From nman64 at n-man.com Wed Nov 1 02:04:23 2006 From: nman64 at n-man.com (Patrick W. Barnes) Date: Tue, 31 Oct 2006 20:04:23 -0600 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Article: Fedora Core 6 Innovates Unabated Message-ID: <200610312004.26316.nman64@n-man.com> http://www.eweek.com/article2/0,1895,2048117,00.asp -- Patrick "The N-Man" Barnes nman64 at n-man.com http://n-man.com/ LinkedIn: http://linkedin.com/in/nman64 Have I been helpful? Rate my assistance! http://rate.affero.net/nman64/ -- -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: not available URL: From sundaram at fedoraproject.org Thu Nov 2 17:26:26 2006 From: sundaram at fedoraproject.org (Rahul Sundaram) Date: Thu, 02 Nov 2006 22:56:26 +0530 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Building and leading FOSS communities Message-ID: <454A2A42.8040001@fedoraproject.org> Hi http://community.linux.com/article.pl?sid=06/10/05/2054209&from=rss Rahul From gmalureanu at agorasoft.com Thu Nov 2 16:12:39 2006 From: gmalureanu at agorasoft.com (=?iso-8859-1?Q?Gabriel_Malur=E9anu?=) Date: Thu, 2 Nov 2006 17:12:39 +0100 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Info Message-ID: <000d01c6fe99$b8745180$0201a8c0@principal> Hi, I'm setting up a software development team under Linux environment. I need to start "protected" by buying a commercial support (technical assistance) and most people are driving me to RH, since, in addition, they provide also support for JBoss and MySQL (aka RHAS), which I'll use. Question: since I intend, when the company will be in "steady-state", to work on a free Linux distro, while supporting it, would you please let me know what would be the connection points, from the practical standpoint, between RHEL and Fedora, compared to other free distros? I'd like to use on some servers the RH supported licenses, and on others a free distro, the "closest" possible to RH. Would be Fedora this one (and why)? Thanks a lot, Gabriel -- -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: GM email signature - from ppt - gif.GIF Type: image/gif Size: 6395 bytes Desc: not available URL: From michel.salim at gmail.com Fri Nov 3 03:43:40 2006 From: michel.salim at gmail.com (Michel Salim) Date: Thu, 2 Nov 2006 22:43:40 -0500 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Info In-Reply-To: <000d01c6fe99$b8745180$0201a8c0@principal> References: <000d01c6fe99$b8745180$0201a8c0@principal> Message-ID: <883cfe6d0611021943q1e047ctc79ea6b30b0e0718@mail.gmail.com> On 11/2/06, Gabriel Malur?anu wrote: > > > Question: since I intend, when the company will be in "steady-state", to > work on a free Linux distro, while supporting it, would you please let me > know what would be the connection points, from the practical standpoint, > between RHEL and Fedora, compared to other free distros? I'd like to use on > some servers the RH supported licenses, and on others a free distro, the > "closest" possible to RH. Would be Fedora this one (and why)? > Hi Gabriel, The closest possible distribution to RHEL will be CentOS (http://centos.org/), or a similar distribution that tries to maintain API and ABI compatibility with the corresponding RHEL release. Fedora is a fast-moving distribution; RHEL releases adopt features first implemented in Fedora, but at any given time Fedora will have newer software than RHEL. My 2 cents would be to use RHEL and CentOS on your production servers, and use a couple of Fedora systems to keep abreast with what will eventually trickle back into the next RHEL release. Best regards, -- Michel Salim Don't worry about avoiding temptation -- as you grow older, it starts avoiding you. -- The Old Farmer's Almanac -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From christoph.strobel at gmail.com Fri Nov 3 10:01:31 2006 From: christoph.strobel at gmail.com (Christoph Strobel) Date: Fri, 3 Nov 2006 11:01:31 +0100 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Info In-Reply-To: <000d01c6fe99$b8745180$0201a8c0@principal> References: <000d01c6fe99$b8745180$0201a8c0@principal> Message-ID: <606ff3780611030201o7fb1394an63a8bfa0053c7e63@mail.gmail.com> Hello Gabriel! Question: since I intend, when the company will be in "steady-state", to > work on a free Linux distro, while supporting it, would you please let me > know what would be the connection points, from the practical standpoint, > between RHEL and Fedora, compared to other free distros? I'd like to use > on some servers the RH supported licenses, and on others a free distro, the > "closest" possible to RH. Would be Fedora this one (and why)? > Fedora is still widely known as the "Linux made by RedHat", this fact in one hand and the option to "upgrade" to RHEL without big differences in using and maintaining the system in the other hand is a good equipment for talking to your customers. I've never used CentOS, so I can't say what the benefits of using this distribution are. But I made quite good experiences with using Fedora for smaller customers, as server- and client-os. Smaller companies are always happy not having to pay for their operating system, especially if their business isn't IT-related and their decision makers don't know much about software. I often hear "We have to pay for Linux? I thought it is free! Why shouldn't we get Windows then?", and it's not easy to convince them that Linux is the better choice. So starting with Fedora can lead them into the Linux-World at smaller costs. Once they are using Fedora for a while, it's not that hard anymore to make them switch to RHEL when their needs and their infrastructure grows. Greetings, Chris -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From samfw at redhat.com Fri Nov 3 11:34:01 2006 From: samfw at redhat.com (Sam Folk-Williams) Date: Fri, 03 Nov 2006 06:34:01 -0500 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Info In-Reply-To: <606ff3780611030201o7fb1394an63a8bfa0053c7e63@mail.gmail.com> References: <000d01c6fe99$b8745180$0201a8c0@principal> <606ff3780611030201o7fb1394an63a8bfa0053c7e63@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1162553641.12164.5.camel@samfw.rdu.redhat.com> On Fri, 2006-11-03 at 11:01 +0100, Christoph Strobel wrote: > Hello Gabriel! > > Question: since I intend, when the company will be in > "steady-state", to work on a free Linux distro, while > supporting it, would you please let me know what would be the > connection points, from the practical standpoint, between RHEL > and Fedora, compared to other free distros? I'd like to use on > some servers the RH supported licenses, and on others a free > distro, the "closest" possible to RH. Would be Fedora this one > (and why)? > > Fedora is still widely known as the "Linux made by RedHat", this fact > in one hand and the option to "upgrade" to RHEL without big > differences in using and maintaining the system in the other hand is a > good equipment for talking to your customers. > This is something I'd be careful with. Fedora and RHEL are only similar in the sense that they are both Red Hat-based distributions. But there is *no* upgrade path from Fedora to RHEL. In other words, to upgrade from Fedora to RHEL you have to do a clean reinstall. That's not to say I wouldn't recommend Fedora (of course), but you don't want to imply that there is an easy in-place upgrade from Fedora to RHEL. Generally speaking, we also want to move away from fedora being the "Linux made by Red Hat". Fedora is community based and many of the important contributions come from non-Red Hat folks. That said, I understand that the impression is out there. This is the elevator pitch: "What is Fedora? Fedora is a set of projects sponsored by Red Hat and guided by the contributors. These projects are developed by a large community of people who strive to provide and maintain the very best in free, open source software and standards." -Sam > I've never used CentOS, so I can't say what the benefits of using this > distribution are. But I made quite good experiences with using Fedora > for smaller customers, as server- and client-os. Smaller companies are > always happy not having to pay for their operating system, especially > if their business isn't IT-related and their decision makers don't > know much about software. I often hear "We have to pay for Linux? I > thought it is free! Why shouldn't we get Windows then?", and it's not > easy to convince them that Linux is the better choice. So starting > with Fedora can lead them into the Linux-World at smaller costs. Once > they are using Fedora for a while, it's not that hard anymore to make > them switch to RHEL when their needs and their infrastructure grows. > > Greetings, > > Chris > -- > Fedora-marketing-list mailing list > Fedora-marketing-list at redhat.com > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-marketing-list -- Sam Folk-Williams, RHCE Global Support Services From dustin.ratliffe at gmail.com Fri Nov 3 19:56:41 2006 From: dustin.ratliffe at gmail.com (Dustin Ratliffe) Date: Fri, 3 Nov 2006 09:56:41 -1000 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] re: Info Message-ID: <2bbbb62b0611031156o34aa375h4414396695b21b9e@mail.gmail.com> Sam Folk-Williams wrote: >Christoph Strobel wrote: >> Hello Gabriel! >> >> Question: since I intend, when the company will be in >> "steady-state", to work on a free Linux distro, while >> supporting it, would you please let me know what would be the >> connection points, from the practical standpoint, between RHEL >> and Fedora, compared to other free distros? I'd like to use on >> some servers the RH supported licenses, and on others a free >> distro, the "closest" possible to RH. Would be Fedora this one >> (and why)? >> >> Fedora is still widely known as the "Linux made by RedHat", this >> fact in one hand and the option to "upgrade" to RHEL without big >> differences in using and maintaining the system in the other hand is >> a good equipment for talking to your customers. > > >This is something I'd be careful with. Fedora and RHEL are only >similar in the sense that they are both Red Hat-based distributions. >But there is *no* upgrade path from Fedora to RHEL. In other words, >to upgrade from Fedora to RHEL you have to do a clean reinstall. >That's not to say I wouldn't recommend Fedora (of course), but you >don't want to imply that there is an easy in-place upgrade from >Fedora to RHEL. > >Generally speaking, we also want to move away from fedora being the >"Linux made by Red Hat". Fedora is community based and many of the >important contributions come from non-Red Hat folks. That said, I >understand that the impression is out there. This is the elevator >pitch: "What is Fedora? Fedora is a set of projects sponsored by Red >Hat and guided by the contributors. These projects are developed by >a large community of people who strive to provide and maintain the >very best in free, open source software and standards." I chose Fedora as my linux distribution after reading this: "If you want to learn about Linux, and then get a job working with it, Red Hat's community distribution, Fedora is the desktop, not to mention server, for you. Red Hat Linux is, without question, the single most important business Linux. As fond as I am of some of the other distributions, if I had to make a living working on Linux tomorrow, I'd be working toward my RHCE (Red Hat Certified Engineer) certification as soon as possible." http://fedoranews.org/wiki/Fedora_Weekly_News_Issue_31#Choosing_a_desktop_Linux_distro http://www.desktoplinux.com/articles/AT3269115798.html I closely follow news regarding the relationship between RHEL and Fedora releases, such as this back in June: "Beta 1 of [Red Hat Enterprise Linux 5] is slated to be available in late July and Beta 2 - which will incorporate the Fedora Core 6 build - is planned for release in mid September" http://www.itnews.com.au/newsstory.aspx?CIaNID=33276 As much as I enjoy learning about and using linux, I really could not justify my time investment if the experience I gained was not tranferable to my IT career all the way up to the enterprise level. This is what distinguishes Fedora from all the hobbiest distributions and I consider it to be Fedora's most disinguishing aspect. Let's not undervalue it. Dustin Ratliffe (Sorry to reply out of the context of the thread. I just joined this mailing-list.) From sundaram at fedoraproject.org Fri Nov 3 21:52:27 2006 From: sundaram at fedoraproject.org (Rahul Sundaram) Date: Sat, 04 Nov 2006 03:22:27 +0530 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Linux Magazine and Fedora Core 6 Message-ID: <454BBA1B.5090001@fedoraproject.org> Hi http://www.linux-magazine.com/issue/73 Linux magazine is distributing Fedora Core 6 DVD in its next issue. A inlay is provided online. Rahul From n.losito at yahoo.it Sat Nov 4 08:58:48 2006 From: n.losito at yahoo.it (Nicola Losito) Date: Sat, 4 Nov 2006 09:58:48 +0100 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Re: Info In-Reply-To: <1162553641.12164.5.camel@samfw.rdu.redhat.com> References: <000d01c6fe99$b8745180$0201a8c0@principal> <606ff3780611030201o7fb1394an63a8bfa0053c7e63@mail.gmail.com> <1162553641.12164.5.camel@samfw.rdu.redhat.com> Message-ID: <67AAC85D-D70C-4426-9A9F-A731972D6D07@yahoo.it> Il giorno 03/nov/06, alle ore 12:34, Sam Folk-Williams ha scritto: > But there is *no* upgrade path from Fedora to RHEL. In other words, > to upgrade > from Fedora to RHEL you have to do a clean reinstall. That's not to > say > I wouldn't recommend Fedora (of course), but you don't want to imply > that there is an easy in-place upgrade from Fedora to RHEL. Well, this isn't necessarily true o trouble free but there are some procedures to switch from a Fedora Core 3 to a CentOS/RHEL 4. [i can provide a link to it, if needed] I do not if and know how the changes in later Fedora releases have "diverged" from RHEL path. Maybe someone more expert than me could give us a couple of tips & tricks on it. BTW for longer machine life cycle i'd go with CentOS/RHEL with no doubt. -- Nicola .:kOoLiNuS:. Losito http://www.koolinus.net http://koolinus.wordpress.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From chitlesh at fedoraproject.org Sat Nov 4 12:10:30 2006 From: chitlesh at fedoraproject.org (Chitlesh GOORAH) Date: Sat, 4 Nov 2006 13:10:30 +0100 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] suse/opensuse contributors For Fedora ? Message-ID: <13dbfe4f0611040410g4b969e26o49fd7c847f093b62@mail.gmail.com> Hello there, Like many of you have seen in many mailing lists, suse/opensuse users and contributors are disgusted. Here, these users/contributors are mostly pro-kde, it's normal because it's suse. However some/these contributors are in search of another distro who supports KDE. Since Fedora Project already started working on UnleashKDE and will be looking for community fedora KDE contributors, I feel we need to market more on Fedora's KDE status and community contributors are respected! The idea came when a friend of mine, - a KDE contributor who spends time writing documentation and do french translation - user of opensuse suddenly seriously looking for another distro who supports KDE. People like him would be useful for the fedora community !! What do you think about it ? Any plans to make fedora benefit from this ? Even if you are not a KDE user, you can still have your say,huh! chitlesh -- http://clunixchit.blogspot.com From maxime.carron at fedoraproject.org Sat Nov 4 12:34:44 2006 From: maxime.carron at fedoraproject.org (Maxime Carron) Date: Sat, 04 Nov 2006 13:34:44 +0100 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] suse/opensuse contributors For Fedora ? In-Reply-To: <13dbfe4f0611040410g4b969e26o49fd7c847f093b62@mail.gmail.com> References: <13dbfe4f0611040410g4b969e26o49fd7c847f093b62@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1162643684.2497.44.camel@FC6pre.falloy.be> Some KDE users have left Fedora, because fedora was including a too old KDE. The second point is : KDE is 1 block on fedora. Just few big packages. KDE-base, KDE-network, includes most of the basic applications (konqueror, kopete, konversation, ...) I'm not a KDE user, so I don't really have any opinion about that, but I think we really have to work on, and to offer a real support for KDE in fedora. Hope this help. Maxime Le samedi 04 novembre 2006 ? 13:10 +0100, Chitlesh GOORAH a ?crit : > Hello there, > Like many of you have seen in many mailing lists, suse/opensuse users > and contributors are disgusted. > > Here, these users/contributors are mostly pro-kde, it's normal because > it's suse. However some/these contributors are in search of another > distro who supports KDE. > > Since Fedora Project already started working on UnleashKDE and will be > looking for community fedora KDE contributors, I feel we need to > market more on Fedora's KDE status and community contributors are > respected! > > The idea came when a friend of mine, > - a KDE contributor who spends time writing documentation and do > french translation > - user of opensuse > suddenly seriously looking for another distro who supports KDE. > > People like him would be useful for the fedora community !! > > What do you think about it ? > Any plans to make fedora benefit from this ? > > Even if you are not a KDE user, you can still have your say,huh! > > chitlesh > -- > http://clunixchit.blogspot.com > From sundaram at fedoraproject.org Sat Nov 4 15:59:49 2006 From: sundaram at fedoraproject.org (Rahul Sundaram) Date: Sat, 04 Nov 2006 21:29:49 +0530 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] suse/opensuse contributors For Fedora ? In-Reply-To: <1162643684.2497.44.camel@FC6pre.falloy.be> References: <13dbfe4f0611040410g4b969e26o49fd7c847f093b62@mail.gmail.com> <1162643684.2497.44.camel@FC6pre.falloy.be> Message-ID: <454CB8F5.7080803@fedoraproject.org> Maxime Carron wrote: > Some KDE users have left Fedora, because fedora was including a too old > KDE. Can you be more specific? What version of Fedora didnt include the latest KDE at that time? > The second point is : KDE is 1 block on fedora. Just few big packages. > KDE-base, KDE-network, includes most of the basic applications > (konqueror, kopete, konversation, ...) > Splitting up packages can make it harder for maintenance. Some of the packages under review are being evaluated to do this however. Rahul From thomas.canniot at laposte.net Sat Nov 4 18:19:24 2006 From: thomas.canniot at laposte.net (Thomas Canniot) Date: Sat, 04 Nov 2006 19:19:24 +0100 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] suse/opensuse contributors For Fedora ? In-Reply-To: <454CB8F5.7080803@fedoraproject.org> References: <13dbfe4f0611040410g4b969e26o49fd7c847f093b62@mail.gmail.com> <1162643684.2497.44.camel@FC6pre.falloy.be> <454CB8F5.7080803@fedoraproject.org> Message-ID: <1162664365.15462.57.camel@MrTomLinux.workstation> Le samedi 04 novembre 2006 ? 21:29 +0530, Rahul Sundaram a ?crit : > Maxime Carron wrote: > > Some KDE users have left Fedora, because fedora was including a too old > > KDE. > > Can you be more specific? What version of Fedora didnt include the > latest KDE at that time? > > > The second point is : KDE is 1 block on fedora. Just few big packages. > > KDE-base, KDE-network, includes most of the basic applications > > (konqueror, kopete, konversation, ...) > > > > Splitting up packages can make it harder for maintenance. Of course, but splitted packages are easier to use. What do we care about ? users or packagers ? I prefer GNOME, but I know that KDE's packaging in fedora is one thing that makes me use GNOME as well. Having splitted packages would not make me use KDE, but it would be a minus less for KDE. Moreover, as an ambassador, I can tell that this way of packaging KDE is really bad seen by the foss community. Chitlesh is from my pov completely right. > Some of the > packages under review are being evaluated to do this however. > > Rahul > -- Thomas Canniot http://www.fedoraproject.org/wiki/ThomasCanniot From michel.salim at gmail.com Sat Nov 4 17:47:25 2006 From: michel.salim at gmail.com (Michel Salim) Date: Sat, 4 Nov 2006 12:47:25 -0500 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] suse/opensuse contributors For Fedora ? In-Reply-To: <454CB8F5.7080803@fedoraproject.org> References: <13dbfe4f0611040410g4b969e26o49fd7c847f093b62@mail.gmail.com> <1162643684.2497.44.camel@FC6pre.falloy.be> <454CB8F5.7080803@fedoraproject.org> Message-ID: <883cfe6d0611040947n58f55837t13093b2d7500f4b7@mail.gmail.com> On 11/4/06, Rahul Sundaram wrote: > Maxime Carron wrote: > > Some KDE users have left Fedora, because fedora was including a too old > > KDE. > > Can you be more specific? What version of Fedora didnt include the > latest KDE at that time? > > > The second point is : KDE is 1 block on fedora. Just few big packages. > > KDE-base, KDE-network, includes most of the basic applications > > (konqueror, kopete, konversation, ...) > > > > Splitting up packages can make it harder for maintenance. Some of the > packages under review are being evaluated to do this however. > We are only splitting the binary RPMs, right? In which case the slight increase in maintenance overhead is well worth it - I don't use KDE as my desktop but there are some KDE applications I don't mind using, provided I don't have to install, say, the entire kdenetwork RPM. By the way, what do people think about changing the button order of KDE and GNOME depending of which desktop one's using? For KDE: http://dot.kde.org/1085457478/ For GNOME, the corresponding file is ~/.gtkrc -- Michel Salim Don't worry about avoiding temptation -- as you grow older, it starts avoiding you. -- The Old Farmer's Almanac From sundaram at fedoraproject.org Sat Nov 4 19:33:13 2006 From: sundaram at fedoraproject.org (Rahul Sundaram) Date: Sun, 05 Nov 2006 01:03:13 +0530 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] suse/opensuse contributors For Fedora ? In-Reply-To: <1162664365.15462.57.camel@MrTomLinux.workstation> References: <13dbfe4f0611040410g4b969e26o49fd7c847f093b62@mail.gmail.com> <1162643684.2497.44.camel@FC6pre.falloy.be> <454CB8F5.7080803@fedoraproject.org> <1162664365.15462.57.camel@MrTomLinux.workstation> Message-ID: <454CEAF9.4@fedoraproject.org> Thomas Canniot wrote: > Le samedi 04 novembre 2006 ? 