptions of every technical detail I could think to put in it: >> equipment specs, models, location, function, wireless encryption keys, >> power feeds (i.e., ups or not), ip addresses, services, etc. >> > I'd use BackupPC to backup all the /etc directories (and /usr/local and > whatever else is important to you). > > -Rob > > _______________________________________________ > K12OSN mailing list > K12OSN at redhat.com > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > For more info see > > From dhuckaby at paasda.org Thu Mar 19 17:41:34 2009 From: dhuckaby at paasda.org (Huck) Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2009 10:41:34 -0700 Subject: [K12OSN] Roaming Profiles Message-ID: <49C283CE.6020404@paasda.org> Have some interesting behavior with roaming profiles I'm looking to correct/change. It appears that when a student logs into a machine a profile is stored locally on each and every machine. If they are logged out and I delete some files manually on the server, the next time they log into a workstation, the files "come back to life" from the profile stored on the local machine. Is there anything detrimental about turning off roaming profiles after it's been in use 3/4 of the year? --Huck From microman at cmosnetworks.com Thu Mar 19 17:48:32 2009 From: microman at cmosnetworks.com (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?=22Terrell_Prud=E9_Jr=2E=22?=) Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2009 13:48:32 -0400 Subject: [K12OSN] Documenting the Network In-Reply-To: <49C26F17.7040006@bittware.com> References: <49C26F17.7040006@bittware.com> Message-ID: <49C28570.1010502@cmosnetworks.com> j.w. thomas wrote: > How do you guys document your networking environment? > > I am the sole admin of a small system, and it just seems bad practice > for the sole repository of all that info to be my head. For one, my > head is notoriously unreliable for that sort of thing. Also, it can't > be backed up. > > Right now I have a small setup with a firewall, an ltsp server, five > clients, a wireless connection, and a stand-alone workstation. More > to come later (printers, more services, etc). > > I'm planning to fire up an svn server to use as a repo for all the > /etc directories on all the machines. I also have a text file with > descriptions of every technical detail I could think to put in it: > equipment specs, models, location, function, wireless encryption keys, > power feeds (i.e., ups or not), ip addresses, services, etc. > > I intend to draw a network map tonight, and I'm going to print that > and the text file out and keep them in the network closet, maybe > hanging on the wall. I'm also thinking that I will write the root > passwords down on a piece of paper, seal it in an envelope, and put it > in the network closet. That might seem like a bad idea, but if they > can get in the network closet, they can already pwn the system. A > sealed envelope would provide for an easy way to get the info should > something happen to me, and would provide a pretty decent indication > that the info had been accessed. Kind of an "In case of emergency, > break glass" approach. > > Is there a better way to store all this info? Maybe some software > (FLOSS only please) has been written to deal with this already? What > do you guys do? > I draw pictures and type up a description. Then this stuff goes in a file labeled "Network Documentation." Yeah, I know, low-tech, but it works very, very well. --TP _______________________________ Do you GNU ? Microsoft Free since 2003 --the ultimate antivirus protection! -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From DLWillson at TheGeek.NU Thu Mar 19 17:52:56 2009 From: DLWillson at TheGeek.NU (David L. Willson) Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2009 11:52:56 -0600 (MDT) Subject: [K12OSN] Documenting the Network In-Reply-To: <49C28570.1010502@cmosnetworks.com> Message-ID: <18759394.71081237485176473.JavaMail.root@zimbra.thegeek.nu> dia can be used to create basic network maps with switches, routers, servers, etc. Not sure if that's already been mentioned or not. I hear Kivio does this sort of thing, too, but I haven't used it. David L. Willson Trainer, Engineer, Enthusiast MCT, MCSE, Linux+ tel://720.333.LANS Freeing people from the tyranny (or whatevery) of Microsofty-ness, one at a time. ----- "\"Terrell Prud? Jr.\"" wrote: > j.w. thomas wrote: > > How do you guys document your networking environment? > > I am the sole admin of a small system, and it just seems bad practice > for the sole repository of all that info to be my head. For one, my > head is notoriously unreliable for that sort of thing. Also, it can't > be backed up. > > Right now I have a small setup with a firewall, an ltsp server, five > clients, a wireless connection, and a stand-alone workstation. More to > come later (printers, more services, etc). > > I'm planning to fire up an svn server to use as a repo for all the > /etc directories on all the machines. I also have a text file with > descriptions of every technical detail I could think to put in it: > equipment specs, models, location, function, wireless encryption keys, > power feeds (i.e., ups or not), ip addresses, services, etc. > > I intend to draw a network map tonight, and I'm going to print that > and the text file out and keep them in the network closet, maybe > hanging on the wall. I'm also thinking that I will write the root > passwords down on a piece of paper, seal it in an envelope, and put it > in the network closet. That might seem like a bad idea, but if they > can get in the network closet, they can already pwn the system. A > sealed envelope would provide for an easy way to get the info should > something happen to me, and would provide a pretty decent indication > that the info had been accessed. Kind of an "In case of emergency, > break glass" approach. > > Is there a better way to store all this info? Maybe some software > (FLOSS only please) has been written to deal with this already? What > do you guys do? > > > > I draw pictures and type up a description. Then this stuff goes in a > file labeled "Network Documentation." Yeah, I know, low-tech, but it > works very, very well. > > --TP > > _______________________________ > Do you GNU ? > Microsoft Free since 2003 --the ultimate antivirus protection! > > > _______________________________________________ > K12OSN mailing list > K12OSN at redhat.com > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > For more info see From rowens at ptd.net Thu Mar 19 18:08:56 2009 From: rowens at ptd.net (Rob Owens) Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2009 14:08:56 -0400 Subject: [K12OSN] Documenting the Network In-Reply-To: <18759394.71081237485176473.JavaMail.root@zimbra.thegeek.nu> References: <49C28570.1010502@cmosnetworks.com> <18759394.71081237485176473.JavaMail.root@zimbra.thegeek.nu> Message-ID: <20090319180856.GA5929@aurora.owens.net> OpenOffice Draw has similar abilities, although I don't know if it's got the same pre-built graphics for routers, etc. -Rob On Thu, Mar 19, 2009 at 11:52:56AM -0600, David L. Willson wrote: > dia can be used to create basic network maps with switches, routers, servers, etc. Not sure if that's already been mentioned or not. I hear Kivio does this sort of thing, too, but I haven't used it. > > David L. Willson > Trainer, Engineer, Enthusiast > MCT, MCSE, Linux+ > tel://720.333.LANS > Freeing people from the tyranny (or whatevery) of Microsofty-ness, one at a time. > > ----- "\"Terrell Prud? Jr.\"" wrote: > > > j.w. thomas wrote: > > > > How do you guys document your networking environment? > > > > I am the sole admin of a small system, and it just seems bad practice > > for the sole repository of all that info to be my head. For one, my > > head is notoriously unreliable for that sort of thing. Also, it can't > > be backed up. > > > > Right now I have a small setup with a firewall, an ltsp server, five > > clients, a wireless connection, and a stand-alone workstation. More to > > come later (printers, more services, etc). > > > > I'm planning to fire up an svn server to use as a repo for all the > > /etc directories on all the machines. I also have a text file with > > descriptions of every technical detail I could think to put in it: > > equipment specs, models, location, function, wireless encryption keys, > > power feeds (i.e., ups or not), ip addresses, services, etc. > > > > I intend to draw a network map tonight, and I'm going to print that > > and the text file out and keep them in the network closet, maybe > > hanging on the wall. I'm also thinking that I will write the root > > passwords down on a piece of paper, seal it in an envelope, and put it > > in the network closet. That might seem like a bad idea, but if they > > can get in the network closet, they can already pwn the system. A > > sealed envelope would provide for an easy way to get the info should > > something happen to me, and would provide a pretty decent indication > > that the info had been accessed. Kind of an "In case of emergency, > > break glass" approach. > > > > Is there a better way to store all this info? Maybe some software > > (FLOSS only please) has been written to deal with this already? What > > do you guys do? > > > > > > > > I draw pictures and type up a description. Then this stuff goes in a > > file labeled "Network Documentation." Yeah, I know, low-tech, but it > > works very, very well. > > > > --TP > > > > _______________________________ > > Do you GNU ? > > Microsoft Free since 2003 --the ultimate antivirus protection! > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > K12OSN mailing list > > K12OSN at redhat.com > > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > > For more info see > > _______________________________________________ > K12OSN mailing list > K12OSN at redhat.com > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > For more info see From DLWillson at TheGeek.NU Thu Mar 19 18:19:09 2009 From: DLWillson at TheGeek.NU (David L. Willson) Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2009 12:19:09 -0600 (MDT) Subject: [K12OSN] Documenting the Network In-Reply-To: <32670497.71161237486654316.JavaMail.root@zimbra.thegeek.nu> Message-ID: <4028252.71181237486748996.JavaMail.root@zimbra.thegeek.nu> Shapes you might need for doing drawings with OO Draw. http://www.lautman.net/mark/coo/index.html --David ----- "Rob Owens" wrote: > OpenOffice Draw has similar abilities, although I don't know if it's > got the same pre-built graphics for routers, etc. > > -Rob > > On Thu, Mar 19, 2009 at 11:52:56AM -0600, David L. Willson wrote: > > dia can be used to create basic network maps with switches, routers, > servers, etc. Not sure if that's already been mentioned or not. I > hear Kivio does this sort of thing, too, but I haven't used it. > > > > David L. Willson > > Trainer, Engineer, Enthusiast > > MCT, MCSE, Linux+ > > tel://720.333.LANS > > Freeing people from the tyranny (or whatevery) of Microsofty-ness, > one at a time. > > > > ----- "\"Terrell Prud? Jr.\"" wrote: > > > > > j.w. thomas wrote: > > > > > > How do you guys document your networking environment? > > > > > > I am the sole admin of a small system, and it just seems bad > practice > > > for the sole repository of all that info to be my head. For one, > my > > > head is notoriously unreliable for that sort of thing. Also, it > can't > > > be backed up. > > > > > > Right now I have a small setup with a firewall, an ltsp server, > five > > > clients, a wireless connection, and a stand-alone workstation. > More to > > > come later (printers, more services, etc). > > > > > > I'm planning to fire up an svn server to use as a repo for all > the > > > /etc directories on all the machines. I also have a text file > with > > > descriptions of every technical detail I could think to put in > it: > > > equipment specs, models, location, function, wireless encryption > keys, > > > power feeds (i.e., ups or not), ip addresses, services, etc. > > > > > > I intend to draw a network map tonight, and I'm going to print > that > > > and the text file out and keep them in the network closet, maybe > > > hanging on the wall. I'm also thinking that I will write the root > > > passwords down on a piece of paper, seal it in an envelope, and > put it > > > in the network closet. That might seem like a bad idea, but if > they > > > can get in the network closet, they can already pwn the system. A > > > sealed envelope would provide for an easy way to get the info > should > > > something happen to me, and would provide a pretty decent > indication > > > that the info had been accessed. Kind of an "In case of > emergency, > > > break glass" approach. > > > > > > Is there a better way to store all this info? Maybe some software > > > (FLOSS only please) has been written to deal with this already? > What > > > do you guys do? > > > > > > > > > > > > I draw pictures and type up a description. Then this stuff goes in > a > > > file labeled "Network Documentation." Yeah, I know, low-tech, but > it > > > works very, very well. > > > > > > --TP > > > > > > _______________________________ > > > Do you GNU ? > > > Microsoft Free since 2003 --the ultimate antivirus protection! > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > K12OSN mailing list > > > K12OSN at redhat.com > > > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > > > For more info see > > > > _______________________________________________ > > K12OSN mailing list > > K12OSN at redhat.com > > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > > For more info see > > _______________________________________________ > K12OSN mailing list > K12OSN at redhat.com > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > For more info see From burke at thealmquists.net Thu Mar 19 22:45:33 2009 From: burke at thealmquists.net (Almquist Burke) Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2009 17:45:33 -0500 Subject: [K12OSN] Roaming Profiles In-Reply-To: <49C283CE.6020404@paasda.org> References: <49C283CE.6020404@paasda.org> Message-ID: <9593DF68-B851-4E05-A21A-B12D19E2EB2C@thealmquists.net> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 It works this way to avoid accidentally deleting a file. Otherwise, it might delete stuff created when you were working "offline" with your laptop. There is a regedit to delete application/browser caches on logoff, so you aren't pulling and pushing them back and forth to the server and taking up server disk space. What files are you trying to delete? This is how you delete the entire roaming profile, http:// www.downloadatoz.com/windows-registry/faq,how-to-delete-roaming- profiles-when-logging-out.html which is useful in someplace like a computer lab with generic logins, but I don't think that is what you are looking for. On Mar 19, 2009, at 12:41 PM, Huck wrote: > Have some interesting behavior with roaming profiles I'm looking to > correct/change. > > It appears that when a student logs into a machine a profile is > stored locally on each and every machine. > > If they are logged out and I delete some files manually on the > server, the next time they log into a workstation, the files "come > back to life" from the profile stored on the local machine. > > Is there anything detrimental about turning off roaming profiles > after it's been in use 3/4 of the year? > > --Huck > > _______________________________________________ > K12OSN mailing list > K12OSN at redhat.com > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > For more info see -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.7 (Darwin) iEYEARECAAYFAknCyw0ACgkQxWV7OPa/g5FTWACfSIBF9Kau9JoBghhnBapWjGvB mtQAn3tjoSz7gYaJrM4GMYkvaWUP22Oq =+jhe -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From willems.leo at googlemail.com Thu Mar 19 23:55:38 2009 From: willems.leo at googlemail.com (Leo Willems) Date: Fri, 20 Mar 2009 07:55:38 +0800 Subject: [K12OSN] =?windows-1252?q?When_Free_Isn=92t_Free=3A_The_realitie?= =?windows-1252?q?s_of_running_open_source_in_school?= Message-ID: <3fabbdc20903191655h311215e3xaec9b002eb47b102@mail.gmail.com> When Free Isn?t Free: The realities of running open source in school http://www.techlearning.com/article/16504 From willems.leo at googlemail.com Thu Mar 19 23:55:39 2009 From: willems.leo at googlemail.com (Leo Willems) Date: Fri, 20 Mar 2009 07:55:39 +0800 Subject: [K12OSN] =?windows-1252?q?When_Free_Isn=92t_Free=3A_The_realitie?= =?windows-1252?q?s_of_running_open_source_in_school?= Message-ID: <3fabbdc20903191655q7e5f5144jaa03479da5b4d9@mail.gmail.com> When Free Isn?t Free: The realities of running open source in school http://www.techlearning.com/article/16504 From scott at hosef.org Fri Mar 20 01:01:34 2009 From: scott at hosef.org (R. Scott Belford) Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2009 20:01:34 -0500 Subject: [K12OSN] Perplexing Samba LDAP issue In-Reply-To: <20090319161202.GH5362@aurora.owens.net> References: <20090319161202.GH5362@aurora.owens.net> Message-ID: On Thu, Mar 19, 2009 at 11:12 AM, Rob Owens wrote: > On Thu, Mar 19, 2009 at 10:46:57AM -0500, R. Scott Belford wrote: >> Aloha >> >> I am finding myself a bit stumped at the moment by the following error >> when adding a user to a Centos 4 based samba/ldap/nfs server. >> >> [root at localhost ~]# smbldap-useradd alohak12osn >> Error: context csn exists before context prefix does at >> /usr/sbin//smbldap_tools.pm line 1187. >> >> Things had been fine until a power outage took down the server. I had >> to do DB recovery to restore LDAP to functionality, but it now seems >> that something else is corrupted. I've done some searching without >> luck, yet. I am hoping that one of you have seen or been stumped by >> this before. Any suggestions would be most appreciated. >> > Just a wild guess: > > I googled csn and it looks like it's a timestamp of sorts. Is your system time/date correct? > > The other thing I'd do is check ldap.conf, libnss-ldap.conf, pam_ldap.conf, and nsswitch.conf against your backups to see if they got corrupted. > > What does line 1187 of smbldap_tools.pm say? Maybe that'll give some clues. Aloha Rob Thanks for the reply. I went offline for the day. Time and date are correct, but, I'll start thinking along those lines. It seems to be something UID related. 1187 is the 5th of the following 5 lines. $nextuid = $entry->get_value($attribute); my $modify = $ldap->modify( "$config{sambaUnixIdPooldn}", changes => [ replace => [ $attribute => $nextuid + 1 ] ] ); $modify->code && die "Error: ", $modify->error; > > -Rob --scott From jthomas at bittware.com Fri Mar 20 04:41:46 2009 From: jthomas at bittware.com (j.w. thomas) Date: Fri, 20 Mar 2009 00:41:46 -0400 Subject: [K12OSN] Documenting the Network In-Reply-To: <49C2759F.4080609@deltacfax.com> References: <49C26F17.7040006@bittware.com> <49C2759F.4080609@deltacfax.com> Message-ID: <49C31E8A.2070603@bittware.com> Tim Born wrote: > Small networks can be noodled using dia (a visio knockoff). > I do what you are describing, with pictures, into a openoffice doc and > keep it near the server console (locked up). > -tim I downloaded dia and have noodled up a diagram. Thanks for the tip. Les Mikesell wrote: > I like the idea of subversion. I've used CVS in the past for my dns > files, cisco configs that are tftp'd to a linux server and a few other > odds and ends. It is really nice when combined with viewvc (a web > interface that will let you browse either cvs or subversion histories, > see side-by-side color-coded diffs of any 2 versions, etc.). > > However it always seemed like too much trouble to turn an existing > directory tree (/etc) into a checked-out svn workspace. Maybe that has > gotten easier with the current version and the sparse checkout options, > though. Has anyone come up with a way to make the files from similar > machines appear as branches with a common history? I don't have that many machines, so I'm not too interested in using branches to manage them. I found some guidance on using svn to manage /etc at http://articles.techrepublic.com.com/5100-10878_11-6142224.html If I'm reading this right (and it's late, so who knows) he keeps a checked-out version of /etc elsewhere and then uses rsync to push the changes. I would much rather have the real version of /etc be the checked out version, but I'm afraid that the only way to do that involves deleting it before doing the checkout. And that's just a /wee/ bit on the scary side. If I were daring enough, here's how I'm thinking I could do it: reboot using a live CD mount /etc make a tarball of etc and put it somewhere safe (just in case) import /etc into svn delete it! check it out via svn. remove live CD reboot weep (for either joy or sorrow) -- Jim Thomas Principal Applications Engineer Bittware, Inc jthomas at bittware.com http://www.bittware.com (603) 226-0404 x536 The sooner you get behind, the more time you'll have to catch up From jkinney at localnetsolutions.com Fri Mar 20 04:46:27 2009 From: jkinney at localnetsolutions.com (James P. Kinney III) Date: Fri, 20 Mar 2009 00:46:27 -0400 Subject: [K12OSN] When Free =?iso-8859-7?Q?Isn=A2t?= Free: The realities of running open source in school In-Reply-To: <3fabbdc20903191655q7e5f5144jaa03479da5b4d9@mail.gmail.com> References: <3fabbdc20903191655q7e5f5144jaa03479da5b4d9@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1237524387.7062.15.camel@merlin.localnetsolutions.com> Looks like another school that tried to run a large Linux installation with Windows admins to me. The greatest challenge to Linux adoption is getting past the FUD spread by articles such as that. There are competent tools to manage a multi-thousand seat installation of Linux. The don't run on windows and are typically not going to be installable by windows admins recently converting to Linux admins. The typical desktop windows user can't run an exchange server either. Most large scale system admins have the skills to craft their own set of scripts to augment the distributions native management tools sets. Simple reset ability such as an overwrite from /etc/skel can solve a huge number of student made environment issues. Changing ownership of all user config files ("dot" files) to be root owned and user readable prevents users from changing settings. Single sign-on is handled by tools that don't involve a windows Active Directory service. LDAP is a main one. But the real clinker in the article was the realization that the school tried to use SuSe Linux. Novell seems to have no interest in helping schools adopt Linux nor will they as long as schools fork out big bucks for Novell licenses. But most importantly, the school system moved faster than their abilities could keep up. Transitioning from to is also fraught with a mountain of issues. Most of those issues are similar to what the article spoke about. The problems that were the exception were the pre-packaged classroom tools near total lack of availability for the Linux environment. Sadly, this is an issue that will not go away until the teachers and schools using Linux craft their own and seed the knowledge bank by publishing their effort using an open source license like Creative Commons or similar so that other Linux-savvy schools can add to the collection. This problem will not be solved by the traditional textbook publisher crowd. We will have to do it ourselves. On Fri, 2009-03-20 at 07:55 +0800, Leo Willems wrote: > When Free Isn?t Free: The realities of running open source in school > > http://www.techlearning.com/article/16504 > > _______________________________________________ > K12OSN mailing list > K12OSN at redhat.com > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > For more info see > -- James P. Kinney III CEO & Director of Engineering Local Net Solutions,LLC http://www.localnetsolutions.com GPG ID: 829C6CA7 James P. Kinney III (M.S. Physics) Fingerprint = 3C9E 6366 54FC A3FE BA4D 0659 6190 ADC3 829C 6CA7 -- This message has been scanned for viruses and dangerous content by MailScanner, and is believed to be clean. From microman at cmosnetworks.com Fri Mar 20 08:35:47 2009 From: microman at cmosnetworks.com (=?windows-1252?Q?=22Terrell_Prud=E9_Jr=2E=22?=) Date: Fri, 20 Mar 2009 04:35:47 -0400 Subject: [K12OSN] When Free =?windows-1252?Q?Isn=92t_Free=3A_The_?= =?windows-1252?Q?realities_of_running_open_source_in_school?