Javascript for text mode (fwd)

Linux for blind general discussion blinux-list at
Thu Nov 3 19:36:19 UTC 2022

Captcha should be outlawed as an ableist hate crime and all media
streaming sites should have direct links for direct download in an
easy to find place.

Sadly, I've known sites where the content of the page is just text,
but its loaded in such a way that having JavaScript turned off causes
the page to be blank or the parts of the website that are static from
page to page load, but the page-specific content doesn't(Kickstarter
comments being the most notable example from my own daily web usage
and the reason I switched from having javascript turned off most of
the time and only turning it on when needed to having it on most of
the time and only turning it off when its at its most obtrusive) or
the page uses scripts to hide/unhide text(fortunately, in this
situation, going into Firefox's view menu and selecting "no style"
from the style submenu usually expands everything on the page, though
in some cases, there was good reason for the collapsable text blocks
and having everything expanded makes skipping over the blocks I don't
want to read difficult.

But yeah, a lot of JavaScript just seems to be there because the web
designer doesn't know when not to use it and seems to be under the
impression they aren't doing their job right if they make a pure HTML4

On 11/3/22, Linux for blind general discussion <blinux-list at> wrote:
> It sounds to me that what we need is a  version of the client side script
> language that always renders the pages in ways
> that are accessible to   the text browsers. Or at least won't
> kick the text browsers out for not running javascript.
> 90 percent of the time, all I want from a given java script intensive page
> is a direct link to some media stream or other. Then I
> can just plug it into my favorite media player.
>  Most of the other times I just want to get past some blasted captcha test.
> Almost everything else falls into the I Don't Care category.
> This makes the solution two pronged. Prong one is to write a version of
> javascript that performs
> as desired. Prong two is to modify the browsers to  actually  attempt to run
> the javascript functions, but using the text friendly version of javascript.
> On Thu, Nov 03, 2022 at 04:19:45PM +0000, Linux for blind general discussion
> wrote:
>> Whether or not Python, HTML5, or any other newer rich web standard
>> eventually supersedes JavaScript completely, it doesn't change the
>> fact that as long as a significant fraction of web pages make heavy
>> use of client-side scripting in one form or another and do so in a way
>> that renders the page unusable in browsers that lack support for
>> client-side scripting, such browsers are going to feel very limiting.
>> And to be honest, I tend to parse "JavaScript" as a catch all for
>> client-side scripting on web pages. Besides, I remember hearing that
>> console browsers are also trailing in support for HTML5 and since this
>> is the first I'm hearing of Python being used on web pages, I have to
>> question whether the python is running on the server or the client,
>> and if the client, how browser support for such is.
>> And while its true there are things Orca can do a console screen
>> reader never could without a major overhaul to how the console works,
>> in my mind, the biggest thing Orca brings to the web you don't get
>> with a console screen reader are the navigational hotkeys, which to be
>> blunt are so damn useful I don't know how I got by without them back
>> when I had a working eye and have no idea why they or something
>> similar isn't a standard feature in web browsers. Seriously, if I woke
>> up tomorrow and could miraculously see again, even if I permanently
>> muted Orca, I'd probably keep it around just for the navigational
>> hotkeys unless I could find a Firefox extension that did the same. And
>> in theory, I would think it easier for navigational hotkeys to get
>> baked into Links the chain, Lynx the cat, elinks, etc. than to
>> overhaul the console to let console screen readers talk to console
>> applications on the backend like GUI Screen Readers do with GUI
>> applications. After all, the browser knows where the html tag
>> corresponding to the various types of html elements Orca uses for
>> structural navigation are and persumably where the corresponding text
>> on the displayed page is.
>> Give me a console browser with an acceptable level of support for
>> client-side scripting and built-in navigational hotkeys, and I could
>> probably live with console screen readers not knowing how to read
>> multi-column text and having to learn a different set of
>> keybindings(after all, despite originally learning how to make text
>> documents with the desktop standard keybindings, I've gotten so use to
>> nano's keybindings I sometimes try doing something the nano way when
>> typing in Firefox).
>> And for what it's worth, I probably wouldn't be half as bothered by
>> the state of console browsers If I made heavy use of GUI applications,
>> but the thing is, Firefox is the only GUI application I use for its
>> own sake, Orca, my window manager, and everything else GUI on my
>> system is to let me use Firefox. If I ever found a console alternative
>> to Firefox that provided a comfortable browsing experience, I could
>> ditch the GUI entirely.
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> Rudy Vener
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