From ssh at tranquility.net Fri Jun 1 00:19:33 2007 From: ssh at tranquility.net (ssh at tranquility.net) Date: Thu, 31 May 2007 19:19:33 -0500 Subject: [K12OSN] CPU vs. RAM for two users In-Reply-To: <465E56F2.6080407@cmosnetworks.com> References: <465C8526.8040206@peopleplaces.org> <465D09F0.9070901@mail.mesd.k12.or.us> <465D91CC.1040305@peopleplaces.org> <1180575049.1267.4.camel@bofh.ltsp> <465E56F2.6080407@cmosnetworks.com> Message-ID: <1180657173.14607.4.camel@bofh.ltsp> Thanks for the tip, Terrell, I knew they were about the same speed-wise (I looked up the 1.8 ghz speed after I posted). You guys who do this on a larger scale will know more abt the CPU's than I. One thing I forgot to mention, the I/O and disks will remain basically the same, just basically changing MOBO/CPU beneath it. Since the existing one is 4.4.x this would be an excellent time to upgrade as well! I have spare disks, so I will probably set up the new one, create the basic users and then copy the /home and custom configs to the new one. thx Scott S. On Thu, 2007-05-31 at 01:02 -0400, "Terrell Prud? Jr." wrote: > With only 2-3 users, you should be fine with 768MB DRAM. Obviously, > more is better, but an AMD 1.8GHz chip (the "2200") will handily > out-run any Pentium-4 of similar clock speed. -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part URL: From rowens at ptd.net Fri Jun 1 01:43:23 2007 From: rowens at ptd.net (Rob Owens) Date: Thu, 31 May 2007 21:43:23 -0400 Subject: [K12OSN] CPU vs. RAM for two users In-Reply-To: <1180575049.1267.4.camel@bofh.ltsp> References: <465C8526.8040206@peopleplaces.org> <465D09F0.9070901@mail.mesd.k12.or.us> <465D91CC.1040305@peopleplaces.org> <1180575049.1267.4.camel@bofh.ltsp> Message-ID: <20070601014323.GB7313@clubber.owens.net> I run a 2.0 Celeron w/ 640 MB at home, typically serving 2 or 3 clients. The CPU is definitely the slow part of this system. I don't seem to swap much, so the RAM is apparently ok. But websites like newegg and amazon really bog it down (I think that's due to their use of java, but I can't be sure). -Rob On Wed, May 30, 2007 at 08:30:49PM -0500, ssh at tranquility.net wrote: > I am going to build a server for two (occasionally three) users from > discarded parts. Given the "hundred meg per client rule", I have two > choices from the junk box. > > 1. AMD 2200 CPU with 768 meg of ram > 2. P4 1.7 ghz CPU with a gig of ram > > I'm aware the 2200 isn't really 2,200 mhz, but given the small user > base, is that enough speed difference to forgo the extra ram? > > thx > Scott S. > _______________________________________________ > K12OSN mailing list > K12OSN at redhat.com > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > For more info see From sbarar at gmail.com Fri Jun 1 02:08:27 2007 From: sbarar at gmail.com (Sudev Barar) Date: Fri, 1 Jun 2007 07:38:27 +0530 Subject: [K12OSN] Are fast disks really that important and why? In-Reply-To: References: <2be970b50705311230v7137bda9l6c0c4a50089af94b@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <774593a20705311908y746d1725ma5c304720894d515@mail.gmail.com> On 01/06/07, Paul VanGundy wrote: > There's definitely a better way to read disk I/O. Try using 'iostat -k > 2' and watch as every two seconds you get a read of your disk I/O as > well as what your cpu utilization is. Pay attention to %iowait as you > look at it also. > Run: #hdparm -tT /dev/sda (for scsi and sata) #hdparm -tT /dev/hsa (for PATA ide) I find the figures returned for cached and buffered disk reads very much in line with my fast/slow experience in running a LTSP network with 35 clients. Money allowing I would always go for raid1 scsi. With cost of one disk and controller already in place one more disk does not take that much extra. As already explained the scsi drives requeue or do parallel queuing to prioritise near by data to the head location resulting in faster user experience. In PATA/SATA queue is processed one by one resulting in large head moments where head may have to travel back and forth as queue are not processed in parallel. This is my understanding till now. However newer sata's are good and i would say if money is constrain then go for raid1 sata's. Why raid1? Avoid the misery of disk going bad on you. It is worth it. HTH -- Regards, Sudev Barar From kdanb at kdanb.com Fri Jun 1 04:53:16 2007 From: kdanb at kdanb.com (Daniel Button) Date: Fri, 01 Jun 2007 00:53:16 -0400 Subject: [K12OSN] Re: K12OSN Digest, Vol 39, Issue 48 In-Reply-To: <20070531160024.80B6D73639@hormel.redhat.com> References: <20070531160024.80B6D73639@hormel.redhat.com> Message-ID: <465FA63C.7000100@kdanb.com> Greg, I ran into a similar problem with setting up the 6020p that I am using. I had to set the video setting from "AUTO" to "VESA". With that change, I have had no issues with the boxes that I am using. Believe me, if I had problems the computer teacher would be eager to tell me.... I am away from the lab, so I can not give you the exact syntax. Sorry that I could not be more specific. Dan Message: 15 Date: Thu, 31 May 2007 09:11:05 -0400 From: "Greg X" Subject: [K12OSN] DevonIT 6030p X term hangs on certain resolutions using LTSP To: k12osn at redhat.com Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed I have to restart client about 4x / day when at higher resolutions (1280x1024). It works fine for a while, but it seems after it's left idle for a a couple hours, it hangs after a few subsequent operations. If I have the edubuntu (7.04) login screen, it doesn't hang (I assume lower resolution). when hung, there's no mouse activity, CTRL-ALT-BACKSPACE is hung too. other terminals on same network are fine when one terminal is hung. happens on both LCD and CRTs anyone have any suggestions? thanks. From microman at cmosnetworks.com Fri Jun 1 04:53:43 2007 From: microman at cmosnetworks.com (Terrell Prude' Jr.) Date: Fri, 01 Jun 2007 00:53:43 -0400 Subject: [K12OSN] CPU vs. RAM for two users In-Reply-To: <1180657173.14607.4.camel@bofh.ltsp> References: <465C8526.8040206@peopleplaces.org> <465D09F0.9070901@mail.mesd.k12.or.us> <465D91CC.1040305@peopleplaces.org> <1180575049.1267.4.camel@bofh.ltsp> <465E56F2.6080407@cmosnetworks.com> <1180657173.14607.4.camel@bofh.ltsp> Message-ID: <465FA657.8070301@cmosnetworks.com> Athlons are considerably faster than P4's, clock for clock. I'd say, of your two choices, go with the Athlon in this case. --TP ssh at tranquility.net wrote: > Thanks for the tip, Terrell, I knew they were about the same speed-wise > (I looked up the 1.8 ghz speed after I posted). You guys who do this on > a larger scale will know more abt the CPU's than I. > > One thing I forgot to mention, the I/O and disks will remain basically > the same, just basically changing MOBO/CPU beneath it. Since the > existing one is 4.4.x this would be an excellent time to upgrade as > well! I have spare disks, so I will probably set up the new one, create > the basic users and then copy the /home and custom configs to the new > one. > > thx > Scott S. > > On Thu, 2007-05-31 at 01:02 -0400, "Terrell Prud? Jr." wrote: > >> With only 2-3 users, you should be fine with 768MB DRAM. Obviously, >> more is better, but an AMD 1.8GHz chip (the "2200") will handily >> out-run any Pentium-4 of similar clock speed From awoehler at woehler.us Fri Jun 1 12:55:10 2007 From: awoehler at woehler.us (Aaron Woehler) Date: Fri, 1 Jun 2007 06:55:10 -0600 Subject: [K12OSN] Moodle Question Generator Message-ID: This may be off topic but I'll risk it since it may help some Moodle math teachers save some time. I've created a page to automatically generate math facts questions: 1+1, 8/3, etc.... http://aschool.us/moodle-scripts/math-questions.php Aaron -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From matrimble at gmail.com Fri Jun 1 13:29:12 2007 From: matrimble at gmail.com (Mark Trimble) Date: Fri, 01 Jun 2007 07:29:12 -0600 Subject: [K12OSN] v6 Questions Message-ID: <46601F28.5000308@gmail.com> Hi, I'm investigating K12LTSP and have a few questions: 1. Does v6 include FreeNX preconfigured? This would be great as I'd like to provide web browser access to remote desktops for my users. 2. Does the Terminal Server profile include DHCP, DNS, and LDAP preconfigured? This wouldn't be so good as the network this server will be placed in already has these services in place and I don't want to bring the network down when I setup the server. 3. Is KDE or Xfce available as a default desktop? 4. Is anyone using fibre-channel SANs with K12LTSP? Thanks in advance for your help and advice! Regards, Mark From steven at simplycircus.com Fri Jun 1 13:47:07 2007 From: steven at simplycircus.com (Steven Santos) Date: Fri, 1 Jun 2007 09:47:07 -0400 Subject: [K12OSN] v6 Questions In-Reply-To: <46601F28.5000308@gmail.com> Message-ID: > Hi, > > I'm investigating K12LTSP and have a few questions: Others will chime in with more authoritive answers, but... > 1. Does v6 include FreeNX preconfigured? This would be great as I'd like > to provide web browser access to remote desktops for my users. I do not think its pre configured, but I know at least a few are running it, and they are usually more than happy to help others get it up and running. > 2. Does the Terminal Server profile include DHCP, DNS, and LDAP > preconfigured? This wouldn't be so good as the network this server will > be placed in already has these services in place and I don't want to > bring the network down when I setup the server. Yes, it does, but only for the private side of the network (where the terminals usually go), not for the public side (where these services usually reside) On the LDAP side K12LTSP has a wonderful script for adding LDAP to a setup. > 3. Is KDE or Xfce available as a default desktop? Yes. > 4. Is anyone using fibre-channel SANs with K12LTSP? I don't know if anyone on this list is, but I know of more than a few that use it with FC, which K12LTSP is based on. From thewhitmers at gmail.com Fri Jun 1 13:53:15 2007 From: thewhitmers at gmail.com (David Whitmer) Date: Fri, 1 Jun 2007 09:53:15 -0400 Subject: [K12OSN] v6 Questions In-Reply-To: References: <46601F28.5000308@gmail.com> Message-ID: On 6/1/07, Steven Santos wrote: > > Hi, > > > > I'm investigating K12LTSP and have a few questions: > > Others will chime in with more authoritive answers, but... > > > 1. Does v6 include FreeNX preconfigured? This would be great as I'd like > > to provide web browser access to remote desktops for my users. > > I do not think its pre configured, but I know at least a few are running it, > and they are usually more than happy to help others get it up and running. > With v6, FreeNX is in the Fedora Extras repository. Also, check http://fedoranews.org/contributors/rick_stout/freenx/ for some extra information on using FreeNX with Fedora, especially regarding the client key. David Whitmer Director of Media & Technology Calvary Schools of Holland (Michigan) web: www.calvaryschoolsholland.org email: thewhitmers at gmail.com From micha at arava.co.il Fri Jun 1 15:10:37 2007 From: micha at arava.co.il (Micha Silver) Date: Fri, 01 Jun 2007 18:10:37 +0300 Subject: [K12OSN] [OT] Downloading GPS data In-Reply-To: <774593a20705282235r5ceade80odf04720ae635b3b8@mail.gmail.com> References: <774593a20705282235r5ceade80odf04720ae635b3b8@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <466036ED.3090606@arava.co.il> I can't help but are you aware of the petition to Garmin to port their software to Linux? http://www.petitiononline.com/Garmin/petition.html Sudev Barar wrote: > This is OT here but with collective wisdom of readers can any one > ppoint me to any resource on command sets to be used for downloading > data from GPS units that connect on to usb ? > > I have tried gpsbable and gpstrans but they provide mostly for garmin > gps's. I am using a gps serial data logger and when i connect through > terminal programm I can acquire real time data. However I want to > download data that has been spooled in the gps memory (sort of file > download). > > Other things tried were mincom and cutecom but as i am not having any > idea of command to initiate download this is as far as i got. And i am > not able to get any information about the gps protocol / device. The > logger model being used is GP50-S from a Taiwanese company, who have > also not responded to my requests for command set. > > They have a Window$ program "GPSTrace" that runs and down loads the > data from logger. As an alternate any way to grab the communication in > a windows machine at the usb port? > > TIA From rowens at bio-chemvalve.com Fri Jun 1 15:25:33 2007 From: rowens at bio-chemvalve.com (Rob Owens) Date: Fri, 1 Jun 2007 11:25:33 -0400 Subject: [K12OSN] graphics problems w/ multiple SCREENs In-Reply-To: <29AEB552E5D40645BA38E82F0939CB08291FD7@MAIL-EXCH.bio-chemvalve.com> Message-ID: <29AEB552E5D40645BA38E82F0939CB08292007@MAIL-EXCH.bio-chemvalve.com> This sure is a lonely thread... I took one of the P3 machines that was giving me trouble with the LCD monitor, and tested it using a CRT. Same problem. So my not-so-educated guess is that there's a glitch in the auto-detection of the video cards in the problem machines. I'll try forcing the vesa driver and see if that has any effect. -Rob -----Original Message----- From: k12osn-bounces at redhat.com [mailto:k12osn-bounces at redhat.com] On Behalf Of Rob Owens Sent: Friday, May 25, 2007 2:35 PM To: Support list for open source software in schools. Subject: RE: [K12OSN] graphics problems w/ multiple SCREENs Some more info: I tested on another client w/ a CRT monitor and the problem did not occur. It still occurs on the machines specified in the emails below. Out of desperation I tried upgrading to rdesktop 1.5, and that did not fix the problem. -Rob -----Original Message----- From: k12osn-bounces at redhat.com [mailto:k12osn-bounces at redhat.com] On Behalf Of Rob Owens Sent: Thursday, May 24, 2007 11:16 AM To: Support list for open source software in schools. Subject: RE: [K12OSN] graphics problems w/ multiple SCREENs I've now also confirmed this problem on another client which has a CRT monitor (same server as #1 and #2, below). Again, this is on K12LTSP 5.0.0EL -Rob -----Original Message----- From: k12osn-bounces at redhat.com [mailto:k12osn-bounces at redhat.com] On Behalf Of Rob Owens Sent: Thursday, May 24, 2007 7:54 AM To: Support list for open source software in schools. Subject: RE: [K12OSN] graphics problems w/ multiple SCREENs I've confirmed the following: 1) This problem exists on two different computers (both computers have the same make/model of lcd monitor, but different video cards) 2) This problem occurs *sometimes* on a laptop that's being used as a thin client. When the problem occurs on this laptop, the graphics are only slightly messed up (a black bar across the bottom of the screen). Toggling back to SCREEN_01 then back to SCREEN_02 usually corrects it. 3) This problem does not occur on my home system, which is LTSP 4.2 on Xubuntu 6.10 I'll test out more machines and post back. Let me know if any of you have any ideas... -Rob -----Original Message----- From: k12osn-bounces at redhat.com [mailto:k12osn-bounces at redhat.com] On Behalf Of Rob Owens Sent: Wednesday, May 23, 2007 12:12 PM To: Support list for open source software in schools. Subject: [K12OSN] graphics problems w/ multiple SCREENs I'm running K12LTSP 5.0.0EL SCREEN_01 = startx SCREEN_02 = rdesktop -f -a 16 10.xxx.xxx.xxx SCREEN_03 = shell All screens work fine, but if I log in to the Windows terminal server on SCREEN_02, then go to SCREEN_01, then back to SCREEN_02, the graphics are unreadable on SCREEN_02. I can "fix" it by toggling to SCREEN_03 and then back to SCREEN_02 -- the graphics go back to normal. Any idea what I can do to fix this? -Rob _______________________________________________ K12OSN mailing list K12OSN at redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn For more info see _______________________________________________ K12OSN mailing list K12OSN at redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn For more info see _______________________________________________ K12OSN mailing list K12OSN at redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn For more info see _______________________________________________ K12OSN mailing list K12OSN at redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn For more info see From lists.john at gmail.com Fri Jun 1 15:29:28 2007 From: lists.john at gmail.com (john ) Date: Fri, 1 Jun 2007 08:29:28 -0700 Subject: [K12OSN] Are fast disks really that important and why? In-Reply-To: <774593a20705311908y746d1725ma5c304720894d515@mail.gmail.com> References: <2be970b50705311230v7137bda9l6c0c4a50089af94b@mail.gmail.com> <774593a20705311908y746d1725ma5c304720894d515@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <2be970b50706010829o5f60c723q371fd2e550458bf5@mail.gmail.com> Thanks Sudev, I think you're probably right. John On 5/31/07, Sudev Barar wrote: > On 01/06/07, Paul VanGundy wrote: > > There's definitely a better way to read disk I/O. Try using 'iostat -k > > 2' and watch as every two seconds you get a read of your disk I/O as > > well as what your cpu utilization is. Pay attention to %iowait as you > > look at it also. > > > > Run: > #hdparm -tT /dev/sda (for scsi and sata) > #hdparm -tT /dev/hsa (for PATA ide) > > I find the figures returned for cached and buffered disk reads very > much in line with my fast/slow experience in running a LTSP network > with 35 clients. Money allowing I would always go for raid1 scsi. With > cost of one disk and controller already in place one more disk does > not take that much extra. > > As already explained the scsi drives requeue or do parallel queuing to > prioritise near by data to the head location resulting in faster user > experience. In PATA/SATA queue is processed one by one resulting in > large head moments where head may have to travel back and forth as > queue are not processed in parallel. This is my understanding till > now. > > However newer sata's are good and i would say if money is constrain > then go for raid1 sata's. Why raid1? Avoid the misery of disk going > bad on you. It is worth it. > > HTH > -- > Regards, > Sudev Barar > > _______________________________________________ > K12OSN mailing list > K12OSN at redhat.com > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > For more info see > From dhuckaby at paasda.org Fri Jun 1 16:32:06 2007 From: dhuckaby at paasda.org (Huck) Date: Fri, 01 Jun 2007 09:32:06 -0700 Subject: [K12OSN] vmware images.. Message-ID: <46604A06.60900@paasda.org> anyone know how to package them up for distribution? I've about completed a vanilla Koha 2.2.9 install... but am unsure of how to make the virtual machine available. create'n it in vmware server --Huck From vceder at canterburyschool.org Fri Jun 1 16:40:51 2007 From: vceder at canterburyschool.org (Vern Ceder) Date: Fri, 01 Jun 2007 12:40:51 -0400 Subject: [K12OSN] vmware images.. In-Reply-To: <46604A06.60900@paasda.org> References: <46604A06.60900@paasda.org> Message-ID: <46604C13.3000103@canterburyschool.org> I don't know if it's the best way, but we have done fine with just shutting down the vm and then tarring or zipping the whole folder... Of course, you might want to add a README with account/password info, etc. Cheers, Vern Huck wrote: > anyone know how to package them up for distribution? > > I've about completed a vanilla Koha 2.2.9 install... > but am unsure of how to make the virtual machine available. > > create'n it in vmware server > > --Huck > > _______________________________________________ > K12OSN mailing list > K12OSN at redhat.com > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > For more info see -- This time for sure! -Bullwinkle J. Moose ----------------------------- Vern Ceder, Director of Technology Canterbury School, 3210 Smith Road, Ft Wayne, IN 46804 vceder at canterburyschool.org; 260-436-0746; FAX: 260-436-5137 From dhbarr at gozelle.com Fri Jun 1 16:44:44 2007 From: dhbarr at gozelle.com (David H. Barr) Date: Fri, 1 Jun 2007 11:44:44 -0500 Subject: [K12OSN] vmware images.. In-Reply-To: <46604A06.60900@paasda.org> References: <46604A06.60900@paasda.org> Message-ID: On 6/1/07, Huck wrote: > anyone know how to package them up for distribution? > > I've about completed a vanilla Koha 2.2.9 install... > but am unsure of how to make the virtual machine available. > > create'n it in vmware server http://www.vmware.com/vmtn/appliances/how_to_build.html Search the page text for "Building a virtual appliance" HTH, -dhbarr. From krsnendu108 at gmail.com Sat Jun 2 07:38:09 2007 From: krsnendu108 at gmail.com (Krsnendu dasa) Date: Sat, 2 Jun 2007 19:38:09 +1200 Subject: [K12OSN] Are fast disks really that important and why? In-Reply-To: <774593a20705311908y746d1725ma5c304720894d515@mail.gmail.com> References: <2be970b50705311230v7137bda9l6c0c4a50089af94b@mail.gmail.com> <774593a20705311908y746d1725ma5c304720894d515@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: How close is SATA2 ncq to the scsi queuing? On 01/06/07, Sudev Barar wrote: > On 01/06/07, Paul VanGundy wrote: > > There's definitely a better way to read disk I/O. Try using 'iostat -k > > 2' and watch as every two seconds you get a read of your disk I/O as > > well as what your cpu utilization is. Pay attention to %iowait as you > > look at it also. > > > > Run: > #hdparm -tT /dev/sda (for scsi and sata) > #hdparm -tT /dev/hsa (for PATA ide) > > I find the figures returned for cached and buffered disk reads very > much in line with my fast/slow experience in running a LTSP network > with 35 clients. Money allowing I would always go for raid1 scsi. With > cost of one disk and controller already in place one more disk does > not take that much extra. > > As already explained the scsi drives requeue or do parallel queuing to > prioritise near by data to the head location resulting in faster user > experience. In PATA/SATA queue is processed one by one resulting in > large head moments where head may have to travel back and forth as > queue are not processed in parallel. This is my understanding till > now. > > However newer sata's are good and i would say if money is constrain > then go for raid1 sata's. Why raid1? Avoid the misery of disk going > bad on you. It is worth it. > > HTH > -- > Regards, > Sudev Barar > > _______________________________________________ > K12OSN mailing list > K12OSN at redhat.com > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > For more info see > From mrjohnlucas at gmail.com Sat Jun 2 12:41:59 2007 From: mrjohnlucas at gmail.com (John Lucas) Date: Sat, 2 Jun 2007 08:41:59 -0400 Subject: [K12OSN] vmware images.. In-Reply-To: <46604A06.60900@paasda.org> References: <46604A06.60900@paasda.org> Message-ID: <200706020841.59187.MrJohnLucas@gmail.com> On Friday 01 June 2007 12:32, Huck wrote: > anyone know how to package them up for distribution? > > I've about completed a vanilla Koha 2.2.9 install... > but am unsure of how to make the virtual machine available. > > create'n it in vmware server > One trick is to keep the size of the VM as small as possible. So here are some steps to take to make it small: - use the smallest virtual disk that is practical - don't pre-allocate disks - keep installation sizes as small as practical - install VMWare Tools (for disk shrinking) - shrink the virtual disk prior to archiving (in order): - in VMWare Server: select VM and then: Edit/Hard Disk/Defragment - in VM run vmware-toolbox and shrink the drive - In order of compression effectiveness, use one of these: - zip archive - gzipped tarball - bzip2ed tarball The regular zip archives are the most portable. All archiving performed with the VM turned off. -- "History doesn't repeat itself; at best it rhymes." - Mark Twain | John Lucas MrJohnLucas at gmail.com | | St. Thomas, VI 00802 http://mrjohnlucas.googlepages.com/ | | 18.3?N, 65?W AST (UTC-4) | From thebobhill at mail.com Sat Jun 2 15:36:19 2007 From: thebobhill at mail.com (Bob Hill) Date: Sat, 02 Jun 2007 11:36:19 -0400 Subject: [K12OSN] Is This A Usable Thin Client For LTSP? In-Reply-To: <29AEB552E5D40645BA38E82F0939CB08292007@MAIL-EXCH.bio-chemvalve.com> References: <29AEB552E5D40645BA38E82F0939CB08292007@MAIL-EXCH.bio-chemvalve.com> Message-ID: <46618E73.1030601@mail.com> Hello group, Would anyone care to comment on whether or not this thin client described below could work well for LTSP? I believe the system has a 32MB DOM. I am inexperienced with DOM's and thin client only machines. Could the etherboot script be placed there? Thanks for any comments. Bob Hill The Optoma ST320 is an easy way to deliver server based applications locally or remotely. No more Bios configuration problems, incorrect drivers or mechanical failures. Everything is ready to go straight out of the box. Thin Client terminals can be set-up with custom configurations, before they reach the end user. Once in place, the OptoViewTM Remote Management software ensures peak performance from your network configuration.* In fact this unit will plug right into your network and can be used as a web browsing terminal immediately! _Specifications_ _Operating System_ *Windows CE4.2 O/S & Integrated I.E. Browser Standard Package Supports RDP/ICA and Secure ICA w Thin Client Terminal w Universal Power Supply Remote Configuration and Management w PS/2 Mouse Image/BIOS Upgrade over FTP/TFTP w Quick Start Card *_Hardware_ *NS Geode GX-1 300/333MHz C.P.U. SDRAM (SO-DIMM) 64MB Flash Memory 32MB Keyboard Locales* _NetWorking_ *10/100 Base-T Fast EtherNet Wake-On-LAN Ready TCP/IP with DNS/WINS and DHCP Point-To-Point Protocol * _Video_ *VESA Monitor Support CRT/LCD Resolution 60 70 72 75 85 640x480 VGA 800x600 SVGA * * * 1024x768 XGA * * * * 1280x1024 SXGA * * * * *_Audio_ *Microphone In Headphones Out Audio Out *_I/O Connectors_ *One DC Jack for Power One RJ-45 for 10/100 Base-T EtherNet Two PS/2 for Mouse & KeyBoard One DB9 for Serial Port (115.2K Baud) One DB25 for Parallel Port (ECP/EPP) Three 3.5" Jacks for Audio One DB15 SVGA Connector Two USB 1.1 Ports* _Indicators_ *Two NetWork Adapter Indicators (Connection Power & Tx/Rx) Power On Indicator *_Power_ *10W Maximum Power Consumption A/C Input 100-240V 50~60Hz *__* From peter at scheie.homedns.org Sat Jun 2 16:13:21 2007 From: peter at scheie.homedns.org (Peter Scheie) Date: Sat, 02 Jun 2007 11:13:21 -0500 Subject: [K12OSN] Are fast disks really that important and why? In-Reply-To: References: <2be970b50705311230v7137bda9l6c0c4a50089af94b@mail.gmail.com> <774593a20705311908y746d1725ma5c304720894d515@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <46619721.60504@scheie.homedns.org> It's getting close to SCSI, but SCSI is still better especially as the number of users (and therefore requests) climbs. I read an article some months ago that explained in detail the evolution of SATA, how compares to SCSI, how SATA2 may be adequate for many (most?) situations, especially when the number of users is smaller, and how in larger multi-user settings SCSI is still best the way to go. I'll see if I can dig that up. Petre Krsnendu dasa wrote: > How close is SATA2 ncq to the scsi queuing? > > On 01/06/07, Sudev Barar wrote: >> On 01/06/07, Paul VanGundy wrote: >> > There's definitely a better way to read disk I/O. Try using 'iostat -k >> > 2' and watch as every two seconds you get a read of your disk I/O as >> > well as what your cpu utilization is. Pay attention to %iowait as you >> > look at it also. >> > >> >> Run: >> #hdparm -tT /dev/sda (for scsi and sata) >> #hdparm -tT /dev/hsa (for PATA ide) >> >> I find the figures returned for cached and buffered disk reads very >> much in line with my fast/slow experience in running a LTSP network >> with 35 clients. Money allowing I would always go for raid1 scsi. With >> cost of one disk and controller already in place one more disk does >> not take that much extra. >> >> As already explained the scsi drives requeue or do parallel queuing to >> prioritise near by data to the head location resulting in faster user >> experience. In PATA/SATA queue is processed one by one resulting in >> large head moments where head may have to travel back and forth as >> queue are not processed in parallel. This is my understanding till >> now. >> >> However newer sata's are good and i would say if money is constrain >> then go for raid1 sata's. Why raid1? Avoid the misery of disk going >> bad on you. It is worth it. >> >> HTH >> -- >> Regards, >> Sudev Barar >> >> _______________________________________________ >> K12OSN mailing list >> K12OSN at redhat.com >> https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn >> For more info see >> > > _______________________________________________ > K12OSN mailing list > K12OSN at redhat.com > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > For more info see > From les at futuresource.com Sat Jun 2 16:12:21 2007 From: les at futuresource.com (Les Mikesell) Date: Sat, 02 Jun 2007 11:12:21 -0500 Subject: [K12OSN] Are fast disks really that important and why? In-Reply-To: References: <2be970b50705311230v7137bda9l6c0c4a50089af94b@mail.gmail.com> <774593a20705311908y746d1725ma5c304720894d515@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <466196E5.2000606@futuresource.com> Krsnendu dasa wrote: > How close is SATA2 ncq to the scsi queuing? It should be equivalent and perhaps even faster because SATA only runs one drive per controller. However you need support in the controller, the drive and the OS and I don't think Linux has it in distribution kernels yet. -- Les Mikesell lesmikesell at gmail.com From peter at scheie.homedns.org Sat Jun 2 16:40:28 2007 From: peter at scheie.homedns.org (Peter Scheie) Date: Sat, 02 Jun 2007 11:40:28 -0500 Subject: [K12OSN] Are fast disks really that important and why? In-Reply-To: <46619721.60504@scheie.homedns.org> References: <2be970b50705311230v7137bda9l6c0c4a50089af94b@mail.gmail.com> <774593a20705311908y746d1725ma5c304720894d515@mail.gmail.com> <46619721.60504@scheie.homedns.org> Message-ID: <46619D7C.8050707@scheie.homedns.org> Can't find the article, but Wikipedia has some good articles the compare SCSI, Serial ATA, Tagged Command Queuing (TCQ, SCSI), and Native Command Queuing (NCQ, SATA). There are also some links to external articles on the matters. Peter Scheie wrote: > It's getting close to SCSI, but SCSI is still better especially as the > number of users (and therefore requests) climbs. I read an article some > months ago that explained in detail the evolution of SATA, how compares > to SCSI, how SATA2 may be adequate for many (most?) situations, > especially when the number of users is smaller, and how in larger > multi-user settings SCSI is still best the way to go. I'll see if I can > dig that up. > > Petre > > Krsnendu dasa wrote: >> How close is SATA2 ncq to the scsi queuing? >> >> On 01/06/07, Sudev Barar wrote: >>> On 01/06/07, Paul VanGundy wrote: >>> > There's definitely a better way to read disk I/O. Try using 'iostat -k >>> > 2' and watch as every two seconds you get a read of your disk I/O as >>> > well as what your cpu utilization is. Pay attention to %iowait as you >>> > look at it also. >>> > >>> >>> Run: >>> #hdparm -tT /dev/sda (for scsi and sata) >>> #hdparm -tT /dev/hsa (for PATA ide) >>> >>> I find the figures returned for cached and buffered disk reads very >>> much in line with my fast/slow experience in running a LTSP network >>> with 35 clients. Money allowing I would always go for raid1 scsi. With >>> cost of one disk and controller already in place one more disk does >>> not take that much extra. >>> >>> As already explained the scsi drives requeue or do parallel queuing to >>> prioritise near by data to the head location resulting in faster user >>> experience. In PATA/SATA queue is processed one by one resulting in >>> large head moments where head may have to travel back and forth as >>> queue are not processed in parallel. This is my understanding till >>> now. >>> >>> However newer sata's are good and i would say if money is constrain >>> then go for raid1 sata's. Why raid1? Avoid the misery of disk going >>> bad on you. It is worth it. >>> >>> HTH >>> -- >>> Regards, >>> Sudev Barar >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> K12OSN mailing list >>> K12OSN at redhat.com >>> https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn >>> For more info see >>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> K12OSN mailing list >> K12OSN at redhat.com >> https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn >> For more info see >> > > _______________________________________________ > K12OSN mailing list > K12OSN at redhat.com > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > For more info see > From jkinney at localnetsolutions.com Sat Jun 2 17:22:20 2007 From: jkinney at localnetsolutions.com (James P. Kinney III) Date: Sat, 02 Jun 2007 13:22:20 -0400 Subject: [K12OSN] Is This A Usable Thin Client For LTSP? In-Reply-To: <46618E73.1030601@mail.com> References: <29AEB552E5D40645BA38E82F0939CB08292007@MAIL-EXCH.bio-chemvalve.com> <46618E73.1030601@mail.com> Message-ID: <1180804940.21501.8.camel@merlin.localnetsolutions.com> That system comes with a version of windows already installed. A. Getting it off may not be possible B. Getting a PXE boot capability may be impossible C. Installing a Linux flash OS may not be possible I would not recommend this device unless you just want to get one and do some tinkering to convert it into an LTSP compatible device. On Sat, 2007-06-02 at 11:36 -0400, Bob Hill wrote: > Hello group, > > Would anyone care to comment on whether or not this thin client > described below could work well for LTSP? I believe the system has a > 32MB DOM. I am inexperienced with DOM's and thin client only > machines. Could the etherboot script be placed there? > > Thanks for any comments. > > Bob Hill > > > The Optoma ST320 is an easy way to deliver server based applications > locally or remotely. > No more Bios configuration problems, incorrect drivers or mechanical > failures. Everything > is ready to go straight out of the box. > > Thin Client terminals can be set-up with custom configurations, before > they reach the end user. > Once in place, the OptoViewTM Remote Management software ensures peak > performance from > your network configuration.