packages requiring me to reboot...

[Otto Haliburton]

> -----Original Message-----
> From: fedora-devel-list-bounces at redhat.com [mailto:fedora-devel-list-
> bounces at redhat.com] On Behalf Of nodata
> Sent: Thursday, December 17, 2009 15:09
> To: Development discussions related to Fedora
> Subject: Re: packages requiring me to reboot...
> 
> Am 2009-12-17 15:02, schrieb Otto Haliburton:
> >
> >
> >> -----Original Message-----
> >> From: fedora-devel-list-bounces at redhat.com [mailto:fedora-devel-list-
> >> bounces at redhat.com] On Behalf Of Eelko Berkenpies
> >> Sent: Thursday, December 17, 2009 05:09
> >> To: Development discussions related to Fedora
> >> Subject: Re: packages requiring me to reboot...
> >>
> >> On Wed, Dec 16, 2009 at 9:43 PM, Otto Haliburton
> >> <ottohaliburton at tx.rr.com>  wrote:
> >>>
> >>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "nodata"<lsof at nodata.co.uk>
> >>> To: "Development discussions related to Fedora"
> >>> <fedora-devel-list at redhat.com>
> >>> Sent: Wednesday, December 16, 2009 11:29 AM
> >>> Subject: Re: packages requiring me to reboot...
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>> Am 2009-12-16 18:21, schrieb Seth Vidal:
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> On Wed, 16 Dec 2009, nodata wrote:
> >>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> we're talking about the experienced user who is comfortable
> knowing
> >>>>>>> what
> >>>>>>> does and does not need a reboot.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> All I'm saying is - we've not taken away any option, the
> experienced
> >>>>>>> user can do what they want.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> -sv
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> True, but the default should be sensible.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> And the default is sensible for the inexperienced user:
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Don't try to explain to the user how to restart the apps
> individually,
> >>>>> tell them to bounce the box and it will be the right version when it
> >>>>> comes back.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> -sv
> >>>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> On the other hand I think requiring more reboots than Windows is a
> bad
> >>>> thing...
> >>>>
> >>> windows update will automatically reboot your system when it
> >> automatically
> >>> updates it
> >>> windows tried the optional stuff but now almost every case it requires
> a
> >>> restart.
> >>
> >> I don't like the term "experienced user" and I never feel comfortable
> >> adding myself to that group but anyway,
> >>
> >> - I don't want Windows to automatically reboot so I disable the
> >> automatic Windows Update on the machines I'm using.
> >>
> >> - I don't want my Fedora to reboot automatically so I disable and
> >> remove PackageKit on the machines I'm using.
> >>
> >> There isn't that much I could say about the times Fedora ask for a
> >> reboot but at least I think it's kind of "unfair" to compare it with
> >> an OS which pushes their updates just once a month.
> >>
> >> Just my € 0.02.
> > first of all PackageKit does not do mandatory reboots.  If you hadn't
> > disabled it you would know that.  In fact the people that are
> complaining
> > don't seem to have any idea why reboots are necessary.  You need to get
> a
> > grip on file processing, cache, and other processes that speeds up
> execution
> > then you will know why it is not trivial. i.e. you kill a task that is
> in
> > the process of writing data to a file after you update it.  What
> happens????
> >>
> >> --
> >> With kind regards / Met vriendelijke groet,
> >>
> >> Eelko Berkenpies
> >> http://blog.berkenpies.nl/
> >>
> >> --
> >> fedora-devel-list mailing list
> >> fedora-devel-list at redhat.com
> >> https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-list
> >
> >
> 
> I wish mailing list discussions were point-for-point for-and-against. It
> would be so much easier.
> 
> Here is my point: Windows requires a reboot less often than Linux. Argue
> all you want, it's true.
I have three computers running windows XP Windows Vista and Windows Vista
Premium 24 hours per day, I have 2 computers dedicated to Linux so I know
what I am talking about.  Windows is a commercial system, it gets paid for
what it produces and so it would be nice for them to boot less, but now they
reboot on every update and that is once a week generally on Tuesday.

> 
> Linux has quicker security updates than Linux. That's an advantage.
> 
> ksplice can patch a running kernel...

If you really want that then you can design and use it yourself.  I don't
believe that anyone wants to patch a running Kernel especially without
testing and not be able to recover the old kernel.  Are you really thinking
and considering the reasons for a reboot, #1 is simplicity!!!
> 
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