Has any solution for blind to run windows under linux?

Jude DaShiell jdashiel at shellworld.net
Sat Apr 18 10:48:26 UTC 2009 

When things show up on the mac that actually are clickable but don't say 
so, some might think there's a problem with the cocoa specification 
standard itself.  That's possible I suppose, but it may be that a user 
might not really have a fundamental understanding of the operating system 
itself.  From another tutorial article on the lioncourt.com site I seem to 
remember that everything is clickable on the mac.  If you don't get a 
link, you click on a word and get a dictionary definition look up at the 
least.  At least that's how it's supposed to be.  The case where one 
clicks on something and nothing happens in the mac environment would be a 
cause for concern about the cocoa specification being less than complete 
on the particular clicking problem under consideration.  Probably the 
problem is more that people are so used to windows coming back with little 
useful either on the computer or the web when clicking they maybe expect 
the same from the mac.



On Mon, 12 Jan 2009, David Poehlman wrote:

> yes, I'm on the vo list and would not have said either use firefox or that 
> jaws is better than voiceover the first because even though you can use fire 
> vox extention, it is not nearly as functional as safari with voiceover and 
> takes a bit to get going.  second, jaws and voiceover are opposites none is 
> better than the other except that voiceover runs on the mac and jaws runs on 
> windows if you get my drift.  The problems with jaws have already been out 
> lined.  the problems with vo are few but some of them are show stoppers like 
> not knowing when something is clickable when it is not written as either a 
> button or a link as authors/developpers are bound to do on web pages. 
> Another is there is no way to read an entire web page in one go but then most 
> web pages are boring anyway so what we really need is a way to read an 
> article in one go.  This can be done on some sites in group mode.  I noticed 
> that jaws now has two modes for web pages but I cannot figure out the 
> advantage of that.
>
> On Jan 12, 2009, at 9:11 AM, David Poehlman wrote:
>
> oh, you are not using fusion.
>
> On Jan 11, 2009, at 8:15 PM, John G. Heim wrote:
>
> David, would you take one second to listen to what I'm trying to tell you?
>
> Quoting from the vmware server 2.0 manual:
>
> "VI Web Access and VMware Remote Console replace the VMware Management
> Interface and VMware Server Console."
>
> As of 2.0, vmware server uses a web application to configure virtual 
> machines. This web app doesn't run under safari.
>
> ----- Original Message ----- From: "David Poehlman" 
> <david.poehlman at handsontechnologeyes.com>
> To: "Linux for blind general discussion" <blinux-list at redhat.com>
> Sent: Sunday, January 11, 2009 3:38 PM
> Subject: Re: Has any solution for blind to run windows under linux?
>
>
>> vmware has nothing to do with a web browser.  If you run fusion on the mac 
>> for instance, you can run linux and or windows xp or vista and  others too 
>> I'm told.
>> 
>> On Jan 11, 2009, at 4:36 PM, John G. Heim wrote:
>> 
>> Getting vmware to run under linux does have something to do with  safari & 
>> voiceover. As I said, I don't think you can get the vmware  web app to run 
>> in safari. It doesn't run very well under firefox with  orca either. Well, 
>> in fact it doesn't run great under IE with jaws for  that matter. It's just 
>> kind of a sucky web app in terms of  accessibility. But I tried all three 
>> and by far the best combo was IE  & jaws.
>> 
>> It's true that having to press the enter key to enter data into a  field 
>> when using jaws is kind of lame but voiceover is chuck full of  things like 
>> that. You have to press a 4 key combination to interact  with a table or to 
>> interact with text.
>> 
>> I don't mean to trash voiceover here. As I said, I am trying to switch  to 
>> the Mac full time. You're on the voiceover list right? I asked  about the 
