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Re: Top Posting....

Note: This message is primarily directed to Paul Howarth who has noted from time to time that he prefers for responses to his fedora-list messages to be directed back to the list rather than to him directly.

Paul Howarth wrote:

On Wed, 2005-03-30 at 16:25 -0500, David Curry wrote:

Craig White wrote:

On Wed, 2005-03-30 at 13:43 -0600, Gustavo Seabra wrote:
no problem - just thought that I would mention it.

I think I have decided to always top post from now on just thinking that
it will aggravate David Curry to do it is good enough reason I think.

:-) Looks like you are pretty clueless, Craig.

On the contrary, Craig is clearly one of the most knowledgeable and clueful posters on the list, as anyone that has been here for more than a week or two should know.

Like you, Paul, Craig is "clearly one of the most knowledgeable" posters on the list regarding fedora linux and probably Windows as well. But, the context of the message Craig posted did not pertain to linux or windows. Rather, it was limited to top posting and his perception of my views on the practice. Within context of the message, he was indeed clueless as demonstrated by his words.

I don't really give a twit how people compose their responses to list messages. What aggravates me is the total disregard some people show for the true fedora linux experts like Alexander Dalloz, Paul Howarth and several others who so generously grant the benefit of their expertise to newcomers and long-time linux users alike.

Disregarding the message composition preferences of Alexander, Paul, et al makes it harder for them to be helpful to others, takes up more of their time to read & pare, adds to their work burden, and may well result in reducing the number of people who benefit from their expertise. Refusal to respect their simple requests is an outright affront and denal of simple human courtesy where it is very much deserved.

I regard top-posting as a minor annoyance. The reasons are well
documented by now. However, I regard as *extremely irritating* those

No offense or aggravation to you is intended. This is a matter on which we clearly disagree though.

posts that:

(a) include name-calling, and/or
(b) address *only* the top-posting/HTML *style* of the post that they
are a reply to, without actually dealing with the *content* of the post,
i.e. trying to help the OP with the problem they are having.

Since the latter of these is clearly not something that bothers you, and
your email to Frank was a fine example of the former,

Keep the record straight, Paul! I do not believe that I have ever posted an email to fedora-list that included any name calling. If you find one, please bring it to my attention!

The "email to Frank" that you refer to must be the message I sent to Frank Stratton privately, off list and was not -- repeat -- not directed to fedora-list. Mr. Stratton directed a message to fedora-list that quoted my message (or parts of it) proclaiming name-calling. The operable phrase that he reacted to claiming name-calling was, "... act tells me that you are either incredibly inept socially or a world class TURD." I presented two alternatives to Mr. Stratton and he self selected the alternative most appropriate to himself.

I'd really
appreciate it if you could leave my name out of any defences you might
be making of such posts.

As you wish. Whether you (or Alexander for that matter) agree with my views, rationale(s), or choice of styles for pursuing an anti-top posting campaign is immaterial. I have pursued the issue because I believe it is the right thing to do and I alone am responsible.

Given the prevalence this week of message threads with "top posting" in the title, and the numbers of other messages containing requests for people to avoid top posting, I see little to no credibility in claims by several posters that as newbies they were/are unaware of the list convention regarding top posting.

They'll certainly be aware now, but it seems that this "discussion" will have to come up every month or so in order to educate the latest batch of newbies to join the list, which is unfortunate.

Unfortunate, but realistic as a high proportion of those newbies will invariably be migrants from Windows and Windows software.

Feel free to follow thru on your top posting idea, Craig. Perhaps I am the only person on the list that perceives such an action as an affront to those making substantial contributions to the fedora community.

Or perhaps you didn't realise he was joking (I hope!)?


It occurred to me that Craig was either joking or simply trying to needle/aggravate me. His objective was less significant to me, though, than the opportunity his message presented to conclude the current "Top Posting" thread on a positive note.

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