= In-Reply-To: <3fabbdc20903191655h311215e3xaec9b002eb47b102@mail.gmail.com> References: <3fabbdc20903191655h311215e3xaec9b002eb47b102@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <49C35563.7030303@cmosnetworks.com> Man, this could've been written by a Microsoft employee! So full of crap masquerading as truth.... Actually, managing many UNIX/Linux machines is quite easy. UNIX administrators have been doing it for over 20 years! It's not that hard. Matter of fact, I use a GNU/Linux machine to manage approximately 300 Cisco routers and over 50 GNU/Linux boxes. I can blow pretty much any change I want to all 300 routers in about two minutes. Same for the GNU/Linux boxes. And I do it all with little "batch files", to use the Microsoft term. And the obvious SuSE bias was rather disgusting to me, since Novell became a Microsoft whore. Debian's been a much better choice anyway ever since Etch, and we already know about Ubuntu LTS. Heck, my Dad runs K12LTSP 5EL as a workstation and likes it. But what struck me most about this article was that it is also a great treatise for *NOT* letting yourself get locked in to Microsoft in the first place. Check out that section regarding "templates, training, and curriculum built around Microsoft Office." Schools should build their curricula around *concepts*, not specific applications. This kind of mentality is why my high school intern, intelligent as he is, cannot do long division! Can you believe that? This brilliant kid CANNOT DO STANDARD LONG DIVISION! HE WAS NEVER TAUGHT IT!! It's that mentality that keeps us behind in the world. --TP _______________________________ Do you GNU ? Microsoft Free since 2003 --the ultimate antivirus protection! Leo Willems wrote: > When Free Isn?t Free: The realities of running open source in school > > http://www.techlearning.com/article/16504 > > _______________________________________________ > K12OSN mailing list > K12OSN at redhat.com > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > For more info see > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From willems.leo at googlemail.com Fri Mar 20 08:49:29 2009 From: willems.leo at googlemail.com (Leo Willems) Date: Fri, 20 Mar 2009 16:49:29 +0800 Subject: =?windows-1252?Q?Re=3A_=5BK12OSN=5D_When_Free_Isn=92t_Free=3A_The_realities_o?= =?windows-1252?Q?f_running_open_source_in_school?= In-Reply-To: <49C35563.7030303@cmosnetworks.com> References: <3fabbdc20903191655h311215e3xaec9b002eb47b102@mail.gmail.com> <49C35563.7030303@cmosnetworks.com> Message-ID: <3fabbdc20903200149t499e99d1q52249644e856792a@mail.gmail.com> Yes, to blame to content (data) as reason to not use free software is quite lame. From jthomas at bittware.com Fri Mar 20 12:45:54 2009 From: jthomas at bittware.com (j.w. thomas) Date: Fri, 20 Mar 2009 08:45:54 -0400 Subject: [K12OSN] When Free =?ISO-8859-7?Q?Isn=A2t_Free=3A_The_?= =?ISO-8859-7?Q?realities_of_running_open_source_in_school?= In-Reply-To: <1237524387.7062.15.camel@merlin.localnetsolutions.com> References: <3fabbdc20903191655q7e5f5144jaa03479da5b4d9@mail.gmail.com> <1237524387.7062.15.camel@merlin.localnetsolutions.com> Message-ID: <49C39002.3050000@bittware.com> James P. Kinney III wrote: > The problems that were the exception were the pre-packaged classroom > tools near total lack of availability for the Linux environment. Sadly, > this is an issue that will not go away until the teachers and schools > using Linux craft their own and seed the knowledge bank by publishing > their effort using an open source license like Creative Commons or > similar so that other Linux-savvy schools can add to the collection. > This problem will not be solved by the traditional textbook publisher > crowd. We will have to do it ourselves. Check out http://en.wikibooks.org - that's a project set up to do exactly that. Wikibooks is a sister of the better-known Wikipedia, and run by the same organization (The WikiMedia Foundation) on the same servers. If anyone out there wants to scratch that itch, you don't have to create your own infrastructure to do it. Several of the books hosted there have been created as class assignments, though these are most often at the university level. -- Jim Thomas Principal Applications Engineer Bittware, Inc jthomas at bittware.com http://www.bittware.com (603) 226-0404 x536 The sooner you get behind, the more time you'll have to catch up From jthomas at bittware.com Fri Mar 20 12:48:39 2009 From: jthomas at bittware.com (j.w. thomas) Date: Fri, 20 Mar 2009 08:48:39 -0400 Subject: [K12OSN] Documenting the Network In-Reply-To: <49C31E8A.2070603@bittware.com> References: <49C26F17.7040006@bittware.com> <49C2759F.4080609@deltacfax.com> <49C31E8A.2070603@bittware.com> Message-ID: <49C390A7.3060603@bittware.com> j.w. thomas wrote: > reboot using a live CD > mount /etc > make a tarball of etc and put it somewhere safe (just in case) > import /etc into svn > delete it! On second thought, it would be safer to move /etc aside instead of deleting it. Wouldn't really need the tarball in that case. > check it out via svn. > remove live CD > reboot > weep (for either joy or sorrow) > -- Jim Thomas Principal Applications Engineer Bittware, Inc jthomas at bittware.com http://www.bittware.com (603) 226-0404 x536 The sooner you get behind, the more time you'll have to catch up From lesmikesell at gmail.com Fri Mar 20 13:08:16 2009 From: lesmikesell at gmail.com (Les Mikesell) Date: Fri, 20 Mar 2009 08:08:16 -0500 Subject: [K12OSN] Documenting the Network In-Reply-To: <49C390A7.3060603@bittware.com> References: <49C26F17.7040006@bittware.com> <49C2759F.4080609@deltacfax.com> <49C31E8A.2070603@bittware.com> <49C390A7.3060603@bittware.com> Message-ID: <49C39540.20000@gmail.com> j.w. thomas wrote: > j.w. thomas wrote: >> reboot using a live CD >> mount /etc >> make a tarball of etc and put it somewhere safe (just in case) >> import /etc into svn >> delete it! > > On second thought, it would be safer to move /etc aside instead of > deleting it. Wouldn't really need the tarball in that case. > >> check it out via svn. >> remove live CD >> reboot >> weep (for either joy or sorrow) No, it isn't that drastic - just some extra steps. The old way was: http://subversion.tigris.org/faq.html#in-place-import But I think there may be an even easier way now http://subversion.tigris.org/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=1328 (although you'd need the current subversion pacakage from rpmforge instead of the stock centos version. And in any case you'll want viewvc or a similar web viewer for easier access. -- Les Mikesell lesmikesell at gmail.com From jkinney at localnetsolutions.com Fri Mar 20 13:24:25 2009 From: jkinney at localnetsolutions.com (James P. Kinney III) Date: Fri, 20 Mar 2009 09:24:25 -0400 Subject: [K12OSN] When Free =?iso-8859-7?Q?Isn=A2t?= Free: The realities of running open source in school In-Reply-To: <49C39002.3050000@bittware.com> References: <3fabbdc20903191655q7e5f5144jaa03479da5b4d9@mail.gmail.com> <1237524387.7062.15.camel@merlin.localnetsolutions.com> <49C39002.3050000@bittware.com> Message-ID: <1237555465.3940.2.camel@merlin.localnetsolutions.com> On Fri, 2009-03-20 at 08:45 -0400, j.w. thomas wrote: > Check out http://en.wikibooks.org - that's a project set up to do > exactly that. Wikibooks is a sister of the better-known Wikipedia, and > run by the same organization (The WikiMedia Foundation) on the same > servers. > > If anyone out there wants to scratch that itch, you don't have to create > your own infrastructure to do it. > > Several of the books hosted there have been created as class > assignments, though these are most often at the university level. And MIT has (nearly) all of their coursework online and free. There is also a growing number of free textbook sites as well. Most of these are written by college profs fed up with the textbook industry practices. It's all good! 40 years from now we will all look back and wonder why the transition to free(dom) software and free(dom) knowledge took so long. -- James P. Kinney III CEO & Director of Engineering Local Net Solutions,LLC http://www.localnetsolutions.com GPG ID: 829C6CA7 James P. Kinney III (M.S. Physics) Fingerprint = 3C9E 6366 54FC A3FE BA4D 0659 6190 ADC3 829C 6CA7 -- This message has been scanned for viruses and dangerous content by MailScanner, and is believed to be clean. From francois.patte at mi.parisdescartes.fr Fri Mar 20 14:30:23 2009 From: francois.patte at mi.parisdescartes.fr (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Fran=E7ois_Patte?=) Date: Fri, 20 Mar 2009 15:30:23 +0100 Subject: [K12OSN] Enabling local thin client hard drive Message-ID: <49C3A87F.9070700@mi.parisdescartes.fr> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Bonjour, I try to enable the hard drive of my laptop which I booted as a TC. Following: http://www.ltsp.org/~sbalneav/LTSPManual.html#id2539065 I added in /opt/ltsp/i386/etc/udev/rules.d/88-ltspfd.rule <---quote On older versions of LTSP5, you'll want to add a line that looks like the following: ACTION=="add", SUBSYSTEM=="block", ENV{ID_TYPE}=="disk", \ ATTRS{removable}!="1", RUN+="add_fstab_entry %k" On more recent versions, you'll want a line like the following: ACTION=="add", SUBSYSTEM=="block", ENV{ID_TYPE}=="disk", \ ATTRS{removable}!="1", RUN+="ltspfs_entry add %k" <----end quote I tried both.... rebuilt image and.... nothing has changed...... So what is the trick to see and mount the hd of my laptop. Thanks for helping. - -- Fran?ois Patte UFR de math?matiques et informatique Universit? Paris Descartes 45, rue des Saints P?res F-75270 Paris Cedex 06 T?l. +33 (0)1 4286 2413 http://www.math-info.univ-paris5.fr/~patte -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.9 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Fedora - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iEYEARECAAYFAknDqH8ACgkQdE6C2dhV2JVFvwCeLSQ/6Vzcb9InykNOoP6RfcKQ BDMAoKeUWFNKWCaluSXT5G4n1IOjA1V3 =p2Gt -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From rowens at ptd.net Fri Mar 20 15:28:00 2009 From: rowens at ptd.net (Rob Owens) Date: Fri, 20 Mar 2009 11:28:00 -0400 Subject: [K12OSN] Perplexing Samba LDAP issue In-Reply-To: References: <20090319161202.GH5362@aurora.owens.net> Message-ID: <20090320152800.GB9281@aurora.owens.net> On Thu, Mar 19, 2009 at 08:01:34PM -0500, R. Scott Belford wrote: > On Thu, Mar 19, 2009 at 11:12 AM, Rob Owens wrote: > > On Thu, Mar 19, 2009 at 10:46:57AM -0500, R. Scott Belford wrote: > >> Aloha > >> > >> I am finding myself a bit stumped at the moment by the following error > >> when adding a user to a Centos 4 based samba/ldap/nfs server. > >> > >> [root at localhost ~]# smbldap-useradd alohak12osn > >> Error: context csn exists before context prefix does at > >> /usr/sbin//smbldap_tools.pm line 1187. > >> > >> Things had been fine until a power outage took down the server. I had > >> to do DB recovery to restore LDAP to functionality, but it now seems > >> that something else is corrupted. I've done some searching without > >> luck, yet. I am hoping that one of you have seen or been stumped by > >> this before. Any suggestions would be most appreciated. > >> > > Just a wild guess: > > > > I googled csn and it looks like it's a timestamp of sorts. Is your system time/date correct? > > > > The other thing I'd do is check ldap.conf, libnss-ldap.conf, pam_ldap.conf, and nsswitch.conf against your backups to see if they got corrupted. > > > > What does line 1187 of smbldap_tools.pm say? Maybe that'll give some clues. > > Aloha Rob > > Thanks for the reply. I went offline for the day. Time and date are > correct, but, I'll start thinking along those lines. > > It seems to be something UID related. 1187 is the 5th of the following 5 lines. > > $nextuid = $entry->get_value($attribute); > my $modify = > $ldap->modify( "$config{sambaUnixIdPooldn}", > changes => [ replace => [ $attribute => $nextuid + 1 ] ] ); > $modify->code && die "Error: ", $modify->error; > Hmm, I think this is over my head. Do you have multiple backups of the DB? If so, maybe try restoring an older one as a test and see if you get the same problem. Also, just out of superstition, I'd try adding a user with a different name and see if you get the same results. One more thing: what if you try specifying the UID manually when adding a user? -Rob From scott at hosef.org Fri Mar 20 15:47:37 2009 From: scott at hosef.org (R. Scott Belford) Date: Fri, 20 Mar 2009 10:47:37 -0500 Subject: [K12OSN] Perplexing Samba LDAP issue In-Reply-To: <20090320152800.GB9281@aurora.owens.net> References: <20090319161202.GH5362@aurora.owens.net> <20090320152800.GB9281@aurora.owens.net> Message-ID: On Fri, Mar 20, 2009 at 10:28 AM, Rob Owens wrote: > On Thu, Mar 19, 2009 at 08:01:34PM -0500, R. Scott Belford wrote: >> On Thu, Mar 19, 2009 at 11:12 AM, Rob Owens wrote: >> > On Thu, Mar 19, 2009 at 10:46:57AM -0500, R. Scott Belford wrote: >> >> Aloha >> >> >> >> I am finding myself a bit stumped at the moment by the following error >> >> when adding a user to a Centos 4 based samba/ldap/nfs server. >> >> >> >> [root at localhost ~]# smbldap-useradd alohak12osn >> >> Error: context csn exists before context prefix does at >> >> /usr/sbin//smbldap_tools.pm line 1187. >> >> >> >> Things had been fine until a power outage took down the server. I had >> >> to do DB recovery to restore LDAP to functionality, but it now seems >> >> that something else is corrupted. I've done some searching without >> >> luck, yet. I am hoping that one of you have seen or been stumped by >> >> this before. Any suggestions would be most appreciated. >> >> >> > Just a wild guess: >> > >> > I googled csn and it looks like it's a timestamp of sorts. Is your system time/date correct? >> > >> > The other thing I'd do is check ldap.conf, libnss-ldap.conf, pam_ldap.conf, and nsswitch.conf against your backups to see if they got corrupted. >> > >> > What does line 1187 of smbldap_tools.pm say? Maybe that'll give some clues. >> >> Aloha Rob >> >> Thanks for the reply. I went offline for the day. Time and date are >> correct, but, I'll start thinking along those lines. >> >> It seems to be something UID related. 1187 is the 5th of the following 5 lines. >> >> $nextuid = $entry->get_value($attribute); >> my $modify = >> $ldap->modify( "$config{sambaUnixIdPooldn}", >> changes => [ replace => [ $attribute => $nextuid + 1 ] ] ); >> $modify->code && die "Error: ", $modify->error; >> > Hmm, I think this is over my head. Do you have multiple backups of the DB? If so, maybe try restoring an older one as a test and see if you get the same > problem. Also, just out of superstition, I'd try adding a user with a different name and see if you get the same results. One more thing: what if you > try specifying the UID manually when adding a user? It is one of those things that will prove elementary once I figure it out. This weekend I'll do some kludging with backups to see what variables emerge. Thanks for the pointers and insight, Rob. > > -Rob --scott From julius at turtle.com Fri Mar 20 17:36:22 2009 From: julius at turtle.com (Julius Szelagiewicz) Date: Fri, 20 Mar 2009 13:36:22 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [K12OSN] perplexing issue with 64bit flash Message-ID: Dear Folks, I've run into a really strange issue with 64bit flash: On three AMD based 64 bit machines (K12 Cenos 5, updated to the latest) I have installed the 64bit Flash from Adobe. On machine A (my little test server) it runs like a charm, on machine B (my home server) it runs some stuff (Youtube), but not other (NYTimes), on machine C (production server, where i really need it) it doesn't run at all. I see no error messages anywhere. The software releases are the same on all three machines. Any ideas? Thanks, julius From reb at taco.com Fri Mar 20 16:34:16 2009 From: reb at taco.com (Phydeaux) Date: Fri, 20 Mar 2009 12:34:16 -0400 Subject: [K12OSN] Support for local USB devices In-Reply-To: <20090319160922.4ED5E615737@althea.taco.com> References: <20090319160922.4ED5E615737@althea.taco.com> Message-ID: <20090320201556.B3A30615B47@althea.taco.com> At 12:09 PM 03/19/09, Phydeaux wrote: >We've still got an issue trying to get USB devices working on our clients. >This is becoming a real problem for us. Has anyone else run into this >issue or can anyone suggest a fix? Do USB devices work on the clients >for anyone else? The bug report is here: > >https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=484580 Thanks to the rousing number of replies on this, zero, I have to ask whether anyone actually has this working or has even _tried_ USB devices on thin clients. From steve.smith at ntschools.net Fri Mar 20 21:11:39 2009 From: steve.smith at ntschools.net (steve smith) Date: Sat, 21 Mar 2009 06:41:39 +0930 Subject: [K12OSN] RE: Support for local USB devices Message-ID: <4B3F7121BDFC90419FD2020E952CE8A2F0091B11F8@DRWNT-EV1A.ntschools.net> Reb We haven't had any issues with usb devices as yet, but we have not implemented ltsp5 on fc 10 as yet. Started building a server with fc10 today, when we get it up and going I'll check out usb devices and get back to you. We are currently running ltsp5 on fc9 in our most up to date setup, with ltsp4.2 on fc8 in most. Steve ________________________________________ From steve.smith at ntschools.net Fri Mar 20 21:45:05 2009 From: steve.smith at ntschools.net (steve smith) Date: Sat, 21 Mar 2009 07:15:05 +0930 Subject: [K12OSN] choosing a distribution Message-ID: <4B3F7121BDFC90419FD2020E952CE8A2F0091B11F9@DRWNT-EV1A.ntschools.net> Hi all have been following the list for quite a while, and thought I would offer my 2 bobs worth on the issue of choosing a linux distro to use for ltsp. Have seen many comments encouraging [or otherwise] the use of centos, fedora suse etc. Just wished to share my/our experience with ltsp , th distro we use, and the reasons why. We are an average size secondary school in Darwin, I am the senior in charge of the schools itc infrastructure, and some decisions had to made for economic reasons as to how to keep access available to as many students as possible to computers. We decided to employ ltsp [on fedora 6] and were able to show the ability to utilise all the old computers [up to 12 years old], including the i-macs, g3's and 486's to again have complete sets of computers working for classes. As a result instead of only 50 machines in 2 rooms, we now have over 300 machines spread around the school. And yes, we have a mixed infrastructure..windows..aplple osX...and now linux. So we teach the students skills not product, and some of their first classes are spent solely on network navigation and access to server directories. It is satisfying to see students able to work on the same task regardless of the platform and operating system. Where possible we provide the same software on all platforms, but don't force the use..students learn to make cjhoices. As for using fedora, we decided to use three year cycles on each server..install a distro, do the configs, keep the updates going till they stop. In the interim we investigate the state of the old boxes used for thin clients, and have developed a plan to keep up with the advancing hardware in discarded computers, and advances in industry standard software.[msoft] utilised in our school environment. For the advances in ltsp on fedora I would really like to extend a great deal of thanks to Warren and the team for making our plan workable. To date we have just retired our last fc6 server, and now running 2 fc8 servers ltsp4.2 (2 yrs old), and implemented one fc9 server ltsp5 for investigation. We are not going to utilise fc9 for long due to department implementing office 2007 so are building a trial server, as I write, utising fc10. This is mainly to obtain openoffice 3.x whicjh can handle .docx extensions. Once the trial build is configured, we will do away with the fc9, and put in fc10 ltsp5. The choice is arbitary, however we have had to give consideration to internal hardware of the the thin clients. Some are too old to run from ltsp5, so 4.2 on fc8 will do untile we retire the old clients [another year or 2], and we'll stay with fc10 until it has itas three year span. I don't have a crystal ball, so in three years we'll see where we are. We have been doing this in a fairly hostile computing environment, however students appreciate being able to log in anywhere on anything, and keep working on their tasks, staff are slowly coming to accept what we have, the difficulty is the department of ed. just my 2 bobs worth Steve From rowens at ptd.net Fri Mar 20 23:34:37 2009 From: rowens at ptd.net (Rob Owens) Date: Fri, 20 Mar 2009 19:34:37 -0400 Subject: [K12OSN] Support for local USB devices In-Reply-To: <20090320201556.B3A30615B47@althea.taco.com> References: <20090319160922.4ED5E615737@althea.taco.com> <20090320201556.B3A30615B47@althea.taco.com> Message-ID: <20090320233437.GB10048@aurora.owens.net> On Fri, Mar 20, 2009 at 12:34:16PM -0400, Phydeaux wrote: > At 12:09 PM 03/19/09, Phydeaux wrote: > >We've still got an issue trying to get USB devices working on our clients. > >This is becoming a real problem for us. Has anyone else run into this > >issue or can anyone suggest a fix? Do USB devices work on the clients > >for anyone else? The bug report is here: > > > >https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=484580 > > Thanks to the rousing number of replies on this, zero, I have to ask whether > anyone actually has this working or has even _tried_ USB devices on thin > clients. > USB devices worked for me on K12LTSP 5EL (CentOS 5 w/ LTSP 4.2). I haven't tried K12Linux (Fedora w/ LTSP 5). I have used LTSP 5 on Debian and USB devices worked there. -Rob From peter at scheie.homedns.org Sat Mar 21 01:29:35 2009 From: peter at scheie.homedns.org (Peter Scheie) Date: Fri, 20 Mar 2009 20:29:35 -0500 Subject: [K12OSN] Support for local USB devices In-Reply-To: <20090320233437.GB10048@aurora.owens.net> References: <20090319160922.4ED5E615737@althea.taco.com> <20090320201556.B3A30615B47@althea.taco.com> <20090320233437.GB10048@aurora.owens.net> Message-ID: <49C442FF.6010301@scheie.homedns.org> Rob Owens wrote: > On Fri, Mar 20, 2009 at 12:34:16PM -0400, Phydeaux wrote: >> At 12:09 PM 03/19/09, Phydeaux wrote: >>> We've still got an issue trying to get USB devices working on our clients. >>> This is becoming a real problem for us. Has anyone else run into this >>> issue or can anyone suggest a fix? Do USB devices work on the clients >>> for anyone else? The bug report is here: >>> >>> https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=484580 >> Thanks to the rousing number of replies on this, zero, I have to ask whether >> anyone actually has this working or has even _tried_ USB devices on thin >> clients. >> > USB devices worked for me on K12LTSP 5EL (CentOS 5 w/ LTSP 4.2). I haven't tried K12Linux (Fedora w/ LTSP 5). > > I have used LTSP 5 on Debian and USB devices worked there. > > -Rob > USB sticks work fine on my K12Linux (F10 & LTSP 5) system. I'm using old Dell Latitude laptops for the clients, and cheap no-name USB sticks. What are you using? Peter From dahopkins429 at gmail.com Sat Mar 21 13:25:22 2009 From: dahopkins429 at gmail.com (David Hopkins) Date: Sat, 21 Mar 2009 09:25:22 -0400 Subject: [K12OSN] perplexing issue with 64bit flash In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Not a solution, but have you checked to see exactly what packages are different between the systems? I've tried using rpm -q -a > rpm.out on different systems and diff'ing the output to check that I have servers configured identically. Sincerely, Dave Hopkins On Fri, Mar 20, 2009 at 1:36 PM, Julius Szelagiewicz wrote: > Dear Folks, > ? ? ? ?I've run into a really strange issue with 64bit flash: On three > AMD based 64 bit machines (K12 Cenos 5, updated to the latest) I have > installed the 64bit Flash from Adobe. On machine A (my little test server) > it runs like a charm, on machine B (my home server) it runs some stuff > (Youtube), but not other (NYTimes), on machine C (production server, where > i really need it) it doesn't run at all. I see no error messages anywhere. > The software releases are the same on all three machines. Any ideas? > Thanks, julius > From accessys at smart.net Sat Mar 21 14:06:18 2009 From: accessys at smart.net (Accessys@smart.net) Date: Sat, 21 Mar 2009 09:06:18 -0500 (EST) Subject: [K12OSN] perplexing issue with 64bit flash In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: my new laptop with 64 bit Ubuntu on it should be here this week and will be able to check out some of these issues. Bob On Sat, 21 Mar 2009, David Hopkins wrote: > Not a solution, but have you checked to see exactly what packages are > different between the systems? I've tried using rpm -q -a > rpm.out > on different systems and diff'ing the output to check that I have > servers configured identically. > > Sincerely, > Dave Hopkins > > > On Fri, Mar 20, 2009 at 1:36 PM, Julius Szelagiewicz wrote: > > Dear Folks, > > ? ? ? ?I've run into a really strange issue with 64bit flash: On three > > AMD based 64 bit machines (K12 Cenos 5, updated to the latest) I have > > installed the 64bit Flash from Adobe. On machine A (my little test server) > > it runs like a charm, on machine B (my home server) it runs some stuff > > (Youtube), but not other (NYTimes), on machine C (production server, where > > i really need it) it doesn't run at all. I see no error messages anywhere. > > The software releases are the same on all three machines. Any ideas? > > Thanks, julius > > > > _______________________________________________ > K12OSN mailing list > K12OSN at redhat.com > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > For more info see > - end ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ occasionally a true patriot must defend his country from its' government +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ "They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve Neither liberty nor safety", Benjamin Franklin - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - ASCII Ribbon Campaign. . . . . . . . . . . . accessBob .NO HTML/PDF/RTF/MIME in e-mail. . . . . . . accessys at smartnospam.net .NO MSWord docs in e-mail . . . .. . . . . . Access Systems, engineers .NO attachments in e-mail, .