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Thanks for providing this feedback, Brian.! Good stuff.<br>
<br>
<br>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 02/12/2018 03:57 PM, Brian Bouterse
wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite"
cite="mid:CAAcvrTFyCfCJ8VGP+-+nDhTAbCaRT7pnasy_6cY15QacKP61oQ@mail.gmail.com">
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<div>At the Foreman Construction day [0] last Wednesday, we had
our first code focused plugin writer's workshop. About 6
people were actively engaged as we talked through the plugin
API, example code, and then tried to install Pulp3. All of
this happened over about 4-5 hours. In contrast to the devconf
workshop which was planning focused, this was a "let's look at
and write some code together" workshop. Two attendees came to
both, and they got all the way to calling their own sync code.<br>
<br>
</div>
<div>We got a lot of feedback, which I will try to group into
some areas. (my feedback in parens)<br>
<br>
</div>
<div>[installation issues]<br>
- the pypi install commands are missing the migrations and
they produce broken installations<br>
</div>
<div>- the vagrantcloud boxes couldn't have a plugin installed
on them :(<br>
</div>
<div>- the dev environments worked great but we didn't recommend
them until we realized all of these other methods were broken<br>
</div>
<div>- we assume the user 'pulp' in a lot of places, e.g.
systemd file, ansible, etc<br>
</div>
<div>- assumptions about Fedora both in ansible, but also the
copy/paste commands<br>
</div>
<div>- some users who copied and pasted commands didn't realize
they weren't for their OS<br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>[desire for simpler things]<br>
</div>
<div>- there is a strong desire to use sqlite as the default db
not postgresql<br>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<br>
Very interesting. Can you elaborate about why?<br>
<br>
<blockquote type="cite"
cite="mid:CAAcvrTFyCfCJ8VGP+-+nDhTAbCaRT7pnasy_6cY15QacKP61oQ@mail.gmail.com">
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<div>- desire to not install a message bus. (I think this is
unavoidable)<br>
<br>
</div>
<div>[need examples]<br>
</div>
<div>- pulp_file is our example, but it's laid out into
different functions and classes. People were confused by this
because they thought the classes and function names are
meaningful when they aren't. For example we were asked "what
is a synchronizer" <a
href="https://github.com/pulp/pulp_file/blob/master/pulp_file/app/tasks.py#L139"
moz-do-not-send="true">https://github.com/pulp/pulp_file/blob/master/pulp_file/app/tasks.py#L139</a><br>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<br>
The Synchronizer used to be the FileImporter and got renamed as part
of early mitigation of the "circular import" problem. I plan to do
some final refactoring as soon as the plugin API stabilizes (really
soon). I suspect the Synchronizer class (at least the name), will
go away. That said, I'm a little puzzled as to what led to actual
"confusion" about a class named Synchronizer that was used to
synchronize a repository. You also mentioned that some of the
function names where somehow confusing - can you name them and why
they were confusing? <br>
<br>
<blockquote type="cite"
cite="mid:CAAcvrTFyCfCJ8VGP+-+nDhTAbCaRT7pnasy_6cY15QacKP61oQ@mail.gmail.com">
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<div>- pulp_file doesn't provide a good example because
changesets do everything for you. (The main pulp_file should
be a simple, direct example of the objects they have to save).<br>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<br>
True, but It does provides a good example of how to use the
ChangeSet.<br>
<br>
<blockquote type="cite"
cite="mid:CAAcvrTFyCfCJ8VGP+-+nDhTAbCaRT7pnasy_6cY15QacKP61oQ@mail.gmail.com">
<div dir="ltr">
<div>- people found pulp_example via github and thought "oh here
is what I needed to find!" only to base their code on outdated
code (we need to delete pulp_example)<br>
</div>
<div>- a database picture would be helpful to show off the data
layer objects, foreign keys, and attributes.<br>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<br>
Yes! We really need to publish an ER diagram. I'm overdue on an
action item to produce one.<br>
<br>
<blockquote type="cite"
cite="mid:CAAcvrTFyCfCJ8VGP+-+nDhTAbCaRT7pnasy_6cY15QacKP61oQ@mail.gmail.com">
<div dir="ltr">
<div><br>
</div>
<div>[specific things]<br>
</div>
<div>- 'id' on the inherited content unit conflicted with a
content unit which also uses 'id'.<br>
- qpid vs rabbitmq defaults confusion. The settings.yaml says
we default to qpid so they installed qpid, but really in
settings.py it's rabbitmq. (this is a 1 line fix)<br>
<br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>In terms of the installation challenges, we should consider
consolidating onto a single installation method of pip with
virtualenv. Of all the methods we offer [1] that is the one
everyone could use and no one minded. We could remove the
other options from the install page so that for for now
(pre-GA) everyone is doing the same, simple thing. I think we
should consolidate our effort and not focus on end-user
installations as the main thing right now.**<br>
<br>
</div>
<div>I also think we should do these things:<br>
<br>
</div>
<div>* switch pulp to use sqlite3 by default. An ansible
installer can both install postgres and configure it, later.<br>
</div>
<div>* rewrite pulp_file to be a really really simple example<br>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<br>
The file-plugin is already a "really really simple example".
Rewriting it not using the ChangeSet will significantly increase
code line count and complexity. As you know, the file-plugin
supports managing FileContent like .img and .iso files. The primary
goal of the pulp-file project is to support real use cases. Because
it's the only plugin, it has taken on a secondary goal of being an
example. I'm opposed to increasing complexity in support of the
secondary "example" goal at the expense of its primary goal. <br>
<br>
The file-plugin currently provides a good example of how to use the
ChangeSet. I have no doubt that plugin writers want additional
examples but I think that if we intend to continue to rely on "real"
plugins as natural examples, we should identify a plugin on the
roadmap that has made the design choice to be implemented without
the ChangeSet and prioritize it. Another choice could be to
refactor the example plugin to support a broader range of examples
and continue to maintain it.<br>
<br>
<blockquote type="cite"
cite="mid:CAAcvrTFyCfCJ8VGP+-+nDhTAbCaRT7pnasy_6cY15QacKP61oQ@mail.gmail.com">
<div dir="ltr">
<div>* delete pulp_example<br>
<br>
Please send ideas, questions, or any kind of feedback.<br>
<br>
[0]: <a href="http://cfgmgmtcamp.eu/fringe.html#foreman"
moz-do-not-send="true">http://cfgmgmtcamp.eu/fringe.html#foreman</a><br>
[1]: <a
href="https://docs.pulpproject.org/en/3.0/nightly/installation/index.html"
moz-do-not-send="true">https://docs.pulpproject.org/en/3.0/nightly/installation/index.html</a><br>
<br>
** I still see Ansible as the right cross-distro installer as
we approach the GA date. @ichimonji10 I am still +1 on your
proposal, I think we just need to consolidate both dev and
testing effort for now. This is similar to the approach for
the migration tool which we know is really important but we
aren't starting yet.<br>
<br>
</div>
<div>-Brian<br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
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