<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.01 Transitional//EN"> <html> <head> <meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/xhtml; charset=utf-8"> </head> <body> <div style="font-family:sans-serif"><div style="white-space:pre-wrap"><div dir="auto">Hi Travis! </div><div dir="auto"> </div><div dir="auto">I agree that today many-repo are problematic at a large scale. </div><div dir="auto"> </div><div dir="auto">I'm not sure the issue can be "fixed" at Almighty level alone since I think </div><div dir="auto">the main issue around this is the limits of git (does not have good composition/submodule support) </div><div dir="auto">and the whole infrastructure around the "one project=one repo" idea. </div><div dir="auto"> </div><div dir="auto">But I'm all ears for suggestions on how we could help improve it - it sounds </div><div dir="auto">like you have some thoughts on it. Care to share ? </div><div dir="auto"> </div><div dir="auto">/max </div><div dir="auto"> </div></div> <blockquote style="border-left:2px solid #777; color:#777; margin:0 0 5px; padding-left:5px"><div dir="ltr">I think my point was missed (probably not worded clearly). I am not mixing microservices and many-repo but relating them.<div><br></div><div>I don't think it's feasible with open source tools today to efficiently scale many microservices in a many-repo approach. In ALR's Push It Real Good presentation, the complexity and startup costs for a new idea were listed, and these are prohibitive (or at least inefficient) for you to take on for each small project. </div><div><br></div><div>I was hoping ALMighty would solve this problem so that many-repo could become a better option. And if it does solve the problem, then possibly the arguments in favor of mono-repo are not as strong since I assume ALMighty will eventually be maintained inside of ALMighty.</div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div>Regards,</div><div>Travis Brown</div><div><br></div><div><br></div></div><div class="gmail_extra"><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Thu, Sep 22, 2016 at 12:41 AM, Baiju Muthukadan <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:bmuthuka@redhat.com" target="_blank">bmuthuka@redhat.com</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">Hi Travis,<br> <br> On Thu, Sep 22, 2016 at 10:45 AM, Travis Brown <<a href="mailto:tkbrown@gmail.com">tkbrown@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br> [...snip...]<br> <span class="">> If the ALMighty project claims to make it easy to go from new<br> > project (and usually new repo) to production microservice but was in<br> > turn developed with a model that does not fit the goal it is<br> > enabling, then we are not eating our own dog food.<br> <br> </span>I think it's not a good idea to mix Monorepo and Microservices.<br> Monorepo is all about how we are going to organize source code in a<br> single repository. Whereas Microservices is an architectural style.<br> <br> Martin Fowler describe it this way [1]:<br> <br> The microservice architectural style is an approach to developing a<br> single application as a suite of small services, each running in its<br> own process and communicating with lightweight mechanisms, often an<br> HTTP resource API.<br> <span class=""><br> <br> > I think the problems favouring a monorepo are possibly the same<br> > problems this project should help solve.<br> <br> </span>That's a good thought!<br> <br> I would like to quote the entire comment by my friend Sajith in FB<br> post [2]:<br> <br> Found Conway's Law to be true in almost all the cases -<br> <a href="http://www.melconway.com/research/committees.html" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.melconway.com/<wbr>research/committees.html</a> - "Organizations<br> which design systems are constrained to produce designs which are<br> copies of the communication structures of these organizations"<br> <br> Would one team be responsible for all the microservices or would you<br> have multiple small teams, each one with responsibility for a small<br> part of the overall system? Also how would your delivery pipleline<br> look like? Would each service have it's own build/test/deploy<br> pipeline?<br> <br> If you have independent teams owning the services like<br> <a href="https://gotocon.com/.../KevinGoldsmith.." rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">https://gotocon.com/.../<wbr>KevinGoldsmith..</a>., Netlfix,<br> <a href="https://sudo.hailoapp.com/.../journey-into-a.../" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">https://sudo.hailoapp.com/.../<wbr>journey-into-a.../</a> etc - organizing<br> each service as a folder or git submodule brings with it a lot of<br> other questions (versioning together, tight coupling)<br> <br> The definition of a service, microservice, macroservice,<br> mediumservice vary wildly depending on who you talk to these days :)<br> <br> Guess it depends a lot on how you slice your services up and how<br> that reflects your team structure - The complexity could be either<br> in modules or in the interstitial glue.<br> <br> If you want to build, test, tag/version and deploy services<br> independently, how would a monorepo work?<br> <br> Independently deployable services brings with it further complexity<br> (discovery, increased surface area for failure etc) - but if your<br> team structure supports that, you could rely on tooling to make it<br> less painful<br> <br> <br> [1] <a href="http://martinfowler.com/articles/microservices.html" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://martinfowler.com/<wbr>articles/microservices.html</a><br> [2] <a href="https://www.facebook.com/baijum/posts/10154503962859641" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">https://www.facebook.com/<wbr>baijum/posts/10154503962859641</a><br> <div class="HOEnZb"><div class="h5"><br> Regards,<br> Baiju M<br> <br> ______________________________<wbr>_________________<br> almighty-public mailing list<br> <a href="mailto:almighty-public@redhat.com">almighty-public@redhat.com</a><br> <a href="https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/almighty-public" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">https://www.redhat.com/<wbr>mailman/listinfo/almighty-<wbr>public</a><br> </div></div></blockquote></div><br></div></blockquote> <div style="white-space:pre-wrap"><div dir="auto"> </div><blockquote style="border-left:2px solid #777; color:#777; margin:0 0 5px; padding-left:5px"><div dir="auto">_______________________________________________ </div><div dir="auto">almighty-public mailing list </div><div dir="auto">almighty-public@redhat.com </div><div dir="auto"><a href="https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/almighty-public" style="color:#777">https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/almighty-public</a> </div></blockquote><div dir="auto"> </div><div dir="auto"> </div><div dir="auto">/max </div><div dir="auto"><a href="http://about.me/maxandersen" style="color:#3983C4">http://about.me/maxandersen</a></div></div> </div> </body> </html>