*LINUX powered*. access is a civil right *#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*# THIS message and any attachments are CONFIDENTIAL and may be privileged. They are intended ONLY for the individual or entity named From joseph.bishay at gmail.com Sat Mar 21 15:03:38 2009 From: joseph.bishay at gmail.com (Joseph Bishay) Date: Sat, 21 Mar 2009 11:03:38 -0400 Subject: [K12OSN] Default iptables? Message-ID: Hello, I hope everyone is doing well. I was working on our network late last night (a bunch of kids managed to wreck it by randomly unplugging switches, network cables, and causing general chaos) and in my aggravation I flushed the iptables rules on the LTSP server. I noticed there was a problem when the network card that the clients run off no longer connected to the switch. Can anyone provide me with a default K12Linux (Fedora 10) iptables-save dump that I can use to restore the rules please? It's a stock installation where it attaches eth0 to the ltspbr0. I am HOPING that solves the problem with the NIC -- I don't know what else to do as that was the only anomaly. Thank you Joseph From francois.patte at mi.parisdescartes.fr Sat Mar 21 15:09:09 2009 From: francois.patte at mi.parisdescartes.fr (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Fran=E7ois_Patte?=) Date: Sat, 21 Mar 2009 16:09:09 +0100 Subject: [K12OSN] Enabling local thin client hard drive In-Reply-To: <49C3A87F.9070700@mi.parisdescartes.fr> References: <49C3A87F.9070700@mi.parisdescartes.fr> Message-ID: <49C50315.2060309@mi.parisdescartes.fr> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Nobody knows? Never try to do something like this? I would like to know. Thanks Le 20/03/2009 15:30, Fran?ois Patte a ?crit : > Bonjour, > > I try to enable the hard drive of my laptop which I booted as a TC. > > Following: > http://www.ltsp.org/~sbalneav/LTSPManual.html#id2539065 > > I added in /opt/ltsp/i386/etc/udev/rules.d/88-ltspfd.rule > > <---quote > On older versions of LTSP5, you'll want to add a line that looks like > the following: > > ACTION=="add", SUBSYSTEM=="block", ENV{ID_TYPE}=="disk", \ > ATTRS{removable}!="1", RUN+="add_fstab_entry %k" > > > On more recent versions, you'll want a line like the following: > > ACTION=="add", SUBSYSTEM=="block", ENV{ID_TYPE}=="disk", \ > ATTRS{removable}!="1", RUN+="ltspfs_entry add %k" > <----end quote > > I tried both.... rebuilt image and.... nothing has changed...... > > So what is the trick to see and mount the hd of my laptop. > > Thanks for helping. > > _______________________________________________ K12OSN mailing list K12OSN at redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn For more info see - -- ********************************************** Note: les adresses ?lectroniques vont changer. D'ores et d?j? vous pouvez utiliser: francois.patte at mi.parisdescartes.fr ********************************************** - -- Fran?ois Patte UFR de math?matiques et informatique Universit? Paris Descartes 45, rue des Saints P?res F-75270 Paris Cedex 06 T?l. +33 (0)1 4286 2413 http://www.math-info.univ-paris5.fr/~patte -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.9 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Fedora - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iEYEARECAAYFAknFAxQACgkQdE6C2dhV2JUPPwCgnldtqPmTx1hWl9iLd/im/g3A KzEAn0OOFmYEVtFOfmsT5xVjPMYxB03S =43YI -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From brcisna at eazylivin.net Sat Mar 21 15:22:48 2009 From: brcisna at eazylivin.net (Barry R Cisna) Date: Sat, 21 Mar 2009 10:22:48 -0500 Subject: [K12OSN] Default iptables? Message-ID: <1237648968.5328.11.camel@localhost.localdomain> Hi Joseph, >From what I understand you can not get any TC's to boot up correctly now? First do an 'service iptables stop' , as root. This will stop iptables altogether. Boot a couple TC's now and make sure your TC's are at least able to boot up correctly at this point. After you make sure they will boot Ok here.next a good thing to do is install Webmin,on your server and drill to "Network> Linux firewall" in Webmin. Select the one option of default to reject all, this option builds a nice firewall for the server that will work nicely with k12ltsp/k12linux,then start adding ports that needs to come in from the internet and to clients. This will take a lot of the error prone-ness out of setting up iptables. Voice of experience talking here :-) Make sure after this you start the 'iptables-k12ltsp'if this is setup on the server?. to allow all traffic as trusted to the TC's side of your network You should be golden at this point! Take Care, Barry From joseph.bishay at gmail.com Sat Mar 21 15:47:43 2009 From: joseph.bishay at gmail.com (Joseph Bishay) Date: Sat, 21 Mar 2009 11:47:43 -0400 Subject: [K12OSN] Default iptables? In-Reply-To: <1237648968.5328.11.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <1237648968.5328.11.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: Hello, Since I'm remote from the server and only have SSH access I can follow your instructions on service iptables stop but is there a way to test if a terminal boots remotely? The other part of your instructions that makes me a bit nervous is the 'start adding ports that need to come in from the internet and to clients." I have no idea what ports are needed or aren't needed :) I assume you're suppose to let everything in and out on the thin client network card, but on the Internet-facing NIC is there a standard "let these through, don't let those through" list? Thank you Joseph On Sat, Mar 21, 2009 at 11:22 AM, Barry R Cisna wrote: > Hi Joseph, > > >From what I understand you can not get any TC's to boot up correctly > now? First do an 'service iptables stop' , as root. This will stop > iptables altogether. Boot a couple TC's now and make sure your TC's are > at least able to boot up correctly at this point. > ?After you make sure they will boot Ok here.next a good thing to do is > install Webmin,on your server and drill to "Network> Linux firewall" in > Webmin. Select the one option of default to reject all, this option > builds a nice firewall for the server that will work nicely with > k12ltsp/k12linux,then start adding ports that needs to come in from the > internet and to clients. This will take a lot of the error prone-ness > out of setting up iptables. Voice of experience talking here :-) > Make sure after this you start the 'iptables-k12ltsp'if this is setup on > the server?. to allow all traffic as trusted to the TC's side of your > network > You should be golden at this point! > > Take Care, > Barry > > > > _______________________________________________ > K12OSN mailing list > K12OSN at redhat.com > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > For more info see > From k12ltsp at rwcinc.net Sat Mar 21 16:11:45 2009 From: k12ltsp at rwcinc.net (Patrick Fleming) Date: Sat, 21 Mar 2009 09:11:45 -0700 Subject: [K12OSN] Default iptables? In-Reply-To: References: <1237648968.5328.11.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <49C511C1.20603@rwcinc.net> Joseph Bishay wrote: > Hello, > > Since I'm remote from the server and only have SSH access I can follow > your instructions on service iptables stop but is there a way to test > if a terminal boots remotely? Speaking from experience - you may not want to muck around with iptables remotely. When you break it you will have to go down and visit the console. In this case, I would reboot the server (I know Linux doesn't really need to be rebooted except in certain situations, but this way you know exactly what is running when it comes back up) Then check iptables -L to see what the rules are, verify that you have forwarding on cat /proc/sys/net/ipv4/ip_forward should output "1" or sysctl net.ipv4.ip_forward should output net.ipv4.ip_forward = 1 And last I would make sure that the interfaces are truly up. ifconfig eth0, ifconfig eth1, etc. and see if you can ping at least one hop out from the interface on the server. The other thing - are you sure you got everything plugged back in right? > > The other part of your instructions that makes me a bit nervous is the > 'start adding ports that need to come in from the internet and to > clients." I have no idea what ports are needed or aren't needed :) I > assume you're suppose to let everything in and out on the thin client > network card, but on the Internet-facing NIC is there a standard "let > these through, don't let those through" list? > > Thank you > Joseph > > On Sat, Mar 21, 2009 at 11:22 AM, Barry R Cisna wrote: >> Hi Joseph, >> >> >From what I understand you can not get any TC's to boot up correctly >> now? First do an 'service iptables stop' , as root. This will stop >> iptables altogether. Boot a couple TC's now and make sure your TC's are >> at least able to boot up correctly at this point. >> After you make sure they will boot Ok here.next a good thing to do is >> install Webmin,on your server and drill to "Network> Linux firewall" in >> Webmin. Select the one option of default to reject all, this option >> builds a nice firewall for the server that will work nicely with >> k12ltsp/k12linux,then start adding ports that needs to come in from the >> internet and to clients. This will take a lot of the error prone-ness >> out of setting up iptables. Voice of experience talking here :-) >> Make sure after this you start the 'iptables-k12ltsp'if this is setup on >> the server?. to allow all traffic as trusted to the TC's side of your >> network >> You should be golden at this point! >> >> Take Care, >> Barry >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> K12OSN mailing list >> K12OSN at redhat.com >> https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn >> For more info see >> > > _______________________________________________ > K12OSN mailing list > K12OSN at redhat.com > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > For more info see > From brcisna at eazylivin.net Sat Mar 21 17:25:59 2009 From: brcisna at eazylivin.net (Barry R Cisna) Date: Sat, 21 Mar 2009 12:25:59 -0500 Subject: [K12OSN] Default iptables? Message-ID: <1237656359.22907.13.camel@localhost.localdomain> Joseph, You could possibly reboot the the thin clients via ssh,into your k12linux server ONLY if you had entered/added the line 'ALLOW_SHUTDOWN = Y' to your lts.conf file.The TC's have to be manually restarted by their 'power button' one time for this setting to take effect,so I think you are out of luck remotely rebooting the TC's even ssh'd into your k12linux server. Opps, just thought ,You are on FC10/ltsp5 which has deprecated this piece. There are a couple shell scripts people have made to remotely reboot TC's from the server login,but there are several steps to make this happen such as 'rebuilding the ltsp tree and adding ssh-keys to the ltsp tree. If you do as stated in the first post in regards to iptables default settings via Webmin the TC's should boot no probs. For 'added on' services you may have to allow some ports to the default settings. Without even getting this far,make sure you disable iptables all together, initially to make sure the TC's will boot to verify,you have everything working at this point. As stated, make sure your nics are started correctly. Do an: ' ifconfig' to see what you are seeing for ip readings all the way through. Are you 100 percent sure you do not have another dhcp server running on your network that the TC's are plugged into? Voice of experience talking here again. Let us know your progress. Take Care, Barry From ckjohnson at gwi.net Sat Mar 21 17:38:06 2009 From: ckjohnson at gwi.net (Christopher K. Johnson) Date: Sat, 21 Mar 2009 13:38:06 -0400 Subject: [K12OSN] perplexing issue with 64bit flash In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <49C525FE.8070900@gwi.net> On my only 64-bit machine which is running Fedora 9 it required not only the flash-plugin from adobe but also: yum install libflashsupport.i386 That could be worth a try. Chris David Hopkins wrote: > Not a solution, but have you checked to see exactly what packages are > different between the systems? I've tried using rpm -q -a > rpm.out > on different systems and diff'ing the output to check that I have > servers configured identically. > > Sincerely, > Dave Hopkins > > > On Fri, Mar 20, 2009 at 1:36 PM, Julius Szelagiewicz wrote: > >> Dear Folks, >> I've run into a really strange issue with 64bit flash: On three >> AMD based 64 bit machines (K12 Cenos 5, updated to the latest) I have >> installed the 64bit Flash from Adobe. On machine A (my little test server) >> it runs like a charm, on machine B (my home server) it runs some stuff >> (Youtube), but not other (NYTimes), on machine C (production server, where >> i really need it) it doesn't run at all. I see no error messages anywhere. >> The software releases are the same on all three machines. Any ideas? >> Thanks, julius >> >> From reb at taco.com Sat Mar 21 18:30:16 2009 From: reb at taco.com (Phydeaux) Date: Sat, 21 Mar 2009 14:30:16 -0400 Subject: [K12OSN] Support for local USB devices In-Reply-To: <49C442FF.6010301@scheie.homedns.org> References: <20090319160922.4ED5E615737@althea.taco.com> <20090320201556.B3A30615B47@althea.taco.com> <20090320233437.GB10048@aurora.owens.net> <49C442FF.6010301@scheie.homedns.org> Message-ID: <20090321183021.B1A03615B77@althea.taco.com> At 09:29 PM 03/20/09, Peter Scheie wrote: >USB sticks work fine on my K12Linux (F10 & LTSP 5) system. I'm using old Dell Latitude laptops for the clients, and cheap no-name USB sticks. What are you using? I've got a few Kensington USB sticks, and we've tried a few other devices. They all behave the same. The devices are seen just fine by the operating system. We can navigate around the directory structures, but when we attempt to access a file we see a "cannot allocate memory" error. Details are here: https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=484580 We're running LTSP 5 on FC10. Most of the clients are fairly modern AMD64x2 machines with Gigabyte motherboards. reb From julius at turtle.com Sat Mar 21 21:34:05 2009 From: julius at turtle.com (Julius Szelagiewicz) Date: Sat, 21 Mar 2009 17:34:05 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [K12OSN] perplexing issue with 64bit flash In-Reply-To: <49C525FE.8070900@gwi.net> Message-ID: The Adobe website states that libflashsupport is no longer needed starting with ver 10. On Sat, 21 Mar 2009, Christopher K. Johnson wrote: > On my only 64-bit machine which is running Fedora 9 it required not only > the flash-plugin from adobe but also: > yum install libflashsupport.i386 > > That could be worth a try. > Chris > > David Hopkins wrote: > > Not a solution, but have you checked to see exactly what packages are > > different between the systems? I've tried using rpm -q -a > rpm.out > > on different systems and diff'ing the output to check that I have > > servers configured identically. > > > > Sincerely, > > Dave Hopkins > > > > > > On Fri, Mar 20, 2009 at 1:36 PM, Julius Szelagiewicz wrote: > > > >> Dear Folks, > >> I've run into a really strange issue with 64bit flash: On three > >> AMD based 64 bit machines (K12 Cenos 5, updated to the latest) I have > >> installed the 64bit Flash from Adobe. On machine A (my little test server) > >> it runs like a charm, on machine B (my home server) it runs some stuff > >> (Youtube), but not other (NYTimes), on machine C (production server, where > >> i really need it) it doesn't run at all. I see no error messages anywhere. > >> The software releases are the same on all three machines. Any ideas? > >> Thanks, julius > >> > >> > > _______________________________________________ > K12OSN mailing list > K12OSN at redhat.com > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > For more info see > From nils at breun.nl Sat Mar 21 22:19:50 2009 From: nils at breun.nl (Nils Breunese) Date: Sat, 21 Mar 2009 23:19:50 +0100 Subject: [K12OSN] perplexing issue with 64bit flash In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Julius Szelagiewicz wrote: > The Adobe website states that libflashsupport is no longer needed > starting > with ver 10. There are some more Flash 10 tips at http://macromedia.mplug.org/ Nils Breunese. From julius at turtle.com Sun Mar 22 12:23:26 2009 From: julius at turtle.com (Julius Szelagiewicz) Date: Sun, 22 Mar 2009 08:23:26 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [K12OSN] perplexing issue with 64bit flash In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Sat, 21 Mar 2009, Nils Breunese wrote: > Julius Szelagiewicz wrote: > > > The Adobe website states that libflashsupport is no longer needed > > starting > > with ver 10. > > There are some more Flash 10 tips at http://macromedia.mplug.org/ > Nils, thank you. As it often happens, the answer to perplexing problem was "RTFM". The very first paragraph tells it all: "Install this libflashplayer.so into /usr/lib64/mozilla/plugins and remove your existing 32bit plugin" I missed the "remove 32 bit plugin" part. julius From john.ellson at comcast.net Sun Mar 22 12:36:49 2009 From: john.ellson at comcast.net (John Ellson) Date: Sun, 22 Mar 2009 08:36:49 -0400 Subject: [K12OSN] perplexing issue with 64bit flash In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <49C630E1.7060206@comcast.net> There is a known issue with the 64 bit Flash from Adobe which causes it to crash on older AMD-64 processors that don't have "lahf" instruction support. To see if your machine has "lahf" support, try: grep lahf /proc/cpuinfo The bug report is at: https://bugs.adobe.com/jira/browse/FP-1026 John On 03/20/2009 01:36 PM, Julius Szelagiewicz wrote: > Dear Folks, > I've run into a really strange issue with 64bit flash: On three > AMD based 64 bit machines (K12 Cenos 5, updated to the latest) I have > installed the 64bit Flash from Adobe. On machine A (my little test server) > it runs like a charm, on machine B (my home server) it runs some stuff > (Youtube), but not other (NYTimes), on machine C (production server, where > i really need it) it doesn't run at all. I see no error messages anywhere. > The software releases are the same on all three machines. Any ideas? > Thanks, julius > > _______________________________________________ > K12OSN mailing list > K12OSN at redhat.com > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > For more info see > > From rowens at ptd.net Mon Mar 23 20:18:09 2009 From: rowens at ptd.net (Rob Owens) Date: Mon, 23 Mar 2009 16:18:09 -0400 Subject: [K12OSN] Installing LTSP 5 over Fedora 10 In-Reply-To: <49BC16AD.1070805@worldnet.att.net> References: <49BC0653.7010609@worldnet.att.net> <49BC16AD.1070805@worldnet.att.net> Message-ID: <20090323201809.GB26024@aurora.owens.net> On Sat, Mar 14, 2009 at 01:42:21PM -0700, Michael J. Izak wrote: > This is exactly the page I was talking about that was not very clear. > > I started out with Fedora 6 LTSP version two or three years ago and it > worked very well. It had thunderbird and firefox in it. Now the centos > version don't have thunderbird. I need thunderbird. I guess nobody > thought of maintaining continuity with the software carried from Fedora > 6 to the Centos when they were building the Centos version. > CentOS does have Thunderbird available. I think somebody already mentioned that in this thread. "yum install thunderbird" should do it. -Rob From sergio.chaves at gmail.com Tue Mar 24 01:34:09 2009 From: sergio.chaves at gmail.com (Sergio Chaves) Date: Mon, 23 Mar 2009 21:34:09 -0400 Subject: [K12OSN] Enabling local thin client hard drive Message-ID: <30f1a9da0903231834t21f62f5epf62bfbb277ac9561@mail.gmail.com> Hi Francois. I am just curious... You do know that the "\" (backslash) on both lines should not be used, right? It means only that the following line is a continuation of the first one. Ex: ACTION=="add", SUBSYSTEM=="block", ENV{ID_TYPE}=="disk", \ ATTRS{removable}!="1", RUN+="add_fstab_entry %k" Is actually: ACTION=="add", SUBSYSTEM=="block", ENV{ID_TYPE}=="disk", ATTRS{removable}!="1", RUN+="add_fstab_entry %k" Sergio >Re: [K12OSN] Enabling local thin client hard drive >From: >Fran?ois Patte (Universit? Paris Descartes) >To: >"Support list for open source software in schools." >Date: >Saturday 11:09:09 am >Not enough information to check signature validity. Show Details >Nobody knows? Never try to do something like this? >I would like to know. >Thanks Le 20/03/2009 15:30, Fran?ois Patte a ?crit : > Bonjour, > > I try to enable the hard drive of my laptop which I booted as a TC. > > Following: > http://www.ltsp.org/~sbalneav/LTSPManual.html#id2539065 > > I added in /opt/ltsp/i386/etc/udev/rules.d/88-ltspfd.rule > > <---quote > On older versions of LTSP5, you'll want to add a line that looks like > the following: > > ACTION=="add", SUBSYSTEM=="block", ENV{ID_TYPE}=="disk", \ > ATTRS{removable}!="1", RUN+="add_fstab_entry %k" > > > On more recent versions, you'll want a line like the following: > > ACTION=="add", SUBSYSTEM=="block", ENV{ID_TYPE}=="disk", \ > ATTRS{removable}!="1", RUN+="ltspfs_entry add %k" > <----end quote > > I tried both.... rebuilt image and.... nothing has changed...... > > So what is the trick to see and mount the hd of my laptop. > > Thanks for helping. > > _______________________________________________ K12OSN mailing list K12OSN at redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn For more info see -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From dahopkins429 at gmail.com Tue Mar 24 10:19:39 2009 From: dahopkins429 at gmail.com (David Hopkins) Date: Tue, 24 Mar 2009 06:19:39 -0400 Subject: [K12OSN] Setting MS Office defaults for K12LTSP Message-ID: Does someone have a working version of the k12ltsp script that sets MS office formats as the global defaults for K12LTSP 5 when using OO.o 3.0? The version I have is for OO.o is for 2.0 and also seems to be missing the patches. Sincerely, Dave Hopkins From willems.leo at googlemail.com Tue Mar 24 11:34:10 2009 From: willems.leo at googlemail.com (Leo Willems) Date: Tue, 24 Mar 2009 19:34:10 +0800 Subject: [K12OSN] OpenOffice doesn't start even after re-install (k12linux F10) Message-ID: <3fabbdc20903240434x26c880a4sf41ff35d7ca0d9f4@mail.gmail.com> Dear Friends, OpenOffice doesn't start even after re-install on k12linux f10. The change that have been down since it work the last time: - activated the 2 network cards - a lot of updates, 10 or more almost every day Now after re-install it still doesn't start. there is no error message and no process to grep during starting. How could force a start? How could I see what is going on? How to get it running? Thanks Leo From willems.leo at googlemail.com Tue Mar 24 11:43:59 2009 From: willems.leo at googlemail.com (Leo Willems) Date: Tue, 24 Mar 2009 19:43:59 +0800 Subject: [K12OSN] moodle file conflict while updating (k12linux F10) Message-ID: <3fabbdc20903240443j6f424627o52fb60d7eb3b3df7@mail.gmail.com> Dear Friends, on k12linux F10 while installing one of the daily updates there is a conflict: Test Transaction Errors: file /var/www/moodle/web/lib/magpie/rss_fetch.inc from install of moodle-1.9.4-3.fc10.noarch conflicts with file from package php-magpierss-0.72-4.fc10.noarch What is the best way to go about it? Thanks Leo From whatch at anwsu.org Tue Mar 24 13:00:50 2009 From: whatch at anwsu.org (Will Hatch) Date: Tue, 24 Mar 2009 09:00:50 -0400 Subject: [K12OSN] fedora 10/ltsp install trouble Message-ID: <49C89216.0948.00D4.0@anwsu.org> I decided to move on from the Centos 5.1 version of k12ltsp to Fedora 10. I installed Fedora 10 on my server, which is just a beefed up Dell Optiplex with two network cards. I installed ltsp server and its dependencies after the initial install was finished. Now I am stuck. I use DevonIT thin clients in my lab. To create a session/connection you just enter the IP address of the server you are connecting to (different sessions for linux or windows ect). My clients can't connect. I followed the network instructions at: https://fedorahosted.org/k12linux/wiki/NetworkSetup but with no luck. I'm not sure what I am doing wrong. Thanks for any help. -Will *********************************** PRIVILEGED AND CONFIDENTIAL: This communication, including attachments, is for the exclusive use of addressee and may contain proprietary, confidential or privileged information. If you are not the intended recipient, any use, copying, disclosure, dissemination or distribution is strictly prohibited. If you're not the intended recipient, please notify the sender immediately by return email and delete this communication and destroy all copies. It is the policy of ANWSU not to discriminate on the basis or race, color, religion, national origin, gender, disability, or gender orientation in its educational programs or activities, or in its employment policies as required by Title IX of the 1972 Educational Amendments, by Section 504 of the Rehabilitation Act of 1973, by Title VI of the Civil Rights Act of 1964, and by Vermont State Law. From wtogami at redhat.com Tue Mar 24 13:28:32 2009 From: wtogami at redhat.com (Warren Togami) Date: Tue, 24 Mar 2009 09:28:32 -0400 Subject: [K12OSN] fedora 10/ltsp install trouble In-Reply-To: <49C89216.0948.00D4.0@anwsu.org> References: <49C89216.0948.00D4.0@anwsu.org> Message-ID: <49C8E000.1060304@redhat.com> On 03/24/2009 09:00 AM, Will Hatch wrote: > I decided to move on from the Centos 5.1 version of k12ltsp to Fedora > 10. I installed Fedora 10 on my server, which is just a beefed up > Dell Optiplex with two network cards. I installed ltsp server and > its dependencies after the initial install was finished. Now I am > stuck. > > I use DevonIT thin clients in my lab. To create a session/connection > you just enter the IP address of the server you are connecting to > (different sessions for linux or windows ect). My clients can't > connect. I followed the network instructions at: > https://fedorahosted.org/k12linux/wiki/NetworkSetup but with no luck. > I'm not sure what I am doing wrong. Thanks for any help. -Will The NetworkSetup page describes booting your clients in a different way, where it gets the operating system netboot from the server. These thin clients boot Fedora and login to the server via ldm. The old K12LTSP used XDMCP instead of ldm. If you want to use it in the old way where it can boot from DetOS, it is probably using XDMCP. You need to manually configure /etc/gdm/custom.conf to enable XDMCP. This is outside the scope of K12Linux. You actually don't need K12Linux at all to act as a XDMCP server. Any ordinary Linux server can do it without K12Linux. Warren Togami wtogami at redhat.com From microman at cmosnetworks.com Tue Mar 24 13:48:28 2009 From: microman at cmosnetworks.com (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?