* > > In fact this unit will plug right into your network and can be used as a > web browsing terminal immediately! > > _Specifications_ > > _Operating System_ > *Windows CE4.2 O/S & Integrated I.E. Browser Standard Package > Supports RDP/ICA and Secure ICA w Thin Client Terminal > w Universal Power Supply > Remote Configuration and Management w PS/2 Mouse > Image/BIOS Upgrade over FTP/TFTP w Quick Start Card > > *_Hardware_ > *NS Geode GX-1 300/333MHz C.P.U. > SDRAM (SO-DIMM) 64MB > Flash Memory 32MB Keyboard Locales* > > _NetWorking_ > *10/100 Base-T Fast EtherNet > Wake-On-LAN Ready > TCP/IP with DNS/WINS and DHCP > Point-To-Point Protocol > > * > _Video_ > *VESA Monitor Support CRT/LCD > Resolution 60 70 72 75 85 > 640x480 VGA > 800x600 SVGA * * * > 1024x768 XGA * * * * > 1280x1024 SXGA * * * * > > *_Audio_ > *Microphone In > Headphones Out > Audio Out > > *_I/O Connectors_ > *One DC Jack for Power > One RJ-45 for 10/100 Base-T EtherNet > Two PS/2 for Mouse & KeyBoard > One DB9 for Serial Port (115.2K Baud) > One DB25 for Parallel Port (ECP/EPP) > Three 3.5" Jacks for Audio > One DB15 SVGA Connector > Two USB 1.1 Ports* > > _Indicators_ > *Two NetWork Adapter Indicators > (Connection Power & Tx/Rx) > Power On Indicator > > *_Power_ > *10W Maximum Power Consumption > A/C Input 100-240V 50~60Hz > > *__* > > > > _______________________________________________ > K12OSN mailing list > K12OSN at redhat.com > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > For more info see > -- James P. Kinney III CEO & Director of Engineering Local Net Solutions,LLC 770-493-8244 http://www.localnetsolutions.com GPG ID: 829C6CA7 James P. Kinney III (M.S. Physics) Fingerprint = 3C9E 6366 54FC A3FE BA4D 0659 6190 ADC3 829C 6CA7 -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part URL: From peter at scheie.homedns.org Sat Jun 2 21:57:40 2007 From: peter at scheie.homedns.org (Peter Scheie) Date: Sat, 02 Jun 2007 16:57:40 -0500 Subject: [K12OSN] North Central Linux Symposium, June 14 & 15 in Minneapolis Message-ID: <4661E7D4.9020105@scheie.homedns.org> Come one, come all, to the North Central Linux Symposium's "Tux for Education Conference", June 14 & 15 at Hennepin Technical College in Minneapolis, MN. This two-day gathering is all about LTSP and using it in schools, colleges and academies. It's also a great excuse for us LTSP-ers to get together face-to-face. The first day, June 14, Thursday, is a series of presentations by people from this list, to school people from across Minnesota. We've sent out invitations to every college, school district, and private school in the state, inviting them to come learn how K12LTSP can give them ten times the computer resources as using Macs or Windows and do so for less money. In short, it's a day of sharing what we know. Also on hand will be Riaan van Brakel of NetDay in South Africa where they have deployed dozens of K12LTSP labs to poor rural schools. While the first day is BY us LTSP users, the second day is FOR us LTSP users. Jim McQuillan will be there, telling us about the state of LTSP 5; Gideon Romm will talk about the improvements to the sound architecture and what lies ahead; and our own Joe Wiedenmeier will give a presentation on his school's use of Asterisk, the Linux-based PBX project. Storage expert & Samba member Chris Hertel will also be there. The conference is free and is a great time hanging out with other Linux folk. Visit www.nclinux.net for more information. Hope you can join us. Peter Scheie From robark at gmail.com Sat Jun 2 22:21:51 2007 From: robark at gmail.com (Robert Arkiletian) Date: Sat, 2 Jun 2007 15:21:51 -0700 Subject: [K12OSN] Are fast disks really that important and why? In-Reply-To: References: <2be970b50705311230v7137bda9l6c0c4a50089af94b@mail.gmail.com> <774593a20705311908y746d1725ma5c304720894d515@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On 6/2/07, Krsnendu dasa wrote: > How close is SATA2 ncq to the scsi queuing? SCSI uses TCQ (tagged command queing) and SATA uses NCQ (native command queing). They are both supposed to do the same thing. Be able to que requests and reorder them according to a more efficient alogithm to minimize head movement. Some things I have notice. When using stand alone scsi drives (not in a raid array) the que depth was auto set to 32 (Adaptec controller). But when putting the same drive and controller into a software raid 1 the depth dropped to 4. I'm guessing this is probably due to the fact that linux software raid already does some deciding which drive head in the array is closer to the requested data. In addition, SATA NCQ is still relatively new, both in terms of kernel support (2.6.18) and hardware support. It requires the drive, controller and driver to support it. Here is an excerpt from a recent LKML discussion regarding HD's that have been blacklisted in terms of ncq support. http://www.mail-archive.com/git-commits-head at vger.kernel.org/msg08460.html [ I'm personally starting to wonder whether we shouldn't disable NCQ by default, and perhaps have a white-list. There seems to be a *lot* of drives that do this wrong.. - Linus ] I think SATA ncq was originally pioneered by Intel and Seagate. Hence, right now the best consumer grade support for it in terms of controllers are Intel's southbridges (like the ICH7R or ICH8R) as they use the intel open spec (AHCI) Advanced Host Controller Interface. The other one is the sil_sata24 driver which is used by the Silicon Image sil3124 (pci-x) and sil3132 (pci-e) chipsets. Jeff Garzik, a RedHat employee, is THE MAN when it comes to this stuff. He develops the libata drivers for the linux kernel http://linux-ata.org/driver-status.html Don't forget one thing, the slowest part of a HD is the mechanical motion. SCSI comes in 15,000 rpm flavour. This really reduces data aquisition latency in two ways. Firstly, the time for the data to spin around to be under the head. Second, 15k rpm drives have smaller size disks in order to deal with the greater vibration from such a fast rpm. Hence, 15k drives are basically short stroked. So the head does not have to travel very far from the beginning of the disk to the end. Not to mention SCSI disks are generally built with longer MTBF. Bottom line, if you can afford it, SCSI is still the best. I would recommend SAS (Serial Attached SCSI). The reason enterprises are using SATA is the price/GB and the size of the drives. You can now buy 1TB (1000GB) SATA drives. If you have big storage needs then SATA definitely makes sense. Usually with an LSI MegaRAID 300-8x or 3ware 9550sx SATA RAID controller. -- Robert Arkiletian Eric Hamber Secondary, Vancouver, Canada Fl_TeacherTool http://www3.telus.net/public/robark/Fl_TeacherTool/ C++ GUI tutorial http://www3.telus.net/public/robark/ From caldodge at gmail.com Sat Jun 2 23:18:24 2007 From: caldodge at gmail.com (Calvin Dodge) Date: Sat, 2 Jun 2007 17:18:24 -0600 Subject: [K12OSN] Are fast disks really that important and why? In-Reply-To: References: <2be970b50705311230v7137bda9l6c0c4a50089af94b@mail.gmail.com> <774593a20705311908y746d1725ma5c304720894d515@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <824a5f7a0706021618n778c2560tacf0a818d51ba3ea@mail.gmail.com> On 6/2/07, Robert Arkiletian wrote: > On 6/2/07, Krsnendu dasa wrote: > > How close is SATA2 ncq to the scsi queuing? > > Not to mention SCSI disks are generally built with longer MTBF. > Bottom line, if you can afford it, SCSI is still the best. I would > recommend SAS (Serial Attached SCSI). If I might add a contrary view - two surveys of large numbers of hard drives were released a few months ago. Unfortunately, they didn't mention brand names, although they did say some brands were far more reliable than others. They _did_ say there was little practical difference in reliability between SCSI and SATA drives. > The reason enterprises are using SATA is the price/GB and the size of > the drives. You can now buy 1TB (1000GB) SATA drives. If you have big > storage needs then SATA definitely makes sense. Usually with an LSI > MegaRAID 300-8x or 3ware 9550sx SATA RAID controller. I'd be inclined to use SCSI for system (programs, etc.) and swap, and SATA for /home and Windows profiles (because users always want more space). Calvin From sbarar at gmail.com Sun Jun 3 00:49:31 2007 From: sbarar at gmail.com (Sudev Barar) Date: Sun, 3 Jun 2007 06:19:31 +0530 Subject: [K12OSN] Are fast disks really that important and why? In-Reply-To: <824a5f7a0706021618n778c2560tacf0a818d51ba3ea@mail.gmail.com> References: <2be970b50705311230v7137bda9l6c0c4a50089af94b@mail.gmail.com> <774593a20705311908y746d1725ma5c304720894d515@mail.gmail.com> <824a5f7a0706021618n778c2560tacf0a818d51ba3ea@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <774593a20706021749y264a7f75w76e5b9780c934105@mail.gmail.com> On 03/06/07, Calvin Dodge wrote: [SNIP] > If I might add a contrary view - two surveys of large numbers of hard > drives were released a few months ago. Unfortunately, they didn't > mention brand names, although they did say some brands were far more > reliable than others. They _did_ say there was little practical > difference in reliability between SCSI and SATA drives. [SNIP] > I'd be inclined to use SCSI for system (programs, etc.) and swap, and > SATA for /home and Windows profiles (because users always want more > space). Normally surveys mentioned would be looking at performance parameters for a single user desktops. Am I correct in this assumption? Since there is no link to study I can not give a informed opinion. I would say it should be other way around. Reads are faster than writes. I run my system with sata/pata for / and scsi for /home /var as that is where multiple queue for read write are occurring. -- Regards, Sudev Barar From caldodge at gmail.com Sun Jun 3 01:16:02 2007 From: caldodge at gmail.com (Calvin Dodge) Date: Sat, 2 Jun 2007 19:16:02 -0600 Subject: [K12OSN] Are fast disks really that important and why? In-Reply-To: <774593a20706021749y264a7f75w76e5b9780c934105@mail.gmail.com> References: <2be970b50705311230v7137bda9l6c0c4a50089af94b@mail.gmail.com> <774593a20705311908y746d1725ma5c304720894d515@mail.gmail.com> <824a5f7a0706021618n778c2560tacf0a818d51ba3ea@mail.gmail.com> <774593a20706021749y264a7f75w76e5b9780c934105@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <824a5f7a0706021816j33dafdadxe7cf9a894e86296b@mail.gmail.com> On 