Leaving? ( AKA Fedora Target Audience)

[dragoran]

Jesse Keating wrote:
> On Friday 28 July 2006 12:28, Harry Smith wrote:
>   
>> The "full speed" groups seems to be of the opinion that NV and ATI
>> will solve the problem if Fedora adopts the Xorg 7.1.  Frankly, I
>> think this is a bit naive.   ATI & NV have need incentive to move
>> forward for Fedora.  If RH did the upgrade that broke the NV and ATI
>> drivers something would happen.  (BTW when is RH planning to move to
>> Xorg 7.1, I have no idea how to find that out.)
>>     
>
> RHEL5.  I'm assuming your "RH" refers to Red Hat Enterprise Server.  We don't 
> do major version upgrades in RHEL, that's part of it being Enterprise themed 
> (:
>
>   
>> But the "full speed" has done this before and  FC survived. Look at
>> the problems when FC 5 first deployed and the less experienced users
>> could not add packages if they were not attached to the Internet
>> until they learned how to fake out yum.   If this is the final path,
>> I hope that people on the forum will be more understanding than when
>> FC 5 first deployed.
>>
>> I would like to remind the "full speed" group of another clause in
>> the objectives for Fedora;
>>
>>         Emphasize usability and a "just works" philosophy in selecting
>> default configuration and designing features provided by Fedora.
>>
>> This seems to be broken with the deployment of Xorg in FC5.
>>     
>
> Incorrect.  FC5 will continue to "just work" if you use the included driver 
> set.  You've gone beyond the default configuration to install binary drivers.  
> You lose the "just works" with every kernel update.  That's the fate you have 
> to deal with when using binary out of kernel drivers.
>
> When FC5 first came out I could have sworn nvidia drivers didn't work for it 
> for a period of time.  Whoops.  Should we have held up the release of FC5 
> until Nvidia caught up?  I think not.
>
>   
thats was something differnet (no working system has silently broke)

also for people installed the nvidia driver used the nvidia installer 
will end up with a broken X  after they updated X (even from xorg-7.0 to 
xorg-7.0-1) because the nvidia installer replaces some files which the 
rpm transaction will replace again. (=>segfaulting gl apps but not a 
system without X)
the xorg-7.1 update is a bit different, those users (nvidia installer 
and rpm based) will end up with no X. For nvidia there is a workaround 
for this , ATI is even more worse
if yum provides a 'yum downgrade xorg-x11' this wont be such a big 
problem, but many user have no idea how to downgrade to and old X 
version again.
this can be fixed in yum and X:
yum: provide a downgrade option
X: fall back to vesa if a driver fails to load (this can also happens 
with open source drivers so it will be usefull for something else too)
=>problem solved ;)