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Re: Help improving translation



Hi,

2006/11/23, Thomas Canniot <thomas canniot laposte net>:
Le jeudi 23 novembre 2006 à 11:03 +0100, Xavier Conde Rueda a écrit :
> Hi Thomas,
>
> >
> > I have been translating fedora in French for few months only and i'm
> > facing problems with contributors' translations.
> >
> > I used to translate po files, and, as we were very few French
> > translators (2 *only*), it was quite easy to ask for the mate to read
> > over the translation and to know what he is actually doing.
> >
> > However, now that I have less free time and now that we are more than 2
> > translating Fedora into French, when I take the initiative to translate
> > 2 or 3 missing or recently added strings, I met bad translation and
> > mistakes.
> >
> > There are few problems in our translation process :
> >
> > - People are not communicating by mailing list. The fact is that
> > translation is often seen as a lonely activity and that you don't need
> > any response from someone to take a po file and translate it. There is
> > no way to know who is working on what.
>
> -- This is bad management. You should fix that by yourself. As the
> project leader, you should query the status of translations. On
> voluntary projects it's important to track the status of other's work,
> since they don't have an economical commitment, also people is very
> selective on what they spend their free time.
>

I am not a project leader. I am just someone who learned English at university and who just see mistakes more than others tranlsators do.



>
>
> > - The status page [1] are useful to know what has been translated, but
> > useless to know what has been read over.
> > - People do not use the reservation system "take" button and if they do,
> > they don't update they reservation.
>
> -- You should assign translations to translators. Only one person
> should have commit access for a given project. When people wants to
> translate something, send them the PO file. You should manage by
> yourself who is doing what. A simple spreadsheet will do.
>

How to step back with people who already have all the rights ? I can't *obviously* take them this right back, nor I want to.
I don't want to be the one who decide, because I believe people are able enough to decide for themselves. If people want to translate something, then they do it, it's their choice.

-- There is nothing bad with telling people what should translate,
it's the leader responsability to assign the work rightly.

Nobody should have a word about what they would want to do, as long as it is good for the Project.

-- But you are saying it's not good for your project, aren't you? You
say people goes their way and it is affecting negatively French
Fedora. I don't see project management as a dictatorship, unless
contributors are unhappy with the dictator. It is called benevolent
dictatorship. So you are unhappy with the project leader. He/she is
commiting work that hasn't enough quality. I'm right?

I don't see how are you gonna fix it by taking a look at what has been
commited. The usual way of working is
translating->reviewing->fixing->commit. If people is commiting without
good reviewing, then you must tell them. If you consider you should
have a word on translation quality, then you should ask for getting
that role assigned to you.


>
> Anyway, I find the take button completely useless, not to mention the
> bunch of mails saying it's going to expire soon. I suppose people
> doesn't want to get 5 mails each time they take a module, so they do
> it once, but not twice :). It's not good for synchronization.
>

So do I.

>
> > What I'm planning to do : take every po file, and read over them until
> > FC7 comes out. This is the only way I found to avoid bad translation in
> > Fedora.
> >
> > Any advice to help out ?
> >
> > As we are changing lots of things on Fedora, wouldn't be the time to
> > improve the translation process :
> > - we shouldn't give anymore rights to upload CVS translation. CVS should
> > only be accessible in read only and only people that read translation
> > over should be allowed to update po to the CVS.
>
> -- As I said, only project leaders should have commit access, not everybody.
>
> > - as there is mailing list for modifications on CVS docs, we need a
> > mailing list as well for each language po modification. Mailing list are
> > easy to set up and do not consume any ressources.
>
> -- There is a commits list you can subscribe, it will do for you. But
> it's the same thing, only you should be committing. Personally, for
> Catalan we don't need it. Not sure we need it for every language.

The problem of *leader* is that one day, I may not be as available as other people would like me to.
We are facing this problem in France, and the leader of the GNOME translation Project is not very well seen by people.
The French GNOME community is divided and does not work to its full capabilities.

>
> > - we could also use a system allowing to add a status of what has to be
> > done with a po file : "waiting for translation", "waiting for being read
> > over", "translation in progress" for example, are status that could be
> > used.
>
> -- If Fedora provides a full web translation management environment it
> would be great. However, a wiki page could be used, where each
> contributor writes down the status of their current translation.

If they do so, they could actually mail the list, that they don't do. Why would they write it on a wiki page ?

-- Why they would change the status on the status page, then :)?

As I see from what you are saying, the main problem is people isn't
using the mail list. This should be adressed as the main problem
inside your project.

I think we are more at a state where people should be obliged to tell the status of their translation to commit it.


Good luck! I hope your translation team improves Fedora.

>
> Regards!
>
> > just my 2 cents.
> >
> > [1] http://i18n.redhat.com/cgi-bin/i18n-status
> > --
> > Thomas Canniot
> > http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/ThomasCanniot
> >
>
--
Thomas Canniot
http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/ThomasCanniot

--
Fedora-trans-list mailing list
Fedora-trans-list redhat com
https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-trans-list



--
Google talk: xavi.conde a gmail.com

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