Re: FLAME____ Why is the kernel source not included

[Ken Johanson <fedora kensystem com>]

> Ken, I'm sorry but you're being an idiot.
>
> 1)  The kernel source is not needed by the vast majority of the users.
> That's a perfectly valid reason in and of itself not to include it.

You are *right*... but so is saying that the vast majority of the users 
wont need - half of the stuff thats put on a distro. Now where you and I 
draw the line on a package being needed may be different but it wont 
change, until schools stop teaching courses on how to build a custom 
kernel, or users needing special hardware builds or secuirty. And your 
position that they can get it from an external source is also right. But 
how convenient you see that will differ from what I perceive.

Rebuiling the kernel is more popular than ever, and needed with the 
build system changes (driver updates), and ever expanding array of 
hawrdware options.

> 2)  It's source, hence there is perfectly valid logic in the argument
> that it should be available as a .src.rpm.

On a separate disc or download is what you're saying...

> 3)  The kernel source *is* readily available by taking one small extra
> step - installing the .src.rpm. 

Thanks!!! Many thanks!!! But this has time and time again been pointed 
out, and not disagreed with by myself, though it wanders from the point 
of immediate availability.. Why are you interjecting what so many people 
have stated and I have never refuted???

Your analogy to the Constitution is
> just plain silly.  Guess what?  Here in the US you are guaranteed
> Constitutional protection but you are not promised a copy of the
> Constitution.  You have to go download it, check it out at the library,
> or buy a copy of it.  Similarly, there is nothing at all preventing you
> from obtaining the kernel source with no more effort than it takes to
> obtain a copy of the Constitution.

You know, this "bitching" that you describe wouldnt be here if it were 
always so easy to get the source. I'm convinced, you probably cant 
coudn't recite most the reasons that have been argued in favor of 
including the source on the installers, either because you're havent 
read the whole thread (I dont blame you) or find it easy to bitch-back 
and the side of the majority, who are being defensive of their distro 
(no blame there either). Either way, your opinion will differ from mine.

> You're just bitching to bitch.  You have to take one silly extra step to
> get the kernel source and you're overreacting to the perceived
> inconvenience.  Get over it.
>
> Cheers!