21:29 +0530, Rahul Sundaram a ?crit : >> Maxime Carron wrote: >>> Some KDE users have left Fedora, because fedora was including a too old >>> KDE. >> Can you be more specific? What version of Fedora didnt include the >> latest KDE at that time? >> >>> The second point is : KDE is 1 block on fedora. Just few big packages. >>> KDE-base, KDE-network, includes most of the basic applications >>> (konqueror, kopete, konversation, ...) >>> >> Splitting up packages can make it harder for maintenance. > > Of course, but splitted packages are easier to use. What do we care > about ? users or packagers ? I prefer GNOME, but I know that KDE's > packaging in fedora is one thing that makes me use GNOME as well. We need to care about both and balance the needs. Rahul From karlie.robinson at fedoraproject.org Sun Nov 5 08:13:31 2006 From: karlie.robinson at fedoraproject.org (Karlie Robinson) Date: Sun, 05 Nov 2006 08:13:31 +0000 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] suse/opensuse contributors For Fedora ? In-Reply-To: <13dbfe4f0611040410g4b969e26o49fd7c847f093b62@mail.gmail.com> References: <13dbfe4f0611040410g4b969e26o49fd7c847f093b62@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <454D9D2B.50708@fedoraproject.org> did you all see this about suse? Microsoft backs Novell's Linux platform http://www.cnn.com/2006/TECH/11/03/microsoft.novell.ap/index.html From cnegus at rucls.net Sun Nov 5 17:36:02 2006 From: cnegus at rucls.net (Chris Negus) Date: Sun, 05 Nov 2006 11:36:02 -0600 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] suse/opensuse contributors For Fedora ? In-Reply-To: <454D9D2B.50708@fedoraproject.org> References: <13dbfe4f0611040410g4b969e26o49fd7c847f093b62@mail.gmail.com> <454D9D2B.50708@fedoraproject.org> Message-ID: <1162748162.2616.400.camel@einstein> On Sun, 2006-11-05 at 08:13 +0000, Karlie Robinson wrote: > did you all see this about suse? > > Microsoft backs Novell's Linux platform > http://www.cnn.com/2006/TECH/11/03/microsoft.novell.ap/index.html If this is the first time seeing this, you should check out Red Hat's responses here: http://www.redhat.com/promo/believe/ http://www.redhat.com/truthhappens/ Bravo Red Hat! -- Chris Negus From rodrigopadula at projetofedora.org Sun Nov 5 16:58:57 2006 From: rodrigopadula at projetofedora.org (Rodrigo Padula de Oliveira) Date: Sun, 05 Nov 2006 14:58:57 -0200 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Fedora Core 6 Review Message-ID: <454E1851.3050203@projetofedora.org> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Brazilian Fedora Core 6 review by Gustavo Picoloto http://cenoura.homelinux.com/linux/review_fedora_core_6.php ASS: Rodrigo Padula Brazilian Fedora Ambassador FAMSCO -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.5 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Fedora - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iD8DBQFFThhRPg3HAC1vlg4RAoFhAJ4vtJr1gHq6lagPDEhkqTmi19/wmgCffPW1 77LB3+Dde+6ByTosy76Myjo= =arNq -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From tchung at fedoraproject.org Sun Nov 5 21:16:35 2006 From: tchung at fedoraproject.org (Thomas Chung) Date: Sun, 5 Nov 2006 13:16:35 -0800 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Fedora Core 6 Review In-Reply-To: <454E1851.3050203@projetofedora.org> References: <454E1851.3050203@projetofedora.org> Message-ID: <369bce3b0611051316q5eedc38asfedb6ce3fc4289c1@mail.gmail.com> On 11/5/06, Rodrigo Padula de Oliveira wrote: > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- > Hash: SHA1 > > Brazilian Fedora Core 6 review by Gustavo Picoloto > > http://cenoura.homelinux.com/linux/review_fedora_core_6.php > > ASS: Rodrigo Padula > Brazilian Fedora Ambassador > FAMSCO Hi Rodrigo, Please add the link at: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Marketing/PressArchive Regards, -- Thomas Chung http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/ThomasChung From stickster at gmail.com Sun Nov 5 22:53:58 2006 From: stickster at gmail.com (Paul W. Frields) Date: Sun, 05 Nov 2006 17:53:58 -0500 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] suse/opensuse contributors For Fedora ? In-Reply-To: <1162748162.2616.400.camel@einstein> References: <13dbfe4f0611040410g4b969e26o49fd7c847f093b62@mail.gmail.com> <454D9D2B.50708@fedoraproject.org> <1162748162.2616.400.camel@einstein> Message-ID: <1162767238.3467.1.camel@localhost.localdomain> On Sun, 2006-11-05 at 11:36 -0600, Chris Negus wrote: > On Sun, 2006-11-05 at 08:13 +0000, Karlie Robinson wrote: > > did you all see this about suse? > > > > Microsoft backs Novell's Linux platform > > http://www.cnn.com/2006/TECH/11/03/microsoft.novell.ap/index.html > > If this is the first time seeing this, you should check out Red Hat's > responses here: > > http://www.redhat.com/promo/believe/ > http://www.redhat.com/truthhappens/ > > Bravo Red Hat! +10. I'm people who have wasted breath foolishly comparing Red Hat to Microsoft are now seeing what it *really* means to put your money where your mouth is. Who said corporate principles are dead? -- Paul W. Frields, RHCE http://paul.frields.org/ gpg fingerprint: 3DA6 A0AC 6D58 FEC4 0233 5906 ACDB C937 BD11 3717 Fedora Project Board: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Board Fedora Docs Project: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/DocsProject -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part URL: From caillon at redhat.com Sun Nov 5 23:02:28 2006 From: caillon at redhat.com (Christopher Aillon) Date: Sun, 05 Nov 2006 18:02:28 -0500 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] suse/opensuse contributors For Fedora ? In-Reply-To: <1162643684.2497.44.camel@FC6pre.falloy.be> References: <13dbfe4f0611040410g4b969e26o49fd7c847f093b62@mail.gmail.com> <1162643684.2497.44.camel@FC6pre.falloy.be> Message-ID: <454E6D84.2020200@redhat.com> Maxime Carron wrote: > Some KDE users have left Fedora, because fedora was including a too old > KDE. > The second point is : KDE is 1 block on fedora. Just few big packages. > KDE-base, KDE-network, includes most of the basic applications > (konqueror, kopete, konversation, ...) KDE makes releases as all-in-one packages. If upstream splits things up, we will split them up, too. See what happened with X.org recently. In fact, I believe we were the first distribution to ship modular X. If KDE users really want things split up, they should let the KDE developers know about it. Feel free to tell this to whoever complains about it. KDE upstream is making it more difficult for both its users and distributors by not splitting up their packages. Not Fedora. From sundaram at fedoraproject.org Mon Nov 6 00:31:32 2006 From: sundaram at fedoraproject.org (Rahul Sundaram) Date: Mon, 06 Nov 2006 06:01:32 +0530 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Orielly blog: Fedora Core 6 reviews Message-ID: <454E8264.4040304@fedoraproject.org> Hi Chris Tyler - Author of Fedora Linux Orielly book. http://www.oreillynet.com/onlamp/blog/2006/10/whats_new_fedora_core_6_part_1.html http://www.oreillynet.com/onlamp/blog/2006/10/whats_new_fedora_core_6_part_2.html Another review http://www.oreillynet.com/onlamp/blog/2006/10/fedora_core_6_installation_hel.html Rahul From sundaram at fedoraproject.org Mon Nov 6 00:39:09 2006 From: sundaram at fedoraproject.org (Rahul Sundaram) Date: Mon, 06 Nov 2006 06:09:09 +0530 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] 10,000 Fedora downloads in five hours Message-ID: <454E842D.8030605@fedoraproject.org> Hi http://news.com.com/2061-10795_3-6129149.html The torrent presents a even more interesting picture when comparing number of downloads of Fedora Core 6 with previous releases. http://torrent.fedoraproject.org:6969/ Rahul From sundaram at fedoraproject.org Mon Nov 6 00:42:44 2006 From: sundaram at fedoraproject.org (Rahul Sundaram) Date: Mon, 06 Nov 2006 06:12:44 +0530 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Prime Time Fedora Message-ID: <454E8504.6050304@fedoraproject.org> Hi "Over at eWEEK Labs, we just took a long look at the latest release of Red Hat's Fedora Core 6. In a word, the Lab guys were impressed." "Virt-manager is the first step towards making Xen manageable to Joe System Admin. As such, I like it, and Fedora Core 6, a lot." http://www.linux-watch.com/news/NS5727666381.html Rahul From lxmaier at gmail.com Mon Nov 6 01:49:28 2006 From: lxmaier at gmail.com (Alex Maier) Date: Sun, 5 Nov 2006 20:49:28 -0500 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Re: Can I use the template of the fedorawiki for my private website? In-Reply-To: <454B8017.8080503@gmail.com> References: <454B8017.8080503@gmail.com> Message-ID: <7f617d270611051749g62021fcfged93fc59e28776e2@mail.gmail.com> Benny, Thank you for your interest in Fedora. However, it is not for me to decide whether the template can be used freely, so I am copying the Fedora Marketing list. Cheers, a On 11/3/06, Benny wrote: > Hi lxmaier! > The template of moin looks very nice. So I want to use it for my > personal moin wiki. Can I use it for that? > > Many thanks! > > Benny > -- Alex Maier Art and Photography [homepage] http://amaier.net [photos and art books] http://lulu.com/amaier [posters] http://www.art.com/memberartist/amaier From tejasdinkar at gmail.com Mon Nov 6 11:14:38 2006 From: tejasdinkar at gmail.com (Tejas Dinkar) Date: Mon, 6 Nov 2006 03:14:38 -0800 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Re: Can I use the template of the fedorawiki for my private website? In-Reply-To: <7f617d270611051749g62021fcfged93fc59e28776e2@mail.gmail.com> References: <454B8017.8080503@gmail.com> <7f617d270611051749g62021fcfged93fc59e28776e2@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20061106111438.GA29734@gja.in> On Sun, Nov 05, 2006 at 08:49:28PM -0500, Alex Maier wrote: > On 11/3/06, Benny wrote: > >Hi lxmaier! > >The template of moin looks very nice. So I want to use it for my > >personal moin wiki. Can I use it for that? I say let him :p As long as he doesn't claim to be the official fedora site :p And it isn't for corporate use -T From aks.abhishek at gmail.com Mon Nov 6 13:03:54 2006 From: aks.abhishek at gmail.com (Abhishek Singh) Date: Mon, 6 Nov 2006 18:48:54 +0545 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Re: Can I use the template of the fedorawiki for my private website? In-Reply-To: <20061106111438.GA29734@gja.in> References: <454B8017.8080503@gmail.com> <7f617d270611051749g62021fcfged93fc59e28776e2@mail.gmail.com> <20061106111438.GA29734@gja.in> Message-ID: <73396bd30611060503s1966c27j3019ee18a093a6fd@mail.gmail.com> In my opinion, we may let him use the template unless it does not hamper the Fedora and the FOSS spirit! Regards Abhishek On 11/6/06, Tejas Dinkar wrote: > > On Sun, Nov 05, 2006 at 08:49:28PM -0500, Alex Maier wrote: > > On 11/3/06, Benny wrote: > > >Hi lxmaier! > > >The template of moin looks very nice. So I want to use it for my > > >personal moin wiki. Can I use it for that? > > I say let him :p > > As long as he doesn't claim to be the official fedora site :p > > And it isn't for corporate use > > -T > > -- > Fedora-marketing-list mailing list > Fedora-marketing-list at redhat.com > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-marketing-list > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From karlie.robinson at fedoraproject.org Mon Nov 6 08:30:41 2006 From: karlie.robinson at fedoraproject.org (Karlie Robinson) Date: Mon, 06 Nov 2006 08:30:41 +0000 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] We made the distrowatch weekly Message-ID: <454EF2B1.8080704@fedoraproject.org> but not in a good way http://distrowatch.com/weekly.php?issue=20061106#phr From rdieter at math.unl.edu Mon Nov 6 14:15:58 2006 From: rdieter at math.unl.edu (Rex Dieter) Date: Mon, 06 Nov 2006 08:15:58 -0600 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Re: Re: Can I use the template of the fedorawiki for my private website? References: <454B8017.8080503@gmail.com> <7f617d270611051749g62021fcfged93fc59e28776e2@mail.gmail.com> <20061106111438.GA29734@gja.in> Message-ID: Tejas Dinkar wrote: > On Sun, Nov 05, 2006 at 08:49:28PM -0500, Alex Maier wrote: >> On 11/3/06, Benny wrote: >> >Hi lxmaier! >> >The template of moin looks very nice. So I want to use it for my >> >personal moin wiki. Can I use it for that? > > I say let him :p > As long as he doesn't claim to be the official fedora site :p fair enough. > And it isn't for corporate use Adding extra restrictions like this goes against the OSS definition/spirit. -- Rex From benny1990 at gmail.com Mon Nov 6 15:03:51 2006 From: benny1990 at gmail.com (Benjamin Weber) Date: Mon, 06 Nov 2006 16:03:51 +0100 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Re: Can I use the template of the fedorawiki for my private website? Message-ID: <1162825431.5230.1.camel@ubuntu> So I can use it on my site? Where can I get the template from? Can send me anyone it/a link? MANY THANKS!!! Benny From duffy at redhat.com Mon Nov 6 15:14:19 2006 From: duffy at redhat.com (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?M=E1ir=EDn_Duffy?=) Date: Mon, 06 Nov 2006 10:14:19 -0500 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Re: Re: Can I use the template of the fedorawiki for my private website? In-Reply-To: References: <454B8017.8080503@gmail.com> <7f617d270611051749g62021fcfged93fc59e28776e2@mail.gmail.com> <20061106111438.GA29734@gja.in> Message-ID: <454F514B.3040109@redhat.com> Rex Dieter wrote: > Adding extra restrictions like this goes against the OSS definition/spirit. Artwork isn't software. ~m From tejasdinkar at gmail.com Mon Nov 6 16:01:37 2006 From: tejasdinkar at gmail.com (Tejas Dinkar) Date: Mon, 6 Nov 2006 08:01:37 -0800 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Re: Can I use the template of the fedorawiki for my private website? In-Reply-To: <1162825431.5230.1.camel@ubuntu> References: <1162825431.5230.1.camel@ubuntu> Message-ID: <20061106160137.GA32708@gja.in> On Mon, Nov 06, 2006 at 04:03:51PM +0100, Benjamin Weber wrote: > So I can use it on my site? > Where can I get the template from? > Can send me anyone it/a link? Hold on, I'm not an official spokesperson for Fedora, nor do I have perms to authorise that. -T From benny1990 at gmail.com Mon Nov 6 16:10:05 2006 From: benny1990 at gmail.com (Benjamin Weber) Date: Mon, 06 Nov 2006 17:10:05 +0100 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Re: Can I use the template of the fedorawiki for my private website? In-Reply-To: <20061106160137.GA32708@gja.in> References: <1162825431.5230.1.camel@ubuntu> <20061106160137.GA32708@gja.in> Message-ID: <1162829405.5230.2.camel@ubuntu> OK, what should I do now? Am Montag, den 06.11.2006, 08:01 -0800 schrieb Tejas Dinkar: > On Mon, Nov 06, 2006 at 04:03:51PM +0100, Benjamin Weber wrote: > > So I can use it on my site? > > Where can I get the template from? > > Can send me anyone it/a link? > > Hold on, I'm not an official spokesperson for Fedora, nor do I have > perms to authorise that. > > -T > From tejasdinkar at gmail.com Mon Nov 6 18:17:08 2006 From: tejasdinkar at gmail.com (Tejas Dinkar) Date: Mon, 6 Nov 2006 10:17:08 -0800 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Re: Re: Can I use the template of the fedorawiki for my private website? In-Reply-To: <454F514B.3040109@redhat.com> References: <454B8017.8080503@gmail.com> <7f617d270611051749g62021fcfged93fc59e28776e2@mail.gmail.com> <20061106111438.GA29734@gja.in> <454F514B.3040109@redhat.com> Message-ID: <20061106181708.GA1654@gja.in> On Mon, Nov 06, 2006 at 10:14:19AM -0500, M?ir?n Duffy wrote: > Rex Dieter wrote: > >Adding extra restrictions like this goes against the OSS definition/spirit. > > Artwork isn't software. He said it's against the spirit :p A Valid point, but IMO if you _CAN_ afford to hire someone to make a nice site for you, you should... On the Other hand if you just want a small site to play with, it's easier to just "borrow" designs :p It's really Up to you.... Actually, who DOES own the copyrights on the templates, anyway? -T From duffy at redhat.com Mon Nov 6 19:00:26 2006 From: duffy at redhat.com (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?M=E1ir=EDn_Duffy?=) Date: Mon, 06 Nov 2006 14:00:26 -0500 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Re: Re: Can I use the template of the fedorawiki for my private website? In-Reply-To: <20061106181708.GA1654@gja.in> References: <454B8017.8080503@gmail.com> <7f617d270611051749g62021fcfged93fc59e28776e2@mail.gmail.com> <20061106111438.GA29734@gja.in> <454F514B.3040109@redhat.com> <20061106181708.GA1654@gja.in> Message-ID: <454F864A.9060004@redhat.com> Tejas Dinkar wrote: > On Mon, Nov 06, 2006 at 10:14:19AM -0500, M?ir?n Duffy wrote: >> Rex Dieter wrote: >>> Adding extra restrictions like this goes against the OSS definition/spirit. >> Artwork isn't software. > > He said it's against the spirit :p How can an artwork license go against the definition/spirit of open source software? Artwork != software. The definition/spirit of open source software simply does not apply. (Sidestepping the fact that 'definition/spirit of OSS' is rather ambiguous - referring to all of OSS rather than a particular software license. For example, the spirit of the GPL is different than the spirit of a BSD license...) The closest thing to 'oss definition/spirit' for artwork could be creative commons, which has a several licenses that include a 'non-commercial' clause. Artwork licenses are necessarily different than software licenses - alluding to the unfortunate fact that many people incorrectly assume that artwork part of or related to a FOSS project (or if it's licensed under *any* creative commons license) is the equivalent of public domain. This is not the case. It does not help, though, that the license for the moinmoin theme & artwork is not defined/stated anywhere (well, at least that I can find.) It probably should be. > A Valid point, but IMO if you _CAN_ afford to hire someone to make a nice site for you, you should... On the Other hand if you just want a small site to play with, it's easier to just "borrow" designs :p "Borrow" as long as it's allowed by the license for the design. Let's not forget that. > Actually, who DOES own the copyrights on the templates, anyway? This is a good question to ask. I would assume hrishi & dfong: https://www.redhat.com/archives/fedora-websites-list/2005-November/msg00142.html Do be sure to file a request for using the Fedora logo though if you intend to use the logo as used in the theme. ~m From sundaram at fedoraproject.org Mon Nov 6 23:32:06 2006 From: sundaram at fedoraproject.org (Rahul Sundaram) Date: Tue, 07 Nov 2006 05:02:06 +0530 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] suse/opensuse contributors For Fedora ? In-Reply-To: <13dbfe4f0611040410g4b969e26o49fd7c847f093b62@mail.gmail.com> References: <13dbfe4f0611040410g4b969e26o49fd7c847f093b62@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <454FC5F6.2080809@fedoraproject.org> Chitlesh GOORAH wrote: > Hello there, > Like many of you have seen in many mailing lists, suse/opensuse users > and contributors are disgusted. > > Here, these users/contributors are mostly pro-kde, it's normal because > it's suse. However some/these contributors are in search of another > distro who supports KDE. > > Since Fedora Project already started working on UnleashKDE and will be > looking for community fedora KDE contributors, I feel we need to > market more on Fedora's KDE status and community contributors are > respected! > > The idea came when a friend of mine, > - a KDE contributor who spends time writing documentation and do > french translation > - user of opensuse > suddenly seriously looking for another distro who supports KDE. > > People like him would be useful for the fedora community !! > > What do you think about it ? > Any plans to make fedora benefit from this ? > > Even if you are not a KDE user, you can still have your say,huh! Improving the KDE experience in Fedora is a worthy goal and you can tell potential users and contributors looking to use KDE on Fedora that we are planning on improving it significantly. However there is no need to target OpenSUSE or any specific distribution at the project level. Ideologically that divisiveness between Linux users is bad. Practically, none of the distributions have enough market enough to be worth it compared to Windows or even better people who havent used computers yet. Rahul From chitlesh at fedoraproject.org Tue Nov 7 07:36:36 2006 From: chitlesh at fedoraproject.org (Chitlesh GOORAH) Date: Tue, 7 Nov 2006 08:36:36 +0100 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] suse/opensuse contributors For Fedora ? In-Reply-To: <454FC5F6.2080809@fedoraproject.org> References: <13dbfe4f0611040410g4b969e26o49fd7c847f093b62@mail.gmail.com> <454FC5F6.2080809@fedoraproject.org> Message-ID: <13dbfe4f0611062336j595bb393i38cc0dd9f6bebd59@mail.gmail.com> On 11/7/06, Rahul Sundaram < hidden > wrote: > Ideologically that divisiveness between Linux users is bad. Practically, > none of the distributions have enough market enough to be worth it > compared to Windows or even better people who havent used computers yet. I was not talking about division, but about making noise about fedora kde talks so that people know that if they want kde it isn't only from kubuntu! chitlesh -- http://clunixchit.blogspot.com From rino.mardo at gmail.com Tue Nov 7 11:33:49 2006 From: rino.mardo at gmail.com (Rino Mardo) Date: Tue, 7 Nov 2006 14:33:49 +0300 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] We made the distrowatch weekly In-Reply-To: <454EF2B1.8080704@fedoraproject.org> Message-ID: <001201c70260$b01f0f50$240110ac@ALJOMAIHBEV.COM> > -----Original Message----- > From: fedora-marketing-list-bounces at redhat.com > [mailto:fedora-marketing-list-bounces at redhat.com] On Behalf > Of Karlie Robinson > Sent: Monday, November 06, 2006 11:31 AM > To: fedora-marketing-list at redhat.com > Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] We made the distrowatch weekly > > but not in a good way > http://distrowatch.com/weekly.php?issue=20061106#phr > The most eye catching issue I always read is about pirut. Then someone would always suggests yumex for features users are looking for not in pirut. If that is the case, why not make yumex the default? From stickster at gmail.com Tue Nov 7 13:58:39 2006 From: stickster at gmail.com (Paul W. Frields) Date: Tue, 07 Nov 2006 06:58:39 -0700 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] We made the distrowatch weekly In-Reply-To: <001201c70260$b01f0f50$240110ac@ALJOMAIHBEV.COM> References: <001201c70260$b01f0f50$240110ac@ALJOMAIHBEV.COM> Message-ID: <1162907919.1770.2.camel@localhost.localdomain> On Tue, 2006-11-07 at 14:33 +0300, Rino Mardo wrote: > > -----Original Message----- > > From: fedora-marketing-list-bounces at redhat.com > > [mailto:fedora-marketing-list-bounces at redhat.com] On Behalf > > Of Karlie Robinson > > Sent: Monday, November 06, 2006 11:31 AM > > To: fedora-marketing-list at redhat.com > > Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] We made the distrowatch weekly > > > > but not in a good way > > http://distrowatch.com/weekly.php?issue=20061106#phr > > > > The most eye catching issue I always read is about pirut. Then someone would > always suggests yumex for features users are looking for not in pirut. If > that is the case, why not make yumex the default? I believe the idea is that pirut follows the GNOME HIG. Yumex is a great application for people who want to tweak their package installations, but for the 80-90% case where the user just wants the latest updates, pirut satisfies those needs. You could make the same argument for just about any set of purposed applications. Ultimately a sane and simple default is required. -- Paul W. Frields, RHCE http://paul.frields.org/ gpg fingerprint: 3DA6 A0AC 6D58 FEC4 0233 5906 ACDB C937 BD11 3717 Fedora Project Board: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Board Fedora Docs Project: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/DocsProject -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part URL: From rodrigopadula at projetofedora.org Tue Nov 7 15:46:06 2006 From: rodrigopadula at projetofedora.org (Rodrigo Padula de Oliveira) Date: Tue, 07 Nov 2006 13:46:06 -0200 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] We made the distrowatch weekly In-Reply-To: <001201c70260$b01f0f50$240110ac@ALJOMAIHBEV.COM> References: <001201c70260$b01f0f50$240110ac@ALJOMAIHBEV.COM> Message-ID: <4550AA3E.70106@projetofedora.org> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Rino Mardo escreveu: >> -----Original Message----- >> From: fedora-marketing-list-bounces at redhat.com >> [mailto:fedora-marketing-list-bounces at redhat.com] On Behalf >> Of Karlie Robinson >> Sent: Monday, November 06, 2006 11:31 AM >> To: fedora-marketing-list at redhat.com >> Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] We made the distrowatch weekly >> >> but not in a good way >> http://distrowatch.com/weekly.php?issue=20061106#phr >> > > The most eye catching issue I always read is about pirut. Then someone would > always suggests yumex for features users are looking for not in pirut. If > that is the case, why not make yumex the default? > +1 -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.5 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Fedora - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iD8DBQFFUKo+Pg3HAC1vlg4RAuY+AJ9ml9Dj485RHwCXPI4teAOZtVbxQwCfWvKU pewo+EBg65UO38EbMZlQpcc= =HDEC -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From sundaram at fedoraproject.org Tue Nov 7 16:28:16 2006 From: sundaram at fedoraproject.org (Rahul Sundaram) Date: Tue, 07 Nov 2006 21:58:16 +0530 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] suse/opensuse contributors For Fedora ? In-Reply-To: <13dbfe4f0611062336j595bb393i38cc0dd9f6bebd59@mail.gmail.com> References: <13dbfe4f0611040410g4b969e26o49fd7c847f093b62@mail.gmail.com> <454FC5F6.2080809@fedoraproject.org> <13dbfe4f0611062336j595bb393i38cc0dd9f6bebd59@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <4550B420.7040501@fedoraproject.org> Chitlesh GOORAH wrote: > On 11/7/06, Rahul Sundaram < hidden > wrote: >> Ideologically that divisiveness between Linux users is bad. Practically, >> none of the distributions have enough market enough to be worth it >> compared to Windows or even better people who havent used computers yet. > > I was not talking about division, but about making noise about fedora > kde talks so that people know that if they want kde it isn't only from > kubuntu! Sure. Go ahead. Rahul From sundaram at fedoraproject.org Tue Nov 7 17:01:11 2006 From: sundaram at fedoraproject.org (Rahul Sundaram) Date: Tue, 07 Nov 2006 22:31:11 +0530 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] We made the distrowatch weekly In-Reply-To: <001201c70260$b01f0f50$240110ac@ALJOMAIHBEV.COM> References: <001201c70260$b01f0f50$240110ac@ALJOMAIHBEV.COM> Message-ID: <4550BBD7.8030009@fedoraproject.org> Rino Mardo wrote: >> -----Original Message----- >> From: fedora-marketing-list-bounces at redhat.com >> [mailto:fedora-marketing-list-bounces at redhat.com] On Behalf >> Of Karlie Robinson >> Sent: Monday, November 06, 2006 11:31 AM >> To: fedora-marketing-list at redhat.com >> Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] We made the distrowatch weekly >> >> but not in a good way >> http://distrowatch.com/weekly.php?issue=20061106#phr >> > > The most eye catching issue I always read is about pirut. Then someone would > always suggests yumex for features users are looking for not in pirut. If > that is the case, why not make yumex the default? How is this related this to this thread? Rahul From n.losito at yahoo.it Tue Nov 7 19:55:12 2006 From: n.losito at yahoo.it (Nicola Losito) Date: Tue, 7 Nov 2006 20:55:12 +0100 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Re: 10,000 Fedora downloads in five hours In-Reply-To: <454E842D.8030605@fedoraproject.org> References: <454E842D.8030605@fedoraproject.org> Message-ID: <7C43DAF8-2625-466B-88E6-F4B96FE1257A@yahoo.it> Il giorno 06/nov/06, alle ore 01:39, Rahul Sundaram ha scritto: > Hi > > http://news.com.com/2061-10795_3-6129149.html > The torrent presents a even more interesting picture when comparing > number of downloads of Fedora Core 6 with previous releases. http://koolinus.wordpress.com/2006/11/01/fedora-core-6-downloading/ 70.0 KB/s as the average download speed seems a bit slow to me {i have a nominal 4megabit download line and i could configure my network} Does that means people are not using bittorrent enough ? -- Nicola .:kOoLiNuS:. Losito http://koolinus.wordpress.com ITA => http://www.koolinus.net -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From sundaram at fedoraproject.org Tue Nov 7 20:17:47 2006 From: sundaram at fedoraproject.org (Rahul Sundaram) Date: Wed, 08 Nov 2006 01:47:47 +0530 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Fedora Core 6 - Batteries Included... Message-ID: <4550E9EB.4030707@fedoraproject.org> Hi "Fedora Core 6 (FC6) is one of the most comprehensive Linux offering I have seen to date. I have worked with Linux distributions starting from Redhat Linux 6.2 and forward. FC6 appears to be running most of the applications that users would need. Be it personal photo and video tools or office productivity suits. In addition, it also comes with a host of proven network and systems management tools built into the system." http://www.dharwadkar.com/technology/linux/fc6_install/ Rahul From paulds at bu.edu Tue Nov 7 21:23:53 2006 From: paulds at bu.edu (Paul Stauffer) Date: Tue, 7 Nov 2006 16:23:53 -0500 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Re: 10, 000 Fedora downloads in five hours In-Reply-To: <7C43DAF8-2625-466B-88E6-F4B96FE1257A@yahoo.it> References: <454E842D.8030605@fedoraproject.org> <7C43DAF8-2625-466B-88E6-F4B96FE1257A@yahoo.it> Message-ID: <20061107212353.GF11528@prozac.horde.com> On Tue, Nov 07, 2006 at 08:55:12PM +0100, Nicola Losito wrote: > http://koolinus.wordpress.com/2006/11/01/fedora-core-6-downloading/ > 70.0 KB/s as the average download speed seems a bit slow to me {i > have a nominal 4megabit download line and i could configure my network} > > Does that means people are not using bittorrent enough ? Not necessarily. There are many reasons why a given individual might be getting poor BitTorrent performance. On the flip side, I've been distributing FC6 via BitTorrent since the release, from a system with a full 1 Gbps connection into the Net. I currently have BitTorrent's outgoing bandwidth utilization capped at a mere 40 Mbps, but it's never even hit that limit. Outgoing throughput peaked at around 30 Mbps during the first 24 hours after release, and it's been steady around 10-12 Mbps ever since. - Paul -- Paul Stauffer Manager of Research Computing Computer Science Department Boston University From sundaram at fedoraproject.org Tue Nov 7 23:01:20 2006 From: sundaram at fedoraproject.org (Rahul Sundaram) Date: Wed, 08 Nov 2006 04:31:20 +0530 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Slam-dunk for Linux - a review of Fedora Core 6 Message-ID: <45511040.9030305@fedoraproject.org> Hi, "Fedora Core 6 follows up version 5 with the latest version of GNOME, the latest core Linux components (kernel 2.6.18, glibc 2.5) and dramatic functional improvements in some of its most important components." "....Fedora Core 6 is the second slam-dunk for Red Hat on the desktop front in all these categories." http://www.brad-x.com/?p=49 Rahul From rino.mardo at gmail.com Wed Nov 8 05:29:23 2006 From: rino.mardo at gmail.com (Rino Mardo) Date: Wed, 8 Nov 2006 08:29:23 +0300 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] We made the distrowatch weekly In-Reply-To: <4550BBD7.8030009@fedoraproject.org> Message-ID: <002501c702f6$e06982d0$240110ac@ALJOMAIHBEV.COM> > >> Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] We made the distrowatch weekly > >> > >> but not in a good way > >> http://distrowatch.com/weekly.php?issue=20061106#phr > >> > > > > The most eye catching issue I always read is about pirut. > Then someone > > would always suggests yumex for features users are looking > for not in > > pirut. If that is the case, why not make yumex the default? > > How is this related this to this thread? > > Rahul > Not directly but also contributes to why we made it "but not in a good way". From sundaram at fedoraproject.org Wed Nov 8 11:42:23 2006 From: sundaram at fedoraproject.org (Rahul Sundaram) Date: Wed, 08 Nov 2006 17:12:23 +0530 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] We made the distrowatch weekly In-Reply-To: <002501c702f6$e06982d0$240110ac@ALJOMAIHBEV.COM> References: <002501c702f6$e06982d0$240110ac@ALJOMAIHBEV.COM> Message-ID: <4551C29F.70407@fedoraproject.org> Rino Mardo wrote: >>>> Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] We made the distrowatch weekly >>>> >>>> but not in a good way >>>> http://distrowatch.com/weekly.php?issue=20061106#phr >>>> >>> The most eye catching issue I always read is about pirut. >> Then someone >>> would always suggests yumex for features users are looking >> for not in >>> pirut. If that is the case, why not make yumex the default? >> How is this related this to this thread? >> >> Rahul >> > > Not directly but also contributes to why we made it "but not in a good way". If you read the distrowatch news, it was not a review of any release of Fedora but a discussion about the website. Its completely unrelated to package managers. Rahul From gerold at lugd.org Wed Nov 8 12:01:39 2006 From: gerold at lugd.org (Gerold Kassube) Date: Wed, 08 Nov 2006 13:01:39 +0100 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Invitation to the FAD Message-ID: <1162987299.3450.21.camel@Amilo-GK.homenet.local> you'll find it as PDF at http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/FAD?action=AttachFile&do=get&target=invite_FAD.pdf First FEDORA AMBASSADORS DAY (FAD EMEA) ======================================= The Fedora Ambassador Day (FAD) is where Ambassadors and other interested members of the Fedora Community come together to plan for future Fedora events and get to know each other. This is your chance to meet other Fedora community members (Ambassadors, Developers) in person. We are proud to invite you to the first FAD in EMEA. The Event will start date ==== December 1st, 2006 (6 pm GMT+1) till December 3rd, 2006 location ======== Werner Mennicke Haus R?hrberg e.V. Im Grossfeld 2 D-79639 Grenzach-Wyhlen - Germany - Agenda ====== Friday ------ afternoon: ?come together? Saturday -------- morning: Keynote from a FAMSCO Member small introduction of the participants afternoon: planning EMEA events for 2007 Breakout-sessions evening: Surprise event with local ?Linux Users? Sunday ------ if desired, visiting University of Basel with introduction in the used Red Hat Cluster Additional information * Accommodation * we have to pay per night and person EUR 5,50 / each. * We have the following rooms: -1- room with bunk bed, cupboard and washbasin -1- room with three bunk beds, cupboard and washbasin -4- rooms with each bunk bed, cupboard and washbasin -1- big room with five bunk beds and cupboards there are different showers and toilets. * You have to take care by your own for bed sheets, sleeping bag and your pillow. * Meals * Organized. Please indicate if you have special dietary requirements (vegetarian, allergies, ...) * Trip-planing * next airport Basel ? Mulhouse (international airport) * next railway-station L?rrach * best reachable railway-station Basel (Badischer Bahnhof) * by car Google Maps is your friend :) * Registration * please send your engaging registration latest November, 18th by E-Mail to GeroldKa at fedoraproject.org We were looking forward to see you soon and it would be a pleasure to have you all at the first event of this kind. -- Regards Gerold Kassube Fedora Ambassador Deutschland / Germany Schweiz / Switzerland Email: GeroldKa at fedoraproject.org 1024D/F33128B9 4ABC A903 F1F4 D9CC C422 AACA EDF1 DF42 F331 28B9 -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: Dies ist ein digital signierter Nachrichtenteil URL: From rino.mardo at gmail.com Wed Nov 8 14:37:59 2006 From: rino.mardo at gmail.com (Rino Mardo) Date: Wed, 8 Nov 2006 17:37:59 +0300 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] We made the distrowatch weekly In-Reply-To: <4551C29F.70407@fedoraproject.org> Message-ID: <000c01c70343$80d47d50$240110ac@ALJOMAIHBEV.COM> > > > > Not directly but also contributes to why we made it "but > not in a good way". > > If you read the distrowatch news, it was not a review of any > release of Fedora but a discussion about the website. Its > completely unrelated to package managers. > > Rahul > Has nothing to do with distronews, the website, or such. It's with the "but not in a good way". Forget distronews just concentrate on "but not in a good way". From sundaram at fedoraproject.org Wed Nov 8 14:43:36 2006 From: sundaram at fedoraproject.org (Rahul Sundaram) Date: Wed, 08 Nov 2006 20:13:36 +0530 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] We made the distrowatch weekly In-Reply-To: <000c01c70343$80d47d50$240110ac@ALJOMAIHBEV.COM> References: <000c01c70343$80d47d50$240110ac@ALJOMAIHBEV.COM> Message-ID: <4551ED18.2080902@fedoraproject.org> Rino Mardo wrote: >>> Not directly but also contributes to why we made it "but >> not in a good way". >> >> If you read the distrowatch news, it was not a review of any >> release of Fedora but a discussion about the website. Its >> completely unrelated to package managers. >> >> Rahul >> > > Has nothing to do with distronews, the website, or such. It's with the "but > not in a good way". Forget distronews just concentrate on "but not in a good > way". Taking a sentence and pulling out specific words is throwing off context. Discussions here should be focused on marketing coordination and contributions. Rahul From thomas.canniot at laposte.net Wed Nov 8 17:14:46 2006 From: thomas.canniot at laposte.net (Thomas Canniot) Date: Wed, 08 Nov 2006 18:14:46 +0100 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] FC6 Reviews Message-ID: <1163006086.4768.6.camel@localhost.localdomain> http://www.softwareinreview.com/cms/content/view/57 and http://www.brad-x.com/?p=49 Some criticisms are not very pleasant to read ... Thomas Canniot From marc at mwiriadi.id.au Thu Nov 9 02:35:16 2006 From: marc at mwiriadi.id.au (Marc Wiriadisastra) Date: Thu, 09 Nov 2006 10:35:16 +0800 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] FC6 Reviews In-Reply-To: <1163006086.4768.6.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <1163006086.4768.6.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <1163039716.6588.8.camel@strikeforce.mwiriadi.id.au> On Wed, 2006-11-08 at 18:14 +0100, Thomas Canniot wrote: > http://www.softwareinreview.com/cms/content/view/57 > > and > > http://www.brad-x.com/?p=49 > > Some criticisms are not very pleasant to read ... > Ouch that first one seems really bad. I'm not sure but most of his gripes were about propietary software. There was only 2 things that he regarded which were core to fedora. One being I think system-config-network which I personally like. Also Adding software repositories. That was a first crack at it in fedora core 6 I thought? It worked well with extras since I used it myself. I think he tried to add a non core repository. I'm not sure what he means though that we look like ubuntu. I personally don't think we do at all. Some of the criticisms are justified but not at fedora. The other repositories should talk to each other more to have a one package policy of some sort that goes against the grain of open source though. Just my thoughts regarding it. To solve it? I'm not sure. I'm not technically minded. >From a marketing perspective I would say maybe more information on getting those specific cards, drivers working? I don't have a wireless card so I can't even comment. I have no issues with the other problems he listed. Regards, Marc From michael at phoronix.com Thu Nov 9 02:41:14 2006 From: michael at phoronix.com (michael at phoronix.com) Date: Wed, 8 Nov 2006 20:41:14 -0600 (CST) Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] FC6 Reviews In-Reply-To: <1163039716.6588.8.camel@strikeforce.mwiriadi.id.au> References: <1163006086.4768.6.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1163039716.6588.8.camel@strikeforce.mwiriadi.id.au> Message-ID: <51148.198.110.249.101.1163040074.squirrel@www.phoronix.com> An Ubuntu developer has posted a mini-review/rants about Fedora Core 6: http://mindwarp.net/?p=30 (seen it on Planet Ubuntu) Regards, Michael Larabel > On Wed, 2006-11-08 at 18:14 +0100, Thomas Canniot wrote: >> http://www.softwareinreview.com/cms/content/view/57 >> >> and >> >> http://www.brad-x.com/?p=49 >> >> Some criticisms are not very pleasant to read ... >> > Ouch that first one seems really bad. I'm not sure but most of his > gripes were about propietary software. > > There was only 2 things that he regarded which were core to fedora. One > being I think system-config-network which I personally like. > > Also Adding software repositories. That was a first crack at it in > fedora core 6 I thought? It worked well with extras since I used it > myself. I think he tried to add a non core repository. > > I'm not sure what he means though that we look like ubuntu. I > personally don't think we do at all. > > Some of the criticisms are justified but not at fedora. The other > repositories should talk to each other more to have a one package policy > of some sort that goes against the grain of open source though. > > Just my thoughts regarding it. > To solve it? > I'm not sure. > I'm not technically minded. >>From a marketing perspective I would say maybe more information on > getting those specific cards, drivers working? > I don't have a wireless card so I can't even comment. > I have no issues with the other problems he listed. > > Regards, > > > Marc > > > -- > Fedora-marketing-list mailing list > Fedora-marketing-list at redhat.com > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-marketing-list > From sundaram at fedoraproject.org Thu Nov 9 03:18:26 2006 From: sundaram at fedoraproject.org (Rahul Sundaram) Date: Thu, 09 Nov 2006 08:48:26 +0530 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] FC6 Reviews In-Reply-To: <51148.198.110.249.101.1163040074.squirrel@www.phoronix.com> References: <1163006086.4768.6.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1163039716.6588.8.camel@strikeforce.mwiriadi.id.au> <51148.198.110.249.101.1163040074.squirrel@www.phoronix.com> Message-ID: <45529E02.9050907@fedoraproject.org> michael at phoronix.com wrote: > An Ubuntu developer has posted a mini-review/rants about Fedora Core 6: > http://mindwarp.net/?p=30 (seen it on Planet Ubuntu) > > Ooo. Easy as pie. I have added these as comments but for our friendly marketing peers here, I present: * Wireless - In Fedora, the policy is to try and stay close to upstream on most packages including the kernel and there is very strong support for Free software. If the card isnt supported in the upstream kernel or requires proprietary drivers or firmware without clean redistribution rights, Fedora wont support it out of the box. You can possibly look at third party repositories for that. Fedora Core 6 includes the ability to use Fedora Extras or custom repositories during installation so this is currently very simple. It can be even automated completely using kickstart. * Graphics: Red Hat spearheaded the AIGLX development and it has merged into Xorg 7.1 that is included in Fedora Core 6. XGL is additional unnecessary overhead of a separate server and widely considered as a legacy hack. * Resolution: This is potentially due to the switchover from Bitstream to Dejavu which appears to have exposed a fontconfig bug. https://bugzilla.redhat.com/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=210491 * Bootup: Fedora has been using the quiet option and rhgb graphical bootup to hide kernel text by default in recent releases. See /etc/grub.conf if you want to disable that. * Package Management: While Apt along with Synaptic and Smart is available in Fedora Extras it is not the default for various reasons described in http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Tools/Apt Hope that explains a few things. Rahul From sundaram at fedoraproject.org Thu Nov 9 03:23:47 2006 From: sundaram at fedoraproject.org (Rahul Sundaram) Date: Thu, 09 Nov 2006 08:53:47 +0530 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] FC6 Reviews In-Reply-To: <1163039716.6588.8.camel@strikeforce.mwiriadi.id.au> References: <1163006086.4768.6.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1163039716.6588.8.camel@strikeforce.mwiriadi.id.au> Message-ID: <45529F43.4060803@fedoraproject.org> Marc Wiriadisastra wrote: > On Wed, 2006-11-08 at 18:14 +0100, Thomas Canniot wrote: >> http://www.softwareinreview.com/cms/content/view/57 >> >> and >> >> http://www.brad-x.com/?p=49 The second review doesnt cover much ground and is pretty supportive. Already posted by me in this list. I would have taken the time to comment on the first review but it hit LWN already at http://lwn.net/Articles/208370/ with ongoing active discussions. Our fearless kernel leader Dave Jones just blogged a comprehensive response. Take a look at http://kernelslacker.livejournal.com/62413.html. If more details is required, let me know. Rahul From nicolas.mailhot at laposte.net Thu Nov 9 07:59:42 2006 From: nicolas.mailhot at laposte.net (Nicolas Mailhot) Date: Thu, 09 Nov 2006 08:59:42 +0100 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] FC6 Reviews In-Reply-To: <45529F43.4060803@fedoraproject.org> References: <1163006086.4768.6.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1163039716.6588.8.camel@strikeforce.mwiriadi.id.au> <45529F43.4060803@fedoraproject.org> Message-ID: <1163059186.5230.2.camel@rousalka.dyndns.org> Le jeudi 09 novembre 2006 ? 08:53 +0530, Rahul Sundaram a ?crit : > The second review doesnt cover much ground and is pretty supportive. > Already posted by me in this list. I would have taken the time to > comment on the first review but it hit LWN already at > http://lwn.net/Articles/208370/ with ongoing active discussions Comparing the first review with the OpenBSD one the author did at the same time is a bit enlightening. Keyboard fails in OpenBSD and its SMP support (90% of new x86 processors) is weak but it's the best thing since sliced bread. BSD CLI utils are good where FC6 gets bashed for not being 100% GUI, and so on -- Nicolas Mailhot From nicolas.mailhot at laposte.net Thu Nov 9 08:38:50 2006 From: nicolas.mailhot at laposte.net (Nicolas Mailhot) Date: Thu, 09 Nov 2006 09:38:50 +0100 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] FC6 Reviews In-Reply-To: <45529E02.9050907@fedoraproject.org> References: <1163006086.4768.6.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1163039716.6588.8.camel@strikeforce.mwiriadi.id.au> <51148.198.110.249.101.1163040074.squirrel@www.phoronix.com> <45529E02.9050907@fedoraproject.org> Message-ID: <1163061531.5230.20.camel@rousalka.dyndns.org> Le jeudi 09 novembre 2006 ? 08:48 +0530, Rahul Sundaram a ?crit : > * Resolution: This is potentially due to the switchover from Bitstream > to Dejavu which appears to have exposed a fontconfig bug. > > https://bugzilla.redhat.com/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=210491 Other bugs complain about Luxi changing between FC5 and FC6 so the problem is not at the font level (should I saved the bug # I know). Rather between FC5 and 6 our freetype version saw major changes and got rid of some code deemed to be related to patented algorithms. The unencumbered replacement fails badly at low dpi resolutions (not surprisingly since Fedora is probably the only distro shipping a "pure" freetype, and I doubt this component saw a lot if review in FC6 test releases?) * Sat Jul 08 2006 Behdad Esfahbod 2.2.1-1 - Update to 2.2.1 <- new freetype version - Remove FreeType 1, to move to extras <- not a small change either In the case of the reviewer his non-standard laptop res (1280x800) may be making worse. If FC6 freetype makes mistakes at low dpi but standard resolutions I can't imagine how bad it may be on exotic ones. And this is not to say I don't support the move to a freeer freetype or I think the freetype maintainer is doing a bad job, but I get tired of seing dejavu blamed for this. ? most of the font people only run the full freetype with patented bits patched in, since the result is so much better than the free one right now. This was true even before the last round of patent-encumbered purging. Also I don't think @rh people suffer from low dpi screens. -- Nicolas Mailhot From sdl.web at gmail.com Thu Nov 9 10:48:04 2006 From: sdl.web at gmail.com (Leo) Date: Thu, 09 Nov 2006 10:48:04 +0000 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Re: FC6 Reviews References: <1163006086.4768.6.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1163039716.6588.8.camel@strikeforce.mwiriadi.id.au> <51148.198.110.249.101.1163040074.squirrel@www.phoronix.com> <45529E02.9050907@fedoraproject.org> Message-ID: On Thu, 09/11/06, Rahul Sundaram wrote: > michael at phoronix.com wrote: >> An Ubuntu developer has posted a mini-review/rants about Fedora Core 6: >> http://mindwarp.net/?p=30 (seen it on Planet Ubuntu) >> >> > > Ooo. Easy as pie. I have added these as comments but for our friendly > marketing peers here, I present: > > * Wireless - In Fedora, the policy is to try and stay close to > upstream on most packages including the kernel and there is very > strong support for Free software. If the card isnt supported in the > upstream kernel or requires proprietary drivers or firmware without > clean redistribution rights, Fedora wont support it out of the > box. You can possibly look at third party repositories for > that. Fedora Core 6 includes the ability to use Fedora Extras or > custom repositories during installation so this is currently very > simple. It can be even automated completely using kickstart. > > * Graphics: Red Hat spearheaded the AIGLX development and it has > merged into Xorg 7.1 that is included in Fedora Core 6. XGL is > additional unnecessary overhead of a separate server and widely > considered as a legacy hack. > > * Resolution: This is potentially due to the switchover from Bitstream > to Dejavu which appears to have exposed a fontconfig bug. > > https://bugzilla.redhat.com/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=210491 > > * Bootup: Fedora has been using the quiet option and rhgb graphical > bootup to hide kernel text by default in recent releases. See > /etc/grub.conf if you want to disable that. > > * Package Management: While Apt along with Synaptic and Smart is > available in Fedora Extras it is not the default for various reasons > described in http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Tools/Apt > > Hope that explains a few things. > > Rahul When one does a review, usually people are expecting a well-researched objective view. I see nothing more than ignorance in that one. But Rahul do you think you comments can become a article in Redhat Magazine? I think we need to show a clearer message to the public. -- Leo From gmureddu at prodigy.net.mx Thu Nov 9 19:28:51 2006 From: gmureddu at prodigy.net.mx (Gian Paolo Mureddu) Date: Thu, 09 Nov 2006 13:28:51 -0600 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] FC6 Reviews In-Reply-To: <1163006086.4768.6.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <1163006086.4768.6.