[Ambassadors] Re: Replies to Certification Projects

[Ankur Sinha]

On Mon, 2009-05-11 at 17:53 +0530, Shakthi Kannan wrote:
> Hi,
> 
> --- On Mon, May 11, 2009 at 5:17 PM, Abhradip Mukherjee
> <abhradipmukherjee at gmail.com> wrote:
> | Because when they get to know that for doing the development they wont get
> | any money / any certificate,
> \--
> 
> So, that is what they want, not knowledge, or freedom of source code?
> 
> ---
> | the best brains ( the ones who can easily get
> | money for their work from other offtime jobs) and the competent  students
> | (who can easily do a project in some institutions by paying some money and
> | can get a certificate) goes away.
> \--
> 
> But, they are only cheating themselves, by paying money and getting a
> certificate. They still will be incompetent at work, and will sit in
> the bench just getting a salary, and will get laid off when an
> economic crunch happens. Yes, it did happen.
> 
> ---
> | The ones who understands the true meaning
> | of FOSS at that moment of time stays with us.
> \--
> 
> ... irrespective of money, job, certificate.
> 
> ---
> | But I can guarantee if those
> | other guys have joined us then, someday later they would have also become
> | FOSS followers as through the activities of the movement we would have
> | successfully conveyed the message to them.
> \--
> 
> Not quite true. Those who want to work on FOSS, will continue to work
> on FOSS, irrespective of whether they get money, job, or certifcate or
> what not, because they do it for a reason that they love working with
> passion, and not in need of what you have mentioned.
> 
> ---
> | But wont go for something which is cheap and gives nothing in return except
> | listing on websites.
> \--
> 
> There is more to it:
> * Building ones' network (social).
> * Knowledge.
> * Recognition.
> ... and these lead to jobs automatically.
> 
> ---
> | What will they have in hand to show their mother, who
> | might not know anything about websites and therefore does not understand the
> | importance. (She would have been more happy to see her son's face on a
> | not-so-famous local newspaper, simply because then she would have had
> | something to take in hand, go to her neighbor and show off).
> \--
> 
> You can show photos taken from participation in installfest, hackfest
> events. Most students own cameras, and phones with digital cameras.
> 
> You can also take a printout of a website.
> 
> ---
> | What will they
> | show to an employer who wont agree to go up and check on the website whether
> | the student sitting in front has a listing on the website or not. He would
> | pick the next guy who has a well known certification in hand.
> \--
> 
> Too generic a statement. There are big MNCs as well as FOSS-based
> startups in India who hire people. Check http://fossjobs.wordpress.com
> for a start.
> 
> ---
> | As I mentioned, we wont take anybody in, _just_ for the certification.
> \--
> 
> Sorry mate, you can't make or guarantee that judgement :)
> 
> ---
> | It
> | will be like if you understand FOSS ideologies well, and if you are willing
> | to learn through projects we will give you an opportunity to work and get
> | certificate of appreciation upon quality contribution.
> \--
> 
> ... and such people, IMO, will do things irrespective of whether you
> give the certificate or not.
> 
> ---
> | "I am certified, but, where can I now get a job?"
> |
> | Have you ever heard somebody asking the same question to any
> training institutions who give away random certifications to any
> | guy with a fat wallet?
> \--
> 
> Such people are being cheated. People who get certificates with a fat
> wallet are cheating themselves too. Just because others are committing
> suicide, doesn't mean we should too.
> 
> There are no shortcuts in life.
> 
> SK
> 

hi,

I agree with the view that Shakti has taken. I also understand what
Abhradip is trying to do, since I'm a college student myself and yes,
unfortunately, the certificate rush here is HUGE. From what I've seen
here, the best brains (the ones who make all the difference) don't give
certificates too much priority. The ones who work/join up at places to
get a certificate in return don't really do much. They join one workshop
after another throughout the year and collect certificates, with NO
working knowledge at all on any of what they've learnt while we sit and
code/learn/contribute etc... 

>From the point of view of "placements", I think it's way..WAAAY more
impressive to have your fedoraproject contributions in front of the
interviewer than a certificate saying "He learnt blah blah from us for a
month."

YOu choose : On one had you have "Ambassador/packager/document
writer/.... at the fedora project"  , on the other "this is to certify
that so and so had participated in a so and so workshop."

It's important to remember that a certificate does NOT certify that you
know something.. It certifies you were present while it was being
taught.. :)

regards,

Ankur