EPEL IRC Notes 2008-03-26

[Stephen John Smoogen]

Summary:

Summary:

 * fill the steering committee; two self-nomination: Xavier Lamien, Andy
   Gospodarek
   * Made the committee 8 members with Xavier and Andy taking seats.
 * new meeting time?
   * Quaid will work on a new page and send out a reminder to the list
     for people to sign up when they are best available.
 * Status Reports: Current build system
   * Reviewed Michael Schwendt's email for the record.. all looks
     good, and he seems to have been patching it.
 * Status Reports: Next gen build system
   * Would have been good to get a GSOC on it.. duh.
   * Mike Bonnet had sent some reports on his ideas to
     fedora-infrastructure-list. Not sure where that is going.
 * Status Reports: RHEL Meta Data
   * Michael Stahnke gave an update on this to the list.
   * Andy G. said the ideas were interesting and he would work with
     Spot on getting that to the list in some form.
   * Xen CentOS images for developers to test with would be a good
     idea.
 * Status Reports: Package pushes (EL-4 1st of month, EL-5 15th of
   month)
   * Got that wrong. EL-4 15th and EL-5 1st.
   * Knurd has documented the process. We need to validate process and
     send corrections.
 * Package Reports: What is waiting for what?
   * Orphans. What about JPO and Alex Thimm's packages?
   * nirik will send to the list what packages are orphaned.
 * Marketing Reports:
   * EPEL at the Red Hat Summit
     * several people have papers on the queue?
     * what ideas would be good for Red Hat Summit?
     * art request has been made.. will see what to do next
 * Standing Issues: EPEL-announce list
   * Move forward with creation of list
   * Request input from people on EPEL-devel for what they would like
     to see.
 * Free discussion around EPEL
   * Need to not eat too much into next meeting.


----------------------------------
**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Wed Mar 26 11:45:06 2008

Mar 26 11:45:06 >#fedora-devel<	reminder ping: Jeff_S, knurd,
mmcgrath, nirik, smooge, stahnma, quaid and everyone interested in
EPEL -- EPEL meeting in #fedora-meeting at 18:00 UTC
Mar 26 11:58:07 *	mjezek has quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
Mar 26 11:58:58 *	quaid gets his coffee and settles into his chair
Mar 26 11:59:09 *	wolfy too. without the cofee
Mar 26 11:59:28 *	nirik runs to get another cup of coffee...
Mar 26 11:59:33 <quaid>	in this virtual conference room I am sitting
near the window looking out on the cascading redwood trees and meadows
Mar 26 11:59:42 *	quaid works his imagination
Mar 26 12:00:05 <wolfy>	quaid: it ain't nice to turn your back to the
colleagues. with or without coffee.
Mar 26 12:00:13 *	smooge has changed the topic to: EPEL Sig meeting --
Meeting rules at
http://www.fedoraproject.org/wiki/Extras/Schedule/MeetingGuidelines --
Init process
Mar 26 12:00:25 >#fedora-devel<	Meeting ping: Jeff_S, knurd, mmcgrath,
nirik, smooge, stahnma, quaid and everyone interested in EPEL -- EPEL
meeting in #fedora-meeting now!
Mar 26 12:00:33 *	schlobinux_
(n=xavierb at AGrenoble-257-1-112-6.w90-27.abo.wanadoo.fr) has joined
#fedora-meeting
Mar 26 12:00:35 <quaid>	wolfy: no, see, the window is positioned such
that I am not rude and can still see everything
Mar 26 12:00:47 <smooge>	Hi everybody; who's around for the EPEL meeting?
Mar 26 12:00:49 <quaid>	also, no glare from the sun ever messes up our
laptops in here, but it's never too dim
Mar 26 12:00:51 *	Jeff_S waves
Mar 26 12:00:56 *	smooge likes to remind everyone that the schedule
for todays meeting as well as a list of all open tasks can be found on
http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/EPEL/Schedule
Mar 26 12:00:58 *	quaid is here
Mar 26 12:00:58 *	schlobinux_ is here
Mar 26 12:01:23 <smooge>	hi guys
Mar 26 12:01:58 *	nirik is here.
Mar 26 12:02:05 *	coren` (n=coren`@linagoraberri.pck.nerim.net) has
left #fedora-meeting ("Baille baille")
Mar 26 12:02:13 <smooge>	Any old business?
Mar 26 12:02:37 <smooge>	will take that as a no
Mar 26 12:02:39 *	smooge has changed the topic to: EPEL SIG Meeting |
fill the steering committee; two self-nomination: Xavier Lamien, Andy
Gospodarek| all | http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/EPEL/Tasks/Misc
Mar 26 12:03:15 *	cebbert (n=cebbert at nat/redhat/x-7ab949d79e441acd)
has joined #fedora-meeting
Mar 26 12:03:20 <smooge>	Ok I would like to say I am +1 with both of
these individuals. Xavier has taken a lot of perl packages and Andy
would allow us to have EL
Mar 26 12:03:23 <smooge>	voice
Mar 26 12:03:55 <nirik>	+1 from me.