>> voiceover vs jaws issue last summer and specifically about  voiceover & 
>> safari compared to IE and jaws. I was on yet another list  and had asserted 
>> that voiceover users would say that it's as good as  jaws. So I asked on 
>> the voiceover list and was disappointed by the  answers. First of all, 
>> several people agreed that voiceover isn't up  the the standard set by jaws 
>> yet. Others suggested I switch to firefox  for the Mac. I guess you can't 
>> entirely trust self-selected surveys   but when it's voiceover users 
>> themselves saying this, it carries a lot  of weight. Well, anyway, that's 
>> what I meant when I used the term  "conventional wisdom". It's not as if 
>> I've done a scientific survey  but then "conventional wisdom" isn't a 
>> scientific term either.
>> 
>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "David Poehlman" 
>> <david.poehlman at handsontechnologeyes.com
>> > 
>> To: "Linux for blind general discussion" <blinux-list at redhat.com>
>> Sent: Sunday, January 11, 2009 1:15 PM
>> Subject: Re: Has any solution for blind to run windows under linux?
>> 
>> 
>> > we are mixing apples with oranges here.  getting vm to run under  linux 
>> > has nothing to do with voiceover and safari.
>> > 
>> > Jaws is over crowded with complexity, it robs us of the natural ook   and 
>> > feel of the browser and makes a lot of mistakes in doing so.  I   find it 
>> > takes no greater number of keystrokes to do most things  with  voiceover. 
>> > I don't know what the "conventional wisdom" means  here but  I have been 
>> > using voiceover for 5 years now and am so glad  I don't  have to be 
>> > forced to turn on forms mode or turn off the  virtual mode  just to use 
>> > the web.
>> > 
>> > On Jan 11, 2009, at 2:04 PM, John Heim wrote:
>> > 
>> > My ultimate goal is to be jaws free. And I'm typing this on a Mac   mini. 
>> > But my impression is that jaws and Windows is still   significantly ahead 
>> > of Mac OS and voiceover. It takes too many   keystrokes to get things 
>> > done vya voiceover. I even asked about  this  on the voiceover list last 
>> > summer and the conventional wisdom  is that  voiceover isn't quite up to 
>> > jaws level yet.
>> > 
>> > I've been trying to get Windows to run in a virtual machine under linux. 
>> > I don't think there is any way I'd have been able to get  that done 
>> > without jaws.
>> > 
>> > 
>> > On Jan 11, 2009, at 12:12 PM, David Poehlman wrote:
>> > 
>> > > I find safari with voice over superior to jaws.
>> > > 
>> > > On Jan 11, 2009, at 1:00 PM, John Heim wrote:
>> > > 
>> > > Windows still has quite a few advantages as a user interface over linux 
>> > > espeically for the blind. Windows and jaws is better than  Max  OS and 
>> > > VoiceOver too. Go on the voiceOver email list and even  they  will 
>> > > admit that. Note that I'm sending this from a Mac mini.
>> > > 
>> > > Other reasons to want to run Windows would include the possibility that 
>> > > you need to use some software that is available only for   Windows and 
>> > > the possibility that you have to support Windows.
>> > > 
>> > > I just got Windows running in a virtual machine via vmware  server2. 
>> > > But I'll post another message about that.
>> > > 
>> > > 
>> > > On Jan 11, 2009, at 6:18 AM, Jude DaShiell wrote:
>> > > 
>> > > > Really, that's as bad as running windows on the mac!  In both  cases 
>> > > > why accept the security problems and waste the disk space?
>> > > > 
>> > > > 
>> > > > 
>> > > > On Fri, 27 Jun 2008, Cody Hurst wrote:
>> > > > 
>> > > > > The simple answer is no. There are ways, but you'd better do your 
>> > > > > reading before asking such things because the ways that are  there 
>> > > > > are inaccessible.
>> > > > > And, why would you want to run windows under linux in the first 
>> > > > > place?
>> > > > > On Jun 26, 2008, at 6:05 PM, 高生旺 wrote:
>> > > > > 
>> > > > > > As title. Thank you!
>> > > > > > Coscell
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