<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN"> <HTML><HEAD> <META http-equiv=Content-Type content="text/html; charset=us-ascii"> <META content="MSHTML 6.00.3790.2577" name=GENERATOR></HEAD> <BODY> <DIV dir=ltr align=left>All,</DIV> <DIV dir=ltr align=left> </DIV> <DIV dir=ltr align=left>I guess it depends on what you consider censorship also. The Children's Internet Protection Act (<A href="http://www.ifea.net/cipa.pdf">http://www.ifea.net/cipa.pdf</A>) gives us guidelines of what should be censored. In that act it also gives school boards and district administration the right to decide what else should be censored in their respective school district beyond what is covered in the CIPA. If you don't want any censorship or don't approve of it, go to your public library. The majority, if not all, of public libraries do not filter at all. Our computers are for educational purposes. They aren't for surfing the web, checking commercial email (hotmail, gmail, aol, etc.), or playing games. That goes for both staff and students in our district. This is something to remember. And me personally, I'd rather be accussed of over censoring than under censoring....</DIV> <DIV dir=ltr align=left> </DIV> <DIV dir=ltr align=left>-Paul</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV align=left>--</DIV> <DIV align=left>Paul VanGundy</DIV> <DIV align=left>Information Technology Director</DIV> <DIV align=left>Epping High School</DIV> <DIV align=left>Epping Middle School</DIV> <DIV align=left>P: 603.679.5472</DIV> <DIV align=left>F: 603.679.2966</DIV> <DIV align=left><A href="mailto:vangundypw@sau14.k12.nh.us">vangundypw@sau14.k12.nh.us</A></DIV> <DIV align=left>Registered Linux User #398783</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV class=OutlookMessageHeader lang=en-us dir=ltr align=left> <HR tabIndex=-1> From: k12osn-bounces@redhat.com [mailto:k12osn-bounces@redhat.com] On Behalf Of Timothy Hart Sent: Wednesday, January 25, 2006 12:28 PM To: Support list for opensource software in schools. Subject: Re: [K12OSN] OT: "MySpace.com" or "policies for when computer useleads to ass </DIV> <DIV></DIV>Dave I couldn't agree more. I don't think teachers plugging into the culture will solve everything. But it will help, as the rest of your email proves. You are aware of these things and are doing things to help the parents out. You are also doing such in a manner which if not punitive as someone else mentioned. You are using "reasonable" (again a moving target) content filtering. You are letting parents know about these things so they can be a better informed parent. All fantastic things. My original argument, as unclear as I may have been, was to not just lock everything down tightly and that be the end of it. I also saw that Dateline. The scary thing was that a bunch of those guys even say the report on TV and still did it. The effort you are putting forth is obviously the way to go here. Parent and child education is the direction to take. I guess I am just pushing the devils advocate view here to make sure we just don't go too far in our censorship and that it is done with all views in mind. <DIV>On 1/25/06, David Trask <<A href="mailto:dtrask@vcsvikings.org">dtrask@vcsvikings.org</A>> wrote: <BLOCKQUOTE class=gmail_quote style="PADDING-LEFT: 1ex; MARGIN: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; BORDER-LEFT: rgb(204,204,204) 1px solid">I'm going to say "yes, but..." Here's why. You mention that as teachers plug into the same culture as the kids do...then these issues will go away. I doubt it...and the reason is that even the most tech savvy teachers (including me) have no desire to troll MySpace.com for whatever reason. In many cases...these activities are adolescent activities primarily done by young people looking to "hook up" or "express themselves". We've all been there, but we're not there anymore. We had our own ways of "hooking up" and so forth that our parents did not know about. The problem now becomes...the criminal element. Their are multitude of pedophiles out there who have now found the Internet to be a GREAT place to hunt their prey. Dateline NBC aired a special recently about how pedophiles use chatrooms and blogs to meet up with children. It was pretty sobering. It's the nature of adolescents to think they're invincible...and back in my teen years...that was dangerous, but primarily only to myself. Now with the instant availablity of information....our teens are in even more danger...not from themselves, but from others...such as pedophiles. Now...you're right...we can't be all things....we cannot b parents to these kids.....but I hav emailed copies of MySpace pages to well meaning parents who simply had no idea...and once they did....they dealt with it. It's unlikely, but my own 7th grade daughter could have a "secret" blog online and I may not know about it. I've talked about it and educated her...etc., but who knows? The other thing to remember is that all of this has mushroomed in a span of the last couple years. That's why I think that it's neccessary for us as tech leaders to begin making parents aware of just what is going on. We're planning a parent night just for this purpose. We plan to show them what is going on...using examples of MySpace.com...etc. and what they can do about it....through educating their child or even monitoring their child. Every teenager will cry "foul" about invading their space, but hey....that's what being a parent is all about. As a parent myself...I feel a little obligated to help my fellow parents out...by protecting them as much as possible at school with reasonable content filtering...and by tipping the parents off to what may be going on that they're not aware of. "Support list for opensource software in schools." < <A href="mailto:k12osn@redhat.com">k12osn@redhat.com</A>> on Wed Jan 25 2006 at 11:01 +0000 wrote: >Look, the only thing I worry about here is going too far with the amount >of responsibilty schools put on themselves to raise children. That is all >I am saying. > >Also please do not automatically peg my being (by my own admission) >young"er" with not being experienced enough to offer an opinion. I am not >saying anything about a "Laissez faire" attitude, I just offer caution >with going too far the other way. I am not saying content filtering is >bad or that an eye shouldn't be looked at certain things. My point is >that it isn't the only issue that should be brought to light. It upsets >me that we are in a world