Mar 26 12:04:10 <Jeff_S>	hrm, do we have one free seat or two?
Mar 26 12:04:59 <nirik>	there is no fixed size I don't think...
Mar 26 12:05:01 <smooge>	when talking to knurd about the number of
seats he said it wasn't a 'set' amount could be 9 could be 7
Mar 26 12:05:19 <Jeff_S>	I see... but we'd like to keep it odd in case
of split votes?
Mar 26 12:05:20 <smooge>	we currently have listed that we have 8 slots
with quaid taking 2 because he is so awesome
Mar 26 12:05:22 <quaid>	right, we just picked based on experience of other SCos
Mar 26 12:05:32 *	quaid needs a diet
Mar 26 12:05:40 <smooge>	I figure he gets two votes
Mar 26 12:05:42 <Jeff_S>	when quaid sits around the house...
Mar 26 12:05:50 <quaid>	*snort*
Mar 26 12:05:57 <quaid>	whoops, I think I inhaled a chair
Mar 26 12:06:11 <quaid>	+1 to Xavier and Andy, btw
Mar 26 12:06:14 <smooge>	well don't worry.. its fiber and will come
out in the end
Mar 26 12:06:22 <Jeff_S>	lol
Mar 26 12:06:28 <Jeff_S>	ok +1 for each from me
Mar 26 12:06:38 <quaid>	"Thank god for the gravel and grit to break it
all down for me."
Mar 26 12:06:40 <smooge>	mmcgrath said he had no issues.
Mar 26 12:06:54 <smooge>	well why do you think they eat grits in the south?
Mar 26 12:06:55 *	nirik wonders if they are here and/or if this
meeting time works for them?
Mar 26 12:07:20 <smooge>	the meeting time doesn't work for them.
Smootherfrogz was available earlier.. but not now
Mar 26 12:07:38 <Jeff_S>	it's pretty bad for me too :)
Mar 26 12:07:48 <nirik>	well, we can now revist the meeting time I guess. ;)
Mar 26 12:08:04 <Jeff_S>	wed/thurs. are generally bad for me since I
tend to have other meetings most of those days
Mar 26 12:08:28 <Jeff_S>	but I'll spare you the details :)  can we
have a sign up calendar like we did before?
Mar 26 12:08:42 *	quaid hates those calendars, fwiw
Mar 26 12:08:49 <Jeff_S>	heh
Mar 26 12:08:55 *	Jeff_S doesn't want to get on quaid's bad side
Mar 26 12:09:06 <smooge>	that would be his underside?
Mar 26 12:09:08 <quaid>	Jeff_S: oh, it's not you, and I promise not to
sit on your head by "accident"
Mar 26 12:09:12 <smooge>	quaid CRUSH
Mar 26 12:09:12 <Jeff_S>	lol
Mar 26 12:09:22 <quaid>	"MP3 BAD!"
Mar 26 12:09:34 <quaid>	"OGG GOOD!"
Mar 26 12:09:45 *	gospo (n=gospo at nat/redhat/x-999a994c8af35a5e) has
joined #fedora-meeting
Mar 26 12:09:46 *	smooge has changed the topic to: EPEL SIG Meeting |
new meeting time? | all |
http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/EPEL/Tasks/Misc
Mar 26 12:09:59 <smooge>	i wonder if gospo is our guest of honor?
Mar 26 12:10:03 <gospo>	heh
Mar 26 12:10:05 *	mjezek (n=jezz at a05-0834a.kn.vutbr.cz) has joined
#fedora-meeting
Mar 26 12:10:17 *	nirik is fine with most times... dunno how to narrow
it down much.
Mar 26 12:10:18 <Jeff_S>	hi gospo
Mar 26 12:10:23 *	smooge calms quaid down with a deep fried snickers
with twinkie
Mar 26 12:10:29 <gospo>	hello Jeff_S et al
Mar 26 12:10:31 <quaid>	I'll find the one we did before and we can resurrect it
Mar 26 12:10:45 <Jeff_S>	smooge: wow, it worked
Mar 26 12:10:53 <quaid>	smooge: better than what most people offer me
when they find out I'm in "whacky California"
Mar 26 12:11:24 <smooge>	ok here are our options: One we try and work
with moin on it... or we look at some outside source to do it. The
centos guys have been using a website that allowed us to put in our
times.. but it was not-opensource
Mar 26 12:11:25 *	TuxBrewer
(n=steven at cpe-069-134-255-095.nc.res.rr.com) has left #fedora-meeting
Mar 26 12:11:53 <smooge>	quaid, whacky California is ok. I will add
some deep-fried sproats and tofu if that will help
Mar 26 12:12:03 <Jeff_S>	I was fine with the moin page before, but I
don't really care what we use
Mar 26 12:12:21 <quaid>	sorry, didn't mean to distract from what
worked OK before
Mar 26 12:12:27 <quaid>	let's just use the stupid Moin table :D
Mar 26 12:12:40 <smooge>	Ok.. if quaid can find the moin page.. that
would be ok. Until we get a Zope solution :)
Mar 26 12:12:51 <Jeff_S>	:)
Mar 26 12:12:54 *	quaid hurtles a Plone compat package at smooge
Mar 26 12:13:06 <smooge>	gospo, to catch you up. You now have a seat
on the board.