=22Terrell_Prud=E9_Jr=2E=22?=) Date: Tue, 24 Mar 2009 09:48:28 -0400 Subject: [K12OSN] OpenOffice doesn't start even after re-install (k12linux F10) In-Reply-To: <3fabbdc20903240434x26c880a4sf41ff35d7ca0d9f4@mail.gmail.com> References: <3fabbdc20903240434x26c880a4sf41ff35d7ca0d9f4@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <49C8E4AC.4020200@cmosnetworks.com> Leo Willems wrote: > Dear Friends, > > OpenOffice doesn't start even after re-install on k12linux f10. > > The change that have been down since it work the last time: > - activated the 2 network cards > - a lot of updates, 10 or more almost every day > > Now after re-install it still doesn't start. there is no error message > and no process to grep during starting. > > How could force a start? How could I see what is going on? How to get > it running? > Try running it from a terminal window. This way you can see any error messages that pop up. --TP _______________________________ Do you GNU ? Microsoft Free since 2003 --the ultimate antivirus protection! -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From whatch at anwsu.org Tue Mar 24 14:21:00 2009 From: whatch at anwsu.org (Will Hatch) Date: Tue, 24 Mar 2009 10:21:00 -0400 Subject: [K12OSN] fedora 10/ltsp install trouble In-Reply-To: <49C8E000.1060304@redhat.com> References: <49C89216.0948.00D4.0@anwsu.org> <49C8E000.1060304@redhat.com> Message-ID: <49C8A4DC.0948.00D4.0@anwsu.org> Ok, I knew something was different. When I go to system>>administration>>network, it shows both of my ethernet cards, plus a ltspb. This puzzled me. So you are saying I can uninstall ltsp and make a connection to the server with my DevonIT clients the way I used to? I'm still unsure of how to get this working. Sorry, I'm a teacher and things like this sometimes require "linux for dummies" instructions before I get it right. >>> Warren Togami 3/24/2009 8:28:32 am >>> On 03/24/2009 09:00 AM, Will Hatch wrote: > I decided to move on from the Centos 5.1 version of k12ltsp to Fedora > 10. I installed Fedora 10 on my server, which is just a beefed up > Dell Optiplex with two network cards. I installed ltsp server and > its dependencies after the initial install was finished. Now I am > stuck. > > I use DevonIT thin clients in my lab. To create a session/connection > you just enter the IP address of the server you are connecting to > (different sessions for linux or windows ect). My clients can't > connect. I followed the network instructions at: > https://fedorahosted.org/k12linux/wiki/NetworkSetup but with no luck. > I'm not sure what I am doing wrong. Thanks for any help. -Will The NetworkSetup page describes booting your clients in a different way, where it gets the operating system netboot from the server. These thin clients boot Fedora and login to the server via ldm. The old K12LTSP used XDMCP instead of ldm. If you want to use it in the old way where it can boot from DetOS, it is probably using XDMCP. You need to manually configure /etc/gdm/custom.conf to enable XDMCP. This is outside the scope of K12Linux. You actually don't need K12Linux at all to act as a XDMCP server. Any ordinary Linux server can do it without K12Linux. Warren Togami wtogami at redhat.com _______________________________________________ K12OSN mailing list K12OSN at redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn For more info see *********************************** PRIVILEGED AND CONFIDENTIAL: This communication, including attachments, is for the exclusive use of addressee and may contain proprietary, confidential or privileged information. If you are not the intended recipient, any use, copying, disclosure, dissemination or distribution is strictly prohibited. If you're not the intended recipient, please notify the sender immediately by return email and delete this communication and destroy all copies. It is the policy of ANWSU not to discriminate on the basis or race, color, religion, national origin, gender, disability, or gender orientation in its educational programs or activities, or in its employment policies as required by Title IX of the 1972 Educational Amendments, by Section 504 of the Rehabilitation Act of 1973, by Title VI of the Civil Rights Act of 1964, and by Vermont State Law. From wtogami at redhat.com Tue Mar 24 14:33:53 2009 From: wtogami at redhat.com (Warren Togami) Date: Tue, 24 Mar 2009 10:33:53 -0400 Subject: [K12OSN] fedora 10/ltsp install trouble In-Reply-To: <49C8A4DC.0948.00D4.0@anwsu.org> References: <49C89216.0948.00D4.0@anwsu.org> <49C8E000.1060304@redhat.com> <49C8A4DC.0948.00D4.0@anwsu.org> Message-ID: <49C8EF51.9070703@redhat.com> On 03/24/2009 10:21 AM, Will Hatch wrote: > Ok, I knew something was different. When I go to > system>>administration>>network, it shows both of my ethernet cards, > plus a ltspb. This puzzled me. > > So you are saying I can uninstall ltsp and make a connection to the > server with my DevonIT clients the way I used to? I'm still unsure > of how to get this working. Sorry, I'm a teacher and things like > this sometimes require "linux for dummies" instructions before I get > it right. Were you using XDMCP before? Warren From whatch at anwsu.org Tue Mar 24 15:21:06 2009 From: whatch at anwsu.org (Will Hatch) Date: Tue, 24 Mar 2009 11:21:06 -0400 Subject: [K12OSN] fedora 10/ltsp install trouble In-Reply-To: <49C8EF51.9070703@redhat.com> References: <49C89216.0948.00D4.0@anwsu.org> <49C8E000.1060304@redhat.com> <49C8A4DC.0948.00D4.0@anwsu.org> <49C8EF51.9070703@redhat.com> Message-ID: <49C8B2ED.0948.00D4.0@anwsu.org> Now that I look at the session creator on my DevonIT thin clients, I was using XDMCP before. I was also able to connect to the server with freenx. >>> Warren Togami 3/24/2009 9:33:53 am >>> On 03/24/2009 10:21 AM, Will Hatch wrote: > Ok, I knew something was different. When I go to > system>>administration>>network, it shows both of my ethernet cards, > plus a ltspb. This puzzled me. > > So you are saying I can uninstall ltsp and make a connection to the > server with my DevonIT clients the way I used to? I'm still unsure > of how to get this working. Sorry, I'm a teacher and things like > this sometimes require "linux for dummies" instructions before I get > it right. Were you using XDMCP before? Warren _______________________________________________ K12OSN mailing list K12OSN at redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn For more info see *********************************** PRIVILEGED AND CONFIDENTIAL: This communication, including attachments, is for the exclusive use of addressee and may contain proprietary, confidential or privileged information. If you are not the intended recipient, any use, copying, disclosure, dissemination or distribution is strictly prohibited. If you're not the intended recipient, please notify the sender immediately by return email and delete this communication and destroy all copies. It is the policy of ANWSU not to discriminate on the basis or race, color, religion, national origin, gender, disability, or gender orientation in its educational programs or activities, or in its employment policies as required by Title IX of the 1972 Educational Amendments, by Section 504 of the Rehabilitation Act of 1973, by Title VI of the Civil Rights Act of 1964, and by Vermont State Law. From whatch at anwsu.org Tue Mar 24 15:54:36 2009 From: whatch at anwsu.org (Will Hatch) Date: Tue, 24 Mar 2009 11:54:36 -0400 Subject: [K12OSN] fedora 10/ltsp install trouble In-Reply-To: <49C8B2ED.0948.00D4.0@anwsu.org> References: <49C89216.0948.00D4.0@anwsu.org> <49C8E000.1060304@redhat.com> <49C8A4DC.0948.00D4.0@anwsu.org> <49C8EF51.9070703@redhat.com> <49C8B2ED.0948.00D4.0@anwsu.org> Message-ID: <49C8BAC5.0948.00D4.0@anwsu.org> I am now able to get to the server from my thin clients. I previously exported my users to a batch file with webmin. I imported them to the new server, and they are showing up. However, when I try to log in as any of them it says it can't authenticate. Also, Once I launch the session to get to the Fedora server, I can't get back to the Detos splash screen. >>> "Will Hatch" 3/24/2009 10:21:06 am >>> Now that I look at the session creator on my DevonIT thin clients, I was using XDMCP before. I was also able to connect to the server with freenx. >>> Warren Togami 3/24/2009 9:33:53 am >>> On 03/24/2009 10:21 AM, Will Hatch wrote: > Ok, I knew something was different. When I go to > system>>administration>>network, it shows both of my ethernet cards, > plus a ltspb. This puzzled me. > > So you are saying I can uninstall ltsp and make a connection to the > server with my DevonIT clients the way I used to? I'm still unsure > of how to get this working. Sorry, I'm a teacher and things like > this sometimes require "linux for dummies" instructions before I get > it right. Were you using XDMCP before? Warren _______________________________________________ K12OSN mailing list K12OSN at redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn For more info see *********************************** PRIVILEGED AND CONFIDENTIAL: This communication, including attachments, is for the exclusive use of addressee and may contain proprietary, confidential or privileged information. If you are not the intended recipient, any use, copying, disclosure, dissemination or distribution is strictly prohibited. If you're not the intended recipient, please notify the sender immediately by return email and delete this communication and destroy all copies. It is the policy of ANWSU not to discriminate on the basis or race, color, religion, national origin, gender, disability, or gender orientation in its educational programs or activities, or in its employment policies as required by Title IX of the 1972 Educational Amendments, by Section 504 of the Rehabilitation Act of 1973, by Title VI of the Civil Rights Act of 1964, and by Vermont State Law. _______________________________________________ K12OSN mailing list K12OSN at redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn For more info see *********************************** PRIVILEGED AND CONFIDENTIAL: This communication, including attachments, is for the exclusive use of addressee and may contain proprietary, confidential or privileged information. If you are not the intended recipient, any use, copying, disclosure, dissemination or distribution is strictly prohibited. If you're not the intended recipient, please notify the sender immediately by return email and delete this communication and destroy all copies. It is the policy of ANWSU not to discriminate on the basis or race, color, religion, national origin, gender, disability, or gender orientation in its educational programs or activities, or in its employment policies as required by Title IX of the 1972 Educational Amendments, by Section 504 of the Rehabilitation Act of 1973, by Title VI of the Civil Rights Act of 1964, and by Vermont State Law. From francois.patte at mi.parisdescartes.fr Tue Mar 24 16:11:40 2009 From: francois.patte at mi.parisdescartes.fr (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Fran=E7ois_Patte?=) Date: Tue, 24 Mar 2009 17:11:40 +0100 Subject: [K12OSN] how to ssh a TC Message-ID: <49C9063C.1000008@mi.parisdescartes.fr> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Bonjour, I want to be able to ssh a TC from the server. I installed sshd in the chroot and enabled it but if I want to ssh a TC the answer is: port 22 connection refused Thank you. - -- Fran?ois Patte UFR de math?matiques et informatique Universit? Paris Descartes 45, rue des Saints P?res F-75270 Paris Cedex 06 T?l. +33 (0)1 4286 2413 http://www.math-info.univ-paris5.fr/~patte -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.9 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Fedora - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iEYEARECAAYFAknJBjwACgkQdE6C2dhV2JWzbACfe0Ex4CVzDIa2TkHj/XFOL5kN TBAAoJwhd7VNPi+fVfT4590R2bEFBJze =pF3Y -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From francois.patte at mi.parisdescartes.fr Tue Mar 24 16:12:29 2009 From: francois.patte at mi.parisdescartes.fr (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Fran=E7ois_Patte?=) Date: Tue, 24 Mar 2009 17:12:29 +0100 Subject: [K12OSN] keyboard on console shell Message-ID: <49C9066D.9050602@mi.parisdescartes.fr> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Bonjour, I would like to enable a French keyboard on SCREEN_02=shell; by default the keyboard is English and it is not very easy to remember all key positions of a QWERTY keyboard when yours is AZERTY For instance, if I want to type rpm -qa | grep awk I have to type: rp, -aq ? grep qzk Thanks for attention. - -- Fran?ois Patte UFR de math?matiques et informatique Universit? Paris Descartes 45, rue des Saints P?res F-75270 Paris Cedex 06 T?l. +33 (0)1 4286 2413 http://www.math-info.univ-paris5.fr/~patte -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.9 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Fedora - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iEYEARECAAYFAknJBm0ACgkQdE6C2dhV2JXsxwCeOqdWgvV3QhsUQ1RB0dyepCMV 5NcAn056wmjnDfm+RH1zi14YX6FUwk3K =+ZNb -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From rowens at ptd.net Tue Mar 24 19:13:11 2009 From: rowens at ptd.net (Rob Owens) Date: Tue, 24 Mar 2009 15:13:11 -0400 Subject: [K12OSN] fedora 10/ltsp install trouble In-Reply-To: <49C8A4DC.0948.00D4.0@anwsu.org> References: <49C89216.0948.00D4.0@anwsu.org> <49C8E000.1060304@redhat.com> <49C8A4DC.0948.00D4.0@anwsu.org> Message-ID: <20090324191311.GC412@aurora.owens.net> On Tue, Mar 24, 2009 at 10:21:00AM -0400, Will Hatch wrote: > Ok, I knew something was different. When I go to system>>administration>>network, it shows both of my ethernet cards, plus a ltspb. This puzzled me. > > So you are saying I can uninstall ltsp and make a connection to the server with my DevonIT clients the way I used to? I'm still unsure of how to get this working. Sorry, I'm a teacher and things like this sometimes require "linux for dummies" instructions before I get it right. > Will, LTSP allows diskless thin clients to obtain an operating system over the network, then initiate some kind of remote session with a server. If your DevonIT clients have their own built-in operating system (sounds like they do), then you don't necessarily need LTSP. As Warren said, and I think you've tried already, you can just use XDMCP. That won't give you access to local devices or sound (I don't think), so you might want to consider PXE booting your DevonIT clients in order to fully utilize what LTSP offers -- assuming you have the option to PXE boot. -Rob > >>> Warren Togami 3/24/2009 8:28:32 am >>> > On 03/24/2009 09:00 AM, Will Hatch wrote: > > I decided to move on from the Centos 5.1 version of k12ltsp to Fedora > > 10. I installed Fedora 10 on my server, which is just a beefed up > > Dell Optiplex with two network cards. I installed ltsp server and > > its dependencies after the initial install was finished. Now I am > > stuck. > > > > I use DevonIT thin clients in my lab. To create a session/connection > > you just enter the IP address of the server you are connecting to > > (different sessions for linux or windows ect). My clients can't > > connect. I followed the network instructions at: > > https://fedorahosted.org/k12linux/wiki/NetworkSetup but with no luck. > > I'm not sure what I am doing wrong. Thanks for any help. -Will > > The NetworkSetup page describes booting your clients in a different way, > where it gets the operating system netboot from the server. These thin > clients boot Fedora and login to the server via ldm. The old K12LTSP > used XDMCP instead of ldm. > > If you want to use it in the old way where it can boot from DetOS, it is > probably using XDMCP. You need to manually configure > /etc/gdm/custom.conf to enable XDMCP. This is outside the scope of > K12Linux. You actually don't need K12Linux at all to act as a XDMCP > server. Any ordinary Linux server can do it without K12Linux. > > Warren Togami > wtogami at redhat.com > > _______________________________________________ > K12OSN mailing list > K12OSN at redhat.com > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > For more info see > > > *********************************** > PRIVILEGED AND CONFIDENTIAL: This communication, including attachments, is for the exclusive use of addressee and may contain proprietary, confidential or privileged information. If you are not the intended recipient, any use, copying, disclosure, dissemination or distribution is strictly prohibited. If you're not the intended recipient, please notify the sender immediately by return email and delete this communication and destroy all copies. > It is the policy of ANWSU not to discriminate on the basis or race, color, religion, national origin, gender, disability, or gender orientation in its educational programs or activities, or in its employment policies as required by Title IX of the 1972 Educational Amendments, by Section 504 of the Rehabilitation Act of 1973, by Title VI of the Civil Rights Act of 1964, and by Vermont State Law. > > _______________________________________________ > K12OSN mailing list > K12OSN at redhat.com > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > For more info see From dahopkins429 at gmail.com Tue Mar 24 20:55:36 2009 From: dahopkins429 at gmail.com (David Hopkins) Date: Tue, 24 Mar 2009 16:55:36 -0400 Subject: [K12OSN] Feedback from a teacher on FC10/LTSP and Tuxpaint Message-ID: All, With the new server (FC10+LTSP 5), I installed Tuxpaint. Authentication (ldap) and home directories (dedicated file server) are the same as the prior system (K12LTSP5 based on CentOS5 with LTSP 4.2). The system is a dual hyperthreaded 2.4Ghz Xeon cpus with 4Gb memory, Ultra360 scsi drives. These are the teacher's observations from today: "Some initial observations: We found that several things are surprisingly slow. Namely, when selecting a new piece of paper, when choosing a new color of paint from the rainbow icon at far right of paint pallette, and when using the ABC feature to type. The delay at times was as long as 8-10 seconds (an eternity to a 6-yr old!) between clicking on the icon and getting to the next screen. Changing paint colors was the slowest. Before today, the ABC typing feature was instantaneous. Today only a handful of students tried to use it, and there was about a 3-4 second delay between typing a letter and seeing it appear on the screen. Creating shapes also has a short lag time. Other features, such as paint brush, stamps, magic, seem to work in synch (sic) and timely with the mouse movements." So, what would cause the slow down? Tuxpaint is not running as a local app. I know that I would have liked to have been able to check the load average during these slow downs, but I was not at the school. Sincerely, Dave Hopkins From whatch at anwsu.org Tue Mar 24 21:24:56 2009 From: whatch at anwsu.org (Will Hatch) Date: Tue, 24 Mar 2009 17:24:56 -0400 Subject: [K12OSN] fedora 10/ltsp install trouble In-Reply-To: <20090324191311.GC412@aurora.owens.net> References: <49C89216.0948.00D4.0@anwsu.org> <49C8E000.1060304@redhat.com> <49C8A4DC.0948.00D4.0@anwsu.org> <20090324191311.GC412@aurora.owens.net> Message-ID: <49C90845.0948.00D4.0@anwsu.org> Thanks for setting me straight guys. I thought I was using LTSP all along, and I guess I wasn't. XDMCP seems to be what I need. I now have my DevonIT thin clients connecting to my Fedora10 server. I discovered that why I was getting an authentication error when user tried to log on was because I used Webmin to create a batch file of my users; the passwords didn't translate for some reason. So if I go in and change the passwords, or get rid of passwords, all is well. I can't use pxe booting because the Detos OS on the thin clients lets me create browser sessions (very handy) or connect to my Windows Terminal Server (primary network platform). I'm still puzzled about a couple of things. When I launch a session to the Fedora server on the thin client, the disconnect button doesn't get me back to Detos. Also, I would like to get a different log in screen that doesn't have all of the users in a list (more like the old k12ltsp login screen). Finally, is there a way to select a group from users and groups, and make it so that entire group can log in without a password? In not, I have to go into each users account via Webmin and change the password requirements (160 users... pain in the ass). Thanks for the great support. -Will >>> Rob Owens 3/24/2009 2:13 pm >>> On Tue, Mar 24, 2009 at 10:21:00AM -0400, Will Hatch wrote: > Ok, I knew something was different. When I go to system>>administration>>network, it shows both of my ethernet cards, plus a ltspb. This puzzled me. > > So you are saying I can uninstall ltsp and make a connection to the server with my DevonIT clients the way I used to? I'm still unsure of how to get this working. Sorry, I'm a teacher and things like this sometimes require "linux for dummies" instructions before I get it right. > Will, LTSP allows diskless thin clients to obtain an operating system over the network, then initiate some kind of remote session with a server. If your DevonIT clients have their own built-in operating system (sounds like they do), then you don't necessarily need LTSP. As Warren said, and I think you've tried already, you can just use XDMCP. That won't give you access to local devices or sound (I don't think), so you might want to consider PXE booting your DevonIT clients in order to fully utilize what LTSP offers -- assuming you have the option to PXE boot. -Rob > >>> Warren Togami 3/24/2009 8:28:32 am >>> > On 03/24/2009 09:00 AM, Will Hatch wrote: > > I decided to move on from the Centos 5.1 version of k12ltsp to Fedora > > 10. I installed Fedora 10 on my server, which is just a beefed up > > Dell Optiplex with two network cards. I installed ltsp server and > > its dependencies after the initial install was finished. Now I am > > stuck. > > > > I use DevonIT thin clients in my lab. To create a session/connection > > you just enter the IP address of the server you are connecting to > > (different sessions for linux or windows ect). My clients can't > > connect. I followed the network instructions at: > > https://fedorahosted.org/k12linux/wiki/NetworkSetup but with no luck. > > I'm not sure what I am doing wrong. Thanks for any help. -Will > > The NetworkSetup page describes booting your clients in a different way, > where it gets the operating system netboot from the server. These thin > clients boot Fedora and login to the server via ldm. The old K12LTSP > used XDMCP instead of ldm. > > If you want to use it in the old way where it can boot from DetOS, it is > probably using XDMCP. You need to manually configure > /etc/gdm/custom.conf to enable XDMCP. This is outside the scope of > K12Linux. You actually don't need K12Linux at all to act as a XDMCP > server. Any ordinary Linux server can