6/2/07, Sudev Barar wrote: > On 03/06/07, Calvin Dodge wrote: > [SNIP] > > Normally surveys mentioned would be looking at performance parameters > for a single user desktops. Am I correct in this assumption? Since No. The studies (there were two different studies, but Google was the only one which stuck in my mind) were from server farms, not single-user desktops. Both surveys were concerned with disk reliability and lifespan, not performance. That was my point, when I said: > > reliable than others. They _did_ say there was little practical > > difference in reliability between SCSI and SATA drives. > there is no link to study I can not give a informed opinion. Sorry. Here they are. Google's study results are at http://labs.google.com/papers/disk_failures.pdf. My memory was a little off - the survey which showed little difference in reliability between SCSI (and FC) drives and SATA drives was at http://www.usenix.org/events/fast07/tech/schroeder/schroeder.pdf. A synopsis of this paper is at http://www.usenix.org/events/fast07/tech/schroeder.html Calvin From julius at turtle.com Sun Jun 3 16:32:39 2007 From: julius at turtle.com (Julius Szelagiewicz) Date: Sun, 3 Jun 2007 12:32:39 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [K12OSN] missing libperl.co Message-ID: Dear Folks, I'm happily running K12 V7 on my laptop with just a few hiccups. One major hiccup is the lack of libperl.so. Vnc server won't run without it. I tried reloading perl, but it didn't help. Advice, please. julius From shishirjh at gmail.com Sun Jun 3 17:28:03 2007 From: shishirjh at gmail.com (Shishir Jha) Date: Sun, 3 Jun 2007 23:13:03 +0545 Subject: [K12OSN] Any news about K12LTSP 7 Message-ID: <6a2207a10706031028i4f83731ajb7691929c476b1b6@mail.gmail.com> Hi, Just was curious to know whether k12LTSP v7 is in plans or not. And if yes then which version of LTSP is going to incorporated in it. We are currently using K12LTSP 5 and are thinking of upgrading to newer version. We have been trying out Edubuntu 7.04 for test and are giving it a thought due to its ease with Pulseaudio and LTSP 5. But as we have been using K12 I dont want to change to debian based Linux from .rpm based system. So guys, if anybody knows about any plans for K12LTSP and its detail, please do share it with me so that I can decide what to do and whether to upgrade or wait for release of version 7 of K12 -- Shishir Jha EPC 1970,GPO 8975, KTM,NEPAL From dyoung at mesd.k12.or.us Sun Jun 3 22:55:23 2007 From: dyoung at mesd.k12.or.us (Dan Young) Date: Sun, 3 Jun 2007 15:55:23 -0700 Subject: [K12OSN] missing libperl.co In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <994441ae0706031555n6cc71823qd75f47ebf7a4c364@mail.gmail.com> On 6/3/07, Julius Szelagiewicz wrote: > I'm happily running K12 V7 on my laptop with just a few hiccups. > One major hiccup is the lack of libperl.so. Vnc server won't run without > it. I tried reloading perl, but it didn't help. Advice, please. Since Eric hasn't rolled K12LTSP v7, I take it to mean you upgraded to Fedora 7 from a K12LTSP 6 box? ISTR a split in the perl packages, with libperl getting it's own package. Try "yum install perl-libs". -- Dan Young Multnomah ESD - Technology Services 503-257-1562 From julius at turtle.com Mon Jun 4 02:38:54 2007 From: julius at turtle.com (Julius Szelagiewicz) Date: Sun, 3 Jun 2007 22:38:54 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [K12OSN] missing libperl.co - resolved In-Reply-To: <994441ae0706031555n6cc71823qd75f47ebf7a4c364@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On Sun, 3 Jun 2007, Dan Young wrote: > On 6/3/07, Julius Szelagiewicz wrote: > > I'm happily running K12 V7 on my laptop with just a few hiccups. > > One major hiccup is the lack of libperl.so. Vnc server won't run without > > it. I tried reloading perl, but it didn't help. Advice, please. > > Since Eric hasn't rolled K12LTSP v7, I take it to mean you upgraded to > Fedora 7 from a K12LTSP 6 box? > > ISTR a split in the perl packages, with libperl getting it's own > package. Try "yum install perl-libs". > Dan, I actually used Eric's "look Ma, it boots!" test release of K12 v7, and it does way more than just boot. As a matter of fact -all- my production stuff works (now), which makes me a bad beta tester. Thank you for the suggestion. Installing perl-libs did the trick. julius From dyoung at mesd.k12.or.us Mon Jun 4 03:26:53 2007 From: dyoung at mesd.k12.or.us (Dan Young) Date: Sun, 3 Jun 2007 20:26:53 -0700 Subject: [K12OSN] missing libperl.co - resolved In-Reply-To: References: <994441ae0706031555n6cc71823qd75f47ebf7a4c364@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <994441ae0706032026n4070b8d4ua48ce8631b5895bb@mail.gmail.com> On 6/3/07, Julius Szelagiewicz wrote: > I actually used Eric's "look Ma, it boots!" test release of K12 > v7, and it does way more than just boot. As a matter of fact -all- my > production stuff works (now), which makes me a bad beta tester. Heck, I missed that he put out a beta. Makes me a worse beta tester. ;-) -- Dan Young Multnomah ESD - Technology Services 503-257-1562 From microman at cmosnetworks.com Mon Jun 4 06:01:47 2007 From: microman at cmosnetworks.com (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?=22Terrell_Prud=E9_Jr=2E=22?=) Date: Mon, 04 Jun 2007 02:01:47 -0400 Subject: [K12OSN] Are fast disks really that important and why? In-Reply-To: References: <2be970b50705311230v7137bda9l6c0c4a50089af94b@mail.gmail.com> <774593a20705311908y746d1725ma5c304720894d515@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <4663AACB.4000200@cmosnetworks.com> > The reason enterprises are using SATA is the price/GB and the size of > the drives. You can now buy 1TB (1000GB) SATA drives. If you have big > storage needs then SATA definitely makes sense. Usually with an LSI > MegaRAID 300-8x or 3ware 9550sx SATA RAID controller. LSI MegaRAID, I agree; I'm buying a MegaRAID 150-6 SATA card for my own SATA home array, for testing and playing. 3ware, no thanks. They don't open their specs (LSI, by contrast, does), and their RAID management tools are binary blobs. --TP From nils at breun.nl Mon Jun 4 12:35:32 2007 From: nils at breun.nl (Nils Breunese) Date: Mon, 4 Jun 2007 14:35:32 +0200 Subject: [K12OSN] missing libperl.co - resolved In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <0AD20F8D-EFE9-4E44-A7F2-23D9281BD5F5@breun.nl> Julius Szelagiewicz wrote: > On Sun, 3 Jun 2007, Dan Young wrote: > >> On 6/3/07, Julius Szelagiewicz wrote: >>> I'm happily running K12 V7 on my laptop with just a few >>> hiccups. >>> One major hiccup is the lack of libperl.so. Vnc server won't run >>> without >>> it. I tried reloading perl, but it didn't help. Advice, please. >> >> Since Eric hasn't rolled K12LTSP v7, I take it to mean you >> upgraded to >> Fedora 7 from a K12LTSP 6 box? >> >> ISTR a split in the perl packages, with libperl getting it's own >> package. Try "yum install perl-libs". >> > Dan, > I actually used Eric's "look Ma, it boots!" test release of K12 > v7, and it does way more than just boot. As a matter of fact -all- my > production stuff works (now), which makes me a bad beta tester. > Thank you for the suggestion. Installing perl-libs did the trick. If that was the problem, shouldn't a dependency on perl-libs be added to the vnc server package? That way yum would have just installed perl-libs when you installed the vnc server and there would have been no problem. Nils Breunese. -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: PGP.sig Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 186 bytes Desc: Dit deel van het bericht is digitaal ondertekend URL: From nils at breun.nl Mon Jun 4 12:38:06 2007 From: nils at breun.nl (Nils Breunese) Date: Mon, 4 Jun 2007 14:38:06 +0200 Subject: [K12OSN] Are fast disks really that important and why? In-Reply-To: <4663AACB.4000200@cmosnetworks.com> References: <2be970b50705311230v7137bda9l6c0c4a50089af94b@mail.gmail.com> <774593a20705311908y746d1725ma5c304720894d515@mail.gmail.com> <4663AACB.4000200@cmosnetworks.com> Message-ID: <3AACA2FF-CA0C-4064-A1B3-67242D6379B2@breun.nl> Terrell Prud? Jr. wrote: >> The reason enterprises are using SATA is the price/GB and the size of >> the drives. You can now buy 1TB (1000GB) SATA drives. If you have big >> storage needs then SATA definitely makes sense. Usually with an LSI >> MegaRAID 300-8x or 3ware 9550sx SATA RAID controller. > > LSI MegaRAID, I agree; I'm buying a MegaRAID 150-6 SATA card for my > own > SATA home array, for testing and playing. > > 3ware, no thanks. They don't open their specs (LSI, by contrast, > does), > and their RAID management tools are binary blobs. 3ware might not be totally open source compliant, but their stuff does seem to work pretty good. Nils Breunese. -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: PGP.sig Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 186 bytes Desc: Dit deel van het bericht is digitaal ondertekend URL: From mblinn at peopleplaces.org Mon Jun 4 12:40:33 2007 From: mblinn at peopleplaces.org (Michael Blinn) Date: Mon, 04 Jun 2007 08:40:33 -0400 Subject: [K12OSN] LTSP Term 1225 Etherboot video Message-ID: <46640841.4060203@peopleplaces.org> Hey folks - I just received my LTSP Term 1225 in the mail today - I went through installing the custom via XServer and specifying the VideoRam in lts.conf and it boots up great. The issue I'm having is when I play a video using totem or mplayer the videos are a solid shade of grey or green. Sound comes through fine. These videos play on other terminals. Has anyone else run into this issue? I figured I'd ask quickly here before calling up their paid support. Thanks, Michael From brcisna at eazylivin.net Mon Jun 4 12:56:12 2007 From: brcisna at eazylivin.net (Barry Cisna) Date: Mon, 4 Jun 2007 07:56:12 -0500 (CDT) Subject: [K12OSN] general acceptance of k12ltsp in schools Message-ID: <36660.216.24.126.67.1180961772.squirrel@www.eazylivin.net> Hello All, I've posted this same question about once a year , in the past,( Since first version of K12LTSP) just wondering what the general outlook or thoughts are of teachers, School administrators, students,in regards to how k12ltsp ,is being accepted. Id like to know from the sysadmins, network gurus( trenchpeople like me ) point of view. Throw in your 2 cents to let others see how their school compares to everyone else's in this scenario. As I stated before it appears to be a matter of IF the Superintendent is "open minded" enough to at least take a look at altenatives to MS$. Our Super that was at this school was very much so. Super, changed,Now things are not that way,,,:(... " It's a Microsoft world out there, whether you like it or not". Enough said,,,:(. Bummer. The best statement I heard was from a poster a couple years ago, that said ." These people are frustrated with the system they have , and they will continue to be frustrated with the system they have, until they are willing to embrace new ideas on school network systems". Enough said,again. As I've stated before, I guess the way