Mar 26 12:13:26 *	smooge grabs plone and uses it with his EL_5 system
Mar 26 12:13:26 <Jeff_S>	gospo: so feel free to join in w/ the
throwing things and fat jokes.. =/
Mar 26 12:13:36 <gospo>	smooge: ah, cool. sorry I was late -- I was
stupidly waiting in #epel for it to start not realizing it was
happening here
Mar 26 12:13:51 <smooge>	ah, did that myself a couple of times
Mar 26 12:13:52 *	gospo wonders if he should have admitted that though :)
Mar 26 12:14:04 <quaid>	nope
Mar 26 12:14:16 *	quaid j/k!!1!
Mar 26 12:14:17 <gospo>	quaid: oh well
Mar 26 12:14:17 *	smooge hands quaid some more tofu
Mar 26 12:14:38 <quaid>	smoked tofu?
Mar 26 12:14:46 <smooge>	Ok quaid will look for and set up a page for
us to deal with times.
Mar 26 12:14:51 <smooge>	smoked in BBQ sauce
Mar 26 12:15:08 <smooge>	ok next part of the meeting... status reports
Mar 26 12:15:11 *	smooge has changed the topic to: EPEL SIG Meeting |
Status Reports  | all | need to make a page... help?
Mar 26 12:15:22 *	smooge has changed the topic to: EPEL SIG Meeting |
Status Reports: Current build system | all | need to make a page...
help?
Mar 26 12:15:54 <nirik>	what page do you need?
Mar 26 12:16:15 <smooge>	Michael Schwendt sent a report to the list..
which is probably better than this meeting.. but it covered what was
needed.
Mar 26 12:16:48 <smooge>	nirik, I need to put a link to where we store
these things.. I was typing as fast as I could during a work meeting
Mar 26 12:16:51 *	mjezek has quit ("Konversation terminated!")
Mar 26 12:17:12 <smooge>	so I left out links in the meeting topics..
til later.. or someone who knows what to stick where
Mar 26 12:17:29 <nirik>	yeah.
Mar 26 12:17:45 *	alleycat (n=lonewolf at fedora/wolfy) has joined #fedora-meeting
Mar 26 12:17:45 *	wolfy has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
Mar 26 12:17:51 <nirik>	basically the build system is fine and stable,
but it's not koji, so we can't use bodhi. Pretty much the same state
its been in for a while. ;)
Mar 26 12:17:59 <smooge>	Yeah.
Mar 26 12:18:18 <smooge>	but I want to make sure we don't have crashes
etc and aren't getting them regularly reported
Mar 26 12:18:33 *	smooge has changed the topic to: EPEL SIG Meeting |
Status Reports: Next gen build system | all | need to make a page...
help?
Mar 26 12:18:40 <smooge>	and we are to where nirik said..
Mar 26 12:18:57 <smooge>	there was some talk in fedora-infrastructure
last week.. but I don't think it went anywhere after that.
Mar 26 12:19:14 <smooge>	in fact I was confused as to where it went
Mar 26 12:19:34 <nirik>	on the infrastructure list? or ?
Mar 26 12:19:37 <Jeff_S>	seemed like people agreed to the general plan/idea
Mar 26 12:19:55 <Jeff_S>	would be really cool if we could find a SoC
student interested in doing parts/all of that...
Mar 26 12:20:04 <SmootherFrOgZ>	hi, sorry for the late, just finished
an professionnal meeting
Mar 26 12:20:11 <Jeff_S>	SmootherFrOgZ: hi
Mar 26 12:20:24 *	Jeff_S got to run now
Mar 26 12:20:26 <smooge>	nirik, Mike Bonnet mentioned it on the list.
Mar 26 12:20:31 <nirik>	ok.
Mar 26 12:20:42 <smooge>	And once more we do not know if Jeff_S and
SmootherFrOgZ are not the same person
Mar 26 12:20:42 *	nirik should join the f-i list... man, too many lists tho.
Mar 26 12:20:52 <Jeff_S>	lol
Mar 26 12:20:56 <Jeff_S>	my secret is safe
Mar 26 12:21:03 <SmootherFrOgZ>	^^
Mar 26 12:21:11 <smooge>	Ok basically he looks to be working on some
patches.. and there was some discussion from dgilmore if they were the
way to go
Mar 26 12:21:28 <nirik>	cool.