do it without K12Linux. > > Warren Togami > wtogami at redhat.com > > _______________________________________________ > K12OSN mailing list > K12OSN at redhat.com > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > For more info see > > > *********************************** > PRIVILEGED AND CONFIDENTIAL: This communication, including attachments, is for the exclusive use of addressee and may contain proprietary, confidential or privileged information. If you are not the intended recipient, any use, copying, disclosure, dissemination or distribution is strictly prohibited. If you're not the intended recipient, please notify the sender immediately by return email and delete this communication and destroy all copies. > It is the policy of ANWSU not to discriminate on the basis or race, color, religion, national origin, gender, disability, or gender orientation in its educational programs or activities, or in its employment policies as required by Title IX of the 1972 Educational Amendments, by Section 504 of the Rehabilitation Act of 1973, by Title VI of the Civil Rights Act of 1964, and by Vermont State Law. > > _______________________________________________ > K12OSN mailing list > K12OSN at redhat.com > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > For more info see _______________________________________________ K12OSN mailing list K12OSN at redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn For more info see *********************************** PRIVILEGED AND CONFIDENTIAL: This communication, including attachments, is for the exclusive use of addressee and may contain proprietary, confidential or privileged information. If you are not the intended recipient, any use, copying, disclosure, dissemination or distribution is strictly prohibited. If you're not the intended recipient, please notify the sender immediately by return email and delete this communication and destroy all copies. It is the policy of ANWSU not to discriminate on the basis or race, color, religion, national origin, gender, disability, or gender orientation in its educational programs or activities, or in its employment policies as required by Title IX of the 1972 Educational Amendments, by Section 504 of the Rehabilitation Act of 1973, by Title VI of the Civil Rights Act of 1964, and by Vermont State Law. From accessys at smart.net Wed Mar 25 00:53:08 2009 From: accessys at smart.net (Accessys@smart.net) Date: Tue, 24 Mar 2009 19:53:08 -0500 (EST) Subject: [K12OSN] fedora 10/ltsp install trouble In-Reply-To: <49C8A4DC.0948.00D4.0@anwsu.org> References: <49C89216.0948.00D4.0@anwsu.org> <49C8E000.1060304@redhat.com> <49C8A4DC.0948.00D4.0@anwsu.org> Message-ID: just a shot in the dark, but I have all sorts of problems when I had two ethernet cards in my computer. it seems on boot up it reversed them every time so they were never where they were being looked for. I removed one of the cards and after that it was finding everything where I had put it. not sure why this was a problem (running SUSE) but maybe you have a similar problem Bob On Tue, 24 Mar 2009, Will Hatch wrote: > Ok, I knew something was different. When I go to system>>administration>>network, it shows both of my ethernet cards, plus a ltspb. This puzzled me. > > So you are saying I can uninstall ltsp and make a connection to the server with my DevonIT clients the way I used to? I'm still unsure of how to get this working. Sorry, I'm a teacher and things like this sometimes require "linux for dummies" instructions before I get it right. > > >>> Warren Togami 3/24/2009 8:28:32 am >>> > On 03/24/2009 09:00 AM, Will Hatch wrote: > > I decided to move on from the Centos 5.1 version of k12ltsp to Fedora > > 10. I installed Fedora 10 on my server, which is just a beefed up > > Dell Optiplex with two network cards. I installed ltsp server and > > its dependencies after the initial install was finished. Now I am > > stuck. > > > > I use DevonIT thin clients in my lab. To create a session/connection > > you just enter the IP address of the server you are connecting to > > (different sessions for linux or windows ect). My clients can't > > connect. I followed the network instructions at: > > https://fedorahosted.org/k12linux/wiki/NetworkSetup but with no luck. > > I'm not sure what I am doing wrong. Thanks for any help. -Will > > The NetworkSetup page describes booting your clients in a different way, > where it gets the operating system netboot from the server. These thin > clients boot Fedora and login to the server via ldm. The old K12LTSP > used XDMCP instead of ldm. > > If you want to use it in the old way where it can boot from DetOS, it is > probably using XDMCP. You need to manually configure > /etc/gdm/custom.conf to enable XDMCP. This is outside the scope of > K12Linux. You actually don't need K12Linux at all to act as a XDMCP > server. Any ordinary Linux server can do it without K12Linux. > > Warren Togami > wtogami at redhat.com > > _______________________________________________ > K12OSN mailing list > K12OSN at redhat.com > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > For more info see > > > *********************************** > PRIVILEGED AND CONFIDENTIAL: This communication, including attachments, is for the exclusive use of addressee and may contain proprietary, confidential or privileged information. If you are not the intended recipient, any use, copying, disclosure, dissemination or distribution is strictly prohibited. If you're not the intended recipient, please notify the sender immediately by return email and delete this communication and destroy all copies. > It is the policy of ANWSU not to discriminate on the basis or race, color, religion, national origin, gender, disability, or gender orientation in its educational programs or activities, or in its employment policies as required by Title IX of the 1972 Educational Amendments, by Section 504 of the Rehabilitation Act of 1973, by Title VI of the Civil Rights Act of 1964, and by Vermont State Law. > > _______________________________________________ > K12OSN mailing list > K12OSN at redhat.com > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > For more info see > - end ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ occasionally a true patriot must defend his country from its' government +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ "They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve Neither liberty nor safety", Benjamin Franklin - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - ASCII Ribbon Campaign. . . . . . . . . . . . accessBob .NO HTML/PDF/RTF/MIME in e-mail. . . . . . . accessys at smartnospam.net .NO MSWord docs in e-mail . . . .. . . . . . Access Systems, engineers .NO attachments in e-mail, .*LINUX powered*. access is a civil right *#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*#*# THIS message and any attachments are CONFIDENTIAL and may be privileged. They are intended ONLY for the individual or entity named From francois.patte at mi.parisdescartes.fr Wed Mar 25 07:19:22 2009 From: francois.patte at mi.parisdescartes.fr (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Fran=E7ois_Patte?=) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 08:19:22 +0100 Subject: [K12OSN] fedora 10/ltsp install trouble In-Reply-To: References: <49C89216.0948.00D4.0@anwsu.org> <49C8E000.1060304@redhat.com> <49C8A4DC.0948.00D4.0@anwsu.org> Message-ID: <49C9DAFA.7010305@mi.parisdescartes.fr> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Le 25/03/2009 01:53, Accessys at smart.net a ?crit : > just a shot in the dark, but I have all sorts of problems when I had > two ethernet cards in my computer. it seems on boot up it reversed > them every time so they were never where they were being looked for. It seems to be either a problem of your /etc/sysconfig/network-scripts/ifcg-ethx file (or whatever this file is on Suse): heve you a line like this: HWADDR=00:13:d4:a1:59:3b (mac-address of your card) or an udev problem: in /etc/udev/rules.d/-persistent-net.rules (whatever this file is on Suse), you should have a rule like this: # Intel Corporation 82573V Gigabit Ethernet Controller (Copper) (rule written by anaconda) SUBSYSTEM=="net", ACTION=="add", DRIVERS=="?*", ATTR{address}=="00:13:d4:a1:59:3b", ATTR{type}=="1", KERNEL=="eth *", NAME="eth0" - -- Fran?ois Patte UFR de math?matiques et informatique Universit? Paris Descartes 45, rue des Saints P?res F-75270 Paris Cedex 06 T?l. +33 (0)1 4286 2145 http://www.math-info.univ-paris5.fr/~patte -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.9 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Fedora - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iEYEARECAAYFAknJ2voACgkQdE6C2dhV2JV10ACcC3uYuF+CJtp4c9qEeTkuoIpq 47oAn3WycN1fZRPUR58oTtCDAnmFXBFG =+9qH -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From whatch at anwsu.org Wed Mar 25 14:37:17 2009 From: whatch at anwsu.org (Will Hatch) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 10:37:17 -0400 Subject: [K12OSN] fedora 10 login screen Message-ID: <49C9FA3C.0948.00D4.0@anwsu.org> I can now connect to my Fedora 10 server from my DevonIT thin clients. Aside from a password issue with the batch file I imported, all is working. One small problem: When I launch the Fedora session from the DevonIT splash screen, I get to a login screen that has all my users. The list of users can be scrolled through, and they are all there. But, when I click disconnect, it doesn't send me back to the splash screen. This may be a DevonIT issue with my thin client, but I hoped I could just change the login screen. Not that easy apparently. I've followed instructions from this website: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/KDE#Graphical_interface but nothing has changed. I like the old k12ltsp login screen. I could get back to the DevonIT splash screen by clicking disconnect. How do I change the login screen? Thanks, Will *********************************** PRIVILEGED AND CONFIDENTIAL: This communication, including attachments, is for the exclusive use of addressee and may contain proprietary, confidential or privileged information. If you are not the intended recipient, any use, copying, disclosure, dissemination or distribution is strictly prohibited. If you're not the intended recipient, please notify the sender immediately by return email and delete this communication and destroy all copies. It is the policy of ANWSU not to discriminate on the basis or race, color, religion, national origin, gender, disability, or gender orientation in its educational programs or activities, or in its employment policies as required by Title IX of the 1972 Educational Amendments, by Section 504 of the Rehabilitation Act of 1973, by Title VI of the Civil Rights Act of 1964, and by Vermont State Law. From thunsucker at cnc-usa.com Wed Mar 25 16:44:31 2009 From: thunsucker at cnc-usa.com (Trey Hunsucker) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 11:44:31 -0500 Subject: [K12OSN] k12linux and windows dhcp server Message-ID: <49CA5F6F.2020400@cnc-usa.com> Hello, I am new to k12linux. I wanted to know the correct dhcp options to put into my windows server 2003 dhcp server. I have disabled dhcp on the k12linux box. I can get the thin client to boot up to the fedora k12linux login screen but then it fails to connect to login. I am sure it has something to do with the dhcp options i put in my 2003 dhcp server. Trey From asmo.koskinen at arkki.info Wed Mar 25 16:53:12 2009 From: asmo.koskinen at arkki.info (Asmo Koskinen) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 18:53:12 +0200 Subject: [K12OSN] k12linux and windows dhcp server In-Reply-To: <49CA5F6F.2020400@cnc-usa.com> References: <49CA5F6F.2020400@cnc-usa.com> Message-ID: <49CA6178.1070503@arkki.info> Trey Hunsucker kirjoitti: > I am new to k12linux. I wanted to know the correct dhcp options to put > into my windows server 2003 dhcp server. We use Ubuntu 8.04 with Windows DHCP Server, here is a screenshot about what is needed on Windows side. Here is just one thin client (this one was a test client), you need all your thin clients be there, of course. http://www.arkki.info/howto/Wiki/LTSP5-Kokkola/Windows_dhcpd.png https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/LTSPWindowsDHCP Hope that helps somehow. Best Regards Asmo Koskinen. From nils at breun.nl Wed Mar 25 17:32:49 2009 From: nils at breun.nl (Nils Breunese) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 18:32:49 +0100 Subject: [K12OSN] k12linux and windows dhcp server In-Reply-To: <49CA5F6F.2020400@cnc-usa.com> References: <49CA5F6F.2020400@cnc-usa.com> Message-ID: <6D23C9AF-760E-4955-BBA4-162BC189730D@breun.nl> Trey Hunsucker wrote: > I am new to k12linux. I wanted to know the correct dhcp options to > put into my windows server 2003 dhcp server. > > I have disabled dhcp on the k12linux box. > > I can get the thin client to boot up to the fedora k12linux login > screen but then it fails to connect to login. > > I am sure it has something to do with the dhcp options i put in my > 2003 dhcp server. Normally you don't need to modify any existing DHCP server configuration, as the default setup is to connect your thin clients to the LTSP server, which provides DHCP for the thin clients, but not for the rest of the network. If you already have a Windows server running DHCP the setup might look something like this: [internet] -> [windows 2003 server] (dhcp) -> [ltsp server] (dhcp) -> thin clients What is your setup like? Nils Breunese. From marcio.teixeira at numerica.us Wed Mar 25 17:51:02 2009 From: marcio.teixeira at numerica.us (Marcio Teixeira) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 11:51:02 -0600 Subject: [K12OSN] Allowing thin clients to connect to other hosts Message-ID: <9DFB8F0FBA71084FAE56F8E36240D92703173DFA@platinum.numerica.us> Hello, I am considering deploying thin clients in a corporate environment and I decided to evaluate K12Linux as a starting point. I am very impressed with what it does with regard to PXE booting thin clients, however I do have a few questions about how the thin clients can be customized. The default use case for K12Linux is that the thin clients allow users to log in to the K12Linux server itself and run apps from there. However, we have a situation where we already have other Linux boxes and Windows machines we would want the thin clients to access. I would envision it as being the case that once the thin client booted up, it would present the user with a list of Linux machines to connect to using XDMCP, or Windows machines to connect to using Remote Desktop or VNC. Users would not actually run software on the K12Linux server after boot-up. So, my questions are 1) what would it take to customize K12Linux to operate in this manner, 2) would I be better starting with a base FC 10 install and attempting to configure LTSP myself on it from scratch, Or 3) are there other LTSP distributions which might be better suited for this purpose? If there aren't any easy answers to this question, any reference, documentation or howto's on how to customize/configure the boot image which K12Linux sends to the PXE clients would be appreciated! Thanks! -- Marcio -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From thunsucker at cnc-usa.com Wed Mar 25 17:51:31 2009 From: thunsucker at cnc-usa.com (Trey Hunsucker) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 12:51:31 -0500 Subject: [K12OSN] k12linux and windows dhcp server In-Reply-To: <49CA6178.1070503@arkki.info> References: <49CA5F6F.2020400@cnc-usa.com> <49CA6178.1070503@arkki.info> Message-ID: <49CA6F23.2040108@cnc-usa.com> Hello Thank you for your fast response. All the settings match what I have put in my test server. I am testing with just 1 client and 1 reservation. The client boots up to the k12linux login but when I attempt to login, says it can't conect the server and then goes back to the login screen. My settings: 17 - root path : 172.16.1.100:/opt/ltsp/i386 46 - Wins/nbt node type : 0x8 66 - boot server host name : 172.16.1.100 3 - router : 172.16.1.1 6 - dns server : 172.16.1.2 Asmo Koskinen wrote: > Trey Hunsucker kirjoitti: > >> I am new to k12linux. I wanted to know the correct dhcp options to >> put into my windows server 2003 dhcp server. > > We use Ubuntu 8.04 with Windows DHCP Server, here is a screenshot > about what is needed on Windows side. Here is just one thin client > (this one was a test client), you need all your thin clients be there, > of course. > > http://www.arkki.info/howto/Wiki/LTSP5-Kokkola/Windows_dhcpd.png > > https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/LTSPWindowsDHCP > > Hope that helps somehow. Best Regards Asmo Koskinen. > > _______________________________________________ > K12OSN mailing list > K12OSN at redhat.com > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > For more info see > From thunsucker at cnc-usa.com Wed Mar 25 18:00:21 2009 From: thunsucker at cnc-usa.com (Trey Hunsucker) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 13:00:21 -0500 Subject: [K12OSN] k12linux and windows dhcp server In-Reply-To: <6D23C9AF-760E-4955-BBA4-162BC189730D@breun.nl> References: <49CA5F6F.2020400@cnc-usa.com> <6D23C9AF-760E-4955-BBA4-162BC189730D@breun.nl> Message-ID: <49CA7135.1000807@cnc-usa.com> Hello, I would like to setup one ltsp server and have around 20 clients in different rooms connect to it. The problem i encountered is that the windows dhcp server beat the ltsp dhcp server to the punch on handing out dhcp. Therefore it seemed reasonable to setup reservations in the windows dhcp server to redirect to the ltsp server. Trey Nils Breunese wrote: > Trey Hunsucker wrote: > >> I am new to k12linux. I wanted to know the correct dhcp options to >> put into my windows server 2003 dhcp server. >> >> I have disabled dhcp on the k12linux box. >> >> I can get the thin client to boot up to the fedora k12linux login >> screen but then it fails to connect to login. >> >> I am sure it has something to do with the dhcp options i put in my >> 2003 dhcp server. > > Normally you don't need to modify any existing DHCP server > configuration, as the default setup is to connect your thin clients to > the LTSP server, which provides DHCP for the thin clients, but not for > the rest of the network. If you already have a Windows server running > DHCP the setup might look something like this: > > [internet] -> [windows 2003 server] (dhcp) -> [ltsp server] (dhcp) -> > thin clients > > What is your setup like? > > Nils Breunese. > > _______________________________________________ > K12OSN mailing list > K12OSN at redhat.com > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > For more info see > From nils at breun.nl Wed Mar 25 18:36:08 2009 From: nils at breun.nl (Nils Breunese) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 19:36:08 +0100 Subject: [K12OSN] k12linux and windows dhcp server Message-ID: Trey Hunsucker wrote: > I would like to setup one ltsp server and have around 20 clients in > different rooms connect to it. The problem i encountered is that the > windows dhcp server beat the ltsp dhcp server to the punch on handing > out dhcp. Therefore it seemed reasonable to setup reservations in the > windows dhcp server to redirect to the ltsp server. This shouldn't be possible if you use the default 2 NIC network setup for LTSP. Are you using a 1 NIC setup? Multiple differently configured DHCP servers on the same network segment is asking for trouble. Nils Breunese. From thunsucker at cnc-usa.com Wed Mar 25 18:51:29 2009 From: thunsucker at cnc-usa.com (Trey Hunsucker) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 13:51:29 -0500 Subject: [K12OSN] k12linux and windows dhcp server In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <49CA7D31.3070501@cnc-usa.com> Nils, The NIC for the windows dhcp server, and both nics for the k12linux box plugged into the same switch. I understand that by default the k12linux setup is designed to have NIC 1 pull dhcp and then NIC 2 to be the ltsp server but that requires a k12linux for each lab/room where they will be at unless you VLAN each port that will be used for ltsp. Trey Nils Breunese wrote: > Trey Hunsucker wrote: > >> I would like to setup one ltsp server and have around 20 clients in >> different rooms connect to it. The problem i encountered is that the >> windows dhcp server beat the ltsp dhcp server to the punch on handing >> out dhcp. Therefore it seemed reasonable to setup reservations in the >> windows dhcp server to redirect to the ltsp server. > > This shouldn't be possible if you use the default 2 NIC network setup > for LTSP. Are you using a 1 NIC setup? Multiple differently configured > DHCP servers on the same network segment is asking for trouble. > > Nils Breunese. > > _______________________________________________ > K12OSN mailing list > K12OSN at redhat.com > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > For more info see > From lesmikesell at gmail.com Wed Mar 25 19:15:35 2009 From: lesmikesell at gmail.com (Les Mikesell) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 14:15:35 -0500 Subject: [K12OSN] k12linux and windows dhcp server In-Reply-To: <49CA7D31.3070501@cnc-usa.com> References: <49CA7D31.3070501@cnc-usa.com> Message-ID: <49CA82D7.1090806@gmail.com> Trey Hunsucker wrote: > The NIC for the windows dhcp server, and both nics for the k12linux box > plugged into the same switch. You might as well configure it for 1-nic operation. > I understand that by default the k12linux setup is designed to have NIC > 1 pull dhcp and then NIC 2 to be the ltsp server but that requires a > k12linux for each lab/room where they will be at unless you VLAN each > port that will be used for ltsp. You can use a single NIC and network, but you need to pick a single DHCP server for the network and configure it to give out all the options you need. Either the windows server can be configured to do that (and other clients will ignore the other options) or the k12 server can be configured to be the only DHCP server you use. -- Les Mikesell lesmikesell at gmail.com From thunsucker at cnc-usa.com Wed Mar 25 19:22:27 2009 From: thunsucker at cnc-usa.com (Trey Hunsucker) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 14:22:27 -0500 Subject: [K12OSN] k12linux and windows dhcp server In-Reply-To: <49CA82D7.1090806@gmail.com> References: <49CA7D31.3070501@cnc-usa.com> <49CA82D7.1090806@gmail.com> Message-ID: <49CA8473.3000403@cnc-usa.com> Les, I understand that you can use a single dhcp server and that is exactly what I'm doing. Here is my original post: I am new to k12linux. I wanted to know the correct dhcp options to put into my windows server 2003 dhcp server. I have disabled dhcp on the k12linux box. I can get the thin client to boot up to the fedora k12linux login screen but then it fails to connect to login. I am sure it has something to do with the dhcp options i put in my 2003 dhcp serve Les Mikesell wrote: > Trey Hunsucker wrote: > >> The NIC for the windows dhcp server, and both nics for the k12linux >> box plugged into the same switch. > > You might as well configure it for 1-nic operation. > >> I understand that by default the k12linux setup is designed to have >> NIC 1 pull dhcp and then NIC 2 to be the ltsp server but that >> requires a k12linux for each lab/room where they will be at unless >> you VLAN each port that will be used for ltsp. > > You can use a single NIC and network, but you need to pick a single > DHCP server for the network and configure it to give out all the > options you need. Either the windows server can be configured to do > that (and other clients will ignore the other options) or the k12 > server can be configured to be the only DHCP server you use. > From lesmikesell at gmail.com Wed Mar 25 19:48:43 2009 From: lesmikesell at gmail.com (Les Mikesell) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 14:48:43 -0500 Subject: [K12OSN] k12linux and windows dhcp server In-Reply-To: <49CA8473.3000403@cnc-usa.com> References: <49CA7D31.3070501@cnc-usa.com> <49CA82D7.1090806@gmail.com> <49CA8473.3000403@cnc-usa.com> Message-ID: <49CA8A9B.6070107@gmail.com> Trey Hunsucker wrote: > Les, > > I understand that you can use a single dhcp server and that is exactly > what I'm doing. Here is my original post: > > I am new to k12linux. I wanted to know the correct dhcp options to put > into my windows server 2003 dhcp server. > > I have disabled dhcp on the k12linux box. > > I can get the thin client to boot up to the fedora k12linux login screen > but then it fails to connect to login. > > I am sure it has something to do with the dhcp options i put in my 2003 > dhcp serve I don't know much about windows so I'd probably go the opposite route and let the k12 server have the whole range as long as it is a reliable box, but this might have the options you need: http://www.opensubscriber.com/message/k12osn at redhat.com/5199037.html -- Les Mikesell lesmikesell at gmail.com From thunsucker at cnc-usa.com Wed Mar 25 19:55:20 2009 From: thunsucker at cnc-usa.com (Trey