[Ambassadors] EMEA Membership Questions

Christoph Wickert christoph.wickert at googlemail.com
Fri May 16 00:13:45 UTC 2008

Am Donnerstag, den 15.05.2008, 23:15 +0200 schrieb JoergSimon:
> Hi Christoph,
> You do not need answer this. I think most people are sick of our ping pong 
> game :P

I'd be happy if it were ping pong, because I hardly get a reply to
simple yes/no questions. :(

> Am Donnerstag, 15. Mai 2008 15:08:03 schrieb Christoph Wickert:
> > I agree the fee is a statement, but do you think that on the other hand
> > not being able to pay the fee also is one? People who are not willing or
> > able to pay the membership may still valuable and hard working
> > contributors.
> You read my comment about help/sponsoring this people? 

Of course I did, otherwise I wouldn't have been able to ask you
something about this comment, wouldn't I?

> > Sorry for asking again, but my question still isn't answered: Is Fedora
> > EMEA really bound to FESCO or FAMSCO from a judical point of view? Can
> > someone please show me the corresponding words in the EMEA statutes?
> > TIA.
> The Fedora Board has given Fedora EMEA e.V. the right to use the 
> Brand "Fedora" (Name, Artwork, Logo ...) and requested quarterly Report to 
> have the overview that we act in there terms. If we will not do our Job, they 
> can take us this right - without this Fedora EMEA e.V. is nothing. 

But this doesn't mean that EMEA e.V. and Fedora (RH, FeSCo, FAmSCo or
whoever) will always agree. And I does not say anything on what to do
when they disagree.

Threatening people is not a solution and will not encourage them to
anything, especially if it is an empty thread. Do you really think RH
would leave the NPO and look for other people to found a new one? This
would be the 'last exit', but we need to find ways to avoid this a few
steps earlier - and this is exactly what I'm talking about.

> > It's a fact that we already have this situation. Think of Kushal for
> > example: No doubt that he is a valuable contributor and if I did not
> > offer him a free place to sleep he would not have been able to come to
> > Berlin at all. Two days ago he told me that he wont be able to come
> > anyway because he did not find a sponsor.
> I think is good to have Friends from all over the world in Berlin. Last Year 
> we had Kushal in Berlin and i am sure it is not the last time we had fun 
> together. I am also sure most of us in Germany would take the chance to get a 
> sponsored flight to india or US to speak about our work in europe. This Year 
> Contributors like Yakoov from US will join us - next year another one - for 
> me this is a good choice.
> > Please tell me, did you know what I just wrote about Kushal? 
> Yes! And be sure many more about him - i can call him a good fellow!
> > If the 
> > answer is "yes", then your "we will find a solution" is wrong. 
> To sponsor flights for Speakers in the end is a decission who is taken by 
> FedoraCommunity Leader EMEA MaxSpevack. How we handle the Member Fee not.
> Only a Example - solution for membership could also be, that the NPO Members 
> decide to create a Activity-CreditSystem - less MemberFee for doing something 
> like talks, events ... 

Thanks, this is the first constructive statement regarding the member
fee I heard in this discussion and I think we should follow our idea.
> > And if 
> > the answer is "no", you are not in the position to tell me that
> The answer is yes - so i am now?

Yes you are, but then I wonder how you can write "we will find a
solution" when you know that we already failed in case of "a good
fellow" of yours.

> > I don't 
> > know what's happening in the Ambassador's community.
> like your kind question in 
> http://www.redhat.com/archives/fedora-ambassadors-list/2007-December/msg00019.html
> You must like our Events a lot! 

There was simple reason for that: Although EMEA was the primary topic of
FAD at Rheinfelden I could not find the meeting minutes with a search
for "EMEA" or "Rheinfelden". It was my mistake, I did not look close
enough and I publicly excused for this like half an hour later.
Nevertheless I still think the meeting minutes belong into the wiki but
not into a PDF inside a tarball at fedorapeople.org.

> > You just said that I never really worked with the Ambassadors Community.
> > Thanks a lot! Maybe I'm not the loudest person who always shouts out "Me
> > first", but I'm doing a lot of work for the project that you won't see
> > on this mailing list.
> Sorry to say, you never showed an interest in the preparation for the NPO in 
> Front of Fosdem or other events, or interest to work in a team with the 
> majority of European Ambassadors.

Now you blame me for not showing interest in the NPO, but in the
previous paragraph you blamed me for asking for information about the
NPO. Huh? So if I'm not interested, why would I ask for information?

Again you confuse "interest" with "financial possibilities". I would
have loved to attend FAD at Rheinfelden, but when I do I need to be sure
it's worth the time and the costs for me. So I wrote a long mail to the
ambassador who organized the FAD and asked if he could give me more
detailed information, so I could prepare better for the meeting. I also
offered more help, but never got a reply, so I did not go to

> I believe you, when you say - you do a lot for the Fedora Project as a 
> Maintainer or so ...!

You are right: I have to admit I did not work WITH the other
ambassadors a lot, but that doesn't mean I didn't work FOR them. In
2007, my fist year as an ambassador I did:
      * Linuxtag 2007 of course
      * I-Party (annual install party here at Münster)
      * 2 full days on "linux.forum/nrw".
      * One radio interview on Fedora
      * One meeting with a couple of journalists whom I showed "sugar"
Correct my if I'm wrong but I think all of these events are ambassadors

> To work as a Ambassador is to communicate and encourage. Tue Gutes und rede 
> darueber ;-)  Back to work now!

I'm not good in fishing for compliments and I don't need to write I did
this or that just to win recognition.

The saying "Do something good and talk about it" also means that
something needs to be done before you can talk. Unfortunately I'm under
the impression that some people are proceeding the other way round, so I
try to talk as little as possible. I hope you won't reproach me with

> Gruss Joerg


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