Mar 26 12:21:52 <smooge>	Hi SmootherFrOgZ, you have been added as the
8th person on the committee. quaid is working on a page for us to
choose a new meeting time to try and get people together better
Mar 26 12:22:22 *	smooge has changed the topic to: EPEL SIG Meeting |
Status Reports: RHEL Meta Data | all | need to make a page... help?
Mar 26 12:22:27 <gospo>	sorry I didn't get the memo, but is the
current one too hard for many (it's great for me)
Mar 26 12:22:27 <SmootherFrOgZ>	ho, i'm ok with this current times
Mar 26 12:22:48 *	kital (n=Joerg_Si at fedora/kital) has joined #fedora-meeting
Mar 26 12:23:46 <smooge>	gospo, SmootherFrOgZ the meeting change has
been on the 'list' since before I got on board. It has been waiting
until we had a full board to see how we could get a majority of people
together every other week
Mar 26 12:23:57 <gospo>	smooge: ok, thanks
Mar 26 12:24:02 *	smooge has changed the topic to: EPEL SIG Meeting |
Status Reports: RHEL Meta Data | all | need to make a page... help?
Mar 26 12:24:24 <smooge>	Michael Stahnke gave an update on this to the list.
Mar 26 12:25:37 <smooge>	I think the issues are two fold. Repoquery
and somehow giving access to EL's for developers.
Mar 26 12:25:53 *	quaid notes that 623 out of 11364 pages have the
word 'meeting' in them, which is actually not that bad
Mar 26 12:26:11 *	mdomsch has quit ("Leaving")
Mar 26 12:26:17 <gospo>	so Michael's notes were interesting and I can
see if I can get an inside track on what pkgs are getting added to
RHEL that already exist in EPEL
Mar 26 12:26:21 <smooge>	I was wondering if we could bittorrent some
CentOS xen/qemu images for people to play with.
Mar 26 12:26:25 *	coren` (n=coren`@linagoraberri.pck.nerim.net) has
joined #fedora-meeting
Mar 26 12:26:44 <nirik>	I would be happy to provide folks with centos
vm's for testing things...
Mar 26 12:26:50 <quaid>	gospo: Spot is supposed to provide that now, btw
Mar 26 12:26:51 <nirik>	but I have no RHEL here at home.
Mar 26 12:26:55 <smooge>	the CentOS is mostly to deal with making sure
that they don't have to worry about licensing
Mar 26 12:27:02 <gospo>	quaid: ah, ok
Mar 26 12:27:35 <quaid>	gospo: but please, do work with him; we'd like
to hear as soon in the cycle as possible; I just went far enough to
ask him to cover that :)
Mar 26 12:27:36 <smooge>	gospo, if you have the time.. it might help
spot's too many tasks list
Mar 26 12:27:42 <quaid>	+1
Mar 26 12:28:24 <smooge>	Ok anything else on this topic?
Mar 26 12:28:31 *	quaid was glad spot said he'd do that, otherwise
quaid would have started scaring Product Managers with EPEL requests
:D
Mar 26 12:28:49 <smooge>	I thought you were scary as it was..
Mar 26 12:29:03 <quaid>	sorry, uh ...
Mar 26 12:29:12 <smooge>	but we do need to get this ready before 5.2 is solid
Mar 26 12:29:19 <smooge>	or 4.7
Mar 26 12:29:28 <quaid>	stahnke had a message on the meta data to f-infra-l?
Mar 26 12:29:32 <gospo>	smooge: quaid: I'll try and talk with spot
Mar 26 12:29:45 <smooge>	quaid, no it was in reply to my last call for
topics on epel
Mar 26 12:29:51 <quaid>	ah
Mar 26 12:29:59 *	smooge has changed the topic to: EPEL SIG Meeting |
Package Reports: What is waiting for what? | all | need to make a
page... help?
Mar 26 12:30:17 <smooge>	woops sorry
Mar 26 12:30:35 <smooge>	anything more on the last item.. I pasted too soon
Mar 26 12:30:46 *	quaid is good, found stahnke's email
Mar 26 12:31:44 <smooge>	and I missed a status report.. but knurd isnt here..
Mar 26 12:31:54 <smooge>	will do a quick change to just say it was covered.
Mar 26 12:31:56 *	smooge has changed the topic to: EPEL SIG Meeting |
Status Reports: Package pushes (EL-4 1st of month, EL-5 15th of month)
 | all | need to make a page... help?
Mar 26 12:32:31 <nirik>	I think knurd made a page describing how to do
those pushes.
Mar 26 12:32:34 <smooge>	Ok I think we have another push coming up
soon. I am hoping to get some time this weekend to go over the pages
that knurd put together
Mar 26 12:32:44 <nirik>	I have been doing pushes to testing every few
days or when requested.