Hunsucker) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 14:55:20 -0500 Subject: [K12OSN] k12linux and windows dhcp server In-Reply-To: <49CA8A9B.6070107@gmail.com> References: <49CA7D31.3070501@cnc-usa.com> <49CA82D7.1090806@gmail.com> <49CA8473.3000403@cnc-usa.com> <49CA8A9B.6070107@gmail.com> Message-ID: <49CA8C28.5090403@cnc-usa.com> Les, In our windows environment it is best for the windows servers to hand out dhcp, we're running a domain. Another user sent me this screenshot for his working windows server setup http://www.arkki.info/howto/Wiki/LTSP5-Kokkola/Windows_dhcpd.png My settings match his, but I still have the same problem. Can't login. Les Mikesell wrote: > Trey Hunsucker wrote: >> Les, >> >> I understand that you can use a single dhcp server and that is >> exactly what I'm doing. Here is my original post: >> >> I am new to k12linux. I wanted to know the correct dhcp options to >> put into my windows server 2003 dhcp server. >> >> I have disabled dhcp on the k12linux box. >> >> I can get the thin client to boot up to the fedora k12linux login >> screen but then it fails to connect to login. >> >> I am sure it has something to do with the dhcp options i put in my >> 2003 dhcp serve > > I don't know much about windows so I'd probably go the opposite route > and let the k12 server have the whole range as long as it is a > reliable box, but this might have the options you need: > http://www.opensubscriber.com/message/k12osn at redhat.com/5199037.html > From dahopkins429 at gmail.com Wed Mar 25 20:05:10 2009 From: dahopkins429 at gmail.com (David Hopkins) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 16:05:10 -0400 Subject: [K12OSN] k12linux and windows dhcp server In-Reply-To: <49CA8C28.5090403@cnc-usa.com> References: <49CA7D31.3070501@cnc-usa.com> <49CA82D7.1090806@gmail.com> <49CA8473.3000403@cnc-usa.com> <49CA8A9B.6070107@gmail.com> <49CA8C28.5090403@cnc-usa.com> Message-ID: > Les, > > In our windows environment it is best for the windows servers to hand out > dhcp, we're running a domain. > > Another user sent me this screenshot for his working windows server setup > http://www.arkki.info/howto/Wiki/LTSP5-Kokkola/Windows_dhcpd.png > > My settings match his, but I still have the same problem. Can't login. I had a similar issue where the thin client would boot, but then could not login with a dual NIC setup and it was related to iptables not forwarding ( nat'ing? ) the login request to the authentication server. Could this be something similar? Or perhaps a firewall issue on the k12 server? Is that disabled? Sincerely, Dave Hopkins From lesmikesell at gmail.com Wed Mar 25 20:12:08 2009 From: lesmikesell at gmail.com (Les Mikesell) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 15:12:08 -0500 Subject: [K12OSN] k12linux and windows dhcp server In-Reply-To: <49CA8C28.5090403@cnc-usa.com> References: <49CA7D31.3070501@cnc-usa.com> <49CA82D7.1090806@gmail.com> <49CA8473.3000403@cnc-usa.com> <49CA8A9B.6070107@gmail.com> <49CA8C28.5090403@cnc-usa.com> Message-ID: <49CA9018.3030107@gmail.com> Trey Hunsucker wrote: > Les, > > In our windows environment it is best for the windows servers to hand > out dhcp, we're running a domain. I don't follow... What does DHCP have to do with a domain other than pointing the clients to the windows box for WINS and DNS if it is AD? -- Les Mikesell lesmikesell at gmail.com From cgrossko at wusd.org Wed Mar 25 21:04:51 2009 From: cgrossko at wusd.org (Cody Grosskopf) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 14:04:51 -0700 Subject: [K12OSN] Feedback from a teacher on FC10/LTSP and Tuxpaint Message-ID: <49CA3A04020000BC0001166D@wusdweb.wusd.org> I couldn't get Tuxpaint to a usable state until I was able to use it as a Local Application, I am not even sure I would call it usable now, but I will say it is about 75% better performance. >>> David Hopkins 03/24/09 1:56 PM >>> All, With the new server (FC10+LTSP 5), I installed Tuxpaint. Authentication (ldap) and home directories (dedicated file server) are the same as the prior system (K12LTSP5 based on CentOS5 with LTSP 4.2). The system is a dual hyperthreaded 2.4Ghz Xeon cpus with 4Gb memory, Ultra360 scsi drives. These are the teacher's observations from today: "Some initial observations: We found that several things are surprisingly slow. Namely, when selecting a new piece of paper, when choosing a new color of paint from the rainbow icon at far right of paint pallette, and when using the ABC feature to type. The delay at times was as long as 8-10 seconds (an eternity to a 6-yr old!) between clicking on the icon and getting to the next screen. Changing paint colors was the slowest. Before today, the ABC typing feature was instantaneous. Today only a handful of students tried to use it, and there was about a 3-4 second delay between typing a letter and seeing it appear on the screen. Creating shapes also has a short lag time. Other features, such as paint brush, stamps, magic, seem to work in synch (sic) and timely with the mouse movements." So, what would cause the slow down? Tuxpaint is not running as a local app. I know that I would have liked to have been able to check the load average during these slow downs, but I was not at the school. Sincerely, Dave Hopkins _______________________________________________ K12OSN mailing list K12OSN at redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn For more info see From burke at thealmquists.net Wed Mar 25 22:37:18 2009 From: burke at thealmquists.net (Almquist Burke) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 17:37:18 -0500 Subject: [K12OSN] how to ssh a TC In-Reply-To: <49C9063C.1000008@mi.parisdescartes.fr> References: <49C9063C.1000008@mi.parisdescartes.fr> Message-ID: <339B09F9-A832-41AC-A243-C166FDA5398E@thealmquists.net> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 IIRC, you need to install sshd in the chroot, set a password for the root user in the chroot, and allow root logins in the sshd.conf file in your chroot. On Mar 24, 2009, at 11:11 AM, Fran?ois Patte wrote: > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- > Hash: SHA1 > > Bonjour, > > I want to be able to ssh a TC from the server. I installed sshd in the > chroot and enabled it but if I want to ssh a TC the answer is: > > port 22 connection refused > > Thank you. > > > - -- > Fran?ois Patte > UFR de math?matiques et informatique > Universit? Paris Descartes > 45, rue des Saints P?res > F-75270 Paris Cedex 06 > T?l. +33 (0)1 4286 2413 > http://www.math-info.univ-paris5.fr/~patte > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- > Version: GnuPG v1.4.9 (GNU/Linux) > Comment: Using GnuPG with Fedora - http://enigmail.mozdev.org > > iEYEARECAAYFAknJBjwACgkQdE6C2dhV2JWzbACfe0Ex4CVzDIa2TkHj/XFOL5kN > TBAAoJwhd7VNPi+fVfT4590R2bEFBJze > =pF3Y > -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- > > _______________________________________________ > K12OSN mailing list > K12OSN at redhat.com > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > For more info see -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.7 (Darwin) iEYEARECAAYFAknKsh8ACgkQxWV7OPa/g5FgjwCeLYLKa/z0Wfd4HwzZW9TA/gH7 GgkAn2YQan45nQE1BA5d2OqxxvI0M5Z6 =FZMI -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From peter at scheie.homedns.org Thu Mar 26 00:20:53 2009 From: peter at scheie.homedns.org (Peter Scheie) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 19:20:53 -0500 Subject: [K12OSN] Allowing thin clients to connect to other hosts In-Reply-To: <9DFB8F0FBA71084FAE56F8E36240D92703173DFA@platinum.numerica.us> References: <9DFB8F0FBA71084FAE56F8E36240D92703173DFA@platinum.numerica.us> Message-ID: <49CACA65.6050008@scheie.homedns.org> Assuming the users' IDs are stored on the K12Linux server, I would setup public key authentication from the K12Linux server to the other Linux boxes--that is, copy each user's public SSH key to each desired Linux server--and then put icons on user's desktops that call something like 'ssh linuxbox1 application'. This means the application will run on linuxbox1 but display on the thin client. To the user, it's all transparent. The city of Largo, Florida has been using this approach, dedicating a server to each application, with great success. Peter Marcio Teixeira wrote: > > > Hello, > > > > I am considering deploying thin clients in a corporate environment and I > decided to evaluate K12Linux as a starting point. I am very impressed > with what it does with regard to PXE booting thin clients, however I do > have a few questions about how the thin clients can be customized. > > > > The default use case for K12Linux is that the thin clients allow users > to log in to the K12Linux server itself and run apps from there. > However, we have a situation where we already have other Linux boxes and > Windows machines we would want the thin clients to access. I would > envision it as being the case that once the thin client booted up, it > would present the user with a list of Linux machines to connect to using > XDMCP, or Windows machines to connect to using Remote Desktop or VNC. > Users would not actually run software on the K12Linux server after boot-up. > > > > So, my questions are 1) what would it take to customize K12Linux to > operate in this manner, 2) would I be better starting with a base FC 10 > install and attempting to configure LTSP myself on it from scratch, Or > 3) are there other LTSP distributions which might be better suited for > this purpose? > > > > If there aren?t any easy answers to this question, any reference, > documentation or howto?s on how to customize/configure the boot image > which K12Linux sends to the PXE clients would be appreciated! Thanks! > > > > -- Marcio > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > _______________________________________________ > K12OSN mailing list > K12OSN at redhat.com > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > For more info see From thunsucker at cnc-usa.com Thu Mar 26 14:48:20 2009 From: thunsucker at cnc-usa.com (Trey Hunsucker) Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2009 09:48:20 -0500 Subject: [K12OSN] k12linux and windows dhcp server In-Reply-To: <49CA9018.3030107@gmail.com> References: <49CA7D31.3070501@cnc-usa.com> <49CA82D7.1090806@gmail.com> <49CA8473.3000403@cnc-usa.com> <49CA8A9B.6070107@gmail.com> <49CA8C28.5090403@cnc-usa.com> <49CA9018.3030107@gmail.com> Message-ID: <49CB95B4.8010707@cnc-usa.com> Les, You are correct, is it very possible to run linux as the dhcp server for a windows domain but I've had much better success with a backup domain controller handing out dhcp. Just my personal preference. Trey Les Mikesell wrote: > Trey Hunsucker wrote: >> Les, >> >> In our windows environment it is best for the windows servers to hand >> out dhcp, we're running a domain. > > I don't follow... What does DHCP have to do with a domain other than > pointing the clients to the windows box for WINS and DNS if it is AD? > From thunsucker at cnc-usa.com Thu Mar 26 15:02:11 2009 From: thunsucker at cnc-usa.com (Trey Hunsucker) Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2009 10:02:11 -0500 Subject: [K12OSN] k12linux and windows dhcp server In-Reply-To: References: <49CA7D31.3070501@cnc-usa.com> <49CA82D7.1090806@gmail.com> <49CA8473.3000403@cnc-usa.com> <49CA8A9B.6070107@gmail.com> <49CA8C28.5090403@cnc-usa.com> Message-ID: <49CB98F3.9040204@cnc-usa.com> David, I disabled the firewall but still didn't fix it. I wanted to mention also that the same client does work when I don't use the windows dhcp server on the same k12linux server. Trey David Hopkins wrote: >> Les, >> >> In our windows environment it is best for the windows servers to hand out >> dhcp, we're running a domain. >> >> Another user sent me this screenshot for his working windows server setup >> http://www.arkki.info/howto/Wiki/LTSP5-Kokkola/Windows_dhcpd.png >> >> My settings match his, but I still have the same problem. Can't login. >> > > I had a similar issue where the thin client would boot, but then could > not login with a dual NIC setup and it was related to iptables not > forwarding ( nat'ing? ) the login request to the authentication > server. Could this be something similar? Or perhaps a firewall issue > on the k12 server? Is that disabled? > > Sincerely, > Dave Hopkins > > _______________________________________________ > K12OSN mailing list > K12OSN at redhat.com > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > For more info see > > From thunsucker at cnc-usa.com Thu Mar 26 15:09:55 2009 From: thunsucker at cnc-usa.com (Trey Hunsucker) Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2009 10:09:55 -0500 Subject: [K12OSN] Single NIC Setup Message-ID: <49CB9AC3.1020902@cnc-usa.com> Hello, Maybe the problems I am having with my setup, is because I started off wrong. I setup a dual nic setup using just the k12linux server and it worked without any problems. I unplugged the bridged NIC(eth0) and set a windows server to hand out dhcp and pointed it's boot options to the other k12linux server nic(eth1). Is there a guide on how to set this up using only 1 nic? I found many of them for k12ltsp but none for k12linux. Trey From lesmikesell at gmail.com Thu Mar 26 15:10:44 2009 From: lesmikesell at gmail.com (Les Mikesell) Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2009 10:10:44 -0500 Subject: [K12OSN] k12linux and windows dhcp server In-Reply-To: <49CB95B4.8010707@cnc-usa.com> References: <49CA7D31.3070501@cnc-usa.com> <49CA82D7.1090806@gmail.com> <49CA8473.3000403@cnc-usa.com> <49CA8A9B.6070107@gmail.com> <49CA8C28.5090403@cnc-usa.com> <49CA9018.3030107@gmail.com> <49CB95B4.8010707@cnc-usa.com> Message-ID: <49CB9AF4.4010005@gmail.com> Trey Hunsucker wrote: > Les, > > You are correct, is it very possible to run linux as the dhcp server for > a windows domain but I've had much better success with a backup domain > controller handing out dhcp. Just my personal preference. I've been running the same linux box for DHCP and DNS for about 7 years with about 5 minutes of downtime once when I had to move it (a k12ltsp version from the RH7.x days). It always worked for windows domain clients and the only change to accommodate AD was to slave the DNS zone the AD server used. I don't really see how anything could be more reliable or less trouble than that. But, if you are booting to the point where the X server starts, I think you are past the DHCP-supplied options anyway. -- Les Mikesell lesmikesell at gmail.com From thunsucker at cnc-usa.com Thu Mar 26 15:17:44 2009 From: thunsucker at cnc-usa.com (Trey Hunsucker) Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2009 10:17:44 -0500 Subject: [K12OSN] k12linux and windows dhcp server In-Reply-To: <49CB9AF4.4010005@gmail.com> References: <49CA7D31.3070501@cnc-usa.com> <49CA82D7.1090806@gmail.com> <49CA8473.3000403@cnc-usa.com> <49CA8A9B.6070107@gmail.com> <49CA8C28.5090403@cnc-usa.com> <49CA9018.3030107@gmail.com> <49CB95B4.8010707@cnc-usa.com> <49CB9AF4.4010005@gmail.com> Message-ID: <49CB9C98.7030800@cnc-usa.com> I agree, I am past the dhcp problems. I would love to have the time to test linux as the dns/dhcp server in a test environment but I just don't have the time and the powers to be still aren't pro on converting more to linux. Showing them k12linux is my first chance to prove that linux is powerful enough to resolve their issues. Trey Les Mikesell wrote: > Trey Hunsucker wrote: >> Les, >> >> You are correct, is it very possible to run linux as the dhcp server >> for a windows domain but I've had much better success with a backup >> domain controller handing out dhcp. Just my personal preference. > > I've been running the same linux box for DHCP and DNS for about 7 > years with about 5 minutes of downtime once when I had to move it (a > k12ltsp version from the RH7.x days). It always worked for windows > domain clients and the only change to accommodate AD was to slave the > DNS zone the AD server used. I don't really see how anything could be > more reliable or less trouble than that. > > But, if you are booting to the point where the X server starts, I > think you are past the DHCP-supplied options anyway. > From microman at cmosnetworks.com Thu Mar 26 16:28:40 2009 From: microman at cmosnetworks.com (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?=22Terrell_Prud=E9_Jr=2E=22?=) Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2009 12:28:40 -0400 Subject: [K12OSN] k12linux and windows dhcp server In-Reply-To: <49CB9C98.7030800@cnc-usa.com> References: <49CA7D31.3070501@cnc-usa.com> <49CA82D7.1090806@gmail.com> <49CA8473.3000403@cnc-usa.com> <49CA8A9B.6070107@gmail.com> <49CA8C28.5090403@cnc-usa.com> <49CA9018.3030107@gmail.com> <49CB95B4.8010707@cnc-usa.com> <49CB9AF4.4010005@gmail.com> <49CB9C98.7030800@cnc-usa.com> Message-ID: <49CBAD38.8000801@cmosnetworks.com> Hmm...if you need to show the Powers That Be (PTB), then you might consider K12LTSP 5EL for your first real deployment. It doesn't get more reliable and rock-solid than that, and you're supported until the year 2014. Decision makers like that. Then, once the PTB say "OK, maybe this 'Linux thing' isn't so bad after all", *then* introduce the Fedora-based K12Linux. --TP _______________________________ Do you GNU ? Microsoft Free since 2003 --the ultimate antivirus protection! Trey Hunsucker wrote: > I agree, I am past the dhcp problems. > > I would love to have the time to test linux as the dns/dhcp server in > a test environment but I just don't have the time and the powers to be > still aren't pro on converting more to linux. Showing them k12linux is > my first chance to prove that linux is powerful enough to resolve > their issues. > > Trey > > Les Mikesell wrote: >> Trey Hunsucker wrote: >>> Les, >>> >>> You are correct, is it very possible to run linux as the dhcp server >>> for a windows domain but I've had much better success with a backup >>> domain controller handing out dhcp. Just my personal preference. >> >> I've been running the same linux box for DHCP and DNS for about 7 >> years with about 5 minutes of downtime once when I had to move it (a >> k12ltsp version from the RH7.x days). It always worked for windows >> domain clients and the only change to accommodate AD was to slave the >> DNS zone the AD server used. I don't really see how anything could >> be more reliable or less trouble than that. >> >> But, if you are booting to the point where the X server starts, I >> think you are past the DHCP-supplied options anyway. >> > > _______________________________________________ > K12OSN mailing list > K12OSN at redhat.com > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > For more info see -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From francois.patte at mi.parisdescartes.fr Thu Mar 26 16:56:57 2009 From: francois.patte at mi.parisdescartes.fr (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Fran=E7ois_Patte?=) Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2009 17:56:57 +0100 Subject: [K12OSN] how to ssh a TC In-Reply-To: <339B09F9-A832-41AC-A243-C166FDA5398E@thealmquists.net> References: <49C9063C.1000008@mi.parisdescartes.fr> <339B09F9-A832-41AC-A243-C166FDA5398E@thealmquists.net> Message-ID: <49CBB3D9.9030407@mi.parisdescartes.fr> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Le 25/03/2009 23:37, Almquist Burke a ?crit : > IIRC, you need to install sshd in the chroot, set a password for the > root user in the chroot, and allow root logins in the sshd.conf file in > your chroot. I did everything of this kind, *but* I remain unable to ssh a TC from the server. Strange behaviour: bash-3.2# service sshd status openssh-daemon is stopped but if I try to ssh a TC, ssh is running: bash-3.2# ssh root at 172.31.100.100 root at 172.31.100.100's password: Permission denied, please try again. So the password is not set. Then I try: bash-3.2# passwd root Changement de mot de passe pour l'utilisateur root. Nouveau UNIX mot de passe : Retapez le nouveau UNIX mot de passe : passwd: Utilisateur inconnu par le module d'authentification sous-jacent translation: 1- Change password for user root 2 New UNIX password 3- retype the password After sometimes: 4- passwd: unknown user for the underlying authentication module What does this mean? Thanks for helping. - -- Fran?ois Patte UFR de math?matiques et informatique Universit? Paris Descartes 45, rue des Saints P?res F-75270 Paris Cedex 06 T?l. +33 (0)1 4286 2145 http://www.math-info.univ-paris5.fr/~patte -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.9 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Fedora - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iEYEARECAAYFAknLs9kACgkQdE6C2dhV2JWjoACeM2QzPknyNElrzC53rrs3wMv4 J1kAoJn+eXBhxUDLHIVMCYvPDmkOIwKO =e9iB -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From thunsucker at cnc-usa.com Thu Mar 26 19:06:52 2009 From: thunsucker at cnc-usa.com (Trey Hunsucker) Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2009 14:06:52 -0500 Subject: [K12OSN] k12linux and windows dhcp server In-Reply-To: <49CBAD38.8000801@cmosnetworks.com> References: <49CA7D31.3070501@cnc-usa.com> <49CA82D7.1090806@gmail.com> <49CA8473.3000403@cnc-usa.com> <49CA8A9B.6070107@gmail.com> <49CA8C28.5090403@cnc-usa.com> <49CA9018.3030107@gmail.com> <49CB95B4.8010707@cnc-usa.com> <49CB9AF4.4010005@gmail.com> <49CB9C98.7030800@cnc-usa.com> <49CBAD38.8000801@cmosnetworks.com> Message-ID: <49CBD24C.1080502@cnc-usa.com> Tried k12ltsp and never got it to work at all. Terrell Prud? Jr. wrote: > Hmm...if you need to show the Powers That Be (PTB), then you might > consider K12LTSP 5EL for your first real deployment. It doesn't get > more reliable and rock-solid than that, and you're supported until the > year 2014. Decision makers like that. Then, once the PTB say "OK, > maybe this 'Linux thing' isn't so bad after all", *then* introduce the > Fedora-based K12Linux. > > --TP > _______________________________ > Do you GNU ? > Microsoft Free since 2003 --the ultimate > antivirus protection! > > > Trey Hunsucker wrote: >> I agree, I am past the dhcp problems. >> >> I would love to have the time to test linux as the dns/dhcp server in >> a test environment but I just don't have the time and the powers to >> be still aren't pro on converting more to linux. Showing them >> k12linux is my first chance to prove that linux is powerful enough to >> resolve their issues. >> >> Trey >> >> Les Mikesell wrote: >>> Trey Hunsucker wrote: >>>> Les, >>>> >>>> You are correct, is it very possible to run linux as the dhcp >>>> server for a windows domain but I've had much better success with a >>>> backup domain controller handing out dhcp. Just my personal >>>> preference. >>> >>> I've been running the same linux box for DHCP and DNS for about 7 >>> years with about 5 minutes of downtime once when I had to move it (a >>> k12ltsp version from the RH7.x days). It always worked for windows >>> domain clients and the only change to accommodate AD was to slave >>> the DNS zone the AD server used. I don't really see how anything >>> could be more reliable or less trouble than that. >>> >>> But, if you are booting to the point where the X server starts, I >>> think you are past the DHCP-supplied options anyway. >>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> K12OSN mailing list >> K12OSN at redhat.com >> https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn >> For more info see > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > _______________________________________________ > K12OSN mailing list > K12OSN at redhat.com > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > For more info see From lesmikesell at gmail.com Thu Mar 26 19:47:32 2009 From: lesmikesell at gmail.com (Les Mikesell) Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2009 14:47:32 -0500 Subject: [K12OSN] k12linux and windows dhcp server In-Reply-To: <49CBD24C.1080502@cnc-usa.com> References: <49CA7D31.3070501@cnc-usa.com> <49CA82D7.1090806@gmail.com> <49CA8473.3000403@cnc-usa.com> <49CA8A9B.6070107@gmail.com> <49CA8C28.5090403@cnc-usa.com> <49CA9018.3030107@gmail.com> <49CB95B4.8010707@cnc-usa.com> <49CB9AF4.4010005@gmail.com> <49CB9C98.7030800@cnc-usa.com> <49CBAD38.8000801@cmosnetworks.com> <49CBD24C.1080502@cnc-usa.com> Message-ID: <49CBDBD4.70903@gmail.com> Trey Hunsucker wrote: > Tried k12ltsp and never got it to work at all. > That's a solvable problem - unless your clients are something new that only ltsp5 handles. It should work out of the box in a 2 nic setup and there are directions around for 1 nic versions. -- Les Mikesell lesmikesell at gmail.com From pfaffman at relaxpc.com Thu Mar 26 20:47:50 2009 From: pfaffman at relaxpc.com (Jay Pfaffman) Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2009 16:47:50 -0400 Subject: [K12OSN] Setting MS Office defaults for K12LTSP In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <932609800903261347p139331eepd97cef445337a540@mail.gmail.com> Here are my notes. They may be a bit cryptic, but they worked for me: On Server made MS office file formats the default. Edited stuff in /usr/lib/openoffice/share/registry/modules/org/openoffice/Setup/. Deleted two users' ~/.openoffice.org directories. Not sure if necessary for the the default file types to take or not. Hmm. Now that I look, it's not very helpful. If that machine weren't behind a NAT firewall I could get the file for you. If you haven't found another solution I might be able to get somehting tomorrow. On Tue, Mar 24, 2009 at 6:19 AM, David Hopkins wrote: > Does someone have a working version of the k12ltsp script that sets MS > office formats as the global defaults for K12LTSP 5 when using OO.o > 3.0? ?The version I have is for OO.o is for 2.0 and also seems to be > missing the patches. > > Sincerely, > Dave Hopkins > > _______________________________________________ > K12OSN mailing list > K12OSN at redhat.com > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > For more info see > > -- Jay Pfaffman http://learn.occ.utk.edu/ +1-865-974-0497 From burke at thealmquists.net Thu Mar 26 21:58:02 2009 From: burke at thealmquists.net (Almquist Burke) Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2009 16:58:02 -0500 Subject: [K12OSN] Single NIC Setup In-Reply-To: <49CB9AC3.1020902@cnc-usa.com> References: <49CB9AC3.1020902@cnc-usa.com> Message-ID: -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On Mar 26, 2009, at 10:09 AM, Trey Hunsucker wrote: > Hello, > > Is there a guide on how to set this up using only 1 nic? I found > many of them for k12ltsp but none for k12linux. > > Trey > I had started working on one here, https://fedorahosted.org/k12linux/ wiki/AdvancedNetworkSetup but I've had some other projects that needed my attention. What I needed to do was go though installing it on my own network and make sure I document everything I had to change. I was going to work on it this weekend, but I'm going to go sandbag instead. The basics are altering all the config files for things like NFS (or NBD), tftpd, the hosts file, etc so that they match your network's configuration. If you have an idea how the process works though, you have a good shot and getting it working. If anyone else has actually set up a working one nic setup on K12Linux (fedora 9 or 10) PLEASE FEEL FREE go ahead and make changes to the wiki, or let me know what steps you had to take so I can eventually get them put in there. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.7 (Darwin) iEYEARECAAYFAknL+moACgkQxWV7OPa/g5HHyQCeNEayHXl0vCJys9lASVHAzSGr bqcAoISFYrBh5n0BERgZ9zNUyu1d6BMM =vNfV -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From burke at thealmquists.net Thu Mar 26 22:27:03 2009 From: burke at thealmquists.net (Almquist Burke) Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2009 17:27:03 -0500 Subject: [K12OSN] how to ssh a TC In-Reply-To: <49CBB3D9.9030407@mi.parisdescartes.fr> References: <49C9063C.1000008@mi.parisdescartes.fr> <339B09F9-A832-41AC-A243-C166FDA5398E@thealmquists.net> <49CBB3D9.9030407@mi.parisdescartes.fr> Message-ID: <743B6194-D579-4479-AB80-79C710569C35@thealmquists.net> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Where exactly did you go to get this bash prompt? -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.7 (Darwin) iEYEARECAAYFAknMATcACgkQxWV7OPa/g5H+YwCfYTGCiPOO7z//Vja+N2wWkS1Z fFgAn3AyBSj8LfL+Nf/Q5telFWDMD18T =44/1 -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From burke at thealmquists.net Thu Mar 26 22:53:00 2009 From: burke at thealmquists.net (Almquist Burke) Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2009 17:53:00 -0500 Subject: [K12OSN] how to ssh a TC In-Reply-To: <49C9063C.1000008@mi.parisdescartes.fr> References: <49C9063C.1000008@mi.parisdescartes.fr> Message-ID: -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On Mar 24, 2009, at 11:11 AM, Fran?ois Patte wrote: > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- > Hash: SHA1 > > Bonjour, > > I want to be able to ssh a TC from the server. I installed sshd in the > chroot and enabled it but if I want to ssh a TC the answer is: Here's a better question, why do you want to do this? -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.7 (Darwin) iEYEARECAAYFAknMB0wACgkQxWV7OPa/g5EYvACffWzKEbnQKuWccNUjHKP3Yf3B 64MAnR3n++9iz4H9TVmFRHhBnnPJpMQN =Pwxj -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From asmo.koskinen at arkki.info Fri Mar 27 08:15:30 2009 From: asmo.koskinen at arkki.info (Asmo Koskinen) Date: Fri, 27 Mar 2009 10:15:30 +0200 Subject: [K12OSN] how to ssh a TC In-Reply-To: References: <49C9063C.1000008@mi.parisdescartes.fr> Message-ID: <49CC8B22.6010903@arkki.info> Almquist Burke kirjoitti: > Here's a better question, why do you want to do this? Because you can do it? Maybe you want to check out exactly what kind of hardware unknown thin client do have (lspci)? Or what it does right now (ps ax, top)? Or what happens when you plug in USB stick (dmesg)? With root enabled you can ssh in thin client and check out all this. It is not the same thing as "chroot /etc/opt/i386". http://wiki.ubuntu-fi.org/LTSP5_Chroot Best Regards Asmo Koskinen. From asmo.koskinen at arkki.info Fri Mar 27 08:29:33 2009 From: asmo.koskinen at arkki.info (Asmo Koskinen) Date: Fri, 27 Mar 2009 10:29:33 +0200 Subject: [K12OSN] Single NIC Setup In-Reply-To: References: <49CB9AC3.1020902@cnc-usa.com> Message-ID: <49CC8E6D.4040000@arkki.info> Almquist Burke kirjoitti: > https://fedorahosted.org/k12linux/wiki/AdvancedNetworkSetup I used that howto when I installed Fedora in KVM (Ubuntu). http://www.arkki.info/howto/Fedora10/Eee_FC10_00.png http://www.arkki.info/howto/Fedora10/ I used these values for Fedora in KVM - one nic - I removed bridge ethernet setup. ---- asmok at ubuntu:~$ ssh -X admin-fedora at 192.168.1.110 [admin-fedora at fedora ~]$ cat /etc/ltsp/dhcpd.conf authoritative; subnet 192.168.1.0 netmask 255.255.255.0 { range 192.168.1.200 192.168.1.250; option domain-name "fedora"; option domain-name-servers 192.168.1.1; option broadcast-address 192.168.1.255; option routers 192.168.1.1; option subnet-mask 255.255.255.0; option root-path "192.168.1.110:/opt/ltsp/i386"; if substring( option vendor-class-identifier, 0, 9 ) = "PXEClient" { filename "/ltsp/i386/pxelinux.0"; } else { filename "/ltsp/i386/nbi.img"; } } [admin-fedora at fedora ~]$ [admin-fedora at fedora ~]$ cat /etc/sysconfig/network-scripts/ifcfg-eth0 # Realtek Semiconductor Co., Ltd. RTL-8139/8139C/8139C+ DEVICE=eth0 HWADDR=00:16:36:13:7e:ab BOOTPROTO=static NETMASK=255.255.255.0 IPADDR=192.168.1.110 ONBOOT=yes USERCTL=yes PEERDNS=yes IPV6INIT=no NM_CONTROLLED=yes GATEWAY=192.168.1.1 TYPE=Ethernet DNS1=192.168.1.1 DNS2=192.168.1.1 DOMAIN=fedora [admin-fedora at fedora ~]$ And this for finnish language. [root at fedora sysconfig]# cat keyboard KEYBOARDTYPE="pc" KEYTABLE="fi-latin1" LAYOUT="fi-latin1" MODEL="pc105+inet" OPTIONS="" VARIANT="" [root at fedora sysconfig]# Best Regards Asmo Koskinen. From burke at thealmquists.net Fri Mar 27 21:14:24 2009 From: burke at thealmquists.net (Almquist Burke) Date: Fri, 27 Mar 2009 16:14:24 -0500 Subject: [K12OSN] how to ssh a TC In-Reply-To: <49CC8B22.6010903@arkki.info> References: <49C9063C.1000008@mi.parisdescartes.fr> <49CC8B22.6010903@arkki.info> Message-ID: <398FB86F-5CC3-436E-BE3A-5BFD05DCFE55@thealmquists.net> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On Mar 27, 2009, at 3:15 AM, Asmo Koskinen wrote: > Almquist Burke kirjoitti: > >> Here's a better question, why do you want to do this? > > Because you can do it? I didn't mean to sound smart, I was just trying to figure out what you were trying to accomplish. The clients mount their minimal OS read only. So if you want to make changes to the client chroot, you'd have to chroot into the client root on the server (where you have read-write access) to make your changes. I think you might need to reboot the client to make some of the changes take effect (like if you enabled SSHD on the client). > > Maybe you want to check out exactly what kind of hardware unknown > thin client do have (lspci)? Or what it does right now (ps ax, > top)? Or what happens when you plug in USB stick (dmesg)? > > With root enabled you can ssh in thin client and check out all > this. It is not the same thing as "chroot /etc/opt/i386". > > http://wiki.ubuntu-fi.org/LTSP5_Chroot > > Exactly, but you have to make the changes to the client root by chrooting into it on the server. That's all I was trying to say. > Best Regards Asmo Koskinen. > > _______________________________________________ > K12OSN mailing list > K12OSN at redhat.com > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > For more info see -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.7 (Darwin) iEYEARECAAYFAknNQbAACgkQxWV7OPa/g5FS9QCfVLxuxVVyJY3kai8Ko7OAOneP 4wAAnRwGBtDIPIYacLRf/KtDiJ1hmTyj =sf2Y -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From Steven at SimplyCircus.com Fri Mar 27 21:55:54 2009 From: Steven at SimplyCircus.com (Steven Santos) Date: Fri, 27 Mar 2009 17:55:54 -0400 Subject: [K12OSN] how to ssh a TC In-Reply-To: <398FB86F-5CC3-436E-BE3A-5BFD05DCFE55@thealmquists.net> References: <49C9063C.1000008@mi.parisdescartes.fr> <49CC8B22.6010903@arkki.info> <398FB86F-5CC3-436E-BE3A-5BFD05DCFE55@thealmquists.net> Message-ID: Maybe this is a dumb question, but why can't you mount the filesystem RW for the session, make your changes, and then remount it RO? --- Steven Santos Director, Simply Circus, Inc. Email: Steven at SimplyCircus.com Mail: 14 Pierrepont Road Newton, MA 02462 Phone: 617-527-0667 Web: www.SimplyCircus.com > -----Original Message----- > From: k12osn-bounces at redhat.com [mailto:k12osn-bounces at redhat.com] On > Behalf Of Almquist Burke > Sent: Friday, March 27, 2009 5:14 PM > To: Support list for open source software in schools. > Subject: Re: [K12OSN] how to ssh a TC > > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- > Hash: SHA1 > > > On Mar 27, 2009, at 3:15 AM, Asmo Koskinen wrote: > > > Almquist Burke kirjoitti: > > > >> Here's a better question, why do you want to do this? > > > > Because you can do it? > > I didn't mean to sound smart, I was just trying to figure out what > you were trying to accomplish. The clients mount their minimal OS > read only. So if you want to make changes to the client chroot, you'd > have to chroot into the client root on the server (where you have > read-write access) to make your changes. I think you might need to > reboot the client to make some of the changes take effect (like if > you enabled SSHD on the client). > > > > > Maybe you want to check out exactly what kind of hardware unknown > > thin client do have (lspci)? Or what it does right now (ps ax, > > top)? Or what happens when you plug in USB stick (dmesg)? > > > > With root enabled you can ssh in thin client and check out all > > this. It is not the same thing as "chroot /etc/opt/i386". > > > > http://wiki.ubuntu-fi.org/LTSP5_Chroot > > > > > > Exactly, but you have to make the changes to the client root by > chrooting into it on the server. > That's all I was trying to say. > > > Best Regards Asmo Koskinen. > > > > _______________________________________________ > > K12OSN mailing list > > K12OSN at redhat.com > > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > > For more info see > > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- > Version: GnuPG v1.4.7 (Darwin) > > iEYEARECAAYFAknNQbAACgkQxWV7OPa/g5FS9QCfVLxuxVVyJY3kai8Ko7OAOneP > 4wAAnRwGBtDIPIYacLRf/KtDiJ1hmTyj > =sf2Y > -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- > > _______________________________________________ > K12OSN mailing list > K12OSN at redhat.com > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > For more info see From burke at thealmquists.net Sat Mar 28 03:06:23 2009 From: burke at thealmquists.net (Almquist Burke) Date: Fri, 27 Mar 2009 22:06:23 -0500 Subject: [K12OSN] how to ssh a TC In-Reply-To: References: <49C9063C.1000008@mi.parisdescartes.fr> <49CC8B22.6010903@arkki.info> <398FB86F-5CC3-436E-BE3A-5BFD05DCFE55@thealmquists.net> Message-ID: -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On Mar 27, 2009, at 4:55 PM, Steven Santos wrote: > Maybe this is a dumb question, but why can't you mount the > filesystem RW for > the session, make your changes, and then remount it RO? > I suppose you could do that, assuming you also configured to have a local shell on the client. You'd have to edit your NFS conf file to make the client chroot export read-write instead of read only and restart NFS. Then boot the client to a local shell and make your changes from there, and then change your settings back. That's why I suggested chrooting into the client root on the server. I thought it would be less work. > --- > Steven Santos > Director, Simply Circus, Inc. > Email: Steven at SimplyCircus.com > Mail: 14 Pierrepont Road > Newton, MA 02462 > Phone: 617-527-0667 > Web: www.SimplyCircus.com > > >> -----Original Message----- >> From: k12osn-bounces at redhat.com [mailto:k12osn-bounces at redhat.com] On >> Behalf Of Almquist Burke >> Sent: Friday, March 27, 2009 5:14 PM >> To: Support list for open source software in schools. >> Subject: Re: [K12OSN] how to ssh a TC >> >> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- >> Hash: SHA1 >> >> >> On Mar 27, 2009, at 3:15 AM, Asmo Koskinen wrote: >> >>> Almquist Burke kirjoitti: >>> >>>> Here's a better question, why do you want to do this? >>> >>> Because you can do it? >> >> I didn't mean to sound smart, I was just trying to figure out what >> you were trying to accomplish. The clients mount their minimal OS >> read only. So if you want to make changes to the client chroot, you'd >> have to chroot into the client root on the server (where you have >> read-write access) to make your changes. I think you might need to >> reboot the client to make some of the changes take effect (like if >> you enabled SSHD on the client). >> >>> >>> Maybe you want to check out exactly what kind of hardware unknown >>> thin client do have (lspci)? Or what it does right now (ps ax, >>> top)? Or what happens when you plug in USB stick (dmesg)? >>> >>> With root enabled you can ssh in thin client and check out all >>> this. It is not the same thing as "chroot /etc/opt/i386". >>> >>> http://wiki.ubuntu-fi.org/LTSP5_Chroot >>> >>> >> >> Exactly, but you have to make the changes to the client root by >> chrooting into it on the server. >> That's all I was trying to say. >> >>> Best Regards Asmo Koskinen. >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> K12OSN mailing list >>> K12OSN at redhat.com >>> https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn >>> For more info see >> >> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- >> Version: GnuPG v1.4.7 (Darwin) >> >> iEYEARECAAYFAknNQbAACgkQxWV7OPa/g5FS9QCfVLxuxVVyJY3kai8Ko7OAOneP >> 4wAAnRwGBtDIPIYacLRf/KtDiJ1hmTyj >> =sf2Y >> -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- >> >> _______________________________________________ >> K12OSN mailing list >> K12OSN at redhat.com >> https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn >> For more info see > > _______________________________________________ > K12OSN mailing list > K12OSN at redhat.com > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > For more info see -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.7 (Darwin) iEYEARECAAYFAknNlC8ACgkQxWV7OPa/g5Eh7wCfRg6kRCtoyzjbA6GEa5GvYb6n FqEAniEQX+FZB6iQc1im5pHhSD3Bai3J =pTUz -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From brcisna at eazylivin.net Sat Mar 28 12:40:29 2009 From: brcisna at eazylivin.net (Barry R Cisna) Date: Sat, 28 Mar 2009 07:40:29 -0500 Subject: [K12OSN] k12linux and windows dhcp server Message-ID: <1238244030.23290.7.camel@localhost.localdomain> Hi Trey, I don't know if this would be an option for you, but you can easily run your existing k12linux servers dhcp server on an alternate port. (usually 1067). AKA: Parallel dhcp servers on same network segment. We have one such set up at one of our school buildings and this way the winders boxes never knows the k12linux server exists. Only downside, you have to hand edit each client machine in lts.conf and add this entry, pointing to port 1067 .But once you see the drill you simply do the 'ol copy/paste info for each client switching the ws<###> Here is an how to on how to set this up: http://wiki.ltsp.org/twiki/bin/view/Ltsp/DHCP#Use_different_port_numbers_for_t Barry From dahopkins429 at gmail.com Sat Mar 28 15:27:01 2009 From: dahopkins429 at gmail.com (David Hopkins) Date: Sat, 28 Mar 2009 11:27:01 -0400 Subject: [K12OSN] Feedback from a teacher on FC10/LTSP and Tuxpaint In-Reply-To: References: <49CA3A04020000BC0001166D@wusdweb.wusd.org> Message-ID: Yesterday, the 1st grade kids used the new FC10 server. ?This was the feedback from the teacher: ?I am not sure why this package would have these issues. ?It is not running as a local application, the old server and new server have the same amount of memory, same speed NICs. The new server has faster drives and faster CPU's. Anyhow, ideas? Teacher's comments: "Today, first grade students experimented with the new features in Tux Paint. ?In most classes, I had 22 computers in use. ?Here are some things of notice: * Most workstations took anywhere from 15-30 seconds to change a custom paint color. ?Oddly, there were two computers that did it in only 4-5 seconds. For most, as soon as they selected this feature, there was an 8-10 second delay getting to the next screen. ?Then the delay to complete the task could range from 10-20 seconds more. ?I stood and watched--it was not related to students impatiently clicking repeatedly. ?Plenty who were very minimal in their requests waited what seemed endlessly. *Today, while the rest of the room continued working, I asked groups of 6 to select a new piece of paper. ?The first group waited 15-20 seconds for each step of the process. ?(There are 4 steps.) ? As there were fewer students using the program, the process quickened, so that by the last group, this took only 3-5 seconds for each step. * I left the program open all day, because it took nearly 4 minutes for 22 computers to open Tux Paint first thing this morning ?(I started them in groups of 6 at a time, as always). ? My little people need practice opening and closing programs, double clicking, finding things on the desktop, etc. *One system was painfully slow in all tasks. ?There was a significant delay when using any tool except the paintbrush tool. " As I look at that list, the common theme seems to be waiting for apps to load which is what? Disk access issue? Authentication issue? ?The thin clients all have 256Mb of memory and run fine with the K12LTSP5 version. The reason for moving to FC10 is sound support and the ability to run FF locally with better sound/multimedia support. ?To get this to work well, I know I need to upgrade these systems to 512Mb ?of memory (tested this already), but even at 256Mb, they are 'ok' for FF locally. ?I can go into the lab and start the app on all systems but I don't have access from the lab to IRC (blocked at the state level). Sincerely, Dave Hopkins From lesmikesell at gmail.com Sat Mar 28 16:05:46 2009 From: lesmikesell at gmail.com (Les Mikesell) Date: Sat, 28 Mar 2009 11:05:46 -0500 Subject: [K12OSN] k12linux and windows dhcp server In-Reply-To: <1238244030.23290.7.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <1238244030.23290.7.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <49CE4ADA.4070308@gmail.com> Barry R Cisna wrote: > Hi Trey, > > I don't know if this would be an option for you, but you can easily run > your existing k12linux servers dhcp server on an alternate port. > (usually 1067). > AKA: Parallel dhcp servers on same network segment. > We have one such set up at one of our school buildings and this way the > winders boxes never knows the k12linux server exists. > Only downside, you have to hand edit each client machine in lts.conf and > add this entry, pointing to port 1067 .But once you see the drill you > simply do the 'ol copy/paste info for each client switching the ws<###> > Here is an how to on how to set this up: > > http://wiki.ltsp.org/twiki/bin/view/Ltsp/DHCP#Use_different_port_numbers_for_t I think this also requires an etherboot floppy (or CD, etc.) instead of PXE to boot. -- Les Mikesell lesmikesell at gmail.com From gabriellopeza at hotmail.com Sun Mar 29 15:01:26 2009 From: gabriellopeza at hotmail.com (gabriel lopez) Date: Sun, 29 Mar 2009 15:01:26 +0000 Subject: [K12OSN] dhcpd.conf Message-ID: I installed K12Linux F10 Stable 4 i386 (ISO) on USB following instructions from https://fedorahosted.org/liveusb-creator and configured the network as described on the manual (two network cards) . I can connect to internet from server (booting from USB) but clients do not boot. "No ip address" I has some experience wih LTSP4.2 but none with LTSP5.0. What i do find id that /etc/dhcpd.conf is empty. Should'nt it something on it as on ltsp4.2? If so, could someone send me a example of it. _________________________________________________________________ Discover the new Windows Vista http://search.msn.com/results.aspx?q=windows+vista&mkt=en-US&form=QBRE -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mel at melwade.com Sun Mar 29 15:06:23 2009 From: mel at melwade.com (Mel Wade) Date: Sun, 29 Mar 2009 08:06:23 -0700 Subject: [K12OSN] dhcpd.conf In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <43080f460903290806j14e0c309o6d90cd8e08bb9abc@mail.gmail.com> I'm not sure about 10, but other versions had a K12LTSP specific dhcpd-k12ltsp.conf or something like that. Have you tried a service dhcpd restart on your system to see if you get any error messages. If it doesn't start, look in your messages.log file to see specific error messages. -- Mel Wade "A common mistake people make when trying to design something completely foolproof is to underestimate the ingenuity of complete fools." - Douglas Adams http://www.melwade.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From rowens at ptd.net Sun Mar 29 19:02:35 2009 From: rowens at ptd.net (Rob Owens) Date: Sun, 29 Mar 2009 15:02:35 -0400 Subject: [K12OSN] dhcpd.conf In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20090329190235.GA31929@aurora.owens.net> Debian/Ubuntu use /etc/ltsp/dhcpd.conf -- maybe try looking there? (I've never used K12Linux) -Rob On Sun, Mar 29, 2009 at 03:01:26PM +0000, gabriel lopez wrote: > > I installed K12Linux F10 Stable 4 i386 (ISO) on USB following instructions from https://fedorahosted.org/liveusb-creator and configured the network as described on the manual (two network cards) . I can connect to internet from server (booting from USB) but clients do not boot. "No ip address" > I has some experience wih LTSP4.2 but none with LTSP5.0. > What i do find id that /etc/dhcpd.conf is empty. > Should'nt it something on it as on ltsp4.2? > If so, could someone send me a example of it. > > _________________________________________________________________ > Discover the new Windows Vista > http://search.msn.com/results.aspx?q=windows+vista&mkt=en-US&form=QBRE > _______________________________________________ > K12OSN mailing list > K12OSN at redhat.com > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > For more info see From brcisna at eazylivin.net Sun Mar 29 22:27:29 2009 From: brcisna at eazylivin.net (Barry R Cisna) Date: Sun, 29 Mar 2009 17:27:29 -0500 Subject: [K12OSN] dhcpd.conf Message-ID: <1238365649.16299.9.camel@localhost.localdomain> Hi Gabriel, The actual dhcp config file resides at /etc/dhcp-k12ltsp.conf. Regardless, if you used all the default settings during setup the clients should boot up. Try the following in a terminal window as root; 1. service dhcpd restart ,,,two times. Make sure you see a green "OK". if this comes up OK do; 2. service iptables stop 3. tail -f /var/log/messages Now try booting a couple clients. if they still do not boot up,post back here what the output is after the /var/log/messages. Also,try plugging in a laptop you have available into the switch that is feeding the the thin clients. This will tell you if this laptop is receiving dhcp and if all of the ip information looks correct to what you think it should be. This will get you started at least. Barry From burke at thealmquists.net Mon Mar 30 03:00:34 2009 From: burke at thealmquists.net (Almquist Burke) Date: Sun, 29 Mar 2009 22:00:34 -0500 Subject: [K12OSN] dhcpd.conf In-Reply-To: <1238365649.16299.9.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <1238365649.16299.9.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 By chance, do you don't have your network cards reversed so that ltspbr0 is associated with the card not facing your clients? -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.7 (Darwin) iEYEARECAAYFAknQNdIACgkQxWV7OPa/g5GosACeKAkvmnDXULfo/3jIRdCqddcO GIQAoIKsA63XFFJIVe2uFN1K4ywgNgJw =zpmW -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From wtogami at redhat.com Mon Mar 30 05:14:41 2009 From: wtogami at redhat.com (Warren Togami) Date: Mon, 30 Mar 2009 01:14:41 -0400 Subject: [K12OSN] dhcpd.conf In-Reply-To: <1238365649.16299.9.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <1238365649.16299.9.