to look at this thought process is the postive. =Job security, MS$ = virused up,,filesystems going down,HD's dying,spend,spend $$$ ,etc :). Take Care Barry Cisna From rmcdaniel at indata.us Mon Jun 4 13:47:55 2007 From: rmcdaniel at indata.us (rmcdaniel at indata.us) Date: Mon, 04 Jun 2007 06:47:55 -0700 Subject: [K12OSN] general acceptance of k12ltsp in schools Message-ID: <20070604064755.d7061e97b78b017ac15395d64f2ce134.ccc2be37db.wbe@email.secureserver.net> Barry, K12LTSP has been openly accepted in our school system. I have always taken the "show me" approach in introducing something new. Since there isn't any cost, it makes it very easy to demonstrate the advantages of K12LTSP and other open source offerings. I am going to be speaking at AETC, Alabama Education Technology Conference, next week on 3 open source solutions, K12LTSP, Asterisk, and Joomla. I will follow up after the conference and give some feedback regarding input that I receive from the attendees. Ron Ronald R. McDaniel Technology Coordinator Conecuh County Schools (251) 578-1752 x30 (251) 363-3201 cell 1*4238*104 SouthernLinc rmcdaniel at indata.us "open your mind to open source" > -------- Original Message -------- > Subject: [K12OSN] general acceptance of k12ltsp in schools > From: Barry Cisna > Date: Mon, June 04, 2007 7:56 am > To: k12osn at redhat.com > > Hello All, > > I've posted this same question about once a year , in the past,( Since > first version of K12LTSP) just wondering what the general outlook or > thoughts are of teachers, School administrators, students,in regards to > how k12ltsp ,is being accepted. Id like to know from the sysadmins, > network gurus( trenchpeople like me ) point of view. > Throw in your 2 cents to let others see how their school compares to > everyone else's in this scenario. > As I stated before it appears to be a matter of IF the Superintendent is > "open minded" enough to at least take a look at altenatives to MS$. Our > Super that was at this school was very much so. Super, changed,Now things > are not that way,,,:(... > " It's a Microsoft world out there, whether you like it or not". Enough > said,,,:(. > Bummer. > The best statement I heard was from a poster a couple years ago, that > said > ." These people are frustrated with the system they have , and they will > continue to be frustrated with the system they have, until they are > willing to embrace new ideas on school network systems". Enough > said,again. > As I've stated before, I guess the way to look at this thought process is > the postive. =Job security, MS$ = virused up,,filesystems going down,HD's > dying,spend,spend $$$ ,etc :). > > Take Care > > Barry Cisna > > _______________________________________________ > K12OSN mailing list > K12OSN at redhat.com > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > For more info see From dhuckaby at paasda.org Mon Jun 4 14:24:47 2007 From: dhuckaby at paasda.org (Huck) Date: Mon, 04 Jun 2007 07:24:47 -0700 Subject: [K12OSN] general acceptance of k12ltsp in schools In-Reply-To: <36660.216.24.126.67.1180961772.squirrel@www.eazylivin.net> References: <36660.216.24.126.67.1180961772.squirrel@www.eazylivin.net> Message-ID: <466420AF.5020707@paasda.org> I find it's accepted for the most part... there are students who feel for their thousands of dollars(private high school) they should be getting stand alone blazing fast bleeding edge workstations to browse and write papers with in the library though. At the elementary school it's greatly accepted keeps the cost of having a fully functional lab WAY DOWN, just a semi-steep learning curve for the teachers(solved with training when possible) who arguably are more burdened than at the high school. --Huck Barry Cisna wrote: > Hello All, > > I've posted this same question about once a year , in the past,( Since > first version of K12LTSP) just wondering what the general outlook or > thoughts are of teachers, School administrators, students,in regards to > how k12ltsp ,is being accepted. Id like to know from the sysadmins, > network gurus( trenchpeople like me ) point of view. > Throw in your 2 cents to let others see how their school compares to > everyone else's in this scenario. > As I stated before it appears to be a matter of IF the Superintendent is > "open minded" enough to at least take a look at altenatives to MS$. Our > Super that was at this school was very much so. Super, changed,Now things > are not that way,,,:(... > " It's a Microsoft world out there, whether you like it or not". Enough > said,,,:(. > Bummer. > The best statement I heard was from a poster a couple years ago, that said > ." These people are frustrated with the system they have , and they will > continue to be frustrated with the system they have, until they are > willing to embrace new ideas on school network systems". Enough > said,again. > As I've stated before, I guess the way to look at this thought process is > the postive. =Job security, MS$ = virused up,,filesystems going down,HD's > dying,spend,spend $$$ ,etc :). > > Take Care > > Barry Cisna > > _______________________________________________ > K12OSN mailing list > K12OSN at redhat.com > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > For more info see > > From sbarar at gmail.com Mon Jun 4 14:33:27 2007 From: sbarar at gmail.com (Sudev Barar) Date: Mon, 4 Jun 2007 20:03:27 +0530 Subject: [K12OSN] [Likely OT] Getting sound working Message-ID: <774593a20706040733j5ca0c830h60d9a9e1c6f40656@mail.gmail.com> I am trying to tweak my laptop (HP Pavillion tx1000) to get sound working. The results of trying so far have been: 1. Tried with Debian Etch / Ubuntu 7.04 2. The sound module that is loaded is snd-hda-intel 3. On boot the sound system does not star0 and the mute button-cum-indicator turn orange. 4. If I blacklist the module snd-hda-intel then I am able to try with various additional options by adding option snd-hda-intel model=????? in /etc/modprobe.d/alsa-base This allows me to boot without loading any sound modules without the mute button going orange till I actually load the module with modprobe command. 5. I have not been able to find exact option that will work. Have tried 3stack 3stack-dig hp auto etc. What further areas I should be looking at? If needed I can post outputs from lsmod lspci etc. I am trying to google and search high and low for any one having working solution to this. I thought collective wisdom on this list may give me some pointers. TIA -- Regards, Sudev Barar From brcisna at eazylivin.net Mon Jun 4 14:45:25 2007 From: brcisna at eazylivin.net (Barry Cisna) Date: Mon, 4 Jun 2007 09:45:25 -0500 (CDT) Subject: [K12OSN] [Likely OT] Getting sound working Message-ID: <43564.216.24.126.67.1180968325.squirrel@www.eazylivin.net> Sudev, This will not help you any but I had the exact same problem on an Intel chipped laptop sometime back. I wrangled with it for sometime. I came to the conclusion it had something to do with the BIOS's IRQ sharing between the sound chipset and the internal modem,and or PCMCIA slot which is kinda/sorta ISA based. I tried all different configs in the BIOS and nothing resolved it. I finally gave up as this was just a " I want to make this work" kind of thing, and the laptop was not really going to be used as an K12LTSP client machine in reality,anyway. As I recall in googling when I was trying this, someone had compiled some sort of generic driver for the intel laptop chipset and had it working thin client but I can not remember what the particulars were on it. I tried doing the "howto" that this individual had posted but never got it to actually work. Let us know if/when you get the sound working on this machine. Take Care, Barry Cisna From matrimble at gmail.com Mon Jun 4 15:09:15 2007 From: matrimble at gmail.com (Mark Trimble) Date: Mon, 04 Jun 2007 09:09:15 -0600 Subject: [K12OSN] Reasons to Use LVM Message-ID: <46642B1B.6050502@gmail.com> Hi, I'm running Compaq hardware RAIDs and was wondering if there's any compelling reasons to use LVM in my K12LTSP v6 installation. I've used LVM in the past on Debian/Skolelinux installations and then it only seemed to complicate hard disk administration without offering any apparent benefits. Regards, Mark From henryhartley at westat.com Mon Jun 4 15:19:08 2007 From: henryhartley at westat.com (Henry Hartley) Date: Mon, 4 Jun 2007 11:19:08 -0400 Subject: [K12OSN] Any news about K12LTSP 7 In-Reply-To: <6a2207a10706031028i4f83731ajb7691929c476b1b6@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <403593359CA56C4CAE1F8F4F00DCFE7D07E20068@MAILBE2.westat.com> Shishir Jha wrote: >> Just was curious to know whether k12LTSP v7 is in plans or not. >> And if yes then which version of LTSP is going to incorporated >> in it. We are currently using K12LTSP 5 and are thinking of >> upgrading to newer version. We have been trying out Edubuntu >> 7.04 for test and are giving it a thought due to its ease with >> Pulseaudio and LTSP 5. But as we have been using K12 I dont >> want to change to debian based Linux from .rpm based system. >> >> So guys, if anybody knows about any plans for K12LTSP and its >> detail, please do share it with me so that I can decide what >> to do and whether to upgrade or wait for release of version 7 >> of K12 On Monday, May 07, 2007 6:30 PM, Eric Harrison wrote: >> For those of you who like your bleeding-edge with extra blood, I >> have a first "rough-draft" of K12LTSP 7.0. >> >> This is based on Fedora 7 test 4 and is at the "look Mom, it >> booted!" stage of development ;-) >> >> ftp://k12linux.mesd.k12.or.us/pub/K12LTSP/testing/7.0.0-32bit/iso/ >> http://k12linux.mesd.k12.or.us/K12LTSP/testing/7.0.0-32bit/iso/ >> rsync -Pav k12linux.mesd.k12.or.us::testing/7.0.0-32bit/iso/ . -- Henry From rowens at bio-chemvalve.com Mon Jun 4 15:31:10 2007 From: rowens at bio-chemvalve.com (Rob Owens) Date: Mon, 4 Jun 2007 11:31:10 -0400 Subject: [K12OSN] graphics problems w/ multiple SCREENs In-Reply-To: <29AEB552E5D40645BA38E82F0939CB08292007@MAIL-EXCH.bio-chemvalve.com> Message-ID: <29AEB552E5D40645BA38E82F0939CB0829200C@MAIL-EXCH.bio-chemvalve.com> Forcing the vesa driver seemed to be an improvement, but it did not completely fix the problem. I say it was an improvement because it went from being a problem 100% of the time, to being a problem about 50% of the time. Weird. -Rob -----Original Message----- From: k12osn-bounces at redhat.com [mailto:k12osn-bounces at redhat.com] On Behalf Of Rob Owens Sent: Friday, June 01, 2007 11:26 AM To: Support list for open source software in schools. Subject: RE: [K12OSN] graphics problems w/ multiple SCREENs This sure is a lonely thread... I took one of the P3 machines that was giving me trouble with the LCD monitor, and tested it using a CRT. Same problem. So my not-so-educated guess is that there's a glitch in the auto-detection of the video cards in the problem machines. I'll try forcing the vesa driver and see if that has any effect. -Rob -----Original Message----- From: k12osn-bounces at redhat.com [mailto:k12osn-bounces at redhat.com] On Behalf Of Rob Owens Sent: Friday, May 25, 2007 2:35 PM To: Support list for open source software in