Mar 26 12:32:47 <quaid>	gospo: yeah, if some of that "what comes in
next EL update" is s3cr3t until X date, it would be good to find a way
to share it early with steering committee members who i) are under
NDA/employed by RHT and ii) can help us to prepare with "I think we
should do this because I just think it's a good idea" stuff;
unfortunately, I fill category i but not ii :)
Mar 26 12:32:51 <smooge>	but realized thats a dollar short and a day
almost too late
Mar 26 12:33:23 *	knurd is on the keyboard now
Mar 26 12:33:27 <knurd>	hi folks
Mar 26 12:33:33 <smooge>	hi knurd how are you?
Mar 26 12:33:40 <knurd>	sorry, just came back to the keyboard
Mar 26 12:33:48 <gospo>	quaid: right, that seems like something I can
bring to the table with this
Mar 26 12:34:00 <gospo>	quaid: of course I also have other secret plans too :)
Mar 26 12:34:02 <knurd>	smooge, to much work, days to short; so
everything normal
Mar 26 12:34:04 <smooge>	I won't be able to get to your pages til
Saturday.. so I wanted to see if I had the push dates correct and if
there were any problems
Mar 26 12:34:16 <smooge>	knurd. ja.
Mar 26 12:34:57 <knurd>	nirik, smooge, the schedule page in the wiki
describes how I did the testing->stable pushes
Mar 26 12:35:04 <knurd>	(or better: how I prepared them)
Mar 26 12:35:54 <smooge>	knurd, ah I got it backwards... 15th for el-4
and 1st for el-5
Mar 26 12:36:17 <knurd>	yeah, that's how we do it
Mar 26 12:36:28 <smooge>	any issues with tuesday pushing EL-5 that you know of?
Mar 26 12:37:01 <knurd>	smooge, I didn't prepare them yet
Mar 26 12:37:08 <gospo>	quaid: just out of curiousity, why don't you
feel like you can do 'ii' above
Mar 26 12:37:14 <knurd>	the only issue that likely will show up
Mar 26 12:37:21 <quaid>	knurd: quick question, do you recall where on
the wiki we last organized verious people's times in a matrix for
figuring out when to meet?
Mar 26 12:37:26 <knurd>	broken deps that are around for one or two months
Mar 26 12:37:36 <knurd>	without any process of them being fixed
Mar 26 12:37:59 <quaid>	gospo: mainly, unfamiliarity with the EPEL
build system and packaging in general; not likely to learn for just
this effort :)
Mar 26 12:38:04 <knurd>	quaid, I suppose we deleted that page again;
but I should be able to find it again
Mar 26 12:38:17 <quaid>	ah, deleted, that would explain why i cannot find it
Mar 26 12:38:20 <quaid>	knurd: trying to recycle :)
Mar 26 12:38:23 <gospo>	quaid: ok, thanks for clarification
Mar 26 12:38:26 *	mmcgrath is back from other meeting
Mar 26 12:38:30 <knurd>	quaid, there are lots of such tables in the
wiki; docs and ambassadors used similar pages iirc as well
Mar 26 12:38:38 <smooge>	knurd, is that the 'orphans' issue. I need to
write up some proposed policies to send to the list and get feedback
then?
Mar 26 12:38:50 <quaid>	knurd: no, see .. I wanted the one I already
filled out so I don't have to re-fill from scratch :)
Mar 26 12:39:23 <knurd>	smooge, no, those are not the "real" orphans
Mar 26 12:39:47 <knurd>	some of the maintainers are likely just lazy
Mar 26 12:40:02 <knurd>	but we have real orphans; people that left
EPEL or Fedora
Mar 26 12:40:06 <smooge>	ok.. I should look at the borked deps script email
Mar 26 12:40:18 <knurd>	jpo (left Fedora) and thimm (left EPEL)
Mar 26 12:40:34 <nirik>	spot took over all jpo's packages.
Mar 26 12:40:46 <nirik>	we should confirm all of thimm's got handled.
Mar 26 12:40:58 <knurd>	nirik, mbonnet, does the script run now and
then? where there broken dep reports in the past two weeks?
Mar 26 12:41:29 <nirik>	knurd: I haven't seen posts on the list. ;( I
can ask mmcgrath when he's back about it... perhaps something broke
Mar 26 12:41:29 *	knurd thinks that it would be really helpfull if the
broken deps report would state how long a dep is broken already
Mar 26 12:41:30 <SmootherFrOgZ>	is someone else takeover their
packages or plan to ?
Mar 26 12:41:38 <nirik>	it was supposed to run from cron
Mar 26 12:42:19 <smooge>	I saw a buildsys but not a deps.. got confused
Mar 26 12:42:26 *	smooge has changed the topic to: EPEL SIG Meeting |
Package Reports: What is waiting for what? | all | need to make a
page... help?
Mar 26 12:42:34 <smooge>	and I think we are on this topic :)
Mar 26 12:42:40 <knurd>	nirik, jpo according to
https://admin.fedoraproject.org/pkgdb/acls/bugzilla?tg_format=plain
still owns quite a few EPEL packages
Mar 26 12:43:03 <nirik>	hum... is that link valid anymore? thats fas1...
