interacting with the cursor:

david poehlman david.poehlman at handsontechnologeyes.com
Wed Mar 30 13:09:26 UTC 2005


could you answer the question please?  If you have a choice, what would you 
want to happen in the interactions I have described?

Thanks!

-- 
Johnnie Apple Seed
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Janina Sajka" <janina at rednote.net>
To: "Linux for blind general discussion" <blinux-list at redhat.com>
Sent: Wednesday, March 30, 2005 12:58 AM
Subject: Re: interacting with the cursor:


So, get Bill to open source Windows. What did you have in mind? Some
kind of prexcripted behavior standard? I can't support that. You want
the proprietary environment, you pay the price. If that's imposing
suffering, heck, yhou choose it by hanging with that proprietary
environment.


david poehlman writes:
> Janina,
>
> I am seeking information and you and Kenny have thoughtfully provided some
> of it.  I'd love to have this behavior configurale in windows.  I do know
> that it is definable in shells or at least terminal emmulations.
>
> Thanks.  What would e most desireable.  A method where you had to know 
> which
> side of the character you are on in order to determine whether back space
> will delete it or not and whether or not you will e inserting to the left 
> of
> it or not having to know but just hearing it allowing this behavior to
> manefest?
>
> -- 
> Johnnie Apple Seed
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Janina Sajka" <janina at rednote.net>
> To: "Linux for blind general discussion" <blinux-list at redhat.com>
> Sent: Tuesday, March 29, 2005 9:54 PM
> Subject: Re: interacting with the cursor:
>
>
> David, I don't believe any of this is specific to how AT works, it's all
> in how the OS works. Note also the definition of cursor:
>
> >From The Free On-line Dictionary of Computing (27 SEP 03) [foldoc]:
>
>   cursor
>
>           1. <hardware> A visually distinct mark on a display indicating
>           where newly typed text will be inserted.  The cursor moves as
>           text is typed and, in most modern editors, can be moved around
>           within a document by the user to change the insertion point.
>
> That's all it is. What backspace or the delete key do is something
> that's definable and has been defined differently by different
> environments. Fortunately, for those of us here on Linux, we can adjust
> those defintions to suit us, if we don't like default behavior in some
> app or environment.
>
> I don't think you're going to find any sympathy for giving up this
> freedom. And, I can't imagine a better definition for cursor. So, what's
> the problem?
>
>
>
> david poehlman writes:
> > Hi all,
> >
> > Sorry if this appears twice, I sent it out from the rong address.
> >
> > I have a question for users of graphical and non graphical linux users
> > concerning its screen reader behavior regarding cursor interaction.  In
> > windows screen readers and in dos screen readers with the accetion of 
> > some
> > older dos screen readers, when interacting with the cursor, the screen
> > reader interacts with the character that is heard when a say character
> > request is sent.  In other words, if I am told by say character that I 
> > am
> > sitting on t and I hit backspace or delete, t is gone.  If I type, t is
> > pushed to the right as I type.  If I move to the left of t and type, the
> > character to the left of t is pushed to the right.  If I move to the 
> > right
> > of t and type, the character to the right of t is pushed to the right as 
> > I
> > type.  My question then is whether this is the behavior in all flavors 
> > of
> > linux with screen readers and if not, how do the ones that differ 
> > behave?
> > In windows, the cursor is a thin vertical line which is never on a
> > character
> > but always between characters or to the left of the character or to the
> > right of the character.  The net effect would then be that if one were 
> > to
> > want to delete a character with back space, one would have to be certain
> > to
> > be to the right of the character to be deleted and if one wanted to use
> > delete to delete a character, one would need to be the left of the
> > character
> > to be deleted.
> >
> > Answers and discussion would be greatly appreciated.  Should windows
> > screen
> > readers or linux screen readers adopt this strategy if they don't employ
> > it
> > already?  Are their better strategies than those described above and if
> > so,
> > what are they?
> >
> > It might be that the later strategy would be closer to the sighted
> > experience.
> >
> > -- 
> > Johnnie Apple Seed
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Blinux-list mailing list
> > Blinux-list at redhat.com
> > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/blinux-list
>
> -- 
>
> Janina Sajka Phone: +1.202.494.7040
> Partner, Capital Accessibility LLC http://www.CapitalAccessibility.Com
>
> Chair, Accessibility Workgroup Free Standards Group (FSG)
> janina at freestandards.org http://a11y.org
>
> If Linux can't solve your computing problem, you need a different problem.
>
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-- 

Janina Sajka Phone: +1.202.494.7040
Partner, Capital Accessibility LLC http://www.CapitalAccessibility.Com

Chair, Accessibility Workgroup Free Standards Group (FSG)
janina at freestandards.org http://a11y.org

If Linux can't solve your computing problem, you need a different problem.

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