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <49D05541.8060800@redhat.com> On 03/29/2009 06:27 PM, Barry R Cisna wrote: > Hi Gabriel, > > The actual dhcp config file resides at /etc/dhcp-k12ltsp.conf. It does? The one shipped in LTSP5 for Fedora is /etc/ltsp/dhcpd.conf. Warren From gianugo.altieri at tiscali.it Mon Mar 30 10:19:42 2009 From: gianugo.altieri at tiscali.it (Gianugo Altieri) Date: Mon, 30 Mar 2009 12:19:42 +0200 Subject: [K12OSN] Introducing ourselves Message-ID: <49D09CBE.4090604@tiscali.it> Dear All, we run a tiny engineering company in the biomedical field, and we wish to share our experience with K12. Being born only last January, we started our computer network straight with Fedora 10 and K12 from the very beginning. Our configuration is: Server: Intel Coreduo 2.5 GHz - 4 GB RAM - 160 GB disk - dual 1Gbps LAN cards running Fedora 10 3 Clients: Intel ATOM littlefalls 2 - 2 GB RAM - diskless - 1 Gbps LAN card Starting with the LiveUSB image, and following instructions, I was able to setup a working LAN in less than half an hour. Instructions were really easy to follow and everything worked as expected. I was amazed! Then I copied the live image to server's disk, and loaded the server with all the necessary software packages from the Internet, and it worked fine. Internet and the outside world are connected through the first LAN port (ETH0) while LTSP terminals are connected through second LAN port (ETH1) and a Gbps switch. I have a couple of wishes in my list, for K12. First of all, I would like to be able to connect printers to thin clients. In fact, for safety reasons, server resides in a closed room, and it would be impractical to connect a printer to it. A convenient location for printers would be beside clients, but it seems clients cannot "see" USB printers, or at least our HP laser. Strangely enough, clients recognize USB pen-drives, but not USB external DVD readers, so I can't figure out why some USB peripherals are working ad some aren't. Second problem is a fat client I wish to link. It runs Fedora 8 with some legacy software. I'm trying to let it "open a window" on the server for a graphical login, and also vice versa, i.e. let the server (and therefore the thin clients) open a graphical login on it. The problem is that I don't know how to do it. If I connect the fat client to LTSP LAN, it grabs an IP, but that's all. It doesn't even "ping" the server, let alone opening a remote desktop on it. Any suggestion? I will read through K12 mailing list to see if somebody has already met and solved such problems, but if meanwhile some suggestions arrive, I'd be really grateful. Gianugo Altieri Filignano, Italy From sbarar at gmail.com Mon Mar 30 10:40:18 2009 From: sbarar at gmail.com (Sudev Barar) Date: Mon, 30 Mar 2009 16:10:18 +0530 Subject: [K12OSN] Introducing ourselves In-Reply-To: <49D09CBE.4090604@tiscali.it> References: <49D09CBE.4090604@tiscali.it> Message-ID: <774593a20903300340h1eee0a10i95e9792ad9d9c119@mail.gmail.com> 2009/3/30 Gianugo Altieri : > ? I have a couple of wishes in my list, for K12. First of all, I would like > to be able to connect printers to thin clients. In fact, for safety reasons, > server resides in a closed room, and it would be impractical to connect a > printer to it. A convenient location for printers would be beside clients, > but it seems clients cannot "see" USB printers, or at least our HP laser. > Strangely enough, clients recognize USB pen-drives, but not USB external DVD > readers, so I can't figure out why some USB peripherals are working ad some > aren't. If the printer is able to work on the server then you can configure it to work on client. You will needa client with USB2 sockets. I am working four/five printers in my office like this. > ? Second problem is a fat client I wish to link. It runs Fedora 8 with some > legacy software. I'm trying to let it "open a window" on the server for a > graphical login, and also vice versa, i.e. let the server (and therefore the > thin clients) open a graphical login on it. The problem is that I don't know > how to do it. If I connect the fat client to LTSP LAN, it grabs an IP, but > that's all. It doesn't even "ping" the server, let alone opening a remote > desktop on it. Any suggestion? Not very clear but if you want to open a session on server from client you can do that by some thing like: Xnest -indirect serverip :1 Or from client do ssh -X serverip and then after log in run the command. In simple terms the -X allows graphical pass through. If you need to run from server on the client something then you will have to configure client to make sure that it allows remote logins and also forwarding of XDMCP. HTH -- Regards, Sudev Barar Read http://blog.sudev.in for topics ranging from here to there. PS: I know most of people do not follow email niceties (mostly they are not aware) but if you follow bottom post/in-line post style of email conversations it becomes a whole lot easier to carry on meaningful dialogue and you can snip out what is not meaningful too. Most people just hit reply button and top post leaving prior message appended uselessly at bottom. See if you can adopt this style and persuade others. In case you are already doing this ..... great, spread the message. From microman at cmosnetworks.com Mon Mar 30 13:31:19 2009 From: microman at cmosnetworks.com (=?ISO-8859-15?Q?=22Terrell_Prud=E9_Jr=2E=22?=) Date: Mon, 30 Mar 2009 09:31:19 -0400 Subject: [K12OSN] Introducing ourselves In-Reply-To: <49D09CBE.4090604@tiscali.it> References: <49D09CBE.4090604@tiscali.it> Message-ID: <49D0C9A7.8030402@cmosnetworks.com> Gianugo Altieri wrote: > I have a couple of wishes in my list, for K12. First of all, I > would like to be able to connect printers to thin clients. In fact, > for safety reasons, server resides in a closed room, and it would be > impractical to connect a printer to it. A convenient location for > printers would be beside clients, but it seems clients cannot "see" > USB printers, or at least our HP laser. Strangely enough, clients > recognize USB pen-drives, but not USB external DVD readers, so I can't > figure out why some USB peripherals are working ad some aren't. Hello and welcome, Gianugo, An easier idea might be to get some network printers, i. e. printers with network cards in them. Then, you can place the printers wherever you want, including beside a client if you wish, but they would still be "connected" to the K12 server through Ethernet. This is how we have our printers set up at work, and I do the same at home. It's great. --TP From microman at cmosnetworks.com Mon Mar 30 13:45:10 2009 From: microman at cmosnetworks.com (=?ISO-8859-15?Q?=22Terrell_Prud=E9_Jr=2E=22?=) Date: Mon, 30 Mar 2009 09:45:10 -0400 Subject: [K12OSN] Introducing ourselves In-Reply-To: <49D09CBE.4090604@tiscali.it> References: <49D09CBE.4090604@tiscali.it> Message-ID: <49D0CCE6.7040709@cmosnetworks.com> Gianugo Altieri wrote: > > Second problem is a fat client I wish to link. It runs Fedora 8 > with some legacy software. I'm trying to let it "open a window" on the > server for a graphical login, and also vice versa, i.e. let the server > (and therefore the thin clients) open a graphical login on it. The > problem is that I don't know how to do it. If I connect the fat client > to LTSP LAN, it grabs an IP, but that's all. It doesn't even "ping" > the server, let alone opening a remote desktop on it. Any suggestion? It should certainly be able to ping the server, *if* this fat client is also on the LTSP client network. If not, i. e. it's on the main company LAN and you're using the classic two-NIC LTSP setup, then you have two choices: 1.) poke a hole in the K12 server's firewall rules for SSH and X11, or 2.) place the Fedora 8 fat client on the LTSP client network. I would recommend the second choice, for two reasons. First, you don't need to poke any holes in the built-in packet filter for X11 (proper security is always good). Second, it's just lower maintenance. Now, once you can ping the K12 server, here's how I would handle graphical logins. I will use KDE as an example, since that's what I happen to run. From your K Menu, choose "Switch user", and choose "Start New Session". You'll get a new graphical login screen, and one of the options at the lower left are two options--"Session Type" and "Menu". Choose "Menu". Of the choices, one of them is "Remote login". That's the one you want. Just point that at your K12 server's IP address, and boom, you have a K12 login prompt. Meanwhile, your "original" Fedora 8 session is still running. To switch between them, you use F7 (to go back) and F8 (to go forward). I'm not sure how easy it would be to have the clients be able to do the same to the Fedora 8 box, because I've never done that. But fundamentally, it should be possible. It might take some fiddling with some of the configuration files under /opt/ltsp/i386...or if your client has X11 with XDMCP built in, you should be able to configure the client directly. What you want at that point is what's called an "indirect" X11 query. Do some Googling for that--"indirect query", XDMCP, and X11. --TP From brcisna at eazylivin.net Mon Mar 30 19:52:41 2009 From: brcisna at eazylivin.net (Barry R Cisna) Date: Mon, 30 Mar 2009 14:52:41 -0500 Subject: [K12OSN] dhcpd.conf Message-ID: <1238442761.23886.2.camel@localhost.localdomain> Oops,,, My Bad, I seen the ltsp 4.2 Didn't see the FC10. I'm a scatterbrain,what can I say... Barry From tonythaaloca at yahoo.com Tue Mar 31 09:00:33 2009 From: tonythaaloca at yahoo.com (mbiatem joben) Date: Tue, 31 Mar 2009 02:00:33 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [K12OSN] help for linux friends Message-ID: <298820.92824.qm@web39507.mail.mud.yahoo.com> HI ALL AM JOBEN BISSONG, I LIVE IN DOUALA, CAMEROON, CENTRAL AFRICA. AM JOBEN BISSONG AND WITH A GROUP OF PASSIONATE LINUX FANATICS WE HAVE STARTED AN ASSOCIATION TO PROMOTE OPEN SOURCE SOFTWARES. WE HAVE A SERVER RUNNING ON DEBIAN AND WE WISH TO START USING LTSP TO START OUT LAN INORDER TO START TRAINING IN OUR COMMUNITY BUT WE LACK FUNDS PLUS WE DO NOT KNOW HOW TO GO ABOUT GETTING LTSPs. CAN ANYBODY HELP? ADVICE, FUNDS, ENCOURAGEMENTS, DOCUMENTATIONS, TUTORIALS ETC...ETC ARE ALL WELCOME. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From tonythaaloca at yahoo.com Tue Mar 31 09:07:44 2009 From: tonythaaloca at yahoo.com (mbiatem joben) Date: Tue, 31 Mar 2009 02:07:44 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [K12OSN] dhcpd.conf Message-ID: <711322.46860.qm@web39505.mail.mud.yahoo.com> HI ALL AM JOBEN BISSONG, I LIVE IN DOUALA, CAMEROON, CENTRAL AFRICA. AM JOBEN BISSONG AND WITH A GROUP OF PASSIONATE LINUX FANATICS WE HAVE STARTED AN ASSOCIATION TO PROMOTE OPEN SOURCE SOFTWARES. WE HAVE A SERVER RUNNING ON DEBIAN AND WE WISH TO START USING LTSP TO START OUT LAN INORDER TO START TRAINING IN OUR COMMUNITY BUT WE LACK FUNDS PLUS WE DO NOT KNOW HOW TO GO ABOUT GETTING LTSPs. CAN ANYBODY HELP? ADVICE, FUNDS, ENCOURAGEMENTS, DOCUMENTATIONS, TUTORIALS ETC...ETC U ARE ALL WELCOME. ##################################################################################### --- On Mon, 3/30/09, Barry R Cisna wrote: From: Barry R Cisna Subject: Re: [K12OSN] dhcpd.conf To: "K12LTSP" Date: Monday, March 30, 2009, 12:52 PM Oops,,, My Bad, I seen the ltsp 4.2 Didn't see the FC10. I'm a scatterbrain,what can I say... Barry _______________________________________________ K12OSN mailing list K12OSN at redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn For more info see -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From stretchem at gmail.com Tue Mar 31 15:24:05 2009 From: stretchem at gmail.com (M Rathburn) Date: Tue, 31 Mar 2009 11:24:05 -0400 Subject: [K12OSN] help for linux friends In-Reply-To: <298820.92824.qm@web39507.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <49d23593.2204be0a.7a8f.2bef@mx.google.com> Start here: www.linuxfoundation.org From gabriellopeza at hotmail.com Tue Mar 31 19:21:44 2009 From: gabriellopeza at hotmail.com (gabriel lopez) Date: Tue, 31 Mar 2009 19:21:44 +0000 Subject: [K12OSN] dhcpd.conf In-Reply-To: <20090329190235.GA31929@aurora.owens.net> References: <20090329190235.GA31929@aurora.owens.net> Message-ID: > Date: Sun, 29 Mar 2009 15:02:35 -0400 > From: rowens at ptd.net > To: k12osn at redhat.com > Subject: Re: [K12OSN] dhcpd.conf > > Debian/Ubuntu use /etc/ltsp/dhcpd.conf -- maybe try looking there? (I've never used K12Linux) > > -Rob > > On Sun, Mar 29, 2009 at 03:01:26PM +0000, gabriel lopez wrote: > > > > I installed K12Linux F10 Stable 4 i386 (ISO) on USB following instructions from https://fedorahosted.org/liveusb-creator and configured the network as described on the manual (two network cards) . I can connect to internet from server (booting from USB) but clients do not boot. "No ip address" > > I has some experience wih LTSP4.2 but none with LTSP5.0. > > What i do find id that /etc/dhcpd.conf is empty. > > Should'nt it something on it as on ltsp4.2? > > If so, could someone send me a example of it. > > > > _________________________________________________________________ > > Discover the new Windows Vista > > http://search.msn.com/results.aspx?q=windows+vista&mkt=en-US&form=QBRE > > _______________________________________________ > > K12OSN mailing list > > K12OSN at redhat.com > > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > > For more info see > > _______________________________________________ > K12OSN mailing list > K12OSN at redhat.com > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > For more info see You are right it is at "/etc/ltsp/dhcpd.conf" Thanks _________________________________________________________________ Discover the new Windows Vista http://search.msn.com/results.aspx?q=windows+vista&mkt=en-US&form=QBRE -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From gabriellopeza at hotmail.com Tue Mar 31 19:58:59 2009 From: gabriellopeza at hotmail.com (gabriel lopez) Date: Tue, 31 Mar 2009 19:58:59 +0000 Subject: [K12OSN] dhcpd.conf In-Reply-To: <1238365649.16299.9.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <1238365649.16299.9.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: > Subject: Re: [K12OSN] dhcpd.conf > From: brcisna at eazylivin.net > To: k12osn at redhat.com > Date: Sun, 29 Mar 2009 17:27:29 -0500 > > Hi Gabriel, > > The actual dhcp config file resides at /etc/dhcp-k12ltsp.conf. > Regardless, if you used all the default settings during setup the > clients should boot up. Try the following in a terminal window as root; > > 1. service dhcpd restart > ,,,two times. Make sure you see a green "OK". > if this comes up OKart do; > 2. service iptables stop > 3. tail -f /var/log/messages > > Now try booting a couple clients. if they still do not boot up,post back > here what the output is after the /var/log/messages. > > Also,try plugging in a laptop you have available into the switch that is > feeding the the thin clients. This will tell you if this laptop is > receiving dhcp and if all of the ip information looks correct to what > you think it should be. > This will get you started at least. > > Barry > > _______________________________________________ > K12OSN mailing list > K12OSN at redhat.com > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > For more info see found dhcpd.conf on /etc/ltsp but "service network restart" does not start the service. I will reinstall it on this USB and start all over again in case i did something wrong. Thanks. _________________________________________________________________ Discover the new Windows Vista http://search.msn.com/results.aspx?q=windows+vista&mkt=en-US&form=QBRE -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From dahopkins429 at gmail.com Tue Mar 31 20:22:50 2009 From: dahopkins429 at gmail.com (David Hopkins) Date: Tue, 31 Mar 2009 16:22:50 -0400 Subject: [K12OSN] dhcpd.conf In-Reply-To: References: <1238365649.16299.9.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: > > found dhcpd.conf on /etc/ltsp but "service network restart" does not start > the service. > > I will reinstall it on this USB and start all over again in case i did > something wrong. > I think you need "service dhcpd restart" Sincerely, Dave Hopkins From dyoung at mesd.k12.or.us Tue Mar 31 20:30:33 2009 From: dyoung at mesd.k12.or.us (Dan Young) Date: Tue, 31 Mar 2009 13:30:33 -0700 Subject: [K12OSN] dhcpd.conf In-Reply-To: References: <1238365649.16299.9.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <994441ae0903311330y1ce41863j76356c5d8187a4df@mail.gmail.com> On Tue, Mar 31, 2009 at 1:22 PM, David Hopkins wrote: >> >> found dhcpd.conf on /etc/ltsp but "service network restart" does not start >> the service. >> >> I will reinstall it on this USB and start all over again in case i did >> something wrong. >> > > I think you need "service dhcpd restart" The LTSP DHCP server initscript in K12Linux is: /etc/init.d/ltsp-dhcpd So: service ltsp-dhcpd restart -- Dan Young Multnomah ESD - Technology Services 503-257-1562 From dahopkins429 at gmail.com Tue Mar 31 20:32:44 2009 From: dahopkins429 at gmail.com (David Hopkins) Date: Tue, 31 Mar 2009 16:32:44 -0400 Subject: [K12OSN] Custom xorg.conf Message-ID: With FC10 and ltsp5, how do I get X -configure to run at the client to generate an xorg.conf file that I can then use to force certain settings? In particular, I need to force 1024/x768 resolution at 75Hz. The autodetect sets the screens to 1280x1024 at 60Hz, but the preferred resolution of the monitor is the lower setting. I have tried simply running X -configure (via using a shell at the client) and I get that the file //xorg.conf.new can't be located. For that matter, is an xorg.conf file created automatically at client boot? If so, I can't find that file either. I do have the xorg.log files if needed. Sincerely, Dave Hopkins From dahopkins429 at gmail.com Tue Mar 31 20:33:56 2009 From: dahopkins429 at gmail.com (David Hopkins) Date: Tue, 31 Mar 2009 16:33:56 -0400 Subject: [K12OSN] dhcpd.conf In-Reply-To: <994441ae0903311330y1ce41863j76356c5d8187a4df@mail.gmail.com> References: <1238365649.16299.9.camel@localhost.localdomain> <994441ae0903311330y1ce41863j76356c5d8187a4df@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Dan, Thanks!!! That is also a little different than earlier versions. Sincerely, Dave Hopkins On Tue, Mar 31, 2009 at 4:30 PM, Dan Young wrote: > On Tue, Mar 31, 2009 at 1:22 PM, David Hopkins wrote: >>> >>> found dhcpd.conf on /etc/ltsp but "service network restart" does not start >>> the service. >>> >>> I will reinstall it on this USB and start all over again in case i did >>> something wrong. >>> >> >> I think you need "service dhcpd restart" > > The LTSP DHCP server initscript in K12Linux is: > /etc/init.d/ltsp-dhcpd > > So: > service ltsp-dhcpd restart > > -- > Dan Young > Multnomah ESD - Technology Services > 503-257-1562 > > _______________________________________________ > K12OSN mailing list > K12OSN at redhat.com > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > For more info see > From rowens at ptd.net Tue Mar 31 20:54:29 2009 From: rowens at ptd.net (Rob Owens) Date: Tue, 31 Mar 2009 16:54:29 -0400 Subject: [K12OSN] dhcpd.conf In-Reply-To: <994441ae0903311330y1ce41863j76356c5d8187a4df@mail.gmail.com> References: <1238365649.16299.9.camel@localhost.localdomain> <994441ae0903311330y1ce41863j76356c5d8187a4df@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20090331205429.GB5380@aurora.owens.net> On Tue, Mar 31, 2009 at 01:30:33PM -0700, Dan Young wrote: > On Tue, Mar 31, 2009 at 1:22 PM, David Hopkins wrote: > >> > >> found dhcpd.conf on /etc/ltsp but "service network restart" does not start > >> the service. > >> > >> I will reinstall it on this USB and start all over again in case i did > >> something wrong. > >> > > > > I think you need "service dhcpd restart" > > The LTSP DHCP server initscript in K12Linux is: > /etc/init.d/ltsp-dhcpd > > So: > service ltsp-dhcpd restart > It is for this reason that I always specify the path and run: /etc/init.d/somescript restart That way I can use tab completion when I don't know the exact name of "somescript" -Rob From rowens at ptd.net Tue Mar 31 20:55:32 2009 From: rowens at ptd.net (Rob Owens) Date: Tue, 31 Mar 2009 16:55:32 -0400 Subject: [K12OSN] Custom xorg.conf In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20090331205532.GC5380@aurora.owens.net> You could try booting a knoppix cd or usb to runlevel 2, then run X -configure. -Rob On Tue, Mar 31, 2009 at 04:32:44PM -0400, David Hopkins wrote: > With FC10 and ltsp5, how do I get X -configure to run at the client to > generate an xorg.conf file that I can then use to force certain > settings? In particular, I need to force 1024/x768 resolution at > 75Hz. The autodetect sets the screens to 1280x1024 at 60Hz, but the > preferred resolution of the monitor is the lower setting. I have > tried simply running X -configure (via using a shell at the client) > and I get that the file //xorg.conf.new can't be located. For that > matter, is an xorg.conf file created automatically at client boot? If > so, I can't find that file either. I do have the xorg.log files if > needed. > > Sincerely, > Dave Hopkins > > _______________________________________________ > K12OSN mailing list > K12OSN at redhat.com > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > For more info see From dyoung at mesd.k12.or.us Tue Mar 31 21:26:40 2009 From: dyoung at mesd.k12.or.us (Dan Young) Date: Tue, 31 Mar 2009 14:26:40 -0700 Subject: [K12OSN] dhcpd.conf In-Reply-To: <20090331205429.GB5380@aurora.owens.net> References: <1238365649.16299.9.camel@localhost.localdomain> <994441ae0903311330y1ce41863j76356c5d8187a4df@mail.gmail.com> <20090331205429.GB5380@aurora.owens.net> Message-ID: <994441ae0903311426y70b7eb31u494646b700b4a9b1@mail.gmail.com> On Tue, Mar 31, 2009 at 1:54 PM, Rob Owens wrote: > It is for this reason that I always specify the path and run: > > /etc/init.d/somescript restart > > That way I can use tab completion when I don't know the exact name of "somescript" Apparently "service" runs initscripts in a more predictable setting by clearing most environment variables and is thus preferred. In practice, I often tab-complete the initscripts directly too. -- Dan Young Multnomah ESD - Technology Services 503-257-1562 From jthomas at bittware.com Tue Mar 31 21:29:03 2009 From: jthomas at bittware.com (j.w. thomas) Date: Tue, 31 Mar 2009 17:29:03 -0400 Subject: [K12OSN] dhcpd.conf In-Reply-To: <20090331205429.GB5380@aurora.owens.net> References: <1238365649.16299.9.camel@localhost.localdomain> <994441ae0903311330y1ce41863j76356c5d8187a4df@mail.gmail.com> <20090331205429.GB5380@aurora.owens.net> Message-ID: <49D28B1F.8010204@bittware.com> Rob Owens wrote: > On Tue, Mar 31, 2009 at 01:30:33PM -0700, Dan Young wrote: >> On Tue, Mar 31, 2009 at 1:22 PM, David Hopkins wrote: >>>> found dhcpd.conf on /etc/ltsp but "service network restart" does not start >>>> the service. >>>> >>>> I will reinstall it on this USB and start all over again in case i did >>>> something wrong. >>>> >>> I think you need "service dhcpd restart" >> The LTSP DHCP server initscript in K12Linux is: >> /etc/init.d/ltsp-dhcpd >> >> So: >> service ltsp-dhcpd restart >> > It is for this reason that I always specify the path and run: > > /etc/init.d/somescript restart > > That way I can use tab completion when I don't know the exact name of "somescript" > > -Rob I ran Kubuntu on my laptop for a couple of months and then switched back to Fedora. The only thing I miss about Kubuntu is that tab completion works on the service command. So "service dhcp restart" actually worked there. Oh. I also miss that the mute and volume controls worked under Kubuntu, but not on F10. Not saying I'm sorry I switched though. -- Jim Thomas Principal Applications Engineer Bittware, Inc jthomas at bittware.com http://www.bittware.com (603) 226-0404 x536 Anything is possible if you don't know what you are talking about. From rowens at ptd.net Tue Mar 31 23:56:41 2009 From: rowens at ptd.net (Rob Owens) Date: Tue, 31 Mar 2009 19:56:41 -0400 Subject: [K12OSN] dhcpd.conf In-Reply-To: <994441ae0903311426y70b7eb31u494646b700b4a9b1@mail.gmail.com> References: <1238365649.16299.9.camel@localhost.localdomain> <994441ae0903311330y1ce41863j76356c5d8187a4df@mail.gmail.com> <20090331205429.GB5380@aurora.owens.net> <994441ae0903311426y70b7eb31u494646b700b4a9b1@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20090331235641.GA6356@aurora.owens.net> On Tue, Mar 31, 2009 at 02:26:40PM -0700, Dan Young wrote: > On Tue, Mar 31, 2009 at 1:54 PM, Rob Owens wrote: > > It is for this reason that I always specify the path and run: > > > > /etc/init.d/somescript restart > > > > That way I can use tab completion when I don't know the exact name of "somescript" > > Apparently "service" runs initscripts in a more predictable setting by > clearing most environment variables and is thus preferred. In > practice, I often tab-complete the initscripts directly too. > That's good to know. Thanks. -Rob