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <45538173.1070701@prodigy.net.mx> Thomas Canniot escribi?: > http://www.softwareinreview.com/cms/content/view/57 > > For this review I have to totally agree on the wireless support (or lack there off) in Fedora, but that's never stopped me and many others to try and get our cards to work. It could certainly be better and easier, sure, but it is not necessarily a top priority, desirable, sure! Many of the points this author highlights are sad but true, many do not depend on Fedora (like the extra packages repos not being compatible with one another, which is responsibility of the repository packagers and maintainers), but it could certainly be easier to add new repositories. Making it so, not necessarily states that Fedora endorses the use of proprietary software, but the fact that some dubious packages live in other repositories, is a fact that other distros (even all-mighty-Debian) have come to realize, and they clearly state that these are beyond their control, so the same could hold true for Fedora in the future. I certainly don't understand the comparison with Ubuntu, the author is CLEARLY an Ubuntu user (and Fedora basher), I've used that distro, I don't like it, just as he doesn't like Fedora. Sure, there are certain areas where Fedora can improve, and that's why users can file RFE's (I've submitted my share, and will probably keep doing so). I don't know what he means by "lost identity". Of course Red Hat Linux lost its identity! It ceased to exist! Fedora (as somewhat rightly said by the author) picks up where Red Hat Linux left off, and to *some* extent could considered the continuation of, but they're different things, one was a product, the other is a [community] project. Contrary to what the author says, I think Fedora's identity is more mature with Fedora Core 6 than any previous release, one thing though, I hope that the "genetic" theme persists as part of the identity with any degree of variation and "evolution" (intrinsic to genetic material :-) ), making it part of the Fedora identity (along the "infinity and beyond" bubble logo). Two lamentable incidents were brought up (with a vengeance) by the author: The infamous Anaconda crash when adding repositories which and the interface had to be manually configured, or when adding iSCSI volumes (not mentioned by the author, but ultimately related to his problem), and the problem with wireless setup. I regret his focus on proprietary, as far from the objective of GNU, Linux and many other Open Source initiatives to "Open" the Web, he seems to be content with it remaining closed... Anyway, that's a philosophical issue not concerning Fedora (as such), I guess the fact that he compares vis-a-vis Fedora to Ubuntu speaks good for Fedora, as Ubuntu is quickly becoming "the defacto standard" distribution for new users, which means that there are some rough edges around Fedora which have to be polished out, but that it is at least at the same level as Ubuntu, but not quite "usable" for new users. This had been the intended way for Fedora for most of the past releases, Fedora (to the best of my understanding) was not targeted at the totally new GNU/Linux user, but more towards the seasoned to power user, without it being as "hard" (complex, really) as Gentoo or LFS, which is why I have always liked Red Hat products, and Fedora is no exception, which I'm infinitely grateful for. However Fedora CAN be used by new and inexperienced users, they need more hand-holding, but in the end they get the hang of it fairly quickly. With the renewed focus on providing within the distro and community that hand-holding new users need only speaks good for Fedora, as it remains the same for experienced users, but gets friendlier for newer, to me that's as close to perfection you can possibly get ;-) << Fanboy-speaking. From rodrigopadula at projetofedora.org Thu Nov 9 22:08:06 2006 From: rodrigopadula at projetofedora.org (Rodrigo Padula de Oliveira) Date: Thu, 09 Nov 2006 20:08:06 -0200 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Brazilian Fedora Ambassadors - Meeting NOW Message-ID: <4553A6C6.4060703@projetofedora.org> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Now!!!! #fedora-br at Freenode!! ASS: Rodrigo Padula -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.5 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Fedora - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iD8DBQFFU6bGPg3HAC1vlg4RAj4MAKCbg1ISuekBJzMM2iy2oP8PyEzBbwCeP40r j5pYLHZONhchRN5pazS+xbE= =kfbY -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From sundaram at fedoraproject.org Thu Nov 9 23:14:47 2006 From: sundaram at fedoraproject.org (Rahul Sundaram) Date: Fri, 10 Nov 2006 04:44:47 +0530 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Re: FC6 Reviews In-Reply-To: References: <1163006086.4768.6.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1163039716.6588.8.camel@strikeforce.mwiriadi.id.au> <51148.198.110.249.101.1163040074.squirrel@www.phoronix.com> <45529E02.9050907@fedoraproject.org> Message-ID: <4553B667.6020106@fedoraproject.org> Leo wrote: > When one does a review, usually people are expecting a well-researched > objective view. I see nothing more than ignorance in that one. > > But Rahul do you think you comments can become a article in Redhat > Magazine? I think we need to show a clearer message to the public. Well, Fedoranews can pick it up. Copying the editor. Rahul From marc at mwiriadi.id.au Thu Nov 9 23:24:17 2006 From: marc at mwiriadi.id.au (Marc Wiriadisastra) Date: Fri, 10 Nov 2006 07:24:17 +0800 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Linux article Message-ID: <1163114658.8682.10.camel@strikeforce.mwiriadi.id.au> Hey All just found this interesting article. http://blogs.zdnet.com/hardware/index.php?p=133 Its a personal opinion has some critique in it which is understandable but a more 'open' view than the one sided one we got the other day. Not related to FC-6 but to linux in general. I'm hoping the article is partly true in the sense that the 'time' is right to increase market share. Hopefully the masses will leave Microsoft to force companies to provide support to linux finally. Regards, Marc From sundaram at fedoraproject.org Fri Nov 10 04:32:47 2006 From: sundaram at fedoraproject.org (Rahul Sundaram) Date: Fri, 10 Nov 2006 10:02:47 +0530 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Fedora Core 6: Kneel before Zod! Message-ID: <455400EF.7090304@fedoraproject.org> Hi "Fedora Core 6, codenamed Zod, was released on October 24 for x86, PowerPC, and AMD64 systems. With a number of improvements over its predecessors, this is an impressive release, if you're willing to overlook a couple of installer bugs." http://distrocenter.linux.com/article.pl?sid=06/11/03/1858255 Rahul From n.losito at yahoo.it Fri Nov 10 10:29:16 2006 From: n.losito at yahoo.it (Nicola Losito) Date: Fri, 10 Nov 2006 11:29:16 +0100 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Re: Ubuntu Release Party in Beijing, what about Fedora? In-Reply-To: <4545C253.8070200@adelphia.net> References: <001c01c6fbe9$c5c9db50$240110ac@ALJOMAIHBEV.COM> <4545C253.8070200@adelphia.net> Message-ID: <41315EAF-F7CB-45DF-BF6D-E86ED25D0F27@yahoo.it> Il giorno 30/ott/06, alle ore 10:13, Jasper Hartline ha scritto: > Not all installation types require 5 CDs. > 5 CDs comprises the whole of the Fedora Core distribution. > Sounds plenty conservative to me, compared to Mandriva's 10 CD set > or something. > [CUT] > Why don't you just move on and forget about Linux rather than > spread misinformation that installihng Fedora Core > requires 5 CDs? Now you're spreading misinformation :-) 10 CD is more like to be the 12CD set of ENTIRE Debian distribution. Mandriva goes to 6 or 7 only for PowerPacks (the ones you can buy in shops). The Free download edition is composed by 3 cds. And in those extra packages you get mp3, proprietary videocards driver, RealPlayer, Opera, and drivers for some modems (56k / ISDN / USB ones). Just for the sake of knowledge ... -- Nicola .:kOoLiNuS:. Losito http://koolinus.wordpress.com ITA => http://www.koolinus.net -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From n.losito at yahoo.it Fri Nov 10 10:35:50 2006 From: n.losito at yahoo.it (Nicola Losito) Date: Fri, 10 Nov 2006 11:35:50 +0100 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Re: Ubuntu Release Party in Beijing, what about Fedora? In-Reply-To: References: <001c01c6fbe9$c5c9db50$240110ac@ALJOMAIHBEV.COM> Message-ID: Il giorno 30/ott/06, alle ore 09:34, Leo ha scritto: > If we assume Fedora is for Desktop users, I think reducing the number > of CDs is a must. Make it within 2 CDs would be nice. At least there > should be an install option that does not require all 5 CDs. Reading some old threads here will make you become more acknoledged that Fedora in *not* FOR desktop use but ALSO for it. Provided you have the knowledge, the time and the will to tailor it to your needs and preferences. And in fact i have Fedora in my highest raccomendation for "open" enviroments where one has to cover different profile of computer usage, since you can customize it and nothing breaks .... so quite the opposite of what happens to some "human" distribution. But if you *need* a pure desktop, an average Joe kind of use with some unsayable proprietary software/technology to use then the Fedora experience is .... sometimes frustrating. -- Nicola .:kOoLiNuS:. Losito http://koolinus.wordpress.com ITA => http://www.koolinus.net -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From sundaram at fedoraproject.org Fri Nov 10 16:17:10 2006 From: sundaram at fedoraproject.org (Rahul Sundaram) Date: Fri, 10 Nov 2006 21:47:10 +0530 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] OLPC Taps 2.6.19 Kernel for First Linux Laptop Build Message-ID: <4554A606.9040505@fedoraproject.org> Hi "The One Laptop Per Child project has decided to utilize a Linux 2.6.19 OLPC kernel with a Red Hat Fedora Core 6 'run-time environment' for the first build of its giveaway portable notebook computer, the project's president for software and content said Sunday. OLPC executive Walter Bender announced the decision via his weekly progress report." http://www.desktoplinux.com/news/NS7522088140.html Rahul From gmureddu at prodigy.net.mx Fri Nov 10 18:45:04 2006 From: gmureddu at prodigy.net.mx (Gian Paolo Mureddu) Date: Fri, 10 Nov 2006 12:45:04 -0600 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] OLPC Taps 2.6.19 Kernel for First LinuxLaptopBuild In-Reply-To: <4554A606.9040505@fedoraproject.org> References: <4554A606.9040505@fedoraproject.org> Message-ID: <4554C8B0.2080504@prodigy.net.mx> Rahul Sundaram escribi?: > Hi > > "The One Laptop Per Child project has decided to utilize a Linux > 2.6.19 OLPC kernel with a Red Hat Fedora Core 6 'run-time environment' > for the first build of its giveaway portable notebook computer, the > project's president for software and content said Sunday. OLPC > executive Walter Bender announced the decision via his weekly progress > report." > > http://www.desktoplinux.com/news/NS7522088140.html > > Rahul > Is kernel 2.6.19 live (i.e out of the oven)? I'll have to give that baby a try! From michel.salim at gmail.com Fri Nov 10 21:43:14 2006 From: michel.salim at gmail.com (Michel Salim) Date: Fri, 10 Nov 2006 16:43:14 -0500 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Re: Ubuntu Release Party in Beijing, what about Fedora? In-Reply-To: <4545D8AC.2070806@adelphia.net> References: <001c01c6fbe9$c5c9db50$240110ac@ALJOMAIHBEV.COM> <4545C253.8070200@adelphia.net> <4545D8AC.2070806@adelphia.net> Message-ID: <883cfe6d0611101343k2d7a17b9v12b210d61806b36a@mail.gmail.com> On 10/30/06, Jasper Hartline wrote: > Leo wrote: > > who is actually spreading misinformation. Even with a minimal > > selection of packages, Anaconda will warn users to have 5CD at hand. > > > > > Dependant upon the package selection you choose Anaconda will state > which CDs you need. > With a minimal selection of packages, Fedora Core requires CDs 1 and 2, This probably should be better documented. I don'[t think many users realize that they could just boot the first CD, choose their installation options and then download only the other CDs that they need. Regards, -- Michel Salim Don't worry about avoiding temptation -- as you grow older, it starts avoiding you. -- The Old Farmer's Almanac From sundaram at fedoraproject.org Sat Nov 11 13:42:42 2006 From: sundaram at fedoraproject.org (Rahul Sundaram) Date: Sat, 11 Nov 2006 19:12:42 +0530 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Re: Ubuntu Release Party in Beijing, what about Fedora? In-Reply-To: <883cfe6d0611101343k2d7a17b9v12b210d61806b36a@mail.gmail.com> References: <001c01c6fbe9$c5c9db50$240110ac@ALJOMAIHBEV.COM> <4545C253.8070200@adelphia.net> <4545D8AC.2070806@adelphia.net> <883cfe6d0611101343k2d7a17b9v12b210d61806b36a@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <4555D352.1020603@fedoraproject.org> Michel Salim wrote: > On 10/30/06, Jasper Hartline wrote: >> Leo wrote: >> > who is actually spreading misinformation. Even with a minimal >> > selection of packages, Anaconda will warn users to have 5CD at hand. >> > >> > >> Dependant upon the package selection you choose Anaconda will state >> which CDs you need. >> With a minimal selection of packages, Fedora Core requires CDs 1 and 2, > > This probably should be better documented. I don'[t think many users > realize that they could just boot the first CD, choose their > installation options and then download only the other CDs that they > need. It's already well documented like say the installation guide. End users dont read much. Rahul From karlie.robinson at fedoraproject.org Sat Nov 11 09:27:40 2006 From: karlie.robinson at fedoraproject.org (Karlie Robinson) Date: Sat, 11 Nov 2006 09:27:40 +0000 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Community - Was - Ubuntu Release Party... In-Reply-To: <4555D352.1020603@fedoraproject.org> References: <001c01c6fbe9$c5c9db50$240110ac@ALJOMAIHBEV.COM> <4545C253.8070200@adelphia.net> <4545D8AC.2070806@adelphia.net> <883cfe6d0611101343k2d7a17b9v12b210d61806b36a@mail.gmail.com> <4555D352.1020603@fedoraproject.org> Message-ID: <4555978C.6030803@fedoraproject.org> Rahul Sundaram wrote: > Michel Salim wrote: >> This probably should be better documented. I don'[t think many users >> realize that they could just boot the first CD, choose their >> installation options and then download only the other CDs that they >> need. > > > It's already well documented like say the installation guide. End users > dont read much. > > Rahul > Every time I see a mention of RTFM I just cringe. Michael brings up a good point about booting the first disc. Even as an ambassador he finds the info hard to come by so why would you expect the average user to home in on it? You guys are always focused on Ubuntu because, I can only assume, you've got user envy. But with "end users don't read much" it's no wonder there aren't as many Fedora users. And if you want to take an example from a distro that's gowing at a pace that will pass Fedora on by, you should be looking at the reason why PClinuxOS is now in the top 10 at DistroWatch.com. (a few months ago it was 10, now it's 6. What does that tell you?) Is because of their community. New users are greeted with open arms. Questions that have been answered hundreds of times continue to be answered as if it was the first time. If you need an example, check out http://www.pclinuxos.com/forum/index.php?topic=10099.0 New user question. The specific answer. Followed by where to find more information. Then success for the user. My best advice for Michael and Rahul... Tip of the week! Not only would you be helping novice users, but you'd get people into the documentation to do a little more learning on their own. I'm sure a tip of the week would be a welcome addition to Fedora Weekly News. From n.losito at yahoo.it Sat Nov 11 16:10:47 2006 From: n.losito at yahoo.it (Nicola Losito) Date: Sat, 11 Nov 2006 17:10:47 +0100 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Re: Community - Was - Ubuntu Release Party... In-Reply-To: <4555978C.6030803@fedoraproject.org> References: <001c01c6fbe9$c5c9db50$240110ac@ALJOMAIHBEV.COM> <4545C253.8070200@adelphia.net> <4545D8AC.2070806@adelphia.net> <883cfe6d0611101343k2d7a17b9v12b210d61806b36a@mail.gmail.com> <4555D352.1020603@fedoraproject.org> <4555978C.6030803@fedoraproject.org> Message-ID: <82710748-D212-4DFF-9F8A-2FA5E5300A61@yahoo.it> Il giorno 11/nov/06, alle ore 10:27, Karlie Robinson ha scritto: > My best advice for Michael and Rahul... Tip of the week! Not only > would you be helping novice users, but you'd get people into the > documentation to do a little more learning on their own. > > I'm sure a tip of the week would be a welcome addition to Fedora > Weekly News. +1 but here we should make a huge list of tips so Thomas (IIRC) which manages the Weekly News has only to do a copy & paste. Or maybe on the official wiki [1] we should build a page like this one: http://ubuntuguide.org/wiki/Fedora_fc5 or this other: http://www.fedorafaq.org/ so we can provide up to date "guides". But then again this makes everything go under the not too quick procedure of getting writing access to the FedoraProject wiki. [1] also this is a viable way if the wiki is hosted in countries different from US where giving some tips to obtain mp3 o libdvdcss is potentially a search for (legal) trouble. To my mind comes that a discussion similar to this was made on opensuse mailing list one year ago when the project had started and they had to define what was "novell" and what was "community ..... -- Nicola .:kOoLiNuS:. Losito http://www.koolinus.net http://koolinus.wordpress.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From marc at mwiriadi.id.au Sun Nov 12 00:31:26 2006 From: marc at mwiriadi.id.au (Marc Wiriadisastra) Date: Sun, 12 Nov 2006 08:31:26 +0800 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Re: Community - Was - Ubuntu Release Party... In-Reply-To: <82710748-D212-4DFF-9F8A-2FA5E5300A61@yahoo.it> References: <001c01c6fbe9$c5c9db50$240110ac@ALJOMAIHBEV.COM> <4545C253.8070200@adelphia.net> <4545D8AC.2070806@adelphia.net> <883cfe6d0611101343k2d7a17b9v12b210d61806b36a@mail.gmail.com> <4555D352.1020603@fedoraproject.org> <4555978C.6030803@fedoraproject.org> <82710748-D212-4DFF-9F8A-2FA5E5300A61@yahoo.it> Message-ID: <1163291486.15462.20.camel@strikeforce.mwiriadi.id.au> On Sat, 2006-11-11 at 17:10 +0100, Nicola Losito wrote: > Il giorno 11/nov/06, alle ore 10:27, Karlie Robinson ha scritto: > > > My best advice for Michael and Rahul... Tip of the week! Not only > > would you be helping novice users, but you'd get people into the > > documentation to do a little more learning on their own. > > > > > > I'm sure a tip of the week would be a welcome addition to Fedora > > Weekly News. > One of the things I've noticed as a comparison is not so much the explaining of 'noob' questions or anything like that. Its the fact that we have to build/improve the community. One of the best overall communities distro's that 'I' have seen is the ubuntu one. I'm not saying it is the best I'm saying its the best I've seen. I'm also not sure how to recreate something like that. The support, the help, the innovation that gets created. The contribution that goes back. For example: There is a modified gnome menu which you can download and install as a deb. There is a bittorrent that you can download. The help.ubuntu.com page which is on their wiki. The howto's which are everywhere. The supporting communities such as the ubuntuguide etc.... The steps they are making to sort out user problems. A simple backup program. automounting of fat32 or ntfs. Things like that or as soon as you mount a harddrive it shows the link on your desktop. All of those 'other' things help make the distro look better. I love fedora as a distro and have done for awhile. One of my biggest gripes isn't with the distro at all its with the community helping to make the overall community better. Its a catch 22 which I have no way of solving or figuring out how to improve. Now people can say well I can help contribute. Yes I can I previously started to create a fedora wiki full of howto's until I found fedorasolved.org. Which is currently getting rebuilt. That is where I'm currently contributing to help make it a haven of howto's. To help people do the stuff that they want to do. How to install and run freenx. How to use xgl with nvidia drivers. How to install movieplayer. The doc's project will be better for it because I believe the non propietary howto's will be sent back to the fedora wiki. I'm open to suggestions on what we can do to help. I personally don't think redhat should get involved in it because I feel that if the community see redhat getting involved they don't contribute. They don't seem to understand that a lot of the supporting stuff while the staff at redhat contribute there are also people who don't work at redhat that contribute. I think that perception needs to be rectified. The greatest example I've seen of this perception was when a guy on a mailing list turned around and said that redhat should put someone in the mailing list to monitor what people were complaining about. He expected Rahul to do that. Well for me I was stunned. I understood his comment to mean that redhat should do everything and the community should do nothing. I know not everyone see's it that way but I wonder how many people see it that way. It seems to be an us and them. It seems to be that don't worry Redhat will do everything or we can't contribute because Redhat won't allow it. Its very apathetic at times which is annoying but understandable. As always I may be way off or I may be interpreting stuff the wrong way in that case please correct it. Regards, Marc From sundaram at fedoraproject.org Sun Nov 12 05:03:55 2006 From: sundaram at fedoraproject.org (Rahul Sundaram) Date: Sun, 12 Nov 2006 10:33:55 +0530 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Community - Was - Ubuntu Release Party... In-Reply-To: <4555978C.6030803@fedoraproject.org> References: <001c01c6fbe9$c5c9db50$240110ac@ALJOMAIHBEV.COM> <4545C253.8070200@adelphia.net> <4545D8AC.2070806@adelphia.net> <883cfe6d0611101343k2d7a17b9v12b210d61806b36a@mail.gmail.com> <4555D352.1020603@fedoraproject.org> <4555978C.6030803@fedoraproject.org> Message-ID: <4556AB3B.8060500@fedoraproject.org> Karlie Robinson wrote: > > Every time I see a mention of RTFM I just cringe. It wasnt. He said it should be documented. I pointed out it already was. Thats very different from "RTFM". > > Michael brings up a good point about booting the first disc. Even as an > ambassador he finds the info hard to come by so why would you expect the > average user to home in on it? > > You guys are always focused on Ubuntu because, I can only assume, you've > got user envy. Who is "you guys" here? > But with "end users don't read much" it's no wonder there aren't as many > Fedora users. Stating a fact wouldnt drive away users. I contribute to documentation and number of times in fedoraforum and fedora-list that I had to point out to my own documentation is several hundreds for every release. If anybody working in documentation believes that end users actually read all of the documentation, do let me know. > > My best advice for Michael and Rahul... Tip of the week! Not only would > you be helping novice users, but you'd get people into the documentation > to do a little more learning on their own. > > I'm sure a tip of the week would be a welcome addition to Fedora Weekly > News. It had one before. I guess we havent had many tips coming in these days. I am sure contributors to that section is welcome. Rahul From n.losito at yahoo.it Sun Nov 12 08:14:03 2006 From: n.losito at yahoo.it (Nicola Losito) Date: Sun, 12 Nov 2006 09:14:03 +0100 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Re: Community - Was - Ubuntu Release Party... In-Reply-To: <4556AB3B.8060500@fedoraproject.org> References: <001c01c6fbe9$c5c9db50$240110ac@ALJOMAIHBEV.COM> <4545C253.8070200@adelphia.net> <4545D8AC.2070806@adelphia.net> <883cfe6d0611101343k2d7a17b9v12b210d61806b36a@mail.gmail.com> <4555D352.1020603@fedoraproject.org> <4555978C.6030803@fedoraproject.org> <4556AB3B.8060500@fedoraproject.org> Message-ID: <4A143689-1560-4E27-B18C-C7B3850F14B2@yahoo.it> Il giorno 12/nov/06, alle ore 06:03, Rahul Sundaram ha scritto: > I guess we havent had many tips coming in these days. I am sure > contributors to that section is welcome. I beg your and other's pardon. Won't be then more helpful to have "tips" coming if a specific section of the wiki undergoes a simplified access procedure ? -- Nicola .:kOoLiNuS:. Losito http://koolinus.wordpress.com ITA => http://www.koolinus.net -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From sundaram at fedoraproject.org Sun Nov 12 08:18:01 2006 From: sundaram at fedoraproject.org (Rahul Sundaram) Date: Sun, 12 Nov 2006 13:48:01 +0530 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Re: Community - Was - Ubuntu Release Party... In-Reply-To: <4A143689-1560-4E27-B18C-C7B3850F14B2@yahoo.it> References: <001c01c6fbe9$c5c9db50$240110ac@ALJOMAIHBEV.COM> <4545C253.8070200@adelphia.net> <4545D8AC.2070806@adelphia.net> <883cfe6d0611101343k2d7a17b9v12b210d61806b36a@mail.gmail.com> <4555D352.1020603@fedoraproject.org> <4555978C.6030803@fedoraproject.org> <4556AB3B.8060500@fedoraproject.org> <4A143689-1560-4E27-B18C-C7B3850F14B2@yahoo.it> Message-ID: <4556D8B9.8090809@fedoraproject.org> Nicola Losito wrote: > Il giorno 12/nov/06, alle ore 06:03, Rahul Sundaram ha scritto: > >> I guess we havent had many tips coming in these days. I am sure >> contributors to that section is welcome. > > I beg your and other's pardon. > Won't be then more helpful to have "tips" coming if a specific section > of the wiki undergoes a simplified access procedure ? > Not sure what this means. Are you talking about the Fedora Weekly News wiki or the Fedora Project wiki? A weekly tips section of weekly news doesnt require wiki access and you can just email the editor. How do you want to simplify access to that? Rahul From n.losito at yahoo.it Sun Nov 12 08:38:57 2006 From: n.losito at yahoo.it (Nicola Losito) Date: Sun, 12 Nov 2006 09:38:57 +0100 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Re: Community - Was - Ubuntu Release Party... In-Reply-To: <4556D8B9.8090809@fedoraproject.org> References: <001c01c6fbe9$c5c9db50$240110ac@ALJOMAIHBEV.COM> <4545C253.8070200@adelphia.net> <4545D8AC.2070806@adelphia.net> <883cfe6d0611101343k2d7a17b9v12b210d61806b36a@mail.gmail.com> <4555D352.1020603@fedoraproject.org> <4555978C.6030803@fedoraproject.org> <4556AB3B.8060500@fedoraproject.org> <4A143689-1560-4E27-B18C-C7B3850F14B2@yahoo.it> <4556D8B9.8090809@fedoraproject.org> Message-ID: Il giorno 12/nov/06, alle ore 09:18, Rahul Sundaram ha scritto: > Not sure what this means. Are you talking about the Fedora Weekly > News wiki or the Fedora Project wiki? A weekly tips section of > weekly news doesnt require wiki access and you can just email the > editor. How do you want to simplify access to that? As I've said in a previous mail i was thinking about our projects Wiki which - for me - must be the primary resource for anything Fedora, even if at first stages it will work as a bookmark to other's resources. -- Nicola .:kOoLiNuS:. Losito http://koolinus.wordpress.com ITA => http://www.koolinus.net -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From samfw at redhat.com Sun Nov 12 12:24:19 2006 From: samfw at redhat.com (Sam Folk-Williams) Date: Sun, 12 Nov 2006 07:24:19 -0500 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Re: Community - Was - Ubuntu Release Party... In-Reply-To: References: <001c01c6fbe9$c5c9db50$240110ac@ALJOMAIHBEV.COM> <4545C253.8070200@adelphia.net> <4545D8AC.2070806@adelphia.net> <883cfe6d0611101343k2d7a17b9v12b210d61806b36a@mail.gmail.com> <4555D352.1020603@fedoraproject.org> <4555978C.6030803@fedoraproject.org> <4556AB3B.8060500@fedoraproject.org> <4A143689-1560-4E27-B18C-C7B3850F14B2@yahoo.it> <4556D8B9.8090809@fedoraproject.org> Message-ID: <1163334259.3906.13.camel@localhost.localdomain> On Sun, 2006-11-12 at 09:38 +0100, Nicola Losito wrote: > Il giorno 12/nov/06, alle ore 09:18, Rahul Sundaram ha scritto: > > > Not sure what this means. Are you talking about the Fedora Weekly > > News wiki or the Fedora Project wiki? A weekly tips section of > > weekly news doesnt require wiki access and you can just email the > > editor. How do you want to simplify access to that? > > > > > As I've said in a previous mail i was thinking about our projects Wiki > which - for me - must be the primary resource for anything Fedora, > even if at first stages it will work as a bookmark to other's > resources. > This would be a good time for a plug to the knowledge base idea. This was recently raised on the docs list and I am a strong advocate. A kbase could allow for easier submission of targeted tips and how-tos. Then we could pull from here into "tip of the day" That's how Red Hat magazine gets it's tips section - from the kbase.redhat.com site... Rahul - I know you discussed this in the past in regards to Klear in particular. Can we revive this? Sam > > -- > Nicola .:kOoLiNuS:. Losito > http://koolinus.wordpress.com > > > ITA => http://www.koolinus.net > > > > > > -- > Fedora-marketing-list mailing list > Fedora-marketing-list at redhat.com > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-marketing-list -- Sam Folk-Williams, RHCE Global Support Services -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part URL: From sundaram at fedoraproject.org Sun Nov 12 12:33:49 2006 From: sundaram at fedoraproject.org (Rahul Sundaram) Date: Sun, 12 Nov 2006 18:03:49 +0530 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Re: Community - Was - Ubuntu Release Party... In-Reply-To: <1163334259.3906.13.