notes from the aug 22nd 2007 fedora desktop sig meeting

[Christopher Blizzard]

Raw notes.  Page lives here:

http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/SIGs/Desktop/Meeting-20070822

Please add yourself if you were there and add yourself to the main
desktop page (which is not complete yet)

http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Desktop

= 2007 Aug 22 Desktop Meeting =

== Present ==

 * Chris Aillon
 * David Zeuthen
 * Christopher Blizzard
 * Ray Strode
 * Jesse Keating
 * Colin Walters
 * others (?)

=== Agenda ===

None posted.

=== Action Items ===

 * Blizzard to add scope + goals to SIG in the wiki
 * Blizzard to clean up SIG and Desktop pages
 * David Zeuthen to clarify action items
 * Adam Jackson / Chris Aillon to finish bootchart package process +
review
 * Colin Walters to work with David Zeuthen on clarifying the package
set for the desktop spin and pushing into the livecd-creation repo

=== Previous Week's Action Items ===

 * Adam was supposed to package up boot chart
  * In Progress - has packages and they are in review.  Chris Aillon is
reviewing.
 * David Zeuthen was supposed to work on the clock applet that changes
time zones
  * In Progress
 * Blizzard was supposed to clean up the web pages and add scope +
decision making to the SIG page
  * In Progress

=== Desktop page vs SIG Page ===

 * Blizzard created the top level Desktop page in an attempt to make
sure that things weren't buried
 * Confusing since we have shared information between the two
 * Need to consolidate and clarify that the Desktop page is the what and
the SIG page is the who
 * Up to Blizzard to fix.

=== Where to send patches and changes? ===

 * Avoid process, mailing list isn't an approval process
 * Just inform the mailing list if you can

 * Note that this project is for the "Fedora Desktop spin" which is not
the normal Fedora spin.  More freedom to make changes and set reasonable
desktop defaults.  Different than Fedora for servers.
 * Main get-fedora page will have to emphasize this
 * Probably won't include package forks but is mostly setting reasonable
defaults
 * Will have to work with package maintainers to make sure that those
defaults are at least available
 * Examples:
  * PolicyKit and sudo style activation of system services (no root
password)
  * NetworkManager by default
 * Lots of fear of divergence but needs to balance with ability to take
risks and experiment
 * Probably a lot of changes that we need for Fedora as a whole at some
point
 * Will work with the board if we need package divergence and work
through any possible trademark or project issues

=== Workflow model ===

 * Walters: want to move away from small fiefdom model
 * Example: things that require a lot of changes all the way across the
distribution like sudo style access require lots of small changes to a
lot of packages so we can't just work in silos
 * Use a post with a patch for changes instead of just going through
single bugs + owners
 * Want to avoid forking wherever possible
 * Try do do things in the post-install stage with defaults instead
 * Main points: encourage experimentation and move quickly?
  * David Zeuthen: Main point is to have defaults that are good for
desktop that might not work well on servers
  * Walters: Main point is to make sure that the desktop folks are in
control of the experience
 * Don't worry about package forking, if we have to worry about that
we'll work with the board and others on that topic later

=== Last Week's Action Items ===

 * David Zeuthen still working on time zone applet
 * Adam Jackson has packaged boot camp, Chris Aillon is reviewing (lots
of discussion of details)
 * Blizzard did some work but not on goals + scope

=== Comps Location for Desktop Spin ===

 * Desktop spin lives in the livecd-tools git repo right now
 * co-owned by David Zeuthen and Colin Walters
 * They will discuss what changes they want to make on the mailing list
 * "Low hanging fruit" thread was supposed to be the start of the
changes but it got out of control pretty quickly
 * Jesse points out that there's only one week to feature freeze :)

=== Responsibility of fixes/changes in Desktop vs. Regular Spin? ===

 * How do we track the difference?  Something in /etc/fedora-release
or /etc/fedora-spin?
 * Hard to diverge due to crappy tool set
 * Can't tell where bug reports come from
 * Lots and lots of discussion (ask the user, detect in bugzilla, write
to a file, etc)
 * Have to move this to next week if that's possible

=== Big Root Password Discussion ===

 * extra password that's not needed on a desktop system
 * want to move to a policykit based solution
 * discussion of sudo + policykit system would work

=== Next Week ===

 * Follow up on action items
 * From Jesse: How to get rid of firstboot screens?