Pipewire and Orca and audio

[Linux for blind general discussion]

So I'm convinced now Pipewire is doing something funky on 
qemu/Virtualbox. I've spun up a quick and dirty Arch system running Mate 
via startx. Pulse works fine but the moment I redo the install with 
Pipewire, Orca keels over.

So is there anything special I need to do in order to get Pipewire to 
play nice? I did sudo pacman -S pipewire pipewire-pulse wireplumber and 
am trying to go with a Pipewire and Wireplumber setup. All other audio, 
like YT vids, works fine, Orca just comes out as a garbled mess, so it 
looks at least to me like Pulse works better on my system.

Anyone else run into this with Arch or other distros using Pipewire and 
fiure out a solution? There's not much online really about it, just 
articles on oh it's a bug, or oh replace Pulse with Pipewire