Mar 26 12:43:11 *	kital has quit (Read error: 113 (No route to host))
Mar 26 12:43:26 *	kital (n=Joerg_Si at fedora/kital) has joined #fedora-meeting
Mar 26 12:43:32 <knurd>	nirik, that's pkgdb, isn't it?
Mar 26 12:44:12 <nirik>	yeah.
Mar 26 12:44:34 <nirik>	ok, I can track down the jpo and thimm
packages and report back to the list/and or next meeting.
Mar 26 12:45:01 <smooge>	to the list if possible.. two weeks is a long
time and I will lose too many brain cells due to old age
Mar 26 12:45:45 <nirik>	yeah.
Mar 26 12:45:57 <nirik>	perhaps we should meet next week if we can
agree on a time before then?
Mar 26 12:46:35 <smooge>	I have 1800 every week blocked off for this
meeting :). We can meet on #epel if this one is taken :)
Mar 26 12:46:39 *	knurd tends to say "a lot can be solved on the list
as well if just two people really drive the issue forward"
Mar 26 12:46:59 *	nirik nods
Mar 26 12:47:39 <smooge>	yeah.. I think that is the preferred method
also.. because that way spot etc can chime in and say "Didn't you know
this is going to affect XYZ?" that of course we should be aware of :)
Mar 26 12:48:07 <smooge>	but forgot because well we are all over the
age of 34 or something
Mar 26 12:48:51 <smooge>	quaid, what is your main focus at RH these
days? Technical communications, marketing, buying selling souls on the
OTC market?
Mar 26 12:50:01 <smooge>	... expects its the last one and he is on the
phone with a broker at the momnet
Mar 26 12:50:24 *	smooge has changed the topic to: EPEL SIG Meeting |
Marketing Reports: | all |
http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/EPEL/Tasks/Misc
Mar 26 12:51:25 <smooge>	ok i put this on just to say the usual: we
have more mirrors, we have an outstanding request for 'icons', and we
probably want to look at how we can market ourselves into a larger
market
Mar 26 12:52:38 <gospo>	smooge: the larger market is why I want to get involved
Mar 26 12:53:55 <smooge>	I think we will be coming to what every group
has to do quarterly, yearly, etc. Who are we, what do we offer, and
who are we 'selling' it to, and at what price? [Price being free but
getting some percentage of help back]
Mar 26 12:54:26 <smooge>	gospo, what do you see as a mission here?
Mar 26 12:54:29 <gospo>	though the issue regarding "support by RH of
systems with EPEL" needs to be worked out (though I don't think it
will be an issues), I'd like to try and encourage more
partners/vendors who use RHEL to consider EPEL as a way to get their
own packages into RHEL
Mar 26 12:55:17 <gospo>	so I get requests from time to time from
hardware vendors to take their tools that poke their hardware and put
them in RHEL
Mar 26 12:55:36 <quaid>	smooge: sorry, distracted
Mar 26 12:55:44 <smooge>	yeah... that has some interesting effects and
may not be a completely EPEL item but some sub/partner group. The
Zenoss package is an example where an RH partner's packages do not mix
with the 'Fedora' packaging standards
Mar 26 12:55:58 <gospo>	but giving outsiders the chance to manage the
pkgs themselves is attractive
Mar 26 12:56:00 <quaid>	smooge: http://developer.redhatmagazine.com is
one of the tools I'm using as a 'developer community mangler'
Mar 26 12:56:11 <smooge>	quaid, put down the peanut butter and marshmallows :)
Mar 26 12:56:21 *	nirik thinks it would be cool to play up EPEL some
at the next redhat summit.
Mar 26 12:56:33 <smooge>	nirik, I agree.
Mar 26 12:56:42 <quaid>	smooge: mainly trying to connect the dots in
the clouds above stuff like Red Hat devel fun, Fedora devel fun,
JBoss.org devel fun, etc.
Mar 26 12:56:44 <gospo>	nirik: I actually have a paper proposed for
the summit that touches on that
Mar 26 12:56:48 <smooge>	quaid, ah yeah I found that recently.
Mar 26 12:56:53 *	quaid and stahnke do as well
Mar 26 12:56:59 <nirik>	cool
Mar 26 12:57:08 <quaid>	anything that we would want ...
Mar 26 12:57:09 *	knurd wonders if he should try to visit both the RH
summit and Fudcon
Mar 26 12:57:16 <quaid>	to have as a focus for annoucing at the Summit?