schools. Subject: RE: [K12OSN] graphics problems w/ multiple SCREENs Some more info: I tested on another client w/ a CRT monitor and the problem did not occur. It still occurs on the machines specified in the emails below. Out of desperation I tried upgrading to rdesktop 1.5, and that did not fix the problem. -Rob -----Original Message----- From: k12osn-bounces at redhat.com [mailto:k12osn-bounces at redhat.com] On Behalf Of Rob Owens Sent: Thursday, May 24, 2007 11:16 AM To: Support list for open source software in schools. Subject: RE: [K12OSN] graphics problems w/ multiple SCREENs I've now also confirmed this problem on another client which has a CRT monitor (same server as #1 and #2, below). Again, this is on K12LTSP 5.0.0EL -Rob -----Original Message----- From: k12osn-bounces at redhat.com [mailto:k12osn-bounces at redhat.com] On Behalf Of Rob Owens Sent: Thursday, May 24, 2007 7:54 AM To: Support list for open source software in schools. Subject: RE: [K12OSN] graphics problems w/ multiple SCREENs I've confirmed the following: 1) This problem exists on two different computers (both computers have the same make/model of lcd monitor, but different video cards) 2) This problem occurs *sometimes* on a laptop that's being used as a thin client. When the problem occurs on this laptop, the graphics are only slightly messed up (a black bar across the bottom of the screen). Toggling back to SCREEN_01 then back to SCREEN_02 usually corrects it. 3) This problem does not occur on my home system, which is LTSP 4.2 on Xubuntu 6.10 I'll test out more machines and post back. Let me know if any of you have any ideas... -Rob -----Original Message----- From: k12osn-bounces at redhat.com [mailto:k12osn-bounces at redhat.com] On Behalf Of Rob Owens Sent: Wednesday, May 23, 2007 12:12 PM To: Support list for open source software in schools. Subject: [K12OSN] graphics problems w/ multiple SCREENs I'm running K12LTSP 5.0.0EL SCREEN_01 = startx SCREEN_02 = rdesktop -f -a 16 10.xxx.xxx.xxx SCREEN_03 = shell All screens work fine, but if I log in to the Windows terminal server on SCREEN_02, then go to SCREEN_01, then back to SCREEN_02, the graphics are unreadable on SCREEN_02. I can "fix" it by toggling to SCREEN_03 and then back to SCREEN_02 -- the graphics go back to normal. Any idea what I can do to fix this? -Rob _______________________________________________ K12OSN mailing list K12OSN at redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn For more info see _______________________________________________ K12OSN mailing list K12OSN at redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn For more info see _______________________________________________ K12OSN mailing list K12OSN at redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn For more info see _______________________________________________ K12OSN mailing list K12OSN at redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn For more info see _______________________________________________ K12OSN mailing list K12OSN at redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn For more info see From dhuckaby at paasda.org Mon Jun 4 15:39:08 2007 From: dhuckaby at paasda.org (Huck) Date: Mon, 04 Jun 2007 08:39:08 -0700 Subject: [K12OSN] first k12ltsp 7.0 test build In-Reply-To: <463FA84B.7040700@mail.mesd.k12.or.us> References: <463FA84B.7040700@mail.mesd.k12.or.us> Message-ID: <4664321C.2010102@paasda.org> Eric, will further 'updates' be installable with a mere 'yum upgrade' by chance? Or not so lucky? =) --Huck Eric Harrison wrote: > For those of you who like your bleeding-edge with extra blood, I have a > first "rough-draft" of K12LTSP 7.0. > > This is based on Fedora 7 test 4 and is at the "look Mom, it booted!" > stage of development ;-) > > > ftp://k12linux.mesd.k12.or.us/pub/K12LTSP/testing/7.0.0-32bit/iso/ > http://k12linux.mesd.k12.or.us/K12LTSP/testing/7.0.0-32bit/iso/ > rsync -Pav k12linux.mesd.k12.or.us::testing/7.0.0-32bit/iso/ . > > > -Eric > > _______________________________________________ > K12OSN mailing list > K12OSN at redhat.com > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > For more info see > > From carl at snarlnet.com Mon Jun 4 15:35:00 2007 From: carl at snarlnet.com (Carl Keil) Date: Mon, 04 Jun 2007 08:35:00 -0700 Subject: [K12OSN] Best mp3 player for use with thin client Message-ID: <46643124.8020901@snarlnet.com> Hi Folks, I've got my daughter on a k12ltsp 5 thin client. It's an NTAVO 6030. But now she wants an iPod, like all her friends. Is there an MP3 player out there that will work off her thin client? I think all the stuff she wants to carry is straight up mp3 with no DRM anything. ck From rowens at bio-chemvalve.com Mon Jun 4 15:41:24 2007 From: rowens at bio-chemvalve.com (Rob Owens) Date: Mon, 4 Jun 2007 11:41:24 -0400 Subject: [K12OSN] Best mp3 player for use with thin client In-Reply-To: <46643124.8020901@snarlnet.com> Message-ID: <29AEB552E5D40645BA38E82F0939CB0829200D@MAIL-EXCH.bio-chemvalve.com> I would start by looking here: http://wiki.xiph.org/VorbisHardware I don't own one, but a while ago I picked out this one if I was to buy a portable music player: http://www.amazon.com/iAudio-MP3-Player-Tuner-Black/dp/B000GTQJ8W/ref=pd _bbs_sr_6/102-0965531-7906554?ie=UTF8&s=electronics&qid=1180971425&sr=8- 6 It advertises that it works with Linux, plays ogg vorbis, has 2GB storage, and costs $80. Sounds good to me. It got good customer reviews on Amazon. -Rob -----Original Message----- From: k12osn-bounces at redhat.com [mailto:k12osn-bounces at redhat.com] On Behalf Of Carl Keil Sent: Monday, June 04, 2007 11:35 AM To: k12osn at redhat.com Subject: [K12OSN] Best mp3 player for use with thin client Hi Folks, I've got my daughter on a k12ltsp 5 thin client. It's an NTAVO 6030. But now she wants an iPod, like all her friends. Is there an MP3 player out there that will work off her thin client? I think all the stuff she wants to carry is straight up mp3 with no DRM anything. ck _______________________________________________ K12OSN mailing list K12OSN at redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn For more info see From eharrison at mail.mesd.k12.or.us Mon Jun 4 15:42:31 2007 From: eharrison at mail.mesd.k12.or.us (Eric Harrison) Date: Mon, 04 Jun 2007 08:42:31 -0700 Subject: [K12OSN] first k12ltsp 7.0 test build In-Reply-To: <4664321C.2010102@paasda.org> References: <463FA84B.7040700@mail.mesd.k12.or.us> <4664321C.2010102@paasda.org> Message-ID: <466432E7.5040203@mail.mesd.k12.or.us> Huck wrote: > Eric, > > will further 'updates' be installable with a mere 'yum upgrade' by > chance? Or not so lucky? =) > > --Huck To upgrade from F7t4 to F7 via yum, you need to grab the fedora-release package from F7. This will do the trick: > rpm -Uhv ftp://k12linux.mesd.k12.or.us/pub/K12LTSP/testing/7.0.0-32bit/i386/Fedora/fedora-release-7-3.noarch.rpm > rpm -Uhv ftp://k12linux.mesd.k12.or.us/pub/K12LTSP/testing/7.0.0-32bit/i386/Fedora/k12ltsp-release-7.0.0-0.noarch.rpm On Friday I put out a new build based on F7 final, but have not tested it much so I didn't send out an email... I did a big chunk of the work for the 7.0 64bit build this weekend, but no IOSs for that yet. -Eric > Eric Harrison wrote: >> For those of you who like your bleeding-edge with extra blood, I have a >> first "rough-draft" of K12LTSP 7.0. >> >> This is based on Fedora 7 test 4 and is at the "look Mom, it booted!" >> stage of development ;-) >> >> >> ftp://k12linux.mesd.k12.or.us/pub/K12LTSP/testing/7.0.0-32bit/iso/ >> http://k12linux.mesd.k12.or.us/K12LTSP/testing/7.0.0-32bit/iso/ >> rsync -Pav k12linux.mesd.k12.or.us::testing/7.0.0-32bit/iso/ . >> >> >> -Eric >> From rowens at bio-chemvalve.com Mon Jun 4 15:44:56 2007 From: rowens at bio-chemvalve.com (Rob Owens) Date: Mon, 4 Jun 2007 11:44:56 -0400 Subject: [K12OSN] [Likely OT] Getting sound working In-Reply-To: <774593a20706040733j5ca0c830h60d9a9e1c6f40656@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <29AEB552E5D40645BA38E82F0939CB0829200F@MAIL-EXCH.bio-chemvalve.com> For hardware problems, I always boot w/ Knoppix. If it works right under Knoppix, then there is hope. If Knoppix doesn't properly configure the hardware, I give up. -Rob -----Original Message----- From: k12osn-bounces at redhat.com [mailto:k12osn-bounces at redhat.com] On Behalf Of Sudev Barar Sent: Monday, June 04, 2007 10:33 AM To: sbarar at gmail.com Subject: [K12OSN] [Likely OT] Getting sound working I am trying to tweak my laptop (HP Pavillion tx1000) to get sound working. The results of trying so far have been: 1. Tried with Debian Etch / Ubuntu 7.04 2. The sound module that is loaded is snd-hda-intel 3. On boot the sound system does not star0 and the mute button-cum-indicator turn orange. 4. If I blacklist the module snd-hda-intel then I am able to try with various additional options by adding option snd-hda-intel model=????? in /etc/modprobe.d/alsa-base This allows me to boot without loading any sound modules without the mute button going orange till I actually load the module with modprobe command. 5. I have not been able to find exact option that will work. Have tried 3stack 3stack-dig hp auto etc. What further areas I should be looking at? If needed I can post outputs from lsmod lspci etc. I am trying to google and search high and low for any one having working solution to this. I thought collective wisdom on this list may give me some pointers. TIA -- Regards, Sudev Barar _______________________________________________ K12OSN mailing list K12OSN at redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn For more info see From nils at breun.nl Mon Jun 4 15:45:28 2007 From: nils at breun.nl (Nils Breunese) Date: Mon, 4 Jun 2007 17:45:28 +0200 Subject: [K12OSN] Reasons to Use LVM In-Reply-To: <46642B1B.6050502@gmail.com> References: <46642B1B.6050502@gmail.com> Message-ID: Mark Trimble wrote: > I'm running Compaq hardware RAIDs and was wondering if there's any > compelling reasons to use LVM in my K12LTSP v6 installation. I've > used LVM in the past on Debian/Skolelinux installations and then it > only seemed to complicate hard disk administration without offering > any apparent benefits. See chapter 2 of the LVM HOWTO for LVM's benefits: Nils Breunese. -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: PGP.sig Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 186 bytes Desc: Dit deel van het bericht is digitaal ondertekend URL: From thewhitmers at gmail.com Mon Jun 4 15:50:06 2007 From: thewhitmers at gmail.com (David Whitmer) Date: Mon, 4 Jun 2007 11:50:06 -0400 Subject: [K12OSN] Best mp3 player for use with thin client In-Reply-To: <46643124.8020901@snarlnet.com> References: <46643124.8020901@snarlnet.com> Message-ID: XMMS has worked well for me in the past. I think you'd need to configure it to use ESD for audio output, and you'll also need to configure it to play mp3 files. I think all you have to do is activate a setting that is disabled by default. You may also need to install with it an mp3 playback library. Unfortunately, that was all from memory. If you run into problems getting XMMS to work, I can look up my actual settings this evening. David Whitmer Director