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <001c01c6fbe9$c5c9db50$240110ac@ALJOMAIHBEV.COM> <4545C253.8070200@adelphia.net> <4545D8AC.2070806@adelphia.net> <883cfe6d0611101343k2d7a17b9v12b210d61806b36a@mail.gmail.com> <4555D352.1020603@fedoraproject.org> <4555978C.6030803@fedoraproject.org> <4556AB3B.8060500@fedoraproject.org> <4A143689-1560-4E27-B18C-C7B3850F14B2@yahoo.it> <4556D8B9.8090809@fedoraproject.org> <1163334259.3906.13.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <455714AD.3000305@fedoraproject.org> Sam Folk-Williams wrote: > On Sun, 2006-11-12 at 09:38 +0100, Nicola Losito wrote: >> As I've said in a previous mail i was thinking about our projects Wiki >> which - for me - must be the primary resource for anything Fedora, >> even if at first stages it will work as a bookmark to other's >> resources. It would require changes to the infrastructure and integrate the account systems into the wiki. Thats a lot of work and is being tracked at http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Infrastructure/AccountSystem2. If you are interested, talk to the infrastructure team about that. > This would be a good time for a plug to the knowledge base idea. This > was recently raised on the docs list and I am a strong advocate. A kbase > could allow for easier submission of targeted tips and how-tos. Then we > could pull from here into "tip of the day" > > That's how Red Hat magazine gets it's tips section - from the > kbase.redhat.com site... > > Rahul - I know you discussed this in the past in regards to Klear in > particular. Can we revive this? PHP is a no go in fedoraproject.org. If you want to stick with clear, we can perhaps talk about getting it installed in fedoranews.org instead. If you want to stick with fedoraproject.org, we need to find a good Free software solution to it, preferably python based. Maybe Plone has a add on. Rahul From samfw at redhat.com Sun Nov 12 12:40:43 2006 From: samfw at redhat.com (Sam Folk-Williams) Date: Sun, 12 Nov 2006 07:40:43 -0500 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Community - Was - Ubuntu Release Party... In-Reply-To: <4555978C.6030803@fedoraproject.org> References: <001c01c6fbe9$c5c9db50$240110ac@ALJOMAIHBEV.COM> <4545C253.8070200@adelphia.net> <4545D8AC.2070806@adelphia.net> <883cfe6d0611101343k2d7a17b9v12b210d61806b36a@mail.gmail.com> <4555D352.1020603@fedoraproject.org> <4555978C.6030803@fedoraproject.org> Message-ID: <1163335243.3906.29.camel@localhost.localdomain> Karlie - I think you have some excellent points. Comments in-line... On Sat, 2006-11-11 at 09:27 +0000, Karlie Robinson wrote: > Rahul Sundaram wrote: > > Michel Salim wrote: > >> This probably should be better documented. I don'[t think many users > >> realize that they could just boot the first CD, choose their > >> installation options and then download only the other CDs that they > >> need. > > > > > > It's already well documented like say the installation guide. End users > > dont read much. > > > > Rahul > > > > Every time I see a mention of RTFM I just cringe. > > Michael brings up a good point about booting the first disc. Even as an > ambassador he finds the info hard to come by so why would you expect the > average user to home in on it? > I don't think Rahul was trying to say RTFM, but I can see how the comment came across that way. There is no arguing this fact - most people don't know about this and many other great features. It's not their fault. And we can't just say, "It's in the doc if they would only read it". Rahul also points out that he routinely answers questions on the forums and mailing lists and points to the docs, which is exactly what we should/can be doing. But there should be a way to make some things more obvious to the user. A "Tip of the day" is a nice idea and it has been discussed many times in the past. Personally, I'd like to see this integrated into the Gnome environment rather than just on the wiki. > You guys are always focused on Ubuntu because, I can only assume, you've > got user envy. > I don't know if I would call it user envy. I think Ubuntu is a great example of an outstanding Linux community. Many of us Fedora users have interacted with Ubuntu people. I think references to the Ubuntu community are only natural given that it's an important part of the linux world at large. In the fedora project we tried hard to never say bad things about any other distro or their community. I hope we can all maintain that civility. By the way, there are *a lot* of Fedora users out there too :) > But with "end users don't read much" it's no wonder there aren't as many > Fedora users. > I don't think Rahul meant this to be directed at a user nor was it in response to a user query. Other comments above. > And if you want to take an example from a distro that's gowing at a pace > that will pass Fedora on by, you should be looking at the reason why > PClinuxOS is now in the top 10 at DistroWatch.com. (a few months ago it > was 10, now it's 6. What does that tell you?) > Again - it's not a competition. I take your point, though. > Is because of their community. > > New users are greeted with open arms. Questions that have been answered > hundreds of times continue to be answered as if it was the first time. > > If you need an example, check out > http://www.pclinuxos.com/forum/index.php?topic=10099.0 > > New user question. The specific answer. Followed by where to find more > information. Then success for the user. > I do think we can make it easier for new users to get involved with Fedora. I have read the ubuntu lists - more so at the beginning of Ubuntu. And I was very impressed with the openness and welcoming attitudes of those who replied. I definitely think we can learn something from these examples. No one thing is going to "fix" this. But I do think that a lot of people have the impression that it's easier to get involved with other linux communities than it is to get involved with our community. That said, I think we have an excellent community once you get to know it. > My best advice for Michael and Rahul... Tip of the week! Not only would > you be helping novice users, but you'd get people into the documentation > to do a little more learning on their own. > I love this idea - more comments in a separate email. > I'm sure a tip of the week would be a welcome addition to Fedora Weekly > News. > -- Sam Folk-Williams, RHCE Global Support Services -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part URL: From karlie.robinson at fedoraproject.org Sun Nov 12 08:13:15 2006 From: karlie.robinson at fedoraproject.org (Karlie Robinson) Date: Sun, 12 Nov 2006 08:13:15 +0000 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Community - Was - Ubuntu Release Party... In-Reply-To: <4556AB3B.8060500@fedoraproject.org> References: <001c01c6fbe9$c5c9db50$240110ac@ALJOMAIHBEV.COM> <4545C253.8070200@adelphia.net> <4545D8AC.2070806@adelphia.net> <883cfe6d0611101343k2d7a17b9v12b210d61806b36a@mail.gmail.com> <4555D352.1020603@fedoraproject.org> <4555978C.6030803@fedoraproject.org> <4556AB3B.8060500@fedoraproject.org> Message-ID: <4556D79B.7040903@fedoraproject.org> I'm going to bulk together my answers ~K Rahul Sundaram wrote: > Thats very different from "RTFM". End users don't read much = RTFM It's an attitude that's not helpful to users who may have troubles regardless of how much they've read. Marc Wiriadisastra wrote: > One of the things I've noticed as a comparison is not so much the > explaining of 'noob' questions or anything like that. Its the fact that > we have to build/improve the community. [snip] > I'm also not sure how to recreate something like that. The > support, the help, the innovation that gets created. The contribution > that goes back. Building a community is about an attitude. It's not about being the Fedora Help desk, it's more about being the fedora Welcome wagon and showing hospitality. Imagine if there was a 4th icon on the desktop by default. Call it Help, or Getting Started that opened up a directory with options for IRC help, Manual pages, Forum Help etc. Thinking that just because some users figured it out by themselves doesn't mean that everyone can do it. Sam Folk-Williams wrote: > I do think that a lot of people have the impression that it's easier to > get involved with other linux communities than it is to get involved > with our community. That said, I think we have an excellent community > once you get to know it. I'm a Fedora Ambassador and consider myself a reasonably intelligent woman. But doing the CLA kicked my butt. It came down to the fact that my webmail was funky, but over and over and over the best advie I could get was along the lines of "gee I don't know, have you read [link to the wiki]?" To this day, *I DO NOT USE FEDORA* on my Linux box simply because I do not want to deal with the community should I have questions. I work hard getting Free Media Discs out, but when it comes to most of what goes on with the marketing and ambassador lists/IRC chats and meetings, I'm turned off. From my point of view, if this is what happens with the ambassadors who are the public face of Fedora, I can only imagine how I'd be recieved as a regular ole user with a question. ~Karlie From sundaram at fedoraproject.org Sun Nov 12 13:31:32 2006 From: sundaram at fedoraproject.org (Rahul Sundaram) Date: Sun, 12 Nov 2006 19:01:32 +0530 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Community - Was - Ubuntu Release Party... In-Reply-To: <4556D79B.7040903@fedoraproject.org> References: <001c01c6fbe9$c5c9db50$240110ac@ALJOMAIHBEV.COM> <4545C253.8070200@adelphia.net> <4545D8AC.2070806@adelphia.net> <883cfe6d0611101343k2d7a17b9v12b210d61806b36a@mail.gmail.com> <4555D352.1020603@fedoraproject.org> <4555978C.6030803@fedoraproject.org> <4556AB3B.8060500@fedoraproject.org> <4556D79B.7040903@fedoraproject.org> Message-ID: <45572234.5040006@fedoraproject.org> Karlie Robinson wrote: > > End users don't read much = RTFM Sorry. Its not. It wasnt what I meant anyway. > > It's an attitude that's not helpful to users who may have troubles > regardless of how much they've read. For a analogy, lets say someone says that feature X should exist. Would pointing to him or her that such a feature already exists be RTFM? I dont think so. Do you find it hard to believe that users dont actually read much documentation? Perhaps a few good looks at usability studies or talking to people who work on documentation would convince you of that. > Imagine if there was a 4th icon on the desktop by default. Call it > > Help, or Getting Started that opened up a directory with options for > IRC help, Manual pages, Forum Help etc Do you believe that this is going to be more discoverable than the menu entry for help which provides exactly that? > To this day, *I DO NOT USE FEDORA* on my Linux box simply because I do > not want to deal with the community should I have questions. Seems to be based on a incorrect assumption. Fedora questions on fedora-list and fedoraforums are usually answered pretty well. This list is for contributors. Rahul From sdl.web at gmail.com Sun Nov 12 18:21:06 2006 From: sdl.web at gmail.com (Leo) Date: Sun, 12 Nov 2006 18:21:06 +0000 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Why Fedora isn't in this list? Message-ID: Hi there, It seems Fedora is one of "Free GNU/Linux distributions" http://www.gnu.org/links/links.html -- Leo From gmureddu at prodigy.net.mx Sun Nov 12 20:35:09 2006 From: gmureddu at prodigy.net.mx (Gian Paolo Mureddu) Date: Sun, 12 Nov 2006 14:35:09 -0600 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Legally correct term. Message-ID: <4557857D.1030703@prodigy.net.mx> As some friends and me are preparing a series of Fedora events to take place in the coming months, we were wondering what is the correct term for "Fedora Linux" legally speaking. We will be making some stickers which amongst other things will feature the legend "Fedora Linux", and since Linux when used in certain contexts can be referred to as Linux?, also I remember that Red Hat refers to Fedora as Fedora?, so when put together both terms, what is the correct way to put them: Fedora? Linux? Fedora Linux? Fedora? Linux? ? I do believe that the same applies to the Logo, where the Infinity Logo is accompanied by the ? symbol, but I'm not sure. Thanks in advance for your inputs and clarifications. From stickster at gmail.com Sun Nov 12 22:41:31 2006 From: stickster at gmail.com (Paul W. Frields) Date: Sun, 12 Nov 2006 17:41:31 -0500 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Re: Community - Was - Ubuntu Release Party... In-Reply-To: <1163334259.3906.13.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <001c01c6fbe9$c5c9db50$240110ac@ALJOMAIHBEV.COM> <4545C253.8070200@adelphia.net> <4545D8AC.2070806@adelphia.net> <883cfe6d0611101343k2d7a17b9v12b210d61806b36a@mail.gmail.com> <4555D352.1020603@fedoraproject.org> <4555978C.6030803@fedoraproject.org> <4556AB3B.8060500@fedoraproject.org> <4A143689-1560-4E27-B18C-C7B3850F14B2@yahoo.it> <4556D8B9.8090809@fedoraproject.org> <1163334259.3906.13.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <1163371291.1553.45.camel@localhost.localdomain> On Sun, 2006-11-12 at 07:24 -0500, Sam Folk-Williams wrote: > On Sun, 2006-11-12 at 09:38 +0100, Nicola Losito wrote: > > Il giorno 12/nov/06, alle ore 09:18, Rahul Sundaram ha scritto: > > > > > Not sure what this means. Are you talking about the Fedora Weekly > > > News wiki or the Fedora Project wiki? A weekly tips section of > > > weekly news doesnt require wiki access and you can just email the > > > editor. How do you want to simplify access to that? > > > > > > > > > > As I've said in a previous mail i was thinking about our projects Wiki > > which - for me - must be the primary resource for anything Fedora, > > even if at first stages it will work as a bookmark to other's > > resources. > > > > This would be a good time for a plug to the knowledge base idea. This > was recently raised on the docs list and I am a strong advocate. A kbase > could allow for easier submission of targeted tips and how-tos. Then we > could pull from here into "tip of the day" > > That's how Red Hat magazine gets it's tips section - from the > kbase.redhat.com site... > > Rahul - I know you discussed this in the past in regards to Klear in > particular. Can we revive this? I put up a workable tip-a-day mechanism over 6 months ago. You can see a mockup at http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/PaulWFrields/TipTest where I directed people to test and comment on it. It can be done entirely with a simple wiki function, and just needs to be integrated into the front page. That's not a kbase substitute, but we don't need a whole kbase to get this started. IIRC, I held off at Patrick's request in favor of some front page revamping. That revamping never really happened, and this got back-burnered. I'm happy to put it on the front page if people would just look at the darn test and comment. Even if you say it's not good enough for a band-aid fix, no problem. -- Paul W. Frields, RHCE http://paul.frields.org/ gpg fingerprint: 3DA6 A0AC 6D58 FEC4 0233 5906 ACDB C937 BD11 3717 Fedora Project Board: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Board Fedora Docs Project: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/DocsProject -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part URL: From samfw at redhat.com Sun Nov 12 23:50:31 2006 From: samfw at redhat.com (Sam Folk-Williams) Date: Sun, 12 Nov 2006 18:50:31 -0500 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Re: Community - Was - Ubuntu Release Party... In-Reply-To: <1163371291.1553.45.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <001c01c6fbe9$c5c9db50$240110ac@ALJOMAIHBEV.COM> <4545C253.8070200@adelphia.net> <4545D8AC.2070806@adelphia.net> <883cfe6d0611101343k2d7a17b9v12b210d61806b36a@mail.gmail.com> <4555D352.1020603@fedoraproject.org> <4555978C.6030803@fedoraproject.org> <4556AB3B.8060500@fedoraproject.org> <4A143689-1560-4E27-B18C-C7B3850F14B2@yahoo.it> <4556D8B9.8090809@fedoraproject.org> <1163334259.3906.13.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1163371291.1553.45.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <1163375431.29212.25.camel@localhost.localdomain> On Sun, 2006-11-12 at 17:41 -0500, Paul W. Frields wrote: > On Sun, 2006-11-12 at 07:24 -0500, Sam Folk-Williams wrote: > > On Sun, 2006-11-12 at 09:38 +0100, Nicola Losito wrote: > > > Il giorno 12/nov/06, alle ore 09:18, Rahul Sundaram ha scritto: > > > > > > > Not sure what this means. Are you talking about the Fedora Weekly > > > > News wiki or the Fedora Project wiki? A weekly tips section of > > > > weekly news doesnt require wiki access and you can just email the > > > > editor. How do you want to simplify access to that? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > As I've said in a previous mail i was thinking about our projects Wiki > > > which - for me - must be the primary resource for anything Fedora, > > > even if at first stages it will work as a bookmark to other's > > > resources. > > > > > > > This would be a good time for a plug to the knowledge base idea. This > > was recently raised on the docs list and I am a strong advocate. A kbase > > could allow for easier submission of targeted tips and how-tos. Then we > > could pull from here into "tip of the day" > > > > That's how Red Hat magazine gets it's tips section - from the > > kbase.redhat.com site... > > > > Rahul - I know you discussed this in the past in regards to Klear in > > particular. Can we revive this? > > I put up a workable tip-a-day mechanism over 6 months ago. You can see > a mockup at http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/PaulWFrields/TipTest where I > directed people to test and comment on it. It can be done entirely with > a simple wiki function, and just needs to be integrated into the front > page. That's not a kbase substitute, but we don't need a whole kbase to > get this started. > > IIRC, I held off at Patrick's request in favor of some front page > revamping. That revamping never really happened, and this got > back-burnered. I'm happy to put it on the front page if people would > just look at the darn test and comment. Even if you say it's not good > enough for a band-aid fix, no problem. > I looked at it a ways back and I think it's great. Actually I put it in another mock-up with a little different css usage: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/SamFolkWilliams/draftMainSandbox I think we should just do this. Sam > -- > Fedora-marketing-list mailing list > Fedora-marketing-list at redhat.com > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-marketing-list -- Sam Folk-Williams, RHCE Global Support Services -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part URL: From marc at mwiriadi.id.au Mon Nov 13 01:09:14 2006 From: marc at mwiriadi.id.au (Marc Wiriadisastra) Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2006 09:09:14 +0800 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Re: Community - Was - Ubuntu Release Party... In-Reply-To: <1163375431.29212.25.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <001c01c6fbe9$c5c9db50$240110ac@ALJOMAIHBEV.COM> <4545C253.8070200@adelphia.net> <4545D8AC.2070806@adelphia.net> <883cfe6d0611101343k2d7a17b9v12b210d61806b36a@mail.gmail.com> <4555D352.1020603@fedoraproject.org> <4555978C.6030803@fedoraproject.org> <4556AB3B.8060500@fedoraproject.org> <4A143689-1560-4E27-B18C-C7B3850F14B2@yahoo.it> <4556D8B9.8090809@fedoraproject.org> <1163334259.3906.13.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1163371291.1553.45.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1163375431.29212.25.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <1163380154.21486.0.camel@strikeforce.mwiriadi.id.au> On Sun, 2006-11-12 at 18:50 -0500, Sam Folk-Williams wrote: > On Sun, 2006-11-12 at 17:41 -0500, Paul W. Frields wrote: > > On Sun, 2006-11-12 at 07:24 -0500, Sam Folk-Williams wrote: > > > On Sun, 2006-11-12 at 09:38 +0100, Nicola Losito wrote: > > > > Il giorno 12/nov/06, alle ore 09:18, Rahul Sundaram ha scritto: > > > > > > > > > Not sure what this means. Are you talking about the Fedora Weekly > > > > > News wiki or the Fedora Project wiki? A weekly tips section of > > > > > weekly news doesnt require wiki access and you can just email the > > > > > editor. How do you want to simplify access to that? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > As I've said in a previous mail i was thinking about our projects Wiki > > > > which - for me - must be the primary resource for anything Fedora, > > > > even if at first stages it will work as a bookmark to other's > > > > resources. > > > > > > > > > > This would be a good time for a plug to the knowledge base idea. This > > > was recently raised on the docs list and I am a strong advocate. A kbase > > > could allow for easier submission of targeted tips and how-tos. Then we > > > could pull from here into "tip of the day" > > > > > > That's how Red Hat magazine gets it's tips section - from the > > > kbase.redhat.com site... > > > > > > Rahul - I know you discussed this in the past in regards to Klear in > > > particular. Can we revive this? > > > > I put up a workable tip-a-day mechanism over 6 months ago. You can see > > a mockup at http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/PaulWFrields/TipTest where I > > directed people to test and comment on it. It can be done entirely with > > a simple wiki function, and just needs to be integrated into the front > > page. That's not a kbase substitute, but we don't need a whole kbase to > > get this started. > > > > IIRC, I held off at Patrick's request in favor of some front page > > revamping. That revamping never really happened, and this got > > back-burnered. I'm happy to put it on the front page if people would > > just look at the darn test and comment. Even if you say it's not good > > enough for a band-aid fix, no problem. > > > I looked at it a ways back and I think it's great. Actually I put it in > another mock-up with a little different css usage: > > http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/SamFolkWilliams/draftMainSandbox > > I think we should just do this. > That looks quite good :) From marc at mwiriadi.id.au Mon Nov 13 01:11:57 2006 From: marc at mwiriadi.id.au (Marc Wiriadisastra) Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2006 09:11:57 +0800 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Re: Community - Was - Ubuntu Release Party... In-Reply-To: <1163375431.29212.25.