[K12OSN] K12LTSP Over Dialup

Fri Jun 11 20:57:57 UTC 2004

A terminal session or command-line over dial up works quite well.  But any sort 
of graphical environment or application over dial-up will be painful at best. 
That said, a few years ago, when TightVNC first came out, I tried it from a 
Win98 client to a Win2k host over dial up.  The performance was decent, but not 
something I'd want to work with on a daily basis.  As I said, it was better than 
driving into the office in the middle of the night, but you wouldn't want to use 
it for regular tasks.  Dial-up just doesn't have the bandwidth for graphical 
environments.

SSH just allows you to encrypt the bits being passed back and forth, and will 
actually increase the load on both ends, but has some compression options.  But 
it won't fix the bandwidth limitation of dial-up.

Petre

Jim and Kelly Younkin wrote:
> Yes, I know the "Evil Empire" cannot be trusted.  Still I have to
> believe there is *something* that will work well over a dialup.  Does
> anyone know anything about "SSH"?
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: k12osn-bounces at redhat.com [mailto:k12osn-bounces at redhat.com] On
> Behalf Of Julius Szelagiewicz
> Sent: Friday, June 11, 2004 4:34 PM
> To: Support list for opensource software in schools.
> Subject: RE: [K12OSN] K12LTSP Over Dialup
> Importance: Low
> 
> On Fri, 11 Jun 2004, Jim and Kelly Younkin wrote:
> 
> 
>>I found this on Windows 2003 Terminal Server.  20K is a bandwidth I
>>could live with, though I need to find out more details of what else
> 
> is
> 
>>necessary.  I really thought Linux would have something in this range.
>>
>>
>>>>Depending on your configuration individual RDP sessions should use
>>
>>between 11K-20K per session.
> 
> 
> Right, and you can "run" win2k on p1 133 with 64K memory. take the
> minimum
> specs from MS with a big grain of salt. julius
> 
> 
> 
> 
>>The following document from Microsoft should help.
>>
>>
> 
> http://download.microsoft.com/download/5/8/c/58ccf087-33c1-41b2-bb74-ee2
> 
>>0be37fde6/TermServScaling.doc<<
>>
>>-----Original Message-----
>>From: k12osn-bounces at redhat.com [mailto:k12osn-bounces at redhat.com] On
>>Behalf Of Petre Scheie
>>Sent: Friday, June 11, 2004 3:46 PM
>>To: Support list for opensource software in schools.
>>Subject: Re: [K12OSN] K12LTSP Over Dialup
>>Importance: Low
>>
>>Even at 200k, that's at least four times the bandwidth you'll ever get
>>with
>>dial-up.  LTSP isn't the same thing as VNC.  LTSP loads the client's
>>whole
>>operating system over the wire, whereas VNC uses a special program on
> 
> an
> 
>>already
>>running client machine to allow the server to just transmit
> 
> streamlined
> 
>>screen
>>updates.  You don't want to try LTSP over dial-up; your users won't
>>accept it.
>>I'm not even sure how you'd get the client to dial the phone to make
> 
> the
> 
>>connection, as to do so would require an OS to already be loaded on
> 
> the
> 
>>client
>>to control the modem, etc. And VNC over dial-up is only so-so; it
> 
> beats
> 
>>driving
>>in on the weekend to tend to a box, but it pales compared to actually
>>being
>>there, and I doubt regular users will find it tolerable.
>>
>>Petre
>>
>>Jim and Kelly Younkin wrote:
>>
>>>This statement makes me wonder about LTSP:
>>>" The whole concept of thin clients requires a fast connection to
> 
> the
> 
>>>server to work.  "
>>>
>>>Here is something I read about using VNC with Linux:
>>>"You would be shocked at how little bandwidth is required to do such
> 
> a
> 
>>>thing. For efficiency disable all screen savers and set the desktop
>>>background to a neutral wallpaper with no fancy stuff. I run on
>>
>>machine
>>
>>>with 120 users on it and the bandwidth used is about 200k average. X
>>
>>is
>>
>>>incredibly efficient as long as you can keep the necessary screen
>>>refresh rates down by not running too much eye candy."
>>>
>>>-----Original Message-----
>>>From: k12osn-bounces at redhat.com [mailto:k12osn-bounces at redhat.com]
> 
> On
> 
>>>Behalf Of Les Mikesell
>>>Sent: Friday, June 11, 2004 11:35 AM
>>>To: Support list for opensource software in schools.
>>>Subject: Re: [K12OSN] K12LTSP Over Dialup
>>>Importance: Low
>>>
>>>On Fri, 2004-06-11 at 10:18, Jim and Kelly Younkin wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>>I am new to Linux, but I have a project that I believe would be
>>>
>>>perfect
>>>
>>>
>>>>for it and my research has pointed me to K12LTSP as the distro that
>>>
>>>will
>>>
>>>
>>>>work best, however I have a question about running the thin clients
>>>
>>>over
>>>
>>>
>>>>a dialup connection.
>>>>
>>>>I plan to have about 20 remote offices set up as thin clients, with
> 
> a
> 
>>>>dialup connection to a K12LTSP server.  They need to be able to have
>>>>internet access, e-mail and office software.
>>>>
>>>>Is performance going to be unbearable over a 56K dialup?  What
> 
> server
> 
>>>>hardware would you recommend for this project?
>>>
>>>
>>>The whole concept of thin clients requires a fast connection to the
>>>server to work.  If you only have one person at each office,
>>>consider some other topology.  If you have several people at each
>>>office it would work to have a suitably sized local server and
>>>several thin clients at each.  If you just want to avoid
>>>software installs at the remote site you might run a live-CD
>>>linux version like Knoppix.   56k is OK for occasional email
>>>transfers or working in character mode.  It's not fast enough
>>>to run typical GUI programs over or even loading/saving data
>>>for everyday use.  You'll either want DSL/cable modem speeds
>>>for each office, or do most work locally, or special applications
>>>written with low bandwidth in mind.
>>>
>>>---
>>>  Les Mikesell
>>>   les at futuresource.com
>>>
>>>
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>>
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