of Media & Technology Calvary Schools of Holland (Michigan) web: www.calvaryschoolsholland.org email: thewhitmers at gmail.com On 6/4/07, Carl Keil wrote: > Hi Folks, > > I've got my daughter on a k12ltsp 5 thin client. It's an NTAVO 6030. > But now she wants an iPod, like all her friends. Is there an MP3 player > out there that will work off her thin client? I think all the stuff she > wants to carry is straight up mp3 with no DRM anything. > > ck > > _______________________________________________ > K12OSN mailing list > K12OSN at redhat.com > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn > For more info see > From nils at breun.nl Mon Jun 4 15:52:30 2007 From: nils at breun.nl (Nils Breunese) Date: Mon, 4 Jun 2007 17:52:30 +0200 Subject: [K12OSN] Best mp3 player for use with thin client In-Reply-To: <46643124.8020901@snarlnet.com> References: <46643124.8020901@snarlnet.com> Message-ID: <92BFAF7A-67DF-4F16-9B38-1ED61371D222@breun.nl> Carl Keil wrote: > I've got my daughter on a k12ltsp 5 thin client. It's an NTAVO > 6030. But now she wants an iPod, like all her friends. Is there > an MP3 player out there that will work off her thin client? I > think all the stuff she wants to carry is straight up mp3 with no > DRM anything. If LDA is working then I guess an iPod should work as well, as long as the software you use supports iPods. I believe gtkpod, banshee, rhythmbox (Gnome) and amaroK (KDE) all provide iPod support under Linux. I believe there are more. Nils Breunese. -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: PGP.sig Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 186 bytes Desc: Dit deel van het bericht is digitaal ondertekend URL: From joebaker at dcresearch.com Mon Jun 4 15:53:12 2007 From: joebaker at dcresearch.com (Joe Baker) Date: Mon, 04 Jun 2007 10:53:12 -0500 Subject: [K12OSN] Reasons to Use LVM In-Reply-To: References: <46642B1B.6050502@gmail.com> Message-ID: <46643568.10905@dcresearch.com> I think LVM is great on a file server. But I like to segregate the LTSP server from the file server. I use an LDAP server for system authentication as well. I like to keep the parts of the system which will change most frequently separate from the bedrock parts of network infrastructure. I have taken the approach of keeping the LTSP server as simple to repair as possible. That means no LVM or RAID whatsoever. (I used it before on an LTSP server and through an untimely shutdown found the system would not boot. It was LVM on top of RAID 1 (including the root filesystem)). So my LTSP server has a single hard drive that will be backed up to another drive which can be swapped out in the event of a catastrophic disk failure. Good luck with your LTSP implementation Mark! -Joe Baker From eharrison at mail.mesd.k12.or.us Mon Jun 4 15:56:11 2007 From: eharrison at mail.mesd.k12.or.us (Eric Harrison) Date: Mon, 04 Jun 2007 08:56:11 -0700 Subject: [K12OSN] Any news about K12LTSP 7 In-Reply-To: <6a2207a10706031028i4f83731ajb7691929c476b1b6@mail.gmail.com> References: <6a2207a10706031028i4f83731ajb7691929c476b1b6@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <4664361B.6080808@mail.mesd.k12.or.us> Shishir Jha wrote: > Hi, > > Just was curious to know whether k12LTSP v7 is in plans or not. And if > yes then which version of LTSP is going to incorporated in it. We are > currently using K12LTSP 5 and are thinking of upgrading to newer > version. We have been trying out Edubuntu 7.04 for test and are giving > it a thought due to its ease with Pulseaudio and LTSP 5. But as we > have been using K12 I dont want to change to debian based Linux from > .rpm based system. > > So guys, if anybody knows about any plans for K12LTSP and its detail, > please do share it with me so that I can decide what to do and whether > to upgrade or wait for release of version 7 of K12 > Yes, there will be two new versions released in the near future (next 1-4 weeks, depending on how busy these last two weeks of school are for me). K12LTSP 5.0-EL will be based on CentOS 5, which is very similar to Fedora Core 6 (i.e. the current K12LTSP 6.0.0), but will be supported with security patches for the next several years. Use this one if you want to install a server and not upgrade it for a long time. K12LTSP 7.0 will be based on Fedora 7, which was just released a couple of days ago. F7 will be supported with security patches for the next year and a half. Use this one if you want the latest-and-greatest and are willing to upgrade every year. If you want to help out with the testing, you will find the pre-release versions here: K12LTSP 5.0-EL: http://k12linux.mesd.k12.or.us/K12LTSP/5.0.0-EL-32bit/ K12LTSP 7.0: http://k12linux.mesd.k12.or.us/K12LTSP/testing/7.0.0-32bit/ -Eric From robert.pogson at gmail.com Mon Jun 4 16:59:44 2007 From: robert.pogson at gmail.com (pogson) Date: Mon, 04 Jun 2007 11:59:44 -0500 Subject: [K12OSN] general acceptance of k12ltsp in schools In-Reply-To: <20070604160021.46D6873787@hormel.redhat.com> References: <20070604160021.46D6873787@hormel.redhat.com> Message-ID: <1180976384.12690.241.camel@Beast> Barry Cisna requested feedback on the subject. I have used k12ltsp, Debian+LTSP and Ubuntu+LTSP. I find mixed acceptance from students. Those who come to school expecting to be able to play around that other OS are a little disappointed that the BOFH can kill a proces that is off task... Those who come to school to learn and rejoice in sharing of ideas and technology love it. In the middle are many who do not care as long as it works. Linux does work. The first place I installed LTSP had 25 Dell Optiplex desktops with Lose98. About 10% of the machines would crash hourly. I tested the system myself. If I simply browsed with Opera and used a single window I could surf forever. If I opened a few windows, it would crash in 15 minutes. If I browsed and used Word, I could crash a system in a minute. These had 64 MB RAM. I had the kids design and build with me a Linux terminal server and it ran all year without another crash. The students loved working in an AMD Athlon 2500 environment with 1.5 gB RAM instead of 400 MHz on 64MB. They were free and empowered. At that same school, not one staff member was willing to try Linux. We used a CD to boot Linux so Linux was optional. One day a visitor came in wanting to prepare a document. I seated her down at OpenOffice on Linux and she finished her task without even noticing that it was not that other OS. Last year, I installed Ubuntu+LTSP in a new school with machines in every classroom. Compared to nothing in the classrooms the year before, staff loved it. Students loved it because it worked. Only 2 staff had problems with Linux. One needed hand-holding for anything not like that other OS and the other kept demanding new and interesting features which I was only too glad to add... The organization was persuaded to go with Linux because it was less than half the price per seat and we obtained many more printers, cameras and scanners than with that other OS for the budget. It was an incredibly small budget for a $28 million school, $100000. For that we installed 153 new seats. Four terminal servers and two general purpose servers along with 8 wax colour printers, ten digital cameras and five USB scanners. It was a lot of work but fun, too. The system ran all year with one failure of memory modules and one hard drive failure. Infant mortality, I suppose. No full time tech was needed. A staff member occasionally monitors the system and watches it just work. Professional visitors are aghast. In a school of that size they often see as few as 40 PCs, in the lab and a few in the library. The power of PCs in every classroom is amazing. It is like having a teacher's aid. An ambitious teacher started doing multimedia on a thick client and another obtained a multi-seat-X cluster. The deciding factor to go with Linux was money, but the reward is ease of maintenance and long life. Students and teachers each have their own website and several students and teachers used that to great effect. That feature took me only 15 minutes to set up. As a techie, I am just amazed at the possibilities. My last school was a disaster. I set up a Linux terminal server in my science lab. Students used it to collect and analyze data, to do research and to prepare reports. Not one staff member came in to see what was happening even with repeated invitations. I found grade 12 students that did not know what a spreadsheet was and teachers were happy with one PC per classroom used for e-mail, browsing and chat. The school had not even applied for school improvement funds that were available. I applied for some Computers for Schools machines. I was fired without notice for vague reasons that the staff and students did not like me. It was amazing. I am not sure whether I did not fit in because I prod people to change or whether it had anything to do with LTSP. What a difference a year makes! That school is following a curriculum that was obsolete in the 1990s. All the new curriculum strongly recommend using computers in classrooms. I have discussed Linux with many school divisions. Most are not even aware of Linux existence. One even said they were a Wintel shop, period. When I mentioned that they were spending twice as much as they needed to spend or were getting half the benefit of the taxpayers' money, they had nothing to say. A few school divisions around here have jumped into Linux but with a division there does not seem to be anything between a demonstration projects and division-wide systems. They have IT teams running off their feet trying to fight fires all over and they do not have time to think ahead to the imminent demise of XP. Most of the current equipment will have to be chucked or converted to Linux thick/thin clients. Most IT guys still think Linux is only good for servers. The policy makers only think of the bottom line and do not care what they get for it. We need to make sure Linux/LTSP is exposed at conferences. Once people have seen and used it their minds will open. Robert Pogson Canada -- A problem is an opportunity. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From brcisna at eazylivin.net Mon Jun 4 18:19:53 2007 From: brcisna at eazylivin.net (Barry Cisna) Date: Mon, 4 Jun 2007 13:19:53 -0500 (CDT) Subject: [K12OSN] Best mp3 player for use with thin client Message-ID: <47031.216.24.126.67.1180981193.squirrel@www.eazylivin.net> Carl, An very easy solution for you,would be Ryhthmbox on your k12ltsp server and install all the plugins for it. AKA: mp3's wav's wma. She can " preview" her songs via Rhythmbox. Buy a 30$ usb / mp3 player at walmart. Make a directory in her home folder /music. Dump all her songs into her /home/user/music folder. Import through Rhythmbox( Import Directory).Plug in your new super duper usb drive / mp3 player in your thin client. Copy from her home folder /music to your desktop icon "USB / brandname".You've got the Linux mp3 player only more versatile than her friends Ipods,,,:) If you are wanting to rip cd's you'd have to do this on the server,with Sound Juicer . Sidenote : If you need to convert whatever format