Mar 26 12:57:16 <gospo>	quaid: nice, maybe we can work together if why
ever annouce who's stuff they are taking :)
Mar 26 12:57:25 <quaid>	knurd: +1
Mar 26 12:57:36 <gospo>	quaid: we definitely need to chat more
Mar 26 12:57:40 <quaid>	gospo: /me *murfle, murfle*
Mar 26 12:58:00 <quaid>	we'll have Fedora as a plaform to announce or
talk about stuff from
Mar 26 12:58:11 <quaid>	and anything that is potentially maybe
possibly EPEL related as talks
Mar 26 12:58:16 <quaid>	so, think about that y'all
Mar 26 12:58:25 <nirik>	knurd: you should. ;)
Mar 26 12:58:26 *	quaid waves his fingers all mesmerizing like
Mar 26 12:58:34 *	nirik should see if he can go to the next fudcon soon.
Mar 26 12:58:56 <smooge>	ok.. I guess its time to start a 'thread' on
EPEL ideas for RedHatCon
Mar 26 12:59:10 <gospo>	smooge: RedHatSummit ;)
Mar 26 12:59:20 <smooge>	I thought it was FedoraSummit
Mar 26 12:59:27 *	gospo is just sharing the kool-aide
Mar 26 12:59:30 <smooge>	or FUDSUM
Mar 26 12:59:36 <quaid>	heh
Mar 26 12:59:39 <gospo>	smooge: FUDCON, RHSummit
Mar 26 12:59:47 *	quaid almost passes out laughing
Mar 26 12:59:59 <smooge>	I need new kool-aide(TM).. All mine have left
the building
Mar 26 13:00:08 <gospo>	:)
Mar 26 13:00:14 <quaid>	ok, it really is time
Mar 26 13:00:18 <quaid>	for us to kill that metaphor
Mar 26 13:00:31 <quaid>	Rev. Jones is coming for ya!
Mar 26 13:00:43 *	smooge pulls a marshmallow from quaid's hand and
hooks up his O2 tank
Mar 26 13:00:50 <smooge>	better?
Mar 26 13:01:02 <smooge>	I still have nightmares about Rev Jones...
Mar 26 13:01:17 *	quaid breathes like Dennis Hopper from Blue Velvet
Mar 26 13:01:35 <quaid>	yeah, all good, thanks
Mar 26 13:01:42 *	smooge realizes he gave quaid the NO2 tank and
changes the mixture
Mar 26 13:02:41 <smooge>	ok so will start a thread.. anything else on
marketing stuff? Cons, projects, etc? [Beyond me realizing HEY we
should have had a GSOC do the koji patch
Mar 26 13:03:05 *	smooge has changed the topic to: EPEL SIG Meeting |
Standing Issues: EPEL-announce list | all |
http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/EPEL/Tasks/Misc
Mar 26 13:03:18 <quaid>	gospo: btw, +1 on working together, you are
speaking about exactly why I feel good about investing my @redhat.com
time in EPEL
Mar 26 13:03:47 <smooge>	Ok this is on the list of "what should we do
about getting new packages, emergency changes, lockdowns, etc"
Mar 26 13:03:57 <gospo>	quaid: excellent
Mar 26 13:04:31 <nirik>	smooge: I'm in general down on more lists, but
I think an announce list might be needed/ok...
Mar 26 13:04:38 <quaid>	smooge: could we piggy-back on
f-devel-announce since it's fairly light in traffic and should all be
on it anyway?
Mar 26 13:04:56 <quaid>	or do we think there is a big enough % of
EPEL-only contributors?
Mar 26 13:04:59 <nirik>	well, is this for end users? or developers?
Mar 26 13:05:07 <quaid>	ah, good q
Mar 26 13:05:12 <smooge>	quaid, the only issue I had was whether the 2
missions matched
Mar 26 13:05:38 <knurd>	I thought it's for users
Mar 26 13:05:38 <quaid>	smooge: interesting ...
Mar 26 13:05:44 <smooge>	I was looking for an end-user list. So that
joe who is using EPEL for puppet doesnt get a suprise patch
Mar 26 13:05:46 <quaid>	f-announce-l for users
Mar 26 13:05:47 <knurd>	there is not that much traffic on epel-devel
Mar 26 13:06:02 <quaid>	the traffic is just not that bad, and anyone
who needs to get the EPEL knowledge is on the others
Mar 26 13:06:10 <knurd>	thus EPEL-announce would be more like
fedora-annouce-list or fedora-package-annouce (a mix likely)
Mar 26 13:06:33 <quaid>	well, I'm +/- on that idea, I see how it's
nicer for the enterprise user dude who "doesn't care about Fedora
stuff"
Mar 26 13:06:38 *	kital has quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
Mar 26 13:06:54 <nirik>	I think the example case was the duplicity
issue not too long ago.
Mar 26 13:07:05 <smooge>	yes. knurd I don't mind if we stick it on
epel-devel for the moment. I would like to see a standard message
header for it though so people can just filter for it
Mar 26 13:07:17 <gospo>	what if fedora-announce is a member of
epel-announce, so that fedora can find out about epel stuff if needed
Mar 26 13:07:22 <knurd>	would be nice to annouce the testing-> stable
move for users somewhere as well
Mar 26 13:07:27 <nirik>	epel had to upgrade to the newer version, but
it broke command line compat. Would be nice to have a way to notify
end users: Hey, you will need to fix scripts, etc.