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <001c01c6fbe9$c5c9db50$240110ac@ALJOMAIHBEV.COM> <4545C253.8070200@adelphia.net> <4545D8AC.2070806@adelphia.net> <883cfe6d0611101343k2d7a17b9v12b210d61806b36a@mail.gmail.com> <4555D352.1020603@fedoraproject.org> <4555978C.6030803@fedoraproject.org> <4556AB3B.8060500@fedoraproject.org> <4A143689-1560-4E27-B18C-C7B3850F14B2@yahoo.it> <4556D8B9.8090809@fedoraproject.org> <1163334259.3906.13.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1163371291.1553.45.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1163375431.29212.25.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <1163380317.21486.4.camel@strikeforce.mwiriadi.id.au> On Sun, 2006-11-12 at 18:50 -0500, Sam Folk-Williams wrote: > On Sun, 2006-11-12 at 17:41 -0500, Paul W. Frields wrote: > > On Sun, 2006-11-12 at 07:24 -0500, Sam Folk-Williams wrote: > > > On Sun, 2006-11-12 at 09:38 +0100, Nicola Losito wrote: > > > > Il giorno 12/nov/06, alle ore 09:18, Rahul Sundaram ha scritto: > > > > > > > > > Not sure what this means. Are you talking about the Fedora Weekly > > > > > News wiki or the Fedora Project wiki? A weekly tips section of > > > > > weekly news doesnt require wiki access and you can just email the > > > > > editor. How do you want to simplify access to that? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > As I've said in a previous mail i was thinking about our projects Wiki > > > > which - for me - must be the primary resource for anything Fedora, > > > > even if at first stages it will work as a bookmark to other's > > > > resources. > > > > > > > > > > This would be a good time for a plug to the knowledge base idea. This > > > was recently raised on the docs list and I am a strong advocate. A kbase > > > could allow for easier submission of targeted tips and how-tos. Then we > > > could pull from here into "tip of the day" > > > > > > That's how Red Hat magazine gets it's tips section - from the > > > kbase.redhat.com site... > > > > > > Rahul - I know you discussed this in the past in regards to Klear in > > > particular. Can we revive this? > > > > I put up a workable tip-a-day mechanism over 6 months ago. You can see > > a mockup at http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/PaulWFrields/TipTest where I > > directed people to test and comment on it. It can be done entirely with > > a simple wiki function, and just needs to be integrated into the front > > page. That's not a kbase substitute, but we don't need a whole kbase to > > get this started. > > > > IIRC, I held off at Patrick's request in favor of some front page > > revamping. That revamping never really happened, and this got > > back-burnered. I'm happy to put it on the front page if people would > > just look at the darn test and comment. Even if you say it's not good > > enough for a band-aid fix, no problem. > > > I looked at it a ways back and I think it's great. Actually I put it in > another mock-up with a little different css usage: > > http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/SamFolkWilliams/draftMainSandbox > > I think we should just do this. Sorry for the double post. I have to say after looking at both Paul's version have the text in the right place I say this because that was the first place I looked to the screenshot. Colours (Colors) attract people to look there so placing the next there is a great idea. Only one complaint Paul and it might be my screen resolution but the text overlapped the bottom line so there was writing over the bottom line under the screenshot. I like it though :) Regards, Marc From sundaram at fedoraproject.org Mon Nov 13 10:14:51 2006 From: sundaram at fedoraproject.org (Rahul Sundaram) Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2006 15:44:51 +0530 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Why Fedora isn't in this list? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4558459B.5030001@fedoraproject.org> Leo wrote: > Hi there, > > It seems Fedora is one of "Free GNU/Linux distributions" > > http://www.gnu.org/links/links.html > See http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/FreeSoftwareAnalysis for the current status regarding this. Rahul From sdl.web at gmail.com Mon Nov 13 12:33:00 2006 From: sdl.web at gmail.com (Leo) Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2006 12:33:00 +0000 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Re: Why Fedora isn't in this list? References: <4558459B.5030001@fedoraproject.org> Message-ID: On Mon, 13/11/06, Rahul Sundaram wrote: > Leo wrote: >> Hi there, >> >> It seems Fedora is one of "Free GNU/Linux distributions" >> >> http://www.gnu.org/links/links.html >> > > See http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/FreeSoftwareAnalysis for the current > status regarding this. > > Rahul Thanks. That's good to know. -- Leo From sundaram at fedoraproject.org Mon Nov 13 12:44:17 2006 From: sundaram at fedoraproject.org (Rahul Sundaram) Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2006 18:14:17 +0530 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Legally correct term. In-Reply-To: <4557857D.1030703@prodigy.net.mx> References: <4557857D.1030703@prodigy.net.mx> Message-ID: <455868A1.8010402@fedoraproject.org> Gian Paolo Mureddu wrote: > As some friends and me are preparing a series of Fedora events to take > place in the coming months, we were wondering what is the correct term > for "Fedora Linux" legally speaking. We will be making some stickers > which amongst other things will feature the legend "Fedora Linux", and > since Linux when used in certain contexts can be referred to as Linux?, > also I remember that Red Hat refers to Fedora as Fedora?, so when put > together both terms, what is the correct way to put them: > > Fedora? Linux? > Fedora Linux? > Fedora? Linux? > > ? > > I do believe that the same applies to the Logo, where the Infinity Logo > is accompanied by the ? symbol, but I'm not sure. > > Thanks in advance for your inputs and clarifications. We dont call the distribution "Fedora Linux". We currently call it "Fedora Core". There is currently a discussion about merging core and extras (http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/FedoraSummit) and the new name post merger hasnt been decided yet but "Fedora" and "Fedora Linux" are potential candidates. Currently you can call it Fedora Core? but I would avoid the "TM" in normal references. The logo doesnt have any registered trademarks associated with it and the names are more casual. Rahul From rhegarty at zbi.com Mon Nov 13 17:11:28 2006 From: rhegarty at zbi.com (Ray Hegarty) Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2006 12:11:28 -0500 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Ray Hegarty is out of the office. Message-ID: I will be out of the office starting 11/13/2006 and will not return until 11/20/2006. I will checking my BlackBerry intermittantly. I will respond to your message when I return. From michel.salim at gmail.com Mon Nov 13 18:05:08 2006 From: michel.salim at gmail.com (Michel Salim) Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2006 13:05:08 -0500 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Why Fedora isn't in this list? In-Reply-To: <4558459B.5030001@fedoraproject.org> References: <4558459B.5030001@fedoraproject.org> Message-ID: <883cfe6d0611131005s6885be33l476b8bee146cfd69@mail.gmail.com> On 11/13/06, Rahul Sundaram wrote: > Leo wrote: > > Hi there, > > > > It seems Fedora is one of "Free GNU/Linux distributions" > > > > http://www.gnu.org/links/links.html > > > > See http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/FreeSoftwareAnalysis for the current > status regarding this. > Regarding Stallman's letter, would he be satisfied if we subtitle "Fedora Core" with "Featuring GNU software", "GNU inside" or some other text to such effect? Without changing the name of the project itself, which would be awkward. -- Michel Salim Don't worry about avoiding temptation -- as you grow older, it starts avoiding you. -- The Old Farmer's Almanac From michel.salim at gmail.com Mon Nov 13 18:05:08 2006 From: michel.salim at gmail.com (Michel Salim) Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2006 13:05:08 -0500 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Why Fedora isn't in this list? In-Reply-To: <4558459B.5030001@fedoraproject.org> References: <4558459B.5030001@fedoraproject.org> Message-ID: <883cfe6d0611131005s6885be33l476b8bee146cfd69@mail.gmail.com> On 11/13/06, Rahul Sundaram wrote: > Leo wrote: > > Hi there, > > > > It seems Fedora is one of "Free GNU/Linux distributions" > > > > http://www.gnu.org/links/links.html > > > > See http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/FreeSoftwareAnalysis for the current > status regarding this. > Regarding Stallman's letter, would he be satisfied if we subtitle "Fedora Core" with "Featuring GNU software", "GNU inside" or some other text to such effect? Without changing the name of the project itself, which would be awkward. -- Michel Salim Don't worry about avoiding temptation -- as you grow older, it starts avoiding you. -- The Old Farmer's Almanac From caillon at redhat.com Mon Nov 13 19:10:43 2006 From: caillon at redhat.com (Christopher Aillon) Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2006 14:10:43 -0500 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Legally correct term. In-Reply-To: <455868A1.8010402@fedoraproject.org> References: <4557857D.1030703@prodigy.net.mx> <455868A1.8010402@fedoraproject.org> Message-ID: <4558C333.2070504@redhat.com> Rahul Sundaram wrote: > Gian Paolo Mureddu wrote: >> As some friends and me are preparing a series of Fedora events to >> take place in the coming months, we were wondering what is the correct >> term for "Fedora Linux" legally speaking. We will be making some >> stickers which amongst other things will feature the legend "Fedora >> Linux", and since Linux when used in certain contexts can be referred >> to as Linux?, also I remember that Red Hat refers to Fedora as >> Fedora?, so when put together both terms, what is the correct way to >> put them: >> >> Fedora? Linux? >> Fedora Linux? >> Fedora? Linux? >> >> ? >> >> I do believe that the same applies to the Logo, where the Infinity >> Logo is accompanied by the ? symbol, but I'm not sure. >> >> Thanks in advance for your inputs and clarifications. > > We dont call the distribution "Fedora Linux". We currently call it > "Fedora Core". There is currently a discussion about merging core and > extras (http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/FedoraSummit) and the new name > post merger hasnt been decided yet but "Fedora" and "Fedora Linux" are > potential candidates. > > Currently you can call it Fedora Core? but I would avoid the "TM" in > normal references. The logo doesnt have any registered trademarks > associated with it and the names are more casual. Just because the logo or names aren't registered does not mean they can't have the trademark symbol. (R) is registered trademark. TM is (unregistered) trademark. And we certainly do have a trademark on Fedora, Fedora Core, etc. and enforce our trademarks. Our marks should not be treated casually. They are among the most important things we own. From linux at elfshadow.net Mon Nov 13 19:21:09 2006 From: linux at elfshadow.net (Jeffrey Tadlock) Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2006 14:21:09 -0500 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Legally correct term. In-Reply-To: <4558C333.2070504@redhat.com> References: <4557857D.1030703@prodigy.net.mx> <455868A1.8010402@fedoraproject.org> <4558C333.2070504@redhat.com> Message-ID: <4558C5A5.8070203@elfshadow.net> Christopher Aillon wrote: >> Rahul Sundaram wrote: >> Currently you can call it Fedora Core? but I would avoid the "TM" in >> normal references. The logo doesnt have any registered trademarks >> associated with it and the names are more casual. > > Just because the logo or names aren't registered does not mean they > can't have the trademark symbol. (R) is registered trademark. TM is > (unregistered) trademark. And we certainly do have a trademark on > Fedora, Fedora Core, etc. and enforce our trademarks. Our marks should > not be treated casually. They are among the most important things we own. And all the logos on the Logo Usage Guideline page: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Logo/UsageGuidelines reflect the use of TM. --Jeffrey From sundaram at fedoraproject.org Mon Nov 13 20:01:33 2006 From: sundaram at fedoraproject.org (Rahul Sundaram) Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2006 01:31:33 +0530 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Why Fedora isn't in this list? In-Reply-To: <883cfe6d0611131005s6885be33l476b8bee146cfd69@mail.gmail.com> References: <4558459B.5030001@fedoraproject.org> <883cfe6d0611131005s6885be33l476b8bee146cfd69@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <4558CF1D.3030009@fedoraproject.org> Michel Salim wrote: > On 11/13/06, Rahul Sundaram wrote: >> Leo wrote: >> > Hi there, >> > >> > It seems Fedora is one of "Free GNU/Linux distributions" >> > >> > http://www.gnu.org/links/links.html >> > >> >> See http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/FreeSoftwareAnalysis for the current >> status regarding this. >> > Regarding Stallman's letter, would he be satisfied if we subtitle > "Fedora Core" with "Featuring GNU software", "GNU inside" or some > other text to such effect? Without changing the name of the project > itself, which would be awkward. Dont know. Will have to ask him when I get back to him later. We need to do continue our own licensing audits and discuss changes before that. Rahul From sundaram at fedoraproject.org Mon Nov 13 20:16:18 2006 From: sundaram at fedoraproject.org (Rahul Sundaram) Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2006 01:46:18 +0530 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Legally correct term. In-Reply-To: <4558C333.2070504@redhat.com> References: <4557857D.1030703@prodigy.net.mx> <455868A1.8010402@fedoraproject.org> <4558C333.2070504@redhat.com> Message-ID: <4558D292.6010604@fedoraproject.org> Christopher Aillon wrote: > Rahul Sundaram wrote: > >> We dont call the distribution "Fedora Linux". We currently call it >> "Fedora Core". There is currently a discussion about merging core and >> extras (http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/FedoraSummit) and the new name >> post merger hasnt been decided yet but "Fedora" and "Fedora Linux" are >> potential candidates. >> >> Currently you can call it Fedora Core? but I would avoid the "TM" in >> normal references. The logo doesnt have any registered trademarks >> associated with it and the names are more casual. > > > Just because the logo or names aren't registered does not mean they > can't have the trademark symbol. (R) is registered trademark. TM is > (unregistered) trademark. And we certainly do have a trademark on > Fedora, Fedora Core, etc. and enforce our trademarks. Our marks should > not be treated casually. They are among the most important things we own. When I was talking about logo, I was referring to the name "Infinity" as being a casual one. Not the logo itself which already has the guidelines associated with them. Rahul From gmureddu at prodigy.net.mx Mon Nov 13 20:17:19 2006 From: gmureddu at prodigy.net.mx (Gian Paolo Mureddu) Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2006 14:17:19 -0600 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Legally correct term. In-Reply-To: <455868A1.8010402@fedoraproject.org> References: <4557857D.1030703@prodigy.net.mx> <455868A1.8010402@fedoraproject.org> Message-ID: <4558D2CF.5010102@prodigy.net.mx> Rahul Sundaram escribi?: > Gian Paolo Mureddu wrote: >> As some friends and me are preparing a series of Fedora events to >> take place in the coming months, we were wondering what is the >> correct term for "Fedora Linux" legally speaking. We will be making >> some stickers which amongst other things will feature the legend >> "Fedora Linux", and since Linux when used in certain contexts can be >> referred to as Linux?, also I remember that Red Hat refers to Fedora >> as Fedora?, so when put together both terms, what is the correct way >> to put them: >> >> Fedora? Linux? >> Fedora Linux? >> Fedora? Linux? >> >> ? >> >> I do believe that the same applies to the Logo, where the Infinity >> Logo is accompanied by the ? symbol, but I'm not sure. >> >> Thanks in advance for your inputs and clarifications. > > We dont call the distribution "Fedora Linux". We currently call it > "Fedora Core". There is currently a discussion about merging core and > extras (http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/FedoraSummit) and the new name > post merger hasnt been decided yet but "Fedora" and "Fedora Linux" are > potential candidates. > > Currently you can call it Fedora Core? but I would avoid the "TM" in > normal references. The logo doesnt have any registered trademarks > associated with it and the names are more casual. > > Rahul > Thanks for the clarification, Rahul. So it is pefectly OK that the Stickers only mention Fedora? I thought of tossing the "Linux" there as to point out that we're using Linux, strictly for users unfamiliar with Linux in general and Fedora in particular, we are still in the "design" phase, so we can change the stickers quite a bit. Thanks again for your input! From sundaram at fedoraproject.org Mon Nov 13 20:36:22 2006 From: sundaram at fedoraproject.org (Rahul Sundaram) Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2006 02:06:22 +0530 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Legally correct term. In-Reply-To: <4558D2CF.5010102@prodigy.net.mx> References: <4557857D.1030703@prodigy.net.mx> <455868A1.8010402@fedoraproject.org> <4558D2CF.5010102@prodigy.net.mx> Message-ID: <4558D746.9020207@fedoraproject.org> Gian Paolo Mureddu wrote: >> > Thanks for the clarification, Rahul. So it is pefectly OK that the > Stickers only mention Fedora? Yes. It is better to retain the same name for consistency. I thought of tossing the "Linux" there as > to point out that we're using Linux, strictly for users unfamiliar with > Linux in general and Fedora in particular, we are still in the "design" > phase, so we can change the stickers quite a bit. Thanks again for your > input! Maybe adding some wording in there would help. On banners, we used to print the definition to help end users understand what it means. If you need any help with the design, you can post to the fedora-art list. Rahul From sundaram at fedoraproject.org Mon Nov 13 21:07:00 2006 From: sundaram at fedoraproject.org (Rahul Sundaram) Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2006 02:37:00 +0530 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] A networking pro lists five reasons you need Fedora Core 6 Linux Message-ID: <4558DE74.8070501@fedoraproject.org> Hi "Red Hat's latest free Linux distribution has new features so good that Greg Schaffer made the switch." http://www.computerworld.com/action/article.do?command=viewArticleBasic&articleId=9004905&source=NLT_NET&nlid=27 Rahul From caillon at redhat.com Mon Nov 13 21:10:48 2006 From: caillon at redhat.com (Christopher Aillon) Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2006 16:10:48 -0500 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Legally correct term. In-Reply-To: <4558D746.9020207@fedoraproject.org> References: <4557857D.1030703@prodigy.net.mx> <455868A1.8010402@fedoraproject.org> <4558D2CF.5010102@prodigy.net.mx> <4558D746.9020207@fedoraproject.org> Message-ID: <4558DF58.1060509@redhat.com> Rahul Sundaram wrote: > Gian Paolo Mureddu wrote: > >>> >> Thanks for the clarification, Rahul. So it is pefectly OK that the >> Stickers only mention Fedora? > > Yes. It is better to retain the same name for consistency. > > I thought of tossing the "Linux" there as >> to point out that we're using Linux, strictly for users unfamiliar >> with Linux in general and Fedora in particular, we are still in the >> "design" phase, so we can change the stickers quite a bit. Thanks >> again for your input! > > Maybe adding some wording in there would help. On banners, we used to > print the definition to help end users understand what it means. If you > need any help with the design, you can post to the fedora-art list. It might even be wise to submit the final work for approval, just to catch any potential problems. From gmureddu at prodigy.net.mx Mon Nov 13 22:32:11 2006 From: gmureddu at prodigy.net.mx (Gian Paolo Mureddu) Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2006 16:32:11 -0600 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Legally correct term. In-Reply-To: <4558D746.9020207@fedoraproject.org> References: <4557857D.1030703@prodigy.net.mx> <455868A1.8010402@fedoraproject.org> <4558D2CF.5010102@prodigy.net.mx> <4558D746.9020207@fedoraproject.org> Message-ID: <4558F26B.3000008@prodigy.net.mx> Rahul Sundaram escribi?: > Gian Paolo Mureddu wrote: > >>> >> Thanks for the clarification, Rahul. So it is pefectly OK that the >> Stickers only mention Fedora? > > Yes. It is better to retain the same name for consistency. > > I thought of tossing the "Linux" there as >> to point out that we're using Linux, strictly for users unfamiliar >> with Linux in general and Fedora in particular, we are still in the >> "design" phase, so we can change the stickers quite a bit. Thanks >> again for your input! > > Maybe adding some wording in there would help. On banners, we used to > print the definition to help end users understand what it means. If > you need any help with the design, you can post to the fedora-art list. > > Rahul > Thanks again, Rahul. Your input is very appreciated, as always. I have one basic design for "case stickers" as we'll be holding an Install-Fest (as we have grown fond to call the event) focused on Fedora Core 6 and as such we wanted to give the participants not only Fedora related media, but also a computer case sticker as I've seen a couple for Ubuntu systems, and I thought why didn't we have some. When we're set on the final design I'll post pics here. From sundaram at fedoraproject.org Mon Nov 13 22:39:00 2006 From: sundaram at fedoraproject.org (Rahul Sundaram) Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2006 04:09:00 +0530 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Legally correct term. In-Reply-To: <4558F26B.3000008@prodigy.net.mx> References: <4557857D.1030703@prodigy.net.mx> <455868A1.8010402@fedoraproject.org> <4558D2CF.5010102@prodigy.net.mx> <4558D746.9020207@fedoraproject.org> <4558F26B.3000008@prodigy.net.mx> Message-ID: <4558F404.4030701@fedoraproject.org> Gian Paolo Mureddu wrote: >> > Thanks again, Rahul. Your input is very appreciated, as always. Welcome. I have > one basic design for "case stickers" as we'll be holding an Install-Fest > (as we have grown fond to call the event) focused on Fedora Core 6 and > as such we wanted to give the participants not only Fedora related > media, but also a computer case sticker as I've seen a couple for Ubuntu > systems, and I thought why didn't we have some. When we're set on the > final design I'll post pics here. I am not sure how you guys are doing the design but the source format in a liberal license would be quite useful for the Fedora Artwork team to reuse it if we can. I am pretty sure we are going to do a set of branded items for every release based on the theme concept for that release like http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Artwork/CDArt and we might as well as include case stickers in that. Rahul From gmureddu at prodigy.net.mx Tue Nov 14 00:58:21 2006 From: gmureddu at prodigy.net.mx (Gian Paolo Mureddu) Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2006 18:58:21 -0600 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Re: fedora-ve logo? In-Reply-To: <447A88CC.30807@nicubunu.ro> References: <447838D0.9050204@gmail.com> <200605270654.06757.nman64@n-man.com> <447997D7.8040609@gmail.com> <200605281101.59896.nman64@n-man.com> <4479E1C9.8060103@redhat.com> <447A88CC.30807@nicubunu.ro> Message-ID: <455914AD.5070605@prodigy.net.mx> Nicu Buculei escribi?: > > It is "Bryant2 Medium Alternate no. 2" (or bold ?) - see it in the > "Test Typer": > http://www.processtypefoundry.com/testtyper/index.php?loadfont=bryant%20pro > > > And i think this approximation is quite close: > http://fedora.nicubunu.ro/artwork/logo/fedora_font.svg (it was made > from scratch, using Bryant just as a visual reference) > Sorry to resurrect a difunct thread, first of all... When this was first discussed I got that SVG file you linked to, and in recent days I have been working on it, extending the characters and even imported many of the characters into Font Forge, however I want to know a couple of things: Are you the original author of these SVG glyphs? If so, so you have any inconvenience that I do extended work on the glyphs? Now I would openly ask if there would be any inconvenience of having a "fedora" font, which would look like (but not be exactly the same) as the official logotype typeface? Before I do anything with the .sfd I would like