Getting people to say nice things about Microsoft (Linspire repo)

[Les]

On Thu, 2007-01-25 at 20:20 -0700, Craig White wrote:
> On Thu, 2007-01-25 at 19:38 -0500, Ric Moore wrote:
> > On Thu, 2007-01-25 at 07:41 -0700, Craig White wrote:
> > > On Thu, 2007-01-25 at 06:05 -0800, David Boles wrote:
> > > > 
> > > > 
> > > > Would know if Freespire has the same security flaw that Linspire has?
> > > > Everything by design in Linspire is run as 'root'. The GUI desktop. The
> > > > applications. The whole thing. Just like Windows does.
> > > ----
> > > Like Ric & Gene
> > > 
> > > Craig
> > 
> > You just had to go there, huh? <chuckles> 
> > 
> > Gene, Les, Tim and I must have been separated at birth, so our
> > coinciding use of the root user is just a sign of that. That plus older
> > vehicles with no computers nor smog controls on them, just belching
> > excess gas and carbon into the ozone the way God intended an American
> > Make to do; though side-pipes to scorch the pavement, a proper
> > gear-ratio to spin the tires and to scare the neighborhood into a hasty
> > retreats while shooing the children to safety. All of that while
> > stone-cold sober. OOH-RAH! 
> > 
> > <Hi-fives Gene + Les> + <smirks> Ric
> ----
> I don't recall Les ever sounding in on whether he logs into the GUI
> desktop as root - perhaps he does but I think not. I wouldn't know about
> Tim.
> 
> I do see Gene complaining about things that he thinks didn't get
> installed properly where no one else has had those issues and I think
> they relate to his continual operation as root, especially building
> packages as root.
> 
> It strikes me as a lazy habit and once someone has settled in to this
> habit, they will not give it up easily. Reminds me of the adage that
> people will purchase emotionally and try to defend their purchase
> rationally.
> 
> I am sort of amused by the adoption of procedure on various OS's - where
> Windows installs the first user as superuser and this user must actually
> labor to create new user accounts and remove the administrative role
> from the first user account. Fedora first boot asks you to create the
> unprivileged user account and some users log in as super user anyway.
> 
> It's clear that the reason that Windows sets the normal user account to
> superuser privileges because they want to appeal to the non-technical
> users who simply want to turn on a computer and start using it right
> away. The penalty for that is that this user must run firewalls that ask
> questions the user doesn't understand, employ anti-virus software that
> this user probably won't verify is being updated and hopefully, when the
> subscription based update service expires, handholds the user into
> repurchase and gets it updated.
> 
> Clearly this is the market that Linspire is seeking which is why they
> also run as superuser.
> 
> Linux has traditionally followed the UNIX methodology where the least
> privileges necessary to function and Fedora / Red Hat has embraced this
> principle closely and has helped to develop the tools necessary to allow
> the user to function and obtain privileges if/when necessary/possible.
> 
> In the end however, it is still your system and of course, you are
> entitled to use however you see fit including disabling SELinux, build
> packages as root, run GUI as root, etc. I guess that the thing that
> clinches it for me is the people whose opinions I most respect suggest
> the above is not good practice.
> 
> Craig
> 
Sorry, Ric,
	In this case Craig is right.  I do not run as superuser.  I run as a
liddle ole' normla user (sic).  I have found that my stumbling fingers
stumble into some nasties all by them selves as root that I then have to
try to figure out what I did and why it had those precise consequences.

Regards,
Les H