Mar 26 13:07:43 <quaid>	gospo: that is a reasonable mailman trick to employ
Mar 26 13:07:44 <knurd>	nirik, +1
Mar 26 13:07:59 <quaid>	then people can get just the epel end-user
announce stuff, and all fedora gets it too
Mar 26 13:08:04 <smooge>	knurd, exactly.. that is where I would like
those messages so that the sysadmins are aware that they are going to
get new stuff whether they were ready or not
Mar 26 13:08:05 <gospo>	exactly
Mar 26 13:08:23 *	quaid thinks, better exposure for EPEL to announce
into f-announce, too
Mar 26 13:08:44 <nirik>	I think end users won't want to mess with
suscribing to a devel list and filtering...
Mar 26 13:08:51 <knurd>	nirik, +1
Mar 26 13:08:52 <quaid>	agreed
Mar 26 13:08:52 <smooge>	ok I think we can put it to a vote.
Mar 26 13:09:00 <gospo>	epel exposure is important, methinks -- not
enough people know about it and go off using other strange repos
Mar 26 13:09:06 *	kital (n=Joerg_Si at fedora/kital) has joined #fedora-meeting
Mar 26 13:09:10 <smooge>	+1 on EPEL-announce for announcements of
pushes, new packages, and emergency problems
Mar 26 13:09:11 *	kital has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
Mar 26 13:09:38 <smooge>	plus it getting cross posted to
fedora-announce if that is 'ok' with fedora side
Mar 26 13:09:38 <knurd>	smooge, +1 (albeit not every "new package")
Mar 26 13:09:39 <quaid>	+1 and +1 to having f-announce-l a subscriber
to epel-announce
Mar 26 13:09:43 <nirik>	+1 here (although we shouldn't overload it)
Mar 26 13:09:55 <smooge>	knurd, no not ever new package. the weekly
build report would be good for it
Mar 26 13:10:00 <nirik>	will testing pushes go there too?
Mar 26 13:10:01 <gospo>	+1 on the list and +1 on the overload to f-announce-l
Mar 26 13:10:06 <nirik>	or just stable pushes?
Mar 26 13:10:23 <quaid>	how about weekly package updates of some kind?
Mar 26 13:10:27 <smooge>	nirik pushes from testing -> stable, stable -> DOOM
Mar 26 13:10:28 <knurd>	let's just ask the devel list what users want
Mar 26 13:10:32 <quaid>	we could use f-package-announce for
epel-package-announce?
Mar 26 13:10:36 <smooge>	knurd, +1 on that
Mar 26 13:10:37 <knurd>	and then we just do it somehow ;-)
Mar 26 13:10:39 <quaid>	or do the same double-subscribe method
Mar 26 13:11:04 <nirik>	I think just one announce list is needed now...
Mar 26 13:11:07 <nirik>	knurd: +1
Mar 26 13:11:20 <smooge>	quaid, I think f-package-announce, but I
never heard of it til now
Mar 26 13:11:23 <nirik>	lets ask the devel community what kinds of
things they would like to see on an announce list.
Mar 26 13:12:19 <knurd>	once we have lots of package annoucements
(with bodhi?) we can add a dedicated channel for them on EPEL-announce
Mar 26 13:12:30 *	nirik nods
Mar 26 13:14:37 <smooge>	sent
Mar 26 13:14:51 *	smooge has changed the topic to: EPEL SIG Meeting |
Free discussion around EPEL
Mar 26 13:15:27 <stickster>	Hey, you guys ate our meeting! :-D
Mar 26 13:15:37 <smooge>	sorry
Mar 26 13:15:38 <quaid>	smooge: yeah, f-pkg-a came from parsing that
feed off f-announce, thank ye gods
Mar 26 13:15:51 <quaid>	stickster: well, we didn't actually come
pushing for the conference room
Mar 26 13:16:00 <stickster>	I know, that's why I was laughing and not crying
Mar 26 13:16:02 *	nirik burps
Mar 26 13:16:03 <quaid>	and since I already have the comfie chair by
the window with the great view, I didn't care
Mar 26 13:16:08 <smooge>	do we need to roll us out now
Mar 26 13:16:28 *	stickster got tied up in an email to Legal, always
another rathole...
Mar 26 13:16:36 <quaid>	yeah, let's roll over to FDSCo
Mar 26 13:16:45 <smooge>	ok.. one sec
Mar 26 13:16:59 *	smooge will close the meeting in 1
Mar 26 13:17:11 <smooge>	-- MARK -- Meeting end


-- 
Stephen J Smoogen. -- CSIRT/Linux System Administrator
How far that little candle throws his beams! So shines a good deed
in a naughty world. = Shakespeare. "The Merchant of Venice"