to know if it would be OK to do so. From sdl.web at gmail.com Wed Nov 15 17:58:03 2006 From: sdl.web at gmail.com (Leo) Date: Wed, 15 Nov 2006 17:58:03 +0000 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Mirror in Main China Message-ID: Hi there, A few friends in China are trying to find a fast mirror for FC and then I find that there are zero mirrors in mainland China though there are a few in Hong Kong and Taiwan. I'd like to see this situation improved. Can anyone give me some pointers? I will try my best to help out. Regards, -- Leo From gerold at lugd.org Thu Nov 16 13:09:07 2006 From: gerold at lugd.org (Gerold Kassube) Date: Thu, 16 Nov 2006 14:09:07 +0100 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] REMINDER: Invitation to the FAD Message-ID: <1163682547.3349.32.camel@Amilo-GK.homenet.local> REGISTRATION cloese on Nov. 18th ====================== you'll find it as PDF at http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/FAD?action=AttachFile&do=get&target=invite_FAD.pdf First FEDORA AMBASSADORS DAY (FAD EMEA) ======================================= The Fedora Ambassador Day (FAD) is where Ambassadors and other interested members of the Fedora Community come together to plan for future Fedora events and get to know each other. This is your chance to meet other Fedora community members (Ambassadors, Developers) in person. We are proud to invite you to the first FAD in EMEA. The Event will start date ==== December 1st, 2006 (6 pm GMT+1) till December 3rd, 2006 location ======== Werner Mennicke Haus R?hrberg e.V. Im Grossfeld 2 D-79639 Grenzach-Wyhlen - Germany - Agenda ====== Friday ------ afternoon: ?come together? Saturday -------- morning: Keynote from a FAMSCO Member small introduction of the participants afternoon: planning EMEA events for 2007 Breakout-sessions evening: Surprise event with local ?Linux Users? Sunday ------ if desired, visiting University of Basel with introduction in the used Red Hat Cluster Additional information * Accommodation * we have to pay per night and person EUR 5,50 / each. * We have the following rooms: -1- room with bunk bed, cupboard and washbasin -1- room with three bunk beds, cupboard and washbasin -4- rooms with each bunk bed, cupboard and washbasin -1- big room with five bunk beds and cupboards there are different showers and toilets. * You have to take care by your own for bed sheets, sleeping bag and your pillow. * Meals * Organized. Please indicate if you have special dietary requirements (vegetarian, allergies, ...) * Trip-planing * next airport Basel ? Mulhouse (international airport) * next railway-station L?rrach * best reachable railway-station Basel (Badischer Bahnhof) * by car Google Maps is your friend :) * Registration * please send your engaging registration latest November, 18th by E-Mail to GeroldKa at fedoraproject.org We were looking forward to see you soon and it would be a pleasure to have you all at the first event of this kind. -- Regards Gerold Kassube Fedora Ambassador Deutschland / Germany Schweiz / Switzerland Email: GeroldKa at fedoraproject.org 1024D/F33128B9 4ABC A903 F1F4 D9CC C422 AACA EDF1 DF42 F331 28B9 -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: Dies ist ein digital signierter Nachrichtenteil URL: From sundaram at fedoraproject.org Sat Nov 18 17:21:12 2006 From: sundaram at fedoraproject.org (Rahul Sundaram) Date: Sat, 18 Nov 2006 22:51:12 +0530 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Big decisions loom for Fedora Message-ID: <455F4108.2030000@fedoraproject.org> Hi Article covering the Fedora Summit related developments http://lwn.net/Articles/207938/ http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/FedoraSummit Rahul From marc at mwiriadi.id.au Sun Nov 19 04:04:08 2006 From: marc at mwiriadi.id.au (Marc Wiriadisastra) Date: Sun, 19 Nov 2006 12:04:08 +0800 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Big decisions loom for Fedora In-Reply-To: <455F4108.2030000@fedoraproject.org> References: <455F4108.2030000@fedoraproject.org> Message-ID: <1163909048.14965.1.camel@strikeforce.mwiriadi.id.au> On Sat, 2006-11-18 at 22:51 +0530, Rahul Sundaram wrote: > Hi > > > Article covering the Fedora Summit related developments > http://lwn.net/Articles/207938/ > http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/FedoraSummit > The wiki shows a lot of questions? Did anything get decided? Lots of new and eventful things to do however is there a yes this is getting done or no its not and all of that? I was going to read the irc logs but they were really long. Is their a summary somewhere? Regards, Marc From sundaram at fedoraproject.org Sun Nov 19 12:43:15 2006 From: sundaram at fedoraproject.org (Rahul Sundaram) Date: Sun, 19 Nov 2006 18:13:15 +0530 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Big decisions loom for Fedora In-Reply-To: <1163909048.14965.1.camel@strikeforce.mwiriadi.id.au> References: <455F4108.2030000@fedoraproject.org> <1163909048.14965.1.camel@strikeforce.mwiriadi.id.au> Message-ID: <45605163.3070007@fedoraproject.org> Marc Wiriadisastra wrote: > On Sat, 2006-11-18 at 22:51 +0530, Rahul Sundaram wrote: >> Hi >> >> >> Article covering the Fedora Summit related developments >> http://lwn.net/Articles/207938/ >> http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/FedoraSummit >> > > The wiki shows a lot of questions? Did anything get decided? Lots of > new and eventful things to do however is there a yes this is getting > done or no its not and all of that? It is a series of proposals that are being discussed. Decisions will be made over time. I was going to read the irc logs > but they were really long. > > Is their a summary somewhere? The Fedora summit page is the summary. Rahul From sundaram at fedoraproject.org Sun Nov 19 17:47:29 2006 From: sundaram at fedoraproject.org (Rahul Sundaram) Date: Sun, 19 Nov 2006 23:17:29 +0530 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Fedora on Sony Playstations - PS3 Message-ID: <456098B1.4080901@fedoraproject.org> Hi, Installation instructions - http://ps3.qj.net/PS3-Linux-The-void-has-been-filled-Full-install-instructions-for-Fedora-Core-5-/pg/49/aid/73144 Videos - http://ps3mods.blogspot.com/2006/11/fedora-core-5-on-ps3-videos.html Rahul From splinux at fedoraproject.org Sun Nov 19 17:58:48 2006 From: splinux at fedoraproject.org (Damien Durand) Date: Sun, 19 Nov 2006 18:58:48 +0100 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Fedora on Sony Playstations - PS3 In-Reply-To: <456098B1.4080901@fedoraproject.org> References: <456098B1.4080901@fedoraproject.org> Message-ID: > Hi, > > Installation instructions - > > http://ps3.qj.net/PS3-Linux-The-void-has-been-filled-Full-install-instructions-for-Fedora-Core-5-/pg/49/aid/73144 > > Videos - > http://ps3mods.blogspot.com/2006/11/fedora-core-5-on-ps3-videos.html > > Rahul That's great :) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From gmureddu at prodigy.net.mx Mon Nov 20 00:21:06 2006 From: gmureddu at prodigy.net.mx (Gian Paolo Mureddu) Date: Sun, 19 Nov 2006 18:21:06 -0600 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Fedora on Sony Playstations - PS3 In-Reply-To: <456098B1.4080901@fedoraproject.org> References: <456098B1.4080901@fedoraproject.org> Message-ID: <4560F4F2.3010504@prodigy.net.mx> Rahul Sundaram escribi?: > Hi, > > Installation instructions - > http://ps3.qj.net/PS3-Linux-The-void-has-been-filled-Full-install-instructions-for-Fedora-Core-5-/pg/49/aid/73144 > > > Videos - > http://ps3mods.blogspot.com/2006/11/fedora-core-5-on-ps3-videos.html > > Rahul > These are awesome! Thanks for sharing. I hope this message makes it to the list, as apparently I've been unable to post to the list for the last couple of days. From sundaram at fedoraproject.org Mon Nov 20 00:23:03 2006 From: sundaram at fedoraproject.org (Rahul Sundaram) Date: Mon, 20 Nov 2006 05:53:03 +0530 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Fedora on Sony Playstations - PS3 In-Reply-To: <4560F4F2.3010504@prodigy.net.mx> References: <456098B1.4080901@fedoraproject.org> <4560F4F2.3010504@prodigy.net.mx> Message-ID: <4560F567.304@fedoraproject.org> Gian Paolo Mureddu wrote: > Rahul Sundaram escribi?: >> Hi, >> >> Installation instructions - >> http://ps3.qj.net/PS3-Linux-The-void-has-been-filled-Full-install-instructions-for-Fedora-Core-5-/pg/49/aid/73144 >> >> >> Videos - >> http://ps3mods.blogspot.com/2006/11/fedora-core-5-on-ps3-videos.html >> >> Rahul >> > These are awesome! Thanks for sharing. > > I hope this message makes it to the list, as apparently I've been unable > to post to the list for the last couple of days. You were able to post to the list earlier too but you send the mails to the list administrators instead of the list a few times. Rahul From gmureddu at prodigy.net.mx Mon Nov 20 00:35:54 2006 From: gmureddu at prodigy.net.mx (Gian Paolo Mureddu) Date: Sun, 19 Nov 2006 18:35:54 -0600 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Fedora on Sony Playstations - PS3 In-Reply-To: <4560F567.304@fedoraproject.org> References: <456098B1.4080901@fedoraproject.org> <4560F567.304@fedoraproject.org> Message-ID: <4560F86A.2000106@prodigy.net.mx> Rahul Sundaram escribi?: > Gian Paolo Mureddu wrote: >> Rahul Sundaram escribi?: >>> Hi, >>> >>> Installation instructions - >>> http://ps3.qj.net/PS3-Linux-The-void-has-been-filled-Full-install-instructions-for-Fedora-Core-5-/pg/49/aid/73144 >>> >>> >>> Videos - >>> http://ps3mods.blogspot.com/2006/11/fedora-core-5-on-ps3-videos.html >>> >>> Rahul >>> >> These are awesome! Thanks for sharing. >> >> I hope this message makes it to the list, as apparently I've been >> unable to post to the list for the last couple of days. > > You were able to post to the list earlier too but you send the mails > to the list administrators instead of the list a few times. > > Rahul > Ohh... I'm pretty sure I was sending to the same address... will have to check my sent-box, I'm really sorry if it was an inconvenience. From michel.salim at gmail.com Mon Nov 20 03:03:27 2006 From: michel.salim at gmail.com (Michel Salim) Date: Sun, 19 Nov 2006 22:03:27 -0500 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Mirror in Main China In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <883cfe6d0611191903q7e4e2e9ek8c4bd0af65c260a3@mail.gmail.com> On 11/15/06, Leo wrote: > Hi there, > > A few friends in China are trying to find a fast mirror for FC and > then I find that there are zero mirrors in mainland China though there > are a few in Hong Kong and Taiwan. I'd like to see this situation > improved. Can anyone give me some pointers? I will try my best to help > out. > Best bet seems to be to contact Chinese universities and ISPs and ask if they could donate the bandwith and disk space for such a mirror. Cheers, -- Michel Salim Don't worry about avoiding temptation -- as you grow older, it starts avoiding you. -- The Old Farmer's Almanac From chasd at silveroaks.com Mon Nov 20 19:38:53 2006 From: chasd at silveroaks.com (chasd) Date: Mon, 20 Nov 2006 13:38:53 -0600 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Re: Big decisions loom for Fedora In-Reply-To: <20061119170006.8E894734B2@hormel.redhat.com> References: <20061119170006.8E894734B2@hormel.redhat.com> Message-ID: > From: Rahul Sundaram > Article covering the Fedora Summit related developments > http://lwn.net/Articles/207938/ From the linked posting to f-a-b by Mr. Spevack: > The choice to have those meetings on the phone, as opposed to on > IRC, was > one that was made by the Board when we started up, the main reason > being > the ones that Paul stated -- phone calls are higher bandwidth, and the > idea is to get everyone in that call on the same page as quickly as > possible. At our company, we have found that phone conferences are very productive, but unless there is a transcriptionist, what each person takes away from that conversation isn't always the same. And the contents of the conversation is not available to those not on the conference call. Slap down a digital voice recorder next to the phone speaker and post an OGG later. > Reading through all of those emails, the one thing that really > struck me > and made me think was the comment that "everything in Fedora takes > a long > time." Fedora isn't just turning a great big ship ( RH, cough ), it is turning a ship, building a ship, and at the same time trying to respond to all the shouters on the dock telling you what to do to both. Yeah, it's gonna take time. From an end-user perspective, I just want to see continuous improvement visible. ( I think there has been a great deal of progress FC5 => FC6 _outside_ of the versions on the packages that are on the discs ) Speed isn't that important to me because Fedora will never be "done" - there isn't really a finish line. Charles Dostale From sundaram at fedoraproject.org Mon Nov 20 19:46:34 2006 From: sundaram at fedoraproject.org (Rahul Sundaram) Date: Tue, 21 Nov 2006 01:16:34 +0530 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Re: Big decisions loom for Fedora In-Reply-To: References: <20061119170006.8E894734B2@hormel.redhat.com> Message-ID: <4562061A.2010808@fedoraproject.org> chasd wrote: > At our company, we have found that phone conferences are very > productive, but unless there is a transcriptionist, what each person > takes away from that conversation isn't always the same. And the > contents of the conversation is not available to those not on the > conference call. > > Slap down a digital voice recorder next to the phone speaker and post an > OGG later. See https://www.redhat.com/archives/fedora-advisory-board/2006-November/msg00206.html I think we found a happy go between by using #fedora-board IRC channel to have a running commentary on the discussions to a appropriate level of detail and getting input from community folks to continue the phone conversations. This worked out pretty well for the summit itself and I think we will continue that process for the future board meetings too. > ( I think there has been a great deal of progress FC5 => FC6 _outside_ > of the versions on the packages that are on the discs ) > Speed isn't that important to me because Fedora will never be "done" - > there isn't really a finish line. Precisely. It would be good to hear what progress you think we have made though. At the organizational level, the package versions arent really interesting. Every Fedora release will progress over the previous one with packages anyway. What's important is the other changes we make which is why the next release of Fedora is going to be pretty important even if the end product ends up being a conservative set of changes this time. Rahul From chasd at silveroaks.com Tue Nov 21 20:47:34 2006 From: chasd at silveroaks.com (chasd) Date: Tue, 21 Nov 2006 14:47:34 -0600 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Re: Big decisions loom for Fedora In-Reply-To: <20061121170006.C33E173475@hormel.redhat.com> References: <20061121170006.C33E173475@hormel.redhat.com> Message-ID: <73252BEE-61CF-4BA2-86DA-52AED7F2A76C@silveroaks.com> > From: Rahul Sundaram >> Slap down a digital voice recorder next to the phone speaker and >> post an >> OGG later. > > See > https://www.redhat.com/archives/fedora-advisory-board/2006-November/ > msg00206.html Is the IRC "transcript" available anywhere ? Not that I am interested, but that is an advantage of a digital audio file of conference call procedings, it can be referenced at any time, sort of a historical record. IRC does open up the live conversation to those that aren't on the conference call. Unless that IRC session is saved and posted, it can't be referenced as time passes. An IRC log is possibly more easily skimmed through than an audio file, but does not contain the "body language" of inflection, etc. > This worked out pretty well for the summit itself and I > think we will continue that process for the future board meetings too. Good. > It would be good to hear what progress you think we have made > though. The transparency into the organization seems to be getting much better. I also think Fedora is out of the "incubation" period. Every startup faces a problem of establishing a brand. Part of establishing a brand is establishing trust. Because of the way the birth of Fedora happened ( which we can't change ), it started not at zero, but somewhere in minus land as far as trust in the eyes of many in the open source community. As the download/update access numbers for FC6 attest, I think a turning point has been reached. Branding is more than establishing what you _are_, it is also establishing what you are _not_. Consistently. The recent MS-Novell dealings have turned the light bulbs on over many heads as the consistency of the message of a free as in speech distribution finally kicked in. And it was good that RH backed that. As much as Fedora is not RHEL, there is a relationship. Somehow we need to find how to differentiate Fedora from Ubuntu in a simple, understandable way that does not knock or put down Ubuntu. As well as the transparency of the organization is progressing ( work still to be done, eh ? ), the transparency into certain engineering decisions could improve. Similar to how XGL was dropped on the world, sometimes I see an entry in the rawhide report on f-d-l and think " How'd they decide that ? ". If you so choose, now you can follow the decision process of organizational issues, because the Fedora organization is now almost completely outside the RH fence line. The decision process on engineering issues is not that transparent, and I expect the merging of Core "into" Extras will help that. An example could be the decision to stick with Firefox 1.5 in FC6. It got mentioned in several reviews, particularly in comparison with Ubuntu. If you followed f-d-l you would have read the Firefox maintainer's understandable position. If reviewers would have seen this quote: > Let me state it plainly for everyone: There is nothing > extremely compelling about Firefox 2.0. Firefox 3.0 on the other hand > will be very compelling for both features, linux support, and > embedding > support. I am seriously considering pushing 3.0 into FC6 and even > FC5, > and have been making noises for a while about that being the next > upgrade. then I think the 1.5 vs. 2.0 issue would have not been a negative, possibly with a positive spin. Bonus points for considering 2.0 not "new" enough. It would have also added to the consistency of the "upstream, upstream" mantra Fedora is/should be known for. Another related issue is if I am new to Fedora and I want to know " Where is Fedora heading ? " , how do I get that info ? What list do I subscribe to ? What URLs/sites should I monitor ? What blogs ? That isn't particularly clear, until after you've sampled a bit of every channel and discarded the ones you feel don't apply. The hardy soul that does that is uncommon. Fedora Weekly News does bring together some of the different channels in one place. I think some of the mismatch between reality and the perception of the Fedora project is rooted in the channels used to expose the activities of the Fedora project. If you subscribe to and follow a decent subset of the mail lists, I think you come away with a good idea of where Fedora is and where it is going. You can't cruise in, surf a few forums and poke at the list archives and come away with the same impression. It isn't a Fedora-specific problem. For my company, I also need to keep on top of proprietary software vendors such as Adobe, Apple, and Microsoft. You can't get a clear picture of those organizations in a couple days of cruising their web sites either. I don't think I'll ever get as good a picture of those organizations compared to Fedora, but if I spend time reading blogs and mail lists from those companies, I get a much clearer picture. OK, this turned out much longer than it should have been, sorry. Charles Dostale From sdl.web at gmail.com Wed Nov 22 01:39:24 2006 From: sdl.web at gmail.com (Leo) Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2006 01:39:24 +0000 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] [review] Fedora Core 6 Message-ID: "Fedora Core is often called a test version of Red Hat, but many believe that it deserves to be recognised as a fully fledged distribution in its own right. Led by a community and sponsored by Red Hat, Fedora is probably one of the most popular GNU/Linux distributions in the world, with users including Wikipedia. It recently reached its sixth release, so let's see what's inside. ......" http://www.free-bees.co.uk/articles/fedoracore6/ -- Leo From n.losito at yahoo.it Sun Nov 26 16:04:46 2006 From: n.losito at yahoo.it (Nicola Losito) Date: Sun, 26 Nov 2006 17:04:46 +0100 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] new italian Fedora site/forum Message-ID: <11683541-E737-48EF-AD45-C0BFA219F0A2@yahoo.it> Hi list, due to a really unpleasant discussion between the owner of the FedoraItalia.org domain and the core member of the Associazione ILDN which ended up in a complete divorce (with papers and "contracts" get done with a lawyer) the latter has decided to start another resource: - http://fedora-it.org which is, at the moment and by any mean a work in progress, so we will look to the logo and such. End of File :-) -- Nicola .:kOoLiNuS:. Losito http://koolinus.wordpress.com ITA => http://www.koolinus.net -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From sundaram at fedoraproject.org Mon Nov 27 20:44:26 2006 From: sundaram at fedoraproject.org (Rahul Sundaram) Date: Tue, 28 Nov 2006 02:14:26 +0530 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Re: Big decisions loom for Fedora In-Reply-To: <73252BEE-61CF-4BA2-86DA-52AED7F2A76C@silveroaks.com> References: <20061121170006.C33E173475@hormel.redhat.com> <73252BEE-61CF-4BA2-86DA-52AED7F2A76C@silveroaks.com> Message-ID: <456B4E2A.6010806@fedoraproject.org> chasd wrote: > >> From: Rahul Sundaram > >>> Slap down a digital voice recorder next to the phone speaker and post an >>> OGG later. >> >> See >> https://www.redhat.com/archives/fedora-advisory-board/2006-November/msg00206.html >> > > Is the IRC "transcript" available anywhere ? > Not that I am interested, but that is an advantage of a digital audio > file of conference call procedings, it can be referenced at any time, > sort of a historical record. IRC does open up the live conversation to > those that aren't on the conference call. Unless that IRC session is > saved and posted, it can't be referenced as time passes. An IRC log is > possibly more easily skimmed through than an audio file, but does not > contain the "body language" of inflection, etc. In the usual place. http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Board/Meetings/2006-11-20. A news item and comments on the same at http://lwn.net/Articles/210377 [snipped a good amount of insights] > > As well as the transparency of the organization is progressing ( work > still to be done, eh ? ), the transparency into certain engineering > decisions could improve. Similar to how XGL was dropped on the world, > sometimes I see an entry in the rawhide report on f-d-l and think " > How'd they decide that ? ". The infrastructure and organizational changes currently being discussed has the potential to solve this problem. Till then if you find yourself wondering why a particular change was made just ask. If you so choose, now you can follow the > decision process of organizational issues, because the Fedora > organization is now almost completely outside the RH fence line. The > decision process on engineering issues is not that transparent, and I > expect the merging of Core "into" Extras will help that. I think so. Any work that continues to be done internally is going to miss out some amount of details when published to the community. Forcing ourselves to work in a external system guarantees that a minimum level of transparency is always there and someone not near the Red Hat water coolers know about these stuff. > > An example could be the decision to stick with Firefox 1.5 in FC6. It > got mentioned in several reviews, particularly in comparison with > Ubuntu. If you followed f-d-l you would have read the Firefox > maintainer's understandable position. If reviewers would have seen this > quote: > >> Let me state it plainly for everyone: There is nothing >> extremely compelling about Firefox 2.0. Firefox 3.0 on the other hand >> will be very compelling for both features, linux support, and embedding >> support. I am seriously considering pushing 3.0 into FC6 and even FC5, >> and have been making noises for a while about that being the next >> upgrade. > > then I think the 1.5 vs. 2.0 issue would have not been a negative, > possibly with a positive spin. Bonus points for considering 2.0 not > "new" enough. It would have also added to the consistency of the > "upstream, upstream" mantra Fedora is/should be known for. I wrote up a wiki page on this at http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Firefox2 and linked to it from the common bugs page which was send to the announce list. I find it hard to see how we could propogate these kind of information further. > > Another related issue is if I am new to Fedora and I want to know " > Where is Fedora heading ? " , how do I get that info ? > What list do I subscribe to ? > What URLs/sites should I monitor ? What blogs ? > That isn't particularly clear, until after you've sampled a bit of every > channel and discarded the ones you feel don't apply. The hardy soul that > does that is uncommon. Fedora Weekly News does bring together some of > the different channels in one place. Apart from FWN, Fedora Advisory board and announce lists as well as Fedora people at http://fedoraproject.org/people are good places to follow discussions. Most of the major discussions happen in one of these . > > I think some of the mismatch between reality and the perception of the > Fedora project is rooted in the channels used to expose the activities > of the Fedora project. If you subscribe to and follow a decent subset of > the mail lists, I think you come away with a good idea of where Fedora > is and where it is going. You can't cruise in, surf a few forums and > poke at the list archives and come away with the same impression. > > It isn't a Fedora-specific problem. For my company, I also need to keep > on top of proprietary software vendors such as Adobe, Apple, and > Microsoft. You can't get a clear picture of those organizations in a > couple days of cruising their web sites either. I don't think I'll ever > get as good a picture of those organizations compared to Fedora, but if > I spend time reading blogs and mail lists from those companies, I get a > much clearer picture. > > OK, this turned out much longer than it should have been, sorry. We are working on consolidating mailing lists where it helps. Rahul From sundaram at fedoraproject.org Mon Nov 27 23:31:16 2006 From: sundaram at fedoraproject.org (Rahul Sundaram) Date: Tue, 28 Nov 2006 05:01:16 +0530 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Primed for desktop Linux Message-ID: <456B7544.2090707@fedoraproject.org> Hi A huge roll out of Fedora http://www.zdnet.com.au/blogs/disasterrecovery/soa/Primed_for_desktop_Linux/0%2c139033346%2c339272380%2c00.htm Rahul From chasd at silveroaks.com Tue Nov 28 19:38:15 2006 From: chasd at silveroaks.com (chasd) Date: Tue, 28 Nov 2006 13:38:15 -0600 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Re: Big decisions loom for Fedora In-Reply-To: <20061128170007.1322273A3D@hormel.redhat.com> References: <20061128170007.1322273A3D@hormel.redhat.com> Message-ID: <0D8F8AA6-1EA5-453F-824A-1079BE67606B@silveroaks.com> > I wrote up a wiki page on this at http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/ > Firefox2 > and linked to it from the common bugs page which was send to the > announce list. I find it hard to see how we could propogate these kind > of information further. I think the "Common Bugs" page is quite informative. I hadn't noticed that link, or passed over it because I already knew the background. Thanks for pointing it out. I think the "Common Bugs" page should have a link on the main page, right up where the download links are. It is at least as important as Usage Stats. Charles Dostale From sundaram at fedoraproject.org Tue Nov 28 19:44:24 2006 From: sundaram at fedoraproject.org (Rahul Sundaram) Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2006 01:14:24 +0530 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Re: Big decisions loom for Fedora In-Reply-To: <0D8F8AA6-1EA5-453F-824A-1079BE67606B@silveroaks.com> References: <20061128170007.1322273A3D@hormel.redhat.com> <0D8F8AA6-1EA5-453F-824A-1079BE67606B@silveroaks.com> Message-ID: <456C9198.3060404@fedoraproject.org> chasd wrote: >> I wrote up a wiki page on this at http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Firefox2 >> and linked to it from the common bugs page which was send to the >> announce list. I find it hard to see how we could propogate these kind >> of information further. > > I think the "Common Bugs" page is quite informative. > I hadn't noticed that link, or passed over it because I already knew the > background. Thanks for pointing it out. > > I think the "Common Bugs" page should have a link on the main page, > right up where the download links are. > It is at least as important as Usage Stats. > Point. I added that link now. I am a pretty biased source having written that document though I believe it is generally very helpful to end users. Rahul From chasd at silveroaks.com Wed Nov 29 21:30:16 2006 From: chasd at silveroaks.com (chasd) Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2006 15:30:16 -0600 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Re: Big decisions loom for Fedora In-Reply-To: <20061129170008.719C073831@hormel.redhat.com> References: <20061129170008.719C073831@hormel.redhat.com> Message-ID: <3F34D637-0F6F-4667-9437-C35AA987DF1E@silveroaks.com> > From: Rahul Sundaram > > Point. I added that link now. I am a pretty biased source having > written > that document though I believe it is generally very helpful to end > users. Fabulous. I think from a marketing perspective, having that link visible helps re-enforce the progress made toward a more transparent organization. To me it says "We aren't perfect, here is the stuff we missed." Maybe I read too much into little things ;) Charles Dostale From sundaram at fedoraproject.org Wed Nov 29 21:34:58 2006 From: sundaram at fedoraproject.org (Rahul Sundaram) Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2006 03:04:58 +0530 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Fedora Core 6: Beauty or Beast? Message-ID: <456DFD02.7080805@fedoraproject.org> Hi A two part review http://www.enterprisenetworkingplanet.com/netos/article.php/3645261 http://www.enterprisenetworkingplanet.com/netos/article.php/3646046 "Conclusion Dare you trust Fedora Core 6 to production servers or desktops? Yes. If they are not mission-critical systems and you can tolerate downtimes, if you are diligent about keeping security patches applied, and if you are willing to trade extra work in exchange for getting your hands on enterprise-worthy bleeding-edge applications. Nothing beats a production environment for testing- no test lab can possibly duplicate all the factors real users will inflict on your innocent computers. If you want something that Just Works, don't use early Fedora releases. Be sure to read the release notes and other documentation. The Fedora project is absolutely dripping with good documentation. Please keep in mind that you can contribute by posting good bug reports and helping other users on the mailing lists, support forums, and Wikis. You don't have to make it your life's work- a little bit from everyone adds up to a lot. " Rahul From luya_tfz at thefinalzone.com Thu Nov 30 07:37:21 2006 From: luya_tfz at thefinalzone.com (Luya Tshimbalanga) Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2006 02:37:21 -0500 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Name for future Fedora distribition? Message-ID: <1164872241.456e8a31123fd@ssl.mecca.ca> How about "Fedora Synergy"? That name implies the effort from both community and developers and the fact it is the base of several distribution like Red Hat Enterprise Linux and One Laptop Per Child. -- Luya Tshimbalanga Fedora Project contributor http://www.fedoraproject.org/wiki/LuyaTshimbalanga From mattdm at mattdm.org Thu Nov 30 11:56:11 2006 From: mattdm at mattdm.org (Matthew Miller) Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2006 06:56:11 -0500 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Name for future Fedora distribition? In-Reply-To: <1164872241.456e8a31123fd@ssl.mecca.ca> References: <1164872241.456e8a31123fd@ssl.mecca.ca> Message-ID: <20061130115611.GA7125@jadzia.bu.edu> On Thu, Nov 30, 2006 at 02:37:21AM -0500, Luya Tshimbalanga wrote: > How about "Fedora Synergy"? That name implies the effort from both community and > developers and the fact it is the base of several distribution like Red Hat > Enterprise Linux and One Laptop Per Child. Fedora Buzzwordy. -- Matthew Miller mattdm at mattdm.org Boston University Linux ------> From n.losito at yahoo.it Thu Nov 30 12:08:16 2006 From: n.losito at yahoo.it (Nicola Losito) Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2006 13:08:16 +0100 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Re: Name for future Fedora distribition? In-Reply-To: <20061130115611.GA7125@jadzia.bu.edu> References: <1164872241.456e8a31123fd@ssl.mecca.ca> <20061130115611.GA7125@jadzia.bu.edu> Message-ID: <70D10A78-4131-4FDB-BE0E-12DE278C689B@yahoo.it> Il giorno 30/nov/06, alle ore 12:56, Matthew Miller ha scritto: > On Thu, Nov 30, 2006 at 02:37:21AM -0500, Luya Tshimbalanga wrote: >> How about "Fedora Synergy"? That name implies the effort from both >> community and >> developers and the fact it is the base of several distribution >> like Red Hat >> Enterprise Linux and One Laptop Per Child. > > Fedora Buzzwordy. In a private mail to Chris Blizzard (after having read a thread in the FAB ml) i suggested: Fedora Jammin' like the old Bob Marley raggae song ;-) Or even better Just Fedora (like the Roberto Cavalli fashion ad or even funnier "Just Jack" of Will & Grave tv show fame ... -- Nicola .:kOoLiNuS:. Losito http://koolinus.wordpress.com ITA => http://www.koolinus.net -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From lxmaier at gmail.com Thu Nov 30 16:00:15 2006 From: lxmaier at gmail.com (Alex Maier) Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2006 11:00:15 -0500 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Re: [Ambassadors] Name for future Fedora distribition? In-Reply-To: <456EFE85.4060401@fedoraproject.org> References: <1164872241.456e8a31123fd@ssl.mecca.ca> <1164891913.5387.0.camel@fluffy.mrtomlinux> <1164892211.3443.4.camel@Amilo-GK.homenet.local> <1164892568.5387.2.camel@fluffy.mrtomlinux> <456EFBC3.10503@glezos.com> <456EFE85.4060401@fedoraproject.org> Message-ID: <7f617d270611300800m1b261c9fm94b01e481fbf791c@mail.gmail.com> Hey, what happened to the puppies? On 11/30/06, Francesco Ugolini wrote: > Hernan Pachas ha scritto: > > +1 > > > > ---Hernan > > > > On 11/30/06, Dimitris Glezos wrote: > >> O/H Thomas Canniot ??????: > >> > Le jeudi 30 novembre 2006 ? 14:10 +0100, Gerold Kassube a ?crit : > >> >> why not only > >> >> > >> >> *FEDORA* > >> >> > >> >> this says all :-) > >> > >> +1. > >> > >> -d > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> -- > >> Dimitris Glezos > >> Jabber ID: glezos at jabber.org, GPG: 0xA5A04C3B > >> http://dimitris.glezos.com/ > >> > >> > >> "He who gives up functionality for ease of use > >> loses both and deserves neither." (Anonymous) > >> -- > >> > >> -- > >> Fedora-ambassadors-list mailing list > >> Fedora-ambassadors-list at redhat.com > >> https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-ambassadors-list > >> > > > > -- > > Fedora-ambassadors-list mailing list > > Fedora-ambassadors-list at redhat.com > > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-ambassadors-list > > > +1 > > -- > Fedora-ambassadors-list mailing list > Fedora-ambassadors-list at redhat.com > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-ambassadors-list > -- Alex Maier Art and Photography [homepage] http://amaier.net [photos and art books] http://lulu.com/amaier [posters] http://www.art.com/memberartist/amaier From stb52988 at gmail.com Thu Nov 30 19:43:39 2006 From: stb52988 at gmail.com (Steve Barnhart) Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2006 14:43:39 -0500 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Re: [Ambassadors] Name for future Fedora distribition? In-Reply-To: <7f617d270611300800m1b261c9fm94b01e481fbf791c@mail.gmail.com> References: <1164872241.456e8a31123fd@ssl.mecca.ca> <1164891913.5387.0.camel@fluffy.mrtomlinux> <1164892211.3443.4.camel@Amilo-GK.homenet.local> <1164892568.5387.2.camel@fluffy.mrtomlinux> <456EFBC3.10503@glezos.com> <456EFE85.4060401@fedoraproject.org> <7f617d270611300800m1b261c9fm94b01e481fbf791c@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <15ce3ec0611301143q6471b8e2haf4cff9990f2f059@mail.gmail.com> I agree, How about just keeping it Fedora and/or Fedora Linux, everyone knows that and no point in confusing people again. No one really cared about the Core part anyway, IMO it was a stupid name. On 11/30/06, Alex Maier wrote: > Hey, what happened to the puppies? > > On 11/30/06, Francesco Ugolini wrote: > > Hernan Pachas ha scritto: > > > +1 > > > > > > ---Hernan > > > > > > On 11/30/06, Dimitris Glezos wrote: > > >> O/H Thomas Canniot ??????: > > >> > Le jeudi 30 novembre 2006 ? 14:10 +0100, Gerold Kassube a ?crit : > > >> >> why not only > > >> >> > > >> >> *FEDORA* > > >> >> > > >> >> this says all :-) > > >> > > >> +1. > > >> > > >> -d > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> -- > > >> Dimitris Glezos > > >> Jabber ID: glezos at jabber.org, GPG: 0xA5A04C3B > > >> http://dimitris.glezos.com/ > > >> > > >> > > >> "He who gives up functionality for ease of use > > >> loses both and deserves neither." (Anonymous) > > >> -- > > >> > > >> -- > > >> Fedora-ambassadors-list mailing list > > >> Fedora-ambassadors-list at redhat.com > > >> https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-ambassadors-list > > >> > > > > > > -- > > > Fedora-ambassadors-list mailing list > > > Fedora-ambassadors-list at redhat.com > > > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-ambassadors-list > > > > > +1 > > > > -- > > Fedora-ambassadors-list mailing list > > Fedora-ambassadors-list at redhat.com > > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-ambassadors-list > > > > > -- > Alex Maier > Art and Photography > > [homepage] http://amaier.net > [photos and art books] http://lulu.com/amaier > [posters] http://www.art.com/memberartist/amaier > > -- > Fedora-marketing-list mailing list > Fedora-marketing-list at redhat.com > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-marketing-list > -- Steve From nicolas.mailhot at laposte.net Thu Nov 30 20:35:22 2006 From: nicolas.mailhot at laposte.net (Nicolas Mailhot) Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2006 21:35:22 +0100 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Name for future Fedora distribition? In-Reply-To: <1164872241.456e8a31123fd@ssl.mecca.ca> References: <1164872241.456e8a31123fd@ssl.mecca.ca> Message-ID: <1164918923.8160.84.camel@rousalka.dyndns.org> Fedora Collection -- Nicolas Mailhot -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 197 bytes Desc: Ceci est une partie de message num?riquement sign?e URL: From wcervini at gmail.com Thu Nov 30 21:00:08 2006 From: wcervini at gmail.com (Walter Cervini) Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2006 17:00:08 -0400 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Re: [Ambassadors] Name for future Fedora distribition? In-Reply-To: <1164872241.456e8a31123fd@ssl.mecca.ca> References: <1164872241.456e8a31123fd@ssl.mecca.ca> Message-ID: <9d1478d80611301300o17a96201q15369a88159e812a@mail.gmail.com> Fedora BlueStorm or Fedora Twister 2006/11/30, Luya Tshimbalanga : > > How about "Fedora Synergy"? That name implies the effort from both > community and > developers and the fact it is the base of several distribution like Red > Hat > Enterprise Linux and One Laptop Per Child. > > -- > Luya Tshimbalanga > Fedora Project contributor > http://www.fedoraproject.org/wiki/LuyaTshimbalanga > > -- > Fedora-ambassadors-list mailing list > Fedora-ambassadors-list at redhat.com > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-ambassadors-list > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From cnegus at rucls.net Thu Nov 30 22:33:00 2006 From: cnegus at rucls.net (Chris Negus) Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2006 16:33:00 -0600 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Re: [Ambassadors] Name for future Fedora distribition? In-Reply-To: <15ce3ec0611301143q6471b8e2haf4cff9990f2f059@mail.gmail.com> References: <1164872241.456e8a31123fd@ssl.mecca.ca> <1164891913.5387.0.camel@fluffy.mrtomlinux> <1164892211.3443.4.camel@Amilo-GK.homenet.local> <1164892568.5387.2.camel@fluffy.mrtomlinux> <456EFBC3.10503@glezos.com> <456EFE85.4060401@fedoraproject.org> <7f617d270611300800m1b261c9fm94b01e481fbf791c@mail.gmail.com> <15ce3ec0611301143q6471b8e2haf4cff9990f2f059@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1164925980.26465.57.camel@einstein> On Thu, 2006-11-30 at 14:43 -0500, Steve Barnhart wrote: > I agree, How about just keeping it Fedora and/or Fedora Linux, > everyone knows that and no point in confusing people again. No one > really cared about the Core part anyway, IMO it was a stupid name. I agree with Fedora Linux. Someone looking for a Linux system that isn't already in the choir will find it more easily in searches. Those of us who were writing about Red Hat Linux were thrown into naming hell when Red Hat Linux shifted to Fedora Core. Fedora Linux would have softened the blow. -- Chris Negus From jkeating at j2solutions.net Thu Nov 30 22:37:42 2006 From: jkeating at j2solutions.net (Jesse Keating) Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2006 17:37:42 -0500 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Re: [Ambassadors] Name for future Fedora distribition? In-Reply-To: <1164925980.26465.57.camel@einstein> References: <1164872241.456e8a31123fd@ssl.mecca.ca> <15ce3ec0611301143q6471b8e2haf4cff9990f2f059@mail.gmail.com> <1164925980.26465.57.camel@einstein> Message-ID: <200611301737.42964.jkeating@j2solutions.net> On Thursday 30 November 2006 17:33, Chris Negus wrote: > I agree with Fedora Linux. Someone looking for a Linux system that isn't > already in the choir will find it more easily in searches. Those of us > who were writing about Red Hat Linux were thrown into naming hell when > Red Hat Linux shifted to Fedora Core. Fedora Linux would have softened > the blow. Personally I'd like to name the distribution releases with "Linux", so you get Fedora Desktop Linux 7 (Naugahyde), Fedora Server Linux 7 (Naugahyde), etc... A book that covers all of the Fedora Linux releases could use the generic "Fedora Linux" term. We still have to name the pile of packages collection. -- Jesse Keating RHCE (geek.j2solutions.net) Fedora Legacy Team (www.fedoralegacy.org) GPG Public Key (geek.j2solutions.net/jkeating.j2solutions.pub) -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: not available URL: From gdk at redhat.com Thu Nov 30 22:41:01 2006 From: gdk at redhat.com (Greg Dekoenigsberg) Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2006 17:41:01 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Re: [Ambassadors] Name for future Fedora distribition? In-Reply-To: <1164925980.26465.57.camel@einstein> References: <1164872241.456e8a31123fd@ssl.mecca.ca> <1164891913.5387.0.camel@fluffy.mrtomlinux> <1164892211.3443.4.camel@Amilo-GK.homenet.local> <1164892568.5387.2.camel@fluffy.mrtomlinux> <456EFBC3.10503@glezos.com> <456EFE85.4060401@fedoraproject.org> <7f617d270611300800m1b261c9fm94b01e481fbf791c@mail.gmail.com> <15ce3ec0611301143q6471b8e2haf4cff9990f2f059@mail.gmail.com> <1164925980.26465.57.camel@einstein> Message-ID: On Thu, 30 Nov 2006, Chris Negus wrote: > On Thu, 2006-11-30 at 14:43 -0500, Steve Barnhart wrote: >> I agree, How about just keeping it Fedora and/or Fedora Linux, >> everyone knows that and no point in confusing people again. No one >> really cared about the Core part anyway, IMO it was a stupid name. > > I agree with Fedora Linux. Someone looking for a Linux system that isn't > already in the choir will find it more easily in searches. Those of us > who were writing about Red Hat Linux were thrown into naming hell when > Red Hat Linux shifted to Fedora Core. Fedora Linux would have softened > the blow. But, see, that's not even what we're talking about. We're not talking about "what will we rename Fedora Core to?" We're looking at FUNDAMENTAL changes of the ACTUAL DELIVERABLES of the Fedora Project. === AS OF RIGHT NOW, HERE'S WHAT FEDORA LOOKS LIKE: === Fedora Core is: (a set of packages maintained by RH) AND (a Linux distribution). Fedora Extras is: (a set of packages maintained by The Fedora Community). === IN THE FUTURE, HERE'S WHAT FEDORA WILL LOOK LIKE: === Fedora _X_ is: (the maximal set of packages maintained by The Fedora Community) AND (too big to distribute on a single CD or DVD) AND (therefore NOT a Linux distro). Fedora _Y_ is: (a Linux distro blessed by RH that is a strict subset of Fedora _X_) AND (a Linux distro aimed at, oh, servers). Fedora _Z_ is: (a Linux distro blessed by RH that is a strict subset of Fedora _X_) AND (a Linux distro aimed at, oh, GNOME-based desktops). === So following Chris's logic, maybe we'd fill in values as such: X = Fedora 7 Linux Y = Fedora 7 Linux Server Z = Fedora 7 Linux Desktop And maybe I buy that for Y and Z... but not for X. Because people will say "I want Fedora Linux", and that's not going to be a sufficient answer, because "Fedora Linux" will just be too damned big. Anyway. Those are the issues as I see them. Discuss. :) --g ------------------------------------------------------------- Greg DeKoenigsberg || Fedora Project || fedoraproject.org Be an Ambassador || http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Ambassadors ------------------------------------------------------------- From jspaleta at gmail.com Thu Nov 30 23:11:29 2006 From: jspaleta at gmail.com (Jeff Spaleta) Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2006 14:11:29 -0900 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Re: [Ambassadors] Name for future Fedora distribition? In-Reply-To: <200611301737.42964.jkeating@j2solutions.net> References: <1164872241.456e8a31123fd@ssl.mecca.ca> <15ce3ec0611301143q6471b8e2haf4cff9990f2f059@mail.gmail.com> <1164925980.26465.57.camel@einstein> <200611301737.42964.jkeating@j2solutions.net> Message-ID: <604aa7910611301511h610049fw18bc268bd449d127@mail.gmail.com> Oh a name game! I like name games. Fedora Akixiusiaksraqsi translated from the I?upiat Eskimo Dictionary Fedora "your future rewards (potentially received rewards)" Fedora Akiqsruun translated as Fedora Promise or Fedora Covenant Covenant: An agreement between two parties. The agreement, according to Ancient Near East custom, consists of five parts: 1) Identification of parties, 2) Historical prologue where the deeds establishing the worthiness of the dominant party is established, 3) Conditions of the agreement, 4) Rewards and punishments in regard to keeping the conditions, and 5) Disposition of the documents where each party receives a copy of the agreement And considering how much emphasis we place on the importance of licensing as the defining quality of what can be part of the Fedora software universe, naming the space..convenant..isn't so out-of-line with that emphasis. What is Fedora if it isn't a promise. What is Fedora if it isn't an expression of a unspoken covenant with the community, to push FOSS forward into the future, a future with rewards for everyone who is involved in the process. -jef"Fedora, fedora-bo-dora...."spaleta From david at gnsa.us Thu Nov 30 23:35:44 2006 From: david at gnsa.us (David Nalley) Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2006 18:35:44 -0500 Subject: [Fedora-marketing-list] Re: [Ambassadors] Name for future Fedora distribition? In-Reply-To: <456F36A6.3020104@glezos.com> References: <1164872241.456e8a31123fd@ssl.mecca.ca> <1164891913.5387.0.camel@fluffy.mrtomlinux> <1164892211.3443.4.camel@Amilo-GK.homenet.local> <1164892568.5387.2.camel@fluffy.mrtomlinux> <20061130134738.GA17219@gja.in> <456F0A32.60000@fedoraproject.org> <456F36A6.3020104@glezos.com> Message-ID: <456F6AD0.2010205@gnsa.us> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Dimitris Glezos wrote: > Well, merging Core and Extras doesn't necessarily mean we should change the name > of our distribution. I suggest for us to consider the cost in changing the name. > > The name "Fedora Core" has established a reputation as "The distribution the > Fedora Project produces". If we completely discontinue the "Core" product as > such, then there is no conflict in keeping that name for our distribution. It > will simply have a new meaning. Besides, that's what the conscious is: we are > opening up Core; we are not substituting it with something new. We are just > changing the build processes and mechanisms. I think Dimitris is absolutely correct. There is a high cost with 'rebranding'. Sometimes rebranding is necessary, but I am not convinced that our 'internal process' change (admittedly visible to anyone) is cause enough to justify rebranding or the immense effort people would have to go through to communicate that to the end user nothing has changed, it's merely a process change. Since Gregdek has said that it can't be only 'Fedora' or 'Fedora Linux' and has also stated that '"The Fedora Project" is the umbrella for everything that Fedora does.' I think Fedora Core is a very apt (thought I suppose I should say yummy instead) name, as producing a distribution/collection of packages is the CORE or central focus of 'The Fedora Project' . David Nalley -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.2 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with SUSE - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iD8DBQFFb2rQkZOYj+cNI1cRAos6AJ9hcP2gO+sWMF6RYCAW/8fgr7+engCggqbQ 67BG7dS5c5/PPExtqqe+Zi0= =VFuf -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----