when you jump on me for suggesting that parents >be responsible for their own children. > >I don't think I want to go to far into the age thing, but please do not >discriminate against my saying I was younger. I offered that to suggest >as teachers get more tech savy and actually "plug" into the same culture >as the kids, a lot of these issues will go away. Not all, but teachers >will be able to model good behavior. Not going to solve everything, that >was just the point I was making. > >Now about your teacher taken away in handcuffs. I would like to hear more >about it. Is it your responsibility as a school to keep the individual >out of trouble? I would argue to a point, yes. Where that point is is the >question, and invariably will lie in a different place in different >situations, as it should. I do not beleive it is laissez faire to say >this but schools should be leary of just blocking "stuff." It just >reminds me too much of China. Maybe I have read 1984 too much. Actually >it stems from all that Lawrence Lessig. > >By the way, good discussion. I like a little heat on the list. > >Tim Hart >"Young, but know a thing or two." > >On 1/24/06, Jim Hays <[ mailto:<A href="mailto:haysja@sages.us">haysja@sages.us</A> ]haysja@<A href="http://sages.us">sages.us</A>> wrote: > >You say you are young enough to participate in many of the same tech >activities as the kids. I take that to mean that you haven't had a lot >of experience in the educational world. This "laissez faire" attitude >is real nice until a group of FBI agents and Homeland Security Agents >and State Police show up at the front door and you as the technology >coordinator get pulled into the middle of a "mess". An hour later one >of our most respected teachers was lead away in handcuffs because of >what he was doing online. > >Now that will change your views on content filtering in a hurry. > > >Timothy Hart wrote: > >> >> >> On 1/24/06, *Tom Hoffman* <[ mailto:<A href="mailto:tom.hoffman@gmail.com">tom.hoffman@gmail.com</A> ] ><A href="mailto:tom.hoffman@gmail.com">tom.hoffman@gmail.com</A> >> <mailto:[ mailto:<A href="mailto:tom.hoffman@gmail.com">tom.hoffman@gmail.com</A> ]tom.hoffman@<A href="http://gmail.com">gmail.com</A>>> wrote: >> >> >> Yes, but doesn't becoming more tech savvy = being able to navigate >> MySpace, etc., oneself? >> >> >> Yes, I agree. >> >> There is nothing either fascist or censorial about reading public >> material on the web. Part of being tech savvy is understanding >that. >> >> >> I am saying that it would be a waste to have someone reading all the >> material looking for people saying mean things and what not. My point >> was as we do become more tech savy this will happen automatically. >> >> The question is whether or not the school has effective methods of >> addressing issues in students lives that aren't strictly punitive >> (advisors, counselors, mentors, therapists, etc.). >> >> >> I agree also to a point. I do have to point out here that the first >> line of responsibility if the parent. It takes a parent, not a village >> to raise a child. The village should support and nuture. I have been >> reading a lot of material that suggests other wise, so I am kind of >> wound up on that fact. >> >> I beleive we are on the same page Tom. I think we are just looking at >> it from different angles. >> >> >> --Tom >> >> _______________________________________________ >> K12OSN mailing list >> [ mailto:<A href="mailto:K12OSN@redhat.com">K12OSN@redhat.com </A>]K12OSN@<A href="http://redhat.com">redhat.com</A> <mailto:[ >mailto:<A href="mailto:K12OSN@redhat.com">K12OSN@redhat.com</A> ] <A href="mailto:K12OSN@redhat.com">K12OSN@redhat.com</A>> >> [ <A href="https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn">https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn</A> >]https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn >> <[ <A href="https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn">https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn</A> >]https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > >> For more info see <[ <A href="http://www.k12os.org">http://www.k12os.org</A> ]http://www.k12os.org> >> >> >>------------------------------------------------------------------------ >> >>_______________________________________________ >>K12OSN mailing list >>[ mailto: <A href="mailto:K12OSN@redhat.com">K12OSN@redhat.com</A> ]K12OSN@<A href="http://redhat.com">redhat.com</A> >>[ <A href="https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn">https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn </A> >]https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn >>For more info see < [ <A href="http://www.k12os.org">http://www.k12os.org</A> ]http://www.k12os.org> >> > >-- >-------------------------------------------------------- >Jim Hays, Technology Coordinator >Monticello CUSD#25 >#2 Sage Drive >Monticello, IL 61856 >(217) 762-8511 ext 1208 >[ mailto:<A href="mailto:haysja@sages.us">haysja@sages.us</A> ]haysja@ <A href="http://sages.us">sages.us</A> >-------------------------------------------------------- > >_______________________________________________ >K12OSN mailing list >[ mailto:<A href="mailto:K12OSN@redhat.com"> K12OSN@redhat.com</A> ]K12OSN@<A href="http://redhat.com">redhat.com</A> >[ <A href="https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn">https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn</A> >]https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn >For more info see <[ <A href="http://www.k12os.org">http://www.k12os.org</A> ] <A href="http://www.k12os.org">http://www.k12os.org</A>> > > >_______________________________________________ >K12OSN mailing list ><A href="mailto:K12OSN@redhat.com">K12OSN@redhat.com</A> ><A href="https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn">https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn</A> >For more info see < <A href="http://www.k12os.org">http://www.k12os.org</A>> David N. Trask Technology Teacher/Director Vassalboro Community School <A href="mailto:dtrask@vcsvikings.org">dtrask@vcsvikings.org</A> (207)923-3100 _______________________________________________ K12OSN mailing list <A href="mailto:K12OSN@redhat.com">K12OSN@redhat.com</A> <A href="https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn">https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn </A> For more info see <<A href="http://www.k12os.org">http://www.k12os.org</A>> </BLOCKQUOTE></DIV> </BODY></HTML>